Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► (upbeat music)

00:00:02 ◼   ► - Hello and welcome to Connected, episode 244.

00:00:12 ◼   ► It's made possible this week by our sponsors,

00:00:15 ◼   ► Backblaze, FreshBooks, and TextExpander.

00:00:18 ◼   ► I'm your host, Steven Hackett,

00:00:20 ◼   ► and I am joined by Mr. Federico Vittucci.

00:00:23 ◼   ► - Hello, Steven Hackett, how are you?

00:00:25 ◼   ► - I'm doing well, how are you on this fine Wednesday?

00:00:28 ◼   ► I am doing better than in the previous weeks.

00:00:31 ◼   ► I'm doing very, very well.

00:00:32 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:00:33 ◼   ► Yes, we're going to talk about that.

00:00:34 ◼   ► There's a lot to cover this week.

00:00:37 ◼   ► And of course, we are joined by everyone's favorite bearded

00:00:41 ◼   ► British man, Myke Hurley.

00:00:43 ◼   ► You put a lot of qualifiers in that one.

00:00:45 ◼   ► I mean, I couldn't say favorite man.

00:00:47 ◼   ► Can't I just be everybody's favorite?

00:00:48 ◼   ► Why can't I just be everybody's favorite?

00:00:50 ◼   ► Because it's Federico's Week.

00:00:52 ◼   ► I'll be everyone's favorite next week.

00:00:54 ◼   ► Next week?

00:00:54 ◼   ► OK, great.

00:00:56 ◼   ► Let's just dive right in.

00:00:57 ◼   ► have a lot of follow up. And we're going to start with hashtag beat Buffett, we're talking

00:01:03 ◼   ► about Warren Buffett's weird iPhone game that's now just in the US and how we felt like the

00:01:10 ◼   ► the high score was probably hard coded. This campaign was a failure. It was we have a tweet

00:01:17 ◼   ► that the highest we've seen was what 12,700 and Warren's I'm looking at the screenshot

00:01:23 ◼   ► Warren Buffett's high score, 15,350.

00:01:26 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:01:27 ◼   ► I do wonder if maybe you put in Warren Buffett as your username, maybe it tricks the game

00:01:33 ◼   ► into giving you a higher score.

00:01:35 ◼   ► I'm surprised that nobody else has tried that before.

00:01:37 ◼   ► Oh, that's interesting.

00:01:39 ◼   ► Maybe you get access to some kind of special mode.

00:01:42 ◼   ► The Warren mode.

00:01:43 ◼   ► The Warren mode.

00:01:44 ◼   ► The Buffett mode.

00:01:45 ◼   ► Can you change your name?

00:01:46 ◼   ► It is clearly very impossible to take that score.

00:01:51 ◼   ► I'll delete the app.

00:01:52 ◼   ► Oh no. I was done. I was done with it. I mean, how many more times am I gonna play it?

00:01:57 ◼   ► I boosted it off into the moon. It's gone. I threw it out of the window like one of these newspapers.

00:02:02 ◼   ► Like you threw out your phone.

00:02:05 ◼   ► I keep dropping my phone all the time. Really?

00:02:08 ◼   ► Yeah, I've got so many. It's covered in scratches now, the screen. I don't know what's wrong with me.

00:02:12 ◼   ► But you have a case, right? You have a case. Yeah, yeah. If I didn't have a case, this thing would have been obliterated before now.

00:02:17 ◼   ► It's taken some real bad like I dropped it a couple of days ago and it hit a shelf

00:02:22 ◼   ► And like yeah on the way down and just like

00:02:26 ◼   ► Catapulted its way across the room. So I'm pleased I have a case

00:02:30 ◼   ► I would have 100% blown through my two Apple Care repairs at this point

00:02:34 ◼   ► Are you sure using the silicon iPhone case like the Apple case? Yeah. Yeah

00:02:38 ◼   ► Do you feel like it's let not grippy enough or you're just suddenly clumsy or like I just I keep dropping it

00:02:44 ◼   ► I don't know what it is. It's not like it's slipping. I just keep dropping it.

00:02:49 ◼   ► It's almost as if the phone is too big and the Max was a mistake.

00:02:53 ◼   ► It's almost as if my hands aren't big enough.

00:02:55 ◼   ► Oh, that's the problem.

00:02:57 ◼   ► That's the real problem.

00:02:59 ◼   ► You should find techniques to grow your hands bigger.

00:03:02 ◼   ► I'm going to look into that. Maybe I should get cases for my hands.

00:03:05 ◼   ► Like a hand extender medication. Something like that must exist. You know, like a pill

00:03:11 ◼   ► that you take and it grows your hand, you know? Or maybe some exercise to extend the

00:03:17 ◼   ► length of your fingers. Is there such an exercise that can do that?

00:03:21 ◼   ► I have no idea. Well, when I was younger, I think my mom convinced me, I don't know

00:03:27 ◼   ► if this is true or not, that there were exercises that you could do to sort of force yourself

00:03:33 ◼   ► to grow taller, like if you remain suspended, like hanging on with your arms, like a bar

00:03:42 ◼   ► or something, you force yourself to grow taller.

00:03:45 ◼   ► This is like some torture rack type stuff.

00:03:47 ◼   ► Yes, it sounds like a torture rack.

00:03:49 ◼   ► It's medieval.

00:03:50 ◼   ► I think it's a medieval technique.

00:03:52 ◼   ► I'm pretty sure that it's not true.

00:03:54 ◼   ► I'm not sure it's a good idea.

00:03:56 ◼   ► But I had a whole problem growing up, because until I was like 14 or 15 I was very short,

00:04:02 ◼   ► I was very short and then in the span of the summer, like two months, I grew by like 12

00:04:08 ◼   ► centimeters and that made me feel a lot better.

00:04:12 ◼   ► It was super awkward when I went back to school in September and I was like a different person.

00:04:16 ◼   ► But yeah, anyway, sorry.

00:04:20 ◼   ► Yes.

00:04:21 ◼   ► Okay, I hope that's enough of that.

00:04:27 ◼   ► Yes.

00:04:28 ◼   ► Sorry.

00:04:29 ◼   ► we have some news from CNET that it seems that they may have fixed the Galaxy Fold.

00:04:37 ◼   ► Samsung may have done it.

00:04:38 ◼   ► Let me talk about the Galaxy Fold. Let me talk about it.

00:04:41 ◼   ► Oh my god. Still.

00:04:43 ◼   ► CNET are reporting on some other reports from some other websites that I've not yet seen.

00:04:48 ◼   ► Wait, this is not even their own report? The reporting from...

00:04:52 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:53 ◼   ► Reporting on other... Okay.

00:04:54 ◼   ► Yeah, they, CNET are reporting based on reports from Yonhap News.

00:05:01 ◼   ► I don't really know what that is, but I'm going on whatever I got.

00:05:07 ◼   ► So apparently Samsung are going to be tucking the protective layer, the kind of screen protector,

00:05:12 ◼   ► under the bezel now so it doesn't come off and people won't want to pick it up.

00:05:15 ◼   ► I don't know how this was ever a thing in the first place.

00:05:19 ◼   ► And they've also reduced the size of some of the hinge parts apparently, so it will

00:05:22 ◼   ► covered by a protective frame better. We'll see. Samsung definitely haven't said this,

00:05:29 ◼   ► but someone is. So, keeping that dream alive, boys.

00:05:33 ◼   ► Yeah, I sure hope that Yonhap News is correct. Nobody hopes it more than me and Samsung's

00:05:40 ◼   ► CEO. And the folks at Yonhap also.

00:05:43 ◼   ► No, they're fine. Yonhap got what they need, right? Like, they've got what they need. It

00:05:47 ◼   ► looks like a Korean website.

00:05:49 ◼   ► Okay. Alright. Well, I'm happy that you're holding on to this glimmer of hope that is the

00:05:59 ◼   ► Galaxy Fold mic. I want this to be true for you, mostly, at this point.

00:06:04 ◼   ► Speaking of things that folded too soon, let's talk about works with Nest.

00:06:09 ◼   ► Oh, that was a transition.

00:06:10 ◼   ► Oh my god. This was the partnership of Nest and some other devices that let them interact,

00:06:17 ◼   ► including the Amazon Echo voice assistant. It worked through this program and some other things.

00:06:23 ◼   ► Google has now extended that through August 31st. They're using the time to work with partners to

00:06:29 ◼   ► make a more permanent solution available, almost as if it's what they should have done in the first

00:06:34 ◼   ► place. What a concept. It's kind of funny, really. You work with these large companies,

00:06:39 ◼   ► and yet you decide just not to bother mentioning to them.

00:06:41 ◼   ► If they had announced this in the first place, saying, "Hey, you have until the end of August,

00:06:47 ◼   ► and then we're gonna move over.

00:06:49 ◼   ► I don't think people would have been upset,

00:06:50 ◼   ► but you pull the rug out from under everybody,

00:06:53 ◼   ► then you have to go back.

00:06:54 ◼   ► They really did it poorly.

00:06:56 ◼   ► - But yet some stuff's never,

00:06:57 ◼   ► like IFTTT is not mentioned, right?

00:07:00 ◼   ► That's probably gone forever.

00:07:02 ◼   ► They called out Amazon as like Google,

00:07:05 ◼   ► in Google's blog posts,

00:07:06 ◼   ► they specifically called out Amazon, right?

00:07:08 ◼   ► That they're gonna work with them.

00:07:09 ◼   ► And they also said that they're gonna work with partners

00:07:12 ◼   ► and they're gonna add assistant features

00:07:15 ◼   ► that will help replace the stuff that's going to be lost.

00:07:17 ◼   ► And they also spoke about, which I do appreciate,

00:07:19 ◼   ► they're like, you know, when we're working with people and adding these things in,

00:07:23 ◼   ► we're actually going to do periodic security reviews of them.

00:07:25 ◼   ► That's going to be part of it.

00:07:27 ◼   ► Good.

00:07:27 ◼   ► But like, see, this is what I mean.

00:07:28 ◼   ► Stuff like that, you're like, yeah, Google, that's a really good point.

00:07:31 ◼   ► Like you should be doing periodic security reviews of the companies

00:07:35 ◼   ► that you allow your products into, right?

00:07:36 ◼   ► Probably nobody else is doing stuff like that, right?

00:07:39 ◼   ► Like you get the certification and then it's all job done.

00:07:43 ◼   ► But that's the type of stuff people want to hear.

00:07:45 ◼   ► They don't want to hear like, oh, all the stuff that you currently are bought into.

00:07:49 ◼   ► We just decided to kill it.

00:07:50 ◼   ► So please buy our products instead.

00:07:53 ◼   ► Up next, I want to talk a little bit about our Macs that has come up on Twitter

00:07:58 ◼   ► in the last week after Myke's promise to buy me an armac if they come out.

00:08:02 ◼   ► Yeah, including if the Mac Pro is an armac, the highest spec.

00:08:06 ◼   ► So just reminding people of that.

00:08:09 ◼   ► That's the one I wish I wouldn't have said the laptop.

00:08:12 ◼   ► Oh, now you wish you wouldn't have said that. That was so obvious.

00:08:15 ◼   ► The laptop, like I could maybe get away with a bit, but like the highest end, the Mac Pro,

00:08:21 ◼   ► I'm still feeling confident about it, maybe. You should feel confident about it.

00:08:25 ◼   ► About the Mac Pro specifically, but like I'm still just a little,

00:08:28 ◼   ► I remain, that's the part that I'm most concerned about.

00:08:31 ◼   ► That's understandable, because it could be very expensive.

00:08:34 ◼   ► So it came up on Twitter, what defines an ARM Mac, because Touch Bar Macs started with the T1 chip,

00:08:42 ◼   ► and now they have the T2 chip and... Can I stop you here for a second? I am unhappy with our

00:08:47 ◼   ► listeners who are trying to like find loopholes. Huh? Right? To be like "Oh, well the T2 chip's an

00:08:55 ◼   ► ARM chip!" No! Shut up is what I say to you, right? You know what I'm saying. Don't try and find

00:09:00 ◼   ► loopholes. This is literally the reason this isn't follow-up, so... No, no, I appreciate you putting

00:09:05 ◼   ► it in here, but I have nothing but disdain for people that made these claims to you, Stephen.

00:09:10 ◼   ► disdain for all of them. I feel there's a, the phenomenon here is that people find it

00:09:16 ◼   ► entertaining when you're forced to spend money. Yeah, yeah, it's why all those YouTube videos

00:09:22 ◼   ► are so popular, right? Like, I'm giving $50,000 to someone for sitting in a car for six hours,

00:09:29 ◼   ► like it's just like a thing. So I think we need to define this a little bit. So yes,

00:09:35 ◼   ► Macs have ARM chips in them now, but they're secondary doing security things in the Touch

00:09:39 ◼   ► or whatever, I think the definition,

00:09:42 ◼   ► I think this is a pretty clear definition,

00:09:44 ◼   ► is that an ARM Mac means the OS or its apps

00:09:48 ◼   ► are running on an ARM processor, right?

00:09:50 ◼   ► It seems like a very simple definition to me

00:09:54 ◼   ► that if the OS or the apps run on something

00:09:57 ◼   ► other than an Intel chip, then it's an ARM Mac.

00:09:59 ◼   ► Like it's not, it's clear.

00:10:02 ◼   ► So then the question came up,

00:10:03 ◼   ► I'm just reiterating what happened on Twitter,

00:10:06 ◼   ► what happens if it's a dual CPU system?

00:10:08 ◼   ► So what if, just hypothetically, I don't necessarily

00:10:11 ◼   ► think this is the case for a lot of-- because it's

00:10:12 ◼   ► super weird and probably expensive.

00:10:14 ◼   ► But let's take the new Mac Pro.

00:10:17 ◼   ► Let's say that it comes with an Intel Xeon in it,

00:10:19 ◼   ► but it also comes with the Apple ARM Mac CPU in it.

00:10:24 ◼   ► And you can run--

00:10:25 ◼   ► it has both.

00:10:27 ◼   ► Again, I think the answer is, does the OS or its apps,

00:10:31 ◼   ► can they run on the ARM processor directly?

00:10:34 ◼   ► And if so, I would say that that is an ARM Mac.

00:10:37 ◼   ► I feel like in good faith I could not argue that point away.

00:10:40 ◼   ► Yeah, I feel like we're all on the same page.

00:10:42 ◼   ► I just wanted to clarify that,

00:10:43 ◼   ► because people are trying to find loopholes,

00:10:45 ◼   ► so I think that's our definition.

00:10:46 ◼   ► 'Cause then I could get you a Mac that does both, right?

00:10:49 ◼   ► Lastly, in follow-up, Myke, this is just for me and you,

00:10:53 ◼   ► we have a co-host on this show who really likes awards.

00:10:57 ◼   ► I feel like he's very--

00:10:58 ◼   ► It's not that I like them, I deserve them.

00:11:00 ◼   ► Yeah, okay, okay.

00:11:01 ◼   ► I feel like he's overcoming some trauma in his past

00:11:05 ◼   ► where he was passed over.

00:11:06 ◼   ► What is possible?

00:11:07 ◼   ► You know, and this has spilled out into the Relay FM newsletter.

00:11:14 ◼   ► There's a new show called Adapt.

00:11:15 ◼   ► We talked about it last week where Federico and Ryan are challenging each other to do

00:11:20 ◼   ► things on the iPad.

00:11:21 ◼   ► It's a great show.

00:11:23 ◼   ► And I interviewed the two of them in the Relay FM membership newsletter.

00:11:28 ◼   ► And there's just a link in the show notes about one of Federico's answers.

00:11:33 ◼   ► Myke, do you want to tell us what this other person wrote?

00:11:36 ◼   ► So the question was, will there be prizes?

00:11:38 ◼   ► I know Federico's really into trophies.

00:11:40 ◼   ► And Federico says, "I like trophies because I deserve them.

00:11:44 ◼   ► As other shows on Relay have proven time and time again,

00:11:46 ◼   ► I hope that ADAPT will allow me to win more trophies in Connected,

00:11:50 ◼   ► whose co-hosts have established an alliance against me

00:11:53 ◼   ► to prevent me from winning additional trophies."

00:11:55 ◼   ► - Now, - Yes.

00:11:57 ◼   ► I feel like we are entering into a very deep and complicated lore here

00:12:00 ◼   ► that I can't comprehend anymore as to how this has occurred.

00:12:05 ◼   ► Well, I believe there is an alliance or a conspiracy against me.

00:12:09 ◼   ► We all have an equal amount of trophies.

00:12:12 ◼   ► We all have one each.

00:12:14 ◼   ► Only one was shaped like a toilet though.

00:12:17 ◼   ► Yeah, and I have that one.

00:12:18 ◼   ► Over time, points were stolen from me over time.

00:12:23 ◼   ► When? Come on!

00:12:25 ◼   ► When? When were they?

00:12:26 ◼   ► In previous predictions and in previous contests that we did, points were not assigned to me.

00:12:34 ◼   ► And you know why the points weren't assigned to you, right? Because you got the answer

00:12:38 ◼   ► wrong. Because you didn't deserve them.

00:12:39 ◼   ► Well that's debatable and you two have teamed up.

00:12:43 ◼   ► Two sides to every story. You two have teamed up and have colluded with

00:12:47 ◼   ► Jason Snell. No collusion.

00:12:49 ◼   ► Yes, there has been.

00:12:52 ◼   ► Easy, easy, easy.

00:12:57 ◼   ► I feel like we would need a report to assess the situation here.

00:13:01 ◼   ► Oh my God.

00:13:04 ◼   ► Well, um.

00:13:06 ◼   ► Are you going to be the person to assign the independent report coordinator?

00:13:11 ◼   ► I would like to have going into WWDC a special investigator looking into the practices that

00:13:19 ◼   ► assigned the points and grade the predictions. Okay. To assure that there will be no collusion.

00:13:27 ◼   ► Sure. Okay. What can we call it? The Gruber Report? Something like that?

00:13:37 ◼   ► We have some big news, gentlemen. Big news. This is actually pretty huge news. Big news. So,

00:13:45 ◼   ► This fall, Relay FM will turn five years old,

00:13:49 ◼   ► which is just, as a side note,

00:13:51 ◼   ► completely mind-blowing to me.

00:13:53 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:13:54 ◼   ► - And we are marking the occasion

00:13:56 ◼   ► with a special live show in San Francisco.

00:13:59 ◼   ► There is a ticket link in the show notes.

00:14:02 ◼   ► This will be on Thursday, August 22nd in San Francisco.

00:14:06 ◼   ► It is going to be a podcasting extravaganza,

00:14:09 ◼   ► so we're going to have a bunch of Relay hosts there

00:14:12 ◼   ► doing some fun stuff.

00:14:14 ◼   ► It's not just like a regular connected or a regular upgrade.

00:14:16 ◼   ► This is gonna be just a full blowout of relay

00:14:20 ◼   ► good fun times.

00:14:23 ◼   ► - Yeah, we're trying to get as many hosts

00:14:24 ◼   ► as soon as we possibly can.

00:14:25 ◼   ► We're trying to get as many people involved

00:14:28 ◼   ► in the episode as possible.

00:14:30 ◼   ► It's gonna be the most ambitious crossover event in history.

00:14:34 ◼   ► Tickets are on sale.

00:14:36 ◼   ► Obviously space is limited because it's a venue

00:14:38 ◼   ► in San Francisco.

00:14:39 ◼   ► I'm very, very, very excited about this.

00:14:43 ◼   ► We obviously have one big live show still to come before this one, but I am very excited

00:14:49 ◼   ► about our fifth anniversary live show.

00:14:52 ◼   ► So we're going to be doing a bunch of stuff throughout the rest of this year, I think,

00:14:58 ◼   ► to try and celebrate our fifth anniversary because it's a pretty big deal for us.

00:15:03 ◼   ► We hope that you'll join us in San Francisco on August 22nd.

00:15:07 ◼   ► I think this will be one that you wouldn't want to miss.

00:15:11 ◼   ► So we're working on some stuff.

00:15:13 ◼   ► We're gonna shoot Myke Hurley out of a cannon. It's gonna be great. I'm like

00:15:17 ◼   ► Actually, you know what? I don't want I will be the one with a surprise at this show

00:15:21 ◼   ► Maybe I'm working on something. I'll let you know later on if it actually pans out

00:15:27 ◼   ► Lastly sort of in this like follow-up topic zero big news section of the show today

00:15:33 ◼   ► Apple sent out invites to the WWDC keynote to everyone's surprise. No one surprise

00:15:39 ◼   ► it is Monday June 3rd in San Jose in the conference center there they're probably

00:15:47 ◼   ► gonna announce some software maybe some hardware we'll see maybe maybe a service

00:15:51 ◼   ► or two you think they could be a service maybe? Maybe the ARM Mac Pro the mic will need to buy

00:15:55 ◼   ► yeah possible maybe the ARM Mac Pro would be possible so the only person

00:16:01 ◼   ► happy about that product if everybody that wants one I actually I would be

00:16:05 ◼   ► happy about that actually. No, but like if everyone that wants to own one, like Steven

00:16:09 ◼   ► will be the only person. Because it's gonna be free. It's true. I can't believe you said

00:16:15 ◼   ► that. I can't believe you made this promise in public. Sometimes I get excited. Well,

00:16:20 ◼   ► a little too much maybe. So here's the question, had you been editing that episode, would you

00:16:25 ◼   ► have edited that promise out? No, I would have stayed in. I'm a man of my word. Good.

00:16:29 ◼   ► Good. Now I know you are, I just wanted that on the record. Much to my detriment. Just

00:16:34 ◼   ► case. So yeah, so WWC is, will be there, all three of us will be of course at WWC all week,

00:16:40 ◼   ► we have our live show that Wednesday night, and Federico and I will be at the keynote,

00:16:45 ◼   ► which is very exciting.

00:16:47 ◼   ► I'm very pleased for you both.

00:16:49 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:16:50 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:16:51 ◼   ► Stephen will get, oh Stephen you don't drink coffee do you? I don't.

00:16:54 ◼   ► I wanted you to experience the terrible WWC coffee with me.

00:16:59 ◼   ► I'll be holding down the fort, being the only one of us bothering to take any notes

00:17:05 ◼   ► from a hotel room somewhere in San Jose.

00:17:07 ◼   ► But I'm very, very happy for my co-hosts that they're going to be going.

00:17:11 ◼   ► Especially Steven, because it's going to be his first Apple event.

00:17:14 ◼   ► So no, that's very exciting, because he deserves it.

00:17:16 ◼   ► I'm super pumped.

00:17:17 ◼   ► So we'll see you in San Jose, if you're in San Jose.

00:17:21 ◼   ► If you're not there, we won't see you.

00:17:22 ◼   ► If you're not there, what's wrong with you?

00:17:24 ◼   ► Really, that's the point.

00:17:26 ◼   ► So, cool.

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00:17:48 ◼   ► A couple of months ago back in, oh, actually in the fall of November,

00:17:50 ◼   ► I was traveling on a family trip.

00:17:52 ◼   ► I was in like rural North Carolina visiting family and I had brought my

00:17:57 ◼   ► laptop and my iPad, but I realized that there's something I need to work on in the evening

00:18:01 ◼   ► and I realized it was in the downloads folder on my iMac at home.

00:18:06 ◼   ► And I'm, you know, hundreds of miles away.

00:18:09 ◼   ► And then I remembered that all that stuff gets backed up on Backblaze.

00:18:12 ◼   ► I was able to log into my account and download that file because Backblaze had backed it

00:18:16 ◼   ► up from my iMac at home.

00:18:18 ◼   ► It was in their service, I could go download it from where I was.

00:18:23 ◼   ► Backblaze is so much more than just a backup solution.

00:18:25 ◼   ► It's really a safety net when you travel.

00:18:27 ◼   ► I definitely saved my bacon on that trip.

00:18:29 ◼   ► And you can sign up for a 15-day free trial

00:18:31 ◼   ► with no credit card acquired at backblaze.com/connected.

00:18:36 ◼   ► Backblaze backs up documents, music, photos, videos,

00:18:39 ◼   ► drawings, projects, everything on your computer

00:18:42 ◼   ► that's important to you.

00:18:44 ◼   ► And they really know what they're doing.

00:18:46 ◼   ► They've backed up over 750 petabytes of data.

00:18:50 ◼   ► They host these great blog posts

00:18:52 ◼   ► where they show how they build their pods

00:18:55 ◼   ► full of hard drives.

00:18:56 ◼   ► They do real engineering to make this possible.

00:18:59 ◼   ► At 750 million gigabytes, it's incredible.

00:19:02 ◼   ► So avoid that looming data disaster.

00:19:05 ◼   ► Go to backblaze.com/connected

00:19:07 ◼   ► for your unrestricted free trial

00:19:09 ◼   ► and to tell them that you heard about them on Connected.

00:19:12 ◼   ► That's backblaze.com/connected.

00:19:15 ◼   ► Head over there now.

00:19:16 ◼   ► Thank you to Backblaze for saving us

00:19:18 ◼   ► from countless data disasters

00:19:19 ◼   ► and for their support of this show and Relay FM.

00:19:23 ◼   ► We've got a couple of new apps we wanna talk about.

00:19:25 ◼   ► Myke, I know you are a big time tracker.

00:19:28 ◼   ► You've been doing a lot longer than I have.

00:19:30 ◼   ► So could you tell us about Timery?

00:19:32 ◼   ► - Yeah, I can.

00:19:33 ◼   ► I love this application.

00:19:36 ◼   ► I'm very happy that it's out now,

00:19:37 ◼   ► so people will stop asking me when it's gonna come out.

00:19:40 ◼   ► This Timery is a third-party time tracking app

00:19:47 ◼   ► which uses the service Toggle,

00:19:50 ◼   ► which is a time tracking application that I use

00:19:52 ◼   ► and I'm a fan of, but the Toggle app

00:19:54 ◼   ► always left a lot to be desired. That's generous, they're not very good. I'm really trying to be kind,

00:20:00 ◼   ► I'm trying my best to be kind. I am a big fan of this application because it does everything that

00:20:09 ◼   ► I want. It looks great, it's very simple, it's very fast to start timers. One of the things I

00:20:14 ◼   ► like about this app, when you go in to start a timer, the first thing you do is start the timer

00:20:19 ◼   ► running before you enter any of the information in, which just feels like the right way around

00:20:24 ◼   ► to do things to me. It's made by a developer whose name is Joseph Hribar, who's a super nice guy too.

00:20:30 ◼   ► I've been on this beta for quite a few months and he's been very accommodating of little features

00:20:39 ◼   ► that I think would be good for the application. But as somebody who really believes in and quite

00:20:44 ◼   ► heavily time tracks, I have a lot of thoughts about these types of things. But the application

00:20:50 ◼   ► is very nice. I like that all of the entries are categorized really well and I can kind of at

00:20:54 ◼   ► a glance get an idea of how much time I'm tracking. I use the widget that it has, the notification

00:21:00 ◼   ► center widget constantly for a couple of things. One, it shows your current timer and you can stop

00:21:05 ◼   ► it from there. It's like a super quick way for me to stop the timer. But you can also have listed

00:21:10 ◼   ► there and in other views of the application saved timers. So if you have specific timers with like

00:21:16 ◼   ► projects and tags that are very frequent for you. You can set them up so you can quite quickly,

00:21:21 ◼   ► like when you first open the application, just fire them off because they're all kind of like

00:21:25 ◼   ► templates that you can hit or they live in the widget. And it also has extensive series

00:21:29 ◼   ► shortcut support where you can basically create whatever timer you want and it can be fired off

00:21:36 ◼   ► with shortcuts. And there's a couple of other shortcuts in there too, to like check the current

00:21:39 ◼   ► entry, stop the current entry, that kind of stuff. I haven't used the shortcuts too much because,

00:21:45 ◼   ► to be honest, like, I...

00:21:49 ◼   ► Well, the reason is,

00:21:53 ◼   ► when I'm doing the work, I'm usually at a device,

00:21:56 ◼   ► and so I just set it up on the device.

00:21:59 ◼   ► Yeah, this is my problem with this, or not my problem,

00:22:02 ◼   ► but I haven't used them either because if I'm doing work,

00:22:04 ◼   ► I'm either at my Mac and I have toggle running,

00:22:07 ◼   ► or I'm on my iPad or my phone with time-re.

00:22:10 ◼   ► So I don't, I just open the app and do it.

00:22:12 ◼   ► Maybe that's just, you know, months of muscle memory and I'll like move to using Siri at some point,

00:22:18 ◼   ► but it hasn't made a big impact on me yet. I mean, but this is like maybe a part of a

00:22:23 ◼   ► larger conversation for the fact that I actually do not ever trigger shortcuts by voice. Ever.

00:22:28 ◼   ► Interesting. We can, we should probably talk about this at another time, but like I, I,

00:22:34 ◼   ► I continue to find the experience to be less than reliable. Like I, I need what I feel like

00:22:42 ◼   ► would be constant reliability from that feature.

00:22:44 ◼   ► And I feel like I can't get it because Siri too frequently is trying to jump in.

00:22:49 ◼   ► Like, for example, this app's name is Timery, right?

00:22:52 ◼   ► Or and I think of my toggle timers as timers.

00:22:57 ◼   ► Siri does not like me to use the word timer.

00:23:00 ◼   ► Siri gets very upset if I use the word timer.

00:23:03 ◼   ► And then it's like, how far do I really want to go

00:23:07 ◼   ► to change my own mental model for what I'm calling things?

00:23:10 ◼   ► And to be honest, it's not far enough, right?

00:23:13 ◼   ► Like, I don't want to start thinking about my time tracking and my time tracking

00:23:17 ◼   ► timers as like different words, because if I say like what, like if I say like, I set

00:23:23 ◼   ► up a specific phrase and I ask Siri for it and then the HomePod just tells me I don't

00:23:28 ◼   ► have any timers running.

00:23:29 ◼   ► But what it's doing is looking for food or cook like the timers that I set for the

00:23:33 ◼   ► clock app. You know what I mean?

00:23:35 ◼   ► Like stuff like that is just too frustrating for me, which is probably why I haven't got

00:23:39 ◼   ► that far with shortcuts because a lot of the applications and things that I want to do

00:23:43 ◼   ► are things that the HomePod can do natively or Siri can do natively, right? So it's like calendar

00:23:48 ◼   ► stuff and email stuff or whatever. And then the nomenclature is too close to what Siri thinks

00:23:55 ◼   ► is native stuff. Right? Federico, do you find that? I mean, I'm sure that you probably have

00:24:01 ◼   ► like a whole set of words that you use instead, but is what I'm saying... I do have the word

00:24:07 ◼   ► Timer in them. Yeah, you see sometimes it works for me and sometimes it doesn't. It's the second

00:24:12 ◼   ► it's the second word like for example I have I have article timer and that starts the mac stories

00:24:19 ◼   ► posts timer that I have or I have like um I guess it depends I have a mix of them but I know that

00:24:27 ◼   ► at least five or six of them have the word timer in it and um it's just I was listening to you both

00:24:34 ◼   ► and I'm the complete opposite.

00:24:36 ◼   ► So I work on the iPad and I have

00:24:38 ◼   ► Timery there.

00:24:39 ◼   ► And in fact, most of the time it's

00:24:41 ◼   ► in SlideOver.

00:24:42 ◼   ► But I think it's just easier for me

00:24:43 ◼   ► to to just shout

00:24:45 ◼   ► at the HomePod and

00:24:47 ◼   ► start a timer.

00:24:48 ◼   ► And it's relatively fast.

00:24:50 ◼   ► It takes a couple of seconds.

00:24:51 ◼   ► I just...

00:24:52 ◼   ► I mean, maybe maybe I should look

00:24:53 ◼   ► at it again. I mean, honestly, it

00:24:55 ◼   ► was kind of just like I was I was

00:24:57 ◼   ► frustrated with it for a while, like

00:24:59 ◼   ► it wasn't giving me exactly what I

00:25:00 ◼   ► wanted and then I just stopped using

00:25:01 ◼   ► it.

00:25:02 ◼   ► I mean, I use shortcuts all the

00:25:04 ◼   ► the time, but I manually activate them, right?

00:25:07 ◼   ► And so plus, I think what it is as well, a lot of the shortcuts that I want to run,

00:25:12 ◼   ► we're really kind of pushing into our last topic today already.

00:25:16 ◼   ► A lot of the shortcuts that I want to run, they require action from me.

00:25:21 ◼   ► So I feel like I can't get into a groove of always wanting

00:25:26 ◼   ► to activate my shortcuts by voice because I can't activate them all by voice.

00:25:32 ◼   ► If I was to think that, oh, shortcuts can always be Siri because I can,

00:25:36 ◼   ► Siri can ask me a question and I can give an answer, I think I'll be more inclined to do it,

00:25:40 ◼   ► you know? But the fact that like some you can and some you can't, some are like,

00:25:45 ◼   ► oh, go check it on your phone. It's like, well, I should have just done this in the first place

00:25:48 ◼   ► then, shouldn't I? So like, I think that that kind of disconnect is one of the things that's

00:25:51 ◼   ► kept me away from using Siri for shortcuts, because it's not a consistent experience as

00:25:57 ◼   ► to what I can actually achieve. And I think that's one of the things that's kind of like

00:26:00 ◼   ► kept me away from it. But Timery is really good. Genuinely, if you are interested in time tracking,

00:26:11 ◼   ► you should try it anyway and you should sign up for toggle. This only works with toggle,

00:26:14 ◼   ► this application. It's like a third party app for this service. But if you are a toggle user,

00:26:19 ◼   ► no question you should be using this app. It is so much better than the toggle app. The one thing

00:26:25 ◼   ► it doesn't have is reports, but how often are you checking those? And when you need them, just go to

00:26:30 ◼   ► to the website anyway because they suck in the iPhone app as it is so like that

00:26:34 ◼   ► I think that this application is fantastic and I really really urge

00:26:39 ◼   ► people to try it out it's free to download free to try and it has a

00:26:44 ◼   ► subscription which enables a bunch more features I really really really love

00:26:49 ◼   ► this application it's lived on my home screen since like the day I got the first

00:26:54 ◼   ► beta and it has really made like a significant difference in how I've been

00:26:59 ◼   ► tracking my time. Like I use this way more than I,

00:27:03 ◼   ► but I don't use my shortcuts workflows, any shortcuts workflows,

00:27:07 ◼   ► my shortcuts shortcuts for this stuff anymore.

00:27:09 ◼   ► Like the stuff that Federico built and I've started to replace,

00:27:13 ◼   ► like I have some more complicated ones that like set timers and open

00:27:16 ◼   ► applications or whatever.

00:27:18 ◼   ► And I'm slowly starting to like and have been for a while going through and

00:27:21 ◼   ► replacing all of those with, uh,

00:27:23 ◼   ► with time-ery actions instead because I just prefer the way that the app works.

00:27:28 ◼   ► and I think that it is really well made and it's very well focused and I'm a big fan.

00:27:32 ◼   ► Yeah, I absolutely love Timery.

00:27:36 ◼   ► It has replaced all of my workflows and now shortcuts.

00:27:40 ◼   ► As I mentioned, I activate the shortcuts via voice all the time,

00:27:45 ◼   ► either on my phone or the watch or one of the many home pods that I have.

00:27:50 ◼   ► I also do only have one home pod as well.

00:27:53 ◼   ► Maybe that's like well, one home.

00:27:55 ◼   ► I only have home pods in one room.

00:27:57 ◼   ► Like I don't have them in my office, but I could always just ask because then because that's the other thing.

00:28:01 ◼   ► I'm sorry, I'm going I'm going back to this again.

00:28:03 ◼   ► The home pods are in the other room.

00:28:06 ◼   ► And then if I say the the high telephone phrase,

00:28:09 ◼   ► even though I then can't hear what it's saying to me properly,

00:28:13 ◼   ► but it can hear me and then my phone won't do it anyway.

00:28:16 ◼   ► Man, I'm on one today. I'm sorry.

00:28:20 ◼   ► But I also in addition to the to to the voice shortcuts,

00:28:24 ◼   ► I also use the Siri shortcuts for Timery as actions,

00:28:29 ◼   ► as little action steps, part of my longer custom shortcuts

00:28:33 ◼   ► in the shortcuts app.

00:28:35 ◼   ► So for example, I have a shortcut that I run

00:28:38 ◼   ► before I sit down to record a podcast,

00:28:41 ◼   ► and this shortcut looks into my calendar,

00:28:44 ◼   ► and depending on the event name,

00:28:47 ◼   ► which would be connected or app stories or adapt,

00:28:50 ◼   ► it starts a different

00:28:52 ◼   ► timer shortcut, depending

00:28:55 ◼   ► on the podcast that I'm about to

00:28:57 ◼   ► record.

00:28:57 ◼   ► I need to do this one.

00:28:58 ◼   ► I need to do that. You told me about

00:29:00 ◼   ► this before. And I feel like I have

00:29:01 ◼   ► an idea of how you would build it,

00:29:03 ◼   ► right? Like just hearing you say

00:29:04 ◼   ► that. And I really need to look into

00:29:06 ◼   ► that.

00:29:06 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:29:07 ◼   ► So I also want to call out

00:29:10 ◼   ► the integration with tagging

00:29:12 ◼   ► and tasks.

00:29:13 ◼   ► These are two separate toggle

00:29:15 ◼   ► features. So tags

00:29:18 ◼   ► allow you to just

00:29:20 ◼   ► tag your timers and later you can use these tags as filters

00:29:24 ◼   ► or just as a better organization

00:29:26 ◼   ► if you wanna use the reports in the web app.

00:29:29 ◼   ► And unfortunately reports and stats

00:29:31 ◼   ► are not available yet in Timery.

00:29:33 ◼   ► But there's an API for those,

00:29:36 ◼   ► so hopefully the developer will implement reports

00:29:38 ◼   ► and stats in the future.

00:29:40 ◼   ► Tasks are something that not a lot of people know about

00:29:44 ◼   ► because it requires a premium toggle account.

00:29:47 ◼   ► If you just use toggle for free,

00:29:51 ◼   ► the task feature will be completely hidden

00:29:53 ◼   ► from time area as well.

00:29:55 ◼   ► But if you're a premium toggle user,

00:29:57 ◼   ► you will be able to organize your projects

00:30:00 ◼   ► with tasks which are effectively like sub projects.

00:30:05 ◼   ► So for example, I have max stories

00:30:07 ◼   ► and using the toggle task functionality,

00:30:10 ◼   ► I can have max stories articles or max stories admin.

00:30:14 ◼   ► You know, it's a way to break down a project

00:30:15 ◼   ► into multiple areas.

00:30:17 ◼   ► And with Timery, you can completely manage those tasks,

00:30:21 ◼   ► and you can create saved timers for a specific project

00:30:25 ◼   ► and a specific sub-task.

00:30:26 ◼   ► It's really well done.

00:30:27 ◼   ► And yeah, I guess there's one feature

00:30:32 ◼   ► that John called out in our review on Mac stories,

00:30:37 ◼   ► which is something that the Toggle Web App

00:30:39 ◼   ► for desktop computers does very well,

00:30:42 ◼   ► is the ability to group related timers.

00:30:46 ◼   ► So for example, if during the day you've been working on and off on different projects,

00:30:51 ◼   ► the toggle web app aggregates all the timers belonging to the same project into one condensed view,

00:30:59 ◼   ► and there's a button on the right that you can press to expand all of those timers.

00:31:04 ◼   ► And it's just a way to condense all of the related timers into a more compact list.

00:31:10 ◼   ► And I would like to see a similar grouping in Timery as well,

00:31:13 ◼   ► because right now Timery only lists your timers in reverse chronological order,

00:31:19 ◼   ► so from the latest to the oldest.

00:31:22 ◼   ► But I would like to see the grouping like the Toggle web app for desktop,

00:31:26 ◼   ► because for some reason the Toggle mobile app also does not do grouping.

00:31:32 ◼   ► Because the Toggle mobile app basically does nothing.

00:31:35 ◼   ► And what it does, it just continues to do it in varying ways of bad.

00:31:40 ◼   ► I've never known an application like this.

00:31:41 ◼   ► Give them some credit. They launched the iPad version a mere two weeks ago.

00:31:46 ◼   ► They did. I mean, at least it honestly, at least it finally exists, but don't need it because

00:31:51 ◼   ► Timery is universal.

00:31:53 ◼   ► Yes, of course. And it's very good.

00:31:55 ◼   ► And it's one of the, I'm going to call it, it's going to be for sure one of the best app

00:32:01 ◼   ► launches of the year in 2019.

00:32:03 ◼   ► Damn!

00:32:04 ◼   ► I mean, it's super awesome.

00:32:05 ◼   ► And we all use it at Mac stories.

00:32:07 ◼   ► It's really good.

00:32:09 ◼   ► Yeah, so...

00:32:11 ◼   ► Hopefully now Myke...

00:32:13 ◼   ► Just want a Mac version.

00:32:15 ◼   ► Mac version, Mac version, Mac version.

00:32:17 ◼   ► Just wait till the end of the year, no problem.

00:32:19 ◼   ► This is perfect for Marzipan.

00:32:21 ◼   ► It'll run really well on my ARM Mac Pro in December.

00:32:23 ◼   ► It will, it will run natively on your ARM Mac Pro.

00:32:26 ◼   ► Hopefully Myke now in the Cortex subreddit people will stop asking

00:32:30 ◼   ► "When's the time tracking app that Myke and Gray keep mentioning?"

00:32:33 ◼   ► I'm not kidding, I'm not kidding, it's switched over now.

00:32:36 ◼   ► now now people are asking me for Android replace like oh no replacements it's

00:32:40 ◼   ► like I can't help you you know I can't help you like you know if you listen you

00:32:43 ◼   ► know I can't help you I have nothing for you super glad it's here but it's not

00:32:49 ◼   ► the only new app we want to talk about this week our friend and sometimes enemy

00:32:53 ◼   ► Casey lists frenemy has frenemy frenemy of the show it's not he's not he's not

00:32:59 ◼   ► my enemy is Casey's a lovely man he smells like cantaloupe when you're up

00:33:05 ◼   ► close to it's very strange it's kind of comforting what is cantaloupe like a

00:33:08 ◼   ► melon it's like a orange melon I thought was like an animal like an antelope

00:33:13 ◼   ► anyway Casey yes well okay see so he's been talking about this on ATP and

00:33:20 ◼   ► analog for a while now and it's finally here it's called vignette and it is it's

00:33:25 ◼   ► like the perfect iOS app that takes a very narrow set of problems and just

00:33:31 ◼   ► executes very well on top of them.

00:33:34 ◼   ► So the issue is we all probably in our contacts

00:33:37 ◼   ► have people that we text with all the time

00:33:39 ◼   ► or talk to all the time,

00:33:41 ◼   ► and they don't have a photo in our contacts.

00:33:42 ◼   ► It's just a gray circle with their initials over it.

00:33:45 ◼   ► And look, I don't wanna live like that.

00:33:47 ◼   ► I wanna live looking at people's faces.

00:33:49 ◼   ► And in the past, before this app,

00:33:51 ◼   ► that meant you have to go around to Twitter

00:33:53 ◼   ► and find people's pictures.

00:33:54 ◼   ► Maybe you took a picture of them at a wedding

00:33:56 ◼   ► and you drop it into contacts on the Mac,

00:33:58 ◼   ► but then it beach balls and crashes

00:33:59 ◼   ► 'cause it's contacts on the Mac.

00:34:01 ◼   ► and it was very difficult to keep your contact database photos updated.

00:34:05 ◼   ► Casey's app is designed to solve that.

00:34:07 ◼   ► So it's an iPhone app.

00:34:09 ◼   ► It skims your local contacts database.

00:34:11 ◼   ► It does not upload them anywhere.

00:34:13 ◼   ► It does not log into any of your accounts.

00:34:16 ◼   ► It's all local on the device, which I love.

00:34:18 ◼   ► So there are other services like this, like on the web.

00:34:21 ◼   ► It's like you got to do some things your contacts you don't want to do.

00:34:24 ◼   ► This app's all local and it searches for the people in your database.

00:34:28 ◼   ► So it looks at Gravatar,

00:34:31 ◼   ► which is where the bulk of mine came from.

00:34:33 ◼   ► Someone's email address is in a contact record.

00:34:35 ◼   ► They use that email address on Gravatar.

00:34:37 ◼   ► It pulls their photo in.

00:34:39 ◼   ► But it can also look at their Twitter profile,

00:34:41 ◼   ► Instagram or Facebook, if you have their links

00:34:45 ◼   ► to their social media accounts in your records

00:34:48 ◼   ► of your contacts.

00:34:48 ◼   ► And I don't have any of those.

00:34:50 ◼   ► Most people probably don't.

00:34:51 ◼   ► So Gravatar was the big fallback for me.

00:34:53 ◼   ► But it goes out and fetches those images

00:34:55 ◼   ► and then gives you a list saying,

00:34:57 ◼   ► I found 32 people with updated images and it lets you select.

00:35:01 ◼   ► I want to override all of them.

00:35:03 ◼   ► I just want to override a select few.

00:35:05 ◼   ► For instance, I have some people in my contacts that I very carefully chose the photo that

00:35:11 ◼   ► I have for them in my contacts list.

00:35:13 ◼   ► It's not necessarily the one they use on Twitter or elsewhere.

00:35:17 ◼   ► So I could just skip over those people and use the photo that I already had.

00:35:22 ◼   ► You hit apply and it applies to them and they sync everywhere and it's awesome.

00:35:26 ◼   ► This is like the perfect example of you have an idea which is a thing that people actually

00:35:32 ◼   ► want to fix and then you make an app that perfectly fixes it.

00:35:36 ◼   ► It's just like, I think Casey did a really great job and like obviously he's a very close

00:35:40 ◼   ► friend but I'm actually really proud of him because I think he's done a very very good

00:35:44 ◼   ► job with this application and I think that it is worth people's time.

00:35:49 ◼   ► Especially because you can download the app for free and do the scan of your contacts

00:35:54 ◼   ► and you only pay when you apply the features.

00:35:59 ◼   ► You pay and then you can apply the updates

00:36:02 ◼   ► and then you can then do it for as many times as you want from that point.

00:36:05 ◼   ► But you can actually see it's like a try before you buy.

00:36:08 ◼   ► You can actually see if it's going to be of a benefit to you,

00:36:10 ◼   ► because if you have a lot of friends who don't have any like a gravatar

00:36:15 ◼   ► and you haven't put that information into the contact database

00:36:18 ◼   ► like their Twitter account or their Facebook account or whatever,

00:36:20 ◼   ► it's not going to find anything.

00:36:23 ◼   ► So I think he did a really good job with the way in which he has done things,

00:36:27 ◼   ► because you can work out if his app's going to be of any use to you before you buy it.

00:36:31 ◼   ► I think he's done a genuine, I'm very proud of him.

00:36:34 ◼   ► I think he's done a great job.

00:36:36 ◼   ► We recorded an episode of Analog yesterday,

00:36:38 ◼   ► which was fun because I always like talking to people just before

00:36:43 ◼   ► something happens because you can kind of get those raw feelings.

00:36:46 ◼   ► So if you're interested in what kind of like what it was like for him to make the app

00:36:51 ◼   ► and then what it felt for him the day before he released it.

00:36:53 ◼   ► You can go listen to episode 157 of analog.

00:36:56 ◼   ► But this app is definitely worth your time as well,

00:36:58 ◼   ► because it has actually genuinely solved the thing that I wanted solved.

00:37:05 ◼   ► So it's great.

00:37:06 ◼   ► Yeah, it's a very good app.

00:37:08 ◼   ► And I'm like, I was surprised

00:37:12 ◼   ► to how many of my contacts were without profile pictures.

00:37:16 ◼   ► And it's just it's such a simple idea and it's been realized so well.

00:37:21 ◼   ► and even the thought of adding a custom field for Instagram to the contact card, that was genius.

00:37:28 ◼   ► So I should also point out that I'm only friends with folks who make great apps. So, you know,

00:37:37 ◼   ► the disclaimer of saying "Walkaes is a friend" of course he's a friend because he makes great apps.

00:37:41 ◼   ► I cannot be friends with developers who make terrible apps. It's like, for example,

00:37:49 ◼   ► Like, all of my friends are handsome and beautiful.

00:37:52 ◼   ► Like, I cannot be friends with ugly people.

00:37:54 ◼   ► Yes.

00:37:55 ◼   ► So, I have very high standards for my friends,

00:37:58 ◼   ► and my friends make great stuff.

00:38:00 ◼   ► So, I have, you know, I have filters for my personal life,

00:38:06 ◼   ► and this is one of them.

00:38:08 ◼   ► So, it's only natural that this is a great app,

00:38:10 ◼   ► because it's my friend.

00:38:11 ◼   ► So, if it sucked, I would have told Casey,

00:38:13 ◼   ► "This app sucks, and you're no longer my friend."

00:38:15 ◼   ► Yeah, if one of your friends makes a bad app.

00:38:18 ◼   ► "Oh, I get upset. I get upset. I get real upset." Like, what have you done?

00:38:21 ◼   ► You have to break up with them. You ruined everything.

00:38:24 ◼   ► I was working on a project a while back with another person, and he came up to me with

00:38:29 ◼   ► something that was ugly and terrible. Like, I basically told him, "Why would you bring this

00:38:37 ◼   ► to my attention? Like, this is a waste of time. Do you know me at all?" And eventually we figured it

00:38:43 ◼   ► out. You know, I have very high standards for everything. So, yep, I'm sorry. This is

00:38:49 ◼   ► just who I am. Oh, okay. Wasn't expecting that look into your psyche, but here we are.

00:38:54 ◼   ► Hey, look, you should as long as you know yourself, you know, all right, we have some

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00:40:57 ◼   ► MacBook Pros!

00:40:58 ◼   ► We're gonna chant, you ready?

00:41:00 ◼   ► MacBook Pros!

00:41:01 ◼   ► You gonna chant?

00:41:02 ◼   ► Come on.

00:41:03 ◼   ► Do we have to talk about this?

00:41:05 ◼   ► Yes.

00:41:06 ◼   ► Is it important?

00:41:07 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:08 ◼   ► I have to talk about it.

00:41:09 ◼   ► I mean, if you want to get a coffee or something.

00:41:10 ◼   ► Apple released a revision to their laptop plan yesterday.

00:41:14 ◼   ► So just to confirm, this is important?

00:41:16 ◼   ► Yes.

00:41:17 ◼   ► Okay.

00:41:18 ◼   ► Cool, cool.

00:41:19 ◼   ► No, no, just cool.

00:41:20 ◼   ► It is.

00:41:21 ◼   ► Alright.

00:41:22 ◼   ► You can take a break, because you've got to talk a lot next.

00:41:25 ◼   ► Yeah, go get a coffee.

00:41:27 ◼   ► Take a walk.

00:41:28 ◼   ► I don't need...

00:41:29 ◼   ► Yeah, okay.

00:41:30 ◼   ► I was just double checking.

00:41:31 ◼   ► No, it's fine.

00:41:32 ◼   ► We can just call you back.

00:41:33 ◼   ► Yes, okay.

00:41:34 ◼   ► So Apple...

00:41:35 ◼   ► For the last several years now, Apple has sort of cleared the decks before WWDC with

00:41:39 ◼   ► announcements that aren't going to be in the keynote.

00:41:41 ◼   ► I think sometimes they use these to signal expectations.

00:41:45 ◼   ► Whatever the case is this year, there are some new MacBook Pros.

00:41:49 ◼   ► So very quickly, the 13 inch width touch bar got a spec bump to faster CPUs in the base

00:41:55 ◼   ► model and faster turbo speeds.

00:41:57 ◼   ► So same machine, same 16 gig RAM limit, but faster Intel CPUs.

00:42:04 ◼   ► Still the same generation, the eighth generation, but the 15 inch is really where most of the

00:42:09 ◼   ► attention was placed with new six core and for the first time, eight core ninth generation

00:42:17 ◼   ► Intel CPUs.

00:42:18 ◼   ► So the 2399 model is six core i7,

00:42:22 ◼   ► 2800 bucks will get you an eight core i9,

00:42:28 ◼   ► and you can configure an eight core i9

00:42:30 ◼   ► with up to five gigahertz turbo boost.

00:42:32 ◼   ► Apple says this is the fastest MacBook Pro

00:42:35 ◼   ► they've ever shipped.

00:42:36 ◼   ► It includes, of course, options for the Vega graphics

00:42:39 ◼   ► that they added towards the end of the year last year.

00:42:42 ◼   ► So in July, they had a big update to the MacBook Pro,

00:42:44 ◼   ► that's where mine came from.

00:42:45 ◼   ► They had a release in the fall with new GPUs,

00:42:47 ◼   ► they have these. I totally love that Apple is spec bumping this computer as

00:42:53 ◼   ► they can. You know, there was for such a long time there, it felt like their eye was

00:42:57 ◼   ► off the ball with these sorts of updates. This is, Federico, to your point, this is not

00:43:01 ◼   ► that necessarily that exciting of a MacBook Pro update unless you just

00:43:04 ◼   ► really wanted eight cores. I mean, if you're really pushing a MacBook Pro, this is good

00:43:08 ◼   ► news. But for most people, including myself, this isn't going to make me go

00:43:11 ◼   ► out and radically change my setup, but it's a signal that Apple is

00:43:16 ◼   ► willing to update these machines as it can, you know, every 10 months, 12 months somewhere

00:43:21 ◼   ► in there.

00:43:22 ◼   ► So I think that's awesome.

00:43:24 ◼   ► But I do think it raises some questions.

00:43:27 ◼   ► And I've got a handful of them.

00:43:29 ◼   ► One, will we ever see a 15 inch without a dedicated GPU again, so in the 2015 generation,

00:43:35 ◼   ► and before the baseline 15 inch you could get with just the Intel integrated graphics.

00:43:40 ◼   ► And as Marco talked about, sort of in that time, and as I agreed with, that was kind

00:43:45 ◼   ► the machine to get if you wanted a bigger screen but you valued battery life and heat because the

00:43:51 ◼   ► dedicated GPU runs a little hotter obviously has an impact on battery life. If you didn't need the GPU

00:43:57 ◼   ► but you just wanted the screen size that was a really good option and that has gone away with

00:44:02 ◼   ► with the Thunderbolt 3 machines and who knows if we'll ever see it again but it's kind of just a

00:44:09 ◼   ► an asterisk on anytime they update these. But what's more interesting is what is going on with

00:44:14 ◼   ► with the 12 inch MacBook and the non-Touch Bar MacBook Pro,

00:44:18 ◼   ► which Federico Lovingly calls the MacBook Escape.

00:44:21 ◼   ► - No, I do not.

00:44:21 ◼   ► I came back from my walk to say that I do not.

00:44:24 ◼   ► - I ran.

00:44:25 ◼   ► - The Verge called it the MacBook Escape in their article.

00:44:29 ◼   ► - What, The Verge is wrong?

00:44:30 ◼   ► The Verge is not God.

00:44:31 ◼   ► - I'm just saying, like, I mean,

00:44:33 ◼   ► that was Marco's nickname, so that's pretty awesome.

00:44:35 ◼   ► It's made it into, like, mainstream.

00:44:37 ◼   ► - Well, we're gonna have to revise this friend's situation

00:44:40 ◼   ► with Marco then, if he insists on using nicknames.

00:44:42 ◼   ► - Wait a second.

00:44:44 ◼   ► - Does that override, he makes a good app,

00:44:46 ◼   ► does that override his app?

00:44:47 ◼   ► - See, that's the problem, he makes a great app,

00:44:50 ◼   ► but he uses nicknames, so they sort of cancel out.

00:44:53 ◼   ► - Interesting.

00:44:54 ◼   ► - I guess we'll have to establish--

00:44:55 ◼   ► - So he's on a level playing field.

00:44:57 ◼   ► - Yeah, well--

00:44:57 ◼   ► - So now I guess it's all about how attractive you find him.

00:45:00 ◼   ► - Well, I guess we'll have to wait and see,

00:45:02 ◼   ► I know he's been working out, he's been working out.

00:45:04 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:45:06 ◼   ► We'll check it out with him.

00:45:07 ◼   ► - The beard looks good.

00:45:08 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:45:09 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:45:10 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:45:12 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:45:14 ◼   ► He's a dog person, he's a dog person.

00:45:16 ◼   ► So by default he wins.

00:45:18 ◼   ► So if you're a dog person,

00:45:20 ◼   ► that defeats all the other factors.

00:45:23 ◼   ► So being--

00:45:24 ◼   ► - So you can be not good looking,

00:45:27 ◼   ► make a bad app and use nicknames,

00:45:29 ◼   ► but if you have a dog, you're all good.

00:45:31 ◼   ► - We can have some kind of acquaintance, yes.

00:45:34 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, yeah, that'd be fine.

00:45:37 ◼   ► But if you're not good looking,

00:45:39 ◼   ► make a bad app and use nicknames

00:45:42 ◼   ► and also are a cat person, just don't even like,

00:45:46 ◼   ► don't even walk near me, yeah.

00:45:49 ◼   ► - What is your email address?

00:45:51 ◼   ► - It's on my website.

00:45:53 ◼   ► - Okay, great, cool, cool, cool.

00:45:54 ◼   ► - So if you, please send me feedback.

00:45:56 ◼   ► I really want to hear what you think about my weird

00:46:00 ◼   ► and twisted psyche. - Grading system

00:46:01 ◼   ► for human people. - Yes, mm-hmm.

00:46:03 ◼   ► You were talking about this very important computer, yes.

00:46:07 ◼   ► - Something. - GPUs.

00:46:08 ◼   ► - Yes, so this is now the second release.

00:46:11 ◼   ► This is now the second release where these two machines

00:46:15 ◼   ► have not gotten an update.

00:46:16 ◼   ► They are the same as they were in 2017,

00:46:19 ◼   ► which means the old keyboard, old CPUs.

00:46:21 ◼   ► My thought is that the non-Touch Bar machine

00:46:26 ◼   ► is only there for a price point.

00:46:28 ◼   ► The Touch Bar 13-inch is pretty expensive.

00:46:30 ◼   ► It also feels sort of irrelevant

00:46:32 ◼   ► in the era of the new MacBook Air.

00:46:35 ◼   ► The Air kind of fills that price point.

00:46:37 ◼   ► So do you need a MacBook Pro there?

00:46:38 ◼   ► Is it just legacy?

00:46:39 ◼   ► What's the deal?

00:46:40 ◼   ► I still think, as I predicted, I think,

00:46:42 ◼   ► or it was a non-graded pick,

00:46:44 ◼   ► at some point I said in our predictions

00:46:45 ◼   ► that I think this machine will go away.

00:46:47 ◼   ► I still think that case is even stronger

00:46:50 ◼   ► after this lack of updating.

00:46:51 ◼   ► - It makes sense too that like,

00:46:53 ◼   ► if that 16 inch rumored amazing MacBook Pro

00:46:57 ◼   ► was probably never gonna replace either of these,

00:47:00 ◼   ► like it would go in at the top end

00:47:02 ◼   ► like the Retina MacBook Pro did, right?

00:47:04 ◼   ► - Oh, of course.

00:47:06 ◼   ► - So then the 13 with touch bar

00:47:09 ◼   ► becomes just the entry MacBook Pro.

00:47:13 ◼   ► - The base, sure.

00:47:14 ◼   ► And yes, it's like whatever it is, $1499 or $1599.

00:47:17 ◼   ► Yeah, so the rumor of this high-end,

00:47:22 ◼   ► like 16-inch MacBook Pro with a new design,

00:47:25 ◼   ► I think you've really hit the nail on the head

00:47:27 ◼   ► of if and when that thing comes to pass,

00:47:30 ◼   ► if it's at WWDC or if it's later,

00:47:33 ◼   ► I think it will be exactly how they introduced

00:47:35 ◼   ► the Retina MacBook Pro in 2012.

00:47:37 ◼   ► They had the same MacBook Pros that they had.

00:47:40 ◼   ► In fact, they revved them, I think, in that same day.

00:47:42 ◼   ► And they said, hey, and now we have a new model

00:47:44 ◼   ► at the top of the line.

00:47:46 ◼   ► This is like the fancy one.

00:47:47 ◼   ► All computers will be like this,

00:47:48 ◼   ► but for now it's only the special one.

00:47:50 ◼   ► And then over time it trickled down

00:47:52 ◼   ► and now they all have run-in displays and look like that.

00:47:55 ◼   ► So I think they will follow that pattern again this time.

00:47:59 ◼   ► The 12-inch MacBook, I think,

00:48:01 ◼   ► is the more interesting question here.

00:48:03 ◼   ► Like, say the non-touch bar just goes away, whatever.

00:48:06 ◼   ► It failed, the MacBook Air is here,

00:48:08 ◼   ► the MacBook Air is awesome, you should get that instead.

00:48:12 ◼   ► The 12 inch I think still does have a place.

00:48:14 ◼   ► Now I still think it's probably too expensive,

00:48:16 ◼   ► but I do think that there are people who value

00:48:20 ◼   ► the thinness, and lightness, and portability above all else.

00:48:23 ◼   ► And I really have come to understand this better

00:48:26 ◼   ► in the last couple of weeks.

00:48:28 ◼   ► I needed a second, normally in the summer

00:48:31 ◼   ► I install the macOS beta on my MacBook Pro,

00:48:35 ◼   ► and I leave my iMac alone because it's my production machine.

00:48:39 ◼   ► But I have a lot of travel this summer.

00:48:42 ◼   ► I've got several personal trips, I have WWDC,

00:48:46 ◼   ► and of course now we can talk about it,

00:48:48 ◼   ► I have this trip to San Francisco in August

00:48:50 ◼   ► for our live show.

00:48:51 ◼   ► I'm unwilling to run a Mac OS beta on a machine

00:48:55 ◼   ► that I need for those sorts of trips.

00:48:57 ◼   ► 'Cause I gotta record shows live on stage,

00:48:59 ◼   ► I gotta stream audio, and that's not the best thing

00:49:02 ◼   ► to do on a Mac OS beta.

00:49:03 ◼   ► And so I was thinking like, well, how am I going to run the Mac OS beta?

00:49:07 ◼   ► Do I do an external drive?

00:49:08 ◼   ► And then I remembered I have a 2015, the original one port MacBook.

00:49:12 ◼   ► It was my wife's machine for a long time.

00:49:14 ◼   ► She has a new air.

00:49:14 ◼   ► And so I got up off the shelf and put Mojave on it.

00:49:18 ◼   ► And I don't want to use that machine.

00:49:20 ◼   ► It's slow and the keyboard is bad and one port is dumb, but the size is sort of intoxicating.

00:49:26 ◼   ► I can see why people really like the thinness and lightness.

00:49:28 ◼   ► So I've kind of come around on this machine existing because it's, it's so portable.

00:49:32 ◼   ► I mean, it's like nothing else in the Mac line, even the MacBook Air that she has now

00:49:38 ◼   ► feels way bigger and heavier than this thing.

00:49:40 ◼   ► So I think there's still room for it to exist.

00:49:43 ◼   ► Maybe they're holding off because it's going to be the first ARM Mac, as a lot of people

00:49:46 ◼   ► have predicted.

00:49:48 ◼   ► Maybe it's that they just haven't put the new Intel CPU in it.

00:49:51 ◼   ► I do believe there are core end processors they could use, but they haven't gotten around

00:49:55 ◼   ► to it for whatever reason.

00:49:56 ◼   ► So that's kind of the shifting ground of the MacBook Pro is still like a problem.

00:50:03 ◼   ► Like it's still unclear where these machines, how they fit together.

00:50:06 ◼   ► But if you want a 15 inch, now seems like a good time to buy it.

00:50:09 ◼   ► We do talk about the keyboards though.

00:50:10 ◼   ► So the 2019 machines have a keyboard and Apple says that they have changed the material in

00:50:19 ◼   ► the butterfly mechanism in a way that should substantially reduce issues that some users

00:50:24 ◼   ► have seen with key sticking and debris and we all know that story. I guess we'll see if it works.

00:50:29 ◼   ► This is now like the fourth iteration of this keyboard, depending on how you count them.

00:50:32 ◼   ► Apple's still calling it the third generation keyboard because it has the membranes.

00:50:36 ◼   ► So like, whatever, you can also count it as the fifth generation keyboard if you really

00:50:39 ◼   ► like count very specifically. So whatever they keep the number doesn't matter. They keep re

00:50:46 ◼   ► working this keyboard. And we'll see if it if it happens to fix it or if it doesn't. But what's

00:50:53 ◼   ► What's really interesting is the keyboard repair program has been expanded to now cover

00:50:59 ◼   ► all butterfly keyboards.

00:51:00 ◼   ► So they lumped in the 2018 MacBook Pro and the 2018 MacBook Air, like we have in my household,

00:51:06 ◼   ► and the brand new 2019 model.

00:51:08 ◼   ► So if you buy a new $3,000 15-inch MacBook Pro tomorrow at the Apple Store with an 8-core

00:51:14 ◼   ► CPU in it, it is covered under the keyboard repair program.

00:51:18 ◼   ► And they also made a lot of statements to some outlets that they are doing a lot to

00:51:24 ◼   ► -- I find this so funny, really -- to reduce the wait times and stuff like that, how long

00:51:29 ◼   ► it takes to get things fixed if you do have a problem.

00:51:33 ◼   ► It's kind of funny, right?

00:51:34 ◼   ► Like Apple say -- and there's a great quote from Jason Snell's article where he's like,

00:51:38 ◼   ► "While Apple is quick to say that the vast majority of the MacBook Pro customers haven't

00:51:42 ◼   ► experienced any keyboard issues, the company still keeps tweaking this design."

00:51:47 ◼   ► And it's like, if, if, cause Apple seem to like really want to talk about the fact that

00:51:51 ◼   ► they don't get that many people with these problems, but yet at the same time they're

00:51:54 ◼   ► extending the whole, like keep like the replacement program to everyone.

00:51:59 ◼   ► They're making great strides at trying to like fix it.

00:52:01 ◼   ► If you go in with a third generation keyboard, they will upgrade it to this new material

00:52:08 ◼   ► model, right?

00:52:09 ◼   ► Like it's like, yeah, I mean you, you say what you're saying and what you're doing,

00:52:15 ◼   ► They don't really match.

00:52:17 ◼   ► And it's like, okay, it's still maybe a small amount of people, but it's clearly more than

00:52:22 ◼   ► before.

00:52:23 ◼   ► Right?

00:52:24 ◼   ► Because you're having to go to all this trouble.

00:52:25 ◼   ► Right.

00:52:26 ◼   ► I want to be clear because we glossed over it.

00:52:27 ◼   ► It seems like the 2018 models will get the new 2019 keyboards.

00:52:31 ◼   ► If you have an older one, you're not going to get this keyboard.

00:52:33 ◼   ► So it's very limited in the changeover.

00:52:36 ◼   ► My feeling is that it may make it better, but I think more important to Apple at this

00:52:41 ◼   ► point is like the damage control angle.

00:52:44 ◼   ► And look, when I bought my 2018, I got AppleCare on it because I get AppleCare on my computers.

00:52:50 ◼   ► But I've heard from a lot of people and seen a lot of tweets and emails of people like,

00:52:53 ◼   ► "I feel like I bought AppleCare just because of the keyboard."

00:52:57 ◼   ► And now I guess it's sort of a sign of Apple saying, "We're going to take care of you no

00:53:02 ◼   ► matter what with this keyboard issue."

00:53:05 ◼   ► And I think that's good.

00:53:06 ◼   ► I still don't know if it's fixed or if people should trust it.

00:53:10 ◼   ► I will say that my 2018 has been mostly okay.

00:53:13 ◼   ► the spacebar has gotten sticky twice,

00:53:14 ◼   ► but compressed air has cleaned it out.

00:53:16 ◼   ► No keys have broken off like on my 2016.

00:53:19 ◼   ► Time will tell.

00:53:19 ◼   ► And until then, Apple seems willing to do what it can

00:53:23 ◼   ► to help the customers with this machine.

00:53:25 ◼   ► Now, the thing they could do to help them the most

00:53:27 ◼   ► is to have a new keyboard,

00:53:28 ◼   ► but clearly that's not the time for that yet.

00:53:31 ◼   ► So here we are, new MacBook Pros,

00:53:34 ◼   ► slightly new keyboard, extended keyboard repair program.

00:53:38 ◼   ► It's interesting they're doing it now.

00:53:41 ◼   ► I guess they're kind of saying that, hey, if they had done this at WWDC, a bigger story

00:53:49 ◼   ► during the conference would be the keyboards, and now this has its own new cycle and it

00:53:53 ◼   ► will be gone by the time that the keynote comes around.

00:53:57 ◼   ► So I see why they did it now, but it's a little bit of a bummer that it's not completely solved.

00:54:03 ◼   ► What do you think about the rumor of the new MacBook Pro?

00:54:07 ◼   ► Do you think this makes it more likely, less likely, or no different?

00:54:09 ◼   ► I don't think it makes it any different.

00:54:11 ◼   ► I still think they could do that in two weeks in San Jose and say, Hey, look,

00:54:15 ◼   ► there's this new high end MacBook pro it's all fancy and new.

00:54:18 ◼   ► It's obviously more expensive, more powerful, whatever new design.

00:54:22 ◼   ► I think that's still totally on the table for WBC.

00:54:25 ◼   ► I don't think this makes it less likely. So we'll see.

00:54:29 ◼   ► I don't know how likely it is.

00:54:31 ◼   ► I don't feel like say that I was 30% sure that it was coming.

00:54:34 ◼   ► I don't think that number's changed for me because of this, but, uh, they can,

00:54:39 ◼   ► If they do that, that path that we talked about a second ago about, this is a new

00:54:43 ◼   ► machine, like the retina macro pro was, and eventually it stuff will trickle down.

00:54:48 ◼   ► They could really do that at any point, I think, and be okay.

00:54:50 ◼   ► Keyboards and laptops.

00:54:54 ◼   ► I'd love to talk about this again, but we're not there yet.

00:54:59 ◼   ► We're not there yet.

00:55:00 ◼   ► All right.

00:55:03 ◼   ► Uh, I'm going to tell us, tell everybody about Texas spender.

00:55:06 ◼   ► Myke, do you want to call Federico and get him back?

00:55:08 ◼   ► I know we checked out during yeah, I'll send a carrier pigeon his way this episode of connected is brought to you by text expander

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00:57:28 ◼   ► So Federico, you published the article that you've been talking about for the last couple

00:57:31 ◼   ► of weeks, and I think probably in essence the best way to describe it, the magnum opus

00:57:37 ◼   ► to working on the iPad right now, right, like this is everything.

00:57:41 ◼   ► This is what, if you want to work on the iPad right now, this is the situation that we are

00:57:46 ◼   ► in in the middle of 2019.

00:57:49 ◼   ► So I kind of wanted to talk to you a little bit, well we all want to talk to you a little

00:57:53 ◼   ► bit about the article and kind of where it came from and then I have some

00:57:57 ◼   ► comments on the content itself. Okay. It was kind of funny because how many

00:58:02 ◼   ► words? This is a big one it's like 50,000 words or something? This is 48,000 49

00:58:07 ◼   ► almost a thousand words it's bigger than my iOS 12 review. Whoa! Wow! Wow really?

00:58:15 ◼   ► Wow it was really funny because you sent this to us like a few days ago so we

00:58:18 ◼   ► could read it beforehand.

00:58:21 ◼   ► And it took me quite a while.

00:58:24 ◼   ► But it was kind of funny.

00:58:25 ◼   ► Like, Stephen was just like, oh, great.

00:58:26 ◼   ► And then he popped in later on.

00:58:27 ◼   ► And he was like, oh, that was really good.

00:58:29 ◼   ► I read it.

00:58:29 ◼   ► And it was like 90 minutes later.

00:58:31 ◼   ► And I'd gotten through like a quarter

00:58:34 ◼   ► in the same amount of time.

00:58:36 ◼   ► It was just so heartbreaking.

00:58:37 ◼   ► I'm a very fast reader.

00:58:39 ◼   ► It disappoints my wife as well.

00:58:41 ◼   ► Sometimes we're reading something together.

00:58:43 ◼   ► I'm like, turn the page, turn the page.

00:58:45 ◼   ► That's the worst.

00:58:46 ◼   ► those people that like I hear my voice in my head when I read which you right

00:58:50 ◼   ► which you obviously don't because you would not be able to do with it actually

00:58:54 ◼   ► I hear your voice in my head yes it takes me takes me quite a while but I

00:59:00 ◼   ► read through it oh it was really good but I kind of a feeling that I got

00:59:05 ◼   ► though while reading the article was I I could just assume that when you set out

00:59:10 ◼   ► to start this project, it probably wasn't the scope that it ended up being.

00:59:16 ◼   ► Very good assumption, yeah. I don't know why exactly I feel that, but

00:59:21 ◼   ► it just, well, maybe one like, probably not the best time of the year for you to be writing

00:59:26 ◼   ► such a huge article considering you've got to do it again starting in two weeks, but...

00:59:31 ◼   ► Okay, I get that, like, why would you want to do this now? But it is true that it started

00:59:39 ◼   ► as a more limited article, but the scope grew quickly. So it's not like suddenly two weeks

00:59:48 ◼   ► ago I realized, "Oh, I've been writing too much." So I'm going to talk about this entire

00:59:56 ◼   ► process in the weekly newsletter this Friday, but basically I started thinking about wanting

01:00:04 ◼   ► to have at least two big stories on the website before WWDC in February. And I just started

01:00:14 ◼   ► saving some notes, some ideas, basically having like a super simple outline. And initially

01:00:19 ◼   ► I wanted to do an iPad story and an Apple Watch story. And both of them, those ideas,

01:00:27 ◼   ► those notes that I had, they did not have the scope of, you know, this major iOS review-like

01:00:33 ◼   ► story. I kept those notes for like a month, so I kept thinking about those ideas, and

01:00:40 ◼   ► then it was in late March when I decided, realistically speaking, I'm not going to

01:00:44 ◼   ► be able to do two stories, and I'm going to focus on this iPad One, and I guess that

01:00:50 ◼   ► it should have a bigger scope than what I initially set out to do. For example, it was

01:00:57 ◼   ► not supposed to include accessories, it was not supposed to include the bridge keyboard

01:01:01 ◼   ► and working with external displays, it was not supposed to include scriptable and JavaScript automation.

01:01:09 ◼   ► So all those elements were supposed to be like separate posts that I wanted to have on Mac stories,

01:01:15 ◼   ► and realizing that I'm not going to be able to do two stories, so I just want to do one,

01:01:22 ◼   ► and I want to make sure that it leaves an impression.

01:01:24 ◼   ► That forced me, and that happened during the mind mapping process,

01:01:29 ◼   ► That forced me to reconsider the scope of the story and say, "Okay, maybe there's a way that I can expand

01:01:37 ◼   ► and still have it feel like a single cohesive story instead of a bunch of sort of disconnected posts."

01:01:47 ◼   ► So I spent a few days in the mind map trying to make sense of it all.

01:01:53 ◼   ► And there were still a few sections that got cut.

01:01:56 ◼   ► There was a section about the Apple Pencil, there was a section about iPad apps that have a three column layout.

01:02:04 ◼   ► Both of them were cut.

01:02:06 ◼   ► But yeah, it started as a more simpler thing.

01:02:09 ◼   ► Like I was just gonna talk about multitasking file management and wishes for iOS 13.

01:02:14 ◼   ► But then I realized, you know, I'm gonna be able to do just one story,

01:02:22 ◼   ► because we were also launching other projects and all of that.

01:02:25 ◼   ► But also, you mentioned why would you want to do this before WWDC?

01:02:29 ◼   ► You're gonna have to write a long article again in a few weeks. That is true, but I realized I

01:02:34 ◼   ► want to go to WWDC

01:02:37 ◼   ► with an article that maybe people can read during the trip to San Jose.

01:02:42 ◼   ► And I wanted to make sure that I will have something that people will keep thinking of at

01:02:49 ◼   ► WWDC, like have people go to San Jose with this article on their minds and

01:02:54 ◼   ► to sort of have one final update because I know that iOS 13 is gonna change things right for the iPad and

01:03:01 ◼   ► I didn't want all my experiments and all my setup changes and all my research go to waste

01:03:09 ◼   ► So I want to have like one final

01:03:12 ◼   ► update one final sort of like state of the Union type of article before

01:03:17 ◼   ► PwC so that people would keep thinking of that so that maybe I could

01:03:21 ◼   ► They could draw some comparisons between my article and what ends up being in iOS 13

01:03:26 ◼   ► but also I wanted to

01:03:29 ◼   ► This is effectively for me an investment in my sanity going forward because in my iOS 13 review

01:03:37 ◼   ► I will not have to waste, well not waste, but you know spend as much time

01:03:42 ◼   ► on offering

01:03:45 ◼   ► historical context for

01:03:47 ◼   ► or "This is how file management used to be" or "This is how multitasking used to be"

01:03:51 ◼   ► because I've already done the work in May and April. So that's why.

01:03:59 ◼   ► Does this feel like a new annual story? Or is this like you wanted to catch everybody

01:04:04 ◼   ► up and then there's that?

01:04:06 ◼   ► Yeah, not an annual thing. I've done iPad stories before, I've done one in 2014 with

01:04:17 ◼   ► the iPad or two and I did one in 2016 for the first year of the iPad Pro, I think.

01:04:27 ◼   ► I don't see myself doing an iPad state of the union like this every year.

01:04:33 ◼   ► Maybe every couple of years.

01:04:34 ◼   ► I don't know if I would do a story of this scope again.

01:04:38 ◼   ► There's only so much you can say about like here's why I use the iPad and I said I don't

01:04:42 ◼   ► want to repeat myself every couple of years.

01:04:45 ◼   ► I'm going to talk about this later, if you accept the fact that I like to work on the

01:04:48 ◼   ► iPad, well, this is it. This is why. I cannot see myself in 2021 or something, saying again,

01:04:58 ◼   ► "Well, it was 2012 when I was doing chemo, and that's why I started using the app." It's

01:05:02 ◼   ► not a story that I want to tell every couple of years.

01:05:05 ◼   ► I think you did it justice by using the review layout on the site, because A, there's just

01:05:11 ◼   ► so much here. Reading it as a flat blog post would have been difficult. But I

01:05:17 ◼   ► think it's nice because it's broken up that say that multitasking gets a big

01:05:22 ◼   ► overhaul in a couple weeks or you know shortcuts get some amazing overhaul in

01:05:28 ◼   ► five years. You've built it for your use case of referring to it in the

01:05:34 ◼   ► future that you can point people to a direct section and say this is

01:05:38 ◼   ► you need to go if you want the background. And I think it deserves this sort of fancy layout,

01:05:43 ◼   ► because it is such an incredible piece of work. The animations are amazing. You guys talked to

01:05:48 ◼   ► Brian who helped you with the animations on App Stories this week. People should go check that out.

01:05:52 ◼   ► But it feels as a reader like the big story that it is. And I like that you've sort of

01:05:59 ◼   ► put a flag in the ground saying this is where we are with iOS 12 up to this point.

01:06:05 ◼   ► Because A, clearly you believe that iOS 13 has the ability to change a bunch of this stuff,

01:06:11 ◼   ► and that hopefully there's a lot of these complaints and issues in here just won't be

01:06:14 ◼   ► a problem in two weeks. But even if they're not, it's sort of a capturing a moment in time with

01:06:23 ◼   ► where you are with it. And even if things don't change in two weeks, they will hopefully change

01:06:28 ◼   ► in the future. And I think that's kind of important when considering a platform that's

01:06:34 ◼   ► that's still as dynamic as iOS on the iPad.

01:06:36 ◼   ► - Thank you, yeah.

01:06:38 ◼   ► I hope that's the case.

01:06:39 ◼   ► I mean, even if iOS 13 ends up being a major disappointment

01:06:42 ◼   ► for the iPad, there's still this article,

01:06:44 ◼   ► it's still gonna be valid.

01:06:46 ◼   ► But one of the, you mentioned capturing a moment in time,

01:06:51 ◼   ► one of the things that is always difficult for me

01:06:55 ◼   ► is to strike a balance between what is personal

01:06:58 ◼   ► and what can be also relatable for other people.

01:07:01 ◼   ► like, when I'm writing a personal story like this one, it's about my usage of the iPad.

01:07:06 ◼   ► Am I writing it for me or am I writing it for other people? And of course, I want to

01:07:10 ◼   ► make sure that other people, that readers, can get something out of it. So those sections

01:07:15 ◼   ► that I cut, where they felt to me a little too personal, like I was writing them just

01:07:23 ◼   ► as a personal research exercise and not with... they were not something that I felt that readers

01:07:30 ◼   ► could get some value out of. And so striking this balance of, for example, the podcasting

01:07:36 ◼   ► setup from the Chapter 5, the external accessories, that is incredibly personal. And in the sense

01:07:45 ◼   ► that it's the setup that I like that works for me that I do not recommend to other people

01:07:50 ◼   ► because I wrote as much in the story. But it underlines a bigger point of how does the

01:07:58 ◼   ► iPad Pro work with external USB and audio accessories in the context of the USB-C port

01:08:06 ◼   ► in the 2018 iPad Pro?"

01:08:07 ◼   ► And the answer is, it's pretty terrible.

01:08:10 ◼   ► But still, it kind of works for me.

01:08:12 ◼   ► And so, that, despite the extremely personal nature, it felt like a good example.

01:08:17 ◼   ► So that really was the... when I was working on the notes and the mind map before I started

01:08:24 ◼   ► writing, going through all the sections and trying to apply this filter of "is this something that I

01:08:31 ◼   ► that I'm gonna have fun writing about?" but also "is this gonna be useful in the context of

01:08:36 ◼   ► does it prove a bigger point? Does it fit the underlying theme of the story?" and if it did not,

01:08:43 ◼   ► then it got cut. So yeah, I really like the conclusion. There was like one line that really

01:08:49 ◼   ► resonated with me in a way that I wasn't expecting. So you were kind of talking about the fact that

01:08:53 ◼   ► that when Steve Jobs introduced the iPad,

01:08:56 ◼   ► it was referred to as like this third device, right?

01:08:59 ◼   ► That like your iPhone is great for this

01:09:01 ◼   ► and your Mac is great for this,

01:09:03 ◼   ► but sometimes wouldn't it be nice

01:09:04 ◼   ► if each of them had a bit of each other

01:09:06 ◼   ► and there could be this device in the middle?

01:09:08 ◼   ► And it was like, oh, here's the third device.

01:09:11 ◼   ► So you say today the iPad Pro is my laptop,

01:09:13 ◼   ► the iPhone is my pocket computer,

01:09:15 ◼   ► and the Mac is the third device

01:09:16 ◼   ► that's better at specific tasks.

01:09:18 ◼   ► I didn't really realize that that's kind of where I am,

01:09:21 ◼   ► but it is where I am.

01:09:22 ◼   ► And it's just, it's my own personal use cases

01:09:25 ◼   ► for these devices that has led me to this position.

01:09:28 ◼   ► But it is kind of funny to see that like, you know,

01:09:31 ◼   ► nearly 10 years later, that the idea of the third device

01:09:34 ◼   ► for some people has changed and that's kind of where we are.

01:09:39 ◼   ► And I really, really heavily resonate with that.

01:09:42 ◼   ► - Yeah, I'm pleased that you liked that.

01:09:45 ◼   ► And it sort of, it plays into this theme,

01:09:49 ◼   ► this idea that there's some people out there who believe that certain design decisions

01:09:57 ◼   ► are sacred, they should never change, and whatever Steve Jobs decided ten years ago

01:10:02 ◼   ► should be forever. And you see this in UI design, you see this in hardware design, and

01:10:08 ◼   ► I think that's a sad outlook, that's a sad way, and really a limited way to look at not

01:10:14 ◼   ► not just technological progress, but life. Because time moves on and things change. And

01:10:23 ◼   ► the iPad maybe started as a way to read a book or read the New York Times or just chill

01:10:29 ◼   ► on the sofa and browse the web. But it is so obvious that over time it has become so

01:10:36 ◼   ► much more. And not because Myke Hurley and Federico are making this up or are sort of

01:10:43 ◼   ► trying to make this a trend.

01:10:44 ◼   ► So it's not propaganda that we're attempting to spread.

01:10:47 ◼   ► Apple is selling an iPad called the iPad Pro.

01:10:50 ◼   ► Like, I couldn't make this up if I wanted to.

01:10:52 ◼   ► It exists.

01:10:53 ◼   ► It's a thing that Apple is selling.

01:10:55 ◼   ► And we're just following the evolution of this product.

01:10:58 ◼   ► And so I was concerned about using that analogy

01:11:03 ◼   ► or sort of trying to flip that quote on its head

01:11:06 ◼   ► and say the iPad is now the notebook

01:11:09 ◼   ► and the Mac is the third device.

01:11:11 ◼   ► because I, you know, I'm going to talk about this in a bit, but I try whenever possible

01:11:18 ◼   ► not to make people upset. And while this may be, you know, I say a bunch of silly things

01:11:24 ◼   ► on this show, but I feel like listeners know that I'm kidding, I hope. Like, for example,

01:11:30 ◼   ► I can be friends with non-good looking people. Like, I've...

01:11:35 ◼   ► No, no, you, everyone, you should see what he's been texting us during the show. It's

01:11:40 ◼   ► horrific the things he's been saying.

01:11:42 ◼   ► Sure. I feel like listeners can separate, on a podcast I feel like listeners can separate

01:11:48 ◼   ► sort of the character that I play sometimes with the real person that's doing the podcast.

01:11:54 ◼   ► But when I write something that is taken, like it gets passed around and people take

01:12:01 ◼   ► screenshots and they quote sections on Reddit. You know how it goes. It's easier for something

01:12:08 ◼   ► that you write to be used against you. And so I was concerned about that quote, but the

01:12:14 ◼   ► more I thought about it, the better it felt and it felt true. And then when I shared it

01:12:19 ◼   ► with you, you told me this is true for me as well. And so that was like, well, I guess

01:12:23 ◼   ► I'm just going for it. So I'm glad that it worked.

01:12:27 ◼   ► What is the other point that you wanted to make about this stuff?

01:12:30 ◼   ► Yeah. Well, I guess it comes with the territory of whenever I publish these stories, there's

01:12:38 ◼   ► a subset of people in this community, the community of folks who read max stories and

01:12:45 ◼   ► maybe they're in fireball and maybe listen to a few relay shows, that they believe that

01:12:52 ◼   ► I and others are on some kind of payroll by Apple and that we're just spreading propaganda

01:12:59 ◼   ► like you said or that it's in our interest to write positive things about Apple because

01:13:06 ◼   ► I genuinely believe, those people believe we get paid, which is not true, obviously.

01:13:12 ◼   ► I get paid because I'm fortunate enough to have sponsors and subscribers.

01:13:18 ◼   ► But it's one thing to believe that, and it's totally fair.

01:13:23 ◼   ► But I was taking a look on Reddit and Twitter, and there's some comments that really make

01:13:33 ◼   ► you think like what is it the the image that people have of what I do and just

01:13:39 ◼   ► scrolling through the reddit thread I was called a snake oil seller yeah yeah

01:13:48 ◼   ► I'm trying to think of all the other things yeah like this idea that the iPad

01:13:55 ◼   ► is terrible therefore if you write about working on the iPad you are writing

01:14:00 ◼   ► false information because all you care about is being considered by Apple for

01:14:07 ◼   ► whatever reason they believe, whatever crazy theory they have. And also there's

01:14:14 ◼   ► the fact that every time I write about the iPad, and I make

01:14:21 ◼   ► sure to convey this point, I'm not trying to prove that the iPad is better than

01:14:28 ◼   ► the Mac for everybody, I'm trying to prove that it's better for me, and that maybe by

01:14:34 ◼   ► sharing my experiences, there's going to be other people who can find that useful.

01:14:41 ◼   ► But I never try to say "Apple should stop selling Macs", or "The Mac is done, goodbye

01:14:46 ◼   ► Mac class".

01:14:48 ◼   ► The entire point of this article is that I beli—and I literally wrote this and quoted

01:14:54 ◼   ► this and used pull quotes throughout the story to highlight this point is that I believe there are

01:15:00 ◼   ► certain ideas that Mac OS got right decades ago and that Apple should maybe take a look at those

01:15:06 ◼   ► ideas again and reconsider them for iOS. But there's still a few folks who tweet at me and

01:15:13 ◼   ► share comments on Reddit. This is ridiculous. Well, trolls can't be bothered to actually read

01:15:21 ◼   ► read what you write. So the type of people who are going to throw grenades on Twitter

01:15:27 ◼   ► aren't the type to actually take what you say seriously. They just want to troll.

01:15:34 ◼   ► Look I am used to this, right? I've been doing this for 10 years. All these being called

01:15:40 ◼   ► names, there's folks who call me pathetic or ridiculous and I wish I was kidding but

01:15:45 ◼   ► this is actual, these are actual words that people use for an article. First of all, I

01:15:49 ◼   ► I think it's said that, no, not for me, it's said for you that, you know, instead of, like,

01:15:55 ◼   ► you want to criticize my work, fine, but why would you need to call anybody, not just mean

01:15:59 ◼   ► names on the internet. It's really not classy or elegant. It's really not a, personally

01:16:05 ◼   ► speaking, I don't think it's a good, you know, it's a good way to live your life, to call

01:16:09 ◼   ► other people pathetic or ridiculous. But I think it's, what saddens me is that for some

01:16:18 ◼   ► people I am not able to convey the fact that I genuinely believe in what I write. And it's

01:16:26 ◼   ► that some people always see the conspiracy behind it. They believe that I'm doing this

01:16:37 ◼   ► because Apple is paying me. And I wish there was a way for me to fix those people, like

01:16:44 ◼   ► to say, "Why don't you believe me?" Not because I need them, but because it makes me sad that

01:16:50 ◼   ► they think that of me, right? It's like, I don't know, maybe I'm not able to convey my

01:16:56 ◼   ► feelings here, but it's just, I find it sad that this is generally what I believe in and

01:17:04 ◼   ► what I'm passionate about. I guess it's just impossible to please everybody, and there's

01:17:09 ◼   ► always going to be, especially once you put your work on the internet, there's always

01:17:14 ◼   ► gonna be folks, you know, from nine-year-olds to, you know, old people who've been using

01:17:20 ◼   ► computers for 50 years. It's always gonna be somebody that doesn't like you, for whatever

01:17:25 ◼   ► reason. That is fine, but it still saddens me to an extent. So, yeah, wow, that felt

01:17:31 ◼   ► good to say this. Yeah. Yeah. But let's not focus on that, though, right? No, no. That's

01:17:37 ◼   ► not what this is about. Like, you've produced something which is very interesting and I

01:17:42 ◼   ► I think quite important. I'm very happy with it. I'm very honestly I'm very happy with what I did.

01:17:46 ◼   ► Yeah good you should be I mean it's wonderful like so I just don't want you to

01:17:50 ◼   ► One obviously you shouldn't think of it that way, but I don't want I'll listen is the thing that that's what this is about

01:17:56 ◼   ► This conversation. Yeah. Yeah, totally

01:17:58 ◼   ► that the vast majority of people have been extremely kind and and like the response I

01:18:06 ◼   ► I was not expecting to have the kind of response that an iOS review would get in September

01:18:11 ◼   ► when there's more attention and people have been looking forward to that in May, which

01:18:16 ◼   ► is incredible.

01:18:17 ◼   ► So I'm extremely happy for the overall reception and response from readers and everybody else.

01:18:24 ◼   ► So it's just, you know, those people, they're still on my mind sometimes, but I'm very happy,

01:18:30 ◼   ► honestly.

01:18:31 ◼   ► Yes, I feel very good.

01:18:32 ◼   ► Good.

01:18:33 ◼   ► You should be.

01:18:34 ◼   ► You deserve that.

01:18:35 ◼   ► It's an incredible piece.

01:18:36 ◼   ► obviously linked in the show notes, take some time, go through it and you will enjoy it.

01:18:41 ◼   ► And for somebody like me, who I am primarily on the Mac, I went through it and downloaded

01:18:47 ◼   ► three or four apps and a bunch of shortcuts because like as you were talking about things

01:18:51 ◼   ► like, Oh, that'd be great if I could solve this or do it this way. And I think I think

01:18:56 ◼   ► the biggest example for me is the local storage deal. So in the files app, there is on my

01:19:03 ◼   ► iPad storage and then there's a bunch of folders for apps that populate things there.

01:19:08 ◼   ► But as a user I can't put things there and there's a third-party app that basically fixes

01:19:12 ◼   ► that.

01:19:13 ◼   ► It's like, "Oh, this is something I need right now and now it's on both my devices."

01:19:18 ◼   ► So it's not just Federico talking about Federico things.

01:19:22 ◼   ► There is real everyday use tips and things in here that are useful to all sorts of people.

01:19:29 ◼   ► So thank you for improving the stuff I'm doing on the iPad by letting me read it.

01:19:34 ◼   ► Anything else to talk about this?

01:19:36 ◼   ► You're still going to do your iOS 13 review.

01:19:39 ◼   ► Is there anything you're going to take from this into that review?

01:19:43 ◼   ► I know you mentioned that now you feel like you don't have to do as much backstory in

01:19:47 ◼   ► the review, but are there certain things that came up in this article that you're going

01:19:51 ◼   ► to make sure to touch on again in the fall?

01:19:53 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean all the core chapters, so file management and working with external keyboard

01:20:01 ◼   ► and shortcuts, all of those will be key areas of interest in the review. I guess something that I

01:20:09 ◼   ► took away from working on this is that maybe the review layout could use some modernization on the

01:20:17 ◼   ► the website we've been using this special layout for the iOS 11 review, iOS 12 review,

01:20:23 ◼   ► and now this story. So there's probably a few... I don't want to change it, like I don't

01:20:28 ◼   ► want to have an entirely new design, but I would like to do some improvements this summer,

01:20:34 ◼   ► if we have time. So there's a few things that I would like to improve. I'm definitely going

01:20:39 ◼   ► to do the 3D rendered animation again.

01:20:45 ◼   ► Yeah, working with Brian has been awesome.

01:20:48 ◼   ► And the freedom of having 3D models instead

01:20:52 ◼   ► of static 2D templates in Sketch or Photoshop

01:20:56 ◼   ► has been so much better.

01:20:57 ◼   ► Yes, please.

01:20:57 ◼   ► Every time.

01:20:58 ◼   ► Because we can try all sorts of crazy ideas.

01:20:59 ◼   ► And maybe even increasing the output of those images,

01:21:04 ◼   ► not just to use them for the initial page of a chapter,

01:21:08 ◼   ► but maybe more throughout a chapter. That would be nice. I guess the entire setup that I had for

01:21:17 ◼   ► writing this story, so using iA writer in combination with working copy and scriptable,

01:21:23 ◼   ► has been awesome. We, thanks to Brett Terpstra, he made a very custom, very extremely specific

01:21:34 ◼   ► template for IA Writer that allowed me to preview the story with the same special layout

01:21:41 ◼   ► that I would get on Mac Stories on the website.

01:21:44 ◼   ► I was able to preview the table of contents navigation, the chapter images, everything inside of IA Writer.

01:21:50 ◼   ► So that saved me so much time and just being able to manage my screenshots locally

01:21:56 ◼   ► with Scriptable, NIKL Drive, and IA Writer all together. It was incredible. So the entire writing setup,

01:22:04 ◼   ► I'm glad that it took me a couple of weeks to get it right, but that worked extremely well.

01:22:11 ◼   ► I was able to upload basically 150 screenshots in a couple of hours.

01:22:17 ◼   ► In one afternoon.

01:22:19 ◼   ► But then this is the other part, you now don't need to spend the first two weeks of June

01:22:24 ◼   ► working out what your setup's going to be for your review this year.

01:22:27 ◼   ► Yeah, which is also going to be super, super useful.

01:22:30 ◼   ► That's a big benefit because you know that it always takes me a couple of weeks to say,

01:22:34 ◼   ► "Hmm, what am I going to use this time for research and all of that?" So yeah, also moving

01:22:40 ◼   ► from Evernote to Apple Notes before working on this story also helped. I was very surprised

01:22:48 ◼   ► that I would...

01:22:49 ◼   ► Just helped my general mental state.

01:22:51 ◼   ► Yes. Yeah, totally, totally. But really, to give you a timeline, I basically started writing

01:22:59 ◼   ► on April 14, and I was done in two weeks with the writing.

01:23:06 ◼   ► So 50,000 words done in two weeks, and then two, three,

01:23:13 ◼   ► three more weeks of editing.

01:23:15 ◼   ► So two weeks of writing, three weeks of editing.

01:23:18 ◼   ► I wrote super fast, because it was so much easier

01:23:22 ◼   ► to write than an iOS review.

01:23:24 ◼   ► Because I was writing out of personal experience.

01:23:28 ◼   ► And if anything, you could argue that the research had been done for seven years before,

01:23:36 ◼   ► not in two weeks at the beginning of the beta season.

01:23:41 ◼   ► And it was a very different process.

01:23:44 ◼   ► I didn't have to keep track of beta one and beta two and beta three and all the changes

01:23:48 ◼   ► in all the betas.

01:23:49 ◼   ► It was like, this is how I use the iPad.

01:23:51 ◼   ► This is stuff that I already know, so I can just write.

01:23:54 ◼   ► I don't need to wait for developer documentation to go live.

01:23:59 ◼   ► I can just write what I know.

01:24:01 ◼   ► And it was a nice change of pace from an iOS review.

01:24:04 ◼   ► If you want to find links to all the stuff

01:24:06 ◼   ► we spoke about this week, you can head over to the website,

01:24:09 ◼   ► relay.fm/connected/244.

01:24:13 ◼   ► While you're there, you can get in touch.

01:24:15 ◼   ► There's an email link there in the sidebar

01:24:17 ◼   ► for feedback and follow-up,

01:24:18 ◼   ► or of course you can do that on Twitter.

01:24:21 ◼   ► You can find Federico there as Vitici, V-I-T-I-C-C-I,

01:24:25 ◼   ► and he is the editor-in-chief of maxstories.net.

01:24:28 ◼   ► You can find Myke online as I-M-Y-K-E,

01:24:31 ◼   ► and Myke is the co-host of a bunch of shows

01:24:33 ◼   ► here on Relay FM.

01:24:36 ◼   ► You can find my writing online at 512pixels.net.

01:24:40 ◼   ► You can find me on Twitter as ismh.

01:24:43 ◼   ► As a reminder, we are doing a live show

01:24:45 ◼   ► in August in San Francisco.

01:24:47 ◼   ► That link is in the show notes.

01:24:49 ◼   ► If you're going to be in the area, we would love to see you.

01:24:52 ◼   ► It's going to be a really special evening.

01:24:54 ◼   ► I'd like to thank our sponsors this week, Backblaze, FreshBooks, and TextExpander.

01:25:00 ◼   ► And until next time, gentlemen, say goodbye.

01:25:02 ◼   ► Adios.

01:25:03 ◼   ► Adios.

01:25:04 ◼   ► Adios.