104: Our Anniversary Birthday


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:06   From Relay FM and live from Memphis, Tennessee, this is Connected episode 104.

00:00:13   Today's show is brought to you by Squarespace, FreshBooks, and Pingdom.

00:00:17   My name is Myke Hurley and I'm joined across the table by a man whose voice is not joining me,

00:00:22   but he's here, Mr. Stephen Hackett.

00:00:26   Hey Myke, how are you?

00:00:27   I'm very good, how are you? You sound so healthy today.

00:00:30   I have laryngitis, and so this is better than it was on Monday when I got here.

00:00:34   I can only whisper, so I'm improving, but it's still pretty bad.

00:00:38   Yeah, this is a good idea that we run the show a little bit later on this week,

00:00:42   because earlier this week there would have been no show. It would have just been me monologuing

00:00:45   90 minutes.

00:00:46   We were talking about, is it a connected when it's only one host? Because connected can happen

00:00:53   if any two of us are available. But if it's you and somebody else, it's a different podcast.

00:00:59   We joked about just splitting upgrade in half, like recording for two hours, splitting it

00:01:03   in half and putting them both out. But I'm glad we're here because today, August 18th,

00:01:08   is the second anniversary/birthday of our company, Real AFM. So congratulations to you.

00:01:15   Congratulations to you.

00:01:16   Oh, thank you so much. So kind. And Google has helped us. They have helped us celebrate

00:01:20   today by allowing us to use Google Docs again because we can now ask the question and get

00:01:26   the answer we need. Is Google Docs updated for split screen on iOS 9?

00:01:30   It is. So we went back into this document yesterday to prepare our notes and the last

00:01:36   time we were in here was episode 77.

00:01:39   And we're now 104. So we have stayed away for a while and we are back and I've got to

00:01:44   say like I know it's taken them a long time. I'm still really annoyed about it but I'm

00:01:48   already more productive on my iPad because I can use Sheets and Docs split

00:01:53   screen especially Sheets because I'd found things and we'd found things to

00:01:57   replace Docs in some cases we're talking about paper last week we spoke about

00:02:00   Quip in the past and there was even a chance that I was just gonna start using

00:02:04   collaborative Apple Notes at some point yeah so we'd found things to replace

00:02:09   that but the stuff that we use Google Sheets for like spreadsheet

00:02:12   collaboration there's nothing else no anything that there is it's trying to be

00:02:17   something else like Airtable which is really great for what Airtable does but

00:02:21   Airtable is more of a database than a spreadsheet and we just needed stuff

00:02:26   that we could keep running totals and lists of things that could be calculated

00:02:29   and there was really nothing else that could do it as well so Google Sheets is

00:02:34   now updated and it makes me super happy. Me too. I'm already honestly like

00:02:38   within a day I was more productive like putting this document together

00:02:42   together today, we have an IFTTT action that searches hashtags. So we were using the RelayQA

00:02:48   hashtags later on in the show today. We're going to be doing some question and answer

00:02:51   about RelayFM because of our anniversary birthday. And I was able to have sheets on one side,

00:02:58   docs on the other, and just very quickly copy and paste them. When I do that for like upgrade,

00:03:03   because we do the Ask upgrade every week, but we use that action as well. It searches

00:03:06   day fttt puts them into a sheet. I'm copying them, alt tabbing, pasting, alt tabbing, copying.

00:03:13   Like, it was just frustrating. It doesn't take that much longer to do, but it's just

00:03:18   frustrating. And you do it several times a week. Yeah. So I'm just really happy that

00:03:23   we got it now so we can finally go back to it. Agreed. It's good news, it took a long

00:03:29   time, but I gotta hand it to them. It works pretty well. There's no, at least I haven't

00:03:33   seen maybe you have any weirdness like some apps kind of get like Instapaper

00:03:37   does this where if you like change the width the text doesn't reflow correctly

00:03:40   and is that they seem to have gotten it right. I feel like I know why it's taking

00:03:44   them as long as it has because they're using some custom UI and some custom

00:03:47   engine to do a lot of this stuff. Yeah no doubt. But I still don't forgive the

00:03:51   fact that it's taking them a year to do it because it's Google it's they're one

00:03:56   of the biggest companies in the world. You got people. They should have been able to

00:03:59   put the engineering effort into this but it's back again and at least iOS 10

00:04:04   doesn't bring any features yet which are like this important right like

00:04:09   fundamentally so hooray I want to provide a correction some follow-up

00:04:14   about logitech case I got the weights wrong the logitech case is 0.9 pounds

00:04:21   not 1.5 pounds so it's a big difference this actually brings it into slightly

00:04:27   under the weight of the MacBook when you put Logitech create 9.7 with the iPad

00:04:33   Pro so it makes it just under. I still have it and I would like it to be. I don't

00:04:38   know why I got these weight weights wrong I actually think the Logitech

00:04:41   website wasn't updated correctly because I copied and pasted the information so

00:04:47   I think it's that they actually put the weight of the bigger one. I think

00:04:51   probably so um and it is bulky so I've been I've been using a little bit on

00:04:55   your iPad it definitely adds more weight and thickness to the iPad than I want initially

00:05:01   but it's not as bad as I was afraid it would be because that 12.9 one is so bulky. They're

00:05:08   doing a good job at it. It is no bigger than it really needs to be and the keyboard is

00:05:15   just amazing.

00:05:17   So it's bulkier, it's heavier, the springboard crashes were fixed after an iOS beta update?

00:05:22   Yes.

00:05:23   I actually think that Apple fixed the bug affecting this keyboard.

00:05:26   So, well it was on the smart keyboard as well.

00:05:29   So anything over the smart connector seemed to make Springboard need to take a little

00:05:34   nap.

00:05:35   But I'm keeping it.

00:05:38   And I'm keeping my iPad in it all the time because I love this keyboard so much.

00:05:43   I brought it with me on this trip, decided to give it a real good go.

00:05:46   And the weight is a trade off.

00:05:48   is less convenient and less portable because of this,

00:05:53   but the keyboard is so fantastic

00:05:55   and the backlighting I absolutely love.

00:05:58   So I'm gonna keep it.

00:05:59   So on the plane I was reading

00:06:01   and I just popped it out of the case

00:06:02   and just put the case down

00:06:04   and was just holding the iPad in my hands and it was fine.

00:06:07   I've been watching video by having it just like

00:06:10   in the keyboard orientation

00:06:11   and just having it on my lap watching video.

00:06:13   The thing is way more stable when on my lap,

00:06:16   which is really good.

00:06:17   and the keyboard is a joy to use

00:06:20   and I love all of the functions keys.

00:06:22   I love that I have brightness.

00:06:23   I love that I have volume controls

00:06:25   and all that stuff just on there.

00:06:27   Yeah, I really love it.

00:06:29   But whilst we're on keyboards,

00:06:30   I actually have one more keyboard thing to talk about.

00:06:33   - Okay.

00:06:34   - Which is the Razer mechanical keyboard.

00:06:35   - Yes.

00:06:36   - So we spoke about this weeks ago.

00:06:37   - Correct.

00:06:38   - Austin Evans, the YouTuber whose video

00:06:40   we linked to previously,

00:06:41   he sent me his, 'cause he didn't want it.

00:06:44   And he heard us talk about it

00:06:46   and he decided to send it to me, and I hate it so much.

00:06:49   I hate this product.

00:06:50   I have no other way to say it, it's huge.

00:06:52   Everything's way too big,

00:06:54   'cause it's like a huge laptop.

00:06:57   Like it feels bigger than like a 13 inch MacBook Pro

00:07:00   for some reason, like it's just huge.

00:07:02   I can't comfortably use it on my lap

00:07:04   because you have the big base of the keyboard

00:07:07   and then like the stand comes off the end,

00:07:09   so when I put it on my lap,

00:07:10   the stand is hanging over my knees, which is not good.

00:07:14   you need so much space for it.

00:07:16   I think the keys are horrible.

00:07:18   I don't know if maybe I don't know what mechanical keys

00:07:21   are supposed to feel like, but these feel spongy to me.

00:07:25   - My guess is that they set out to make

00:07:29   the world's thinnest mechanical keyboard in name

00:07:32   and maybe it's so thin you're not getting a lot of

00:07:34   the benefits of an actual mechanical keyboard,

00:07:36   like what Jason types on.

00:07:37   You got springs and buckles and metal.

00:07:40   And this thing seems to be trading some of that away.

00:07:44   I haven't typed on it, you didn't bring it.

00:07:46   No.

00:07:47   You would need another suitcase to bring it.

00:07:49   It sounds like it's so big.

00:07:51   But yeah, it seems like maybe it's just not for everyone.

00:07:54   But the Logitech that you like was a big hit on the Verge.

00:07:58   Walt Mossberg really seems to like it.

00:08:00   It's getting good reviews elsewhere.

00:08:01   So it seems like if you don't want this smart keyboard, which

00:08:05   is polarizing to a degree, right?

00:08:07   It's using those stainless steel dome caps.

00:08:10   It's covering the fabric.

00:08:11   It's kind of weird.

00:08:12   if that's a little too far away from what you want,

00:08:14   it really sounds like the Logitech

00:08:16   is the way to go at this point.

00:08:17   - Yeah, I completely agree.

00:08:18   Like, this Razer One is crazy.

00:08:22   And I know there are different products,

00:08:23   different devices, but I think that probably

00:08:26   even the Logitech Create for 12.9 will be better.

00:08:29   Like, I even felt like the keys don't feel even.

00:08:31   Like, when I press them, they seem to like,

00:08:34   move down one side more than the other.

00:08:36   - I'm sure that's fine.

00:08:37   - And the stand that's on the back, the little kickstand,

00:08:40   It doesn't sit flush to the case.

00:08:42   It like is angled off the case, which is just terrible.

00:08:45   The open keyboard button is where

00:08:46   the right arrow key should be.

00:08:48   So every time I press the right key,

00:08:49   what I think is gonna be the right keyboard button,

00:08:50   the software keyboard pops up.

00:08:52   Everything is terrible about this product.

00:08:54   I hate it.

00:08:55   So, but thanks Austin for sending me it.

00:08:58   Now I don't know what to do with it.

00:09:00   So up next today, let's address a question from Max.

00:09:05   So Max wrote in and said,

00:09:07   "I wonder how do you store important private documents

00:09:09   like bank statements on your iPads and iOS devices. On my Mac I use an encrypted disk

00:09:14   image but I would like to move to a more mobile maybe iCloud based approach. Stephen what

00:09:19   do you do? So I really have two levels. The stuff that I just need to reference. I actually

00:09:26   save in 1Password. So 1Password you can save documents within your encrypted 1Password volume

00:09:32   if you will. Now where that breaks down is that that's not a document provider. So things

00:09:37   that have in there, like take example, I have PDFs of the wills that my wife and I have.

00:09:42   That's not a document that I'm ever editing, right? I need it as reference at some point.

00:09:46   I need to know that it's secure, but it's not a, what I would call like a living document,

00:09:50   I'm not going in and out of it. Everything else lives on Dropbox. Now I do have two-factor

00:09:55   authentication turned on for Dropbox. So you need my password, which is a one password,

00:10:01   generated password, and you need my phone. It's not completely bulletproof, right? And

00:10:06   you really need super sensitive information maybe that's not enough but

00:10:11   I feel like for me it is. So I don't know maybe Max's stuff is more sensitive

00:10:18   than mine is and he's not willing to use Dropbox or iCloud like that. As far as I

00:10:22   know and if the listeners know something please get in touch because we want to help Max

00:10:26   out. As far as I know from looking around there's not really anything on iOS like

00:10:32   what he's doing on the Mac. We have an encrypted disk image that you once you

00:10:36   reject the volume it's just a bundle and no one can get into it so I don't really

00:10:40   know the answer but for me one password for like static storage of you know like

00:10:45   I have scans of our passports in there that sort of stuff and then Dropbox with

00:10:49   with two-factor authentication feels like enough for me at least I don't do

00:10:54   anything like this like I either keep stuff in Dropbox which is secured by my

00:10:58   thumbprint and I mean on iOS like a four digit passcode which is amazing yeah or

00:11:05   or it's being saved in 1Password.

00:11:08   But outside of that, I don't really have anything special

00:11:12   that I'm doing.

00:11:14   But to be honest, I don't really keep a lot of that type

00:11:18   of stuff on anything.

00:11:21   Sure.

00:11:23   My bank statements are held up my bank.

00:11:27   Yeah, so you're not downloading a lot of that locally

00:11:30   to carry around.

00:11:30   I mean, frankly, I've been doing a lot more of that recently

00:11:32   with the house stuff.

00:11:33   but I'm just keeping Dropbox folders

00:11:35   because I either need to share those folders with Adina.

00:11:37   - Yeah.

00:11:38   - It's just all staying in Dropbox.

00:11:39   - That's a good point.

00:11:40   That's another angle of this where

00:11:42   if you have something that is private but shared--

00:11:44   - Then it's even more difficult.

00:11:45   - Yeah, so if anyone has any good suggestions from Axe,

00:11:48   please let us know.

00:11:49   - Yep.

00:11:50   All right, let's take a break

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00:13:12   Alright so there has been a whole slew of rumours about the next iPhone over the last

00:13:18   couple of weeks and you know whilst we know this stuff it's all rumour, it's all conjecture,

00:13:23   there are a couple of things in here that are interesting enough that I wanted to touch

00:13:27   on them today, the main one being a blue iPhone. Now I've never heard of iPhone in Canada,

00:13:34   I've never heard of this site before, but they purport to have a blue iPhone, I think

00:13:42   this is the Plus model, it looks like the bigger model because it's got the dual camera

00:13:46   set up, and they have it in a bunch of arrangements. Now they've taken a bunch of photos of it,

00:13:52   it

00:14:11   and then the kind of the layout for the dual camera is matching a lot of the case leaks

00:14:15   we've seen. So let's just assume this is real for the sake of this discussion.

00:14:22   Okay. What do you think of the blue iPhone?

00:14:24   I like the blue a lot. You know we've spoken a lot over time about having options in the

00:14:30   iPhone line and Jason has talked a lot about this as well. That for a long time it was

00:14:34   just black or silver and then they added gold and now they've added rose gold and so to

00:14:39   a fifth option. You know we're getting to a point where this is true there

00:14:42   actually are a lot of options and colors for the iPhone. As far as this particular

00:14:47   phone I really like this blue and I think it would be nice to offset the gold

00:14:51   and rose gold with something a little bit a little bit darker. Again like this

00:14:56   has the black cover glass on the front which I like I don't really don't care

00:14:59   for the white glass above and below the screen. I think I'm in the minority there

00:15:02   but it'd be nice to have another darker option and I think it looks great and I

00:15:07   I think if it's real, it's definitely something

00:15:09   that I would be tempted by,

00:15:11   having carrying space gray phones for a long time,

00:15:14   it'd be nice to have another option.

00:15:16   - So one of the things that I find weird about these leaks,

00:15:18   though, is the fact that the front of it is black.

00:15:21   Why would they do that?

00:15:23   History has shown, and I know things can change,

00:15:25   but every color gets white, and it's just interesting to me

00:15:30   that they would put the blue with the black.

00:15:33   I don't know why they would do that.

00:15:34   Clearly the white sells well,

00:15:36   which is why every other color is white.

00:15:38   But I'm cool with that because I haven't had

00:15:41   a black iPhone in a bit.

00:15:43   I'm looking forward to maybe getting this blue

00:15:47   'cause I like it, I think it looks really nice.

00:15:49   I was probably gonna go rose gold for my next iPhone,

00:15:53   but I may go blue just because it's different

00:15:56   and it looks pretty cool.

00:15:58   - And it's a way to signify you have a new iPhone

00:16:01   if the design stays more or less the same.

00:16:03   - So that's one of the reasons

00:16:04   I think they're doing a new color.

00:16:06   It's because the new color shows the new iPhone.

00:16:09   They did it with the rose gold, right?

00:16:10   They brought the rose gold out for the S

00:16:12   because it shows new phone.

00:16:14   It's just a visual way when the phone isn't changing

00:16:17   to show that you have a new phone.

00:16:19   So I reckon that they're pro,

00:16:21   I'm pretty confident they're gonna do this

00:16:23   because as well, the colors that they've added,

00:16:26   gold and rose gold, traditionally skew more feminine.

00:16:29   So I think that they may go with a blue

00:16:34   to try and balance that out a little bit more.

00:16:36   Now, I mean, I don't think that that's necessarily

00:16:39   the case for everyone.

00:16:40   Like I know that, I mean, I have a gold iPad,

00:16:42   I want a rose gold phone,

00:16:44   but I think that they're just going with the trends.

00:16:46   I think maybe more guys would buy the blue one

00:16:49   over the pink one, because that just tends to be

00:16:52   how our brains are wired to work by mass media.

00:16:55   Now we don't need to get into that discussion,

00:16:57   but I think that they may be going with blue

00:16:59   as just a different color.

00:17:01   I would like to see it maybe be a bit brighter,

00:17:03   like I just want more vivid color in my devices these days,

00:17:07   but I think this is really cool.

00:17:09   But this isn't the only rumors,

00:17:11   this isn't anything that comes out

00:17:12   over the last couple of days.

00:17:14   There's also a discussion about

00:17:16   what devices we're gonna see.

00:17:18   A lot of the earlier rumors were hinting towards

00:17:21   there being an iPhone Pro,

00:17:23   and there being then three devices.

00:17:29   You have the regular 7, then the 7 Plus,

00:17:32   I assume it's called the 7 and then the 7 Pro.

00:17:35   And some of the case leaks that we'd seen

00:17:37   showed an iPhone plus size with a smart connector on it.

00:17:40   Right.

00:17:41   But now 9 to 5 Mac is saying that that won't be happening.

00:17:44   So here's my question.

00:17:46   Will there be no third iPhone, or will there

00:17:49   be no iPhone with a smart connector on it?

00:17:52   My guess is that Pro and smart connector are kind of linked.

00:17:56   And so if we don't see a Pro model,

00:17:59   we won't see a smart connector on the iPhone.

00:18:01   And I had a lot of questions about that anyways, like,

00:18:04   what would you be using a smart connector for on an iPhone?

00:18:07   Like, are they gonna ship a really tiny keyboard?

00:18:10   Or are they gonna ship some other adorable tiny thing?

00:18:14   - I thought maybe like battery case, speaker case.

00:18:17   Like, they might go down the route that like--

00:18:19   - The modular thing, like LG is doing it with the G5.

00:18:22   - The Motorola one.

00:18:24   - Yeah, the Droid Force or Z or something,

00:18:26   one of those has it now.

00:18:28   I think that's really trendy,

00:18:29   I don't see Apple going down the road.

00:18:30   I don't either, but like it's like where what could you do with it and like there's some things you could do with it

00:18:34   But I think it's that's a little bit too fiddly. I agree

00:18:37   So I don't you know, but I mean you look at it right now

00:18:41   The pro doesn't really have a lot of stuff that it does

00:18:43   They only needed essentially one idea for what a smart connect could do and it would have been enough enough. Yeah

00:18:48   And so yeah, I think I think we'll see the seven tiny pencil

00:18:52   What do we think you tiny pencil and we'll see the seven plus with this dual camera set up

00:18:58   So assuming this is this is accurate regular phone and then the plus you're gonna stay in the plus Club cool Sam

00:19:04   And I can't wait for all of the people that begrudgingly join us when this dual cameras thing is only in the plus

00:19:09   Yeah, and it plus plus Club is gonna get a resurgence later on this year. I'm so excited

00:19:15   I'm just so happy to see people like Jason and Gruber like begrudgingly move over to the plus Club

00:19:21   Yeah after you know trying to put it down for so long

00:19:23   Yeah, well, you know Myke was right lives on

00:19:27   Yes, forever. And let's talk about their headphone jack for a moment, right?

00:19:33   Okay. What we've seen and what a lot of people thought we'd see is we'll get a

00:19:37   second speaker and all of the parts leaks including the renders that we've

00:19:41   seen and the device that we've maybe seen with the blue one shows two speaker

00:19:45   grills, parallel speaker grills. Right. So seeing that would hint second speaker.

00:19:51   However, Apple Insider has got some schematics from somewhere which suggests

00:19:57   that that is purely cosmetic. The microphone is sitting behind that speaker

00:20:01   grill. Apple! That makes me sad. I am now firmly in the camp of believing that

00:20:11   they are removing the headphone jack now because the next phone that they're

00:20:16   gonna be working on, this iPhone, 10 year anniversary iPhone, is gonna be the

00:20:21   one with a brand new design it might go the route that John Gruber spoke about with the

00:20:25   edge to edge or glass right and the capacitive home button like the false touch home button

00:20:32   embedded in the display or something because they may be moving to this false touch home

00:20:36   button for a reason that doesn't make any sense right now. I think that they are doing

00:20:39   a bunch of these things to this phone to set up the next one because they don't want all

00:20:43   of the headlines on the next phone to be "Apple removes the headphone jack" and that's a super

00:20:48   Like a lot of people have a fundamental issue

00:20:50   with me saying this because they have a view of Apple,

00:20:53   which is perfection.

00:20:54   - Well, I don't know, I mean sure, some people do.

00:20:58   My problem with it is, is it Apple sells a silver product

00:21:01   this year that people, that they need to sell?

00:21:04   They can't sacrifice.

00:21:06   - But they're not sacrificing it.

00:21:08   They're still removing it anyway, right?

00:21:10   If the headphone jack was ever gonna completely sacrifice it

00:21:14   they were always gonna do it.

00:21:15   And people will buy this phone regardless.

00:21:17   it doesn't matter what they do.

00:21:18   - And that's where the word sacrifice comes in.

00:21:20   Like, if a lot of people skip this one for some reason,

00:21:24   which would be stupid, right?

00:21:25   So say that you don't buy this iPhone

00:21:27   because of the headphone jack.

00:21:28   Well, it's not coming back, right?

00:21:29   Apple has never added something back.

00:21:31   - You're not gonna push their hand to put the headphone back.

00:21:33   - Right, really what I mean by that

00:21:34   is that they would create something

00:21:36   that wasn't as good as it could be on its own.

00:21:40   And really, the headphone jack thing aside,

00:21:43   really where that gets me is this second speaker

00:21:46   because this is a feature that not only are all their competitors doing, all the flagship

00:21:50   Android phones have two speaker systems and they all sound good, or just look at the iPad.

00:21:57   They're already doing this on iOS devices.

00:21:58   They have four in those.

00:21:59   Yeah, and so if you're going to take the opportunity to redesign the bottom of the phone, yes, you

00:22:04   do have to deal with putting the microphone somewhere and maybe it doesn't work if it's

00:22:10   in the same very small space as the speaker for some reason.

00:22:13   But I would have expected seeing this design

00:22:17   that we would see two speakers.

00:22:18   And I would say I think people who see it will expect it to.

00:22:23   And if you go back to the original iPhone design

00:22:27   and all the way up through, I think, the five,

00:22:29   or whenever they changed it, for a long time,

00:22:32   the bottom of the phone was symmetrical.

00:22:34   You had the input, the 30-pin dock connector,

00:22:37   and you had a grill on either side.

00:22:39   And a lot of people assumed both were speakers because it looked that way.

00:22:42   And now they're going to go back to that and they're still not going to be doing it.

00:22:46   It's a little frustrating. I would like my iPhone to be louder.

00:22:49   I like the speaker to be better. I like a lot of people. I think like you

00:22:53   use just the iPhone speaker to listen to podcasts a bunch. Well I use the iPad speakers now

00:22:57   because they're so good.

00:22:58   Yeah, but it would be nice if the iPhone could be better and it seems like it's not going to be

00:23:02   this time around. That's a little disappointing. So I don't think they're going to stand on stage

00:23:07   and say it as a second speaker.

00:23:09   right i don't think that they can say that it is second speaker i think they

00:23:12   don't lie

00:23:13   but i think they're creating a design that is deceptive and is deceptive on

00:23:16   purpose

00:23:17   uh... a little bit and i i think that if there was a speaker that make a big deal

00:23:21   out of it yet there will be there will be uh... basis to shame i mean it's just

00:23:25   it's just a shame i think and

00:23:27   i think i think one of the things that we're gonna feel about this this i'd

00:23:31   this iphone is that

00:23:33   it's a shame i think will be something that will mention about like her it's a

00:23:37   It's a shame that it doesn't have a new design.

00:23:39   It's a shame that they've taken the headphone jack away.

00:23:42   But I think if the camera is as good as it probably could be, I think that could be awesome.

00:23:49   Yeah, you know, I think that it will be a period of adjustment for people.

00:23:55   And for me personally, the only time I really use the headphone jack is while I work out.

00:24:00   And even in that scenario, my Bluetooth earbuds, which I own a pair, would be better.

00:24:05   I just never remember to take them or charge them or anything.

00:24:09   But for a lot of people who are using it in their cars,

00:24:11   hardwired in is going to be an adjustment,

00:24:13   or you got to buy a dongle to go from Lightning to 3.5

00:24:17   millimeter.

00:24:18   There will be adjustment period.

00:24:21   I think that it's a little early.

00:24:23   Like if you look when they drop things like the floppy drive

00:24:26   or the optical drive, they had really--

00:24:30   with the optical drive, in particular with the MacBook Air,

00:24:32   they had a really good case for, hey,

00:24:34   We don't have to back up to DVDs.

00:24:36   We have Time Machine.

00:24:37   You don't need to watch movies on a disc.

00:24:40   You can get it from iTunes.

00:24:41   You can rent them from iTunes.

00:24:42   It was in the same keynote.

00:24:43   I don't know what that story is with the headphone jack.

00:24:45   - Bluetooth.

00:24:46   - But it's not, I don't think it's as good as a reason.

00:24:50   - No it's not, but that's gonna be the reason.

00:24:52   So this is the thing, the story you've painted

00:24:56   is the way the presentation will go,

00:24:58   but the implicit part in what you're saying

00:25:02   is there was a good reason for it.

00:25:04   but I don't think Bluetooth is, and I'm not alone in this,

00:25:08   Bluetooth just isn't a good enough reason.

00:25:10   So I will not switch to Bluetooth headphones until,

00:25:15   like the only route that I see myself switching

00:25:17   to Bluetooth headphones is if I could get

00:25:19   a pair of Bluetooth headphones that do quick charging

00:25:21   via the lightning port on my phone,

00:25:24   because if I have Bluetooth headphones,

00:25:26   I have battery anxiety constantly.

00:25:28   Like when I leave the house with Bluetooth headphones,

00:25:31   I have my earbuds in my pocket,

00:25:33   Because if I'm out, I like to be able to listen to stuff.

00:25:37   And if the battery dies, then there's nothing you can do

00:25:40   because it charges by mini USB.

00:25:42   Like where am I gonna do that?

00:25:43   And my hope is that Apple create a new set of earphones

00:25:47   that charge via the lightning port like the pencil does.

00:25:50   Like it has a little male connector in there somewhere

00:25:53   and you just unplug it, pop it in and it charges.

00:25:56   That would be awesome.

00:25:56   Otherwise, I'm just gonna stick to the probably

00:25:59   lightning earbuds that they put in the box.

00:26:02   The battery stuff is just something I don't want to have to deal with.

00:26:05   I think a lot of people would be there.

00:26:07   There was a report that Apple was working on, like low power Bluetooth stuff, but the

00:26:11   thing with Bluetooth, it's always going to be better next year, like the promise every

00:26:15   year.

00:26:16   And it is better than it used to be, but it's not good enough.

00:26:19   And having a headphone jack, there's no power draw, hardly at all.

00:26:24   Or if you're streaming with Bluetooth, it's noticeable.

00:26:26   So Rosemary in the chat room has said that she sees the battery level in notifications

00:26:31   for our Bluetooth headphones so it's not an issue and I totally get that like it's

00:26:34   possible to see the battery I just don't want to have to think about another

00:26:39   battery in my life I have to think of the batteries of everything I know my

00:26:44   watch yet the thing I put on my wrist the computers that I use the things that

00:26:48   I have in my pocket I don't want to also have to think about my headphones as

00:26:51   another battery thing I have to worry about like it having a battery in there

00:26:56   but me being able to just plug it in and quick charge it that works perfectly for

00:26:59   for me.

00:27:00   Yep.

00:27:01   Alright, we should probably get into some of our relay Q&A stuff, but before we do that

00:27:06   let me thank our second sponsor for this week and that is the fine folk over at Pingdom.

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00:27:49   checking its availability as often as every minute.

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00:27:55   Pingdom detects more than 400,000 outages on the web every day.

00:27:59   And this is just the websites that they look after.

00:28:02   This isn't all of the websites.

00:28:04   You if you're not using Pingdom are in the other camp.

00:28:06   You're in the much larger number of sites that are going down and then people don't

00:28:09   know what to do with them.

00:28:10   And it's not even just these days about the whole website going down.

00:28:13   Maybe you have a checkout functionality or you sell stuff.

00:28:16   You have e-commerce or you have contact form or there are specific like logins or search

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00:28:34   website and if there's an outage they will detect it and immediately alert you so you

00:28:39   won't be caught out with your website being broken. You need Pingdom so you don't have

00:28:45   to get tweets from people telling you that your website is down. We use Pingdom at Relay

00:28:49   a

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00:29:10   use the code connected at checkout

00:29:12   and you'll get 20% off.

00:29:14   Thank you so much to Pingdom

00:29:16   for their support of this show and Relay FM.

00:29:18   - So Myke, you bought something on your trip.

00:29:22   - Yeah, I got a tattoo yesterday.

00:29:24   I got a Relay FM focused tattoo.

00:29:27   So it's a piece of artwork that we've used

00:29:31   at Relay Con on the badges that we had

00:29:33   and we're making some stickers of this

00:29:35   which will be available for sale soon.

00:29:37   And it is, in essence, the simplest representation

00:29:42   of our artwork.

00:29:45   So it is a round rack with a circle in the middle,

00:29:48   which is some kind of artwork entity.

00:29:50   The two black lines are the name of the show,

00:29:53   then the subtitle of the show,

00:29:54   and the triangle on the top left,

00:29:56   which is where the Relay FM logo goes on our artwork.

00:29:59   So this is basically our designer, Frank,

00:30:01   he has a template and like a grid system that he developed.

00:30:06   And this is like, if you take that grid system

00:30:08   and just put something where the things need to go,

00:30:10   this is the simplest representation of our artwork

00:30:13   that you can have.

00:30:14   And I didn't want to get the Relay FM logo tattooed on me.

00:30:18   I just didn't want the logo.

00:30:20   - Yeah.

00:30:21   - Because I feel like that's just a bit much.

00:30:24   - A little weird.

00:30:24   - It just feels strange to me.

00:30:26   And also our logo could change in the future,

00:30:30   but our artwork is most likely gonna always look like this

00:30:33   because this is just how podcast artwork tends to be,

00:30:36   with like a piece of artwork and a name.

00:30:38   And also if we changed the artwork style,

00:30:42   it feels like that changing would be less of an effect

00:30:44   than the company logo changing.

00:30:47   Because this just symbolizes podcast to me.

00:30:50   Like ATP, right?

00:30:51   They're not a real AFM show,

00:30:52   but their artwork kind of looks like this, right?

00:30:54   Because a big circular thing in the middle

00:30:55   with the name of the show underneath it.

00:30:57   This just looks like podcast to me.

00:30:59   - Yeah, they use an antique computer on their artwork.

00:31:01   - Yeah, it should be one in your collection, I think.

00:31:05   So I'll put a link in the show notes so you can go and see my tattoo.

00:31:08   I took a picture of it last night and right now it's very rustly as I have saran wrap on my arm.

00:31:12   So it's your first one?

00:31:13   It's my first tattoo.

00:31:14   You got some catching up to do with me.

00:31:16   It is actually my first. I already know my next one.

00:31:18   Yeah, that's how it goes.

00:31:19   Yeah. I mean this is the my next tattoo it was an idea that I'd had a long time ago but just never did it.

00:31:24   And then I saw this artwork and immediately knew that this is what I needed.

00:31:27   So now I have a real AFM tattoo and I wanted to do it whilst I was here in Memphis.

00:31:32   I decided to do this a couple of months ago,

00:31:34   but I wanted to do it whilst we were together

00:31:36   and whilst we were celebrating our second anniversary.

00:31:39   So now I have a real AirFam tattoo on my body.

00:31:42   - So today is two years from the launch of the network.

00:31:46   And we, per our tradition, we did this last year,

00:31:49   and we did it at launch.

00:31:50   We thought we would do some question and answer,

00:31:52   which is really why I'm here today.

00:31:54   You didn't need me for the first half of the show.

00:31:55   I could be asleep.

00:31:56   - Yep.

00:31:57   - But we're gonna do Q&A.

00:31:58   If this goes south, you will just ask me

00:32:00   yes and no questions.

00:32:01   you're just going to do like a system of tapping on the desk to indicate yes or

00:32:05   no

00:32:06   uh... said you want to uh...

00:32:09   so it is i'm going to all school the question is that

00:32:12   and then maybe you can give some answers okay thank you the first one comes from

00:32:15   rob and rob on school what has been your favorite podcasting moment in the last

00:32:20   year so

00:32:21   for me the the my favorite single moment

00:32:24   was when i introduced gray on stage at relaycon yeah because it was a surprise

00:32:29   that we'd been working on for a while and we managed to keep it secret. So when I was

00:32:34   able to call him up on stage, that was a really fun thing for me because it was very unexpected

00:32:39   for the people there and also for the people listening. So I think over the last year that's

00:32:44   probably been my favorite moment and also the thing that I was the most nervous about

00:32:48   standing on stage and introducing him. Yeah I think RelayCon for me is also the highlight

00:32:54   of our year. We worked on it for a really long time. It was a lot of effort to make

00:33:00   it happen and when we looked out on that crowd and the bar was full and there were people

00:33:05   standing in the back and we had a wait list of hundreds of people we couldn't get in,

00:33:11   it was a big success. And that meant a lot to me, meant a lot to the company, meant a

00:33:15   lot to both of us. And by far, hands down, probably in the two years, honestly, that

00:33:22   event for me has been the highlight so far. Kathy asked what goal do you have

00:33:27   for year three that wasn't even on your mind until this year? So without going

00:33:33   into too many details some of the numbers that we aim for now from like an

00:33:37   audience size and a financial size they're numbers that I never could have

00:33:42   imagined that we would have achieved. We've you know without trying to blow

00:33:46   our own trumpet too much we've been very successful over the last couple of years

00:33:49   and we've built something that we're really proud of and just some of the numbers that we're looking at it doesn't it doesn't even make

00:33:55   any sense to me and also like something that we've been talking about this week is

00:33:59   thinking about me and Steven getting some help some like administrative help as we're trying to like do more and

00:34:06   Things like that. It just doesn't it just is mind-blowing to me that we're now in a position where we're like a real company

00:34:12   Yeah, I mean I think for me I think we have some ideas

00:34:19   For shows and for projects I'll call them projects

00:34:22   That we would not have tackled a year ago that we're now talking about doing. Yeah, that's true. We

00:34:28   we are

00:34:30   Not we're trying to not have as many shows launch this year's the coming year as we did in the previous year

00:34:36   Just because we I think it gets to a certain point and we can't manage all of the shows

00:34:41   As well as we would like if we had too many

00:34:43   But we have we have a new project

00:34:46   very new very early stage that we were talking about over the last couple of days, which is

00:34:52   Ambitious very ambitious and if we were able to pull it off I

00:34:58   Will be it would have very much surprised last year's Myke

00:35:03   Yeah, I thought that this was a type of thing that we'd be able to do. So

00:35:06   Yeah, we've got that one Zach asked what iOS podcast clients did the relay hosts prefer for day-to-day listening?

00:35:12   I use overcast. I know you use overcast

00:35:15   I think on the whole it's split between overcast and pocket casts for everybody

00:35:20   on the network. I'm hoping Castro starts to bump in there as I was talking about

00:35:25   an upgrade of JSON. I'm so close for Castro to me because there are just some

00:35:30   things about this application which is so like fundamental to the way that I

00:35:33   listen to podcasts but I need an iPad app so we'll see what they do there but

00:35:40   yeah it's mainly overcast and pocketcast right now. Parker wanted to know how we

00:35:44   we first met. This is probably a story we've told a few times and... On mind dating. Yep.

00:35:52   Over history I feel like I don't really remember it as well anymore but I know

00:35:59   that... I mean I... I know. Okay I don't remember. Yeah so you you interviewed me on

00:36:09   the bro show. So I reached out to you then to ask you to be on my first podcast. Yeah.

00:36:16   And we talked about the iPad and we stayed in touch. I think we hit it off really well

00:36:20   in the air. And then you were writing for a website at the time that I started doing

00:36:24   some app reviews for as well. Yeah. And we went from there, we did our first show together

00:36:30   on Genius which we've now brought back if you're not listening to Shame On You. And

00:36:34   and we did the 512 podcast, which is the precursor to the prompt, and we just went from there.

00:36:41   So it started with an interview and now we have a company together.

00:36:44   That's how these things go, kids. Watch out when you're doing those interviews, because

00:36:49   you might end up tied to someone for the rest of your life.

00:36:54   Next up, from Danny. Danny asked, "Do any of you use Marco's fancy file matching tool?"

00:36:59   So this is something he's been speaking about on ATP a bunch.

00:37:03   The tool that he uses to take WAV files and match them up to affect drift.

00:37:09   I don't do it because I can't use command line stuff properly.

00:37:17   I use it a little bit if I run into trouble but most of the time the stuff I'm editing,

00:37:22   so I only edit living behind the scenes, I only edit currently ungenius and liftoff and

00:37:26   both short and they're both only two people so generally I can do it manually and I'm

00:37:30   fine.

00:37:31   So a couple people mentioned in chat did we say that Federico wasn't here today?

00:37:34   I don't think we did.

00:37:35   Federico's at the beach.

00:37:36   Yeah he's on summer vacation right now.

00:37:38   I think he's writing his iOS review in the sand so this year this is a special feature

00:37:46   for local Club Max Stories members.

00:37:49   You just go read his review it's being written on a beach.

00:37:51   He's writing it with a stick in the sand so that's gonna be nice.

00:37:54   seems like a not a good way to back up your text. It's fine don't worry about it, he's

00:37:58   taking drone photos of it. Yeah so Federico's on holiday so that's just the two of us today.

00:38:03   Sorry Federico. Kate wanted to know what has the experience of running Relay been like

00:38:09   compared to what you expected when you started. So this morning me and Steven were being a

00:38:13   little misty eyed and we were talking about the day before we launched. So the day before

00:38:19   we launched we had like a letter that we published at Relay.fm. Yeah, week before. Week before.

00:38:23   before and it kind of just said what because we hadn't spoken about what we were doing

00:38:29   we when we left five by five we just went quiet for a bit to get this stuff ready and

00:38:33   then about a month later we published this website which had just this open letter on

00:38:38   it and it kind of said who we were and what we were doing what we were looking to try

00:38:43   and achieve with relay FM and then it listed the shows and it was analog which was the

00:38:48   the first new show, Connected, Virtual,

00:38:53   Inquisitive, and the Pen Avic.

00:38:55   They were our five shows.

00:38:56   So that's the thing that I can't believe now

00:38:59   is we have like 25 nearly.

00:39:02   So we have five times the amount of shows,

00:39:05   many more hosts than that,

00:39:07   maybe six or seven times the amount of hosts, if not more.

00:39:11   And it's kind of a daunting thing to think about now

00:39:16   if i was to go back then and tell myself that

00:39:18   we were able to manage it pretty nicely now because we kind of over in the

00:39:22   flow of things in the group

00:39:25   it's uh...

00:39:27   it's a funny thing to think back to the five that we started with

00:39:30   and that being like an impossible number in the size of a company her now we have

00:39:35   over twenty

00:39:36   i think the big

00:39:38   change in experiences that we're both now doing it as our jobs

00:39:42   and where we started relay

00:39:44   we both had nine to five jobs,

00:39:46   and we were doing it after work,

00:39:49   in the evenings, on weekends,

00:39:51   and now, as of a year ago, we're both in it full time.

00:39:55   And that's been a huge change,

00:39:58   and because of that, we've been able to grow it

00:40:00   the way we have.

00:40:01   If we were still having nine to five jobs,

00:40:02   there's no way Relay would have 25 podcasts.

00:40:05   - So the funny thing is, though,

00:40:07   I never had a doubt in my mind

00:40:09   that it would be my job one day,

00:40:10   like this would do it.

00:40:11   Like, I was convinced.

00:40:13   otherwise i would never have done this.

00:40:15   Like if I didn't think that this was gonna be the thing,

00:40:17   we would have never started it.

00:40:19   And I know that it was difficult

00:40:21   and I didn't know when it was gonna happen,

00:40:23   but I really believed we could do it.

00:40:26   But it happened quicker, much quicker for both of us

00:40:29   than I expected.

00:40:31   I thought it was gonna be a couple of years,

00:40:33   but I was convinced that this would be the path

00:40:35   for both of us.

00:40:36   - Yep, same.

00:40:37   - Oz asked, if you could have any guest in the world

00:40:42   for any show on your network, who would it be and why?

00:40:47   Do you have one?

00:40:48   I was thinking you might have someone

00:40:50   space related or something.

00:40:52   - I mean, I have some dreams for particular shows.

00:40:55   So like, it'd be fun to have some astronauts like Tim Peake

00:40:59   or, you know, Chris Hadfield on "Lift Off."

00:41:03   That'd be a lot of fun.

00:41:04   On this show, you know, it would be really daunting,

00:41:07   but it would be fun to talk to an Apple executive.

00:41:10   Not that we would get anything amazing out of them,

00:41:13   but it would be a real honor,

00:41:15   and it would be like a real holy cow type moment.

00:41:19   But I don't hang my hat on any of those things.

00:41:22   I'm proud of everything we do now.

00:41:23   Like I don't consider having something like that on a show

00:41:27   like an actual goal.

00:41:29   Like it would be amazing,

00:41:30   but it's not something I strive for.

00:41:32   - I mean, there are certain Apple executives

00:41:34   of course we'd love to talk to.

00:41:35   Mine would be Ive, speak to Jonathan Ive.

00:41:38   - Yeah. - Sir Jonathan Ive.

00:41:39   - Wow, put that in there.

00:41:41   - Yep, and then maybe somebody like Stephen Fry,

00:41:44   you know, is someone I've always wished I could talk to,

00:41:46   and also for me, Adam Savage.

00:41:48   They kind of, they're like the people that--

00:41:52   - I'll second you on Adam Savage.

00:41:54   - If I could talk to Adam Savage, Stephen Fry,

00:41:56   and Johnny Ive, I would be pretty, I'd be pretty happy.

00:41:59   - There you go.

00:42:00   - So as a company, we tried our best to make money.

00:42:05   Some of that is through sponsorship, which we do.

00:42:08   Some of that is through membership,

00:42:09   which we'll talk about later.

00:42:10   But one of the things we have to do with all of that

00:42:12   is send our invoices, and we use FreshBooks for that,

00:42:14   and they are our sponsor for this week.

00:42:16   - Nice. - It's good segue, right?

00:42:17   - It's good. - FreshBooks are on the mission

00:42:19   to help small business owners save time

00:42:20   and avoid the stress that comes with running their businesses

00:42:22   and I, we, can completely attest to the fact

00:42:26   that they do this every single week.

00:42:29   I am happy that I use FreshBooks

00:42:31   because their invoicing is so pain-free.

00:42:35   You can get an invoice set up and sent out in 30 seconds.

00:42:38   It saves all, you can save in all of the different line items.

00:42:41   So like I have all of our shows saved into FreshBooks.

00:42:44   So I just choose to show and it fills out the prices

00:42:47   and everything automatically.

00:42:49   All of our clients, all of the companies that we bill,

00:42:51   that's all saved in there.

00:42:52   It's so, so simple to get them sent out.

00:42:56   And what our sponsors love is we make it very easy

00:42:59   for them to pay us because with FreshBooks,

00:43:02   you can integrate so many different ways.

00:43:04   You can integrate card payments, PayPal payments,

00:43:06   they have their own payment information.

00:43:08   You can put on how to be paid by check,

00:43:10   how to be paid by bank transfer.

00:43:11   You can put all of this stuff

00:43:13   front and center on the invoice.

00:43:14   And this is why FreshBooks customers

00:43:16   get paid five days faster on average.

00:43:18   We were laughing about this the other day.

00:43:20   FreshBooks pays so quickly,

00:43:22   which is really funny to me.

00:43:23   Like as a company, they pay us super quick.

00:43:26   And it's because they love their invoices

00:43:28   as much as we love sending them.

00:43:30   FreshBooks can also help you keep track of your expenses.

00:43:33   You can automatically import your bank transactions

00:43:35   for easy reconciliation.

00:43:36   know Steven lives in that section. They have great reports so I like their reports. I can

00:43:41   log in and on my dashboard at FreshBooks it tells me who is 60 days overpayment, who is

00:43:47   90 days overpayment. So I know just at a glance where the money is and what I need to do about

00:43:52   it. And I can also get automatic chasers set up on the invoices. You know when people have

00:43:57   looked at them and you can have automatic reminders sent as well. If you bill anybody

00:44:01   for anything, they also do time tracking as well, you should check out FreshBooks. It

00:44:06   is absolutely fantastic, I wouldn't want to use anything else. And I don't say this about

00:44:11   everything, right, like a sponsorship is not us saying, like we don't come in here and

00:44:15   just say "oh I love this more than anything in the world" but this is how I feel about

00:44:19   FreshBooks, it is something you should be trying. Go to FreshBooks.com/Connected, use

00:44:23   the code "Connected" in the "How you heard about us" section so that you know that you

00:44:27   came from the show you get 30 days of unrestricted use by going to freshbooks.com/connected

00:44:33   no credit card required for that trial at all thank you so much to Freshbooks for their

00:44:36   support of this show and Relay FM. Kevin wants to know which of us is Batman and which is

00:44:43   Robin? So I was thinking about this I think you would be Batman because you're way more

00:44:47   active than I am and probably stronger. I am out fighting crime at night. Yeah and I

00:44:52   don't do any of the crime fighting. And my voice sounds like Batman. That's true can

00:44:56   Can you just say it like I'm Batman?

00:44:58   I'm Batman.

00:44:59   Perfect.

00:45:00   Where's the trigger?

00:45:01   But you have your own answer.

00:45:04   I think Casey is Robin.

00:45:05   And we're both Batman.

00:45:06   There you go.

00:45:07   We share the Batman duties and Casey is our Robin.

00:45:10   No, no, that's a pretty good question.

00:45:13   The bigger question I think is, I'm going to deviate from the document, is if you, like

00:45:20   what superhero, I guess, who would you want to be?

00:45:25   to be yeah it feels I would be spider-man why cuz spider-man he his

00:45:31   powers aren't so much that they completely take over his life right it

00:45:36   like there are some superheroes where their superpower makes a physical change

00:45:41   to their life which is unwieldy like the thing right or like Superman is huge is

00:45:48   like this big huge guy spider-man she's a regular regular sized dude and he has

00:45:53   all these awesome powers has this strength ten times of his size right

00:45:58   which is awesome and he can web around the city and climb up walls I like it

00:46:02   Spidey sense every good spider-man is the one hmm what about you um I think

00:46:09   it probably be Batman because like Batman has no powers right he's just

00:46:14   like a rich guy with that I don't like about Batman oh we're just gonna move on

00:46:17   him um Chris asked cuz you're drinking water this time yep is there anything

00:46:23   you would like to talk about the upcoming year for relay that we should get excited about?

00:46:27   I think the only thing I can say that we're definitely gonna do

00:46:32   that is not giving anything away is a bigger relaycon.

00:46:37   Yes.

00:46:38   So there will be more than one relaycon event next year saying that we will be doing another

00:46:43   relaycon event in Atlanta for the Panadict, which was the first ever relaycon, and then

00:46:49   we will do another RelayCon WWDC during like in San Francisco for WWDC week and we will

00:46:57   get a bigger venue for that.

00:46:59   Yes.

00:47:00   And I would hope that we by the end of the year would be able to do one more.

00:47:03   Yeah, I would agree with all that.

00:47:05   You know San Francisco we had 150 tickets, we had 400 people on the waiting list currently.

00:47:09   I mean clearly we could go bigger.

00:47:12   We just wanted to start small, even that small event was expensive and we wanted to...

00:47:15   We needed to do something we could cope with.

00:47:17   Yeah.

00:47:18   you did an amazing job of it so I think I'm confident you got Batman's really

00:47:22   good at planning parties that's true that's that's what that is he's actual

00:47:25   superpower so Rosemary mentioned the London meetup was fun I'm not gonna say

00:47:32   this right now but I might try and do a show next year in London like a live

00:47:39   show yeah yeah I think it'd be fun because that's the thing we have meetups

00:47:42   and we have really calm yeah really calm as a show yeah meetups it's just when

00:47:47   we're hanging out. So by the way, I'm gonna be in New York this weekend. I'm gonna be

00:47:52   doing a little meet up in New York City on Sunday.

00:47:55   I can't make it.

00:47:56   No, you weren't invited.

00:47:58   Wow.

00:47:59   On Sunday, what is Sunday, the 21st?

00:48:02   Sure.

00:48:03   It's at noon, Eastern Time, New York Time at this place. I'm very, very, very set up

00:48:10   for this.

00:48:11   Yeah.

00:48:12   beer or beer authority I'll put a link to my tweet about this in the show notes

00:48:19   but I'm gonna be doing a little meet up in in New York's I'm gonna be in New

00:48:22   York this weekend so cool yeah so we do those and they're not really kind of

00:48:25   events but we're gonna try and do more relay con events so yeah you can look

00:48:31   out for those that's something that we know we're gonna do and it's not a big

00:48:34   surprise. Walker asked when you set metrics for a new show or goals do you

00:48:39   set the goals for downloads or sponsors or like for sponsor code uses or

00:48:45   something else so when we have a new show we don't set goals we don't say to

00:48:50   the hosts you have to hit 20,000 downloads for this show to exist because

00:48:57   there are many reasons to have a show not all of them audience size not all of

00:49:03   them a topic there's many reasons and a lot of the time for us it's like if it

00:49:07   feels right and we can handle a new show of that type

00:49:11   Or if you know, it's a topic everyone are going to so we don't set goals

00:49:15   We have metrics for each show that we consider to be a success for that show

00:49:20   like the level of which the pen addict is successful within its field is

00:49:26   Maybe greater than this show even though the audience is smaller

00:49:30   because if you think about the amount of people that there are that love pens and

00:49:35   then the amount of people that love pens that understand technology enough to

00:49:38   want to listen to a podcast about it we've probably got the majority of that

00:49:42   audience yeah where whilst this show is a success we don't have the majority of

00:49:46   the technology audience right so this show isn't as big as ATP right there was

00:49:50   room to grow there but I don't think there is any show in the world about

00:49:54   pens that is bigger than the pen addict so different shows have different goals

00:49:58   depending on that show so we don't have a specific metric that we set set fair I

00:50:03   think so yeah Graham asked what is the most terrifying and most exciting relay

00:50:09   related moment in the past year 100% really con is one of those things really

00:50:14   con San Francisco I was terrified yeah about everything 100% of the time but it

00:50:23   was also one of the greatest moments of my life like that whole thing doing all

00:50:27   of that it was just fantastic so yeah I think I think past really con I guess

00:50:33   longer than a year now but when we launched shows like Mac Power Users or

00:50:39   like the summer pilots that became Cortex and Rec. Diff's, I think those were

00:50:44   all big moments as well. Bringing Jeff to the network of

00:50:47   presentable isn't a whole one for me. Jeffrey Veen is such a

00:50:52   renowned person in his field in design. Having Jeff as part of the network

00:50:58   has been a really really great thing for me at the past year as well.

00:51:02   as a new show. I mean I love all of our shows but we're able to with presentable

00:51:08   break into some new new kind of worlds and and it's really renowned within the

00:51:16   design world like some of the people that he talks to like executives at

00:51:19   Facebook and Spotify somebody who works in the Hillary Clinton campaign. Yeah

00:51:22   that's amazing guest list. Yeah it's a totally different type of show somebody

00:51:26   said that it has a different feel which it does it does have a different feel

00:51:28   and that's completely on, Jeff is naturally very very good at this and if you're not listening

00:51:36   to presentable you should check it out because even if design isn't your thing so much it's

00:51:41   just fascinating discussion so that's been another cool thing for me this year.

00:51:45   I can't think what other shows have we launched this year, Free Agents is really good you

00:51:51   should go check out Free Agents that's the new show.

00:51:54   Canvas is a great addition.

00:51:57   Disruption was the rebrand from Isometric.

00:52:00   My word, it's less than or equal this year?

00:52:02   I feel like it's been in the last year.

00:52:05   That's a great show.

00:52:06   We're happy to have that on the network and have a lean.

00:52:08   Remaster was the rebrand from Virtual.

00:52:11   Thoroughly Considered.

00:52:13   Congratulations to the Studio Neat guys on the Glyph Kickstarter.

00:52:16   Top 4 and Under the Radar.

00:52:20   Under the Radar is coming up on a year.

00:52:24   it's been crazy I think we like doubled this year yeah just about that's not

00:52:28   gonna happen next year it can't yeah agreed I can't it's not that we wouldn't

00:52:32   want to we just can't there's that there's no way we could be able to

00:52:36   handle that so yeah I'm really happy I love all the shows that we've added in

00:52:39   the last year I think we have I mean as you would like to assume from making it

00:52:44   bigger but we have a very I think impressive stable and roster of shows

00:52:49   and hosts right now which actually brings me to a great question from

00:52:53   Yasmine is one of the hosts of material. Yasmine is great to ask this type of question and I'm pleased

00:52:59   that she did. What things are you doing to ensure your network is diverse and goes beyond white men

00:53:03   talking about Apple? So, there's a couple of things here I want to address. The Apple part of it,

00:53:08   that is just where our network centers and we have shows that break outside of Apple.

00:53:14   I think now we probably have, well we definitely have more shows that are focused on other things

00:53:19   other than Apple technology. But one of the things, the perceptions of people is that

00:53:24   the people that talk about whatever it is they're talking about, they tend to be focused

00:53:28   more in the Apple world. Like, like I can tell by the differences, has John Cercuso

00:53:31   on it? Yep. Top four has Marco on it. But Marco and Tiff never talk about Apple stuff.

00:53:37   So there is a, there is a perception, um, and that is just about changing the host that

00:53:42   we have. But there's also something to be said for fitting within a topic area, right?

00:53:48   like material has somebody who is a prominent iOS developer and a prominent

00:53:55   iOS commentator. So Russell and Andy are both still prominent in the

00:54:00   Apple world as well as in the Google world. So we're kind of in

00:54:04   that area. I'm not too fussed about really trying to break outside of that

00:54:09   but there are more important things in Yasmin's question for me like the

00:54:15   diversity part and the white and the men part so I think that we have made some

00:54:21   really great strides from a gender perspective we're not where we would

00:54:25   like to be we would like to be 50/50 or as close to 50/50 as we can be but we've

00:54:32   I think that I mean I'm gonna say this I believe that relay FM is better than the

00:54:38   tech podcast industry as a whole at gender diversity yeah but there's still

00:54:43   more that we want to do to try and get to our goal. We have been at 50/50 and then it's

00:54:47   diverged from that and then we're trying to get back closer to that again. So one of the

00:54:52   things that we do, and we're doing it now more than ever, is when we have new shows

00:54:56   in the works, we are looking at every decision that we make into how it will affect our diversity

00:55:04   balance. So we were talking about we had a new show that we were working on, a new idea.

00:55:10   This will have one host, most likely, and then maybe some contributors to it.

00:55:15   So we want the contributors to be diverse, and also if we bring this person in, and we

00:55:20   have them do this show, how will it affect our diversity balance, and what other changes

00:55:25   do we need to make to the network to then balance that out.

00:55:28   So right now, we have a show in the works that I'm going to be a part of, where we're

00:55:35   bringing in one new female host, and my other co-host will be female as well, so I love

00:55:39   to test which we've spoken about and there's been a pilot of that show. So that is bringing

00:55:43   a new woman to the network and also making one new show that has two female hosts. So

00:55:48   that's something that we're excited about. We're working with one other woman on a new

00:55:51   show and we have some ideas and some people that we're considering contacting in the near

00:55:56   future which are female to try and help balance that out. We then have to start thinking more

00:56:02   about our racial diversity but right now we're focusing on gender because it's the thing

00:56:06   that we can affect easiest quickest. So it's hard, it's really hard to find the balance

00:56:14   because we need to balance what we feel is right and what we know we can make money with

00:56:19   and the audience and the people that we're bringing in because frankly in our world of

00:56:23   technology there are more men than women and so this is something we have to try our best

00:56:28   to surface new talent, leverage people that have great audiences so we can build shows

00:56:34   around them and we're trying to balance it that way so it's super difficult I

00:56:39   hope that when you hear this you can hear how much we struggle with it and

00:56:43   how important it is to us and I hope that when you hear me talk about these

00:56:47   things you can see how important we do genuinely feel it is and how we believe

00:56:54   that we have a part to play to try and make it better yeah absolutely and we

00:56:59   didn't get it right at launch. No, it took us some time. And looking back,

00:57:04   that was wrong on our part and we continue to strive to do that. Thankfully the

00:57:10   world is different now in technology and this stuff is highlighted more and it is

00:57:16   through having people like Yasmeen on the network who do hold us to task and

00:57:20   whilst that is difficult it's something that I am very thankful that we have.

00:57:25   that we have people in our roster of hosts that look out for this stuff with

00:57:30   us and suggest it. I mean that's how we run as a company we love everybody to be

00:57:36   involved and to give their opinions and we it's important to us that we try and

00:57:40   make the best we can with that so thank you for that question Yasmin and I

00:57:44   hope that there is a suitable answer in there. Justin asked how do you keep shows

00:57:50   from getting stale or repetitive and Justin then complimented us that we do a

00:57:54   great job with this. I don't think there's a magic formula. I think it's

00:57:59   about feeling it. So you've got to be happy with what you're making and if

00:58:04   you're happy with what you're making then you're probably doing something to

00:58:06   try and keep it fresh. That's kind of how I feel about that. I would add to that

00:58:10   that a lot of our shows, like this show, Connected, has really moved from a tech

00:58:16   new show to a tech new show driven by personality and so people come to

00:58:21   connected to hear the news and hear what's going on, but also to hear our

00:58:25   take on it and to hear the interplay between the three of us who have been

00:58:29   doing the show for a long time together who are really close. And that in of

00:58:34   itself helps a show stay fresh because as our friendship evolves and as things

00:58:40   come up in life and as you went independent and I went independent and

00:58:45   Federico has taken on iOS reviews, like the way we frame things in the show has

00:58:49   changed and that has just allowed us to evolve the show sort of without any like

00:58:55   direct manipulation of what's going on it's just life has evolved and so the

00:59:00   show has evolved. The Release Notes Twitter account of the podcast and

00:59:07   conference asked as a Release Notes veteran what is Myke's advice for Steven

00:59:13   as he prepares for his talk? So very recently Steven was announced as a

00:59:17   a speaker at the release notes conference which I spoke at last year.

00:59:20   Hopefully I sound better. I just want to say I keynoted. Just saying. Look at me.

00:59:29   My advice to you Steven would be and this is to anybody who's giving any talks and

00:59:33   this will also be for you Kathy because Kathy Mrs. Super in the chat room is

00:59:36   gonna be speaking at all conference. Which is super awesome. Which I'm very excited

00:59:39   excited about. So my advice is give your talk to someone who films you.

00:59:50   Okay. Because you give it to somebody, one person is more scary than a group of

00:59:58   people. Yeah. And when they film you, you can watch it back which is horrific. I

01:00:03   bet. But it helps a lot. I would not suggest giving the talk to the person

01:00:09   that I gave mine to which was Grey.

01:00:10   - I'm not gonna do that.

01:00:11   - Don't do that, that's horrible.

01:00:13   Very useful, but horrible.

01:00:15   - Yeah.

01:00:16   - So I say find somebody you trust,

01:00:19   somebody you trust that you know

01:00:23   will give you honest feedback.

01:00:24   - Right, he's not gonna candy code it

01:00:26   if you're not very good.

01:00:27   - That's why Grey was the right person for me,

01:00:29   because I trusted that he would tell me if it sucked.

01:00:32   - He will.

01:00:33   - But yeah, the filming part is good,

01:00:37   because it also adds a level of pressure to you as well.

01:00:40   So that would be my recommendation there.

01:00:43   - I'm super excited to be speaking.

01:00:45   Really, since it's a great conference last year,

01:00:47   like you said, your keynote is the first one.

01:00:49   It was the smoothest first conference

01:00:52   or event I've ever been to.

01:00:53   You would never know that it was their first time.

01:00:55   - It was amazing.

01:00:56   They looked after me,

01:00:58   they looked after everyone that was there.

01:00:59   They had some really great ideas.

01:01:01   I am very sad that I can't make it,

01:01:03   but it's just a bad time for me on the calendar.

01:01:06   But if you haven't got a ticket to release notes,

01:01:10   you should go.

01:01:11   It's good for app developers,

01:01:14   but it's also good for anybody that has their own business.

01:01:16   I learned some extremely valuable things that week.

01:01:20   - Me too.

01:01:21   - That are staying with me today,

01:01:22   just from people that are very smart

01:01:24   to talk about their business.

01:01:24   And just to say, we mentioned Steven is going there,

01:01:29   but Steven isn't the only really FM host

01:01:31   that's gonna be talking at release notes.

01:01:33   Christina Warren of Rocket will be there,

01:01:36   David Sparks of Free Agents and MacPow Users

01:01:39   will be there as well, as well as some other great folk

01:01:41   who are talking at the conference.

01:01:43   - It's nice too to go to some of these smaller events,

01:01:45   like all release notes, XOXO,

01:01:48   CocoaConf, Yosemite.

01:01:52   These events are really nice because WWDC is so busy.

01:01:56   And if you're a developer, you are in sessions.

01:02:00   And these conferences give you a chance to meet people

01:02:03   and to talk to people outside of a regimented schedule.

01:02:07   It's like Release Notes and XO and all these things

01:02:10   have downtime built into the schedule.

01:02:13   And you're supposed to mingle and meet with people.

01:02:15   And the people that I met at Release Notes,

01:02:17   people I met at XO last year who I'd only known from afar,

01:02:22   like on Twitter or something.

01:02:23   And you get to know them over a weekend at a conference,

01:02:26   and you leave as friends.

01:02:27   And that's really cool, and that's

01:02:29   That's what I'm looking forward to with release notes is hanging out with some people and

01:02:32   meeting new people.

01:02:33   And our final question this week comes from Jimmy and Jimmy asked, "How big do you see

01:02:37   with AFM in two years?"

01:02:39   I have literally no idea anymore.

01:02:42   We're bigger now than I thought we would be in two years, so I'm with you that I don't

01:02:47   really know.

01:02:48   Like Myke said, I don't think we're going to be doubling again as far as the number

01:02:51   of shows, but I do think, and we said this last year, and we've been doing it, pushing

01:02:56   into other topic areas.

01:02:58   So we've got liftoff, which is about space.

01:03:02   We had a material a while ago now,

01:03:04   but breaking out of that mold has been important to us

01:03:06   and we will continue to do that,

01:03:09   to move away from just covering Apple

01:03:12   and even consumer technology on the whole.

01:03:14   I think we're gonna start adding things to that.

01:03:17   And that's exciting to me.

01:03:19   And so I think for me, I don't think about relay size

01:03:24   anymore about the number of shows

01:03:25   a number of hosts but the number of like topic areas or communities that Relay is

01:03:31   a part of and for me I think that that will continue to to grow. Oh Lucas just

01:03:37   asked in the chat room. Really the last question. I was hoping someone would ask

01:03:40   this how do we come up with a name? It was terrible. There was multiple days of

01:03:46   fighting trying to come up with names. We were together for part of it yeah and

01:03:50   then you went home and it continued. Still couldn't come up with one that we

01:03:53   both liked and then that we both liked and was available domain wise right and

01:03:59   I couldn't remember how we learned on relay FM until recently when our

01:04:06   designer Frank suggested he reminded me that it was his suggestion relay FM was

01:04:12   his idea because we were so stuck at that point that we asked for his help

01:04:16   and he came up with the name relay FM because it fit the things that we were

01:04:19   looking for audio based technology based there are answers in both and then the

01:04:25   the idea of the relay the things being passed from person to person like topics

01:04:30   being passed from person to person the shows kind of all having a link between

01:04:34   them all and that's any company between us yeah you know with the times are

01:04:38   different so we had a name before that we both liked in hindsight it would've

01:04:43   been limiting well we didn't do it it would have been designed limiting yeah

01:04:47   but it was a trademark issue where it was not available and so we went with

01:04:53   Relay and I have no regrets about that choice. No I like it I love it it's a

01:04:57   word that exists that you can spell. One of the things that I think has changed a

01:05:03   lot is we were very set at the start that we would always refer to it as Relay FM

01:05:07   always refer to it as Relay FM and very quickly we started just referring to the

01:05:11   company as Relay which is fine I don't think it's bad I don't think it's wrong

01:05:15   but it was just funny that we were so set on it,

01:05:17   it was always gonna be Relay FM.

01:05:19   - Yeah.

01:05:20   - And then I think within the first couple of days,

01:05:21   we both just started calling it Relay.

01:05:22   - Yeah, I try to, when I write as the company.

01:05:25   - When I write, it's always Relay FM.

01:05:27   - But yeah, just in conversation, it kind of becomes Relay,

01:05:29   and that's fine.

01:05:30   And you know, we get called on the press Relay.fm,

01:05:35   which that one does bother me, but I can't control it,

01:05:37   so what are you gonna do?

01:05:40   - So before we wrap up today,

01:05:41   I just wanted to mention again

01:05:42   that our membership shows are now out.

01:05:44   - Yes.

01:05:45   you will have gotten an email that has a link to the RSS feed that you can subscribe to

01:05:52   which will hold your member content. So this will include now the many members only shows

01:05:59   that we're posting over the next couple of weeks. We have so many, we're planning to

01:06:02   just do this into August, we have so many that we may actually be bleeding over into

01:06:05   September a little bit now which is amazing. So the Connected one is up. Connected was

01:06:08   the first one and we've also as of today we have posted Analogue and Bonanza and today's

01:06:14   one as we record this is the cortex upgrade crossover which I am so proud of.

01:06:19   It is amazing. We did a text adventure in the wild west there is a trailer that's

01:06:25   floating around it's we played it a cortex played an upgrade you should you

01:06:31   should become a member to listen to this even if you just for all of these shows

01:06:35   actually you should become a member so you can check them out we hope that you

01:06:39   will stick around so you can go to relay.fm/membership to find out more

01:06:43   and sign up we would really appreciate that you do this and also going forward

01:06:48   you know we've done like show pilots and stuff where we've sent we've we did free

01:06:52   agents this way we did canvas this way we'll be now posting those to this

01:06:57   members only feed as well as some other stuff that might pop up so this has

01:07:00   become a real benefit of being a member as you get this special members only

01:07:05   like out of context content from your favorite hosts so you go check that out

01:07:11   Alright, we'll be back next week. Is Federico back next week?

01:07:16   Yeah, I think we're recording late in the week.

01:07:18   Yeah, so he'll be back from vacation, so we'll be back together as a three, provided

01:07:22   that Steven gets through whatever this is, and that I come back alive from New York.

01:07:28   My arm hasn't fallen off. If you want to find the show notes for this week, head on

01:07:32   over to relay.fm/connected/104. Thanks again to our great sponsors for this week's episode,

01:07:40   the fine folk over at Freshbooks, Pingdom and Squarespace.

01:07:44   If you wanna find Steven online, he is @ismh on Twitter.

01:07:48   I am @imike, I-M-Y-K-E.

01:07:50   Steven writes over at 512pixels.net.

01:07:53   And I am @mikewasright.com sometimes.

01:07:57   Thank you so much to everyone that listens to this show,

01:08:00   has been listening to this show over the 104 episodes,

01:08:03   and the now two years that we've been doing this thing.

01:08:06   So thank you so much for helping us

01:08:09   and for allowing us to do this thing that we love

01:08:12   by tuning in and supporting our sponsors

01:08:15   and being our members and all of that stuff.

01:08:17   I can't tell you how much it means to me

01:08:20   that we're able to do this.

01:08:22   And it's purely because all of you out there

01:08:24   decide that you wanna tune in to listen to us.

01:08:26   So thank you so much and we'll be back next time.