338: KanBanBanSubHub


00:00:00   (upbeat music)

00:00:02   Hello and welcome to Connected, episode 338.

00:00:13   It is made possible by our sponsors,

00:00:16   Pingdom, ExpressVPN, and Delete.me.

00:00:19   My name is Stephen Hackett and it is an even episode,

00:00:22   so I get to introduce my friend Federico Vatici first.

00:00:26   - Hello, hi, how are you?

00:00:27   - I'm good, how are you?

00:00:29   I'm fine. Well, I'm upset about something, but I'm also fine at the same time.

00:00:33   You can be both upset and fine if you, you know, if you try and, you know,

00:00:38   people can separate feelings.

00:00:39   Interesting. Maybe if you weren't upset, you'd be good,

00:00:42   but because you're upset, you're fine.

00:00:44   Then I'm upset and good. Like I can, you know,

00:00:47   put the upset feeling in a little drawer and then when I think about it,

00:00:51   I get upset, but otherwise I'm good.

00:00:53   Oh, I'm going to take the upset feeling and put it in a drawer.

00:00:56   I'm gonna push it deep deep down in the drawer lock the drawer and I'll be fine

00:01:00   Myke how are you? I'm I'm both good and fine

00:01:12   Perfect. So no problems here got your emotion and jars on a shelf you go pick one up

00:01:17   Examine it. Mm-hmm. Put it back. We should start the show with follow-up and not feelings

00:01:23   Although this follow-up item is about feelings. Okay. I've been running the iOS 14.5 beta

00:01:29   I don't remember why I put the beta on because I haven't put the beta on the Apple watch

00:01:36   which I don't wear to unlock it with a

00:01:39   Face-mask thing so I don't I don't I just realized I got I'm not sure why I'm running the beta anyways

00:01:44   I have the beta on my phone, and I've got I listen to Apple music

00:01:48   I've got an Apple music account, but I have Spotify installed and

00:01:51   I've gotten just really exhausted of

00:01:54   Siri via CarPlay asking me

00:01:58   What music service would you like to play that album on?

00:02:01   And so I why do you don't you like your assistant to be intelligent?

00:02:06   I would like my assistant to have a setting and I could just pick and so I have uninstalled Spotify for my phone

00:02:12   To keep it from asking me

00:02:14   This reminded me. I think it stopped or maybe after like five years mine has finally learned

00:02:20   but HomePod Siri has this deal like hey, you know, tell me the news and

00:02:25   This is the news from I just said to NPR

00:02:29   I said if you want I can also play news from Fox or whoever else

00:02:34   It's like I don't need you to tell me every single time that I can change the news source

00:02:39   Like if you just had a setting like the Amazon voice assistant does I could just say when I ask for the news

00:02:45   Pull it from this source. I don't want to hear about these other ones

00:02:48   it's just I don't know why Apple all of a sudden is allergic to having this as a setting and

00:02:52   So anyways, I did what Apple wanted. I rage uninstalled Spotify. So you win

00:02:58   That is what they wanted

00:03:01   You're playing the game now. Yes

00:03:03   well, I

00:03:05   Can we talked about this a few episodes ago?

00:03:08   I can I continue to confirm and I wrote this in the in my story that will be out

00:03:13   I'm working on the story like a it's not a review but it's like a this sort of

00:03:18   an overview about 14.5, which I usually don't do because I'm usually exhausted after my

00:03:25   annual reviews. But this update felt like I really wanted to write about it. And so

00:03:30   I'm writing about it.

00:03:31   It's been a while too, though.

00:03:33   It's been a while. And so I can kind of, you know, get a little like writing exercise done.

00:03:37   It's fine. It's good for me. And I've read in the story, like, I can confirm that it's

00:03:42   been over two months that I've been using 14.5, I didn't see any further prompts to

00:03:51   pick a different music service. And I've tried a bunch of things. I've also tried the method

00:03:56   suggested in the "clarification" that Apple sent to TechCrunch, like, hey, when you ask

00:04:02   for playing a playlist or a radio station to a different app, and you specify, like,

00:04:08   Pandora or in Spotify, Siri may prompt you again. But nope, I don't get those prompts.

00:04:16   Like I chose Spotify months ago and it's stuck with that. So I don't know, man. Maybe only

00:04:24   CarPlay Siri is the intelligent one and the one on the phone is like a small brain. CarPlay

00:04:29   Siri is big brain, you know, having all those prompts.

00:04:32   Maybe it's actually the opposite and like they just haven't properly got this set and

00:04:37   running for the CarPlay version. Is that even possible? I don't know.

00:04:44   It's impossible to tell, right? Because obviously there's no page in Settings.

00:04:48   It's like everything is invisible here. And it's so strange how the whole

00:04:55   thing is... Like, I get it. The idea of a default... Again, we talked about this

00:05:02   a while back, the idea of a default for audio is essentially different from browsers and

00:05:10   email clients. If anything, because browsers and email clients, they have a consistent

00:05:17   URL scheme that you can use to launch them. It's HTTP for browsers and Mailto for emails.

00:05:25   There's no such thing as a URL scheme for audio. There's no unified linking system for

00:05:31   podcasts, right? So obviously the idea of what's a default, it mostly involves Siri.

00:05:39   So I get it, why you're asking Siri, "Hey, I want to listen to music via Spotify." Like,

00:05:44   makes sense. But it's the whole idea of that request is invisible. It only exists within

00:05:53   the memory of Siri. There's no proof of it in settings. And the whole thing is weird.

00:06:00   I still... like I understand... I can read Apple's glorification.

00:06:05   I can even understand it to an extent. I still disagree with it. I still think it doesn't make a lot of sense.

00:06:12   In your article, you linked to something about what Spotify are doing.

00:06:17   And I just wanted to just make reference to it here, that you seem to be very happy using Spotify for your podcast listening.

00:06:25   It's one of those things that you can admit that you're liking, but also you can feel

00:06:30   bad about it at the same time instead of like eating too much chocolate. Yes. So I, I, I'm

00:06:38   liking it. Like I was just listening to you and Grey Myke and catching up on cortex and

00:06:43   it's like this morning I was finally listening to the new Obama and Bruce Springsteen Spotify

00:06:51   original show. It's actually really nice. It's a couple of days. Just chillin. Yeah.

00:07:00   I mean, it's Barack Obama and Bruce Springsteen. I mean, it's actually talk about serious stuff

00:07:05   too. I don't know. I like it. I like the idea of you open the Spotify app and in the single

00:07:12   home page you have both kinds of audio. Now I get it. This is either something that you

00:07:17   love or something that you hate. Yesterday on Twitter, I got a lot of people saying this

00:07:23   is exactly why I switched from Spotify to Apple Music, because I was tired of Spotify

00:07:31   pushing too aggressively these podcasts that I don't really want on the homepage, because

00:07:36   all I want is music. And I totally get it. I totally understand. On the other hand, I

00:07:40   also got replies from people saying something along the lines of, "That is my favorite thing

00:07:46   about Spotify having access to both kinds of audio so that no matter like when I know

00:07:51   that I want to listen to something I can choose from the same app or even I can have a queue

00:07:58   of audio that mixes and matches both music and podcasts so that if I want to go out for

00:08:04   a walk or out for a run I can have like 10 minutes of a short podcast and then some music

00:08:09   and then another interview. So I think it's something that you either like or fundamentally

00:08:14   dislike. I'm liking it so far. And I know there's always those people that ask me, "How

00:08:20   can you live without chapter markers?" And you know, all those, like, I totally understand.

00:08:27   A lot of people are really serious about their podcast listening habits. They want to have

00:08:30   all kinds of controls. Me personally, I never use chapters. And all I do is I hit play.

00:08:38   And if my girlfriend is talking to me, I press pause. I don't skip around. I don't use

00:08:44   chapters I don't open show notes like I just listen to the audio and it's fine

00:08:51   people could do as they please but just like for me personally I just

00:08:55   diametrically opposed to the idea of thinking I want to listen to audio right

00:09:01   like oh I would like audio let me open my audio app and then what kind of audio

00:09:05   would I like would I like music or podcasts like my brain doesn't think

00:09:08   that way okay you know I just I think like I want to listen to a podcast so I

00:09:12   open my podcast app, you know what I mean? And I'm not saying one is right or one is

00:09:16   wrong. This is just a preference thing. But it's like, as you mentioned, like, you know,

00:09:20   I, you know, I open up Spotify and I choose what I like to listen to. I'm never in that.

00:09:24   Like it's, I either want music or I want a podcast. Like I, I would never choose one

00:09:30   or the other because I was prompted. Like I always know what I want before I start the

00:09:36   process.

00:09:37   All right. And I guess that's really what we're, what we're different maybe because

00:09:40   So I, like, there's many times during the day, like when I'm washing the dishes, for

00:09:46   example, and I'm like, I want to have something in the background because I'm not interested

00:09:50   in what's on TV, for example.

00:09:52   And I'm like, I just want to have some stuff going on.

00:09:56   And then I open Spotify, and I guess what I like is, because of the recommendations,

00:10:01   I don't have to make a decision.

00:10:03   And I think the older I get, the more I appreciate stuff that removes decisions from my life.

00:10:10   having to make decisions all the time. And so it's like I open it and it's like,

00:10:14   "Hey dude, here's a podcast, here's a music you could like." And I appreciate that.

00:10:19   That it's like, "Oh, you're making it easy for me to play something." So, but I

00:10:25   totally understand why a lot of people don't like it. I also feel like, podcast

00:10:31   aside, what Spotify is doing on the homepage is a lot more interesting than

00:10:37   what Apple is doing in the "Listen Now" tab. What they're doing with the... they have

00:10:43   this update coming out this month. They're adding new sections to the home

00:10:47   page. They're adding three months of your recent listening activity. They have

00:10:55   sections for playlists made for you. They can push new releases from your favorite

00:11:02   artists to the top of the page. Like, it's a lot more dynamic, it's a lot more

00:11:06   personalized than what Apple is doing with the ListenNow page, and as I wrote

00:11:11   in my iOS 14 review last year, I'm not a fan of how they changed

00:11:19   the ListenNow page in iOS 14. I think it's a regression from what it used to

00:11:23   be, and it's also the speed of it, like the performance of it. The Spotify

00:11:32   app is really fast, both when you open different sections and when you search, and Apple Music

00:11:37   is... you get that two-second delay when you first open ListenNow or when you search for

00:11:44   stuff, and once you try Spotify you can really see the difference. On the other hand, real-time

00:11:51   lyrics, man, those are super nice in Apple Music, and they're gonna get even better in

00:11:55   14.5. So I'm still very much in the face of liking Spotify more and more. There's a few

00:12:03   things from Apple Music that I really, really do miss. But I don't know, I think this is

00:12:09   good for me. The whole "let's try Spotify out for a year and see what happens". I recommend

00:12:15   it as an experiment if you're curious about what's going on on the other side. It's really

00:12:21   eye-opening. I could get on board maybe for music but there's just stuff that

00:12:26   they don't support for podcasts that I'm just never gonna be able to reconcile

00:12:31   like I want show notes okay right you know and like you don't know everyone

00:12:36   has to want them I do and they just don't support that you know this stuff

00:12:41   like I wish they would support chapters and chapter images but I can get on

00:12:45   board with them not having that you know like whatever like I would like that but

00:12:49   to me show notes is like super important I like it I like having links the types

00:12:53   of podcasts that I listen to typically have very good show notes so I just I

00:12:57   want that and they just don't have any of that stuff and frankly I don't

00:13:01   understand why like I don't know why they're not supporting any of this stuff

00:13:05   but they're just not. Apple has killed some more computers off they keep to

00:13:11   keep doing this last week some of the 21 and a half inch iMacs they're also for

00:13:19   sale but the options are more limited you can now only get them with a 256 SSD

00:13:24   or one terabyte fusion drive the other options are all gone so simplifying that

00:13:29   lineup it's a not a good time to buy one of those iMacs don't don't buy one of

00:13:35   them and the iMac Pro is completely yeah they that went way faster than I thought

00:13:40   it would it was for sale while supplies last and I guess they had like six of

00:13:44   them in a warehouse and that was it. Someone bought more. Mm-hmm. How fast

00:13:49   that happened it kind of feels pointless to even take that intermediate

00:13:53   step now like in hindsight like you should just got just gone right just

00:13:58   like straight out forget about it because it was like six days from while

00:14:04   supplies last to we don't this is if this product never existed like there

00:14:08   isn't even a product page for it on the website anymore so I think it may as

00:14:11   I've just gone straight to step B, but yeah, yeah, maybe they just wanted to give you know, those people one last shot

00:14:17   Very strange much chance. Did you to make your decision if you wanted to buy it?

00:14:22   Maybe you just want like a cool gray Intel computer. Okay

00:14:27   IOS 14.5 continues to be in beta

00:14:31   developers got beta 5

00:14:34   What was it earlier this week? It was yesterday. Yes yesterday and

00:14:39   There are some secrets in this beta

00:14:42   according to Mac rumors Beta 5 has reference to an

00:14:48   a14x chip

00:14:50   Which we have not seen

00:14:52   and that is believed to go into a

00:14:55   Next generation iPad Pro which seems like should be out any time now. I

00:15:01   Mean at this point it seems like 14.5 is just waiting on

00:15:07   New hardware and then it'll it'll come out although we're gonna talk in a minute about some other things they've done in that beta

00:15:12   But it sure seems like there's a lot of evidence pointing to this new iPad being being here pretty soon. I hope so

00:15:20   This beta also changed some of the language around the Apple TV remote

00:15:26   So it removes reference of the seer remote replacing it with Apple TV remote

00:15:32   I guess someone did like a find and replace across the project

00:15:35   It also changes the home button name to the TV button.

00:15:40   So the Apple TV remote has menu and the next to it,

00:15:47   it looks like a TV.

00:15:48   And for a while that would take you home

00:15:51   and you can make it go to your TV app

00:15:54   back when Apple thought that's what everybody wanted to do.

00:15:57   And they've renamed that from the home button

00:15:59   to the TV button in tvOS 14.5.

00:16:04   So some tweaks to those names.

00:16:05   I don't know if this actually means anything,

00:16:07   but it's interesting.

00:16:09   - It should mean that they're getting rid

00:16:11   of that stupid device.

00:16:12   It's honestly like the worst accessory

00:16:14   that Apple ever designed.

00:16:16   Silvia found out two days ago, two days ago.

00:16:20   So the Apple TV, so this current version of the Apple TV

00:16:23   with the Siri remote and everything,

00:16:25   how long has it existed?

00:16:26   2014?

00:16:31   When did the first version of the Apple TV

00:16:33   to your remote come out? Let me look. You should know about this stuff. I want to say 2013, 2014 maybe.

00:16:39   It was in 2015. Okay, so 2015. So for almost six years, Sylvia and I, we have watched TV with the

00:16:49   Apple TV. She just found out two days ago that you can swipe on the remote. It supports touch controls.

00:16:57   So was she tapping? I don't know what she was doing. How was she moving around? Well, you can tap on the

00:17:03   edges. Here's the thing. I am pretty sure that she tried to use it a while back, one

00:17:08   of those times when I was at WWDC, and she couldn't get it to work. And I believe that

00:17:14   she kept using the Apple TV in two ways, either from the iPhone with the virtual remote, or

00:17:21   with our regular TV remote, because a regular TV remote, it can also control the Apple TV

00:17:27   UI. And so, and I was like, don't you know how to use an Apple TV remote? And I was like,

00:17:32   You gotta swipe and control via touch."

00:17:35   And she was looking at it, like, "Where am I supposed to touch this?

00:17:39   Don't you see the touchpad?"

00:17:40   It's like a solid 30 seconds of just trying to figure out how the Siri remote worked.

00:17:46   And like, she's not wrong.

00:17:48   Like I get it.

00:17:49   It's a stupid remote.

00:17:51   It's not intuitive at all.

00:17:52   It's bad.

00:17:55   If there were trophies for things you hate the most in the world, I would give number

00:18:01   one price to the Siri remote. Like, it's honestly an object that I fundamentally hate. And,

00:18:08   I mean, I threw one in the trash and I sent you guys video proof of it.

00:18:12   Oh yeah, I remember when you did that.

00:18:15   Honestly, whoever designed the Siri remote should feel bad about the stress and anxiety

00:18:20   they caused in people trying to understand that remote. And, like, I forgive you, but

00:18:26   you should still feel bad about that design.

00:18:28   macOS Big Sur has a corresponding beta 11.3 beta 5 is out as well.

00:18:35   It also contains strings for new hardware iMac 21 comma 1 and 21 comma 2.

00:18:43   So these are models that are not out.

00:18:46   Assumably these would be Apple Silicon iMacs.

00:18:50   I can't imagine there's going to be a new Intel iMac ever again.

00:18:53   And so you know with the iMac Pro and now the low-end iMac either being dropped or sort

00:18:58   of trimmed down. Maybe this is close as well. I really hope we don't have to wait to WVDC.

00:19:05   We may have to, but new Macs are coming too, guys.

00:19:07   Are you guys going to buy this new Apple Silicon iMacs?

00:19:11   Probably not.

00:19:12   Okay. Just to get an idea of what computers are you both waiting for?

00:19:17   I want a replacement for my iMac Pro.

00:19:20   Okay.

00:19:21   Which is probably not going to be the first iMac. Because I would expect, and let's say

00:19:28   surprise us, I expect the first iMacs will have M1 chips in them and then there will

00:19:35   be a second generation chip which will power the MacBook Pro and possibly a more powerful

00:19:41   iMac. That's what I'm waiting for. Or, depending on when they release that, if there's any

00:19:46   more rumblings of this tiny Mac Pro, I'm also intrigued about that. So, I haven't... basically

00:19:53   I want something, I do want something to replace my iMac Pro.

00:19:57   That is Apple Silicon, obviously.

00:20:00   And I'm just, I haven't made my mind up yet about what route I would prefer to go down.

00:20:04   If they showed them to me at the same time, even without seeing them, I would probably

00:20:08   want to get the little small Mac Pro.

00:20:11   But we'll have to wait and see on that.

00:20:13   But the first round of iMacs, I can't imagine that that's something that I would want to

00:20:20   replace this machine.

00:20:21   Even though I'm sure it'll be great and I'll be lusting after it if it has a new, fantastic

00:20:25   design, it will be probably giving me in some areas, if it's anything close to the M1 in

00:20:32   the iMac Pro, similar performance in a lot of areas to what my iMac Pro can do, which

00:20:39   is fantastic, obviously, for those machines, but doesn't make it a compelling upgrade for

00:20:44   me.

00:20:45   Yeah, I don't have a place for an iMac, really, in my life.

00:20:48   For a while Mary used one, but she's got the M1 MacBook Air and she likes having a notebook

00:20:54   and then when she's at her desk, she uses it in clamshell mode with the LG 4k ultra

00:20:59   fine.

00:21:00   And so she's set.

00:21:02   I don't need it.

00:21:03   I definitely gonna see what Apple silicon Mac Pro looks like and go from there.

00:21:10   I mean, I'm happy with my Intel one, I'm going to continue to run it for a long time.

00:21:14   But when it is time to replace it, if there is an Apple Silicon Mac Pro that I can put

00:21:19   drives in and put cards in, then I would do that.

00:21:22   If the Mac Pro isn't that, if it's not expandable in some way, then I could see myself going

00:21:27   back to an iMac.

00:21:28   But I really enjoy having a bunch of storage and a bunch of other stuff inside my computer.

00:21:35   And so I want to see what that story is before I would make any decisions.

00:21:39   Federico, are you still using the studio dock with the iPad?

00:21:42   Yes, I'm very much liking it. It's still... that's how I worked all week, that's how I've been writing all week.

00:21:49   I continue to believe that I want to free up more space on my desk.

00:21:56   Right now I've just been putting the Mac Mini Magic Keyboard and the Mac Mini Magic Trackpad in a drawer when the Mac Mini is turned off.

00:22:05   But I also... I kind of want to also put the Mac Mini itself under the desk,

00:22:12   try to figure out a better space optimization for it.

00:22:15   I know that there's people who have been using VESA mounts and different strategies.

00:22:20   Just a bunch of Velcro, man.

00:22:22   I mean, it's got to be a lot of Velcro, man.

00:22:26   Yeah, strong Velcro. Have you ever heard of Command Strips?

00:22:29   They're really strong Velcro, basically.

00:22:31   You should just throw a bunch of those on the top of it, stick it under the desk,

00:22:35   or stick it to the back of the monitor, you know, go wild.

00:22:38   I don't know, maybe.

00:22:39   I want to think of ways to free up more space on my desk, but also like, I don't know, we're

00:22:43   going to move eventually, so maybe I shouldn't do too many modifications to my existing setup.

00:22:48   I don't know, we'll see.

00:22:50   Right now, I have a complaint to share with the com- I have a complaint with the company.

00:22:56   So I want to complain to the company named Satechi that because they made a really attractive

00:23:03   Bluetooth keyboard and I want to give them my money but that keyboard is sold

00:23:08   out everywhere so they have this keyboard that 9to5Mac recently reviewed

00:23:13   I also got some comments from Maxories readers who were able to get one

00:23:17   it's called the Satechi Slim X1 it looks like a magic keyboard it looks like a

00:23:22   compact magic keyboard but it's space grey and it supports multi-device

00:23:28   pairing which is all I want like for the longest time all I wanted was a compact

00:23:33   Magic keyboard, not the extended one that, you know, Apple sells with the NumericPad.

00:23:42   It's the only one available in Space Gray. I want a Compact Magic keyboard that is Space

00:23:47   Gray and supports multi-device pairing. And the SLEEMAX one does all that, and it's also

00:23:54   backlit. So, I really want that keyboard, but it's sold out everywhere. I also tried,

00:24:01   on the Satechi website, on Amazon.com, Amazon Italy, Amazon UK, and Amazon Germany. Because

00:24:06   sometimes when I try and be very clever about "Oh, something is not available on Amazon

00:24:13   Italy, I guess the Germans have it." But no, it's not even on Amazon Germany. So I'm really

00:24:19   upset. I mean, I'm joking, but I'm annoyed that this compa- I mean, congrats to them

00:24:23   for selling out this keyboard, but I also want to give them my money, and currently

00:24:30   my money has not left my credit card because it's sold out. But has it actually ever been

00:24:36   available? Because sometimes this happens, right? Like 9to5Mac or Fubo product? Okay,

00:24:41   people have it, okay. Because you know, you see this, it's like, here's this new Belkin

00:24:45   charger, it's not available, right? They're not selling it yet for like a month, you know.

00:24:49   But okay, if people have it then... Let's try again, sateci.net, yeah, out of stock,

00:24:54   you see? Yeah, and I was just looking on Amazon in the UK for you and they don't have it either.

00:24:58   I really want this keyboard because that means I can get rid of a bunch of stuff, I don't

00:25:04   have to put my Magic Keyboard in a drawer anymore, I can just have a single keyboard

00:25:10   that looks good, and that can switch between the Mac Mini and the iPad Pro.

00:25:16   But yes, to go back to your question, Steven, I'm still using the Studio Doc, and I really

00:25:19   like it, but I want to see, of course, what happens with the new iPad Pro.

00:25:25   Hopefully it'll still be compatible.

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00:26:41   Pingdom from SolarWinds for the support of the show and Relay FM. Last week we

00:26:47   had a conversation I really enjoyed about things Apple would not do if the

00:26:56   iPhone was starting today and it was and again I would once again like to

00:27:01   commend Federico for coming up with that fantastic topic for last week. In this

00:27:05   topic there is a great foreshadowing.

00:27:10   Among Shortcuts power users we all know that the iCloud.com link you can actually

00:27:17   reverse engineer and look at the API that puts together the shared shortcut.

00:27:21   That is how I can extract things like the icon that a shortcut uses from the

00:27:29   iCloud.com link because if you call on the right web API you can get a bunch of

00:27:35   information, a bunch of details about the shortcut itself. So like I'm pretty sure

00:27:39   that Apple doesn't like it. Sometimes you say things on this show that I wish for

00:27:46   your own sake you didn't say, that's one of them. If you like that you can do that,

00:27:53   you shouldn't say it.

00:27:54   We all know it. I just kind of like to steer the pot and see what happens. So here am I

00:28:03   steering and steering and seeing what happens.

00:28:06   So you have just heard Federico talk about Shortcuts Links and I suggest to Federico

00:28:14   that he is potentially harming himself by talking about these things.

00:28:18   Seven days later, all shortcut links are dead. Can you explain what's going on, Federico?

00:28:27   I woke up this morning, got my phone, checked my Twitter replies, and there was a person saying,

00:28:33   "Hey, do you know why I can't seem to install your Apple Frames shortcut anymore? I go to the link

00:28:40   and it gives me this error." And I was like, "Well, that's weird."

00:28:44   My first thought was that finally Apple got me, and they

00:28:49   manually killed the Apple Frames shortcut on their servers, because maybe they didn't like the fact that I was using their

00:28:57   graphical assets for Apple Frames, which was weird, because I knew that there's people at Apple who actually use Apple Frames,

00:29:04   but I thought, you know, maybe they're changing PR people around. They don't want Apple Frames to be around anymore.

00:29:10   So I just thought that it was an isolated issue

00:29:13   Just about Apple frames and I created a reminder in my task manager saying fix this later

00:29:20   Then a couple of hours later

00:29:22   Somebody told me are you aware of this thing where all shortcuts links ever

00:29:29   Created have been dead since yesterday after iOS 14.5 beta 5

00:29:36   Came out and so here's what's going on

00:29:39   on. Something happened on Apple's iCloud.com servers yesterday, and all iCloud.com links

00:29:48   for shortcuts ever, ever created from the very first version of shortcuts, up until

00:29:54   some point yesterday, Tuesday, March 23rd, all those links are currently dead. They return

00:30:03   a 404 error saying that the shortcut does not exist anymore.

00:30:07   it says on the iPhone, "Shortcut not found. The shortcut link may be invalid or it may

00:30:12   have been deleted."

00:30:14   In addition to that, I'm not sure when this change happened, but for a long time, so Shortcuts

00:30:22   before it was called Shortcuts used to be Workflow. And Apple bought Workflow, kept

00:30:28   it on the App Store for a year, and then it relaunched as Shortcuts. But for the longest

00:30:33   time, Apple kept those old workflow links working. So in workflow, you could also share

00:30:42   your workflows, and they were uploaded to the workflow servers, and they had a workflow.is.is

00:30:50   URL. For a long time, Apple automatically redirected those workflow links to iCloud.com

00:30:59   links. And that was a really great gesture to cap compatibility with those workflows.

00:31:04   Now, I'm not sure when this happened, but those workflow links are also dead. They do not redirect

00:31:10   to iCloud anymore. But I'm not sure this happened yesterday. It may have happened a while back,

00:31:17   I just wanted to mention it because I think it's important to be complete about this.

00:31:23   In any case, the main issue is all shortcuts links created from 2018 until yesterday,

00:31:30   so three years of shortcuts links, are at the moment of recording this down,

00:31:36   and they've been completely wiped out. Now, last week in our section I mentioned how,

00:31:43   for a variety of reasons, I believe that Apple doesn't exactly love the idea of people sharing

00:31:49   shortcuts with one another. And I also mentioned how, and you didn't want me to

00:31:55   talk about it, Myke, how you can look up shortcuts metadata on Apple servers by

00:32:02   using a specific API call. They have a records API that you can use to look up

00:32:08   stuff like the icon and the glyph and the color of shortcuts, the creation date,

00:32:14   stuff like that. Now, this morning when I noticed that all shortcuts links were

00:32:21   down, the first thought was "Oh, Myke was right, obviously, I shouldn't have

00:32:26   mentioned this. Somebody listened to Connected and they took down

00:32:31   all those links to get rid of the metadata lookup method." And here's where

00:32:38   the whole situation is really strange, but at the same time it also gives me

00:32:42   hope. You can still create links to shortcuts. New links, new iCloud.com links are working.

00:32:51   It's just the old ones that are dead.

00:32:53   Maybe they just kill them on a daily basis. Like tomorrow, none of today's will work.

00:32:58   Sure, maybe they just haven't, it just lasts 24 hours. Maybe, could be. I mean, could be.

00:33:04   Do you know if the API call stuff, does that work against new links or have they turned

00:33:08   that off?

00:33:09   what I did, right? So I took a new link and I tested my old metadata shortcuts and it's

00:33:16   still working. You can still look up shortcuts metadata with that method. You can still extract

00:33:22   information from a new iCloud.com link. So all this to me feels like a bug because they

00:33:33   didn't, at least as long as I'm concerned, like they didn't change anything

00:33:38   for that API lookup method. The shortcuts gallery was also down yesterday, so Apple

00:33:46   must have done something with the transition to iOS 14.5 beta 5 and I

00:33:52   guess they accidentally took down all the links. At least that's what I want to

00:33:56   believe. Also, if Apple suddenly decided to kill sharing shortcuts with other people via

00:34:05   iCloud links, they would probably do it the opposite way. They would probably prevent

00:34:10   the creation of new links, and they would keep the old ones around, at least for a while.

00:34:17   So if their intention was to kill those links, they would probably do the opposite of what

00:34:22   doing now. Still, it sucks, because for, like, I woke up this morning and I started getting

00:34:29   tweets and emails from people saying, obviously those people know nothing, they're saying

00:34:33   "Hey, I just came from, like, for example, Wired a couple of weeks ago. They linked to

00:34:38   Apple Frames as one of the most popular shortcuts that you can use on your iPhone." And I got

00:34:44   an email from somebody saying "Hey, I was trying to install your shortcuts from Wired

00:34:48   and it's not working, can you upload it again, please? And now I gotta explain to these people,

00:34:54   like, I have three emails already and a bunch of tweets, and I gotta explain to all these people

00:34:59   why it's not really my fault. But at the moment, I'm basically standing here, and I got 230

00:35:05   shortcuts in the MaxStory shortcuts archive. All those links are dead. There's probably a hundred

00:35:12   more in my previous coverage of shortcuts for stuff that I did not put in the MacStories

00:35:18   shortcuts archive. And obviously this goes beyond MacStories. There's entire communities

00:35:24   that have years of content that is basically useless now. The shortcuts subreddit, RoutineHub,

00:35:30   which is a popular website where people can share shortcuts. Obviously, Matthew Cassinelli,

00:35:37   entire shortcuts library is not accessible at the moment. Shortcuts that Rosemary and

00:35:45   David share on automators here on relay.fm, as well as the shortcuts that the automators

00:35:51   listeners share in the forums, those are dead. Like, it's a very unfortunate situation, and

00:35:59   the lack of communication doesn't help. We reached out to Apple for a comment. They do

00:36:05   not have a comment at the moment, I believe. So, yeah. So, I mean.

00:36:12   I don't like that answer. I don't know.

00:36:18   So we're all... And obviously I have a membership program where people give me money to... At

00:36:24   least part of the perks. One of the perks is accessing exclusive members-only shortcuts.

00:36:32   So yeah, I'm...

00:36:35   I bet they didn't mean to do...

00:36:38   My feeling is they did not mean to do this, but they have done something that's caused

00:36:43   this.

00:36:44   I expect that this is a bug caused by them doing something.

00:36:47   I expect the something is probably something you're not going to like, but I doubt that

00:36:53   they meant to knock out all of these links in one fail swoop, especially because you

00:36:59   can still make them.

00:37:00   want to clarify before he gets out of hand. Apple did not say no comment to us. We just

00:37:06   haven't gotten a reply yet.

00:37:08   Oh, okay. I thought that they were like, "Oh, no, we don't know."

00:37:14   We haven't gotten a reply yet, but we reached out. So the ball is in their court now. So

00:37:21   yeah, we're all just waiting. That's what I was going to say. We're all just waiting

00:37:23   to understand what's going on. Maybe this is nothing. Maybe somebody was making a change

00:37:29   the shortcuts gallery yesterday and they accidentally changed an ownership property in the Amazon

00:37:37   S3 bucket where all these links are stored. I don't know, man.

00:37:41   Apple has a status page for iCloud. It doesn't have anything for shortcuts on that page.

00:37:47   But similarly, there is also, as of right now, no errors on that page for anything.

00:37:53   You could imagine that maybe if some iCloud thing was down it could take this with it.

00:37:59   But as it stands right now, there is no notification of any errors with iCloud.

00:38:06   Who knows what it is.

00:38:08   Grand scheme of things, not that important, but to certain communities incredibly important.

00:38:13   I mean it would suck if three years of work were not accessible anymore.

00:38:19   because Apple removed two years ago the option to share shortcuts with other people as files.

00:38:27   As files, yeah.

00:38:28   It used to be that you could share a dot shortcut file with somebody else and they could import

00:38:35   the shortcut as a file. Then they changed the whole security system around shortcut

00:38:41   sharing in iOS 13. We talked about it before, the whole untrusted shortcut system that you

00:38:49   got enabled in settings, and you cannot import shortcut files anymore. So iCloud.com links

00:38:55   are the only way for installing shortcuts made by other people. And hopefully this is

00:39:02   just a bug. Apple doesn't need to comment, they just need to fix it. But at least I believe

00:39:09   it's a bug. Again, if they were planning to kill the feature, they would probably do it

00:39:17   the opposite way. They would remove sharing for new shortcuts and new links, but they

00:39:23   would keep the old legacy ones around. So it's just a bug. It would be nice to hear

00:39:31   what's going on, but let's wait a couple of days and see what happens.

00:39:35   So strange. So they did something on the server side that corresponds when a beta came out?

00:39:42   I guess. I guess. I mean, my theory is they were doing some work on the shortcuts gallery,

00:39:49   because that was down yesterday, and when it came back, someone did something horrible

00:39:57   to the database. I mean, it's got to be millions of links, right? I assume. And, you know,

00:40:05   somebody changed the permissions of that database or something. I hope they have a backup.

00:40:11   (laughing)

00:40:13   - Backed up on iCloud, it's fine.

00:40:15   - Cool.

00:40:17   - It's got to do a full restore

00:40:18   to bring the one database back of all of iCloud.

00:40:20   Okay, today is the 20th anniversary of Mac OS X,

00:40:25   which is pretty wild to think about.

00:40:27   There's a lot of great stuff out there to go read about it.

00:40:30   I rounded up a bunch of stuff on 512.

00:40:33   Mac Power Users episode 580 is basically all about this,

00:40:38   and we kind of walk through the transition

00:40:41   and the high points of the last 20 years.

00:40:43   So I don't want to do that here because I did it there,

00:40:46   plus the two of you would be bored.

00:40:49   But I do want to talk a little bit--

00:40:51   - You chose the right location for the coverage

00:40:55   in its entirety as it is on Mac Power Uses.

00:40:58   - And I think people would really enjoy that episode,

00:41:02   so go check it out.

00:41:03   I was really proud of how that came out.

00:41:04   So the thing that really, for me,

00:41:08   that I wanna talk about with y'all is

00:41:11   what has come after that.

00:41:13   And so Mac OS X comes out in 2001, five years later,

00:41:18   well, the same year the iPod comes out,

00:41:21   which had really had nothing to do with OS X,

00:41:23   it ran this like weirdo thing they bought for somebody else.

00:41:27   They switched to Intel five years later,

00:41:31   And then six years later, we get the iPhone.

00:41:34   Pretty relatively short period of time.

00:41:38   I often don't think about that in terms of like

00:41:42   how long it was since Genesis of OS X,

00:41:45   but it really was pretty quick.

00:41:47   And so for really for most of its life,

00:41:50   Mac OS, OS X, whatever you wanna call it,

00:41:53   has lived with these sibling OSes.

00:41:56   And of course now it's spun off watch OS

00:41:58   and tvOS and all these other things.

00:42:00   And I don't know if they could have done the iPhone the way they did it had they not done

00:42:04   Mac OS X the way that they did it.

00:42:07   But at the same time, Apple's also not afraid of shedding old baggage.

00:42:10   So things like carbon, 32-bit apps, older apps and services that don't matter anymore.

00:42:17   Even though Mac OS is 20 years old and it looks roughly the same, like it sells the

00:42:23   dock and the mini bar and stuff, I don't think there's much in it that is actually 20 years

00:42:29   old because they've continued to reinvent it and bring new technology into it over the

00:42:34   last few years, reunifying it with iOS under the hood, all these things.

00:42:39   And I kind of want to know what the two of y'all thought about that and what you think,

00:42:45   like how you see Mac OS today kind of fitting into the bigger Apple ecosystem.

00:42:52   I find it interesting to really think about the fact that it all stems from OS X, like

00:43:01   everything now, right?

00:43:03   Like even though watchOS I'm sure shares basically nothing from a technical perspective, it's

00:43:12   still...

00:43:13   I mean like the kernel's the same, you know, some of the like the low level...

00:43:17   Even watchOS?

00:43:18   Yeah, some of the low level like network stack.

00:43:20   I think a lot of the real deep stuff is the same.

00:43:23   Even better to the point that I was trying to make.

00:43:26   To think that without OS X all of this stuff wouldn't exist.

00:43:33   But from many perspectives, like one, I'm sure it could be argued that without OS X

00:43:38   Apple probably wouldn't be around anymore.

00:43:40   But that's like a different conversation.

00:43:43   But it's kind of fascinating really to think of this technology which is older than 20

00:43:49   Some of the underlying technology is next technology, correct?

00:43:53   Yeah, so I mean really like mock BSD and some of the real low-level stuff, it gets roots

00:43:59   go back 30 years.

00:44:01   So I find that quite fascinating really that there is this, I wonder how long it will be

00:44:10   into the future for OS X's legacy to continue from like real terms of technology developed

00:44:18   for OS X still being used, not just like, "Hey, we know how to make operating systems

00:44:22   because of OS X." You know what I mean? Like the real actual, this code that bears similarities

00:44:29   and/or is the same at an underlying level as the stuff introduced in 2001 or whatever.

00:44:37   It's interesting. Yeah, I mean, when they introduced the iPhone

00:44:42   in '07, it was like, "It runs Mac OS X."

00:44:46   It's like, well, I mean, at a certain point, that's true.

00:44:49   Lots of custom stuff on top of it.

00:44:51   And that's still how they work today, where the low-level stuff is the same, but like

00:44:56   watchOS, tvOS, iPadOS, they're all different interpretations of it, and they have their

00:45:01   own application layer on top of it, even though Apple is slowly moving towards unifying that

00:45:07   as well with things like SwiftUI.

00:45:09   It's a nice thing to mock.

00:45:11   with the world though.

00:45:12   Yeah, I don't have any particular thoughts.

00:45:14   I just feel like it's impressive that the foundation of this operating system is turning

00:45:20   20, but at the same time, here in 2021, we're all witnessing a new beginning for the platform.

00:45:29   And I think it's very exciting.

00:45:30   I think I honestly feel like there hasn't probably been a better time to be a Mac user

00:45:37   than right now, because you can feel like the company is really committed to it.

00:45:41   As a... I'm not a Mac user, like I don't consider myself a primarily a Mac user,

00:45:48   but I am in a good way, right, jealous of all the excitement that surrounds what's going on with

00:45:57   MacOS, what's going on with M1 Macs, and like it's a good thing, it's a great thing to witness

00:46:02   this sort of comeback for the platform, both in the software and the hardware. So, yeah, it turns 20,

00:46:10   but, you know, in many ways it's, you know, turning one this year. So I think it's really,

00:46:19   really exciting. Yeah, I mean, they're using the foundations that they built so long ago to launch

00:46:25   all this new stuff. I mean, it is, yeah, it is a remarkable run. Yeah, I mean, man, that's six years

00:46:32   between Mac OS X and the iPhone like that is no time. That is the number

00:46:38   that really jumped out of me today. Especially when you then go like six

00:46:42   years to that and then just it's 13, 14 years to now. Yeah. You think about it

00:46:52   felt like OS X have been around forever. Forever. And now it's over twice

00:46:58   stat amount of time since. Yep. Weird. Time is weird. This episode of connected is

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00:49:10   In a report which was detailing a mysterious temperature sensor in the current HomePod

00:49:15   Mini, which is like just a super weird, wonderful report from Mark Gurman, Mark also reiterated

00:49:21   a line that he said in the past which is "Apple has been developing new speakers

00:49:26   i.e. HomePods with screens and cameras" so he's spoken about this in the past I

00:49:31   think there was a report a while ago about the HomePod I think it was

00:49:35   detailing a HomePod mini suggesting that there might be a HomePod which was in

00:49:41   price between the mini and the current HomePod which I mean there could be more

00:49:46   sense to that rumor now than there was before because the other part of that

00:49:50   rumor is because the big HomePod won't exist anymore, so who knows, but also detailing

00:49:55   that Apple's been looking at HomePod versions or models that have screens on them.

00:50:01   Furthermore, Steve Moser at MacRumors, Steve was responsible for finding a bunch of stuff

00:50:06   we were talking about earlier on in the show too, Steve found references in tvOS 14.5 to

00:50:13   FaceTime, iMessage and image capturing frameworks being added to tvOS.

00:50:19   Now you may think to yourself that this sounds peculiar or surely the HomePod already has

00:50:26   FaceTime and iMessage stuff.

00:50:28   It's like yes and no, there's a few things.

00:50:30   So as of 2020, HomePod is part of tvOS not iOS, they changed that over.

00:50:35   So HomePod gets its updates via the tvOS stack, not the iOS stack.

00:50:41   And also it had some of the parts of iMessage and FaceTime in them in the sense of allowing

00:50:47   you to place calls, send messages, that kind of stuff.

00:50:51   But what it seems like this is now being integrated into the platform at a more deep level, it's

00:50:58   probably a deep and open framework.

00:51:00   That's probably what they did by putting iMessage in there.

00:51:03   And the key is this is surely intended for the home pod because it makes not a lot of

00:51:12   sense to put iMessage on the TV.

00:51:16   If these frameworks are going into these devices, it's most likely for a HomePod device, especially

00:51:23   image capturing as well.

00:51:25   They're never going to put a camera on the Apple TV, you would assume.

00:51:28   It doesn't make any sense, why would you do that, but it could be on a HomePod.

00:51:31   Dude, you could have a 70-inch FaceTime call.

00:51:33   It would be amazing, right?

00:51:35   I don't think so.

00:51:37   So if we just take this as read, that all of this seems to suggest that there is a likelihood

00:51:43   for a HomePod of a screen.

00:51:46   And I actually think that there is potentially more case for that now that the big home pod

00:51:51   is gone.

00:51:52   You know, like the cheap home pod is just audio, the larger home pod has a screen on

00:51:56   it.

00:51:57   And because there is an existing market growing product offerings that are like this.

00:52:03   You know, Amazon makes stuff like this, Facebook makes stuff like this.

00:52:07   So if we're looking at this landscape now, what would we want this product to actually

00:52:14   do?

00:52:15   to say to us, "Alright, here is the next HomePod. It truly is the center of the home.

00:52:22   The whole family can get around it and have a FaceTime call. It has what else?" So what

00:52:28   would you guys want to see on something like this?

00:52:32   Well, so I guess the idea is that what we are imagining is Apple's version of an Echo

00:52:39   show or a Nest Hub, basically?

00:52:43   Yep.

00:52:44   OK. Well, I guess music, for example, would make a lot of sense. So music, you can follow

00:52:51   real-time lyrics and you can control music that way. Obviously, the idea of a digital

00:52:57   picture frame, right? So you can have your favorite photos and you can have slideshows

00:53:02   and have it be automatic or different versions of a digital clock, obviously, with maybe

00:53:10   even different watch faces that you can choose from. And I guess just generally speaking,

00:53:17   it would be nice to have a centralized hub for things you share in the family. So your

00:53:26   family calendar, your family reminders with the grocery list. Maybe you could have like

00:53:32   "Find My" and have your kids' position automatically show up and it could give you updates when

00:53:39   the location of somebody you're tracking changes.

00:53:42   Like all the things that you share

00:53:45   with iCloud over family sharing, I

00:53:47   think it would be a good place for that

00:53:49   on this kind of device.

00:53:52   My underlying problem with this assumption

00:53:55   is I'm just not sure at this point

00:53:59   how much Apple is committed to the home

00:54:03   and to the idea of building an ecosystem of products

00:54:08   around this, given what happened to the HomePod,

00:54:12   given the slow pace of updates with the Apple TV,

00:54:15   given that there's not really an ecosystem right now.

00:54:19   I mean, a HomePod mini is not an ecosystem.

00:54:22   A HomePod mini is a tiny speaker.

00:54:24   The ecosystem, I guess, is iCloud,

00:54:26   but iCloud is also on the iPhone and iPad, so.

00:54:29   - Or HomeKit. - Or HomeKit, yes.

00:54:30   But also HomeKit is a framework that Apple makes for others.

00:54:34   - Well, I mean, I think what happens

00:54:35   if Apple dives back into this and fails again.

00:54:40   Like if the HomePod mini just kind of like bumbles along

00:54:45   for a while, it never really takes off,

00:54:49   but it's like fine for people who just want Apple Music

00:54:52   and don't want Amazon in their bedroom or whatever.

00:54:55   Like that's not a big market probably,

00:54:56   but it could be enough.

00:54:57   But if they've really launched something like this

00:55:00   that we're talking about with a screen,

00:55:01   which I think would be really compelling,

00:55:03   and it HomePods again, like it doesn't take off

00:55:07   or it fails in some way, like then what happens?

00:55:11   'Cause then at that point you're O and two

00:55:14   or maybe one and two if the HomePod mini's okay.

00:55:17   I just don't know how willing they are to try again.

00:55:22   I think they should try again,

00:55:24   but I'm not sure how willing they would be to do that.

00:55:27   - They just ended up, I feel like, in a weird spot

00:55:32   where they have perhaps the most popular mobile operating system around.

00:55:39   They have HomeKit, they have Siri, which is not great,

00:55:42   they have iCloud and Family Sharing, all great components,

00:55:47   but the big piece missing from the puzzle is

00:55:53   all these different technologies they don't really resolve

00:55:57   in a unified ecosystem for the home. And it's very weird, because they

00:56:02   I have all these, you know, most of them really solid components. I mean most of them because Siri is not solid

00:56:10   But they're missing a unifying strategy. I would actually like to posit the theory that makes me

00:56:15   Feel better is that the HomePod being discontinued is a signal of Apple's recommitment. Okay?

00:56:23   It's a signal that we are imagining

00:56:27   Potentially suggesting the home pod is the wrong product at its price point

00:56:32   For what it people want it to do, right?

00:56:36   So like that's kind of what I'm positing here and that they have woke up and been like, okay the home pod mini

00:56:42   Does everything the home pod needs to do and so we should not continue to offer this larger product. Yeah

00:56:50   Let's get rid of it now while we make way for our next product and at this point I am hoping for

00:56:57   very good Apple TV like product which incorporates more home stuff that's what

00:57:03   I'm hoping for and or as well like a echo show Google Nest Hub Facebook

00:57:12   portal like device made by Apple and I understand that you could say hey why

00:57:19   not just put an iPad on a stand I'll tell you I tried that it's not great

00:57:26   like it's you're really forcing it to do something that it's not really made to

00:57:33   do yeah you know like my echo show for example the screen is always on and

00:57:37   showing me something the iPad doesn't do that like it's not what it's for right

00:57:43   like it is meant to be a personal device it is yours it's like one person's

00:57:47   device where these other products are built around being a device for a family

00:57:53   even the HomePod, right? Like you can have multiple people talking to it and it recognizes

00:57:58   that and an iPad can't do that.

00:58:00   Sometimes.

00:58:01   Sometimes, but it does do it. I mean, it might not be completely reliable. I don't know how

00:58:05   reliable these other products are at doing it. I found it to be somewhat reliable. There

00:58:10   is a difference in having a device like this, which is built around, okay, this is in a

00:58:15   shared environment first, now what does it do? It's building from a different direction

00:58:22   to and even the HomePod has been built from that mindset where an iPad or an iPhone is

00:58:28   not built for that.

00:58:30   I would really like to see them go down this route.

00:58:33   They could actually make third party apps, right?

00:58:36   Let me put Zoom on this thing and it will be great.

00:58:39   We use an iPad for all this kind of stuff at home.

00:58:43   It would be great for us to just put one of these things somewhere in the house and we

00:58:47   could have these calls and it worked really nice.

00:58:51   I would really be into that. I don't know if they're going to do it, but I do think

00:58:59   I do believe in them when it comes to the home, purely because I've said this before

00:59:05   about AR, right? Like why are they even, you know, AR/VR, why are Apple attacking this

00:59:10   market? Well, because it's a new market. It's an emerging market, right? And if they want

00:59:17   to have the next iPhone hit they've got to try and be in every emerging market

00:59:22   right you've got to have something so I do believe that once the home market is

00:59:28   never gonna be iPhone sized right because I mean you've already taken it

00:59:33   down from say like four divided to one right like if every home had one it's

00:59:37   still gonna be a quarter of the amount of phones there are right because

00:59:40   everyone has their own phone but it's still a emerging market for consumer

00:59:45   technology because Apple's competitors are doing such a good job and are

00:59:53   continually iterating. So do you want to just abandon this emerging market for

01:00:00   the consumer technology? I don't believe that they would want to especially when

01:00:04   the home market really has the ecosystem key. Like it really is a very important

01:00:13   component to locking you into an ecosystem.

01:00:17   Even with this connected home interoperability thing,

01:00:22   that's still not going to be like,

01:00:25   what is your syncing system?

01:00:26   What is your music system?

01:00:28   Where are your photos?

01:00:29   You're still going to want that lock-in,

01:00:32   and it's always going to be better on the device made

01:00:34   by the company that's also making the software part.

01:00:37   Even if they all talk to each other,

01:00:38   it's always going to be better when you have one and one

01:00:41   together, right?

01:00:42   And so I think it would not be a good move for Apple

01:00:45   to allow Amazon or Google to just take all of this market

01:00:52   when it seems like at this point, they haven't really tried.

01:00:56   Yeah.

01:00:57   The issue there is that they have a long road ahead

01:01:03   to catch up, especially with Amazon,

01:01:06   when it comes to having lots of options,

01:01:09   when it comes to being aggressive with pricing,

01:01:14   and when it comes to having devices that can be flexible.

01:01:20   You can get an Amazon Echo for cheap,

01:01:22   and you can connect all kinds of accessories

01:01:25   and all kinds of services to it.

01:01:26   Because they have ignored this market for the past three

01:01:30   years, maybe, I guess, at the beginning,

01:01:33   when years ago, four or five years ago,

01:01:35   when everybody was making fun of the icons,

01:01:38   Like, hey, who wants to talk to an assistant stuck

01:01:41   in a cylinder, right?

01:01:42   People, especially in the Apple media ecosystem,

01:01:45   were sort of making fun of the echo at the beginning.

01:01:48   But Amazon kept going.

01:01:50   And they iterated and iterated on it.

01:01:52   And now it's something that, especially

01:01:55   in the past couple of years, I've seen it here in Italy.

01:01:58   As a country in Italy, we tend to be pretty late

01:02:03   to discovering new tech products.

01:02:06   And it's a combination of, well, it's a long discussion.

01:02:09   It's a combination of usually we do not get new tech stuff

01:02:14   as soon as Americans do, but also we tend to be,

01:02:18   as a people, pretty ignorant when it comes

01:02:20   to understanding technology.

01:02:21   But that's a failure of the education system in Italy.

01:02:23   That's a whole other topic.

01:02:25   Still.

01:02:26   - It's a more old-fashioned country.

01:02:29   - Yes, we are.

01:02:30   - And that is also one of Italy's selling points

01:02:33   to the rest of the world,

01:02:34   so you don't wanna completely give it up.

01:02:35   But there's another side to it, which is unfortunate when

01:02:37   it comes to technology.

01:02:39   However, what I've seen in the past two years

01:02:41   is devices like the Amazon Echo and the Google Assistant

01:02:45   as well have totally been accepted as regular appliances

01:02:51   that you can have in the home.

01:02:53   I see my friends referring to them,

01:02:56   using them as something that is just as common

01:02:59   as a phone at this point.

01:03:02   I mean, I went to my accountant's office

01:03:04   a few weeks ago, and I heard one of her colleagues

01:03:08   asking something to the echo.

01:03:09   I was like, wait, do you have an echo in the office?

01:03:12   She was like, yeah, we're using it here as well.

01:03:15   So it's like totally normal now.

01:03:17   And it surprises me that Apple has slept

01:03:20   on this for such a long time.

01:03:23   And so I wonder now, can you come back

01:03:27   from the failure of the HomePod and do it quickly,

01:03:31   and do it in a way that is still interesting enough for people,

01:03:36   that's really my concern.

01:03:37   Because it's really too bad that they

01:03:40   are abandoning the market.

01:03:43   And I don't want to believe that they are.

01:03:44   I believe that they want to do something,

01:03:47   but I'm rightfully so, I think, skeptical that they can succeed

01:03:53   because they don't have exactly a lot of positive points going

01:03:59   them right now. The one other counterpoint that I'll make to Federico

01:04:05   what you're saying about like the things that they need to do to combat Amazon is

01:04:10   you said price and flexibility of offering right? Yes. Because that's

01:04:17   arguably what Amazon have succeeded on right? That they're cheap, they keep

01:04:23   making them cheaper and they put it in everything. And you can get them in

01:04:27   all sizes and flavors and colors.

01:04:29   Yeah.

01:04:30   Yeah.

01:04:31   And you don't even have to buy a product from Amazon and you can get it.

01:04:34   You know, maybe you bought this other product and now you have Echo in your house, right?

01:04:38   You have Alexa in your house.

01:04:39   I'm taking a particular stand on this.

01:04:42   I don't know how much I believe it, but I just want to make the point anyway of the

01:04:45   iPhone, right?

01:04:47   That there were already lots of options available for phones.

01:04:53   Everyone had one.

01:04:54   Nokia was killing it, right?

01:04:55   Like Blackberry was destroying everyone like it was all good.

01:04:59   And then Apple created something which was so compelling that even though it was more

01:05:04   limited in some ways like lockdown, more expensive, everyone wanted it because it was so cool.

01:05:12   And they've done that many times.

01:05:15   Do I think that the HomePod is their next place to do this?

01:05:19   No, I actually think even though I have a lot of issues with the idea, I think they're

01:05:23   more likely to do this, have this impact in a future AR product or something?

01:05:27   You know, I'll add the Apple watch actually to that category of stuff I

01:05:31   just mentioned, right? Of like a product where there were already offerings and

01:05:35   people saw this type of product from Apple and they were like, "This is more

01:05:39   expensive than everybody else's but it is actually cool and I'll get it." They

01:05:43   could do that, I mean there's a company that has history of doing it, they could

01:05:46   do that for a home product, right? Where they make this thing where it's like

01:05:51   like halfway between a HomePod and an iPad and a Mac, right, in the sense of like what

01:05:57   you would do with it at home. And, you know, you could, I could imagine a world in which

01:06:03   there isn't a family computer anymore because all of the family computers tasks are taken

01:06:07   up by this Apple home device that has all this shared stuff that the family needs. Uh,

01:06:14   what you know, you know what I'm saying? Like I'm getting a bit like pie in the sky now,

01:06:18   But my point is like they have shown in the past that they can create products that disrupt

01:06:24   an industry and I want them to make something like this.

01:06:29   I don't want them to abandon the home.

01:06:31   Oh, I agree.

01:06:32   And I don't want them to not abandon the home because I'm someone who's terrified about

01:06:39   having Amazon or Google products in my house.

01:06:41   This is not where I'm coming from.

01:06:43   Because I have these products and I'm happy with them.

01:06:45   For me, it's just I think that this is an area that they could do cool stuff in and I want to see them do it

01:06:51   I absolutely I hope that they do and I hope that a device of a screen on it is the root that they take honestly

01:06:58   Like I want them to get weird like you have lots of money do weird stuff

01:07:04   Try all kinds of form factors it

01:07:07   Especially for the home. It's not like everything needs to be this super expensive

01:07:14   highly refined audio speaker for audio files. Do something that sounds crappy but it's easy to use

01:07:21   and it's got Siri that gets the basics right. Like get weird and try stuff. It doesn't have to be

01:07:29   like "oh my god I feel like I'm listening to heaven in my ears and now you can get the like these

01:07:35   six tweeters and a subwoofer?" No, do something that sounds like crap but is easy to use and you

01:07:42   You can get it there and you don't have to use Amazon and Google services and it automatically

01:07:49   is set up with your iPhone super quickly, you touch your iPhone, you set it up and you

01:07:52   can use FaceTime and that's it.

01:07:54   And you can go from something in a box to a functioning speaker with a display in like

01:08:01   two minutes and only you can do it because you're Apple and you control the whole thing.

01:08:05   But like, try lots of different things.

01:08:08   I love when Apple tries weird stuff.

01:08:11   What I dislike is when they don't believe in it, and when they abandon it, and when

01:08:15   it's like they stop doing updates, and we all know what's happening, this thing is gonna

01:08:19   get killed, and then they wait two years to finally kill it.

01:08:24   No, do stuff, like try things.

01:08:27   It's exciting when Apple tries new stuff, like the AirPods Max, I love them.

01:08:31   Like they just did these weird phones that nobody's gonna buy.

01:08:39   More weird things.

01:08:40   That's what I would like to see.

01:08:41   You ready to move on?

01:08:43   Yo, I want to talk about these, Steven.

01:08:46   Okay.

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01:10:38   -All right. So, what have you done, Steven? -Hello.

01:10:40   -Hi. What's going on here?

01:10:43   Hmm. Please explain yourself.

01:10:47   -I've tried a new task manager. -Okay.

01:10:51   -And it could be the one. -The one? What is the one for you?

01:10:55   -So, happy for you both. -Thank you.

01:10:57   Define the one task manager. The one that it does, it works the way I want it to work.

01:11:03   Okay. And the apps are nice enough and... Okay.

01:11:06   Looks pretty good. Okay. Looks like Todoist to me. Yeah. Just looking at the images now. It is like if Todoist and

01:11:14   Good task had a baby, it would come out. Really? That's high praise. Okay. Yeah, it's got some good tasks sort of vibe to it.

01:11:22   Okay. Anyways, so I for the last month or so have been using TicTic. TicTic.

01:11:27   Which, by the way, you search for it all, it just takes you to TikTok.

01:11:36   I don't really feel for them.

01:11:37   Yeah, their namespace.

01:11:38   I just searched TikTok, like I just typed TikTok into the Omni bar.

01:11:43   Is that what it's called on Safari?

01:11:44   What do they call it?

01:11:45   I don't know.

01:11:46   No, I think that's what Chrome calls it.

01:11:48   The magic bar.

01:11:49   Okay.

01:11:50   The bar where now there isn't a search bar, right?

01:11:53   I just searched TikTok and it just took me to the TikTok website.

01:11:56   It just didn't even take me to Google.

01:11:58   Like, it just, "Nope, I know what you want."

01:12:02   And I'm like, "No, that was wrong."

01:12:03   Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, tick.

01:12:06   It's fun to say.

01:12:07   Yes, it is.

01:12:09   Trying this out, there's a bunch of stuff that is very similar to Todoist.

01:12:14   So like, tick, tick, Todoist, remember the milk, good task, kind of.

01:12:20   Like, there are several of these that sort of, in my mind, are on kind of the same,

01:12:25   roughly the same playing field. So it has natural language entry for things like dates

01:12:32   and if you learn the keyboard shortcuts for things like, you know, what list you want

01:12:36   to put something in, the repeating syntax. So you don't have to be clicking around a

01:12:40   bunch to set parameters. Click click. Did you just like click click? Yeah. The sync

01:12:52   - It's pretty solid.

01:12:54   They run their own sync engine.

01:12:57   So they're not on top of reminders like Good Tasks is.

01:13:00   - What's it called?

01:13:01   Sync Sync?

01:13:01   - Sync Sync.

01:13:03   It has some UI customization, not a ton,

01:13:06   but you can set themes and like each list has an emoji

01:13:10   and it's kind of got the basics.

01:13:12   You can also do customization on how lists are sorted

01:13:17   and that sort of thing.

01:13:18   You can do smart lists, which is pretty cool.

01:13:20   In fact, their smart list tool to build them

01:13:22   is actually pretty good.

01:13:24   Wait, wait, tell me more about the smart lists.

01:13:26   How can you put them together?

01:13:28   They're smart smart.

01:13:29   OK.

01:13:29   Smart smart.

01:13:30   List list.

01:13:31   List list.

01:13:33   How do you choose the filtering conditions, whatever?

01:13:39   Yeah, so they have some pre-made ones.

01:13:42   So if you wanted to build one that just showed you

01:13:44   the next five days, they have some dropdown menus

01:13:48   that you can use.

01:13:49   but they also have their own syntax.

01:13:53   - Okay.

01:13:54   - And you can look it up on their website.

01:13:56   I think that's probably the easiest way to do it.

01:13:58   And you can basically build out your like Boolean search

01:14:03   for what you want.

01:14:04   So you could say, I want these parameters.

01:14:07   I want all my lists except this one list.

01:14:10   Or I just want to include this tag with these parameters.

01:14:13   So you can combine different elements to make a smart list.

01:14:16   - Is it more understandable than the third language

01:14:19   have to learn if you want to use to do it. Yeah, it's fine, we support smart list except

01:14:26   you gotta speak a new language. So you need to go to the British Museum, consult the Rosetta

01:14:31   Stone and then maybe you can create a repeating reminder. It's a little bit like that, but

01:14:37   once you kind of get the hang of it, it's not too bad. They've got tags, I don't care

01:14:42   about tags, they got priority which is fine. They also have this cool thing where you can

01:14:49   mark a task partially complete.

01:14:51   Wait, what? Partially complete?

01:14:53   For instance, I have a recurring task every Wednesday to make sure that on 512,

01:14:59   like the blog sponsor for the next week, I have all their content.

01:15:02   I usually send them an email on Wednesday and say, "Hey, you're coming up next week.

01:15:05   This is a reminder. This is the content that I need."

01:15:07   And so what I've started to do is I've marked that 50% complete once I email them

01:15:12   and then fully complete once I actually get the content.

01:15:16   So you can kind of like track.

01:15:18   And what's the like, okay, what's the what how do you do that though? Like what are you doing?

01:15:22   under the task there's like a

01:15:25   You click click you milk it is completely a progress bar you click yeah

01:15:31   Yeah, and then it shows up like a percentage thing in the list. Okay, I haven't seen that in any other task manager

01:15:38   And I kind of dig it. No, it's interesting. I think I can come back to white it isn't a minute. Do you?

01:15:44   Have to say in advance like this is a task which can be partly completed

01:15:49   No, how do you can you do it on the iPhone? Can you do this thing?

01:15:53   How much of what you're saying Steven is exclusive to the Mac or desktop version as far as I know?

01:16:00   Everything is everywhere

01:16:03   Best I can tell I think one of the reasons you've not seen that in other places is like this

01:16:08   As much as you know, I'm sorry to invoke it

01:16:11   just so

01:16:14   in the face of GTD, which so many of these systems have gone through. It's so wrong.

01:16:18   Because it's like, well, actually that's not one task. There's multiple tasks in a project.

01:16:24   Right, but Dave Allen's not the boss of me.

01:16:26   And also, I don't think that way either. But I'm saying, I think the reason you may not have seen

01:16:31   that anywhere else is because it's like, if you think in the more traditional terms of how these

01:16:37   systems should be used, you would never work that way. But now, literally you've said that, and now

01:16:42   that is the feature that has now made me just go and download this application.

01:16:45   That is actually also the thing that stood out the most to me. It's like,

01:16:50   no, because I totally, I totally...

01:16:52   It's truly different, right? Everything else that you said so far, it's like,

01:16:56   okay, what is their interpretation of the features that everybody else has?

01:17:00   But that thing, because I also do it all the time, like, I have something, for example,

01:17:05   that is due on a specific day, but I prepare for it in advance, right? So that when I need to do

01:17:12   it, the work is already done, except that I don't want to mark it as complete because

01:17:17   maybe I'm risking that on the day of, I'm going to forget. So it's like, partially complete

01:17:23   actually makes a lot of sense. And also, like, keep talking, is such a normal way of working

01:17:31   now, and I think we all probably have this, where you have tasks that are dependent on

01:17:34   somebody else doing something. So part of the task is you asking for it, or you do,

01:17:39   know, like, which is exactly the example that you gave Stephen, but that's become such a

01:17:43   more normal way of working that I think is, is more, is much more modern. Like you, you

01:17:49   communicate with somebody and say, I need a thing and then you're waiting for it to

01:17:52   come back. So technically you've done your part or maybe all you need to do, but the

01:17:57   task isn't complete until the other person does what they're supposed to do.

01:18:01   What I love is that we are explaining tic tic to Stephen.

01:18:04   No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm not, I'm just trying to like, we're talking about why in

01:18:10   general this is a thing that people might want.

01:18:13   Yeah, or some people may put like a tag on it, like waiting. It's like I don't like tags

01:18:17   in any system, so this has jumped out at me as something unique and kind of useful. You've

01:18:23   got, you can do subtasks too, which I could make that a task and a subtask, right? Like

01:18:31   get sponsorship content and be like sub task one, email them, sub task two, put it in google

01:18:37   docs.

01:18:38   Like I don't, just don't think that way.

01:18:39   Yeah, me too.

01:18:40   I've tried the sub task thing like before and basically what I like to do is just write

01:18:45   the entire thing and all the sub tasks in the task name and then that's just how I work.

01:18:50   Like I don't like the sub task model.

01:18:52   Yeah, sub tasks are just separate tasks holding hands.

01:18:57   It's silly.

01:18:58   Like at that point just create multiple tasks and sort them so that they stick closer together.

01:19:06   Agreed.

01:19:07   A couple other things that I really like in the task description, you can use Markdown.

01:19:16   And so I sent y'all a screenshot of this, but I sometimes, like if I need to post a

01:19:22   show or something, I may just keep a bunch of links that I need handy and I could just

01:19:28   a little markdown list of them. And it's just a nice way to like just have you know progress

01:19:34   or something associated with a task and I like markdown so it's got it's got markdown

01:19:39   markdown.

01:19:40   And it's something I definitely miss from switching from Todoist to OmniFocus.

01:19:44   Yeah Todoist has it but Todoist like it really treats descriptions as comments and so they

01:19:50   get all tagged with like a time and a date I don't necessarily need that. So the description

01:19:57   is a little more flexible, I think.

01:19:59   - Steven, can you mix and match, like in the same list,

01:20:02   can you view both tasks and calendar events?

01:20:06   - So I don't, calendars are one of the things

01:20:07   that I don't mix into my,

01:20:10   into my task manager, but yes, you can.

01:20:14   So like right now I'm in today,

01:20:16   and I see all my calendar items,

01:20:18   and I see my tasks intermixed by time.

01:20:22   So like I have edit and publish connected

01:20:24   and connected pro, do it for 30,

01:20:27   that is in between pick my kid up from school and then like a board meeting I have this

01:20:31   evening so it doesn't end time order which is cool.

01:20:35   Are you on Salesforce, Steven?

01:20:38   Yeah man.

01:20:39   While I guess while I'm here, so it does have calendar integration, I don't use it.

01:20:45   It has a Pomodoro timer which I don't care about.

01:20:51   The only place where Pomodoro has to go is on pizza.

01:20:54   Oh, time tracking?

01:20:56   tomato timer. The tomato is the universal symbol for Pomodoro timers. Yep. You can do habit tracking.

01:21:05   I don't do... well, I kind of do, but in a paper notebook. But if you wanted to create habits to

01:21:11   track in TickTick, you can do that. I don't care about it. So, and what's cool, if you turn those

01:21:16   things off, they disappear from the UI. So it's not like I have like a calendar tab and it's just

01:21:20   empty. Like there's no UI even indicating that this app could show me calendars, which

01:21:26   I think is helpful.

01:21:27   What's the shortcut support like?

01:21:30   Yeah, shortcut support is pretty good. So you can bring things in. So I've got a couple

01:21:36   of like save to the tick tick inbox, save to a certain list. I've talked about this

01:21:40   before, but I have a shortcut to like a link anywhere on my phone, like I want to link

01:21:46   to it on 512. So put it in the 512 list due today. And that works really well. It also

01:21:52   has some shortcuts for shortcut support, I guess, things that have been with donated

01:21:57   to shortcuts. What's the verbiage like the intents?

01:22:00   Yeah, the way do you mean parameters or like,

01:22:05   yeah, yeah, like the actions you can, you can take, okay, there are several others you

01:22:12   You can get tasks from a list.

01:22:15   So if you had like one of those daily boot up shortcuts, it could show you a task from

01:22:19   any list.

01:22:20   You can open any list or calendar directly, you can start or stop the Pomodoro timer,

01:22:26   check in the habit, that sort of thing.

01:22:28   So it's it's pretty good.

01:22:29   I think it's probably on par with something like Todoist in terms of what you can do with

01:22:33   it with shortcuts.

01:22:35   And you can also get stuff into it via Zapier, which I do quite a bit of.

01:22:40   Widgets.

01:22:41   It's got widgets, they're pretty basic.

01:22:44   I think they look nicer than Todoist's.

01:22:47   Todoist has like some weird text rendering stuff

01:22:49   in their iOS widgets, but it's simple enough.

01:22:53   I've got a small one on one homepage

01:22:54   and it kind of shows me the next three or four things

01:22:57   and it works well enough.

01:22:58   - What about, so one of the things

01:23:00   that I really like about using good task

01:23:02   is that it uses reminders as its database,

01:23:06   which means that whenever I wanna save a new task quickly,

01:23:10   I can just talk to my Apple Watch.

01:23:12   I can say, "Remind me about this,"

01:23:13   and because it's all based on reminders,

01:23:16   it shows up in Good Task 2.

01:23:19   Does it have an Apple Watch app?

01:23:21   Does it have Siri integration that,

01:23:24   even if I gotta say, in tic-tac, remind me about this?

01:23:28   Like, how quickly can you save stuff?

01:23:30   - Pretty quick.

01:23:31   So it does have an Apple Watch app,

01:23:33   and it can show you the list that you want,

01:23:35   and you can quickly input things with your voice.

01:23:39   The iPhone app, or I guess the iOS app,

01:23:41   has two different ways you can use it with Siri.

01:23:43   You can do, the first one you said

01:23:45   where you can basically tell it,

01:23:47   tell your phone just to remind me

01:23:49   and TickTick will scrape the reminders inbox

01:23:51   and then just move those things into the TickTick inbox

01:23:54   and then get rid of them in reminders.

01:23:56   Or you can say, add so and so to my list in TickTick.

01:24:00   I've tried both, they work basically

01:24:03   as well as each other.

01:24:05   So I use the in TickTick version

01:24:07   because I do use Apple reminders

01:24:10   for like very specific types of things.

01:24:12   And so I kind of want to keep that a little bit separate,

01:24:14   but it offers both, which is nice.

01:24:17   You can kind of work the way you want to.

01:24:19   - Tell us why we're not gonna like it.

01:24:21   - Yeah.

01:24:22   - There's gotta be some stuff-

01:24:23   - There has to be a catch.

01:24:24   - That, you know.

01:24:26   - I don't know, iPad support.

01:24:27   Maybe there's no pointer integration or something.

01:24:30   - That's a good question.

01:24:32   Let's see, I have my iPad here.

01:24:34   - Yeah, it's like, what are we not gonna like?

01:24:36   There's gotta be some stuff we're not gonna like, right?

01:24:38   'Cause right now, you're painting the picture

01:24:41   of this is the best to-do app ever made, you know?

01:24:43   It sounds fantastic.

01:24:44   Every part of it sounds great.

01:24:46   - Okay, so the trackpad support is very basic.

01:24:50   It doesn't do anything to change shapes or anything,

01:24:52   but it does work, it's just not fancy.

01:24:55   - iPad keyboard shortcuts?

01:24:56   - It has a couple.

01:24:59   It's got Command + N will give you a new one.

01:25:04   I'm trying to see, I'm trying to pull up the shortcut thing.

01:25:07   It's got a few.

01:25:08   It definitely could be better on the iPad,

01:25:10   but it's perfectly functional, but like, totally fine.

01:25:14   Some people won't like that it has its own sync, I think.

01:25:17   I think some people like that it syncs

01:25:18   a top of Reminders or CloudKit, or you can choose,

01:25:21   you know, like the To Do app, you know,

01:25:24   to DO, you can sync on iCloud or Dropbox or whatever.

01:25:28   This is a service with an app, so you know,

01:25:30   you've gotta know and you gotta trust them with your data.

01:25:33   Some people won't like that.

01:25:35   Like a lot of these apps,

01:25:36   it's free with a premium subscription.

01:25:39   And I think where they draw the line

01:25:41   between free and premium is a little stingy.

01:25:44   You know, it's like 28 bucks a year.

01:25:47   So it's kind of in line with what Todoist is, I think.

01:25:49   And I think some people,

01:25:51   I think maybe y'all in particular won't like

01:25:54   that it has all these other features

01:25:55   that you don't want or need.

01:25:58   But because you can turn them off

01:26:00   and they'd basically disappear,

01:26:01   it really hasn't bothered me that much.

01:26:03   but I think that would bother some people knowing that this app does a lot more than what they're using it for.

01:26:08   I don't know how that could annoy people if you can turn them off and don't have to see them anymore.

01:26:12   Outside, out of mind.

01:26:13   Maybe it's just like the overhead maybe, I don't know.

01:26:16   The principle of it, that this company is also working on all these other features.

01:26:21   Getting distracted.

01:26:22   Right, yeah, that's more what I mean.

01:26:24   Yeah, like why are they spending time on a tomato timer? I don't need that.

01:26:28   Right, but that only bothers me if there are core problems with the main application, right?

01:26:33   - Mm-hmm, I will say the Apple Watch app

01:26:35   could be more robust.

01:26:37   It's pretty simple, and at least in the current release,

01:26:39   there's this weird thing where it puts overdue task

01:26:43   at the bottom and at the top of the list,

01:26:44   and I've contacted them, and they say

01:26:46   that that's like a known thing,

01:26:48   so I think that's just a temporary bug.

01:26:50   But the Apple Watch app is relatively straightforward.

01:26:54   There's not a lot of customization you can do there,

01:26:57   which with Todoist and with others,

01:26:59   you can really like more finely control

01:27:01   Apple Watch app but it's basic but it gets it gets the job the job done just

01:27:05   fine. It looks cross-platformy like it doesn't really look Mac ish but neither

01:27:12   does Todoist. I would argue that it is a good task really a good task. This on the

01:27:16   Mac looks like good task. It is a native app so it's not best I can tell it's not

01:27:21   Electron but it's definitely not super native feeling but unless you're using

01:27:26   OmniFocus or things that's pretty much par for the course. Yeah there's no such

01:27:30   thing as Mac like you know like OmniFocus I spoke about it before the

01:27:35   Mac app not good doesn't look nice doesn't really feel that great in a lot

01:27:42   of places like okay great it's a native application but like it's not a

01:27:49   particularly nice one to use all right like you know there is no such thing as

01:27:54   Mac like anymore so it's got URL schemes if you're into that that's exciting on

01:27:59   on the Mac? On iOS. I'm looking at this blog post from their company blog, "20

01:28:05   lesser-known tick-tick features." Let's see, "set time to a task based on flexible

01:28:12   time zone options." Nice, that's a good one to have, I like that. "See how many days

01:28:18   are left for a task with countdown mode." They call Pomodoro "Pomo," which I don't

01:28:26   like when people have those kinds of abbreviations, like when people say let's have a combo or

01:28:32   let's do a pod. It's like no please don't but okay.

01:28:36   So if you did a show together about time tracking it would be a pomo collab pomo colo pod. I'm

01:28:44   trying to put all those words together.

01:28:46   A pomo pod. It's a pomo pod.

01:28:48   Hub, pub sub hubbub. Remember that?

01:28:51   What? What did you just say?

01:28:55   sub. Oh, I remember. Pub-sub-hub-hub. It's a Google thing. An open, simple web scale

01:29:05   and decentralized PubSub protocol. It's now just called WebSub, which is so much sad.

01:29:11   Why didn't you call that years ago? Okay. Yeah. Wow, the Google PubSubHubHubHub. PubSubHubHubHub.

01:29:23   I'm reading this training lesson on features.

01:29:26   Quickly arrange today's tasks with plan your day.

01:29:30   So there's a feature called plan your day.

01:29:32   - Yeah, I don't, I just have a list named today.

01:29:35   That works for me.

01:29:37   - Okay.

01:29:38   - But you can, like, if you had a lot of things do

01:29:40   in today, you could like bring certain things over

01:29:43   to that different view.

01:29:44   - Okay.

01:29:45   So here's my question for you, Steven, and be honest.

01:29:48   Is it one of those apps that when you use it on iOS,

01:29:50   It looks kind of weird and web-appy?

01:29:54   Or does it feel like an actual native app?

01:29:56   Yes.

01:29:57   It looks weird?

01:29:58   It looks cross-platformy, but other than, I guess, the iPad cursor support stuff, like

01:30:04   click and drag and drag and drop, it feels native, but it looks just like their Android

01:30:10   app.

01:30:11   The app looks the same everywhere.

01:30:12   Okay.

01:30:13   So is that similar to Todoist, right?

01:30:15   Todoist feels like a native app, but it looks nothing like iOS apps.

01:30:19   I think out of all of them, most similar to Todoist.

01:30:23   Is it true that there's a Kanban view?

01:30:26   There is.

01:30:27   So you can take any list and you can view it in Kanban view and section things off into

01:30:35   different categories or different columns, I guess.

01:30:39   So I know Todoist added that last year, I think, and TickTick has it as well.

01:30:46   So this is now...

01:30:47   So you can can you can can ban ban sub hub and tick tick.

01:30:53   So this is now a tick tick podcast.

01:30:54   Oh my gosh.

01:30:56   Multiple multiple reminders or annoying alert.

01:31:00   Yep.

01:31:01   I imagine annoying alert is like do you right?

01:31:04   I think so.

01:31:05   I haven't played with that.

01:31:06   One thing I have played with is you can customize the snooze.

01:31:11   And so if if something reminds you at 11 and you want to push it back 30 minutes, like

01:31:14   can customize those quick actions pretty easily.

01:31:19   Oh man, Matt in the Discord has just posted, you know the "Always Sunny in Philadelphia"

01:31:26   meme?

01:31:27   That is perfect.

01:31:28   This is the gang switch at Sick-Tek.

01:31:30   That is perfect.

01:31:36   This looks nice!

01:31:38   argument when we mentioned some people may be concerned that this company is trying too

01:31:45   many things and they may be distracted. You can play white noises inside.

01:31:52   I just, me and you hit the same part of the website at the exact same time. I was like

01:31:58   hang on a minute. Why is there a white noise feature in this

01:32:02   application? It's for the Pomodoro timer.

01:32:05   Those two things would go together because Pomodoro is about focusing

01:32:10   intently on work for a set period of time and you're supposed to leave the

01:32:13   timer up viewable to you I believe and so having white noise kind of makes

01:32:17   sense you would pair them together right I'm gonna focus 15-20 minutes on this

01:32:22   one project I will now put on white noise to help me focus I understand why

01:32:26   you would put those two things together I just don't know if it needs it but if

01:32:31   If you want to be the one-stop shop for somebody's productivity,

01:32:36   a timer is not a huge overhead of resources to put into the application, right?

01:32:42   Right. So this app wants to be like a centralized dashboard for all kinds of productivity, I guess.

01:32:50   Tasks, events, and everything in the middle of that.

01:32:53   Yeah, you can even keep notes in it. But again, if you don't want any of that stuff and you turn

01:32:57   it off you don't you don't see like the shell of those features anywhere which

01:33:01   which I like. Since you guys seem so interested in that there is import

01:33:04   function from Todoist, from Microsoft to do, from Wunderlist, from OmniFocus, from

01:33:12   Toodleoo, and from Ico. Wunderlist, which is dead like that's gone now. All of

01:33:19   those import features never work as good as you know. I hope they will but yeah I I

01:33:24   I just end up taking an hour and just rebuilding from scratch.

01:33:30   But there you go.

01:33:31   I've been really happy with it over the last month or so.

01:33:34   Oh, it's brought up in the Discord.

01:33:36   It also has start dates, which Todoist famously does not have.

01:33:40   So if you're one that needs a span on a task, like I can do this Wednesday through Friday,

01:33:45   but it's due Friday, you can do that in TickTick.

01:33:49   I don't work that way, but if you do, it's there.

01:33:53   updates are also called defer. In omnifocus. In different applications, in different systems.

01:33:59   Or duration. But why are we only discovering this service

01:34:04   in 2021? It's kind of been on my radar for a while,

01:34:08   but one day I was like, I had real work to do that I didn't want to do, and I switched.

01:34:13   I know I heard this before because MKBHD mentioned it in a bunch of videos.

01:34:18   He always talks about it, and so much so that even in the App Store page, like in the first

01:34:22   sentence they reference him like I'm sure he's sent them a ton of business

01:34:25   and I think in my mind I've always thought of tick-tick as a good Android

01:34:31   option and I've never thought to look at it yeah all right well I've downloaded

01:34:37   it I mean I guess I'm gonna start playing around with it yeah I'd be

01:34:41   interested to know what y'all we all think I gotta try it

01:34:45   I'm setting an only focus task to check out Tiktok. I think that's it.

01:34:52   If you want to find links to the stuff we spoke about head on over to the

01:34:58   website relay.fm/connected/338. While you're there you can send us an

01:35:06   email with feedback or follow-up. You can become a member, get connected pro that

01:35:13   That is a longer ad-free version of the show we do each and every week.

01:35:17   This week we talked about the right place to put the dock in macOS.

01:35:22   We talked about the time we saw an iPhone X before it was released and weird art installation

01:35:27   in Chicago.

01:35:28   It's pretty good.

01:35:29   Oh, and we gave a critical breakdown of the System Preferences iconography in macOS.

01:35:34   Yes.

01:35:35   It was a very busy pre-show this week.

01:35:38   So go check that out.

01:35:40   You can find all of us online.

01:35:42   You can find Federico on Twitter as vitiici, V-I-T-I-C-C-I.

01:35:47   He is the editor-in-chief of MaxStories.net.

01:35:50   Federico, I'm looking forward to reading your iOS 14.5 coverage.

01:35:56   When that ships, whenever that ships.

01:35:58   75,000 words.

01:36:00   Well, no, but it's not going to be a short one.

01:36:04   Yeah.

01:36:05   Of course it's not.

01:36:06   Yeah.

01:36:07   Okay.

01:36:08   Federico, I do have a question for you.

01:36:11   If you woke up and you were suddenly wealthy enough you didn't have to work anymore,

01:36:17   was the first thing you would do?

01:36:19   Not like what would you do ultimately like buy a boat and live on the beach but like

01:36:22   first thing in the morning you get a text message from your bank saying you don't have

01:36:25   to work anymore, like what would you do?

01:36:27   Why would the bank be the person to tell you this?

01:36:30   Just what the bank tells me.

01:36:33   I feel like if you become independently wealthy your banker texts you.

01:36:36   Just like hey.

01:36:37   Okay.

01:36:38   Alright.

01:36:39   Fine.

01:36:40   Alright.

01:36:41   Like, would you expect me to be like, original and say something that...

01:36:45   No, no, it'd be you.

01:36:47   Well, okay, so here's the thing...

01:36:50   Like, like what I would do?

01:36:51   Yeah.

01:36:52   I would, I would probably pay off my house, like, first thing.

01:36:55   I'm gonna be boring and save, like, if I were...

01:36:59   So like, totally rich, like Bill Gates rich?

01:37:03   Yeah, like, you don't ever have to worry about money again,

01:37:06   and your grandchildren won't ever have to worry about money.

01:37:08   All right, cool.

01:37:09   So the first thing I would do is I would just buy an apartment that,

01:37:14   like the dream apartment in Rome. Right?

01:37:18   So like I would get the kind of house that like if I was a millionaire,

01:37:22   I would buy in Rome. Yeah. Well,

01:37:24   it's like there's a list of things that I would do right away.

01:37:27   I would say the house is the first one.

01:37:31   And then I would probably

01:37:37   get a new car. Like, I wanna... actually I want to get a bunch of cars. So you bought

01:37:45   an apartment with no garage. No, no, no, obviously there has to be a garage. There has to be

01:37:49   a garage for like... Jerry Seinfeld lives in an apartment and he has lots of cars. You

01:37:54   can make it work. And a 20th anniversary Mac. Yep, you can make it work. Like, I wanna,

01:37:58   I wanna get, I wanna get a... also the apartment has to have like a, like a movie theater/giant

01:38:07   game room. It's a big apartment. So it's more, I guess it has to be a house. But the problem

01:38:11   with living in a house is like I'm scared of not having neighbors. So like it can be

01:38:17   a house but there has to be someone nearby. Or I can have my own 24/7 security. There

01:38:25   you go. There is also a dream of mine. Like get super rich and have like custom security

01:38:30   around. Bodyguards. Yeah, like bodyguards but also security. But like the front gate,

01:38:35   always somebody, but there also has to be, like I thought about this, there also has

01:38:40   to be, these are the things I think about, there has to be like, when you think about

01:38:44   it, security for security, because what if the security guy eventually gets jealous and

01:38:49   wants to kill you? So like there has to be somebody keeping an eye on the security guy.

01:38:54   So like you gotta have like a two prong system for, if you want to have like three prongs,

01:39:00   what about the second prong? What if prong one and prong two, they gang up?

01:39:05   What I'm saying is, yeah, that's the concern.

01:39:07   So like you gotta have, you gotta have some kind of layering system for your own security

01:39:13   people because those people may also be out to get you if you're super rich.

01:39:19   So the house, but there has to be somebody, someone like, I don't want to, like, what

01:39:23   if something happens to me in the middle of the night and I start screaming and nobody

01:39:27   hears me like that is not good.

01:39:30   So either neighbors or multiple levels of security.

01:39:35   Then I will...

01:39:36   So hang on a second, hang on a second.

01:39:39   It's a busy morning.

01:39:40   I just need to draw a line here.

01:39:45   So Federico, what would you do if you got a text message from your bank that said you

01:39:50   are wealthy?

01:39:52   I might wake up in the night screaming and who's gonna be there?

01:39:59   I just want to make sure we're staying on track here.

01:40:02   [laughter]

01:40:07   You know, the things we think about.

01:40:09   I'm just trying to contextualize the thing.

01:40:12   No, it's good.

01:40:14   So the house, the house, then a beach house, like my own beach house, then a bunch of cars.

01:40:23   Then security?

01:40:25   than security. Like I want to go visit my friends like a manager and Maserati and I

01:40:30   want to walk in there and be like, give me five cars and I'm going to pay cash. I don't

01:40:34   care. I'm super rich and I'm going to buy five Maserati cars just like that. You wouldn't

01:40:40   have the cash. Well, it's in the bank account. Well, that's not cash. I mean, I got the money.

01:40:46   Just paying for it. Yeah. He's not taking a loan out. He's paying for it. Or I could

01:40:50   have like a bunch of duffel bags that my own security guy takes like it's paying cash.

01:40:57   I don't think they would take that. Why not? Right? Because what like they're just ready

01:41:04   to accept like 1.5 million euro like no one can accept that type of cash. You're just

01:41:10   having it in a backpack and be like here you go. Whatever that's gonna be a wire transfer

01:41:15   for that. And lastly, for like the morning of, I will probably acquire my own dog park.

01:41:23   Like I'm gonna have my own facility for letting dogs play and just hang around. Like I wanna

01:41:31   have my own dog park. Just a garden? It's not enough? In your house that you're buying?

01:41:37   Well, no, it has to be, well, it can be, I gotta decide, it can be by the house or it

01:41:43   can be elsewhere. Also what I wanna have, like I don't have, I didn't go to university,

01:41:51   right? But I wanna end up... I wanna buy a degree. I wanna buy, no, I want my, I want

01:41:58   Italy to like, because I'm so rich, right? And I'm so important, like I wanna be one

01:42:03   of those people that receives a degree without going to university. Right. You should just

01:42:10   buy a wing of like, I'm going to buy a wing of yours.

01:42:13   Like now what you're going to give me a degree or what?

01:42:16   It's like, yeah, yeah. Honor an honorary doctorate and being wealthy.

01:42:19   And they give you like when they do those ceremonies, they give you like that,

01:42:23   that fancy coat or something, the fancy hat and everything.

01:42:28   I want to have that.

01:42:29   You should, I mean, look, you come from a, does Viterbo have a university?

01:42:33   They do.

01:42:34   You, you've got to try and get, tell me with the,

01:42:38   with like the dean of Viterbo University because you've got to be one of the most world renowned

01:42:44   people from Viterbo. Sure. Right? I guess. You've got to try and learn who's the journalism

01:42:49   professor at Viterbo University. Well I'm not a journalist right? Right? Try and get

01:42:54   that person and find them on LinkedIn. I gotta log into LinkedIn again. Yeah, find the journalism

01:43:00   professor at Viterbo University and get your honorary degree. Look, if you're that rich,

01:43:06   someone can log into LinkedIn for you. You don't have to see that again.

01:43:09   No, I'm talking about he should do this part now. Like this is, this is the thing in current

01:43:13   day Federico's life. Get, get your paper son. Like the actual paper, which says you got

01:43:19   a degree on it.

01:43:21   Uh, yeah. So that's a busy morning for finding out you're a billionaire, I guess.

01:43:29   It's very productive.

01:43:30   There's a bunch of extras that we can talk about in the future. Like having my own tattoo

01:43:35   studio which is also an investment that I like I'm dreaming to like I have you know

01:43:41   I own the tattoo place now hiring hiring a private chef and then firing the person immediately

01:43:48   saying I cook better than you.

01:43:51   A bunch of things like that.

01:43:59   Is it the University of Naples Federico the second?

01:44:02   This is what they've dug up in the Discord.

01:44:03   called the Tuscia University because it's the local area where Viterbo and

01:44:09   nearby towns are located. It's called Tuscia, T-U-S-C-I-A. I believe it's called

01:44:17   University of Tuscia, something like that. But it's in Viterbo, yes.

01:44:23   It's actually very nice.

01:44:24   You've got a 5001 arrow trying to go to a website.

01:44:27   It doesn't seem good.

01:44:29   Maybe you should have started the day with a donation to the university.

01:44:33   Maybe we just brought their website down just by everyone.

01:44:35   Maybe we just Google it again.

01:44:37   You can find Myke online, @IMYKE on Twitter.

01:44:41   Myke hosts a bunch of shows here on Relay FM and he hosts the cool kids keyboard club

01:44:47   most Fridays at Myke.live over on Twitch.

01:44:50   Yep.

01:44:51   Big keyboard energy over there.

01:44:52   Big keyboard energy.

01:44:54   You can find me online as @ismh and I write over at 512pixels.net.

01:44:59   souls.net. I want to tell you about another show on relay FM that you may enjoy and that

01:45:04   is make do. You don't have to monetize your hobbies. But if you want to make do is ready

01:45:11   to be your cheerleader. Listen as you hobby with Tiff Arment and Julia Scott at relay

01:45:16   dot FM slash make do or search for make do wherever you get your shows. I'd like to thank

01:45:22   the sponsors of this episode of connected. They are Pingdom express VPN and delete me

01:45:29   until next week guys. Say goodbye to cheerio. Bye y'all.