237: New iMacs, iPads, and the 2019 March Event Draft


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:08   From Relay FM, this is Upgrade episode 237. Today's show is brought to you by Luna Display,

00:00:16   Squarespace and Green Chef and oh boy do we have a big super special episode for you today. My name

00:00:23   is Myke Hurley and I am joined by Mr Jason Snell. Hello Jason Snell. Hey Myke Hurley, um

00:00:30   I think Apple has woken from its um post-Christmas slumber. It's out of the Apple is out of

00:00:38   hibernation. Jason we have a huge show today so my hashtag SnellTalk question comes from me and

00:00:45   it's to you. What is happening on today's episode? Uh lots of things are happening on today's episode

00:00:51   Myke. There's a draft that'll happen later. Because we have an event next week. Next week Monday I will

00:00:57   be there, Steve Jobs Theater, uh services, we're doing a draft and because it's a different

00:01:02   kind of event we have planned a different kind of draft haven't we? It's going to be the experimental

00:01:08   upgrade draft. But what do we have before that? Well I'm glad you asked. Before that we have

00:01:14   something fun. We have an interview. We do. Which is not the first time we've done interviews here

00:01:20   on the show. We did, I did those interviews um a while ago uh from the Masters of Automation event

00:01:26   and we've had a few guests and all that. This is this one's a little different. I got a chance to

00:01:31   sit down with Colleen Novielli who you may not have heard of but you probably will again in the future.

00:01:38   She is the iMac product manager and we have new iMacs to talk about because after a little bit

00:01:44   less than two years the iMacs have gotten refreshed and I got a chance to sit down with

00:01:49   Colleen who basically her job is to live, breathe, eat, drink iMac and talk a little bit about her

00:01:58   and her background coming to Apple and how that informs what she's doing with these new iMacs and

00:02:06   we talk we have some processor specs and stuff in there too. A good conversation with uh with

00:02:12   somebody a new voice honestly a new voice from Apple and I love that Apple is doing these podcast

00:02:17   interviews now and bringing some of their people out to be seen and heard. I think it's uh I

00:02:23   think it's good I think it's good to for everybody to have some perspective about Apple as a company

00:02:28   that's made up of lots of people who work really hard on these products and we can criticize them

00:02:33   and and we do but I think it is also really great to hear from the people who who this is their

00:02:40   career is caring about these products that get released and and Colleen definitely is one of

00:02:45   those people. Yeah this is really exciting for us of course and uh yeah we think that you're going

00:02:50   to love it too and of course that is also noting something you may not know dear Upgradient that

00:02:55   there not only was iPads yesterday there's new iMacs today because we have released this kind of

00:03:04   on an embargo from Apple so Jason has details and we're going to talk about those. Right so news

00:03:09   news breaking is yes there are new iMacs if you haven't heard that already let us break that news

00:03:16   new iMacs after a little less than two years with new processors and there's even some ninth

00:03:22   generation Intel processors in there which is kind of interesting and uh yeah so the the Apple's

00:03:29   refreshing a lot of product lines Myke this week even just a lot of refreshing going on but I can't

00:03:36   even believe this is a follow-up item that we're just like breezing past but uh it is WWDC announced

00:03:44   June 3rd to 7th in San Jose uh it is happening I guess we all knew it was gonna happen but that is

00:03:51   pretty much all we have to say about it today because we have many many more things to cover

00:03:56   and so I guess we should probably just jump straight into the interview Jason do you think

00:04:01   that sounds good yeah that sounds great here then dear listeners is that interview okay I'm here

00:04:08   with Colleen Novielli who is the iMac product manager you have new iMacs congratulations we do

00:04:14   and thank you very much we're very excited thank you for coming on the on the show I wanted to ask

00:04:20   so I don't know if we've met before and I don't know if people know you but you are the iMac

00:04:24   product manager which is a pretty big responsibility do you have a you have a Mac story have you how

00:04:30   how long have you been using Macs I do my Mac story starts in I'll say about 2006 or 7

00:04:37   I was working in Philadelphia and I was forced into using a PC as part of of my business and

00:04:45   I had always heard about iMacs, Macs in particular, Macbooks and I wanted something portable so I

00:04:54   decided that I was going to by myself save my money buy myself one of the white polycarbonate

00:04:59   Macbooks I thought it was super exciting and beautiful I actually bought it on craigslist

00:05:05   it was one of my first craigslist purchases ever I think craigslist is a pretty new phenomenon at

00:05:10   the time and so I met someone in a coffee shop and classic craigslist exactly and we exchanged

00:05:18   some cash and I found myself with one of the most beautiful purchases I had ever made in my life and

00:05:22   that was my first Macbook that's awesome I you know when I bought my iMac Pro I sold my 5k iMac

00:05:29   on craigslist and yes indeed we went to a Starbucks and did you oh I was gonna kid about

00:05:34   that you brought a Mac to a Starbucks with cash that's awesome nope it happens it happens and so

00:05:40   your you know your background you've been at Apple what five years almost five years how did you how

00:05:45   did you come to Apple I came to Apple because in my previous career I have worked in product

00:05:51   development research and development and a lot of product development functions and I decided I

00:05:57   wanted to go back and get my MBA so I got a master's in marketing specializing in topics like product

00:06:04   development and I decided that I wanted to work for the company that I thought had the best product

00:06:10   development in the world I saw Apple as the ultimate focusing on the customer and customer

00:06:16   experience and then turning that into the best products that exist beautiful in form and also

00:06:24   absolutely wonderful wonderfully designed Mac OS and Mac hardware and function and so I set my

00:06:32   sights on Apple and I was lucky enough to get an internship with the Mac team all right let's hear

00:06:36   it for that I started as an intern too yes that's the great way in it's a great way in yeah that's

00:06:41   really hard treat it as an interview and hopefully you get lucky that's right and then hopefully they

00:06:45   remember you and they're like I like that intern that's right hopefully they remember you is right

00:06:49   yes have lunch with as many people as possible so that they remember your name I didn't know we were

00:06:53   going to have intern advice but that's fine we may pivot here to advice for interns that's right

00:06:58   all right so you come to Apple yes and I don't know if you know this but the technology industry

00:07:03   has a reputation of being kind of a boys club not like it used to be but there are so there are a lot

00:07:10   of men on stage at events and the you know there's a perception of that and certainly when I you know

00:07:16   20 years ago when I started doing this that was definitely the perception and here you are the

00:07:22   iMac product manager and not a member of the boys club that's true this is I mean I don't want to

00:07:28   make this something that that is a like a defining issue or something like that but clearly it's

00:07:33   something that you've had to think about about being a woman in a increasingly visible role in a

00:07:38   technology company that's very visible yes itself yes that's true so first of all Apple is a you

00:07:45   know a company that prides itself on having a lot of diversity and there are women at Apple who are

00:07:51   great strong leaders and coming to Apple I was able to pretty immediately find some awesome

00:07:57   women role models for me at Apple I think that a lot of times when you talk about women in tech

00:08:04   you talk about women needing to help other women come along in tech and so then then there'd be

00:08:09   more women to me being a woman in tech is all about finding role models and then being a role

00:08:15   model I think when you're younger and you're trying to figure out you know what what can I be

00:08:20   you look for people who are like you so a really good example I think is that now that a woman has

00:08:26   run for president of the United States I think more women or more girls if you were to walk into

00:08:31   a classroom tomorrow would raise their hand and say you know if you said do you think you can be

00:08:35   president they would say yeah I think I could be and eventually when a woman does become president

00:08:40   I think every girl would raise their hand and say you know I think I can be because when you see

00:08:44   someone doing something who's like you then you're more apt to say oh well well I could do that and

00:08:50   so I think for me I've always looked for women you know oh I can be like that woman not that I

00:08:57   couldn't be like a man too but I think there's something to to finding someone who's just like

00:09:01   you in a lot of ways and then I strive to be that for other women other girls who you know I want to

00:09:07   give them a role model to say I could do that I could be a product manager at Apple and then

00:09:12   more women come into the tech industry that way. I think that with my own kids I've definitely seen

00:09:17   that that you don't say anything they are so observant and I do think that there's at least

00:09:22   in some kids that reluctance where they're like am I allowed to do this am I in this space and

00:09:27   as adults you might think well of course yes exactly but if a kid doesn't feel like they

00:09:31   are represented then they may just internalize it's not for me it's not I'm not allowed to do

00:09:36   that I 100 agree with you yes. So um iMac obviously your life now your job now yes is all about the

00:09:44   iMac it is yeah so this is before your time a little bit but I get to do that now having done

00:09:49   this for this long I get to do this the iMac when it came out yes was um it was a big deal but it

00:09:55   was also a it was a consumer product it was a low-end product it was a product that was very

00:10:02   possible very popular with the masses but there were always those snooty Power Mac users who was

00:10:07   like you know it's it's for it's fine for some uses and over the years the iMac has really evolved

00:10:13   and changed in a lot of different ways it became I think the default Mac I was one of those people

00:10:19   who was like well I just buy a Power Mac I was like I don't I buy iMacs I switched to the iMac

00:10:24   a long time ago yeah now we live in an era where we have probably more than three quarters of the

00:10:30   Macs Apple cells are laptops totally um the we all have iPhones we all have iPads so obviously and

00:10:40   you and I were talking before we started we both were going to talk about this which is the role of

00:10:44   the iMac because the role of the iMac I guess is always shifting but it keeps shifting so what

00:10:50   you know what are the the ecological niches that the iMac fills today what's the role of an iMac in

00:10:56   2019 I think that that is a great question one that I have spent a lot of time thinking about

00:11:02   myself and the teams at Apple you know you mentioned I wasn't at Apple when the iMac was

00:11:08   born lucky enough and this is a little known fact but my boss Tom Boger was actually the original

00:11:13   iMac product manager and so it's amazing that I get to learn from him some of the things that were

00:11:19   important from the original iMac and the iMac throughout its life the iMac has evolved quite

00:11:26   drastically since its inception as this approachable computer to get everyone onto the internet

00:11:31   throughout its life there were several notable points that I'll point to one thing that happened

00:11:38   was the 16 by 9 aspect ratio when it took on this aspect ratio it now became the source of content

00:11:46   both creation and consumption for a lot of pros and then I think along the way it also took on

00:11:52   the retina 4k and 5k retina displays which are incredible they're incredible for consumers but

00:11:58   they're also incredible for pros who are relying on the 4k 5k resolution 218 pixels per inch what

00:12:06   we call retina quality to really do their work to see that color and to see that detail that was

00:12:11   2014 that was a big step forward yes exactly for the iMac exactly retina versions of it and so in

00:12:17   this evolution I think it has evolved into a product that really spans the widest breadth

00:12:23   of consumer to pro in the Mac lineup you have very very entry-level consumers you have people who are

00:12:30   very new to Mac and then at the other end of the spectrum you have some serious pros using this

00:12:34   every day as their lifeblood and this is you know what they rely on day in and day out to get their

00:12:38   work done right that base model which hasn't changed we should say that base model still

00:12:43   is the one that was there before but that is that model exists to point to people who are

00:12:49   who don't need a lot in terms of of the highest of high tech but they want to have that computer that

00:12:56   they can afford to have that computer that's got it all in one they don't have to hook up a monitor

00:13:01   or something like that it's just that and and then it goes up from there to almost now with these new

00:13:05   models almost at iMac pro territory so it's covering a lot of ground it is covering a lot

00:13:11   of ground yes it's a product that really spans many many customer use cases and the way within

00:13:18   both of those product categories so consumer and pro the customers are using the product has also

00:13:23   evolved quite significantly as when the first iMac was introduced it was really your central computing

00:13:29   unit your central desktop unit now a lot of people as you mentioned are doing their compute

00:13:34   in a mobile space right they're having they have iPhones and they have iPads sometimes they have

00:13:38   both they have Mac books that they want to take with them in a portable fashion and then they

00:13:44   have iMac which has become in a lot of ways to some people a complementary or ecosystem product

00:13:49   that they're using alongside of those other devices so the the tables have turned a little

00:13:53   bit where it used to be sort of like the home computer was the center and I think the digital

00:13:59   hub Steve Jobs unveiled was part of that like and then there was that moment where I said oh it's

00:14:03   actually everywhere the iMac is kind of like that too where when when you're talking about in a home

00:14:09   now what we think of is this is the device that we park somewhere in the home and that everybody can

00:14:14   use when they need a bigger screen or more power or just a different context it's not the only

00:14:21   place to go now it's a place for everyone to go when they need it yes that is absolutely correct

00:14:27   and I'll talk just a little bit about the different ways that people are using it in the home

00:14:31   so I think that everyone is familiar with the home office set up where you have your iMac and you're

00:14:36   using your iMac either to run your business from your home or really that kind of central

00:14:40   productivity device for your family you're probably doing Safari you're looking for news

00:14:46   you're looking and checking your email at the same time you're looking at your family calendar

00:14:50   and you're multitasking between a lot of consumer productivity applications and then it has evolved

00:14:57   in this way that I think is really beautiful for the family and that is as a shared desktop space

00:15:04   and sometimes that space is outside of a home office for example in more of a family room where

00:15:08   it can be more of a communal kind of more fluid type of product used in conjunction with your

00:15:13   other devices. You sit your kid down at the computer do their homework but then in another

00:15:18   context the parents are using it for something and then in a different context maybe you're playing a

00:15:23   movie on the on the big screen especially on the 27 inch model and it's a like you said ecosystem

00:15:29   earlier I think that's really interesting that it's part of your larger story instead of being

00:15:36   just the story it's just part of a bigger story. That's absolutely right one thing that's really

00:15:41   benefiting this this types of these types of customer scenarios is continuity and so continuity

00:15:47   is an amazingly seamless way to move whatever you're doing from your iOS device to your Mac

00:15:53   and vice versa and so I'll just give you a couple examples of how that would be used in a home as a

00:15:58   shared desktop. So picture your family and you're all sitting around in your living room and one or

00:16:04   more family members may be on their iOS device so they have their iPhone or they have their iPad

00:16:09   and maybe someone gets a text message from a friend and it has a link to a website and so they

00:16:14   pull it up on their phone and it's great to use websites on the big beautiful phones of our iPhones

00:16:20   and iPads but sometimes it would be nice to walk up to a 27 inch iMac and use continuity to pull up

00:16:26   that same website and look at it full screen. Look I love my iPad Pro but I definitely have those

00:16:32   moments where I say I'm just gonna go to the iPad the iMac now absolutely I just it's the right

00:16:38   because it's the right context and if I want to use continuity stuff it will actually my doc will

00:16:43   pop up and say here exactly that's what you were looking for right and so in that sense it's really

00:16:47   a bigger more it's very beautiful display that you're using and you're able to continue all of

00:16:54   the things that you're doing on your other devices but it also has the processing power of a desktop

00:16:59   computer and so you're able to do basic things like pull up Safari and messages but then also

00:17:04   when you do want to do productivity or even pro tasks you can use that shared desktop in that space

00:17:08   as well. All right so we talked about kind of a consumer and family concept and then you mentioned

00:17:14   pro there that is the other part of the story with these iMacs it's been the story and now it's even

00:17:19   more so that at the top end there's this I cannot tell you how many people I know personally who

00:17:27   have said I can't decide between the high-end iMac or the iMac Pro because there is this there's a gap

00:17:34   there and there's sort of this question of like do I want the specced up iMac or the base model

00:17:40   iMac Pro and I feel like with the with the changes that you're making with these 2019 versions of the

00:17:46   iMac that it may be a little bit clearer because some of that gap can go away and so you can it's

00:17:53   maybe a little bit more easier to pick your spot in the iMac line now? Yeah I think that the way

00:17:57   that you're thinking about it is exactly right we do think of iMac as a family both iMac and iMac Pro

00:18:03   and we think that it suits an entire range of customers from your base level consumers like

00:18:07   I said before all the way up to your serious pro with an iMac and then iMac Pro takes it to a new

00:18:12   level for workstation class performance with the new updates now you're able to go all the way up

00:18:18   to an eight core processor with iMac 27 inch iMac and you're also able to configure all the way up

00:18:23   to a radium pro Vega graphics option with 48 compute units and we do think that that will

00:18:32   serve the needs of many pro customers who want to use the 27 inch iMac and want to configure up to

00:18:38   an eight core processor and up to radium pro graphics Vega graphics but we then have iMac Pro

00:18:46   and iMac Pro starts with the Xeon processor at eight cores it starts with 32 gigs of memory it

00:18:52   starts with a one terabyte SSD you have your four Thunderbolt ports and you have 10 gigabit ethernet

00:18:59   and so we think that there's a distinction there for the customers who want to kind of start at

00:19:03   that level configure a workstation class workhorse performance iMac and configure up from there

00:19:10   right so it makes it makes sense that there are people who might have chosen the base model iMac

00:19:15   Pro and you know I think people go through this have gone through this in the last year

00:19:20   but now there's a little more space for them to pick their their spot and and not necessarily need

00:19:27   to go to the iMac Pro if they don't need to because there's a lot of fundamental power that can get

00:19:31   built into those higher end configured order versions of the of the 27 inch the 5k iMac yes

00:19:37   I think that there's an iMac now that will fit that whole spectrum of pro needs well we should talk

00:19:42   about computer things yes I suppose since we're talking about this the previous iMacs yes were from

00:19:50   2017 I believe yes that's right June of 2017 all right so it's been not quite two years yep and

00:19:57   one of the things that struck me about the new specs yes in these models is that those were

00:20:02   sixth generation Intel is that right those were seventh generation generation yes the new ones

00:20:09   yes are eighth and in some cases ninth generation that is correct depending on what you buy you may

00:20:16   actually leapfrog a generation that's true in these in these systems so tell me um tell me

00:20:22   about the the ninth generation Intel you've got these cores I should I I'm getting very excited

00:20:28   about cores here we should step back yes okay every 5k iMac has at least six cores that's correct

00:20:34   so that's very exciting that's a good line it's a great start and then if you say well that's not

00:20:38   enough you have an eight core i9 option that's absolutely correct and that's the ninth generation

00:20:45   yes well yes so I'll clarify a bit so on the 27 inch iMac we are going to have across the

00:20:52   three base configurations that are available and will be available today we have two eighth

00:20:58   generation six core parts on two of the configurations and then on the highest standard

00:21:02   configuration we move to ninth generation ninth generation is also our eight core CTO or configure

00:21:09   to order part as well and that's the i9 part and Intel just recently in the fall announced their

00:21:16   ninth generation of processors and so we are using the two processor parts that were available and

00:21:23   were a right fit for the iMac family at the time and then the remaining configurations have the

00:21:29   latest eighth generation processors right which is still an improvement some upgrade six cores

00:21:34   across the line for the 27 inch iMac awesome performance over the iMacs that were current

00:21:39   as of yesterday correct but you did you did take these two so it's in the good better best of the

00:21:44   5k the best is going to be that ninth generation processor yes ninth generation six core yeah and

00:21:51   then you can configure that i9 if you want the bestest of the best above that that's absolutely

00:21:56   correct that's pretty cool now on the on the 4k version yes what are you doing there on the 4k

00:22:02   version so again we have the 1099 configuration that is not being updated tomorrow the updates

00:22:08   are today the updates will be for the 1299 configuration and above so our retina 4k models

00:22:15   the 1299 has a quad core processor today it will continue to have a quad core eighth generation

00:22:20   processor and then the 1499 base configuration will have a six core eighth generation processor

00:22:27   and the configure to order option is also an eighth generation six core i7 so now with hyper

00:22:33   threading processor so i like this because one of the things that always struck me um because i do

00:22:38   work at an iMac yes every day yes is that is a big screen in my face and i've come to like it i've

00:22:44   come to use it but sometimes i think do i need 27 inches and the answer is well no maybe i don't

00:22:51   but i i need the power and in the end i bought an iMac pro so of course that was my decision but

00:22:57   one of the things that i like in seeing what happened to the 21.5 inch yep is it's it's got

00:23:05   more power it's got more capability it is not you know you you can you can configure it up to

00:23:11   something that is pretty dramatic in including a vega uh gpu that's right yes um so we don't like

00:23:18   to say that the 21.5 inches for consumers and the 27 inches for pros um surely many pros use the 27

00:23:25   inch configurations because they want the biggest uh most beautiful um largest profile to work and

00:23:32   do all of all of their professional editing um but the 21.5 inch iMac also has a lot of pro customers

00:23:39   if you think about it there are many situations where there are space constraints both here in

00:23:43   the us but also internationally a lot of times you don't have space constraints in the home or in the

00:23:48   business and so we want to provide those customers the opportunity to take advantage of the new

00:23:52   processing power and graphics power too i want to talk storage with you okay and this is so okay so

00:23:58   the iMac pro got this redesign where it's SSD only and the Mac mini got a redesign where it's SSD

00:24:08   only just the flash storage using that space in both models actually for ventilation that's right

00:24:13   that hasn't happened on the iMac at least yet so you still have sort of the spinning disk option

00:24:22   and the fusion drive option and then the SSD option is that philosophy about making sure

00:24:30   you can balance price with with performance because spinning disks i don't you know they're

00:24:36   not great they're slow um they're not reliable SSDs are so great but i look at the prices of

00:24:44   these iMacs and i think well if you kick out spinning disks they're all going to get way

00:24:48   more expensive is that really the the story here about why the iMac needs to have that cover that

00:24:53   spectrum uh yeah i think um you know i'll think about it just just a little bit differently um

00:24:58   similar to similarly to what you were just saying um when you think about where you really need

00:25:04   all flash storage um you really need it in a notebook right you want to keep your notebooks

00:25:08   as thin as light as possible um spinning drive technology is probably not something um in 2019

00:25:13   that you want to be carting around with you from a mobile perspective and you know from an iMac

00:25:18   pro perspective here we're talking about serious pros who are running through terabytes of data

00:25:23   in their daily workflow and for them having all flash stories storage is super important

00:25:28   when you think about the iMac line we want to provide a range of customer of storage for

00:25:33   customers at all different kinds of price points that are affordable to customers and you can pick

00:25:38   based on what your workflow is and what you need so the great thing about our fusion drive technology

00:25:43   is it partners a super fast SSD which for most customers will keep all the applications and

00:25:49   things they do on a regular basis basis there and have that be super snappy performance for them

00:25:54   and it also gives them the capacity of an of a hard drive which um and for some SSD you know

00:26:01   technologies is not necessarily the the most affordable option and so fusion drive is giving

00:26:06   you the best of both worlds it's giving you the SSD and it's also allowing you across the iMac

00:26:11   line to have a terabyte or more of storage and up on the 27 inch line we actually give a two terabyte

00:26:16   fusion drive as a standard configuration for some of those pros so yeah and I I'm definitely not

00:26:23   trying to get you to say well yes this is uh this is our decision I just think it's obvious this is

00:26:28   the way Apple's going with all the other products and the iMac can't quite get there yet I would

00:26:32   imagine that related to that is the fact that you've updated all these models and they all keep

00:26:37   their price points they're not they're they didn't get a price increase or anything like that the

00:26:42   slots the old slots for the prices of good better and best are the same right they are so that's I

00:26:51   guess that's part of the story too is that ultimately we would all like to spend money

00:26:55   on a terabyte flash drive but that I I know what those costs are it's going to make it a much more

00:27:00   expensive product and and so that's why we have fusion drive I suppose um I love that we were able

00:27:05   to provide processors with six cores and give really awesome performance up performance updates

00:27:11   at the same price points across the line and then from a storage perspective we really love the fact

00:27:17   that we're able to give such a variety of storage for the really really broad range of customers we

00:27:21   talked about at the beginning and then they can choose which right for them so what is the most

00:27:28   interesting thing about these new iMacs that we haven't talked about what what what have we not

00:27:33   we've talked about chips a lot we've talked about where they live in the in the family is there

00:27:38   something else that that you think people should know about these that we haven't talked about yes

00:27:43   I think one of the most interesting things is the way that iMacs are a critical part of

00:27:51   the design of homes but also businesses large and small throughout the world and the anecdote

00:27:59   I'll say there is I like to travel a lot I travel a lot for work and also like to travel in my free

00:28:05   time as a hobby and it's probably because I'm the iMac product manager but I notice iMacs everywhere

00:28:12   and so within the last year or two I have been to Vietnam and Singapore and Hong Kong I've been to

00:28:20   New Zealand I've been to many places in Europe and wherever I go there are iMacs in storefronts in

00:28:26   businesses everywhere they're in salons and they're in real estate agencies and they're in fitness

00:28:32   studios they're in hotels I saw a few in an airport a few months ago and it really speaks

00:28:39   to the way that customers are proud of putting iMac in their space if you think about a small

00:28:45   business owner who has spent months designing their new space they've designed the flooring

00:28:49   and they've designed the wallpaper or paint and the artwork and the furniture and then it gets

00:28:54   down to picking a desktop that they want at their check-in. A big plastic box a lot of cables that'll

00:29:01   look great. No that doesn't fit in with the whole design aesthetic right and so they want something

00:29:05   they can be really proud of and also helps to elevate that design and you are seeing that

00:29:10   everywhere so it's not just in the home it's for businesses of all sizes and I just I really love

00:29:15   the fact that all customers that use iMac love them and are so proud of them to display them

00:29:20   like that. So how do you find interesting ways that people use iMacs because you've obviously

00:29:26   talked about it here a lot different places we said it's not you know it's always changing what

00:29:32   it's for and it's got these niches that it's in now where do you get your other than traveling

00:29:38   and seeing them everywhere do you are you are you on like social media looking at people who were

00:29:43   saying check out my iMac and things like that? I am I am I absolutely am I think someone fed you

00:29:47   that question because everyone I work with at Apple knows me as going out to social media all

00:29:52   the time and looking at my product and seeing what it's doing and then coming back and and those are

00:29:56   the real uses of your product right? That's absolutely right so you know I think historically

00:30:00   research of a product has been clearly going into the store and trying to see what customers are

00:30:05   asking for there's quantitative and qualitative research that research companies do trying to ask

00:30:09   customers how they're using it I think today a really real way to get feedback right away is just

00:30:14   to go to social media so I do this all the time for iMac I go to Instagram or Twitter I go to

00:30:21   Facebook and I type in hashtag iMac and I usually only pull posts from the last 48 hours between you

00:30:27   know when I'm looking 48 hours since and at any given time posts come up from all over the world

00:30:35   so Instagram for example there was one day where I pulled posts this was about six months ago before

00:30:41   I was I was doing an internal presentation on the iMac and I pulled posts down from New Zealand,

00:30:47   Australia, Vietnam, Moscow, two places in Europe and the United States that was all within 48 hours

00:30:55   and I took the text that was said on the Instagram post and I translated it because I don't speak all

00:31:01   of those languages and they were all saying the same thing in a sense they were saying hey look

00:31:08   at my newly designed office hey look at my newly designed family room look I just bought an iMac

00:31:14   hey friends look at me in the store making this purchase of an iMac that I'm so proud of

00:31:18   there were a couple of parents with their kids next to the iMac you know hugging the iMac box

00:31:24   and I'm so proud to get my iMac and to me it's a really special thing I think if you think in

00:31:32   generalities how many people are posting about a desktop and how proud that makes them and how

00:31:37   it elevates their space I think the iMac is very unique in that sense and it makes me very proud

00:31:42   about how much customers love them. Do you pass that on? Is that actionable intel in terms of

00:31:49   where you go next with the iMac seeing how people are using your product is that the most important

00:31:56   thing to think keep in mind that customer? Definitely I think that being in touch with

00:32:02   the customer and their needs and what they're doing is one of the most important things

00:32:06   I think product development goes beyond that and I think you know Steve certainly had this vision

00:32:11   you don't ask customers what they want you listen to their intrinsic needs what are they saying that

00:32:16   they want but what are they not saying that they want what is it they really want to do maybe

00:32:21   things that they don't know that they want to do yet but you kind of undercover that intrinsic need

00:32:25   that they have and then base your product development off of those types of things.

00:32:28   So I guess totally understand that that that it's the faster horse thing right like people

00:32:34   didn't say they wanted a car they said they wanted a faster horse yes and so you have to see what

00:32:37   their needs are. Surely you see some of these things and you're surprised like wow that is not

00:32:43   like I would imagine because people are very clever and they you you make a product and say well here

00:32:48   is our product and we think it'll be used this way yeah and I would imagine every now and then you

00:32:52   say to yourself oh I had no idea that people were using that product that way. Yeah like when you

00:32:57   see a woman picture of a woman using one on a train that's a couple in coffee shops those are

00:33:02   the ones that are technically it's an all-in-one it's kind of portable yeah the 27-inch please but

00:33:10   that's that's right to me I think one of the more interesting uses now that is popping up is with

00:33:18   kids so we all know that students are learning to use iPads and Macs at a very young age they're

00:33:26   using them in school they're using them as part of their classroom assignments and then they're using

00:33:31   them for their homework assignments and so a lot of kids are coming home and they want to continue

00:33:35   to use iOS and Mac OS devices because it's what they're used to from school and so they're using

00:33:40   IMAX to do homework and in a shared family space the mom and dad can review their homework monitor

00:33:46   their homework it's very easy for them to use and then further to that kids are starting to use pro

00:33:52   applications today they're starting to code and to use applications that go along with coding like

00:33:57   Xcode they're learning the Swift language and they're using through that everyone can code

00:34:02   curriculum so you got your Swift playgrounds on your iPad and you come home and you're like hmm

00:34:06   maybe I can build an app now it is I mean that's absolutely right kids are coding and they're using

00:34:11   Xcode on the Mac and for IMAX in particular it's a big beautiful screen that they can use to do not

00:34:17   only their keynote and pages homework that they have to complete but then they can use Xcode and

00:34:22   they can build an app and I think that's awesome. So I'm not going to ask you the question that

00:34:28   everybody wants me to ask you which is which is you know about the future because the future is

00:34:33   known to nobody especially Apple people speaking publicly but I hope that that there you know will

00:34:41   be more iMac and iMac Pro news in the future but this has been a lot of fun I know that a lot of

00:34:49   people out there have been anxiously awaiting you know how it works everybody's excited the new iMac

00:34:54   comes out and then time passes on and then everybody's like where's the new iMac again

00:34:58   yes and here it is and here it is so I'm glad that it's finally here yes and it looks great and I

00:35:04   want to thank you for being on the podcast too because I know this is a new thing for you.

00:35:08   I want to thank you for having me this has been wonderful. It's been great to talk about this

00:35:12   stuff and I'm just going to say it again Colleen Novielli is the iMac product manager thank you so

00:35:18   much for being here absolutely thank you so much Jason. This episode of Upgrade is brought to you

00:35:22   by Green Chef. Green Chef is a meal delivery service that includes everything that you're

00:35:27   going to need to cook delicious gourmet meals that you can feel good about because Green Chef

00:35:32   will send you a wide variety of organic ingredients and imaginative new recipes every single week.

00:35:38   Their meal plans include options for paleo, vegan, vegetarian, keto, gluten-free, omnivore, carnivore.

00:35:46   Green Chef is the first USDA certified organic meal delivery service and they offer those

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00:35:56   yourself over at Green Chef. Each ingredient is thoughtfully sourced and its journey is tracked

00:36:01   from planting to plating and their recipes include pre-made sauces and dressings and spices so you can

00:36:07   get more flavor in less time. Every ingredient is hand-picked and delivered right to your door.

00:36:13   Anyone can be a cook with Green Chef's help including Jason Snell. Hi Jason Snell what have

00:36:18   you been cooking with Green Chef? Uh so my Green Chef stuff I mean we got the vegetarian box which

00:36:24   is interesting they have menus for all sorts of different diet types and although I'm not a

00:36:30   vegetarian we have various food issues in our house that made that the best choice for us and

00:36:35   we got some Japanese vegetable fritters which were let me tell you one great way to to do vegetables

00:36:45   is to put some like uh bready stuff on them and fry them. That is the Jason Snell approved vegetable

00:36:52   method. Just fry it vegetables well roasting is the right way to do it but if you want to have a

00:36:56   special treat those are really good and we also had actually a variation on something that we

00:37:00   we make ourselves which is a sweet potato enchilada which is really nice that we do a sweet

00:37:05   potato quesadilla and sweet potato as a filling in Mexican stuff is actually pretty great and that had

00:37:11   you know corn and um Monterey Jack cheese and that was really good too so yeah it's all good stuff. I

00:37:16   want to make that so I'm gonna be stealing those recipes. For $50 off your first box of Green Chef

00:37:24   go to greenchef.us/upgrade that is greenchef.us/upgrade for $50 off your first box of Green Chef.

00:37:32   Our thanks to Green Chef for their support of this show and Relay FM. Well Myke there is our

00:37:38   there's our first surely the first of many um interviews with uh with uh somebody who works at

00:37:44   Apple on the products that we talk about all the time. Yeah I'm really excited about this I I think

00:37:49   you know there are there must be so many wonderful people at Apple like Colleen who know what they're

00:37:56   talking about and have things to say and and I really do hope that this is the start of them

00:38:02   doing more and more of this like we have people that want to know about this stuff. Yeah I think

00:38:08   it benefits them because it's so easy Apple's so huge it's so easy to think of them as this model

00:38:13   monolithic entity and in fact you know it is it's just people who care about their jobs yeah and uh

00:38:19   care about the products they make and use the products I the truth is I have never met more

00:38:24   committed rabid fans of the Mac than people I know at Apple. Oh I bet. That is yeah yeah yeah

00:38:32   that's like nobody cares more about the Mac than the people that work on it right like that just

00:38:37   makes sense. Yeah and that's the funny thing is that the world tends to focus on the iPhone

00:38:41   and the iPad and maybe the Apple watch and all of that but the fact is the iMac is a big deal

00:38:50   like it's it's easy to lose uh kind of like lose the plot about like the scale of Apple it's so

00:38:55   it's such a huge company but you know even with desktop only being a fraction of the Mac market

00:39:02   the iMac is you know it's probably like billions of dollars of business for Apple to do the iMac

00:39:09   it is it is again it's like in those analyst calls where they say this is the size of a fortune 200

00:39:14   company this is the size of it's like they say that because we've all lost complete scale about

00:39:19   how Apple operates and the iMac like we think of it it's like oh it's a Mac it's a desktop Mac it's

00:39:24   like no it's super important as Colleen was saying it fills all of these different ecological niches

00:39:30   which I think is the if you think about the history of the iMac it has changed so much from

00:39:36   version to version not just physically but like who uses it the definition of what it is it

00:39:40   continues to shift but it's undeniably an important product and it is very nice that um at least uh

00:39:47   for occasionally it gets its moment in the sun to shine a little bit well all right let me I want

00:39:52   to ask you actually I want to see what you think about this who is the iMac for today I've been

00:40:01   trying to kind of think about like looking at the current Mac lineup you've got the iMac Pro right

00:40:07   at the very top end which is not even going to be at the very top end by the end of this year right

00:40:13   because the Mac Pro is going to fill that space so then that's going to bring the iMac you know

00:40:18   whatever they do with the iMac Pro we assume it will stay around I mean I reckon it'll stay around

00:40:22   because that was the product Apple actually wanted to make right and they were kind of persuaded into

00:40:29   all force depending on how you look at it into making the Mac Pro so the iMac Pro I reckon is

00:40:34   going to stick around and maybe they will adjust the pricing on it we'll see and then you have all

00:40:40   of the laptop line which is the most popular of the Mac line in general anyway that's what most

00:40:45   people buy then you have the Mac Mini which is kind of really I feel like between the Mac Mini

00:40:51   and the iMac Pro that space has been squeezed and I'm not sure who the iMac is for today so

00:41:00   what do you think? Well I mean Colleen delineated in our interview and also like outside the

00:41:07   interview there were lots of examples that that she gave to me about different scenarios right

00:41:13   it's all about like businesses not just in the back office but in the front office she mentioned

00:41:19   you know the last thing you want to do is put a an ugly computer in the middle of your newly

00:41:23   redesigned office so you you put an iMac there because it's pretty so it's got it's got that and

00:41:28   it's got the the shared home Mac she talked about and kids using it and I think that's a scenario

00:41:34   that they see obviously she is scouring social media looking for uses of the iMac including odd

00:41:42   oddball uses of the iMac when it's riding on a train somewhere and then the other thing we talked

00:41:46   about and it's funny because I was going to ask her and she brought it up too which is the gap the

00:41:50   iMac Pro gap and how these new models at the high end it actually it's in a strange way I think it

00:41:58   maybe is freeing for the iMac Pro because it's a lot if what you want is a certain level of

00:42:05   performance you can get there without going to the iMac Pro with some of the details of the these new

00:42:09   processors now you don't get the cooling system of the iMac Pro but you can build a pretty dramatically

00:42:16   powerful Pro product now on the on the 27 inch iMac and the fact that the 21 and a half inch iMac

00:42:24   now has a six core bill to order like this is this is good like they are they are this is it's

00:42:33   I think the way I would put it is it's the flexibility Mac in some ways now it comes with

00:42:37   the monitor like the Mac Mini is super flexible but the iMac is kind of in a similar boat the the

00:42:43   role of a desktop system these days is to be versatile and fill a lot of little niches because

00:42:49   we don't live in an era where everybody has to have their own desktop computer that we don't

00:42:54   that's that's a different thing I think it's really telling what she said she used the word

00:42:58   ecosystem and if you didn't catch that like that's a person who's in charge of the iMac saying the

00:43:05   iMac fills a role in a larger ecosystem it used to be like the computer but now it's part of a

00:43:13   larger picture it's it's a device you use in certain contexts and I think that's really

00:43:18   interesting are you surprised they didn't do anything to the iMac Pro along with these iMac

00:43:25   bumps like you know considering how close now in in processor and in graphics the iMac is at the

00:43:31   top end is getting to the iMac Pro to be fair to the bottom end of the iMac i should say yeah to

00:43:36   the bottom I think that's part of the thing here is that it when I say it frees the iMac Pro it's

00:43:41   like because the iMac Pro starts at 5 000 but it goes you know way higher than that I feel like

00:43:46   they you know Apple has shown in the last few years that they don't want to turn over every

00:43:51   product every time right like all at once like the Macs get turned over in in pieces and I would

00:43:57   imagine there will be a Mac an iMac Pro update at some point maybe it will even come along with

00:44:02   the Mac Pro maybe not it probably has something to do with whenever Intel Xeon processor generation

00:44:09   they're waiting for but I do think they will do it because like you said it's kind of the original

00:44:15   vision of the future of the Mac and as an iMac Pro user and I know Steven feels this way too like

00:44:23   it has some very specific advantages the cooling thing is a huge thing touch on that a little bit

00:44:27   more actually because that's important when you're thinking about especially some of the power you

00:44:31   can put inside of the regular iMac now like why is like the fan and why that's important yeah because

00:44:36   if you're a pro user and you are you've built to order the most awesome iMac ever you know it's

00:44:44   going to heat up and those fans are going to blow and it's got the iMac ventilation system which is

00:44:48   kind of loud and in some jobs it doesn't matter if you're a podcaster like us if you're doing audio

00:44:53   or something like that it can be really annoying to have the loud fans and the iMac Pro doesn't do

00:44:58   that and you know that is it's designed to for a thermal envelope that's like way up above where

00:45:06   the base model and even the first couple of models will will touch on it and so like Steven's example

00:45:12   is he bought a regular iMac and the fans blew too much and so he he got rid of it and replaced it

00:45:20   with an iMac Pro because it's got that newer cooling system and I still suspect that the iMac

00:45:25   is going to that approach but as Colleen pointed out you know we were talking about it I said good

00:45:31   better and best for iMacs and and and they you know they don't like Apple doesn't like to talk

00:45:35   about good better best but because they're all good they're all best but but there is this truth

00:45:42   in that that these are these are computers that are flexible but at the high end you know you're

00:45:48   going to be you're going to be pushing it to their limits and that that's just that's this part of it

00:45:53   depends on what you want to do with it it's great that it's so powerful but there's still a role I

00:45:58   guess I would say for the iMac Pro even now because it it has characteristics that go beyond what the

00:46:06   iMac can have but it's still great like not everybody needs that and and that's that's what

00:46:10   she pointed out like not everybody really needs an iMac Pro it's a five thousand dollar computer

00:46:14   it's a workstation it it's not there are a lot of people who are doing pro level tasks and the iMac

00:46:20   has plenty of power to provide now that it's been updated so like this iMac today is thrown

00:46:28   a wrinkle in my personal plans because I never felt the requirement for an iMac Pro it's way more

00:46:37   than I need from a machine but I was thinking that you know maybe I would get one if the Mac Pro

00:46:46   isn't what I wanted so like I'm thinking about like my next computer I'm running a 2015 5k iMac

00:46:52   still for my main production machine and I was thinking you know I'm due an update probably

00:46:58   over the next year or two just to try and keep keep things a relatively cutting edge you know

00:47:05   and I was thinking I'll I'll wait for the Mac Pro and see what that's all about because

00:47:09   I do like the idea of maybe buying this Mac Pro and then just making component updates to it over

00:47:16   the next 10 or 15 years right like going the real Syracuse or approach assuming that that is a

00:47:21   possibility right we we still don't have any real idea what modular means for Apple when it comes to

00:47:27   the Mac Pro but I thought if the Mac Pro was too expensive or not what I wanted then my next machine

00:47:33   would be an iMac Pro but now looking at the specs in these machines I don't think I need to go to

00:47:39   that level I think I could make a relatively like spec out a relatively top of the line iMac and get

00:47:47   way more than I need considering I don't feel like I'm pushing my 2015 iMac right so yeah I think I

00:47:55   think there's some validity there and I think that is part of what Apple is trying to do is is uh you

00:48:01   know the iMac has a tough job it really does the fact that they haven't touched that bottom of the

00:48:05   of the line model I mean it's there so that they can have a cheap non-retina iMac it's the same

00:48:13   reason the MacBook Air is still there is that there's a price point that they that they want

00:48:17   to hit and they want to have a Mac available there and this is this is what it's going to be

00:48:21   yep but the fact that it goes from there all the way up you know you've got all those six core

00:48:26   processors then you can you can build to order above that and the and with the Vega graphics like

00:48:32   it will take you almost as far as you want to go and then you need to get an iMac Pro so it

00:48:38   depends on the on the deal like it depending on how you push it it may blow those fans and you

00:48:43   may not like that but I don't know the characteristics of these Intel processors they may also

00:48:48   be better thermally because they're newer a newer generation or they may run hotter because they are

00:48:54   that much faster and that it's all down to kind of the thermal regulation that Apple builds in and I

00:48:59   didn't get a chance to you know to walk away with a 27-inch iMac that that didn't that didn't happen

00:49:05   I realize now like I probably have a bit of a soft spot for the iMac as I have been using one for 13

00:49:13   years yeah see yeah this goes back to the fact that it is kind of the unsung hero that it's it's

00:49:20   it's a Mac which is a tiny part of Apple's overall product line and not one of the ones that is

00:49:25   generally spotlighted and then even within that it's a desktop Mac so that's even less interesting

00:49:30   yep but and yet it is super important and a lot of us I mean I am also an iMac user that is what

00:49:38   I sit in front of every day for all my talk about the iPad pro lifestyle and we do have iPads to

00:49:44   talk about too but like but the computing device I use the most is probably still my iMac because

00:49:50   I am in terms of time that's the same for me too on a daily basis because yeah the most time

00:49:56   intensive things that I do are recording and editing podcasts and every time I'm recording

00:50:03   and editing I'm sitting in front of my 2015 5k retina iMac exactly and and have been since I

00:50:10   bought it in 2015 late 2015 or whenever it was but before that the machine that I was sitting in front

00:50:16   of was a previous iMac so I mean I've been using these for like you for pretty much since I started

00:50:25   podcasting in general there was a gap where I was using a Mac mini but you know I've been using

00:50:32   iMacs with just like a couple of year gap for that since the first Intel iMac which was my first Mac

00:50:39   so yep oh yeah well I'm pleased we spent some time looking at the iMac today but that wasn't

00:50:46   all there was no we want to talk about so I want to also just extend a thanks to to Colleen

00:50:52   um and Apple for for giving us uh that time today um that's really really wonderful of them to do

00:50:59   so thanks for that but I want to talk about two new iPads kind of we have a new iPad Air

00:51:05   iPad Air brings its reintroduction back into the product line there wasn't an iPad Air before

00:51:12   yesterday in the category of Apple products named Air that we didn't think we'd ever see again

00:51:17   yeah I was it took me about half an hour to realize the name yeah right after it was announced

00:51:24   like it didn't sink in to me for a while like there wasn't an iPad Air and or that this thing

00:51:31   was even called the iPad Air um and it's important that distinction is important we'll get to in a

00:51:37   minute but it's also a new iPad mini so this I think the big big news for me is that Apple pencil

00:51:45   support is on both of these products um I'm super super surprised to see that the Apple pencil is

00:51:52   now supported on the mini but I'm also really pleased to see that too it's it's supported on

00:51:59   all iPads now the the it's the first generation and Apple pencil is supported on on all iPads now

00:52:06   right first so first generation Apple pencil is on the iPad mini the sixth generation iPad and the

00:52:13   iPad Air and then the uh two iPad pros have the second generation pencil yep also um yeah very

00:52:21   interesting that uh Apple is bringing the you know Logitech crayon into the fold too because yeah

00:52:28   they'll all work with that too which is excellent um yeah this iPad Air so the new iPad Air has a

00:52:37   10.5 inch screen and is replacing the pro in the lineup so the 10.5 inch iPad pro is gone but that

00:52:46   was actually more expensive right yeah it was a weird outlier and it was more expensive so they

00:52:51   got it in a in a cheaper price this is the classic sort of like it's a it's a classic uh size but a

00:52:58   little bit uh a little bit larger it's gonna be larger than the standard iPad and more expensive

00:53:04   um with a better processor it's got the uh a12 bionic yeah so it's the a12 which is in the in the

00:53:11   iPhone 10s so it's not it doesn't have the the fancier uh iPad pro one but it's it's a modern

00:53:18   processor so you can get an iPad mini and an iPad Air with the modern Apple processor and uh the

00:53:24   screen it's that nice screen yeah it doesn't do ProMotion but that's about I think the only thing

00:53:29   that's really knocking it back down off of the because remember that that uh 10.5 iPad Pro was

00:53:35   the previous generation it wasn't the styling of the new ones it was just a holdover basically

00:53:40   a holdover until they had the iPad Air ready to go yeah the the other thing uh is they they bumped

00:53:46   the maximum storage down so this this tops out at 256 the previous iPad Pro uh went up to 512

00:53:55   right because again not not pro cut the price and yes of course there's the issue where there's the

00:53:59   base price and then there's a you can you can load it up with cellular because it's got the

00:54:04   modern fast cellular in it too and storage and then with with a gigantic um price if you want it

00:54:13   but uh Jason I priced up uh an iPad mini today just went to see so I if I was going to get one

00:54:19   I would probably want to go with cellular the maximum storage which is 256 with if let's just

00:54:27   imagine and I would get a pencil and then a smart cover and it was 900 pounds I was like

00:54:32   you can go there you really can't go there if you want to um but we'll come back to the iPad mini in

00:54:41   a minute but I just found that funny it's like oh you can still get an iPad mini up to nearly a

00:54:45   thousand if you really want to go for it um I mentioned that I was super surprised to see that

00:54:52   the iPad mini had Apple pencil support I was way more surprised to see that the iPad Air has a smart

00:54:58   keyboard yeah so they um seem to have not changed the dimensions of either model which means they

00:55:08   have maintained compatibility so the iPad mini fifth generation um now is uh can use iPad mini

00:55:17   for stuff yep and the 10 5 iPad pro stuff should work fine because they're literally using the iPad

00:55:28   pro smart keyboard for the 10 5 on the iPad Air it is the exact same it's the older smart connector

00:55:33   thing it will use those keyboards um I had a thought of like guys we made a lot of these

00:55:38   keyboards we need to like well no I can't you say that no one's happier than bridge remember when

00:55:44   you and I were like why is bridge making a 10.5 iPad keyboard and um that looks like a better

00:55:52   decision now because I think it'll work just fine with the iPad Air um because it's I believe they

00:55:59   are they are literally the same size and shape because um all the accessories are compatible

00:56:05   with both so that's that's good I say thumbs up to Apple for that because the how many times have we

00:56:10   had a product be slightly different and break compatibility with everything but it seems based

00:56:16   on the tech specs and everything like these are not going to be that no which is I mean that's

00:56:21   brilliant right um I want to read a quote from the uh press release because I just find it to be

00:56:27   interesting um that this lineup is offering the best most innovative iPad lineup ever where the

00:56:34   customers prioritize portability screen size power or price there's an iPad for everyone

00:56:40   that's I mean that is definitely what you can see happening but I find it interesting at the same

00:56:48   time that Apple is now kind of at this point willingly introducing more points into the iPad

00:56:56   lineup where I think previously it's felt like oh the iPad lineup has just gotten messy but now

00:57:03   it's like well what what they've done now is they've clarified the pro stuff a little bit

00:57:09   more by removing the 10.5 which was clearly around just to kind of to fill out a price point for a

00:57:15   while and reintroduce the old product line they've actually made it mirror the laptops more than they

00:57:21   did uh previously so it's back to kind of mirroring the laptops again you've got iPad MacBook iPad Air

00:57:28   uh MacBook Air MacBook Pro iPad Pro like it's fully mirroring that lineup again and I am

00:57:35   wondering if this is for a reason like iOS 13 is just around the corner we're all hoping for

00:57:44   significant iPad changes I'm wondering if one the power that they're putting into all of this line

00:57:50   and also the variation of price point and entry level in the line is gonna is saying another

00:57:58   signal to what iOS is gonna look like in the fall yeah it's possible I think we we have talked on

00:58:04   this show about how parts of Apple's product line are a little bit more in disarray they seem to be

00:58:10   headed somewhere but it's still kind of a mess and when the MacBook Air was announced we thought that

00:58:15   would bring clarity and then we got it and it did not bring clarity and then contrast that to the

00:58:20   iPad which really they have gotten their entire product line together where they've got five

00:58:29   relatively new products at these different price points it's all they all offer something different

00:58:36   so that you can choose they've got the iPad mini I think it's interesting to view it this way the

00:58:41   iPad mini is no longer a product for it used to be a product that was the cheapest product and the

00:58:50   smallest product and that was always that argument of like well what's it for and the iPad is the

00:58:55   cheapest iPad now like the iPad is for cheap the iPad mini is for small and it costs a little bit

00:59:02   more than the iPad and I think that's good too because it's saying like if you want this and

00:59:06   clearly people do that you know then you can get it so I love it because it is Apple I think maybe

00:59:15   saying something about the maturity of the iPad as a product line and also the fact that they need to

00:59:18   be more flexible in what they offer and now they've got five different spots you can land

00:59:24   in terms of screen size and features and price for the iPad and it is such a dramatic change from

00:59:33   a few years ago when the iPad was also kind of a mess they really like differentiating from pro

00:59:39   and not was their big step because it allowed them to sell a cheaper iPad and also the cutting edge

00:59:45   iPad and now they've got even beyond that where they're like below the pro we've even got options

00:59:51   for you yeah and you know I think this is I think this is a reaction to what we talked about because

00:59:55   it takes a long time for them to turn this stuff we talked about a few years ago when the when the

01:00:00   iPad sales were going down of like you know what is what can Apple do to make the iPad rebound and

01:00:08   more affordable iPad was one they brought the pencil down to all of these and now they've got

01:00:14   more options out there and it took a little time but they did get their house in order they're

01:00:19   gonna straight up sell a lot of those minis to people that will wait they are and and they're

01:00:25   good ecological niches for the mini too including kids but not limited to kids there's a whole bunch

01:00:30   of places that people want small iPads and it'll fill that which is thinking about it for myself

01:00:36   like I actually want to go and try it out I want to see what it's like to use an iPad mini with

01:00:41   an Apple pencil because I think that that could be a really interesting device even for someone like me

01:00:47   yeah sketches and notes this is this is the thing we talked about about imagining the um

01:00:51   10s max uh with a pencil so yeah this is sort of the flip side of that which is well no iPhone with

01:00:58   a pencil maybe not but an iPad mini with the pencil now you've got a notepad sketchbook thingy

01:01:03   I also want to see how they look next to each other because the pencil and the iPad mini because

01:01:08   I think that could look kind of funny like I'll just put the pencil next to a mini very like

01:01:13   what's gonna happen there pencil yeah I feel like they could have maybe shrunk down a bit so I think

01:01:18   the last thing I wanted to talk about this is this uh the idea of the the previous thinking and the

01:01:24   current thinking around the differentiation between iPad pro and non-pro iPad and it's

01:01:30   interesting to me to see the keyboard and the pencil come down because it's like all right

01:01:34   we've kind of established I mean we'd established already you know the iPad sixth generation had a

01:01:40   pencil but now there's a keyboard a smart keyboard in the in the non-pro lineup and it reminds me

01:01:45   again of the laptops where you know the MacBook pros get all the new whizbang fancy features but

01:01:51   eventually like the uh unibody aluminium design will find its way down and the keyboard will find

01:01:57   its way down for for its sins and uh and all that kind of stuff so it's interesting to me to see

01:02:05   where we are with the pro now and the non-pro iPads you see right okay design is clearly one

01:02:10   of them thinness and lightness and thickness is another is another stuff uh the inductive

01:02:16   charging of the pencil is another part of it the four speakers is another part of it like

01:02:21   these are promotion motion displays which is the uh 120 refresh rate display um so like the super

01:02:29   speedy snappy display is another one face id is now another one exactly so like okay so now looking

01:02:35   at where we are with the iPad pro all right we'll imagine in a few years some of those features are

01:02:39   going to start finding their way down the product line face id will probably be the big first one

01:02:44   because apple i'm sure would love to move that out as fast as they possibly can well basically the

01:02:50   the iPad pro you could also compare i know you're compared to the MacBook pro you could also compare

01:02:54   to the iPhone 10 right it's the product line for cutting edge tech and that doesn't necessarily

01:03:01   mean it will always be defined by these things because the iPad pro is originally defined

01:03:06   as smart keyboard and pencil and that's neither of those things are true anymore

01:03:13   but iPad pro still has things that differentiate it they've just changed

01:03:16   yeah but i i agree with that but i think that like those the iPhone and the iPad pro are inherently

01:03:24   positioned for different types of users right like the most fancy iPhone is for everyone but

01:03:30   the iPad pro in theory or at least is positioned as all right so you want a work device huh

01:03:36   right that's where it starts and in that it's like the MacBook pro you're right i just think

01:03:40   that it's interesting that what apple is doing in face id is a great example is like cutting edge

01:03:44   tech goes in the most expensive product and yes and like apple proudly announced this week on

01:03:49   monday they proudly announced two new iPads with a home button and bigger bezels very touch id and

01:03:56   it's okay because you know that's the that's okay it is a it is a cheaper product you're not paying

01:04:04   for that stuff maybe you don't like it but you don't you don't have to pay for it if you want

01:04:08   a an ipad like this you can get one and you don't have to pay eight or nine hundred dollars to get

01:04:13   it all right i want to bridge between where these topics are and the draft by asking you about this

01:04:22   what do you think it says about apple's focus on their servitude services narrative for next week

01:04:27   that they are just a week away from a press event but they're releasing new products it is

01:04:34   the report with mark german that's like no hardware at the event right like this is the point i think

01:04:40   that was paksowski who said that first okay yeah well it's good it's like no hardware at the event

01:04:44   it's like apple doesn't want first off as i think um given the depths of complicated complicated

01:04:54   things we've added to the draft process this year that will be revealed shortly um i think there's

01:05:01   a lot already on the table for this services event and services i mean it's a little bit like what i

01:05:07   said about the imac it's like this is designed to spotlight the services it's not designed to

01:05:12   spotlight whizzy new hardware first off this is not the you know this is a a refresh to these models

01:05:19   it's not like a completely new thing you've never seen before but more than that it's like apple

01:05:25   doesn't need an event to launch new hardware they've proven that this week again and they

01:05:30   want it off the table because they know that some people are going to focus on the new hardware and

01:05:33   not pay attention to the services narrative which is really want they what they want to sell is they

01:05:38   want to tell their services story and this is off topic for that and it would be a little bit weird

01:05:43   if like nbc came out to unveil their new fall lineup and they said but but first let me tell

01:05:48   you about this great uh new cable box that comcast is going to offer like no probably not the right

01:05:57   way to approach it so i think you know they're clear in the decks they've done this in the past

01:06:01   too it's always fascinating when you get those announcements a week before an event because that

01:06:04   is the we're throwing these things off stage or maybe they were never going to be on stage in this

01:06:08   case i think that's probably true but um yeah yeah it's uh there's too much they've got a full

01:06:14   program of what they want to reveal next monday and um a new ipad mini and faster imax was not

01:06:23   on the list for next monday and that's nothing saying nothing bad about them it's just not what

01:06:27   they're trying to do next week today's episode is also brought to you by our friends over at

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01:08:22   of this show and all of relay fm so jason snell there has been much excitement today but there

01:08:28   is still much more excitement to come and it starts with as all events do the upgrade draft

01:08:35   welcome to the draft everybody so this is because we've got a kind of a peculiar event coming up

01:08:42   next week we're going to be doing some experiments with today's draft uh and so we're gonna we're

01:08:49   going to be doing a bunch of different types of rounds so we have four regular rounds which you're

01:08:53   used to so make a bunch of picks about what we think is going to happen but we're actually going

01:08:57   to start with two pickum naming rounds you'll see what i mean in a minute we're going to have two

01:09:02   special rounds for this draft with three picks each which is a celebrity appearance round

01:09:08   and a trailer round and we're also going to finish off with a tiebreaker question which is something

01:09:13   we've been talking about for a while that we would try and do and considering we're in a new year

01:09:17   we're going to be implementing some changes to the upgrade draft to help us out in certain situations

01:09:22   and it will include the tiebreaker question so mike now mike i got some scoring questions for you

01:09:26   here are the individual picks in the special rounds each worth one point or is the special

01:09:31   round as a whole worth one point based on who uh picks the most hmm interesting i was thinking just

01:09:38   each one each pick is still worth i was thinking that too degraded in that way yeah i think we

01:09:42   still go with each each answer is worth it's worth a point especially because we're having

01:09:47   less regular picks this time because we we are assuming that the it will be a pretty focused

01:09:54   event right and uh i reckon probably and we'll get to this difficult to try and guess this is maybe a

01:10:02   little bit more difficult than normal to try and guess what apple's going to be doing um all right

01:10:07   so so for this event next uh next monday we're going to do um 12 basically it's 12 total points

01:10:15   available plus the tiebreaker which only counts if we get tied so the regular draft rules do still

01:10:23   apply though the winner of the previous draft gets first pick and that was me for an item to count it

01:10:28   must be either clearly announced on stage or on a slide during the presentation we no longer need

01:10:35   adjudication because of a tiebreaker but if we do feel in theory but if there is still some

01:10:40   requirement for adjudication if we disagree on a scoring decision if you and i can't we have a

01:10:45   gentleman's agreement we have been very good about giving each other points but should something come

01:10:49   down to a crucial moment about who wins um we will we will pass the stephen haggart no half points

01:10:56   awarded four points only no points awarded for anything previously announced and the points

01:11:02   awarded on the episode are final right so we can't pick for example we can't pick anything we

01:11:07   already talked about in this episode because that was already announced exactly so none of that will

01:11:13   count yes shall we move into our first rounds yeah let's do it let's do it and this is the um

01:11:19   i introduced this as we were planning this episode i introduced this concept because i realized

01:11:24   sometimes um on our on our drafts we are essentially picking two sides of the same coin

01:11:30   and i thought it might be better uh in certain circumstances to just have rather than have a

01:11:37   sort of like combine that with an obvious this or that with um other draft strategy about what goes

01:11:45   first and what goes second we just break them out and so we have two pick them rounds for this draft

01:11:51   um the first of which is what's it going to be called so if i i want to make sure that i'm

01:11:57   following here so i'm giving the rules for the up gradients what i pick you can't say it too right

01:12:02   yeah it's true you get you get to go first which seems really unfair that you get to go first for

01:12:06   each of these i think hmm that's the rules that's the rules that's that's what you win for winning

01:12:12   a draft on the pick them round you it's fine we're not going to do a snake a snake draft it's not

01:12:19   going to happen go ahead well i would say so so the two pickings that we have is what is the video

01:12:23   streaming service going to be called and what are the services bundle be going to be called if

01:12:27   there's going to be one for both of them um i don't think it is as clear-cut as you might assume first

01:12:34   for either of these to be honest i mean the services bundles a bit more tricky but i really

01:12:39   went back and forth on what i would think about for the name of the video streaming service because

01:12:44   there are i think two obvious answers um which are tv and video so apple tv apple video and so i

01:12:52   really went back and forth on this because apple tv makes sense because they have a product and it

01:12:59   kind of helps bundle it all up into one but the more i started thinking about this because of the

01:13:06   fact that apple is working with so many other companies and we reckon we'll work with more and

01:13:12   that may come up during the picks today i'm starting to think they won't call it apple tv

01:13:18   because the apple tv still exists so i'm gonna go with following apple music apple video all right

01:13:27   i think i think you have uh definitely talked about some of the ways that apple tv is a bad

01:13:33   idea um we have talked on the show about how apple has made deals with movie distributors they've

01:13:40   bought movies at sundance um so they're going to be like with netflix there's going to be movies on

01:13:45   this service yes it's not just tv it's not just tv although it will be on and it's not just on your

01:13:51   tv uh device it's on devices although there is a tv app which i think i think there's a case for

01:13:57   and a case against apple tv as the name um you know netflix kind of implies movies even though

01:14:04   it's primarily a tv service now the flicks you know kind of idea uh so i i have been talking up

01:14:11   the name apple tv as the service because it's the simplest and yes it's already a product but it's

01:14:16   also that app and i think that app is going to be the cornerstone of it and i see no reason to stop

01:14:20   now so i will pick apple tv even though i think you're right there are lots of reasons why it

01:14:24   wouldn't be the name and i think it's not i think it would require some kind of vision and um maybe

01:14:30   not courage but uh boldness on their part to just say no we're gonna we don't care about the confusion

01:14:36   and the fact that our hardware is also called that that's the right name everything is apple tv

01:14:41   and we'll go from there so apple tv for me and uh we get one of us will get a point unless they name

01:14:47   it something else in which case we will both be sad the field gets a point at that point yes

01:14:52   steven hackett gets a point then so what would the services bundle be called now this one this

01:14:59   one is just wide open right it is if it if it if the service bundles even exists yeah and if it even

01:15:05   has a name i tried to think about this jason i'm like all right what what could they call it it

01:15:10   could be like i was thinking like premium but that sounds too close to prime so i was going through

01:15:16   i was like okay so what is it what is a bundle right a bundle is is a single payment it's a

01:15:22   single thing i'm gonna go with apple one well uh you said it was wide open and yet that is you

01:15:27   totally sniped what i was gonna say maybe just call it apple two i don't know we're all like

01:15:37   apple two plus i would give you apple roman numeral one oh my that's not i don't want it

01:15:45   you can't give it to me i don't want it i don't want to just close it apple a which would just

01:15:49   be like beautiful is it one is it i i don't even know right maybe it's just the roman numeral one

01:15:55   and then the apple logo that's what they do oh my god yeah you're gonna buy it now huh i i am that

01:16:02   was the best one i i i have come up with because i don't really know a name for this either that's

01:16:05   why i called it apple prime a lot just because it was like amazon prime but i didn't think that they

01:16:11   were actually going to call it that i mean it depends kind of what they're going for if you

01:16:15   want it to be a bit playful you could do something like all access or something like that right like

01:16:19   you i don't know i feel like that their branding is more likely to be just the two word dealio

01:16:26   and then that's that so you gotta pick something yeah apple you gotta pick something so have you

01:16:33   jason that's the yeah boy and i don't want it to reflect some other um although there's there is a

01:16:41   one service out there too isn't it i'm sure that there are because it's not like an incredibly

01:16:46   clever name but the i think the point is that they're just not going to be going after like

01:16:50   of amazon right like that's just the one that they can't bar up against i think everybody

01:16:55   else is probably fair game for them uh okay i am going to choose um the all apple pass okay

01:17:08   which is a terrible name yeah but i don't want to say all access because that's cbs

01:17:12   okay ah yes all apple pass all apple past and i'll take pass if it's apple pass i'll take that

01:17:18   too but it won't be because it's going to be apple one yeah okay if it is called apple pass

01:17:24   you can have the point um thank you because that will be close enough i think yep but it won't be

01:17:29   so congratulations on winning the draft mike

01:17:35   i will say i'm feeling pretty good about my first two i know that like apple tv

01:17:39   sort of makes sense you know i was thinking jason when you were talking about apple tv like

01:17:42   do you do you can you see a possibility of a separate app for the video service that ties into

01:17:50   tv well i think that's one of the items on our list for drafting purposes okay uh i think it's

01:17:57   an interesting question i think where these things that we made lots of assumptions but not all those

01:18:02   assumptions will probably be accurate right like apple has this habit of surprising you and so i

01:18:08   think we have to re-examine all of those things like i feel very strongly that the tv app is the

01:18:13   logical place they have been trying to make the tv app happen for several years now and i think this

01:18:21   is part of that this is feeding into that strategy but could they totally throw it away and be like

01:18:25   nah it's not the tv app it's its own app they could uh they could so that that's all to play for and

01:18:32   all to be drafted yes it's quite literally all to play for as we go into pick number one now as we

01:18:40   always say i put together we put together a list of things that we can pick from for our draft

01:18:46   and i've and then i take that list and i kind of rank it and uh i'm even struggling i'm really

01:18:53   struggling i really struggled with this event um to try and think what is the most likely stuff to

01:18:59   occur i think i'm gonna i think this first pick for me seems seems pretty obvious considering what

01:19:06   we just spoke about but like i'm gonna pick the existence of a services bundle so there being a

01:19:12   services bundle unveiled there is a likelihood that apple will be a strong likelihood that

01:19:18   apple would be talking about at least two maybe three services that will all be paid for at this

01:19:25   event i would be really surprised if they didn't offer some way of paying for all of it including

01:19:33   apple music and maybe some other stuff to in one payment because it's just a bad user experience

01:19:40   to have like four or five multiple charges and it's also fiscally irresponsible for apple to

01:19:46   to kind of like be making multiple charges to somebody right like you want to make one charge

01:19:52   because then your credit card fees are less and all that kind of stuff um a services bundle which

01:19:56   bundles up the new services or some old services maybe sprinkle some other things in i think will

01:20:02   be part of uh what apple talks about next week i think that is uh smart i agree with you assuming

01:20:11   that this event is going to launch a video service and that new service and potentially a video game

01:20:18   service that's a lot of services right to go with the ones they've already got which is why we put

01:20:26   the services bundle in the pick them round because although there's been no i think definitive

01:20:32   reporting on that one it's hard to imagine that apple is going to say this will be i mean they

01:20:38   may present it as this will be 999 and this will be 499 and this will be 699 and then have that

01:20:45   slide at the end that's like aha but now how much would you pay but now we're going to make it

01:20:50   available for the low low price of whatever yeah and it's called all apple pass which is not what

01:20:57   it's called yeah and i genuinely think that they will be selling more individually if you want to

01:21:03   like if you don't want it and you know it'll be a look maybe a little bit cheaper for you if you

01:21:06   just want video and you don't want news and gaming and blah blah blah and blah blah blah

01:21:10   but being able to bundle it all together will also mean that more people are more likely to use all

01:21:18   of the services you want people to be using right if you're just like well you want video and you

01:21:22   want music well now you can also get news as well like that's free now for you right so that that's

01:21:28   kind of the incentive um so yeah services bundle yeah i think that's good i'm gonna go uh with one

01:21:35   of the other services we talked about and just say um not just that the new service the news thing is

01:21:41   going to happen because i think we kind of assume that it will but a little more specifically i want

01:21:45   to say that there's going to be that that ios update that they've been beta testing that it

01:21:49   will launch with and that they will promise that it will launch soon um i'm i'm not sure i want to

01:21:54   say like this week or next or this month because we're almost at the uh end of the month by the

01:22:00   time this event happens but um i i want to say that soon in the next few weeks uh with that

01:22:06   ios update the new subscription service will launch as a part of that and and put my stake

01:22:11   in the ground for that one so i want to we want to make some clarifications here because next few

01:22:15   weeks is a bit that's difficult for like the draft well i i want them to say a date i want to say that

01:22:21   it will a soonish date for it that they're not going to say it launches this summer that there's

01:22:25   a no we know there's an ios update ready to go very soon it's in beta right now um and i'm kind

01:22:30   of tying it to that that there's going to be a a the next ios software update is going to get released

01:22:35   and it's going to enable this feature and it's going to come soon and that they'll promise a

01:22:39   soonish date that basically if this is the new service is coming in ios 13 this fall i lose it

01:22:45   should we say by the end of april uh sure like the date that they announce is by yeah they may

01:22:51   not say the words by the end of april but something in that time frame yeah yeah so like if they save

01:22:56   in the next couple of weeks that's the end of april if they give a date right like that so just

01:22:59   so just so we have a stake in the ground right they may say it launches in april in fact and that

01:23:03   might that might be the way to do it depends on how confident they're feeling about their service

01:23:07   and about ios 12.2 i mean i don't think we spoke about this but like they even updated the apple

01:23:12   news app with a new logo yeah in 12.2 so like it's definitely going to be in 12.2 and 12.2 has been

01:23:19   in beta for a while unless they've had to hang up with their uh deals and they feel like it's not

01:23:24   ready in which case they cannot even announce it if they wanted to so i feel like it's cool

01:23:28   enough of a question but it's still my first pick so maybe i guess we should say like there was a

01:23:32   mark german report about a bunch of stuff and it even seems like reminiscent of like apple music

01:23:39   they're still struggling to get some deals done like they're going up to the last minute

01:23:43   but yeah i think they've got the texture deals in place right i think that that that is so they're

01:23:47   going to have magazine content and all that but i think they are trying to close deals with

01:23:50   you know news sources because they want the new stuff too but with video too though right like

01:23:55   they would they would this the report was saying that they were like at the wire with getting some

01:24:00   of the video stuff needed that they need but i also kind of expect though jason that at this

01:24:06   level at this high level it's probably always like this right probably that you're going right up to

01:24:12   the very very end before you end up getting something completely nailed down that would

01:24:17   make sense to me that it kind of is always that way and that's why i won't launch on the day

01:24:21   either and apple one part of the carrot for apple is making these deals and saying we'll put you on

01:24:25   the slide we'll talk about you in our event that kind of thing is is part of the the the inducement

01:24:30   to the deals is we're doing this event do you want to be on stage you know we won't we you know not

01:24:36   your we'll put your logo on stage or we'll put a screenshot on stage or something like that or

01:24:40   they're like well no we want an executive on stage and it's like well we're not going to let you do

01:24:44   that right and they have to just keep going backwards and forwards until they get to the

01:24:47   end point which i expect happens very frequently that that's how i assume most of this stuff tends

01:24:51   to go all right so pick number two kind of leading from that point um i'm gonna say that apple will

01:24:58   have content that they did not make available for subscribers to this new service oh interesting

01:25:05   so here's my thinking on this they're having the event now and their tv shows i can't imagine

01:25:13   many if any already i think they're going to have something you will get this is the catalog

01:25:21   you think there's going to be catalog content i've changed my mind on this one like at first i i

01:25:26   thought no no they're not going to do that but i think they're going to have some stuff and it may

01:25:29   even be like oh we're going to offer like a limited selection from hbo and if you want more sign up

01:25:35   for hbo in apple video right like and then they do that kind of amazon prime channels model which is

01:25:42   again i'm not picking that right now we maybe pick that right but like that's a good example where

01:25:46   there is some older hbo content on amazon prime exactly video yeah so like you can buy this stuff

01:25:52   and if you like this stuff you can get more of it but i think that they will have a very thin

01:25:58   service when they launch and i also think that this is the video stuff is probable the service

01:26:05   i reckon will launch before a lot of apple's content is ready and what are you going to pay for

01:26:10   like what are you paying for so i've come around to thinking that there will be there will be some

01:26:17   additional content that apple is going to be licensing and this isn't the idea of like oh

01:26:23   we're paying sony to buy this tv show and it's made for us this is like stuff you already know

01:26:28   about stuff that's existed in the world before that apple will have available to subscribers

01:26:32   of apple video i um that's it's risky i think i i see again this is the beauty of draft picks

01:26:40   i see your argument i think it's possible it's not it's it's there's this weird middle ground

01:26:47   where i don't think they're going to be a big catalog service where the the i don't think it's

01:26:51   going to be big but i think you've got it you know if you get like hey we've got sopranos and we've

01:26:56   got game of thrones and we've got something else you know obviously not those shows right but like

01:27:01   you get my point like they'll get some stuff so they have some thing yeah so they have something

01:27:08   something that is not and and just to be clear here we're not talking about the um the channels

01:27:14   idea where they're going to offer subscriptions to other video services within the new app like

01:27:19   amazon's prime channels we're talking about that they will make stuff available for free

01:27:24   if you're a video person of apple video subscriber or a all apple pass subscriber apple pass yeah

01:27:31   it is the idea of the potential that they may uh do kind of prime channel stuff which is why

01:27:37   it makes me think they might have some free stuff right it's like a lead-in it could be and that

01:27:42   could in fact be part of their deal right is is hey showtime we're gonna resell showtime inside

01:27:48   here but we want to make some of your older content available or hey cbs all access can you

01:27:56   give us the first season of star trek discovery and the good fight and and we'll put those on our

01:28:02   service and maybe cut you in a little bit but we'll also we'll be selling hard your service on

01:28:07   top of that like if they could cut some deals with that that that will give you season one of star

01:28:12   trek but there is more and if you want that the way you get that is doing this right and season

01:28:18   one of star trek discovery is a good example of something that is not available in the us on any

01:28:24   other streaming service outside the us is a different story but inside the us that would be

01:28:29   something like that would be a coup so you know there's there's some possibilities there i like

01:28:34   it it's an interesting pick um i'm gonna i'm gonna take the flip side of it which is i'm gonna pick

01:28:38   the prime channels thing i think that they're going to have something that they could probably

01:28:42   actually make happen immediately or almost immediately in the tv app regardless of whether

01:28:46   they've got the service up and running which is this you know it's been reported so it sounds like

01:28:51   it's going to happen but who knows which is having a cornerstone of this tv strategy also be bringing

01:28:56   other services in that you pay for and all appear in the app now this is a subtle distinction because

01:29:02   those services have apps right but the idea here is to integrate it in the tv app more directly

01:29:07   that this is you're in the tv app and you can just go showtime and it'll say buy showtime and boom you

01:29:15   have added showtime via an apple subscription and it appears in the tv app and it's unified with

01:29:21   that interface and that they're going to roll out a bunch of deals with that part of it too so again

01:29:27   i think that has been reported but it could not happen at this event and it is a weird thing where

01:29:33   it's you know again it's kind of just a making progress over where they are now which is having

01:29:38   those things be apps that can show up in the tv app but you know by all accounts it sounds like

01:29:43   they want everything to live in the tv app like they really want you to just find showtime or cbs

01:29:49   all access or whatever in the tv app and say yes please now and then it's just in there and you

01:29:54   don't you don't think about it which is what prime channels does and it's great i do i do cbs all

01:29:59   access through prime channels and it's super easy because it means all of their shows are just mixed

01:30:03   in with all the amazon prime shows they're all available one app very convenient there is another

01:30:08   part of this so it's like yeah of course apple would want that but i wonder if the world has

01:30:12   started to change around them a little bit you know where a lot of these companies are now

01:30:17   starting to really understand the importance of having their own service you know yeah i i think

01:30:24   amazon views itself as a platform for other services and netflix doesn't and amazon has

01:30:29   seen that as an advantage and i think it is and i think if you're one of these smaller services if

01:30:34   you're cbs all access or acorn you know or brit box being inside the the loving arms of amazon or

01:30:42   apple is a good thing because now like you are apple is promoting like because if you go on the

01:30:48   amazon prime video app like they're pushing those services like amazon is advertising other people's

01:30:55   streaming services and that's that's pretty good right like and if you search for a show you search

01:31:00   for star trek discovery on amazon it says yes we have it and when you click it says you have to

01:31:06   subscribe to cbs all access to get it in prime channels and then you can have it and that is

01:31:11   powerful so i think that if if apple did that same thing where they're like you know we're basically

01:31:16   promoting your services inside our service if you're in netflix you're not interested but if

01:31:22   you are one of these smaller services yeah i think it's kind of a big deal and i think you want to be

01:31:25   there maybe this is why brookbox is launching in the uk could be could be that could be one reason

01:31:32   like again it's the the to sell that through amazon and apple for example that's pretty great

01:31:38   and again netflix does not seem interested right netflix just wants to be the only service you get

01:31:44   and all you need no i think netflix either like you to think it's original right like it is

01:31:49   original they like you to think it is right like i think netflix's model is trying to make them hbo

01:31:55   as opposed to generic service serving up content that i think that's their overall goal right they

01:32:01   and they and they want to have everything you want right like netflix's goal really is that you don't

01:32:05   ever need to leave the netflix app other other shows are not relevant just we give you enough

01:32:11   content you never need to have anything but netflix that's that's their that's their strategy

01:32:16   and you know right now they're the only ones doing that nobody else is is keeping up with them there

01:32:21   i think you know we've talked about it other companies may have aspirations but nobody else is

01:32:25   netflix right now all right we're halfway through the draft which feels like a perfect time to take

01:32:29   our final break of this show and thank squarespace for their support of this show you can make your

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01:34:10   upgrade and relay fm squarespace make your next move make your next website so moving to pick

01:34:17   number three okay this one's a little bit boring um but it feels feels pretty inevitable for me

01:34:25   the initial launch will be us only of the video service yeah of the video service sorry i should

01:34:30   have made that clearer but the video service i believe will will be us only in its initial launch

01:34:36   that just feels like the way it's going to go most of apple's services like this have been

01:34:42   sometimes there's not too much of a gap but i'm thinking specifically because of any deals they

01:34:49   may need to make with other partners that they will just be making sure they've got all of that

01:34:55   stuff taken care of because i don't believe any of their own content will be on the service initially

01:35:02   they can wait a little bit longer before they need to roll it out to other territories

01:35:07   yeah i think i think you're probably right just because that seems to be their default i think the

01:35:12   um you know what reports suggest is that they are planning to rapidly follow with other countries

01:35:18   but um that you know that that's not the same as launching in like what if they said we're

01:35:25   launching in all english-speaking countries or something like that but uh wouldn't that be nice

01:35:29   and they're going to own all their own content right so they could do that but you do get the

01:35:33   sense that not only is the us their biggest market but that it does provide a test bed and makes it

01:35:38   easier than to roll it out elsewhere rather than rolling it out in all these different regions and

01:35:41   then having problems and having to fix them in all the regions um and there are local regulations

01:35:47   about tv and stuff that that can come into play um so i think that's a it's definitely a boring

01:35:54   pick but also probably a pretty good one yeah i will apologize for the boringness of that pick but

01:35:59   sometimes sometimes you've just got to go with it in the draft that's draft rules we have other stuff

01:36:04   we'll talk about like kind of like the ones we haven't picked uh once we've once we finished

01:36:08   with the with the overall picks so but that that is one that i think will happen just because as

01:36:13   well like this happens with everything everything is us only first this is just how it is yeah this

01:36:19   is it's a meme amongst people that don't live in the us uh us only i cannot tell you how um much

01:36:26   laughter i got out of was it the was it apple news finally launched in canada yes and i i just i

01:36:32   laughed and again i'm not laughing at canadians i'm laughing ruefully at the fact that canada

01:36:38   which is so close to the us in so many ways it has to wait so long for services she has a literal

01:36:47   it's geographically close to the united states um but they they uh they have to wait i think part of

01:36:54   the issue there was that they wanted to they needed to make it so that they were it was

01:36:57   bilingual so they had french sources as well as english um but uh i just feel bad that and that

01:37:04   goes i've watched that very carefully because you would think can it would be easy to bring services

01:37:08   to canada and yet everybody seems to do it very slowly which is why my only article i ever wrote

01:37:14   for the crazy apple rumor site was specifically about how itunes was never ever ever coming to

01:37:19   canada because that seems like the lot that the canadians have do you know in in ireland you still

01:37:25   can't buy any tv shows in itunes oh boy isn't that wild wow that is that is never bothered no

01:37:33   no well anyway when this video service launches in the us it will be rapidly followed by launches in

01:37:39   the uk and uh let's say australia and canada will just get really mad this is what happened

01:37:47   for me apple music that was kind of the rollout i think it was uk and then u.s australia um next

01:37:52   uh okay i'm gonna i'm gonna go with the darn it you picked my pick

01:37:56   video game i just pasted into the doc a little early people and that's how he read my mind

01:38:02   i'm gonna i'm gonna pick the video game service that is has only been reported as far as i can

01:38:06   tell with one report which was in cheddar uh that said in january that apple was working on a service

01:38:11   that would basically it's unclear exactly how it works they described it as a netflix for games

01:38:17   i'm unclear how it's gonna work but i think that there will be something that they're gonna unveil

01:38:22   presumably with a game demo i'm not gonna pick game demo on stage but i feel like

01:38:27   i could pick it every time yeah there's always a game demo on stage but i feel like the only

01:38:33   reason there'd be a game demo on stage is because they unveiled this service um i'm not sure exactly

01:38:38   what form it's going to take whether it's going to be that apps are going to have uh in-app purchase

01:38:43   stuff that it gets completely unlocked if you're a member if there are certain games that have a

01:38:48   price but if you're a member it's free um if you know some combination of those whether you get

01:38:55   like you unlock everything that's in the in-app purchase or if you get like credits every month

01:39:00   so that they say you know you pay five dollars for this service or ten dollars for this service

01:39:05   but you get twenty dollars in iap credits every month or something like that there there are

01:39:08   different ways they could do it um i i'm not saying whether it'll be successful or not but i

01:39:13   think that this is in the water that apple is trying to do something that makes basically makes

01:39:18   the game experience on ios better and this is an interesting example of a service that's basically

01:39:24   leveraging their power in the app store um to i think that i think their feeling is that you know

01:39:31   games on ios are kind of scummy because everything is free to play with uh purchases and that this is

01:39:38   their next attempt to class it up a little which is basically to create a hierarchy where if you're

01:39:44   a paying games fancy person you get all the all the junk gets disappeared and you get a more

01:39:51   pristine experience but however the de whatever the details are i'm fascinated to see what they

01:39:55   try to do here but i'm going to put um a chip down on that they will do a a game service that is

01:40:03   basically giving you free game stuff on ios so let me tell you why i wanted to pick this jason

01:40:10   it has only been reported once that chad report is the only time it's ever been rumored yep but

01:40:17   in the same idea jumpa kazan's report didn't even talk about the video service right so like i feel

01:40:23   like this event has been pretty well kept under wraps and also game developers are pretty used to

01:40:31   and the companies that they will probably be going to for this to begin with it used to keeping their

01:40:35   mouth shut because they're always on stage right so like there is there is an idea of keeping it

01:40:41   under wraps but i have heard from some third parties and i don't know what to make of it yet

01:40:46   but i have heard of games that are currently in development being delayed for this yes i've heard

01:40:53   two separate cases of this of games being delayed now it could it could be that they don't launch it

01:40:58   here and they launch it at ww dc or something like that this would seem like a great place to do it

01:41:02   but it's possible that the timing is not is not right and this is actually going to be not

01:41:07   not announced at all um although again if i was doing a bundle i would mention we're doing this

01:41:12   video game thing and it's going to be great and this is going to roll out in june or whatever

01:41:16   however they want to do it and i have wild speculation i know that we love wild speculation

01:41:21   on this i love it and i have some speculation nintendo are working on a mobile game of mario kart

01:41:29   it's called mario kart world tour i think is the name and they mentioned this a long time ago it

01:41:34   was supposed to come out by now it was supposed to be out basically now in march that was the

01:41:40   original thing nintendo's previous earnings call and the last earnings call they said it was delayed

01:41:45   no reason no time frame but it's delayed i think nintendo will be putting the mario kart game as

01:41:52   part of the streaming service right we might see nintendo on stage in fact on on on monday nintendo

01:41:57   have been on stage before right so there is precedent for it shigeru miyamoto came on stage

01:42:02   to announce a super mario run yeah i always think go but that's pokemon uh the other reason i think

01:42:09   this at the time of super mario go super mario go if you remember was a one-time in-app purchase

01:42:13   to unlock the rest of the levels you got some for free nintendo were unhappy with the amount of money

01:42:19   that they made from that transaction from super mario run yeah they were unhappy with how much how

01:42:23   much money they made from super mario run they actually made a lot of money but it wasn't where

01:42:28   they consider their games to use they make a lot more money from their games typically right right

01:42:33   then there was a report a couple of weeks ago that nintendo are becoming increasingly more difficult

01:42:37   to work with because they they kind of work in partnership with with a couple of different uh app

01:42:44   development companies there's a company called dina who they're who are their biggest partner

01:42:48   and they've worked with some other partners for some other games i think the fire emblem game was

01:42:51   made by a different studio the idea is that nintendo are being hesitant they're very hesitant

01:43:00   to be bleeding money from their customers so some of the games that they've released have been quite

01:43:05   heavy on in-app purchase since the original one and it seems like they are changing course

01:43:10   on wanting to include that and that is making the game developers that they're working with unhappy

01:43:14   because they can't make as much money so all of this leads to me thinking nintendo would love the

01:43:20   opportunity to be in a subscription service model with some more guaranteed revenue that apple will

01:43:26   provide them because apple will really want that game in this service if it exists right because

01:43:33   mario kart will make people sign up nobody knows what this game looks like by the way like is it a

01:43:39   racing game is it like one of those ones where you're just flicking from left to right nobody

01:43:43   knows what this game looks like because nintendo have given no details other than the name

01:43:47   and that it will probably tie into a future mario kart game or the current one

01:43:52   so i think that they would jump at the chance for uh the option to get more money and i expect

01:43:59   apple will like to do a lot of this stuff like a lot of companies do be like okay

01:44:03   you'll make whatever amount of money it will be but we'll also guarantee it will be at least this

01:44:08   much if you don't make that we'll give you it right as a way to kind of sweeten the pot it's

01:44:12   a possibility so yeah that is my whole spiel that i was about to give for pick four about why i think

01:44:18   the video game service will be unveiled even though there's been nothing on it but i think

01:44:22   it's coming and i think and i'm not predicting that nintendo are going to do this i just think

01:44:28   there are a lot of things that line up in the stars which suggest it could be possible

01:44:33   i love that you talked for three times as long as i did about my pick thank you

01:44:36   if it's video games man i'm all about the video games i know pick four i've got another really

01:44:43   boring one um because i don't really understand it but it seems like it's going to happen an apple

01:44:49   credit card so this is something that's been rumored that apple is partnering with goldman

01:44:55   sax and they're going to create a credit card and you will and they're also going to make a bunch of

01:45:00   enhancements to apple pay to make this a better experience but i quite frankly cannot fathom what

01:45:07   the benefit is to a customer to own this to have this card um i can't work it out but it's been

01:45:14   rumored and also there were people from like there's a website called the points guy which is

01:45:19   a credit card reward points website you have been invited to this apple event so that's a good sign

01:45:27   i don't get it um but there's been a bunch of rumors about it and again it's also referenced

01:45:32   in mark gorman's report that like goldman sax are working on it it's called project cookie which is

01:45:36   hilarious um but i don't know what the i can't fathom why someone would want this like because

01:45:42   i don't know what the benefits are yeah so they'll be they'll be um presumably part of it because

01:45:46   this is how all these point credit cards work is purchases at apple or on the apple store or using

01:45:53   apple pay will get you more points than regular purchases yeah and that presumably you can use

01:45:59   your points you can redeem or dollars or however they want to do it you can redeem that for a

01:46:04   percentage discount of you know so if you've got a hundred dollars you can redeem it for 150 in

01:46:10   apple credit or something like that right where they will apple will compensate you more highly

01:46:14   for stuff that is from apple so you use your money you use the card to buy apple stuff and then you

01:46:21   use the rewards from that to buy more apple stuff that's the that's probably how it will work and

01:46:26   then of course there's that rumor that they're going to tie this in with software on the devices

01:46:31   that will provide sort of like a higher level of data sync uh in terms of you monitoring your

01:46:36   purchases and stuff that this would be like a preferred uh card that will do more in your um in

01:46:43   your wallet app basically i bet there's going to be some privacy stuff right they're going to be

01:46:48   like you know and uh we're going to do excellent i mean like we're not going to sell that you know

01:46:52   yeah yeah but like what do you use the points on like apps or credit like where's what are

01:46:57   the points get you i don't know buying new iphones whatever you know buy new apple stuff yeah i guess

01:47:03   so but yeah this also just feels like company gets to the size like like apples and they're basically

01:47:12   you know we spoke about this before like apples moved slowly become a bank um yeah this part of

01:47:17   it when you have so much money you start you need to start to be able to control money and this is

01:47:23   where apple is in their company's life cycle so making starting to make a credit card you know

01:47:28   like and understanding what that looks like it reminds me of like working with motorola to create

01:47:33   the rocker right like let's just start and we have a company and we see what this looks like and we

01:47:38   understand a little bit more about this business and then maybe down the line we do something more

01:47:43   so right super weird one but it feels like a possibility it may not be earth-shattering i

01:47:47   mean like everybody's got a everybody's got a credit card a branded credit card yeah everybody

01:47:52   so you can get your marvel comics card you can get your major league baseball card you can get your

01:47:57   airline card they're all out there um okay so i the last pick by the way it is it is i'm gonna go

01:48:04   down pricing um with my last pick and i was thinking about this because i've been talking

01:48:09   for a while now about this service and thinking about how they're how they could price it um

01:48:14   and thinking out of the gate they're not going to have a lot they've got a smaller collection of

01:48:19   originals um and i think that the debate has really been sort of at that ten dollar break

01:48:24   point is this a 999 service or is this more than 999 999 sure 799 599 a month whatever it is and

01:48:31   then i was thinking about it netflix now costs the base the base right where you don't get 4k

01:48:39   get multiple users at once and it's just a base model is 1099 i think maybe 1199 but it's they

01:48:48   just raised it hbo go is like 15 a month um and i will point you back to my law of pricing which

01:49:01   is that whatever price you think apple's going to price something at um add money to it and then add

01:49:07   a percentage to that and that's the actual price of the product and that's why even though i've

01:49:11   been thinking this entire time we've been talking about this that this service would launch at a low

01:49:16   price i don't think it is i think it's going to be more than ten dollars a month um i will also

01:49:20   point out the higher you make the standalone price the better the bundle looks so i think that's part

01:49:27   of it too is why not set the price standalone price high because what you really want and it's

01:49:33   not high compared to like again compared to netflix even if you match netflix they're not

01:49:37   going to have con content on the netflix level but if you look at some of the other streaming

01:49:42   services they're all kind of pushing upward from five or six dollars and apple wants to be viewed

01:49:47   as a premium product so they're gonna they're gonna charge more because charge more means you're

01:49:51   worth more and that's certainly what hbo is thinking so um that's that's i mean who knows

01:49:57   what will happen to hbo in the long run because of word media but i think apple will price the

01:50:02   standalone video service at more than ten dollars a month for these reasons they want to be seen as

01:50:07   premium and it gives them that much more of a savings when you bundle it with music or you

01:50:13   bundle it with the or or what or the big bundle or whatever they want to call it so i again i'm not

01:50:18   i'm not 100 or even um sort of 70 confident in this but um i was going to pick less than

01:50:25   ten dollars and i thought about it and i was like there's no way i can pick that never bet against

01:50:29   apple being cheap that's a wonderful rule to live by just live i mean and you'll never be disappointed

01:50:36   is the second part of that right because it's sometimes you might be pleasantly surprised that

01:50:40   they're cheaper than you thought but um it does save you from a lot of heartache when when you

01:50:45   think oh that macbook air is going to be 999 and then it's not and you're like oh yeah well you know

01:50:50   it's apple all right so they are the four main draft picks we'll go through a couple of extra

01:50:56   ones um as we finish off today but we're going to go into our super weird celebrity round um because

01:51:03   of everything that's happening we're assuming apple's going to have some stuff to say about

01:51:06   their own original content the assumption that we have going into this event is there will be

01:51:11   some celebrities on stage coming out to talk about the stuff that they're making um so what we're

01:51:16   going to do is just give the name of the people maybe a little bit of explanation why but it

01:51:19   probably isn't required but i'm going to go with my number one pick who feels like the most obvious

01:51:24   person to be there for me which is reese witherspoon the reason i picked reese witherspoon not only is

01:51:29   she in uh the morning drama tv show thing which has a lot of celebrities a lot of big answers in

01:51:36   it uh reese witherspoon's production company hallow sunshine has sold multiple shows to apple at this

01:51:41   point yeah she is three yes she is probably their single most important creator on the service in a

01:51:47   weird interesting way because not it doesn't matter about her a-list status she is a big power player

01:51:53   in hollywood now and uh is exa in herself in that way so i think pretty she'll be there plus plus

01:51:58   she is in the show with jennifer aniston and steve correll yeah so she is wearing the two hats

01:52:05   exactly which i think that's why i think that she is like so important to the service like she is

01:52:09   behind the scenes and in front of the camera this is going to be my clever first pick after you took

01:52:14   the obvious pick but you took it instead which is very clever of you um i will just go ahead and say

01:52:19   who's the only person who apple has talked about who they are excited to be in business with and

01:52:25   that's oprah yes oprah winfrey was a high on my list too they are gonna be wheeling out oprah for

01:52:32   this one you would think i i think oprah can walk out she's fine yeah she could just walk and give

01:52:37   a wave and just walk straight off again and we're all good i like her being brought out in like a

01:52:41   sedan chair or something like that like here she is it's oprah say no more but uh yeah yeah i don't

01:52:47   know who's going to be on stage is anybody going to be on stage but i like the idea that this is

01:52:52   apple's opportunity to cart out celebrities so uh we might as well pick them and see what happens i

01:52:56   am imagining do you remember when marvel brought all of their create like all of their heroes out

01:53:01   for the first avengers movie you know and they all did that like big lineup like good got a lot of

01:53:05   superstars like that's what this feels like to me that it's where they might not get that exact shot

01:53:11   it is this is the beginning of the apple cinematic universe um sure got it so my next pick is j.j

01:53:16   abrams for a similar reason for reese with a spoon j.j that's the best you've mentioned before

01:53:21   big apple fan but also involved in two projects at apple um right now so i think j.j will be happy to

01:53:29   come on stage yeah yeah he is a giant apple fan from way back mac fan um did the opening titles

01:53:36   and music for the show alias which was his second tv show uh himself on his mac i did not know that

01:53:43   yeah oh yeah the music and the title they had him in that like photo montage didn't they a while ago

01:53:49   of people using that contortion and he's spoken at wwdc he is producing a show for apple i think

01:53:55   it's a i think it's a good one yeah he's producing two there's two shows two shows see there you go

01:53:59   oh it's it's it's tough i'm gonna go i'm gonna go with steven spielberg next good pick uh he he is

01:54:07   uh he made a deal with apple for uh amazing stories he was one of the first people to make a deal with

01:54:14   apple um i think everybody knows who steven spielberg is that is that is helpful he is a

01:54:20   legend in hollywood and the thing that put it over the edge to me for me is that he has spoken out

01:54:25   uh in negative ways about netflix and film um and even though apple has some film plans of its own

01:54:33   i kind of like the idea that steven spielberg would take would would go to an apple event as

01:54:38   a dig on netflix so i'm gonna pick steven spielberg beef he's going for the beef

01:54:43   so here's the thing i really struggle with my last one our last picks for this

01:54:48   because apple have at their disposal here maybe not at their disposal but on their roster i mean

01:54:54   i was looking at this and putting this together the star power that they have for this service

01:55:00   is astronomical to me like brie larson captain marvel is going to be doing a show

01:55:05   jason momoa whose aquaman is doing a show you've got captain america captain america chris evans

01:55:11   is doing a show my understanding is that chris evans has been shooting uh it was shooting scenes

01:55:16   in in a in in the park behind john syracuse's house so oh wow i can report that exclusively

01:55:22   here i think chris evans was in john's backyard and who knows syracuse is in the show maybe john's

01:55:27   dog ran past chris evans and he petted it who knows but they have a lot of uh stars but i

01:55:34   think that they will want to show a bit of breadth in their service offering so i think they will

01:55:39   have a representative from sesame workshop come on stage are you saying that there will be a puppet

01:55:45   i don't know if there'll be a puppet there might be a puppet but an individual from the sesame

01:55:49   workshop will come on stage to talk about some of the content that their workers like oprah

01:55:54   they have a a like a big big contract it's not a like here's this one show it is a you're gonna

01:56:00   make a suite of products for us they also have this with um peanuts like charlie brown and stuff

01:56:06   but i think sesame workshop feels good uh that would probably be a good good kind of like hey

01:56:11   we're not just all about adult shows and dramas and stuff like that we've got we've got something

01:56:16   for everyone so i think sesame workshop will be uh on stage at the event and i have so many to pick

01:56:21   here i feel like um jason mimoa who is the star of of that show c which by all accounts is one of the

01:56:27   most expensive tv shows made maybe maybe outside of game of thrones um is i i would not be surprised

01:56:35   if he's there he is also aquaman um but uh i'm gonna go in a different direction which is i'm

01:56:42   gonna jump off of your jj abram's pick and say especially since apple enjoys music as well uh

01:56:49   whether it's a musical performance or whether it's just a joint performance with jj i'm gonna

01:56:54   say sarah burellis yep because she is working with jj abrams on a show called little voice and she is

01:57:04   composing the music for the show um so i think that's really interesting like it is it is uh

01:57:14   that that yeah that that i like that connection it just feels very appley that she's she's working

01:57:20   um with jj abrams and she's working doing music stuff and that makes uh makes apple yeah happy i

01:57:27   think it's a good pick because if they do jj he's probably gonna come out when he's collaborating

01:57:31   you know like they're working together on a show so it makes sense for them to come out together

01:57:34   and talk about the show that they're working on now i want to see ron moore uh who was a star

01:57:38   trek producer in battle star galactica and does outlander now i want to see him on stage but

01:57:42   i don't think ron moore again i think you either need to be a big name producer or you need to be

01:57:47   somebody who is a well-known entertainer so again just to clarify the celebrity round these are

01:57:54   the actual human beings walking on the stage it's not appearing in a trailer yes because we have a

01:58:00   trailer round around so these are we're assuming that apple will show some trailers for that content

01:58:05   or some scenes or something to show like we do actually have stuff look how good it is yeah i

01:58:10   think it could even be a still i think they could even be if you if you show a still image if we see

01:58:15   something from a tv production on a screen that counts for this round yeah i suppose if they do

01:58:20   one of those things where they have like a video that shows a like a billion cuts of all the

01:58:26   different shows that they're doing in in a minute that uh all of these might score uh but uh and

01:58:31   we'll have to do some little uh trailer like frame by frame trailer analysis in order to get that out

01:58:36   but we'll do that we'll do that so my first one i'm going to go with because i think that this is

01:58:41   going to be their crown jewel the race witherspoon jennifer aniston and steve correll morning show

01:58:45   drama um i think that for me the sheer star power that they have attached to this show is going to

01:58:54   make it an important show for them um i think that you know it was it was incredible when they brought

01:58:59   on witherspoon and aniston to be in this show together especially because jennifer aniston's

01:59:03   not been in tv shows for such a long time this is her return to tv but then when they added steve

01:59:09   correll and later on it was like oh okay like they they wanted to go big right for for their like for

01:59:15   the final casting of all of this like not they have pumped a lot of star power into this one show

01:59:21   um so i think that this is going to be a big one for them and i think you know some kind of some

01:59:26   kind of imagery for that will look good if they're all on screen at the same time you know like look

01:59:31   at this look at all these amazing stars they're in one of our tv shows we have three hollywood actors

01:59:38   in one tv show it's also um an early order and i think that that's there's some power in that too

01:59:44   it was ordered a long time ago yeah and it also seems like it's this isn't a science fiction show

01:59:49   this one is probably faster to make right you would assume right and and i think it'll be one

01:59:55   of the first ones that they launch we didn't draft a sort of launch strategy but i would not be

02:00:01   surprised if there were if they made pilots available to everyone or to some people i think

02:00:07   that's sensible in the same way that you know i think they'll have some other content and you can

02:00:11   buy right you buy descriptions i think it'll be similar they'll have some kind of uh hey watch

02:00:15   this one episode but that that might exist after a free trial period which i think we have we have

02:00:21   lots of things that we didn't get into in this in this draft that i think are really open questions

02:00:25   maybe we'll talk about it briefly at the end uh with the bring out your dead round um i'm gonna go

02:00:29   uh you said uh you know it's not science fiction i'm gonna say they they need some science fiction

02:00:33   because they want some explosions and if jason mamoa isn't on stage they could at least put

02:00:38   aquaman himself in uh in a clip from sea which again if they're spending a lot of money on it

02:00:44   that money is going to be on the screen i think they will want something that's got you know

02:00:48   dazzling visuals explosions and the like so i'm gonna i'm gonna say we'll see something of sea

02:00:56   um i agree it was on my list uh i'm gonna go back to oprah there's gonna be some oprah content uh

02:01:02   in in this thing i think do we all get a car uh you know look under your seats you will get an

02:01:08   apple tv okay i'm looking i'm looking forward to that apple tv is for everybody yeah i think

02:01:11   there's just something and i have no idea what it will be but as again as we mentioned they've

02:01:15   made a big song and dance about this one so oh uh i am gonna i'm gonna play uh favorites a little

02:01:23   bit and i'm gonna say in addition to see i think we're gonna uh one of the early orders was ronald

02:01:28   d moore's sci-fi series and although ron moore may not be a household name to be put on stage i

02:01:34   hope he is but i i didn't pick him um that is an interesting show because it's about the space race

02:01:39   uh but the space race continued after the apollo program and continues to this day so it's an

02:01:45   advanced sort of human exploration in space also possibly cold war kind of show and you know we're

02:01:52   headed up to the 50th anniversary of the moon landing um i think it would be i think thematically

02:01:59   it would be good with all these sci-fi series is a question of do they have clips that have effects

02:02:03   or can they do some effects for the clips i'm sure they could if they wanted to that happens for

02:02:08   trailers for movies they do effects just for the trailers because it's so much earlier than the

02:02:13   rest of the movie so i'm going to put a chip down on that one on ron moore's sci-fi series about

02:02:18   space the space race because i think it will have some spectacular visuals that people will like

02:02:23   my final pick for trailers is going to be little america which is being created by husband and wife

02:02:32   team kumar najini and emily v gordon they worked on the big sick together big sick yeah great great

02:02:38   movie and they're working with uh some of the producers and writers of masters of none as he's

02:02:43   in sorry show and it's basically looking at true stories of immigrants in america and like telling

02:02:49   their kind of and it's described as the funny romantic heartfelt inspiring and unexpected lives

02:02:54   of immigrants in america at a time where their stories are more relevant than ever i think apple's

02:02:59   again going to want to show some some breadth to their um kind of offering but also you know the

02:03:04   big sick performed so well at award shows uh i think that that it might also you know and also

02:03:10   that movie was very successful as an indie hit even so i think that's gonna gonna play pretty

02:03:15   well for them lots of great choices still on the board because they've they've ordered so many shows

02:03:19   oh my god so many shows i'm gonna go i'm gonna go like you chose sesame workshop in the celebrity

02:03:25   round i'm gonna go with another one of their deals that shows the well-roundedness of this so you've

02:03:29   got the oprah content we've shown a mainstream drama we've got some sci-fi we've got this almost

02:03:33   kind of indie feeling uh and netflix feeling show with little america netflix feeling show

02:03:39   i'm gonna round it out with with kids content and in this case rather than going back to sesame

02:03:43   workshop i'm gonna pick uh peanuts charlie brown that will get a glimpse of even if it's literally

02:03:49   just a glimpse of snoopy and charlie brown uh i think apple wants to send a message of like yeah

02:03:53   we got peanuts because they do they they made a deal with with uh charles schultz's uh company to

02:03:59   do charlie brown peanuts content as well as their deal with sesame workshop to do new stuff so

02:04:05   charlie brown and snoopy are recognizable i think worldwide and uh so they'll they'll appear somehow

02:04:13   on stage as a part of this because you gotta brag you gotta you gotta brag about having uh snoopy

02:04:18   locked up i think as well it's like who would you bring out on stage right so like yeah that

02:04:22   will make sense to show charlie brown everybody so i think that that would that would make sense

02:04:27   to show visually as opposed to like hey bring out this person because there kind of isn't really

02:04:31   anybody to bring out all right so finally our tiebreaker so our tiebreaker round is a madcap

02:04:37   question uh in the essence supplied by me supplied by jason snell and the question is what is the

02:04:43   color of tim's shoes uh i should have done some research into this should have beforehand but i'm

02:04:50   gonna say dark gray dark gray okay we're gonna have a real debate if it's a mid-tone gray oh

02:04:58   it's gonna be wild um i am going to say see i looked at pictures and he has done white he's

02:05:07   done black i there's a lot of kremlinology that should not go on about this so i'm gonna say white

02:05:13   all right so before we before we finish out today we've got a whole draft as always you can find

02:05:18   uh the scorecard in the show notes so you can draw you can like pick along at home but things that we

02:05:23   didn't talk about i said a couple of things i wanted to mention um i think that apple will talk

02:05:29   about other partners that they're going to be working with to bring airplay to like roku maybe

02:05:34   fire tv as well just like these are some other companies that we're gonna work with they'll show

02:05:39   they'll talk about their deal with samsung they'll talk about the home apps on like you know the

02:05:44   advancements with home and what they're going to be doing with airplay on other devices but i think

02:05:49   they'll also have some other options to show off which will be roku fire tv as the low price entry

02:05:56   point and then they're still going to have the apple tv as the higher point and then working

02:05:59   with other tv manufacturers and integrating home kit and stuff like that i will throw in one that

02:06:04   i didn't pick which is uh which i really like which is uh tim apple i think somebody will make

02:06:08   a tim apple reference yeah i don't think it will be i don't think it will be tim cook but perhaps

02:06:13   one of those crazy actors will say thanks tim apple oh yeah i hadn't thought of it that way

02:06:20   that was good yeah because i thought when i put it in it just happened and i was like ah they'll

02:06:24   make it now it feels like a bit old the joke but yeah it definitely feels like something someone

02:06:30   would say to get a quick a cheap laugh yes i want to ask you because you put in a couple of things

02:06:35   and this is probably what you would go to next but what is going to happen with the mac and this

02:06:41   content yeah so i think one of the most fascinating things here i think it'll be in the tv app

02:06:44   everywhere else one of the most fascinating things about this whole thing and um uh is where what

02:06:50   happens on the mac and i i think it's a real question i almost made this a pick them as well

02:06:56   because it really is like what do they do so i think they got some options right they can say

02:07:00   we put it in itunes yay nobody is excited about that uh they could say it's going to be on the tv

02:07:07   app which is coming to the mac this fall they could do that right like marzipan and it'll be

02:07:12   on the tv app this fall and you'll need to upgrade your mac in order to watch the service they could

02:07:17   say um it is uh what we're also doing is you can log into your account and watch it on the web

02:07:24   and that means that if you're on a mac or a pc or any other platform chromebooks whatever you can

02:07:29   watch it on the web as well and that's like i mean every other video service right the the fallback

02:07:34   is the web if they don't have an app it's fine it's on the web i think that might be the easiest

02:07:39   thing for them to do and then they don't need to worry about updating any mac app to support it and

02:07:43   maybe the tv app comes later um and it is possible that they will just literally say this will be on

02:07:49   the mac in the fall when that app comes out and otherwise you have no no other way to watch it on

02:07:54   the mac but um i don't know which one they're going to choose if i had a guess i would say

02:08:00   it will be available on the web and then maybe the tv app will come to the mac this fall marzipan

02:08:05   yeah right yeah i think that would be the scenario there but i i would really like them to see

02:08:10   to see them do a web version only because it um it gets them on all other platforms without them

02:08:18   actually having to support them particularly as long as they can get the web page it answers a

02:08:22   million questions exactly right it's just oh it's if you want it it's just on the web go watch it on

02:08:27   the web yeah log into your apple id and there it'll be so that is the draft the draft is taken care

02:08:35   of you can find links to scorecard and links to everything else we discussed about in this episode

02:08:40   i hope that you have enjoyed this extra special wonderful bonus bumper episode of upgrade this has

02:08:46   been a really big episode for us yes thanks thanks to uh thanks to our special guest as well it was a

02:08:50   big big moment for us to have a special apple guest on i know for the first time very very

02:08:56   very happy about that and again we'll actually give a little shout follow out you should go listen to

02:09:01   atp with feel chiller it's incredible it's a wonderful wonderful episode totally puts all

02:09:05   these apple people on podcast i know isn't it great but we're feeling very very uh we feel

02:09:10   really pleased that we're able to do this today and i hope that you enjoyed the episode as much

02:09:14   as we have enjoyed putting it together you can find links to everything that we've spoken about

02:09:18   today over at relay.fm upgrade slash 237 but you can also find those links in your podcast app of

02:09:25   choice if you want to find jason online you can go to sixcolors.com the incomparable.com and he is

02:09:31   @jsnell on social networks like twitter and instagram and stuff like that and i am @imike

02:09:38   thanks to squarespace and lunar display and green chef for the support of this show but most of all

02:09:45   as always thank you for listening we'll be back next time when we're reporting live after an event

02:09:51   yes that's right it'll be a later release than usual because i will be in cupertino for the event

02:09:55   but it's going to be the regular day usually it's like a wild day of the week but it's going to be

02:09:58   on monday jason's going to be there so we will be reporting um as soon as he is done and back in

02:10:04   the snell zone yes i will tell you what oprah is really like oprah okay so thank you so much for

02:10:10   tuning in we'll be back next week with even more until then say goodbye jason snow oh i'm tired

02:10:16   goodbye everybody

02:10:25   so