0:00:00(upbeat music)
0:00:02- From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 189.
0:00:11It is brought to you this week by our fine sponsors,
0:00:14Smile Molecule and Slack.
0:00:17My name is Steven Hackett
0:00:18and I'm joined by my cohost, Myke Hurley.
0:00:21- Sup homie?
0:00:22- Hi man, Federico's on a special assignment this week.
0:00:27Special assignment being vacation?
0:00:30You know, something, I don't know what he's doing.
0:00:32He's around doing things, not this year.
0:00:35- Federico Vittucci is a man of the planet now.
0:00:38- Mm, man of the planet.
0:00:40- Yeah, he just moves around from place to place.
0:00:44He's always there, he's been posting
0:00:45on his Instagram stories, which is the thing
0:00:48that he usually doesn't do. - Yeah, that blew his mind.
0:00:49I have some breaking news from the chat room.
0:00:52It's episode 190, not 189.
0:00:55- That is good breaking news.
0:00:56As far as breaking news goes, the correction of the episode number is pretty strong.
0:01:02Thank you to Kate for making Steven better at his job.
0:01:06Episode 190.
0:01:07190.
0:01:08Okay.
0:01:09From Relay FM.
0:01:10No, no, no.
0:01:11No?
0:01:12Okay.
0:01:13We're just gonna go with it.
0:01:14Okay.
0:01:15In my regime, thanks to Ian.
0:01:19We're gonna start with some follow-up.
0:01:21I'm actually gonna start with follow-out because I had a really interesting conversation with
0:01:26with Serenity Caldwell on this week's episode of query.
0:01:29Remember we spoke last week or the week before
0:01:31about her really cool iPad review
0:01:32that she did this amazing movie all on the iPad,
0:01:37like about the iPad?
0:01:38It was really, really cool.
0:01:39And I think all three of us were impressed with it.
0:01:41A lot of people really enjoyed it.
0:01:42And I got to speak to her about
0:01:44the behind the scenes of that.
0:01:45So like the decision making that went into it,
0:01:47some of the tools she used,
0:01:48what was the hardest thing about it,
0:01:50what was easier than it looks.
0:01:52It was really fascinating, really eye opening to me.
0:01:55You know, I at least think about iOS productivity through the lens of how my friends use it,
0:02:01which like you and Federico and Jason, like mostly word based stuff.
0:02:07So like writing or preparing show notes or doing spreadsheets, not like sitting down
0:02:11and making a movie, right?
0:02:12It's not something that you do on a regular basis on your iPad.
0:02:14So it's really interesting to hear that angle of creation on the iPad.
0:02:18And I think you may enjoy that episode if you haven't heard it yet.
0:02:22So there'll be a link over in the show notes.
0:02:24There is a thing that has occurred over the history of the three of us recording shows
0:02:31together and it is a curse. The prompt was cursed and connected is cursed in that we
0:02:37have had a history of talking about things sometimes and mostly randomly before they
0:02:47immediately get killed. These things go away. Even last week or the week before, I asked
0:02:55what happened to Liam, the recycling robot? Well, Apple have a new robot. That robot is
0:03:02called Daisy and Daisy disassembles iPhones to reclaim materials. It was announced as
0:03:08part of Earth Day as like, you know, Apple showing more about the things that they do
0:03:13to like, I don't know, show them how much more thoughtful they are about the world,
0:03:18right? They do these press releases every now and then. This is a quote from that press
0:03:22release. "Daisy is made from some of Liam's parts." What?
0:03:27Oh no. Oh no! What kind of robot horror are we a part of
0:03:31here? Why? So like I have a few different questions here. Like, one, why did they need
0:03:36to do that? Like, why can't Liam just like be Liam or like be put away somewhere? Why
0:03:41Why did they have to disassemble Liam and use his parts in Daisy?
0:03:45Why does Daisy need Liam's parts?
0:03:47Why can't she have her own parts?
0:03:48I think you're making an assumption that maybe we shouldn't make.
0:03:52The real question is, did Daisy kill Liam for his parts?
0:03:56Right?
0:03:57Oh no.
0:03:58You're assuming a human came in and disassembled the poor guy, but maybe they built Daisy and
0:04:03Daisy looked at her and said, "Hey, I don't think you like those little spring-loaded
0:04:06clamps you have.
0:04:07It would be a shame if something happened to them."
0:04:09And then she went over there and took him.
0:04:11- It's just people came in one day,
0:04:13she's like, hi, I'm Daisy, Liam's gone.
0:04:15- Yeah.
0:04:16- And then she showed how good she was
0:04:19at taking apart 200 iPhones an hour,
0:04:21so she's way better than Liam.
0:04:23But I don't like it because Liam has been murdered now,
0:04:28and that makes me very uncomfortable.
0:04:31I don't know why, or maybe, I don't know,
0:04:34maybe Liam was, he had like a organ donor card,
0:04:39and maybe he fell over or something.
0:04:41And they just figured that they would,
0:04:45his parts were used for Daisy, who knows?
0:04:48We can't know, but all we know is Liam is dead,
0:04:51long live Daisy.
0:04:53- Yeah.
0:04:54It's a rough world out there, Myke.
0:04:57The world of recycling is not all puppies and rainbows.
0:04:59- It's cutthroat.
0:05:01It's cutthroat.
0:05:02You think just because it helps the environment, no, no.
0:05:04It is, if you're a robot in the recycling business,
0:05:08That's not good for you.
0:05:09Watch your back.
0:05:10A better robot may come take your parts.
0:05:12You know what it is?
0:05:14If you're a robot in the recycling business,
0:05:16you're one step away from being recycled.
0:05:18That's what they did.
0:05:19I've just realized it.
0:05:20They recycled Liam into Daisy.
0:05:24Whoa.
0:05:25That's pretty dark, man.
0:05:27That is dark.
0:05:28Can we move on?
0:05:28I feel sad.
0:05:30I think we have to.
0:05:31Let's move on to incredibly happy news.
0:05:34The LTE Apple Watch is rolling out to a few more countries.
0:05:38Woo!
0:05:39Denmark, Sweden, and India will join Taiwan on May the 11th.
0:05:44So it's slowly expanding.
0:05:47Carriers are coming on board.
0:05:49That's kind of all there is to say on it, but it is happening.
0:05:53Should we travel to those countries, or should we fly their flags on those days?
0:05:59I feel like we should mark the occasion somehow.
0:06:01Feels like a lot of work, but yeah, if you want to go to Denmark, Sweden, and India,
0:06:06Taiwan all on one day. I wish you the best of luck in that. It'll be a good vlog.
0:06:11Yeah I think you have to go... I think if you start in India it could be possible
0:06:16right? Probably not though, but you never know you could try. We should talk about
0:06:19emoji because that's a thing that we have talked about sometimes. So
0:06:25remember back in 2016 where Apple changed the pistol emoji to a water
0:06:31pistol. Remember this? And unfortunately like the next day or something
0:06:37Microsoft changed it from a ray gun to a hand pistol. It was the same day. So
0:06:42Microsoft were unveiling their brand new emoji that they had worked very long and
0:06:46hard on and on the day that Microsoft did that Apple were like oh hey we've
0:06:50changed a gun. So they took all of the wind out of Microsoft sales and
0:06:54And Microsoft, in that release, after like three to four years of using a ray gun, they
0:07:03changed it to a pistol and then Apple changed their pistol to a water pistol.
0:07:09And basically yesterday, Google announced that they are going to be changing the representation
0:07:15of their pistol to a water pistol looking emoji sometime in the very near future.
0:07:22that is something that they're going to be doing. Facebook also confirmed to EmojiPedia
0:07:27they are going to also be joining these companies in making this change, changing their representation
0:07:32of the pistol emoji to a water pistol. Microsoft, Samsung and Twitter who are kind of the other major
0:07:38emoji platforms have not made any announcements at this time and have said that they have nothing to
0:07:43say. You know looking back on this like Apple kind of strong-armed people here like I feel like
0:07:51Google and Facebook they kind of have to do this because Apple did it and Apple did it
0:07:57I mean we spoke about this at the time whilst they had good intentions. They did this poorly
0:08:03You know for many reasons in that, you know
0:08:06They they changed something that was an existing character rather going back into history any
0:08:11representation of that gum will be replaced with a water pistol which could be incredibly distasteful or
0:08:16troubling in some instances. Yes
0:08:20It was basically, you know, the way I look at it, it was a move with good intentions,
0:08:25but it was poorly implemented. And you can see now, like, I think Apple learned from this.
0:08:30If you look at what they've been doing recently with their accessibility emoji,
0:08:34they put through a proper proposal, as you're supposed to do if you're adding new emoji,
0:08:39but they spoke about it way in advance. And my expectation now would be that they would
0:08:45maybe give a little bit more time and maybe speak to people on the emoji like
0:08:52the Unicode Consortium before making a change as significant as the as the
0:08:55pistol one. So I think it's I think it's a change that is good and I totally
0:09:00agree with you these other these other companies sort of have a you could say
0:09:04Apple's held a water pistol to their head and making you change it. Let me say that, couldn't you?
0:09:08And it wouldn't be so horrifying you know it's just either change it or your
0:09:12hair's gonna get wet. The Google one in this article is really good. It's like a super
0:09:16soaker, it has like a separate tank on top. They went serious, right? I want one of those.
0:09:21Yeah, they're good, they're good. It's like, aha, we have a gun that can hold more water.
0:09:26In 2019, Apple is gonna have a super soaker rifle instead of their pistol. You heard it
0:09:32here first. Oh, it actually looks like there has been a, since I put this into our document,
0:09:37Twitter seemed to have confirmed that they're gonna be changing theirs to also a water pistol
0:09:40point in the near future. So that is more real-time follow-up. That leaves Facebook
0:09:44and poor old Microsoft with a more conventional pistol, like a firearm in theirs.
0:09:52Yeah, I feel like this, again, I'm pleased that companies are doing this. I just think
0:09:58that sometimes it might be nicer if they all work together on stuff like this. You know,
0:10:01considering there is literally a working group, right, where they are all on this board together,
0:10:07the Unicode Consortium, they can have these conversations.
0:10:10And I hope that everybody learned a lesson
0:10:13from the way that everything went there,
0:10:15because it took something that should have been
0:10:17positive news and kind of made it a little bit negative,
0:10:19which I think that nobody really wanted.
0:10:21- Yeah, I agree with you, but at the same time,
0:10:23maybe Apple wanted to make the statement by just doing it.
0:10:27You know what I'm saying?
0:10:29- But it's a bigger statement
0:10:30if Google will do it at the same time.
0:10:32- Yeah, maybe.
0:10:33- Like, it is a way bigger statement to say,
0:10:37Google, Microsoft, Facebook and Apple joined together today to make a statement and they
0:10:42changed their pistol emoji to a water pistol and this is why and these are the statements.
0:10:46That's a bigger, more impactful message rather than Apple feeling like they have to be the
0:10:52lone crusader, which they definitely don't need to be and stuff like this.
0:10:57These companies, they have shared values.
0:11:00It isn't all about competing to show who's the best and who's the smartest.
0:11:03Sure.
0:11:04Yeah, I see what you're saying.
0:11:06All right, today's show is brought to you by TextExpander from our friends at Smile.
0:11:10You can communicate smart with TextExpander, create snippets of things that you type or
0:11:14copy and paste all the time and you'll be able to save yourself loads of time and hassle.
0:11:19You might want to set up snippets for website URLs that you frequently go to, email addresses
0:11:24that you have to be typing all the time and you could even have multiple ones to drop
0:11:27them all in at once.
0:11:28What about today's date?
0:11:29Or today's date formatted in other date formats, which I use all the time.
0:11:33I have if I type in UUSD, it gives me a date in the US format.
0:11:37Or what about just answers to common questions that you're frequently
0:11:40having to answer over email?
0:11:42You can just simply summon your snippets in any app on the Mac, Windows, iPhone,
0:11:47even your iPad as well, using the abbreviation, or just search for them
0:11:51using a hotkey while you're typing.
0:11:53You can even tailor each snippet with fill in fields if you want to add a
0:11:57little personalization to the message.
0:11:59Texas Bandar is also great for teams.
0:12:02It can multiply your team's productivity by making shared knowledge available instantly
0:12:06to everyone who needs it.
0:12:08You can make your team's common responses accessible and searchable through simple abbreviations
0:12:12and keyboard shortcuts.
0:12:13They can all be written and edited by your best writers, so it's always your best language
0:12:18at all times that's being sent out of your company.
0:12:20It's available on multiple platforms, updated immediately and everywhere when modified.
0:12:26If you're on a support or sales team, or in legal, medical or the real estate profession,
0:12:30Expander can transform your work, leaving you more time to focus on what you do best.
0:12:34We've been implementing a couple of these at Real AFM recently, just to even for things like
0:12:38naming our files in a consistent way, and it's helping us with just being able to make sure we've
0:12:44got everything where we need. You know, you can just type in a couple of keys, fill in a couple of
0:12:48like drop downs and type in some text and everything is nicely filed and nicely readable at all times.
0:12:54If you spend any amount of your day typing, you need Text Expander. It's the smartest way to
0:12:58improve the workflow of your communications. Go to textexpander.com/podcast for 20% off
0:13:04your first year. Just tell them you heard about them on this show. That is textexpander.com/podcast.
0:13:09Go right now and get 20% off your first year when you tell them that you came from connected.
0:13:14Our thanks to TextExpander for their support of this show and Relay FM.
0:13:18So we saw this week the release of iOS 11.3.1. If you've been following the news a little
0:13:26bit, there's been an issue with iPhone 8 and 8 Plus models if they have a third-party screen
0:13:33repair.
0:13:35I miss this. I had no idea that this was a problem at all. Like, I didn't see this reported
0:13:40anywhere until I read this story today.
0:13:42It was done a little bit, and there was some conversation by, like, the right to repair
0:13:46people with, like, Apple's crippling third-party repairs. Not the case. It seems that this
0:13:51was a bug because there's a bug release in the form of iOS 11.3.1 and so what was happening
0:13:57if you had a third-party screen put on your phone or the repair done by a third party
0:14:04you could end up with intermittent touch issues on the phone because these like non-genuine
0:14:12replacement parts weren't being appropriately like I read something like the touch scan
0:14:19or like the scan rate or something would come out of sync out and I read a couple of different
0:14:22things theorizing what it could be, but in short they fixed it in 11.3.1 and there are
0:14:26a couple of things about this update that I would like to talk about. Primarily, its
0:14:33existence. Like why do I have to install this on my iPad Pro? Why do I have to install this
0:14:40on my iPhone X if all that's in here is this update for iPhone?
0:14:45It is at no, right? Like, they're just bad at release notes.
0:14:48I mean, maybe. I was actually trying to find the official release notes, and I'm sure I'm
0:14:53going to do that in the chat. I'm going to help you with the URL. If there's more in
0:14:56there, say that there's more in there. I don't know, it's just like, the primary thing being
0:15:01this, running into my iPad Pro is like, this seems weird to me.
0:15:06It is, yeah. It is strange that, like, if there is other stuff, they didn't even mention
0:15:11the fact that there was other stuff because it's like why would I need this?
0:15:17Why would I need this on my iPad Pro?
0:15:19I completely agree with you actually.
0:15:20That doesn't make sense because I'm looking at the release notes on a KBase article about
0:15:26iOS 11 updates it is called and it has a little you can like click to each one and it just
0:15:31shows you the release notes and it well it says it improves the security of your iPhone
0:15:36or iPad and addresses an issue so security improvements whatever that means.
0:15:41I mean, it's hardly like the most exciting thing in the world.
0:15:44And there was a security update for the Mac yesterday as well that involved what could
0:15:47be some cross-platform stuff.
0:15:49And so, yeah, that's good.
0:15:52But even if this wasn't just an iPhone 8 update, I think it goes to the conversation we've
0:15:57had before that Apple is seemingly unable to update only some devices or only like,
0:16:05why can't we run an update in the App Store for mail when there's new mail stuff?
0:16:08Why do we have to wait for an iOS update?
0:16:11it's still a very monolithic release and they don't seem able to break it down into these
0:16:17different components or even target individual devices if they need to.
0:16:23But going back to the bug itself, it is not surprising to me that something like this
0:16:26would come out of Cupertino because the issue is third-party repair companies fixing iPhone
0:16:33screens. I mean, and like, what kind of test conditions would lead you to being able to
0:16:40like logically come across that, you know? And like, and it's even like, it obviously
0:16:46didn't, it wasn't widespread in any betas or anything like that, because they would
0:16:52have seen this happening. They would have had people reporting it. And it's because
0:16:55it's such a specific use case. One, you have to have an iPhone 8. Two, you have to have
0:16:59broken the screen, and three, you have to have them taken it to a third-party repair
0:17:04company. There are so many things that have to happen for this to become known on a wide
0:17:10scale. Apparently, it was some kind of microchip that had a bug and it was disabling screen
0:17:15input. I don't know why. I reckon it's some kind of tempering thing that they have anyway,
0:17:19like just so they know and then maybe it was like, "Oh, it's all gone wrong." I mean, I
0:17:25I don't know, I've never had to replace a screen.
0:17:28I don't know how expensive they are,
0:17:30but I'm naturally assuming it's always gonna be cheaper
0:17:33if you go to a third party,
0:17:34because that's what third parties do, right?
0:17:35They would always price it cheaper than Apple.
0:17:38- Yeah, Apple's prices are more competitive
0:17:40than they used to be, unless you have an iPhone 10.
0:17:42That's an expensive phone to repair.
0:17:43But yeah, lots of people go to third parties.
0:17:45I know there's several in town that you can go to.
0:17:48One's very noticeably right across the street
0:17:52from the Apple stores.
0:17:52As you walk out of the Apple store dejected,
0:17:54look up onto the horizon and there's a third-party service provider.
0:17:57That's very clever.
0:17:58Waiting for you.
0:17:59There's a chain here called iSmash.
0:18:03That's a really good name.
0:18:04It's a good name, right?
0:18:05They fix screens, they do all kinds of stuff, but they fix screens.
0:18:08That's one of the things they do.
0:18:10If phone unlocking was still a thing, they would do that, right?
0:18:14It's like one of those types of places.
0:18:15Yeah, no doubt.
0:18:17I did want to talk a little bit about the second half of the release notes.
0:18:20I just want to read this because I find it incredible.
0:18:25"Non-genuine replacement displays may have compromised
0:18:28"visual quality and may fail to work correctly.
0:18:32"Apple-certified screen repairs are performed
0:18:34"by trusted experts whose genuine Apple parts."
0:18:38See support.apple.com for more information.
0:18:41I don't think I've ever read a more passive-aggressive
0:18:44chunk of text in release notes of all time.
0:18:47Like, this is just dripping with this attitude from Apple, and it really, like, I think it's
0:18:54kind of a bad look.
0:18:55I don't know, did that rub you the wrong way?
0:18:59I more like how much this bothers you.
0:19:02Like I kind of don't, I'm fine with it.
0:19:04I like how much it upsets you.
0:19:07That makes me very happy.
0:19:08Because I'm like, well yeah, sure.
0:19:10Like I read that stuff and I agree with it.
0:19:13probably correct that if you should and because I don't think it means you have
0:19:18to go to the Apple store right like an Apple certified screen repair could be
0:19:24done at a an Apple service provider yeah and I guess they they probably have more
0:19:30flexibility on their pricing but there's only so low they can go I guess so I
0:19:35mean I kind of like I read that and I'm like yeah you're probably right support
0:19:39documentation, you know?
0:19:42- Yeah.
0:19:43- But I understand why it gets you.
0:19:44- Just the way that it's worded,
0:19:46compromise visual quality, performed by trusted experts,
0:19:50like instead of just like the guy at the mall.
0:19:52- It's like everybody else sucks, right?
0:19:54Like the mall guy, he doesn't know what he's doing,
0:19:57he's trying to put like a Galaxy S screen on there,
0:20:00and like, you know, he has no idea.
0:20:02He just gets a piece of glass and like just puts it on
0:20:05and hopes that it will work, and he puts a little print out
0:20:07an iPhone home screen behind the glass and then just gives you your phone and you leave.
0:20:11So I don't know. Go update your friends I guess to 1131.
0:20:17Hey Flickr's back. Is it? It's back in the news.
0:20:22Hopefully. It's back in the news.
0:20:23SmugMug have bought Flickr. What is a SmugMug? SmugMug.
0:20:29It is a photo sharing and print service. Not unlike Flickr. They're actually kind of similar.
0:20:35What I didn't know is that Smug-Mug is family owned, which is pretty cool.
0:20:39There was this article at Broken USA Today, of all places, saying that Smug-Mug is purchasing
0:20:46Flickr away from the smoldering carcass that is Yahoo.
0:20:51Well, I think they actually bought it from Oath.
0:20:53Yeah.
0:20:54Well, I like to think of Oath as just a container around the smoldering carcass of Yahoo.
0:21:01It's just like a sleeping bag full of death.
0:21:04Yahoo and AOL together, right? That's Oath. Yeah, that's a real pair of acquisitions.
0:21:11Owned by Verizon. It's a real, that is like just a whole mess of stuff going on over there.
0:21:17It is. If you had told 2002, Steven, one day AOL and Yahoo and Flickr are going to be owned
0:21:23by a company called Oath, hey I would laugh, oh but that's really just a shelf of Verizon
0:21:28to be like, what has happened to the internet in 2018? But that's where we are. So, Smug
0:21:34- So, Lungmug is saying that Flickr is gonna remain
0:21:36a standalone community, that it is going to
0:21:40pour resources into it.
0:21:44We should say that, you know, Flickr was bought by Yahoo
0:21:48years and years ago.
0:21:50Yahoo sold for only 4.5 billion, which is,
0:21:53I mean, it's a lot of money to me and you,
0:21:54but it's not that much money in 2018 acquisitions,
0:21:58if you think about how big Yahoo was at one point.
0:22:01- Yeah, it's again, one of those things,
0:22:03you go back far enough and say this is how much Verizon's going to buy Yahoo for and
0:22:07you'd be like, nah, you're crazy.
0:22:09Like Yahoo is the place, you know?
0:22:11Yeah.
0:22:12And the chat room is asking if we're killing Flickr by talking about it.
0:22:16I hope not.
0:22:17I would like to think that right now, I mean, it's probably got the best chance it's ever
0:22:22had.
0:22:23Maybe we kill Oath, you know, maybe that was the whole thing.
0:22:26Yeah.
0:22:27It can't be long for this world.
0:22:30So there's a lot to talk about here, I think.
0:22:32I don't know what your experience was, but for me, especially in college, so talking
0:22:372004, 2005, 2006, that time frame, sort of pre-iPhone time, Flickr was a really important
0:22:45part of my internet life.
0:22:48I had an account for a really long time.
0:22:52I was a part of some really genuinely enjoyable communities on Flickr of Mac nerds and other
0:23:00people in Memphis who are photographers and I learned a lot from those people and had
0:23:04really like really honestly good conversations online in these communities. And I still have
0:23:10an account I went through, maybe when Yahoo! bought them and sort of cleaned out my archive
0:23:15and really trimmed what was there. I don't know the last time I uploaded Flickr wise,
0:23:18it's been a really long time. And I used to do it daily in 2008 2009. I did a photo a
0:23:23day project and I posted it on Flickr. So every single day I uploaded that I don't think
0:23:28been the case for hardly anybody recently. There are still communities there. In fact,
0:23:33you remember that video I did a couple months ago, maybe last month, about the
0:23:37AlphaSmart, that keyboard computer thing? That whole enthusiast community exists in a Flickr
0:23:47group. I stumbled across them in my research, and all these people hacking smart Alphas,
0:23:53or AlphaSmarts and doing all this stuff.
0:23:54And they're doing it all on Flickr.
0:23:56It's this crazy thing.
0:23:58But I can't imagine there's a lot of those communities left
0:24:02on Flickr because so many things have come along
0:24:07and have overtaken it.
0:24:09I think Flickr's a really good example of a web 2.0 company
0:24:14that totally missed the boat on mobile.
0:24:16They did not have a mobile app for a really long time.
0:24:20and when they did, it was really pretty bad.
0:24:23And there were some third party apps.
0:24:25The website wasn't responsive for a really long time.
0:24:28They just, they could have been,
0:24:30if they had been on their feet about it,
0:24:33they could have been there in the app store on day one
0:24:35and saying, hey, this is the default place
0:24:37for you to share your photos
0:24:38when you take them from an iPhone.
0:24:40And they just weren't.
0:24:41- They could have been Instagrams.
0:24:43They could have been bought by Facebook
0:24:44for like a billion dollars or whatever it was.
0:24:46- Yeah, but they weren't.
0:24:47and Instagram I think is that place now.
0:24:51And that makes me a little sad because
0:24:53Flickr had all this great organization to it
0:24:56that you could build these really nice albums
0:24:59and they had all the community stuff.
0:25:00Whereas Instagram is really just a Twitter-like timeline
0:25:04and it lacks a certain permanence that I think Flickr had
0:25:08in a lot of people's lives for a long time.
0:25:10So I mean, I don't know anything about SmugMug really.
0:25:14I don't know anything about the family that owns it
0:25:17or the CEO that's quoted in this article,
0:25:20but I would love to see it flourish.
0:25:24I just don't know if that's possible in 2018.
0:25:27- I feel like they've missed the boat
0:25:31on anything that would have been substantial for them
0:25:34at this point, honestly.
0:25:36I don't think that they could rise to prominence
0:25:42to be either of the things
0:25:43that they could or should have been,
0:25:45and I don't really know what it could be right now.
0:25:49I'm just gonna go out on a limb and say that
0:25:51if SmugMug is like a family-owned business,
0:25:54Flickr probably already has a community large enough
0:25:56to fulfill what they want from it.
0:25:59And as long as they keep that community happy
0:26:01and maybe bring some more people in,
0:26:03they're gonna be fine.
0:26:05And considering what SmugMug's business is,
0:26:09just being able to natively advertise
0:26:12that you should print your photos, right,
0:26:14and stuff like that whilst in Flickr,
0:26:17all of that stuff's gonna be good for them.
0:26:19Like it is a logical purchase for SmugMug's business,
0:26:23but I cannot imagine it being Instagram.
0:26:27I just can't see it because it's too late now, right?
0:26:34Like Flickr's too old and too big to change enough, right?
0:26:39Because you'd end up with Flickr stories.
0:26:43Like, it's gonna have to do all of that, right?
0:26:46Like to try and combat it, you know?
0:26:49And I just don't imagine it happening.
0:26:52The funny parallel for me here is, you know,
0:26:54you were completely right in what you said about
0:26:57Flickr in this situation because they missed mobile.
0:27:01But one of the other big web 2.0 companies
0:27:04that missed mobile was Facebook.
0:27:06And it's kind of funny to see that like,
0:27:09because Facebook didn't have a competitor,
0:27:12they weathered the storm and got it together,
0:27:16but Flickr had Instagram.
0:27:19- Oh man, Path totally had it there for a second.
0:27:21No, they didn't.
0:27:22- But like, if something would have come along
0:27:24like at that time, that was compelling,
0:27:27it could have killed Facebook in theory, right?
0:27:31I know it's on a much bigger scale,
0:27:33but it's just funny when you look at it like that,
0:27:35that comparison-wise, Flickr had a huge audience
0:27:39for its place, Instagram came with zero
0:27:43and was able to surpass it, grow,
0:27:46and then got bought by Facebook and explode, right?
0:27:48Like, you know, and it's funny that like,
0:27:51Facebook were just lucky, they had enough money
0:27:54that they could buy companies like Instagram
0:27:56and WhatsApp and all these other types of companies
0:27:59to keep them going whilst they got a lot
0:28:01of their stuff in check until they became compelling
0:28:04on mobile.
0:28:05And it's just funny to me to think about that comparison
0:28:08looking at how those two companies kind of weathered that storm and Flickr did not do
0:28:12well and then they got bought as well as Instagram got bought but Yahoo treated Flickr badly and
0:28:20Facebook has treated Instagram very well it seems. So it's just funny to look at all of
0:28:26those companies like compared to each other from like a where are they now standpoint
0:28:31that now Flickr is just being traded away as some way to inject cash into a new company
0:28:36and it's kind of sad.
0:28:38- It is.
0:28:39Yeah, I think that's all sad.
0:28:44- But it looks like that they're in the right place
0:28:45for where they want to be right now.
0:28:47I think that SmugMug will probably be
0:28:49a really good home for Flickr,
0:28:51and I bet that everybody that works there
0:28:53will probably be a lot happier as well.
0:28:55So I think this is a nice move,
0:28:58and I hope they are able to do something with it
0:29:00because Flickr is an institution,
0:29:02and it would be really nice to see something
0:29:04come of this that's positive.
0:29:06Yeah, I think so. And, you know, maybe they can never return to those glory days, but
0:29:12maybe they can grow it from where it is. Because I think Yahoo buying it was kind of the second
0:29:17blow after missing mobile. Because like you said, Facebook did pull out of that. Flickr
0:29:23didn't. And I think part of that was because Yahoo wasn't able to do it. Yahoo didn't have
0:29:27the brand to pull that sort of thing off. Or the desire.
0:29:31Or the desire. Because, you know, Yahoo was what it was.
0:29:33Sunset remember the sunset slide I do
0:29:36I'm on the Yahoo homepage right now. It's not good. I can't imagine it being good at this point
0:29:43It hasn't been good for a long time. I can't imagine it being good now
0:29:46Alright today's show is also brought to you by a new sponsor and that is molecule
0:29:51I'm sure you spent a lot of effort into making your home a comfortable welcoming and maybe even these days smart environment
0:29:58But do you ever think about air pollutants in your home?
0:30:01Because without them you could actually sleep better, feel better, and live more healthily.
0:30:06Molecule is the only air purifier that destroys pollutants.
0:30:10Let me tell you why that's important.
0:30:12More than 80% of people living in urban areas that monitor pollution are exposed to air quality
0:30:17that doesn't meet the recommendations set by the World Health Organization.
0:30:22The worst news is that actually, and this was very upsetting for me to find out,
0:30:26indoor air can be up to five times worse than outdoor air.
0:30:30Yeah, it's good to know. To rest easy knowing that you're breathing clean air, you need
0:30:36Molekule. Molekule are introducing a breakthrough science that is finally capable of destroying
0:30:41air pollutants at a molecular level. And their many, many happy customers are reaping the
0:30:46benefits of customers saying they're able to breathe through their noses for the first
0:30:49time in years. Molekule has a clean design with high quality experience. It's been called
0:30:54the Apple of Air Purifiers. You know what that means? That means it's pretty and it
0:30:59in a nice box and technology has been personally effective and verified by science but more
0:31:05importantly is tested by real people. Molekule have already helped allergy and asthma sufferers
0:31:10cope with their conditions and significantly reduce their symptoms. The Molekule air purifier
0:31:15is whisper quiet energy efficient made for rooms of all sizes it's portable and connected you can
0:31:20control Molekule using its touchscreen display or remotely using the iPhone or Android app.
0:31:26You need to go and look at the Molekule air purifier for yourself so you can see what it can do
0:31:30and to see how good looking that thing is head to molekule.com that's molekule of a k so m-o-l-e-k-u-l-e
0:31:38dot com to take a look around and when you make your first order use the code connected to get
0:31:4475 dollars off that is connected for 75 dollars off your order at molekule.com our thanks to Molekule
0:31:51for their support of this show. So in Alphabet's Q1 earnings report, it became clear that the
0:31:59company is spending a lot of money on Nest without probably the return that they would like to see
0:32:06from it. So it takes some work to see exactly what these amounts are, and this stuff was all
0:32:12brought from a Vurd report where they did the hard work so I didn't have to, and you can see that
0:32:17Alphabet, what they've done is they've placed Nest into a section of their earnings
0:32:22akin to how Apple reports the Apple Watch in like an other category. And this has been
0:32:28changed because Alphabet rolled Nest back into Google, I think that was like within
0:32:34the last year or so. So they made a bunch of adjustments to previously reported figures
0:32:39which meant you could see the difference in the profit and loss. So like Nest were in
0:32:43another part of the business where it was hidden away in a big bucket, right? Then it
0:32:49got moved into another bucket and you could just see the impact of how those buckets changed
0:32:53from time over time to be able to work out these amounts. So it's not as hidden as
0:32:57maybe Google would like. So what this has shown from some calculation is that Nest made
0:33:03around $726 million in revenue but lost $621 million last year. So, you know, it's not
0:33:12in the red, but I don't think it's where you would want the company to be right now or this division.
0:33:19So like this investment could be worth it ultimately because Google has a shot to
0:33:25potentially further integrate Nest and Google Assistant together to try and maybe take on
0:33:31Amazon, which is clearly what they're trying to do with all of their home products because
0:33:34Amazon have the mind share and if you any statistics and figures show they also have
0:33:39the significant market share in the smart connected home device space right now.
0:33:44And also, if you look at the suite of tools and features available, it is probably more likely
0:33:52that Google could become dominant in this area than they could in the phone area with the Pixel.
0:34:00Pixel is a very good phone, considered to be the best Android phone, but it's very difficult for
0:34:06for them to try and take down Samsung,
0:34:07and it's very difficult for them to try
0:34:09and take down Apple, right?
0:34:10Like in the idea of units sold,
0:34:12but it seems like you would maybe have a clearer path
0:34:15as Google to produce products at a better quality
0:34:20and with larger audiences than Amazon, right?
0:34:23'Cause the market's way smaller,
0:34:25Google has more resources in this area, right?
0:34:27And this is what they do.
0:34:29But it does seem that right now, even with this spending,
0:34:32Amazon's still the leader,
0:34:34Nest is not really churning out products at a speedy rate. I think it's going to be really
0:34:38interesting to see what happens over the next 12 months because they just released a new
0:34:43camera that has the Google system built in, right? That's something that they did recently,
0:34:47I think. You know, when I look at this stuff, it's like, well, I can see why Google or Alphabet
0:34:55is putting the money into this because Nest make great products when they make them and
0:35:04if they're able to I guess pump up this stuff and make a bunch of really compelling home
0:35:12products that also integrate and include in some instances the Google Assistant and Google
0:35:17home stuff, they have a real kind of shot at competing and out competing Amazon, right?
0:35:27You would think. But even today, like Amazon are releasing more products. Did you see this
0:35:32today? The Echo Dot for kids?
0:35:34Yeah, it's just colored funny, right?
0:35:36It's colored, it comes in a colorful case and it has increased parental controls.
0:35:40Okay.
0:35:41So you can put it in the kids room or whatever and it's, you know, it's better for working
0:35:47with the stuff that they're gonna ask.
0:35:49Because Amazon will not stop releasing new Echo products.
0:35:53- They can't.
0:35:53- They cannot be stopped.
0:35:54- Yeah, I think Google is in a great position
0:35:58to take Amazon on here.
0:36:00And maybe, if you read the reports,
0:36:03Nest was like a real disaster,
0:36:05and they got rid of some people,
0:36:07and then it was like under Alphabet,
0:36:09now it's under Google again.
0:36:11It's been through, as a company, a lot of things.
0:36:15and maybe they're getting close to sorting all that out
0:36:20and we're on the edge of this great Nest Renaissance.
0:36:25I'd love it, I have a lot of Nest products.
0:36:26I've got several cameras I have there.
0:36:29I always forget what it's called.
0:36:30Like the security pad, the alarm system deal.
0:36:35Nest Secure, I've got one of those in my office.
0:36:38I've been happy with their stuff
0:36:40and the app's pretty good.
0:36:41They don't support HomeKit but you can live with that.
0:36:44It's like they have so many good pieces
0:36:47and they just need to keep pushing
0:36:49because I think especially with Amazon
0:36:52breathing down their necks with the Echo family of stuff,
0:36:56you've gotta stay on top of this.
0:36:57You've gotta remain competitive
0:36:59'cause if you go, if Nest Go's another year, 18 months
0:37:01with no real change in their products,
0:37:04then that's a pretty big deal.
0:37:05I think a bigger deal than it was last time around.
0:37:08When they were quiet, 2015, 2016, 2017,
0:37:12They didn't have a lot of real good competition, but now they do, and they need to stay on
0:37:18the ball.
0:37:19So some real-time follow-up from Pastor Boy in the chat room.
0:37:25The Echo for Kids has a feature called Magic Word, where it encourages, with positive reinforcement,
0:37:34if kids use the word "please" when asking the Echo to do things.
0:37:39Which is really interesting because I was talking with some friends a couple of days
0:37:42ago who were like having this issue, or like it was friends of friends that were having
0:37:47this issue, where they're having to say please to their echo because they don't want their
0:37:53kids to just really like think about that they have to bark orders at things all the
0:37:57time.
0:37:58Mm-hmm.
0:37:59Which is kind of incredible, right?
0:38:00And also something else, oh this is so cute, it's optimized for a waxer.
0:38:07Oh, oh boy.
0:38:09Isn't that incredible?
0:38:13This specific version is optimized for common mispronunciations of the code words that kids
0:38:20might do.
0:38:21This is maybe the best thing Amazon have ever done.
0:38:23I'm melting now.
0:38:24This is so good.
0:38:25I mean, it's nice, but it's a very Amazon way to do it, whereas you could just have
0:38:30all those be settings for any Echo.
0:38:32I'm not going to go by...
0:38:34I think a lot of it is, though.
0:38:35I agree with Echo.
0:38:36in the parental control features.
0:38:41Like the magic word stuff is all in the parental control
0:38:44features so. - Good.
0:38:45So there you go. - Some of it's
0:38:46already in there.
0:38:47- Amazon's doing a lot of stuff and that should do more.
0:38:50- Speaking of Amazon doing a lot of stuff,
0:38:52it feels like they've already decided to move on
0:38:55to their next big bet, home robots.
0:38:58This is a report from Mark Gurman and Brad Stone
0:39:01over at Bloomberg that the team
0:39:05that was responsible for the Amazon Echo, the Fire TV,
0:39:10the Fire tablets and the Fire phone, may it rest in peace,
0:39:14which is run by someone with the name Craig Zirr.
0:39:18They have started a new secret project
0:39:21to build what is being dubbed a domestic robot.
0:39:25This report is very, very light on any substantial details.
0:39:30The project is code named Vesta,
0:39:32which is named after the Roman goddess
0:39:34of the hearth, home, and family.
0:39:37And Amazon are hiring a lot of people.
0:39:38They have an ex-Apple engineer,
0:39:40or ex-Apple executive, I should say,
0:39:42who's running their kind of like,
0:39:44some of the machine learning stuff around vision,
0:39:49that this thing's gonna need to see stuff.
0:39:52And basically a lot of it, honestly,
0:39:54is Bloomberg speculating about what the robot might do,
0:39:57which it's not great reporting.
0:39:59They got this one little tidbit
0:40:00and then just tried to turn it into an article, honestly.
0:40:03Like one thing that they say,
0:40:04oh, what if it's just an Amazon Echo device?
0:40:06That is mobile, that's rubbish.
0:40:08That is a rubbish, terrible speculation.
0:40:10You may as well have not even bothered.
0:40:12Like, because like what?
0:40:14Like I can just put a dot in every room.
0:40:16I don't need a robot to follow me around
0:40:18so I can give Echo commands.
0:40:20So I thought what might be more fun
0:40:23is if we try and think of some things
0:40:25that we would want an Amazon Echo home robot to do.
0:40:29So, one thing that I want it to do is something I don't want it to be, which is humanoid.
0:40:38I would not want a home robot to have a humanoid shape, because that would be too creepy. I
0:40:45would like it to have a different shape, you know, like maybe just something more like
0:40:50Eve from Wall-E, right? Like, I would prefer something in that kind of thing, like, you
0:40:55know, like that would be more comfortable for me. Maybe to not even have a head,
0:40:59right, just like the body and the arms, that would be way better. But here's some
0:41:03things I was thinking of, Steven. Some basic cleaning stuff, like a Roomba, right?
0:41:08Like, if this thing can move around, why not put like a vacuum on the bottom of
0:41:12it and it can do some cleaning. I was thinking like maybe some restocking of
0:41:16homeware items, so if it sees that I've like, I don't know, I don't know how much
0:41:20this thing's gonna follow me around, but like let's just assume that it sees me
0:41:24throw some olive oil, like an olive oil bottle into the recycling bin that it's like, "I'll
0:41:29order some olive oil for you." And it just lets me know, like, "Oh hey, I've ordered
0:41:32some olive oil." Um, also home security. You know, I can have this thing patrolling.
0:41:37I like that.
0:41:38Guard dog mode. You can just like walk around the house patrolling stuff.
0:41:41It's like at the front window and it pulls back the curtain with his robotic arm, just
0:41:45like, peek out the curtain and then puts it back.
0:41:46Peeking out and it's like, and you can see, I can see what you're up to out there. And
0:41:50Also, like, I figure, boombox mode, you know?
0:41:54Like, you know, walk around and play--
0:41:57DJ Roomba.
0:41:57You invented DJ Roomba.
0:41:58Yeah, I invented DJ Roomba.
0:42:01So that's what I would like to see an Amazon home robot do.
0:42:06I mean, obviously, it would have Echo functionality built
0:42:09into it, right?
0:42:10Because that's what powers everything.
0:42:12But it's actually got to do stuff, right?
0:42:15Like, all of this stuff is going to do stuff.
0:42:17And I actually have another Amazon story
0:42:20I want to talk to you about in a minute where it's, you know, it's all about trade-offs,
0:42:23right? Like, I'm going to allow this thing if it's going to do stuff for me. And allowing
0:42:29Amazon to put a robot into my home requires significant trade-off that they are willing
0:42:37to give me in what it can do, right? Like, I want this thing to be fairly priced and
0:42:43I get a ton of benefit from it because otherwise why am I letting Amazon walk around in my
0:42:50house right?
0:42:51I come up with a list of things that I don't want the robot to do.
0:42:56Okay.
0:42:57That's more interesting.
0:42:58I would add to your list I would love for something to be able to, as someone who mowed
0:43:02their grass this morning, do some yard work for me.
0:43:05Rake some leaves.
0:43:06Yeah.
0:43:07But you know mow the grass.
0:43:08But things I don't want taken over by robots.
0:43:11I don't think I want them doing like food preparation.
0:43:14Like my wife and I cook, we enjoy it.
0:43:17Maybe some stuff like, I don't know,
0:43:19like something about like a robot checking
0:43:21how well done a steak is and like flinging knives
0:43:23all over my kitchen seems like a weird.
0:43:25- Oh man, so make me a sandwich.
0:43:28Like isn't that the best thing?
0:43:29Like I would love that.
0:43:30Obviously like yes, I would draw the line,
0:43:33but like you know, make me a cup of coffee
0:43:35would be kind of great, I would enjoy that.
0:43:38- Maybe.
0:43:39- I think maybe that's version three though, right?
0:43:41Yeah, that's an in-app purchase.
0:43:43Yeah, I want to know that it's capable before I let it near the fire.
0:43:48Yeah.
0:43:49It just turns on a blender full of rocks.
0:43:51Oh no, Liam!
0:43:51Pull Liam.
0:43:52Oh no.
0:43:53I don't want it to--
0:43:58I don't think I want it to take over work stuff.
0:44:01My thought is a robot should not edit a podcast.
0:44:03But my bigger thought is I don't want it to assume what task it can take over for me.
0:44:08I want some sort of system.
0:44:11"Okay, you can do this, this is how I show you
0:44:14"how we do it, I don't want it to like,
0:44:16"I just come home one day and one day it has just like
0:44:18"rearranged all the furniture or has cleaned out my closet.
0:44:22"I want it to be responsive and not going out on its own."
0:44:26And like, "Oh, Steven always edits podcasts
0:44:28"in the afternoons, I'll just do that one day when he's out.
0:44:30"Like I don't want to come home and find that happening."
0:44:32- Yeah, I actually agree with that a lot.
0:44:34Like I wouldn't want to see that it's doing stuff like that.
0:44:40Like there has to be an element of like machine learning in a product like this, but I don't
0:44:48want it to take it upon itself to do things for me.
0:44:51Even if it has the ability to do them, I want it to ask, right, before it goes ahead and
0:44:57does stuff like that.
0:45:00Like this does feel like, I mean, this will happen, right?
0:45:05I really do believe that we will have robots in our homes one day purely because I feel
0:45:12like all technology is influenced by science fiction.
0:45:16And whatever was in science fiction when people were kids is what they eventually want to
0:45:20make.
0:45:21Right.
0:45:22And that we just trend towards science fiction because all of these inventions require people's
0:45:27imaginations and the best imaginations are the people that create these worlds and then
0:45:33and that just informs our own imaginations, right?
0:45:36And then I think a lot of times,
0:45:38we end up just making what we saw in movies as kids.
0:45:41And The Jetsons is formative for many of us,
0:45:45and we gotta have a robot butler at home, I guess.
0:45:49- Yeah, also, I don't want it to inject itself,
0:45:53or interject itself, I should say, into relationships.
0:45:57So I don't want it telling my kids yes or no
0:46:02thinking watch TV after school or you know hey your wife was mad when she left
0:46:06the house you didn't see it I'm just giving you a hand like I don't think I
0:46:10want that in my life yeah I don't want I don't want to be in an argument and then
0:46:16the robots like actually two days ago you said this right right where it's
0:46:22like you're arguing about like who said what and then the robot jumps in and
0:46:26it's like well Bob's right Mary's wrong yeah I don't I don't want that like the
0:46:32robot should keep its mouth shut in my opinion. Dumb robot. Who does he think he is?
0:46:36Also, I don't want it to murder anybody. And I say that jokingly, but you said like
0:46:41a home security system. There's a real question here about ethics. Like, if someone breaks
0:46:46into my house, does the Echo robot have the right to stop them with force?
0:46:51I had an imagination feature here earlier today and decided not to put it in the document,
0:46:58now I will use it because now you've brought that out in me. I was imagining like a net gun.
0:47:03You come home, there's just a guy in a net in your kitchen like you tried breaking in so I stuck him
0:47:09in a net. Yeah or if like your phone's not connected to the wi-fi so it doesn't know it's you and then
0:47:14you get hit with a net. Oh yeah, the wi-fi was down so I thought you were a bad guy. I mean like
0:47:19when you introduce things like this like these are the questions like you know we're being funny
0:47:24about it, but hopefully someone's thinking about these things seriously.
0:47:28It's the self-driving car problem, right? Do you kill ten pedestrians or two people
0:47:35in the car? These are the things that eventually have to be coded or logic'd out in some way.
0:47:41If my house is on fire, who does the robot help save?
0:47:45Who does it go for first? Does it leave the dog? What does the robot do?
0:47:51I would train mine to take the Drobo.
0:47:54Get the data out.
0:47:56Drobo first.
0:47:58Don't second.
0:47:59Just throw the Drobo out the window and then come back first.
0:48:02No, no.
0:48:02There's hard drives in there.
0:48:03You've got to be gentle with the Drobo.
0:48:04You've got to sit it down gently on the sidewalk.
0:48:07This is when it ejects the balloon
0:48:09that it ties to the Drobo and pushes it out.
0:48:12I would take it, but I'm waiting for the Mac Mini
0:48:13to eject it so I can unplug it safely.
0:48:15Good robot.
0:48:16Good robot.
0:48:17You've learned very well.
0:48:18Yeah.
0:48:19I mean who knows, right, like if this is a pie in the sky thing, if this is a real thing.
0:48:24I agree with you that science fiction to a degree shapes our future because we're, that's
0:48:28what we grow up with as kids, that's what as adults we want to see happen.
0:48:31Um, I don't know man, like I like the voices and stuff but this seems like a totally different
0:48:36thing so I don't think it's anytime soon but it's something worth thinking about.
0:48:41But it's weird.
0:48:42It's weird to think about.
0:48:43It is weird.
0:48:44Today's episode is also brought to you by Slack, a collaboration hub that lets you organize
0:48:49your team's work into easily searchable channels. You can use Slack for projects, interests,
0:48:54teams, for your office. No matter what type of group you have, Slack is perfect for it.
0:48:58And when you do, you will know that everyone is always in the loop. All the relevant information
0:49:04that you need is in one place and it's easily accessible. And it's super simple for new team
0:49:08members to get up to speed. Slack helps you dramatically reduce the number of emails that
0:49:12you'll need to send, whilst also streamlining your team's communication. Everything is kept in one
0:49:18place. So you can search and find stuff. You can send messages to people in single groups or small
0:49:25groups. All of the history is there for everybody to see. So you're not in a situation where like
0:49:30someone forgot to hit reply all and now you've just got that one person's thing and then you
0:49:34have to forward that to everyone else. You don't have to do any of that with Slack. And Slack has
0:49:38so many incredible integrations it becomes more and more powerful all the time. As well as real
0:49:43time messaging, you can do video and voice calls, you can do group file sharing, you
0:49:47can integrate with all of the apps and services that you use, stuff like Google Drive, Salesforce
0:49:52and Zendesk and I'll say it's actually not even that difficult to build Slack bots of
0:49:57your own, I actually built one. It's very simple, like it just talks to a Google Sheet
0:50:02but like I was able to do that, that's how cool it is. And they have great guides for
0:50:05that sort of stuff as well. Everything's in all one easy to use app, you can use drag
0:50:09and drop file sharing that works with all the apps and services that you already do
0:50:14and Slack will work wherever you do. Their mobile apps for iOS and Android sync seamlessly.
0:50:19It's on the web, it's on all major platforms, so you're able to pick up where you left off
0:50:24no matter where you are. I would be lost about Slack at this point. It is so embedded in
0:50:31the way that I do business. At this point, it's just where I go every day. It's one of
0:50:36the first things that I check when I'm getting ready for the day and it's one of the last
0:50:40things that I check in the evening. Because my Slack group, the Slack group that we run
0:50:45now, it's so split so nicely. We have general channels and fun channels where people can
0:50:50hang out but then we also have channels where all the work is being done and where messages
0:50:54are being shared. It is really the hub of a lot of the stuff that I do in my life. It's
0:51:00really an incredible tool. To learn more about Slack, head to slack.com, that is s-l-a-c-k.com.
0:51:07Thanks to Slack for their support of Real AFM and for giving us an easy way to communicate
0:51:11every day. Slack, where work happens.
0:51:14So Amazon, talking about trade-offs. Would you like Amazon to have access to your car?
0:51:22I like it more than having access to the front door of my house, I think.
0:51:27This is similar to that front door system thing where you could set up a camera on a
0:51:31lock Amazon Key I think it was called.
0:51:34I think Amazon Key now includes this Amazon trunk delivery.
0:51:39They have partnered with GM and Volvo to allow them to deliver packages to the trunks of
0:51:44cars in 37 US cities.
0:51:47This is currently restricted to Prime customers who have cars that are from the 2015 model
0:51:52year or newer, and they also have to have an active OnStar or Volvo on-call accounts.
0:51:58What are these things?
0:52:00OnStar at least is, I think it does a bunch of stuff, but one thing it can do is it monitors
0:52:04for an accident and then it basically calls you in the car, like not your phone, but it
0:52:09calls the car.
0:52:10It's like, "Are you okay?"
0:52:11It can call 911, it can share your location.
0:52:14I think OnStar also does like, "Hey, I'm looking for XYZ, can you help me find assistant
0:52:21type stuff, I'm not really sure. I assume Volvo on Call is similar.
0:52:24Yeah. One of the other things that they can do, Volvo on Call, and also some of the other GM
0:52:30connected things, they can actually lock and unlock cars because that's how this is done.
0:52:37So you use the Amazon Key app to describe the car and you register your
0:52:46GPS and license plate with it as well. And basically, you can say I want it delivered
0:52:52to the trunk of my car and as long as your car is parked within a safe radius of an address
0:52:58already used for an Amazon delivery, so your home or your office or whatever, right, so it's in the
0:53:03parking lot or it's in the driveway, Amazon will deliver to the trunk of the car. You get notified
0:53:08every step of the process and it's possible for you to change your mind and block the delivery
0:53:12at any point forcing the delivery to be sent to a physical location like a front door somewhere
0:53:17your driver will be sent your license plate and GPS so you can find the vehicle and when they
0:53:22arrive they make a request to the car's connected service right so like on star over one call
0:53:27and the trunk is opened so why would you do this is i think a huge question because like
0:53:34if it's close to your if if the car has to be near your home or your office why would you have
0:53:42something delivered to the car. So Amazon posted a video because they've been doing
0:53:47some like data tests of this in some cities and they spoke to some customers and there
0:53:52were two I think kind of compelling reasons for doing this. One, speaking to a mother
0:54:00who had diapers delivered to the car because they didn't want a doorbell to ring and wake
0:54:06the baby?"
0:54:07It's like, "Okay, makes sense."
0:54:09Or another person who was saying that they had birthday presents for their child and
0:54:15they didn't want them to be spotted, so they were put in the car, so then they could
0:54:20be brought into the house at a safe time.
0:54:23I could also see this being a better way to receive deliveries at your office.
0:54:27Because the car's not going to move, and so one of the things that is a good idea about
0:54:34the giving Amazon access to your front door thing is you don't have to be home, right?
0:54:39That's the key part of these things is this means that Amazon can deliver without needing
0:54:45to rearrange deliveries. And the thing about the car is the car is way less personal. They
0:54:51only have access to their trunk and it's super hard from the trunk in a lot of cars to get
0:54:55to the main part of the car, right? If you're an average size human being. It's kind of
0:54:59out of the way, way less personal. They can't get access to you. They're not going to have
0:55:03problems with pets, right, and all that kind of stuff. So it is a more compelling thing,
0:55:08I think, than having something delivered directly into your home. But it's still got the weirdness
0:55:15factor, right? Of like some rando is gonna put something into your car.
0:55:22Yeah, I mean, I guess it feels a lot better than the house. Another situation that I thought
0:55:28of when you were talking about I had a job years ago where it was actually very difficult
0:55:33to have packages delivered to the building because the way the building was and the way
0:55:37security was, it was a real hit or miss situation.
0:55:41And oftentimes you would end up with something that was, you know, unable to deliver rescheduled
0:55:47or go pick it up at the depot or something.
0:55:49And that was frustrating.
0:55:51And something like this could have, you know, alleviated that because the parking lot wasn't
0:55:56necessarily all behind a security gate.
0:55:58So if I knew something was coming today, I could leave my car in the front parking lot
0:56:01outside of security and something could be delivered to it.
0:56:03I don't have to deal with the front desk and all that stuff.
0:56:06So there are reasons for it.
0:56:08And I do think it feels a lot better than the home, partially because there's a third
0:56:14party involved because they are requiring that step through OnStar.
0:56:19You're not giving Amazon a key to your car.
0:56:22You're giving Amazon the ability to speak to your car manufacturer system that you assumedly
0:56:30trust and they have that middle step there.
0:56:34That does feel better to me than having a lock with a code and a camera.
0:56:40At least now there's some other entity who's aware of what's happening and that's involved.
0:56:46To me it feels like it's another step of verification in a way.
0:56:51If I want to cancel it, I just tell OnStar, "Hey, I'm not doing this anymore."
0:56:55And so if you get any calls, don't let them do it.
0:56:56Whereas with the house, you have to change your lock because you're going to take the
0:56:59smart lock off or whatever.
0:57:00So I think, you know, I don't know if it's particularly useful to me in the way my life
0:57:04operates but I could see it being useful to people and I could see why you would do this
0:57:09instead of delivering to your house when no one's home.
0:57:12Alright, last thing today.
0:57:14Spotify.
0:57:15So we spoke a couple of weeks ago that Spotify was having an event this week and we were
0:57:22thinking that there was this rumored car speaker device that we thought was going to appear.
0:57:29That did not happen.
0:57:31So who knows what was going on with that.
0:57:33Maybe that's still something for the future.
0:57:35But Spotify did in basically the event was to talk about their business model and some
0:57:40changes that they're making to their free tier as a way to try and convince
0:57:44people to subscribe to their service for money. Let me tell you some of these
0:57:49features, Duman. So one of the things that they're adding to the free tier is
0:57:53access to 15 select playlists of which you can play any song you want in any
0:57:59order. Now that might sound a bit peculiar if you've never used Spotify
0:58:03free tier but previously you've been forced to shuffle playlists and artists
0:58:08And this is, you know, this is just a restriction that they're trying to put on you so it's frustrating, right?
0:58:14Because they want you to get the money, but now they're gonna do a free 15 playlists
0:58:19That you can choose and you can do whatever you want with but these playlists are create created and curated by Spotify
0:58:26It includes stuff like discover weekly and stuff like that
0:58:29Outside of this free 15, you're still gonna be forced to shuffle as you were before, right?
0:58:35so you can't go to like, I don't know, Counting Crows.
0:58:37I have no idea why they came into my head.
0:58:40I was trying to think of like a band Steven would like.
0:58:44And I don't think you like Counting Crows,
0:58:46but they just came to my head.
0:58:49I was going to say the Postal Service,
0:58:50but I was like, that's too sad.
0:58:51And then, you know what, I think I was trying to think
0:58:54of Defqab the QT, but say Counting Crows instead.
0:58:56- Yikes.
0:58:57- There's the curse sounds, it's the curse sounds.
0:58:59- Yeah, I mean they have that one song everybody likes,
0:59:01but past that, eh.
0:59:03- Mm-hmm.
0:59:04Anyway, but Counting Crows, maybe it's something to do with like parking lots or something
0:59:09because we were just talking about cars.
0:59:11Who knows why they popped into my head, but let's say you wanted to listen to Counting
0:59:14Crows, you're still going to have to have all that shuffled.
0:59:19You're now going to be asked in the sign up process what your favorite artists are.
0:59:26This is akin to like Beats Music and then Apple Music.
0:59:28Yeah the Bubbles.
0:59:29Yeah the Bubbles.
0:59:30I wonder if they're going to do Bubbles too.
0:59:33But this will allow Spotify to immediately tailor their experience to you.
0:59:36Right, so they'll show you artists more quickly that you're used to without
0:59:41having to wait for it to learn. They have a feature called
0:59:45"assisted play listing" which is machine learning to help you build new playlists.
0:59:50So when you're putting a playlist together
0:59:51it will suggest songs to you based upon what works with the previous song that
0:59:55you just added to that playlist. That's really cool. I think that's really
0:59:59awesome. I like that feature a lot as like this is a way for you to build a cool playlist,
1:00:05stuff that's going to work well together. I like the sound of that. And a data saving mode
1:00:10to reduce data for people on smaller data plans. So all of this sounds really good and I guess that
1:00:18what Spotify is trying to do is to show you how good the service can be if it's like completely
1:00:23unrestricted to you, especially with the playlist stuff. But do you think that this is going to make
1:00:28people that wanted the free tier pay for the paid tier like in big enough numbers for them
1:00:33to actually do this?
1:00:34Yeah, I don't know.
1:00:36You know my brother uses Spotify uses the free tier and having music shuffled that I
1:00:41can control would drive me bananas.
1:00:44I'm an album front to back kind of guy.
1:00:45So I get what you're saying.
1:00:48But this feels like they're just adding more carrot and not any more stick to people who
1:00:51want to they want to move up to a paid subscription.
1:00:55So I don't know if it'll work or not.
1:00:57Spotify is on the hook for making that transition happen more often though because now they
1:01:01have shareholders and they need, like we spoke about a couple times ago, they need to work
1:01:08on getting more people onto that paid service and I think you're right.
1:01:12The playlists are the best things about Spotify and if they can give you a tease of that then
1:01:18maybe that's enough carrot but I don't know if people will respond or not honestly.
1:01:23I agree like that the playlists are the thing right like that everybody that loves Spotify talks about discover weekly a lot
1:01:30Right, and I will say that Apple have those playlists
1:01:33But I don't know where it's getting some of this information from so like, you know, it has they have like your favorites mix, right?
1:01:40They consistently show me songs in my favorites mix that I know I only ever listened to twice
1:01:47Because it was songs from albums from the inquisitive series
1:01:52It's always got for me like a song from Pavement, which was Brad's band, which I don't like,
1:02:00or a song from the Sweeney Todd album. And it's like, I know that I've only ever listened
1:02:06to these like once or twice, like why are they in my favorites mix? And I guess maybe
1:02:10it's trying to like, make sure it pulls, like doesn't try and have too much of the same
1:02:17artist or whatever, but I think that there's something going weird in that algorithm where
1:02:22it's thinking that I want to listen to those. Because I can tell you, I don't, right? Like,
1:02:30I don't understand why it would show me that stuff. Like it's not giving me an impression
1:02:34like it's learning what it thinks it knows about me. Like I'm looking at it right now.
1:02:39And there's a lot of really good stuff in there. Some of my favorite songs, there's
1:02:42stuff that I do really enjoy, but yeah, there's another Pavement song. Like why is that in
1:02:47there like I don't like it and I've never listened to it more than once I
1:02:51listened to it one time because I really didn't like that album and like I just
1:02:55don't understand like where did that come from all like big girls don't cry
1:02:59by Frankie Valli in the Four Seasons I know I've not listened to that song in
1:03:03like four years like I don't understand where that's come from but all of the
1:03:11other stuff is pretty good happens really good machine learning right I
1:03:15- I guess so.
1:03:16- We'll see, I mean I wish them luck,
1:03:18because Spotify, like I said, they need to do this,
1:03:20and I think with Apple Music,
1:03:23it's still way behind Spotify in terms of subscriber count.
1:03:29It's native, and that's a big leg up,
1:03:32and Apple can run out the clock on Spotify, right?
1:03:34Like Apple has, for all intents and purposes,
1:03:37unlimited money, and Spotify, for all intents and purposes,
1:03:40does not, so they need to do this.
1:03:44I wish him luck because I think Spotify being good is good for Apple Music.
1:03:48I think people who use Spotify, the free service, even if they stay on free, this makes Spotify
1:03:54stickier and that's a good thing as well.
1:03:56If you want to find show notes this week, you can do so in your podcast player or you
1:04:01can head over to the website relay.fm/connected/190 is this week's episode, Today I Learned.
1:04:09You can get in touch with us while you're there.
1:04:11You can send us an email with your feedback and follow up.
1:04:14You can do that on Twitter as well.
1:04:17You can find Myke there as I-M-Y-K-E.
1:04:20And Myke is the host of a bunch of shows here on Relay.
1:04:22Go to relay.fm/shows.
1:04:25If you like connected, I promise you,
1:04:26you will find something else that you will love.
1:04:29Just as much, not more than connected,
1:04:31but the same amount, equal amounts of love.
1:04:33If you wanna find me on Twitter,
1:04:35you can do that as ismh and I write 512pixels.net.
1:04:39He's not here this week, but we're usually joined by Federico Vittucci.
1:04:43He is the editor-in-chief at MacStories.net.
1:04:45If you want to tell him how much you missed him this week, please do that.
1:04:49You can find him on Twitter @Vittucci.
1:04:54We'd like to thank Smile, Molecule, and Slack for sponsoring the show this week.
1:04:57Until next time, Myke, say goodbye.
1:05:00Adios.