94: I Have No Idea When WWDC Is


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:07   From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 94. Today's show is brought to you by our

00:00:13   friends Squarespace and Braintree. My name is Myke Hurley. I am joined by Federico Vittucci.

00:00:18   Ciao Federico. Ciao Myke. And Steven Hackett. Howdy Steven Hackett. That's not how you do it.

00:00:28   Really caught me off track there, honestly.

00:00:30   This is how I do it today. Everything's out of the window.

00:00:33   Yeah, we're going to jump right in. We're not doing any follow-up.

00:00:37   We were already planning on recording a little bit later this week due to some other things.

00:00:41   And about an hour before we recorded, Apple dropped a bunch of news.

00:00:45   And so we had like three pages of WWDC predictions, which we're going to do, I think, maybe, an abbreviated version of that at the end of the show.

00:00:54   This show is going to be really focused on the App Store changes that were just announced.

00:00:58   But first, Myke, you wanted to talk to us a little bit about Google Live Photos.

00:01:02   Okay, so this app is called Motion Seals.

00:01:07   It may as well be called Google Live Photos.

00:01:09   I don't know why you'd give it any other name.

00:01:12   So Google dropped this app last night, which basically takes a look at your photo roll,

00:01:17   looks at all of the live photos, does some magic to them, and then allows you to create

00:01:22   movie files and gifs out of them. Google is doing something with their AI big data photo

00:01:28   processing stuff that they've been working on I assume with Google Photos to take a look

00:01:33   at what's going on inside of your live photos, stabilize them and as _DavidSmith put it on

00:01:39   Twitter makes them look like you meant to take them rather than just as an extra bonus

00:01:43   to your photograph. If you've not tried this app it's free, it's mind blowing and effectively

00:01:51   all have done a better job with processing of live photos than I think Apple ever could

00:01:58   and have kind of made Apple look bad in my opinion because what this app spits out is

00:02:06   incredible and if you've played around with it, I found this whilst messing around yesterday,

00:02:11   when you click into one of the photos there is the little logo that they have in the bottom,

00:02:18   If you hit it, it shows you what the live photo looks like and then what the motion

00:02:22   still looks like and you can see the difference between them and it really kind of shows up

00:02:27   how good they are.

00:02:28   I am just blown away by this application and I have one wish and I really wish this could

00:02:36   happen that I could save these back out as live photos again.

00:02:39   I wish it was possible to do that because I would just be processing all of my live

00:02:44   photos that I care about through this application and saving them.

00:02:47   a shame that you can only output them as GIFs and movies. Blown away by this.

00:02:52   If anything, it's an argument in favor of how Google can use, what do they call it,

00:02:57   big data to kind of ship a consumer app that's easy to use, easy to understand, and the final

00:03:05   product doesn't look like a lot of work, but in reality Google is able to do this and to

00:03:11   pull this off because they look at a lot of pictures, they look at a lot of live photos

00:03:15   from iOS users. They know how to stabilize them, how to make them look pretty. And the

00:03:21   end result is this pretty nice package, but actually there's a lot of data behind the

00:03:26   scenes. And if Google starts doing this kind of consumer-friendly, easy-to-use iOS apps

00:03:33   based on their own Cloud Vision APIs or all of the data that they can gather from, I don't

00:03:40   I don't know, photos, emails, you know, you can make the same argument for Google inbox

00:03:45   maybe, but if Google starts doing more of this, I think it'll be great because it'll,

00:03:50   you know, sort of raise the competition for Apple to make even better apps. Because I

00:03:54   feel like having tried these motion stills, now my live photos look all blurry and, you

00:04:00   know, what do you call something that moves a lot? Motiony? I don't know. Shaky?

00:04:05   Yeah, unstable, maybe?

00:04:07   Unstable, yeah. Motiony is better.

00:04:09   I have to say I'm maybe in the camp the small camp of people that absolutely loves live

00:04:16   photos. I leave it on constantly and I am always surprised and happy about some of the

00:04:24   little things that come through with live photos. I think it is a fantastic feature.

00:04:31   This app has really shown me though how much better they could be and I want my live photos

00:04:38   to just look like this. Google has done something kind of incredible here. It's

00:04:44   one of those things where it's like this is it as you kind of mentioned Federico

00:04:47   about you know the the using the data to create a consumer product this is kind

00:04:53   of just like a really small thing that they've made you know it looks like a

00:04:56   very small utility and it's like this is what we can do. Yes. You know and it's

00:05:02   kind of like holy moly okay you know that's kind of it's like wow

00:05:08   Apple would have loved to have been able to do this

00:05:11   I would assume this just cannot be done

00:05:15   without all of that big data processing that occurs

00:05:19   and the crazy thing is like you're not uploading these photos anywhere to have

00:05:23   this happen

00:05:24   it's just doing it and that's what I don't understand like how is it doing it

00:05:28   I'm blown away by it. Absolutely fantastic application

00:05:32   I love just looking at them. Got a few bugs

00:05:35   in places. I mean, I've had a few issues, but the overall

00:05:39   debut, I would say, and this is a Google Research project, it's not even

00:05:43   meant to be

00:05:43   like a full-blown app launch, you know, it's a small utility from Google Research.

00:05:47   Really well done, really nice idea.

00:05:50   Yeah, I really hope that, like, just one of those little

00:05:53   SDK points for 10 is to be able to save live photos,

00:05:58   you know, that would be real great. I would be very very happy about that,

00:06:01   because then they could add it to this application,

00:06:03   and then I could do some processing and that would be awesome.

00:06:06   Come on Apple, make me happy.

00:06:09   Alright, so we kind of alluded to this at the top.

00:06:13   Apple released some huge news today

00:06:16   via some interviews with some news outlets

00:06:20   about App Store changes.

00:06:22   So we want to get into those, but before we do,

00:06:24   let me take a moment to thank our first sponsor of this week's episode

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00:07:36   of this show and Relay FM.

00:07:39   Alright so, let's pick a couple of news outlets here. So Phil Schiller sat down in the last

00:07:45   day or two with a few, namely The Verge, The Loop and also John Gruber at Daring Fireball.

00:07:52   I'll include links to those because it's a few different takes.

00:07:56   I mainly spent time with The Verge's article.

00:07:58   They had a really good in-depth article by Lauren Goode, excellent reporting as always,

00:08:03   and they did a good job of really making it a pretty article too, which is always a nice

00:08:07   thing.

00:08:09   This is big stuff.

00:08:13   All of these changes are applying to all of their app stores and they've kind of got two,

00:08:20   three really big things here.

00:08:22   So the first up is something that we're all expecting them to do on stage at WWDC regardless

00:08:29   of whatever changes are happening, which is to acknowledge the fact that app review has

00:08:34   changed and they are making it faster.

00:08:38   really seem to go into too much detail as to how they're doing this, right? I haven't

00:08:43   seen anything here. Have you guys seen anything from any of the reports about the how?

00:08:48   They just said "new processes", whatever it means.

00:08:52   And I think that's probably all we're going to find out, right? I assume maybe Apple want

00:08:56   to limit the amount of ways that people could try and game this system, because there's

00:09:00   clearly a change with more automated processing, I think, which is what we'd all assumed anyway.

00:09:06   but this has changed significantly. Gruber has some more details, if you will,

00:09:14   so according to his interview with Schiller, it's three things making the app review

00:09:19   faster. Tool improvements, so technology, staff changes, and policy changes. And apparently

00:09:27   Gruber asked Schiller about these policy changes, but Schiller didn't want to say anything.

00:09:32   Of course he didn't. There you go. But a good statistic, we're at the point now, this is

00:09:37   from Apple, that 50% of submitted apps are now reviewed within 24 hours and 90% are reviewed

00:09:43   within 48. Seeing that statistic coming from them, we were kind of guessing it, that is

00:09:49   an astronomically big change. 50% within 24 hours.

00:09:54   And in the Loop article, Phil Schiller says that it's like 100,000 app reviews a week,

00:09:59   which I figured it was high, that number seems bonkers to me.

00:10:03   And so you would think that to get that many reviews done faster that whatever they change,

00:10:10   whatever they're not saying has to be significant to make such a big impact.

00:10:14   Yeah, because then you're assuming from that, like you couldn't do with any reasonable amount

00:10:20   of stuff 50,000 apps in 24 hours over a weekly basis, right?

00:10:27   It's just no way you could do that.

00:10:28   It just doesn't seem like something that you'd be able to give enough time to right you following me

00:10:33   I know that the numbers sound weird the way that I say them

00:10:35   But if you imagine that like if there's a hundred thousand a week 50% of them in 24 hours

00:10:40   How many people would you need to make that happen if it was fully human reviewed?

00:10:44   There's no way that they could do that

00:10:46   So they've got to be increasing it there

00:10:48   But this is good to see that it's been acknowledged because now that it's been acknowledged

00:10:52   I think maybe developers will be able to try and rely on it a little bit more right that you maybe will buy

00:10:58   48 hours in now rather than two weeks if 90% within 48 hours Federico this has

00:11:05   got to be great for you right when you're thinking about embargoes and

00:11:07   stuff well it brings a few changes like it used to be the developers will give

00:11:13   me an advance notice of maybe like a couple of weeks I've just realized for

00:11:18   you like the bad point is now like you used to get a week to write a review

00:11:22   now you might get four hours to do it no now I just gotta get started beforehand

00:11:26   and so a developer has to tell me, "Look, we're trying to submit an app by next week."

00:11:32   And at that point, I got to start writing because then I know that app review will happen

00:11:35   within two days. But the idea here is that... And of course, Apple doesn't want to confirm

00:11:40   this, but the idea is that alongside better automated tools to kind of test the quality

00:11:48   of an iOS app to see if it crashes or if it has private APIs, the idea is that human app

00:11:56   app reviewers can maybe fast-track apps from trusted, long-time developers, and Gruber

00:12:03   says that this is an impression that he has. Apple doesn't want to confirm or deny this,

00:12:09   so we can only speculate. But I feel like it's one of those things that behind the scenes

00:12:13   they would make sense. You know, if maybe Tapbots, for example, they have been developing

00:12:18   Tweetbot for like five or six years now, and they go to submit an update, and the Apple

00:12:24   automation tools, go look to the binary of the app, they test the app, it doesn't crash,

00:12:29   it doesn't have any private APIs, the human reviewer has assigned this app, he sees street

00:12:35   bot, he sees the reputation of the developer, and he goes like, okay, let's fast track this,

00:12:39   I don't need to look at this at all. So maybe it's, you know, that's the kind of policy

00:12:44   change that fieldshooter is kind of hinting at, and of course Apple doesn't want to confirm

00:12:50   this because otherwise developers will go and ask for "so how do I become a long time

00:12:56   trusted developer, how can my app be fast tracked for review without the human reviewer

00:13:01   getting back to me with every single question about my app?" I feel like we will never know

00:13:07   about this, but if it is the case it makes sense.

00:13:11   I would feel that there's probably a score assigned to a developer, right? How many times

00:13:17   have you had to expedite review? How many times have you had crashing apps? How many

00:13:21   times have you broken rules? That kind of stuff.

00:13:24   Refunds, refunds, for example.

00:13:26   All of that stuff, I mean this is kind of a logical way to do it, it assigns to a score

00:13:30   and there's a threshold for score and if you've got a high enough score they just let you

00:13:34   through on the "does it crash? No? Well then we're probably good to go." Because the idea

00:13:38   being then that you want to be a good citizen, you don't want to do things you maybe shouldn't

00:13:43   do because it would bring your score down if we think of it that way.

00:13:47   So that is App Review. I expect we probably won't hear about this one on stage now. I

00:13:55   think because, you know, we'll talk about this later, but WWDC is just around the corner.

00:14:00   They've done all of this now. I still think some of this will be recapped, but I think,

00:14:04   you know, we all expected this was going to happen. Apple knows we've been talking about

00:14:07   it for like a month. They've confirmed it. Job done, right? Like, we're all good now,

00:14:11   You've given us what we were looking for.

00:14:15   So this is another change here.

00:14:17   So subscriptions.

00:14:20   Subscriptions have existed in the App Store for a long time.

00:14:23   They've been fixed to specific types of applications like media applications, dating applications,

00:14:29   that kind of stuff.

00:14:30   You could have subscriptions, you know, like productivity stuff like Microsoft Office apps

00:14:34   and things like that.

00:14:35   You could have subscriptions in a, you know, you'd be able to manage them in a really old

00:14:41   looking part of the app store. Have you ever been to that part when you go and manage your

00:14:44   subscriptions and you get pinstripe screens? It's pretty bad. I had to cancel one recently

00:14:50   because I signed up for an app that I had to subscribe to to use and I only needed it

00:14:55   for like one thing so I went in there to get rid of it and I was like "Oh, hello iOS 6!"

00:14:59   I didn't know you were hiding back here. But, okay, so what we have here basically is now

00:15:07   it seems all applications can have a subscription model

00:15:12   and it will kind of be upfront

00:15:15   as a

00:15:16   thing in the app store so

00:15:18   what we have was like maybe buy and get we may now see subscribe and you'll

00:15:24   subscribe for a fee

00:15:25   and it will be monthly annually however the developer chooses to to do it

00:15:31   this is one thing that's a little ambiguous in reading these articles and then

00:15:34   reading a page on Apple's developer website which will have the link for in

00:15:37   the show notes as well.

00:15:38   Apple really outlines two different types of apps that can do this.

00:15:42   The first one being content apps like what we've seen before and the second one

00:15:46   being services which we've seen some apps do this like Spotify and Evernote

00:15:51   you can pay through the App Store mechanism for their service and Gruber

00:15:58   points out like maybe Tweetbot or Twitterific for instance could implement

00:16:02   this thing to have regular income coming in so they can continue to update their apps.

00:16:08   But the way the Apple page reads, that is really not for that.

00:16:13   This says that although all categories of apps will be eligible, this model is not appropriate

00:16:17   for every app.

00:16:18   That needs to be something that comes with a service with "ongoing value worth the recurring

00:16:24   payment."

00:16:25   Yeah, but couldn't that just be ongoing development?

00:16:28   Like the quotes that Schiller gives to the...

00:16:31   The Verge seemed to indicate that. He talks about games.

00:16:35   And Apple calls out games as a service.

00:16:38   That massive multiplayer online games are a service. Right, but could news apps be

00:16:43   services?

00:16:44   Like would you class Tweetbot as a news app? No.

00:16:47   And thinking about an app like One Writer,

00:16:50   just to throw one that's on my home screen out, it's a text editor. I don't think that they

00:16:55   could get away with

00:16:56   doing some sort of auto-renewable subscription.

00:16:59   What I think this will lead to is undoubtedly as this rolls out later, I think later this

00:17:04   year, there will be articles, we will write about, we will write them and talk about them,

00:17:10   where a developer tries to do a subscription and Apple says no and it makes sense to everyone

00:17:15   else that they should get in or vice versa that someone, you know, who writes a text

00:17:19   editor app tries to do an auto subscription.

00:17:22   We're all like, what the hell?

00:17:23   This is not an ongoing service.

00:17:25   There's going to be middle ground here that they have to figure out.

00:17:27   Like, you know, I completely agree with what you're saying, but this is where it gets ambiguous

00:17:31   from The Verge.

00:17:32   He suggests many enterprise apps can move to subscription and that professional apps

00:17:36   that require a lot of maintenance and new features and versions would be a good fit.

00:17:40   Like isn't that every app?

00:17:43   It's really difficult.

00:17:44   Is OmniFocus suitable for a new subscription on the App Store?

00:17:48   It may because you get a sync service.

00:17:50   I mean, I don't know.

00:17:51   I don't know where the line is.

00:17:52   Yeah.

00:17:53   It's tricky to understand because is Peacock or...

00:17:56   - You know, I was just gonna bring up James, right?

00:17:58   'Cause he'll be the one to break it for everyone, right?

00:18:01   - Yes, I don't know, is drafts a service

00:18:04   or do you have to have some kind of web service component?

00:18:08   Like I don't understand, I get it for content

00:18:11   like Netflix and Spotify and, you know, HBO, whatever.

00:18:15   When it comes down to, you know, indie

00:18:20   or not necessarily indie, but just utilities.

00:18:22   So like a text editor or something like Ulysses.

00:18:27   Do you subscribe to Ulysses?

00:18:29   I don't know.

00:18:30   I struggle to understand this for two reasons.

00:18:32   One, because it's different from what we used to have,

00:18:35   and two, because the Apple documentation is kind of vague

00:18:37   right now.

00:18:39   And it'll be interesting to see what Apple explains next week.

00:18:43   Because Schiller says, we wanted to announce this

00:18:47   so developers can come to WWDC and attend sessions

00:18:50   about these changes while already having the knowledge of what is going on, what is changing.

00:18:56   So there will be sessions about this next week. And I want to understand, because a

00:19:03   lot of the articles that I read today seem to kind of follow the idea that, according

00:19:09   to Apple, the future on the App Store is subscriptions. And all of these articles mention developers

00:19:15   have been asking for paid upgrade pricing for paid apps for a long time. And this is

00:19:22   the answer. But then you go look at the Apple documentation and it says, "Look, you've got

00:19:26   to understand subscriptions are not for everyone, and either your app falls in the content area

00:19:31   or in the service area, and you still have to remember that there's different models

00:19:36   that you need to know before considering subscriptions. So you can do freemium, you can do free, you

00:19:44   you can do paid model, you can do Paynium, that's an ugly word, but it's on Apple's website.

00:19:51   So it's not like Apple is saying "Look, everyone, drop your paid apps, drop your in-app purchases,

00:19:56   we're all doing subscriptions right now". There are some changes, but my interpretation

00:20:02   is that this is definitely not for everyone. At least not right now. Mostly because I don't

00:20:10   if Apple will accept everyone. I mean, if I have a calculator and I've been developing

00:20:15   this calculator for six years, is it like a service? Is it a recurring value, whatever

00:20:23   Apple calls it? No clue.

00:20:27   This reminds me of, I guess, App Store 1.0, right? Like, the Verge calls this App Store

00:20:31   2.0, which is a funny line, but I can kind of see it, in that here's a bunch of rules,

00:20:37   we're not gonna fully define them yet

00:20:39   because we don't know yet.

00:20:41   And that's why, and again,

00:20:42   like the idea of them putting it out there now

00:20:45   and then talking to developers next week

00:20:47   and then waiting for apps to be submitted

00:20:50   over the next couple of months,

00:20:51   because it's like, okay, what are we gonna do?

00:20:54   Like, where does this work?

00:20:55   We don't know if this works.

00:20:56   And it is that idea that like,

00:20:58   something that OmniFocus submits,

00:20:59   and you're like, okay, we'll look at this app,

00:21:01   we look how expensive it is,

00:21:03   we look at the work that goes into it, that makes sense.

00:21:05   but then you look at something like, I don't know,

00:21:08   123 Notetaker, right, which has had like one update

00:21:12   in the last four years, and it doesn't do anything.

00:21:16   You know, I'm sorry if this app exists, it probably does,

00:21:18   and it's probably not good.

00:21:19   - 123 Notetaker.

00:21:20   - Mm-hmm, you know, and they look at it and be like,

00:21:22   well, it doesn't make sense here,

00:21:23   and they kind of have to try and judge it that way.

00:21:26   There's still more to go, we haven't spoken about it all yet.

00:21:31   There's more pricing tiers,

00:21:32   There's now 200 across countries and currencies.

00:21:36   And The Verge points out a good thing,

00:21:37   that like imagine a company like Netflix,

00:21:40   they could have their regular pricing in the US,

00:21:43   and if they've got an emerging market or a new company,

00:21:45   they can have a different pricing tier

00:21:47   and a different currency in that country.

00:21:49   I think that's really cool.

00:21:50   And in the same idea, if you're charging,

00:21:53   you're a developer and you've got a subscription

00:21:55   either currently right now,

00:21:57   or a subscription in a year's time,

00:22:00   and you wanna raise it for new customers,

00:22:02   You can do that and your current customers stay

00:22:04   at the previous pricing.

00:22:06   I thought this is also a really good way

00:22:07   to do introductory pricing, right?

00:22:09   You have a new update out, bring the price down,

00:22:11   and then you put it up a few months later

00:22:13   and you keep the old people on the low price

00:22:15   and new people on the new price.

00:22:17   And users are alerted of any pricing changes

00:22:19   before it's made.

00:22:22   I'm interested to see what happens there, right?

00:22:24   'Cause this is stuff that we don't know yet,

00:22:26   but these like implementation details.

00:22:28   Let's say I'm using 123 Notetaker

00:22:30   and I'm paying every month because it's a really great app now.

00:22:34   And then they want to change it to $100 a month,

00:22:38   and I don't want to pay that anymore, and I say no.

00:22:41   What happens? Does the app go away?

00:22:43   Can I not use it anymore? Do I just not get any more updates?

00:22:48   Like what happens in that scenario?

00:22:50   In theory, you stop paying and the service ends.

00:22:54   Right, but then there's the app delete.

00:22:57   You know, there's all of these, like how does it stop?

00:22:59   shows you a message that says "look you're not paying anymore, you're a cheap guy, you

00:23:04   cannot use this app".

00:23:05   But it's like "1, 2, 3 note taker, you're charging me $100 a month, you're taking my

00:23:09   notes ransom". And they're like "well that's how it is". And in the same vein, if I delete

00:23:15   an application, just a subscription cancel, because currently they don't. These descriptions

00:23:20   that exist right now, if you delete the app, the subscription continues. So I would like

00:23:26   to see stuff like that changed but maybe it's because it's a real old system.

00:23:31   Yeah.

00:23:32   Something too listed in the subscription prices on Apple's website is a way to kind of fake

00:23:39   free trials where if you have an auto-renewable subscription you can set like the first subscription

00:23:48   length which you can do like monthly every two months every six months or a year you

00:23:53   you can set the first one to be free.

00:23:56   And so someone can download a free app and have a free subscription to do whatever the

00:24:00   app does and then they don't get billed until the free trial period is over unless they

00:24:06   go in and turn it off.

00:24:08   That's kind of cool.

00:24:10   It is but...

00:24:11   Well that's not new is it?

00:24:13   Well...

00:24:14   I don't know.

00:24:15   It's...

00:24:16   I think some of the wording here is different but the...

00:24:18   interesting to me in it is that does is

00:24:24   there going to be a temptation for

00:24:25   developers if you download an app and

00:24:27   you don't pay for a subscription. You know

00:24:29   right now we think of subscriptions as you

00:24:31   know I download the newspaper app but no

00:24:32   new articles come in unless I pay. Are we

00:24:35   going to be in a world where you

00:24:36   download an app and it does nothing it's

00:24:38   just a shell until you turn on a

00:24:41   subscription and if that's true that's

00:24:43   where we're going then this free trial

00:24:45   language makes more sense because I can download the app and I can actually see

00:24:50   what it's like and then if you know if it's not for me then it's not for me but

00:24:53   I don't know I don't know how much this is new or not but it's something that I

00:24:57   think some developers are going to be playing with and trying to implement in

00:25:00   new ways. Yeah because it like flat out says on developer.apple.com for example

00:25:07   for a monthly subscription you can offer users a seven day or one month free trial.

00:25:10   Now the difference here and you're right Federico this has existed before the

00:25:14   difference here is if OmniFocus goes to a subscription model, which it couldn't

00:25:19   have done before, if it can do that, that is a very different scenario, right? Like

00:25:25   you're now in the part where OmniFocus can give a free trial which they

00:25:30   couldn't do before. I feel like the bigger question here.

00:25:35   So let's assume that the Apple documentation is not clear yet but any

00:25:42   any developer, like Gruber says, Tweetbot or Twitterific, whatever, will be able to

00:25:48   use this model, so free subscription as a trial, and then charge, I don't know, annually

00:25:55   or every two years for a version of an app, and then, you know, another subscription when

00:26:00   the current version is updated, like a major update, the developer decides.

00:26:05   So let's assume that everyone will be able to do this.

00:26:09   Would you guys pay for your text editor or your graphics editing app or your task manager?

00:26:18   Would you subscribe to those apps? How does this possible change make you feel?

00:26:23   Okay. Lots of my friends are developers. And I love them all and I want them to eat. And

00:26:33   I'm happy to pay for software.

00:26:36   But I have to say I'm a little uncomfortable with the idea of every app on my home screen

00:26:42   I pay monthly for it.

00:26:44   There's just like a, like that could really start adding up right?

00:26:49   If I'm paying $2 a month for 20 apps as opposed to like $5 a year for them or something.

00:26:58   And I know that what it does is like quadruples the revenue that these people can get.

00:27:02   But what that also does is quadruple the amount of money I have to pay.

00:27:06   And it quadruples the app fatigue that a lot of people are already feeling.

00:27:11   So I don't know.

00:27:13   Maybe what it is then is I just pick and choose my apps more and I download less new apps

00:27:19   because I don't want to enter into a myriad of new subscription prizes.

00:27:24   Maybe I don't download a new game or two games every week for like £2 a pop because I'm

00:27:31   concerned that I don't want to pay £2 a month in case I don't play this game and don't delete

00:27:36   it yet because like for some people I will download an application and I don't touch

00:27:42   it for a while right like I download a game and I don't play it for a while because of

00:27:46   whatever reason but I've downloaded it I'm gonna keep it until I check it out and I'm

00:27:49   just thinking like will it change the way that I approach buying applications like will

00:27:56   Will it be that initially way too many people jump on this?

00:28:01   The original app store, right?

00:28:02   People just ran in and they were like, "This app costs 20 pounds and we all pay for it

00:28:08   because we had no idea what we were doing."

00:28:11   Is that what's going to happen?

00:28:12   I don't know.

00:28:13   I feel like I could end up in a scenario where I have to make more decisions than I do right

00:28:18   now, where right now it's super easy.

00:28:20   I just think to myself, "Oh, here's that money," and it's gone.

00:28:24   while I go "hmm, do I want to subscribe to this?" and then I don't ever download it,

00:28:28   and that developer doesn't get any money out of me then, where they might have got some

00:28:32   out of me before.

00:28:33   The upside, Myke, so my counter-argument would be, if everyone, or if a lot of developers

00:28:40   at least, switch to this model, you will actually download more apps because of the free trials.

00:28:46   So you will get to try more apps, and eventually, once you find something that works for you,

00:28:53   will start paying for that app, so you will have more choice initially, and then you will

00:28:58   narrow down your choices to the app that works for you, you will subscribe to that app, and

00:29:05   it's like the best apps will survive, if you will, you know, it comes down to the quality

00:29:12   and kind of the purpose of an app, if it has the features that you're looking for, if you

00:29:16   like the design, so the better app succeeds, you know, so you will be able to download

00:29:22   bunch of different 1-3 note takers, and then you choose the note taker that you prefer,

00:29:29   you subscribe to that one, and it looks like there's some nice changes for developers once

00:29:35   you subscribe. I mean, you can have multiple tiers for levels, such as bronze or silver

00:29:43   or gold, I'm thinking for my own subscriptions for Club Maxories I could have a gold membership

00:29:50   that is better than the normal membership, that's now possible with the new subscription

00:29:55   APIs. Or you can have cheaper prices for emerging markets. That used to not be possible with

00:30:03   the previous subscription APIs. So once you do get a subscriber, it looks like as a developer

00:30:09   you will have better tools, which is a nice change. As a customer, as a consumer, I think

00:30:15   there will be a spec... I mean, and that's a big if. If developers of the kind of apps

00:30:21   that we use will be able to do this, I think there will be a change of kind of habits,

00:30:26   the way that we discover app. Apps used to be, we do our research before, we read app

00:30:31   reviews, and then we choose the app and we get one shot. We buy that app and it has to

00:30:37   work for us because the refunds are terrible. Now, it looks like the way that things will

00:30:44   be in the future is, we'll try an app from the App Store with a free subscription, we'll

00:30:49   try them all, and then we'll choose one and we'll start paying for that one. It's different.

00:30:55   That feels like, as a consumer, that feels like a nicer way to do it, right? You download

00:31:01   a bunch of free apps because they're all subscriptions and you try them and you pick the one that

00:31:04   lasts. But it's like understanding where that's gonna fall, right? Because then I just imagine

00:31:09   that like, as I say, let's say that the 10, 15 apps I have on my home screen will go to

00:31:14   subscription. So that's very different to the way that I'm doing it right now. And it's

00:31:18   just trying to see how this ends up shaking out. But I agree, there are routes in all

00:31:23   directions. This could either be really, really great or not so great. And it's wondering

00:31:28   where it falls within that greatness spectrum to see how this actually starts shaking out.

00:31:34   There is one thing that we haven't mentioned yet, which is maybe the biggest piece of news

00:31:38   in all of this, the Apple cut percentage drop. So everybody knows it's 70/30. Apple gets

00:31:46   30, the developer gets 70. After somebody is subscribed for a year to an application,

00:31:53   Apple's cut is now dropped by 50% to 15% is what they take. So it's cut in half. And this,

00:32:02   interestingly this new revenue split starts on June 13th for all applications that currently

00:32:09   use subscription. That's weird, right? Like why are they doing... like all of the rest

00:32:14   of this is happening in the fall. We'll be with iOS 10 I'm sure. Why are they doing the

00:32:21   revenue part on Monday? I mean maybe it's a good, you know, good faith effort, goodwill

00:32:29   kinda thing, where they say "hey let's go ahead and get the clock counting now"?

00:32:32   I'll tell you why, Myke, because there's Logic Pro is coming to the iPad and there

00:32:36   will be a subscription.

00:32:37   Yeah, but there is no subscription currently.

00:32:40   And also Apple keeps a hundred percent of that. Well, whatever.

00:32:44   I was wondering like maybe someone like Amazon?

00:32:48   Maybe someone like Netflix? Like they're like

00:32:51   "It's okay guys, we're gonna take less from you"?

00:32:55   You know, this is interesting and I feel like it kind of puts the spotlight on giving developers

00:33:03   the proper recognition.

00:33:04   Because initially, Apple gives you a lot of advantages with using the AppSource, so you

00:33:09   don't have to care about hosting and search, because when it works, there's the AppSource

00:33:15   search.

00:33:16   It gives you promotion, it gives you a CDN for screenshots and videos, so it makes sense

00:33:21   to ask for a bigger cut initially.

00:33:24   And then, after a year of service, you know, when Apple has kind of recouped their costs,

00:33:29   it makes sense to switch to, you know, to give more money to the developer, because

00:33:35   the developer is doing most of the work maintaining an app.

00:33:40   It's interesting because just today, before Apple announced these changes, I saw the developers

00:33:48   of Sketch, the popular Mac app for designers, they also basically changed to a subscription

00:33:55   model. So Sketch very famously exited the Mac App Store a few months ago, and today

00:34:04   they had this announcement, which was kind of confusing at first, and they added a bunch

00:34:09   of clarifications, that there's no longer going to be major versions, major upgrades,

00:34:16   like from Sketch 3.9 to Sketch 4.0. Instead, they will switch to a subscription model that

00:34:23   you pay for an app, like $100, you can use that app for a year with free updates, and

00:34:32   then you will have to pay $99 again for another year of usage. But unlike most subscription

00:34:43   when, what you mentioned Myke, what happens if I stop paying, the Sketch developers have

00:34:48   figured out this system where you stop paying, you will get stuck on the current version,

00:34:54   it'll keep working, you will just no longer get free updates or the next version of the

00:34:59   app. And this is interesting timing, because just today Sketch announces this model, and

00:35:05   Apple comes out with these changes. I have to wonder, I mean, I see no relation between

00:35:10   the two, but I have to wonder if at some point maybe Sketch will reconsider the idea of not

00:35:15   making an iOS app, an iPad version, or coming back to the Mac App Store. It does seem to

00:35:21   me like Apple is laying the groundwork for developers of this kind of pro software, where,

00:35:27   you know, the really heavy users want to pay for those apps. Maybe in the future we'll

00:35:33   finally see, you know, Sketch for the iPad Pro, or a real Photoshop for the iPad Pro,

00:35:38   You know? It does seem to me like this is not for everyone, so if you come up with a

00:35:44   $2.99 utility to change text from lowercase to uppercase, maybe a subscription is not

00:35:51   what you're looking for. But even if you're a small team, but making a really popular

00:35:56   app such as Sketch, maybe this is something that will make it possible for you to have

00:36:01   an iOS version, or to go back to the App Store and the Mac App Store.

00:36:08   implications for the Mac App Store are

00:36:11   really interesting because the the

00:36:13   pricing thing has come up. I mean

00:36:15   sandboxing is a big issue too.

00:36:17   We'll see if that makes mention on

00:36:19   Monday. But you know Sketch actually just

00:36:21   this morning rolled out an announcement

00:36:24   about subscription pricing for their app

00:36:26   and they very famously very loudly pulled

00:36:29   out of the Mac App Store. What was it? I think

00:36:31   the end of last year. So I don't know if

00:36:33   this is enough to bring them back or

00:36:35   bring somebody back without fixing

00:36:38   sandboxing but it is when I think about this I can see the repercussions for the

00:36:43   Mac I can see how it would it would make the Mac App Store potentially more

00:36:49   inviting to developers if you think about some of the big software on the

00:36:53   Mac now I mean I'd pay for office and I pay for the Adobe Creative Cloud Suite

00:36:58   both monthly and it comes out of my credit card and it's done and up until now

00:37:04   this has not been possible for developers who want or need

00:37:10   you know ongoing revenue from their app and they want the benefits of being in the Mac App Store.

00:37:15   So even though the Mac App Store as far as I can tell didn't get any specific mentions in any of this, the fact this

00:37:20   is coming everywhere, I think will benefit the Mac.

00:37:22   The fact that they said this is coming everywhere

00:37:27   suggests that there will also be some other stuff for the Mac App Store, right? Like if they're gonna make some changes to it,

00:37:33   Please make all the changes to it. Yeah, the other thing that's coming here is search ads

00:37:39   We spoke about this weeks ago, right? There was a Bloomberg piece, I think

00:37:44   This is interesting so

00:37:48   developers will be able to buy keywords

00:37:51   then a

00:37:53   Developer only pays when someone clicks on the ad the ad will show in searches a small blue banner pops up at the top

00:38:01   There's a little tab that indicates it's an ad

00:38:03   But it does look visually different

00:38:06   It looks like you maybe can or can't include images on it

00:38:12   Depends I guess maybe it's higher rate or something because it will take up more real estate or maybe it's done on screen size

00:38:19   I'm not sure. I haven't read all the documentation as we speak

00:38:22   It seems like there is going there are lots of interesting restrictions about user data

00:38:28   So Apple is saying they will not be sharing user data with developers users have the ability

00:38:34   themselves to opt out of Apple search ad data tracking and location tracking if they want to I

00:38:41   Don't know what would happen to ads showing for you if you did that

00:38:45   But Apple is going to be creating search profiles of people not tracking personal info

00:38:51   So what I assume is they will understand what they understand about you

00:38:55   They will then drop you into a bucket, right?

00:38:58   You're in this type of person bucket,

00:39:01   which then a developer can buy ads to show

00:39:03   for this type of person, is what I would assume.

00:39:06   There is an auction system that developers will buy into.

00:39:12   So you'll bid on keywords,

00:39:13   very much like how Google does it.

00:39:16   Phil Schiller says that apparently they're gonna try,

00:39:20   this will somehow be fair to indie developers

00:39:23   and big companies.

00:39:24   I don't know how you do that in an auction system, because an auction system is whoever

00:39:29   pays the most gets the word.

00:39:33   So I would love to see how that's gonna be fair.

00:39:38   This goes into beta on Monday.

00:39:41   I really don't know what to think.

00:39:43   I mean, it seems like Apple is leaving money on the table for Google and Facebook to grab

00:39:49   with app install ads.

00:39:53   I just, you know, I feel like we're not the best people to comment on ads, because we

00:39:59   as geeks have, you know, ad blocking vision. We naturally block things that look like banners

00:40:08   or ads on the web. If anything, I really think John Siracusa on Twitter, he has a point when

00:40:14   says they don't really look that different, you know, paid ads from normal app results

00:40:23   on the App Store search. They look different to us because we've been trained after years

00:40:28   of staring at computer screens to recognize those little labels and different backgrounds,

00:40:33   but I bet that most people will just click on the first paid advertisement for an app.

00:40:39   And in that case, maybe it's a good idea for Apple.

00:40:43   You know what maybe bothers me?

00:40:46   Is that maybe like Google, I don't say this about Facebook because I don't have those

00:40:52   feelings about Facebook, but it sort of breaks the purity of search results.

00:40:58   Because you say, "Look, we came up with this crazy awesome search engine, and it's so intelligent,

00:41:03   and it can figure out the best results for you, and we use data in a bunch of different

00:41:09   ways to give you the best results at any time, but then, oh, by the way, as long as you pay,

00:41:14   you can be in the first spot. It sort of breaks that purity of design of search. But, you

00:41:20   know, people are clicking them, money is being generated, and everyone seems to be happy,

00:41:26   so who am I to comment on that?

00:41:29   I know I click Google Ads.

00:41:31   Oh, me too. Occasionally, when I see an offer, like I'm Googling, I don't know, restaurants

00:41:37   or hotels, you get the coupons from Google Ads, I occasionally do that as well. But I

00:41:44   do know that I'm clicking on an ad, you know, a lot of people have no clue that there are

00:41:49   ads on Google Search, they just see a bunch of links.

00:41:52   If it's what they're looking for though, it's not a problem. And that's where it becomes

00:41:57   difficult. Who is going to be able to buy, like, tweet?

00:42:04   Exactly, or how many developers will pay for markdown or, I don't know, image cropping?

00:42:14   Who's gonna buy email?

00:42:15   Exactly. I mean, wanna bet against Google and Microsoft there with Outlook and Gmail?

00:42:21   Yeah. Is airmail gonna be able to afford to buy the word email?

00:42:25   I don't think so.

00:42:26   I mean, and I assume that you won't be able to buy trademarks, but that could be difficult

00:42:31   though because like what if your application is called 123 note-taking and somebody else

00:42:39   makes a calculator and a note-taking application and they buy the keywords 123 and note-taking

00:42:48   and somebody searches for 123 note-taking looking for your app and they're given a nicely

00:42:53   blue highlighted so that must be the one you're looking for and it's not the application right

00:43:00   Like, there is some real difficult stuff in this.

00:43:03   The developer of 123 Notetaker really is having a tough time.

00:43:08   Or a good day! Like, I've maybe put in a lot of… Oh dear.

00:43:16   Worst app story ever, Myke. 123 Notetaker. First it's not updated for like two years,

00:43:21   and then it switches to subscriptions and wants to buy an ad.

00:43:25   Well, his sister subscriptions got better, but now can't get visibility in search because

00:43:30   everyone's buying his keywords. I just wonder how this is going to play out.

00:43:36   So this is... okay. Google ads are pretty good. They're not always that good. There

00:43:42   was an interesting story recently, EU referendum happening right now, and the No campaign were

00:43:48   buying up keywords this week for people to register to vote. If you typed in "register

00:43:54   to vote" on Google, there was an ad that popped up. It looked like it was taking you through

00:43:58   to sign up to register to vote, but you weren't. So you weren't being able to register to vote

00:44:04   because they didn't want people to register because then they might be registering to

00:44:08   keep us in the European Union. So there are definite problems with this. This is Google

00:44:12   having this problem. The company has done this stuff for over a decade, nearly, maybe

00:44:17   two decades. This is the first time Apple's done this stuff. I'm discounting iAd. This

00:44:23   This is the first time Apple's done anything like this and they are implementing this system

00:44:28   in a massive way on the App Store.

00:44:35   One of the biggest e-commerce platforms on the planet.

00:44:42   I just really struggle to see how they're going to get this right.

00:44:47   They don't have the company knowledge in this. They don't do this stuff. I don't know.

00:44:57   You know, what makes me curious is, currently if you go to the App Store and search for

00:45:02   "mail", you get a top result which is like one of those custom banners that Apple gives

00:45:09   you. So in theory, if you pay for an ad, you should be able to rank higher than Apple with

00:45:14   the mail ad.

00:45:15   Unless Apple bid the most.

00:45:17   and pay themselves. So what it comes down to, let's just shift money from accounting

00:45:23   to…

00:45:24   And EdiQ is just in there bidding late at night on keywords.

00:45:29   So what it comes down to is exactly keywords. So if I'm a user, I open the App Store and

00:45:37   I search for email and I see a promoted result. Well, I don't know it's a paid ad, but

00:45:44   I just see Outlook. Like, "Ok, Microsoft has Outlook and iOS is pretty cool, I'm

00:45:49   gonna download Outlook and I'm gonna be happy." But now I'm a different type of

00:45:52   user and I go to the App Store and I search for "email power user" or, I don't know,

00:45:58   "email workflow" because I expect to see stuff, you know, a different type of email

00:46:03   client such as, I don't know, Spark or Airmail. Is Apple able to kind of narrow down the results

00:46:10   based on those keywords, that's the idea, right? Because if I search for email, that's

00:46:14   a general type of search. Like looking for hotel on Google means everything means nothing.

00:46:21   But if I look for more specific keywords, the system should be able to surface apps

00:46:26   from smaller developers who have invested a smaller amount of money and show them to

00:46:31   me. Which is, you know, the implication is, even if our own search, so even if normal

00:46:38   non-paid-for App Store search is not able to surface results for apps such as Tweetbot

00:46:45   or, you know, Airmail, the developer will be able to invest like 50 bucks or 100 bucks

00:46:51   to buy that spot so that when that type of user searches for that kind of app, it'll

00:46:58   come up. That's the perfect idea. I don't know if it'll work in practice, that's

00:47:04   my concern.

00:47:07   definitely just a minefield of stuff to worry about and Google's been doing it a

00:47:11   really long time and I think Apple can get there. I think they can get it done

00:47:14   right but I would imagine there's going to be a period of learning and of

00:47:19   you know problem-solving that people will find loopholes and people will find

00:47:24   ways to sort of game the system. But it's um you know at the end of the day I

00:47:30   agree with the notion that a lot of people aren't going to see these as

00:47:36   ads that they're going to kind of just move past them or they're going to you

00:47:40   know I mean I don't know I don't know how big of a difference it's going to

00:47:43   make and of course anytime you have a bidding system there's a problem with

00:47:47   the rich get richer type situation but on the like the backside of all this

00:47:52   conversation is the privacy angle right that's what so many people talk about we

00:47:57   talk about Google ads that you know you actually happened to me just the other

00:48:00   day I was looking something on Amazon and then I you know I'm on Facebook and

00:48:04   and that product I was looking at on Amazon

00:48:06   is suddenly in a Facebook ad, right?

00:48:08   And I don't understand how that works,

00:48:10   it doesn't bother me.

00:48:11   But Apple has a very different take on all of that

00:48:15   from Google and Facebook and everyone else.

00:48:18   And so there's a page,

00:48:20   search ads and privacy on Apple's developer site.

00:48:24   And basically what it boils down to is that

00:48:29   no one is getting data from users.

00:48:33   individual developers who are running ads all they have is the relationship

00:48:39   based on direct interaction and so you can't see if you're buying a keyword you

00:48:48   can't see how you know data based on other keywords there's some contextual

00:48:52   information shared with developers but nothing that's really all that invasive

00:48:58   I don't think and none of it goes to third parties in line with Apple's

00:49:02   overall. Apple has, at apple.com/privacy, they have a company-wide privacy policy and

00:49:08   they're saying that search ads fall underneath that existing language. And so, there's segmentations,

00:49:16   there's stuff that advertisers can do here, but it seems like it's going to be much more

00:49:22   anonymous than something like Google AdWords. I mean, I'm not worried about this kind of

00:49:30   I'm not either. I'm not worried about on Google like I don't I don't you know that doesn't bother me

00:49:34   I know how it works my living is based on advertising. I don't have a problem with it

00:49:37   Nobody's buying an ad to show to Myke Hurley right like oh we must buy an ad for that one person

00:49:44   That's really sad. What are you worried about? What are you worried about? Maybe one two three note taker will you know?

00:49:49   Because I'm clearly at the target market now

00:49:52   That the ad privacy stuff it's kind of just like

00:49:57   We say we I mean, I'm sure they're doing this stuff and it's great

00:50:00   But like it's just like it makes it sound better than it is the end of the day

00:50:04   They're selling random data now, which in a way that they weren't doing before about more people

00:50:10   You know, this is a step in a camp. That is not a

00:50:16   Regular Apple camp I was about to say a phrase that I won't say

00:50:23   But I think you all know what it was

00:50:26   Easy, but I'm not gonna say it. I'm not saying it. So you can't can't blame me

00:50:31   But you know what it is and I genuinely believe that that's all I'm gonna say we could still blame you

00:50:38   You can still blame me, but I haven't said that could mean anything

00:50:41   But do you guys agree with me on that thing that I haven't said?

00:50:45   Probably Federico, maybe it seems really unlikely, right?

00:50:54   This this feels like a new Apple thing wouldn't have happened before hmm. I

00:50:59   Don't know. I feel like maybe it's just you know. It's just evolution

00:51:04   Doesn't matter if who is alive or isn't hey we talking about

00:51:09   Things change

00:51:13   Always sure later. You know what's what's the the Greek philosopher said pantere?

00:51:19   You know like everything flows, and it's just no

00:51:23   No, it was not Greek, but it was a philosopher. Anyway, it's just the current natural state

00:51:31   of things to change, so whoever is in charge has to recognize change. That's what makes

00:51:39   great executive people to be able to notice change, to be surrounded from like-minded

00:51:44   individuals who can spot changes. And now, at this point in time, I can understand why

00:51:50   Apple sees, you know, these companies, Google and Facebook, are getting a lot of money to

00:51:57   show app install ads to people who are not even looking for apps because they are either

00:52:02   searching or checking their selfies on Facebook, but they're making lots of money because people

00:52:07   want to download new apps and games, so why don't we also make some money when people

00:52:13   actually do search for new apps to try?

00:52:17   In theory, I understand, and it's maybe even a good idea, it's not the purest form of technology

00:52:27   that I like, because I mean, come on, you're buying an ad, it's not, you know, it's not

00:52:33   sexy, if you will, but it works, you know?

00:52:37   Advertisement works.

00:52:38   And especially app-installed ads seem to be a profitable business for a lot of companies,

00:52:44   a lot of people.

00:52:46   So I do understand why Apple wants to do it. I remain skeptical that they will be able

00:52:50   to put up a system that is accurate and that also is able to balance the bigger companies

00:52:57   with a lot of cash and the indie developers who want to promote a one-two-three note taker

00:53:02   with markdown features for URL scheme automation, but we'll see. It makes sense. I'm just a

00:53:12   little skeptical.

00:53:13   Alright, sharing is the last part, not really much yet. I don't really understand this.

00:53:22   When apparently on the share sheet, on the home screen you'll be able to 3D touch on

00:53:28   an icon and pops up a share sheet and you'll be able to share apps with your friends.

00:53:35   Yeah.

00:53:36   See, I have many thoughts about that, so. And I'm gonna tell you my thoughts. Right

00:53:42   after this commercial. No, I've always dreamed to do that, but there's no commercial.

00:53:46   I could take a break if you want. No, no, no. I just wanted to say that. I don't

00:53:49   know why. Anyway. I think it's a terrible idea to have a fixed option in the limited

00:53:57   space of the Quick Action menu on the home screen, because developers are currently limited

00:54:02   to four choices for the Quick... Assuming this is the Quick Action menu, I have to assume

00:54:07   In the current version of iOS, the options, the space that developers have is limited.

00:54:14   And for Apple to come in and say, "Okay, look at that fourth option, ain't that nice.

00:54:19   Well, we're going to replace that with the share icon."

00:54:22   I don't think that will be the case.

00:54:25   I think we're looking at a redesign of the 3D Touch menu on the home screen coming with

00:54:32   iOS 10.

00:54:34   Because it seems like a terrible idea to force a share option upon developers.

00:54:40   So maybe there will be a second menu, or maybe there will be like a swipe option.

00:54:45   You 3D touch on an icon, then you swipe to reveal a bunch of additional actions, one

00:54:51   of them being share, or I don't know, delete, maybe?

00:54:55   Maybe the wiggle thing is going away?

00:54:57   I don't know.

00:54:58   But it sounds to me like a redesign of the home screen for 3D touch is coming.

00:55:03   Yeah, I think that you're completely right. It would be so weird to put the share thing

00:55:09   on what we currently have. I don't understand. It's such limited real estate. Why would you

00:55:14   put it there? It would make sense that there might be a completely different view come

00:55:21   Monday.

00:55:22   Yeah, even then, and I agree with you guys, you can't stuff a share sheet in there. My

00:55:27   thought was maybe it says share something and then it opens the share sheet. But even

00:55:32   then even if they redesign it unless there's just like tons of space to spare

00:55:37   like I don't know if putting ways to share apps to your friends like that is

00:55:45   if that is a thing for developers and again like Myke you said we're friends

00:55:48   lots of developers but if if promoting apps is like gets in the way of the user

00:55:56   experience from the customers perspective then I think that's the

00:56:01   wrong decision you know right now if you go in the app store you know you can you

00:56:04   can tap and you can share but it's it's a little hidden and it's not it's not

00:56:08   super super great and I could see like how great would it be if you could 3d

00:56:14   touch on an app icon in the update list right oh my gosh like you know Instagram

00:56:20   had an update and I can just share it like from there like that sort of more

00:56:24   natural is a more natural place to me than the home screen but I agree with

00:56:28   you guys like I will reserve judgment until we see how it looks but I do have

00:56:34   concerns here but I think that the underlying desire for Apple is good that

00:56:43   they they want to make it easier to share apps that you're using you know

00:56:46   in the in the loop article there's a section about the featured section of

00:56:52   the App Store Apple is going to be approving that bringing the categories

00:56:56   tab back, which has come and gone over the years, and make it more easy to browse through

00:57:01   apps. Because there is a huge discovery problem, even if you set aside search completely. Just

00:57:06   going through the app store sort of manually is difficult, and sometimes you see a tweet

00:57:13   go by about an app and you can click on that. But it could all be easier, and I understand

00:57:18   that I'm wanting to do that.

00:57:21   I guess people being able to share apps with each other is nice in a perfect world.

00:57:26   I think the people that share apps already share apps.

00:57:31   I don't think that necessarily putting a 3D touch action is going to increase app shareability.

00:57:37   It's just going to make it easier for the people that already do it to just do it from

00:57:41   another way.

00:57:42   By the way, if you do share apps with anyone, I would like to recommend a fantastic app

00:57:46   by our friend Jon Voigt.

00:57:47   called Blink because you should always assign an affiliate tag to it even if you're saying

00:57:52   to a friend because that's money back for you my friends so check out Blink, it's a

00:57:56   great affiliate linking application. And he also has an app called Associate now which

00:58:00   does the same for Amazon which is awesome. Go check those apps out, links in the channels.

00:58:07   I'll tell you what guys, I think that people who share apps with other people online with

00:58:15   the default messages are weird. Like, you know how you share an app and there's like

00:58:21   a pre-composed message with a bunch of exclamation points? Like, "Go check out this app!" You

00:58:26   know, it's super creepy, I think it's weird. I never share apps like that, you know? Like

00:58:33   with the message that a developer wrote for me, I don't like it. So I don't think I'll

00:58:39   be a fan of this option if it's done in this way.

00:58:42   Unless they have a direct share to MacStories, you know?

00:58:45   They just built that right into the share sheet for you.

00:58:47   Well, in that case, it has to append a link to a MacStories review, if it finds one.

00:58:53   In that case, I will approve.

00:58:55   You will approve?

00:58:56   Yes.

00:58:57   That's nice.

00:58:58   That's real good.

00:58:59   All right.

00:59:00   Why now?

00:59:01   Why today?

00:59:02   Why today?

00:59:04   See, my idea is they don't want this possible controversy that is rising today, you know,

00:59:13   the feedback from developers, the questions about ads and subscriptions to be the focus

00:59:19   of the post keynote announcements.

00:59:23   Other reason, maybe it's just too long and they don't want to have like a three hour

00:59:29   keynote.

00:59:31   And they get to hold sessions about these topics with developers already being prepared,

00:59:39   with developers already having questions, because they had almost a week to think about

00:59:43   them, so they can go to the sessions, go to the labs, be prepared, ask questions.

00:59:49   I think it makes sense in this case.

00:59:52   You know what?

00:59:53   That's probably it.

00:59:54   All of those things make perfect sense.

00:59:56   Yeah, of course you do it, if you think of it that way.

00:59:59   Very clever.

01:00:00   about giving developers time to think about it. Give them a week to think about it, or

01:00:05   however many days it is. Clearly I have shown over the last two weeks, I have no idea when

01:00:10   WWDC is. Last week it was a week away, today it's a week away, it was never a week away

01:00:16   last week or this week. Anyway, I think it's good to give people time to think about it

01:00:21   so they can come prepared. It's like so many of our developer friends say, and David was

01:00:28   talking about this on Under the Radar a couple of weeks ago, that if you're going to sessions,

01:00:37   come prepared to those sessions so you don't waste your time, or you're going to labs,

01:00:41   come prepared. Think about what you would want to ask. This is just that, right? Having

01:00:46   the idea of thinking about what you want to ask.

01:00:49   Yeah, I think that's a good point.

01:00:54   Anything else on this?

01:00:56   I mean I think I think the big like the meta view here is that clearly Apple's

01:01:03   been at work and has been listening and is is trying something I mean it's been

01:01:08   you know what is it eight years since the iOS App Store launched and there

01:01:13   really have been very few structural changes after in-app purchase was added

01:01:18   and so to see changes and obviously there are problems with some of these

01:01:23   and there's gonna be a lot of figuring it out.

01:01:25   But to see them doing something is encouraging to me.

01:01:28   And I'm sure it won't all be perfect at first,

01:01:32   but I do think that they realize

01:01:34   that there are problems in the App Store economy.

01:01:38   And so much of what's in here is really designed

01:01:42   to help make development,

01:01:44   and in particular, independent development,

01:01:47   which is of course the world we live in, more sustainable.

01:01:51   And yes, I mean, the rich will always get richer

01:01:52   in the app store but I can see in here the desire to make smaller apps and smaller teams

01:02:02   more sustainable and that's something that I can get behind 100%.

01:02:06   Couldn't agree more.

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01:04:02   So we had a whole episode planned to talk about WWDC predictions. We're not going to

01:04:10   do all of that now. We're going to pick some and we're going to do our very favourite thing

01:04:14   in the world, we're gonna go round robin. I hope someone's gonna keep the order of the

01:04:19   round robin because you know how that can get really messy. Steven, I'm gonna go to

01:04:25   you first. You can get the first pick round robin style. Pick something. Maybe limit it

01:04:33   to OS X and iOS that you're hoping for at WWDC.

01:04:39   No one cares about tvOS anyways. It'll be fine.

01:04:41   Except for Joe Steele.

01:04:43   not his real name. I'm gonna go for my first round Robin pic with what I

01:04:49   think will be a crowd pleaser especially if Jason Snell's in the crowd about the

01:04:54   name that that the Mac OS rebranding will happen this year. Obviously there's

01:05:01   some collision with Mac OS X and iOS X. The X is as dated as the second

01:05:06   Matrix movie. It's time to move on and I think that we will see Mac OS. I'm not

01:05:11   willing to say if it will be the correct way capital M with a space or not but

01:05:16   I think the rebranding will happen.

01:05:19   Alright what do you think the name will actually be?

01:05:22   I think they will do Mac OS and then the California code name so Mac OS Death Valley.

01:05:33   Any number?

01:05:35   I think that the number will exist in like System Profiler because it has to have a

01:05:39   version number but I think on the outside there will not be a public facing number.

01:05:45   In that regard, what will iOS be called?

01:05:48   iOS 10.

01:05:49   I know that sounds like a dumb question.

01:05:53   So here's the thing, I think that where OS 10 is in its life cycle, the exact version

01:05:59   matters less.

01:06:00   When you were in like 10.2, 10.3, 10.4, those were all drastically different from each other.

01:06:04   You know, you have 70 to El Capitan, you set somebody down in front of them, they can't

01:06:07   tell the difference.

01:06:08   is more mature, in many ways it is moving more slowly.

01:06:12   So I think that the number is like, the number is a really clear indication that there are

01:06:17   big differences and that is still a thing in iOS's life and it's not a thing in the

01:06:20   Mac's life anymore.

01:06:21   What do you think the number will be though?

01:06:25   Probably 10.12.

01:06:26   I don't think they're going to go to, I think if they go to 11 they will do it when iOS

01:06:30   does just to keep it consistent for people who see it.

01:06:33   Because then everything will be on 11, right?

01:06:35   Yeah, but I don't think that's going to be a public thing.

01:06:38   watchOS doesn't follow the same numbers does it but tvOS does. tvOS does because they like

01:06:45   hijacked on to iOS at iOS 9 and so tvOS is weird but I think it's sort of like the Mac

01:06:54   where the exact version doesn't really matter to people. Yeah. Federico do you have any

01:06:59   thoughts on that you agree with Steven? I mean what kind of thoughts are there to have?

01:07:04   a name. I just don't see the big deal from a lot of people speculating on this, including

01:07:10   you too, but in a loving way.

01:07:12   Well, 'cause you don't care. At all. I mean, I'm in the middle, right? But like, you know,

01:07:19   people really care about this, 'cause lots of people really do care about the name.

01:07:22   It's a name! What does it matter? You just have to use the computer, you don't look at

01:07:27   the name, you use it.

01:07:28   Well, let's see if they call this iOS teaching, we'll see if you care about names then, huh?

01:07:32   That's awesome. If you ask me, they can call it iOS Coca-Cola and I won't care as long

01:07:37   as it's great.

01:07:40   Federico, tell us something you do care about.

01:07:43   The name. No, I really do care. I'm sorry. I really do care about, let's see, improvements

01:07:53   to iPad multitasking. I feel like what we got last year with the split view was nice,

01:08:00   great, especially on the big iPad Pro, it has changed kind of the way that I use the

01:08:05   iPad because I'm in Split View all the time, basically, and I save a lot of time doing

01:08:11   stuff, moving from my Twitter client to Slack and to my text editor. But I do want to see

01:08:17   a new app, Picker Design, because the current one shows you the last... this is a thing

01:08:23   that not a lot of people know. But the three apps that you see when you swipe down in Split

01:08:28   view, those are not a random choice or the last three apps that you opened. That's a

01:08:34   very conscious design decision from Apple's engineers. Those are the last three apps that

01:08:40   you used in Split View. It's kind of confusing, I still kind of don't get it, but that's the

01:08:47   way that it works. I want to see a new design there, I want to have a search bar, I want

01:08:52   to have favorites, and I want to have like a more compact view. That's kind of like a

01:08:56   a home screen with all of my apps, so it's faster to say switch between apps, to search

01:09:03   for apps, and to kind of move, you know, if I opened, I don't know, Ulysses like two days

01:09:08   ago, so I don't have to scroll and scroll and scroll to find it, you know? And there

01:09:14   also needs to be, I think, a faster way to kind of swap the apps that you're using in

01:09:22   Split View. So right now, let's say that you have Tweetbot on the left side and you have,

01:09:28   I don't know, Safari on the right side. If you want to swap the positions, you gotta

01:09:32   do a whole dance of closing the Split View, opening Safari, then doing the swipe again.

01:09:37   There needs to be a faster way. And, you know, while we're talking about Split View, I need

01:09:42   to mention drag and drop. Now, the last time I heard some of the iPad features, Apple will

01:09:50   save them for iOS 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, possibly updates throughout the year and next year,

01:09:58   so I don't know just how many iPad features we'll get, and I don't know if drag and drop

01:10:02   is one of them, but still, I wanna be optimistic that it'll happen sometime during the iOS

01:10:09   10 release cycle, and that will be nice, because I want to be able to drop text, files, images,

01:10:16   whatever. Instead of just using the clipboard or extensions, it'll be nice to just touch

01:10:22   and hold and drag it away. It's gonna be a nice time-saver.

01:10:26   I'd like to add on to some of your multitasking stuff. I want all of that, by the way, but

01:10:30   the multitasking thing, at a bare minimum, I want a search bar. That would be the most

01:10:36   important one to me, I think, because the favourites would be really nice, but just

01:10:40   letting me access anything.

01:10:42   I would really like a keyboard shortcut to bring up that view like,

01:10:47   like spotlight. So maybe you would hit command S. It wouldn't be that obviously,

01:10:52   but you'd hit command S and it would,

01:10:54   it would automatically bring up that side view and go to the search.

01:10:58   I could type what I wanted and then arrow up and down and hit what I want and

01:11:02   it will automatically pop those two apps into split view. I would love that.

01:11:06   and I don't think I ever would have thought of something like this before

01:11:11   but it's just because I use an external keyboard with my iPad Pros

01:11:15   a hundred percent of the time and being able to do this would be great

01:11:20   I can't think of how you could invoke the

01:11:23   split view quicker with touch right now we've spoken about this it's slow to bring

01:11:27   that across and it's cumbersome

01:11:29   but it would be really nice as a quick way to be able to do this with a keyboard shortcut

01:11:33   I would really love that.

01:11:36   It's your turn, Myke.

01:11:37   You kinda hijacked my round, but...

01:11:40   I gave you the ability to add on to Stevens, you just didn't care enough.

01:11:44   I'm going super small potatoes with this, but it's something I want so much, which is

01:11:49   better handling of rich text on iOS.

01:11:52   I thought it was gonna be a name.

01:11:55   iOS Myke.

01:11:58   It's such a simple thing, but it's something that I really, really want to see done better.

01:12:03   If I copy and paste something that's in rich text into another application, I want it to

01:12:08   be rich text in that other application.

01:12:10   I don't want all the formatting stripped away.

01:12:12   It's such a basic thing and it's done really badly on iOS.

01:12:16   And there are a few things where if, you know, I'm finding myself opening up a Mac to do

01:12:24   something which is just sending a couple of emails every week because it's a pain in the

01:12:29   butt to do it otherwise. I can do it otherwise but it's me copying and pasting lots of little

01:12:33   things as opposed to just one whole block of something like a table or a list and keeping

01:12:39   the bullet formatting as I want it to be between applications. I really really hope for this.

01:12:45   It feels like such a basic thing but I'm sure you'll agree with me Federico that it is handled

01:12:49   really badly right now.

01:12:51   Yeah, the rich text framework on iOS is even implemented differently across Apple apps.

01:12:57   So you can, most of the time you're not able to copy and paste rich text between notes

01:13:02   and mail, for example, or pages.

01:13:05   It's all kinds of messed up, and there needs to be improvements to TextKit or whatever

01:13:11   to have a whole new rich text framework that includes formatting, images, any kind of media

01:13:17   you should be able to copy and paste in a rich text editor.

01:13:20   And I don't think we'll see TextEdit coming to iOS because Apple has pages there, but

01:13:26   it could be a nice demo.

01:13:28   It's one of those small features that would make for a really nice 30-second demo to be

01:13:34   able to paste bullet lists between apps.

01:13:38   It's one of the biggest oversights coming from OS X, you have that kind of lack of support

01:13:42   for rich text on iOS, needs to be fixed.

01:13:47   We're back to you, Steven.

01:13:49   So I'm going to go with the ever popular story of the Siri API.

01:13:55   So we've seen obviously a lot of movement here with other companies and other products.

01:14:01   But Siri is still basically just locked away in its little screen on top of iOS and can't

01:14:08   really interact with many apps unless they're built by Apple.

01:14:12   So you can say, "Hoy telephone, add potatoes to my shopping list."

01:14:17   if your shopping list is in any list for omniFocus and not reminders you're out

01:14:22   of luck. And I think it's high time for that to change where developers could

01:14:26   hook into Siri and Siri could send data from apps and apps could provide Siri

01:14:31   with data to return back to you so you could you could ask Siri a question

01:14:35   about what is on your to-do list in omniFocus and it could tell you.

01:14:39   There's obviously some issues to work out here the big one being sort of the

01:14:45   thing people complain about with the

01:14:46   Echo is that it's sort of robotic to

01:14:48   talk to you so you have to say you know play

01:14:50   the song by Federico's band on Spotify

01:14:54   because it can't parse or you can't

01:14:57   tell it to always ignore Amazon Prime

01:15:00   Music because everyone always wants to

01:15:02   ignore Amazon Prime Music. I think it can work

01:15:05   through that I think there's you know

01:15:06   will be some education there with

01:15:07   customers and how it could work but I

01:15:09   think it's time that the Siri API

01:15:11   finally be serviced. I think it's time right? It's got to be. Feels like it.

01:15:19   Federico, you're up.

01:15:22   Ok, so what can I pick right now? Let's see, I'm gonna go with the customizable

01:15:27   control center just because I feel like I use control center a lot for music

01:15:34   playback, you know, the flashlight and those shortcuts and I would love to be able to

01:15:41   have my own shortcuts in there to open the settings that I always use, such as, you know,

01:15:46   enable low power mode, or, you know, jump to the content blocker sections of the Safari

01:15:52   settings, or maybe even have app shortcuts at the bottom with quick actions, so I can

01:15:59   open Tweetbot or I can go to the equip document, for example. I feel like it was great when

01:16:07   Apple added Control Center with iOS 7, I want to say, but it's mostly remained the same.

01:16:16   Aside from design changes and a bunch of minor additions for Apple settings, it hasn't really

01:16:23   been opened up to user customization, and I feel like it's time to do that.

01:16:29   I agree. I definitely agree. For me, I'm going to go with system-wide dark mode. I am one

01:16:38   of those people that I always choose dark modes for applications. It's easier on my

01:16:43   eyes. I think it's nicer than blinding white light all the time. And I would love to see

01:16:50   this pushed by Apple as a thing so more and more developers will put in a position where

01:16:55   they would be thinking more about creating dark UI as opposed to white UI.

01:17:00   So I would really love to see that become a thing in iOS as a system-wide

01:17:06   dark mode to try and further push along a lot of stuff that Apple's been doing

01:17:11   about color and reducing brightness on the on the screens. Yeah I would tack

01:17:17   on to that too, bringing both that and night shift stuff to the Mac because if

01:17:24   it's bad when you're looking at an iPhone or an iPad it's even worse if

01:17:28   you're looking at a 27-inch iMac. So I think that that stuff could become a

01:17:33   thing on both platforms. Maybe even the watch we spoke about even on the watch.

01:17:37   If you look at your watch in the middle of the night and it's that bright blue

01:17:40   light it's really jarring. It's like night shift and dark mode I would like

01:17:45   everywhere and I would like to be independent from each other so I could

01:17:49   run my phone in dark mode all the time, which I would do,

01:17:54   and only have night shift on at night.

01:17:56   So I think, yes, it's more toggles and settings,

01:17:59   but I think it'd be worth it.

01:18:02   - All right, Steven, you do have a pick.

01:18:04   - So I'm gonna go with collaborative documents

01:18:08   inside of the Notes app.

01:18:10   I know that's small, there's bigger things on the list

01:18:13   that I could go with.

01:18:14   - Oh man, I'd love that though.

01:18:16   - But I would love it a lot.

01:18:17   use notes heavily and my wife and I have some shared documents that we have to

01:18:24   get into and they're in Google Docs which she doesn't like using she does

01:18:28   nothing else in Google Drive except these like three documents we have to

01:18:31   look at once a month and it would be great if it was in notes with the

01:18:35   asterisk of lol iWork in the cloud that it would have to work better than the

01:18:42   their current document syncing air quote scheme with iWork.

01:18:47   But I think they could do it and I think that it would be,

01:18:49   it would add another level of richness to what already,

01:18:53   honestly, is a pretty good Notes app.

01:18:55   If they do that and add a font size to the Mac,

01:18:57   it'd be great.

01:18:58   But Notes is really good and I think that sharing

01:19:00   is like the next level up from where they are now.

01:19:03   - All right Federico, your final pick.

01:19:08   My final pick. I'm gonna go with a new... no, actually I'm gonna go with Xcode on iOS.

01:19:16   Oh yeah, nice.

01:19:18   I was about to say messages, but instead...

01:19:20   I'm gonna pick that one so you still have something to say.

01:19:22   Okay, Xcode for iOS. I feel like it needs to happen. There's a new generation of programmers

01:19:31   waiting to be able to learn Swift on iOS, and specifically on the iPad.

01:19:36   Now last time I heard there was some kind of prototype of Xcode for the iPad Pro, I

01:19:42   don't know about other iPads in November, and it was definitely a thing inside Apple.

01:19:48   And John Gruber heard the same, there was a link that he shared on during Fireball.

01:19:55   So I don't know, we haven't heard any rumors about that since.

01:20:01   Some people say it's gonna be something like Playgrounds from OS X ported to the iPad instead

01:20:08   of the full-on Xcode suite of tools and apps.

01:20:13   I don't know if you will be able to write an app on the iPad and submit it to the App

01:20:18   Store, but that's the end goal, I feel like, to be able to move development from a Mac

01:20:24   to any computer, whether it's a Mac or an iPad, and even an iPhone.

01:20:30   Because I don't think it's crazy to imagine a future where people can program an app on

01:20:34   a phone and to send it to the App Store.

01:20:37   It's crazy today, but is it crazy five years, ten years from now?

01:20:40   I don't think so.

01:20:41   So the idea is to be able to program and to create software for Apple platforms on any

01:20:47   Apple computer.

01:20:49   And by that I include the iPhone and the iPad.

01:20:52   So maybe this year we'll get a slimmed down version of Xcode on the iPad Pro, or maybe

01:20:57   will get a full Xcode on iOS, I don't know. The focus is the entire WWDC promotional material,

01:21:04   the entire website, seems to be heavily Swift themed. That makes sense with the release

01:21:10   of Swift 3.0 coming out, but I feel like that could be, in addition to App Store changes,

01:21:19   could be the developer announcement at WWDC. And if it happens, I feel like an entire category

01:21:29   of people, including me, will finally be able to learn programming to try out Swift for

01:21:35   real in an Apple developer tool on iOS, which is great. And I'm really excited about that

01:21:43   possibility.

01:21:44   Me and you have both said that we think it's going to happen, right?

01:21:49   I believe that it's going to occur.

01:21:51   I just think that the iPad Pro is begging for this.

01:21:56   And I think it will be, whatever it is, it will be just Swift.

01:22:00   But I think it's going to be.

01:22:03   I think we're going to get something.

01:22:05   My final pick, and the final pick, is revamped iMessages.

01:22:10   are so many services now that do some core parts of messaging so much better than iMessages

01:22:17   does. Basically iMessage needs to become aware of the internet. What we need to see at a

01:22:24   very bare minimum I believe is stuff like rich previews. If I send Steven a tweet in

01:22:30   iMessage I wanted to see what the tweet is without having to click through to the link.

01:22:35   Just expand that stuff. It's all there. The metadata is all there. It's all available

01:22:39   to just pull in. Slack does it, Telegram does it, you know. So many applications are able

01:22:45   to pull this stuff in and do things with it. I would love to see that. You know, coming

01:22:49   along with that more emoji stuff. Just go crazy with the emoji. Put them everywhere.

01:22:53   Make them big, right? Big emoji when you're just sending an emoji. I love that. It's one

01:22:56   of my favorite things in applications these days. I love big emoji. Really kind of make

01:23:03   iMessage the...

01:23:05   Grid again.

01:23:06   I wasn't going to say that, but I will go with that.

01:23:10   Make it a messaging service that you would expect to see in 2016.

01:23:16   You know, stuff like stickers would be interesting.

01:23:18   You don't have to go that far, right?

01:23:20   It would be great, but just make it more aware of the internet and bring it into line with

01:23:26   messaging services.

01:23:28   Because right now, iMessage just feels like SMS.

01:23:32   And it's not that, but that's what it feels like.

01:23:36   Alright so that's it WWDC stuff. If you want more WWDC predictions and you enjoy people

01:23:43   picking things, on upgrade this week me and Jason did a WWDC prediction draft. We started

01:23:50   with 28 predictions, we picked one each until we have a list of 14 which is the first upgrade

01:23:55   WWDC draft. So we speak about more prediction stuff than we had time for today because Apple

01:24:01   dropped an absolute bombshell on us. So you can go check that out if you want to. Next

01:24:05   Next week on Connected is going to be a very big thing.

01:24:11   RelayCon WWDC.

01:24:15   Next week we're going to be on Monday having a cavalcade of Relay FM stars on stage doing

01:24:22   a few different show-like things.

01:24:24   It's going to be recorded, we're doing it live with an audience in San Francisco.

01:24:28   It will be released as an episode of Connected.

01:24:32   So that will be Monday or Tuesday, you will get that.

01:24:36   Look forward to it, we've been working very hard on it, we're very excited about it and

01:24:41   I hope that you enjoy it.

01:24:42   So that's what you're going to get from us next week.

01:24:46   Until then, if you want to find our show notes head on over to relay.fm/connected/94.

01:24:50   If you want to find Federico online he is @vittici, V I T I C C I.

01:24:56   He writes at maxstories.net.

01:24:57   Federico is joining me in London.

01:24:59   We look forward to seeing everyone at the connected meetup this week.

01:25:03   It's going to be a great time.

01:25:04   I'm very excited.

01:25:06   Steven, we will then be meeting up with in San Francisco and we all look forward to it.

01:25:11   I think I speak to all of us.

01:25:13   If you are a connected listener, come over and say hi.

01:25:15   We cannot wait to meet all of you that are going to be in San Francisco next week.

01:25:19   Steven is @ismh on Twitter and he writes over at 512pixels.net.

01:25:24   I am @imike.

01:25:25   I-M-Y-K-E.

01:25:26   Thank you so much for listening to this week's episode.

01:25:29   Thank you to Squarespace and Braintree and we'll be back next time.

01:25:32   Until then, say goodbye guys.

01:25:34   Adios.

01:25:35   Adios.

01:25:35   Adios.