The Talk Show

173: ‘Fork the Universe’, With Special Guest Jason Snell


00:00:00   you know I can't believe i missed the [TS]

00:00:01   holiday party again is a different kind [TS]

00:00:05   of anything interesting happen in the [TS]

00:00:09   last few weeks now quiet peaceful [TS]

00:00:12   tumbleweed roll by [TS]

00:00:14   yeah you know not much apple doesn't [TS]

00:00:17   really do much in the fall you have to [TS]

00:00:31   laugh a little [TS]

00:00:32   despite do i was talking about what the [TS]

00:00:35   other day about we're on a walk and I [TS]

00:00:37   said you know I feel like it's been [TS]

00:00:39   going nonstop for a long time and I [TS]

00:00:41   realized it totally had been going [TS]

00:00:42   nonstop for a long time we went to win [TS]

00:00:45   to Ireland for all and I realized like [TS]

00:00:48   literally I went to the apple event in [TS]

00:00:50   the next drag on a plane and went to [TS]

00:00:52   this event in Southern California this [TS]

00:00:54   festival over the weekend and then from [TS]

00:00:56   there I went basically straight to all [TS]

00:00:57   and in the middle there like I got the [TS]

00:01:00   one review unit of the of the macbook [TS]

00:01:02   pro and then like the day after I came [TS]

00:01:04   back from Ireland I got the touch bar [TS]

00:01:07   review unit with the macbook pro and it [TS]

00:01:10   just it like it is non-stop like one [TS]

00:01:12   thing after another all fault you know [TS]

00:01:14   what I mean it's you know but it you [TS]

00:01:17   know tough life for us you know I mean [TS]

00:01:20   but you know it's amazing new computers [TS]

00:01:22   before anybody gets them while getting [TS]

00:01:24   around the globe to meet interesting [TS]

00:01:26   people but it has been activated [TS]

00:01:30   yeah i mean i'm not i'm not complaining [TS]

00:01:32   it is it is a privilege to do this but [TS]

00:01:33   uh but it's the high season [TS]

00:01:35   I mean that's what I keep telling [TS]

00:01:36   telling people that I season this is [TS]

00:01:38   this when everything is happening for [TS]

00:01:39   for Apple it's like this this time [TS]

00:01:41   period in like WWDC or the craziest [TS]

00:01:43   times of the year i think this is [TS]

00:01:45   crazier honestly for us i have because [TS]

00:01:48   just step that I don't know somehow to [TS]

00:01:51   me even that several weeks long period [TS]

00:01:55   between the iphone 7 coming out and the [TS]

00:01:58   macbook man I don't know that somehow [TS]

00:02:01   seemed jam-packed with stuff to your [TS]

00:02:04   rules in Apple watch this you know two [TS]

00:02:07   roles in there and yeah I mean there's a [TS]

00:02:11   lot going on a lot lot of stuff going on [TS]

00:02:13   anyway long story short just wasn't a [TS]

00:02:15   good time for an election that i had a [TS]

00:02:17   like hundred and ten percent obsessive [TS]

00:02:20   interest in to know what ya do stuff [TS]

00:02:24   like stuff going on it was a it was a [TS]

00:02:27   busy fall I do feel like we've reached [TS]

00:02:28   you know it's all subsided a little bit [TS]

00:02:31   now and I I feel like that mentally I'm [TS]

00:02:33   starting to shift gears I still got some [TS]

00:02:35   stuff that I put off that I need to pick [TS]

00:02:37   back up again but it's like mental [TS]

00:02:38   shifting gears into you know holidays [TS]

00:02:40   end-of-year people you know if you want [TS]

00:02:43   to make a holiday stories and gift [TS]

00:02:45   guides and best of yes and stuff like [TS]

00:02:48   that it's starting to feel more like [TS]

00:02:50   that at last night which is good guys [TS]

00:02:52   like Thanksgiving six next week's oh [TS]

00:02:54   here it is [TS]

00:02:56   I thought it was a little bit back book [TS]

00:02:58   pro review I I got all I got three of [TS]

00:03:02   them i got i got the the button one [TS]

00:03:04   where they call it work on the macbook [TS]

00:03:06   escape [TS]

00:03:07   I guess we are making to capture any [TS]

00:03:09   album but you know whatever i know i got [TS]

00:03:11   that the same time you did we got that [TS]

00:03:13   the day of the event [TS]

00:03:14   yeah they had those I i got the 13-inch [TS]

00:03:18   with touch bar I don't have a week later [TS]

00:03:20   about at least a week later I don't that [TS]

00:03:22   sounds right days what was a week I was [TS]

00:03:24   in Ireland because I which is the week [TS]

00:03:26   after the event because i got an email [TS]

00:03:27   from apple on like a wednesday in [TS]

00:03:29   Ireland saying can you come by cupertino [TS]

00:03:30   on thursday to pick up your your 13-inch [TS]

00:03:32   macbook with touch bar and I was like uh [TS]

00:03:34   no [TS]

00:03:36   and so I didn't get that one and then I [TS]

00:03:39   got the 15-inch I don't know but that [TS]

00:03:42   was later 15 inches [TS]

00:03:43   it was really only just a few days [TS]

00:03:45   before the embargo deadline so i opened [TS]

00:03:48   it and turned it on and and looked at it [TS]

00:03:50   but I spent much less time with the [TS]

00:03:52   15-inch simply because i already had the [TS]

00:03:54   13-inch with the touch bar setup right [TS]

00:03:56   with my stuff you know it's a I've got [TS]

00:03:59   bbedit on it and you know i have I it's [TS]

00:04:03   just there and emptied little you know [TS]

00:04:05   the thing I do to wrap blockquote so [TS]

00:04:07   they all look like nice markdown [TS]

00:04:08   blockquote that's alright and if you're [TS]

00:04:11   not that we're complaining about getting [TS]

00:04:12   review units but you know onboarding to [TS]

00:04:14   a new mac is a lot of work and when you [TS]

00:04:16   have to do it three times in three weeks [TS]

00:04:18   we go here we go again like what would [TS]

00:04:21   files what do I installed come on my [TS]

00:04:23   grade no i don't really want to migrate [TS]

00:04:24   but then i have to install everything [TS]

00:04:26   I've done you know big hook up with [TS]

00:04:28   dropbox and I don't know about you I i [TS]

00:04:32   also have to juggle like they're these [TS]

00:04:34   hard breaks up like five authorized [TS]

00:04:36   itunes computers and like not authorized [TS]

00:04:39   Apple music devices [TS]

00:04:40   yeah and so I'm always juggling like [TS]

00:04:42   logging out of of different iPads and [TS]

00:04:44   phones and stuff in order to get slots [TS]

00:04:46   back to put other computers in there and [TS]

00:04:49   it's a yeah so it's again not [TS]

00:04:51   complaining it's it's great that we get [TS]

00:04:52   to do this for our job but you know like [TS]

00:04:54   that all of this stuff is not meant to [TS]

00:04:55   be done as frequently as we do him so [TS]

00:04:58   yeah I i I'm even little things I've run [TS]

00:05:02   into a little thing where my amex card [TS]

00:05:06   has a maximum limit on how many apple to [TS]

00:05:08   pick up a devices that can be hooked up [TS]

00:05:10   to [TS]

00:05:10   uh-huh and oh yeah and you know and it's [TS]

00:05:13   uu it it's magnified because it's like [TS]

00:05:17   to now you get two phones when they give [TS]

00:05:18   you review phone to give you one of each [TS]

00:05:20   size and it's like I got iPads and stuff [TS]

00:05:23   and it's like I don't even know what you [TS]

00:05:24   know and some of them i foolishly left [TS]

00:05:27   named John's ipad so it's like all right [TS]

00:05:31   it's like what [TS]

00:05:33   which one is that I don't mean what and [TS]

00:05:36   I just usually the they're like updates [TS]

00:05:38   that reset the name so I realized the [TS]

00:05:40   other day that my ipad is called the [TS]

00:05:42   ipad again it's like well I don't know [TS]

00:05:43   when that happened but it's like no [TS]

00:05:44   wonder I went on my device list my soft [TS]

00:05:47   three things named ipad and had no idea [TS]

00:05:50   which was which [TS]

00:05:51   it's yeah it's a lie i have been able to [TS]

00:05:54   Apple pay i've been testing the apple [TS]

00:05:56   watch two and i actually I'm written [TS]

00:05:57   about that yet but they can't do Apple [TS]

00:05:59   pay because it's just I think my um my [TS]

00:06:01   financial institutions have given up on [TS]

00:06:03   me and they're like no no more devices [TS]

00:06:05   for you every time I hear it's like I [TS]

00:06:08   can't even forget it you know [TS]

00:06:10   oh and my bank as sometimes what I've [TS]

00:06:12   done is I i generally if i use a charge [TS]

00:06:15   card i use my amex it's just I just use [TS]

00:06:18   it everywhere and the only times I ever [TS]

00:06:19   don't use it isn't a place that doesn't [TS]

00:06:21   take amex [TS]

00:06:24   but to get around this amex limit if I [TS]

00:06:27   have a device that i'm testing from [TS]

00:06:28   apple that I don't really want to spend [TS]

00:06:31   i know i'm not gonna spend a ton of time [TS]

00:06:33   on you know like for example at WWDC [TS]

00:06:37   they gave me a an Apple watch with the [TS]

00:06:41   beta of watch us three-mile which wich [TS]

00:06:44   like it's like I think that's one thing [TS]

00:06:46   i don't know but at some point they gave [TS]

00:06:48   it to me it wasn't a new hardware it was [TS]

00:06:50   just you know here you could try this [TS]

00:06:51   thing out with the watch was three and I [TS]

00:06:53   thought that's interesting but it's not [TS]

00:06:54   just I'll just put the watches 3 beta on [TS]

00:06:56   my own wife watch you know I mean and so [TS]

00:06:58   I didn't you know I didn't want to go [TS]

00:07:00   put this amex limit on it so i use my [TS]

00:07:02   other card [TS]

00:07:03   my my my bank sends me a letter in the [TS]

00:07:05   mail every time I set up Apple pay that [TS]

00:07:07   it's like congratulate it's so totally [TS]

00:07:09   written from the perspective of like [TS]

00:07:11   you're going to have one device you know [TS]

00:07:13   that you do this with will tell you [TS]

00:07:15   everything how it works and you know and [TS]

00:07:17   I just keep it's like I I should have [TS]

00:07:19   kept all the letters because i bet i've [TS]

00:07:20   got 15 of them by now [TS]

00:07:22   well I i think the advantage of this is [TS]

00:07:24   it so easy in so many different ways [TS]

00:07:27   that you do you review tech products to [TS]

00:07:30   lose perspective if you're not careful [TS]

00:07:31   and this is like the reverse of that [TS]

00:07:34   which is there's nobody I think more [TS]

00:07:38   aware of the pain of of basically [TS]

00:07:42   upgrading to a new device then reviewers [TS]

00:07:45   because we have to do it like with every [TS]

00:07:48   device look for a while there I could [TS]

00:07:49   tell you everything you need to do to [TS]

00:07:51   migrate from a macbook to another [TS]

00:07:54   macbook or from a powerbook to another [TS]

00:07:56   power book because i was reviewing all [TS]

00:07:58   the laptops at macworld and so like I [TS]

00:08:00   would go through i would migrate [TS]

00:08:02   everything a couple times a year and so [TS]

00:08:06   I mean that's good because we get to [TS]

00:08:07   experience that and I think apples got [TS]

00:08:09   some issues with with the migration [TS]

00:08:11   assistant on the mac and with some stuff [TS]

00:08:13   they're getting better but like you know [TS]

00:08:14   they've got some issues there and those [TS]

00:08:16   really come out when you're migrating [TS]

00:08:17   multiple times a year because regular [TS]

00:08:20   people only might do it once a year for [TS]

00:08:21   a phone and once every several years for [TS]

00:08:24   an ipad or your Mac I i have spoken I i [TS]

00:08:27   still think it's too hard on a Mac but [TS]

00:08:28   yeah and I think part of it is because I [TS]

00:08:32   don't [TS]

00:08:33   I think part of it really is it [TS]

00:08:35   technical challenge and not just a [TS]

00:08:37   disinterest I think because you can you [TS]

00:08:40   still have so much freedom of what to [TS]

00:08:42   put we're now file system on a mac and [TS]

00:08:46   it's you know really it's just [TS]

00:08:49   technically not it's not you can't just [TS]

00:08:51   say close the disc and open it you know [TS]

00:08:53   it's because there's all sorts of stuff [TS]

00:08:54   that's a different because it's [TS]

00:08:56   different hardware you know I think it's [TS]

00:08:58   the number one motivator why they do [TS]

00:08:59   what they did desktop and documents [TS]

00:09:01   thinking the way they did it was that I [TS]

00:09:03   don't like their if you keep everything [TS]

00:09:05   if you buy everything three App Store [TS]

00:09:08   which you know some people do and and [TS]

00:09:10   you're not a superpower user but you [TS]

00:09:12   keep everything in documents and on the [TS]

00:09:13   desktop and and then you log into a new [TS]

00:09:16   mac like it will just sync your stuff [TS]

00:09:19   and you're ready to go it's it's for the [TS]

00:09:21   rest of us who've got you know legacy [TS]

00:09:24   apps non mac app store apps all sorts of [TS]

00:09:26   stuff like that and then you turn the [TS]

00:09:28   migration assistant i'm not convinced [TS]

00:09:30   migration assistant is doing so hot i [TS]

00:09:32   tried I've tried it twice with these two [TS]

00:09:34   macbook pros that I've got and it failed [TS]

00:09:37   both times you know it's interesting [TS]

00:09:39   i've given up on migration assistant DA [TS]

00:09:41   beyond i haven't used it in a few years [TS]

00:09:43   I mean and maybe I should you know give [TS]

00:09:45   it another shot one of these health of [TS]

00:09:46   what you just had is reading I think you [TS]

00:09:48   should i what i don't recommend it [TS]

00:09:51   what I have is an apple notes document i [TS]

00:09:55   started this two or three years ago [TS]

00:09:56   setting up a new mac and so it's the [TS]

00:10:00   first thing I do is I like you know go [TS]

00:10:02   through the first run I put my icloud [TS]

00:10:04   guy you know go through and put my [TS]

00:10:05   icloud credentials in so because I put [TS]

00:10:07   my cloud credentials in my notes inks [TS]

00:10:09   and write a note has a checklist of you [TS]

00:10:13   know do this do this do that now it's [TS]

00:10:16   you know and that's like about boarding [TS]

00:10:18   script more dollars yourself yeah more [TS]

00:10:21   or less and then some of the stuff I [TS]

00:10:22   completely checklist right let's do this [TS]

00:10:24   then do this team is already gotten so [TS]

00:10:26   you don't miss a step [TS]

00:10:27   yeah you know it kills me be at it will [TS]

00:10:28   sink all of it some wood let's let's [TS]

00:10:32   let's the nerd out free it's you and me [TS]

00:10:33   we talk about baseball talk about bbedit [TS]

00:10:35   BB that will let you put like all of its [TS]

00:10:38   support stuff in in dropbox which is [TS]

00:10:40   great and I use that but its preferences [TS]

00:10:44   file does not go in dropbox and so every [TS]

00:10:46   time I move to [TS]

00:10:47   new Mac I either have to manually reset [TS]

00:10:50   all of the preferences or I have to go [TS]

00:10:51   to you know a home folder library [TS]

00:10:54   application support no library [TS]

00:10:57   preferences dot bare-bones BB and [TS]

00:11:01   preferences and copy that file over so [TS]

00:11:03   that my editor is the way I like it and [TS]

00:11:05   I do that every single time I move max [TS]

00:11:07   it's like one of those things on the [TS]

00:11:08   checklist is I gotta move my BB at [TS]

00:11:10   preferences because there they don't [TS]

00:11:11   they don't cloud sync I can't fish them [TS]

00:11:13   out dropbox yeah I've been meaning 5 [TS]

00:11:16   used that ever since bb-8 added that [TS]

00:11:17   feature [TS]

00:11:18   I mean it's couple years ago at least at [TS]

00:11:21   first I really liked it but it's grown [TS]

00:11:23   to annoy me because I end up with like [TS]

00:11:25   the same documents open because i also [TS]

00:11:28   have the preference set to ya restore [TS]

00:11:30   open documents and are all almost all [TS]

00:11:32   almost everything I reckon bbedit is [TS]

00:11:34   stored in dropbox so when I go to a [TS]

00:11:38   different machine and use bbedit their [TS]

00:11:41   dropbox has the same document and so [TS]

00:11:43   it's open in two and I don't I I fat [TS]

00:11:46   have found that I don't want that [TS]

00:11:47   because I don't try to leave too many [TS]

00:11:50   documents open [TS]

00:11:51   yeah and and oftentimes I you know i'll [TS]

00:11:54   leave one place and finish on the other [TS]

00:11:56   and then I go back and it's like oh I [TS]

00:11:57   don't want that you know its opening [TS]

00:11:59   documents i'm done with because it lost [TS]

00:12:01   state because i'm not you know keeping [TS]

00:12:02   them in open and sink myself and that I [TS]

00:12:05   i agree i've noticed that but i like the [TS]

00:12:07   fact that like all my scripts and [TS]

00:12:09   clippings and things like that are just [TS]

00:12:11   sort of there everywhere that's nice i [TS]

00:12:13   do too but I the ni dai know it's going [TS]

00:12:16   to annoy me to go back to the old way [TS]

00:12:17   where if i write a new script or just [TS]

00:12:19   one of my scripts just tweak one of my [TS]

00:12:21   scripts that to get that prepared script [TS]

00:12:23   to percolate everywhere i'd have to do [TS]

00:12:29   it manually [TS]

00:12:30   you know Ram zip up the the I don't know [TS]

00:12:33   maybe what I should do is just turn off [TS]

00:12:34   the preference to reopen documents and [TS]

00:12:36   see I don't know I've had it but it's a [TS]

00:12:38   mild annoyance that i've had i've been [TS]

00:12:39   thinking for like a year i should like [TS]

00:12:41   dig into this and and redo it but I I [TS]

00:12:44   don't another so so many things that we [TS]

00:12:46   do with our computers that are like it's [TS]

00:12:48   annoying but it doesn't you got up you [TS]

00:12:50   gotta clear the bar of i'm going to sit [TS]

00:12:52   down for an hour and figure out what the [TS]

00:12:54   hell is going on and so that you're just [TS]

00:12:56   like me I'm not gonna leave it and [TS]

00:12:57   probably do we do you have more than an [TS]

00:12:59   hour of misery me [TS]

00:13:00   maybe maybe not but it's just enough i [TS]

00:13:03   do that all the time with like [TS]

00:13:04   automation stuff where automation is [TS]

00:13:06   great but it's gotta you gotta clear the [TS]

00:13:09   time to like do it and once you do you [TS]

00:13:11   like yeah i-i've got this automation [TS]

00:13:13   thing but so often it's just like yeah [TS]

00:13:14   I'm not gonna bother I I it's close [TS]

00:13:17   enough and it's not enough annoyance for [TS]

00:13:19   me to break out an hour to try and [TS]

00:13:21   figure it out so you just leave it [TS]

00:13:23   I actually you know it's funny you [TS]

00:13:24   should say that i actually did a couple [TS]

00:13:26   of those things last week as a sort of [TS]

00:13:30   get my mind off of other things you know [TS]

00:13:33   my mind off the internet and I found it [TS]

00:13:36   very difficult to to write honestly got [TS]

00:13:43   a what i read a thing you know that we [TS]

00:13:46   just keep going mad here and I know [TS]

00:13:47   Merlin and I talked about this last week [TS]

00:13:49   extensively you know blah blah the [TS]

00:13:52   election and hard feelings but I saw a [TS]

00:13:54   couple of other people with sight Steven [TS]

00:13:55   Levy and a good thing on his back [TS]

00:13:57   channel he had everything was just a day [TS]

00:13:59   after the election but I i have a half [TS]

00:14:04   of me says I should just charge ahead [TS]

00:14:06   and write some you know typically daring [TS]

00:14:08   fireball topic stuff because other [TS]

00:14:11   people who read daring fireball i'm sure [TS]

00:14:13   would more than even usual love to have [TS]

00:14:16   their mind occupied by this you know to [TS]

00:14:20   get it off thoughts of the election and [TS]

00:14:21   and president huh [TS]

00:14:23   Trump yeah but then there's another half [TS]

00:14:26   of me that says that is it's it's so [TS]

00:14:31   it's inappropriate right that did with [TS]

00:14:34   something this the you know that seismic [TS]

00:14:39   level happens it's just it's just [TS]

00:14:41   foolish to write something that is so [TS]

00:14:43   off topic and I'm sorry I i found myself [TS]

00:14:46   unusually jammed last week in terms of [TS]

00:14:50   actually getting anything written by [TS]

00:14:52   what i did is i occupied myself by doing [TS]

00:14:54   a couple like Apple script things that [TS]

00:14:56   I've been meaning to write for myself [TS]

00:14:57   and it really it helped I this sort of [TS]

00:15:00   thing where I once i start like writing [TS]

00:15:02   an apple script and I'm yeah I'm because [TS]

00:15:04   half of it would for me always with [TS]

00:15:06   Apple script is what the hell is the [TS]

00:15:08   syntax were black [TS]

00:15:10   ok i find myself I cad [TS]

00:15:13   our can go by and I haven't had any [TS]

00:15:15   thoughts of the election and I'm and [TS]

00:15:17   it's like the best our my day was [TS]

00:15:19   writing yeah what is it here I've got it [TS]

00:15:21   just opened its a apple script that will [TS]

00:15:24   create a new text file at the current [TS]

00:15:26   right in the current Finder window [TS]

00:15:28   well that's nice yeah i mean i I've [TS]

00:15:31   it'sit's funny we're talking about this [TS]

00:15:34   because the as we record this i think [TS]

00:15:36   that the news kind of broke today that [TS]

00:15:38   Sal's ago Ian who is the automation an [TS]

00:15:42   applescript product manager at apple for [TS]

00:15:43   years is no longer employed by Apple I [TS]

00:15:47   didn't know that [TS]

00:15:48   oh yeah yeah i Justi just mentioned he [TS]

00:15:50   did it he did a presentation at the mac [TS]

00:15:52   tech conference today and and I'm not I [TS]

00:15:55   I just say i'm sad but I'm not really [TS]

00:15:57   surprised because i'm not sure Apple's I [TS]

00:15:59   has been on that particular ball for a [TS]

00:16:01   long time but you know and it's not for [TS]

00:16:03   everybody and I when I talk people know [TS]

00:16:04   that i do automation stuff and they're [TS]

00:16:06   like oh you know I it's hard to get into [TS]

00:16:09   and and that's all true but then you [TS]

00:16:11   know every and again I do leave things [TS]

00:16:14   for a long time and sometimes it's like [TS]

00:16:16   a well you know I should automate that [TS]

00:16:17   but every time I do one of those I [TS]

00:16:19   finally put in that work not only as a [TS]

00:16:21   kind of a pleasure to solve the problem [TS]

00:16:23   i am I think to myself this must be what [TS]

00:16:25   computer programmers feel all the time [TS]

00:16:26   but you know once it's done i guess i [TS]

00:16:30   can hand it to other people sometimes if [TS]

00:16:32   they wanted I've done that a little bit [TS]

00:16:34   and you know things get passed around [TS]

00:16:36   and it can make it just can make your [TS]

00:16:38   life better like I i have a bunch of [TS]

00:16:39   things now that are there not even Apple [TS]

00:16:42   scripts their their shell scripts that [TS]

00:16:45   run inside a service so basically you [TS]

00:16:51   know you basically make an automator [TS]

00:16:52   thing that says do the shell scripts [TS]

00:16:54   yeah and and then you want that table [TS]

00:16:56   current selection as input and pass it [TS]

00:16:58   to the script [TS]

00:16:59   yeah and so I did that for like I've got [TS]

00:17:01   I've got all these scripts that either [TS]

00:17:02   i'm i'm cool you know [TS]

00:17:04   clicking on something in the finder and [TS]

00:17:05   and doing a keyboard shortcut or I'm i'm [TS]

00:17:08   choosing it from the the contextual menu [TS]

00:17:10   to do all sorts of like audio processing [TS]

00:17:13   and stuff for podcasts and I just do it [TS]

00:17:15   in in its it's all scripts running in [TS]

00:17:17   the background and I got a lot of [TS]

00:17:19   scripts from Marco Arment who is very [TS]

00:17:21   comfortable with the command line and [TS]

00:17:22   just issues all this things from the [TS]

00:17:23   command line like I'm not gonna do that [TS]

00:17:25   I'm gonna put it in a little [TS]

00:17:26   you know I'm going to wrap it an [TS]

00:17:27   automator and just hit a keyboard [TS]

00:17:29   shortcut and do it and it's great and [TS]

00:17:31   every time I do one of those things I [TS]

00:17:32   think to myself I can't believe I went [TS]

00:17:34   months where I was bringing up the [TS]

00:17:36   terminal and dragging and folders to get [TS]

00:17:38   the pathnames and then issuing the shell [TS]

00:17:41   scripting commands and all that now only [TS]

00:17:43   do is point & click and that's the [TS]

00:17:45   that's the great thing about Mac [TS]

00:17:46   automation stuff and iOS to really is [TS]

00:17:48   once once it's done you know it's out of [TS]

00:17:51   the way all you do is go Boop and magic [TS]

00:17:53   things happen and you know that's that's [TS]

00:17:55   that's that's the abstracted computer [TS]

00:17:57   user interface in a nutshell right there [TS]

00:17:59   is you shouldn't know what the steps are [TS]

00:18:00   you should be able to build the steps [TS]

00:18:02   and then put it aside and just keep [TS]

00:18:04   doing your work there and some of the [TS]

00:18:05   utilities you know that are along those [TS]

00:18:09   lines like text expander and keyboard [TS]

00:18:11   maestro I think you are my star does i'm [TS]

00:18:13   almost certain text expander does is [TS]

00:18:15   there's a way if you go to like the [TS]

00:18:16   about box or something [TS]

00:18:17   it shows you how much time you say since [TS]

00:18:19   you've been using it and if you've been [TS]

00:18:22   using i I've got some of these utilities [TS]

00:18:23   where I somehow it it's like I look and [TS]

00:18:26   it tells me I've saved you know like [TS]

00:18:27   like 10 hours of Emma for so many years [TS]

00:18:30   but that's like a and each little step i [TS]

00:18:33   get one of them for me i fade published [TS]

00:18:35   this somewhere i don't know i don't [TS]

00:18:37   think it's on just or something like [TS]

00:18:39   that I've written about on during [TS]

00:18:40   fireball but I have a very particular [TS]

00:18:42   style of title casing i use on daring [TS]

00:18:44   fireball alright where is it you know [TS]

00:18:46   everything you know big word gets [TS]

00:18:48   uppercase letter and then there's a [TS]

00:18:50   specific set of little words that are [TS]

00:18:53   not like of a and uh and it can be [TS]

00:18:59   tricky though to do it to to automate it [TS]

00:19:02   because if you can be fooled by things [TS]

00:19:03   like quotes in the text that's being [TS]

00:19:10   selected because then that should be [TS]

00:19:12   capitalized if it's the first word in a [TS]

00:19:13   quote because it's like the title of the [TS]

00:19:15   thing so I back together a script years [TS]

00:19:18   ago that gets it right 99.9 percent of [TS]

00:19:21   the time and I have a exactly like you [TS]

00:19:23   know like you said it's an automator [TS]

00:19:25   script or our service with that shell [TS]

00:19:29   script running in it and have it mapped [TS]

00:19:30   to shift shift command T for ya title [TS]

00:19:34   case [TS]

00:19:34   and there are some I I think about how [TS]

00:19:37   much time that has saved me over the [TS]

00:19:38   years and it's it's just unbelievable [TS]

00:19:40   and but before I wrote it even though [TS]

00:19:42   i've been using it for years I think [TS]

00:19:43   we're all those years I was like arrow [TS]

00:19:45   arrow arrow shift and we type the letter [TS]

00:19:47   arrow arrow it's crazy [TS]

00:19:50   yeah it'sit's um I mean that's a keeper [TS]

00:19:53   my sister tells me save seven hours by [TS]

00:19:55   the way i just looked it goes back to [TS]

00:19:58   regular expressions right i mean you did [TS]

00:20:01   you write the chapter in the BB at [TS]

00:20:02   manual about regular expressions that [TS]

00:20:04   you know i know but the second half of [TS]

00:20:08   it is so I i think this is first I want [TS]

00:20:11   to take too much credit [TS]

00:20:12   the regular expression chapter and [TS]

00:20:14   bbedit was there when i started but BB [TS]

00:20:18   it was using a very old regular [TS]

00:20:21   expression library [TS]

00:20:22   it was really a derivative of the flight [TS]

00:20:24   of the original unix one guy named Henry [TS]

00:20:28   somebody somebody wrote it and it only [TS]

00:20:31   had like the basic regular expression [TS]

00:20:33   surprised it was almost more like a [TS]

00:20:36   glorified wildcards yeah and all the [TS]

00:20:40   fancy stuff that you can do when you [TS]

00:20:42   read that chapter and you're like holy [TS]

00:20:44   crap was added when i was there and so I [TS]

00:20:48   wrote the group you know they had added [TS]

00:20:50   onto the chapter to write all the pcre [TS]

00:20:52   yet up all right [TS]

00:20:55   yeah that's anyway that that's I i tell [TS]

00:20:58   people about crap about regular [TS]

00:20:59   expressions and then a that same look as [TS]

00:21:01   when i talk about automator if you talk [TS]

00:21:02   about shell scripting which is like I [TS]

00:21:04   don't want to learn it and understand it [TS]

00:21:05   i don't know and i get i get that but [TS]

00:21:07   like especially when I when I would talk [TS]

00:21:09   to writers and editors about crap I'd be [TS]

00:21:12   like you understand text is what you do [TS]

00:21:15   for a living i'm telling you if you [TS]

00:21:18   bought it like by Jeff freedoms book but [TS]

00:21:20   you know or read the BBA chapter there [TS]

00:21:23   are things in there that you know you if [TS]

00:21:26   you learn it all of a sudden you'll be [TS]

00:21:27   sitting there thinking oh man I can't [TS]

00:21:29   believe I need to do this this is going [TS]

00:21:30   to take me an hour and if you know the [TS]

00:21:32   language of grip if you know those [TS]

00:21:34   symbols you can do it in two minutes and [TS]

00:21:37   it had only happen once okay and you [TS]

00:21:40   realize that it is because you know it [TS]

00:21:43   is a life skill that you need to have [TS]

00:21:45   i I'll tell you the truth is a true [TS]

00:21:47   story I I didn't learn regular [TS]

00:21:50   expressions while i was in college even [TS]

00:21:51   though I was a bbedit nerd Comp Sci [TS]

00:21:53   major I I did it just look I i mean i [TS]

00:21:56   think the farthest i ever got was like [TS]

00:21:58   dot plus and dot star which is you know [TS]

00:22:01   just more like like old cars wildcards [TS]

00:22:04   find everything and I just never saw the [TS]

00:22:07   need for it and like a year or so after [TS]

00:22:10   college I got a temp job at the [TS]

00:22:14   philadelphia inquirer in the advertising [TS]

00:22:17   department where they had a bunch of [TS]

00:22:20   Excel spreadsheets with all of the ad [TS]

00:22:23   rates for everything and it was each [TS]

00:22:25   department had their own thing in each [TS]

00:22:28   one had like seven pages or 12 pages of [TS]

00:22:31   add in a you know a matrix you know so [TS]

00:22:37   it keeping them in excel as where the [TS]

00:22:39   business people set them made total [TS]

00:22:41   sense and then you know they're be [TS]

00:22:42   graphic designers who turn them into a [TS]

00:22:44   book that they could send out the people [TS]

00:22:46   so I got hired to do these books because [TS]

00:22:48   I could do graphic design and so I did [TS]

00:22:50   the first one and this is that everybody [TS]

00:22:52   did it but there was all sorts of [TS]

00:22:54   gibberish in columns that wasn't public [TS]

00:22:57   we know it was it must have made sense [TS]

00:23:00   for the business people who use the [TS]

00:23:02   Excel spreadsheet but what it didn't [TS]

00:23:04   need to go in there and so the way that [TS]

00:23:05   every you know it was done before and [TS]

00:23:08   the way I did the first book was you i [TS]

00:23:10   just went in and edit each column by [TS]

00:23:12   hand and it was just you know tab delete [TS]

00:23:14   tap delete and and just pages and pages [TS]

00:23:17   and pages and pages and you know couple [TS]

00:23:19   of days work easily i may be a week's [TS]

00:23:21   work for the whole book mostly just [TS]

00:23:24   deleting crap and i thought there's got [TS]

00:23:27   to be a better way and I thought about [TS]

00:23:28   that i think this is the sort of stuff [TS]

00:23:30   regular expressions are supposed to [TS]

00:23:31   solve and so I wrote I just felt like a [TS]

00:23:34   day writing like that just a couple of [TS]

00:23:36   regular expressions and bbedit and then [TS]

00:23:38   so i went from excel to text bbedit to [TS]

00:23:43   just run a couple of saved grep patterns [TS]

00:23:45   imported it into the document and I was [TS]

00:23:48   done and I literally mean literally [TS]

00:23:50   turned like a week's work of work for [TS]

00:23:53   each book into about like two hours [TS]

00:23:57   and so I just what I acted as though i [TS]

00:24:00   didn't write the script and just static [TS]

00:24:02   but you know roll [TS]

00:24:03   browse the web but it's that that's [TS]

00:24:07   actually going out of Excel is that's [TS]

00:24:09   like a pro tip for for all this stuff to [TS]

00:24:12   is like I can't tell you how many times [TS]

00:24:13   I've had something in Excel that's been [TS]

00:24:15   a disaster and I just selected and paste [TS]

00:24:18   into bbedit comes in his tab delimited [TS]

00:24:19   and where you save it out as a [TS]

00:24:21   tab-delimited file and you and you do [TS]

00:24:23   all of the crazy tech stuff and you just [TS]

00:24:25   make sure that they're there are tabs [TS]

00:24:26   between the field and right bring it [TS]

00:24:27   back into excel and you're like look [TS]

00:24:29   yeah it was it was all it was an excel [TS]

00:24:31   all along but it wasn't you you know you [TS]

00:24:33   completely take it out you x we're [TS]

00:24:35   taking multiple columns in excel and I [TS]

00:24:36   pulled them out and then kind of like [TS]

00:24:38   mix them and match them and and and and [TS]

00:24:40   reassemble them in the right way and [TS]

00:24:42   then you paste them back in and it's [TS]

00:24:44   like you know it's like that you never [TS]

00:24:46   left excel but they totally came out of [TS]

00:24:48   excel and it's not like you can't do [TS]

00:24:49   some wild card stuff in excel but you [TS]

00:24:52   probably right visual basic script to do [TS]

00:24:53   things too but for me it was just like I [TS]

00:24:55   get this back to text and can i can i [TS]

00:24:58   write a couple of pattern matching [TS]

00:25:00   search and replaces that solve this [TS]

00:25:02   problem and usually the answer is yeah [TS]

00:25:04   and you can take an hour for can do in [TS]

00:25:05   10 minutes [TS]

00:25:06   find that it i mean literally wonderful [TS]

00:25:09   web literally terrible of weeks weeks of [TS]

00:25:11   work in two hours of work and I just got [TS]

00:25:15   paid for weeks or I felt like I deserved [TS]

00:25:18   it huh yeah i would just say this one [TS]

00:25:21   last thing [TS]

00:25:22   it was a long time ago must have been [TS]

00:25:23   2001 or so when i wrote that that the [TS]

00:25:26   second half of the bbedit group chapter [TS]

00:25:28   I would still say it is one of the [TS]

00:25:30   pieces of writing that I am most proud [TS]

00:25:32   of in my entire life because I've people [TS]

00:25:35   have told me many times when they find [TS]

00:25:37   out that i wrote it they're like oh my [TS]

00:25:38   god that was the first time regular [TS]

00:25:39   persons ever made sense to me and I [TS]

00:25:41   can't take credit for the whole chapter [TS]

00:25:42   but I did take a pass through the early [TS]

00:25:44   part just because that was my goal is I [TS]

00:25:46   do feel like I have a knack for regular [TS]

00:25:49   expressions [TS]

00:25:49   that's the one area of programming where [TS]

00:25:52   I'm better than almost anybody it's I [TS]

00:25:54   just ice I really am good at figuring [TS]

00:25:58   out how to create the syntax to match [TS]

00:26:00   what I want to match [TS]

00:26:01   and ends up creating these things that [TS]

00:26:04   most people look at me [TS]

00:26:05   they're like what the hell yeah i really [TS]

00:26:08   want i think that's the problem with [TS]

00:26:09   with regular expressions readability [TS]

00:26:11   like people see them anything about that [TS]

00:26:13   it's nonsense I can't do it so no if you [TS]

00:26:15   learn it's actually fairly [TS]

00:26:17   straightforward [TS]

00:26:18   not all of them but most of them but [TS]

00:26:19   they look like nonsense [TS]

00:26:22   well I just thought me know but this is [TS]

00:26:24   something this is I get the perfect [TS]

00:26:25   combination for me because i have a [TS]

00:26:27   knack for explaining things and i have a [TS]

00:26:29   knack for regular expressions and in [TS]

00:26:31   hindsight I still feel you know what is [TS]

00:26:33   it [TS]

00:26:33   14 15 years later I'd I i still feel [TS]

00:26:36   it's one of the best things I've ever [TS]

00:26:37   ever written [TS]

00:26:39   yeah yeah I love that chapter that i [TS]

00:26:41   mentioned Jeff riedel's O'Reilly book [TS]

00:26:43   about this is great but it's from [TS]

00:26:45   possession of a you know longtime unix [TS]

00:26:48   guy and he talks about scripting a lot [TS]

00:26:50   in that like shell and perl scripting [TS]

00:26:52   and for me the most direct application [TS]

00:26:55   was bbedit so the BBA chapter is a much [TS]

00:26:58   more distilled clear approach to this [TS]

00:27:01   then I love that freedom book and I used [TS]

00:27:03   to reference at all the time but the BB [TS]

00:27:06   the chapter is a much more simple gentle [TS]

00:27:08   introduction [TS]

00:27:09   yeah I love it I love the freedom book [TS]

00:27:11   too and i read I've read both editions [TS]

00:27:13   maybe three editions and there might be [TS]

00:27:14   a third I don't know every time there's [TS]

00:27:15   a new addition there is a third and i [TS]

00:27:18   have all three copies and I've read them [TS]

00:27:20   all covered it is but it's a i would i [TS]

00:27:26   would definitely say it is it it this [TS]

00:27:30   Friedel book is so comprehensive and so [TS]

00:27:32   well done that it's I don't know that [TS]

00:27:35   I've ever read any book on any subject [TS]

00:27:37   where you could say well there's no need [TS]

00:27:38   for anybody else to ever write a book on [TS]

00:27:40   this again but I would honestly say that [TS]

00:27:41   that's the case with freedoms book on [TS]

00:27:43   regular expressions and I just can't see [TS]

00:27:45   how anybody else would sit would say [TS]

00:27:47   well I'll take the time to write a [TS]

00:27:50   technical book which is really hard on [TS]

00:27:53   this subject when there's a book that [TS]

00:27:55   covers it [TS]

00:27:56   both perfectly and extensively all right [TS]

00:28:00   maybe I'll take a break how about I take [TS]

00:28:01   a break here and think the first friend [TS]

00:28:03   of the show [TS]

00:28:04   it's our good friends good good friend [TS]

00:28:07   Casper Casper they make obsessively [TS]

00:28:10   engineer mattresses and shockingly fair [TS]

00:28:12   prices go to Casper calm / the talk show [TS]

00:28:15   and used code the talk show and you'll [TS]

00:28:17   say fifty bucks towards your mattress [TS]

00:28:20   with one exception hold on i'll tell you [TS]

00:28:22   what that is [TS]

00:28:23   so here's the deal I've told you this [TS]

00:28:25   before I'll say it again Casper has [TS]

00:28:27   created one perfect type of mattress [TS]

00:28:29   it's it's a combination of like memory [TS]

00:28:33   foam and some other stuff that's just [TS]

00:28:37   the right blend of types of things so [TS]

00:28:40   you don't have to pick between six [TS]

00:28:41   different types of mattresses that you [TS]

00:28:44   know what the hell how do you know what [TS]

00:28:45   the differences these guys it really is [TS]

00:28:47   sort of like the Apple attitude taken [TS]

00:28:49   two mattresses trust us will do all the [TS]

00:28:51   work will make one type of mattress and [TS]

00:28:54   then all you have to do is pick the size [TS]

00:28:55   that's it that is it's the just seems to [TS]

00:29:00   me this is how a mattress company should [TS]

00:29:02   do it now in addition to that because [TS]

00:29:04   they sell they make them they right here [TS]

00:29:07   in United States in fact and they sell [TS]

00:29:09   them directly to you you just go there [TS]

00:29:12   they cut out the middleman and it [TS]

00:29:14   enables them to keep their prices [TS]

00:29:17   incredibly lower than the mainstream big [TS]

00:29:20   brand mattresses you find in traditional [TS]

00:29:23   mattress stores premium mattress is [TS]

00:29:26   often start at well over 1,500 casper [TS]

00:29:30   mattresses cost just 500 for twin 754 [TS]

00:29:34   full 854 queen and just 954 a king so [TS]

00:29:38   you can get a king from them for less [TS]

00:29:40   than like a twin from a lot of the other [TS]

00:29:43   big brands crazy there and like I said [TS]

00:29:46   they're made right here in America now [TS]

00:29:48   biggest thing you think how am I going [TS]

00:29:50   to buy a thousand-dollar mattress and [TS]

00:29:53   not even try it you have to worry about [TS]

00:29:56   they have a hundred knight home trial if [TS]

00:29:58   you don't love it they will pick it up [TS]

00:30:00   at your house give you a full refund no [TS]

00:30:02   hard sell [TS]

00:30:03   it's not like trying to cancel your [TS]

00:30:04   cable it it's something like that you [TS]

00:30:06   just say i want to send it back and they [TS]

00:30:08   say ok when you know and then somebody [TS]

00:30:10   shows up and they take the mattress away [TS]

00:30:11   and you get your money back and that's [TS]

00:30:13   it I've had readers Casper's been a [TS]

00:30:15   sponsor long enough i've gotten emails [TS]

00:30:17   from readers who have done that and they [TS]

00:30:19   said i can't believe how you know can't [TS]

00:30:20   believe how easy it was to actually just [TS]

00:30:22   send it back because they actually you [TS]

00:30:24   know they didn't believe that it was [TS]

00:30:25   going to be easy because that sounds too [TS]

00:30:27   good to be true [TS]

00:30:28   but that's how confident Casper is in [TS]

00:30:31   your mattress get yours today hundred [TS]

00:30:35   Knights in your own home they have a dog [TS]

00:30:38   mattress even that's a new product and [TS]

00:30:41   that's the one that you don't get 50 [TS]

00:30:43   bucks on because it's a lower price but [TS]

00:30:45   if you have a if you have a dog get him [TS]

00:30:47   a good mattress go check it out [TS]

00:30:48   I've had readers tell me this is a thing [TS]

00:30:50   when i first did this read i didn't know [TS]

00:30:52   that the discount it apply to the dog [TS]

00:30:55   one so I had a couple of readers who [TS]

00:30:57   said hey I've got my dog the mattress [TS]

00:30:58   but i didn't get 50 bucks off but I [TS]

00:31:00   don't care because my dog loves the [TS]

00:31:02   mattress so that's that's the exception [TS]

00:31:05   go to Casper calm / the talk show and [TS]

00:31:07   remember that code the talkshow to say [TS]

00:31:10   fifty bucks on any human sized mattress [TS]

00:31:12   maybe that would get my dog off my couch [TS]

00:31:17   i love doing sponsor reads I've gone [TS]

00:31:21   from having it be the part of this job [TS]

00:31:24   that I hate to part that I i love i [TS]

00:31:27   think that makes the I'm not to get [TS]

00:31:30   podcast e inside baseball but I think [TS]

00:31:32   that's make makes the reads better once [TS]

00:31:33   when you can't either a couple podcast i [TS]

00:31:35   listen to where you know the ads are our [TS]

00:31:39   part of the entertainment and you just [TS]

00:31:41   can't you know you cannot listen to them [TS]

00:31:43   you can tune out you can't skip you [TS]

00:31:45   really gotta pay attention because they [TS]

00:31:47   went they they put their personality [TS]

00:31:49   into them and you know and that I think [TS]

00:31:51   that makes the difference if it's if [TS]

00:31:52   it's like a hostage video or something [TS]

00:31:54   it's a lot less entertaining but if it's [TS]

00:31:56   a if it's part of the fun [TS]

00:31:57   then it's a lot better I can't even tell [TS]

00:32:00   you how many emails I got from people [TS]

00:32:01   about last week's show with Maryland [TS]

00:32:03   where they're a just thinking was like [TS]

00:32:05   oh my god I needed that you know uh huh [TS]

00:32:07   you know for the election even they're [TS]

00:32:08   like oh my god sponsor reach so good i [TS]

00:32:13   will have to do is take a mental break [TS]

00:32:14   here and just say I I don't have time to [TS]

00:32:17   respond to all of my email but I got so [TS]

00:32:20   much email never at most emails I've [TS]

00:32:22   gotten about an episode of the show in [TS]

00:32:24   as long as i can remember from people [TS]

00:32:26   last week and all of it I i honestly [TS]

00:32:30   didn't see one that was I honestly [TS]

00:32:32   thought there'd be some from Trump [TS]

00:32:34   people or you know people who just don't [TS]

00:32:36   want to hear about people who are upset [TS]

00:32:38   about the way the election turned out [TS]

00:32:40   you know go back to tech dummy i didn't [TS]

00:32:42   get any of that and which was sort of [TS]

00:32:44   our goal that was the way you know that [TS]

00:32:46   we approached in what we talked about [TS]

00:32:47   but I got so much email from people [TS]

00:32:50   thanking us for that so i just want to [TS]

00:32:52   say to all of you who listen thank you [TS]

00:32:55   for listening and thank you for the good [TS]

00:32:56   words i have a podcast question for you [TS]

00:32:59   Jason you don't answer [TS]

00:33:02   do you do any other podcast regularly i [TS]

00:33:05   occasionally so you here in there [TS]

00:33:08   occasionally podcast yeah yeah just some [TS]

00:33:12   time from time you mean like all per day [TS]

00:33:14   is like that I guess I got a bug up my [TS]

00:33:21   butt recently about something that I had [TS]

00:33:23   never thought about before and I this is [TS]

00:33:25   the sort of thing that I tend to think [TS]

00:33:27   about I can't believe I didn't really [TS]

00:33:28   think that much about it when I set up [TS]

00:33:30   the talkshow to be on daring fireball [TS]

00:33:32   which is the fact that I've been doing [TS]

00:33:39   it I've always done it it and most of [TS]

00:33:41   the podcast almost all the podcasts I [TS]

00:33:42   see do it but putting the episode number [TS]

00:33:45   in the title and making the episode [TS]

00:33:47   number a major part you know like that [TS]

00:33:49   the main anchor on the URL that the like [TS]

00:33:53   dead on our websites on six colors and [TS]

00:33:56   during fireball we don't have post [TS]

00:33:58   number you know 420 3123 right now that [TS]

00:34:04   was a good one [TS]

00:34:05   yeah a little-little 20 3323 why why do [TS]

00:34:09   we do this and and you know TV shows [TS]

00:34:12   don't do it I mean they sort of do now [TS]

00:34:15   the right where you're like when you [TS]

00:34:17   watch digitally you do you know you're [TS]

00:34:19   going through season 1 episode 7 of [TS]

00:34:21   american horror story or whatever so [TS]

00:34:24   there is right there's sort of that on [TS]

00:34:27   TV but I don't know I I it's a good it's [TS]

00:34:31   a good question like why why do we [TS]

00:34:34   number podcasts and you you I can always [TS]

00:34:36   tell what number it is because you [TS]

00:34:37   actually do number them in the like the [TS]

00:34:39   slug of of the talk show but not like in [TS]

00:34:42   the in what people see just like the [TS]

00:34:45   real descriptions right I i well [TS]

00:34:49   but I have them in the metadata for the [TS]

00:34:51   show so like when you're looking at your [TS]

00:34:52   podcast player it will say 1 773 yeah [TS]

00:34:57   well I switched recently I did switch [TS]

00:34:59   just a couple weeks ago from putting EP [TS]

00:35:03   period space the digital you know [TS]

00:35:07   representation of the number colon i [TS]

00:35:09   took out the EP because i thought you [TS]

00:35:11   know what it its craft like that I yeah [TS]

00:35:16   I don't like I like clean urls I don't [TS]

00:35:18   like seen dot PHP at the end of the URL [TS]

00:35:21   i don't like seeing all the gibberish [TS]

00:35:24   and like the medium URLs I don't like [TS]

00:35:26   tracking in a URL i like the URL to have [TS]

00:35:30   every single bit of it be meaningful and [TS]

00:35:33   I same way with like the titles i don't [TS]

00:35:35   but it seems to me [TS]

00:35:37   yeah I don't know their seem it part of [TS]

00:35:39   me thinks that part of it is that you [TS]

00:35:40   want to know which one's the newest [TS]

00:35:42   episode in your podcast player and that [TS]

00:35:43   maybe it actually is useful because it [TS]

00:35:46   you it's it's a more confident way of [TS]

00:35:49   making sure that your podcast player [TS]

00:35:51   whatever software it is whichever sort [TS]

00:35:53   order it's using top to bottom or bottom [TS]

00:35:55   to top you know which one's the newest [TS]

00:35:57   one [TS]

00:35:58   uh-huh so I'm keeping it i like when i [TS]

00:36:00   made the change to get rid of the e [TS]

00:36:01   period i was on the verge of just [TS]

00:36:04   getting rid of him period and maybe just [TS]

00:36:07   putting them in the URL but then I [TS]

00:36:08   thought you know what I think there's a [TS]

00:36:09   reason everybody does it matter with you [TS]

00:36:12   think I don't know if it's a reason that [TS]

00:36:15   is I don't know if it's a good reason or [TS]

00:36:17   if it's more just sort of continuity I [TS]

00:36:19   mean some of it is reference why is to [TS]

00:36:23   be able to say it's this one like saying [TS]

00:36:25   like the macworld we had volumes and [TS]

00:36:30   numbers like internally we would have [TS]

00:36:32   liked you turning us a story and it [TS]

00:36:35   would be 24 dash 0 for and that was [TS]

00:36:38   literally 2404 was like the tooth the [TS]

00:36:43   april two thousand eight issue or [TS]

00:36:46   something is like vol.24 number four and [TS]

00:36:49   and that was partially because in a [TS]

00:36:51   fight in the file system like it would [TS]

00:36:53   sort right that all the 2400 force would [TS]

00:36:56   go together and then there you have 25 [TS]

00:36:57   405 and it would just kind of keep going [TS]

00:36:59   like that so I think some of it is just [TS]

00:37:01   sort of like finding an internal [TS]

00:37:03   structure and for podcast you could do [TS]

00:37:04   it by date you could literally say you [TS]

00:37:06   know this is the one for the you know [TS]

00:37:10   this day in November of 2016 and the [TS]

00:37:12   metadata certainly supplies that so you [TS]

00:37:15   could just you could just do that you [TS]

00:37:17   could have nothing [TS]

00:37:18   I don't know as a kid growing up I [TS]

00:37:21   really loved reading comic books and [TS]

00:37:23   comic books always had that like this is [TS]

00:37:25   amazing spider-man number 183 and and [TS]

00:37:28   they would have footnotes and they would [TS]

00:37:30   say no spider-man face the Scorpion [TS]

00:37:32   before an amazing spider-man number 83 [TS]

00:37:34   and send him to prison and you'll [TS]

00:37:36   account number III yes if only I had [TS]

00:37:38   that issue i could read that now and i [TS]

00:37:40   was part of what appeals to me about the [TS]

00:37:43   podcast numbering scheme is that which [TS]

00:37:45   is just it lets you hang a number on it [TS]

00:37:47   and say for reference sake this is what [TS]

00:37:49   it is rather than saying season one [TS]

00:37:51   number three or just giving you a date [TS]

00:37:55   but I don't know if that's a great [TS]

00:37:57   reason to do it [TS]

00:37:58   I'm probably also the the other thought [TS]

00:38:01   I had this since the incomparable is now [TS]

00:38:03   at 326 episodes I think maybe it was a [TS]

00:38:08   it made sense when you did 10 episodes [TS]

00:38:13   of a podcast in the early its podcasting [TS]

00:38:15   and now there are these podcasts that [TS]

00:38:17   have hundreds and hundreds of episodes [TS]

00:38:19   were pretty soon if not already there [TS]

00:38:21   will very soon be many podcast with with [TS]

00:38:25   a thousand-plus episodes tomorrow so [TS]

00:38:28   hannah it's sort of crazy marco was [TS]

00:38:30   saying on ATP a couple an episode or two [TS]

00:38:32   ago because he knows because he runs so [TS]

00:38:34   Radio One's get it he said that the real [TS]

00:38:38   they're already there [TS]

00:38:39   yeah at the end they do because there's [TS]

00:38:40   radio stations that will publish five or [TS]

00:38:42   six podcast today like it meaning like [TS]

00:38:46   the 15 or 12 hour three our four of the [TS]

00:38:49   you know the sports fans podcast in the [TS]

00:38:52   morning [TS]

00:38:53   comments okay you'll have episode 1500 [TS]

00:38:56   crazy the comic-book analogy is pretty [TS]

00:39:00   good guess the best for me is it gives [TS]

00:39:05   you something to hang on sequentially [TS]

00:39:06   and say look we've done a lot of these [TS]

00:39:07   and and then I that with incomparable I [TS]

00:39:10   mean even though we built an index and [TS]

00:39:12   one of the reasons that we did end up [TS]

00:39:14   using using movable-type which you use [TS]

00:39:16   on during [TS]

00:39:16   rball for the incomparable CMS is [TS]

00:39:19   because i wanted a I wanted an index of [TS]

00:39:22   of topics and so I've got an index of [TS]

00:39:25   topics so if somebody wants to see [TS]

00:39:26   what's that episode where where John [TS]

00:39:29   grouper and John Syracuse to talk about [TS]

00:39:30   the Godfather you can look up the [TS]

00:39:31   godfather and it won't be like it's this [TS]

00:39:33   number right but still people will email [TS]

00:39:36   me tweet me post on Facebook whatever [TS]

00:39:38   they'll say was that episode about [TS]

00:39:40   whatever and it there is something nice [TS]

00:39:43   about being able to say that was number [TS]

00:39:45   32 and just become point I'm gonna be [TS]

00:39:47   like it's that one that number i don't [TS]

00:39:49   know it's like a little handle for an [TS]

00:39:51   episode [TS]

00:39:52   yeah the alternative would be the just [TS]

00:39:55   look at the dates just happened but that [TS]

00:39:57   doesn't show up that's not gonna show up [TS]

00:39:59   in the list in your podcast player [TS]

00:40:01   well but that's maybe a self-fulfilling [TS]

00:40:03   prophecy right right i mean i think [TS]

00:40:05   maybe podcast player you I is is in part [TS]

00:40:08   based on the idea that a lot of podcasts [TS]

00:40:11   organize themselves by numbers but [TS]

00:40:13   overcast has it has a date field right [TS]

00:40:16   and there are dates for every episode [TS]

00:40:18   and in overcast and i would imagine most [TS]

00:40:20   podcast players or are kinda like that [TS]

00:40:22   and certainly if a podcast weren't [TS]

00:40:24   numbered I'm sure they would all be like [TS]

00:40:26   that [TS]

00:40:26   yeah but if you if I'd like made my not [TS]

00:40:29   numbered or didn't put the numbers in [TS]

00:40:31   the titles it's not going to change it [TS]

00:40:33   you know i mean it's the collective [TS]

00:40:34   decision that the broadcast industry as [TS]

00:40:38   a whole is made to do that [TS]

00:40:40   yes it is it's more fun for me to say we [TS]

00:40:44   talked about raiders of the lost ark and [TS]

00:40:45   the incomparable number eight then it is [TS]

00:40:47   to say October 17 2010 episode was that [TS]

00:40:54   that was that the gap in my appearances [TS]

00:40:56   on the uncomfortable with it because we [TS]

00:40:58   laughed about I was just on recently [TS]

00:41:00   like you just said to talk about the [TS]

00:41:01   Godfather with John turkeys in a few [TS]

00:41:04   other and forget their names sorry [TS]

00:41:07   because I went there was a bunch it was [TS]

00:41:09   it was great I had a great time I I [TS]

00:41:13   can't count the number of people who [TS]

00:41:15   made the crack on twitter that they [TS]

00:41:17   can't believe that all of us long-winded [TS]

00:41:19   podcasters made a podcast about the [TS]

00:41:21   Godfather that was shorter than [TS]

00:41:22   Godfather [TS]

00:41:24   but it was at it that I hadn't been on [TS]

00:41:27   since Reuters that was episode aid [TS]

00:41:29   yeah that was six is basically six years [TS]

00:41:32   October 10-2 October 16 other than a day [TS]

00:41:35   we were in my interview for my david [TS]

00:41:37   letterman episode which was I yeah but [TS]

00:41:39   in terms of like being on the panel yeah [TS]

00:41:40   we want to mate 2 323 that's fine that's [TS]

00:41:44   fine i tried a couple of times to get [TS]

00:41:45   you on it's like you're busy and and I I [TS]

00:41:48   want to like with Merlin i kinda want to [TS]

00:41:49   deploy you guys tactically I don't want [TS]

00:41:51   to be like I want to ask you when [TS]

00:41:52   there's something I got this really good [TS]

00:41:53   news like I for like a couple years I [TS]

00:41:55   don't think we're going to the godfather [TS]

00:41:57   to get siracusa when asked John Gruber [TS]

00:41:58   you know what will make we're gonna make [TS]

00:42:00   it happen and we finally made it happen [TS]

00:42:01   was great to get somebody to go to miss [TS]

00:42:03   you know any chance to talk about able [TS]

00:42:05   to go to is worth it [TS]

00:42:07   although we didn't make it happen until [TS]

00:42:08   a bogota was actually dead [TS]

00:42:10   yeah well mr. maybe we can maybe that [TS]

00:42:12   was what I was waiting for just I wanted [TS]

00:42:14   able to pass on before we talked about [TS]

00:42:16   him [TS]

00:42:16   I like this is so amazing i literally at [TS]

00:42:21   just five seconds ago got a DM from rich [TS]

00:42:25   single creator video asking if I'd heard [TS]

00:42:30   that salad left Apple yeah west dive I [TS]

00:42:34   was spooked I was like is he listening [TS]

00:42:35   do we have a live broadcast that I don't [TS]

00:42:37   know that I should have turned off the [TS]

00:42:39   live stream for being competent be on [TS]

00:42:42   everyone's been talking about him but [TS]

00:42:44   then I realized that asking have I heard [TS]

00:42:46   means he's not spoken but that was kinda [TS]

00:42:50   spooky given that we we spent a good [TS]

00:42:51   chance the last 45 minutes talking about [TS]

00:42:53   bbedit and automation and tell ya [TS]

00:42:58   new macbook pros [TS]

00:43:02   yeah i read i really enjoyed your review [TS]

00:43:07   I thank you often think of when I write [TS]

00:43:10   these reviews I don't know if you feel [TS]

00:43:11   the same way but I write them and [TS]

00:43:13   sometimes I feel like I i know that i've [TS]

00:43:18   got this like I'm might I I don't you [TS]

00:43:20   know I don't care of other people agree [TS]

00:43:22   with me or not but my I know that what [TS]

00:43:23   I'm saying about this i'm certain of [TS]

00:43:24   other times I feel like I haven't had [TS]

00:43:27   enough time or it's it's [TS]

00:43:29   something a lot of times it's just that [TS]

00:43:32   I feel like I have enough time but at [TS]

00:43:35   other times it's like I'm not sure that [TS]

00:43:36   what I care about is representative of [TS]

00:43:39   enough people and I kind of had that [TS]

00:43:42   worried with the reviewer wrote of these [TS]

00:43:45   macbook pros because i know that there's [TS]

00:43:50   a lot of people who are disappointed in [TS]

00:43:51   just the basic idea of the direction [TS]

00:43:54   apple is taking them on but I read a [TS]

00:43:57   whole bunch of the reviews from people [TS]

00:43:59   who I really respect like you enjoy a [TS]

00:44:00   stern it goes on and i read a whole [TS]

00:44:05   bunch of them after you know after after [TS]

00:44:07   my review and it really seemed to me [TS]

00:44:09   like a very large consensus of that [TS]

00:44:13   these are pretty good machines [TS]

00:44:14   yeah I tried to mean because the way [TS]

00:44:19   we've got kind of strung out i got to [TS]

00:44:21   write a piece after the apple event with [TS]

00:44:25   that was basically quick hands-on with [TS]

00:44:27   that 13-inch macbook escape and I got to [TS]

00:44:30   I got to use it for a week and travel [TS]

00:44:32   and then write another piece about it by [TS]

00:44:33   the time I got to the touch bar one I [TS]

00:44:35   felt like I kind of addressed the issues [TS]

00:44:38   about like peoples disappointment i [TS]

00:44:39   rather than I think I macworld column [TS]

00:44:41   about people's disappointment and what [TS]

00:44:43   that meant for like why kind of Apple [TS]

00:44:45   let everything build up and and and [TS]

00:44:47   people kind of this was a thing they [TS]

00:44:49   could focus on some of their [TS]

00:44:50   disappointment and let it out and and so [TS]

00:44:53   I felt like by the time i get a touch [TS]

00:44:54   bar review I could like it was great [TS]

00:44:56   because I could just write about the [TS]

00:44:57   touch bar and was like I i wrote a [TS]

00:44:59   couple sections about the rest of the [TS]

00:45:00   computer but really it was an essay [TS]

00:45:02   about the touch bar in touch ID because [TS]

00:45:04   that was the thing that was little was [TS]

00:45:06   left and frankly was the thing i found [TS]

00:45:07   most interesting and its really why I [TS]

00:45:10   love 3i honest I'm not just saying that [TS]

00:45:14   because you're on the show in your [TS]

00:45:15   palates really why I of all the reviews [TS]

00:45:17   i really think i like year's best [TS]

00:45:18   because i spent a relatively little [TS]

00:45:22   amount on touch bar just because I had [TS]

00:45:24   so much else to say about sort of the [TS]

00:45:26   bigger picture and the other thing I [TS]

00:45:30   thought was that your video which [TS]

00:45:33   focused almost entirely on the touch bar [TS]

00:45:35   was super instructive in like a in the [TS]

00:45:40   difference between like the way Apple [TS]

00:45:41   would do a promotional video [TS]

00:45:43   about the touch bar in fact did and they [TS]

00:45:45   showed it during the event yours was [TS]

00:45:47   focused on look when you're doing real [TS]

00:45:49   stuff like here's you know just stupid [TS]

00:45:51   little things you know like the fact [TS]

00:45:53   that you can it when you adjust the [TS]

00:45:56   brightness or the volume you can just [TS]

00:45:58   put your finger on it and slide without [TS]

00:45:59   tapping on the actual thing that shows [TS]

00:46:01   up it illustrated in a way that I feel [TS]

00:46:05   like 10,000 words wouldn't have conveyed [TS]

00:46:08   you really have it to visual it's [TS]

00:46:09   clearly a very visual input device and [TS]

00:46:13   so I feel like the video really help [TS]

00:46:14   have you done video reviews before I've [TS]

00:46:17   done a handful of them i did some [TS]

00:46:19   macworld and then since I've been doing [TS]

00:46:21   six colors I've done a few that you know [TS]

00:46:23   they take time and the challenges always [TS]

00:46:25   am I doing this because everybody agrees [TS]

00:46:27   that videos the future and we need to do [TS]

00:46:29   video or am i doing it because video [TS]

00:46:30   will be able to impart something that's [TS]

00:46:33   worth imparting and and for me it really [TS]

00:46:35   is like I will put in the time if I feel [TS]

00:46:37   like this is gonna be the best way to [TS]

00:46:39   communicate something with the touch bar [TS]

00:46:40   it was very clear this was the weighted [TS]

00:46:43   I i needed to communicate what was going [TS]

00:46:44   on with the touch bar and I had the time [TS]

00:46:47   I finished that review basically on [TS]

00:46:49   friday afternoon in the embargo was [TS]

00:46:51   monday morning and so on the weekend [TS]

00:46:52   unlike the sunday morning i basically [TS]

00:46:54   sat down is it alright let's figure out [TS]

00:46:55   if i can make a video here and i ended [TS]

00:46:57   up with like an iphone 7 on a in a glyph [TS]

00:47:01   attached to a like a little tripod and a [TS]

00:47:05   bigger tripod and I tried to figure out [TS]

00:47:07   like can I get an angle where I can see [TS]

00:47:09   the touch bar and it's not blown out and [TS]

00:47:12   then I can capture the screen and kind [TS]

00:47:14   of put them together and in the end it [TS]

00:47:16   did work which is good because that's [TS]

00:47:17   what i wanted is like I wanted people to [TS]

00:47:20   be able to see like what happens on [TS]

00:47:21   screen what happens on the touch bar [TS]

00:47:23   where your fingers go [TS]

00:47:24   what's the result can you see the [TS]

00:47:26   animations can you see how some of the [TS]

00:47:29   apps have these totally wild like slider [TS]

00:47:32   interfaces and others just have keys [TS]

00:47:34   some of them color the keys some of them [TS]

00:47:36   don't color the keys and until you know [TS]

00:47:38   there will be it's a little harder [TS]

00:47:41   because you can't like to a screen [TS]

00:47:42   capture of its hard to make those videos [TS]

00:47:44   and i have the advantage of having some [TS]

00:47:45   time to shoot the video when I figured [TS]

00:47:47   out of the gate there aren't going to be [TS]

00:47:49   that many videos that explain this [TS]

00:47:51   feature and apples videos are probably [TS]

00:47:53   not what people want to see because [TS]

00:47:55   they're gonna be really slick but [TS]

00:47:56   they're not as [TS]

00:47:57   sara lee i mean the marketing videos [TS]

00:47:58   they're not going to necessarily like [TS]

00:48:00   slowed down enough for people to see [TS]

00:48:02   what's going on and in the end it was [TS]

00:48:04   about five minutes long which you know i [TS]

00:48:06   kinda feel like could be too long but at [TS]

00:48:08   the same time I felt like I really [TS]

00:48:09   packed in with stuff so but it was worth [TS]

00:48:12   doing because of that because it was it [TS]

00:48:14   was how much how many words like you [TS]

00:48:16   said how many words what I had to try to [TS]

00:48:18   write to convey what i could just show [TS]

00:48:20   in a video yeah I I honestly feel like [TS]

00:48:23   it that's the sort of thing that just [TS]

00:48:25   can't be done it verbally it and you [TS]

00:48:29   know it [TS]

00:48:30   I say even even just little things like [TS]

00:48:32   look here's what it looks like in this [TS]

00:48:34   app here's what it looks like in this [TS]

00:48:35   happen and they're all sort of [TS]

00:48:37   monochromatic and you can go through a [TS]

00:48:39   bunch of stuff in the touch bar apps you [TS]

00:48:42   know switching from app to app and you [TS]

00:48:44   know doing things and using the control [TS]

00:48:45   strip and it almost feels like a [TS]

00:48:48   monochrome screen and then all of a [TS]

00:48:51   sudden you're in something like Maps [TS]

00:48:53   question and it's it is all lit up like [TS]

00:48:56   Times Square [TS]

00:48:57   yeah i'm not saying that's wrong yet [TS]

00:48:59   iight but it is you know it it it is [TS]

00:49:02   such a different thing know and all of a [TS]

00:49:04   sudden when your keyboard like Maps is [TS]

00:49:07   probably the best example but it it when [TS]

00:49:10   your keyboard lights up with all those [TS]

00:49:11   colors it is a weird different thing [TS]

00:49:14   because i've been using App laptops for [TS]

00:49:19   I don't know long time you know at least [TS]

00:49:22   15 16 17 years since i first bought one [TS]

00:49:26   and had one at the school paper before [TS]

00:49:29   that so you know probably 20 years my [TS]

00:49:31   keyboards never let up in color before [TS]

00:49:33   yeah so yeah it was surprisingly weird [TS]

00:49:37   to me it really was when you get the [TS]

00:49:40   burst of color it really was [TS]

00:49:41   surprisingly interesting to me you have [TS]

00:49:44   a calculator is the other one that [TS]

00:49:45   struck me because they there are a few [TS]

00:49:46   of those keys are like an orange they're [TS]

00:49:48   like super bright [TS]

00:49:50   yeah and they're still keys but they're [TS]

00:49:52   super bright that maps it's it's [TS]

00:49:54   basically putting up the same icons that [TS]

00:49:56   are in iOS and they're very colorful [TS]

00:49:57   that is the by far the most colorful [TS]

00:49:59   implementation sort of standard buttons [TS]

00:50:00   like people the calculator I thought [TS]

00:50:03   calculator was really instructive done [TS]

00:50:05   only in the use of color but both [TS]

00:50:06   calculator and James Thompson's p Cal [TS]

00:50:08   cap [TS]

00:50:09   those were those were both instructive [TS]

00:50:11   to me in realizing that what I what I [TS]

00:50:14   think is the right way to handle the [TS]

00:50:16   touch bar is as an extension of the [TS]

00:50:18   keyboard and not i mean when all the [TS]

00:50:21   questions like why I wouldn't why would [TS]

00:50:23   you need to touch bar why wouldn't you [TS]

00:50:24   just want to use the mac interface it [TS]

00:50:26   was that idea of I don't know how to do [TS]

00:50:29   this with the keyboard which means that [TS]

00:50:31   i'm going to get to a certain point [TS]

00:50:33   where i have to take my hands off the [TS]

00:50:34   keyboard move down to the trackpad and [TS]

00:50:36   click on some UI on the screen and so [TS]

00:50:39   the calculator was that moment where I [TS]

00:50:40   realized oh I can put like square roots [TS]

00:50:42   and cube root and log and sine and [TS]

00:50:44   cosine on the touch bar and I can do [TS]

00:50:47   numbers and then immediately just move [TS]

00:50:49   my hands slightly up and go tap and now [TS]

00:50:51   I've got a result or the or or [TS]

00:50:53   conversion you know fahrenheit to [TS]

00:50:55   celsius or something and my hands stay i [TS]

00:50:57   was already up on the number right in my [TS]

00:50:59   hand just move up and that was that more [TS]

00:51:01   I thought oh yeah this is why this is [TS]

00:51:03   this is where this shines is I just stay [TS]

00:51:06   on the keyboard and the touch bar kind [TS]

00:51:08   of just as an extension of the keyboard [TS]

00:51:10   that and is that how everybody's going [TS]

00:51:13   to use it I don't know it's so early we [TS]

00:51:15   don't really know but it felt to me like [TS]

00:51:16   that was the moment that unlocked like I [TS]

00:51:19   see why you would use this and and when [TS]

00:51:22   I am James sent me a beta P calc where [TS]

00:51:26   when you tap the function keys it [TS]

00:51:27   brought up a palette of all his [TS]

00:51:29   functions in the UI and and what that [TS]

00:51:31   meant was I tap the the touch bar and [TS]

00:51:33   then I had to take my hands off the [TS]

00:51:35   keyboard move to the trackpad and then [TS]

00:51:37   move the cursor up and then click on [TS]

00:51:39   which one I wanted and I sent him an [TS]

00:51:41   email back and said you know I think [TS]

00:51:42   this is wrong i think what you need is [TS]

00:51:44   to put your functions in the touch bar [TS]

00:51:47   because because it feels like a defeat [TS]

00:51:49   if I touch the touch bar and then i have [TS]

00:51:51   to take my hands off of it and move [TS]

00:51:52   around with the cursor and so he changed [TS]

00:51:55   it and now it's like your most recent [TS]

00:51:57   the functions and conversions appear in [TS]

00:51:59   the touch bar and it's like night and [TS]

00:52:01   day because now i type in 32 and I tap [TS]

00:52:04   conversion fahrenheit to celsius and [TS]

00:52:07   that and it all happens on the touch bar [TS]

00:52:09   and I never have to sort of switch modes [TS]

00:52:11   to mousing around [TS]

00:52:13   yeah and I think that calculator is [TS]

00:52:18   the apples calculators an interesting [TS]

00:52:20   example in a couple of ways I I my gut [TS]

00:52:23   feeling is that that's one of the apps [TS]

00:52:24   that got it most right yeah me too and [TS]

00:52:29   one thing to and I know apple said this [TS]

00:52:31   is true but my experience testing the [TS]

00:52:33   device is that it is clear that apple's [TS]

00:52:37   mac app engineering teams spent a lot of [TS]

00:52:41   time working on touch bar support for [TS]

00:52:43   their apps because there are obviously [TS]

00:52:45   some of the oddball apps like the ones [TS]

00:52:47   that are in applications / utilities you [TS]

00:52:49   know it had only one who's got updated [TS]

00:52:51   it did you really go through everyone i [TS]

00:52:54   did i did i I've got you want to hear [TS]

00:52:57   the list no review but it's like so you [TS]

00:53:00   to activity monitor not that's the one [TS]

00:53:03   that gets me activity monitor and [TS]

00:53:05   terminal are the two utilities that [TS]

00:53:08   Gotye do about terminal i forgot about [TS]

00:53:09   right i forgot the terminal was that was [TS]

00:53:11   buried away in utilities I used to it [TS]

00:53:13   but they also located in this is some of [TS]

00:53:16   the stock and some of them are there [TS]

00:53:17   straps straps but calculator calendar [TS]

00:53:19   contacts finder Final Cut Pro garageband [TS]

00:53:22   iMovie itunes keynote male maps messages [TS]

00:53:25   numbers pages photos preview quicktime [TS]

00:53:27   player safari system preferences and [TS]

00:53:30   then they're a bunch of apps that use [TS]

00:53:31   the sort of standard text editing [TS]

00:53:33   interface and they pick up a text editor [TS]

00:53:35   touch bar interface so like text edit [TS]

00:53:37   and and notes get that get that text [TS]

00:53:40   editing so it's too so there's like [TS]

00:53:42   there's like more than a dozen they did [TS]

00:53:44   a lot mean for people who say apple [TS]

00:53:46   doesn't care about the mac it's like [TS]

00:53:47   they built this whole new bit of [TS]

00:53:49   hardware and then they updated all of [TS]

00:53:51   these mac apps to support it was a lot [TS]

00:53:53   of work right and there's a lot of work [TS]

00:53:56   in I might be missing something actually [TS]

00:54:01   but there's there's the the the hardware [TS]

00:54:03   engineering work of actually putting an [TS]

00:54:06   embedded iOS device into the keyboard [TS]

00:54:09   with this everything system-on-a-chip [TS]

00:54:10   and having a stay way that it can [TS]

00:54:14   interface with the Intel side you've got [TS]

00:54:16   like this arm little arm computer [TS]

00:54:18   running on your keyboard and it [TS]

00:54:20   communicates with the Intel side and the [TS]

00:54:22   Intel side even does the because the one [TS]

00:54:24   of the things that the the iOS device on [TS]

00:54:26   the touch part doesn't have is a GPU so [TS]

00:54:28   the Intel side does the GPU rendering [TS]

00:54:31   and has to go back but it's all done [TS]

00:54:33   securely in and there's a whole bunch of [TS]

00:54:35   the let you know [TS]

00:54:36   electrical engineering going on there [TS]

00:54:37   that's it it's just that you'd never [TS]

00:54:39   know it right didn't you know it's 60 [TS]

00:54:42   frames-per-second just like iOS its [TS]

00:54:45   instantaneous touch [TS]

00:54:48   it's just like you know you'd expect [TS]

00:54:50   from any apple iOS touch device so [TS]

00:54:52   there's that engineered did physical [TS]

00:54:53   hardware engineering of that there's the [TS]

00:54:59   and ended the second level is the mac [TS]

00:55:02   programming side where all of these apps [TS]

00:55:05   were updated with whether they got a [TS]

00:55:08   right or wrong [TS]

00:55:09   none of them seemed half-ass they all [TS]

00:55:11   seemed like a lot of thought went into [TS]

00:55:12   it all these apps got updated with touch [TS]

00:55:16   bar support which is a lot of work but [TS]

00:55:19   then in between those two there's the [TS]

00:55:22   xcode side where the people who work on [TS]

00:55:26   the api's and xcode itself had to do all [TS]

00:55:29   the work to make it so that mac [TS]

00:55:32   developers have api's and and you know a [TS]

00:55:35   simulator so they can test our machines [TS]

00:55:37   that don't actually have a touch bar and [TS]

00:55:38   all of that stuff so an awful lot of [TS]

00:55:41   work went into this and i completely [TS]

00:55:42   agree it's it's to me [TS]

00:55:44   example number one that I whatever else [TS]

00:55:46   is going on with the mac and some of the [TS]

00:55:49   machines that have gone way too long [TS]

00:55:51   without getting updated it's clear that [TS]

00:55:53   Apple this is invested in the mac i [TS]

00:55:56   really think that touch bars is proof of [TS]

00:55:58   it [TS]

00:55:58   yeah and we can debate and I've been [TS]

00:56:01   trying to make this distinction for the [TS]

00:56:02   last couple of weeks it's like part of [TS]

00:56:04   what I think a lot of us do is try to [TS]

00:56:06   understand why Apple is doing what [TS]

00:56:07   Apple's motivation is why Apple made the [TS]

00:56:10   choices it made [TS]

00:56:11   I want to separate that from the [TS]

00:56:14   judgments about whether these are good [TS]

00:56:15   decisions are not because i think we [TS]

00:56:17   could debate whether doing the touch bar [TS]

00:56:20   is a good decision or not we can debate [TS]

00:56:22   the price of these systems and we can [TS]

00:56:24   debate you know this there's so many [TS]

00:56:26   aspects of this that we can that we can [TS]

00:56:29   talk about but I think you can't debate [TS]

00:56:32   the fact that Apple made a major [TS]

00:56:34   investment in the mac platform in this [TS]

00:56:37   in this this particular computer because [TS]

00:56:39   we're seeing a huge bit of hardware [TS]

00:56:41   engineering happening here [TS]

00:56:43   a whole lot of software engineering [TS]

00:56:45   happening here so we can you know we can [TS]

00:56:47   debate whether we think this is the [TS]

00:56:48   right approach whether this was a waste [TS]

00:56:50   of time whether having a laptop focused [TS]

00:56:54   input device method is good or bad if [TS]

00:56:56   it's going to be a gimmick there's all [TS]

00:56:58   those things but you can't debate it was [TS]

00:57:00   a huge investment on Apple's part to do [TS]

00:57:02   this and if they really didn't care [TS]

00:57:03   about the mac why would they do it right [TS]

00:57:06   exactly i do another laptop with the [TS]

00:57:08   latest did intel chips and move on [TS]

00:57:10   right i mean that they could do that [TS]

00:57:12   yeah here's why I think calculators is a [TS]

00:57:14   great example the Apple calculator app [TS]

00:57:16   is a great example because the buttons [TS]

00:57:18   so Apple it at least I don't know [TS]

00:57:21   forever since like iOS 7 show and then [TS]

00:57:23   when you know the the Yosemite whenever [TS]

00:57:27   the mac version was that got the sort of [TS]

00:57:30   iOS style visual refresh [TS]

00:57:32   Apple has a very consistent calculator [TS]

00:57:34   look and it's you know mostly based on [TS]

00:57:36   the color orange [TS]

00:57:38   yeah thanks you know orange buttons so [TS]

00:57:43   when those buttons on the keyboard it [TS]

00:57:45   makes the keyboard look calculator [TS]

00:57:47   branded right like in so if you use [TS]

00:57:49   apples calculator you know what it looks [TS]

00:57:50   like it's got this sort of just orange [TS]

00:57:53   calculator look you see these buttons [TS]

00:57:55   that are orange and it's it to me is a [TS]

00:57:58   very cool way of making the touch bar [TS]

00:58:00   feel like it's part of the app it's it's [TS]

00:58:03   a really cool move and all of the all of [TS]

00:58:06   the functions that are in orange on the [TS]

00:58:09   UI are orange on the touch bar and so [TS]

00:58:13   it's like yeah you mean you immediately [TS]

00:58:15   get it you're like oh yeah right like a [TS]

00:58:17   of course they are course the equals [TS]

00:58:18   button is orange so I'd when I i was at [TS]

00:58:22   the event and I got to talk to people at [TS]

00:58:25   Apple and they showed me the calculated [TS]

00:58:28   and at it a couple of the people i spoke [TS]

00:58:30   to you know that this is one of my [TS]

00:58:32   favorite examples i know it sounds silly [TS]

00:58:33   but they should be calculator and then [TS]

00:58:34   at first like in the default calculator [TS]

00:58:36   mode the only button you have up there [TS]

00:58:38   divided x minus plus equals and they [TS]

00:58:41   said no that it seems silly because [TS]

00:58:43   those buttons are there you know you can [TS]

00:58:45   hit shift on the equals key to get plus [TS]

00:58:47   and you know it's it's not like you [TS]

00:58:49   can't type that but they said like it in [TS]

00:58:55   our testing [TS]

00:58:56   with the team that was using it we found [TS]

00:58:58   that we loved this and surprising how [TS]

00:59:00   many people at on the Apple at inside [TS]

00:59:03   Apple who had access to this and we're [TS]

00:59:05   working on it [TS]

00:59:06   loved the calculator thing because all [TS]

00:59:08   of a sudden you have to get it makes [TS]

00:59:10   your laptop keyboard feel more like [TS]

00:59:14   having that extended keyboard that has [TS]

00:59:16   this the thing on the right side where [TS]

00:59:18   you have number pads and dedicated [TS]

00:59:20   buttons for those features right there's [TS]

00:59:23   a reason why some people who enter [TS]

00:59:24   numbers a lot like having an extended [TS]

00:59:26   keyboard that has that keypad over there [TS]

00:59:28   it gives you sort of the now the number [TS]

00:59:31   layout maybe isn't quite as convenient [TS]

00:59:32   having a horizontal row of numbers but [TS]

00:59:34   not having to worry about everything [TS]

00:59:36   shift or the fact that that they're not [TS]

00:59:40   consecutive you know that- is right [TS]

00:59:43   there but plus you have to hit shift to [TS]

00:59:44   get I mean it's all sort of weird typing [TS]

00:59:47   those those operators on the keyboard on [TS]

00:59:50   that regular keyboard with you don't [TS]

00:59:51   have a numpad with the touch bar [TS]

00:59:54   it really is natural yeah i mean you [TS]

00:59:58   could argue that count [TS]

00:59:58   could argue that count [TS]

01:00:00   Slater is the best example and that that [TS]

01:00:03   they really do run the game but i do [TS]

01:00:05   think that this is going to be an [TS]

01:00:06   interface playground where we're going [TS]

01:00:08   to learn a lot in the next year or two [TS]

01:00:10   where Apple and third-party developers [TS]

01:00:13   tried a bunch of stuff and find out what [TS]

01:00:15   the right approach is because it's all [TS]

01:00:17   over the map now like how calculator is [TS]

01:00:18   a good example because there are there [TS]

01:00:20   are buttons you want to press that that [TS]

01:00:23   are on keys like there is no I mean [TS]

01:00:26   there's an equals key and there's a [TS]

01:00:27   there's a plus and minus and do you know [TS]

01:00:29   but like multiplication is the asterisk [TS]

01:00:32   and division is the / it's like no no [TS]

01:00:34   we're just going to put the symbols on [TS]

01:00:36   the on these virtual keys at the top [TS]

01:00:38   it's like that is the like almost purest [TS]

01:00:40   example where there are things you want [TS]

01:00:42   to type that you don't know what keys to [TS]

01:00:45   press so we're going to just draw those [TS]

01:00:47   keys on the touch bar and you know now [TS]

01:00:49   you know how to press them and you go [TS]

01:00:51   all the way down to something like Final [TS]

01:00:53   Cut which is this incredibly intricate [TS]

01:00:56   context-based set of of sometimes it's [TS]

01:01:00   buttons sometimes it's got like sliders [TS]

01:01:02   and scrubbers and things and you know [TS]

01:01:04   and then there's a bunch of stuff that's [TS]

01:01:05   in between where some some of them you [TS]

01:01:07   look at it you go [TS]

01:01:08   I don't know if this is very useful and [TS]

01:01:10   then others you you look at and like [TS]

01:01:12   Maps you're like whoa you know what am i [TS]

01:01:14   what am I seeing now there's a there's a [TS]

01:01:15   can-can Pratap the the gas station but [TS]

01:01:18   now and it will show me all the gas [TS]

01:01:20   stations around me and and I think over [TS]

01:01:22   time well we'll figure out what [TS]

01:01:24   philosophically like what's the right [TS]

01:01:26   approach what people what looks good and [TS]

01:01:29   what do people actually want to use I [TS]

01:01:32   found safaris to be useless and I'd have [TS]

01:01:35   to make up i have to admit that i didn't [TS]

01:01:37   spend a lot of time configuring the [TS]

01:01:39   touch bar and a lot of apps just because [TS]

01:01:40   I ran out of time and I am gonna feel [TS]

01:01:43   like I will you know once i'm using a [TS]

01:01:45   touch of our quick macbook pro is my [TS]

01:01:47   domain laptop and i will get into do [TS]

01:01:51   that but i found safaris default [TS]

01:01:53   implementation to be useless which is [TS]

01:01:55   that it shows thumbnails of your tabs in [TS]

01:01:57   your current window and I mean maybe [TS]

01:02:01   daring fireball is identifiable it looks [TS]

01:02:04   like a gray button but it they just look [TS]

01:02:06   like a bunch of what almost every [TS]

01:02:08   webpage just [TS]

01:02:10   that shrunk to that size is [TS]

01:02:12   indistinguishable they're just little [TS]

01:02:13   white that with things you know little [TS]

01:02:17   white with grade [TS]

01:02:19   it's just too small i I couldn't [TS]

01:02:21   possibly use that i also embed a little [TS]

01:02:25   bit baffled and and I say this also this [TS]

01:02:28   is a larger complaint I have is they [TS]

01:02:29   added these these tabs safari tabs in El [TS]

01:02:33   Capitan and I like them and I use them [TS]

01:02:35   but they're not on iOS to this day and [TS]

01:02:39   they're not in the touch bar which also [TS]

01:02:40   kind of baffles me like I've told you I [TS]

01:02:43   want these you know these sites and [TS]

01:02:45   they've got these nice little icons and [TS]

01:02:47   they're important enough that I want you [TS]

01:02:48   to keep them tabbed all the time so the [TS]

01:02:51   ontology mean yeah the pin tabs are not [TS]

01:02:53   back and not accessible either so it's a [TS]

01:02:55   little bit and any other graphic that [TS]

01:02:58   that's a great example of like what we [TS]

01:02:59   can do graphic previews of what of all [TS]

01:03:01   the pages that you've gotten your tabs [TS]

01:03:02   and make it a slider it's like well that [TS]

01:03:04   sounds great that's a really cool way of [TS]

01:03:06   showing that this is a feature that has [TS]

01:03:09   more than just buttons in it but in [TS]

01:03:11   practice I don't think it makes any [TS]

01:03:13   sense i don't think it works at all [TS]

01:03:15   I am NOT that's the the bunch of things [TS]

01:03:16   like that that's like you know I get why [TS]

01:03:18   you did it but I honest to god I'd I [TS]

01:03:21   feel embarrassed that I didn't even look [TS]

01:03:23   because it maybe I actually um maybe you [TS]

01:03:25   can actually go in and configure it to [TS]

01:03:26   do this but so if it's already there i'm [TS]

01:03:29   gonna good after we're done recording [TS]

01:03:31   i'm gonna go set up my review unit to do [TS]

01:03:33   this but I think it should be the [TS]

01:03:35   default I my god is I think that this [TS]

01:03:39   far you should just default to putting [TS]

01:03:40   the next tab previous tab buttons up in [TS]

01:03:43   that don't show me they are one just say [TS]

01:03:46   next tab previous tab and make them nice [TS]

01:03:47   and big and have them say next tab [TS]

01:03:49   previous tab yeah i know it's got [TS]

01:03:52   backward and forward [TS]

01:03:53   yeah I don't actually forward I want [TS]

01:03:55   next tab previous tab because i feel [TS]

01:03:57   that the shortcuts for that is kind of [TS]

01:03:59   convoluted it's it's like control tab [TS]

01:04:02   and control shift tab which is really a [TS]

01:04:05   finger full use it that you get that [TS]

01:04:07   with those visual previews I do wonder [TS]

01:04:09   and I I suspect there's a guideline [TS]

01:04:11   somewhere that I haven't seen because [TS]

01:04:13   I'm not a developer i do wonder about [TS]

01:04:15   the touch bar being used for [TS]

01:04:17   informational purposes if somebody laid [TS]

01:04:19   down an edict to that like information [TS]

01:04:22   that isn't permit [TS]

01:04:23   it's like temporary text should not go [TS]

01:04:26   in the touch bar because like I'm [TS]

01:04:27   baffled why the now playing in the [TS]

01:04:30   control strip brings up a scrubber for [TS]

01:04:33   itunes just like I'm never going to [TS]

01:04:34   scrub for music but it might be kind of [TS]

01:04:36   fun just to if I pop that open to see [TS]

01:04:38   the name of the song i'm listening to [TS]

01:04:39   its not there and it won't it'll show [TS]

01:04:42   you in safari i'll show you little tiny [TS]

01:04:45   thumbnails a part of the page of the [TS]

01:04:46   webpage that your you've got loaded in [TS]

01:04:48   your tabs but what it won't do is put up [TS]

01:04:51   like the name of that tab right of that [TS]

01:04:53   page which would be more way more useful [TS]

01:04:56   and I wonder if they've decided like [TS]

01:04:59   know if emerald kind of like text labels [TS]

01:05:01   of what's in a page is not something you [TS]

01:05:04   should do in the touch bar i'm not sure [TS]

01:05:06   I agree with that but I thought I I it [TS]

01:05:08   seems like there's a rule at work here [TS]

01:05:09   that they don't want to put like a a [TS]

01:05:12   text read out it's only for controls not [TS]

01:05:15   for information and even then i would [TS]

01:05:17   say but but a sliver of a horizontal [TS]

01:05:21   sliver of a webpage as a preview is [TS]

01:05:24   useless to me too i am reminded and and [TS]

01:05:29   I skimmed the user interface guidelines [TS]

01:05:33   for the touch bar I should get back to [TS]

01:05:36   that night he read them read them [TS]

01:05:37   thoroughly but I can't help but think [TS]

01:05:39   that no matter how well-written that [TS]

01:05:41   document is just that the evidence of [TS]

01:05:43   using all of apple's apps is that it's [TS]

01:05:47   still sort of a wild west and yet [TS]

01:05:49   they're feeling and now that third-party [TS]

01:05:51   developers can get in on it we [TS]

01:05:53   collectively are feeling our way to how [TS]

01:05:55   we should use it and when i'm reminded [TS]

01:05:56   of is how in the very early years of the [TS]

01:06:00   original mac let's save somewhere around [TS]

01:06:02   nineteen eighty-four 289 or so i would [TS]

01:06:07   say took 45 years the mac was famous for [TS]

01:06:12   its you know human interface guidelines [TS]

01:06:13   right from the beginning and that there [TS]

01:06:15   is consistency and a toolbox that [TS]

01:06:17   developers could use so everybody's [TS]

01:06:19   alert will look at it but you go back [TS]

01:06:20   and look at screenshots from like there [TS]

01:06:22   then you know almost close to the [TS]

01:06:25   nineties I'd say right around system 6 [TS]

01:06:27   is where things got very definitively [TS]

01:06:29   you know Matt all that smack like or um [TS]

01:06:33   this app was clearly written by a [TS]

01:06:34   developer who does not know the matter [TS]

01:06:36   you just see stupid things like somebody [TS]

01:06:39   who spelled ok [TS]

01:06:40   okaaay in a diner a button right like to [TS]

01:06:45   a mac users eyes that it just jumps [TS]

01:06:47   right out as and that's a mistake right [TS]

01:06:51   you do not spell ok ok why but if you [TS]

01:06:54   look back at like 84 85 86 like mac [TS]

01:06:57   dialogues you'd see that all the time [TS]

01:06:59   and you're just weird layout you know [TS]

01:07:01   like not having a default button in the [TS]

01:07:04   dialog right at it [TS]

01:07:06   things that you are or putting the [TS]

01:07:08   default button not in the bottom right [TS]

01:07:09   corner it just things that eventually [TS]

01:07:12   became like what's the word [TS]

01:07:16   idiomatic right idiomatic Mac UI design [TS]

01:07:20   we don't have rat yet that's the what's [TS]

01:07:22   an idiomatic design for the touch bar of [TS]

01:07:25   a nap the touch part interface for a nap [TS]

01:07:27   what type of features are our should go [TS]

01:07:28   in there by default we don't have it yet [TS]

01:07:31   yeah and and i'm excited by the fact i [TS]

01:07:35   mean you could argue like maybe Apple's [TS]

01:07:38   App show a little more unification may [TS]

01:07:40   then they have but I'm okay with it the [TS]

01:07:42   way it is which is everybody [TS]

01:07:44   it looks like with some rules and [TS]

01:07:46   restrictions everybody has tried to [TS]

01:07:49   develop the right approach for their app [TS]

01:07:52   and their content and their users and I [TS]

01:07:56   and sort of let the chips fall where [TS]

01:07:58   they may and I think that's great [TS]

01:07:59   because I I mean right now i think i [TS]

01:08:02   could say with certainty that there are [TS]

01:08:04   apps that do it wrong and the door right [TS]

01:08:05   and we can argue about which is with but [TS]

01:08:07   like there is such a variation and maybe [TS]

01:08:11   it'll turn out that something like what [TS]

01:08:14   Final Cut does is totally the right way [TS]

01:08:16   to do it which is you got sliders and [TS]

01:08:18   you know you're you're intentionally [TS]

01:08:20   using it like that like the DJ app on [TS]

01:08:22   stage right and maybe you know if I had [TS]

01:08:26   to choose I would guess that maybe we're [TS]

01:08:29   gonna back off of that and say actually [TS]

01:08:30   what we saw with DJ in Photoshop what we [TS]

01:08:33   see with final cut pro is maybe too far [TS]

01:08:36   too intense too much of a UI instead of [TS]

01:08:40   a set of shortcuts you know and you know [TS]

01:08:43   and maybe will back off of that maybe [TS]

01:08:44   not maybe i'll turn out that UI is what [TS]

01:08:46   people love and it's having that surface [TS]

01:08:48   there is the best thing in the world [TS]

01:08:49   old but my gut feeling is that it's like [TS]

01:08:52   that's a big that's a big step to go and [TS]

01:08:55   I'm not sure that's the right approach [TS]

01:08:56   but i'm sure people at Apple were [TS]

01:08:58   debating it too and it doesn't have to [TS]

01:08:59   be one of the other I mean it right now [TS]

01:09:01   and right now it isn't in fact my [TS]

01:09:02   biggest Christian final cut is more that [TS]

01:09:04   it's so complicated that it seems to be [TS]

01:09:06   not customizable in any way and and [TS]

01:09:09   that's for me the fact that they went [TS]

01:09:10   back to this classic like from 10-point [TS]

01:09:13   Oh customize toolbar interface to cut [TS]

01:09:16   let people customize the touch bar i [TS]

01:09:18   really like that because I it should be [TS]

01:09:21   personal you should be putting the stuff [TS]

01:09:23   on it that you care about the most and i [TS]

01:09:25   don't know how many people do that but [TS]

01:09:26   I'm glad that that's there and that is [TS]

01:09:28   customizable I worried that it wasn't I [TS]

01:09:30   mean the next step should probably be [TS]

01:09:31   able to make the left third parties have [TS]

01:09:33   access to control strip yeah that's one [TS]

01:09:34   thing at a time and i really like it [TS]

01:09:38   just feels so Mac like it [TS]

01:09:40   terms of the way that the cut [TS]

01:09:43   customization feels exactly like [TS]

01:09:45   customizing the toolbar in a window and [TS]

01:09:48   we're gonna cocoa app it's you know it's [TS]

01:09:50   you know it's by design and it's no [TS]

01:09:53   surprise but it really just goes to show [TS]

01:09:54   that the people who wrote these api's [TS]

01:09:57   are you know knew what they were doing [TS]

01:09:59   and they did it the right now and and I [TS]

01:10:02   you know it doesn't always say when they [TS]

01:10:05   show these things on stage and people [TS]

01:10:06   asked afterward i'm sure they do the [TS]

01:10:07   same to you like what what what do you [TS]

01:10:09   think a lot of it's like well look good [TS]

01:10:11   let's see what the details are and when [TS]

01:10:14   I first customize the toolbar I was like [TS]

01:10:16   wow ok good like they did a really good [TS]

01:10:18   job like I had this whole worry about [TS]

01:10:21   how do you use like you move the cursor [TS]

01:10:25   to the bottom of the screen and it like [TS]

01:10:27   disappears and suddenly you get a [TS]

01:10:28   selection in a toolbar but you in the [TS]

01:10:31   touch bar but you don't see your cursor [TS]

01:10:33   anymore but it's still sort of there as [TS]

01:10:36   a ghost and you can move it around and [TS]

01:10:37   then if you move it back up it pops back [TS]

01:10:39   out on the bottom of your display I'm [TS]

01:10:41   like that's weird [TS]

01:10:42   how are they gonna do that and when I [TS]

01:10:43   used it was like well it makes perfect [TS]

01:10:45   sense like they nailed it they they [TS]

01:10:46   really did figure out a way to do it [TS]

01:10:49   where you never feel like suddenly [TS]

01:10:51   you're pointing device is gone into a [TS]

01:10:53   different parallel universe and nothing [TS]

01:10:55   makes sense anymore like it all held [TS]

01:10:57   together and I'm impressed by by the [TS]

01:11:00   good kind of care that they took with [TS]

01:11:01   that stuff [TS]

01:11:02   it's a little thing [TS]

01:11:03   but I appreciate so when you go into [TS]

01:11:06   edit mode the buttons that are there [TS]

01:11:08   jiggle it's a little similar to you know [TS]

01:11:13   very similar and it clearly drawn from [TS]

01:11:14   the home screen customization and iOS [TS]

01:11:17   where if you want to move your apps [TS]

01:11:19   around in iOS you know you hold the home [TS]

01:11:22   button and you go into the mode and all [TS]

01:11:24   your apps Google it's a good way of [TS]

01:11:28   playing off something people are [TS]

01:11:29   familiar with I feel like that that idea [TS]

01:11:33   but wait if you're going to put him in [TS]

01:11:35   reorder mode make them you know jiggle [TS]

01:11:37   around but what I really like is that to [TS]

01:11:39   me i think is it feels just slightly [TS]

01:11:42   more of us of a serious jiggle then the [TS]

01:11:46   iOS jiggle like the iOS one to move more [TS]

01:11:50   or less in a goofy way and the kind of [TS]

01:11:53   twist yeah they twist and the mac was [TS]

01:11:55   just kind of go back and forth and I may [TS]

01:11:57   be part of that is that it's just [TS]

01:11:59   horizontal maybe they you know but i [TS]

01:12:00   think they could have made him twist if [TS]

01:12:02   they wanted to even if it made the [TS]

01:12:03   corners you know go off the the top it [TS]

01:12:06   just feels more appropriate to the mac [TS]

01:12:08   in a way that the mac is is is a more [TS]

01:12:12   serious platform than iOS I do like the [TS]

01:12:15   personality [TS]

01:12:17   I mean that's one of the things I said [TS]

01:12:18   mind you that you quit that you quoted I [TS]

01:12:20   always always have a moment like it to [TS]

01:12:21   junk it links to me what what part we [TS]

01:12:23   quote i'm and and that one was without [TS]

01:12:26   it's just it's a reporting a true [TS]

01:12:28   feeling I had which is this has more [TS]

01:12:31   personality than I thought it would like [TS]

01:12:32   the ANA it has a lot of animations i [TS]

01:12:34   think if you just read about this [TS]

01:12:36   feature you would not imagine that that [TS]

01:12:39   everything animates and like the touch [TS]

01:12:43   ID sensor when it comes on there is this [TS]

01:12:45   arrow and the arrow like stretches like [TS]

01:12:48   it's made a rubber as it points at the [TS]

01:12:50   touch ID sensor and it is i mean it's [TS]

01:12:53   not wacky know but it is whimsical in a [TS]

01:12:56   way that it totally didn't need to be [TS]

01:12:58   and and there's just little stuff like [TS]

01:13:00   that that I think you know that there is [TS]

01:13:02   there is personality here it isn't just [TS]

01:13:04   this kind of gray we gave we made you a [TS]

01:13:07   toolbar enjoy it's like a little bit [TS]

01:13:09   more enthusiastic and and and I like [TS]

01:13:12   that I like that it's got person to its [TS]

01:13:14   a Mac like whimsical pneus [TS]

01:13:16   so that touch here to login with you [TS]

01:13:18   know touch ID and then it and the arrow [TS]

01:13:21   you know stretching it that to me feels [TS]

01:13:24   right for the mac and it should be it [TS]

01:13:27   would it should be if they did something [TS]

01:13:28   similar on iOS it would be more [TS]

01:13:31   whimsical and appropriately [TS]

01:13:32   yeah I think that's right Horace [TS]

01:13:36   acquitted this thing that horse did you [TS]

01:13:38   wrote a week or two ago where he he [TS]

01:13:41   wrote a piece about see if i can find it [TS]

01:13:45   here i love that piece [TS]

01:13:48   I did too but you know where's Apple [TS]

01:13:50   going with the Macintosh and you know it [TS]

01:13:53   an analogy about you know why isn't the [TS]

01:13:56   maca touchscreen and i'll put the link [TS]

01:13:59   again in the show notes so anybody who [TS]

01:14:00   hasn't read it can do it where for art [TS]

01:14:01   though mcintosh but he wrote and see if [TS]

01:14:07   i can find the quote it cannot [TS]

01:14:15   on the role of being the future he's [TS]

01:14:16   talking about the mac that belongs to [TS]

01:14:19   the touch screen devices it will not [TS]

01:14:20   more him into a touchscreen device any [TS]

01:14:23   more than a tech a teens parent will [TS]

01:14:25   become cool by putting on skinny jeans [TS]

01:14:27   what it will do is become better at what [TS]

01:14:32   it is hired to do i'll put a link in the [TS]

01:14:34   show notes is i promise i'm doing right [TS]

01:14:35   now copying pasting them so infamous for [TS]

01:14:38   saying i put something under here is [TS]

01:14:40   copy paste there it is very well done [TS]

01:14:44   the UH it's great i mean i wrote a piece [TS]

01:14:47   about the same time called like parallel [TS]

01:14:50   falar perpendicular philosophy yes and [TS]

01:14:52   it's the same things like why does [TS]

01:14:53   Microsoft insist on doing these [TS]

01:14:55   touchscreen things and everybody's like [TS]

01:14:56   oh god I can't believe apples not doing [TS]

01:14:58   and it's like well number one reason is [TS]

01:14:59   Apple already has a touchscreen OS so [TS]

01:15:01   what happens doing is differentiating [TS]

01:15:02   you're saying and and this can be hard [TS]

01:15:04   for Mac users to hear although i don't [TS]

01:15:06   mind it's like the mac is like the [TS]

01:15:08   classic computing metaphor that Apple [TS]

01:15:11   makes and you can't push it too far [TS]

01:15:13   because it becomes an iPad or an iPhone [TS]

01:15:15   then and they've already got that like [TS]

01:15:17   they don't need to do a touchscreen [TS]

01:15:19   tablet like they have a touchscreen [TS]

01:15:21   tablet already so the mac has to be [TS]

01:15:24   defined by some fundamental premises and [TS]

01:15:29   apple and again you could debate it and [TS]

01:15:32   say no no [TS]

01:15:33   Microsoft's doing the right thing but [TS]

01:15:35   what Apple has decided and they've done [TS]

01:15:36   this again again they said it publicly [TS]

01:15:38   repeatedly is the max for traditional [TS]

01:15:41   computing with a pointing device and in [TS]

01:15:44   the case of a laptop is very clear [TS]

01:15:46   it's two perpendicular surfaces but it's [TS]

01:15:48   even true on the desktop you've got your [TS]

01:15:49   keyboard tray or the bottom of your [TS]

01:15:51   laptop and that's the control surface [TS]

01:15:53   and it's got the keys and it's got the [TS]

01:15:55   touch bar maybe and it's got the [TS]

01:15:56   trackpad and then it you got the screen [TS]

01:15:58   and this stuff happens on the screen and [TS]

01:16:00   you control it from the from the [TS]

01:16:02   perpendicular surface that's in front of [TS]

01:16:04   you and if you would rather directly [TS]

01:16:06   manipulate with your hands that's fine [TS]

01:16:08   that's not what a mac is max aren't for [TS]

01:16:10   that [TS]

01:16:11   yeah I add this adult with you know [TS]

01:16:13   becoming it cool by putting on skinny [TS]

01:16:15   teen jeans is the best as it's the best [TS]

01:16:19   metaphor I've yeah a lot of I I've seen [TS]

01:16:21   I decided think of it he did but it i [TS]

01:16:23   love it [TS]

01:16:24   and to me the way that it is it that [TS]

01:16:29   Apple has adopted some of these things [TS]

01:16:30   like the animation for that arrow is [TS]

01:16:32   exactly the same way where it's it's not [TS]

01:16:34   trying to be iOS it's not trying to be [TS]

01:16:36   you know it's doing it in a Macintosh [TS]

01:16:38   way and i have to say personally on the [TS]

01:16:41   flip side I got to spend i spent like [TS]

01:16:43   half an hour in a microsoft store when i [TS]

01:16:45   was in san francisco last month for the [TS]

01:16:47   apple event and they had a the new [TS]

01:16:49   surface [TS]

01:16:50   I don't know what they call it surface [TS]

01:16:52   the road studio yes service studio had a [TS]

01:16:55   couple of them set up and a whole bunch [TS]

01:16:57   of apps like photoshop and and and stuff [TS]

01:17:00   and there wasn't you know it was it [TS]

01:17:03   wasn't that crowded there actually I'm [TS]

01:17:06   not making fun of them for having for [TS]

01:17:07   supper and crowded there was actually a [TS]

01:17:08   line for people to try out the VR thing [TS]

01:17:11   they had set up so there was a thing [TS]

01:17:13   there that was drawing a crowd of it [TS]

01:17:16   seemed to me like at least 10 people at [TS]

01:17:18   a time constantly waiting to try the VR [TS]

01:17:20   think so there is something there that [TS]

01:17:21   is drawing people in the store but that [TS]

01:17:23   the surface wasn't so I got to play with [TS]

01:17:27   it and I old person trying to dress like [TS]

01:17:30   a teenager is exactly that it's better [TS]

01:17:33   than anything I could say I had other [TS]

01:17:35   complaints about like the latency [TS]

01:17:36   compared to the Apple pencil on ipad [TS]

01:17:38   there it was low latency I mean [TS]

01:17:40   Microsoft is it you know definitely did [TS]

01:17:42   some work on that but it was not like [TS]

01:17:44   Apple pencil but the weirdest part was [TS]

01:17:46   the way that that just exactly what you [TS]

01:17:49   would think like having a mouse based [TS]

01:17:50   interface but then using touch and a [TS]

01:17:53   pencil to do things was weird like we're [TS]

01:17:55   all of a sudden as your pencil gets near [TS]

01:17:56   you see a cursor on screen right beneath [TS]

01:17:58   it and it's like weird you know i feel [TS]

01:18:01   like i'm using it's not that much better [TS]

01:18:02   than one of those airport terminals [TS]

01:18:06   where you get your boarding pass and [TS]

01:18:07   every time you touch the screen the [TS]

01:18:08   windows mouse cursor moves to where you [TS]

01:18:10   touch it it it just feels like old [TS]

01:18:14   person dressing like a teenager is [TS]

01:18:16   exactly i get it i can't think of [TS]

01:18:18   anything better than that and i would [TS]

01:18:20   just bring a guest break my heart to see [TS]

01:18:21   Apple do that to the mac i guess the the [TS]

01:18:25   one thing that that I if I extended [TS]

01:18:27   horses men metaphor a little bit is it [TS]

01:18:30   is possible for something theoretically [TS]

01:18:33   for something like windows to have a [TS]

01:18:34   like a chrysalis and like turn into a [TS]

01:18:37   teenager right [TS]

01:18:38   I mean they could evolve windows to the [TS]

01:18:40   point where it is a touch interface [TS]

01:18:42   the problem is they've got everybody [TS]

01:18:44   who's using Windows PCs and they don't [TS]

01:18:46   wanna you know they don't have a they [TS]

01:18:48   tried it right they tried it with with a [TS]

01:18:50   metro and with the their arm based stuff [TS]

01:18:53   and in the end the the they retreated [TS]

01:18:56   back to the power of their successful [TS]

01:18:59   windows platform and they've made it [TS]

01:19:00   better but like they have one operating [TS]

01:19:02   system and they can change the context [TS]

01:19:03   but it's one operating system and there [TS]

01:19:06   are challenges with that and I don't you [TS]

01:19:08   know it's not that they're not [TS]

01:19:09   unsolvable they may be solvable but it's [TS]

01:19:12   like I i'm not saying that fundamentally [TS]

01:19:17   microsoft is right or wrong or Apple is [TS]

01:19:19   right or wrong but if you look at what [TS]

01:19:22   the assets of both companies are [TS]

01:19:24   Microsoft has this incredibly successful [TS]

01:19:25   desktop operating system traditional [TS]

01:19:28   computer operating system and they [TS]

01:19:29   haven't done anything in mobile so what [TS]

01:19:32   do you do to get to to approach sort of [TS]

01:19:35   like the mobile world and the touch base [TS]

01:19:36   world you gotta take windows and you [TS]

01:19:38   gotta jam it in there and if your Apple [TS]

01:19:40   you got the mac you get iOS they're fine [TS]

01:19:43   you don't need to do that so they're not [TS]

01:19:44   going to do that and so when people say [TS]

01:19:46   you know one of them is right and one of [TS]

01:19:48   them is wrong [TS]

01:19:49   that may well be i'm not quite sure it's [TS]

01:19:51   that clear [TS]

01:19:52   I think it may be a much more kind of [TS]

01:19:54   shades of grey situation depends on your [TS]

01:19:56   use cases and who knows where we'll be [TS]

01:19:58   in five or ten years but i would i would [TS]

01:20:00   argue both companies are doing what [TS]

01:20:02   makes sense for them because you know [TS]

01:20:04   Microsoft has the assets it has an apple [TS]

01:20:06   is very apple is extremely fortunate in [TS]

01:20:09   fact they're basically the only company [TS]

01:20:11   in the world who has a very successful [TS]

01:20:14   touch-based operating system and a [TS]

01:20:16   traditional computer operating system [TS]

01:20:18   and so they don't need a gym together [TS]

01:20:19   they can just keep them apart and [TS]

01:20:21   everybody like us who's like I love the [TS]

01:20:22   mac i want to keep using the mac they're [TS]

01:20:24   not going to make a Mac that's totally [TS]

01:20:26   unrecognizable because at that point why [TS]

01:20:27   wouldn't you just use a pc or or switch [TS]

01:20:30   and use an iPad so the you know that [TS]

01:20:33   Apple has the luxury of doing that and [TS]

01:20:35   it makes perfect sense that that's what [TS]

01:20:36   they're doing and i also will say that i [TS]

01:20:38   found Windows 10 running on the surface [TS]

01:20:41   to call again the studio service to do I [TS]

01:20:45   i was very lost and confused [TS]

01:20:49   just going between apps and navigating [TS]

01:20:52   the system and it it there i found it i [TS]

01:20:55   honestly found it confusing and part of [TS]

01:20:56   it is just that I haven't used windows [TS]

01:20:58   regularly in over a decade [TS]

01:21:00   yeah but it's very I'm all my windows [TS]

01:21:03   skills were really good up to a point [TS]

01:21:05   and then they windows has evolved enough [TS]

01:21:06   now because I've got windows 10 online [TS]

01:21:08   my imac and boot camp and Windows has [TS]

01:21:12   evolved to the point where all my old [TS]

01:21:13   windows skills which were pretty good [TS]

01:21:15   are just useless now I I'm no idea what [TS]

01:21:17   I'm looking at [TS]

01:21:18   so that doesn't help that it but i will [TS]

01:21:20   say that i've spent time few years ago [TS]

01:21:22   with like when the original surfaces and [TS]

01:21:25   I didn't find those confusing at all now [TS]

01:21:27   I didn't really love the whole idea [TS]

01:21:28   where you can go into traditional [TS]

01:21:30   Windows mouse mouse pointer mode right [TS]

01:21:32   and run your traditional Windows [TS]

01:21:34   software and you go into this other mode [TS]

01:21:36   of the metro mode and it's all [TS]

01:21:38   touch-based but I got it because the [TS]

01:21:40   metro thing was clear like oh these are [TS]

01:21:43   big chunky touch targets and and instead [TS]

01:21:45   of tiled windows they're you know [TS]

01:21:47   they're going on more of a 2d thing and [TS]

01:21:49   you swipe side to side and this is you [TS]

01:21:53   know all new and everything is big and [TS]

01:21:56   you know big thump sizable touch targets [TS]

01:21:59   now and if i want to run my you know [TS]

01:22:01   Mike you know Microsoft Excel i switch [TS]

01:22:02   to this other mode and it looks exactly [TS]

01:22:04   like Excel I know exactly where we're [TS]

01:22:06   going to mouse right yeah I I i guess i [TS]

01:22:09   can see why they went away from that and [TS]

01:22:11   why people rejected it but it it made [TS]

01:22:14   way more sense to me to go that way and [TS]

01:22:16   I think part of it was like understand [TS]

01:22:18   offski they clearly wanted to because [TS]

01:22:21   they had the the army base surface [TS]

01:22:23   tablets that only had the metro mode and [TS]

01:22:26   I really feel like that's where some of [TS]

01:22:29   them the ones who have good taste in [TS]

01:22:30   Microsoft wanted to go like good taste [TS]

01:22:33   in the animal sense and it was a much to [TS]

01:22:35   me a much more compelling device and I [TS]

01:22:37   think it only failed because it didn't [TS]

01:22:39   get developers support that developers [TS]

01:22:41   kept the old classic you know windows [TS]

01:22:44   win32 API apps so i was i was at the d [TS]

01:22:47   conference when they did that demo the [TS]

01:22:49   first of the first time and i remember [TS]

01:22:51   seeing all the metro stuff and thinking [TS]

01:22:52   you know with the original surface and [TS]

01:22:54   thinking damn that is really good Mike [TS]

01:22:57   here comes microsoft you know everybody [TS]

01:22:58   watch out and then they did that moment [TS]

01:23:00   they're like and if you want to run [TS]

01:23:02   office [TS]

01:23:02   instead of showing what I expected to [TS]

01:23:04   see which is like a demo of a [TS]

01:23:05   touch-based office like officer ipad is [TS]

01:23:08   today and they're like boom now you're [TS]

01:23:11   in the Windows desktop and you plug in a [TS]

01:23:14   mouse and a keyboard and you have a pc [TS]

01:23:16   and I thought no no no I remember you [TS]

01:23:19   know what i wrote a piece you wrote a [TS]

01:23:20   piece about it and we were talking about [TS]

01:23:22   it and so do you so close and I still [TS]

01:23:25   believe like the right thing to do was [TS]

01:23:27   from microsoft microsoft to say we have [TS]

01:23:30   taken all our knowledge of windows and [TS]

01:23:31   we have built a touch-based operating [TS]

01:23:33   system that will you know it's related [TS]

01:23:35   and steve ballmer wants to call it [TS]

01:23:36   windows something we'll call it that but [TS]

01:23:38   it's different and the windows RT was [TS]

01:23:41   like that but it was like already [TS]

01:23:43   compromised and half-hearted like they'd [TS]

01:23:45   already kind of sold it out that all [TS]

01:23:46   said given the strength of apple and and [TS]

01:23:49   and google in mobile operating systems [TS]

01:23:51   and what has happened with all of [TS]

01:23:53   Microsoft's attempts to make just a [TS]

01:23:55   mobile operating system [TS]

01:23:56   I'm not really convinced now that even [TS]

01:23:59   if they had done what I think would have [TS]

01:24:00   been the best product that anybody would [TS]

01:24:03   have bought it because they would have [TS]

01:24:04   been selling they couldn't have [TS]

01:24:05   leveraged any of their or much of their [TS]

01:24:08   strength which was windows to get people [TS]

01:24:11   on board so they be starting from [TS]

01:24:12   scratch like they did with Windows Phone [TS]

01:24:14   yeah and so you know i think it would [TS]

01:24:17   have been a way out a way better product [TS]

01:24:19   but I I think feel like by the time they [TS]

01:24:21   got to metro and making that demo the [TS]

01:24:24   ship it kind of sailed already i think [TS]

01:24:26   it was the right way too bad because it [TS]

01:24:27   was cool yeah i think it was the right [TS]

01:24:29   thing to do [TS]

01:24:30   from a design perspective but it was not [TS]

01:24:33   going to work from a marketing [TS]

01:24:35   perspective it's just wasn't going to [TS]

01:24:38   get an erection [TS]

01:24:39   I don't know that there's anything they [TS]

01:24:40   could have done to make metro better [TS]

01:24:42   just better in terms of if we had done a [TS]

01:24:45   better job designing it if we've done a [TS]

01:24:47   better job making the initial set of [TS]

01:24:48   apps it would have succeeded i don't i [TS]

01:24:51   don't think it i don't think it failed [TS]

01:24:52   because it wasn't good enough i think it [TS]

01:24:54   failed be for other reasons [TS]

01:24:56   yeah yeah and it's it's tough because [TS]

01:24:59   you look at microsoft and you know [TS]

01:25:01   Microsoft Microsoft ambition was that of [TS]

01:25:04   a dominant operating system vendor but [TS]

01:25:06   their position was that of a newcomer [TS]

01:25:10   essentially because you know android and [TS]

01:25:13   iOS gobble battle market up very quickly [TS]

01:25:16   they were left kind of with not a whole [TS]

01:25:18   lot like they weren't there in the in [TS]

01:25:20   the blackberry camp down and also [TS]

01:25:22   receiving votes were these people with [TS]

01:25:24   five percent of the market and that's [TS]

01:25:26   tough that's a tough position to be in [TS]

01:25:28   I don't you know I i love a lot of what [TS]

01:25:30   Microsoft's doing now but it's a it's [TS]

01:25:32   still a tough position to be in because [TS]

01:25:33   they do need to be windows and try to [TS]

01:25:35   innovate and you know i know a lot of [TS]

01:25:38   people especially creative people people [TS]

01:25:40   who use pen input all the time on their [TS]

01:25:43   mac with a with a tablet and all that [TS]

01:25:46   people who really kind of going ape over [TS]

01:25:48   the over the surface studio and I'm not [TS]

01:25:52   one of those people [TS]

01:25:54   I'm so it didn't really throw me and in [TS]

01:25:56   fact when I looked at it I thought I [TS]

01:25:58   would much i think i would much rather [TS]

01:25:59   have a in desktop ipad yeah but that's [TS]

01:26:04   what i will say this i did I if you draw [TS]

01:26:08   for a living I don't know if you draw [TS]

01:26:10   comics if you are an architect or [TS]

01:26:12   something like that I can totally see [TS]

01:26:13   how the city so yeah tablet is a device [TS]

01:26:16   for you but I'd I don't want to pry [TS]

01:26:18   don't see any reason to like that device [TS]

01:26:20   if you're not if you're not someone who [TS]

01:26:22   makes a living with a pen in your hand [TS]

01:26:23   and the funny thing and the enemy and [TS]

01:26:25   there's this is part of the people [TS]

01:26:27   coming back to people being grumpy with [TS]

01:26:28   Apple about various things it's like one [TS]

01:26:31   of the things that seems like yeah if [TS]

01:26:32   you're cartoonist or a comic book artist [TS]

01:26:34   or or anybody who is who is using these [TS]

01:26:36   certain kind of inputs there's going to [TS]

01:26:38   be a class of user for whom the surface [TS]

01:26:40   studio is the perfect computer and you [TS]

01:26:43   know what a lot of those people are [TS]

01:26:44   going to be loyal mac users and they're [TS]

01:26:46   gonna they're gonna feel torn and [TS]

01:26:48   they're gonna feel like Apple has left [TS]

01:26:50   let them down a little bit because Apple [TS]

01:26:52   isn't providing them with that same kind [TS]

01:26:53   of product and all of those feelings are [TS]

01:26:56   valid but I would also say it's also [TS]

01:26:59   valid for Apple to say we're never going [TS]

01:27:00   to make a product like that like that is [TS]

01:27:02   not how big how big a market is that how [TS]

01:27:04   many how many surface studios are going [TS]

01:27:06   to sell right i mean it's a cool product [TS]

01:27:08   that will be perfect for a very specific [TS]

01:27:10   group of people and they should love it [TS]

01:27:12   because you know because it's it's made [TS]

01:27:14   for them and it's brilliant for them but [TS]

01:27:16   i'm not sure that i can see the logic of [TS]

01:27:18   Apple like making their next imac like a [TS]

01:27:21   surface to do I just doesn't make sense [TS]

01:27:22   going to see not in the very near future [TS]

01:27:25   not within the next handful of years but [TS]

01:27:27   I could see [TS]

01:27:29   within 10 years I could see Apple having [TS]

01:27:31   a 30-inch iOS device [TS]

01:27:33   oh i agree i mean that's that's the at [TS]

01:27:37   some point I was talking to somebody [TS]

01:27:38   about it and that's what i said is it's [TS]

01:27:40   way more likely that makes a giant iPad [TS]

01:27:42   right then they make a touchscreen mac [TS]

01:27:44   on your desk like that way more likely [TS]

01:27:46   Waverly I i had so much more likely that [TS]

01:27:50   you know just the guy is the guy that [TS]

01:27:53   Hillary Clinton was locked when ya is [TS]

01:27:57   right right Justin I do they only met [TS]

01:27:59   are you the guy from Princeton who said [TS]

01:28:01   it was a ninety-nine percent or you need [TS]

01:28:02   silver who said it was you know the [TS]

01:28:04   two-to-one odds because that makes the [TS]

01:28:07   difference there [TS]

01:28:07   well I woke up loving that guy from [TS]

01:28:09   Princeton and woke up the next day one [TS]

01:28:13   and have a talk with he wrote a blog [TS]

01:28:16   post and it's just kinda hilarious [TS]

01:28:18   because it's like dude you said greater [TS]

01:28:19   than ninety-nine percent probability i [TS]

01:28:21   don't think you know how probability [TS]

01:28:22   works like that was and that was nate [TS]

01:28:23   silver people were really ragged on nate [TS]

01:28:25   silver about it not to get too much into [TS]

01:28:26   the election but it's like it's over all [TS]

01:28:28   along he got crap from so many people [TS]

01:28:30   saying Donald Trump had a chance he's [TS]

01:28:32   like look if we miss our numbers up then [TS]

01:28:35   she's gonna have a she's gonna have a [TS]

01:28:36   sweep but if we miss that if the polls [TS]

01:28:38   are all off two percent down which like [TS]

01:28:40   by less than they were off for Obama [TS]

01:28:43   Romney just which was like off by 3% if [TS]

01:28:45   they're off in Trump's favored by 2% [TS]

01:28:47   he's gonna win the electrical and like [TS]

01:28:50   he said that days before the election [TS]

01:28:52   everyone that's what they were off by 2% [TS]

01:28:54   yeah you so it was chosen from within [TS]

01:28:57   that cone of pop probably no poles [TS]

01:29:00   nationwide her up three percent and she [TS]

01:29:02   wound up winning the popular vote by 1% [TS]

01:29:04   which honors and was not please don't [TS]

01:29:06   email me i know i'm not arguing that [TS]

01:29:08   means she should be President I know the [TS]

01:29:09   rules the idea though is that if a [TS]

01:29:11   candidate especially the Democrat only [TS]

01:29:14   wins because of the electoral college [TS]

01:29:16   only win the popular vote by 1% that [TS]

01:29:18   there's a very high probability that the [TS]

01:29:20   Republican candidate will win the [TS]

01:29:22   electoral college and it's exactly will [TS]

01:29:24   happen [TS]

01:29:25   yes and it this year the left in 2012 [TS]

01:29:27   silver said that that it was actually a [TS]

01:29:30   motto bama's favor the way the states [TS]

01:29:32   were stacking up he could have lost the [TS]

01:29:33   popular by half a percent or something [TS]

01:29:35   anyone the left right for this election [TS]

01:29:37   the way it stacked up that and they [TS]

01:29:40   factored in like a form [TS]

01:29:42   before you can go back and look they [TS]

01:29:43   said they had like an eight ten twelve [TS]

01:29:45   percent chance the Trump would lose the [TS]

01:29:47   popular vote and when the electoral [TS]

01:29:48   college and so like you know [TS]

01:29:50   probabilities are hard it's hard for [TS]

01:29:52   people to understand the New York Times [TS]

01:29:53   said that field goal the whole time and [TS]

01:29:56   that was one of my thoughts on election [TS]

01:29:57   night was like I guess you missed the [TS]

01:29:59   field goal but it's a 30 NFL fan when [TS]

01:30:03   they say her chances are like making a [TS]

01:30:05   thirty-eight-year-old yard field goal in [TS]

01:30:07   the NFL it's like you know what people [TS]

01:30:08   miss it 38-yard field goals all the time [TS]

01:30:10   i asked buffalo bills and Seth's yeah [TS]

01:30:13   yeah it happens let me take a break here [TS]

01:30:15   they're gonna sponsor it is one of our [TS]

01:30:17   best friends of the show it's Harry's [TS]

01:30:20   Harry's makes shaving products they make [TS]

01:30:24   themselves they are terrific terrific [TS]

01:30:26   big razor companies i'm not gonna name [TS]

01:30:29   names i'm not going to name that in [TS]

01:30:30   gillette chick they have this annoying [TS]

01:30:33   habit of putting out new models but you [TS]

01:30:35   know the Mach 7 whatever the hell they [TS]

01:30:38   call the new thing and what they do [TS]

01:30:39   every time they put out a new model is [TS]

01:30:40   they raised their already high prices [TS]

01:30:42   unlike those guys Harry's doesn't want [TS]

01:30:45   to have charged they're going for low [TS]

01:30:47   prices [TS]

01:30:48   that's why they made their razors even [TS]

01:30:50   better they have just upgraded their [TS]

01:30:51   whole line of razors and handles and [TS]

01:30:54   they're keeping the prices exactly the [TS]

01:30:56   same they're not just putting on a new [TS]

01:30:59   line to make you feel like 12 hours to [TS]

01:31:00   spend more to get more now you pay the [TS]

01:31:02   same prices with that they already had [TS]

01:31:03   which were already lower than the [TS]

01:31:06   national big brands and they've improved [TS]

01:31:09   everything there are five blade razors [TS]

01:31:11   now include softflex hinge for a more [TS]

01:31:15   comfortable glide they now include a [TS]

01:31:17   trimmer blade for hard-to-reach places [TS]

01:31:19   which I think for most men at least is [TS]

01:31:21   like that little area right under your [TS]

01:31:23   nose a lubricating strip and a textured [TS]

01:31:27   handle for more control when it's wet [TS]

01:31:29   it's they sent me one and I have to say [TS]

01:31:31   I love my old one [TS]

01:31:32   I've had it for years that I mean I've [TS]

01:31:34   had it since Harry started sponsoring my [TS]

01:31:36   show it was like I think around 20 years [TS]

01:31:38   ago it feels like and when I put the old [TS]

01:31:40   one away here's the thing it still looks [TS]

01:31:42   brand new [TS]

01:31:43   which is bizarre it is their stuff is [TS]

01:31:45   built to last but the new one the [TS]

01:31:46   textured handle it's clearly better the [TS]

01:31:49   instant upgrade [TS]

01:31:50   no problem [TS]

01:31:51   and it's still just two bucks per blade [TS]

01:31:53   compared to four dollars or more that [TS]

01:31:56   you'll pay the drugstore brands like [TS]

01:31:58   Gillette they own our own factory in [TS]

01:32:01   Germany where they make plays they don't [TS]

01:32:03   just buy like cut-rate blades on some [TS]

01:32:05   kind of open market and then just slap [TS]

01:32:07   Harry's label on them they have their [TS]

01:32:08   own razor blade factory in Germany where [TS]

01:32:11   they make these blades and then they can [TS]

01:32:13   keep the prices low because they sell [TS]

01:32:16   them direct to you [TS]

01:32:17   Harry's is so confident in the quality [TS]

01:32:20   of blades [TS]

01:32:22   they'll send you their popular free [TS]

01:32:23   trial set which comes with a razor five [TS]

01:32:27   blade cartridge and shaving gel [TS]

01:32:30   it's free when you sign up for a shave [TS]

01:32:32   plan all you do is pay shipping plus [TS]

01:32:38   there's a special offer for fans of the [TS]

01:32:40   talkshow get a bottle of Harry's post [TS]

01:32:43   shave balm added to your order for free [TS]

01:32:47   when you visit Harry's dot-com and use [TS]

01:32:49   the code talk show know that just talk [TS]

01:32:52   show at checkout [TS]

01:32:54   you will get a free bottle of the post [TS]

01:32:56   shave balm it's good stuff smells good [TS]

01:32:58   feels good i've got it it's really [TS]

01:33:00   really nice stuff so go to Harry's calm [TS]

01:33:02   right now and use talk show at checkout [TS]

01:33:04   to claim your free trial set and post [TS]

01:33:08   shave balm which is better than the deal [TS]

01:33:10   you get from most other podcast so [TS]

01:33:11   remember that that's Harry's dot-com [TS]

01:33:14   code talk show you talked about the [TS]

01:33:18   control strip before we move on to other [TS]

01:33:20   things we do you remember this is the [TS]

01:33:23   stupidest question I've ever going to [TS]

01:33:24   ask do you remember the court control [TS]

01:33:26   strip classic mac OS do I remember the [TS]

01:33:30   control strip [TS]

01:33:32   yeah I actually booted up a an emulator [TS]

01:33:34   the other day to look at it to just [TS]

01:33:37   remind myself but god I like I had that [TS]

01:33:39   on my powerbook don't you remember like [TS]

01:33:41   CPU connect expounder book utilities [TS]

01:33:43   which like added items to the control [TS]

01:33:45   and loved it yes [TS]

01:33:47   yeah toi I mean that was that was that [TS]

01:33:49   was like the dock of its day to put in [TS]

01:33:52   clatters know who our modern mac users [TS]

01:33:53   you know it to me was better it was one [TS]

01:33:55   of the things I mean famously or maybe [TS]

01:33:58   not famously because I was a little [TS]

01:33:59   maybe more obscure but the first like 34 [TS]

01:34:01   years of daring fireball is mostly me [TS]

01:34:03   bitching about Mack [TS]

01:34:04   I was 10 in the ways that the interface [TS]

01:34:05   is not as good as the classic mac OS and [TS]

01:34:08   control strip is one of those things [TS]

01:34:10   where it was so perfectly Mac like every [TS]

01:34:13   pixel of it was perfectly it of the way [TS]

01:34:18   that things were supposed to look in [TS]

01:34:19   that OS and just everything for doing [TS]

01:34:22   the close button the little the little [TS]

01:34:24   zipper thing that you would just tap to [TS]

01:34:26   make it expand and contract that just [TS]

01:34:30   everything about it was so nice and it [TS]

01:34:33   was so elegant and it felt so right for [TS]

01:34:35   the mac system-wide that you just have [TS]

01:34:37   this little thing and then you could [TS]

01:34:38   eventually you could drag it around to [TS]

01:34:39   any corner didn't have to be in a corner [TS]

01:34:42   I think it had to be a corner right [TS]

01:34:44   no it could be it could be anywhere [TS]

01:34:45   learning either somewhere along the left [TS]

01:34:47   or right and you'd zip it open and you [TS]

01:34:50   get all these little icons and they [TS]

01:34:51   opened it up to third parties and third [TS]

01:34:53   parties did some really useful stuff and [TS]

01:34:57   like the mac equivalent Mac os10 [TS]

01:34:59   equivalent of it is all these little [TS]

01:35:01   turd icons in the top-right of our men [TS]

01:35:05   toolbars or the menu bar menu bar you [TS]

01:35:07   still got them all those my cards were [TS]

01:35:09   there in the old Mac OS that those would [TS]

01:35:12   all be control strip items and your [TS]

01:35:14   menubar would only have menus and then [TS]

01:35:16   anything else would be in a control [TS]

01:35:18   strip which was really nice [TS]

01:35:20   it bothers me i will end 15 years later [TS]

01:35:25   that we don't we don't we had something [TS]

01:35:28   so elegant as the control strip and now [TS]

01:35:30   we've put all these terms and our menu [TS]

01:35:32   bars [TS]

01:35:33   I wonder if bartender this bartender let [TS]

01:35:39   you put their bar anywhere [TS]

01:35:41   I wonder about that like this bartender [TS]

01:35:43   is kind of like that where you can [TS]

01:35:44   actually pull things out of the menu bar [TS]

01:35:45   and put them in a little bartender bar [TS]

01:35:46   and I wonder if you can you can [TS]

01:35:49   yeah you can I think you can move it [TS]

01:35:51   around hmm i look at that i looked at [TS]

01:35:53   bartender remember looking at years ago [TS]

01:35:55   and for some reason and rejected it but [TS]

01:35:58   maybe I should take another look [TS]

01:36:00   yeah I don't know it's it's not i mean [TS]

01:36:03   its hat its kind of hacky although it's [TS]

01:36:05   got some things going forward i use it [TS]

01:36:06   to clean up my menu bar because there's [TS]

01:36:08   some items that I don't need to see most [TS]

01:36:09   of the time but I can't really need to [TS]

01:36:11   get to it but it's it's in the ballpark [TS]

01:36:12   right and the idea there is could [TS]

01:36:14   imagine pulling all of the stuff off the [TS]

01:36:16   menu bar and putting [TS]

01:36:17   in this little little bar that that you [TS]

01:36:20   talk somewhere else so you pop up [TS]

01:36:21   somewhere else and yeah we just I think [TS]

01:36:23   the answer is screen real estate is that [TS]

01:36:26   that in the control strip was designed [TS]

01:36:28   to be very small when collapsed and then [TS]

01:36:31   you pop it open to get to the UI and [TS]

01:36:33   floated above everything and then you [TS]

01:36:35   turn off appletalk or do whatever you [TS]

01:36:37   need to do or connect via PPE to the [TS]

01:36:41   Internet in the dial-in with your modem [TS]

01:36:42   and then you and then you snap it closed [TS]

01:36:45   in the end it just is a little this [TS]

01:36:47   little tiny thing in the corner and then [TS]

01:36:48   you're done and now we've got these huge [TS]

01:36:50   monitors and they just littered with [TS]

01:36:51   menu bar I demand the top but yea [TS]

01:36:53   control trip was great it was it was an [TS]

01:36:55   unsung hero of the sort of latter-day [TS]

01:36:58   classic mac OS yeah really was and I'm [TS]

01:37:01   so it started on laptops to and then was [TS]

01:37:02   so popular they they brought it to the [TS]

01:37:05   desktop to every computer even though it [TS]

01:37:07   started on powerbook I i haven't I wish [TS]

01:37:09   that I had asked while I was talking to [TS]

01:37:11   people from apple but I I can't help but [TS]

01:37:13   think that they named the new thing that [TS]

01:37:14   control strip that it's not a [TS]

01:37:16   coincidence that it's you know I built [TS]

01:37:18   by people who remember deal with because [TS]

01:37:19   it's so similar in concept the way it [TS]

01:37:22   zips open from the song yeah I mentioned [TS]

01:37:25   it to them I was like that's a familiar [TS]

01:37:27   name and like yeah we knew we knew [TS]

01:37:29   yeah you know some of you guys would [TS]

01:37:30   notice that we reuse the name and you [TS]

01:37:33   know it's it's uh it's a cute reference [TS]

01:37:36   like I think that's what they were going [TS]

01:37:37   for was those in the know it was you [TS]

01:37:39   know apples aware of all these things [TS]

01:37:41   that has the intellectual you know [TS]

01:37:42   property in the trademark for and that [TS]

01:37:44   was a name that they had and it was [TS]

01:37:46   doing a similar job and so they used to [TS]

01:37:48   him and it just adds similar character [TS]

01:37:50   you know just the way that it animates [TS]

01:37:51   soup not-so-nice yep [TS]

01:37:55   anything else on the macbook pros I i [TS]

01:37:59   have 1i guess broad topic about it but [TS]

01:38:02   anything you want to talk about with the [TS]

01:38:03   new macbook pros [TS]

01:38:05   I don't know I I mean it's the other big [TS]

01:38:10   thing about them well I mean we [TS]

01:38:12   mentioned touch bar we mentioned touch [TS]

01:38:13   ID the other big thing about him is the [TS]

01:38:15   port's em and I feel sort of talked out [TS]

01:38:18   about it because we've been talking [TS]

01:38:19   about it since the macbook came out a [TS]

01:38:21   year ago and almost two years ago now [TS]

01:38:24   and certainly in the last month since [TS]

01:38:27   the apple event and I'm kind of over it [TS]

01:38:30   like [TS]

01:38:31   it support transition it stinks [TS]

01:38:33   everybody knows that stinks [TS]

01:38:34   everybody buys adapters there's a period [TS]

01:38:37   where everybody's got the adapters and [TS]

01:38:39   has old hardware and then eventually it [TS]

01:38:40   goes away and I think USBC invulnerable [TS]

01:38:42   three is like a good direction to go [TS]

01:38:45   and the only way you get there is by [TS]

01:38:46   going through a transition so here we [TS]

01:38:48   are and you know I I don't know if I I'm [TS]

01:38:53   I i I'm kind of drained of outrage or [TS]

01:38:56   something like that because i do think [TS]

01:38:57   it's superior in almost every way every [TS]

01:38:59   time I try to plug something into the [TS]

01:39:01   back of my imac and get the USB [TS]

01:39:03   orientation wrong and have to flip it [TS]

01:39:05   over and peer into the port to make sure [TS]

01:39:07   that i'm doing it right [TS]

01:39:08   I think well USBC dependable three solve [TS]

01:39:12   this [TS]

01:39:12   this is dumb and so you know I i get i [TS]

01:39:16   get people complaining about it and [TS]

01:39:18   there right to complain about it but at [TS]

01:39:20   the same time I feel like in the long [TS]

01:39:21   run it's going to be it's going to be [TS]

01:39:24   great and I'm gonna miss magsafe um I [TS]

01:39:27   will but at the same time I think it's [TS]

01:39:29   also cool that you can on the on the [TS]

01:39:31   touch bar models you can plug in your [TS]

01:39:33   mac on either side that is great that is [TS]

01:39:35   so great [TS]

01:39:36   it's so many yeah there are so many [TS]

01:39:39   times where it's at the worst is when [TS]

01:39:42   you're far enough away from the power or [TS]

01:39:44   it would fit to the right but not the [TS]

01:39:46   left [TS]

01:39:47   yeah it's just the but there's other [TS]

01:39:49   times we just don't want to have to [TS]

01:39:50   drape it around the outside where it [TS]

01:39:52   just is inelegant like I'm in one case [TS]

01:39:56   for me it was an east coaster is [TS]

01:39:59   sometimes if you're on the acela on the [TS]

01:40:01   United on the East Coast train amtrak [TS]

01:40:04   acela you can get there's some really [TS]

01:40:07   cool seats that have a table in between [TS]

01:40:09   them but you're facing people on the [TS]

01:40:10   other side and the tables are relatively [TS]

01:40:13   as you might expect there it's not a [TS]

01:40:15   very wide table you know you're pretty [TS]

01:40:18   close but you have enough space were two [TS]

01:40:20   people back to back can you know put [TS]

01:40:22   their laptops you no fair you know [TS]

01:40:24   easily but if you wanted to stretch the [TS]

01:40:28   power around the other side it's you [TS]

01:40:29   know you can do it but it it so be so [TS]

01:40:33   much easier if you could always just [TS]

01:40:34   plug it in on the side closest to the [TS]

01:40:36   wall [TS]

01:40:36   yeah yeah so it's again i get i get [TS]

01:40:41   people's complaints about it maybe I'm [TS]

01:40:43   just a little jaded because I've seen [TS]

01:40:45   all before it's like yes everybody will [TS]

01:40:47   complain yes it will be a pain yes we [TS]

01:40:48   will need adapters then we'll get over [TS]

01:40:50   it and then in a few years we'll look [TS]

01:40:52   back and think wow I can't believe that [TS]

01:40:54   we use that I this stuff so much bad [TS]

01:40:56   link to a couple of examples from like [TS]

01:40:58   four years ago macbook pros and they it [TS]

01:41:01   was so uncanny how the almost [TS]

01:41:04   word-for-word you didn't even have to [TS]

01:41:06   like edit out like it you know one you [TS]

01:41:09   know the name of the port they would [TS]

01:41:10   just be like to have you know not enough [TS]

01:41:11   ports too thin not you know they're [TS]

01:41:13   eight exactly word for word what people [TS]

01:41:16   are saying about these i also believe i [TS]

01:41:19   have written about this too but i [TS]

01:41:20   believe firmly that Apple's aggressive [TS]

01:41:23   traditional not just in this case with [TS]

01:41:26   the going all USBC Thunderbolt three but [TS]

01:41:30   they've you know that they've done this [TS]

01:41:32   so many times in the past that it it [TS]

01:41:34   brings about the future we're being all [TS]

01:41:37   USBC is fine [TS]

01:41:39   sooner than if they had stuck a couple [TS]

01:41:42   of legacy ports on on the devices if [TS]

01:41:45   they put it you know old school USB and [TS]

01:41:48   one old Thunderbolt or something like [TS]

01:41:50   that in I firmly I can't prove it there [TS]

01:41:54   is no way to prove it without the [TS]

01:41:56   ability to take a fork the universe in a [TS]

01:41:59   but in the alternate universe where [TS]

01:42:01   these new MacBook Pros have like a USB [TS]

01:42:04   port and a Thunderbolt port I don't know [TS]

01:42:07   what other ports people still wish they [TS]

01:42:09   had but alright SD card reader or [TS]

01:42:11   something like that i really believe [TS]

01:42:15   that two or three years ago [TS]

01:42:17   it's less of a it's less of a USBC [TS]

01:42:19   everywhere world [TS]

01:42:21   oh sure I mean I I think I it's only a [TS]

01:42:25   matter of degrees because you I think [TS]

01:42:27   you made this point on daring fireball [TS]

01:42:28   which is if you have legacy ports you [TS]

01:42:31   have no motivation to switch because you [TS]

01:42:34   can just keep using your legacy port but [TS]

01:42:36   once you've switched and you have no [TS]

01:42:37   more of the old ports then there's no [TS]

01:42:40   longer any point in buying anything [TS]

01:42:42   using the old ports and you move to the [TS]

01:42:43   new ports and that and then you move on [TS]

01:42:45   and and it the longer you leave the [TS]

01:42:48   bridge and apples done that in the past [TS]

01:42:49   where they left the bridges and they've [TS]

01:42:50   done it with a rip the band-aid off and [TS]

01:42:53   I this time they decided to rip the [TS]

01:42:55   band-aid off and i I'm I'm okay with it [TS]

01:42:58   I [TS]

01:42:58   in fact the people that I I have the [TS]

01:43:00   most sympathy for are probably like the [TS]

01:43:03   photographers and videographers who use [TS]

01:43:04   that SD card slot and I totally get why [TS]

01:43:07   it is a pain to have to go from having [TS]

01:43:09   no reader to having a reader as somebody [TS]

01:43:13   who use an 11-inch air [TS]

01:43:15   I didn't have a slide haha i already had [TS]

01:43:18   already felt that pain but I get it I [TS]

01:43:20   totally get that say I get that one too [TS]

01:43:22   I i do get it and it speaks to how [TS]

01:43:24   useful the s2 built in SD slot is too [TS]

01:43:28   serious photographers that Apple did it [TS]

01:43:31   ever in the first place because it's the [TS]

01:43:33   least appellee thing that they've done [TS]

01:43:35   in a long time it is [TS]

01:43:39   yes it's just like since they put s [TS]

01:43:41   video on the Macintosh yeah like why is [TS]

01:43:43   this 40 right it has to be if it's so [TS]

01:43:46   underrated it really it's it the SD card [TS]

01:43:50   slot on max is the return of the floppy [TS]

01:43:52   drive i mean its way you know that you [TS]

01:43:55   know thousands of times faster and [TS]

01:43:56   thousands of you know times more storage [TS]

01:43:59   but it's you know the floppy drive it [TS]

01:44:03   isn't police Tapley thing I know so it's [TS]

01:44:06   I eat the fact that it's so useful is [TS]

01:44:08   the reason they did it in the first [TS]

01:44:09   place but the fact that they removed it [TS]

01:44:11   is because the reason why it you know [TS]

01:44:14   Apple was the first company to remove [TS]

01:44:16   the floppy drive right although i mean i [TS]

01:44:18   just bought for experimenting for like [TS]

01:44:21   podcasting stuff I bought an SD card [TS]

01:44:24   that does Wi-Fi it's not the ID by it's [TS]

01:44:26   a it's a toshiba i think one and it's [TS]

01:44:30   pretty good you know it's again not [TS]

01:44:32   perfect but i can see apple's philosophy [TS]

01:44:34   here to of saying you know you can get a [TS]

01:44:37   card reader and then there are also new [TS]

01:44:38   wireless technologies in in the SD cards [TS]

01:44:41   in the cameras the another there are [TS]

01:44:43   other ways to transfer this stuff or you [TS]

01:44:47   bring a cable and attach your camera [TS]

01:44:48   direct you know it's not but I i get it [TS]

01:44:52   i like I get why why that's a bit major [TS]

01:44:54   inconvenience because that was their you [TS]

01:44:57   know their storage medium of choice and [TS]

01:44:58   had a reader built in now [TS]

01:45:00   now it's gone I totally get it that said [TS]

01:45:03   that there's still a fair number i [TS]

01:45:04   realized SD is the most popular size but [TS]

01:45:07   there's still a number people shooting [TS]

01:45:08   on canons that shoot the caf [TS]

01:45:12   card and there's other cameras that she [TS]

01:45:15   did use the supermicro almost like sim [TS]

01:45:17   cards size SD card right super time [TS]

01:45:21   yeah and then with them you have to [TS]

01:45:22   bring an adapter you know usually it's i [TS]

01:45:25   think most people probably used there's [TS]

01:45:26   SD standard SD card sized adapters that [TS]

01:45:29   you slide it in and then you put into [TS]

01:45:30   your still you know it wasn't an ideal [TS]

01:45:32   world and i feel like the world where [TS]

01:45:34   everything just works wirelessly and you [TS]

01:45:37   can very very quickly [TS]

01:45:39   airdrop things equivalent of airdrop [TS]

01:45:42   whether it's actually officially drop or [TS]

01:45:43   not but just you know a lot of things [TS]

01:45:45   from your standalone camera to your [TS]

01:45:46   macbook it's gonna come quicker now that [TS]

01:45:49   the SD card is not in Macintosh's yeah I [TS]

01:45:54   I think that's true but i think i think [TS]

01:45:56   maybe they'll be a little longer of a [TS]

01:45:58   pain the pain transition will be a [TS]

01:46:01   little different there than for like us [TS]

01:46:02   getting stuff but i just think back to [TS]

01:46:04   like you know the imac throughout their [TS]

01:46:06   cereal ADB and and scuzzy all in one [TS]

01:46:09   throw for four USB and this is this is a [TS]

01:46:12   little bit like that I guess the last [TS]

01:46:15   thing i want to talk about is it the [TS]

01:46:18   whole the the people arguing that these [TS]

01:46:20   aren't pro devices that ok they're nice [TS]

01:46:22   it's nice enough but it's not a pro [TS]

01:46:24   device because it's not the fastest [TS]

01:46:27   intel mobile chipset it's not the one [TS]

01:46:31   that I don't get into the details but [TS]

01:46:35   Apple wants to use the low-energy ram [TS]

01:46:38   and they'll use it with by wanting to [TS]

01:46:40   use the low-energy ram their limited to [TS]

01:46:43   16 gigabytes right now that's gonna [TS]

01:46:45   change soon enough i get i would bet in [TS]

01:46:47   2017 there will be an update to the [TS]

01:46:49   macbook pros that support at least 32 [TS]

01:46:51   gigabytes of RAM I don't know if it go [TS]

01:46:54   to 64-bit will be at least 6 32 but [TS]

01:46:58   there's people who would want just to [TS]

01:46:59   name one thing that they would rather [TS]

01:47:01   have apple build a at least as an option [TS]

01:47:05   another level of macbook pro that I say [TS]

01:47:10   has a better graphics card a higher [TS]

01:47:15   energy that ram that that would support [TS]

01:47:17   up to 32 or more gigabytes of RAM even [TS]

01:47:20   if it takes more energy [TS]

01:47:22   and would rather have a significant hit [TS]

01:47:25   on battery life but a performance [TS]

01:47:27   improvement and they'll just plug it in [TS]

01:47:29   or you know get less battery life why [TS]

01:47:31   wont Apple build that machine and let [TS]

01:47:33   them buy it yeah I'm i guess i get that [TS]

01:47:38   although i think your Apple you know [TS]

01:47:40   what the sweet spot of your market is [TS]

01:47:42   and you know who's buying these things [TS]

01:47:43   and and again it sucks if you are the [TS]

01:47:48   person who's in the corner of the market [TS]

01:47:51   that is small but you're in it so it's [TS]

01:47:55   super important to you and apple look 7 [TS]

01:47:57   goes are we really going to solve are we [TS]

01:47:59   gonna build one reference sort of design [TS]

01:48:01   for the macbook pro and it's going to [TS]

01:48:04   cater to two percent of our market or [TS]

01:48:06   four percent of our market are we really [TS]

01:48:07   going to do that and you know the [TS]

01:48:10   customer not everybody needs to be [TS]

01:48:13   targeted customers not always right not [TS]

01:48:14   everybody needs to be targeted and that [TS]

01:48:16   stinks if you're in that in that area [TS]

01:48:18   that we're apples like look you agree [TS]

01:48:20   just gonna have to suffer because we're [TS]

01:48:21   not going to build this product we would [TS]

01:48:22   have to make major changes in order to [TS]

01:48:24   build this product so that it would also [TS]

01:48:26   overlap your needs so I get that I also [TS]

01:48:29   think though Apple knows about the march [TS]

01:48:30   of time and the market technology and as [TS]

01:48:33   in so many of these apple product [TS]

01:48:34   designs they're kind of looking ahead [TS]

01:48:36   and maybe some of that is that they [TS]

01:48:38   expected more from Intel that I would [TS]

01:48:40   maybe that can help but i also think [TS]

01:48:41   true little I do [TS]

01:48:43   yeah yeah yeah and I i have this you [TS]

01:48:46   talk about next year's like yeah you [TS]

01:48:48   think Apple would use its influence with [TS]

01:48:50   intel maybe to say how about a 32 gig [TS]

01:48:53   ceiling next time right [TS]

01:48:55   can you work on that because we really [TS]

01:48:56   could use that but in this same [TS]

01:48:59   enclosure with the same power profile [TS]

01:49:01   and all of that next year stuff is going [TS]

01:49:04   to be able to do way more than this year [TS]

01:49:05   stuff and the year after that because [TS]

01:49:07   this this this model will probably be [TS]

01:49:10   the same one that we see in terms of the [TS]

01:49:12   shape of it and the touch bar and all [TS]

01:49:15   that this is probably also the 2018 [TS]

01:49:17   macbook pro and the 2019 macbook pro on [TS]

01:49:19   I think side and every year they're [TS]

01:49:21   going to have more capabilities fitting [TS]

01:49:23   in this small K so this is the year [TS]

01:49:24   where it's kind of a tough ask and next [TS]

01:49:27   year will be better and and that's again [TS]

01:49:30   stinks if you're not in there now and [TS]

01:49:32   you need a laptop now it is [TS]

01:49:34   I have no arguments for you yeah that's [TS]

01:49:35   terrible i get it right [TS]

01:49:38   I think you know you have to think I [TS]

01:49:40   keep thinking about it from like a [TS]

01:49:41   marketing perspective product marketing [TS]

01:49:42   perspective is that Apple has three [TS]

01:49:46   slots for macbooks for families of [TS]

01:49:49   macbooks and they you know they have [TS]

01:49:51   their gradients that blend between them [TS]

01:49:53   at price points you know where there's [TS]

01:49:55   like a hundred dollar at every hundred [TS]

01:49:57   dollars from like 999 up to you know [TS]

01:50:00   four thousand dollars almost you know [TS]

01:50:01   there's configurations that you can buy [TS]

01:50:04   but fundamentally there's the macbook [TS]

01:50:07   cheap in other words price is your [TS]

01:50:09   biggest concern and that is the macbook [TS]

01:50:12   air and it has been for the last few [TS]

01:50:13   years the whole entire reason the [TS]

01:50:16   macbook air is still being sold is to [TS]

01:50:18   hit the 999 starting price point right [TS]

01:50:21   it's like the old plastic macbook was [TS]

01:50:23   back in the day before it got eclipsed [TS]

01:50:25   by the magic you know I forgot about [TS]

01:50:26   this the last time you were on the show [TS]

01:50:27   the last time you were on the show back [TS]

01:50:29   in August we were talking about macbooks [TS]

01:50:31   speculating about what we're now talking [TS]

01:50:33   about nine site and you did something [TS]

01:50:35   about the macbook pro being the best [TS]

01:50:37   selling mac and yeah that was totally [TS]

01:50:40   everybody said no no it's like I heard [TS]

01:50:43   somebody because the prices so right and [TS]

01:50:44   it worked weird weird to me and you are [TS]

01:50:47   thinking too much about people like us [TS]

01:50:48   and really I heard from a couple people [TS]

01:50:52   who work in apple retail stores and [TS]

01:50:53   they're like you just cannot even [TS]

01:50:55   believe how many people when they come [TS]

01:50:58   in to get a new mac it's it and you can [TS]

01:51:01   you know and they can you can you know [TS]

01:51:02   they say kids dealing with them and you [TS]

01:51:04   know these apple the people who work in [TS]

01:51:05   the source of various it's very clear [TS]

01:51:06   that these people just you know they [TS]

01:51:08   want to get a mac they're definitely you [TS]

01:51:10   know you can tell they're gonna buy one [TS]

01:51:11   but they're not definitely there's no [TS]

01:51:13   doubt they're going to get the air it's [TS]

01:51:14   just a question of which one because you [TS]

01:51:16   know about a hundred dollars is the most [TS]

01:51:18   more they're gonna spend and it's all [TS]

01:51:19   about and I'm an imac I macbook areas [TS]

01:51:22   that are right I i haven't used macbook [TS]

01:51:24   pro in years so for me I think i got i [TS]

01:51:26   was too busy focusing on like the [TS]

01:51:27   flagship and the one that's got the [TS]

01:51:29   probably the biggest profit margin right [TS]

01:51:32   right but that's not the same as I mean [TS]

01:51:34   and that's why that 999 13-inch non-red [TS]

01:51:37   air is still there right because that is [TS]

01:51:40   that is priced to move and that's the [TS]

01:51:42   price that gets you into a mac laptop [TS]

01:51:43   and it's a pretty you know what it's a [TS]

01:51:45   pretty good system it's pretty it's a [TS]

01:51:47   pretty good mix [TS]

01:51:47   power and price it really is even today [TS]

01:51:49   people who are thinking of the old pc [TS]

01:51:51   industry in a way that everything every [TS]

01:51:53   six to eight months you'd you know just [TS]

01:51:55   put new chips and you know everything [TS]

01:51:56   would get faster and he'd always be you [TS]

01:51:58   know swapping out in a way that the [TS]

01:51:59   macbook air is effectively unchanged in [TS]

01:52:02   the prices unchanged prices and going [TS]

01:52:03   down there keeping it in 99 it's it's [TS]

01:52:07   because people keep buying them it is a [TS]

01:52:09   best-selling device and they don't mind [TS]

01:52:11   people don't mind it fast enough for [TS]

01:52:13   them so you know you could say that [TS]

01:52:15   Apple is under like some kind of moral [TS]

01:52:17   obligation to you know cut the Pricer [TS]

01:52:20   you know but it's you know business-wise [TS]

01:52:23   you know that's it doesn't make any [TS]

01:52:24   sense [TS]

01:52:25   it's a very popular device and it exists [TS]

01:52:27   just to hit that price point then [TS]

01:52:29   there's the macbook pro which is right [TS]

01:52:32   now it's the same size there's no [TS]

01:52:34   argument in size or weight between a [TS]

01:52:36   13-inch macbook pro in a macbook air it [TS]

01:52:38   is just you know if you want to say pro [TS]

01:52:41   it's really you know like I I emphasize [TS]

01:52:43   the word nice in my review its the [TS]

01:52:44   macbook nice in our the macbook premium [TS]

01:52:47   if you want to call it it is you know [TS]

01:52:49   it's there in every single regarded as [TS]

01:52:52   nicer faster as the retina screen and [TS]

01:52:56   now it has a super bright red screen and [TS]

01:52:58   then in between is the macbook then in [TS]

01:53:01   light which you know that's what now is [TS]

01:53:04   called the macbook 10 years ago or eight [TS]

01:53:07   years ago was the macbook air and you [TS]

01:53:08   still pay a pretty penny a premium for [TS]

01:53:10   the thinnest and lightness and the [TS]

01:53:13   niceness and it has a Retina screen and [TS]

01:53:16   it just it's just it's just sexy right i [TS]

01:53:18   mean that's just it is like the little [TS]

01:53:20   convertible sports car right it is [TS]

01:53:23   really really i was in a meeting i'm on [TS]

01:53:26   this panel at Drexel University that [TS]

01:53:28   meets like once a year like it its [TS]

01:53:31   alumni advisors in this thing and it [TS]

01:53:33   would be able to meet I don't go to [TS]

01:53:34   meetings very often and we just had a [TS]

01:53:37   meeting and there is a guy who had the [TS]

01:53:39   the you know the current macbook and all [TS]

01:53:42   i could think is a goddamn that is a [TS]

01:53:44   nice that is a nice-looking laptop I [TS]

01:53:46   don't it's not really for me right but [TS]

01:53:48   it's like I you know and I think he's [TS]

01:53:50   you know you just typing emails on it [TS]

01:53:51   and it's like wow that is a nice thing [TS]

01:53:53   to carry around [TS]

01:53:55   is there room for something else like [TS]

01:53:58   that would be yeah this isn't my [TS]

01:54:00   proposed marketing name but the the [TS]

01:54:02   macbook max for the macbook the power [TS]

01:54:06   the power mac book pro or you know [TS]

01:54:08   whatever you want to call it something [TS]

01:54:10   that trades battery life and maybe some [TS]

01:54:15   thinnest and wait for sheer computing [TS]

01:54:18   power [TS]

01:54:19   well it's the equivalent I mean it's a [TS]

01:54:21   slot that they haven't had for a little [TS]

01:54:23   while because if you think about the the [TS]

01:54:25   areas like the plastic macbook and the [TS]

01:54:27   macbook is where the areas to be macbook [TS]

01:54:30   pro is still sort of where it was and at [TS]

01:54:33   in terms of 13 and 15 and then there's [TS]

01:54:35   this lot that used to be like the the [TS]

01:54:38   lunge a right the cafeteria for the [TS]

01:54:40   17-inch macbook pro and they just don't [TS]

01:54:42   make that computer anymore but you know [TS]

01:54:45   and and i think this is a lot of the pro [TS]

01:54:48   fear about Apple is that laptop doesn't [TS]

01:54:54   exist and the mac pro basically doesn't [TS]

01:54:56   exist because it's been abandoned since [TS]

01:54:59   it was released three years ago and so [TS]

01:55:01   here we are [TS]

01:55:04   like what is this what does this all [TS]

01:55:05   mean does apple care about that that [TS]

01:55:08   market enough to make a product for it [TS]

01:55:10   or do pros have to kind of sneak out [TS]

01:55:12   their livelihood on computers that were [TS]

01:55:15   not really made for them because that's [TS]

01:55:17   the best that Apple once not can offer [TS]

01:55:19   wants to offer is willing to offer and i [TS]

01:55:22   don't know i mean they totally could I [TS]

01:55:24   I'm a little surprised that they didn't [TS]

01:55:25   take the old macbook pro and stuff [TS]

01:55:28   something even more powerful in there in [TS]

01:55:31   the old enclosure and just say look [TS]

01:55:32   we've got this thing that's got old [TS]

01:55:34   ports and it's got its got the latest [TS]

01:55:35   Intel processors in the latest GPU and [TS]

01:55:38   go to 10 and no touch bar and just it's [TS]

01:55:41   also available you can max it out you [TS]

01:55:43   can load it up with stuff and if you [TS]

01:55:46   really need it you can you can take I [TS]

01:55:47   sympathize and I'm hearing from readers [TS]

01:55:49   and listeners and I see it and I believe [TS]

01:55:51   I believe them [TS]

01:55:52   I don't think it's like an idle threat [TS]

01:55:54   but I'm hearing from people saying I i [TS]

01:55:55   think i have to switch back to Windows [TS]

01:55:57   you know because I I need to be able to [TS]

01:56:00   buy something and it's clear Apple isn't [TS]

01:56:01   gonna make it for me and that is the [TS]

01:56:03   advantage of its always been the [TS]

01:56:04   advantage of the pc market place is that [TS]

01:56:06   you [TS]

01:56:06   well [TS]

01:56:07   Apple's whole Apple has holes in its [TS]

01:56:09   lineup and right now its hole is a [TS]

01:56:11   notebook that is optimized for let's [TS]

01:56:14   just say I was gonna say power but that [TS]

01:56:16   sounds like it might be energy [TS]

01:56:17   performance sheer performance the most [TS]

01:56:20   Ram Charan the fastest ships in the [TS]

01:56:22   fastest graphics they don't have that [TS]

01:56:23   they don't sell it and there are pc [TS]

01:56:26   laptops that have you know the fastest [TS]

01:56:28   intel cpus and incredibly fast hot GPUs [TS]

01:56:32   and you know they just you know [TS]

01:56:33   sacrifice battery life and wait for that [TS]

01:56:35   apple doesn't feel that the pic the hole [TS]

01:56:38   in the pc market is in my opinion [TS]

01:56:40   niceness there's nothing you can buy on [TS]

01:56:42   the pc market that's as nice as a [TS]

01:56:44   macbook pro um obviously that's [TS]

01:56:47   subjective obviously the difference in [TS]

01:56:49   that and it drives people some people [TS]

01:56:50   not is you can measure performance you [TS]

01:56:52   can go run a benchmark and come up with [TS]

01:56:54   a number [TS]

01:56:55   there's no benchmark for how nice the [TS]

01:56:57   machine is and how much I appreciate the [TS]

01:56:59   new hinge when I lift open the thing but [TS]

01:57:02   I feel it in my gut and I believe it [TS]

01:57:05   that's what you give up it's a shame [TS]

01:57:07   that there are people who love mac o Mac [TS]

01:57:09   os10 love the mac and but have the that [TS]

01:57:12   their personal needs are such that they [TS]

01:57:14   want that machine because I don't think [TS]

01:57:16   apple is going to make right and i think [TS]

01:57:19   yeah it's so easy to come across as as [TS]

01:57:23   not have be having sympathy for them or [TS]

01:57:26   not caring about them and I that's not [TS]

01:57:29   how I feel at all but if your Apple you [TS]

01:57:33   have to make a calculation about you [TS]

01:57:36   know first off there's all the things [TS]

01:57:37   about what [TS]

01:57:38   what's the product we if they went down [TS]

01:57:40   this path and then realize that the you [TS]

01:57:42   know that was going to limit them to 16 [TS]

01:57:43   gigs ram and they're like well you know [TS]

01:57:45   we thought until we come through with [TS]

01:57:46   something different but they didn't [TS]

01:57:48   maybe that happened or maybe they did [TS]

01:57:49   they decided 16 was good enough for [TS]

01:57:51   almost all cases what is the number of [TS]

01:57:55   people for whom the highest-end mac [TS]

01:57:58   laptop is simply not sufficient [TS]

01:58:00   what is that number what's the size of [TS]

01:58:02   that market and who are those people and [TS]

01:58:04   are they influential and all that [TS]

01:58:06   nada yeah and so you ask that you do [TS]

01:58:10   have to buy something right now or or [TS]

01:58:12   can they wait a year for something that [TS]

01:58:13   will be you know the better more [TS]

01:58:16   efficient more powerful in the same [TS]

01:58:17   space and that's for me that's the [TS]

01:58:20   question like [TS]

01:58:21   if Apple I'm sure Apple has done that [TS]

01:58:23   calculation we know that Apple has very [TS]

01:58:26   smart product marketing and research [TS]

01:58:28   people and they look at this stuff and [TS]

01:58:31   they've got access to data that we don't [TS]

01:58:32   because they are apple and my guess is [TS]

01:58:36   because these are the decisions they [TS]

01:58:38   made that they looked at that and said [TS]

01:58:39   that market is not sufficiently large [TS]

01:58:42   enough the market were cutting off by [TS]

01:58:45   making these decisions is not [TS]

01:58:46   sufficiently large enough for us to not [TS]

01:58:48   make these decisions so we're going to [TS]

01:58:50   do it and maybe they're right and maybe [TS]

01:58:53   they're wrong right maybe the wrong but [TS]

01:58:55   if they're right it doesn't change the [TS]

01:58:57   fact that there are lots of people [TS]

01:58:58   potentially just not enough in that [TS]

01:59:02   space we're gonna feel like apples and [TS]

01:59:04   in them and you know what Apple has [TS]

01:59:06   abandoned them apples said look if you [TS]

01:59:08   need 32 gigs of ram in your laptop and [TS]

01:59:11   this kind of bent you know like I'm in a [TS]

01:59:14   real afm slack and and shahid Kamal [TS]

01:59:17   Ahmad is in there and he's a he's a game [TS]

01:59:18   developer and he's I think he's gonna [TS]

01:59:20   buy one of these because he's also a mac [TS]

01:59:22   fan but like he's doing windows [TS]

01:59:24   development now and he looks at this and [TS]

01:59:25   Brianna was like this to you know do it [TS]

01:59:28   she knows about game development Stefan [TS]

01:59:29   and they're like you know for for 3d and [TS]

01:59:34   VR and stuff like that this hardware is [TS]

01:59:36   kind of not good enough [TS]

01:59:38   it's like it and and for gaming it's [TS]

01:59:40   certainly not good enough but Apple has [TS]

01:59:41   made that decision for years now if like [TS]

01:59:44   we don't care if it's not good enough [TS]

01:59:45   for gaming we don't optimize for gaming [TS]

01:59:47   so I guess what I'm saying is it it [TS]

01:59:50   could be that Apple's miscalculated here [TS]

01:59:51   but it could also be that what we're [TS]

01:59:53   hearing is the the people who are [TS]

01:59:56   basically being told by Apple we're not [TS]

01:59:59   going to make a computer [TS]

01:59:59   going to make a computer [TS]

02:00:00   that will satisfy you and apples not [TS]

02:00:02   wrong to make that decision necessarily [TS]

02:00:04   and they're definitely not wrong to be [TS]

02:00:06   angry about it but it's not a sign that [TS]

02:00:08   this was a misfire that some people are [TS]

02:00:11   going to buy a PC because Apple can [TS]

02:00:14   satisfy I think that it's also the case [TS]

02:00:16   that apple wood designs to do you know [TS]

02:00:20   eliminates makes choices for their [TS]

02:00:23   customers because they've truly believe [TS]

02:00:25   that they know better and they want to [TS]

02:00:26   keep customers from making a mistake by [TS]

02:00:30   which i mean let's say you go into the [TS]

02:00:32   apple store and in you know you've got [TS]

02:00:34   the money to spend and you want to buy a [TS]

02:00:37   the best macbook pro that you can get [TS]

02:00:40   for the best macbook located in case [TS]

02:00:42   they had a different name like the [TS]

02:00:43   macbook plus or whatever [TS]

02:00:45   obviously there are some truly expert [TS]

02:00:49   users game developers like you said [TS]

02:00:50   people who really do know exactly [TS]

02:00:52   yes I don't care finally get five hours [TS]

02:00:54   of battery life instead of 10 i want the [TS]

02:00:56   machine has this power I think Apple [TS]

02:00:58   know that there's other people who come [TS]

02:00:59   in and say well if this machine is is [TS]

02:01:03   twenty-five hundred dollars in this [TS]

02:01:05   other machine is twenty-five hundred [TS]

02:01:06   dollars and thicker and heavier but look [TS]

02:01:07   at the specs [TS]

02:01:08   it's got more gigahertz it's got more [TS]

02:01:10   ram that's clearly the better machine [TS]

02:01:12   i'll buy the one that's better [TS]

02:01:14   or maybe it's more expensive right I [TS]

02:01:16   don't know but whatever if it can be [TS]

02:01:18   mistaken as being better in them in [TS]

02:01:20   their mind but it isn't for them that [TS]

02:01:24   it's gigahertz extra gigahertz they [TS]

02:01:25   don't need that extra graphics that they [TS]

02:01:27   don't need its battery life that they [TS]

02:01:29   were would appreciate if they had it [TS]

02:01:31   that it would be a mistake for them to [TS]

02:01:33   walk out of that store i think apple [TS]

02:01:34   obviously it's not these macbook pros [TS]

02:01:37   are not the best hypothetical macbook [TS]

02:01:39   pros from november 2016 for every single [TS]

02:01:42   person but i think what Apple is it i [TS]

02:01:46   think it's you know restating what you [TS]

02:01:48   said what Apple's tried to do is make [TS]

02:01:50   the best machines for the most people [TS]

02:01:52   and that keeps your mother and people [TS]

02:01:55   from buying the wrong going the wrong [TS]

02:01:58   way [TS]

02:01:59   yeah and and it's it's not to come back [TS]

02:02:02   to like when the customer like myths we [TS]

02:02:05   have about companies succeeding or [TS]

02:02:07   failing based on keeping their customers [TS]

02:02:09   happy [TS]

02:02:09   the truth is that it's not [TS]

02:02:13   it's not a you choose to make everybody [TS]

02:02:15   happy or you choose to make some people [TS]

02:02:17   unhappy the truth is the choices you [TS]

02:02:19   make are going to make somebody unhappy [TS]

02:02:20   in most cases and you get to choose who [TS]

02:02:23   you make unhappy and apple makes the [TS]

02:02:26   choices and now we'll have to live with [TS]

02:02:28   them and we'll see quite what happens [TS]

02:02:31   but it you know if if Apple views the [TS]

02:02:34   decisions about battery and about weight [TS]

02:02:36   and about sighs and and says that you [TS]

02:02:40   know ninety percent of our users care [TS]

02:02:42   about that stuff and one percent of our [TS]

02:02:45   users care about this other thing then [TS]

02:02:47   you know I can see why they make that [TS]

02:02:49   decision right and and it doesn't [TS]

02:02:51   doesn't make it any more bitter if [TS]

02:02:54   you're somebody who's kind of on the [TS]

02:02:56   outside looking in saying i really like [TS]

02:02:57   more than 16 gigs of ram and my laptop [TS]

02:02:59   please or a better GPU but it's an open [TS]

02:03:04   it's an open question like a pro like [TS]

02:03:07   you said it means nice that's probably [TS]

02:03:11   true in the mac pro it's the same [TS]

02:03:13   question of like does Apple Apple as a [TS]

02:03:16   company right now making is making [TS]

02:03:20   decisions about what their audiences for [TS]

02:03:22   these various products who are their [TS]

02:03:24   customers and it may be that the apple [TS]

02:03:27   of five years ago would be like oh man [TS]

02:03:28   we gotta get the high-end super high-end [TS]

02:03:31   developers and content creators and [TS]

02:03:32   people who used to use linux and now use [TS]

02:03:34   a use a Mac because they get the command [TS]

02:03:36   line we got to get those people because [TS]

02:03:37   we got to use them in the mac you know [TS]

02:03:39   maybe apple a day is like now we're not [TS]

02:03:41   interested in those people we want a [TS]

02:03:43   mass-market of people the macbook pro is [TS]

02:03:46   nice but it's not gonna be for everyone [TS]

02:03:47   and that's their decision to make and if [TS]

02:03:51   they want to turn their back on certain [TS]

02:03:52   markets it might be a good business [TS]

02:03:53   decision and if i was in those markets I [TS]

02:03:55   would be pissed off that I think all [TS]

02:03:57   these things are true I don't think if [TS]

02:03:59   people in a certain markets switch to [TS]

02:04:01   windows or linux it means the macbook [TS]

02:04:04   pro is a bad decision necessarily [TS]

02:04:05   because it you know it [TS]

02:04:07   Apple Apple will not be surprised if [TS]

02:04:09   that happens right that is not like [TS]

02:04:11   these came out and apples like what they [TS]

02:04:13   only have 16 gigs of ram haha were [TS]

02:04:15   shocked right they made that decision [TS]

02:04:16   they knew what the ramifications we're [TS]

02:04:18   going to be and you know it's it's [TS]

02:04:21   interesting if that's the case that a [TS]

02:04:24   bunch of people maybe that they've kind [TS]

02:04:25   of wood over [TS]

02:04:26   to the mac over the last 15 years with [TS]

02:04:27   OS 10 are now not in Mara not in their [TS]

02:04:32   target anymore and then i will say i [TS]

02:04:34   just think that you know again it's [TS]

02:04:36   things could change [TS]

02:04:37   you know the past does not always [TS]

02:04:38   predict the future but if you look at [TS]

02:04:40   the last 10 years of macbook sales you [TS]

02:04:43   know it's you know it has gone down a [TS]

02:04:45   little bit last year but I think that's [TS]

02:04:46   mostly been people waiting you know but [TS]

02:04:48   yeah it's the apples priorities [TS]

02:04:52   prioritizing a witness to an obstet [TS]

02:04:55   almost obsessive degree at prioritizing [TS]

02:04:58   battery life to an almost obsessive [TS]

02:05:00   degree you know and it really I i come [TS]

02:05:03   back to this many many times that the [TS]

02:05:04   order of your priorities matters [TS]

02:05:06   tremendously even if you have liked to [TS]

02:05:08   you know the customer and the Apple have [TS]

02:05:11   like the same top four priorities you [TS]

02:05:13   know but they're in slightly different [TS]

02:05:15   order it makes it makes a tremendous [TS]

02:05:17   difference in a resulting product and [TS]

02:05:19   apples the blister order of priorities [TS]

02:05:22   has shown to be very successful [TS]

02:05:24   yeah and that's that's the thing is is a [TS]

02:05:28   Apple Apple it could be making a bad [TS]

02:05:33   decision here it's entirely possible [TS]

02:05:34   that they're making a bad decision here [TS]

02:05:36   and we'll find out what the market says [TS]

02:05:38   about it but they have their priorities [TS]

02:05:40   and a lot of it is something that is [TS]

02:05:41   just sort of like quintessentially apple [TS]

02:05:43   and you know when we say they prioritize [TS]

02:05:45   the battery i mean i think that the [TS]

02:05:47   right thing to say there is really like [TS]

02:05:48   they prioritize the weight and men's the [TS]

02:05:52   thinness and the battery comes third [TS]

02:05:56   where the battery has to hit some kind [TS]

02:05:58   of metric but but really no more than [TS]

02:06:02   that because every inch every minute [TS]

02:06:05   every hour of battery life above what [TS]

02:06:09   they think is optimal is added weight [TS]

02:06:11   and thickness that they risk that that [TS]

02:06:13   you know you don't get you get enough [TS]

02:06:15   battery to hit like with the ipad it's [TS]

02:06:17   whatever 10 hours and that's it you [TS]

02:06:20   don't get any more battery and that with [TS]