112: Make a Little Friendship


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:06   From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 112.

00:00:10   Today's show is brought to you by Pearl Reavision.

00:00:14   My name is Myke Hurley, and I have the pleasure, as always, of being joined

00:00:17   from across the pond by Mr. Stephen Hackett.

00:00:19   Hello. And from a smaller pond and in a bunch of land mass, Federico Vittucci.

00:00:25   Hello, guys. Hi, Myke. How are you?

00:00:28   Hi Federico, how are you?

00:00:30   I'm great, I'm great, yeah.

00:00:32   Good stuff, Steven Hackett.

00:00:33   Yes, as keeper of said follow up,

00:00:36   would you be able to boot us right into the show?

00:00:39   Yeah, let's do it.

00:00:40   So we spoke some, in context of the

00:00:43   Pixel phone announcements last week

00:00:45   talking about Google Photos,

00:00:47   and how Pixel customers will get unlimited

00:00:51   Google Photos storage for their full res images,

00:00:54   which is pretty cool, you have to pay for that normally,

00:00:56   from Google.

00:00:57   We were speaking about that and then we kind of brought up iCloud storage a little bit.

00:01:01   So I went off and I put together a blog post talking about everything that you can do with

00:01:08   iCloud storage and the list is like getting on up there as far as the number of items.

00:01:14   You can do your photo library, you can sync files, you can sync your desktop and documents

00:01:18   if you're a risk taker.

00:01:22   Device backups and then of course all your personal data, right?

00:01:24   email calendars, reminders, Safari, keychain entries, etc. Tons of stuff you can put into

00:01:32   iCloud Drive and iCloud storage. And so it's really at this point, and this is not like

00:01:39   a new thought, this is not original, but at this point it's really hurting the experience

00:01:44   of being an iOS user when you run into the limit of that 5GB free plan. And Apple has

00:01:51   has never shared what percentage of iCloud customers

00:01:56   run out of space or how many end up upgrading.

00:02:00   I know just space like in real life.

00:02:02   I know lots of people who at the free five gigs,

00:02:05   usually after they replace an iPhone

00:02:08   and it doesn't clear from their backup

00:02:10   and they just live without iCloud space,

00:02:13   which is like detrimental to the experience

00:02:16   that Apple wants you to have.

00:02:17   So there's some fundamental problems

00:02:19   increasing the free space everybody gets. And the big one is just how data

00:02:24   works, how many hard drives, how much storage Apple can serve. Apple's data center

00:02:30   program, which is really impressive and doesn't get a lot of news coverage,

00:02:35   they've got data centers in North Carolina, they've got one on the West Coast,

00:02:38   they're building one I think in Europe somewhere, they're all powered by solar and wind.

00:02:43   It's a great program, but Apple can't give unlimited amounts of space

00:02:49   away because the physicalities of storing that data just get out of hand.

00:02:53   And so I don't know what Apple should do here but I think they should do

00:02:57   something and maybe they start small and go from five to ten gigs but even that

00:03:02   is a potentially monumental undertaking to offer that but I think

00:03:08   it's different than comparing it to Google Photos where it's a really nice

00:03:12   add-on but you don't have to have it. I think iCloud is becoming so important to

00:03:17   Apple's ecosystem that they're really kind of shooting themselves in the foot with it

00:03:22   at this point.

00:03:23   So my thinking about this right now, like this is a bit of a meme right at the moment

00:03:27   to talk about this. We've moved away as you rightly put in your blog post from talking

00:03:32   about the 16 gigabyte phone to talking about the 5 gigabytes of storage right. We've just

00:03:36   moved that frustration and conversation over to this new thing about gigabytes. Part of

00:03:42   problem that Apple are facing right now is that if you try to use the services

00:03:47   the way that they want you to, everything that you're doing is adding to the

00:03:51   iCloud storage that you have because they put it in one bucket, right? So if

00:03:55   you turn on iCloud photo library like they want you to, then all your photos

00:03:58   are syncing. If you upgrade to Sierra and do everything they want then all your

00:04:02   documents are syncing. So by doing the things that Apple is asking you to do on

00:04:06   your devices, you're gonna reach that 5 gigabytes super fast, right? So like

00:04:11   they're asking you to do more to run their devices with the right experience

00:04:16   that they're looking for but then what it's doing is pushing you immediately

00:04:19   past that 5 gigabytes like if you're turning on iCloud photo library on an

00:04:23   iPhone and an iPad and then turning on the desktop syncing on one Mac that you

00:04:28   have for example right so then you can access it on iOS how many people are

00:04:32   going to hit that 5 gigabytes basically immediately so my thinking would be that

00:04:37   that if I was in charge at Apple, what I would do is I wouldn't be making it for the size

00:04:43   of the device or whatever. I would pick an amount, maybe 5GB, and you get 5GB of free

00:04:49   storage for every device you own. So if you have two iPhones and a Mac, you get 15GB of

00:04:57   iCloud storage. That's how I would do it. And so then you just lock it in every time.

00:05:02   Maybe you increase it to 10GB, but I would give people more for every device that they

00:05:06   they have. Here's an argument that I've seen from quite a few people over

00:05:12   the past couple of weeks and it really gets to me. Basically a lot of people are

00:05:18   saying that because Apple makes money from services then it's not in their

00:05:22   interest to double iCloud storage like the base tier or to make it cheaper

00:05:29   because they're making so much money from services now it's really stupid to

00:05:33   think that Apple would change that.

00:05:36   And I really don't get this argument,

00:05:38   because we all know that Apple is making money from services.

00:05:40   We're not arguing that Apple is not the kind of company

00:05:43   that wants to make money from services

00:05:45   in a different way than Google.

00:05:46   We know that.

00:05:47   We know the numbers, we know the money,

00:05:49   we look at the reports.

00:05:50   What I'm saying is, does it feel right

00:05:54   that Apple is still offering just five gigabytes?

00:05:57   It's not about, hey, but look,

00:05:58   they're making this kind of money.

00:06:00   Does it feel right to have that kind of basic default

00:06:04   iCloud experience, or do we expect better and more

00:06:07   from Apple?

00:06:08   It's not about the money because we can count.

00:06:10   We know the kind of profit that they're making from services.

00:06:13   And we know that Apple is different from Google.

00:06:15   But to look at the numbers and say, yeah,

00:06:16   they're never gonna do that,

00:06:17   it betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of Apple, I think.

00:06:21   I wanna, at least I wanna hope that Apple is the kind

00:06:23   of company that does what's right.

00:06:26   And in my mind, five gigabytes is not right.

00:06:29   it doesn't feel right to the consumer,

00:06:31   it doesn't feel right to the user

00:06:32   because it's an inferior experience.

00:06:36   So it doesn't matter the kind of money they're making

00:06:38   because people are upgrading.

00:06:40   I think that to limit iCloud in that sense

00:06:45   is a worse experience for the customer.

00:06:47   And I think Apple is the kind of company

00:06:49   that wants to make things right

00:06:51   because you could make the same argument

00:06:52   about the 16 gigabyte iPhone.

00:06:55   Apple was making more money

00:06:56   because people were buying different models,

00:06:59   but was it right to have a base version limited to 16 gigabytes?

00:07:03   It doesn't feel right.

00:07:04   And so Apple moved past that.

00:07:06   And I would like to see Apple moving past the 5 gigabytes.

00:07:08   I don't know how, but to say that they're making money

00:07:11   so they're never going to do that,

00:07:13   I think that's really not the right argument to follow.

00:07:16   - I agree completely.

00:07:19   Like, I think at this point, Apple,

00:07:23   if they're making money on services is great, right?

00:07:26   Like that's a great thing,

00:07:27   but we know they make so much money on the hardware

00:07:29   and they can use some of that hardware money

00:07:32   to underwrite the money

00:07:34   that they would be paying for in storage.

00:07:37   I think that that is a perfectly fine thing

00:07:39   to do as a company.

00:07:40   And then also, they continue to make money from people

00:07:44   in their other ways.

00:07:45   It's not just iCloud, it's Apple Music, the App Store.

00:07:48   People continue, they continue to make money from people.

00:07:51   Like the 50 gigabytes here is 99 cents a month.

00:07:56   come on, guys, you can at least put it to 50 gigs, right?

00:08:01   Like, if it costs, if you wanna charge 99 cents a month

00:08:04   for that, you can afford to give people that.

00:08:07   I don't know.

00:08:10   - Yeah, it's time for them to do something, so.

00:08:13   Speaking of the Pixel phone, I've been,

00:08:17   I've not ordered one, I've not joined Myke in that endeavor,

00:08:21   but I have been keeping an eye on the order pages,

00:08:23   And the XL, so the larger phone, has been bouncing back and forth between sold out and

00:08:29   then only being available, I think, in white.

00:08:32   That doesn't really say anything about the number of sales, right?

00:08:35   Like if they only made 100 phones and they only sold 100, then they'd be sold out.

00:08:39   But they are offering a waiting list.

00:08:42   I think it's interesting that they're not just moving the ship dates like back and back

00:08:45   and back like Apple does with the iPhone.

00:08:48   I don't know if they're being conservative in what they're manufacturing to say, "Hey,

00:08:52   We would need to make sure that we have the demand to produce another X number of thousands

00:08:58   of devices.

00:08:59   But I find it interesting that the big one is the one that seems to be doing a little

00:09:04   bit better.

00:09:05   But yeah, so if you want a black or a blue one in the Excel, you just can't do it right

00:09:10   now.

00:09:11   Yeah, I don't know what's going on there, but it looks like at least that they're doing

00:09:15   a good job, right?

00:09:17   Like in theory, it means they're at least selling as many as they thought they would,

00:09:21   or at least that they're executing on their plan the way that they want, you know?

00:09:24   Yeah, I mean, who knows if we'll ever get sales numbers for these things.

00:09:29   I don't know if it'll be something that they need to include in their quarterly reports

00:09:33   or not.

00:09:34   You know, Apple does announce numbers to a degree, so my guess is Google won't, but it

00:09:41   would be interesting to know how it does, especially, you know, in the light of all

00:09:45   the Samsung stuff that people may be looking for alternatives now.

00:09:48   Yeah, could be.

00:09:49   Well, I think the Nexus has always been popular enough anyway, right? They've always done

00:09:54   a decent job, but this one is maybe a little bit more enticing than usual.

00:09:58   I think so.

00:09:59   So Brandon wrote in with a screenshot, which I assume has come from some Google Home product

00:10:05   page somewhere. I don't have a link, but I'm going to assume that Brandon hasn't made this

00:10:10   on his own. Which it seems to indicate that the Google Home will do what I want with timers,

00:10:17   in which you can name timers.

00:10:19   So it has like three options.

00:10:20   Set a timer for 15 minutes, set a 13 minute timer for pizza,

00:10:24   and how much time is left on my pizza timer.

00:10:26   There are like some commands that you can give to Google Home.

00:10:29   This makes me both excited and upset,

00:10:31   because now this is exactly what I'm looking for.

00:10:36   But this isn't like-- I want to see a lot more out

00:10:39   of the product record.

00:10:40   I'm not going to go and buy a Google Home because I

00:10:42   can name timers.

00:10:43   But it is a thing that I really--

00:10:45   You know, it's a little too far, I think,

00:10:49   just for that one feature.

00:10:50   So I'm gonna keep my eye on the Google Home,

00:10:52   if and when it ever arrives in the UK.

00:10:55   I wanna see what it's capable of.

00:10:57   So Steven, yours is on order, right?

00:10:59   It's like, is it December it comes?

00:11:01   - No, no, it's like the end of this month.

00:11:03   - Oh, great, so we'll look forward to that.

00:11:06   You can name all of your timers.

00:11:07   - Yeah, so I've got the Echo,

00:11:08   it's gonna stay in the kitchen.

00:11:09   The plan is to put the Google Home out here in the office

00:11:12   and put 'em head to head through some stuff.

00:11:14   So I'm excited to see how it performs.

00:11:17   - You should try and get them to talk to each other.

00:11:19   - That'd be great.

00:11:20   Make a little friendship.

00:11:22   So we do have an update on the Relay FM sticker pack

00:11:25   that we talked about a couple weeks ago.

00:11:27   It has entered beta with a bunch of our hosts.

00:11:30   It's going really well.

00:11:31   So I'm hoping that we are just around the corner

00:11:34   from shipping it.

00:11:35   You know, it's funny.

00:11:37   I was definitely at the camp that I thought stickers

00:11:39   were gonna be a fad, and maybe they still will be.

00:11:42   But so far, it seems that the usage has been pretty steady

00:11:46   amongst my friends, and not just the two of you.

00:11:49   Real people are using them.

00:11:52   And so I think that maybe they are here to stay

00:11:55   a little bit more than I initially thought.

00:11:57   But you will soon be able to send little pictures

00:12:00   of Federico and the Viticci Silo quality

00:12:03   through the Relay app.

00:12:04   - So go download the Relay FM app.

00:12:06   I'll put a link in the show notes

00:12:08   in case you don't already have it,

00:12:09   and there will be an update coming.

00:12:11   very very soon about this so you'll be able to go and get it for yourself.

00:12:15   Alright let's take a break and thank our sponsor for this week's episode. It's a new

00:12:19   sponsor for the show and that is Pearl.

00:12:21   And today I want to talk about the Pearl rear vision

00:12:24   backup camera. Pearl is a company that believes

00:12:28   that the latest in automotive technology should be available

00:12:31   to everyone regardless of whether it's time for you to buy a new car

00:12:35   regardless of whether you had a car for multiple years. This is why they created the

00:12:39   rear vision.

00:12:40   Pearl's founders all met at Apple, they worked on the iPod, they worked on the iPhone

00:12:45   and then they came together after their time there to put their focus on automotive technology.

00:12:50   This is what they were really kind of passionate about and interested about.

00:12:53   The rear vision is an advanced backup camera and alert system that you can install on any

00:12:58   car in just minutes.

00:13:00   It's all wireless and solar powered which is amazing and it's a camera frame.

00:13:04   So you have this camera frame that has these dual HD cameras, they work in both day and

00:13:08   night and you just install them on your license plate. Super, super easy to do and it has

00:13:13   fantastic wide angle views. You never need to worry about batteries because it has that

00:13:17   solar power, which is I think that's just a really smart thing that there's no way you

00:13:21   have to plug it in. You don't have to take it off and plug it into charge by USB like

00:13:25   it just is solar powered. So it's always good. It's always ready to go. It's theft resistant

00:13:29   installs securely around your license plate, and you connect wirelessly to an adapter that

00:13:34   that you plug into your car's ODB port.

00:13:37   And then that's what sends the connections to

00:13:39   and then to the app.

00:13:39   It's super, super simple.

00:13:41   So, Steven, what was it like to install

00:13:43   and kind of how have you felt using the Rivadon?

00:13:46   - It's super easy to install.

00:13:48   So it comes in this really nice box

00:13:50   of very simple instructions.

00:13:52   You take your license plate off,

00:13:53   you put this frame up around it.

00:13:55   If you change the license plate, you know,

00:13:57   at least here in the States, just a couple of,

00:13:59   you know, usually big Phillips head screws.

00:14:02   Super easy to install.

00:14:04   It just really goes together really nicely.

00:14:06   The fit and finish, like the polish on the hardware

00:14:09   is like unbelievably nice.

00:14:11   And it's great.

00:14:13   So we put it on our family minivan,

00:14:15   which does not have a backup camera.

00:14:17   And it's always bothered me.

00:14:18   We've got kids in the neighborhood and dogs

00:14:20   and we have to cross the sidewalk to get to the street.

00:14:23   And knowing that we now have like another view

00:14:27   to make sure that nothing bad is gonna happen

00:14:30   is really nice.

00:14:32   And you would never know that it was like

00:14:34   a backup camera frame, like it just looks like a nice,

00:14:38   you know, frame you put around your license plate.

00:14:40   But having that peace of mind that we can

00:14:42   quickly open the iPhone and double check

00:14:45   that nothing's behind us with that nice,

00:14:47   really clear, wide angle picture,

00:14:50   it just is a nice peace of mind.

00:14:52   And we're doing it without the expense of like

00:14:55   bolting the super nerdy thing to the back of the car.

00:14:57   Like you would never know that all this technology

00:14:59   was packed into it.

00:15:01   The Pearl rear vision utilises advanced image processing.

00:15:04   The adapter processes the video and streams it to the Pearl app on your iPhone.

00:15:09   It can also use the camera frame to detect obstacles in your path and provides audio

00:15:13   and visual alerts straight to the app.

00:15:16   When you've got the app open you can pan around so you can take a look at what's around you,

00:15:21   see all obstacles and even peek around corners.

00:15:26   They also get a mount for your phone so you can mount your phone so you can take a look

00:15:29   at it right so you get a little mount that you can install into the car so you can put

00:15:32   your phone up so you don't need to be holding your phone when you're doing this as well

00:15:34   which is just additional safety which I think is really cool.

00:15:37   To find out more about the Pearl rear vision camera just go to pearlauto.com/connected

00:15:43   that's p-e-a-r-l-a-u-t-o dot com slash connected.

00:15:48   Listeners of this show get free two day shipping and this will be applied automatically when

00:15:52   you go and check out by visiting pearlauto.com/connected.

00:15:58   Thank you so much to Pearl and their rear vision camera for supporting this show and

00:16:02   Relay FM.

00:16:04   Alright so I was very happy to see some little reviews come out from my co-hosts over the

00:16:11   last few days.

00:16:12   Federico you have spoken about your experiences using the iPhone 7 which you got on loan from

00:16:19   Apple. I think we spoke about it a little bit last week. But you kind of went down a

00:16:23   different route than maybe some other reviews would go, especially because you've had, you

00:16:28   know, it's like a few weeks since the product's been out. So kind of what led to your thinking

00:16:32   and what things did you want to focus on?

00:16:35   So Apple gave me this review unit a week after the iPhone 7 actually came out. And they didn't

00:16:42   have an iPhone 7 Plus, so I was a little surprised. But, you know, we have a supply problem in

00:16:48   Italy and I guess in the rest of Europe as well. So I was okay with testing the iPhone 7.

00:16:53   I was a little skeptical, but then I realized I'm gonna need a couple of weeks, you know, to

00:16:58   test this phone to see how it works for me.

00:17:01   And especially to understand this change from a big phone to a small phone.

00:17:05   And so I thought by the time I'm gonna get ready to publish an article

00:17:10   it's gonna be almost a month since the iPhone 7 came out. And so how can I

00:17:16   put together a story because I want to share my thoughts without falling into the obvious, you know, without repeating

00:17:22   what other people said. And I know that it's not necessarily a problem, right?

00:17:25   That, you know,

00:17:28   struggling to be original can sometimes be a detriment to my process, you know.

00:17:33   I gotta be different from anybody else at all costs, and that's a problem.

00:17:38   But this time, as I was using the iPhone, and as I, you know, I bought some accessories that

00:17:45   were not included with the iPhone, such as the Beats Solo 3 and the smart battery case for the iPhone 7.

00:17:51   I realized I'm trying these things and in the reviews that I read last month,

00:17:56   these aspects of the experience were not as deeply

00:18:00   focused on these features. Those reviews didn't mention these aspects and I feel like from my personal experience

00:18:08   these are things, you know, wireless audio, white color, the battery case,

00:18:14   using the Beats Solo 3, the W1 chip, I feel like these are key aspects of the

00:18:22   iPhone 7 experience that are available today and they're gonna be a big deal in

00:18:26   the future. So I try to develop this angle of I feel like there's some

00:18:31   features, you know, beyond the design, the headphone jack, the cameras, of course the

00:18:37   7 Plus I couldn't try, but beyond the obvious aspects that people

00:18:41   mentioning the original reviews. And this is not a slide to those reviews because there's

00:18:46   utility in the embargo review. I did that in the past with the iPhone Pro, for example.

00:18:51   I know that there's value in providing a basic overview of what's new. But weeks later, when

00:18:58   the dust settles, are there aspects that I want to focus on? And so this idea of the

00:19:04   iPhone 7 feels like a phone from the future kind of started to gain traction in my mind,

00:19:11   And I tried to go from there.

00:19:13   And I think I did a good job, at least I hope people liked it.

00:19:17   And it was successful, not as big as the iOS 10 review, of course, because that's like

00:19:21   an event.

00:19:22   But I'm happy with the output and I feel like a lot of people didn't consider those aspects.

00:19:29   And I got a few emails and a bunch of tweets from people saying, "I want to buy the Beats

00:19:34   headphones because I want to try the W1 chip."

00:19:36   And of course, everybody's starting to get excited for the AirPods, which are also going

00:19:40   have the W1 chip. So I think, you know, most of the time I try not to fall into the trap

00:19:47   of "I gotta be different and I gotta be original otherwise people won't care about me", but

00:19:52   this time I think that approach paid off.

00:19:55   I think the thing that's interesting about the tech that you took was you were kind of

00:19:59   talking about aspects of the phone that, you know, they aren't necessarily the sexiest,

00:20:03   they're not like the newest things, but they're the things that people will use every day.

00:20:08   Especially now, we all need to start considering

00:20:12   a little bit more than we used to wireless headphones.

00:20:15   I think many, many people use them, but not everybody.

00:20:18   But now we're kind of being nudged

00:20:20   towards wireless headphones as more of a thing.

00:20:22   And now there's some new technology

00:20:25   which seems to be making them better.

00:20:27   So focusing on that is a really good thing.

00:20:29   Because as well, all of the reviews that came out,

00:20:32   the Solo 3 I don't think were out yet,

00:20:34   and people had the AirPods

00:20:35   but couldn't talk about them so much.

00:20:37   So you've been able to focus on that in a different way,

00:20:39   but also something like the battery case.

00:20:41   Now, you know, the battery case you spoke about at the time,

00:20:44   we've made fun of it a bunch because it is ugly as sin,

00:20:47   because it's weird looking, but I've seen one,

00:20:49   I've held on the same way as you have,

00:20:51   and I know people that have them

00:20:52   and think that they're really cool.

00:20:53   It's like, great, go for it.

00:20:54   Like, if it works for you.

00:20:56   So I think it's really interesting,

00:20:58   like to look at a review in this sense of like,

00:21:00   this is the review of someone

00:21:02   who's been using it for a bit,

00:21:04   but also that focuses on some things

00:21:06   that you can now look at doing with your phone

00:21:10   that you're gonna be dealing with on a daily basis.

00:21:12   There was one thing though, like if you're reading

00:21:14   through this, like there are, in your review,

00:21:17   there are three products that require charging.

00:21:20   And there's also a screenshot where you've got

00:21:25   like the batteries widget and it has your iPhone,

00:21:27   your case and your watch.

00:21:29   And I guess if your headphones were connected as well,

00:21:31   it would have that too.

00:21:32   I think you actually tweeted like a picture of this recently

00:21:36   of like all of your battery things connected.

00:21:38   - Yeah.

00:21:39   - And again, it's like, you know,

00:21:41   this is just where we are right now.

00:21:42   We're in a kind of a battery transition, I hope,

00:21:45   like that there's better battery technology,

00:21:48   hopefully on our future.

00:21:49   But it's just a thing right now where it just frustrates me,

00:21:52   like that I have to think about so many things

00:21:55   that need charging.

00:21:56   It's just like, I hate our battery present, you know,

00:22:02   it just really frustrates me.

00:22:04   Yeah, and ideally, I feel like there's a two-step process here.

00:22:09   Ideally, every device that connects to the iPhone will eventually move to the low power

00:22:14   consumption of something like the W1 chip, right?

00:22:17   Because if something lasts 40 hours, you don't have to charge as frequently, but you still

00:22:22   have to charge.

00:22:23   Yeah, and infrequent charging can be...

00:22:26   It's probably worse than frequent charging.

00:22:28   It is.

00:22:29   Because you forget about it.

00:22:30   Right?

00:22:31   This was the problem I always have with my Pebble.

00:22:32   once every week or so because it had like a seven-day battery life so I never

00:22:37   thought about charging it so it would just die on me in the middle of the day.

00:22:39   My Apple Watch has never done that because I put it on its charging stand

00:22:43   every night. Right? So the second step would be we just gotta get rid of the

00:22:48   habit of manual charging with the cable and there has to be in the future I

00:22:52   don't know 10 years 15 years from now maybe five years maybe next year I have

00:22:56   no idea but there has to be something that you just put something on your desk

00:23:00   and there's like a wireless charging...

00:23:02   - Well this stuff exists, right?

00:23:04   Like there are a bunch of phones that use this.

00:23:05   Like IKEA sell this range of desks

00:23:08   that have these charging pads in them.

00:23:11   Like I want one of those.

00:23:12   - Even beyond charging pads,

00:23:13   because you still gotta remember to put it on the pad,

00:23:16   that's better than having a cable,

00:23:19   but ideally in the future there'll be like a power lamp

00:23:22   in your bedroom and it goes off

00:23:24   to charge everything wirelessly all the time.

00:23:26   I don't know if that's gonna give you cancer, probably.

00:23:29   Maybe not, hopefully.

00:23:30   They're figured out. - Very, very likely.

00:23:31   (laughing)

00:23:33   - But you know, it's like stuff from the Jetsons, right?

00:23:36   You have a charging lamp that propagates power

00:23:38   across the room.

00:23:40   That's the idealistic future.

00:23:42   Well, Cyr, you know, I think personally,

00:23:45   decades away from that.

00:23:47   But maybe, you know, moving away from cables,

00:23:49   having these low-power chips, I think that will help.

00:23:52   And especially now, it's a weird transition phase

00:23:55   because you have the iPhone with the lightning cable

00:23:59   and then you have the Beats with the micro USB.

00:24:02   So you gotta remember to put in different adapters,

00:24:04   different cables, and it's difficult.

00:24:07   It can be basically battery management.

00:24:09   That's what you're doing.

00:24:10   You're managing your batteries.

00:24:12   And so Apple wants to make it easier with widgets

00:24:14   and with the reminders, with low power mode,

00:24:17   with the battery case, but you still gotta remember

00:24:19   to pack a bunch of cables and a bunch of adapters

00:24:21   if you wanna go travel and make sure

00:24:23   that you don't run out of juice.

00:24:24   And that's one of my things as being a relatively frequent traveler is my travel bag is getting

00:24:31   heavier and heavier as I'm adding more and more cables to it, more and more adapters.

00:24:37   Then I have to get some device that has five USB chargers on it because there is no hotel

00:24:43   room in the world that will give me enough outlets.

00:24:47   It just continues to add up and add up over time.

00:24:50   And I understand the benefits of this stuff.

00:24:52   I haven't got any Bluetooth headphones that I really like to use yet.

00:24:55   I'm hoping that AirPods will be that thing for me.

00:25:00   Otherwise I'm probably going to get some of these Beats ones that you've used here, especially

00:25:04   for plane travel and stuff.

00:25:08   But it's just so many batteries.

00:25:10   Yeah, I know.

00:25:12   I'm really excited for the AirPods.

00:25:15   I generally believe it's the piece of hardware that I'm most excited about this year besides

00:25:20   PlayStation VR.

00:25:21   that will be the AirPods. If only because there's so many different parts of my life where I'm just

00:25:26   walking around and I want to have headphones, but not you know the beats type of headphones all the

00:25:31   time. Especially when I'm lying in bed at night, the AirPods just seem perfect so I can listen to

00:25:37   music, I can listen to podcasts without you know having these big headphones on my head.

00:25:41   If they work for me, if they're comfortable, if they don't fall off, I think that that'll be the

00:25:48   the sweet spot for me, but maybe not.

00:25:52   So I guess we'll find out in just a few weeks,

00:25:54   because late October is approaching quickly.

00:25:57   So we're halfway through, basically.

00:26:00   - And Steven, you spent some time

00:26:02   with your non-hissing, non-fizzing 7+, right?

00:26:06   - I did, so my review's a little more traditional

00:26:09   than Federico's, kind of looking at.

00:26:11   You know all the high points you would look at

00:26:12   in a new phone?

00:26:16   - Reading Federico's, where we really overlap

00:26:21   is the idea that for some reason, this iPhone,

00:26:26   finally, I think for both of us, crosses the line

00:26:29   into true pocket computer type territory.

00:26:34   That maybe it's the additional RAM and the plus,

00:26:37   or maybe it's that the camera's so good,

00:26:39   or maybe the speed is so much better.

00:26:41   Something about this generation really feels like

00:26:45   this is not just a phone anymore,

00:26:46   but it is a computer that's with me all the time.

00:26:50   And it's not because I've drastically changed

00:26:52   how I work on my phone.

00:26:53   It's not because it's the first big phone I've had.

00:26:55   I've had both the 6 and the 6S Plus

00:26:58   because Myke was right.

00:27:00   - Yeah, what's up?

00:27:01   - But something about this year really,

00:27:03   this phone feels different and it feels like the power

00:27:07   or the smoothness, something about it

00:27:09   has just crossed that threshold in my mind

00:27:12   that it's more than an iPhone.

00:27:13   Yeah, I've been using mine a lot more than I've been using an iPhone in the past at home.

00:27:19   And again, I don't know why that I'm doing that.

00:27:22   I don't know if it's the newness factor, but I've been using my iPads less at home and

00:27:26   using my iPhone more for things, you know, like just reading and browsing.

00:27:30   And I don't know what it is.

00:27:31   I think part of it is I'm currently engrossed in PewDiePie's Tuba Simulator, and that's

00:27:36   only on my iPhone.

00:27:37   So I keep carrying the iPhone around so I can go in and publish all my videos.

00:27:41   It's hilarious.

00:27:42   it's a great game by the way, I actually really recommend it. It's probably the best free

00:27:46   to play mechanic game that I've ever played. So anyway, that might be why I'm carrying

00:27:50   my iPhone around more than normal, but it is a really really great device.

00:27:55   One thing for me that I think has led to that is the speakers being better, where if I was

00:28:01   listening to a podcast around the house, I would drag my iPad Pro behind me, and the

00:28:06   phone is so much louder. It's not as good as an iPad speaker, it's not even close, but

00:28:12   but it is so much better than the old iPhone,

00:28:14   it's good enough.

00:28:15   - Yep.

00:28:16   - And I don't know, maybe that's really what,

00:28:19   one of the big reasons is for me,

00:28:21   but you know, the iPhone's been around for nine years.

00:28:26   The iPhone 7, just like every other iPhone before it,

00:28:30   is the best one ever, right?

00:28:31   Like, it's amazing that in nine years,

00:28:36   they really haven't had a device

00:28:37   that wasn't a worthwhile upgrade,

00:28:40   especially if you do every two years,

00:28:42   but even every year there's always something for people.

00:28:46   And I think that's super impressive.

00:28:48   And the iPhone 7, and especially the 7 Plus in my opinion,

00:28:52   fall right into that category of like,

00:28:54   you know the 6S was a really good phone,

00:28:56   but the 7 takes everything about it and makes it better.

00:28:59   - In most ways.

00:29:00   - Yeah, I mean, yeah, there's always a few trade-offs,

00:29:03   right, like the headphone jack is I think a bigger deal

00:29:05   than maybe Federico thinks, but it's,

00:29:10   If you can deal with it, then it's a worthwhile upgrade, no doubt.

00:29:17   I maintain my position that it's the weirdest iPhone.

00:29:22   I just think it's so weird.

00:29:23   I really love it, but there's just things that they've done with it that are weird to

00:29:27   me.

00:29:28   And they continue to be weird, right?

00:29:30   The home button is weird.

00:29:32   Plugging my headphones into the Lightning port is weird.

00:29:36   It feels super strange.

00:29:37   And they're a little buggy as well.

00:29:39   Like every now and then, I'll move my phone in a certain way and the audio cuts out and

00:29:43   it's like, "Mm, lightning port, what are you doing?"

00:29:46   I haven't had that.

00:29:47   I just think it's because the connection maybe isn't as strong or deep, I don't know, as

00:29:52   the headphone port.

00:29:53   Maybe it's like disconnecting every little while.

00:29:55   Or you may just have a funny set of ear pods.

00:29:57   There is also that possibility.

00:30:00   Where I really was struck with that when I was out of town a couple weeks ago to release

00:30:03   notes I inadvertently left my 3.5 millimeter earpods at home so the only

00:30:11   ear ear pods I had with me were my lightning pair and I had a had a big set

00:30:16   of headphones in my suitcase because I was doing some podcasting there but like

00:30:19   on the plane all I had were my lightning ear pods and I wanted to watch some TV

00:30:24   on my iPad and I was like oh no what am I gonna do and then I remembered I can

00:30:28   just plug them into the lightning port on my iPad and it worked totally fine

00:30:32   fine but that was really a strange feeling.

00:30:35   Yeah it's weird.

00:30:36   This doesn't go together.

00:30:38   Every time I plug my headphones into my phone it's like this isn't the right connector.

00:30:42   It's a very strange, like every time I'm like this is weird and then I do it and then it's

00:30:47   okay.

00:30:48   Everything's fine.

00:30:49   But yeah I mean I don't know.

00:30:52   I know that I'm maybe just being a little bit like stuck in the mud about Bluetooth

00:30:58   just because I've never really had a great Bluetooth experience but it's probably because

00:31:02   I haven't owned good enough Bluetooth headphones.

00:31:05   You know, like the Bluetooth headphones that I own,

00:31:08   these Sennheiser ones, they sound so bad.

00:31:13   Like the connection's just terrible.

00:31:15   I'm hoping that, you know, and I know that Federico,

00:31:19   you've really enjoyed the Beats Solo, guys.

00:31:22   So I'm looking forward to trying out a better experience

00:31:26   with AirPods and then moving on from there

00:31:30   and probably replacing my travel headphones

00:31:33   with some Bluetooth headphones as well.

00:31:35   I might get the Beats ones because they've got

00:31:37   that really, really long battery life, right?

00:31:39   Like I just don't wanna have to think about it.

00:31:41   Like a 10 hour battery life on a pair of headphones

00:31:44   is not enough for me, right?

00:31:46   Because I go on flights frequently that are longer than that

00:31:50   and I don't wanna have to deal with that.

00:31:52   So a 40 hour battery life, if they can really achieve that,

00:31:55   and I know that you had great success with that Federico,

00:31:58   Like that's the type of product that I want to see, you know.

00:32:00   So I'm hoping that Apple really is making it easier

00:32:04   with this W1 chip.

00:32:05   And I am very interested to see where this continues to go.

00:32:10   I know that Federico, you had like some feelings about,

00:32:13   you know, your belief that Apple will work

00:32:16   with other people maybe, and that we'll see more like

00:32:19   maybe some Bose headphones or whatever

00:32:21   with these things in them.

00:32:23   I am less optimistic than this,

00:32:25   but I really hope that they do do that.

00:32:27   so there is more choice within the iPhone line

00:32:30   rather than just Beats or just AirPods.

00:32:33   - Yeah, mine is an uninformed guess,

00:32:36   but it just feels like it's in Apple's best interest

00:32:39   to make sure that the W1 chip

00:32:42   stays exclusive to Apple devices, of course,

00:32:44   stays exclusive to the iPhone, to the iPad and the Mac,

00:32:47   uses iCloud accounts for syncing, the pairing information,

00:32:51   but it feels like Apple cannot make all of the headphones

00:32:53   in the world that people like, that people love.

00:32:55   They cannot make Bose headphones, they cannot make B&O headphones.

00:32:59   So it feels like it's the type of opportunity, slightly different than HomeKit, which is

00:33:04   basically open to everyone.

00:33:06   Kind of modeled after the MI5 program, where Apple works with selected companies, you know,

00:33:12   high-end audio makers, basically, to make headphones that take advantage of the W1 chip,

00:33:17   but that also are not AirPods and are not Beats headphones.

00:33:20   And I feel like if they're not gonna do that, that's a missed opportunity.

00:33:23   Because again, maybe Apple is thinking, well, we want everyone to use AirPods and Beats,

00:33:27   but there's people who don't want to use those headphones, and to those people, which I believe

00:33:31   are quite enough people, it could be a serious benefit to have W1 experience propagate to

00:33:36   different types of headphones.

00:33:38   Because it's a better audio experience than Bluetooth.

00:33:42   That's basically it.

00:33:43   You don't have to think about pairing, you don't have to worry about battery life as

00:33:46   much.

00:33:47   Range is impressive.

00:33:49   And it feels like they're just limiting themselves if they don't at least collaborate with some

00:33:54   companies.

00:33:55   I'm not arguing that Apple should open up the standard and allow everyone to make W1

00:33:59   headphones.

00:34:00   They're not going to try to replace Bluetooth because it's just they call it a secret sauce

00:34:04   on top of Bluetooth.

00:34:05   But they're basically doing their own custom process.

00:34:07   I know.

00:34:08   I hate it so much.

00:34:10   You know, custom software and hardware on top of Bluetooth.

00:34:13   And that feels like the type of optimisation for the iPhone that other companies could

00:34:19   jump in and maybe work with Apple to provide a better experience.

00:34:23   I thoroughly hope you're right. Do you think that they're using Wi-Fi as well with these?

00:34:28   Is that, do you reckon that's what may be helping the range?

00:34:31   I don't know. Because I thought about it and I'm home and I'm walking around and range

00:34:37   is amazing. But then when you go out and when you're just using Bluetooth, it's also amazing.

00:34:44   So I don't know what they're doing. But you're not leaving it so far away though, are you?

00:34:48   I could probably try to walk like 20 meters away from my iPhone, but then it's gonna be

00:34:53   unattended, so I should probably try with Sylvia. Yeah, you say to Sylvia, "Just wait

00:34:57   there a moment," and then you jog off, and then you see how long it lasts for. This is

00:35:03   This is a test that only you can do, Federico.

00:35:05   Yeah, I can try. I don't know if it's like in everyday life, why would you ever need

00:35:11   that? You know, you leave your iPhone on the menu.

00:35:12   Oh no, it's not because it's a feature we need. It's just the wonder of like, is it

00:35:17   using Wi-Fi? Like, is that what is helping you get the range? Like, because you're at

00:35:22   your home, right? So if it's using Wi-Fi in some way, then maybe, you know, that might

00:35:28   be how it's keeping the connection. Because Apple haven't made Bluetooth technology better,

00:35:32   Right, like they, you know, that's not what they're doing here.

00:35:36   They're adding on to Bluetooth, right?

00:35:38   Like they haven't created like the best ever Bluetooth chip.

00:35:41   They're doing something else with it, right?

00:35:44   Like it's, you know, they haven't just made, because otherwise Bluetooth would be

00:35:49   better in general, but it's not like that.

00:35:50   They're this, this additional stuff that they've added on top of it, I think is

00:35:55   their own technology and it's, it's maybe something along the lines of what

00:35:59   continuity, you know, how that works.

00:36:00   Yeah.

00:36:01   AirDrop works, right?

00:36:02   using their Wi-Fi technology I believe in some way to help make this better.

00:36:06   But it's way better than AirDrop, much more reliable. And I came across some bugs, I talked

00:36:12   about it on Twitter, I was really upset initially, but I figured that it was my fault, because

00:36:17   one I was using a beta, and that's not really the problem. The problem was I was using the

00:36:21   beta and then I downgraded to iOS 10 stable.

00:36:24   Yeah, we spoke about this, didn't we?

00:36:26   Could fix this, and it wasn't really the solution. So once I moved back to the beta, and especially

00:36:31   with 10.1 beta 2, much much better. Basically being perfect, I can switch between devices

00:36:37   with like 2 seconds from Control Center. And it's amazing, I never had that kind of setup

00:36:41   with Bluetooth headphones at all. So they're doing good stuff with the W1, but I'm curious

00:36:47   to see if we're going to see more beyond beats and AirPods.

00:36:51   Yeah, I wish that the other beats stuff was for sale. Like I've got a pair, they may be

00:36:56   the originals, or maybe the two of the Powerbeats, you know, they're earbuds but they have little

00:37:02   hooks that go over your ears. And they're great for working out or running because they're

00:37:06   not going to fall off. And I would like to check them out with the new stuff, but they're

00:37:11   not, there's not even a ship date availability coming this fall on Apple's website today.

00:37:17   So you know, maybe the AirPods, I gotta get that name straight in my brain, my guess is

00:37:26   those will ship first and like I'm gonna order a pair I'm looking forward to

00:37:29   trying the Federico like you I've only grown in my interest about what they

00:37:35   will be like I've gotten to use them very briefly but I think they're gonna

00:37:41   be really interesting but I don't want to work out with them I don't want to

00:37:44   run with them I like that the power beats go over your ear and so they're not

00:37:47   gonna come flying out very easily but you can't get them yet so you know it's

00:37:52   It's very early days in this stuff, but I think that it's promising that the people

00:37:58   who have had experience with it so far have been impressed that it's not just snake oil.

00:38:02   It seems like it really is an upgrade from where we have been with Bluetooth headphones.

00:38:10   Even the Powerbeats 2, they're okay.

00:38:13   They don't sound great and the connection range is kind of not great.

00:38:20   like using them and if your phone is like in your pocket or in your bag like

00:38:25   you know with you sometimes it can drop out or get staticky like it's not very

00:38:29   far away and I would look forward to seeing you know what they would be like

00:38:34   with this new this new tech from Apple so I'm definitely interested in it I

00:38:39   think that it's something that could be you know Apple is pushing us into this

00:38:44   wireless world Myke like you were saying like you haven't really been

00:38:48   been interested in this before, you've had an experience that's not super great, but

00:38:52   now we're here because of the product decision they made with the iPhone 7.

00:38:55   Yeah, I have no choice but to pay attention now.

00:38:58   Right, exactly. So hopefully they're delivering on the other side of it.

00:39:01   Over the last couple of months there have been continued changes in the App Store. We

00:39:05   spoke a little bit about subscription models, and then I think the company that everyone

00:39:11   was expecting to go down the subscription model route, the OmniGroup, has done something

00:39:19   ever so slightly different. So can one of you kind of sum up what the OmniGroup are

00:39:24   up to?

00:39:25   >> Yeah, so they're switching to a different model that I guess we were expecting. Instead

00:39:31   of going with subscriptions and, you know, asking everyone to subscribe to OmniFocus

00:39:36   or a hominid planner, they're taking advantage of in-app purchases and the way receipt validation

00:39:42   works for developers to, I don't want to say fake, but basically implement a new way to

00:39:49   do free trials, a limited feature set for two weeks, and then if you want to continue

00:39:54   using an app, you gotta unlock the full feature set once with a single in-app purchase.

00:40:00   And if you don't want to unlock the app, it's gonna remain on your device, but it's only

00:40:04   only going to be used as a viewer. So you can only view files of that type shared with

00:40:09   you. And this, of course, I'm not sure how it applies to OmniFocus because you don't

00:40:12   share tasks as files with OmniFocus.

00:40:15   Yet.

00:40:15   But they're starting with... yet, exactly. But we're starting with, I think, OmniGraffle

00:40:19   launching today on the apps, in fact, the new version of OmniGraffle 7. And it's interesting

00:40:25   because these technologies have been around for a while. So developers have been able

00:40:29   to validate receipts to do free apps with in-app purchases for years now.

00:40:35   But it only seems recent, at least a recent development or maybe a sort of new awareness

00:40:41   from developers to be able to say, "Look, we're going to have a free app on the App

00:40:45   Store.

00:40:46   We're going to give you a free trial.

00:40:47   That free trial is an in-app purchase set at tier zero.

00:40:51   So zero dollars.

00:40:52   It's free.

00:40:53   And it lasts for two weeks.

00:40:55   After that, we're going to remove the trial.

00:40:57   It's a non-renewable purchase, right?

00:40:58   - So in the real world, it's a single purchase.

00:41:00   You basically unlock the free In-App Purchase.

00:41:03   So you unlock the free trial and it lasts two weeks.

00:41:07   After that, either you unlock the full feature set

00:41:09   of the app or you just keep it installed,

00:41:12   but it's gonna be free and limited

00:41:13   because you cannot only view stuff,

00:41:14   you cannot create stuff anymore.

00:41:16   And it's basically the shareware model all over again,

00:41:20   but done with In-App Purchases instead.

00:41:23   And it's not just the Omni Group,

00:41:25   because I feel like after the Omni Group announcement,

00:41:28   which a lot of people paid attention to because it's,

00:41:30   you know, OmniGroup is the poster child

00:41:32   of making money on the App Store,

00:41:33   especially the iOS App Store.

00:41:35   To-do announced that they're going free as well

00:41:38   with in-app purchases.

00:41:39   They're starting with Android,

00:41:41   so they're doing the same model,

00:41:42   free with a free in-app purchase to unlock the trial.

00:41:45   After that, you gotta unlock the full feature set

00:41:48   with another single in-app purchase.

00:41:51   So it's not a subscription, and To-do says,

00:41:53   "We're gonna consider other platforms if this goes well."

00:41:56   And it's interesting to me because for many many years we've been arguing Apple should implement what other developers have been doing for ages for Mac software.

00:42:05   Which is you download the free app, there's a trial and then you buy the app.

00:42:10   And what the Omni Group is doing here and what Todo is also doing is basically the same thing but the model, the technology is different.

00:42:19   And I still don't know if this is Apple, if this is something that Apple is officially happy about,

00:42:26   if they received guidance from Apple to follow this route.

00:42:29   I'm gonna guess yes. And the reason I think this is, do you remember when the Omni group tried to

00:42:34   use the App Store receipts to activate their own version, right? It was like they were using,

00:42:42   if you bought it in the Mac App Store, you would unlock the OmniFocus downloaded version

00:42:47   for free, right, if you download it from their website, and that got killed.

00:42:52   So my thinking would be that OmniFocus wouldn't do this unless they knew it was gonna be okay.

00:43:01   - Yeah. - Right?

00:43:03   Like, because this is such a big, this is like a huge change for their business model,

00:43:09   one that I think they know that they wanted to do that.

00:43:13   Like, you know, this is something that the Omni group knows they need to do because their

00:43:17   apps are expensive for the App Store, right? Like $40 a pop or something for some of them.

00:43:22   Free trials are almost essential for them to continue, I think, because they need people

00:43:28   to be able to try their software without paying high prices to get in the door.

00:43:33   And this will allow that. Like, you know, we talk about OmniFocus a lot and I have people say to me,

00:43:39   like can you tell me how good it is? Can you tell me if it does this? Can you tell me if

00:43:44   it does that? Because people want to make sure that their purchase is okay before they

00:43:48   go ahead and buy it, right? So I think that this is a really good way for them to just

00:43:54   say, well, hell, now just download it and find out yourself and you've got two weeks

00:43:58   to try it. Two weeks is a good trial time and you can find out if it's good for you.

00:44:01   I think this is really good for them, but I do believe that they've, that they have

00:44:06   with Apple beforehand to make sure it works because, I mean, if they hadn't, that's kind

00:44:11   of crazy.

00:44:12   Like, that would be a bad decision.

00:44:14   You know why it feels strange?

00:44:16   I guess it's because we went from the sort of narrative where you cannot do free trials

00:44:20   on the App Store, it's impossible, Apple is not working with indie developers to do this,

00:44:26   to "we have a working solution without any announcement from Apple and we're using the

00:44:31   stuff that's already in place with in-app purchases" and suddenly everyone realizes

00:44:35   "Oh, we can do free trials on the App Store."

00:44:37   It's just a major change in the things we believed

00:44:40   about pricing apps on the iOS App Store.

00:44:43   And suddenly the Omni Group comes out and be like,

00:44:46   "Well, there you go, we're gonna switch to free trials."

00:44:49   And everyone's okay with it.

00:44:51   And it's just, it's a major change for the Omni Group,

00:44:54   but also for the entire, you know, how many articles,

00:44:56   how many podcast episodes we've done about sustainability

00:44:59   of indie software on the App Store,

00:45:01   of pro software on the App Store,

00:45:03   with developers not being able to give trials to people.

00:45:06   We've been talking about this stuff for years,

00:45:08   and now it's possible, and there's no,

00:45:11   it's not like a major launch from Apple.

00:45:13   There's no dedicated webpage about,

00:45:16   you can now do free trials

00:45:17   and then let people try your software.

00:45:20   It's stuff that's already available to developers,

00:45:22   and I don't know, maybe the OmniGroup just figured it out,

00:45:25   or maybe Apple just went to them and was like,

00:45:27   "Hey, you know, you can actually do this now

00:45:29   "because we're okay with it."

00:45:31   Maybe that was it, maybe it was not the case,

00:45:33   but anyway, this is gonna be a thing now.

00:45:36   And I feel like-

00:45:37   - My expectation is that this is just

00:45:39   an incredibly complicated thing to get right.

00:45:42   - Probably, probably, because you're dealing

00:45:44   with received validation, in-app purchases set to free.

00:45:47   And so it can be complex when you're dealing

00:45:50   with people with multiple currencies.

00:45:52   Of course, it's limited to individual accounts.

00:45:54   So family sharing cannot,

00:45:56   once you unlock an in-app purchase on one device,

00:46:00   members of your family sharing setup cannot access that In-App Purchase.

00:46:03   So if I buy the new OmniGraffle and I unlock the complete feature set within In-App Purchase,

00:46:09   Silvia, who is part of my family sharing plan, will not be able to unlock that In-App Purchase

00:46:14   because In-App Purchase is still not available to family sharing.

00:46:17   So it comes with a bunch of limitations, it comes with a bunch of complex things to make sure that they're working right.

00:46:22   I mean, it does sound like a better deal overall for people like the Omni Group

00:46:29   because they're able to say, "Look, we have a $200 app on the iPad, which sounds crazy,

00:46:35   but now you can try it for free for two weeks." So, you know, I think it's going to be beneficial to them.

00:46:40   Yeah, I think so too. I hope it works, and I hope it is a model that other developers can

00:46:47   take, because it will allow people that make these productivity apps to charge more money, whether it's

00:46:53   subscriptions or higher kind of prices to get in the door because then because you'll have free

00:47:00   trials. Now are the omni group setting and subscription plans after this or is it a one-time

00:47:06   payment for something like omni-grefl? No it's a one-time payment it's not a subscription they

00:47:11   made sure to stress that it's gonna be a single time unlock and I actually believe they're gonna

00:47:18   be able to do some kind of upgrade pricing if you unlocked a previous In-App Purchase.

00:47:27   Say OmniGraffle 8 launches in three years, maybe if you bought OmniGraffle 7 within a

00:47:32   specific time frame, you're going to be able to unlock that future In-App Purchase at a

00:47:37   discounted price.

00:47:38   I'm not sure about this, but by basing the entire system on In-App Purchases and doing

00:47:43   receive validation, they can do a bunch of things that used to be exclusive to

00:47:47   selling Mac software on your own with licenses and that kind of

00:47:52   stuff and now it seems like the only group can do this for in-app purchase on

00:47:56   the iOS and Mac App Store and you know the Mac App Store of course it's kind of a

00:48:00   joke but it's again seems possible. App Store ads are also a thing that exists

00:48:06   now in search. Now they're not in the UK so I haven't seen any but I know that

00:48:11   Federica you have a US account and Steven of course you have a US account.

00:48:14   So I was wondering kind of what has your opinion been as a consumer right now when looking

00:48:19   at search results and seeing ads?

00:48:20   Are you seeing what you'd expect to be seeing?

00:48:23   It seems to be, to me at least, a really mixed bag where sometimes if I'm searching for something

00:48:31   the quote right ad will show up and other times it'll seem really off or seem like someone

00:48:39   is trying to be in a place they shouldn't be.

00:48:43   And I've also done, as I'm sure Federico has,

00:48:47   like search for name, like well-known apps

00:48:50   that probably already have installed,

00:48:53   just to see if the ad matches the branded search

00:48:57   that I'm doing, or if a competitor is there.

00:48:59   And it seems like a real mixed bag at this point,

00:49:02   where sometimes I get what I expect,

00:49:04   or get something that seems to make sense,

00:49:05   and other times it seems to be doing kind of whatever it wants.

00:49:11   I'm not super impressed so far.

00:49:14   What about you Federico?

00:49:15   Yeah, I don't know what to think honestly because it's been really a mixed bag.

00:49:21   I was looking for a bunch of apps and some ads were useful because they gave me this

00:49:27   indie result from a developer I didn't know about and it was actually relevant.

00:49:32   Then I would say this happened maybe 20, 30% of the time,

00:49:36   and the rest was completely irrelevant ads

00:49:40   for big name companies that were bidding on some keyword.

00:49:43   And then I was looking at that result,

00:49:45   which was not really accurate

00:49:47   and not really what I was looking for.

00:49:48   So it doesn't seem to me at least now

00:49:51   that what Apple has done is amazing,

00:49:53   and oh my God, it's completely different

00:49:55   from Google AdSense and other types of ads

00:49:57   that we've seen on the web before.

00:50:01   I don't particularly mind them, but I don't think they're great either.

00:50:06   I think it's something that Apple wants to try, and if I were to rate the experience

00:50:13   right now it would be not even a 6 out of 10.

00:50:18   Barely a 6 out of 10.

00:50:19   I think of most of the developers that I follow online, it seems that there just tends to

00:50:24   be a lot of confusion.

00:50:26   It is confusing.

00:50:27   confusing sometimes you get the actually good results most of the time you get

00:50:32   like poker, casino type of games in search results which are really not the type of

00:50:38   stuff I'm into and it doesn't seem like Apple is accounting for my previous

00:50:44   history so you know I'm not the type of I'm pretty sure I never ever downloaded

00:50:49   a poker or casino game before in my entire life with this account which I've

00:50:53   been using for like eight years on the App Store. So it doesn't seem like they're

00:50:57   accounting for relevancy to the user, they're just using this system based on

00:51:03   keywords and bidding and you know, I don't know how it works, but it's not

00:51:07   particularly impressive. Like it's my jaw didn't drop when I saw the App Store

00:51:12   ads, whereas I was more impressed by you know Apple doing curation and stuff like

00:51:17   categories and you know the more frequent updates to the App Store on page.

00:51:22   That's impressive and that's really well done when Apple curates apps. Search ads, yeah, you know, that's my reaction. Yeah, they exist

00:51:31   Yeah, it's not really doing gangbusters. I don't know why it's US only

00:51:36   That doesn't really make sense to me, but it is but to be honest like I'm not missing it. I'm not upset that I

00:51:44   Don't think I'm gonna gain much out of this if they exist to be honest. Yeah again

00:51:50   It seems like sometimes you search for stuff and it's pretty good. Other times you do search for

00:51:56   specific things and you run into this result from some shady company with lots of money.

00:52:01   So I guess that's just how ads work.

00:52:05   And I mean we need more time to assess how this will scale in practice. If maybe there's not enough indie developers

00:52:12   trying this right now, maybe if you know the percentage of ads is skewed towards big-name companies with deep pockets,

00:52:18   We don't know. So maybe by next WWDC we'll be able to make a more, you know,

00:52:23   better assessment of has this been useful at all or is it something that you know, it's kind of like I had.

00:52:30   It was a thing that existed but it was never impressive to anyone.

00:52:33   R.I.P.

00:52:36   All right, I think that about wraps it up for today.

00:52:38   There's not a lot going on right now. I think we're in the lull before another event, I think.

00:52:44   Just feeling it.

00:52:48   If you want to find us all online, there's a few places you can do that. You can go to

00:52:53   MaxStories.net for Federico's work and he's over @Vitiici on twitter. Steven is at 512pixels.net

00:53:01   and he is @ismh and I am @imike and I would love it if you would check out my YouTube

00:53:07   videos at youtube.com/mikehurley. You can find me there. Thanks again to Pearl and their

00:53:12   rear vision camera for supporting this week's show and most of all as always thank you for

00:53:17   listening we have a bunch of show notes and links today go to relay.fm/connected/112

00:53:23   thanks so much we'll be back next time until then say goodbye guys

00:53:25   arrivederci adios