377: Most Importantly, Compressor


00:00:00   (upbeat music)

00:00:02   From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 377.

00:00:13   Today's show is brought to you by Things,

00:00:15   Capital One, and Setapp.

00:00:17   My name is Myke Hurley and I'm joined by Jason Snow.

00:00:20   Hi, Jason Snow.

00:00:21   - Hi, Myke Hurley.

00:00:22   - We just got finished with the big Apple event here,

00:00:25   the big October Apple event.

00:00:27   Unleashed! - We did.

00:00:29   - Unleashed, it was Unleashed,

00:00:30   and it did look like, more like a Star Trek warp field

00:00:34   than a Star Wars hyperspace.

00:00:36   And in fact, there is a shot in the event

00:00:38   where the enterprise goes into warp.

00:00:41   So I guess that's what it was.

00:00:43   - So that is my hashtag SnowTalk question for you.

00:00:45   It comes from me again, and it's follow up from the last one

00:00:48   that we did on the draft episode.

00:00:49   Jason, do you feel that Apple have been Unleashed?

00:00:52   - Yes. - Okay.

00:00:54   - Yes, it's all the reasons that we said, right?

00:00:57   It's the processor power of the pro chips,

00:01:02   and it's the MagSafe thing, which I thought it was,

00:01:05   well, I mean, we'll get to it,

00:01:07   but I guess it shows you something

00:01:10   about how much they wanted to hammer home about performance,

00:01:12   that they didn't make a bigger thing about MagSafe,

00:01:15   but we're gonna make a big thing about MagSafe.

00:01:18   That's what's gonna happen.

00:01:19   We're gonna do that job for them

00:01:20   because I think it's a big deal.

00:01:22   - Before we get into anything today,

00:01:24   we have a very quick announcement at the top of the show.

00:01:27   Merch is back.

00:01:28   - Merch is back.

00:01:30   We are doing our promised fall,

00:01:33   or at least fall in this particular hemisphere hoodie return.

00:01:38   We also have an upgrade t-shirt return.

00:01:40   So if you want to get yourself something nice

00:01:42   for the holidays or whatever, we got you covered.

00:01:47   - Yeah, so we haven't brought these hoodies and shirts

00:01:50   back since like 2019.

00:01:52   So we have a white, gray, and black version

00:01:56   of the upgrade logo tee.

00:01:58   We have a great red upgrade logo.

00:02:00   And for the first time, we're bringing new colors

00:02:02   to the much loved upgrade hoodie.

00:02:05   So it's previously only been in black,

00:02:07   but we now have a red and a heather gray option

00:02:11   with a new pro black and white upgrade logo

00:02:16   embroidered onto the chest.

00:02:18   With, as always, a very special message

00:02:20   for only the true upgradients on the inside of said hoodie.

00:02:25   These wonderful upgrade logo merchandise products

00:02:29   are only gonna be around for a couple of weeks,

00:02:32   I think the 2nd of November.

00:02:33   So you go about two weeks to get these things.

00:02:36   First or 2nd of November.

00:02:38   You go to upgradeyourwardrobe.com and you can pick them up

00:02:42   or you can check the link in the show notes

00:02:45   and you can get some wonderful upgrade merch

00:02:47   and help support the show.

00:02:49   - And just to be clear, the hoodie, as always,

00:02:52   is in my favorite hoodie.

00:02:53   And I said, please, independent training company hoodie,

00:02:57   which is my favorite.

00:02:57   - Super good hoodie.

00:02:59   - And new color options for the logo is white and black.

00:03:03   And so that gave us the options to do the gray and the red.

00:03:06   And they both look great.

00:03:07   And it's the first time we've done the upgrade logo tee

00:03:09   with the logo in red instead of black.

00:03:11   So it looks pretty cool too.

00:03:12   - So we've got some new options there.

00:03:14   - New colorways, as they say, colorways.

00:03:16   - Yeah, the color czar is infected.

00:03:19   - The color czar, oh yes.

00:03:20   - He got all up in there and changed

00:03:22   and fiddled with the merchandise.

00:03:25   Should we do the draft results, Jason Snell?

00:03:28   - Yes, let's do the draft results.

00:03:29   We conferred before the show and I am the winner.

00:03:32   - Yes, congratulations.

00:03:34   You now win the year.

00:03:35   I can finally put this horrible year behind me.

00:03:38   - Yeah, we'll just move on.

00:03:39   That's right.

00:03:40   I'm glad we don't have any Twitter accounts or anything.

00:03:42   It's just, yes, we acknowledge it and let's move on.

00:03:44   However, I will say, I think we did really well.

00:03:46   In our MacBook Pro section,

00:03:49   I went five for five and you went four for five.

00:03:51   The only thing that separated us there is that you made the,

00:03:56   I would say, extremely logical suggestion

00:04:00   that they put an ethernet jack in the power adapter

00:04:03   if they're gonna do MagSafe, like on the iMac.

00:04:06   And they didn't do that.

00:04:07   - I kinda can't believe they haven't done this.

00:04:09   I assume there must be a data transfer issue

00:04:13   with this MagSafe connector they're putting on the laptops.

00:04:15   - So here's what I think.

00:04:17   And I think maybe if you think of it this way,

00:04:19   they made the right decision, although I would be,

00:04:24   I would love for them to offer this down the road,

00:04:26   but the big change with MagSafe,

00:04:29   as opposed to all previous MagSafes,

00:04:31   is it used to be MagSafe with one and two of MagSafe.

00:04:34   This is MagSafe 3.

00:04:35   You had a MagSafe cable that ran to the power block

00:04:39   and it was hardwired into the power block,

00:04:42   which meant you could only ever use MagSafe

00:04:44   with the Apple power block.

00:04:46   Theoretically, there were licensees

00:04:47   and there were people who did it kind of on the sly.

00:04:51   But it was, you had to use their block,

00:04:54   which means that if you wanted to attach

00:04:55   to just a plug in your car or a plug in an airplane,

00:05:00   USB plug or whatever, no, you couldn't do any of that.

00:05:05   You just had to use the Apple power cable.

00:05:07   And this MagSafe 3 is a MagSafe 3 to USB-C plug.

00:05:12   That's all it is.

00:05:14   And as a result, they would have to also build

00:05:18   a new power block, a new USB-C thing

00:05:21   that also had an ethernet jack in it.

00:05:23   It was like a little hub.

00:05:24   And so I can see why they may be opted

00:05:28   for the simpler solution of,

00:05:30   we're just gonna USB-C all the things,

00:05:32   rather than create some sort of proprietary,

00:05:35   only works with our laptops, adds,

00:05:37   piggybacks, ethernet kind of thing.

00:05:39   So if they had to choose,

00:05:42   maybe this is the right choice,

00:05:45   but it is a cool idea to get that ethernet plug

00:05:47   off the table and not have to use a dongle for it.

00:05:51   But that was not the case.

00:05:54   The colors of our draft was very innovative.

00:05:57   - It went the way we expected, really.

00:05:58   - It went essentially with our two picks,

00:06:00   our first two picks, which were silver and space gray.

00:06:02   We really bet on the fact that they were going to,

00:06:05   also these laptops predate some of Apple's other color moves

00:06:09   because they were supposed to be,

00:06:10   all the rumors suggest, June release.

00:06:14   And that was the era of silver and space gray

00:06:17   before we entered the weird starlight,

00:06:19   midnight zone that we now reside in, at least temporarily.

00:06:23   So we'll see what they do in the long run

00:06:25   with their pro laptops and really with all the Macs,

00:06:29   pro and not, and what color changes they make there,

00:06:32   having only really seen these and those iMacs

00:06:34   that are colorful, where they're gonna go.

00:06:36   But in the end, we split that.

00:06:38   So basically say no points for that.

00:06:40   And then our other picks round, we split.

00:06:43   You and I both had AirPods,

00:06:44   versions of AirPods details that we got right.

00:06:47   You called out John Turnus being introducing a product.

00:06:50   He absolutely did that.

00:06:51   He was the kind of guiding force.

00:06:53   He was one level of parentheses in from Tim.

00:06:55   - Is it fair to say John Turnus is Mac Daddy now?

00:06:59   I'm pretty sure he is, right?

00:07:00   - He has to share custody with Craig Federighi though,

00:07:04   right, like he's Mac OS Daddy.

00:07:05   - Yeah, but Craig is software daddy.

00:07:06   Craig, he, you know.

00:07:08   - That's fair.

00:07:09   - All right, okay.

00:07:10   And then the other one I got right in here

00:07:12   was I said that they would mention a new version

00:07:14   of an Apple Pro app,

00:07:16   figuring that they would have some update

00:07:17   that would enable something.

00:07:18   And Myke, they mentioned three.

00:07:21   They mentioned Logic, they mentioned Final Cut Pro,

00:07:24   but most importantly, Compressor.

00:07:27   - Everyone's favorite.

00:07:28   - Everybody's favorite app, Compressor.

00:07:30   Somebody who's compressed video with Compressor.

00:07:33   I'm like, okay, Compressor.

00:07:34   - You were spot on with Logic.

00:07:36   Like you said in the show

00:07:37   that they would talk about spatial audio

00:07:38   and they did.

00:07:39   I would love them to actually release that

00:07:41   because I think it's the third time

00:07:42   they've spoken about this.

00:07:43   - They've spoken about, I knew they'd bring it up,

00:07:45   but they also mentioned that they're using,

00:07:47   they're doing a motion tracking feature

00:07:48   so you can do those things where like the camera pans,

00:07:51   but the titles pan with it,

00:07:52   like they're actually in the shot and stuff.

00:07:54   They've got that feature in an update to Final Cut

00:07:56   and it'll use the neural engine and blah, blah, blah,

00:07:58   all those things, but they definitely use that.

00:08:01   So I got that one right.

00:08:02   However, I missed on the Apple Silicon Mac Mini,

00:08:05   which I still feel like they could introduce

00:08:07   at any point with these new chips

00:08:08   and just say, oh yeah, we also did a new Mac Mini,

00:08:10   but they didn't do it in the show

00:08:12   and they haven't done it today.

00:08:14   You called out the affordable external display.

00:08:17   We also didn't get that.

00:08:18   - How many times did they mention displays

00:08:21   in this presentation?

00:08:22   Like- - So many.

00:08:23   - So many, hey, you can have four display,

00:08:25   like however many displays it is now,

00:08:27   but obviously you have to spend like $700,000

00:08:29   if you want them to be Apple branded displays.

00:08:33   Yeah, that was frustrating to me.

00:08:34   - But there are so many.

00:08:35   Yeah, I know it really, it's still a pain point

00:08:39   and I hope I address it.

00:08:40   I got the Jon Stewart comedy bit right.

00:08:42   They instead did a garage band thing

00:08:45   where you remixed all the sounds

00:08:46   that I think Stephen Hackett and I both looked at

00:08:48   and were amazed by.

00:08:50   I appreciated that it was in a garage.

00:08:52   - You didn't get the Jon Stewart comedy bit right.

00:08:54   - I did not get the Jon Stewart comedy bit.

00:08:55   - I was like, I love it. - There's no Jon Stewart.

00:08:57   I didn't get Jon Stewart.

00:08:58   Instead they did this garage band thing,

00:09:01   which was in a garage.

00:09:02   There was like laundry and stuff.

00:09:02   - That was fun, right? - It was pretty close.

00:09:03   And yeah, they're sampling Apple sounds,

00:09:06   including an appearance from the iPod Hi-Fi

00:09:09   who had that in the Apple keynote bingo.

00:09:11   iPod Hi-Fi would reappear along with the original iMac.

00:09:14   And there's a lot of really great little tidbits in there

00:09:18   sampled by that guy who's like by his laundry,

00:09:21   which is funny 'cause that's like very much like my setup.

00:09:24   - Well, what I liked is that person had a Pro Display XDR

00:09:28   just in the middle of their garage.

00:09:30   - Somebody said Pro Display XDR in the garage.

00:09:33   Somebody in a Slack that I'm in was like, that's interesting.

00:09:36   And I thought, well, those big holes make it really easy

00:09:38   for the spiders to crawl in there.

00:09:40   But the good news is they can crawl right back out

00:09:44   'cause the holes are really big.

00:09:46   - Yes they are. - And the Pro Display XDR.

00:09:47   - Do you remember when you had a spider in your computer?

00:09:49   - Yes, yes I do.

00:09:52   That's why I mentioned it.

00:09:53   And you said Mac OS moderate shipping in October.

00:09:57   Honestly, we could have gone either way.

00:09:59   We asked Steven and he said, he thinks you didn't get this,

00:10:02   but it's arguable that by the transitive property you did

00:10:05   because these new Macs are shipping next week

00:10:07   and they are gonna have Mac OS moderate,

00:10:09   which means presumably that they won't just ship on that.

00:10:11   And I know Apple actually has announced

00:10:13   that Mac OS moderate is shipping on Monday.

00:10:16   - Monday? - A week from today.

00:10:17   - Oh, I didn't see that. - It will be shipping

00:10:19   on the 25th of October.

00:10:22   They didn't really mention in the keynote,

00:10:23   you kind of have to do some logic work to get there,

00:10:25   not logic pro, but actual like Mr. Spock kind of logic.

00:10:28   But it doesn't matter because that made the score

00:10:32   seven six, if we had tied at seven,

00:10:35   the over under set at 60 minutes, the show 50 minutes long,

00:10:39   I chose the under or rather you chose the over

00:10:43   and I got the under.

00:10:44   So whether it tied seven seven

00:10:47   or I think we're officially gonna rule at seven six,

00:10:48   but even if we tied, I would have won.

00:10:50   So it's sort of not, doesn't matter to litigate it

00:10:53   because I got the under and that's the draft.

00:10:55   So now we can never speak of this year's drafts again.

00:10:59   - Yeah, the drafts are done.

00:11:00   Congratulations, Jason, on your win on this draft

00:11:03   and your win for the year.

00:11:04   Hard fought year, this is the first non draw of the year.

00:11:08   - Indeed, so I sort of won by one point in the end.

00:11:12   - So there's obviously as we record,

00:11:14   there's always things going on, right?

00:11:16   So like people are digging through web pages

00:11:18   and the wonderful relay FM members discord

00:11:21   is always throwing things in there as we're gone,

00:11:22   which is very helpful because there's some stuff

00:11:24   that's pertinent to discussion.

00:11:26   And I just think a bit real time follow up before we begin.

00:11:28   So our good friend Mac OS Monterey,

00:11:31   which is shipping on Monday apparently,

00:11:32   which I'm intrigued about,

00:11:34   found out that Steve Trout Smith,

00:11:36   friends of the show tweeted this,

00:11:38   that Safari is going to clearly be redesigned again.

00:11:43   Old tabs appear to be back in one of the images

00:11:50   on the Mac OS 12.

00:11:51   - Yeah, well, I mean, something that I wrote about last week

00:11:53   when they changed it a little bit

00:11:56   is that I got the distinct impression that they weren't done.

00:12:00   And so yes, I'm sure they're not.

00:12:02   And I would imagine that there would be more changes

00:12:05   probably rolled out.

00:12:07   There'll probably be a beta this week

00:12:08   that is the final for next week

00:12:10   and that has more tab changes in it.

00:12:12   So I think there's no doubt. - That feels like a real

00:12:14   like coming in hot on that one, right?

00:12:17   It's, what is it?

00:12:18   Monday today, Monday next week,

00:12:20   apparently there's gonna be a new design.

00:12:22   Nobody has it installed.

00:12:23   Maybe by the end of the day today,

00:12:25   people will start having it installed.

00:12:27   I wouldn't be surprised if they released a beta

00:12:29   at some point, but yeah, it's happening again.

00:12:33   They're changing it again.

00:12:35   I think it's gonna be looking at this image.

00:12:36   This kind of seems like best of all worlds

00:12:38   kind of thing for Safari.

00:12:40   But I guess we could talk about that

00:12:42   maybe in the coming weeks.

00:12:44   Just real quick on Monterey

00:12:45   before we move on to everything else today.

00:12:47   What do you think about stability and stuff?

00:12:50   I keep seeing people say it's shaky.

00:12:53   - I don't agree.

00:12:54   I think Monterey works fine.

00:12:58   I think it's not hard to use it.

00:13:01   I don't, I've been using it for a little while now

00:13:03   as my main system, it works fine.

00:13:06   I don't, I'm not running into any big problems,

00:13:09   any weirdnesses.

00:13:10   I think there are issues with some of the features,

00:13:13   but they're mostly like,

00:13:15   yeah, shortcuts doesn't work very well

00:13:16   because it's kind of a beta

00:13:18   and is not really in a great state.

00:13:22   Like it is on iOS in fact.

00:13:24   But as just day-to-day use,

00:13:27   I basically haven't even noticed.

00:13:28   I have to remind myself sometimes

00:13:30   that Monterey is what I'm using now

00:13:32   because it's basically, it feels just the same as Big Sur.

00:13:37   It's just the same.

00:13:39   - The release candidate is out now,

00:13:41   says Zach in the Discord.

00:13:42   - Yeah, see, there you go.

00:13:45   Probably with tabs.

00:13:46   - Probably with tabs.

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00:15:37   Hi, I'm Zane Lowe,

00:15:40   and I would like to talk to you about my friend, Siri.

00:15:43   - Oh yes, my good, good friend.

00:15:44   - Zane Lowe loves Siri.

00:15:47   That's what we learned today.

00:15:49   I was not expecting music.

00:15:51   Like I expected AirPods, right?

00:15:53   But I did not expect music

00:15:56   as like a part of the presentation today.

00:15:59   It was interesting.

00:15:59   - I didn't either.

00:16:00   I think it's a good example of storytelling on Apple's part.

00:16:05   They wanted to tell something a little bit broader,

00:16:08   tell a little bit broader story

00:16:10   than just we have some new AirPods.

00:16:12   And so putting it in kind of a context

00:16:14   and they had some other product revisions

00:16:16   that they wanted to do.

00:16:17   HomePod mini revision of a sort

00:16:19   and a new service that they wanted to offer.

00:16:23   And so they rolled those together

00:16:24   and told a little bit broader story about it

00:16:26   rather than just dropping the AirPods.

00:16:28   And that makes sense.

00:16:30   Like if you've got these things floating around there,

00:16:32   why not unify them and tell a single story about audio.

00:16:36   And in terms of what Zane introduced

00:16:38   with his good friend, Siri,

00:16:39   it's this Apple Music Voice plan,

00:16:41   which is $5 a month and in 17 countries later this fall.

00:16:44   And I saw a lot of people sort of baffled by this.

00:16:46   Like, this is a weird thing.

00:16:47   Why are they doing this?

00:16:48   But my recollection when I got an Amazon Echo,

00:16:50   one of the first things that Amazon offered me

00:16:53   was a cheap Amazon Music version

00:16:56   that only worked on my Amazon Echo.

00:16:59   And I used that for a little while.

00:17:00   And then they added out Apple Music support or whatever.

00:17:04   I decided to dump it, but this is that essentially,

00:17:08   which is there's no, like you can't make playlist.

00:17:12   There's no support for spatial audio.

00:17:15   It's literally a super limited access to the playlist

00:17:19   that Apple curates and access to the library.

00:17:22   And you've got to use Siri to do it.

00:17:24   And there's probably a reason

00:17:26   in terms of how they negotiate these plans,

00:17:28   but there's a precedent, right?

00:17:29   Like there are precedents

00:17:30   for these kinds of super limited things.

00:17:34   And so the idea here is you buy a couple of HomePods

00:17:38   and pay $5 a month and they have access

00:17:41   to all the music in the world.

00:17:43   And that's, you know, it's not for everybody,

00:17:45   but as somebody who did at least for a little while,

00:17:48   use one of those similar plans on the Amazon Echo,

00:17:51   I kind of get it.

00:17:52   I see why it's available.

00:17:54   It's not for everybody, but it's like a way in if you,

00:17:57   and it's actually less limited than those are

00:18:01   because I think this is on any Apple device.

00:18:03   You just have to use Siri in order to kick it off.

00:18:07   - Yeah, I was like, it was surprising at first

00:18:09   because they were like,

00:18:10   "Hey, we've got loads of new playlists

00:18:12   for different moods and activities

00:18:13   that you can just ask for them."

00:18:15   I'm like, "What is that?"

00:18:17   Like, you know, like you can say like,

00:18:18   "I wanna go hiking, give me some music."

00:18:19   And they've put some playlists together.

00:18:21   But it turns out if now all you can do

00:18:23   on the Apple Music Voice plan, which is $4.99 a month,

00:18:26   is just use your voice, then you need more options

00:18:31   for if you want specific playlists, right?

00:18:33   You can't necessarily think like,

00:18:36   "Hey, I would like to listen to Apple alternative hits."

00:18:40   Right, 'cause if you can't see it,

00:18:42   how would you know that they even have that?

00:18:46   So by saying like, "Hey, I want some music for the afternoon,"

00:18:49   or, "I want some music for a sunny day,"

00:18:52   maybe they can use more contextual stuff

00:18:54   to try and find music that way.

00:18:56   I was surprised and I think, please,

00:18:58   when they were talking about Apple Music Voice plan,

00:19:01   I thought it was gonna be something like a Pandora, right?

00:19:04   Where it's like, you can only say,

00:19:07   "Hey, play me the radio," whatever.

00:19:08   But they said, "You can play everything,

00:19:11   but just only by your voice."

00:19:12   - When they started introducing it,

00:19:14   I actually had a thought that maybe it would be a free tier

00:19:16   with ads or something. - Yes, that too, yep.

00:19:19   - But Apple's not gonna do that.

00:19:21   Instead, this is the free tier.

00:19:22   It's $5 a month, but this is their low-cost entry,

00:19:27   compromised, but still gives you access to the library.

00:19:30   And I totally see there being use cases for this.

00:19:33   It's the kind of thing where, yeah,

00:19:37   you buy a couple of these devices and you wanna do that.

00:19:39   Now, if you've got Spotify or something like that,

00:19:41   then you can do that too.

00:19:42   But if you've got nothing and you just wanna set up

00:19:45   a couple of speakers and have it play music,

00:19:47   this will give you that,

00:19:49   that little tiny chunk of Apple Music.

00:19:50   So yeah, and that playlist thing,

00:19:52   that was actually, I think,

00:19:53   that the Beats service was really good at,

00:19:55   was the sort of mood-based playlists

00:19:58   where it's like, "I'm cooking," or whatever.

00:20:00   And I'm feeling, they had the little two-input thing

00:20:04   where you'd be like, "I'm cooking

00:20:05   and I want the mood to be fun."

00:20:08   And then it would be like, "Here is a playlist for you."

00:20:10   And those were all,

00:20:12   I don't think those were all algorithmically generated.

00:20:14   I think somebody built a bunch of different playlists.

00:20:16   - They said they got their people to come

00:20:18   and choose the songs.

00:20:19   - Yeah, so more like that is good.

00:20:23   And so I'm glad that Apple made the point

00:20:27   of saying we're adding a bunch of new playlists for context,

00:20:29   because I think that's super important,

00:20:31   whether you've got the voice plan or not,

00:20:33   especially if you are just,

00:20:35   sometimes you're just in the mood.

00:20:36   You're like, "I'm not gonna pick up my phone

00:20:37   and pick a playlist."

00:20:38   I'm like, "Just play me something for this."

00:20:41   And so the more you can get into every little context

00:20:44   and have it be good, the better, I would say.

00:20:47   - I'm intrigued to see what the,

00:20:50   there has to be some form of explanation UI, right?

00:20:55   Like if you sign up for this,

00:20:57   there's gotta be some kind of like,

00:20:58   here's what you do, right?

00:21:01   Like, do you know what I mean?

00:21:03   - Yeah, well, my guess is that it would be in voice, right?

00:21:07   I mean, you can even sign up in voice.

00:21:08   It's very much like what Amazon does.

00:21:10   You can actually just say, I forget what the wording is,

00:21:12   but apparently you just say,

00:21:14   "I wanna try the Siri music plan."

00:21:17   And what is it?

00:21:19   Users can subscribe to the Apple Music voice plan

00:21:21   through Siri by saying, "Mm-hmm, ahoy telephone."

00:21:24   - No, just say it, Jason, come on.

00:21:26   - Dart, well, no, I especially don't wanna do this.

00:21:28   - Say it.

00:21:30   - Ahoy telephone, start my Apple Music voice trial, right?

00:21:33   Which is very much what Amazon does.

00:21:35   They want you to sign up on device,

00:21:37   and then I'm sure there's some sort of like,

00:21:39   would you like to know more about how to do this?

00:21:41   You can say things like, play a cooking playlist,

00:21:45   or play a hiking playlist,

00:21:47   and they'll do it that way is my guess.

00:21:50   - This is part, like I think you got that from the website.

00:21:52   I think they have a new thing called Only on Apple.

00:21:55   This is like the Angela Arendt's thing, right?

00:21:58   Meet at Apple, Only on Apple.

00:22:01   The best experiences, Only on Apple.

00:22:03   What does that mean?

00:22:04   Apple's not like a thing, it's like a collection of,

00:22:08   I'm not gonna, there's not enough time today

00:22:10   for me to start getting into that.

00:22:12   Let's talk about some, they did some hardware stuff,

00:22:14   so they resurrected the home set again

00:22:17   for the HomePod mini, and they now,

00:22:20   the Colorzar has found their way to the HomePod mini

00:22:23   and done a good job.

00:22:24   - Yeah, so the Colorzar zipped on over from the iMac,

00:22:29   and bestowed upon the HomePod mini some colors.

00:22:34   Not all the colors, but some colors,

00:22:36   yellow, blue, and orange,

00:22:38   and the little wrapped cables and all that,

00:22:44   which I think I would bet you

00:22:46   they're the exact same color as the iMacs.

00:22:48   - Oh, it's 100% the same cable,

00:22:51   like with our shadow of a doubt,

00:22:53   they're the same cables. - Yeah, it looks very much

00:22:54   like the exact same cable.

00:22:55   - They look just like the power cable.

00:22:58   So yeah, I mean, look, yellow, orange, and blue, why not?

00:23:01   Right, like why not?

00:23:02   I think this is a good idea, just add some color to it.

00:23:05   They could be fun.

00:23:06   I'm super tempted to get a yellow one for my desk

00:23:10   to match my iMac, but I'm not gonna do that,

00:23:12   because I don't really use my HomePod mini very much,

00:23:15   other than just, what I use my HomePod mini for the most

00:23:18   here at the studio is being the hub for HomeKit.

00:23:21   But I have, kind of everything turns on and off

00:23:25   through automations,

00:23:26   but it's here being the permanently always on hub.

00:23:29   These new colors will be joining the space gray,

00:23:32   which I would have just naturally assumed was black,

00:23:35   but space gray and white versions of the HomePod mini,

00:23:38   all $99 on sale in November.

00:23:41   And then I think the last part of the music portion

00:23:45   of this presentation was focused around the AirPods.

00:23:49   So the presenter was first kind of showing off spatial audio,

00:23:53   and they did a really cool promo thing

00:23:56   in the Steve Jobs theater with like the graphics

00:23:58   and the screens and stuff, it looked really good.

00:24:00   And they were like really hammering home to Dolby Atmos,

00:24:02   which by the way, so they've been adding tons of new music

00:24:06   with the Dolby Atmos support, the spatial audio support.

00:24:09   They just added the Hamilton soundtrack.

00:24:11   Oh my God.

00:24:13   - Oh, in Dolby Atmos, wow.

00:24:14   - I listened to the opening track yesterday

00:24:17   and it moved me, like I had tears in my eyes.

00:24:19   'Cause like, you know, Hamilton goes,

00:24:21   the moment when like, you know,

00:24:23   like basically the entire chorus starts like in every way,

00:24:26   it's very enveloping.

00:24:28   If you're a Hamilton fan, I really recommend it

00:24:30   'cause it sounds incredible.

00:24:33   There's also, there's a new mix of "Let It Be,"

00:24:36   like the album, right?

00:24:37   Of the Beatles. - Yes.

00:24:39   - And "Let It Be," the title track in Atmos is also amazing.

00:24:43   So there's a lot, if you haven't checked it out in a while,

00:24:45   there's lots of new music being added to spatial audio.

00:24:49   And what's happening is kind of, I think,

00:24:50   what we hoped would happen is once it was out and available,

00:24:55   the mixes will just get better as people know more

00:24:57   what they're doing with it.

00:24:58   So I think some of the more recent stuff

00:25:00   I've been even more impressed with

00:25:02   because it feels like the mixes are,

00:25:03   that they're kind of really finding their place.

00:25:05   So I recommend it if you haven't checked it out.

00:25:08   So they were talking about Dolby Atmos and they're like,

00:25:10   "Hey, you know, the Max and the Pro AirPods,

00:25:12   they support it and now what about the regular AirPods?"

00:25:16   So third gen.

00:25:16   - What about the regular AirPods?

00:25:18   Yeah, third generation, which as you got the draft point for

00:25:21   are a shape inspired by the AirPods Pro.

00:25:26   They look very much like AirPods Pro,

00:25:30   but without the custom ear tips,

00:25:31   without the little interchangeable ear tips,

00:25:33   it's just hard plastic,

00:25:34   but otherwise they look like an AirPods Pro

00:25:37   and the case looks like an AirPods Pro case.

00:25:40   It may be the AirPods Pro case.

00:25:41   Honestly, I don't know if it's any different,

00:25:44   but what they've rolled in here then is spatial audio support

00:25:50   and the adaptive EQ and all of that kind of stuff.

00:25:53   And they added some sweat resistance

00:25:55   and improved battery life,

00:25:58   like all sorts of things that make it more

00:26:03   than the AirPods second generation,

00:26:06   but still less than the AirPods Pro is sort of how I read it.

00:26:11   And in true, true modern Apple fashion,

00:26:15   they're still selling the second generation AirPods for 129.

00:26:18   And these new ones will be 179.

00:26:21   - So I don't remember the prices previously.

00:26:24   I always, I feel I should always write this down

00:26:26   before the event begins.

00:26:28   Do you remember how much the regular AirPods were?

00:26:31   I feel like they were somewhere in that region.

00:26:35   My expectation is AirPods 3 have taken that price point

00:26:39   and then AirPods 2 have gone down in price.

00:26:42   So Zach, I love this second and chat was 159 or 199,

00:26:48   'cause you could get the wither

00:26:49   without the wireless charging case.

00:26:51   So they're basically bang in the middle.

00:26:53   'Cause the new case has MagSafe and wireless charging

00:26:56   support, which is the same as the AirPods Pro, by the way.

00:26:59   I think in the presentation, they kind of made it seem

00:27:01   like there was some kind of special MagSafe,

00:27:03   but like AirPods Pro do charge on MagSafe

00:27:05   'cause MagSafe is just a T charger at the end of the day.

00:27:09   The overall shape of them,

00:27:11   they look more like AirPods Pro.

00:27:13   I'm gonna be really keen to know like some of the people,

00:27:17   like we have friends, like Steven Hackett, for example,

00:27:19   doesn't like AirPods Pro shape wise,

00:27:21   but likes regular AirPods.

00:27:23   I know that there are a bunch of people in this camp, right,

00:27:25   that couldn't really take the AirPods Pro shape

00:27:28   or the in-ear part.

00:27:29   And I'm intrigued to see how they find AirPods 3

00:27:33   from a comfort perspective.

00:27:34   That's gonna be really intriguing to find out.

00:27:37   Yeah, it's got the little sensor now in the smaller stem.

00:27:39   So no more tapping the side of your head.

00:27:42   They've added a new low distortion driver

00:27:45   and longer battery life.

00:27:46   So I don't remember if the regular AirPods

00:27:49   were in the Find My network,

00:27:50   but I saw that these ones were as well.

00:27:52   So, you know, basically this is exactly

00:27:55   what you'd expect from AirPods.

00:27:56   Apple mentioned they're the best selling headphones

00:27:59   or earphones in the world, which obviously they are.

00:28:02   This seems like a really solid update

00:28:04   that will probably last the next few years, right?

00:28:06   I think AirPods is something

00:28:08   that they know what they've got.

00:28:09   They can produce them at massive scale for a good price.

00:28:12   I will say, I know it's true Apple fashion thing,

00:28:15   blah, blah, blah, but I actually do think

00:28:16   this is a product where it is a good idea

00:28:19   to still keep the old version around.

00:28:21   The old version is great.

00:28:22   And if you can just make it cheaper and cheaper

00:28:24   to get into the AirPods lifestyle,

00:28:26   I think that's a good thing.

00:28:29   - Yeah, the one that I thought about for this

00:28:33   is a parts thing, which is just,

00:28:36   this feels like Apple also optimizing for AirPods now

00:28:40   and saying, let's use a bunch of the stuff

00:28:41   we use for AirPods Pro in AirPods.

00:28:44   Not just to make a better AirPod product,

00:28:47   but also to sort of like,

00:28:50   almost like they built a framework with a foundation,

00:28:55   let's say with AirPods Pro,

00:28:57   and they wanna use some of those same pieces in AirPods,

00:28:59   whereas the original AirPods were their own thing.

00:29:02   And then they kind of re-engineered it for AirPods Pro.

00:29:05   This feels like more like,

00:29:06   can we simplify the stuff we need to make?

00:29:09   And eventually the second generation AirPods will go away,

00:29:12   and then AirPods will be kind of like,

00:29:14   they'll have more in common,

00:29:15   and that'll make it easier for Apple

00:29:16   to manufacture these things.

00:29:18   And that struck me that that was something

00:29:21   that they were doing in here too.

00:29:22   By the way, I've heard from people who don't like

00:29:23   the little squeeze control on the AirPods Pro,

00:29:26   and I don't understand them, but they're out there.

00:29:29   I think this is a big boost for AirPods

00:29:32   because I hate the tapping on the ears thing.

00:29:35   And I much prefer squeezing the stems to do control.

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00:31:32   All right, we should start getting

00:31:34   into the two-part main event,

00:31:36   the double bill, as it were, of this event.

00:31:39   The first part being Apple Silicon.

00:31:41   So, Tim Cook mentioned that Apple is one year

00:31:44   into a two-year transition.

00:31:45   I was surprised that he mentioned that.

00:31:47   They must still be confident they're gonna have this done

00:31:49   by the end of next year.

00:31:50   Or was it midway through next year, one of the two, right?

00:31:53   - It's two years, it depends on how you define

00:31:55   what a two-year transition is.

00:31:56   Did it start in June, did it start in the fall?

00:31:58   I would say it probably started in November of last year

00:32:01   when they introduced the first M1 Max,

00:32:03   and so they've got until November of next year

00:32:06   to complete the two-year transition.

00:32:08   - Yeah, which I think is still,

00:32:10   I'm pleased to hear that.

00:32:12   So, maybe by the end of next year,

00:32:15   we should have everything that will, I guess,

00:32:17   include the Mac Pro, at least information about it,

00:32:19   if not its release.

00:32:21   And they will toot in the horn of Apple Silicon,

00:32:24   that the response has been off the charts,

00:32:26   Mac had the best year ever because of it, blah, blah, blah.

00:32:30   But then we get into the new M1 chips, M1 Pro and M1 Max.

00:32:35   - Yeah, I guess they really like Pro and Max.

00:32:37   Not Pro Max though, just Max.

00:32:39   - Yeah, I know I'm gonna get that wrong a lot.

00:32:42   I am on board with this personally.

00:32:46   I think that this is much better naming

00:32:48   than adding letters to things.

00:32:50   - Yeah, I mean, M1X was a good way

00:32:52   of referring to this thing.

00:32:53   I was looking back-- - It's been helpful.

00:32:55   It's been a good shorthand for us for the last few months.

00:32:56   - Yeah, I was looking at my speculative charts that I made

00:32:59   and I kept putting them in quotes, right?

00:33:01   Because who knows what it's actually gonna be called.

00:33:03   It was just a useful thing.

00:33:05   But this is for, so something we've talked about briefly

00:33:10   as this transition has been going on,

00:33:12   which is how do you market different versions of a chip

00:33:15   if you're Apple?

00:33:16   We know that Intel has ways of doing it

00:33:19   and other chip makers have different ways of doing it,

00:33:21   describing what generation this is

00:33:24   and what's different about it,

00:33:25   but how is Apple going to handle it?

00:33:27   And this seems like a pretty reasonable thing,

00:33:30   which is they've got M number

00:33:34   and then they'll have M number Pro and M number Max.

00:33:37   And who knows, maybe there will be M number Pro Max

00:33:40   at some point, who knows?

00:33:42   I'll also say these are chip families themselves.

00:33:47   They all have the 10 cores, the eight performance cores,

00:33:51   so it's twice as many performance cores as the M1.

00:33:54   They both have that.

00:33:55   But on the GPUs, it's not just 16 and 32.

00:33:59   There's also a 24 variant that you can get

00:34:02   on the 14 inch MacBook Pro.

00:34:04   And of course the RAM that you have to configure

00:34:07   is as you build this system on a chip varies as well.

00:34:10   So there's even some variants within the chips

00:34:15   in terms of what's available.

00:34:16   - Do you think that's binning?

00:34:17   - It might be, I don't know enough about chip stuff,

00:34:20   but it wouldn't shock me if the M1 Max 24 is a binned 32,

00:34:25   but either way, they're differentiating.

00:34:31   It's not like every config has its own name.

00:34:34   And that means that they're more expansive.

00:34:36   They can have an M1 or an M2 Max driving a Mac Pro

00:34:41   that is beyond, or maybe that's the Pro Max.

00:34:44   Who knows how they wanna do it?

00:34:45   But this gives them some flexibility

00:34:47   to talk about their chips while also,

00:34:50   I think answer to another question that we got,

00:34:52   also keeping the clarity of the chip line

00:34:55   that this is the M1.

00:34:56   - So just in the 14, you can get the M1 Pro

00:35:00   with an eight core CPU and 14 core GPU,

00:35:03   10 core and 14 core, 10 core and 16 core.

00:35:07   Then you can get the M1 Max of a 10 core CPU, 24 core GPU,

00:35:12   and a 10 core CPU and 32 core GPU.

00:35:15   So they've got a spread.

00:35:17   - Speaking of binning the 14, yeah,

00:35:18   the 14 base model is an eight core,

00:35:21   which means it's six performance cores,

00:35:23   which is really interesting, right?

00:35:25   So that's binning, right?

00:35:27   That's clearly binning.

00:35:28   So anyway, these things have room to spread.

00:35:30   They're not, just as with the M1,

00:35:33   they're not like the specs are the same for every model.

00:35:35   There's variants inside the names too,

00:35:38   but it gives them a couple of big baskets

00:35:41   from marketing purposes to explain.

00:35:43   And people roll their eyes at like the word marketing,

00:35:45   but like marketing also- - No, it's good.

00:35:47   - Encompasses explaining your product to customers, right?

00:35:50   You're going, it's not just explaining it to the press

00:35:53   and doing ads, it's explaining to customers

00:35:56   what the difference is between this chip,

00:35:59   this chip and this chip.

00:35:59   And so now they can say M1, M1 Pro, M1 Max.

00:36:02   And yes, there's variation inside there

00:36:06   on all three of those,

00:36:08   but it gives you something to hold on to

00:36:11   like the good, better, best basically

00:36:12   is what's going on here.

00:36:14   - Yeah, and you can have,

00:36:16   there's up to 64 gigabytes of RAM now,

00:36:19   but that requires the M1 Max.

00:36:22   - On the max, right?

00:36:23   Yeah, the 32.

00:36:25   So it's 16 on the M1, 32 on the M1 Pro and 64 on the M1 Max.

00:36:30   And the memory bandwidth goes up as well.

00:36:34   Like there's, like the M1 Max

00:36:36   is not just a little bit bigger M1 Pro,

00:36:40   it's got a lot of other,

00:36:42   unlike the memory bandwidth and all of that,

00:36:44   there's a lot going on in there.

00:36:45   So it's gonna be interesting to see

00:36:47   when the ship sort of like

00:36:49   what all the breakdowns really are.

00:36:51   I liked Johnny Srugi's charts,

00:36:56   which are, you know,

00:36:57   they actually referred to like what the mystery PC

00:37:01   they were comparing themselves to.

00:37:03   There was a little like text at the bottom

00:37:05   that said what it was.

00:37:06   I thought that was nice.

00:37:07   And they're making the same case.

00:37:08   Yeah, it said like the performance PC

00:37:12   it had down there what like Alienware or whatever

00:37:14   the performance PC laptop was.

00:37:16   - I would be really keen to see what that is

00:37:18   and cannot wait for all of the tech YouTubers

00:37:20   who actually do the comparison now.

00:37:22   'Cause I wanna see that.

00:37:23   I wanna see, I wanna see like, show me, right?

00:37:27   Like, and so obviously Apple is very razor blade.

00:37:31   One of the razor blade.

00:37:32   - Yeah.

00:37:33   - Okay, that's a good one.

00:37:34   - And I think, again,

00:37:35   Apple is always going to do

00:37:37   whatever makes them look the best, right?

00:37:39   It is marketing.

00:37:40   That's, this is what's happening here.

00:37:41   That said, it seemed to me at least at a glance

00:37:44   during the event, not knowing about this category

00:37:46   and I agree, I look forward to the people

00:37:48   who really care about performance PC laptops

00:37:51   to talk about how this really compares in the real world.

00:37:54   But the idea that when they said, look, on this chart

00:37:58   where we're looking at power and performance,

00:38:00   we're faster and we use way less power.

00:38:02   And then they'd had that one example where they said,

00:38:05   we're in the ballpark, essentially.

00:38:08   They weren't as fast, like as the fastest, fastest.

00:38:10   But they said, but we use way less power

00:38:13   and then you run on battery and they go

00:38:14   and they drop way down because they just can't do it

00:38:17   when they're not plugged in.

00:38:20   And, but I liked that moment only because it was Apple,

00:38:25   I will admit begrudgingly and they put a little bow on it

00:38:29   to make it seem like we're in the ballpark, right?

00:38:31   It's like, that means you're slower.

00:38:33   But it made me get, I think, a pretty clear idea

00:38:38   of how Apple views where they are with the competition.

00:38:41   And then yes, it will now need to be proved out by,

00:38:45   like Apple doesn't make up those numbers.

00:38:46   Apple has a whole team called

00:38:48   the Performance Marketing Group that includes a bunch

00:38:50   of people I used to work with at MacWorld, Mac user.

00:38:53   They do those tests, but obviously the ones

00:38:56   that they're gonna show in the charts they're gonna show

00:38:57   are the ones that make Apple look the best.

00:38:58   And other people may make different judgments

00:39:01   that they think are a better reflection of reality

00:39:03   of how people use this stuff.

00:39:05   And so that's gonna be really interesting to dig

00:39:07   into those highly technical people who are doing that stuff.

00:39:10   But at a glance, it looks really good.

00:39:13   And it's not, but it's not surprising

00:39:15   because we know the legacy of Apple's chip development

00:39:19   for the iPhone and the iPad over the years.

00:39:22   We're just seeing more cores and way more GPU cores

00:39:25   than we've ever seen before.

00:39:27   - So I don't know if we detailed it, but the 10 core CPU.

00:39:30   So it's a 10 core CPU maximum across both

00:39:33   with eight high performance and two efficiency cores.

00:39:38   - Right, and they say 70% faster than the M1,

00:39:40   but really when it comes down to is that it's,

00:39:43   the M1 is what, four high performance, is that right?

00:39:48   And two high efficiency?

00:39:50   - Let's just say, yeah.

00:39:52   - Let's say yes.

00:39:53   - Let's just say yes, the exact same amount.

00:39:55   - Really it's scaling the high performance cores that matters

00:39:57   that's the thing that matters the most.

00:39:59   And so you're getting up to 10 core and that's across.

00:40:01   So basically all of the M1 Max and Pro

00:40:05   just have a double the high performance core count

00:40:09   from the M1 just straight up.

00:40:11   And then the variance comes in memory bandwidth

00:40:14   and in graphics and in some little pieces too.

00:40:17   So memory bandwidth is a double the Pro on the Max.

00:40:22   The GPU cores go up all the way to potentially 32

00:40:27   from the 16 Max GPU on the Pro model.

00:40:32   And then the other things that I thought

00:40:33   were like little tidbits that you might've missed.

00:40:36   The M1 Max has two video encode engines.

00:40:38   So it's gonna be faster at encoding video

00:40:40   because it's got two engines to throw the work at.

00:40:42   It's got two of those ProRes engines.

00:40:44   So there's a ProRes encode decode engine in the chip

00:40:48   in the Pro, which for people who use Apple's ProRes

00:40:52   video codec, like you're gonna benefit

00:40:54   from having it be built into the Silicon.

00:40:57   That's gonna be a big deal.

00:40:58   And then there's two of those on the Max.

00:41:00   - I think they said later on,

00:41:01   I think it's Srouthy who was a previous guest on the show.

00:41:04   - Yes. - Some time ago.

00:41:06   - Two years ago talking about the 16 MacBook Pro back then.

00:41:09   - Srouthy said that the, I think the 16 inch

00:41:13   could like encode video like faster

00:41:17   than a Mac Pro with an afterburner card.

00:41:20   - With the afterburner card.

00:41:21   'Cause the afterburner is also doing that ProRes thing.

00:41:23   - The afterburner card specifically made for ProRes, right?

00:41:27   - Yeah, they basically built in,

00:41:29   again, this is a simplification.

00:41:31   I'm sure a Pro video person will tell me

00:41:33   something very specific about it.

00:41:34   But philosophically it's like they wanted to build

00:41:38   the afterburner into the chip.

00:41:41   - Or at least the parts they needed, right?

00:41:42   Like just like to small it as much as you could.

00:41:44   But essentially they have put into the system on a chip

00:41:48   something specific, right?

00:41:50   To actually make the video work, right?

00:41:53   And I love to see it.

00:41:54   Like, I think this is fantastic.

00:41:56   I'm not worried about that myself.

00:41:58   But if I was like, oh, on the occasion

00:42:01   when I like encode something from Final Cut,

00:42:04   well now I'll get that benefit.

00:42:05   Rather than being like, oh, you know,

00:42:07   would I wanna, if I wanna shoot in ProRes one day,

00:42:09   am I gonna want one of these afterburner cards?

00:42:11   For gosh knows how much money.

00:42:12   It's like, no, the MacBook Pro can just handle it.

00:42:15   You know, and again, we'll look to the future

00:42:18   in the coming weeks for sure.

00:42:19   But what is a Mac Pro gonna do, Jason?

00:42:22   My God.

00:42:24   - Yeah, I do wonder what a Mac Pro will look like.

00:42:28   And I think we've seen the start of what their ambition is

00:42:32   with the Macs, which is building in a bunch of stuff

00:42:36   that they feel like they know that the pros want.

00:42:39   I think the open question is still,

00:42:43   does Apple feel like there's a place in its world

00:42:46   for any graphics system

00:42:49   that isn't Apple's own graphics system?

00:42:51   And will that be necessary?

00:42:54   Are there customers for the Mac Pro who just, you know,

00:42:58   I know your graphics are great Apple,

00:43:00   but I really need to put in a card that does this.

00:43:03   I don't know the answers to that.

00:43:05   And I'm also not that customer.

00:43:06   So I don't even know the questions

00:43:08   that they would be asking.

00:43:09   But I think that's a question, right?

00:43:11   Is that Apple's never done support on their silicon

00:43:15   for an external discrete GPU.

00:43:18   So that's like up in the air for the Mac Pro.

00:43:20   But you can see in terms of like base performance

00:43:23   that they would be able to offer pros

00:43:25   that here it is in a chip that's designed for a pro laptop.

00:43:29   Although by the way, these chips are totally also gonna run

00:43:34   on the big iMac at least optionally,

00:43:37   and maybe on a Mac mini at some point.

00:43:39   I mean, like we will see more use for the M1 Pro

00:43:42   and the M1 Macs than just in laptops,

00:43:46   but they seem like they were designed for the laptops.

00:43:49   - Like I'm starting to really wonder

00:43:51   if for the typical pro Mac user,

00:43:55   if they're going to need discrete,

00:43:58   like external graphics cards,

00:44:00   because they could just keep putting more GPUs in it.

00:44:03   Just keep putting them in there.

00:44:05   - I don't know.

00:44:06   I don't know what the answer is there.

00:44:07   And it's very technical and it has to do

00:44:10   with Apple's perception of that market.

00:44:11   - Because if Apple can get close to,

00:44:14   so like the specs of some of those laptops, right?

00:44:17   So it's like the laptop version of a 38E.

00:44:21   38E is like, you know,

00:44:22   Nvidia's close to top of the line laptop chip

00:44:26   for graphics right now.

00:44:28   They don't hit it, but they get close to it, right?

00:44:30   And if they can get close to what is considered

00:44:33   to be an incredibly powerful GPU in a laptop

00:44:38   without all of the aggressive cooling

00:44:40   that's going on in some of these things,

00:44:41   like I've got a wonder like,

00:44:43   can they just do what they need to with a Mac Pro?

00:44:47   Like, so when I say for like,

00:44:50   this is not going to make people happy

00:44:52   that we're using bootcamp to play video games, right?

00:44:55   But that's why I asked of like a pro Mac user.

00:44:57   Like if pro Mac users are using like After Effects

00:45:03   and Final Cut, maybe Premiere or whatever,

00:45:06   as long as they can make those specific things

00:45:10   work really great,

00:45:12   can't Apple just do it all on their own?

00:45:16   Like I am going to be intrigued as you were saying,

00:45:19   to find out people that really know this stuff,

00:45:22   really like are in it, right?

00:45:24   And I think a lot of this,

00:45:25   like I'm intrigued to see like all the tech YouTubers

00:45:27   talk about this more as we continue to go forward

00:45:29   and see again what Apple are doing again and again,

00:45:32   to start to realize like,

00:45:34   can they just handle it all themselves now?

00:45:36   Do they not need to go to AMD anymore

00:45:40   to get what they need out of GPUs

00:45:42   in the same way that they don't need to go to Intel anymore

00:45:44   to get what they need from CPUs?

00:45:46   - Yeah, well, we'll have to talk about this a lot more

00:45:49   in the, we'll probably have a year to talk about it,

00:45:51   but the idea of what's a Mac Pro 4

00:45:53   and everybody's got a different vision of it.

00:45:55   And I will say the thing to watch for is if somebody says,

00:45:59   well, of course Apple will do the Mac Pro this way

00:46:01   because you need to support this.

00:46:04   I would say, look, examine carefully what this is

00:46:09   that you need to, they need to support

00:46:11   because somebody wants it.

00:46:13   Because if we know anything about Apple,

00:46:16   it's that Apple makes decisions

00:46:19   about what it's gonna do with its products.

00:46:21   And sometimes it's gonna leave some of the wants or needs

00:46:25   of some kinds of customers on the outside.

00:46:29   And that can be a dangerous game

00:46:31   because if you leave too many of your customers

00:46:33   on the outside, your product is going to be a failure.

00:46:37   At the same time, it's also the sign

00:46:40   of being a good product person

00:46:43   and a good editor of your product

00:46:45   that you can't support everybody's use case.

00:46:49   You need to pick the best use case

00:46:52   for the most people that makes the best product.

00:46:54   And so I just say, I'd watch that

00:46:56   because some people are going to say

00:46:57   the Mac Pro is going to be a system

00:47:00   that one of the things that defines it

00:47:02   is that four years after you bought it,

00:47:03   you can swap in a new card and you can make it

00:47:07   have better graphics performance.

00:47:09   And that's something that is part of the legacy

00:47:12   of traditional computers,

00:47:13   but Apple may not see that as a thing.

00:47:16   Apple doesn't sell upgrades,

00:47:18   processor upgrades for four-year-old computers.

00:47:20   They just don't do that anymore.

00:47:21   The same time the Mac Pro will cost a fortune,

00:47:24   how do they feel about that?

00:47:27   We don't know the answer, but I'm just saying

00:47:29   we are going to all need, when we're thinking about this,

00:47:33   to calibrate individually every single one of those.

00:47:36   Well, obviously it will have this feature

00:47:38   because somebody needs it.

00:47:39   Because some of those features,

00:47:41   Apple may say it's not worth it to do that.

00:47:44   And I don't know where Apple's going to draw the line.

00:47:46   - Man, I'm so excited, Jason.

00:47:48   Like, I remember what it was like last year

00:47:52   when the feeling started to dawn on us

00:47:55   when using the M1 chips for the first time,

00:47:58   just how powerful it was.

00:48:02   You know, like running benchmarks from device to device

00:48:06   and kind of seeing what was, oh, hang on a minute.

00:48:09   This laptop, this MacBook Air is as fast as my Mac Pro

00:48:13   in some things, right?

00:48:14   And I'm just, I'm so excited to find out

00:48:19   what are these going to feel like, you know?

00:48:24   - Yeah, and yeah, we should talk about,

00:48:26   you can't really just use a chip, right?

00:48:28   You got to put it in a computer.

00:48:29   So we're going to talk about that.

00:48:31   - But before we do, let's thank our final sponsor

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00:49:37   All of this stuff just sounds super awesome to me.

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00:49:44   You know, there's a bunch of fun things,

00:49:46   you got a bunch of demos you can do,

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00:49:50   By the way, I have no idea what a random forest is,

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00:50:13   and Relay FM.

00:50:14   All right, this is the big, big main event.

00:50:17   - It is, it is.

00:50:18   - I had to keep holding my back from,

00:50:20   like hold myself back from referencing stuff

00:50:21   while we were talking about the chips.

00:50:23   If either of us would have picked one of the two following,

00:50:28   I think it would have been a big surprise in the draft.

00:50:32   The MacBook Pro has a notch, the MacBook Pro has feet.

00:50:36   - Yes.

00:50:36   - Both of these things, quite surprising.

00:50:39   - They always have had feet.

00:50:41   - These are quite pronounced feet though.

00:50:43   - These are more pronounced feet, yes.

00:50:45   The feet, the bumps are bigger.

00:50:48   The bumps are bigger this time around.

00:50:49   - These are clearly, they're airflow feet,

00:50:51   which makes a lot of sense.

00:50:53   Where before I think it was just like,

00:50:54   stop the laptop sliding away kind of feet,

00:50:57   those little rubber guys.

00:50:59   Now they've got like,

00:51:00   these things are made out of aluminum on the bottom

00:51:02   and then they go to the rubber.

00:51:03   - Yep, yep.

00:51:04   - Let's just talk about the notch.

00:51:05   Can we just talk about the notch?

00:51:06   Let's just start with the notch.

00:51:06   - Yes, we gotta do it.

00:51:08   So I like how they described it as being like,

00:51:11   oh, and we added the, and like,

00:51:12   we're not putting a notch intruding into your screen.

00:51:16   We've expanded the screen around where the camera is.

00:51:20   That was a nice little bit of, of Contra,

00:51:24   I don't know, counterintuitive marketing of that.

00:51:28   It is described as being using the menu bar.

00:51:32   So they basically raised the menu bar height

00:51:35   and the menu bar goes,

00:51:37   the notch area is the menu bar area,

00:51:39   which means they showed of course,

00:51:40   some apps with very few menus.

00:51:44   Apps with more menus,

00:51:45   I assume that they've got some menu bar code

00:51:48   that detects the notch and wraps the menu items

00:51:52   around the notch and that's just how that works.

00:51:54   - It's really weird, like on Apple's website,

00:51:56   they're all just showing all of the screenshots.

00:51:59   They have no menu bars on them.

00:52:01   So it makes them look smaller.

00:52:02   - Here's what I was gonna say is,

00:52:04   what they've done is the menu bar lives with the notch.

00:52:08   The notch is essentially part of your menu bar now.

00:52:11   And it goes around that.

00:52:12   If you think of it that way, the notch is the menu bar.

00:52:15   The notch lives in the menu bar.

00:52:18   And then when you're in like a full screen mode

00:52:21   or something like that,

00:52:23   what all their screenshots show is full screen mode

00:52:26   doesn't go up through the notch, at least not by default.

00:52:31   Maybe it does, I mean, we don't know the details here,

00:52:34   but it looks like what they're viewing as the ideal

00:52:37   is when you are in a full screen,

00:52:40   it just stops at the notch and it's blank above there.

00:52:44   - Which makes perfect sense

00:52:45   because then you can go up to the top

00:52:47   and the menu bar will come down.

00:52:49   But I'm just not sure why Apple is showing

00:52:51   most of the product photos on the website

00:52:54   with just the black bar on the top.

00:52:56   'Cause I'll just say like-

00:52:57   - It's 'cause they're ashamed of the notch.

00:52:59   - But it's like, I don't even know,

00:53:00   I've been seeing a lot of people

00:53:01   over the last couple of days

00:53:02   'cause this started to be a potential rumor

00:53:04   in the days leading up to the event.

00:53:06   I don't know why this bothers people.

00:53:08   Like that is a part of the screen

00:53:11   you can't do anything with anyway.

00:53:13   - Yeah, I like that, that's the other way to view it here

00:53:16   is that what they've done is they've used that extra space

00:53:18   at the top around the notch,

00:53:19   which you might view as useless space on the iPhone.

00:53:21   It's kind of useless, but they put control center up there

00:53:25   and you can see stuff up there

00:53:26   and they're using it for the menu bar.

00:53:27   It's the same thing.

00:53:28   And so the menu bar lives up there.

00:53:30   And the only thing that's gonna be janky about it

00:53:33   is that the menu bar, like I said,

00:53:35   the menu bar has to move around it.

00:53:38   And so you're gonna get apps with lots of menus

00:53:42   that you're gonna have some of the menus

00:53:44   to the left of the notch and some to the right of the notch

00:53:46   and you're just gonna have to deal with it.

00:53:48   But I think it's clever how they've done it

00:53:52   and it's not as big a deal.

00:53:55   It makes it look more like the notch on the phones.

00:53:59   It makes the screen look more expansive.

00:54:02   You're getting into space

00:54:04   that otherwise would have to be blank.

00:54:06   If you aren't capable of cramming your camera

00:54:10   in the little tiny bezel space, which they're not clearly,

00:54:15   then you could either have emptiness up there

00:54:18   or you could use it for something.

00:54:19   And clearly they looked at it and said,

00:54:20   "Well, we could just put the menu bar up there."

00:54:23   Most Mac users, most of the time have a menu bar

00:54:25   and it doesn't need all that.

00:54:27   It can work around the notch.

00:54:28   And so here we are, notch, notch is here on the Mac.

00:54:31   - I've gotta say though,

00:54:32   I would like to know why the notch is as big as it is

00:54:35   because it seems pretty big and they don't have,

00:54:39   like it's not face ID up there.

00:54:41   So what's going on up there?

00:54:42   - No, I don't know.

00:54:44   I mean, I'm sure there's a microphone up there

00:54:47   and there's the camera up there.

00:54:48   - I know there's some kind of light sensors, right?

00:54:51   Because it's doing like, what do you call it?

00:54:53   The true tone and like when it dims the light.

00:54:58   - Yeah, yeah, all that stuff is probably in there.

00:55:00   I don't understand Apple's sensor thing on the Mac anyway.

00:55:04   This is a 1080.

00:55:06   We, I think accurately predicted exactly

00:55:09   what they would say by the way, on our draft episode,

00:55:12   which was, this is the best webcam ever in a Mac laptop.

00:55:17   - Yep.

00:55:19   (laughing)

00:55:20   - Because that's all they can really say.

00:55:21   It's a 1080p with a special like new layered lens

00:55:26   or something like that.

00:55:27   But, and that's all nice, but still it's like,

00:55:31   it's not a 4K or anything.

00:55:32   It doesn't do center stage or anything.

00:55:34   It's just a little bit better.

00:55:36   I get that the depth of it is limited,

00:55:38   yet somehow they put mini LED in there,

00:55:42   but they couldn't put a better camera system in there.

00:55:44   Oh, well, this is where we are right now.

00:55:46   But notch, I think is something that people

00:55:49   will get used to very quickly.

00:55:51   - Maybe the mini LED is one of the things

00:55:53   that preclude them from putting a better camera in there.

00:55:55   - Entirely possible, entirely possible,

00:55:57   but everything's cramped up there.

00:55:59   - I would say that is a perfectly fine trade off.

00:56:02   A 1080p camera is fine.

00:56:03   It's fine, all right, it's gonna do the job.

00:56:06   That screen, oh my God, 120 frames per second promotion.

00:56:11   - Yeah, I didn't think you'd get your promotion.

00:56:13   - Neither did I.

00:56:14   I was really nervous this morning when I looked at it.

00:56:17   I was like, why did I pick that?

00:56:19   I have that feeling.

00:56:20   I don't know if you ever have that feeling.

00:56:22   Sometimes I look at the draft scorecard and I'm like,

00:56:25   why, why did I do that?

00:56:27   And this was one of those things.

00:56:29   That screen is gonna be very nice.

00:56:32   And they are bigger as well.

00:56:34   It's 16.2 inches on the 16 inch

00:56:37   and 14.2 inches on the 14 inch.

00:56:40   And the 14 inch model has more pixels

00:56:43   than the previous 16 inch did.

00:56:46   So I know there's a lot of talk about 2X Retina.

00:56:49   Is that a thing?

00:56:51   - I don't know, somebody can tell us.

00:56:53   - The resolution is very, very, very high on these screens,

00:56:57   which looks super cool.

00:56:58   And a thousand nits of sustained brightness, 1600 peak

00:57:02   brightness is gonna look great with HDR

00:57:05   as you expected it would.

00:57:06   And they've made the bezels way smaller.

00:57:09   So I'm, oh man, this screen is gonna be,

00:57:13   I just, as I had that thought, I was like, oh yeah,

00:57:17   but Myke uses his laptop in dock mode.

00:57:19   - Yeah, this screen is gonna be great, right?

00:57:23   Because it is essentially like that iPad Pro screen

00:57:26   put on a Mac laptop.

00:57:28   And this feels like, Apple puts a lot of pro display

00:57:33   technology in places that are not like super pro uses

00:57:37   like an iPhone or, yeah, an iPad Pro too.

00:57:39   But like this one, like the pro display XDR,

00:57:42   this one feels like, oh, this is a computer for people

00:57:45   who actually really need something

00:57:48   like extended dynamic range.

00:57:50   Like I can see exactly why they would put this

00:57:55   in this product, right?

00:57:56   It makes sense, this is the pro laptop.

00:57:58   This is how you differentiate the pro laptop

00:58:00   from your non pro laptop, makes sense to me.

00:58:03   - The performance though is bananas on this.

00:58:06   The 16 inch is two times faster in CPU

00:58:09   than the previous model, between two to four times

00:58:12   faster GPU than the previous model.

00:58:14   The 13 inch is 3.7% up to 3.7% faster CPU,

00:58:19   nine to 13 times faster GPU.

00:58:22   That is just wow.

00:58:25   - Yeah, I mean, all the things we said about chips,

00:58:27   that's what we're talking about here.

00:58:28   - Most powerful Mac notebooks ever, obviously.

00:58:31   - Yeah, absolutely.

00:58:32   This is those chips we just talked about.

00:58:34   There's a lot going on here.

00:58:37   Lot of ports too, lot of ports.

00:58:38   - Lot of ports. - Did you see?

00:58:39   - Yeah, that was one of the things I forgot to mention

00:58:41   with the M1 Macs and M1 Pro when we're talking about those

00:58:44   is they did say that it increases the amount of IO available

00:58:49   with these chips over the M1.

00:58:52   So they've got HDMI, what I really liked actually,

00:58:56   'cause we've also not spoken about Touch Bar,

00:58:58   we'll come back to that in a second.

00:58:59   You know, Storussi said, "We're adding ports,

00:59:03   HDMI, three Thunderbolt 4, SD card, headphone jack,

00:59:08   MagSafe 3, which is a high power,

00:59:11   can still charge via the Thunderbolt ports as well."

00:59:15   That's a lot of ports, man.

00:59:17   - Yeah, and it's what people wanted, right?

00:59:21   Like there is this whole sense here that this is Apple

00:59:25   taking all the criticism that it's been given

00:59:27   for the last five years essentially on its laptops

00:59:30   and saying, "Okay, we hear you."

00:59:31   This seems like it's the abandonment

00:59:33   of the less is more philosophy when it comes to Pro laptops

00:59:38   that they actually need to do work.

00:59:39   This seems like it's the laptop version essentially

00:59:43   of what happened when they said,

00:59:44   "All right, we're gonna make a new Mac Pro

00:59:46   because we understand what you care about."

00:59:48   And so that's why you see an SD card slot

00:59:51   and that's why you see HDMI.

00:59:54   And like HDMI, I know a lot of people aren't gonna use it,

00:59:58   but like HDMI is the thing where you walk

01:00:00   into any conference room and you've gotta have

01:00:03   your dongle with you because you need to adapt

01:00:05   to whatever that is.

01:00:06   Like HDMI is the standard.

01:00:08   Every monitor in every conference room probably has,

01:00:11   or at least has an option of HDMI.

01:00:12   You're gonna be able to get to HDMI.

01:00:14   There will be an HDMI cable connected

01:00:17   to that device probably.

01:00:18   Like it's, I think it absolutely is a port

01:00:23   that needs to exist on a laptop.

01:00:24   And so here it is.

01:00:26   And then the SD card, again,

01:00:30   we've talked about this for years now,

01:00:31   but like it's not for everybody,

01:00:33   but there are lots of workflows

01:00:35   where you've got a device somewhere

01:00:36   that's recording onto an SD card

01:00:38   and you wanna get it off.

01:00:39   And you could attach that device via USB or something,

01:00:43   or maybe there's a wireless transfer,

01:00:45   but you know what's even easier and faster

01:00:47   is just to stick in the card and to your computer

01:00:50   and have it work.

01:00:51   And so this gets for all media professionals

01:00:55   who've got, whether it's photos or audio or video,

01:00:57   loaded on a card, they can just jam that card

01:00:59   into the laptop and pull that stuff off fast.

01:01:01   That is easier, no dongle required.

01:01:04   It's good.

01:01:05   - I saw someone on Twitter said this today, I think like,

01:01:07   and it's not really something I considered,

01:01:08   but an SD card slot also allows you to expand the storage

01:01:12   available on your laptop if you need that at a point.

01:01:15   - I suppose that's true, right?

01:01:16   - Right.

01:01:17   - It's not gonna be as fast.

01:01:18   - Yeah, but it's available to you.

01:01:21   Like if all you just need is, you have a one terabyte SSD,

01:01:25   but you need two terabytes for something,

01:01:28   well, you get a one terabyte SD card,

01:01:29   which is I believe is possible.

01:01:31   And now you have two terabytes if you wanted it.

01:01:33   I mean, it's not as, it's just not as fast,

01:01:36   not as maybe as easy to back up,

01:01:38   but it's expandable storage.

01:01:39   I never really considered that.

01:01:41   In my mind, the SD card slot is always just like,

01:01:43   hey, I took some photos,

01:01:45   but there is the possibility there of just

01:01:48   having it available to you at all times.

01:01:52   You know, if not necessarily critical stuff stuff,

01:01:55   you got to back up of course,

01:01:56   but that's something that's there

01:01:58   that couldn't have been otherwise.

01:01:59   We just thought that was kind of a cool usage for it.

01:02:03   So Touch Bar, they literally said the Touch Bar is gone.

01:02:07   I could not believe that.

01:02:08   - They did, they did.

01:02:09   They replaced the Touch Bar with this full height,

01:02:13   which is interesting.

01:02:13   They haven't had that in a long time.

01:02:15   They likened it.

01:02:16   I thought there was again, a little bit of a misdirection

01:02:18   where they talked about how

01:02:20   people really like this keyboard we made.

01:02:22   So we're going to do it like that.

01:02:24   But then they did say,

01:02:25   replacing the Touch Bar with this full height F key thing

01:02:30   that they're doing in an anodized black

01:02:33   kind of keyboard well.

01:02:34   So it's like a black rectangle with the black keys in it.

01:02:39   - It looks like a black,

01:02:41   just a black magic keyboard on top of a laptop.

01:02:45   Which is interesting.

01:02:46   And they said about the,

01:02:48   and they've got it on the website too,

01:02:49   with the tactile feel of mechanical keys that pros love.

01:02:53   Well, Apple, let me,

01:02:55   - Whatever.

01:02:55   - Let me talk to you.

01:02:56   (laughing)

01:02:57   Let me talk to you about that.

01:02:58   I mean, like technically sure,

01:03:00   but I mean, I have some nicer feeling keyboards

01:03:01   if you'd like to see those too.

01:03:03   - Yeah, but again, they're not like,

01:03:05   it's not the butterfly keyboard.

01:03:06   They're just sort of saying, look,

01:03:08   we know it's the actually good keyboard

01:03:10   that people are going to use.

01:03:11   - And the touch ID button is a key.

01:03:13   It's like, it's an actual key on the keyboard.

01:03:16   - Yeah, it's just, it's what we've seen before.

01:03:19   And, but you remove the touch bar and this is what you get.

01:03:22   I think it's all fine.

01:03:24   RIP to the touch bar.

01:03:26   Everybody out there who liked the touch bar.

01:03:27   It's still on that low end model for now,

01:03:29   but come on, it's not going to be there for very long.

01:03:31   The next time they rev it, it'll be gone there too.

01:03:33   It was an experiment that is, was interesting,

01:03:37   but the bottom line is it was an interesting experiment

01:03:41   that needed some work and they never did the work.

01:03:44   So either they decided it was dead on arrival

01:03:47   or they rapidly discovered that it was dead,

01:03:52   but they shipped it and then it sat there for several years.

01:03:56   But the fact, and again,

01:03:58   if you've got something out of the touch bar, that's great.

01:04:00   But all I have to do is point you to the fact

01:04:02   that they never improved it in any substantial way

01:04:07   across multiple OS revisions.

01:04:09   Like they never, even when it was new-ish,

01:04:13   they didn't ever really add anything to it.

01:04:16   And all the stuff that you could do that was interesting

01:04:18   with it was via third sort of hacky third party software.

01:04:21   And that's, that was the truest sign.

01:04:24   And it's like, did that kill it?

01:04:26   Or was that just a sign that it was dead?

01:04:28   I think it's probably the latter that within Apple,

01:04:31   very quickly, there was no support to do any extra work

01:04:34   on touch bar.

01:04:34   And so it was going to go away.

01:04:36   - And in a sign of true 2021 Apple,

01:04:40   these laptops are in most dimensions,

01:04:42   bigger and heavier than the ones they replace.

01:04:44   - Yeah.

01:04:45   - Not by a lot, but they are bigger and heavier

01:04:48   than the ones they replaced.

01:04:49   And this is probably due to the screen.

01:04:52   And they were talking about, they've done a lot of work

01:04:55   to really make the thermals work for this machine.

01:04:59   You know, I think this is like 50% better capacity

01:05:02   for airflow and they really don't want the fans

01:05:06   ever to come on, but when they do, they want it to be,

01:05:08   you know, it's going to work great.

01:05:10   I think Apple's, you know, rightly so,

01:05:12   scared itself with some thermal stuff in the past,

01:05:15   doesn't want to be in that realm again.

01:05:18   So they've done something about it

01:05:21   and they've designed these laptops

01:05:23   to really do a good job of it.

01:05:25   - Yeah. And that's fine.

01:05:28   Like the battery is weight, right?

01:05:31   That's part of the trade off there.

01:05:33   And they, I mean, let's talk about the battery for a second.

01:05:37   The battery life, I, so listeners to Upgrade Plus

01:05:41   will have heard among our rejected items

01:05:44   that we could have picked in the draft last week,

01:05:46   was one that I put in there that I thought

01:05:48   had a chance of happening, but I didn't pick it.

01:05:50   So obviously not that strong a chance,

01:05:52   which was a claim of 20 or more hours of battery life

01:05:57   for something is made.

01:06:00   And I laughed and laughed when they pointed out

01:06:03   that the 16 inch model has 21 hours of video playback.

01:06:06   And on their website, they've got a 20 plus at some point.

01:06:09   It's like as much as 20 plus hours of battery life,

01:06:13   there it is.

01:06:14   But you can see that when you've got big beefy laptops

01:06:17   that are also, you know, they've got battery life

01:06:21   and the power to energy ratio is good.

01:06:26   And then you do things like have the, you know,

01:06:29   video codex and put those in the chips

01:06:33   so you can make a video playback test.

01:06:35   That's super just like with the iPhones.

01:06:37   That's super good because it's just doing it all on the chip

01:06:41   and that's power consumption wise much lower.

01:06:44   And so you can fit it in there.

01:06:46   - And the fast charge, did you see that fast charge

01:06:48   50% in 30 minutes?

01:06:50   - In 30 minutes too.

01:06:50   Yeah, these are big battery stories

01:06:52   and that I think will hit a lot of pros,

01:06:55   especially developers that they had a four times

01:06:59   as many code compiles on a single charge in Xcode,

01:07:03   which I thought a nice little shout out

01:07:05   to the developers out there.

01:07:06   So we'll see in regular use, but it's a Apple Silicon Mac.

01:07:10   So I think we all suspected it would have dramatically

01:07:15   better battery life and it seems to.

01:07:19   So that's fantastic.

01:07:20   And we'll just have to see, you know,

01:07:22   it's all down to the details because battery life

01:07:23   is something that really, you know,

01:07:25   you encounter in the real world

01:07:27   and tests are not the real world.

01:07:28   So we're gonna have to, you know,

01:07:29   people are gonna take this and use it on battery

01:07:32   and see what happens and we're gonna hear those stories,

01:07:34   but it's looking really good.

01:07:37   - There are three power adapters that can be included

01:07:41   depending on the chip that you got.

01:07:44   There's a 67 watt, a 96 watt and a 140 watt.

01:07:49   So there's the 14 gets you a 67 or 96,

01:07:54   depending on what your CPU count is.

01:07:58   And then the 16 inch just gets a 140 watt.

01:08:01   - The big one.

01:08:01   - The 16 inch has a 100 watt hour battery

01:08:05   and the 14 has a 70 watt hour battery.

01:08:07   - There's a lot, you know, they're pro laptops.

01:08:10   There's a lot going on here, but that's all.

01:08:12   Also another example of why having MagSafe in a cable

01:08:17   is a simplification because the cable is the cable

01:08:20   and then it's just the matter of what the USB-C adapter is

01:08:24   that's providing it with power.

01:08:26   And like, I wanna stop for a second

01:08:28   and talk about MagSafe actually, because like MagSafe 3,

01:08:31   first off, they did call it MagSafe.

01:08:32   And I think that wasn't a certainty

01:08:34   just because they did take that name

01:08:36   and use it for the iPhone, but here it is too.

01:08:38   And they're acknowledging that there was a MagSafe 2

01:08:40   and this is a MagSafe 3.

01:08:42   And I wanna think about how MagSafe was a victim of USB-C,

01:08:45   basically that Apple said at some point,

01:08:47   well, we wanna do USB-C charging.

01:08:49   And so MagSafe is gonna go away

01:08:50   and now you're gonna have to plug these things in,

01:08:52   which seemed weird, right?

01:08:53   Because Apple had been extolling the virtues

01:08:56   of the magnetic connection, saving your laptop

01:09:00   from getting knocked off the table for years.

01:09:02   And then in like 2016, they basically said,

01:09:06   well, forget about that, you just plug it in now.

01:09:09   And it always seemed a little bit strange

01:09:11   that they just kind of abandoned it,

01:09:13   whether they did it for technical reasons

01:09:16   or whether they did it for aesthetic reasons, I don't know.

01:09:22   I'm very happy to have it back.

01:09:24   And I know I've said this before, but I just, I'm doing,

01:09:27   actually it's recommended by John Syracuse,

01:09:29   so he's doing it too.

01:09:30   Like I have a USB-C thing that plugs into one of the ports

01:09:34   on my MacBook Air that is MagSafe essentially,

01:09:37   and has a magnet cable that I use to charge it

01:09:40   because even on a USB-C laptop,

01:09:43   I wanted MagSafe essentially.

01:09:45   So I'm very happy that MagSafe 3 is here.

01:09:47   I imagine that in a year,

01:09:50   it will be on every single Apple laptop

01:09:52   that this is going to come back.

01:09:54   I'm also very happy that USB-C charging is also supported

01:09:59   direct in all those cables or in all those ports.

01:10:02   And that's for something we mentioned last week as well,

01:10:05   which is sometimes you got like a hub or a monitor,

01:10:10   and it needs a direct USB-C or Thunderbolt connection

01:10:15   in order to do its job.

01:10:17   And you want the one plug thing.

01:10:19   And the last thing you want is to have to plug in your

01:10:20   laptop with the one plug and then also do MagSafe

01:10:24   because you know USB-C can do power.

01:10:26   So now you can do MagSafe if you want to,

01:10:29   but if you've got that hub lifestyle, it's fine.

01:10:33   It will still work.

01:10:34   They're not making that broken by adding in MagSafe.

01:10:38   And I think that's great too.

01:10:40   They did their audio thing again, Myke.

01:10:42   You and I have been talking about this

01:10:43   since they've been this next generation,

01:10:45   starting with that 16 inch that they did in the fall of 19.

01:10:49   They've been talking about their studio quality mics,

01:10:51   which are apparently better with a 60% lower noise floor.

01:10:54   So now you can record things that are happening down

01:10:56   at your shoes, I guess, lower the floor, right?

01:10:59   Is that how that works?

01:11:00   - No, that's a technical term.

01:11:01   - Yeah, oh, is it?

01:11:03   Okay, it's not about like the height at which you record?

01:11:05   - No, that's the technical term.

01:11:06   It's about not picking up the sound of your shoes.

01:11:09   - Your shoes on the noise floor, I see.

01:11:11   - We're professionals, you must take what we're saying.

01:11:13   - You should have a quiet floor, not a noise floor.

01:11:16   That was your mistake is don't have your floor be noisy.

01:11:18   - 60% lower noise floors by adding a rug.

01:11:21   They basically added a virtual rug to the microphone.

01:11:24   - So we'll see how these are.

01:11:26   I am, I think Apple calling them studio quality

01:11:31   is kind of ridiculous.

01:11:32   I guess it depends on what studio you're in.

01:11:34   They don't sound that great

01:11:36   unless you're right up against them,

01:11:37   but they say that it's better.

01:11:39   And then they also said they seem to have devoted

01:11:41   a large portion of the space of the laptop

01:11:45   to the four woofers and two tweeters

01:11:48   in the six speaker sound system

01:11:50   that also supports spatial audio with 80% more bass.

01:11:53   You know, we'll have to hear it to see.

01:11:56   It is an interesting choice.

01:11:59   I assume they talked to pro customers

01:12:01   about the importance of getting good audio

01:12:03   out of their laptops.

01:12:04   I would think that most pro customers

01:12:06   would probably use headphones, but I don't know.

01:12:09   I mean, Apple seems to have taken a lot of pride

01:12:11   in upgrading the sound system on all of their devices.

01:12:15   And so I'm not surprised to see that here.

01:12:18   - I'm really excited about these,

01:12:19   but they get really expensive, Jason.

01:12:22   Have you poked around?

01:12:24   So they start, starts at $19.99 for the 14 inch,

01:12:27   $24.99 for the 16 inch.

01:12:29   - Right, so it's more expensive even at the base price

01:12:31   than the old 13 inch high-end was.

01:12:34   And then it just goes up from there.

01:12:37   - And these things get up to like three, 4,000, 6,000.

01:12:41   - Pretty easily.

01:12:43   - Yeah. - Pretty easily.

01:12:45   - It's not hard.

01:12:46   It's not hard to take a 64 gig with the max chip

01:12:51   and let's put eight terabytes of storage in there.

01:12:56   That'll gets me to six grand.

01:12:57   Even with two terabytes, that's 4,200, one terabyte.

01:13:03   It's 38.99.

01:13:04   Take it back down to 32, it's 34.99.

01:13:06   But like that's, yeah, these start high

01:13:11   and then go up from there.

01:13:13   - Yeah, start high, go higher.

01:13:14   - Yeah, but if you look at the power, you're like, okay.

01:13:16   I mean, it sort of makes sense

01:13:18   in terms of what power is involved and the specs involved,

01:13:21   but it is a very classic kind of Apple thing.

01:13:24   And the fact that they moved the base price up even so

01:13:29   is also kind of interesting, right?

01:13:30   Like these are pro laptops. - I'm not surprised though.

01:13:32   I'm not surprised that the base price has gone up

01:13:34   because there's more in it, you know,

01:13:37   like the screens and all that kind of stuff.

01:13:40   It is better technology.

01:13:42   And they're keeping some of the older ones around, right?

01:13:46   I don't think the 16, the 16 is just more expensive now,

01:13:48   but I think if you want a 16 inch laptop,

01:13:51   you're probably happy to pay what Apple will charge you

01:13:53   because you want a 16 inch laptop, right?

01:13:56   Like it's already a niche thing.

01:13:58   It's kind of like, yeah, I'll get it.

01:13:59   The 14 is more expensive than the 13,

01:14:01   but the 13 is still there for the time being.

01:14:04   - Yeah, that's a, I mean, maybe a problem to solve later,

01:14:08   but I look at that 13 inch M1 MacBook Pro and I think,

01:14:12   what are you?

01:14:13   Why are you here?

01:14:15   And if I had to guess- - Well, let me tell you,

01:14:16   Jason, it's a fantastic laptop, right?

01:14:18   Like I just wanna say, like I've been using one for a year

01:14:21   and it's just a superb computer, but yes,

01:14:25   it is now easy to look at and be like,

01:14:28   shouldn't you just be the MacBook Air?

01:14:30   Like, is this just for touch bar lovers?

01:14:32   Like, yeah, I understand what you mean.

01:14:34   - I don't know where they're going

01:14:36   and I know that it gives them a low price

01:14:39   to get into MacBook Pro,

01:14:40   but is it a MacBook Pro as it's now defined?

01:14:43   Like it doesn't have the screen, it has the touch bar,

01:14:47   it doesn't have the ports, it doesn't have MagSafe.

01:14:49   It's like this poor product has been,

01:14:52   ever since it was the MacBook escape back in the day,

01:14:55   this poor in between MacBook Pro has been a weird product

01:15:00   and I hope that the next time it gets revised,

01:15:03   it turns into something different.

01:15:07   I'm not quite sure what that is.

01:15:09   Is there a place for a, maybe just call it a MacBook

01:15:13   at 1299 that's a little more modern than this one,

01:15:18   but not quite up to the Pro?

01:15:20   It just, my problem with it primarily at this point

01:15:24   is that these new 14 and 16 inch MacBook Pros

01:15:27   have defined what the MacBook Pro is

01:15:29   and this, even though it's got an M1 in it,

01:15:31   it feels otherwise like a escapee

01:15:35   from the previous generation of MacBook Pro

01:15:38   and I wonder where they're gonna go with it

01:15:40   because what you don't wanna do, I would argue,

01:15:42   is pack, like the display is what it is.

01:15:46   That's one of the ways you save money.

01:15:47   You're not gonna pack the new display in there.

01:15:49   That's the 14.

01:15:50   Maybe you could put an M1 Pro chip in it.

01:15:54   Maybe you can't, I don't know,

01:15:56   but you don't wanna raise the price too much.

01:15:58   You don't wanna make it 15 or 1499

01:16:02   because they wanna hold down the low end.

01:16:04   So I just, I'm curious what they're gonna do there

01:16:06   because that product continues to feel like a weird outlier

01:16:11   that doesn't belong in either camp

01:16:13   and I don't know what they're gonna do,

01:16:15   but it does continue to exist

01:16:17   and if you need a touch bar, there it is.

01:16:20   - Yeah, it's there for you.

01:16:22   So these Macs, I think quite surprisingly,

01:16:26   you can order them right now

01:16:28   and they start shipping next week.

01:16:30   - Yeah, that's it. - That was a surprise?

01:16:32   Surprise?

01:16:33   - That was the most optimistic.

01:16:36   You and I talked about it.

01:16:37   Like, is it gonna be October or November?

01:16:40   And the answer is October.

01:16:41   They're gonna hit October 29th.

01:16:43   And so they obviously by all these stories were delayed,

01:16:48   but when it came time to announce them,

01:16:52   it was Apple knowing that they have them now

01:16:53   and they can ship them.

01:16:55   So, and that macOS Monterey is going to wrap up

01:16:57   and they're gonna push it all out the door next week.

01:17:01   - Although of course, if you're hearing this,

01:17:04   it's too late for next week.

01:17:05   - Oh yeah, because everybody's already ordered them.

01:17:07   - Yes, they've been ordered.

01:17:08   - If you haven't ordered them yet, yes, I'm sure.

01:17:10   There may be some at your local Apple store

01:17:12   you should check on launch day and go in there.

01:17:15   - I ordered one, Jason.

01:17:16   - Did you now?

01:17:17   Did you now?

01:17:18   Is your wallet feeling a little bit lighter today?

01:17:22   - Quite a lot a bit lighter, Jason.

01:17:23   I'm not gonna lie to you, my friend,

01:17:25   it's a very expensive computer.

01:17:26   - What I'm asking is what's in your wallet?

01:17:28   And the answer is not as much as it used to be.

01:17:30   - You wanna know what I got?

01:17:31   - Yeah, yeah.

01:17:32   - 14 inch MacBook Pro in space gray.

01:17:35   I realize now that I didn't even think to choose a color,

01:17:40   but space gray is what I would have gone with.

01:17:42   I got the Apple M1.

01:17:44   - You get very distracted when you're buying these things.

01:17:46   - Because I have such a limited space of time.

01:17:48   Like you were waiting for me, right?

01:17:50   And it's like, if I wanna get my order in,

01:17:52   I gotta get it in fast.

01:17:54   I went with the Mac CPU, what the system on a chip.

01:17:57   So 10 core CPU, I went with the 24 course GPU option.

01:18:01   I don't need more than that.

01:18:03   64 gigabytes of memory, just to see.

01:18:07   Two terabytes of SSD storage.

01:18:10   I got one terabyte on my current MacBook Pro

01:18:13   and I wished I wouldn't have done that.

01:18:17   Yeah, and that's it.

01:18:18   So that was very expensive.

01:18:20   - 38.99 in dollars.

01:18:22   - Yep, it's 37.99 in pounds.

01:18:24   I don't wanna know what the conversion is

01:18:26   for that in dollars.

01:18:28   So I have a MacBook Pro that I'm gonna be selling

01:18:31   to help fund it.

01:18:32   But my MacBook Pro is my main machine now

01:18:36   and has been for the last year or so.

01:18:39   And I'm especially looking at this machine

01:18:43   as travel is starting to become a thing again

01:18:45   in my not too distant future.

01:18:47   And me and that thing are gonna get on real fine.

01:18:51   And honestly, I really wished Apple would just release

01:18:54   a frigging display because that machine,

01:18:57   like this machine is gonna be so much more powerful

01:19:00   than my iMac.

01:19:02   Like I just wish they would release a display

01:19:04   and then I could just use it.

01:19:06   - That isn't a $5,000 display, yeah.

01:19:08   - Right, just give me a display

01:19:10   and then me and this MacBook Pro,

01:19:12   we could just do everything together.

01:19:13   We'll be the best of friends, you know?

01:19:16   So overall, this is pretty great, man.

01:19:20   This is pretty great, right?

01:19:22   - It's pretty good.

01:19:23   Hanging out there, I know we talked about the chips earlier.

01:19:26   I think I would expect that at some point

01:19:29   in the next few months, we'll see some other products

01:19:32   with these chips.

01:19:33   I really think that there's a possibility

01:19:37   that 24-inch iMac will get an M1 Pro option,

01:19:41   but it may wait until they have a larger iMac

01:19:46   so that they can do those at the same time, right?

01:19:49   - I think so, I think it's iMac Pro.

01:19:50   - Like basically, I think the argument would be,

01:19:53   I don't wanna tempt people into buying this small iMac

01:19:57   with the Pro chip when I know as if I'm Apple

01:20:01   that there's the bigger iMac coming, I might hold off,

01:20:04   but it's right there as is the Mac Mini, honestly.

01:20:08   Like the Mac Mini, it seems like they could do that

01:20:12   fairly simply with an announcement

01:20:14   that they're gonna put the M1 Pro as an option

01:20:18   in the Mac Mini with more ports,

01:20:20   and that doesn't require an event for them to do that.

01:20:22   They could do that at any time.

01:20:24   And I imagine they will do that at some point, event or not.

01:20:29   Maybe they hold all this off

01:20:30   and there's a Mac event in the spring

01:20:32   where there's a new iMac

01:20:33   and that there are other updates that happen then.

01:20:35   They could also just in the next few months,

01:20:36   just say, "Oh yes, here it is," in a press release,

01:20:40   and that would be fine.

01:20:41   But I'm excited by that because now you can see

01:20:43   it doesn't just stop at the M1.

01:20:45   And that's the, for me, I mean,

01:20:47   if you bought a MacBook Pro like Myke did,

01:20:49   then this is a big announcement because of the MacBook Pro.

01:20:53   For the rest of us, it's still a big day

01:20:55   because we now have a spread of Apple Silicon products

01:20:59   and we have a much better idea

01:21:01   of sort of where Apple is headed

01:21:02   with the rest of the Mac product line

01:21:04   during the rest of this transition.

01:21:06   And as somebody who is waiting anxiously for a big iMac,

01:21:12   like this is great news because now,

01:21:15   essentially I know what's gonna be in my next computer.

01:21:18   I know what chip is gonna be in it.

01:21:20   It's gonna be an M1 Pro or an M1 Max.

01:21:24   That's what's gonna be in my iMac.

01:21:26   Go to upgradeyourwardrobe.com

01:21:30   and you can find some wonderful upgrade merchandise.

01:21:33   You can get yourself the upgrade logo tee

01:21:35   or the upgrade hoodie.

01:21:37   Go to upgradeyourwardrobe.com and you can pick those up.

01:21:40   I'd like to thank our sponsors for this week's episode.

01:21:42   Things Set Up in Capital One.

01:21:45   And also thanks to everybody who supports the show directly.

01:21:48   You can go to upgrade, getupgradeplus.com,

01:21:50   go to getupgradeplus.com and you can sign up

01:21:53   and you'll get longer ad-free versions of the show.

01:21:56   I have no doubt Jason will have many more words

01:21:59   to write over at sixcolors.com in the upcoming days.

01:22:03   Especially with Monterey on the horizon.

01:22:06   - Man.

01:22:07   - I'm sure you're gonna be working hard.

01:22:08   - I got a lot of words already,

01:22:10   already socked away for that one.

01:22:11   I gotta finish up and it's gonna be a busy week.

01:22:14   Big week, good week.

01:22:15   Very excited. - Big week, good week.

01:22:16   - And let's hope, by the way,

01:22:18   that this is it for this year, but we'll see.

01:22:20   We'll see.

01:22:22   - Jason is @jasonl on Twitter.

01:22:23   I'm @imike, I-M-Y-K-E.

01:22:26   And we'll be back next week.

01:22:28   Until then, say goodbye Jason Snell.

01:22:30   - Goodbye Jason Snell.

01:22:31   (upbeat music)

01:22:34   [ Music ]