Connected

00:00:00 ◼   ► Hello, and welcome to Connected, episode 586.

00:00:12 ◼   ► I am your annual chairman, Stephen Hackett, and I am joined by Mike.

00:00:21 ◼   ► Hello, I am the meat inside of this chairman's sandwich, and I have, I am the meat, and I

00:00:28 ◼   ► have the pleasure of introducing keynote chairman Federico Vettici.

00:00:32 ◼   ► Hi, Federico.

00:00:33 ◼   ► Hello, hello, how are you?

00:00:36 ◼   ► Will I always be the meat in this sandwich?

00:00:38 ◼   ► No, because sometimes I'll go first, right?

00:00:40 ◼   ► Yeah, we rotate.

00:00:41 ◼   ► So then I'll be like a hot dog on top of the chairman bun.

00:00:43 ◼   ► We live in a modern society, you can be the meat, you can be the part of a vegan sandwich,

00:00:49 ◼   ► if you want.

00:00:50 ◼   ► Oh, I can be the corn inside of this sandwich.

00:00:52 ◼   ► You can be the tuna, you can be the chickpeas, you get the juice.

00:00:56 ◼   ► I am the impossible meat inside of this chairman's sandwich.

00:00:59 ◼   ► Yes, yes, but you are in between the bread, Mike.

00:01:03 ◼   ► That's right.

00:01:04 ◼   ► The chairman bread.

00:01:05 ◼   ► The gluten-free bread.

00:01:06 ◼   ► Oh, my half of the same.

00:01:08 ◼   ► One is gluten-free.

00:01:08 ◼   ► Are you both gluten-free?

00:01:10 ◼   ► No, I'm not.

00:01:11 ◼   ► I was going to say, gluten-rich.

00:01:12 ◼   ► The sandwich would suck.

00:01:14 ◼   ► He's swimming in the stuff.

00:01:17 ◼   ► Gluten-free bread, impossible meat, terrible sandwich.

00:01:22 ◼   ► Just start again.

00:01:23 ◼   ► No?

00:01:24 ◼   ► Just have a different thing.

00:01:26 ◼   ► Yes.

00:01:27 ◼   ► How are we supposed to do a podcast today?

00:01:30 ◼   ► I'm not even sure.

00:01:31 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:01:31 ◼   ► We should thank our sponsors, Century and Squarespace.

00:01:34 ◼   ► Thank you.

00:01:35 ◼   ► Yes.

00:01:35 ◼   ► Thank you for listening.

00:01:36 ◼   ► Who was supposed to do that?

00:01:36 ◼   ► It's a new year.

00:01:37 ◼   ► New year, same us.

00:01:39 ◼   ► You know?

00:01:41 ◼   ► Clearly.

00:01:41 ◼   ► Clearly.

00:01:42 ◼   ► But no, some things, gentlemen, they are above space and time.

00:01:49 ◼   ► And one of those things is follow-up.

00:01:51 ◼   ► Follow-up.

00:01:52 ◼   ► Follow-up.

00:01:53 ◼   ► Federico, can you...

00:01:56 ◼   ► Two things here.

00:01:57 ◼   ► One, I think we had a question that's not in here, like some background of the Tici scale.

00:02:01 ◼   ► But then, when we graded the year in the Annies, like a month ago, you suggested some changes to the Tici scale, which Kate, the maker of the original scale, has updated.

00:02:13 ◼   ► So you want to go over this with us?

00:02:15 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:02:16 ◼   ► Kate wrote in,

00:02:18 ◼   ► I know you didn't actually discuss Federico's Tici scale suggestion in a lot of detail in episode 583, but I wanted to see if I could draw a quokka.

00:02:27 ◼   ► And this happened.

00:02:28 ◼   ► Please wait to open it during the show if you choose to discuss making any changes.

00:02:31 ◼   ► So, if you recall, I suggested to add, to change the animals and sort of the little figurines at the very opposite ends of the Tici scale.

00:02:41 ◼   ► And I suggested for the right side, so the happy side, the cutest animal on Earth, the quokka.

00:02:49 ◼   ► Let's open the link.

00:02:50 ◼   ► Let's see.

00:02:52 ◼   ► Oh, man.

00:02:53 ◼   ► Beautiful.

00:02:54 ◼   ► Beautiful.

00:02:54 ◼   ► Very good.

00:02:55 ◼   ► That's pretty good.

00:02:56 ◼   ► Somebody recommended, I don't have their name now, and it doesn't seem like it's in the feedback system anymore, changing spider to a mosquito.

00:03:07 ◼   ► Because, apparently, I don't believe this is true, but apparently spiders can be helpful, but nobody likes mosquitoes.

00:03:13 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:03:14 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:03:15 ◼   ► I don't love it.

00:03:17 ◼   ► No?

00:03:18 ◼   ► Because you need, when I look at Nightmare, and I see this spider.

00:03:24 ◼   ► I don't like the spider, though.

00:03:26 ◼   ► It's Nightmare!

00:03:27 ◼   ► But I don't, but the problem is I have to keep looking at the image, and I don't want to.

00:03:33 ◼   ► I like the quokka, because he's just a little happy guy.

00:03:37 ◼   ► You know, he's just, he's probably saying best I love you to me.

00:03:41 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:03:41 ◼   ► But, I mean, honestly, I prefer the bat, if I'm being honest, to the spider.

00:03:46 ◼   ► I don't, I have to keep hiding the spider.

00:03:49 ◼   ► I prefer the bat to come back.

00:03:51 ◼   ► What else could it be?

00:03:52 ◼   ► What else gives, um...

00:03:54 ◼   ► A ghost!

00:03:55 ◼   ► No, I like ghosts.

00:03:58 ◼   ► Me too.

00:03:58 ◼   ► Especially the way you would draw them, you know?

00:04:00 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:04:01 ◼   ► What about a scorpion?

00:04:03 ◼   ► I'm still into a bat.

00:04:04 ◼   ► Scorpion?

00:04:04 ◼   ► Bat.

00:04:06 ◼   ► Still into a bat.

00:04:07 ◼   ► That's me.

00:04:08 ◼   ► Um, I'm very bat-focused today.

00:04:11 ◼   ► Okay.

00:04:12 ◼   ► Well, we can keep...

00:04:13 ◼   ► We can leave it as Kate has done it, but I just wanted to voice my...

00:04:17 ◼   ► Maybe, but this is the point, right?

00:04:19 ◼   ► I'm really unhappy about it being a spider, but maybe that's the point.

00:04:22 ◼   ► Well, let's see.

00:04:23 ◼   ► We can keep thinking about this.

00:04:25 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:04:26 ◼   ► Gabriel wrote in and said, I'm listening to old episodes.

00:04:29 ◼   ► Don't know why you do that, but good luck to you.

00:04:32 ◼   ► Uh, and said, I encountered a recommendation by Federico in episode 22 about an RSS app named

00:04:38 ◼   ► Newsblur.

00:04:39 ◼   ► I'm curious if 10 years later, if this is still recommended.

00:04:43 ◼   ► Uh, no.

00:04:45 ◼   ► I, I like the...

00:04:47 ◼   ► No.

00:04:48 ◼   ► Nope.

00:04:48 ◼   ► Nope.

00:04:50 ◼   ► I like the company behind Newsblur.

00:04:52 ◼   ► I think they have pivoted to doing other things now.

00:04:55 ◼   ► I believe if I'm not mistaken.

00:04:57 ◼   ► Is it AI, Federico?

00:04:58 ◼   ► Probably.

00:04:58 ◼   ► No, it's, it's...

00:05:00 ◼   ► And you have seen this.

00:05:01 ◼   ► We have talked about this, and I think you actually talked about this on Upgrade, maybe

00:05:05 ◼   ► even.

00:05:05 ◼   ► They're making e-ink glasses.

00:05:08 ◼   ► Oh.

00:05:10 ◼   ► We, we have mentioned this.

00:05:13 ◼   ► They are called, let's see, um, uh, Sol, S-O-L.

00:05:21 ◼   ► Yes.

00:05:21 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah.

00:05:22 ◼   ► I think it's the same company behind Newsblur.

00:05:25 ◼   ► Uh, they're making this now.

00:05:27 ◼   ► Um, and as a result, Newsblur is kind of stuck in time from, uh, you know, many years ago.

00:05:34 ◼   ► That is a significant pivot, isn't it?

00:05:36 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:05:36 ◼   ► I mean, it's still about reading.

00:05:38 ◼   ► That's true.

00:05:39 ◼   ► That is true.

00:05:40 ◼   ► But now they're going to blast the feeds into your eyes.

00:05:43 ◼   ► Yes.

00:05:43 ◼   ► Uh, no, my recommendations, Gabriel, are, uh, either use Feedbin or I know Reader.

00:05:50 ◼   ► That's what I think you should be using.

00:05:51 ◼   ► Uh, as a service or an app?

00:05:53 ◼   ► Uh, service.

00:05:55 ◼   ► Okay.

00:05:56 ◼   ► But if you want to talk about clients, I mean, uh, there are plenty, plenty of choices.

00:06:01 ◼   ► Uh, Unread, Lear, Reader, both the classic or the new one.

00:06:07 ◼   ► Uh, Fiery Feeds.

00:06:09 ◼   ► You got so many great options on Apple platforms.

00:06:12 ◼   ► Um, I've been using Lear, Lear, however you call it, after your recommendation.

00:06:17 ◼   ► Um, and I like it.

00:06:19 ◼   ► It does some things that are odd to me, but I'm getting used to them.

00:06:23 ◼   ► Like, they're just some, well, I say odd, they're just different to Reader.

00:06:26 ◼   ► And so, like, I'm just getting used to the way that, that Lear, Lear, I don't even, I don't

00:06:31 ◼   ► know how to say it.

00:06:32 ◼   ► Um, I like thinking every time I open my RSS app, I'm reading the Lear.

00:06:38 ◼   ► I don't know why that's funny to me.

00:06:40 ◼   ► It's just very funny.

00:06:40 ◼   ► Fake news.

00:06:41 ◼   ► Lots of lies.

00:06:42 ◼   ► Lots of lies inside my RSS.

00:06:45 ◼   ► Um, but, yeah, I like that one.

00:06:47 ◼   ► I like that one.

00:06:47 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:06:48 ◼   ► I'm using Feedbin, and then I was using Reader Classic, and it was slowly breaking down.

00:06:54 ◼   ► And Jason mentioned, I think on Upgrade, that he was using ReadKit.

00:06:58 ◼   ► And I used ReadKit when it was new, like, 100 years ago, and I didn't really like the first

00:07:03 ◼   ► version, but the current version is pretty great.

00:07:06 ◼   ► And so, I'm, Feedbin plus ReadKit everywhere.

00:07:08 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:07:10 ◼   ► What is this one?

00:07:12 ◼   ► ReadKit.

00:07:13 ◼   ► Wasn't, no, wasn't it just, wasn't it, like,

00:07:16 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:07:16 ◼   ► I'm not thinking of something else, like a, like it was like a reading list thing.

00:07:19 ◼   ► You're thinking of Mr. Reader.

00:07:20 ◼   ► Mr. Reader.

00:07:22 ◼   ► Remember Mr. Reader?

00:07:23 ◼   ► The Reader is my father.

00:07:25 ◼   ► I also like that Liar has a, uh,

00:07:31 ◼   ► I think it's Lear, by the way, Mike.

00:07:33 ◼   ► I think it's French.

00:07:33 ◼   ► But I've already told you.

00:07:35 ◼   ► I'm gonna call it Liar.

00:07:37 ◼   ► Wow.

00:07:37 ◼   ► I already told you this.

00:07:38 ◼   ► Respect from the French.

00:07:39 ◼   ► I've really spoken like a British guy.

00:07:41 ◼   ► Okay.

00:07:41 ◼   ► Sure.

00:07:42 ◼   ► Well, you know, I've been listening to Arrested History.

00:07:45 ◼   ► So, you know, there's a lot of, uh, anti-French propaganda in my ears now.

00:07:50 ◼   ► You can keep a grudge, for sure.

00:07:51 ◼   ► Okay.

00:07:52 ◼   ► The British can keep a grudge?

00:07:54 ◼   ► Yes.

00:07:54 ◼   ► Absolutely.

00:07:55 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:07:56 ◼   ► They're so mad about all sorts of things.

00:07:57 ◼   ► Yes.

00:07:58 ◼   ► We keep some grudges.

00:07:59 ◼   ► But the thing is, we keep them very quietly.

00:08:01 ◼   ► You know?

00:08:03 ◼   ► But, uh, uh, uh, I forgot what I was saying.

00:08:06 ◼   ► Oh, liquid glass.

00:08:07 ◼   ► That was, I like that it's got a liquid glass design.

00:08:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:11 ◼   ► So I can barely read anything.

00:08:12 ◼   ► It's awesome.

00:08:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:13 ◼   ► ReadKit has liquid glass, but it's very minimal.

00:08:16 ◼   ► Just around the edges.

00:08:20 ◼   ► Okay.

00:08:20 ◼   ► It's a new year.

00:08:22 ◼   ► And with a new year, sometimes trends change, right?

00:08:27 ◼   ► We used to put really heavy filters in all our Instagram photos, and now we're just posting

00:08:31 ◼   ► reels of ourselves dancing to the trauma that we all share.

00:08:35 ◼   ► Have you two seen the trend, the 2016 trend?

00:08:38 ◼   ► Does that come across your radar yet?

00:08:39 ◼   ► Mm-mm.

00:08:39 ◼   ► Oh, people were posting pictures from 2016.

00:08:42 ◼   ► Oh, I did.

00:08:43 ◼   ► Okay.

00:08:44 ◼   ► I did see that, and I had no idea what was going on.

00:08:46 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:08:47 ◼   ► If you don't know why people are doing it, it's odd.

00:08:49 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:08:50 ◼   ► But, uh, that's what's going on.

00:08:51 ◼   ► We were so innocent back then.

00:08:53 ◼   ► Anyways, what I'm saying is beige is the new black.

00:08:56 ◼   ► Everyone on planet Earth sent me this link, including y'all, uh, to a new Spigen case.

00:09:05 ◼   ► And I would say, Spigen has been doing this, this play for years, like, oh, we have a

00:09:09 ◼   ► case that looks like an iMac with the colors, or we have a little Apple Watch stand that

00:09:13 ◼   ► looks like a Macintosh.

00:09:14 ◼   ► This is the classic LS iPhone case.

00:09:20 ◼   ► Limited sedition.

00:09:22 ◼   ► Limited sedition?

00:09:24 ◼   ► Is that what you said?

00:09:25 ◼   ► What else could LS mean?

00:09:26 ◼   ► I mean, that's a good point.

00:09:31 ◼   ► So, it pays, they say it pays homage to the legendary Macintosh 128K.

00:09:36 ◼   ► I mean, it's beige-y, it's boxy.

00:09:39 ◼   ► It's cool.

00:09:40 ◼   ► It is humongous.

00:09:42 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:09:43 ◼   ► It's really bulky.

00:09:44 ◼   ► It has, like, corners that, if you look at the images, it has corners that go out past

00:09:49 ◼   ► the screen.

00:09:51 ◼   ► Um, it reminds me, there was someone that I'm friends with who, her iPhone case is, like,

00:09:57 ◼   ► a rectangle.

00:09:57 ◼   ► Like, it has hard corners.

00:09:59 ◼   ► It's like, what are you, what are you doing?

00:10:00 ◼   ► Like, um, but anyways, this case is awesome.

00:10:03 ◼   ► It's pretty, it's pretty nostalgic.

00:10:05 ◼   ► It's bulky, though.

00:10:06 ◼   ► Um, and, uh, it's, it's MagSafe compatible.

00:10:10 ◼   ► I think.

00:10:12 ◼   ► I should probably try that.

00:10:13 ◼   ► Let me get it.

00:10:15 ◼   ► Well, they do have a MagSafe one, if yours isn't.

00:10:18 ◼   ► Um, it's called MagFit.

00:10:20 ◼   ► It's the, that's the case style.

00:10:23 ◼   ► I like the product imagery that they have, where they've kind of put it into, into, like, fun,

00:10:28 ◼   ► um, environments.

00:10:30 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:10:31 ◼   ► One of them is they've, like, faked a pair of AirPods Pro to look like old headphones,

00:10:36 ◼   ► which I think is, AirPods Max, which I think is really funny.

00:10:38 ◼   ► Mine is MagFit.

00:10:41 ◼   ► MagFitted.

00:10:42 ◼   ► There you go.

00:10:43 ◼   ► They also have a strap that they're selling.

00:10:45 ◼   ► Did you see the strap?

00:10:46 ◼   ► I did, but not, not a strap person like you.

00:10:49 ◼   ► Right.

00:10:51 ◼   ► Uh, it's really nice.

00:10:52 ◼   ► Uh, I think the strap is also really nice.

00:10:54 ◼   ► But while we're talking about Spigen, today, I put my Mac Mini into the Apple Mac Mini Classic

00:11:02 ◼   ► C1 stand to make it look like a Tangerine iMac.

00:11:06 ◼   ► Yes.

00:11:06 ◼   ► So it's now sitting in front of me.

00:11:07 ◼   ► I took it out of a wonderful gift that Stephen bought me, which is now behind me, which was

00:11:13 ◼   ► a tiny, uh, Mac Pro thing, stand, uh, which was very funny.

00:11:19 ◼   ► That was a birthday gift.

00:11:20 ◼   ► Maybe last year you got me.

00:11:21 ◼   ► I think so.

00:11:22 ◼   ► Um, it's that, which is very funny.

00:11:24 ◼   ► Uh, but now it's, now it's nice and tangerine too.

00:11:28 ◼   ► Cause why not?

00:11:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:11:29 ◼   ► I bought this cause I have an M4 Mac Mini now that replaced my dead M1 Mac Mini as my

00:11:35 ◼   ► home server.

00:11:35 ◼   ► And, uh, I bought this.

00:11:38 ◼   ► I didn't know you were buying it.

00:11:40 ◼   ► And like, you sent me a picture of it or I saw it.

00:11:42 ◼   ► I think we were in a meeting and I saw it.

00:11:44 ◼   ► Um, cause it was like on your desk.

00:11:45 ◼   ► Yeah, I picked it up.

00:11:46 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:11:46 ◼   ► And I was like, oh, I actually just did this too.

00:11:48 ◼   ► And it is, it's adorable.

00:11:50 ◼   ► It's great.

00:11:52 ◼   ► Um, we should have fun with our accessories, right?

00:11:55 ◼   ► Not everything has to be boring.

00:11:56 ◼   ► Yeah, exactly.

00:11:57 ◼   ► I do wonder if it's a good idea to put your Mac Mini in a, in a box, but.

00:12:02 ◼   ► You know, it's just, I mean, it's covering the sides and the top and the fan is at the

00:12:09 ◼   ► bottom.

00:12:09 ◼   ► I think it, I think it pulls air in the bottom and blows it out the bottom if I remember

00:12:13 ◼   ► correctly.

00:12:14 ◼   ► I mean, mine's been fine.

00:12:15 ◼   ► Like I've been doing it for a week.

00:12:16 ◼   ► Maybe the air just comes out of the headphone jack or something.

00:12:19 ◼   ► Maybe.

00:12:20 ◼   ► I mean, I, so mine's been on there for a while and I had mine downloading and encoding every

00:12:27 ◼   ► episode of the Computer Chronicles this week.

00:12:30 ◼   ► And it's been fine.

00:12:31 ◼   ► Like I have, it hasn't seemed to overheat in any way.

00:12:34 ◼   ► You do, man.

00:12:35 ◼   ► Look, this NAS is not going to fill itself.

00:12:38 ◼   ► But it doesn't, why does it, it doesn't need to be full though, right?

00:12:44 ◼   ► No.

00:12:45 ◼   ► Okay.

00:12:46 ◼   ► Spinning desks?

00:12:47 ◼   ► Spinning discs in there?

00:12:49 ◼   ► Uh, yeah, yeah.

00:12:51 ◼   ► Okay.

00:12:51 ◼   ► Not like Federico.

00:12:52 ◼   ► I heard you.

00:12:53 ◼   ► I'm not at all SSD NAS.

00:12:55 ◼   ► Federico has an SSD NAS.

00:12:57 ◼   ► Although it's only got one disc in it, I think.

00:13:00 ◼   ► No, two now.

00:13:00 ◼   ► Two now.

00:13:01 ◼   ► Two now.

00:13:01 ◼   ► Two now.

00:13:02 ◼   ► Two now.

00:13:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:03 ◼   ► Mine's all spinning drives.

00:13:05 ◼   ► Okay.

00:13:05 ◼   ► On the Mac mini webpage on apple.com, they have a little illustration of the air.

00:13:09 ◼   ► It comes in the bottom and then circulates and then comes out like the other part of the

00:13:14 ◼   ► bottom.

00:13:15 ◼   ► Sure.

00:13:19 ◼   ► Air comes in the front of the foot and comes out the back of the foot.

00:13:23 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:23 ◼   ► Okay.

00:13:24 ◼   ► There you go.

00:13:25 ◼   ► Equally weird.

00:13:27 ◼   ► Like a George Foreman grill.

00:13:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:13:29 ◼   ► App Stories, Federico talks about some stuff he's up to if you're wondering what I'm referencing.

00:13:36 ◼   ► You can go check that out.

00:13:37 ◼   ► I have a question for you both.

00:13:40 ◼   ► Do you use widgets on macOS?

00:13:42 ◼   ► No.

00:13:44 ◼   ► Not at all?

00:13:46 ◼   ► Stephen, do you use any?

00:13:47 ◼   ► Not at all.

00:13:47 ◼   ► I do.

00:13:48 ◼   ► I have on, in the sidebar thing, notification center that's terrible.

00:13:54 ◼   ► I have a find my widget and the weather and then featured photos.

00:14:00 ◼   ► You don't have any on your desktop?

00:14:03 ◼   ► So, this is new.

00:14:05 ◼   ► I have two on the desktop.

00:14:06 ◼   ► I have my calendar and I have a widget that tells me what time it is in London.

00:14:11 ◼   ► Helpful.

00:14:13 ◼   ► It is.

00:14:17 ◼   ► I, today, remembered I had widgets on my desktop.

00:14:21 ◼   ► I feel like it's a thing that I set up and then kind of forgot that they were there.

00:14:27 ◼   ► Something that really annoys me is with a laptop, if you plug into a display and then unplug it again,

00:14:33 ◼   ► sometimes the widgets move position and I find that really frustrating.

00:14:37 ◼   ► They like overlap over each other, which just isn't helpful.

00:14:40 ◼   ► But, okay, I was just wondering.

00:14:41 ◼   ► I feel like it's a feature that I would want more from, you know, and I don't really even know what I mean by that.

00:14:47 ◼   ► But it's just like, ah, this isn't as good as I thought it was going to be to have these widgets on my Mac.

00:14:53 ◼   ► Especially the Notification Center thing.

00:14:55 ◼   ► It's just so half-baked.

00:14:56 ◼   ► And they never change it.

00:14:58 ◼   ► It's just a mess.

00:15:00 ◼   ► I feel like they made it worse in Tahoe, where now there's, like, two different buttons to clear different types of notifications.

00:15:07 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:15:08 ◼   ► I find it very annoying.

00:15:10 ◼   ► The thing that kills me is they had the perfect solution.

00:15:12 ◼   ► They had Dashboard.

00:15:15 ◼   ► It was, like, a place all your widgets live, and you could go there and then come back.

00:15:18 ◼   ► And then they got rid of it.

00:15:20 ◼   ► Oh, so you just, you don't care about Notification Center anymore.

00:15:23 ◼   ► You just want Dashboard.

00:15:24 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:15:24 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:15:25 ◼   ► Just give me Dashboard back.

00:15:26 ◼   ► You know, for a long time, it was an overlay, right?

00:15:28 ◼   ► They would fly in over your desktop.

00:15:29 ◼   ► And then at some point, it became a space to the left of your first desktop.

00:15:35 ◼   ► Like the Today View in iOS, right?

00:15:38 ◼   ► Well, that's going to go away.

00:15:40 ◼   ► Probably.

00:15:41 ◼   ► I hope not, though.

00:15:42 ◼   ► I've got a bunch of widgets in my Today screen on my phone.

00:15:45 ◼   ► But just bring it back.

00:15:47 ◼   ► Like, give me a dedicated place that's not, like, crammed on the side in Notification Center.

00:15:52 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:15:53 ◼   ► Dashboard was pretty good.

00:15:55 ◼   ► It was really good.

00:15:56 ◼   ► That was a good time.

00:15:58 ◼   ► I liked that a lot.

00:16:00 ◼   ► They should bring it back.

00:16:01 ◼   ► They should.

00:16:02 ◼   ► You know, I actually do agree with you.

00:16:03 ◼   ► They should bring that back.

00:16:04 ◼   ► Justice for Dashboard.

00:16:05 ◼   ► Sure.

00:16:06 ◼   ► These have been our Dashboard confessions.

00:16:09 ◼   ► Thank you very much.

00:16:10 ◼   ► Oh, my God.

00:16:11 ◼   ► You know what I like in Tahoe?

00:16:12 ◼   ► I like live activities in the menu bar.

00:16:14 ◼   ► Me too.

00:16:14 ◼   ► From my phone.

00:16:15 ◼   ► I think that's good.

00:16:16 ◼   ► That's a good thing to have.

00:16:17 ◼   ► I like that a lot.

00:16:18 ◼   ► That was well done.

00:16:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:16:19 ◼   ► Mine didn't work until, like, 26.2.

00:16:22 ◼   ► Okay.

00:16:23 ◼   ► Everything else worked.

00:16:25 ◼   ► Like, I got iPhone notifications and screen sharing.

00:16:27 ◼   ► No live activities.

00:16:28 ◼   ► Updated 26.2.

00:16:30 ◼   ► They suddenly worked.

00:16:31 ◼   ► There you go.

00:16:32 ◼   ► You should shake the bugs out.

00:16:34 ◼   ► Yeah, I guess so.

00:16:35 ◼   ► This episode of Connected is brought to you by Sentry.

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00:17:57 ◼   ► And, you know, I like to think Relay is on that list as well.

00:18:00 ◼   ► We're basically the same as those companies.

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00:18:33 ◼   ► Big news, everybody.

00:18:37 ◼   ► The bundle is back.

00:18:40 ◼   ► On Tuesday, Apple announced Apple Creator Studio,

00:18:45 ◼   ► which is a collection of professional apps and content

00:18:50 ◼   ► and AI features for less professional apps altogether.

00:18:56 ◼   ► And one thing.

00:18:59 ◼   ► Okay.

00:19:00 ◼   ► So you get, for $129 a year or $12.99 a month, which is way less than I pay for Adobe Creative Cloud,

00:19:09 ◼   ► you get...

00:19:10 ◼   ► For good reason.

00:19:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:19:11 ◼   ► Well, those apps are...

00:19:13 ◼   ► You get Final Cut Pro for Mac and iPad, Logic Pro for Mac and iPad, Pixelmator Pro, our old friend

00:19:20 ◼   ► for Mac and iPad, Motion for Mac, Compressor for Mac, Mainstage for Mac,

00:19:27 ◼   ► and then Keynote Pages and Numbers and, quote,

00:19:30 ◼   ► later on, Freeform will get AI features and content that are only available if you subscribe to the old Creator Studio.

00:19:44 ◼   ► Creator Studio.

00:19:44 ◼   ► And that is the Keynote Pages, Numbers, and Freeform.

00:19:49 ◼   ► The apps are free, but stuff inside them you get if you pay, right?

00:19:55 ◼   ► That seems to be the case.

00:19:57 ◼   ► So on the web page, it has examples of, oh, you have, like, they're going to have, like,

00:20:05 ◼   ► kind of like an Unsplash-type tool, with, like, a set of, you know, photos and...

00:20:11 ◼   ► Content Hub.

00:20:13 ◼   ► Content Hub with premium graphics and photos for Apple's iWork suite,

00:20:17 ◼   ► as well as exclusive templates, themes, and AI features.

00:20:20 ◼   ► There you go.

00:20:21 ◼   ► Very exciting stuff.

00:20:24 ◼   ► It's sort of interesting, like, looking at this software over time.

00:20:28 ◼   ► It used to all be together.

00:20:31 ◼   ► Like, you would get Final Cut Studio.

00:20:33 ◼   ► It came in a box with a bunch of DVDs, and then they slowly broke it apart.

00:20:37 ◼   ► Same thing with iWork, right?

00:20:39 ◼   ► It used to be Pages and Keynote and Numbers, and they broke them apart.

00:20:42 ◼   ► And iWeb.

00:20:42 ◼   ► iWeb.

00:20:43 ◼   ► Well, iWeb, iDVD, those were all in iLife.

00:20:47 ◼   ► That's it.

00:20:48 ◼   ► Yep.

00:20:49 ◼   ► But that is broken down over time.

00:20:51 ◼   ► Part of it is because Keynote, Pages, and Numbers are free,

00:20:54 ◼   ► and they've been free for a long time,

00:20:56 ◼   ► which I think is a real good thing for the Apple ecosystem.

00:20:59 ◼   ► Like, I think it's great you get a very competent set of Office apps

00:21:03 ◼   ► when you buy a Mac or an iPad or an iPhone.

00:21:06 ◼   ► So, yeah, this is what we're looking at.

00:21:09 ◼   ► It's going to come in a couple weeks.

00:21:11 ◼   ► And if you're a student or teacher, it's just $2.99 a month or $29 a year,

00:21:17 ◼   ► which I think is awesome.

00:21:19 ◼   ► Like, if you're a college student and you need these things, this is really cool.

00:21:25 ◼   ► And then, as to be expected, if you buy a Mac or a qualifying iPad, rest in peace, iPad mini, I guess,

00:21:33 ◼   ► you get three months of it.

00:21:35 ◼   ► And the subscription supports family sharing.

00:21:38 ◼   ► So, I said this on the NPU that comes out on Sunday, but I'll say it here, too.

00:21:42 ◼   ► The thing that I thought about immediately when I read about the family sharing is my daughter plays the keyboard,

00:21:49 ◼   ► and she's learning guitar.

00:21:50 ◼   ► And I would never have purchased Mainstage just for her to play with it, to see if she was interested in it.

00:21:58 ◼   ► But, like, if I sign up for this, and I do use Logic and Final Cut, I use Final Cut some,

00:22:05 ◼   ► like, I would just get Mainstage.

00:22:06 ◼   ► And I could put it on her MacBook Pro, and she could experiment with it and explore it.

00:22:11 ◼   ► And I think that's pretty cool.

00:22:12 ◼   ► Yeah, but similarly, I do not need motion, compressor, or Mainstage.

00:22:20 ◼   ► Yeah, I mean...

00:22:21 ◼   ► But I now will be paying for them, I guess.

00:22:23 ◼   ► But, like, I'm never going to use those apps, ever.

00:22:26 ◼   ► Like, I will never use them.

00:22:28 ◼   ► I don't even know what compressor does.

00:22:30 ◼   ► What does compressor do?

00:22:31 ◼   ► Does it compress?

00:22:31 ◼   ► What does it do?

00:22:32 ◼   ► I assume it compresses things.

00:22:33 ◼   ► It compresses.

00:22:35 ◼   ► For what, though?

00:22:36 ◼   ► For compression.

00:22:37 ◼   ► Ah, thank you.

00:22:38 ◼   ► I didn't get that before.

00:22:40 ◼   ► Like, I just don't know what it does.

00:22:42 ◼   ► The thing that I'm most excited about here is Pixelmator Pro for iPad.

00:22:45 ◼   ► Like, that is good.

00:22:48 ◼   ► Because I use Pixelmator on my iPad.

00:22:49 ◼   ► I would like to correct some things they were saying.

00:22:53 ◼   ► Because apparently, like, you know, they're referencing, like,

00:22:57 ◼   ► oh, now there's, like, file compatibility between Mac and iPad.

00:23:00 ◼   ► There already was.

00:23:00 ◼   ► Like, if you used Pixelmator Pro on your Mac,

00:23:04 ◼   ► you could open those files in Pixelmator for iPad.

00:23:06 ◼   ► Like, they haven't created some kind of, like, thing that didn't exist before.

00:23:12 ◼   ► Because the reason I know that is because I do that.

00:23:14 ◼   ► But I have, as a person who uses that app and likes it,

00:23:19 ◼   ► like, it is, it has been a shame that there are,

00:23:23 ◼   ► Pixelmator Pro is much more fully featured on the Mac.

00:23:28 ◼   ► And I really like that app.

00:23:29 ◼   ► So I am excited to play around with whatever this new version of Pixelmator is for the iPad.

00:23:37 ◼   ► It looks good.

00:23:38 ◼   ► It looks very modern.

00:23:39 ◼   ► I think of all of them, it's maybe the only one that seems to be liquid glassed, I think.

00:23:45 ◼   ► I don't think any of the other Pro apps have gotten a new design.

00:23:49 ◼   ► I don't know when we're going to see that.

00:23:50 ◼   ► I expect we will, but I don't know when we will.

00:23:52 ◼   ► I can imagine they move much slower for good reason.

00:23:56 ◼   ► Yeah, I saw people that are like, oh, the Pro apps team is, like,

00:23:59 ◼   ► rebelling against liquid glass.

00:24:00 ◼   ► Like, I don't think that's true at all.

00:24:02 ◼   ► It's been the case basically forever that Apple's Pro apps,

00:24:06 ◼   ► their user interfaces are different than the system.

00:24:09 ◼   ► Like, Aperture and Final Cut and these other things, Logic,

00:24:13 ◼   ► they don't look like the rest of macOS.

00:24:15 ◼   ► That's been true forever.

00:24:17 ◼   ► Like, I don't think, I don't want to read into this anything about the iOS 26, macOS 26 design.

00:24:26 ◼   ► So, as somebody who uses Logic Pro, as I do,

00:24:32 ◼   ► that's the one of these that I use the most.

00:24:34 ◼   ► It's an interesting thing, really, because I have Logic.

00:24:39 ◼   ► So, what then?

00:24:40 ◼   ► What happens to my copy of Logic that I paid for now?

00:24:43 ◼   ► Do we know?

00:24:44 ◼   ► Apple has been cagier about this than I think they should be,

00:24:49 ◼   ► but they have said that, I think, to MacRumors,

00:24:54 ◼   ► that there will be, like, some features coming to those.

00:25:01 ◼   ► So, the quote is, and the quote was about Final Cut Pro.

00:25:03 ◼   ► So, maybe it applies to the others.

00:25:06 ◼   ► A one-time purchase will still be available,

00:25:08 ◼   ► but access to some of the premium content

00:25:10 ◼   ► will be available to Apple Creator Studio subscribers.

00:25:13 ◼   ► So, we know that.

00:25:13 ◼   ► Logic Pro and Mainstage have all the same features,

00:25:18 ◼   ► whether they are subscription or one-time purchase versions.

00:25:22 ◼   ► So, they're treating Logic Pro and Mainstage differently

00:25:26 ◼   ► than they are Final Cut Pro, I guess.

00:25:30 ◼   ► They should be much clearer about this.

00:25:32 ◼   ► I think that would be something I criticize them for

00:25:35 ◼   ► in these announcements.

00:25:39 ◼   ► Yeah, or just say, like, pay up.

00:25:42 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:25:43 ◼   ► Right?

00:25:44 ◼   ► Like, this is what it is now.

00:25:46 ◼   ► This is what we're doing.

00:25:47 ◼   ► There's a lot of thoughts on the icons.

00:25:52 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:25:53 ◼   ► I'm seeing lots of thoughts on the icons.

00:25:55 ◼   ► What are your thoughts on the icons overall?

00:25:57 ◼   ► Do you like them?

00:25:59 ◼   ► They are...

00:26:00 ◼   ► What's a good adjective for this?

00:26:03 ◼   ► They're not ugly, per se.

00:26:06 ◼   ► They're unique.

00:26:09 ◼   ► Like, they're not even liquid glass, as such.

00:26:13 ◼   ► They don't look like this because of liquid glass.

00:26:16 ◼   ► They're like, they've got a new style.

00:26:18 ◼   ► They're like lines?

00:26:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:21 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:21 ◼   ► They're basic.

00:26:22 ◼   ► That would be my word.

00:26:24 ◼   ► They're basic.

00:26:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:25 ◼   ► They're very basic.

00:26:26 ◼   ► They're basic.

00:26:27 ◼   ► You know, they got the basic vibe.

00:26:29 ◼   ► You know, like, a basic person?

00:26:30 ◼   ► These are, like, basic icons.

00:26:32 ◼   ► The basic icons.

00:26:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:33 ◼   ► I would agree with that.

00:26:35 ◼   ► They're, like, not even mid.

00:26:36 ◼   ► They're basic.

00:26:37 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:38 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:26:39 ◼   ► Mm.

00:26:39 ◼   ► Six, six, seven.

00:26:40 ◼   ► Oh, God.

00:26:43 ◼   ► No.

00:26:46 ◼   ► Well, this has been fun.

00:26:49 ◼   ► I wrote in my blog post that I love the icons,

00:26:54 ◼   ► and someone texted me.

00:26:55 ◼   ► They were like, is this sarcasm?

00:26:57 ◼   ► I was like, I mean, they're not great,

00:26:59 ◼   ► but they're fun.

00:27:02 ◼   ► Like, you know, they're fun.

00:27:04 ◼   ► Should we tier rank them?

00:27:05 ◼   ► Yes.

00:27:06 ◼   ► Obviously.

00:27:07 ◼   ► Let's tier rank them.

00:27:07 ◼   ► I would like to tier rank them,

00:27:09 ◼   ► but within context to each other.

00:27:11 ◼   ► Okay.

00:27:13 ◼   ► Does that make sense?

00:27:13 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:27:14 ◼   ► So not compared to their past versions or-

00:27:16 ◼   ► Or just icons in general.

00:27:18 ◼   ► Okay.

00:27:18 ◼   ► Just amongst themselves.

00:27:19 ◼   ► Okay.

00:27:20 ◼   ► Yeah, so we have, what, 10 icons total,

00:27:22 ◼   ► Final Cut Pro, Logic Pro, Pixelmator,

00:27:24 ◼   ► Keynote, Pages, Numbers, Freeform,

00:27:26 ◼   ► Motion Compressor, Mainstage.

00:27:27 ◼   ► Yep.

00:27:28 ◼   ► There's a link in the show notes and the Discord,

00:27:30 ◼   ► so you can follow along.

00:27:30 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:27:31 ◼   ► Pull over in your car.

00:27:32 ◼   ► We'll open the bidding at Final Cut Pro.

00:27:35 ◼   ► So it's a single line creating a clapperboard,

00:27:39 ◼   ► and then there's like a frosted area on the inside.

00:27:41 ◼   ► Oh, it's a clapperboard?

00:27:42 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:27:43 ◼   ► Clap on.

00:27:43 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:27:43 ◼   ► And then you can see that, like, the little check,

00:27:46 ◼   ► like the line part that's usually on a clapperboard,

00:27:48 ◼   ► like black and white part.

00:27:50 ◼   ► It's like shining through the purple glass in the middle.

00:27:53 ◼   ► I'm going to assume that the fact that Federico didn't know what it was

00:27:56 ◼   ► probably should suggest that it is not that high up.

00:27:59 ◼   ► No.

00:28:00 ◼   ► What do you think?

00:28:02 ◼   ► This is a C tier at best.

00:28:06 ◼   ► C tier.

00:28:07 ◼   ► Steven, how are you feeling?

00:28:08 ◼   ► I think amongst the ones here, I think it's,

00:28:13 ◼   ► I would give it a B.

00:28:15 ◼   ► Okay.

00:28:16 ◼   ► I think, I mean, so the old one,

00:28:18 ◼   ► I know we're not comparing them,

00:28:19 ◼   ► but I'm going to compare them just for a second.

00:28:20 ◼   ► Like the old one was a clapperboard.

00:28:22 ◼   ► If you're using Final Cut Pro, I think you know what that is.

00:28:24 ◼   ► My complaint with it is the little objects behind the frosted glass,

00:28:32 ◼   ► like it feels like they should be on top of the frosted glass.

00:28:35 ◼   ► Yes, they should.

00:28:36 ◼   ► But, you know, I don't know.

00:28:38 ◼   ► What do you think, Mike?

00:28:39 ◼   ► I would say looking at all of them,

00:28:43 ◼   ► I would maybe put this as a C tier

00:28:44 ◼   ► because it is not very clear what's happening here

00:28:48 ◼   ► where some of the other ones, they're a bit more clearer.

00:28:50 ◼   ► Oh, they're doing something fun.

00:28:52 ◼   ► And I don't really think that the Final Cut Pro logo

00:28:55 ◼   ► is doing either anything clever or fun.

00:28:57 ◼   ► So I, but it's not bad.

00:28:59 ◼   ► So I would say, let's do C tier.

00:29:00 ◼   ► But as always, with a good podcast tier list,

00:29:04 ◼   ► we can move it around when we're done.

00:29:06 ◼   ► That's right.

00:29:06 ◼   ► For sure.

00:29:07 ◼   ► Logic Pro, I would like to open it D tier.

00:29:09 ◼   ► I hate it.

00:29:10 ◼   ► I just feel like we need to do better than it's a vinyl record.

00:29:16 ◼   ► Like, I just think that we could do more than it's a record.

00:29:20 ◼   ► That's funny.

00:29:21 ◼   ► I looked at it and I thought, it's a CD.

00:29:23 ◼   ► Well, it's either, right?

00:29:25 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:29:26 ◼   ► It's either a CD or a record.

00:29:27 ◼   ► But it could also be a tire.

00:29:29 ◼   ► Or it could be a, you know, it's, it doesn't convey music to me in a way that I think it could.

00:29:36 ◼   ► Yes.

00:29:38 ◼   ► What do you think, Federico?

00:29:39 ◼   ► I really dislike this one.

00:29:43 ◼   ► D tier?

00:29:44 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:29:46 ◼   ► I'm really not into it.

00:29:49 ◼   ► Pixelmator Pro.

00:29:51 ◼   ► This one, it's also a little, like...

00:29:54 ◼   ► I don't understand this one.

00:29:56 ◼   ► I don't get it either.

00:29:57 ◼   ► I don't know what they're doing here.

00:29:58 ◼   ► Like, I guess we've got layers, right?

00:30:00 ◼   ► And then what are the dots?

00:30:02 ◼   ► What is that?

00:30:03 ◼   ► Doesn't Pixelmator do vector stuff?

00:30:06 ◼   ► Like, is that an outline?

00:30:06 ◼   ► Does it?

00:30:07 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:30:08 ◼   ► I don't use Pixelmator Pro.

00:30:08 ◼   ► I mean, if it did, that would make sense.

00:30:10 ◼   ► But I didn't know that it did that.

00:30:11 ◼   ► I mean, probably does.

00:30:12 ◼   ► It might not.

00:30:12 ◼   ► I mean, I think it's an F.

00:30:13 ◼   ► Like, it's the...

00:30:15 ◼   ► I mean, it's also just the shortcuts icon.

00:30:17 ◼   ► Yeah, it's like shortcuts with a line that was like, ah, we need to make it different.

00:30:23 ◼   ► And somebody was like, I know what to do.

00:30:25 ◼   ► We'll put a line at the bottom.

00:30:26 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:28 ◼   ► This is F tier.

00:30:30 ◼   ► It's the worst one, I think.

00:30:31 ◼   ► So I'd forgotten about the F tier, which is why Logic Pro is in the D tier.

00:30:36 ◼   ► But I actually do think it's a better icon than the Pixelmator Pro one.

00:30:39 ◼   ► So I'm actually happy to leave it like that.

00:30:41 ◼   ► Okay.

00:30:41 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:30:42 ◼   ► Keynote.

00:30:44 ◼   ► This one's pretty good.

00:30:45 ◼   ► Yeah, it's doing its thing.

00:30:47 ◼   ► You know?

00:30:47 ◼   ► It's doing its thing.

00:30:48 ◼   ► I think it's A tier.

00:30:48 ◼   ► I like that it's a glass panel.

00:30:50 ◼   ► And you can sort of see the stand under the glass surface.

00:30:55 ◼   ► I mean, it's not a masterpiece.

00:30:58 ◼   ► None of these are a masterpiece.

00:30:59 ◼   ► Again, we're ranking them against each other.

00:31:02 ◼   ► You know?

00:31:02 ◼   ► Right.

00:31:03 ◼   ► So there can be an S tier here.

00:31:05 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:31:07 ◼   ► And I think I know what it is.

00:31:08 ◼   ► And it isn't this one.

00:31:09 ◼   ► But I have an S tier.

00:31:11 ◼   ► I do too.

00:31:11 ◼   ► Yeah, it's the McDonald's one.

00:31:13 ◼   ► When we get there.

00:31:15 ◼   ► When we get there.

00:31:16 ◼   ► One thing I like about the Keynote one, and really all the iWork ones, they kept much more

00:31:22 ◼   ► of the history of the icon than the Pro Apps.

00:31:25 ◼   ► Like, the original Keynote box was a lectern with a little chart on it.

00:31:31 ◼   ► And that's kind of always been there.

00:31:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:31:34 ◼   ► And I like that.

00:31:35 ◼   ► I like that they've kept that history.

00:31:38 ◼   ► I would say maybe A tier.

00:31:40 ◼   ► I think A.

00:31:41 ◼   ► Okay.

00:31:42 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:31:43 ◼   ► Yeah, I agree.

00:31:44 ◼   ► And then we got Pages, which is just a really bright orange pencil with a line.

00:31:50 ◼   ► Oh, I thought it was a huge pencil on a really tiny page.

00:31:56 ◼   ► I mean, it could be that too.

00:31:59 ◼   ► Like a massive pencil on a little page.

00:32:02 ◼   ► That's the power of App Intelligence.

00:32:03 ◼   ► Big pencils.

00:32:06 ◼   ► I think it's C.

00:32:08 ◼   ► I like the colors.

00:32:09 ◼   ► I do too.

00:32:10 ◼   ► I like the colors.

00:32:11 ◼   ► Really vibrant.

00:32:11 ◼   ► The colors are good, but I just don't.

00:32:13 ◼   ► It feels so uninspired.

00:32:16 ◼   ► Yeah, it's just two lines.

00:32:18 ◼   ► D tier?

00:32:19 ◼   ► Yes.

00:32:21 ◼   ► Okay.

00:32:21 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:32:22 ◼   ► Okay.

00:32:22 ◼   ► Numbers is good.

00:32:25 ◼   ► Yes.

00:32:25 ◼   ► This is Simplicity done well.

00:32:28 ◼   ► S tier.

00:32:29 ◼   ► No.

00:32:30 ◼   ► Whoa, I disagree with that.

00:32:31 ◼   ► I love the color.

00:32:33 ◼   ► I love the light shining up through the bars.

00:32:36 ◼   ► No.

00:32:37 ◼   ► This icon, first of all, it's giving you the middle finger.

00:32:39 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:32:40 ◼   ► I see that.

00:32:41 ◼   ► And I don't like it.

00:32:42 ◼   ► I like it more because of that, but it doesn't make it S tier.

00:32:45 ◼   ► Because often my numbers sheets do give me the middle finger as well.

00:32:49 ◼   ► I'll tell you.

00:32:50 ◼   ► They often are like that.

00:32:52 ◼   ► I would say B.

00:32:53 ◼   ► B.

00:32:54 ◼   ► Yeah, it's a B.

00:32:55 ◼   ► It's a B tier icon.

00:32:56 ◼   ► Okay.

00:32:57 ◼   ► Freeform.

00:32:59 ◼   ► I think this is good looking.

00:33:03 ◼   ► I think it's an A.

00:33:04 ◼   ► That is just the Freeform logo made in liquid glass.

00:33:07 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:08 ◼   ► That's what that is, you know?

00:33:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:09 ◼   ► And I think if you know what Freeform is, this is doing a good job of showing what the app does, right?

00:33:16 ◼   ► I think it actually looks better than the current Freeform app, which kind of has a weird 1990s diner vibe.

00:33:24 ◼   ► I don't like that, but I do agree with you, but I do agree with you that it looks better than the current one.

00:33:28 ◼   ► It might be the only one that's an improvement.

00:33:29 ◼   ► And I like these generally.

00:33:32 ◼   ► I would disagree with you for some of the ones that we've got coming up, but maybe A tier for Freeform?

00:33:40 ◼   ► Yeah, okay.

00:33:41 ◼   ► I can live with that.

00:33:42 ◼   ► Motion.

00:33:44 ◼   ► S tier.

00:33:45 ◼   ► Whoa, okay.

00:33:47 ◼   ► Yeah, they just ripped off the McDonald's logo.

00:33:49 ◼   ► They just didn't care.

00:33:50 ◼   ► Is that why that's an S tier?

00:33:51 ◼   ► It's so brazen.

00:33:53 ◼   ► Yes.

00:33:53 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:54 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:33:55 ◼   ► I mean, it's literally that.

00:33:59 ◼   ► I don't know if I agree with S tier.

00:34:00 ◼   ► Well, okay, so Federica has an S tier.

00:34:03 ◼   ► Let me pull out my S tier, and then we can see where we are.

00:34:05 ◼   ► Compressor is my S tier.

00:34:07 ◼   ► Compressor.

00:34:08 ◼   ► What?

00:34:09 ◼   ► It is compressing.

00:34:10 ◼   ► Only in the middle.

00:34:11 ◼   ► That's what you need.

00:34:13 ◼   ► It comes in huge.

00:34:14 ◼   ► It's compressed in the middle, and it comes out huge.

00:34:16 ◼   ► That's what you need.

00:34:17 ◼   ► Just to compress the middle part.

00:34:18 ◼   ► Is the compression doing anything?

00:34:20 ◼   ► The middle bit.

00:34:22 ◼   ► It's just making the middle bit smaller.

00:34:23 ◼   ► Is that how it works with compression?

00:34:26 ◼   ► Yeah, I like compressor a lot.

00:34:29 ◼   ► The M in MP3 stands for middle, actually.

00:34:32 ◼   ► There you go.

00:34:33 ◼   ► Sure.

00:34:33 ◼   ► So it's just doing the middle part.

00:34:34 ◼   ► The middle part.

00:34:36 ◼   ► Wait, did we rank motion?

00:34:39 ◼   ► No, we did not.

00:34:41 ◼   ► Because Federico came in with an S tier, and I just wanted to get my S tier on the table.

00:34:45 ◼   ► Okay.

00:34:46 ◼   ► So we considered them against each other.

00:34:47 ◼   ► I...

00:34:51 ◼   ► I could give it a...

00:34:53 ◼   ► I'm torn on motion.

00:34:55 ◼   ► Because they did rip off the McDonald's logo, I don't like it.

00:34:58 ◼   ► But I really like the motion that it actually indicates.

00:35:01 ◼   ► Like, that ball is bouncing, and that's fun.

00:35:03 ◼   ► Can you imagine if they chose yellow for this one?

00:35:04 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:05 ◼   ► That would be amazing.

00:35:06 ◼   ► Get a phone call.

00:35:08 ◼   ► So close, right?

00:35:09 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:35:10 ◼   ► Um, to be honest, like, I was mostly joking about the S tier.

00:35:17 ◼   ► My actual S tier would be the main stage one, because I really like it, and I have no idea

00:35:22 ◼   ► what it is.

00:35:23 ◼   ► Like, it's a fader.

00:35:24 ◼   ► Because I absolutely...

00:35:25 ◼   ► What is it?

00:35:26 ◼   ► It's like a fader on a soundboard.

00:35:27 ◼   ► Yeah, like a volume slider on a...

00:35:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:35:29 ◼   ► Yeah, whatever.

00:35:30 ◼   ► I don't get it.

00:35:31 ◼   ► And because I don't get it, it's so esoteric that it's, like, captivating to my eyes, because

00:35:36 ◼   ► I have no idea what I'm looking at.

00:35:37 ◼   ► What if we put motion, compressant, and main stage as S tier?

00:35:41 ◼   ► What about...

00:35:41 ◼   ► Hey, I had numbers.

00:35:42 ◼   ► Yes.

00:35:42 ◼   ► Come on.

00:35:43 ◼   ► No.

00:35:44 ◼   ► No, not numbers.

00:35:44 ◼   ► No, just these three apps.

00:35:46 ◼   ► These three forgotten apps with the ripped-off icon, the middle compression, and the...

00:35:54 ◼   ► And the who knows what that is.

00:35:56 ◼   ► And the who knows object.

00:35:57 ◼   ► Those are S tier icons.

00:35:59 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:36:00 ◼   ► We're going to get a lot of email.

00:36:01 ◼   ► We did it.

00:36:01 ◼   ► This is the official ranking.

00:36:03 ◼   ► No, hang on, hang on, hang on.

00:36:04 ◼   ► Hang on.

00:36:05 ◼   ► Hang on.

00:36:05 ◼   ► Okay.

00:36:06 ◼   ► I would like to see numbers higher, but I do agree that Keynote's really good, and that

00:36:15 ◼   ► Freeform's better than the old one.

00:36:16 ◼   ► So I don't think numbers belongs of it.

00:36:19 ◼   ► Because numbers is not better than the old one, and it's not doing anything, like...

00:36:24 ◼   ► I mean, because realistically, if we're thinking about the app itself, you're not...

00:36:29 ◼   ► Like, numbers is not a charts app.

00:36:31 ◼   ► It does charts, but that's not what you use it for.

00:36:34 ◼   ► Like, you're inputting spreadsheet data into it.

00:36:37 ◼   ► Like, it does charts.

00:36:38 ◼   ► Charts are great.

00:36:39 ◼   ► But I would guess that most number sheets don't even have charts in them.

00:36:43 ◼   ► The official ranking of the icons in the Creator Studio suite are F tier, Pixelmator Pro, D tier, Logic Pro, and Pages, C tier, Final Cut Pro, B tier, Numbers, A tier, Keynote and Freeform, and S tier, Motion, Compressor, Mainstage.

00:37:06 ◼   ► Yes.

00:37:06 ◼   ► Yes.

00:37:07 ◼   ► We can talk about them compared to the old icons if you want to.

00:37:11 ◼   ► Freeform may be the only one that's better.

00:37:15 ◼   ► The Pro apps are all worse, for sure.

00:37:18 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:37:21 ◼   ► Yeah, there was a graphic that I think a basic Apple guy made.

00:37:25 ◼   ► See if I can find it.

00:37:27 ◼   ► Oh, the someone gets better at icon design over time.

00:37:30 ◼   ► Yeah, that was the meme one.

00:37:33 ◼   ► There was like...

00:37:35 ◼   ► Y'all go look at the current Compressor app icon.

00:37:38 ◼   ► This one, this one, this one.

00:37:40 ◼   ► I'm going to put it in the Discord.

00:37:43 ◼   ► Oh, I found it on threads.

00:37:45 ◼   ► Look at this evolution of icons, right?

00:37:47 ◼   ► I mean, look at the original ones.

00:37:50 ◼   ► Look at main stage, okay?

00:37:53 ◼   ► What is it?

00:37:56 ◼   ► Like a VIP ticket pass?

00:37:58 ◼   ► The original main stage?

00:37:59 ◼   ► Because it's like on the main stage.

00:38:01 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:38:02 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:38:02 ◼   ► And also, the original motion one?

00:38:05 ◼   ► What is that?

00:38:06 ◼   ► Like the thing from Inception, the movie?

00:38:08 ◼   ► That DiCaprio is doing?

00:38:09 ◼   ► Gyroscope.

00:38:10 ◼   ► Gyroscope.

00:38:11 ◼   ► Yeah, okay.

00:38:12 ◼   ► Let me say it to you right now, all right?

00:38:14 ◼   ► I don't know why I said it so aggressively.

00:38:16 ◼   ► You shut up and listen to me.

00:38:18 ◼   ► Jesus, okay.

00:38:19 ◼   ► God, I got something to say.

00:38:21 ◼   ► The motion one is terrible, the old one.

00:38:24 ◼   ► What is it?

00:38:25 ◼   ► It's terrible.

00:38:25 ◼   ► Where is it?

00:38:26 ◼   ► Where is it?

00:38:26 ◼   ► It's terrible.

00:38:26 ◼   ► Where's motion?

00:38:27 ◼   ► Oh, the gyroscope.

00:38:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:38:29 ◼   ► The DiCaprio one.

00:38:30 ◼   ► Okay, sure.

00:38:30 ◼   ► This is terrible.

00:38:31 ◼   ► Like, no.

00:38:32 ◼   ► So aggressive.

00:38:35 ◼   ► The old numbers one is good because it's charts coming from a spreadsheet.

00:38:38 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:38:39 ◼   ► Like the really old one, like the original one.

00:38:41 ◼   ► Compressor?

00:38:42 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:38:43 ◼   ► I like the new one more, honestly.

00:38:46 ◼   ► Oh, man.

00:38:46 ◼   ► I love the old one where it's like you're like squeezing a thing down onto your files.

00:38:50 ◼   ► Pretty good.

00:38:51 ◼   ► We're also squeezing something.

00:38:52 ◼   ► Man, the transition from the current Pixelmator Pro icon to the new one, that's rough.

00:39:01 ◼   ► Like, that icon was beautiful.

00:39:02 ◼   ► Well, the one in the middle, the original Pixelmator icon, I don't like very much.

00:39:06 ◼   ► No, no, the middle, the current one, the middle one.

00:39:08 ◼   ► The current one in the middle is beautiful.

00:39:10 ◼   ► And like, I cannot understand how they got to that.

00:39:14 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:39:14 ◼   ► Like, I don't get that at all.

00:39:16 ◼   ► Like, there must have been something better than that.

00:39:19 ◼   ► Do you think Apple Intelligence made any of these?

00:39:23 ◼   ► No, because they would have been much worse.

00:39:29 ◼   ► No, Apple Intelligence made the current ones.

00:39:32 ◼   ► They would still be much worse, I think, is what he was saying.

00:39:37 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, maybe.

00:39:38 ◼   ► I mean, though, look at the originals.

00:39:41 ◼   ► Especially like, I don't know, maybe I'm growing old.

00:39:45 ◼   ► Maybe I'm nostalgic.

00:39:47 ◼   ► Those 3D icons, man.

00:39:49 ◼   ► Those were like the keynote one.

00:39:51 ◼   ► Like, seriously, the keynote one.

00:39:53 ◼   ► Look at the numbers one.

00:39:55 ◼   ► That lectern looks heavy.

00:39:57 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah.

00:39:59 ◼   ► I kind of want to touch the screen and pick up those rectangles.

00:40:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:40:03 ◼   ► I don't, I don't, I just don't want it.

00:40:06 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah.

00:40:07 ◼   ► That's because you are a, what's the opposite of a nostalgic individual?

00:40:12 ◼   ► You're not capable of nostalgia.

00:40:14 ◼   ► I just live in the now.

00:40:16 ◼   ► Yeah, sure, because you're a hippie.

00:40:17 ◼   ► They're so dark.

00:40:19 ◼   ► All these icons look so dark.

00:40:20 ◼   ► They're not dark.

00:40:20 ◼   ► They're not dark.

00:40:21 ◼   ► They're objects.

00:40:22 ◼   ► They're dark.

00:40:24 ◼   ► Look at like the Pixelmator one.

00:40:25 ◼   ► There's like a shadow over everything.

00:40:27 ◼   ► Have you seen the Creator Studio ones?

00:40:29 ◼   ► But they've still got a brightness to them, you know?

00:40:33 ◼   ► Where?

00:40:33 ◼   ► The colors.

00:40:35 ◼   ► And like the, you know, the ink well.

00:40:37 ◼   ► Why is the ink well so much bigger than the pen?

00:40:40 ◼   ► You know, it's just like this.

00:40:42 ◼   ► I just, I don't have the nostalgia for like the skeuomorphic.

00:40:46 ◼   ► I just don't have it.

00:40:47 ◼   ► Like, it was fun while it was there, but I just don't, I don't long for those days.

00:40:52 ◼   ► The kids, they pine for nostalgia for the skeuomorphism.

00:40:56 ◼   ► Looking at this, I think actually one of the best icons on the icons over time link image

00:41:02 ◼   ► is the Logic one, the most recent Logic one, where it looks like an RIA award.

00:41:10 ◼   ► You know, like your album's gone platinum.

00:41:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:13 ◼   ► That's a fantastic logo.

00:41:15 ◼   ► And it works even in the stupid round rack they put it in.

00:41:18 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:18 ◼   ► Oh, man.

00:41:20 ◼   ► They really massacred some of these apps.

00:41:22 ◼   ► Like, I think the Creator Studio version of the iWork apps are better than the current ones.

00:41:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:32 ◼   ► Page's keynote numbers, as they are currently, they're just nothing.

00:41:35 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:37 ◼   ► No, I agree.

00:41:38 ◼   ► Okay.

00:41:41 ◼   ► Yeah, I'll give you that.

00:41:43 ◼   ► Especially the keynote one.

00:41:44 ◼   ► The keynote one is better.

00:41:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:45 ◼   ► I think they're all better.

00:41:47 ◼   ► The colors are brighter and more fun.

00:41:49 ◼   ► They've got a little bit more going on in them.

00:41:51 ◼   ► Because they'd stripped out all of the flavor from them anyway.

00:41:56 ◼   ► And I feel like you've kind of added a little bit of it back.

00:41:58 ◼   ► And at least now they kind of fit with their friends.

00:42:01 ◼   ► Here's a question.

00:42:02 ◼   ► Here's your question.

00:42:02 ◼   ► Uh-huh.

00:42:03 ◼   ► What's the, you know, you have to choose one because your life depends on it.

00:42:09 ◼   ► Okay?

00:42:09 ◼   ► For some reason.

00:42:10 ◼   ► What's the absolute best icon that Apple has ever made?

00:42:17 ◼   ► Aperture.

00:42:17 ◼   ► Absolute best.

00:42:18 ◼   ► Aperture.

00:42:18 ◼   ► Aperture.

00:42:20 ◼   ► You're looking down the lens.

00:42:21 ◼   ► Yeah, he did it.

00:42:21 ◼   ► Yeah, he did it.

00:42:22 ◼   ► That is it.

00:42:24 ◼   ► The aperture one?

00:42:26 ◼   ► Yeah, that's it.

00:42:26 ◼   ► I think it could be.

00:42:27 ◼   ► It was a good icon.

00:42:28 ◼   ► It was a good icon.

00:42:29 ◼   ► Do you have any other suggestions, Federico?

00:42:32 ◼   ► Let's see.

00:42:36 ◼   ► I mean, I always liked Otto, the automator guy, personally.

00:42:40 ◼   ► I've really liked photos, like the current and like the one prior, like the flower made of

00:42:48 ◼   ► little colored glass chips.

00:42:49 ◼   ► I think that's a really beautiful icon.

00:42:50 ◼   ► I wonder.

00:42:52 ◼   ► I mean, I do like, in general, I liked the version that we had before this where like, y'all talked

00:43:00 ◼   ► about an upgrade, like Tech said it was a page with a pencil in front of it, and the pencil

00:43:04 ◼   ► broke out of the shape.

00:43:05 ◼   ► Like, I thought that general look and feel was really nice.

00:43:09 ◼   ► The round rack, I think, hurts everything.

00:43:13 ◼   ► Yeah, the round rack where the border could be broken, that was the best for me.

00:43:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:43:19 ◼   ► Because it was like, there is a consistency, but also you can add a bit of fun.

00:43:23 ◼   ► Because when they were all just completely random shapes, it's like...

00:43:27 ◼   ► Yeah, no, I liked it.

00:43:29 ◼   ► I get it.

00:43:30 ◼   ► No, I get it, but I feel...

00:43:32 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:43:32 ◼   ► Okay, so I've always had a few favorites.

00:43:34 ◼   ► I pulled out some graphic with all of the Mac OS X icons.

00:43:39 ◼   ► I always had some favorites.

00:43:41 ◼   ► Automator, Graffer, which is this utility.

00:43:44 ◼   ► It was like the 3D shape of, I don't know, like an open cube with like this colorful sheet

00:43:53 ◼   ► of paper inside.

00:43:54 ◼   ► Kitchen, Kitchen Access specifically was great.

00:43:59 ◼   ► Just literally a kitchen.

00:44:00 ◼   ► IWeb, I always liked.

00:44:03 ◼   ► Like the corkboard with the photos and the thing sort of pinned on it.

00:44:07 ◼   ► The original Safari one, like the shiny compass, I always liked.

00:44:13 ◼   ► And there was another one that I liked.

00:44:16 ◼   ► Automator I mentioned.

00:44:18 ◼   ► Finder.

00:44:19 ◼   ► No, no.

00:44:21 ◼   ► Never really spoken to me.

00:44:23 ◼   ► Oh, preview.

00:44:23 ◼   ► Obviously, the original preview one with the photos and the loop on top.

00:44:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:44:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:44:29 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:44:30 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:44:31 ◼   ► Those were some good icons.

00:44:32 ◼   ► They were.

00:44:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:44:34 ◼   ► Anyway.

00:44:35 ◼   ► It's in the past.

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00:46:33 ◼   ► In a, I would say, pretty low-key announcement earlier this week, Apple and Google jointly announced

00:46:45 ◼   ► that the upcoming version of Apple Intelligence and the foundation models that Apple is going

00:46:52 ◼   ► to be building would be essentially powered by Google and Google Gemini.

00:46:58 ◼   ► This will be for cloud models, but expectedly on device models too.

00:47:04 ◼   ► Essentially, Gemini will be powering the Apple foundation models.

00:47:10 ◼   ► We were expecting this to occur.

00:47:13 ◼   ► There was one of the most interesting parts in the statement is this.

00:47:18 ◼   ► Apple determined that Google's AI technology provides the most capable foundation for Apple

00:47:22 ◼   ► foundation models, which I find interesting.

00:47:25 ◼   ► Apple said that.

00:47:26 ◼   ► Google said that.

00:47:27 ◼   ► It's kind of a bit of a mic drop to the AI industry potentially.

00:47:32 ◼   ► But that's the statement as given.

00:47:35 ◼   ► Not really any detail of any kind.

00:47:40 ◼   ► I mean, obviously, the expectation is we will start to see some features rolling out.

00:47:45 ◼   ► I'm honestly feeling like it is essentially impossible at this point that we're going to see anything

00:47:51 ◼   ► before WWDC of Apple Intelligence.

00:47:54 ◼   ► Like, I know that there had been a question of some of these things coming before, but who

00:47:58 ◼   ► knows?

00:47:58 ◼   ► I just have they been working on this for a long time?

00:48:02 ◼   ► Like, who knows at this point?

00:48:04 ◼   ► But we'll see.

00:48:06 ◼   ► But yeah, this is how Apple is going to get themselves out of the Apple intelligence

00:48:10 ◼   ► hole.

00:48:11 ◼   ► Not a surprise, but it was interesting how they announced it, at least.

00:48:15 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:48:17 ◼   ► And especially the joint statement from Apple and Google.

00:48:23 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:48:23 ◼   ► It feels like it's been a while since we last saw these two companies out in the public saying

00:48:30 ◼   ► we're collaborating on iOS.

00:48:34 ◼   ► very much the sort of energy that you had way back in the day with, you know, Eric Schmidt

00:48:40 ◼   ► on stage, you know, at Apple conferences, talking about Google search, talking about the YouTube

00:48:45 ◼   ► app on iOS, iPhone OS.

00:48:48 ◼   ► Well, you know what it reminds me of?

00:48:49 ◼   ► Do you remember the, all of the stuff they were doing together in COVID?

00:48:54 ◼   ► Do you remember?

00:48:55 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:48:56 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:48:56 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

00:48:57 ◼   ► The COVID detection stuff.

00:48:58 ◼   ► Contact tracing.

00:48:58 ◼   ► Contact tracing.

00:48:59 ◼   ► That's it.

00:49:00 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:49:01 ◼   ► Terrible stuff.

00:49:02 ◼   ► Terrible, terrible stuff.

00:49:03 ◼   ► Terrible stuff.

00:49:04 ◼   ► Can we just, can we read the second part of the statement for a second?

00:49:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:49:11 ◼   ► After careful evaluation, Apple determined that Google's AI technology provides the most capable

00:49:16 ◼   ► foundation for Apple foundation models and is excited about the innovative new experiences

00:49:22 ◼   ► it will unlock for Apple users.

00:49:23 ◼   ► Apple intelligence will continue to run on Apple devices and private cloud compute while maintaining

00:49:30 ◼   ► Apple, Apple, Apple's industry-leading privacy standards.

00:49:33 ◼   ► First of all, foundation for Apple foundation.

00:49:37 ◼   ► Terrible.

00:49:38 ◼   ► That is so bad.

00:49:40 ◼   ► Any, like, I don't understand how that passed the first reading.

00:49:44 ◼   ► This statement, I hadn't realized until now how, how this is such a workshop statement between

00:49:51 ◼   ► these two companies because they each get a compliment.

00:49:56 ◼   ► Right.

00:49:57 ◼   ► Google has the most capable technology and Apple is industry-leading or privacy.

00:50:02 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:50:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:50:05 ◼   ► It's interesting.

00:50:05 ◼   ► Really interesting.

00:50:07 ◼   ► So, realistically, and then we're going to talk about, I want to talk about this report

00:50:11 ◼   ► from the information in a second.

00:50:13 ◼   ► But if you just read this statement, it sounds like Apple is using Google technology running

00:50:20 ◼   ► on private cloud compute.

00:50:22 ◼   ► So, they're getting a, first of all, they never mention, like, they never say, like, an AI model

00:50:28 ◼   ► or a large language model.

00:50:30 ◼   ► They're just saying Google Gemini and Google cloud technology.

00:50:33 ◼   ► But it's running on Apple infrastructure, it's running on private cloud compute, and it's still

00:50:39 ◼   ► going to be called Apple Foundation Models and Apple Intelligence.

00:50:42 ◼   ► So, first of all, they did manage to get Google to give them a model that runs on Apple Silicon.

00:50:52 ◼   ► So, a model that doesn't run on TPUs.

00:50:55 ◼   ► One of the biggest advantages of Google compared to the rest of the AI industry is that they do

00:50:59 ◼   ► not rely on NVIDIA.

00:51:01 ◼   ► They have their own TPU.

00:51:04 ◼   ► It's a tensor processing unit.

00:51:05 ◼   ► It's a specialized type of chip for LLMs, for AI processing.

00:51:10 ◼   ► I would assume it's ARM, right?

00:51:12 ◼   ► I think so.

00:51:16 ◼   ► What's the latest one that they have?

00:51:18 ◼   ► Ironwood?

00:51:18 ◼   ► TPU, maybe?

00:51:21 ◼   ► Let's see.

00:51:23 ◼   ► Yeah, it's Ironwood.

00:51:26 ◼   ► It's the seventh generation.

00:51:30 ◼   ► Is it based on ARM?

00:51:31 ◼   ► Well, so, it's weird.

00:51:38 ◼   ► They have...

00:51:40 ◼   ► It's split.

00:51:42 ◼   ► They have a companion CPU inside that is based on ARM, and the rest isn't, I think.

00:51:48 ◼   ► Because my question, my wonder on that was, like, you know, obviously Apple's chips are ARM.

00:51:52 ◼   ► And I just wondered if maybe that was helpful in some way.

00:51:55 ◼   ► But anyway, it doesn't matter.

00:51:56 ◼   ► In any case, so this is the biggest advantage that Apple has, that Google has, is that they control how their AI operates on the chips that they make, right?

00:52:08 ◼   ► So they are not, they don't depend on NVIDIA giving them GPUs and server class GPUs for training or inference.

00:52:18 ◼   ► But to take that and say, well, we got to make sure that it runs on Apple Silicon, that seems like a massive undertaking for Google.

00:52:29 ◼   ► And so I'm guessing that it must have been worth it from a financial standpoint.

00:52:34 ◼   ► The rumor is saying that Apple is giving Google $1 billion for this.

00:52:39 ◼   ► I saw another report saying that it's actually more than $1 billion.

00:52:42 ◼   ► Who knows?

00:52:44 ◼   ► Yeah, the Financial Times said it will be several billions to Google over time, and it's structured like a cloud services contract.

00:52:51 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:52:51 ◼   ► And it sounds like it was done in a few months, which is even more impressive from my perspective.

00:52:56 ◼   ► What, for other AI companies, I mean, what are the other AI companies, right?

00:53:03 ◼   ► We're looking at, obviously, Google, OpenAI, and Anthropic.

00:53:06 ◼   ► Those are the big three.

00:53:08 ◼   ► There's really not a European AI company.

00:53:11 ◼   ► There's Mistral, but Mistral, you know, it's not in the big leagues like these three American labs.

00:53:17 ◼   ► Oh, yeah, sure.

00:53:19 ◼   ► Meta.

00:53:19 ◼   ► But I mean, they believe it.

00:53:22 ◼   ► They believe it.

00:53:23 ◼   ► Whether they are seen as that or not, that's what they believe they are.

00:53:27 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:53:27 ◼   ► So.

00:53:28 ◼   ► Just like they were a metaverse company, and then they were an AR, and then they were a VR company,

00:53:33 ◼   ► and they've just fired all the people that are working on their video games.

00:53:36 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:53:38 ◼   ► So, from my perspective, the biggest loser here is OpenAI.

00:53:41 ◼   ► So, I agree.

00:53:44 ◼   ► Apparently, they turned it down.

00:53:45 ◼   ► Apparently so.

00:53:47 ◼   ► Apparently so.

00:53:48 ◼   ► And because, obviously, there's still, Apple is not saying anything about the ChatGPT integration

00:53:53 ◼   ► that they have right now.

00:53:55 ◼   ► What's going to happen when Siri gets better, and it's based on Gemini, and has a version

00:54:01 ◼   ► of Gemini running in the cloud?

00:54:02 ◼   ► Will it even need ChatGPT anymore at that point?

00:54:05 ◼   ► No.

00:54:06 ◼   ► I think, obviously, that extension, that ChatGPT extension is on its way out, the way I see it.

00:54:12 ◼   ► It's going to be there because they have a contract or something, but they're going to phase it out

00:54:17 ◼   ► over time, if this goes well.

00:54:19 ◼   ► And I assume it's going to go well.

00:54:20 ◼   ► Because Gemini 3...

00:54:21 ◼   ► It's just not going to be needed anymore, right?

00:54:22 ◼   ► It's not going to be needed anymore.

00:54:23 ◼   ► Like, if the whole point is that you're going to be able to have emotional support, world

00:54:28 ◼   ► knowledge, taking actions across apps, like, why do you even need ChatGPT anymore?

00:54:33 ◼   ► You know what?

00:54:33 ◼   ► Up-to-date information.

00:54:35 ◼   ► Where is that going to come from?

00:54:36 ◼   ► Right.

00:54:38 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:54:40 ◼   ► So, I want to talk about this report from the information that they're providing a little

00:54:45 ◼   ► bit more details about how this is actually going to work.

00:54:48 ◼   ► And I'm going to read you some bits and pieces from this article.

00:54:52 ◼   ► Some of the features will launch this spring.

00:54:55 ◼   ► So, some of the features.

00:54:57 ◼   ► You know, Mike, obviously, famously said that he doesn't believe that all of the features

00:55:04 ◼   ► from two years ago will launch in the spring.

00:55:06 ◼   ► I think it is just worth noting, by the way, that I have already ticked off an annual Ricky's

00:55:12 ◼   ► point, which may be the fastest in history.

00:55:16 ◼   ► I think it is.

00:55:17 ◼   ► I've already done it.

00:55:18 ◼   ► It was very fast.

00:55:19 ◼   ► It's pretty great.

00:55:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:55:21 ◼   ► So, let's break this down.

00:55:23 ◼   ► Others, including Siri's ability to remember past conversations or proactive features that

00:55:31 ◼   ► could suggest they leave home to avoid traffic, are expected to be announced at the company's

00:55:38 ◼   ► annual developer conference in June.

00:55:40 ◼   ► And they're not going to ship this year, I don't think.

00:55:42 ◼   ► Still.

00:55:43 ◼   ► So, in addition to the things they promised, they want to have the ability for Siri to

00:55:49 ◼   ► have some basic memory feature, it sounds like.

00:55:52 ◼   ► So, all of the popular LLMs these days, ChatGPT, Cloud, Gemini, they have a memory feature with

00:55:58 ◼   ► the ability to remember previous conversations and recall information from previous chats.

00:56:02 ◼   ► Obviously, Siri has so far been an ephemeral assistant.

00:56:07 ◼   ► You ask a question, you dismiss Siri, that question is gone.

00:56:10 ◼   ► There's no storage, there's no memory.

00:56:12 ◼   ► So, they want to add memory.

00:56:13 ◼   ► And now, this thing I don't get.

00:56:15 ◼   ► Proactive features that could suggest they leave home to avoid traffic ahead of an airport

00:56:20 ◼   ► pickup.

00:56:21 ◼   ► First of all, this fixation on airport pickups.

00:56:25 ◼   ► I still find it so strange.

00:56:27 ◼   ► Doesn't Siri already have proactive suggestions?

00:56:31 ◼   ► Yeah, but it's based on your calendar.

00:56:33 ◼   ► I think both of these features are part of personal context.

00:56:37 ◼   ► I don't think these are separate features.

00:56:38 ◼   ► These are not two features, this is one feature.

00:56:41 ◼   ► Because if you think about it, past conversations, that's information you've given the system.

00:56:46 ◼   ► And proactive features to leave because of an airport pickup, that is pulling information

00:56:51 ◼   ► from an iMessage, potentially.

00:56:53 ◼   ► Will you get me from the airport, right?

00:56:54 ◼   ► And now, the system knows.

00:56:55 ◼   ► Now, that is different to there is a calendar event in my calendar.

00:57:01 ◼   ► Because realistically, that's what I want my phone to be able to do, right?

00:57:06 ◼   ► Like, I shouldn't have to put everything into every possible place for it to know, right?

00:57:11 ◼   ► In theory, right?

00:57:12 ◼   ► Like, why could it not be that Steven says, will you pick me up from the airport?

00:57:16 ◼   ► And I say, yes.

00:57:17 ◼   ► And then my iPhone's like, right, okay, I know that that's going to happen now.

00:57:20 ◼   ► And then if there's traffic, it'd be like, hey, you know, you said you'd go get Steven, right?

00:57:24 ◼   ► Like, wouldn't it be incredible if your iPhone could do that?

00:57:27 ◼   ► Right?

00:57:28 ◼   ► Like, if your iPhone could just, like, know that information, and it just goes like, hey,

00:57:33 ◼   ► what are you doing right now?

00:57:35 ◼   ► You said you'd go pick up Steven from the airport.

00:57:37 ◼   ► Be great.

00:57:38 ◼   ► Because who wants to leave him at the airport?

00:57:39 ◼   ► You want to be left at the airport, Steven?

00:57:41 ◼   ► You know, not for very long.

00:57:43 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:57:44 ◼   ► So there you go.

00:57:44 ◼   ► The iPhone can help you.

00:57:45 ◼   ► You can step in.

00:57:46 ◼   ► But I think these are personal context.

00:57:48 ◼   ► I think that this is a...

00:57:49 ◼   ► Because that all feels like that's the context of what you're doing on your device, right?

00:57:56 ◼   ► Which is the hardest.

00:57:58 ◼   ► I think it's going to be the hardest thing to solve, but will be the most beneficial if

00:58:02 ◼   ► they can actually work it out.

00:58:03 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:58:04 ◼   ► Now, the next point is interesting.

00:58:06 ◼   ► Apple can ask Google to tweak aspects of how the Gemini model works.

00:58:12 ◼   ► But otherwise, Apple can fine-tune Gemini on its own so that it responds to queries the way

00:58:20 ◼   ► Apple prefers the person involved in the project set.

00:58:22 ◼   ► Now, fine-tuning is this process of taking a pre-trained model and optimizing it for some

00:58:34 ◼   ► specific tasks to basically alter the parameters of the model to, in theory, improve its accuracy,

00:58:42 ◼   ► give it more specificity for some particular tasks, reduce hallucinations, have customized

00:58:50 ◼   ► interactions, reduce bias that's in the model.

00:58:54 ◼   ► And you, as a user, right now, you cannot fine-tune Google Gemini.

00:59:00 ◼   ► Google can fine-tune.

00:59:02 ◼   ► It's not an open-source model.

00:59:03 ◼   ► So Apple has been given some access to the fine-tuning process for Gemini.

00:59:08 ◼   ► This will be the platform-specific stuff, right?

00:59:10 ◼   ► Like, for example, if you ask, most likely, and I'm just, I'm imagining this, but I'm pretty

00:59:16 ◼   ► sure that's how it's going to work.

00:59:18 ◼   ► If you ask, like, how can I turn off my phone?

00:59:22 ◼   ► It's not going to give you instructions for a Pixel phone.

00:59:25 ◼   ► It's going to give you instructions for an iPhone, right?

00:59:28 ◼   ► Because the base model, the base Gemini 3 model does not know that it's a model specifically

00:59:34 ◼   ► designed for Apple users.

00:59:36 ◼   ► It just knows that it's a model trained by Google.

00:59:38 ◼   ► And with fine-tuning, you can add specificity, right, for your platform, in this case, if you're

00:59:44 ◼   ► Apple, to optimize for specific tasks and specific responses.

00:59:48 ◼   ► And this is different to, like, giving it a prompt?

00:59:51 ◼   ► Like, what do they call that, like, system prompts?

00:59:54 ◼   ► Right.

00:59:55 ◼   ► Because with fine-tuning, you're actually altering the parameters of the model.

00:59:59 ◼   ► You're not retraining the model.

01:00:02 ◼   ► The model is still pre-trained.

01:00:04 ◼   ► But you're altering some of the parameters and the connections between the parameters to

01:00:08 ◼   ► answer you in a different way.

01:00:11 ◼   ► The risk here, because there's a challenge with fine-tuning.

01:00:14 ◼   ► First of all, it's very costly from a resource perspective, especially with a 1.2 trillion

01:00:22 ◼   ► model, which supposedly is this one.

01:00:25 ◼   ► It's a very expensive thing to do from a technological and resource perspective.

01:00:31 ◼   ► And you have the, obviously, the other risk, huge risk, is the model for getting things.

01:00:38 ◼   ► Because you're altering the parameters contained in the pre-trained model, you're switching

01:00:43 ◼   ► those connections.

01:00:43 ◼   ► And you risk that, in plain terms, the risk is that if you fine-tune too much, the Gemini

01:00:52 ◼   ► model through Apple will be worse than the Gemini model through Google.

01:00:56 ◼   ► It's like if you banged your head really hard and forgot something, then you're not going

01:01:01 ◼   ► to be as effective.

01:01:01 ◼   ► But at the very least, you learned what it feels like to bang your head.

01:01:05 ◼   ► Yes.

01:01:05 ◼   ► You make a new connection, but you lose some in the process.

01:01:09 ◼   ► Some stuff just shakes out along the way.

01:01:12 ◼   ► The information is saying that this model will give Siri world knowledge info and emotional

01:01:18 ◼   ► support.

01:01:18 ◼   ► Lots of people use AI models for, obviously, web searches and just asking trivia questions.

01:01:26 ◼   ► The world knowledge part, like I don't...

01:01:27 ◼   ► Okay, so world knowledge is...

01:01:29 ◼   ► No, I know what it is, but is it going to be world knowledge cut off at a certain point?

01:01:34 ◼   ► But that's not good then, is it?

01:01:37 ◼   ► And the huge question mark there is, and I think I know my answer, but the huge question

01:01:42 ◼   ► is, is this model capable of tool calling?

01:01:44 ◼   ► So is this the kind of model where you talk to it, and if it doesn't know, it tells you,

01:01:50 ◼   ► I'm going to run a web search, and then it comes back to you, right?

01:01:53 ◼   ► That's tool calling in an essence.

01:01:56 ◼   ► Or, you know, will this model have image generation?

01:01:59 ◼   ► Google has a pretty good image generation model.

01:02:02 ◼   ► Is Gemini capable of tool calling?

01:02:04 ◼   ► I assume yes.

01:02:05 ◼   ► It is, even though it's not really used that well in the Gemini apps, but it is capable of

01:02:11 ◼   ► it.

01:02:12 ◼   ► It's pretty good at it, actually.

01:02:14 ◼   ► It's just the Gemini UI from Google is terrible.

01:02:17 ◼   ► So from your perspective, because obviously you know more about this than me and Steven

01:02:22 ◼   ► do, like just the way this industry and the way that things work, they're not necessarily

01:02:28 ◼   ► running Gemini?

01:02:29 ◼   ► They're using a Gemini model to power Apple's foundation model?

01:02:34 ◼   ► Or do you think they're actually just running Gemini?

01:02:36 ◼   ► So I think we're going to talk about this in a couple of minutes.

01:02:40 ◼   ► I think they're going to have this two model approach.

01:02:46 ◼   ► They're going to have a small on-device model, and they're going to have a bigger model.

01:02:50 ◼   ► You know what they're going to have?

01:02:51 ◼   ► They're going to have a router-based system, just like OpenAI.

01:02:55 ◼   ► And I'm simplifying here.

01:02:56 ◼   ► They're going to have a model in the middle, and I think that model is going to be based,

01:03:00 ◼   ► it's also going to be made by Google.

01:03:02 ◼   ► They're going to have a model that's going to make a decision, like, okay, user wants

01:03:07 ◼   ► to set a timer.

01:03:07 ◼   ► It can probably, you know, let me give you an example.

01:03:12 ◼   ► Set a timer for 10 minutes.

01:03:14 ◼   ► Simple enough, run it on-device, go for it, use the Apple model.

01:03:19 ◼   ► But what if I ask, hey, I want to set a timer for cooking pasta the way that a really popular

01:03:28 ◼   ► chef would do it in a Michelin restaurant.

01:03:31 ◼   ► The router would be like, oof, okay, that's a timer, but it's also a very complex question.

01:03:36 ◼   ► I'm going to use the bigger model for this, and then go back.

01:03:38 ◼   ► That's usually what a router does.

01:03:42 ◼   ► So I think that's what they're going to do.

01:03:44 ◼   ► And I think they're going to have some pretty...

01:03:48 ◼   ► It's going to be interesting to see where the guardrails are for that.

01:03:54 ◼   ► Like, how can you trick the system?

01:03:55 ◼   ► You know, all those kinds of things.

01:03:57 ◼   ► I'm going to get to the two most interesting parts of this report.

01:04:01 ◼   ► The first one.

01:04:02 ◼   ► Siri will be able to handle other types of tasks, such as creating a notes document with a cooking

01:04:11 ◼   ► recipe.

01:04:11 ◼   ► I mean, you read this and you're like, okay, sure, what's the big deal?

01:04:16 ◼   ► The big deal here is that they are going to use this model.

01:04:20 ◼   ► And the reason why I mentioned it's going to be able to do tool calling.

01:04:23 ◼   ► They're going to be able to have the output of the big model, the Gemini model running in the cloud,

01:04:29 ◼   ► feed its output back to AppIntense on your device.

01:04:34 ◼   ► Because creating a notes document with a cookie recipe that you find thanks to word knowledge,

01:04:39 ◼   ► that means you will be able to take data from the big Gemini model and do stuff with it,

01:04:47 ◼   ► such as notes, reminders, I don't know, send an iMessage, stuff like that.

01:04:51 ◼   ► So they found a way to integrate, it sounds like, AppIntense with the model.

01:05:00 ◼   ► Unless it's not AppIntense, but it's that MCP bridge that we discussed a while back that

01:05:10 ◼   ► was found hiding in the iOS 26 code.

01:05:14 ◼   ► Remember this?

01:05:15 ◼   ► That Apple was working on this kind of like middleman approach for bridging MCP to something

01:05:22 ◼   ► else on iOS.

01:05:23 ◼   ► I wonder if that's what this is.

01:05:27 ◼   ► Like, you will be able, because if you go to Gemini right now, it doesn't have any idea

01:05:32 ◼   ► what an AppIntent is.

01:05:34 ◼   ► And I doubt that this entire model was retrained from scratch just for Apple, right?

01:05:44 ◼   ► Gemini knows MCP.

01:05:45 ◼   ► That's what it knows.

01:05:47 ◼   ► And I think if you're Apple and you want to integrate it with apps on iOS or iPadOS or

01:05:53 ◼   ► whatever, you need to have some kind of bridge in between them.

01:05:56 ◼   ► Like the MCP language that the model already knows and the AppIntense that you know, you

01:06:02 ◼   ► Apple, that you control, but the model has no idea what they are.

01:06:05 ◼   ► So I think that's what they're doing.

01:06:07 ◼   ► Okay.

01:06:09 ◼   ► And lastly, while certain common Siri tasks such as setting a timer, reminder, or sending

01:06:13 ◼   ► a specific text message to a phone contact will continue to be powered by technology stored

01:06:18 ◼   ► on Apple devices, the new version of Siri would also be able to handle instances in which

01:06:24 ◼   ► the customer's question isn't clearly understood.

01:06:27 ◼   ► And they give this example of asking to send a message to a contact, but the Siri doesn't

01:06:33 ◼   ► understand the question and it goes off to the model in the cloud and the model in the

01:06:37 ◼   ► cloud parses the question, goes back and you send the message.

01:06:41 ◼   ► So that's what I mentioned before with the two model approach.

01:06:43 ◼   ► Fascinating stuff that only, if this is actually true, right?

01:06:48 ◼   ► Because this is a report from the information and we're not able to test it and this is not

01:06:53 ◼   ► out yet.

01:06:53 ◼   ► But if this is true, fascinating tech from my perspective that you have two models sort of

01:07:00 ◼   ► feeding off of each other and communicating and performing actions and going to the cloud

01:07:05 ◼   ► when needed, running on device when needed, and being able to interchange data, that'd be

01:07:12 ◼   ► pretty cool if it works.

01:07:13 ◼   ► Nobody else is doing it because obviously nobody else.

01:07:17 ◼   ► I mean, Google could do it, but Google doesn't really care about on-device models.

01:07:22 ◼   ► And no one else has the need that Apple does, right?

01:07:26 ◼   ► Yes.

01:07:27 ◼   ► Google is the other big platform.

01:07:29 ◼   ► They have their own.

01:07:30 ◼   ► Like you said, they don't care about on-device.

01:07:33 ◼   ► Well, Apple, clear their own work in a foundation model has failed or not gotten them where they

01:07:39 ◼   ► want to be.

01:07:39 ◼   ► And they are, you know, I'm going to say backed into a corner, but I think it's the right corner

01:07:46 ◼   ► to be in of like, we want as much of this as possible to run locally.

01:07:49 ◼   ► And so Apple really is in a position that no one else is right now.

01:07:54 ◼   ► And I'm sure that there are people at Apple who just hate that they have to go do this,

01:08:01 ◼   ► right?

01:08:01 ◼   ► That they really thought they could do it themselves.

01:08:03 ◼   ► They want to do it themselves, but have been unable to do it.

01:08:07 ◼   ► And, you know, as they would-

01:08:08 ◼   ► Especially the people whose job it was.

01:08:10 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:08:10 ◼   ► They were sure they hate it the most.

01:08:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:08:12 ◼   ► And, you know, a lot of them probably aren't there.

01:08:14 ◼   ► So it's, it is just such an interesting time to see Apple use an outside company's technology

01:08:24 ◼   ► to feature or to depower what, what could and should be a core feature of their ecosystem.

01:08:29 ◼   ► Like it just doesn't happen very often.

01:08:32 ◼   ► And it's, um, it's going to be very interesting to see what I'm kind of most curious about is

01:08:39 ◼   ► when this stuff rolls out, how does Apple talk about it?

01:08:42 ◼   ► Like forget WWDC, forget the developer, um, state of the union, but like when this, like

01:08:50 ◼   ► when this rolls out to people's phones in a year or whenever it is, is Google or Gemini,

01:08:57 ◼   ► is that going to be anywhere?

01:08:58 ◼   ► Right.

01:08:59 ◼   ► Is it, are people going to know that, oh, when I'm doing this, it's not, you know, I

01:09:06 ◼   ► don't think most people care, but it's just going to be very interesting to see how Apple

01:09:09 ◼   ► handles that in their messaging.

01:09:10 ◼   ► I think.

01:09:11 ◼   ► I figured I'd just call it Apple intelligence because like my initial thought is like, oh,

01:09:16 ◼   ► the Apple intelligence name is tarnished, but it's not like they ever rebranded Siri.

01:09:21 ◼   ► So I figured they just keep calling it Apple intelligence and they just try and like brute force

01:09:28 ◼   ► their way through this thing.

01:09:29 ◼   ► And, and, and realistically, if they actually make it work, I don't think it will matter

01:09:35 ◼   ► what it's called.

01:09:36 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:09:38 ◼   ► Like if they actually can get these phones to do the things that they think that they'll

01:09:42 ◼   ► be able to do with this technology, I don't think it will.

01:09:45 ◼   ► It is not in Apple's interest in the longterm to call this Google Gemini.

01:09:50 ◼   ► I think.

01:09:52 ◼   ► I think you're probably right.

01:09:54 ◼   ► because also, you know, I'm sure there are people inside of Apple that believe that one

01:10:00 ◼   ► day they'll be able to do this themselves and get rid of Google.

01:10:03 ◼   ► I don't believe that.

01:10:05 ◼   ► I think that that, I think the longer we go, the less likely that becomes.

01:10:11 ◼   ► Because it just feels like this is such a difficult and expensive technology in the way that we

01:10:20 ◼   ► understand it right now to develop, that if you're not doing it, like actively doing it,

01:10:26 ◼   ► you're going to fall behind.

01:10:27 ◼   ► That's my view on it, but I don't know.

01:10:29 ◼   ► But like, there can be many things that change between now and five years from now about the

01:10:34 ◼   ► way this kind of technology is developed, right?

01:10:36 ◼   ► But it just feels like if you haven't got it going, you're going to really struggle to

01:10:40 ◼   ► get it going.

01:10:41 ◼   ► And it doesn't really necessarily feel like money is the thing that solves it.

01:10:45 ◼   ► Because if it was, Meta and Apple would have just as good a technology as OpenAI, but they

01:10:51 ◼   ► don't.

01:10:52 ◼   ► Fascinating stuff.

01:10:54 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:10:55 ◼   ► So, when do we think this is happening?

01:10:59 ◼   ► I mean, I expect something ships in September, but I don't think it's going to be everything.

01:11:05 ◼   ► No, no, no.

01:11:05 ◼   ► I mean the integration.

01:11:07 ◼   ► When do we think it's happening?

01:11:08 ◼   ► Like March?

01:11:09 ◼   ► I think WWDC.

01:11:10 ◼   ► WWDC.

01:11:11 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:12 ◼   ► I think it's iOS 27.

01:11:14 ◼   ► I could see, though, before then, maybe like the OpenAI extension, maybe they roll out a

01:11:21 ◼   ► Gemini extension and you can choose between the two.

01:11:23 ◼   ► Maybe there'll be little things, like maybe Google's image generation stuff gets plugged

01:11:30 ◼   ► into image playgrounds the way OpenAI is now.

01:11:33 ◼   ► But I think like the big deal, right?

01:11:36 ◼   ► The full integration, better Siri, all that stuff.

01:11:39 ◼   ► I think that's iOS 27.

01:11:41 ◼   ► It's like, what would even ship in 26?

01:11:43 ◼   ► Like, what would it be?

01:11:44 ◼   ► What would the feature be?

01:11:45 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:11:46 ◼   ► I mean, I think it's the things I said, like it's extensions to things we already have where

01:11:50 ◼   ► it becomes an option versus OpenAI.

01:11:52 ◼   ► I mean, like of the Apple intelligence features that we believe we are going to get based on

01:11:58 ◼   ► the stuff that they originally showed off at WWDC 2024, you know, what realistically could

01:12:04 ◼   ► ship in 26?

01:12:06 ◼   ► And I just don't, I just don't know what that could be or what would be.

01:12:12 ◼   ► Like, why would you not spend more time on it?

01:12:14 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:15 ◼   ► Maybe just the extension, like Steven said.

01:12:17 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:18 ◼   ► I could see that.

01:12:19 ◼   ► But yeah, I was kind of hoping that they would do it before, but you kind of made me change

01:12:26 ◼   ► my mind.

01:12:27 ◼   ► They're going to do it in 27.

01:12:29 ◼   ► It feels like this maybe came together a little slower.

01:12:32 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:12:33 ◼   ► My theory on it is that they were waiting for the antitrust stuff to be dealt with.

01:12:39 ◼   ► Or this has been done for years.

01:12:41 ◼   ► And like you said, it took a lot of time to get the language right in the announcement.

01:12:45 ◼   ► I'm just kidding.

01:12:47 ◼   ► It's just a joke, guys.

01:12:48 ◼   ► Oh, okay.

01:12:49 ◼   ► Everybody settle down.

01:12:50 ◼   ► No, for sure.

01:12:51 ◼   ► For sure.

01:12:52 ◼   ► It was the antitrust stuff, right?

01:12:53 ◼   ► If the court had said Google can't get a bag of cash and give it to Apple to be the default

01:13:01 ◼   ► search engine, like then there's no way this could happen in that environment.

01:13:06 ◼   ► But that's not what happened.

01:13:07 ◼   ► That is preserved.

01:13:08 ◼   ► And like the money flowing both ways, it's all fake anyways, right?

01:13:12 ◼   ► Like Apple paying billions of dollars, it's just going to come out of the search fee, right?

01:13:16 ◼   ► It's going to write a smaller check.

01:13:17 ◼   ► So that, I think, had to be preserved for this to move forward, at least in the way that it's

01:13:23 ◼   ► now going to.

01:13:23 ◼   ► Pretty cool if you're Google, though, right?

01:13:27 ◼   ► It's great.

01:13:28 ◼   ► It's great if you're Google.

01:13:28 ◼   ► Powering their AI on every smartphone?

01:13:30 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

01:13:32 ◼   ► Or at least, you know, every smartphone that's not in China, right?

01:13:36 ◼   ► I mean, it's, it is, they're going to have the foundation model on both major smartphone

01:13:42 ◼   ► platforms.

01:13:43 ◼   ► Yep.

01:13:44 ◼   ► Wild.

01:13:45 ◼   ► Well, I think that does it for this week.

01:13:49 ◼   ► Thank you for joining us.

01:13:51 ◼   ► Thank you for, uh, sitting through us arguing about icons.

01:13:55 ◼   ► Lots of good stuff.

01:13:55 ◼   ► If you have feedback or follow-up, you can send us a note.

01:14:00 ◼   ► There's a link in the show notes to our feedback form, or you can go to connectedfeedback.com

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01:14:13 ◼   ► pro, which is the longer and ad-free version of the show we do each and every week.

01:14:17 ◼   ► This week, we talked about our friends and family's reaction to liquid glass over the

01:14:23 ◼   ► holidays, um, and, uh, suggestion from someone's parents about who should replace Tim Cook.

01:14:28 ◼   ► It was, it was a wild time at the top of the show.

01:14:32 ◼   ► It's not what you think.

01:14:33 ◼   ► It's not, for real, it's not what you think.

01:14:36 ◼   ► It's not what you think.

01:14:37 ◼   ► Not what you think.

01:14:38 ◼   ► It is not what you think.

01:14:40 ◼   ► If you want to find more of Federico, you can stand outside his apartment, or you can go

01:14:45 ◼   ► to macstories.net and, uh, follow the team's work over there.

01:14:49 ◼   ► You can also find more of Mike.

01:14:52 ◼   ► He hosts a bunch of shows here on Relay, and he writes at theenthusiast.net.

01:14:58 ◼   ► You can find my writing at 512pixels, and I co-host Mac Power Users here on Relay, and, uh...

01:15:06 ◼   ► I'd like to thank our sponsors.

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01:15:08 ◼   ► It's been a minute, and I'm still finding my, finding my feet again.

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01:15:16 ◼   ► of the show.

01:15:17 ◼   ► And until next time, guys, say goodbye.

01:15:19 ◼   ► Adividechi.

01:15:20 ◼   ► Cheerio.

01:15:21 ◼   ► Bye, y'all.