68: The Cryogenic Chamber of Topics


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:08   From relay FM, this is Upgrade, episode number 68.

00:00:12   This week's episode is brought to you by Braintree, TextExpander, and Hover.

00:00:17   My name is Myke Hurley and I'm joined by Mr Jason Snell.

00:00:21   Hello! Hello, Mr Myke Hurley.

00:00:23   Hello, Jason Snell. We are one week away from the Upgradies.

00:00:27   Yeah, oh my goodness. Well, we're not prepared. We are completely unprepared for the upgradees.

00:00:33   Oh no. But they are coming. So if you are listening to this and for some reason you still

00:00:39   have not put in your suggestion for a category or topic you would like to be given an upgrade award

00:00:45   to, make sure that you do that within the next couple of days and you want to use the hashtag

00:00:50   #AskUpgrade, the normal hashtag, and next week we will have a special episode of the show,

00:00:57   which will be the Upgrady Awards for 2015.

00:01:01   >> Woo.

00:01:02   >> But we do have some follow-ups, some regular follow-up, as always.

00:01:08   We found a dashboard user.

00:01:12   There were a couple of people that claimed to be dashboard users after our discussion

00:01:17   last week, but the most impressive, I think, would be the right word to use, is definitely

00:01:24   Joe, Joe Sarsero on Twitter. Joe uses dashboard for calendars, weather, stocks, TV schedules,

00:01:32   a TV guide, he uses iStat, Apple remote desktop deliveries and many many more. There's a link

00:01:40   in the show notes to a picture that Joe has sent over Twitter for us. So you can get an

00:01:46   idea for yourself just to what extent Joe continues to use dashboard. You will see my

00:01:53   I replied to Joe, if you follow that link, where I asked him, "Is this serious?"

00:02:00   Because this picture looks very much like it was taken from 2005. Like, it's so full

00:02:06   of stuff.

00:02:07   In a NASA launch center somewhere, also, because it's got lots of Earths, lots of weathers,

00:02:15   there's three globes, there's, by my count, let's see, one, two, three, four, five, six,

00:02:19   seven weathers. There's a test tube full of red liquid. Yeah, there's a lot. It's a lot.

00:02:28   It's amazing. I guess the modern equivalent of something like this would be to have, I

00:02:35   don't know, to have just apps or some different spaces or something. I mean, the nice thing

00:02:40   about Dashboard is that you can put a whole bunch of stuff right where you want it, and

00:02:46   then it's just available with one keystroke or one gesture.

00:02:50   The modern equivalent of this is widgets on Android home screens.

00:02:54   Yeah, I suppose that's true. That's true, but on the Mac, I think what you would do

00:02:58   if you wanted to approximate this would be you'd have a bunch of apps that launched into

00:03:02   their own space. Or a bunch of stuff in Notification Center.

00:03:05   Yeah, that's true. Notification Center widgets. You can get a lot of this stuff in there.

00:03:10   Yeah, you can. But it's, but he's got a workflow and it works for him, and dashboard stuff.

00:03:16   essential. Well, there's a reason they haven't killed it outright. They've just pushed it

00:03:20   off to the side. It's sort of like it works, but it's not being updated. I don't think

00:03:24   anybody's making new dashboard widgets. You could. If you know some JavaScript, you could

00:03:29   do it. But yeah, all right. Well, we tip our cap to Joe. I mentioned in passing a couple

00:03:36   of other things that we could have chosen, and I actually heard from people who said,

00:03:40   "Hey, don't make fun of that. I use that all the time. That's useful." And yeah, that was

00:03:43   the point is, I am sure that we could mention almost anything that comes with the OS, and

00:03:52   that's why it's there, is somebody is using it.

00:03:56   Yeah, the reason it's not been taken out yet, it's not an accident. It's not like it was

00:03:59   just forgotten about, like, someone in Apple was like, "Oh, Dashboard's still there?"

00:04:03   Like they heard that on our show last week and it'll be gone in the next point. It's

00:04:08   because people are using this stuff. Apple knows that people are using this stuff.

00:04:12   And also I want to make the point, because I did hear, I get the sense from a couple

00:04:15   of people that when I say that I think Apple wouldn't make Launchpad today, which is where

00:04:19   this all started, there's a sense that I'm saying Launchpad is stupid, or the people

00:04:25   who use it are stupid, and that's not true.

00:04:26   I don't use Launchpad.

00:04:28   I don't find it useful.

00:04:29   I've got lots of apps.

00:04:30   Launchpad is a complete disaster for me, but I'm not the user it was intended for.

00:04:35   And I did hear from somebody who said that they love it because they are completely visual,

00:04:40   typing a word of an app is not what they want to do and they can do a single keystroke or

00:04:45   gesture, the list comes up and then they can point at the icon that's what they want and

00:04:50   they can't put all those apps in their dock because then they would be too small. And

00:04:53   I think that is what that is designed for. But also I'm not saying Apple should remove

00:05:01   it, and if I did get that across, I didn't mean to. What I'm saying is I don't think

00:05:08   today's Apple would make Launchpad. I don't think today's Apple would make Launchpad or

00:05:15   at least make it in the way that it was made, because it feels to me like it was made by

00:05:20   an Apple that was trying to make everything on the Mac look like iOS and that they've

00:05:25   changed direction. So that was my point, was today's Apple, if they were trying to solve

00:05:33   the same problem, would have a different solution, but the fact that it remains suggests to me

00:05:38   that it's not painful in a way that makes them want to demolish it or, yeah, it's not,

00:05:45   they don't want to demolish it and it seems like they don't want to put in the effort

00:05:49   to redo it to be something that is more in keeping with what their vision for app launching

00:05:55   is on the Mac, which honestly is, I think, spotlight. I think all the work they put into

00:06:00   spotlight in the last couple of releases to make app launching faster and to, you know,

00:06:05   it show immediately to autocomplete to an app and have that box be dead center in the

00:06:12   interface. All of these things suggest to me that they think that's the primary way,

00:06:15   that this is a nice secondary way and they don't care enough to turn it into a new metaphor

00:06:21   because it's already there and it's not a priority for them. I'm not judging it based

00:06:26   on that. I think that Apple itself today, my read on Apple's philosophy today is they

00:06:33   they wouldn't do it that way. But it's there and people use it and that's great. And dashboard

00:06:37   still lives.

00:06:40   Moving on, as Steve pointed out, we were talking about the Apple logo on the iPad Pro still

00:06:45   being in portrait and how this seemed kind of peculiar considering that the device is

00:06:49   pretty much even established as, from a marketing perspective, a landscape device now. And Steve

00:06:56   mentioned that, and he's very true, the initial setup screen for iPads and iPhones remains

00:07:01   I see lots of people when they get their new iPad Pro, they tweet pictures of this, that

00:07:07   they have it in landscape, but the device forces them to put it into portrait to continue

00:07:11   the setup process basically, and to be able to read it anyway.

00:07:15   Yeah, it's a legacy of...

00:07:20   I mean, this is similar to the Launchpad conversation.

00:07:22   It's a legacy of the iPhone.

00:07:25   got to do all the setup screens in portrait because that's how the iPhone

00:07:30   primary that's the primary orientation for the iPhone yeah I mean there's only

00:07:34   one you know there's it's only the six plus that has the landscape and if you

00:07:41   think you know there's still multiple devices that they're targeting right

00:07:44   they're going all the way from the iPhone 4 all the way up to the new six

00:07:48   is right yeah and even with this setup screen even the six plus though the

00:07:52   primary orientation is portrait.

00:07:53   - Oh yeah, that's what I was gonna say.

00:07:55   Like--

00:07:56   - It's just the home screen you can rotate into landscape.

00:07:58   The others, you're right, you can't even rotate

00:07:59   the home screen into landscape.

00:08:00   So, but I think-- - So the OS is a portrait OS.

00:08:03   It remains a portrait OS, because even on the 6 Plus,

00:08:06   it feels a little bit like an after fall at times.

00:08:09   - Yeah, and the, and this goes back

00:08:13   to what we were saying earlier on previous episodes

00:08:15   about the iPad needing some love and some space

00:08:19   be its own product. That, you know, it doesn't matter in the end, "Oh no, I got a new iPad.

00:08:26   I have to hold it this way instead of this way to set it up." No, it doesn't. But it

00:08:33   does say something about Apple's priorities because Apple does sweat some of the details

00:08:38   and you know, could that be landscape? Could it be both? Could it be rotatable? Probably.

00:08:44   It's not because of the iPhone, really, because if you have to pick one, you're going to pick

00:08:48   that one because of the iPhone. Again, it's fine on one level, but on another level, it

00:08:55   burns a little bit because I feel like it's just a little example of a larger problem

00:09:02   with iPad software. I do feel like the more I use it that it is just... There's some things

00:09:06   I enjoy doing in portrait on the iPad Pro. Sometimes I actually like writing in portrait

00:09:11   on the iPad Pro. It reminds me when I was in college, our page layout machines that

00:09:16   we would use at the college newspaper were all, they were Mac SEs because I'm old, and

00:09:23   they were attached to radius full page displays, which were these, the idea was you could see

00:09:27   the entire page on this display. It was a huge external monitor. Well, by today's standards,

00:09:34   it was tiny, but it was a portrait monitor, which was kind of brilliant because if you're

00:09:39   in the publishing industry, right, newspapers and magazines and stuff are in portrait mode.

00:09:45   not in landscape orientation. So I use my iPad Pro like that sometimes and it gives

00:09:50   me a flashback to those old full page display days. If I'm in a text editor I can see more

00:09:54   of my text and usually you don't need the width in a text editor anyway so unless I'm

00:09:58   working with a split view or something like that sometimes I will put the iPad Pro upright

00:10:02   and work on it that way. And then sometimes when I'm reading I'll do that but most of

00:10:07   the time it's in landscape and so it is kind of this funny thing where I feel like the

00:10:12   The iPad Pro wants to be a landscape device and there are just these occasional design

00:10:17   touches and software touches that suggest that Apple is like, "Meh, we're comfortable

00:10:24   with portrait."

00:10:28   This isn't really a follow-up item, it was just something that I wanted to mention.

00:10:32   I have one of those Sphero BB-8s, you know, the one that you can control with the iPhone

00:10:37   and it rolls around?

00:10:38   You mean BB-8, the droid introduced in the new major motion picture Star Wars colon The

00:10:43   Force Awakens?

00:10:44   Yes, that will be occupying Myke at the movies at the end of this show.

00:10:48   This is your pre-warning, okay?

00:10:51   I'm not, there will be a spoiler horn before that section begins.

00:10:55   I will just not accept anybody complain about spoilers.

00:10:58   I'm telling you now, we're like 45 minutes away maybe from the even beginning.

00:11:03   You know now.

00:11:04   Plenty of time to pull off to the side of the road and turn off the podcast before we

00:11:08   get there which will be at the very end of the show.

00:11:10   Exactly. So it's going to be we've still got a lot of stuff to get through but I just want

00:11:13   to mention it now. Okay? Okay that is your warning everyone. And the BB-8. So the BB-8

00:11:21   is like it's this fantastic thing that was developed by a company called Sphero which

00:11:25   Disney took a major stake in when they saw what they could do because it allowed them

00:11:29   to develop the technology to create not only the actual Sphero that's in the, sorry the

00:11:34   the actual BB8 that's in the film, but also to create this line of toys.

00:11:40   So it works with these crazy motors inside of a ball that makes it roll around and uses

00:11:44   a bunch of cool magnets and stuff.

00:11:46   Now I bought this when it came out a couple of months ago and I love it.

00:11:50   It's a great little thing, it charges by induction charging in this little dock and you can run

00:11:54   it around and it's really a lot of fun to play around with.

00:11:58   But it updated today because all of the sounds that the toy would make came out of the companion

00:12:03   an iPhone app, you control it with the iPhone app, and the sounds come from the iPhone app,

00:12:07   not from the BB-8 toy itself. And they updated it today with actual movie realistic sounds

00:12:17   of BB-8. So obviously before had just some placeholder sounds.

00:12:23   I wonder if they were the placeholder sounds from the movie, but they weren't the final

00:12:27   movie sounds? Because that happens a lot where they've got like temp tracks that they put

00:12:32   then. The toy previously didn't sound, doesn't sound anything like BB-8. Yeah. Like, you

00:12:37   know, there was, it was really different, which is awesome, and it's now been updated,

00:12:41   and it's also, he's also got some little different actions that mimic some of the actions that

00:12:47   he made in the movie too, which is awesome, and I just like that they did that, and I

00:12:52   would, just wanted to mention, if you don't have one of these, or there's a Star Wars

00:12:56   nerd in your life that you think would like something like this, you should get them it,

00:13:01   it is awesome. And I think there's a perception that this was going to be, and maybe it is,

00:13:06   the hot toy for Christmas that people are thinking, well, you know, I didn't get them

00:13:10   when they were first on sale. They're available. I looked on Amazon the other day and, and

00:13:17   they were available for, for Amazon prime shipping that day immediately before Christmas,

00:13:22   the whole thing. And they may be in stores too, cause I haven't, I haven't been in a

00:13:26   store because why would I do that to myself in the last couple of weeks? But, but they're,

00:13:31   They're around, so don't, if you thought that that would be a cool gift but you've given

00:13:35   up hope on it, you could actually check it out because you may be able to find the BB-8.

00:13:39   They were hard to get when they were released, and I wouldn't be surprised if one of the

00:13:43   reasons they released it so early, they released it as part of that Force Friday thing, which

00:13:47   so it gave people the time to get one. So you can still get them, and if you're interested

00:13:52   or know somebody that is, you should because it's awesome.

00:13:55   Yeah, very cool. I saw when I was at Twit doing new screensavers, I think, we had a guest who was,

00:14:04   they did a teardown of BB-8, the BB-8 toy, and it was pretty cool, like how they make it do what it

00:14:12   does, like where the chips are and where the magnets are and, you know, it was, and the

00:14:17   physics of how it works, and it's pretty cool, pretty cool. I'll put a link to that in the show

00:14:22   shouldn't it's the episode of the new screen savers.

00:14:25   Yeah. I have another thing that's also not follow-up, but this is the pre-Christmas show,

00:14:31   and so we're like, "Well, what's going on?" Nothing. And I wanted to do follow-out, so

00:14:39   it is sort of follow-up, about the episode of Top Four that featured on this very podcast

00:14:45   Network, Real AFM, that featured Marco and Tiff Arment and their top four things of whatever.

00:14:57   That should be the show description, top four things of whatever. And there was a special

00:15:01   episode number nine that also featured you and your girlfriend, Adina, talking about

00:15:08   Christmas songs. And I wanted to mention that because I just finished listening to it, in

00:15:13   fact the other day and it was I'm so backed up on podcasts it's a disaster but I did listen

00:15:18   to this and it was it was delightful for many reasons including the fact that it was set

00:15:23   up so that you could all play the music and respond to it and the way the way that was

00:15:28   all set up and the way Marco edited it it's great because you know you want to hear the

00:15:32   music you're talking about but and you do but more than that you hear the people who

00:15:38   are talking about the music react to it, which is beautiful. I also, my other things that

00:15:45   I like about that episode is that Marco only has one selection and it's number four.

00:15:49   - Yep.

00:15:50   - Cause that guy does not know how top four lists work, which is a problem for a show

00:15:56   that is about top four lists. And the selections were hilarious and some of them I agree. I

00:16:03   actually agree with you completely about Last Christmas by Wham.

00:16:06   - Good man.

00:16:07   It's a great song. Great song. Great song. I am from the 80s, so I've got that going

00:16:11   from... That's a great song. The Wham version is the only acceptable version. Yeah, I agree.

00:16:15   And that's amazing to say, because if there were a Michael Buble version, you would think

00:16:19   that you would like it. Is there a Michael Buble version of that? There probably is.

00:16:22   I don't think there is. I haven't come across that. But I don't think it would be able to,

00:16:26   even though as great... Because that's the other thing I learned from that, is that basically

00:16:29   Myke Hurley's musical take on Christmas songs is, "That's good, but it could use more Michael

00:16:37   Buble. He's just really good at this type of music.

00:16:41   You know, the Michael Buble song you should listen to, that I have in my library, is when

00:16:46   the, I think it was the first Spider-Man movie, it might have been the second Spider-Man movie

00:16:52   came out. They had Michael Buble do a swinging version of the Spider-Man theme.

00:16:58   I think I've heard that. It's so great. And I used to do, we had a

00:17:04   guy I worked with had a, basically a karaoke band. They were a live band without a singer

00:17:09   and you could pick a song and they'd play it and you got to sing it. And they did, it's

00:17:14   the one that was at Jim Dalrymple's party at WWDC. It's that band. And the first time,

00:17:20   it was a long time ago, like '97 or something. First time we did a party with those guys,

00:17:25   I said, "I'm not singing. Forget it. There's no way I'm singing." And they're like, "Oh,

00:17:29   come on, you have to." I said, "Okay, I'll make you a deal. If they know the theme from

00:17:32   Spider-Man I'll sing. Well guess what? On the last the last item on the last page of

00:17:38   their song list was the theme from Spider-Man. So I did it but I always dreamed of how it

00:17:42   would be like sound really good as that slowed down kind of kind of swing version of the

00:17:47   Spider-Man song. Michael Buble does that. It's brilliant. So there you go.

00:17:51   I wish I could have had you do that.

00:17:53   Oh yeah. Oh yeah. My Spider-Man theme I would say better than my Baby One More Time by Britney

00:18:01   Spears which I... which is the rock version like the Fountains of Wayne version of that

00:18:05   which is also an excellent cover. People should seek out the the Fountains of Wayne version

00:18:09   of Baby one more time. It's pretty great. But you know I've mentioned this before I'll

00:18:13   mention it again if you do want to see Jason sing there is a place that that happens it

00:18:18   will be in the show notes episode 17 of It Might Get Personal and you sing Don't Dream

00:18:23   It's Over which I love. I've listened to that many times. I also wanted to mention what

00:18:29   we're talking about in respect that top four and Christmas there is now a B-side

00:18:34   the first ever non attached to a podcast episode Myke at the Movies required a

00:18:42   revision of the relay CMS yes we don't need to get into that but yes it did

00:18:48   there is now a B-side and it's also on the incomparable feed of myself and Tiff

00:18:54   Arment talking about National Lampoon's Christmas vacation so if you want to get

00:18:58   in the holiday spirit and that is a movie that you like you should listen to that if

00:19:02   you've never seen that then you should go and watch it and then join in with the Christmas

00:19:07   Vacation episode I'd never seen Christmas Vacation so it was kind of perfect and we

00:19:12   watched that and it was a very good Christmas feeling movie so there is your follow out

00:19:19   for this week's episode of Upgrade should we move on with our first sponsor of this

00:19:24   week's show? Yeah, let's do it. I'd like to take a moment to thank Braintree Code for

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00:21:01   Neither a brain nor a tree by the way.

00:21:04   Indeed.

00:21:05   Oh I've got a, I've got some exciting news Myke.

00:21:07   Oh yeah?

00:21:08   I sent you a package.

00:21:09   Oh it hasn't arrived yet.

00:21:11   When did you send it?

00:21:12   Oh yeah I know.

00:21:13   it like Friday, it's gonna be late. You'll get it eventually.

00:21:17   - Yeah, I might get it for my birthday. - Yeah, you'll get it when's your birthday.

00:21:21   - January 31st. - Yeah, you'll probably get it by then. But I did send you it sort of,

00:21:28   yes. It's got some good stuff in it. It's all themed around our show and our sponsors actually,

00:21:35   strangely. But we'll talk about that when you receive it. I did wanna do a mini analog,

00:21:43   your podcast with Casey List where you talk about more personal stuff, which is a very

00:21:48   interesting podcast. I wanted to ask about Christmas stuff since this is Christmas week.

00:21:55   We're only a few days away. I was just curious. We don't have to take a lot of time with this,

00:22:00   but I was curious, do you have any particular like Christmas traditions that you do and

00:22:05   what are your plans? Not in detail. You don't need to tell me where you're going to be,

00:22:10   like, but sort of like what, you know, what are you looking forward to, like, for actually

00:22:14   what you do, like, during Christmas week and Christmas Eve and Christmas Day?

00:22:18   >> Uh, Christmas Eve, I'm actually going to see Star Wars again.

00:22:22   >> Oh, that's nice.

00:22:23   >> I'm taking my brother, yeah, because he just got back from Australia, so he hadn't

00:22:28   yet seen it, so I booked tickets for the two of us to go on Christmas Eve. We're going

00:22:31   to an IMAX, because I haven't seen it in IMAX. So we're going to go do that together. Then

00:22:35   we'll have dinner with my dad on Christmas Eve. We always do, that's when we exchange

00:22:40   presents of my dad. This year is slightly different we're quite a small family

00:22:46   especially over Christmas it's just like a basically it's me, my brothers, his

00:22:51   family's wife and kids and it'd be my mum and my nan that's usually it for

00:22:56   Christmas but this year is gonna be my first Christmas without children in the

00:23:01   house on Christmas Day because my brother is having his first family

00:23:06   Christmas at home where he lives down on the coast. So they're having that and then coming

00:23:11   to us on Boxing Day which is the 26th for those of you that don't know. So it's actually

00:23:16   just going to be me, my younger brother who's 21, my grandma and my mum. And it's going

00:23:23   to be very different. We're going to wake up late, you know, like it's going to be a

00:23:26   very different feeling Christmas so I'm very interested to see how that is. And then I

00:23:30   guess for traditions wise, I guess we just had the little things that we do in England

00:23:36   which are different. Right? So we have, I don't know about you, but we have dinner at

00:23:41   lunchtime, we have a Christmas dinner at lunchtime. We have things like Christmas crackers, are

00:23:46   you familiar with Christmas crackers, Jason?

00:23:48   JASON Yeah, I am, but people out there are, we do

00:23:52   those on New Year's actually, we try to buy some crackers at the, there's a store that

00:23:57   sells them that's like the international things store, and we get them, we can get them there

00:24:03   and we try to do that like a New Year's Eve, we do those. But not on Christmas, I don't

00:24:09   think, well, we did that. We actually did get those and do those a couple of years ago,

00:24:12   just for fun. But I know that's an English tradition. They're little bundles that you

00:24:16   pull open and they pop and they've got like a little toy or a little surprise inside.

00:24:20   - Yeah, and a little hat. So we do them at dinner.

00:24:21   - And a crown.

00:24:22   - Yeah, and then we all wear the crowns, the hats as we eat dinner.

00:24:26   - Yeah, that is pretty great. I have a picture of my family from a few years ago and we all

00:24:32   have little pink and red paper crowns on our heads. It's adorable.

00:24:38   >>TIM And then we tend to repeat Christmas dinner on Boxing Day. That's not something

00:24:45   that happens everywhere, but we have like another one on Boxing Day.

00:24:49   >>DAVID Ah, interesting. With the same stuff or…

00:24:52   >>TIM Yeah, all the same food. I mean, the turkey is, you know, it's the leftover,

00:24:55   that's what we do with our leftover turkey basically. We eat it on Boxing Day as a full-on

00:24:59   second Christmas.

00:25:00   Christmas that's neat yeah that's fun yeah and my grandma does the cooking

00:25:04   because she's the best and it's just so good that's one of the reasons that we

00:25:09   have Christmas at her house because she loves to entertain she loves to cook for

00:25:14   us and it's always good so that's that's that's basically my Christmas probably

00:25:19   this year's Christmas will include more alcohol than usual because there's no

00:25:23   children around so that will probably be the theme of my head I had already

00:25:28   I've already figured that one out, Myke.

00:25:31   Just spelling it out for everyone.

00:25:33   Actually, I was talking to one of my friends who's a Dr. Who fan, and they were talking

00:25:36   about how Dr. Who is on at like five o'clock this year. It's very early. Because Christmas

00:25:42   TV is apparently a thing in Britain too. Here, networks basically abandon television. We're

00:25:47   reruns or maybe sports, but really there's kind of nothing. Whereas in Britain, it's

00:25:52   a huge thing that in the evening of Christmas night, that there are things on television.

00:25:57   But also we were talking, so Doctor Who does a Christmas special, this is going to be like

00:26:00   the 11th or the 12th or something. It's kind of crazy that they do one every year now.

00:26:05   But when I was talking to this person, they mentioned that one thing that Americans also

00:26:10   don't understand about Christmas in the UK is that people are drunk when they're watching

00:26:16   TV in the evening. That is also a thing that happens. And I think maybe more than it does

00:26:21   in America.

00:26:22   Yeah, we're a boozy nation.

00:26:23   Yeah.

00:26:24   What about you, Jason?

00:26:25   Lots of candy, too.

00:26:26   Lots of candy.

00:26:27   Oh, yeah.

00:26:28   Lots of chocolate.

00:26:29   All the chocolate.

00:26:30   So many selection boxes of chocolate.

00:26:31   Mm-hmm.

00:26:32   Yeah.

00:26:33   It's gonna be--

00:26:34   Selection boxes.

00:26:35   That sounds like something that would be in a user interface.

00:26:38   It's basically lots, you know, like you can get like--

00:26:40   It's a sampler box, yeah.

00:26:41   A sampler.

00:26:42   There you go.

00:26:43   We call them selection boxes.

00:26:44   Yeah, I know.

00:26:45   It's just that was--I don't think I've heard that term before, but I know exactly what

00:26:48   you mean.

00:26:49   Famously, it's the Whitman sampler in California and in the West Coast. We have See's Candy

00:26:56   that has the sampler boxes. So yes, absolutely. Selection boxes. So much. For me, it's similar

00:27:04   to your brother actually. This year I told my mother and the other, we told everybody

00:27:12   in our family we weren't going to go anywhere this year for Thanksgiving or Christmas. We

00:27:15   We just decided for Christmas especially, every year for the last, I don't know, seven,

00:27:21   eight years, maybe even longer, we have gone somewhere else for Christmas, generally to

00:27:28   Arizona where my mom lives.

00:27:31   And that was fine.

00:27:35   Going to grandma and grandpa's house for Christmas was a fun thing to do when my kids were little.

00:27:39   But there is something so dispiriting about having a tree.

00:27:42   Some years we didn't even have a tree here.

00:27:45   years that was so sad that we're like, "Okay, we'll get a tree," and we would get a tree

00:27:48   right after Thanksgiving. And then on the 20th or 22nd or whenever we would have to

00:27:53   leave to drive all the way to Arizona, which takes two days, by the way, which is another

00:27:57   reason we didn't want to do it, you got to take the tree down because you're not going

00:28:01   to be back for more than a week. So we would take the tree down and put it outside. And

00:28:06   it was the saddest thing to take the tree and dismantle it before Christmas. And I know

00:28:13   that's like a kind of a funny thing, but it's like, "No, I want to have Christmas. I want

00:28:16   to have my tree. I want to be in my house on Christmas Day." And my mom is coming this

00:28:21   afternoon actually. She's coming and she's going to stay with us for the week. And that's

00:28:25   great, but we didn't want to do it somewhere else this year. So I'm looking forward to

00:28:31   it. I assume we will replay. Lauren and I actually have to figure out our game plan

00:28:35   here, but I assume we're going to replay our Thanksgiving in some ways with the dishes.

00:28:41   I'm not sure if we're gonna do a turkey. We may actually do a steak instead, like a big

00:28:45   flank steak, but we have to put that together today basically. We're gonna do our shopping

00:28:51   list and plan it all out and what are the sides and all that. But otherwise it's quite

00:28:55   similar that in the morning, now that the kids are older, they get up a little bit later,

00:28:59   but we'll do the presents thing on Christmas morning and then there'll be a dinner, but

00:29:08   it'll be midday or maybe two in the afternoon, something like that. And yeah, it's fun. It's

00:29:15   fun, but we're doing it here. I'm looking forward to having it be at my house and being

00:29:19   able to--I think that's one of the great things about Christmas, being able--especially as

00:29:24   an adult--is being able to have that nesting kind of feeling of Christmas and it's at your

00:29:30   place. And I've enjoyed the kind of Christmas trip thing for a while, but it's time to go

00:29:36   go back to home. So Christmas at home this year.

00:29:39   You're saying about turkey. I can't imagine Christmas without turkey. Because it's our

00:29:45   only turkey dinner, you know. We don't have Thanksgiving.

00:29:49   Yeah, we do it all on Thanksgiving. And I make a good turkey, I have to say. I could

00:29:57   do it again. And we might go that way. I use a brine. I brine it. There's Alton Brown,

00:30:04   the TV food guy has a recipe for that that he did on his show Good Eats that I love and

00:30:12   it's you know you make this big briny liquid in a five gallon plastic bucket from the Home

00:30:18   Depot and you stick the turkey in it and it sits there overnight in the garage out in

00:30:25   the corner and then in the morning you know you pull it out and pat it down and put stuff

00:30:31   in it and like aromatics and stuff, not the actual stuffing. And it's great. It's juicy

00:30:38   and tasty and all of those things. So we might do that, but it is a lot of hassle and nobody

00:30:42   seems to like the dark meat. And so I feel like it's kind of wasted, although the leftovers

00:30:46   are pretty great. So this is the internal debate is it would be much easier to marinate

00:30:50   a flank steak and just do it that way and everybody would enjoy it. And it would be

00:30:54   great. My kids like that better than turkey, but we may end up with a turkey anyway. That's

00:31:00   I feel like you're talking yourself into it.

00:31:02   No, I go back and forth on it. I see all the pros and cons and this is the nice thing about

00:31:07   having a marriage is that, you know, I don't have to make the call. We're going to, we'll

00:31:12   talk it through and see, you know, if Lauren's inclined and I'm inclined, then we'll go that

00:31:16   direction. There's also the question of like, can we get one? You know, I'm sure we can,

00:31:20   but we should probably plan that. So, yeah, it's fun. You know, traditions are fun and

00:31:26   I think they can become a problem when you become chained to them and you don't want

00:31:31   to do them, but you do them because you feel like they're necessary or that you'll be judged

00:31:35   if you don't do them. But if you enjoy them and enjoy the rhythm of it, I think that people

00:31:40   in general, it's like in human nature to like patterns and repetition, and that can lead

00:31:47   to bad habits and things like that too, but it can also be kind of fun. And the whole

00:31:51   Christmas experience from the decorations and the music and the family and the meals

00:31:58   and things like that. It's kind of comforting and also is cyclical. There's something about

00:32:05   that that this is the end of one year and the beginning of the next and you can mark

00:32:09   time, the passage of time with it. So I love Christmas, it's great.

00:32:16   So we have in our document here, we have an area of our document which we have now started

00:32:22   to refer to as the cryogenic chamber of topics.

00:32:25   Yes, it's the graveyard. It's the ore. The evergreen, we used to call it in the magazine

00:32:31   business, it's evergreen, meaning just put it over there, it never goes out of date,

00:32:36   it just sits there. Eventually it does actually go out of date, but you don't need to do it

00:32:40   this week because it could go on forever. And we got a lot of stuff in there. We could

00:32:44   do like the wheel of fortune from the cryogenic chamber. There is so much stuff in there.

00:32:52   Home networks, comic books. We should talk about comic books sometime. That would be

00:32:56   fun. Family sharing is in there and that was one where we felt like we were being so negative

00:33:03   for a while that we need to give some space to that because that's going to be a rent.

00:33:10   just invite Joe Steele back. We'll just tear it apart because family sharing and sharing

00:33:17   Apple IDs and the way Apple's got Apple ID stuff set up is a total mess. So that's in

00:33:21   there. YouTube Red and Google Podcasts and stuff is in there. Preparing for a new OS

00:33:27   was in there from when we were talking about upgrading to El Capitan. Home automation is

00:33:32   in there, I've written about that a lot. So many things to talk about. So are we pulling

00:33:40   some things out of the deep freeze today? Is that what's happening?

00:33:42   We're pulling one thing out.

00:33:44   Alright.

00:33:45   And that's Amazon Prime Air.

00:33:47   Okay. Was this topic delivered from the cryo chamber by drone?

00:33:51   Yeah, that's how it came to me today. They dropped it into the document via a little

00:33:56   Google Docs drone.

00:33:57   You put a little placemat down and then the drone drops the topic in.

00:34:01   It's just where you put your cursor.

00:34:02   That's where they drop it.

00:34:03   So this is for anybody that doesn't know, Amazon Prime Air is a kind of future

00:34:10   initiative from Amazon.

00:34:11   It's something that they are talking about that they want to do.

00:34:14   They're developing, um, the technology that they need.

00:34:17   But one of the main reasons that Prime Air exists as a thing right now is my belief

00:34:23   and what is I think quite evident is that Amazon are trying to use the excitement

00:34:28   behind something like this to lobby the agencies that make the rules for drones and stuff like

00:34:34   that. It's the FAA in America, right? A lot of this stuff exists as a way to try and lobby

00:34:41   the decision makers and the lawmakers into helping them make the decision. That will

00:34:47   mean that Amazon can start delivering packages via drone flight. Is that fair to say? That

00:34:53   is how it seems to me.

00:34:55   Yeah, I think so. This is about, yeah, it's about demonstrating this technically and politically

00:35:02   and trying to build some kind of consumer understanding about how it might, you know,

00:35:07   how do we picture this? How might it work? And why would that be good for everybody?

00:35:13   So they created a video about this many months ago, where they just kind of gave a demonstration

00:35:19   of what this type of thing could look like. And more recently, and within the last month

00:35:24   or two, they have used their brand new company spokesman Jeremy Clarkson, who has done all

00:35:29   of Amazon's ads now, to kind of show an update video and they show a little bit more of a

00:35:37   finalised drone and what that could look like and they show some non-computer animation,

00:35:43   like it looks like computer animation but they say that this is the thing really flying,

00:35:47   and give a little bit more detail into how this type of thing could work. Because I remember

00:35:51   originally people saying like oh if these drones, they're going to deliver things outside

00:35:57   your home and people are just going to steal the stuff and they showed some more real world

00:36:02   scenarios into how something like this might work. So the overall view of this is Amazon

00:36:07   expects this to be like a 30 minute delivery type thing, that's how they're dealing with

00:36:12   this. So they have their Prime Now I think it's called which is one hour delivery in

00:36:15   certain areas so they're expecting Prime Air to do things within 30 minutes. So the idea

00:36:20   being you would be at home and you would realize you need something you go on

00:36:25   Amazon you see that it's available for Prime Air and you ship it you know so

00:36:30   you choose what you want you select it it probably costs an exorbitant amount

00:36:33   of money and then you go out to like your backyard and you place down this

00:36:37   little map which has got the Amazon logo on it and what I expect is occurring

00:36:44   here is that the computer system inside of the drone is looking for that map

00:36:47   because that's where it lands, that's where it drops it off.

00:36:50   So what it seems like you would do this for, you are at home and you need something,

00:36:55   so it comes and delivers it to you at home. That's how it works.

00:37:00   And I think that this is a very interesting thing. And I'm kind of, wanted us to talk about

00:37:08   why we would want this if we would want this. So how do you feel about this kind of idea,

00:37:14   Jason, do you like the idea of having the magic trackpad that you need delivered to

00:37:19   you by drone?

00:37:20   JASON DOUGLAS - I don't know, I mean, how often is it that we need something delivered

00:37:27   to us immediately? I mean, the video is cute, it's the girl who's lost a shoe, and I think,

00:37:34   "Well, she just lost it," unless the dog ate it, and then they cut to the dog and the

00:37:37   dog ate it, so. And it's a cute English bulldog, it's adorable. And so, yeah, but how often

00:37:44   does that happen?" And you probably have a shoe store that you could go to. But yeah,

00:37:48   "Oh no, no, we can't go outside. That's crazy." So it sounds like a good idea on very specific

00:37:56   like scenarios, but I don't know how... Then again, wouldn't it be great if you realized

00:38:03   you needed a thing and you could have a little thing bring it to you. But, you know, other

00:38:08   people are trying this with Uber and, you know, there are other services in cities that

00:38:12   will do this. So I don't know, I don't know, it's a great video. It seems really, it makes

00:38:22   it seem more practical than perhaps it actually is. I like that putting the mat down is really

00:38:28   smart. It makes it feel like that extra bit of user interaction, I think makes it feel

00:38:34   more like a, I don't know, more understandable and controllable in a strange way. The idea

00:38:40   that like it's not like, oh, the robot doesn't just appear at your door. You go outside and

00:38:44   throw a mat down and then the thing lands because it sees where you're telling it to

00:38:48   land. It's like a little temporary helipad on your front lawn. I don't know. You got

00:38:57   to be near an Amazon distribution center. What's the range of these things? What's the

00:39:02   markup and cost? Actually, the airspace issue is one of the things that concerns me the

00:39:10   least in a sense because this does seem like kind of unused airspace and I do believe that

00:39:15   the technology is going to be good enough that these devices are going to be able to

00:39:18   navigate around and be smart about not crashing into people's houses or killing birds or whatever.

00:39:26   But I don't know, it's a weird, it's really weird and it's really weird that they're trying

00:39:31   this because is this something that has huge potential? Is Amazon going to have, you know,

00:39:36   thousands of drones flying around cities all over the world. I don't know.

00:39:42   I don't think we're ever going to get to a situation where it's like constant, like

00:39:46   this just just just like the sky is just littered with drones for the reason of like why did

00:39:51   you know that you brought this up earlier like how often you're going to need this but

00:39:55   I think that that's inbuilt in the reason for existing like this exists for the thing

00:40:00   that you need right now and that doesn't happen very often.

00:40:04   that you can't wait a day for Prime delivery.

00:40:07   - Well, and there are, you know,

00:40:09   Amazon's also experimenting with same day delivery

00:40:12   in certain cities, right?

00:40:13   And you pay an extra fee,

00:40:15   but you get somebody brings it to your house that day,

00:40:17   whether it's a delivery,

00:40:19   traditional delivery company that they're working with,

00:40:21   or whether it's a, you know,

00:40:23   some person in a van comes to your house

00:40:25   and says, "I got your box here."

00:40:27   - You can assume that Amazon doesn't want that to exist.

00:40:31   They want, because my assumption looking at this is,

00:40:36   Amazon are trying to replace Prime Now,

00:40:39   the same day delivery with Prime Now.

00:40:41   Because the only reason Prime Now exists

00:40:43   is because you're close to a distribution center,

00:40:45   which means a drone could bring it, unless it's a big thing.

00:40:48   So my assumption would be that they don't want

00:40:50   delivery drivers bringing video games

00:40:54   to people's houses anymore on the same day.

00:40:56   They want it taken by a drone

00:40:58   because that is so much cheaper, right?

00:41:01   That's my assumption in looking at this.

00:41:03   - In the long run, it's cheaper

00:41:04   because you can just build it out of hardware

00:41:07   and you can program the software and then they all,

00:41:10   you know, you don't have to pay a human.

00:41:12   And yeah, I can see it.

00:41:14   I mean, I don't think this is unreasonable.

00:41:16   I actually, I mean, you always start to think

00:41:18   about your own situation and think,

00:41:23   well, I don't have an Amazon distribution warehouse

00:41:27   anywhere near me.

00:41:28   And I know what they're trying to do

00:41:30   they're also trying to build these things in cities where they've got a limited supply

00:41:34   of the most popular items and that's one of the other ways that they do this. It's, you

00:41:39   know, I don't know, I definitely thought about it and there are those moments where I thought,

00:41:43   oh, well, that would be great. But in most cases, I can just go to the store and buy

00:41:48   things, right? Maybe I can't get the exact thing, but there's going to still be some

00:41:54   luck about whether the exact thing is at that Amazon warehouse. Anyway, like I can go to

00:41:58   the shoe store and buy my kid some new soccer shoes if the dog eats one of the shoes, which

00:42:05   is the scenario in the Jeremy Clarkson video. So I actually started to think that this would

00:42:11   be really cool in areas that had more kind of geographic issues. And there are different

00:42:18   kinds of geographic issues. Like I could see this being valuable in cities that have horrible

00:42:23   traffic problems, that where you really can't get to wherever you need to go. But especially

00:42:29   in places where there aren't things near you. The challenge there is that the drone's got

00:42:35   to fly to you, and it's got a limited range. So somebody out in the countryside who doesn't

00:42:41   have access to something, is a drone going to fly 30 miles to them or something like

00:42:45   that? Maybe. But that seems like in the short run, this is going to be for people in pretty

00:42:49   densely populated areas where, you know, again, you're investing all of this effort in a service

00:42:57   to keep, to save people from having to drive or walk or take the bus down the street to

00:43:02   get something at the shop.

00:43:04   David: So I was thinking like, you know, I live in a relatively suburban area and there

00:43:09   aren't really any stores where I can get the majority of things that I would buy from Amazon.

00:43:15   You know, like there aren't, I mean there's like a couple of food stores and that's about

00:43:19   it, where I live.

00:43:20   And if I want to get to anywhere where I could buy things I would buy on Amazon, like computer

00:43:26   things, games, Blu-rays, that type of stuff, right?

00:43:29   Books, things you tend to buy on Amazon.

00:43:32   I would need to get on public transport because I don't drive.

00:43:36   And then I'm looking at a probably, you know, 30 minute each way type scenario to get to

00:43:42   to somewhere where I could be pretty confident it has the stuff that I want. So for me, I

00:43:47   would use something like this. And then the other part of it is, the Prime Now service

00:43:52   doesn't deliver to my area currently. They tend to do that within the big cities because

00:43:58   they do what you just mentioned. They have these places that have the most popular items

00:44:03   and they do it in the big cities because where the most people are they'll get the best coverage

00:44:06   that way. But if you think about it, if you take it out far enough, the place where it's

00:44:10   probably cheapest for Amazon to build and operate new distribution centers is

00:44:17   in places like where I live where it's cheap or real estate is cheaper so in

00:44:22   the future I could have a Amazon warehouse not too far from me because

00:44:29   like there are there are a bunch of factories and warehouses like about

00:44:32   another 20 minutes down the road from where I live so they could build one

00:44:35   there and then could ship things to me I also see stuff like this as a you know

00:44:40   if Amazon ever wanted it they could open you know stores in these distribution

00:44:44   centers and stuff like that like you know I can imagine a Best Buy or

00:44:47   something because they I saw somewhere in Seattle they just opened their first

00:44:51   retail location right which is really interesting that they operate in both

00:44:54   extremes of this but so you know for me Amazon Prime Air seems like something I

00:45:01   would really like because I could I I use Prime I love Prime I love the next

00:45:05   delivery but there are certain things like I just bought Fallout 4 on PlayStation because it was

00:45:12   like £30 on Amazon which is a pretty good discount, it's like 25% off already and I had

00:45:18   bought it and it came to me today, I ordered it yesterday but there was a, you know, when thinking

00:45:23   about this topic I was like when I bought it was because I wanted it, if I could have paid

00:45:28   two or three pounds, four pounds extra and had it in 30 minutes I would have done that.

00:45:33   that. Because I can imagine that's the kind of price it would be on top for a Prime member,

00:45:39   because you're already getting discounted shipping, you pay a little bit extra and you

00:45:43   get it delivered to you by drone. And the whole thing is like impulse buys, right? These

00:45:48   drones are small, but what tends to be small is impulse buys. The things that you buy,

00:45:55   like there's a movie that you want and you want it on Blu-ray so you just buy it and

00:45:59   have the drone bring it to you in 30 minutes or a video game or like a new mouse because

00:46:04   or something you know let's say that my keyboard exploded not that it could do that but I'm

00:46:09   sure in the future they'll be nuclear powered so they will my keyboard explodes and I'm

00:46:14   halfway through writing something I need a keyboard and the drone could bring it to me

00:46:17   in 30 minutes otherwise it's going to be a 90 minute trip you know there are things that

00:46:21   I'm like yeah I want this like this is something that would I would find useful and I know

00:46:27   it's lazy but it's convenience and I think that laziness and convenience whilst they are

00:46:33   kind of two sides of the same coin in most instances I think I can see the difference

00:46:39   between them and it's just because I am at home now I work from home I don't work in the city

00:46:44   anymore like I used to where I could pick things up on the way home like for me because I don't have

00:46:49   a car these things become more tricky and especially in London and in England less people

00:46:55   of my age are buying and owning cars because it's too expensive. So in that future, I again,

00:47:01   I understand more why something like drone delivery starts to make sense.

00:47:05   I see what you're saying, but at the same time, I have that moment of like,

00:47:10   you can't wait till tomorrow to play Fallout 4?

00:47:13   But that's an impulse buy. I mean, and I did, and I happily waited. But if I could have had

00:47:18   it delivered to me by drone in 30 minutes, I would have done because why not?

00:47:24   Well there you go, I think that is a great slogan for this service.

00:47:28   Because why not?

00:47:29   Because why not?

00:47:30   And I know that a lot of people are going to be like, "Oh, listen to him, he's so entitled."

00:47:34   But this is my generation, ladies and gentlemen, because we were brought up in the internet

00:47:38   age.

00:47:39   And for example, that's why you can buy Fallout 4 on the PlayStation Store and download it.

00:47:45   But my internet connection can't cope with that.

00:47:47   It can't download a 30GB game.

00:47:50   So I have to buy physical disks.

00:47:53   So things that should be digital and are digital I can't access that way. So I have to buy

00:47:58   the physical copies which makes it less of an impulse buy.

00:48:03   My generation is the generation of things being instant. And if you think about your

00:48:08   kids, I at least still have the hang up and the hangover of the 90s and early 2000s. But

00:48:18   your kids, they're in this world way more than me or you are, right? Everything is just

00:48:23   a click of a button and it's there. And you think about that. That's why stuff like I

00:48:28   believe what stuff like this exists because and will exist because for the things that

00:48:33   you need that you can't download, you want them quickly because like everything else.

00:48:38   **Matt Stauffer** So this is essentially these are downloads for physical items.

00:48:41   **

00:48:41   Yeah, that's how I look at it. Because it's 30 minutes, that's a download wait time, right?

00:48:46   And then it arrives. Job done.

00:48:48   Yeah, I just, so I come back to the practicality of it, which is can they do, short of a revolution

00:48:54   where like all the stores close and everything is brought to you by robots, which, you know,

00:48:58   could happen. You know, it's not, seriously, it's not beyond the realm that I could, like

00:49:06   I can shop by the web right now at my local Safeway store.

00:49:11   I can check with the boxes of all the things that I want

00:49:13   and somebody will bring it to me

00:49:14   and we never do it that way.

00:49:16   But we could do it.

00:49:17   - That's how me and Adina shop.

00:49:18   We have all of our groceries delivered to us.

00:49:22   - Yeah, we can do that.

00:49:23   I know a lot of people in New York

00:49:23   that they do it that way too,

00:49:25   because it's impractical to go.

00:49:27   And also there are places in New York

00:49:28   where you shop at the store

00:49:31   and at the end of a process you pay

00:49:33   and they deliver it to you later.

00:49:36   When I was 17, that was my job, Jason.

00:49:38   - Ah, to deliver the groceries.

00:49:40   - Yeah, well I was always like the assistant guy,

00:49:43   'cause I don't have a driving license,

00:49:44   but I was one of the guys that was in a van.

00:49:47   It was in a supermarket called Waitrose,

00:49:50   which is a fancy supermarket.

00:49:52   And people would come in, they would do their shopping,

00:49:55   and then they would say, "I want this to be delivered."

00:49:58   Someone would come along, bag it,

00:50:00   and they would book in a time,

00:50:02   and then me and the delivery guy would jump in a van,

00:50:05   and take around all the deliveries the next day.

00:50:08   It was, I loved that job, Jason.

00:50:10   Aside from this, it's my favorite job I ever had.

00:50:14   I loved that job, it was so great.

00:50:16   But because it was so simple, right?

00:50:17   We just used to just jump in the van.

00:50:19   There was no stresses, you know?

00:50:20   There was no like corporate crap I had to deal with,

00:50:24   like in my later jobs.

00:50:26   The worst thing that could happen

00:50:28   was we drop a bottle of wine, which we did once,

00:50:30   and it was horrific.

00:50:32   It was actually six bottles of wine.

00:50:35   and it was horrible. But aside from that, you know, no stresses. But yeah, that's, I've

00:50:41   totally cut off your point. But yeah, that is something that happens a lot. People have

00:50:44   their groceries delivered to them now. And again, it's like for us it's because we can't

00:50:48   go to the store, put them in the car and drive them home.

00:50:51   Exactly right. Exactly. Like I was saying, I know people in New York who do that and

00:50:54   that's the reason is that they can't, they can go to the store, but they can't take a

00:50:58   shopping trip worth of stuff home with them because they would have to carry it themselves

00:51:01   and they've got kids or whatever, and it's just not practical. So instead, they do that.

00:51:06   It actually makes sense. So I guess that's what I'm saying is I can extend that out and

00:51:10   say, "I could do that too. Other people could do that. The storefronts could become less

00:51:15   important as the delivery. You could have large items delivered by self-driving car.

00:51:20   You could have small items delivered by little drones." It's possible. It's entirely possible.

00:51:25   I think where it breaks down for me is I'm not sure I believe that the range and the

00:51:31   availability will be beyond sort of like urban centres.

00:51:35   And as somebody who grew up out in the middle of nowhere, I actually think like longer range

00:51:41   delivery would be more exciting because there are people who have access to nothing.

00:51:45   Yeah, I think that that is a, again, this is already the future.

00:51:50   That just feels like future times two, right?

00:51:52   I feel like it's definitely possible that that could be the case, that this would be

00:51:57   a way for Amazon to service everyone.

00:52:00   That sounded a little threatening.

00:52:06   It did. I added that in. But that is it though, right? That is obviously the evil maniacal

00:52:13   goal of this. This puts Amazon everywhere. If you are Jeff Bezos, that's what you do

00:52:21   as well, right? Because these things will be cheaper to run and operate than putting

00:52:27   people in vans.

00:52:29   Well, and I think the argument would be more efficient than rather than people in vans,

00:52:33   you've got people loading drones.

00:52:35   Yeah, people still loading the vans though, that aren't the same people that drive the

00:52:39   vans.

00:52:40   Yeah, but I'm just saying you're reducing the inefficiency. The people are part of the

00:52:46   inefficiency there, but I think it's also just the time, you know, the driving and all

00:52:50   of that and the idea is that then you've got everybody working back at the warehouse and

00:52:54   they don't have to go out they just stay at the warehouse and they're you know and they

00:52:57   work them to death at the warehouse instead. Yeah interesting interesting world we live

00:53:05   in it was like it's a great video people should watch it.

00:53:07   Yeah there was one last point on this like the reason I wanted to talk about this anyway

00:53:11   which is because I watched a Mythbusters episode yesterday in which they tested how deadly

00:53:18   drones are and basically what they did was they took two drones one that was

00:53:24   like a one that anyone can buy like a toy one and one that was used for

00:53:29   commercial use like it wasn't they had their own custom-built drone for

00:53:33   camera work but this is one that you could buy right that people can buy and

00:53:37   attach cameras to and it's used frequently and they created like a neck

00:53:42   analog with veins in it and stuff right and were flying the drones into this

00:53:48   neck and both of the drones that you can buy did no damage like they were built

00:53:54   so that the rudders would not slice anyone basically was the thinking but

00:54:01   then they used their own one that they built and it had like carbon fiber

00:54:05   blades and it just destroyed the neck of this that they created so you don't want

00:54:11   to run into the Mythbusters drone but basically the idea of this was saying

00:54:15   that as long as people stick to the current kind of ways of doing things and safety then these things

00:54:22   are fine and probably stuff like amazon would use would be built to not um to not be able to kind of

00:54:30   cut somebody open if it crashed into them but it was just it was just interesting to me that it is

00:54:35   that that is part of it though like that is part of the risk i guess is that oh yeah people are

00:54:40   dangerous. - Well, and it's part of the political risk,

00:54:44   I think even more so is this fear of death from the skies,

00:54:48   right? (laughs)

00:54:49   That people are like, "Oh no, it's gonna crash into us.

00:54:52   "It's gonna ruin everything.

00:54:53   "The robot drones are here to kill us all."

00:54:55   And so being able to say, "No, it's fine.

00:54:58   "It's okay, don't worry about it.

00:55:01   "It's all good, that's good."

00:55:04   - But that's drones, there's nothing anybody like us

00:55:07   can do about it unless we work for the FAA.

00:55:09   they can do something about it. Otherwise, you're going to get little packages delivered

00:55:13   to your home by some kind of flying robot.

00:55:16   >> Before we go to Ask Upgrade, I wanted to mention something that I intended to be in

00:55:21   follow-up and I didn't think of it at the time. And it's just a fun little thing, which

00:55:27   is I sent our friend Merlin Mann a little something in the mail, just a thank you, a

00:55:36   little Christmas card kind of thing from the incomparable. And without going into any of

00:55:43   the details, I just wanted to point out, he sent me back a handwritten thank you note in

00:55:47   an iMessage.

00:55:48   >> Genius.

00:55:49   >> Isn't that great? Isn't that a great idea that he wrote with, is it iPad Pro and Apple

00:55:57   Pencil perhaps? I don't even know, but whatever.

00:55:59   >> It's going to be.

00:56:00   >> Right? It was a handwritten thank you note that just appeared in my iMessage. And I tapped

00:56:04   it and it opened up and it was full screen and it was a handwritten note. And truly we

00:56:10   live in a world of miracles. This is all I am saying. It was just such a clever fusing

00:56:14   of it is the personal, delightful personal touch of a handwritten thank you note, but

00:56:19   just done on an iPad and then sent via iMessage. It was more immediate, but it was also just

00:56:26   kind of that really nice personal feeling. It was really cute.

00:56:29   So, yeah, it's good for the holidays coming up, right? You want to do your thank you notes?

00:56:33   That's right, and a little pencil related follow up too. So, just throwing it out there.

00:56:39   Nice life hack there, Merlin.

00:56:41   Mmhmm.

00:56:42   All the great pencils.

00:56:46   All the great life hacks as well.

00:56:48   Uh huh, yeah. That's what he's known for.

00:56:52   This week's episode is also brought to you by TextExpander from Smile. If you ever need

00:56:56   to find yourself in a situation where you're typing things frequently. Different phrases,

00:57:03   sentences, words, even whole paragraphs, you need TextExpander in your life. TextExpander

00:57:08   is there to help save you time and effort by expanding short abbreviations, a couple

00:57:13   of characters that you decide into frequently used texts or even pictures. You can even

00:57:17   create, which I do, and I send a lot of email as part of my job, and I send a lot of email

00:57:23   out to our sponsors and to things like that. And also, I guess we have some kind of what

00:57:28   you would call customer support type things that we do with listeners, they have issues

00:57:32   with things and I am able to create and have done many different snippets of TextExpander.

00:57:37   Some just fill in a couple of words, like I have TextExpander snippets for all of our

00:57:41   show names because I type them quite frequently, or I have TextExpander snippets for whole

00:57:45   sentences of things that I might use. But where it gets most powerful for me is in the

00:57:49   little forms that you can create. So I can type a couple of characters in this little

00:57:54   code that I've created and it will pop up this form where I can choose for some dropdowns

00:57:59   what I want it to say. So there might be a couple of words or a couple of phrases that

00:58:02   are different or when I fill in our sponsor information in our CMS I just type in the

00:58:07   name of the sponsor and it pops up a little thing and I can say oh this is upgrade so

00:58:11   choose the upgrade code and I can manually enter in any discounts and things like that

00:58:16   if it's needed for that week. It is super super simple and really just saves me a ton

00:58:22   of time. And when I was talking about sending emails as well, it helps improve your communication,

00:58:27   especially if you're in a customer support type thing or even just for the work that

00:58:31   you do if you just want to make sure that you are sticking to the same responses each

00:58:36   time. You can create these stock replies really easily and TextExpander will just keep that

00:58:41   nice and sorted for you. I really love TextExpander, it's on iOS as well where I have my snippets

00:58:47   synced with a bunch of my favourite apps and they have their own keyboard as well for iOS

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00:58:58   are available for $19.95 for existing users but TextExpander 5 is free to anybody who

00:59:04   purchased any version of TextExpander on or after January 1st 2015. You can find out more

00:59:10   about Texas Band of Five by visiting smile software.com/upgrade. Please note that Texas

00:59:16   Band of Five requires Yosemite and is ready for El Capitan and Texas Band of Five iOS

00:59:21   is available from the App Store for iPhone and iPad. Thank you so much to Smile for their

00:59:26   support of this show. Time for some Ask Upgrade, Jason.

00:59:31   Lasers. Bartek would like to know, "How do you upgrade

00:59:36   apps on the Apple TV. Ashfault 8 is telling him he needs to update, but he can't work

00:59:41   out how. Jason, help him.

00:59:44   I can't. I don't know. I thought they're supposed to automatically update, right? Aren't they?

00:59:49   I believe so. I've never done any updates, but I've had the little blue dots appear.

00:59:54   Yeah. Yeah. I think it's meant to automatically update. I would say, so I have to go back

00:59:58   to the old standbys in a situation like this which is, you know, reboot it.

01:00:07   I never thought we would have an Ask Upgrade where we were going to tell people to turn

01:00:11   it off and turn it on again, but that's what I would suggest as well.

01:00:14   Yeah, reboot it and see if that gets it back on the track of looking for updates.

01:00:18   You could look in the App Store to see if there's an update button, update submenu,

01:00:25   but I don't know, I have never done that.

01:00:27   I'm really going with the flow with the Apple TV.

01:00:29   I'm seeing what it does when I do nothing to it

01:00:33   other than use it.

01:00:34   And it's worked so far.

01:00:36   So I don't know, but I don't have asphalt eight.

01:00:38   So I can't say.

01:00:39   Sorry.

01:00:42   - I don't know. - Failure.

01:00:43   Ask upgrade failure.

01:00:44   Boom.

01:00:44   - Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

01:00:46   That's the laser signing off.

01:00:47   - Wop, wop, wop.

01:00:48   Yeah, the lasers misfired and killed a guy.

01:00:51   - Oh no.

01:00:52   Will would like to know.

01:00:54   He wants to know if it's time to join the year of Tichi

01:00:57   and to get an iPad Air 2 now or cross fingers and wait for an Air 3.

01:01:02   And the caveat to this, which I think makes it the most important,

01:01:05   in the way that I'm going to give my answer,

01:01:07   is Will has said that this would be his first iPad.

01:01:13   - Well, I'm intrigued by what your answer is going to be,

01:01:17   so why don't you go first?

01:01:18   - I would say to wait.

01:01:20   I believe there will be an Air 3 at some point in 2016.

01:01:25   And considering this is your first iPad,

01:01:27   you're already okay with living without one.

01:01:29   It's been out for five years at this point.

01:01:32   I would suggest waiting until the new one comes out

01:01:34   so you can take advantage of whatever features it brings.

01:01:37   - Okay.

01:01:40   I think I replied to Will and told him to wait

01:01:45   or to not wait because there's always a new iPad

01:01:48   and it's pretty a powerful device as it is.

01:01:52   and there probably won't be one until next fall.

01:01:56   There is a rumor that there might be an iPad Air 3

01:01:59   in the spring.

01:02:00   And you know, Apple keeps doing crazy stuff

01:02:03   that is not like what Apple used to do.

01:02:05   So if that's the case,

01:02:07   if there's a new Apple approach here,

01:02:10   which is you refresh sort of like the high end

01:02:12   of your line in the fall,

01:02:15   and then you do some sort of like backfilling in the spring

01:02:18   with let's say a smaller iPhone,

01:02:20   'cause there are more rumors about that now.

01:02:22   and something like an iPad Air 3?

01:02:25   Maybe, maybe?

01:02:29   - I currently believe in the small iPhone iPad Air 3

01:02:32   rumor of April, March, April,

01:02:35   along with Apple Watch 2.

01:02:37   I think we're gonna get an event

01:02:38   that has those three products lumped in together

01:02:42   because I don't think any of them are exciting enough

01:02:44   for their own event.

01:02:45   And if you put them together,

01:02:46   it might bring a bit more kind of pizazz to it.

01:02:49   Plus you attach the word iPhone to any announcement

01:02:52   and it gets a little bit more buzz.

01:02:54   So even though it's maybe not as exciting an iPhone,

01:02:56   it might help put the spotlight on these products as well.

01:03:01   That's my thinking.

01:03:02   That's basically the same thing I had

01:03:04   for when the iPad Pro would be released,

01:03:06   which was the event with the iPhone.

01:03:09   - Yeah, we'll see.

01:03:13   I think it's intriguing this idea.

01:03:16   And I think the reason Apple might do this,

01:03:18   'cause that's the question, it's like,

01:03:19   well, Apple does everything in the fall,

01:03:20   why might they do this?

01:03:21   The answer is because Apple does everything in the fall,

01:03:23   and maybe this is a good kind of off, you know, off cycle,

01:03:27   like six months later cycle to release some other stuff.

01:03:31   - Plus it's worth remembering that this Apple,

01:03:34   the idea of Apple does everything in the fall

01:03:36   has only been around for a couple of years.

01:03:38   They always had the music event,

01:03:39   which was around that time of the year.

01:03:41   - Yeah, that's true.

01:03:45   - You know, like, yeah, Apple does do everything

01:03:46   in the fall, but it's only been a couple of years

01:03:48   that I've done that.

01:03:49   - Well, for the iPhone, right, was in the fall

01:03:54   for all but the first one, and the iPad's been in the fall

01:03:57   for all but the first one.

01:03:58   - Is that true?

01:04:00   I thought that they did it in April for quite a while.

01:04:03   - I don't think, well, maybe they did.

01:04:06   'Cause I have memories.

01:04:07   No, you're right, they did it in the summer

01:04:08   for several years before they migrated it to the fall.

01:04:11   That's true, you're right.

01:04:12   Now we're gonna get people who tweet us

01:04:14   because they heard me say that, immediately paused it,

01:04:17   tweeted at me that I was wrong,

01:04:19   and then pressed play again

01:04:20   and heard that you immediately corrected me.

01:04:22   'Cause that's how podcasts work on the internet.

01:04:24   - In this instance,

01:04:26   I would like you to still send that tweet to Jason,

01:04:28   because--

01:04:29   - No, don't do it.

01:04:31   - I get the pleasure of working with Mr. Jason Snell.

01:04:34   - It's the first four iPhones were in June

01:04:36   and then they relocated.

01:04:37   So since 2011, every iPhone has come out in the fall.

01:04:40   - But what about the iPad?

01:04:42   I think that was around March, April time.

01:04:45   - The first one was.

01:04:46   - Well, anyway, as I was saying,

01:04:48   I get the pleasure of working with Mr. Jason Snell.

01:04:51   And one of the great things about working with Jason

01:04:54   is his great knowledge and experience of these products.

01:04:58   So every time I get the time where this is rare,

01:05:03   where I am able to be correct,

01:05:06   I take great pleasure in it

01:05:07   because I can't believe the luck that I have,

01:05:10   not only to work with Jason, but to momentarily at least know something that he doesn't know.

01:05:15   I am so old, Myke, that it all runs together to me now.

01:05:19   I'm not accepting that.

01:05:20   The iPad, the story, if you recall, the story with the iPad is that when they did the third

01:05:25   generation, which was the first retina model, they very quickly turned around and did a

01:05:29   much more capable fourth generation that they called the new iPad, right? That whole line

01:05:35   of the third and fourth generation where it was like, we're not going to even explain

01:05:39   what this product is. And that was the moment that they shifted from spring to fall because

01:05:44   they did that quick turnaround with the fourth generation and left that third generation

01:05:48   Redna iPad kind of hanging out there.

01:05:50   We had one of those.

01:05:51   That was when they gave it lightning, wasn't it? Because it was the only device with 30

01:05:56   pin then, I think?

01:05:57   Yeah, I think that's right too. Although now I don't, you know, you've shaken me to my

01:06:02   foundations, Myke. I don't even know what's true anymore.

01:06:05   I'm going to PC World.

01:06:07   - Yeah, it's crazy town, but that was when it happened.

01:06:10   So basically they've been for the last,

01:06:13   yeah, you're right, like three years for the iPad

01:06:16   and four years for the iPhone, they've been in the fall,

01:06:20   but they could do anything.

01:06:21   I think it makes sense because it's the holiday quarter,

01:06:24   but it's absolutely true that there's too much

01:06:26   going on there, not just like too much for consumers

01:06:30   or too much for us to cover it,

01:06:31   but it's too much for Apple to have the cycles

01:06:34   all hit in the fall, and it's bad product rollout to have every single product you do

01:06:39   drop at once because then you lose track. And they did a good job of rolling the products

01:06:43   out over an extended period this fall, but there's too much. There's too much in Apple's,

01:06:48   even the iOS product line. So having that stuff, having more of that stuff come out

01:06:52   in the spring makes sense. So if that is true, that rumor could be true, and that would be

01:06:56   interesting. So that leads me to be less inclined to tell Will to dive in now if there are some

01:07:02   interesting rumors that there might be an iPad Air 3 sooner rather than later. So that's

01:07:07   so I kind of have to that rumor makes me gives me pause and makes me revise my thoughts.

01:07:14   I don't know. Well, I don't know. I was right. You an answer here. But wait, I think I think

01:07:20   wait is what we're saying. Okay. We'll go with that. And Mr. Tony Cyndala, this is Tony

01:07:27   would like to know. And he has a this is an interesting content, Jason. I'm interested

01:07:31   what you think of this. So Tony says, "I struggle at Christmas with non-e-media items

01:07:39   like books and music increasingly feeling like a bad gift." What are your thoughts

01:07:43   on that?

01:07:44   Hi Tony. I don't know. I think books feel like a good gift to me. I think books feel

01:07:58   pretty good. That even people who are dedicated ebook readers, I think a nice book is a gift.

01:08:05   I don't know. I think plus there's so many books that are not as great digitally, comic

01:08:09   book collections or books for kids, big history books or novels or things with pictures in

01:08:17   them. I don't know. I think they're okay. Giving music like a CD, yeah, I think you

01:08:24   could argue that that's not as good. But I think music as a gift has often been bad because

01:08:30   music tastes are so personal that it's very difficult to buy music for somebody. All of

01:08:34   us, I imagine at some point, I certainly had that moment where my parents got me a cassette

01:08:39   tape for Christmas that was some band that I knew a song of and they thought this was

01:08:44   like the best thing. They're like, "Hey, that's a band that I know you were aware of and I

01:08:48   bought you their album on a cassette tape." And it was just a terrible gift that I remember

01:08:54   all this time later because I didn't care and I didn't want it and it wasn't a thing

01:08:58   that I, it was so personal to me that buying me music was not something I wanted to do.

01:09:05   So I think media is problematic in general but I think books are great gifts. I think

01:09:09   there are so many books and there's so many different things that even with people reading

01:09:14   on Kindles and on their phones and things like that, you know, I feel pretty good about

01:09:19   books as a gift.

01:09:20   Yeah, movies are better than music, I think if you're gonna buy physical things.

01:09:26   I agree. Books, if there's enough meaning to them as well, a book can be nice.

01:09:30   But stuff like music, you know, you can't, there isn't anything like an app.

01:09:36   I guess don't buy anyone's software on a CD, I guess is the thing, right? Don't do that.

01:09:42   Aside from that, I think it's still pretty good. As long as there's meaning in it, I think it will work.

01:09:47   Alright, ladies and gentlemen, this is one of your two final warnings for Star Wars spoilers.

01:09:56   We are about to take a break. Once we come back, we are going to be talking about The

01:10:00   Force Awakens and we will play a spoiler horn immediately and then it's going to be straight

01:10:07   up spoiler town. Everything I'm going to be talking about and we will be talking about

01:10:12   will be laden with spoilers. So we will be addressing the Force Awakens.

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01:12:26   And now, spoilers for Star Wars colon The Force Awakens.

01:12:37   Alright okay, so here we are.

01:12:40   We're in The Force Awakens time.

01:12:41   Now this is the only place- Myke at the Movies!

01:12:45   It's time for Myke at the Movies!

01:12:47   Is that a new jingle?

01:12:48   Myke is an English guy!

01:12:49   Oh here we go.

01:12:50   He watches some movies!

01:12:52   Is this Flop House-like?

01:12:54   No, it's not as good as that, and not as bad.

01:13:00   And now here's Myke at the movies!

01:13:04   I haven't even said...

01:13:06   Starring Myke Hurley!

01:13:07   Okay, I'm done.

01:13:09   What I think of this movie anywhere publicly.

01:13:12   Oh!

01:13:13   Because...

01:13:14   I'm going to start by talking about spoilers.

01:13:18   Now you had a great discussion about spoilers on the episode of Incomparable that came out

01:13:22   this weekend, which was fantastic. And it's basically the episode of The Incomparable

01:13:27   that you were destined to make, right? Like a new Star Wars. I don't think we ever expected

01:13:32   that. And it's it was amazing. It perfect. And the end of the episode is about spoilers.

01:13:38   And it's just you and John. So I think everybody else had gone to bed at this point.

01:13:41   Yeah, yeah. And he wasn't ready yet. So we talked for another half hour.

01:13:45   And John spoke about spoilers. And there is a key thing about spoilers that I think I

01:13:50   I think that Jon believes this and CGP Grey planted this nugget of information in my brain

01:13:55   and it's ruined me ever since. Knowing if somebody thinks a movie is good is, in my

01:14:01   opinion, a spoiler. Because it sets expectations.

01:14:07   It's not a plot spoiler, but it definitely changes your anticipation for the thing that

01:14:12   you're about to consume.

01:14:14   this movie. Because if there are people like you or John and I had known that you thought

01:14:20   the movie was good before I saw it, my expectations may have been set too high. Because I may

01:14:28   have thought, "It's gonna be perfect, it's gonna be the best movie ever made." That's

01:14:34   how I take these sorts of things. I like to know absolutely nothing. But I also at the

01:14:41   same time didn't specifically do anything in the run up to protect myself. I watched

01:14:46   the trailers but that was it. I didn't go and search anything. I was pretty sure I wasn't

01:14:53   going to see anything I didn't want to because I wasn't looking for it. And then also what

01:14:57   I did to prevent, because I do see that my main concern was knowing what people think

01:15:03   about this movie when it came out. That was what I thought was the biggest risk of spoiling

01:15:07   for me because I didn't want to know what people thought about it. I wanted to go in

01:15:11   clean. So I implemented a bunch of mute filters the day before the movie came out so I wouldn't

01:15:16   see anybody's opinions. And then I also made sure I saw it as early as I could, which was

01:15:22   like 11am on Thursday because it came out a day early here. I could have seen a midnight

01:15:26   show on Wednesday but I didn't want to do that. So I saw it like the first showing at

01:15:30   at my local cinema on Thursday morning.

01:15:33   So I was able to see the movie Unspoiled.

01:15:36   This was something that I was gloating about to you

01:15:40   and to many people that I was gonna see this movie first.

01:15:43   - Oh yeah.

01:15:43   - That actually turned out to be a terrible thing.

01:15:45   (laughing)

01:15:46   - Up his end.

01:15:47   - I didn't have anybody to talk to.

01:15:49   However, luckily there was a couple of people,

01:15:53   the main person being friend of the show,

01:15:55   Mr. James Thompson, who'd seen a midnight show.

01:15:57   And so I realized a couple of hours afterwards,

01:15:59   James has seen it so I was talking to him but I couldn't talk to anyone for like any

01:16:04   of you guys for like 24 hours like no one had seen the movie and then basically it was

01:16:10   like I was getting ready to go to sleep at like 1.30am or something that night and that

01:16:15   was when everyone was going to see it which I thought was kind of hilarious so it's like

01:16:18   everyone's going to be talking about it when I'm asleep.

01:16:23   So I can sum up my feelings about this movie in one word.

01:16:29   And it was the way that I felt about this, the moment that I left the cinema, and I actually

01:16:41   think that my feelings about this movie in this regard are stronger than anybody else.

01:16:45   I think The Force Awakens was perfect.

01:16:50   the one word that I keep coming back to. Like no movie is without like

01:16:54   interesting plot foibles and stuff like that and and this this movie has them

01:17:00   but that's not what I'm really referring to. Like this movie to me was the exact

01:17:07   movie I wanted it to be in every single way and that's what makes it perfect.

01:17:12   I loved this movie so much it's easily my favorite Star Wars movie. Wow.

01:17:19   Because, alright Jason, this is probably going to upset a lot of people.

01:17:25   I really, really love Star Wars.

01:17:31   Like many nerds.

01:17:34   But there are lots of moments in the original trilogy that are slow to me.

01:17:44   Especially the first, especially New Hope.

01:17:46   I actually enjoy A New Hope the least of the three Star Wars movies.

01:17:52   My favorite is Empire, then Jedi.

01:17:56   When I was growing up, Jedi was always my favorite.

01:17:59   Because I loved the opening scene.

01:18:00   It's because of the Ewoks.

01:18:01   No, I love the Ewoks, actually.

01:18:02   Because it was the Ewoks.

01:18:03   No, it was Badass Luke.

01:18:05   That was my favorite thing.

01:18:07   I loved that scene.

01:18:09   I always did as a kid.

01:18:11   But, also my favorite, obviously.

01:18:15   are I don't know the it's basically just I think it's just a thing of the times and maybe

01:18:21   oh yeah it's actually reminds me of how people talk about the original Star Trek now and

01:18:26   it's been long enough now from the from 1977 that people can say the same thing about the

01:18:30   original Star Wars movies it is from there from another era and people who didn't live

01:18:35   through that era don't have the nostalgia aspect of it and are not used to the the way

01:18:41   entertainment was made back then as much.

01:18:44   - I think I just like a little bit more action.

01:18:46   That's just me, that's just my tastes.

01:18:50   And this movie delivers on that.

01:18:51   Like it is a fantastic action movie.

01:18:54   - There are so many action set pieces in it.

01:18:56   It's kind of stunning.

01:18:58   And we could argue maybe one too many,

01:19:01   but there are lots of them.

01:19:05   Having watched it a second time,

01:19:06   I was struck by how it just keeps rolling and that there's just like this happens and

01:19:14   then this happens and then this happens. I saw a troll on Twitter basically say, "Oh,

01:19:19   it's so boring and the pace is really bad." And I'm like, "You came into that movie wanting

01:19:24   to hate it because there's no…"

01:19:25   You watched a different movie, buddy.

01:19:27   You could argue that the pace is unrelenting and that there's too much, but you can't argue

01:19:31   that there isn't enough pace because it's all pace. It rolls from scene to scene. There

01:19:36   are barely, there is, in the middle in fact there's a moment that the first time I saw

01:19:40   it I thought it sagged a little bit and watching it a second time I decided that it doesn't

01:19:45   sag in the middle but it is a moment where there isn't wall to wall action for a few

01:19:50   minutes. It's just like a movie at that point. How dare they?

01:19:55   And I think that that pace is part of what makes me think this movie was so amazing and

01:19:59   the reason, the reason that I say that this movie is perfect is because of how I felt

01:20:04   watching it. I have never seen a movie that I have been so emotionally involved in. I,

01:20:13   from the very first moment, from the sound hitting, right, the orchestra blaring up,

01:20:23   I was in. I was just so in. I cried so much during this movie. I obviously laughed a lot

01:20:31   like everybody did, but I don't know if everybody else would cry.

01:20:35   Oh boy did I cry a lot.

01:20:38   I had those kind of-- every time an original trilogy

01:20:42   person popped up, I kind of had the lump in my throat,

01:20:46   like the happy feeling.

01:20:48   But when Han dies, I was sobbing.

01:20:53   I was gone, man.

01:20:55   I couldn't deal with it.

01:20:56   Because I know that many people saw this.

01:21:00   I wasn't completely sold on the idea that he was going to be killed in this movie.

01:21:05   Like I see it now.

01:21:06   It's like, of course he was.

01:21:07   This means he never has to do another Star Wars movie.

01:21:10   Yeah.

01:21:11   Um, but I didn't really think of it that way going into this.

01:21:14   Um, and in that, when that scene began, whilst it looked like he was going to get

01:21:21   killed, I think that the idea of just how much it looked like he was going to go off

01:21:25   that bridge made me think that he might not, right?

01:21:29   It was like this looks so obvious that he's gonna go off this bridge because there's no rail on it

01:21:33   That he's that he'll be okay and the scene like they I think that they set up quite nicely

01:21:39   the idea of

01:21:42   Kylo Ren

01:21:44   Turning away from from the dark side like when earlier in the movie

01:21:47   It seems to be quite conflicted and this is when he's on his own, right? So it's it is a real emotion

01:21:52   He's feeling he feels the conflict

01:21:54   So I don't know like when he was just when he was then saying it on the bridge and he threw the mask down

01:21:59   I was like or the helmet I was like, yeah, this could happen like the movie is so

01:22:05   This this new band of heroes is so young. Maybe he could join them and you know, but yeah, so when he

01:22:13   Yeah, when when that lightsaber went through him man that got me and I kind of didn't stop crying for a while like for quite some

01:22:21   Time I think I was still crying

01:22:23   When Leia and Rey see each other and then they start hugging and that made me go again

01:22:29   I was I was all-in on this movie and I think that's why

01:22:33   It felt so perfect to me. I left the cinema and I was just like I was just gobsmacked

01:22:40   I just couldn't believe what I'd seen

01:22:42   It was just superb because I loved every part of it. Like I loved all of the characters

01:22:48   They're all so fantastic and there was just so many things about this movie that speak to

01:22:54   Who I am now and like the way that I look at the world

01:22:57   Like Rey and Finn as like the main characters of this movie

01:23:02   Like that is so much about like what I think the world should be now

01:23:07   like

01:23:09   strong women and inclusion and

01:23:13   The all of this just led to this just what I think is just this incredible piece of work that that

01:23:20   Abrams has created I

01:23:23   Just love this movie. I've really loved this movie

01:23:26   It's uh, I think I mean I agree with you it's a good movie I

01:23:32   Wouldn't say perfect. I think there I have some issues with it, but you know

01:23:38   Nothing is so perfect that it can't be criticized as somebody we know might say I have some issues

01:23:43   but they it is overwhelmed by it is overwhelmed by a feeling of joy and watching it and

01:23:48   also a feeling if I take one step back what I say is

01:23:51   that some of the criticism that I've seen of it is that it's sort of a stealth remake of the original Star Wars and there's

01:23:58   Certainly some truth to that but as I said on the incomparable, I feel like this movie needed to do two jobs

01:24:04   It needed to hold the hands of the fans and say it's gonna be okay

01:24:08   Star Wars is back and it needed to set a direction for the future and those are the two things that it accomplished and people who

01:24:14   Say well, there's too much fan service. It's like no no, there's just enough fan service if I was making this movie

01:24:20   I would have done that too. Like I would have done that because the idea is exactly that to show that

01:24:27   Guys, it's okay. Like look, this is Star Wars. See we can still make those ones

01:24:33   It doesn't have to be like the other ones. We can still make this Star Wars movie."

01:24:38   You could argue that there has not been a good/real Star Wars movie since 1983, right?

01:24:46   If you think of it in those terms, if you think about the special editions and you think about

01:24:51   the prequels, this is that moment of saying, "Look, remember the things you love? Here are

01:24:56   the people you loved. Here is the attitude and the approach to this that you loved. And there's

01:25:01   there's new people who you're going to love, and we're going to put it all together in

01:25:05   a big ball. And it's going to be exciting about the past and also exciting about the

01:25:10   future. And a movie that's just one or the other I think would have been less successful.

01:25:16   It would have been really risky to do a movie that just turned its back entirely on the

01:25:19   past. And the huge asset from a business standpoint of Star Wars is that it's got this mass of

01:25:25   people who love it because of the past. But a movie that was entirely about the past would

01:25:29   also I think be a failure. But I don't come out of that, I don't come out of The Force

01:25:32   Awakens thinking, "Uh, isn't Star Wars good? I like those old movies." I came out of The

01:25:38   Force Awakens thinking, and talking with my family, including my kids who really loved

01:25:42   it, my kids loved it, I think that also says something. We came out of the movie talking

01:25:46   about, after we got far enough away from the people who were waiting in the line for the

01:25:49   next showing, because we didn't want to spoil them, and there were people, I actually saw

01:25:52   a guy stick his, because we were coming out the doors on the side of the theater, and

01:25:57   into the line of the next showing. And there was actually a guy with his fingers in his

01:26:01   ears and I was like, "Oh dude, good job, but I feel bad for you, but good job." But once

01:26:06   we got about, you know, 50 feet, 100 feet away, we were all talking about what happens

01:26:11   next, right? Not, "Oh hey, look at Han and Leia and Luke, isn't that great?" But like,

01:26:17   what happens next? Who is Rey? What is her story? How did she get where she was? What

01:26:22   does she do now that she meets Luke? What's going to happen with Ben, with Kylo Ren? What's

01:26:28   he going on to next? Poe and BB-8 are back with Leia. What happens there? And that was

01:26:35   what it was all about. And that, I think, is the success story of this movie from the

01:26:41   standpoint of calculations creatively of what you need to do to get. How do you get the

01:26:47   engine back on of a franchise like this and they did it. They did it in a movie that is,

01:26:53   you know, it's as entertaining the second time as the first. I watched it twice in about

01:26:56   a 14 hour period and it was not a problem to watch it a second time.

01:27:03   Yeah, I have my next two showings booked. So I'm going on Christmas Eve and taking my

01:27:10   brother and then me and Idina are gonna see it on New Year's Day. She did see the movie

01:27:16   today actually she took her mom she's she's back home in Romania right now and

01:27:21   Adina is a relatively new Star Wars viewer she actually saw the original

01:27:27   trilogy this year for the first time and she told me she thought the film was

01:27:32   perfect as well so my thinking about this is the people that are like super

01:27:37   into Star Wars like really into Star Wars maybe see a lot more of the faults

01:27:43   than other people? Like, I love the movies, but I'm not like really deep in it, you

01:27:48   know?

01:27:49   Well, I said this on the—incomparable, I think. It's like, I'm not a Star Wars

01:27:55   fan. I am a Star Wars fan in the sense of I was six years old when Star Wars came out,

01:28:04   and I was 12 years old when Return of the Jedi came out, and every single kid who was

01:28:10   alive during that period was completely surrounded by and a part of Star Wars, because it was

01:28:18   one of the defining things. But, you know, I read a Star Wars book when I was in elementary

01:28:25   school and I read a Star Wars book when they came out with those supposedly authorized

01:28:29   and now decanonized books about what happened afterward. I read one of those, but that's

01:28:35   But I was always a Star Trek fan, later I was a Doctor Who fan, but Star Wars has just

01:28:41   sort of been like, "I like it, it's great. I'll go see all the movies." But it was never

01:28:46   part of my fan identity or anything. So it's kind of, I'm a Star Wars fan like everybody

01:28:54   in the world is a Star Wars fan, which if you look at how many people saw this movie,

01:29:00   I'm that kind of Star Wars fan, like everyone. And, uh, and you know, yeah, my criticisms

01:29:06   about it are, are, are maybe informed by that a little bit, that, that it's like the, the

01:29:11   Starkiller base thing is like, do we really want to go back to the Death Star thing again,

01:29:15   Death Star analog again? I thought that was maybe not necessary. And I think some of the,

01:29:19   the space science stuff is so ridiculous that they would have been better off having it

01:29:23   be even less science-y and more unexplained. Like, we suck the energy out of the sun until

01:29:31   it goes dark and then we fire our beam across the galaxy and everybody can see it and everybody

01:29:36   can see the planets exploding. And as I said on The Incomparable, that's not how space

01:29:39   works. It doesn't work like that. I would have actually rather it had been more vague.

01:29:45   But you know, these are minor points and it didn't stop me from enjoying the movie. Like,

01:29:50   similar points I have about the JJ Abrams first Star Trek movie but didn't stop me from

01:29:55   liking it. No. A lot. I want to talk a little bit about the characters. Ray is perfect as

01:30:03   a hero, right? A Hoenn. She's just brilliant, right? She smashes down gender stereotypes,

01:30:10   doesn't take any crap from anyone. I love the whole, like, wouldn't let Finn hold her

01:30:16   hand. Like, what are you doing? Why do you keep taking my hand? Even better is when there's

01:30:19   that explosion he's knocked flat and sort of semi unconscious and when he

01:30:23   wakes up he looks at her and says are you okay and she's like yeah because

01:30:28   he's playing his role right he's playing his gender role of I've got to hold her

01:30:32   hand and make sure she's okay and protect her and she's fine he's the one

01:30:36   who's getting the crap he's beating out of him he is having a very bad day right

01:30:39   yeah that's I you know take my hat off the writing because when you think about

01:30:44   something that's on the face of it the way that you would like a way that most

01:30:49   people would show her strength is to not even address any of those things right? You're

01:30:53   just like we don't even think about this this is the world right? Everyone's strong male

01:30:57   or female but it actually makes a bigger impact when you do have those moments where the guy

01:31:03   tries to play a stereotypical role and is shot down. I think that is what makes her

01:31:09   look so strong because of the comparison like if they would have just had her do all of

01:31:14   those things and they didn't have those interactions I don't think it would have hit home as hard.

01:31:18   The First Order is obviously, has a sexist culture because he was raised in a stormtrooper

01:31:25   education facility or whatever and he believes that these are the proper gender roles.

01:31:30   But Rey-

01:31:31   Well even though his boss is female.

01:31:33   Yeah even so.

01:31:34   Even so this is true.

01:31:36   It's interesting.

01:31:37   Even Rey is also interesting as an inversion of Luke because she is also kind of a loner.

01:31:43   I mean he's got his aunt and uncle but he always sort of feels it removed from them

01:31:46   a little bit and he's he's um although she's like alone alone he's got friends and they

01:31:51   shoot womp rats and bicker's canyon and all of that she's alone ever see him no she's

01:31:57   she's alone in the desert and and it's interesting because luke has a lot to learn he has raw

01:32:02   skills but has a lot to learn and he wants to get out of there and ray ray is waiting

01:32:09   so she's staying there and she does the opposite she's got a lot of skills she's improving

01:32:13   herself by surviving and navigating her world while she waits.

01:32:18   And I find that kind of interesting, along with just the nerdy kind of art direction

01:32:22   stuff about how Jakku, although it is not Tatooine, has so many of those things that

01:32:27   just feel like Star Wars because it's these funny like, I don't even know what to call

01:32:32   them, little antenna pillar kind of things out in the desert and garbage and sun setting

01:32:38   and things and little speedery things where it just it feels like Star Wars

01:32:42   and that that's the world she lives in but it's a

01:32:45   yeah it's a she's a it's a that's a great she's a great hero character

01:32:50   and I like the fact that she's also still learning

01:32:53   you know she she doesn't flip on the Millennium Falcon and take it out right

01:32:58   she kinda smashes it into a few things on the way out and

01:33:02   there's a really nice moment that I think says a lot about these new

01:33:04   characters about Finn and Rey that

01:33:06   when they're in the Millennium Falcon for the first time, they both have that

01:33:10   quiet moment separately when he's in the gunning pod and she's in a pilot seat of

01:33:14   like, "Okay, I can do this." That is a wonderful moment about these new

01:33:20   characters trying to talk themselves into this being, you know, being the hero

01:33:24   of their story here. Because neither of them had ever done the thing that

01:33:28   they're doing before, right? Well, I mean, if you discount like the TIE fighter

01:33:32   a scenario that Finn was like but when Finn sat down in the TIE fighter he'd never operate

01:33:37   something like that before. No, he was in sanitation and just got promoted to be a to

01:33:42   be a an infantry which is basically you know I think I think that's the Empire or the First

01:33:48   Order's cannon fodder so he was not a high-ranking anything he had been this was his first combat

01:33:54   that he had seen before that he was working in the trash compactors. So this asks one

01:33:58   of the first questions that I have. I mean, Rey is obviously as great at everything that

01:34:03   she is because of the fact that the Force flows through her, right? She is incredibly

01:34:09   strong and is powerful and her control of the Force is clearly unlike anything that

01:34:18   we've seen in the movies before because she is able to use the Force without any training

01:34:24   from anyone. Luke couldn't do that. So there is a great power there that we're going to

01:34:30   see later on.

01:34:32   I imagine when they say there has been an awakening, when that line comes out and this

01:34:38   movie is called The Force Awakens, it seems to me that perhaps this is all about Rey.

01:34:42   That she has, her Force power has awakened and it is the start of a new era where previously

01:34:49   it was only sort of the people that Luke had trained and something bad happened there and

01:34:54   Han and Leia's son went off and explored the dark side but Rey's Force awakening

01:35:02   is the beginning of this story.

01:35:04   So my question around Finn is does he have any of the Force in him? Because he does some

01:35:15   interesting things in this movie like the idea that he can just he just feels

01:35:21   it in him to be an incredible fighter fighter and a pilot right like not like

01:35:27   he doesn't fly but he is great at operating a gun yeah and he'd never done it

01:35:31   before he can wield a lightsaber and he'd never done it before and he does a

01:35:36   relatively good job of it and I just wonder like will they both to certain

01:35:41   extents have some of the force in them? I don't know, but I think that that's an interesting

01:35:46   thing to explore in between now and the next one.

01:35:50   - I kind of hope not, only because not everybody can be a Jedi, although, and I kind of like

01:35:56   the idea of him being, his special power is that he is a decent person. He's the storm

01:36:04   trooper who refused to be a storm trooper, and how special is that? Now maybe there's

01:36:09   a reason behind it and maybe it's his connection with the Force or fate or whatever that led

01:36:15   him down this path. But it doesn't need to be because you could say he is the one in

01:36:21   a million or one in a hundred thousand stormtrooper who absolutely refuses his training and his

01:36:27   conditioning. There's the implication that they're almost brainwashed too. And he was

01:36:31   raised in this first order dynamic. So we're talking about this pretty serious, just a

01:36:39   propaganda and brainwashing happening here, and he refuses. He refuses to shoot in the

01:36:45   village, and he runs away at his first opportunity and takes the pilot with him, you know, and

01:36:51   gets out of the first order and wants to run. Then he wants to run as far away as possible,

01:36:56   which is the tension that he has with the other characters, is that he isn't interested

01:36:59   in this adventure that they're on. You know, and Rey is on it kind of reluctantly because

01:37:04   she wants to get back to her home because she's waiting for something unspecified. But

01:37:11   Finn just wants to run. Still, he's remarkable because he is the stormtrooper who refused.

01:37:17   And that I think is really interesting about his character regardless if he's got the force

01:37:22   in him or not. One of the reasons that made me think that

01:37:24   he may is because there is a big franchise to be built here and there are limited Jedi.

01:37:31   They need more Jedi, so let's have another Jedi.

01:37:35   It's possible.

01:37:36   I love that he wields the lightsaber because I think in the original trilogy especially

01:37:39   there was this idea that like it's only the special people who get to wield the lightsabers

01:37:43   and with him he's like, "Well, the button's right here, right?

01:37:47   I can do this."

01:37:48   So Fools doesn't turn it on.

01:37:50   And he's not incompetent with it.

01:37:52   He's untrained or lightly trained.

01:37:56   Serenity had a good point on the incomparable episode about how we see Rey with her stick

01:38:00   that she fights with. She's got this kind of martial arts stick fighting thing that

01:38:05   she does and her use of the lightsaber is informed by that style of fighting.

01:38:12   Yeah, I totally noticed that she didn't fight like anybody else has with the lightsaber.

01:38:19   She was operating it in a different way, kind of like holding it up down as opposed to down

01:38:26   facing up and she was like prodding it, like she was poking, right? It was a very different

01:38:32   way of fighting. Right, which comes from her having that stick that whole time. Which is

01:38:37   genius, it's genius that they set it up by giving her that weapon. And I think the impression

01:38:42   you get with Finn is that he's trained on what that other stormtrooper is trained with,

01:38:45   which is that sort of like stun gun stick thing that he fights that stormtrooper with,

01:38:53   then takes from him and that that's his method of fighting with a lightsaber which is kind

01:38:57   of more brutal and stormtrooper like. Nice touches that are not necessarily obvious on

01:39:02   first viewing for everybody but are definitely there and and interesting. I mean one of the

01:39:07   things that I like about this movie is that these characters are there aren't they aren't

01:39:12   direct analogues these characters are all remixed into they are fill fulfilling they

01:39:18   seem to be fulfilling roles in the Star Wars universe that are familiar roles from the

01:39:21   original movies but they're not in the slots they're all kind of mixed up so so

01:39:26   Rey is is sort of like Luke but like we've said sort of not like Luke in that

01:39:33   you know and she's Finn especially you know he is what is he is he like Luke is

01:39:39   he like Han not really Poe Dameron is kind of Han like but but not not a

01:39:45   a scoundrel? Like Po and Finn kind of share Han as like their sensibilities. A little

01:39:53   bit. Yeah, he's got the--Po's got the the the roguish part but he's also kind of gung

01:40:01   ho like like Luke. He's like "Yay! We're gonna fly and I'm a great pilot!" Finn is--wants

01:40:10   to run away and just get out of here, which is very much like Han. But like Han Solo in

01:40:15   this movie is kind of Obi-Wan. I mean, by the end he is Obi-Wan, essentially. But Luke

01:40:21   is also kind of Obi-Wan in this movie. It's just like, they are all not exactly analogs

01:40:29   of the characters, and that's good because they're their own people. As Jon said on that

01:40:33   incomparable episode, you know, Rey is a person called Rey. Finn is a person called Finn.

01:40:38   are not Luke analogs and Han analogs and Leia analogs. That's not who they are. They're

01:40:45   kind of mixed up in their roles. And that's great because that's how it should work, is

01:40:52   their paths will be different because their histories are different and their attributes

01:40:56   are different. But it's exciting that these characters do seem well-defined, that their

01:41:03   actions make sense. And yeah, again, without throwing the prequels under the bus, I felt

01:41:08   much better about these characters and in the prequels I felt like even the characters

01:41:12   that had potential to be great were squandered like I pod may is the best example of that

01:41:18   where that's a great actress and a character who had a lot going for her and by the end

01:41:23   of the series she's just completely wasted and yeah so here these these characters all

01:41:31   seemed fully formed to me and yeah they're they're iconic and and larger than life and

01:41:35   all of those things because that's what Star Wars is but but they felt like real people

01:41:38   but I am conflicted between the light and the dark Jason oh are you now because I think

01:41:45   my favorite of all the characters is Kylo Ren and this is something that it took a few

01:41:50   days for this to settle in with me because I just couldn't stop thinking about this character

01:41:55   there are so many little things about him that make him so interesting to me like the

01:42:00   The idea that he doesn't need the mask and he uses it as an intimidation thing.

01:42:06   And he's, he got it, as John said on that incomparable episode, he just got it off of

01:42:09   Vaydorfan.com.

01:42:10   Yeah.

01:42:11   It's like, I like, I need a mask too, like Darth Vader.

01:42:14   And he doesn't need it, but he does it to be, and there's that shot of like the Knights

01:42:18   of Ren that's in that vision shot where it's like, that this seems to be like, they're

01:42:22   almost like cult kind of force cult thing where they've got masks and dark robes and

01:42:27   things.

01:42:28   But yeah, he doesn't, he doesn't need it.

01:42:29   He just wears it because it's cool and because his grandfather was Darth Vader, who he thinks

01:42:35   – also fascinating – he says, "I want to finish what you started."

01:42:39   I'm not sure he knows that Darth Vader repented at the end.

01:42:42   I don't think anybody knows.

01:42:44   Me and Stephen were talking about this.

01:42:47   Nobody knows that part of the story.

01:42:48   Just Luke.

01:42:49   Did we ever see Luke tell anybody anything?

01:42:51   Luke saw it and then Luke saw the Force Ghost at the end of Return of the Jedi?

01:42:54   And that's it.

01:42:55   So it may be that did Luke not share that with his pupils?

01:42:59   Did Luke not want to talk about Darth Vader?

01:43:02   Let's just not talk about Darth Vader.

01:43:04   And you know with kids, if you don't talk about the subject, they're going to learn

01:43:06   it on the street.

01:43:07   They're all talking about Darth Vader out on the street.

01:43:10   But he's become a Vader fetishist, basically.

01:43:12   I think it's a fascinating take.

01:43:14   The seduction to the dark side has a family aspect.

01:43:17   Your grandfather was Darth Vader.

01:43:19   And you've got this guy, whoever Snoke really is, because I'm skeptical about that that

01:43:24   character is not, there isn't a much more of a story there, but you've got somebody

01:43:29   whispering in your ear and you've got this curiosity about your grandfather and your

01:43:34   uncle doesn't, who's training you, doesn't want to talk about it. And you, you know,

01:43:38   he's become obsessed with it, but also, um, he's a brat. He's a whiny kid who, um, who

01:43:45   wants things the way he wants them and is, uh, and I love that about him too. I love

01:43:51   that Darth Vader, his icon, right, was so, you know, controlled in his rage, right? Like

01:44:00   in the first Star Wars movie where he's choking people, right? But it's like, "I find your

01:44:05   lack of faith disturbing. I'm going to choke you now with my hand," right? From across

01:44:09   the room. And there's a beautiful callback to that in this movie where there's the guy

01:44:15   brings him the bad news and you totally are expecting him to just get murdered by Kylo

01:44:21   Ren, and instead he turns around and smashes up all the equipment, and then pulls him across

01:44:28   the room with the Force and lets him go. It's like, "What? This is a different guy."

01:44:32   And it's like, yeah, he is a different guy. He's no Darth Vader. He's a kid, and he's

01:44:37   a big baby, and he has rage problems, and he's not under control. And that's scary

01:44:43   on one level, but it's also kind of intriguing on another level that he does not have it

01:44:48   together. And we see it. We see him say it. We see him say it to his father before he

01:44:53   kills his father. It's, yeah, it's a really interesting character. And sometimes I think

01:44:59   that that's going to be a fascinating story in this trilogy of movies. I argued in The

01:45:04   Incomparable that I feel like there is some possible redemption for him and everybody

01:45:08   else is like, "Nope, nope, he killed Han Solo. There's no redemption for him." I think, I

01:45:12   don't know, I think that's what makes the story interesting is you've got the rise of

01:45:17   Rey and you've got the rise of Kylo Ren as dark and light avatars and that's interesting,

01:45:22   but also they're connected and he has the temptation of the light side of the force

01:45:29   and that is really interesting to me. Can he be redeemed? He is Han and Leia's son.

01:45:37   At what point is he irredeemable? And maybe it ends all with him sacrificing himself nobly,

01:45:43   which is sort of what Darth Vader did, right? At the last minute. It's that deathbed confession

01:45:48   kind of thing, but you know, Darth Vader took out the Emperor. That was his thing where

01:45:51   he finally turned away from the dark side again. Fascinating seasoning there. So yeah,

01:45:57   I agree with you. This is a really cool character and I like Adam Driver. I heard somebody complain

01:46:02   that he's like a whiny Jedi and it's like, "Eh, a whiny is not what I would say. He doesn't

01:46:07   strike me as being like Anakin in the prequels. He is a big baby, this is true, but he looks

01:46:17   weird and I understood why he was behaving the way he was, even though I didn't approve

01:46:25   of it.

01:46:26   And what I also really like is that he now probably needs his mask, right? Because Rey

01:46:32   leaves him with a lightsaber wound to the face.

01:46:36   He still doesn't need it, but yes, he is scarred now.

01:46:39   Yeah.

01:46:40   That may leave some damage that we haven't seen yet.

01:46:44   We don't know.

01:46:46   He's left there kind of scrabbling away, and the guy, the general is told to go get him

01:46:52   and bring him back to Snoke.

01:46:53   I like that he's going more Vader.

01:46:56   He's going more Vader.

01:46:58   He's on the path.

01:46:59   He's embraced that now by killing his father, yeah.

01:47:01   And so that's why I think that maybe like, because again, I think about somebody.

01:47:05   I wanted her to chop off his hand and I felt like even JJ Abrams thought that was too on

01:47:08   the nose.

01:47:09   I was waiting for it.

01:47:10   I was like, who's going to lose their hand in this battle?

01:47:12   Which one of them?

01:47:13   And I liked that he didn't do that.

01:47:15   Wait for it.

01:47:16   Next movie, maybe next movie.

01:47:17   Because so would I be right in thinking like this is the only Star Wars movie where someone

01:47:21   hasn't lost their hand?

01:47:22   I think that's true.

01:47:23   No, I am your cousin.

01:47:25   Chop out of my hand.

01:47:30   Let's talk about the family aspect very quickly. Do you think Rey is Luke's daughter?

01:47:34   Yeah. I mean, I think that's the obvious setup, although there's a lot of explanation

01:47:38   that needs to go on there. Why was she left behind? What's the complicated story there?

01:47:43   Maybe she's not. I think that's what the movie kind of wants us to feel, is that when

01:47:49   she meets Luke, it's not just the great Jedi Hope meeting Luke Skywalker for the first

01:47:57   time but that they have a they have a connection but you know it's possible

01:48:00   that she's that she's not I I have a hard time with her family history being

01:48:05   so mysterious that it isn't something other than oh yeah well I had a family

01:48:11   but then they left I mean I totally understand all that I just I just

01:48:16   personally just don't think that's the case I just think there's more Jedi we

01:48:19   don't know about like but that's how I look at it and it's like it's setting up

01:48:22   up. This is like the start of the next 30 years, because Star Wars is just a thing now,

01:48:29   like Marvel is.

01:48:30   Yeah, I think that, um, but my gut feeling would be that she is related and that she

01:48:37   is Luke's daughter and that the story is going to be who was her mother and what happened

01:48:42   and why was she taken away and why was she hidden away on Jakku. But we'll find out,

01:48:48   one of the great loose threads. Regardless, we're going to see her trained by Luke in

01:48:55   some way, which kind of excites me. I feel like in Empire Strikes Back, one of the things

01:49:00   about it was that it was about Yoda training Luke. And I feel like, because also Snoke's

01:49:04   last line is "Tell Kylo Ren that he needs to return here to complete his training."

01:49:14   We're setting up a second film where the dark and light Jedi are receiving their training

01:49:19   and emerging out more.

01:49:20   It's just going to be a two hour long montage.

01:49:23   Could be.

01:49:24   Oh Myke can you imagine that?

01:49:25   That would be so beautiful.

01:49:26   It's a training montage.

01:49:28   The motion picture.

01:49:30   So how do you feel about the fact that Star Wars is just here now?

01:49:33   Is Star Wars going to become less special over time?

01:49:37   Ah yes.

01:49:41   It is going to become less special because of the familiarity with it.

01:49:44   superhero. When the Spider-Man movie came out in 2001, no, 2002, I was so excited because

01:49:53   Spider-Man was my favorite superhero. And now, you know, these superhero movies are

01:49:58   all around us and I think it's great. I really like the Marvel movies. My family just watched

01:50:03   Ant-Man this weekend. I had already seen it, but they hadn't seen it and everybody liked

01:50:08   a good movie. But it's not special, right? It's not special like it used to be, but it

01:50:16   can still be great and fun. And I think Star Wars has this potential to be like that. And

01:50:22   I read a story over the weekend that was poorly written in the sense that it said something

01:50:27   about how Star Wars will now be like the Marvel movies where everything is kind of interlinked.

01:50:31   It's like, "No, that's actually not true." It is a shared universe for telling stories,

01:50:38   but what they're not trying to do is have all the movies take place in sync with one

01:50:44   another. Star Wars has this rich history that the Marvel movies, you know, they pushed everything

01:50:49   into the present other than like, you know, Ant-Man basically has—Michael Douglas was

01:50:54   Ant-Man 20 years ago or something—but mostly it's in the present. Star Wars has this

01:50:59   whole history. So the next Star Wars movie, which will be out in a year, is one of these

01:51:04   movies they're calling the anthology movies, which are set in other parts of the Star Wars

01:51:07   universe. So that's the movie about stealing the plans for the Death Star that leads into

01:51:13   the original Star Wars film. And that's fun because they like the art direction can be

01:51:18   quoting the old Star Wars movies and stuff, which could be a lot of fun. And then separately,

01:51:24   they're doing what they're calling the saga movies, which are episodes 7, 8, 9, and then

01:51:28   who knows where they'll go after that, but that's telling a kind of a continuing--the

01:51:32   mainline continuing story. So it's gonna be less special, it's not gonna be quite like

01:51:37   the Marvel movies are, and I think that's good. I think that's kind of a--I like to

01:51:41   see that restraint, that they're--they've got a main storyline that will be in successive

01:51:47   movies, they don't have the confusion of all the kind of crossover stuff happening, and

01:51:51   they've got other stories that they want to tell that are--they feel are good stories

01:51:54   and good movies in their own right set in the Star Wars universe, which quite frankly

01:51:58   what took them so long. It's such a great idea. I saw somebody talking about that about

01:52:03   Star Trek too, and I think it's worth asking about any of these things. Do you need a core

01:52:08   set of characters that you tell stories about every year or two and that's all you do and

01:52:14   that's your franchise? Or are you better off taking, if you've built a rich world, taking

01:52:19   different views into it and Star Wars is this rich world that people know kind of like,

01:52:25   you know, because it's been in the culture for so long. So I would say the long, the

01:52:30   short version of this long version is I think it's less special but there, but it could

01:52:35   be way better because we have more of it because it, you know, if you didn't like the prequels

01:52:39   it has been a long time since there's been good Star Wars in the movie theater.

01:52:42   Yeah, we can end up in a better scenario, we probably will, because over time the overall

01:52:49   quality of Star Wars movies is going to increase because there will be more of them.

01:52:53   Right, so just by percentages.

01:52:56   Because currently, you know, we've just passed the 50% level of good Star Wars movies.

01:53:03   There's now slightly over half of the Star Wars movies that have ever been made are good.

01:53:09   We're now past that, which is great.

01:53:11   But over time there's going to be some bad ones but there's going to be a lot of good

01:53:15   ones because they're going to have, it's going to continue for many years to have all of

01:53:19   the best of the best want to work on this franchise.

01:53:22   Like the same that we have with Marvel, right?

01:53:23   There are very few bad Marvel movies.

01:53:27   I mean, I don't think there are any bad ones.

01:53:30   There are just varying levels of good in my opinion of what's been made.

01:53:33   Yeah, I agree.

01:53:34   Well, oh, all right.

01:53:35   And the worst, maybe the Thor 2, it's not actually that bad.

01:53:38   That's not that good.

01:53:39   It's just the worst of all of those movies.

01:53:41   It's not, I don't like that movie.

01:53:43   It's not atrocious, but it's not good.

01:53:46   I don't like that movie.

01:53:46   But it's okay, it's fine, it wasn't for me.

01:53:49   So I think that's what we're gonna see with Star Wars,

01:53:51   and I think people, when they say it's gonna be like Marvel,

01:53:53   they get confused what they're trying to say.

01:53:56   We're not gonna have a connected universe,

01:53:57   but there is gonna be a Star Wars universe

01:54:00   where things occur in.

01:54:01   Like that's what's gonna happen,

01:54:02   but they're not all happening at the same time,

01:54:05   which is, as you said, is what we have with Marvel.

01:54:07   But this is about to become a rich universe,

01:54:10   which is why, I assume, is one of the reasons why, that they decided to say that the expanded

01:54:15   universe is not canon.

01:54:17   - Exactly.

01:54:18   - Because now they have the ability to kind of paint their own universe, like to stitch

01:54:24   their own tapestry.

01:54:25   - Disney is now, and Lucasfilm, is in the Star Wars business for real. Like, there is

01:54:32   a machine that is up and running that is determining stories for Star Wars for on film and TV.

01:54:40   And I think that's great. I think that's actually pretty awesome that they are doing that.

01:54:46   But you need to give them the latitude to decide like what are the story decisions that they want to make.

01:54:51   And I think it's great. I think it will be... I love the fact that these anthology movies don't have to...

01:55:00   They can stand on their own and be their own thing and tell their own stories and be judged

01:55:05   and as good or bad movies without having it be connected to the overall Star Wars ongoing

01:55:13   story. I think that's really I think that's a good thing and that's a nice twist on what

01:55:16   they're doing with Marvel. I think it's actually a lower degree of difficulty in some ways

01:55:20   and with a chance of a better product because you know Marvel it's a tough trick because

01:55:25   they compressed everything and it's all happening simultaneously and I think that's kind of

01:55:28   hard. In fact I think Guardians of the Galaxy benefits from being so far out into space

01:55:34   that they didn't have to worry about it. And Star Wars gets to do that. Gets to say, "Well,

01:55:40   this happened a long time ago." Not just in the galaxy far, far away, but like 20 years

01:55:43   further back than that. And I think it'll be good. I'm excited about it. I'm actually

01:55:48   curious if they are, since I mentioned TV shows, if they would consider doing something

01:55:51   like that too. Do it, right? Because Marvel has done that.

01:55:55   Agents of SHIELD has been successful enough. And Agent Carter has been successful enough.

01:56:01   And then the Netflix shows have been very successful.

01:56:03   Yes, I forget about those, of course, yes. Oh, they'll definitely do it. I mean, I'm

01:56:07   sure Netflix is already like writing the huge checks, like how big does this check need

01:56:11   to be, Disney? Give us Star Wars. Give us a Star Wars TV show.

01:56:17   Most likely. I mean, because again, the thing with the Marvel universe is the Marvel universe

01:56:23   is written. And that's, I think that's a problem for Disney is they can't really do anything

01:56:31   that doesn't already exist. I think it's going to be a long time if ever before we see a

01:56:38   Marvel movie created where the character doesn't already exist in Marvel comics. But with Star

01:56:46   Wars, Disney have an open book to write whoever they want because it is a world where they

01:56:53   can create everything because the main story, the story people care about has already been

01:56:58   been told. So it's like the Rogue One, right? The Rogue One movie. We don't know any of

01:57:03   these characters, they've never existed to us before.

01:57:05   No, exactly right. But they're in that world and they're telling a story in that world.

01:57:11   Exactly, because the thing is, the world of Marvel movies is America, right? Like that's

01:57:18   the world that you can't create new things in that world, you just create new people.

01:57:24   But with Star Wars, the character is actually the world, like the place that they are in.

01:57:29   That's the character.

01:57:30   A galaxy.

01:57:31   A galaxy.

01:57:32   A galaxy of people and aliens and planets to explore and tell stories.

01:57:35   In fact, I think that it's great that Rogue One is the first of these non-Saga Star Wars

01:57:41   movies that's coming out.

01:57:42   I'm more troubled by the fact that they seem to be creating a lot of like Boba Fett

01:57:47   movie and Young Han Solo movie and all that.

01:57:50   And those might be good movies, but...

01:57:51   I think it's fine.

01:57:53   But I would like to see them not just be "Let's explore characters we already know."

01:58:00   I would like there to be some, like Rogue One, that it's like in the Star Wars world

01:58:06   and it's something we understand, but it's just a good story.

01:58:08   I think though, with all the movies you know about, you're at like 50/50, because like

01:58:12   7, 8, and 9 is characters you don't know, majorly.

01:58:16   And then we've got Rogue One, which we don't know, and then there's gonna be like Boba

01:58:20   Boba Fett and Han. I think it's good for that though because those characters we only know

01:58:24   what we've seen. I think it might be nice to go back and see a little bit more about

01:58:28   them like especially Boba Fett. What an incredible movie and even series of movies you could

01:58:35   make about the things that guy does. Which are completely out of everything to do with

01:58:43   what happens in the original trilogy. Just what does he do? How does he go around the

01:58:48   the galaxy collecting bounties.

01:58:50   Like I'm, I'm interested in seeing what those sort of movies look like.

01:58:54   As well as then after they're established, just seeing like Bob Space, you know,

01:58:59   that's just a name I have, Disney can take their name if they want.

01:59:02   Yeah.

01:59:02   And just like, you know, person in that world who does things kind of like this,

01:59:06   like give me a Jedi movie for a Jedi I've never seen before.

01:59:10   I just want to see what that looks like.

01:59:12   Like a singular guy or girl trying to make it on their own in the world.

01:59:16   Like they are a Jedi, or like they've been trained,

01:59:18   they are like a full on Jedi,

01:59:20   and they're just going out and doing Jedi stuff.

01:59:22   Like what were all of those Jedis doing in the prequels

01:59:26   when they all got murdered?

01:59:27   What film was that?

01:59:28   Was that two or three where everyone got killed?

01:59:30   Like opera, like what was it?

01:59:32   Three.

01:59:33   What was the, what did they call it?

01:59:35   It was some number, I don't even know.

01:59:36   Operation something something.

01:59:38   Don't make me think about it.

01:59:39   Protocol something, anyway.

01:59:41   Whatever.

01:59:42   What were they all doing?

01:59:43   Like I wanna know what they were doing.

01:59:45   - Yeah, although some of that I think is in Star Wars Rebels.

01:59:48   Have you seen Star Wars Rebels?

01:59:50   - No.

01:59:51   - It's good.

01:59:52   It's a computer animated TV series

01:59:55   that's set between episode three and episode four.

02:00:00   - Yep.

02:00:01   - It's very good.

02:00:02   It's actually a lot of fun.

02:00:03   - Okay.

02:00:04   - It's got, and one of the,

02:00:06   one of the, Dan Morin in the chat room, Order 66, thank you.

02:00:10   One of the characters is a Jedi,

02:00:13   and you're asking yourself like,

02:00:14   well how could there be a Jedi when they killed all the Jedi? And it's like he was an apprentice

02:00:18   and his master was killed, but he survived and it's like they're not, it's not, I actually

02:00:23   think that there's more to mind there, but they do some of that in Rebels. This idea

02:00:27   that they didn't get all the Jedi, there are still Jedi out there, what were they doing?

02:00:32   How did they survive? Were they able to do some good while hiding their identity from

02:00:37   the Empire as the Empire was ascended? Sure, there's a story there probably, but there

02:00:41   is a little of that in Kanan's story in Star Wars Rebels, which is a good one.

02:00:46   I have one last question for you and we'll wrap this up. Do you know why the Disney logo

02:00:52   thing is not shown before this movie? Like, I just got Lucasfilm limited.

02:00:57   Yeah, me too. I think they decided that it was... that was like a branding decision.

02:01:04   I think they maybe decided that the 20th Century Fox fanfare thing was so iconic that replacing

02:01:10   it with the Disney thing was gonna be weird and maybe like Lucasfilm and Star Wars is

02:01:18   all you need. After your 30 minutes of trailers.

02:01:22   So they're continuing to operate Lucasfilm as a wholly owned subsidiary.

02:01:26   Yeah like Pixar. But I feel like they made a decision, I think it's a great decision,

02:01:34   they made the decision not to stick the "When you wish upon a star" in front of it and just

02:01:38   to have it be sort of silent Lucasfilm and Star Wars.

02:01:41   And, you know, I think that was a great call.

02:01:43   We'll see whether it continues in that way

02:01:47   or if they will eventually stick the Disney.

02:01:50   I was hoping John Williams would do a Disney fanfare

02:01:54   that was sort of in the style

02:01:55   of the 20th Century Fox fanfare.

02:01:57   - Yeah.

02:01:58   - And compose that and pop that on the beginning of it.

02:02:00   But, you know, I thought this was good.

02:02:02   I was glad not to see the Disney logo there.

02:02:05   We don't need to see it.

02:02:05   Lucasfilm and Star Wars that's the branding. Yeah it's weird like I recently

02:02:10   bought the Star Wars movies from iTunes they don't have it in them. Interesting.

02:02:17   They don't have fanfare like episodes 4, 5 and 6 and that was really weird like it was weird enough

02:02:23   seeing it here but it wasn't something you know it was fine I think it wasn't

02:02:26   because I wasn't used to it but seeing those now and there's no fanfare on

02:02:30   them it's like oh okay that's strange. Yeah. There we go. So that's The Force

02:02:34   Awakens double thumbs up from me I can't wait to see it again this week I'm very

02:02:38   excited because I saw it in 2D so we've seen it in 3D IMAX just to see what that

02:02:43   experience is like there's a great shot where there's a Star Destroyer kind of

02:02:47   sticking out of the screen that's that's the best thing that's in the movie in

02:02:50   3D but that one is pretty funny yeah your daughter kicking it she kicked it

02:02:55   yeah it's funny I like that so that's it for this week's episode if you want to

02:03:00   go to our show notes find links and stuff you can feel free to do that

02:03:03   rover at relay.fm/upgrade/68. You can also find some buttons there if you want to help

02:03:08   support the show you can do that and sign up for a relay FM membership. If you want

02:03:12   to find us online you can find Jason at sixcolors.com and he is @jsnell on twitter J S N E double

02:03:18   L. I am @imike I M Y K E. We'll be back next week with the upgrade-ies so strap in that's

02:03:25   going to be a ton of fun really looking forward to that. Thanks again to our sponsors this

02:03:30   week smile with TexExpander, Hover, and also the great people over at Braintree for helping

02:03:35   support this week's episode.

02:03:38   Merry Christmas and happy holidays to all of you out there and we'll be back next time.

02:03:41   Until then, say goodbye Jason Snell.

02:03:44   May the force be with you Myke Hurley.

02:03:46   And with you.

02:03:48   Live long and prosper.

02:03:49   Something like that.

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