Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► (upbeat music)

00:00:02 ◼   ► - From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 21.

00:00:11 ◼   ► Today's show is brought to you by Hover,

00:00:13 ◼   ► simplified domain management and Loot Crate,

00:00:16 ◼   ► a monthly subscription box for epic geek

00:00:18 ◼   ► and gamer items and pop culture gear.

00:00:20 ◼   ► My name is Myke Hurley and today I'm joined

00:00:22 ◼   ► by Mr. Steven Hackett.

00:00:23 ◼   ► Hello, Steven Hackett.

00:00:25 ◼   ► - Hello, Michael Hurley.

00:00:26 ◼   ► - And the glorious return of Federico Vittucci.

00:00:29 ◼   ► Hello, Federico.

00:00:30 ◼   ► Hey guys, how are you?

00:00:32 ◼   ► Happy to have you back.

00:00:33 ◼   ► I'm happy to be here again.

00:00:36 ◼   ► Happy New Year to Steven.

00:00:38 ◼   ► You too, buddy.

00:00:39 ◼   ► Because we didn't talk, I said Happy New Year to Myke last week, but I didn't say that to

00:00:44 ◼   ► you.

00:00:45 ◼   ► So do you celebrate the New Year in Tennessee?

00:00:51 ◼   ► We are aware of it.

00:00:52 ◼   ► They have a different calendar.

00:00:54 ◼   ► Yeah, you do.

00:00:56 ◼   ► It's 1945 in Tennessee.

00:00:59 ◼   ► In some ways that's not untrue, but yeah, no, it was lovely.

00:01:03 ◼   ► Had a nice Italian dinner actually, and then went home.

00:01:09 ◼   ► What did you have to eat?

00:01:11 ◼   ► I had, well, so Italian in air quotes, right, because Federico's here, but I had a lovely

00:01:18 ◼   ► ravioli and meat sauce and some salad and some tea.

00:01:24 ◼   ► It was good.

00:01:27 ◼   ► So what did you do at midnight?

00:01:29 ◼   ► Did you just stare at the OS X installer?

00:01:34 ◼   ► I was in bed early.

00:01:36 ◼   ► I didn't see the midnight.

00:01:38 ◼   ► My idea would have been better, I think.

00:01:41 ◼   ► Probably.

00:01:43 ◼   ► I think I should have gone with what you went with, but I'm old and saying up to midnight

00:01:47 ◼   ► seems impossible.

00:01:48 ◼   ► Cool.

00:01:50 ◼   ► So yeah, it feels good to be back, Myke.

00:01:53 ◼   ► The last episode was really great.

00:01:55 ◼   ► You guys did a great job, I think.

00:01:57 ◼   ► 2014 has been a strange year for technology.

00:02:02 ◼   ► What do you think we're gonna see this year?

00:02:05 ◼   ► - The Apple Watch.

00:02:06 ◼   ► - The Apple Watch, like Jeff Bezos buys a real AFM.

00:02:10 ◼   ► - Federico, you sound a little under the weather.

00:02:14 ◼   ► - I do?

00:02:14 ◼   ► - Yeah, you sound like you've got a cold.

00:02:16 ◼   ► - Well, yeah, I had one like a couple of weeks ago.

00:02:22 ◼   ► - Are you still, did you have a heavy new year?

00:02:27 ◼   ► Like a week later, are you still feeling the effects of New Year?

00:02:29 ◼   ► Well, you know, it takes a while to get back to the usual routine.

00:02:39 ◼   ► It's been a, let's say, it's been not a great first week of the year for me,

00:02:47 ◼   ► but now it should be getting better.

00:02:50 ◼   ► That's how I like to look at it.

00:02:55 ◼   ► One of the unfortunate things about 2015 so far is that we have 100,000 pieces of follow-up.

00:03:02 ◼   ► It's an entire page in our Google Doc.

00:03:06 ◼   ► This is the most I've ever seen, so do you want to get started?

00:03:10 ◼   ► So we'll get started.

00:03:11 ◼   ► So FU number one.

00:03:14 ◼   ► FU number one?

00:03:17 ◼   ► You're saying FU but then you're calling me number one.

00:03:19 ◼   ► It's very conflicted.

00:03:22 ◼   ► like you're the best worst person I know. So listener Arno, Arno, listener Arno

00:03:29 ◼   ► wrote in and basically asked do App Store rejections, which we've talked a

00:03:34 ◼   ► lot about of course, matter in the grand scheme of things? So Arno's argument is

00:03:38 ◼   ► that while app rejections are like obviously a big deal to us and our

00:03:44 ◼   ► friends, that maybe like normal people it's not such a big deal that you know

00:03:50 ◼   ► like Federico likes to call them normal people you know his like our friends who

00:03:54 ◼   ► aren't in this space like a do they even use these apps that get like bumped you

00:04:00 ◼   ► know by Apple and even if they do like is it is it a big deal that these

00:04:05 ◼   ► features or these apps are like held back because you know most people don't

00:04:09 ◼   ► really care about things like today widgets that can fire app actions and

00:04:14 ◼   ► that sort of thing so at least my two senses that I will concede that this is

00:04:19 ◼   ► sort of a problem that is limited to a certain slice of the App Store and a

00:04:25 ◼   ► certain slice of customers of the App Store but I would argue that it is part

00:04:28 ◼   ► of the market that Apple should pay attention to because we do have

00:04:32 ◼   ► influence in you know the press and that we are the people who Apple needs to buy

00:04:37 ◼   ► the watch on day one and who will end up behind the watch on day one more than

00:04:42 ◼   ► likely so while we are a small part of the market I would argue that we're an

00:04:45 ◼   ► important one. I don't think normal people, my friends as I call them, I don't

00:04:54 ◼   ► think they care about the same apps that we care about. They don't use stuff like

00:04:59 ◼   ► Drafz or Peacalc. I mean there are people of course who use them but it's

00:05:05 ◼   ► just on average I don't see those kinds of you know more articulated apps on

00:05:11 ◼   ► on other people's home screen.

00:05:14 ◼   ► But the ignorance doesn't make it right, just because the majority of customers on the App

00:05:21 ◼   ► Store don't use the same apps that we do because we are more tech-savvy or we just like to...

00:05:27 ◼   ► I mean, Steven, you run a website about comparing the best apps for the job.

00:05:34 ◼   ► Because millions of people don't...

00:05:36 ◼   ► They just want the free utility from the App Store.

00:05:38 ◼   ► don't want the best or the more powerful app, it doesn't mean that Apple shouldn't be paying

00:05:44 ◼   ► attention to this problem, especially because when they have rules and when they don't follow

00:05:49 ◼   ► those rules, that's just wrong, and when you come up with a stupid exception that's just

00:05:56 ◼   ► stupid, there's no excuse for the stupidity of some app store rejections.

00:06:01 ◼   ► So if you want to make up rules as you go, I don't think that's a great idea.

00:06:07 ◼   ► I think Apple should update the guidelines and clearly state "here's what we want you

00:06:13 ◼   ► to do, here's what you cannot do" because that's a new rule on the App Store.

00:06:21 ◼   ► I don't think that releasing new iOS features just like they did with iOS 8 at WWDC and

00:06:29 ◼   ► then saying "yep, we have this feature but you cannot use it because otherwise we're

00:06:34 ◼   ► going to reject you".

00:06:35 ◼   ► I don't think that's a great behavior from Apple, I don't think that's a great strategy.

00:06:41 ◼   ► So even if people don't care about this, it doesn't mean that Apple shouldn't be better,

00:06:48 ◼   ► and hopefully next year they will be better.

00:06:50 ◼   ► I think, for myself, part of the problem that I see with this is the indie developers that

00:06:56 ◼   ► go through these problems end up being the people that set trends that the bigger apps

00:07:00 ◼   ► follow.

00:07:01 ◼   ► So if you look at stuff like port-refresh or like x-coreback URLs, things that are used

00:07:07 ◼   ► now by all the biggest apps because they end up setting trends or design features or just

00:07:13 ◼   ► standard interaction methods that we get used to, these things were all pioneered by indie

00:07:19 ◼   ► developers who were pushing the envelope and if Apple makes it harder and harder and harder

00:07:22 ◼   ► for them it's going to stunt the development of the entire platform.

00:07:29 ◼   ► It's like you're going against the people who experiment and come up with all the ideas

00:07:34 ◼   ► that eventually trickle down to more mainstream software.

00:07:42 ◼   ► So I think it's extremely important to make sure that the people who like the pioneers

00:07:47 ◼   ► of software always get the best deal, you know?

00:07:52 ◼   ► And that's really problematic, you know, for people like us because these are the apps

00:07:57 ◼   ► that we use and that we love, and it's concerning to see a company releasing all these features

00:08:04 ◼   ► and then months later, even after approving these apps, coming up with all sorts of exceptions

00:08:09 ◼   ► and then you...

00:08:11 ◼   ► And even that's not necessarily the worst part for me.

00:08:14 ◼   ► The really bad part about these apps or rejections is first you approve an app and then you reject

00:08:23 ◼   ► it and then the following day because the developer went to the press you accept the

00:08:28 ◼   ► app again.

00:08:29 ◼   ► It makes it seem like you don't know what you're doing.

00:08:32 ◼   ► That makes Apple look weak, I think.

00:08:35 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:36 ◼   ► And when they say, because they had this crazy weird blog post on the developer blog, and

00:08:44 ◼   ► they were like, "Remember that the most effective way to appeal to a rejection is to use the

00:08:50 ◼   ► app review board."

00:08:51 ◼   ► It's not true because when people went to the press, to TechCrunch and other blogs, that

00:08:57 ◼   ► was clearly the most effective way because it took less than 24 hours.

00:09:02 ◼   ► And there was a blog post from Panic where they say that because of these blog posts,

00:09:07 ◼   ► we managed to get transmit with the iCloud Drive feature back on the App Store.

00:09:12 ◼   ► So what you're saying on the developer blog sounds like an excuse because it's not true.

00:09:17 ◼   ► It's really weird.

00:09:18 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:09:19 ◼   ► Marco's take on it that it kind of sounded like a threat yeah it was kind

00:09:25 ◼   ► of sound like a threat it's like a sort of like I don't know it sounds like a

00:09:28 ◼   ► Godfather type thing you know yeah you know it's good for you an offer that

00:09:34 ◼   ► you can refuse exactly yeah Phil Schiller's just outside someone's house

00:09:40 ◼   ► with a baseball bat waiting for them to come out yeah we should we should move

00:09:44 ◼   ► You come to me on the day that I reject your app? Speaking of app store

00:09:53 ◼   ► rejections, our Myke's app, sort of, the wonderful tg-tweets had an issue

00:10:02 ◼   ► with their icon and I actually had that thought in beta that he was using the

00:10:06 ◼   ► or Myke was using, not Myke, was using the Twitter bird in the logo and

00:10:12 ◼   ► apparently Apple rejected it because it was a misleading use of the Twitter logo

00:10:19 ◼   ► and it looks like he's got a new one at least on his profile.

00:10:22 ◼   ► Yeah somebody has saved the day and helped Danny out with a new logo but I just

00:10:28 ◼   ► thought it was interesting like "and now our apps rejected it!" Yeah!

00:10:33 ◼   ► Yeah so you know it that's one thing I can understand you know kind of getting

00:10:39 ◼   ► close to another brand but there's definitely silliness.

00:10:43 ◼   ► - But we failed as beta testers

00:10:46 ◼   ► because we should have done better.

00:10:48 ◼   ► - Stephen failed 'cause I haven't even noticed it.

00:10:50 ◼   ► - I thought about it but it didn't say anything.

00:10:50 ◼   ► - It just didn't tell anyone.

00:10:52 ◼   ► It's like, oh, the app doesn't work on my phone

00:10:54 ◼   ► but you'll work that out.

00:10:56 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:10:57 ◼   ► - So--

00:10:59 ◼   ► - There's a new icon coming.

00:11:01 ◼   ► Did you guys see the tweet from--

00:11:03 ◼   ► - It looks good.

00:11:04 ◼   ► - I didn't see the icon, I just saw the tweet.

00:11:06 ◼   ► It's his Twitter bio picture, the feather.

00:11:11 ◼   ► - The quill.

00:11:13 ◼   ► - Oh, nice. - Yes, thank you, Myke.

00:11:14 ◼   ► Looks good.

00:11:15 ◼   ► So, on occasion we have talked about photo management

00:11:21 ◼   ► on our show.

00:11:22 ◼   ► I don't know if you guys have noticed.

00:11:24 ◼   ► - Occasionally? - Occasionally.

00:11:27 ◼   ► So, FU2 is about photos on iCloud.com,

00:11:31 ◼   ► disappeared for a little while.

00:11:32 ◼   ► So there's a link to the Mac observer.

00:11:36 ◼   ► basically Apple didn't say anything and iPhoto was,

00:11:41 ◼   ► or not iPhoto, Photos for iCloud.

00:11:44 ◼   ► Is that what we're calling it, Photos for iCloud?

00:11:45 ◼   ► Is that what Apple calls it?

00:11:46 ◼   ► It's very confusing.

00:11:47 ◼   ► - iPhoto in iCloud. - Apple Photos in the cloud

00:11:49 ◼   ► match in the cloud and--

00:11:51 ◼   ► - iPhoto in iCloud in iOS.

00:11:54 ◼   ► - In the match. - Yes.

00:11:56 ◼   ► So I think that's kind of weird,

00:11:58 ◼   ► but it's still in beta, right?

00:11:59 ◼   ► So if they took it down and put it back up,

00:12:01 ◼   ► like I think that's whatever.

00:12:03 ◼   ► I was gonna ask you, Federico,

00:12:06 ◼   ► And I meant to ask you, when we spoke about this a couple weeks ago, what does photos

00:12:10 ◼   ► on iCloud match tunes?

00:12:13 ◼   ► What does that look like on OS X?

00:12:16 ◼   ► Do photos just show up in the iCloud drive in Finder or can you even access them at this

00:12:20 ◼   ► point from the Mac?

00:12:21 ◼   ► Because the photos for OS X app is not out yet, of course.

00:12:24 ◼   ► So what's the experience like on your MacBook Air?

00:12:26 ◼   ► Okay, you're going to hate me for this.

00:12:30 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:12:31 ◼   ► Because you're not running Yosemite.

00:12:33 ◼   ► No, no, I am.

00:12:35 ◼   ► I just didn't bother to look because I just look at pictures on my phone and my iPad.

00:12:40 ◼   ► You're in front of your MacBook Air right now.

00:12:44 ◼   ► Go to finder.

00:12:45 ◼   ► Where I'm supposed to look, okay.

00:12:48 ◼   ► There's no iCloud drive in my sidebar.

00:12:50 ◼   ► It's called the iCloud photo library, by the way.

00:12:53 ◼   ► So do you have it on mic?

00:12:55 ◼   ► Yes, I do actually.

00:12:57 ◼   ► Okay, so what does it look like if you have...

00:13:00 ◼   ► What does it look like on the Mac?

00:13:01 ◼   ► I have my iCloud drive and there's no...

00:13:03 ◼   ► There's no photos folder.

00:13:04 ◼   ► There's no photos folder, there's nothing.

00:13:08 ◼   ► There's other apps that I use on iOS and the Mac, but no photos.

00:13:12 ◼   ► Okay, and the chat room is screaming that it's just in the browser, so it's on iOS and

00:13:17 ◼   ► the browser.

00:13:18 ◼   ► Yeah, I used the iCloud.com web app for the one time that I wanted to look at pictures

00:13:25 ◼   ► on my Mac for some reason, probably because I was in a sort of Steven Hackett fugue state.

00:13:33 ◼   ► I wanted to look at pictures.

00:13:35 ◼   ► Yeah, because I mean, I'm taking pictures on my phone.

00:13:37 ◼   ► Why would I want to look at pictures on my Mac?

00:13:40 ◼   ► I mean, it's not like I use, I don't know, one of those widows that they use like FX

00:13:45 ◼   ► to do post-processing on photos, whatever.

00:13:47 ◼   ► I just take pictures and save them and send them to my mom and my friends.

00:13:52 ◼   ► You know, I just don't process photos.

00:13:54 ◼   ► What does it mean to process photos?

00:13:56 ◼   ► I have no, I have no idea what I'm doing with pictures.

00:14:00 ◼   ► My photo library is currently being prepared.

00:14:05 ◼   ► It's preparing itself?

00:14:06 ◼   ► Yeah, it's currently preparing itself.

00:14:09 ◼   ► I don't know what that means.

00:14:10 ◼   ► Well, I've just logged in.

00:14:11 ◼   ► Guys, you know when they show you, when there's people and they're excited to see, like, "Oh,

00:14:18 ◼   ► in this photo editing app, you can see all the curves and all the levels and I have no

00:14:23 ◼   ► idea what that means."

00:14:24 ◼   ► That excites me.

00:14:25 ◼   ► Yeah, I know.

00:14:26 ◼   ► I know that excites me.

00:14:29 ◼   ► Sometimes I try to tweak those sliders and I mess up every time.

00:14:34 ◼   ► And a picture turns all dark and gloomy and that sucks.

00:14:40 ◼   ► I don't have any sort of photographic knowledge.

00:14:45 ◼   ► So I just take pictures and I save them on my phone and that's it.

00:14:48 ◼   ► So I'm sorry, Steven, but I had no idea.

00:14:52 ◼   ► But it doesn't seem like they're available in the Finder.

00:14:56 ◼   ► So I've never looked online before and it practically looks just like what it does on iOS.

00:15:02 ◼   ► Yeah, there's a screenshot in the chatroom from the wizard and it's just a grid of images.

00:15:08 ◼   ► Yep.

00:15:08 ◼   ► So we'll add that to the show notes.

00:15:11 ◼   ► Michael?

00:15:12 ◼   ► Yes.

00:15:13 ◼   ► Where could people find the show notes?

00:15:15 ◼   ► Relay.fm/connect2/21

00:15:17 ◼   ► Wow, you were all minimalistic.

00:15:20 ◼   ► So it's my new rethinking for 2015.

00:15:24 ◼   ► This is the new Zen.

00:15:27 ◼   ► I want to just give the people what they want as fast as they can take it.

00:15:33 ◼   ► That was really quick.

00:15:34 ◼   ► You just really gave it to them fast.

00:15:37 ◼   ► So follow up number three.

00:15:39 ◼   ► We're almost halfway there.

00:15:42 ◼   ► Last week during the show I promised that I would look up our show notes in my virtual

00:15:48 ◼   ► machine that is running Next Step, but my Next Step VM doesn't have a browser.

00:15:53 ◼   ► So if you are out there and you can help me install a browser in my Next Step VM, please

00:15:58 ◼   ► contact me because I would like to do that and to be fair I spent zero time looking into

00:16:03 ◼   ► it but if you want to help me, get in touch.

00:16:06 ◼   ► Is that because you failed?

00:16:08 ◼   ► It's because I forgot about it again.

00:16:10 ◼   ► You failed didn't you?

00:16:12 ◼   ► You don't know how to do it.

00:16:13 ◼   ► Wow.

00:16:14 ◼   ► I didn't even look into how to do it.

00:16:18 ◼   ► You don't just know though?

00:16:20 ◼   ► I don't just know.

00:16:21 ◼   ► Okay.

00:16:22 ◼   ► I could do it in, you know, OS 8. So the next bit of follow-up, follow-up 4, follow-up IV,

00:16:31 ◼   ► if you will, for doing Roman numerals. Myke, I want to toss this to you about Google and the

00:16:38 ◼   ► Motorola numbers from last week. Did you read this link in on the New York Times? No. Okay. Well,

00:16:44 ◼   ► there's a link in the New York Times about the Google and Motorola acquisition because I think

00:16:49 ◼   ► We goofed up the numbers, but it's hard to tell because it's all very confusing.

00:16:52 ◼   ► But if anybody did, it wasn't me.

00:16:54 ◼   ► It was your segment.

00:16:56 ◼   ► Nah, I don't think it was.

00:16:57 ◼   ► Okay, well apparently some numbers are weird.

00:16:59 ◼   ► If you're upset, then go read that link, which you can find in the show notes.

00:17:04 ◼   ► Thank you very much to whoever sent that in.

00:17:06 ◼   ► Yeah, I don't know who sent that in.

00:17:08 ◼   ► So...

00:17:09 ◼   ► I failed.

00:17:10 ◼   ► You really...

00:17:11 ◼   ► Follow-up IV was just a disaster, wasn't it?

00:17:14 ◼   ► It really was.

00:17:16 ◼   ► I'm really sorry.

00:17:17 ◼   ► - Should we move on to-- - I'm sorry for you guys.

00:17:22 ◼   ► You sound really sad.

00:17:26 ◼   ► - It's really coming off, we're 17 minutes in

00:17:29 ◼   ► and the wheels are just off.

00:17:30 ◼   ► So the next three follow ups five, six and seven

00:17:35 ◼   ► are about our show notes in browsers.

00:17:37 ◼   ► And the first one is in a homemade browser

00:17:41 ◼   ► that Will Richardson on Twitter apparently made a browser

00:17:45 ◼   ► when he was 14 and he used it to load our show notes.

00:17:48 ◼   ► - So can he just make browsers these things?

00:17:51 ◼   ► - He did, it's called Meteor version 1.2

00:17:53 ◼   ► and the show notes don't load very well

00:17:55 ◼   ► but made his own browser so that's pretty cool.

00:17:59 ◼   ► - Did he make it just so like, for us?

00:18:04 ◼   ► - If he's 14 now then yes, but I read it

00:18:07 ◼   ► as if it were in past tense.

00:18:09 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:18:10 ◼   ► - He doesn't look like he's 14.

00:18:13 ◼   ► - Okay.

00:18:14 ◼   ► The next the next couple links, it's just so weird,

00:18:19 ◼   ► listener Brian loaded our show notes in a browser called 3B. Why is it 3B?

00:18:25 ◼   ► What is that? It's your own personal 3D space. It's very

00:18:32 ◼   ► strange. There's a link in the chat room to this. You should definitely go try it

00:18:38 ◼   ► out. You guys lit up these dropper links so quick. Do you guys look at this?

00:18:43 ◼   ► Myke, did you know that the PlayStation Home thing where you control this little human

00:18:50 ◼   ► in a virtual space? The next step is to ask people to do stuff like open the relay website

00:18:58 ◼   ► in these virtual realities. And why is this guy wearing a shirt with all these hearts?

00:19:06 ◼   ► Because he loves us. So the first one, screenshot one, is looking at the connected page and

00:19:12 ◼   ► And then, it's our Twitter pages.

00:19:16 ◼   ► The person is wearing hearts.

00:19:17 ◼   ► I think that's really sweet.

00:19:19 ◼   ► Can you walk around while you're looking at show notes?

00:19:21 ◼   ► I think you can.

00:19:22 ◼   ► I didn't try to use the product because I didn't want to make my computer explode.

00:19:27 ◼   ► But it looks so bad though.

00:19:29 ◼   ► It's really weird.

00:19:32 ◼   ► Can you jump in the car and drive against the show notes?

00:19:38 ◼   ► Self-driving show notes is big at CES this year.

00:19:41 ◼   ► Wow.

00:19:42 ◼   ► It's a thing, so that happened.

00:19:44 ◼   ► - Well, it looks like it, yeah.

00:19:47 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:19:48 ◼   ► - Oh my God.

00:19:49 ◼   ► - I like the retro interface of this browser.

00:19:54 ◼   ► - Like there's some parts of it, like screenshot three,

00:19:57 ◼   ► I don't even understand what's going on.

00:20:00 ◼   ► Like what is that?

00:20:02 ◼   ► - What is the destination button?

00:20:03 ◼   ► What does it do?

00:20:04 ◼   ► There's a subway button?

00:20:06 ◼   ► - I don't know, it's very strange.

00:20:09 ◼   ► - Can you take Korea into the subway?

00:20:11 ◼   ► You can take an airport shuttle and go visit Analogue on the next page.

00:20:15 ◼   ► There should have been a tube button just for Myke.

00:20:19 ◼   ► Just for Myke. Yeah.

00:20:23 ◼   ► So the last piece of follow-up from Aaron on

00:20:27 ◼   ► Twitter. I'm going to mess up Aaron's last name so I'm just going to check it out and skip it.

00:20:31 ◼   ► Of Relay FM loaded up in

00:20:35 ◼   ► Pixel Fari, which is Nevin Muren's

00:20:39 ◼   ► browser that is basically real 8-bit so it's like a safari. I remember this.

00:20:45 ◼   ► yeah I totally forgot about it but it's super cool and it basically makes

00:20:49 ◼   ► everything look like you know

00:20:50 ◼   ► nevin's games are an 8-bit so you have space age and the incident so it's kind

00:20:55 ◼   ► of that sort of look

00:20:57 ◼   ► I think it looks pretty cool and of course it loads relatively well

00:21:01 ◼   ► there's a few issues in the navigation but overall works pretty well

00:21:04 ◼   ► I think it's great. yeah I like this this is cool

00:21:08 ◼   ► So that's the follow up this week.

00:21:12 ◼   ► Well then it's probably about time for a sponsor.

00:21:16 ◼   ► That sounds good to me.

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00:23:06 ◼   ► FM. Thank you so much to Hover for their continued support of Connected.

00:23:11 ◼   ► Did you like the code Federico? Yeah it was really really really great.

00:23:15 ◼   ► Hover is on board with our movie. Well everybody is. Oh I mean yeah obviously.

00:23:21 ◼   ► We already received funding from a big Hollywood studio. Oh yeah I didn't know about this.

00:23:26 ◼   ► I did! I didn't tell you guys. Oh you did you got it all right yeah yeah as long as

00:23:31 ◼   ► As long as someone has it. Yeah, it was like one of those scenes from the from

00:23:36 ◼   ► Entourage, the the TV show. Never seen it. It's really great. Me neither.

00:23:41 ◼   ► Is that like Star Wars? Oh, come on! You don't get my pop culture references. That's a problem.

00:23:47 ◼   ► I'm sorry. Wait, what show am I on now? Yeah, I'm sorry to be the... Alright, so we

00:23:54 ◼   ► have some real-time follow-up from a friend of the show Doug Beal who's in

00:23:59 ◼   ► the chat room Doug Beale threw up connected on Emacs 24.4.1

00:24:06 ◼   ► I don't know what that means

00:24:07 ◼   ► and it's very exciting to see our site in black and white and aqua so that's also in

00:24:15 ◼   ► the show notes now so that is now

00:24:16 ◼   ► Why is the logo so big?

00:24:19 ◼   ► Because it we scale it down on this oh I can't the file we use is much bigger than how it

00:24:25 ◼   ► is shown on the website because of programming.

00:24:31 ◼   ► Anyways, topic zero, guys.

00:24:35 ◼   ► We're going to talk about Hackintoshes.

00:24:37 ◼   ► Wow.

00:24:37 ◼   ► Amazing.

00:24:38 ◼   ► OK, topic zero is--

00:24:39 ◼   ► What year is this?

00:24:41 ◼   ► We've got like, Emacs and Pixel Fari and Hackintoshes.

00:24:45 ◼   ► Like, this is 2015, guys.

00:24:46 ◼   ► Come on.

00:24:47 ◼   ► No, it's definitely 2006.

00:24:50 ◼   ► So this came up because listener Brian,

00:24:52 ◼   ► who exchanged some emails with me this week,

00:24:54 ◼   ► kind of asked our thoughts on it.

00:24:55 ◼   ► And I thought it was an interesting topic

00:24:57 ◼   ► and I too thought it was dead.

00:24:59 ◼   ► And then I looked around a little bit

00:25:00 ◼   ► and turns out, trademark,

00:25:03 ◼   ► that Hackintoshes are totally still a thing.

00:25:06 ◼   ► Just this week we had sort of serendipity.

00:25:11 ◼   ► I did not make this happen.

00:25:13 ◼   ► But our sweet setup interview this week

00:25:16 ◼   ► with Sebastian Green, dude runs a Hackintosh.

00:25:20 ◼   ► Like it's inside a Power Mac G5 case

00:25:23 ◼   ► which is like big bonus points for me.

00:25:26 ◼   ► But he runs a Hackintosh.

00:25:29 ◼   ► Friend of a friend of mine in real life,

00:25:33 ◼   ► Thomas Newton who writes Egg Freckles runs a Hackintosh.

00:25:36 ◼   ► And Lifehacker of all sites keeps an updated guide

00:25:40 ◼   ► on building a Hackintosh.

00:25:42 ◼   ► Like people still do this.

00:25:44 ◼   ► I don't know why, which is what I wanna talk about.

00:25:46 ◼   ► - It sounds like you're looking for validation.

00:25:50 ◼   ► - Oh, yeah.

00:25:52 ◼   ► I'm not building a Hackintosh.

00:25:54 ◼   ► Well, not yet.

00:25:55 ◼   ► I have no interest.

00:25:58 ◼   ► That's what all this is about, all this time.

00:26:00 ◼   ► He's been collecting all these old Macintoshes.

00:26:02 ◼   ► Look at all these people doing Hackintoshes.

00:26:05 ◼   ► Great guys, huh?

00:26:06 ◼   ► Huh, it's great guys, yeah?

00:26:08 ◼   ► And he's just winking.

00:26:09 ◼   ► Yeah, Hackintoshes, right?

00:26:11 ◼   ► What do you think?

00:26:12 ◼   ► We don't approve.

00:26:15 ◼   ► I'm not doing it.

00:26:16 ◼   ► But there are a bunch of links in the show notes

00:26:18 ◼   ► that if you want to do it, you could do it.

00:26:23 ◼   ► I just don't, I don't understand,

00:26:27 ◼   ► like I totally get the idea of like tinkering

00:26:30 ◼   ► and like I want to build something myself

00:26:32 ◼   ► and like there are definitely,

00:26:34 ◼   ► like I understand that completely

00:26:38 ◼   ► and I think there's advantages to like knowing

00:26:40 ◼   ► your own hardware like on a philosophical level

00:26:42 ◼   ► but it seems like such a giant pile of trouble.

00:26:46 ◼   ► I don't understand, this comes from somebody

00:26:48 ◼   ► who I have done this in the past.

00:26:49 ◼   ► I did it with, I didn't build one,

00:26:51 ◼   ► but I had back in 2009, first the HP Mini 1000

00:26:56 ◼   ► and then the Dell Mini 9 running OS X.

00:26:58 ◼   ► The Dell Mini 9 was like perfectly built to run OS X.

00:27:01 ◼   ► It ran leopard like out of the box just about.

00:27:05 ◼   ► So I've done this and I know firsthand

00:27:06 ◼   ► that at least in 2009 it was a major pain.

00:27:09 ◼   ► Any update you had to like repatch or like change something

00:27:12 ◼   ► and maybe it's better now, but it definitely seems

00:27:16 ◼   ► like a lot of work when Mac hardware is not that expensive these days like the

00:27:20 ◼   ► prices have really come down you can get something really powerful for really not

00:27:24 ◼   ► that much money so I just don't I don't understand why this is still a thing

00:27:29 ◼   ► can I just go back on something a moment please did you say knowing your hardware

00:27:34 ◼   ► on a philosophical level I did say that yeah he did yes okay I think I just

00:27:44 ◼   ► I don't have to defend myself for the two of you.

00:27:47 ◼   ► No, you don't.

00:27:48 ◼   ► I don't know what that means.

00:27:49 ◼   ► Let me defend Steven.

00:27:50 ◼   ► I have to say that even if I want to make fun of his ideas on occasion, I do respect

00:27:59 ◼   ► the challenge of a Hackintosh on a technological level.

00:28:02 ◼   ► I think it's pretty cool knowing all the different components and how you can make OS X run on

00:28:10 ◼   ► a hardware it's not supposed to.

00:28:12 ◼   ► Like it's not something that I ever ever do myself, but I understand why some people want

00:28:18 ◼   ► and I also think that in some countries where Apple prices get like a crazy crazy high for

00:28:27 ◼   ► some reason, whether it's taxes or like other fiscal things that I don't understand, I think

00:28:35 ◼   ► it makes sense to make a Hackintosh.

00:28:37 ◼   ► So I would never do one myself, but I understand and I think I respect the idea.

00:28:46 ◼   ► I think it's pretty cool.

00:28:47 ◼   ► I wouldn't say a philosophical connection to my hardware, but overall I think it is

00:28:53 ◼   ► cool.

00:28:54 ◼   ► Do you feel like you philosophically connect to your iPad Air 2?

00:28:58 ◼   ► Oh yeah, totally.

00:28:59 ◼   ► Yeah, I understand.

00:29:02 ◼   ► What if you could hackintosh and run iOS?

00:29:04 ◼   ► "Oh, that'd be weird."

00:29:07 ◼   ► You know?

00:29:09 ◼   ► Yeah, and your price point competition is a good one, the one that I didn't think about

00:29:14 ◼   ► because I'm a silly American.

00:29:16 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:29:18 ◼   ► I just thought it was interesting because I looked into it and people are still doing

00:29:21 ◼   ► it a lot.

00:29:22 ◼   ► And so I thought it was just interesting to bring up.

00:29:27 ◼   ► I really am not going to do one.

00:29:29 ◼   ► Okay.

00:29:30 ◼   ► Talking about weird Mac hardware.

00:29:37 ◼   ► We should get into this.

00:29:40 ◼   ► Tell us, Myke.

00:29:41 ◼   ► Along with some other scoops last night, Scoop Machine, Mark Gurman, at 9to5Mac, posted a

00:29:50 ◼   ► surprising piece about a completely new MacBook Air at the 12 inch screen size, completely

00:30:00 ◼   ► rethought in the way it's designed with a bunch of different changes like keyboard spacing,

00:30:07 ◼   ► using speaker grill fans and a trackpad with no clicking area and just like no I/O of any

00:30:16 ◼   ► kind really just like two holes in the side loads of really interesting and

00:30:22 ◼   ► very surprising changes to push the MacBook Air further down its you know

00:30:29 ◼   ► down its road it's like eventual road of becoming this incredibly thin

00:30:33 ◼   ► incredibly light like incredibly incredibly thin piece of hardware so we

00:30:39 ◼   ► should talk about it yeah can I can I can I put forward my crazy theory first

00:30:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:46 ◼   ► Please.

00:30:47 ◼   ► Is it possible that this is a Mac that runs on ARM chip?

00:30:51 ◼   ► Oh.

00:30:53 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:54 ◼   ► I saw some people tweeting about that.

00:30:57 ◼   ► I think that's definitely a possibility, especially...

00:31:00 ◼   ► This is another chapter in a long-running rumor, and for a while, those rumors included

00:31:05 ◼   ► it would be fanless.

00:31:06 ◼   ► Now, you can run...

00:31:08 ◼   ► There's Intel Ultrabooks, and they run without fans, but I think the ARM thing is definitely

00:31:13 ◼   ► a possibility here.

00:31:17 ◼   ► And I think that is part of a lot of other questions that I have.

00:31:23 ◼   ► I have nothing but questions about this machine at this point.

00:31:26 ◼   ► You know, it would kind of make sense in a way, because it's doing a bunch of other weird

00:31:30 ◼   ► things.

00:31:32 ◼   ► So it may as well be so radically different, you know?

00:31:36 ◼   ► Like I don't know, the Retina MacBook Pro did a bunch of really weird stuff because

00:31:43 ◼   ► it was so different and the same was like the original MacBook Air as well

00:31:46 ◼   ► like there were some fundamental changes and I guess the fundamental change here

00:31:50 ◼   ► would be runs on ARM and doesn't have any ports except one USB port right?

00:31:56 ◼   ► They're like fundamentally different and they priced them in such a way to like

00:32:00 ◼   ► scare most people off but you know pricing is a whole other thing but go

00:32:05 ◼   ► on Steven let's start looking at some of your questions.

00:32:08 ◼   ► Okay so let's

00:32:09 ◼   ► start with the the port issue so according to this rumor it's gonna have

00:32:13 ◼   ► headphone port on one side and a USB C which if you're not familiar you should

00:32:16 ◼   ► look at this link USB C is actually really similar to a lightning connector

00:32:21 ◼   ► it's reversible it's really small and according to these images it's the only

00:32:26 ◼   ► port on the machine now I didn't even think about it until Chuck's go down

00:32:30 ◼   ► Twitter earlier or just a little while ago was like Apple watch has magnetic

00:32:34 ◼   ► charging why wouldn't this have some sort of like snap-on magnetic charger so

00:32:38 ◼   ► like maybe that would be good like I don't want to have to unplug something

00:32:43 ◼   ► to charge my computer but one port even if like charging isn't through that port

00:32:50 ◼   ► which USB C could could charge a machine like this really pushes this into iOS

00:32:56 ◼   ► territory in the I/O you know like an iPad has one connector and a headphone

00:33:05 ◼   ► jack. Do you know I hadn't really thought of that? That hadn't crossed my mind

00:33:08 ◼   ► mind. The Apple watch angle? No, not that it's... That it's an iPad? It's what an

00:33:14 ◼   ► iPad has, like it's... you don't plug anything into it, like you just don't do that.

00:33:19 ◼   ► Yeah it's um... Do you reckon that, I mean this is another thought that I'm just

00:33:24 ◼   ► having randomly, do you reckon that like the charger would have I/O? So the again

00:33:30 ◼   ► think looking at the iPad, the iPad has a HDMI like adapter so you can instead of

00:33:37 ◼   ► AirPlay you can plug HDMI right into the iPad and that adapter has a lightning

00:33:42 ◼   ► it had a 30 pin now has a lightning connector on it so you can charge and

00:33:45 ◼   ► get power in and HDMI out at the same time and it definitely leads to

00:33:50 ◼   ► questions of dongles or docks or what if this thing only has one port you know

00:33:56 ◼   ► even on a MacBook Air but especially on a MacBook Air but even on a MacBook Pro

00:34:00 ◼   ► like my bag is full of dongles I have Ethernet, 5Y800, you know VGA,

00:34:06 ◼   ► DVI, like all these things because I'm out and about and my MacBook Pro

00:34:11 ◼   ► basically just has USB and Thunderbolt and HDMI but even then I'm adapting all

00:34:19 ◼   ► the time so to a degree I think Mac users are used to this but the the

00:34:23 ◼   ► alternative is and I wrote it in all capital letters in my show notes of OMG

00:34:27 ◼   ► PowerBook Duo like what if what if this thing does come with a dock of some sort

00:34:31 ◼   ► that you can put in your bag and it has all these ports I don't think Apple's

00:34:35 ◼   ► gonna do that. I think it's like the worst idea ever if they do. Like I need to

00:34:40 ◼   ► I need to I need to hear Apple's... if this is true I need to hear the marketing

00:34:45 ◼   ► because like one port is is crazy making. Like for example for me like I have my

00:34:55 ◼   ► my keyboard that I use because I use this the Microsoft keyboard with the

00:35:00 ◼   ► hole in the middle that I can't remember the name of now. I have to plug a little

00:35:04 ◼   ► USB dongle in for it to work. I don't know why. I don't know why they can't use Bluetooth like everybody else

00:35:11 ◼   ► but you have to use this little dongle. So I wouldn't even be able to use my

00:35:14 ◼   ► keyboard if I want to charge, right? So that's... let alone like maybe I want to

00:35:20 ◼   ► plug in my iPhone, maybe I want to plug in anything like a hard drive. The idea

00:35:25 ◼   ► that I would then have to take like a dock in my bag kind of undoes the idea

00:35:31 ◼   ► of portability. Laptops are portable. I totally agree. So having to carry around

00:35:35 ◼   ► more so I can use my portable machine, the whole point, all you're

00:35:40 ◼   ► doing is taking the weight that you're taking out of the machine and

00:35:43 ◼   ► adding it into something you have to carry with you anyway. So what's the

00:35:47 ◼   ► point? I get that if you're on a plane it might be fine and it makes it

00:35:51 ◼   ► awesome for that and you plug it in but I don't think that, I think that's too

00:35:56 ◼   ► narrow in the thinking. A laptop you take to the coffee shop

00:36:00 ◼   ► or you take downstairs or you know it's just the idea is you move it around and

00:36:04 ◼   ► if I have to carry around a bunch of cables and dock with me just so I can

00:36:08 ◼   ► have two USB ports that I can use whilst I'm charging I don't know if that's if I

00:36:14 ◼   ► would want that like I can't see why I would want that yeah and and maybe the

00:36:19 ◼   ► marketing angle is hey this thing gets crazy if it's on arm maybe this thing

00:36:22 ◼   ► gets like all day battery life or two day battery life yeah something insane

00:36:26 ◼   ► and so Apple's argument is you don't need it I mean if you need to like sync

00:36:29 ◼   ► your phone lol you don't need to do that anymore if Stephen is the sink his iPod

00:36:34 ◼   ► classic you can do that but you know he doesn't need to really like carry a

00:36:39 ◼   ► charger around around with him but that I agree with you Myke is sort of thin

00:36:45 ◼   ► reasoning and it inevitably like these machines if this is true like people

00:36:52 ◼   ► gonna be carrying around a lot of extra stuff potentially and I don't know if

00:36:55 ◼   ► Apple like wants people to do that or not. But like then I think I think this

00:37:01 ◼   ► is like our version of the removal of the zip drive or like the removal of the floppy drive.

00:37:06 ◼   ► Powering USB at the same time is important for like a lot of things.

00:37:13 ◼   ► Yeah but it's you know it's that idea that like if you know the idea being if

00:37:18 ◼   ► you think about previous times is Apple has a vision for where they want to take

00:37:22 ◼   ► machines but first they have to have the first one and then from that they change

00:37:27 ◼   ► the way that we use our computers right there if you think about it in those

00:37:30 ◼   ► terms like if you look at look use hindsight right this might be that one

00:37:36 ◼   ► so we look at it as being crazy and I'm like setting my hair on fire and running

00:37:40 ◼   ► around my room because I see them having one USB port but it's just the same as

00:37:46 ◼   ► everything else that they've ever done but you know it but it's hard to see

00:37:50 ◼   ► right now but you know I hope that they're not I mean yeah I hope they're

00:37:55 ◼   ► not just hobbling the machine because they want to make it really thin really

00:37:58 ◼   ► light you could put two on this you could put two you could put two right

00:38:02 ◼   ► there could be two. I would imagine that if this is real there's got to be two.

00:38:10 ◼   ► The ports just don't sit don't sit right with me there's nothing I can't

00:38:13 ◼   ► think of a single advantage except thinness and lightness but if you

00:38:17 ◼   ► already have the bus and everything one more port is not shouldn't be a big deal.

00:38:20 ◼   ► What's also interesting about this machine I think is the size so not

00:38:26 ◼   ► the thin necessarily but the fact that it's a 12 inch model that that raises a

00:38:31 ◼   ► lot of questions. You know Apple sells an 11.6 inch MacBook Air. I just bought one

00:38:36 ◼   ► for my wife last month and I will say compared that machine compared to this

00:38:40 ◼   ► mythical MacBook Air the new one looks so much better like the 11 inch MacBook

00:38:45 ◼   ► doesn't look good. No, it's ugly. The bezel is humongous and it's like 16 the ratio of the

00:38:53 ◼   ► screen is weird so it's really short and really wide. But I tell you what I like

00:38:58 ◼   ► about this though this is a 12 inch laptop like 12 inch screen laptop that's

00:39:03 ◼   ► smaller than the 11. Does his thing say that? Yeah the physical size is a quarter

00:39:11 ◼   ► of a quarter or three quarters of an inch smaller than the 11 inch. Yeah and

00:39:16 ◼   ► and they're doing some things that harken back to the 12 inch powerbook

00:39:20 ◼   ► with like the full width keyboard is definitely something that was on the 12 inch

00:39:25 ◼   ► powerbook. Like a lot of things about this machine are really interesting to

00:39:29 ◼   ► me but going back to the size thing so is Apple going to sell a 11 inch MacBook

00:39:36 ◼   ► a 12 inch like MacBook Air 2 and then a 13 inch MacBook Air like I don't know

00:39:44 ◼   ► where this fits in line with the rest of the products and my my thought is and we

00:39:50 ◼   ► can surely argue about it that if this has retina which Gherman doesn't say if

00:39:55 ◼   ► it does or not but if it does I think this sits in between the current MacBook

00:39:59 ◼   ► Airs and the MacBook Pro so you have the non retina 11 and 13 maybe their names

00:40:05 ◼   ► change to just MacBook again, you have this machine in the middle, if it's Retina, and

00:40:10 ◼   ► then you have the Pros.

00:40:12 ◼   ► That makes sense to me with the current landscape.

00:40:15 ◼   ► Can I ask you guys a question?

00:40:19 ◼   ► Yes, sir.

00:40:20 ◼   ► Because I really don't understand.

00:40:24 ◼   ► What's with the obsession of making laptops thinner?

00:40:28 ◼   ► Because I mean, I cannot get it on a phone.

00:40:31 ◼   ► I kinda understand it there because a phone is something that you hold in your hands all

00:40:37 ◼   ► the time and therefore having a more comfortable physical size really helps.

00:40:43 ◼   ► And I understand the argument for lightness in a laptop because you're carrying a laptop

00:40:48 ◼   ► all the time so it's important to make it light.

00:40:52 ◼   ► But the crazy obsession with thinness at the expense, possibly because this is a rumor

00:40:59 ◼   ► So we're speculating here.

00:41:01 ◼   ► But at the expense of battery space, of I/O,

00:41:08 ◼   ► all these other compromises in this rumor,

00:41:10 ◼   ► is it really worth it?

00:41:13 ◼   ► Because just one port for the power adapter

00:41:18 ◼   ► sounds crazy to me, like totally crazy,

00:41:21 ◼   ► on a completely different planet than removing

00:41:24 ◼   ► DVD and you know, the other stuff that Apple does.

00:41:28 ◼   ► But making it like so thin that, I mean, I have a 2011 MacBook Air and

00:41:36 ◼   ► I still think it is crazy thin.

00:41:38 ◼   ► Am I wishing desperately for a thinner MacBook Air?

00:41:43 ◼   ► No, but also I should note that I don't use my MacBook Air that much.

00:41:47 ◼   ► But still, I mean, is it really necessary to compromise everything

00:41:53 ◼   ► that a Mac is great for, so having ports, having more battery life than a phone or an

00:42:00 ◼   ► iPad, is it really worth it just to be crazy thinner?

00:42:03 ◼   ► Because it looks to me like a demonstration of finesse, of look how awesome we can make

00:42:10 ◼   ► our MacBooks so thin and light, but do people really want that crazy thinness?

00:42:15 ◼   ► I mean I agree with you Federico, and it's the same argument we had with the iPhone 6,

00:42:19 ◼   ► Like if they get the thickness the same as before, like what does that mean battery life

00:42:26 ◼   ► wise?

00:42:27 ◼   ► I see it more, like it makes more sense to me on a mobile device.

00:42:33 ◼   ► But a 12 inch laptop you can carry really in just about any bag, you can carry it very

00:42:40 ◼   ► easily with you.

00:42:41 ◼   ► And if Apple is trying to make a super portable Mac, weight is a huge factor there.

00:42:46 ◼   ► I moved recently from a MacBook Air to a MacBook Pro both in the 13 inch

00:42:52 ◼   ► Class but the pro is heavier and the pro is thicker and I do notice that in my bag

00:42:57 ◼   ► And so if this is all about portability

00:43:00 ◼   ► And they can still get good battery life

00:43:02 ◼   ► Like there's no way this thing gets worse battery life than the current MacBook Air. Apple very rarely moves backwards in terms of battery life

00:43:09 ◼   ► So clearly they've been able to figure it out. And again, maybe that's ARM. Maybe that's that maybe it's not retina

00:43:14 ◼   ► maybe it is. There's still too many unknowns, but I do think that the

00:43:21 ◼   ► battery life, I just don't see them moving backwards on that at this point.

00:43:24 ◼   ► I think the thickness argument, like if you're gonna make it

00:43:29 ◼   ► lighter you're taking stuff out or you're making components smaller so you

00:43:32 ◼   ► end up with more space so you may as well make the case thinner, right? In

00:43:36 ◼   ► theory. But also like it is the traveling thing as Stephen said, you put it in a

00:43:41 ◼   ► bag right and it takes less space in your bag but also like a super thin

00:43:46 ◼   ► computer is a real marvel. I remember like the original MacBook Air

00:43:53 ◼   ► right it was like what is this thing and people buy it for that you know because

00:43:59 ◼   ► you pick it up in the store and it's like this is like thinner than a book

00:44:02 ◼   ► this is crazy this is a computer and it's a good marketing tool. It's the same

00:44:06 ◼   ► reason they make the phones thin like because they keep making them

00:44:10 ◼   ► thinner because it looks good on the posters and you know because you can get

00:44:14 ◼   ► the ginga it's hiding behind a pencil what what you know it's like it looks

00:44:20 ◼   ► good. A laser cut pencil. It's sellable right it's sellable. It is and the the original

00:44:25 ◼   ► Mappo Gare is of course a really good way to think about this this computer

00:44:30 ◼   ► you know I we talked about it last week or a couple weeks ago in our Q&A that you

00:44:34 ◼   ► know I had one for a short period and they got rid of it because the the

00:44:38 ◼   ► performance was so bad and on the original MacBook Air that had everything

00:44:41 ◼   ► to do with like they used an iPod hard drive and turns out running OS X on an

00:44:45 ◼   ► iPod hard drive is miserable. But you know I remember when they I remember the

00:44:50 ◼   ► keynote that they announced the MacBook Air in a little flip down door and it

00:44:55 ◼   ► had micro DVI it's the only Apple laptop to ever ship with micro DVI so again in

00:45:00 ◼   ► the world of adapters like if you own a first-gen MacBook Air you have this

00:45:03 ◼   ► adapter you can ever use and I remember thinking like oh my god they have one

00:45:07 ◼   ► USB port like what are you thinking and of course they rectified that later on

00:45:11 ◼   ► but the world like the world dealt with the MacBook Air and a lot of people

00:45:17 ◼   ► really like this that first-gen machine and like what I think this will be that

00:45:22 ◼   ► first-gen machine came with a hefty price you know now the MacBook Air is the

00:45:26 ◼   ► base machine it's the bottom of the tier it's the cheap one but that was not the

00:45:30 ◼   ► not the case when the original MacBook Air came out I don't remember how much

00:45:33 ◼   ► it was but it was significantly more than a MacBook and so maybe maybe this

00:45:37 ◼   ► machine is following that trajectory that yeah like there's trade-offs here

00:45:40 ◼   ► but you're making those trade-offs to make your bag light and to keep a

00:45:43 ◼   ► computer thin and if that interests you and we don't have the performance

00:45:49 ◼   ► problems of yesteryear because we're on SSD and and even you know we've we've

00:45:53 ◼   ► made great strides and heat consumption and all these things then maybe this

00:45:58 ◼   ► machine is like the fulfilled promise that the original MacBook Air couldn't

00:46:01 ◼   ► deliver on. So to go back to the pricing discussion the question that you asked a

00:46:06 ◼   ► ago, like where does this sit in the line? I think that this device, no

00:46:10 ◼   ► matter whether it's cheaper or more expensive, will sit outside of the

00:46:15 ◼   ► MacBook Air line in the same way that the Retina MacBook Pros sat outside of the

00:46:19 ◼   ► MacBook Pro line. You know, it was like you went to the store and it was like

00:46:22 ◼   ► MacBook Air, or like, so MacBook Pro, it'd be like MacBook Pro Retina display. I

00:46:27 ◼   ► think it'd be like that. You've got MacBook Air and then MacBook Air with X or 12

00:46:31 ◼   ► inch MacBook Air, you know? And the Retina displays were more, like those

00:46:35 ◼   ► Those machines were more, they sat above the line, and then slowly, I don't think, I don't

00:46:39 ◼   ► know, I don't think you can buy a non-random APU perot anymore, I think they're all gone,

00:46:44 ◼   ► but slowly took over, and I think you're right, I think that probably makes a lot of sense,

00:46:48 ◼   ► Myke.

00:46:49 ◼   ► I think this will be more expensive, by the way.

00:46:51 ◼   ► So can I ask you another question?

00:46:54 ◼   ► Because I'm, like, you guys know that I'm not so into Macs lately, but this is fascinating

00:47:00 ◼   ► to me.

00:47:03 ◼   ► Can we, if this rumor is true, that's always the basic introduction here, if this is true,

00:47:11 ◼   ► can we extract some theories about the future of OS X from this type of MacBook?

00:47:20 ◼   ► And I thought of two.

00:47:23 ◼   ► One is that without many USB ports, I think people will rely even more on AirDrop and

00:47:33 ◼   ► other Bluetooth and Wi-Fi transfer solutions for files, especially now that it's supported

00:47:40 ◼   ► on iOS and OS X.

00:47:42 ◼   ► They can exchange files between the two of them.

00:47:45 ◼   ► And the second one is that with a large trackpad, multi-touch gestures are still going to be

00:47:51 ◼   ► a thing on OS X. Is there anything else that we can assume about this? Because, I mean,

00:47:58 ◼   ► a MacBook, it's cool, it's great, I mean, it's thin, and it's got this new keyboard,

00:48:03 ◼   ► okay, well, whatever, right? I mean, it'll be amazing hardware, but how does it affect

00:48:09 ◼   ► the software if this is true?

00:48:11 ◼   ► Well, I think there's even some going the other way that we've all said, everyone has

00:48:16 ◼   ► said Yosemite looks better on a red display but they sell a boat ton of MacBook Airs and

00:48:22 ◼   ► so I think this can address I think the software may points to this even in that way and we

00:48:27 ◼   ► should say before we move on that you totally can buy a 13 inch MacBook Pro with no display

00:48:32 ◼   ► still it's it's still on sale today which seems silly but it's 1100 bucks so spend the

00:48:38 ◼   ► extra hundred dollars and go right now I guess but um yeah I think I think it's really interesting

00:48:43 ◼   ► think about Federico and I think airdrop is definitely a big part of that again

00:48:50 ◼   ► with the original Macbook Air.

00:48:53 ◼   ► When it works.

00:48:54 ◼   ► Yeah well there is that.

00:48:57 ◼   ► On the original MacBook Air in that keynote there's a slide that has a

00:49:03 ◼   ► picture of an optical disc and just one word "Y" over the top of it and it in

00:49:09 ◼   ► that keynote as well Apple talked about streaming and that you could read

00:49:13 ◼   ► download purchases from the iTunes store and they built the case that optical

00:49:16 ◼   ► media is dead. This is the first computer we're shipping without an optical drive

00:49:19 ◼   ► and you don't need it because we have all these other things and I think this

00:49:25 ◼   ► machine can follow in those footsteps and say you know what your iOS devices

00:49:29 ◼   ► already don't need to sync with iTunes anymore. If you need to move files sure

00:49:34 ◼   ► if you need gigabit Ethernet here's an adapter but if you don't need it you

00:49:37 ◼   ► just need AirDrop or peer-to-peer wireless it's already built in so you

00:49:43 ◼   ► don't you don't need all the stuff that nerds want to hold on to. Okay how about

00:49:46 ◼   ► this if you can allow me to interrupt you Steven. Now that we have iCloud Drive

00:49:53 ◼   ► and now that we have iCloud integration in mail you need fewer ways to exchange

00:49:59 ◼   ► files with other people physically and we're gonna make iCloud Drive more like

00:50:03 ◼   ► Dropbox and you can easily store files in iCloud Drive and share them with

00:50:07 ◼   ► people with a simple link instead of putting them on a USB dongle and giving the USB dongle

00:50:12 ◼   ► to somebody else.

00:50:14 ◼   ► So can we, I think it's, I mean, I'm not sure, I think it would be crazy, but if the rumor

00:50:20 ◼   ► is true and if Apple is crazy enough to really do this, I think that it's not too crazy on

00:50:28 ◼   ► our end to assume that they're going to do some sort of new file store exchanging features,

00:50:35 ◼   ► whatever.

00:50:36 ◼   ► think removing the physical components means... because people are not gonna stop sharing files,

00:50:45 ◼   ► of course, if you take away... when you took away the DVD and the CD drive from people, they didn't

00:50:52 ◼   ► stop using files, they just moved the files from the CD and the DVD to the USB. If you take USB

00:50:59 ◼   ► away from people, those files are gonna be used anyway, just in different ways. So does this mean

00:51:05 ◼   ► Does it mean that Apple is going to rely even more on sorting files in the cloud?

00:51:09 ◼   ► And if that's the case, is the cloud iCloud Drive?

00:51:12 ◼   ► And if that's the case, again, does it mean that iCloud Drive is getting new sharing features?

00:51:17 ◼   ► It did.

00:51:18 ◼   ► It got mail drop in Yosemite that I can email you a file of almost any size and it's using

00:51:23 ◼   ► iCloud Drive in the background to move it.

00:51:25 ◼   ► But you still cannot create a shareable link just to iCloud Drive like you can in Dropbox.

00:51:30 ◼   ► this is what I was saying before about like Apple creating a project that like

00:51:36 ◼   ► pays for the future. So they say like we want to do this, we need this

00:51:41 ◼   ► device to do this, this is the future but it starts here. So that's why I think

00:51:48 ◼   ► it's priced high. Like I don't, you know, there's conjecture over whether

00:51:54 ◼   ► it costs more, costs less, like whether that's why they're doing X, Y, Z. I think

00:51:57 ◼   ► it's priced high because this is not a device for everyone because they are

00:52:01 ◼   ► making some serious like because I think you know they'll be all crazy things they

00:52:05 ◼   ► would do it will run hot right because there's no fans and it's gonna run hot

00:52:09 ◼   ► right and they think that it won't but you'll get weird stuff that happens with

00:52:13 ◼   ► it there's probably some things in there that maybe we don't even know about yet

00:52:17 ◼   ► which are like super weird maybe the battery isn't any better than the Mac

00:52:20 ◼   ► book yeah I mean like maybe it's just like well we're doing this now and then

00:52:23 ◼   ► over the time it will get better and better or like you know it would turn

00:52:26 ◼   ► out like and it runs on ARM and by the way you know everyone needs to recompile

00:52:31 ◼   ► their apps it's like you know you don't know what these kind of things are gonna

00:52:34 ◼   ► be like Steven tell me if what I said was completely dumb about the about the

00:52:40 ◼   ► ARM thing you've probably used some verb in a in a you know a strange way but

00:52:46 ◼   ► they will get follow-up all right so let me ask this question because I just

00:52:49 ◼   ► I just thought, now I said it, I'm interested in it.

00:52:52 ◼   ► If Apple use ARM chips,

00:52:57 ◼   ► do people have to recompile their apps

00:52:59 ◼   ► in the same way they did for Intel?

00:53:01 ◼   ► - Though they would need to be some sort of

00:53:03 ◼   ► fat binary system,

00:53:05 ◼   ► like the transition from PowerPC to Intel.

00:53:07 ◼   ► I mean, there will be a transition

00:53:09 ◼   ► because Intel code won't run natively on ARM.

00:53:11 ◼   ► - Right, so that's the other thing, right?

00:53:12 ◼   ► If this is an ARM device,

00:53:14 ◼   ► then it's gonna be the start

00:53:16 ◼   ► of that transition device potentially.

00:53:18 ◼   ► So, I don't know.

00:53:20 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:53:21 ◼   ► But my point is like, this is a,

00:53:24 ◼   ► I see this as like the original MacBook Air,

00:53:26 ◼   ► unlike the first Retina MacBook Pro.

00:53:28 ◼   ► It is a future facing device

00:53:31 ◼   ► that Apple will price accordingly.

00:53:34 ◼   ► - Does the Mac do backups in iCloud like you can on iOS?

00:53:39 ◼   ► - No.

00:53:40 ◼   ► - No.

00:53:41 ◼   ► - So maybe that's another possibility

00:53:42 ◼   ► because if you take away USB,

00:53:44 ◼   ► what about, you know, time machine and,

00:53:47 ◼   ► I don't know, just thinking that, I think Myke is right.

00:53:51 ◼   ► - You can do time machine to like a time capsule,

00:53:53 ◼   ► like wirelessly, like they're not gonna,

00:53:56 ◼   ► I can't ever see a world where Apple allows you

00:53:59 ◼   ► to backup 256 gigs of storage to the cloud.

00:54:03 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:54:04 ◼   ► - It's never gonna happen, it's just too much.

00:54:06 ◼   ► - Oh, never say never, never say never.

00:54:09 ◼   ► - It's never gonna happen.

00:54:11 ◼   ► The reason I say that is because there is never a world

00:54:14 ◼   ► in which that becomes affordable,

00:54:15 ◼   ► because as Apple get the ability to store more and more,

00:54:19 ◼   ► hard drives just get bigger, or SSDs just get bigger.

00:54:22 ◼   ► So they move along together.

00:54:25 ◼   ► That's my theory on that anyway.

00:54:26 ◼   ► Yeah, but I think the idea of iCloud backup on iOS and the Mac

00:54:34 ◼   ► is just fundamentally different.

00:54:35 ◼   ► I mean, you can restore from iCloud on iOS,

00:54:38 ◼   ► but it's definitely not the same as a time machine backup

00:54:42 ◼   ► where you have history and versioning and all

00:54:45 ◼   ► these other things. I don't know, I don't like Tinder agreed that I don't think

00:54:49 ◼   ► Apple's gonna do that even if they did I don't think I would use it but um yeah

00:54:54 ◼   ► there's lots of questions but I think overall I think we're in agreement that

00:54:57 ◼   ► this this machine if it's real if this is what it is it's definitely going to

00:55:01 ◼   ► move the bar you know move things forward in the notebook space in a big

00:55:06 ◼   ► way. So what do we think is this is this happening like does this seem does this

00:55:14 ◼   ► seem feasible I think yeah I think it does do we want to talk about the timing

00:55:21 ◼   ► at all no I mean I just did you see the post that we had on Mac stories today I

00:55:27 ◼   ► did I did and I linked to it but there was a bunch of arguing about that on

00:55:32 ◼   ► Twitter and I don't think Apple leaks things in 9 to 5 Mac on purpose I could

00:55:39 ◼   ► be wrong but I don't see this being Apple PR speaking through Mark Gurman I

00:55:43 ◼   ► I don't see that either, but what I do see is like, there has been no other Apple news

00:55:50 ◼   ► during CES week and that would be breaking a multi-year trend.

00:55:53 ◼   ► So I don't know.

00:55:55 ◼   ► I don't think that they would go to to German, right?

00:55:59 ◼   ► But it is still weird.

00:56:00 ◼   ► Of all people.

00:56:01 ◼   ► Yeah, it is still weird because they haven't done anything else and that is the way Apple

00:56:08 ◼   ► has operated for years.

00:56:09 ◼   ► So I don't know what I think about it.

00:56:11 ◼   ► Alright, should we take a break?

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00:57:51 ◼   ► Alright so it's a new year and lots of people do new things in the new year but Federica

00:57:59 ◼   ► you've got some things in here that you're currently trying.

00:58:02 ◼   ► What's cooking?

00:58:04 ◼   ► So every year, after I recover from the New Year's Eve night, I sit down and it used to

00:58:16 ◼   ► be at my Macbook and now it's at my iPad, but I try to understand whether the software

00:58:22 ◼   ► I'm running is still the best for me.

00:58:25 ◼   ► So I try to use the occasion of a new year to re-evaluate some apps, some services that

00:58:33 ◼   ► that I pay for and I've been doing this for like three or four years now and every year

00:58:39 ◼   ► I discover something new. It's like those people who move furniture around, you know,

00:58:47 ◼   ► just to see if maybe there's a better option. I know my mother is one of those people and

00:58:52 ◼   ► instead of moving furniture, I sign up for new web services. So I saved four, I think,

00:59:03 ◼   ► of these new apps and services that I'm trying.

00:59:05 ◼   ► So if you guys want, I can.

00:59:07 ◼   ► I would like to discuss this with you.

00:59:11 ◼   ► I want to hear it.

00:59:12 ◼   ► OK.

00:59:13 ◼   ► So the first one that I wanted to take a look at,

00:59:17 ◼   ► not just because maybe it will turn into a Mac service

00:59:21 ◼   ► article, but just out of personal curiosity,

00:59:24 ◼   ► was whether Instapaper was still the best read later app for me.

00:59:31 ◼   ► I have a complicated history with read later apps.

00:59:35 ◼   ► I used Instapaper for years.

00:59:39 ◼   ► Two years ago, I switched to Pocket.

00:59:42 ◼   ► Then from Pocket, I switched to Safari Reading List,

00:59:46 ◼   ► but I was missing Instapaper's text features too much.

00:59:49 ◼   ► - Just all features.

00:59:52 ◼   ► Just...

00:59:52 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:59:53 ◼   ► - Yeah, but especially the text presentation

00:59:56 ◼   ► and the friends network.

00:59:58 ◼   ► I don't, like, I know this is gonna sound really bad, like, I don't care about, um,

01:00:06 ◼   ► I'm trying to phrase this in the, in the last, in the least, uh, in the way that it will have

01:00:14 ◼   ► fewer consequences for me. I don't care about, uh...

01:00:21 ◼   ► Just say it, say it.

01:00:22 ◼   ► I'm not a typography expert.

01:00:24 ◼   ► Okay, you don't care about fonts is what you're saying?

01:00:27 ◼   ► No, no, no.

01:00:29 ◼   ► Like, I don't...

01:00:31 ◼   ► What you're saying is...

01:00:32 ◼   ► What he was afraid of, you just did.

01:00:34 ◼   ► [Laughter]

01:00:36 ◼   ► Myke...

01:00:37 ◼   ► Hey buddy!

01:00:39 ◼   ► Okay, I'm not one of those people who spends time adjusting the margins and the font weight, the font size, and I want to have this serif and some serif...

01:00:48 ◼   ► Not because I don't care, because it's like I'm arrogant.

01:00:52 ◼   ► It's just that I don't understand and I don't think my...

01:00:59 ◼   ► like the way that I read requires these settings.

01:01:03 ◼   ► It's like those people who taste wine and when they drink wine they want like the advanced glass

01:01:10 ◼   ► because it's better for the type of wine.

01:01:12 ◼   ► You know, like I don't understand. I just use a normal font.

01:01:16 ◼   ► Anyway, I don't know what "normal" means, it's just the default one usually.

01:01:22 ◼   ► Helvetica.

01:01:24 ◼   ► Yeah, probably. I don't know. No, I use the Serif one, the one with the little details.

01:01:31 ◼   ► So, last year I was missing Instapaper's features too much, I switched back.

01:01:37 ◼   ► In the past few months, after putting together my must-have annual roundup for the apps that I use,

01:01:44 ◼   ► I was wondering whether Instapaper really the best for me because I love the app.

01:01:48 ◼   ► It's just, you know, I think it is my, uh, it is 50% my duty and other 50% my curiosity

01:01:56 ◼   ► to see what Pocket has been doing. So I asked on Twitter, uh, about, you know,

01:02:03 ◼   ► what are you guys using for, uh, read later apps? And I received, I think like 300 replies

01:02:10 ◼   ► and they were fairly evenly split between Instapaper and Pocket, with a few people using

01:02:16 ◼   ► Readability, it appears they are still around, and Pinboard and Safari Reading List and other apps

01:02:23 ◼   ► that I don't know, like there's one called Reading Pack, I think. Anyway, most people were using either

01:02:29 ◼   ► Instapaper or Pocket, so I was surprised actually to see, I thought that people who followed me

01:02:37 ◼   ► would be more inclined to use Instapaper. But half of those people actually use Pocket. So,

01:02:45 ◼   ► I was like, okay, maybe I should try Pocket again. So, I've been trying Pocket. I paid for a premium

01:02:50 ◼   ► account myself because I wanted to get the full experience. You know, when I try all these new

01:02:57 ◼   ► apps, I want to go all in because I want to understand. And I gotta say, I kind of like it.

01:03:07 ◼   ► Like the first week I thought it was a placebo effect, you know, because this is new so it must be better, you know.

01:03:14 ◼   ► Like when you move furniture around again, it always looks better because it's new.

01:03:19 ◼   ► But I've been using this for a couple of weeks now.

01:03:24 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm happy to say.

01:03:25 ◼   ► This never gets old. This is awesome.

01:03:27 ◼   ► So this has been, I think, week two or week three, the beginning of week three maybe.

01:03:32 ◼   ► I think it is pretty good.

01:03:35 ◼   ► good. The text parser is much better than Instapaper. I'm seeing less weirdness in the

01:03:43 ◼   ► way that Pocket parses articles on the web, like it supports captions for images better,

01:03:50 ◼   ► and in general it's got less craft in the text. The way that articles flow in Pocket,

01:04:01 ◼   ► less weird. It's not perfect, but it's less weird than InstaVapor. And I think that the

01:04:08 ◼   ► presentation with images and like Pocket as a grid, like with previews of photos and thumbnails

01:04:15 ◼   ► for videos, I think it looks fantastic. And in general, I know this is going to sound

01:04:24 ◼   ► weird, but it seems that Pocket has been moving from a read-later solution to a more like

01:04:30 ◼   ► a strange mix of "it's both read later" and like a bookmarking service because there's

01:04:38 ◼   ► a this thing called Pocket Premium which I don't see many people talking about but it's

01:04:43 ◼   ► a like it's a basically a permanent storage solution for your Pocket archive. It archives

01:04:52 ◼   ► web pages so you can always... it's like the pinboard... what is it called? Like archival

01:04:59 ◼   ► account. It creates an offline copy of a web page and it also gives you advanced

01:05:06 ◼   ► search options and the ability to automatically assign tags to articles. So

01:05:12 ◼   ► it's basically bookmarking features into pocket and you pay like 50 bucks a year

01:05:17 ◼   ► and you also ensure that you know the usual stuff like you support the

01:05:22 ◼   ► service and you make sure that it's going to be around in the future.

01:05:26 ◼   ► So what I'm doing basically, and this is going to sound so confusing and so like people are

01:05:31 ◼   ► going to be "what?"

01:05:33 ◼   ► I'm using Pocket as both a read-later and bookmarking system.

01:05:38 ◼   ► So you're not using Pinboard?

01:05:40 ◼   ► No.

01:05:41 ◼   ► What?

01:05:42 ◼   ► At least not in the past couple of weeks.

01:05:45 ◼   ► Because I go, I really go into these rabbit holes sometimes and I question everything

01:05:52 ◼   ► about myself. And usually that everything is about software. And I know this is going

01:05:57 ◼   ► to sound unnecessarily epic to people. But I do question, I do question everything because

01:06:07 ◼   ► I want to I want to understand what I do. So yeah, I've been like, you know, you know,

01:06:13 ◼   ► I told you, I told you, you too, my my fellow podcasters, I told you that I use Twitter

01:06:20 ◼   ► faves a lot, like whenever I see a link that I want to read or view in the future, I just

01:06:27 ◼   ► give it a star.

01:06:29 ◼   ► And since I started using Pocket, I actually just send everything to Pocket, so I'm using

01:06:33 ◼   ► the favorite feature just for actual favorites, like tweets that I like or that make me laugh,

01:06:39 ◼   ► it's usually stuff from Kyle and Joe.

01:06:44 ◼   ► I actually used faves for faves and pocket for links and it's both for articles that

01:06:50 ◼   ► I want to read but I actually also saved like tutorials and Python stuff into pocket.

01:06:57 ◼   ► This is interesting, I want to see how it works out for me.

01:07:01 ◼   ► Two things that I don't like, whenever you share an article, it shares the article with

01:07:07 ◼   ► a short link, so I had to put together a workflow to resolve the link and use the original link

01:07:17 ◼   ► of an article because I don't like using the pocket.co short links.

01:07:23 ◼   ► And it doesn't have highlights.

01:07:25 ◼   ► I'm kinda missing highlights from Instapaper.

01:07:28 ◼   ► I wasn't a huge user of highlights, but I do like the idea on principle.

01:07:35 ◼   ► I want to be able to easily highlight text that I like.

01:07:39 ◼   ► So that's not in pocket.

01:07:40 ◼   ► We'll see how it goes.

01:07:42 ◼   ► I'm optimistic because I think it's kind of different.

01:07:46 ◼   ► And I wouldn't be too sad to just move from a dual system of bookmarks and read later

01:07:55 ◼   ► to just one system that sorts everything for me.

01:07:58 ◼   ► Search is also pretty awesome.

01:08:01 ◼   ► But it's too soon.

01:08:02 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean I've looked at Pocket, I looked at it last year for a little while and sort

01:08:07 ◼   ► of what you led with is why I stay with Instapaper.

01:08:10 ◼   ► I just really prefer the reading experience but I think overall both are in really good

01:08:16 ◼   ► shape.

01:08:17 ◼   ► I think BetaWorks is in a really good job with Instapaper and I think Pocket's made

01:08:20 ◼   ► a lot of advancements and so it's good to have competition and I definitely use Instapaper

01:08:28 ◼   ► kind of the way you just talked about using Pocket where it's not just read it later stuff.

01:08:33 ◼   ► Sometimes I use Instapaper, even though I have a Pinboard account, just to stash something

01:08:36 ◼   ► away or like, "Hey, I'm going to link to this this afternoon and just stick it in Instapaper,"

01:08:41 ◼   ► which isn't great and leads to some noise in there, but the key is what works for you.

01:08:49 ◼   ► I miss the Instapaper friends section a lot.

01:08:54 ◼   ► I really like to see what like what Steven or Marco or Myke, I don't think you share

01:09:00 ◼   ► stuff on Instapaper because you don't read.

01:09:03 ◼   ► So I do.

01:09:04 ◼   ► I like to see what Steven does.

01:09:05 ◼   ► It handles videos just fine.

01:09:06 ◼   ► I just saved, I mean all the videos are on YouTube anyway, so I just use the YouTube

01:09:11 ◼   ► watch later function.

01:09:12 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, sure, sure.

01:09:14 ◼   ► We don't believe you, Myke, but anyway.

01:09:16 ◼   ► So what else is getting turned inside out for you, Federico?

01:09:19 ◼   ► So I have an RSS problem and I realize it's an issue.

01:09:27 ◼   ► I keep switching between RSS clients, probably because I have too much free time on my hands

01:09:34 ◼   ► sometimes, but also because I do it for the greater cause.

01:09:40 ◼   ► That's my excuse for everything.

01:09:44 ◼   ► So I'm looking for an RSS reader that allows me to see articles inside the folder, sorting

01:09:54 ◼   ► them by popularity instead of date or name.

01:10:00 ◼   ► And I don't think this exists.

01:10:02 ◼   ► I know that Feedly does that to an extent when you go to the website.

01:10:08 ◼   ► I think there's a popular filter on the homepage.

01:10:12 ◼   ► And I, but I don't think that any other service has a popularity filter.

01:10:18 ◼   ► So for context, I switched from Frit Wrangler to Fiddly last year, last summer, because,

01:10:26 ◼   ► you know, for the same reason, it's just instead of switching in January, I switched in June

01:10:32 ◼   ► to get a better, a better understanding of what other people are using.

01:10:38 ◼   ► I think it is a common geek mistake to get too entrenched in a single idea or belief.

01:10:46 ◼   ► So I switched to Fiddly to see what was up with that.

01:10:50 ◼   ► Also because two years ago I bought a lifetime Fiddly Pro subscription.

01:10:55 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, I know.

01:10:57 ◼   ► It was like one of 5,000.

01:10:59 ◼   ► So I think I got a pretty good deal because it was limited.

01:11:03 ◼   ► But now you're forced to use it.

01:11:05 ◼   ► No, it's not that I'm forced.

01:11:07 ◼   ► I have a...

01:11:10 ◼   ► Let's say that maybe when I use it I don't feel bad, you know, because hey, I'm actually

01:11:15 ◼   ► using this.

01:11:17 ◼   ► So I switched to Feed

01:11:28 ◼   ► my own here. We still haven't spoke about that cop.

01:11:35 ◼   ► Yeah that's gonna be a whole episode. News readers.

01:11:39 ◼   ► Yes, last year I switched from Rangler to Feedly and I used Feedly first with Reader,

01:11:46 ◼   ► then I switched to Newsyfy, which is a fantastic RSS reader for iOS. And I especially like

01:11:51 ◼   ► then Newsyfy is fast and it lets you customize the way that you share articles.

01:11:58 ◼   ► You can assign a single tap and hold on the article list to bring up the system share

01:12:04 ◼   ► sheet so you can send articles to extensions, which is nice.

01:12:09 ◼   ► And the app is clean, polished, it's got a premium business model, which I think is really

01:12:16 ◼   ► smart considering the modern app store.

01:12:20 ◼   ► But now, I use Twitter lists a lot, and I use Nuzzle to catch up on Twitter and articles

01:12:29 ◼   ► that people share when I'm away.

01:12:31 ◼   ► But now I'm wondering, okay, so RSS is my file system for news.

01:12:37 ◼   ► And I want to be able to open RSS, depending on the time that I have, I want to see either

01:12:45 ◼   ► all articles from newest to oldest because that's just how I work. I know Steven that

01:12:53 ◼   ► upsets you because it should be from oldest to newest. You were going to say that, right?

01:12:59 ◼   ► No. I have stuff set newest to oldest.

01:13:06 ◼   ► Oh yeah? I must be confused. I think that sometimes you used to say that. Anyway.

01:13:14 ◼   ► Depending on the time that I have, I want to be able to look at articles, either all

01:13:27 ◼   ► of them or just the popular ones.

01:13:30 ◼   ► And yesterday I asked on Twitter, is there a way to sort tweets in a Twitter list by

01:13:37 ◼   ► popularity based on retweets and faves?

01:13:40 ◼   ► And it doesn't seem that there's a way to do that, but that would be pretty smart, you

01:13:43 ◼   ► know?

01:13:44 ◼   ► And I think the problem is that Twitter doesn't care about lists or the list API.

01:13:50 ◼   ► So my idea was, okay, maybe there's an RSS reader that does this.

01:13:56 ◼   ► So I was like, okay, I'm using Feedly.

01:13:59 ◼   ► Is there a way to do this in Feedly?

01:14:01 ◼   ► I couldn't find a way to sort articles on popularity, whether it's how many people are

01:14:06 ◼   ► reading these articles or maybe are sharing this article.

01:14:09 ◼   ► So basically, I signed up in this, I had this realization.

01:14:16 ◼   ► It was like when you're in the desert and you see water.

01:14:21 ◼   ► And I signed up for NewsBlur.

01:14:23 ◼   ► Oh no.

01:14:26 ◼   ► So this is an entirely different RSS service.

01:14:30 ◼   ► What?

01:14:31 ◼   ► Did you sign up for a lifetime account by any chance?

01:14:34 ◼   ► No, no, no.

01:14:35 ◼   ► No, but yeah, it was really cute.

01:14:38 ◼   ► there's this single guy making this service and there's a picture of his dog

01:14:41 ◼   ► and it's like if you pay for the service you're gonna feed my dog for 12 days and

01:14:46 ◼   ► I thought that was really cute and funny so I signed up...

01:14:49 ◼   ► That sounds terrible though. Only 12 days!

01:14:52 ◼   ► Yeah but there's 7,000 people using the pro service.

01:14:56 ◼   ► Oh well then you only need to feed the dog, the dog's fed.

01:14:59 ◼   ► So how many days is the dog gonna live if you do 7,000 for 12?

01:15:03 ◼   ► Do you pay a year? What do you pay?

01:15:05 ◼   ► You pay a year.

01:15:06 ◼   ► Yeah, well that's more than...

01:15:08 ◼   ► 80,000 days!

01:15:10 ◼   ► 80,000 days!

01:15:12 ◼   ► Yeah, see...

01:15:13 ◼   ► That's 230 years!

01:15:14 ◼   ► This dog is gonna live a lot with our food.

01:15:17 ◼   ► Yeah, this dog's fine, man!

01:15:19 ◼   ► Yes, she's fine!

01:15:21 ◼   ► But anyway, the picture was really...

01:15:23 ◼   ► The photo was really cute!

01:15:27 ◼   ► It's all it takes to put a picture of your dog and Federica will buy your service.

01:15:31 ◼   ► True story!

01:15:33 ◼   ► There was also a problem for me with plaques.

01:15:35 ◼   ► Every time they have an update, they share, like in the blog post, on the company blog,

01:15:42 ◼   ► every time there's a new feature, they use a photo of the dog, like Berkeley, the Plex dog.

01:15:49 ◼   ► And every time I see the Plex blog posts, I want to try out the new features just to feel a connection.

01:15:57 ◼   ► Anyway, I'm just weird with dogs.

01:16:01 ◼   ► So there was a picture of a dog and I signed that for NewsBlur, also because there's a real reason, not just a cutesy one.

01:16:08 ◼   ► Basically

01:16:11 ◼   ► NewsBlur lets you... so it's ugly, okay?

01:16:14 ◼   ► It doesn't look really

01:16:17 ◼   ► pleasant. It looks like a Windows file system, slightly polished up.

01:16:26 ◼   ► It's kind of weird really looks like a dashboard for links. I don't know

01:16:32 ◼   ► It lets you train the service

01:16:36 ◼   ► to

01:16:38 ◼   ► specific

01:16:40 ◼   ► keywords or

01:16:42 ◼   ► titles or authors in

01:16:44 ◼   ► RSS

01:16:46 ◼   ► items

01:16:47 ◼   ► So if you say, okay

01:16:49 ◼   ► I want to see more of this topic or I want to see more of this author or I want to see less from this

01:16:56 ◼   ► specific source. If you train the service with time, there's a focus mode in the

01:17:02 ◼   ► app. So you can view RSS articles, there's three sections, ALL which shows

01:17:08 ◼   ► you all articles, UNREAD which shows you new stuff and FOCUS which shows you the

01:17:13 ◼   ► important stuff. So my idea was, okay, if I train this service enough, maybe one

01:17:19 ◼   ► day I will be able to to open the app and go to the focus mode and I will see

01:17:23 ◼   ► all the important stuff. But then again, if I train this service, it is not

01:17:29 ◼   ► going to be about popularity. It is going to be about the stuff that I instruct

01:17:34 ◼   ► the service to look for. So it's not strictly about the number of shares and

01:17:39 ◼   ► the number of hits that an article gets. It's just about keywords and

01:17:43 ◼   ► stuff. So we'll see. I don't know because NewsBlur also has comments, which is kind

01:17:49 ◼   ► weird you can comment in an RSS reader because it's kind of like a social

01:17:53 ◼   ► platform you can follow people there. Search is like it's crazy fast. I

01:18:00 ◼   ► was able to find RSS articles from 2011 in two seconds. It goes way way back in

01:18:06 ◼   ► years. I don't know how to do it. I guess that when you give it a subscription it

01:18:12 ◼   ► tries to load as many articles in the past as possible. That's kind of cool.

01:18:15 ◼   ► silly, it does look pretty terrible.

01:18:17 ◼   ► Yeah, I checked it out right after Google Reader died.

01:18:21 ◼   ► I looked at a lot of services, and it's definitely not real pretty on the eyes.

01:18:27 ◼   ► But if you use it with a third-party app, I guess you're sort of shielding yourself from that a little bit.

01:18:33 ◼   ► What do you guys use for iOS these days?

01:18:37 ◼   ► Feed Wrangler and Unread on my iPhone.

01:18:40 ◼   ► It's the only service and app that I use.

01:18:44 ◼   ► Yeah, I use Feedbin for the service and then Unread on iOS and Reader on the Mac.

01:18:53 ◼   ► So there's no way to, at least in the apps that you guys use, there's no way to sort

01:19:00 ◼   ► articles based on popularity in RSS?

01:19:04 ◼   ► No.

01:19:05 ◼   ► No, but I view something like Nuzzle, like Nuzzle for me kind of fills that need.

01:19:10 ◼   ► I don't necessarily want to look at my news that way all the time.

01:19:13 ◼   ► So it's a kind of view that's separate from the way I read RSS, but maybe that's just

01:19:18 ◼   ► me.

01:19:19 ◼   ► RSS and just getting news is not an important thing for me.

01:19:23 ◼   ► I find out about everything I need to find out about through osmosis on Twitter.

01:19:29 ◼   ► It just is there.

01:19:31 ◼   ► People are talking about it.

01:19:32 ◼   ► I don't have a business which relies on news quickly.

01:19:38 ◼   ► I don't need to post links and stuff like that.

01:19:41 ◼   ► And pretty much all of the topics on the shows tend to be what everybody's talking about.

01:19:49 ◼   ► So I have my last two items.

01:19:54 ◼   ► Zapier, it's basically an IFTTT for geeks.

01:20:01 ◼   ► I know that IFTTT is already for geeks.

01:20:04 ◼   ► This is basically the more advanced version.

01:20:07 ◼   ► This is for Federico.

01:20:09 ◼   ► - No, there's plenty of people using it, just not me.

01:20:12 ◼   ► Don't make me sound like the crazy person every time.

01:20:15 ◼   ► - You do a good job on Europe.

01:20:18 ◼   ► (laughing)

01:20:20 ◼   ► - I looked at it actually a couple of weeks ago maybe,

01:20:23 ◼   ► and it seems really crazy. - It's crazy.

01:20:27 ◼   ► Yes, it is.

01:20:28 ◼   ► So it's a web automation.

01:20:31 ◼   ► You can connect multiple services together.

01:20:33 ◼   ► IFTT calls them like channels and recipes.

01:20:38 ◼   ► Zapier calls them like just I think apps and zaps.

01:20:42 ◼   ► - Oh.

01:20:43 ◼   ► - Yeah, and actions, whatever.

01:20:46 ◼   ► The terminology is kind of weird,

01:20:48 ◼   ► but the functionality is amazing.

01:20:50 ◼   ► So you can do stuff like you can create conditions for IFS.

01:20:55 ◼   ► You can, there's a free service that you're using

01:21:02 ◼   ► in combination with Zapier called the Zapier Email Parser,

01:21:06 ◼   ► which looks for specific strings of text in emails,

01:21:13 ◼   ► and it can extract that text and use it as a placeholder

01:21:19 ◼   ► in other actions.

01:21:22 ◼   ► You can do stuff like--

01:21:25 ◼   ► it just offers more data when you're

01:21:27 ◼   ► trying to create an action.

01:21:31 ◼   ► Like, it allows you to--

01:21:33 ◼   ► like all the different tags and variables,

01:21:37 ◼   ► it's just much more, more, more than IFTTT.

01:21:41 ◼   ► You can create different,

01:21:46 ◼   ► you can use different accounts for the same service.

01:21:48 ◼   ► So you can connect like two Google Docs accounts

01:21:51 ◼   ► or two Twitter accounts,

01:21:53 ◼   ► and you can view a full history of all your actions

01:21:58 ◼   ► and whether they worked or not.

01:22:01 ◼   ► And if they didn't work, you can,

01:22:03 ◼   ► basically there's a debug mode

01:22:05 ◼   ► and you can understand why you're not,

01:22:08 ◼   ► a piece of data is not getting from service A to service B.

01:22:11 ◼   ► And in general, it's just a more advanced,

01:22:16 ◼   ► it's basically IFTTT for power users.

01:22:20 ◼   ► - It's also sort of expensive looking at this pricing.

01:22:24 ◼   ► - It is expensive.

01:22:24 ◼   ► I'm paying 20 bucks a month to use this.

01:22:27 ◼   ► So right now I'm doing stuff like,

01:22:29 ◼   ► I can post to different Slack channels using email.

01:22:37 ◼   ► That's kind of nice, but not like a must-have for me.

01:22:40 ◼   ► What is a nice addition to my workflow

01:22:44 ◼   ► is I'm getting notifications in pushover, which

01:22:49 ◼   ► is this notification iOS app.

01:22:52 ◼   ► Every time specific Twitter accounts or Apple's YouTube

01:22:57 ◼   ► channel or Apple's press release websites posts a new item, I get a notification on my device

01:23:07 ◼   ► and because I'm paying for the 20 bucks a month account, I'm getting those notifications in under

01:23:13 ◼   ► two minutes. They say 15 minutes, it's actually much much faster than that. I would like to have

01:23:19 ◼   ► like to know that it's not gonna be 15 minutes because in my experience it's never

01:23:25 ◼   ► been 15 minutes. I'm also using other stuff like I get a notification every time our newsletter goes

01:23:33 ◼   ► out on MailChimp. What else? I'm doing stuff to like save my RSS articles from Mac stories to a

01:23:41 ◼   ► Google spreadsheet. So I'm kind of curious to see whether this... because I think I

01:23:48 ◼   ► I stumbled across many limitations with IFTTT and I want to see whether my problem is the

01:23:56 ◼   ► lack of options in IFTTT or maybe that I just don't rely on web automation that much.

01:24:04 ◼   ► I just wanted to shake things up a bit and see what's up with my web automation.

01:24:13 ◼   ► You guys use IFTTT?

01:24:14 ◼   ► No, I mean, not really.

01:24:18 ◼   ► There are a couple of things that IFTTT does for me, but I don't use it as such.

01:24:25 ◼   ► Like, it's not something that I'm always adding to, like Workflow, which I love.

01:24:31 ◼   ► Yeah, I play with it, but I don't rely on it for anything on any regular basis.

01:24:40 ◼   ► I had some stuff like archiving to Evernote note, like Twitter favorites to Evernote,

01:24:45 ◼   ► that sort of thing, a while ago, but I sort of lost interest in it and I don't think

01:24:50 ◼   ► I have anything running currently.

01:24:52 ◼   ► Right then gentlemen, do you have anything else you'd like to add on this week's

01:24:56 ◼   ► show?

01:24:57 ◼   ► Or are we good?

01:24:58 ◼   ► Are we good to bring it home?

01:25:00 ◼   ► I think we're good, Myke.

01:25:02 ◼   ► I do want to say one thing.

01:25:03 ◼   ► I don't have the new fav animation that everybody has on Twitter.

01:25:07 ◼   ► I don't have it.

01:25:08 ◼   ► Like, I don't know why my app's up today.

01:25:09 ◼   ► - Are you using Twitter on the iPhone?

01:25:11 ◼   ► - Yeah. - The iPhone.

01:25:12 ◼   ► Are you sure? - Yes.

01:25:13 ◼   ► Am I sure I'm using it on the iPhone?

01:25:15 ◼   ► No, I'm using it on my Mac.

01:25:16 ◼   ► Of course it's my iPhone.

01:25:18 ◼   ► I don't have the animation.

01:25:19 ◼   ► I have the art animation. - This is your punishment.

01:25:21 ◼   ► This is your punishment.

01:25:22 ◼   ► - Twitter A/B test things even within their own app.

01:25:25 ◼   ► So maybe you're just not in the test group.

01:25:26 ◼   ► - So I'm in like the B group,

01:25:28 ◼   ► like the B minus minus group.

01:25:30 ◼   ► Everyone's like, "I love this animation."

01:25:32 ◼   ► I'm like, "What are you talking about?

01:25:33 ◼   ► "It's just the same as it was before."

01:25:34 ◼   ► There you go.

01:25:35 ◼   ► - And you're sure you updated the app?

01:25:37 ◼   ► 100% I even deleted it and reinstalled it. Wow. You really wanted it. I

01:25:41 ◼   ► Don't know why I'm not getting it. The animation is so good Myke. I know everybody I've seen gifts

01:25:47 ◼   ► I've seen gifts. You really gotta see them in action, man. It's so good. I

01:25:53 ◼   ► Can't wait until Twitter does something you hate

01:25:56 ◼   ► Seems impossible

01:26:02 ◼   ► Thank you so much for listening to this week's episode of Connected.

01:26:05 ◼   ► You can find the show notes at relay.fm/connected/21.

01:26:09 ◼   ► Thanks so much to our sponsors this week, our friends over at Hover and LootCrate.

01:26:13 ◼   ► If you want to find us online, I am at imike, I-M-Y-K-E.

01:26:16 ◼   ► Federico is @vittici, V-I-T-I-C-C-I, and Steven is @ismh.

01:26:21 ◼   ► Steven writes the fantastic 512 pixels .net, and Federico writes thegreatmaxstories.net.

01:26:27 ◼   ► And I host many shows at relay.fm, which you can find at relay.fm.

01:26:31 ◼   ► And thanks so much for listening, we'll be back.

01:26:33 ◼   ► Say goodbye, boys.

01:26:34 ◼   ► Adios amigos.

01:26:35 ◼   ► Bye!

01:26:35 ◼   ► Adios amigos. Bye!

01:26:40 ◼   ► [