92: WWDC 2016 Draft


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:08   from relay FM this is upgrade episode number 92 today's show is brought to you

00:00:14   by the lovely folk over at casper squarespace

00:00:17   and pingdom my name is mike hurley and i'm joined by mr jason snell hello

00:00:22   jason snell hi mike it's good to be back uh talking

00:00:25   to you last week we did our special pre-taped

00:00:27   holiday edition and we're a day late this time because you were off gallivanting around

00:00:32   Spain around Catalonia and but we're back and it's good because next week we will be

00:00:40   together in San Francisco for WWDC.

00:00:43   We sure will so that can only mean one thing today that we are going to talk about WWDC

00:00:50   rumors and expectations.

00:00:52   However dear listener we are doing something slightly different today we are going to be

00:00:56   doing a WWDC rumor draft, the first annual upgrade WWDC rumor draft.

00:01:04   Okay, sure, first annual, right.

00:01:07   The upgradeees pointed out that first annual was the right way to go because we did it

00:01:11   again.

00:01:12   So I'm going to explain that to you in just a moment about how we're going to go about

00:01:15   doing all of that today, but we do have a couple of small items of the follow-up.

00:01:21   And Jason, I believe you need to make some kind of public apology.

00:01:24   Yeah, I'm a terrible person.

00:01:26   I mentioned Les Misérables and said that it was about the French Revolution, but it

00:01:30   said after that, the fact is, I haven't seen Les Misérables as my wife pointed out this

00:01:36   morning, the 90s musical that I saw when I was in New York City was Phantom of the Opera.

00:01:41   Oh wow, that's quite an interesting mistake to make.

00:01:45   So I missed, well, it was actually about to start when I was outside the theater next

00:01:52   to the hotel that I was staying at and I was alone and was like, "I will just go in and

00:01:58   see a Broadway show for, you know, at Standing Room for some ridiculously cheap price." And

00:02:03   the show happened to be The Phantom of the Opera. But anyway, so I haven't seen Les

00:02:06   Mis and my wife was watching the Carpool Karaoke with James Corden this morning and a bunch

00:02:12   of Broadway stars because the Tony Awards are coming up and they were singing a song

00:02:15   from Les Mis and I was like, "Yeah, I don't know that song." So anyway, I got that wrong.

00:02:19   I have seen Les Mis, but I don't know enough about the history of Les Mis to have corrected

00:02:24   you.

00:02:25   It's French people. It was all pretty much just the French Revolution for like a hundred

00:02:27   years, right? Yeah? Sure.

00:02:28   I think they're still doing it.

00:02:30   I'm terrible. I don't know anything about musicals or French history. I apologize. The

00:02:36   other bit of follow-up we have, which is in the category of follow-up we're not going

00:02:40   to follow up about, which is just this news. We had some podcasting business news. We've

00:02:45   been talking a little bit about the business of podcasting the last few weeks and our friends

00:02:49   at mid-roll including Mr. Lex Friedman who was on this very show a few weeks ago bought

00:02:54   Stitcher the podcast-ish playing app for four and a half million dollars. Four and a half

00:03:03   million dollars is not a lot of money for a company that had like twelve people. Well

00:03:07   they bought it from Deezer who bought out Stitcher not too long ago Deezer is like a

00:03:11   Spotify but in Europe it's not really known in the US. And it looks like either Deezer

00:03:19   had some cash flow issues or just decided it was not a direction they want to go in.

00:03:23   And we'll talk about this and sometime down the road I think we'll revisit the business

00:03:28   and podcasting thing now is not the time but I'm intrigued by that sale price because that

00:03:33   says something to me. I'm not quite sure whether it says something about Deezer or something

00:03:39   about viewing the business model of this and deciding maybe that music discovery streaming

00:03:45   companies don't really fit with podcasts, which I would argue, or whether it says something

00:03:50   about the value of Stitcher that it was sold for a song essentially. But regardless, Midroll,

00:03:58   Lexus company, which is a podcast network and an ad sales network, is now also the owner

00:04:03   of this app that plays podcasts, although in a non-standard way where they're kind of

00:04:08   of like gobbling up your files and re-encoding them and putting ads in between them and stuff

00:04:13   like that. But it's an interesting development and you know, definitely something for us

00:04:18   to perhaps discuss with Lex at some point down the road.

00:04:21   But not now.

00:04:22   >> I want to reserve judgement on this one a little bit. I think that on paper for the

00:04:30   openness of podcasts that we've been speaking about, even when Lex was on, it seems like

00:04:35   a bad thing but I want to see what mid-roll do with it before I cast a

00:04:40   judgment but if I was gonna make a guess it would be so they're able to collect

00:04:45   more data to sell for their advertisers which we know mid-roll would like because

00:04:49   Lex told us so this gives them a way to do that we'll see how it ends up playing

00:04:54   out yeah I'm Marco and John Gruber have both reacted negatively to this which is

00:05:02   not surprising. I've never been a fan of Stitcher, but I view this and think, you know, I'm not

00:05:08   entirely sure that mid-roll isn't going to make Stitcher better because I think mid-roll

00:05:12   is less interested in Stitcher's kind of weird total control, re-encode your streams kind

00:05:18   of approach and maybe more concerned with data, yeah, with understanding the data. But

00:05:24   the bottom line is, you know, Stitcher's only a few percent of the podcast market, a small

00:05:28   percentage and their demographics. Midroll's going to be able to tell what the behavior

00:05:33   of Stitcher listeners is, but Stitcher listeners aren't like other listeners, so they're going

00:05:37   to get behavioral data about some segment of the podcast market, but that doesn't necessarily

00:05:42   mean it's behavioral data that can be portable to other parts of the podcast market. So I'm

00:05:49   also going to wait and see.



00:05:53   interest to try and attract as many podcast creators as possible into the Stitcher platform.

00:05:58   So I'm interested to see what they do with it. Right? Because as you say, they currently

00:06:03   have a specific type of person who listens in Stitcher. As opposed to the, you know,

00:06:09   all apps have their own specific types. You know, I bet Overcast skews more technology

00:06:14   show. I bet the iTunes app skews more NPR. But they're bigger, audience wise, I would

00:06:21   say than Stitcher are.

00:06:23   Oh, by far, by far, I would say.

00:06:25   So you know, it would be interesting to see what the mid-roll do. I mean, we are not on

00:06:30   Stitcher, we have never been on Stitcher at Real AFM. We just didn't like some of the

00:06:34   terms in their contract agreements that they make you sign to be as part of their platform.

00:06:41   Whilst we have signed agreements with other companies, you know, like Google and Spotify,

00:06:46   we are more comfortable with those companies and those agreements. We take it on like a

00:06:50   you know, company by company basis, we'll see what the mid-roll will do. I would be

00:06:54   interested if they're able to create a platform that is as open as you can make a platform.

00:07:00   Well, let's see. Also, I would say, and I know this seems maybe not intuitive, but,

00:07:08   you know, we were talking about NPR type, other, you know, leading professional podcasters

00:07:14   wanting more data, and mid-roll wants more data too, no doubt, because the advertisers

00:07:18   want more data and as Lex said, they want data and are being sold data that doesn't

00:07:23   even exist in some cases. But mid-roll also has been very committed to the concept that

00:07:29   we have here at Relay and that I do on The Incomparable, which is that these are ads

00:07:33   that are read by the hosts in the host voice. They have not introduced pre-taped radio ads.

00:07:40   They have not introduced a product that goes through and auto-dynamically inserts radio

00:07:47   ads in the middle of podcasts based on when you listen and where you listen. There's a

00:07:51   lot of really junky sleazy ad approaches to podcasts that are out there, and none of those

00:08:00   have been ones that I've heard Midroll espouse. So although they are a big company, you know,

00:08:05   owned by a big company, and they definitely want user data because they want to reach

00:08:09   advertisers, that's the business they're in, I'm not sure they're the ones that I'm concerned

00:08:15   about. But as Marco and John did point out quite

00:08:20   rightly, an advertising vendor owning the listening platform is a very peculiar way

00:08:28   to do things and maybe on paper isn't the best. It feels like maybe that their interests

00:08:35   would skew differently. Well, I think you could say that about Mitterl

00:08:38   in general that they are, because they came, Mitterl's story is that they came out of a

00:08:43   podcast network and they were a podcast network with their own sales team and they decided

00:08:47   to sell other podcasts. So they have Earwolf, the podcast network, and then they have Midroll,

00:08:53   which came out of Earwolf. So that is weird in and of itself, right? Because they have

00:08:58   their own podcast that they're selling ads for and they're selling ads for other podcasts,

00:09:02   including mine, including The Incomparable. They sell the ads for The Incomparable. And

00:09:06   they used to sell some ads for Relay too. And I always thought that was a little bit

00:09:10   weird and potentially a conflict of interest that they're a content provider with their

00:09:13   own slots that they're trying to sell ads into, and do they, you know, there are lots

00:09:17   of arguments there about like, are they giving the best slots and is it just sort of leftovers

00:09:21   or are they really trying to build a business that is neutral about this, but this gets

00:09:26   thrown in there too, which is like, they're trying to do a lot and it's unclear how these

00:09:31   things work together or if they should, so it'll be interesting to see.

00:09:35   I will welcome Lex Friedman back to the show.

00:09:39   Yeah, love to have him back.

00:09:41   not too distant future if he wants to talk about this. Lex, our door is open, we enjoyed

00:09:46   our last discussion, we'd love to hear what you have to say. But today we have even more

00:09:51   exciting stuff to talk about. So let me run down with you dear listener the rules of engagement

00:09:58   for the first annual upgrade WWDC draft. We have 28 rumors that have been added to a list

00:10:08   to buy me and Jason. So we've been collating this list over the last week or so. It's things

00:10:13   that we expect to happen or things that have been espoused as likely to happen. So we have

00:10:20   been adding them to a long list. We will each take turns picking from this selection until

00:10:25   we have put together our own list of 14. We ended up with 14 rumors each. And then after

00:10:32   the WWDC announcement on Monday on the keynote. We will be able to score who picked the most

00:10:38   things that ended up coming true and crown the first ever W upgrade WWDC draft winner

00:10:46   on episode 93. So that is the rules for today's draft.

00:10:51   So, incomparable does a lot of drafts and if people don't know this is like in professional

00:10:56   sports they often when people are coming out of high school or college they will all the

00:10:59   teams take turns picking the players and then they own the rights to those players and they

00:11:03   can sign them and it and then fantasy sports does that you know every year you pick who's

00:11:07   on your your football team and the incomparable we do it with silly things like television

00:11:12   characters or whatever but I'm a little uneasy about the idea that we're gonna pick a winner

00:11:18   from the draft because I don't you know I don't want to be held to a standard but apparently

00:11:23   I am going to be and also because I think feel fundamentally everybody wins when you

00:11:26   draft things. But anyway, we are going to still do that.

00:11:29   We're all winning, but there has to be one of us that will win the most. And that will

00:11:34   be Crown next time. In my opinion, there has to be a winner because then next year, the

00:11:40   Crown can be challenged. So one of us is going to win.

00:11:45   So draft picks 1-5 of the first annual upgrade WWDC draft are brought to you by Pingdom.

00:11:54   Pingdom. Do you like how I did that Jason? That's very good. That's sports. All the sports leagues

00:11:58   Are looking on with admiration at how you've integrated the advertising into the product of the product now. It's perfect

00:12:05   You can start monitoring your websites and servers today at pingdom.com/upgrade when you go there

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00:12:23   Everybody has things on the internet these days everyone and some stuff really definitely

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00:14:06   Go to Pingdom.com/upgrade for a 14-day free trial and use upgrade at checkout to get 20% off.

00:14:13   thank you so much to Pingdom for their support of the first annual upgrade WWDC draft. Now,

00:14:22   we need to decide who is going to go first, so I think we need to do some kind of coin

00:14:28   flip.

00:14:29   Okay.

00:14:30   Do you have a coin?

00:14:31   No, but I have random.org.

00:14:33   Why don't you go to random.org?

00:14:36   Random.org is the place you go whenever you need a random number chosen for you at random.

00:14:41   uh... i'm going to pick uh... i'm gonna pick a number do you want evens or odds

00:14:45   i'll take odds

00:14:47   and the number is forty nine you get to go first excellent so

00:14:51   my first pick

00:14:53   for the upgrade w_w_t_c_ draft is

00:14:57   first annual

00:14:58   first annual thank you so much for reminding me

00:15:01   i'm gonna say that OS X will be renamed

00:15:05   Mac OS

00:15:08   Oh Myke, that was going to be my pick.

00:15:10   I know it was. That's why I picked it first.

00:15:12   Boo.

00:15:12   Because I really feel like this is going to happen.

00:15:15   This is a Jason was right.

00:15:16   I, to my memory, you were the first person to mention this.

00:15:19   And I have been along this bandwagon with you.

00:15:24   This seems so obvious now.

00:15:26   Just the fact that we have Mac OS

00:15:32   and an X, right, for the 10.

00:15:34   And then you have the lineup of everything else,

00:15:36   which has got some kind of conformity in style and in the way that it's written. You know,

00:15:42   like they all look the same, they're all written the same, they all sound the same, they all

00:15:46   have the lowercase stuff, it's all one word. It just seems strange that we have one of

00:15:50   them out of the four or five now that there is that's not in this style. It just seems

00:15:56   so obvious that they're going to do it.

00:15:58   Tim: Yeah, so I've got some questions, I've got some follow-up questions for you that

00:16:03   We'll get into the details. It's your pick. You got it. You get all of the variations

00:16:06   here. But I have a couple questions for you. One is, do you think it will be Mac OS, lower

00:16:10   case M-A-C, capital OS, one word, or do you think it will be Mac OS, sort of keeping the

00:16:15   capital M and the space? That's question number one. What do you think there?

00:16:18   - Lower case one word. - Okay, interesting.

00:16:21   - Otherwise, what's the point? - Well, I'm not, well, I mean, do they need

00:16:25   to adhere quite that closely? They're almost never listed together. Mac OS with a capital

00:16:30   as the name. Also Mac is the product. The Mac is a product in a way that TV or i or

00:16:39   watch isn't quite the product. It's Apple watch, Apple TV, and iPhone, iPad. So I think

00:16:49   they could call it Mac OS and capitalize it and maybe put the space in. I think it's a

00:16:55   possibility. Although again, maybe this is just me denying.

00:17:00   I have to say, when I look at people talking about this and saying this, the people that

00:17:05   are like "It's gonna be Mac OS, capital M with a space" are the people that used Mac

00:17:09   OS before. I think that there is an element of like, not wanting to let go.

00:17:14   The odds, I mean, the odds that people like me and Grouper are going to just defy it if

00:17:21   it's called Mac OS, one word with a lowercase m, and just continue, just begin to call it

00:17:25   Mac OS again with capital M and a space. I'd say those odds are pretty good.

00:17:32   Well it's like the fact that we call them iPads and not like a bushel of iPad or whatever

00:17:38   it is.

00:17:39   iPad devices.

00:17:40   Yeah, the Apple one is the call.

00:17:41   iPad branded tablet devices.

00:17:43   But I do think though that you would end up eventually giving in because it is the product

00:17:48   name like you're giving it like a different name and not the product but like you know

00:17:51   it is the name of the OS. Like it might be for a while, like you just hold on tight to

00:17:56   what you feel is right, but eventually we're gonna have to let go of it.

00:18:00   - Okay, so the next question I have for you is, what is the version number? Is it Mac OS

00:18:12   10.12? Is it Mac OS 11? Or as somebody on Twitter pointed out to me today, is it Mac

00:18:19   OS 12 because it's currently 10.11 so you'd go 10.9, 10.10, 10.11, 12. What do you think?

00:18:29   No, really I don't think they're gonna put a number like in the marketing. Well I mean

00:18:35   they do iOS 9 right? Yeah I just don't think they're gonna do it with Mac OS. Are they

00:18:40   gonna stick with California place names? Yeah. So you think it's gonna be Mac OS Monterey?

00:18:46   Yeah. There will be a number, right, that it has.

00:18:49   Sure, it might say version 11.0 or even version 10.12 in the about box, but you're saying

00:18:56   no marketing name. No marketing name.

00:18:58   No marketing number. Yeah.

00:18:59   Because I think it's not important. And I also think that once, I think next year.

00:19:05   Good argument. I think it's not important.

00:19:07   Now, they've shown that the number's not important now because they've gone to 10, 11, right?

00:19:11   Like the number doesn't mean anything anymore. But it is important for, they use it in marketing

00:19:15   for all of their other operating systems. So if they're truly going to be parallel,

00:19:18   would they not use a number? Right, so this is my other part, is I think

00:19:21   that iOS 11 will not be called 11. I think they're going to go to 10 and that's it.

00:19:26   Because I think once you get to a certain point, then the numbers just get too high.

00:19:31   So I think they'll go to iOS 10 and then they'll change the name.

00:19:35   Well you know, Android uses their lettering scheme with a clever name, and the Mac has

00:19:41   just had these nicknames. Would iOS end up with nicknames or would they, would they,

00:19:46   are they just going to call it iOS and not even talk about the new iOS for 2016?

00:19:51   I think they'll give it a name like they did with the California place names. Because they

00:19:55   came up with that, right? They came up with the California place name thing kind of for

00:19:58   no reason. Like they just wanted to give a name to OS X because the numbers were getting

00:20:03   ridiculous I think. So, you know, they were done with the cats and they were just like,

00:20:07   Let's not go to numbers. Let's actually go and give it some names

00:20:09   So I think they'll either do that for iOS and I'm still holding on to Apple OS at some point

00:20:15   Where I think that they will just converge them

00:20:19   Anyway, not like the OS is but I think they'll converge the branding in some way

00:20:22   I don't think it's gonna remain iOS forever, but that's my own weird little pet thought

00:20:27   But I do think that this will be Mac OS and then whatever Golden Gate or something, you know

00:20:33   I have no idea about the name. I don't know enough about California

00:20:36   - So I have a little, I also have a thing

00:20:38   I'm gonna put out there that again is not a,

00:20:41   I would say not a pickable thing.

00:20:43   So we're gonna roll it in here

00:20:45   to the first pick in the draft,

00:20:46   which is, I still wonder and maybe it's not this year,

00:20:51   but I still feel like it's possible

00:20:53   that Apple is going to seriously de-emphasize

00:20:56   their versioning and make it about,

00:21:00   and then, you know, because the versioning is,

00:21:02   I think not very valuable for them for marketing reasons,

00:21:05   It's good to communicate to developers,

00:21:07   but given that all OS updates are free

00:21:10   and they can push out OS updates all the time,

00:21:13   and now they can push out betas for users

00:21:17   as well as developers all the time.

00:21:20   I'm starting to wonder if we will get,

00:21:24   maybe not this year, maybe next year,

00:21:25   to a point where this, I mean, what you said about,

00:21:28   maybe the numbers don't matter,

00:21:30   like that's the point where the numbers really don't matter

00:21:33   'cause we're not gonna even talk about it anymore.

00:21:35   It's continuously going, we're gonna keep doing releases

00:21:38   and you can expect that there's gonna be

00:21:40   a milestone release that happens

00:21:42   that gets announced at WWDC,

00:21:44   but what it is doesn't matter

00:21:47   because we'll also be doing releases in the fall

00:21:50   and in the winter and in the spring or whatever, right?

00:21:54   So I think that's a question is,

00:21:55   I feel like whether they come out and say it or not,

00:21:58   that this is maybe a direction that they're going

00:22:02   to just more continual development of the OS,

00:22:05   making it less about like, we're gonna make big news.

00:22:08   It's also bad for them.

00:22:09   I think it's terrible.

00:22:11   I know it's necessary because you have to talk

00:22:14   to the developers and everybody,

00:22:15   everything Apple says is covered,

00:22:17   but I'm not sure it's really in Apple's best interest

00:22:20   to tell the public about these awesome features

00:22:23   that aren't available for three months or four months.

00:22:27   Like it's much, people don't,

00:22:30   They'll forget by the time they come out.

00:22:32   And all you'll do is frustrate them.

00:22:34   They're like, "Oh, the iPhone does this thing.

00:22:36   Oh, not yet.

00:22:37   Oh, okay."

00:22:38   So it'll be interesting to see in general.

00:22:40   Apple is, they're steering the ship, right?

00:22:43   And we don't know quite where they're going yet,

00:22:44   but it'll be interesting to see.

00:22:46   And I'm with you.

00:22:48   Thank you for picking the Jason was right pick.

00:22:50   Back OS.

00:22:53   - What's your first pick?

00:22:55   - All right, for my first pick in the WWDC draft,

00:23:00   I've got a bunch of choices here.

00:23:02   So part of the draft strategy is that you wanna pick things

00:23:06   that the other person might pick like you did.

00:23:08   Even if there's something that you like better,

00:23:11   it's not available for you if somebody else picks it.

00:23:13   So I'm gonna go with

00:23:17   iPad multitasking improvements.

00:23:22   - Guess what number that was on my list?

00:23:25   - Two.

00:23:25   too. Ha ha ha. In your face, Harley! You got me, you got me. So, so, so iPad multitasking

00:23:36   improvements, not iPhone multitasking, that one's still on the board, but iPad multitasking.

00:23:45   So last year the iPad got some love from the iOS update for the first time in a long time,

00:23:53   all these multitasking features that are not available on the iPhone, they're only available

00:23:56   on the iPad. And when they announced it, only the iPad Air 2 existed and could support them.

00:24:01   We're like, "Oh, well, okay." And I bought an iPad Air 2 because I wanted to have something

00:24:05   that could run this thing. Well, now we've got an iPad Pro and another iPad Pro. And

00:24:11   even the iPad Mini, the new iPad Mini can do this. But the iPad Pro makes this even

00:24:15   more interesting. But it was a first take last year, so lots of stuff could be better.

00:24:21   the app picker could be better.

00:24:23   The ability to perhaps connect a couple of apps

00:24:27   so that they can run, they're paired together

00:24:30   and they open simultaneously.

00:24:32   Right now, the right side app is always the same

00:24:34   until you manually change it to be something else.

00:24:37   There's no drag and drop,

00:24:39   which is understandable for version one,

00:24:40   but wouldn't it be great if you could drag data

00:24:42   from the left side to the right side or vice versa.

00:24:44   And the ability to possibly either run the same app

00:24:50   into in split screen or update some apps

00:24:55   so that they're essentially running themselves

00:24:57   in split screen, however you wanna cut that,

00:24:58   but like be able to have two Safari windows open at once,

00:25:01   wouldn't that be nice instead of having like fake apps

00:25:04   that fake out Safari just so that you can run them

00:25:07   in the sidebar.

00:25:08   So those are my highlights, but just overall,

00:25:13   I'm gonna say more better multitasking features, please.

00:25:18   - I think the reason that this is for me a sure winner

00:25:23   is the way that iOS and the iPad Pro

00:25:28   has started to make serious inroads

00:25:30   into people doing more work on iOS.

00:25:32   I think that that,

00:25:33   this is something that's definitely out in the press now,

00:25:37   so I think people are focusing on it more,

00:25:39   more and more people are doing this.

00:25:40   Me and you, obviously, and so many of the other people

00:25:43   that we know are using the iPad Pro more and more,

00:25:46   And I believe it is because fundamentally

00:25:49   the changes made to iOS 9 to improve

00:25:52   the iPad's ability to do stuff.

00:25:55   And I think that having it been a year

00:25:58   since people have kind of got to grips

00:26:00   with the way this works, I think that we can so easily

00:26:04   see ways that it should be improved.

00:26:06   I have high hopes that Apple have seen some real

00:26:11   big changes that can be made here.

00:26:13   just to make one thing smoother, you know,

00:26:17   the ability of finding applications

00:26:19   to launch in the split screen should be a lot smoother,

00:26:21   as you say, but also to add additional functionality

00:26:24   like drag and drop and stuff like that.

00:26:26   I think that this is gonna be something

00:26:28   that is gonna end up being a big point here.

00:26:32   I think we're gonna see some really, really great stuff

00:26:34   from iPad multitasking.

00:26:35   So that is a very solid pick, Mr. Snell.

00:26:38   - Thank you.

00:26:38   - My second draft pick, I'm going back to the Mac.

00:26:42   - Oh, good, just like Apple did way back when.

00:26:44   - Exactly, OS X will get Siri support.

00:26:47   - Okay, this is a rumor.

00:26:50   So you're getting some points on the board here

00:26:55   by going with the reported rumor.

00:26:58   So that's all a good draft strategy for the win, yeah.

00:27:02   - Yeah, I'm going for the points here.

00:27:04   But it seems like an obvious one.

00:27:06   I think, I expect that your next pick

00:27:09   will be probably something Siri related.

00:27:11   I think Siri is gonna be one, okay interesting.

00:27:14   I think Siri's gonna be one of the big players

00:27:17   at WWDC this year.

00:27:19   And I think OS X getting Siri support

00:27:21   is gonna be something that happens mainly because

00:27:25   what else are you gonna put in OS X or Mac OS

00:27:28   that you can actually put on the side of a box

00:27:30   if there was such a thing to say that this is what

00:27:33   this OS has and Siri support is one of the last things left

00:27:36   I think for Mac OS to get to make it

00:27:41   as well-rounded as it can be in the Apple ecosystem.

00:27:44   Every other Apple device has it, the Mac does not.

00:27:47   So I think it's time.

00:27:48   - I agree, although, I mean,

00:27:51   so I wrote a thing about this yesterday

00:27:53   on six colors actually about,

00:27:55   we're doing this week are like wish lists of stuff,

00:27:58   Dan and I are for the, for the, for WWC,

00:28:01   we're doing our wish list this week.

00:28:03   And the theme that I came up with actually

00:28:05   for a lot of the Mac improvements

00:28:07   and Siri was the best example

00:28:08   is I want iOS features when they come to the Mac,

00:28:13   I want them to be Mac features.

00:28:16   And this is the question mark I have is,

00:28:18   Siri on the Mac, what is that?

00:28:21   Is it a thing that lives in the menu bar

00:28:23   and in Notification Center and is walled off

00:28:25   from the rest of the system?

00:28:26   Because some of the stuff that they brought to the Mac,

00:28:28   like Find My Friends, for example,

00:28:30   there is no Find My Friends app on the Mac.

00:28:33   You can add a widget to Notification Center,

00:28:35   it lives there, that's it.

00:28:37   It's like, it's just walled off.

00:28:38   It doesn't interact with the Mac in any way.

00:28:40   You can't do anything with it.

00:28:41   You can view it.

00:28:43   It is an iOS feature imported, but walled off,

00:28:47   in a little black box.

00:28:48   So that's my question about Siri is,

00:28:51   is Siri gonna let me do useful things on the Mac

00:28:53   that are like Mac things?

00:28:54   Or is it just gonna be a replication of Siri from iOS

00:28:58   that also is available on my Mac?

00:29:02   Because I'm a lot less excited about it if that's all it is.

00:29:05   I get why they might do it that way.

00:29:07   and it would check the box, but it's like, I can,

00:29:09   and for years have been able to actually on the Mac

00:29:11   for like more than a decade,

00:29:13   for a lot more than a decade,

00:29:14   you've been able to do some rudimentary voice control

00:29:17   on the Mac.

00:29:18   And I'm happy for them to check that out

00:29:19   because it was really rudimentary,

00:29:21   but that voice control stuff let you kick off scripts

00:29:25   and you know, automator actions and stuff like that.

00:29:27   And I want that.

00:29:29   I want the Siri on the Mac to be able to do stuff

00:29:33   with my Mac and interact with the apps on my Mac.

00:29:36   and let me customize things and have them be triggered.

00:29:40   And I think that's an open question

00:29:43   about whether it will do any of those things

00:29:45   that are like fundamentally Mac things,

00:29:47   or whether it's really just gonna be a mirror

00:29:50   of Siri on iOS kind of locked off and on the side,

00:29:53   maybe with some support and a couple of Apple apps.

00:29:56   - I think that if Apple was just going to make

00:30:04   this the basic Siri that we already have and it not be OS X flavored in some way, then

00:30:11   why did they not do it before? You know, it would seem like such a wasted opportunity

00:30:16   and kind of pointless if all you do is just be like, "It can check sports scores. Is

00:30:21   that what you need?" You know, I just feel like it would be a bit of a weird choice,

00:30:29   know unless it gets feature parity with whatever new Siri might come and I'm sure we'll talk

00:30:36   about that in a bit. So you want to pick your next one?

00:30:40   Yeah let's do it. I am going to also shamelessly pick something that's been rumored and therefore

00:30:48   needs to happen and that is a new MacBook Pro.

00:30:53   Ooh interesting. So you're going with the hardware.

00:30:57   Yeah I'm going with the hardware.

00:30:58   there have been people as well like in the last few days saying no hardware.

00:31:04   People always say no hardware at WWDC and sometimes there's no hardware at WWDC. I'll

00:31:07   remind you the last major update to the MacBook Pro, the retina MacBook Pro happened at guess

00:31:14   when WWDC.

00:31:17   Yep, and the Mac Pro right?

00:31:20   But it was like four years ago that the MacBook Pro, I think the retina MacBook Pro came out.

00:31:23   It's been a while. It could get thinner and lighter and faster. Somebody was upset with

00:31:30   me when I said that on Twitter yesterday. They're like, "Oh, but I don't want that terrible

00:31:34   MacBook One keyboard." It's like, "Well, you're not going to get that." None of the rumors

00:31:37   say that. The existence of the Magic Keyboard suggests that even Apple is well aware that

00:31:41   the MacBook keyboard may be a little bit pushing it for their pro users, let's say. But I do

00:31:46   think it could be thinner and lighter and a little more in line with the MacBook and

00:31:50   the MacBook Air in terms of being not as thin as that but thinner and lighter. Thunderbolt

00:31:55   3 which is also USB-C compatibility. The rumor is that there's that screen, the OLED touchscreen

00:32:08   above the keyboard, that's a rumor too so that might be in there. I'm taking a wait

00:32:14   and see attitude to that. I am skeptical of a touch device on a keyboard because I don't

00:32:20   look at my keyboard most of the time, and so forcing my vision down there is not my

00:32:24   favorite idea, then again it solves the zombie arms problem, right? Which is that Apple firmly

00:32:28   believes nobody should be reaching out and holding their arm out and interacting on a

00:32:33   Mac screen, that the whole idea is that you should be interacting down. There's the two

00:32:38   perpendicular surfaces and they want you down on the keyboard and the mouse, and so if you

00:32:43   put a screen down there, that would be a better place to interact. And I don't think they're

00:32:47   wrong about that. So we'll have to see the details of it, but it's been a while, it's

00:32:52   time for some hardware revisions, and just when you say "oh, but it's a developer conference,"

00:32:59   they, you know, it's always about software announcements because it's not a major product

00:33:04   launch, it's a developer conference. Guess what is a fact about developers? 100% of Apple

00:33:12   platform developers develop on the Mac today,

00:33:15   because you have to use a Mac to develop iOS apps.

00:33:20   You have to, you have to.

00:33:22   So that's a great audience to give pro,

00:33:27   to make a pro announcement to

00:33:28   and have them whoop and holler.

00:33:29   And the time is right.

00:33:30   So I'm gonna throw it out there.

00:33:32   I'm gonna, yes, I will take the risk

00:33:33   that perhaps it won't happen because I think it will.

00:33:36   And I think, and I'm excited about it 'cause it's time.

00:33:39   It's past time.

00:33:40   the Mac Pro and MacBook Pro both are long in the tooth, so I'm gonna say new MacBook

00:33:44   Pros, that's my pick.

00:33:45   I'm fully on board with you, I think we're gonna see new MacBook Pros on Monday. I don't

00:33:50   think they're gonna ship Monday.

00:33:52   No.

00:33:53   I mean, 'cause there's the question of if it does have this new screen in it, if it

00:33:57   does have Touch ID in it, what about OS X, which doesn't support these things?

00:34:03   So they talked about that on ATP a couple weeks ago, and they were way too skeptical

00:34:07   about it because the fact is when new features like the Retina MacBook Pro, in fact, when

00:34:11   new features are rolled out on hardware, there's an interim OS update that supports it and

00:34:16   then there's the proper, you know, and then it has to run that build and then eventually

00:34:20   there's another bug release build that comes after that and then it can run that build

00:34:23   and then eventually the full version comes that fall. But I don't think that would be

00:34:28   if they have a product ready to ship with Touch ID, let's say, it'll ship with a version

00:34:32   of OS X that has the Touch ID stuff in there and that's just how it'll be. They won't hold

00:34:36   that for the fall and hold the hardware, they'll just roll it in. That's how they do it. They've

00:34:41   done that since time immemorial. They've done that. So that's what they'll do. Now they

00:34:46   may do, you're exactly right, this may not even be one of those "it's shipping now" or

00:34:50   "it's shipping Friday" or "it's shipping next Friday." It may be "it starts shipping in

00:34:54   July" or "it starts shipping later this summer." That totally could be the case, because that

00:35:01   product, the existing MacBook Pro is so old that if they have a month even where they're

00:35:07   getting those out the door and the new ones coming in, they'll be fine. They'll be fine.

00:35:12   All right, my next pick then. I'm going all in on Siri now. Siri API.

00:35:19   All right.

00:35:21   Again, another thing long overdue. I think a Siri API is something that we should be

00:35:27   seeing now this you know what was it the was it the iPhone 4s that introduced

00:35:35   Siri yes a long time it's been around and I think that there has been enough

00:35:41   chatter in the right places to suggest that we're gonna see something no I I

00:35:47   have absolutely no idea what this is gonna look like I know what I want it to

00:35:51   look like you know like I want it to just be Siri controlling applications I

00:35:56   developers to have a strong API that they can pick from specific tasks that Siri is able to do.

00:36:01   Right, so start relatively small. I'm reminded of the when multitasking was first introduced,

00:36:07   right? It could do like those six things. I'd be totally fine if Siri could do like a small

00:36:12   subset of things in applications, but they're things that you would really want it to be doing

00:36:17   to start with and then they can build out from there. I have no idea what could happen with

00:36:22   Siri I think there's gonna be big Siri changes that bring the API along with it

00:36:26   and puts it on OS X but I have my fingers crossed I am definitely in the

00:36:32   camp that WWDC 2016 the big thing that comes out of it is Siri 2.0. I hope so I

00:36:40   think for all the reasons detailed previously including on this show I

00:36:45   think we're all waiting for the next leap by Siri and what we've seen is

00:36:49   incremental stuff with Siri.

00:36:51   And they do keep adding features,

00:36:54   but it doesn't feel like Siri is appreciably different

00:36:58   and better than it was when it was introduced.

00:37:00   It's incrementally better, but it needs to up its game.

00:37:05   I think everybody feels that given all the announcements

00:37:06   from Google and what Amazon is doing.

00:37:08   And I hope we see that.

00:37:10   And the API is a part of that, right?

00:37:12   Being able to, one of the great things

00:37:13   about the Amazon service is that it has this out,

00:37:17   It has this hatch that is the external triggers,

00:37:22   they're called skills.

00:37:23   And that's huge because then even if it's not native

00:37:27   and the interactions are not as fresh and friendly

00:37:31   as they are, if they're native to built by Amazon,

00:37:34   you can get out of it and do stuff

00:37:37   and build your own connections.

00:37:40   And that's a huge deal.

00:37:42   So if Siri is able to connect to iOS apps or web services

00:37:46   and basically you've got a third party story for Siri,

00:37:50   I think that could be a huge part

00:37:52   of making it a better product.

00:37:53   - I agree completely.

00:37:55   Jason, you're number three.

00:37:56   - All right, so I'm going to choose,

00:37:58   this is a little bit, again,

00:38:00   you've gotten in my head a little bit

00:38:02   about wanting to win this,

00:38:05   which is making my choices a little bit more practical

00:38:10   and a little less wacky.

00:38:11   I guess I'll save the wacky for later.

00:38:13   - There's a little wacky in this list.

00:38:15   We're gonna get to it.

00:38:16   So with my third pick, I'm gonna pick new 3D Touch actions

00:38:20   and functionality for the iPhone.

00:38:22   Similar to my iPad multitasking argument,

00:38:28   I'm gonna say 3D Touch was introduced last year.

00:38:31   So what we're seeing is a first take on 3D Touch.

00:38:35   And it's been a year and oftentimes the first take

00:38:40   is something you can get out the door that's functional.

00:38:43   I wrote an article about how I thought 3D Touch

00:38:45   and actually Force Touch on the Mac are kind of not quite right that they need

00:38:48   to be a little more central. I hope we see that from Apple, a new kind of

00:38:55   global approach to how you should handle 3D Touch going forward on iOS, but at the

00:39:01   very least what I want is I want to see some forward progress, some new actions.

00:39:06   I want anything that looks like it should reasonably be 3D Touchable should

00:39:11   be. I'm looking at you Control Center, right? Control Center is the one that really kills

00:39:17   me. It's like it's got a whole bunch of little icons there that you should be able to press

00:39:20   on with 3D Touch and get a shortcut to a specific feature of the, you know, of whatever app

00:39:26   is sitting there. And you can't. It just doesn't support those. So 3D Touch in more places,

00:39:32   more functional, more customization, and I'm holding out hope a little broader kind of

00:39:38   that Apple provides themselves and to developers saying here's how we want everybody to treat

00:39:44   3D touch so that it becomes an integral part of the iPhone experience because it's just

00:39:49   not there yet.

00:39:50   Yeah and it's gonna have to remain iPhone for now.

00:39:53   I'm not in the camp of thinking that 3D touch and long touch should be the same thing.

00:39:57   I think they have to be different things and Apple just needs to work out how they put

00:40:01   it in all their devices.

00:40:03   I think combining those two things doesn't help.

00:40:05   doesn't make it a thing, they may as well have just had right-click long touch a long

00:40:09   time ago, like, but they didn't do that, I think it's right to kind of split them up.

00:40:13   >> Yeah, I think they need to find a gesture that will work on non-3D touch devices that

00:40:20   is the equivalent, and so that everybody can count on it, and 3D touch isn't put in this

00:40:24   sort of sideline of "nice to have, but never essential", and if that's long-press, then

00:40:30   I'm fine with it, because I think that's the problem with, fundamentally with both Force

00:40:34   and 3D Touch is as long as you can't count on it being everywhere and that'll be a long

00:40:40   time if you don't have an equivalent, what you're doing is you're making it optional

00:40:45   and when it's optional it's a lot less useful.

00:40:48   All right, so my next pick is an Apple Music revamp. I think that WWDC is the wrong place

00:40:57   to do this but they did it last time.

00:41:02   Why change now?

00:41:03   Yeah, it's been a year. I don't think they're going to spend a lot of time on it this time.

00:41:07   I think they have a very busy WWDC as it is, but I think we're going to see a few slides

00:41:13   of this is some changes that we're making to Apple Music, and then I think they'll just

00:41:18   move on from there. I don't think we're going to see a lot to it, but I think we are going

00:41:22   to see some news about it.

00:41:23   Okay, yeah, I mean, I would hope so. I'm holding out hope that since it's taking the raps off

00:41:32   of new OS stuff that we may see, yeah, some screenshots of what Apple Music looks like

00:41:39   now. Again, same argument, right? It's sort of like year two. How did you rethink this

00:41:43   now that it's out in the world? What does that look like in iOS? What does that look

00:41:46   like on the Mac? Will we see changes to stuff on the Mac, too? So are you, does this, does

00:41:53   this, Apple Music, is this about the services, is this about the iOS app? What exactly does

00:41:58   this cover? Well I was thinking mainly iOS but I think that it's gonna be some

00:42:04   changes to the service. They might be ready to announce some kind of video

00:42:09   stuff in there because there's more and more of this happening. Didn't they just sign

00:42:15   something for a designer for some fashion coverage or something yesterday?

00:42:19   Right. I think we might start to see some details about how Apple Music is going

00:42:23   to integrate more video content and that might be the end of Kinect because they

00:42:28   need to tap. That detail might get you bonus points depending on what

00:42:32   gets announced so it's good it's good for you to have the bonus points in there.

00:42:36   All right I want to go next. Wow I'm gonna say I'm gonna I'm gonna go out a

00:42:47   little bit out on a limb with this one because I think it will be it's a little

00:42:55   risky but I think I wanna I want to pick it it's developer tools on the iPad Pro

00:43:04   oh that was one of mine in there and I believe very strongly in this one I

00:43:11   don't want to say full Xcode because it may not be but I feel like they've got

00:43:17   an iPad Pro we've been saying for years that you know one of the milestones of a

00:43:23   platform coming into its own, maturing, is that you can develop for the platform on the

00:43:28   platform. And the fact is iOS is not something you can develop on an iOS device. You have

00:43:33   to develop it on a Mac. So I think Apple wants to get there. There have been rumors that

00:43:39   people in Cupertino on the developer tools team have iPad Pros. And with the iPad Pro,

00:43:48   especially the big one, the 12.9,

00:43:51   you could totally develop software on that thing.

00:43:54   So I wanna see that.

00:43:56   Now, maybe what we'll see is a light version

00:43:58   or somebody suggested Swift based,

00:44:01   maybe like playgrounds and things like that,

00:44:03   that's something that's light.

00:44:04   I would like to see Xcode for iPad,

00:44:06   even if it is limited in what it's capable of doing,

00:44:10   I would love to see Xcode on the iPad Pro.

00:44:12   So since this is a developer conference

00:44:15   and I feel like Apple's got the pieces in place now

00:44:17   where it's got devices legitimately powerful enough,

00:44:19   and screens legitimately big enough in the case of the 12.9,

00:44:23   that I think they could do it.

00:44:24   So I wanna see it.

00:44:25   I wanna see developer tools on the iPad Pro.

00:44:28   - I think you're right.

00:44:30   I also think that whatever it is, it will be Swift only.

00:44:34   For like it's a waste of their time and effort

00:44:37   to go with anything else.

00:44:39   This is obviously what Apple believe

00:44:41   is gonna be the future.

00:44:42   If they're building something new,

00:44:44   I think they may as well just go all Swift on it

00:44:45   just wait for people to catch up if they want to.

00:44:50   That works, right? I mean, I think people complain because people complain

00:44:53   about everything, but, you know, but the details, yeah, there

00:44:58   will be some details that will be interesting, but I want it to be,

00:45:01   I want to be there, and I think some, I think there will be an iPad Pro

00:45:05   developer story, so that's how I'm gonna, I'm gonna put it, yeah.

00:45:10   and my last pick in this round will be for a new...

00:45:16   Okay, that's not how drafts work, but okay.

00:45:18   That's... it's a round sponsored by Pingdom.

00:45:21   Yeah, this is... yes, that's true, okay.

00:45:23   Will be a new Apple Watch home screen design.

00:45:27   So, saying goodbye to the honeycomb.

00:45:30   Alright, that was on my top picks list, so good job there. Way to go.

00:45:34   I think that time has proven that that is just bad design.

00:45:39   The tiny icons that spool off into the distance that are impossible to move

00:45:46   around on the device or in the app consistently,

00:45:51   the kind of shrink and grow whilst it looks really good in a demo is incredibly

00:45:58   hard to use.

00:46:01   The icons being so small and being so close to each other makes them incredibly hard to

00:46:06   pick what you're looking for on the run.

00:46:09   I just think that time has shown that that was not the best way to try and display the

00:46:15   type of information Apple's looking to display.

00:46:18   They want to continue with apps, which they definitely do, because that's what people

00:46:23   expect on devices now.

00:46:26   I think that they are going to have to, and they will, do something to change the way

00:46:31   the hub screen looks and is presented.

00:46:34   >> MATT STEVENSON Yeah, yeah.

00:46:36   I fully endorse this.

00:46:38   I think the big—we've broken it up into a few little bits here—but the big question

00:46:46   for the Apple Watch is how proud is Apple of its first conception of the Apple Watch

00:46:54   and the WatchOS?

00:46:56   And how willing is it to, two years almost after they announced it, how willing is it

00:47:02   to accept that it, that they missed, they missed some things.

00:47:07   They didn't get it right outside of the box.

00:47:09   Because I feel very strongly as an Apple watch user, as somebody who uses it every day and

00:47:14   likes it, that there are some things about it that are just wrong, that they blew it.

00:47:19   They didn't know they had this initial, they took a shot.

00:47:22   It didn't work.

00:47:23   The home screen is a good example of it.

00:47:25   terrible. So we'll see. WatchOS 3, right? Like, how much do they rethink the Apple

00:47:32   Watch and how much do they like double down and be like "No, you're gonna get to

00:47:36   like it. You're gonna, you're gonna, the honeycomb, you will embrace the honeycomb."

00:47:40   Right? And I hope they don't. I really hope they don't because that, nothing

00:47:44   would make me less enthusiastic as an Apple Watch user than Apple coming out

00:47:52   at WWDC and saying that they think the Apple Watch is fine.

00:47:56   Yeah.

00:47:57   Because it's not.

00:47:58   Because we, you know, we are on record as really loving these devices, but they are

00:48:02   imperfect as you know, as many things are.

00:48:04   And if, and if Apple doubles down on some of these imperfections, that would be upsetting.

00:48:09   Right.

00:48:10   Fix the problem, fix the things that are getting in the way of your product being great.

00:48:15   Because those of us who believe that it could be great and that hardware is not the only

00:48:19   problem here, the software and some of the interface conceptions just are in the way

00:48:24   of the product. We'll see. I mean, that's about personalities, right? I don't think

00:48:29   that's even about technical capability. That's like, are you willing to change some of your

00:48:32   assumptions from two years ago about the Apple Watch? We'll see. But I really hope you're

00:48:37   right about this one, Ethan, if it gives you points. And I'm going to sit in that keynote

00:48:42   now and I'm going to be like, "Oh, that's a mic choice. Boo, boo, boo."

00:48:45   - They'll announce the Siri API

00:48:47   and you'll hear one man going, "Boo!"

00:48:50   - Boo!

00:48:51   (laughing)

00:48:52   - Everyone turns to you, it's like, "Myke picked it."

00:48:55   - Yeah, that's right.

00:48:55   I thought I was hoping that would be a...

00:48:57   Boy, yeah, it's gonna be a big,

00:48:59   all those Siri announcements

00:49:00   are gonna be big point totals for you.

00:49:01   But yeah, we'll see.

00:49:02   All right.

00:49:03   It's my turn.

00:49:05   And so with the last pick of this first cycle,

00:49:09   I am going, these are all big.

00:49:10   - I love how much you hate

00:49:12   that I'm rewriting the rules of drafting here.

00:49:14   - Yeah, this is Myke, Myke drafts are not.

00:49:17   - They're not canonical drafts.

00:49:19   - Non-canonical drafts, exactly right.

00:49:21   Okay, so I don't want you to make a complete run

00:49:28   on Siri related things,

00:49:30   'cause I don't wanna be the guy who's booing

00:49:32   during the entire Siri section.

00:49:35   So I'm gonna take a page from that Macworld piece

00:49:37   that I wrote, speculative Macworld piece

00:49:39   I wrote a couple of months ago,

00:49:40   and say Apple's gonna announce the Siri speaker

00:49:44   or something like it, a piece of hardware

00:49:47   with Siri integrated that sits somewhere in your house

00:49:50   and listens to what you have to say

00:49:52   and talks back to you and plays music and stuff like that.

00:49:55   I'm gonna put that down, a hardware announcement

00:49:59   for a Siri related product.

00:50:00   Now, my hesitation here is this sounds like a fall product,

00:50:04   not a summer product and not a WWDC product.

00:50:08   but I just, I want in on the Siri bandwagon.

00:50:11   So I'm gonna put a chip down on the Siri speaker

00:50:16   just in case that this is, 'cause Amazon's got theirs,

00:50:20   Google has announced theirs.

00:50:22   Does Apple come out and say, yes, us too,

00:50:25   rather than spend the entire summer,

00:50:27   even if it doesn't ship until the fall,

00:50:29   rather than spend the entire summer hearing how,

00:50:33   oh, Apple's gotta come up with a strategy for this

00:50:35   'cause Google's coming out with their thing

00:50:37   and Amazon's already out there, where is Apple?

00:50:40   That's not necessarily a great reason to introduce a product,

00:50:42   but some stranger things have happened.

00:50:44   So I'm gonna throw it out there, the Siri speaker.

00:50:47   - This is one that I've really considered as a wild card.

00:50:50   I believe maybe that something like this will exist.

00:50:53   I'm not entirely convinced.

00:50:55   - There could be a developer story here too.

00:50:57   I mean, the way that I get this into the AWDC keynote

00:51:00   is that it's part of the API discussion.

00:51:02   - Yeah, for sure.

00:51:04   - You need to not assume

00:51:05   that you're gonna have a screen to display on.

00:51:08   And your APIs that you build will not just be

00:51:11   for the iPhone and the Apple TV,

00:51:12   it will also be for this thing.

00:51:14   And part of that larger Siri 2.0 discussion.

00:51:19   That's my theory.

00:51:20   - We'll say, I think that this product might exist.

00:51:25   I don't feel like it's gonna be now.

00:51:27   I feel like it's too soon, but I'm willing to be wrong

00:51:31   because I am becoming increasingly interested

00:51:34   in these products.

00:51:35   I'm just waiting for one of them to be announced in my country.

00:51:38   - They could also decide that it's, well, yeah,

00:51:42   I mean, that's one of the great advantages

00:51:43   of what Apple's doing is that they would be able

00:51:45   to hit way more countries with this presumably over time

00:51:48   because they're much better at international.

00:51:51   Yeah, well, I mean, and they're really better at Google

00:51:53   at this, I think too, but--

00:51:55   - For sure they are, but like Google's better than Amazon.

00:51:58   - That is, everybody is better than Amazon.

00:52:01   So we may see it, the only other hesitation I've got is

00:52:05   And this is some of this is my own hope which is they could do a thing where they do

00:52:10   licensing thing and let third-party speaker manufacturers integrate Siri and I hope they don't honestly because

00:52:20   It won't go well

00:52:23   And it will still be slow and we seem like with homekit like is this even a thing that people want to do so

00:52:30   That's also a possibility but given that they bought beats

00:52:34   beats and given Apple's history and really wanting to make awesome speaker products like

00:52:40   that old iPod Hi-Fi.

00:52:42   You know this is the first time that I've ever thought about beats in the speaker discussion

00:52:47   and it makes a heck of a lot more sense. Beats know how to make speakers.

00:52:52   Right? Yeah. So maybe a Siri speaker. Maybe even an Apple Beats speaker.

00:52:59   Yeah, see I don't think they will call it the Siri speaker. I think it will be a product

00:53:04   that has Siri built into it, but it's also going to be focused around music quite heavily.

00:53:08   I made the prediction, Jason, you may have not heard the episode yet on Connected, I

00:53:13   want to just throw it out there that this product will be called iPod.

00:53:16   Oh, that's nice. The new iPod, that would be great. That's a great name for it. I love

00:53:22   the idea of reusing names for things that have some cachet but can't be used for what

00:53:28   they were anymore, so that would be great. I do think, you know, the guys, they kind

00:53:32   of laughed a little bit and then I kind of talked them around a little bit. It feels

00:53:38   unlikely based on Apple's current trends of naming, but the iPod has such great brand

00:53:44   recognition I think it would be interesting to bring it back.

00:53:47   Especially if it's about music and it lives in your home. That's pretty great.

00:53:52   So we'll see. Okay, so that's the first round of picks. The second round of picks is brought

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00:56:23   of this show.

00:56:25   Alright Jason, next up. I'm going to pick native watch apps.

00:56:30   Okay, don't we already have native watch apps? Explain what you mean by this.

00:56:34   So this will be an Apple Watch app that works completely independently of an iPhone. So

00:56:41   if there is no connection, it is able to do stuff. The way that the watch apps are working

00:56:47   right now is there's still a lot of data transfer being made between the phone and the watch,

00:56:52   right? So like, for example, if I want to add something to OmniFocus, it gets really

00:56:57   upset if it can't connect to my phone. So these will be apps that will run fast and

00:57:02   they will be able to collect data and you'll be able to do stuff with them without a phone

00:57:06   being around. Okay, I'll give you that, although, like I said, WatchOS 2 did allow watch apps

00:57:12   to pull data over Wi-Fi when they're not near their phone.

00:57:16   It doesn't work very well.

00:57:17   Well, okay, so that's why I'm going to give you this and I'm going to give you kind of,

00:57:21   I think, the catch-all category of like watch apps having more abilities to be away from

00:57:27   their iPhone, right?

00:57:28   There's like better--

00:57:29   Yeah, I should have clarified, that's a better clarification of that for sure, because as

00:57:31   you say, there are parts of it, but I don't know if this is a hardware thing or a software

00:57:36   thing, but they really don't feel like they're doing anything.

00:57:40   You know, very frequently I'll hit a button and it's like, it registers the animation,

00:57:44   but nothing happens. So I'm hoping to see some more in there.

00:57:48   Yeah, okay. I mean, really, any watch improvements would be welcome. So in fact, I'm going to

00:57:56   stick with the Apple Watch thing. I'm going to do it. And I'm going to do it. I know this

00:58:03   This is esoteric, but this is what I'm going to do.

00:58:08   My pick is the behavior of the button, the friends button on the Apple Watch will be

00:58:18   altered.

00:58:19   That's my choice.

00:58:21   Changing the behavior of the friends button because it's dumb.

00:58:25   Back to our previous conversation.

00:58:28   is the button on the Apple Watch and I never use it because all it brings up is a little

00:58:33   screen with a bunch of faces on it that I can send like quick messages to and that's

00:58:37   not how I use my Apple Watch. So I'm not saying that they won't completely abandon it, although

00:58:41   they should completely abandon that approach, but I would like it at the very least for

00:58:46   them to say, "Oh, now you can choose what the button does." It can do all of these other

00:58:50   different useful things that are way more useful in showing the ring of faces when you

00:58:55   press the button. The moment they announced that what the button did I thought that was

00:59:00   a terrible idea and more than a year of using the Apple watch has not changed my opinion

00:59:05   one bit. It's dumb.

00:59:09   I think that it is a significant thing if they do it because you know the the digital

00:59:16   touch was one of the key features of the Apple watch. So taking it away from that button

00:59:22   will again show a understanding maybe of the way people are using it. I can't imagine many

00:59:28   people are using the digital touch stuff really. You know like me and my girlfriend both have

00:59:34   Apple watches and we use it very infrequently and she's the only person in my list of like

00:59:39   12 people or my multiple lists of 12 people that I can have that I do this stuff with

00:59:44   any seriousness at all. Yeah I would be very surprised if uh... Again this is one though

00:59:52   that I can see them potentially doubling down on if they can make it better. So imagine

00:59:58   if the digital touch stuff now allowed for walkie talkie type stuff. That might be kind

01:00:04   of cool, you know, and you could use the button in that kind of way. If they doubled down

01:00:10   on the friend stuff and made it more compelling, then I would maybe be more okay with them

01:00:15   leaving the button behaviour as it is, rather than, you know, as I wouldn't be okay with

01:00:20   them doubling down on the honeycomb. Alright. Alright, next up, I am going to go with a

01:00:26   new Mac Pro. Alright. Following the exact same guidance as your thought about what the

01:00:34   MacBook Pro would look like and why it would be on stage. I think that we will see a Mac

01:00:40   Pro update. I think it will be a slide after they've announced the MacBook Pro. Right,

01:00:45   they would put up a slide and say "and also we have a new Mac Pro today, it has this,

01:00:48   this and this, moving on. That's all I think it's going to get, but I think they'll do

01:00:52   it there because if you want to get a cheer from, you know, from any audience about the

01:00:59   Mac Pro being updated, it's the only one you're going to get it from.

01:01:02   Oh yeah, I know, exactly right. If you want to do it as something other than a press release,

01:01:07   this is the audience, and again, they announced it at WWDC, so why not? Okay, I'm going to

01:01:15   go, "I'm not entirely convinced this is a feature that will be good, but I feel like

01:01:20   they're probably going to do it, especially since we've seen Google announce it as well,

01:01:23   which is bring multitasking to the iPhone." And if you saw that Google I/O keynote, they

01:01:30   showed the split screen on a big Android phone with two apps running top and bottom, and

01:01:35   I thought, "Okay, what happens when you slide up the keyboard?" Like, the keyboard is the

01:01:40   size of the app, but that said, you have big phones like the iPhone 6s Plus, #mikewasright.

01:01:48   Is there a way for Apple to make multitasking somehow useful for people with especially

01:01:54   the big phones, since they've already built it into the OS for the iPad? Would they allow

01:02:00   that? Whether it's something like a split screen or something like a virtual screen

01:02:03   where you've got it peaking it and you sort of like slide them up and down to get the

01:02:07   quick access to them, or when the keyboard slides in, it slides the one that's not active

01:02:13   off the screen temporarily while you type. Or even something like SlideOver might be

01:02:17   useful on a phone, where you could very quickly flip into this thing that you've kept pinned

01:02:23   to the side, look at something and then flip it back out, which is different and distinct,

01:02:27   I think, from regular multitasking switcher. You're somebody with an iPhone 6S Plus. What

01:02:33   What do you think? Is this a possibility and, and, or is it dumb?

01:02:37   One of the reasons I think it's possible is the landscape mode on the Plus.

01:02:43   Oh! Hmm.

01:02:44   'Cause you kind of need a landscape mode for this to work, and so this is something that

01:02:49   they actually built into the next version, you know, the developer preview of N, Android

01:02:55   N. Android didn't have a landscape mode, but when you enter into multitasking mode and

01:03:00   go to your home screen it will show it in landscape but it doesn't do that if you're

01:03:04   not in multitasking mode. If you turn your phone on the side it doesn't change things

01:03:07   into landscape. So it needs a landscape mode kind of fundamentally for it to work because

01:03:13   I think I've played around with this in N and really it works best when you're in multitasking

01:03:18   sorry when you're in landscape because you get to see the majority of the applications

01:03:22   right information side by side. I do want this feature not to do serious work on but

01:03:28   for little things. So like a couple of days ago I got an email from someone who needed

01:03:32   me to check a date for something, but it was like three dates that I needed to give them

01:03:37   and it was annoying me to jump backwards and forwards between apps. I would have loved

01:03:41   to have just very quickly brought up Chrome that I could check the date of the thing and

01:03:44   just type them into the email, boom boom boom, like I do on my iPad. I wanted that. I don't

01:03:49   want to run my phone in that all the time, but for the quick things that I need to check,

01:03:53   it would be really useful.

01:03:56   Alright. What's your pick?

01:04:00   So following on from the Mac Pro, I think if they introduce a new Mac Pro and a new

01:04:06   MacBook Pro, they will for sure have an external Retina display to go along with it.

01:04:13   Huh. Bold prediction. Bold prediction. There's been a lot of speculation about it and then

01:04:19   I think the ATP tipster said, "No, it's not gonna be there." But I feel like you're right

01:04:25   that you want to see them as a package.

01:04:29   You want to be able to say, look, hey professionals,

01:04:31   you have these professional devices,

01:04:33   and yes, you will have an external display,

01:04:35   a big external display that you can connect.

01:04:40   The Thunderbolt display is going out of stock,

01:04:43   and it's very old.

01:04:45   And there was a rumor that I thought was fairly credible

01:04:48   about this idea that what you do is you put a GPU

01:04:50   in the display, which is kind of in line

01:04:52   with the Thunderbolt display,

01:04:53   which had a lot of electronics in it.

01:04:55   It was kind of a computer on its own.

01:04:58   And that if you put the GPU in the display,

01:05:00   you could connect via Thunderbolt 3

01:05:02   and it would be able to drive like a 27 inch,

01:05:06   like a 5K display.

01:05:07   So it's possible that they could make this work

01:05:09   without having to wait for the next version of DisplayPort

01:05:12   at the end of next year,

01:05:14   which I don't think Apple wants to wait.

01:05:16   So I think the real question is,

01:05:18   does this happen at WWDC or later on in 2016?

01:05:23   And it's an open question, but again,

01:05:26   if you're gonna do it,

01:05:27   you're not gonna cannibalize any sales.

01:05:29   Say that you're gonna do it, even if it's just,

01:05:32   and yes, you will be able to connect this

01:05:34   to a beautiful brand new 27 inch 5K display

01:05:37   that Apple is shipping this fall.

01:05:40   And even if all they said was that,

01:05:42   I think that that would be fine.

01:05:43   And people would lose their minds

01:05:46   and we would come back to it in the fall.

01:05:48   - Just to know it's coming.

01:05:49   I mean, my feeling is like,

01:05:51   I don't know if they're gonna do this,

01:05:52   But if I'm going with the fact that there's a new Mac Pro,

01:05:55   I'm going with this as well,

01:05:56   because I think they have to announce those two things

01:05:59   together in my mind.

01:06:00   I just think that it would naturally go together

01:06:02   because this new Mac Pro should in theory have the support

01:06:06   for whatever this display will eventually be.

01:06:08   So you may as well announce them together.

01:06:10   - Yeah, I think I can buy that.

01:06:13   I can buy that.

01:06:14   All right, for my pick in what is what the eighth round

01:06:17   of this draft, I'm going to pick something

01:06:21   that is totally just a way for me to collect some points.

01:06:23   We've seen with the Safari developer preview

01:06:25   that Apple is really working on a lot of WebKit features.

01:06:29   The WebKit team is sort of open about the fact

01:06:31   that they're working on some other features

01:06:32   that haven't appeared in the preview yet,

01:06:35   or the technical preview, I guess it's called,

01:06:38   technology preview, STP.

01:06:41   And so I think there will be a Safari/WebKits,

01:06:45   at least a slide on stage

01:06:48   that will talk about all the awesome things they're doing

01:06:50   to update Safari, and including the stuff

01:06:54   that's in the technology preview as some stuff

01:06:56   that has not yet made it into the technology preview.

01:06:59   Of interest to podcasters, I think they will announce

01:07:03   that they're gonna support WebRTC,

01:07:05   and that would be WebKit, so that'll be iOS and Mac.

01:07:08   And what that would mean is like all these web-based tools

01:07:10   that let you do podcasting that record remotely,

01:07:13   like CAST, will work on iOS once that is implemented.

01:07:20   So I'm gonna throw that out there,

01:07:21   that like a bunch of WebKit updates, including WebRTC,

01:07:25   in the next version of iOS and OS X,

01:07:29   Mac OS, whatever it's called.

01:07:31   - I feel like this is one of those things

01:07:34   they can just put with Mac OS

01:07:36   because it gives them some features, right?

01:07:38   That they can say, "Here's some stuff we're doing

01:07:40   with Mac OS," and then maybe they can like lead

01:07:42   into iOS from that, but like it gives them a point

01:07:45   on the slide when it comes to Mac OS.

01:07:47   - And as a developer, yeah, as a developer conference too,

01:07:49   just let them saying, "Hey, we did the Safari Technology Preview, there are a lot of amazing

01:07:53   things. If you're a web developer, look at all these amazing things that we're going

01:07:55   to have. You can follow along. We're announcing today that these other features are going

01:07:59   to be in the build of the Technology Preview that comes out today and they'll all be in

01:08:03   the OS this fall." And something like that.

01:08:06   - It was like a couple of years ago when they kept talking about the DOM, which made no

01:08:10   sense to me at all. I had no idea what the DOM was, but everyone was really excited about

01:08:14   the fact that you could do things with the DOM.

01:08:16   - Woo! DOM!

01:08:17   - You know?

01:08:18   or Deloise. Either way, it sounds great.

01:08:20   - All right, so next up for me, and I'm taking one from you,

01:08:24   major Mac App Store changes.

01:08:26   - Okay. Lay it on me.

01:08:28   - The Mac App Store is a disaster.

01:08:30   I'm not the first person to realize this.

01:08:32   - No. - It is something

01:08:34   that has had absolutely no love

01:08:37   from a design perspective even since it came out.

01:08:40   It looks old, it looks weird,

01:08:42   it does very strange things.

01:08:44   Major developers are not going anywhere near it

01:08:47   it and or leaving it, something needs to change. I don't know what it would be. I don't know

01:08:52   if major Mac App Store changes means just they're going to just change the way it looks

01:08:57   and feels to use to maybe make it more useful. Maybe they bake it even deeper into the OS

01:09:02   in some way, or maybe they change how it works from a technical perspective and make sandboxing

01:09:08   more friendly, or they just make the business proposition nicer on the Mac App Store. Maybe

01:09:13   Mac App Store upgrades. Maybe they put it there to try and bring some people back.

01:09:18   I don't know what it might be, but I just feel like the Mac App Store is going to get

01:09:22   some time on stage to announce some kind of fundamental changes to the way it looks, feels,

01:09:29   or is approached to by developers.

01:09:33   This will be the first time we've seen Apple at WWDC since the... Well, we've seen, you

01:09:42   know, there was that story about Phil Schiller taking over some responsibilities for app

01:09:46   stores, and we've seen the app review times lower and stuff like that. So there's probably

01:09:51   a story coming from Apple that is, "Look, we're making changes. We've listened and we're

01:09:57   making changes, and you've already seen it with the app review. Whoa, big applause line

01:10:01   there, and here's some other things that are going on." My hope is that one of the major

01:10:05   Mac app store changes is absolutely like, "We're going to loosen this way up because

01:10:10   we want the Mac App Store to be thriving and there's too much good stuff that's not in

01:10:15   the store yet and we want you all in the store with your Mac apps. So we're dropping the

01:10:20   requirements for this and that. And you'll still need to be approved and we'll still

01:10:24   need to make sure that you're not doing something that's bad, but we're no longer going to lock

01:10:28   you out if you, whatever. And maybe there's going to be a way for you to have an installer

01:10:34   and the way your installer will work within the Mac App Store is people will open it and

01:10:39   then the Mac App Store app will run the installer itself and walk people through what's going

01:10:43   to happen, or an uninstaller that does the same thing. I mean, whatever, however deep

01:10:47   this goes, I don't know, but I would love to see that, where Phil Schiller stands on

01:10:52   stage and says, "Bottom line, we want you all in the Mac App Store. Here's how we're

01:10:56   going to make it possible for you to be in there, because there aren't enough of you

01:11:01   in there just now."

01:11:03   I don't know if they just say, "To hell with sandboxing?"

01:11:08   I don't know what you do, but maybe.

01:11:12   - I would.

01:11:12   - Because you can still install OS X applications

01:11:16   as easy as you ever could.

01:11:18   So I don't know if it's necessary.

01:11:20   Many people might disagree with me.

01:11:21   Many people will probably agree with me.

01:11:23   I don't know, but I feel like that wouldn't be

01:11:25   the worst thing to do.

01:11:27   - Yeah, I know.

01:11:28   It's like we're doing it right in the Mac App Store

01:11:30   and we're doing it so right that nobody uses it.

01:11:32   - Yeah. - Well, great.

01:11:33   Good for you.

01:11:34   Good for you.

01:11:35   I think-- - We've got our great

01:11:36   little place here where we don't even observe the rules.

01:11:38   - So, and you could spin this a couple of ways.

01:11:40   I would say you could spin this as we are,

01:11:43   we are really going, doubling down on the Mac App Store.

01:11:47   We're gonna make so everything can get in the Mac App Store.

01:11:50   You could also spin it the other way,

01:11:51   which is we are giving up on the Mac App Store.

01:11:53   The super curated approach totally failed.

01:11:56   And so we're gonna open it up.

01:11:58   But either way, they should do it.

01:12:00   - Yep.

01:12:01   - Yep, most definitely.

01:12:02   - All right, for my choice in the ninth round,

01:12:08   I'm going to pick from iOS a customizable control center.

01:12:13   - Nice pick.

01:12:14   - Control center needs to make some changes.

01:12:16   It's the thing you flip up from the bottom of the screen.

01:12:18   I mentioned 3D touch earlier.

01:12:20   The ability to choose some things,

01:12:23   even if they're all system-based.

01:12:26   It would be great if third-party apps

01:12:27   could provide things that go in the,

01:12:29   you know, that are optional for the control center,

01:12:32   that would be really great.

01:12:33   But even if it's customizable, especially on iPads,

01:12:36   there's a lot of room down there and not a lot of choices.

01:12:40   I would love to be able to have some other functionality

01:12:43   that you can toggle quickly from there,

01:12:48   because sometimes, you know,

01:12:49   some people don't use some of those buttons.

01:12:51   They're like, "I'm never gonna flip it open

01:12:53   "and tap on the calculator,

01:12:54   "so could I replace that with something else?"

01:12:57   That would be great.

01:12:58   it's something that's just from a predefined list of eight things that Apple will do, will

01:13:03   offer you, or whether it also includes something that third-party app providers can provide.

01:13:09   But regardless, I like Control Center. I use it all the time, and I would like it to be

01:13:14   more functional.

01:13:15   I couldn't agree more. I would love to be able to change some stuff. One of my favorite

01:13:20   things about Android, they have this stuff in the notification shade, and you can move

01:13:25   things around in there now. I mean it's in the new version, it's in the developer

01:13:28   version, like in the beta version of N, but you can customize what goes in there, you

01:13:33   can move things around to your own order, and there's some great stuff that you can

01:13:36   choose from. I would love to be able to see some of that. Like for example, I very, very

01:13:41   rarely need to turn Bluetooth on and off. Now I have the Apple Watch who turns Bluetooth

01:13:45   on and off. If you're an Apple Watch user, you do not need that there, because you need

01:13:50   it on all the time.

01:13:51   Right, but you may be somebody who has a corporate VPN and needs to toggle their VPN on and off,

01:13:56   and you can't do that from Control Center.

01:13:57   Exactly.

01:13:58   Or, for example, something I cannot believe is not in there, is Low Power Mode.

01:14:03   I just cannot believe that Low Power Mode is not in Control Center.

01:14:06   I flick up Control Center every single time thinking that it's there, even though I know

01:14:11   it's not.

01:14:14   The question also about, like, I was doing a presentation at a user group, and one of

01:14:18   of the things I did was like, it was like secrets

01:14:20   of the Mac menu bar.

01:14:21   And one of them is, you know, menu bar items,

01:14:23   you hold down the option key

01:14:24   and you get all these extra things.

01:14:25   And I thought about that for, for control center,

01:14:27   the idea that maybe 3D touch,

01:14:29   or maybe it's a touch and hold or whatever,

01:14:30   but the idea that you could, you know,

01:14:32   if you go on the Bluetooth item,

01:14:34   if you want to keep it there,

01:14:35   it's not just a Bluetooth toggle,

01:14:36   it lets you pick a device and connect to it,

01:14:38   or pick a wifi base station and connect to it.

01:14:41   How about that?

01:14:42   Wouldn't that be a nice feature?

01:14:43   But you know, right now it's just, it's, it's too dumb.

01:14:46   So make it smarter.

01:14:48   - Yeah.

01:14:48   - My next pick is iOS software keyboard improvements.

01:14:53   And this is a few different things here.

01:14:56   - Okay.

01:14:57   - I would like to see more layouts in the software keyboard

01:15:00   on the large iPad Pro.

01:15:01   I want to see the international layouts promised to us.

01:15:04   And I also want to see the third party keyboards

01:15:08   become like actual keyboards.

01:15:10   You know, I want the switching to be better.

01:15:13   I would love to see them be able to perform a lot better.

01:15:16   I just want to see that really kind of pick up now.

01:15:20   We're a couple of years into this

01:15:22   and nothing has really significantly changed

01:15:26   to try and make these keyboards stronger.

01:15:29   You know, you've got stuff like Gboard,

01:15:31   which people really love.

01:15:32   I can't use because Google is, as you mentioned,

01:15:35   not so great about outside of the US at times.

01:15:38   But I want to see people being able to use these keyboards

01:15:44   as their main keyboards without having a nightmare

01:15:46   trying to switch backwards and forwards. Why can't I turn off the standard one?

01:15:51   Why does that always have to be enabled? I understand that like they want to

01:15:55   enable it for security when you're entering passwords, but just show a

01:15:58   specific password-owning keyboard. Let me choose between SwiftKey and the emoji

01:16:02   one, and just let me leave it at that. Like if I want to choose a third party one,

01:16:05   stop giving me the first party one. I really want to see some changes there.

01:16:09   I will throw in a couple that I want. I want a distinct set of settings for

01:16:15   hardware and software keyboards.

01:16:18   Because when I'm typing on a hardware keyboard,

01:16:20   I do not want auto-capitalization.

01:16:23   I do not want auto-correct,

01:16:24   because it incorrects my correct typing,

01:16:29   and it's infuriating.

01:16:30   So then I go and turn it off,

01:16:31   and then I'm sitting with my iPad in my lap

01:16:34   using the software keyboard,

01:16:35   - And just looks gibberish.

01:16:36   - Expecting it to auto-correct, and it totally doesn't.

01:16:39   Those should be separate features.

01:16:41   For Pete's sake, we now have the iPad Pro shipping,

01:16:43   you know, with these accessories that you can get

01:16:45   that are made by Apple that are external keyboards.

01:16:47   - A keyboard that you make and put in the marketing.

01:16:50   - Yeah, they need to be different.

01:16:52   So I would throw that out there that they need to do that.

01:16:55   And then actually also from the iPad Pro perspective,

01:16:59   the two finger track pad feature,

01:17:02   they need to tweak it a little bit

01:17:05   because I accidentally set it off with a finger brush

01:17:10   and delete things that I've written all the time.

01:17:15   So I want it to be less sensitive.

01:17:19   I want to have to do a little more work

01:17:22   to get it into trackpad mode.

01:17:24   And I also want it to be more reliable about it

01:17:27   'cause sometimes I put two fingers down

01:17:28   and I start to move and it just starts tacking keys,

01:17:31   which is also really annoying.

01:17:32   So it activates sometimes when I don't want it to,

01:17:35   and it doesn't activate sometimes when I do.

01:17:37   And as a result, I get really frustrated by it.

01:17:38   - It's one of my favorite features of the iPhone

01:17:41   because it works almost like all the time.

01:17:45   but it's one of the things that annoys me most

01:17:47   about the iPad because I can't get it to work consistently.

01:17:49   - Yeah, when it works, it's great,

01:17:51   but it is so inconsistent and frustrating.

01:17:52   So those are my two things that I'll throw in

01:17:56   on the software keyboard.

01:17:57   And there are probably others.

01:17:58   I mean, you could change the whole little auto,

01:18:02   the smart bar or whatever it is above there.

01:18:07   That could be a lot better and more contextual

01:18:09   and have more stuff in it than I think app developers

01:18:11   are allowed to put in there too.

01:18:13   - And there's about 17,000 different things you could do

01:18:16   to improve the emoji keyboard as well.

01:18:18   - Yes, like make it searchable for one.

01:18:20   - Yeah, just yeah, yeah.

01:18:22   - I wrote a whole story for Macworld about that.

01:18:24   Apple's emoji, our emoji game is really strong

01:18:27   and their keyboard on iOS is really poor.

01:18:30   All right, so for my pick rounding out round 10

01:18:33   and the end of this block,

01:18:35   I'm going to choose major changes

01:18:38   and improvements to CarPlay.

01:18:41   You are probably the only person in the world that has had the amount of experience of CarPlay

01:18:46   that you've had. I just used it that one day and made the video.

01:18:50   Technically, no. I actually have it hooked up. I was using it the other day because Apple actually

01:18:56   has come a long way. One of the weird things about CarPlay is iOS 9 wasn't that great with CarPlay,

01:19:02   but a couple updates in it got a lot better. CarPlay is way better than it was a year ago

01:19:07   when I made that video, and I keep thinking about making a follow-up. People who have CarPlay in

01:19:11   in their cars perhaps have experienced this. I don't. I have CarPlay in a box that I can

01:19:15   plug in in my house. So I should probably put it in my car at some point just so that

01:19:19   I can write about it some more. And now it's at the point, it's much better now. At this

01:19:23   point I would be willing to have it in my car, where a year ago I wasn't. But, you know,

01:19:27   they are, Apple's trying to get in the car, they are in this competition with Android

01:19:31   Auto, they need to make CarPlay better. So I want to hear them talk about, and I hope

01:19:37   they do, that's why I'm picking them, talk about CarPlay and ways that they're going

01:19:40   make it better because it's still not that great and I feel like they need to

01:19:45   spend some time saying we're gonna you know we're gonna make it better they've

01:19:48   they've teased that they're going to be able to do it completely wirelessly how's

01:19:51   that going to work are they going to do other features I'm gonna roll Siri in

01:19:54   the car in here too I feel like Siri needs to get smarter in the car

01:19:57   regardless but especially needs to get smarter in the car when there's carplay

01:20:01   because a lot of times you know what you can't interact with a screen you need to

01:20:05   talk to a device and Siri is not good enough at being a conversationalist in the car and

01:20:12   help you get information that you seek while your eyes are on the road. So some sort of

01:20:21   Apple in-car story that is not Apple building a car but is Apple is committed to making

01:20:28   more improvements to car play. I want to see it so I'm going to put it on my list.

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01:22:20   support of this show, Relay FM, and of course, the upgrade WWDC draft 2016. So we are in

01:22:29   the final stretch now, Jason.

01:22:30   Yes, the lightning round, if you will.

01:22:32   You could say that. I am going to go with system-wide iOS dark mode.

01:22:39   All right.

01:22:40   That's my next pick here.

01:22:41   Good choice.

01:22:43   Now, this thing is being called dark mode. You know, Federico did some great stuff here

01:22:48   when he did his iOS 10 pics. But I actually think it's going to be slightly more than

01:22:54   this. I have a hunch that the Instagram design, the new black and white Instagram design is

01:23:01   going to be something that we see wider in iOS. I think that is a fresh, kind of black

01:23:08   and white style design or just way calmer design. You take a look at the WWDC pages,

01:23:14   everything's dark and you know there's a simple color there that could easily be flicked backwards

01:23:18   and forwards. I think that Apple is going to start to really change the way that the

01:23:23   design guidelines are so things will be a bit sharper, a bit plainer, even more plain

01:23:28   than what iOS 7 was, to allow for an easier ability to switch between dark and light.

01:23:36   - Yeah, so they introduced a dark menu bar

01:23:41   in OS X a couple versions ago,

01:23:45   and it's really dumb because it's a dark menu bar,

01:23:50   and that's it.

01:23:51   And I think originally people who had apps

01:23:54   that ran in the menu bar couldn't even easily tell

01:23:57   if the menu bar was dark or not, and they fixed that.

01:23:59   So now they can tell and they can change their icon

01:24:01   to be the opposite when it's a dark menu bar.

01:24:03   but what it's not is a dark mode for the operating system.

01:24:07   Like, and I know, you know, you got a window,

01:24:09   a lot of windows are gonna be like documents

01:24:11   and they're gonna be lots of white with black text

01:24:14   and that's how it is.

01:24:15   But some interface elements throughout could get picked up

01:24:18   and sort of like darkened and you have a second theme

01:24:21   and they didn't do it.

01:24:22   So on iOS, I would love to see it.

01:24:25   I would love to see a dark mode.

01:24:26   I would love to see it something that all the OS can,

01:24:30   all the apps can pick up and do pick up

01:24:32   that you should be able to set it to turn on at sunset.

01:24:35   All of those things I would like to see,

01:24:39   because it's nice.

01:24:41   It's nice when you're working in the dark,

01:24:44   having a white screen in front of your face is painful

01:24:47   when it doesn't have to be.

01:24:48   And like if you've looked at overcast dark mode,

01:24:51   for example, that's a good example of that.

01:24:53   Something like, even like notes,

01:24:55   I would rather have it be when I'm taking notes

01:24:57   in a darkened room, like I often am

01:25:00   when I'm watching a movie or something for a podcast,

01:25:02   I would love to be able to have a dark mode for it.

01:25:04   Instead, what I do is I end up triple clicking

01:25:07   and I have triple click set to be invert screen.

01:25:10   And since everything in iOS is so aggressively,

01:25:15   you know, white with a little bit of black,

01:25:17   if you triple click, it turns into a sort of a dark mode.

01:25:21   It's weird, but sort of,

01:25:22   but a proper dark mode would be great.

01:25:25   - So I think that's what we're gonna,

01:25:27   I think we're gonna see something along those lines

01:25:29   will be a bigger kind of interface change again. I mean it's been some years since iOS 7 now.

01:25:34   >> So a lot of what we've been saying it has been about the Apple Watch has been fix it, fix it,

01:25:40   fix the things that are wrong. I'm gonna say something completely new here which is

01:25:45   time for watchOS 3.0 to include the ability for custom watch faces. Expanding the abilities of the

01:25:53   existing watch faces is something that should also be on the list and I think we all assume that

01:25:58   there will be some incremental improvements to how watch faces are

01:26:01   displayed, but I think I want to see the ability for third parties to build apps

01:26:08   that provide custom watch faces that, you know, they got to be approved by Apple,

01:26:12   but I feel like it's time. The Apple Watch, one of the things that it does is

01:26:17   tell the time, and if you would ask me what the state of the Apple Watch's

01:26:22   watch face game would be a year after it shipped, I would not--I would be

01:26:27   disappointed with the reality of it if you know it's just not enough and I

01:26:32   realize there are lots of reasons you want to there's intellectual property

01:26:35   reasons you want to knock off existing watch faces there's a quality reasons

01:26:38   where a lot of like pebble watch faces are really gross that said you know

01:26:44   having Apple have approval and have guidelines I would like to see that and

01:26:49   I would I would like to see watch faces in general be more customizable than

01:26:53   they currently are. I would trade this for fewer, more flexible Apple watch faces. I

01:27:00   would probably do that, where, you know, right now an Apple watch face sort of can only do

01:27:05   one thing. If those all could be a little more variable in terms of where they put text

01:27:11   and what they put where, that would be nice too. But I'm gonna go with the custom watch

01:27:16   faces too. I think, why not?

01:27:19   Do you foresee custom watch faces as anyone can make one or Apple makes it possible for

01:27:26   approved designers to do it?

01:27:29   I think it's the latter, right?

01:27:30   Apple approval is going to be a key part of it.

01:27:34   I would have just imagined it's going to be an app store style process.

01:27:38   Right, but anyone can come along and make one.

01:27:42   They've just got to get it approved as opposed to Apple saying Louis Vuitton and Gucci and

01:27:47   etc.

01:27:48   Exactly. That was what I was thinking. And it might even be something that just, you know, the store for it, if you will, is in the Apple Watch app.

01:27:55   And it just, that's where it lives and you install a watch face and there's no, you know, there's no app you install on your phone that has a watch face extension.

01:28:03   It's more like there are watch faces in the watch face. I mean, that Apple Watch app is pretty bare. There's not a lot happening in there.

01:28:10   So putting in a watch, a watch face gallery and letting you load things on. I mean, that's something that, that Pebble did that I liked. So I'd like to see that.

01:28:18   Alright, next up, this is a kind of a continuation from what I was saying about native watch

01:28:25   apps but I think further untethering the Apple Watch from the phone, so allowing the Apple

01:28:31   Watch to get more information from some kind of connection, whether it be a cell connection

01:28:40   and we can maybe get to that with a later prediction or just to be able to do more with

01:28:46   than it can currently do so you can kind of have this device be its own little

01:28:53   thing if it wants to be I think that's something that they're gonna do more

01:28:56   with because I think that whilst the Apple kind of said that this was the

01:29:00   case it doesn't feel like that's the case because if I'm at my in my in my

01:29:04   home and the phone is not around my watch gets really upset so and I know

01:29:09   it's connected to the Wi-Fi so I think that this could be significantly

01:29:13   improved upon, if not completely revolutionized.

01:29:16   >> All right, I'm going to, I mean, some of those things were in watchOS 2.0, but as you

01:29:21   pointed out when we talked about this earlier with apps standing alone, it doesn't go far

01:29:26   enough, it needs to go further. I'm going to stay on the watch thing for a little watch

01:29:31   segment here, my pick, which is a very specific pick and it is something that I actually added

01:29:36   while we were talking. I'm going to throw down the ability to migrate an Apple Watch

01:29:43   to a new iPhone without having to wipe it and reinstall it from a backup. If you ever

01:29:49   buy a new iPhone or have your iPhone break and have to replace it, guess what you have

01:29:52   to do to your Apple Watch? You have to completely erase it and then re-pair it and then let

01:29:57   it load your last backup, if you have a backup, from that iPhone. So I'm going to say, "New

01:30:04   feature of WatchOS 3, if you're using a phone that's got an existing Apple ID that's the

01:30:09   same as the new phone that you're going to, it will just be able to migrate without wiping

01:30:14   itself clean and starting again.

01:30:18   That would be great.

01:30:19   Especially when we all get new phones again.

01:30:21   I mean, if we remember what happened last September in the meeting, you just shouted

01:30:24   for four weeks.

01:30:25   Exactly right.

01:30:26   It's upgrading.

01:30:27   Upgrading should be a delight.

01:30:29   And if you've got an Apple Watch, upgrading your iPhone is a pain.

01:30:33   So make it more delightful.

01:30:36   I'm gonna venture into territory I don't understand and say that there will be some kind of big

01:30:41   Swift announcement.

01:30:42   Oh good.

01:30:43   That's all I know is that there will be time devoted to Swift and it will be big stuff,

01:30:47   not just like, "Hey, Swift's going good."

01:30:50   Like I think that they're gonna do something which will be significant with Swift.

01:30:54   New version of Swift, they learned their lesson, they've listened to developers, and it does

01:30:59   more awesome things now.

01:31:01   Yeah.

01:31:02   Basically.

01:31:03   That's all I have to say on that.

01:31:04   That's good.

01:31:05   You don't want to elaborate on some of the thoughts about what those big new features

01:31:09   of Swift would be?

01:31:10   I think that the integer parameter is going to significantly change.

01:31:17   And everyone stop listening.

01:31:18   Well, it'll be more dynamic.

01:31:20   There'll be some more dynamic typing, I hope.

01:31:23   Dynamic typing.

01:31:24   That's when you type really fast, right?

01:31:25   Yeah, that's what new keyboards do.

01:31:28   They just make it more dynamic.

01:31:29   Okay, good.

01:31:30   Excellent.

01:31:31   Okay, I'm with you there.

01:31:32   All right, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say something that's totally nuts

01:31:35   But I it's wish fulfillment time here late in the draft and I'm gonna I'm gonna I want credit if my wish is fulfilled

01:31:40   The fulfillment itself won't be enough. I'll also get draft credit for it

01:31:44   a

01:31:46   replacement for iTunes on the Mac

01:31:48   Mm-hmm, so

01:31:54   The idea that Apple needs to split some of this stuff off

01:31:58   that there's a new version of iTunes that is focused on music,

01:32:02   perhaps there's a separate app that is for device sync and maintenance and backup and things

01:32:06   for people who are still doing wired connections to their iOS devices.

01:32:11   But breaking it up, breaking up the monopoly,

01:32:17   simplifying iTunes, having the whole music story be a little bit more,

01:32:21   actually having it be more like iOS, where there's a music app, and there's a store app,

01:32:26   and there's a device sync app in this case since it's on the Mac and that's

01:32:31   and that's it instead of one place the the long requested never delivered

01:32:38   breakup of big iTunes. Big iTunes. Go get big iTunes out of the way.

01:32:44   Alright so we're into our last and final picks now then. I guess we are. Now one of

01:32:51   the things so I'm struggling now with what we have left in this document

01:32:56   Because I can either go for something that is potential but I don't think will happen or I can just take crib something

01:33:02   Immediately from what you just put in your article about the Mac

01:33:05   But I think that's a bit outlandish and I do want you to maybe go through it

01:33:10   So I'm just gonna go with Apple watch to announced. I

01:33:13   Don't think that they're gonna do this

01:33:16   Like I really don't think that this is gonna happen and this is what happens when you get to the end of the draft here

01:33:21   But no left there could be some stuff in Apple watch 3

01:33:27   That they just can't talk about unless they talk about the Apple watch 2

01:33:31   hmm, like

01:33:34   fundamentally like if they say something like

01:33:36   Let's just say for argument's sake that the Apple watch 2 has a SIM card in it and it has a cell connection

01:33:41   Let's just say again. I think we're still another version away from that

01:33:45   But let's just say that's the case and that's why they talk about independent

01:33:49   You know that the watch can talk independently when you're out on a run

01:33:52   There's no way they can do that without kind of acknowledging the fact that it's gonna have a cell connection

01:33:57   Which means they need to maybe talk about the hardware. I

01:33:59   Don't know depends on how much they want to give developers now as opposed to giving them like three weeks pull the thing ships

01:34:06   So it could be uncharted territory a little bit with what they want to announce and what they don't want to announce and how this

01:34:13   impacts the hardware

01:34:15   But that's why I say that there is a slim chance that they announced the Apple watch to

01:34:21   Shipping in a month two months if the products not selling gangbusters. They know it's a q4 product like Tim has said

01:34:29   It's a holiday product

01:34:30   Maybe they just don't care about the fact that are gonna cannibalize some sales for a little while. I don't know

01:34:35   All right. Well, I think that's unlikely highly unlikely, but why is my last pick my friend?

01:34:41   So for my last pick and the last pick of the draft, I've got some stuff that I could pick

01:34:46   But I'm not gonna pick I'm not gonna pick any of those instead

01:34:50   I'm gonna pick something that's slightly more possible than the Apple watch 2 appearing on stage at

01:34:56   WWDC and it's this

01:34:58   To celebrate the fact that OS 10 is now Mac OS 11

01:35:04   they're going to say these go to 11 and

01:35:09   Spinal tap is going to appear on stage and perform at the end of the keynote

01:35:14   I think there is more chance of a live upgrade from the keynote stage

01:35:18   Then then spinal tap to appear. I don't think I don't agree. I think I think the appearance of spinal tap is

01:35:24   More likely than a live upgrade or the Apple watch to appearing. So that's what I'm gonna say spinal tap slash Mac OS

01:35:32   11 there it is

01:35:35   Just mark it mark it down. All right

01:35:38   I get like I win the draft if that happens. How about that? Will you agree to that? That's a double or nothing

01:35:43   Yeah, I'll tell you what

01:35:44   I'll give you that if spinal tap come out on stage no matter what the scoring is you win the draft. Okay. Thank you

01:35:50   And that's the end of the draft and that's the end of this week's episode

01:35:54   Thank you so much for listening and I hope you've been playing along at home

01:35:59   I'm look very much looking forward to next week when we announce the winner

01:36:04   Uh, who will be crowned champion of the, uh,

01:36:07   first annual upgrade WWDC draft, but let's

01:36:10   talk about next week for a moment.

01:36:12   Yes.

01:36:12   So, um, next week, uh, upgrade, we will be

01:36:16   recording in person, uh, after the keynote.

01:36:19   So we will, you know, sometime after the

01:36:21   keynote, we'll be recording in person.

01:36:22   We may or may not stream live.

01:36:24   I hope that we will be able to stream live.

01:36:25   So you'll be able to tune in if you want to.

01:36:27   Um, something that I will mention this, uh,

01:36:30   like just after the keynote, but I'll say

01:36:32   it now so you can bear it in mind.

01:36:33   We love to do extended ask upgrade for this type of stuff.

01:36:37   So if you have any questions, thoughts that you want us to elaborate on that kind of stuff

01:36:42   because of the keynote announcements, just send them in with the hashtag ask upgrade

01:36:46   and we'll try and get to as many of those as we can.

01:36:48   So feel free to do that.

01:36:50   I love doing that sort of stuff because you pick up on like the random

01:36:53   and weird little things that people thought of or found because of that.

01:36:57   So please send any of that sort of stuff into us

01:36:59   so we can address it on the show with the hashtag ask upgrade.

01:37:02   So we'll be recording that episode, but also on Monday, it's RelayCon.

01:37:07   Now you may have, may not have heard of this.

01:37:09   I hope that you have, but we're doing an event in San Francisco for the first time.

01:37:13   Um, it's going to be a live show.

01:37:15   Um, we're going to be doing some fun stuff.

01:37:17   We've got some great things planned.

01:37:19   Uh, part of it is going to be, uh, the connected hosts.

01:37:22   So me, Steven and Federico.

01:37:24   And then there's going to be a segment that I've put down in my

01:37:26   document, title was Myke and Friends, which is going to be me, you and

01:37:30   Serenity Coldwell talking about the announcements of the day.

01:37:33   This is going to be recorded live and it will be out in the connected feed.

01:37:38   So we'll be talking about it, we'll be linking to it, but if you're interested in picking

01:37:42   up what I think is going to be a really fun episode, go subscribe to connected now and

01:37:47   you'll get that next week.

01:37:49   And you'll also get this week's episode of connected, which will be fun.

01:37:51   So go to relay.fm/connected to find out more and subscribe there.

01:37:55   But we're really excited for RelayCon and Jason, I'll say now thank you for being a

01:38:00   part of it on stage with me. I am very excited. We've got a big night planned, so I think

01:38:04   it's gonna be a lot of fun.

01:38:05   - Monday's gonna be a big day, and somewhere in there between a keynote and relaycon, we

01:38:10   will find at an undisclosed location, we will find enough time to do upgrade. That's the

01:38:17   agenda for Monday. And again, I will offer, we can just ride around in my car if you really

01:38:24   want to. Do a car cast. But we should probably do it at a secret location instead of in my

01:38:29   I feel like, you know, for the car cast to exist in the future, which I'm sure it will

01:38:35   make an appearance later on, there needs to be extenuating circumstances. Me and you being

01:38:40   together in person with the ability to walk to multiple locations where we could record

01:38:45   does not need a car cast. But I appreciate the invitation.

01:38:48   Probably right. Fine, you don't want to be in my car, that's fine. Alright, no, I'm looking

01:38:53   forward to it. You and me together in San Francisco. That part in San Francisco is less

01:38:58   exciting for me because this is basically where I live but you'll be here and a lot of other people

01:39:02   will be here and there'll be a big apple event I'll be there and then I will find you afterward

01:39:07   and we will do an upgrade next week and keep score about the draft which will be ugly probably

01:39:12   yeah especially because we'll be in person you know it might come to fisticuffs who knows it could

01:39:17   thank you so much for listening to this week's show if you want to find our show notes head on

01:39:21   over to relay.fm/upgrades/92 thanks again to our lovely sponsors this week Casper, Squarespace,

01:39:28   and Pingdom and we'll be back in person next week.

01:39:31   Thank you so much for listening.

01:39:32   Say goodbye Mr. Snow.

01:39:34   - Goodbye everybody, next week in San Francisco.

01:39:36   - San Francisco.

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