00:00:12 ◼ ► It's made possible this week by our sponsors, NetSuite, Squarespace, and 1Password Extended Access Management.
00:00:19 ◼ ► I am your Keynote Chairman, Steven Hackett, and I'm joined by our Annual Chairman, Mr. Mike Hurley.
00:00:25 ◼ ► Hello, I am Annual Chairman Mike Hurley and I'm joined by Federico Vittucci. Ciao Federico!
00:00:36 ◼ ► So thank you, thank you. I wasn't here and I just want to let the people know that I have no idea what you did last week.
00:00:55 ◼ ► And I have not. I just saw the title, the Tichy Olympics. I have no idea what it's about. Literally no clue.
00:01:41 ◼ ► We could create a space-time rift if you listen. And so we have to be really careful about that.
00:01:53 ◼ ► It was. It was. It was. I was interested to have Jon on the show. Did you know Jon was on the show?
00:02:17 ◼ ► So we're off next week because we're going to be live in London. We look forward to seeing
00:02:24 ◼ ► everybody at the Hackney Empire who's coming out. So we're going to be doing a live show,
00:02:28 ◼ ► which I'm very excited about. It's going to be a good time by all and we're very excited.
00:02:39 ◼ ► It depends on the way that you look at it. But I'm excited. Everyone's coming into town now.
00:02:45 ◼ ► People are starting to arrive. And I'm really, really, really looking forward to our show at
00:02:57 ◼ ► So I've already spoken with the guys, obviously. I don't want to get into details. Everything's
00:03:06 ◼ ► fine. Just not really a good time of year for me to leave. And we're good. Obviously, I'm
00:03:16 ◼ ► going to miss a lot being there. And I know that it's an incredible milestone for Relay.
00:03:23 ◼ ► Doesn't feel like 10 years. At the same time, it feels like forever, which usually it's a
00:03:43 ◼ ► your life with everybody coming in. So yeah, I just felt like I needed to share just in
00:03:52 ◼ ► The tichy fans. The tichy fans are going to be out there. Yeah, it's a shame. It's understood.
00:04:00 ◼ ► But disappointing, but you're not disappointing. You know what I mean? We all wanted to be
00:04:05 ◼ ► there together, but unfortunately, life finds its own ways sometimes. And they're not necessarily
00:04:12 ◼ ► the ways that you want them to find. That's the full quote. That's the full quote. It's
00:04:20 ◼ ► Yeah. We had some follow-ups. We had a lot of follow-ups that we can't talk about because
00:04:28 ◼ ► Federico's here. I didn't really anticipate that being a problem. So if you sent feedback
00:04:34 ◼ ► about what we did last week, thank you. I read it all. I'm sorry. But we did have someone
00:04:48 ◼ ► Federico. I'm going to read this Federico. Know that it's coming from our listener, not
00:04:54 ◼ ► for me, because it's a little antagonistic. I think I keep hearing Federico ignore this
00:04:59 ◼ ► point about Apple bot crawling content, robbing the shop. I'm not ignoring it. Without ever
00:05:07 ◼ ► pointing this out. If robot instructions don't mention Apple bot, but mention Google bot,
00:05:12 ◼ ► the Apple robot will follow Google bots instructions. This is an important distinction.
00:05:23 ◼ ► I don't think it's an important distinction. And I think this person was probably playing,
00:05:31 ◼ ► ah, gotcha. No. Because first of all, even Google bot extended is a relatively new addition to web
00:05:43 ◼ ► Google AI answers are something that are still rolling out, literally. It's like a feature that
00:05:49 ◼ ► is launching now. So forgive me if I have not implemented the Google bot extended blocking.
00:05:56 ◼ ► Obviously I do not want to block Google bot. So the, I'll tell you what's the important distinction.
00:06:03 ◼ ► The important distinction is recognizing that I don't want to block Google bots because I still
00:06:09 ◼ ► want my website to be indexed on search engines. Yeah. And Apple bot is also something that people
00:06:16 ◼ ► want. Exactly. Exactly. Because I do want Mac stories to show up in spotlight. For example,
00:06:20 ◼ ► if you are a suggested website that's made possible by Apple bot, but more importantly,
00:06:26 ◼ ► why is it exactly like I failed to understand this point? Why is it that I should be okay with Apple
00:06:35 ◼ ► doing what Google does? Like this, this part does not compute with me. And I feel like it's quite,
00:06:43 ◼ ► um, ironic that we spend, you know, in the Apple community, a lot of people hold the Apple to a
00:06:49 ◼ ► higher standard, but in this case, the argument would be, oh no, but they do what Google does.
00:06:54 ◼ ► Therefore it's okay. I thought we were expecting better from Apple. Are we not? Um, so yeah,
00:07:00 ◼ ► I disagree. Or different at least. I mean, I don't think, I mean, again, we will probably keep
00:07:06 ◼ ► mentioning this for a while. We were not expecting Apple to do things the way they did them. Yeah.
00:07:12 ◼ ► And also I would just mention like, just as a general, like rule of thumb with feedback,
00:07:23 ◼ ► Like not everything needs to be explicitly drawn out every single time. Like, yes, this is an
00:07:30 ◼ ► interesting distinction that if you don't mention Apple bot, but have restrictions around Google
00:07:36 ◼ ► bot, then Apple will follow them. Okay, great. But that doesn't change the fact of what's happening
00:07:42 ◼ ► here. They're still doing. The situation was that Apple, like, cause let's imagine Google,
00:07:48 ◼ ► that Federico did know about Google bot extended, right? And he could have made a decision about
00:07:54 ◼ ► Google bot extended. Apple bot extended didn't exist until after it had already crawled. Right.
00:08:00 ◼ ► So they didn't, the situation's not different. Apple did not give a choice and just follow
00:08:08 ◼ ► Google is not necessarily the way to do things. And like, it doesn't, it didn't, it didn't give
00:08:13 ◼ ► people a choice. There is a scenario in which someone could say, I want Google to do this,
00:08:24 ◼ ► if I'm ever going to make any money out of this, Google's probably going to be the one to work it
00:08:29 ◼ ► out. Like if, if publish it, there's like a history that if publishers are ever going to make money,
00:08:36 ◼ ► Google is the company who has a history of that being the case. I don't think that's going to be
00:08:42 ◼ ► the case going into the future, but if you were to take the optimistic take, right? Like if you
00:08:48 ◼ ► look at what Google pay, like what, you know, like Google sending traffic to people or YouTube paying
00:08:56 ◼ ► creators, like all of those scenarios tend to be better off for the creator. I still don't believe
00:09:04 ◼ ► that any of these things will have a better off for a creator, but that could be a decision I can
00:09:08 ◼ ► imagine someone making. Apple's never going to give creators any money ever for anything.
00:09:14 ◼ ► So that could be a decision somebody would make and just Apple being like, we'll just follow the
00:09:19 ◼ ► Google rule is not, it's not an, uh, it's not a wholly acceptable way of doing things. That's just
00:09:27 ◼ ► what they decided to do, but it doesn't mean that every publisher, like they were given no agency
00:09:48 ◼ ► I, uh, what do you want to know? What do you think of it? Does it work? It does. What did you get
00:09:55 ◼ ► and how does it, how does it work? Yeah. So I got the aquara aquara, a car, a car, a car, a car,
00:10:04 ◼ ► you 200 smart lock. So this is there as of this according their newest smart lock. It works with
00:10:21 ◼ ► uh, support or mechanism with an iOS and watch us where it basically puts a card and wallet.
00:10:27 ◼ ► And when you bring your device near the lock, it senses it and then unlocks it, which is pretty
00:10:32 ◼ ► cool. Yeah. This is, this is like the, it was, it's called, what is it called? Home home key feature.
00:10:39 ◼ ► I think. Okay. Cause I have car key for cars. Home key thought imagine such a world, the naming
00:10:45 ◼ ► incredible. Uh, but that's the key feature of these things, right? Is that you can just
00:10:51 ◼ ► walk up to them. And then I don't think this lock is getting it, but like the next version of this
00:10:57 ◼ ► is using ultra wide band. So you just walk up to the lock and it will open. Right. So ultra wide
00:11:02 ◼ ► band is support for smart locks is coming in iOS 18 and watch us 11. And that will obviously require
00:11:10 ◼ ► different hardware and I'm sure a car and others will, will move on that. And that is interesting,
00:11:16 ◼ ► but this seems like something that is maybe a little bit better fit for me. Um, because my,
00:11:31 ◼ ► like intentionality about unlocking. And I just wasn't sure about like, how close do you have to
00:11:36 ◼ ► be for the ultra wide band? Does it sense that you're moving towards it? I think the thing about
00:11:47 ◼ ► Yeah. There's a distance, but like ultra wide band would know you were walking towards the door.
00:11:52 ◼ ► Maybe so. So, but nevertheless, this is, this is a fantastic system because you don't have to do
00:11:59 ◼ ► like open the app, unlock the lock or whatever. Oh yeah. And Bluetooth wouldn't work for you for,
00:12:05 ◼ ► because you're so close all the time. Right. And it has a fingerprint. So, so you have the lock
00:12:12 ◼ ► mechanism that goes on the inside of the door and it works with the lock that's already there. So
00:12:16 ◼ ► it's like turning the dead bolt in my case on my very American door. And it has a keypad that's
00:12:23 ◼ ► weatherproofs and go outside. It has a keypad on it. So you can, you can use a key, a pin code to
00:12:28 ◼ ► get in, uh, in the car app, you can set a temporary pin. So it's like, if you know, if it's an Airbnb
00:12:34 ◼ ► situation or you're letting your dog sit her in or something, you can give them a pin code. It's only
00:12:39 ◼ ► good for a set amount of time, but it also has a fingerprint sensor on it. So I can also walk up to
00:12:45 ◼ ► it and touch it. You know, I think I registered both my thumbs and both my index fingers and I can
00:12:50 ◼ ► touch it and it will, it will unlock. And, uh, the installation wasn't too bad. I've got pictures and
00:12:56 ◼ ► stuff on, on the blog post. I will say, and this is true for a car really across the board. Their
00:13:02 ◼ ► documentation is pretty bad. And, uh, I don't know what that's about. I have some theories.
00:13:15 ◼ ► It's not like it's, it's, this is a totally fine thing, but like, I don't know how much of a
00:13:20 ◼ ► presence, I don't really think they have much of a presence outside of China, but they sell worldwide.
00:13:25 ◼ ► Yeah. And I think that they're not putting the work into localization. I mean, you can see it
00:13:31 ◼ ► throughout the app. The app is just like weird, it weirdly words things, but it's fine. Um,
00:13:37 ◼ ► one of the things I do like about a car is a lot of their products you can use without ever touching
00:13:42 ◼ ► the car app, but you may just lose some features because of that. Yeah. And there, there was a
00:13:48 ◼ ► thing, the initial version of the blog post, I had something that was incorrect. So I had to go back
00:13:52 ◼ ► and edit it. Um, after a couple of friends pointed it out where this thing will work with matter.
00:13:58 ◼ ► And I don't have any matter stuff enabled on my network. And in the setup flow for the lock in the
00:14:05 ◼ ► Akara app, it's like, Oh, if you want to use matter, you have to upgrade to the new hub,
00:14:09 ◼ ► which is the M three is there. Their current hub, the sports matter, but turns out that's not true.
00:14:15 ◼ ► You can enable matter with a firmware update on the M two hub, which is the one that I happen to
00:14:20 ◼ ► have. And, um, I ended up not doing that yet because when you enable matter, basically you're
00:14:27 ◼ ► going to have duplicates of everything and home kit. You have like the standard to do it for this
00:14:31 ◼ ► stuff. And I don't need to do it. So yeah, that for this particular product, like it, it gives
00:14:36 ◼ ► you no benefit, right? Like only if you were tying, like if you, you know, if you had a home
00:14:42 ◼ ► alarm system, like let's imagine that ring actually do what they promised and support home kit, which
00:14:47 ◼ ► I don't think they're ever going to do as a matter. Sorry. I don't think they're ever going to do it,
00:14:51 ◼ ► but if they had done that and you had like a ring alarm system, right. You could like tie these
00:14:55 ◼ ► things together somehow. So I do have a system and the way I do that is home bridge, which
00:15:01 ◼ ► explodes every six months, but that is more. Yes. But that means you don't need matter, right?
00:15:06 ◼ ► Cause you can, you can just rebuild home bridge. Yeah. You know, it's like, it's like changing the
00:15:13 ◼ ► batteries in the smoke alarm. You know, you do that and you rebuild home bridge and, and you're,
00:15:18 ◼ ► you're good to go. This is exactly why I have no interest in those. Oh yeah. It can be, it can be
00:15:23 ◼ ► really frustrating. But this it's pretty great. I mean, the home key thing's awesome. And I have it
00:15:29 ◼ ► set up on the, you can see in the picture, I have it set up on the doorframe because I have the
00:15:33 ◼ ► regular door and then I have a storm door with like a, like a screen on it. And when it's nice
00:15:37 ◼ ► outside, I leave the regular door open and the screened open so I can like get fresh air and like
00:15:42 ◼ ► hear the kids in the backyard or whatever. And so I have it in between those and I can just walk up
00:15:48 ◼ ► and I do with my watch and just like put my wrist up to it. It unlocks and I've really enjoyed it so
00:15:55 ◼ ► far. And of course you can do interesting automation stuff based on your locks. And I've done,
00:15:59 ◼ ► I've, I've tinkered around the edges of that. I feel like it's easy when you're automating things
00:16:04 ◼ ► with locks to like get yourself in a situation that's probably not the best safety wise. Yeah.
00:16:08 ◼ ► So so I've, I've had fiddle with that a little bit, but it is it's pretty great. And I mean,
00:16:16 ◼ ► like the other car stuff, I've got a bunch of their water sensors, like under the sinks and I
00:16:22 ◼ ► have one in the pan for my hot water heater. And I have a couple of their, they have these, like,
00:16:26 ◼ ► they don't sell them anymore. I don't know what happened, but they have these buttons and basically
00:16:31 ◼ ► you can just use them as home kit triggers. So I have two of those. I do have one of those. Yeah,
00:16:37 ◼ ► they're great. Um, the Acara mini button something. Yeah. And I've got two on our fridge and one opens
00:16:45 ◼ ► and closes the garage door and the other turns on a lighting scene that basically turns on the lights
00:16:51 ◼ ► across the front of the house. So you can just hit the button and, um, all their hardware is great.
00:16:57 ◼ ► It's really the localization and some of the directions where things, uh, things fall down
00:17:02 ◼ ► a little bit. And this lock is currently 20% off for prime day. Oh, nice. Yeah. Uh, I want to,
00:17:09 ◼ ► like, while we're talking about this, I give like a massive recommendation for the, the doorbell,
00:17:13 ◼ ► the G4 smart video doorbell. Uh, I have one and I love it. And what makes it so good compared to
00:17:21 ◼ ► other products is it is home kit and it is wireless. Like it's powered by batteries. Yeah. So it was.
00:17:28 ◼ ► Yeah. Yeah. Nice. Which is there's nothing else. It's the only product that does this. Yeah. And
00:17:34 ◼ ► the way that they do that is the chime that you have inside is actually what's connecting to home
00:17:40 ◼ ► kit. And then it is then creating a connection between itself and the camera. That's cool.
00:17:48 ◼ ► Like section. So it's very clever the way that it's doing it. They make a lot of products that
00:17:53 ◼ ► no one else kind of does. Like, uh, I was interested in like w water sensors for a while.
00:17:59 ◼ ► And, uh, at least at the time, they were really the only company making them that worked with
00:18:03 ◼ ► home kit. And the way they do that with home kit is super smart. They basically act like an alarm
00:18:09 ◼ ► system in home kit. It's like, if one of those gets tripped, my phone is going to go nuts. And
00:18:13 ◼ ► that's exactly what I want it to do. If there's water in a cabinet under a sink, interrupt my
00:18:18 ◼ ► podcast recording to tell me that, you know? Um, so I have one of those. Yeah. Yeah. They're great.
00:18:24 ◼ ► My irrigation system. And I think it's very clever how they use the, uh, the critical notifications
00:18:32 ◼ ► of IUS so that even if you are in a focus mode or you have like your notification silence, like it's
00:18:38 ◼ ► always gonna make a noise and a loud one at that. It makes me sleep better, honestly. Yeah. They
00:18:48 ◼ ► And I have a couple of the cameras too. They have a camera that you can make look like a cat.
00:18:55 ◼ ► Um, it comes in the box. Little cat ears. I'm realizing now that I have a lot of Acara products
00:19:01 ◼ ► because they make such good stuff. Like their products are really, really good. And this,
00:19:06 ◼ ► the camera, I don't remember which one it is, but I'll put, I'll put it in the show notes.
00:19:14 ◼ ► You can have a connects as a hub and then you can connect other things to that. And again,
00:19:19 ◼ ► it's like you can, it's the hub G3 camera hub G3 is the product I'm talking about. Like you can
00:19:25 ◼ ► just use it in home kit and you can use it as a camera. But then if you go into the Acara app,
00:19:29 ◼ ► you can change what the, like, you can move the camera around up and down and turn it around.
00:19:48 ◼ ► the door sensors I have a like tied to the alarm system that we use, but it's good stuff.
00:19:54 ◼ ► I've got, I got one door. I mean, all my doors are like that, but I got one door in particular
00:19:58 ◼ ► that would be very handy to know its status. Cause you can't really see it easily. Uh, and it's $14
00:20:12 ◼ ► Oh, that's clever. So, you know, if the fridge door is like stuck open, if the fridge is open.
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00:22:04 ◼ ► Vision Pro is available worldwide now, which is well, not what, thank you. Uh, not completely
00:22:12 ◼ ► worldwide, but more countries. They have it in a lot of Asian and European countries. It's in
00:22:17 ◼ ► Canada too. Um, and a couple of people wrote in about this, Jonathan, including them with like
00:22:25 ◼ ► pointing out, it is interesting in all of the newsroom pieces that they've done. They show,
00:22:30 ◼ ► uh, the dual loop band instead of the solo loop band. Yeah. And yeah, I've read a report. I don't
00:22:37 ◼ ► remember where this came from now. It might've been from Mark Gurman actually that that has just
00:22:41 ◼ ► become a directive. Like Apple's kind of refreshed the way they're doing in store stuff and the dual
00:22:46 ◼ ► loop band is, is one of the things they've refreshed to. It is more comfortable, I think
00:22:52 ◼ ► than the solo loop. And I will also, I wanted to bring this up because I now am a solo top boy.
00:22:58 ◼ ► So I did the solo top because I could get a solo band now because they're out in the UK. So I was
00:23:05 ◼ ► waiting for them. So the solo top is where you take two of the solo loops, like the knitted one,
00:23:10 ◼ ► and you get this 3d printed adapter and you can then use two of those instead of the dual loop.
00:23:23 ◼ ► it like goes wild for it. I would say it's fine. Like it's, it's more for me, it's more comfortable
00:23:31 ◼ ► and it is more easily adjustable, but it is not as big an improvement improvement for me as I
00:23:37 ◼ ► expected based on other people. And this is, I think for me, based on the fact that I found the
00:23:45 ◼ ► dual loop to be comfortable where most people don't. Interesting. So I think if you, I think
00:23:52 ◼ ► that's maybe your, uh, the thing to consider if you're considering this, if you already find the
00:23:57 ◼ ► dual loop comfortable, I would say, I'm not sure that it is worth the amount of money that I had
00:24:01 ◼ ► to spend on a second solo band. They're really expensive and like may, you know, I'm sure it
00:24:08 ◼ ► will be better when I have other people trying it out, but you know, for adjustability, like
00:24:13 ◼ ► just ability sake, it's, it's way better. And what I'll say is I need to do some more testing on this.
00:24:18 ◼ ► Like I've been using my vision pro the last couple of days and the eye tracking is just so unreliable
00:24:23 ◼ ► and I don't know if it's related to this. So I might need to do some, some testing if like
00:24:28 ◼ ► something's happening and now it's not eye tracking me as well. But like, I had to stop using it today
00:24:32 ◼ ► cause I was, I was really getting frustrated because I just couldn't, it would just would not work.
00:24:50 ◼ ► Sometimes I genuinely feel like it's like a weather thing. And I think it's something with
00:24:56 ◼ ► my eyes. Like I think that there might, sometimes there might be something going on with my eyes and
00:25:00 ◼ ► it's just not, not as reliable, but it's a thing I've had on and off over using the vision pro. But
00:25:06 ◼ ► like today it was just like particularly annoying, but I do feel like maybe I've thrown too many
00:25:11 ◼ ► factors at it. Um, because one of what I was doing today is I'm like deleting all my apps and
00:25:17 ◼ ► reinstalling my apps because it's, I have the app store now, like, and I'm nearly done. So I've just
00:25:22 ◼ ► been going through slowly and like delete one thing and still another thing. Because if I try
00:25:27 ◼ ► and do an update for an app, it's like, put your old password in. It's like, well, I don't want to
00:25:30 ◼ ► do that. So, yeah. But so, so, so, but you're thinking that you have unreliable eyes. That is
00:25:37 ◼ ► your, potentially there is, I am not ruling that out as well. That my eyes are unreliable. Oh God.
00:25:45 ◼ ► No. That wasn't necessary though. Like, okay. I'm reliable. No, stop. We got it the first time.
00:25:53 ◼ ► I don't think you did. Well, I'm taking the word eye, like, like I like eyes and I'm putting it in
00:25:58 ◼ ► the middle. Oh, he's explaining it. Yes. You didn't laugh. So you didn't laugh. So I just figured
00:26:04 ◼ ► that like you didn't get it, which is fine to not get it. Do you want us to clap for you? Should we
00:26:11 ◼ ► clap? Please clap. Please clap. Thank you. Thank you. Just two claps. Wow. Two claps. I liked it.
00:26:18 ◼ ► Is this how I am? Is this how people view me? Yes, Steven. Yes. Now you, you understand the pain
00:26:54 ◼ ► Today, Apple introduced HomePod mini in midnight made with a hundred percent recycled mesh fabric.
00:27:00 ◼ ► The internet freaked out. Didn't they already make a black one? Yes. A space gray one. And let me
00:27:05 ◼ ► tell you, they look identical. In my blog post, I took Apple's own press images and all I did was
00:27:11 ◼ ► put them side by side in Photoshop and hand on heart. I cannot tell the difference between the
00:27:17 ◼ ► two dark ones. Oh, let me play this game. Hold on a second. So I'm opening 512. Is there. Okay. I'm
00:27:24 ◼ ► not reading the cat. I'm not reading the text. Okay. Don't read the text. Okay. So you have,
00:27:30 ◼ ► okay, so you have the image on the left and the image on the right. Um, and I got to make out
00:27:35 ◼ ► which one midnight is. I'm going to see that meeting. Okay. So the one on the left seems a
00:27:42 ◼ ► bit darker. Is midnight darker than space gray? I'm going to go ahead and say that midnight is
00:27:49 ◼ ► the one on the left. Nope. Other way around. Oh my God. No. Midnight is lighter than space gray.
00:28:11 ◼ ► hundred percent recycled materials. Like, is that what they're saying? Is that the thing?
00:28:14 ◼ ► Uh, I don't, I don't think so. So in the 2021 press release, when they added the different colors,
00:28:23 ◼ ► all it says is, uh, mesh fabric. They don't say anything about recycling. So recycle. So
00:28:30 ◼ ► I have here the 2020 product environmental report for the HomePod mini. Oh man. The receipts.
00:28:37 ◼ ► 90% recycled plastic in the mesh fabric. Okay. So the press release was for the additional 10%.
00:28:53 ◼ ► Sure. Very exciting. This obviously got people very worked up saying that how dare Apple
00:29:01 ◼ ► update the HomePod mini without preparing it for Apple intelligence is still powered by whatever
00:29:07 ◼ ► the HomePod mini is powered by, you know, some Stephen, everybody knows that 10% of recycled
00:29:12 ◼ ► mesh fabric is all you need for Apple intelligence. That's you know, I forgot about that.
00:29:27 ◼ ► Yeah, that was good. If you like to be clapped, please clap me, daddy. Okay. So, uh, that HomePod
00:29:36 ◼ ► mini up next, Mike, what is happening with your AirPods? All right. I have a problem with my
00:29:41 ◼ ► AirPods and this is just one of these things that I want to say. Are you sure it's, it's AirPods and
00:29:45 ◼ ► not your unreliable years? I don't know. Okay. There could be a lot of things. I want to explain
00:29:51 ◼ ► the situation that I'm having. So AirPods in, this is usually happening when I'm on a train,
00:29:58 ◼ ► but not exclusively. Sometimes it happens randomly. My AirPods in and I'm listening to something,
00:30:04 ◼ ► sometimes listening to something and playing a game. The game I'm playing right now, by the way,
00:30:09 ◼ ► is Pegglin. I have been playing this game all day, every day for months. This game rules so hard.
00:30:16 ◼ ► Thank you, John Voorhees for doing this to me. I love this game. It is a peggle rope like,
00:30:22 ◼ ► which is just a beautiful sentence. Fantastic video game. Love it so much. Anyway, so playing that,
00:30:30 ◼ ► listening to a podcast, like one of my favorite podcasts, like NPC, you know? No, thank you.
00:30:36 ◼ ► Although I have recently started listening to Into the Aether. So I've been listening to a lot of
00:30:40 ◼ ► that and they're all just one episode. Do you know what I mean? I'm halfway through their 15 hour
00:30:44 ◼ ► episodes. They put out a couple of days ago, Steve, we listen to a podcast that put out in
00:30:48 ◼ ► a 15 hour episode. You know, I've heard y'all mentioned that a couple of times and it blows
00:30:52 ◼ ► my mind. Yeah. That episode is so long. It will never appear on Spotify. Yeah. Like that's the
00:30:59 ◼ ► thing. Smart speed is going to save you five hours. It was hilarious to me, right? Like I
00:31:07 ◼ ► was like, cause they just put out another episode today, which is six hours and 40 minutes long.
00:31:11 ◼ ► They don't always do this. It just so happened to happen two in a row. Um, and they're like
00:31:16 ◼ ► long-term projects that they do, which are really cool. Um, and I want to listen to the GameCube
00:31:23 ◼ ► one. I've really been looking forward to the GameCube one cause I want some GameCube recommendations.
00:31:28 ◼ ► And I was like, well, surely I'm nearly done with the games of the decade episode and I have eight
00:31:31 ◼ ► hours left. It's like, Oh man, I'm never going to get there anyway. So I'm listening to podcasts or
00:31:38 ◼ ► whatever. And what happens is all of a sudden audio stops and the transparency or noise cancellation
00:31:48 ◼ ► fails. So, you know, if you ever go from like transparency mode to like off, right? Yeah. If
00:31:55 ◼ ► you ever try that, you know, you can like turn it off. You just be like, no, I don't want any of this.
00:31:59 ◼ ► So like I hear it. And usually it's happens in one year first. So like say the left year will,
00:32:06 ◼ ► the transparency will fail. Then the right one, all audio stops. It disconnects from like disconnect
00:32:12 ◼ ► from my phone completely. And I have to wait. Then what will happen is it goes in reverse.
00:32:19 ◼ ► The transparency mode will kick back in again. Then it will reconnect to my phone and then I
00:32:26 ◼ ► can listen to audio. Like essentially my AirPods are rebooting and this happens. Sometimes I'm on
00:32:32 ◼ ► a train journey, like a 15 minute train journey. And it will happen multiple times. At first,
00:32:38 ◼ ► I thought it was like I was going through a specific area. Like I know this is a thing where
00:32:41 ◼ ► sometimes Bluetooth connections can be knocked out, but that's not the case. It happens at
00:32:46 ◼ ► multiple points, different points, and sometimes I'm not on a train at all. So this is a very weird
00:32:52 ◼ ► and actually very annoying thing that I have. I'm having happened to my AirPods and I want to put
00:32:58 ◼ ► this out there into the world of like, am I alone in this? Just to set the record straight. I am not
00:33:05 ◼ ► doing any betas here. My phone is not on the betas. It's happening on my phone. I wouldn't even know
00:33:11 ◼ ► how to do anything with AirPods. I am just using the devices as a regular human would be using them
00:33:18 ◼ ► and this keeps happening to me. So essentially it's like they're just like rebooting, which is
00:33:24 ◼ ► very strange. Have either of you ever had this happen to you? No. No. No. No. You don't know
00:33:32 ◼ ► about US 18 on your phone? What's the point? That is the thing. Fair enough. I'll stop.
00:33:48 ◼ ► but I will probably wait for at least another beta because I mean we're going to talk about
00:34:03 ◼ ► about. By the way, Federica, I'm very happy that you got back on the right side of history with
00:34:08 ◼ ► the photos design. Yes. It is good. The photos redesign is good. It's good. It's good. I'm a fan
00:34:15 ◼ ► now. I'm happy that you... But I like that you... One, I love that it happened and two, I like that
00:34:20 ◼ ► you wrote about it because I think for me that was always the point of the thing that you had to
00:34:25 ◼ ► settle. I have a potentially warm take. It's the best time. Well done. Stay with me. I think in the
00:34:37 ◼ ► Apple community, a lot of so-called pundits, they have this weird obsession with being right and
00:34:47 ◼ ► they don't understand then being wrong and being wrong in public actually makes for great content.
00:34:59 ◼ ► a lot of people may make a decision and they won't ever change from that decision where yes,
00:35:05 ◼ ► if you change your decision, you get two blog posts out of it. Exactly. You know what I mean?
00:35:10 ◼ ► And maybe you could change your opinion again and you get a third one. Well, then you just look like
00:35:14 ◼ ► an idiot if you do it too much. Two is the maximum. There's a balance is what I'm saying.
00:35:21 ◼ ► Yeah. Anyway, yes. Photos. Photos is good, but probably, you know, you're fine just waiting for
00:35:28 ◼ ► maybe even a couple more betas actually. I mean, yeah, I saw that. That's my thought. Like,
00:35:33 ◼ ► just wait until it gets really, really solid. I would probably expect the next one to have
00:35:41 ◼ ► Yeah. I think I am at this point kind of waiting on that at least because then it would be like,
00:35:46 ◼ ► well, I might as well jump in and try it because I've tried some of these features out on my iPad,
00:35:52 ◼ ► right? And like, I feel like that is going to be best to try on my iPhone, like on my iPad Mini,
00:35:56 ◼ ► because obviously if there's any intelligence features, they're not going to work on that poor
00:36:00 ◼ ► little thing. But it gets very hot, very slow, very hot, very slow. But anyway, we'll come back
00:36:06 ◼ ► to that in a second. Going back to my Apple's problem, I find it very frustrating. If anybody
00:36:10 ◼ ► has experienced this, please let me know. This is my feedback. This is the end of it. This is
00:36:17 ◼ ► the feedback. The feedback is given. It's given. It's out there. What's the feedback number for
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00:38:37 ◼ ► and Relay FM. So we spoke about betas a second ago, but public betas are out over on max stories.
00:38:47 ◼ ► This has been a slew of articles covering iOS 18, Mac OS, Sequoia, watch OS 11, and they're out.
00:38:54 ◼ ► People are running them. There was some confusion because the day the public betas were supposed to
00:39:01 ◼ ► come out, there was a new developer build, but it was of beta three and it regressed one area,
00:39:09 ◼ ► Mike, that you talked about. So why don't you tell us about that and then we'll get Federico's take
00:39:13 ◼ ► on the public betas. Yeah, so they republished beta three. Presumably it was then going to be
00:39:19 ◼ ► the public beta because Apple have done that before. I don't remember when, but I remember
00:39:24 ◼ ► this happening before of like redoing a developer beta and then the public beta came out.
00:39:38 ◼ ► My expectation is that it was just, and I will say, I use it, this is kind of broken, like it worked,
00:39:43 ◼ ► but it was like shaky. And I'm hoping that they just need to do some tweaks because it would be
00:39:50 ◼ ► really weird to not have this feature. So like, I feel like it's just one of these things that
00:39:55 ◼ ► it will appear maybe in beta four or beta five again, but they did remove that feature.
00:40:02 ◼ ► It's a bummer. It's a real bummer. Yeah. Yeah. There's no public beta for Vino OS either.
00:40:09 ◼ ► So that's probably good. They used to not do a watch public beta, remember for years. And I think
00:40:15 ◼ ► just the complexity of restoring one of those devices, if it goes sideways is, I'm okay with
00:40:21 ◼ ► that being. Is it still like a horror show if you mess that up? Like, is it still really bad?
00:40:36 ◼ ► just by virtue of not having a USB cable, you know, like that's not, and being a slow device,
00:40:43 ◼ ► like it's not going to be fun. The restore process, which I have not done in many years,
00:40:49 ◼ ► probably only happened once to me, but I'm going to bet that it's not pleasant. You know?
00:41:08 ◼ ► It's really good. Yeah. Jonathan has a template that I actually want to steal eventually.
00:41:24 ◼ ► Jonathan is, this is something that we did not share publicly, but actually Alex, who's been
00:41:31 ◼ ► doing the previous watchOS coverage and annual reviews, been doing them for 10 years. Alex
00:41:37 ◼ ► decided to wrap it up with watchOS 10. So going forward, Jonathan will be taking care of the
00:41:47 ◼ ► Can I, considering the time has passed, can I talk about what happened at WWDC when it came
00:42:31 ◼ ► to do the reviews. Walking by somebody like, Hey, do you want to write something for Mac stories?
00:42:36 ◼ ► Honestly, I was around Alex enough that week that it did feel like that at a certain point where
00:42:44 ◼ ► he just didn't want to do it. Well, he would have asked you, but you're tied up with tvOS.
00:42:48 ◼ ► No, I got fired. It was a shame. And, uh, there's, there's, unfortunately, uh, we're in an
00:42:56 ◼ ► arbitration right now. There's legal proceedings going on. I can't share anymore. And I also can't
00:43:18 ◼ ► Unfortunately, I can't talk about this right now. You'll be hearing from John Voigt. He's my lawyer,
00:43:41 ◼ ► Okay. Uh, no, but I'm very excited about Jonathan taking care of this and he's done a great job,
00:43:45 ◼ ► I think, with the, with the public preview, um, testing things that I, that I would have
00:43:50 ◼ ► never tested. So yeah, there's going to be a watchOS 11 review on Mac stories this year.
00:44:04 ◼ ► like live activities in the smart stack. I want that. Right. And also the smart stacks promise
00:44:11 ◼ ► to actually do what they said they would do last time, which is like reflow them a bit better.
00:44:17 ◼ ► And I'm sure in watchOS, the watchOS 10, like I haven't checked this, but this is my memory
00:44:22 ◼ ► that they said live activities would be in that. And that never happened. Um, training load. I'm
00:44:28 ◼ ► really interested to see the judgment that my Apple watch report on me after my workouts.
00:44:38 ◼ ► And I can tell you, please share that story. I, uh, walk, uh, like, uh, last week in the evening,
00:44:49 ◼ ► I started feeling a sore throat and I was like, um, uh, usually as we know, it's pretty much a
00:44:58 ◼ ► sign that something is going on. Sure enough, woke up the next morning with a notification from the
00:45:04 ◼ ► vitals app on my Apple watch running the watchOS 11 beta saying, uh, there's three data points
00:45:10 ◼ ► that are outliers here. And specifically it's your temperature, your heart rate and your respiratory
00:45:16 ◼ ► rate. It was like, boy, I'm dying over here, but it was like, your temperature is like 1.5 degrees
00:45:23 ◼ ► higher and your heart rate is really off and your respiratory rate is also kind of off.
00:45:29 ◼ ► And that persisted for multiple days. Of course I got sick and, uh, and you know, sure enough,
00:45:36 ◼ ► I got a fever and I got a cough and everything. So, and, and then, um, it did it for like three
00:45:43 ◼ ► days. And what was cool about it is that I could tell that I was getting better because every
00:45:49 ◼ ► morning, like there was going to be like one fewer data point. So like the one day the temperature
00:45:55 ◼ ► was okay, but the two other values were still not. And then it was just the heart rate that it was
00:46:01 ◼ ► still high and then it stopped. So the vitals app, I know that it's not new data, like all these data
00:46:07 ◼ ► points, you could manually check in health before, but I think it's the UI and the bringing them
00:46:13 ◼ ► together, making them very actionable, like in the way that like it's presented in plain English.
00:46:20 ◼ ► It tells you every morning when you wake up, it doesn't require you to go open health on your
00:46:26 ◼ ► phone. You can just do it all with a very simple UI on the watch. I think it's very cool. And I
00:46:32 ◼ ► think it's going to help a lot of people. Yeah. I don't worry, Steven. I got you. Uh, I see this
00:46:39 ◼ ► data in sleep plus plus like, cause it underscore uses it to form like a sleep, like a readiness
00:46:46 ◼ ► score is what he calls it of like pulling in. I think it's some of these are all of these things
00:46:51 ◼ ► as a way to show you how prepared you might be for the day. But I don't check that every day.
00:46:58 ◼ ► Like I, I actually check that usually because of something that I'm feeling. I like the idea of my
00:47:04 ◼ ► watch actively reaching out and telling me like that something's changed. Like, I think that's
00:47:11 ◼ ► cool. Uh, and in terms of, in terms of, um, Sequoia, John, uh, John wrote about it. Um,
00:47:19 ◼ ► it's takeaway, I think pretty much in agreement with him. Um, there's that two features that are
00:47:26 ◼ ► really cool, like the iPhone mirroring and the iPhone notifications. Like that's gonna be,
00:47:31 ◼ ► that is the highlight of my quest Sequoia. And I think it's, it's gonna be something that a lot of
00:47:36 ◼ ► people are gonna use, especially nerds. I think people like us, we're going to be all over that
00:47:40 ◼ ► feature. Um, but otherwise, and that is also pretty much my sentiment right now in mid July
00:47:49 ◼ ► with iOS and iPadOS 18, we're all just waiting for Apple intelligence stuff to show up. And,
00:47:55 ◼ ► and so what you're left with in Sequoia, in iOS, in iPadOS is a lot of smaller, like app related
00:48:05 ◼ ► features on iOS. You do have the customization to sort of salvage this release without Apple
00:48:13 ◼ ► intelligence. You, you have control center, uh, which is customizable. And for me right now,
00:48:19 ◼ ► it's the highlight of iOS 18. You do have the home screen stuff. Um, and, uh, the, the photos app,
00:48:28 ◼ ► which as we have established, I am now a fan of it. And I think it's, I'm curious to see what Apple
00:48:34 ◼ ► does now that there's a public beta. Uh, I don't think we are witnessing the kind of backlash that
00:48:42 ◼ ► we experienced three years ago with the new Safari, because the new Safari, that version of Safari was
00:48:48 ◼ ► bad. This version of photos, it's, it seems like it's more of a subjective thing. I wouldn't say
00:48:54 ◼ ► it's an objectively badly designed photos UI. I don't think that's the case. I think Safari
00:49:11 ◼ ► they came at it from the thing of there, we have all this stuff and nobody looks at it.
00:49:18 ◼ ► And people like this kind of stuff. And so let's show it to them, but in a way where we're not
00:49:28 ◼ ► like you just continue scrolling. If you need to go further, like my expectation is like,
00:49:33 ◼ ► I would say 90% of the time when people open the photos app, what they want is one of the
00:49:39 ◼ ► last 20 photos and they're still visible. They're still there. And so you can still get to those if
00:49:45 ◼ ► you want to, but now you're also going to be pulled into like, Hey, look, here's these pictures of you
00:49:49 ◼ ► and your friends. And Hey, look, here's this. And Hey, look, there's that. And so I think that is
00:49:53 ◼ ► like, I think the design has come from a, from a sincere place, not just a, how can we rethink
00:50:03 ◼ ► I saw some people say, Oh, but I don't want to discover photos in my library. And like,
00:50:12 ◼ ► Why are you even taking pictures? Like if you don't want to rediscover memories and photos,
00:50:20 ◼ ► like it's almost like saying, um, no, actually I don't have an analogy. It just seems wild.
00:50:28 ◼ ► It's really strange. It's really strange that you may be against the idea of rediscovering photos
00:50:34 ◼ ► and memories when you do have a photo library. Like, you know, uh, anyway, we'll see if Apple
00:50:41 ◼ ► listened to, for example, one feedback that Apple may want to listen to is if you set your grid to
00:50:50 ◼ ► be fully expanded on the, on the phone. So you swipe down and you see just the grid and you force
00:50:57 ◼ ► quit photos, maybe something that Apple could implement is remember the state of photos. Um,
00:51:03 ◼ ► right now, if you expand the grid and you force quit photos, the next time you open photos,
00:51:09 ◼ ► the grid is not fully expanded. Um, so maybe that's something that Apple could do, but honestly,
00:51:15 ◼ ► I don't think it's, I think it's a pretty good design and I think Apple is onto something with
00:51:21 ◼ ► this idea of, look, you can still do just the basics and that's literally 60% of the screen
00:51:28 ◼ ► by default. But if you want to, you can keep, you can keep scrolling and find stuff because
00:51:48 ◼ ► which is like, Oh, so you don't ever want to see, you know, X or Y thing. Just get rid of it.
00:51:53 ◼ ► Like, I just think that's very, it's very, I love it. And I think, I think that a good job.
00:52:00 ◼ ► What I also think it's wild is that we've gone from photos being a completely non customizable app
00:52:07 ◼ ► to photos being Apple's most customizable app ever. Like second only, I mean, at this point
00:52:15 ◼ ► to shortcuts really. And shortcuts is the app that literally is designed to let you create stuff.
00:52:20 ◼ ► So it's customizable by design, but what you can do in photos, it's, it's wild. Like rearrange stuff,
00:52:27 ◼ ► modify pin collections. Like I hope it, like, I hope that Apple is now entering it's actually,
00:52:36 ◼ ► this is a pretty good sentence that I should say for my iOS review. See, this is something that we
00:52:43 ◼ ► spoke about on the pre-show. Mike, where can people get connected pro while I'm saving this out.
00:52:47 ◼ ► Getconnectedpro.co is where you can go to get longer ad-free versions of the show. We were
00:52:53 ◼ ► talking about Federico preparing for his iOS review and what his plans are for that this year.
00:52:59 ◼ ► Yeah. What I was going to say in the sentence that I wrote down is that I hope that we are,
00:53:11 ◼ ► customization with the home screen, lock screen, widgets. And I hope that iOS 18 is pointing at a
00:53:17 ◼ ► more functional customization in the sense of like, look at photos and look at control center.
00:53:23 ◼ ► That's my theory. Yep. Which I literally just saved. So yeah, that's good. That's good. It's
00:53:30 ◼ ► been, it's been interesting this year. I feel like there's been more overall like change in evolution
00:53:36 ◼ ► in some areas than maybe we've seen in past years, like particularly around like the tinting and some
00:53:41 ◼ ► of the home screen stuff on iOS 18. I don't know. It feels like things are maybe a little bit less
00:53:47 ◼ ► set in stone this year, which is, which is always interesting. It's interesting to see how Apple
00:53:55 ◼ ► obviously the biggest example of that sort of in modern Apple history, but even, even there's
00:54:01 ◼ ► other features, you know, they're continuing to evolve and continue to change. And that's always
00:54:05 ◼ ► really interesting to watch. I think I'm going to change the color tinting. Do you think,
00:54:09 ◼ ► or you think that's done now? Oh, I think it's done. I think it's done. Yeah. Yeah. I think
00:54:15 ◼ ► if that time is passed now. I have seen, I can kind of on one hand, I have seen two, three examples
00:54:25 ◼ ► of a pretty good looking tinted and custom icon layout on the home screen. Like I saw a photo on
00:54:34 ◼ ► threads of a person with wallpaper and on the left side was like this skyscraper with like orange
00:54:41 ◼ ► lights. And on the right side, the person had put like, just like, like a vertical row of two icons,
00:54:47 ◼ ► tinted orange. I was like, yeah, that, you know, that looks pretty good. It's not something that
00:54:53 ◼ ► I would ever use. And you got to wonder, like, especially on social media, how many of these
00:54:58 ◼ ► screenshots are done for clout and like, do you actually use your phone like that? But I do think
00:55:04 ◼ ► that there will be enough people using phones with cast, with weird and beautiful icon, custom icon
00:55:10 ◼ ► layouts that it's justified for Apple to do it. Not something that I will ever do, but Hey, you
00:55:16 ◼ ► cannot like customization only when it just so happens to be your kind of customizations. It's
00:55:22 ◼ ► kind of like democracy, you know, you got to love it all the time. Otherwise you're not going to love
00:55:27 ◼ ► it ever. Sure. That's the thing. That's the way to say it. I just, I just, I just want to be able
00:55:36 ◼ ► to use dark mode and not have dark icons though. And dark widgets. Like I want to be able to
00:55:44 ◼ ► separate those things out a little bit. Um, and like be able to pick and choose like dark mode
00:55:50 ◼ ► or not dark widgets or not dark icons or not. And yeah, I don't like that. I have that choice.
00:55:57 ◼ ► Here's the thing I also don't understand. I don't understand this. They can do whatever they want
00:56:01 ◼ ► with this people. I don't know why they tint the wallpaper. I don't know why that's the thing. Like,
00:56:05 ◼ ► like make it dark wallpaper, darker. That is like a very strange setting to even exist to me. Like,
00:56:12 ◼ ► I'm not really sure what that serves. Like there is very, is I am concerned that there are user
00:56:20 ◼ ► interface designers at Apple that don't understand what dark mode is like what people are using dark
00:56:27 ◼ ► mode for. And the tinting is one of them. Like, I don't like when people choose dark mode, it's not
00:56:36 ◼ ► like, Oh, I can't stand bright color. Like even like the way that they're doing this like dark
00:56:42 ◼ ► mode tinting of apps. Like I'm looking at an image here in Federico's article and it's like, they
00:56:48 ◼ ► make the WhatsApp icon a little less saturated. Like why though? Like for what reason? They're
00:56:53 ◼ ► trying to get people to use messages. You know, that's, that's anti-competitive behavior.
00:56:57 ◼ ► I guess, but like for, I just don't understand for what reason is felt to do that. Yeah. It's
00:57:05 ◼ ► strange. Uh, and I'm concerned about the way that they do into dark mode. Cause like, I also just
00:57:11 ◼ ► don't really like in general, Apple's dark mode icons. I don't, I don't think, no, I think some
00:57:19 ◼ ► of them look great and some of them look not good at all. And what is the vibe check from both of
00:57:29 ◼ ► you? Um, small icons, large icons. I don't like the large icons. I have not used it on my phone yet.
00:57:41 ◼ ► Right. Like I have not tried it on my phone, but in every image that I see, I don't like the large
00:57:47 ◼ ► icons. They are too big for me. Like it's too big. Yeah, but after a while, like I'm telling you,
00:57:53 ◼ ► I also thought like, Oh, this is going to be like old person's home screen, you know, like,
00:57:58 ◼ ► Oh, giant icons because grandpa can read the labels. Um, but after a while you do get used
00:58:04 ◼ ► to them and it makes you appreciate, especially if you have like nice icons on your home screen,
00:58:09 ◼ ► it makes you appreciate the icons more. And then when you go back to the smaller ones with the
00:58:13 ◼ ► text, you're like, Oh, these are small and have text underneath them. They look, Oh, I don't know.
00:58:20 ◼ ► Maybe it's like a novelty bias type of thing now, but I really like my chunky icons. You know,
00:58:26 ◼ ► I'm gonna, I'm gonna try it when I, when I put it on my phone, but I've just, I'm not sold on it yet.
00:58:41 ◼ ► um, for all the, the thoughts that I shared about AI and I'm not like, I, this is not an AI segment.
00:59:00 ◼ ► especially because of the, uh, text activation that it's going to be possible. Like the text
00:59:07 ◼ ► mode. I was at the beach and, and I wanted to do a bunch of things. And obviously I had to do them
00:59:13 ◼ ► like, for example, I had to, uh, turn off a specific light that I left on at home. And I had
00:59:24 ◼ ► to open the whole map and, you know, find the room and find the accessory and turn it off, which was
00:59:29 ◼ ► fine. It took me 20 seconds, but I had the thought of like, it's going to be so nice when I can just
00:59:36 ◼ ► tap the virtual indicator and be like shut down balcony light and it's done. So like that idea of
00:59:59 ◼ ► And I was kind of wondering if you also had, like, if you've been thinking about this at all,
01:00:04 ◼ ► like anticipating the new Siri. I anticipate it in faith. Like I am going to choose to believe
01:00:17 ◼ ► it will be as effective as they showed us. If that bears out, then I am excited about this.
01:00:26 ◼ ► And so like I, and at the moment I am choosing to believe that that is true. So I am excited for a
01:00:32 ◼ ► much more capable system. Like that's what I am looking forward to. Like the ways in which you can
01:00:38 ◼ ► trigger it is nice. The new UI is nice. Fine. But like, that's not like, we're not going to get the
01:00:44 ◼ ► capability until later on. It seems like the full capability. That is what I am most excited for
01:00:50 ◼ ► because I want to be able to have a natural conversation with my devices and have it do
01:00:58 ◼ ► things for me. Like that's what I want to be able to do. Like I use this example already,
01:01:05 ◼ ► but I'll say it again. So I'm like, I had to do this thing where, uh, for, we have like a
01:01:12 ◼ ► selection of tickets for the live show that we're giving out to the family members of hosts and like
01:01:17 ◼ ► friends and stuff like that. So I had a like 100 page PDF and every page on the PDF was a,
01:01:27 ◼ ► an individual ticket and I needed to do, I needed to split that PDF into individual PDFs
01:01:35 ◼ ► and name them with the seat number, which was on the PDFs. The way I did this was I created a
01:01:45 ◼ ► shortcut to separate it, but then I did, couldn't, I could not come up with a way to extract that one
01:01:54 ◼ ► particular piece of information and then rename the file as that. I have no idea and I don't
01:02:02 ◼ ► actually think that Siri will be able to do this, but that's what I'm aiming towards. Like that's
01:02:09 ◼ ► what I want to be able to say to my computer, take this PDF, separate it into individuals,
01:02:15 ◼ ► take the seat number and rename each file with the seat number. Computers should be able to do
01:02:22 ◼ ► that task, right? Like, yeah, I don't think the Siri they showed, no, neither do I, but
01:02:27 ◼ ► to get to there, I think is this middle part, right? Of like, Siri will understand what I want
01:02:35 ◼ ► more, Siri will be able to talk to applications, there are Siri intents and like, you can see a
01:02:40 ◼ ► scenario where we get to that, which on the face of it, a computer should be able to do that. I
01:02:49 ◼ ► know computers can do that. I know people can make this work, right? That like, with a combination of
01:02:53 ◼ ► OCR, like you could make it work, but the amount of time it would take to do that, I just did it,
01:03:09 ◼ ► and it activate all of the things needed to do that and just provide me with the result, like
01:03:15 ◼ ► in seconds, I think we're on the path to a computer being capable of doing these things
01:03:21 ◼ ► for us, like a personal computer, but to get there, we got this part in the middle and is
01:03:27 ◼ ► that part in the middle, I'm also excited about the idea of being able to have a communication
01:03:33 ◼ ► with my phone and it surface information for me and then perform simple actions. Like I am excited
01:03:40 ◼ ► about that rather than a, I ask the assistant a question and get an answer and that's the end of
01:03:48 ◼ ► it. That is like all Siri has been for like 10 years and like, I am ready to move past that and
01:03:56 ◼ ► give it another shot, you know? Yeah. Yeah. And it's not that computers can't do those things,
01:04:02 ◼ ► right? You could make something to do that on a Mac, but you have to know how to do it. It's
01:04:08 ◼ ► about unlocking those capabilities, not only on a new type of device, like an iPhone or iPad, but
01:04:14 ◼ ► for people who aren't going to open automator or shortcuts or the command line. And yeah,
01:04:20 ◼ ► but even then, like if I was the type of person where I was having to do that task frequently,
01:04:25 ◼ ► I would work out the way to do it. Like I know I could do it. I could get some help from some
01:04:28 ◼ ► friends to maybe write a script for me. Like for example, Jason created a script for me,
01:04:34 ◼ ► which I did some modifications on and like he did some modification. So like every year when we do
01:04:39 ◼ ► the upgrade is I can have it go through the calculations and try and like pull together
01:04:46 ◼ ► the way that people write things. So like Breath of the Wild and Zelda Breath of the Wild, like try
01:04:51 ◼ ► and like lump those together to make that job easier. And while that took a lot of effort,
01:04:57 ◼ ► I need that every year. So it's good to have done the effort because then it saves me time in the
01:05:02 ◼ ► long run. But this task about the PDF I needed once, right? So like it wasn't worth doing the
01:05:09 ◼ ► effort, but I should still ask the computer once, right? Like and it do it that one time
01:05:14 ◼ ► because there shouldn't be any set up for me. Like even just to have not written the shortcut,
01:05:22 ◼ ► right? Like that's the part where like I knew I could get shortcuts to separate this PDF for me
01:05:28 ◼ ► into individual PDFs. Like I should at least be able to say like, hey computer, take this PDF and
01:05:34 ◼ ► split it up for me. And it do that part at least. And I would expect that new Siri should be able
01:05:41 ◼ ► to do that. Like from my expectation, if it's in shortcuts, it should be able to do it. That is like
01:05:47 ◼ ► a absolute minimum bar for me. I have no idea if I'm going to get that. Like whenever this probably
01:05:53 ◼ ► ships next year, but like that for me is like the, if it's in shortcuts, it should be able to do it.
01:05:58 ◼ ► If it can't, I don't understand why. But I don't know. - I don't think we're too far off from what
01:06:05 ◼ ► you are envisioning here, especially if like Apple is going to add more domains to the app intent
01:06:13 ◼ ► and they're going to roll out the app integration of course in the iOS 18 cycle. And it sounds like
01:06:19 ◼ ► from Mark Gurman's report, one of those, that Siri will also get like the ability to chain multiple
01:06:25 ◼ ► commands into one. So I think there's a scenario in which like late 2025, say early 2026 maybe,
01:06:48 ◼ ► Imagine your company security like the quad of a college campus. There are nice brick paths
01:06:53 ◼ ► between buildings. Those are the company owned devices, IT approved apps and managed employee
01:06:59 ◼ ► identities that you know about. But then there are the paths that people actually use, the shortcuts
01:07:05 ◼ ► through the grass. Those are unmanaged devices, shadow IT apps, non-employee identities,
01:07:12 ◼ ► like contractors. Most security tools only work on those happy brick paths, but a lot of the security
01:07:19 ◼ ► problems take place on the shortcuts. Well, 1Password extended access management is the
01:07:24 ◼ ► first security solution that brings all of those unmanaged devices, apps, and identities
01:07:29 ◼ ► under your control. It ensures that every user credential is strong and protected. Every device
01:07:36 ◼ ► is known and healthy and every app visible. 1Password extended access management solves
01:07:42 ◼ ► the problem traditional IAM and MDM can't touch. It's security for the way that we work today.
01:07:48 ◼ ► And it's available now to companies with Okta and coming later this year to Google Workspace
01:08:03 ◼ ► There's a link in the show notes. Our thanks to 1Password extended access management for
01:08:07 ◼ ► their support of connected and all of Relay FM. I wanted to close this week with a couple of
01:08:14 ◼ ► app stories. Hey, that's the stories of apps. The stories. My name is John Voorhees. I used to be a
01:08:25 ◼ ► lawyer. I came to America on a boat. On a week for a week. If people are asked us, it took a week.
01:08:31 ◼ ► We found that out today. Yeah. It took a week. UTM-SE is a retro PC emulator for the iPhone,
01:08:41 ◼ ► iPad, and vision pro. And I think out of everything that has changed in the app store in the last
01:08:46 ◼ ► couple of years, for some reason, this is the one that blows my mind the most. That I can emulate
01:08:51 ◼ ► windows XP on my iPad. What is happening? Did you see my hot take on threads about this?
01:08:58 ◼ ► What'd you say? So I responded to probably neil i potel, I think, saying that using with windows XP
01:09:14 ◼ ► Yeah. So, yeah. I mean, you saying that this has changed, like this has changed within the last
01:09:22 ◼ ► month. Like this app has been on a whirlwind and it was rejected a bunch of times and things
01:09:29 ◼ ► were changed. It was rejected. And now it's here and everything that I've found, no one is really
01:09:35 ◼ ► saying why? I don't know why it got approved. Well, there is no why. Isn't that also like a
01:09:44 ◼ ► Smashing Pumpkins song? Probably. There is no why because the idea is that, I mean, Apple is now
01:09:53 ◼ ► letting... The way I look at it is if Delta is successful and old store is so successful,
01:10:00 ◼ ► we also got to let it on the app store because that's what the people want. And we're going to
01:10:05 ◼ ► give people what... We'd rather have people be happy on the app store than be happy on a third
01:10:12 ◼ ► party store. That's sort of my takeaway. Well, because this one was making headlines because
01:10:18 ◼ ► they rejected it from notarization to be on old store initially. Like that's what the big problem
01:10:24 ◼ ► was with this because that's not something that Apple should be doing. Right. But they did it and
01:10:33 ◼ ► then it became a whole thing. And then some stuff got changed. And now, as you say, it's also on the
01:10:39 ◼ ► app store as well as being in Delta. Sorry, in old store. So, what happened? Why is this now
01:10:49 ◼ ► available? And this is the consistent thing which is becoming more and more frustrating
01:10:54 ◼ ► about authorization. What Apple is and isn't allowing on the app store and how it's changing
01:10:59 ◼ ► its rules. And sometimes the rules are this and sometimes the rules are that. It's like,
01:11:30 ◼ ► just technologically speaking, I think it's very cool that you can run Windows XP, you can run
01:11:40 ◼ ► I should. Yeah. There's something for you to do here, obviously, when you're less busy.
01:11:48 ◼ ► DLS games, like whatever. Anything that is considered retro, you can emulate with UTM SC.
01:11:57 ◼ ► UTM I have used before on the Mac to run the Linux distro that runs Home Assistant on my Mac Mini
01:12:06 ◼ ► server, and SC is the iPad version. So yeah, that's pretty cool. And hopefully, slowly but surely,
01:12:14 ◼ ► more and more of these apps are coming on the vanilla app store, and I hope that will continue
01:12:19 ◼ ► to be the case, especially with emulators that require JIT, for example. I hope that Apple can
01:12:41 ◼ ► Yeah, you can now run it on the iPad. You don't have to be in the EU, you can just get it on the
01:12:47 ◼ ► app store. There's some iPad-specific skins, especially impressive, I think, are the DS ones.
01:12:54 ◼ ► And what I think is also pretty cool is that you can use Delta with multi-window. I don't know who
01:13:00 ◼ ► wants to play multiple video games at the same time, but Delta has been optimized for iPadOS
01:13:06 ◼ ► and Stage Manager. So if you want to, you can keep, I don't know, Pokemon Red going in one window
01:13:11 ◼ ► and Tetris in another. Like, you can run Mario Kart and, I don't know, give me a DS game, Mike.
01:13:19 ◼ ► Mario Kart DS. Well, okay, sure. You can run two versions of Mario Kart at the same time.
01:13:30 ◼ ► Super Mario 64 DS. There you go. Excellent game. You can do that, multiple windows. I don't know
01:13:38 ◼ ► why, but you can. And so, yeah, I think it's going to be... I think the iPad is especially well suited
01:13:46 ◼ ► for DS emulation because of the dual screens and, you know, you have a bigger display. And I think,
01:13:54 ◼ ► especially like an 11-inch iPad Pro, for example, in portrait mode, running Delta with DS games,
01:14:06 ◼ ► This week also marked the launch of the new version of Overcast. Overcast turns 10 years
01:14:24 ◼ ► Where did the time go? But Marco has been talking about this for a long time on ATP and, of course,
01:14:31 ◼ ► under the radar here on Relay, talking about... Basically, Overcast was in a position where there
01:14:37 ◼ ► was a lot of really old code and he was unable to move the app forward in a lot of ways that he
01:14:44 ◼ ► wanted to because of all this Objective-C. And, you know, he wasn't in the Swift UI land that
01:14:51 ◼ ► an app starting today would be in. And so he underwent a massive rewrite to basically bring
01:14:56 ◼ ► Overcast over into the modern times using Swift and Swift UI. And the result of that currently
01:15:03 ◼ ► is an app that is more or less the old version of Overcast minus a couple of features, but built on
01:15:11 ◼ ► a new foundation to move forward. And we got some links in the show notes for people to go check
01:15:16 ◼ ► out. I'm sure... Actually, I know that the majority of you listening are listening in Overcast because
01:15:22 ◼ ► it is the most popular podcast client for this and many other tech podcasts. And I'd love to know
01:15:28 ◼ ► what you all think about it. This update for me, Mixbag. I have some things about it that I really
01:15:36 ◼ ► like, some things that I don't like, and some things that I'm kind of in the middle. So visually,
01:15:42 ◼ ► a lot of the design tweaks that Marco has done, I do really like. I especially like the new
01:15:48 ◼ ► home screen. I like the circle playlists. I would like to be able to remove some of them because I
01:15:54 ◼ ► don't need them all, but like I only use two playlists and I think that they look nice.
01:15:59 ◼ ► I like the kind of like carousel of shows that's at the top. I expect in the future that I'll be
01:16:06 ◼ ► able to long press on these and do stuff with them, but I do like that they're up there because
01:16:11 ◼ ► I do sometimes just find just, oh, that's just like a really quick way to just jump into what
01:16:16 ◼ ► I'm listening to. I'm still getting used to the nail playing screen. The way in which you access
01:16:23 ◼ ► show notes and chapters is especially what I'm trying to get used to. I really like the sliding
01:16:27 ◼ ► cards that was there in Overcast before. You just slide left to right. I'm much more used to the,
01:16:39 ◼ ► I actually quite like the way to get to, there's like a quick way to get to the show notes,
01:16:45 ◼ ► which is just tap the artwork and that's how I'm doing it and that works pretty well. Although
01:16:49 ◼ ► sometimes, you know, with some things that you, when you tap something, usually you tap it again
01:17:00 ◼ ► I don't like the chapter screen where it just like full screen takes over and that UI I'm not a fan
01:17:11 ◼ ► of, but it works though, which is fine, you know, like it's working for me, but I know I've got to
01:17:19 ◼ ► get used to it. We've been using that nail playing screen for like six years, like in the exact way
01:17:25 ◼ ► that it was. I think that's how long it's been since that was released and so I kind of got to
01:17:31 ◼ ► get used to it. Originally I was very upset about the removal of streaming because that was how I
01:17:36 ◼ ► don't download podcasts. I just press play and they stream, but in actuality it has not caused
01:17:45 ◼ ► a problem for me and I think the way that Marco designed the idea that you press play and it brings
01:17:51 ◼ ► up playing screen and then just goes downloads for you, I think is a very clever way of dealing with
01:18:01 ◼ ► the way in which podcasts are being produced now, which is what a lot of direct was the AI,
01:18:07 ◼ ► like the ad insertion stuff, is causing him dynamic, I was gonna say direct but that's wrong,
01:18:12 ◼ ► dynamic ad insertion. That was really making things difficult for him it seemed like and so
01:18:18 ◼ ► if this allows him to continue making like the audio effects and all that kind of stuff better,
01:18:23 ◼ ► great, like that then I'm fine with it. I really love the go back button that he's added,
01:18:32 ◼ ► so if you accidentally seek or if you like skip chapters and something, there's like a little
01:18:37 ◼ ► button that pops up on the artwork inside of the app, it says go back and there's a little time and
01:18:42 ◼ ► it counts down and it will go away for you. This is great because I was listening to that 14 hour
01:18:48 ◼ ► episode of the podcast that I mentioned earlier on and I accidentally knocked the home screen and
01:18:53 ◼ ► jumped by many hours in that podcast and so I quickly opened Overcast and was able to hit the
01:19:00 ◼ ► go back button and it took me back to where I was before I did the accidental jump. I really like the
01:19:06 ◼ ► context menus for moving episodes between my, I have two playlists, an all episode playlist and a
01:19:12 ◼ ► queue playlist, so I just move things from the all episodes to my queue and I like that when you kind
01:19:18 ◼ ► of like tap the three dots you get some options of like add it to the queue, add it to next in the
01:19:23 ◼ ► queue, I just like the way that is designed and similarly when I'm in my queue playlist how I can
01:19:28 ◼ ► tap on something and just like make it jump right to the top or go right to the bottom,
01:19:32 ◼ ► I like those buttons that are there but something that I miss is that you can no longer drag and drop
01:19:37 ◼ ► multiple episodes or episodes between playlists, I used to do that a lot. This is kind of like the
01:19:44 ◼ ► back and forth is where I am with this app where like there are things that I like about it,
01:19:49 ◼ ► there are things that have changed that I don't like about it and that's because I've used this
01:19:53 ◼ ► app in its, the state that it has been in for six years is an incredibly long time for an app to
01:19:59 ◼ ► remain in a state. I actually think that is a testament to how good the design was in my opinion
01:20:06 ◼ ► then that it has maintained for that period of time. I can't imagine any other app that I would
01:20:13 ◼ ► still want to use after not changing for that amount of time so I think that that was a
01:20:25 ◼ ► I am really hoping that it bears true that this rewrite allows for further iteration of the app
01:20:34 ◼ ► because for me this version has not provided enough to warrant the time difference but like
01:20:41 ◼ ► so I hope that it continues to get better because there are things that I like about it and there
01:20:50 ◼ ► regressions for me and so we'll see where it goes from here. That's kind of my feeling on it. It's
01:20:55 ◼ ► like this is fine for what it is right now and I hope that he will be able to iterate on it in
01:21:01 ◼ ► the way that he said that he will be able to because this version doesn't click for me everywhere
01:21:05 ◼ ► but I'm confident and hopeful that the app will continue to get better because there are these
01:21:10 ◼ ► little shining moments in here which are like so nice like that go back button and I really like
01:21:16 ◼ ► a lot of the animations in the app now and the app feels modern again so I'm hoping that this is
01:21:23 ◼ ► as Marco has very well put it so I believe in completely like the foundation for the app moving
01:21:27 ◼ ► forward so that's kind of where I am with it. I have some thoughts. So for the past year I used
01:21:34 ◼ ► Pocket Casts as my primary podcast client. I do need to have voice boosting and stream silence
01:21:43 ◼ ► or smart speed to listen to my shows so Apple Podcasts is out of the question. It's not something
01:21:49 ◼ ► I can use. I use Pocket Casts for a year and just last month I decided I cannot use it anymore
01:21:59 ◼ ► because and I know that it's something that Automattic who own Pocket Casts are working on
01:22:04 ◼ ► but Pocket Casts is way too slow at refreshing my podcasts. So many times it happened for example
01:22:11 ◼ ► that Mike just put out a new episode of Upgrade or a new episode of Cortex and I couldn't listen
01:22:16 ◼ ► because it was not showing up in Pocket Casts and I know that Automattic has said they're working on
01:22:22 ◼ ► improving server speeds and refresh times but I just needed you know I was so fed up that I
01:22:29 ◼ ► started looking for something else. I would be surprised if they're able to do this and the
01:22:33 ◼ ► reason I say this has been a fundamental issue of Pocket Cast for its entire existence and they've
01:22:40 ◼ ► always said that they're working on it and it has gotten better but there's clearly something going
01:22:45 ◼ ► on with their architecture which makes that complicated for them. So like I don't know in your
01:22:52 ◼ ► situation I wouldn't believe it was going to improve to the point that you want it which is
01:22:56 ◼ ► instant like Overcast has been and Apple Podcasts is and Castro is as well. Yep so just last week I
01:23:04 ◼ ► tried Castro with the new owners. I really like Castro and for me right now it is the app to beat.
01:23:12 ◼ ► I love its UI, its inbox and queue based approach. It's fast, I get notifications from it, I really
01:23:20 ◼ ► like the now playing screen but I realized I decided you know with the new version of Overcast
01:23:25 ◼ ► you know that's I want to give it a try and I am giving it a try. I temporarily deleted Castro and
01:23:31 ◼ ► I put Overcast on my home screen. So this is the opinion of someone who hasn't used Overcast in a
01:23:36 ◼ ► long time. I love that it's fast, that it feels a lot more modern than before and that it shows me
01:23:45 ◼ ► those like quick new episodes at the very top of the UI. Something that I immediately noticed that
01:23:52 ◼ ► is a common limitation all throughout the Overcast UI is that you cannot long press anywhere.
01:24:02 ◼ ► Just like you cannot long press on those episodes, you cannot long press on a podcast, there are no
01:24:09 ◼ ► context menus at all for these episodes. So that is something that I wish that Marco could add.
01:24:16 ◼ ► I like that there's now like a more clear UI for having like the separation between all episodes
01:24:26 ◼ ► and the queue. That's all I need to do, like I just want to see all episodes from my shows and
01:24:33 ◼ ► then select some of those and put them in a queue. I like that there's like a proper playlist called
01:24:39 ◼ ► Queue. It's obvious, it's simple, it's large enough, easy to get to and I appreciate that I
01:24:46 ◼ ► can reorder episodes in the queue like you mentioned with the context menu or using drag
01:24:51 ◼ ► and drop. Although I wish the drag and drop supported multi-item drag and drop. So let me drag
01:24:56 ◼ ► and drop multiple episodes at the same time. Previous Overcast could, new one can't. I asked
01:25:03 ◼ ► Marco about this and said this is a SwiftUI limitation. So okay or at least I see how whatever
01:25:10 ◼ ► he's doing here like it's something that he wanted but it can't do. Okay. It's unfortunate.
01:25:27 ◼ ► where the chapters are. I love the undo button and obviously the audio effects are still the best
01:25:36 ◼ ► ones. Like having used the PocketCast version and the Castro version, the Overcast audio effects are
01:25:42 ◼ ► the best ones. So there's absolutely no question. I just want to make something very clear here that
01:25:47 ◼ ► like Marco would have to mess up this app so bad. Like so so bad for me to not want to use it for
01:25:54 ◼ ► how good that is. Like he has so much latitude for destroying this application if he wanted to,
01:26:01 ◼ ► to like before I would want to switch because of how good it is. Like the smart speed and the voice
01:26:07 ◼ ► boost features are so so good. Industry leading for sure. For sure. I love how fast it is. I was
01:26:15 ◼ ► having some issues with refreshing a Patreon based RSS feed this morning but I know that Marco is
01:26:20 ◼ ► working on some fixes for the new version of the app already so that's fine. The episode eventually
01:26:25 ◼ ► showed up and I love how search because this is something that I do quite frequently. Search lets
01:26:32 ◼ ► me search through my episodes so quickly. Like recently I needed to find a six-year-old episode
01:26:43 ◼ ► of Into the Aether which is one of my favorite video games podcasts and it like searching for
01:26:49 ◼ ► those old episodes in Overcast is excellent. I'm gonna give you two things that I dislike
01:26:56 ◼ ► and hopefully these are areas where Overcast can improve with this new foundation. The first one is
01:27:02 ◼ ► I dislike that the queue is a playlist rather than something that I can access from my now playing
01:27:12 ◼ ► screen. This is something that for example it's something that I really like about Pocket Casts
01:27:19 ◼ ► where I can see what's coming up almost like a music player right. Like the queue is part of the
01:27:26 ◼ ► now playing UI and so I can manage my queue without having to dismiss the player and go
01:27:32 ◼ ► back to the main view of the app. Right now the queue is basically a glorified playlist
01:27:38 ◼ ► and I think it should also be something that you can access from the player. And the second thing
01:27:44 ◼ ► and this is something that I have asked you guys to explain to me multiple times, you have and I
01:27:49 ◼ ► still don't get it. In the home screen of Overcast right next to podcasts it says there's a segmented
01:27:59 ◼ ► control that says current and all. I do not understand what this means. I just wanna see
01:28:08 ◼ ► all my podcasts and I don't understand what's current and what's all. Some podcasts are decided
01:28:16 ◼ ► by Overcast to be inactive because they've not published in a long time. Isn't that something
01:28:28 ◼ ► that I should form as my personal opinion instead of Overcast's opinion? I have this consistent issue
01:28:35 ◼ ► with all podcast apps that do this because people will sometimes let me know why is your show not,
01:28:42 ◼ ► why is your show gone? And it's like well no that's not how it works. Actually you know what
01:28:48 ◼ ► I'm wrong that's not what it is because I'm on current and I can see some things that are
01:28:53 ◼ ► considered as inactive. So some I don't know. I thought I knew but maybe I don't because when I
01:29:00 ◼ ► go to current some of my shows that are listed are inactive are there and some oh okay all right I
01:29:09 ◼ ► think I've got it now. I think I've got it now. I think it shows that you have episodes that are
01:29:18 ◼ ► unlistened to in. That's what it is. I'm always gonna have episodes that are unlistened to.
01:29:26 ◼ ► Yeah but that's what's going on. This tab just makes me feel bad. So this and this is what I'm
01:29:37 ◼ ► I don't listen to every single episode of every one of those. I just pick and choose and put them
01:29:42 ◼ ► in my queue. I'm always gonna have unlistened episodes. So I'm guessing there's always gonna
01:29:49 ◼ ► be something that is current. What I want is I just want to see all my shows. When I tap on one
01:29:55 ◼ ► I see the list of all episodes and some of them are like grayed out or they have a checkmark or
01:30:00 ◼ ► something that says you've played this. That's all I want. Like this if there was like an in-app
01:30:07 ◼ ► purchase to spend two dollars to make this segmented control disappear I would pay for it.
01:30:13 ◼ ► Like just because it visually bothers me. Just like because everything is for me everything is
01:30:27 ◼ ► So yeah but otherwise I'm really liking this update and like this is a very small thing. Like
01:30:41 ◼ ► hope Marco has a new foundation to iterate on this app now. Yep. My only really kind of big thing
01:30:49 ◼ ► UI-wise is I don't understand why different components of what should be kind of the same
01:30:56 ◼ ► thing look radically different. So the screen to manage or skip around chapters is a separate screen
01:31:05 ◼ ► from the show notes which is a separate screen from the EQ and audio you know settings including
01:31:11 ◼ ► the sleep timer and I think show notes and chapters could be one thing but they all interact in
01:31:17 ◼ ► different ways. Like the EQ and the sound effects is a panel that slides up from the bottom. The
01:31:22 ◼ ► other two are full screen but operate in different ways and I don't understand why they're not all
01:31:28 ◼ ► similar and I would like to see that sort of stuff tidied up and that's feedback that I shared in the
01:31:33 ◼ ► beta and again in my blog post so we'll see if that happens but overall I agree with you all.
01:31:39 ◼ ► It's an app that a lot of people including three of us love and have used for a long time and if
01:31:44 ◼ ► this means that he can move it forward in ways that are meaningful again then I'm super excited
01:31:49 ◼ ► for him and you know our complaints are I think minor if he can move the ball forward in these
01:31:56 ◼ ► new ways and I seem to think that he can. Yeah I think we're very consistent on that of like
01:32:02 ◼ ► there are changes and changes to an app that you use this much you kind of question them but none
01:32:10 ◼ ► of that will matter if the app gets the improvement that we want it to get. Yeah. Which is just like
01:32:15 ◼ ► consistent features and and love and care and you know moving it forward so yeah I'm excited for it
01:32:23 ◼ ► it's doing me great you know we've been using it for I don't know like a few weeks a month
01:32:28 ◼ ► or something right through the beta process and it got better during that and I know that
01:32:33 ◼ ► Mark has focused on it and I know that he pays attention to what people have to say and so I
01:32:39 ◼ ► expect that it's only going to get better and only going to get better quicker too so. Yeah.
01:32:43 ◼ ► He did and I would just say like you know listening to him and understanding what he's been through
01:32:49 ◼ ► to get this done he has done something quite herculean it's basically started again like
01:32:54 ◼ ► it's a new app like he may as well have given another name and like released another app like
01:32:59 ◼ ► that's essentially what he has done here like this is not the typical like redesign like this is just
01:33:05 ◼ ► like he went start new project basically and like let's go over again. Maybe should have called it
01:33:12 ◼ ► overcast new year like you remember those names? Neuer. For like 15 years ago overcast Neuer.
01:33:21 ◼ ► And so yeah I think it is quite an incredible thing and we only we only give it criticism
01:33:35 ◼ ► Well I think that does it for this week if you want to find links to the stories we spoke about
01:33:42 ◼ ► head on over to the website relay.fm/connected/511 those links are also in your podcast player of
01:33:50 ◼ ► choice there's also a link to become a member of get connected pro which is the longer ad-free
01:33:55 ◼ ► version of the show that we do each and every week. Except next week. Except next week and we're
01:34:00 ◼ ► off. Except next week. I've been I feel like underscore you know like when they did the
01:34:05 ◼ ► the longer episode of under the radar and now he's like usually not longer than 30 minutes
01:34:12 ◼ ► like so for the last two weeks I've been I've been I've not been I've been really restricting myself
01:34:16 ◼ ► from saying every week. That's fine Mike. So and then like two weeks out and I'll be okay again.
01:34:23 ◼ ► It's fine you know. Everybody will be fine. If you want to find us on oh I didn't finish my sentence
01:34:30 ◼ ► uh you can also submit feedback or follow up there's a link in the show notes for that too.
01:34:33 ◼ ► You can find us all online Federico is the editor in chief of maxstories.net and can be found on
01:34:39 ◼ ► mastodon and threads as vatici. Mike can be found on those social networks as imyke. He's the host
01:34:47 ◼ ► of a bunch of other shows here across relay and is the host of the relay 10 show which is very
01:34:53 ◼ ► exciting. You're like you're only gonna get that once I'm not gonna. I know you know I only want it
01:34:59 ◼ ► once I don't need it any other time like I want it to be you but I think or I think here's the rule
01:35:06 ◼ ► if you arranged it you can host it you can host it and that will typically mean that you will be
01:35:12 ◼ ► back to being host again. Yeah yeah you you are resigning as svp of european events after this
01:35:20 ◼ ► immediately immediately. Tinder my resignation. Time for an election that's what y'all do in the UK right?
01:35:27 ◼ ► Yeah yeah yeah yep. You can find me on mastodon and threads as ismh86. I write 512 pixels.net
01:35:35 ◼ ► and co-host mac power users here on relay each and every sunday afternoon. I thank our sponsors