146: It's About the Journey


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:08   From Relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode 146. Today's show is brought to you by Mack Weldon,

00:00:15   Encapsula, and FreshBooks. My name is Myke Hurley. I am joined by the man behind sixcolors.com,

00:00:22   Jason Snell.

00:00:23   I'm peeking out from behindsixcolors.com right now. Hello, Myke. How are you?

00:00:27   I'm very well, Jason Snell. How are you?

00:00:30   Good, very good. Busy, been busy. Lots going on.

00:00:35   I've been doing lots of podcasting

00:00:38   this last week, what with Apple News and also

00:00:42   Leo Laporte went on vacation and so I've been a...

00:00:45   I'm gonna end up filling in four times for him over the course of eight days.

00:00:49   It's a little exhausting. I spent three hours straight just talking

00:00:54   yesterday. It was a lot. But I'm here. I'm ready.

00:00:57   Maybe that's more Jason than people can handle. Who knows?

00:01:00   Well, I take some solace in the fact that these are sort of like non-Jason channels.

00:01:05   They're not used to me. So that if somebody is listening to all of those channels and

00:01:09   all of my usual channels, I apologize for the excess of me.

00:01:13   The Snellathon that you're a...

00:01:14   A little too much. The Snellzone expanded a little too far there. Yeah.

00:01:18   But Jason, nobody cares about this.

00:01:21   No.

00:01:22   #SnailTalk question this week and it comes from Matthew. Matthew wants to know, "Do you

00:01:26   listen to the radio?"

00:01:28   Well, Matthew, the short version is... not really. The slightly longer version is...

00:01:36   We have... I listen sometimes in the car, I listen to the radio. We have... I'm not

00:01:41   a big fan of the radio in general, and I haven't been since I was a teenager, because I like

00:01:46   to hear the songs that I like, and if I hear a song I don't like, I don't like the fact

00:01:49   that I can't skip it. I also don't like chatter, not only the commercials on radio, which I

00:01:55   find like really in your face and annoying, but the chatter where a DJ will tell you about

00:02:01   whatever thing they're interested in, that it's like not why I listen to the radio, unless

00:02:06   I'm listening to a baseball game or something, I'm probably there to listen to the music

00:02:09   on the radio. We have satellite radio in our cars, which has a bunch of specialty stations

00:02:15   that are actually, a lot of them are pretty good, but even there, they, and they don't

00:02:18   have commercials, but even though they have DJs who occasionally come on and say, "Let

00:02:22   me tell you this news about where some band is touring," and I'm like, "Nope, turn the

00:02:26   channel." I was thinking about this yesterday because I was listening to one of my go-to

00:02:32   playlists now on Apple Music, which is the A-list for... They have these A-list playlists,

00:02:38   I've talked about them before, where some editor at Apple Music is curating a list of

00:02:42   sort of 50 recent songs that are really good in a particular genre, and I listen to the

00:02:46   alternative A-list playlist a lot and then pull songs out of there for my own playlist

00:02:51   of like, "I really like that song, I'm going to put it in my favorites too." And I was

00:02:56   thinking about how that is the ultimate, for me, expression of the radio because nobody

00:03:01   talks, it's just the songs, and if I don't like a song, I skip it and I go on to the

00:03:07   next one. I love it. And I can control which ones I listen to and I can go back because

00:03:12   Because in the end, it's just the playlist that somebody selected.

00:03:16   There's still a music mind somewhere, listening to all these songs and picking ones that they

00:03:21   think are good and putting them in rotation, just like you would on a radio station playlist.

00:03:24   But instead, it's just an iTunes playlist that I can play.

00:03:27   And that's pretty great, and I've discovered a lot of great music for that.

00:03:29   So it's actually a little bit like I'm back into listening to the radio again in a way

00:03:35   where I can discover music that's not just music I've already listened to and I'm going

00:03:40   to listen to again, which I did for a long time, or with a little more control over it

00:03:46   than something like Pandora.

00:03:48   Yeah, so you can find those A-lists, you can just search for them, A-lists, but they're

00:03:52   always floating around in the Discover section or whatever it's called in Apple Music.

00:03:57   And they're really good, at least the ones that are in genres that I like. They're really

00:04:01   well done, and I was just seeing somebody, I want to say it was Cable Sasser, who was

00:04:05   tweeting about how it doesn't get promoted in the US but like he's a big Japanese pop

00:04:10   fan and there's a J-pop A-list.

00:04:12   Yeah, a J-pop and a K-pop I think he was talking about.

00:04:15   Yeah, yeah, right. And not all the songs are available for people in the US market but

00:04:19   they've got, you know, genres in the US and elsewhere curated this way and it's a lot

00:04:27   of fun. I still hear things, I listen to the alternative station on the Sirius XM radio

00:04:32   a lot and the overlap is fascinating with the A-list and the lack of overlap sometimes

00:04:37   is fascinating where I'm like, I've never heard this song before, why? And sometimes

00:04:42   I will actually, I will take note of what the song is and search for it later if I hear

00:04:49   a song I really like. So I do occasionally discover things on the radio, on the satellite

00:04:53   radio station that I don't find in the A-list so it's kind of fun to have a second opinion.

00:04:58   But that's one of the ways that I've been really happy with what Apple Music does. I

00:05:01   know there are other streaming music services that do this, but that's the one I'm using,

00:05:05   so that's the one I'm talking about. Don't email me.

00:05:08   Don't, please don't. If you would like to submit your question for the opening of the

00:05:12   show, just tweet with the hashtag SnellTalk and it will go into a list and maybe it will

00:05:17   be picked in a future episode. And thank you to Matthew for sending in his hashtag SnellTalk

00:05:20   question.

00:05:21   It's been really hot, Myke. It's been really hot here. Nope, we can't talk about it. Nope.

00:05:26   Nope.

00:05:27   I got one of the Pride bands, the Nylon bands, the Six Color band. Did you get it?

00:05:31   I got it, I'm wearing it right now.

00:05:33   - I love it, I love it so much.

00:05:35   It's a great, this looks great, right?

00:05:37   I've been wearing it all the time.

00:05:39   - It's vibrant and this is the first nylon band I've worn.

00:05:43   I don't love the nylon band.

00:05:44   I think given my druthers, I prefer the sport bands,

00:05:47   but this one is fun and beautiful.

00:05:50   In the chat room last week, it came up

00:05:52   and I didn't say it in the show

00:05:54   and so I wanted to do a correction.

00:05:56   I made it, I overly linked the Apple rainbow logo

00:06:01   to the Pride band, which is not appropriate.

00:06:04   So the color is not my strong point.

00:06:08   Apple's rainbow in their six colors starts with green

00:06:11   and goes to blue, which is not how rainbows really work,

00:06:16   but that's the Apple rainbow.

00:06:18   The Pride rainbow is more like the actual rainbow.

00:06:22   It goes in order from red out to purple.

00:06:25   And the shades are a little bit different,

00:06:27   which again, I'm very bad at.

00:06:29   So just to be clear, the Pride Band is a Pride Band.

00:06:31   I enjoy the fact that a six color rainbow--

00:06:36   - Is evocative.

00:06:37   - Is resonant in terms of Apple's corporate history.

00:06:39   While I like that combination, it's like,

00:06:42   it is Apple history plus Apple supporting Pride.

00:06:45   I love how those go together.

00:06:47   And it's really fun.

00:06:48   And as somebody who has staked a portion

00:06:50   of their professional life on the concept

00:06:53   of a six color rainbow, I enjoy the fact

00:06:56   that I get to wear not only something

00:06:58   that is supportive of Pride but also a six-color rainbow because I am in favor of all the six-color

00:07:07   rainbows. So anyway, just to be clear about that, it's not an Apple rainbow band, it is

00:07:13   a Pride band and it's beautiful.

00:07:15   It is. I love it so much and as you said, right, like I get to wear my new favorite

00:07:20   band which looks awesome and I also get to support something that I support so I love

00:07:24   that and I'm really happy with it and it's awesome. It's funny, I showed it to a D&D

00:07:28   and she's like, "I'm not sure how that will look, right?

00:07:30   Like a rainbow band."

00:07:31   And I bought it and I put it on, she was like,

00:07:33   "Oh my God, it's amazing."

00:07:34   So it really, like the pictures don't do it justice,

00:07:38   like the vibrancy of the colors,

00:07:39   like it really is fantastic.

00:07:41   - Yeah, that's it, they're super, super vibrant.

00:07:45   That's the thing that really struck me about it

00:07:46   is these are not muted colors.

00:07:47   In fact, my understanding, somebody was telling me

00:07:49   that these are actually much more vibrant

00:07:52   than the colors that were in the pride bands

00:07:54   that Apple gave to its employees.

00:07:58   that we talked about last year,

00:08:00   it may be that in wider production

00:08:02   they were able to brighten it up even more.

00:08:05   - Yeah. - Yeah.

00:08:06   - So we spoke a bit last week about podcast analytics

00:08:10   and we got a lot of follow up,

00:08:11   like a lot of feedback,

00:08:12   I mean, which we asked for, right?

00:08:13   We asked people to tell us,

00:08:14   do you like us to talk about this?

00:08:15   - We did. - We got some people

00:08:16   that said that they didn't enjoy it,

00:08:18   like, good, I'm pleased to know that, right?

00:08:20   Like, I'm pleased to know if you don't,

00:08:22   but honestly, we got inundated with people telling us

00:08:25   that they enjoy it.

00:08:26   Now again, I know this is slightly self-selecting, right?

00:08:29   I think people that enjoy it are more likely to tell you that.

00:08:31   But basically, I just want you to say to all of the people

00:08:33   that did enjoy our discussion last week, we hear you,

00:08:37   and we are going to come back to this discussion.

00:08:40   I think as it progresses,

00:08:42   everything we spoke about last week, that stands.

00:08:44   I don't have anything that I feel like I need to add to it.

00:08:47   I was pretty happy with how the conversation came out.

00:08:50   There is an episode of Exponent,

00:08:52   which is Ben Thompson's show,

00:08:53   which goes into this in some more detail as well.

00:08:56   And I encourage people that are interested to maybe go

00:08:59   and listen to that too.

00:09:01   And I'll put a link in the show notes.

00:09:02   - And for the message for the people who didn't like it,

00:09:05   I think which were that we heard from fewer of them

00:09:08   than from other sources.

00:09:10   I think, you know, we hear you too.

00:09:11   I think we've always tried to be erring on the side

00:09:14   of not going too far down that path.

00:09:18   And this is not gonna turn into a show about podcast

00:09:20   industry mechanics, right?

00:09:22   But from time to time, I think we will talk about it

00:09:25   because it's of interest to us

00:09:27   and it is an emerging digital media form

00:09:30   and Apple is a major player in it.

00:09:32   And I think for all of these reasons,

00:09:34   it's worth us talking about it,

00:09:37   but we're also gonna try to be cognizant of the fact

00:09:40   that that's not the core focus of what we do.

00:09:43   And when we do talk about it,

00:09:44   we'll probably talk about it later in the show

00:09:45   and not that often because again,

00:09:48   that's not the primary focus of the show.

00:09:49   - Yeah, so we'll come back to this discussion

00:09:52   more news or information emerges about Apple's podcast analytics, because right now there

00:09:57   isn't anything more than we found out two weeks ago.

00:10:00   No, in fact, the new tags, I actually built a bunch of the new iTunes tags into the incomparable's

00:10:05   RSS feeds and the iOS 11 beta version, the developer beta, the version of the podcast

00:10:16   app on there totally doesn't support them yet. So even though they announced them, the

00:10:20   that actually supports those tags is not running externally.

00:10:25   - I don't think anybody's supporting them yet.

00:10:26   I think people are working on that.

00:10:29   - Sure, sure.

00:10:30   So my feed is there and I'm looking forward

00:10:31   to a first release of the podcast app

00:10:33   that actually supports it because that'll be interesting

00:10:36   to see sort of like how it works.

00:10:38   And I'm looking forward to that

00:10:41   and giving feedback to Apple where appropriate.

00:10:43   There are some things,

00:10:44   O'Shane who does Castrail wrote a blog post

00:10:48   where he was sort of like,

00:10:49   I have some questions about this.

00:10:51   He's very happy about it.

00:10:52   And I think most podcast app developers are,

00:10:56   because this is how you move the whole industry,

00:10:59   is to have Apple say, new tags, and then everybody

00:11:01   builds them in.

00:11:03   So Ashane can do that with Castro.

00:11:06   But when you move through it logically,

00:11:08   there are a bunch of like, how does this get implemented?

00:11:10   And how does this work?

00:11:11   And I suspect in the end, what we're going to find

00:11:13   is Apple does have some specific ideas about it.

00:11:15   And we're going to see how it's put into practice

00:11:17   in the podcast app.

00:11:19   and that will solve a lot of these questions.

00:11:24   But I had a bunch of questions too about the details of it.

00:11:27   So it's summer beta season.

00:11:29   This stuff gets worked out this time of year.

00:11:31   - Jason, do you think that at some point in the future,

00:11:33   you may be getting your peanut butter machego

00:11:35   via Amazon Prime?

00:11:36   - Myke, this doesn't go far enough.

00:11:40   Why didn't you ask if I'll receive it via an Amazon drone?

00:11:44   - That's a good point.

00:11:45   Maybe even by drone.

00:11:46   Because in a very surprising turn of events,

00:11:51   Amazon have acquired Whole Foods.

00:11:54   - Yeah, apparently so.

00:11:55   - Did not see this one coming.

00:11:56   - No.

00:11:57   - $13.7 billion it took to secure Whole Foods.

00:12:02   This is very interesting.

00:12:03   I think it's just another case of Jeff Bezos

00:12:07   deciding he wants to own everything he can.

00:12:11   And I'm very intrigued to see what this could do,

00:12:16   not only to the US but also in the UK where Whole Foods has a small presence. I think

00:12:20   there's four Whole Foods stores in the UK. And I'm probably never going to do my grocery

00:12:26   shopping from Whole Foods but there are specialty items that we will sometimes pick up from

00:12:31   one if we're ever around because they do some great stuff, right? Like if we wanted to eat

00:12:36   our pumpkin pie, Whole Foods is a great place to get one of those in the UK because it tastes

00:12:40   real good. It tastes like what I've tasted from America. So they do a lot of like specialty

00:12:44   stuff but their food typically is a little bit higher priced especially here.

00:12:48   Oh boy. I don't know it's it's it's expensive it's an expensive market as

00:12:53   yeah as a person who has the closest market the one within walking distance

00:12:57   is a Whole Foods it's expensive to be it's convenient to have that market

00:13:00   there boy is it expensive so and some of the stuff is not some of the stuff is

00:13:04   very good and some of the stuff is of mediocre quality and that's the that's

00:13:08   the thing about Whole Foods is that it's not like oh it's all so good it's like

00:13:11   well, some of it is good and some of it is overpriced and fine. But this is an interesting

00:13:17   deal for Amazon. I mean, look, it's all been analyzed. There's so much conventional wisdom

00:13:26   here. But I think it does make sense to say Amazon's been experimenting with retail. They've

00:13:31   got experimental bookstores. They've got that experimental. I drove past it with Glenn Fleishman

00:13:36   when I was visiting him in Seattle,

00:13:38   that experimental checkout-less Amazon store

00:13:41   where you just go in and it knows who you are

00:13:44   and you take things off the shelves and leave

00:13:46   and it charges you, which is so totally wacky.

00:13:50   So I think Amazon, on one level,

00:13:52   Amazon's experimenting with retail as a place to,

00:13:56   and these physical extensions inside,

00:13:59   how do those work?

00:14:01   Because Amazon doesn't have as much knowledge of that.

00:14:03   I think also this is about locations that Amazon has,

00:14:08   by buying Whole Foods, Amazon gets these locations

00:14:13   that are in the wealthiest parts of the US.

00:14:18   That these are the really,

00:14:21   the places where Whole Foods is

00:14:23   are extremely good demographically

00:14:26   in terms of the income of the people who live there.

00:14:28   That's sort of where Whole Foods has gone.

00:14:30   And so it gives Amazon a physical presence

00:14:33   that they didn't have before. Is that for doing their deliveries? It remains to be seen.

00:14:39   I also would say, because Jeff Bezos is crazy like a fox, that sometimes I think maybe an

00:14:49   acquisition like this happens, and I know it's easy to say, talking about $14 billion,

00:14:54   it's kind of insane to suggest that this is just a lark. But I think one of the brilliant

00:15:02   things about somebody like Jeff Bezos is some intuition about like this seems like a good

00:15:08   idea and we'll find out what exactly how as we go. Like maybe the physical presence in

00:15:16   the markets will be helpful. Maybe learning about retail will be helpful. Maybe this becomes

00:15:21   a way that you get faster deliveries into all of these neighborhoods and drone deliveries

00:15:27   and all that kind of stuff that they do.

00:15:29   But maybe it'll be something else.

00:15:32   And maybe they'll find out that it's a good business

00:15:34   to have around, and there are some synergies,

00:15:36   but they're not going to completely swamp it,

00:15:39   that it's more valuable for them to own it and not

00:15:42   have someone else own it and have

00:15:43   a presence in those markets.

00:15:45   It could be as simple as the physical presence

00:15:47   of being able to have a place where you can stock items

00:15:50   and that you can have drivers come from and stuff like that.

00:15:53   So it's a kind of a wacky kind of play.

00:15:56   but Jeff Bezos does that. He's also building, you know, rockets. And drones for people.

00:16:04   And he bought a newspaper in 2017. So, you know.

00:16:09   What the Washington Post got to do was have some freedom to explore what a newspaper would look

00:16:16   like in the 21st century instead of trying to stay alive. And that's interesting, right? It's not

00:16:23   necessarily directly related to Amazon's business and Amazon, I think that's Jeff

00:16:27   Bezos owns that, Amazon doesn't own that, but it's that idea too. This is an Amazon

00:16:31   purchase but there's that too. It may be more about how can the Amazon

00:16:38   approach inside Whole Foods try to define like what retail supermarkets are

00:16:45   for in the modern era with some freedom to do that because they got Amazon's

00:16:53   backing. I don't know, it's interesting. I'm not, like, I saw somebody's analysis

00:16:58   who said, "Well, you know, this wraps it up. The future of grocery stores is that people

00:17:03   will just bring a box full of groceries to your door." It's like, you know, I can see

00:17:08   that for some stuff, but like, I'm an Amazon Prime member. I don't have, I don't have toilet

00:17:13   paper and, and cans of beans shipped to me via subscription from Amazon or something

00:17:19   like that. I don't do that. And so I'm skeptical of that. I think that some stuff could be

00:17:26   simplified and automated, but I think Amazon's explorations in retail suggest that even Amazon

00:17:32   understands that there's a limit to what you can Amazonify.

00:17:36   I don't even think Amazon believe that, right? Because otherwise they never would have started

00:17:39   building their own retail stores. I mean, they've just started building their own bookstores.

00:17:44   You think that like, of everyone in the world, Amazon would know that there's no point for

00:17:47   bookstores, but turns out they think there might be a point.

00:17:49   Right, and I think the argument is, what would a bookstore look like? This is like the Washington

00:17:54   Post argument. What would a bookstore look like if it was designed in a world where Amazon

00:17:58   dominates rather than being an old bookstore trying to fight off Amazon in a world where

00:18:04   Amazon dominates? And those are different, right? Like a bookstore that accepts that

00:18:08   we live in an Amazonified world, but that there's still a place for a bookstore. And

00:18:14   Who can do that? Well, one company that can do that is Amazon. So they're trying it

00:18:18   out and they're experimenting with it. I think there's something to be said for that.

00:18:22   When you dig into the location thing, which I think is a really great argument that you

00:18:25   posed about, like, you know, if they wanted to do this, Whole Foods is the best company

00:18:30   to buy because they get access to all this fantastic prime real estate, right? Like,

00:18:34   if Amazon decided that they just wanted to open their own stores, it would be way harder

00:18:39   for them to find this real estate in these locations than it would have been to just

00:18:43   by Whole Foods. And the reason I think that it's interesting is when you look at where

00:18:49   a lot of Whole Foods stores are, are in big metropolitan cities, right, in and around

00:18:56   those areas.

00:18:57   Yep.

00:18:58   And it makes me think of me here in London. I don't have a car. So I can't do grocery

00:19:05   shopping like people who have cars can. So we get all of our grocery shopping delivered

00:19:12   by a company called Ocado. All they are is an online grocery delivery service. They get

00:19:18   food from our favorite supermarket, which is Waitrose, and they get brand stuff. We

00:19:22   just order it all online and they bring it all. That's where Amazon could do this,

00:19:29   in those cities where people can't drive to the grocery store.

00:19:32   In big cities where transit is dominant, that's definitely an interesting wrinkle. I have

00:19:37   friends who live in New York City who it's the same thing. They don't have a car and

00:19:44   the way so many, I mean, some places do it where you, where there are lots of different

00:19:50   ways to do it. You can do it online and they'll get your stuff and they'll bring it. There

00:19:53   are also places in New York, which I find fascinating, where you go shopping and at

00:19:58   the end you check out and then you give your cart to them and then they will come in a

00:20:06   a delivery window later that day and bring you your groceries.

00:20:09   That was my first job after school, was being the helper boy for the delivery driver who

00:20:15   would take home people's groceries.

00:20:18   Right, right. And the advantages, like I had this with my local grocery store where if

00:20:22   you use one of those affinity cards, they know what brands you buy, which actually means

00:20:28   that you can very quickly generate a menu on a website that is, "Here are all the

00:20:33   products you buy, check the boxes for the ones you want. I mean you can do that and

00:20:37   there is some intelligence there, "Oh it seems like you buy this every three weeks,

00:20:40   every four weeks." And one thing Amazon would like and my local grocery store would like

00:20:44   is only shop with us because that gives them the ability to raise prices and you still

00:20:50   buy them. It's like the Amazon Dash buttons are like this where there's limited number

00:20:53   of products like I just bought, I have a Dash button and it's for laundry detergent and

00:20:59   They only have certain kinds that are available via the dash button, but it includes one that

00:21:03   is one that I want.

00:21:05   And I enjoy, every month or two, I enjoy pressing that button.

00:21:08   It's very exciting.

00:21:09   My wife said that she and my daughter were up at Costco and they were looking at laundry

00:21:13   detergent and they were going to buy some new laundry detergent.

00:21:15   They said, "No, we're not going to do it."

00:21:18   My wife said, "Because your father really likes pressing that button."

00:21:22   And she told me this story and I said, "Yeah, I do."

00:21:25   In fact, I pushed it earlier today and it was really awesome.

00:21:29   you push this button in your house and then you walk away and you get an email from Amazon

00:21:32   like a few hours later that says we're sending you your laundry detergent but what's the

00:21:37   price on it? Like when I press the button I don't know and I'm in their worlds now.

00:21:42   They can raise the price, they can drive me toward their very particular product that

00:21:45   they want me to buy which is what they have done with the Dash button and there are great

00:21:50   advantages to that. Realistically, you know, as a consumer we shop at Whole Foods and Trader

00:21:56   Joes and Costco and Safeway. And so I get that they all want me in their universe 100%

00:22:04   of the time. It's a little bit like computer industry lock-in, right? It's the same idea.

00:22:10   Amazon wants you, or Safeway or Whole Foods, they want you in their ecosystem. Because

00:22:15   sure, why would you not want to consume all of a consumer's money? I get it, but I don't

00:22:20   know how realistic that is. So it's messy. There's a lot going on here. But it's hard

00:22:25   not to think that brick and mortar retail is not going to continue to transform because

00:22:31   of the existence of the internet. And yeah, if we have self-driving delivery trucks and

00:22:36   robots that'll roll the box up to your front door or whatever, like, you can extrapolate

00:22:41   out that this is going to be a very different kind of scenario. That said, I think there's

00:22:46   still a great deal of value in walking into a store and talking to the butcher or squeezing

00:22:54   an avocado to see if it's ripe, that kind of thing. The robots will squeeze our avocados

00:22:59   for us in the future though. The Amazon drone will squeeze all the avocados and choose the

00:23:05   right one for you.

00:23:06   And there'll be a VR headset that will allow you to take a look at the food.

00:23:09   Oh yeah. You gotta have the fruit squeezer glove though to get the proper tactile response

00:23:16   to say if it's a good melon or not.

00:23:18   Oh, Jason, you know, that's not, this is not a completely out of possible scenario.

00:23:22   I know. I know.

00:23:24   We'll be dead and gone. I'll be dead and gone by the time that's a half--you'll be just

00:23:28   a cranky old man being like, "In my day, we didn't have virtual melon tapping." And, you

00:23:33   know, that'll be fine.

00:23:35   Apple have hired James Ehrlich and Zach van Amburg to run video programming at Apple.

00:23:42   This report comes from Recode. They both come from Sony, Jamie and Zach, where they were

00:23:48   top TV executives. These two are responsible for helping shows like Breaking Bad, Shark

00:23:54   Tank, The Shield, and The Blacklist happen, and they will be reporting to EdiQ.

00:23:59   Yeah, it's big news. These were the co-presidents of Sony Pictures Television, and I asked my

00:24:07   friend Joe in the chat room, I asked him, "Is this the well-run part of Sony or the

00:24:13   badly-run part of Sony?" And he said, "No, this is the well-run part of Sony." They have

00:24:18   been a very successful studio. One of the problems with Sony Pictures Television is

00:24:22   that Sony doesn't really own an outlet. They don't own a TV network. And these days, generally

00:24:27   the most common thing that happens is you own what you show if you're a network. So

00:24:33   if you're Fox, Fox makes the shows, the studio makes the shows, and then the Fox channels

00:24:38   air the shows. And it's a much easier business if you've got that vertical integration than

00:24:44   if you are Sony trying to hold onto a show that's an NBC,

00:24:49   and NBC is looking at the shows and there's like,

00:24:50   well, this show we make and this show Sony makes,

00:24:54   so we're gonna keep the show that we make.

00:24:56   It's a challenge.

00:24:59   Joe in the chat room points out Sony does own Crackle, so.

00:25:02   - Well, Crackle's biggest show is leaving Crackle.

00:25:05   - Is leaving for Netflix, yeah, that's true,

00:25:08   the Jerry Seinfeld show.

00:25:09   So it's a big deal though,

00:25:10   because these are well-respected TV executives.

00:25:13   And what it does, like number one is,

00:25:17   I feel like this stops all speculation about,

00:25:21   well, maybe Apple is not gonna jump in

00:25:24   all the way into making original video

00:25:26   and having a video outlet.

00:25:28   They'll still tinker around the edges with Apple Music,

00:25:31   but we don't really know if they're gonna go into TV

00:25:34   in a big way.

00:25:37   We know now, we know now.

00:25:38   Like put a pin in it.

00:25:42   You don't hire the co-presidents of Sony Pictures Television

00:25:46   to sit around and tinker around the edges

00:25:48   with some shows on Apple Music.

00:25:51   You hire those guys to build you a competitor to Netflix.

00:25:55   That's what you do.

00:25:57   To make original programming for Apple's outlets

00:26:01   that they're going to create probably.

00:26:03   Yeah, I feel like the jig is up.

00:26:06   This is it.

00:26:07   Apple's all the way in on video now.

00:26:10   more than just what we see on Apple Music

00:26:12   is what you're saying.

00:26:13   You think that this is precursor to Apple Television.

00:26:17   - I think, so we talked about this on the,

00:26:19   it was a weird turning of the tables episode

00:26:21   of my podcast, TV Talk Machine, that I do with Tim Goodman,

00:26:25   who's the chief TV critic at The Hollywood Reporter.

00:26:27   He had lots of questions for me last week about this,

00:26:31   but I think we both agree that this is a precursor

00:26:37   to Apple getting in the content game that like this fall,

00:26:41   when these guys start, they start at the end of August,

00:26:44   they're gonna make deals with creators

00:26:50   and they're gonna produce shows

00:26:52   and those shows are gonna air somewhere

00:26:54   and almost certainly it's going to be on an Apple something,

00:26:56   whether it's rolled into Apple Music

00:26:58   or I think more likely an Apple TV service,

00:27:03   another service that you can subscribe to from Apple

00:27:06   that's gonna have original content

00:27:07   and everybody can roll their eyes now and say,

00:27:09   but I already pay for Hulu and Netflix and Amazon Prime,

00:27:11   why would I pay for Apple Music or Apple Video,

00:27:14   Apple TV service?

00:27:16   And my answer is because they're gonna sign some like

00:27:19   famous creators and famous properties

00:27:22   and adapt famous books and things and create a new HBO.

00:27:27   - If you signed up for Netflix and Amazon,

00:27:31   they'll use the same reason to get you to sign up for this.

00:27:34   They're creating TV shows that you might wanna see.

00:27:37   - That's the plan. - Yeah, what if the next

00:27:39   Game of Thrones, the next Westworld,

00:27:41   the next Breaking Bad, what if something like that

00:27:45   is on the Apple platform?

00:27:47   That's how they get you to subscribe.

00:27:50   And I think that's where they're going.

00:27:53   I cannot understand how else this hire makes sense.

00:27:58   I'm also really excited about it in the sense that

00:28:01   my confidence in these two gentlemen

00:28:03   to understand how television works,

00:28:05   much higher than my confidence in EdiQ, right?

00:28:08   EdiQ, I always was like, yeah, EdiQ's there,

00:28:11   but this isn't his world.

00:28:12   And you know, so who's gonna do this?

00:28:14   And it's a little bit like they have music people

00:28:17   who do Apple music.

00:28:18   It's not EdiQ, there are music people.

00:28:20   These are TV people and their development executives.

00:28:23   And guess what?

00:28:25   This is what they're gonna do.

00:28:27   The highly thought of in contract negotiations

00:28:31   with their existing employer, and then they jump.

00:28:33   And what Tim said last week on TV Talk Machine is,

00:28:37   he suspects at least that one of the reasons here

00:28:40   is that lack of an outlet.

00:28:41   The fact that this deal is gonna give these guys

00:28:44   the ability to put their shows on their outlet,

00:28:47   which will be this new Apple video service.

00:28:50   And so, yeah, I would expect that they're gonna,

00:28:52   they may license some catalog stuff like, you know,

00:28:55   because in the early days, the last thing you wanna do

00:28:57   is say, "Hey, new Apple TV service,

00:28:59   "pay us $10 a month for one show or three shows," right?

00:29:03   They're gonna need to find some non-exclusive catalog stuff,

00:29:06   old TV shows that they put in the library

00:29:08   that you can watch.

00:29:09   In terms of the transition,

00:29:11   it'll probably be a little bit like what Amazon did,

00:29:13   where they started with an all cart TV service,

00:29:15   which they've had for a while now for digital.

00:29:18   And then they kind of overlaid their free

00:29:21   for Prime members stuff on top of it.

00:29:23   In reality, what was happening

00:29:25   is there's two different things there.

00:29:26   There's a streaming service and there's an all cart service,

00:29:28   but they kind of put it together.

00:29:29   I don't know whether Apple will do that.

00:29:31   Apple sort of did that with music where there's sort of the Apple Music and the

00:29:36   iTunes store. My guess is it's going to be a little bit like that where there's

00:29:39   going to be TV shows on iTunes that you can buy and then there's going to be TV

00:29:42   shows that you get with your with your your subscription to Apple service. So

00:29:48   it's gonna take some time. I don't think we're doing the math like it takes a

00:29:52   long time for shows to be made so like they're starting to do production on the

00:30:01   Expanse, which is a show that I like,

00:30:02   and I follow their production office Twitter account.

00:30:05   They're starting to do production on that show.

00:30:07   That will debut in January of next year.

00:30:10   So it's six months to make a 13-episode cable series.

00:30:14   And that's after they've already started the writing.

00:30:17   And in that cast, they've got an existing cast,

00:30:19   so they don't have to do a lot of casting.

00:30:21   So you back it up from there, and then you've

00:30:24   got to write the show and get the green light for it.

00:30:27   And then before that, you've got to sign--

00:30:29   make the deal with the people who

00:30:31   gonna make the show. It's a long process. So I would imagine that there'll be some

00:30:35   really big announcements this fall about deals being signed with creators, maybe

00:30:39   even from script to series, like no pilots, just "we like your idea, we like

00:30:45   your script, go make it, here's here's money, go make 10 episodes or 8 episodes

00:30:50   or whatever." Even so, I doubt we'd see anything before fall of 2018. You know

00:30:56   what you were saying about how it might be enticing to them to go to somewhere

00:30:59   where it's an outlet, right, where they can actually have their shows on their company

00:31:04   service. It might be even more enticing when that company has basically infinite money

00:31:09   for you to get to get it right. You know?

00:31:13   Yeah.

00:31:14   Like, Apple are probably going to be able to throw more money at this than Sony could,

00:31:18   or like anybody else.

00:31:19   Oh, sure.

00:31:20   Because if they want to do this, they want to get it right. And the way you get it right

00:31:23   is to have all the money, and they have all the money that they can spend.

00:31:26   Right, like Amazon and Netflix will both spend several billion dollars on content this year.

00:31:32   Like I think it's six billion for Netflix and four billion for Amazon or something like

00:31:36   that. In that range though, of many billions.

00:31:39   But they've already got the money coming in, right? So they're doing it now to spending

00:31:43   billions and the money's coming in.

00:31:44   Right, but this is how it starts, right? You start by spending money on creating content

00:31:48   and you kind of have to bootstrap it. I think ultimately Apple doesn't necessarily want

00:31:52   to be Netflix, I think maybe they want to be HBO. I think they want to have, ultimately

00:31:57   they want to have a stable of really good original programming that people want to subscribe

00:32:01   to. And maybe they'll commission some movies and they'll go to Sundance and buy some feature

00:32:06   films and put them on there and they'll make some film deals like Netflix is making some

00:32:10   film deals and create a service. But given Apple's brand, I think it's more likely that

00:32:15   they want to see themselves as a premium, high quality content brand where really good

00:32:21   stuff that people like, not stuff that's high quality but nobody watches. They want crowd-pleasing

00:32:25   stuff too, but of a perceived high quality. So I think less likely that they'll do, what

00:32:31   we said on TV Talk Machine was Fuller House, which Netflix is doing. I think they, you

00:32:36   know, Netflix wants to be more like for everyone, and I imagine Apple doesn't want to do that.

00:32:40   I think Apple would much rather be seen as a prestige, high quality thing, like HBO,

00:32:47   which is successful at that. So something like that, I think, is what Apple probably

00:32:50   wants to do.

00:32:51   have a television show out right now called Planet of the Apps, which we've not spent

00:32:54   any time talking about on this show.

00:32:56   That's true.

00:32:57   But I will provide some follow-out to Connected, where on last week's show we reviewed it.

00:33:02   So if you want to go and find out my and Steven's thoughts on Planet of the Apps, you can go

00:33:08   there.

00:33:09   I gotta be honest, I watched the first, like, four minutes of episode two, which was the

00:33:15   father and daughter coming down the escalator and explaining their app that shows things

00:33:21   on your backpack of your kids backpack.

00:33:25   And I just couldn't go on.

00:33:27   One of these days I'm going to have to force myself to watch a whole episode of it.

00:33:30   That genre does not work for me.

00:33:33   I stopped watching reality TV basically a long time ago, and the stuff that I did watch

00:33:39   was not stuff like this.

00:33:40   I've seen one episode of Shark Tank.

00:33:44   It does not appeal to me.

00:33:45   It appeals to other people.

00:33:47   I suppose I will have to force myself to watch an episode at some point.

00:33:50   But it's fine. The Incomparable has a whole show about reality TV that Maudy Ashley and

00:33:55   Rias Haldu called the villain edit. A little plug for that. They love that reality TV.

00:34:00   I think it's great. It's just not for me. I prioritized in my life what TV I wanted

00:34:05   to watch and reality TV fell out of it. So I'm looking forward to listening to your

00:34:10   connected review of it. Maybe then I won't have to watch it.

00:34:12   Yeah, listen to that and then once you hear what we say, you will make your mind up on

00:34:19   but whether this is a show for you or not I think.

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00:35:44   Capsula for their support of this show and RelayFN. So new iPads we both have

00:35:50   both new iPads so the 10.5 inch and the 12.9 and I want to break them down

00:35:57   kind of section by section and talk about them and I think the thing that is

00:36:02   worth talking about when you're thinking of both of these iPads not just the 10.5

00:36:06   which is arguably the newer because it features a revised form factor but what

00:36:12   what

00:36:28   are focusing on is the 120Hz display. Now this is one of those things that I think is

00:36:36   very difficult to explain because it's something you have to see. With retina it was easy to

00:36:45   explain because it was everything is crisper, right? Just imagine everything being crisper

00:36:51   or it looks like a sheet of paper, that kind of thing. These are things you can explain.

00:36:55   The problem with the 120Hz is it's, I think it's more tricky to explain it because what

00:37:02   it looks like is something that's not real and that's harder to explain because there's,

00:37:07   I don't really know if there's anything you can compare it to in real life because nothing

00:37:11   is like that in real life. There aren't real life apps that fly around, right? Like this

00:37:16   isn't a thing that you can say, oh, it's just like the app window that we have outside of

00:37:20   our homes. Like the thing that is closest to me that I think is, you know when you see

00:37:25   see a TV ad or Apple do this in their ads, when you're watching somebody use a device

00:37:29   but they're not actually using it, right, they're pretending to use it, and there is

00:37:34   a computer animation going on which is green screened into the device, that's what it

00:37:38   looks like. So if you've ever seen an app on a, or an iOS device or any type of device

00:37:45   on a TV, on an ad, and you're like, that looks too smooth, it looks weird, it doesn't

00:37:50   outright. That is what the 120Hz display looks like. It is not right.

00:37:56   This is actually the same way that I described Retina to people. There used to be lots of

00:38:02   TV ads. Google did this where they had ads where they would show you what was going on

00:38:08   in a Google search or whatever, music's playing, they do a whole ad, and you notice

00:38:13   that everything is perfect type, like perfectly smooth, no dots, and you realize, "Oh, this

00:38:19   what the internet would look like, this is what a computer would look like if it actually

00:38:22   had like a print resolution screen, which nobody had at the time. And you could tell,

00:38:26   like, this is fake, but beautiful, but fake, because nobody actually has a screen like

00:38:31   this. And then the Retina screen came out and you're like, "Oh, yeah, look, it's that

00:38:35   thing from the TV." It's a little bit like that. It's, it's, um, yeah, I, I am not one

00:38:41   of the, I was listening to ATP last week and Marco was saying about how it's incredible,

00:38:46   It's incredible.

00:38:47   And he's right, it's really good.

00:38:49   I would back off a little bit and say I don't think it's as impressive as Retina is in terms

00:38:55   of being an upgrade.

00:38:57   I don't think I necessarily believe that if you use a screen like this and you go back

00:39:03   to another screen that you're ruined necessarily.

00:39:08   But I would say that the people who tell you that it's not a big deal and that if you weren't

00:39:14   looking for it you wouldn't notice it are wrong. That it's noticeable. The first moment

00:39:21   I picked up one of these devices at the Apple event at WWDC, I immediately thought, "Oh

00:39:28   my god, what is going on here?" And I wasn't even thinking about ProMotion in general,

00:39:34   just how smooth everything was. And that was the gut feeling was, "Look how smooth everything

00:39:38   Look how smooth scrolling is, bringing up multitasking, all of it just feels smooth.

00:39:44   And I think that's the power of this, it's not, like, the P3 color gamut stuff and the

00:39:50   brighter colors, you get that feeling of like, "Whoa, look at the bright color!"

00:39:54   And I had a moment like that this week, too, by the way, where I was looking at somebody's

00:39:59   Instagram stream and there was a picture and I thought to myself, not thinking about the

00:40:03   color gamut or anything or the fact that I was on a new iPad, I saw it and I thought,

00:40:07   I thought, "Oh, these colors are really bright.

00:40:09   Oh, you know, this is that, this is the screen

00:40:11   that's doing that."

00:40:12   But this feels like, this is just a thing

00:40:15   that's kind of holistic that with the retina screen

00:40:17   and the 120 Hertz, what you get is the whole experience

00:40:20   just feels smooth.

00:40:23   And that is a little bit intangible, I realize,

00:40:26   but whether you're scrolling or kicking off an animation,

00:40:31   you can feel it and it's quite, it's very,

00:40:33   it's just pleasant.

00:40:34   It's a really nice feeling.

00:40:36   There is a spectrum of where people fall on to how close.

00:40:41   So if you take True Tone and Retina as your points,

00:40:45   so how much of a difference True Tone makes

00:40:47   and how much of a difference Retina makes,

00:40:49   that is kind of like the spectrum here.

00:40:52   True Tone is really nice, but it doesn't break you.

00:40:54   Like it's just really nice to have that on a screen

00:40:57   and it's a really lovely enhancement,

00:40:59   but it doesn't make other screens worthless.

00:41:01   Retina does, right?

00:41:03   Like it breaks you.

00:41:05   You have a retina to screen,

00:41:06   you

00:41:19   like every other screen I don't want anymore,

00:41:21   but I'm very close.

00:41:23   That like if the next iPhone doesn't have this,

00:41:25   I'm gonna be really disappointed.

00:41:27   If this doesn't come to every computer,

00:41:30   like Retina did, if this doesn't come

00:41:32   to everything Apple makes, I would be very disappointed,

00:41:35   because I absolutely love this,

00:41:37   and when I use my iPhone now, I'm like,

00:41:40   what is going on, this is so janky.

00:41:43   - So this is what I would say is,

00:41:46   I feel like this feature gets rolled up into our perception of the speed of the product

00:41:54   and the smoothness of the product.

00:41:56   So when I go back to an older iPad, what I don't feel is "Ugh, look at that slow

00:42:03   frame rate, look at that choppy animation."

00:42:05   No, it just feels slower.

00:42:10   Everything feels slower.

00:42:11   Even on iOS 10 on these new iPads, everything feels incredibly new.

00:42:15   Even if it isn't actually any slower, like literally you move your finger and you go

00:42:21   from point A to point B and it's the same on both devices, that's not it.

00:42:26   It isn't actually slower.

00:42:28   It feels slower.

00:42:30   Why does it feel slower?

00:42:31   Because it's juddering through that lower frame rate as it does the animation of your

00:42:36   swipe.

00:42:37   And the juddering effect in your brain feels like, oh, it's struggling.

00:42:42   It's struggling to keep up.

00:42:43   we've seen lots of devices when they're slow,

00:42:46   when they're struggling, they drop frames basically, right?

00:42:49   And so our brains, I feel like as computer users,

00:42:52   especially technology users have been calibrated to be like,

00:42:54   oh, it's struggling, it's not,

00:42:56   the illusion is breaking here.

00:42:58   And once you've seen this new illusion,

00:43:01   the old illusion is more obvious that it's there.

00:43:04   So I would not, I mean, I'm trying to put this specifically

00:43:09   that like, I don't think this is one of those things

00:43:11   that people are gonna single out and be like,

00:43:13   "Oh, the frame rate."

00:43:14   I think it's more like it works holistically.

00:43:17   It's part of this, you know, you've got powerful hardware,

00:43:20   it's drawing the screen fast, the animations are smooth.

00:43:22   Everything kind of works together

00:43:24   to just make it feel smooth.

00:43:26   And on the older hardware, it doesn't feel as smooth

00:43:29   and therefore it feels less nice and less fast,

00:43:33   even though it's not about the actual speed

00:43:36   of getting from point A to point B.

00:43:37   It's about the journey, Myke.

00:43:39   It's about the journey from point A to point B

00:43:41   and how smooth it is.

00:43:44   The overall display of the 12.9 now is just, it's the best screen I've ever used.

00:43:52   Because now the 12.9 gets True Tone and the P3 wide collar along with the 120Hz stuff,

00:43:59   the ProMotion, and like it is just this glorious screen.

00:44:04   Because it's the biggest, right?

00:44:05   It's this huge screen when compared to where you're using it, right?

00:44:10   'cause you use it right in front of your face.

00:44:12   So it is this massive screen with these beautiful colors.

00:44:16   Like I remember saying, when I got the smaller,

00:44:19   when I got the 9.7 inch iPad Pro a year ago,

00:44:22   looking at my home screen was glorious

00:44:27   because the colors of the app icons,

00:44:31   like they never looked like that before.

00:44:32   Like that was honestly one of the places

00:44:34   I noticed it the most was looking at my home screen

00:44:36   because it's a screen that I see so often,

00:44:39   but it looked different again because it was more vibrant than before.

00:44:42   And I feel the same when looking at my 12.9 inch iPad. I'm like, Oh wow.

00:44:46   Because that's the iPad that I use the most.

00:44:49   And so I get the joy whenever I was using the smaller iPad when I would travel.

00:44:53   But the 12.9 now I get to see it every day and it's just,

00:44:57   it's fantastic.

00:44:59   Like this screen with true tone and the 120 hours stuff and the white color

00:45:04   stuff and like, Oh, I love it. Jason.

00:45:07   Both screens are brighter now as well, so you can see them better outside.

00:45:11   These displays on both of these iPads, I mean, it's no joke that Apple say these are the

00:45:17   best they ever make, and usually I don't know if I can tell that, right?

00:45:21   Like, "This is the best we've ever made!"

00:45:22   I'm like, "Okay."

00:45:23   Right?

00:45:24   Like, it looks really nice, but these, I can hold them and I'm like, "Yeah, they're right,"

00:45:28   because I've never seen computer displays like these before.

00:45:31   - You mentioned the brighter screen, there's also on the 12-inch, I should mention, I wrote

00:45:36   12.9 inch iPad Pro since I use it all the time and nobody seemed to write this article

00:45:42   because all the reviews were about the 10.5 inch understandably because it's the newer

00:45:46   size.

00:45:47   Plus it was what Apple was giving out.

00:45:49   Yeah, although that's not, I asked for a 12.9 and a review unit and that's what I got.

00:45:55   For embargo I believe all they were doing was giving out the small one.

00:45:59   Maybe I don't, I can't say that for sure, maybe that's true.

00:46:04   I would assume that everybody who was getting an embargo would want the 10.5 because it's

00:46:08   a more mainstream product than the 12.9 and it's the new one in terms of the size. So

00:46:13   why would you not want that one? I asked for one, that one too. And then I changed my mind

00:46:18   when I saw all the reviews were the 10.5. I was like, let's, let's go the other way.

00:46:21   So I wrote the story about the 12.9. I will write more about this in the weeks to come.

00:46:26   But my first story out of the gate about this was what's different with the 12.9 because

00:46:31   are a bunch of differences. And the brightness and the anti-glare on the 12.9 are way up

00:46:40   from the old 12.9, because remember, sort of, the 12.9 first edition came out, and then

00:46:46   the 9.7 iPad Pro came out, and it was better and brighter and had the anti-glare stuff

00:46:51   on it, and the true tone, and the P3 color gamut, right? So this is like a double step

00:46:57   for the 12.9 display. And yeah, can you work on it in sunlight outside because it's so

00:47:04   much brighter and because it's got the anti-glare coating? I say you can, which is a big step

00:47:11   because it used to be that you really couldn't. Like, I cranked up the brightness all the

00:47:15   way and I was in a text editor and I could read it and I could write on it in direct

00:47:20   sunlight. I will say, all your fingerprints light up when you're in direct sunlight, so

00:47:25   So bring a rag to wipe down your iPad screen,

00:47:29   because when you're in direct sunlight,

00:47:30   your fingerprint, your finger oil is everywhere.

00:47:34   But you can do it because that display

00:47:35   is so much brighter than it used to be.

00:47:37   - So part of the reason that this thing feels so smooth

00:47:42   is probably also because of the A10X,

00:47:45   which is an incredibly powerful new processor.

00:47:47   It has three cores, 33% faster in single core,

00:47:51   89% faster in multi-core than the chip it was replacing,

00:47:55   I think it was the A9X. Um, the real well benefit of this, it doesn't necessarily come

00:48:01   now, like some of these benefits come later, um, but there will be applications that you

00:48:05   use that will be able to do things quicker.

00:48:08   Yeah, there are some, um, there are not a lot of them right now, but there are some,

00:48:13   um, like Affinity Photo, which just got released and Apple demoed on stage, is like Photoshop,

00:48:19   basically, and they've got a bunch of things that they're doing that there's some stuff

00:48:22   they can do real time and there are things that if you've got a filter that you want

00:48:26   to do that you know like any other computer it will do it faster but I feel like yeah

00:48:30   for most use what this increased speed is really providing is more I tried to struggle

00:48:39   to describe this in the article if you imagine like there's the base level of performance

00:48:43   that people on an iPad Pro have today right and it's plenty it's plenty so what's happening

00:48:49   is behind there, imagine sort of like behind what you're doing now, there's some room.

00:48:55   So if you push it a little bit more, there's room, because you're not taxing that system.

00:48:59   I feel like what this new model does is expand the room that's behind a lot of the current

00:49:06   performance stuff, and that's the best way I can come to describe it, because really,

00:49:12   it's not going to make as big a difference until you've got software that's really pushing

00:49:16   and most iPad software doesn't really push it in that way, but we're seeing

00:49:20   more of it all the time. I was exporting audio from Ferrite on the iPad with a

00:49:26   plug-in which I bought and put in a compressor plug-in and I thought to

00:49:32   myself this is one of those examples of where the faster iPad is gonna do this

00:49:38   maybe twice as fast or almost as my older 12.9 inch and that's just look oh

00:49:44   "Oh look, I hit a processor constraint."

00:49:46   It doesn't happen all the time on the iPad

00:49:48   like it does on the Mac, but it's going to, increasingly.

00:49:50   And so this, it's a big jump.

00:49:53   - In regards to new hardware, kind of new hardware design,

00:49:56   obviously the 12.9, it's unchanged.

00:49:58   It's exactly the same, right?

00:50:00   I don't think there's any change at all

00:50:01   except for the antenna bands.

00:50:03   - No, the microphones are in a different place

00:50:06   and the camera is slightly bigger,

00:50:08   although the back shell that I've got still fits it.

00:50:12   and there's a flash which didn't exist on the 12.9 before.

00:50:16   So those are the hardware differences really

00:50:18   is that the antenna lines are less noticeable

00:50:22   and there's the flash and the microphones are relocated.

00:50:26   So if you've got one of those silicone back cases

00:50:28   for your 12.9 inch iPad Pro and you move it to the new model

00:50:31   and you try to shoot video,

00:50:32   your microphone will be covered by the case.

00:50:36   It's a very esoteric thing, but it'll fit.

00:50:39   Otherwise it's exactly the same.

00:50:41   But the new hardware, really, the big hardware changes are in the 10.5 because the case got

00:50:47   bigger, kept the same weight, which is, I'm really pleased they did that, but it got a

00:50:52   bigger screen.

00:50:53   Now, what does this bigger screen practically bring to the table?

00:50:57   So, software doesn't take advantage of it in any real meaningful way.

00:51:03   There isn't a, the larger screen thing that doesn't, didn't pan out the way we hoped,

00:51:08   as we've spoken about, right?

00:51:10   like the applications that you see on the screen,

00:51:12   they're partway between iPhone and iPad,

00:51:15   they kind of sit in the middle of it there.

00:51:16   They're not the full iPad app in portrait

00:51:19   that you get on the 12.9

00:51:22   when you put them into split screen mode.

00:51:24   What I guess, one of the big things

00:51:26   that is the reason they did this I expect

00:51:29   is that it's a differentiator from what is now iPad,

00:51:32   the 9.7 inch, 'cause the only one that they do.

00:51:35   I think surprisingly for Tim Cook's Apple,

00:51:38   They do not sell the 9.7 inch iPad Pro.

00:51:41   You can't buy it.

00:51:43   So now, if you go into an Apple store,

00:51:44   you can look at three iPads on a table

00:51:46   and you can see distinctly which one is which.

00:51:49   There aren't two 9.7 inch iPads that look exactly the same.

00:51:54   There is a 9.7, a 10.5, and a 12.9.

00:51:56   You can stack them up and you can see how they're different.

00:52:00   I like the larger screen because it's a larger screen, right?

00:52:03   And I like the way the iPad looks.

00:52:04   I like the thin bezels.

00:52:05   I think it looks really great.

00:52:07   I did wish for more, but I'm happy with what I got as well.

00:52:11   Because it doesn't feel bigger.

00:52:12   It's bigger, but it never feels like it.

00:52:14   - No, it doesn't feel bigger, it doesn't feel heavier.

00:52:17   It still feels like that smaller iPad

00:52:20   for better and for worse, right?

00:52:22   As a 12.9 inch fan, I look at it and I think,

00:52:26   you know, it's the 9.7 grown a little bit.

00:52:29   It's not like the 12.9 packed into a smaller case,

00:52:33   which was kind of what I was hoping for, but it's fine.

00:52:37   I'm kind of resigned now to the fact that it's not for me.

00:52:40   Like the 12.9 is the one that I still like

00:52:43   and I'm not gonna switch to the 10.5.

00:52:46   It's just not gonna happen because I like the bigger screen.

00:52:49   The bigger screen has a lot of value to me.

00:52:51   I do wonder if app developers of pro-leaning apps

00:52:56   on the iPad may tweak their settings.

00:53:04   I don't know the details of how this is actually set up in the OS with the 10.5, but I do wonder

00:53:10   if they might try to put some more information on screen when you're in a 10.5 split screen.

00:53:18   Right now, by default, using the old sort of size classes for apps, the old breakpoints

00:53:25   for how an app gets laid out, this is following the same rules as the 9.8, right?

00:53:31   over 9.7. It's sort of two phone app layouts when you've got it in side by side. And I

00:53:38   wonder, I don't know this, so developers can tell us, but my understanding from a couple

00:53:44   of years ago is that there are various sort of size families and there are breakpoints

00:53:49   and it's a little bit like when I build a website and I've got breakpoints for different

00:53:56   browser widths that the layouts change at certain breakpoints. I don't know if they

00:54:01   can, I would assume they can target this particular size of split-screen 10.5 and

00:54:09   it would be nice if they could because they could maybe put some more stuff on

00:54:13   it but you know it's not that big a screen so there's only so much stuff you

00:54:17   can put on it and you know it's not as nice experience to have split-screen apps

00:54:22   in the 10.5 screen as it is on the 12.9 that's just the bottom line that's just

00:54:25   how it is but you get a much lighter thinner smaller device in exchange.

00:54:32   You made reference to the cameras the cameras are different now hold the the current iPhone

00:54:37   cameras I believe 12 megapixels on the back with support for 4k video and an LED flash

00:54:42   is the first time a flash has been on an iPad and there is a 7 megapixel front facing camera

00:54:48   as well but of course it brings with it a camera bump on the back because I guess there

00:54:53   is

00:55:05   And there is also the ability in the larger iPad now, two things that didn't get before,

00:55:11   to have the Apple SIM. Apple SIM is great if you're using cell. Apple SIM is awesome

00:55:15   because you can just choose from providers no matter where you are in the world.

00:55:18   I love the Apple SIM on my iPad. And you can, I didn't know this, you can trigger a high telephone,

00:55:25   which is the wake word for Apple's digital assistant. It's not actually a high telephone,

00:55:30   we just won't say what the real one is because it will set off everybody's devices.

00:55:33   You can now do that when your large iPad is not plugged in.

00:55:37   I didn't know that was a thing, turns out.

00:55:41   - Yeah, yeah, that's a little odd thing

00:55:44   that the 9.7 could do that when it was plugged in,

00:55:47   or when it was unplugged, and the 12.9,

00:55:49   for whatever reason, couldn't, so now it can.

00:55:51   - So like when we had the very great iPad Mini,

00:55:56   which I think was the iPad Mini 2,

00:55:59   which was the iPad Mini's high point,

00:56:01   What made it so great was that Apple removed all of the reason that you would choose one

00:56:08   iPad over another except for the size.

00:56:10   Right, so the internals of both the regular iPad and the iPad mini are exactly the same

00:56:15   as they are here with the 10.5 and the 12.9 inch iPad Pro.

00:56:20   Everything is the same inside of them.

00:56:22   The only differentiator now is which screen size do I want?

00:56:26   Do you think this is a good thing or a bad thing?

00:56:28   I think it's great.

00:56:30   Love it. Think it's great. Confusion is not good.

00:56:34   The other two models were obviously built separately on different tracks.

00:56:39   It's very strange. In fact, I think the speculation at the time was that the 12.9

00:56:45   was built as an iPad Pro and the 9.7 was built as an iPad Air 3 basically.

00:56:52   And at some point they decided no, no, this is an iPad Pro 2.

00:56:57   And they're not the same and it was really weird

00:57:00   and I always use the millionaire question,

00:57:03   which is if a millionaire walks into an Apple store

00:57:05   and says, give me your finest iPad,

00:57:07   the answer is, we don't know which one you want

00:57:10   because they're both differently good.

00:57:12   And now that millionaire walks into the Apple store

00:57:15   and says, give me your finest iPad.

00:57:16   And they say, which size?

00:57:18   Because otherwise they are identical.

00:57:22   And that's, I think that's great.

00:57:25   So I guess this is hardware and the physical things,

00:57:29   but the other difference is software, right?

00:57:31   And so that is one of the other things that goes into this,

00:57:34   is that there is differences in software.

00:57:35   And we're gonna come back to that in a moment, actually.

00:57:38   I did just wanna say at this juncture,

00:57:40   before we take a break,

00:57:42   that these iPads are just the best computers I've ever used.

00:57:45   I love them so much.

00:57:46   I think they're fantastic.

00:57:48   I'm so, so happy.

00:57:50   And I'm using 10 on these.

00:57:52   I did put iOS 11 on both of them

00:57:54   and had to restore both of them.

00:57:57   Because at different points over the space of 36 hours,

00:58:01   I got absolutely crippling home screen refreshes, right?

00:58:07   Springboard crashes.

00:58:08   And the iPads wouldn't come on anymore.

00:58:10   They would not boot further than the Apple logo.

00:58:15   So don't put iOS 11 beta 1 on your devices right now,

00:58:19   which is exactly what we were talking about last week.

00:58:22   and it's because I've had to restore both of these iPads,

00:58:25   which is fine.

00:58:26   I got to go through the restore thing.

00:58:28   - I share your enthusiasm about these devices,

00:58:32   but when, yeah, when iOS 11 is on them and working well,

00:58:36   that's the stuff.

00:58:38   - I'm so excited. - That's when it's really--

00:58:39   - I don't think I've ever been more excited

00:58:41   for an iOS release.

00:58:42   I'm just like, "Just give it to me now, like I need it."

00:58:45   Oh, I'm so excited.

00:58:46   - I was pretty excited about iOS 9,

00:58:48   just because adding multitasking at all

00:58:51   with such a huge deal, but this is huge.

00:58:55   - Here's the difference, right?

00:58:56   Then it was like, "Oh, this is exciting.

00:58:57   "What could it give us?"

00:58:59   But now we are like heavy iPad users, right?

00:59:02   - Yeah, it's already transformed us,

00:59:03   and now they're giving us more things, yep.

00:59:05   - So that's why I'm so excited for it.

00:59:07   All right, let's take a break.

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01:01:02   I get lots of questions.

01:01:03   We get lots of questions about what computers people should buy.

01:01:07   But in the last couple of weeks I have had an increasing amount of "Which iPad should

01:01:12   I buy?"

01:01:13   And I wanted to just spend a moment, Jason, giving a mini iPad buying guide for the upgrade

01:01:19   in Zappa.

01:01:21   I think this question comes down to one other question, right?

01:01:24   So the question you give me, I give one question back to you, and this is what should answer

01:01:28   it.

01:01:29   And it is, "What do you want to do with it?"

01:01:32   So these are what I believe the two iPads are suited for.

01:01:37   10.5 inch, so the new iPad, the newest new.

01:01:41   I believe that the 10.5 inch is the iPad Pro that is best suited for consumption first.

01:01:48   So if you want to be reading or browsing or watching stuff, I think this is maybe the

01:01:54   best iPad all around for that with work attached, right?

01:01:59   So it's like both of these iPads do both of these things, but there is a leading use case.

01:02:05   And I think the leading use case for the 10.5 is for media and entertainment first with

01:02:11   light work, like maybe writing in a text editor because the keyboard is bigger now, or maybe

01:02:16   doing your email, maybe doing some spreadsheet stuff.

01:02:19   But I don't think that it is the best sized iPad for long periods of multitasking work

01:02:25   because you don't get the full app sizes, right? So you don't get these full apps.

01:02:29   So there are more compromises that you have to make. It's easier to travel with because

01:02:33   it's smaller and lighter, but I don't think you would really want to be, if you're intending

01:02:37   to start working all the time from your iPad, I don't think that this is the best one to

01:02:42   move to for that. Purely because you don't get the best of multitasking.

01:02:47   So in the inverse, the 12.9, I think that this is the iPad that is suited best for working

01:02:53   first. It has, you get the ability, so when we talk about these two apps, I'll say this

01:02:57   again, when you go into multitasking mode on a 12.9 inch iPad and you have two apps

01:03:01   side by side, what you see is effectively an iPad application in portrait mode. You

01:03:06   get two of those side by side, so if you turned your iPad around, that's what the apps would

01:03:10   look like. It's two iPad apps side by side, when you've got the iPad in landscape, you

01:03:14   see two portrait apps side by side. It is also a huge canvas if you're illustrating or

01:03:20   are doing design work, and you also get basically full sized keyboards, right? So you get full

01:03:26   sized keyboards you can attach to it, maybe in cases or the smart keyboard, or you get

01:03:31   a full sized on screen keyboard. Video looks great on it, right? Because it's a nice big

01:03:36   display, but it can be a little too large for, like, maybe a little bit unwieldy or

01:03:42   heavy for browsing Twitter or watching video, right? Because if you're holding it, or if

01:03:46   you got it on the couch, it's kind of a bit big. It's a bit big on airplanes, like sometimes

01:03:50   it doesn't really fit on the tray table very well, because it's a big thing, right? It's

01:03:54   like a 13 inch screen basically with this border around it. It's a very big device.

01:04:00   That also makes it heavy, especially when paired with a keyboard. Depending on the keyboard

01:04:05   you put on this, you're in laptop weight, right? So it's also tougher to travel with.

01:04:10   So my conclusion of this, and then I'll throw over to you, Jason, is that the 10.5 inch

01:04:14   iPad is the replacement for your current iPad if you want to step up what you are doing

01:04:21   on your iPad.

01:04:22   So if your current iPad, whatever you are doing on it, if you just want to take the

01:04:25   next step, it's great for that because it's great for reading stuff, it's great for writing,

01:04:31   it's great for getting some work done like email and it's great for browsing things like

01:04:34   Twitter and Facebook and Reddit and that kind of stuff.

01:04:36   It's a great iPad for that.

01:04:38   The 12.9 inch iPad is if you want to buy an iPad to replace your laptop.

01:04:42   That's the one that you want to get.

01:04:43   If you wanna replace everything you do on your laptop

01:04:45   with an iPad, you should get the 12.9

01:04:48   because that's the one where you can get

01:04:50   all your work done easily or easier than you can the 10.5.

01:04:55   What do you think, Jason?

01:04:56   - I think that's not a bad breakdown.

01:04:59   It's funny 'cause I was thinking this,

01:05:04   it sounds a little bit to me like,

01:05:06   should you get the 13 or the 15 inch MacBook Pro, right?

01:05:11   Like you could have that conversation.

01:05:14   And what is the conversation at that point?

01:05:16   One of them is a little more expensive

01:05:18   and gives you a bigger screen.

01:05:19   Which one do you want?

01:05:21   Which one do you prefer?

01:05:22   You wanna save some money and also have the smaller screen?

01:05:25   Or do you really want that extra screen?

01:05:26   Yes, there's some power,

01:05:27   there's some processor differences there too,

01:05:30   which this does not provide.

01:05:31   But it's a similar argument,

01:05:33   which is like, how are you gonna use it?

01:05:35   How much do you care about the added screen real estate?

01:05:38   Because there is a cost in terms of weight and size

01:05:41   doing it. I think, yeah, in terms of getting worked on the 10.5, I mean, I

01:05:47   think it also is about how much you work on it, especially if you're traveling.

01:05:54   Look, you can be a dedicated road warrior with a 10.5 inch iPad Pro,

01:06:02   because you could be with a 9.7. You will, everything will be a little bit

01:06:06   cramped. The keyboard is a little bit smaller on the 9.7, right? But the 10.5, they've made it

01:06:12   that it fits within the definition of a full-sized keyboard. Plus the 10.5, at least in iOS 11,

01:06:20   will get that cool swipey keyboard where you can access punctuation by swiping down on the keys.

01:06:24   Sure, right, when you're using the software keyboard. And then the smart keyboard that

01:06:29   you can get is, the keys are a little bit bigger so they can call it a full-sized keyboard. Turns

01:06:34   out there as a definition for what a full-size keyboard is, and it's a certain amount with

01:06:39   a range of like a millimeter, and they're in the range, it's a little on the small side,

01:06:43   but it's in the range of being called a full-size keyboard, which is why they call it that now.

01:06:47   I will say, I did notice immediately that the keyboard was bigger just by using it.

01:06:51   Like I could feel it.

01:06:52   Yeah.

01:06:53   I don't know if everyone can, but I really could feel it.

01:06:55   Yeah, and they've been aggressive with all the edge keys being a little narrower, but

01:06:59   gets those main keys to be the the QWERTY keys are full-sized. So I guess

01:07:06   what I'm saying is as an 11-inch MacBook Air user from way back, don't let

01:07:13   anybody tell you that that device is too small to get work done. I've edited many

01:07:17   many podcasts in Logic on an 11-inch Mac screen, right? And people would say,

01:07:23   "Well, it's impossible. You just can't." It's like, "Well, I did. I don't think I would

01:07:26   wanted to edit video on it, right? That would have been hard, but for podcasts I

01:07:32   could do it. So what I'm saying is like the 10.5 can be used for all the

01:07:37   same things as the 12.9 can. It's just going to be a little more cramped, which is why

01:07:41   I think your advice is pretty practical. Like if you are prioritizing the,

01:07:48   like you said, the consumption stuff and just sort of like some light work and

01:07:52   not a lot of multitasking and then you know that sometimes you're going to be in a situation

01:07:57   whether you're traveling or even when you're at home where you are going to need to do

01:08:01   some multitasking and do some more heavy work it will do it.

01:08:05   It is entirely capable of doing it.

01:08:07   It might be a little cramped but you could totally do it and you what you get is that

01:08:11   lightness and the thinness out of it.

01:08:13   But I do agree like for me I love the bigger screen.

01:08:21   I do actually love it for reading Twitter and Slack and things like that.

01:08:25   I love it for reading comics, although the 10.5 is much better at reading comics than

01:08:29   the 9.7, it's still not as good as the 12.9.

01:08:32   And so for me, I'd rather have all of that power there for when I need to do multitasking

01:08:38   work and all of that, but I still, 90% of the time I use it, I'm using it just as a,

01:08:43   in that sort of more consumption mode, and I'm very happy with it.

01:08:46   So either of these can be either.

01:08:48   It ends up being about what you want to spend, how much weight you want to carry, and how

01:08:52   much the extra pixels mean to you.

01:08:54   Because they all do the same things.

01:08:57   It's just, you know, for me I look at it and think I'm willing to spend the money to have

01:09:02   that bigger screen and I don't mind that it's bulkier and heavier because it's just so nice.

01:09:08   And that's funny coming from somebody who used an 11-inch MacBook Air, but that's where

01:09:12   I am now.

01:09:13   Well yeah, I mean the 11" MacBook Air, right, it had a lot of convenience to it, but the

01:09:19   screen was smaller than it could have been.

01:09:21   Like if you look at the 11" MacBook Air and the MacBook, right, the MacBook screen is

01:09:25   bigger and it's also smaller, right?

01:09:28   That was the screen size they could fit in a product of that size at the time, I guess.

01:09:33   Yeah, I agree.

01:09:34   Like, I have to say, both of these things can do both of these, both of these devices

01:09:38   can do all of these things, I think there is just a way that they skew and I think one

01:09:45   skews more towards work than the other. I will say what we haven't thrown in here, which

01:09:49   it should, if you plan to do absolutely no work on your iPad, you should probably get

01:09:55   the $329 iPad. If all you want to do is just read Twitter and watch a movie, like get that

01:10:02   one. I mean I will say that the screens are so good that if you have the money

01:10:08   and the desire maybe you should get the 10.5 but like if that doesn't bother you

01:10:12   then you should get the regular one. I agree and I'll also say sometimes I hear

01:10:16   people they get confused about the smart cover and they think oh well but what if

01:10:21   I want to have a keyboard it's like all Bluetooth keyboards work with iPads so

01:10:25   you can buy that you can buy that cheap you know 5th generation iPad and pair

01:10:30   it with a Bluetooth keyboard and go to town. So that's not enough of a reason.

01:10:37   I agree that Apple has done a good job of splitting this iPad line in two and

01:10:41   if all you're doing is really light stuff and browsing Twitter and

01:10:48   doing email and stuff like that you don't even need the iPad Pro.

01:10:51   Have you used any accessories with your iPads?

01:10:54   A few. I used the apple leather sleeve thing, which is interesting. It's nice.

01:11:06   It feels like I'm an art student. I think that's actually kind of what it's designed for.

01:11:11   It's like you've got a naked iPad, probably. It doesn't have to be. It can have a cover on it.

01:11:15   But a naked iPad in this sleeve with the apple pencil at the top, and you carry it around with you.

01:11:20   And it's like, "Oh, I'm here. I'm ready for art class." That's how it sort of feels like to me.

01:11:23   me. It's really nice. It is not cheap, but it is really nice. Nice leather, nice stitching.

01:11:28   It's a beautiful, enormous in this case because it's for the 12.9 sleeve, but it's nice.

01:11:35   I will say super quick on that, it's an interesting tidbit. It's actually designed to hold the

01:11:41   iPad with the smart keyboard attached to it. So, that is not what I was told by Apple and

01:11:48   I ask specifically. What they told me was it is designed to not be used with the case,

01:11:55   but it will fit with the case in it. However, your case will stretch a little bit and over

01:12:00   time it will create a little bit of a shape. Either will fit, but my understanding is that

01:12:06   if you put it in with the thicker case, then over time, like as leather does, it will expand

01:12:11   a little bit. It'll fit it just fine and you may see a little bit of a stretch mark on

01:12:15   it.

01:12:16   I've only seen and played with the one on the 10.5.

01:12:19   If you don't have a case on it,

01:12:20   it kind of flops about in there a little bit

01:12:22   in a way that I'm uncomfortable with.

01:12:23   So like, I think it's maybe nicer

01:12:26   if you do have the keyboard on it,

01:12:27   'cause it has a bit of friction in there.

01:12:28   - Do what you have to do.

01:12:29   - But your mileage may vary, I guess.

01:12:32   - Yeah, I've been using it just completely caseless

01:12:36   and sliding it in the little thing

01:12:39   and it worked fine with me,

01:12:42   But it's not a, I'm not gonna be keeping it in there, right?

01:12:47   Like I got a smart cover and I got a new smart cover

01:12:52   'cause one of the exciting things is

01:12:54   they now make a leather smart cover for the 12.9

01:12:57   and it means there's finally an Apple accessory

01:12:59   for the 12.9 that comes in colors

01:13:02   that are not gray and white.

01:13:04   So the leather smart cover is in brown or midnight blue

01:13:09   or I think black.

01:13:11   And so at last the hegemony of gray and white iPad 12.9 accessories from Apple has been

01:13:20   broken. So that's nice.

01:13:22   Yeah, I don't own any of the smart covers. I have an old 9.7 inch smart cover which still

01:13:29   works. I haven't tried it with the 10.5 but it still worked with my previous iPad Pro.

01:13:34   Like I'm talking about an iPad. Would it not fit at all?

01:13:38   Well, give it a try. It won't be a good experience though.

01:13:43   Well, I mean, I only ever use it to prop the iPad up on a plane. That's all I ever use it for.

01:13:49   Because you have what? You have the smart...

01:13:51   Well, I was using the Create case before, right? But I'm not doing that anymore.

01:13:55   So actually it's not an issue for me now because I've moved to the smart keyboard again.

01:13:59   My primary use of my 12.9 has always been with the smart cover.

01:14:05   and then I will add a keyboard when I need it,

01:14:09   but I don't live with it in the,

01:14:11   that would be a way to get me turned off

01:14:14   on the 12.9 pretty fast

01:14:16   if it was always in a bulky keyboard case, right?

01:14:18   That's not what I want.

01:14:20   - Yeah, I am a smart keyboard person,

01:14:22   so I use the smart keyboard on my big one I always have,

01:14:24   and I'm gonna use it on the 10.5

01:14:26   because Logitech's case, I hate.

01:14:30   - Yeah, I haven't tried it,

01:14:31   but it's not a style that I particularly like.

01:14:34   I'm really skeptical about it.

01:14:36   - I've tried. - Did you get one?

01:14:38   - Yeah, and I hate it, it's terrible.

01:14:40   I find it terrible.

01:14:41   I haven't done a comprehensive review,

01:14:43   but Serenity Caldwell has,

01:14:44   and I'm gonna put it in the show notes,

01:14:46   and she didn't like it either.

01:14:48   I mean, I honestly, Jason, I'm going to return it.

01:14:51   I haven't yet, I used it for 20 minutes,

01:14:53   and I was like, I am not gonna get on with this.

01:14:55   Like, it's not, everything I liked about the create

01:14:59   is not in this one.

01:15:00   I really, really didn't like it at all.

01:15:03   But again, I'll put a link to Wren's review

01:15:06   because she does a better job of talking about

01:15:09   the positives and negatives about it,

01:15:12   but it's really not for me.

01:15:14   - Yeah, I really like the 9.7 Create,

01:15:19   and I am disappointed--

01:15:22   - Me too.

01:15:23   - That Logitech didn't take what they learned

01:15:26   from the 9.7 Create and use that in a 10.5 Create,

01:15:30   'cause I think it would be a really good product.

01:15:32   And maybe they will do that down the road, who knows?

01:15:35   - I hope so, because what they've got right now

01:15:38   is not the create at all.

01:15:40   - Yeah, yeah.

01:15:43   - So yeah, iPads, very excited about them.

01:15:48   I believe everybody should buy them

01:15:50   so Apple can keep making them.

01:15:52   - Fair, fair point, good.

01:15:54   That's just, let the word be known.

01:15:57   Everybody go buy an iPad or two.

01:16:00   - Go buy, go buy.

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01:17:43   Alright Jason Snell, it's time for some Ask Upgrade.

01:17:47   Alright, let's bring it.

01:17:50   Chris asked, "I'm a first time True Tone user. Do you guys use night shift in addition to

01:17:54   True Tone or is True Tone enough for the night?"

01:17:57   I have not been using True Tone long enough to have an opinion about it.

01:18:00   Really?

01:18:01   I mean, oh yeah, you didn't use the small one, right? Okay. So maybe I should be the

01:18:06   one to answer this.

01:18:07   12.9

01:18:08   Yeah, I use them both because I actually think that night shift and True Tone are a beautiful

01:18:13   pairing.

01:18:14   There you go.

01:18:15   Like when it starts to get late in the day, that True Tone screen looks even better because

01:18:19   of Night Shift. So I recommend having that turned on. I love Night Shift personally.

01:18:25   I think it's a great feature.

01:18:26   Yeah, one of the challenges with Night Shift and True Tone, if you just use True Tone,

01:18:30   is it works if it's the evening and you've got the lighting in your room because it's

01:18:37   going to make everything match the lighting and that's enough. But if it's dark, True

01:18:45   tone won't help you. It won't help you because there's no light in the room other than your

01:18:51   screen light and that's why night shift is extra valuable because then it's going to

01:18:55   push things into that gentler yellowy orange tone even when there's no light in the room

01:19:03   for the true tone sensor to find.

01:19:06   Michael wants to know, "If I'm embracing the multi-pad lifestyle, do you recommend getting

01:19:10   both with cellular or just one?"

01:19:12   So the multi-pad lifestyle is the life that I lead which is to have multiple iPads that

01:19:17   I use for different purposes.

01:19:20   In my experience, the way that I embrace it is that I use the big iPad at home and I use

01:19:26   the small iPad when I'm out of the home.

01:19:29   So I just have cellular on the iPad when I'm out of the home.

01:19:32   That makes the most sense for me.

01:19:35   I'm going to be travelling this year differently and I don't know how I'm going to deal with

01:19:39   this yet in that I'm going to be away from the UK for a month in August so I'm thinking

01:19:47   I'm probably just going to take the 10.5 and deal with the crampedness because I only have

01:19:51   Solier on that one and I do like on my iPad the ability to not have to worry about tethering

01:19:58   or things like that. Like if you can get Cell go for it but I do recommend just work out

01:20:03   what you want to use your iPads for and then decide if you want to get Solier on one or

01:20:09   Joshua asked, "I'm looking to upgrade from early 2010 iMac and 2011 MacBook Pro to a

01:20:16   single machine. What should I do?" I think in that, in this example, you should probably

01:20:22   buy a MacBook Pro and an external display so you get the best of both. What do you think,

01:20:27   Jason?

01:20:28   Yeah, I think that's the right answer.

01:20:30   Yeah.

01:20:31   Is get a MacBook Pro and if you need that large screen, then buy an external display.

01:20:37   Yeah, I think that makes the most sense.

01:20:40   Tom asks, "Any advice on cases to increase grip on a slippery iPhone 6?"

01:20:46   So I mean, I can't speak to every case.

01:20:48   I mean, I really have just been a user of Apple's cases for a long time.

01:20:54   And I use the silicone cases, which I find add a sufficient level of grip, the silicone

01:20:59   cases that Apple make.

01:21:01   I used the 11 case on the iPhone 6 and 6s from Apple and loved it.

01:21:07   But I was happy to get rid of it when I went to the 7 with the jet black.

01:21:12   Because now I can touch the edges of the phone again.

01:21:17   Gaane asks, "Does iOS 11 on iPad have keyboard shortcuts related to multitasking or is it

01:21:24   still touch only?"

01:21:26   Jason?

01:21:27   I don't understand this question because command tab has always been a keyboard shortcut related

01:21:36   to app switching, I guess.

01:21:38   So if you mean very specifically like can you pick an app and put it into a place with

01:21:46   keyboard shortcuts, no, you can't do that.

01:21:50   I was trying to imagine this.

01:21:51   like Mission Control on the Mac doesn't have keyboard shortcuts either, right? So I could

01:22:00   imagine having a system-wide keyboard shortcut to like show and hide the slide-over window.

01:22:06   I think that would be kind of fun.

01:22:08   But there isn't a slide-over window on 11, right? It makes sense on 10.

01:22:12   Sure there is. Sure there's a slide-over window. I mean slide-over is still there.

01:22:15   Oh, sorry. I know what you mean. Yeah, no, I didn't, I know what you're talking about.

01:22:17   I was thinking of the app switcher. Slide-over is when the little app peeks in from the side.

01:22:21   Yeah, right. So I can imagine doing a keyboard shortcut and having slideover pop over and then dismissing it and all of that.

01:22:28   But in terms of like, I would like a keyboard shortcut to go into the multitasking view, for example.

01:22:39   I think that would be useful. There are some things they could do, but a lot of it's not practical.

01:22:47   Phil is asking, I have upgraded an Air 2 to a 10.5 inch iPad Pro. The Pro attracts more

01:22:54   fingerprints and it's harder to clean. Do you find this to be the case? Yes. So the

01:22:59   iPad Pro's screens, the coating on them is different because of the pencil and whatever

01:23:05   the coating is, whatever it is that they did to it, one of the downsides is that the Pro

01:23:10   line attracts significantly more fingerprints to the screen. You find that to be the case

01:23:15   as well? I can't compare. I haven't used a non-pro for so long that I can't say, but

01:23:23   there's, I don't know, like I said, in bright sunlight there's a lot of fingerprints that

01:23:30   are visible, but I can't compare it, so I can't tell you. From my memory of when I changed

01:23:36   initially, I can say that this is the case. Those, especially the bigger the screen, the

01:23:42   you can see as well because there's more there but I do find that to be the case.

01:23:47   And finally today John asks, "Do you have any suggestions for bags for the iPad Pro

01:23:52   12.9 inch?" Jason, do you have any bag other than your trusty backpack that you love?

01:23:58   I don't have a specialty bag for the iPad because I don't live my life in a way that

01:24:02   I'm just carrying an iPad around. I have lots of other bags that I use. I have a shoulder

01:24:08   a messenger bag that I use sometimes and I've got my trusty backpack so yeah, I have no

01:24:14   opinions about bags either. So take us home Myke.

01:24:17   So I have two. The Tom Bihn Restretto is a great shoulder bag, like messenger bag that

01:24:24   will fit a 12.9 inch iPad. The laptop compartment fits laptops or tablets up to 13 inches. It's

01:24:32   a great bag and I own one and I really like it. And then I will also throw in my cars

01:24:38   and the pen addict, Brad Dowdy, he has a company called NotCo and they recently made a briefcase

01:24:45   like made of a nylon material called the Laniya which will fit an iPad Pro and is great if

01:24:52   all you want to do is just carry it in your hand. You can also fit a bunch of other stuff

01:24:56   in there as well, it comes with a little small bag too but it doesn't have any straps or

01:24:59   anything so people like to carry around. So when I go to like a conference or something

01:25:03   like that. I'll put everything in my rucksack and I'll put everything in my suitcase and

01:25:09   I put the linear in there as well. So when I'm going backwards and forwards from my hotel

01:25:13   room during the day, I'll just be carrying my iPad in the kind of the briefcase and it

01:25:17   works really well for me. So they are my suggestions there.

01:25:20   Wow. That is ask Myke. People wanted answers from me today, Jason.

01:25:24   They did. They wanted all the answers from me. I can't

01:25:27   help you. I'm glad that you were here because those

01:25:29   would not have been questions that I would have picked if I was the one who had to answer

01:25:34   them.

01:25:35   What can I say? I have some wisdom to give. It's not a lot.

01:25:38   You do.

01:25:39   But I have some.

01:25:40   I don't know. You proved that you have a lot to give today with all of that. This is your

01:25:44   iPad. The iPad is on the brain. This is one of your favorite subjects. And it's coming

01:25:48   out. It's showing itself.

01:25:50   I do mull with my iPad. If you would like to suggest some questions for Ask Upgrades,

01:25:55   maybe some specific things that only Jason can answer.

01:25:58   That's not necessary.

01:25:59   The #AskUpgrade on Twitter.

01:26:02   If you'd like to find our show notes you can go to relay.fm/upgrades/146 and I would like

01:26:08   to thank Encapsular, Freshbooks and Mac Weldon for supporting the show.

01:26:13   Most of all thank you for listening as always.

01:26:15   You can find Jason online at sixcolors.com and the incomparable.com.

01:26:20   Jason hosts a selection of shows at relay.fm as well including the fantastic download

01:26:24   which you should be listening to if you're not already.

01:26:26   Jason is @jsnell on Twitter, J-S-N-E-L-L. And I am @imike, I-M-Y-K-E. We'll be back

01:26:34   next time. Until then, say goodbye, Jason Snell.

01:26:38   Keep cool, everybody. Hydrate.

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