25: The Microsoft of Ourselves


00:00:00   [Music]

00:00:07   From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 25.

00:00:12   Today's show is brought to you by igloo, an internet you'll actually like.

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00:00:20   for a 10-day free trial.

00:00:21   Visit lynda.com/connected and Squarespace.

00:00:25   Start here, go anywhere.

00:00:27   My name is Myke Hurley and I had the pleasure today of being joined by Mr. Steven Hackett.

00:00:30   Hello, Steven.

00:00:31   Hey, guys. Welcome back.

00:00:33   And Mr. Federica Vitici. Hi, Federica.

00:00:36   Hey, boys.

00:00:37   Feels like it's been forever since we spoke.

00:00:39   It's been like two decades, I think.

00:00:42   Two whole decades.

00:00:43   It's true.

00:00:44   It was weird because we did the special and then I missed the show.

00:00:47   And so it's been a while since I've spoken to you guys in our

00:00:50   I mean, we talk all the time, but in our podcast machine, it's been a while.

00:00:54   In the world's greatest.

00:00:56   You know, Steven and I secretly recorded an episode of "Connected" with Myke last week.

00:01:02   He didn't want to publish it because it was all about window management on OS X.

00:01:08   Then window management on iOS and that took about 25 seconds to get through.

00:01:11   I can't tell who you're trolling.

00:01:13   Everyone.

00:01:14   Everyone.

00:01:15   Anyone.

00:01:16   Anyone that owns a computer.

00:01:17   This is the popular multi-troll.

00:01:20   It's like with a single sentence you control multiple people at once.

00:01:25   I've been working on this method for a few years now.

00:01:30   I'm happy to say.

00:01:34   I won't finish that sentence, Myke. I'm sorry.

00:01:38   We have an action-packed show today, gentlemen. We should do

00:01:41   some follow-up. So our first follow-up is about photo

00:01:47   management, which we have not really covered before, but I thought it could be

00:01:50   interesting to get into. So picture life which Federico is picture life one that

00:01:57   you tried? Yeah. One of you guys tried it right? Yeah. I used it for like for like a

00:02:02   year I think actually. I still have all my old photos in there so. I believe

00:02:08   Casey List was their last user. Did he just sign up and then they got acquired?

00:02:12   No he just loves it. He uses it all the time. He's always sending me pictures of

00:02:17   London and they've got URLs of PictureLife.

00:02:21   So Casey only sends you pictures of London from PictureLife.

00:02:27   That's what he does to you on iMessage.

00:02:35   So it's being acquired by a company whose name I am searching for as I stream.

00:02:41   Thank you! StreamNation, which is a pretty great cloud company name, and they say that

00:02:49   basically picture life for the short term will stay the same, but they laid off a bunch

00:02:54   of people, is that right?

00:02:56   Who asked StreamNation? What do they do? I've never heard of them.

00:03:00   They own PictureLife now.

00:03:02   It's basically like a digital hub in the cloud for movies, music files, and now pictures.

00:03:08   So it's like any kind of media file into this sort of account that you keep and you stream

00:03:13   stuff to all your devices.

00:03:15   It's kind of like Plex, but like less popular, I think.

00:03:19   Actually, you know, it would have been great if Plex acquired Picture Life, because StreamNation

00:03:25   doesn't seem to have much of a name, at least in our, you know, like I never heard of this

00:03:31   StreamNation before, personally, and I tend to try a lot of apps.

00:03:34   So it's kind of weird.

00:03:35   Yeah, that is weird that you wouldn't have heard of that.

00:03:37   I genuinely mean that. I'd never heard of them.

00:03:40   I didn't know that they made services.

00:03:42   It sounds like one of those Akamai,

00:03:44   those just streaming service providers.

00:03:47   StreamNation's a really weird name.

00:03:49   I think this is Verge article in here.

00:03:51   I haven't actually read this Verge article,

00:03:52   but the title's interesting enough.

00:03:55   Why Every Photo Storage Company Gets Acquired or Dies.

00:04:00   Is it fair to say this will just never work?

00:04:04   This is a business that will just never work?

00:04:06   Because no one's been able to keep it up.

00:04:08   Yeah, and I think there's some, I think this Verdu

00:04:35   base to sustain them. So I guess having a lot of users is kind of like rolling the

00:04:40   dice as well isn't it really because you've got to hope that you get a lot of

00:04:44   users and a big portion of them don't have a lot of photos. If you have lots of

00:04:47   photos, lots of users and they all have lots of photos you're just like

00:04:50   magnifying the problems. Yeah so Casey uploading gigabytes of images to picture

00:04:55   life cost them you know more money than you know I think I tried it out and

00:04:59   uploaded like my little test album and I didn't cost them hardly anything. So it's

00:05:03   definitely you know it's not surprising like you know picture life kind of lasted

00:05:08   longer than most you know we've ever picked passed away we have loom was

00:05:13   purchased by Dropbox right yep so it became carousel yeah that's right and

00:05:19   you know I think I think it's it's clear that these things just can't they don't

00:05:23   just have enough steam behind they don't have enough resources behind them to be

00:05:26   standalone companies anymore yeah I think the biggest problem is that and I

00:05:33   I realize that this is unpopular between us, but most people don't want to manage photos.

00:05:39   They just expect to be able to take pictures on a smartphone and the pictures are into

00:05:44   the photos or gallery app, whatever they're called.

00:05:48   And they don't want to have the basic homework to do to manage photos once they're done.

00:05:57   They just expect to be able to open an app and find the photos.

00:06:01   And the problem is that these companies originally tried to solve a problem, which is you want

00:06:06   to back up all your photos in the cloud.

00:06:08   But now that the cloud has come in different ways to the default apps by Apple and Microsoft

00:06:14   and Google, these companies are trying to solve different problems and trying to sell

00:06:20   features like these extra options to people.

00:06:23   Like on Picture Life you can organize your photos, you can view them on a map, or you

00:06:28   can do albums in a different way, that's a really tiny market.

00:06:33   And especially it's a tiny market with high costs, because if you're trying to sell this

00:06:38   kind of product, and then you have to account for the Amazon Web Services costs, you're

00:06:45   going to have a problem, which is the reason why all these companies either sell out or

00:06:52   they need to shut down like Everpeaks.

00:06:54   Because it's very sad to say, but even if you have great features, these are options.

00:07:01   They're not a product.

00:07:02   And most people expect photo management to not be actually about management at all.

00:07:10   They expect the photos app on their device to have their photos on all their devices.

00:07:15   And so I think it's sad, but also kind of not surprising.

00:07:21   And good luck to StreamNation.

00:07:24   Yeah, I guess because if you try to bundle all these different media features into one

00:07:30   service, it actually makes more sense because you have something like blacks and this StreamNation

00:07:35   sounds very similar.

00:07:37   So I kind of see the appeal of, okay, I want to manage all my media in a single place.

00:07:43   And I'm the kind of user that wants to keep MP3 files.

00:07:46   I want to keep JPEG photos.

00:07:48   I want to browse and manually connect them to my TV.

00:07:50   So it kind of makes sense.

00:07:52   But a photo product alone, it's a big problem.

00:07:55   I think it's safe to say you can't do this photo management stuff unless you have another

00:08:00   product that you sell.

00:08:01   So companies like Google and Dropbox and Apple and Microsoft can do them because they're

00:08:06   like bolt-ons for other services that they have and then they can kind of even up the

00:08:10   cost that way and/or they actually host them themselves.

00:08:16   Amazon could probably do it as well quite well.

00:08:17   I know they have something like that.

00:08:19   But that seems like they're the companies that can do it, and these independent companies

00:08:24   start up.

00:08:25   So I can't see it ever panning out.

00:08:27   I think that that market has proven itself now to be a not very successful one.

00:08:33   Right.

00:08:34   Someone like Apple or Google can do it because they are padding that cost elsewhere.

00:08:38   I'd be very curious to know what an average iCloud user costs Apple a year.

00:08:45   I pay the lowest tier, like the 99 cents a month or something.

00:08:48   Surely it costs them more than that, I would think, especially once Photos comes online.

00:08:54   But they can offset that by the fact that I have an $800 phone in my pocket.

00:08:58   So it's different when you have a bigger company that can do more things and you can move things

00:09:03   around where your P&L isn't as simple as, "These Photos came in, this money came out,

00:09:08   we are dead."

00:09:09   So it's a simple equation, I think.

00:09:13   Should we move on?

00:09:15   Yes.

00:09:16   Should we move on from the management?

00:09:17   Yes.

00:09:18   Podcast Comic Part 2 is up, the link is in the show notes. Federico, where could

00:09:25   the show notes be found? Well the show notes are... I'm very sad to announce that

00:09:34   the show notes are ending. There's gonna be no more show notes. I think you've

00:09:38   misread the follow-up document a little bit. Did I? Really? Yeah, just a tad. The show notes will continue. We'll get to the end of the show notes

00:09:48   shortly. Well my interpretation was more epic. Yes it was, I think it was. Just slightly

00:09:55   misinformed. The show notes will continue to be at relay.fm/connected and this week's can be at

00:10:00   slash 25. There's no more show notes. No that's not what that means. Steve B thank you so much

00:10:07   for the second edition of the connected comics you go and read and it'll be in the show notes

00:10:12   this one is as epic as the first if not more so and it and it requires some

00:10:19   listener participation will not spoil it you should go and check it out it's uh

00:10:24   there's some frightening things in this comic there are there I'm a little I'm

00:10:28   afraid we're not gonna spoil it but I'm afraid of what happens to us

00:10:31   um all right so we have we so we got a lot I got a lot of email about the iPad

00:10:39   special. Thank you for all the kind words. I can speak for all three of us that we...

00:10:43   I think we're all very happy with how that came out. We had a lot of emails,

00:10:48   I read them all, I didn't get to reply to all of them, about people saying, you know,

00:10:53   using the iPads, especially in school, and just kind of how the iPad has made a

00:10:57   difference in a lot of people's lives, not just three of us, not just Federico.

00:11:01   There was one tweet, though, that I really wanted to call out, so it'll be in the

00:11:05   show notes that we're talking about someone mentioned that iBooks was like

00:11:10   the worst example of skeuomorphism ever and then there's this graphic of the

00:11:14   iowa7 iBooks and all the books are kind of like fallen off the shelves because

00:11:18   the shelves aren't there anymore they're sort of like collapsed on the bottom of

00:11:21   the iPad it's really it's really quite funny my book is also falling off the

00:11:26   shelf I saw that but you're gonna set up yeah you you're sort of laying on top of

00:11:30   what looks like a Max Sparky field guide. I'm on top of Max Sparky, yeah. It's kind

00:11:36   of weird. Yeah, great graphic. Yeah, really funny. So that'll be in the show

00:11:42   notes. We also have a photo sent to us by Jason Snell. Come on, really?

00:11:50   I'm not familiar with his work. Is this really by Jason? It really is by Jason. He

00:11:56   sent me this image of him listening to connected outside of the one infinite

00:12:01   loop in his car. He actually does this. Yeah, so there's an old joke that

00:12:06   if you get it then awesome and if you don't then we'll just carry on. So

00:12:12   this is the announcement. So we have an announcement to make. Are you guys ready?

00:12:15   Chat or are you sitting down? I'm ready. Please correct Federico for us. We have an

00:12:19   announcement about the future of the show and really of all podcasting ever.

00:12:24   we are bringing the show notes and old browsers vertical to borrow a term from

00:12:32   another show it's coming to an end so these three links that are in the show

00:12:37   notes by Spencer on Twitter of connected in iCAB and connected in IE6 which is

00:12:46   really a lot of fun as well as his final one show notes and conqueror which uses

00:12:52   basically a precursor to WebKit. It's time to put this this follow-up

00:12:58   thread to bed and I think I speak for all of us. We are sunsetting the show

00:13:05   notes in old browsers. Yes we're working on the museum if you heard that episode

00:13:08   I'm hard at work curating and walking around looking fancy and we're going to

00:13:15   preserve these somewhere but for now the the show notes in old browsers is over

00:13:22   We've been able to...

00:13:24   We already bought a cape for Steven, and we are looking into launching a crowdfunding campaign to acquire the frames that we're gonna use to hang the prints of the channels in old browsers.

00:13:40   We're gonna launch an Indiegogo campaign to buy frames for our museum.

00:13:46   We've also been able to console Steven adequately.

00:13:51   I know that he's very sad that this needs to end, but the sun has set on this vertical.

00:13:57   So here's the thing.

00:13:58   So I am a little sad, but I'm really proud of the work that people did to document this.

00:14:04   I mean, really, if you think about it, it's nuts that anybody actually did this.

00:14:08   And so I, for one, I'm sad but happy at the same time.

00:14:12   It's very confusing being me right now.

00:14:15   Do you feel like you changed people's lives?

00:14:20   I would say that we made a dent in the universe.

00:14:23   I think we're at the intersection of art and history.

00:14:30   Myke is going to be so happy with this segment of the show.

00:14:33   This episode of Connected is brought to you by our friends over at lynda.com.

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00:15:58   Well, they have the foundations of programming.

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00:16:35   So, topic zero.

00:16:39   We've gone back to our weird topic.

00:16:40   We have topic zero, topic 0.5, and then topic 0.9.

00:16:44   It's hard to understand.

00:16:47   Topic zero, we spoke, man, I think a long time ago, Myke, about your setup and if a

00:16:53   Mac Pro would be a good fit for you.

00:16:57   We decided no.

00:16:58   We decided no, that a Mac Pro was not a good fit for me and that I was going to get a Mac

00:17:02   Mini.

00:17:03   But then what happened, Steven?

00:17:04   What are you recording on right now?

00:17:06   Well, I was-- you jumped a step.

00:17:07   I was saying, Apple disappointed us with the Mac Mini.

00:17:11   Oh, yes.

00:17:12   Yeah, the new one's lame.

00:17:13   There's no quad core anymore.

00:17:14   Although, did you guys see, like last week, I saw an article,

00:17:17   the quad core is for sale again, but it's the old one?

00:17:19   Yeah.

00:17:20   It's very-- like, I don't--

00:17:21   That's only in the US as well.

00:17:22   Well, at least it was when I checked.

00:17:24   Oh, is it?

00:17:24   Yeah.

00:17:25   Is it?

00:17:25   OK.

00:17:26   And then we looked at an iMac, but you

00:17:28   didn't want an iMac on your desk for many, many reasons, which

00:17:31   I totally understand.

00:17:32   And so we opted to buy a Mac Pro.

00:17:35   - Yes, we have a Mac Pro,

00:17:36   and I've been using it for about two weeks now.

00:17:39   And I'm happy to say that I really love it.

00:17:42   I'm very happy with my Mac Pro.

00:17:44   But we have a couple of stories

00:17:46   that I would like to tell very quickly,

00:17:48   because I think that they're incredibly entertaining.

00:17:50   So we bought the Mac Pro in the UK.

00:17:53   It was very expensive,

00:17:55   especially in dollars because of that.

00:17:57   So we got it here,

00:18:00   and we unboxed it and I put the thing together

00:18:03   and I started plugging everything in

00:18:05   and was just slightly getting the Mac ready.

00:18:08   And I don't know what made me think of this,

00:18:10   but I was like, 'cause if you remember,

00:18:12   if you remember the conversation we had many weeks ago

00:18:15   about that, I wanted audio in and audio out,

00:18:17   dedicated audio in and audio out.

00:18:19   I just thought it was a good thing to do.

00:18:21   So we thought, you know, that's something

00:18:24   that the Mac Pro definitely has

00:18:27   because there's two ports, right?

00:18:29   you have an audio and an audio output.

00:18:31   Turns out it doesn't.

00:18:32   The Mac Pro has two audio outs.

00:18:35   One is digital and one is digital with headset.

00:18:39   - Which is BS.

00:18:40   - Which makes no freaking sense.

00:18:42   Apple, I hate you so much for doing that.

00:18:45   So, because I have things set up in a peculiar way

00:18:50   that allows me to play sound effects and stuff

00:18:51   all through the same machine and mixer.

00:18:53   It's very complicated, but it works for me.

00:18:55   And basically, that wouldn't work.

00:18:59   So we were very upset, very scared.

00:19:01   Me and Steven were very scared at this point

00:19:03   'cause we were worried that we'd spend a lot of money.

00:19:05   However, I have been able to fix it.

00:19:07   I purchased something called an i-mic,

00:19:10   which is amazing.

00:19:11   - Hilarious.

00:19:12   - By Griffin.

00:19:14   And it's basically just, it's an audio in to USB.

00:19:18   So basically I have my mixer is set up

00:19:22   with like multiple audio in and audio out.

00:19:24   It works, working absolutely perfectly.

00:19:26   Means I can still do things like this.

00:19:28   if I want to, so they're there, they're available to me,

00:19:31   to do at any moment, and that's one of the main reasons

00:19:34   that I like to have it set up in the weird way that I do.

00:19:36   The other thing was, I just needed to point this out

00:19:40   because one of the co-hosts of this show

00:19:43   believes that he is a lead genius of the Memphis region

00:19:46   and understands all about the K base

00:19:49   and everything like that.

00:19:50   So we are, we basically have found out

00:19:54   that this was a problem, and also I had started

00:19:56   to do Migration Assistant, and it told me

00:19:58   take about an hour and we had about 90 minutes until we needed to record this

00:20:01   show. Then it jumped to five hours. You started migration without consulting

00:20:09   anyone else. Just gonna put that out there. I'm not saying that's competition. Before you attempt to throw me under the bus, which I will refute.

00:20:15   Okay. Carry on. Well, we'll see if you're able to do that. Then it jumped to five

00:20:19   hours so I said to Steven, "What shall I do?" And also as well, at this time we were

00:20:22   freaking out that potentially the audio equipment wouldn't work properly with the

00:20:25   computer so I was like what should I do because you know I could record on my

00:20:29   USB microphone but like it's not gonna be great and he's like I believed you'd

00:20:34   said to me just power it off like just just shut it you can you can quit out of

00:20:40   migration assistant but that didn't work couldn't and so we just powered it off

00:20:44   which is fine wasn't fun great it's not great the absolute turns out fine was

00:20:48   couldn't have been further away from fine the machine would not boot it just

00:20:53   - It wouldn't boot.

00:20:54   - Tell the truth, Myke.

00:20:56   - It wouldn't boot.

00:20:57   I turned it on and it was just looking

00:20:59   to complete migration assistant

00:21:01   with nothing connected to it.

00:21:02   It would just sit there and couldn't do anything.

00:21:05   And also, I didn't have a keyboard

00:21:07   that I could connect to it,

00:21:08   so I couldn't do anything, I couldn't quit.

00:21:10   And then I was able to try and find a,

00:21:11   I then had a brainwave that I could connect

00:21:14   my weird Microsoft Bluetooth keyboard,

00:21:19   'cause it has this little dongle.

00:21:20   'Cause I couldn't connect a Bluetooth keyboard to it

00:21:22   because I couldn't do anything.

00:21:25   And then we were able to restart it and zap the PRAM.

00:21:30   And then it all worked.

00:21:31   And now it's been fine, and it's been great ever since.

00:21:33   And it's very fast, and it's very efficient.

00:21:35   I just wanted to tell this story to highlight the fact

00:21:38   that Steven gave some terrible advice.

00:21:42   Fine.

00:21:42   It was bad advice.

00:21:43   And chat room, I'm just ignoring you trolling me.

00:21:48   I didn't know any better.

00:21:49   I was relying on him.

00:21:50   Yeah.

00:21:52   It's not great, but it's fine.

00:21:55   And it works now, and it's wonderful.

00:21:56   And the Mac Mini is now going to a retirement

00:22:00   home for computers.

00:22:02   It's currently sitting underneath the desk

00:22:04   with the power cord wrapped around it.

00:22:05   Is it leveling the desk?

00:22:07   No, no, no.

00:22:09   It's sitting with my other backup equipment that I have.

00:22:12   Because I like to have backup equipment.

00:22:14   We still have it.

00:22:15   And you're seeing greatly improved bounce speeds.

00:22:18   Everything's quicker.

00:22:19   Everything's quicker.

00:22:21   everything is more efficient.

00:22:24   I'm able to do multiple things at once, which is amazing.

00:22:27   I did have the entire UI lock up on Monday

00:22:31   whilst recording upgrade.

00:22:33   - It's fine.

00:22:34   - Which led, and hilarity ensued.

00:22:35   Aside from that, it's been fantastic.

00:22:38   Federica, what do you think about Mac Pros?

00:22:41   Okay.

00:22:45   - I'm trying to think of a good analogy.

00:22:47   - Casey, let's really like some.

00:22:50   You know when you turn on the TV and there's like a talk show about science and you don't

00:22:56   understand a word of what they're saying?

00:23:00   That's kind of how I feel.

00:23:02   Like I get the basic story here, you bought a new computer and it didn't turn on and Steven

00:23:08   let you down.

00:23:11   So yeah, I feel for you but I'm kind of happy that you got it working.

00:23:15   I'm happy for you.

00:23:16   Thanks.

00:23:17   Thank you.

00:23:18   were panicky right like we have to record you can't record we've broken the computer

00:23:24   then I got more panicky and I was like oh just reset the PRAM and then you didn't have

00:23:31   a keyboard and it just but it's fine now and we're gonna cut all this out because I'm gonna

00:23:36   volunteer to edit the show and it's good it's fine.

00:23:40   Federico speaking of exciting things it's a good segue to Microsoft yes let's talk about

00:23:47   outlook for iOS. So Microsoft, back in December, I think, a couple of months ago, they bought

00:23:54   this new email app for iOS called Accompli, I think iOS and Android actually. It was an

00:24:01   email app that I actually got pitched, what was it, September, October, and I didn't take a look

00:24:09   because I kind of wasn't interested in another email client for iOS and that was probably a bad

00:24:15   call from me. But anyway, so they bought this email client, they waited a couple of months,

00:24:20   and now this email client is called Outlook for iOS and it's an official Microsoft app and, you

00:24:25   know, all that. It supports Outlook.com, Gmail, iCloud, Yahoo Mail, I think. It doesn't support

00:24:34   regular IMAP email accounts. It integrates directly with Dropbox because Microsoft is now doing

00:24:41   like some sort of partnership with Dropbox, OneDrive of course. And it's a... So I've been

00:24:48   trying this outlook for the past week and you will be surprised to know, this is like one of those

00:24:54   up for the headlines, you can't believe what happened next. You will be surprised to know

00:25:02   that it's my default email client now. Well, not default, ten... Well, yes, yeah.

00:25:10   The one you like the most? Yes, genius, technically it's not a default client.

00:25:15   Yes, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, please forgive me. So what do you like about it?

00:25:19   They're doing this clever feature called focused inbox, which is basically a way to separate emails

00:25:30   that you get in your inbox from like important email messages and other stuff that goes into a

00:25:37   section very appropriately called "Other". So the stuff that matters to you

00:25:44   according to the app goes into the focus section and all the other

00:25:49   stuff like newsletters and emails from people you don't want to

00:25:54   hear from, it goes into "Other". So this is something that Outlook

00:26:00   does independently. It's not reflected into the email service that you use. So

00:26:06   So if you use Gmail or if you use iCloud, you're not going to see another label or folder

00:26:11   added to your account.

00:26:12   It's just an app thing that happens.

00:26:16   And you can switch between these two.

00:26:18   And what I like is that you only get push notifications for messages that come into

00:26:23   the Focused Inbox.

00:26:25   So let's back up a little.

00:26:28   Outlook, like Mailbox, like Cloud Magic, like other modern email clients that do push notifications,

00:26:36   they send all your email over to their servers so they can serve you push notifications.

00:26:43   So if you're the kind of user who doesn't want to have all your email into somebody

00:26:49   else's server, you're not gonna want to use Outlook.

00:26:52   So I tested this one with my Gmail account and I like that, unlike other solutions to

00:27:00   replicate this kind of feature, you know, to have important emails into a separate section,

00:27:05   it only sends you a push notification for stuff that the app believes it belongs to the focus

00:27:13   section. So that's kind of handy because until a few weeks ago I was trying CloudMagic in combination

00:27:20   with SaneBox, which is this service that I heard from Max Parkey actually. And I like this

00:27:28   combination using same box with cloud magic, Outlook only sends you push notifications

00:27:33   for focused messages, which is kind of handy, so you're not gonna hear push notifications

00:27:38   over and over, and then you open the app and you find only fewer messages. I thought the

00:27:43   integration was kind of cool. And the big feature is that Outlook integrates email and

00:27:48   calendar in the same place. Actually email, calendar and files, because you can connect

00:27:53   your OneDrive and Dropbox account. So while you're writing an email message, you can reference

00:27:57   your calendar and you can attach files from OneDrive and Dropbox.

00:28:02   And it's also kind of impressive that it's able to scan email messages that you get that

00:28:07   contain a date and a time.

00:28:10   And it can tell you if you receive an invitation to a calendar event or something that you

00:28:15   need to RSVP to, it tells you whether there's a conflict in your calendar, which is kind

00:28:20   of nice.

00:28:21   And it also sends you push notifications for calendar events.

00:28:25   So if you want, you can use AppLook on iOS as your only email and calendar app, although

00:28:31   it's not a great calendar app, it's just like a calendar view more than a full calendar

00:28:36   client like Fantastical or Calendars from Riddle.

00:28:40   I think it's a cool app, it works really well with Gmail, search is fast.

00:28:47   emails go over to Microsoft's servers, which I guess is probably not as potentially problematic

00:28:56   as another smaller company.

00:28:59   So I mean, it's Microsoft, so it's not like they're out to...

00:29:02   Well, the problem's not that in particular, but there's a link to Gabe's website, MacDrifter,

00:29:09   about this.

00:29:10   He's linked to several things.

00:29:14   It's not so much that it goes over another server, that's a problem, but it's that that

00:29:21   is in violation of the security policies for many companies who depend on Outlook.

00:29:26   Oh yeah.

00:29:27   I'm not familiar with that stuff.

00:29:28   Or depend on Exchange on the back end.

00:29:32   It's not that it's...

00:29:33   It is a problem, and I would say it's a problem for consumers even, if you're worried about

00:29:37   that sort of thing, but it means that Outlook for iOS doesn't meet the requirements for

00:29:42   a lot of companies that use Microsoft products.

00:29:45   And that's fine if it's a third party app, but it's a first party app.

00:29:48   Microsoft bought it and didn't deal with this.

00:29:51   So it also does this for Exchange accounts as well?

00:29:57   Like Microsoft Exchange accounts, do they have the same problem?

00:30:01   It seems like it.

00:30:02   I read some of this, but it was a couple days ago and I don't really understand all of it.

00:30:07   But it's something that, hey, if you work like Myke, your old job, you guys use Lotus

00:30:12   Notes as did my old job.

00:30:15   And there was a lot of security around that, things we could do and couldn't do.

00:30:18   And the same thing is very common if you use Exchange at work.

00:30:21   And so I would just say if you're looking at using it for work and you know the security

00:30:25   policies, I would check.

00:30:27   You don't want to get caught in the middle of this.

00:30:32   Can I go on a bit of a brief discussion about email clients and calendar clients on iOS?

00:30:40   May I have your permission, Myke and Steven?

00:30:42   You have my permission?

00:30:44   Yes.

00:30:45   Okay.

00:30:46   So I'm kind of surprised about the kind of innovation that third-party developers are

00:30:50   doing.

00:30:51   And not just that, because of course for a long time third-party apps have been doing

00:30:54   different stuff on iOS than Apple's apps.

00:30:58   just how for how long Apple has been ignoring these additions to email and to calendar apps.

00:31:07   Because Apple's mail and calendar are very much traditional clients.

00:31:12   Like they're not trying to think about email and calendar events in different ways.

00:31:17   And the innovation in Apple's apps for these two particular tasks that people do a lot

00:31:24   email messages and calendar events has been really slow.

00:31:27   I mean, Apple has been doing, I mean, the last big features from Apple are, I think,

00:31:33   VIP contacts and in calendar driving times, which never actually worked for me.

00:31:41   And instead, you get all these other companies, I mean, besides Google, okay, let's not talk

00:31:46   about Google because they own Gmail and they have a massive, massive scale for email.

00:31:50   But other companies like Accompli before it became Outlook still had some pretty good

00:31:55   ideas, integrating your calendar and your email. It makes sense for me. And Cloud Magic is doing

00:32:01   this feature called Cards that lets you save an email for like an attachment, an entire message,

00:32:11   not just files, to other services like Evernote or Todoist if you want to turn a message into

00:32:18   an action. And instead, in Apple's Mail, there's no share sheets. You can only open files using

00:32:25   the native Quick Look preview. And it feels like a really prehistoric, in many ways, client.

00:32:33   Don't even get me started on the Calendar app, because it's really sad. And I'm surprised,

00:32:41   because on other apps... I'm not saying that Apple in other apps has been following

00:32:45   third-party developers, but they've been doing more new stuff, like Safari is doing...

00:32:52   Or Messages.

00:32:53   messages is doing new things.

00:32:55   And instead, the mail and calendar teams

00:32:58   seems to be either slow or they don't believe

00:33:01   that they need to innovate in this space,

00:33:03   which I think that case would be kind of dumb.

00:33:05   But yeah, that's just a brief thought.

00:33:09   - I think my kind of maybe argument and point on that

00:33:12   is like what you're asking for

00:33:17   and what I agree I would like to see more of,

00:33:20   I think maybe more power user features.

00:33:23   So potentially Apple don't think that more average users need stuff like that.

00:33:28   But my counter argument, so I was playing devil's advocate a bit with that, is that's

00:33:34   totally fine and to a point I agree with that.

00:33:37   But on that basis, allow me to choose what my default email app is.

00:33:42   If you believe, like Apple, that you don't want to include that stuff because you think

00:33:47   that it would maybe make the app too complicated for people that don't need it, which I totally

00:33:51   understand if that's the decision you choose to make then you need to allow me to make

00:33:56   the decision about what mail app I want to use and stop controlling the default clients.

00:34:06   I think if you're making decisions based on that kind of idea then I should be able to

00:34:10   have the control over what mail app I use.

00:34:15   I agree, you know, I was thinking about this in terms of the apps that we've picked over

00:34:20   at the Suite Setup and a lot of our reviews, you know we're reviewing things that have

00:34:25   first party apps in the running so like reminders or mails or calendar and I don't think that

00:34:31   we've ever picked an Apple first party app because of this and Myke I think you said

00:34:35   it really well you know they've got to hit a really broad user base with their first

00:34:39   party apps and they kind of allow you know if you even know that third party mailups

00:34:46   are a thing you're probably already a power user on the grand scheme in the

00:34:50   grand scheme of things and so they let people innovate in spaces and yes that

00:34:54   stuff does come back and I think messages I think they had to do it had

00:34:59   to work on that from a strategic standpoint because they're competing at

00:35:02   so many things so many messaging services and are you know in parts of

00:35:07   the world losing out to things like line or whatsapp or other third parties but

00:35:12   you know most people are going to use the mail app that comes on the dock of

00:35:15   their phone and and so it needs to be simple enough that anyone can use and I

00:35:19   agree that it's frustrating and Myke I'm totally behind you that I should be able

00:35:24   to set what app I want to use like if I want something more complicated because

00:35:28   I can deal with it let me use it by default don't make me jump through hoops

00:35:32   whether we ever see that or not I don't know but I think you know I think the

00:35:37   fact that so many like nerds in our circles have used Outlook and like it

00:35:43   like Federico, I think that really says something about the state of the first

00:35:48   party app. I think it also says a lot about Outlook and I think it's sort of

00:35:52   funny that like I'd never heard of this app that was acquired and then all of a

00:35:55   sudden like Outlook's out and it's basically the same app with a new icon and people

00:35:59   are you know like if those guys that have been more successful at marketing

00:36:03   maybe they would want to have to sell to Microsoft, I mean I don't know, but it is

00:36:07   just it's an interesting time and then even today there was news about

00:36:12   Microsoft again buying sunrise the calendar app this is crazy I think that

00:36:19   this is like I mean we spoke about this a couple of weeks ago myself in Federico

00:36:22   and I think that this in my mind sticks to it like I genuinely think that for

00:36:27   doing crazy kind of stuff and like unexpected things Microsoft is like the

00:36:33   most exciting tech company to me right now like they are doing stuff and that

00:36:37   and it's new stuff for them so it's like that you I kind of feel like I can't at

00:36:42   the moment I cannot guess where they're going to go next and I think that's really cool

00:36:46   for them to have that kind of feeling about them.

00:36:49   I think it is exciting not necessarily because you believe they're doing the right thing

00:36:54   because we don't know but it's exciting because you're seeing them change like in real time.

00:37:01   It's fundamental huge changes as well like oh now you don't have to pay for OneDrive

00:37:07   and you can integrate Dropbox for Microsoft Office and the apps are free if you do.

00:37:12   It's like, "Whaat?

00:37:14   That's not your business!"

00:37:16   Or like, "Windows is free!"

00:37:18   Like, "Okay!"

00:37:19   They lost mobile, or at least this generation of mobile, and they're trying to grasp at

00:37:24   any straw they can.

00:37:27   They're trying to buy it back.

00:37:29   They're trying to become relevant to people, they're trying to be relevant to us, to the

00:37:32   three of us, and you see their partnership with Dropbox.

00:37:35   So if you have a word document in Dropbox, you just tap it, you can edit in Word, save

00:37:38   it back to Dropbox, all one very fluid thing.

00:37:42   Because they enjoyed dominance for so long and they were late on mobile and I would say

00:37:46   they've basically missed this generation.

00:37:48   Windows Phone is not going anywhere.

00:37:51   They've got to do these things to become relevant and I think it's working by the fact that

00:37:56   you just said you're excited about it.

00:37:57   So it's, you know, I agree with you.

00:38:00   I think they have a lot of interesting things going on.

00:38:02   I think Microsoft at the same time is its own worst enemy sometimes.

00:38:07   The weird pricing around Office on iOS for so long was just baffling until you remember

00:38:13   that they're used to serving corporate customers and that's how corporate world works and it

00:38:17   doesn't work in the consumer space.

00:38:19   So I think they have to take what they know about the enterprise and if they want to move

00:38:24   downstream into the three of us and the way that we work, they have to meet us where we

00:38:29   are.

00:38:30   things like Outlook being a really good mail client with all these like features

00:38:34   that people want is a great example of that. But I think they got to do it, do a

00:38:39   better job at it and I think they got to do it more consistently before any of us

00:38:43   would be looking at Microsoft services or something like that to move our stuff

00:38:46   into. So I really want to try Outlook on iOS but I haven't yet because I know

00:38:51   that Microsoft at the moment don't have a like comparably exciting or well

00:38:56   featured or good-looking Outlook for Mac. And I love Mailbox and I love

00:39:04   organizing my email with Mailbox like making email go away and come back at

00:39:08   certain time reorganizing messages into my own order and stuff. And I'm really

00:39:13   kind of invested in that system and for it to work properly for Mailbox to

00:39:17   really work properly you've got to use it everywhere because otherwise weird

00:39:21   things happen. It just looks really strange. But that's fine because

00:39:26   you just got to understand that going in and I do so now like I can't try

00:39:30   another email app but it looks like Outlook has a lot of those features that

00:39:34   I like like snoozing email basically is one of the big things that I love about

00:39:38   mailbox but I don't know how well their Mac app deals with that stuff but at the

00:39:46   very least their Mac app is still like last generation for their stuff but I

00:39:51   expect that to change but I don't think it's gonna change until like Windows 10

00:39:55   something like that.

00:39:57   We'll see.

00:39:58   I mean, let me just say guys that we will talk about email over the next few weeks.

00:40:05   I've been teasing Myke.

00:40:09   Is that right, Michael?

00:40:10   Yeah, Federico said to me the other day, "I have a big surprise, but I'm not telling you."

00:40:16   Which is effectively what Steven said with the Chromebook, but I think he threw that

00:40:20   out the window a couple of days ago, therefore ruining the experiment.

00:40:23   We should talk about that.

00:40:24   even on the document today. So okay maybe next week. So you guys are up to really

00:40:29   weird things right now and I'm kind of excited about that. Yeah we're the

00:40:34   Microsoft of ourselves, basically. Wow. That's quite nice, I like that. I want to try and find exactly what you said to me, but I can't see it in my messages now.

00:40:47   - Scroll up and command F, surprise.

00:40:52   - I cannot see it, I cannot see it.

00:40:55   It's in here somewhere.

00:40:57   Oh, this is from Federico.

00:41:00   "I also have a big confession for you,

00:41:03   "but I'll tell you over the next few days, it's a big one."

00:41:06   I'm like, you can't just say that to someone,

00:41:08   but you wouldn't tell me, so I don't know what it is.

00:41:11   But there we go, it's teasing,

00:41:13   they call that in the industry, teasing.

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00:43:11   Love three people as well igloo

00:43:15   So nice. Yeah, great people so friendly Canadian. You see they're always nice

00:43:20   So Myke what's going on with beats? I didn't read any of this. I am so confused

00:43:26   I read this 9 to 5 Mac article today

00:43:29   And and I think as the day has gone on things have got clarified a little bit, but I still think it's really confusing

00:43:35   So basically, there's another scoop from Mark Gurman

00:43:38   effectively talking about what Apple's plans for Beats are.

00:43:41   And what it seems like, at least on the face of it,

00:43:43   is Apple is going to be launching

00:43:44   a third music streaming service,

00:43:46   or a third music service, I should say.

00:43:49   So there will be iTunes, which will remain as iTunes,

00:43:52   then they have Beats, and then there will be this new one.

00:43:55   Let's call it iTunes Music,

00:43:57   for the sake of giving it a name for now.

00:43:59   So iTunes Music will be kind of an amalgamation of both,

00:44:03   and it will be baked within the OS

00:44:05   and there'll be like revamped versions of the music apps

00:44:08   and probably iTunes and desktop

00:44:10   that takes into functionality this.

00:44:11   You'll be able to, and it sort of ties into Beats' engine

00:44:15   and all of this cool stuff that we do around playlists

00:44:17   and recommendations and all that kind of stuff.

00:44:19   But it won't be Beats.

00:44:21   And from what it seems like,

00:44:23   they're not gonna be removing Beats when this comes out.

00:44:26   - Why?

00:44:28   - I know, there are kind of hints in the article

00:44:31   that maybe they will phase Beats out,

00:44:34   but Beats will still exist.

00:44:35   This is what I took away from this,

00:44:37   is Beats will still exist, they will use Beats technology,

00:44:40   and you will be able to transfer your playlists

00:44:43   and history from Beats into this app,

00:44:45   but Apple are not renaming and rebranding,

00:44:48   they're creating a brand new Apple-created app.

00:44:50   And also, this may be an Android app as well,

00:44:53   which I really don't understand.

00:44:55   Like, if Beats still exists, why not?

00:44:57   And like, why, I'm so confused, like why?

00:45:00   Why not just say, "Here is an update to Beats.

00:45:03   "Beats is now called iTunes Music,

00:45:05   "and it has a new look and feel."

00:45:07   Like, why be like, "And we're gonna create

00:45:09   "a new Android app as well,

00:45:11   "and the Beats Android app will still be around for a while,

00:45:13   "and it's gonna use the smart stuff,

00:45:15   "but it's gonna be like iTunes-y."

00:45:17   I'm very confused about it.

00:45:19   Federico, do you have any different kind of take from this,

00:45:22   like from the art?

00:45:23   Is that why it's okay? - Yes, I think it kinda

00:45:23   makes sense.

00:45:25   - Okay, no, please tell me why.

00:45:27   Because I can't understand why they wouldn't just rebrand.

00:45:28   Because that's what I would do.

00:45:30   I mean, if I had to buy a company,

00:45:34   I would just buy the company, keep it working,

00:45:36   then slowly phase it out and build the technology

00:45:40   into a new product that I can control fully.

00:45:42   Because maybe you don't know,

00:45:43   maybe Beats Music did something weird with their app

00:45:47   that Apple wants to do better.

00:45:49   So maybe they always had to build it from the ground up.

00:45:52   Yeah, because I mean, maybe they just want to,

00:45:55   I mean, my interpretation is that

00:45:57   they're gonna slowly fade out Beats Music.

00:46:01   They're going to seriously downplay

00:46:04   the music listening aspect in the current iTunes application.

00:46:08   And they're gonna launch this new iTunes Music app,

00:46:11   whatever it's called,

00:46:12   that it's only dedicated to music and to all kinds of music,

00:46:17   whether it's your music or a radio feature or streaming.

00:46:21   And I think it kind of makes sense

00:46:22   because otherwise you would have this situation

00:46:25   that you'd have like Apple makes the music app,

00:46:29   but it also has to maintain Beats Music,

00:46:31   which is their app, but also a separate brand.

00:46:35   I don't know, I think it makes sense

00:46:36   to just start from scratch and incorporate the best ideas

00:46:39   into a new product,

00:46:41   rather than keep maintaining an existing product

00:46:44   and create something strange from a branding perspective.

00:46:47   - Yeah, but that's the thing though,

00:46:48   like it seems like for at least a period of time,

00:46:52   they will be maintaining the Beats app,

00:46:53   that's what I find confusing. - Yeah, of course, of course.

00:46:55   If they would have just on the day one of this launch been like "and Beats Music has gone away and we have this brand new thing"

00:47:01   I would have expected that. But the idea of kind of keeping them at least for a period of time running concurrently

00:47:08   that's what is very peculiar. I can't really wrap my head around that because I didn't expect that.

00:47:13   Yeah, I mean I guess you don't want to say "Hey, Beats Music is going away in like seven days"

00:47:19   But then also...

00:47:20   There's like always a grace period, you know, but I guess it makes sense, I don't know.

00:47:24   Unless you're Everpix.

00:47:25   Heyo!

00:47:26   It's just like arguably though as well, like, the Beats brand is stronger?

00:47:30   Yeah, that's my concern, actually.

00:47:33   Like, why are they doing, like, from Gurman's article,

00:47:39   it seems like they're doing away with the Beats brand, and that's kind of weird, I think.

00:47:43   I don't know.

00:47:44   My only thoughts on that is maybe they want to focus the Beats brand on the hardware,

00:47:48   because I think the hardware is definitely way better known.

00:47:51   Yeah.

00:47:53   And maybe it's, you know, if you think about it that way, then maybe iTunes is a stronger

00:47:58   brand than Beats Audio, you know, as far as a music service.

00:48:03   But I think the timing is definitely, you know, if this article plays out is weird.

00:48:09   And I think potentially really confusing, like, you know, what, what, where should I

00:48:14   listen to music?

00:48:15   You know, Apple is, you know, what should a user do with something Apple is really good

00:48:18   at answering most of the time?

00:48:20   and and it seems like if this is going to be a weird transition that's going to

00:48:24   be foggy for a little while I do think they've got to do something with iTunes

00:48:28   I mean it's it's iTunes is aging the the people like me who buy music and sync it

00:48:35   to an iPod we're dying off in droves and so they have to do something to

00:48:39   modernize their music platform and clearly that's what's part of the Beats

00:48:42   purchase I just I hate to see them move forward in a way that is is confusing or

00:48:48   in a way that costs them, you know, cost them customers or brand loyalty.

00:48:54   Because I think people who like the Beats Audio app really like it, and it'd be a shame

00:48:59   to throw all that away, but who knows?

00:49:02   I'm concerned as well this will just be bolted into iTunes.

00:49:06   Like there's just this part of me that's like, "They're not gonna do anything significant

00:49:11   of iTunes."

00:49:12   It's just gonna be like, "This is the other thing!

00:49:14   Hey guys, there's something else that's in iTunes."

00:49:18   that concerns me. Like at least if it was Beats, right, then you could just

00:49:22   have this separate app which does that part but I just feel like it's just

00:49:26   gonna be another thing to go into iTunes. Or maybe you're just gonna have iTunes

00:49:31   on the desktop and there's going to be a music app also on the desktop finally.

00:49:36   The music part is out of iTunes. Well if they were gonna do that they

00:49:42   should just split apart everything because then it doesn't make you... I see where

00:49:46   you're going with that, but then the brand iTunes makes no sense.

00:49:50   They should just be like the iOS management app, the music app, and the podcast app, please?

00:50:01   What I caught from the article that was interesting to me, German says that users are going to

00:50:07   be able to listen to their own music and also to browse the streaming catalog and add music

00:50:15   to their collections.

00:50:17   And that's kind of strange because it sounds like you're going to be able to have local

00:50:20   music and presumably iTunes match music and streaming music in the same application.

00:50:28   Spotify used to kind of do this.

00:50:31   I don't know if it still does.

00:50:32   And it was super, super confusing.

00:50:34   Terrible, like really bad, but it did kind of do it.

00:50:37   Because you end up having all these little badges next to songs to tell you whether it's

00:50:42   streaming or cache because you're going to be able to also, according to Gurman, to download

00:50:47   songs in an offline cache, so you're going to have badges for streaming, cache, local

00:50:53   music and iTunes match music.

00:50:55   It's kind of sounds like a mess.

00:50:58   And in fact, it's no surprise that the article also says development has been problematic

00:51:04   inside Apple.

00:51:05   And so hopefully they will do some, you know, I think they need to clean some things up,

00:51:10   Like iTunes Match needs to go away, I hope so.

00:51:15   Or maybe just make it a super niche feature instead of putting it front and center into

00:51:21   iTunes.

00:51:22   I don't know.

00:51:23   They need to do some reorganization for music because they have so many different products.

00:51:27   iTunes Match, iTunes, iTunes Radio, Beats Music.

00:51:32   Yeah that's about it.

00:51:33   I'm telling you man, it's gonna be called iTunes Match Music Radio Streaming in the

00:51:38   cloud.

00:51:39   It's going to be, I mean, I'm being stupid, but the name I cannot imagine will be good.

00:51:43   They should just give it a brand new name.

00:51:45   Maybe it'll just be Apple Music.

00:51:46   Apple Music.

00:51:47   Kill iTunes.

00:51:48   Yeah.

00:51:48   Just kill it.

00:51:48   Kill iTunes.

00:51:49   I don't know, man.

00:51:50   It's, it's, I think a lot of people hate iTunes, but it is well known.

00:51:55   Um, I don't know.

00:51:56   It's, it's confusing to think about and you know, like right now it's sort of clear

00:52:03   because they're very separate, right?

00:52:05   Like you have iTunes and iTunes match and then you have Beats and they're

00:52:09   discrete non-related things.

00:52:11   And so once they start blending them,

00:52:13   it could go sideways.

00:52:16   We'll see though.

00:52:17   - Yeah. - We'll see.

00:52:18   - Right, Federico posted a nice article today,

00:52:25   an iPad Air review.

00:52:27   Which is kind of not a review, we'll talk about that.

00:52:30   A review in the sense of, anyway,

00:52:33   I'll get to what I mean in a moment.

00:52:34   But let's take a moment to thank our third

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00:55:25   So what I was referring to before is,

00:55:28   so Federico posted an iPad Air 2 review today,

00:55:33   But it's not really a review of the iPad Air 2,

00:55:36   at least that's the way that I took it.

00:55:37   Like yes, you're talking about it,

00:55:39   but it's much more the iPad as a thing than the Air 2.

00:55:44   I mean, you talk about in the hardware section specifically

00:55:48   what the features of the Air 2 have helped you

00:55:51   to get things done faster,

00:55:53   but a lot of that stuff is maybe inconsequential

00:55:56   to the overall idea of what the iPad allows you to do.

00:56:00   Is that fair to say?

00:56:01   I guess I used the Air 2 as a jumping point to discuss in general, because I realized,

00:56:09   like I said on Twitter, that I never fully expressed my thoughts on why I used the iPad,

00:56:16   because I had a bunch of mentions here and there on Max Stories, and then of course a

00:56:21   lot of episodes of The Prompt and Connected, but I never put together all my thoughts in

00:56:27   a single place.

00:56:28   So that's what I kind of used the Air 2, I wouldn't say as an excuse because I really

00:56:34   loved the device.

00:56:36   But I wanted to review the device, so the review in itself was kind of brief.

00:56:41   And I used the occasion, the opportunity to talk about the iPad in general.

00:56:46   Yeah, that is correct, Michael.

00:56:49   So talk us through then a little bit.

00:56:52   Give people maybe that haven't read it like a kind of an overall idea of the types of

00:56:57   things that you're talking about and what this is really displaying for you.

00:57:02   So the basic point is that three months ago I bought an iPad Air 2 but for three

00:57:10   years now I've been trying to slowly but steadily moving all my way of working

00:57:20   and being entertained from the Mac to the iPad and it started three years ago

00:57:28   because I was hospitalized and I was stuck in a bed doing funny chemo

00:57:38   treatments so I wasn't able to to use a Mac because it was too heavy and

00:57:43   uncomfortable, I didn't have Wi-Fi. So after I went for like two weeks without working,

00:57:53   which is unusual for me because I always want to work because I'm lucky enough to have,

00:57:58   like my work also is kind of fun for me, you know, it's like I'm playing every day with

00:58:03   stuff and it's like a game that prints money, not too much money because I'm not a billionaire

00:58:09   or whatever, but it seems to be working.

00:58:12   So for me, it's also fun besides being, you know,

00:58:15   financial moderate success for me.

00:58:18   - Yeah.

00:58:19   - And it's always weird when I cannot work.

00:58:22   And I was really upset because I was stuck there.

00:58:25   So I was like, you know,

00:58:26   I'm just gonna try to use the iPad.

00:58:28   So three years ago, iPad 3, iOS 6,

00:58:33   the situation was really different from today.

00:58:36   and it was really hard for me to just do simple things like I want to have a simple link on

00:58:43   Maxories and it was really hard for me because I didn't know Python, I didn't have all these

00:58:48   fancy workflows, so I kind of started my way there with apps and Dropbox and Markdown and

00:58:55   all this basic stuff.

00:58:57   And over the years I've been trying to work around the limitations of iOS using scripts,

00:59:05   URL schemes, bookmarklets, that kind of stuff.

00:59:09   And then last year, iOS 8, and it was a huge change for me with extensions, action extensions,

00:59:19   the share sheets, the document extensions, it was really a big change for me.

00:59:23   And so in the article I tried to kind of express why, in spite of working from home and having

00:59:35   a Mac that works and runs Yosemite, why I still work from my iPad and I do everything

00:59:42   on the iPad, and the only thing that I do on my MacBook at this point is Skype twice

00:59:47   a week to talk to you guys and downloading torrents, because you cannot do that on iOS,

00:59:54   and other stuff like backups of iOS devices locally in iTunes and, you know, that kind

01:00:00   of access that iOS doesn't give you.

01:00:03   And I wanted to explain in the article why I need to have this ability to always be on

01:00:11   the move, and not just to have the ability, but I have a requirement to always, you know,

01:00:17   to not sit at a desk for several hours every day, because I move a lot around the house,

01:00:23   I move a lot around Rome, I go back and forth between Viterbo and Rome every week, and I

01:00:28   I need to have my work and my friends and my connections and my music, whatever, always

01:00:34   with me.

01:00:36   So the basic point of the article was that.

01:00:43   Why have a 10-inch display instead of using a Mac?

01:00:48   And people seem to be liking it.

01:00:50   Like the response has been far beyond what I was expecting.

01:00:56   So I'm really, really happy.

01:00:57   I got a few questions, if you guys don't mind, that I would like to address real quickly

01:01:03   because I didn't mention these in the article.

01:01:05   So yes, I use a keyboard on my iPad.

01:01:09   For years I used the Logitech tablet keyboard, which is a Bluetooth keyboard with a bunch

01:01:16   of iOS specific shortcuts.

01:01:20   And two months ago, Logitech was kind enough to send me for evaluation these other keyboard

01:01:26   called, oh no, gosh, I don't remember the name, like, uh, logic, it's not the keys to

01:01:34   go, it's not the, oh, you know, I'm really bad with names, I'm gonna send you a link

01:01:39   in the show notes, it's basically like a, it's a case and a keyboard and it's got this

01:01:44   handy feature to, like, it's got extra buttons for iOS, so I can take a screenshot by just

01:01:53   pressing a button on the keyboard and I can do other shortcuts directly on the keyboard that

01:01:58   they're new to this model. Is it just a keyboard? Is it a keyboard with a case?

01:02:03   It's a keyboard with a case and it's like made of, externally it's made of cloth and it's a red

01:02:10   color. It's kind of awesome and I love it because when you open, when you snap the iPad into the

01:02:17   case and you move it towards the keyboard, it attaches using magnets to the keyboard and the

01:02:26   Bluetooth on iOS automatically turns on because it recognizes that a keyboard has been attached.

01:02:31   It's kind of awesome. So I don't have to manually connect. Is it called the Type Plus? I think so.

01:02:39   Yes, thank you Michael. It looks like it because it has a bunch of like it has a Siri key and a

01:02:42   multitasking key. Yes, thank you, thank you Michael. Yes, I also knew the multitasking key,

01:02:47   which was not available in the Logitech tablet keyboard, so I don't have to double click the home

01:02:54   shortcut anymore, I can just click the multitasking shortcut and then I have all my multitasking view.

01:03:01   It's really handy, so I use that when I want to type longer. Usually I just use, this was the

01:03:09   the other question. Usually I just type in portrait mode and I don't use the split keyboard.

01:03:14   So a lot of people...

01:03:15   You do have big hands, don't you?

01:03:17   Yes, yes, I do. I do have big hands. That was the point of my replies on Twitter. I

01:03:23   know it's uncomfortable for most people. God bless me. I don't know. I have big hands.

01:03:33   My mom was especially skilled in making big ends. I don't know.

01:03:38   Whatever. Next question. There was a few people on Twitter that asked me how I publish the

01:03:50   website. It happens from editorial, which is this crazy text editor for iOS that lets

01:03:58   you create workflows, so this is different from the workflow app for iOS.

01:04:03   Editorial lets you create workflows and it supports Python so you can use

01:04:09   scripts to connect to your WordPress website which is what I do. I connect

01:04:15   over Python to my Mac stories and I publish articles from the iPad.

01:04:21   Those were the big questions that I received today. I didn't

01:04:25   include them in the article. Myke and Steven, if you guys have questions, thank you for

01:04:33   letting me talk about the article, I really appreciate it.

01:04:36   Yeah, I do have some. One comment is what I found really interesting, and this ties

01:04:40   back a little bit to last week's episode, you did a better job in that article of making

01:04:46   me want an iPad Air 2 than Apple does. When I was reading it, because this is exactly

01:04:53   what I was looking for is like real reasons to use one and like and I was

01:04:58   imagining being Federico Vittucci you know like going around town and and and

01:05:03   being able to kind of really use these incredible features and like you know

01:05:11   all the things that you talk about and the way that you keep up to date with

01:05:13   things and I imagine like how like I've been doing a lot of writing recently and

01:05:17   and I get very distracted by everything else that's happening.

01:05:23   And I wonder if, do you feel Federico that the iPad allows you to focus more?

01:05:28   Or is that like a myth?

01:05:29   Or you actually do feel that?

01:05:31   No, no, no, no.

01:05:32   That's not a myth at all.

01:05:33   Like, because when I write, I'm like, I'm in lockdown mode.

01:05:37   I'm into the text editor.

01:05:39   And when I'm on a Mac, I'm just looking around all the time

01:05:42   because there's the menu bar, there's stuff, you know?

01:05:45   On the Mac, there's stuff.

01:05:46   you see the desktop, you see the dock, if you're like me and you keep it at the bottom,

01:05:50   I'm sorry Steven.

01:05:53   On the Mac there's always distractions.

01:05:55   You can go into fullscreen mode but it's just an excuse.

01:05:59   On the iPad you're forced to be there.

01:06:03   It's not a Mythmic, it's a real thing.

01:06:10   You said the same thing on the iPad special, that you had this desire for an iPad Air 2

01:06:16   And then it sort of went away.

01:06:17   How much of that do you think is not so much about the iPad Air but about your 6 Plus?

01:06:22   Because you spoke previously you had an iPad Mini, you don't use it hardly at all anymore

01:06:26   if ever.

01:06:27   Do you think it's just that those two are too close for you and you want something sort

01:06:31   of a bigger jump?

01:06:32   Oh they definitely are.

01:06:33   Like the Mini, it's basically I feel like everything I can do on my Mini I can do on

01:06:38   my iPhone 6 Plus and like 90% of them are better on the 6 Plus.

01:06:44   I understand what you're saying Federico and I believe that you are being truthful when

01:06:51   you say you can hold the iPad Air 2 comfortably with one hand.

01:06:56   I don't know if I feel that way myself.

01:07:01   I haven't really played with one long enough but I believe what you're saying.

01:07:06   But what I know is there is literally no problem.

01:07:10   there would never be a problem in me holding the 6+ in one hand for extended periods of

01:07:14   time.

01:07:15   So things like reading and stuff like that, it's better.

01:07:19   And also, many of the apps that I like to use for long periods of time are better on

01:07:23   the iPhone than the iPad, like Tweetbot.

01:07:26   Or like, I can't think of any other, but that's a big one.

01:07:31   And so it looks a lot better and it feels a lot nicer to have the iPhone there rather

01:07:35   than the iPad.

01:07:36   And so that's one big thing for me.

01:07:38   To go along that thread a little bit,

01:07:42   I really enjoyed Federico, the software segment

01:07:44   where you're talking about the apps that you use

01:07:47   and how they make you feel connected to the world.

01:07:49   But I feel that way with my six plus.

01:07:52   I feel like a massive part of my connection to the internet

01:07:57   is through my iPhone and it plays a huge part of my time

01:08:02   with being on the web and all of the things

01:08:08   I do through it and I do a lot of work on it and stuff like that, even when I'm at home.

01:08:14   But how do you feel about your iPhone and how do you use your iPad and iPhone differently?

01:08:21   That's a great question.

01:08:23   I think in many ways what I wrote in the software section can be applied to the iPhone.

01:08:30   It's just for me, because I use the iPad more.

01:08:35   So let me just say I work a lot, you know, because it's fun for me and like I said, it's

01:08:42   almost like a game, so it doesn't really bother me to be working a lot.

01:08:48   So that's why I use the iPad more.

01:08:50   But if I had to say the iPhone is more... it's what I use for photos, it's what I use

01:08:57   for phone calls, it's what I use... the iPhone is what I use when I want to check something

01:09:03   quickly, you know?

01:09:05   Like I'm at the grocery store and I'm waiting in line and I want to see Twitter real quick

01:09:12   and I use the iPhone.

01:09:14   Or someone calls me, I use the iPhone.

01:09:16   I need to send a text, I use the iPhone.

01:09:19   The iPhone for me has become more like a... it's a utility that you use quickly and then

01:09:26   you put away.

01:09:28   And that's one aspect.

01:09:29   The other aspect has been location.

01:09:32   I use my iPhone a lot for maps, for keeping track of where I go.

01:09:43   Before I used to have moves on my iPhone to build the map of all my movements, because

01:09:51   like I said, I move a lot around Rome and going back and forth between Rome and Viterbo,

01:09:57   and I like to visualize all my movements over time.

01:10:00   So I used to rely on moves and now moves is kind of dead so I'm using the Google app which

01:10:06   lets you do sort of the same thing tracking your location and it lets you see your movements

01:10:12   over time on a map and it's not as nice as moves used to be but it works.

01:10:18   What Google app is that?

01:10:20   The Google app?

01:10:21   Google, yes, Google.

01:10:22   Just Google.

01:10:23   So I use the iPhone a lot for quick interactions and for location, I think.

01:10:32   And the iPad is like, for many people, what would be the computer?

01:10:37   You know, for me it's the computer.

01:10:39   And it's strange because I grew up using a regular computer.

01:10:43   In fact, until a few months ago, the computer, in the sense of, you know, the computer, you sit down, you have the keyboard and you have the big screen.

01:10:51   And I grew up with the conception of the computer, you know, the screen, the desk and the chair.

01:10:56   And now the iPad is kind of this new thing.

01:10:58   It's a display that's big enough.

01:11:00   I can do a lot of stuff on it.

01:11:04   And it's nice because the stuff that I do on the iPad, like, people used to, people

01:11:09   still kind of make fun of me sometimes when you go, "Oh, you have a workflow for that?"

01:11:15   Like, every time I write about, you know, all this little time that I can save doing

01:11:20   stuff on the iPad. And it's nice when I see the check at the end of the month for the

01:11:28   stuff that I do by saving time with all these automations. And it kind of makes me… I'm

01:11:36   trying not to be super self-conscious about this, but I'm happy that the stuff that I've

01:11:41   been doing is working out well for me and it allows me to have a decent lifestyle. And

01:11:46   And it's strange, for me writing the article was strange because most people, I mean the

01:11:54   feedback has been great but most people are like "yeah, great article but not for me".

01:11:59   So it's strange for me to, I don't know, like I'm struggling to, the iPad is so, even after

01:12:07   three years is so new to me, like so strange, but it works, you know, and that's the end

01:12:14   of the article, it works.

01:12:16   And it all started from this article from Wired, like nobody knows what the output is

01:12:20   good anymore.

01:12:22   And like I get the perspective, it's just I know what it's good for.

01:12:27   And that was the idea and the conclusion is I know what it's good for.

01:12:32   And hopefully some people will find inspiration in that.

01:12:36   That will make me really, really happy.

01:12:37   I have one last thing that I want to ask you.

01:12:40   And can you give me a short answer to this?

01:12:42   It's fine.

01:12:43   Because I'm not asking for you to defend yourself, but you appreciate that you're a special flower in this, right?

01:12:49   Like that there are many people that

01:12:51   Don't or wouldn't work the way that you do and your reasons

01:12:55   Whilst they make a lot of sense to me at least and I think to many others

01:12:59   There are still a lot of people that aren't gonna work the way that you do. I

01:13:02   Get what you're saying I

01:13:07   think I'm I

01:13:09   I think I'm lucky because I'm, as you say, a special flower, a special case that happens to be...

01:13:16   that happens to have a blog that is read by a few people. I think there are many, many others like me

01:13:23   that just don't have the time or the space where they can express this.

01:13:30   Like, I think I'm not the only one doing this.

01:13:36   It's just because you know me and you know the website and there are other people that know the website and the podcast

01:13:42   so it's like and it's easy, you know, like to point a finger like

01:13:45   there's a

01:13:48   Yahoo news rewrote

01:13:50   Linked to my article and and they use the headline like can the ipad be used as a pc an apple blogger

01:13:57   uh set out to to find out and

01:14:01   like it's easy to use me I guess as an example and again it's super strange to have this

01:14:09   article going so popular and people saying "oh yeah this guy can do it" like it's you

01:14:15   know what I you know how like I don't have to I don't like to be you know all pompous

01:14:22   and stuff like to be "oh my god yeah I'm popular" like I hate that kind of stuff.

01:14:28   I'm just happy that people can use this as an example.

01:14:33   To answer your question, I don't think I'm alone.

01:14:35   I think it's easy to say that I'm alone, but that's not really the truth.

01:14:44   And I think that more people will share their iPad setups.

01:14:53   Also because there's some sort of... like when you try to say "yeah I don't use a Mac",

01:14:58   the Apple community can be a little, you know, aggressive.

01:15:01   But it is still weird to a lot of people though, right?

01:15:04   Mmhmm, yeah, yeah.

01:15:07   And what's... like, change is weird.

01:15:09   You have to have an Apple 2 to do real work, you know, like...

01:15:12   Yeah, exactly.

01:15:13   It's just a cycle.

01:15:14   Like I'm trying to find the right words not to sound like a pretentious guy.

01:15:23   I'm just, you know, I want to be a nice guy.

01:15:28   And popularity, it's kind of a double-edged sword.

01:15:35   When it makes you say things that other people don't get it, they're like, "Oh my God,

01:15:40   this guy."

01:15:41   You know?

01:15:44   So I'm just happy that people can find inspiration in this.

01:15:47   And I know that it's not for everyone.

01:15:50   Totally.

01:15:51   Like, I get it.

01:15:52   Like, people need Macs.

01:15:53   And that's great.

01:15:54   Macs are great.

01:15:55   PCs are great in general.

01:15:57   It's a great invention.

01:15:58   Greatest invention ever.

01:16:01   Also this one, the tablet, is also another great invention.

01:16:03   That was my point.

01:16:07   So I think that about wraps it up for this week.

01:16:09   I don't have anything more.

01:16:12   So does anybody else?

01:16:13   Are we good?

01:16:14   Are we golden? So good. So good. We're back. We're back together and I'm very

01:16:19   I'm very happy to be joined by my co-host this week. If you would like to

01:16:23   find my lovely co-hosts you can find Bitter Eco's work at maxstories.net

01:16:27   and he is @Vittici on Twitter V I T I C C I. Steven is the writer and proprietor

01:16:33   of fivetolfpixels.net. He writes also @sweetsetup too. Is it

01:16:38   That's thesweetsetup.com.

01:16:44   Thesweetsetup.com.

01:16:45   Yes.

01:16:46   Thank you.

01:16:48   And also is @ismh on Twitter and I am @imike.

01:16:53   If you'd like to find the show notes for this week's episode, you want to take yourself

01:16:56   over to relay.fm/connected/25.

01:17:00   Thanks again to our sponsors this week.

01:17:01   Our friends are over at Linda, Igloo, and Squarespace, and we'll be back next time.

01:17:07   Until then, buh-bye.

01:17:08   - Arrivederci.