450: The Bluetooth Nature of it All


00:00:00   [MUSIC PLAYING]

00:00:03   From Relay FM, This is Connected, episode 450.

00:00:12   That's a nice number.

00:00:13   Today's show is brought to you by our three excellent sponsors,

00:00:16   Fitball, Electric, and NetSuit.

00:00:18   And it's my pleasure to introduce Mr. Stephen Hackett

00:00:21   to the show.

00:00:22   Hello, Stephen.

00:00:23   Hello, Federico.

00:00:24   How are you?

00:00:24   Doing fantastic.

00:00:26   I forgot to say my name in this intro,

00:00:29   but I'm assuming that people can tell who it is.

00:00:31   It's Federico, by the way.

00:00:33   Yeah, we're 450 in.

00:00:34   I mean, people should know us.

00:00:36   You've got to assume that people could tell.

00:00:39   But hey, maybe somebody was surprised.

00:00:41   Maybe somebody was like, hey, this person

00:00:43   didn't say their name.

00:00:44   But yes, it's me.

00:00:45   Speaking of surprises, we are joined

00:00:47   by everyone's favorite John, John Voorhees.

00:00:52   Hey, bud.

00:00:53   Hey, Stephen.

00:00:54   How you doing?

00:00:54   I am good.

00:00:55   Thanks for stepping in today.

00:00:57   Mike is out.

00:00:57   He's got some travel going on.

00:00:59   And we said we haven't had our friend on in a long time.

00:01:03   And so here we are.

00:01:04   I'm not even sitting in Federico's lap

00:01:07   for this episode.

00:01:08   I mean, it seems like the last two times I've done it,

00:01:10   I've done it in Federico's old apartment, which

00:01:13   was a little crowded, shoulder to shoulder.

00:01:15   But I'm sitting at home at my spacious desk.

00:01:18   And it's good to be here.

00:01:20   And your slightly unalive MacStudio.

00:01:22   Yeah, my MacStudio has had some real troubles.

00:01:25   But it's on the mend now that I've got a brand new user

00:01:28   account.

00:01:29   That's good.

00:01:30   I'm glad it's looking up.

00:01:32   You've been retelling some of that story on App Stories.

00:01:35   And you've been through the ringer with that computer.

00:01:38   I really haven't.

00:01:39   And especially, it's like always comes at the worst time

00:01:41   when I've got something that I have to get out.

00:01:43   And here I am stuck spending.

00:01:45   I spent last Saturday.

00:01:47   I spent 4 and 1/2 hours on the phone with Apple support.

00:01:52   I don't wish that on anybody.

00:01:53   Oh, we have a little bit of follow up around the Beats

00:01:56   Studio Buds Plus.

00:01:59   This is the earbuds that were foretold by the Mike Hurley

00:02:03   Top Tech tip line for tips.

00:02:05   They are available for order today.

00:02:08   They are translucent.

00:02:10   They look incredible.

00:02:12   They are amazing.

00:02:13   And I wish that Apple would make everything translucent,

00:02:18   like in the good old days.

00:02:21   It's a whole vibe.

00:02:22   Imagine having this and an iPhone that's translucent

00:02:27   and maybe a little computer, like a translucent Mac Mini.

00:02:32   That would be so sick.

00:02:34   I've been hovering over the purchase button

00:02:37   on the Italian Apple Store, Steven and John.

00:02:41   And John knows, I can't buy this yet,

00:02:44   because it says they're coming soon.

00:02:46   They're not available.

00:02:47   Like, I see them.

00:02:48   It says new, shows all the pictures

00:02:52   of the transparent version.

00:02:54   But it says not yet available.

00:02:58   We can get them in two days here, Federico.

00:03:00   And I'm thinking about it.

00:03:03   It may be time for my big Apple buddy again.

00:03:07   The real big Apple buddy, being me, not the people in New York.

00:03:11   No, not those people, the real one from North Carolina,

00:03:15   the big Apple buddy from North Carolina,

00:03:18   who sends me stuff occasionally.

00:03:20   So we'll see.

00:03:21   Ideally, I would just get the Italian version.

00:03:25   But usually with these things,

00:03:27   it means like the product page is up,

00:03:30   but it's not going to be available for a few weeks.

00:03:33   And I really wanted to have those before my travel to WWDC

00:03:37   so that I could test the noise canceling on a plane.

00:03:41   That was my idea, but we'll see.

00:03:43   However, the design, I mean,

00:03:45   it's so beautiful to look at, look at this.

00:03:48   You can see all the stuff inside.

00:03:50   - Yeah, I like them a lot too.

00:03:52   - It looks awesome.

00:03:53   It uses USB-C for charging.

00:03:55   There's no wireless charging here

00:03:56   and there's no in-ear detection.

00:03:58   So the thing where you take the AirPods Pro out

00:04:01   and they stop.

00:04:01   - Oh, interesting.

00:04:02   - And according to the Verge, the ANC and transparency

00:04:06   is maybe not quite as good as the AirPods Pro,

00:04:08   but they come in at 169.

00:04:10   That is $20 more than last time.

00:04:12   But these things are popular

00:04:14   and this looks incredible.

00:04:16   And I hope we see much more of this sort of design language.

00:04:20   So I want to talk to you a little bit

00:04:21   about automation April.

00:04:24   Today you published the winners of the Shortcuts.

00:04:29   Shortcuts what?

00:04:32   Shortcuts like a-

00:04:33   - Contest.

00:04:34   - Cage match for shortcut creators.

00:04:37   There's a bunch of awesome things in here.

00:04:39   You guys sent me this list last night

00:04:41   and I downloaded a bunch of them and played with them.

00:04:44   Could you all run me through some of your favorites

00:04:46   and how you feel like it went this year?

00:04:48   - Yeah, we got a great crop of entries this year,

00:04:52   well over a hundred.

00:04:53   And we were fortunate enough to have a great panel of judges

00:04:57   to help us get through all this.

00:04:58   But at the end of the day, we picked our six winners.

00:05:01   And I'll start off by talking about

00:05:04   the best everyday shortcut,

00:05:06   which is kind of a category that's special to me

00:05:09   in Federico, I think,

00:05:10   because it's meant to emphasize that a shortcut

00:05:15   doesn't have to be complicated to be good.

00:05:17   And so this year's winner for that was Jason Beetic,

00:05:22   I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly,

00:05:26   with a shortcut called Yes More Events.

00:05:29   And Yes More Events is a great title, a great name,

00:05:32   because it really, it's a play on no more events

00:05:36   when you get your calendar widget

00:05:38   or your complication on your watch.

00:05:39   And you see you have no more events for the day.

00:05:42   It's really a waste of space.

00:05:44   And so what this shortcut does is it grabs

00:05:47   a couple of overdue tasks from the Reminders app

00:05:50   and puts them in a pre-populated calendar event

00:05:55   that occurs at like 11.45 p.m. until midnight.

00:05:59   So that when you get to the end of your day

00:06:00   and you've got all of your meetings

00:06:03   and appointments taken care of,

00:06:05   you've still got something there

00:06:06   that has some valuable information in it

00:06:08   with a title that shows you how many tasks are overdue,

00:06:13   and then a notes section that shows you what the tasks are

00:06:16   so that if you have a little free time,

00:06:17   you can knock those off.

00:06:18   And it could be, it's a shortcut

00:06:20   that could be easily adapted for other things too.

00:06:22   You could put an inspirational quote in there

00:06:25   or something else.

00:06:25   It's a pretty cool one.

00:06:27   - And apparently Jason is in the Discord right now

00:06:30   and just found out that he won in this category.

00:06:34   - Oh, well, congratulations, Jason.

00:06:37   You gotta go read Mac stories more frequently.

00:06:39   (laughing)

00:06:42   - So yeah, I love that.

00:06:43   I love that shortcut.

00:06:45   Personal favorite of mine is, I mean,

00:06:48   we're gonna talk about the best overall shortcut

00:06:51   in a couple of minutes.

00:06:53   The best media one by Joshua Dick.

00:06:57   The best media shortcut, Qmedia.

00:06:59   I love this one.

00:07:00   So the idea for this is kinda simple,

00:07:03   but yet so effective at the same time.

00:07:06   So Qmedia, it answers the question of,

00:07:09   I wanna save music or video for later.

00:07:13   I don't wanna have to choose between multiple extensions

00:07:16   to save that content.

00:07:18   So what this shortcut does,

00:07:20   it lets you use a single shortcut called Qmedia

00:07:23   that depending on what you're sharing via the share sheet,

00:07:27   it understands if you're sharing music

00:07:29   from Apple Music, Spotify, Deezer, Bandcamp,

00:07:33   or if you're sharing a video from YouTube, Vimeo, Twitter,

00:07:37   I forgot which other sources.

00:07:39   So it checks that,

00:07:41   and then depending on whether you're saving music

00:07:43   or video for later,

00:07:45   it uses the native actions for Play by Mark Kostanaka

00:07:49   or Music Box, also by Mark Kostanaka.

00:07:52   So the idea being,

00:07:54   there's these two apps made by the same developer.

00:07:57   One of them lets you save videos for later.

00:07:59   The other lets you save music for later.

00:08:02   Instead of using two share extensions,

00:08:04   you can just use one shortcut in the share sheet

00:08:07   that understands the type of content you're sharing

00:08:09   on its own automatically.

00:08:12   And I just love that idea

00:08:13   because it sort of becomes this catchall,

00:08:16   kind of like a read later shortcut

00:08:18   that it's very low friction.

00:08:21   And I mean, I'm a fan of play a music box.

00:08:24   So this was kind of perfect for me.

00:08:26   I love this idea and how it does the checking

00:08:30   of the type of content you're sharing, very nicely done.

00:08:33   - Yeah, another one that won an award

00:08:36   was for productivity shortcut

00:08:39   is Jan Damscher's meeting notes for Obsidian.

00:08:44   Now, this is to me was kind of an interesting one

00:08:47   because Obsidian has an awful lot of automation tools

00:08:51   built right into it.

00:08:52   And I think a lot of people in the Obsidian community

00:08:55   really stick to those automation tools,

00:08:58   whether it's community plugins or some of the other features

00:09:01   built right into the app by default.

00:09:04   But this uses shortcuts and I've actually found myself

00:09:07   that shortcuts is a great way to create templates.

00:09:11   And that's what this shortcut does.

00:09:13   It combines information from your calendar

00:09:17   with text actions and generates a format for meeting notes

00:09:23   with things like attendees, the dates, the meeting title,

00:09:28   and a place to take notes about it.

00:09:30   So it just kind of pulls all that information together

00:09:33   in one place and then uses a community plugin

00:09:36   called Advanced URI to save that to Obsidian

00:09:41   because the standard URL scheme for Obsidian

00:09:46   doesn't have the ability to do that.

00:09:47   Advanced URI allows for the creation of a note

00:09:51   with content in it 'cause all that content

00:09:53   gets encoded into the URL, then dropped into Obsidian

00:09:57   where it is saved in whatever folder you pick

00:10:00   when you install the shortcut.

00:10:02   - I think one of my favorites is the one

00:10:04   that won best Mac shortcut that lets you use a QR code

00:10:08   on Mac OS because I mean, it's like ridiculous

00:10:11   'cause I've been in this situation.

00:10:12   I'm sure a lot of people have like,

00:10:13   oh, there's a QR code on this website

00:10:16   and I wanna do the thing at my computer,

00:10:18   but I gotta get my phone.

00:10:20   I gotta like open the camera, use their new weird UI,

00:10:23   which isn't as good as the old one.

00:10:25   And so this one, it uses like a web API to basically,

00:10:30   I guess, look at the QR code and then figure out

00:10:32   what you're supposed to do with it.

00:10:33   - Yeah, that's exactly right.

00:10:34   I mean, it's a really nice thing to be able to do that

00:10:38   with the Mac because it's not built in.

00:10:42   - I wanna talk about the best overall shortcut.

00:10:44   So the best overall shortcut is called Inline Converter

00:10:48   and it's made by Dylan Mac.

00:10:49   In fact, Dylan, Steven won last year

00:10:53   for one of your favorite shortcuts, the meme maker.

00:10:56   - That one is very good.

00:10:58   - That was very good and Dylan won last year

00:11:00   in the best everyday category and came back this year

00:11:03   with Inline Converter, which is such a genius idea, I think.

00:11:07   So Inline Converter was inspired by something

00:11:10   that is missing on Mac OS,

00:11:13   which is the Inline Unit Conversion stuff

00:11:16   that Apple added in iOS and iPad OS 16,

00:11:20   but they didn't add it in Mac OS Ventura.

00:11:23   I'm referring to the ability to just select any text on iOS.

00:11:27   And if it contains like a unit of length or temperature

00:11:30   or currencies, whatever,

00:11:32   it automatically converts that for you.

00:11:35   And even if you don't select the text,

00:11:37   sometimes those things, they get underlined.

00:11:41   And so you can tap those and it's like a data detector

00:11:44   and you got a little pop-up with your conversion.

00:11:46   Excellent feature, but it's not on the Mac.

00:11:49   And so Dylan had this idea for, well,

00:11:52   what if I made a shortcut that sort of brought

00:11:55   that functionality over to Mac OS?

00:11:57   And it works beautifully in that you can select any text

00:12:01   and Inline Converter works as a quick action on Mac OS.

00:12:05   So you will find it in the services menu.

00:12:07   And for any text that matches units of length, weight,

00:12:12   volume, temperature, and I forgot what else,

00:12:16   you get a pop-up after running the shortcut.

00:12:19   You got a pop-up that says,

00:12:20   here's all the values you may wanna convert.

00:12:23   Like for example, when you convert Celsius,

00:12:25   you get a pop-up with Celsius, Fahrenheit,

00:12:28   and Kelvin temperatures, sort of like it works on iOS.

00:12:33   And the beautiful thing about this shortcut is that

00:12:36   I mentioned Mac OS because it was designed for Mac OS,

00:12:38   but you can totally use it on iOS and iPad OS.

00:12:41   In fact, it's so fast to use, I pinned it to my iPad dock.

00:12:46   And whenever I wanna convert something quickly,

00:12:48   I can just run the shortcut from there.

00:12:50   And the beautiful part is Dylan did a lot of work

00:12:54   to match all possible sort of permutations

00:12:58   of how you may find units written down as text.

00:13:03   So there's a lot of regular expressions in the shortcut.

00:13:08   You never see any of this.

00:13:09   You never see any of this complexity.

00:13:12   But behind the scenes, Dylan did a lot of work to,

00:13:15   for example, all the different ways

00:13:17   you can spell and write centimeters.

00:13:21   So it can be centimeter or centimeters or cm,

00:13:25   or cm could be with a space, without a space.

00:13:29   And all those things are things that

00:13:31   when you're writing regular expressions,

00:13:33   it takes a lot of work.

00:13:34   And he did all of this for all the five,

00:13:37   I believe different categories of units

00:13:39   that are supported.

00:13:40   It's a beautiful work in terms of the structure

00:13:44   and the code of the shortcut with a very clear idea

00:13:49   with the flexibility of being able to say

00:13:52   this works as a quick action on Mac OS,

00:13:55   but it also works if you run it manually.

00:13:57   It also works from Siri.

00:13:59   It works from the share sheet.

00:14:01   It works from a bunch of other places.

00:14:03   And it's just, it's useful.

00:14:05   It's actually a useful thing to have.

00:14:08   So Dylan is one of the best shortcuts creators

00:14:13   out there at the moment, I think.

00:14:15   And so having this kind of recognition,

00:14:17   I and John and the team of judges,

00:14:19   we felt like, yeah, this is the one

00:14:22   that should win it all this year.

00:14:25   - Yeah, it was a really great shortcut.

00:14:27   I don't want to forget Tim Nhumpke,

00:14:29   who won with the best health shortcut too, right?

00:14:33   - Yes. - Action Health.

00:14:34   - That one is also very good.

00:14:35   - Yeah, Action Health is really good

00:14:36   because it's built on a series of list actions

00:14:40   and it kicks off with allowing you to pick from a list

00:14:43   to decide what workout you want to do

00:14:46   or whether you want to log water, caffeine, or your weight.

00:14:49   And it's really pretty simple in that sense,

00:14:52   but there was a lot of setup that went into it

00:14:53   because it builds in a whole bunch of different kinds

00:14:56   of workouts that can be started directly from the shortcut.

00:14:59   You can, at the outset, you can delete the workouts

00:15:05   that you don't do because it's a really long list

00:15:07   and narrow it down to just--

00:15:08   - Yeah, that was a cool feature.

00:15:09   It was like, I'm never gonna do an open water swim.

00:15:11   I don't need it in here.

00:15:13   - Yeah, exactly.

00:15:15   'Cause it's got really everything in there

00:15:17   with emoji and everything to help make it easy

00:15:20   to pick what you're doing.

00:15:22   And this is a new category for us this year.

00:15:24   We did HomeKit last year,

00:15:26   which is a little bit hard to judge

00:15:27   because sometimes it requires particular hardware.

00:15:31   And the thing about this shortcut

00:15:34   is that it takes advantage of the action button

00:15:37   on the Apple Watch Ultra.

00:15:38   It can be used with a regular Apple Watch too,

00:15:41   but it was really designed to be a one button press

00:15:44   type of shortcut, which I thought was really cool.

00:15:47   And it really does, it shows that you can do

00:15:49   some very interesting things with shortcuts on the watch,

00:15:52   even though, as Federico and I discussed on App Stories

00:15:55   when we did our watchOS wishes,

00:15:58   shortcuts on the watch is a very limited system.

00:16:03   So that's the list of winners.

00:16:05   - Yeah, I think they're all fantastic.

00:16:07   I know talking to you guys behind the scenes

00:16:09   the last couple of weeks,

00:16:10   it seems like y'all are very pleased with how this went.

00:16:13   So I think we're all can look forward to it again

00:16:15   next year, right?

00:16:16   - Oh yeah.

00:16:17   I mean, now we're on the hook for this.

00:16:19   So now we gotta keep doing it.

00:16:20   - That's right.

00:16:21   - And I honestly think like we found a better balance

00:16:24   this year in terms of like content on the site,

00:16:27   activities in Discord, you know,

00:16:29   stuff in Mac Stories Weekly,

00:16:32   the Plus and Premiere content.

00:16:34   Like it's a nice sort of a way to take advantage

00:16:39   of all the different things we do.

00:16:41   And so, yeah, I mean, hopefully next year,

00:16:46   I don't know, maybe we'll do best Reality Pro shortcut

00:16:50   or whatever like that.

00:16:52   Hey, maybe we're gonna do VR shortcuts, you know?

00:16:56   But realistically, my hope for next year

00:17:00   is that we're gonna have more changes in shortcuts this year

00:17:04   than we did last year when, you know,

00:17:07   it didn't really change much.

00:17:08   And so I was also,

00:17:11   I think it was challenging for people this year

00:17:13   to come up with new shortcuts, with new ideas,

00:17:16   because the actions that we got,

00:17:18   the new features that we got in shortcuts in iOS 16,

00:17:21   weren't exactly groundbreaking.

00:17:24   - No, they didn't really open any new avenues

00:17:26   for new types of shortcuts.

00:17:29   - Hopefully next year we'll get a lot of new ideas,

00:17:31   but yeah, that's done.

00:17:33   Now we're gonna send out the prizes.

00:17:35   I believe Dylan, I gotta get in touch with Dylan.

00:17:37   Dylan is based in New Zealand, so it's probably take away.

00:17:41   - Boy, if we had known that,

00:17:41   we wouldn't have given him a prize we have to ship.

00:17:44   (laughing)

00:17:46   - See, the thing is, we don't know who the winners are

00:17:50   until we picked the shortcuts,

00:17:53   and then we ask Alex, hey, give us the data.

00:17:56   Like, I have no idea, we had no idea who won

00:17:59   until we asked Alex at the end,

00:18:01   get the info from the database.

00:18:03   - Okay, okay, so yeah,

00:18:06   so you're judging them blind, basically.

00:18:08   - Yeah, yeah, that's the idea,

00:18:10   and sometimes a few people put in their names

00:18:13   in like the description of the shortcut inside the shortcut,

00:18:17   so at that point you're gonna know,

00:18:19   but otherwise I prefer to go in blind

00:18:21   without any info whatsoever on who made the shortcut.

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00:20:43   - So Apple continues to release news

00:20:47   in the lead up to WWDC.

00:20:50   We got a couple of big stories this week from them.

00:20:52   I wanna start with the one that is definitely

00:20:55   right up y'all's alley,

00:20:56   now with Apple announcing new quote,

00:20:59   "concert discovery features"

00:21:01   on Apple Maps and Apple Music.

00:21:04   So John, can you tell us a little bit about what this is?

00:21:06   - Yeah, so Apple did a couple of different things.

00:21:08   They built in a new category of guides

00:21:13   into Apple Maps,

00:21:14   which concentrate on music venues

00:21:19   in a dozen or so cities.

00:21:20   There are cities in North America,

00:21:23   in the United States, Europe,

00:21:26   and Japan, and Australia,

00:21:29   as well as Mexico City.

00:21:32   So there's a lot of venues in here.

00:21:36   It's a little limited so far.

00:21:38   There are roughly 40 of these,

00:21:40   but if history is any guide, I think,

00:21:43   these guides will in fact expand over time

00:21:46   because if you think back to when guides

00:21:48   were first introduced in Apple Maps,

00:21:51   I think it was like, it was either two or three years ago,

00:21:54   there were only a few,

00:21:55   and they were like in LA, New York, London,

00:21:58   and maybe a couple of other cities.

00:22:00   And now, anytime you visit a city of really any size,

00:22:05   there are guides available,

00:22:06   and there are more like geographical guides as well.

00:22:09   So it's good to see the venues in there.

00:22:11   You can pick up tickets even

00:22:13   and see what shows are playing

00:22:14   because a while back, Shazam added a feature

00:22:19   that allows you to see what concerts are coming up.

00:22:23   And so that Shazam feature,

00:22:25   which was just in the Shazam app,

00:22:27   has been integrated with Maps.

00:22:29   And then the second component of this is the set lists,

00:22:34   which are really kind of a new sort of playlist

00:22:38   in Apple Music.

00:22:39   It'll show big artists who are out on tour right now

00:22:43   and compile a playlist,

00:22:45   which I assume is presumably based

00:22:47   on what they're playing in concert.

00:22:49   And yesterday, when I looked at it at first,

00:22:52   it hadn't fully populated, but it is now.

00:22:55   So if you go to the browse section,

00:22:57   you can go into a dedicated section

00:22:59   that just has these set lists,

00:23:01   or you can search for them.

00:23:02   And they've got Sam Smith in there and Taylor Swift,

00:23:06   and I think Beyonce, and a bunch of other people

00:23:09   who are out on tour right now.

00:23:10   It's fairly limited.

00:23:12   I mean, there's some information in there about the tours,

00:23:14   but it usually is like a paragraph or two.

00:23:17   But it's something that, you know,

00:23:20   Federico and I have talked about this for years and years.

00:23:22   Like, why doesn't Apple integrate music

00:23:24   with more of the things that it does?

00:23:26   More of its apps, more of its services.

00:23:29   And this is a, it's a first step.

00:23:31   And I think it's kind of a small one,

00:23:34   but it is also, at least on the guide side,

00:23:37   and I guess on the music side too, it's editorial content.

00:23:40   And I think Apple usually tends to start relatively slow

00:23:44   with editorial content and build it up over time.

00:23:47   So I'm hoping we'll see more of it in the future.

00:23:49   - Obviously very much thrilled to see this feature.

00:23:53   I think it's the right approach to sort of combine

00:23:56   Apple Maps and Apple Music and have these,

00:23:58   all these sort of two-way street

00:24:00   of integrations between them.

00:24:03   That being said, I mean, it's obviously a small rollout.

00:24:05   Do we know, John, what data set Apple is using

00:24:09   for concerts and schedules?

00:24:11   Is it bands in town?

00:24:13   Are they using them?

00:24:13   - Yeah, they're using bands in towns, yeah.

00:24:15   - Okay, so, but that means they're not,

00:24:17   they do not have, like, how are they compiling the list of,

00:24:22   like the actual set list for a concert?

00:24:25   - That I don't know.

00:24:25   It's not really stated anywhere.

00:24:27   I assume that they've got an editorial team doing it.

00:24:29   - Yeah, because I sort of wish that Apple would just go ahead

00:24:33   and use an excellent service that I've been using,

00:24:36   I believe since I was in high school.

00:24:37   So that was like approaching 20 years ago.

00:24:40   Setlist.fm, such an incredible website

00:24:45   that is sort of crowdsourced databases for sort of

00:24:50   what songs artists actually play

00:24:53   in which dates of their tours.

00:24:56   And I don't think Apple is using this.

00:24:59   Otherwise they would have mentioned it.

00:25:01   So I think it's obviously a small rollout,

00:25:04   geographically speaking, very limited.

00:25:07   It's gonna be a while before they're gonna expand this

00:25:10   to all major locations around the world.

00:25:13   But still, this is the right idea.

00:25:15   Like integrate with Apple Maps and Apple Music,

00:25:19   bring in editorial content, have playlists

00:25:22   for when they're actually, you know,

00:25:25   what they're actually playing.

00:25:27   And you could imagine down the road, like,

00:25:29   okay, well, what if you could buy,

00:25:31   I don't know if Apple wants to go down this road,

00:25:34   but what if you could buy a concert ticket

00:25:36   from Apple Music using Apple Pay?

00:25:37   Like the potential is obviously there.

00:25:40   And I mean, now that Apple is effectively a bank

00:25:44   with their own debt, credit card and whatever,

00:25:47   like it's not so far-fetched to imagine,

00:25:50   okay, now you can buy concert tickets from Apple Music.

00:25:52   And I mean, shortly in the United States,

00:25:56   when you consider all the drama surrounding Ticketmaster,

00:25:59   all that scene, like it does feel like a field

00:26:04   that is ripe for more competition, healthier competition.

00:26:08   So, you know, I wouldn't mind seeing that.

00:26:13   - The guides are quite good.

00:26:14   I mean, I checked out the Chicago one

00:26:16   for the alternative music scene

00:26:17   because I know Chicago's venues pretty well

00:26:20   of having to live there.

00:26:21   And it did a good job of picking out some of the top venues.

00:26:24   So, you know, I mean, it's a start.

00:26:26   It needs to be in more cities, of course,

00:26:27   but it seems like it's a pretty good start.

00:26:30   - Hey, let me ask you both this.

00:26:33   What's the last concert you've been to?

00:26:36   - I went in October of 2019.

00:26:40   October of 2019, I saw Frank Turner in Chicago.

00:26:45   - Okay, or whatever you see.

00:26:49   I think you've been to a concert lately.

00:26:52   - I'm trying to think.

00:26:53   I know I saw Death Cab in 2019 in Nashville.

00:26:56   - Didn't you go see Jimmy Ewoldt at some point?

00:26:59   - I think we talked about it, but I didn't go.

00:27:01   - Oh, we talked about it.

00:27:03   - Honestly, I think that Death Cab show in '19

00:27:05   may have been the last one.

00:27:07   - Last one for me was Liam Gallagher in February, 2020,

00:27:11   like a week before the COVID outbreak in Italy.

00:27:13   - Oh, wow.

00:27:14   (laughs)

00:27:16   Wow, that's crazy.

00:27:17   - Liam was doing two dates in Italy,

00:27:18   one in Milan and the other in Rome.

00:27:21   I almost went to the Milan one, but then I went to Rome

00:27:24   because it was obviously close to home.

00:27:27   And it turned out later that the Milan concert

00:27:30   was one of the first sort of like hotspots for the outbreak.

00:27:34   (laughs)

00:27:35   - I bet, wow, wow.

00:27:37   - I'm seeing-- - I'm seeing a bullet there.

00:27:39   - Yeah, I'm seeing Boy Genius right after WWDC.

00:27:43   He's telling Federico again to just make him jealous

00:27:46   because I know he'd like to go.

00:27:48   - I am so jealous.

00:27:50   I was wondering today,

00:27:52   do you guys saw the WWDC schedule

00:27:58   that Apple put out last night?

00:28:00   They sent developers who were selected to attend

00:28:03   sort of the keynote day,

00:28:06   a schedule for what they're gonna do.

00:28:08   And there's apparently like this evening activity

00:28:11   at Apple Park. - I saw that, yeah.

00:28:13   - Which it seems to me like it could be

00:28:16   a sort of a music performance by somebody.

00:28:20   - It could be.

00:28:21   That's what I thought.

00:28:21   Although I immediately saw developers speculating

00:28:23   that it's like a headset try-on thing.

00:28:26   My mind went originally--

00:28:27   - Oh, why a night?

00:28:28   Are you gonna make you try the headset at sunset?

00:28:30   - I know, my mind went immediately to a concert too.

00:28:33   - I mean, imagine if Boy Genius.

00:28:36   - That would be cool.

00:28:37   - Do we know where Boy Genius is on June,

00:28:40   what is it, June 3rd?

00:28:42   What's, no, what's June 5?

00:28:44   - They're probably on the East Coast

00:28:45   because I'm seeing them shortly after that, yeah.

00:28:50   June 2nd, they're playing in San Diego.

00:28:52   - Oh. - Oh.

00:28:54   - June 3rd, they're at the Rose Bowl.

00:28:56   - Okay, so that's not too far away.

00:28:59   It's Southern California, but.

00:29:00   - Okay.

00:29:02   - Yeah, they are not playing on June 5th.

00:29:04   They have a day off that day.

00:29:06   - If Boy Genius, if I'm calling,

00:29:08   if I'm wishing into existence right now,

00:29:11   Boy Genius playing live at WDC,

00:29:13   I'm just, I'm gonna lose it, guys.

00:29:14   I know. - Yeah, especially

00:29:15   since Press Access doesn't,

00:29:17   does Press Access come with concert access in the past?

00:29:20   - Not necessarily.

00:29:21   - Well, I will beg for it.

00:29:24   - Yeah, so will I. - To everybody I know.

00:29:25   - So will I.

00:29:25   - This, I mean, I can't help but think about

00:29:30   Apple's former entrance into this, right?

00:29:33   Of course, you have iTunes Ping,

00:29:34   and then we had Apple Music Connect,

00:29:39   where artists could go on, it was like a weird thing.

00:29:43   - Oh, yeah, it's like a weird social--

00:29:44   - They could upload photos and stuff.

00:29:46   Clearly, neither of those worked right,

00:29:47   and this, by having Apple and its partners do it

00:29:52   and not necessarily relying on artists

00:29:54   to have their PR person log into Apple Music Connect

00:29:57   on the web and upload photos, right?

00:29:59   That was all probably a terrible experience.

00:30:01   This seems, while much smaller in scope,

00:30:05   at least at this point, that's pretty exciting.

00:30:08   But again, it's 10 cities worldwide right now.

00:30:12   So they're starting small,

00:30:13   but it makes sense to pull these

00:30:17   different platforms together, right?

00:30:19   That you have maps and music

00:30:21   and some Shazam stuff maybe.

00:30:23   And Apple has these different services and apps,

00:30:27   and they don't always really know about each other.

00:30:30   And I think this is a really interesting way

00:30:32   to sort of cross-pollinate things

00:30:35   a little bit more than they've done before.

00:30:37   - Yeah, next up, and I've been seeing this forever

00:30:40   at this point, next up should really be news.

00:30:43   Like when I'm imagining if I'm using Apple Music,

00:30:45   we talked about this on the show.

00:30:47   Imagine if I'm using music and I'm like,

00:30:49   to keep that example,

00:30:51   imagine if I'm like,

00:30:55   in the album page for The Record by Boy Genius,

00:31:00   and there's a little expandable section at the bottom

00:31:04   that is a curated list from Apple News

00:31:08   for reviews for the album.

00:31:11   Like that could be useful, that could be fun.

00:31:14   So I don't know, we'll see, but I agree.

00:31:18   Music is such like, there's so many different things

00:31:21   you could do with it.

00:31:21   Concerts, merch, editorial content, podcasts, right?

00:31:26   There's a whole other aspect of

00:31:29   why are the Zane Lowe interviews and some of the other,

00:31:34   - Yeah.

00:31:35   - Some of the other presenter interviews,

00:31:37   why are they so hard to find in Apple Music

00:31:40   and subscribe to?

00:31:41   - Yeah.

00:31:42   - So it also feels like there's definitely potential for

00:31:44   having a better podcast integration with Apple Music

00:31:47   than what we have right now,

00:31:48   which is like effectively right now you have,

00:31:51   those interviews are like any other music content,

00:31:55   except they're not, they're not music.

00:31:57   They're content about music.

00:31:59   - Yeah, I think Jason's complained about

00:32:01   how they're presented in the app.

00:32:03   - Yeah, yeah.

00:32:04   It's like those should be,

00:32:05   those are more similar to video channels or podcasts

00:32:09   than a music album.

00:32:10   And yet you discover them and you interact with them

00:32:15   as if it was another piece of music content in Apple Music.

00:32:18   And I think that's wrong.

00:32:19   That's the wrong approach.

00:32:20   - Yeah.

00:32:21   - So there's a lot that Apple could do

00:32:22   to sort of cross pollinate between services.

00:32:25   And maybe this is the beginning of something.

00:32:27   Maybe it's just a one-off thing, but I hope it's not.

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00:34:18   The other big bit of news out of Apple this week

00:34:21   came with Accessibility Awareness Day, which is this week.

00:34:25   And Apple is previewing some features

00:34:28   that will come later this year.

00:34:29   So, assuming the next versions of iOS, iPadOS,

00:34:34   MacOS, et cetera.

00:34:36   And there's really quite a few things in here,

00:34:38   maybe half a dozen features or so.

00:34:41   And I thought we could walk through them

00:34:42   starting with Assistive Access,

00:34:46   which is a new customizable UI for the iPhone and iPad.

00:34:51   So, users with cognitive disabilities

00:34:54   can lighten the load of using their favorite apps.

00:34:56   And Apple has a lot of screenshots, examples of this.

00:34:58   They're in your story as well, John.

00:35:00   Say the Messages app, and instead of a bunch of buttons

00:35:03   and a bunch of things going on,

00:35:04   really simplifying that to make it easier.

00:35:08   And I don't think we quite know

00:35:09   how the customization works yet,

00:35:11   but this looks very exciting to me.

00:35:13   And John, do you know if this is coming to third parties?

00:35:16   Like if I made a Mastodon client,

00:35:19   could I kind of enroll it in this

00:35:21   and make my UI simpler for people

00:35:23   who want to lighten the load?

00:35:26   - Kind of yes and no.

00:35:28   I mean, the way Apple explained it to me is that

00:35:31   it comes automatically with the OS.

00:35:35   So a developer doesn't actually have to do anything

00:35:38   to include their app, say, in this grid of giant icons,

00:35:42   if it's set up that way.

00:35:44   Because one of the options is kind of a big chunky buttons

00:35:47   on the iPad or iPhone with big text and high contrast,

00:35:51   making it really easy to hit those targets and so forth.

00:35:55   And so third party apps can be included in that.

00:35:58   And when you go into those third party apps,

00:36:01   you'll see this really big back button,

00:36:02   which is one of the features of assisted access

00:36:05   that makes it easier for users to find their way back

00:36:08   to where they started.

00:36:10   But the rest of the UI, the UI that the developer creates,

00:36:14   I don't believe has any special APIs

00:36:17   to make something assistive access friendly.

00:36:20   It's not, you know, I don't,

00:36:22   they weren't talking about it this week

00:36:25   and I don't think those APIs exist yet,

00:36:27   but it would be nice over time to see the ability

00:36:31   for developers to have that alternative UI.

00:36:33   - Yeah.

00:36:34   - The other, you know, the other thing that can be done too

00:36:36   with assistive access, 'cause it's really customizable,

00:36:39   it doesn't have to be those big chunky buttons,

00:36:41   which are what were shown off because they were so visual.

00:36:43   But if someone is more text oriented, it can also be done.

00:36:47   And I haven't seen a picture of this,

00:36:49   but it's more like rows in a table.

00:36:52   So I think my sense is it's maybe more like looking

00:36:55   at a spreadsheet or something and picking your apps

00:36:57   from a list as opposed to having colorful icons.

00:37:02   - Another feature that definitely gained a lot of attention

00:37:04   was live speech and personal voice.

00:37:08   So this is a new feature across the iPhone, iPad, and Mac

00:37:12   that allows users who can't speak to type responses

00:37:16   that are spoken aloud on the phone.

00:37:19   So it's kind of, I mean, it is text to speech,

00:37:21   but the person is doing the text entry, if you will.

00:37:25   And you can also use this in in-person conversations.

00:37:29   And what is really interesting about it is that

00:37:32   if you have 15 minutes, you can sit down and record

00:37:35   a bunch of randomized text prompts,

00:37:38   and it will build a facsimile of their own voice.

00:37:43   So if you're working with somebody who maybe is at risk

00:37:46   of losing their voice over time, that you can preserve that

00:37:50   and then use that in these conversations.

00:37:53   And that is just fascinating to me.

00:37:56   And a lot of these are AI powered,

00:37:59   but Apple doesn't brand them as that.

00:38:01   This definitely feels like something that is definitely

00:38:04   powered by machine learning or whatever under the hood.

00:38:07   And it is English only at launch,

00:38:09   which is a bit of a bummer that this isn't more

00:38:11   international, but I think it really solves a problem

00:38:15   for a lot of people who would kind of be stuck

00:38:19   with using a voice that doesn't sound like them,

00:38:22   that doesn't reflect who they are,

00:38:24   and this makes it much more personal, which I love.

00:38:28   - Right, there are already apps on the App Store

00:38:30   that are designed to do this, not with a personalized voice,

00:38:34   but creating spoken out loud responses for people to use.

00:38:38   And I know those developers are really excited

00:38:41   about the option of being able to use a voice

00:38:45   that's in a person's own voice.

00:38:47   - From what I understand, once you read these prompts,

00:38:51   it's using the neural engine on Apple Silicon,

00:38:55   and it takes hours for that to process.

00:38:58   But then at the end, you'll have your voice.

00:39:02   And I saw a demo of this, it was very, very short,

00:39:06   so it's a little hard to judge how good it is.

00:39:08   I have cloned my voice in Federico's

00:39:11   using 11 Labs technology, and it's interesting.

00:39:15   Mine, I think, was pretty good.

00:39:16   The intonation was a little strange at times.

00:39:18   - Mine was horrible.

00:39:20   - Federico's was, imagine Federico sounding

00:39:23   extremely American with only a hint,

00:39:26   a hint of his underlying voice.

00:39:28   It was--

00:39:29   - Yeah, I sounded like somebody from Ohio.

00:39:31   - You did, you really did.

00:39:33   Midwestern teaching, it was really pretty funny.

00:39:36   But in the demo I saw, the woman who gave it

00:39:40   had an Indian accent, and it handled her accent pretty well,

00:39:43   which I know 11 Labs stuff doesn't,

00:39:45   so it'll be interesting to see how this goes.

00:39:48   I mean, I think you really have to listen

00:39:50   to more than a couple of sentences spoken

00:39:52   to really judge how good the quality of the voice is,

00:39:55   but I think it's still, even if it's not

00:39:57   the highest quality, it's still a really nice feature

00:40:00   for people to have who are at risk of losing their voices

00:40:02   because of like an ALS diagnosis or something like that.

00:40:06   - And of course, since we,

00:40:08   I shared this feature on Mastodon yesterday.

00:40:13   I got a, shall we say, a cluster of,

00:40:17   a type of people.

00:40:20   You guys know the type of people I'm talking about.

00:40:23   Is there a name for the extremely,

00:40:28   extremely privacy-concerned folks out there?

00:40:33   Like, the people who see a potential,

00:40:36   like the people who think some kind of

00:40:39   state-sponsored agency is after them,

00:40:42   even though they are absolutely not a high-risk individual.

00:40:47   - Right, I don't think so,

00:40:49   but I know who you're talking about.

00:40:51   - And I got a few, I got a few replies

00:40:53   and some emails from people saying,

00:40:54   oh, this feature is bad because what if,

00:40:57   now somebody told me over email,

00:41:00   I'm not gonna talk in public anymore

00:41:06   if there are iPhones and iPads in the room

00:41:09   because it means they're gonna sample my voice

00:41:12   and they're gonna make a fake version of my voice.

00:41:15   Well, first of all, good luck with that.

00:41:18   But second, I think that's actually inaccurate

00:41:23   because iOS 17 supposedly will let you

00:41:28   make you go through these prompts

00:41:32   where you gotta read a random sentence, right?

00:41:35   - Right.

00:41:36   - And what was the example in the story of a sentence,

00:41:39   John, was like--

00:41:41   - Oh, I don't remember.

00:41:42   - It was like a very specific, I'm looking it up right now.

00:41:44   So for example, one of the prompts that you gotta read

00:41:47   is grabbing a cup of coffee this afternoon sounds great.

00:41:51   And imagine like there's multiple of these phrases.

00:41:56   Actually, the screenshot says one of 150.

00:42:00   So I assume you will have to read one of a,

00:42:04   you will have to read at the very least

00:42:06   150 phrases for 15 minutes.

00:42:09   - I don't think that's accurate.

00:42:11   That, well, there was some--

00:42:12   - Well, the screenshot says one of 150.

00:42:15   - I know.

00:42:16   That question was asked during the briefings

00:42:18   and it was not clear whether it was actually 150.

00:42:21   It's like 15 minutes.

00:42:22   - But let's say that we have, I don't know, let's say 30.

00:42:26   We have 30 phrases that you need to read

00:42:29   at are totally random.

00:42:30   Like maybe another phrase will be,

00:42:33   yes, I think I will need to go out with an umbrella.

00:42:35   Somebody, if they really wanted to quote unquote,

00:42:38   steal your voice, they will need to sort of

00:42:41   social engineer you into speaking these random phrases,

00:42:46   even though they're totally disconnected from each other

00:42:48   in a public setting with their iPhone

00:42:52   out recording your voice.

00:42:54   And so, I mean, you could probably tell

00:42:57   if somebody's starting you asking questions

00:42:59   that would generate this exact phrase as a response.

00:43:03   It's impossible, right?

00:43:05   You see, it's impossible for somebody

00:43:07   to sort of find a way to clone your voice

00:43:11   without you knowing.

00:43:13   So I think that concern is kind of silly and--

00:43:16   - It is, it is with Apple.

00:43:17   I think it's a real concern potentially with other tools.

00:43:20   I mean, I think-- - It is, yes.

00:43:21   - With 11 Labs, I mean, I cloned your voice

00:43:24   and I didn't ask your permission.

00:43:25   And it did a very bad job and I did that for $5.

00:43:30   You can sign up for $5 to generate a voice.

00:43:32   You can generate up to three or four of them, I think.

00:43:34   So there are tools out there to do this

00:43:37   for very inexpensively.

00:43:40   - Voices are cheap these days.

00:43:41   - They are, they are.

00:43:42   - You gotta wonder why people pay for podcasts.

00:43:45   - Hey, we'll just have to--

00:43:46   - Hey, no, keep paying, keep paying.

00:43:48   Get connected pro.co.

00:43:51   - We'll just write scripts and have them go through the voices.

00:43:53   - Don't tell him that, John.

00:43:54   Get connected pro.co and keep paying for the show

00:43:59   if you are, thank you.

00:44:01   So yes, I don't think this can be abused

00:44:05   because of how Apple design showed how this feature

00:44:08   is gonna look like when it comes out.

00:44:11   - Yeah, I would also point out that they said

00:44:12   that this does not sync over iCloud by default

00:44:15   because they were concerned about things

00:44:17   like someone having an iPad in a household

00:44:20   that is used by other people.

00:44:21   So you can turn on end-to-end encrypted sync

00:44:25   of these voices between devices,

00:44:27   but by default, that's not enabled.

00:44:30   That's an opt-in thing.

00:44:31   - Something that I found very impressive

00:44:33   and we had a video in the story as well.

00:44:36   And John, you gotta understand, Stephen,

00:44:39   that John is so fancy these days.

00:44:41   He got the briefing and I didn't.

00:44:43   So, much J, very, very high-end,

00:44:48   fancy Apple press member.

00:44:51   The point-and-speak feature of the magnifier,

00:44:54   how does it work?

00:44:56   - It works a lot like door detection,

00:44:57   which we got last year, where if you remember,

00:45:00   you point the magnifier app at a door

00:45:03   and it will give you information about how to open it.

00:45:05   Basically, it'll tell you whether it's open or closed

00:45:07   and what kind of handle it has, that sort of thing.

00:45:10   And this is an extension of that.

00:45:11   It uses LIDAR and the camera and text recognition.

00:45:15   So you can, the demo, the video we had in the story

00:45:19   is of someone holding the magnifying app

00:45:21   up to a microwave oven and it does more

00:45:26   than just read the buttons.

00:45:27   What it does is, as you put your finger over a button,

00:45:31   it tells you what the text of the button

00:45:33   under your finger is.

00:45:34   So it's read it all in advance

00:45:37   and as you get to the start button, it'll say start.

00:45:40   And then if you move your finger down, it'll say stop.

00:45:45   It'll do that kind of thing.

00:45:47   It's really neat.

00:45:48   And it's designed to work with more than just appliances too.

00:45:51   I mean, another example that was given was,

00:45:54   someone is in an office environment

00:45:57   and is looking at a file cabinet

00:45:58   and there are labels on the file cabinet

00:46:01   saying what's in the drawers

00:46:02   and it will be able to tell them what those labels say

00:46:05   so they can find things without any assistance.

00:46:08   So it's a really cool feature.

00:46:10   - I mean, that's gotta make sense for,

00:46:11   like there's obvious potential there for a headset, right?

00:46:14   - Oh yeah, definitely.

00:46:16   - Down the road, like eventually glasses, right?

00:46:20   The idea of you look at something and it tells you,

00:46:23   in this case, like the buttons on a microwave oven,

00:46:27   like that is an incredible functionality,

00:46:31   obvious benefits for the accessibility community,

00:46:36   but just in general, like incredible tech.

00:46:39   And I think there's a lot of potential here

00:46:42   for something that you actually wear on your face

00:46:44   and it shows you information in front of your eyes,

00:46:48   as opposed to through the screen of a phone.

00:46:51   But still, the magnifier app really becoming

00:46:55   one of the most powerful and useful and life-changing,

00:47:00   I would say, apps that Apple makes.

00:47:04   Like it started as a fancy zoom button for the camera

00:47:09   and look what it's turned into.

00:47:11   So I would love to get the backstory at some point

00:47:14   of the magnifier app because it's really grown

00:47:18   into one of the most powerful things that Apple makes.

00:47:22   - Yeah, it's become kind of this crossroads

00:47:25   for both accessibility features and features

00:47:29   that maybe people who don't consider themselves

00:47:31   in needing accessibility features also can benefit from

00:47:34   because maybe they have a hard time reading a menu

00:47:38   at a restaurant in dim light and so they use the magnifier

00:47:41   and the flashlight to magnify that.

00:47:43   So it's a really interesting app in that way to me.

00:47:46   - There's something in the grab bag list of changes

00:47:51   that caught my attention and I asked John about it.

00:47:55   John, in his fanciness, didn't have unfortunately

00:48:00   any more details for me.

00:48:01   So I'll discuss this with both of you,

00:48:04   including Steven and our audience.

00:48:07   Shortcuts is adding, remember this,

00:48:10   a shortcut for users with cognitive disabilities

00:48:14   that creates a visual diary in the Notes app.

00:48:18   - My theory on this is not the Notes app,

00:48:20   it's the journaling app that they haven't launched yet.

00:48:22   - Yeah, okay, okay, okay, okay.

00:48:25   That's where I wanted to go.

00:48:26   - Ah, that's a good one.

00:48:28   - So this to me smells like that, but also an evolution

00:48:33   of the remind me about this feature that Apple added

00:48:38   to Siri in, what's that, iOS?

00:48:44   12?

00:48:45   Something like that, years ago.

00:48:48   So in Siri, you can say, hey thing, remind me about this.

00:48:53   And most of the time it should create, I know,

00:48:58   but it should create a reminder that contains a deep link

00:49:03   that takes you back to the this,

00:49:06   to the thing you're looking at.

00:49:07   So if you do remind me about this and you're in Safari

00:49:10   looking at a webpage, it'll be a link to the page.

00:49:12   If you're looking at a location in Maps,

00:49:15   it'll be a deep link to Maps.

00:49:16   It's based on the NS User Activity API,

00:49:20   the API that Apple loves to use for everything.

00:49:22   Remember this, creates a visual diary in the Notes app.

00:49:29   It sounds like an evolution of that, but I agree.

00:49:32   If they're working on a journaling app,

00:49:34   they're saying notes now because that's what they gotta do.

00:49:39   I think this will probably go in the journal thing.

00:49:41   - Yeah, I think that's a great theory.

00:49:43   I mean, I think the simple explanation

00:49:45   is that it's simply a shortcut that'll show up in Gallery

00:49:48   one day that lets you save a screenshot

00:49:50   to a particular note or a photo.

00:49:54   - I mean, you can do it today.

00:49:57   If that's all that is--

00:49:59   - No, I understand.

00:50:00   - You can build that today.

00:50:02   I mean, also a fun idea.

00:50:03   You could make a shortcut that does get what's on screen,

00:50:06   which is an action right now in iOS 16, create note, boom.

00:50:11   That's it, like you replicated that shortcut,

00:50:13   if that's the case.

00:50:15   Because right now, what you cannot do right now,

00:50:18   it could also be notes instead of the Diary app.

00:50:25   Because something that is supported in Notes today,

00:50:30   but only if you save a note in a specific way,

00:50:34   is saving deep links inside Apple Notes.

00:50:38   So native deep links to apps.

00:50:40   You can save those, but only via Quick Note.

00:50:45   Quick Note is, it lets you capture a deep link

00:50:49   to apps on screen or apps that you recently used.

00:50:53   But if you're just creating a regular note

00:50:56   without Quick Note,

00:50:57   there's no way to capture those deep links.

00:51:00   So maybe Apple is actually doing new things

00:51:03   for deep links in iOS 17.

00:51:07   - I mean, if I were to, if this were the Ricky's, Steven.

00:51:12   - Just a couple of weeks away.

00:51:16   - Because I could make a case here for,

00:51:20   this is just a sign of a bigger thing that Apple is doing.

00:51:24   In iOS 17, they're gonna let you create deep links manually

00:51:27   for whatever you want.

00:51:29   And that could become the Apple flavored way, for example,

00:51:35   to create wiki links for Apple Notes.

00:51:38   - Yep, yep, absolutely.

00:51:40   - Because you know if they're gonna do that,

00:51:41   that feature, like you may have seen it in Obsidian,

00:51:44   in Kraft, in Notion,

00:51:46   that could be a very Apple way to do it.

00:51:49   Like, oh, it's not a wiki link, it's a--

00:51:52   - It's a deep link.

00:51:52   - Magic link, whatever you wanna call it.

00:51:55   - Magic link.

00:51:55   (laughing)

00:51:57   You know?

00:51:58   - There were a couple of Mac specific things

00:52:00   in the grab bag I wanted to mention.

00:52:03   One is that made for iPhone hearing devices

00:52:06   will work with M1 and M2 Macs.

00:52:08   So these are class of hearing aids

00:52:10   that integrate nicely with iOS.

00:52:12   Perhaps the most interesting thing on the Mac

00:52:15   is adjusting text size.

00:52:18   So I assume this is dynamic type coming to macOS.

00:52:22   This has been an area of accessibility on the Mac

00:52:24   that historically has been pretty poor.

00:52:28   Their preview only shows a handful of their own apps

00:52:32   like Finder, Messages, Mail.

00:52:34   I think Calendar and Notes were in there.

00:52:37   But there's a lot of question about

00:52:38   is this going to be something system-wide?

00:52:40   Because as many ways to do text in an app on iOS as there are

00:52:45   on the Mac, there's even more.

00:52:47   And we've all been in a situation where like

00:52:51   you wanna use dynamic text

00:52:53   or you wanna help somebody set it up

00:52:54   and like the one app they really needed in,

00:52:56   it doesn't support it very well.

00:52:58   Or it's like very clearly broken,

00:52:59   they didn't really test it.

00:53:01   And so I'm curious how Apple will do this on the Mac.

00:53:04   Is it going to be something that gets added to,

00:53:07   I mean, a bunch of these apps they listed are AppKit,

00:53:10   but Messages is not.

00:53:12   Messages is Mac Catalyst.

00:53:15   So like, is this coming to both AppKit and Catalyst

00:53:18   and to SwiftUI?

00:53:19   And if you use some sort of web thing, you're on your own.

00:53:22   I just wanna know how this is going to work

00:53:25   because if you have only a handful of Mac apps support this,

00:53:29   then it's gonna be frustrating for people who want to use it

00:53:33   or need to rely on it.

00:53:35   - There is also a new voiceover feature

00:53:38   where it'll sound, the Siri voices will sound more natural

00:53:42   when they're played back anywhere from 0.8X to 2X.

00:53:46   And while these are Siri voices and not human voices,

00:53:50   I do wonder whether that is tied to technology

00:53:53   that might be coming to something like Apple Podcasts

00:53:56   with an overcast style smart speed feature

00:53:59   for the Apple Podcasts app,

00:54:01   because now we've got that in voice memos already,

00:54:05   and now we're seeing it crop up in voiceover

00:54:08   with the Siri voices.

00:54:09   It's not a real stretch to imagine that coming

00:54:13   to another app like Podcasts as well.

00:54:15   - I really think they're gonna do it this year.

00:54:17   Like I would be shocked if Podcasts does not get

00:54:21   the equivalent of a smart speed or trim silence,

00:54:25   whatever you wanna call it, if it doesn't get it this year.

00:54:28   And you know that, again, the Apple-flavored way

00:54:32   to do something that's sort of become something

00:54:35   that you expect in third-party apps,

00:54:37   but Apple comes out and says, "We have this,

00:54:39   "but we've done it in a unique way."

00:54:41   - Magic Podcasts. - You know if they're gonna

00:54:42   do Magic Voices, Magic Voices, Magic Voice.

00:54:46   Hey, every podcast has a magic voice

00:54:49   if you really like the show.

00:54:51   You know, that's a nice way to think about it.

00:54:54   But if they're gonna do it, they're gonna say,

00:54:57   "Oh, this is all done by the neural engine on device."

00:55:00   And we analyze the voices and we make 'em sound even better

00:55:05   so that you can enjoy your favorite shows even more

00:55:09   thanks to the power of the neural engine

00:55:11   and it's all done on device as you listen to podcasts.

00:55:15   They don't even need to be downloaded,

00:55:16   like something like that.

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00:57:08   - Hey, before we talk about this thing

00:57:10   you put in the notes, Steven,

00:57:11   this is not in the notes,

00:57:14   but I have a couple of things I wanna share.

00:57:17   And the first one is a confession.

00:57:19   - Uh-oh. - Ooh.

00:57:20   - I like stage manager now.

00:57:22   - Ah. - On the Mac.

00:57:25   - There you go.

00:57:26   (laughing)

00:57:27   I felt that one coming.

00:57:29   - This all started because John was making a case.

00:57:33   So you were saying before the show, Steven,

00:57:36   that John and I have a kind of like a toxic relationship

00:57:39   and in a way we kind of do,

00:57:41   but it's the good toxic, it's not the bad one.

00:57:45   It's that sort of relationship where like John tells me,

00:57:49   "Hey, you should check this out."

00:57:50   And I spend a bunch of money and I do.

00:57:52   And sometimes I like it and other times I don't.

00:57:54   And then there's me making John jealous of something.

00:57:58   And it's like, "Oh, I gotta check out the thing

00:58:00   that Federico does."

00:58:01   And John spends a bunch of money

00:58:02   or spends a bunch of time doing something

00:58:05   and maybe likes it or not.

00:58:06   It's like this constant push and pull of what we do.

00:58:11   In any case, the latest example of this being

00:58:14   John telling me a few days ago,

00:58:17   "Hey, you should really try stage manager on the Mac."

00:58:19   And I gotta tell you, it's been a bit of a shock initially.

00:58:24   And there's plenty of things that I would change,

00:58:27   but I just had a moment as we were recording this

00:58:31   when it did something that made sense.

00:58:35   And I was like, "You know, that's actually kind of nice."

00:58:39   I don't know.

00:58:41   I feel like it makes a lot more sense on the Mac than iPadOS

00:58:46   where you don't have the limitations

00:58:49   of four windows per workspace.

00:58:51   You have the total control over the resizing.

00:58:55   It's like that great combination of the multitasking

00:58:59   and multi-windowing you already know and love,

00:59:01   but with this little sort of guard rails around it,

00:59:05   with this little structure around it,

00:59:08   that even though it's not perfect,

00:59:10   I feel like it's a much better pill to swallow

00:59:15   than stage manager on iPadOS.

00:59:17   - Yeah, I figured it would appeal

00:59:21   to your organizational side.

00:59:23   - Yes, that's exactly what I'm liking about it

00:59:26   because I like to organize things.

00:59:30   It makes me feel good to organize things,

00:59:33   both digitally and in the physical realm.

00:59:38   But yes, yeah.

00:59:40   Steven, do you use it?

00:59:44   - No, I gave it a shot early on and I haven't revisited it.

00:59:48   So, you know, I've got, what am I using?

00:59:51   I think I'm using magnet right now

00:59:52   as my window management thing

00:59:55   'cause I like the keyboard shortcuts it has,

00:59:57   but I don't know.

00:59:59   Maybe I need to give it another shot.

01:00:02   - Yeah, I mean, it's like Federico said,

01:00:05   it really does need a lot of work.

01:00:06   I mean, it's very frustrating that it's so mechanical

01:00:10   to have to set up your stages in the first place.

01:00:13   Especially if you're working in just a handful of apps

01:00:17   for a long period of time, it's pretty nice then.

01:00:20   And you know, it needs shortcut support,

01:00:22   it needs keyboard shortcuts, it needs a lot of stuff,

01:00:25   but it's not nearly-- - It needs a lot.

01:00:27   It needs a lot. - Yeah.

01:00:28   It's just not as frustrating though

01:00:30   as it is on the iPad.

01:00:31   On the iPad, I feel like I have handcuffs on,

01:00:34   especially as soon as I try to use an external display.

01:00:37   With the Mac, it's an annoyance,

01:00:39   but it's also, there's a benefit to it too.

01:00:42   'Cause I've been using it full-time really

01:00:44   since the betas last summer.

01:00:46   - I think part of it, I just turned it on,

01:00:48   and the immediate thing I hate is all the animation.

01:00:52   - Yes. - So how I use my Mac,

01:00:54   like things overlap a lot.

01:00:57   And I do have, I run Quitter by our friend Marco,

01:01:01   and it will hide apps.

01:01:03   I don't have it quit apps, but I have it hide apps

01:01:05   that are in the background over time.

01:01:07   So over time, things slowly go away, some things,

01:01:12   but all the zooming in and out and going back and forth,

01:01:17   I just don't need.

01:01:19   - Yeah, I feel like they need to calm down

01:01:21   with these animations, like we get it.

01:01:23   You're Apple, you're capable of making

01:01:25   these beautiful animations. (laughing)

01:01:26   And I'm sure, I get it.

01:01:29   You wanna be proud of those, and look, we all are.

01:01:31   We think you do a great job,

01:01:33   but like, it's fine, like make it, you know.

01:01:36   Maybe these animations, maybe, I don't know,

01:01:40   maybe an idea for power users could be that maybe

01:01:44   animations, they're like people, they age over time,

01:01:48   and over time you stop seeing them,

01:01:50   because like those animations are not as young

01:01:53   as they used to be.

01:01:54   When you first started using stage managers,

01:01:56   maybe like a year into using a particular feature,

01:02:01   you don't see the animations anymore, because they aged,

01:02:05   and now you don't need to see it.

01:02:06   In any case, they need to calm down with the animations.

01:02:09   You gotta be able to label the workspaces

01:02:12   in the strip on the left.

01:02:14   You gotta be able to make like fixed presets

01:02:17   for here's my podcasting workspace, and there should be--

01:02:21   - And you can do that with spaces to a degree.

01:02:23   - You can, yes. - You can say,

01:02:25   always open this app in this space,

01:02:27   even this space on this display.

01:02:30   And yeah, I would like all of those things to be true,

01:02:33   but the biggest one is the animation,

01:02:35   especially on a studio display, right?

01:02:37   It's like a giant chrome window came swinging back in.

01:02:40   It's like, okay.

01:02:41   - It's a lot, it's a lot of swooshing and swooping

01:02:46   all around the place.

01:02:47   Okay.

01:02:48   - It's a very swoopy UI, for sure.

01:02:50   - Yes, it's like, okay, here we go again.

01:02:54   It's animating, it's coming into view.

01:02:57   It just happened to me.

01:02:58   But there's, I feel like there's a lot more

01:03:03   to potentially salvage here than iPadOS.

01:03:08   With, if I guess Apple has chosen,

01:03:13   because by this time, you know, Mac OS 14,

01:03:19   as I've decided to call it, Mac OS Skyline,

01:03:22   I'm convinced that will be the name.

01:03:24   I don't have any insider information.

01:03:27   There is no such thing as a t.g. tip line.

01:03:30   I also don't want it.

01:03:32   It feels like too much pressure in my life.

01:03:35   - Is Skyline a place in California?

01:03:37   - That's what I asked him.

01:03:37   - Well, it's a registered trademark.

01:03:40   - Oh, oh, it's a neighborhood in San Diego, it looks like.

01:03:43   - There you go.

01:03:44   I am convinced.

01:03:47   I don't have any insider information.

01:03:49   Mac OS Skyline.

01:03:50   - I like the sound of it.

01:03:51   - Oh yes, by this time, things are locked.

01:03:54   - Yeah, they're done, right?

01:03:56   They're done, they're done.

01:03:57   They're probably already using beta two

01:03:59   of whatever they're building.

01:04:02   But if Apple decided to put in the work,

01:04:05   I think there's plenty they could do

01:04:06   with stage manager on the Mac.

01:04:08   There's a lot they should do with stage manager on iPadOS,

01:04:12   but I'm liking the organization.

01:04:14   And just a few minutes ago, I was clicking a link

01:04:19   and it took me briefly into another workspace.

01:04:22   And then when I was done,

01:04:23   it took me back into my previous workspace.

01:04:26   And yes, I could use fewer animations.

01:04:28   I could use some general speed up of the whole thing,

01:04:33   but it's nicer than iPadOS.

01:04:37   And the second thing, I told you I had two things.

01:04:40   It's more like an open-ended question for people.

01:04:44   I'm just wondering what everybody's using

01:04:46   as a notebook for "Zelda Tears of the Kingdom."

01:04:49   Like, is the connected,

01:04:53   are the passionate ones using Apple Notes, Obsidian,

01:04:56   dedicated apps to keep notes for "Tears of the Kingdom?"

01:05:00   Stephen, I'm familiar.

01:05:01   I'm assuming you are familiar

01:05:03   with what "Tears of the Kingdom" is.

01:05:05   - Yes, but I don't know why you need a notebook for it.

01:05:08   - Oh, there's so much information.

01:05:09   - Wow. Oh, Bob.

01:05:11   Oh, Stephen.

01:05:12   Yes, for these games like "Elden Ring,"

01:05:16   do you know what "Elden Ring" is?

01:05:17   - Yes.

01:05:18   - Okay.

01:05:19   - These massive games that have tons of side quests

01:05:23   and collectible items and things you gotta do,

01:05:26   you gotta keep a note, like a little note.

01:05:29   You gotta do something.

01:05:31   In fact, Steam on PC

01:05:35   is getting like a native note-taking feature,

01:05:38   which is genius. - Oh, I didn't know that.

01:05:40   - Yeah, they're getting, like in the Steam overlay,

01:05:43   they're adding like a built-in note-taking thing,

01:05:47   which is genius because like that notepad will sync

01:05:50   across all of your devices,

01:05:52   including eventually on the Steam Deck.

01:05:54   So if you're playing something on PC

01:05:56   and you take a note and later on the Steam Deck,

01:05:57   you find the same note.

01:05:59   But "Zelda" is on Nintendo Switch, of course.

01:06:01   And right now I'm using Apple Notes

01:06:04   just because it allows me very quickly

01:06:07   to either put down a link or some text or a screenshot

01:06:10   of what I'm doing in the game.

01:06:12   But I'm sure that people have other systems for this.

01:06:15   And so if you're playing "Zelda"

01:06:17   and you're taking notes about "Zelda"

01:06:19   and you think you have a good system for taking your notes

01:06:21   and saving locations on the map or whatever, let me know.

01:06:26   Because yeah, I'm looking for that sort of a solution.

01:06:31   - I got nothing for you, Tichi.

01:06:32   Other than-- - I know you've done nothing

01:06:34   because you've just been wandering around.

01:06:35   You haven't done anything in this game.

01:06:37   - I wandered out into the mountains

01:06:39   and didn't even play the game.

01:06:40   I just wandered the countryside,

01:06:43   fighting people and using up all my resources.

01:06:45   But yeah, yeah, that's me.

01:06:48   - Before we go, I wanted to talk to y'all about a story.

01:06:52   It was linked on Mac Stories a while ago,

01:06:54   and now it's sort of available to everybody

01:06:56   where with Phone Link, which is an app for Microsoft,

01:07:00   you can use iMessage from a PC.

01:07:05   I think y'all have been playing with this,

01:07:07   and I'm curious how it works and how it's working out.

01:07:12   - There's a lot of limitations in this feature.

01:07:14   I've been using it for a while.

01:07:17   It is convenient.

01:07:19   I'll give you that.

01:07:20   It's better to have it than to not have it, for sure.

01:07:24   It's useful if you're on PC and you have a paired iPhone.

01:07:29   And so for example, when I got a message from John,

01:07:31   if I happen to be playing a game on my PC,

01:07:34   I get a notification with that message from John

01:07:37   so that I just don't have to grab my phone

01:07:41   and use the messages app there.

01:07:43   I can just see the notification from my PC

01:07:45   and reply from there.

01:07:47   However, that only works for one-to-one

01:07:52   message conversations.

01:07:54   Like it doesn't support iMessage threads at all.

01:07:57   It doesn't support groups.

01:07:59   So you can only reply.

01:08:00   It's basically like, it's a glorified version

01:08:05   of car Bluetooth integration.

01:08:08   It pulls all of your contacts, notifications,

01:08:12   sort of like old school Bluetooth cars could do.

01:08:17   Not CarPlay.

01:08:18   I'm not talking about CarPlay.

01:08:19   - It's the same thing that lets you get

01:08:20   message notifications on Fitbit and stuff too, I think.

01:08:25   - Yes, yes.

01:08:26   It's basically that system, but on a PC

01:08:29   with a nicer UI around it

01:08:32   than you probably could have found on a Fitbit.

01:08:34   You have an app and you have two tabs

01:08:38   for notifications and messages.

01:08:40   You can see other notifications from apps.

01:08:42   Of course you cannot interact with them.

01:08:45   I believe they do not get marked as read.

01:08:49   So later you're still gonna find your notifications

01:08:51   that you've already seen on PC.

01:08:53   You're gonna find those on the iPhone,

01:08:56   but still given the limitations, it's nice to have.

01:09:00   And yeah, I think it's a clever workaround for,

01:09:06   and I don't think we're gonna get any more than this.

01:09:08   I don't think Apple,

01:09:09   I don't think it's in Apple's top priority list to say,

01:09:13   oh, we need to have better support for Windows 11 computers

01:09:17   for messages and notifications.

01:09:19   So given the Bluetooth nature of it all, it's pretty okay.

01:09:23   It's all right.

01:09:24   It's a nice way to get notifications

01:09:26   and to reply to the occasional message from your Windows PC.

01:09:30   - So it doesn't sound like it's gonna let people

01:09:33   get the full iMessage experience.

01:09:35   - No, absolutely not.

01:09:36   No, no, no, no.

01:09:38   - It's more of a gap filler, it sounds like,

01:09:40   really like, as you said, Federico,

01:09:42   when you happen to be on your PC

01:09:43   and maybe your phone's not around

01:09:45   or you don't wanna grab your phone,

01:09:46   you can fire off a quick message.

01:09:48   - Something funny that it does,

01:09:50   I guess because of security concerns,

01:09:53   if you send, so if I'm on PC and via this app,

01:09:58   I send a URL to John, correct me if I'm wrong, John,

01:10:04   but I believe that by default,

01:10:06   that URL does not expand into a rich link.

01:10:10   You gotta say tap preview.

01:10:13   - That's why I've been getting those.

01:10:14   All right, now I understand, yeah.

01:10:17   I think you're right because I've noticed that with you

01:10:20   that sometimes I get those and they don't expand out.

01:10:22   It'll just be like the--

01:10:24   - Tap to preview, it says tap to preview, I think.

01:10:28   Or they do not get a preview at all.

01:10:30   But yeah, they kinda work, but not as they would normally

01:10:35   work with iMessage to iMessage from an Apple device, yeah.

01:10:40   - It always brings up conversations of iMessage on Android

01:10:42   and I think we all just kind of understand

01:10:44   that Apple's not gonna do that, right?

01:10:48   - But why would they, why would they, right?

01:10:50   - The iMessage is a huge lock-in factor for their ecosystem.

01:10:52   - Exactly, like even beyond the security concerns

01:10:57   of using RCS or whatever Google is asking about,

01:11:01   even beyond that, so setting those concerns aside

01:11:04   for a minute, from a pure business perspective,

01:11:06   why would you, when it's become the thing

01:11:10   to be a blue bubble in iMessage conversations,

01:11:14   it's such a huge lock-in effect,

01:11:17   much more so than iCloud or Apple Music.

01:11:22   None of those services matter anymore

01:11:25   for the lock-in effect.

01:11:26   It's all about iMessage.

01:11:28   And so why would you give that up?

01:11:30   - Yep, not until you're forced to, I guess, right?

01:11:32   I mean, that's really what it comes down to.

01:11:35   - Yes, yeah, yeah.

01:11:37   - Cool, well, that about does it for this week.

01:11:39   Before we let you go, a reminder that we are

01:11:41   in annual specials season here at Relay FM,

01:11:45   where a bunch of our shows publish into the crossover feed

01:11:48   that all of our members have access to.

01:11:51   The connected special is up there and genius is there.

01:11:53   I think the pen addict is this week,

01:11:56   a bunch of good stuff coming.

01:11:57   So if you are a member, be sure to check that out.

01:12:00   And if you're not, now is a great time to join.

01:12:03   Connected Pro is a longer ad-free version of the show

01:12:06   each and every week.

01:12:07   It's just five bucks a month or $50 a year.

01:12:09   We'd love to have you join.

01:12:11   Mike is gone, so we don't care, you know,

01:12:13   where you can find him on the internet.

01:12:15   But if you wanna follow Federico,

01:12:16   he's the editor-in-chief of maxstories.net.

01:12:19   And he is on mastodon.maxstories.net as Vitici.

01:12:24   You can find me at 512pixels.net

01:12:27   and I'm on Mac Power Users every Sunday here on Relay FM.

01:12:31   John, where can people find you?

01:12:33   - Well, you can always find me, of course,

01:12:34   at maxstories.net and on Mastodon,

01:12:37   I'm John Voorhees, my full name.

01:12:40   - Awesome.

01:12:41   I'd like to thank our sponsors this week.

01:12:42   They are Fitbaud, Electric and NetSuite.

01:12:45   And until next time, guys, say goodbye.

01:12:48   - Arrivederci.

01:12:48   - See you later.