Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► [Music]

00:00:07 ◼   ► From Relay FM, this is Connected, episode 18.

00:00:11 ◼   ► Today the show is brought to you by lynda.com, where you can instantly stream thousands of

00:00:15 ◼   ► courses created by industry experts.

00:00:17 ◼   ► For a 10-day free trial, visit lynda.com/connected.

00:00:21 ◼   ► Dev Mountain, a world-class coding school in the mountains of Utah.

00:00:25 ◼   ► and PDF Pen Scan Plus from Smile, the app for mobile scanning and OCR.

00:00:30 ◼   ► My name is Myke Hurley and I'm joined by Mr. Steven Hackett.

00:00:33 ◼   ► Hi Steven.

00:00:34 ◼   ► Hello Michael.

00:00:35 ◼   ► And Mr. Federico Vittucci.

00:00:36 ◼   ► Hi Federico.

00:00:37 ◼   ► Ciao Myke.

00:00:38 ◼   ► Ciao Federico.

00:00:39 ◼   ► How are you doing?

00:00:40 ◼   ► I am very well.

00:00:42 ◼   ► How are you fine gentlemen on this evening?

00:00:44 ◼   ► I'm doing well.

00:00:45 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:00:46 ◼   ► I'm doing extremely well on this evening and hello to you as well Mr. Steven Hackett from

00:00:51 ◼   ► Tennessee.

00:00:52 ◼   ► Hello.

00:00:53 ◼   ► Hello. Is that where you're from? Is that really Tennessee? Yeah, I live, it is, it's the state.

00:00:58 ◼   ► Yeah, I know the American states. That's good. How many can you name, Federica? Oh, many.

00:01:05 ◼   ► Yeah, many of them. All of them, all of the states. How many states are there? 52. 50, right?

00:01:16 ◼   ► So this is a 51. Yeah. I mean, Puerto Rico is almost a state.

00:01:21 ◼   ► I know, right? Email Myke about that. So the thing, the thing is, like, I have felt guilty

00:01:29 ◼   ► about this before, and maybe we've talked about it, but like, you guys, at least being the very

00:01:34 ◼   ► small sample of my international friends are like relatively acquainted with America, like geography,

00:01:41 ◼   ► like, like sort of regional humor.

00:01:44 ◼   ► And now maybe that's colored by the fact that you know me, but like, I feel like

00:01:48 ◼   ► overall people who don't live in America know more about America than like

00:01:53 ◼   ► Americans know about other countries.

00:01:55 ◼   ► Like, I don't know.

00:01:56 ◼   ► I don't know the like intricacies of like, if you live in certain parts of, of

00:02:02 ◼   ► England, you have this accent or you're, you know, these stereotypes apply to you.

00:02:06 ◼   ► I feel bad about it.

00:02:08 ◼   ► I feel like I should know your stereotypes better.

00:02:10 ◼   ► All I know about America is from House of Cards and other TV shows.

00:02:15 ◼   ► Well, that's a documentary basically.

00:02:17 ◼   ► Yeah, and you also.

00:02:19 ◼   ► Have you watched the West Wing?

00:02:21 ◼   ► It's on Netflix.

00:02:22 ◼   ► It's good.

00:02:23 ◼   ► If you like political drama, the West Wing is really good.

00:02:25 ◼   ► Yeah, because I don't have Netflix.

00:02:27 ◼   ► Oh yeah.

00:02:28 ◼   ► Well, you can move to Myke's house and watch it.

00:02:30 ◼   ► Or I can keep using Netflix.

00:02:33 ◼   ► I managed to sign up with a free trial once using a VPN.

00:02:39 ◼   ► What I'm doing now is that Netflix every two or three months they send me an email saying

00:02:44 ◼   ► "Hey, do you want to try Netflix again?"

00:02:46 ◼   ► So every time they send me this email I use the free link, like a freeloader basically,

00:02:52 ◼   ► to watch House of Cards.

00:02:54 ◼   ► So I'm expecting to get another email in February.

00:02:58 ◼   ► This is like when I had all that Dropbox space.

00:03:01 ◼   ► Yes.

00:03:02 ◼   ► But Oli, I have an excuse because I cannot legally access Netflix in Italy.

00:03:07 ◼   ► I had an excuse.

00:03:08 ◼   ► No.

00:03:09 ◼   ► Yeah, you bought an Android phone that came with Dropbox space.

00:03:12 ◼   ► It was my excuse.

00:03:13 ◼   ► So anyway, I just used the free trial.

00:03:16 ◼   ► Just over and over.

00:03:18 ◼   ► Yes.

00:03:19 ◼   ► I like it.

00:03:20 ◼   ► Because they sent me this really heartfelt email saying that they miss me and that they

00:03:24 ◼   ► want me to try Netflix again.

00:03:25 ◼   ► I'm like, "Okay, whatever.

00:03:27 ◼   ► Just streaming us of cards."

00:03:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:03:30 ◼   ► It comes back in February.

00:03:31 ◼   ► Every now and then I get a letter from Amazon, and the letter is to encourage me to tell

00:03:36 ◼   ► people to try out Amazon Prime and they give me two little plastic cards like

00:03:41 ◼   ► credit cards that just have a URL on them which is just like amazon.com/prime/freetrial

00:03:46 ◼   ► and they want me to give those to people.

00:03:50 ◼   ► And you just use them?

00:03:51 ◼   ► No, I mean I'm already a Prime subscriber and all they want me to do is just get other

00:03:57 ◼   ► people to sign up for a free trial.

00:03:58 ◼   ► I don't get anything for it, it's not like if you sign up I'll get like an extra month.

00:04:03 ◼   ► They're just little cards that have the generic URL on them that they want me to give out.

00:04:07 ◼   ► Did you talk about Amazon in real life, Myke?

00:04:10 ◼   ► I love Amazon.

00:04:11 ◼   ► I love Prime.

00:04:12 ◼   ► Prime changed my life.

00:04:13 ◼   ► Really?

00:04:14 ◼   ► Yeah, I just renewed my Prime this week, actually.

00:04:17 ◼   ► It's good.

00:04:18 ◼   ► It's good.

00:04:19 ◼   ► Although, I didn't get an email about it.

00:04:22 ◼   ► It's like, "Oh, $100 is out of my account.

00:04:24 ◼   ► Thanks, Amazon."

00:04:25 ◼   ► Yeah, don't worry about things like that.

00:04:27 ◼   ► No, money's a construct, anyways.

00:04:30 ◼   ► Money is...

00:04:31 ◼   ► Guys, speaking of life-changing events, we are changing the lives of people who love

00:04:38 ◼   ► technology around the world by rediscovering old web browsers.

00:04:45 ◼   ► I noticed even that this week we got at least two more entries in our list of unusual browsers

00:04:53 ◼   ► accessing our website.

00:04:55 ◼   ► We did.

00:04:57 ◼   ► The Relay website does not hold up very well on the WebTV viewer.

00:05:02 ◼   ► What is a WebTV viewer?

00:05:03 ◼   ► It ships.

00:05:04 ◼   ► I don't really know.

00:05:05 ◼   ► I tried looking it up, but those are sort of generic terms.

00:05:07 ◼   ► Maybe someone in the chat room can help us out.

00:05:09 ◼   ► But the UI has Sony's logo all over it.

00:05:12 ◼   ► So either it's been hacked or it's some sort of Sony TV product.

00:05:17 ◼   ► But the ATP site, which is built on Squarespace, shows up actually pretty well.

00:05:22 ◼   ► Our site doesn't render at all.

00:05:24 ◼   ► But that's interesting.

00:05:27 ◼   ► So that was from Jimmy on Twitter and we have another one from David Ragsdale on Twitter

00:05:31 ◼   ► who loaded it up in the Kindle Paperwhite experimental browser, which might be the worst

00:05:37 ◼   ► browser that currently ships in the world.

00:05:40 ◼   ► However our website looks pretty good on it.

00:05:44 ◼   ► Yeah well your voice really got high there.

00:05:46 ◼   ► I'm really excited!

00:05:50 ◼   ► So what is a Kindle experimental browser?

00:05:53 ◼   ► Is this the thing that flies with the drone?

00:05:55 ◼   ► Yes, no, it's uh, Kindles, uh, eating Kindles forever have come with a browser built in.

00:06:02 ◼   ► I don't even know what it's based on.

00:06:03 ◼   ► I guess probably some fork of WebKit, but, uh, you can like, if you're connected to wifi,

00:06:08 ◼   ► if you have a 3g Kindle, you can browse the internet.

00:06:11 ◼   ► I'll be at very slowly and in grayscale on your Kindle, it's the worst thing.

00:06:16 ◼   ► Like you never want to be in a situation where like, I need to look up something.

00:06:20 ◼   ► Let me pull out my Kindle.

00:06:21 ◼   ► But the site loads, so thank you to David for being patient enough to let that load.

00:06:27 ◼   ► He also did it at 8.44am, which is a good job doing that first thing in the morning.

00:06:32 ◼   ► So what if we stayed up all night to get the browser to work?

00:06:37 ◼   ► Yeah, maybe.

00:06:38 ◼   ► Talking about E-Ink, are you guys familiar with the Yota phone?

00:06:43 ◼   ► Oh god.

00:06:44 ◼   ► I'm trying to ignore your text message right there.

00:06:45 ◼   ► Is it like the double phone?

00:06:46 ◼   ► Yeah, it's the one that's an Android phone and it's got like a regular Android screen

00:06:49 ◼   ► on the front and an E-Ink screen on the back.

00:06:51 ◼   ► Guess who loves it Federico?

00:06:53 ◼   ► Guess between me and Myke, who of us loves it?

00:06:57 ◼   ► Between you and Myke?

00:06:58 ◼   ► It's Myke.

00:06:59 ◼   ► It's Myke.

00:07:00 ◼   ► It's like the fun with the future in the front and the business in the back.

00:07:05 ◼   ► So they've got in an area where I frequent these days, they have a, in London, they have

00:07:13 ◼   ► a concept store.

00:07:15 ◼   ► What does that mean?

00:07:17 ◼   ► It's where my co-working space is, okay? It's where I go to co-work.

00:07:21 ◼   ► There it is.

00:07:22 ◼   ► It's around that area.

00:07:23 ◼   ► They have set up a store and they have these things now and I went in and played around with one

00:07:28 ◼   ► and I was very very impressed with it.

00:07:29 ◼   ► So they have the Android touch screen and the regular screen on the front and on the back.

00:07:34 ◼   ► They have some set apps that they have, like an RSS reader and News Reader, some games which use the ink screen.

00:07:40 ◼   ► They have a separate home screen thing which is really pared down.

00:07:44 ◼   ► and there's like a toggle that you can do to switch off the front screen completely

00:07:49 ◼   ► and it shows you, it said I had like nine hours battery life and then when I turned it off

00:07:53 ◼   ► to just be the E-Ink screen, so four days.

00:07:55 ◼   ► But you can access the entire Android OS via the E-Ink screen and it wasn't that bad.

00:08:03 ◼   ► That's a really solid recommendation.

00:08:07 ◼   ► No but like if you think, right, if you've got like an hour of battery life

00:08:10 ◼   ► you turn it on you could last for like another six hours and you can still kind of do everything.

00:08:14 ◼   ► Can you make phone calls? Yeah, you can do everything and in the last four days. Yeah, that's what the indicator said ink is

00:08:22 ◼   ► Crazy good for battery life. That's what the pebble uses. Mm-hmm

00:08:26 ◼   ► I was I was really I was really impressed with it, but it's really expensive. Well, it's not really expensive. It's

00:08:33 ◼   ► 555 pounds. I mean that's like unlocked phone expensive, but it's more money than I want to spend

00:08:38 ◼   ► But if I was gonna buy an Android phone like if that was my thing

00:08:44 ◼   ► without a shadow of a doubt this is the phone that I would get right now.

00:08:47 ◼   ► Really? Because it's interesting enough

00:08:50 ◼   ► that it actually does something that's useful. Like I can see some real uses.

00:08:55 ◼   ► Federico, imagine you're reading a long article that you found

00:08:57 ◼   ► on MacStories. You could just flip it over and just start reading

00:09:02 ◼   ► reading on E-Ink anyway, which is nicer. I don't read Apple websites.

00:09:06 ◼   ► Okay. And there was this other example that the salesperson guy gave me, which I thought was

00:09:11 ◼   ► quite cool. Like say you get an email with like you're in the airport, I always go back to

00:09:14 ◼   ► the airport and it's got like a QR code on it or whatever for your boarding pass.

00:09:17 ◼   ► You could just take a screenshot of that and you can just lay it on the ink screen and

00:09:21 ◼   ► it's just there and then you can just kind of do what you need to do with it.

00:09:25 ◼   ► I can see that it's one of those things that when you use it you'd find uses for it.

00:09:28 ◼   ► I think that it feels like when I first saw it I was like it's interesting but it seems

00:09:32 ◼   ► like a gimmick but I feel like there are some actual real world uses for something like

00:09:37 ◼   ► this.

00:09:38 ◼   ► I don't think this is like the... do you guys remember that super weird and corny kind of presentation from

00:09:47 ◼   ► ASOS for the padphone which was like a device... and there was like the guy pulling out this phone from his jacket

00:09:57 ◼   ► and it's like this is magical it was like super weird and strange and it was like this kind of double device

00:10:04 ◼   ► There was like a phone that you could put into a tablet.

00:10:07 ◼   ► Yeah, dude, it's coming back.

00:10:09 ◼   ► They have a new version, the PadPhone X.

00:10:11 ◼   ► There's a new PadPhone?

00:10:13 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:10:14 ◼   ► Yeah, it's on AT&T.

00:10:15 ◼   ► Yeah, the PadPhone X or X, I guess, coming to AT&T on October 24th.

00:10:20 ◼   ► Got an 8.5 out of 10 on Engadget, so must be good.

00:10:24 ◼   ► Make sure to find the old presentation video because it was like one of my favorite...

00:10:29 ◼   ► I think it was a CES.

00:10:32 ◼   ► If it was CES, that's definitely one of the best CES conferences that I ever watched.

00:10:37 ◼   ► It was really magical.

00:10:39 ◼   ► So Myke, you're saying that this is actually pretty good.

00:10:42 ◼   ► I was very impressed with it, genuinely.

00:10:46 ◼   ► We know what we can get you for Christmas.

00:10:48 ◼   ► Yeah, you can get me that.

00:10:50 ◼   ► I've got some follow up on what WebTV was.

00:10:53 ◼   ► There's a link in the show notes.

00:10:55 ◼   ► MSN TV was a television thin client that came out, I don't know, like the early or late

00:11:03 ◼   ► 90s or early 2000s and the service was cut off in January of this year.

00:11:08 ◼   ► I don't know a single word of what you said.

00:11:10 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:11:11 ◼   ► There's a link in the show notes.

00:11:13 ◼   ► Michael, where could the show notes be found?

00:11:16 ◼   ► So I was really impressed as were many people with Federico's Italian interpretation of

00:11:21 ◼   ► the show notes last week.

00:11:23 ◼   ► So I've decided that I would like to give a very British, kind of old-timey presentation

00:11:29 ◼   ► of the show this week.

00:11:30 ◼   ► Are you guys ready for this?

00:11:32 ◼   ► I'm prepared.

00:11:33 ◼   ► Go on.

00:11:34 ◼   ► Verily, if one would like to happen upon thy showeth notes, one should navigate oneself

00:11:39 ◼   ► to thy browser of thine web and pontificate upon the URF RFLF relay full stop FM/connected/18.

00:11:49 ◼   ► Here you will happen upon a selection of the very finest links one could ever wish to peruse.

00:11:54 ◼   ► Wow.

00:11:55 ◼   ► That sounds like when you're playing video games and they're like medieval video games

00:12:04 ◼   ► with kings and queens.

00:12:06 ◼   ► That's like what they talk about.

00:12:08 ◼   ► That's how we get taught English when we grow up.

00:12:11 ◼   ► It's good.

00:12:12 ◼   ► I stood up like halfway through it.

00:12:13 ◼   ► I just felt like I had to.

00:12:14 ◼   ► So next week, Steven, it's your turn.

00:12:16 ◼   ► It's gonna be good.

00:12:17 ◼   ► It's gonna be good.

00:12:18 ◼   ► You gotta roll American, those show notes up.

00:12:20 ◼   ► That's wow.

00:12:21 ◼   ► Please don't read the show notes while you're shooting a gun.

00:12:25 ◼   ► Too late bro.

00:12:27 ◼   ► Or as many people indicated to me over this week, not American, English simplified.

00:12:33 ◼   ► Yes.

00:12:34 ◼   ► Yeah, that screenshot's a hundred years old.

00:12:39 ◼   ► So we have some follow up around Panix transmit and draft widgets and other things.

00:12:47 ◼   ► Federico, what is happening in Cupertino?

00:12:51 ◼   ► Well we don't know what's happening in Cupertino.

00:12:53 ◼   ► What we see on the App Store is that Apple has reversed these three major rejections

00:13:00 ◼   ► for widgets and one iCloud feature on the App Store.

00:13:04 ◼   ► So the first popular rejection was the Pcalc widget that's been reversed the following

00:13:13 ◼   ► day.

00:13:14 ◼   ► Then there was the transmit case with the panic app to an FTP client and file manager.

00:13:20 ◼   ► Apple forced panic to remove a feature to share any file to iCloud drive and the press,

00:13:29 ◼   ► including MaxSories, made a big deal out of this removal and the feature was reinstated.

00:13:36 ◼   ► And now the latest app to go through a similar process has been Greg Pearce's Drafts. Excellent

00:13:44 ◼   ► note-taking app for iOS. The app came with a widget that lets you create a new draft,

00:13:53 ◼   ► an empty note or create a new note with the contents of your clipboard.

00:13:58 ◼   ► And Apple forced Greg to remove the widget because he couldn't ship with buttons to open

00:14:04 ◼   ► the app.

00:14:06 ◼   ► Now the widget is back and it's actually even better than before because it's got buttons,

00:14:12 ◼   ► plenty of them actually, and it also lets you open recent notes in the app.

00:14:18 ◼   ► So it's got plenty of functionality now.

00:14:21 ◼   ► And it looks like Apple is now okay with this sort of widgets.

00:14:25 ◼   ► It didn't really make sense to remove these widgets from the App Store.

00:14:30 ◼   ► There are dozens of apps at this point that can use buttons and other, you know, there

00:14:36 ◼   ► are basically direct links to specific sections of an app to perform tasks from Notification

00:14:42 ◼   ► Center.

00:14:43 ◼   ► It didn't make any sense, so I'm glad that JARFS is the latest example of a questionable

00:14:49 ◼   ► rejection that didn't really make sense and now it's been rectified.

00:14:53 ◼   ► So I'm happy and I actually think that widget is better now.

00:14:58 ◼   ► So that's good news.

00:15:01 ◼   ► But what have we got?

00:15:03 ◼   ► What is the situation?

00:15:04 ◼   ► Like are people allowed to do these things?

00:15:07 ◼   ► Yes.

00:15:08 ◼   ► Maybe.

00:15:09 ◼   ► I mean Evernote, you know there was some talk this week on Twitter about Evernote's widget

00:15:13 ◼   ► has a bunch of buttons.

00:15:15 ◼   ► spoke about last week and they had an update yesterday as well that you know that remained

00:15:20 ◼   ► in place and it seems like either they're going to allow it or you know you have to

00:15:28 ◼   ► remember like these examples are high profile applications they're not you know I mean there

00:15:33 ◼   ► could be other apps that people just don't know about dealing with this but I kind of

00:15:38 ◼   ► my gut says that they're going to let it let it fly and I wonder you know I don't know

00:15:44 ◼   ► how big the app store review team is. I got an email from somebody this week you

00:15:49 ◼   ► know saying like well you know is that app review team even in Cupertino are

00:15:53 ◼   ► they part of like corporate Apple you know parts of like the iTunes store are

00:15:56 ◼   ► outsourced you know how how close how close to the you know how behind the

00:16:01 ◼   ► veil are these reviewers and did they have somebody in there you know their

00:16:06 ◼   ► manager or just even one or two reviewers who like this problem all stems

00:16:11 ◼   ► from a very small group of people.

00:16:13 ◼   ► So it's hard to tell.

00:16:15 ◼   ► I'm hoping that it calms down, obviously,

00:16:17 ◼   ► because it uses great functionality.

00:16:18 ◼   ► It makes widgets actually useful.

00:16:22 ◼   ► So hopefully it's a chapter that's closed.

00:16:25 ◼   ► Yeah, I don't think that widgets like Launcher, which

00:16:30 ◼   ► was an app and a widget to basically simulate

00:16:33 ◼   ► a home screen in the Today View, a notification center,

00:16:37 ◼   ► I don't think that that kind of widgets

00:16:39 ◼   ► are coming back because Apple doesn't like them, you know, just the simulating home screen

00:16:44 ◼   ► in your today view. But I think that widgets that can launch apps, of course, that can

00:16:51 ◼   ► launch specific sections inside an app or perform a task, such as creating a new draft

00:16:57 ◼   ► with the contents of your clipboard, I think those are okay. And I think even if Apple

00:17:03 ◼   ► maybe want widgets to be simpler, I think they have now realized that by rejecting this

00:17:11 ◼   ► sort of functionality, by trying to set an example, they're just upsetting the kind of

00:17:17 ◼   ► audience that also happens to write about them.

00:17:21 ◼   ► Because like, iOS 8 is the kind of geeky, you know, update that is used by... and I'm

00:17:29 ◼   ► I'm not referring to myself in any way.

00:17:32 ◼   ► I'm just trying to think of all the other people who write Apple blogs.

00:17:35 ◼   ► Generally, those people are kind of power users.

00:17:39 ◼   ► So when you take away functionality from power users, they usually complain.

00:17:43 ◼   ► But in this case, they also write websites and blogs so they can make a bigger deal than

00:17:48 ◼   ► maybe in the past few years for other kinds of features that Apple didn't want.

00:17:53 ◼   ► So I think in this case, they just need to let it pass and accept the fact that widgets

00:17:59 ◼   ► do this sort of stuff, you know? And maybe this will be reflected next year in major

00:18:06 ◼   ► changes in the way that Apple is doing widgets. Just at this point, why not do more, right?

00:18:12 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, I think it's a really good point. And iOS on the whole, you know, these new

00:18:19 ◼   ► features in iOS 8 especially, like, they're not as mainstream as, say, copy and paste

00:18:24 ◼   ► was in iPhone OS 3.

00:18:27 ◼   ► They're getting as iOS becomes more mature when they add things, those things are in

00:18:34 ◼   ► of themselves more mature features.

00:18:36 ◼   ► There's no, to use a term that's been thrown around in the past, there's no real low-hanging

00:18:41 ◼   ► fruit left on iOS.

00:18:43 ◼   ► There's obviously a lot of things we would like, but again, we're the power users.

00:18:47 ◼   ► The average person on the street with an iPhone, it does what people need it to do.

00:18:53 ◼   ► I guess you can find people who would want certain things, but on the whole, I think

00:18:56 ◼   ► Apple as iOS matures, like, this is going to be an issue because they're pushing the

00:19:01 ◼   ► bar, you know, they're making it more powerful, they're making it more flexible than it's

00:19:06 ◼   ► ever been before.

00:19:08 ◼   ► And clearly App Review or some faction within Apple, like, hasn't quite caught up to that

00:19:14 ◼   ► yet and hopefully it's, that's not, you know, an ongoing problem.

00:19:22 ◼   ► Well, reliability is the new low-hanging fruit.

00:19:26 ◼   ► Sick burn, bro.

00:19:27 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, just, you know, people at this point, people know that there are problems

00:19:32 ◼   ► sometimes on iOS, especially when it launches.

00:19:34 ◼   ► They created this new idea that when the new major version of iOS launches, you gotta ask

00:19:40 ◼   ► your friends whether it's okay to upgrade.

00:19:42 ◼   ► Because everybody has the geeky friend, right?

00:19:45 ◼   ► Everybody has the computer tech-savvy friend.

00:19:47 ◼   ► And they always ask, "Hey, I saw there's an update.

00:19:50 ◼   ► Is it safe?"

00:19:51 ◼   ► - Oh, I get that.

00:19:52 ◼   ► - And there was always that kind of component

00:19:55 ◼   ► to releasing software updates,

00:19:58 ◼   ► but in the past two years, especially after Apple Maps,

00:20:01 ◼   ► I think it was the turning point for this kind of behavior.

00:20:04 ◼   ► Friends always ask, "Should I do the update?"

00:20:09 ◼   ► Like, every time I see them, they ask about updates,

00:20:12 ◼   ► because now there's an update for everything all the time.

00:20:15 ◼   ► Everything is a software update these days.

00:20:18 ◼   ► - Unless it's a Mac app.

00:20:19 ◼   ► - They all, yes.

00:20:21 ◼   ► Really sad, I'm sorry for you buddy.

00:20:24 ◼   ► But yes, my friends always ask me about software updates and next year if they focus on...

00:20:30 ◼   ► Like if they come out and say, "Look, this year we just made iOS twice as fast and we give you twice the battery life."

00:20:36 ◼   ► People will just go crazy.

00:20:39 ◼   ► I mean, maybe we would go like...

00:20:43 ◼   ► We would go, "Yeah, we'll go here."

00:20:46 ◼   ► But worse than you SDK stuff.

00:20:48 ◼   ► stuff. Right, I mean that's what I'm saying like like I would love my phone to last two days but

00:20:53 ◼   ► like Apple, I mean we talked about this with OS X like with an annual release cycle

00:20:57 ◼   ► they've got to put stuff out every year and by the time iOS 8 is sort of like done being patched up

00:21:03 ◼   ► you know they're on to iOS 9 or whatever's next and it's it's a pace that's worrisome

00:21:09 ◼   ► and and this sort of thing where you know the the SDK and the features and the APIs pull ahead and

00:21:17 ◼   ► it's got to like by the time Apple, like the rest of the applicants yanked along up to

00:21:22 ◼   ► this current state then like the SDK and APIs and everything are already further ahead.

00:21:27 ◼   ► It's kind of, it takes some time for everyone to get on the same page and by the time they

00:21:31 ◼   ► are there's a new page being written at WWDC.

00:21:34 ◼   ► But we'll see.

00:21:37 ◼   ► I guess we will talk about the features that we want to see in iOS 9 and kind of the stuff

00:21:43 ◼   ► that we think is still missing maybe next year.

00:21:47 ◼   ► But in general I think that iOS is at the point where the simple things are the most

00:21:51 ◼   ► appreciated ones.

00:21:53 ◼   ► So speed and reliability, efficiency in general, just being able to use an app without crashing

00:21:59 ◼   ► and without having to restart an iPhone every couple of days to speed things up.

00:22:07 ◼   ► That would be awesome just in general.

00:22:11 ◼   ► It's true.

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00:24:52 ◼   ► Topic zero this week is a topic we haven't really ever talked about before but there

00:24:58 ◼   ► There are apps that you can use to manage your photos.

00:25:01 ◼   ► Really?

00:25:02 ◼   ► Yeah, it's pretty cool.

00:25:03 ◼   ► Like can you move the photos around?

00:25:05 ◼   ► Yeah, you can put them on the cloud and then the cloud sometimes goes out of business.

00:25:10 ◼   ► Can I like take the photos from my hard disk and put them on the web?

00:25:17 ◼   ► I love that you said hard disk.

00:25:21 ◼   ► So carousel is an app that we've covered before built by our friends at Dropbox and carousel

00:25:28 ◼   ► started life as basically an auto uploader for your iOS or Android device.

00:25:33 ◼   ► So you have pictures in your camera roll carousel uploads them to Dropbox automatically and

00:25:39 ◼   ► those of us who use Dropbox or either for photo management and storage or just as a

00:25:44 ◼   ► gateway to the Mac or your desktop computer.

00:25:48 ◼   ► It's really great right you don't have to use image capture you don't have to plug it

00:25:50 ◼   ► and it just syncs up, you don't have to deal with photo stream.

00:25:53 ◼   ► Well, you got to hand to Dropbox.

00:25:56 ◼   ► I really have been impressed at the rate

00:25:57 ◼   ► that they've been adding things to carousel.

00:25:59 ◼   ► And so this morning, or yesterday sometime,

00:26:06 ◼   ► the carousel app got a nice update.

00:26:08 ◼   ► We have a link in the show notes that I'm now

00:26:09 ◼   ► realizing is like a week old because it's

00:26:11 ◼   ► about the Android app, so we'll fix that.

00:26:13 ◼   ► But a couple really nice things have come to the iOS device.

00:26:17 ◼   ► So carousel, one of its main UI features

00:26:19 ◼   ► was you could scroll back in time so you could like have this little like slider

00:26:23 ◼   ► and like slide back like 2012 and look at pictures but they've sort of beefed

00:26:29 ◼   ► that up with it with the ability to they'll send up like a push notification

00:26:34 ◼   ► for a flashback which is very similar to which service was it had don't say don't

00:26:41 ◼   ► say don't say we'll just be sad okay so one of the dead photo management systems

00:26:47 ◼   ► of that I think it was I think it's dead they're all dead it is the one that died

00:26:52 ◼   ► it's the one that we all loved and then it died yeah the photo management

00:26:55 ◼   ► service that shall not be named had this feature so you could very yes no that's

00:27:03 ◼   ► sorry have had this feature it made it very easy to see photos in your library

00:27:08 ◼   ► from previous years and so now carousel does that so I was playing with it this

00:27:13 ◼   ► morning and apparently like 10 years ago today I had pictures taken like just

00:27:18 ◼   ► like me and my college roommate in our dorm so it's kind of fun to be like oh

00:27:20 ◼   ► man that was 10 years ago what happened how did I get old it's all built in now

00:27:25 ◼   ► which is really nice and and that feature obviously works if you have all

00:27:28 ◼   ► your photos and Dropbox and carousel knows about them but it also has a

00:27:32 ◼   ► feature which is a little I think more mainstream where it can clean up space

00:27:38 ◼   ► on your phone and I don't know about you guys I don't know if you have played

00:27:42 ◼   ► with this but it's a little confusing as to what it's doing when it's doing it so

00:27:49 ◼   ► I went in and I had some things on my camera roll and I said hey there's some

00:27:53 ◼   ► space we can clean up I hit the button and then like something happened I don't

00:27:56 ◼   ► know what happened but what I really want is a switch to be like once

00:28:00 ◼   ► carousel has uploaded this image take it off my camera roll because I keep my

00:28:03 ◼   ► camera roll basically empty and right now I've got to plug it into my Mac and

00:28:07 ◼   ► blow it away an image capture so I don't have to delete them one at a time I tap

00:28:11 ◼   ► on them all in iOS. So let me understand, carousel can delete photos from the photos

00:28:18 ◼   ► app but they go into a recently deleted album? Yes. And then you gotta delete all the photos

00:28:28 ◼   ► from the recently deleted album otherwise they get wiped from the device after 30 days?

00:28:34 ◼   ► I believe so. Again, like, we should know this.

00:28:38 ◼   ► Yeah, that's an ISA thing. Because I'm trying all these new apps to delete screenshots, right?

00:28:45 ◼   ► There's one called Screeny and another called Sharky.

00:28:50 ◼   ► And basically, yes, it's called Sharky.

00:28:52 ◼   ► Where's George?

00:28:55 ◼   ► So basically, when you delete the screenshots, they go into a recently deleted album on your device.

00:29:03 ◼   ► and if you want to just erase them from memory you gotta hit a button and say

00:29:11 ◼   ► just delete them all right now. I haven't tried Carousel, like I only

00:29:17 ◼   ► downloaded the app again and used it for like two minutes. I didn't see the option

00:29:23 ◼   ► to delete photos from the camera roll. But I guess that, I mean I'm kind of

00:29:30 ◼   ► I'm interested in trying Carousel again because of the flashback, but I also am fine with

00:29:37 ◼   ► iCloud Photo Library.

00:29:40 ◼   ► I went on a bit of a quest a couple of weeks ago.

00:29:44 ◼   ► I managed to download all the photos that I have, like everywhere.

00:29:50 ◼   ► It's a little more than 3,000 pictures, and I put them all into iCloud Photo Library because

00:29:56 ◼   ► I upgraded to the paid plan.

00:29:59 ◼   ► 99 cents each month and I'm fine, you know, there's some minor issues occasionally, like

00:30:10 ◼   ► you don't see the thumbnails in the Photos app, you gotta restart the app, but overall

00:30:14 ◼   ► all my photos sync across devices and it's fine. But I think Dropbox is doing some cool

00:30:20 ◼   ► stuff with Carousel, now I'm not sure about this option to delete photos and also the

00:30:26 ◼   ► the way that they worded it, like, free up space on your device.

00:30:30 ◼   ► Yeah, it's weird.

00:30:31 ◼   ► That's not really true, because you cannot really delete the photos.

00:30:34 ◼   ► You gotta still make sure that the photos are deleted.

00:30:37 ◼   ► But that's an iOS 8 limitation, I think.

00:30:39 ◼   ► I think they're trying to make it...

00:30:42 ◼   ► The flashback is really nice.

00:30:44 ◼   ► But when I opened it this morning, it wasn't really like a Never Peaks-like flashback.

00:30:49 ◼   ► There was pictures taken on this exact day.

00:30:53 ◼   ► It was like pictures from around the same period a while back.

00:31:00 ◼   ► I think the free space verbiage is just trying to...

00:31:04 ◼   ► That's what people think, right?

00:31:05 ◼   ► Like, "Oh, I need to have free space on my phone."

00:31:08 ◼   ► And "delete" is a scary word to put into an application.

00:31:12 ◼   ► So maybe they're just trying to...

00:31:14 ◼   ► Coupled with the limitation, they can't really do what I want them to do, so they're just

00:31:18 ◼   ► trying to soften that language somehow.

00:31:21 ◼   ► I think I think overall I mean Dropbox with carousel being like the front lines is very clearly trying to become like a

00:31:29 ◼   ► photo management solution built on top of their sync engine you know on

00:31:33 ◼   ► OS 10 you can have it automatically suck in screenshots

00:31:38 ◼   ► You can actually the Dropbox app on the Mac will take your iPhoto library contents and like upload them to Dropbox and

00:31:45 ◼   ► They're really making a play

00:31:48 ◼   ► Like not only like can you sync your PowerPoint documents with Dropbox is like you can use it. You know like it like I do still

00:31:55 ◼   ► Like just for photo storage and for you know having my photos always accessible to me

00:32:00 ◼   ► I'm really at this point like not

00:32:03 ◼   ► Like I will play with iCloud photos when photos that app shows up for for the Mac, but I'm really not

00:32:13 ◼   ► I'm not yearning for iCloud photos to sort of come out of beta and be available everywhere.

00:32:20 ◼   ► It's not super anxious to change my system right now.

00:32:30 ◼   ► Yeah, as it stands, I'm fine with Dropbox.

00:32:36 ◼   ► I don't ever peruse the photos that are in Dropbox.

00:32:39 ◼   ► I just know that they're there, but I don't do anything with them.

00:32:43 ◼   ► That's a great point because since I started using iCloud for the library,

00:32:48 ◼   ► I'm going through my old photos more because they're just there.

00:32:52 ◼   ► And I love going through old photos.

00:32:55 ◼   ► It's one of the things that I love doing the most when I'm not doing

00:32:59 ◼   ► backstory stuff on my iPad or my iPhone.

00:33:02 ◼   ► Just going through old photos, remembering people, remembering stuff.

00:33:06 ◼   ► And because I have all the photos there, I'm looking at my photos more and I feel like

00:33:11 ◼   ► I make better use of my memories because I can easily access them.

00:33:16 ◼   ► Whereas before it was always, you know, I gotta make sure that I open this folder, I

00:33:20 ◼   ► gotta try a specific app, and now they're just there.

00:33:23 ◼   ► And I think I'm happier, you know, because it's easier.

00:33:27 ◼   ► I guess you could say the same thing for music.

00:33:31 ◼   ► people like Steven who just don't use Spotify and other beats music or

00:33:35 ◼   ► streaming services, they just want their music. For me, I think that my photos are

00:33:39 ◼   ► more valuable, I guess, for me than songs, and I cannot see Steven's point about

00:33:44 ◼   ► music, I cannot see a reflection of that in photos. So yeah, that's a great point,

00:33:49 ◼   ► Myke. Thank you for saying that.

00:33:52 ◼   ► So we got a little more photo topics.

00:33:57 ◼   ► Federico, basically your system exploded, right?

00:34:01 ◼   ► For crunching images for your website?

00:34:03 ◼   ► Yeah, you were right when you said that this deal was a real...

00:34:08 ◼   ► What's the word that you used to describe that kind of workflow?

00:34:13 ◼   ► Fragile, I think is what I said.

00:34:16 ◼   ► Yes, that was an understatement.

00:34:19 ◼   ► Give people a refresher of what you're talking about.

00:34:22 ◼   ► So a couple of episodes ago, I was working on my Twitter article, and I was putting together

00:34:32 ◼   ► screenshots because I was reaching the end of my writing session.

00:34:36 ◼   ► And so I thought that because I was testing this app that allowed me to, let's say, automate

00:34:45 ◼   ► the system share sheet and kind of to connect multiple share sheets and the document picker.

00:34:51 ◼   ► So I thought that I could create a workflow to take a screenshot, put it in Dropbox through

00:34:57 ◼   ► the native document picker, and then on my Mac Mini server, which is hosted at Mac Mini

00:35:02 ◼   ► Colu, I could open the file in ImageOptim, which is this image optimization app for the

00:35:10 ◼   ► Mac which removes a lot of extra information from image files and it makes them smaller

00:35:16 ◼   ► without visibly ugly loss in terms of quality.

00:35:25 ◼   ► So they're smaller, they save you bandwidth on the CDN, and they don't look terrible.

00:35:32 ◼   ► And I thought that the Mac Mini, using Hazel, could...

00:35:36 ◼   ► I'm just adding layers and layers of complication here.

00:35:39 ◼   ► The Mac Mini, using Hazel, could look for the image file in Dropbox, run ImageOptim,

00:35:44 ◼   ► it back into Dropbox and then back on my iPad I would open the document picker again, find

00:35:50 ◼   ► the optimized image file, download it and use the sharesheet again to upload it and

00:35:57 ◼   ► get a link.

00:35:58 ◼   ► So that was quite a few steps.

00:36:00 ◼   ► I love you so much for trying.

00:36:02 ◼   ► Yeah, that's a lot of…

00:36:04 ◼   ► You gotta give me credit for my commitment to my idea, right?

00:36:09 ◼   ► I mean, I really tried to make it work.

00:36:13 ◼   ► I then realized that basically the entire thing was broken.

00:36:20 ◼   ► No image was being optimized.

00:36:28 ◼   ► Waiting there for it to come back and it's just gone forever.

00:36:32 ◼   ► You just thought it was done?

00:36:34 ◼   ► No, I was putting together my article, right?

00:36:37 ◼   ► And thank God I got the, like, I started being skeptical.

00:36:42 ◼   ► I was like, are my images really optimized?

00:36:45 ◼   ► Because the preview for the article in the editorial,

00:36:49 ◼   ► when you switch to the preview, it took seconds to load.

00:36:54 ◼   ► And usually, when I have optimized images,

00:36:56 ◼   ► they don't take all those seconds to load.

00:37:01 ◼   ► So I started wondering, are my images really smaller?

00:37:05 ◼   ► And so I downloaded all the already uploaded images,

00:37:09 ◼   ► which were like only 10 files, fortunately, out of like 50.

00:37:14 ◼   ► Only 10 files I downloaded them and they were full quality.

00:37:18 ◼   ► And so I ran my workflow again,

00:37:21 ◼   ► this time while being logged into my Mac mini via screens,

00:37:26 ◼   ► the VNC client to see the process happening.

00:37:30 ◼   ► And of course, image app team was launching

00:37:32 ◼   ► and then closing after a fraction of a second

00:37:35 ◼   ► without even touching the file.

00:37:36 ◼   ► (laughing)

00:37:37 ◼   ► just there bouncing in the dark. And yes, it was terrific workflow. Actually, you know

00:37:46 ◼   ► what? I think that by doing all the upload, download the image and then using Pythonista

00:37:54 ◼   ► to open the file, I think I was making the image bigger. So, yeah. So, yeah. Basically,

00:38:06 ◼   ► I spent like an afternoon being upset.

00:38:09 ◼   ► And then I just decided that for once I needed to use my Mac.

00:38:13 ◼   ► I didn't really want to go through my screenshots on my Mac.

00:38:17 ◼   ► Primarily because I was upset.

00:38:18 ◼   ► So out of principle.

00:38:20 ◼   ► But then the practical version of myself thought that, you know, 50 image files, I probably

00:38:28 ◼   ► want to optimize them.

00:38:29 ◼   ► So I ran the image optim locally.

00:38:32 ◼   ► Now I'm basically left with no solution because there's no image opt-in for iOS.

00:38:38 ◼   ► I know that there's an app called "Reduce", I know that there's the other app called "OneEdit"

00:38:43 ◼   ► that can save multiple images from PNG to JPEG, but still it's no replacement for image

00:38:49 ◼   ► opt-in.

00:38:50 ◼   ► There's no image opt-in on iOS.

00:38:51 ◼   ► I'm really sad about this, like not physically sad but just like conceptually sad, if that's

00:38:58 ◼   ► a thing.

00:39:00 ◼   ► So yeah, I don't know what the solution is.

00:39:03 ◼   ► I'm kind of hoping that maybe in the future workflow, the guys that make this awesome

00:39:08 ◼   ► new app will try to find a way to bring ImageOptim to iOS.

00:39:14 ◼   ► I know that ImageOptim is actually based on a bunch of open source libraries to do various

00:39:20 ◼   ► types of JPEG optimization.

00:39:24 ◼   ► Like I don't remember the names, but if you go to the website, you can see the names of

00:39:27 ◼   ► of all the technologies that they use.

00:39:29 ◼   ► I don't know guys, because there's no solution for me.

00:39:34 ◼   ► I know that I could, there's a version of image opt-in

00:39:37 ◼   ► called image opt-in CLI that you can run from terminal,

00:39:42 ◼   ► but it's not like an official download.

00:39:47 ◼   ► You gotta do some stuff with Ruby.

00:39:49 ◼   ► You gotta download the Ruby gems.

00:39:52 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:39:53 ◼   ► - Tej, it sounds like there could be

00:39:54 ◼   ► a much easier way to do this.

00:39:57 ◼   ► Oh yeah, pay more in CDN.

00:39:59 ◼   ► That's a much easier way.

00:40:00 ◼   ► - Stephen, how do you do it?

00:40:02 ◼   ► - I use the Mac.

00:40:05 ◼   ► Actually, I don't really crunch.

00:40:06 ◼   ► I don't have that many images.

00:40:07 ◼   ► So I usually don't bother with it, but.

00:40:10 ◼   ► - Right.

00:40:11 ◼   ► - I do enjoy the fact that Federico

00:40:14 ◼   ► basically Benjamin buttoned his images,

00:40:16 ◼   ► which is sort of hilarious.

00:40:18 ◼   ► I mean, Federico, would it be like the worst thing

00:40:24 ◼   ► If you only had your iPad and you didn't have your Mac to like drop box them over to your

00:40:31 ◼   ► Mac Mini and then use screens on the iPad like do it on the Mac itself and then let

00:40:36 ◼   ► them sync back.

00:40:37 ◼   ► Yeah, but that's slow, right?

00:40:40 ◼   ► I mean I get it but...

00:40:42 ◼   ► Yeah I guess that could be a...

00:40:44 ◼   ► Yeah especially because the Mac Mini is really fast at uploading to Dropbox because of the

00:40:49 ◼   ► the crazy Mac Mini color speeds. It takes a second to download an image that's 2 megabytes.

00:40:56 ◼   ► I guess I could do that. I will probably start doing that or maybe I'll just hire someone

00:41:03 ◼   ► to write me a script. Because the thing is that Rackspace, which is the CDN that I use,

00:41:09 ◼   ► Cloud Files, they do have a Python library that's like a new one. It's called PyRacks.

00:41:17 ◼   ► I just don't know how to install it on my Mac. I don't have the time. It doesn't support

00:41:22 ◼   ► Pythonista because ideally I would just use the Rackspace API with Pythonista and it would

00:41:28 ◼   ► be perfect because I will have native uploads. But still, in that case, I will have the problem

00:41:35 ◼   ► of no image opt-in on iOS. See, I really need a Mac for this. Unless someone makes image

00:41:42 ◼   ► ImageOptim is compatible. In that case, because when you start getting savings of like—

00:41:49 ◼   ► But this is how your brain works when you start thinking of these new things. We are

00:41:53 ◼   ► following you down this rabbit hole.

00:41:56 ◼   ► You are observing the process. Basically, when you get, say, ImageOptim, when you give

00:42:03 ◼   ► multiple images to ImageOptim, it gives you a summary of all the megabytes or kilobytes

00:42:08 ◼   ► that you're saving by optimizing the files.

00:42:11 ◼   ► So for the Twitter article, I was saving like 20 megabytes.

00:42:15 ◼   ► And if you multiply that for, I don't know,

00:42:18 ◼   ► let's just say for 10,000 page views,

00:42:22 ◼   ► Steven, are you better at math than me?

00:42:25 ◼   ► - Nope.

00:42:26 ◼   ► That's a whole lot of megabytes.

00:42:28 ◼   ► - That's a lot of megabytes.

00:42:29 ◼   ► And that's actually a lot of euros out of my pocket

00:42:33 ◼   ► if I don't optimize my images.

00:42:35 ◼   ► So I need ImageOptim, especially for this,

00:42:38 ◼   ► popular article that people are expecting like the Twitter apps, the iPad apps that I posted today,

00:42:44 ◼   ► I need those savings on the files. But if I want to do that on the iPad, that's a problem.

00:42:51 ◼   ► And I like for the kind of mini review or the small news post that has a small image,

00:42:59 ◼   ► I can live without image opt-in. But for these kind of big reviews or big features that I have

00:43:04 ◼   ► have on the site, I need to optimize the files.

00:43:07 ◼   ► And yeah, I guess I will go with Stephen's way

00:43:11 ◼   ► and just use screens.

00:43:13 ◼   ► Also because screens has a nice new clipboard mode.

00:43:17 ◼   ► You know, Stephen, you actually gave me a pretty good idea here.

00:43:20 ◼   ► Well, that'll be $250.

00:43:23 ◼   ► You can PayPal me.

00:43:25 ◼   ► I mean, it's interesting to hear what holds you up

00:43:30 ◼   ► from doing all your work on iOS.

00:43:31 ◼   ► And this is not one that I would have guessed.

00:43:34 ◼   ► I probably wouldn't have thought about it, but you know something that is like seemingly like that Mac

00:43:40 ◼   ► app is super simple like you just drag an image onto it and it gives you output

00:43:43 ◼   ► but that because of behind the scenes stuff it's not on iOS yet but definitely

00:43:49 ◼   ► keep us posted and you know maybe you could just hire Myke to

00:43:54 ◼   ► run ImageOptima on his MacBook Pro for you.

00:43:56 ◼   ► Yeah I'll do that.

00:43:57 ◼   ► Yeah, thank you guys for for being my my therapists here for

00:44:03 ◼   ► image problems

00:44:05 ◼   ► You're welcome

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00:46:09 ◼   ► That's a cool sponsor.

00:46:10 ◼   ► Yeah, I like that.

00:46:11 ◼   ► Yeah, I just wanted to say that it sounds really awesome.

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00:46:21 ◼   ► So we're going to talk about workflow, which frankly seems like magic still.

00:46:28 ◼   ► So I know we've got some links where Federico talked about it on his site, but Myke, you've

00:46:34 ◼   ► been using it a lot.

00:46:36 ◼   ► I want to hear from Myke.

00:46:38 ◼   ► Hello, everyone.

00:46:39 ◼   ► Me too.

00:46:40 ◼   ► My name is Myke Hurley and I'm a workflow addict.

00:46:45 ◼   ► So basically what happened was this app came out for me like at midnight last Wednesday.

00:46:52 ◼   ► So basically just after we finished recording this show.

00:46:55 ◼   ► And I knew Federico had mentioned that it was coming out and workflow guys had mentioned

00:46:58 ◼   ► it was coming out.

00:47:00 ◼   ► I was up until half past three in the morning talking to Federico basically just over and

00:47:07 ◼   ► over and over again saying, "Oh my God, this is amazing.

00:47:10 ◼   ► I can't believe this is possible."

00:47:13 ◼   ► workflow is an app that allows you to create chains of actions in a visual

00:47:19 ◼   ► style. A lot of people have said it's kind of like editorials, kind of like

00:47:24 ◼   ► launch center pro, it's kind of like automator. But for me it's like a flowchart.

00:47:29 ◼   ► You're basically just creating a flowchart of actions and these actions

00:47:34 ◼   ► perform a greater action in aggregate. So like for example a very simple workflow

00:47:41 ◼   ► that I created but it solves something that frustrates me and this is this is

00:47:45 ◼   ► super vain you know when you use the front-facing camera to take a selfie

00:47:49 ◼   ► yeah and it yeah okay yes you do Steven you send them and I don't I'm not a

00:47:55 ◼   ► hundred percent sure why this happens it doesn't need to be explained perfectly

00:47:59 ◼   ► fine the front-facing camera flips the image because it's like a mirror yeah

00:48:05 ◼   ► because like a mirror so it flips the image around and I don't like that

00:48:08 ◼   ► because it looks weird to me. So I set up a workflow. So basically I just hit

00:48:15 ◼   ► the workflow, it takes a picture of me and then it flips the image around and

00:48:20 ◼   ► then I can share it. And it's just three little actions. I just dragged in "take

00:48:24 ◼   ► photo with front camera, take one photo, flip image horizontally and share." So

00:48:29 ◼   ► it's for me to do that. Previously I'll take a picture and I have to open

00:48:33 ◼   ► an app like some weird image editing app and I have to flip it around and then

00:48:37 ◼   ► save it to the camera roll and then I'd have two images and then I could share it.

00:48:42 ◼   ► But so it's just like this is the kind of stuff that I'm finding super interesting.

00:48:46 ◼   ► I mean and then it goes into like some of the crazy things that people have built.

00:48:51 ◼   ► Like Federico created this timezone converting thing.

00:48:55 ◼   ► Oh you know you actually got to fix that.

00:49:00 ◼   ► So I'll wait for you until you share that but it basically scrapes Google and does like

00:49:05 ◼   ► a timezone conversion.

00:49:07 ◼   ► We know what I put together last night. Basically, in Safari I always want to get the link of

00:49:19 ◼   ► an image, but Safari for iOS when you tap and hold an image it only gives you two options.

00:49:26 ◼   ► One to copy the image and the other to save it. There's no option to copy the link to

00:49:31 ◼   ► the image. So I put together this new workflow that uses a feature of an upcoming update.

00:49:39 ◼   ► It basically looks at the selection of the web browser and there's a bunch of steps involved

00:49:47 ◼   ► and then it gives me a list of all image URLs found in the Safari selection and I can choose

00:49:55 ◼   ► one and it's copied to my clipboard and I'm really excited about this one.

00:50:01 ◼   ► One of the biggest things about workflow that surprised me the most was the extension support.

00:50:12 ◼   ► Like how you can make any workflow basically, I've got one that adds, if I'm on a page in

00:50:20 ◼   ► browser or in tweetbot or anywhere I have a URL that's a podcast I can open

00:50:25 ◼   ► the workflow to add it to Huffduffer like I don't have to copy the URL or

00:50:28 ◼   ► anything it's just all you hit run workflow and then I get the option to

00:50:33 ◼   ► run whatever I want to. Myke is gasping. Give me that URL. Alright I'll send it to you.

00:50:38 ◼   ► Yeah because as well like I'm trying to put a couple of these in the show notes

00:50:41 ◼   ► because people will just be like like like how I just reacted give me it I want

00:50:46 ◼   ► it.

00:50:47 ◼   ► Yeah, and the sharing of, so like if someone builds something like Federico, I have several

00:50:52 ◼   ► that you built and that you were tweeting about the other night, and it's really nice

00:50:56 ◼   ► to like download because it just, it's really easy to share.

00:50:59 ◼   ► But what's frustrating is they don't sync between your devices and so you can use airdrop.

00:51:03 ◼   ► So like I'll make one on my phone or iPad and then airdrop it to the other device, which

00:51:08 ◼   ► is a little frustrating.

00:51:09 ◼   ► Hopefully, I don't know if you know, but it would be nice if they had some sort of syncing.

00:51:13 ◼   ► Yeah, I guess at one point they will have to add sync.

00:51:18 ◼   ► I don't know more, Steven.

00:51:21 ◼   ► Even like a manual sync like Launch Center Pro does, where it just backs it up to, I

00:51:25 ◼   ► think it goes to Dropbox, right?

00:51:26 ◼   ► And then you just have to go to another device and load it on.

00:51:31 ◼   ► But just when it...

00:51:34 ◼   ► The fact that I use Chrome makes it super awesome, because it means that I'm able to

00:51:41 ◼   ► together some of the other, like so say for example there's a I want to take a

00:51:46 ◼   ► web page and turn it into a PDF like that awesome screenshot app doesn't work

00:51:50 ◼   ► in Chrome but now I can use a create PDF workflow and and do it instead so I'm

00:51:58 ◼   ► able to in Chrome I can just grab these things now and do interesting things

00:52:01 ◼   ► with them where Chrome was kind of it kind of is like a second-class citizen

00:52:05 ◼   ► for extension support because a lot of these apps are made for Safari.

00:52:11 ◼   ► So it's interesting how some of the things you can do.

00:52:14 ◼   ► And just stuff like file downloaders.

00:52:18 ◼   ► Yeah, that's a big one too.

00:52:21 ◼   ► Or also, when you mentioned the extension, something that's really nice is the way that

00:52:28 ◼   ► workflow can kind of make, like be a replacement for other apps extensions.

00:52:37 ◼   ► Like for instance, the Draft extension, it lets you capture text from any app.

00:52:44 ◼   ► So for instance, from Safari, I can capture the link to a web page into a draft.

00:52:51 ◼   ► But I cannot really run an action at the moment of capturing text from the Draft extension.

00:52:59 ◼   ► So with Workflow, and using the URL scheme of the Drafts app, I can, from Safari, with

00:53:06 ◼   ► just one workflow, one chain of actions, I can send a link to Drafts which sends it somewhere

00:53:14 ◼   ► else and then I return to Safari and I can run this from the from the sharesheet.

00:53:20 ◼   ► You know there's no bookmarklet, there's no other weirdness with JavaScript and Python and that kind

00:53:26 ◼   ► of stuff so this is really nice. And there's two workflows that I like I'm using all the time.

00:53:33 ◼   ► One is to open a Twitter link in the Twitter app because when people send me, including you

00:53:40 ◼   ► Myke and Steven, when you send me links to tweets, those are like links that open in Safari in the

00:53:47 ◼   ► Twitter website and with Workflow I can just open the tweet in the Twitter app, which is really nice.

00:53:54 ◼   ► And there's another workflow that I found on Reddit, there's a subreddit called, just Workflow,

00:54:02 ◼   ► it's full of people sharing workflows and suggestions, it's really nice. Some guy made

00:54:08 ◼   ► the workflow to open the website called azlyrics.com that basically to look at the search result

00:54:24 ◼   ► for the currently playing song in google.com and find the lyrics webpage and just open

00:54:32 ◼   ► that directly without seeing Safari first. It just opens the direct link to the webpage

00:54:39 ◼   ► for the song lyrics. It's really full of these kind of possibilities. I mean, I got a bunch

00:54:46 ◼   ► of workflows that are really just demos, you know, just concepts. Like, I'm not going to

00:54:50 ◼   ► use those workflows on a daily basis. But other workflows, like you, Myke, like, I'm

00:54:55 ◼   ► I'm using these every day because they're actually and practically useful.

00:55:01 ◼   ► And it's still kind of incredible for me to see that Apple is doing also this big promotion

00:55:07 ◼   ► for the app and that it's so popular.

00:55:09 ◼   ► I mean it still is in the top 10 of the general top paid apps for iPhone and iPad.

00:55:18 ◼   ► And Apple has chosen the app as editor's choice, best new apps.

00:55:23 ◼   ► today the App Store Twitter account, Twitter about workflow, so it's really kind of surreal

00:55:29 ◼   ► for me to see this interest in iOS automation. I think it's totally deserved because it's

00:55:41 ◼   ► such an awesome app made by a fantastic team and I'm super excited about the future. I

00:55:50 ◼   ► they're planning big stuff.

00:55:52 ◼   ► And I'm so happy to see people like Myke,

00:55:56 ◼   ► and I don't mean this in like,

00:55:58 ◼   ► to disrespect you. - No, no.

00:55:59 ◼   ► - Like, you're not generally interested

00:56:02 ◼   ► into Python scripting or making these URL actions,

00:56:06 ◼   ► you know, that kind of stuff. - I was always interested

00:56:08 ◼   ► in the URL scheme stuff, but it just went over my head.

00:56:11 ◼   ► - Yeah, yeah, that's what I meant.

00:56:13 ◼   ► It was too much for you. - Yeah.

00:56:15 ◼   ► - Because you didn't-- - But it's like,

00:56:16 ◼   ► I showed workflow to my girlfriend yesterday.

00:56:19 ◼   ► - Yeah.

00:56:20 ◼   ► - And she was like, "Oh, this is really cool.

00:56:22 ◼   ► "I wanna try this out."

00:56:23 ◼   ► So I immediately just gifted her the app.

00:56:25 ◼   ► It's like, do it.

00:56:26 ◼   ► But she, 'cause it makes sense.

00:56:28 ◼   ► And because they do a great thing as well,

00:56:31 ◼   ► they have so many different actions

00:56:33 ◼   ► that you can choose from,

00:56:34 ◼   ► but they do a good job of not showing you them all

00:56:38 ◼   ► unless you explicitly ask to see them all.

00:56:40 ◼   ► So it shows you suggested actions, right?

00:56:43 ◼   ► And then you can back out and see all actions.

00:56:45 ◼   ► And I just think it just makes it easier.

00:56:48 ◼   ► I do like looking at the all actions list though,

00:56:50 ◼   ► that's how I've gotten inspiration to build new things,

00:56:54 ◼   ► 'cause I can see some of the stuff that it can do,

00:56:56 ◼   ► you know, like if I don't go down a certain path.

00:56:59 ◼   ► But I mean, there are things that I would like to see,

00:57:02 ◼   ► like I'd like to see the gallery more frequently updated.

00:57:06 ◼   ► I would love it if, like you know how drafts

00:57:09 ◼   ► has like the community, where like you can kind of see

00:57:12 ◼   ► all of the things that people submit to the drafts community?

00:57:16 ◼   ► I would love to see that for workflow as well,

00:57:18 ◼   ► like just a site where you can search,

00:57:20 ◼   ► like I wanna do this type of workflow,

00:57:23 ◼   ► and then it shows up. - They're kind of doing that

00:57:24 ◼   ► on Reddit, but it's not real evolved at this point.

00:57:29 ◼   ► - Right, you see, I'd love to see that on their site.

00:57:32 ◼   ► Like I'm sure these are all, I mean, you know,

00:57:35 ◼   ► not reinventing the wheel, like I'm sure

00:57:36 ◼   ► that they are thinking about this stuff,

00:57:38 ◼   ► but like I say these things just because I think

00:57:40 ◼   ► that this is such an important app.

00:57:43 ◼   ► This is genuinely, I think, one of the most important apps

00:57:46 ◼   ► that I've seen in a long time.

00:57:47 ◼   ► the things that this thing can do is I just think it's incredible I'm completely blown away by it and

00:57:54 ◼   ► I cannot believe it was built by like by a couple of guys they're like 18 and 20 yeah and and they're

00:58:03 ◼   ► really nice guys as well and and it just blows me away well I think back another second yeah I think

00:58:09 ◼   ► it works because it is visual and yeah you know automator on the mac is is visual but this is even

00:58:16 ◼   ► in some ways easier to use an automator on OS X.

00:58:20 ◼   ► - Oh, it definitely is.

00:58:22 ◼   ► - You know, like, I was kind of the same, but with you,

00:58:23 ◼   ► like I have Launch Center Pro

00:58:25 ◼   ► and I use it for a couple of things,

00:58:26 ◼   ► but I never really got super into it.

00:58:28 ◼   ► But like Workflow, because it's,

00:58:31 ◼   ► Workflow rewards you for using it, right?

00:58:33 ◼   ► It's fun to build these things and put them together.

00:58:36 ◼   ► And it has a, because it's visual,

00:58:39 ◼   ► you can kind of understand the flow a little bit better

00:58:41 ◼   ► than just straight X callback URL,

00:58:44 ◼   ► or things like Launch Center Pro kind of on top of it.

00:58:48 ◼   ► So yeah, I agree, Myke.

00:58:49 ◼   ► It's a big step forward in using iOS

00:58:52 ◼   ► for more complicated tasks.

00:58:54 ◼   ► Now, I know there was some,

00:58:57 ◼   ► the app was a long time coming,

00:59:00 ◼   ► and I'm hoping that the App Store review,

00:59:04 ◼   ► which we'll keep coming back to,

00:59:05 ◼   ► allows them to continue pushing it forward

00:59:07 ◼   ► because it really is incredibly powerful just on day one.

00:59:12 ◼   ► And as these things evolve and people figure out

00:59:14 ◼   ► how to do more things, it's only gonna get better and better.

00:59:18 ◼   ► - Yeah, I think that a big difference

00:59:21 ◼   ► with other automation apps is that workflow actually ties

00:59:25 ◼   ► into native iOS features, like you can quick look files

00:59:30 ◼   ► or you can open web pages in Safari, you can pick documents.

00:59:33 ◼   ► Like it's not just a launcher,

00:59:35 ◼   ► it actually does stuff with files and, you know,

00:59:40 ◼   ► apps like music, you know, it kind of,

00:59:42 ◼   ► It's built deeply into iOS.

00:59:45 ◼   ► And I think that the feature that most people are not

00:59:50 ◼   ► talking about is the engine and the system

00:59:53 ◼   ► that they built into workflow, which they call the content

00:59:56 ◼   ► graph, which is basically what keeps the app working

01:00:02 ◼   ► when you-- with this visual system.

01:00:05 ◼   ► And it's basically an engine that

01:00:07 ◼   ► capable of transforming actions to output certain types of content depending on what

01:00:16 ◼   ► action you use next. So this sounds like a messy collection of words. But in practice,

01:00:24 ◼   ► you can do stuff like, action 1 takes a link to a webpage and action 2 says "make PDF".

01:00:35 ◼   ► And normally you would say, okay, if I want to make a PDF from a link, I guess you will

01:00:41 ◼   ► just create a blank page with the link as text.

01:00:46 ◼   ► But actually because of the content graph, Workflow is capable of guessing, okay, if

01:00:51 ◼   ► this is a link, you probably want me to fetch the contents of this link and you probably

01:00:56 ◼   ► want me to return HTML and because you have make PDF as the next section, you want me

01:01:03 ◼   ► to convert this HTML to PDF and give you a preview. So the power of the content graph,

01:01:09 ◼   ► just being able to turn certain types of content into different types of content depending

01:01:14 ◼   ► on the actions that you choose, that's incredibly powerful for iOS automation. And if you've

01:01:21 ◼   ► been spending hours into apps like editorial and drafts, do you know all the errors that

01:01:27 ◼   ► you get with "oh, wrong input type"? That kind of stuff, because you're trying to make

01:01:31 ◼   ► the app do things that it's not supposed to do.

01:01:35 ◼   ► And with Workflow, you can do crazy things that are seemingly unrelated.

01:01:39 ◼   ► You can do stuff like link to PDF or like if I take an image from the browser, either

01:01:46 ◼   ► if I use Quick Look, you show me a preview, but if I, I don't know, if I use Safari, then

01:01:54 ◼   ► open the image in the new tab.

01:01:56 ◼   ► So it's this kind of flexible system and for iOS automation, I think that's huge.

01:02:01 ◼   ► and also much more capable than Automator or noise 10.

01:02:05 ◼   ► So it's a-- yeah, I'm really excited.

01:02:10 ◼   ► I like some-- and I do it every now and then.

01:02:13 ◼   ► I just open the app and just start dragging things around

01:02:18 ◼   ► and seeing what I can find.

01:02:21 ◼   ► And that excites me, because every time I open it,

01:02:24 ◼   ► I kind of-- not every time, but every few times I open it,

01:02:28 ◼   ► and I have an idea.

01:02:30 ◼   ► I'm like, "Okay, how could I try and do something like this?"

01:02:34 ◼   ► I'm just in awe at this application.

01:02:39 ◼   ► But let's talk more about some apps.

01:02:42 ◼   ► Let's talk about Federico's Apps of the Year.

01:02:45 ◼   ► But before we do that,

01:02:47 ◼   ► let's thank one of my apps of the year,

01:02:48 ◼   ► PDF Pen Scan Plus from Smile Software,

01:02:52 ◼   ► helping support this episode.

01:02:53 ◼   ► PDF Pen Scan Plus is the app for mobile scanning and OCR.

01:02:57 ◼   ► It allows you to scan documents directly on your iPhone and iPad and use OCR on them to

01:03:02 ◼   ► detect the text that is found in the image that you take.

01:03:06 ◼   ► So you can take images of multiple images super quickly and you can do all the post

01:03:10 ◼   ► process image editing right on your iOS device.

01:03:14 ◼   ► You can crop these images quickly and precisely.

01:03:16 ◼   ► PDF Pen Scan Plus recognises the edges of your images, making sure you don't miss anything

01:03:21 ◼   ► important.

01:03:22 ◼   ► And version 1.5 now takes advantage of image optimisation, making sure your images are

01:03:26 ◼   ► crystal clear.

01:03:27 ◼   ► So PDF/PEN ScanPlus can help you blast through stacks of documents or receipts in one go.

01:03:33 ◼   ► You can export these documents all at once, making batch scanning easier than ever.

01:03:38 ◼   ► So maybe you leave it to the end of the month to do your expenses so you can scan all your

01:03:41 ◼   ► images in.

01:03:42 ◼   ► You can see, "Oh, I've got all these receipts.

01:03:44 ◼   ► Let me go BBBP.

01:03:45 ◼   ► We've got your receipts."

01:03:47 ◼   ► And then you can automatically upload them to Dropbox or iCloud Drive for storing and

01:03:51 ◼   ► availability on the Mac and other iOS devices.

01:03:55 ◼   ► PDF/Pen Scan Plus's OCR scanning also takes a text of the documents which you can copy

01:04:00 ◼   ► and paste into another app for easy searching later or to use somewhere else which is really

01:04:05 ◼   ► really cool.

01:04:06 ◼   ► PDF/Pen Scan Plus is a universal iOS app.

01:04:09 ◼   ► It works on your iPhone and your iPad and it's available right now on the App Store.

01:04:13 ◼   ► You can learn more by going to Smilesoftware.com/connected.

01:04:17 ◼   ► Thank you so much to Smile for their continued support of this show.

01:04:24 ◼   ► The year is over and the Federico has spoken.

01:04:27 ◼   ► Yeah, it's become an annual tradition.

01:04:33 ◼   ► It's been four years now that I do this kind of recap.

01:04:37 ◼   ► Myke, do you want to ask me questions?

01:04:40 ◼   ► What do you want to talk about?

01:04:42 ◼   ► I'm happy to answer all your questions and concerns.

01:04:46 ◼   ► So what we're talking about...

01:04:47 ◼   ► Do I sound like this is questions and concerns reminds me of an underscore David Smith?

01:04:51 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:04:52 ◼   ► Well, I mean, you know, no one could sound just like Hanus Kool, but I guess you can

01:04:55 ◼   ► use his words.

01:04:58 ◼   ► What we're talking about is Federica Viticci's must-have iPad apps for 2014.

01:05:03 ◼   ► So Federica mentioned every year he does this, he rounds up the apps that have come out in

01:05:08 ◼   ► the year or the things that he's using this year.

01:05:11 ◼   ► And what I'm kind of interested in, because people can go, they can go to our show notes,

01:05:16 ◼   ► relay.fm/connector/18, they can find the link to Mac Stories and read the piece.

01:05:22 ◼   ► But I have a couple of things that I'm interested in.

01:05:26 ◼   ► In 2014, what have the apps that have been released enabled you to do that you've not

01:05:32 ◼   ► been able to do before?

01:05:34 ◼   ► What changes have been made to make your iPad even better to work on?

01:05:40 ◼   ► Two big changes were workflow, which we just talked about.

01:05:44 ◼   ► It speeds up a lot of tasks that I do every day.

01:05:49 ◼   ► The other big change was editorial 1.1 which came out in May.

01:05:55 ◼   ► I did a big review of the update and max stories also.

01:05:59 ◼   ► That was a big change.

01:06:01 ◼   ► It added a bunch of new features.

01:06:05 ◼   ► I have hundreds of workflows in editorial for text editing and images just being able

01:06:12 ◼   ► to prepare blog posts on the iPad.

01:06:15 ◼   ► That was a big change.

01:06:17 ◼   ► In general, I think that with iOS 8, so starting this, especially since August, when I got

01:06:23 ◼   ► all the betas that I covered on Mac stories in September, I started seeing this big change

01:06:31 ◼   ► for extensions, you know, action extensions, share extensions, today widgets, not so much

01:06:37 ◼   ► with the keyboards, I don't do much keyboard switching except for emoji++ and sometimes

01:06:44 ◼   ► clips. Extensions were huge for me. I was super happy to drop all the Python scripts,

01:06:55 ◼   ► all the JavaScript bookmarks in Safari to use extensions, which are much, much better

01:07:02 ◼   ► than before. And in terms of personal use of the iPad, I think that Todoist was another

01:07:11 ◼   ► a big change. We talked about this before, moving away from Reminders and iCloud and

01:07:18 ◼   ► using Todoist, that was a big change for me. And Clips, which is this clipboard manager

01:07:25 ◼   ► from the same developers of Dispatch and email client for iPhone. I didn't really use clipboard

01:07:32 ◼   ► managers before iOS 8 because they didn't have an easy enough way to copy stuff into

01:07:39 ◼   ► their containers, I would guess. And there's still no real clipboard manager for iOS, like

01:07:48 ◼   ► it can have on OS X with Alfred and Clip Menu and other similar apps, Launch Bar. There's

01:07:55 ◼   ► no real clipboard manager on iOS, so Clips is a nice in-between solution, because it

01:08:02 ◼   ► uses the widget and the extensions. So in general, I think doing a comparison, right,

01:08:08 ◼   ► the way that I work on the iPad in December 2014 and compared to last year, I think that

01:08:14 ◼   ► I'm much faster. Probably the basic workflow is not much different because it's still heavily

01:08:22 ◼   ► based on Safari editorial and launch center pro and drafts. But I think I'm faster. Like

01:08:29 ◼   ► I can do, I wouldn't say double the work, but I can save several minutes more thanks

01:08:34 ◼   ► to extensions and thanks to workflow and all these more capable tools and just faster and

01:08:42 ◼   ► more reliable ways to move information around, to move images around.

01:08:49 ◼   ► Not so much for ImageOptim.

01:08:51 ◼   ► To move documents around.

01:08:54 ◼   ► I'm generally faster.

01:08:57 ◼   ► And then there's the brand new stuff. Like, some of those apps I didn't mention in the

01:09:06 ◼   ► article because I'm still testing them. I'm not sure whether they'll become, like, apps

01:09:11 ◼   ► that I use every day. There's the new stuff, like being able to convert currencies in Safari

01:09:16 ◼   ► using stacks. Or some new apps and updates that are coming out. There's a big update

01:09:23 ◼   ► to Python Insta, which I don't know when it will come out. There's really some new stuff

01:09:29 ◼   ► that is coming down the road for iOS 8. And I think that until next time, we will keep

01:09:37 ◼   ► seeing these sort of new ideas, right? And so today, I think I'm still changing things,

01:09:44 ◼   ► like how I do stuff. I will probably rewrite for the, again, all the image workflow that

01:09:50 ◼   ► I use. But yes, in general I think I'm much faster and I think that's good news because

01:09:57 ◼   ► I can concentrate on other stuff. Like I can do more show notes for the podcasts or I can

01:10:03 ◼   ► do more research or I can do more reading because it doesn't take me half an hour just

01:10:07 ◼   ► to put together a blog post for my stories. You know? That's a saving time is a much,

01:10:14 ◼   ► much welcome change.

01:10:15 ◼   ► Obviously this year you've moved from the mini to the iPad Air 2.

01:10:20 ◼   ► Has this changed anything in a significant way?

01:10:23 ◼   ► Do you find you work better with the Air 2 than the mini?

01:10:28 ◼   ► In hindsight I think, yeah, I think I...

01:10:34 ◼   ► It's probably because my eyesight is getting worse.

01:10:38 ◼   ► I think I'm more comfortable with the Air 2.

01:10:42 ◼   ► but only because they managed to make it so thin and light.

01:10:46 ◼   ► The original iPad Air was too heavy and thick for me.

01:10:51 ◼   ► This one I think strikes a great balance between the mini and the bigger form factor.

01:10:58 ◼   ► So I think it was a great move and I'm expecting that the higher capacity of RAM and the CPU will...

01:11:09 ◼   ► there will be apps that really take advantage of that sort of stuff.

01:11:13 ◼   ► I'm seeing that today with the fact that Safari can keep more tabs in memory, for example,

01:11:20 ◼   ► compared to the mini, so that's a nice change. But I still have to use apps that really take

01:11:27 ◼   ► the hardware to the extreme, you know, the apps that can make you go "okay, yeah, I can see why

01:11:34 ◼   ► I need more RAM and more CPU. Today I see like a small glimpse of that kind of process like

01:11:39 ◼   ► there's more tabs in Safari or for example the other day I was using this, I was trying this

01:11:47 ◼   ► service called Rev.com. It's an audio transcription service that I wanted to try out. Basically you

01:11:56 ◼   ► record an audio file, you send this audio file to this company using an iOS app and they give

01:12:03 ◼   ► they give text back to you, they transcribe the audio for you, so they promote this kind of service

01:12:10 ◼   ► as being a nice workflow for students or people who attend conferences and they want

01:12:18 ◼   ► to transcribe audio. So what I did was, using Workflow, I downloaded the mp3 file of an episode

01:12:28 ◼   ► of David Smith's podcast, Developing Perspective. I downloaded this other app called... Let

01:12:39 ◼   ► me just take my iPad. It's an audio editor for iOS, which I found on the App Store using

01:12:46 ◼   ► search. So that was a new one for me. It is called Hokusai. I think it's Japanese.

01:12:54 ◼   ► Oh my God.

01:12:55 ◼   ► So it let me edit the MP3 and I noticed that when I exported the MP3 file, it was really

01:13:03 ◼   ► fast, like faster than I think it would have been on the old hardware.

01:13:11 ◼   ► I could tell that something was different and that was a nice surprise.

01:13:17 ◼   ► And by the way, the Rev.com transcription was really accurate, like just a couple of

01:13:23 ◼   ► spelling mistakes.

01:13:25 ◼   ► I kind of wanted to stress test them by giving them an episode about WatchKit.

01:13:33 ◼   ► They mostly got it right because David was using a lot of technical terms, but something

01:13:39 ◼   ► that I found amusing is that instead of transcribing WatchKit, they transcribed WatchKit.

01:13:46 ◼   ► Yeah, that was kind of weird.

01:13:51 ◼   ► It's close.

01:13:52 ◼   ► It's close.

01:13:53 ◼   ► Really close.

01:13:54 ◼   ► I think the the the hardware change will be

01:13:57 ◼   ► more notable

01:14:00 ◼   ► Down the road at least I hope so I you know, otherwise, it's wasted money

01:14:06 ◼   ► You should have gone the golden I think everyone's fast. Yeah. Yeah. I mean my like I sit here listening to this

01:14:13 ◼   ► I've read your article. I

01:14:15 ◼   ► I've seen some of this in my own life. Like I went from the air back to the retina mini and I

01:14:22 ◼   ► Prefer the size I think but for me like what holds up my work on iOS is sort of like

01:14:29 ◼   ► fundamental issues

01:14:31 ◼   ► That software can only go so far in addressing like yes

01:14:35 ◼   ► I was eight and things like workflow in particular and editorial like I can do a lot of the stuff like

01:14:41 ◼   ► Text expand or having a keyboard like I can do a lot of stuff

01:14:44 ◼   ► I do on my Mac on my iPad now, but it's sort of like the fundamental things of

01:14:49 ◼   ► when I write I like a lot of browser tabs open and sometimes I have multiple text documents and I like to see it all

01:14:54 ◼   ► at once and and

01:14:55 ◼   ► I'm so much slower at typing on the iPad than I am on the Mac

01:14:59 ◼   ► And so there's still some like fundamental things that may never change about the device itself that still have me reaching

01:15:05 ◼   ► for like a MacBook Pro with the keyboard where I can have all these windows open and and maybe that's a

01:15:12 ◼   ► Shift that I just haven't made mentally yet

01:15:14 ◼   ► especially with some of the like multiple apps at a time thing and

01:15:18 ◼   ► But it's still, I still feel like, yeah, this stuff is great and like it does address a lot of issues,

01:15:25 ◼   ► but there's some like fundamental like step one problems that I still have with, you know,

01:15:30 ◼   ► porting a lot of my work to the tablet.

01:15:33 ◼   ► I don't know.

01:15:35 ◼   ► I mean, for me, like I find that I read something like this,

01:15:42 ◼   ► I read these articles that Federico writes or just listen to him talk

01:15:45 ◼   ► and I want to be able to work like this.

01:15:48 ◼   ► Like I hear it and I'm like,

01:15:52 ◼   ► I want to be able to use the iPad to do work in this way.

01:15:57 ◼   ► I wanna be more like you Federico,

01:16:03 ◼   ► I don't know what to say.

01:16:04 ◼   ► - Thank you, that's really an honor for Myke.

01:16:07 ◼   ► - So much so that I read your article earlier

01:16:09 ◼   ► and I grabbed my iPad mini

01:16:11 ◼   ► and I reorganized the home screen.

01:16:13 ◼   ► Yeah, I think I'm happy to hear that because it means that the article at least has some

01:16:20 ◼   ► kind of purpose.

01:16:22 ◼   ► I think it took me a lot of time to say, okay, I want to make sure that if one day, you know,

01:16:32 ◼   ► I'm on an island and for some reason the island only lets me use an iPad, I don't know why

01:16:38 ◼   ► why would that ever happen, but just follow my argument.

01:16:42 ◼   ► If I'm in the position where I cannot use a MacBook,

01:16:44 ◼   ► I need to make sure that I don't drop all my work

01:16:49 ◼   ► for the site.

01:16:51 ◼   ► I need to be able to continue to work and to do the same,

01:16:53 ◼   ► work at the same degree of quality.

01:16:57 ◼   ► Readers shouldn't be able to tell whether

01:17:01 ◼   ► that's Federico writing at a Mac and when,

01:17:04 ◼   ► okay, yeah, that's Federico on an iPad

01:17:05 ◼   ► because the article is worse.

01:17:07 ◼   ► I don't want that kind of reader experience.

01:17:10 ◼   ► So it took me a lot of time to,

01:17:14 ◼   ► and especially a lot of money,

01:17:15 ◼   ► to browse the App Store and try many, many apps

01:17:19 ◼   ► because I tend to buy all the apps that I use for work

01:17:24 ◼   ► that I don't necessarily even review for Mac stories

01:17:27 ◼   ► because I just need them personally.

01:17:29 ◼   ► And it took me a lot of time to,

01:17:31 ◼   ► coming from the Mac where I was used to stuff like Alfred

01:17:35 ◼   ► or Keyboard Maestro, you know, what do I do on iOS now?

01:17:39 ◼   ► And it was time consuming, and it was tiring

01:17:43 ◼   ► from every time I needed to set up an app from scratch,

01:17:48 ◼   ► which was, you know, it's not a fun experience.

01:17:51 ◼   ► But now I can see, I think I can see the benefit of that,

01:17:56 ◼   ► because when I work on my iPad, I'm completely comfortable.

01:18:01 ◼   ► And when I'm at my Mac, now I don't keep up

01:18:04 ◼   ► with my iOS workflows on my Mac and I'm not sure what to do anymore when I'm on my MacBook

01:18:11 ◼   ► because there's no editorial, there's no clips, there's no workflow on my MacBook and so I'm

01:18:18 ◼   ► not exactly sure how and if I want to, you know, rebuild all my workflows on the Mac.

01:18:28 ◼   ► And I think that, to conclude, what I want to do, if people find this kind of, I wouldn't

01:18:42 ◼   ► say mission, but maybe a way of doing things, if people find this enjoyable and if people

01:18:49 ◼   ► like you Myke can take some inspiration out of these kind of articles, I think it's useful

01:18:58 ◼   ► you know, to write this kind of stuff or make stories because I like it. I don't want to

01:19:03 ◼   ► like, I actually enjoy showing people how stuff can be done on iOS and I enjoy talking

01:19:10 ◼   ► to you and showing you new apps and new tips. I actually take a lot of enjoyment out of

01:19:16 ◼   ► that. And I think that maybe also more people can say, "Hey, maybe I can be more, I can

01:19:24 ◼   ► have this kind of freedom to do work anywhere I want because I can just take my iPad with

01:19:29 ◼   ► me or my iPhone even. And I think that's powerful, right? Being able to do work anywhere. Or

01:19:39 ◼   ► maybe not just necessarily do work anywhere because I don't want people to work all the

01:19:43 ◼   ► time. But just knowing that if something happens and you cannot be at home and use a computer,

01:19:49 ◼   ► can still do serious stuff on iOS.

01:19:52 ◼   ► That's the...

01:19:53 ◼   ► Oh, it makes a ton of sense.

01:19:55 ◼   ► Sum up.

01:19:56 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:19:57 ◼   ► Thank you.

01:19:58 ◼   ► No, and I think, you know, this has obviously been a topic since day one on our show because

01:20:03 ◼   ► it's been a topic for you for a long time and sometimes people are like, well, you know,

01:20:08 ◼   ► I think people look at it as kind of a you're doing it for like weird reasons.

01:20:13 ◼   ► Like, like what you just said is really true that, you know, there are situations where

01:20:17 ◼   ► you can't have a Mac or like you just have your tablet because you're in between things and it's very helpful

01:20:23 ◼   ► like to you know, you might not be able to do a hundred percent of what you can do on the Mac

01:20:27 ◼   ► but the more you can do like the more freedom you have to

01:20:30 ◼   ► Sort of like live your life without being tied to you know

01:20:34 ◼   ► Any more hardware than you than you need to be I think that's a perfectly valid reason. I think it's about a reason that

01:20:40 ◼   ► like the iPad

01:20:43 ◼   ► Exists you look at Apple's

01:20:45 ◼   ► marketing for it and you know we didn't talk about the new Christmas ad but like you know it's bouncing like in that ad bouncing between

01:20:50 ◼   ► the Mac and the iPad doing all these things and and it being a

01:20:54 ◼   ► Not so much about the device in front of you

01:20:56 ◼   ► But about the work that's in front of you and what you're trying to accomplish and that is exactly more important than yes

01:21:02 ◼   ► like these things are just tools like they're fancy screwdrivers. That's all they are and

01:21:06 ◼   ► You know making it sing making it do the things that you need it to do like

01:21:10 ◼   ► Anyone who looks at that with an eyebrow raised is crazy to me

01:21:15 ◼   ► Thank you for saying that because one last thought. On my Twitter account I show a lot

01:21:26 ◼   ► of screenshots of the workflows that I use for articles and just on the iPad in general.

01:21:36 ◼   ► Every time I share that kind of "Hey, I'm working on this kind of workflow" or "I managed

01:21:44 ◼   ► do this or thanks to this other person for the suggestion, I get the comment that says

01:21:50 ◼   ► with a winky face at the end, "Hey, why don't you just use a Mac?" Yeah, I know, I can use

01:21:56 ◼   ► a Mac, you know, I have a MacBook right now.

01:21:59 ◼   ► Oh, sort of. Most of a MacBook.

01:22:02 ◼   ► Sort of. Most of the MacBook, at least. What's left of the MacBook? I have a Mac and I'm

01:22:07 ◼   ► not saying this to, like, I'm not a, it doesn't make me upset, right? I mean, there's a much

01:22:14 ◼   ► much worse stuff in the world that's comments.

01:22:17 ◼   ► No, come on.

01:22:19 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean, I'm not even upset at Twitter scanning apps, but that's another topic.

01:22:25 ◼   ► So it doesn't make me upset, but it's like, I think an attitude that I don't like.

01:22:31 ◼   ► Like why can't you understand why would some people have the like, some people I think

01:22:38 ◼   ► like me want to know that if they cannot be at a desk every day they can still be in touch

01:22:45 ◼   ► with people or just being able to do work because maybe work gets your mind off things

01:22:51 ◼   ► or maybe because you want to just be able to continue your stuff anywhere you are. And

01:22:57 ◼   ► I think that part of the problem here is that especially when you talk to people who have

01:23:03 ◼   ► made a serious investment in getting an expensive Mac or like an iMac or a Mac Pro and then

01:23:10 ◼   ► you say, "Yeah, I don't need a Mac. I need an iPad." You don't necessarily attack another

01:23:17 ◼   ► person's investment, but when you put that in question, they get all defensive. So I

01:23:22 ◼   ► don't want to turn this into analog, Myke, so I won't steal your show. But I think that

01:23:29 ◼   ► there's always a, especially in this niche, right? We're talking about a small community

01:23:33 ◼   ► really. But when you say, "I don't need a Mac. I can do all my stuff on iOS." And you

01:23:38 ◼   ► get the Mac people saying, "Oh, you're crazy. Why wouldn't you?" And you get the winky face

01:23:41 ◼   ► at the end of a tweet and you got all the sarcastic notes, you know? And you get all

01:23:46 ◼   ► the smiles and the creepy messages. I don't know why they put winky faces at the end.

01:23:51 ◼   ► And they say, "Use a Mac with a winky face. What's the winky face for?" So you get all

01:23:56 ◼   ► messages and I'm like why wouldn't you just... I'm not saying give it a chance but just

01:24:02 ◼   ► try to understand a different position, you know, because I totally understand

01:24:06 ◼   ► why people would say "no, I need a Mac" like someone like Myke who has a

01:24:10 ◼   ► recording studio or you know as all the fancy hardware to make people sound

01:24:15 ◼   ► better like I totally understand why Myke needs a Mac I totally understand

01:24:19 ◼   ► why someone like Marco needs a Mac because he needs to program and because

01:24:22 ◼   ► there's stuff on iOS that you cannot do. It's not possible. There's no development program

01:24:29 ◼   ► on the iPad that lets you make apps. So I totally get it. But I think we would save

01:24:39 ◼   ► a lot of time without being sarcastic and just being able to accept more other people's

01:24:48 ◼   ► point of views, which I realize it's an extremely obvious statement, but when it comes to this

01:24:54 ◼   ► small audience, you know, people who work on iOS and the Mac, which is like less than

01:24:59 ◼   ► 1% of the world's population, I think it'll be more useful. Just general thought, because

01:25:06 ◼   ► of the winky face.

01:25:08 ◼   ► No more winky faces.

01:25:10 ◼   ► I like winky faces, just not with the winky faces combined with an otherwise somewhat

01:25:15 ◼   ► angry statement. Because can you imagine people like talking to you with an upset tone and

01:25:22 ◼   ► then they do a wink?

01:25:24 ◼   ► Hey you! Wink!

01:25:25 ◼   ► You know? That's what I mean.

01:25:26 ◼   ► Yeah. Steven, do you want to tell us how much you love your pebble, Winky Face?

01:25:37 ◼   ► So I wrote a thing, it was going to be in the show last week but we ran out of time,

01:25:42 ◼   ► about sort of using the pebble in the real world.

01:25:45 ◼   ► And we spoke about it with you, Myke,

01:25:47 ◼   ► when you started wearing one when you had a day job.

01:25:50 ◼   ► And like if people notice it in meetings

01:25:54 ◼   ► or like if it's vibrating or lighting up,

01:25:56 ◼   ► do people like, does it catch people's eye?

01:25:57 ◼   ► Do they ask about it?

01:25:58 ◼   ► And I've had a couple experiences where it was noticed.

01:26:01 ◼   ► And not only because like the vibrate motor

01:26:04 ◼   ► was kind of rattly or the screen lit up in a meeting,

01:26:07 ◼   ► but I would look at it and then, you know,

01:26:10 ◼   ► kind of perceived at least here if you look at your watch like that can be seen

01:26:14 ◼   ► as rude and so I wrote a little bit about that and kind of the short version

01:26:22 ◼   ► of it is is that I think and maybe it's like me being in like meetings with

01:26:28 ◼   ► clients and stuff like we haven't quite like arrived as a culture at least in my

01:26:36 ◼   ► little corner of culture like we're looking at your watch or having a watch

01:26:39 ◼   ► is doing things is considered normal.

01:26:42 ◼   ► And I kind of equate it to like, I was a very early iPhone adopter, like you pull your iPhone

01:26:46 ◼   ► out and there's not that many iPhones around, like it draws attention.

01:26:50 ◼   ► And not necessarily in the "hey I'm going to mug you in your car" type way, but you

01:26:54 ◼   ► know people want to see it, people have questions, and I've seen a little bit of that with the

01:26:58 ◼   ► Pebble.

01:27:00 ◼   ► And so, I ran it for a couple weeks just out of the box, and then Myke on your suggestion,

01:27:07 ◼   ► I turned the vibrate motor off, which is really interesting because then when my phone would

01:27:12 ◼   ► vibrate I would like expect it on my wrist or like go to look at my wrist even after

01:27:18 ◼   ► only like two weeks of wearing it.

01:27:20 ◼   ► It rewired my brain very quickly.

01:27:23 ◼   ► And then I had like a fancy event I had to go to so took it off and put my regular watch

01:27:27 ◼   ► back on because the plastic pebble at least is pretty ugly in my opinion.

01:27:32 ◼   ► And it happened like my phone went off in my pocket and I looked at my wrist and it's

01:27:35 ◼   ► like my mechanical like regular watch like oh this watch doesn't know about

01:27:40 ◼   ► tweetbot like it's just a thing and so it was interesting to me how quickly I

01:27:46 ◼   ► became like used to it and I don't know about you Myke like if you're not

01:27:50 ◼   ► wearing yours and your phone goes off do you look at your wrist like if you're

01:27:53 ◼   ► just around the house and haven't put it on yeah it drives me crazy I hate it

01:27:57 ◼   ► when my when I eat when my pebble runs out battery yeah which I will say at

01:28:03 ◼   ► least like if you turn it off at night the battery life was actually pretty

01:28:07 ◼   ► good better than I had anticipated. So I've kind of come to the end of my

01:28:13 ◼   ► Pebble experiment and I kind of have two points I want to see what you guys think.

01:28:20 ◼   ► One like the Pebble itself as a device you can go out and buy like it's still

01:28:27 ◼   ► gen 1 it's kind of clunky it doesn't integrate really well which we spoke

01:28:32 ◼   ► about a couple weeks ago.

01:28:34 ◼   ► I kind of worry about Pebble with Android Wear and the Apple Watch coming.

01:28:41 ◼   ► There's a link on Pebble's blog they announced this week that they are hooking into Android

01:28:48 ◼   ► Wear.

01:28:49 ◼   ► So Android Wear, I don't think really quite, I need to read more, but I think the gist

01:28:52 ◼   ► of it is that they can do interactive notifications on the Pebble to a degree like Android Wear

01:28:58 ◼   ► does on things like the Moto 360 and the LG G Watch or whichever one mic you own.

01:29:05 ◼   ► Yeah so what it's allowing you to do is when you get an email instead of just

01:29:09 ◼   ► like dismissing the notification you can now take some sort of action on it like

01:29:13 ◼   ► open on the phone archive it or you can decline things like you're able to do

01:29:19 ◼   ► more like some of the stuff where apps use the Android Wear like SDK to do some

01:29:29 ◼   ► more extended functionality. Purple is now hooking into that which is

01:29:34 ◼   ► interesting. Yeah and I think like that sort of thing is going to be key to them

01:29:41 ◼   ► surviving like integrated products coming onto the market and my guess is

01:29:46 ◼   ► that they're not going to be able to do that on iOS, that whatever mechanisms are

01:29:50 ◼   ► being used, you know, Apple's doing this not via like Bluetooth notifications but

01:29:54 ◼   ► through app extensions where you are projecting an extension onto the watch

01:29:59 ◼   ► and if you hit play on your podcast player on your watch like that's going

01:30:03 ◼   ► back to the device itself and sort of its own private way and so I don't think

01:30:09 ◼   ► they're gonna be able to do that level of integration on the iOS side of things

01:30:14 ◼   ► No, and like them adopting Android wear stuff like, you know, there's a question in the chat room

01:30:19 ◼   ► Do you use your your phone less because of the watch like really the answer is no

01:30:23 ◼   ► Because you still have to pull your phone out to deal with anything

01:30:25 ◼   ► You can see what's there and you can dismiss it

01:30:27 ◼   ► But if I got to go to reply to a text message or you know anything like that

01:30:31 ◼   ► I'm still pulling my phone out in my pocket. I

01:30:33 ◼   ► Think like so overall like that. I worry for pebble especially in the iOS camp like what's gonna happen when Apple moves in

01:30:43 ◼   ► I hope that they can become a really credible Android Wear maker because like you know I'm

01:30:49 ◼   ► looking through this blog post now and they're basically saying notification wise and app

01:30:53 ◼   ► wise if you can do it on Android Wear you can do it on Pebble now.

01:30:58 ◼   ► So if that is the case like that is pretty cool and it because what makes it different

01:31:06 ◼   ► is like you know if they say you've got like a week long battery life and if that's important

01:31:12 ◼   ► you, you won't be able to get another smartwatch that can do that.

01:31:17 ◼   ► Pebble becomes the de facto standard and really I mean they need to

01:31:25 ◼   ► have like a version 3 come out quite soon. So we had like the original and

01:31:29 ◼   ► we had the steel, we needed something else maybe a new form

01:31:33 ◼   ► factor, a tighter design because these guys in theory should have a head start

01:31:38 ◼   ► should have had a head start against some of these other companies that are

01:31:42 ◼   ► trying to do this stuff because they've been making these things for a couple of

01:31:45 ◼   ► years you know so like pebble should be able to make in theory like in my

01:31:51 ◼   ► opinion a better watch than like Asus can because pebbles whole business is

01:31:58 ◼   ► making watches like that is their business yeah but I think it's one of

01:32:03 ◼   ► those things where the software will trump like if yeah I'm if the Apple

01:32:07 ◼   ► Well that's like the whole... you can't do that.

01:32:11 ◼   ► It's important.

01:32:12 ◼   ► So I don't know, I don't know, my guess is I'm out of line with you.

01:32:17 ◼   ► I think they'll be fine on Android if they can stick.

01:32:20 ◼   ► I think the future for the Pebble on iOS is darker.

01:32:25 ◼   ► But my idea of buying this thing a month ago was are risk notifications useful?

01:32:33 ◼   ► And the answer I think is yes.

01:32:36 ◼   ► their frustrations with it, which I've voiced, which you've voiced as well.

01:32:41 ◼   ► But the idea that I can just very quickly look at something and especially like in the

01:32:46 ◼   ► car, the pebble is great.

01:32:48 ◼   ► Like I can just, you know, my hands are already up on the wheel and I can just turn my wrist

01:32:52 ◼   ► over and like not be tempted to look at my phone.

01:32:56 ◼   ► And I know before you ride in, I probably shouldn't even be doing the pebble in the

01:33:00 ◼   ► car, but whatever.

01:33:01 ◼   ► That's how life is.

01:33:03 ◼   ► So I think there's a lot of promise in this area of having something that is sort of a

01:33:08 ◼   ► satellite to your phone.

01:33:11 ◼   ► I don't think the Pebble is the ultimate answer, but I do think there are some cultural things

01:33:15 ◼   ► that have to catch up and I think things will.

01:33:17 ◼   ► I think there'll be a point where in a year, two years, three years, as more people are

01:33:21 ◼   ► wearing the Apple Watch or Android Wear devices or even the Pebble, that it's that stigma

01:33:28 ◼   ► of, "Hey, I'm looking at my watch in a meeting.

01:33:31 ◼   ► Am I being rude?

01:33:32 ◼   ► telling you subconsciously that I'm out of time, that will wear off.

01:33:37 ◼   ► And I think it sort of has to, and to a degree, for this to be accepted.

01:33:43 ◼   ► Even now, it's rude to pull your phone out, or I feel it's rude to pull your phone out

01:33:48 ◼   ► when you're having a one-on-one conversation with somebody.

01:33:51 ◼   ► But it's not common for me to be in a meeting and everyone has their iPhones out on the

01:33:55 ◼   ► table to just kind of keep a half-eye on it.

01:33:59 ◼   ► So I think we'll get there as a human race.

01:34:02 ◼   ► But it's, you know, I will say I'm more excited about the Apple Watch now than I was before

01:34:08 ◼   ► wearing a pebble because I've seen sort of that promise of, "Hey, you know, we can put

01:34:12 ◼   ► things a glance away," and my frustration not being able to interact with those things

01:34:18 ◼   ► will be dealt with with the Apple Watch.

01:34:21 ◼   ► And so I would say that it's, I'm probably more likely to jump in on generation one than

01:34:27 ◼   ► I would have been without this little experiment.

01:34:33 ◼   ► That mirrors a lot of my thoughts, although I like my pebble enough to continue to wear

01:34:37 ◼   ► it every day.

01:34:38 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm shipping mine back tomorrow.

01:34:40 ◼   ► Poor pebble.

01:34:41 ◼   ► Really sad conclusion.

01:34:43 ◼   ► That's alright.

01:34:44 ◼   ► Poor pebble.

01:34:45 ◼   ► Alright, I think that's about it for this week's episode of Connected.

01:34:49 ◼   ► If you'd like to find the show notes for this week, you can maybe go back to the start and

01:34:52 ◼   ► listen to my long explanation.

01:34:54 ◼   ► Otherwise, just go to relay.fm/connected/18.

01:34:59 ◼   ► If you'd like to find us on the internet, there's a few ways you can do that.

01:35:02 ◼   ► I am @imike on Twitter, I am YKE @federico.

01:35:08 ◼   ► Federico is @vitici, V I T I C C I, and Steven is @ismh on Twitter.

01:35:16 ◼   ► Federico writes the fantasticmaxstories.net and Steven Hackett writes at the lovely 512pixels.net.

01:35:22 ◼   ► We'll be back next week with another episode of Connected.

01:35:25 ◼   ► Until then, thanks to our sponsors.

01:35:31 ◼   ► And...

01:35:32 ◼   ► Linda, DevMountain and SMILE.

01:35:34 ◼   ► We'll be back.

01:35:35 ◼   ► Bye bye.

01:35:36 ◼   ► Arrivederci.

01:35:37 ◼   ► Adios.

01:35:38 ◼   ► [BLANK_AUDIO]