0:00:00[Music]
0:00:07From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode number 42. Today's show is brought to you by
0:00:13Lynda.com where you can instantly stream thousands of courses created by industry experts,
0:00:18hover, simplified domain management and OmniFocus. Now on the Apple Watch.
0:00:23My name is Myke Hurley and I'm joined by Mr. Stephen Hackett. Hello Stephen Hackett.
0:00:29Hello Michael Hurley. How are you? I'm doing well. I should start the show with a thank you
0:00:36to my wife. It is our wedding anniversary and I am here recording a podcast with you instead of
0:00:42on a date with her. So she gets a high five from the connected nation, the international connected
0:00:48fan base. Thank you, Ms Hackett. Yes, but we're without Federico this week. No, yes,
0:00:56We should have mentioned that as well. We do have no Federica. It's just just me and Stephen
0:01:00However, we do have another accent joining us a little bit later on Federica's on the beach for a little bit of a holiday. So
0:01:06He's having fun fun in the Sun as the kids say I think it's was it Republic Day or something
0:01:13Yes, it's when Italy won its independence from the British. I don't think that is I
0:01:19Don't think that's how it works
0:01:22Like listen, you know if we want to start talking about empires you want to look at the Roman Empire and yeah
0:01:27We can go down that whole route if you want to yeah, really everybody is
0:01:30Gaining their freedom from Federico's people
0:01:33So we're gonna do some some follow-up so a
0:01:42Friend of the I'm gonna say friend of the network because I can do that
0:01:47friend of the network
0:01:50You say don't mm-hmm
0:01:52(laughing)
0:01:53- Jamie Phelps, JXPX777.
0:01:56- 11.38.
0:01:57- That's a different movie.
0:01:59Wrote on his web blog about his Sony Ericsson T637.
0:02:05- Oh, look at that bad boy.
0:02:08- Yeah, I remember, do you remember these phones?
0:02:11They were awesome.
0:02:12A friend of mine had one and I was super jealous.
0:02:15So he writes on his blog about us talking
0:02:18about someone else's idea of calendar based
0:02:21not disturb. So if you remember this from a couple weeks ago the the general idea
0:02:25is that if I'm in a meeting my phone should know that because of a calendar
0:02:29invite and it should put itself and do not disturb you know if I set it up to do so.
0:02:32And turns out these Sony Ericsson phones did this way back in the day so not
0:02:40necessarily a new idea but I still think it's a really good idea. What do you
0:02:46think? Do you still want this? I do still want that idea. I used to have a phone
0:02:51that was kind of like this. I had like a Sony Ericsson Walkman phone. It was my
0:02:57last phone before I got an iPhone, before the iPhone came out, and it was black and
0:03:02orange and it had the... I don't know how... I don't know why they called it a Walkman
0:03:07phone. You could put music on it, like you could put music on basically any phone
0:03:10at that point. Right, the rocker kind of brought that into being a
0:03:15little bit. Well, we had more... we had phones here that could do that stuff before
0:03:18that was just you could plug that thing into iTunes like that's right there was
0:03:23like I had some Sony software that I could basically put music onto my onto
0:03:29my Sony Walkman phone I used to do it had radio on it and stuff as well you
0:03:33know it was pretty cool if if people want to see a link to jxpx777's
0:03:40blog post where could they go Myke oh they could go to relay.fm/connected/42
0:03:47The sound you heard was Myke scrolling back to the top of the document to see
0:03:51what episode number this is. It was actually, I swiped to the left with a
0:03:57four finger gesture to go back to the CMS to see it in big bold text. Nice
0:04:02that's a life hack that only really a handful of us can do. So we have some
0:04:09we have some nose tapping follow-up and like the browser history and like many
0:04:15other things over the three years of us doing a show together I am implementing
0:04:21a end of nose tapping follow-up I am instigating the reincarnation of the
0:04:27nose-dipping follow-up now so short-lived so Peter wrote in and and
0:04:34Peter apparently lives where does he say in Michigan I think so Michigan is in
0:04:38the very north part of the country where it touches Canada it's very cold they
0:04:43have like I don't know like moose walking around lots of snow and ice I'm
0:04:49very unlike the weather we have here that's hot very like the weather that
0:04:53you have in London which is I think just wet all the time so Peter writes in to
0:04:58say I've been nose tapping on the iPhone since day one and so is everyone around
0:05:03me because when you're outside during I love this eternal Michigan winter you
0:05:08have to keep your gloves on it's not new with the Apple watch and it's not weird
0:05:11and he said he was frustrated with us for not thinking about this and
0:05:15I would like to apologize to the people of Michigan and really all winter states
0:05:19But uh you know if it's 10 degrees out like he says it is then I think I would probably nose tap too if it
0:05:26Came down to it better than than taking a glove off to take care of something something simple I suppose
0:05:31So I think Myke I think what you're gonna need to do is
0:05:35We're gonna need to put one of us in like some sort of large
0:05:38Like a meat freezer and see if you're more prone to nose tap under cold conditions
0:05:43I will notice half under all conditions my friend
0:05:48Well your conditions we got to find somebody who hasn't nose tapped and I admitted to it last week again like Peter
0:05:56Under circumstances that were not normal. You're just doing it walking around like a normal human being I do at home
0:06:02well, I mean
0:06:06Privacy of your home. I know it's one thing. Have you done it in public you've done in public? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah
0:06:11It's like I talked to my watch in public
0:06:14Yeah, I can't
0:06:17I don't go crazy with it. But like I will I will whisper the occasional thing, you know
0:06:22Like replied to a text message or something. I'll totally do that
0:06:25Yeah, I do wish
0:06:29I do wish Siri could talk back or at least it could be an option for it to talk back
0:06:34So, you know, if you do see on your watch, it just gives you text back and it's weird not hearing the device
0:06:40Respond to you. Have you found that sort of strange or off-putting?
0:06:43Yeah, especially when it gives me some sort of funny response
0:06:48Yeah, you're just reading it. It's like yeah, it's like it's not funny when you're not delivering it
0:06:53Like I know there's not an awful lot of comedic delivery
0:06:56From Siri, but I don't know if just feels weird to just be reading jokes back from the computer robot
0:07:03I don't know. Robot or not huh? Yeah that's a different network. Yeah so thank you Peter
0:07:11for writing in. We wish you all the best and you know maybe maybe global warming will take
0:07:19care of you. So that's all my follow Myke. It's short and sweet this week. On that happy
0:07:26note should we take our first break for this week? That'd be great. This week's episode
0:07:30is
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0:09:50So we have a little bit of connected QA as topic zero. So you want to
0:09:58tackle this first one? Because I don't have a good answer for the first one.
0:10:03Neither do I. So this is from @zavaloth on Twitter. If computers didn't exist,
0:10:08what would you guys do for a living? I guess now right if you ask me right now
0:10:14I'd probably try and get into radio. Yeah I mean radio pre-exists to computers so
0:10:21I think intellectually your answer works. I think that's probably what
0:10:25I'd go for. Other than that I would I don't know maybe theater or something
0:10:32now like I've never I've never been an actor of any kind but I figured now I'm
0:10:38I'm too used to doing things that entertainment, you know?
0:10:43I'm too used to creating entertainment,
0:10:44so I'd probably have to try and create something like that
0:10:47again to be creative, and that's probably the only way
0:10:52I could do something like that, I think.
0:10:53- Yeah, it's hard intellectually,
0:10:55because you're saying that knowing what you do now,
0:10:57but the question doesn't specify,
0:10:59do computers suddenly go away?
0:11:01And so now you're like, oh, I gotta find something else
0:11:03to do, or like, who you are has been shaped
0:11:06by the fact that you grew up with technology,
0:11:08So it's hard to, it's a very tricky question.
0:11:11Very tricky.
0:11:13My best answer is something with my hands.
0:11:15So like thoughts I had was like a bicycle building,
0:11:18a repair.
0:11:19- You could play a trumpet.
0:11:21- I could play a trumpet.
0:11:22I'm not very musical.
0:11:23But like I, again, like to have computers disappear
0:11:29to they never exist, like I really enjoyed my time
0:11:33as like a hardware technician.
0:11:34And so I think doing something with my hands,
0:11:36taking things apart, putting them back together,
0:11:37sort of repair or construction I think would be would get me by just fine it's
0:11:45good it's a good question I like that there was intellectual ambiguity in it
0:11:49it's a good one okay and the next question comes from I'm gonna say eaten
0:11:55eaten Schulman on Twitter what watch app do you wish existed native ones really
0:12:06Is that the best you have for us?
0:12:07- I really do.
0:12:08So I've written about watch faces and glances on 512.
0:12:13I haven't written about the apps yet,
0:12:14but I'm really only using like three of them.
0:12:16And there's not one that like,
0:12:18I really wish I had that I don't have.
0:12:20I just, to me, the watch does what it does and that's fine,
0:12:25but there's not like a gaping hole in my watch workflow.
0:12:28I don't know. What about you?
0:12:30- My biggest one is Google apps,
0:12:32because I like to use Google apps on my phone,
0:12:34because I like to receive transit directions.
0:12:37That's my main thing.
0:12:38I've been hearing a lot of people
0:12:38talk about Apple Maps recently.
0:12:40Fundamentally, the main reason I cannot use Apple Maps
0:12:43is because I need transit directions.
0:12:46And Google, and the reason that I like to use one app
0:12:49for walking and transit directions
0:12:52is because I like to know how long it's gonna take me
0:12:54to get from one place to another.
0:12:55Like, I could go to a different app,
0:12:57and I've tried other apps like CityMapper and stuff,
0:12:59I don't like them.
0:13:00I like Google Maps, it's very easy.
0:13:02and it also has a better database and stuff. I just like going to Google Maps and doing all of that.
0:13:07At the moment, then when I get off the train or whatever and then I want to walk places,
0:13:13I go to Apple Maps and enter the location in Apple Maps because I love, love the Apple Maps
0:13:21integration on the Apple Watch. I think it might be my favorite feature. Like the tapping stuff.
0:13:25Tapping the beep beep beep beep beep.
0:13:28It's so good man. It's just so good.
0:13:30Yeah, I like it too.
0:13:32because my main thing is like I still haven't 100% worked out what the taps mean but like it just
0:13:37makes me look at my like I'm basically no oh I better look at my wrist you know and I really
0:13:43really love it I've been whenever I've been walking around London a few times over the last
0:13:46couple of weeks like just going to places I've never been before or like just taking some
0:13:51directions that I've never taken before and the Apple watch has just made it so easy because I
0:13:56always hated like walking around the streets with my phone out like I just don't like that
0:14:01Especially when you have a big phone as well,
0:14:04it's like, come with something, keep taking it
0:14:05out of your pocket, put it away, keep that pocket put away.
0:14:07- Myke was wrong.
0:14:07- It's frustrating.
0:14:08Nope, Myke was right because now I have the best
0:14:10of both worlds.
0:14:11- Yeah, you hear this, this is my six plus.
0:14:14That's right.
0:14:15- So I'm really, I really, really love it,
0:14:18but I would like to see Google Maps,
0:14:19but I don't think we'll get that until the native SDK
0:14:22because it's not gonna be good enough.
0:14:25- I think there's, I think that's a good example,
0:14:28maybe the best example I can think of,
0:14:30an app that maybe they're waiting until native apps. Maybe they're saying hey, you know what watch kit
0:14:35We can't do what we want to do. So we're just gonna
0:14:37Gonna sit it out
0:14:39but I do like the Apple Maps watch integration I
0:14:42drive a good bit during the week and some place, you know sometimes to
0:14:46To places that I don't know where they are
0:14:49so, you know use directions around town and and just the tapping and like be able to
0:14:52Just glance at my watch instead of like fishing my phone out of the cup holder
0:14:56To see where my turn is and that sort of thing is really great. I know not everybody
0:15:00Likes it but some people on Twitter talking about that. But I really do like that it that it mirrors what's on the phone and
0:15:08You know, there's rumors that I was 9 will bring transit directions. Maybe maybe your answer will be
0:15:14You know will come in a different form than you expect
0:15:18Yeah, and I'm I have heard that but I reserve judgment
0:15:25because I'm just I'm just not sure about it yet because Apple Maps walking
0:15:32directions can still be super wonky so I don't know how I feel about transit
0:15:37especially because we have complex transit here because we have lots of it
0:15:41you know so we have buses and trains and tubes and like National Rail over ground
0:15:47and transit has to be exactly right like yeah you can't mess that up that has to
0:15:50be bang on and in theory you can make it exactly right because at least in the UK
0:15:54Transport for London holds all of that data and they can license it in one big
0:16:00chunk. So we should actually be one of the easier places I think to get a lot
0:16:04of that especially in London then maybe some other cities would be in the world
0:16:09but that's what I expect anyway because I know people license it to make apps.
0:16:12If that's a that's fair it'll be interesting to see what Apple does with
0:16:16that and you know trains it's not really a big thing for me here but I could see
0:16:20that being a really frustrating, you know, feature not to have if you if you depend
0:16:26on it. So topic 0.5 is that our friends at Microsoft have made another
0:16:36acquisition. They sure have. They bought Wunderlist. Yeah, which is a little
0:16:43surprising to me initially but you know upon thinking about it it makes a lot of
0:16:46since and Federica wrote about it I think today or yesterday about that they
0:16:50acquired I see miss actually Vunderlist right not wonder list I just realized
0:16:55you live closer Germany than I do yeah cuz the company's name is six
0:16:58Wunderkinde because you know W's are pronounced that way in Germany yeah so I
0:17:04assumed it's it's Wunderlist and we've been calling it Wunderlist this whole
0:17:08time so I apologize to six Wunderkinde and now Microsoft this is like
0:17:15- Microsoft.
0:17:15(laughing)
0:17:18- Get out, get out now.
0:17:20- You're gonna be alone.
0:17:21- Fine, I will take it.
0:17:23I can do it. - It's monologue.
0:17:25- I think this is genius.
0:17:27This is a genius move.
0:17:29This is like, Microsoft right now
0:17:32doing some really exciting stuff.
0:17:33They are strengthening their cross platform strategy.
0:17:36They are really digging deep on like making
0:17:39the Office ecosystem, I guess it would be, kind of,
0:17:43like stronger and stronger.
0:17:44'Cause I mean, they bought a Compley
0:17:46and turned that into an office product effectively,
0:17:48they turned it into Outlook.
0:17:50But Sunrise is still Sunrise.
0:17:53And it looks like at least for the time being,
0:17:56Wunderlist is going to remain Wunderlist.
0:17:59I'm going all in on that now.
0:18:00And that makes sense, right?
0:18:03Because a Compley didn't really have a brand behind it.
0:18:07It was new and I don't think a lot of people really used it.
0:18:10But these two, like Sunrise and Wunderlist, they do.
0:18:14definitely do and plus there is less of a fit because Microsoft don't have a
0:18:19office calendar app and an office task app so maybe in six months time they
0:18:24will rebrand them with these new you know we'll get like Microsoft agenda and
0:18:29Microsoft tasks you know as brands and they'll sit in the office suite but I
0:18:33think this is genius they're acquiring smart young nimble companies that are
0:18:38experimenting and doing exciting stuff rather than trying to build this stuff
0:18:41internally. I think this is a genius move and it makes them stronger and stronger.
0:18:45It makes them much more exciting and it's that you know they're buying
0:18:49companies that have strong iOS presences, strong Android presences, so they don't
0:18:54have to build three times. I just think this new Microsoft that they've
0:19:00been like showing over the last few months, I just continue to be more and
0:19:04more excited by it. I totally agree and I think you're right it helps round out
0:19:10their sort of consumer stuff because they do have made me outlook and exchange
0:19:14just calendaring but not the way sunrise does and you could do to-do list in
0:19:18outlook and exchange but not the way that that Thunderless does so it's it's
0:19:22them moving more to the consumer market you know there's been a lot of talk
0:19:25about like Google's apps on iOS we're talking about that today but I think
0:19:30Microsoft you know they're doing a lot again cross-platform you know going
0:19:34looking outside their own OS's to bring services and applications
0:19:40to a bigger market and that obviously makes a lot of sense because
0:19:44Windows Phone is really little. But yeah I hope that they continue to
0:19:49let these guys do good work. It's a great app. We named it our the best
0:19:52shared to-do list on the suite setup I think last year. And so yeah really
0:19:58happy for those guys and we'll keep an eye on it but I think
0:20:02I think Microsoft can handle this and handle it well.
0:20:06Good times.
0:20:07- So yeah, this is one of those Wall Street Journal
0:20:11reported stories that I think they said 100 million
0:20:13or something, and then I put it in the document
0:20:16and then before, in between me putting it in the document
0:20:19and I was starting to show it from the list confirmed it,
0:20:21or Six Month at Kinda confirmed it.
0:20:23So congratulations to them.
0:20:25Like, that's a lot of money.
0:20:27(laughs)
0:20:29That's a lot of money.
0:20:31Would you sell to Microsoft for $100 million?
0:20:34Me?
0:20:35I mean, all I can sell is half of Relay and 5V pixels,
0:20:40100% of that.
0:20:41I don't know if that's really in Microsoft's wheelhouse.
0:20:45Well, I mean, if Microsoft would like
0:20:47to give us $100 million, I think we would definitely
0:20:49entertain the idea.
0:20:51I think so.
0:20:51I mean--
0:20:53I would create a Microsoft podcast for $100 million.
0:20:58I would sell out for $100 million.
0:21:00I just want to put that on the table.
0:21:01- Yeah, see now we're gonna get emails
0:21:02from people who want a Microsoft podcast.
0:21:04- Well, they can have one.
0:21:05They just have to give me $100 million.
0:21:07That is my price for a Microsoft podcast, $100 million.
0:21:12- We should just move on.
0:21:14- Move on to receiving $100 million?
0:21:15This week's episode is brought to you by OmniFocus.
0:21:22And when we come back from this,
0:21:23we're gonna be talking to Russell Wojtowicz
0:21:25about Google Photos.
0:21:27I just love OmniFocus. My life is in OmniFocus. Without OmniFocus I don't think I could get
0:21:35through a day anymore. We have some huge projects that we're working on right now and I keep
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0:21:59I do this on my iPhone, I do this on my Mac, I love the whole ecosystem there.
0:22:05There's been a universal update recently for the iOS apps and now the iPad and
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0:22:43It's great and the iPhone's got it, the Mac's got it, the iPad's got it. I love
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0:22:50for the Apple Watch. So one of the things that I've been doing now is I check what
0:22:54tasks I have on my Apple Watch. I can add items to my inbox just by dictation in
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0:23:02walking down the street and I have that idea that I have to throw in there. It
0:23:05comes for free with the universal version of OmniFocus. It's just waiting for
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0:23:19get a glance, no pun intended, of what you need to take care of. They have a glance,
0:23:23and they have an app and I have them both. I like the glance as well because it tells me the next
0:23:26upcoming thing that I have. You can even check things off right from within the Apple Watch app
0:23:31as well. Continuity picks up the last perspective, context or project that you were looking at on
0:23:36your iPhone. So it's make sure that you're always where you need to be. I just love it. This is just
0:23:42something else on top of the system that I already love so much. And the awesome people at OmniGroup,
0:23:47I don't even know how they did this, have created a pretty much full functioning demo of OmniFocus
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0:24:07up with an amazing support team and they are so confident that you are going to
0:24:11love OmniFocus. They even offer a 30-day return policy. This is not something you
0:24:16see a lot of iOS app developers do at all but Omni make it happen. So go and
0:24:19check out OmniFocus today go to omni group.com/omnifocus. Thank you so
0:24:24much to the Omni Group for supporting this show and all of Relay FM. So I'm so
0:24:29happy that we are now joined by Mr. Russell Ivanovich of Shifty Jelly,
0:24:33developer of the award-winning pocket cast. Hi Russell, how are you?
0:24:37Hi Myke, I'm just here fondling my new award. Yes, you're in San Francisco right
0:24:42now, right? I am indeed. I'm finally almost in your time zone.
0:24:46Well, I don't know if it works like that. I think you're about the same distance away.
0:24:52You're closer to me. Damn it. I fly across the world to try and get closer to your time
0:24:56zone and I just fail. You overshot it just a tad. So congratulations, if anybody doesn't
0:25:01know, PocketCasts was awarded a material design award in the inaugural material design awards
0:25:08at Google I/O. So congratulations. Why thank you, and if anyone doesn't know, probably
0:25:14Chris and Phil really deserve the
0:25:16Congratulations for that award. Although I did help just a tiny bit. Thanks. I'm gonna take someone to credit
0:25:22Yeah, okay. It's it's all me. I don't know who anyone else works for a team. It's a team of one
0:25:29It's well deserved. It's
0:25:31Parkhouses is beautiful and I've been playing with Android a little bit recently and it's
0:25:36It's kind of like my go-to app when I think about material design in my brain. So good job. Good job
0:25:44Occupying my my mind space if you will. Oh, thank you
0:25:48so
0:25:51We thought we'd cover Google Photos today, so we have a course because we have to
0:25:56Yes, because we are the photo management podcast. Well, I gotta stop you if you cover this and it shuts down
0:26:02I'm holding you personally responsible
0:26:04Curse if the curse can overcome Google Photos then
0:26:08Then we're doing something very right or very wrong
0:26:12So at Google I/O now last week
0:26:15Google announced Google Photos which more or less and I want to get into this a little bit more or less is what Google Plus
0:26:22did with photos, but now it's sort of unbundled uncoupled because I think the Google Plus brand is
0:26:28not in great standing
0:26:30So so kind of
0:26:34High level what is what's Google doing in this in the space Russell?
0:26:40Okay, so pre Google Photos you had something called Google+ Photos which like you say was
0:26:45weirdly kind of embedded with the whole Google+ social network and I've been using that I
0:26:50think for at least a year now just to, it does the auto upload thing, all your photos
0:26:54go up, you know they're all there, it creates weird little stories out of them and does
0:26:58animated gifs and stuff.
0:27:00So I guess the new bit is they've broken it out into its own separate app and they've
0:27:05They've added some really cool, I guess, I don't know what you call it, categorization
0:27:10and it recognizes people, it recognizes places and it does all of this without you having
0:27:16to lift a finger.
0:27:17So I was one of those users that used to go into iPhoto and say, "Yes, this is me and
0:27:20this is my wife and we went here and try and geotag on my photos and all that."
0:27:25So this does all of that for you, which is just amazing.
0:27:30Just I mean, we're going to jump around a little bit now because I have a question that
0:27:33I've been meaning to ask someone and I can ask you.
0:27:36I'm uploading photos to Google Photos
0:27:38and I'll talk about that in a minute.
0:27:39And it hasn't done any face detection though.
0:27:41Do I need to do something?
0:27:43- No, it's just magical.
0:27:44So it doesn't know the names of the people.
0:27:47So basically if I look at mine,
0:27:48I see the people that I've taken the photos of most.
0:27:51So my kids are number one and two.
0:27:53And then there's myself and then there's my wife
0:27:55and there's a few other people, you know,
0:27:56I regularly stalk and take photos of like Philip.
0:28:00And it doesn't know who those people are,
0:28:01but it knows every single photo that they're in
0:28:03and it just kind of auto-categorizes it.
0:28:05So I'll give you a creepy example.
0:28:07Someone was asking me for a photo of Philip the other day.
0:28:09You know, they're like,
0:28:10"Oh, we have to have a photo of Phil."
0:28:11So I just went in there, I clicked on his face,
0:28:13and it literally showed me every photo
0:28:15that Philip's ever been in.
0:28:16I could find the one I wanted and send that off.
0:28:19- Where in the UI is that exactly?
0:28:21- Yeah, this is the weird part.
0:28:23So I couldn't find it for the first 30 minutes.
0:28:24It's in the search button.
0:28:26So the second you hit search, you get people,
0:28:28I think you get places and you get categories,
0:28:30then you can just free text search as well.
0:28:32Yeah, I only have places and things.
0:28:34Maybe it needs more data, I don't know,
0:28:35but I don't know people yet.
0:28:36But anyway, that's an aside that nobody else needs to hear.
0:28:39So there is some limits to what you can put in, right?
0:28:44'Cause it's unlimited and limited, is my understanding.
0:28:47It's kind of a bit peculiar in the way
0:28:49that that's broken down.
0:28:51Well, I guess if you use an iPhone 6 or a 6 Plus,
0:28:53it's effectively unlimited.
0:28:55You know, you have an eight megapixel camera
0:28:56that is unlimited up to 16 megapixel,
0:28:59I think 1080p is the video limit. So that's all the iPhone takes as well. So even someone like me who has
0:29:04Wink wink does not just slightly better camera on my phone in the s6
0:29:08It is it is honestly bad. We won't get into that today
0:29:12This is not why we invited you onto this show, yeah, I got that in there didn't I? Thank you Samsung for my check later
0:29:21No, so that takes 16 megapixels photos and it can take 4k video
0:29:25So assuming you go the free route, it will actually down sample that 4K video down to
0:29:301080p.
0:29:31But I'm one of those people that pays, I think it's $12 a year to get, I want to say 100
0:29:36gigabytes of storage.
0:29:37So the cool thing about that, I'm hoping this still works the same way, is when you go over
0:29:41those limits, that's the only thing that counts against your storage.
0:29:44So I have about 120 gig worth of stuff in there, but I'm only being, I think, allocated
0:29:51for about 50 of it.
0:29:52Yeah, that makes sense to me now why, like what it says my allocation is seems way lower
0:29:59than, that you've just made sense to me because my allocation is some really small number
0:30:03but I know I have gigabytes of photos in there at the moment and it's like, you're like 500
0:30:07megabytes.
0:30:08I'm like, I don't understand what's happening here.
0:30:10Yeah, so it's only the ones that go over that limit and those limits used to be, they used
0:30:14to have the same thing, they were just far lower.
0:30:16I think originally it was, I want to say 2048 pixels across and the videos were, I don't
0:30:21I don't know, maybe 720p or something,
0:30:23but they've upped both of those.
0:30:25- So I decided that I was gonna kind of go in with this
0:30:30and just upload some photos.
0:30:32'Cause I saw the presentation
0:30:33and I thought it looked really interesting.
0:30:35Because there isn't really anything about Apple's solution
0:30:39that really made me wanna jump.
0:30:43Like there just wasn't anything there for me
0:30:45that I thought was compelling enough.
0:30:47Like I could already get to my photos,
0:30:49I have them on Dropbox.
0:30:50I don't ever really look through them enough that that would be the main
0:30:54reason because that kind of seems to be the main reason is you can have all of
0:30:57your photos wherever you want them. I kind of have never really needed that.
0:31:01It's never really been a massive thing for me. I always looked for other stuff
0:31:04so like when I was using Everpix I liked the flashback features and some of
0:31:09the categorization stuff that they did so it was fun to use that but my Dropbox
0:31:12solution has done a pretty good job and you can get apps that can let you turn
0:31:16Dropbox into like a like you know can get apps that put like a viewer in front
0:31:20of Dropbox kind of thing that we've spoken about on the show before. But I saw the stuff
0:31:23that Google was doing and I was like that looks really interesting to me. Like yeah
0:31:27the ability to like search without there being any tagging and it finds things. So I was
0:31:31like I want to give this a go. So I've pointed like a few thousand photos at it so far and
0:31:38it's been sucking them up. The best way to do this I've found is to download this little
0:31:43Mac uploader which you can get from the photos website and it just sits there. You just tell
0:31:49what files, what folders you want it to suck in,
0:31:51so I just pointed my Dropbox photos folder at it,
0:31:55pulled out some that I didn't want.
0:31:56And then it gives you this really weird dialogue
0:31:59about duplication in Google Drive,
0:32:01'cause you can, Steven, you just found this, I think,
0:32:03that you can sync them to your computer
0:32:05via Google Drive, right?
0:32:07- Sort of, so it doesn't,
0:32:10so I did the same thing you did,
0:32:11I pointed at a folder with subfolders of images,
0:32:14and so you can go into Google Drive on the web
0:32:18and there's like a ad as a folder type guy,
0:32:23and so it'll syncs the photos back down,
0:32:25but they're just, it's just a flat structure.
0:32:28There's no organization or subfolders there.
0:32:32So what I was thinking, or what I was kinda hoping
0:32:34was it to be like Dropbox.
0:32:35So I could have local directories,
0:32:37I could have full res copies locally in my machine,
0:32:40and that just sort of get mirrored in the cloud,
0:32:42but it's not really the way it works.
0:32:43And in hindsight, of course,
0:32:45Google is very much a web first client second,
0:32:47in many ways.
0:32:49And so there's a sort of some of these edge cases
0:32:51you have to be aware of if you want to use this
0:32:54more like iCloud photo library.
0:32:59It's not really quite the same thing.
0:33:01- Yeah, it's definitely a little bit different to that.
0:33:04I mean, what I generally do is just once a month,
0:33:08I go to the Google takeout thing that they have
0:33:10and I just download a full backup of all my photos
0:33:13and then store that somewhere.
0:33:16That's the top tip.
0:33:18- That's the top tip.
0:33:19It is a big download.
0:33:20I mean, if you don't have good internet,
0:33:22good luck getting that.
0:33:23So I think I have, I wanna say 35,000 photos
0:33:26in there at the moment.
0:33:27And I think the thing that amazed me the most
0:33:29is I could just search for anything.
0:33:30I could say, show me pictures of the beach in 2012.
0:33:33Show me where I was for this picture.
0:33:36I did this funny one.
0:33:37I searched for Sydney Harbour
0:33:38and it found the Sydney Harbour Bridge
0:33:40in a picture of a picture.
0:33:42So I'd been to someone's house.
0:33:43I'd taken a picture of some pictures
0:33:45So they've taken it, it actually took, yeah, it's like, yeah, that's the Sydney Harbour
0:33:48Bridge and it does some amazing stuff.
0:33:52Just for a joke, I just search for pictures of sleeping, for example, and it shows you
0:33:55people sleeping.
0:33:56You know, pictures of babies, it shows you pictures of babies.
0:33:58And this is all, you've got to remember in your photo library that you haven't spent
0:34:01any time tagging.
0:34:02So I didn't have to go through and say, you know, this is a picture of someone sleeping.
0:34:06I searched for koala just for you guys as well, and that works as well.
0:34:09Because in my backyard I have some koalas.
0:34:14- Yeah, for someone who, I'm not gonna be moving
0:34:18to this full time, but in thinking about it,
0:34:21I sort of view it as, it could be a way
0:34:23to have my photos backed up somewhere else
0:34:25and give me a different way to get into them
0:34:27where I could, again, easily search.
0:34:30And I have folders and subfolders done by sort of event type
0:34:35or it's kind of a mix of events and people
0:34:37and this would give me a way to search sort of across
0:34:40all of that stuff and the search really, I think,
0:34:43is the most impressive thing about this.
0:34:45Like you said, it's very natural search,
0:34:47like, hey, you know, I went on vacation in 2008.
0:34:50Like it knows when it was and it kind of knows where it is.
0:34:54And it really is like,
0:34:57this is how Google can flex its muscle
0:35:00over anyone else in the industry, I think.
0:35:02- Definitely, if you want to look at, you know,
0:35:04what are the biggest differences between this
0:35:06and, you know, iCloud photos,
0:35:07it's definitely that search and categorization
0:35:10that Google's able to do, you know,
0:35:11on a massive scale on their servers.
0:35:12So I'll give you another example.
0:35:14I was doing just an interview with someone,
0:35:17just over email, and they said,
0:35:19can you give me a picture of your setup at work?
0:35:21What does your desk look like?
0:35:22So I just searched for computer monitor,
0:35:24scrolled down, there's my monitor at work
0:35:26with my Mac Pro next to it,
0:35:27and I just sent the guy the picture.
0:35:29Really handy.
0:35:30- So this is the exact reason why I decided
0:35:33I wanted to sign up for this,
0:35:35'cause I just think that that is so awesome.
0:35:37And it doesn't get it right 100% of the time.
0:35:40Sometimes I know there are things in there
0:35:41it's not finding but my feeling about this is the fact that you can do any of it is awesome
0:35:46and the longer I use this if I really do you know want to keep using it the better I know
0:35:51it's going to get right just over time this stuff will improve but the I think the thing
0:35:57that has that has impressed me the most right now is some uploading my photos and I get
0:36:01a push notification every little while we've made a collage for you or we've made an animation
0:36:06for you or we've made a collection for you and these are just these awesome things or
0:36:10Or they take a photo and they're like "We've enhanced it" and they've just made it look
0:36:14more artistic or they've corrected color or something.
0:36:19Or they'll say "Hey, what about that time you went to San Francisco?" and it's like
0:36:22showing me WWDC last year or it's showing me Atlanta and it picks up all the photos
0:36:27and puts them in this little story and it breaks them up by day.
0:36:31Or it takes a selection of images that were taken in quick succession and it turns them
0:36:36into an animation.
0:36:37And I know that this stuff has been around for a while, that like Auto Awesome I believe
0:36:41it was called on Google Plus.
0:36:43Yeah that's what it was.
0:36:45It's so fantastic to I think to just get these little things that pop up every now and then.
0:36:49And look I've had some weird ones, I've had ex girlfriends and stuff appear.
0:36:54But it's like I'm not going to blame Google for that because they have no, they can't
0:36:58know that.
0:36:59So that's not an issue that I have.
0:37:01Actually they probably do but they just don't want to let me know that they know.
0:37:06Yeah they don't want to turn that on, they don't want to freak you out too much.
0:37:09But I found the same thing, so I've had this for years now.
0:37:12The best time honestly is when you go on a trip somewhere, like you were saying WWDC,
0:37:16like I went to an island just off the coast called Kangaroo Island and it literally made
0:37:21like a photo book of my journey which is something I used to love to get home and do like in
0:37:25iPhoto and it did a really good job.
0:37:27Yeah this is the thing that I'm most impressed with because it takes your photos and gives
0:37:31you little presents.
0:37:32Like, they give me little gifts every now and then.
0:37:36And it's just nice, I like it.
0:37:38It's something that, it just adds a bit of playfulness.
0:37:41And this is part of my overall feeling about Google Photos,
0:37:46especially where it is right now,
0:37:48is this is not a professional,
0:37:52like, this is not a pro user's tool, right?
0:37:55Because the unlimited stuff is for lower quality stuff,
0:37:59right, and/or they will take your photos
0:38:02and they will down res them a little bit,
0:38:04which I don't care about,
0:38:05but I know that there are loads of people that will,
0:38:07and that's fine.
0:38:08And then when they take your photos,
0:38:09they do fun things with them.
0:38:11Like, this is a consumer tool,
0:38:13and I am a consumer when it comes to photos.
0:38:15All of my photos are taken on my iPhone.
0:38:17Like, I'm totally happy with that.
0:38:19That's where they live.
0:38:21And I'm, the way that I've got it is,
0:38:23at the moment, I'm still doing my automatic upload
0:38:26from my phone to Dropbox,
0:38:29as I've done for years now,
0:38:31and then Dropbox sucks them in to Google Photos
0:38:36and that works for me 'cause it stays out of the way
0:38:38and then I get all these other cool features.
0:38:41- Yeah, no, that sounds like a good way to go
0:38:42and I definitely agree.
0:38:43If you're someone with a digital SLR
0:38:46that takes 40 megapixel raw images
0:38:49and you need to archive those
0:38:50'cause they're from weddings or whatever,
0:38:52this is not a tool for you.
0:38:54It's like you say, it's a consumer thing.
0:38:55It's for people like me.
0:38:56I go out, I take 99.9% of my photos on my phone
0:39:00and then I want some quick way to have access to those.
0:39:03And it's just really cool that, you know,
0:39:04in the background without you worrying,
0:39:06they just all end up in a central place
0:39:07and a central place that is now searchable.
0:39:10You know, I didn't have that two weeks ago.
0:39:12- Right.
0:39:15Real quick before we cut you loose,
0:39:16you know, there's been a lot of conversation
0:39:19and there always is with Google,
0:39:21especially in the Apple sort of camp,
0:39:23that Google is gonna do things with your data
0:39:26or they're going to, you know,
0:39:29your kids are gonna end up on an ad somewhere.
0:39:32You know, there's this really interesting article,
0:39:35if you guys saw it, over on Medium,
0:39:38Federico linked to it on Mac Stories a couple days ago,
0:39:40that talks about this, and basically,
0:39:42with the head of Streams Photos and sharing it at Google,
0:39:46basically, sort of sums up, Myke,
0:39:47your sort of stance on Google over the years of like,
0:39:51yes, they have access to a lot of data about me,
0:39:52but I get all these great things back,
0:39:54and I think you even just said that with the photos,
0:39:55like, you know, they can do all these little things,
0:39:58and you get all these really nice tools and stuff
0:40:01at your fingertips, but there's a part of me,
0:40:05and I'm using Google Photos, and I will continue to use it
0:40:08as just, like I said, another window into my photo library.
0:40:11But does that sort of stuff make you guys think
0:40:16differently about using this, or is it something
0:40:19that is not really a concern, or maybe it is a concern
0:40:24but not an important one?
0:40:26What are your thoughts on that?
0:40:28So I mean my take on that is that, you know, we, as part of what I do, like I run servers,
0:40:34I know where files go, I know how cloud hosting works, so any company that you're going to
0:40:39use that involves any sort of hosting, you have to implicitly trust them.
0:40:42So you have to trust Dropbox, you have to trust Apple, you have to trust Google, and
0:40:45if that's not, you know, something that you're comfortable with, then that's, you know, that's
0:40:51fine.
0:40:52But I mean for me personally, I really do, you know, put a lot of trust in Google.
0:40:56I don't mind if their algorithms go through my email, I don't mind if their algorithms
0:41:00go through my photos.
0:41:02Because I know at that scale you can't have a human being sitting there and going, "Oh,
0:41:05yes, interesting.
0:41:06What did Russell talk about today?
0:41:08Page, page, page."
0:41:10It's just not a thing that worries me.
0:41:12And I mean if it is something that worries you personally, then that's fine.
0:41:16You don't have to use it.
0:41:17Yeah, I feel the same.
0:41:19And I also, I spoke about this on Upgrade recently.
0:41:24I feel utility in this stuff.
0:41:26And it's even like in the interview, Bradley Horowitz is talking about, let's say for example
0:41:31in the future they find some way that they're happy with to give this data in some form
0:41:39to companies.
0:41:40Let's say Tesla need to make a product recall.
0:41:43They can contact you directly because they can find out you own a Tesla because of your
0:41:48photo data.
0:41:49And he's saying, "Look, we have the proper controls and checks and all that kind of stuff
0:41:52imbalance and to make sure it's all okay and that the users find it.
0:41:56He's speaking kind of... it sounds like a little off the cuff but it probably
0:42:01isn't. But the idea of like that of course they'll make sure that
0:42:05people know what they're doing. Because this is the type of thing that
0:42:08if Google got silly about the company would shut down because they would be
0:42:13taken through every single court on the planet. If they just start selling
0:42:17people's photo data. There is a way to do this properly and I
0:42:23believe that they would do it properly. And people have been saying
0:42:27that this is like, and I think Google has said this as well, this is Gmail for
0:42:31photos and I am so on board with that as an idea for what this is. It just feels
0:42:37like that. This is just like doing for photos what Gmail did for email. It's
0:42:42just is like just an end-to-end solution it's simple and you have unlimited
0:42:47storage. I am finding something weird at the moment it's probably to do with my
0:42:50setup where for some... I don't understand what is happening on my phone on my iPhone I'm
0:42:54seeing duplicate photos but not on the web so something as weird is happening
0:42:57on my iPhone I need to diagnose but I think that's because I kind of have my
0:43:02photos rooting in and out again but I'll work that out later but they look it's
0:43:06perfectly fine on the on the Mac. But I'm excited about this. I'm happy that
0:43:12there is a simple solution that I get utility out of from a company that is
0:43:16not going to shut this down. Yeah I mean I'm the same I just hope that yeah
0:43:22the curse of connected doesn't strike again because I mean you guys are a bit
0:43:26infamous for this. You know that is a long-running joke of the show but there
0:43:31was a point of this Steven that I saw I think you make on Twitter this week
0:43:34that somebody was like, "Oh, but Google have a history of shutting stuff down," which they do.
0:43:39Yeah, someone asked me that. And people always say, "Well, Google Reader..." Yes, Google does
0:43:48do that, but I wouldn't worry about that with Photos. Photos is a need that everybody has.
0:43:54Only we care about RSS services. I think this is clearly something here to stay,
0:44:02Not only because everyone has photos, but especially if you know
0:44:04If you can install it on iOS or Android or an Android if it's automatic where I can just have my photos backed up to
0:44:11This thing automatically like that's gonna be such a value to so many people. I really I
0:44:16Don't remember. I don't remember who tweeted a couple people did actually I don't really worry about that with with Google stuff
0:44:22Yes, they shut stuff down sometimes but it's a they always give you a way to get your data back
0:44:27their Google takeout is really good and it's
0:44:31it's sort of too big and too important for them to brush this aside in two years.
0:44:37Because I think there was something that you said which I liked which is
0:44:44like photos are just they are part of every big company. Right, I mean
0:44:50Apple has their photos platform, Google has theirs, you can do stuff with
0:44:54OneDrive, Microsoft, Dropbox of course has carousel. I mean any big
0:45:00Amazon photos, I mean any big like platform company you can think of is
0:45:04doing something in this space that they can't they can't afford not to at this
0:45:07point. So I would I wouldn't let that worry your your sweet head.
0:45:12Yeah I think that's the same. I think that you know as integral as you know
0:45:16email is to our lives now I think photos has become the same thing and I think
0:45:21you know big companies like Apple, Google, Microsoft, you know Dropbox they all
0:45:24realize that. This is definitely not some you know 20% project like Google
0:45:29reader was so I think this is here to stay you know for the long run.
0:45:33Russell thank you so much for joining us. Where can people find you on the
0:45:37internet? They can find me in San Francisco. Come and say hi while I'm here
0:45:41but seriously you can find me @RustyShelf on the Twitters and you can
0:45:47see stuff about our company at ShiftyJelly.com. Awesome. Thanks so much for
0:45:52joining us. Thanks for having me. Right let me just take a last break for today
0:45:57and then we can get into talking about some WWDC predictions before we head into
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0:49:40so much to hover for sponsoring this week's episode. So let's talk about
0:49:47Dub-Dub huh? Please stop. So we want to do some WWDC predictions. Can I start? Yes you please go
0:49:55first and then I am going to play I'm gonna read Federico's and
0:49:59simultaneously pull his apart as I read them. It's gonna be great. Yeah so whilst
0:50:03Federico couldn't be here he provided us with all of his predictions but I have
0:50:08some of my own. But I wanted to just get out there because one day I'm gonna get
0:50:11something right and then it's gonna be awesome. So the only really
0:50:15strong one for me is I think that we're gonna see a complete overhaul of
0:50:20notifications. I think that today widgets will be more
0:50:25powerful, there will be some rethinking and some extending and what
0:50:29they can and can't do. I think that we're gonna see notifications overhauled in
0:50:33general, like better and more actionable notifications, maybe more button
0:50:38choices, more stuff that can be activated about having to open the app to do it,
0:50:44right? It can just be done and it happens in the background. Maybe as well allowing
0:50:48messaging apps to use the quick replies, like so Slack could use that for example
0:50:53which would be awesome. I think that we're gonna see better notification
0:50:57settings for apps, I spoke about this a couple of weeks ago, like the global
0:51:00settings stuff, I think we're gonna see that. And also some more APIs for
0:51:04allowing granular notification support to help enhance the Apple Watch so you
0:51:09could have certain notifications sent to certain places and you could choose those
0:51:14in your apps of choice. I think we are going to see a music streaming service. I
0:51:19think that's gonna be a thing that happens and that's gonna be great. I
0:51:23think that's a pretty obvious one. I think we're only gonna see an Apple TV
0:51:26announcement if there'll be some content deals as well, some like additional cool
0:51:30stuff that we're gonna see on stage or just stuff that nobody really cares
0:51:33about but they're gonna do it anyway like you know they're gonna get some
0:51:36more streaming services or something like that I think we're gonna see some
0:51:39more of that kind of stuff that goes along with it maybe it'll be some big
0:51:43video games or something but I think that Apple TV will come with some other
0:51:47flashy presentations or announcements and but I think the thing that will get
0:51:51the most on stage time at this keynote is going to be watch OS 2.0 I think out
0:51:56of OS X iOS and the watch OS I think that they're gonna devote the most time
0:52:01to showing us the new features of 2.0 and also some examples of the types of
0:52:06apps that can be built with the native SDK.
0:52:09I agree on both points. You know notifications have always been vaguely
0:52:15frustrating on iOS and now you know you can, if you're an iMessage, you can
0:52:21reply and you can dictate or type right into the notification drop-down little
0:52:26guy but you can if it's something like slack or or email or something like that
0:52:32so it's a degree it's it's sort of time to open it up a little bit more and you
0:52:38know I think overall you know people say they want like universal VIP which I
0:52:43don't think is really possible
0:52:45I mean how does how does iOS know you know Myke you're an email VIP how do
0:52:50they tie that to Twitter and slack and other services but I do think a more
0:52:54common more you know powerful way to break these things down into sort of
0:53:01bite-sized chunks makes makes a lot of sense well I think some of the universal
0:53:05VIP stuff comes from like don't have like a friends list on the watch and VIP
0:53:11and that kind of stuff like give me you know you unify that at least you know
0:53:17right we'll see obviously watch OS is gonna get a lot of time they they have
0:53:23basically already said that native apps will be part of the keynote on
0:53:31Monday. So yeah, I think that's all. I think those are probably two really
0:53:36safe bets. Federico had that stuff, you know, access to the sensors and
0:53:45hardware which Apple said the SDK will have, that sort of thing. Apple will make it
0:53:53easy to migrate from watch kit to watch OS SDK.
0:53:55I'm not so sure he's right about that.
0:53:56I don't think Apple really cares
0:53:58if it takes you more time to rewrite your watch app.
0:54:00- Especially if they announce it now for like the fall.
0:54:03- I think that's definitely the case.
0:54:05I think it's definitely alongside iOS 9 in the fall.
0:54:10You know.
0:54:12- It's interesting that he doesn't think
0:54:14there'll be a native SDK for the Apple TV.
0:54:17Like that seems like something
0:54:18that they would definitely do because of games.
0:54:20- Yeah, I think so.
0:54:24And maybe games, on iOS games have always had
0:54:29like weird status where they can run code bases
0:54:33that aren't Apple, there's always this weird muddy water
0:54:38with games and that may continue to be the case on the watch.
0:54:41I have yet to find a reason that I would want to play
0:54:43a game on my watch but maybe I'm the minority there.
0:54:49- So yeah, so, watch apps for sure,
0:54:53watch OS 2.0 or whatever it will be called for sure.
0:54:57You know, new OS X, San Francisco font
0:54:59showing up on iOS and OS X.
0:55:02- How do you feel about that by the way?
0:55:04- I'm not thrilled they're changing it again on the Mac
0:55:07or that it's rumored.
0:55:08I do think San Francisco is really nice looking
0:55:11and really easy to read, which I would appreciate.
0:55:14You know, like I said, it's weird that if they do it
0:55:19that Yosemite is the only version of OSN
0:55:21that was using Helvetica for the system font.
0:55:24But I could see why Apple wants to do it.
0:55:26And for a company that cares about every single detail,
0:55:29not having their own typeface in their UI
0:55:33has always seemed strange to me.
0:55:35So it seems like it's time.
0:55:37It's just like, why didn't you do this a year ago?
0:55:39Like why did you always know Helvetica
0:55:43was gonna be a stepping stone in OS 10?
0:55:45Or did you not think San Francisco was gonna be ready?
0:55:48you know, or what I think actually happened,
0:55:51if the watch was actually supposed to ship in the fall
0:55:54and it slipped, my guess is that Yosemite
0:55:57was supposed to use San Francisco initially.
0:56:00- Ooh, that's, I was just thinking like,
0:56:02why did they do it?
0:56:04That is smart.
0:56:06- And when they couldn't ship the watch,
0:56:07they didn't want to tip their hand with the font
0:56:11or with the typeface, and so they went with Helvetica
0:56:14as a stand-in, which is fine, like,
0:56:17I have a laundry list of problems with Yosemite's UI.
0:56:20Helvetica is not on that list.
0:56:22I really like it as a system font for the most part.
0:56:25So maybe they were just sort of backed into a corner
0:56:28with the timing.
0:56:29'Cause you know, it's a lot of moving parts, right?
0:56:31Like you're not gonna hold off your OS X redesign
0:56:34because your watch isn't ready to ship, so.
0:56:36Federica also says,
0:56:39and I agree more iCloud drive presence in the Finder.
0:56:42Right now you have that in the sidebar,
0:56:45but it's sort of janky and like it's hard to understand
0:56:48why it's different and it's hard,
0:56:51my big promise is it's hard to understand
0:56:52sync status of anything.
0:56:54I think it's just they need to continue
0:56:56to make that clearer.
0:56:57What is going on in iCloud Drive?
0:56:59What's there, what's not?
0:57:00What is the state of this document or this folder?
0:57:03And he says, Siri and Control Center come to OS X.
0:57:07You know, it'd be nice,
0:57:09I don't know if this is the year or not.
0:57:10I don't know why you would need Control Center.
0:57:12I don't know what it would do for you
0:57:13because you have the menu bar
0:57:15and you have media keys on your keyboard.
0:57:17They basically cover things like Bluetooth, Wi-Fi,
0:57:20you know, power stuff, volume.
0:57:23But Siri, I think it's probably time.
0:57:26There have actually been times where I wish I had Siri
0:57:28on the Mac if my hands were full and I could just say,
0:57:31you know, ahoy computer phone
0:57:32and have Siri do something for me, but.
0:57:34I'm gonna come back to iOS if that's okay.
0:57:41Federico, is that okay with you?
0:57:42Oh, we can't answer.
0:57:44- C, C, he said C.
0:57:46- So, he says other stuff, he says Swift 2.0,
0:57:50I don't know if it's like air quotes 2.0,
0:57:52but I think Swift will see, if not keynote time,
0:57:55I think definitely time in the State of the Union,
0:57:57which if you're not familiar with this,
0:57:59the State of the Union is the keynote Apple gives
0:58:02Monday afternoon, sort of after the public keynote,
0:58:07there's a break, and then State of the Union,
0:58:08it's available to developer members,
0:58:12so I'm a member so I can watch this on my iPad later.
0:58:15And it's sort of a--
0:58:16- I think it's everyone now though,
0:58:17that last year that was one of the videos
0:58:19that anybody could watch.
0:58:20- Was it? Okay.
0:58:21- Yeah, it was.
0:58:22- But, so anyway, so the State of the Union
0:58:25is a, it's sort of half, we are unpacking the keynote
0:58:29into more detail and like, this is some of the technical
0:58:31stuff going on behind the scenes.
0:58:33I mean, the keynote is designed for everybody,
0:58:34this is sort of one step closer to like,
0:58:37you're in a, you know, in an actual WWDC session.
0:58:41- Yeah, when we watched it last year,
0:58:42it was the first time we ever watched it.
0:58:44There are parts of it that I thought were really interesting.
0:58:46There are parts of it where I wanted to blow my brains out.
0:58:48'Cause for me, it was like, oh my God,
0:58:50he's writing code on stage,
0:58:51I don't understand what is happening.
0:58:55And it was horrible.
0:58:56And watching it in the room with people that understood it,
0:58:59they're like, oh, look at that.
0:59:00And I'm like, ah, it's just words.
0:59:02Words I don't even understand.
0:59:04- Yeah, so I think Swift might show up there.
0:59:10I think you probably actually will.
0:59:12New remote app for the Apple Music Service and Apple TV.
0:59:15Yeah, maybe.
0:59:16Demos of iWork apps, like maybe,
0:59:20I don't know if they're gonna do much with iWork or quote.
0:59:23- Well, there's extensions in iWork apps is what you're saying.
0:59:27- Oh, I can read.
0:59:28Yeah, if they do extensions.
0:59:30And then new parental controls in the iOS,
0:59:35in iOS and the Mac app storage, I think is definitely huge.
0:59:41Think overall we've talked about we've talked at great length on this show about the problems of the App Store
0:59:46You talked a lot about it on behind the app, you know, I definitely would like to see this sort of like curated
0:59:53Idea get spread to the App Store and better control and and all this stuff
1:00:00I think you know do we see is the time for Apple to do this?
1:00:02It's kind of like if this stuff doesn't happen next week. It's gonna wait for a year
1:00:05Apple's not going to roll out, I don't think, a large App Store change in October.
1:00:10Right, like this is the time to have everyone's attention and everyone's
1:00:15sitting there looking at the stage. This is when you make those announcements and
1:00:18when you make those changes. So some of this stuff, if we don't see it, it's just
1:00:22it's not in the cards for, you know, 2015-2016. So anyways, you want to go through
1:00:30some of this iOS stuff I feel like I've been rambling iOS iOS 9 yes so one of
1:00:37the main things that the Federico I know really wants and I'm not convinced we'll
1:00:44see it demoed WWDC is iPad multitasking so like split screen views or some
1:00:53additions to the iPad which show it's great for multitasking I think that is
1:00:58possible but I think that they might wait until the next iPads who knows but
1:01:02it would be nice to see it there I wonder if the mini will get that stuff
1:01:08I don't know like depends what they're gonna do but it would be be interesting
1:01:13to see something like that make me might make me want to use my iPad in in
1:01:17different sort of situations you know because it kind of will bridge the gap a
1:01:20little bit more say I want to do some research or something and write some
1:01:23notes because I would just like to be able to do that it might be nice to be
1:01:27through an iPad or something do you think we're gonna see that? I think if we
1:01:31do it's gonna be sort of like the split view controller stuff or like very
1:01:37clearly Apple is putting things in place because there's going to be a bigger
1:01:40phone but they can't say there's going to be a bigger phone and so it may be
1:01:44that like if you sort of put the pieces together in all the sessions like this
1:01:49is clearly coming but I agree with you I have a tendency to think that this might
1:01:54be one of those things where it's sort of held for later unless iOS 9 is not as
1:01:59wide-reaching as some people we know might like it to be and this is sort of
1:02:04like the big feature at that point I think we see it on stage but I think it
1:02:08just kind of depends on the positioning of it. A home app to manage home kit
1:02:13devices I think that's pretty solid now especially today saw a bunch of people
1:02:18reporting Federico had another write-up about this he writes a lot at the beach
1:02:21that's that's what I've learned today that there's there are some homekit
1:02:27devices now popping up so that's that's the thing that's happening so there
1:02:33will probably be more about that on stage keyboard tweaks including a
1:02:37redesigned shift key I don't know about the shift key I don't know for two years
1:02:42right yeah I feel like you're kind of all in on it now unless Apple were
1:02:49looking for like a quick chair on stage. Yeah like "hey we redesigned the shift key"
1:02:56You know where fist pump guy jumps up you know. If fist pump guy jumps up for the shift key then
1:03:01we greatly underestimated the power of the shift key design.
1:03:08We have, I've seen people saying about this like a Google Now type Siri so it's more
1:03:17visual and spotlight based and this would come along with, as Sepp Ferrico is mentioning,
1:03:22initial Siri and spotlight APIs because you'd be able to tie backwards and forwards for them.
1:03:28Which would make sense, you know, I think it would be interesting to see that. I don't know
1:03:34what Apple would be able to do here because they're not Google and they just don't have
1:03:41the data that Google has to be able to build Google Now. Yeah, unless this is searching just
1:03:46what's on device.
1:03:48- That seems like it would take a lot of power,
1:03:51processing power to do.
1:03:53- That seems like a very Apple thing to do.
1:03:56Or it may be that, you know, it may be the time
1:03:59where they say, look, if you have iCloud
1:04:00and you want the stuff, you can log into it.
1:04:02But maybe it's only, maybe it's only if you have iCloud
1:04:06and not if you use Gmail or Google Apps like we do
1:04:09or something like that.
1:04:09So I agree with you, like this would be really nice
1:04:12and there's a lot of things about Google now
1:04:13that I really like.
1:04:14But I don't know if Apple has the keys to the car
1:04:18with this sort of stuff because they,
1:04:20because of their stance on this stuff.
1:04:22I don't know, it'd be great, and it would be great
1:04:26if Siri could go to the next episode,
1:04:30the next download episode in Overcast, for instance.
1:04:33And so that sort of stuff I think is more likely
1:04:35than a Google Now type thing,
1:04:39'cause I just don't know how Apple solves the data problem.
1:04:43It seems insurmountable almost.
1:04:46- I mean, I feel like if they did have some API stuff,
1:04:50you could have apps throwing information out
1:04:53for Apple to collect, but even in that instance,
1:04:57it still feels like it would be very simplified
1:04:59because it's gonna be like that.
1:05:01I would be very interested to see
1:05:02if they're able to pull something like this off.
1:05:04I feel like this would be something that Apple would do
1:05:06to try and catch up to Google,
1:05:08but Google will always be ahead in this
1:05:10because this is just what Google do.
1:05:14This is what they make, you know?
1:05:16They make little robots that search inside of information
1:05:19and present it to you in different ways.
1:05:21But it does feel like it's something
1:05:23that Siri should be doing,
1:05:25because Cortana does a little bit
1:05:26of this kind of stuff as well.
1:05:27So it's time for Siri to pick up this kind of intelligence.
1:05:31Enhancements to the Mail app,
1:05:35which include extensions on iCloud Drive.
1:05:37This one feels like it has to exist.
1:05:40Not that I care because I use third-party mail apps but this one needs to exist in mail.app.
1:05:47It's kind of ridiculous that it wasn't there already.
1:05:50A couple of quick ones, new health app visualisations.
1:05:54Yeah, I suppose they'll do more there.
1:05:57Find My Watch, which you know, they have to find my iPhone on the watch.
1:06:01Find My Watch would make a lot of sense.
1:06:04Beats music streaming with popular celebrity DJs.
1:06:08Maybe this might be like Tim Cook's celebrity moment, you know?
1:06:12Here is the DJs that we're talking about this week.
1:06:14I do think we're going to see the music stuff.
1:06:17So I actually thought a lot about this today.
1:06:23You can think about WWDC in two ways.
1:06:25You can think about it being the developer conference where Apple does things like unveil
1:06:30Swift like they did last year.
1:06:32And they showed code during the keynote on stage.
1:06:38I think that's the primary way that I think about W2C.
1:06:43Maybe because I'm there and I'm friends
1:06:44with a bunch of developers and I care about that stuff.
1:06:47But W2C is one of Apple's only media times
1:06:52throughout the year.
1:06:53And so something like the music streaming service,
1:06:56if that is a completely consumer oriented,
1:07:01not open to developers type thing.
1:07:04And so I wonder, do they show it now
1:07:06or do they, or is this, what I'm increasingly thinking is,
1:07:10does this get bundled in with a phone announcement
1:07:12in the fall?
1:07:13You know, Apple for a long time did the music events
1:07:17in like September and October,
1:07:18kind of flip-flopped and moved around over the years
1:07:20with iPods, and they still do some of that.
1:07:23They had Bondo and Tim Cook doing the weird finger thing,
1:07:25which I'm now doing with my two hands, and I feel weird.
1:07:28Maybe beats and stuff, maybe that gets pushed
1:07:34to the fall when it's more of a consumer focus.
1:07:38I don't know, and they could do this on Monday
1:07:39and it not be weird at all, but I just,
1:07:41I have this feeling that it might not be next week
1:07:44and it might be in the fall instead.
1:07:46- No, I think that if Apple are really going
1:07:50for bug fixes and stability improvements,
1:07:53then that's why they do the music streaming service
1:07:56because they have a user-facing feature
1:07:57to talk about at WWDC.
1:07:59- I mean, maybe.
1:08:01I mean there's that has just as much possibility happening as my thing I think I think it ever also
1:08:07We're saying and the rumors are that this launches before the next iPhone and if they wait for the new iPhones
1:08:13That's longer than the new iPhone
1:08:15Because they did like the redesign music app is in 8.4
1:08:19Right, which is similarly we're gonna see next week. So
1:08:23Very has also said that there could be a workout app on the iPhone with workout types that are supported on the watch
1:08:30I don't know. I feel like maybe but I feel like that would be taking away a
1:08:33Feature
1:08:36Agreed that the watch has you're taking away less of the watches reason to exist if you put the work app on the iPhone
1:08:42I agree, and I think it's you know, I really like having the activity app. So if you have a watch
1:08:48Activity app shows up on your phone
1:08:51automagically and it has got the rings and you can look at the you know
1:08:56Awards and everything and I really like that app and actually like the way it looks is like the first app with a dark
1:09:02UI that I've really have ever liked on iOS
1:09:05But I have a tendency to agree with you that like
1:09:10Showing activity on the phone is a is a status report, right? It's showing me what I've done
1:09:15So if my watch is not on me, I can kind of see where I am throughout the day
1:09:19But it's sort of a it's a read-only type thing
1:09:22I can't you can't go into activity as far as I know and like manually into a workout you have to do that on the
1:09:26watch and so I don't know like why would you take the sort of one of the primary
1:09:31things of the watch and bring it to the iPhone at least so early like I could see
1:09:35this making sense down the road I think right now it's still really early in
1:09:39this in this products life and I don't know if you want to take out a big you
1:09:45know a big leg out of it out of its out of its stool quite yet so last couple of
1:09:51things are some changes to the extensions that go beyond the share
1:09:55So, you know, like having on the copy and paste menu, for example.
1:09:58Maybe Force Touch will be something that brings this in the next devices.
1:10:03And, you know, leading in and touching on what we were talking about with Google Photos earlier,
1:10:08better faces and places support in the Photos app for iOS.
1:10:12Yep, I think in a lot of ways there's a lot of work to be done in Photos on iOS.
1:10:19Like if you have iCloud Photo Library and you open the Photos app or the photo picker,
1:10:24the photo picker your phone basically just sits there for eight seconds ten
1:10:27seconds while it is doing something hopefully. You know I think this is one
1:10:33of those weird things where photos sort of came out mid-cycle and I feel like
1:10:36there's a lot of rough edges still in in the iOS implementation of it so I think
1:10:42that but I think photos are gonna get pretty constant attention for a while
1:10:46till they get all this stuff worked out. So thank you Federico for sending us in
1:10:51your list and I like that you know because he's not here we can go no not happening.
1:10:56Yeah so the uh we didn't talk about the the Apple TV thing I do tend to think that new
1:11:06Apple hardware is on the horizon I I think that it will come hand in hand with either
1:11:14a native SDK or Apple's Web TV service.
1:11:17Like the the the Apple TV is basically
1:11:22an A5 I think it's 1080p. I've got one
1:11:27it's it's a fine little box. I mean it
1:11:29can be it can be buggy but the hardware
1:11:31seems it does what it needs to do you
1:11:34know it's it could be faster but it's
1:11:36not I don't want to like hit it with a
1:11:39hammer every time I use it. So I don't
1:11:43know what they gain from like releasing hardware now and it being another six
1:11:50months or the three months or the nine months until there's software to kind of
1:11:54like use the additional hardware. So my thought is when Apple TV gets a refresh
1:11:58it will be hardware and software at the same time and my guess is that some
1:12:02software will only be only be tied like to that hardware so hey the Apple TV web
1:12:10TV streaming service thing is out and you have to have a new Apple TV to play it because
1:12:14the as Joe Steele points out in the chat room the only single core A5 thing ever built can't
1:12:19run it.
1:12:21So that to me is seems like a lock and step type thing and I don't think that's next week.
1:12:27I think a lot of people want it to be next week but I don't think it is.
1:12:31I think there's not enough smoke to prove there's fire there quite yet for me.
1:12:37- So you think no new Apple TV?
1:12:40- I think the Apple TV will go,
1:12:42if it is mentioned it would be very minor.
1:12:47I don't think there'll be a revision,
1:12:49I don't think there'll be a software update.
1:12:51We'll see.
1:12:52The first 30 minutes will be about the Apple TV now
1:12:54because I've said that.
1:12:55I think the other hardware thing to consider
1:12:59is the Mac Pro which has been out for almost two years now.
1:13:03Or maybe two years since they announced it
1:13:06in like about a year and a half maybe since they shipped it.
1:13:08Maybe some of the chat room can correct me on that.
1:13:10It's been a while, it has not had a harder update.
1:13:13And I'm not, I don't follow the Xeon Intel drama
1:13:16as close as Marco does.
1:13:19So I'm not even sure if a Mac Pro update is possible
1:13:22at this point, but it does feel like that thing
1:13:25is maybe time for some sort of revision to the Mac Pro.
1:13:30Even if it's the same chips, you know, GPU,
1:13:33or at least a configuration change,
1:13:36It just seems like that's gotten a little stale again.
1:13:39And if there's any time to do a Mac Pro update,
1:13:41it is at WWDC.
1:13:43So I would like to see them do something with that.
1:13:46- Cool.
1:13:48- That's it.
1:13:49iPod shuffle, yes or no?
1:13:51- Oh, definitely.
1:13:52- Definitely.
1:13:53You heard it here first and probably only.
1:13:55(laughing)
1:13:58Yeah, it'll be good.
1:13:59- I think that's about it.
1:14:01Right, so we'll be there next week.
1:14:02We'll be recording on Tuesday.
1:14:04- Yes.
1:14:06From our hotel room. From our hotel room, yep, and so you'll be able to hear that. We'll have
1:14:10coverage on upgrade on Monday, so if you want to hear mine and Jason's opinions a
1:14:16couple of hours probably after the keynote we'll have that up on upgrade
1:14:20and then we'll be ready for some more considered thought after thinking about
1:14:24things, finding out some more information, we'll be talking more about it on
1:14:27Tuesday on Connected, so you can tune in we're gonna have a bunch of coverage
1:14:31next week. Which I think you'll really enjoy, there'll be a few of us there, a few of the team, the
1:14:34Relay people are going to be in San Francisco so we'll have some stuff there and hopefully
1:14:39we'll be able to provide you with some great coverage next week of WWDC.
1:14:43So I hope that you'll tune in and keep it locked to Relay FM, we've got some great stuff
1:14:48coming that I think you guys are going to love.
1:14:51If you want to find our show notes for this week you should head over to relay.fm/connected/42
1:14:59probably at that page you will find the answer to everything. I think is that
1:15:05something about 42 right? About answers and questions and that kind of thing.
1:15:09If you want it you can find it there. Thanks again to our sponsors this week, our good
1:15:13friends over at Lynda, OmniFocus and Hover. If you want to find myself online
1:15:17I am @imike, I am YKE. Steven is @ismh. Our absent co-host who is probably buried
1:15:25in sand right now is @vitiici, V I T I C C I, Federico writes @maxstories.net and Stephen
1:15:31writes @512pixels.net and I host a cavalcade of shows at Relay.fm of which a show is a
1:15:39part. So thank you so much for listening and we'll be back next time. Until then, say goodbye
1:15:44Mr Stephen Hackett. Adios.
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