28: Two Men in a Very Tiny Room


00:00:00   *beep*

00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:09   Live from London and from Relay FM, this is Upgrade episode number 28. Today's show is brought to you

00:00:17   by our friends at Harry's, an exceptional shave at a fraction of the price, Hover, simplified domain

00:00:22   management and MailRoute, a secure hosted email service for protection from viruses and spam.

00:00:27   My name is Myke Hurley and today I have the absolute pleasure of being joined across the

00:00:31   table by Mr. Jason Snell.

00:00:33   Hi Myke.

00:00:34   I'm right here.

00:00:35   Let's shake hands.

00:00:36   Look at this.

00:00:37   We are touching.

00:00:38   We are both live in London.

00:00:39   Jason is here as we are preparing.

00:00:41   This is the first of two live and in-person episodes that we're going to be doing of our

00:00:45   lovely show.

00:00:46   We are ensconced in a very small office.

00:00:49   Somewhere in a secret location in London.

00:00:51   High above London.

00:00:53   We are towering over London town.

00:00:55   So we have an interesting setup for today. I'm getting over a cold, Jason. I'm sorry

00:01:00   if you... I'll try and steer clear of you for as much as I possibly can.

00:01:03   You tell me that after we've shaken hands.

00:01:05   Uh-huh. And hugged. We hugged.

00:01:07   We did.

00:01:08   Casey insisted that you give me a slightly awkward hug, which was fantastic. I appreciate

00:01:13   that.

00:01:14   Indeed. Extra long, extra awkward. Just for Casey.

00:01:16   And we're sitting here across from each other. Jason has a beautiful sticker on his MacBook

00:01:21   Air.

00:01:22   Six Color Rainbow Apple. I got that when I started Six Colors. Also, I realized we had

00:01:27   three Apple laptops in our house and to tell them apart was hard. So now we ordered stickers

00:01:34   for everybody and now we can tell them all apart. My wife has a knitting pattern, I have

00:01:38   the Six Colors Rainbow Apple, and my son has a TARDIS from popular English television program

00:01:44   M.M.E., Doctor Who.

00:01:45   Doctor Who.

00:01:46   Yeah, Doctor Who. In that case.

00:01:49   So we have an action-packed show.

00:01:51   We do.

00:01:52   As always.

00:01:53   We do.

00:01:54   Should we start off with your favorite topic?

00:01:55   I wonder if we're not as energetic as we normally would be because we're not shouting into a

00:01:58   microphone but actually shouting at another human being.

00:02:01   It's very peculiar.

00:02:04   When you record on your own all the time, just looking at a computer, it's a very, very

00:02:09   different experience.

00:02:10   Because plus there's so many variables that change.

00:02:12   I don't have my own microphone.

00:02:14   I can't hear my own voice.

00:02:15   All of these things change.

00:02:17   But we work with what we've got.

00:02:18   it's gonna be a very different but very exciting episode. Yes, yes, in our

00:02:22   special, also we've come together to make this podcast technically, I've

00:02:27   provided two table microphones, you provided your USB interface, it's a

00:02:32   perfect match. Yep, this is a meeting of minds. Yes, and we'll do this, and if this

00:02:37   fails we'll just try it again next week. Uh-huh. All right, should we do some

00:02:41   follow-up? Yes, please. I wanted to, we got some, we got some feedback about Apple TV

00:02:46   and there was a story about Apple TV. And since we talked about it, I thought we would

00:02:49   talk about it some more. John Pekowski at BuzzFeed, formerly of D, all things D, and

00:02:56   then in between he was some--was he somewhere else? I don't know. He's moved around a little

00:03:00   bit.

00:03:01   >> Is he at the Times, the Journal, or something like that?

00:03:02   >> Yeah, maybe. Maybe so. But anyway, now he's--

00:03:04   >> So he's part of this new San Francisco office, right?

00:03:06   >> Yeah. Matt Honan, I believe, hired him for the BuzzFeed San Francisco bureau.

00:03:11   >> I do enjoy some of the crazy stuff on BuzzFeed, but I feel like I can't take it seriously

00:03:15   when I go there to read serious stuff.

00:03:18   It is weird when you see all the subheads from a serious bit of Apple scoop and it's

00:03:22   the same subheads that you would use to have like, you know, eight things you didn't know

00:03:27   about where honey comes from.

00:03:30   Take this quiz about how much of a bee you are.

00:03:33   Yeah, exactly.

00:03:35   So anyway, John Pekowski is working for BuzzFeed now, along with Matt Honan, who is a friend

00:03:40   of--I don't know if he's a friend of the show, but he used to work for me in Macworld.

00:03:45   And they're doing some great work over there, and John Pekowski's sources are excellent,

00:03:48   and he says there will be a new Apple TV.

00:03:50   It will launch at WWDC.

00:03:53   There's a reason why on Apple's site it says Apple TV starts at $69.

00:03:57   I think that's just a mistake.

00:04:00   Well, he says it's not -- I mean, it may be, but he says, "Look, I'm also saying they're

00:04:05   going to have it at WWDC."

00:04:07   And he had some details.

00:04:08   He said it's going to have an A8 processor or a variant of the same.

00:04:14   It's going to have a dramatic increase in onboard storage to accompany downloadable

00:04:18   apps from an app store well beyond the 8GB that's in the current device and an improved

00:04:24   operating system, he says, that will support Siri control of Apple TV and enable it remotely

00:04:28   for a selection of HomeKit-enabled home automation devices.

00:04:32   So a lot of these rumors have been rolled together into this report where he's confirming

00:04:36   it and saying it'll happen at WWDC, it's going to have a new remote control, it'll have Siri

00:04:40   support, perhaps even on the remote control, it'll have app support.

00:04:43   got to wonder about game, the ability to play games on it.

00:04:47   This may be the piece of hardware that some people have said has been floating around

00:04:50   at Apple for a couple of years just waiting for approval to launch it.

00:04:55   A rumor like this, maybe I'm being a bit critical, but a rumor like this seems like it's just

00:05:00   an easy one to do.

00:05:02   He's basically taking all of the rumors and saying this is going to happen.

00:05:05   So even if only like 75% of it, it's like, "Well, see, I got it right."

00:05:08   Well, in many ways, I think all he has to do is get a good source to confirm, say, "Look,

00:05:13   this is the stuff that is floating out there," and get somebody to say, "Yes, that's accurate,

00:05:18   and it'll happen in June."

00:05:20   And that may be the case here.

00:05:22   But this product, if the rumors are true and the rumblings that I've heard are true that

00:05:27   this has been floating around for a couple of years, then that's interesting too, because

00:05:33   that's--of course stuff's going to leak.

00:05:36   if you leave a project and a year later it's still not out, I mean, I think people might

00:05:41   be more – when we were talking about rumors, that's one vector for rumors, I think, is

00:05:45   somebody who's left a project and is frustrated maybe that their work has not come to anything

00:05:49   and they haven't released it.

00:05:51   But John Pekowski, I think the big nugget here is he says it's going to happen and

00:05:56   it's going to happen at WWDC.

00:05:57   And Mark Gurman had a different report a little bit earlier that was a little vaguer about

00:06:01   when it was going to happen, but these seem to be in line. Their sources seem to be quite

00:06:08   similar.

00:06:09   What do you think a product like this does for Apple? Would it be a good idea to launch

00:06:16   another platform now when they've just announced the Watch platform?

00:06:21   I don't know. I mean, I imagine this is all going to be quite familiar to iOS developers

00:06:25   and these are all going to be in the family.

00:06:28   And whether this is-- in fact, we theorized a few years ago,

00:06:32   there were a bunch of people on the internet.

00:06:34   I don't say we like you and me, but there

00:06:36   were a lot of people saying the idea of Apple TV apps

00:06:39   might even be with the Apple TV as kind of a child

00:06:42   to an iOS device, which is very much what the Apple Watch

00:06:46   actually is.

00:06:48   But I don't know.

00:06:49   I think that they'll all be similar things.

00:06:52   The iOS developers should feel very familiar with them.

00:06:55   And probably the people focused on watch apps are probably in a very different category most of the time

00:07:01   from the people who would be building Apple TV apps. Those don't seem to have a lot of overlap.

00:07:06   I'm interested to try and understand what kind of apps people would make that would go beyond stuff like just taking advance of AirPlay and things like that.

00:07:13   Like, do you think that people would make like games for this device, then Apple needs... would they think about a controller if that was the case?

00:07:21   I think I mean there were rumors that this would be you know a device that

00:07:26   would have an optional controller and Amazon has sort of done that and Roku

00:07:29   has done that where there's kind of a generic controller and then there's like

00:07:33   a premium controller. Amazon's premium controller has the microphone you get

00:07:37   that with the Fire TV but you don't get it with a Fire Stick you have to buy it

00:07:40   separately and Roku has a blow Bluetooth blow to what is blow to it has a Bluetooth

00:07:46   remote and a blowfish that comes with it as well. A Bluetooth remote with a motion

00:07:53   sensor in it so you can play, I don't know, Angry Birds is the one that they

00:07:56   always talk about. I think that maybe they put a lot of money into buying

00:08:00   Angry Birds, getting it developed on Roku so now they're gonna promote it.

00:08:03   But I could see that. I could also see Apple saying, "Look, for anything beyond

00:08:08   the most basic interaction, use an iOS device." I could see that too.

00:08:11   Yep, yeah. And a real place for third parties is to create like really really nice looking

00:08:18   controllers. You know they have like a made for Apple TV type thing like they have made for iPhone

00:08:23   and stuff like that. It's interesting, I mean as I said I just think it's it would be an interesting

00:08:30   choice to have it now when there really should be a lot of focus even at WWDC for the watch.

00:08:36   Right.

00:08:36   because that's, I assume, when we're going to see this is what watch apps will be.

00:08:42   Right, although the watch... that's true, that's true. What we've seen so far with WatchKit is the

00:08:47   stuff that's the very basic stuff. So if they're going to roll out how to write proper watch apps

00:08:52   at WWDC and how to write Apple TV apps, that is more stuff. But then again, what better place

00:08:59   to do it than WWDC? It's the venue. It is the venue. And again, maybe there's not as much

00:09:04   overlap as you'd think because I'm trying to think of the kinds of things,

00:09:07   kinds of apps that would be great on Apple TV and it's media apps and games

00:09:14   and those are not probably what you want to see on the watch. That's a good point.

00:09:18   Yep, definitely. So maybe it's this is something for everyone, you know, a little

00:09:23   bit of this. Watch people over here, Apple TV people over here, you might get a like

00:09:27   a West Side Story kind of thing where they're fighting to do it. We're not going to sing

00:09:35   that whole song because we don't want to pay the royalties for that. Upgrady and Bob gave

00:09:38   some feedback that I wanted to read which is similar. He references the John Pekowski

00:09:43   story and says, "I'm sure you'll be talking about the Apple TV future this week. Upgrady

00:09:48   and Bob, you may have made this happen. But I have a question about the $69 current model.

00:09:54   one we're looking for a way to stream music to a stereo or an additional stereo in one's

00:09:58   house the typical answer is Airport Express at $99 but didn't Apple just make it $30 cheaper

00:10:03   to do the same thing with Apple TV? That's an interesting idea but is Apple TV's ports,

00:10:13   doesn't Apple TV just do HDMI and like optical out? Does it have a mini jack on it?

00:10:18   >> I don't think so.

00:10:19   I don't think it does and I think that's the issue is that there's a standard audio mini

00:10:24   jack on the back of the airport express and all that's on the back of the Apple TV is

00:10:29   optical audio, HDMI, and that USB port that's just for tether beta updates basically.

00:10:39   It's not in use for regular stuff.

00:10:41   So if you had an audio something that took optical audio out, that TOS link connector,

00:10:47   then yes, you could use Apple TV and it would probably work.

00:10:51   - So HDMI, optical audio, ethernet, IR, micro USB.

00:10:55   - But no mini jack for audio,

00:10:56   which is what the Airport Express does.

00:10:58   I agree it's a little weird that the Airport Express

00:11:00   is 99 and the Apple TV is 69, but that's the way it is.

00:11:05   - I have just found out that Apple puts the Apple TV

00:11:08   under the iPod section of the website,

00:11:10   which is a really weird place for it to live.

00:11:12   - That's a bad neighborhood to live in.

00:11:14   That's like living on the edge of a cliff.

00:11:15   Shuffle Nano. I'd forgotten that this Nano even existed.

00:11:19   Oh yeah.

00:11:19   The iPod Touch, Apple TV, and accessories.

00:11:24   Well maybe that would be a sign when the Apple TV has truly left hobby status is that it

00:11:29   gets its own navigation on the Apple website.

00:11:32   Yep.

00:11:33   Store Mac, iPhone, watch TV, iPad, iPod.

00:11:36   iPod, yeah. I don't know. I wouldn't buy any real estate in the iPod section, right?

00:11:42   I'm so surprised that a lot of these products exist, and I wonder what the point is of them now.

00:11:48   Like this iPod Touch, it's what? iPhone 5? It's the iPhone 5, right? That's the internals of it.

00:11:57   Is that it? Maybe so. This is the one that John Syracuse had before he got his iPhone 6.

00:12:02   So is it even iPhone 5 spec, or is it like a 4S?

00:12:06   I think the screen, it's an iPhone 5 size.

00:12:10   Oh yeah, yeah, but the processor in it I don't think is even iPhone 5 processor. I could

00:12:14   be wrong about that.

00:12:15   It's a, I'm looking at the page, we are diving deep today. I'm sure the chat room are probably

00:12:20   already telling us exactly all the specs. I should go there.

00:12:23   Yes, chat room says it's an A5.

00:12:25   A5. Which was, is that 4? Is that the iPhone 4?

00:12:30   It's normally we would have, we would have all of our, uh.

00:12:33   Yep. Well, we're being told.

00:12:34   iPhone 4S, yes.

00:12:35   Yeah, Neil Ash in the chat room is saying it's the iPhone 4S.

00:12:37   Don't let us, Neil Ash.

00:12:38   We're trusting you. We're putting a lot of trust in you right now.

00:12:42   Yeah, so that's really interesting that this product still does exist to me.

00:12:46   I find it a very peculiar thing. I know that, you know, it's kind of like if it's sitting

00:12:49   there and you sell 100,000 of them a year, then it's 100,000 products sold.

00:12:55   Just like the iPod Classic, right? It's easy to make. It's cheap to make. People still

00:12:59   buy them. You're not putting any effort into it. But at some point, you know, this is the

00:13:04   -- I mean, the argument here is that at some point you could make it go away and although

00:13:08   some people would complain about it I think Apple would say look if you want

00:13:11   something in your pocket by a phone if you want a lower cost iOS device buy an

00:13:15   iPad mini yeah because he 199 for an iPod touch and 249 for an iPad mini right

00:13:20   if they like the starting iPad mini but at that point you know if you think who

00:13:24   are you buying them for it's probably kids maybe an iPad mini is better they

00:13:28   buy for an iPad 5 chips that's also an a5 chip also also something that should

00:13:33   probably be killed killed yeah oh anyway so thank you upgrading Bob for

00:13:42   suggesting that we talk about the Apple TV and also talk about mysterious

00:13:46   products on Apple's website in the in the the dead zone deaths yeah I pod

00:13:51   category that's right some might say that giant monster lives deep in the

00:13:56   iPod category but very few bad to venture in there. Ahoy iPod no. We have a cheese vertical

00:14:06   update. Naturally. Have you had any more cheese? I have. My girlfriend is plowing through the

00:14:12   Manchego. She is enjoying it very much so I would like to pass on my thanks. Oh good.

00:14:19   She's, well I assume that there will now be more Manchego in our house than ever before.

00:14:25   That's good to hear.

00:14:27   We also got some good feedback from listener Brandon.

00:14:29   He said, "Thank you to me for your work as an ambassador of fine dairy."

00:14:34   You should get a business cut.

00:14:38   When I come into Heathrow, I should say I am an ambassador of fine dairy.

00:14:42   What are you here for, sir?

00:14:43   I'm here to spread the good word of sheep cheese.

00:14:45   Yes.

00:14:46   And Brandon says, "I just had my first hit of Manchego.

00:14:49   Wow, sheep juice is delicious."

00:14:51   I like hit.

00:14:52   He's called it a hit.

00:14:53   hit, like a dealer. So plus 10 for hit, minus 10 for sheep juice. Just to be clear, if you're

00:15:04   drinking or eating sheep juice, you are not having cheese. That is another part of the

00:15:10   sheep that you should not squeeze that sheep. Not that. Anyway, listener Eric also said

00:15:19   He sent out a link that we can put in the show notes to a podcast called Gastropod,

00:15:24   which did an episode called "Say Cheese," which listener Eric recommended and said it's

00:15:28   the ultimate cheese vertical and entire podcast in the inquisitive style.

00:15:32   So save—I'll have to give that a listen to find out more about cheese, including,

00:15:39   apparently, that Cheddar is a place in England where Cheddar is from.

00:15:45   This is what we learned.

00:15:46   These are the important facts.

00:15:47   You will only find on upgrade.

00:15:48   So she's vertical.

00:15:51   Before we go on, Myke, I wanted to also give you a report from where I'm staying while

00:15:56   I'm in London.

00:15:57   My friend Simon's house, Simon and Julie and their daughter Lexi are taking care of me.

00:16:03   And this morning I got up and fought the jet lag and they have a little, up at the very

00:16:08   top of their house where their guest room is, they have a little tiny shower and I went

00:16:11   in there and then I shaved, be the smooth face you see here.

00:16:16   And one of those comforting things, I'm thousands of miles away from home, but you know what

00:16:20   I had with me?

00:16:21   Please tell me.

00:16:22   I had the delightful shaving lotion from Harry's.

00:16:26   Our good friend at Harry's who helped him support this episode.

00:16:29   Oh, we do love Harry's.

00:16:31   They are the best.

00:16:32   And you know, as Jason said, when you're away from home, there are sometimes the little

00:16:37   comforts that you need.

00:16:39   And Harry's is definitely one of those little comforts.

00:16:42   Because shaving can be difficult.

00:16:43   It can be uncomfortable.

00:16:45   It can cause nicks, cuts, scrapes, so much more and also it's expensive.

00:16:49   Buying these blades, if you really want to get a good shave you have to replace your

00:16:53   blades frequently and that can be extremely expensive.

00:16:56   But that's what Harrys, they are out there to tackle.

00:16:59   Harrys make their own blades.

00:17:00   They went and found an incredible factory in Germany who are absolute experts at crafting

00:17:05   these beautiful razor blades and they decided that they needed them.

00:17:08   They needed to make sure they could always get these blades because they'd found the

00:17:11   perfect ones.

00:17:12   So they purchased the factory in Germany.

00:17:14   And this allows them to offer an extremely high quality shave at half the price of other

00:17:19   big branded blades because they own the whole stack.

00:17:23   Harry's will ship for free to your front doorstep and they have an incredible deal for their

00:17:27   starter set which is just $15.

00:17:29   It can get you a razor, moisturising shave cream or foaming shave gel and 3 razor blades.

00:17:34   On average a Harry's shaver saves $150 each year because they use their Harry's blades.

00:17:42   I love the way that Harry's razors look.

00:17:44   Jason loves their products as well.

00:17:45   They really care about making your face feel good.

00:17:49   Their stuff smells great.

00:17:51   My girlfriend has now stolen my Harry's razor.

00:17:55   - Wow. - Yep.

00:17:56   Because she--

00:17:57   - So we, okay, cheese and the Harry's razor now.

00:18:00   - Yeah, she's taken over.

00:18:01   - She has immaculate taste is what I'm saying.

00:18:03   - She was unhappy.

00:18:04   We were talking about it.

00:18:05   She was unhappy with her razor blades.

00:18:07   So I said, "Well, why don't you try this one?"

00:18:09   And she is now very happy with the Harry's set

00:18:12   that she has now stolen from me which is great I mean I love the way it looks

00:18:15   it's got a great classic style their products are just so great I'm a big fan of

00:18:20   their stuff they've got a really nice brand that I like and it kind of

00:18:23   is very cool and retro. Harries are a great company you should go check them out if you

00:18:27   want to clean

00:18:28   clothes comfortable shave then you should be going and checking out Harries

00:18:32   go to Harries.com right now and they will give you five dollars off

00:18:35   if you use the coupon code upgrade with your first purchase

00:18:38   has H-A-R-R-Y-S dot com and coupon code upgrade to get five dollars off your first purchase

00:18:44   to start shaving better today. Thank you so much to Harry's for their support of Upgrade

00:18:49   live from London.

00:18:50   Doing this live, I keep waiting for us to finish things and having like an audience

00:18:54   go "yeah, yeah, yeah." But there's no, we're live before nobody.

00:18:56   No.

00:18:57   Live before chat room. The chat room is always there with us. They're always our studio audience.

00:19:01   There is a large chat room audience today. This is one of the, looking at our statistics,

00:19:05   This is one of the largest live listener audiences we've had.

00:19:09   Well, we could, we could, we're also a little earlier than usual because I usually, we usually

00:19:15   do this at 11 a.m. Pacific time.

00:19:17   Yes.

00:19:18   Which, which is what, 7 p.m.

00:19:21   Most of the year it's 7 p.m.

00:19:22   Yes, most of the year.

00:19:23   We're in that weird time now where it's different.

00:19:24   The three weeks of it not being correct for anybody.

00:19:28   Yeah, yeah.

00:19:29   But so, you know, we're a little bit earlier than that and maybe people are happy about

00:19:33   that.

00:19:34   I could do this podcast earlier in the day, but I don't know if Monday morning, I don't

00:19:40   know if I would be at my best at eight or nine in the morning on a Monday morning.

00:19:43   I don't need you to do that.

00:19:45   I think 11.

00:19:46   I'm sufficiently caffeinated and I had a chance to go through our notes and all of that, which

00:19:52   if we did it earlier, I think I'd have to do it on Sunday night and I don't want to

00:19:56   do that.

00:19:57   No.

00:19:58   So I wanted to talk to you today about your technology life when you travel.

00:20:03   Yeah, yeah. Because I always find this interesting.

00:20:06   It's topical. Excellent topic. Did you know I'm traveling now? I'm like, really?

00:20:12   This interests me because I like to understand the way that people deal with these things.

00:20:16   Because plus also for the first time, me and you, this is the first time that you've traveled

00:20:21   that me and you have been in so much contact because now we do the show.

00:20:24   Right. And the last few days you have been on edge, I think is probably the best way to put it.

00:20:29   Well, on Friday in the relay slack room, I believe at one point I posted something that

00:20:38   was just the word "Travel Stress" in all capital letters with spaces in between them.

00:20:44   And if I could remember how to get that ASCII art picture of the guy jumping out of a window,

00:20:50   that's what I would have done.

00:20:51   Stephen Hackett is going to immediately send you his text expander.

00:20:54   Yes, please, please do.

00:20:55   Because he uses that a lot too.

00:20:57   Because that's what I was feeling.

00:20:58   And it was, you know, all last week was super stressful for me.

00:21:02   And I know some people get really stressed out when they travel, and sometimes I do too.

00:21:05   But for this time, all the stress was before the trip.

00:21:09   I felt like once I got here, I know my way around London.

00:21:12   I've been here so many times now.

00:21:13   This is like my fifth or sixth trip to London since 2000.

00:21:17   Before 2000, I had never been outside of North America.

00:21:21   But since then, I've been here a bunch.

00:21:23   And so I know my way around the tube, and I have an Oyster card, and it's all good.

00:21:28   But last week I was sitting there thinking,

00:21:31   "I have this huge stack of things

00:21:32   "that I have to get done before I go."

00:21:34   And so as the week progressed and I was not,

00:21:37   I felt like my pace was not sufficient

00:21:40   to get everything done before I went,

00:21:43   you know, it just amped up the stress.

00:21:45   I had a bunch of stuff that I had agreed to do

00:21:47   in the evenings last week because I couldn't agree

00:21:52   to doing it the following two weeks.

00:21:53   So I ended up with four of the five nights.

00:21:56   I had an evening engagement of some sort.

00:21:59   I had a podcast.

00:22:00   I had to teach a class.

00:22:01   I had to speak at a user group.

00:22:04   And I had a board meeting for the nonprofit that I'm on, the National Novel Writing Month

00:22:08   board.

00:22:09   And so four out of the five nights I also couldn't...

00:22:11   I was so busy last week that I felt like this is the kind of week where I could go back

00:22:16   to work after dinner and work through the evening in order to get it done, and I didn't

00:22:20   have the evenings either.

00:22:21   Do you think that this stress is different this time because of your work situation has

00:22:29   changed?

00:22:30   Partially, I think.

00:22:32   It's definitely true that when I would travel before, even if it was a business trip, I

00:22:37   would delegate to people and not have to worry about it as much.

00:22:42   And now one of the facts of being on my own is that I need to make the arrangements and

00:22:53   my ability to delegate is limited.

00:22:54   I did actually have a nice conversation with Dan Morin, who I believe is actually listening

00:22:58   to us live, saying, "Hey Dan, can you look in on the website for me just because I don't

00:23:03   know how constant my focus will be.

00:23:07   I'm going to be traveling internationally, I've got a bunch of trips."

00:23:09   I did, I mean, I wrote two or three things this morning, but tomorrow I'm hoping to walk

00:23:14   around London a little bit, and so I'm going to be a little less attentive.

00:23:17   So yeah, some of that is there, that I've got responsibilities that, you know, I have

00:23:22   responsibilities before, but I also had a team that I could say, "Can you watch this

00:23:25   for the next week?"

00:23:26   And I don't have so much of that now.

00:23:29   You know, my book chapters that I'm working on and blog posts that I'm doing and all of

00:23:35   that is stuff that I have to take care of myself.

00:23:37   So I think that was part of it.

00:23:41   But in the end, there's a good end to the story, which is in the end I feel like I did

00:23:45   end up doing everything I needed to do before I went.

00:23:47   I didn't defer anything or punt anything.

00:23:49   I wrote the chapter that I needed to write for the book that I'm working on.

00:23:55   It's a funny thing.

00:23:56   I'm writing an e-book for tidbits about photos, the Photos app, which is great.

00:24:01   I'm learning a lot about the Photos app.

00:24:03   But one of the things--and it's pretty good, although Aperture users, I think, are not

00:24:07   are going to hate it, but iPhoto users will like it.

00:24:11   But so Tanya Angst, who is the series editor for those books,

00:24:17   we agreed to a schedule.

00:24:18   And I said, I've got two weeks that I'm

00:24:19   going to be traveling internationally,

00:24:20   so we need to work around that.

00:24:22   And they said that was fine.

00:24:23   And then she sent an email early in the week and said,

00:24:26   so here's what I'm thinking we want

00:24:28   to do to move the schedule around a little bit in order

00:24:30   to get a first version of the book out sooner.

00:24:33   And I looked at it, and she was sort of

00:24:35   assuming that I'd be writing it for the next two weeks.

00:24:37   And I wrote back and I said, "One problem with this, I'm not going to be around."

00:24:42   And it was nice because she had that moment where she's like, "Oh, I forgot you were traveling."

00:24:46   So it's all okay.

00:24:47   But in order to fulfill the basic level of what this plan was that she had, I did need

00:24:51   to do some stuff that I had initially expected not to have to do until after I got back.

00:24:58   I had to do this week.

00:24:59   And that was what I think put my stress level over the edge.

00:25:01   But in the end, I wrote the chapter I needed to write on Saturday.

00:25:06   My wife and I took a walk for an hour or two.

00:25:08   We came back.

00:25:09   I was already packed at that point.

00:25:10   I packed my suitcase on Saturday morning.

00:25:13   And my flight was at 9 p.m., which was actually great because I was already getting tired

00:25:21   when I got on.

00:25:22   And then I was able to sort of doze on the plane.

00:25:24   And then the stress was gone because then I was in the air and it was all over.

00:25:27   But that preparing for it and figuring out what to pack, including what technology to

00:25:31   pack that was all balled up in that in that stress that just kept elevating

00:25:36   throughout the whole week until on Friday I shouted in the relay chat room

00:25:40   TRAVEL STRESS! I want to get to the technology but there isn't there is an

00:25:44   interesting part because I'm feeling this because on Friday I am away for two

00:25:48   weeks yes right and you're doing the multiple stop travel just like I am and

00:25:53   there's an interesting thing where it's like even though things are getting

00:25:57   taken care of because it's yours now it's different to when you work

00:26:02   somewhere because it's like if something went wrong it's like well someone's gonna

00:26:06   fix it right and ultimately it doesn't affect me if something happens because

00:26:10   I'm not there but now if something goes wrong and I'm not there it ultimately

00:26:15   affects me right and that adds a different you do have Steven yes and you

00:26:19   do have your your your co-hosts like Steven's taken over a lot of the

00:26:23   responsibilities which I love him for but it's still it's like this other

00:26:27   thing where it's like ah but it's you know if things go a bit awry like if

00:26:32   something pops up and I have that for me I have that like low-level anxiety at

00:26:36   all times it's like I need to be connected because I there are there's

00:26:39   going to be parts of my two-week trip where I will not be connected and that's

00:26:45   gonna be a really interesting way to do things I hope you weren't bitten by a

00:26:49   vampire during those times. Yes, we will see. I am going to Romania for a

00:26:54   week as well. We're traveling around so I expect that parts of the

00:27:00   mountains will not have accurate cell coverage. They're called "Pythian Mountains".

00:27:07   So we'll see what happens. So let's get to the technology they bring of you.

00:27:11   Yes. What have you got and how do you make those decisions? What

00:27:16   makes the cut. You know the big thing that that... Did you bring your own mic?

00:27:20   I, alas, I did not. The big thing that that I stressed out about was actually

00:27:26   about audio because we have these two episodes that we're that we're recording

00:27:29   and I want to record it clockwise when we're in Ireland as well, which

00:27:33   hopefully you will be on. And so I had that moment of thinking, you know,

00:27:39   what should I bring? I've got two table mics, should I bring my USB thing? Should

00:27:43   I bring my recorder, which is an SD card recorder that is also its own microphone, so that gives

00:27:51   me a third microphone for a tabletop situation, and I stressed out about that for a while.

00:27:55   And in the end, I thought that I would just bring the recorder, which can double as a

00:28:00   USB audio input if I need to, and then I thought, "Oh, I can ask Myke to bring his USB thing

00:28:06   to the office in London," and that's what we're using now.

00:28:11   So it all actually all worked out because I got, we teamed up and that made it a lot

00:28:16   better.

00:28:18   So I stressed out about that.

00:28:19   I have my MacBook Air, so bringing that was not a big deal except for the fact that, and

00:28:24   we talked about this briefly when I was traveling over the holidays, I don't have one computer

00:28:28   anymore.

00:28:29   And so I had that moment of, I did a lot of stressing out because of files I didn't want

00:28:33   to bring with me, not just because of the work but because of the sizes.

00:28:36   Like the total party kill project is like 10 gigabytes, and I thought on my little MacBook

00:28:42   Air SSD.

00:28:43   It turns out I do have room, and I'm happy that I've already edited next week's episode

00:28:49   because I don't have to do that while I'm here.

00:28:52   But I was also trying to minimize the stuff that I was copying because on Saturday afternoon

00:28:56   I ended up copying all the projects that I know I need to work on next weekend's incomparable,

00:29:02   and the following weekend's incomparable I need to edit while I'm here.

00:29:06   And so I brought those files with me.

00:29:07   So some of it was that of making sure that the apps that I had on the laptop, which I

00:29:13   hadn't opened since the Apple event, making sure they were all updated.

00:29:17   And it turned out that I needed to update because I'm writing about photos, there was

00:29:21   a new OS 10.10.3 beta that had come out.

00:29:24   So I needed to update to the latest beta so that I could have photos with me.

00:29:30   And running beta software on your laptop when you're traveling is crazy, but at the same

00:29:33   time I'm writing a book out about photos.

00:29:34   I have no choice but to do that.

00:29:37   And that's actually why I'm on the beta on this laptop, is because I knew I'd be traveling

00:29:41   and need access to photos.

00:29:43   So that stuff was the big stuff.

00:29:47   I'm not too worried about chargers at this point.

00:29:51   I brought a computer charger and an iPad charger, and I brought my iPad with me.

00:29:55   The iPad charger doubles as the phone charger.

00:29:59   So that was most of it.

00:30:02   I did spend, oh, I'd say I spent an hour with it,

00:30:07   but I didn't because I was doing other things

00:30:09   in the background while this very slow burn was happening

00:30:12   between my iPad and iTunes.

00:30:14   'Cause I wanted to load a bunch of movies and TV shows on

00:30:18   for the plane and for my train

00:30:20   and all of these different trips that I'm taking

00:30:23   in case I wanna watch something.

00:30:24   And first off, it was attached to my Mac Mini.

00:30:29   And when I tried to sync it on the Mac Mini,

00:30:32   it started to act very strangely and I thought, you know what, I'm going to unsink it from my Mac Mini,

00:30:35   I'm going to sync it to my iMac. And my iMac is connected to the Mac Mini's giant storage volume with gigabit Ethernet,

00:30:46   so it shouldn't be a problem.

00:30:47   Lots of home movies.

00:30:48   Yeah, yeah, lots of home movies, pictures of the kids. No, it's stuff I've ripped off of Blu-rays and things like that.

00:30:53   perfectly legal, but still.

00:30:55   And what I discovered is that the,

00:30:58   I was running the iPhotos beta on iOS,

00:31:03   the iPhoto, or the photo in iCloud photo data.

00:31:06   - Oh, right, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:31:07   - And although that is supposed to dynamically

00:31:12   determine how much storage on your device it uses,

00:31:17   for this Photos book, I've been syncing photos.app

00:31:20   with the cloud and I've got something like four or five thousand photos in there.

00:31:27   And they had all synced to the device and so the device was reporting that I couldn't,

00:31:31   the iPad mini, couldn't sync any videos because it had 70 gigabytes of photos.

00:31:39   And I tried to remove them by turning it off and it said, "This will delete 6,000 photos."

00:31:45   And I said, "Yes, that's a good idea."

00:31:47   And then I attached it to iTunes and it still reported that I had 70 gigabytes of photos.

00:31:51   It turned out that, like I said, doing this in the background while I'm working on other

00:31:55   things, but what I ended up doing was I had to update my iPad Mini to the iOS beta.

00:32:01   So I'm all on beta.

00:32:03   Every device I have here is using beta software, but that, because I knew that this was some

00:32:08   weird bug involving the iCloud photo library stuff.

00:32:11   And indeed, once I had updated to the beta and I turned off iCloud Photo Library, it

00:32:17   deleted all the images off the image.

00:32:20   Now, this has got me concerned because if iOS really wants to download a thumbnail of

00:32:28   every single one of your iCloud images in your iCloud library...

00:32:31   That could still be massive for some people.

00:32:33   Well, this is what I'm thinking is that if I've got 5,000 or 10,000 or 20,000 photos

00:32:37   in my collection, does that mean that if I turn on iCloud Photo Library, it's going to

00:32:43   try to fill up 60 or 70 gigs of my device with photo previews?

00:32:49   Because that's insane.

00:32:51   That stuff should be streamed if there's not enough room, right?

00:32:54   There should be something that it does.

00:32:57   But this is a thought that occurs to me as I'm freaking out on Friday afternoon, and

00:33:01   so I just decided, or maybe that was Saturday morning, so I just turned it off for now,

00:33:06   But it's something that I need to investigate when we get back.

00:33:08   That's a really good point though, because thumbnails are small, but they still take

00:33:12   up space.

00:33:13   And if you're encouraged to put your entire life's worth of photos into this app.

00:33:18   And in the iOS 8.3 beta, all you can do is turn it on and off.

00:33:23   So does that mean that you can't have a large library unless you have extremely large devices?

00:33:27   Shouldn't it do the, uh, "We're going to assume how much space"?

00:33:31   Yeah, well that's what it should do.

00:33:35   And it's beta, so maybe it will do that.

00:33:36   But I had the experience where I really needed to turn it off in order to copy movies to

00:33:41   my iPad.

00:33:42   That's not ideal.

00:33:43   Not ideal.

00:33:44   But anyway, that was a huge source of stress.

00:33:46   But in the end, I did end it up where I've got some movies, got some future homework

00:33:51   for the incomparable on there that I have to watch that John Syracuse had assigned me,

00:33:55   and then some other stuff that is of my own choosing.

00:33:59   The problem with watching anime on an airplane is that anime is one of those things that

00:34:05   just there's often surprise nudity that happens out of the blue and and and then

00:34:11   I'm the guy who's watching cartoon boobs on in coach class on British Airways and

00:34:16   that's a bad that's a bad thing so that's a that's a challenge so we're

00:34:23   gonna talk about the phone that you have with you we'll talk about that I omitted

00:34:28   that from my packing list just so that we could talk about that as its own

00:34:31   topic. But I'm interested, did you get a local SIM? I did. I did. Now the last two times

00:34:38   I've been here I have bought a SIM from three. Which is, you know, they are a prepaid, they're

00:34:47   a carrier but they have a prepaid plan. And they have the insane data limits. Yeah, so

00:34:54   When I was in Ireland a year and a half ago, I bought one, and then last year I bought one here in London at a shop not too far, about a block from here in fact.

00:35:06   And in London, the deal is for £15, you get 30 days of like a thousand talk minutes and a thousand texts and something like, oh, and unlimited data.

00:35:21   And it roams, although I think maybe there's a data cap

00:35:24   when you roam, so next week when I'm in Ireland,

00:35:28   I will be able to use a certain amount of data,

00:35:30   hopefully without ever having to recharge it

00:35:33   or buy a new card.

00:35:34   I'm hoping. - Three are really good.

00:35:36   They have this, I think they call it like the,

00:35:40   something abroad or something like that,

00:35:42   where you can use your-- - At home abroad,

00:35:45   I think it's called. - And you can use

00:35:46   your data and minutes and stuff in other countries,

00:35:50   And it just takes from your local allowance?

00:35:52   - Yeah.

00:35:53   - There's no roaming charges?

00:35:54   - Yeah, it's pretty great.

00:35:55   So I was thinking, I've gotta get to my friend Simon's house

00:35:58   and I like screenshotted some Google Maps

00:36:01   so I would know how to get there just in case.

00:36:03   And then we get to the baggage claim area.

00:36:07   So I'm through customs and immigration.

00:36:11   I'm in the baggage claim area and against the wall

00:36:13   is a SIM card vending machine.

00:36:18   And in the vending machine, the three package is there

00:36:22   for 20 pounds.

00:36:23   So, and I know that's a five pound markup,

00:36:26   and I think to myself, if I get it here,

00:36:29   I will immediately have data.

00:36:30   I can send a note to my wife saying I landed.

00:36:32   I can see if Simon has sent me a note,

00:36:35   'cause I was asking him what the right tube stop is,

00:36:37   the best, the most efficient route to go,

00:36:39   and I will have access to maps as I'm making my journey

00:36:43   so I can get there regardless of whether Simon

00:36:46   gives me proper directions or not. Or I cannot spend those five extra pounds and wait until

00:36:51   Monday morning and then walk down on Monday morning. So I spent the five extra pounds

00:36:56   for 20 pounds, got it. As I'm waiting for my bag to come off the conveyor, I pop open

00:37:01   the SIM card on this phone, an unlocked phone, put in the SIM, turn it on and send my wife

00:37:10   a text saying I've landed and get the directions from Simon and he has a better tube stop for

00:37:15   me to ride to and all of that happened. Totally worth it, but it's come to that now where

00:37:20   -- and it's smart because international travelers are going to want to buy those cards, so why

00:37:25   would you not put a prepaid SIM card vending machine at the baggage claim?

00:37:28   And of course put a mark-up on it.

00:37:30   So by the time my bag came out -- and five pounds didn't seem -- I had a couple of people

00:37:34   on Twitter saying, "Oh, it's probably a bad deal." It is a five pound mark-up, but I knew

00:37:41   I knew what the markup was and I was fine with it, but the fact that I was online and

00:37:46   sending messages to people before my bag even came out.

00:37:50   I mean, I say I literally spent no extra time because I would have been standing there waiting

00:37:56   anyway.

00:37:57   It's incredible how fast they set up.

00:37:58   And you could just pop it in and it's just ready to go.

00:38:00   And it's ready to go and then there's information you can register and you can top it up and

00:38:03   things like that, but you just pop it in and it'll go.

00:38:05   And I was also impressed by this.

00:38:08   Three's little card that the SIM card comes in is a,

00:38:12   it's got all the sizes.

00:38:14   So if you've got a SIM or a micro SIM or a nano SIM,

00:38:19   you just punch out the size you want from the card.

00:38:21   - Very clever.

00:38:22   - Very, very super smart.

00:38:23   So I was very impressed,

00:38:24   and this is the third time I've used them, like I said.

00:38:26   I recommend it.

00:38:28   You have to have an unlocked phone, that's the only thing.

00:38:30   Although AT&T in the US has gotten much better

00:38:32   at unlocking your phone,

00:38:34   My understanding now is that after you're out of contract you can call them and they

00:38:37   send you a text basically and then it's unlocked.

00:38:39   My only issue with that stuff is iMessage.

00:38:42   I really wished you could still receive iMessages to your phone number when you're on another

00:38:47   phone.

00:38:48   Well you can because your iMessage account, Apple registers the number of your cell phone.

00:38:55   So does that work now?

00:38:56   Because when I've tried to do it in the past it hasn't worked.

00:38:59   It worked.

00:39:00   I was actually asked on this phone I've got, it says would you like to receive iMessage.

00:39:04   messages at my US phone number. Oh, perfect. Only iMessages will work. Your normal SMS's

00:39:11   won't go through but iMessages will go through. Anybody that sends me an SMS I don't want

00:39:16   it. No, yeah. Because it can get really expensive. So I'll probably just buy a SIM in Ireland

00:39:23   when we land and then also a SIM in Romania when I go to travel. Because 3 doesn't unfortunately

00:39:29   their feel at home doesn't include Romania.

00:39:32   'Cause I use EE here, and I use EE

00:39:35   because their LTE is incredible.

00:39:38   And 3E used some of that,

00:39:40   but they don't have the access to the speeds.

00:39:42   When I signed up to EE,

00:39:43   they were the only LTE carrier in the UK,

00:39:45   and they were that way for about six months.

00:39:47   And I love the speeds.

00:39:48   You can get up to like 80 megabytes down

00:39:51   in certain parts of the island.

00:39:52   It's really, really amazing.

00:39:53   - It looks like what I'm getting is 3G

00:39:56   for the most part on 3.

00:39:57   But again, having data while I'm traveling internationally

00:40:02   is such a treat because for several years,

00:40:05   after we all came to expect having the internet

00:40:07   in our pocket at all times,

00:40:09   but before you actually could get it in any way

00:40:12   that wasn't sort of this ridiculously overpriced

00:40:14   international roaming, that was bad.

00:40:17   - It would always catch you out.

00:40:18   Every single time, it always catches you out.

00:40:20   - I should say, Anne Cremins in our chat room says

00:40:23   actually 3's got unlimited data in Ireland there's just a tethering limit

00:40:28   which is what Marco Arment was talking about because Marco just went through this too

00:40:32   yeah and because Marco has just been in England. He was at NSConf and now he's going back to

00:40:38   rule next week. Yeah but he's taking a week sabbatical in New York before coming back to here.

00:40:45   But there was something that they spoke about on that show which I want to now speak about

00:40:48   about on this show.

00:40:49   Yes, I am replicating Marco's experience in so many different ways.

00:40:53   Yes.

00:40:54   But first I think we need to hear from some friends at a company whose name is pronounced

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00:41:00   Myke.

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00:42:24   Excuse me, I do have a cold.

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00:42:27   it's progressing through this episode.

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00:43:01   Thank you so much to Hover for their continued support of this show.

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00:43:05   You know what are phrases that you shouldn't say when you have a cold?

00:43:08   Please tell me.

00:43:09   Domain needs.

00:43:10   Domain needs.

00:43:13   Deeds from hovid.com.

00:43:15   Doesn't work.

00:43:17   So this is the year of Myke.

00:43:20   Myke has been right through all of 2015 so far.

00:43:24   Interesting claims.

00:43:26   Yes, the thing that I'm right the most about is everybody deciding that the 6+ is the phone

00:43:33   for them.

00:43:35   This started on Connected on the Fine Reel FM where both in the same episode Stephen

00:43:41   and Federico professed that I was right about the 6 Plus and its incredible benefits over

00:43:47   every other phone on the market.

00:43:48   And then I was thrilled that this week's episode of our favourite follow-up show, the Accident

00:43:55   Attack podcast, which was a great episode this week in which you could hear the strain

00:44:01   of KC as they went through an entire episode of follow-up.

00:44:05   But then at the end had the best topic ever in which Marco professed his new love for

00:44:11   the 6 Plus, in which they also professed that Myke was right, which enables the hashtag

00:44:17   MykeWasRight to stretch even further.

00:44:20   So you are sitting here in front of me with a 6 Plus right now, a white one.

00:44:25   So I wanted to just take us back to episode one of this show, which was where we reviewed

00:44:32   the iPhones.

00:44:34   And in that episode, I remember you scoffing at the 6 Plus.

00:44:39   Yes, indeed.

00:44:40   This very model, in fact.

00:44:41   This very unit.

00:44:42   It's still that one!

00:44:43   Yeah, yeah.

00:44:44   Wow, you just hang on to those things.

00:44:45   Yeah, this is why.

00:44:47   This is why.

00:44:48   You gotta live with it.

00:44:49   Spend some time with it.

00:44:50   That's clever.

00:44:51   So then we have you...

00:44:52   Anyway, so this beautiful one right here, straight from Cupertino into Jason Stell's

00:44:56   hands.

00:44:57   Uh-huh.

00:44:58   You said it was too large and just not for you, but I knew it was gonna be the phone

00:45:03   for me and I'm so happy and I continue to be happy with my 6+. So you have been using

00:45:09   this for just a couple of days.

00:45:11   Since I inserted that SIM card at the baggage claim.

00:45:15   So I'm interested to see especially how we are with this on next week's episode. But

00:45:19   what do you think about it? Because now you've used the 6, right? That's the key thing because

00:45:23   you jumped from the 5S to the 6+ in review.

00:45:26   Indeed.

00:45:27   But now you've had that part in the middle.

00:45:29   Yeah, so I mean I chose to bring this because I also had access to an unlocked iPhone 6

00:45:38   so I could have done that and it would have been the same as my phone that I carry at

00:45:42   home and I thought, you know, this is a great opportunity to bring that unlocked 6 Plus

00:45:47   and use it and have some time with it.

00:45:50   Plus, with the battery being larger and me traveling, I thought that might be a good

00:45:55   thing to have and having the bigger screen and if I'm in cases where I'm not, I don't

00:46:03   have access to other technology, I'll have, you know, because I'm not at home and I'm

00:46:06   not as comfortable, I will have this big screen on this big iPhone.

00:46:10   So I had a bunch of reasons to try it.

00:46:13   I don't think I'm going to give you the same narrative as Marco because my initial reactions

00:46:21   are good god it is a huge phone.

00:46:25   The first, I was trying to use it while I was walking

00:46:30   to the tube station and from the tube station in one hand,

00:46:34   as is my want as an iPhone user,

00:46:36   and I had to tap on a button in the lower part of the screen

00:46:41   but it was the lower right and I couldn't reach it.

00:46:45   I almost dropped the phone trying to stretch my thumb over

00:46:47   to reach it and I realized that I needed to use two hands

00:46:51   except that I was carrying something in my other hand.

00:46:54   I only had the one hand free, and I thought,

00:46:58   whoa, this is a big phone.

00:46:59   I cannot reach the other side of it from here.

00:47:01   - There's a special grip.

00:47:02   - Reachability, reachability I could do.

00:47:05   And although I rarely use reachability on the 6,

00:47:08   on the 6 Plus, yesterday I was thinking,

00:47:09   oh, reachability, good, I'm glad I have that.

00:47:12   But reachability doesn't help me get from left to right.

00:47:15   - So I think this is something that you end up getting to.

00:47:19   you develop a confidence with the phone.

00:47:24   So I have like a really weird way of holding it.

00:47:29   Like I am now demonstrating to Jason that if I need--

00:47:31   - This is Myke's iPhone 6 Plus tips.

00:47:34   - If I needed to get to that bottom corner,

00:47:36   I would like throw the phone up into my thumb.

00:47:40   Basically the more you use it--

00:47:41   - Well that's what I did and it was terrifying.

00:47:43   - Yeah, this is the thing,

00:47:46   you need to get more comfortable with it.

00:47:47   I have had some catastrophic drops with this phone.

00:47:50   Because of its size, I did this,

00:47:52   I've done this a couple of times,

00:47:53   you kind of drop it and as you try and catch it,

00:47:55   you hit a corner and it just spins uncontrollably

00:47:58   and hits the floor, which I'm very happy I have a case on it.

00:48:01   I have, for the first time,

00:48:03   I bought AppleCare with this phone

00:48:05   'cause I knew that there was a bigger chance of dropping it.

00:48:07   That is a thing that over time you start to get used to.

00:48:11   But, so, and also, I know that you're a Twitterrific user.

00:48:15   - Twitterific is totally not built with this phone.

00:48:18   - Yeah, well that was in fact where I felt

00:48:20   the pain was in Twitterific.

00:48:22   - More than any other app that I've used

00:48:24   on a regular basis, that's the one that I struggle

00:48:26   with the most because all of the buttons are at the top,

00:48:29   which is not ideal.

00:48:31   And I do feel this still, that there are many developers

00:48:35   that are not accurately thinking about the size challenges

00:48:40   of even the six with some of this stuff.

00:48:43   Like, I believe you should be able to,

00:48:46   with a lot of those tab bars, have it configurable

00:48:48   so it can sit in other parts of the UI,

00:48:51   especially something like a tab bar.

00:48:53   Like, I know I'm making, like, I'm like professing,

00:48:55   this is easy, just move it, and I'm sure it's not.

00:48:58   But I still feel like there are a lot of apps

00:49:01   that they're putting the navigation where it used to be

00:49:05   rather than where it now maybe should be,

00:49:07   which is in a different part of the device.

00:49:09   Because those far corners,

00:49:12   any corner can actually be hard to hit with these devices.

00:49:15   - Yeah, my problem was where I really felt

00:49:18   it was with the keyboard though,

00:49:20   where I wanted to hit the delete key

00:49:22   and I was holding the phone in my left hand

00:49:24   and my left thumb has to get over there

00:49:27   and I'm walking and I'm thinking to myself,

00:49:29   I can hit that button but I may drop this phone

00:49:32   if I do that.

00:49:33   - So I may, this isn't necessarily a great help

00:49:38   but there's a really great third party keyboard

00:49:40   called Flexi, and one of the functions that it has

00:49:43   is you can squeeze the keyboard over.

00:49:46   So it just occupies two thirds of the keyboard screen.

00:49:49   So it squishes it together,

00:49:51   and it makes it really, really easy for one-handed typing.

00:49:53   It's also a really good keyboard,

00:49:54   this one actually, the Flexi keyboard.

00:49:56   I've only been trying it out for a few days,

00:49:58   but CGP Grey suggested it to me,

00:50:02   because he is a Dvorak keyboard user,

00:50:05   and it has Dvorak, which is, I don't even understand.

00:50:08   I enabled it and I don't get it.

00:50:10   - I'm starting to understand CGP Grey better now.

00:50:13   (laughing)

00:50:15   In the chat room, he says,

00:50:18   "Where did you hear about that keyboard, Myke?"

00:50:20   - Is he there?

00:50:21   - I think, well, somebody identifying as Grey

00:50:23   is in the chat room.

00:50:25   Come on over, Grey, we're in London.

00:50:26   - See, I'm not-- - Head on over.

00:50:28   - I will say nothing more unless you confirm

00:50:30   why I know about this keyboard, 'cause he showed me it.

00:50:33   And he showed me the fact that you can squeeze it up.

00:50:36   It's actually a very good keyboard,

00:50:38   and I do suggest that people should try it out.

00:50:41   But yes, it can be difficult sometimes

00:50:45   to hit certain parts of the interface.

00:50:49   - Yeah, well, I'm gonna live with it.

00:50:51   And I enjoy the big screen and I enjoy the fact

00:50:56   that the battery is bigger and so it lasts longer.

00:51:01   Grace says that he doesn't actually use Dvorak on iOS.

00:51:04   That's just his finger typing or hand typing keyboard.

00:51:08   - I don't know, I have no idea how you could use

00:51:11   two different types of keyboard.

00:51:14   Like on iOS I use this, yeah, very interesting.

00:51:18   So,

00:51:20   obviously one of the great things about the 6+

00:51:26   is the amount of information that you can see

00:51:29   on the screen at once.

00:51:31   do you find that to be significant over the six

00:51:35   like do you feel like you're able to say for example when you read twitter effect

00:51:38   you can obviously see more tweets do you find that to be a an interesting thing

00:51:43   well again only it's only been a day

00:51:45   but no

00:51:47   but i was a convert my i i i'm just i'm remaining skeptical but this is why i'm

00:51:51   doing and it's only day one and i'm going to be here for two weeks and i'm

00:51:54   going to be using this phone

00:51:55   as my phone for two weeks so we'll see how it goes but

00:51:58   uh...

00:52:00   Again, I think I would have been more impressed

00:52:01   coming from the five to the added space of the six plus,

00:52:05   but coming from the six, it's bigger.

00:52:07   It's bigger, everything's bigger.

00:52:10   Everything, there's more of everything.

00:52:12   I actually, I showed this when I was packing up,

00:52:15   I showed this to my wife

00:52:15   and she was really interested in it.

00:52:17   And one of the reasons she,

00:52:19   'cause she was thinking about it,

00:52:21   'cause she thought about how,

00:52:22   oh, it's so huge, I would never put that in my pocket.

00:52:24   And then she said, you know what?

00:52:25   I never put my phone in my pocket.

00:52:27   it's always in her purse or in a small bag.

00:52:30   It's not in her pocket.

00:52:33   And then she said,

00:52:36   actually having the bigger screen is nice.

00:52:38   And then she is starting to need reading glasses

00:52:43   and there's the larger mode, display mode on the 6 Plus.

00:52:47   - I forgot that existed.

00:52:48   - Yeah, yeah, well that's because you're--

00:52:50   - It looks crazy.

00:52:52   - That's because you're young.

00:52:53   But I showed it to her and she said,

00:52:56   wouldn't you always have it like this?" I said, "Well, because you can fit more things

00:52:58   on in the other mode." And she says, "No, no, no, no, no. Why would you not have it

00:53:01   like this, where everything's just bigger and easier to see?" And if you're using

00:53:06   standard-sized, non-crazy phones, things that aren't the 6+, you have to just crank up

00:53:12   the text in the text controls, and then everything looks weird. Whereas if you put it in the

00:53:19   the large print mode it's just like an iPhone 5 except huge. So Gray has now

00:53:27   confirmed to me in the chatroom that he is now using the 6 Plus. Yeah. So this is

00:53:32   what I'm starting to see. So he's another Myke was right convert. Yeah. Now my

00:53:38   feeling about this because obviously Marco was being quite positive about it

00:53:43   I believe that before the end of this trip you will feel very differently about

00:53:46   Strong words, strong words.

00:53:49   Federico is on board now, totally as well.

00:53:53   And my feeling is now, people can see the advantages of the device without being completely

00:53:58   shocked by its size because you've had the stepping stone.

00:54:01   Yeah, I've heard the theory.

00:54:03   I've heard the theory.

00:54:04   I'm holding out hope for you still.

00:54:06   Like because you're going to see.

00:54:09   My soul can still be saved, that's what you're saying.

00:54:11   The battery.

00:54:12   because again you've not really seen the advantage of the battery yet either because you've not been

00:54:16   using it enough but when you see just how far it can take you in a day it's a it is an incredible

00:54:23   thing the six plus is I love that device this device more than many other apple devices it's

00:54:31   because it's like I don't I don't use an ipad anymore I don't need one because I can get so

00:54:36   much out of out of this device talking about this actually reading is one thing and I want to mention

00:54:41   something because obviously we're going to be way out of the loop now because of when

00:54:45   we record. That book comes out tomorrow doesn't it? That Steve Jobs book.

00:54:48   Oh yes. Yes indeed.

00:54:49   Have you seen any of it?

00:54:50   Only the excerpts that Fast Company has been running.

00:54:53   An Upgrading, I can't remember their name now because they tweeted at me earlier, they

00:54:56   picked it up in Waterstones in London already or in the UK somewhere because they've just

00:55:01   got them on the shelves in some places. There is going to be an audiobook I'm very excited

00:55:06   about Audible was doing an audiobook. But yeah, Apple is truly ordaining this book now.

00:55:13   Have you seen it? They tweeted about it, they've seen emails.

00:55:17   There have been a few pieces. Steven Levy wrote about it, Brian Chen wrote about it,

00:55:21   that Apple is publicly backing this as the blessed Steve Jobs book as opposed to the

00:55:27   Isaacson book.

00:55:28   Did you see Eddie Q's tweet?

00:55:29   I didn't see Eddie Q's tweet. I remember in the Jonathan Ive profile where he said, you

00:55:35   know my opinion of the Isaacson book couldn't be lower.

00:55:39   Yeah he said Eddy Kooz is a...

00:55:41   Oh is this one where it's like...

00:55:43   Best Portrayer was about to be released becoming Steve Jobs.

00:55:45   Right that was his reaction to seeing a bunch of Apple people walked out of the of the documentary

00:55:51   about Steve Jobs that was at South by Southwest.

00:55:54   Oh right yes.

00:55:56   And said that's not the Steve that we knew but this book is.

00:56:00   So he was pretty upset I guess at the...

00:56:03   I'm excited about it. I am very excited. Yeah, I pre-ordered it. I'll read it on, maybe on

00:56:09   the train up to Scotland. I'll be listening. You'll be listening? I'll be listening. You

00:56:13   won't be listening to me read it. That would be very quiet. You'll be listening to the

00:56:16   book on Audible. That's what you're saying. Are you a fast reader? I bet you are. I am.

00:56:20   So how, when do you think you'll have it done by? It depends on how much other stuff I have

00:56:24   to do. I also have to edit some podcasts and things like that. But I should, between my

00:56:30   flights and everything I should have some time to to rip through it. It's

00:56:33   interesting though that like there is now this book that Apple is saying is

00:56:38   the right one even though the guy it's about like allowed for a book to be

00:56:43   created which is now considered to be bad. Like Apple is basically shunning the

00:56:51   Isaacson. Yeah well I think what this teaches us is that John Siracusa is

00:56:58   always right. The best episode of Hypercritical. And we should listen to him.

00:57:02   Number 42, The Wrong Guy. The Wrong Guy. God, so good.

00:57:07   Like, when I start typing it into my URL bar, I type in 5x5.tv/hy, that episode comes up

00:57:14   as in my history. I keep this episode of Hypercritical always downloaded because it's just a masterpiece.

00:57:24   If you've never heard John Siracusa ripping into the Isaacson book, there is a treat for

00:57:29   you in our show notes which can be found at relay.fm/upgrade/28.

00:57:37   Or in your podcast app that you're using right now.

00:57:40   Your podcast app of choice.

00:57:41   Right, should we maybe approach some Ask Upgrade?

00:57:45   I'm so excited for next week for when you finally decree that Myke was right.

00:57:49   Okay, interesting.

00:57:50   Maybe I'll do that on the show after when you're not on.

00:57:53   Yeah, because I'm going to miss one in a couple of weeks, so maybe that's when you can give

00:57:58   me the blessing that I've always wished for.

00:58:03   Definitely not declare you completely wrong and ban you from the podcast for not joining

00:58:08   the 6+ cult.

00:58:11   Let's see, we should move on to AskUpgrade right before we do.

00:58:18   We are recording this a couple of hours before we're going to be doing our meetup, so maybe

00:58:22   next week one of our topics can be to talk about the Meetup and also the fact of us doing

00:58:28   this podcast in person. I would love to talk next week about the value of seeing people

00:58:34   in person. We'll be at OOL, so we'll be seeing a lot of interesting people, so I think that'll

00:58:37   be a good thing to talk about. And we are definitely looking forward to the Meetup tonight.

00:58:42   That should be a lot of fun.

00:58:43   We're going to be in that frame of mind next week.

00:58:44   Yeah, for sure. But before we do that, I have to tell you Ask Upgrade is brought to you

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01:01:20   So Jason, we can speak simultaneously which we can't do when we're completely laggy

01:01:27   because we always have the round trip.

01:01:29   Just all the latency.

01:01:31   We could sing.

01:01:32   We have a zero, let's not do that.

01:01:34   We have zero latency right now.

01:01:35   - We only sing at Christmas.

01:01:37   Listener Neelesh has asked,

01:01:39   what health apps do we currently use

01:01:41   in conjunction with Apple's health app?

01:01:44   - You know, somebody asked me about the health app

01:01:46   the other week and I had to say I used it,

01:01:49   I checked it out right when iOS 8 came out,

01:01:52   which is when nothing worked with it,

01:01:53   and I haven't gone back to it.

01:01:55   - Exactly the same.

01:01:56   I haven't even filled out my information in it.

01:01:59   - And Federico, you know, he's using it.

01:02:01   - I'm using it and I hear people who say that they like it

01:02:04   and it's good and I just have not gotten back to it.

01:02:07   So I'm using pedometer to view my steps.

01:02:11   - Pedometer plus plus from _DavidSmith.

01:02:13   - From _DavidSmith.

01:02:15   - I love that app.

01:02:16   I have it in my notification center.

01:02:18   I love it when I go over 10,000 and I get the confetti

01:02:21   when you open the app.

01:02:21   - Yay!

01:02:23   - But that is the only app that I use.

01:02:24   I don't even think, I assume it's got health app integration

01:02:27   but I've not tied them together in a way.

01:02:29   - It does.

01:02:30   or at least they're both reading the same data from the same sensors.

01:02:32   Of course. So they'll show it.

01:02:33   So that's the answer is I think I think I need to revisit it.

01:02:37   But it also, I think, shows the power of

01:02:39   of having not necessarily a negative experience,

01:02:44   but having kind of a zero experience with sometimes they bump.

01:02:46   Apple will bundle an app that doesn't have any support yet,

01:02:50   which makes sense. It's a real chicken and egg problem.

01:02:52   They have to have the app there.

01:02:53   But when I first wanted to use it, there wasn't anything there.

01:02:57   and so then I sort of like shrugged and said,

01:02:59   "Oh, this isn't interesting."

01:03:00   - It was for like an hour and then took it all away again.

01:03:03   - Right.

01:03:04   - And it was a really botched launch of the health app.

01:03:06   - So it's too bad, but I do need to revisit it then.

01:03:08   Absolutely.

01:03:09   - I feel like a lot of this sort of stuff

01:03:10   was in advance of the watch,

01:03:12   and I think that the watch will be forcing us

01:03:14   into a way of using it,

01:03:15   because it just does it automatically.

01:03:17   So maybe that's when I'll start checking it out

01:03:19   a little bit more. - Maybe so.

01:03:21   - Listen to Chris, he's wrote in,

01:03:23   "The weirdest thing about the USB Type-C to Chris

01:03:27   is that all the iOS devices come with a standard USB cable.

01:03:31   - Right, now first we'll point out,

01:03:32   this is not a question.

01:03:34   - It's a statement.

01:03:35   - Yes, so #telupgrade.

01:03:37   - Don't, please.

01:03:38   - We don't need another.

01:03:39   But that is, I mean, we've spoken about this.

01:03:40   - Yes.

01:03:41   - It is really interesting that if you have

01:03:44   any Apple devices, they come with cables

01:03:47   that you can't yet use with the iOS devices

01:03:50   and the new MacBook Air.

01:03:52   - I'm a little surprised that the MacBook

01:03:54   doesn't come with an adapter or that Apple doesn't

01:03:58   sell a lightning to USB-C cable, although that probably would be an

01:04:04   adapter in and of itself. But the thing is,

01:04:07   from Apple's perspective when looking at its device, why?

01:04:11   Yeah, right, well that's a fair point. Why would you have them? Why do you need to

01:04:14   connect those two devices? And I think we said this

01:04:16   maybe last week is, you know, Apple's take on this is why would you connect them?

01:04:20   There's no need.

01:04:21   That there are edge cases where you would sync over a wire, but that they've got Wi-Fi

01:04:26   sync and they've got cloud sync, and that's all you need.

01:04:29   Because the idea of this MacBook Air is we're not thinking about edge cases.

01:04:34   Like, it is a non-edge case computer.

01:04:36   The edge cases should use another computer.

01:04:39   It may be that, you know, as we move to USB Type-C everywhere, that at some point they

01:04:45   they will introduce an iPhone that uses USB type C.

01:04:49   - Do you think they will do that?

01:04:51   - Well, maybe not.

01:04:52   I mean, maybe what I'm saying is a lightning

01:04:54   to USB type C connector in the box.

01:04:56   And that will be what's expected

01:04:58   and you'll need to convert it to go the other way.

01:05:00   But there's such an installed base

01:05:02   with the existing USB ports that it's very weird.

01:05:05   It's a very weird situation.

01:05:06   And I don't think they're gonna ship with two

01:05:08   in the box, right?

01:05:09   - You'll just have to buy one of the adapters.

01:05:11   And this leads on to listener Ben

01:05:14   is talking about what we were just alluding to, maybe putting USB-C connectors onto the

01:05:20   iOS devices. Now, I don't see that ever happening.

01:05:23   No, I mean, from what I can see, Lightning is designed specifically to be different from

01:05:30   what USB-C does, and it's a subset, it's simplification, and that's good for Apple's iOS devices, but

01:05:37   that also means that putting Lightning on a laptop doesn't make sense, and it means,

01:05:41   I think putting USB-C on an iPhone doesn't necessarily make sense.

01:05:45   Now I could see a scenario where they built in maybe some smart technology so that you

01:05:52   could use a lightning to USB-C plug or a lightning to USB plug and they wouldn't need any extra

01:05:59   intelligence in the plug that the phone or the iOS device would have that intelligence

01:06:04   and be able to sense what kind of a device is connected.

01:06:09   I could see something like that happening but I have a hard time thinking that they

01:06:14   would just switch over.

01:06:15   I think that's going to be a while.

01:06:18   Yergin, will you be able to pair for instance business and personal iPhones with your Apple

01:06:24   Watch?

01:06:25   Your night phone and your day phone.

01:06:26   Yeah, your night phone and day phone.

01:06:27   Or as far as we're aware, is it just one at a time?

01:06:31   As far as I can tell it's a one to one relationship.

01:06:35   You would just choose I guess.

01:06:36   just go into the Apple Watch app and just pair it with... You'd have to do it manually

01:06:40   I would assume because that's way too confusing I think. Yeah. Because how would it know what...

01:06:45   Like if all the devices are in the same house, funnelling all of the communication to the

01:06:51   watch I don't think would make sense. No. You'd have to go in and change it. Yeah. It

01:06:54   would be like unpair from one, unpair from the other. I would think. I would think. And

01:06:57   then another Apple Watch question from Gary. Will the Apple Watch have a do not disturb

01:07:02   mode so it doesn't turn on if you check it in the movie theater.

01:07:06   Now I don't have an answer for this but I think it's a great question. I would imagine

01:07:11   it would but I don't know. I think having Do Not Disturb on the watch makes sense and

01:07:16   then the movie theater is fascinating and somebody else, actually listener Clive, asked

01:07:22   can you turn off the auto display on the Apple Watch and change it to tap to display because

01:07:26   he's a truck driver. And I would think that you would need a Do Not Disturb mode and you

01:07:31   would also need the ability to turn off motion-based screen activation because if you're in the

01:07:39   movie theater and you move your hand, your wrist is going to light up and is that light

01:07:42   not going to disturb the people around you?

01:07:45   I know there is a Do Not Disturb mode because I've seen it.

01:07:49   Because I've seen it somewhere on Apple's website where it also says you can set the

01:07:53   watch to Do Not Disturb or you can set them both to Do Not Disturb and I think it's the

01:07:57   same for Airplane mode.

01:07:58   So you could do that on the watch device.

01:08:00   I think you could do it in the companion app.

01:08:03   But the idea of tapping to get the time is interesting

01:08:07   'cause it would also save you on battery life, I think.

01:08:09   I think people would want to make that decision.

01:08:13   - Right, right.

01:08:14   And I can see Apple saying,

01:08:15   "There are valid reasons why you would want to do this."

01:08:18   So we'll take the hit of the extra complication

01:08:20   of having that as a setting.

01:08:23   - Yeah, I'm interested to see what that's gonna look like.

01:08:26   There is all these little things

01:08:28   And this is why my mind keeps going back

01:08:31   to the iPhone introduction,

01:08:33   where we have all these questions

01:08:34   which are so simple from a fundamental level.

01:08:36   - But if you don't know, you don't know.

01:08:37   - But we don't know the answers.

01:08:38   And because I remember--

01:08:40   - Half the questions Dan and I got

01:08:42   for our iPhone FAQ story, we don't have answers to.

01:08:46   We have a little triage space in the document

01:08:48   where it's like, can we answer this question?

01:08:50   No, no, no, no, no.

01:08:51   We just don't know.

01:08:52   - I could take an educated guess, but I don't know.

01:08:55   Like I remember pouring through the information

01:08:59   about the iPhone to see if when you put it in silent

01:09:02   it had vibration, 'cause it didn't clear,

01:09:05   this is the original iPhone, it didn't clearly say

01:09:08   that it turned on a vibrate motor when it was in silent.

01:09:10   - Right.

01:09:11   - And I needed to know if it did that,

01:09:12   and it seems so basic now, but I couldn't find an answer.

01:09:16   - Right.

01:09:17   - So I had to wait. - You had to wait.

01:09:17   - So there's all these little things,

01:09:18   because they're so basic that Apple's not gonna talk

01:09:21   about them on stage, they're not gonna put them

01:09:22   all in the press, like on all the press stuff,

01:09:24   'cause it's so simple.

01:09:25   - This is why I end up posting,

01:09:27   when I get one of these products in advance

01:09:29   and go out from under the embargo,

01:09:31   the first thing I do is say,

01:09:32   "Okay, does anybody have any questions?" on Twitter.

01:09:35   Because then I-- - You get

01:09:36   the really interesting stuff.

01:09:37   - And then I can answer them.

01:09:39   Because I actually have the product and can answer it.

01:09:42   But at this point, I don't have the product,

01:09:43   and if I did, I couldn't answer them.

01:09:45   - That's one of my favorite things

01:09:46   when the embargoes lift on these products.

01:09:48   And you see people like yourself and John Gruber saying,

01:09:51   "What are your questions?"

01:09:52   'cause you find out these tiny little tidbits of information

01:09:56   which are really, really interesting.

01:09:58   - But Apple is never gonna talk about them, 'cause why?

01:10:00   - No, 'cause why would you?

01:10:01   Because the amount of information

01:10:02   that they would then need to give is way too much

01:10:05   that you wouldn't be able to comb for real.

01:10:07   So I'm really interested to see, I mean,

01:10:09   it's gotta be a couple of weeks until the embargo list.

01:10:16   When do you think it will be, pre-order time?

01:10:18   Or after?

01:10:18   - That would be my guess would be pre-order time.

01:10:20   - So the April 10th.

01:10:21   So maybe it lists a couple days before, 8th or 9th?

01:10:24   Yeah, I don't know. Maybe.

01:10:25   I personally haven't heard of, and I don't know if you do, and I don't want to ask,

01:10:29   of anybody that has got a device or has been offered one.

01:10:33   I know there were some briefings after the event, although it didn't seem like there were very many.

01:10:38   And that was so unlike most of these events, which it's two weeks before the release date.

01:10:42   This was more than a month before the release date.

01:10:46   So, did Apple really give a small group of people?

01:10:50   Apple watches under a month-long embargo? Maybe.

01:10:54   They did it with a phone? The original phone? I mean it's only a very small select group,

01:10:58   but they had it for a time and it was just then.

01:11:00   Yeah, but this is a long amount of time. It's possible that they have, but I actually can say

01:11:06   I don't know anybody for sure who's got one. It wouldn't make sense to me to give people

01:11:10   in a longer period because this is something you have to integrate into your life.

01:11:13   I think you do need to live with it. I think it would be smart if they did give a select group.

01:11:19   Also it'll be an interesting, people were talking about this on Twitter, it'll be an interesting

01:11:22   selection of people who get it because I imagine it will be a very different selection from what

01:11:28   we're used to. It's a swath of different industries. Right, there'll be fashion and fitness and

01:11:33   they'll be watchmaking. Yeah, there'll be lots of different ones. I think that'll be great.

01:11:37   This comes from listener Angus. The space black stainless steel watch is only available with a

01:11:43   the black link bracelet, unlike the regular steel.

01:11:45   Why do you think this is?

01:11:47   - Exclusivity.

01:11:49   - It's fashion, it's fashion, Angus, this is what it is.

01:11:51   - Yeah, and also under fashion, what did we say?

01:11:56   Because fashion?

01:11:58   - Because fashion.

01:11:59   I think that I look at that black stainless steel watch

01:12:03   as the addition of the lower models.

01:12:07   So it is more expensive, you can only buy it

01:12:09   in that configuration, it seems like.

01:12:11   So it feels to me like the, I want to be special

01:12:14   but I don't have $17,000.

01:12:17   So I look at that watch like that.

01:12:19   It's the high-end version.

01:12:22   So you can only buy it in that way.

01:12:24   That's how I see that one.

01:12:26   Whether it is that way or not, I don't know.

01:12:28   But there's so much, 'cause I've been talking

01:12:31   to lots of people on Twitter.

01:12:32   I've had people say to me, if I had conversations

01:12:34   with the Apple reps in the interactive chat

01:12:37   who have said you'll be able to completely customize it

01:12:39   check out and get whatever strap you want, we don't know.

01:12:42   No.

01:12:43   Flat out, we don't know.

01:12:44   We are effectively, we have more information than we did before the event about what bands

01:12:48   are available, but until April 10th, we actually don't really know what you're going to be

01:12:52   able to buy.

01:12:53   And they may be able to, they may even change it up, right?

01:12:57   We don't know.

01:12:58   I think there was an argument about either the Space Black being too hard to make or

01:13:06   or too expensive to make and so they limited it.

01:13:10   Or because fashion, they felt like the only one that it really looked good with was matched

01:13:16   with a black.

01:13:17   It's almost like somebody made the argument like, "Well, you should only make this watch

01:13:22   if you can pair it with a band of the same material.

01:13:25   And if you can do that, we could sell that."

01:13:27   And so there's some reason why they feel like these are harmonious together in a way that

01:13:31   other others aren't and that's just what we have to do.

01:13:34   It's like the edition bands.

01:13:36   You only get the edition bands with the edition.

01:13:38   It doesn't look like you can buy the gold ones, just if you want to.

01:13:44   We'll see.

01:13:45   Now we're in a list.

01:13:47   Fred says, "We need a cheese and wine vertical."

01:13:50   We can definitely look into that.

01:13:53   We're going to the meet up, so that could be.

01:13:55   I'm not a big wine fan, although I like red wine occasionally.

01:14:00   me a Zinfandel or a Cabernet Sauvignon or something like that, but I prefer beer to

01:14:06   wine. I prefer beer and wine to mixed drinks though, so I'm really a lightweight is what

01:14:12   I'm saying.

01:14:13   >> He's just a simple man.

01:14:14   >> But yeah, exactly. But listener John does have an ask upgrade for the cheese and wine

01:14:19   vertical.

01:14:20   >> Yes, so we have from John, you are a do it yourself kind of guy, Jason, you like beer.

01:14:26   Have you ever made your own beer? Have you ever done a home brewery type thing?

01:14:30   So one of my former co-workers actually was a home brewer and he brought in his beer for

01:14:35   everybody and it was pretty good.

01:14:37   My stock answer to this is to say this is -- I do like beer.

01:14:43   I like beer so much that I'm not going to make beer.

01:14:46   I feel like --

01:14:47   Don't ruin beer, Jason.

01:14:48   I feel like the amount -- unlike some things where I would be taking fresh ingredients

01:14:52   and making pickles or jam or something like that, with this, I feel like I'm going to

01:15:00   have to invest in a lot of different funny ingredients to make something that probably

01:15:05   is never going to satisfy me at the same level as something that is made by one of the high-quality

01:15:11   craft brewers that I can buy beer from. And if I was living in a world where the only

01:15:17   beer I could buy was mass-produced stuff and not in a style I liked, I would make it myself.

01:15:22   But I feel like there are so many beers that I can get very easily that I really do like

01:15:27   But I am not going to start making beer in my bathtub.

01:15:32   I can't.

01:15:34   And I don't have the time for it anyway.

01:15:36   It's much easier for me to bake something one weekend than it is to brew beer.

01:15:39   I don't have the space for it.

01:15:41   I don't have the time for it.

01:15:42   And quite frankly, I think in the end, it wouldn't really make me that happy because

01:15:47   I don't think it would be appreciably better and probably would be appreciably worse than

01:15:51   what I can buy because I can buy good stuff.

01:15:53   I'm not limited to just the bad stuff.

01:15:56   Yeah, I mean I see that kind of thing where it's like I already like things in the world

01:16:01   that people are making professionally and there's nothing that I need.

01:16:07   Like I don't think, "Oh, I like this beer but only if it did this to the point where

01:16:12   I then feel like I need to go ahead and make it."

01:16:15   So I'm on board with you with that one.

01:16:17   Plus I also have like a distinct fear that I would poison myself in some way.

01:16:23   So I try and steer clear of that kind of thing.

01:16:26   So Jason, I think we've come to the end of our Ask Upgrade this week, which probably

01:16:29   brings us to the end of our first live and in-person episode of Upgrade.

01:16:33   It's good, we should do one again next week.

01:16:34   Well that's a really good idea, why don't we do that?

01:16:37   Why don't we do it from a completely different country?

01:16:39   Okay, that's a great idea.

01:16:40   Well I already did that for this one, but we can do it again.

01:16:44   There was actually one other Ask Upgrade and I think I just pasted in the wrong one.

01:16:49   It was, somebody else asked me to talk about my favorite beers.

01:16:54   So I will very quickly say I like Stouts and Porters.

01:16:57   People always think that means Guinness.

01:16:59   Guinness is perfectly okay, although I kind of refer to it as the Budweiser of Stouts.

01:17:04   It's available everywhere and it's, well, it's better than Budweiser.

01:17:07   It's fine.

01:17:08   Maybe we can have some this weekend.

01:17:10   But there are other dark beers that I prefer to that.

01:17:14   And my favorite right now, my favorite beers back home would be, I like the Anchor Porter,

01:17:22   I like the Stone Milk Stout.

01:17:27   Those are probably my favorites.

01:17:28   Sierra Nevada Porter used to be one of my favorites and the Blackbeard Porter is also

01:17:32   really good.

01:17:33   I like the English style Porters a little bit more than the Stouts and I guess that

01:17:37   puts me in England over Ireland.

01:17:39   And next week ask me and I'll say the Guinness is the best.

01:17:42   Let's hope that the border guards haven't heard that because they will not let you in.

01:17:47   Thank you so much for listening to this episode.

01:17:50   I hope that it has been as much fun for you as it has been for us.

01:17:53   It's a very interesting experience and I appreciate everybody who has listened live as well.

01:17:58   So thank you for tuning in.

01:17:59   We will be live again hopefully.

01:18:00   Hopefully.

01:18:01   Hopefully next week.

01:18:02   Internet connections willing in Ireland.

01:18:03   Yeah, equipment willing.

01:18:04   We'll talk about that.

01:18:05   Yeah.

01:18:06   So look out for that.

01:18:08   We'll be tweeting.

01:18:09   Me and Jason will do it individually.

01:18:10   J.J. Jase is @JSnL, J-S-N-E-L-L, and I am @imike, I-M-Y-K-E. But also, we have a sentient

01:18:18   show Twitter account, which is @_upgradefm, which decides to do whatever it does, whenever

01:18:25   it chooses to do it. And it's a lot of fun, that Twitter account. I don't know how it

01:18:30   tweets, but it does tweet. I think it just tweeted now. I'm not sure. We'll have to find

01:18:37   We'll have to find out and I want to thank our sponsors for this week our friends over at mail route hover and Harry's

01:18:43   But most of all thank you for listening

01:18:45   Don't forget Jason writes over at the fantastic six colors calm which has a you in it this week, which is incredible

01:18:52   Yes, I'm very happy to see

01:18:54   That we have changed to to the correct. Well while I'm here we have to spell it with you

01:19:01   It's the right thing to do and thank you all for listening and we'll be back next time

01:19:06   Goodbye, Myke Hurley. Shake hands again.

01:19:08   Yay! We did it!

01:19:10   [Music]