66: I'm Holding a Billboard


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:04   From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode number 66.

00:00:08   Today's show is brought to you by lynda.com,

00:00:11   TextExpander from Smile and igloo.

00:00:14   My name is Myke Hurley and I am joined by Federico Vittigi.

00:00:17   Hello Federico.

00:00:18   Hello Myke.

00:00:19   And Steven Hackett.

00:00:21   Hey boys.

00:00:22   So we are back after a very stressful week,

00:00:26   at least for Federico.

00:00:27   Yes.

00:00:28   How are you feeling now?

00:00:29   calm. We're gonna talk about your review in a little bit but you feeling good now?

00:00:32   Yeah I'm feeling better I'm catching up still going through my email some new

00:00:37   apps that I want to try but I feel like I'm almost caught up and then you know

00:00:41   I'm super relaxed at the moment I spent a very relaxing weekend and I could just

00:00:47   feel like the all the stress like wearing off going away that's good so

00:00:52   I'm feeling I'm feeling pretty good Myke. Do you know who's not feeling very good?

00:00:58   Um, audio users.

00:01:01   Oh poor guys, poor guys.

00:01:03   I wanted to put this in here just because music streaming services have been such a long running thing for us.

00:01:10   And it was kind of like when Everpix shut down, you know, even though none of us were using audio at the time, which is probably the issue.

00:01:16   But as we record this, yesterday, November 16th, the news broke that audio is shutting down.

00:01:22   shutting down they've gone bankrupt and Pandora is buying their kind of key

00:01:26   assets for 75 million dollars so audio is gone right and and in maybe not a mean

00:01:33   way but Pandora is kind of just like picking the bones you know they just

00:01:37   they've just gone in and bought up what's like what the assets that are left

00:01:41   to help probably audio pay off its debts this was inevitable I think and it's

00:01:46   kind of mean I feel like I kind of mean to say that but with Apple music

00:01:51   it just kind of felt like

00:01:53   Audio had no place anymore like even though they did things that were different into things in an interesting perspective

00:01:59   But if you get another massive player it feels like some of the small players are gonna start to disappear. Titles next.

00:02:05   Yeah, I guess I mean I used audio for many years after

00:02:11   We all did right? We all did.

00:02:13   Spotify was the service that got me into streaming services

00:02:18   But after Spotify, so back in 2010, up until maybe 2013 even, I used RDO with a family account.

00:02:27   I loved the design and the service got so many features and details right for me.

00:02:34   Like the new releases section, and every Tuesday, back when it used to be New Music Tuesday.

00:02:40   It was the perfect new release page that I wanted...

00:02:44   And also to find out what was kind of good in your network of people. That was my favorite thing about

00:02:50   audio, right? Like it helped me find music from like-minded individuals, so I was finding new stuff.

00:02:56   I always really liked that about the service. It had real kind of good social stuff in it.

00:03:01   Yeah, and you could sort by label. You know, it's a tiny little detail that other services don't have.

00:03:08   And me and my girlfriend, we used a family account on audio for many years. She still says

00:03:14   that audio had the best design and like the overall structure of all the services. And it

00:03:20   kind of reminds me in a way of Everpix, you know, the parallel here is that they both had great

00:03:26   designs loved by tech people, I would say. But eventually it died because it wasn't as popular

00:03:36   with the masses maybe as other services like Spotify and Apple Music or, you know, Google Play

00:03:41   music even. So it's a sad day for RDL lovers, but as you say, we kind of saw this coming,

00:03:50   you know? It was inevitable at some point, it was the less differentiated of them all.

00:03:55   Not in terms of little design details or specific features, but for the general public. There

00:04:02   was no reason to use RDL instead of something like Spotify or Apple Music or Google.

00:04:07   - Yeah.

00:04:07   - Pouring one out for audio.

00:04:11   - Yes, yes.

00:04:12   - Man, I think it's another example where,

00:04:15   like in so many industries,

00:04:16   you can really only have two major players.

00:04:19   I mean, we see that in operating systems a lot.

00:04:22   But I mean, even like big, like photo services,

00:04:26   all these things, like it just often feels

00:04:27   like the third place guy gets squeezed out.

00:04:30   And I mean, it is rough,

00:04:31   and I'm sure a lot of people are affected by it,

00:04:34   but I agree with you guys.

00:04:36   I feel like if you didn't see this coming you were kind of not paying attention.

00:04:40   Yep. I'm sure that they did too but there's only so much you can do right? You just keep fighting

00:04:45   at it but at a certain point there's not really anything you can do other than kind of like cross

00:04:49   your fingers and hope. It's a shame. Yep I agree. In lighter news I have an incredible image here

00:04:57   sent via a tweet from Gabriel. Gabriel did an artist's rendition of Federico parading his iPad

00:05:04   around his home attached to his pencil like a picket sign. It is incredible. I don't like to ask

00:05:14   for things you know because I feel like it's a bit mean but Gabriel I would love a kind of a colored

00:05:22   version of this because I can see that you started to ink it. I would love to see like a full finished

00:05:28   colored version of this that would be that would make me very very happy. I would probably make a

00:05:33   a sticker out of it.

00:05:35   Can I just point out a little detail here in the picture?

00:05:38   So on the iPad screen it says in Italian "Abbiamo Tastiere in Italiano".

00:05:45   It's not perfect, so Gabriel, sorry, but I have to point this out.

00:05:50   I guess what you wanted to say is "We want Italian keyboards", because right now it says

00:05:55   "We have Italian keyboards".

00:05:59   So maybe what you want to say is "voliamo tostier in Italiano" which would be "we want

00:06:05   keyboards in Italian".

00:06:07   It's such a small detail but it completely changes it.

00:06:10   Yes, especially in relation to the review and my complaints about the Italian layouts.

00:06:14   I guess what you wanted to say is "we want" instead of "we have" but it's such a great

00:06:20   picture and I love how my hairstyle, the jacket, the shoes and the pillow for protection.

00:06:28   Totally nailed it. It is excellent. It really really made me laugh when I saw it which is why I want more of it

00:06:35   Gabriel if you are willing that would be amazing if you're not that is also okay. You did a fantastic job. We still love you

00:06:41   Yes, we do. We do still love you indeed

00:06:43   There's somebody in the in the chat room

00:06:46   Suggested making it a fracture which is also a very very good idea

00:06:50   Yeah, they're not a sponsor today, but it's also a very very good idea

00:06:53   Now Federico, you have a very important topic that you'd like to share with us today.

00:06:58   And I wanted to keep this as a prize for you guys because, you know, I like surprises.

00:07:03   So, you know that I've been doing some very important field reporting on car sharing services in Italy.

00:07:11   Yes.

00:07:11   And I like to keep tabs on the car sharing scene in Italy with my friends. So let me tell you a little story.

00:07:18   Last week,

00:07:20   before, actually maybe about 10 days ago, it was before the iPad review, it was the

00:07:24   Friday night before. I was out for dinner at a friend's house, I know because I remember

00:07:29   I sent Steven a picture, and we were talking and my friends were like "do you want to go

00:07:35   to the club later because we're going to the club?" and I was like "no, I don't want to

00:07:39   go tonight, I gotta finish my review". They knew that I was writing my iPad article. And

00:07:46   You know, I was dedicated to the cars, I needed to ride, but I asked them "Are you gonna take

00:07:51   your car?"

00:07:52   And I asked this because a few weeks before, a friend of mine, her car got broken into

00:07:58   in front of the club, and by some people they stole a bunch of jackets and a wallet that

00:08:03   was left in the car.

00:08:05   So my friends, I knew they didn't want to take a car to the club anymore.

00:08:11   And my friend replied, "Yeah, we're not gonna take my car, we're going with an Enjoy car."

00:08:16   And I was like, "What's an Enjoy car?"

00:08:19   So there's this service in Italy, it's called Enjoy, and it's a car sharing service with

00:08:26   a particular twist.

00:08:29   So you don't want to use your car, or maybe you don't have a car, and you have a smartphone,

00:08:35   So you download this Enjoy app and you find, so you provide your location with Apple Maps

00:08:43   and it finds these Fiat cars around you.

00:08:49   They are red, Fiat, you know the Cinco Cento, the 500.

00:08:52   Is that what they call it in Italy?

00:08:56   The Cinco Cento?

00:08:57   Yes!

00:08:58   That is amazing.

00:08:59   What do you call it?

00:09:00   What, just the Fiat 500?

00:09:01   No, no, the Cinco Cento.

00:09:02   But I'd never considered that, right?

00:09:05   it's not 500, that's stupid, but it just sounds way better when you say it.

00:09:09   I think there's a bunch of Italians walking around going "that's the Fiat 500!" No, that's not what happened.

00:09:14   No, no. So you got this bunch of Fiat, red Fiat's, and I saw these cars for many, many months before,

00:09:23   I just never realized, I just thought it was some kind of advertising for, you know, there's people

00:09:27   who put stickers on their cars for money, you know, like free publicity for companies that want to put

00:09:33   stickers on people's cars and you get some money out of it. I thought it was just some

00:09:38   kind of deal in Rome. Instead, it's a company, it's called Enjoy, and it's got this fleet

00:09:43   of Fiat cars. You use a smartphone and you find a car around you. And it shows you all

00:09:53   these little cars on a map, so it can be green if it's available, it can be yellow if it's

00:09:58   busy, means it's taken by someone else, or it can be read if it's currently on the road.

00:10:04   So what you do is you rent a car. So this car is parked somewhere. And you say, "I want

00:10:12   to take this car." And you have 15 minutes to get to the car, by walking or any other

00:10:19   means. You go to the car and those free 15 minutes you don't pay anything. When you're

00:10:27   in front of the car from your smartphone you unlock the car with the app, you get into

00:10:33   the car and you start paying a fee. It's like 10 cents or 15 cents a minute for driving.

00:10:41   You drive, all the details are from the smartphone app, so your credit card information for payments,

00:10:48   your personal details, so they got your first name, your last name, all your information.

00:10:53   You unlock the car with the phone, you start driving, you can go only in a certain area

00:10:59   in the map.

00:11:00   So you cannot go from Rome to Viterbo, you can say drive for, I don't know, two or three

00:11:04   blocks.

00:11:05   When you're done, you just park the car, you leave it in a good condition, you get charged

00:11:09   on your smartphone, you leave the keys inside, and the car automatically unlocks when you're

00:11:18   out of the car, you leave the car there, and it's available for someone else to use.

00:11:23   My friends told me they use this car sharing service all the time, where they need to go

00:11:28   somewhere and they don't want to use their car. They just see if an Enjoy car is available

00:11:34   from the phone. They walk to the car, they got 15 minutes. They get into the car, they unlock with

00:11:40   the phone. The car is fully furnished inside, so you get a GPS navigator, you get a USB plug if you

00:11:48   want to charge your smartphone. You cannot smoke in the car, of course, you got to leave it in a

00:11:52   a good condition. And whenever they need to go to the club or maybe go somewhere, you

00:11:57   know, in the morning, they don't want to use a scooter or maybe their own car, they just

00:12:02   use an Enjoy car and they pay like a couple of euros to go to somewhere nearby. And it's

00:12:09   super popular, they told me, and it's just like BlaBlaCar. I had no idea this existed.

00:12:16   So I went to the website, I looked it up on Wikipedia. It's a car sharing service. Apparently

00:12:20   it's available in Rome, in Milan, and in Florence, and in Turin, maybe.

00:12:24   And yeah, I witnessed the process.

00:12:28   So, we were at dinner, and when I was done, I was like, "I gotta see this."

00:12:32   You know, "I gotta talk about this on the podcast." So, I walked to the

00:12:36   car with my friend, and indeed, the car was parked

00:12:40   like in a street, it was a very quiet street, and my friend

00:12:44   went there with a smartphone from the iPhone, he

00:12:48   the car, the car was like, "boop boop," and it unlocked.

00:12:51   And it got into the car, and it was this red Fiat

00:12:55   with a bunch of Enjoy stickers, and the keys were inside.

00:12:59   It was basically super simple.

00:13:03   And this is very popular, and I had no idea.

00:13:06   And they were like, "Come on, you don't know the Enjoy cars?"

00:13:08   I was like, "No."

00:13:10   I have a car, I always use my car.

00:13:13   But it's such a great idea, such a polished implementation.

00:13:16   You know, it was flawless from the iPhone. I was super surprised.

00:13:20   So I thought that you guys and our listeners would love to hear about this.

00:13:24   It reminds me of a service called Zipcar, which is in the US and it's in the UK.

00:13:30   And it's very similar, right? You can hire a car for a certain period of time.

00:13:34   You just need to find them on the street. They have an app and the app unlocks the car.

00:13:40   It's very similar in that regard.

00:13:43   Yeah, so they went to the club, they left the car, they couldn't leave the car just in front of the club,

00:13:51   there's like a parking area. But yeah, and afterwards they just took a taxi. But yeah, it's a good service.

00:13:59   Well there we go, thank you so much for your reporting from the field on Italian car sharing services and their popularity.

00:14:06   This week's episode is brought to you by lynda.com, the online learning platform with

00:14:12   over 3000 on-demand video courses to help you strengthen your business, technology and

00:14:17   creative skills.

00:14:18   For a free 10-day trial, visit lynda.com/connected.

00:14:24   With lynda.com you can watch and learn videos created by experts who are super passionate

00:14:29   about teaching.

00:14:30   You can stream any of these thousands of video courses on-demand, you can learn at your own

00:14:34   schedule and at your own pace and all of the courses that are on lynda.com are broken down

00:14:38   into bite-sized pieces so you can watch them from start to finish or in any order you like

00:14:42   or you can just jump in and find out that one piece of information that you need.

00:14:46   And a real easy way to do that is to search the transcripts that they give of each of

00:14:50   their videos so you can very quickly jump in and just say like "oh I want to search

00:14:54   compression" when you're looking in a logic video and you can just go straight to the

00:15:00   compression section if that's what you want to learn.

00:15:02   So I mentioned Logic, that is a software program for music and all podcasts that use it.

00:15:07   You can learn how to use Logic with lynda.com, you can learn how to use Photoshop, you can

00:15:11   learn how to develop iPhone apps, you can learn Swift, you can learn iOS app development

00:15:16   essential training, you can even learn how to develop Android apps if you want.

00:15:20   They have Android Studio essential training, you have Android Wear training.

00:15:24   No matter what it is, no matter what you're looking to do, it's not just development and

00:15:27   it's not even just software programs.

00:15:29   They can teach you negotiation tactics and business skills.

00:15:32   They can teach you marketing skills.

00:15:34   Lynda.com is for people that want to solve problems, for people that are curious of people

00:15:37   who want to make things happen.

00:15:39   You can create and save playlists of all the courses that you want to watch to customise

00:15:43   your own learning path and you can share this with friends, colleagues and team members.

00:15:46   You can also watch and download courses to your Android or iOS device with the Lynda.com

00:15:51   app to learn on the go.

00:15:53   Your Lynda.com membership will give you unlimited access to training on hundreds of topics all

00:15:57   for one flat rate.

00:15:58   If you're looking to become an industry expert, you're passionate about hobby, or you're just

00:16:02   trying to learn something new, go ahead and visit lynda.com/connected to sign up for your

00:16:09   free 10 day trial.

00:16:11   Thank you so much lynda.com for their support of this show and Relay FM.

00:16:17   So Federico, how did your review go?

00:16:20   How was it received?

00:16:21   Because obviously we recorded our episode just before you put your review up, so I'm

00:16:26   interested in seeing how it went for you.

00:16:28   It went very well, well beyond my expectations. A lot of people were happy that I got a review unit.

00:16:35   And so I usually measure this kind of result with two metrics, feelings and analytics.

00:16:43   The second one, very happy with the results. It's basically like what I get typically in a couple of weeks,

00:16:53   maybe even three weeks, just in a couple of days, which was kind of crazy.

00:16:57   Of course, I ended up in a bunch of round apps for iPad Pro reviews,

00:17:02   so a lot of websites linking to my review, a lot of people on Twitter.

00:17:07   So in terms of traffic, it's a really, really good one.

00:17:10   Is it as big or bigger than some of the other things you've done,

00:17:13   like your iOS reviews and stuff like that?

00:17:15   I was bigger than the iOS 9 review.

00:17:17   Okay. Bigger than an editorial?

00:17:20   Oh yeah, of course.

00:17:21   editorial, it's such a geeky app, you cannot hope to achieve that kind of exposure with

00:17:30   the markdown text editor, Myke.

00:17:33   It was just slightly bigger than my iOS 9 review, so I was really happy there.

00:17:39   But in terms of feelings and reactions from people, it was way higher than the response

00:17:45   to my iOS 9 review, just because the sheer effect of the surprise.

00:17:51   some people were kind of expecting me to have an iPad Pro, especially

00:17:56   after we posted the selfie from London, but a lot of people were generally happy

00:18:02   that I was able to try it in advance, and especially the

00:18:06   angle that I used for my review. So instead of comparing it to a MacBook like

00:18:10   most of the other reviews did, I kind of took a very pragmatic approach, I think,

00:18:15   to just use the iPad Pro for what I usually do on the iPad R2, and because I

00:18:20   don't use a Mac, people were happy to see that I also did the same with the iPad Pro.

00:18:26   So I talked about multitasking, I talked about iOS instead of saying "Yeah, you can do this

00:18:30   on a Mac, you cannot do this on an iPad".

00:18:33   So it was maybe kind of a unique perspective, and at least that's the reaction that I saw

00:18:39   in people, and I'm happy.

00:18:41   It was definitely worth all the stress and the fatigue and the crazy amount of hours

00:18:49   spend writing and editing at night.

00:18:52   So yeah, I'm happy, Myke.

00:18:54   - Good, now both me and Steven have iPad Pros now.

00:18:58   We both went out and bought them.

00:19:00   We wanna talk about those a little bit today.

00:19:02   But I wanted to start off talking about something

00:19:06   that you wrote, Steven, a few days ago

00:19:08   on the idea of there not being a flagship iPad Pro app

00:19:12   from Apple.

00:19:13   Do you wanna just summarize your feelings on this?

00:19:16   - Yeah, I just sort of had the thought

00:19:19   that in the past, at certain times,

00:19:21   Apple has used software to sort of show off its hardware.

00:19:25   So the original iPad had iWork.

00:19:27   The next couple iPads,

00:19:29   especially when they added the run-in display,

00:19:33   got iLife apps, so iMovie and iPhoto,

00:19:36   which of course is no more, 'cause it was terrible.

00:19:38   And even going further back,

00:19:40   they've done this sort of thing, right?

00:19:45   IMAX got CD burners when iTunes could burn CDs,

00:19:48   that sort of thing.

00:19:49   And the iPad Pro, for all of its unique characteristics,

00:19:53   which I think we talked about really well last week,

00:19:56   there's not anything from Apple showing that off,

00:20:02   and they've sort of just put it out there

00:20:06   and are letting their party developers pick up that mantle.

00:20:11   And I'm not sure that's the right approach

00:20:13   for a device like this.

00:20:15   So I've heard this criticism in a few different sources and one of the main

00:20:19   things, and I think you called this one out as well, is that they should have

00:20:23   made an app to demo the pencil. Like a sketching app or an art app of some

00:20:27   description. So I've been thinking about this and I don't know if I agree

00:20:33   that Apple should be making an app for art. Like the Notes app is a demo area

00:20:40   for the pencil, right? From talking to people that have used them, Federico I'm

00:20:45   sure that you agree, out of all of the apps that have pencil capability, Notes

00:20:49   is the best, right? So the drawing area in Notes is kind of the place that you

00:20:54   would demo this stuff. And I don't really think that Apple should be focusing

00:20:59   their attention on creating any kind of art app because this isn't something

00:21:03   that they do. I don't think that they would be able to do as good a job as some

00:21:08   these other companies. So Apple gave early access to people to make stuff

00:21:12   better than they would be able to make it. Now there is some question around the

00:21:16   way that like the touch sensitivity is and the refresh rate and that sort of stuff

00:21:20   like how responsive the pencil is but I'm sure some of that could be cleaned

00:21:23   up. But I don't know if I agree that they need to make an artistic app. I do

00:21:28   believe that they should have made a pro app of some description for the iPad but

00:21:33   in a field that they already have a foothold in, so like say they brought logic or Final Cut or like

00:21:39   a version of that to the iPad, I think that would have made more sense to me. I agree that there

00:21:44   should have been something, but I don't think that an art app is the one, even though they introduced

00:21:48   the pencil. Because like artists and graphic designers, I'm sure that they want apps from

00:21:55   the companies that they know, use and trust, like Adobe, and are maybe not as interested in

00:22:00   an Apple one when they haven't really got any chops in this area?

00:22:04   Yeah, I mean, I see that. I see what you're saying. I think maybe the examples we disagree on,

00:22:13   but I think we fundamentally agree that they should have done something with it, as opposed

00:22:18   to just sort of like, "Hey, it's out there." And, you know, Apple's always really good at having

00:22:24   their parties on stage to show off what they could do, including the little guys who had the race

00:22:28   cars a couple years ago that I can't ever stop thinking about. But Myke, you and I were

00:22:36   like in the hotel room watching the keynote and WWDC were like, "What was going on?"

00:22:40   - Yeah, it was a real kind of mood killer. It was like the first thing, wasn't it?

00:22:44   - Oh yeah, I was like, "Well, I guess I'm gonna go get a sandwich because I just don't

00:22:48   care about WWDC anymore." But yeah, I mean--

00:22:51   - "Get to San Francisco for this?"

00:22:54   Yeah. That's so bad. If you're listening, we're really sorry. We're picking on your

00:22:58   company. Sort of. And they do that, right? And they give access to certain developers,

00:23:07   you know, Adobe, Microsoft, the lady who was cutting open that poor person's kneecap. There's

00:23:15   that advanced stuff, right? And they can show that off, and there's stuff on day one that

00:23:20   takes advantage of the iPad Pro's unique capabilities.

00:23:23   But I just, it feels sort of weird,

00:23:27   especially in today's environment,

00:23:28   which we're gonna get to,

00:23:30   just to put it out there without having a big,

00:23:33   like, this is what this thing can do.

00:23:35   Maybe it's, maybe it's, you know, pencil driven,

00:23:39   maybe it's not, maybe it's just like,

00:23:40   look how powerful this thing is.

00:23:42   And someone emailed me saying that iMovie was kind of that,

00:23:46   'cause iMovie got a big update,

00:23:47   and it can do like three streams of 4K video.

00:23:50   According to the notes, I don't have any interest in that,

00:23:53   so I haven't really played with it.

00:23:54   But if that's the flagship, they would push it.

00:23:59   I don't think that's what they're,

00:24:00   I think I maybe just got an update.

00:24:02   But I don't know, it's interesting.

00:24:06   It's not a mood killer, it's not going to destroy

00:24:09   the iPad Pro's sales or anything.

00:24:11   I think there's some other things that might be doing that.

00:24:13   But at the end of the day, this is not a huge deal

00:24:17   I just find it sort of curious that they didn't do something.

00:24:20   Yeah, I wonder if maybe, I totally agree with Stephen.

00:24:23   It would have been great to see Apple making their own

00:24:26   Pro app for the iPad Pro.

00:24:27   Especially, you know, kind of to set an example,

00:24:29   like they did with the original iWork for the iPad.

00:24:33   I wonder if maybe the reason is they want to wait for iOS

00:24:39   to kind of stabilize on the iPad Pro

00:24:41   to maybe ship a couple of updates

00:24:43   before doing their own Pro app.

00:24:45   And this is no excuse for not having a Pro app on the iPad Pro, but maybe I'm just trying to understand why this is the case.

00:24:54   And maybe waiting for iOS 9.2, maybe iOS 9.3, to have a bunch of additions to make the software keyboard a little better,

00:25:04   maybe improve external keyboard support, maybe even have international keyboards for, you know, the smart keyboard for more types of users,

00:25:12   before releasing a Pro app on the App Store to the general public.

00:25:16   I wonder if maybe they're just waiting for the iPad Pro ecosystem to be more international, more global, more stable.

00:25:24   I don't know. I would love to see Final Cut, Logic.

00:25:28   I don't know if Apple wants to make new types of Pro apps, like from the ground up.

00:25:34   The Pro apps that they have is Logic and Final Cut on the Mac, unless I'm missing something.

00:25:40   Maybe they should make Ayad producer, I don't know.

00:25:45   But still.

00:25:46   It's got a pro in it, you know.

00:25:48   There's no pro, so I don't know, maybe we'll have to wait for next year.

00:25:52   My fingers, as I said on my stories, my fingers are crossed for Xcode on the iPad Pro.

00:25:57   And next WWDC, it'll be fun to see what they do.

00:26:01   Because you know, WWDC is the audience for pro users, and maybe that's the perfect stage

00:26:09   to see here's what we've been doing on the iPad Pro is what we want to do for

00:26:13   Pro users on iOS. We'll see. So the other part of this conversation is whether Pro

00:26:20   apps can actually exist on iOS and if the App Store as it is currently is even

00:26:26   built to support them. So like for example the Mac App Store has logic in

00:26:32   it right and it's like what is it $250 or something like that? It's along those

00:26:38   lines. It's like 200 bucks. Yeah, so it's a high price. Now, how would

00:26:44   people react to see a $200 app on the iOS App Store? Like, does that fit? Well,

00:26:52   how would pro people react? My mom is not gonna buy Logic for the iPad,

00:26:57   but what if you're a pro and you want to use an iPad for that kind of

00:27:03   stuff on the go and maybe that's no problem for you. I think it will actually set a good

00:27:09   example for the App Store to say we have casual apps, we have free apps, we have games, we

00:27:15   have apps at $2, but it's also possible to make apps at $50, $100 maybe. And if the Omni

00:27:22   Group can do it, I don't see why Apple cannot do it, honestly.

00:27:26   Yeah, that is a really good point.

00:27:29   And I think Apple has to be the one to do it at this point. I mean, we've talked about

00:27:32   the race to the bottom a lot. And say that you're just a developer who's going to build

00:27:39   an audio editor, and there's some out there, Jason Snell used one to edit the incomparable

00:27:44   this week where you guys talked about it on upgrade. And that app is like, what, like

00:27:48   15 bucks or something? It's crazy cheap for what it is. I would imagine that developer

00:27:54   feels like they can't charge more, and that if something is really expensive, someone's

00:28:01   going to find something that is almost all the same things for less money

00:28:04   anyways. You know on the Mac we have this legacy of software being expensive and

00:28:09   software like coming before you guys were born coming in boxes you have to go

00:28:13   to the store and get it. And that legacy is still around on the Mac and you see

00:28:19   it in the Mac App Store you see it outside the Mac App Store. But iOS

00:28:23   doesn't have that and so the the norm is something something cheaper. I think the

00:28:28   only way to help correct that is for Apple to do it. I don't think third party developers

00:28:33   can go out and say, "Hey, I made an audio editor and it's going to be $100 for your

00:28:39   iPad." Even if they did, the App Store has some structural issues that can't target the

00:28:45   iPad Pro. You actually can't target hardware hardly at all when you release an app through

00:28:51   iTunes Connect. It runs on the iPad. You always see this in games, right? You go to download

00:28:57   a game and capital letters are like, "We do not support the iPad 2." It's like, well,

00:29:02   you can't really say that. What you're saying is your game doesn't work well on it and you're

00:29:05   sort of advising people not to download it if they have that device. And I think Apple's

00:29:09   got to fix that structural stuff too, or the whole conversation is sort of a moot point.

00:29:15   The idea of being able to target devices I think is one of the real key things. I know

00:29:19   people talk about upgrade pricing a lot, but I think, this is harsh, but I think people

00:29:24   need to get over that, that's never happening. It's just never gonna

00:29:27   happen. Even on an infinite timescale I would say that they're just not gonna do

00:29:32   that. But the idea of targeting devices seems like a possible thing, especially

00:29:36   if they're now starting to bring iOS devices into the fold like the iPad

00:29:42   Pro that can do things that other devices cannot do.

00:29:48   If you have an app that really needs the pencil, no

00:29:52   other iPad can even understand that it exists. And the screen size as well.

00:29:57   I really feel like the iPad Pro is the device in which developers should

00:30:03   be able to say "I am making an app for that device" but they can't do that.

00:30:09   Let me make a point here. Actually two points. The first one is I believe

00:30:15   the app store should get better at understanding system requirements

00:30:19   and it should be more like Steam or any other serious game store, where it shows you, like,

00:30:24   it's not up to the developers to, you know, fill a description page with a bunch of plain text

00:30:30   to explain the kind of hardware that you need. It's clearly shown in a text specification section

00:30:36   that tells you you need this iPad and, you know, you cannot install on this iPad, you need these

00:30:40   features, you need these accessories. That should be better. But I also want to briefly talk about

00:30:45   developers because a common mistake that some developers do is believing that

00:30:53   their apps could be sold to millions of people where instead they should accept

00:31:01   the fact and leverage the fact that they're making apps for a tiny portion

00:31:07   of iOS users. That doesn't mean it's not profitable. So let me give you an example.

00:31:11   For example, if you make a markdown app or a very specific GTD app, that kind of app

00:31:20   is targeted at a very specific audience.

00:31:24   If you price it at $2, because maybe you say if I price this app at $2, maybe I can attract

00:31:31   more customers.

00:31:33   But the people who don't need your app, who don't need a Python interpreter or a markdown

00:31:38   app or a crazy automation app. They're not going to be buying your app anyway. Even if

00:31:44   it's $1, $2, it's always going to be too expensive. And I see developers making this mistake over

00:31:51   and over. The people who need your app accept the fact that it's a tiny audience, that it's

00:31:57   not the same audience of Clash of Clans or Angry Birds or Minecraft. It's a different

00:32:02   audience. But those people are willing to give you money, and a lot of money, if they

00:32:06   really need your app. So there's this common mistake is pricing the app for

00:32:11   the idealistic market of the App Store instead of using price points and

00:32:17   making apps more expensive because the kind of audience that

00:32:21   you're after is gonna give you money anyway and it's gonna support you

00:32:24   through the years and it's gonna give you a lot of money when you compare that

00:32:28   to a free app or a free game. And when it comes to pro apps, I

00:32:34   I think the Omni group is not alone in setting a great example.

00:32:38   There's apps for lawyers, apps for doctors, apps for technicians of any kind, apps for engineers.

00:32:45   And these apps on the App Store, you can find them today.

00:32:48   I'm not dreaming about these apps. They exist.

00:32:51   And they are priced at $50, $90.

00:32:55   It's very expensive compared to free apps or $2 apps.

00:32:59   But those developers not only accept the fact that they have a different audience,

00:33:04   they also price their apps accordingly.

00:33:06   And so if you say, "I want to make this crazy Photoshop replacement for the iPad,

00:33:12   but it's not going to give me a lot of money if I sell you $2 because the App Store system is broken."

00:33:19   We could argue that Apple should provide better tools on the App Store for developers,

00:33:24   and that's a different discussion.

00:33:26   But as a developer and as a marketing person, because you also gotta be that, you gotta understand your audience

00:33:32   and you gotta understand the kind of people that I'm building apps for.

00:33:36   Are those people willing to give me this kind of money?

00:33:40   Because basically you're leaving money on the table if you try to price your crazy productivity app, your pro app,

00:33:46   your very advanced app at $2 just because all the other apps on the App Store are priced at $2.

00:33:54   I feel like Apple should do something and we could argue about that.

00:34:00   But also developers often just make apps and price them according to what the 90% of the market says,

00:34:08   instead of doing maybe a little more research and understanding maybe we should actually increase the price

00:34:14   and we should cater to this kind of audience because that wouldn't be a problem and we would actually make more money.

00:34:21   I don't disagree with that sentiment, like about knowing your customer base and kind

00:34:26   of moving on it from there.

00:34:28   But it's difficult, you know, it is an issue when you feel like the environment that you're

00:34:36   in doesn't support you, right?

00:34:38   And that the platform that you're working for doesn't care about you.

00:34:42   Like there is an element of that I think which scares away some developers from wanting to

00:34:46   go down this route.

00:34:48   Sure.

00:34:49   Because if they don't believe that the people in the store that they're going into, the market that they're going into, will care,

00:34:55   it makes the idea of building a product that is for a specific market, it makes it quite a daunting thing when you're creating something for months and months and months

00:35:06   that potentially nobody will buy because you're not confident that they're going to buy it.

00:35:10   Well, I guess the comparison here is, do you want to be the next Justin Bieber?

00:35:17   Or do you want to be the indie artist who plays at smaller venues but still makes money

00:35:21   because that kind of audience is willing to pay for you and to support you?

00:35:27   Developers of productivity apps, pro apps, need to accept the fact that those apps are

00:35:32   not going to be used by millions of people.

00:35:35   And this is even a personal struggle of mine.

00:35:39   When I write my stories, I want to have 50 million page views per month.

00:35:43   I'm not going to have those page views, because the kind of content that I write and the kind

00:35:48   of people that I attract, I'm not going to...

00:35:51   There's just so many people who are interested in the kind of opinion and maybe writing that

00:35:55   I do.

00:35:56   So in theory, I would love to have crazy page views, the same page views of The Verge or

00:36:03   whatever other big site you have in mind.

00:36:06   But I'm not going to be able to do that.

00:36:08   and that's just an utopia. It's just not going to happen because there's just so many people

00:36:14   in the world who are interested in supporting you for the kind of niche specific content

00:36:20   that you write or niche specific app that you make. So everyone loves fame and popularity

00:36:28   and millions of units of anything, whether it's millions of people, millions of fans

00:36:33   and millions of money. But it's just not gonna happen every time. Because, you know,

00:36:38   pop content is not the same as specific content, and pop apps are not the same as pro apps. And

00:36:46   sure, the environment could be a little more welcoming, and that's why I think Apple should

00:36:51   maybe do a little more. Improve analytics, improve, you know, the tools that developers

00:36:55   are given to manage reviews on the App Store. There's improved test flight, improved developer

00:37:00   tools. But also on the developer side, please, and I say this to developers every time, try

00:37:06   to understand your audience first. Don't try to say, "I made this cool text editor. Why

00:37:12   it's not becoming the next Angry Birds?" Well, there's a reason. And the reason is people

00:37:18   are just not going to use your app because there are just so many people who need that

00:37:21   kind of app.

00:37:24   If anybody understands the idea of creating niche content for smaller markets, it's us

00:37:29   as well, right? Like this is what we do every single day. We don't really target

00:37:35   the general public with our content. We make stuff that is more niche. And I

00:37:41   understand that, and it's kind of the same as you Federico, but I think that

00:37:45   podcasters and writers work in an ecosystem that supports them better than

00:37:50   maybe Apple's ecosystem supports indie developers who want to make something a

00:37:54   little bit more niche. Let's say for example with podcasts there are a bunch

00:37:58   of apps which have huge audiences that promote what we do. I mean even Apple

00:38:03   does a really good job of promoting our stuff, right, which is really niche stuff.

00:38:08   And it's the same for like for writers. There are a bit like the bigger sites

00:38:13   like The Verge for example, there is a potential that they would link to

00:38:17   you. That is not out of the question. And also you know there are RSS apps and

00:38:22   stuff like that which are built to kind of make getting your content really easy

00:38:25   because the ecosystems that we're both in maybe support independence on a more

00:38:30   level playing field in some instances. And of course there is some, you know,

00:38:36   there are changing biases like iTunes these days really does promote the NPR

00:38:40   and the story driven podcasts more than the stuff that we do, but we do still get

00:38:46   level footing in some instances for some of the people. Like there is more of a

00:38:49   support there. So I think that I agree with you on the sentiment of, you know,

00:38:54   making niche stuff but I think that maybe our views are a little bit tainted by the

00:38:58   fact that the audience's new ecosystems are maybe a bit larger for us than they are for

00:39:04   people that are trying to build these applications.

00:39:07   True, and I totally believe Apple should do a little more, maybe evangelism or maybe even

00:39:12   marketing, like why is there no App Store apps Twitter account? Like there's one for

00:39:18   App Store games and there's a general App Store one that tweets about the front page

00:39:23   stuff basically. But there should be a Twitter account for people who work on iOS and people

00:39:28   who buy productivity and utilities on the app store. And Apple should totally do a little

00:39:33   more and maybe even curate a little better and maybe put the spotlight on developers

00:39:39   who make these kind of tools. Maybe reach out, we don't know if this happened, but maybe

00:39:43   reach out to developers like the Sketch guys. They don't want to make an iPad version. Why

00:39:48   Why is there no iPad version?

00:39:51   Apple, whatever is in their power, they should try to do developer evangelism and to reach

00:39:58   out and to provide tools to make it better for developers.

00:40:01   But I honestly believe that at least 50% of the problem is on the developer's shoulder.

00:40:10   You gotta understand your audience.

00:40:11   the other side Apple should do better, should provide more tools and maybe more

00:40:19   publicity for these kind of apps. But also I don't believe the system is

00:40:26   inherently broken. That's my, at least what I feel.

00:40:30   Before we move on from this, if this type of discussion and content interests you

00:40:35   you should listen to the Release Notes podcast because this is what they talk

00:40:38   about every week so I'll put a link to those guys in the show notes as well. We

00:40:43   still have a bunch of other things that we want to talk about in regards to the

00:40:45   iPad Pro. Currently me and Steven have not even given our thoughts on the

00:40:48   device. So but before we do that let me take a second break this week to thank

00:40:52   TextExpander from Smile for sponsoring this week's episode. This is you know

00:40:57   we're talking about like Pro apps and niche markets that are awesome. This is one

00:41:00   of them right? TextExpander is one of these types of apps that exists and it

00:41:06   is awesome and people love it and it's built like a real kind of following

00:41:10   around it and it's an example of the type of app that can work and succeed

00:41:14   right because people love it so much that they talk about it. So like they

00:41:18   live in a world where maybe it's more difficult right for them to get

00:41:23   traction because what they do is quite a nerdy thing but the people that have it

00:41:26   love it so much that they want to talk about it all the time. So let me explain

00:41:29   to you what TextExpander is if you don't know. It is an app, it is a little app

00:41:34   that's on your Mac and iOS as well. If you ever type the same sentences, phrases or even

00:41:38   words on a regular basis, then TextExpander is something you need and it's definitely

00:41:42   going to help you out. It will save you time and effort by expanding short abbreviations

00:41:46   into frequently used text and even pictures. TextExpander will help you improve your communication

00:41:52   on a daily basis. For example, say you send out a bunch of emails all the time that tend

00:41:57   to be quite similar in nature. You can increase the consistency of your email responses by

00:42:01   by creating form messages and snippets for common stuff.

00:42:05   So you have the ability to customize stock replies.

00:42:07   You can create a stock reply,

00:42:09   but you can also add in kind of drop down

00:42:11   and fill in fields so you can put in people's names,

00:42:13   you can select from different options.

00:42:15   So it makes it really simple and really fast

00:42:17   to send out standardized emails,

00:42:19   but also providing a human touch

00:42:20   with these fill in sections as well.

00:42:22   You could maybe create a snippet

00:42:23   for the meeting notes template that you have, right?

00:42:25   So you go into a meeting and you set up a template

00:42:27   in a Word document or something like that, or a text file.

00:42:31   You can do this so nothing gets left out. You can set up a snippet for these notes so that you always

00:42:35   make sure that you're following the same format. Or you could even use a snippet when requesting

00:42:39   a reference from someone if you hire people for your job. So you can just make it super easy

00:42:44   to get stuff that might take a little while to write out if you were just typing them

00:42:48   without TextExpander. And with a new look and feel TextExpander 5 is here to help you type even

00:42:52   faster than ever before by making suggestions of frequently typed phrases to abbreviate and save

00:42:58   TextExpander can remind you of missed opportunities to use your abbreviations whilst you're typing.

00:43:03   You can also sync your snippets amongst multiple devices by storing them on iCloud Drive or

00:43:08   Dropbox.

00:43:09   This means you can access them wherever you want, even on TextExpander's iOS app.

00:43:14   Smile have made a great iOS app for TextExpander.

00:43:16   You can use your snippets in a bunch of other apps that have integrated them, or you can

00:43:20   use their iOS custom keyboard that comes with TextExpander for iOS, allowing you to use

00:43:26   your snippets in absolutely any app. Texas Band of 5 for the Mac costs $44.95 US. Upgrades

00:43:32   are available for $19.95 for existing users and it's free to those who purchased on or

00:43:38   after January 1st 2015. You can find out more about Texas Band of 5 by visiting Smilesoftware.com/connected.

00:43:46   Please note that Texas Band of 5 requires Yosemite and is ready for El Capitan and Texas

00:43:50   Band of iOS is available in the App Store for iPhone and iPad.

00:43:55   So there's this Tim Cook unleashed Europe thing going on right now?

00:43:59   Yeah, he's taking a real tour right now of everywhere, just talking smack in every different

00:44:03   country in Europe.

00:44:05   Basically.

00:44:06   So there's an article over on TechCrunch that I'm going to link to where he talks about

00:44:13   the Mac and iPad.

00:44:14   And of course, it's an interesting time for two-in-one devices.

00:44:19   Surface Pro 4 is out, the Surface Book, also for Microsoft is out, where it's a

00:44:24   laptop and then you do some magic and it's a tablet. And of course Microsoft

00:44:28   with Windows is more or less one OS everywhere, where on the Mac you of course

00:44:35   have OS X and iOS being sort of separate things. And the iPad Pro begins to merge

00:44:40   those things a little bit, that it comes with the keyboard and it comes with some

00:44:45   multitasking, not true windowing, but the ability to do more than one thing at

00:44:49   once which has defined iOS for a long time. And so there's a course

00:44:53   hand-wringing for people saying is Apple going to merge the MacBook and the iPad.

00:44:59   And Tim Cook says no. He says that they want to make the best tablet and the

00:45:05   best notebook in the world and that they can't do that in the same device which

00:45:09   which I agree with I think the Surface Book and the Surface Pro 4 and all these

00:45:13   other things as beautiful as they may be have compromises. But there is this stress right

00:45:20   now from my people of the Mac that the iPad is coming in and the iPad is going to come

00:45:30   take our MacBooks away. And Cook is saying that that's not the vision they have. But

00:45:38   I think two things are important to think about in that conversation, then we can move

00:45:42   on. The first one is that Apple is not afraid of cannibalizing their own products. They

00:45:48   have said that repeatedly. I think a very famous example was the iPhone, where all of

00:45:54   a sudden, the iPod, which was even more than the Mac, a huge drive for Apple's resurgence

00:46:01   in the 2000s. The iPhone comes out, and then the iPod sales just dry up, right? People

00:46:10   we're asking about that and Apple's response is,

00:46:12   well look, people are buying iPhones

00:46:14   and the iPhone is the best iPod ever,

00:46:17   so we're fine with that.

00:46:18   We're fine with cannibalizing our own sales.

00:46:20   And I think in these conversations,

00:46:23   the sentence always is,

00:46:25   can the iPad Pro replace my MacBook?

00:46:27   And if it does, then Apple's fine with that

00:46:31   because they're still selling you an Apple product.

00:46:33   And if your iPad replaces your Lenovo,

00:46:36   then that's even better

00:46:37   because you weren't an Apple customer and now you are.

00:46:39   And so from Apple's perspective,

00:46:41   I think it makes sense to keep them separate.

00:46:43   And I think that the stress between the Mac and the iPad,

00:46:48   that's not as big of a deal to Apple's sales

00:46:51   as it may seem to some of us who feel

00:46:54   a little more emotionally involved about it.

00:46:56   But there is that tension, right?

00:47:00   There's people like Federico who already,

00:47:02   you already do your work on an iPad, which is awesome.

00:47:05   And then there's people like me who,

00:47:07   I could do a lot of work on my iPad,

00:47:09   but there's still some stuff that I have to do on my Mac.

00:47:11   And I wrote a little bit about that the other day

00:47:13   in a post on 512.

00:47:15   And then there's people behind us who are younger,

00:47:18   people like, you know, even as young as my kids

00:47:20   who really only ever use an iPad,

00:47:23   and that's just gonna be what they grew up on.

00:47:26   And there will still be Macs around,

00:47:28   but the landscape may be different.

00:47:31   And so I feel like why all this is in the news

00:47:34   and why so many people are just setting themselves

00:47:36   on fire over it is that there's this stress, right?

00:47:38   there's a stress, there's this tipping point of like,

00:47:40   what does the iPad Pro mean for the Mac?

00:47:43   And I think that the simple answer is we don't know yet.

00:47:45   And yes, there are gonna be more people

00:47:48   who can use an iPad than ever for their jobs,

00:47:50   but mostly because of the software stuff

00:47:53   and stuff we've been talking about,

00:47:54   the iPad can't do what I need it to do for my job.

00:47:57   So for me, the iPad Pro is a really interesting device

00:47:59   and I have many thoughts about it,

00:48:01   but it doesn't really change the equation yet.

00:48:04   And I think that's gonna be a shift over time,

00:48:07   I think the iPad Pro is sort of like one more step in that direction of, hey, if you want

00:48:12   to do your job on a tablet, that's great, you can do it, here's a really good one to

00:48:16   do it on, but that doesn't mean that the Mac is going away or going to die or anything

00:48:19   like that.

00:48:21   So you're not saying that we should build a wall around the iPad, otherwise it's going

00:48:26   to take our MacBooks away.

00:48:27   Wow, I'm just going to let that comment just go right by.

00:48:32   - No, I don't because,

00:48:33   Myke is just dying.

00:48:38   Because the reality is that people will always need

00:48:43   different types of tools to get their job done, right?

00:48:46   Like people like us who make things for a living

00:48:48   and Federico, you and I especially as people

00:48:51   who do a lot of writing, it's a very different skill set

00:48:55   than someone who is doing like computational analysis

00:48:58   on the human genome.

00:49:00   Like those people are always gonna need computers, right?

00:49:02   Like they're gonna need super computers,

00:49:03   they're going to need as much hardware as they can buy.

00:49:06   And it's just a gradient of what people need.

00:49:09   And so what if the gradient changes a little bit over time?

00:49:13   I think it should, you know.

00:49:14   If you looked at Federico Secchi, for example,

00:49:17   as someone who is a writer and an editor for a living,

00:49:20   30 years ago, you would've been doing all of that

00:49:23   on a typewriter or some very basic word processor.

00:49:26   And the idea that you're gonna do all of your work

00:49:30   on a computer one day probably seemed crazy.

00:49:32   And now it has sped all the way through

00:49:36   the personal computer revolution,

00:49:37   through everyone has a PC to now you're doing it on tablet,

00:49:40   which is even more futuristic

00:49:43   than a computer was 30 years ago.

00:49:45   I think all that is is a shift.

00:49:47   I think everybody can still buy the machine

00:49:50   they wanna buy in 10 years.

00:49:51   If I still wanna use a Mac or still have to use a Mac,

00:49:53   I'm gonna be able to do that.

00:49:55   And I don't think it's worth going crazy over,

00:49:59   because the iPod Pro doesn't really solve

00:50:00   a lot of those problems yet.

00:50:01   And even if it does, like who cares?

00:50:03   They're still gonna sell Macs.

00:50:04   They're not, this idea that the MacBook

00:50:08   is going to go away in three years,

00:50:10   or five years, is just really crazy to me.

00:50:13   - And I guess there's, you could say,

00:50:16   a lot of people are kind of afraid that the Mac

00:50:19   is gonna end up like the iPod Classic.

00:50:22   that it did a very...

00:50:23   it solved a very specific job and now that's done by the iPhone

00:50:28   and you could argue that

00:50:29   you know most people are fine with music on the iPhone but there's people like

00:50:32   Steven who need an iPod Classic because they like the old school way

00:50:37   of listening to music

00:50:38   and...

00:50:39   To be fair they did stop selling that.

00:50:41   Yes, but I believe there's a fundamental difference in that

00:50:45   Apple gives more importance to the Mac ecosystem than to the iPod Classic and

00:50:50   that you cannot compare a music player to a whole desktop operating system.

00:50:56   And what's crazy to me, I agree with you, Steven, what I believe is we'll be fine.

00:51:03   And what's crazy to me is that I see people saying that the iPad is only good for writing

00:51:11   reviews of the iPad.

00:51:12   And that's crazy because you just need to look around you and you see doctors using

00:51:17   iPads.

00:51:18   I once talked to a person who managed a vineyard, so they make wine and they only use iPads on the field,

00:51:29   they use iPads for the accounting system. Just look around you, you can see people using iPads as computers,

00:51:36   just like you can see people using Macs as computers. They are both computers.

00:51:41   At least some of us are so stuck on the vocabulary notion of what a computer is that we're missing

00:51:51   the practical implementation of the computer, which is a tool that lets us do work, that

00:51:58   lets us play, and that lets us be entertained and stay in touch with others.

00:52:02   So it's not as much as what the computer is, it's what the computer does.

00:52:07   And so if for you, Steven, the computer is, you know, the Mac at your desk with the keyboard

00:52:12   and with a bunch of hard drives and with the relatives in the attic, you know, the old

00:52:17   computers, that's fine. Maybe the computer for me is the iPad and maybe for some kid

00:52:22   in China, the computer they use is the iPhone because they only, you know, they use line

00:52:27   and they do all their shopping and entertainment online. And you know what? We're fine. And

00:52:32   And everyone's fine. And I don't believe... We could argue about the design of the software

00:52:38   and the APIs and all the technical differences between them. But arguing what a computer

00:52:46   is today, it's just crazy. It's just... What if I go to somebody and say, "You're driving

00:52:54   a car, but your car is not really a car. The only car is the original Ford from 100 years

00:53:00   go. It's not about the definition of a computer, it's about the utility of the computer. And

00:53:06   computer is everything. It's a smartphone, it's an iPad, it's a Mac. And I honestly don't

00:53:12   understand the fixation with defining what people should do and how they should do it.

00:53:17   Right. And I want to come back in an episode and talk more about the idea of one OS versus

00:53:24   multiple OS's. You know there's, even in the chatroom right now, the idea that, you know,

00:53:31   if Microsoft is successful with the...

00:53:35   Windows 10?

00:53:36   Yeah, yeah, all in one OS, Windows 10 type thing, like does that put pressure on Apple

00:53:41   to do that? And then there's even talk on the Apple side of like, well maybe the iPad

00:53:45   should have its own variant of iOS, which is also crazy. I think that's not a big deal

00:53:52   because people who buy these products,

00:53:54   like the consumers who are gonna buy an iPad

00:53:57   or buy a MacBook and do their job on it,

00:53:59   then they don't care.

00:54:02   Like as long as they can do their work

00:54:04   and it's fast and it's easy and it's secure

00:54:07   and it's affordable,

00:54:09   like consumers don't care about

00:54:12   what stack your software's built on.

00:54:14   They just don't.

00:54:15   And yes, it may make developers' lives harder or easier,

00:54:19   but if the history of the App Store has taught us anything,

00:54:23   it's that developers will, they'll adapt.

00:54:27   And there's maybe software that we're not getting now

00:54:31   because the App Store is what it is,

00:54:33   but there's still really good software being made

00:54:35   for the iPad and for the iPhone and for the Mac.

00:54:38   And so, I don't know, I agree with you Federico.

00:54:40   Like it's all sort of like,

00:54:42   it's interesting to talk about intellectually,

00:54:45   and even as someone who is, you and I aren't,

00:54:48   if this were like a battlefield, which it is not.

00:54:51   Like you and I sort of have different stances on this

00:54:54   because of the way that we work.

00:54:55   But the reality is, like you said,

00:54:57   it doesn't really matter

00:54:58   because these products aren't going away.

00:55:02   And as long as you get your job done

00:55:04   and you can meet those requirements I just laid out,

00:55:06   then like, what does it really matter?

00:55:08   - And you know what I learned this week is

00:55:11   because I got some, you know,

00:55:15   I wouldn't say criticism or negative comments, just very strong, diverging opinions.

00:55:22   But what I learned is a person's simplicity is someone else's masochism.

00:55:29   And for me, the iPad is the essence of getting work done in a simple way.

00:55:36   And to someone else, that may appear as this guy is going through all these problems and

00:55:42   apps and workflows, this guy's crazy, he's a masochist. But it only depends on your perspective

00:55:49   and for me I could say, you know, masochism pays the rent. And, you know, again, we're just fine,

00:55:58   everyone does work in their own way. What we need to discuss is, I feel like, what we can do to

00:56:08   empower more people? How can we change the iOS APIs to create new kinds of apps?

00:56:14   Those are the problems. Let's not argue about what I do or what Steven does or

00:56:19   Myke does. That's not the matter. The matter is looking ahead, you know, ten

00:56:24   years from now, what kind of mobile software, what kind of desktop software

00:56:28   do we want to make? And let's make that happen, you know? That's what I continue

00:56:32   to think about every day. And that's, for me, the core of the story here.

00:56:38   What can we do to do better? Not who's right and who's wrong right now.

00:56:44   Let's talk about this thing. So I want to talk about one thing with the

00:56:52   hardware that's been rattling around in my brain. I watched a video when the

00:56:56   Surface came out. Satya Nadella was talking to Neil I Patel and they were in

00:57:01   a store and they were talking about the Surface Book and they were talking about

00:57:04   the Surface Pro 4 and when they were talking about the Surface Pro 4, Satya

00:57:10   kept referring to it as a digital clipboard. He kept saying digital

00:57:15   clipboard, digital clipboard and I thought that's such a weird thing why you

00:57:19   keep saying that? Like that sounds so strange but that's how the iPad Pro

00:57:25   feels to me because it is this weirdly massive thing which I can't explain it

00:57:32   but feels way bigger in portrait like so like you know if you think that it's

00:57:37   just scaled up right which is effectively what it done and taken the

00:57:40   ten inch and just like dragged it like diagonally right stretched it out the

00:57:44   difference for the portrait for me feels way bigger than the difference in

00:57:48   landscape do either of you feel that way like I hold it in portrait and I'm like

00:57:52   oh my god this thing is massive and hold it in landscape and don't feel that way

00:57:55   I have that exact thought especially looking at apps that are content heavy

00:57:59   You know, it's I mean the home screen looks silly either way, but if you open like slack or

00:58:05   Safari as in portrait is just like holy cow this thing. I'm like holding a billboard. Yeah

00:58:12   It's very peculiar. I mean, I want to just say for out up top that I love it so much. Oh

00:58:18   Yeah. Yeah. I love I love this iPad. I love it dearly

00:58:22   Because it is the best it is also the best iPad for content consumption

00:58:29   consumption.

00:58:30   Oh yes, there we go.

00:58:33   It is both the iPad Pro and the iPad Con.

00:58:36   I like that joke very much.

00:58:38   I don't think anybody else does but I think it's very clever.

00:58:42   It really is though because they built that.

00:58:44   They put incredible speakers in it.

00:58:47   My MacBook Pro is just sitting there now closed.

00:58:51   We watch all of our videos and stuff on this thing now because also it takes up less space

00:58:57   to watch the videos.

00:58:58   Yeah, the koala is gonna be upset.

00:59:01   Well, the koala can go hard up a tree.

00:59:05   So for example, sometimes we eat dinner downstairs on the coffee table, and if we have a meal

00:59:11   which requires multiple plates, let's say we've made a Mexican dish or something, the

00:59:17   table is mainly covered in bowls and plates.

00:59:20   So when we do that, I have to find a HDMI cable, grab my laptop, plug my HDMI cable

00:59:25   into the TV and watch it on the TV.

00:59:27   This is crazy right? I know this is gonna kill people that we sit in a room with a TV

00:59:31   right in front of us but still watch stuff on the MacBook or the iPad in front of the

00:59:35   TV. But it's just how we are. Everyone needs to just get over it. But now the iPad takes

00:59:41   up less space to put down. I got a smart cover for it because it's the only accessory in

00:59:46   this country and it takes up way less space on the desk because they haven't got the keyboard

00:59:52   in the way. So it's great for that stuff. I love multitasking, right? All the space

00:59:59   for all the apps. And I just love that this thing is so large and I'm able to

01:00:05   just see all my stuff there. And it feels like a kind of futuristic two-handed

01:00:12   desk of some description. It's like the original Surface, right? I really, really

01:00:18   do love this I love this so much that I've started to put stickers on it yes

01:00:22   there are stickers on the back I'm currently in that awkward phase where

01:00:26   like there aren't enough right so like currently it's it's maybe like a third

01:00:30   covered in like specific areas it's like when you're starting to get a beard yes

01:00:35   exactly it's patchy right now it's going for a change right but he'll be okay on

01:00:40   the other side so but I'm messing that I have a Vittici seal of quality on there

01:00:45   figured it was the right sticker for this thing. So I'm starting to just put it on there.

01:00:50   Do you know why I'm doing this? Because I love this thing. This really is the device for me,

01:00:57   for so many different things. And I'm so excited for when I can finally get a keyboard for this,

01:01:02   and when I can get a pencil for this. We'll talk about that in a minute, because I think it will

01:01:06   bring it even further along in that route. But it just remains frustrating for me. And I was

01:01:12   was talking about this on upgrade we spoke about it in details you should go

01:01:14   listen to that episode about the fact that you know I can't edit podcasts

01:01:19   safely on this there are apps and we spoke about it earlier that can maybe do

01:01:23   it but I as of yet don't trust them but I feel like over time that's going to

01:01:27   change and what it's seeming like right now is my MacBook Pro will pretty much

01:01:32   only ever leave this house if I'm getting on an airplane other than that

01:01:35   I'll be taking the iPad I'm all-in on this guys I really really am I I adore

01:01:41   it I really do. That's high praise from you Myke. It's grabbed me man it really really has

01:01:47   for everything like for reading Twitter, for watching movies, for responding to emails like

01:01:53   I'm still in the same issues where a bunch of apps that I use aren't updated and you notice it way

01:01:58   more because they look ridiculous they just look ridiculous but I'm confident that the majority of

01:02:05   of those apps will receive those updates but it's just you know I feel like it's

01:02:11   a matter of time and that app Ferrite, the podcast editing app, I am

01:02:16   gonna take a look at it and I will maybe try editing something on it at

01:02:20   some point in the future just to see what it's like but yeah I am I'm all in

01:02:25   guys I really am and it seems like a bright future for this thing.

01:02:28   I'm very happy to hear that Myke. I got a technical question so please don't be upset.

01:02:33   I'm not gonna be upset.

01:02:34   Okay, promise.

01:02:36   Okay.

01:02:37   Promise.

01:02:38   So, hypothetically, let's say that I manage to power the USB interface that I use with

01:02:46   my microphone and to have the power in the USB interface and have data going into the

01:02:53   iPad.

01:02:55   Can I run Skype and Ferrite in split view and talk to you guys and record my local audio?

01:03:03   On the other... No? Why not?

01:03:05   It isn't possible to have the audio pass through and record in another application.

01:03:10   They are like completely separate from each other.

01:03:12   No, that's a bummer.

01:03:14   And that is because...

01:03:16   Well, it's possible to do if both of those apps integrate that audio bus thing.

01:03:21   Yeah, yeah.

01:03:22   But currently it's not possible.

01:03:24   What I thought you were going to ask me is how I would feel if you wanted to do that, right?

01:03:29   And my feeling on this...

01:03:30   Oh, what were past feelings in your mic?

01:03:32   Well, my feeling about all of this, and it's the same with editing a show on a device like this, is

01:03:39   I am... my thing is all about trust of the device, and as of yet, like, I don't trust the iPad to do

01:03:48   this because I've not done it for a specific period of time, or... and also it's maybe new in

01:03:54   being able to be capable even to do tasks like this. I genuinely believe that in the future I

01:04:00   I will feel comfortable about it, I'll be happy about it.

01:04:03   But right now I just struggle to trust these devices

01:04:07   to be able to do this, that specific type of work.

01:04:10   I trust it more than enough to do many, many other things.

01:04:14   But the thing that is like intrinsically important

01:04:16   to my business and is the way that I make money

01:04:20   and is complicated.

01:04:22   And if like, for example, I start something

01:04:24   and then lose it means time and money lost.

01:04:28   That is why I'm just a little bit hesitant

01:04:30   of being able to go down this road yet.

01:04:33   - Fair enough, thank you.

01:04:34   - Steven, how do you feel about the iPad Pro?

01:04:39   - I feel conflicted deeply.

01:04:42   I've gone from swings of this is insane,

01:04:46   I'm going to return it to this is an insane device

01:04:50   and I love it.

01:04:51   It's like we spoke about before.

01:04:54   I mean, my Air 2 is not really a work computer.

01:04:57   as sort of a consumption device, reading, Netflix, research if I'm writing history stuff

01:05:04   like YouTube and notes kind of the same time. That sort of thing. Not doing spreadsheets,

01:05:09   not doing editing or a lot of writing on it. But the interesting thing to me with the Pro

01:05:18   is not necessarily the power of it, although that is nice. It actually is just the simple

01:05:22   thing of the screen size that split view and slide over and everything are just

01:05:27   much nicer on this bigger display and and the biggest thing that I like is the

01:05:33   software keyboard is finally a software keyboard and iPad that I can use really

01:05:38   comfortably. You're American. Such an American. Wow. Because it's terrible for everybody else.

01:05:43   It's just wrong. What I'm saying has nothing to do with the layout. It really

01:05:48   is the size of the keys that it is much more comfortable than even the Air 2 keyboard for

01:05:54   me just to type directly on the glass. Yeah but my problem is some of the keys are the

01:05:58   wrong size. I know what you mean, I know what you mean. Pair it with a magic keyboard you'll

01:06:07   be set. And so I've been using it a lot and I've been using it for more work stuff than

01:06:12   I have ever used the Air 2 but then I go to use it in that sort of consumption role and

01:06:17   it's kind of silly and if even a little troublesome to use it if you're you know

01:06:24   watching something in bed or that sort of thing so so I don't know I will say

01:06:28   and I share this thought with you guys earlier that I picked in my air 2 and it

01:06:33   felt really tiny which is worrisome so I don't know if I'm gonna keep it or not

01:06:40   if I do decide to keep it I will get the bigger one I just bought the 32 gig just

01:06:45   to try it and take advantage of Apple's return policy.

01:06:49   So I don't know, I need some more time with it.

01:06:53   At this point I'm leaning towards keeping it,

01:06:55   but I don't know.

01:06:57   - You might still be in the honeymoon period.

01:07:00   - Right, exactly.

01:07:01   So I'm gonna run out the clock on this return thing

01:07:03   and see, I've got a week from today,

01:07:06   or a week from tomorrow.

01:07:07   And part of my decision is tied up,

01:07:11   and we can just move on into this,

01:07:13   is that I can't find a pencil for the life of me.

01:07:18   And I even have the business team hook up at the Apple store

01:07:20   and they're supposed to call me when they get one in

01:07:22   and they're gonna hold it for me.

01:07:24   But they're just not, just can't be found.

01:07:27   And I don't necessarily want it from like,

01:07:29   I'm not an artist, I'm not really a sketcher,

01:07:32   someone who doodles or draws a lot.

01:07:34   But for me, it will help me understand the device better.

01:07:37   And I'm not interested in the smart keyboard.

01:07:40   Like I used it, I used both in the store

01:07:41   the smart keyboard is dumpster fire at least the way that i want a keyboard to be but um

01:07:48   i would like to like fully experience it with the pencil and i can't yet which is frustrating

01:07:53   they screwed up so bad yeah i don't know what they've done but they screwed up so badly like

01:07:59   there's no way around this like and they've screwed up about it in every possible way right

01:08:04   one the device is out and this isn't out two they are advertising this like the tv ads have the

01:08:11   the pencil in them.

01:08:12   So much so that when I mentioned,

01:08:14   like I was talking to my mom about,

01:08:16   she was like, "What are you doing today?"

01:08:17   I said, "I'm going to the Apple Store."

01:08:18   She's like, "Again, what are you going

01:08:19   "to the Apple Store for?"

01:08:21   So I told her about the pencil.

01:08:22   She's like, "Oh, is that the one on the TV?"

01:08:24   Right, so the TV ads, right, are there.

01:08:27   They have them in the stores so you can try them out,

01:08:30   but you can't buy them anywhere.

01:08:32   And the other part of it is, they're not talking about it.

01:08:35   There's nothing from Apple about what is going on here.

01:08:39   They are over, you have to wait over a month

01:08:41   if you order it online.

01:08:43   And I have tried in all of London.

01:08:45   There is not, as of yesterday, from a call that I made

01:08:48   to the Apple online team, they were checking stock for me

01:08:52   and there was not one pencil in all of London

01:08:53   at 10 a.m. in the morning when the stores opened.

01:08:56   - That's crazy.

01:08:57   - Like I don't know what they're doing.

01:08:59   I mean, I understand Black Friday, that kind of thing.

01:09:03   I could get all of that, but my feeling is

01:09:07   they should have just waited.

01:09:09   - Yeah, and they've waited before.

01:09:10   The iPad Mini came out basically the week of Black Friday.

01:09:14   And it was very constrained even then.

01:09:18   They really slipped into almost Christmas

01:09:20   'til the iPad Mini really kind of reached

01:09:22   acceptable stock levels.

01:09:23   But I guess that's the trade-off, right?

01:09:26   That you have to decide, do you want the iPad out early

01:09:29   and then the pencils and everything be ready?

01:09:32   I finally just ordered one online

01:09:33   and it's almost Christmas before it's gonna get here.

01:09:35   It's like five weeks.

01:09:36   And the, either way, I was just surprised that Apple

01:09:40   didn't really say anything about it.

01:09:47   That it was just like, oh, you go to order it.

01:09:49   And I just had assumed that all this stuff

01:09:51   would be available at the same time, like a normal person.

01:09:55   And it's not, and I really think it's frustrating.

01:09:57   And talking to the, talking to people

01:10:01   at the Apple store here, it really seems like

01:10:04   people are frustrated by that, and they're getting

01:10:06   a lot of questions and I think there are a lot of people who are just going to hold off

01:10:10   in their purchase until they can have both because for a lot of people that's a big draw.

01:10:16   And it's sloppy. The Apple Watch release was sloppy where you could order them and then

01:10:22   if you wanted a Black Link when you were waiting like two years, I mean it really was out of

01:10:26   control. And they get it right with the iPhone but like every other product, the Mac Pro,

01:10:33   shipping months and months and months after you ordered it.

01:10:37   It's just, they have this problem and maybe it's that

01:10:41   there was some technical issue, maybe it's that, you know,

01:10:45   they had a supplier problem and who knows, right?

01:10:49   I don't envy the problem of making things at scale,

01:10:51   at Apple scale, because it seems incredibly difficult

01:10:54   and I'm not smart enough to do it.

01:10:56   But you gotta communicate, you gotta set the expectations

01:10:58   and they just did it and so you have a bunch of people

01:11:00   like running around in circles trying to find this thing and being frustrated

01:11:04   they can't they can't purchase it. It annoys me when Apple allow memes to be

01:11:10   created about themselves right so like this is becoming a meme now that like a

01:11:16   product comes out and you can't buy it right because you know we just mentioned

01:11:20   the Apple watch right it was it was the same the Apple watch it's the same here

01:11:23   I was like, "You don't have to let this happen."

01:11:29   It's not like the iPad Pro is a baby and it's coming when it's coming.

01:11:35   You choose the day that it was released.

01:11:38   You can choose that if you want to.

01:11:40   So it tells me they made the choice to be like, "No, we'll just do this because of X

01:11:44   and we'll go for it."

01:11:46   And I know that there are business businesses that need to make money, but a business like

01:11:49   Apple's, considering the way that they talk about things, also really care about customer

01:11:53   satisfaction and you've got a lot of unsatisfied customers right now because

01:11:56   people want to buy your product but cannot buy it and I think that it is

01:12:01   very very peculiar and I know that like for some people who are very quick and

01:12:06   ordered immediately like it seems that some people are getting theirs like

01:12:11   they're getting them like on the way and there are some in some stores but I

01:12:16   it greatly concerns me that there aren't any in London,

01:12:20   like at all.

01:12:22   And for as much as I know, there haven't been either.

01:12:26   Like I know some people that have been checking as I have,

01:12:29   I know some people that have been checking

01:12:30   the two flagship stores,

01:12:31   and it feels like there just haven't been any.

01:12:34   And that is really, really weird.

01:12:37   - Yeah.

01:12:38   - Yeah, and it's again, it's that like frustration

01:12:40   that people are excited about this,

01:12:43   and you're sort of damaging that excitement.

01:12:45   And that's not what you want for what you are, as a company, are really behind saying

01:12:50   this is the future of computing for some people, for a lot of people.

01:12:56   And hampering that just seems really counterintuitive to what they're trying to do.

01:13:02   But the good thing for us is we get more content out of it, because if I would have got a pencil

01:13:06   this week, then I would have just told you what I think about the pencil.

01:13:09   But instead I got to complain about it, and then in a couple of weeks' time I can tell

01:13:11   you what I think about pencil.

01:13:12   Yeah.

01:13:13   Well, Tim is really concerned about our show notes.

01:13:14   Yes, many emails he sends us and this week he's gonna get what he wants.

01:13:20   This week's episode is also brought to you by Igloo, the internet you'll actually like.

01:13:24   With Igloo, you don't have to be stuck at your desk to get your work done.

01:13:27   You can manage your task list from your beautiful new iPad Pro while you're sitting in the garden.

01:13:32   You can share status updates with your team on your iPhone as you're leaving a client's

01:13:35   site, and you can access the latest version of a file from home on your Retina iMac.

01:13:40   You can do this in your pajamas as well and nobody will ever know.

01:13:42   These days everything is mobile, your work should be too.

01:13:45   You no longer have to be tied to a specific device or specific operating system or a specific

01:13:50   network to get on your internet.

01:13:51   With igloo you can manage everything from any device that has a web browser, it's going

01:13:56   to work because they care about modern web standards and they build their platform to

01:14:00   work perfectly within that.

01:14:01   They have responsive design built right in and they allow you to customise your igloo

01:14:05   and configure it to look and feel exactly how you want.

01:14:08   You can give it the branding that you need and you can also customise different areas,

01:14:12   group spaces so different areas of your teams can log in to their own group

01:14:17   spaces and they'll get all of the functionality and all of the tools that

01:14:20   they need to get their work done. If they don't need the status update thing, a

01:14:23   certain team, maybe the accounting team or maybe the marketing team don't need

01:14:27   status updates, you can just remove it. It's very very easily. People these days

01:14:31   as well, they love to have their documents with them wherever they are,

01:14:35   right? It's part of the mobile working that people have these days. And so

01:14:38   services like Box and Google Drive and Dropbox is stuff that people use because

01:14:42   it gives them the ability to access their files immediately wherever they are.

01:14:45   The problem with things like this is if you work in a big company and people are

01:14:48   taking those documents and putting them onto their own personal accounts in

01:14:51   those platforms that can be a security risk. So igloo have integrated all of

01:14:55   these services into their easy to secure platform so you're able to keep your

01:14:59   customers and your employees safe and secure and all the documents and stuff

01:15:02   within it. They have 256-bit encryption for igloo, single sign-on and active

01:15:06   directory integrations. All of this stuff I'm sure is like very exciting for

01:15:10   people that really care about those things. I know what single sign-on means

01:15:13   and that's very good and 256-bit encryption sounds like lots of

01:15:16   encryption so that sounds pretty good too. It's time to break away from the

01:15:19   internet you hate. Go and sign up for igloo right now and you can try it out

01:15:22   for free for any team of up to 10 people for as long as you want. Sign up right

01:15:27   now igloosoftware.com/connected. Thank you so much to igloo for their

01:15:31   support of this show and the lovely relay FM. So we asked the listeners, the

01:15:38   people in the world for some questions for us about the iPad. You can always

01:15:43   send in your questions by the way, you can send them to our Twitter account

01:15:46   @weare_connectedfm. And so the first one comes from Jan or Jan, I'm gonna go

01:15:52   with Jan. Jan wants to know which keyboard do you prefer, I'll throw this to you

01:15:56   Federico first as you've had the most time, Apple or Logitech? I know last week

01:16:00   you were saying that the... is it smart keyboard? Magic keyboard? I can never

01:16:04   smart keyboard.

01:16:05   Okay, the smart keyboard is the one that you were sticking with.

01:16:08   Has that remained?

01:16:09   So if we're only talking about the keyboard, I would say I prefer the Logitech keyboard.

01:16:16   I prefer because it's backlit, because the keys feel better to me.

01:16:20   But the accessory that I would carry around with me every day,

01:16:26   I would just say the smart keyboard.

01:16:29   because the Logitech case is just bulky and it's difficult to get the iPad Pro into the case and not of the case.

01:16:39   I don't like the plastic enclosure at all and if you were to ask me what kind of accessory should I buy because I want to take it out with my iPad and just put it in my backpack and travel, I would say the Smart Keyboard.

01:16:56   If I were to buy one myself today, I'd buy the smart keyboard.

01:17:04   And so Steven, you said you didn't like the smart keyboard.

01:17:07   Have you had any time with the Logitech Create?

01:17:11   I have not.

01:17:12   I know they've had them in and out of stock at my store, but I have not played with it.

01:17:17   I think what I will probably end up doing if I keep this thing, or even if I go back

01:17:22   to the Air 2 is do what I have normally done and pair it with a Apple Bluetooth keyboard.

01:17:28   I really like the Magic keyboard. The names are so confusing. The new one, the new slimline

01:17:36   one. So I think if I will end up just kind of going that route again, that doesn't make

01:17:41   it extremely portable, but I work at home and that's not a huge worry of mine right

01:17:49   now. So I've had very little time with the smart keyboard every time and it

01:17:58   seems fine. I'm gonna get one of those at some point in maybe 2020 when they're

01:18:05   available in stores because I want to try that out. I want

01:18:09   to have a self-contained unit like a laptop. I know, I understand.

01:18:15   Like a laptop so it's always there and I can just grab it and

01:18:19   it's part of it and it's the stand and the keyboard. I really am interested in

01:18:23   trying that so that's something that I will be giving a go when I can get my

01:18:29   hands on one. Rob would like to know does the pencil work in apps only if they've

01:18:35   been optimized for it and does it work differently in different apps Federico?

01:18:39   Well developers need to optimize for the predictive touch and coalesce touch

01:18:47   APIs if they want to take advantage of them. And there's also other APIs for the Pencil.

01:18:54   So developers have to optimize and to use these new APIs to support the Pencil, the

01:19:00   pressure stuff, the angle that you want to use your Pencil. Those are new APIs. They

01:19:05   require an update from developers. You can still use the Pencil on the iPad Pro, in other

01:19:12   apps, it's just gonna be like a finger. So you control the iOS interface and you

01:19:17   can draw just like you could draw with your finger. It's just not gonna be

01:19:21   updated for the other features of the pencil, which is higher

01:19:26   scan rate and the pressure sensitivity, the tilt. Those features

01:19:31   require an update from the developers. If the developers don't update

01:19:35   their apps, you can use a pencil on the screen. It's just gonna be a replica of

01:19:39   your finger. So the apps that have integrated properly like paper and stuff

01:19:47   like that, I'm seeing many people say that it's not as good as the Notes app.

01:19:51   Does Apple have some secret sauce or is it just that these developers

01:19:55   maybe need more time to tweak? Developers need more time to tweak and

01:20:00   basically Apple just gives you the API's and a way to access the data that comes

01:20:05   from the pencil. There's data that comes in from the pressure sensitivity, there's another

01:20:10   API that's called the Azimuth, which gives you, my understanding is the orientation vertically

01:20:15   of the pencil on the screen. Developers have this data, they just need to build their engines

01:20:19   for it. So the Apple engine in the Notes app is better, I think, than other apps. Procreate

01:20:26   comes close, I would say. Basically Apple gives you a way to read the data that comes

01:20:32   from the Pencil, but the display does the rest, but the developers have to build their

01:20:36   own drawing and sketching engines in their own apps.

01:20:39   Alright, so it's a case of refinement over time to get everyone to the point where it

01:20:45   can be like the Notes app if they want it.

01:20:46   Yeah.

01:20:47   Okay, well that's fine then, because I'd heard that it's better and worse in some apps, and

01:20:51   I guess that completely explains why.

01:20:55   So next question comes from Marina.

01:20:57   In split screen, is there a keyboard shortcut to switch between the two open apps without

01:21:01   touching the screen?

01:21:02   No.

01:21:03   Well, you could kind of do it, I guess, if you activate the Command-Tab Switcher.

01:21:11   And if you put the focus in another app, that should become the active one.

01:21:16   I haven't tried that, but I'm pretty sure that it does work like this.

01:21:19   So this is not an official shortcut, it's more like a workaround.

01:21:24   Because it's maybe a dumb decision of iOS 9 not to have keyboard shortcuts to interact

01:21:30   with Split View and slide over, you need to touch the screen to tell iOS, "Yes, this is

01:21:34   the active app that I'm currently using, it's the last touched one, and that's the one receiving

01:21:40   keyboard input right now."

01:21:43   I think you should be able to select the active app with Command-Tab, but I'm not completely

01:21:48   sure.

01:21:49   So Marina, you should try that.

01:21:53   Brian would like to know, "Can you truly take notes with the Pencil using the Pencil, like

01:21:58   in a real note-taking mode?"

01:22:00   all that Brian's interested in. So I spent just a couple of minutes of a

01:22:05   pencil because I was gonna run to another store to see if I could get one.

01:22:08   And my experience with it is it's the closest to note-taking that I have

01:22:17   ever seen. So if you imagine a piece of paper as large as the iPad and you take

01:22:22   a pencil and you put the pencil on the paper the line is the same size that I

01:22:26   would expect it to be. Which is not the way it's ever been with any other of

01:22:30   of these types of things you have to zoom in right to get it to be small I

01:22:33   was able to write very small and it looked like my handwriting on a piece of

01:22:36   paper so if people are I mean I know that I am the pen guy right and I will

01:22:41   have a more kind of I'm gonna I want to spend some more time of it and do a more

01:22:45   thorough kind of thinking and a review for the pencil because I feel like I may

01:22:50   be a person in the place that can talk about it right because I care about this

01:22:54   stuff but I would say thumbs up on that at least that it looks like my hand

01:23:00   writing on a piece of paper which is unlike anything else I've seen from this

01:23:04   type of stuff before from a stylist on an iPad.

01:23:07   Yeah my only experience with handwriting was that image that I sent you

01:23:12   and CGP Grey and that I also used on the Mac stories review. I do not hand write

01:23:17   like never at all. So you know that's all I have to say. It feels pretty

01:23:25   good but I don't even remember what a pen and paper feels like so you know

01:23:31   Munish would like to know do you find the screen to take more smudges than

01:23:35   previous models or is it just me oh my god yes what is wrong with this thing

01:23:43   what is going on here they've changed something they must have changed

01:23:47   something yeah I would say for the pencil maybe there's some you know maybe

01:23:51   the coding is different on screen I don't know. Apple didn't tell me it's got

01:23:55   they just said it's got the same what is the term oleophobic coding of the previous

01:24:02   iPads so there you go. If they have they've done something different to it

01:24:06   because it's not the same. Yeah. Like it is very different I look at it sometimes

01:24:10   and I'm like what happened to you? How did you get this way? What have you gone

01:24:17   through. What troubles have you seen? I've seen hands and fingers all over me.

01:24:24   Like was I eating chicken wings and then using this? What's going on here? It's crazy. It seems to

01:24:30   retain a lot of that lovely finger oil. Chris would like to know how far can you

01:24:35   push iPad Pro memory? Like how many apps or browser tabs does it take before a

01:24:40   reload or refresh? I feel like Federico, if you are the person that would know

01:24:44   this if it's possible to know this? So I only got two anecdotes maybe. One is

01:24:52   the workflow extension that I use to combine images and maybe access

01:25:00   files that are not like just a few kilobytes, actually a few megabytes per

01:25:06   file. The workflow extension seems faster and like it takes fewer seconds to

01:25:13   execute and to finish them on the iPad R2. But last night I was playing around with JavaScript actions in one writer, which is this text editor for the iPad.

01:25:26   And I was looking up, because I don't know JavaScript, I was looking up StackOverflow, Google search all over the place. I got like 30 tabs open.

01:25:34   And in one particular example, I had opened a web app to debug a JavaScript regular expression

01:25:43   like 30, 40 minutes before.

01:25:46   Then I went on with...

01:25:47   You really are very special.

01:25:50   Then I went on with my research and I opened like maybe a couple of dozen tabs after that.

01:25:57   When I went back to the web app, I lost the regex that I was trying, but I went back to

01:26:04   the web app, so maybe like 15 tabs before, and it was still open and stored in memory,

01:26:11   and I could copy the expression, and I didn't lose any of my progress there.

01:26:16   So in Safari, it was running fullscreen, so it wasn't in SplitView, but in Safari, it

01:26:21   much much better than the iPad R2. So I would say it retains upstate a lot more than the iPad R2.

01:26:31   It's not just speed, it's also how long can you keep something open without having to reload it from a cold start.

01:26:39   So yeah, there is progress there.

01:26:41   Marina would like to know, I get that the Pencil doesn't pair when you plug into a non-iPad Pro iOS device, but does it charge?

01:26:50   Another funny detail here. I tested this. I didn't write it in my review because I didn't know what to make of it.

01:26:58   So you plug it into the iPad Pro, it charges. I plugged it into the iPad R2, it charges.

01:27:05   I plugged it into the iPhone and I saw the pencil battery going down.

01:27:11   [Laughter]

01:27:14   I saw it in the widget.

01:27:16   So was the pencil charging the iPhone? What was it doing?

01:27:20   I have no idea. I would say it was some kind of bug. And that was before I put the iOS

01:27:27   9.2 beta on my phone. So it might as well have been a bug of iOS 9.1, or maybe it's

01:27:34   just not meant to be plugged into an iPhone. In theory this shouldn't happen, because you

01:27:39   should be able to plug it into any sort of lightning-capable accessory or charger and

01:27:44   and it should charge. But I saw with my eyes the widget and the battery going down for

01:27:50   a couple of units in the percentage status of the battery. So, no idea what that happened.

01:27:57   I would suggest plug the pencil into the iPad Pro or into a lightning cable. Don't plug

01:28:05   it into an iPhone. Because just try to do what Apple says, not what it's in theory possible

01:28:11   to do. Again, maybe it was a bug just one time, but I did see it with my eyes so unless

01:28:18   I was drunk, which I wasn't because it was the middle of the afternoon, plus I don't

01:28:21   drink a lot, I did see the widget going down on the iPhone. No idea why.

01:28:28   And finally, Ling would like to know, is it possible to use the iPad Pro in bed? If so,

01:28:33   has it hit Federico's face at some point? So I would like to ask the second question,

01:28:38   has the iPad Pro hit you in the face yet?

01:28:40   No. It hasn't. It is possible to use it in bed, there's a disclaimer here.

01:28:46   You have to turn the brightness all the way down. That's the one thing you need to do.

01:28:50   I always do. I always do. Always less than 50% for me. All the time. Never full brightness on my iPad.

01:28:57   No, never full brightness, but I have personally found that the only way to stop my girlfriend

01:29:02   from being upset that I use the iPad Pro when she's trying to sleep is that the brightness

01:29:07   has to be all the way down. Oh no, no, that would be crazy.

01:29:10   That's what I thought, but it's fine when the lights are off, you know

01:29:13   Yeah, I mean my girlfriend isn't particularly upset about brightness

01:29:18   What I wanted to say is I see some people saying that it's a it's an uncomfortable device even with two hands

01:29:27   It's uncomfortable in portrait

01:29:30   You that's why I in the review

01:29:33   I said you should really go to an Apple store and try an iPad Pro in your hands on your own because I

01:29:39   I don't know Myke, did you look at my hands when we met?

01:29:43   Do you think I have big hands?

01:29:46   You do have big hands.

01:29:48   I have big hands too, like this is the thing that we have.

01:29:50   I don't know if it's the size of your hands is the thing that helps in this.

01:29:55   You just need to accept that it's heavy and if you want to use it comfortably, you're

01:30:00   just going to have to change some of the ways that you've used iPads.

01:30:03   It's not the same, you can't hold it in the same ways, you can't support it in the same

01:30:07   But you just need to adapt to it, which I have.

01:30:10   And people say, "Oh, why are you adapting for the device?"

01:30:13   Because I love the device, and I use it in bed every evening.

01:30:16   I use it in bed in the mornings too.

01:30:18   And I just have to hold it differently.

01:30:20   Maybe sometimes I sit differently, so I prop it up on my knees.

01:30:22   Yeah, exactly.

01:30:23   It's just what you do, right?

01:30:24   And you just change the way that you interact with the device.

01:30:27   It's the same as when I went from an iPhone 5 to an iPhone 6 Plus.

01:30:32   You just adapt to the device if it's something that you really want, and then you just go

01:30:36   for it.

01:30:37   work of it and that's just how you live.

01:30:40   Yeah because the benefits of the overall experience kind of outweigh the

01:30:46   adaptation of ergonomics. So I do what Myke does, I prop it up on my knees or

01:30:52   maybe rest my elbows on my lap. You know, some minor adjustments, no big deal.

01:30:57   I want to use this device so some smaller changes are necessary.

01:31:02   That's what I would say.

01:31:04   - Steven, I'm assuming that you haven't really

01:31:07   used the embed so much?

01:31:11   - Well, Steven already has an Apple II embed,

01:31:13   so doesn't use the iPad.

01:31:15   - That's right, yeah, it's just on a little cart.

01:31:17   I mean, you guys are right, it is big

01:31:19   and you do have to think about what that means

01:31:23   in all your various use cases.

01:31:25   So, you know, it's something that it's really hard

01:31:27   to talk about because in some ways it's so much bigger

01:31:31   than I expected but um yeah it just it takes some adjustments at least for me

01:31:38   so I have not it has not fallen on my face my all my my bones in my face are

01:31:43   still intact there we go you can expect a bunch more of this type of stuff as we

01:31:49   get the accessories in and as we start a little bit of devices I'm interested to

01:31:52   see if Stevens gonna stick with his so you want to keep tuning in to connected

01:31:55   if you want to hear more about the iPad Pro as I'm sure and hope that many of

01:31:59   If you want to catch our show notes for this week head on over to relay.fm/connected/66.

01:32:05   Thanks again to our sponsors Igloo, Smile with TechExpander5 and lynda.com.

01:32:11   If you want to find Federico's work online head on over to maxstories.net and he is also

01:32:15   @Vittici V I T I C C I on Twitter.

01:32:18   You can find Steven's work over at 512pixels.net and he is @ismh on Twitter and I am @imike.

01:32:26   Thank you so much for listening, we'll be back next time.

01:32:28   Until then, say goodbye guys.

01:32:30   Au revoir.

01:32:31   Au revoir.