0:00:00[Music]
0:00:06From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 159. Today's show is brought to you by Blue Apron,
0:00:13Hover and Encapsula. My name is Michael Hurley. Oh wow, why did I do that? I'm joined by Federico
0:00:19Vittucci and Steven Hackett. Hello everyone, we're very formal today. What did I do that for? Oh no,
0:00:26As you can tell, I'm a little bit sick and I'm afraid the cold has spread to my brain.
0:00:30So that's the end of me now.
0:00:33I have never done that.
0:00:34Why did I do that?
0:00:35That was so strange.
0:00:36Hello, my name is Michael David James Hurley.
0:00:38Welcome to the show.
0:00:40We have some follow-ups.
0:00:41Steven, please, please follow up because I've ducked myself now.
0:00:45Steven: Yeah, you really did.
0:00:46You used all your names.
0:00:48We spoke about my annual St. Jude fundraiser and thank you to the connected audience.
0:00:54We have, as of Monday, we reached our goal of $9,000.
0:00:59It's currently at $15,000 and change, which is super awesome.
0:01:02They met the challenge!
0:01:04Thank you.
0:01:05I challenged everyone and they did it and destroyed it because you had a goal of $9,000
0:01:10and it's at $15,000 now, which is unbelievable and it's the best clause ever and please give
0:01:16money if you haven't already.
0:01:18Please just do it because it's worth it.
0:01:20So great.
0:01:21So awesome.
0:01:22- Yes, so thank you, and I know lots of people
0:01:24have been linking to it on Twitter,
0:01:26and I saw some blog posts about it from lots of people,
0:01:28so thank you all for sharing,
0:01:30and it just means the world to me and my family,
0:01:33and lots of other St. Jude families.
0:01:35- Yep, couldn't be a better cause.
0:01:38- So we're going to jettison the rest of follow-up
0:01:42to next week.
0:01:43There's some very exciting Spotify follow-up
0:01:45that I'm not gonna tell you about yet,
0:01:46but it's really a scene in my house right now,
0:01:50my music situation.
0:01:52I've just gone back to cassette tapes, that's the--
0:01:54- Oh no, there's no spoilers.
0:01:56- Yeah, there's just tapes everywhere.
0:01:59We're gonna get into this Apple event,
0:02:01but really the Apple event wasn't yesterday,
0:02:04it really sort of started over the weekend.
0:02:08Because-- - Oh wow.
0:02:10- Because a couple of weeks ago we would have said,
0:02:14the HomePod firmware leak,
0:02:16probably the worst software leak Apple's ever had.
0:02:19Surely it won't happen again.
0:02:21I guess what happened guys, it happened again.
0:02:24- It happened again. - It was worse.
0:02:26- It was kind of worse and different.
0:02:27- Yeah, I think this was worse, right?
0:02:28I think this was definitely worse.
0:02:29- I think it was worse too.
0:02:31- Because the HomePod stuff,
0:02:33it really kind of mostly confirmed things
0:02:36we already thought we knew, right?
0:02:39- Yeah, and also it was a mistake.
0:02:41This one-- - Yeah,
0:02:43we're gonna get into that in a minute.
0:02:44We're gonna get into this mistake malicious meme
0:02:47that's going around right now.
0:02:50But this really kind of,
0:02:53it took away a lot of the little things, right?
0:02:57'Cause when the HomePod stuff's going around,
0:02:59wherever these leaks, people were just like,
0:03:00oh, you know, this is the broad strokes,
0:03:03but where Apple really excels is the little things.
0:03:06And this leak had all those little things in it.
0:03:09Stuff like Animoji, you know,
0:03:11like some of the portrait mode stuff.
0:03:13Like so many really interesting tiny details
0:03:16were shared in advance.
0:03:19and even stuff like the animation for registering face ID,
0:03:24the fact that there was gonna be an update to AirPods,
0:03:27the list goes on and on and on, right,
0:03:29of the little things that came out because of this leak.
0:03:32And from what can be discerned,
0:03:35I think initially it was presumed
0:03:36that this was a leak from a carrier, right?
0:03:39I think that was originally how it was reported,
0:03:41that it maybe slipped out during the testing process,
0:03:45but it later came to light that really,
0:03:48this was just someone shared a public URL,
0:03:51'cause the URL was public, to get the GM,
0:03:54which I assume is created to share with carriers
0:03:58and stuff like that, to share with people
0:03:59that need to do regulatory testing.
0:04:02Apple has a URL that they give to these companies,
0:04:04which is obscurity, what is it,
0:04:07like security through obscurity type deal?
0:04:09- Yeah, basically.
0:04:10They shared an entire list of links from,
0:04:15I assume from what I've heard, from an internal email,
0:04:19like they selected an entire paragraph of links
0:04:23and they just sent that around to a bunch of publications
0:04:27and then eventually on Reddit and other sites, yeah.
0:04:31- And I think it might have been for me personally,
0:04:35John Gruber, who I first saw mentioned to the fact
0:04:37that he was very aware that this was sent out
0:04:42by someone inside of Apple, not as a controlled leak,
0:04:46but as a, I want to spoil things or I wanna share,
0:04:50you know, like somebody was leaking this
0:04:52to spoil something, right?
0:04:54And so Federico, you mentioned mistake
0:04:57and what do you mean by that?
0:04:59Can you explain that?
0:05:01- For the HomePod, I do mean that it was like,
0:05:04it was not an accident because of the way that,
0:05:07the way that Apple handles these releasing OTA updates
0:05:12for internal employees only and the general public.
0:05:17My understanding is that the system
0:05:19that they used to have in place,
0:05:21I don't know if it's been changed since, I hope so,
0:05:24but the system that used to be in place months ago,
0:05:26it was really easy to make that kind of mistake.
0:05:28It was a very manual process.
0:05:30And someone who was in charge of pushing this OTA update
0:05:34for the HomePod to the employees
0:05:36that are currently testing the speaker,
0:05:38made a genuine mistake and basically dropped the wrong,
0:05:42the file in the wrong folder.
0:05:44And the fact that that was even possible,
0:05:47it wasn't meant to be a malicious act.
0:05:49It just, you're dealing with drag and drop
0:05:52and you're dealing with two folders,
0:05:53it's easy to make that kind of mistake.
0:05:55But the system shouldn't be structured like that
0:05:57in the first place.
0:05:58So from what I know, that was a mistake.
0:06:01This one, it was done on purpose.
0:06:03I don't know with,
0:06:05I mean, I guess if you're sharing the GM before the release,
0:06:10and especially the GM seed of the iPhone 10,
0:06:13you know that there's gonna be stuff in there
0:06:15and you know that people are gonna be able
0:06:16to decrypt the firmware and to look inside
0:06:21and see stuff like an emoji.
0:06:22So to say that that person didn't know the extent
0:06:26of his actions or her actions, I don't believe that.
0:06:31I don't think that's the case.
0:06:34They knew perfectly that leaking the GM a few days ahead of the event would cause damage to Apple.
0:06:41All the reporting around it was really interesting for a couple of days, right?
0:06:45There seemed to be a lot of discussion about like whether 9to5 should have reported on it, etc, etc.
0:06:52My personal feeling on it is it is a shame that this stuff came out, but 9to5 should have reported on it.
0:06:58If you get some really interesting juicy details, would you not share?
0:07:03So Federico, somebody gave this to you.
0:07:05You got this GM.
0:07:07Would you do anything with it?
0:07:09I mean, you don't have to say like,
0:07:10we do go to the whole extent that they did
0:07:12ripping it to shreds, but.
0:07:14- No, I mean, you know me and you know I wouldn't do that
0:07:18because I've had much better material in the past.
0:07:21And I've, you know, I've sat on it with my mouth shut,
0:07:26not because I don't think it should be reported on
0:07:29because I do believe 95 mecha make rumors
0:07:32and they're doing their job.
0:07:33And it's their business model to report this.
0:07:37And especially after the links were on Reddit, were public,
0:07:41thousands of people had the GM installed
0:07:43before Apple stopped signing the file.
0:07:46So they were just doing their jobs.
0:07:49Personally, I don't like doing that
0:07:52because it's not the way that I see Max
0:07:52because it's not the way that I see max stories,
0:07:55it's not what I do,
0:07:56and I wouldn't be able to sleep comfortably at night
0:08:00knowing that I'm upsetting other people,
0:08:04even if it would be a considerable gain for my website,
0:08:08I mean, at least in terms of traffic.
0:08:10But I had stuff in the past and I didn't share it,
0:08:14but I also believe it's totally,
0:08:1995 Mic and MicRumors are just doing their jobs
0:08:21and if they were not reporting on that first,
0:08:24somebody else would have.
0:08:25- So I don't think they did anything wrong
0:08:28in reporting this information.
0:08:30I mean, because the idea of spoilers
0:08:33is an interesting thing for me.
0:08:35Like a spoiler's a thing for a company event
0:08:38where they're introducing new products.
0:08:40Like, this is something that I've been really bouncing around
0:08:44in my head a lot over the last week or two.
0:08:47Spoilers, spoilers is a thing, right?
0:08:50For an Apple event.
0:08:51seems kind of strange in the abstract term because like, spoilers, this is a term that we use for
0:08:59works of entertainment, fictional things, and obviously we see Apple's presentations as a
0:09:07work of entertainment, right? It's why we watch the two-hour keynote presentation or whatever,
0:09:12but it's like this, it's really weird that like there is this entire industry built around
0:09:20reporting on rumors that we all pay attention to but then there is a certain
0:09:26line that could be crossed where people start talking about spoilers like it I
0:09:30think that these leaks this past weekend it's been really interesting and I can't
0:09:35in my mind sum up exactly why this one was considered to be so bad I think it
0:09:43was a combination of the fact that it was the second time and so a lot of
0:09:49people thought that we had the immune system to this kind of leak because of the HomePod
0:09:55and instead this was worse. So it's like, imagine if you get a bad disease and you do
0:10:02a vaccine and then a few months later you get the same disease again, only it's worse.
0:10:08And apply that in terms of spoilers, you know? And we thought, you know, we have, you know,
0:10:14that there was a leak months ago, it's fine and now we're gonna be surprised. And then
0:10:18just a few days before it hit hard again with even more details.
0:10:22I guess it was the proximity, right? The proximity to the event was the problem.
0:10:27Yes.
0:10:28Because it was, you know, everybody thinks once you get to like Saturday before the keynote,
0:10:33you're probably good now, right? Like you've probably got everything you're gonna get.
0:10:39But then it was just like, for the entire weekend, more and more and more information
0:10:45as Steve Trout and Smith and Guillermo Rambo were looking through all of this stuff and
0:10:51pulling out more and more and more things.
0:10:54Again like I think it's totally fine that they do that stuff because look if you don't
0:10:59want to see it don't follow them on Twitter because you know you're just gonna you're
0:11:03gonna get it right because this is what they do.
0:11:06The problem is though that now whatever they find is reported more widely and if you follow
0:11:12anyone in technology or anything in technology you are gonna find out about
0:11:16what happens in these things because it's it's such big news you know like
0:11:23even the people who are talking about the fact that it's terrible still linked
0:11:26to it yeah I got a lot of replies after I got in a kind of argument about
0:11:34about whether an Apple event constitutes a spoiler-worthy event comparable to Star Wars,
0:11:43for example. Some people obviously believe that an Apple event is comparable to going
0:11:48to the cinema to watch a movie and someone walks out and tells you who dies at the end.
0:11:54Other people say, "Well, it's just a big commercial for a company." I think I sit somewhere in
0:12:00the middle and I think I tweeted this. Of course there are spoilers about an
0:12:05Apple event and it's nicer to be surprised. I think it would have been, you
0:12:11know, we would have been in a different mood hadn't we known anything about the
0:12:17iPhone X. Like the design. Imagine if the design with the ears was completely new
0:12:22yesterday. We would have gone crazy. Instead we got a... we were already used to
0:12:27it. But I also think that any Apple event is more about how Apple presents a story and presents the
0:12:34features and I think it was still a good show from that perspective. There's sort of a strange
0:12:39phenomenon right, Phil Schuler's on stage and he is introducing things and then people are clapping
0:12:45which is like a side topic which I find super weird in press events. I know they have Apple
0:12:49employees there. In my mind I just hope it's all Apple employees and not people in the press
0:12:53applauding but please clap please clap poor Jeb sad he so he announces his
0:13:01stuff and he's rolling it out and like everyone in the room knows it's coming
0:13:04but he still announces it like there was no nod it's like when the iPhone 4 was
0:13:09left in a bar and gizmodo picked it up and took it apart your job said on stage
0:13:16you know you've seen this before but you you ain't really seen it and and Apple
0:13:20made jokes like that in the past of you stop stop us if you've heard this before
0:13:24there was none of that yesterday and in in my mind I think it's because the
0:13:28leaks were so serious and like so deep like we knew almost everything that
0:13:35Apple just had just chose for whatever reason just to not address it whatsoever
0:13:41and that that was sort of strange or like it's sort of like there's this big
0:13:44elephant in the room and like you can kind of joke about it when you know one
0:13:48gets left in a bar but when an employee leaks a bunch of firmware to the press
0:13:52maybe it's awkward to joke about. It's a very strange dynamic I think played out
0:13:57on stage. Yeah I think it was the right move right because acknowledging it you
0:14:02know it depends what people are doing it for. Acknowledging it in a way encourages it
0:14:08right? Yeah because it makes people famous. Yeah if the two-year-old is bad
0:14:11like like sometimes all the two-year-old wants is attention and if he's throwing
0:14:16a tantrum to get attention, like that you need to be careful
0:14:18about how you approach that situation so you don't
0:14:21encourage that bad behavior.
0:14:23And I think that, I'm not calling whoever does this
0:14:25a two year old, but I think there's some parallels
0:14:28that if Apple, like Apple doing nothing about this
0:14:32publicly is more of a voice of damnation than if they
0:14:36got on stage and said yes, we had a leak and we're working
0:14:39to find who it is, because then you embolden people
0:14:41who are tempted to do it.
0:14:43I think, you know, where we are,
0:14:46we were doing what you were saying Federico,
0:14:48where we are today in 2017,
0:14:51like you can't go into these events
0:14:54without knowing anything anymore
0:14:56and it's been that way for such a long time
0:14:58and clearly it appears that Apple's attempts
0:15:02to increase secrecy are upsetting some of their employees.
0:15:06That's what I think has done this personally.
0:15:09You know, like we heard that big report about the secrecy.
0:15:12I can imagine many people inside of a company being really upset about being put through
0:15:17that and lashing out, because it is kind of a very strange thing, right, to be sat down
0:15:22in a room and to be told off by some security officers and being told what to do. And I
0:15:27expect that there are people that are lashing out against that, which is why we're getting
0:15:31some really weird and involved and deep leaks from inside of Apple.
0:15:36Well I mean, you're right, and I would also add to that, that in the current political
0:15:42climate in the US, I wouldn't be surprised if there's some kind of personal revenge against
0:15:48you know the direction that for example management and especially Tim Cook and you know is going for
0:15:53with totally in regards to to Apple and you know their views yeah. So there's you know there are
0:15:59more maybe more reasons than ever before for people to get things out and honestly like this
0:16:05is going to be a cat and mouse game every time Apple plugs a hole there will be another one.
0:16:11right, this is just how it's gonna be because at the end of the day people
0:16:15could just talk to people, right, like it doesn't, the firmware stuff is more
0:16:19revealing because people, you know, can find things themselves and show evidence
0:16:23but people couldn't always talk. So my feeling on this is it is a shame that we
0:16:28found out so much information but when I see it I appreciate it for what it is as
0:16:32exciting news and just wait for the event as normal. It's like what am I
0:16:37gonna do about it? Like I'm not gonna avoid it because do you know what last
0:16:40weekend was really exciting and super weird and fun to watch in its own way. So my feeling
0:16:47on it is just like appreciate it for what it is and move ahead. Do you know what I mean?
0:16:53Like last weekend was crazy and I had so much fun chatting with you guys and reading Twitter
0:16:58about all the stuff that was happening because it was like "Whoa, what is going on?" And
0:17:03I still watched the event and I still had a great time watching the event and I was
0:17:07still like gasping and laughing my butt off and stuff like I feel like where we
0:17:12are in 2017 one like these things come together now like you got to take one
0:17:17and you got to take the other yeah yeah but don't don't leak anything to
0:17:23Federico because he ain't never gonna do nothing with it right Federico well I'm
0:17:28gonna keep it to myself yeah you can yourself you know that that's the way to
0:17:31do it you know just know the knowledge know that I'm a I'm just saying I'm a
0:17:36a good receiver of the leaks. You're like a vault, right? It just goes in and you lock
0:17:40it in the vault and it stays there. Yeah, that's exactly it.
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0:19:32support of this show iOS stories I still on that one I think so where does that
0:19:38go now iOS stories calm that's where does it go nowhere maybe I have dotnet I
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0:19:55One day I'll put it where it needs to go if I remember.
0:19:59Alright, should we talk about the event, Steven?
0:20:02Over to you.
0:20:03Yes, let's talk about the event.
0:20:06We like to start with meta comments, that's where we're going to go first.
0:20:11First time on Apple Park, first time in the Steve Jobs Theater, the event opens with a
0:20:17really nice video of the park and the theater and all these wonderful glass buildings.
0:20:23I will insert a comment here that if you have not listened to,
0:20:27or don't normally listen to, Upgrade with Jason and Myke,
0:20:29you definitely should, 'cause Jason was there
0:20:31and talks a lot about just the process of being on campus
0:20:34and how the theater was.
0:20:35I find all this stuff endlessly interesting.
0:20:37- We're gonna go to next year, right?
0:20:39We're gonna take a trip, right?
0:20:40- Take a field trip. - During WWDC?
0:20:42- Absolutely.
0:20:43It seems like it went off without a hitch.
0:20:46There's no reports in press of people being locked
0:20:49in bathrooms or the power not working in their chairs.
0:20:52It seems like everything worked.
0:20:53So that's good.
0:20:54- Maybe they're still locked away, right?
0:20:56- Maybe, yeah.
0:20:58I did see press posting pictures of the bathrooms,
0:21:00which I have just--
0:21:01- There were no handles on the doors,
0:21:03which people were complaining about.
0:21:04But like, I don't, you know,
0:21:06if you can't find a handle for a door, push the door.
0:21:09I mean, I don't really know how difficult that is, but.
0:21:12- Put your back into it, come on.
0:21:13- Yeah, use some elbow grease.
0:21:16- Yeah.
0:21:17Use your giant iPhone Plus to leverage it open.
0:21:20- Just smash it open.
0:21:22It's good.
0:21:23That's what Johnny Ive wants.
0:21:25The event opens, of course,
0:21:27it's the first time at Steve Jobs Theater.
0:21:28It opened with what I thought was just a really
0:21:31heartwarming dedication of the theater to Steve Jobs.
0:21:37- It hit me, man.
0:21:38- Yeah, so it opens, if you haven't watched the video,
0:21:41you should definitely watch it.
0:21:42There's, it just says Steve Jobs Theater on the screen,
0:21:46and there is a voiceover from Steve
0:21:48talking about the passion he has for making things
0:21:51and infusing that passion into Apple.
0:21:53And as long as Apple keeps that first, Apple will be okay.
0:21:56It was actually very sobering
0:22:00because the theater was dark, it's just the white text.
0:22:03You don't see any pictures of Steve during this time.
0:22:05- Do you know where that came from?
0:22:07- You know, I tried finding it.
0:22:10So it sounds, it doesn't sound like it's recorded
0:22:13at the very end of his life.
0:22:15I don't really know where it's from
0:22:16and I couldn't really find it.
0:22:18The audio quality to me sounded like an older clip.
0:22:23It wasn't something, maybe it was maybe recorded, I don't know, like 20 years ago or something.
0:22:28You know what I mean?
0:22:29Like it doesn't sound like it was super new.
0:22:33As new as it could have been anyway.
0:22:35So if you, listener, if you know, if that's from a speech or something I would really
0:22:38like to know, so let us know.
0:22:42Tim comes out, one of his first lines is, and this felt super, super genuine from him,
0:22:48was "I miss hearing his voice."
0:22:53And I get it, right?
0:22:55Like even part of my brain now is like, "He's a CEO of a company, you've never met him."
0:22:58But like, a lot of us looked up to Steve and still have feelings about him and his work,
0:23:05and as much as the three of us feel that way, if it's cheesy or not, it's kind of not my
0:23:10point.
0:23:11Cook and these guys, like all these executive team, they work with him for decades. I can't,
0:23:16I still imagine it's very raw for them moving into a campus that was Steve's last work,
0:23:21running a company that is Steve's biggest product. And it just, it was really nice.
0:23:27Steve's widow was there. And I think in the front row, like it was just a very, like,
0:23:33very nice, like Apple family moment. I had some pictures of Steve talking about his life, talking
0:23:39about how Apple Park was his vision for the future of the company and he wanted developers
0:23:46and designers to work together.
0:23:48Steve Jobs came up with the open floor plan, I guess we can blame him.
0:23:51But all of this really nice stuff.
0:23:54We're not going to see this every time.
0:23:55This is a, you have to dedicate the theater to who you named it after.
0:24:00And I think it was just, it was an incredible way to open it.
0:24:03And even the transition was, you know, Steve love days like this where we get to announce
0:24:07new products and we have a bunch of new products.
0:24:10They even handled that transition out of it,
0:24:11I think, really gracefully.
0:24:14- Yeah, it was good.
0:24:14It was really good.
0:24:15- Yeah, it was.
0:24:16It was really nice.
0:24:17Not everything was awesome.
0:24:18So there's a link.
0:24:19We have a link in the show notes to an article on The Verge.
0:24:21They were keeping tally, as I think a lot of us were.
0:24:24The gender ratio this time was pretty bad.
0:24:28We talk about this after every event.
0:24:31Apple seems to do better at WWDC
0:24:33because there's more opportunity for more people on stage
0:24:36events like this but it was basically all white dudes this time. Angela had
0:24:44a section at the beginning talking about retail but after that
0:24:49it was just dudes. Yeah it's a shame they had a couple of like cameo
0:24:55moments like Deidre on the paddle board. It was like the best, that was one of the best
0:25:01demos apples dine since since Phil Schiller jumped out of a window but yeah
0:25:07it wasn't good it wasn't good and I feel like they do some of that stuff to like
0:25:11attempt to try and balance it out but that for me only points out the fact
0:25:15that they're not doing a good job in general you know what I mean like I feel
0:25:21like sometimes they're trying to compensate but by doing that they only
0:25:24serve to continue to highlight the fact that one all of their executives are men
0:25:30and two, that they only have those executives
0:25:34come out on stage to demo the product.
0:25:36Like it's peculiar.
0:25:38Like does EdiQ like really need to come out
0:25:41to demo Apple TV?
0:25:42Like does he need to do that?
0:25:44- No.
0:25:45- I don't know if it actually has to be him.
0:25:47So yeah, this is something that I own,
0:25:51I mean all of us only hope we'll get better,
0:25:54but it's still a shame that we have to talk
0:25:56about this all the time.
0:25:58- Yeah, and it's a shame that it's predictable,
0:26:01like going into this, that the fall events,
0:26:04because they're smaller, and Apple,
0:26:07I mean, I get it, like,
0:26:07Phil Shiller's gonna be on stage to talk about that,
0:26:09I don't have a problem with that,
0:26:11but if you have opportunities for other players to come in,
0:26:14you should take that, and like you said,
0:26:15like, Eddy Cue's the perfect example,
0:26:17like, Eddy's who he is, and you know,
0:26:20he did a good job this time,
0:26:22but is there someone on the Apple TV team who,
0:26:27you know, A, has more ownership over the product
0:26:29than he does, right?
0:26:30Because Apple doesn't just pick somebody
0:26:33because of their gender or race to put them on stage.
0:26:35It's somebody who is over that product
0:26:38or who is involved in it, right?
0:26:39They just don't randomly pick to meet a number.
0:26:41And that's important to them.
0:26:42Like, was there somebody there?
0:26:44Is there somebody on that leadership team
0:26:45that could do that?
0:26:46I don't know, but I hope that they do better than this.
0:26:52This is not a stroke in the win column for me.
0:26:56- Mm-hmm.
0:26:57- So what else?
0:27:00Big Apple retail section.
0:27:03I don't think there's anything particularly new in there.
0:27:05They talked about how they're calling
0:27:06their fancy stores town halls,
0:27:07which is like my eyes rolled so hard
0:27:09they fell out the back of my head.
0:27:10- T.G., you going to Milan to watch a movie?
0:27:12- I'm going to the Milan town square for movie night.
0:27:16Instead of watching a movie at my house,
0:27:18I'm gonna go to the Apple town square.
0:27:21I think it's, I mean, the stores
0:27:25and the locations look fantastic.
0:27:26And I'm pretty sure that the one in Piazza Liberty
0:27:28in Milan will be amazing.
0:27:30- I'm sure. - There's just a tone of like,
0:27:33I don't know, pretentiousness maybe.
0:27:36- Yeah, luxury, man.
0:27:37It's luxury.
0:27:38It's what it is.
0:27:39- It's like, yes, it's a very,
0:27:41I mean, the Apple stores are amazing,
0:27:43but like, it's a store.
0:27:45- Yeah.
0:27:46- Like people, they have this idea
0:27:49of the people like to hang out at the Apple store
0:27:52And maybe there's some element of that
0:27:57when you consider the cultural events
0:27:59with like today at Apple and that kind of stuff.
0:28:02But in practice, people go to the Apple Store
0:28:04when their iPhone screen is broken
0:28:06and when they need to buy a new lightning cable
0:28:09and stuff like that.
0:28:11I don't see that beautiful image of
0:28:15couples sharing a day at the Apple Town Square
0:28:19and children smiling and running around
0:28:22as the genius grove is, you know, filling up with people.
0:28:26I just don't see that.
0:28:27It's not a park, it's an Apple store.
0:28:29Like they're making this more romantic than it should be.
0:28:33That's all I'm saying.
0:28:34- It's like they can embrace the fact
0:28:36that people do go there
0:28:38and they just wanna look around and stuff like that.
0:28:40But it's like, you know.
0:28:42- If I want to spend quality time with my girlfriend,
0:28:45I'm not going to the Apple store.
0:28:47- Like make the nice stores.
0:28:48Like yeah, make the nice stores because they're amazing.
0:28:51but just understand what they are.
0:28:55They're not community spaces, right?
0:28:58They're not.
0:28:59They're still stores.
0:29:00Even if you have events,
0:29:02it's just a store that has events in it, right?
0:29:05Like if they actually build something
0:29:07that you cannot buy anything in, then fine, right?
0:29:10Which is not unheard of, like not unheard of,
0:29:14but it's not like a thing you could never imagine, right?
0:29:17'Cause it could just be like a big marketing thing.
0:29:19But if you can buy something in there, it's a store.
0:29:23Right?
0:29:24You know.
0:29:25Wait, come on guys, come on.
0:29:27- So what you're saying is I should cancel my family trip
0:29:30to my Apple Town Hall.
0:29:32- Yeah, you should, I'm sorry.
0:29:34I'm really sorry.
0:29:35- Yeah, imagine that.
0:29:36For example, for my birthday, instead of organizing,
0:29:39I don't know, a dinner at a fancy restaurant at the beach,
0:29:42I'm just gonna say to my friends,
0:29:43hey guys, my birthday party is gonna be
0:29:46at the Apple Town Square.
0:29:47- I'll meet you at Apple, right?
0:29:49- Isn't that the line we're supposed to say?
0:29:50I'll meet you at Apple.
0:29:52- I'll meet you at Apple.
0:29:54I mean, so you can buy me my birthday gift directly.
0:29:57- Yeah, that's what we're gonna do for Myke's bachelor party
0:29:59to scrap what else we're working on.
0:30:01We're just gonna go to--
0:30:02- Go to the Apple.
0:30:04- Go to the Apple.
0:30:06- Go to Apple Town Square, somewhere in America.
0:30:09- See you at Apple, everybody.
0:30:11- Yeah. - Okay, it's gonna be great.
0:30:13I was a little surprised by the retail section.
0:30:16We haven't seen one in a while,
0:30:17and I figured there's a lot of stuff to talk about
0:30:21in this event, 'cause I don't think there's gonna be
0:30:23a second fall event.
0:30:24I started to doubt myself once we were into retail.
0:30:27I was like, oh, are they pushing this
0:30:28so they can push something else to October?
0:30:30I don't think that's the case.
0:30:31I still think we're only seeing one event.
0:30:33Maybe they just wanna talk about their new stores,
0:30:35but it's good to see.
0:30:37I think it was an informative section,
0:30:40but just a little unexpected and such a busy morning.
0:30:44- Talking about busy.
0:30:46There were three iPhones.
0:30:47Yes.
0:30:48Crazy.
0:30:49Should we talk about the 8s quickly?
0:30:50I mean, really, it's just quickly, right?
0:30:51Yeah, why not?
0:30:52No one cares about the 8s.
0:30:54We should talk about them though, come on.
0:30:55We can't not talk about them.
0:30:56And I'm mocking the 8 a little bit.
0:31:01I think if you are a consumer, if you're this person, you're probably not listening to this
0:31:07show, but if you upgrade your phone every two or three years, the 8 or 8 Plus is going
0:31:12to be awesome.
0:31:13of friends you know I'm sure y'all are like this on iPhone day everyone in your
0:31:16life text you to be like what should I buy like I went to a thing last night
0:31:21with like five or six friends and they were all like this is what we talked
0:31:24about the first 20 minutes as a new iPhones but the I think if you know if
0:31:29you're that sort of user like I've got friends who have you know an iPhone 6 or
0:31:32a 6s they're gonna go to an 8 and it's gonna be an awesome upgrade and they
0:31:36don't want to spend the money for the 10 which is totally understandable so the
0:31:39The 8 is an important phone.
0:31:41I think it is overshadowed in the enthusiast circle,
0:31:44but we have to remember that we're like the king
0:31:46of the enthusiast circle.
0:31:47Like, of course we're all doing the 10.
0:31:50But for a lot of consumers, the 10 is just like
0:31:52a crazy thing Apple did at the top of the line,
0:31:54like the gold Apple Watch was.
0:31:56- 'Cause it's so expensive. - And the 8
0:31:56implies what's new. - It's silly.
0:31:57It's so silly silly.
0:31:59- Yeah, exactly. - It's silly silly.
0:32:00- That's what basically everyone last night said.
0:32:02And then, you know, I'm sure they were all judging me
0:32:04because they know I'm gonna buy it, but.
0:32:06- Yeah, but also like-- - I think they're great
0:32:07at this. - I do need to say,
0:32:09like the jet black plus silly, silly expensive.
0:32:12Right, they're silly expensive, these phones.
0:32:14The plus phones were very expensive,
0:32:16the 10 is very expensive.
0:32:18I just wanna say something super quick.
0:32:19Maybe someone can help diagnose this for me.
0:32:21But I think Apple's product pages give me motion sickness.
0:32:25The scrolling, I get so uncomfortable
0:32:29with the scrolling on these pages, like the iPhone pages.
0:32:33- I hate that where they hijack your scroll.
0:32:35- It makes me feel ill.
0:32:37And I don't know what it is.
0:32:38I don't have motion sickness.
0:32:39I've never had motion sickness before.
0:32:41- So you feel how I feel when I look at the--
0:32:44- I think the ProMotion.
0:32:46- iPads, I can't handle ProMotion.
0:32:48- I feel physically uncomfortable scrolling these pages.
0:32:50- That's 'cause you know how much money you're gonna spend.
0:32:52- But I'm looking at the iPhone 8 right now.
0:32:54I really don't like it.
0:32:56Like I'm scrolling, I have to like look away when I scroll.
0:32:59- There's a lot of moving elements.
0:33:00It's not just like the initial animation.
0:33:04It's like as you scroll,
0:33:06every single section has some moving parts.
0:33:08- Yeah, and also it doesn't--
0:33:09- And they move in different directions.
0:33:10- It doesn't scroll as smoothly as I think it should,
0:33:13and I think that might be part of it as well.
0:33:15- Yeah. - Yeah.
0:33:16- Like it's a bit jittery
0:33:17because it's such a heavy webpage, I expect.
0:33:20- Yeah.
0:33:21- They're very beautiful, but they make me sick.
0:33:22I tried it in Safari too on my iPad
0:33:25and I had the exact same problem,
0:33:26because I figured, oh,
0:33:27maybe Chrome isn't rendering this correctly,
0:33:30because that has happened in the past,
0:33:31but it doesn't seem to be the case.
0:33:33But anyway, the 8 is a really good looking phone.
0:33:39I like the glass, I like the return of the glass.
0:33:43I do really like the new gold colour which seems to be a mix between rose gold and gold.
0:33:48It seems to be something in between those.
0:33:50I was watching some hands on videos this morning, it seems very subtle.
0:33:55I like it.
0:33:57I think the video watch called it a sandblasted look almost.
0:34:00was colorful and they stripped the color back somehow. It looks
0:34:04really nice in the renders but very subtle I think in person. It almost looks
0:34:08like there's some yeah there is like some kind of color on the back of it
0:34:12which is not white and you know it looks really nice it's like this goldy color
0:34:17and then the aluminium is like a gold color and the phone itself it's it's
0:34:21good right like it's got the wireless charging in it which I wouldn't have
0:34:24expected it's you know it's got all the features that we expect it's got a these
0:34:29- These new portrait mode features, right?
0:34:31This lighting stuff, is this just for the new phones?
0:34:34- Hold on a second.
0:34:35- All right.
0:34:36- It's also got the standard power adapter,
0:34:39which is a shame that Apple is still
0:34:42putting this one in the box.
0:34:43Of course it's got the ear pods,
0:34:45it doesn't have the ear pods.
0:34:46It's gonna be a long time, I think,
0:34:47before we get the ear pods in the box.
0:34:49And it's got the lightning jack to,
0:34:52lightning to headphone jack adapter.
0:34:54So that's still a thing.
0:34:56- Yeah, that comes in the box with the X.
0:34:58Oh, the X, here we go.
0:34:59- With the 10 too. - Oh no.
0:35:01- It comes in the box, we'll get to that.
0:35:02It comes in the box with the 10 or adapter thing,
0:35:05which I'm really surprised they put it in there.
0:35:08- I'm just really annoyed that these phones
0:35:10support fast charging and then Apple is still upsetting you
0:35:13on the USB-C charger, which should be the correct one
0:35:17to give to people.
0:35:18But anyway. - Yeah, it does.
0:35:19What's the fast charging when it does what,
0:35:21like 50% in 30 minutes or something?
0:35:24- 50% in 30 minutes thanks to USB-C power delivery,
0:35:27which is obviously has been built into the lightning controller, so now you can take advantage of any USB-C brick that has power delivery built in
0:35:35and you can fast charge your iPhone just like you can do roughly the same with the iPad Pro and USB-C
0:35:40I will say that that's nowhere near what Android phones can do, like with the USB-C stuff they charge so much faster than that
0:35:47so maybe that's why they're not heavily promoting it yet because it's not really fast charging
0:35:52it's faster charging
0:35:54it's faster
0:35:55I was asking about the portrait mode, right?
0:35:57So you get it on the iPhone 8 Plus also.
0:36:00But you don't get it on the 7 Plus, right?
0:36:03They're not adding these things to the 7 Plus.
0:36:05Even though they seem to just be software, right?
0:36:08This seems to be a software feature for that phone.
0:36:10But I think it's in the sensors that they're using for the new dual cameras.
0:36:15Okay.
0:36:16So I think that's the reason.
0:36:19I mean, it wouldn't be the first time that Apple is artificially...
0:36:22I don't think it's a problem.
0:36:23I don't think it's a problem.
0:36:25limiting a feature even if older hardware would be perfectly capable.
0:36:28You gotta sell your product, right? Like you've got to do that and sometimes it's
0:36:32the combo of software and hardware that you sell. No, but I mean it gets
0:36:35especially obvious when stuff like the first-gen 12.9-inch iPad Pro, if you just
0:36:41change a couple of lines in the iOS 11 firmware, you can use three apps at once,
0:36:45but Apple is artificially limiting the feature so that it only works on the
0:36:49second-gen 12.9-inch iPad Pro. But I think in this case for the portrait lining
0:36:54effects. I think it's down to the sensors in the camera. It's not just like
0:36:58marketing making a decision that no this feature must be on the on the new phone.
0:37:03I think it's actually in the sensor. So so we can move on to the X. I think my
0:37:08feeling on this is... I got one more thing on the 8 and 8 Plus. I think it's great that Apple is using the same
0:37:15system on a chip in all these phones. That like if if the X didn't exist the
0:37:23the 8 and 8 Plus is still a huge upgrade in performance
0:37:26over the 7 and 7 Plus.
0:37:28I was hoping for this, but I was a little nervous, right,
0:37:33that this would get, say, the A11,
0:37:37and then the high-end phone will get
0:37:40the X version of it, right,
0:37:41it's like a faster GPU or something.
0:37:44But the silicone is the same in all of these phones,
0:37:47and that means they're gonna age better,
0:37:50they're going to age more appropriately
0:37:51for a high-end phone.
0:37:53This is, if it weren't for the X,
0:37:55this would be the flagship,
0:37:56and it has all the power we expect
0:37:58in a flagship upgrade year over year.
0:38:00And that was encouraging to me,
0:38:02that Apple is taking this phone seriously.
0:38:04- Yeah, I would say that if you have upgraded,
0:38:09like any time during this iPhone 6 body generation
0:38:13of phones that we've had,
0:38:16you will be as happy upgrading to this phone
0:38:19probably as you've been upgrading to any others, because--
0:38:21- I think so.
0:38:22- It is a similar kind of bump that we've had
0:38:25over the last couple of years, right?
0:38:26It looks the same, the cameras are better,
0:38:28and it has some other cool features.
0:38:31You know, you get wireless charging,
0:38:32everything's faster, right?
0:38:33Like it feels like that. - True tone.
0:38:35- True tone?
0:38:36Actually, like the seven to the eight feels better
0:38:39than the 6S to the seven.
0:38:42- Yeah. - For sure, if you're right.
0:38:44- I think this is quite possibly for this design,
0:38:48like this iPhone 6 era design,
0:38:50this is as good as it gets.
0:38:52- Right, so yeah, this is it.
0:38:53This is the ultimate design of that.
0:38:55This is how good that is gonna get, right?
0:38:57Like that is as good as it will get.
0:39:00I think that they have managed that.
0:39:01I think adding glass back into that phone
0:39:04is gonna make it look really fancy again,
0:39:06you know, like in a new way.
0:39:07But let's talk about the 10.
0:39:10All right, just super quick.
0:39:11I keep saying X in my head.
0:39:13I can't help it. - Yeah, me too.
0:39:14- I can't help it, 'cause it says it right there, right?
0:39:17Like it says X, so I just keep saying X,
0:39:21because honestly, like personally, just I prefer X.
0:39:25I think it's cool in a weird way.
0:39:28I get why they've done 10, I get it,
0:39:32but I do personally wish that they called it X,
0:39:35and I will accidentally call this the iPhone X
0:39:39in a way that I never called it Mac OS X.
0:39:43- Yeah, totally the same problem, yes.
0:39:47I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do it all the time.
0:39:49- I was having a conversation with Steven Transmith
0:39:54yesterday over iMessage and he was telling me,
0:39:58look, they're gonna call it the iPhone 10
0:39:59because it's tomorrow's iPhone today.
0:40:01And I was like, sure, sure, it's a beautiful idea
0:40:03but iPhone X just sounds cool
0:40:05and they cannot possibly do the iPhone 8
0:40:07and the iPhone 10 in the same year.
0:40:09And I was so certain they were not gonna do the 10.
0:40:13And I was so surprised when they actually said
0:40:16I literally couldn't believe it that they actually went there.
0:40:21I was so sold on the idea, oh, they're going to do the iPhone X.
0:40:24So it sounds futuristic, it sounds cool, and it's a chance for them to reset the numbering.
0:40:29So next year, they're going to do iPhone X2 and iPhone X3 and iPhone X4, you know?
0:40:34And they just went in the opposite direction.
0:40:38They already solved this. This is a solved problem.
0:40:41problem it's gonna be 10.1 no then 10.2 Jaguar and 10.3 Panther. Let's bring the
0:40:52big cat names back. Time is a flat circle. It really is. If I was gonna make a super
0:40:57early prediction that I shouldn't make oh no I think that next year we get 9
0:41:01and 11 and then 12 they have two models I don't think there's gonna be a plus
0:41:08version next year I think they're gonna make an iPhone 9. I don't think that
0:41:15can I don't think that between now and then they're gonna be able to make a
0:41:18bigger phone in this form factor I just don't think it's gonna happen so they're
0:41:24not just gonna have one phone for sale which costs $1,000 I think that they'll
0:41:28make another version of the current design and then they'll make another one
0:41:33of this new 10 design but it will be the iPhone 11 and then there will be an
0:41:37iPhone 9. I just as we stand here today I don't believe that they will be able to
0:41:43make what is essentially the plus version of this phone within a year. I
0:41:46don't think they're gonna be able to do it because they seem to have struggled
0:41:50to put this one out right like it seems like it's gonna be constrained it seems
0:41:55like it was difficult for them to make right like it if you if you are to
0:41:59believe anything that you are to believe then that would be the case because I
0:42:02can tell you there is no way Apple wanted this phone to ship in November
0:42:05like why would they want to do that? They want it to ship now. Why would you do that?
0:42:11Why would you want it in November? You want to have it immediately for everyone, right?
0:42:15That's the whole point of doing the event. Like you have it available for pre-ordering
0:42:20in a week and you sell it the week after that. But they're not doing that. I really think
0:42:24that we're going to see a nine next year and I think personally, I think that's probably
0:42:31why they went with calling it 10 and nothing else because it's in the line but it's in
0:42:36the future and they're still going to backfill up until this point.
0:42:41Yeah, the idea of selling the phone from the future today is the perfect excuse to make
0:42:49it a more expensive phone because you're paying for the future and God knows what the future
0:42:55costs so it's okay for Apple to charge you over a thousand dollars for this.
0:42:59In the future, $1,000 isn't worth what it's worth now.
0:43:02You know, in the future, money loses all meaning.
0:43:06Inflation, you know, they're just charging inflation.
0:43:09They're preemptively charging for inflation in the markets. Makes sense. So, yeah, I was
0:43:18just surprised because I – and we go back to this discussion on the leaks and the rumors.
0:43:26Like macOS 10, which macOS 10 was already a thing when I came into the Apple ecosystem.
0:43:31So I had to learn the correct pronunciation of macOS 10 as I was learning the Apple world.
0:43:39But the iPhone X and iPhone X, it was rumored that I convinced myself in my mind before
0:43:45the event that was going to be the correct naming.
0:43:48And now it's going to be, I mean, maybe in a month we're not going to talk about this
0:43:51anymore, but I'm already hearing people.
0:43:53I mean my mother called me a couple of hours ago.
0:43:56She was like, "So what about the iPhone X?"
0:43:58And I thought, you know, this is gonna be a problem.
0:44:02Everybody's gonna call it the iPhone X.
0:44:04- Whenever, I think it was Tim that said the name,
0:44:06or whoever it was that said the name,
0:44:08when they said 10, I was like, "No!"
0:44:10I was like, "Why?
0:44:11"Why did you do this to me?"
0:44:14Like I don't dislike it.
0:44:15I don't dislike that it's 10,
0:44:17but my brain was already set on X.
0:44:20Like it's done. - Yeah, you mean the iPhone,
0:44:22The iPhone Tim, like Tim would say.
0:44:25- The iPhone Tim.
0:44:27The Tim phone.
0:44:29Yeah, okay, right, should we just get off this,
0:44:32start talking about it?
0:44:33Should we just stop talking about the number?
0:44:36- It's beautiful, it's a beautiful phone.
0:44:37- It's so beautiful.
0:44:38Oh my god, I want it so bad.
0:44:39I want it so bad, like just give it to me right now.
0:44:41Like I'm so sold on this.
0:44:45I know many people have many problems.
0:44:47We'll talk about some of those many problems.
0:44:49I don't see 'em.
0:44:50I just see this beautiful thing that I want.
0:44:53That I want so bad.
0:44:55And right, like I feel like we should probably
0:44:56just address this right now.
0:44:58Obviously all of us are not getting the eight plus.
0:45:01Right? - Nope.
0:45:04- So like plus club is over.
0:45:05Hashtag plus club is dead for now.
0:45:08We're gonna put it on a shelf.
0:45:10- Now it's the X Club.
0:45:13- I've thought about X Crew, hashtag X Crew.
0:45:16'Cause I don't wanna go for club
0:45:18'cause we already had a club.
0:45:19like we should be a crew now so I'm going with #Xcrew. We should be, maybe we should be a fam,
0:45:25you know? No I don't like that so much. The X fam. Personally I'm going with #Xcrew to replace the
0:45:33plus club. The thing is right, and people have been asking me this already about like oh obviously
0:45:39you're gonna stick with the plus because you love the plus so much. The idea of like plus club
0:45:46was never about just "I want to have a big phone."
0:45:50Like for me, you guys can chime in too, it was about "I want the best phone."
0:45:54And I believed personally the Plus to be the best phone.
0:45:58And it's not anymore, the X is better. And it's going to take some time for us,
0:46:02for all Plus users to like to get used to this new phone,
0:46:06right, because it seems like it's a compact design
0:46:09in UI, obviously the keyboard is going to be smaller,
0:46:13The screen is still big but it's big in a different way, right? Like it's tall not wide.
0:46:18I still think that I will get what mostly what I want which is good battery life. It looks like
0:46:24it's probably got like plus level battery life because it's what do they say two hours more than
0:46:29the seven so the battery life is going to be fine. And I'm going to get the two cameras which I
0:46:34really love and they're even better right because they're both optically image stabilized. That was
0:46:39That was a terrible way to say that,
0:46:41but you know what I'm trying to say.
0:46:43And you get a screen where I can see a ton of stuff on it.
0:46:47That's kind of all I really want.
0:46:49This is gonna be the best phone, so I'm gonna move to it.
0:46:51And then as soon as Apple make another one,
0:46:53and they make it bigger, that will probably be better,
0:46:55and then I'll move back to that one, right?
0:46:58- Yeah, that's basically my plan.
0:47:02Stick with the 10 as long as they make just one version,
0:47:07and whenever there's a bigger model, upgrade to that.
0:47:10Because I'm sure the screen on that phone
0:47:12is gonna be glorious.
0:47:14- Like six and a half inches or something.
0:47:16- Yeah, imagine like a plus with no bezel.
0:47:18I mean, that would be amazing.
0:47:19- So the two of you feel confident
0:47:21that there's a plus version of this new phone
0:47:23coming at some point.
0:47:24- Yeah, because I imagine they won't continue
0:47:26making the iPhone 6 design forever
0:47:29and they won't sell just one phone.
0:47:30This is why I think there'll be a nine.
0:47:34There will always be more than one phone.
0:47:36Maybe. I'm torn on that. I think maybe there's part of this that feels like I
0:47:44want there to be a bigger phone. Let me just state my preference before I say
0:47:48what I'm getting ready to say. But I can look at this phone and I could see the
0:47:52argument of saying this gives you the best of both the regular and the plus. So
0:47:56we just what we used to do with two phones because we had to we can do with
0:48:00one phone now with this new technology. So I think that you are right for now in
0:48:05in the same way that the screen was as big as we needed
0:48:09before there was a plus, right?
0:48:11Like the argument of like,
0:48:13oh, why would we have a big screen
0:48:14like those silly Android phones?
0:48:16I think it's the same kind of thing.
0:48:18It's just a reset.
0:48:19And after this becomes the norm,
0:48:21we'll want a bigger screen again.
0:48:23- But I think we're thinking ahead of ourselves here.
0:48:26Let's talk about the notch,
0:48:31or as Apple calls it, the sensor housing.
0:48:34a small, let's call the sensor,
0:48:36a small place where the sensors are placing the device.
0:48:41So all the folks that were saying Apple sure
0:48:44embraced the notch were right.
0:48:46Apple is most definitely embracing the notch
0:48:49and actually they have put out updated developer guidelines.
0:48:53They've even refreshed the WWDC app and developer portal
0:48:58with new videos and new guidelines.
0:49:00And they're explicitly telling developers,
0:49:02do not place black bars at the top to hide the corners,
0:49:07the rounded corners of the display.
0:49:09Do not place a black bar at the bottom
0:49:11to hide the home indicator.
0:49:14You should take advantage of the full screen of the iPhone X.
0:49:16- So happy.
0:49:18- Yes, and I agree because I think it's one of those cases,
0:49:22you know, when Johnny Ive says,
0:49:23it's the purest expression of,
0:49:25I think this is totally correct.
0:49:27I think this is not marketing, this is true.
0:49:30I don't understand, actually I do understand,
0:49:33and I have some ideas, but the developers
0:49:36and the designers will, you know, on Twitter,
0:49:37if you scroll Twitter, especially what I call design Twitter
0:49:41there's a trend right now going on of designers
0:49:45posting mock-ups of what an iPhone 10 with black bars
0:49:49will look like and they will look better.
0:49:50- Oh, it would be so wonderful, no.
0:49:52No, no. - No, not at all.
0:49:54- No, no, because it's on principle.
0:49:56I don't want a screen that I'm paying for to be cut off.
0:50:00I want all of it.
0:50:01I'm buying this screen, goddammit,
0:50:03and I want to use all of that screen.
0:50:06Right?
0:50:07- I know, so it just looks so much--
0:50:09- I don't, no, I don't, no, I don't, no.
0:50:10- It just looks more, it just looks more futuristic.
0:50:14- Yes.
0:50:14- I think it goes back to
0:50:17a fraction of the design community
0:50:21that sort of looks back at the days of iOS 6
0:50:26iOS 5, the old Apple design, thinking that it still looks better than iOS 11, which I totally don't understand, but you know, everyone has different tastes.
0:50:37But I do believe that embracing the notch and having a full screen app design on the iPhone X looks so much better than faking a black status bar at the top.
0:50:46the top. I think the black status bar makes sense for some types of
0:50:50applications like photo editing apps for example, where you want a more you know
0:50:55maybe a more constrained space like you don't want to have any distractions on
0:51:01top of the on top of the app so it makes more sense for some apps but in general
0:51:06I think it looks so much better and so much it's just so cool when you look at
0:51:13the entire app UI that extends towards the top of the iPhone X.
0:51:18And I think Apple is right here.
0:51:21It's also really funny to me that a lot of criticisms right now is how bad everything looks in landscape.
0:51:26It's as if nobody's ever used a landscape iPhone before.
0:51:29It's always looked terrible, everyone.
0:51:31It's a... yeah.
0:51:32You don't know this because you also are diametrically opposed to having a Plus phone.
0:51:37Yeah.
0:51:38Landscape iPhones, it's just not...
0:51:40No one uses it because it sucks, right?
0:51:42Like, because it's just not right.
0:51:43It's just not built right.
0:51:44Like, you know, I've used it every now and then, but everything's kind of awkward.
0:51:49Right?
0:51:49Like it's never been a good experience.
0:51:51It's always been kind of terrible and kind of like an afterthought.
0:51:55It wasn't really the primary way of interacting with the phone.
0:51:58Even on the plus, you can tell it's an afterthought.
0:52:00Nobody builds stuff right for it because nobody uses it and et cetera, et cetera.
0:52:04Right?
0:52:04Like saying how bad everything looks in landscape because of the notch.
0:52:09At that point, in my opinion,
0:52:11you're just looking for something.
0:52:13You're looking for a criticism to make,
0:52:15which is totally fine because you know what,
0:52:17you don't have to like it, but I do.
0:52:20I mean, my problem with a lot of this sort of stuff is like,
0:52:23and this is just a problem with the internet,
0:52:26where people just state something like it's a fact, right?
0:52:29(laughing)
0:52:31Like your opinion is not fact.
0:52:33All of the stuff that I'm saying right now, it's my opinion.
0:52:36My opinion is all of this,
0:52:37But I know it can be super difficult to state this stuff about context, especially on Twitter.
0:52:41But it's just, you know, anything should rub you up the wrong way.
0:52:44And that's one of them for me.
0:52:45It's like, this is a fact that I'm stating.
0:52:47My fact is based upon my opinion.
0:52:49These are not the same.
0:52:51Myke, I think you in general have a problem with some type of memes from the Apple
0:53:01community.
0:53:02Yeah, I really do.
0:53:04I have shared beliefs.
0:53:06Uh-huh. Or like just shared phrases, terms, anything really. I have lots of, just lots
0:53:15of problems. Lots of them.
0:53:18You have lots of problems?
0:53:19I have lots and lots of problems.
0:53:20I'm sorry.
0:53:21It's okay. It's okay. I mean, I can live with them. The problem is everybody else has to
0:53:27as well, because you have to listen to me talk about it.
0:53:30So anyway, the notch. You now have two Batman ears on the top of the phone.
0:53:36Do you know what's so great about that Federico? I love you so much, but to me it sounded like
0:53:41you said "bad man" and I was like "oh, hang on a second, we got a bad man in here, huh?"
0:53:47We got a bad man. So from the right side, they are kinda interactive in that you can
0:53:55can swipe down from them and the features that they activate have been
0:54:01splitting too. So the right side opens the new control center which doesn't
0:54:06come up from the bottom anymore, it comes down from the top, kind of like an
0:54:09Android phone. And the left side, it goes to the cover sheet which is the new
0:54:14notification center/lock screen of iOS 11. And you can swipe down in the middle
0:54:19of the screen as always to access Spotlight MKBHD. Very thankfully cleared
0:54:24one up for me. I have a lot of thoughts before we move on from this, this very thing.
0:54:32I just want to say that for Control Center I was hoping, I was maybe thinking/hoping that
0:54:38Apple would integrate Control Center with the app switcher like on the iPad. I think this looks kind
0:54:44of weird because I have never, I mean it's gonna take a while in terms of muscle memory to think
0:54:50that my flashlight I now need to swipe from the top of the phone it's also maybe gonna be more
0:54:54difficult to access I don't know. The flashlights on the on the locked home screen. I know I know
0:54:59it's also on the locked home screen so then maybe it's not a problem what about music playback or
0:55:03like the other shortcuts. Well yeah I mean well hopefully it would be showed there right if you're
0:55:08playing something already. I think I will get used to it anyway it's not gonna be a deal breaker
0:55:15But yeah, it's gonna be strange initially.
0:55:17Yeah, I think one of the reasons they did that is just because I can't imagine how they would have fit
0:55:22all of that on one screen like the multitasking and the control center because I bet you'd always be swiping the wrong way
0:55:28It's like the cards thing again
0:55:29You'd always be swiping and you're either looking for one or the other and which one does it show you?
0:55:33So at least with the control center as it's going to be
0:55:36Whilst it's a place to get used to it's a dedicated place that it always is and you will always get it
0:55:42You know what I mean?
0:55:44But yeah.
0:55:45So in January 2016, actually on my birthday that year,
0:55:49oddly enough, I wrote what has to be the most unpopular thing
0:55:52I've ever published.
0:55:54All right.
0:55:54Mainly because Gruber called it out.
0:55:56He disagreed with it.
0:55:57So I got emails for months.
0:55:59A few people telling me I was stupid.
0:56:02Talking about combining Control Center and Notification Center.
0:56:08Now this is obviously now a year and a half ago.
0:56:10So it's an older system, Control Center and notification
0:56:14center, different now, right?
0:56:16With cover sheet, I guess.
0:56:17But it is, I think, inherently odd
0:56:21that you pull down from the left bad man ear to get one thing,
0:56:27and you get another thing when you go right.
0:56:30And I don't know if the solution is combining them,
0:56:33or if you pull down and you swipe one direction,
0:56:36you get widgets, but you swipe the other way
0:56:38you get Control Center.
0:56:40It just feels very disjointed right now.
0:56:43And maybe it,
0:56:44I'm sure this is not the case,
0:56:48but it feels a little bit like they designed this phone
0:56:50and then they figured out,
0:56:51then they realized they had a retrofit control center
0:56:53into it.
0:56:54And it feels a little hacky to have one thing on one side
0:56:58and one on the other.
0:57:00And then Spotlight is a third thing.
0:57:02Like why can't Spotlight live in some other place?
0:57:04Like it just,
0:57:05it feels like there's a lot going on
0:57:07with the gestures on this phone.
0:57:08We haven't even gotten to,
0:57:09When you go home, you swipe up,
0:57:10and those animations are weird too.
0:57:12There's a lot going on, there's a lot to remember.
0:57:14I'm sure we will all adjust, right?
0:57:16That's not my problem, we will all adjust to it.
0:57:19But I feel like there's a lot going on,
0:57:20and it's a little disappointing
0:57:22that they didn't take the opportunity
0:57:24to readdress some of this stuff
0:57:25and combine those now, like they did on the iPad.
0:57:27The iPad, for all of its pros and cons
0:57:30of the new multitasking system,
0:57:32having your multitasking and your control center together
0:57:35is actually pretty nice,
0:57:36'cause you just have this dashboard view
0:57:37of all the things you can do.
0:57:39and the iPhone doesn't have that,
0:57:41and on the iPhone X, it's even more fragmented
0:57:45than it was before.
0:57:46- I'm happy with it though.
0:57:52I mean, I wanna use it, but this makes sense to me
0:57:57because it's persistent.
0:58:00Like, the things that you were just recommending there,
0:58:03Steven, it's the same problem I have
0:58:04with the current control center, right?
0:58:05Like, combining it with widgets,
0:58:08it's like, just the idea of swiping
0:58:11and I never feel like I've got what I want
0:58:13and I can never remember which way I need to swipe.
0:58:16- Oh yeah, no, and I'm not saying that I have the answer.
0:58:19This is a hard problem.
0:58:20- Yeah.
0:58:21- This is a complicated thing, but I'm not,
0:58:26like what they did is probably the,
0:58:28even though there's a lot of gestures,
0:58:30it's probably the simplest from your perspective, right,
0:58:32that you don't have to mode switch
0:58:34once you've entered a new area of the UI,
0:58:36but I don't feel like they've quite hit it.
0:58:40- Yeah, I think the separation of the two sides,
0:58:45of course, makes it easier and makes it possible
0:58:48to do this kind of multiple gestures,
0:58:51because you know left is one thing and right is another.
0:58:53It would have been stranger
0:58:55if there was like an invisible separator between them.
0:58:58So I think the ears actually make this possible,
0:59:01make this better. I'm just curious, technically speaking,
0:59:07and maybe I should have checked in the simulator or in Xcode, but if
0:59:12you're using a left-to-right language, does the functionality reverse? Like the
0:59:19left side becomes control center and the right side becomes the cover sheet? I
0:59:23think so, because the entire UI kit should be flipped. That's interesting.
0:59:29I do wanted to ask you guys, do you think there will be a time in the let's say
0:59:36next three years, so by say 2020, are we gonna see an iPhone 10 like phone without
0:59:46the notch? I think that that is the ultimate goal. Yeah. To keep making that
0:59:53smaller and smaller until it's gone. That's how you take this phone to its
0:59:57end but they're not close to that yet because there's so much technology that
1:00:04has to be crammed into that thing and I think the goal will be how do we get it
1:00:08all under the screen yeah if you look at the the there one of their many
1:00:15confusing product pages there's a graphic of everything in that notch and
1:00:18I agree with you like there's a ton of stuff in there yeah and it is crammed
1:00:22packed it's actually probably a little surprising as it's as small as it is now
1:00:25I do think ultimately that, Federica, you're right, that they will get there.
1:00:29Is it in three years? I don't know, but I do think ultimately that's where they
1:00:33want it to be, and if they get rid of the notch and then they get rid of the bad
1:00:38man ears, then they run into the problem that we have. This is my favorite. This is my
1:00:44absolute favorite. The bad man ears. You guys are terrible with me. It only took us three
1:00:53years to get back to time of koalasing. Only three years.
1:00:58Oh man remember that? Yeah this is the new one.
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1:02:53All right, so face ID. Face ID is a pretty big deal, right?
1:02:59Yeah. I guess.
1:03:02I'll start with you, Steven. You're gonna miss the home button, do you think? What do you think?
1:03:07I don't I don't think so. I mean, so we talked about when we talked about this when this
1:03:12rumor first came out, and we made some predictions, and we all did terribly it. I think it's because
1:03:18we sort of lacked the the understanding of how this would work. And I think Apple did
1:03:25a good job at selling it selling it that it's easy to use. And that it is the things that
1:03:34that are not Touch ID related at the home button,
1:03:36they've moved other places.
1:03:37So the side button you long press for Siri,
1:03:41which seems like it's gonna be more accident prone.
1:03:42I'm curious to how that's gonna play out
1:03:44'cause with the 7, if it's in your pocket,
1:03:47you can't really do Siri accidentally
1:03:49because you can't press the button.
1:03:50But with this, it seems like that's gonna happen a bunch.
1:03:55I'm curious to see how that plays out.
1:03:56You can double tap the side button to do Apple Pay.
1:03:59You can still do the five press thing to enter SOS mode
1:04:02you can on the current phones under iOS 11. So the things that the home button
1:04:07has done they have moved elsewhere. The one feature as best I can tell and
1:04:12Federico maybe you know the answer to this I think reachability is gone I
1:04:16don't think I've seen where it goes. No it's gone it's no more yep. So rest in
1:04:22peace reachability. Rest in peace ability. Oh it's probably fine on a phone this
1:04:28size right like I miss it I don't know I thinks did you ever know I use it all
1:04:35the time really to bring notifications sent to them with one hand hmm I do use
1:04:43it sometimes I'll just that if I can't reach it I don't know I mean I don't
1:04:47know how this thing feels in the hand yet like I don't actually know how it
1:04:50feels it looks or feels in my hand maybe I can reach the entire screen just on my
1:04:54thumb who knows like I haven't I mean I don't have the context yet but
1:04:58But if I can't reach the notification center with just one hand, like if holding the hand
1:05:04that I'm holding, then I will miss reachability for that because it allows me to do that.
1:05:08But it is a dumb feature which they probably should get rid of, right?
1:05:11Because it's like, it's an embarrassing thing to have to add to a phone.
1:05:15Yeah, I mean, but yeah, I get that.
1:05:18But I do think, I mean, I don't use it, but it sounds like you do and you find it useful
1:05:22so that it's probably worthwhile.
1:05:25So I mean, so to kind of wrap up, it feels like they have built a case for these are
1:05:29all the things the home button used to do.
1:05:32And this is where they are now.
1:05:33They're either behind gestures, which you'll learn to figure out, or they're behind the
1:05:36aside button press.
1:05:38And they've kind of reassigned all those actions elsewhere in the phone.
1:05:42And so I think I'm I think I'm honestly going to be just fine.
1:05:47Many months ago, we made touch ID predictions.
1:05:50So like we've been talking for weeks about whether touch ID would go away or not.
1:05:53and we made predictions.
1:05:54There were three questions.
1:05:56One was if the iPhone 8 would feature a touch ID sensor
1:06:00on the back or embedded.
1:06:02Obviously this question was misguided
1:06:05considering what we know now.
1:06:06We were obviously all wrong.
1:06:08Me and Stephen thought it would go on the back.
1:06:09Federico thought it would go under the display.
1:06:11The answer is it doesn't exist.
1:06:13The second question was would Apple ditch touch ID
1:06:17because of hardware issues?
1:06:19We don't obviously know what the answer was.
1:06:22We all didn't think that Apple would do that.
1:06:25It will maybe never be known if they got rid of Touch ID
1:06:30because they couldn't do it,
1:06:31as opposed to wanting to go to Face ID, like we don't know.
1:06:35And would Apple ditch Touch ID in favor of another form
1:06:38of biometric identity for the iPhone 8?
1:06:41I said that I didn't think that Apple would have something
1:06:44that could be as secure as Touch ID.
1:06:46I was wrong.
1:06:47Steven said that he didn't think that Apple would do it
1:06:50because they spent so much time preaching the security of touch ID, so it would be too
1:06:56hard to remove it.
1:06:58And Federico was the only one of us who said, "Unless something new is safe or safer."
1:07:04So we had three predictions.
1:07:07There were nine possible right answers.
1:07:10We got one of them.
1:07:12So well done to us, I guess, especially Federico.
1:07:17There were nine possible outcomes and only one of those nine were correct.
1:07:22So we didn't do the best job there.
1:07:26But Federico, you got something right.
1:07:29I mean, if you look at the hard numbers that Apple presented yesterday, it sure seems like
1:07:37the Face ID is more secure than Touch ID because fewer people in the world could accidentally
1:07:42unlock your phone because they share the same facial features as yourself.
1:07:49Yeah, I mean there's some real like, but when they put the asterisk on there I'd love to
1:07:54know what those statistics are because they never said before, unless someone you live
1:08:00with has similar fingerprints to you, like that was never a thing that they spoke about,
1:08:04but they did say...
1:08:05They mentioned the...
1:08:06The genetics.
1:08:07Even if it was a joke.
1:08:08Right.
1:08:09about the evil twin but that was not... I don't think that was meant to be a joke
1:08:14No. It was meant to be serious but presented in a lighthearted way. Yeah I'm really
1:08:19keen to understand like my brother who kind of looks a little bit like me can
1:08:25he unlock it? Like how close do you have to be? So I'm excited... not excited I'm
1:08:30keen to try that out right and see what that's like and I appreciate that they
1:08:34said it but like I would also like to know what those numbers are because
1:08:39those numbers they didn't share like what is the chances at that point
1:08:42because I bet it would be less than one in fifty thousand at that point because
1:08:47they had felt they needed to say it I can already kind of feel how the next
1:08:52iPhone gate will be about twins being able to unlock each other's iPhones
1:08:59especially yeah that's probably what it will be and get and twin gate twin gate
1:09:05Maybe I can maybe I can break that gate wide open to you
1:09:08I just want you to win why don't you register the web domain already twin gate calm? That's good
1:09:15Judy looks a lot like you sponsor
1:09:18so maybe you can see if Jude can unlock your phone and then you can post maybe ten second YouTube clip and
1:09:23Get a billion views and go on TV
1:09:26That anniversary is coming up like next week sometime. Well, it's always gonna be whenever the iPhone come out, right?
1:09:32like oh yeah I guess that's a good do you want to talk about the the the fact that do you want to
1:09:37talk about the incredibly poor luck for Craig Federighi I very much the worst possible thing
1:09:43that could have happened during this presentation actually did happen yes so around the hour 36
1:09:50minute mark uh Craig Federighi goes to demo the iPhone 10 for the first time and as you it makes
1:09:57a lot of sense right he's got to pick it up and lock it with his handsome man face because
1:10:02that's the first thing you want to demo on this phone and it fails and so there's a screenshot in
1:10:06my blog post enter passcode your passcode is required to enable face id we have all seen
1:10:11messages like this a lot of people said what's what happens when your phone restarts that is not
1:10:17true that's not the language used when your phone restarts that language is touch id requires uh your
1:10:23passcode when iPhone restarts. It gives you the reason it is required. However, iPhones can enter
1:10:29this state where a PIN is required to authenticate before you can use a biometric authentication.
1:10:37If Springboard crashes, if you've installed a software update and haven't logged in since,
1:10:43that happened to me after the iOS 11 GM yesterday. I got this exact language on my 7 Plus.
1:10:50This is not what happened. I'm sure this phone was not put in SOS mode. But if a phone goes into SOS
1:10:54mode, it shows this error message. Or if touch ID can't match after several tries, so we've all done
1:10:59this, we got another shower, right? And we're all raisin-y and warm and cozy. And we go to unlock
1:11:04touch ID and it won't work. You can get this message. So all that to say something happened
1:11:09to this phone. I don't think it was restarted. But either the springboard crash while it was sitting
1:11:14there under a black cloth waiting for Craig to walk over to it, or in people getting it
1:11:21ready.
1:11:22It tried to unlock on their faces a bunch of times and it couldn't do it and then entered
1:11:25this mode.
1:11:27But something happened.
1:11:29And the initial response was, oh my gosh, Face ID is broken.
1:11:33And like, it that's just not true.
1:11:36I think it's just bad luck that that this phone entered a state that it needed a pin
1:11:42before he could move forward.
1:11:44Federighi has come a long way from his shaky hand on the trackpad in the in the back to
1:11:49the Mac event in 2011.
1:11:51He said, Hey, we have a backup phone.
1:11:52He picks up the other phone, he unlocks it, he proceeds to unlock that phone several times,
1:11:57which seemed off script.
1:11:59But I think just to like reiterate, hey, this works, like, lock the phone, do it again.
1:12:03I did a couple of times during the demo.
1:12:06I think the first phone was just really bad luck.
1:12:08I'm sure it's embarrassing for Apple and the event team.
1:12:11I'm sure someone when that happened sort of sank through the floor they were standing
1:12:16on maybe someone got yelled at.
1:12:18There is a funny bit that happened years ago when Steve Jobs trying to import photos into
1:12:23iPhoto for the first time and the digital camera wouldn't come on and he throws it into
1:12:27the front row of the audience I guess to his assistant or somebody.
1:12:30Really?
1:12:31Yeah it's great.
1:12:32We'll dig that up for the show notes but he just like chunks it and is like here fix this
1:12:37and then I think it happens again.
1:12:39So I think I think he should have untone the phone like chunked it off the side of the stage
1:12:43I think it would have been a really nice you dedicated the place of Steve Jobs throw something off the stage
1:12:46So it's all I want
1:12:48So anyways, I don't I think face ID is fine, I think this was just an incredible crummy piece of luck
1:12:55I think Federighi handled it. Well, yes, it's embarrassing for Apple. Yes
1:13:00It'll be kind of made fun of for a while with people who remember it
1:13:02But I don't like I'm not worried right that I'm gonna go use Apple pay at Whole Foods and I have to enter my pen
1:13:08Like it this is something that happened on stage happens in real life to us
1:13:12Randomly and it's unfortunate, but I don't think it's anything more than that
1:13:17That's all yeah, I'm not concerned about it like I think it is is what it is
1:13:23It will happen to me every few days because it happens to me every few days right now, right?
1:13:28Like I have to put my passcode in instead of my thumb. Like I'm not bothered about it
1:13:32There's something that I that I want to mention about the new unlocking process on the iPhone 10
1:13:38- Yeah.
1:13:40- So right now I see some benefits
1:13:43and some things I'm kind of concerned about.
1:13:47So the obvious benefit to me seems like
1:13:50when you're holding the phone
1:13:52and you're dealing with notifications,
1:13:54it's more convenient than ever
1:13:55because just by looking,
1:13:57you put the iOS lock screen in a locked state
1:14:01so you can fully interact with notifications
1:14:04and read messages, respond to messages and all that.
1:14:07But the fact that you need to, you know, there's a padlock icon now on the lock screen.
1:14:15It's a very big icon. And the animation for that icon to unlock is kind of slow.
1:14:22And it feels to me like the animation is actually slower than it takes for Face ID to authenticate you and to recognize you.
1:14:29So I wonder if the animation of the icon will cause the perception that Face ID is slower than Touch ID.
1:14:36And also I wonder if having to do the dance of look with your eyes open then swipe up
1:14:43It's gonna be slower than place your finger and click
1:14:46So I
1:14:50Am under the assumption that
1:14:53You are able to swipe the screen as
1:14:58You are raising it to your face and then look at it and it will go to the home screen
1:15:05Okay. I wonder how that works.
1:15:09Well because when you swipe up it will then say look to open.
1:15:14Or put in your passcode. Yeah, okay.
1:15:17Right, so this is something that I am under an assumption with which I am confident is based on true fact.
1:15:25Okay.
1:15:27So that will be a way that you'll be able to do the kind of unlock from the pocket, right?
1:15:33because this was my big thing, I unlock my phone, my phone's on the home screen before
1:15:38it gets to my face because I just unlock it as it's coming out of my pocket, right, so I just press the home button or whatever
1:15:44this is a way, it might be a bit slower, but a way to kind of mimic that so I don't feel like I'm always look, swipe, like I want to swipe and look and then get there
1:15:51and it seems like that is going to be a thing that is possible
1:15:55but you know the thing about the animation?
1:15:58I would maybe, if that's the case, right, like I would maybe say that the animation is taking as long as it takes the system to do what it's supposed to do.
1:16:08Rather than the system is waiting for the animation to complete.
1:16:13It wouldn't be, there's precedent for that though. It wouldn't be the first time that IOS animation framework is actually slower than it takes the system to perform a feature.
1:16:22So, we'll see. Obviously this phone is not coming out until November and I think it's going to run probably iOS 11.1.
1:16:31So Apple has plenty of time to tweak things.
1:16:34And I mean, maybe we'll even see some leaks from iOS 11.1, who knows?
1:16:40Maybe we'll know more in a few weeks.
1:16:45I guess.
1:16:49But yeah, overall, I think I'm a fan. I was talking to some friends and my girlfriend
1:17:01and my mom about this. First question is, Face ID is super cool. You look at your phone
1:17:08and it understands your face. I feel like when people hear that Apple did some tests
1:17:14with photographs and videos and masks and it uses the depth information and the lasers
1:17:20to make sure they're actually looking at a real human being. They're not being spoofed
1:17:24by these other authentication tricks.
1:17:27It needs your attention and all the work.
1:17:30And it needs your attention. And everybody says that it's super cool. Like the invisible
1:17:34lasers and the 30,000 dots on your face. That's amazing. There's an element of that's kind
1:17:39of creepy but I think we all had the same reaction four years ago when Touch ID first
1:17:46came out.
1:17:47It was kind of creepy that a company can now read my fingerprint.
1:17:52And of course it all comes down to the secure enclave and the way that Apple deals with
1:17:57this information.
1:17:58So I think the creepiness factor won't be an issue at all.
1:18:01If anything I think Apple will probably have a PR problem with the identical twin stuff
1:18:08and they're maybe sort of trying to get ahead of the problem
1:18:10by talking about it at the keynote.
1:18:13But I think overall, this idea is super cool.
1:18:15It looks, sounds, and it works futuristically.
1:18:20So I think it's the perfect compliment
1:18:23to this kind of futuristic phone.
1:18:24- All right, there's, oh my gosh,
1:18:26there's still so much more to go on this.
1:18:28Let me take a break and we can get back to talking
1:18:31about the iPhone, we'll call it 10?
1:18:34Yeah, we'll call it 10, right?
1:18:3510, 10 is the agreed upon?
1:18:3610 is the agreed upon. - 10, yes.
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1:20:06So the cameras on the iPhone X, I don't know if either of you understand this more than
1:20:12me but it seems like they're the same but with optical image stabilisation on both,
1:20:18like are there any other differences?
1:20:20I don't really understand.
1:20:22So the X and the 8 Plus both have the new 12 megapixel sensor, it's also true on the
1:20:29the 8 but the plus and the 10 have the dual camera system with the telephoto lens.
1:20:33And they're both 12 megapixel now right? They weren't both 12 megapixel before.
1:20:37I think so yeah. The differences between the plus and the 10 is that both lenses on the
1:20:4410 are optically image stabilized. So before just the regular lens was and the telephoto
1:20:51wasn't. So this would make portrait stuff and zoomed in video smoother which is good.
1:20:57The other slight difference is the aperture's
1:20:59a little bit better on the X than the Plus,
1:21:01but it's a pretty minor change.
1:21:03I think, again, going back a step,
1:21:06eight versus 10, the 8 Plus has an amazing camera system,
1:21:09and the 10 is only a little bit better.
1:21:12If you're looking at the 8 or 8 Plus,
1:21:14I don't think you have to be super sad
1:21:16about the camera system you're not getting on the X.
1:21:18- Real-time follow-up, the 7 Plus,
1:21:20both of them are listed as 12 megapixel as well.
1:21:24- Well, there you go.
1:21:26they're apparently they're new and they've got stuff in them.
1:21:29But yeah, I don't, I mean, looking at it,
1:21:32it's like the difference is the new one has a 2.4 aperture
1:21:37on the telephoto, the old one had a 2.8,
1:21:39and then it's digital optimized,
1:21:42no, just a dual optical image stabilization
1:21:45and a true tone flash with slow sync, whatever that means.
1:21:49They're the differences. - I don't know what
1:21:50that means, but a better flash.
1:21:52- And apparently they've got a bunch of sensors in
1:21:54which are enhanced by, what do they call it kids?
1:21:57- Neural networks.
1:22:00- There you go, neural networks, machine learning.
1:22:02That's in the camera now.
1:22:03- Bionic.
1:22:04- It's everywhere.
1:22:04- Bionic, ISP.
1:22:06- Bionic, that's fun.
1:22:07- Apple's building their own, we skipped over it,
1:22:09but Apple's building their own GPU and ISP now,
1:22:13'cause the power of VR stuff's gone.
1:22:14- Internet service provider is my understanding
1:22:16of that phrase.
1:22:17- Image system processor.
1:22:19- Image system processor.
1:22:20- Yeah, so that's all good stuff.
1:22:23So they can do more fancy stuff.
1:22:25Front camera you can do on the 10, you can do the depth stuff because they have all the
1:22:28stuff for the face ID.
1:22:30So even though it doesn't have two cameras.
1:22:31Selfies are gone, it looks so good guys.
1:22:33Yeah, Snapchat games gonna go way up if you're young and into that sort of thing.
1:22:38Like me being in Federico?
1:22:40Yeah, like you in Federico.
1:22:42Yeah, y'all should be in your 20s.
1:22:43For now.
1:22:44Not much longer.
1:22:45I look at this phone and I'm so blown away by the beauty of it.
1:22:49I don't want to put it in a case and I'm really concerned about my opinion and my feelings
1:22:52about this. Well AppleCare+ is $200 on this phone. $200! Because it's glass, that's why.
1:22:58I mean it's strong glass but it's still glass, right? So it's, that's more than the 8 and
1:23:048 Plus, even though the Plus, AppleCare+ - that's really a confusing sentence - is more expensive
1:23:09than on the 7 Plus. God, names. Oh gosh darn it. I assume it's because if you smash the
1:23:14OLED screen it's just more expensive. Oh man. They said the glass is harder than what they've
1:23:20put up on previous phones.
1:23:22See the back glasses, it's got a steel reinforcement
1:23:25under it to help keep it stiff.
1:23:27But yeah, people are gonna break it.
1:23:29I am not gonna put a case on it 'cause I'm not an animal.
1:23:31My phone has been naked basically the whole time
1:23:35I've had an iPhone and I will continue that tradition.
1:23:38The only question is what color to get.
1:23:40But no case here in my life, no case.
1:23:44- What do you wanna do Federico?
1:23:48Well I think I'm gonna go with the obvious choice which would be 256GB black.
1:23:58I mean that's, you know, I guess it's the most expensive one, no the most expensive
1:24:05one is the 512 model.
1:24:07No it's not a 512.
1:24:10Okay so the best one, yeah.
1:24:12So are you gonna put a case on it though?
1:24:15Umm...
1:24:16What about the folio?
1:24:19At least initially I will not.
1:24:23I will try to see, I mean obviously I'm going to get AppleCare so I will see if I can survive
1:24:28without a case.
1:24:30But I don't want to do the folio because I don't see the phone as an iPad.
1:24:35Also I'm not the kind of business user I don't think.
1:24:39You got to put your debit card in there for fast access.
1:24:42Yeah sure sure.
1:24:43Apple pay fix that now that's the sweet irony of apples yeah apples basically
1:24:50built a wallet case you're like a book use Apple pay properly because your card
1:24:56will be trying to talk to the reader I'm sure they've the cards on the front of
1:25:02the phone and if he's in the back I'm sure they've worked that out you can't
1:25:07have them stacked on top of each other though you'd have to have it opened to
1:25:10use it? Maybe. No that's how NFC works. Like if you have two cards on top of each other
1:25:18and try and put them against the reader it just doesn't know what to do. You have to
1:25:22like separate them. So you would have to open the folio every time you wanted to use Apple
1:25:27Pay and leave it open when you scan it. So you'll be doing it with like two hands like
1:25:31a little book. Like you'll walk into the checkout with a book in your hand and you're putting
1:25:35it against the card reader. There's a word of warning to all of you folio fans out there
1:25:39hashtag folio fam the folio fans the iPhone 10 beats MacBook Pro in geek
1:25:47bench tests it beats the 13 or no Pro in geek bench tests so your new phone will
1:25:55be faster than your new laptop what does that really mean though it doesn't mean
1:26:00anything because I'm just gonna preempt a ATP I'm sure they're gonna talk about
1:26:07this for four hours. I don't think it really matters because the type of task even on an iPad,
1:26:15the type of tasks that push an iPad or is different from the type of tasks that push a Mac
1:26:20like there's some overlap right like Jason Snell is editing podcasts on iPad because he's a crazy
1:26:24person. But most people don't do that. And like, it's great if you're doing that sort of like
1:26:30hardcore production on iOS, but 99% of iOS users don't. And even the stuff Federico does, it's
1:26:37pushing the CPU and GPU more than most people do. But I think they're so
1:26:42different like oh my god the ARM processor is faster than the MacBook Pro.
1:26:46That doesn't mean we're gonna have a MacBook Pro with ARM because it may be
1:26:49faster but there's still a hundred other problems with putting this chip in a Mac.
1:26:53Like you don't have thunderbolt. All the stuff we talked about you know
1:26:56thunderbolt you know Windows support all you have to have developers recompile
1:27:00their stuff which they're not gonna do because they don't care about the Mac.
1:27:02like I don't see it happening. It's more for me
1:27:06lol Intel that Apple's custom
1:27:09assumingly much smaller team than what Intel has like I'm sure Apple's CPU team is a much smaller group of people than all of Intel and
1:27:18They're getting it handed to them, but I don't think it is a big deal
1:27:23It's no big of it. It's no bigger video than it was before this I don't think
1:27:28Are you both worried about how many animated emoji you're gonna get from me?
1:27:33I'm definitely gonna block you and I message I am gonna this is it now
1:27:37This is this is the pinnacle of everything its emoji stickers, which I've always wanted
1:27:42I've always wanted to have to be able to use emoji like stickers
1:27:45But now I can make them do whatever I want. I can make them make any type of face
1:27:50You know, I can make an angry robot. I can make a happy monkey. I can make a perplexed chicken
1:27:56Anything I want to do I can do it. I'm so excited about this
1:28:00I may just send all of my messages as audio messages recorded through the face of
1:28:06A unicorn that might just be the way I communicate with people in 2017
1:28:10No, I want you to be the chicken Myke. Yeah
1:28:14I I feel like I need to spend some serious time choosing what my one will be
1:28:19Right, like I think everybody needs to go through this
1:28:21They even did it on stage right where would it Tim was the alien and what did what did Craig Craig's Fox?
1:28:29It was the Fox course obviously
1:28:31So I'm gonna need to spend some serious time looking through this. I haven't seen anywhere yet. Like what the full list of emoji is
1:28:39So so if you go to Apple newsroom
1:28:42On the iPhone 10 page. I think there's a list of there's 12 of them
1:28:48I think because they said they have about six or seven of them as gifts. I
1:28:53will put the Fox one in the show notes so we can see that on the show notes page
1:28:58for this this episode. Okay I'm trying to find this list now I don't see it.
1:29:06I think there's like 12 of them. Okay. What's interesting it's an
1:29:10iMessage app like it's not in the emoji keyboard. It makes sense to me.
1:29:17I think so too and I think you know they're still trying to make I message apps a thing but
1:29:20It is what it is
1:29:23I'm very excited about an emoji guys. I really really really really am like very very excited about it like
1:29:29it was it was the first time that I
1:29:32Did I that I generally love that?
1:29:36Laughing my butt off I was especially
1:29:40like I
1:29:42I did not expect Johnny to do the demo of the animoji and that was, you know when you
1:29:50when you get the feeling that you know someone and that person tends to be a very serious,
1:29:55very composed person and then suddenly they do something funny and it's funnier than it
1:30:02should be because you never see them in that light. Because it's so out of character for them.
1:30:07Yes, and that's exactly what happened to me with Johnny yesterday.
1:30:11He was doing the monkey, the monkey animoji and I was like, this is, this is just so funny.
1:30:17It's like, you know, good times at the, during the Apple video, you know, the white, the white room
1:30:24is funnier than usual. The white room got some character in it and those characters were animated
1:30:29monkey faces. I'm really excited about this feature. Like, this is something that people
1:30:35people are going to go crazy for, I think.
1:30:38And I'm very, very, very excited to play with it.
1:30:41- You know, even technically speaking,
1:30:43it's quite the accomplishment from Apple
1:30:45because they're using the new face recognition APIs.
1:30:50And I guess they're also available with ARKit,
1:30:53you know, all the detection points that developers
1:30:56can request to form this approximation of your face.
1:31:00And they're also doing some stuff, I guess, with Metal 2
1:31:03and maybe sync it to animate the Animoji on screen.
1:31:07So if you look at the leaks from the iOS 11 GM
1:31:12from last week, all the Animoji were low poly versions,
1:31:17so very low polygon count.
1:31:19And I believe Apple is doing some hardware tessellation
1:31:23to smooth all the surfaces out and make the polished,
1:31:27you know, rounded fully 3D Animoji
1:31:30that we have on the iPhone 10.
1:31:31So that's kinda awesome from a technical perspective too.
1:31:35It's a silly feature, but it's very nicely done
1:31:39from a technical perspective.
1:31:40And it's also interesting--
1:31:41- This is not silly.
1:31:42This is deadly serious.
1:31:43- It's serious too.
1:31:45I mean, I think it's gonna sell iPhones, honestly.
1:31:48And it's gonna make for some amazing commercials.
1:31:52- Yeah. - Yeah.
1:31:53I am very excited.
1:31:55- This isn't in the notes, but iOS 11
1:31:59does not have Apple's new emoji.
1:32:02It's gonna be, assuming later,
1:32:03maybe in 11.1 with this new phone.
1:32:06Is that a, I was gonna ask you, is that a break?
1:32:10Has it been on a minor update
1:32:11or have they been in major releases the last couple years?
1:32:13I just couldn't remember.
1:32:14- No, they've been in the like 10.2, 10.3, 10.2,
1:32:19I think actually, yeah.
1:32:21Like a couple of months later.
1:32:22- This isn't a break from precedent then.
1:32:24- Yeah, I mean, you know,
1:32:27You have to wait for your elf emoji, which is coming with the next version.
1:32:32I just want the mind blown one.
1:32:34iOS 11 comes out next week.
1:32:36How are you feeling for the week?
1:32:38Umm...
1:32:41Do we need to talk about it?
1:32:43Like...
1:32:45I mean, we can just gloss right past it and pretend it's not happening if that will make you feel anything.
1:32:49No, I just wanted to say that, of course, the final week is sort of a rush to get everything done.
1:32:55there's still bugs to be fixed, screenshots to be taken, and this year we're working on new
1:33:02extras, new avenues to be explored, so we're also trying to finalize that and more more
1:33:10shall be revealed next week on connected and on max stories and everywhere hopefully.
1:33:18And, but yeah, obviously, you know, six days left means not much sleep will be experienced
1:33:28by my body.
1:33:29Odd way of saying that.
1:33:32It's very weird.
1:33:34This is a real roundabout.
1:33:36What day does it come out?
1:33:37Is it Tuesday the 19th?
1:33:39Yes.
1:33:40Okay.
1:33:41Yes.
1:33:42Okay.
1:33:43Yeah.
1:33:44hopefully a couple of hours before Apple pulls the switch so people have time to
1:33:49check out the review before they rush to update everything. Yep.
1:33:54It's a big day. It's a good review. It's good. Very exciting. Yeah.
1:34:00Alright so we are actually out of time for today. Mostly because Federico has an
1:34:07espresso deficiency right now or something and like there's some words
1:34:11words that are needed. I'm not 100% sure of the reason, I just know that there's
1:34:15some kind of real emergency in regards to I think the sleep that Federico has put into
1:34:21his body or something. Something. His word is in some way like that. So we're gonna
1:34:25hold talking about the Apple Watch and the Apple TV to next week, along with talking
1:34:32about iOS 11. So we've still got an action packed show. I mean there's so much stuff,
1:34:37why not spread it out? We've got a few weeks that we need to fill here before the
1:34:41products come on to our doorstep so we'll talk about the Apple Watch and our opinions
1:34:46on the Apple TV next week. If you want to find our show notes for this week head on
1:34:50over to relay.fm/connected/159 you can find Federico at maxstories.net you should keep
1:34:57your eyes locked to max stories over the next week or so because there's lots of cool stuff
1:35:01happening Federico is @Vittici on Twitter V I T I C C I Stephen is at iasmh and you
1:35:08You can find his work over at 512pixels.net.
1:35:10I know that Steven has finished work on his High Sierra review but that doesn't come out
1:35:14until what, the 25th?
1:35:16The 25th, so I got a couple of weeks but yeah it's ready to go.
1:35:19You're the lucky one.
1:35:20I am.
1:35:22You can find me, I am @imyke on Twitter and yes I do have a cold and yes I am sorry about
1:35:29that.
1:35:30Thanks again to our sponsors this week, the fine folk over at Encapsula, Hover and Blue
1:35:34Apron and we'll be back next time.
1:35:37Until then, say goodbye guys.
1:35:38Adios.
1:35:39Adios.
1:35:41[BLANK_AUDIO]