Upgrade

00:00:00 ◼   ► *BEEP*

00:00:00 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 163.

00:00:12 ◼   ► Today's show is brought to you by Balance, Squarespace, and Macworld.

00:00:16 ◼   ► And my name is Myke Hurley, and I am joined in person across this breakfast counter by Mr. Jason Snow.

00:00:21 ◼   ► Happy breakfast counter, Myke.

00:00:23 ◼   ► Happy breakfast counter to you, Jason Snow.

00:00:24 ◼   ► We're in Chicago right now.

00:00:25 ◼   ► We are.

00:00:26 ◼   ► We even have a tiny, tiny, tiny audience.

00:00:29 ◼   ► But nobody cares about that because it's time for Snell Talk.

00:00:32 ◼   ► That's perfect. Nice. I like that. We actually have a really fun Snell Talk question today

00:00:36 ◼   ► from Josh. Josh misses the old small talk, so how's the weather today?

00:00:40 ◼   ► It's sunny today.

00:00:41 ◼   ► It is sunny. We are in Chicago. We're in Airbnb right now. There's a train that goes by sometimes,

00:00:47 ◼   ► which you may get the pleasure of hearing.

00:00:48 ◼   ► Yeah, just pretend we're Merlin.

00:00:50 ◼   ► Yeah, we've got a streetcar. And we are at Release Notes.

00:00:53 ◼   ► Yes.

00:00:54 ◼   ► So at least that starts today.

00:00:56 ◼   ► We've been doing some stuff in and around.

00:00:58 ◼   ► We had a bunch of live episodes.

00:01:00 ◼   ► We had a live episode of The Pen Addict,

00:01:01 ◼   ► which is coming out later this week at Field Notes.

00:01:04 ◼   ► We had a live episode of Connected,

00:01:06 ◼   ► and a live episode of Ungenius.

00:01:07 ◼   ► Connected's out, Ungenius took me out today as well.

00:01:09 ◼   ► We've been doing some fun stuff, bunch of meetups.

00:01:11 ◼   ► It's been a really, really great week so far.

00:01:13 ◼   ► - And now we have a live episode of Upgrade,

00:01:14 ◼   ► live before a studio audience.

00:01:16 ◼   ► - Of two people, Federico and Steven.

00:01:18 ◼   ► Say hi, guys.

00:01:19 ◼   ► - Hey. - Hey, guys.

00:01:20 ◼   ► - You probably can't hear them, but they're there.

00:01:22 ◼   ► They're there, they're working on their iPads.

00:01:23 ◼   ► They're not imaginary. They're real. Yeah.

00:01:25 ◼   ► You can't work on an iPad, Myke. What are you talking about?

00:01:27 ◼   ► That's very true, actually. That is very true.

00:01:29 ◼   ► So, how's the Spider Mac?

00:01:32 ◼   ► Uhhhhh...

00:01:34 ◼   ► The Spider Mac is... The Spider is gone.

00:01:37 ◼   ► The Mac has returned.

00:01:39 ◼   ► I cannot tell you how relieved I was to get my iMac back.

00:01:43 ◼   ► I was so sad.

00:01:46 ◼   ► I mean, I think I mentioned this last week.

00:01:48 ◼   ► I was so sad to have it gone and have my little monitor arm

00:01:52 ◼   ► Just standing there at attention with nothing on it. It was like but my computer. Where is where did it go?

00:01:58 ◼   ► But it has been returned from its repairs

00:02:01 ◼   ► with

00:02:04 ◼   ► With no spider in the in the glass

00:02:06 ◼   ► They give you the spider back like, you know

00:02:08 ◼   ► If you have some like some kind of medical procedure that like kidney stones or put them in a little jar for you or something

00:02:13 ◼   ► No, this is more like when a pet dies that does not give you your dead pet. They they flushed it

00:02:17 ◼   ► they use a lot of I'm sure a lot of care and and

00:02:22 ◼   ► to see how they did that like just the whole process taking the screen off just to remove

00:02:27 ◼   ► the spider and then put it back again. I assume they pulled off the entire screen and replaced it.

00:02:34 ◼   ► It's the only way to do it right? Yeah and those iMacs are hard to do but anyway it's it's uh

00:02:39 ◼   ► it's done it which allows me to work undistracted and also to sell it or give it away

00:02:47 ◼   ► Handed down when I decide to upgrade upgrade my iMac which I think is gonna happen

00:02:52 ◼   ► I think it's just a matter of whether I'm gonna do the

00:02:56 ◼   ► Latest and greatest iMac this fall or whether I will I really want to see about the iMac Pro

00:03:02 ◼   ► I think this is my decided. I think you've decided this in your brain. You're getting an iMac Pro

00:03:06 ◼   ► I think you've decided I have decided to get an iMac Pro with one exception

00:03:10 ◼   ► Which is I know there's gonna be a moment

00:03:12 ◼   ► When I'm on the shopping page for the iMac Pro once the orders open up where it's gonna say

00:03:17 ◼   ► Here's how much it costs and it's gonna be $5,000 and I'm gonna be like really do I want to do this?

00:03:24 ◼   ► We I mean, I think everybody used to do this you'd go to the old Mac Pro page and you'd price up

00:03:31 ◼   ► How expensive can you make this?

00:03:33 ◼   ► You know like you get it like 10 grand 12 grand this probably gonna be like that

00:03:37 ◼   ► I reckon not that you'll pay that no

00:03:38 ◼   ► But you could if you wanted to it will be the base model if I get one of these let me tell you that base model

00:03:44 ◼   ► Will be very very very good. Yeah, I mean there's no doubt that logically

00:03:49 ◼   ► it would be good for me doing my job to have that but not the writing part, but the

00:03:53 ◼   ► denoising files part

00:03:56 ◼   ► audio files, so yeah, we'll see

00:03:58 ◼   ► Last week we spent some time talking about emoji. Let the eleven point one beta came out

00:04:04 ◼   ► After the after we recorded so you can get the emoji now and they're great. There's a bunch of new great emoji in there

00:04:09 ◼   ► And I got some feedback some follow-up from Mark Bram Hill who is the creator of welcome to Macintosh

00:04:16 ◼   ► And he just did a big emoji series. He has a lot of thoughts about emoji. So I was talking about

00:04:20 ◼   ► that I believe that Apple hold off the emoji releases until after the main release to try and

00:04:27 ◼   ► Spare on adoption and mark said that Unicode finalizes emoji in the summer

00:04:32 ◼   ► Giving a fairly short timeline to illustrate and that Unicode are now switching to an earlier timeline

00:04:38 ◼   ► Finalizing three months after in the spring so we may see next year's new emoji in iOS 12 because vendors have complained to Unicode

00:04:46 ◼   ► Which is why they switched their timeline so it could be the reason for the wait

00:04:50 ◼   ► so we'll see I mean that is a I still believe that they hold it off because

00:04:54 ◼   ► Other vendors like Google have supported them already

00:04:57 ◼   ► But it could be like if they want to spend time really illustrating them and that kind of thing

00:05:01 ◼   ► But it's good to see that it is funny to see how the Unicode consortium which is this big thing

00:05:06 ◼   ► Is basically the emoji house now, right like and that they're making all these changes now

00:05:11 ◼   ► So emoji can be better prepared and stuff like that. But yeah, so that's what they're doing going forward. Yeah

00:05:16 ◼   ► It's it's a funny example of an organization that

00:05:20 ◼   ► Was not made to do this, but they've kind of become fallen into it. So they yeah, they have to deal with this

00:05:26 ◼   ► Is what they do. Yeah, you know

00:05:28 ◼   ► so

00:05:30 ◼   ► when we were in

00:05:32 ◼   ► Chicago we planned to go to the cinema together. Unfortunately, you had a plane that got cancelled so you didn't make it

00:05:37 ◼   ► Yeah, there was a it's sunny now, but over the weekend there were torrential rains

00:05:43 ◼   ► Chicago big thunderstorms for a whole day on Saturday and so my flight got cancelled

00:05:48 ◼   ► So I came in Sunday which meant I didn't get the chance to do Myke at the movies in person

00:05:56 ◼   ► with you on Saturday night.

00:05:57 ◼   ► Because we wanted to talk about, I went to see Blade Runner 2049 which we were going

00:06:01 ◼   ► to talk about together but we can't now so I just want to give some completely no spoilers

00:06:06 ◼   ► opinions of Blade Runner 2049.

00:06:09 ◼   ► Here we go.

00:06:10 ◼   ► I just wanted to say that I really like this movie a lot.

00:06:14 ◼   ► It gave me what I liked about the first one, the visuals and the music are incredible,

00:06:18 ◼   ► just so beautiful.

00:06:20 ◼   ► One of the most visually beautiful films I have ever seen.

00:06:25 ◼   ► It was stunning.

00:06:26 ◼   ► And it also gave me less of what I didn't like about Blade Runner.

00:06:31 ◼   ► So I found the story to be easier to follow and there was more action.

00:06:35 ◼   ► Like there was more stuff going on in the movie.

00:06:37 ◼   ► So you just made Blade Runner fans happy and then like reluctant because they're like,

00:06:42 ◼   ► But wait, Myke is saying that he likes Blade Runner 2049 better than Blade Runner in some

00:06:49 ◼   ► ways because it has more of the things that you like, which is going to be heresy.

00:06:53 ◼   ► I prefer this movie.

00:06:54 ◼   ► But as I mentioned to you I believe last night, there is literally nothing you can say about

00:06:57 ◼   ► Blade Runner now that will not anger somebody.

00:07:00 ◼   ► If you like Blade Runner, you already don't like what me and Jason have to say about anything

00:07:03 ◼   ► to Blade Runner.

00:07:04 ◼   ► Even though, we've got this reputation now, even though we both pretty much came out in

00:07:10 ◼   ► our revision with John Syracuse in being much more favorable to Blade Runner after watching

00:07:15 ◼   ► the final cut. Yeah, but I prefer this movie. I really like Ryan Gosling in general, so

00:07:21 ◼   ► that was a big win for me, like he's great in it. I really re- I recommend it. I know

00:07:25 ◼   ► it hasn't done very well in the box office. Um, which it- in a way, like it doesn't surprise

00:07:32 ◼   ► me. Like I understand that like it's a huge cast, but it is a sequel to a movie that is

00:07:38 ◼   ► kind of a cult movie Blade Runner. I feel like it was not a hit.

00:07:43 ◼   ► So it is not surprising to me that the the sequel to this movie which maybe

00:07:48 ◼   ► never should have been made right like by a lot of people's standards it kind of

00:07:52 ◼   ► has not doing so well but I do recommend it like I actually don't really feel

00:07:58 ◼   ► like you even need to have seen Blade Runner to go and see this movie like

00:08:01 ◼   ► they set things out pretty simply with text and it's like it's kind of like

00:08:05 ◼   ► they have like a crawl at the beginning kind of thing and that's it. But yeah I

00:08:09 ◼   ► really liked it. I'm just ashamed we can't talk about it in more detail. Maybe

00:08:12 ◼   ► one day. Maybe. One last thing. I just wanted to mention because I've been

00:08:17 ◼   ► spending more time with Apple nerds in different locations over the last couple

00:08:22 ◼   ► of days. The iOS 11 Wi-Fi password sharing thing is amazing. So this is when

00:08:27 ◼   ► you're somebody's connected to a Wi-Fi network and you try to connect to the

00:08:31 ◼   ► same network, it gives them a pop-up on any device, Mac or iOS. They can say yes, allow

00:08:37 ◼   ► this person, share the password with them and it just pre-fills on your device and you

00:08:42 ◼   ► just have to be in somebody's contact book. So it's quite funny like if there's a bunch

00:08:44 ◼   ► of people in a room and you try and connect to the Wi-Fi, it pings all of their devices

00:08:50 ◼   ► and someone will just let you on. But it is so much easier to go like, "Hey, what's the

00:08:54 ◼   ► Wi-Fi password?" It's really good. It's a really good feature.

00:08:56 ◼   ► Yeah, and it doesn't need to be secure in that way, right? Because the idea is not,

00:09:03 ◼   ► well, they're not the owner of the Wi-Fi network, so should they be giving that out?

00:09:08 ◼   ► The fact is, once you know the Wi-Fi password, you know it, theoretically, and you can share

00:09:13 ◼   ► it, so why not just share it?

00:09:14 ◼   ► Yeah, these people have to be in your contacts. Like, I like that kind of security. They just

00:09:17 ◼   ► have to be a friend of yours, and you can give them the Wi-Fi password. I think that

00:09:21 ◼   ► works really well. It's a good feature.

00:09:23 ◼   ► That's great. I look forward to using that sometime.

00:09:25 ◼   ► So I didn't say, I want to, because we kind of skip all the way through the Snell Talk

00:09:29 ◼   ► question. Thank you to Josh for submitting his Snell Talk question. If you have a question

00:09:32 ◼   ► you'd like to open the show, #snelltalk and they'll go into a document and we can pull

00:09:37 ◼   ► those out.

00:09:38 ◼   ► That's right. And who knows, maybe there'll be more Snell Talk questions about Small Talk,

00:09:42 ◼   ► about the weather.

00:09:43 ◼   ► Maybe there will be.

00:09:44 ◼   ► Then it'll be directed by the listeners. We'll have to talk about Small Talk because they

00:09:47 ◼   ► demand it.

00:09:48 ◼   ► I think it kind of all is Small Talk.

00:09:49 ◼   ► Yeah, I suppose so.

00:09:50 ◼   ► Why is it called Snell Talk?

00:09:51 ◼   ► It's just directed instead of random. It is a little weird, I have to say, not just,

00:09:57 ◼   ► it's very nice to be across the table from you. We do this really a shocking amount,

00:10:01 ◼   ► given that I live in California and you live in London, we do this two or three times a

00:10:06 ◼   ► year it seems, which is great. So high five. Yeah, there it is. That was good podcasting.

00:10:13 ◼   ► You spit out some water and did a high five. It is a little disconcerting, I realize, as

00:10:18 ◼   ► I'm sitting here because I keep looking up and to my left expecting to see the oak tree

00:10:26 ◼   ► out my window and it's not there. There's no oak tree over there. Where's the oak tree?

00:10:30 ◼   ► Where's the squirrel that is running along the fence? They're not out there.

00:10:34 ◼   ► I can see him at McDonald's.

00:10:35 ◼   ► It is Monday morning though. So that is, that feels, and I'm sitting here kind of unshaved

00:10:40 ◼   ► and in my shirt from yesterday because I haven't taken a shower yet this morning. And in that

00:10:45 ◼   ► way, it feels like upgrade.

00:10:47 ◼   ► There's a lot of information for the listener.

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00:11:04 ◼   ► - Speaking of what we said earlier, absolutely.

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00:11:09 ◼   ► - Did you wear your Mack Weldon sweatpants on the plane?

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00:11:12 ◼   ► - Of course you did. - Of course I did.

00:11:13 ◼   ► - It was a little chilly the other day at home

00:11:15 ◼   ► and I put on my Mack Weldon sweatpants

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00:11:18 ◼   ► and I thought, oh, we're Mac Walden sweatpants twinsies.

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00:12:06 ◼   ► I should say I'm also wearing Mac Walden today, Jason.

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00:12:11 ◼   ► - Thank you so much to Mac Walden

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00:12:14 ◼   ► And Relay FM, Jason, your favorite topic.

00:12:18 ◼   ► There's a new Kindle.

00:12:20 ◼   ► - What?

00:12:21 ◼   ► A new Kindle?

00:12:22 ◼   ► - A new Kindle.

00:12:23 ◼   ► So this is it.

00:12:24 ◼   ► This is still the Oasis, right?

00:12:26 ◼   ► Which is weird because they seem to come up with names

00:12:29 ◼   ► for new stuff all the time.

00:12:31 ◼   ► - Yeah, they--

00:12:32 ◼   ► - And this seems like a pretty significant update.

00:12:33 ◼   ► - Well, they've revised the Paperwhite.

00:12:35 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:12:36 ◼   ► - So this is, and they've revised the Kindle,

00:12:39 ◼   ► I guess is what they call it. - Paperwhite

00:12:39 ◼   ► is a terrible name.

00:12:41 ◼   ► Like that, for me, is not aged.

00:12:43 ◼   ► That is just a bad product name, Paperweight.

00:12:45 ◼   ► - Well, the idea at the time was that it is

00:12:50 ◼   ► a high contrast screen.

00:12:52 ◼   ► Instead of being a kind of medium gray,

00:12:54 ◼   ► it's a very light gray and it's got the backlighting on it.

00:12:56 ◼   ► And it's actually the best Kindle to get

00:12:59 ◼   ► in terms of being a good buy with the features that it's got.

00:13:02 ◼   ► - Still?

00:13:03 ◼   ► - Well, we'll see how this new one.

00:13:04 ◼   ► So this new Oasis, this is the old Oasis

00:13:06 ◼   ► was more expensive than this one and kind of weird.

00:13:11 ◼   ► It came with a case with a battery on it, and you had to get the case because it was

00:13:16 ◼   ► very small and very thin and had not great battery life, although e-ink, e-book readers

00:13:21 ◼   ► are really good at using battery lightly.

00:13:26 ◼   ► But you could put the case on it and then it would use that battery or recharge its

00:13:31 ◼   ► own internal battery.

00:13:33 ◼   ► So with this, they've kept the kind of wedge shape of that.

00:13:37 ◼   ► It's got a kind of a thick part and a thin part, but the case is gone, the mandatory

00:13:42 ◼   ► battery case.

00:13:43 ◼   ► It's got bigger battery inside and it's heavier than it was because that battery weighs a

00:13:52 ◼   ► couple ounces, so it's heavier.

00:13:55 ◼   ► And it's got a larger screen, it's got a 7-inch screen, so it's kind of going outside of the

00:13:59 ◼   ► previously common 6-inch Kindle screen.

00:14:04 ◼   ► So it's still their premium, most expensive Kindle, but it's no longer their light Kindle

00:14:10 ◼   ► because it's gained that weight.

00:14:12 ◼   ► And it's cheaper, so that's good, it starts at $250.

00:14:17 ◼   ► And we'll see how it goes.

00:14:20 ◼   ► They're doing some interesting things, they're now doing a storage tier, which they didn't

00:14:26 ◼   ► do before, which I think is really funny because ebooks are very small.

00:14:30 ◼   ► I think they're doing this because they've added audible support.

00:14:33 ◼   ► So Amazon owns Audible and you can buy Audible bundles of ebook and audiobook and they've

00:14:41 ◼   ► added to this new Oasis and I think they're rolling it out to a couple of existing models

00:14:45 ◼   ► including the old Oasis and maybe there's one more where they're going to add Bluetooth

00:14:51 ◼   ► support that apparently there's Bluetooth in those devices and it's just turned off.

00:14:55 ◼   ► Bluetooth audio support so that you can also use it, pair it with headphones and listen

00:15:00 ◼   ► to your audiobook if you want to stop reading but keep going. Which is funny because that's

00:15:05 ◼   ► a throwback to the original Kindles. The original Kindles had headphone jacks and you could

00:15:09 ◼   ► put audiobooks on them. So this is like the next generation of that which I think is kind

00:15:13 ◼   ► of interesting. And then the other big thing which has never before been in existence on

00:15:18 ◼   ► a Kindle unless you used a Ziploc bag in the bathtub like Jeff Bezos apparently did. He

00:15:24 ◼   ► doesn't need to anymore because it's waterproof.

00:15:26 ◼   ► Yeah, why would you want a waterproof Kindle?

00:15:29 ◼   ► To read in the bathtub.

00:15:31 ◼   ► Is that the main reason that they've done this?

00:15:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:15:34 ◼   ► That's interesting.

00:15:35 ◼   ► Yeah, people, and I know, so I realized, I was talking to Aline Sims actually about this

00:15:40 ◼   ► who is here, and she said she was excited about the bathtub thing, and I realized your

00:15:48 ◼   ► feeling about reading in the bathtub has a lot to do with whether you have a good bathtub,

00:15:52 ◼   ► and I do not.

00:15:53 ◼   ► Our bathtub is uncomfortable.

00:15:54 ◼   ► You can read in the shower.

00:15:55 ◼   ► Is that a thing you want to do?

00:15:56 ◼   ► - No, that's not gonna happen.

00:15:58 ◼   ► When we were in Hawaii, I did read in a,

00:16:01 ◼   ► there was a hot tub at the place we were staying, out back,

00:16:04 ◼   ► and so it's just, you know, it's out there in the fresh air

00:16:05 ◼   ► in a beautiful view in a hot tub, and I did read there,

00:16:08 ◼   ► and I had the Kindle Oasis, the old one,

00:16:11 ◼   ► so I would just, you know, hold it very carefully

00:16:14 ◼   ► so as not to drop it in the water and destroy it.

00:16:16 ◼   ► But I think there are people who read in the bathtub,

00:16:20 ◼   ► including Jeff Bezos, who, I'm not kidding,

00:16:22 ◼   ► famously said that he used a Ziploc bag around his Kindle.

00:16:26 ◼   ► It's funny because it's IPX8 certified for waterproofing, which is just funny to me because

00:16:32 ◼   ► of what this certification means, like what you can do. You can submerge a Kindle for

00:16:38 ◼   ► up to 2 meters for 60 minutes. I don't think that's ever going to happen.

00:16:43 ◼   ► What I was thinking is that's the rating for "Mom, I dropped the Kindle in the pool,

00:16:48 ◼   ► we'll go get it now." How long does it take to fish it out of the bottom of the pool?

00:16:54 ◼   ► This is, I feel like Amazon is shifting their tactics here.

00:16:58 ◼   ► And this is, look, e-book, e-ink readers are a niche product category, but they're actually

00:17:05 ◼   ► popular.

00:17:06 ◼   ► We've talked about this.

00:17:07 ◼   ► Every time we talk about the Kindle, I have to do this disclaimer, which is tech nerds

00:17:09 ◼   ► think it's dumb because it's black and white and you should just get a tablet.

00:17:14 ◼   ► But the fact is, tech nerds are not the main audience for this product.

00:17:18 ◼   ► It is people who are the demographic of Kindle users.

00:17:21 ◼   ► I'm sure if Amazon actually would release this data, which they never will, but I would

00:17:25 ◼   ► say the demographic of Kindle, it's older. There are probably more women than men in

00:17:32 ◼   ► this demographic. It is the book reader demographic, which is a very different demographic than

00:17:39 ◼   ► the tech nerd demographic. And these are great for reading books. That's why I have them,

00:17:43 ◼   ► is they're great for reading text on a page. That's what they're good for. And Amazon

00:17:50 ◼   ► this time is like storage tier, audiobook integration direct, waterproofing, bigger

00:17:57 ◼   ► screen which is new, it probably is going to be, I have the Kobo Aura 1 which is a pretty

00:18:03 ◼   ► good ebook reader and it's like the difference between reading a paperback and reading like

00:18:06 ◼   ► a hard cover book or something where it's like got the bigger screen. I imagine the

00:18:10 ◼   ► Oasis is going to kind of be like that. So it shows that Amazon is still trying stuff

00:18:16 ◼   ► with the Kindle which I like.

00:18:18 ◼   ► - They don't have a color one, right?

00:18:20 ◼   ► - No, I mean the color Kindle was basically

00:18:22 ◼   ► the Fire tablet. - The Fire.

00:18:26 ◼   ► - Right, the Kindle. - It's still black and white.

00:18:28 ◼   ► - Yeah, it's just, I think they make color ink,

00:18:31 ◼   ► but there are issues with it and it's not important.

00:18:34 ◼   ► - You don't need it.

00:18:34 ◼   ► But I think that adds to what you were saying

00:18:37 ◼   ► about who this product is for.

00:18:39 ◼   ► Like if they were making this for the tech audience,

00:18:41 ◼   ► they probably would put color in it

00:18:42 ◼   ► just because it would be fancy.

00:18:43 ◼   ► - Yeah, it would be a checkbox and all that,

00:18:45 ◼   ► But this is an uncool product.

00:18:47 ◼   ► This is not a product that needs to be cool.

00:18:49 ◼   ► - This isn't an echo.

00:18:50 ◼   ► - No.

00:18:51 ◼   ► - You know, it's not cool.

00:18:52 ◼   ► - I have an iPad and I read on my iPad all the time

00:18:54 ◼   ► and when I read novels, I read them on a Kindle.

00:18:57 ◼   ► I prefer to read them on the Kindle.

00:18:58 ◼   ► I prefer the reflective screen.

00:19:00 ◼   ► - It's comfortable.

00:19:02 ◼   ► - It is easier on my eyes.

00:19:04 ◼   ► It's nice to not be distracted.

00:19:09 ◼   ► Just, you know how I say working on the iPad

00:19:11 ◼   ► feels less distracting than working on the Mac

00:19:13 ◼   ► because mostly I'm in one app at a time. Reading on the Kindle is way less distracting

00:19:18 ◼   ► than reading on the iPad because there's no notifications coming in or anything like

00:19:21 ◼   ► that. I'm just reading my book. So it's, yeah, it's not for everyone and I think

00:19:26 ◼   ► that for people who are sort of more vaguely interested in a Kindle, the Paperwhite is

00:19:32 ◼   ► probably still going to be the better buy because it's way cheaper and like if you're

00:19:35 ◼   ► going to buy an e-reader that's kind of disposable and you use it at the beach a

00:19:38 ◼   ► couple of times a year. The Paperwhite is the one I choose because it does have the

00:19:44 ◼   ► lighting so you can read it at night without a light.

00:19:47 ◼   ► Does this have a light?

00:19:48 ◼   ► Yeah. They all do now. This has like eight. It's something like their nine LCD or nine

00:19:54 ◼   ► LED backlights in the Paperwhite and this one's got like 15 or something.

00:19:59 ◼   ► This is bigger, right? It makes sense.

00:20:01 ◼   ► Yeah, and it's more evenly lit when they do it that way. So yeah, I think it's cool.

00:20:06 ◼   ► You want one?

00:20:07 ◼   ► Well, so I like the Oasis, the current Oasis a lot and one of the things I like about it

00:20:12 ◼   ► is you can pop that cover off and it's super light. It's like not, like there's nothing

00:20:17 ◼   ► in your hand. It's just, there's no weight to it. It's great.

00:20:20 ◼   ► But this isn't that.

00:20:21 ◼   ► And this one is, is I think basically the same weight as the one, the current Oasis,

00:20:27 ◼   ► the old Oasis in a case. But without the case, it's way heavier. It's like several ounces

00:20:31 ◼   ► heavier. So when this was announced, I thought to myself, yeah, you know, I think as a user

00:20:36 ◼   ► of the Kindle. I, Oasis, I'm not sure I really want to have this. As somebody who writes

00:20:43 ◼   ► about this and talks about it, I totally ordered it because I decided it was worth it to me

00:20:47 ◼   ► to try it out and talk about it and review it and figure out where it fits in my grand

00:20:51 ◼   ► which Kindle should you buy scheme.

00:20:53 ◼   ► I think the waterproofing might edge out the weight. Like the benefit of the waterproofing

00:20:59 ◼   ► for a lot of people will be like I don't care that it's heavier. Like I really need it to

00:21:02 ◼   ► be waterproof.

00:21:03 ◼   ► If you are somebody who takes your Kindle to the beach or the pool or anything like

00:21:07 ◼   ► that or reads in the bathtub or a hot tub or something like that.

00:21:10 ◼   ► I should have called it the Kindle bubbles or something.

00:21:13 ◼   ► Oasis, I get it.

00:21:16 ◼   ► It is weird to me that they did all of this and didn't give it a new product name.

00:21:23 ◼   ► That is strange to me.

00:21:24 ◼   ► Well I think obviously it was the successor to the Oasis.

00:21:33 ◼   ► when they were developing it, the fact that it's got that kind of wedge shape where the

00:21:36 ◼   ► battery's on one side, so you've got your sort of side you grip that's a little bit

00:21:40 ◼   ► thicker and then there's the other side which doesn't have that which means it makes it

00:21:43 ◼   ► lighter overall and less bulky overall. Obviously it originated from that same idea so it's

00:21:49 ◼   ► they think about it as an evolution. I think there are too many kindles and that there's

00:21:55 ◼   ► probably a kindle in there that they should probably get rid of but that's where we are.

00:22:01 ◼   ► So there's also going on to more kind of entertainment-y news in technology.

00:22:05 ◼   ► There's a few things going on this week that are all relating to movies and how technology

00:22:12 ◼   ► companies are evolving their movie efforts.

00:22:16 ◼   ► The first is a service called Movies Anywhere, which is something that's existed for a while

00:22:20 ◼   ► but wasn't massively useful.

00:22:22 ◼   ► Yeah, Disney Movies Anywhere is what it was.

00:22:24 ◼   ► Yeah, because it is a Disney-owned property and it was you could buy, say you bought a

00:22:29 ◼   ► Disney movie on iTunes or Amazon or Google Play, you could link these

00:22:33 ◼   ► accounts to Disney service and then these movies would be available for you

00:22:37 ◼   ► everywhere both in the Disney movies anywhere app and this is this is the big

00:22:43 ◼   ► part this is the the really mind-boggling part if you bought a

00:22:48 ◼   ► Disney movie on Amazon you could download it on iTunes yes and vice

00:22:53 ◼   ► versa across all of these services this week Disney extended this to other

00:22:59 ◼   ► major studios. It's now called Movies Anywhere, right? They removed the Disney branding from

00:23:03 ◼   ► the name. And it includes Warner Brothers, Universal, Fox, and Sony. I think Paramount

00:23:09 ◼   ► is the big holdout.

00:23:10 ◼   ► Paramount is the big holdout.

00:23:11 ◼   ► But this, so this is wild. So you can buy movies wherever they're cheapest and watch

00:23:17 ◼   ► them wherever you want.

00:23:19 ◼   ► Yeah, I suspect that their, the pricing's going to be the same everywhere.

00:23:23 ◼   ► I'd like to imagine this because you know you can go to to iTunes sometimes and there'll be a

00:23:28 ◼   ► Like a movie of the day. Yeah, that's possible. It's possible, but they'll they'll sink everywhere and and I

00:23:34 ◼   ► had this experience with the Disney stuff where we were visiting my mom in Arizona, and I threw a

00:23:39 ◼   ► fire TV stick in my bag

00:23:42 ◼   ► just for the trip because she doesn't have any Netflix down there and

00:23:47 ◼   ► I thought we might want to watch movies, and I realized that I had Disney movies anywhere

00:23:53 ◼   ► and we brought up the Amazon movie list and in the purchase movies was all the

00:23:59 ◼   ► Marvel movies that I bought on iTunes it was like oh my god that is amazing what

00:24:04 ◼   ► it does is it's really good for so the the background here is that the movie

00:24:09 ◼   ► studios are concerned that with the rise of streaming services people aren't

00:24:13 ◼   ► buying movies anymore because you can just just whatever is on wait wait for

00:24:18 ◼   ► it to be on streaming and they want to so it used to be they were more hostile

00:24:22 ◼   ► to us, but now they want us to, they're motivated to make us happy. And so this is,

00:24:30 ◼   ► I mean, with that motivation out there, this is a consumer friendly feature. It's them

00:24:35 ◼   ► trying to coax us into continuing to buy or resuming buying movies by saying, "Guess

00:24:41 ◼   ► what? We've decided that despite Apple and Amazon fighting over you, if you buy our movie,

00:24:48 ◼   ► You just get it everywhere. You buy a disc with a code, you get it everywhere and it's

00:24:52 ◼   ► not like use the ultraviolet app which links to this voodoo service you've never heard

00:24:57 ◼   ► of. It's like no, no, no. You will get this on all services. If you want it on Google

00:25:03 ◼   ► Play, if you want it on iTunes, if you want it on Amazon, we don't care. We don't care

00:25:06 ◼   ► if you have an Apple TV or an Amazon Fire TV.

00:25:08 ◼   ► Adam: Both, all of them.

00:25:09 ◼   ► Scott: We literally just, you get the movie when you buy the disc or you do a download,

00:25:14 ◼   ► you get the movie. And maybe that'll work. They're trying to make your investment in

00:25:19 ◼   ► buying a movie more valuable because they know that if you're, even if you're not going

00:25:24 ◼   ► to Netflix and watching movies, but you're starting to watch movies on set top boxes,

00:25:28 ◼   ► that stops Blu-ray sales because you can't do anything with the Blu-ray. And if you're

00:25:33 ◼   ► like, you know, us, right? I definitely had this where I will buy an iTunes download.

00:25:38 ◼   ► And one of the reasons is that it's available everywhere on my iPad without me having to

00:25:43 ◼   ► rip the Blu-ray and copy it to Plex and then put it on my iPad. I can literally just go

00:25:48 ◼   ► download in the TV app and it'll download. That is so much more convenient. And so if

00:25:56 ◼   ► you are somebody who might buy a Blu-ray otherwise, this gives you an out, which is no, it's covered

00:26:01 ◼   ► now. No matter what device you want, it's covered. It's super smart. I get why they're

00:26:06 ◼   ► doing it, but it is a really positive, good news for consumers kind of thing. And it works.

00:26:12 ◼   ► a kind of magical and you get some movies when you sign up for it too.

00:26:15 ◼   ► You get Ghostbusters, The Lego Movie and Beaker 06.

00:26:18 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:19 ◼   ► Good movies.

00:26:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:21 ◼   ► And so I signed up and you link your accounts, you sign up to Movies Anywhere.

00:26:25 ◼   ► If you were a Disney Movies Anywhere person you put in that password and stuff at some

00:26:29 ◼   ► point and it like relinks, it copies that data over.

00:26:32 ◼   ► So it's sort of a new service but it'll copy your data from Disney Movies Anywhere.

00:26:36 ◼   ► you log in to iTunes and Amazon and Vudu and Google and like all the services they've got

00:26:43 ◼   ► if you've got accounts there. So if you've got a bunch of ultraviolet movies that are

00:26:47 ◼   ► synced to your Vudu account which I did. I had two. Well, the ultraviolet codes are so

00:26:53 ◼   ► stupid because the app is so bad but there are some digital movies that are over there

00:26:57 ◼   ► and that's actually one of these kind of pro tips is if you've got movies in that stupid

00:27:00 ◼   ► ultraviolet locker and it's linked to Vudu, then you link the Vudu account to movies anywhere

00:27:06 ◼   ► and they all come over. So I've got these ultra violent movies that are suddenly in

00:27:09 ◼   ► my iTunes account.

00:27:10 ◼   ► - I read on the Verge that Apple will give you the 4K HDR versions as well.

00:27:16 ◼   ► - Yeah, it seems like the, one of the things that's happening here is, I think it depends

00:27:24 ◼   ► on every studio's deal, because like, Disney's not on in 4K HDR.

00:27:28 ◼   ► - Disney doesn't have it at all, but like if the movie exists and you bought it somewhere

00:27:31 ◼   ► else.

00:27:32 ◼   ► a resolution blind service.

00:27:37 ◼   ► So like I had some movies that I bought,

00:27:40 ◼   ► not in HD a long time ago, they're all in HD now.

00:27:44 ◼   ► Like that's another thing that the service seems to do

00:27:46 ◼   ► is just grant you like look.

00:27:48 ◼   ► - If you get the best version.

00:27:49 ◼   ► - You bought our movie, you get it in the best version

00:27:52 ◼   ► that's available, yeah.

00:27:54 ◼   ► - How did Disney convince Apple

00:27:59 ◼   ► and Google and Amazon to do this?

00:28:02 ◼   ► - That's a good question.

00:28:03 ◼   ► That's the part that makes me wonder because

00:28:05 ◼   ► - I can't work it out.

00:28:06 ◼   ► - This goes against their business model of erecting walls

00:28:09 ◼   ► that make it harder for people to switch.

00:28:11 ◼   ► - Like I can see how Disney convinced the other studios

00:28:15 ◼   ► because they probably had data that showed

00:28:17 ◼   ► this is good for you, it's been good for us.

00:28:19 ◼   ► - Yeah, and they saw, I mean,

00:28:20 ◼   ► Disney just built this thing, right?

00:28:22 ◼   ► I don't know if Disney built it

00:28:24 ◼   ► and already had talked to the other studios

00:28:26 ◼   ► and they're like, no, no, no, or, but whatever.

00:28:29 ◼   ► Disney built it, they showed that it works

00:28:31 ◼   ► and all the other studios are like, that's good.

00:28:34 ◼   ► And at some point somebody had a conversation

00:28:36 ◼   ► which was, you don't even need to,

00:28:38 ◼   ► don't try to reinvent this.

00:28:40 ◼   ► Let's just do it.

00:28:41 ◼   ► - Let's do it altogether.

00:28:42 ◼   ► - Let's just turn it into something for everyone.

00:28:43 ◼   ► - Yeah, and we'll take our branding off it.

00:28:45 ◼   ► We're gonna make this a consortium deal.

00:28:47 ◼   ► Don't worry about it.

00:28:48 ◼   ► - Yeah, you kick in some money for the development efforts

00:28:49 ◼   ► and we'll turn this into a consortium.

00:28:52 ◼   ► - I just assume that either Disney

00:28:54 ◼   ► or one of the other studios,

00:28:55 ◼   ► when going to these companies for deals,

00:28:57 ◼   ► they're just like, yeah, we're gonna do this,

00:28:58 ◼   ► but you're gonna have to do this now.

00:29:00 ◼   ► - Yeah, 'cause that's the thing is that Amazon and Apple

00:29:05 ◼   ► and Google all had to build in support for this.

00:29:08 ◼   ► - Which is, boggles my mind as well, right?

00:29:10 ◼   ► That it's not just like you have to give us,

00:29:13 ◼   ► you have to give people the movies for free, right?

00:29:15 ◼   ► So you're not getting any money out of it.

00:29:17 ◼   ► You also have to develop hooks

00:29:19 ◼   ► into your existing infrastructure,

00:29:21 ◼   ► which given everything I kind of know about iTunes,

00:29:24 ◼   ► was probably a very difficult thing to do.

00:29:27 ◼   ► - I could see the argument if you're Apple

00:29:30 ◼   ► that it's getting people into your ecosystem too because anything that happens at Google

00:29:40 ◼   ► or Amazon or Voodoo or Ultraviolet or whatever is just kind of swept into iTunes which makes

00:29:48 ◼   ► it super convenient on the Apple TV.

00:29:49 ◼   ► It makes Apple bodies boxes more appealing.

00:29:52 ◼   ► But the argument, the counter argument is all those iTunes movies that people have invested

00:29:56 ◼   ► in that's the only reason that they're still using an Apple TV.

00:29:59 ◼   ► they can get a fire stick. They can just get the fire stick and they're gone. So that's

00:30:04 ◼   ► the risk. It may just be that they're all like, don't forget that the studios have some

00:30:09 ◼   ► leverage here, right? Because they own the content. That's what I assume has happened.

00:30:13 ◼   ► So it may be that just part of the deal here is that the studios have all said, one of

00:30:19 ◼   ► the conditions of us being on your services is that you need to provide this feature that

00:30:25 ◼   ► allows our customers to have the freedom to move among services.

00:30:30 ◼   ► And it is interesting to me, considering Disney is the forerunner of this and Apple don't

00:30:35 ◼   ► get 4K Disney movies, but they've still been able to convince Apple to do this.

00:30:40 ◼   ► It's like it's a weird bargaining thing going on right now.

00:30:44 ◼   ► This may have been a condition of Disney a while ago or even of other studios even before

00:30:48 ◼   ► this got built.

00:30:49 ◼   ► It might have been in the contract.

00:30:51 ◼   ► Which is a provision.

00:30:52 ◼   ► For the 4K stuff.

00:30:53 ◼   ► thinking it's like a provision that says if we bring you a customer for our movie and

00:31:00 ◼   ► say give them this movie you have to do it essentially in the contract. If the contract

00:31:05 ◼   ► is read that way which is we get to arbitrarily designate people as owning a movie for based

00:31:14 ◼   ► on codes or whatever. Which might be like you know you'd buy like a DVD and it would

00:31:19 ◼   ► have an iTunes code in it. Yeah exactly. Something like that. That's like a redemption code but

00:31:22 ◼   ► So it's possible that legally it was in the contract. Yeah.

00:31:25 ◼   ► And the movie studios came to Apple and Amazon and Google and said,

00:31:31 ◼   ► here's how,

00:31:31 ◼   ► here's what we're building to enforce this part of the contract. So we,

00:31:36 ◼   ► you need to do this. So it may be that it wasn't even a negotiation.

00:31:39 ◼   ► It may have already been in the deal and that they decided this is how we want

00:31:43 ◼   ► to implement this. Now here's a date, you know, please. And, and for,

00:31:47 ◼   ► for Apple's part, it sounds like, you know, or any of these companies part,

00:31:52 ◼   ► They have to do some authentication and they have to accept some like movie IDs as being

00:31:59 ◼   ► granted. It's a development project though. Somebody at Apple had to spend time building

00:32:04 ◼   ► this stuff and that allows people to take content out of their ecosystem and likewise

00:32:08 ◼   ► for Amazon and Google.

00:32:09 ◼   ► And as you can imagine, US only.

00:32:12 ◼   ► For now. For now.

00:32:14 ◼   ► But those for now's are infinite.

00:32:16 ◼   ► Well the fact is yeah, we talk about contracts. It's a different contract.

00:32:21 ◼   ► in every single region and so that's a mess. It is a mess. But I think there's hope here

00:32:28 ◼   ► because what this suggests is that the big players in digital distribution and the studios

00:32:36 ◼   ► all feel that this is the way forward or mostly feel that this is the way forward. So it may

00:32:43 ◼   ► end up everywhere over time just because nobody wants to do it the old way.

00:32:49 ◼   ► the old way. This just becomes the way. Yeah, you get a movie, it's got a code inside, you

00:32:55 ◼   ► put that code in at Movies Anywhere and it pops up in your library. Right? You just buy

00:33:01 ◼   ► a movie on iTunes and it's on your Fire Stick. Yeah, I'm interested to see since Blu-rays

00:33:07 ◼   ► are physical objects, they're going to have to print inserts and put them in there, how

00:33:10 ◼   ► long that takes to turn over but I assume every Blu-ray is going to have a code in it

00:33:15 ◼   ► now for this purpose using Movies Anywhere and that'll be an interesting experience too.

00:33:22 ◼   ► But I'm much more inclined to buy a Blu-ray knowing that I get the full HD version on

00:33:28 ◼   ► all the services. The problem is that these guys are also working against themselves if

00:33:33 ◼   ► they really want to sell Blu-rays instead of digital copies because I almost always

00:33:37 ◼   ► buy the digital copy now because it comes out like a month before Blu-ray does. And

00:33:43 ◼   ► And I'm not as obsessive with the Blu-ray quality as John Syracuse is.

00:33:47 ◼   ► I don't want boxes in my house. I don't want more boxes.

00:33:49 ◼   ► Well, and I'm ripping all my Blu-rays and putting them in Plex, right? And so the goal

00:33:54 ◼   ► there is that those Blu-rays are going to end up in a box in the garage. They're not

00:33:58 ◼   ► going to be in my house anymore.

00:34:00 ◼   ► But then it's like, I don't want that. I just want the digital movies.

00:34:02 ◼   ► Yeah. Well, it's a lot less clutter if you do that, which is usually what wins the day

00:34:07 ◼   ► for me. It's like Wonder Woman, Spider-Man Homecoming. I just bought the iTunes version.

00:34:11 ◼   ► And now, I got them everywhere.

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00:35:16 ◼   ► make your next website. So last week it was announced that Steven Spielberg's Amazing

00:35:22 ◼   ► Stories is to be rebooted for Apple's video efforts project. I don't really know how

00:35:28 ◼   ► to reference that right now but Apple's video thing. Yeah I struggled in writing like

00:35:33 ◼   ► through 4,000 words about this last week to describe it this way but it's Apple's presumably

00:35:39 ◼   ► forthcoming video service or video offering. We're going to talk about it like it's happening

00:35:45 ◼   ► mostly because there's no way it isn't because they hired those two executives and according

00:35:51 ◼   ► to the Wall Street Journal gave them a billion dollar budget and now they're signing on Steven

00:35:57 ◼   ► Spielberg properties like these aren't going to be in we're going to get these just aren't

00:36:01 ◼   ► gonna be in Apple Music anymore. We'll get to that in a minute.

00:36:03 ◼   ► Yeah, Zach von Amberg and Jamie Ehrlich.

00:36:08 ◼   ► Mm-hmm. The Breaking Bad guys, right?

00:36:10 ◼   ► Are the guys, well they're Sony.

00:36:11 ◼   ► Sony.

00:36:12 ◼   ► Which did Breaking Bad, they're not writers, they're, you know,

00:36:16 ◼   ► they're development executives.

00:36:17 ◼   ► They bring the deals in.

00:36:18 ◼   ► And, yeah, exactly. And then they hired somebody from, I think,

00:36:21 ◼   ► WGN America, and they've got a whole...

00:36:25 ◼   ► A serious team.

00:36:25 ◼   ► And apparently in Culver City in LA, so they're like, that's the Apple

00:36:30 ◼   ► Powered

00:36:32 ◼   ► Service office that's got all these TV producers. They're in the industry. This is not

00:36:36 ◼   ► This is not carpool karaoke and Planet of the Apps and it's those are easy jokes to make

00:36:44 ◼   ► But that was like that was literally like Eddie Q and his and the and the beats people

00:36:49 ◼   ► Messing around with that way. That's what Eddie did right? That's what they did. That's what Jimmy Iovine did

00:36:56 ◼   ► Yeah, and then they were like, oh these suck

00:37:00 ◼   ► Yeah, and we need to be serious about this and we're gonna do this that was their test stuff

00:37:05 ◼   ► But we need to be serious. So so it was like version one. Yeah, so people who try to say

00:37:10 ◼   ► Oh, well, they got to do better than carpool karaoke

00:37:12 ◼   ► Yeah, this is all about that

00:37:14 ◼   ► And this is not gonna be like the next one will be amazing stories and then in six months

00:37:19 ◼   ► There will be another Apple video product. That's also not gonna happen

00:37:23 ◼   ► giving these guys that budget is a

00:37:28 ◼   ► Giving these guys that budget is a sign that they're they're gonna make lots of deals lots of deals

00:37:34 ◼   ► So let's talk about this one

00:37:36 ◼   ► What is amazing stories because it's this is a reboot of an existing property right what what is amazing stories

00:37:44 ◼   ► I've never heard of it amazing stories is

00:37:46 ◼   ► an anthology series from the 80s

00:37:50 ◼   ► based on

00:37:53 ◼   ► Basically a the name of a science fiction magazine from the 50s that's still being published

00:37:58 ◼   ► So it was kind of like the Twilight Zone except

00:38:02 ◼   ► Lighter and not as good

00:38:07 ◼   ► I would say there are a lot of people who have who have very fond

00:38:10 ◼   ► Memories of amazing stories my understanding is that those are the people who were sort of 10 years old when it premiered

00:38:15 ◼   ► Yeah, I was 15. I was not impressed

00:38:17 ◼   ► But some people liked it, but the idea is it's an anthology series

00:38:21 ◼   ► So I think Black Mirror except not as dark as Black Mirror because there's nothing as dark as Black Mirror

00:38:26 ◼   ► It's the black, but it's it's a little black so every yeah, so every episode is going to be

00:38:31 ◼   ► different a different story okay, and

00:38:34 ◼   ► It's like that um they say that Brian Fuller is gonna be the showrunner on it

00:38:38 ◼   ► Is it American Horror Story? Is that like that? No that's anthologized across seasons, so you have one story across a season

00:38:44 ◼   ► This is all right the the Iron Mankey show that's that's different things every episode. Yes

00:38:49 ◼   ► I'm Amazon Black Mirror. I think it's like the most

00:38:52 ◼   ► Relevance modern example although there's also a room something or other on HBO. That's like this showtime

00:39:00 ◼   ► I don't want scary things. I don't know so this is this is that this is

00:39:04 ◼   ► genre stories science fiction fantasy horror in

00:39:08 ◼   ► Basically short stories so one episode tells a story and then the week type deal

00:39:14 ◼   ► And that also means director and writer and stars of the week so that presumably they'll have

00:39:19 ◼   ► well-known actors Black Mirror has a lot of very well-known actors in it because they're

00:39:22 ◼   ► not committing to being on a series they're shooting a 60-minute movie and then they're

00:39:28 ◼   ► gone. So it's gonna be like that. That's what that that's what that show is. Brian

00:39:32 ◼   ► Fuller who created Star Trek Discovery who is the showrunner on American Gods. He did

00:39:37 ◼   ► Hannibal he's done a bunch of other stuff. He's apparently the showrunner which is

00:39:42 ◼   ► interesting because he's always sort of said his story for why he left Star Trek Discovery

00:39:49 ◼   ► was that he was too busy running American Gods which always was suspicious but now it's

00:39:53 ◼   ► like extra suspicious. Then again this is an anthology show so Brian Fuller is a good

00:39:59 ◼   ► name.

00:40:00 ◼   ► Steve: He was given a lot of money by Apple.

00:40:01 ◼   ► Chris: Brian Fuller was given a, he's a good name to attach to it creatively and since

00:40:06 ◼   ► it's an anthology series it may be a matter of like let's have Brian Fuller come in and

00:40:11 ◼   ► define what this show is and pick what the stories are. But he doesn't necessarily have

00:40:17 ◼   ► to, maybe he writes the first episode, but otherwise he's finding the writers and the

00:40:21 ◼   ► directors and the stories that they're going to do. And then we'll see. But it's five million

00:40:26 ◼   ► an episode for 10 episodes. That's, that feels like a big budget. Is that big? That's 50

00:40:31 ◼   ► million, but it's out of a billion. So, you know, 20 of those, I mean, you know, obviously

00:40:35 ◼   ► you know, I'd say that's a standard like big budget TV show thing. It's not, it's not cheap

00:40:41 ◼   ► cheap. But I think the Star Trek Discovery episodes cost like 7 million an episode, 8

00:40:46 ◼   ► million an episode. Game of Thrones is probably more like 10 million an episode.

00:40:50 ◼   ► A billion an episode.

00:40:51 ◼   ► So the dragons are really expensive is my understanding.

00:40:54 ◼   ► They eat a lot.

00:40:56 ◼   ► It's been reported as well that Apple are in lots of bidding wars. I mean there's lots

00:41:01 ◼   ► of rumbling about all the bidding wars that they're in.

00:41:03 ◼   ► So they got a billion dollars, right? So they are talking to people and they're bidding

00:41:08 ◼   ► on content. And so the best example, Ryan Murphy who did American Horror, does American

00:41:14 ◼   ► Horror Story has, and Glee and I mean a bunch of stuff.

00:41:19 ◼   ► What a tone shift.

00:41:21 ◼   ► Glee is the outlier for him, I gotta say. Most of his stuff is…

00:41:24 ◼   ► It's like a little dark and then the happiest, happiest ever.

00:41:26 ◼   ► Nip/Tuck was him too, which is a super weird show.

00:41:29 ◼   ► Wow, okay. What an interesting portfolio.

00:41:32 ◼   ► - Yeah, oh yeah, he's an interesting guy.

00:41:34 ◼   ► I don't love his stuff, but he is, he is,

00:41:36 ◼   ► he knows what he is doing and what he's good at.

00:41:41 ◼   ► So he's got a show called "Ratchet," which is based,

00:41:44 ◼   ► it's like, it's a little, you know how they did

00:41:46 ◼   ► the Psycho prequel, which is called "Bates Motel."

00:41:50 ◼   ► This is like evil nurse Ratchet from "One Flew Over

00:41:54 ◼   ► the Cuckoo's Nest," and it's like how she became

00:41:57 ◼   ► - Oh wow.

00:41:57 ◼   ► - Evil nurse Ratchet.

00:41:59 ◼   ► That's the show, bidding wars over it.

00:42:02 ◼   ► Apple was apparently strongly involved

00:42:05 ◼   ► in bidding for that show and didn't get it.

00:42:08 ◼   ► - They lost to Netflix.

00:42:09 ◼   ► - Apparently Netflix got it by packaging together

00:42:14 ◼   ► a super sweet deal for American Horror Story

00:42:17 ◼   ► to continue streaming on Netflix

00:42:19 ◼   ► and a two season commitment to Ratched.

00:42:24 ◼   ► So they put, basically they were like,

00:42:25 ◼   ► we're gonna give you all the money up front.

00:42:27 ◼   ► And Apple kind of was like, no, we're not gonna,

00:42:29 ◼   ► feels rich for Netflix maybe made a deal to push Apple out right like they're

00:42:33 ◼   ► trying to make sure that Apple isn't get that say and we should say Netflix is

00:42:37 ◼   ► content acquisition budget is about seven billion dollars next year so

00:42:41 ◼   ► Apple's only Apple's not leaping to that you can't I mean you can't go from zero

00:42:47 ◼   ► to seven you can't go to the millions that doesn't you can't come through one

00:42:51 ◼   ► billion is stage one of this but the point is they're playing in this game

00:42:54 ◼   ► and they've got money to spend which is why the Spielberg deal is interesting

00:42:58 ◼   ► So on the podcast I do with Tim Goodman on the Uncomfortable TV Talk Machine, we've been

00:43:03 ◼   ► talking about this a while. And in fact, for a couple of weeks we've been saying, "Wait

00:43:07 ◼   ► for it. There will be a big name attached to Apple. They will make a splash." And this

00:43:14 ◼   ► is it, I guess I would say.

00:43:16 ◼   ► Steven Spielberg's a pretty big splash.

00:43:18 ◼   ► But this is the first in a series of deals. Like, there will be another one in a few weeks.

00:43:25 ◼   ► There will be another one after that. They will make with a billion dollars, they could

00:43:28 ◼   ► buy 20 shows. They're not going to do that. They'll probably buy 10 shows and like HBO

00:43:33 ◼   ► has got probably 15 shows going over the course of a year. I think Apple wants to get to maybe

00:43:39 ◼   ► that level. Probably won't get the right off. They'll probably fund some original movies

00:43:44 ◼   ► too. They'll buy some movies. We'll see in the next, I mean I feel like I can tell you

00:43:48 ◼   ► what is going to happen in the next six months. They're going to make a deal with an actor

00:43:51 ◼   ► that you've heard of. They're going to make a deal with the creator of a show that you

00:43:55 ◼   ► It's a Boardwalk Empire type deal, right? Let's find a big movie actor and put them

00:43:59 ◼   ► in a TV show.

00:44:01 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, and there was a rumor that they're talking to Vince Gilligan who did Breaking

00:44:04 ◼   ► Bad.

00:44:05 ◼   ► Jennifer Aniston apparently as well.

00:44:06 ◼   ► Yeah, well there's a show with Jennifer Aniston and somebody else that has been shopped around

00:44:10 ◼   ► that they've been talking about. Vince Gilligan and Bryan Cranston from Breaking Bad have

00:44:16 ◼   ► both apparently been like talking to them. Apple's also trying to talk to people and

00:44:20 ◼   ► these guys who… these guys have a relationship with the Breaking Bad guys, but they're

00:44:24 ◼   ► also talking to people who they like but they've never worked with before. So, Hollywood Reporter

00:44:30 ◼   ► did a good story about this. So, those are going to pay off. Some of those deals are

00:44:34 ◼   ► going to get made and people are going to be all of a sudden people are going to look

00:44:37 ◼   ► in like six months and they're going to be like, "Oh, Apple's already got five shows

00:44:41 ◼   ► in production." It's still going to take until like the end of next year before they show

00:44:44 ◼   ► up but that's going to happen and because they got a billion dollars to spend and they

00:44:50 ◼   ► will go to film festivals. That's going to happen. They're going to go to a film festival

00:44:53 ◼   ► and they're gonna buy some movies. And people are gonna go like, "Where are those going?"

00:44:57 ◼   ► And the answer is going to be, they're going wherever all this other stuff is going on

00:45:01 ◼   ► Apple's stuff. And they will buy some catalog stuff too. They'll buy streaming rights.

00:45:06 ◼   ► Do you think so?

00:45:07 ◼   ► Yeah, they'll, I feel like, there's a question about what this service is, but I feel like

00:45:14 ◼   ► if it's only these originals, it's gonna feel kinda skimpy. So I would imagine that they

00:45:19 ◼   ► will buy some films and they'll probably play it as, you know, these are some of the most

00:45:28 ◼   ► popular movies on iTunes and now you can stream them for free with your subscription.

00:45:33 ◼   ► Do you think just movies? Do you think they're trying to do TV?

00:45:37 ◼   ► Maybe.

00:45:38 ◼   ► Why, like, you wrote a great piece which came out from like a long Twitter exchange which

00:45:44 ◼   ► I was unfortunately swept off into that you had over the weekend and brought about a lot

00:45:49 ◼   ► stuff and there's one thing you mentioned in here it's like why not just buy Hulu?

00:45:53 ◼   ► Well so Tim Goodman says that he thinks that's what they should do.

00:45:59 ◼   ► Hulu is owned by three TV networks and a cable company.

00:46:05 ◼   ► The TV networks it's a real question whether they want Hulu, they're almost like frenemies

00:46:11 ◼   ► to Hulu like they all probably want to do their own streaming services like ABC Disney

00:46:16 ◼   ► owns part of Hulu. But they're going to launch their own streaming services. So why are they

00:46:22 ◼   ► in Hulu? The idea was Hulu was a thing that networks could do to claim that they were

00:46:28 ◼   ► doing something in streaming video when they weren't.

00:46:30 ◼   ► It was an as well thing. Like we're also here as well.

00:46:33 ◼   ► We also were present, right? It was a tough thing for them to do. They've always had this.

00:46:38 ◼   ► So what Tim has suggested is if Apple buys Hulu, they get Hulu's original content, they

00:46:44 ◼   ► They get Hulu's streaming deals, at least for a while,

00:46:47 ◼   ► 'cause those are all renegotiable.

00:46:49 ◼   ► They get Hulu's infrastructure.

00:46:51 ◼   ► If you think about Beats Music,

00:46:53 ◼   ► Apple Music is built on the back of Beats Music,

00:46:55 ◼   ► 'cause it's already built.

00:46:56 ◼   ► - That's the example to push.

00:46:58 ◼   ► You'd be like, "Oh, why would they do that?"

00:47:00 ◼   ► Well, they did it already, right?

00:47:01 ◼   ► Apple wanted to launch a streaming music service,

00:47:04 ◼   ► so they bought one, and then changed it into their own.

00:47:07 ◼   ► - And Hulu actually has a live TV service, too,

00:47:09 ◼   ► that could be integrated directly into Apple TV.

00:47:11 ◼   ► Because the real key is like, okay so let's just say this thing costs $10 a month. There

00:47:17 ◼   ► has to be stuff there. You can't start charging $10 a month when you have just one show, right?

00:47:23 ◼   ► Because CBS All Access is charging $5 a month for essentially Star Trek Discovery. Although

00:47:28 ◼   ► they've got, even they have their CBS back catalog.

00:47:31 ◼   ► The stuff.

00:47:32 ◼   ► That's why I think they have to have catalog stuff. So even if they don't buy Hulu, which

00:47:36 ◼   ► would cost them like $25 billion. It would be a very expensive purchase, but Apple might

00:47:42 ◼   ► be actually a better owner for Hulu than the networks and cable companies that own it now.

00:47:48 ◼   ► Counter argument to Hulu, Apple buying Hulu is if they bought Hulu, Hulu's got its own

00:47:51 ◼   ► programming executives and their own original content. They wouldn't necessarily have needed

00:47:55 ◼   ► to hire these guys, but it doesn't preclude them from still buying Hulu.

00:48:00 ◼   ► When I think about buying, they're really buying it for technology if they want to use

00:48:05 ◼   ► it but they're buying out the contracts that's that's the value is yeah he's

00:48:09 ◼   ► buying and they would they would own the Handmaid's Tale which won the Emmy for

00:48:13 ◼   ► Best Drama they would just own it like they want Apple won awards so bad oh oh

00:48:18 ◼   ► sure well that's definitely gonna be part of the part of the story right is

00:48:20 ◼   ► that the Apple wants to is gonna want to win an Emmy Award for something so good

00:48:24 ◼   ► for Amazon yeah it's done really well for Hulu yeah Hulu is on the map now

00:48:27 ◼   ► because of the Handmaid's Tale in a way that they weren't like I think like

00:48:30 ◼   ► transparent and stuff like the amount of awards transparent one it's like it it's

00:48:34 ◼   ► It's legit.

00:48:35 ◼   ► And what's that thing?

00:48:36 ◼   ► Yeah, man, the high castle did that too.

00:48:37 ◼   ► Is that the quote from Bezos?

00:48:38 ◼   ► "Every time we win an Emmy, we sell more shoes" or something like that?

00:48:42 ◼   ► Like it's, you know, I love that quote.

00:48:44 ◼   ► It makes total sense, but like it's funny.

00:48:46 ◼   ► That's the way he thinks too.

00:48:48 ◼   ► So if they don't buy Hulu though, I do think that they need something.

00:48:50 ◼   ► So maybe it's old TV shows.

00:48:53 ◼   ► Old TV shows seems like a weirder fit for them than old movies.

00:48:59 ◼   ► But yeah.

00:49:00 ◼   ► You throw The Office and Parks and Rec and 30 Rock, you know.

00:49:01 ◼   ► They can also buy a lesser streaming service and throw those or a few and throw them all

00:49:07 ◼   ► together so like exists like like acorn is a good example acorn. Well you wouldn't because

00:49:13 ◼   ► you get it in Britain. It's called television. Acorn is a a primarily British TV streaming

00:49:20 ◼   ► service that's got some European TV as well, but it's primarily like British current and

00:49:26 ◼   ► classic British TV and that it's a niche streamer and they could buy some little streamers and

00:49:34 ◼   ► put them together, make some deals for some movies and call it a day and have a better

00:49:40 ◼   ► package of stuff to show. But I do, I agree, if they do ten original series, they're not

00:49:46 ◼   ► going to roll them out at once, right? Because then they'll run for ten weeks and then they'll

00:49:50 ◼   ► be done and then what? Then there's nothing. The crickets are dripping on the surface.

00:49:54 ◼   ► get no push on any of them when there's too many.

00:49:56 ◼   ► So think about HBO's originals, right? HBO's got two or three originals on, maybe four

00:50:01 ◼   ► at a time, and they are staggered across time. That's kind of the level they need to offer.

00:50:06 ◼   ► It would, if that was all, would it be enough? Maybe, but I feel like there's, you know,

00:50:10 ◼   ► I don't want to overstate this, but I think it's important for them to have some catalog

00:50:14 ◼   ► stuff too. And the movies make sense to me from a, like a PR perspective of like, also

00:50:18 ◼   ► we've got these, this great selection of movies that's favorites from the iTunes catalog that

00:50:22 ◼   ► you can watch for free. That's how you spin it, but in reality it's like we made some

00:50:26 ◼   ► content deals for some old movies just like HBO does. Because HBO's got, you know, some

00:50:31 ◼   ► recent releases and then they've got a catalog of old, weird old stuff. Like I watched Batman

00:50:36 ◼   ► Forever on HBO because we were doing it for the incomparable and I went to Fan TV, which

00:50:44 ◼   ► is like a streaming catalog, and they're like, "Oh, it's on HBO Go." I'm like, "Great." And

00:50:48 ◼   ► terrible but it was there so I could watch that so free do you think do you

00:50:53 ◼   ► think this is a separate service this is gonna be Apple music right big question

00:50:57 ◼   ► because it really feels like you put in a billion dollars into this don't call

00:51:00 ◼   ► it music when it's not music well if they if they rolled into Apple music

00:51:04 ◼   ► they'd have to change the name I think that would be bad for everything if I

00:51:08 ◼   ► had to pick I would pick if I had a guess about what's gonna happen I'd say

00:51:12 ◼   ► it's a separate service because music consumers and video consumers are

00:51:16 ◼   ► different. Apple wants more money from consumers. Maybe they offer a bundle or something. But

00:51:21 ◼   ► it's like it's a separate service. Amazon you get video when you get Prime. You still

00:51:25 ◼   ► have to pay extra if you want the full music library. They still have that as a separate

00:51:28 ◼   ► service. Google is talking about rolling Play into YouTube Red. Google Play All Music, All

00:51:37 ◼   ► Access Music.

00:51:38 ◼   ► Geoff - Now they're like saying if you get YouTube Music is what they're really pushing

00:51:43 ◼   ► now.

00:51:44 ◼   ► Well, the Google Play Music is going to get rolled in there too. But it's like $15 a month.

00:51:51 ◼   ► It's not a $9, $7 a month video service at that point. So, my gut feeling is it will

00:51:56 ◼   ► be a, we'll say $10 a month, maybe it's $7 a month or $5 a month with a 90-day trial.

00:52:03 ◼   ► So when you get an Apple TV, you get three months of it for free and all of that is there.

00:52:08 ◼   ► They'll do that and then maybe there's a bundle where you can get the package deal for both

00:52:14 ◼   ► Apple Music and Apple whatever.

00:52:16 ◼   ► Yeah, they already used a good name. So, Apple TV is taken.

00:52:21 ◼   ► I think Apple TV is a good name for it anyway. I think that Apple, why not just, the TV app

00:52:27 ◼   ► is already there, right?

00:52:28 ◼   ► Yeah, it just becomes Apple TV Box and the Apple TV service.

00:52:31 ◼   ► And there's an argument about like, well what about movies? Movies aren't TV. It's

00:52:34 ◼   ► like Apple has, with the TV app, Apple has already said that they consider any video

00:52:39 ◼   ► that you watch on a device that you own TV.

00:52:41 ◼   ► But you're watching it on even the movies you watch them on the TV.

00:52:44 ◼   ► Yeah, right. Or on your iPad but there's a TV app on your iPad so you're either watching

00:52:48 ◼   ► it on your TV via an Apple TV or you're watching it on your iPad or iPhone via the TV app.

00:52:53 ◼   ► It's all TV. So I think the Apple TV as a product you know conflating it with Apple

00:53:00 ◼   ► TV as a service maybe that's I don't know maybe that's been the plan all along but I

00:53:04 ◼   ► feel like…

00:53:05 ◼   ► It's a way to help sell Apple TV.

00:53:06 ◼   ► But I feel like that's the idea and then and then it's only available on the Apple

00:53:10 ◼   ► TV as a streamer box. And so if you want Apple TV, you get an Apple TV and then you get Apple

00:53:16 ◼   ► TV.

00:53:17 ◼   ► Is that a problem? Because like if I want Netflix shows, if I want Amazon shows, I can

00:53:21 ◼   ► get them mostly anywhere. If Apple creates their own TV shows, should they restrict it

00:53:28 ◼   ► on the Apple and iOS devices and TV devices?

00:53:32 ◼   ► Depends on what they want to do, right? I think Apple has this kind of vision of their

00:53:37 ◼   ► revenue as a combination of things. If this was a pure services revenue thing, they would

00:53:46 ◼   ► put it everywhere.

00:53:47 ◼   ► MATT: Make an app for Android.

00:53:48 ◼   ► JASON: But they want…

00:53:50 ◼   ► MATT; Apple Music's on Android.

00:53:52 ◼   ► JASON; Yeah, but is that the legacy of there being beats on Android?

00:53:56 ◼   ► MATT; I don't know. I don't think so.

00:53:58 ◼   ► JASON; They had an existing app…

00:53:59 ◼   ► MATT; They could have just shut that down.

00:54:00 ◼   ► JASON; An existing developer. They could have. It's a good counter argument and I thought

00:54:05 ◼   ► about that and it's possible. My gut feeling is the most likely scenario is Apple wants

00:54:11 ◼   ► this to be a revenue generator for services but their whole services strategy is to get

00:54:16 ◼   ► more revenue out of people who are their customers, not get random services revenue from people

00:54:23 ◼   ► who don't have Apple products. So that they, I think they want to view this as a way to

00:54:27 ◼   ► drive people to buy an Apple TV.

00:54:29 ◼   ► I think that would be a mistake.

00:54:33 ◼   ► I don't know. I could go either way. I mean...

00:54:35 ◼   ► Because the Apple TV is too expensive.

00:54:37 ◼   ► Does Apple... The question is, does Apple want this service,

00:54:41 ◼   ► does Apple want the Apple TV service to be everywhere and...

00:54:47 ◼   ► Or do they want it to be a lever to use to get people to buy an Apple device?

00:54:52 ◼   ► I think if the plan is, which I think it's obvious is more services revenue,

00:54:57 ◼   ► I think the best thing you do is make it available to everybody.

00:55:02 ◼   ► If your goal is we want to get more recurring revenue the easiest way to do that is to put it on Android as well

00:55:09 ◼   ► I think it's a good argument. You open it up to anyone with a device. Yeah, it's a good it's a good argument

00:55:14 ◼   ► I see they're good arguments on either side. Yeah, so I

00:55:17 ◼   ► Don't know what the right thing to do from a business standpoint is

00:55:21 ◼   ► I do know that if I put myself in the mind of Apple. Mm-hmm

00:55:28 ◼   ► Restricting it to Apple hardware seems most likely thing to do

00:55:32 ◼   ► Yeah

00:55:33 ◼   ► But the precedent of Apple music on Android is what puts a question mark over my head because Apple music is the same

00:55:39 ◼   ► strategy it's the strategy of we need recurring revenue so what I would also say is

00:55:44 ◼   ► This is a video service it wouldn't shock me if what they do is they put it on

00:55:51 ◼   ► Android and

00:55:54 ◼   ► They put it in iTunes on Mac and PC

00:55:58 ◼   ► but restricted to Apple TV as a streamer box

00:56:02 ◼   ► and say look if you want our TV service on your TV

00:56:05 ◼   ► - No that's what I think they would do

00:56:06 ◼   ► they put it on Android so you can watch it on the go

00:56:08 ◼   ► but if you want to watch it on the television

00:56:10 ◼   ► the only way to watch it

00:56:11 ◼   ► - Buy our box

00:56:12 ◼   ► - Yeah they won't be on

00:56:13 ◼   ► they won't make an Amazon Fire app

00:56:15 ◼   ► they won't make a Chromecast compatible thing

00:56:17 ◼   ► but I think they would make an Android app

00:56:19 ◼   ► to watch it on the go

00:56:20 ◼   ► - And people will say oh well this is ridiculous

00:56:22 ◼   ► I'm never gonna pay money for this

00:56:23 ◼   ► I'm never gonna buy an Apple TV for it

00:56:25 ◼   ► Okay, but when they announce that fill in the blank creator of your favorite show has

00:56:33 ◼   ► a new show with fill in the blank star that you love.

00:56:37 ◼   ► Breaking Bad 2.

00:56:38 ◼   ► Yeah, from the producers of Breaking Bad starring this amazing set cast that you love and then

00:56:44 ◼   ► there's this other show that also sounds really cool that they're doing and they're only on

00:56:48 ◼   ► Apple TV, then you start to go, "Well, Apple TV also does do Netflix and Amazon. It's a

00:56:55 ◼   ► little expensive but it's the only way I'm going to get to watch the show and will everybody

00:57:00 ◼   ► do that?" No, of course not. There's a lot of arguments in the tech world are, "Well,

00:57:04 ◼   ► everybody won't do it and therefore it will be a failure." And it's like, this is what

00:57:07 ◼   ► I hear about the Star Trek being on CBS All Access instead of Netflix in the US. And they're

00:57:12 ◼   ► like, "Oh, well, not as many people are going to watch it so it's a failure." It's like,

00:57:16 ◼   ► actually, they're going to make…

00:57:18 ◼   ► CBS will make more money this way.

00:57:19 ◼   ► They're building an entire streaming service on the back of this thing. It's probably

00:57:23 ◼   ► going to work for them. They probably don't care that it's going to be 10% of the viewers

00:57:28 ◼   ► that they would get if they put it on television because that's not the point. The point

00:57:32 ◼   ► is the money and the ongoing subscriber revenue and all of those things. So, that's what

00:57:39 ◼   ► I come back to with the Apple thing is, yeah, they're going to suppress viewership. The

00:57:42 ◼   ► The only people who care about the fact that that amazing new show is not going to be seen

00:57:46 ◼   ► potentially by as many people because it requires you to have Apple hardware are the people

00:57:51 ◼   ► who are creating the shows because they want to be seen.

00:57:55 ◼   ► And that's Tim Goodman wrote this piece of the Hollywood Reporter.

00:57:57 ◼   ► It's a really great piece.

00:57:58 ◼   ► Part of the deal here is money talks in Hollywood but they also care about the things they make,

00:58:05 ◼   ► the creators and there is some risk that if Apple's service is perceived as being super

00:58:15 ◼   ► limited then it will make deals go sour.

00:58:25 ◼   ► When do you think we're going to start to see some of this stuff happening?

00:58:31 ◼   ► Next fall.

00:58:32 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:58:33 ◼   ► - I can't--

00:58:34 ◼   ► - So you reckon a couple of shows

00:58:36 ◼   ► will be announced as in development?

00:58:37 ◼   ► Like was this--

00:58:38 ◼   ► - Well no, I think in the next six months,

00:58:42 ◼   ► Apple will make, will close like--

00:58:44 ◼   ► - Lots of deals.

00:58:45 ◼   ► - 10 deals.

00:58:46 ◼   ► - So was this 12, 15 deals? - 12, 15 deals.

00:58:48 ◼   ► - Officially announced or was it--

00:58:50 ◼   ► - Just reported.

00:58:51 ◼   ► Although it's been reported for a while

00:58:53 ◼   ► that they've been talking and talking to Apple,

00:58:56 ◼   ► but this is the Wall Street Journal reported this.

00:58:58 ◼   ► - But like, was this reported as a rumor

00:59:00 ◼   ► or was it like, this is an official release, this is done?

00:59:03 ◼   ► - Both, it was, it was, oh, it hasn't been official.

00:59:05 ◼   ► - Oh, okay, okay.

00:59:06 ◼   ► - It is reported by the Wall Street Journal

00:59:07 ◼   ► as having happened.

00:59:09 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:59:10 ◼   ► - Not as rumored, but as a fact that they made this deal.

00:59:13 ◼   ► - Right.

00:59:14 ◼   ► - Previously in the Hollywood Reporter,

00:59:15 ◼   ► it was rumored that they were talking.

00:59:17 ◼   ► But Wall Street Journal anyway says it happened,

00:59:19 ◼   ► deal is done.

00:59:21 ◼   ► So, but they haven't said anything about it.

00:59:23 ◼   ► And I think that's one of the challenges here

00:59:24 ◼   ► is that Apple probably doesn't want to say anything

00:59:26 ◼   ► about this until they have a service to launch.

00:59:29 ◼   ► So we may just get a lot of leaks from,

00:59:31 ◼   ► Wall Street Journal's a little surprising,

00:59:33 ◼   ► I think we're gonna get a lot of leaks from Variety

00:59:34 ◼   ► and the Hollywood Reporter and Deadline.

00:59:36 ◼   ► - I mean, Wall Street Journal would have been surprising,

00:59:39 ◼   ► but it's technology, it's technology related, right?

00:59:41 ◼   ► They can just do our sources, they're gonna get it.

00:59:42 ◼   ► - At some point-- - But it is better for Apple

00:59:44 ◼   ► to be in Variety and the Hollywood Reporter,

00:59:46 ◼   ► 'cause that's where the industry is and cares.

00:59:49 ◼   ► - So the deals are gonna happen over the next six months.

00:59:53 ◼   ► I would say you're gonna see rolling thunder from Apple.

00:59:56 ◼   ► Like it's gonna be-- - It's very serious.

00:59:58 ◼   ► It's going to be a lot of deals. People are going to, it's not going to be just amazing

01:00:02 ◼   ► stories, right? I feel like these guys are there to make deals and they've been given

01:00:07 ◼   ► money according to Wall Street Journal. They've been given a billion dollars to make deals.

01:00:10 ◼   ► They're going to make deals.

01:00:11 ◼   ► And I bet if they needed more money, they'll get it, right?

01:00:13 ◼   ► My guess is that Apple has an idea of like, we want to launch this in the fall. We want

01:00:16 ◼   ► to announce it in June at WWDC and we'll launch it in the fall or we'll announce it. They'll

01:00:22 ◼   ► probably announce it in June and we'll announce the launch date at the iPhone event in the

01:00:27 ◼   ► fall and it will launch sometime in the fall. And that sometime will probably be determined

01:00:31 ◼   ► by when the shows are ready, but that's about how long it takes. Like to go from making

01:00:38 ◼   ► a deal to doing, having a script, doing the casting, setting up the production, shooting

01:00:44 ◼   ► the show, editing the show, that takes time. It takes a lot of time to make a TV show.

01:00:49 ◼   ► So I think it's most likely that it'll be a new Apple TV service next fall.

01:00:57 ◼   ► What do you think about originals versus existing properties?

01:01:07 ◼   ► For Apple launching this now, does it make sense for them to try and create purely original

01:01:13 ◼   ► things or is it more sensible for them to do stuff like buying an old series and rebooting

01:01:17 ◼   ► it?

01:01:18 ◼   ► Well, this is a programming question and it's the same with Netflix. Netflix's strategy

01:01:23 ◼   ► is get something for everyone and Netflix releases so many shows because they're paying

01:01:28 ◼   ► seven times as much as Apple is going to pay.

01:01:29 ◼   ► I can't believe the amount of originals they have. There's so many that I've never heard

01:01:33 ◼   ► of.

01:01:34 ◼   ► Yeah. And it's so easy to miss them. And they will also do, they'll do Fuller House, right?

01:01:40 ◼   ► They'll do a broad sitcom that's not going to appeal necessarily to the same people to

01:01:45 ◼   ► whom Stranger Things appeals.

01:01:47 ◼   ► Or Knuckles or something.

01:01:48 ◼   ► Or yeah, exactly, or Bloodline or Master of None.

01:01:52 ◼   ► - Or BoJack.

01:01:53 ◼   ► - That would be a great game show is like,

01:01:56 ◼   ► we go back and forth trying to name

01:01:58 ◼   ► as many Netflix originals as possible,

01:02:00 ◼   ► but it might be too long, it goes on forever.

01:02:02 ◼   ► - But my favorite thing about Netflix

01:02:05 ◼   ► being outside of the US is all of the deals

01:02:07 ◼   ► that they do with US networks.

01:02:08 ◼   ► So we love Jane the Virgin.

01:02:10 ◼   ► - So, right.

01:02:11 ◼   ► - And now it is streaming weekly on Netflix.

01:02:15 ◼   ► - Which Netflix, and that's counter to Netflix's brand,

01:02:17 ◼   ► because Netflix's brand is about dropping a whole season and binging it, but Netflix

01:02:21 ◼   ► has made a lot of deals. They're doing that with Star Trek Discovery too. And it comes

01:02:26 ◼   ► out every week and there are a lot of US shows that instead of making a deal with a British

01:02:29 ◼   ► TV channel and then a French TV channel and a German TV channel, they just make a deal

01:02:34 ◼   ► with Netflix. Netflix buys it for the whole world and you get it the next day everywhere

01:02:38 ◼   ► in the world and it releases weekly. It's really good. So that's a nice sidebar which

01:02:44 ◼   ► is I expect that Apple will roll this service out if not initially then very rapidly internationally.

01:02:51 ◼   ► This is a thing that Apple has over Amazon and Google which is they really try to play

01:02:57 ◼   ► internationally with their entertainment services and like Amazon is bad at that. Amazon is

01:03:03 ◼   ► in like a handful of countries. So I imagine these deals that they're making, they're going

01:03:07 ◼   ► to make for the originals anyway. They're going to make for worldwide.

01:03:09 ◼   ► Adam: Yeah, because they own the content so they can put it wherever they want, right?

01:03:13 ◼   ► And they already have the distribution method.

01:03:15 ◼   ► Right.

01:03:16 ◼   ► But like if all the original stuff, it would be easy.

01:03:17 ◼   ► There's well, we're making the deals.

01:03:19 ◼   ► So like we'll just decide it's going to be worldwide.

01:03:21 ◼   ► So in terms of what the programming is, I don't think they don't have a $7 billion budget.

01:03:25 ◼   ► I don't think they're going to cast a wide net like Netflix.

01:03:28 ◼   ► I don't think they're going to make Fuller House.

01:03:30 ◼   ► HBO is what I keep coming back to.

01:03:32 ◼   ► You could say Showtime, you could say Stars.

01:03:34 ◼   ► But I feel like Apple, Apple feels like a premium cable to me, like in terms of their

01:03:41 ◼   ► brand.

01:03:42 ◼   ► Yeah, so far they've not done a good job of that, but it's all Apple Music though, right?

01:03:46 ◼   ► So that's a good thing. So they didn't launch the TV service with Carpool Karaoke.

01:03:51 ◼   ► So this is the question is in that meeting with

01:03:54 ◼   ► Eddie Q and maybe Tim Cook and

01:03:56 ◼   ► And Zach and Jamie the TV executives. What did they say about the brand of Apple?

01:04:02 ◼   ► Like what did they say? We want to be family-friendly. Did they say we want to be like HBO?

01:04:06 ◼   ► Did they say we want to be like Netflix? What did they say? My gut feeling is they want to be HBO

01:04:11 ◼   ► They want prestige they want to win awards, but they also want Game of Thrones

01:04:15 ◼   ► Everybody in the TV industry wants Game of Thrones Jeff Bezos wants the names next Game of Thrones

01:04:20 ◼   ► Netflix wants the next Game of Thrones everybody wants that so of course they said that but that's my gut feeling is like HBO is a

01:04:27 ◼   ► Good model because they have huge international hits. They've got prestige

01:04:31 ◼   ► They win awards they got comedies. They got dramas. They got some docu series and

01:04:39 ◼   ► They wrap all that up and that's their service that they sell to cable subscribers or over the top with HBO now

01:04:47 ◼   ► So that's my gut feeling is that is that maybe it'll be a little different

01:04:51 ◼   ► There's a question about like how how gritty will they get if they get like a really grim and gritty thing?

01:04:56 ◼   ► Will Apple be concerned about that being part of the Apple brand?

01:04:59 ◼   ► I think that gets overplayed where people talk about Apple and Disney and Pixar

01:05:02 ◼   ► I think I think it gets overstated sell the movies and TV show will be tea

01:05:06 ◼   ► - Yeah, there will be rated R, TVMA content.

01:05:11 ◼   ► - You can buy Game of Thrones on iTunes.

01:05:14 ◼   ► - Yeah, you can buy the underrated versions

01:05:17 ◼   ► of movies on iTunes.

01:05:18 ◼   ► - Didn't know that.

01:05:19 ◼   ► - So I don't think, but those aren't from Apple, right?

01:05:22 ◼   ► Those are from a studio in Apple's The Reseller.

01:05:24 ◼   ► This is like from Apple, Apple Presents.

01:05:27 ◼   ► But I still think, my gut feeling is,

01:05:29 ◼   ► it's still gonna be stuff like HBO.

01:05:30 ◼   ► - Because the thing is, if the plan is you want the awards,

01:05:34 ◼   ► well, sometimes people are gonna get naked.

01:05:36 ◼   ► 'Cause that's what happens in award-winning TV shows.

01:05:39 ◼   ► - It's true.

01:05:40 ◼   ► - You're just gonna have to deal with that.

01:05:41 ◼   ► Like it can't, these two things come together.

01:05:43 ◼   ► - They're not all gonna be like that.

01:05:44 ◼   ► But I think they will push the envelope with some stuff

01:05:46 ◼   ► and then they'll have some other stuff that is less so.

01:05:49 ◼   ► It wouldn't surprise me if they're not quite as aggressive

01:05:51 ◼   ► with the adult content as HBO,

01:05:54 ◼   ► that some of their stuff will be more adult

01:05:56 ◼   ► and some of the stuff will be more kind of like TV level.

01:06:01 ◼   ► - Yeah.

01:06:02 ◼   ► - They'll lose some TV and some cable TV

01:06:03 ◼   ► a balance. Because not everybody wants stuff like that.

01:06:08 ◼   ► But that's my gut feeling is that they'll do that and that the first slate will reflect

01:06:13 ◼   ► that. But we'll see. We'll see what the marching orders are that these execs have been given

01:06:17 ◼   ► because that's part of the deal. That's their magic stuff is they know people but they also

01:06:21 ◼   ► are trying to adhere to what the promise of the brand is. What are they trying to bring

01:06:28 ◼   ► to people because in the end Apple does want to build a service where people know it has

01:06:34 ◼   ► an identity like I know what I get when I subscribe to Apple TV like I know what I get

01:06:39 ◼   ► when I subscribe to HBO or Showtime.

01:06:42 ◼   ► I bet you're so happy about this because this is just like Jason's wheelhouse.

01:06:47 ◼   ► My world's colliding here.

01:06:48 ◼   ► TV and technology.

01:06:49 ◼   ► It is pretty awesome.

01:06:51 ◼   ► Well it's fun.

01:06:52 ◼   ► I mean I love talking about it.

01:06:55 ◼   ► I will say it does frustrate me when I hear the carpool karaoke jokes because they are

01:07:02 ◼   ► justified. Planet of the Apps jokes are the best too because that was not a show I liked.

01:07:09 ◼   ► They are justified to joke about that because Apple's flailing kind of attempts at TV have

01:07:14 ◼   ► been not great. But they hired these guys.

01:07:19 ◼   ► All of this was done before they hired these people.

01:07:21 ◼   ► Right.

01:07:21 ◼   ► Like it was done.

01:07:22 ◼   ► Yeah, they hired these guys in June. That was the day. That day in June. That was the

01:07:29 ◼   ► day that Apple got serious about this.

01:07:30 ◼   ► That was the time that Eddy got taken off the project, right?

01:07:32 ◼   ► Yeah, well I think they report to Eddy, but one of the good things about Eddy Cue, I think,

01:07:38 ◼   ► is that he knows to put the professionals in charge of their business. And this is like,

01:07:44 ◼   ► these guys are set up in Culver City and they're doing Apple TV. And that's what they're doing.

01:07:48 ◼   ► And that was the day that Apple got serious about video.

01:07:50 ◼   ► And all the jokes are totally earned, but if you're analyzing Apple making a deal with

01:07:56 ◼   ► Spielberg using the lens of Planet of the Apps...

01:07:59 ◼   ► You're looking at it wrong.

01:08:01 ◼   ► Yeah, that's malpractice.

01:08:02 ◼   ► You're looking at it wrong.

01:08:03 ◼   ► So the downside of this is I've been paying attention to this long enough that I see those

01:08:08 ◼   ► takes, I've seen those takes in the last week, and they infuriate me.

01:08:12 ◼   ► Because that's somebody who is either willfully misunderstanding or just completely doesn't

01:08:20 ◼   ► get it.

01:08:21 ◼   ► It's just dying to make the joke, right?

01:08:22 ◼   ► Yeah, the joke is more important.

01:08:24 ◼   ► And it's like, hey, we should all laugh at Planet of the Apps.

01:08:26 ◼   ► Do you know what?

01:08:27 ◼   ► I bet there were some really bad Netflix originals, like at the start.

01:08:30 ◼   ► I bet there were some terrible ones.

01:08:32 ◼   ► Sure.

01:08:33 ◼   ► But this is like even before, imagine like Netflix made its own TV series and put it

01:08:37 ◼   ► out on DVDs before they had streaming.

01:08:40 ◼   ► It's like the before time.

01:08:41 ◼   ► is a hard line between when they hired these guys and what came before because that was

01:08:47 ◼   ► the moment that Apple became a Hollywood player and those guys were hired in June but they

01:08:52 ◼   ► didn't start until late August. So now is when this is all going to happen. Now they've

01:08:57 ◼   ► taken, they started taking meetings and planning their attack. They've made one acquisition.

01:09:02 ◼   ► There will be many more. Apple has enough money to buy 20 original series at an average

01:09:07 ◼   ► of 50 million per. I don't think they'll do that and I think that the cost will be

01:09:12 ◼   ► up and down. I think they'll buy some documentaries and I think they'll buy some movies and

01:09:16 ◼   ► I think they'll do some other stuff but it'll be fun to see what they are. That's

01:09:20 ◼   ► the thing that fascinates me about this too is like what is an Apple video service? What

01:09:24 ◼   ► does it mean? Who is it for? What's it going to look like and what big names that are familiar

01:09:30 ◼   ► to us are going to be attached to the Apple brand for the first time? That's kind of

01:09:34 ◼   ► fun right like some matter you love who suddenly is going to be showing up on

01:09:37 ◼   ► stage at an Apple event somewhere to promote their TV show they're all gonna

01:09:40 ◼   ► be on stage oh yeah this is a life now Spielberg with King no bingo man with

01:09:48 ◼   ► art with our keynote draft we're gonna have to start we're gonna have a whole

01:09:50 ◼   ► section of our draft oh they're gonna Apple where they start a big TV shows

01:09:55 ◼   ► they're like oh we have a new show with an in Bryant Cranston comes on the stage

01:09:59 ◼   ► and he's vintage Apple jacket and he spends a few minutes talking about I

01:10:03 ◼   ► I think you stole that from Drake.

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01:11:06 ◼   ► Jason, it is time for #AskUpgrade.

01:11:09 ◼   ► So people send in their questions every week,

01:11:11 ◼   ► use the #AskUpgrade and they go into a lovely document

01:11:14 ◼   ► which we can pull out.

01:11:15 ◼   ► And today we will start with Andrew.

01:11:16 ◼   ► And Andrew asked, "Mac desktops have the option

01:11:19 ◼   ► "to get a magic mouse and a magic trackpad

01:11:21 ◼   ► "when you buy them.

01:11:22 ◼   ► "Is there a reason to do this?"

01:11:24 ◼   ► - Well, this should be for you, right?

01:11:26 ◼   ► Don't you have two input devices?

01:11:29 ◼   ► So I use a Wacom tablet and a trackpad.

01:11:33 ◼   ► So what I do, and I have and did use a mouse and trackpad,

01:11:37 ◼   ► and I've got some RSI problems.

01:11:37 ◼   ► - Yeah, I know other people who do the same thing

01:11:39 ◼   ► because of RSI.

01:11:40 ◼   ► They use certain movements they use on their off hand,

01:11:43 ◼   ► and then they have another hand for other movements.

01:11:45 ◼   ► - To find movement.

01:11:46 ◼   ► So what you get to do is, by having two input methods,

01:11:49 ◼   ► you get to give dominant hands a break,

01:11:53 ◼   ► which is really good for RSI,

01:11:54 ◼   ► so you're kind of moving around what you're doing.

01:11:57 ◼   ► So say for example, just in general web browsing,

01:12:00 ◼   ► and moving around the machine,

01:12:01 ◼   ► if I'm panning around, I use the trackpad.

01:12:04 ◼   ► If I'm trying to click something, I use my Wacom tablet.

01:12:07 ◼   ► When I'm editing, my trackpad is used

01:12:09 ◼   ► for navigating the timeline of logic, right?

01:12:12 ◼   ► So I zoom around, zoom in,

01:12:13 ◼   ► that's all with gestures with my right hand,

01:12:16 ◼   ► and then my left hand is doing all the important work

01:12:18 ◼   ► with Wacom tablet.

01:12:19 ◼   ► So the reason to do this is that it gives you a way

01:12:22 ◼   ► to kind of mix everything up, and if you get used to it,

01:12:25 ◼   ► it's a really efficient and kind of cool way.

01:12:28 ◼   ► It kind of feels a bit minority report like

01:12:30 ◼   ► to have your hands doing all this stuff at all times.

01:12:33 ◼   ► So yeah, that's probably why they offer it

01:12:35 ◼   ► because it is actually a nice pairing to have.

01:12:38 ◼   ► Josh asked, "Will we ever see mouse pointer support

01:12:41 ◼   ► on iOS or just the iPad?"

01:12:43 ◼   ► Do you think we're ever gonna get a mouse for iOS?

01:12:46 ◼   ► - Oh.

01:12:48 ◼   ► - I feel like it's getting closer all the time.

01:12:49 ◼   ► - I feel like it's getting closer

01:12:50 ◼   ► and that anything that we would assume Apple

01:12:53 ◼   ► would never do on the on iOS we need to throw away because they've done all sorts of things

01:12:58 ◼   ► that we assume they would never do. I you know I posted my friend Chip wrote a story

01:13:03 ◼   ► on six colors a couple years ago about Bluetooth pointing device support in iOS and I agree

01:13:11 ◼   ► with him and I I feel like ever since they did the text insertion cursor thing that I

01:13:18 ◼   ► I wish they would just support Bluetooth pointing devices.

01:13:21 ◼   ► Just like support them for that.

01:13:25 ◼   ► And maybe for some other gestures, right?

01:13:27 ◼   ► Like it doesn't have to be a big thing,

01:13:29 ◼   ► but I don't want a mouse,

01:13:32 ◼   ► or I don't want a cursor on screen all the time

01:13:36 ◼   ► that you click around on.

01:13:37 ◼   ► I don't think that's the right interface for iOS.

01:13:40 ◼   ► But I think that they could do more.

01:13:44 ◼   ► I think that there are cases

01:13:45 ◼   ► where a pointing device is useful.

01:13:47 ◼   ► Selecting text. Let me tell you as somebody who writes all the time

01:13:51 ◼   ► Selecting text that that that I beam cursor that they have where you put two fingers down on the iPad or your 3d touch on

01:13:59 ◼   ► The on the iPhone it's great

01:14:02 ◼   ► It frustrates me that I can't just have a trackpad

01:14:06 ◼   ► When I'm sitting on my iPad sitting at my at a table looking at my iPad

01:14:13 ◼   ► To do that like that would be great. Just the little text selection cursor. Yeah would be enough right? I don't need a

01:14:19 ◼   ► Whole windowing system. That's all I need. So I hope they do it. The other thing is

01:14:25 ◼   ► virtual like like

01:14:28 ◼   ► Consoles like screens and all of that some of those there you can buy

01:14:32 ◼   ► Citrix has a while ago

01:14:36 ◼   ► You have to buy that special mouse Citrix have it and then jump desktop and the Citrix X1 Citrix X1 maps

01:14:42 ◼   ► which I bought to try out and it works really great.

01:14:45 ◼   ► Like, I would love to be able to use a mouse with Google Sheets

01:14:48 ◼   ► because Google Sheets can get real complicated.

01:14:51 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:14:51 ◼   ► And if I could use a trackpad built into it,

01:14:54 ◼   ► like just a trackpad built into the smart keyboard,

01:14:57 ◼   ► I would be very happy with that.

01:14:59 ◼   ► Also as somebody who has, who uses the iPad in a stand with a keyboard all the time.

01:15:04 ◼   ► Yep.

01:15:04 ◼   ► And you do too.

01:15:05 ◼   ► Yep.

01:15:07 ◼   ► I'd really rather when I'm, when all I'm doing is like scrolling and swiping,

01:15:11 ◼   ► I would really love to be able to do that with while keeping my hands down.

01:15:15 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:15:17 ◼   ► I'll wait to score a webpage without scoring the screen.

01:15:19 ◼   ► And this is nice, right? Please don't tell me to buy a laptop. No, no,

01:15:22 ◼   ► don't do it. Don't, don't email Myke. Um, the, the, uh,

01:15:27 ◼   ► the fact is you should not have to buy a Citrix mouse, right?

01:15:33 ◼   ► Yeah. You should be able to use, again,

01:15:37 ◼   ► individual apps could support it.

01:15:39 ◼   ► It doesn't have to be that there's a big black arrow

01:15:41 ◼   ► on the screen all the time.

01:15:43 ◼   ► But like, yeah, if I'm in screens and I have a,

01:15:46 ◼   ► I shouldn't, like screens has a mode

01:15:48 ◼   ► where you use your iPhone as a track pad.

01:15:50 ◼   ► And that's cool, but you know what's better than an iPhone

01:15:53 ◼   ► as a track pad?

01:15:54 ◼   ► - Track pad. - A track pad.

01:15:56 ◼   ► - Funnily enough.

01:15:56 ◼   ► - So if I have to do that, there are certain circumstances

01:15:59 ◼   ► where I think it would be useful.

01:16:01 ◼   ► I think the fear is that you're opening Pandora's box

01:16:04 ◼   ► and turning it back into a Mac,

01:16:05 ◼   ► but that's not what we're saying.

01:16:07 ◼   ► Just like drag and drop and multitasking

01:16:10 ◼   ► and all of these other things

01:16:11 ◼   ► that they brought from the desktop,

01:16:13 ◼   ► don't turn it into a Mac.

01:16:14 ◼   ► It's a different take on it.

01:16:16 ◼   ► I don't think iOS is a platform

01:16:18 ◼   ► that can't take advantage of pointing devices

01:16:23 ◼   ► because we've already seen that in certain cases it can.

01:16:27 ◼   ► So why not just embrace that for the edge cases?

01:16:30 ◼   ► It's not gonna be a fundamental part of the product,

01:16:32 ◼   ► but for the edge cases, why not do that?

01:16:34 ◼   ► Why not let the, here's the crazy ones

01:16:37 ◼   ► who want to pair a trackpad, let's do it.

01:16:38 ◼   ► And I will say, one of my thought exercises

01:16:42 ◼   ► that I like to do is imagining a desktop iPad,

01:16:47 ◼   ► you know, imagining a 24 inch iPad.

01:16:49 ◼   ► Even if it's in a position where you can touch it

01:16:55 ◼   ► and all of that, you're probably gonna have

01:16:57 ◼   ► an external keyboard and a pointing device

01:17:00 ◼   ► would be really good in that scenario too.

01:17:01 ◼   ► - It might be a bit too big to be like

01:17:03 ◼   ► just pulling stuff around on the screen all the time.

01:17:06 ◼   ► - Yeah, but for gestures and flipping around and all that,

01:17:08 ◼   ► yeah, you may not wanna always be touching the screen.

01:17:10 ◼   ► - But like reaching the top right-hand corner of the screen,

01:17:12 ◼   ► you know, if it's 24 inches,

01:17:14 ◼   ► 'cause it's probably gonna be suspended

01:17:15 ◼   ► or like on the table or something.

01:17:17 ◼   ► - And again, not asking for a Mac solution here

01:17:19 ◼   ► where it just turns it into a Mac.

01:17:20 ◼   ► I'm saying maybe products like that,

01:17:23 ◼   ► and even an iPad that's sitting upright

01:17:25 ◼   ► with a external keyboard could be improved

01:17:29 ◼   ► by having the ability to add a pointing device.

01:17:32 ◼   ► So Josh, the answer to your question is,

01:17:35 ◼   ► I don't know if we're ever gonna see it,

01:17:37 ◼   ► but I hope we do.

01:17:38 ◼   ► I feel like the genie is out of the bottle

01:17:40 ◼   ► with the iBeam cursor for text selection.

01:17:43 ◼   ► Like if you're gonna allow us to move a cursor

01:17:45 ◼   ► on the screen, Apple,

01:17:47 ◼   ► let me have a device that lets me do it more easily.

01:17:50 ◼   ► - Adam says, you guys both often discuss

01:17:53 ◼   ► your frequent use of Dropbox and Google Docs.

01:17:57 ◼   ► Why not do both files and docs in Google Drive?

01:18:00 ◼   ► So one of the reasons for me is I forget that Google Drive is a storage solution

01:18:07 ◼   ► for anything other than Google documents and photos.

01:18:11 ◼   ► Which aren't really stored there.

01:18:13 ◼   ► No.

01:18:13 ◼   ► Right. It's just a link to the cloud.

01:18:14 ◼   ► So this is why. Because the documents don't really exist in Google Drive,

01:18:18 ◼   ► like the Google Docs stuff, I forget that I can put anything in it.

01:18:22 ◼   ► Right? Because it's just like, well, this is just the place where files that don't exist exist.

01:18:28 ◼   ► Yes, that's right.

01:18:29 ◼   ► And the people that I collaborate with, everybody uses Dropbox.

01:18:33 ◼   ► I'm not going to say to someone, "Hey, use Google Drive instead."

01:18:36 ◼   ► And apps integrate better with the Dropbox API. That's why.

01:18:40 ◼   ► So Google Drive is just where my docs live.

01:18:43 ◼   ► It's not my storage solution.

01:18:46 ◼   ► Yeah, I have not tried to do, like, shared folders and all of that.

01:18:50 ◼   ► You're right, everybody's got Dropbox.

01:18:53 ◼   ► It's the power of freemium too in a way that, like,

01:18:55 ◼   ► even though you can get Google Drive with free space too, it's like,

01:18:58 ◼   ► Everybody's got the Dropbox app installed everybody knows how to how to do that

01:19:02 ◼   ► and so it's sort of like I've already adopted it and

01:19:05 ◼   ► It and I think it's powerful. Also. It has the strength like so many apps do of being what Dropbox does

01:19:13 ◼   ► Whereas Google Drive is not what Google does it's a an adjunct and so I feel like Dropbox is always going to be hungrier at

01:19:22 ◼   ► Building features and reliability for Dropbox then Google is for Google Drive. They're very hungry with the design

01:19:29 ◼   ► Have you seen my concern is that Dropbox is losing focus? Yeah, and now they're saying well, we're a

01:19:35 ◼   ► We're really not a company for storage

01:19:37 ◼   ► We're a place to

01:19:38 ◼   ► Collaborate to collaborate and design and all that with Dropbox paper and all that's like no that's not what you are. Sorry

01:19:44 ◼   ► Adrian wants to know Jason you still using todoist I am

01:19:51 ◼   ► I went through a period I went through about a week where I forgot to open it

01:19:56 ◼   ► But it was a weird week it was a and I was traveling and it was weird

01:20:02 ◼   ► But yes, I am using it is I've got a bunch of monthly tasks in there for the six colors magazine

01:20:08 ◼   ► I've got a bunch of weekly tasks, especially for download having to

01:20:11 ◼   ► schedule

01:20:13 ◼   ► Download podcast guests and make sure that the download topic list is is up and running. How's that going Steven?

01:20:20 ◼   ► He's away doing it now. He's gone already

01:20:23 ◼   ► and I have

01:20:25 ◼   ► Podcast posting to do's in there now where I've got like free agents every other week

01:20:31 ◼   ► There's a post so it's it's still on my calendar, but it's also in my to-do list

01:20:36 ◼   ► My my complaints my issues with to-do lists are still

01:20:40 ◼   ► that I

01:20:43 ◼   ► Keep thinking of things based on that. I need to do them by a certain date, but they take more time and get frustrated

01:20:50 ◼   ► that I can't say like I have this I have to watch so like I have to watch these movies

01:20:57 ◼   ► for an incomparable episode recording on Friday. So I want a thing that says remember you have

01:21:02 ◼   ► to watch two movies by Friday. Todoist doesn't want to do that. Todoist wants me to either

01:21:08 ◼   ► put that on Friday in which case I'm not going to see it until it's too late or I have to

01:21:12 ◼   ► create it earlier which is not the real deadline in order to tell me I could do that and have

01:21:17 ◼   ► So you want like start dates. Yeah, yeah, this is, and we talked about this before,

01:21:21 ◼   ► it's like that's one of the challenges I've got with it is it really thinks of like todoist

01:21:25 ◼   ► as this is a relatively small thing you can check off on a certain day and that's not

01:21:32 ◼   ► quite what I want. I wanted to kind of hover over me and say remember this needs to be

01:21:36 ◼   ► due by Friday and it will take four hours. Due by Friday, D-U-E by Friday. It's totally

01:21:43 ◼   ► different. But yes I am. I am trying to integrate it. I am trying to find ways to, what's

01:21:49 ◼   ► happening now is that I have things that fall out of the Snell filing system which is my

01:21:52 ◼   ► brain and I'm like, "Oh yeah." And I think this is the sort of thing I should

01:21:58 ◼   ► put into Do-It. So we'll see how it goes. But I am sticking with it for now along, you

01:22:03 ◼   ► know, the calendar still is a thing that I use because it is how my brain works but Do-It

01:22:08 ◼   ► is helping out.

01:22:09 ◼   ► It's a compliment.

01:22:10 ◼   ► It's helping me out for now.

01:22:11 ◼   ► Dalton asked, "Why is the Chromecast usually left out when talking about TV Box competition?"

01:22:17 ◼   ► It's true, when we talk about TV Box competition, we just did it, we didn't mention Chromecast

01:22:21 ◼   ► at all.

01:22:22 ◼   ► Now the reason I don't is because it's not a TV Box.

01:22:25 ◼   ► It is not a box that has an interface.

01:22:29 ◼   ► It's like AirPlay.

01:22:30 ◼   ► It's just a way to stream stuff.

01:22:32 ◼   ► I think that's why I leave it out.

01:22:34 ◼   ► It doesn't feel like the same product to me as an Apple TV or Roku or Fire TV.

01:22:40 ◼   ► don't build apps for it. It's like does it do just the support for Chromecast already

01:22:45 ◼   ► exists in other places? If it does you can Chromecast to it, right? You can do the casting

01:22:50 ◼   ► thing and you can watch it on the TV. That's why I leave it out because it doesn't have

01:22:54 ◼   ► that same feeling of like is Google going to do deals for Chromecast? Like it doesn't

01:22:58 ◼   ► feel that way, you know? What do you think?

01:23:01 ◼   ► >> Yeah, you said it. I think that's the, okay, I'm going to be a little impolitic here,

01:23:10 ◼   ► but I feel like this is one of those examples where Google is run by people who don't understand

01:23:17 ◼   ► how people think. And I know there are a lot of tech nerds out there who love Chromecast.

01:23:23 ◼   ► Of course there are. It's a dongle that you attach to your TV and then control everything

01:23:28 ◼   ► from your phone. That's a tech nerdy kind of thing. I think most people, like there's

01:23:35 ◼   ► no there there. There's no home there. It really is. I, I'm a tech nerd. I do not want

01:23:41 ◼   ► to sit down in front of my television and then pop around on my phone looking for an

01:23:47 ◼   ► app to stick on the television and then find the button. I don't do that. I, this is why

01:23:53 ◼   ► I don't like to airplay. Airplay is a last resort. I will airplay if I have to. If there's

01:23:57 ◼   ► an app that lets me airplay that isn't available on the Apple TV, I will do it. But I hate

01:24:02 ◼   ► it. I hate it because now I've got a device that is streaming over my network. Is it going

01:24:06 ◼   ► to be reliable? How's that going to work? I know that Chromecast will pick up the URL

01:24:10 ◼   ► and will go out and find it itself so it's not like that but it's like suddenly my phone

01:24:15 ◼   ► is a remote. And if it works for you that's great but it's not the same as these other

01:24:21 ◼   ► products and that's why. That's right or wrong. That's why.

01:24:25 ◼   ► it doesn't feel like they're doing deals. They just like open this up as a way to

01:24:29 ◼   ► say to developers "oh you can integrate with this?" So it's like a different

01:24:33 ◼   ► strategy and I think that's why we don't bring it up because the Apple TV and the

01:24:37 ◼   ► Fire TV, they are backed by companies that are trying to make original content.

01:24:42 ◼   ► Right? Like that's what makes that interesting is that it's more than just

01:24:47 ◼   ► the thing you plug into the television and I think that's why Google kind of

01:24:51 ◼   ► gets left out of this in places. Yeah, their thing is, um, turn your,

01:24:55 ◼   ► your device is the best remote, they say. And I don't agree.

01:25:00 ◼   ► Promotes are really nice. And in general, and there's, there's no,

01:25:05 ◼   ► they're there. I just, I believe that

01:25:07 ◼   ► I mean, Google Chrome cast, as far as I know, and forgive me,

01:25:13 ◼   ► I'm sure there are exceptions here, but to me,

01:25:15 ◼   ► Chromecast is a wireless video

01:25:19 ◼   ► adapter. Like it's a plug. It's not a place for stuff like the Fire TV and Roku and the

01:25:29 ◼   ► Apple TV. It's, and it, if it works for you, again, I'm not saying you're a bad person

01:25:35 ◼   ► if you like Chromecast. Chromecast has a lot of things going for it, but it's not, one

01:25:39 ◼   ► of these things is not like the other and, and, and that's why, and I, it, it, to me,

01:25:46 ◼   ► It's like one of those things that I point out and I say Google like you're so weird.

01:25:52 ◼   ► Like why is this your strategy that everything is an app, everything is an Android app on

01:25:59 ◼   ► your phone and the Chromecast, well we don't need an interface on it.

01:26:03 ◼   ► We don't need a remote.

01:26:04 ◼   ► Your device is the best remote.

01:26:05 ◼   ► I'm like yeah, I don't agree with that.

01:26:07 ◼   ► Just like I don't agree when Vizio put out those TVs that didn't have remotes because

01:26:13 ◼   ► you're supposed to use your phone.

01:26:14 ◼   ► It's like no, uh-uh, no.

01:26:16 ◼   ► - And lastly today, Simon asked,

01:26:19 ◼   ► "At $199, is the Sonos One the HomePod Killer?"

01:26:23 ◼   ► So the Sonos One was announced a couple weeks ago.

01:26:26 ◼   ► It is the Sonos Play One, which is their little speaker,

01:26:29 ◼   ► but it has Amazon Echo support.

01:26:33 ◼   ► It's going to get Google Home support,

01:26:35 ◼   ► and AirPlay Two, it's $199.

01:26:39 ◼   ► So that's $200 cheaper than the HomePod.

01:26:43 ◼   ► I don't like the phrase "the killer" because it never worked.

01:26:47 ◼   ► Anything that's called the something killer never killed anything?

01:26:49 ◼   ► Yes.

01:26:50 ◼   ► But is the Sonos One serious competition for the HomePod?

01:26:55 ◼   ► Ah, yes, but...

01:27:00 ◼   ► Are people gonna buy it?

01:27:01 ◼   ► My guess, because I've got to play one, which is basically the same,

01:27:04 ◼   ► other than the voice support.

01:27:07 ◼   ► And it sounds good.

01:27:09 ◼   ► The HomePod sounds better.

01:27:13 ◼   ► HomePod sounds better than the Play 3 let alone the Play 1.

01:27:16 ◼   ► The HomePod has Siri integration which is problematic in many ways, but it also is going to let you

01:27:23 ◼   ► voice control Apple music.

01:27:25 ◼   ► So if you're an Apple music subscriber,

01:27:28 ◼   ► you can't do that on the Play 1, whatever it's called, the Sonos One, right? Because the

01:27:33 ◼   ► Amazon Echo stuff, I almost said her name, the Amazon Echo stuff

01:27:37 ◼   ► will let you voice control Amazon's music stuff.

01:27:41 ◼   ► Yeah, and maybe I think Spotify down the road but not we were talking about some connect

01:27:46 ◼   ► It's so confusing is there is a potential that the airplay to integration will let you control Apple music

01:27:52 ◼   ► Via Siri it's but then but then it's from via Siri from your your phone not on the device and it's streaming to the device

01:28:00 ◼   ► yeah, so

01:28:02 ◼   ► so I think I think

01:28:04 ◼   ► My answer here is no because I think the home pod exists in this weird space where?

01:28:09 ◼   ► People are gonna buy it because they love Apple and they've got and they are using Apple music and that they think it's gonna be

01:28:15 ◼   ► A good product and the Sonos one is weirdly complicated by what assistants are on it

01:28:21 ◼   ► It does sound good

01:28:22 ◼   ► I think I guess what I'd say is the real challenge for the home pod is that it has it is expensive and

01:28:28 ◼   ► There are speakers that are cheaper that have similar features

01:28:32 ◼   ► That sound pretty good. Yeah, I mean I I

01:28:36 ◼   ► I still, I think the jury is out on whether the HomePod is even going to be worth it for anybody.

01:28:42 ◼   ► Oh, I agree. I agree. It's a weird product.

01:28:44 ◼   ► It has a real risk to be the iPod Hi-Fi 2, in my opinion. It's a very expensive,

01:28:50 ◼   ► very limited use case device. I think there's a real scenario where next fall there's an all-new

01:28:56 ◼   ► HomePod. Which is $199. That's smaller and cheaper and not, yeah, not what this current HomePod is.

01:29:05 ◼   ► we'll see but I think I think that's the challenge I don't think it's so does

01:29:08 ◼   ► one's entrance is love the jig is up for the home pod because I think it's it's

01:29:13 ◼   ► just another entrant in this in this field that talk that exposes the issues

01:29:19 ◼   ► with the home pod if you like to find a show this week or it really that a fan

01:29:24 ◼   ► such upgrade such 163 thank you to everybody that some questions as always

01:29:28 ◼   ► you can submit snow talk questions with a hashtag snow talk for the beginning of

01:29:31 ◼   ► the show and #AskUpgradeQuestions for the end of the show. If you want to find Jason online,

01:29:37 ◼   ► he's at SixColors.com, TheIncomparable.com, he hosts a bunch of shows over at relay.fm

01:29:42 ◼   ► as well and he's @JSnell on Twitter, I am @imike. We'll be back next week as normal,

01:29:48 ◼   ► we're at the Release Notes Conference, if you are at Release Notes, we're going to be

01:29:51 ◼   ► there for the next few days, so please come say hi, we'd love to speak to you and, I don't

01:29:56 ◼   ► know, talk about pineapple or something. Sure, probably. But we'll be back next time, until

01:30:01 ◼   ► Until then, all thanks to our sponsors this week,

01:30:04 ◼   ► the great folk over at Balance, Squarespace, and Macworld.

01:30:07 ◼   ► We'll be back next week.

01:30:08 ◼   ► Until then, say goodbye, Jason Snow.

01:30:10 ◼   ► Goodbye, everybody.

01:30:11 ◼   ► High five!

01:30:12 ◼   ► Woo!

01:30:13 ◼   ► [BLANK_AUDIO]