The Talk Show

158: Live From WWDC 2016, With Guests Phil Schiller and Craig Federighi


00:00:00   ladies and gentlemen welcome to mezzanine once you please take your [TS]

00:00:09   seats and silence your cellphone's daring fireball productions in [TS]

00:00:18   association with the daring fireball company LLC is delighted to welcome you [TS]

00:00:25   to a daring fireball presentation of the talk show live from WWDC 2016 and now [TS]

00:00:38   once you please welcome your host Jon groomer ball [TS]

00:00:47   I actually needed that reminder my cell phone was not on on silent [TS]

00:00:53   thank you Mike [TS]

00:00:57   ah i will start by thanking our sponsors on this is a fifth-year actually we've [TS]

00:01:04   been doing I've been doing a show at least fourth time here at mezzanine and [TS]

00:01:09   I think that mail chimp has been sponsoring our bar all along and if not [TS]

00:01:14   it's at least as far back as I remember so I it just in case it isn't clear the [TS]

00:01:20   bar is on house it is on mailchimp male chim if you guys don't know they are in [TS]

00:01:25   email newsletters like my friend Ben Thompson strategery goes after the [TS]

00:01:32   mailchimp I they also have a bunch of new features stuff that integrates with [TS]

00:01:37   online stores and integration just about any online store platform that you might [TS]

00:01:43   be familiar with and then you can get your customers to get email when [TS]

00:01:47   products that they're interested are available or whatever great company if [TS]

00:01:52   you need to send email [TS]

00:01:55   go to mailchimp . calm and please let's hear for them for the open bar also back [TS]

00:02:09   with us for the fourth consecutive year has a sponsor the show is microsoft and [TS]

00:02:13   had for years it's not even like a wow that's weird microsoft sponsoring now [TS]

00:02:19   it's like awesome and and it makes total sense they have this website is going to [TS]

00:02:23   give you so much more information than I have time to give you now any dev any [TS]

00:02:28   app.com that's the message we're trying to give that any developer you're [TS]

00:02:33   working on mobile or the web for any type of app if you need cloud services [TS]

00:02:38   now called the user app service you need that sort of stuff go check it out their [TS]

00:02:43   website is so much information here's a funny thing the same website last year [TS]

00:02:47   but instead of any dev any app.com I said any app any dev . com and we are in [TS]

00:02:55   fact streaming this live uh and you know the show went on and meantime I gave out [TS]

00:03:04   the wrong URL for the pretty pricey sponsor [TS]

00:03:10   and what happened is there's some kid in Australia was watching the live stream [TS]

00:03:13   of grip like jumped on and registered the domain this true story this is an [TS]

00:03:22   absolute true story of you guys seem at Dancing he's your represent microsoft [TS]

00:03:26   he's about this tall women Hockenberry gonna have a fight after the show's over [TS]

00:03:32   you can ask him he'll vouch for this so they got in contact with them were like [TS]

00:03:36   oh man that's what Microsoft we better get this domain and it was already gone [TS]

00:03:39   contacted the kid and they were like oh man this kid is gonna you know he's [TS]

00:03:43   really gonna let us have it and he was like well one of those xboxes would be [TS]

00:03:46   nice [TS]

00:03:49   so they they said the kid like a box-like with an xbox in like all the [TS]

00:03:55   cool stuff that you could possibly imagine going to the xbox and I got the [TS]

00:03:58   domain so I think it's safe that you you can just go check out the information [TS]

00:04:02   for Microsoft go to any app or any dev . now any doubt any half.com microsoft [TS]

00:04:10   great sponsor and then last but not least we won more sponsor this one is [TS]

00:04:14   new and surprisingly this is the thing because we think Microsoft by going to [TS]

00:04:19   go bigger than that but this is actually one of the few i mean i'm guessing maybe [TS]

00:04:23   three or four corporations in the world with a larger market cap than Microsoft [TS]

00:04:30   it's mac.com [TS]

00:04:36   mat.com is this store that I would run if I were gonna run like an online store [TS]

00:04:43   and I me be clear i have absolutely zero interest in running a store and seems [TS]

00:04:47   seems like a terrible job [TS]

00:04:50   ah and a lot of hard work and I I don't like either of those things so ah yeah [TS]

00:04:58   I'm not gonna run store but if I did it would be like Maddie there's a way [TS]

00:05:00   networks have one product today that's it you don't even know what it is you [TS]

00:05:03   have to like go there at midnight you find out what they're selling to needs [TS]

00:05:06   one thing daily deal [TS]

00:05:07   usually I'd like an unbelievable price I'm i said this before i'm half worried [TS]

00:05:12   that they're like stealing these things and that I don't know if me endorsing it [TS]

00:05:16   like this is makes me complicit in the crime because when you're sounding like [TS]

00:05:19   a hundred twenty dollars stereo $14 usually that was just you know it's like [TS]

00:05:24   that scene in Goodfellas when they're selling cigarettes out of the back of [TS]

00:05:26   the truck but what they really do the other thing they do is they just [TS]

00:05:30   concentrate on making everything real funny the descriptions of the products [TS]

00:05:34   are real funny they have funny videos every day and I i really do get the [TS]

00:05:38   feeling that they'd be happy if you just go there and check them out every day [TS]

00:05:41   and you never buy anything that even though it's like the gimmick of the [TS]

00:05:43   thing is like here's the product by format and you can just type men and [TS]

00:05:47   they're like well like I didn't like that so my thanks to them [TS]

00:05:52   I'm so last year was a little different than in previous years because we do [TS]

00:06:02   actual special guest [TS]

00:06:04   what happened was the backstory on it is it was a week before WWDC and still [TS]

00:06:08   haven't asked anybody to be on the show and I was putting it off because I kind [TS]

00:06:12   of had it in my hand I kind of wanted to see if I could get well and i put it off [TS]

00:06:19   because I didn't want to hear now and I was like a week before I was reduced I [TS]

00:06:22   just asking so send email to steve down and said look this probably ridiculous [TS]

00:06:26   and so just feel free to say no but I do the show every year and I think we [TS]

00:06:32   really cool i think it would work really well if phil schiller came on and day [TS]

00:06:36   after the keynote we could talk about it nerd out and go into detail that you [TS]

00:06:40   can't get into anakena and he wrote back and all he said was not ridiculous [TS]

00:06:44   let's talk tomorrow and next thing you know week later Phil Schiller was [TS]

00:06:49   screwing around not coming out behind the curtain and making me wonder whether [TS]

00:06:54   i IQ maybe he went to the bathroom maybe we miscommunicated on what the ques [TS]

00:07:00   we're going to be and it was great i mean i don't know how many people here [TS]

00:07:04   were here last year it really was great it was the best time I've had on stage [TS]

00:07:11   in my life and then i watch the video and I didn't even really died watching [TS]

00:07:15   myself as I got this is actually pretty good and it ended and it was a big [TS]

00:07:20   surprise we kept it under wraps [TS]

00:07:22   everybody seemed pleasantly surprising it just made it all the more fun on the [TS]

00:07:26   show's over and go backstage and people like wow that was great i can't believe [TS]

00:07:31   it was amazing that was amazing and start meeting people and it was about [TS]

00:07:34   three minutes 34 minutes after the end of the show when the first person said [TS]

00:07:37   we're really gonna have a hard time topping that next year and I thought wow [TS]

00:07:46   that I that did not occur to me because this is this week has been a blur like I [TS]

00:07:51   really just asked a week ago and then we set this up and I've been thinking [TS]

00:07:54   questions and you're right and there's only so far up i can go you know it's [TS]

00:08:01   only so many different ways that that we could go up to one of these years it is [TS]

00:08:06   absolutely going to be the case that it is not as good a guest is the year [TS]

00:08:09   before I mean one of these times it really is going to be John Smoltz coming [TS]

00:08:12   out and that'll be great and will have a good show [TS]

00:08:17   I mean there might be more people even go to the open bar in mid-show but what [TS]

00:08:22   you can do by the way please [TS]

00:08:24   I really run up a good tab where we're good here but this is not that year this [TS]

00:08:31   year i think i think it's not bad [TS]

00:08:36   so this year how do you top fill shoulder [TS]

00:08:41   here's how ladies and gentlemen please give a warm welcome to fill shower and [TS]

00:08:51   Craig federighi [TS]

00:09:08   yeah [TS]

00:09:11   true story got a text message of 45 minutes ago hour ago [TS]

00:09:25   you guys have any food here no we don't we have lots of booze [TS]

00:09:33   aah so when they get here [TS]

00:09:37   here's what Craig Craig has a box lunch from WWDC and that's what he's eating [TS]

00:09:45   and a friend of the show announcer Paul process asked him is that a WWDC box [TS]

00:09:52   lunch and the answer is an aged well it was an old stuff into these bugs life so [TS]

00:09:59   let it be said Apple it's their own dumper [TS]

00:10:08   I can absolutely validate that for over 20 years of doing surveys from WC every [TS]

00:10:17   single year the number one complaint is the food and so you resign ourselves to [TS]

00:10:22   the fact that that if that's the worst thing that comes on to WC all is good [TS]

00:10:28   it's tradition so so i always start to show i started my last year i always ask [TS]

00:10:36   me guess how do you think the keynote one yesterday good audience haha great [TS]

00:10:42   presenters missing line once again Phil Schiller was not onstage at the keynote [TS]

00:10:49   this is becoming a new tradition um i was teasing with Tim that between Craig [TS]

00:10:56   and in jeff williams and now bows [TS]

00:10:59   I don't meet the minimum height requirement to present but quite [TS]

00:11:06   honestly the high-tide spoke to you yesterday briefly and I told you I [TS]

00:11:10   thought you did an amazing job [TS]

00:11:11   many people thought creek [TS]

00:11:17   because you it's not just that you're up there and you're good you're covering [TS]

00:11:20   stuff but you you covered like three hours of stuff in 90 minutes or whatever [TS]

00:11:26   long you're onstage [TS]

00:11:27   yeah it was it was a lot [TS]

00:11:32   yeah i mean that the team did a tremendous amount of work and we try to [TS]

00:11:35   what did the article i saw on the wringer today I'm gonna be saw this now [TS]

00:11:41   i want to go into details the article but the headline was cranked apples [TS]

00:11:44   Craig federighi is perfect [TS]

00:11:51   I i read that article in and I can only confirm that it's not true [TS]

00:12:01   so I I didn't think about it yesterday but today it occurred to me that they're [TS]

00:12:07   sort of wasn't a recurring overriding theme and the announcement yesterday [TS]

00:12:11   which in broad strokes is that you guys have opened up a lot of stuff to [TS]

00:12:18   third-party developers that was previously reserved for Apple's first [TS]

00:12:23   party code [TS]

00:12:25   yeah I quickly i might even miss some caulk it so that VoIP apps can get the [TS]

00:12:31   same lockscreen privileges for incoming calls as the phone app and facetime [TS]

00:12:35   which is yours messages so you have whatsapp can you can specify contact [TS]

00:12:42   when i text Craig default by going to wet whatsapp instead of I message I [TS]

00:12:47   serie API I message apps maps extensions and even non mac app store apps can now [TS]

00:12:59   use card kid in a bunch of my cloud services is that a coincidence or is [TS]

00:13:09   that like a strategic part of the plan for this you know this year [TS]

00:13:13   well with iOS 8 we we started that with extensions you know opening up like the [TS]

00:13:19   share sheet for instance for a while there was if we didn't build it couldn't [TS]

00:13:22   be in the share cheating so we had to build a Twitter interface ourselves and [TS]

00:13:26   Facebook interface and as a bioassay we started having extensions for for [TS]

00:13:31   extending the system was sharing widgets and so we we built a lot of the [TS]

00:13:36   technology with XP see services folks know what those are and outer out of [TS]

00:13:42   process UI and all the all the building blocks to make this possible and and [TS]

00:13:46   this year we really felt like giving the developers more and more opportunities [TS]

00:13:50   to let users do what they want to do and across all these experiences was you [TS]

00:13:56   know it's a way that we could really make a platform better or for all of our [TS]

00:13:59   user so yeah I don't came together nicely with Syria as well and have been [TS]

00:14:06   part of it seems to me like as the platform's floral evolved because it's [TS]

00:14:10   definitely him especially iOS and mac what it means [TS]

00:14:15   to have an appt is more than like on the mac ok you launch an app and a window [TS]

00:14:20   opens up and you are in this window and the jeweler's as the developer or on iOS [TS]

00:14:26   it's a little simpler is that you get the screen but now to be an app that's [TS]

00:14:31   really taking advantage of the the best at the the newest of the platform has to [TS]

00:14:36   offer you need to be inside other apps you know widgets inside I message [TS]

00:14:44   yeah I think that just makes sense for for mobile i mean if you were if you [TS]

00:14:48   have a half and the right place to interact is on the notification on the [TS]

00:14:53   lockscreen you don't want to use it have to unlock the phone and launcher app in [TS]

00:14:57   order to get something done or invoking your appt with serious gonna be the [TS]

00:15:01   quickest path to getting something done we want to make that possible and so I [TS]

00:15:05   think that's what you're what you're seeing here as well as you say and [TS]

00:15:08   inside of maps if you want to book a ride or you want to get a restaurant or [TS]

00:15:12   any of those things I it's going to just be a quicker and smoother flow if your [TS]

00:15:17   integrated in the place where the user started instead of requiring switching [TS]

00:15:20   around and so this is opening all that up and i think developers are going to [TS]

00:15:24   do a tremendous number of things within the we didn't even envision so should be [TS]

00:15:27   an exciting year it's also just an evolution of the success of the at model [TS]

00:15:32   right we apps apps took off been wildly successful this amazing software process [TS]

00:15:39   and then you want to have apps in your Maps you wanted apps in your series [TS]

00:15:43   situations and you wanted a person you're you know in your messaging into [TS]

00:15:47   we like apps we like them everywhere we want to use them in many places so to me [TS]

00:15:52   it's an evolution of what's going on with apps in general I and you mentioned [TS]

00:15:56   XP see and i know i mean assistant fairly fairly nerdy crowd but i do think [TS]

00:16:02   it-it's a years-long shift where end in my layman's a good XP see is [TS]

00:16:09   inter-process communication and it's a way for different processes that can be [TS]

00:16:13   sandbox and all of the privacy and hey you this process can't fiddle with the [TS]

00:16:20   data of this process without having an inch shared location that they can still [TS]

00:16:25   communicate with each other in a rich way [TS]

00:16:27   I compared to the old days the mac OS has always been extensible and you [TS]

00:16:33   whether you want to go back to the classic mac OS with like an it's or the [TS]

00:16:39   next step days with things that bundles and input managers and remember in the [TS]

00:16:44   early days of pakistan when we have the hack sees the input managers and that [TS]

00:16:49   was and edit and in layman's terms the fundamental differences those were ways [TS]

00:16:53   to extend apps officially or unofficially where the extension code [TS]

00:16:57   was running within the process [TS]

00:17:00   yeah from a stability point of view and a privacy point-of-view really bad news [TS]

00:17:05   so we know we started years and years ago with mock messaging and on that we [TS]

00:17:12   build XP see as a form of remote procedure call or an asynchronous [TS]

00:17:18   messaging structured messaging thing but we then created what we internally [TS]

00:17:22   called XP sea containers which are really what you now think of as spc [TS]

00:17:25   services which the ability to package a whole bunch of code and let the system [TS]

00:17:29   managed launching that code sharing that code down when it needed to but exposing [TS]

00:17:34   services in that way and that turned out to be really important even internally [TS]

00:17:39   within us that we were using it for quite awhile within the OS before was [TS]

00:17:42   exposed as a mechanism for third parties because it allowed us to set different [TS]

00:17:46   security boundaries around different this is really get nerdy but is around [TS]

00:17:51   because I [TS]

00:17:56   if if you're gonna go load you know some some image format even or run a document [TS]

00:18:01   a spotlight converter or something that's going to run over all your [TS]

00:18:04   documents you want to make sure that that thing crashes it doesn't crash the [TS]

00:18:09   overall process the the spotlight indexer or the app you don't want to [TS]

00:18:14   have any more access to anything but the one thing its supposed to have to do the [TS]

00:18:17   job [TS]

00:18:18   so this was all part of our our security and sandboxing architecture but then [TS]

00:18:22   with with iOS a we saw the opportunity to combine that with essentially remote [TS]

00:18:28   views the ability to say that the UIUC on screen that looks like it's all from [TS]

00:18:32   one app is actually composed from the main app but also one or more XP see [TS]

00:18:36   services serving you I in into that and we manage all that and that gives you [TS]

00:18:41   this the single experience but we're all the security boundaries and stability [TS]

00:18:45   boundaries are in place and that's that's enabled us to take this [TS]

00:18:48   extensibility model from something that was you know really hack see prone in in [TS]

00:18:53   the next step and and well in it [TS]

00:18:56   yeah 3 and-and-and make it much more stable and so that's that's been now [TS]

00:19:03   building block for for all these things that we're doing and iOS 10 was just [TS]

00:19:07   really stepping on the gas on the places where we could do that that made the [TS]

00:19:10   biggest difference for user experience um one of the most surprising changes [TS]

00:19:15   and again I think that this is in the spirit of openness or flexibility on [TS]

00:19:20   Apple's part and relinquishing control that previously wasn't linkage and it [TS]

00:19:25   surprised me is that you can now remove a whole bunch of the default apps on iOS [TS]

00:19:31   from your home screen though you would not want to [TS]

00:19:36   you have the freedom just knowing you have the power that you'll never use [TS]

00:19:40   this is it's one of my favorite pages on it on the what's newsite is i love the [TS]

00:19:45   page because it even goes out of the way to say you know because of all the [TS]

00:19:48   compression that we use and and the techniques that we use in the shared [TS]

00:19:51   frameworks they only take up a hundred and fifty megabytes [TS]

00:19:56   yeah well okay so this is true this is true I we should be really clear on [TS]

00:20:02   actually what this feature is what it's not because not everything you might [TS]

00:20:06   think it is so so what it is is you are removing when you remove an app you're [TS]

00:20:12   removing it from the home screen you're removing all the user data associated [TS]

00:20:15   from it you're removing all of the hooks that it has and other system services [TS]

00:20:20   like Siri no longer will try to use that when you talk to and so forth [TS]

00:20:25   we're not actually deleting the application binary and the reason is is [TS]

00:20:29   really twofold one they're small but more significantly the whole iOS [TS]

00:20:34   security architecture around the system update is this one signed binary where [TS]

00:20:42   we can verify the integrity of that with every update that there's no mixing and [TS]

00:20:46   matching going on between all of these different pieces and so if you go and [TS]

00:20:51   say well I don't like what's an app that someone would remove I'm gonna get this [TS]

00:20:56   now i can't think of one eye [TS]

00:21:01   stocks stock start some people don't follow the stock market fair enough some [TS]

00:21:05   people do not follow the stock market or that's not witches are good for them [TS]

00:21:08   yes something yes and and we don't they might remove that app and and when you [TS]

00:21:14   do it's hidden in any user data and preferences and so forth associate was [TS]

00:21:18   gone [TS]

00:21:19   if you want to get it back we were thinking about how do we how do we let [TS]

00:21:22   you restore this we thought well people are naturally when they if they want to [TS]

00:21:24   get it back [TS]

00:21:26   they're gonna go to the app store and search for it and so you go to the app [TS]

00:21:29   store and search for it and it'll show up and you'll say get and it will [TS]

00:21:34   reappear because that's how they know to be fun but the download will be running [TS]

00:21:38   arguably fast exactly compression technology gets extra incentives led [TS]

00:21:46   sometimes mistakenly report that we're moving these apps out of the system [TS]

00:21:50   bundle and into the store for downloading and that's not really the [TS]

00:21:53   case we're just making up the easy mechanism for restoring Ezra's seeing it [TS]

00:21:57   from the store like that it's it's really still part of the system is that [TS]

00:22:00   the records right here that's interesting that means there won't be [TS]

00:22:03   like an update to mail that comes to the app store it's just just like it used to [TS]

00:22:06   be it will be part of it [TS]

00:22:08   that is correct I'm well speaking of the app store on this last week [TS]

00:22:17   a week another reason I sound on this side I just got these gigantic a total [TS]

00:22:22   nerd out and I'm just gonna let him have fun and I have no problem with that a [TS]

00:22:27   week ago there were a bunch of changes improvements to the app store in a [TS]

00:22:35   certain sense you can do you know it are one of them and it did not get mentioned [TS]

00:22:38   in kino but review times for absolutely to the appstore way faster news [TS]

00:22:52   we got this is one of those cases where we can address a problem before it [TS]

00:22:57   starts to boil over just in anticipation of potential future it for the audience [TS]

00:23:06   at the keynote though that to not even mention that and just take that applause [TS]

00:23:11   is amazing because you know that it's coming in that developers are now pretty [TS]

00:23:16   happy about that it would have been an easy way to get applause but we didn't [TS]

00:23:20   stick to that [TS]

00:23:22   yeah you know it was exactly people have all these awesome conspiracy theories in [TS]

00:23:27   the fun to read but it was exactly what we said which was the we were working in [TS]

00:23:33   the keynote we actually thought about having a whole developer section to talk [TS]

00:23:37   about the app store the keynote and looking at keeping it really we really [TS]

00:23:41   want to get done before and just under two hours if we could and and you [TS]

00:23:46   couldn't really talk about that and the subscription stuff and the and the [TS]

00:23:51   answer stuff and all that in in three minutes we really need to talk about 15 [TS]

00:23:55   minutes to explain in and and it just wasn't worth losing 15 minutes a product [TS]

00:24:01   time to talk about that if we could instead just talking to people ahead of [TS]

00:24:05   time so we decided to do something we've never done before which is before the [TS]

00:24:08   keynote so explain some of this [TS]

00:24:11   however it was kind of tough to do because here we're talking to to you and [TS]

00:24:15   a few others and saying here things we're doing for the appstore knowing [TS]

00:24:18   that we still have to come a few days later you know apps working with Cirie [TS]

00:24:23   and apps working with messages and these are huge impact on developers and a new [TS]

00:24:27   a noose store for message apps are going to come out and so we can really tell [TS]

00:24:32   the whole picture of all the things we're doing so he told sort of half of [TS]

00:24:35   it and and waited for the rest well part of it that goes together so one of the [TS]

00:24:40   improvements last week was search ads and i noticed energy if you notice [TS]

00:24:47   before we came out there was an ad that showed up first as is John you did your [TS]

00:24:52   ads before when we started to study [TS]

00:24:54   it was really nice thank you find two of the three were relevant to what i want [TS]

00:25:12   for the for the benefit of your advertising won't mention which 1i [TS]

00:25:15   didn't find quite relevant to my interests [TS]

00:25:21   I was gonna be nice i was gonna say [TS]

00:25:28   I was going to say how there's a italian that you couldn't mention a week ago [TS]

00:25:32   where the idea of the search is it improves discoverability and there's a [TS]

00:25:38   discoverability aspect with the iMessage apps where if i send you a widget [TS]

00:25:44   through an iMessage happen you don't have it yet there's a very subtle you [TS]

00:25:49   know this was before i forget what exactly did ya see the two in a couple [TS]

00:25:54   of really interesting things that the team did and working on on this message [TS]

00:25:58   apps is number one that if i send you something if i send you a sticker if i [TS]

00:26:04   send you a jibjab you get to receive it and expand experience it without having [TS]

00:26:09   to download the app and so you can do that on a lot of these things where some [TS]

00:26:14   other services you're always being hit with the hey download this in order to [TS]

00:26:17   see what someone sending you the team really wanted to have a great experience [TS]

00:26:20   for the receiver you don't have to do that however there is attribution there [TS]

00:26:24   and you can choose to get it for like one of those jobs really cool i want to [TS]

00:26:28   download them to and share them with friends and hopefully that will become a [TS]

00:26:32   nice viral marketing in addition to other ways for users to discover apps [TS]

00:26:36   and messages on on search ads make the case and you when we talked last week [TS]

00:26:44   you did and I I on the phone call I thought yeah that makes sense and then [TS]

00:26:48   and and I want to live my notes and I was like I'm not sure I get it [TS]

00:26:51   make the case and I on this part on this particular partnership that that the [TS]

00:26:55   system that you guys have designed can and should be to the benefit of smaller [TS]

00:27:01   indie developers and it's not going to be dominated by the biggest companies [TS]

00:27:07   that with the you know budgets that are more than everybody here combined so the [TS]

00:27:13   the to the to sort of priorities we set on the team as they were working on it [TS]

00:27:18   was if we're gonna do this we have to do in a way that number one protects your [TS]

00:27:24   privacy there are many ways that companies do when they're not protecting [TS]

00:27:27   privacy and we need to understand that and secondly how do you do in a way that [TS]

00:27:32   gives advantages too small indie developers because it's easy to imagine [TS]

00:27:36   a system that didn't do that and so we set out to [TS]

00:27:39   think of all the things we could do to make that possible and and there's a [TS]

00:27:42   long list of things and and we'll go through all of the morning all but but [TS]

00:27:47   there are many things things like first of all there's no minimum bid so we [TS]

00:27:52   don't set up a bar if you have a very small amount of money can just do what [TS]

00:27:56   you want small money the fact that we're going to work really hard to try to make [TS]

00:28:00   relevance the top priority over bid for why something gets shown that the users [TS]

00:28:07   are the ultimate deciders of what gets shown based on their cliques are big [TS]

00:28:12   input to what is relevant to the search result the fact that we're going to work [TS]

00:28:18   hard to try to police and improve the whole metadata system if we find as it [TS]

00:28:23   easily could be abused 222 her developers the fact that there's been a [TS]

00:28:29   hotly debated thing the fact that you can Duke on questioning you can use [TS]

00:28:33   someone else's brand in your ad words that you want to use as we thought about [TS]

00:28:39   it that is more likely to benefit the small developer than the big developer [TS]

00:28:43   because the big developers are going to pick on a lot of small developer terms [TS]

00:28:46   but a small developer can try to latch onto a big developers name if you want [TS]

00:28:49   to search for angry birds in your game you can write if in so we think that [TS]

00:28:54   that can help him the fact that there is no exclusivity so at large development [TS]

00:28:58   cannot say and I want to be the top bed and i'm going to spend everything I can [TS]

00:29:03   to buy up this term there will be no exclusivity is going to be a rotation [TS]

00:29:06   there and as the rotation appears the relevance will help drive it further [TS]

00:29:10   so we're trying everything we can and i think one of the best things is right [TS]

00:29:14   now [TS]

00:29:15   once our data throughout the summer the downloads the users get from the ads are [TS]

00:29:20   real downloads to benefit the developer but we're not charging during the beta [TS]

00:29:24   time so it's a chance for everybody to get in and try it out [TS]

00:29:27   help us learn from it and drive real downloads real does business about any [TS]

00:29:31   marketing spend [TS]

00:29:32   so we're trying to think of things we can do and will think more will will [TS]

00:29:36   take feedback and see what's happening and what works and doesn't work and who [TS]

00:29:39   feels like the getting stomped on and we'll try to do all we can to make it [TS]

00:29:42   better [TS]

00:29:45   and the the last bit of news with the appstore changes are live in a big the [TS]

00:29:55   third of it was an expansion of the categories that are allowed for [TS]

00:29:59   subscriptions i don't know if you noticed but there was a little bit [TS]

00:30:02   confusing last week about the difference between all apps from all categories vs [TS]

00:30:07   all apps let me to let me explain that [TS]

00:30:09   um so our intention is exactly as as we talked about which is we're opening up [TS]

00:30:17   subscription model to all categories this so what kind of an after you make [TS]

00:30:24   doesn't directly have an impact on whether you can have a subscription [TS]

00:30:27   model or not there are we if we want to open up subscriptions to all developers [TS]

00:30:32   of all apps that is the hope however there are a couple little little gotchas [TS]

00:30:39   what we have to be careful and so that's why does this some caution here at [TS]

00:30:43   number one if you want to create a professional app and you're going to [TS]

00:30:46   maintain it and do updates and you want to have some ongoing revenue stream [TS]

00:30:50   that's of course intention of this but because it's pop on that right do we do [TS]

00:31:00   users really want and I'm sorry to pick on this category if somebody makes this [TS]

00:31:04   out because I'm sure there's examples where you you would want but do you [TS]

00:31:07   wanna a flashlight app to now be a nap you have to pay for forever with a [TS]

00:31:11   subscription model uses probably don't want that [TS]

00:31:15   and so we have to be sensitive first of all to is there some minimum [TS]

00:31:19   functionality where users now get pissed off and say everything's turned [TS]

00:31:24   subscription [TS]

00:31:25   I don't want to buy stuff anymore this is not okay [TS]

00:31:28   the end and now that's a a drag on business on the app store and therefore [TS]

00:31:31   we all lose [TS]

00:31:32   so where we feel responsibility and I read your time you think so hey why not [TS]

00:31:36   just the market choose but what if the market screws itself up and it does [TS]

00:31:40   badly and then we all lose so we have to be a little bit sensitive to not do [TS]

00:31:44   something we think that could backfire and heard all of us so we want to be [TS]

00:31:48   careful about minimum functionality to be some guideline around that which we [TS]

00:31:52   already have a guideline a minimum functionality for anything you can just [TS]

00:31:56   wrap a website and call it an hour [TS]

00:31:58   but to be a little bit more functionality for subscription [TS]

00:32:01   I think the guide the guidelines include and our long-standing guidelines that [TS]

00:32:05   the app store has plenty of fart apps already that that is absolutely one of [TS]

00:32:09   the rules and then there is a secondary issue which is and we're working through [TS]

00:32:15   this [TS]

00:32:16   there are certain are certain states and governments where there are laws about [TS]

00:32:22   creating a subscription revenue stream without a clear promise to the user of [TS]

00:32:27   what they're paying for down the road and so our legal team has been working [TS]

00:32:30   with us on this on trying to make sure we put in place in the store the right [TS]

00:32:34   way for developers to make clear their intention to deliver value for that [TS]

00:32:39   customer also be breaking the law by asking for subscription with no [TS]

00:32:43   intention to delivering value down the road and so we want to be careful of [TS]

00:32:46   those things so those are the kinds of reasons we have cabinets on it but the [TS]

00:32:51   intention is i think is all what we all want [TS]

00:32:58   the mac app store [TS]

00:33:05   I'm not gonna stay [TS]

00:33:07   I'm not going to say it's been treated as the ugly stepchild but maybe the [TS]

00:33:11   slightly less attractive step tile and a couple of examples test flight beta [TS]

00:33:17   testing was in iOS App Store I Craig is it in the mac app store yet i don't [TS]

00:33:23   think so [TS]

00:33:23   alright so no test flight I know you don't video video reviews i know i dent [TS]

00:33:30   in it seems like that really works like there's you know instead of just static [TS]

00:33:34   screenshots to show your app on iOS you can have a video that shows it in [TS]

00:33:38   animation and a lot of times for developers who are doing the the the [TS]

00:33:42   cinematic experience of really making the appt feel great [TS]

00:33:46   the video can do so much more than than a static screenshot on and all of the [TS]

00:33:53   news last week applies to all of the app stores so that in and of itself is a [TS]

00:33:58   change in a a change in the way the app story distributing new features yeah so [TS]

00:34:06   um we love all of our kids and I'm sure all of you do as well [TS]

00:34:10   equally and and and so so we love the mac app store we wanted to do well we [TS]

00:34:18   want to support the developers in its we care a lot about it we use it ourselves [TS]

00:34:21   it's a very important store for ourselves we moved all of our software [TS]

00:34:25   distribution into it and are very happy with that so we're one happy software [TS]

00:34:29   developer that's using it and and and and we still think in the long view of [TS]

00:34:36   all this [TS]

00:34:36   it matters a great deal we think it matters for privacy we think it matters [TS]

00:34:41   for security we think it matters for quality on the store [TS]

00:34:45   we've all seen examples of apps that have been hijacked on servers where [TS]

00:34:49   people download stuff that have viruses injected in them and we don't want any [TS]

00:34:52   part of that any that all of us so we think it's a still an important solution [TS]

00:34:56   and we're dedicated to it there are things through the years in the mac app [TS]

00:35:01   store that haven't been fully implemented because they didn't make as [TS]

00:35:04   much sense in the mac as they did in iOS or the engineering effort was really [TS]

00:35:09   high for for a benefit that wasn't seen as big or whatever I example . so test [TS]

00:35:15   flight you know for the engineering involved there [TS]

00:35:18   you know people felt that there are a lot of opportunities in the map from [TS]

00:35:22   website to download apps for tests and ribs distribute beta software so the [TS]

00:35:28   need wasn't as great right it was a clear need is not as clear on mac so [TS]

00:35:32   that's why some decisions were made and trade-offs their arm but as you say as [TS]

00:35:38   I've been working more with the appstore team since december you know I've really [TS]

00:35:43   push the team to please make sure everything makes sense across all the [TS]

00:35:48   stores as much as possible and maybe some exception to that that that we have [TS]

00:35:52   to make but we don't want to we want to try to do everything the same on all the [TS]

00:35:56   stores as much as possible including the mac app store so one thing the mac app [TS]

00:36:05   store is is has been good for and and the mac software ecosystem in general is [TS]

00:36:10   good for is that it seems to support higher prices of apps for for truly [TS]

00:36:15   professional apps deeper apps and there's aid consensus or you know maybe [TS]

00:36:22   not consensus is wrong or maybe you'll disagree but there's a lot of people who [TS]

00:36:25   think that one of the things that's holding back the ipad especially now [TS]

00:36:28   that it's the ipad pro from replacing a macbook for someone who might want to is [TS]

00:36:36   that it lacks the same depth of deep apps for work that the mac has and the [TS]

00:36:43   reason is that the pricing pressure is more like iphone style couple of bucks [TS]

00:36:49   as opposed to Mac style where fifty-dollar $80 hundred-dollar software [TS]

00:36:54   is as long been the norm [TS]

00:36:57   oh I think you see two things happening at the same time number one the ipads [TS]

00:37:03   capabilities are growing as a pc replacement product for some people i [TS]

00:37:09   know some people have made some statements about that I don't know who [TS]

00:37:12   and and and so we're trying to make it more powerful making it larger screen [TS]

00:37:18   keyboards the more powerful processors and and all that's happening to drive it [TS]

00:37:23   into a more capable product at the same time you start seem more professional [TS]

00:37:28   applications begin to make their way onto it and and so I think we're [TS]

00:37:32   seeing changing changes there were seeing certainly apps that have a [TS]

00:37:36   similar version on on your iPhone that you wanted your iPad will have some [TS]

00:37:41   pricing but other apps that may be coming over the mac or pc are bringing [TS]

00:37:45   on pricing models that are more like that and so you're going to see this [TS]

00:37:48   this duality with ipad that it's it is a little both happening and we see an [TS]

00:37:53   increase of the more professional apps happening and we see stuff and flight [TS]

00:37:57   with developers working on that's really impressive desktop quality software more [TS]

00:38:02   cumming died down [TS]

00:38:03   yeah it's definitely not the hardware everyone because the ipad pro stand [TS]

00:38:06   toe-to-toe with the macbooks on any technical measure you can give it I mean [TS]

00:38:11   it's beautiful displays powerful cpus and stuff like that so it's not holding [TS]

00:38:15   back and I do think you if you really look at some of the professional apps [TS]

00:38:19   that are on the ipad it's I mean some of them are really first class and I think [TS]

00:38:24   the I pros going to accelerate that and we absolutely want to find any way [TS]

00:38:30   possible to make deep investment by developers in the platform possible [TS]

00:38:36   because I think we'll all win when that happens I'm new topic [TS]

00:38:40   privacy and security I remember a couple of years ago maybe more i don't know how [TS]

00:38:45   many years but i was at WC and I somehow wound up in a session on security [TS]

00:38:50   I don't even know why I was there but I was interested i think i was talking to [TS]

00:38:55   somebody and I gotta go into this thing on security and i'll go with it and I [TS]

00:38:58   went in and listen at the end it was when they were still doing q and A's and [TS]

00:39:01   I remember this very vividly and and somebody asked the question of somebody [TS]

00:39:07   was on the engineering team in charge of security [TS]

00:39:09   um gave a rant about how passwords are terrible and people pick bad passwords [TS]

00:39:14   because you remember and passwords that are hard to remember remember hard to [TS]

00:39:19   crack hard to guess are unusable there are less usable have you guys given any [TS]

00:39:24   thought to what's next beyond passwords and there is this pause speaker yes haha [TS]

00:39:36   and it was like well that's an interesting that's a very interesting [TS]

00:39:39   and truthful answer and we've seen I think in the intervening years some of [TS]

00:39:43   the things that might have been circulating touch ID yeah um and now one [TS]

00:39:47   of my favorite features you guys announced yesterday can't wait to use it [TS]

00:39:50   is to unlock auto and lock yeah yeah so can you talk about how I came to be [TS]

00:39:59   which part of it i mean our caring about security or 10 with auto and lock in [TS]

00:40:03   particular the details of how what are you guys doing to make auto and lock as [TS]

00:40:09   truly secure that it's not you know that I'm not over here opening Phil's macbook [TS]

00:40:14   because he's you know in the room [TS]

00:40:16   yeah yeah well a bit of course this it's a continuation of the work we did with [TS]

00:40:24   continuity to develop really low power BTW led-based discovered protocols your [TS]

00:40:30   devices could discover each other continuously with acceptable overhead [TS]

00:40:35   for a battery point of view and also all the authentication mechanisms we put in [TS]

00:40:39   place as far as having your device's know that they're your devices so that's [TS]

00:40:44   that's kind of a foundation that the unique challenge with auto unlock is you [TS]

00:40:49   don't want a kind of a relay attack where Phil is actually you know well far [TS]

00:40:56   away from his office and someone basically has a Bluetooth listener [TS]

00:41:00   that's going to forward a signal to you it's because you're now by his is mac [TS]

00:41:05   and this mac is having a conversation with Phil's watch over a very long [TS]

00:41:11   distance and so we're actually able to do time-of-flight a calculation using [TS]

00:41:18   peer-to-peer Wi-Fi where we literally can measure how long at the speed of [TS]

00:41:24   light it's taking for the signal to travel from your watch to your mac and [TS]

00:41:27   back [TS]

00:41:28   and very fast stopwatch so I and and because of because of that if you [TS]

00:41:37   interposed any kind of relay would introduce the delay that immediate would [TS]

00:41:40   tell us so you notice there's high jinks inputs yeah make sure they type in your [TS]

00:41:44   password [TS]

00:41:44   yes yeah absolutely and so so that that that piece is critical but i think you [TS]

00:41:49   know that on the bigger picture in touch ID is one way that we've helped with [TS]

00:41:54   passwords but actually on iOS just be secure Enclave in that whole [TS]

00:42:00   architecture the fact that your device is not encrypted just with your password [TS]

00:42:07   with your passcode which honestly whether it's four digits or six digits [TS]

00:42:10   is short enough that if you have a brute force attack or possible it would be you [TS]

00:42:16   know you readily could break into something but instead it's entangled [TS]

00:42:20   with a hardware key that only secure Enclave runs the secure Enclave will [TS]

00:42:24   only do it son rapping when running Apple sign software and will only have [TS]

00:42:30   to try ten times and so fundamentally yeah we that that was first a very [TS]

00:42:38   important step to say you have a practical length passcode with really [TS]

00:42:41   industrial-strength security and so we keep pushing on this i'm continuing on [TS]

00:42:46   the sort of privacy vain i think it's a good segue into serie quote-unquote deep [TS]

00:42:56   learning aii these sort of features that you guys was a big part of the [TS]

00:42:59   presentation yesterday because a big part of your onstage message about it [TS]

00:43:06   was the emphasis on the way that the systems are designed to protect users [TS]

00:43:11   privacy and the technical implications of that [TS]

00:43:17   yeah um so one of my questions when does deep learning happens so like I'm on the [TS]

00:43:23   phone and i'm taking a couple of pictures of the event and stuff like [TS]

00:43:28   that when does the the that analysis occur [TS]

00:43:32   yeah so if you upgrade your device stylist and you have your photo library [TS]

00:43:36   there with your 10,000 photos or hundred thousand photos on it [TS]

00:43:40   the analysis of that kind of backlog will occur when your plug-in on AC [TS]

00:43:45   overnight because this is this is a considerable amount of computation [TS]

00:43:48   that's going to occur that we would not have happened in in your pocket but when [TS]

00:43:53   you're out taking a fresh picture at that point we will instantaneously [TS]

00:43:57   perform the analysis on that hot photo as it's going into your photo library we [TS]

00:44:03   can do it we can do it that fast it is like seen classification I mentioned [TS]

00:44:07   yesterday yesterday yeah that a long time ago that uh that is like about p11 [TS]

00:44:15   billion calculations that have to occur to do that thing like that's a horse [TS]

00:44:19   that's a mountain and but but with art with the GPUs and iOS devices these days [TS]

00:44:27   really cook so we can we can get through that you know essentially [TS]

00:44:30   instantaneously with the with the photos on and on the privacy part my [TS]

00:44:38   understanding correct me if I'm understanding from what I've learned is [TS]

00:44:41   if you've got iCloud photo library and I take a couple pictures with my iphone [TS]

00:44:47   the photos will sync to the cloud and then they will go to my ipad in my mac [TS]

00:44:52   yep but the deep learning analysis doesn't go with them each machine [TS]

00:44:57   performs its own its own processing on its own time when it you know plugged in [TS]

00:45:04   an appropriate [TS]

00:45:05   is that true that is that is true right now so each device does its own [TS]

00:45:09   processing in the future we could share the results of like the first one who [TS]

00:45:16   does the work just share just make that work go along for the ride but today [TS]

00:45:21   it's it's going to be each device doing it independently when you think about [TS]

00:45:26   what's going to happen if we release iOS and OS 10 on separate days everyone's [TS]

00:45:34   iphones will race to do all this work on their on their library first and then [TS]

00:45:40   the mac will be it'll it'll be fine that at that point so we would have saved the [TS]

00:45:45   iphones from doing the work if we'd had the share there were share the work of [TS]

00:45:49   the mac-10 just adding that [TS]

00:45:51   you of of someday they may not all have to do it it's a view where we're not [TS]

00:45:56   Apple will never actually know that analysis ourselves we won't see that [TS]

00:46:00   data writes a way to do it when we're we're out of the loop [TS]

00:46:04   yeah i mean to be clear the photos themselves are the architecture such [TS]

00:46:09   that they're encrypted in the cloud and the metadata any metadata about the [TS]

00:46:13   photos that you create or that we create through deep learning classification is [TS]

00:46:19   is encrypted in a way that Apple's not not reading it so [TS]

00:46:29   I want to I want to get to get nerdy on this differential privacy [TS]

00:46:33   yeah because it's a phrase it's gonna I was like an official thing iĆ­ve learned [TS]

00:46:37   a little more it's not just afraid you guys made up it's a good it would have [TS]

00:46:40   been afraid we would have made it on time huh [TS]

00:46:44   but on that Martin would have done a better name if that's what we did but [TS]

00:46:50   like in the state of the union yesterday I mean there's they're real math behind [TS]

00:46:54   it it's not just of a name that is applied to policies this is that great a [TS]

00:46:59   branch of statistical analysis yes that it talked to me about it give me a [TS]

00:47:04   little i know you touched about in the keynote but you me and give us like a [TS]

00:47:07   little slightly juicier layman's overview of differential privacy [TS]

00:47:11   sure yeah I mean of course of course the idea is that if we wanted to know what [TS]

00:47:20   word you know a new word that everyone was that lots of people were typing that [TS]

00:47:24   we didn't know so that we would stop market as a spelling error maybe we even [TS]

00:47:27   suggested on the keyboard like them or something yeah like now that it's just [TS]

00:47:32   it's trending it's hot we want you know we want all our customers to be able to [TS]

00:47:35   know that word but we don't want to know that you and filler in particular type [TS]

00:47:39   and we would have no way to have any any knowledge of that you can imagine if if [TS]

00:47:44   what we're essentially assembling is a picture of little of little pieces of [TS]

00:47:49   data you know of the forest but all we're getting is a little piece and and [TS]

00:47:54   when we get that little piece even each device will statistically much of the [TS]

00:47:59   time even lie about its little piece right but those lies will all cancel out [TS]

00:48:04   with enough data and the picture will will suddenly resolve what willow with [TS]

00:48:09   enough data points will resolve itself and so and yet it and literally if we [TS]

00:48:15   were trying to learn a word we would send one bit [TS]

00:48:19   we send a position and a sink we cash the word we send a single bit from the [TS]

00:48:25   hash we said position 23 Phil saw a one but Phil's phone would flip a coin and [TS]

00:48:31   actually say actually I'm gonna lie about it i'm going to zero even though i [TS]

00:48:34   saw one and that's the data that goes to apple an apple with enough of that data [TS]

00:48:39   can build a composite a composite picture and say holy smokes we have a [TS]

00:48:42   war [TS]

00:48:42   here and this many people it roughly are seeing it and that's typically what you [TS]

00:48:47   want to know you want to know what's happening at large but we have no desire [TS]

00:48:51   to know what specifically who is doing which the body what you would want to [TS]

00:48:54   know it's not typically what other companies in the industry with one hand [TS]

00:48:58   and and part of the reason this is so important to get into is because you [TS]

00:49:02   know there's that the theory that what we can just anonymize the data and send [TS]

00:49:06   it up and then all is good and it's a bunch of crap because i can send all [TS]

00:49:10   this data and say hello you know who you are [TS]

00:49:14   oh but I happen to know that same location to go to every night after the [TS]

00:49:18   same place you go to work every day I've got all this date I just don't know your [TS]

00:49:21   name and your ID [TS]

00:49:23   boy it's really hard to reverse engineer the anonymous data right so you need to [TS]

00:49:27   do is create a system that goes beyond anonymizing to really make it impossible [TS]

00:49:30   to reconfigure without user is so [TS]

00:49:41   so the way i have written down here is that it if it works as you're describing [TS]

00:49:46   it means it's not just that apple doesn't use that information to reverse [TS]

00:49:51   the anonymity is that mathematically you can't we can't right it's the distant [TS]

00:49:56   design of the system is such that it's not even possible if new executives come [TS]

00:50:01   in a few years and maybe they would like to you know local right but companies [TS]

00:50:06   change [TS]

00:50:07   I mean I just don't know i mean that's that's absolutely true and the point the [TS]

00:50:10   point of view I mean honestly it is the point of view that someone says hey I [TS]

00:50:15   know I know we know a ton about you but don't worry we're nice guys and our bit [TS]

00:50:22   you know where it's all good well okay maybe you're nice guys 10 years from now [TS]

00:50:26   who's running this thing or what if someone breaks into your computer's are [TS]

00:50:30   they nice guys right so you just don't want to have any central source that has [TS]

00:50:35   that kind of knowledge because in the fullness of time [TS]

00:50:38   anything is possible and so differential privacy is I mean their mathematical [TS]

00:50:44   proofs that will will show that that you you cannot with any confidence determine [TS]

00:50:51   anything about any of the people contributing to the data set and we [TS]

00:50:53   think that's important [TS]

00:50:55   all right speaking of companies that do collect some information about people uh [TS]

00:51:00   google and facebook are two competitors that and I know a lot of times when you [TS]

00:51:04   guys talk about these companies you might talk about search engines and you [TS]

00:51:07   might talk about social networks I because you're gentlemen I but i'll i [TS]

00:51:12   will name names and i'm going to just point out the google and facebook are [TS]

00:51:15   both and actively pursuing a lot of the same goals [TS]

00:51:21   I mean just the the image record our image analysis that's a mountain that's [TS]

00:51:25   a horse those companies are showing similar things yeah you guys are showing [TS]

00:51:29   this uh but it really is it did I don't want to use a member of is a hundred [TS]

00:51:35   eighty degree different tactic where they're doing it with cloud servers in [TS]

00:51:40   doing the computing in the cloud on data that they have aggregated there and your [TS]

00:51:46   method is to do it distributed on the actual devices critics are [TS]

00:51:53   and as I'm not me i'm not saying this I'm like let's see I i don't know i mean [TS]

00:51:57   i'm totally like okay I saw your keynote i'm looking forward to trying it and [TS]

00:52:02   yeah let's see if it works for me I I you know I don't know I i buy him [TS]

00:52:07   yeah i think i might but but critics are saying well critics are already saying [TS]

00:52:10   and they've obviously since the keynote was just yesterday i've seen in a couple [TS]

00:52:14   of articles that your your strategy is doomed to keep Apple it behind them [TS]

00:52:20   because Google and Facebook way is the only way that works and i'm not quite [TS]

00:52:25   sure where that comes from because their PR department [TS]

00:52:28   I mean [TS]

00:52:34   of 800 manage your engine or social network provider that we don't know [TS]

00:52:40   about [TS]

00:52:40   I I i think part of it is in my mind is maybe there's an assumption a part of [TS]

00:52:45   some people and oppressed that that a server farm has this massive amount of [TS]

00:52:51   computational power and that a puny little phone can't compete but it's not [TS]

00:52:58   like there's one person's iphone who's trying to do the image analysis for all [TS]

00:53:01   the photos on iCloud like a billion phones to throw this problem right a [TS]

00:53:05   billion active devices like the billion active Apple devices that are out there [TS]

00:53:09   in the aggregate have an enormous amount of CPU power that's right that's right [TS]

00:53:14   at the other thing is there's this idea that well if you don't have the data how [TS]

00:53:18   would you ever learn [TS]

00:53:20   well turns out if you want to get pictures of mountains you don't need to [TS]

00:53:23   get out of people's personal photo libraries like we found out we can [TS]

00:53:27   define some pictures of some mountains get some tough detective work and we [TS]

00:53:33   found them [TS]

00:53:36   uh so the lesson [TS]

00:53:41   pretty good I so moving on Cirie Cirie now has an API and it's six categories i [TS]

00:53:56   don't know if i write them down but it's like ridesharing Mel gene photo sir [TS]

00:54:03   voice calls payment hey man listen one more [TS]

00:54:08   why can't any money ya know we did payment [TS]

00:54:12   alright i can say a few different ways well past their 6 16 characters workouts [TS]

00:54:18   there we go thank you [TS]

00:54:20   yeah on this device should have a live out in traversing right here but it's [TS]

00:54:23   totally and omissions and we don't know who said it we don't think that [TS]

00:54:32   so why why restrict Syria to those six specific categories [TS]

00:54:38   yeah it comes down to modeling the the domains well in order to understand what [TS]

00:54:44   someone is saying people gonna say going to speak to Syrian a whole bunch of [TS]

00:54:49   different ways and even a whole bunch of different languages and when they say [TS]

00:54:53   when they want to say send a message to fill saying that I'm gonna be late for [TS]

00:55:01   the interview then we I could have said that in dozens of other other ways i can [TS]

00:55:07   said we chat fill that I'm going to be late for the interview we chat Phil [TS]

00:55:11   using wechat telling him that etcetera and I even could say something like [TS]

00:55:16   WeChat Phil and then I need to know like okay well what do you want to say to him [TS]

00:55:21   and Cirie knows all this because Syria understands the domain of messaging well [TS]

00:55:27   it understands all the vocabulary it understands what the the verbs are what [TS]

00:55:32   the objects are and can collect them and can do so in a dialogue and so we want [TS]

00:55:38   to make sure that when you're talking your assistant that your assistant is [TS]

00:55:42   unit is consistently intelligent about understanding you and how flexible you [TS]

00:55:48   can be in talking to it and so to do that we had to develop those domains and [TS]

00:55:51   so these are the domains that we developed in a way that developers can [TS]

00:55:54   plug-in will do more and more of that over time and of course will search for [TS]

00:55:59   more and more flexible ways to enable developers to do that time but we want [TS]

00:56:03   to make sure that what we do is preserve the intelligence of your assistant you [TS]

00:56:08   know we really wouldn't super easy for us to say hey just tell us a trigger [TS]

00:56:13   word or the name of your app and will hand you a string right and good luck [TS]

00:56:18   and so you'd say something to Syria and most the time you get back the app doing [TS]

00:56:22   something crazy and the user would say what next series doesn't understand me i [TS]

00:56:27   don't understand this and in this case we're able to be consistent about series [TS]

00:56:31   ability to understand you and so will will make models more powerful more of [TS]

00:56:35   them for more domains but we we start with a baseline have a quality [TS]

00:56:39   experience around what we [TS]

00:56:40   and I think this is an insight into how we are right or wrong how we approach [TS]

00:56:45   things differently than some other companies do we all been seeing stories [TS]

00:56:49   for a while saying a apple some other companies are doing some assistance and [TS]

00:56:54   they're allowing these these other apps to be bots into handoff and and do [TS]

00:56:59   things for them you're not you're behind where when we have thought about doing [TS]

00:57:03   it for a while we thought about it since the very beginning of Siri which is we [TS]

00:57:07   needed a solution to how he keeps you from being smart one thing and then [TS]

00:57:11   stupid another that will be an inconsistent experience and all we want [TS]

00:57:15   to be sure to be some equally smart at all the things we do as it gets extended [TS]

00:57:19   that intelligence needs to extend and so the team has been working hard at that [TS]

00:57:23   were others shoved into quickly to do things that don't translate that [TS]

00:57:27   intelligence to third-party apps and so to do that means you have to with [TS]

00:57:31   intention add categories and domains the hope is that more and more so that users [TS]

00:57:36   can ask anything they want overtime use any of their apps that they love and it [TS]

00:57:40   all works it just takes time building domains so would rather take the time to [TS]

00:57:43   do it right then rush out just because it gets a good story to say you have [TS]

00:57:47   something [TS]

00:57:52   one of the things I've been doing in the last year or so maybe half year but I've [TS]

00:57:58   noticed and I'm sorry I banging this drum a couple times a month on during [TS]

00:58:02   fireball is is wide the industry as a whole doesn't seem to count I message as [TS]

00:58:09   a messaging platform and you know that the number that always gets throws [TS]

00:58:13   monthly active users and whatsapp has so many monthly active users and so there [TS]

00:58:18   were so many billions of dollars and ah I message has must you know is right it [TS]

00:58:25   has to be right up there in terms of you know monthly active users daily active [TS]

00:58:28   users hourly active users users sending my messages during the talk show [TS]

00:58:34   ah is that frustrating [TS]

00:58:39   I mean Jackie country layers and customers don't read those things it's [TS]

00:58:45   all inside the beltway kind of like who's feels proud of that they made a [TS]

00:58:48   list that it's a matter of the users yeah i remember messages is the the most [TS]

00:58:53   used app on iOS . so it's used a lot and and certainly we saw that every time [TS]

00:59:01   we'd add a couple new emoji it would be like the biggest thing we work all year [TS]

00:59:06   on like a new file system or something [TS]

00:59:13   yeah [TS]

00:59:16   and it turned out the rest of the world outside this room was more excited about [TS]

00:59:20   the two new emoji and so we we figured you know if there's one place we can [TS]

00:59:26   make a tremendous difference in how people experience iOS fundamentally to [TS]

00:59:31   spend a lot of time and messages and so we put a ton of of creative energy into [TS]

00:59:37   it and and ultimately through opening up to developers i think that the [TS]

00:59:40   collective energy that will go into making message is great it's gonna be [TS]

00:59:42   phenomenal [TS]

00:59:43   in the Kenai was sitting like in mid middle of the floor halfway back halfway [TS]

00:59:47   in the center just right in the middle i really was a great place to hear the the [TS]

00:59:51   reactions that the biggest reaction I thought of the entire keynote was when [TS]

00:59:56   you would announce that emoji we're going to 3x [TS]

00:59:56   you would announce that emoji we're going to 3x [TS]

01:00:00   I side i'm not i'm not exaggerating I'm not exaggerating and I will [TS]

01:00:04   it was like a real visceral buzz and it's like and here's a crowd of people [TS]

01:00:08   you know developers who were or more technically minded and they are here to [TS]

01:00:11   hear about technical details and this thing that is really just you know it's [TS]

01:00:15   just more fun got this really powerful reaction and we're going to for see this [TS]

01:00:26   is why we don't let you out now we're gonna be held to that when we don't [TS]

01:00:36   really like your staff Rex apple and then eventually be finally for apps [TS]

01:00:51   I really given coming down the homestretch by this is a few competitors [TS]

01:00:58   right now that program is your exes but we got 240 it's like that onion story [TS]

01:01:04   about the chick CEO says screw this we're going to five blades in like three [TS]

01:01:11   years later she came out with a five blade razor you can't look at your [TS]

01:01:16   campus can't underestimate available to suit any other i mentioned something [TS]

01:01:23   that it means clearly there's a lot of work and a lot of it's very fun a lot of [TS]

01:01:28   it is you know the developer integration it really turns it into a platform it's [TS]

01:01:34   not just a thing that people can text without it's a thing that the people in [TS]

01:01:38   this crowd can write software for anything that stands out that maybe [TS]

01:01:41   didn't get enough love in the keynote well we can't we talk about the way in [TS]

01:01:45   which i think these apps can spread kind of in a really great way by really we [TS]

01:01:50   didn't talk about that at all and I think that's going to be really powerful [TS]

01:01:53   for developers and it's going to make it work developers while to put some energy [TS]

01:01:56   into it into them [TS]

01:01:58   we made him really easy to create so artists we think will be a community of [TS]

01:02:03   artists that will build sticker packs that are just really fun and they don't [TS]

01:02:05   need to write any code to do it so I think that's going to be really [TS]

01:02:08   important [TS]

01:02:09   um also i think the the way that they are distributed if you have it's not [TS]

01:02:20   just about the extension extension can be part of your app and so there's some [TS]

01:02:25   cases where you want to model where the extension is sort of in cooperation with [TS]

01:02:30   your larger app experience I mean when one simple example be like if if you [TS]

01:02:34   have your your sports after sports app knows what your favorite teams are well [TS]

01:02:39   your extension in messages that let you share those clips or or whatever is [TS]

01:02:44   gonna is going to know that as well so there's a connection there we have one [TS]

01:02:50   where something that people like to do a lot to share music special here [TS]

01:02:53   something you're like wow that's great i want to tell my friend about this [TS]

01:02:56   awesome song [TS]

01:02:57   well if you go to the Apple music extension it knows what is now playing [TS]

01:03:03   it you know and your music and it knows what you listen to the last few songs [TS]

01:03:07   and so that's just one tap to share and so I think will be interesting [TS]

01:03:11   integrations where the message extension is sort of the tip of the iceberg of [TS]

01:03:15   experience that you have inside your app as well I alright moving on to watch us [TS]

01:03:21   I what you guys do [TS]

01:03:25   year after year is make iterative improvements to yourself over and you [TS]

01:03:28   add features you take what was slow and you make it fast [TS]

01:03:32   you take what was ugly and you make it look better on but the performance [TS]

01:03:36   improvement on app launch speed on one watches three it does not look like one [TS]

01:03:43   year-over-year like right it's crazy and I really did in the keynote had a I got [TS]

01:03:49   to see this and then when I got you know the hands-on with a watch running [TS]

01:03:52   watching us three for real it's for real it really isn't anybody in the audience [TS]

01:03:56   is they have you guys upgraded anybody it its crew [TS]

01:04:01   how is that possible I'm a couple of things we we certainly actually had some [TS]

01:04:09   ram despair [TS]

01:04:10   really yeah yeah it turns out that uh you know if people are running you know [TS]

01:04:16   they have their favorite 10 apps we can keep them mostly running you know we [TS]

01:04:21   keep mostly resident wall will help them so they're not burning CPU will keep [TS]

01:04:24   mostly resident which means you're not doing all the work that goes into [TS]

01:04:28   launching a nap when you take them live but the other thing is it turns out when [TS]

01:04:33   we first were coming out with watch OS we were being really conservative about [TS]

01:04:38   understanding how people are going to use the watch and try to make sure we [TS]

01:04:41   could hit our goal of a very solid all day battery life so you could use it all [TS]

01:04:46   day and you can charge it at night and we found we we'd actually like really [TS]

01:04:49   overshot the goal and so we know it was an area just massive focus and paranoia [TS]

01:04:54   throughout the release you know we needed to make sure that we squeezed [TS]

01:04:58   every little bit of juice out of the thing and so realizing we had this [TS]

01:05:02   budget we said hey look we actually have enough to do background updates [TS]

01:05:05   you know we overshot enough that we can keep these apps both in memory but also [TS]

01:05:10   keep them up-to-date throughout the day so when you look at them they're already [TS]

01:05:14   there it's not like lon [TS]

01:05:16   and then with them let him get the information that they already have the [TS]

01:05:19   information and so those were two really vital techniques I i think the other [TS]

01:05:24   thing is is you talk about you you build somethin as new and different as the [TS]

01:05:28   watch and until you finish and you live on it and you figure out like what's [TS]

01:05:32   really the essence of of of this thing and we appreciate which problems with [TS]

01:05:35   the most important salt we realized that the watches is all about glance ability [TS]

01:05:41   you know it's it's useful to the to the extent that like okay i can solve my [TS]

01:05:46   task i'm done if I'm up here and I'm waiting and I'm fiddling around my arms [TS]

01:05:50   getting tired this is no fun anymore i'm going to do it a different way and with [TS]

01:05:54   that as our obsession for the last year we've taken all of those tasks and we [TS]

01:05:59   said you have to be able to finish the task and and two seconds right and that [TS]

01:06:04   meant the launch better be the incident part because now we need to let the user [TS]

01:06:07   think and do something in two seconds and get it done and with that focus you [TS]

01:06:11   find a way and chipped away at it [TS]

01:06:14   what really strikes me once I got two hands on with it and they could really [TS]

01:06:17   see it is it's just how much it the design changes to the navigation of the [TS]

01:06:22   user experience art exactly coinciding with the engineering improvements to [TS]

01:06:29   make it faster so the fact that glances are no longer a separate thing is [TS]

01:06:33   because the apps themselves in the dock conservative glances because they're [TS]

01:06:38   getting the background updates because you made the changes that make them stay [TS]

01:06:41   resident memory [TS]

01:06:43   yeah it's nice when it all comes together it really hits that absolutely [TS]

01:06:48   the other thing I that's that once you start to use the new watch us in [TS]

01:06:53   addition to having that the apps come across faster you can get access to [TS]

01:06:57   quickly you watch faces in a sense become sort of apps in himself in the [TS]

01:07:02   sense that you change the ones you use you rearrange them and change the [TS]

01:07:05   complications for example I would normally keep the activity rings on my [TS]

01:07:10   watch face but now i can choose to make that the next one and I just swipe over [TS]

01:07:14   to them and swipe back because i use the activity watch face versus needing the [TS]

01:07:18   Rings and then I can have a different watch face for some other time of the [TS]

01:07:22   day when I need some other actions and access to have apps so that becomes a [TS]

01:07:26   much quicker and more useful way to expand the things you do [TS]

01:07:29   with its really fine changes through the interaction and really different [TS]

01:07:33   complications to so if you're going to be in more of your your workout mode you [TS]

01:07:39   would swipe over and the complications that are relevant to that and therefore [TS]

01:07:42   the launchers essentially for that all right there so you kind of go here's [TS]

01:07:46   what you know I'm at work I'm gonna be this way I'm you know out with the [TS]

01:07:50   family i'm gonna go this way and you have all the different activities that [TS]

01:07:52   are relevant to that you've got almost a custom dock or custom launcher based on [TS]

01:07:56   your watch space so that's another element where I feel like it's really [TS]

01:07:59   come together in a nice way [TS]

01:08:00   um yeah the team has done a really great job so just wrapping up coming down home [TS]

01:08:08   Swift and you were on my show few months ago when swift one open source that was [TS]

01:08:12   very good time [TS]

01:08:13   um lot of dynamism and we can and we talked about Swift use within Apple and [TS]

01:08:21   and why you guys can't yet right the OS and your absence with but that you're [TS]

01:08:26   using engines using it to write unit tests and stuff like that it's gonna use [TS]

01:08:30   but I saw the announcement that this new swift playground app is itself written [TS]

01:08:34   Swift yeah well actually an OS 10 like most of the doc and I don't have those [TS]

01:08:39   of Mission Control [TS]

01:08:41   yeah well Oh God [TS]

01:08:46   Nadal not happy in our sunday sermon was that name first hinted at this it huh [TS]

01:08:58   I don't know hope last year right here you know I thought always being so [TS]

01:09:03   transparent but that is all right through it [TS]

01:09:08   I know that you're very polite in in our and our run-through for the the show [TS]

01:09:13   when I guy I say oh we were changing the name to mac OS and is like on sunday and [TS]

01:09:19   my next slide is to say something about how you know we have these great new [TS]

01:09:23   features in Mac OS and literally going so are new releases mac OS and so we [TS]

01:09:27   have some great features in iOS 10 it's that stuff we spent a lot 15 years for a [TS]

01:09:33   long time and I think we all feel great about the new name it anyway in it is in [TS]

01:09:38   mac OS the doc is substantially converted so where were Mission Control [TS]

01:09:44   all those areas are are like using Swift a lot so it's starting to starting to [TS]

01:09:48   spread a lot internally there are some barriers but i think this year the most [TS]

01:09:52   important thing and i think chris lattner really covered in the state of [TS]

01:09:54   the union is getting the source stability and so we decided this year [TS]

01:10:01   like we're going to put that over all all the priorities take what we've [TS]

01:10:05   learned you know when we first shift Swift a couple years ago the objective [TS]

01:10:10   was let's make sure that it's familiar from an API point of view you know [TS]

01:10:14   minimize the the kind of transition of a hold I gotta learn all the method names [TS]

01:10:18   for all the classes already know and so we really biased toward that now people [TS]

01:10:22   are so familiar with Swift the priority is let's make sure those api's are all [TS]

01:10:27   very native to Swift and their feel and so we've done all the hard work to to [TS]

01:10:32   update all the API is all the naming conventions and take some major api's [TS]

01:10:36   like or graphics and live dispatch and make them just awesome for swift and so [TS]

01:10:40   I was yeah it's important stop [TS]

01:10:42   but what that means is uh we we achieve that level source stability so next year [TS]

01:10:50   it won't be lying go boy you know where you know as a developer so that's that's [TS]

01:10:55   the important thing ABI stability which means literally that the the Swift [TS]

01:10:58   binary built could be linked against the future libraries that's one that we made [TS]

01:11:03   a lot of progress haven't gone all the way there but that's far less that's far [TS]

01:11:07   more of an issue for us internally than it is for developers it's important for [TS]

01:11:11   developers but much but i think the source stability was the right priority [TS]

01:11:14   and and I feel really good about the progress that that he made on that uh [TS]

01:11:18   last question have a one thing that did you guys announced yesterday whether it [TS]

01:11:23   was in the keynote or not maybe something that Miss the keynote but one [TS]

01:11:26   thing that did you think deserves a little extra attention and i'll let you [TS]

01:11:29   guys think about it i will go first and and you're correct answer is probably [TS]

01:11:33   your file system is that I'm gonna say I'm gonna say universal clipboard [TS]

01:11:39   because I've always wanted this and I for me its links it's like I'm on my [TS]

01:11:45   phone and say all I want to post this during fireball but I'm in my office so [TS]

01:11:48   why would I do it on a phone I i I'll go sit down my my imac and do it with the [TS]

01:11:53   real keyboard but how do I get this from here to there yeah and it man [TS]

01:11:57   what I want to do is just copy it going over there any command B and it and then [TS]

01:12:03   again the thinking through that you guys did of how to do this in a way that [TS]

01:12:07   isn't going to surprise people in a bad way [TS]

01:12:11   there's like a two minute timeout yep I it's so like if i copy something on my [TS]

01:12:16   phone right now and tomorrow i pasted my mac i'm not getting that's right because [TS]

01:12:21   it's it's really like what you're the ways of detecting what's what's the [TS]

01:12:25   value in the communication is like the other continuity features is [TS]

01:12:29   peer-to-peer so it's not like you're sending everything you copy up to the [TS]

01:12:32   cloud all of a sudden just so that it can get down to the other device it [TS]

01:12:35   really is about you know kinda to did it here copy paste which i think is is [TS]

01:12:40   absolutely what people want and it has the right right privacy & performance [TS]

01:12:44   characteristics and as you say it's it's no so it gets rid of the surprises and [TS]

01:12:50   it just turns out to be the most once you have it it's the most natural way in [TS]

01:12:52   the world to do these kinds of things so I [TS]

01:12:55   think the team did did awesome work there I'm like that's great there is a [TS]

01:12:59   new file system again [TS]

01:13:01   no i mean i think the new file system is is great and by the way I mean the [TS]

01:13:06   prospect of this is when you have to get right let's say uh huh and and so the [TS]

01:13:15   the we have been an awesome filesystem team who really knew which problems we [TS]

01:13:21   needed to solve for a world of of flash storage and has done a super solid job [TS]

01:13:29   and we're being you know we're being conservative about how we're rolling it [TS]

01:13:31   out as a developer preview so people can kick the tires on it this year but we [TS]

01:13:37   look forward to making a part of the products going forward and I mean I [TS]

01:13:40   think it's going to be be great and obviously we did we didn't talk about it [TS]

01:13:43   is we don't talk about peer Developer Preview material there but I think in [TS]

01:13:46   terms of something that's important for the platform going forward it's big [TS]

01:13:49   what are you so let's just say three years from now we're all using iPhones [TS]

01:13:54   that are using a PFS instead of HFS plus what would be like a noticeable [TS]

01:13:59   improvement to the to the experience so it'll help with performance that will [TS]

01:14:05   help with things like how we do software updates and other things because we can [TS]

01:14:08   we can snapshot volumes we can roll things back I mean a lot of their lot of [TS]

01:14:12   important attributes there it's important when you think about [TS]

01:14:15   multi-user like how files are protected between multiple users on a Mac because [TS]

01:14:21   we actually have file system level encryption now standard across both [TS]

01:14:26   platforms and so I think from a security point of view it's it's big and and I [TS]

01:14:34   think performance I mean now you do a copy or even like the safe save [TS]

01:14:39   operation when you save documents in a lot of apps it's like move that one [TS]

01:14:43   aside create another hole copy of all of that now overwrite some of it now delete [TS]

01:14:49   the old directory now that's atomic and the clone file makes all of that super [TS]

01:14:54   fast so i think it's just going to be a great across-the-board I want to answer [TS]

01:14:59   in the end [TS]

01:15:00   very different direction of the keynote the thing that we haven't talked about [TS]

01:15:04   that to me was really amazing was we had a bunch of present a demo where's who [TS]

01:15:11   had never been in a keynote before is the first time and they were fantastic [TS]

01:15:20   Stacy did a great job better than everyone did a great job posed in [TS]

01:15:25   incredible job and arm and Cheryl of wasn't cut and Cheryl did an incredible [TS]

01:15:31   job and and all of them work on the things the demo we'll just done and and [TS]

01:15:36   there and they were they were fantastic so that that's my sort of unsung thing [TS]

01:15:41   of the keynote was those presented I I said mid keynote i was sitting with ben [TS]

01:15:45   thompson and I said I can't believe that none of these people have ever done this [TS]

01:15:47   before because the narrow amazing and they really did they really did kickass [TS]

01:15:52   up there that was created on that's it unless you guys have anything else for [TS]

01:15:57   me just thank you i mean i want to give some thanks here i want to thank our [TS]

01:16:02   sponsors mailchimp microsoft and mat.com mph . com go there and buy some junk [TS]

01:16:12   I want to thank Jake shumake Schumacher and Jed hurt they're doing the video [TS]

01:16:18   here so if you're watching on at home you can think that they are the co [TS]

01:16:24   makers of the upcoming documentary app the human story which has been in the [TS]

01:16:29   works for a while I've seen a rough cut it is amazing it is really coming along [TS]

01:16:35   app documentary calm if you want to see more Dru Bischoff from hybrid events is [TS]

01:16:41   here running whatever apparatus is involved in doing the live streaming [TS]

01:16:44   which i've heard is very hard i want to thank mezzanine and the entire staff [TS]

01:16:52   here who have been there led by Megan Rogerson she's great she's been here all [TS]

01:16:59   four years that I've been here the staff is great [TS]

01:17:01   the bartender's are great security guy i mean just really great place and I [TS]

01:17:05   really appreciate it [TS]

01:17:06   I want to thank all the fastest and my wife Amy Gruber just the tip pain their [TS]

01:17:17   podcast that is on 90 some kind of hiatus but they're the ones who made [TS]

01:17:24   this event run so that i can just sit back here and be nervous and make these [TS]

01:17:29   cards with questions and not pay attention to any of the details I don't [TS]

01:17:32   know anything that's going on out here and the fact that you guys even have [TS]

01:17:36   seats is thanks to that and I want to thank Phil and Craig for being here [TS]

01:17:43   thank you unbelievable [TS]

01:17:46   thanks a lot [TS]

01:17:50   we thank you for being here [TS]

01:17:54   yeah [TS]