330: You Can’t Eat an App


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:08   Hello and welcome to Connected, episode 330.

00:00:12   It's made possible by our sponsors AirBuddy, Bombas, and Pingdom.

00:00:18   My name is Stephen Hackett and I am joined by Mr. Federico Vittucci.

00:00:22   Hello, Stephen Hackett. How are you?

00:00:23   I'm good, Federico Vittucci. How are you?

00:00:26   I'm very good. Thank you.

00:00:27   That's good.

00:00:28   Myke Hurley is here. Myke Hurley, how are you?

00:00:30   Happy birthday

00:00:33   Thanks. Happy birthday

00:00:35   28th of January, Steven's birthday

00:00:38   I'm old now. Mm-hmm. No

00:00:43   older

00:00:45   older yeah, I

00:00:47   Had to fill out some paperwork recently and it was one of those things where they you have to check like the age bracket

00:00:54   you're in and

00:00:55   So I'm turning 35 this week and the one before me was like it was like

00:01:02   26 to

00:01:05   34

00:01:06   You went up in the drop-down

00:01:08   Yeah, the next one was 35 to like 44 and I like I guess I'm getting ready to be that that checkmark

00:01:15   You got to get on tik-tok it's the only way to reverse this

00:01:24   It's the Benjamin Button of social media networks.

00:01:29   Time to get on TikTok.

00:01:30   Okay, what would I do on TikTok?

00:01:34   You would show off like weird things about old computers.

00:01:37   No, you gotta do the dances, man.

00:01:39   You gotta do the dances too.

00:01:41   The dances too, naturally.

00:01:42   Do the dances whilst like opening an iBook.

00:01:46   You gotta do those videos where like there's like music and you're dressed one way and

00:01:52   then you do like a movement and you're dressed much fancier. Yeah. I go from one black t-shirt

00:01:59   to another. Yeah, I kinda like that. No, you should do old Mac TikToks, you know, because

00:02:05   then like the kids will be like, "What is that?" You could blow their minds of old technology,

00:02:10   you know. Or you should do the switch where like you're wearing a prompt t-shirt and then

00:02:14   you do the switch and you have a connected t-shirt. Same t-shirt. That technology should

00:02:19   be colorful ones. It's the same t-shirt. We should put that shirt back on sale.

00:02:25   Oh, Steven just made a decision without consulting anybody else in the group and now he said

00:02:29   it. We have some follow-up very exciting stuff. Last week Federico challenged me to name Apple

00:02:36   hardware features that were quickly reverted. I came up with none but we have one from a

00:02:43   listener Thomas sent in, what about the buttonless iPod shuffle? And they went

00:02:49   back and said, "Oh hey, turns out people like the buttons." And they put the

00:02:54   buttons back on the fourth gen like two years later. So let's start off with the

00:02:59   iPod shuffle. This was our first generation shuffle. It's based on the

00:03:03   concept that shuffling is a wonderful way to listen to your music. And we could

00:03:07   make a really affordable player without a display that just shuffled your songs

00:03:12   and was super easy to use and it's been a really big hit. The second generation

00:03:17   was even better. It was dramatically smaller, it had a clip, it had these ring

00:03:21   buttons on it that was really easy to use. The third generation, we took off the

00:03:27   buttons, added voice over so you could listen to your songs and added playlists.

00:03:33   Now it could talk you through your playlists and you could pick a playlist.

00:03:35   but people clearly miss the buttons, right? So they love the buttons of the

00:03:42   second generation but they love voiceover and having playlists on their

00:03:45   iPod from the third. So what are we gonna do? Let's make the best of both. The new

00:03:51   iPod shuffle. It's even smaller than the second generation. It's got buttons,

00:03:55   voiceover, and playlists. And it's really small.

00:04:02   Myke can you tell us about your exciting Salesforce news? I've been acquired by

00:04:08   Salesforce. Oh no. Goodbye everybody they just wanted just me. No they've joined

00:04:14   the Unicode consortium as a voting member so maybe now they'll find Slack

00:04:19   will finally update their emoji. So there aren't many companies that are like

00:04:25   voting members of the Unicode consortium which means that they have the ability

00:04:29   to say yes and no to different emoji. Lots of different companies are part of the consortium,

00:04:35   but Salesforce now join Adobe, Apple, Facebook, Google, IBM, Netflix, Microsoft, and a company

00:04:41   whose logo I literally cannot discern. It looks like a chipmunk with headphones on. I don't

00:04:47   understand what it is. So yeah, they are now in that. They get voting rights. And I hope that

00:04:55   that means that they're gonna, I don't know,

00:04:58   focus on emoji a little bit better?

00:04:59   - One would hope that they pay attention.

00:05:03   - One would hope, one would hope.

00:05:05   - I wonder if acquiring Slack is what led to this.

00:05:07   I'm trying to think of what else Salesforce owns

00:05:10   that would benefit from a high power stake in emoji.

00:05:15   - Well, it's not just emoji.

00:05:17   It's all text and computers.

00:05:20   - But no one cares about text and computers.

00:05:21   Everyone cares about emoji.

00:05:23   I'm a youth.

00:05:24   I think it's companies that are voting members and even companies that are on the consortium

00:05:30   have some kind of vested interest in communication.

00:05:34   I think that's the reason.

00:05:35   That makes sense.

00:05:36   And Jeremy.

00:05:37   And Jeremy.

00:05:38   The...

00:05:39   Creator of emoji.

00:05:41   The creator of emoji.

00:05:42   He only gets half a vote though, this chart tells me, which I think is a travesty.

00:05:46   I think Jeremy should get three votes.

00:05:48   Which half?

00:05:49   To everybody's one vote.

00:05:53   beard half. Whoa, that's a... you've crossed into a new level of dad jokes in your advanced age.

00:05:59   System updates! Yesterday Apple released iOS 14.4, watchOS 7 point something, I don't know,

00:06:10   7.4? 7.3? I think they're off by a number. 7.3. 7.3, and 14.4 also came out for the HomePod

00:06:20   and the HomePod Mini. What is new in this update?

00:06:24   There's the HomePod Mini integration with the iPhone.

00:06:28   There's the better handoff support in that you can

00:06:32   more quickly and easily hand off music from your iPhone to the HomePod by

00:06:37   placing the iPhone over it and you get that

00:06:39   special UI on the lock screen. I haven't tried it because I

00:06:43   don't have a HomePod around anymore, but it looks like I'm not really...

00:06:50   And I think Myke agrees, I'm not really sure why this has to be...

00:06:53   Like, why this exists.

00:06:56   Mostly because it just feels like...

00:06:59   I don't know, I just struggle to imagine personally the use case for this.

00:07:04   Like, isn't it easier to just ask Siri to play something?

00:07:07   Yeah, it's like, what's the thinking? Like, I look at my phone and I'm like,

00:07:10   "Oh yeah, music!" Right? It's like, it's a strange thing, like, to do,

00:07:17   to be like, "Oh, you're near a HomePod mini?"

00:07:19   "Oh, look, I just happened to walk near a HomePod." I personally am pretty intentional

00:07:29   with the music I want to listen to. And so like when I decide to put on music, I either

00:07:34   ask an assistant or I use Airplay or I put on headphones. It's this like, and even the

00:07:42   way they show it off in advertisements, in commercials, like these people who just realize,

00:07:46   "Oh, I just happen to be in your home pod. Let me hand it off."

00:07:49   It's like, how big a home you have that you can just so happen to casually walk by a smart speaker?

00:07:56   Speaking of your music choices, I've been getting almost daily reviews of your Spotify playlists.

00:08:04   Daily? Daily reviews?

00:08:05   Yep. Yep. Having listened to this show over the last couple of weeks, Adina has moved back to

00:08:13   Spotify and has found your playlist and has been listening to them. I've been told that

00:08:18   they're very good.

00:08:20   And which ones?

00:08:22   Like your best of 2021 is one of them, I think. And there's a couple of us. Or best of 2020.

00:08:28   I don't know. I haven't looked right. Like I'm not the one doing this. And the overall,

00:08:36   you've been pegged overall as having musical tastes. She told me that sits somewhere between

00:08:41   indie rock and emo music.

00:08:42   and I'm like yeah that's fair. Absolutely. You nailed it. On the money. That is me. Hello.

00:08:52   Oh well, that's a plot twist as well. Like, very nice. I didn't know that she was using it and

00:09:00   that she was checking out my playlists. I'm very happy. I should make more of those public. I think

00:09:05   I think I only have two. Best of 2020 and all-time favorites, maybe. Yeah, I have a

00:09:12   bunch more. That's cool. Thank you for telling me that.

00:09:16   I have an incredibly interesting real-time follow-up.

00:09:21   That logo that I said looked like a chipmunk in the small image that I saw is the logo

00:09:27   of the Sultanate of Oman. Wait, which is the country?

00:09:33   Yeah.

00:09:34   What?

00:09:35   What?

00:09:36   They are on the Unicode Consortium and help you and help approve emoji.

00:09:43   I'll include an article from BuzzFeed which is wonderfully titled "Why is this random

00:09:48   golf country helping pick your emoji?"

00:09:51   I'll put it in the show notes.

00:09:52   Wow.

00:09:53   It just, to my mind, it looked like a chipmunk.

00:09:55   I still don't know exactly what the logo is meant to represent.

00:09:58   I did not intend to offend anybody.

00:10:01   I think you owe an entire country an apology. I just did. Alright, I'm sorry everybody.

00:10:05   It's not a country, it's a Sultan. Unless it is a chipmunk. The royal chipmunk.

00:10:10   I don't think it is a chipmunk. In any case we were talking about the software updates.

00:10:17   I don't think there's anything much else to cover in iOS 14.4. I mean, there's support for

00:10:25   scanning smaller QR codes in the camera, and you can now properly categorize Bluetooth accessories.

00:10:34   This is very much like a niche feature, but sometimes I've heard from some people saying

00:10:40   my car stereo unit does not get recognized as a car Bluetooth device, because my phone thinks

00:10:48   it's a pair of headphones. And so, for example, you don't get certain integrations like syncing

00:10:54   contacts, for example, or if you're using Spotify, having the car view in Spotify.

00:10:58   And so now in Settings, when you tap on a Bluetooth accessory, you can classify it. You can

00:11:06   say this is a headphone, this is a hearing aid, or this is part of a car Bluetooth unit, so you can

00:11:14   properly say, you know, you can properly categorize each Bluetooth device that you connect to, which

00:11:20   which is nice. I checked mine and they were all properly categorized, so I don't have this issue.

00:11:25   I think this will particularly help for Bluetooth accessories that you want to put in an old car or in an old truck.

00:11:33   And you know those adapters that you buy from Amazon? Now you can categorize them from Bluetooth settings.

00:11:39   I don't think there's anything else worth covering in iOS 14.4.

00:11:42   In watchOS 7.3 there's the new Unity watch face, which is inspired by the Pan African flag

00:11:50   and there's also, I believe, a special Series 6 watch and special watch bands that are coming out.

00:11:57   Yeah, it's really interesting. They've actually made an actual watch that they're selling,

00:12:04   which has an engraving on the back which says "Black Unity", which I don't think they've done

00:12:09   something like this for a cause before? Like I can't think of even product red or something.

00:12:17   So it's cool. Very cool. And they're giving Apple's donate and proceeds to six global

00:12:22   organizations to promote equality and civil rights.

00:12:25   And the watch band looks amazing. Like I really love the combination of the three different

00:12:31   colors, the black, green and red. It's really, really lovely.

00:12:33   It's nicely done. Yeah.

00:12:36   Myke, I see in the notes that you put in a comment about the AirPods Max battery issue

00:12:41   and I wanted to comment on these as well. I have been noticing battery drain of my AirPods

00:12:49   Max headphones as well. A few days ago I charged them and then yesterday I removed them from

00:12:55   the case and it said 40%. It's like, wait, how? How is this possible?

00:13:01   I'm convinced at this point that the proximity sensors aren't working correctly.

00:13:05   Yeah, they seem to be winning a fight between those and whatever sensors and the magnets.

00:13:11   I think so. Yeah.

00:13:12   Um, there was nothing in the release notes that suggested there would be any help,

00:13:18   but I'm just hoping. Um, and I also, I've still been having some issues with my HomePod pair,

00:13:23   with my Apple TV. And so I've updated both the Apple TV and the HomePod pair in the hope that it

00:13:29   will, uh, fix that. Where it's just like, sometimes just like, oh, this just won't work. I was like,

00:13:34   okay fine I'll just use my TV speakers.

00:13:38   He just forgets about it?

00:13:40   Yeah.

00:13:41   You used to be my friend and now you're not.

00:13:43   Remember with the iPhone I think it was the 4 Apple had proximity issues where the screen

00:13:50   wouldn't go to sleep when you put it up against your face and they fixed it with software

00:13:53   so.

00:13:54   Was that a problem with the white model or am I remembering something completely different?

00:13:59   It was rumored I think that that's why the white one was so far behind that maybe some

00:14:04   camera issues, but it was an issue on the the standard black model as well.

00:14:09   So I think it was mentioned during the Attenagate keynote is like, oh, we're also tracking these

00:14:13   other things.

00:14:14   One thing about 14.4 just before we move on, it does include some security updates that

00:14:21   address a pretty potentially nasty things.

00:14:24   I don't know how much of this was actually out in the world.

00:14:27   Apple often doesn't give detailed notes on this until after the updates been out for

00:14:31   a little while.

00:14:33   So they Apple hasn't said too much yet about what exactly got fixed.

00:14:37   But there were some issues with the kernel and with web kit that meant someone could

00:14:42   make code execute on your phone by just visiting a website, which is the wrong website, which

00:14:47   is bad.

00:14:48   All right, we have a bunch of stuff to talk about today.

00:14:50   But let's take a break here.

00:14:52   And thank our first sponsor.

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00:16:59   a 20% discount. That's air buddy.app/connected. Be quick and grab that 20% discount. Our thanks

00:17:07   to everybody for their support of the show and relay FM. There were some changes at the

00:17:14   Top of Apple this week were announced a couple of days ago. Myke, do you want to walk us

00:17:19   through who is being shuffled around?

00:17:21   Yeah, so Tim Cook's gone.

00:17:24   Oh, okay.

00:17:25   Eddie Q's in.

00:17:26   Eddie.

00:17:27   We're starting over, baby. There's going to be music and open shirt. No, Dan Riccio is

00:17:35   moving on from his role as Senior Vice President of Hardware Engineering to focus on a "new

00:17:43   project and reporting to Tim Cook directly. Did I ever tell you that, did I ever tell

00:17:48   you that Riccio means two very different things in Italian? No. Like, as an Italian word?

00:17:54   So Riccio either means curly or hedgehog. Could it mean both? Well, no. No. It's like,

00:18:02   it's the same word as two very different meanings. I mean, like if you had like a curly hedgehog.

00:18:06   Sure, you could have that. Like a Riccio-Rico? You could have a Riccio-Rico. Dan Curley sounds

00:18:11   like my sort of name. Like if I were to have like a fictional name I would be called Dan Curley.

00:18:18   It's not far away from my brother's name to be honest. Exactly. It's just one one one

00:18:23   letter difference. Wait your brother's name is Pan Curley? Yes, weird really. It's weird.

00:18:28   We're half brothers. Obviously everyone's going "Apple Car!" right? Like that's that's the thinking.

00:18:37   I don't think it's that. No. Because I don't think Apple will make a car. I don't think it's going to

00:18:46   happen. If there's ever going to be an Apple car, I don't believe they will manufacture it. Like,

00:18:52   that's more what I mean. Well, it's still an Apple car. Right, but then they don't need a hardware

00:18:57   engineering vice president so much to oversee the making of the vehicle, right? Because they'll work

00:19:04   equip a partner. But anyway, whether they do or don't, I don't think it's this. I think

00:19:08   it's something to do with AR or some kind of wearable project. That's where I reckon

00:19:13   it's going to be because he's probably doing this already, right? Like whatever Apple's

00:19:18   making. And if they think that this is going to be an important thing for the company going

00:19:22   into the future, they might want to spin it out and kind of have somebody overseeing this

00:19:27   whole different effort. I really don't think that Dan Riccio is moving on to whatever the

00:19:33   car project is because this would also be like the 17th person to run this this mythical

00:19:38   car project.

00:19:40   And he was actually the first person to run it and then it moved to Bob Mansfield.

00:19:44   Oh really?

00:19:45   Yeah, so Renee Ritchie tweeted this that initially it was under Dan Curley and then it was under

00:19:52   Bob Mansfield.

00:19:53   Remember he came out of retirement to run this for a while?

00:19:56   And now it's under the guy from Google.

00:20:01   G.N. Andrea.

00:20:02   G.N. Andrea, that guy.

00:20:04   Yep, G.N. Andrea.

00:20:05   But I think, so because this is the argument, right?

00:20:08   So G.N. Andrea was a software person.

00:20:11   So you know, if they were building a car, G.N. Andrea probably wouldn't be the person

00:20:17   to run the entire effort.

00:20:20   They could be a hardware software effort.

00:20:21   Nevertheless, look, maybe it's a car.

00:20:23   I just don't think it's that.

00:20:25   I don't think it is for a totally different reason.

00:20:29   So I want to read you a quote from Dan Curley in this press release.

00:20:34   Please call him by his real name because it's so confusing to me now.

00:20:37   Dan Riccio.

00:20:38   Thank you.

00:20:39   "After 23 years of leading our product design or hardware engineering teams, culminating

00:20:45   with our biggest and most ambitious product year ever."

00:20:48   So we're talking about, I guess, 2020 with the M1 Max and everything else.

00:20:52   "It's the right time for a change.

00:20:54   Next up, I'm looking forward to doing what I love most, focusing all my time and energy

00:20:58   Apple and creating something new and wonderful that I couldn't be more excited about. I don't think we would even know about this

00:21:05   Let alone in this these terms if it were the car

00:21:11   I think that that is still I think Apple still treats that as more of a secret than it actually is

00:21:17   and

00:21:18   Stay they did make

00:21:20   Moves in this before but I don't know how public I don't remember how probably yeah

00:21:26   Yeah, they hired some people, they laid some people off,

00:21:27   they had self-driving cars registered

00:21:30   in a couple of states.

00:21:31   But this, it feels like the way that Tim Cook,

00:21:36   Tim Cook for a long time always talked about health sensors,

00:21:38   right, and the watch got a bunch of those.

00:21:40   And now he's talking about how AR and these other things

00:21:45   can change the way we work and learn and play.

00:21:48   This just feels like Apple winking at what's already

00:21:51   kind of been floating out there.

00:21:53   Maybe they're just giving this guy a chance to say something

00:21:56   because he is sticking around and he's not being promoted

00:22:00   to the sacred halls of Apple fellowship,

00:22:03   like Phil Schiller is.

00:22:05   But I don't know, like him saying he's really excited

00:22:07   about it and talking about this new thing he's gonna do,

00:22:11   that's very unusual for Apple.

00:22:13   And I think it kind of fits in my mind,

00:22:15   at least a little bit with the way Tim Cook

00:22:17   has talked about some of this stuff.

00:22:19   - So I have a conspiracy, a fun conspiracy theory

00:22:21   to share in a minute.

00:22:22   But my personal theory on this as well

00:22:26   is this might actually be more about who they're bringing up

00:22:29   into this role than what Riccio's going on to do.

00:22:33   So John Turnus is going to be taking on the hardware

00:22:36   engineering role.

00:22:38   You will remember John from doing

00:22:40   the majority of the presentation of the M1 Macs

00:22:44   from the last Apple keynote.

00:22:46   Yep, he also introduced the iMac Pro and the Mac Pro.

00:22:50   And so there was an article that Mark Gurman wrote a while ago kind of detailing the future

00:22:57   of Apple executives.

00:22:59   And John Turnus has spoken about very kindly in this.

00:23:03   Like at the level of there are people inside of Apple that think he could be CEO one day.

00:23:08   So I my belief really is that they're doing some maybe potentially.

00:23:15   I mean look it could be as simple as they know how important Turnus is.

00:23:20   They want to give Turnus a promotion, so they're asking Riccio to go run something else.

00:23:24   Which are moves they can make.

00:23:27   Yeah, it definitely could be, and that doesn't say anything bad about Riccio.

00:23:31   It says good things about both of them.

00:23:33   Right, they've both--

00:23:34   He's been doing that job for a very long time.

00:23:36   You can't have the same people doing the same things forever.

00:23:39   Sometimes you want to move stuff around.

00:23:40   And it's kind of funny, because Turnus has actually been at Apple for nearly as long as Dan Riccio has.

00:23:46   I had no idea he'd been there 20 years.

00:23:48   20 years?

00:23:49   He looks so young. How old was he when he started?

00:23:52   Maybe it was his first job.

00:23:53   It could have been. You know, maybe he was coming in as a toddler and designing the iPhone 4.

00:23:59   But yeah, he seems very well liked. And the thing that I think about is the Mac stuff that we've

00:24:06   heard about in recent years that we all like, the Mac Roundtable, iMac Pro, Mac Pro, M1, really like

00:24:15   even the Intel updates we've had over the last couple of years that have been good.

00:24:19   Like we have, I think, applied those good feelings to Ternus.

00:24:24   I think he owns a lot of that, right?

00:24:25   He seems, I mean, that's his job, right?

00:24:27   He's the hardware guy.

00:24:29   My feeling is, and I've, is that Ternus really has worked very hard at this Mac Renaissance

00:24:37   that we're currently seeing, a phrase that I'm stealing from my cohost on Mac Power Users.

00:24:42   this Mac Renaissance is something that he has been very involved in.

00:24:49   And now if he's stepping up over even more hardware and over a broader organization,

00:24:57   that's exciting to me that that enthusiasm he has.

00:24:59   When you watch him, it's almost infectious to watch him talk about this stuff.

00:25:02   You can just tell he just loves hardware.

00:25:05   That's exciting for me to see that be applied to other parts of the company.

00:25:09   But selfishly I hope that the Mac keeps getting that same enthusiasm because I think the last

00:25:14   couple of years it's really been in a good place.

00:25:17   My conspiracy theory, which I don't believe, but it did pop into my head so I thought I

00:25:22   would share it, is that Riccio has been the head of hardware engineering during a tricky

00:25:27   time for some products, especially the Mac.

00:25:30   And all of the rumors are pointing towards these huge changes, like 180 changes to the

00:25:34   Mac, that maybe they're moving Riccio away because he did a bad job and Taunus is going

00:25:38   gonna make it all better for us. So like a punishment? I mean maybe. I'm not saying I

00:25:50   super believe it but there is something particularly strange that if all of these rumors are true

00:25:57   the timing is interesting. Yeah well this is it. We're getting rumors of like Apple

00:26:02   basically wiping out four years of products right and like pretend they didn't exist and

00:26:08   And then at the same time, the guy who runs that division is moving away from that division,

00:26:13   and then this guy that we've only really started to hear about recently, at the same time that

00:26:18   things seem to be improving, is taking over the whole hardware engineering division.

00:26:24   So what you're saying is, Richio is a huge USB-C fan, and hates keyboard travel.

00:26:28   Just a big USB-C fan, hates MagSafe.

00:26:31   Loves the Touch Bar.

00:26:32   He's the Touch Bar guy!

00:26:34   Oh no!

00:26:35   Okay, so this was part of it.

00:26:37   The touch bar was part of what led me to this because people say, "Oh, now Johnny Ive's

00:26:44   gone, it's going to get better again."

00:26:46   And I don't believe this because at the time, we were all saying Johnny Ive had checked

00:26:52   out and was designing the building.

00:26:54   So I don't think Ive had really much to do with the last few years of products at Apple.

00:27:03   It seemed like he had kind of moved on to doing other things.

00:27:07   And then also, I was responsible for all the good stuff that's coming back too.

00:27:10   So I don't know.

00:27:15   What I'm saying is timing is interesting.

00:27:17   It is.

00:27:18   It's very interesting.

00:27:19   But I'm not going to hang my hat on this as like, "Aha!

00:27:21   I know what's happened here."

00:27:22   Yeah.

00:27:23   And I mean, I know you're not marrying yourself to that theory, but one hole I do want to

00:27:29   poke in it is that if we are getting ready to have new notebooks at WWDC that

00:27:34   have MagSafe and a bunch of ports like they're not starting that today now that

00:27:40   Riccio is out the door. Right like this it's a long process to get there but it

00:27:46   is very interesting and the timing is fascinating. How long has Ternus been in

00:27:51   charge like actually really in charge of Mac hardware? Yeah I don't know. Right and

00:27:55   And that could have been in the last few years.

00:27:58   And it may have been that like, I mean, he was present at the round table.

00:28:01   I think like, I wouldn't be surprised if like when they decided they were going

00:28:04   to do that round table, maybe they made some leadership changes in the Mac

00:28:07   hardware team, because if you're going to change direction, probably makes sense

00:28:12   to have fresh direction, maybe.

00:28:16   Right.

00:28:16   I think, you know, if you feel like, oh, we're going to change everything

00:28:19   to be like, we'll get, but we had the same people run it.

00:28:21   I don't know.

00:28:21   It's fascinating.

00:28:23   Isn't it?

00:28:23   Mm-hmm.

00:28:24   It's cool though, because I get a good feel from from John Ternus.

00:28:27   He seems like a nice guy. Yeah.

00:28:29   Uh, I like his presentations and stuff.

00:28:32   So, um, I'm excited. Like, I'm, you know, this is like another reason

00:28:37   to to be excited about hardware this year.

00:28:40   Like maybe it's going to get shaken up a little bit more.

00:28:44   And over the next couple of years. So it's cool.

00:28:47   He's pretty buff. I'm looking at this PR picture of him.

00:28:49   He's really good looking. He's very handsome.

00:28:52   He's very good looking.

00:28:53   That's important to me in a computer executive.

00:28:57   [laughter]

00:28:59   Steven, stop objectifying the executives, please.

00:29:03   I'm sorry.

00:29:04   He's smart too, you know.

00:29:05   Yeah.

00:29:06   We all miss Bob's man-fields.

00:29:08   Cuddliness.

00:29:09   Ruggedness.

00:29:10   One feature that came out for the Apple Watch this week, and I'm... was this part of 7.3

00:29:18   or did it come...

00:29:19   No, for some reason.

00:29:20   They just rolled it out?

00:29:21   Okay, separate.

00:29:22   it out and then there was in 7.3 it got the ability to auto download these time to walk

00:29:29   things okay you could download them manually for two days before perfect yeah so this is

00:29:38   time to walk it's a new fitness feature of the apple watch that is a 25 to about 40 minute

00:29:48   out there different lengths and they are well-known guests you know celebrities

00:29:52   telling stories about their lives and then playing playlists of music that's

00:29:59   meaningful to them and you can walk and listen to these and there's images that

00:30:05   automatically play on your Apple watch so if they're talking about maybe their

00:30:09   childhood home they grew up in maybe a picture of them as a child or the the

00:30:13   home is there. Turns your Apple watch into a very fancy keynote presentation

00:30:18   and it's it's clever I think because people like celebrities and people like

00:30:23   stories and you have to walk to hear the story. There's going to be new stories

00:30:30   rolling out through April so it seems like this is maybe a short-run program

00:30:35   like a spring program but it is part of Fitness Plus and I do wish that it kind

00:30:41   have been available to everybody. I think that would have been cool.

00:30:44   It's like a teaser for Fitness Plus. Yeah, yeah like hey if you like this check out

00:30:48   all this other stuff we have on Fitness Plus. Here's a 30-day trial or whatever

00:30:51   they have. I don't know I personally feel a little weird about having like

00:30:56   launching a feature right now that is about hey walk outside. It is weird, it is

00:31:05   weird. We can technically exercise and walk outside we're not in lockdown

00:31:11   down right now, but it's still like I personally am trying to avoid all sorts

00:31:18   of contact with anything and anyone as much as possible. Yeah, yeah. But it just

00:31:24   feels like I'm allowed to go outside but it just feels kind of weird to launch

00:31:27   this feature right now. Yeah, I completely understand what you're saying.

00:31:32   It's like here, outside exercise is allowed and kind of encouraged a bit if

00:31:38   you're on your own but it is like hey go outside but don't go outside but if you

00:31:46   do go outside Dolly Parton will tell you a story. It's so funny. So I went out for a walk

00:31:53   yesterday in my neighborhood I was planning to test his feature out I was

00:31:57   like oh this is like on Monday I was like I know I was gonna go out for a walk

00:32:00   tomorrow and I'll listen to one then and then just before I left I was like no I

00:32:07   "No, I want to listen to a podcast of my choosing."

00:32:10   So that was, I think that's probably the end of time to walk for me.

00:32:15   It's a nice idea, but it's never going to be what I choose.

00:32:21   It's like I encourage it for people if they don't have loads of podcasts that they like

00:32:27   to listen to.

00:32:28   It's good for that kind of stuff.

00:32:31   But for me it was kind of just like, I would prefer to finish this episode of The Adventure

00:32:36   his own instead, right? Like, so I'm gonna do that. I don't know, it just feels kind of

00:32:40   weird also that, hey, Shawn Mendes was paid a bunch of money to tell you a

00:32:45   story about his childhood. Like, okay, great. And they were recorded while walking

00:32:51   themselves. Oh, really? I didn't know that. Which the sound engineer in me is like

00:32:56   really, you know, trying to like piece that together. It's not actually that hard,

00:32:59   but like what if they get out of breath? Or they trip? Like, you gotta start over?

00:33:03   Are they reading? Are they just talking? So many questions! Anyways, I have not used it.

00:33:08   Well, because you can't walk.

00:33:09   I can walk short distances.

00:33:11   Well, it's not called "time to walk short distances."

00:33:14   "Time to walk to the back of the garden."

00:33:17   That's right, that's right.

00:33:18   It's just Shawn Mendes says "how you doing?" and that's it.

00:33:20   Oh, I'm at work. Sorry, Shawn.

00:33:22   I have some real-time breaking news.

00:33:27   Ooh!

00:33:28   Okay.

00:33:29   Are you ready for this?

00:33:30   Yes.

00:33:31   Yes. You can now purchase AirPods Max ear cushions individually.

00:33:37   Oh. Okay.

00:33:39   AirPods Max. How much are they?

00:33:41   Million dollars.

00:33:43   I bet 70 something.

00:33:45   Yeah.

00:33:46   Alright, let me check.

00:33:48   So this is a thing you couldn't do before? You couldn't get the...

00:33:51   No, they were listed as coming soon.

00:33:54   Ah.

00:33:55   Let's see. Accessories...

00:33:57   In Italy, they are...

00:34:00   Tutu, what are you? Uh, 79 euros.

00:34:03   Uh, okay.

00:34:04   You were spot on there then.

00:34:07   That's expensive.

00:34:08   Should I get the red ones?

00:34:09   Yeah.

00:34:10   And mix and match?

00:34:12   Oh, 69. Nice. $69.

00:34:17   Nice.

00:34:18   Still says coming soon, but you can order them.

00:34:20   It's just funny, looking at the site now, it says coming soon, ships in one day.

00:34:24   Yeah.

00:34:25   It's like, that's really soon.

00:34:26   They're coming Monday in Italy.

00:34:27   It's coming very soon!

00:34:29   Yeah, $69.

00:34:32   You get two, right? Because it's just showing one in the picture.

00:34:35   Yeah, you get two. You get two of them.

00:34:37   You have to buy the left and right sides separately.

00:34:39   One set, okay. Can you imagine $69 each?

00:34:41   Yeah, I can.

00:34:43   Yeah, I can. I can imagine.

00:34:45   I like the thought of this.

00:34:47   I don't want to spend $69 for my $500 headphones.

00:34:51   That only works most of the time.

00:34:53   I'm going to think about it. I wish the red was more red.

00:34:56   More red.

00:34:57   Yeah, it feels like coral.

00:34:59   See, my thing is as well that none of these colors appeal to me enough that I want to

00:35:06   buy them.

00:35:08   The red is a bit of a disappointment now that I'm looking at the texture on the photo.

00:35:13   It's not red enough.

00:35:14   Yeah, it's kind of salmon.

00:35:16   Mmm, yeah.

00:35:18   Pinkish.

00:35:20   The blue's nice, but not on the black band.

00:35:22   The green is just horrible.

00:35:24   The green is bad.

00:35:25   What color is that?

00:35:26   It's like olive?

00:35:27   Yeah.

00:35:28   It's like a little olive, V?

00:35:30   No, that's an offense to olives.

00:35:32   It's worse than olive.

00:35:37   Maybe the only good one is the black one, actually.

00:35:39   Do you like olives?

00:35:40   I do, I love olives.

00:35:42   Yeah.

00:35:43   Ugh.

00:35:44   Wait, what?

00:35:45   Nah.

00:35:46   Why that sound?

00:35:47   Gross.

00:35:48   What kind of olives?

00:35:49   I'm not a big olive fan.

00:35:50   I like olive oil.

00:35:51   I like things made from olives.

00:35:52   I'm not a really big fan of olives.

00:35:54   What else is made of olives besides olive oil?

00:35:56   I knew you were going to say that.

00:35:58   You know, olive paste.

00:36:00   Olive flavor Jolly Ranchers.

00:36:03   You can make olive bread.

00:36:05   It's like in Italy you can get bread with little pieces of olives.

00:36:08   Yeah, that's not what I want though, because that's little pieces of olives, you know?

00:36:11   It's not like olives, I don't like them when they're smaller, either.

00:36:15   Olive oil is like, I mean in Italy it's like water, basically.

00:36:18   It's like an essential good.

00:36:20   It's the elixir of life.

00:36:21   I mean, I love olive oil.

00:36:23   Let's take a little shot before recording

00:36:25   No, you don't want to do that just really smooth you out, you know

00:36:31   The horrible voice sounds you would make with your mouth and throat coated in oil

00:36:38   You just be like gurgling for 20 minutes

00:36:40   Okay, let's take a break

00:36:43   All right

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00:38:04   bombas.com slash connected our thanks to bombas for their support of the show and relay FM

00:38:11   Alright, Tweetbot 6 came out yesterday. It's a new app with this new version so it replaces

00:38:21   and doesn't replace, it's the opposite of replacing. It doesn't replace Tweetbot 5 but

00:38:26   it's a new app in the App Store. Tweetbot 5 is gone from the store though. It's now

00:38:31   a subscription based app. It's either $1 a month or I think it's 99 cents a month or

00:38:37   $6 a year with a subscription. At the moment, there aren't any large new features, but there

00:38:45   is the promise from Tapbots the developers have more coming in the future. The subscription

00:38:51   for Tweetbots 6 gets you the selection of features that you otherwise cannot get. Multiple

00:38:57   accounts, advanced filters, notifications, and the ability to tweet. So if you do not

00:39:02   subscribe you can still use the app but you are using a read-only version of

00:39:07   Tweetbot. Tapbots are referring to this as early access. The new features

00:39:15   because like those things I've mentioned before they were all in the app before

00:39:18   right these are just you you if you don't pay you can't get access to those

00:39:21   things. New to Tweetbot 6 are new app icons. The default one is much better.

00:39:27   I hated the Tweetbot 5 icon because it looked really angry and the Tweetbot 6 one does not

00:39:34   look so angry. There are more UI themes but I will still make the same complaint I did

00:39:41   last time. They only have like one or they have like basically one true black theme.

00:39:48   I wish they had more. And this app is now built on Twitter's version 2 API. Now I believe

00:39:56   Tweetbot have to pay for this, which they didn't before.

00:40:00   And I expect this is probably why they've decided to go with the subscription route

00:40:04   for the app now, because they have ongoing costs to Twitter that they didn't have before.

00:40:10   With the version 2 API, my belief is they get more features and more features are coming.

00:40:16   Version 6 of Tweetbot now can use Twitter's polls and cards features, which is great.

00:40:22   And I hope that they're able to add more native features like this in the future to make basically

00:40:28   like to not... and this is a complaint that we had a long time ago when we all switched

00:40:33   to the official Twitter app, that you didn't feel like you were being held back by using

00:40:39   a third party app from getting the full experience.

00:40:43   Well they have access to polls, at least to an extent, in there you can see results, but

00:40:47   if you want to vote you still got to open Twitter or Twitter.com.

00:40:51   And you can't create a poll from Tweetbot.

00:40:54   Do you know if that's the thing that is they haven't implemented it yet or are they not

00:40:58   able to?

00:40:59   I'm not sure.

00:41:00   I think that the new Twitter API is still very much a growing thing.

00:41:05   I don't think it's by any means finished yet.

00:41:09   So yeah.

00:41:10   Okay.

00:41:11   Let's talk about supporting app developers and features.

00:41:16   features. There's been a lot of conversation about this app and it's a similar kind of

00:41:22   conversation to many apps that have moved to a subscription based business model. I

00:41:33   get a few things I want to say on this. So I think it's totally valid to say that you

00:41:37   will subscribe to an application because you use it every day and the developers need to

00:41:41   get paid. That is perfectly valid. It is completely acceptable as a thing to do. It's like how

00:41:49   I subscribe to Twitch streamers that I like. I just want to support their work. I enjoy

00:41:56   what they do, so I just want to give them money because I want them to keep doing the

00:42:00   thing that they're doing. It is also valid, in my opinion, to say that as a customer,

00:42:07   For the subscription, you would want a value exchange.

00:42:10   You may not always want that, but it might be, depending on the type of application,

00:42:15   or depending on the type of thing, you might want that.

00:42:18   So I do not think that it's acceptable to really take it to extremes that some people

00:42:23   do, where they harass developers and write blog posts and leave one star reviews.

00:42:31   That's a whole different thing, especially when Tweetbot 5 just remains.

00:42:37   still available, it's still there for you. If they had updated Tweetbot and then ripped

00:42:41   it all out and made it read only, that would have been like a whole different thing. But

00:42:45   that's not what they did, right? They created a brand new app and it's up to you then. But

00:42:51   I do think it's totally fair to take a wait and see approach. So like, I want to see what

00:42:57   features they add and see if it's then worth my money on a more consistent basis. Like

00:43:03   You might want to keep using version 5 for a while, wait to see what Tapbots do to convince

00:43:08   you.

00:43:09   Because it is interesting, really I feel like a lot of apps that move from one-off payment

00:43:15   to subscription have a selection of features to give to you.

00:43:19   I would like to read a quote from Max Stories, his own one true John, for his, because I

00:43:25   think John encapsulated this better than I'm going to be able to.

00:43:29   John says "I have no issue with subscriptions conceptually, but they rightly carry the expectation

00:43:33   that in return for regular payments, users will receive meaningful periodic updates.

00:43:38   Recognising this, many developers timed the move to a subscription with a substantial

00:43:42   app update to start off on the right foot, which Tapbots has not done.

00:43:46   Tweetbots' subscription is primarily based on the promise of future updates.

00:43:50   Even though the Tweetbots' subscription isn't expensive, I think Tapbots owes its users

00:43:53   more than it has delivered.

00:43:55   And I do agree with Jon there.

00:43:58   There's another problem.

00:44:00   Maybe not a problem.

00:44:01   something that I would have done differently,

00:44:03   because I've seen it done differently over the past year,

00:44:06   really.

00:44:07   I think the way that developers, and especially

00:44:09   this type of indie developers, indie developers that we

00:44:12   cover on the site, the way that they prepare for app launches

00:44:18   and for introducing a new subscription model has changed.

00:44:24   I think this is something that I've been noticing increasingly

00:44:27   over the past year.

00:44:29   I think it's become pretty much common to run effectively open test flights for all

00:44:35   kinds of users, to show them exactly what you're working on and why it's going to be

00:44:40   worth the cost of a subscription.

00:44:42   It's become pretty common to have an open Slack, for example, where beta testers can

00:44:48   join and can discuss, where developers can have a direct line of contact with those members.

00:44:54   those members, those early users, will be your first... will be the kinds of people

00:45:01   that will defend you on Twitter. You're evangelists. You're evangelists when you launch the app.

00:45:09   Obviously it's been pretty common to get in touch with a bunch of websites to give them

00:45:13   access to the beta and to explain, "Hey, here's why we're switching to a subscription." It's

00:45:19   It's become pretty common to do a blog post, sometimes months in advance, to say, "Here's

00:45:24   the thing, here's what we're going to do, and here's why." You look at the Brian Mueller,

00:45:30   for example, what he did for Carrot 5, which is launching, I believe, tomorrow, or at some

00:45:35   point this week. He had a long thread on Reddit, like a full post with hundreds of comments,

00:45:43   Really good.

00:45:44   Really, really good explanation of "Here's what I'm doing for Kerat 5.

00:45:49   Let me explain it to you."

00:45:50   And that's great.

00:45:51   And what I think is happening here...

00:45:55   We've gotten a bunch of tweets about folks complaining about Tweetbot moving to a subscription.

00:46:00   It was even worse, I think, when the folks at Fantastical moved to a subscription.

00:46:07   I think a lot of indie developers need to accept a few hard realities in 2021. The first one is,

00:46:15   I get it, the idea of why wouldn't you want to support your favorite indie developer? Like,

00:46:23   I totally get it. Sentimentally speaking, it's a topic close to my heart. But I think especially

00:46:29   in 2021, in a post, well, quote-unquote, post-pandemic, current pandemic world,

00:46:36   I think you gotta put those feelings aside and you gotta account for the fact that this is money

00:46:45   we're talking about and people are rightfully so very conscious of their financials right now.

00:46:53   And so I think thinking that people are going to support you anyway, it's not going to work out,

00:47:00   I think, right now. Because unfortunately, money and taking care of your family,

00:47:06   you know, those things are more important than developer goodwill right now.

00:47:11   And I think that there's something to be said about being open in advance and getting feedback,

00:47:19   Maybe. Exactly. I know that a lot of indie developers in our community take the Apple

00:47:26   approach of like, we don't say anything. But you're not Apple, that's the thing, right?

00:47:31   That was my second, that was my second reality. You're not Apple. You cannot just bring a

00:47:37   surprise on people. It's not like you're, you know, Tim Cook walking on stage and introducing

00:47:41   the new iPhone. This is an app. You're boring! Exactly. I mean, I think especially right

00:47:46   now again look at what folks like Greg Pierce are doing with drafts or Brian

00:47:52   Mueller with Care of Five like you know there's plenty Aaron Pierce with his

00:47:57   suite of HomeKit apps and utilities like there's plenty of indie developers who

00:48:01   have realized that the App Store economy and the competition has changed you know

00:48:08   right now compared to 10 years ago the surprise app launch where you know you

00:48:14   create demand by surprising people and say "no there's the new app by Tapbots, I must own this

00:48:21   you know three dollar app". That used to work out in 2010, it doesn't necessarily work out in 2021.

00:48:27   I mean, did it though? To an extent, I think so. Because every time Tapbots would release a new

00:48:34   version people would lose their minds that they had to pay again, right? Right. I think it's

00:48:39   heating up with subscriptions because it's money forever. But it's kind of

00:48:45   interesting to me that they weren't more open in advance

00:48:51   because Tapbots are a company that have always had these problems of like we

00:48:57   have a new version and we're gonna charge for it and we're gonna charge for

00:49:00   it because we're a company this is what we make. Fine. But every single time

00:49:04   people get upset, right? Like you must know this by now, right? Like you've had

00:49:08   it with a Mac app, you've had it with every version of the iPhone app. People get upset,

00:49:16   rightly or wrongly, about needing to spend more money on software. And I think we've

00:49:21   spoken about this a lot on this show, of the reality of the economy that you're in. You

00:49:29   cannot compare apples to apples. You can't say, "This costs this, and this costs this,

00:49:37   and everyone should be cool with it. Right? Like, oh, but $6 a year, like you spend $6

00:49:45   a day on your lunch. Like, why would you not want? But like, it's the economy of the world

00:49:51   that you're in is what you're working within, right? Like, software is cheap. So...

00:49:58   And people really like to eat.

00:50:00   Yeah.

00:50:01   You can't eat an app.

00:50:02   But you know what, it's like, this is what they're in.

00:50:06   Like this is... Yeah, it's not ideal.

00:50:08   It would be so much better fit for developers if software was more expensive.

00:50:13   And I get it, like I understand it, but that just isn't it.

00:50:18   And like so, you know, you can be frustrated about it and be frustrated about it,

00:50:22   but you still have to work within

00:50:25   the constraints of the economy around you.

00:50:32   Yeah, yeah. Which is why I think it's really important to be proactive and to build,

00:50:39   you know, excitement before the release to be like... Right now, all the successful app launches

00:50:46   that we're covering on the site, they had a very open beta stage, lots of feedback, thousands of

00:50:54   users. So you launch the product with an established fan base who is going to do whatever they can to

00:51:00   to promote your app.

00:51:02   And I think that's the way to go right now.

00:51:05   I think using the old approach of, surprise,

00:51:07   we have an app, doesn't work out anymore.

00:51:10   And when you add on top of that

00:51:12   the subscription surprise effect,

00:51:15   I don't wanna say it's a recipe for disaster

00:51:17   because hopefully this will work out for these developers,

00:51:20   but I think it's a risk

00:51:22   and you're taking a big risk in doing that.

00:51:24   - Like we have a subscription too now, right?

00:51:27   Like you can pay us money and you get the show.

00:51:30   But there was a lot of considerations that we took into it.

00:51:33   Nothing was going to get taken away from our show.

00:51:36   We didn't take away any features or put them behind a paywall.

00:51:40   And we also decided that we didn't want it to be just like, "Hey, support us by giving

00:51:44   us money."

00:51:46   We were going to remove ads from our show and give bonus content.

00:51:50   So that felt like an overall package that we were willing to offer.

00:51:55   I think that that's the kind of things that people need to make those kinds of considerations

00:51:59   that just support us because we need support, it's not going to work of as many people as

00:52:09   support us and get this and this and this, let's talk about it, you know, like there is a,

00:52:15   there is more success in a better mixture I think in the long run.

00:52:21   Yeah, something about it makes me feel like me as a customer or a user of an app or a service,

00:52:29   I'm being that my support or my continued use of it is just taken for granted.

00:52:35   Like, oh yeah, let's move on to this just out of goodwill.

00:52:39   That's fine and there's lots of things that all three of us do that to.

00:52:42   You know, Myke, you mentioned craters on Twitch.

00:52:45   All of us support things like that.

00:52:48   But you can't, or well, you shouldn't build your entire business on that.

00:52:56   And I think with Tapbots in particular,

00:52:59   they've had run-ins with users online

00:53:03   and they've been cranky about things.

00:53:04   And that's fine, we're all that way sometimes,

00:53:06   but you need to go to the user base

00:53:10   and explain what's going on.

00:53:12   And to John's really good point in his article,

00:53:15   prove, do some of that work on the front end

00:53:19   that this is going to be worthwhile.

00:53:22   The six bucks a year is not a lot of money

00:53:23   for a lot of people.

00:53:24   It is a lot of money for some people too.

00:53:26   And you need to prove that you've earned it and that your app or service or

00:53:33   whatever it is, is something that you're willing to keep investing in because

00:53:39   for better or for worse, and whether it was Apple's goal or not, when setting

00:53:44   up recurring subscriptions, the understanding is at least, especially for

00:53:49   like power user nerd type users who are going to use tweet bot over Twitter or

00:53:56   we're gonna use Twitter if ik over Twitter or some other third-party

00:53:59   weather app or podcast separate this whole scene that we're in that we all

00:54:04   have an understanding that ongoing recurring subscription equals ongoing

00:54:09   updates and mm-hmm they just didn't deliver on that you know I was flipping

00:54:16   through tweetbot6, I've got it on my phone and looking through it like if you

00:54:20   didn't tell me it was a new version I'm not sure I would have

00:54:24   noticed and that's not fantastic. I've come to prefer a lot about the way that

00:54:31   the Twitter app itself works for me now and there are things that I've gotten

00:54:35   really used to but there are things that Twitter does that are pretty hostile and

00:54:39   I don't expect to see them in third-party apps like promoted tweets for

00:54:44   companies that are completely irrelevant to me.

00:54:46   Like I get I get promoted tweets for betting companies all the time.

00:54:50   Like there is I don't do this.

00:54:52   Like, you know, and I even said when they gave me the option, show me

00:54:57   personalized ads, because my feeling is if you're going to show me ads, I at

00:55:02   least want them to be relevant.

00:55:03   Sure. Right. Because look, Instagram does it and I buy stuff from Instagram all

00:55:08   the time because the ads are relevant.

00:55:11   So I buy stuff, but I'm never going to join your sports betting service because I don't

00:55:16   bet on sports. Right. So like stop showing me these ads. There was a while for a couple

00:55:21   of weeks where I'm not kidding, but every five or six tweets I was shown a tweet from

00:55:26   a topic. Oh yeah. Yeah. And then that stopped happening. Uh, interestingly, this is something

00:55:35   I noticed. I, it was kind of frustrating. I made the decision a couple of weeks ago

00:55:39   that I wanted to stop using Twitter as much as I was. I made this decision two days before

00:55:45   the insurrection on the Capitol and it completely broke it, because it's like, "Alright, I'm

00:55:50   going to stop using Twitter as much and then like, ah, I've got to be plugged in online!"

00:55:55   Because I was gone for two days, I didn't see an ad on Twitter for two days. Like, when

00:55:59   I went back, no ads. And I thought it was really interesting, because maybe they just

00:56:05   show me a lot of ads, I'm on Twitter a lot. Use Twitter less, see less ads. I don't know.

00:56:10   I noticed it. I don't know what they're thinking is on that or if they do do anything on that,

00:56:13   but I did notice. Way less ads and no more topics being shoved in my face after I took

00:56:18   some time away for a day or two. It's very interesting. If the overall experience of

00:56:22   Tweetbot can improve from the new API features, I could move back, but there are things that

00:56:28   I'm super used to now. Like I was using Tweetbot today and I have really come to prefer and

00:56:35   love the threaded conversations in a timeline because I was noticing I would

00:56:40   see a tweet and it was just like some random like at like at Federico yeah it's

00:56:44   like what does this mean like if I want to know I have to click through to it

00:56:49   but in the Twitter app you see all of the replies in context and while at

00:56:54   first I remember we were all like this is madness why would you do this after

00:56:58   get used to it, it is a vastly superior way to follow conversation. I keep my eye on it.

00:57:06   I'm intrigued because I used to love Tweetbot but moved away from it just over time. But part of the

00:57:15   reason I moved away from it is because they couldn't take advantage of the things that

00:57:18   Twitter could. If they decide to, maybe they can make better design decisions. But I don't know yet.

00:57:24   and what I wouldn't see.

00:57:26   -Yeah, I feel the same way for all those reasons.

00:57:29   Also the fact that --

00:57:30   And I'm not sure if the version 2 of the API

00:57:33   gives them access to the full history of Twitter search.

00:57:37   That's one of the big reasons why I also like

00:57:39   to use the Twitter app,

00:57:41   being able to search for any tweet from the past --

00:57:45   how long has Twitter existed?

00:57:46   I don't know, 15 years or something.

00:57:49   But also, I just feel like using any third-party client these days,

00:57:55   and this is true for Tweetbot, Twitterific, Aviary, all of them,

00:58:00   it just feels like I'm not using the real, if you will, Twitter experience.

00:58:05   It just feels like I'm a little bit detached from normal people.

00:58:09   Like, it's even one of those small things, right, when there's, like, an event,

00:58:13   like a real-world event going on, and there's the special hash flag, as they call it.

00:58:18   it. And you can see that in a third party client and it just feels like you're missing

00:58:23   out on what the rest of the world is doing.

00:58:25   Let alone that the tweets aren't real time.

00:58:28   Yeah. And that. So, you know, something that I've been doing a lot lately is checking out

00:58:35   Twitter when I'm watching a specific program on TV in Italy, on live television.

00:58:41   It's Big Brother. Come on, it's Big Brother. Just say it.

00:58:43   It's that, but not also a bunch of other ones.

00:58:46   Okay.

00:58:47   But mostly the Big Brother.

00:58:48   That's the big brother.

00:58:50   You know they extended the program again.

00:58:52   Those folks are going to be locked out in the house for six months.

00:58:56   They're going to keep extending that thing until the pandemic is over.

00:59:00   Like, you know, the big brother will continue.

00:59:03   When they finally open the doors,

00:59:04   it will be the children of the people that were sent in that come out.

00:59:07   Yeah, pretty much.

00:59:10   But yeah, but it's like when you do that and you get the real time tweets

00:59:15   and you see like millions of other people talking about the same thing,

00:59:18   that's not something that you can get in a third-party client, you know? It's all

00:59:22   of those reasons why I also use the Twitter app, which for many other reasons,

00:59:26   like, it also drives me crazy. The fact that it's horrible on iPad, for example.

00:59:31   The promoted tweets, the fact that I keep seeing the same ads over and over, like,

00:59:36   the same... there's not enough variety to those ads. It's always like the same...

00:59:41   there's one for a cellphone provider that I keep getting over the past week,

00:59:46   it's so annoying but still. I mean one thing you can do which is what I do is I mute the

00:59:50   accounts and you'll still get bad ads but you at least won't see the same ads all the

00:59:54   time and I do find that to be preferable. That's a good name. Okay. But I mean you're

01:00:00   still gonna see stuff that is irrelevant to you but at least it's not the same thing over

01:00:05   and over again. Yeah. Like it's funny right like I think it was a point that I made when

01:00:12   we all moved when I moved and then Federico you'd been on a Twitter app first and then

01:00:16   I went in and Stephen I think you came after, I was like there is no other service like

01:00:22   this where I don't use the app that the company makes. Right? There are third party Instagram

01:00:30   apps.

01:00:31   No. Well there used to be some but then they shut down the API but it wasn't as popular

01:00:36   like the idea of a third-party client I think it's pretty unique to Twitter. If you remember

01:00:41   there used to be like YouTube clients, like I remember ProTube back in the day, like that was

01:00:46   a really good YouTube client and then of course Google shut down the API. But I think the idea of

01:00:52   the Twitter client is very unique and very unique to Twitter itself. I don't know, Twitter seems to

01:00:59   think that they can, you know, convince developers to come back and make actual full clients again.

01:01:04   I'm still very skeptical. Yeah, I am taking a very wait and see move on that.

01:01:10   One thing that I find that I like in the default Twitter client, it's not something I would have

01:01:17   guessed and a lot of the content is garbage, but when there is something trending that is newsworthy,

01:01:25   you can understand it pretty quickly normally. Yeah, they do that like breakdown, don't they?

01:01:31   Yeah, where someone at Twitter writes a couple sentences and they have the most relevant tweets

01:01:38   And then if I want to go read more, I can. Usually they have news organizations towards the top of that or the user that's involved.

01:01:45   A lot of the trends themselves I don't care about or just not useful to me, but when they are,

01:01:52   I find that a pretty good way to understand at least a little bit and see if I want to go explore the story more.

01:01:58   And in Tweetbot, maybe it's an API thing, maybe their users just don't care about it as much,

01:02:03   but it's just like a list and you don't necessarily easily understand what it's about.

01:02:08   And I find that surprisingly, I find that a little bit frustrating.

01:02:13   Yeah, I do feel like maybe we all have been away from third party apps for too long now.

01:02:19   And like the prospect of actually returning to them with a older feature set might be unrealistic now.

01:02:28   That's a good subtopic, actually.

01:02:31   Maybe we should talk about this not today, but in the future,

01:02:34   but I'm just going to, you know, throw it out there for now.

01:02:37   Do you guys feel like you are checking out fewer apps,

01:02:44   new apps than before?

01:02:46   I had this feeling a couple of years ago.

01:02:49   Remember? Remember I sent you a text one day and was like,

01:02:52   "Are there new apps anymore? Because I don't find them."

01:02:56   And how do you feel about it now?

01:02:58   less. Less. I'm putting it down as a future topic. Okay, all right. Let's think about it.

01:03:06   And some real-time follow-up. It's called early access. That's how they label it,

01:03:11   is because that's what Twitter's version 2 API is. So it's incomplete, and that's what they decide

01:03:17   to name this version of tweetbot. Paul Haddad says that they will remove that label once the API

01:03:23   reaches 1.0. Okay. So it is weird that they call it that because there was no explanation.

01:03:30   Apparently, that's why. Right. I mean, that is a I just assumed it was along those lines,

01:03:35   but it makes more sense that it aligns with what Twitter is calling it to. You know, one thing I'm

01:03:41   just I've been sitting here playing with Tweetbot six. One thing I do not miss from the regular

01:03:47   Twitter app is I don't I don't ever really care to see who likes or retweets my tweets. I mean,

01:03:53   I'm thankful people do but I really just want to see my replies and

01:03:57   You can get to one of those views or the other in Twitter, but Twitter really wants to show you

01:04:03   Engagement stuff and the notifications what they call notifications in that room. Yeah, and I just don't

01:04:10   This is not something I keep up with

01:04:12   We see this is I I understand what you mean, but I also do sometimes want to see it and

01:04:18   You just can't

01:04:21   Right, and like that's the difference.

01:04:23   I'm gonna sound like an idiot.

01:04:26   Oh, he's gonna say it's the opposite.

01:04:28   [laughter]

01:04:31   I sometimes open the verified tab to see if other verified users have engaged with my tweets.

01:04:37   Oh, I mean, I do that too.

01:04:39   [laughter]

01:04:41   It makes me feel good sometimes.

01:04:43   Secret club.

01:04:45   Verified people.

01:04:47   [laughter]

01:04:49   Well, we're all terrible.

01:04:51   Well, you know how we can say it, and I do genuinely believe this, I really hope that

01:04:56   Twitter's verified system that they're apparently going to be rolling out soon is genuinely

01:05:01   open.

01:05:02   It should be open to everybody.

01:05:03   Everyone should be able to be verified.

01:05:06   And I hope that that is more what they're moving towards.

01:05:09   I know that they explicitly called out people who are in activist groups and stuff like

01:05:15   that, which I think is a really good addition.

01:05:18   ultimately I think they need to be able to move Verified to everyone.

01:05:22   Yeah.

01:05:23   Everyone should be able to be verified.

01:05:25   But then those of us who are ready, give us a gold checkmark instead.

01:05:28   Is that what you want?

01:05:29   Oh my god, oh my god.

01:05:31   Yeah, I would love to have like an extra badge, you know.

01:05:36   But what do you want it to suggest?

01:05:38   Verified Pro.

01:05:40   Verified Pro, okay.

01:05:42   That's good.

01:05:44   If you want to hear more about Twitter,

01:05:46   this morning's episode of Dithering

01:05:49   with Jon Gruber and Ben Thompson talks

01:05:51   about Twitter's recent acquisition

01:05:55   of a newsletter company, but also just on a bigger stage,

01:05:59   like Twitter's moving forward and how do they monetize things.

01:06:03   I don't know.

01:06:03   It found it to be a very compelling conversation.

01:06:05   So go check that out if you are a Dithering subscriber.

01:06:09   Anything else on Twitter and Tweetbot?

01:06:10   We've got one more thing to close this out.

01:06:13   I don't think so.

01:06:14   This episode of Connected is brought to you by Pingdom.

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01:07:31   Our thanks to Pingdom from SolarWinds for their support of the show and RelayFM.

01:07:36   So we thought it would be interesting since Tweetbot has moved to a subscription for us

01:07:40   to talk about the app subscriptions that we currently are using. Some of these are in

01:07:47   the App Store, some are out of the App Store, some of these are personal, some of these

01:07:51   sort of blend the lines between personal and business, but I think it'd be fun to talk

01:07:56   about this.

01:07:57   I kind of just, I had this as a thought in my mind for a while, and I especially, because

01:08:03   I knew that we were going to be bringing a variety of opinions to the show today, I also

01:08:08   wanted to prove that we do support developers with subscriptions. Like we're not like anti

01:08:15   that. But so I figured it would be worth highlighting some of those at least.

01:08:20   So Myke, do you want to go first?

01:08:22   Okay. Yeah. So I have a selection of apps in the App Store and other little things.

01:08:29   Apple One Premium, you know, I love to support Apple.

01:08:31   Oh yeah. Indie developer right there. Good.

01:08:34   the upstart, gotta get them a go.

01:08:37   Tweetbot is now on that list.

01:08:38   I signed up for the annual 'cause I wanted to try it out.

01:08:41   Office 365 'cause those guys really need some help

01:08:44   over there at Microsoft,

01:08:45   but I do have an Office 365 subscription.

01:08:49   Widgetsmith, YouTube Premium.

01:08:52   Okay, I want, before I know someone's gonna write in,

01:08:55   I will close Twitter, close email.

01:08:58   I know that, I'm pretty sure YouTube Premium is cheaper

01:09:01   if you pay for it outside of the App Store.

01:09:03   is just how I do it. I can't be bothered to change it. This is it. Drafts, Bear, the

01:09:13   Markdown editing application. Castro, Craft. Craft is cool.

01:09:20   There are three note-taking apps in this list.

01:09:23   A lot of note-taking. Yeah, I like to take notes. All right, Drafts I use for some automation

01:09:30   stuff. I use it mainly for that. And also drafts. Drafts is one of those aspirational

01:09:36   purchases. I like to think one day I could be a full on drafts user. Bear is my favourite

01:09:46   like markdown text editor. I like it for that. Where's the other note taking? Well craft,

01:09:55   I don't think of it as a note taking app.

01:09:56   Craft is like, for me, that's where I, it's Evernote.

01:10:01   Okay. That's what I treat Craft as basically.

01:10:03   Like loads of stuff goes into it, all kinds of different types of content.

01:10:08   Plus as well, like I,

01:10:10   I wanted an application that was siloed of just one thing.

01:10:15   So everything to do with Cortex brand, I wanted in one application.

01:10:18   I didn't want it into mixed with other stuff.

01:10:20   So I have just a Craft workspace for all of that.

01:10:24   It was previously in Notion.

01:10:25   Craft is better for me for what I want to do.

01:10:28   VSCO, the photo editing app.

01:10:32   Deliveries.

01:10:34   Halide Mark 2, another aspirational subscription.

01:10:39   You know?

01:10:40   GIF Wrapped, the GIF app.

01:10:43   Carrot Weather, Overcast, and Dew.

01:10:46   These are all of my in the App Store subscriptions.

01:10:50   And then I have a selection of apps

01:10:52   that I pay for outside of the App Store.

01:10:54   There might be more than this subscription wise,

01:10:57   but these are the ones I could remember

01:10:59   and through looking at the apps on my devices.

01:11:02   I pay for Fantastic How from outside of the App Store,

01:11:05   which I recommend because it's a legitimate business purchase for me

01:11:09   and allows me to do it because it's super complicated to try and

01:11:12   even with Apple Pay to choose different cards in the App Store.

01:11:18   So hard to do, and I really wished it wasn't so difficult.

01:11:22   One password, text expander, Creative Cloud, Spark, I pay for the Teams feature, Discord,

01:11:30   I pay for, I don't remember what they call it now, I think it used to be called Nitro,

01:11:35   but I pay for that.

01:11:36   I technically don't pay for Slack myself, but I kind of pay for Slack.

01:11:41   We split it.

01:11:42   Yeah.

01:11:43   Technically.

01:11:44   OmniFocus, I pay for OmniFocus outside of the App Store too, and Toggle.

01:11:49   Okay.

01:11:50   They're my subscriptions.

01:11:51   Those are some good subscriptions.

01:11:52   It's a real slice of Myke Hurley there, like multiple note-taking applications, time tracking,

01:11:58   right?

01:11:59   It's just all like, you just cut me open and these are the apps you find inside.

01:12:04   That's not how apps work at all.

01:12:06   It's like, it's like a rock, you know, like a geo type thing.

01:12:09   Sure.

01:12:10   Sure.

01:12:11   I think geo is Pokemon, right?

01:12:13   Yes, Steven.

01:12:15   I know Pokemon.

01:12:16   I'll go next.

01:12:17   I also have Apple One Premium, Kraft, which I use for all my work related notes.

01:12:23   I keep my personal notes in Apple Notes.

01:12:27   Headspace which is a meditation relaxation app.

01:12:31   Nomo Robo which is a call screening app that uses the mechanism put in I think in iOS 12

01:12:41   maybe 11 or 12 where you can run phone numbers through a database and see if it's spam or

01:12:46   not.

01:12:47   Does that work for you?

01:12:49   - NoMoRobo?

01:12:50   - Yeah.

01:12:51   - It does, yeah.

01:12:53   It's pretty good.

01:12:54   - Okay.

01:12:55   - I think it's pretty good.

01:12:56   I get a little badge a lot saying this is a spam call

01:12:58   that NoMoRobo puts up on the screen, so.

01:13:00   - Nice.

01:13:01   - Overcast, Fantastical, Strava.

01:13:06   I forget which level of Strava,

01:13:08   but they have different features.

01:13:09   That's a running and cycling tracking app.

01:13:12   - You getting a lot of use out of that recently?

01:13:14   - No, that was an annual purchase.

01:13:17   like in the summer. Past Steven had very different opinions to what current

01:13:24   Steven would. Well not opinions, capabilities. Day one, deliveries, gift

01:13:32   wrapped, carrot weather, Todoist, which is my task manager. I did look technically

01:13:40   I remember the milk membership is also still active but set to expire in about

01:13:44   month oh wow the love affair is over I'm sure I'll be back yeah I have no doubt

01:13:50   about it widgetsmith YouTube premium do as well which is fantastic ones outside

01:13:59   the App Store that I could think of were one password which is both like our

01:14:04   company pays for and then I have a family account that I share with Mary

01:14:07   I'm the same. TextExpander... Not with Mary, I don't share a one-part story with your wife.

01:14:14   It's cool with me. TextExpander and Backblaze. Backing up my Macs. Oh, Backblaze, yeah. We're

01:14:22   all three gonna have ones we forgot about after we hear someone else mention it. Creative

01:14:27   Cloud, pay for the whole shebang. Slack, of course, Relay pays for it for our, you know,

01:14:33   50 people that are in there, and then Office 365.

01:14:37   I think that's it.

01:14:38   I mean, we didn't really get into pure entertainment.

01:14:43   I think YouTube Premium is as close as we got, but looking through my active list in

01:14:46   the App Store and looking through my expenses, that's what I came up with.

01:14:51   My list is a bit shorter than you guys, I think.

01:14:54   So in terms of apps, Kraft?

01:14:56   I genuinely expect though that for you, a lot of the apps that would be the ones that

01:15:04   me and Steven would have, you're very likely on betas of those apps.

01:15:09   No.

01:15:10   And not necessarily the same ones, but like that there might be like a type of application

01:15:15   so you just you don't need a subscription for it. Or maybe you just the types of applications,

01:15:20   you just have apps that aren't subscription apps.

01:15:22   No, I don't have a lot of betas on my devices right now.

01:15:26   Did a lot of cleanup over the past few months.

01:15:30   So what I pay for in the App Store is Craft,

01:15:32   which is where I'm keeping all of my notes right now.

01:15:35   Timery, because, I mean, it's, you know, all those reasons.

01:15:39   It's the best time checking app.

01:15:41   Carrot Weather, and I'm really keen to see

01:15:44   what Brian does with --

01:15:46   -Oh, I miss Timery. I miss Timery.

01:15:48   Sorry. -Timery.

01:15:50   -It's like one of my favorite apps ever.

01:15:51   How did I miss it?

01:15:52   Timery has to be like one of the apps that I use the most on all of my devices, especially

01:15:56   now with the widgets and the shortcuts.

01:15:58   How did I miss Timery?

01:15:59   I really use it a lot.

01:16:01   Timery is super good.

01:16:02   Carrot Weather, I'm really keen to play around with version 5.

01:16:05   I haven't spent as much time as I hope with it.

01:16:08   We're gonna have a review on Mac stories, but not by me.

01:16:11   Because hopefully you didn't write it.

01:16:15   By Federico.

01:16:16   Uh, I haven't used this one.

01:16:20   It's really cool. It's really cool.

01:16:23   I played around with the beta. It feels a little bit intimidating at first because of

01:16:26   all those new options for UI customization and all that kind of stuff, but we'll see

01:16:32   when it launches.

01:16:33   Castro, I pay for the, what's it called, Castro Plus subscription. I really like the app,

01:16:40   the way that it works with the inbox.

01:16:42   Apollo, I subscribe to the Apollo Ultra subscription annual thing.

01:16:47   That's the Reddit app, right?

01:16:50   That's the best Reddit client you can find, one of the best developers you can find around

01:16:55   really Christian, he's such a cool guy.

01:16:58   And it's the best Reddit experience you can find on iOS and iPadOS.

01:17:03   I still really like NARWAL.

01:17:06   I like the simplicity of NARWAL and I think that's what most people don't want.

01:17:10   They want the features of Apollo and I am just not that heavy a Reddit user, I think.

01:17:17   Well, I'm not a heavy Reddit user. I just like the way that Apollo works. I subscribe

01:17:23   to Kipit as well, which is the document manager type application. It's sort of like Devon

01:17:31   think, but like a lightweight version of Devon think. It would be a good way to describe

01:17:36   it. This is where I keep all of the PDF versions of our newsletters, for example, PDF copies

01:17:43   of Apple's documentation. And I switched from DevOnThink because Kipit had much better shortcuts

01:17:50   integration when I needed it a few months ago. I know that there's a new version of

01:17:55   DevOnThink coming out that in theory, amongst other actions, will also have new shortcuts

01:18:01   integration. So maybe I will reconsider, but for now I'm using Kipit on all of my devices.

01:18:06   Pokemon Home, this is the service that lets you move around Pokemon between different

01:18:13   games and different systems. It's like online storage for Pokemon.

01:18:18   I was so happy to see this in here.

01:18:23   I subscribe!

01:18:26   Of course, but it was just heartwarming to me for some reason to just see that Pokemon

01:18:32   Home was in there.

01:18:33   You know, Myke, as I make sense of my life after a bit of a break that I had, the Pokémon

01:18:39   itch is coming again.

01:18:40   Oh, here we go.

01:18:42   Not for competitive play.

01:18:44   I don't think I can handle that sort of stress, if you will, right now, but the single player,

01:18:51   like actually just playing Pokémon and catching them and playing the old games as well.

01:18:55   I think it's coming back.

01:18:57   I think I may be starting like the Pokédex quest again sometime soon.

01:19:03   Anyway, two PDF apps.

01:19:05   PDF Viewer, which is like my default PDF reader

01:19:09   for like signing stuff, contracts, annotations,

01:19:13   all that sort of like basic PDF stuff, I subscribe to that.

01:19:17   But also Highlights.

01:19:19   Highlights I exclusively use for my annual iOS

01:19:22   and iPadOS reviews.

01:19:23   And I use it because it lets me view the document

01:19:27   and the annotations in split screen side by side.

01:19:30   It's got this very unique view for annotations

01:19:33   and documents that I really like.

01:19:35   And finally, this is something that I started using

01:19:37   a few months ago, AdGuard Pro.

01:19:40   This is an ad blocker, but also it installs

01:19:44   like a VPN on your device for DNS protection.

01:19:50   And basically it's one of those apps that tries to block ads

01:19:55   and encrypt your internet requests with a VPN profile.

01:20:01   And I think it's been working out really well for me lately.

01:20:03   Like, for example, thanks to AdGuard,

01:20:06   when I go to certain Italian newspaper websites

01:20:11   and I want to watch a video, the ad doesn't load at all.

01:20:16   The video just starts playing.

01:20:19   That's one of the things that AdGuard can do.

01:20:21   Now, I feel sorry for the ad industry

01:20:23   because I feel like I'm stealing your money,

01:20:24   but hey, I wanna watch those videos for...

01:20:28   (laughing)

01:20:30   what am I supposed to do? I want to watch the video. I don't want your ad.

01:20:33   I know, it's allowed. It's on the App Store, so, you know, go complain to Apple, not me.

01:20:39   So yeah, AdGuard. Now, outside of the App Store, I obviously pay for Spotify, which technically

01:20:49   I'm not subscribed to. Like, I haven't subscribed to Spotify per se. Like, what I've done is I have

01:20:56   this little, this neat website that I go to where I purchase gift cards, like US gift cards for

01:21:04   online services. You can purchase a gift card for the US App Store, for Spotify, for the Google Play

01:21:11   Store. So what I do is I purchase Spotify gift cards, then I use ExpressVPN, which is also a

01:21:16   sponsor of the show, to log into Spotify as a US, with a US location, and then I use my US gift card

01:21:26   to redeem my Spotify Premium US version subscription.

01:21:31   It's interesting because this definitely feels like it would be a One True John job to get you gift cards.

01:21:38   So I guess it's nice that you found a website to relieve that work from One True John.

01:21:43   Yeah, a very good website, which I will not share in case, you know, they shut it down.

01:21:50   Yeah, because like, are they sending you scans of actual gift cards?

01:21:54   used to now they have a more efficient, much more efficient system in place.

01:21:57   I've used something like that before. That is shady.

01:22:02   You know, I used to be friends. Well, I think at some point we became friends with the previous

01:22:07   website that I used to rely on for this kind of stuff with Jeff. His name was Jeff and

01:22:12   Jeff and I, like he was one of those websites that sent you the scan of the gift card. And

01:22:18   I don't know, sometimes we talked and I think at some point he discovered Mac stories and

01:22:23   he started asking me questions privately over email and that got kind of weird and so I

01:22:29   stopped using Jeff's website.

01:22:31   I can imagine this is like one of those things with like a dealer and so his name in your

01:22:36   address book is just like Jeff gift card.

01:22:38   Wait, I think if you buy drugs you don't put in Joe heroin as their contact name.

01:22:44   Well, no, you know, obviously you wouldn't write...

01:22:50   I don't... I think like... heroin is maybe not a great...

01:22:55   I mean, come on!

01:22:57   It's all drugs straight to heroin!

01:22:59   Yeah!

01:23:02   I don't think that that's like...

01:23:03   Well, hey look, Cindy cocaine was out of town.

01:23:07   So have a cocktail.

01:23:08   Oh my god.

01:23:09   Oh my god.

01:23:10   Why don't you just start with weed?

01:23:15   I mean, exactly.

01:23:17   Why do you go straight to heroin?

01:23:19   No, you want to go all the way.

01:23:23   No actually...

01:23:24   William Weed, Mary Marijuana?

01:23:27   Actually I saved him, and I'm not joking, I saved him as Jeff Itunes.

01:23:32   See, I knew it.

01:23:34   I told you.

01:23:36   Alright, so like if you met someone at like a club, like in our younger years, you know,

01:23:45   they you might say by the name of the nightclub that you met them in you associate the person

01:23:51   because you don't you didn't you didn't get i mean how often do you catch people's surnames

01:23:55   in those kinds of situations also like you don't introduce yourself with your last name exactly

01:23:59   hello i'm federico vitigi get away from me you creep

01:24:04   no let me see if i can find jeff itunes jeff itunes can you imagine if it's jeff williams

01:24:13   It's the real Jeff iTunes

01:24:16   Now sometime one time he failed to

01:24:19   Send me the scan of a gift card, and he was very apologetic and he told me like hey

01:24:25   I had some trouble at home. I was like dude. I don't care

01:24:28   You misunderstood our relationship Jeff I chance

01:24:33   All right Federico blogger what else is on your list, okay?

01:24:42   I just got that, that was good. I got that. Slack, 1Password. I use both 1Password for work

01:24:54   and 1Password for family. Family, just me and Sylvain for work. I have John and Alex and

01:25:00   we all share access to a bunch of like work stuff and work documents. Toggle, obviously,

01:25:06   time tracking. Dropbox, which I still use, even though...

01:25:10   Oh yeah, Dropbox. I didn't put that one on my list.

01:25:13   Yeah, me too.

01:25:14   I still use it. I still use it. It's still the best file and document sharing service

01:25:19   you can find. And I think that's pretty much it. I don't have anything else in my list

01:25:25   that requires a subscription, and I was looking at my phone again. That's the stuff on my

01:25:31   home screen and on the second page. I don't think... I mean technically in Twitch on an

01:25:37   iPhone I do use the... that's not a subscription when you...

01:25:40   No, you buy like tokens.

01:25:42   You buy the tokens, so you know, tokens are like a subscription but you buy them as in

01:25:46   a purchase on the iPhone. So yeah, that's my list.

01:25:50   I'm sure that there's stuff that we missed out on, plus of course like this doesn't take

01:25:54   into account, you know, the apps that we might repurchase every year, right, like you get

01:25:58   new version or whatever but this is just in an effort to show that we are good

01:26:03   subscription boys and we pay lots of money to developers because we love them

01:26:08   if you want to find links to the stuff we spoke about they're over on the

01:26:12   website at relay.fm/connected/330

01:26:18   while you're there you can get in touch via email via a little link there right

01:26:23   there in the sidebar so send us some feedback or follow up you can become a

01:26:27   become a member of Connected Pro, you get a longer ad-free version of the show each

01:26:33   and every week.

01:26:34   This week we discussed the list of words added to the dictionary for the year, and it was

01:26:40   very interesting.

01:26:42   We also talked about how Wall Street works, how none of us understand it.

01:26:45   Well, we didn't talk about how it works because we don't know how it works.

01:26:49   Because we don't understand it.

01:26:50   Good point.

01:26:51   Thank you for the clarification.

01:26:54   You can find us all on the internet.

01:26:56   You can find Federico on Twitter @vitiicci.

01:27:01   He's the editor-in-chief of MaxStories.net.

01:27:03   Federico, I have two related questions for you this week.

01:27:08   Wow, okay.

01:27:09   What are the best and worst flavored ice creams?

01:27:14   Flavors of ice cream, I should say.

01:27:17   Well, the best is...

01:27:20   Well, I'm a simple guy.

01:27:22   I'm gonna say chocolate.

01:27:25   the best kind. Do you have a particular brand of chocolate ice cream that you enjoy? Oh

01:27:30   well, no, I have a particular ice cream shop that I enjoy. Okay, you want to give them

01:27:34   a shout out? Like a gelato shop, not like, but wait, by ice cream I don't mean like ice

01:27:40   cream that you buy at the supermarket. I was thinking about gelato, so. Well I mean you

01:27:44   can buy gelato at the supermarket too, but yes, you know, artisanal gelato I guess. I

01:27:52   don't know if they would call themselves artisanal, because I'm assuming you're using

01:27:55   some kind of like been around since 1712 or something kind of gelato shop over there in

01:28:03   Italy right?

01:28:04   Mm-hmm.

01:28:05   Yeah.

01:28:06   Good stuff though.

01:28:07   Yeah.

01:28:08   But the worst flavor...

01:28:11   I really dislike lemon as a ice cream flavor.

01:28:19   I really don't get it as a flavor.

01:28:21   Like why would you want to eat?

01:28:22   I like lemon sorbet.

01:28:24   I find it very refreshing.

01:28:26   Yes, that's fantastic after a meal, for example.

01:28:30   It's very... but as a... I'm thinking of like...

01:28:34   on a cone, right?

01:28:36   If I got to pick three flavors...

01:28:37   Right, like creamy, not icy.

01:28:40   Yeah.

01:28:41   Okay.

01:28:42   Yeah, and I really... like, I'm not a huge fan of fruit-based flavors for ice cream.

01:28:50   Mmm, mmm.

01:28:51   I come more of like chocolate, you know

01:28:54   Vanilla that kind of like - I'm very traditional. Yeah, you can find Myke on Twitter as I

01:29:01   My ke and Myke host a whole bunch of shows here on relay FM Myke. Is there anything you want to talk about?

01:29:07   No, I love everyone. Oh, that's good. That's my that's my new that's my new thing. I love it. Love everybody except bad people

01:29:15   You can find me on Twitter as ismh. I write over at 512 pixels net

01:29:21   I like to thank our sponsors this week air buddy bombus and pingdom until next time guys say goodbye

01:29:29   I'd have you there - cheerio. Bye y'all