65: The iPad Pro Review


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:06   From Relay FM, this is Connected, and this is episode number 65. Today's show

00:00:11   is kindly brought to you by Braintree, Casper and Igloo. My name is Myke Hurley

00:00:16   and I'm joined by Mr Stephen Hackett. Hello Mr Hackett.

00:00:19   Hello Myke, how are you? I am very well, very well indeed. We have a special

00:00:22   episode today as I mentioned and we have the man of the hour here,

00:00:25   Mr Federico Vittucci. Hello guys. How are you doing Federico?

00:00:29   You sound very professional.

00:00:31   - I do, I'm glad I got fancy new equipment.

00:00:35   I'm almost a professional podcasters.

00:00:37   - Well, you know, you're professional in all manners.

00:00:39   Your iPad has been upgraded to professional,

00:00:41   your microphone's been upgraded to professional,

00:00:43   we're ready to go.

00:00:44   - It's the pro week.

00:00:46   - It is indeed.

00:00:47   So we're assuring our usual format today

00:00:49   because today's episode is all about the iPad Pro,

00:00:53   which Federico has had for about a week now

00:00:55   and he's probably loving it.

00:00:57   (Federico laughs)

00:00:58   That's a joke, right? Yeah, eight days. That's how long I've been playing with this device.

00:01:04   Yeah.

00:01:05   So did you steal this? Like, how did this come into your possession?

00:01:08   Well, basically you just need to break into the Apple Europe offices and know where to look,

00:01:14   and you just go home and you get an iPad Pro. No, that's not really the story.

00:01:19   So remember last week we met in London, Myke?

00:01:24   Mm-hmm.

00:01:24   the reason why I was in London is that I was picking up an iPad Pro. Really? Yeah, I was in London last week and I flew back home on the same day.

00:01:40   In fact Myke, you took me to the airport. We were on a train, it was a really

00:01:46   professional train. I was actually surprised by the cleanliness of the

00:01:50   train in London. We don't get those kinds of trainings in Rome. I imagine now that I

00:01:54   I was kind of like your bodyguard, right?

00:01:56   Protecting the iPad.

00:01:57   - Exactly.

00:01:58   You were protecting me from possible London thieves.

00:02:02   - Yep.

00:02:04   - Basically, you know, they were trying to get my iPad.

00:02:07   I flew back on the same night.

00:02:10   I couldn't use the iPad Pro on the plane,

00:02:14   but as soon as I got home,

00:02:15   my girlfriend and I prepared a nice dinner,

00:02:19   and then I started playing with the iPad,

00:02:21   and I started to set up all my apps, all my accounts.

00:02:25   It was a clean installation of iOS 9.1.

00:02:29   So it comes with iOS 9.1.

00:02:31   It's a special build for the iPad Pro.

00:02:33   And I basically spent the first night

00:02:36   just trying to set up all my apps

00:02:38   and logging into web services,

00:02:41   installing Dropbox and 1Password,

00:02:44   because that's what you do as soon as you set up

00:02:45   a new iOS device.

00:02:47   And I think I basically took it away until 5 or 6 a.m.

00:02:57   Because I was really excited to kind of play around,

00:03:01   trying to get some work done.

00:03:02   Because one of my initial concerns was,

00:03:08   if I want to write about this, I should be able to use it first.

00:03:12   It's not like I'm just reviewing this device as it is.

00:03:16   if this needs to be my main computer, I need to spend the first couple of days,

00:03:21   maybe more, and like the entire week trying to work on it. So it was like

00:03:26   a dual process of trying to write the review and trying to use the device as

00:03:30   my main and only computer, just like I used to do on the iPad R2.

00:03:35   So initially I struggled, and I think I told you guys this, I struggled to

00:03:40   balance, you know, I need to review this, but I also need to use this as I would

00:03:44   normally do. But eventually it was all okay and the review was done in time and we got

00:03:50   here to this point today where all the reviews are coming out. So it's a nice day, Myke.

00:03:57   It is indeed. So you've been using it solely as your device for the last eight days?

00:04:01   Yes, exclusively as my... Just like the iPad R2, I removed the SIM card from my iPad R2,

00:04:09   I got a 128 gig model of the iPad Pro, Wi-Fi installer, so I put in my SIM card, and as

00:04:15   soon as my SIM card moves from one device to the other, the other device becomes my

00:04:19   primary one. That's the sign that recognizes. That's the mark. It's my main device, the

00:04:27   one with the SIM card.

00:04:28   Yeah, it's always interesting when you review something of that line of, "I need to review

00:04:35   this thing and like get my workflow set up but I also need to keep working and

00:04:39   do my job. Right? So if you're reviewing something really different than what you

00:04:42   normally do that can be that can be challenging. So I commend your your

00:04:48   approach to this and I think that it's a good one as someone who you get your job

00:04:53   done on an iPad you run a successful website you do all these things from

00:04:58   your tablet the only way you could review something and and really

00:05:02   understand it is to do your business on it to fully dive in so I like the way

00:05:08   that you went about testing this and I think that it shows in the review that

00:05:12   you know you're not on your iPad air to doing Mac stories and the iPad Pro every

00:05:17   couple hours to like check something you know but yeah you do have all the way in

00:05:21   and I think that you know that's that's something why you have one why you're

00:05:25   able to do this review that you have that perspective that a lot of people

00:05:28   don't have because it is your primary computer which of course we're going to

00:05:32   get get into but um yeah I like the way you went about this. Thank you and I mean

00:05:38   you can get even more Inception style I mean the review itself needed to be done

00:05:44   on an iPad Pro because the review was also working for me you know it's that's

00:05:48   work so I needed to do my regular tasks on the iPad Pro I also needed to write

00:05:54   the review but the review itself needed to be done on an iPad Pro so it was all

00:05:58   you know, it was all a cycle. In a weird way, like the most perfect task for this

00:06:03   device is its own review. It's a review in itself. How interesting is that?

00:06:10   Yes exactly. Alright let's start talking about the hardware itself. So we're gonna

00:06:15   break this down into a few different topics. So like hardware, software and

00:06:20   accessories, which is kind of like the way that you broke down your reviews as

00:06:24   as well. So let's talk about the weight of the device. Now my memory tells me

00:06:30   that the iPad Pro is the same weight as the original iPad and it's funny because

00:06:37   you know you think about the original iPad that was perfectly fine weight wise

00:06:40   but as they've gotten lighter and lighter over the years the thought of

00:06:43   going back to a previous model was like death so when I heard about this my

00:06:47   imagination was well it's gonna be too heavy so tell me what you think about

00:06:51   at Federica? So it's heavier than the iPad R2 but the big difference is it's

00:06:57   also much bigger. You got 6.5 centimeters from one side in terms of

00:07:04   gain and you got five centimeters on the other side so it's much bigger and the

00:07:10   difference when you when you put the two of them side by side or maybe on

00:07:15   top of the other as I have in one of my pictures you really can see the

00:07:19   difference. It's a much bigger screen. So my first reaction when I first saw an iPad Pro on a table was that it looked like a MacBook display without the body, just the screen.

00:07:32   And when I picked it up, so in my mind for some reason my muscle memory kind of adjusted to believing that as soon as I was gonna pick it up, it would be as heavy as a MacBook Air.

00:07:46   So when you pick one up, it's strange because it is heavier of course, but it's also much lighter than you would expect from a device that size.

00:07:58   And the thing that gets me every time is that it's really well balanced.

00:08:04   So there's no way to tell the top from the bottom in terms of weight.

00:08:11   just it's this huge screen and it's very well balanced.

00:08:15   It's got the same unibody construction of the iPad R2 so it's really

00:08:20   the finish and the weight, it really feels good in the hand

00:08:25   and there's no particular moment when I was like

00:08:31   this is too heavy for what it does and

00:08:34   the weight distribution I think, they've done a really good job there.

00:08:38   So of course it's strange because when you remember the first iPad and it was thick and it was a 10 inch device

00:08:45   and in your mind you go "I don't want to go back to a device that's so heavy".

00:08:51   But you also gotta remember that it's basically a 13 inch device, the iPad Pro.

00:08:57   And it's just slightly thicker than the iPad R2 and I couldn't tell the difference really in daily usage

00:09:04   in terms of the thickness increase. So it's heavier and when you pick up an iPad Pro and an iPad R2,

00:09:11   you know, one hand with the Pro, the other hand with the Air 2, you can tell the difference.

00:09:18   But it's also not too heavy for the kind of screen that it has. And I got a big disclaimer about this

00:09:25   in my review. This really comes down to the size of your hands, how comfortable you are with holding

00:09:32   a 12.9 inch device, what exactly you aim to do with the iPad. Are you okay with holding

00:09:39   your iPad with two hands for just a couple of minutes? Or do you want to run a marathon

00:09:43   holding your iPad? I don't know why you would want to do that. But it really depends on

00:09:48   your kind of physical usage, like your physical interaction between your hands and the iPad.

00:09:53   Because this thing is heavier. But for me, it's not too heavy.

00:09:59   Did you feel fatigued after holding it for a while?

00:10:02   So you're reading in bed.

00:10:04   Did you feel the weight of it then?

00:10:06   Because the funny thing about it, whilst it's not too heavy, it's bigger in every way, right?

00:10:11   So it is kind of, I would assume, maybe more cumbersome to deal with.

00:10:17   It's not as portable as an iPad R2 or an iPad Mini in the sense that my hand can go all

00:10:25   the way from one side of the screen to the other.

00:10:28   So I can pick up an iPad mini just with a single hand with my thumb and another finger

00:10:34   on the other side.

00:10:35   I cannot do that on the iPad Pro.

00:10:37   So it's not as easy to maneuver basically, like you can't just like very quickly pick

00:10:41   it up from the table?

00:10:42   No, you can do that.

00:10:45   Depending on if you pick it up from a corner, you can do that.

00:10:48   I do that all the time.

00:10:49   So when I'm in the kitchen and I leave the iPad Pro on the kitchen table, I just grab

00:10:53   it if I want to check something.

00:10:54   So that's totally doable.

00:10:56   What's different is if you were to compare holding the iPad Pro and the iPad Air 2 just

00:11:05   on your wrists for, I don't know, 10 minutes, maybe by the end you would feel more fatigue

00:11:13   on the iPad Pro because it's heavier.

00:11:17   What I think I've done is I have naturally adjusted to kind of either using my lap or

00:11:23   or using my elbows as a kind of resting area for when I'm holding the iPad Pro.

00:11:30   But when I'm walking around the house, I need to walk often and I need to stretch.

00:11:35   And I do these five minute walks. I go on the balcony, I just keep walking just to stretch myself for a little while.

00:11:43   And when I'm walking with the iPad Pro in both hands, I don't feel any fatigue.

00:11:49   So maybe for really prolonged periods of time, like for 10 minutes, 20 minutes, just holding

00:11:56   the iPad Pro with two hands, of course you would feel fatigue, you know, because it's

00:12:00   heavier than the iPad Air 2.

00:12:03   But for just a couple of minutes, you know, when you're just picking up an iPad, just

00:12:07   checking something, Twitter, I don't know, I think you'll be fine.

00:12:10   Or you're cooking in the kitchen and you need to look up a recipe, I think you'll be fine

00:12:14   there.

00:12:15   that I think is important to consider with the weight,

00:12:18   you know, comparing it to the original iPad,

00:12:20   which you guys will remember,

00:12:21   I bought one during our iPad special.

00:12:24   - Yes.

00:12:25   - Or for our iPad special.

00:12:26   And I actually got it off the shelf this weekend

00:12:30   to just kind of get reacquainted with the weight.

00:12:33   And that original iPad had a curved back, you know,

00:12:36   where it, if you sat it on a table, it would rock.

00:12:38   The edges were thinner than the back,

00:12:41   kind of like the iPhone 3G and 3GS had a similar effect.

00:12:44   think that's important too that the this iPad like all of Apple's modern tablets

00:12:49   is completely flat on the back so you sit it down it doesn't wobble it doesn't

00:12:54   move and I think that helps too with that model of how thick does it feel and

00:12:58   how heavy does it feel where you know the 3G and 3GS if you pick one up it

00:13:02   feels heavier and thicker than it actually is because you have that curve

00:13:06   there. I think that I would imagine works in favor for the iPad Pro that because

00:13:13   is the same thickness throughout, your fingers and your mind don't get tricked to thinking

00:13:18   that it's thicker or heavier than it actually is.

00:13:20   In my mind, at least I remembered the iPad 3 actually of being heavier for some reason.

00:13:28   And I know that maybe we rewrite our own memories when it comes to what an old device feels

00:13:34   like but I really didn't have much of a problem with the iPad Pro.

00:13:40   And it could be that I'm just so used to taking these short breaks that holding the device

00:13:47   for...

00:13:49   I'm not holding the iPad Pro, or even the iPad Air 2 for that matter, for an hour.

00:13:56   Just walking around for an hour.

00:13:58   And in that case, of course I would feel fatigue on my wrists.

00:14:02   Because for several minutes at a time it can become a problem.

00:14:07   But on the other hand, if you need to walk for an hour and while doing so you want to

00:14:13   check a screen, maybe the iPhone is the best device for the job there.

00:14:17   So in my routine, in my daily habits, this has not been a problem.

00:14:23   And which I was really happy to see because it was one of my biggest concerns moving from

00:14:30   the iPad or to the iPad Pro.

00:14:32   So yeah, I'm happy here.

00:14:35   I think one of the important things to remember, I know we're really kind of belaboring the

00:14:38   point about the wait, but I think it is kind of important when you look at the overall

00:14:42   hardware of this thing.

00:14:44   But I guess one of the interesting things to remember is that this is the furthest away

00:14:49   from a consumption device that the iPad has ever been, and I know we're going to talk

00:14:54   about that a little bit later on.

00:14:56   But a lot of the things that we're talking about, like, you know, how does it feel when

00:14:58   you do this for a certain period of time, it's like consumption stuff like reading and

00:15:01   things like that. Where maybe this iPad was built more to be put on the desk

00:15:05   than any other iPad before it. So maybe like the idea of holding it for long

00:15:09   periods of time in your hands is maybe not so much of a problem.

00:15:13   Exactly. And even when you see the kind of accessories that Apple has made,

00:15:17   there's a keyboard, there's a pencil. So it's meant to be used

00:15:23   primarily at a desk. That doesn't mean that you cannot hold the device and walk

00:15:28   around or take the device out of the smart keyboard and sit on the couch and get work done,

00:15:34   because I totally do that. But for a lot of people this is gonna be the device they're gonna use at

00:15:41   their desks, either drawing, sketching, typing, reading email. But again, it's not a mutually

00:15:49   exclusive type of thing here. You can use it there, you can pick it up, you can walk around with it

00:15:55   for a few minutes, you can put it in a bag and go out and get work done at a park because

00:16:01   it's got a SIM card. So it's more skewed towards desk usage, but that doesn't mean it's impossible

00:16:08   to use it as a portable iPad because I've done that. I've taken it with me at the mall.

00:16:16   Don't worry, Apple, no one saw the iPad. I got to make sure that I say this. I've taken

00:16:23   with me in the car while I was waiting for my girlfriend. I worked from my car, I took

00:16:29   it to my therapist who also didn't see the iPad Pro. So yeah, it makes more sense than

00:16:37   the iPad R2 and the iPad Mini of course at a desk, but it's also still an iPad in terms

00:16:42   of portability. That's my takeaway.

00:16:45   All right, there's still tons of stuff that we need to talk about in regards to the hardware,

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00:18:27   of this show and Relay FM.

00:18:30   So one of the most interesting parts here,

00:18:33   which is really weird.

00:18:34   So like, you know, when I think about this device,

00:18:37   Federico, and after reading the review that you've written,

00:18:40   there is this real kind of struggle and battle

00:18:43   between the consumption part

00:18:45   and the professional working part of this device.

00:18:47   And one of the consumption areas where the iPad Pro

00:18:50   is better than any iPad before it is the speaker system.

00:18:53   Can you explain a little bit about what's going on here?

00:18:56   - Okay, so it's got four speakers,

00:18:58   two at the top, two at the bottom.

00:19:01   And what the iPad does, it can automatically detect

00:19:06   whether you're using the device in landscape mode

00:19:08   or important mode, of course.

00:19:10   And all speakers can produce the same frequencies.

00:19:15   But depending on the orientation, only the bottom ones produce bass frequencies, and the topmost ones handle the mids and highs.

00:19:25   So the result is a very well balanced sound, it's much warmer and richer than the R2.

00:19:34   The best part is when you rotate your iPad, it detects rotation, so it switches to what

00:19:41   the speakers do according to your physical orientation of the device.

00:19:45   So no matter landscape or portrait mode, sound kind of always follows you around and adjusts

00:19:54   automatically depending on the device.

00:19:56   And they're really loud, and not in a bad way.

00:20:01   It sounds great, it's a very warm sound and it's much richer than the iPEDR 2.

00:20:09   It has all these layers of sound that you normally don't hear on the mini or on the

00:20:16   iPEDR or on the iPhone for that matter.

00:20:20   I really like how it sounds and I've been listening to Apple Music, to podcasts, in

00:20:27   Orcast.

00:20:30   It maybe doesn't get quite as loud as some external speakers, of course.

00:20:35   It's still a tablet.

00:20:37   But it's much louder than the Air 2.

00:20:40   And I've been using it to listen to music at the highest volume.

00:20:45   And you can hear songs just fine from another room.

00:20:50   And in fact, my girlfriend, she was impressed because when I was listening to music in the

00:20:55   kitchen she could hear songs just fine in the bathroom which is you know like

00:21:00   four to five meters away there's a there's a hall and then there's another

00:21:04   room. It also makes for nice background music when there's like a family dinner

00:21:10   or you got some friends over. It's a really good companion there to make sure

00:21:16   that you got some tunes in the background you know. So I'm really really

00:21:20   happier. Again, didn't expect this. I was so used to the speakers of the Epidder 2.

00:21:26   I wasn't expecting it to sound this good. In fact, it sounds even better than the speakers

00:21:30   on my MacBook Air, which I realized, of course it does, because my MacBook Air is a four-year-old

00:21:36   device, so I guess speaker technology got better in the meantime. They sound great.

00:21:42   So believe me, you gotta go... I don't know if you could get a demo of this at an Apple

00:21:48   store if it's a crowded place but they really sound great.

00:21:53   So one of the interesting things about the 6 Plus when it was released was that even

00:21:57   though the screen was bigger because the physical body of the phone was bigger Apple were able

00:22:02   to shove more battery inside the case. Is this the same for the iPad Pro? Do we have

00:22:08   a larger battery here or is it just powering the Retina display which is looking pretty

00:22:13   incredible?

00:22:15   Of course it's got a power display and there's a more powerful CPU, GPU and 4GB of RAM.

00:22:22   So you gotta provide more energy there.

00:22:25   But Apple says that you get 10 hours of battery life in average usage.

00:22:31   So you can surf the web, watch a couple of videos, play games, read books.

00:22:36   In my practical tests, and here I gotta have another disclaimer, I like to turn off auto

00:22:43   brightness on my devices and I keep it just about 50%. So I could very easily get over

00:22:55   11 hours of battery life and the device would turn off just when it was approaching 12 hours

00:23:04   of usage. So 11 and a half hours. I might have taken a few breaks here and there when

00:23:10   the iPad was not working so it was locked and the screen was off. So I can

00:23:15   say that I comfortably got to 11 hours of usage. You know, because I spent

00:23:21   days, basically I didn't get any food to eat, I was just at my desk

00:23:26   working. My girlfriend was very understanding over the past week. It was

00:23:30   a very nice surprise and it's not the first time that Apple does this,

00:23:34   that they promise 10 hours and you get 11. I remember this has been the case for

00:23:39   previous iPads before. So 10 hours is a good metric to give you an average of

00:23:44   usage, which is impressive when you consider the new display, more RAM,

00:23:49   more power, new speakers. But they like to do this. There's this 10 hour threshold

00:23:56   that's been holding true for the past five years. I wonder if eventually we'll

00:24:00   get more, but today we still get those 10 hours and maybe a little more, even

00:24:05   Apple doesn't like to say so. It's interesting to hear and I think the 6+

00:24:10   is a good parallel when you put these bigger displays into devices there is a

00:24:16   bigger power drop the battery you power drop the GPU that has to drive this

00:24:20   thing comes with the A9X processor which just seems like a like a beast but you

00:24:24   know I think the screen and the way they got to 12.9 inches is really interesting

00:24:29   so if you if you go back and watch the introduction they they have an iPad Air

00:24:34   and basically the height of the air is the width of the the iPad Pro and then

00:24:39   they basically came to 12 point inches to make it 4 by 3. It's still 264 pixels

00:24:46   per inch according to Apple's website which is the same as the Air 2 and then

00:24:50   of course both of those are less than many because the mini is higher because

00:24:54   using the same resolution as the Air 2 but in a smaller package. How is that

00:25:01   screen in real life. Does it, compared to an Air 2, does it look a little less sharp?

00:25:05   Because on paper it may, but it shouldn't buy much. I mean, how is it, how does it

00:25:10   look, how the colors, does it seem like an improvement over the Air 2 or is it

00:25:14   kind of the same thing but bigger? So I asked about this. It's got the same color

00:25:19   reproduction of the Air 2 and the Mini 4 and to me it looks exactly the same in

00:25:25   in terms of sharpness, color, brightness of the display.

00:25:29   What's impressive is the feeling

00:25:33   of looking at a portable retina display.

00:25:36   So it's not a technical observation, it's just a personal feeling of mine.

00:25:40   When I look at the display it looks fantastic because it's so big

00:25:43   and it shows two apps at the same time, text is

00:25:46   crisp, legible, it looks exactly

00:25:50   to me like an iPerf2 display. It's only more impressive because it's bigger

00:25:54   But the color, the sharpness, the render quality, that's the same.

00:25:58   The crazy thing to me is the resolution of this thing is bigger than the MacBook.

00:26:04   Yeah, 5.6 million pixels should be more than a MacBook, I think.

00:26:10   Yeah, the MacBook is 226 pixels per inch at 2304 by 1440.

00:26:15   Yeah.

00:26:15   That's madness to me.

00:26:18   I don't know how they make the decisions that they make,

00:26:21   and I'm not saying it's a bad or good decision, but it's just really crazy to me that there is this iPad

00:26:26   which is better than this future laptop. It is kind of magical in its own little way.

00:26:32   And what's even crazier is because of this crazy resolution, when you activate multitasking in split view

00:26:40   and you move to the 50/50 split view layout, you basically get two iPadder, two portrait apps at the same time.

00:26:51   They're only slightly, maybe like a couple of hundred pixels of difference between the two resolutions,

00:26:58   but it's basically like using two iPads vertically at the same time, which is crazy.

00:27:03   And the effect when you activate Split View, it gets you by surprise because it's really like using two regular sized apps at the same time.

00:27:12   And you get the controls where you expect them to be, you get tabs at the top in Safari,

00:27:18   So it's really a nice effect.

00:27:20   And again, to me it's crazy that this thing has this kind of resolution.

00:27:24   And when I go back to my MacBook Air to record podcasts on Skype,

00:27:31   I look at the screen and I see those big chunky pixels,

00:27:34   and I'm like, "Oh my god, what am I using?"

00:27:36   Yeah, it looks really nice.

00:27:39   There's a line in your review, you say,

00:27:44   You say, "A week after I started using the iPad Pro,

00:27:46   I picked up my old iPad Air 2,

00:27:48   and it felt like an iPad Mini."

00:27:50   - Yes.

00:27:52   - That's frightening to me,

00:27:53   as someone who uses an Air 2 and who really likes it,

00:27:56   that if I get one of these things,

00:27:58   that I'm going to be ruined.

00:28:01   But what does an iPad Mini feel like now?

00:28:03   Have you tried a Mini since having this?

00:28:05   - No, not yet.

00:28:06   I wanna go to the Apple Store and pick up an iPad Mini

00:28:09   to see what my reaction is gonna be.

00:28:11   I'm probably gonna think it's a very big iPhone.

00:28:14   Because I needed to confirm with myself,

00:28:17   I think I was going, I thought I was going crazy,

00:28:19   is this an iPad Air 2?

00:28:21   I asked my girlfriend, she was like, are you kidding me?

00:28:24   It really does feel tiny, you know?

00:28:27   And not just multitasking, but just apps,

00:28:30   like full screen apps, it feels so tiny.

00:28:33   When you get used to, so these big toolbars,

00:28:36   these wide sidebars on the iPad Pro,

00:28:39   you start using iOS on an iPad R2 and it feels exactly like I felt when I moved from the

00:28:47   iPad mini to the R2. It feels just impossibly small and not in a good way. The keyboard

00:28:54   is smaller, apps are all closer together when you do split view. The icons on the home screen,

00:29:01   and we can talk about this, it's just very closely grouped together. I think this will

00:29:08   be a common reaction for people who move from an Air 2 to the Pro. You give it a few days,

00:29:15   you pick up the iPad Air 2, you're gonna feel like "how did I use this for a year?"

00:29:21   You can just hear the groans like "nooooo" because this is what it was like when we all

00:29:25   got the Plus, right? There are just so many advantages to having a larger screen. So I

00:29:34   I just got a Retina iMac.

00:29:36   - Yes.

00:29:37   - And if I ever use my MacBook now, I feel constrained

00:29:40   because the screen is smaller.

00:29:42   - Yes.

00:29:43   - Right? Like whenever you, it was the thing,

00:29:45   whenever you increase the real estate

00:29:47   of the machine that you're using,

00:29:49   the benefits of that become intrinsically important

00:29:53   to the way that you work.

00:29:54   - I totally believe, I'm starting to believe

00:29:56   that we as humans have a natural tendency

00:30:00   for liking big screens.

00:30:01   almost no one likes a small screen.

00:30:05   Like if you had to choose, would you look at text, would you look at a webpage,

00:30:09   would you look at a photo on a small screen voluntarily?

00:30:13   Unless you have some very important physical constraints.

00:30:17   And from that point of view we can talk about accessibility and that's totally fair.

00:30:22   But if you had the choice, choosing between a small screen and a big screen,

00:30:27   of course you're going to pick the big screen.

00:30:30   because it shows you more, it shows you better photos, it shows you more text, it's easier

00:30:37   to look at for the eyes. So, again, the effect is really like moving from the Mini to the

00:30:44   R2 or from the iPhone 5s to the iPhone 6 and maybe to the 6 Plus. You go back and you say,

00:30:51   was I even getting work done on this thing? Was it possible? What was I thinking? And

00:30:56   You know, that's natural progress in terms of these devices. As the screens get bigger,

00:31:02   it's a balance, right? You gotta say, "Am I still able to use this? And if I am, do

00:31:07   I see the benefits in a bigger screen?" If you do, then you go back and you say, "Yeah,

00:31:12   this is too small. I cannot get anything done here."

00:31:15   Clearly a lot of upside there from a work perspective, but I think there are a lot of

00:31:20   people who are not going to use their iPad at their desk. They're going to use it on

00:31:24   the couch, they're going to be hanging out watching Netflix. How is that bigger screen

00:31:32   in those scenarios? If you're reading in bed and air two can feel somewhat big at times,

00:31:40   did you experience any of that? Is there any weirdness there as far as using it sort of

00:31:44   in a more relaxed position?

00:31:48   Did you see the photo that I sent you last night?

00:31:50   I did.

00:31:51   The one watching the same video.

00:31:53   It's like you wield a TV next to your bed.

00:31:55   Yes.

00:31:57   So this is totally, I have a footnote in my review.

00:32:00   When I play games or watch movies, it's totally like having a mini high-rest TV on my lap or on my desk.

00:32:08   I don't know how I should describe this, if this is a problem for people or not.

00:32:16   because when you're resting, when you're in a relaxed position, you can use a smart cover or the smart keyboard as a stand.

00:32:25   So, in theory, it shouldn't be a problem if it's too big. It could only be a positive, you know, because you're looking at a bigger screen so it's more comfortable.

00:32:35   You don't have to hold your device with both hands, so size shouldn't be an issue in that case.

00:32:42   So I don't know, like, when you're in bed, do you like to use like another stand for the iPad?

00:32:49   While watching Netflix? Because when you're on the couch, you can just put the iPad Pro on your lap.

00:32:55   And it's this big screen that you see in front of you.

00:32:58   If you have a desk, you can just use a stand.

00:33:03   Or, you know, just like my picture in the review, you can just prop it up on your lap and watch a movie.

00:33:09   So, I don't know, maybe for kids it could be a problem, you know, kids with small hands,

00:33:17   it's a heavier device, so that maybe is a problem, you know, if you're gonna ask your

00:33:24   children to pick up an iPad Pro, I can imagine at 700 grams that can be an issue.

00:33:31   Just knock over my daughter.

00:33:32   Yes.

00:33:33   It just disrupts her center of gravity and she just goes straight down.

00:33:37   Yeah.

00:33:38   For kids, maybe that's a problem, and I see your argument there.

00:33:42   But for adult people, I don't know, I think you'll be fine.

00:33:46   One of the main uses of my MacBook Pro now is it's become the machine that we watch TV

00:33:52   on in bed.

00:33:53   Yes, yes.

00:33:54   But this is the same screen size.

00:33:56   So goodbye!

00:33:59   My MacBook is becoming...

00:34:01   The more I think about the iPad Pro, and we'll talk about this at the end, but I'm starting

00:34:05   to just check off more of what I do with my MacBook Pro and it's becoming less and less

00:34:10   likely that it will have a serious place in my life if I get one of these.

00:34:15   Now before we depart from the screen and move on to other positive devices, this is the

00:34:21   first of a couple of things I believe that put the iPad in a weird position from a refresh

00:34:28   cycle and what I'm talking about is 3D touch.

00:34:31   So the iPad Pro is a new device but it's kind of still stuck in the middle between the iPad

00:34:38   Air 2 and the new iPhones.

00:34:40   And one of the first things that highlight this is the fact that you cannot use 3D Touch

00:34:45   on this device, right?

00:34:49   How has that impacted you on a daily basis?

00:34:52   Has it, has it not?

00:34:54   Do you need it?

00:34:55   What do you think you need it for?

00:34:56   Could this device even comfortably use a technology like this?

00:35:00   So the biggest issue has been the lack of shortcuts on the home screen.

00:35:06   But what I also noticed is I use 3D Touch on my phone with my thumb, so when I'm scrolling

00:35:13   Twitter I can just press harder with my thumb and I get a preview in Tweetbot, you know,

00:35:18   Tweets and webpages.

00:35:20   I don't use the iPad Pro like that, and even if I did, there's a, you know, there's a gap

00:35:28   in apps between the bezel of the device when my thumb rests and the content on the screen.

00:35:36   So in Tweetbot you get a sidebar or maybe in Safari you get a margin between the bezel

00:35:43   and a link in the text of a webpage.

00:35:46   So I struggle to imagine how you would use 3D Touch on an iPad.

00:35:50   You would have to use another finger, so another hand like your index finger on the right hand

00:35:55   point at content and use 3D touch. So I think there will be some 3D touch

00:36:03   implementation. I don't know if it'll be like the iPhone. So on home screen it's

00:36:08   gotta be like the iPhone because shortcuts are just too convenient. But

00:36:12   the physical interaction of using, at least for me, using 3D touch on an

00:36:18   iPhone and imagine it on an iPad Pro is different because even on the 6 Plus I

00:36:24   I can hold the device and with my thumb use 3D Touch anywhere, because I can reach the screen anywhere.

00:36:30   On the iPad Pro it would require another hand, so I don't know.

00:36:35   And it will be especially weird when the iPad is being used with a keyboard vertically.

00:36:42   So do you just... there's a risk you gotta knock your iPad over trying to use 3D Touch when it's used vertically with a stand.

00:36:50   I think there's gotta be some kind of 3D touch implementation in the future.

00:36:56   I don't know if it'll be exactly like the phone.

00:36:59   I had this moment in preparing, looking at the iPad Pro pages on Apple's website.

00:37:07   And as the resident space nerd, I liked, there was a lot of space stuff in the keynote and all their example images.

00:37:14   I was like, oh man, it's gonna be so cool to like,

00:37:16   you know, 3D touch and have a live photo

00:37:19   of like Jupiter spinning under my thumb.

00:37:21   And then I was like, and Myke actually was like,

00:37:22   you know there's not 3D touch in the iPad Pro.

00:37:25   And I was like, no!

00:37:26   (laughing)

00:37:29   You know, maybe next time, you know,

00:37:31   I think this happens with Apple products sometimes

00:37:33   where you end up the iPhone having something first.

00:37:36   I mean, just look at Siri.

00:37:38   It took a while to bring that to the iPad

00:37:40   and it's still not on the Mac.

00:37:41   I think maybe it has less to do with like,

00:37:43   lifecycle of products and more to do with the iPhone being sort of the the front or the iPhones where they make all their money

00:37:50   Or most of their money and it's that's where they're pushing the envelope. You know, I think I agree with you Federico that

00:37:57   three tips would be really nice especially for

00:38:00   Home screen shortcuts. It's amazing how quickly that has become like part of my workflow in my iPhone. Like I'm totally in on it

00:38:09   But the you know, I think it will get there, but I'm not I'm not shocked. I'm not like

00:38:14   Super surprised that it's not here on day one. Yeah. Yeah, I totally agree

00:38:20   The just imagining pick and pop while holding an iPad Pro

00:38:25   I just I cannot see it or you know, maybe I'll be proven wrong in the future

00:38:30   But I think the big the bigger screen gets the harder it is for 3d touch to be effective

00:38:35   So either Apple comes up with a new implementation just for the iPad or maybe

00:38:40   I'm just wrong and when it does finally ship with the touch it'll be okay with pick and pop as you normally do on the iPhone.

00:38:47   So we'll see. Also another hardware feature that you know, it's on the phone, but it's not on the iPad

00:38:54   It's a second generation Touch ID sensor.

00:38:56   So that's really a bummer because I'm totally used to the crazy fast unlocking experience of the iPhone 6s and

00:39:05   And on the iPad Pro you can immediately tell it's the first generation Touch ID.

00:39:10   It's slower and it's not as fast or accurate or capable of accepting different orientations of your finger than on the iPhone 6s.

00:39:22   So it's the one we've been used to with the previous iPads.

00:39:25   Talking about Touch ID and hardware stuff, is there a Taptic motor in this device?

00:39:30   No.

00:39:31   Okay, so there's no vibrate motoring because I don't believe any other iPads have had yeah, no, it doesn't vibrate. Yeah, okay

00:39:38   My only reason thinking that is like games and stuff, but it's never been a thing that's been there before okay

00:39:43   Yeah, so to wrap up the hardware

00:39:45   I thought we could talk real quick about some of the it's like the pure tech spec so

00:39:49   Federica you mentioned it's got four gigs of RAM. Yes, which is of course

00:39:54   The most that we've seen in a iOS device and I imagine that is all about that multitasking experience

00:40:01   Can you tell the difference between the iPad Air 2 and the Pro in this regard?

00:40:06   Yeah, it's a bit snappier, it's more responsive, and when you use a full screen app like Safari,

00:40:12   and you open a bunch of tabs, you can tell that it's keeping those tabs longer in memory.

00:40:17   So it's not a massive difference from the iPad Air 2, but it's noticeably faster, snappier, more responsive.

00:40:23   Some animations are quicker and I've been fine with the performance.

00:40:31   It makes me more efficient because when I put up two apps side by side, I can switch between Safari tabs.

00:40:40   The extensions, something like Workflow, if it needs to work with a lot of data, so with a big video or with a big photo,

00:40:48   The extension can use more RAM, so it works really nicely for me.

00:40:54   And Federico, you mentioned that you have a 128, and there's two versions of the 128,

00:41:00   one with Solia and one without.

00:41:04   And then other than that, there's just the 32 WiFi, right?

00:41:06   There's no 64GB.

00:41:09   Do you think this is an issue from Apple?

00:41:13   I don't know.

00:41:14   I asked, and they wouldn't tell, of course, why they made this decision.

00:41:18   can only imagine. It's strange to me that the base model is a 32 and not a 64. I can

00:41:25   understand the sort of jump to 128, because for people who are going to use this as their

00:41:31   main computer, you put in a lot of games, a lot of movies, a lot of documents, so you

00:41:36   want to use this as a computer, you need the 128. So that I understand. I don't understand

00:41:42   why the base model is the 32 version and not the 64 gig one. Maybe there's some kind of

00:41:50   ... Steven has a theory that it's a supply chain issue. I'm coming up empty. Or maybe

00:41:57   they just want to push people to buy the 128 gig model because it's more money and more

00:42:04   revenue. I don't know.

00:42:05   - Yeah, it's a little odd, but we've complained

00:42:08   for a while now about odd storage issues

00:42:10   with iOS devices, you know.

00:42:12   It may be a parts issue, I don't know if they're using

00:42:14   the same parts for storage here as they are

00:42:16   in the 6S and 6S Plus, where I think a lot of people

00:42:20   are buying the 64, because it's that,

00:42:22   the way the thing is set up now.

00:42:26   But I agree too, that if this is a device

00:42:30   that Apple sees as a true computer replacement

00:42:34   that maybe they think, hey, you know what,

00:42:36   128 gigs is a lot better of a situation to be in.

00:42:41   It's gonna give you more breathing room,

00:42:43   it's gonna feel more like a computer

00:42:46   in a traditional sense if you have that more storage space.

00:42:50   So maybe they're sort of leading you to that 128

00:42:52   like they do on the iPhones,

00:42:54   but I think it's fine either way.

00:42:57   I mean, it's just sort of an interesting thing

00:42:59   to think about in light of all the other storage issues

00:43:03   we've talked about.

00:43:04   The limiting of the cellular to the 128 version is also just a peculiar choice, because that's

00:43:09   not something that they do with other iPads.

00:43:11   No, they allow you to choose any configuration with any kind of storage and WiFi plus cellular

00:43:18   connection.

00:43:19   So, that's interesting.

00:43:23   The cellular is the kind of premium that you can only get if you go all in with the iPad

00:43:27   Pro.

00:43:28   What's crazy about that is since like the beginning of iPad time, it's been 130 bucks

00:43:35   to add cellular data.

00:43:37   So you could buy the 16 gig and spend another $130 and get the cellular.

00:43:43   So it's not like the margins would be less on the 32 gig.

00:43:50   They're still going to charge that premium to add the cellular anyway.

00:43:55   That makes no sense to me.

00:43:56   I really would like to know why they they made that decision again. Maybe it's to say hey, you know what this

00:44:02   Review this as a machine that is going to be used in an office in a home office and you know in a professional

00:44:10   environment where you're gonna have Wi-Fi and

00:44:13   maybe there's something it's as important here as it is on something like the mini or the air - but

00:44:19   Why take that option away from your customers is something that I just I don't get it. Yeah

00:44:25   Yeah, it's very strange. All right, we should talk about iOS 9 and how iOS 9 feels on the iPad Pro

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00:47:10   - You know, when we look back,

00:47:12   there's always interesting things that come out.

00:47:15   You can connect the dots once you're kind of past them.

00:47:17   And I think there have been a lot of dots leading

00:47:20   to this device.

00:47:22   So we have the iPad Air 2, which came out last year

00:47:26   and all of a sudden, this thing is sort of ridiculous, right?

00:47:31   There's so much power here.

00:47:32   can do so much and then iOS 9 comes out with all this multitasking slide over

00:47:37   split view picture-in-picture that the power in the Air 2 especially since they

00:47:43   didn't rev it this year make a lot of sense now right the hardware sort of

00:47:47   maybe outpaced the software for a second and and now iOS 9 and the Air 2 feel

00:47:52   really well matched and the iPad Pro I think is just another step in that

00:47:58   direction right so you know multitasking might be a little tight on the Air 2

00:48:02   probably really tight on a mini 4 but on a Pro like you said Federico you get

00:48:06   these nice iPad portrait apps side-by-side. We're going to talk a little

00:48:11   bit about that but I was wondering are there ways that it doesn't make sense

00:48:14   yet or are we in that situation again where the hardware is outpacing the

00:48:17   software in areas in your mind? Well when it comes to multitasking they make a lot

00:48:25   of sense together especially when you want to use two full-size apps and you

00:48:30   get the feeling and the power to do so. There are some parts of the iOS 9

00:48:37   interface that could use a little more creativity because they show a lot of

00:48:43   potential. So the home screen is totally the same on the iPad Pro. You get the

00:48:48   same 5x4 grid of app icons, excluding the docking landscape, and

00:48:55   and they're just only more spaced out. So there's no additional room for more icons,

00:49:03   no special usage of the bigger home screen, and folders are totally the same. Control center,

00:49:11   when used in landscape, it just shows more white space between the toggles. So they look really

00:49:20   weird when you're used to having the tight control center icons.

00:49:25   And they totally scream, "Hey, let's put more toggles in here. We got room for them.

00:49:32   You can put in additional shortcuts if you want, but you can't."

00:49:35   So it is strange to look at the home screen, to look at control center.

00:49:39   And on the other hand, Apple has done some new things for iOS 9.

00:49:44   So in Notification Center, you get a mini monthly calendar at the top,

00:49:49   next to today's date. You see this little monthly calendar which is useful when you want to pull down and see upcoming weeks and days of the month.

00:49:59   Or of course the software keyboard is totally different from the Apple Air 2.

00:50:04   So they have done some things and in typical Apple fashion they have chosen some areas to focus on for the 1.0

00:50:16   and some other parts of the interface are clearly not done.

00:50:21   They're not unusable. They're just the same as the previous generation.

00:50:25   So you can see the potential there.

00:50:27   And I wouldn't be surprised to see new things coming to the home screen on the iPad Pro.

00:50:35   It just feels very lonely, you know, to look at those app icons, to look at those control center shortcuts.

00:50:42   You can see the space for innovation, the space for additional shortcuts to save time, to jump between apps.

00:50:51   I don't know. You just can see the potential. It's just not there yet.

00:50:55   So, I would say that iOS 9 and the iPad Pro, they make sense together.

00:51:01   And in some areas, Apple has done some customizations that are really welcome.

00:51:06   But there's a few aspects that need more time and need more work.

00:51:12   Maybe Apple designers themselves need to understand what people want.

00:51:16   They need to look at the home screen, to look at Control Center and say

00:51:21   "What can we do to better organize apps?"

00:51:25   Maybe the most obvious answer is "Let's put more apps on the first page."

00:51:29   I don't know, but do something with that space.

00:51:33   In Control Center, just allow users to define their own shortcuts.

00:51:38   The space of Control Center on the iPad Pro

00:51:42   basically begs for more shortcuts in there.

00:51:46   The Control Center UI reminds me of what the notification view was like

00:51:51   until iOS 9.

00:51:53   It wasn't until 9 that Apple realized that

00:51:56   just swiping down and seeing one whole list of icons doesn't make sense,

00:52:01   because with 9 you got the ability to have the split view between notifications and widgets.

00:52:06   So it shows that there is the ability to do more there, but I think what it does show is it sometimes takes a little bit longer than it should.

00:52:14   One of the things that you mentioned in your review was a growing frustration in the SlideOver UI

00:52:20   that has been really put to the test with the iPad Pro. Can you explain what that is?

00:52:26   So the SlideOver UI is when you're swiping from the right edge of the screen to bring up the last used app in SlideOver

00:52:34   and when you then swipe down from the status bar of the SlideOver app, you see the SlideOver App Picker

00:52:42   which is this vertical tray of three icons at a time that already in September I was arguing that it could have used a better way to organize apps

00:52:53   apps and to let you find apps to use in multitasking.

00:52:58   And two months after the public release of iOS 9, I totally believe that the SlideOver

00:53:02   App Picker is the single iOS 9 feature that's aging badly.

00:53:09   It is very annoying to find an app that you used a couple of days ago, because there's

00:53:13   no search bar.

00:53:14   So you've got to scroll all the way to the top and look at the icons and see, "Oh, hey,

00:53:18   that's the app I want to use in SlideOver."

00:53:21   It's a slow process.

00:53:22   a tedious process to find all these apps with no organization. The list isn't compact, so

00:53:28   it's not a grid and you can look at a bunch of icons at a time. You can only see three

00:53:33   icons in a single screen, so you need to swipe slowly, look at each icon and say "yep, that's

00:53:37   the app". On the iPad Pro, because the screen is so big, it becomes even more annoying because

00:53:45   Apple didn't use the increased space for showing you more icons in the slide over.

00:53:52   It's scales, right? I assume that the blocks are still as big.

00:53:56   That's a way you really could have made that easier, was like shrinking that down.

00:54:00   I don't even know why they used the big card interface there. Just icons would be perfectly acceptable.

00:54:06   And even, also because you know, only the most recently used app

00:54:12   uses the card as a sort of screenshot preview of your last activity in the app.

00:54:18   Which is weird, right? Because it looks like it's meant to be modeled on the multitasking view.

00:54:22   That's kind of where the UI comes from.

00:54:25   But it doesn't use the multitasking view like where the previews.

00:54:31   It's very peculiar.

00:54:32   No, it just shows you a lighter gray background.

00:54:36   Which is great. That's what I want.

00:54:38   So I would really like to see a way to search apps in there, maybe a grid layout.

00:54:45   If you don't want to use cards, just let me choose to have a more compact grade of apps.

00:54:50   So I can look at maybe 10 to 12 icons at a time.

00:54:53   And maybe even let me say, "Hey, I never want to use this app in the slide-over or in multitasking,

00:55:00   so I don't want to see my content blocker in there.

00:55:03   I'm not going to switch back and forth between Safari and my content blocker.

00:55:08   If I want to change settings, I go to the content blocker app.

00:55:11   There's a lot of apps, or games for that matter,

00:55:14   There's really a lot of apps that don't make any sense in the slide-over menu, but there's no way to turn them off.

00:55:20   So when you're scrolling the list, you've got to see them all until you find the app you're looking for.

00:55:24   And on the iPad Pro that becomes a problem because the UI just scales, and they don't take advantage of the bigger screen to simplify the process of finding apps in the app picker there.

00:55:33   Let's talk about the software keyboard for a moment, because I know that you've got some frustrations with this.

00:55:38   Can you explain some of the sweeping changes that Apple have made, some of the enhancements,

00:55:43   but also how they're affecting you on a daily basis?

00:55:46   So the main idea is to replicate the feeling and the functionality of a desktop keyboard,

00:55:51   of a magic keyboard.

00:55:53   You see there's a number row at the top, always shown.

00:55:58   There's special characters on top of numbers.

00:56:00   There's a bunch of extra keys on each side of the keyboard.

00:56:04   And it's really meant to replicate the way that you work on a physical keyboard on your

00:56:07   Mac on an iPad Pro, on a software keyboard. Which is a great idea in theory.

00:56:12   It's a great idea because there's going to be a lot of people switching from

00:56:14   laptops or from notebooks to an iPad Pro so they can

00:56:17   be instantly familiar with the keyboard. The problem here,

00:56:22   and I remember I was going crazy for this, Apple is using

00:56:26   a US English layout for the keys. So for listeners who don't know, live in America

00:56:31   and have no idea about international keyboards,

00:56:33   Physical keyboards have minor but important changes across different countries.

00:56:40   So in America, the delete key, the backspace key, whatever you want to call it, is not

00:56:49   directly on top of the return key.

00:56:53   There's I believe square brackets in between return and delete on the right side of the

00:56:58   keyboard.

00:56:59   In Italy, and I believe in the UK as well, and in other European countries, the delete

00:57:05   key sits on physical keyboards for computers. The delete key sits directly on top of the

00:57:12   return or enter key.

00:57:15   We call it return, and it's shaped like a beautiful upside-down boot.

00:57:18   Yeah. And so when I'm sliding with my hand on the right side of the keyboard, just by

00:57:24   feel. I can tell the return key and I can tell the delete key is a rectangle directly on top of the keyboard.

00:57:31   On the iPad Pro, I use the US English keyboard, which has a different layout of the Italian one.

00:57:38   And of course, it's got this delete key that's not directly on top of return. And that's okay, you know, I get why they're

00:57:46   kinda finding a way to replicate the US English layout of physical keyboards on a software keyboard.

00:57:53   The problem is, when I switch to the software Italian keyboard, which I use for texting my mom or my girlfriend or just doing searches on Google in Italian,

00:58:04   they only change the glyphs on the keys, the icons, so the delete glyph is different, but the layout and the shape of the keys is the same.

00:58:16   So it's an Italian keyboard in that it's got Italian icons and it writes in Italian

00:58:22   But it doesn't use the Italian keyboard layout.

00:58:25   Yeah, it uses the little icon that says return, right?

00:58:29   Like so the little arrow, but the key shape is the same.

00:58:33   Is that what you're saying?

00:58:33   The key shape is the same and the placement of the delete key is not as the keyboard

00:58:38   I'm looking at right now on my Mac

00:58:41   So I got delete on top of return on the iPad Pro when I switched to the software Italian keyboard

00:58:47   The delete key is not on top of return. There's a bunch of keys in between them

00:58:52   It's a real interesting oversight, right? Because they've identified that something needs to change

00:58:55   but they haven't changed what they actually need to change. Yeah, and

00:59:00   It took me a couple of days. I was going crazy

00:59:06   adjusting to you know to this different layout and I realized that my situation is a bit peculiar because I'm in Italy

00:59:13   but I write in English and my audience is primarily American so I use the US key English keyboard and

00:59:19   For me the struggle was going from the IPAD R2 keyboard the software one, which I used on a daily basis

00:59:26   I mostly use the software keyboard when I work from my iPad

00:59:29   So I needed to go

00:59:32   from that keyboard to the US English software keyboard on the iPad Pro, which has a different layout.

00:59:39   On the iPad Air 2, the delete key is on the right side. On the iPad Pro,

00:59:44   there's a bunch of keys underneath the delete key, so I was always typing them instead of deleting characters.

00:59:50   So that's for the US English.

00:59:52   So I think I got two problems trying to get used to. The US English layout itself and

00:59:58   and the fact that the Italian software keyboard doesn't switch to the physical Italian keyboard.

01:00:04   So it's a...

01:00:05   Maybe my situation is a bit odd,

01:00:07   but I totally believe that Apple should, if they want to replicate the layout of physical keyboards,

01:00:15   they should be correctly doing so and they should be accurate.

01:00:18   I don't think it's gonna be that weird because I'm gonna have the exact same problem.

01:00:22   Right? The keyboard is not going to be

01:00:26   laid out as I would expect it to be even though it's gonna have

01:00:29   All of the it's gonna understand that is a British keyboard

01:00:33   It's gonna have the glyphs as they should be but the layout is gonna be different which is gonna be very peculiar for me to try

01:00:38   And get get used to yeah, and on the on the app side

01:00:42   All these extra once I get used to it and it took me a few days and I'm still

01:00:49   typing characters I don't want to type when I want to delete a few characters on the text field.

01:00:56   The upside is that the extra characters always shown

01:01:01   at the same time in the main keyboard view and especially the number row and the special characters on top of numbers,

01:01:08   they came really in handy for me for editing markdown, so I get easier access to square brackets,

01:01:15   easier access to numbers.

01:01:18   So once I got used to it, it was really nice because even when writing scripts in Pythonista,

01:01:25   these special characters are useful to have on the main keyboard, so I don't have to switch between different views of the keyboard.

01:01:32   But another thing that has me going crazy, you know the little 1, 2, 3 key on the keyboard that lets you switch to only the special character and number mode?

01:01:45   And you know that there's a little globe key next to it.

01:01:48   Well, the placement of the globe key and the 1-2-3 key has been reversed on the iPad Pro.

01:01:56   For a reason! Nobody can explain!

01:02:00   For reasons unknown, every time I go, instinctively reach out to the 1-2-3 key, I switch keyboards with the globe key.

01:02:11   I either switch to the emoji one or I switch to Italian.

01:02:15   I don't understand why the globe icon is now the first one

01:02:19   instead of being in the second spot, I believe. It's on the iPad R2,

01:02:23   on the iPhone, it's always been that way, I believe.

01:02:27   Or if they changed it, they changed it a couple of years ago and now on

01:02:31   every other device it's in the second spot, in the bottom row, on the left

01:02:35   most side corner. Now the position is different on the iPad Pro

01:02:39   So every time, just with my left index, I go reach out for that key, I change keyboards, and I'm like "Oh no, not again".

01:02:47   I don't understand why there's this change. I honestly have no idea.

01:02:54   Maybe the theory is that, again, to replicate a physical keyboard, the globe key needed to be out of the way?

01:03:04   I don't know. Coming up empty with explanations. No idea.

01:03:09   Seems crazy to me that that would change. It's such a muscle memory thing that worries me.

01:03:13   So one other thing that's different on the iPad Pro keyboard is that there's no more split keyboard.

01:03:19   And I'm pretty sure that the most loyal Scott Forsthold fans will be upset here.

01:03:25   The split keyboard famously introduced by Forrestal back in the iOS 5 days on the iPad is now gone on the iPad Pro.

01:03:35   You can still undock the keyboard so you can use it as a full-size keyboard, not necessarily at the bottom, so you can move it around vertically, but you can no longer split the keyboard.

01:03:47   keyboard. I don't know, I'm not particularly sad. It is a bit strange that they're doing it now,

01:03:55   when you consider that maybe some people, not me, but some people could find this useful because the

01:04:00   iPad Pro is wider and having the ability to have a split keyboard on each side could make it a

01:04:07   little easier for them. But I never used it, I'm not really sad. And it was a long time coming,

01:04:15   I was actually surprised that it was still around with iOS 9, so maybe the iPad Pro offered a nice opportunity for a clean break.

01:04:22   I don't know, are you guys sad that the split keyboard is gone?

01:04:26   I am, because I use it, and it feels like it would be more useful to me to have it here.

01:04:30   Really, you use it?

01:04:31   Yeah, I do use it.

01:04:32   It's more comfortable to hit the middle keys on the keyboard when in portrait.

01:04:37   It looks kind of terrible, man.

01:04:39   Oh, it looks terrible, but it's functional.

01:04:40   It's very functional.

01:04:41   You don't have to stretch your hands so much to hit the middle keys when you're typing

01:04:45   in portrait.

01:04:46   So I've always really liked it and now it's going to be even more difficult to type in

01:04:51   portrait because the thing is huge.

01:04:53   It's like a landscape iPad.

01:04:55   So it feels like this is the only real iPad to me where the split keyboard would be super

01:05:00   useful to more people.

01:05:02   But now they've gotten rid of it.

01:05:03   Yeah.

01:05:04   I agree with Myke 100%.

01:05:06   Which is kind of peculiar.

01:05:08   But you know I guess if I need it that much there are third party keyboards that will

01:05:11   be able to help me.

01:05:12   Eh, do you really want to use the third party keyboard, Myke?

01:05:15   No, especially when it's more difficult to switch between them now because they've moved

01:05:18   the bons now.

01:05:20   Yes.

01:05:21   By the way, switching between third party keyboards seems to be a little faster on the

01:05:26   iPad Pro.

01:05:27   It takes 4 gigs of RAM to switch between keyboards.

01:05:30   That's what the extra RAM is there for.

01:05:32   I didn't include this in the review, I kind of just want to mention it in passing with

01:05:35   you guys, but it seems like a fraction of a second faster, but could be a placebo effect,

01:05:40   Maybe my brain is just looking at this fast device and saying, "Yeah, switching keyboards is also faster."

01:05:46   It seemed that way to me, but I'm not completely sure about it.

01:05:49   That's why they moved the globe, because they wanted to show you how much quicker it was.

01:05:52   Oh, yeah. That's the strategy there.

01:05:56   Okay, guys, look, we did fix it. Keyboards are good now.

01:05:59   Federico, last week on the show we were talking about you using multiple iPads in the past to do the monthly results stuff.

01:06:08   I assume that tasks like this with the split view, with it looking like basically two iPads next to each other, make things like this a lot easier for you on a day-to-day basis.

01:06:17   Yeah. You don't get the problem of the Apet Air 2 when splitting the screen in two apps shows you two apps, for sure.

01:06:27   But it also gives you a compact layout, which often hides some controls or forces you to swipe to reveal sidebars and other menus.

01:06:37   Here you get exactly two portrait apps at the same time, so you get a regular vertical layout.

01:06:45   And it helps for, again, there's a few different examples.

01:06:50   Safari shows tabs and controls at the top.

01:06:55   Many apps don't use action sheets that come up from the bottom.

01:07:02   they instead use popovers on the iPad Pro, so you can see these little menus

01:07:07   instead of a model menu that takes half of the screen.

01:07:12   It's a series of little differences, and it's all based on size classes for iOS,

01:07:18   which developers have started to use last year, and then they're highly used to

01:07:24   power the multitasking interface of iOS 9 on the iPad.

01:07:28   For me, and the kind of usage that I do with the iPad and with iOS 9, I would say that the iPad Pro brings the true expression of iOS 9 multitasking,

01:07:43   because it's really two full-size apps at the same time. It feels like there's no compromise there.

01:07:50   And on the iPad R2, it's more like saying "Yeah, we can do two apps at the same time"

01:07:56   and it's great.

01:07:57   And I've used it since June, I wrote my entire review using iOS 9 multitasking, it was amazing.

01:08:04   On the iPad Pro, it's better.

01:08:05   Simply because you get two bigger apps and you get the same layouts that you're used

01:08:10   to, which is a very important thing to note.

01:08:15   Because when you're using apps in fullscreen, switching to split view doesn't have an increased

01:08:21   cognitive load on you.

01:08:23   You don't have to remember "oh yeah, when I split the screen, the controls change".

01:08:27   They're always in the same spot, which helps a lot when working with touch on the iPad.

01:08:31   That's a really, really interesting point.

01:08:33   I hadn't considered that, but yeah, because I guess on the iPad Pro a lot of apps are

01:08:38   being scaled up, right?

01:08:40   So when you put them into split view, because it's still so big, they don't need to do that.

01:08:45   they don't need to change.

01:08:46   - Yep, exactly.

01:08:48   So my favorite example is Safari.

01:08:51   Again, I use the app all the time.

01:08:52   And I'm so used to having tabs on the iPad

01:08:57   just below the address bar.

01:08:59   When I use Split View with Safari on the iPad R2,

01:09:02   I'm annoyed every single time it changes

01:09:04   to a compact layout,

01:09:05   which has the little tab icon in the bottom right corner.

01:09:08   So when you tap it, you get the iPhone tab view.

01:09:12   you don't get the horizontal list of tabs at the top,

01:09:16   you get a little carousel of tabs.

01:09:19   On the iPad Pro, even when you use Split View,

01:09:22   it still keeps the tabs at the top,

01:09:25   just below the address bar,

01:09:26   which is super convenient to move between

01:09:28   a bunch of websites when you're multitasking.

01:09:30   That's my favorite example by far.

01:09:32   - What about some third-party apps?

01:09:36   Have you had any good experiences or bad experiences

01:09:39   with the idea of the increased screen size

01:09:42   split view? One of my favorite experiences has been Tweetbot, because in portrait mode it shows

01:09:49   the second column, so on the iPad R2 you get the second column only in landscape. On the iPad Pro

01:09:56   you also get it in portrait because it's bigger. That's nice. I still think that top bots should

01:10:03   consider having three columns in landscape because there's really a lot of space available.

01:10:10   they could use a third column in landscape on the iPad Pro.

01:10:14   The interesting thing about the Tweetbot is, so I like to use it a lot on my iPad,

01:10:18   but I use it a lot in portrait view because I like to be able to see my,

01:10:22   like when I read my tweets, just to have that kind of an uninterrupted experience.

01:10:26   So is that something that I'm going to miss when using it on the iPad Pro?

01:10:31   Yes.

01:10:31   Or is the fact that because there's so much screen size,

01:10:35   I kind of get a real good view of the single column and then there's just another column there

01:10:40   there as well? Or is it gonna feel cramped for me still to have two columns there?

01:10:44   Okay, so no, it won't feel cramped because there is space available, Myke. It's just

01:10:51   a matter of taste and visual preference. Do you like having a second column or

01:10:57   just does it distract you too much? Because if that's the case, maybe there

01:11:03   should be a preference for users who never want to see the second column

01:11:08   in portrait, but it's not a problem of available space. The first column still is bigger, wider,

01:11:14   and it gives you more room for tweets. So it's just a matter of visual clutter. Do you want to see that or not?

01:11:21   Maybe it should be a preference, I don't know.

01:11:25   Other third-party apps that were really nice. I'm testing this new... not testing, I bought it from the App Store.

01:11:32   or I'm seeing if it works for me. This clipboard manager for iOS is called "copied"

01:11:38   and it's nice because in Split View

01:11:41   it

01:11:43   it shows you not just the list of

01:11:46   items that you've copied to the clipboard, it also shows you a detailed view for the selected item.

01:11:54   So on the iPad Earth, of course

01:11:56   it only shows a list and then you get a tap and you get the detailed view. On the iPad Pro when you're in Split View

01:12:01   view, you get both the list and the detailed view on the right side. So that was nice.

01:12:06   I saved a bunch of items into this app, so having the two views available at the same

01:12:12   time, that's a nice time saving. I didn't really have any problems getting used to apps

01:12:19   with a split view or at a bigger size. In fact, it was only a benefit to have more consistent

01:12:29   views when switching to multitasking. If you use a lot of third-party apps, I generally

01:12:37   believe that the iPad Pro is a very good update because you get used to a full-screen layout.

01:12:46   When you switch to the split-view layout on the iPad Pro, it's still the same one. It's

01:12:51   only slightly narrower than the iPad 2, but you really cannot tell the difference.

01:12:59   I would say, Myke, that there wasn't any problem getting used to it.

01:13:03   In fact, another nice feature was on the iPad R2, the shortcut bar, you know, the little

01:13:12   shortcuts on each side of QuickType, the suggestions on top of the keyboard, on the smaller iPad,

01:13:19   you often get a popover if there's no room for shortcuts.

01:13:24   So you get a popover to choose shortcuts.

01:13:29   On the iPad Pro, because the keyboard is wider, the shortcuts are always shown without the

01:13:34   popover, so there's no second step.

01:13:36   You always get those icons on top of the keyboard, and there's no other list grouping them.

01:13:44   So overall, I didn't have any problems getting used to third-party apps.

01:13:50   It was only beneficial to me, I would say.

01:13:52   Alright, we should probably talk about the accessories, right?

01:13:54   Because this is completely brand new.

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01:16:01   of this show and Relay FM.

01:16:03   - So one of the big parts of the iPad Pro story,

01:16:06   of course, are the accessories.

01:16:09   And I, for one, because I'm leading this section,

01:16:12   would like to start with the pencil

01:16:14   'cause I think that's the most interesting

01:16:17   and I'm gonna, Federica, I'm gonna read something

01:16:19   that you wrote.

01:16:20   You say, "First, allow me to get this out of my system.

01:16:24   "The Apple Pencil is not the iPad Pro's primary input system

01:16:28   "that's still your finger and multi-touch."

01:16:31   - My understanding is that they've blown it now, right?

01:16:34   'Cause it's a stylus, is that right?

01:16:35   They blew it, right?

01:16:36   That's the thing?

01:16:37   - Do we have to address that?

01:16:39   I'm not even gonna address it.

01:16:44   And rewatching the iPad Pro introduction from September,

01:16:48   that's something that they say multiple times.

01:16:51   The pencil is a supplementary input method.

01:16:55   But it's one that I think is really interesting

01:16:58   'cause they haven't done it before.

01:17:00   There's the quote that people take out of context

01:17:02   and there's, you know, it potentially opens it up

01:17:05   to a whole new type of creativity and that sort of thing.

01:17:10   So how is it, how's the pencil?

01:17:12   First it really feels like a pencil, like the size is much taller than I expected it to be and

01:17:17   it feels great in the hand. It's light,

01:17:21   it's, I mean it's white so

01:17:24   some people won't like it because it kind of stands out if you have a black iPad.

01:17:28   But it feels really nice, so as an object, it feels very nice.

01:17:34   The performance on the screen is impressive and it feels very natural.

01:17:41   natural ink or sketches. Lines follow the tip of the pencil very closely.

01:17:50   And if you're moving the pencil slowly, there's no perceptible delay between a line appearing on screen and the tip of the pencil moving slowly on the display.

01:18:02   If you accelerate the drawing a little bit, there's a tiny, tiny latency between the two,

01:18:09   but it's much, much, much better than any other stylus I've tried on the iPad before.

01:18:15   And the result is, it's by far the best performing stylus I've ever tried, and even if I'm not

01:18:25   an artist and I don't need to annotate documents on my iPad on a daily basis, I've always bought

01:18:32   you know, Stylie on the iPad, just to try them out and see, you know, is this gonna be better for me if I wanna, I don't know, use Evernote with a bunch of PDFs.

01:18:44   For some reason I kept on buying, you know, Stylie for my iPad. I don't know why.

01:18:50   But the Pencil is really something else. And it's a combination of hardware and software.

01:18:56   APIs that Apple launched with IS9, predictive touches and coalesced touches. They help in

01:19:03   getting the iPad screen to recognize and to reduce latency between the pencil, the tip

01:19:10   on the screen and the lines appearing.

01:19:13   I tried the pencil with notes and with some third-party apps that I downloaded from the

01:19:19   App Store or that I got access via TestFlight. I tried it with paper, with

01:19:26   Evernote, I tried it with Adobe Sketch which is a sketching app from

01:19:34   the Adobe guys. What else? I tried even other apps that weren't necessarily based

01:19:41   on sketching and annotations such as I think it's called Complete Anatomy. It's

01:19:47   from 3D for medical and it was done on stage.

01:19:51   Oh yeah.

01:19:52   The one where they were drawing bone, horrifyingly, right?

01:19:56   You can also cut muscles and see what's underneath.

01:19:59   Stop!

01:20:01   Never using that app.

01:20:04   From an educational perspective it's really nice because you can make these precise cuts

01:20:09   and see what the human body is like.

01:20:12   Perfect.

01:20:13   So you get this 3D figure and you can use the tip of the pencil too.

01:20:20   Basically, it's like surgery. You get a cut precisely and you see what's underneath, so you can see the bones, you can see the muscles.

01:20:27   It's very cool and uses the 3D graphics of the iPad Pro so you can zoom and pan around. Very nicely done.

01:20:34   But anyway, my main use case for the pencil when testing it was using the Notes app.

01:20:39   And it just feels like writing on paper.

01:20:43   So I don't write on paper much.

01:20:45   And I realized that I'm talking to one of the guys who has a pen podcast.

01:20:49   What's up? I have many questions.

01:20:50   Hey, Myke, sorry. Sorry.

01:20:52   Just let me say sorry in advance.

01:20:54   If I'm going to say things that you don't like or don't, you know, please forgive me, Myke, whatever.

01:21:00   It feels like writing on a piece of paper to me.

01:21:04   And again, I say this as someone who doesn't write on paper much, but the palm rejection is nearly perfect.

01:21:11   So I can rest my entire wrist and arm on the iPad Pro, so I can just, you know, rest my...

01:21:19   a good portion of my forearm on the display and it won't recognize any touches,

01:21:25   so it won't draw one of those accidental lines that you always get when you try third-party stylus

01:21:32   and an app that's not built for the pencil.

01:21:35   Here that's not the case.

01:21:37   When you can rest your arm on the display

01:21:39   and you can draw with the pencil,

01:21:40   you can write, you can sketch,

01:21:42   and you only get the rendering,

01:21:45   the ink or the lines from the pencil.

01:21:48   So it's very well done.

01:21:50   I did trigger a couple of accidental lines,

01:21:55   usually in the bottom half of the display.

01:21:59   So I don't know if the iPad Pro is doing polymer ejection like in a circle around the pencil.

01:22:06   I have no idea.

01:22:07   Or maybe just a software issue.

01:22:09   I would say that I got 90% accuracy, which is very impressive.

01:22:16   So I think a way to tell about how Apple is doing the polymer ejection.

01:22:19   Can you move anything on the interface whilst using the pencil?

01:22:23   No.

01:22:24   In fact, when you, it's weird to describe,

01:22:28   if you, even if you activate Split View,

01:22:31   so you put two apps side by side,

01:22:33   one that has an input field for the pencil

01:22:37   and another like, I don't know, Slack or Splitbot.

01:22:40   You can draw on the left side with a pencil,

01:22:44   you can rest your palm of your hands on the Split View app

01:22:49   and it won't do anything.

01:22:51   So even when you're using two apps at the same time,

01:22:53   Palmer Ejection applies globally to the display and it's very well done.

01:22:57   So what it's doing, it seems like, is as soon as the pencil comes into contact with the iPad

01:23:02   it shuts off all other input.

01:23:04   Probably.

01:23:05   Yeah, which is sensible because you typically won't need it.

01:23:09   Because I would assume, and you can tell me if I'm wrong, that as soon as you lift the

01:23:14   tip you can move things.

01:23:17   Well you can zoom, you can select controls.

01:23:19   Yeah, that's when the tip of the pencil is off the paper.

01:23:23   I actually haven't tried to just hold in the pencil, and I don't know if it's even possible to hold the pencil on the screen

01:23:31   and select a bunch of menus at the same time with another finger.

01:23:35   I guess I didn't try this because when I'm drawing I'm concentrating on the lines and actually using the pencil.

01:23:43   But my idea is that yes, when you're...

01:23:47   And again, I didn't confirm this with Apple.

01:23:49   So it's just my speculation.

01:23:51   But when I'm touching the screen with the pencil, it blocks everything else.

01:23:55   So those accidental lines that I got were maybe a problem in between lifting the pencil and just triggering a touch.

01:24:04   But again, 90 to 95% accuracy.

01:24:09   I remember reading the first impressions from the Pixar guys and the Disney guys and they said it's nearly perfect and they were totally right.

01:24:18   It's nearly perfect. It's not 100% perfect but it's almost there.

01:24:22   I need to ask you some very specific questions now.

01:24:25   Okay.

01:24:26   Something I would really like to understand is how the iPad Pro and the Pencil work together for handwriting.

01:24:34   So can you take, for example, what would effectively be a blank sheet of paper

01:24:40   and write like you would normally write? Does it come up really small and really precise?

01:24:45   Because one of the problems of previous iPads, you've had to zoom in to make it look like the size of handwriting.

01:24:52   Can you write as if you were writing on a piece of paper? Will it accept input that is that small?

01:24:56   Yes, it does accept inputs that is smaller.

01:24:59   So you gotta combine the pencil and the ink rendering of an app.

01:25:06   So if you select a small pen and you maybe turn down the size, then if you use the pencil

01:25:14   you're gonna be able to write small details or small letters and small handwriting in

01:25:18   general.

01:25:20   So basically, Apple have now created the iPad I always wanted.

01:25:24   This is something I have always wanted.

01:25:27   So, you know, something that I imagine is

01:25:29   I take a lot of notes whilst recording during the shows.

01:25:32   I could maybe use this type of device for that.

01:25:34   I mean, I am a handwriting person.

01:25:37   This is something that seems very interesting to me.

01:25:40   Something else I've heard is that the texture

01:25:43   of the touchscreen is slightly different on the iPad,

01:25:47   which gives more of a resistance for when using the pencil.

01:25:50   Is this something that you've personally noticed?

01:25:53   Maybe a little bit.

01:25:54   Yeah, I've heard it's not a lot, but it gives some feedback when you're drawing the pencil

01:25:59   across the screen so it feels a little less like rubber on glass.

01:26:05   Maybe it has a tiny bit of resistance, but it wasn't a big deal to me really.

01:26:10   It's not like when you're moving, the pencil just glides across the display.

01:26:14   You don't get friction.

01:26:16   I noticed this and I thought that maybe the problem was me, but now that you mention it,

01:26:21   it is a little change in the screen. When you use your finger it feels a little different

01:26:27   from the Apet Air 2, but again it's a very tiny difference.

01:26:31   Okay.

01:26:32   Yeah.

01:26:33   Yeah, so that would be a good thing for me, right? So I'll be looking forward to reporting

01:26:37   back on just how much this feels like a good pen on good paper.

01:26:41   I don't want you to be disappointed, Myke.

01:26:43   No, no.

01:26:44   You're an expert.

01:26:45   The thing is I will always perfectly understand that it's rubber on glass. It's never going

01:26:49   feel like some of the good tools that I have, but just some of the basic

01:26:53   ideas of the fact that this could work for somebody that wants to use

01:26:56   handwriting software, this is a big boon for the device that I'm

01:27:01   very excited about.

01:27:03   Yeah, I think based on what I've seen, I've seen my

01:27:06   girlfriend write. I really basically forgot how to handwrite, but I tried and

01:27:12   it's fine, especially because you can rest your entire hand, you know, when writing.

01:27:17   So it feels like writing on a notebook with a pen.

01:27:20   That's the important part. Using hover hand is no way to go.

01:27:23   Oh yeah. You don't have to be careful with placing your hand on the screen.

01:27:27   With the previous iPad slightly, you needed to be careful,

01:27:30   like holding the stylus in an unnatural position to make sure that you didn't accidentally touch the screen.

01:27:35   That's not the case with the pencil.

01:27:37   You can just rest your hand and write.

01:27:39   Yeah.

01:27:40   And I think a lot of people are going to ask this.

01:27:44   can use the Pencil on older iPads? I mean, obviously you wouldn't have the touch sensitivity

01:27:50   and that sort of stuff with the scanning, but does it work at all?

01:27:52   No. At least in my tests it didn't.

01:27:55   So it doesn't even act like a dumb stylus?

01:27:59   No. So what it does is, when you... again, I tried.

01:28:04   When you plug in the Pencil into the iPad Pro, it shows you a pairing request.

01:28:12   So you get a dialogue that says "do you want to connect to the Apple Pencil?"

01:28:15   You say yes, and then it shows up in the Bluetooth preferences.

01:28:18   What I also tried is I turned off Bluetooth on my iPad Pro, so it was no longer connected to the pencil,

01:28:24   I plugged in the pencil on my iPad Air 2, and it didn't bring up the permission to connect to the pencil,

01:28:31   and I couldn't use it at all on my iPad Air 2.

01:28:34   So like, you open the Notes app, you put the pencil tip on there, and it doesn't recognize it?

01:28:40   Do you want me to try now?

01:28:42   I want to, yeah, this is something I think is quite important.

01:28:45   Let me try again.

01:28:46   Yeah, try that, because that is a...

01:28:48   That would be really interesting because it means that they're using a very peculiar tip.

01:28:52   Yeah, let me try for a second.

01:28:54   [Music]

01:28:59   Okay, so I get the pencil right here and my iPad Air 2.

01:29:04   Plug in the pencil into the iPad

01:29:09   and I get no permission to use the pencil.

01:29:13   So I can try to open the Notes app.

01:29:15   Just open the Notes app and see if it will recognize any kind of touch.

01:29:18   I bring up a new note,

01:29:20   and I switch to the drawing,

01:29:23   and it does nothing.

01:29:25   Man, that is crazy.

01:29:27   Because basically it means that they have not got a capacitive tip on this.

01:29:30   It's an iPad Pro only accessory.

01:29:33   Hmm, and I'm more interested now than ever about what they're using to recognize the touch because I know that Bluetooth will wait

01:29:41   But there are other Bluetooth styluses, but it means that the tip is not

01:29:45   It's not built in the same way that other stylus are right because they use

01:29:50   Whatever they use the conductive technology to make sure that it works, but how interesting all right

01:29:55   Thank you for performing that real-world test. Yeah sure I really appreciate that

01:29:59   I have one last question about the pencil and then we can move on to the keyboards.

01:30:02   So I know one of the things that it does is if you can plug it in for 15 seconds

01:30:07   and it gives you 30 minutes of charge, right?

01:30:09   Yes.

01:30:09   That's one of the great things about it. Can you do that continuously?

01:30:11   What do you mean?

01:30:12   So after it runs out after that half an hour, can you plug it in again?

01:30:16   For another 15 seconds, get another half an hour?

01:30:18   You can always plug it in.

01:30:20   Because I just wondered how the battery technology works, right?

01:30:22   Like if it was like you do that once and then you have to give it a full charge, but that's really cool.

01:30:28   They don't give you any recommendation. You can just plug in the pencil and

01:30:32   when you first connect the device to the iPad Pro, you get an additional icon in the batteries widget in Notification Center.

01:30:41   That's what I hoped it would be.

01:30:42   Yeah, just your pencil there and when you plug it into the iPad,

01:30:46   the icon in the widget, it gets a charging indicator

01:30:53   And you can always plug it in whenever you want. You also get an adapter in the box.

01:30:59   So it's a female-female adapter, so you can use a cable to charge the pencil instead of an iOS device.

01:31:04   And you really should do that, because when you plug in the pencil in an iOS device, I can confirm, it's kind of dangerous.

01:31:11   Yeah, it's incredibly crazy. I'm happy that they gave the connector away, and I'm really puzzled that they didn't mention this on stage.

01:31:18   because the idea of plugging that pencil into the iPad, you are begging for it to be broken.

01:31:24   Yeah, and it kind of jiggles into the connector.

01:31:29   Nope.

01:31:30   You should have you thought about maybe putting the pencil in and then holding up the iPad like a sign?

01:31:34   I did that.

01:31:36   You do when you need to protest at home, right?

01:31:41   You know one of those, I don't know if you've ever seen them, but one of those like religious

01:31:47   things in Italy, there's like a priest holding up a cross. I tried to do that with my iPad

01:31:56   and the pencil and it was really dangerous. I can't believe you actually did that with

01:31:59   something that you don't own. That is crazy. I was being careful.

01:32:04   Yes, of course you were, of course, Apple, if you're listening. We're more careful.

01:32:10   First and only time. Don't try this at home, kids.

01:32:14   surrounded by pillows.

01:32:15   - Yep, I'm so proud of you.

01:32:17   Alright, Stephen, ask some questions about the keyboard.

01:32:20   You're a typing person.

01:32:21   - So, from my perspective, as someone who,

01:32:25   I have an iPad keyboard case now,

01:32:27   I've got the Logitech Ultra Thin for the Air 2.

01:32:31   It's great.

01:32:32   I don't use it a lot.

01:32:34   And looking at this smart keyboard,

01:32:37   I wonder if it's something that I would use.

01:32:39   Like, the pencil's way more interesting to me.

01:32:42   You've got the smart keyboard Federico.

01:32:44   My big concern with it is sort of

01:32:48   from having used other keyboards like this.

01:32:50   Like if you use the Surface,

01:32:52   what is it, the Pro keyboard that they sell,

01:32:55   and have used a bunch of iPad keyboards over the years.

01:32:58   And for me it's all about the feel

01:33:00   and the travel of the keys and sort of what the experience is

01:33:04   and Federico I know you've just said it,

01:33:08   like that you are a software keyboard user for the most part.

01:33:12   So how is the smart keyboard?

01:33:14   Is it worth, you know, the extra bulk and weight

01:33:17   of carrying this thing around,

01:33:18   or is it sort of something that you think

01:33:20   a lot of people could do without?

01:33:22   - The first two days, I just hated the smart keyboard.

01:33:27   (laughing)

01:33:29   I could, I felt like a dumb monkey

01:33:33   trying to type on the smart keyboard the first two days.

01:33:36   I was too small, very little travel between the keys, when pressing the keys, I just couldn't...

01:33:42   and the layout was different, and all these differences combined, I was just going crazy.

01:33:49   The third day, I woke up, went into the kitchen, started typing on the smart keyboard, and

01:33:55   I basically almost finished my review on it.

01:33:59   So I gave it 48 hours, and then, you know, it started working for me.

01:34:06   And now I'm just loving it.

01:34:09   So here's the thing.

01:34:11   If you don't like keyboards with little travel when pressing down the keys, this is not for

01:34:18   you.

01:34:19   If you are in the camp of people who don't like the new MacBook keyboard, you're not

01:34:24   gonna like this one because it's got even less travel.

01:34:26   Yeah, and also it's not even plastic on the top, right?

01:34:29   It's like that material.

01:34:30   No, it's fabric.

01:34:31   And when you... can I give you a little demo of the sound that it makes when you slide your fingers across the keys?

01:34:37   This is a podcast, it feels like the perfect scenario.

01:34:40   Okay, so this is the sound that the smart keyboard makes when you're typing on it.

01:34:45   [

01:34:45   [Tapping]

01:34:47   Ugh.

01:34:49   And this is the sound that it makes when you're sliding your fingers across the fabric that covers the keys.

01:34:58   [Tapping]

01:35:02   Did you get that?

01:35:03   Yeah, it sounds horrible. Like it sounds like there's nothing. Like you're just slapping some fabric. That's what it sounds like.

01:35:09   It's kind of like that. So if you don't like small keyboards or very thin ones, you're not gonna like this one.

01:35:20   But for people like me, with no particular preconception on small keyboards, travel, when pressing keys, I personally don't like clicky keyboards.

01:35:33   keyboards and I realized this is like one of the worst things you could say to

01:35:39   Mac nerds. I mean on a daily basis though you're just smashing your fingers into

01:35:45   pieces of glass like you're not ever using a keyboard so anything is better in air quotes

01:35:51   than then yeah because I don't want to make judgments on what is better and

01:35:55   what is worse but anything is better right it's more travel any travel is

01:35:59   more travel. Yeah, exactly. So for me, when pressing the keys is still better than not

01:36:06   pressing anything on the screen, if I'm looking for the physical feel of pressing a key. On

01:36:14   the third day, I got very used to the Smart Keyboard, and now I can type really fast on

01:36:21   it. And the big difference here to understand is that the Smart Keyboard doubles as a cover,

01:36:28   And that's a big advantage.

01:36:30   And even if there's a... when you fold the keyboard back into the cover, it creates a

01:36:37   little ridge on the front of the cover, because there's a keyboard behind it.

01:36:42   And it's not very nice to look at, but in practice it adds some bulk to the iPad, but

01:36:50   not as much as other keyboard cases do.

01:36:54   And I feel like keyboards will see many types of keyboards like this, using the smart connector

01:37:01   to transfer data and power, will see many types of these thin covers that also have

01:37:07   a keyboard. And for me, the big thing is, when I put the smart keyboard on the iPad,

01:37:14   it is both a cover and a keyboard in a single package, I can still put the iPad Pro in my

01:37:20   bag and basically there's a gain in maybe half a centimeter which is no big deal, which

01:37:28   is not exactly like using the Logitech keyboard case which adds a ton of bulk to the iPad

01:37:33   Pro.

01:37:34   Because you have one of those as well, don't you?

01:37:36   Yes, yes.

01:37:37   Apple gave me also a Logitech Create.

01:37:40   It's a keyboard case and it's very nice.

01:37:44   The keyboard is great.

01:37:45   It's really like a MacBook keyboard.

01:37:47   It's got an Italian layout, which I really appreciate.

01:37:50   And unlike the Smart Keyboard, it has a shortcut row.

01:37:55   So you get these iOS specific shortcuts.

01:37:59   So like a home button, media controls, brightness, volume.

01:38:04   It's really nice and it's backlit.

01:38:06   It's very surprising to me that the Smart Keyboard doesn't have those shortcut keys.

01:38:12   The backlight on that Logitech One though, man, that sounds really great.

01:38:17   So that's one of the advantages of the smart connector, right? It transfers both data and

01:38:21   power from the iPad to the keyboard and vice versa. So the logic that creates has two levels

01:38:29   of backlight. It kind of dims the keys after a few seconds, then turns them off to save

01:38:36   power of course, but as soon as you press this, and if you're constantly typing, it's

01:38:41   always backlit, and it's very convenient when you're typing in the dark and you want to

01:38:46   the keys. It's very nice. The problem is I really don't like the case part of the

01:38:52   Logitech Create. It feels kind of cheap. It's plastic. It's covered in a nice

01:38:56   textured fabric, which is cool, but the case itself, it's plastic. It feels cheap

01:39:02   to me. I don't like how you get up, you know, place the iPad into the case, kind

01:39:06   of force it into the corners. I don't like how the volume buttons are

01:39:14   are covered by these contact buttons on top of it, and they have cheap stickers for plus and minus,

01:39:24   which are already coming off in my review unit. So the keyboard is excellent. The case part feels a little rushed,

01:39:31   which is too bad, because the keyboard is really nice. But, and here's the other thing that I also mentioned in the review,

01:39:39   It depends on how you're gonna use the iPad Pro. If you're gonna use the device at a desk or in an office

01:39:44   setup, if you're not gonna be traveling a lot with the iPad Pro, if it's really

01:39:48   like a desktop computer for you, and when you don't need the case you can just take the iPad,

01:39:54   you should consider the Logitech keyboard, because if your primary usage is

01:39:59   sitting down, typing on a keyboard connected to the iPad Pro,

01:40:03   it is a better physical keyboard for productivity. It's got the shortcuts,

01:40:08   it's got backlight, it's bigger, so it really feels like a MacBook keyboard.

01:40:14   And there's more travel when pressing keys, but if you're gonna travel with the iPad,

01:40:20   if you wanna take the iPad with you, and you're looking for a solution that's bought a cover and a keyboard,

01:40:26   I really recommend the Smart Keyboard. But, again, if you don't like thin keyboards,

01:40:32   and if you don't like the fact that there's little travel on the keys, then I don't know.

01:40:37   I would say my suggestion is go to an Apple Store, try the keyboard like a lot of people

01:40:41   have done with the MacBook, see if it works for you.

01:40:44   I bet there's gonna be demo units at an Apple Store with the iPad Pro and the Smart Keyboard.

01:40:49   So try that, see if it works for you, and then consider, am I gonna travel with this

01:40:53   iPad Pro a lot or am I gonna sit down most of the time?

01:40:56   So the bulk of the logic that I create is not a problem.

01:41:00   That's a question you gotta ask yourself and I would say there's gonna be many more smart

01:41:06   connector powered accessories coming out. Apple told me it's totally up to third-party

01:41:11   manufacturers to come up with ideas. They're not setting any street guidelines on the types

01:41:19   of accessories that they can create. They can go crazy. And I totally believe there's

01:41:23   going to be all sorts of keyboards and cases and covers, whatever. So maybe wait a little

01:41:29   and see what third-party companies do. That would be my advice.

01:41:33   That connector is magic.

01:41:35   Yes, it's really nice. It's not magnetic, the connector itself. So it's three pins that have to be in contact with the connector on the iPad Pro.

01:41:45   There's magnets around it. Like as usual, since the iPad 2 there's magnets on the left side.

01:41:54   So Apple uses the magnets to align the cover or the cover part of the Smart Keyboard.

01:42:02   And because they're used to align magnets on one side and on the other side, they also align the connector.

01:42:10   But the connector itself doesn't have magnets inside the connector or inside the pins.

01:42:15   It's just a point of contact. So that's a little detail worth mentioning.

01:42:21   It's interesting to me too that the connector does offer that flexibility.

01:42:26   So we've talked about keyboards, but do you know, can that connector be used for other

01:42:32   types of things?

01:42:33   So what I thought of just kind of randomly was using an iPad and an audio setup.

01:42:39   Could I sit this thing down on top of a DJ station or some sort of mixing interface and

01:42:45   transfer data to that connector or is it just keyboards?

01:42:48   Yeah, I don't know yet.

01:42:50   I also imagine the same kind of possibility, but I don't know.

01:42:54   I got no details from Apple on how much power can you transfer with the smart connector.

01:43:00   I don't have the technical details behind the requirements for the smart connector.

01:43:06   I can also imagine that would make sense for audio accessories, for audio instruments that

01:43:10   you can plug in in some way into the iPad, but I don't know.

01:43:15   Just speculation.

01:43:16   That's fair.

01:43:17   And do you think we're going to see this on, or any of the accessories really, on other

01:43:21   iPads in the future?

01:43:24   That's the question that I was also thinking about. It would make sense, right, to kind of make it a more universal kind of plugin type or

01:43:33   plug-and-play experience on any iPad. But right now it's also one of the key

01:43:39   differentiators on the iPad Pro, right? You can plug in this keyboard or you can use other accessories because it's a more, you know,

01:43:49   PC-like iPad. It can be your computer so it's more accessible. Right now it's

01:43:55   the kind of 10-pole feature that's only on the iPad Pro but maybe

01:43:59   down the road it'll become more universal across iOS. So I don't know. For

01:44:04   sure I don't see it happening on the iPhone. I don't know, I just cannot picture

01:44:09   an iPhone connected to a physical keyboard. But on the iPad Air 2, I don't know.

01:44:15   Well with a lot of the accessories, like the ones that you guys mentioned about like an

01:44:20   audio interface or something, I guess you've just got to consider why would it make more

01:44:23   sense than just plugging it into the Lightning port, right?

01:44:25   I think because you could just plug an iPad into an audio thing using the Lightning port.

01:44:30   So I guess it's about where's the, what is this connector supposed to be used for?

01:44:35   What type of information can it provide?

01:44:37   So I bet it doesn't provide as much data or power as a Lightning port can.

01:44:41   Yeah, that's a good point.

01:44:43   Yeah, the big difference there is if you use the smart connector with another accessory,

01:44:47   you can also charge the iPad at the same time.

01:44:49   So there are benefits, but it's like wondering what the two can do and how they can work

01:44:54   in conjunction or against each other.

01:44:58   One last question on the accessories.

01:44:59   Are Apple still making a standard smart cover?

01:45:02   Yes, but I didn't get one.

01:45:04   I'm curious to see how it works because the smart keyboard, you cannot... so you get two

01:45:11   Type and watch. So type is the physical keyboard and watch is when you fold the keyboard into the back of the iPad

01:45:18   so you can use it as a stand to watch movies or play games.

01:45:21   But you cannot fold the smart keyboard to prop up the iPad to type on the software keyboard as you can do with the smart cover.

01:45:32   It's basically the almost flat position, like a 20 degree angle that you can do on the smart cover.

01:45:38   the Smart Cover. I believe the Smart Cover still has the same two angles as usual, so

01:45:46   type on the software keyboard and watch, but I couldn't test one because it didn't give

01:45:50   me one. So I'll go to the Apple Store as soon as it's available and try to get one.

01:45:57   So big question. Are you going to be using this? Are you going to be buying one? Is this

01:46:01   your iPad now?

01:46:03   Yes, this is my iPad, I'm gonna upgrade to an iPad Pro, I'm gonna get the same model,

01:46:08   128, WiFi and cellular, and I just, I feel like everything I've done on iOS so far, trying

01:46:17   to get work done for the past three years on iOS, and trying to use the iPad as my only

01:46:22   computer really for the past year and a half, maybe two years, I feel like everything got

01:46:27   me to this point where I gotta make a decision, am I going all in with the iPad or not?

01:46:32   And it's only natural after I've seen how iOS 9 and multitasking works on the iPad Pro and the kind of performance gains that I get

01:46:40   and the screen

01:46:42   Seeing more content and using two apps at the same time picture in picture is amazing. The speakers are amazing

01:46:49   I feel like this is what I want and not because there's an expectation from people or from Apple

01:46:56   You know on me to be liking this because I get a lot of people saying yeah, of course Federico

01:47:01   it's gonna like this. But it really works in practice for me because at the end of the day

01:47:07   what I need to do here is get work done and make money, you know, with my job. So I have no

01:47:14   particular interest in appeasing other people, you know. Yeah, yeah, I like it. So are you happy now?

01:47:20   I need to get work done on this thing and using it for a week and I have that crazy schedule. I've

01:47:29   been using the iPad Pro like 15 hours each day to get a good feel of it in a week. And

01:47:35   I feel like I've seen enough of iOS and of using it in practice that I can comfortably

01:47:42   say this is the iPad I want and this is what I want to buy, this is what I want to use.

01:47:48   So my conclusion after eight days of iPad Pro is this is my new iPad and I'm going to

01:47:55   buy one.

01:47:57   What about the portability thing?

01:47:58   Do you see yourself maybe at some point going the route that I expect, which is that you

01:48:03   will get a smaller iPad for the beach?

01:48:05   No, Myke.

01:48:06   Let's wait until the summer.

01:48:08   This isn't over until the summer.

01:48:09   Myke, I'm sorry, but it's just not happening.

01:48:12   It's not over, man.

01:48:13   It's not over until the summer.

01:48:14   I can't imagine.

01:48:15   I guess you could use the iPad as one of those tanning mirror things, right?

01:48:20   You're sitting there on the beach, get yourself a nice little tan.

01:48:24   It's gonna look great, Federica.

01:48:26   You're gonna be real brown this summer.

01:48:28   - Oh, real brown, okay.

01:48:30   - Get the silver one so you can just flip it over

01:48:32   and give yourself a nice little brown.

01:48:34   - Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:48:35   We'll see, we'll see, Myke.

01:48:37   But I don't believe so.

01:48:39   - So I think your conclusion makes a lot of sense.

01:48:42   If anyone is doing work on an iPad,

01:48:46   I think the iPad Pro is just full of upsides.

01:48:48   But what about users who are maybe more like me

01:48:52   where I get my job done on a Mac,

01:48:55   But my iPad is sort of that secondary role of casual gaming, reading, browsing, social media, that sort of stuff.

01:49:02   So what about me? What should I do?

01:49:06   So that's the key difference. If you're not using the iPad as your

01:49:12   primary computer,

01:49:14   the variables that you got to consider change. So you're no longer looking at power or

01:49:21   or iOS 9 multitasking. You're looking at size and you're looking at price and

01:49:27   you're looking at comfort when using the iPad for those types of activities.

01:49:33   So you have to consider the trade-offs, their important changes. So am I going to

01:49:41   hand over the iPad to my kid who's probably going to have problems using the

01:49:46   iPad Pro instead of an iPad Mini or an iPad Air? Am I okay with spending quite a bit of

01:49:53   money to get an iPad Pro when the only thing I'm going to do is watch Netflix and play

01:49:58   Alto's Adventure? I feel like I cannot make this decision for readers. I can only give

01:50:09   you this advice. The iPad Pro, I believe, is called Pro because it's meant for work.

01:50:15   doesn't mean that it's not better for movies or for games or the speakers because it is better.

01:50:21   In my personal preference it is much better to see a bigger movie or have richer, louder music.

01:50:29   Yeah, you go back to your bigger screen argument from earlier on.

01:50:32   Yes. But that's my personal preference and it's kind of, for me, it's kind of a nice consequence

01:50:40   of the primary cause, which is this is better for work and it's also better for entertainment.

01:50:48   But if for you work is out of the equation, I would say consider these other variables.

01:50:55   Size, price, you know, do I really need all this power? Because otherwise you'd just be fine with

01:51:02   with the iPad Air 2, if you don't really need all those other features of the Pro, it depends

01:51:10   on how much you want to spend and how comfortable you are with a bigger device when it's not

01:51:16   used for multitasking and work, basically.

01:51:19   So Steven, are you going to get one?

01:51:20   I'm going to give it a shot.

01:51:23   I don't want to say that I'm going to do it and fall in love with it.

01:51:27   I don't know.

01:51:28   like the Air 2, like almost everything about it.

01:51:32   The idea of a bigger screen making the media stuff better

01:51:37   is really intriguing to me, 'cause I do watch,

01:51:40   I watch a lot of stuff on my iPad,

01:51:42   and you talked about, we didn't talk about it here,

01:51:44   but in your review you talk about picture in picture

01:51:46   being really good, and I do a lot of research and stuff

01:51:50   on the iPad where I'm watching a keynote or watching

01:51:53   some sort of video and taking notes,

01:51:55   and that sort of work I think would really benefit from it.

01:51:58   But on the flip side, I do use it a lot on the couch. I use it a lot in bed reading at night.

01:52:02   And you know, maybe it's not as good of a fit there. I just don't know.

01:52:07   But I'm willing to give it a shot. So I'll be checking it out. I'll be ordering one.

01:52:13   I'm definitely going to do the pencil. I'm not sold on the keyboard. I want to try it in person.

01:52:17   I figure if I like the iPad Pro, I can always add the keyboard later.

01:52:22   I think the pencil is much more interesting from like a reviewing perspective to experience that.

01:52:27   But whether it sticks or not, I'm not sure.

01:52:31   I guess we'll kind of see where that goes.

01:52:33   - As I've said on the show many times recently,

01:52:37   since iOS 9, I've been using my iPad more and more for work

01:52:40   and there are a couple of things that I still feel

01:52:43   like I need to be able to turn it into a device

01:52:45   that I'm looking to use more seriously

01:52:47   and one of them is a keyboard.

01:52:49   I just like the ability of seeing the full screen

01:52:52   in front of me and typing rather than typing

01:52:54   on the actual screen itself, right,

01:52:55   so I get more of the view.

01:52:57   So obviously the smart keyboard provides that and I really like the idea of it being portable

01:53:02   and always there and part of the whole case, part of the package, right, so I'm not having

01:53:05   to throw another thing in my bag.

01:53:08   So I will try the keyboard.

01:53:10   I'm definitely going to get the pencil because it's in my wheelhouse and I really do believe

01:53:14   that this could be a better iPad for me and could really replace my MacBook Pro in all

01:53:20   instances other than when I'm travelling for long periods of time because I like to have

01:53:24   something that I can edit audio on, right, just in case I need it because sometimes

01:53:28   I do edit shows when I travel. But for work, like when I go to my co-working

01:53:32   space or whenever I'm just not at my Mac, when I'm not over in another country, I

01:53:37   can see myself wanting to use the iPad Pro for that and that makes a lot more

01:53:40   sense for me. Like I'm trying to stay away from my iMac for the majority of

01:53:45   time when I'm not recording, so I'm not sitting at this desk for 15 hours a day.

01:53:49   And I think that the iPad Pro could really help with that as the iPad Air is

01:53:54   taking it a big step in the right direction for that. So I'm looking

01:53:59   forward to trying this out and I will be getting one as soon as I can.

01:54:02   Nice. You sold us on it Federico, you did the job.

01:54:07   Well I'm glad. I think I made a good case for people who need it for work and

01:54:16   maybe people who don't need it for work and I'm really curious to see what you

01:54:20   guys do with your iPad Pro and if you stick to it after you use it for a while or if you

01:54:26   go back to the iPad Air 2, I'm sure we'll have plenty of follow-up for the next few

01:54:32   episodes and thankfully we'll have Steven taking care of the follow-up for us. So we're

01:54:38   in a good position guys, we're all gonna use the iPad Pro, we're all gonna be pros. It's

01:54:42   gonna be the era of the pros, that's what I'm saying right now.

01:54:48   I don't think we can go any further than that. If you would like to get in touch with us,

01:54:51   you want to send in feedback, there's a few ways you can do that. You can find a link

01:54:54   to send us an email and also find our show notes over at relay.fm/connected/65. There'll

01:55:00   be links to some Apple pages and also Federico's reviews as well, you can find them there.

01:55:05   If you want to read Federico's work on his lovely website, you can go over to maxstories.net

01:55:09   and you can also find Federico on Twitter, he is @vittici, V I T I C C I. Stephen writes

01:55:14   over at 512pixels.net and I'm sure that he'll have some of his own thoughts about the iPad Pro once

01:55:19   he gets one in his hands so 512pixels.net for that and Stephen is on Twitter too he is @ismh

01:55:25   and I am on Twitter I am @imike I M Y K E I don't write any of my thoughts anywhere else but I do

01:55:30   podcast them in many many places you can find those shows along with this show and all of the

01:55:34   other great shows on Relay FM over at relay.fm thanks again to our sponsors this week Braintree,

01:55:40   Kasper and Igloo and we'll be back next time. Until then, say goodbye guys.

01:55:45   Arrivederci. Adios.