76: Dreaming is Enough


00:00:00   *Dramatic Music*

00:00:06   From Relay FM, this is Connected Episode 76.

00:00:10   This week's show is brought to you by Braintree and Squarespace.

00:00:14   My name is Stephen Hackett and I am joined this week by my friend, Mr. Federico Vittucci.

00:00:19   Hello, Stephen.

00:00:20   Hello, friend.

00:00:21   How are you, friend?

00:00:23   I'm doing well. Our...

00:00:25   Our British...

00:00:27   friend is

00:00:29   He's not here. So the time has finally come is

00:00:32   He might actually be dead. He was quite

00:00:35   under the weather and

00:00:38   Someone who speaks for a living that's no good. So he is he is with some

00:00:41   Hot water and ginger I think is what you told him to drink. So yeah, that's my recipe for you know

00:00:49   fighting this kind of

00:00:52   Nasty disease Myke. I know he's listening live to the show

00:00:56   It puts a lot of pressure on me.

00:00:58   It's almost, you know, when I told you when our when your boss is watching you do your work

00:01:04   This is really what it feels like. I hope we won't disappoint you Myke.

00:01:08   Stephen, I know that we have some follow-up.

00:01:12   We do have some follow-up. So up first we are revisiting the Canary which is the, if you remember, sort of the all-in-one

00:01:21   Internet of Things type security system you can put in your home where it has a camera and like an alarm a bunch of other

00:01:28   stuff and

00:01:30   Dan Morin has one he wrote this thing up over on six colors

00:01:33   basically tying it to his Wemo switch so

00:01:38   For instance if the you know you can turn a light off and it triggers something on the canary and you can kind of build

00:01:45   these workflows

00:01:47   To start tying all these things together, which I think is pretty neat

00:01:50   Yeah, again, I wish I could buy this. I didn't know the Wink protocol before. Is this like a device or an API or both?

00:02:02   I think I want to say both, but I'm not totally positive.

00:02:09   Yeah, the only automation that I do, very lightweight automation with IFTTT and my Philips

00:02:18   lights and there's some Elgato stuff that I do with the sensors that I have, but mostly

00:02:25   I find myself just using the native iOS widgets to quickly control my lights and other home-connected

00:02:35   devices.

00:02:36   faster when I'm on my local Wi-Fi network I just need to swipe down and

00:02:40   control my lights and I tried a bunch of third-party Philips Hue clients

00:02:47   from third-party developers but really I come down to just using the

00:02:52   official app because it's faster it doesn't do any weird things with my

00:02:57   local IP address you know the third-party Hue apps for some reason always

00:03:03   stop working for me at a certain point and I'm using the simplest

00:03:09   solution of them all which is the native widget. But still this looks pretty cool.

00:03:13   I gotta investigate this wink protocol which is nice. They do have a product

00:03:17   called Wink Relay which when I think about it's like you and Myke winking.

00:03:23   Wink Relay.

00:03:27   The thing for me with all this stuff is that all the home automation

00:03:33   stuff is very Wild West feeling right now where you can get all these services

00:03:37   and apps and kind of time together yourself and I think the promise of homekit

00:03:40   is all this stuff can be like we're gonna build one common layer for all

00:03:46   this stuff I think Google's trying to do that as well it just still seems to me

00:03:52   that it's like I have this hesitancy about it I can invest in all this stuff

00:03:56   and then in two years none of it talked to each other it still feels very early

00:04:00   days and that's fine like I understand if I buy the huge smart lights like I've

00:04:04   had a canary on my mind since we recorded that this I think is gonna

00:04:10   change significantly over the course of the next couple of years and there may

00:04:14   be some early adopter tax to pay here yeah it reminds me of the xkcd comic on

00:04:19   standards have you ever seen that one I have it's a good one yeah there are 14

00:04:25   competing standards we need another one and now there's like 15 competing

00:04:29   standards. Really this is the situation right now with home devices. There's the

00:04:33   Google one, the Apple one, a bunch of third-party ones, and really it's great

00:04:37   to have standards, but at which point, you know, a lot of standards is too

00:04:42   many, and we'll see how it plays out in the end, I guess.

00:04:46   Yeah, early days. And that's not unusual, right? I mean, you saw that in

00:04:52   everything from, you know, like personal computing, operating systems, all the way

00:04:56   through now. This is part of the life cycle of technology and it's just a fun reminder

00:05:02   sometimes that something you invest in today or set up today to work may not be bulletproof

00:05:08   forever.

00:05:09   Yeah, I mean in the end we're all going to die. You also got to consider that.

00:05:15   Yeah, I feel like that's sort of the trump card in any conversation. It's like, "Well,

00:05:20   the iPad sales will die." Well, we're all going to die anyways.

00:05:22   You want to talk about it?

00:05:24   they did a really good job I will point out yesterday's episode of upgrade.

00:05:31   They cover this in depth. I don't want to retry all of it but short version is the

00:05:36   iPad year over year is what 25% down. It's not great right? I mean

00:05:44   that's not good news. I think that there's the thought of well the iPad

00:05:50   Pro was late or the iPad Air wasn't revved and I think I think while those

00:05:54   things are true I don't think it accounts for such a huge drop you know

00:05:57   my thought is at least the iPad is still finding it's sort of the size that it's

00:06:06   supposed to be you know it was it was huge at the beginning and now it's

00:06:09   settling and it's taking a long time to find where that number is it's not to

00:06:14   say the iPad is still a big business of course but it's I suspect that it will

00:06:21   drop some more and eventually will level off into some sort of stasis where like

00:06:25   this is the side so the size of Apple's tablet business and yeah until they find

00:06:30   that number you're going to continue to get quarterly results like this where

00:06:33   it's a big decrease year over year and and I do think it will level out

00:06:38   somewhere you know maybe maybe it's the size of the Mac maybe it's bigger maybe

00:06:41   it's smaller, but it's definitely not the next iPhone. Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised

00:06:47   to see the iPad kind of, you know, leveling off somewhere in between the iPhone and the

00:06:56   Mac, probably closer to a Mac. It's important not to lose perspective, I think. When Apple

00:07:02   sells 20 million Macs a year and they still sell 54, 55 million iPads a year, it's still

00:07:09   quite a big difference.

00:07:10   And the decrease is obvious, and it's been going on

00:07:15   for a few years now.

00:07:17   And to me, it always comes down to a very fundamental question.

00:07:24   For me, it is, do you believe that in the future,

00:07:27   when you're not on your smartphone for doing tasks that

00:07:33   you cannot do on a small screen, do you believe that the big

00:07:36   screen, it's gonna be a laptop or a big multi-touch tablet. And that's the very

00:07:42   basic question and we can argue that the iPad has been decreasing, still bigger

00:07:46   than the Mac and they're still selling a lot of iPads, but there's been a decrease

00:07:49   and it's been slowing down and that's objective to observe. But if

00:07:55   you gotta think about the future, do you see the laptop with the physical

00:07:59   keyboard and the traditional desktop metaphors or do you see the tablet?

00:08:04   Personally, I see the tablet, so when I'm not on the smartphone, I want to be using a multi-touch display big enough to type on, to view movies, to collect my photos and organize all my media and documents.

00:08:20   And there's people who prefer desktops, and I agree with you, it'll level off at some point.

00:08:28   And my personal theory is that it'll still be bigger than the Mac, but we'll see.

00:08:33   It's funny whenever there's this kind of financial result.

00:08:41   A lot of people seem to be rooting for the iPad to die, as if they need to prove a point.

00:08:49   I don't think nobody has to prove a point here.

00:08:53   here because it is great that Apple is still selling 20 million Macs, more than 15 million

00:08:58   iPads and iPhones. God even knows what's the real number. I think it's great, but some

00:09:06   people seem to kind of have some sort of a... What's the German word for pleasure from other

00:09:12   Spain? Schadenfreude?

00:09:14   Sure.

00:09:15   Yeah, that's the one. I mean, I'm asking you of all people.

00:09:19   I don't know.

00:09:20   But yeah, we'll see how it goes. I remain with a shade of optimism in me.

00:09:28   I think that's totally fair and I agree with you. I do think that the iPad, its groove will be larger than the Macs.

00:09:37   That wherever it settles down, it will be more than what Apple's selling with the Mac line.

00:09:43   but how much bigger you know is really hard to say but I do think that

00:09:47   fundamental question of like what do you what do you use when you're not in your

00:09:50   smartphone is a really interesting one because for a lot of people and I can

00:09:54   also even speak for me that the smartphone can be my only computer some

00:09:59   days and in my previous life it was my computer most work days you know where I

00:10:04   was out doing client stuff all day running around and I could do email and

00:10:10   could do team management and task management all this stuff from my phone

00:10:13   where it really was the the main device and you know if I think about the range

00:10:19   of computing devices in my life the one that I would have the hardest time

00:10:24   giving up is the iPhone you know I could I could do without the iPad I could I

00:10:28   could get my work done without a Mac but take the iPhone away it that is like a

00:10:34   bigger hurdle for me because it is like the primary device that I go to so often

00:10:39   And I think that's like, I mean,

00:10:42   that says a lot about what the smartphone has become, right?

00:10:45   That it is, for so many people, an indispensable part

00:10:49   of their workflow and their life.

00:10:52   And to see that,

00:10:54   to see that being

00:10:58   really like the question of like,

00:11:02   what is, you know, if you put yourself down,

00:11:05   what do you go to, I think is a really interesting way

00:11:08   of looking at it.

00:11:08   for me right now it's the Mac but it is increasingly the iPad and even you know

00:11:14   over the last several months for Myke it's been the iPad more than the Mac so

00:11:17   I think I think people will end up where they end up and you know maybe the Mac

00:11:23   and the iPad will be more siblings than than anything else and I think that's

00:11:26   fine it's still a business that I think is obviously worth Apple continue to

00:11:32   invest in and continue to do and you know that that mindset of well you know

00:11:39   the iPad it's not a real computer and so I want it to not do well like that's just

00:11:43   silly to me right like yeah who cares they don't buy one then yeah yeah I

00:11:48   don't listen to canvas like whatever it's fine but there are people who do

00:11:52   depend on it and who who do their work on it and who care about it and it's

00:11:57   still a viable product at the end of the day wherever it finds its sales numbers

00:12:02   you know, then that's that.

00:12:04   Yeah, the way I see it, it always comes down to anthropology in a way.

00:12:09   Humans are animals that like sitting down.

00:12:13   And this is why I don't completely buy the argument that someone can use a smartphone as their only computer.

00:12:19   Because at one point you're gonna have the desire of sitting down and crave a bigger screen.

00:12:26   I can use my iPhone as my only computing device.

00:12:31   This doesn't mean that when I'm sitting down at my desk or on the couch, I don't wish for

00:12:37   a bigger screen to watch a movie or to read a book or an article.

00:12:42   I believe the smartphone will in the future be something essential, like having an internet

00:12:48   connection at home or having electricity.

00:12:51   You will have a smartphone, which is a small computer that's always with you.

00:12:54   humans as a species, they like sitting down resting and when you're in that sort of scenario,

00:13:03   you want a bigger screen. So we'll see where it ends up. It can be a Mac, it can be an

00:13:09   iPad, it can be a mix of the two. It can be VR for that matter. I don't know. I doubt

00:13:15   that, but you know, we'll see how it goes. Yeah. Imagine having a finder in VR, Steven.

00:13:23   I don't want to think about that.

00:13:26   - Imagine all the bugs and crashes in VR.

00:13:30   That's gonna be awesome.

00:13:31   - Wow.

00:13:31   I did definitely notice in last week's Canvas

00:13:35   that you made reference to the Finder in past tense.

00:13:40   - Oh yeah.

00:13:41   - On the Mac there was the Finder.

00:13:42   Like, no, it's still here, it's all right.

00:13:43   He's smiling at me right now.

00:13:44   - Yeah, for me it's sort of a past version of me.

00:13:48   - Yeah, that's totally fair.

00:13:50   Speaking of things that are past tense,

00:13:53   has Google updated Docs for iOS 9?

00:13:56   - I don't even know what,

00:13:59   why are we still subjecting ourselves to this?

00:14:04   - To make a point, I think.

00:14:05   - It's, for me, Google Docs is like watching the news on TV.

00:14:10   Every day there's like bad news,

00:14:12   and this is really similar.

00:14:14   You know, you turn on the TV and bad stuff is going on,

00:14:16   you look at Google Docs, nothing's going on, and it's bad.

00:14:21   So no update, Steven.

00:14:23   This is sort of becoming like the section

00:14:25   when we used to tell people where to find the show notes.

00:14:28   We needed to come up with a new excuse

00:14:30   or a clever way of saying that every single time.

00:14:34   There's no Google Docs update with iOS 9 multitasking.

00:14:37   I'm sorry, friends.

00:14:38   - It's a bad day.

00:14:40   All right, we're going to get into some topics,

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00:16:15   this show and all of relay FM. So Steven what did you buy this time? I know it's

00:16:23   an old Mac. It is an old Mac. This is something special. The 20th anniversary

00:16:31   Mac. So in 1996 Apple the company was 20 years old they announced hey we're gonna

00:16:38   build a Mac to celebrate this it took them a year so in 1997 the 20th

00:16:45   anniversary Mac or the TAM was released

00:16:47   and it was $7,500 and it had a crazy

00:16:52   startup tone and came with a giant subwoofer

00:16:54   and had an LCD and a desktop which

00:16:56   sounds familiar if you're sitting in

00:16:58   front of an iMac. And it's really one of

00:17:04   the holy grails of Apple computing if I

00:17:06   could use that phrase where there's not

00:17:08   many of them out there. They're they

00:17:10   really only sold depending on what you

00:17:14   you see 6,000, 10,000 of them.

00:17:18   That number is actually hard to nail down.

00:17:21   Anyway, so I've been looking at one for a long time

00:17:24   and I turned 30 last week and Myke and some other people

00:17:28   basically were like, you should do this

00:17:30   and badgered me into it.

00:17:33   And so I did it and it showed up

00:17:35   and I made a video about it and it's amazingly weird.

00:17:39   So how did you get one, if you may know?

00:17:43   - The beauty of eBay.

00:17:47   - Oh, okay, so three-story way.

00:17:49   - Yeah, yeah.

00:17:50   Well, when a mom and dad and a Mac love each other very much

00:17:56   yes, they pop up on eBay from time to time

00:18:00   and I've been looking for a while.

00:18:02   This particular one was a good bit less

00:18:06   than what they normally go for, which was nice.

00:18:08   And the reason I found out, it's not quite pristine.

00:18:13   If you look at the video, it's not a perfect example.

00:18:17   There are a couple issues here and there,

00:18:18   but overall it's in good shape.

00:18:20   And it's a crazy machine, man.

00:18:24   - And it's a working machine

00:18:27   because you reinstalled the OS.

00:18:31   - I did.

00:18:31   So it ships with system 7.6.1, which is ancient.

00:18:36   which is ancient. So did you have an archive of this system OS on your drives?

00:18:44   I didn't have this but it came this came with the all the original CDs so

00:18:51   the software CD it came with so if you look at pictures of this thing there's

00:18:57   this big like external unit and that's like I said a sub and then the power

00:19:00   supplies in there and to show that off it was a Bose system. Bose shipped a

00:19:07   two CD set of different types of music. There's like classical, there's rock,

00:19:11   there's like this crazy techno song that I can't get out of my head to like show

00:19:16   off this thing and and the CD player and everything could be used separately from

00:19:19   the computer so it was like big sound system stuff. So anyways all that stuff

00:19:23   came with it and so I just basically just put the system disk in the CD

00:19:29   drive and formatted the drive and started clean with it. How does the Bose speaker sound?

00:19:37   It's really great. It holds up. It does. I listened to the CDs that came with it and

00:19:45   then we had a couple CDs around the house I popped in it and it really does sound good.

00:19:51   It may be 19 years old but it sounds great.

00:19:58   How's using System 7 today?

00:20:02   What can you do?

00:20:03   I don't know anything about this.

00:20:06   Yeah, I mean it's old and so this thing will run up through Mac OS 9 which is much more

00:20:11   modern and in some key areas.

00:20:14   I mean there's no doubt that it's old.

00:20:18   I have a couple things on there.

00:20:20   I don't have a ton of classic Mac OS software,

00:20:23   but I really don't see myself like booting this machine up

00:20:26   all that often anyways.

00:20:27   I think I have some other Macs that are far less rare

00:20:30   to do that on, but System 7's pretty old.

00:20:34   This thing comes, this particular unit has

00:20:36   the ethernet card in it and that's like a separate set

00:20:40   of extensions to like TCP/IP to work.

00:20:43   Like it really is old school and it feels much older

00:20:47   than even OS 8 and OS 9 do. But it's really eye-opening to see how far we've come.

00:21:02   Do you know if anyone from this team that made System 7 is still working at Apple today?

00:21:11   I would think so. Surely there's someone kicking around still. That really was only 20 years

00:21:16   ago. But it's definitely... there's nothing... I mean OS X and iOS have nothing to do

00:21:24   with this system. Like it's totally different every way. So what's the story

00:21:29   of this particular Mac? I think the big thing about that makes this

00:21:36   computer special is that it was unique for the time and it really... I really

00:21:45   think that it was you know if you think about 1997 Apple is you know before next

00:21:50   the next acquisition it's before Jobs comes back really this was developed in

00:21:56   1996 Apple was on the ropes right they had a bunch of Macs that no one cared

00:22:01   about they made way too many of them and there was no distinguishing one from

00:22:05   another their system software was in trouble it was aging quickly they were

00:22:10   were bleeding users to Windows and I think Apple whether consciously or not

00:22:16   swung for the fences with this computer in a way that was really unusual for the

00:22:22   time. There is a I'll put in the show notes there's a Johnny Ive video for

00:22:28   this computer and it's kind of funny because Johnny Ive is like young and has

00:22:31   sideburns and it's all very strange. Yes it's very young. But the what he says in that

00:22:38   video and the things they talk about in it like resonate today. So things like

00:22:43   Apple cares about design and cares about the details that no one sees. There's a

00:22:49   joke that Steve Jobs used to tell that the back of his computer looked better

00:22:53   than the front of anyone else's. That phrase ends up more or less in this

00:22:58   video. They talk about the way that it's put together on the back and like

00:23:02   the way that everything is paid attention to. I mean for example there

00:23:07   where you plug in your keyboard and stuff on this computer. There's a photo of it in my YouTube video.

00:23:11   There's cable routing. So there's little clips so you can put the cables in it and then a cover that goes over them so you don't have to see...

00:23:19   If you have this out on a desk in an open office and someone walks past it, they don't see your cables. They're all tucked behind this little plate.

00:23:26   All those little details, using an LCD and a desktop, which was unheard of in 1996,

00:23:33   making it more than a computer but an

00:23:36   entertainment system. So with the Bose

00:23:38   system you could also tune it to FM

00:23:41   radio and you could watch TV on it. You

00:23:44   could bring coax right into the computer.

00:23:45   Like all these things like entertainment,

00:23:49   design, great sound, a striking design. I

00:23:55   mean even at 20 years old this computer

00:23:57   in its own way is beautiful and unique.

00:24:01   That's all stuff Apple cares about today. And so what was so surprising to me was

00:24:06   to see the seeds of that before Steve Jobs comes back. I think it's easy, I

00:24:12   think I've done it, it's easy to write off 90s Apple like it was just a dumpster

00:24:16   fire and Steve Jobs and company came in and saved it. Well some of that

00:24:21   Renaissance was already going on and I really think that has everything to do

00:24:24   with Johnny Ive. You get the sense that this was the first project that he was

00:24:29   really allowed to kind of go crazy on. And there are some problems with that.

00:24:34   It's not a perfect system, but it is one that very much feels like the Apple we

00:24:40   know today. And that is just really interesting to me. Yeah, it's for some

00:24:46   reason, he reminds me of the Bose speaker. It's kind of similar to the Mac Pro.

00:24:53   Yeah, yeah. Someone made that joke on Twitter. It is that sort of circular shape.

00:24:58   But it's a very fancy computer, if you ask me.

00:25:04   Like for a vintage computer, it's not like an ugly piece of plastic, like a badge box.

00:25:09   It looks beautiful to me.

00:25:12   And even I'm looking now at pictures of the back.

00:25:15   There's like a fan in the top right corner, there's a six color Apple logo in the center.

00:25:22   I mean, it looks really nice.

00:25:25   You posted a picture of this Mac compared to an iMac and you can clearly see the evolution

00:25:32   or at least the line of thinking evolving throughout two decades.

00:25:39   Probably one of your best purchases, Steven.

00:25:42   At least from my audience point of view.

00:25:48   It's really an interesting product to watch in the video, which you published on YouTube

00:25:53   today for your new youtuber career. I don't know about career. I really like the video.

00:26:00   What was the process of shooting the video this time? Yeah so I've been pretty open that

00:26:07   this YouTube thing is very experimental. For me it's something that I don't have the...

00:26:13   I'm not a video guy by default. I'm learning this really as I go and so each one I am purposefully

00:26:22   introducing a new element. So this time it was the motion. So a lot of those sliding shots done with my camera mounted on a

00:26:29   slider.

00:26:32   And so I'm like I said, I'm learning as I go. So I had you know, I had the script written

00:26:37   I kind of knew what shots I needed and then spent basically a day yesterday

00:26:40   up at the office

00:26:44   shooting it. And it's done on sort of that infinite white backdrop

00:26:48   which I have done with like a giant roll of white butcher paper and some fancy

00:26:51   table placement. It's really shockingly low-tech, but what excites me about

00:26:59   doing this is that it's a way to to extend like what I'm doing. Like I got I

00:27:07   wrote about doing the anniversary of Myke years ago and like all the tech specs and

00:27:11   all the things why it's technically interesting and that's fine like

00:27:13   there's a place for those articles and I will continue to do those articles but

00:27:17   But what video lets me do is sort of tell the story of something in a different way.

00:27:23   So like this video I very purposefully did not talk about the specs.

00:27:26   Like it came with a 603 processor and it really should have probably been a 604 because it

00:27:31   was underpowered and some of them ran hot.

00:27:33   And like that doesn't matter for this sort of stuff.

00:27:36   What matters is that this is a, like you said, it's a unique looking computer like this paint

00:27:40   color, the startup chime, all of it is one off.

00:27:43   Like stuff done on this computer is never done again.

00:27:47   Video lets me tell that story that it's harder to get across in an article

00:27:53   and

00:27:55   so this whole project or whatever this becomes is really an idea of

00:28:01   Being able to extend what I'm already doing on 512

00:28:06   But sort of in like a new way and the hope is that this is wildly successful and becomes part of what 512 is

00:28:13   but but for now it is just me sort of experimenting and learning and

00:28:18   Seeing what works and what doesn't well down the road 512 museum. That's what I'm telling you

00:28:24   You gotta have a museum with all your old mechs. I just found a picture of

00:28:30   Seinfeld with the 20th anniversary mech

00:28:34   Yep. Yeah, there's one. It's it's the other kind of famous product placement is it shows up in Batman and Robin

00:28:42   I think and Alfred like burns a CD on it, which this computer can't do but it's kind of funny

00:28:48   They definitely showed up and you know you you know it's a tan because it's the only computer that looks like this

00:28:54   Which I think is um

00:28:56   Which I think is pretty awesome. Yeah, so what can you give us a hint of what's your next?

00:29:02   must have old Mac purchase

00:29:05   in your dream list I

00:29:09   Think the I think the Macintosh TV is pretty harmless still what's a Macintosh TV, so it is

00:29:16   Like what year it was I'm looking

00:29:19   1993 and I'll put a link in the chat room making oh my god. It's black it is

00:29:25   TV and it is in some ways related to the TAM so the Macintosh TV you could watch TV on it as well

00:29:33   but

00:29:35   You can either watch TV

00:29:37   Or work on it as a Mac. Couldn't do both

00:29:40   It's basically like a 14 inch CRT

00:29:45   Performa what's kind of sad if you look at this date it was for sale from October 1993 to February 1994

00:29:52   Oh, no, like five months

00:29:54   Which was sad and it ran system

00:29:57   7.1 to 7.6 and so the TAM runs 7.6

00:30:01   So it's like that kind of shows you how slow the OS had become.

00:30:05   Like we were in System 7 for a long time.

00:30:09   These are probably as rare as the TAM.

00:30:12   They don't go for as much.

00:30:13   I think that a lot of people just think, oh, it's black.

00:30:16   That's interesting.

00:30:17   But I would say that's on the short list still.

00:30:22   I'm looking at the Wikipedia page for Macintosh TV.

00:30:25   This is crazy.

00:30:25   Only 10,000 were made.

00:30:27   Yeah.

00:30:29   Remember Apple's 30th Mac birthday thing

00:30:33   they did a couple years ago?

00:30:34   - Yeah.

00:30:35   - They did that slideshow of a computer per year.

00:30:38   I believe that the Macintosh TV was 1993's pick for that.

00:30:43   Was just sad because it wasn't for sale for very long.

00:30:47   But maybe one of these will show up one day.

00:30:49   So I have plenty more stuff to make videos about though

00:30:51   without buying anything else.

00:30:53   Which is good because I have depleted

00:30:54   my collection money for a while.

00:30:56   - Yeah, we both know that's not gonna happen.

00:30:59   So yeah, we'll see what happens.

00:31:02   I do love the TAM video, Steven, well done.

00:31:06   - Thanks, man.

00:31:08   Oh, we didn't mention, we have to mention this real quick.

00:31:10   We'll put a link in the show notes to the Welcome Tour video.

00:31:14   - Oh yes, oh my god.

00:31:16   Why do they, what's the reason for that weird looking video?

00:31:21   - So it came on a CD, it came preloaded

00:31:25   on the computer out of the box.

00:31:28   The video makes it a little more disjointed because it was actually a Mac app and you could click through and watch these different

00:31:34   Video clips. I just put them all together into one long video

00:31:37   But it's it is a part tour of the computer

00:31:42   So like this is how the trackpad works because can't think came with the trackpad seven mouse

00:31:46   With like leather inserts around it. It's all very strange and

00:31:49   Then really my favorite part is towards the end where it's just this

00:31:54   multimedia extravaganza

00:31:58   So like there's a tear falls from an eye that makes ripples in a water that becomes the strings on a cello and

00:32:05   Then what I put in the 20th anniversary Mac video is this

00:32:09   Drawing of the old Western like the poster that then gets hit by lightning and becomes a guitar player

00:32:16   Who's alive with the train in the background? Yes? It's all very

00:32:20   LSD inspired yeah, and

00:32:26   What I can't

00:32:28   Reconcile is that I think this was weird even for 1997

00:32:33   Yeah, it's like my impression having shared this like with some people who were around and even covering Apple at the time

00:32:38   They were like, yeah, that was strange. Well, I don't remember. I mean I was alive in 1997

00:32:44   I was what eight I wasn't that weird

00:32:47   I don't remember people being into this sort of weird things

00:32:52   So the video was definitely weird at the time and it is even worse now

00:32:56   So maybe it was a way to showcase the CGI

00:33:00   Capabilities at the time no idea I can coming up short with explanations

00:33:06   Yeah, it's not

00:33:09   It's not great. I mean if you were to put this video in a time capsule and

00:33:14   You know save it for the future and people looking back at this video that they they could think man

00:33:21   people were weird in 1996. I mean, the cowboy with the guitar and the

00:33:28   train and the tear and the... I just... It's awesome. You should go check it out on

00:33:36   YouTube. It's a must watch in its very own way.

00:33:41   Yeah, so that's the welcome tour video. So all these things will

00:33:47   be in the show notes at relay.fm/connected/76 or in your app of choice.

00:33:53   So, Ferik, let's talk about AirMail for a little bit.

00:33:58   Ok. So what's AirMail up to? So it's, AirMail came out originally in three years ago in 2013.

00:34:07   Shortly after Google acquired Sparrow. You remember that email client?

00:34:14   - Oh yeah, foreign one out.

00:34:16   - Yes, arguably it was, according to many people,

00:34:21   one of the best email clients that were made

00:34:25   after the Tweety era of modern Mac app design

00:34:30   and Google bought Sparrow and these Italian guys

00:34:34   from Bloop, it's the name of the company,

00:34:36   came out with this airmail client for the desktop.

00:34:41   So it was an email client with support for IMAP

00:34:44   Gmail and eventually iCloud. It was very powerful and it evolved especially after version 2,

00:34:51   I believe in 2014, to have a variety of power user features. So you could have markdown,

00:34:59   you could write a markdown and have a preview of rich text while writing a message. You could have

00:35:04   filters for search, you could have a lot of customization options. And now they made

00:35:12   airmail for iPhone. So I've been, and again, as the joke goes, I've been testing this iPhone version since about

00:35:20   November, I think,

00:35:22   or early December. It launched yesterday on the App Store. I have a review on Mac stories and

00:35:27   every time a new email client comes out, it gets people talking. And I believe the reason is

00:35:34   the default mail app,

00:35:38   Especially if you use Gmail and you know just yesterday Google said there's a billion people using Gmail every month

00:35:44   The mail app experience with Gmail on iOS is not great

00:35:48   So it doesn't have any specific Gmail features and this probably comes down to you know

00:35:54   The the war between Apple and Google you don't have push notifications

00:35:58   The interface of the Apple mail app is very much a classic, you know traditional one

00:36:04   It works well for IMAP and iCloud, but for Gmail and the crazy things that Gmail does on top of email,

00:36:11   you cannot have those in the Mail app and most notably again fast search and push notifications.

00:36:18   So, Airmail tries to offer a modern email experience based on

00:36:25   the features and design that others have tried in the past few years on iOS.

00:36:31   It's kind of obvious that it borrows heavily from Mailbox, which again, putting one out,

00:36:37   it's going away at the end of the month.

00:36:39   So you have modern features such as snoozing or you can browse contacts.

00:36:47   There's better support for attachments,

00:36:51   so you can integrate with third-party file management services like Box and Dropbox if you want to import an attachment from those services or like

00:36:58   save an attachment directly from email to one of those locations. So it builds

00:37:03   on top of what others have been doing for the past few years, but it doesn't

00:37:07   try to do a lot of that, like, smart automatic categorization of messages,

00:37:13   similar to what you can find in Spark by Riddle or notably Inbox, which is the

00:37:20   alternative Gmail app from Google. It's mostly like a collection of

00:37:27   features from the past few years in iOS email clients. So there's a little bit of

00:37:34   Outlook, there's a little bit of Mailbox, the app integrations are very

00:37:40   similar to what this patch has been doing on the iPhone and iPad. So as I argue in my

00:37:46   review, Airmail is a really power user oriented client. There's a lot of

00:37:52   customization, you can change a lot of settings, probably even too many for most

00:37:56   people. It gives you complete control over appearance workflow, you can change

00:38:01   everything. One of the key features is iCloud sync, so if you use

00:38:06   RML on the Mac you can activate iCloud sync for two reasons. One, it lets you

00:38:12   import an account so you don't have to type in your email address if you want

00:38:17   to add it on another device. And the second one, possibly even the most

00:38:21   useful one, you can sync settings across platforms. So if you say, "When I mean

00:38:27   snooze until morning, but my morning is noon because I wake up late, I want

00:38:33   this setting to be available across the Mac and the iPhone." And with iCloud Sync

00:38:37   in general, you can do that. I wish more apps would do that. So often I'll

00:38:42   set something up just the way I want it and then I'll pick up my iPad and it's doing

00:38:45   something totally different. I don't know how hard that is. I get the

00:38:49   sense that having I was in the beta and been playing it with this some more the

00:38:55   setting stuff in airmail is really deep and I agree with you that I think to a

00:38:59   degree there's too much fiddliness in there that I think some people will find

00:39:03   that overwhelming but the the fact that it does sync really is nice and I wish

00:39:09   that more developers who are cross-platform not just iOS but

00:39:12   especially on the Mac as well like spend the time to do that because it really is

00:39:17   such a nice feature, especially when you have, you know, sometimes I have four toggles,

00:39:22   like who cares, I can go in and set my four settings, but this thing has just

00:39:25   seemingly endless number of options, and going through with your phone

00:39:29   in one hand, sitting at your Mac, changing all the check boxes so

00:39:33   they're the same, it gets super old quickly. And so I really like that about

00:39:38   Airmail. Yeah, there are some parts that are rough, and in my review I call them

00:39:44   not finished. Some of them are related to performance. So scrolling

00:39:50   isn't always fixed at 60 frames per second. You can get kind of

00:39:56   jittery when scrolling, which I don't like of course. Sometimes animations kind

00:40:02   of get stuck so when you perform as wipes to run actions there's some UI

00:40:08   glitches there. The way that the signature comes up on screen is kind of

00:40:12   And there are some features that, while not problematic from a technical point of view, are just not there.

00:40:19   Notably, there is no iPad version, and some options of the Mac app are not available yet.

00:40:26   So you cannot write in Markdown, or you cannot create saved searches. There are no filters for search.

00:40:33   So it's a solid beginning. But there are still some issues from a technical point of view, and some features that are missing.

00:40:41   are missing. And the big problem for me and I believe for Myke and I think for a lot of

00:40:46   people is that there's no iPad version. The problem here is when you try one of these

00:40:53   modern email apps with features such as, you know, snooze settings to move a message from

00:41:00   one folder to another at a certain time or, you know, when you activate sync and you want

00:41:06   to have all these preferences in a certain way, not having the same app on all of your

00:41:11   devices becomes a problem. And for me, because I don't use a Mac, I use the iPhone and iPad,

00:41:17   I want to have the same email client, with the same settings, with the same conventions,

00:41:20   with the same design even, because doing email is something I don't like, and if I have to

00:41:25   do, which I do, I want to make sure that I'm fast and that I know how to do that. So if

00:41:32   If you have a Mac and an iPhone, you don't work on the iPad, I recommend trying Airmail,

00:41:38   because on the Mac and on the iPhone, it works nicely.

00:41:42   For people like us, I think not having an iPad version at launch is a problem.

00:41:48   Now, the developers are working on an iPad version.

00:41:50   There's going to be supposedly an iPad beta soon, but as always in these cases, launching

00:41:57   with an iPhone app with the promise of an iPad version down the road doesn't do much

00:42:01   right now. I have a need for email on my iPad right now, which means that I

00:42:08   gotta use Outlook on both the iPhone and the iPad. But I think RML is going to

00:42:14   strike a chord with power users, and I know that it did the same on the Mac. A

00:42:18   lot of people use RML on the Mac because it's got all of these options and

00:42:21   settings that if you're extremely nitpicky or geeky about your email

00:42:27   you're going to appreciate having on iOS.

00:42:30   What I wanted to discuss briefly with you, from my conclusion,

00:42:36   I just quickly touched upon.

00:42:39   The email market on iOS today, it seems kind of crazy to me

00:42:43   that just seven years ago, Apple wasn't even

00:42:47   accepting third-party email clients on the App Store.

00:42:51   And now the market has flourished.

00:42:54   Since Sparrow came out, 2010, 2011, maybe on the iPhone, there's so much choice right

00:43:02   now and big companies are making email apps.

00:43:05   So there's Gmail inbox outlook, Yahoo email if you use it, and there's third-party developers.

00:43:12   There seems to me that there's much, much more innovation on the iOS app store for email

00:43:19   than on the Mac.

00:43:21   Yeah, and it's going on the Mac too. There's a poly mail I think is in beta.

00:43:27   Yeah. I think what it really speaks to is that Apple's first party client just

00:43:32   hasn't kept up. Especially when you look at some Gmail specific things and my

00:43:40   guess is it's only going to get worse you know at some point Gmail, I mean they're

00:43:44   building a super set of stuff on top of IMAP and it's not that you can't

00:43:48   archive mail. I mean that the basics work in Apple's first-party client but

00:43:52   these other features that people have built on top of Gmail snoozing and all

00:43:58   this other stuff eventually we're going to get to a point where IMAP can't

00:44:03   support that sort of thing and so either Google will move to their own thing

00:44:08   completely which they have hinted at that they may do at some point or you're

00:44:13   going to be in a situation where you're waiting on Apple to you know get around

00:44:17   to, oh next year when the new version of iOS comes out then they may include this

00:44:21   stuff. And you know historically Apple's been slow to have like great support for

00:44:29   other people's stuff and you know the iOS supports and OS X support exchange

00:44:38   and they support you know the basics of Gmail but at some point I think that

00:44:42   that riff is going to become too great and I think with that out on the horizon

00:44:45   a lot of these third party developers have jumped in and are building clients

00:44:49   who know work really well with all that stuff and give people what they expect

00:44:54   from a Gmail experience and I think that Apple has created this this this hole in

00:45:03   the market of like their their app is great if you use iCloud or if you use

00:45:06   Gmail without all the bonus stuff but if you really want some of these nice

00:45:10   power user features then mail is in line with a bunch of other Apple apps that

00:45:16   don't get the job done right like mail has become something like reminders or

00:45:22   before this year notes right where it's a simple app and it's fine for a lot of

00:45:28   people and it's you know it gets the job done but anyone who needs more power is

00:45:31   gonna go to a third party and things like Evernote happened and things like

00:45:36   It's paper in pocket as opposed to reading list and things like

00:45:42   OmniFocus and Todoist and Todoist instead of Reminders. And I think what we're seeing is

00:45:46   that happening in mail clients in a big way.

00:45:50   Yeah, but I totally wouldn't be surprised to see iOS 10 with the snoozes in the

00:45:56   mail app. I mean, it's one of those features that Apple wants or needs to

00:46:02   Sherlock, eventually, because so many people are using it. And it's a third-party

00:46:07   innovation that Apple isn't afraid of being inspired from, as you would

00:46:14   say. It's really copying, but it's one of those third-party conventions

00:46:18   that eventually becomes like a standard in iOS apps, like Pull to Refresh. Or

00:46:23   what's the other one that they did? Reading List, Pull to Refresh, there was

00:46:28   another one. Oh, swipe gestures on email from Mailbox. That also wasn't an Apple Mail feature.

00:46:37   Now it's almost second nature for millions of people. I believe that eventually we will

00:46:44   get new settings in Apple Mail, maybe based on reminders and iCloud, I don't know. But

00:46:51   I want to see Apple have really better integration with Gmail. I know that's probably a utopia

00:46:57   scenario because you know Apple and Google but one can dream and if dreaming is not enough

00:47:04   we'll still have the App Store you know so I

00:47:07   Guess I guess my question for you is

00:47:10   We're saying all this flourish of activity

00:47:13   but the road behind us is littered with the carcass of dead email clients or

00:47:19   dying email clients, and I just I wonder if

00:47:24   Is there room for a successful third-party mail app? I mean we have Outlook now, but that's owned by Microsoft

00:47:30   That doesn't really count. Outlook doesn't have to make money end of itself, right?

00:47:33   But I would imagine that airmail does and if you look at even something like mailbox, you know, not I

00:47:41   Feel like a mailbox had been a paid app. That was wildly successful. Maybe Dropbox would have kept it

00:47:47   I don't know

00:47:48   But you see what I'm saying? Like I understand that the future is exciting

00:47:52   but I can't help but think about all the clients that we've loved that have come and gone as well.

00:47:58   I think the future, if you're an indie developer doing email clients, the future is in power users.

00:48:05   Power users are a very peculiar breed of human. They like apps that make them save time and

00:48:17   and make them more efficient and they're not...

00:48:20   Paying is not a problem and I think it's smart to make

00:48:24   to kind of market an email client as

00:48:28   the email app for power users with a lot of settings, with a paid up front

00:48:32   kind of model and we've seen this happen with

00:48:36   OmniFocus to do people are not afraid to

00:48:39   pay for software that they use and

00:48:43   with the problem with email is that unlike a task manager

00:48:47   email works at scale. So you gotta integrate with services, you know, Gmail, iCloud, and you gotta have this sort of scaling server components such as search or push notifications.

00:49:00   And it can be tricky to balance, you know, I wanna make a free email client and make money off, you know, data in some way or advertising, or integrations, you know, I wanna make partnerships and make money that way.

00:49:16   Or maybe I don't want to make money at all if I'm Google and Microsoft because my company is big enough to make money in other ways.

00:49:23   I just want to provide an email service.

00:49:25   Or maybe you want to sell an email client and have all of these features.

00:49:30   I think Airmail has a better shot at surviving than other apps that are free and that have no clear way of making money down the road.

00:49:40   the road unless an acquisition is in sight or maybe you want to discontinue the client

00:49:47   and do something else with it. I think Ereml as an indie product has a better chance of surviving.

00:49:54   I mean we've seen that with Ereml on the Mac. It's been going on for three years, the developers

00:49:59   charge for the app on the OS X and with free services and free apps there's always the risk

00:50:08   of them being discontinued. That's also the case with paid apps. But statistically, I

00:50:15   have better faith in a small team selling an email client at a price than this sort

00:50:22   of venture-backed email client that's free and you don't really know how it makes money.

00:50:29   But hey, look at that. It's a shiny new toy and eventually it will disappear. We'll see.

00:50:35   Alright we got a little bit more talk about this week but first we're going to

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00:53:03   Federico, what did you buy? I bought a Synology device, network attached storage,

00:53:12   little media server that I keep at home and I'm having lots of fun with.

00:53:19   I assume you want to know the backstory here. I do. I also want to know,

00:53:23   because I'm a nerd, which model you bought. I bought, and I know some people were upset by my decision, I bought the DS214 Play.

00:53:32   And I bought that one instead of the DS216 because it was cheaper.

00:53:40   I looked up the reviews on AnandTech and there was no

00:53:44   significant change for stuff that I was mostly interested in. And it was cheaper on Amazon and it had Prime shipping.

00:53:52   And this is a two bay NAS. I bought initially a four terabyte

00:54:04   Western Digital Red drive. Only bought one. I did my research.

00:54:11   I only bought one, then I realized I was being stupid. I needed to have a

00:54:18   a RAID configuration and so I bought the second one and enabled what they call the SHR, which is the

00:54:26   RAID automatic type of setting from Synology itself. I set it up and now my first drive is

00:54:35   mirrored to the second one and so if a drive fails I should have the second one ready to go.

00:54:41   The reason I bought this, I explained this in the email to Club Max Stories members on Sunday.

00:54:50   My girlfriend and I have been growing increasingly insecure about backups.

00:54:56   My girlfriend, she has an old MacBook.

00:54:59   We put an SSD in it a couple of years ago, actually, maybe even more, 3 to 4 years ago.

00:55:08   and the MacBook is still doing okay, but eventually it's gonna die,

00:55:13   and she wants to have a time machine backup.

00:55:17   We didn't have a time machine volume.

00:55:19   We are firmly against cables, so we wanted to have a wireless time machine volume.

00:55:26   We don't have an Apple Airport Extreme or Time Capsule,

00:55:31   because we prefer Netgear hardware in our house for wireless needs,

00:55:37   So we wanted to have a wireless volume for Time Machine.

00:55:41   That was the first issue.

00:55:43   My second backup anxiety is that with all this work that I do for Max Stories, Club Max Stories and Relay,

00:55:53   I deal with a lot of documents and data that, okay, I do backup with iCloud,

00:55:58   but I always, and I do keep in Dropbox or Box, but I felt like having a redundant option,

00:56:08   you know, that I control, would be, it would make me feel safer. And then there's the media problem,

00:56:16   which is we watch a lot of TV shows, a lot of movies every night,

00:56:20   ...

00:56:22   Sorry.

00:56:24   And we want to have the kind of workflow that doesn't force us to use a Mac, to download them.

00:56:33   We don't, because every weekend, or every two weeks lately, we go back to Viterbo, our hometown.

00:56:41   We don't want to put a Mac in our suitcase, we just want to bring our My iPad Pro.

00:56:48   We don't want to bring the Mac just to watch TV shows and to download them, because downloads on iOS are terrible.

00:56:56   So my idea was, we can either buy a Mac Mini or we can buy a NAS right now.

00:57:04   Eventually, I believe the Mac Mini is the better option for me, but this year we'll see how the new Macbooks are.

00:57:11   But right now we wanted to have something that we could set up and forget about it for the rest of the year or really for the future.

00:57:18   So we went with the Synology because I've been reading for the past few years.

00:57:23   My friend Gabe at MacDrifter, he owns the Synology. My friend Don also used to write for Mac Stories, he has the Synology.

00:57:33   And everyone I know that has the Synology were super satisfied with the product.

00:57:39   So I thought, you know, I want to have backups, I want to organize all my TV shows and movies,

00:57:45   and some music that I no longer listen to because it's not available on streaming services.

00:57:50   I want to organize them, I want to have them in a single location, and at this point

00:57:54   I also have a fiber connection, which is fast and it allows me to upload and download at crazy

00:58:00   speeds, at least for me, for my standards. I should really buy a Synology. And it really was a

00:58:08   a few coincidences and maybe late realizations that led us to buy one and set it up.

00:58:14   And it's now in our kitchen in a fancy piece of furniture, at least we think it's fancy

00:58:19   from IKEA, so the fancy scale is objectable.

00:58:24   But it's working quite well for us.

00:58:28   I'm mostly using the default Synology apps, so the DS apps that they have, like DS Video

00:58:35   and DS Audio.

00:58:37   I know that I could use Plex, but for some reason the port that Plex uses is not working

00:58:46   for my connection, whereas the DS-Video one is working just fine, both on WiFi and 4G.

00:58:52   Synology gives you this quick connect sort of online component that allows you to access

00:58:58   your NAS from outside of the local network, and that's been working super well for me

00:59:04   so far.

00:59:07   So yeah, I set up a DS video with folders where I can watch TV shows and movies.

00:59:13   I downloaded some albums like Rare, EPs and live performances from Oasis and Death Cab

00:59:20   for Cutie that are not available on Apple Music and Spotify.

00:59:24   And I don't want to use YouTube because I'm not an animal, so I keep them in the Synology

00:59:29   and I listen with the DS audio app, which is a fine app.

00:59:31   It lets you stream music, it lets you download songs locally.

00:59:36   works for me. We're watching TV shows, watching movies, listening to music.

00:59:43   The last aspect, at least for now, I configured the Cloud Sync feature. It basically lets

00:59:51   you mirror online services like Box or Google Drive or Dropbox back into the Synology. So

00:59:59   you have a backup of those online services running on your local device.

01:00:06   gives me the peace of mind of knowing that yes, I do save all of my critical work files

01:00:11   in Box and Dropbox, but if something ever goes wrong with those accounts, I also have

01:00:15   a copy on my Synology. So that's what we're doing so far.

01:00:22   Yeah, I mean, what I really like about these things is that you can expand what you do

01:00:28   with it as time goes on. So if you do decide to do Plex or do decide something else, then

01:00:32   it's a very modular system because it

01:00:35   unlike a hard drive sitting on you know

01:00:37   just sitting directly you know over USB

01:00:41   or Thunderbolt or something this is a

01:00:42   computer so you can like the cloud sync

01:00:45   for instance you know it's running that

01:00:46   whether or not your Mac or iPad is in

01:00:49   the house if you're you know someplace

01:00:52   else and are doing something in Dropbox

01:00:54   or Box then the Synology is keeping up

01:00:55   with it on its own because it is a

01:00:57   self-contained unit and that gives you a

01:01:00   lot of flexibility and power in setting things up to just to run and just to

01:01:06   take care of things when you're not actively interacting with the

01:01:13   box. I think it's really great and I had a 4 bay one for over a year and had

01:01:21   a hardware issue with it and then ended up not keeping it but I've got a Mac

01:01:27   many at home on the network and it takes over, has taken over a lot of those

01:01:31   things that the NAS did, but really the idea is the same as having

01:01:36   something always on the network that can take care of things, that can host

01:01:40   backups, can host files, share media. It really is a very useful thing if you

01:01:47   need that sort of functionality. Yeah, and I appreciate how the company has a

01:01:52   a suite of mobile apps. They are updated for the latest iOS versions. There's like some

01:02:00   crazy stuff that I'm not gonna use. There's a note-taking app called the dsNote. It's

01:02:05   like a mix of Evernote and a task manager. Of course there's a traditional file manager

01:02:13   that lets you browse folders and create shortcuts and that kind of stuff. And then there's a

01:02:18   DS video and audio, which is the media experience, and the ones with the crazy people can even

01:02:28   install a beta of the Synology OS version 6, but I thought about it for a couple of

01:02:35   seconds, then I read "You cannot downgrade to the stable version" and I'm like "Nope,

01:02:39   not gonna do that on my new fancy toy that I'm using for backups and TV shows". So yeah,

01:02:45   The company is really, you know, they have updates coming, they have mobile apps, the

01:02:50   hardware is solid, and it's extendable, so, you know, it might have been lots of fun.

01:02:56   Awesome.

01:02:57   I think we'll wrap up this week talking about this rumor of the March 15th Apple event,

01:03:05   which is, Germin posted this a couple hours ago as we record, and basically kind of bringing

01:03:12   together all the stuff we've been talking about. So the 5 SE, iPad Air 3

01:03:19   which I think is the most interesting thing that we haven't really talked

01:03:22   about, and then sort of a watch refresh. Not new watch hardware itself but new

01:03:27   bands, potentially a software update, you know the sort of the accessory side of

01:03:32   the of the watch. I think what's most interesting to me though for today is the

01:03:37   iPad Air 3 and the reports over the last couple weeks have really congealed

01:03:42   around it being an iPad Pro mini. So having four speakers, having a smart

01:03:47   connector which means that you know the potentially a new smart keyboard or

01:03:52   third-party keyboards could interface like they do on the iPad Pro and then

01:03:56   even potentially pencil support. What I mean the iPad Air 2 is a great device

01:04:03   and is powerful and is really held up.

01:04:05   But Federico, do you think that they need to

01:04:08   make the Air like a little Pro or do

01:04:11   you think that there's room to keep some

01:04:12   of those Pro features only on the 12-inch model?

01:04:15   Well it makes sense for some

01:04:18   features to trickle down from the Pro to

01:04:21   the Air line. I don't know if there's a

01:04:24   need for all of them, so you know the

01:04:27   crazy CPU or the 4GB of RAM or the

01:04:30   the Pencil, but definitely the speaker system and the smart connector make sense to me.

01:04:36   The Pencil is the big question, right?

01:04:39   Because Apple pushed the iPad Pro with the Pencil as a unique proposition from the company,

01:04:44   for artists and users who needed a better input device, the Pro and the Pencil seemed

01:04:52   to go together as a single product.

01:04:55   So breaking out the pencil from the Pro line and extending compatibility with the iPad

01:05:02   Air would be interesting to see what happens there.

01:05:06   But I do believe that the speaker system and the accessory support with the smart connector

01:05:11   make sense to me.

01:05:14   I think Apple needs to always offer new reasons to upgrade an iPad to the latest model.

01:05:24   If anything, because a lot of people don't buy iPads like they buy iPhones, there's still

01:05:31   people who have an iPad 2 or an iPad 4, remember that guy?

01:05:35   Oh yeah.

01:05:36   And a lot of people still have those and they see an iPad Air and it doesn't have, you know,

01:05:43   it's faster and it's lighter, but it doesn't have new things, right?

01:05:48   I mean, two speakers and a new connector, that's new stuff for people.

01:05:54   The pencil will be even better.

01:05:56   So I guess it makes sense to try crazy things first with the Pro, and eventually, having

01:06:03   the technology come down to the iPad Air, and maybe with slightly inferior CPU or RAM,

01:06:10   I don't know.

01:06:11   And of course, the big difference would be the user experience, just using iOS.

01:06:18   It can be the same version of iOS, and it can be the same set of accessories and hardware,

01:06:23   just using iOS on the iPad Air and on the iPad Pro is for me better on the Pro

01:06:28   because it's bigger. You could have the same features and exactly the

01:06:32   same set of accessories on both devices and yet I would still prefer the Pro

01:06:36   because iOS is bigger and it's more comfortable. And it wouldn't be

01:06:41   the first time that we would end with a sort of scenario where every

01:06:45   iPad is essentially the same and you just gotta pick a size. Apple did this

01:06:50   before with the iPad Mini and the iPad Air, and now I wouldn't be surprised to see the

01:06:53   iPad Air and the iPad Pro sharing the same stage in terms of features, and it's just

01:06:58   a matter of screen size. So the rumor makes sense to me. The big question mark is the

01:07:03   pencil, at least for me, so I guess we'll see in about a month if the rumor's true.

01:07:09   And it has to be, because it's Gorman.

01:07:13   I agree with you on all of that. I think that Apple has to do what it can to make

01:07:20   each release exciting and I think that holding things just for the iPad Pro

01:07:24   because it's big or because it's special in some way is not the strategy that

01:07:29   need to be pursuing right now. If the iPad was not in more or less freefall I

01:07:35   think it would be different but I think they have to try to put the brakes on

01:07:39   that in any way possible. I think that the flip side of that especially with

01:07:44   the pencil is that if they get this into the air 3 and I still think the 9.7 inch

01:07:51   iPad is sort of the default one for most people yeah especially as phones have

01:07:55   gotten bigger I think the mini is sort of more specialized than maybe it once it

01:07:58   was at the beginning. I think that that would be encouraging to developers to

01:08:04   support the pencil in their apps or for

01:08:08   developers who make very pencil focused

01:08:10   apps like a lot of these drawing and art

01:08:12   apps. I think there's benefit to them as

01:08:14   well that hey you know I'm not building

01:08:17   this app that for only people who bought

01:08:19   the pro but air3 users can can use it as

01:08:21   well and over time it trickles down and

01:08:23   down. So I think the pencil makes a lot

01:08:26   of sense for the 9.7 inch screen. I also

01:08:29   agree with you that I'm not particularly

01:08:30   tempted by it except for you know

01:08:34   reading a bed or something the iPad Pro has has really clicked with me because

01:08:39   iOS is it benefits from the breathing room and especially the multitasking

01:08:45   stuff in iOS 9 even using it on an Air 2 feels cramped after after being on the

01:08:51   Pro so I don't see myself particularly tempted by this model but I do think

01:08:56   that there there will be people who are and who look at some of the stuff that

01:09:01   the pro can do and especially with the pencil and don't want to sacrifice you

01:09:08   know the size of the weight or don't want to spend a thousand dollars and you

01:09:12   know the air being a good bit cheaper I think will help bring this technology to

01:09:18   more people so I think it makes a ton of sense from a strategy standpoint and I

01:09:24   will be I will say that I would be surprised and disappointed if the pencil

01:09:30   doesn't show up on the iPad Air this time around.

01:09:34   You can buy the same furniture, you can buy the same couch and the same TV sets, and then

01:09:39   you gotta choose, do you wanna live in a small house or do you wanna live in a big house?

01:09:43   It's just a matter of preference.

01:09:44   You wanna be cozy, you know, with all the stuff closer together, or do you wanna be

01:09:48   comfortable and, you know, have a big real estate?

01:09:52   That's just a matter of your preference.

01:09:54   I believe that's the best way to go in the future, and also because people don't want

01:09:58   the big tablet or just want to see the air as the default, also because it's cheaper,

01:10:05   having pro hardware aspects come down to the most commercially viable iPad is also an incentive

01:10:16   for developers to make more pro apps, if you think about it.

01:10:21   The standard tablet becoming more pro is a benefit for everyone, not just for the pros.

01:10:26   It's almost like, slowly but surely, pro features of MacBook Pros became available to MacBooks,

01:10:35   and everyone saw the benefit in that.

01:10:38   So I see the same happening with the iPad.

01:10:42   I don't know, it just may be strange to think about, because it's so close to the iPad Pro

01:10:48   release, when Apple made a big deal of, you know, the Pencil is exclusive to the iPad

01:10:52   Pro, it's our best iPad ever, and now like five months later there's the

01:10:56   possibility of the iPad Air gaining the same features. That's maybe what's

01:11:00   strange right now, but if you think about it like from a higher perspective it

01:11:05   makes sense.

01:11:06   Yeah, I think so, and I don't think Apple's ever one to really hold

01:11:11   themselves to past statements. So if they say "Oh, it's exclusive to the iPad

01:11:14   Air," well that's not untrue.

01:11:15   It was at the time!

01:11:16   Yeah, I think they can't do it. And if they are doing this, this may explain

01:11:20   why the iPad Air 3 maybe they wanted to be exclusive to the pro for some reason

01:11:27   and and maybe that's why this is in the spring but I also think that I think

01:11:32   overall Apple is slowing down the iPad release cycle and I think that makes I

01:11:37   think that makes sense I think that burning resources to make a new iPad

01:11:42   every 12 months when people clearly aren't updating that often is I think

01:11:46   that's fine and so to make the

01:11:50   Each individual you know product or SKU you know good enough to last a couple of years and the iPad Air 2 has held up

01:11:56   really well, and you know we all said when they came out this is overkill and

01:11:59   Now with iOS 9 multitasking we see that you know it handles that well

01:12:05   And it was obviously built with that sort of thing in mind eventually

01:12:09   But the the pro is a different beast and is a lot more powerful so and I don't know if the Air 3 would have

01:12:14   The 4 gigs of RAM or the exact same processor configuration, but I would

01:12:19   expect it to be plenty powerful for the next 18 to 24 months if they continue to slow down this cycle.

01:12:30   But thankfully we only have a couple of weeks, or I guess about a month, to wait and see what happens.

01:12:36   It's gonna be interesting. I wanna try an Air 3. I'm pretty sure I'm not gonna switch because I just love iOS on the big screen.

01:12:48   big screen but it's an interesting product for me to consider so we'll see.

01:12:54   I think that does it for this week. You can find our show notes, like I said, in your podcast

01:13:01   App of Choice or on our website relay.fm/connected/76. You can find

01:13:08   Federico at MacStories.net or on Twitter at @vitticci. You can find Myke who is

01:13:16   homesick today but you can find him on

01:13:18   twitter as well at i Myke I am at ismh

01:13:21   on twitter and 512 pixels dot net is

01:13:23   where I spend my time writing about

01:13:25   computers that are older than some of my

01:13:27   readers now that's true it's true it's

01:13:32   yeah that's there's that so you feel

01:13:35   free to get in touch you can send us

01:13:37   feedback from the website get in touch

01:13:39   on twitter let us know what we messed up

01:13:41   and we will address it and follow up I

01:13:43   I think that's it.

01:13:45   So, till next time, Federico, say goodbye.

01:13:48   - Arrivederci.

01:13:49   - Adios.

01:13:50   [