00:00:00 ◼ ► Well, how about let me bring you back together then. What would you buy if not a Tesla? I
00:00:08 ◼ ► Hold on. Tiff just brought me a plate of freshly baked cookies and wants me to taste test to
00:00:37 ◼ ► This does not by any means have to make it in the show, but expressly had an interesting
00:00:42 ◼ ► What do you think the best server-side language would be? Use Windows for .NET? Use Windows
00:00:51 ◼ ► I can tell you with some confidence, perhaps a lot of confidence, that Swift on the server
00:00:58 ◼ ► But with regard to what one should do, there's so many great answers to that question that…
00:01:12 ◼ ► No, just hold on. A couple of years ago, it was absolutely not the right answer. And I'm
00:01:33 ◼ ► That's ish true. So what I hated about .NET was really all the things around it. So like
00:01:47 ◼ ► of the equivalents and all the Eclipse-based IDEs. But it's still ugly. But it's Windows
00:01:56 ◼ ► that drove me away from… Windows and like the whole IIS pipeline and information servers,
00:02:06 ◼ ► But they now have .NET Core, which is new since… I think it was starting to be developed
00:02:09 ◼ ► or was just coming out when I left this world. And .NET Core is a subset of .NET that will
00:02:14 ◼ ► run on pretty much anything. And I actually think that could be a reasonable answer. I'm
00:02:22 ◼ ► not saying it's the best answer. I'm just saying it could be a reasonable answer, because
00:02:25 ◼ ► you can have all the good parts of .NET and C#, which C# is a great language. It has its
00:02:34 ◼ ► ecosystem that's garbage. And so if you can issue the rest of the ecosystem, then you're
00:02:39 ◼ ► But I mean, I think that it's really… obviously it depends on what you're trying to build
00:02:43 ◼ ► and what its purpose is and what your team or you know. But I mean, I could make a decent
00:02:48 ◼ ► argument for PHP, maybe even an ancient-ass language from the Stone Age like Perl, depending
00:02:56 ◼ ► Well, I think doing anything on the web using Windows or any Windows-adjacent technology
00:03:03 ◼ ► as your back end is like the path of most resistance. Don't do that. Use an open technology,
00:03:19 ◼ ► all this stuff." And I ask having that be your deployment target instead of the bazillion
00:03:26 ◼ ► deployment targets for all the different languages. It's just better to go with something completely
00:04:04 ◼ ► Swift, which I assume nobody is using, probably not even Apple, but of the ones that are existing
00:04:12 ◼ ► Yeah, the problem with Swift and the server is that it violates a number of my best practices
00:04:21 ◼ ► one is that you should never have any risk of being the largest installation of it. And
00:04:42 ◼ ► and scaling problems that no one else is running into, or that too few people are running into
00:04:47 ◼ ► where that could make it hard to get past them. Or it might make things become my problem
00:04:53 ◼ ► that shouldn't be my problem. And that's not a recipe for happiness when you're running
00:04:58 ◼ ► Also, if you get into server-side stuff and you end up learning of the Windows stack or
00:05:14 ◼ ► But again, without question, you are not wrong. But it is not as guaranteed as you're painting
00:05:20 ◼ ► it to be. Like, for example, at work, we were straight up Windows .NET the whole way for
00:05:33 ◼ ► really a front-end language, but we were basically using PHP to consume .NET APIs. It's weird.
00:05:42 ◼ ► away from Windows and onto .NET Core so we can deploy to any, within reason, any Linux-based
00:05:51 ◼ ► And to be fair, I'm speaking a little bit, more than a little bit out of my comfort zone
00:06:04 ◼ ► which is one of the Swift server-side things, is really good, which very well may be. And
00:06:10 ◼ ► they said, "Me saying C# is better than Swift," says CAM25, "that's only true because Swift
00:06:17 ◼ ► is so new and people are being scared to adopt." And that's exactly why you don't want to be—this
00:06:22 ◼ ► is what Marco was just saying. Like, you do not want to be on the bleeding edge on server-side
00:06:56 ◼ ► is a pretty much annual occurrence—the AppCamp for Girls fundraiser/live near WWDC concert
00:07:04 ◼ ► jam with James Dempsey and the Breakpoints. If you are not familiar with this—and we've
00:07:12 ◼ ► talented musician. And he writes songs that are very catchy and very good, but the lyrics
00:07:18 ◼ ► are all about writing code. And this sounds like it may not be enjoyable at all at first
00:07:25 ◼ ► glance, but it's actually really, really, really good. And so ATP is one of many sponsors
00:07:42 ◼ ► sort of thing for girls and other underrepresented groups, especially in the middle school age
00:07:57 ◼ ► members of AppCamp for Girls are dear friends of ours, most especially Jean McDonald, who
00:08:01 ◼ ► is one of their founders. They are an unbelievably good organization that has done tremendous
00:08:07 ◼ ► things to push young girls and young women forward into STEM sort of paths through life
00:08:17 ◼ ► and teach them that they too can write code. And despite what all these jerky boys around
00:08:27 ◼ ► for a boy. And so if you are in the WWDC area next week on Wednesday, I strongly encourage
00:08:34 ◼ ► you to come and hang out and say hi. I'm pretty sure all three of us will be there for at
00:08:46 ◼ ► is a donation effectively to AppCamp for Girls. There will be an open bar with, I'm told,
00:08:51 ◼ ► top shelf liquor, which is very exciting. And even if you're not at WWDC, you know what?
00:09:03 ◼ ► to your attention. We're trying to raise $25,000 for AppCamp for Girls, and I could not say
00:09:07 ◼ ► enough good things about that organization. So if you have the means, I strongly encourage
00:09:14 ◼ ► you to throw a few bucks their way, whether or not you're going to be there. And if you
00:09:32 ◼ ► They actually weren't. We didn't actually get that much feedback on that. I didn't think
00:09:47 ◼ ► one router doesn't cover a lot of our houses all the way. There's always gaps or slow spots
00:09:52 ◼ ► or dead zones. What you need is what businesses figured out a long time ago. You need a distributed
00:10:10 ◼ ► everyone with a great value and with the easiest setup I've ever seen of a wireless router.
00:10:16 ◼ ► So here's what you do. You start out with the base station, and you plug this into your
00:10:19 ◼ ► network connection, just like any other router. Then you have the Eero beacons. These are
00:10:35 ◼ ► run wires everywhere if you don't want to, if you can't. They all communicate with each
00:10:39 ◼ ► other, and they form this huge, even, fast blanket of Wi-Fi coverage across your entire
00:10:45 ◼ ► home. You can use whatever number of the beacons you need. Most homes need about two beacons,
00:10:49 ◼ ► plus one base station. These are all high-grade wireless gear, all the top radios, top speeds,
00:11:05 ◼ ► ever seen of any Wi-Fi router, and it happens to have this incredible coverage area by using
00:11:14 ◼ ► saying this, the reviews speak for themselves. This is a very highly rated item. Look on
00:11:22 ◼ ► Eero.com, and at checkout, you can select overnight shipping, and if you do, enter promo
00:11:27 ◼ ► code ATP to make that shipping free to the US or Canada. So once again, go to Eero.com.
00:11:33 ◼ ► That's E-E-R-O dot com, and for free overnight shipping to the US or Canada, select overnight
00:11:47 ◼ ► iOS 11.4 is out, and I am happy to tell you the long national nightmare is over. AirPlay
00:11:53 ◼ ► 2 and Messages in the Cloud are here. I have tried neither of these things. So I am useless.
00:12:02 ◼ ► I have nothing constructive to add, really, other than to say I have seen people throwing
00:12:07 ◼ ► up screenshots of their iCloud storage usage after engaging Messages in the Cloud and seeing
00:12:20 ◼ ► iCloud storage, because I don't use iCloud photo library, and I don't back up to iCloud
00:12:34 ◼ ► - I say that every time, yes, I am gonna make that same joke every time someone doesn't
00:12:39 ◼ ► - You're a power user. This makes a big difference in how your device functions. How, what?
00:13:10 ◼ ► - I mean, I just, I've never really had, I've never felt like I've had the deed. And I'm
00:13:15 ◼ ► not saying I wouldn't get use out of it, but I've never felt like I had the need. But now,
00:13:18 ◼ ► now this is the moment, this is the moment when I'm probably gonna have the need. Because
00:13:29 ◼ ► me to spring for some amount of iCloud storage. Or maybe I'll just play the slow and lazy
00:13:36 ◼ ► Procrastinators game. Hello, Marco. And maybe at WWDC next week, I will get some more free
00:13:53 ◼ ► for it just so you can back up all your devices. Like, forget about the messages in the Cloud
00:14:00 ◼ ► - No real argument here. But either way, I have not tried any of these things. And, John,
00:14:19 ◼ ► - I believe under iOS 11.4, if you AirPlay to a HomePod or I think an Apple TV, you know,
00:14:28 ◼ ► the app model or forward, that should, I think, automatically use AirPlay 2. Except if you're
00:14:35 ◼ ► streaming Overcast, which is part of the reason why I now had to go buy a fucking HomePod.
00:14:51 ◼ ► - Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like, that's the whole point. Like, the features that it
00:14:55 ◼ ► gives, multi-device audio and stereo pairing, I can't use with my single HomePod. So if
00:15:03 ◼ ► music is going over the air." I suppose I might notice, like, less lag in the controls,
00:15:07 ◼ ► but other than that, it never even occurred to me to try because I just have the one HomePod.
00:15:29 ◼ ► - It was just today. The second one I haven't hooked up yet. It was literally, like, tonight
00:15:37 ◼ ► - It sounds good, yeah. It doesn't sound as mind-blowing as people have said. I honestly
00:15:44 ◼ ► expected it to sound a little bit better than it does, but it does sound way better than
00:15:47 ◼ ► the Amazon Echo and it's, you know, for the size, it sounds good. They are certainly doing
00:15:53 ◼ ► a whole lot of bass, especially at lower volumes where you're less likely to notice. I think
00:16:00 ◼ ► the bass is dynamic by volume level. Bose has done this for a long time where basically
00:16:05 ◼ ► at lower volumes you use more bass than at higher volumes and it makes lower volume sound
00:16:26 ◼ ► was kind of gambling, like, Airplay 2 seemed like it was maybe never going to come or going
00:16:36 ◼ ► I was going to just keep doing other things until it was clear that it was going to actually
00:16:40 ◼ ► happen. Well, it actually happened, so now I have to test it and I'm going to be traveling
00:16:45 ◼ ► a lot back and forth to the beach this summer, so I bought one for there and one for here.
00:16:49 ◼ ► So I can actually test it and I have a feeling it's going to be a pretty big chunk of my
00:16:59 ◼ ► Messages in the Cloud, they were both debuted or teased at WWDC 2017. They were announced,
00:17:06 ◼ ► not teased, they were announced. Fair, fair. And it is now less than a week away from the
00:17:13 ◼ ► keynote that kicks off WWDC 2018 and just in the nick of time, just by the skin of their
00:17:21 ◼ ► teeth they have gotten this in in time. And it makes me wonder, is it that this is really
00:17:27 ◼ ► and truly fully baked and it was a happy coincidence, or is this getting shipped a little sooner
00:17:31 ◼ ► than they want just so they can check the before 2018 checkbox? Well, something clearly
00:17:36 ◼ ► went wrong here. I hope people who have access to press that have access to Apple during
00:17:40 ◼ ► WWDC week, ask this. Not that it's some deep deadly secret, but I feel like if it's a year
00:17:46 ◼ ► since when you announce something and when you release it, something has gone wrong and
00:17:56 ◼ ► a question that needs to be asked and answered. We can't just pretend like, oh, just sometimes
00:18:08 ◼ ► or a thing that we might be working on. It was like, here are these things and some things
00:18:12 ◼ ► are available now and some things will be able two weeks from now and some will be available
00:18:20 ◼ ► good. Yeah, honestly, I haven't turned the feature on yet, even though I do pay for storage,
00:18:25 ◼ ► Casey, because I'm a little scared to be one of the very first people to turn this on. I
00:18:30 ◼ ► think it's very telling that Apple has not enabled this for the Mac yet and has not enabled
00:18:38 ◼ ► it by default on iOS and has kind of buried the setting that it kind of makes me, it kind
00:18:47 ◼ ► if that's the reason. I did enable it just because I was the feature, one of the features
00:18:52 ◼ ► I was most excited about last year and I'm like, fine, I'll wait for a delay. I'd rather
00:18:59 ◼ ► times, then pulled back and like, well, whatever, they'll get it worked out. But at this point,
00:19:02 ◼ ► I'm like, look, you've had a year, this thing better work. I'm enabling it. So I enabled
00:19:06 ◼ ► it. It was buried. I was thinking of why it doesn't appear to be enabled by default. It's
00:19:10 ◼ ► hard to tell because like I know I did probably, I don't, did I play with it during the betas?
00:19:18 ◼ ► know, people have a surprising amount of data in their messages, right? So if they enable
00:19:22 ◼ ► it by default, it would blow everybody's free five gigabytes, just like Casey, right? Because
00:19:33 ◼ ► Or I don't know, I can keep track of what, or maybe music doesn't count towards it, but
00:19:42 ◼ ► your phone and then go into iCloud and then look at, go to manage storage and then look
00:19:49 ◼ ► at the messages row and, and you may not think you have a lot of messages like, oh, it's
00:19:54 ◼ ► just text messages. How big could it possibly be? But you send video to people, people send
00:20:09 ◼ ► Yeah. If you actually get a legit GIF, I don't even know if this is possible. Is it possible
00:20:13 ◼ ► to get an actual GIF in messages or just does it like back end convert them all down before
00:20:18 ◼ ► No, no, no. They're actual GIFs. I shouldn't say this with such extreme confidence. I am
00:20:23 ◼ ► fairly sure that they are not converted because if you, you know, save that from your messages
00:20:33 ◼ ► GIF is GIF animations are not space efficient, let's just say, despite the fact that, you
00:20:37 ◼ ► know, they're still delightful. Right. Anyway. So my messages, it says 4.6 gigabytes and
00:20:49 ◼ ► new version of a Mac OS is not out yet. What is it going to be? 10, 13, 15 or something
00:21:01 ◼ ► device I've upgraded. And when I tap on messages, it says 4.6 gigabytes when I tap on messages.
00:21:07 ◼ ► Oh, fine, fine. Now you're going to tell me, it has a little thing that says conversations
00:21:19 ◼ ► the fact that the thing I just tapped on said 4.6 gigabytes. So anyway, now when I go in
00:21:22 ◼ ► 4.6 gigabytes, I go in it says conversations 2.18 gigabytes. And then I go into the next
00:21:26 ◼ ► screen and my top conversation is negative one byte. And my second conversation is negative
00:21:31 ◼ ► six bytes. Nice. And they're sorted, they're sorted. But yeah, so something is a little
00:21:36 ◼ ► bit wacky with their calculations of exactly how much storage thing is taking up. Cause
00:21:40 ◼ ► I'm pretty sure I have no conversations that are negative bytes in size. So it hasn't destroyed
00:21:47 ◼ ► my messages. Everything, all my conversations on my phone, I continue to see there, but
00:21:51 ◼ ► I have also not using the actual feature yet, which is so your messages should be the same
00:21:59 ◼ ► you go into your iPad, it should be the same. I will try that out as I upgrade my devices.
00:22:19 ◼ ► Yeah, I am not that, but leaving aside the iCloud storage issues, which are self-created,
00:22:30 ◼ ► back from WWDC, because even though I do have some issues with iMessage from time to time,
00:22:34 ◼ ► like messages coming out of order and so on, I don't want to mess with any of that until
00:22:41 ◼ ► Yeah, I think the main reason to enable this, you're like, I never had these bugs. Why would
00:22:47 ◼ ► I enable this feature if you're saying that this feature might be itself buggy? I never
00:22:52 ◼ ► have the problems that it's supposedly solving. I think it's mostly for the same reason you
00:23:02 ◼ ► It's another backstop against losing stuff. So maybe there's some conversations that you
00:23:07 ◼ ► have that have sentimental value or you have tons of videos and images or whatever, and
00:23:13 ◼ ► you may be schlepping them along from device to device but don't really have a good cloud
00:23:18 ◼ ► backup of it for whatever reason, Casey. This will give you a cloud backup of all your conversations,
00:23:33 ◼ ► theory if everything works well, you will now have all your conversations in more places
00:23:38 ◼ ► than you used to, especially if I think like most of us, you have some conversations that
00:23:47 ◼ ► but aren't, you know, like, it's not the same everywhere. This in theory will make it the
00:23:51 ◼ ► same everywhere and will also make sure that that sameness is also stored on Apple's server
00:24:00 ◼ ► it will also make your messages go in order. So I'll let you know if it destroys—I don't
00:24:09 ◼ ► I even got an iPhone, and if I did messages on an iPod touch, I don't even remember. So
00:24:14 ◼ ► I was using AIM. All my sentimental conversations are on AIM, or maybe some on ICQ, but I don't
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00:26:32 ◼ ► - So WBC is coming. I don't know how we want to dig in on this. I don't have any particular
00:26:37 ◼ ► format because we're not as clever as upgrade with their draft and all that nonsense, which
00:26:46 ◼ ► - Get Jason on the podcast, you know there'll be a draft. That's how it works. Get me on
00:26:58 ◼ ► - That's true. The whole show is follow-up. That's my secret, Casey. It's all follow-up.
00:27:03 ◼ ► - Reference acknowledged. Reference acknowledged. All right. So how do we want to start this?
00:27:08 ◼ ► Do we want to just start spitballing things we're excited for, hopeful for? I mean I guess
00:27:16 ◼ ► - All right. So I'm excited about this because we really know almost nothing going into it.
00:27:32 ◼ ► We have no hardware parts leaks or anything like that. We really have no idea what we're
00:27:46 ◼ ► And that's kind of concerning on some levels, but mostly it's very exciting that this will
00:28:00 ◼ ► on Kinesis this week, they were talking about how rather than kind of predictions, they
00:28:21 ◼ ► I think the major problem areas to me are the Mac and Siri. And it's not that they suck
00:28:38 ◼ ► The Mac, it's hard to tell with the Mac whether they are just neglecting it horribly or whether
00:28:47 ◼ ► there is some big new direction that it will be taking that just isn't ready yet. You know,
00:28:53 ◼ ► this is always a problem when looking at Apple. And with Siri, you can kind of say the same
00:29:02 ◼ ► on a better Siri that hasn't launched yet. Who knows, right? So what I want to see this
00:29:07 ◼ ► year, like all we've seen from the few little trickles of rumors that we've gotten are people
00:29:13 ◼ ► saying that, "Oh, big stuff is in the work for the Mac with various like cross platform
00:29:17 ◼ ► slash new UI framework kind of things." And other people saying, "No, it's not." Or mostly
00:29:22 ◼ ► saying, "It's not ready yet and maybe it will be ready next year." What I want to see this
00:29:37 ◼ ► want to see some kind of indication that these aren't just sucking like they are sucking
00:29:43 ◼ ► now forever. That Mac OS and that Siri, even if their major upgrades are coming next year,
00:29:53 ◼ ► I want to see a sign of life this year that they will have major upgrades. And if their
00:29:59 ◼ ► major upgrades are ready, that's even better, but it sounds like they're probably not. So
00:30:07 ◼ ► problem areas right now is not because they're just being elected forever, but because bigger
00:30:32 ◼ ► Not even Apple announcements, but things where they don't say, "But here are size quests."
00:30:43 ◼ ► times observing Apple is kind of like observing a black hole. You can't see the thing you're
00:30:50 ◼ ► looking for, but you can try to observe effects of things around it that might indicate that
00:30:56 ◼ ► it's there. So something that indicates that there is a next generation of Mac OS or of
00:31:05 ◼ ► UI development on the Mac or of Siri getting significantly better. Just something to indicate
00:31:11 ◼ ► that this work is going on and is progressing rather than the way it looks right now in
00:31:21 ◼ ► Even if we don't get any official announcements, I just want to see a sign of life that that's
00:31:33 ◼ ► If we're talking about the things that, before we get to preview/prediction, we're just talking
00:31:46 ◼ ► Well, let me just get the quick one out of the way. A Mac Pro teaser would make me happy,
00:32:00 ◼ ► a rumor or announcement or whatever that Apple was trying to slow down and pull features
00:32:13 ◼ ► What would make me happy to see is that this WWDC reflects a slowdown, which means like,
00:32:20 ◼ ► That means it's like boring stuff and we'd be talking about, "Oh, they don't have anything
00:32:27 ◼ ► There's no new hardware, there's no amazing new software, and even though we didn't think
00:32:31 ◼ ► But I would take that as a sign that the slowdown in philosophy is in effect and is bearing
00:32:39 ◼ ► The less they have to say, the more I will expect the things they do announce to actually
00:32:46 ◼ ► So all the new things that I think we should start off talking about are things we know
00:32:52 ◼ ► Hopefully they're boring and they're reliable and they're predictable and they have fewer
00:32:57 ◼ ► bugs than their equivalents in the past couple of years and longstanding bugs that bother
00:33:06 ◼ ► That kind of a slowdown, which sounds boring, but is kind of what I would like from Apple
00:33:19 ◼ ► in 2019, including the Mac Pro, but also all the stuff with the cross-platform stuff that
00:33:34 ◼ ► Take the time to roll that out next year and have this year be like a rebuilding year where
00:33:39 ◼ ► there aren't any earth-shattering announcements, but everything that is announced ships on
00:33:52 ◼ ► More solid than usual and all sorts of little bugs that have been around for years and years
00:34:10 ◼ ► Yeah, you know, I think the number one thing on my list is having now experienced the comparative
00:34:26 ◼ ► And in fact, just this evening, I was talking to Aaron, my phone in my pocket, and I don't
00:34:38 ◼ ► was saying something about my mother, which I wasn't really clear on and definitely startled
00:34:48 ◼ ► I don't know how Siri heard the wake word because I didn't say anything that even vaguely
00:34:58 ◼ ► Now in the defense of my phone, it wasn't my pocket, but that is the first time I think
00:35:20 ◼ ► And I've actually taken the, I've gotten into the habit of turning Bluetooth completely
00:35:46 ◼ ► But it can't quite get there via Bluetooth, so it just sits and spins and sits and spins
00:35:52 ◼ ► and sits and spins and no, it doesn't fall off to the already active cellular connection.
00:36:13 ◼ ► Bluetooth as much as possible, that also means that when an app tries to transfer files or
00:36:40 ◼ ► I think forever is considerably shorter than the amount of time it actually takes, because
00:36:51 ◼ ► That's the thing is that, just like you said, there's no reason in theory that this couldn't
00:36:55 ◼ ► use Wi-Fi or hell, even cellular if it wanted to for those of us who have cellular watches
00:37:19 ◼ ► Why not prefer Wi-Fi and cellular until the battery is down to 75% or 50% and then start
00:37:53 ◼ ► But it's the kind of small, long-standing issue that is only an issue in certain situations,
00:38:56 ◼ ► will happen, but I'd like to see some notification improvements, some more—and Mike has been
00:39:09 ◼ ► I don't recall if it was Mike or Jason, but one of them said, "Hey, what about geofencing
00:39:25 ◼ ► Can we do something to make this better and preferably have more granular controls over
00:39:34 ◼ ► Additionally, I would love to have either third-party watch faces, which we've all been
00:39:41 ◼ ► banging that drum for a long time, or I would just think—I think it would be really excellent
00:39:57 ◼ ► nice way to kind of see what your day is—what's in front of you for the day in a very lovely
00:40:05 ◼ ► And it would be awesome if I could have, like, a weather report inserted from Carrot Weather
00:40:26 ◼ ► And so it's general Siri improvements, Siri watch face, like, widgets for third parties.
00:40:32 ◼ ► Again, I'll ask for third-party watch faces, but I feel like this is my Gene Munster TV
00:40:56 ◼ ► to keep secret than software stuff, especially software stuff that only happens in California,
00:41:01 ◼ ► So that argues for no hardware of any interest, because that probably would have leaked by
00:41:14 ◼ ► can keep that really, really secret even when it's something huge like Swift or whatever,
00:41:19 ◼ ► They usually can't keep secret the idea that there is a project underway to do something
00:41:34 ◼ ► a lot of sort of, again, boring rebuilding-year-style hardware that they could put out, like, slightly
00:41:50 ◼ ► You know, some kind of device besides an iPhone X that lacks a home button, so pick one of
00:42:01 ◼ ► There's all sorts of things—small, iterative, non-revolutionary things they could do with
00:42:29 ◼ ► going to see the fruits of those labors anytime soon, so, you know, maybe next year, right?
00:42:36 ◼ ► Maybe they're bringing new people on board, but maybe the second or third generation Siri
00:42:43 ◼ ► Yeah, I mean, it does often seem like they just kind of woke up to the Mac having a major
00:43:02 ◼ ► That's their product that they supposedly care a lot about, and it's a flagship feature,
00:43:12 ◼ ► all of their competitors' devices and products so they know what everyone else is doing.
00:43:18 ◼ ► Like, is it conceivable that these people, like, had no experience with any of the other
00:43:35 ◼ ► knew they were behind, they thought they were working to improve it, but it turns out they
00:43:43 ◼ ► spring that they needed an entirely different approach, and prior to that they had been
00:44:02 ◼ ► It's just the improvements have not been keeping pace with the competitors' improvements,
00:44:24 ◼ ► and curse of Apple that when you talk to your phone, it gives you the little transcript
00:44:28 ◼ ► of what Siri thinks you said and then Siri's response, so it's perfect for screenshotting."
00:44:34 ◼ ► And that is definitely a genre where someone asked some question or tried to say something
00:44:54 ◼ ► And Siri clearly understood the 29 and had just asked a question about 28 or 29 but could
00:44:58 ◼ ► not map that 29 back to, you know, so you just take a screenshot of this absurd conversation.
00:45:20 ◼ ► It puts the 2 and the 9 on the screen as what it understood you to say and then goes off
00:45:42 ◼ ► Imagine, like, if you look at the incredible amount of access Siri has to us, to our devices,
00:46:11 ◼ ► These could be amazing products and this could be an amazingly useful assistant if it was
00:46:23 ◼ ► And now that we're seven years into it, it's really concerning that it isn't better than
00:46:34 ◼ ► But I don't want Siri to be better than Alexa, better than Google Assistant, like better than
00:47:18 ◼ ► There's obviously a lot of work involved in building some kind of system for Siri to index
00:47:39 ◼ ► And there is a provision there for the app that's being called upon to provide vocabulary
00:47:56 ◼ ► So this is the list of things they might be saying and try to match that and let me know
00:48:06 ◼ ► a list of strings that could be any band they could be possibly asking for, any song title.
00:48:20 ◼ ► complex maybe asynchronous or offline indexing process, kind of like what Spotlight does
00:48:36 ◼ ► I also see the possible competitive pressure for Apple to never add it because now Apple
00:48:42 ◼ ► Music is the only thing you can use, you can call it by name from Siri on your phone, which
00:48:58 ◼ ► and to their hardware products is better than whatever they're making for Apple Music and
00:49:03 ◼ ► But anyway, a SiriKit audio intent would be very, very good and that would make me very
00:49:26 ◼ ► Most apps have no use for Siri because most apps are not note taking apps, workout apps,
00:49:41 ◼ ► Like if your app is not one of those like five or six things that they have these little
00:49:45 ◼ ► narrow intents for, not only is there nothing for you to use, but you aren't even allowed
00:50:15 ◼ ► What I really want to see is less specific generic intents that can be used more broadly
00:50:22 ◼ ► for lots of app types, even if it isn't necessarily as sophisticated or as good as specialized
00:50:49 ◼ ► And then the app can provide through the vocabulary API, you know, a small set of actions and
00:51:02 ◼ ► This is not a new concept and doing speech recognition with a limited vocabulary is really
00:51:07 ◼ ► So like that is not going to be as smart as, you know, something that's more, you know,
00:51:15 ◼ ► What do you want your message to so and so to say, well, where do you want to hail your
00:51:33 ◼ ► It hurts developers and it hurts users ability to use apps through Siri that they might want
00:51:38 ◼ ► So just some kind of generic action that can just map a generic list of verbs and objects
00:52:00 ◼ ► And incidentally, that kind of change is exactly the kind of thing that happens year over year
00:52:05 ◼ ► Like they'll announce an API and it will be very limited and there'll be a bunch of use
00:52:18 ◼ ► know, the brain dead thing where you say words, we turn it into text and we chuck the text
00:52:25 ◼ ► This is, you know, it's much more sophisticated in saying, well, because these intents are
00:52:44 ◼ ► So at that WWDC and over the course of the year, they get feedback from developers using
00:52:54 ◼ ► Or it, you know, there's these common use cases that don't fit, like Margaret was saying,
00:53:17 ◼ ► Maybe there's a few classes of applications that we want to cover, not just specific intents,
00:53:23 ◼ ► but these classes require a different approach, require approach more like Marco described
00:53:36 ◼ ► and if you've spent the year sending feedback and being frustrated that you can't use it
00:53:43 ◼ ► Like this is why, this is why developers, people don't understand why anyone would want
00:53:48 ◼ ► Developers get excited when, you know, they go to the keynote and maybe there's some fun
00:54:00 ◼ ► Like this new API is what I've wanted because now all these things that I wanted to do,
00:54:05 ◼ ► I don't need to read, we're weird work around or I'm, I'm able to add features that I've
00:54:13 ◼ ► And they get super excited about something that's buried 20 minutes into an obscure session
00:54:19 ◼ ► And the fruits of that come out like, you know, over the course of the year applications
00:54:40 ◼ ► And then you'll find out about it if you're not listening to this podcast, you know, weeks
00:54:49 ◼ ► But WWC is excited for exactly these reasons that they make changes to APIs that seem boring
00:55:03 ◼ ► that pretty much exactly what Marco described is entirely plausible for a sort of down year
00:55:12 ◼ ► where it's not going to make Siri magically amazing, but it will be the next major step
00:55:18 ◼ ► in the Siri Intents API, which will, you know, will go a long way to making our apps nicer
00:55:24 ◼ ► One more thing I would like to have on the Intents front is SiriKit default app settings.
00:55:35 ◼ ► for various system level things has been on people's wish lists for since the beginning
00:55:46 ◼ ► I don't see those things happening for lots of reasons, various system level integrations
00:56:03 ◼ ► intent defaults to things or, you know, whatever, insert your app of choice for your intent
00:56:17 ◼ ► Like having any like advancement to that system is going to pay dividends in how people use
00:56:57 ◼ ► So having a default system for SiriKit apps, I know a default system for web browsers and
00:57:12 ◼ ► Like that was the year where we got all the things we thought we were never going to get.
00:57:18 ◼ ► Like that is a big applause line in the keynote of saying you can now pick your default apps,
00:57:32 ◼ ► You know, you did third-party keyboards, but you didn't do I can change to my default mail
00:57:49 ◼ ► Like this sound -- we're at the point with iOS where there's not a lot of huge features
00:57:56 ◼ ► that everyone's going to use that people feel like are missing, but there's plenty of features
00:58:03 ◼ ► we're going to let you change your default mail app, so many people use Gmail or whatever.
00:58:15 ◼ ► I found another category of things you feel embarrassed having to explain to people who
00:58:22 ◼ ► It's like, oh, look, they're looking at all these great apps, and I can use this and that
00:58:29 ◼ ► How can I make it when I mail something using this handy share thing that you showed me,
00:58:43 ◼ ► But it's like, what about when -- like in your case, what about when I tell it to remind
00:59:07 ◼ ► That's an embarrassing long conversation that, you know, maybe doesn't come up that often,
00:59:25 ◼ ► And honestly, I think it is definitely a one-year project and it is a big applause line and
00:59:31 ◼ ► it will be a big like before and after thing where we're like, I remember when you couldn't
00:59:41 ◼ ► So people -- you, third-party developer, have a better opportunity to make more money in
00:59:47 ◼ ► the App Store because now people will be able to use your application as the default reminder's
00:59:55 ◼ ► >> And that's been a big theme to things that we've gotten at previous WWDCs that we've
01:00:00 ◼ ► been very happy with is ways for third-party apps to have the same levels of access and
01:00:15 ◼ ► So you know, like when we got background audio, finally we could have like background -- like
01:00:20 ◼ ► we could have third-party music and podcast players and they could do all the same things
01:00:26 ◼ ► And over the years, Apple really has broken down a lot of those barriers of differences
01:00:40 ◼ ► of URLs is one of those major ones that is still a really big barrier that significantly
01:00:59 ◼ ► >> I just -- I don't think default apps, you know, being able to set a default web browser,
01:01:55 ◼ ► And if not this year, then maybe next year, but please not 10 years from now because that
01:02:35 ◼ ► it is that we are running out of obvious low-hanging fruit for Apple to fix, which is good.
01:02:55 ◼ ► Of course, now I'm committing the ultimate programmer sin and saying, "Oh, I'm sure that's
01:03:22 ◼ ► bang for the buck about making it a more attractive platform for third-party developers and making
01:03:30 ◼ ► That's the level we're at now with iOS where it's like -- same thing with more sophisticated
01:03:42 ◼ ► They've been improving, but there are still a couple things that we could change to make
01:03:54 ◼ ► But our notifications are not as sophisticated, and it results in our devices annoying our
01:04:08 ◼ ► I mean, with so much of this stuff -- I know this probably is not the case, but so many
01:04:27 ◼ ► And every year, the big new thing of the new OS is something that it seems like shouldn't
01:04:44 ◼ ► And I think another major area that I'd like to see Apple improve on, which I don't expect
01:04:49 ◼ ► to happen anytime soon, because by all accounts, it's actually gotten worse in the last few
01:04:53 ◼ ► years, especially under Tim Cook's structure of management, is I want to see a sign that
01:05:10 ◼ ► the pace, actually innovate on all their platforms without two-thirds of them being seemingly
01:05:18 ◼ ► Actually move forward and use the massive resources they have to maintain all the platforms
01:05:41 ◼ ► Well your desire for a slowdown is only a thing because it seems like they can't update
01:05:59 ◼ ► Well, it's more like don't race ahead so quickly that you leave your messes behind you.
01:06:22 ◼ ► I suppose you could say if they improved the baseline quality of all their products but
01:06:53 ◼ ► They're just not yet at the point where they can show a noticeable improvement across all
01:07:24 ◼ ► Honestly, I think that would be an improvement because it used to be that it would race ahead
01:07:43 ◼ ► release cycle—and we've talked about this before—the annual release cycle is not compatible
01:08:06 ◼ ► And if they're being compelled to do them in a year or less, I'm sure I'm oversimplifying
01:08:14 ◼ ► And so, I think some sort of indication that Apple is willing to say, "No, this marketing
01:08:37 ◼ ► And we did hear a report—one of you mentioned this earlier—a report a couple months ago
01:10:11 ◼ ► more conservative because we've proven to ourselves that whatever balance we were striking
01:10:24 ◼ ► And then once you announce it, you're kind of committed, and it turns out—so that their
01:11:04 ◼ ► And just the question of what will be in the new iOS, what will be in the new macOS, what
01:11:07 ◼ ► will be in the new Xcode, what will be announced for Swift, which is much easier because it's
01:11:27 ◼ ► I'm just wondering if the standard required suite of things that we know at every WWDC,
01:11:47 ◼ ► And add features in point releases, but if they didn't have the burden of having a newly
01:11:53 ◼ ► named, newly numbered, new major version of all their stuff, maybe not even a new version
01:11:59 ◼ ► of Xcode, maybe just an Xcode, but I don't even know what the hell version Xcode is on,
01:12:02 ◼ ► but just don't change the first number or the second number, just change the third number.
01:12:14 ◼ ► in them, but it's worth considering whether Apple is a prisoner to every year having one
01:12:23 ◼ ► It's like, well, this is really iOS 11 point whatever, but we're just going to change the
01:12:32 ◼ ► I don't see that on the cards, but I'm thinking about what the reaction would be and whether
01:12:42 ◼ ► a new major release of all these important components and to be able to have enough marketing
01:12:48 ◼ ► features to be worthy of a new name and a new number and a new section of your website.
01:12:54 ◼ ► That seems like it might influence the decision about whether something is ready to fit in
01:13:04 ◼ ► What's different about it than an 11, except for a bunch of bug fixes and minor features?
01:13:09 ◼ ► That needs to stay in and that can lead you to the path of either shipping something before
01:13:36 ◼ ► There's lots of young frameworks that can kind of carry the weight of new major versions
01:14:01 ◼ ► But in terms of major new features that are not across platform UI framework for macOS,
01:14:32 ◼ ► have a significant impact on users and third-party developers and they should do those things.
01:14:57 ◼ ► They've made improvements over the last couple of releases, but it's still not what you want
01:15:55 ◼ ► Maybe offering their own intelligent displays of certain types of data or complications.
01:16:03 ◼ ► I have a feeling if they did it at all, they would probably do it in a very limited way.
01:16:16 ◼ ► I would even just see, I'd love to see things like, in addition to all my other complaints
01:16:21 ◼ ► about WatchKit, because WatchKit is horrible, and I still maintain that WatchKit should
01:16:26 ◼ ► be entirely thrown away, and there should be a UI framework that Apple uses and developers
01:16:46 ◼ ► My number one problem with my watch app is that the now playing glance has a volume control
01:17:03 ◼ ► Right now, most of, not most, a lot of people, almost most, who could install the overcast
01:17:18 ◼ ► I also, as I've said many times before and blogged about, I want actual background audio
01:17:28 ◼ ► I want now playing info center and remote command center so I can actually make a useful
01:17:41 ◼ ► system of complications was a miss and needs to be completely thrown out and rewritten.
01:17:51 ◼ ► So the idea of letting third party apps integrate into the watch faces with complications, that
01:17:58 ◼ ► But the current system of complications is, first of all, the way they're integrated into
01:18:22 ◼ ► So for instance, I don't need to see the timer calculation-- the timer complication if I
01:18:56 ◼ ► I also think that the entire API for supplying complications with their data was built upon
01:19:05 ◼ ► the like, you know, watch series zero hardware limitations of your app really can't be running
01:19:14 ◼ ► And also the idea that was added in I believe OS 2, which is time travel, where you could
01:19:20 ◼ ► spin the crown on your watch face and have it advance forward and backwards in time and
01:19:44 ◼ ► So I think that entire system needs to be scrapped and rethought, both from the display
01:20:01 ◼ ► I mean, what I would love from TV OS is if the OS could leap out of that pocket and fix
01:20:29 ◼ ► But the frame rate matching and the improvements to the playback APIs and everything, so that
01:20:38 ◼ ► the third party applications can take advantage of it, those were the last major features
01:21:03 ◼ ► But things that I want from the OS that it doesn't do, there's not a lot of the obvious
01:21:10 ◼ ► stuff left they really have to get now into the refinement and performance and new APIs
01:21:29 ◼ ► They don't want to go into the TV app, the little vestige of their attempted skinny bundle
01:21:38 ◼ ► coming with all their new TV shows and movies and other stuff that Apple is paying billions
01:21:48 ◼ ► shot at a grid of rectangular things on your screen or whatever their interface is going
01:21:55 ◼ ► But for now, I'd be content to just do minor refinements and really what I want is a new
01:22:06 ◼ ► Like oh, now I can get my things to show up in the TV app whereas previously they wouldn't.
01:22:12 ◼ ► That might be kind of interesting for people who use the TV app but I feel like that OS
01:22:17 ◼ ► is in a holding pattern awaiting Apple's video service and awaiting, as far as I'm concerned,
01:22:35 ◼ ► Do you think we'll get maybe widgets, which I'm not so convinced are really that useful
01:23:16 ◼ ► And then there's the thing that Gruber wrote about, the declarative UI framework, which
01:23:20 ◼ ► Mark Gurman says is codenamed Amber or Ultraviolet, that is apparently like a new kind of like
01:24:27 ◼ ► the system UI conventions and widgets in light of no longer being able to reach the top of
01:24:33 ◼ ► screens very often and in light of just the iOS 7 look being really dated and there being
01:25:03 ◼ ► So if they're truly taking this as a bug fixing year and if these cross-platform things aren't
01:25:35 ◼ ► more darkness that is an opt-in for developers with the exact same problems that we saw with
01:25:46 ◼ ► That could be a fun thing for Mac developers to wrangle with and that could also be a fun
01:25:53 ◼ ► It's not the most complicated feature in the world and it does make a lot of sort of busy
01:25:59 ◼ ► work for developers to make sure their applications look good in both dark mode and light mode,
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01:28:20 ◼ ► So last summer at the beach I brought with me my wonderfully hated 2017 15 inch MacBook
01:28:30 ◼ ► Pro because I had to work full time there for like a month and so I got the LG 5K brought
01:28:44 ◼ ► It had close performance to my 2014 iMac at the time so it was like alright this is good
01:28:57 ◼ ► Having the all USB-C lifestyle even when you have four ports was still kind of annoying.
01:29:01 ◼ ► Certain things were like certain peripherals were not reliable or were only reliable when
01:29:06 ◼ ► put into a real port not the hub on the back of the monitor or things like that but you
01:29:25 ◼ ► Alright so I have a problem is that this summer I will hopefully be working there a lot again
01:29:52 ◼ ► whatever the keynote is if they actually announce new MacBook Pros that have look I'm not hoping
01:30:03 ◼ ► I don't care how it's changed just something even if it's still butterfly switches even
01:30:21 ◼ ► Like just any indication like here's a third generation butterfly key mechanism or even
01:30:27 ◼ ► better here's the scissor mechanism from the magic keyboard which is a nice halfway point
01:30:45 ◼ ► change the keyboard now it is probably going to be more reliable because it's hard to make
01:30:50 ◼ ► it less reliable but also they've had all this time to see like okay we have some problems
01:30:54 ◼ ► with dust and stuff getting under these keys so hopefully if they change it now it should
01:31:04 ◼ ► course dependent on if a new laptop gets announced next week and so far we haven't seen any evidence
01:31:23 ◼ ► I would probably develop neck and shoulder problems but I could use that full time with
01:31:32 ◼ ► Another option is to get a different monitor for out there something like either like a
01:31:46 ◼ ► That's my work I actually have two 4K monitors side by side and it is pretty nice like I'd
01:31:52 ◼ ► still prefer a single 5K which you can I think you can also do with that 2015 actually obviously
01:32:02 ◼ ► Well unless if our listeners know if there's a 5K monitor that can work at 60 hertz with
01:32:21 ◼ ► monitors that like that people will officially say yes this works at 60 hertz with the you
01:32:27 ◼ ► know with the 2015 laptops even the ones without the GPU like it's actually that's actually
01:32:34 ◼ ► They're not great well not give you one but you know I mean like I have that at work and
01:32:41 ◼ ► They're not tremendous but they're sufficient and the one thing I will say while I'm thinking
01:32:46 ◼ ► of it just in case you go and do something without talking to me which is something that
01:33:06 ◼ ► Yeah you have to do that to get 60 hertz because I almost sent the one I have back when we
01:33:12 ◼ ► got it at work until I did a little googling and realized oh no no I can get 60 hertz out
01:33:20 ◼ ► So a couple of people in the chat are saying that I can use the Thunderbolt 3 to Thunderbolt
01:33:28 ◼ ► I believe they are correct however this is what the Apple stores do with the LG Ultrafine
01:33:37 ◼ ► If you look if you look closely at those screens you see it's actually running at a reduced
01:33:42 ◼ ► quality what it's doing so you can actually do this because the Thunderbolt 3 or 2 adapter
01:33:49 ◼ ► So you can plug the 3 or 2 adapter into the USB C monitor then you can take a Thunderbolt
01:33:54 ◼ ► 2 cable and plug it into the adapter and plug it into your laptop and if you do that what
01:33:59 ◼ ► will happen is the laptop it seems to be that the laptop basically down renders it renders
01:34:04 ◼ ► it to like a roughly 4K sized buffer and then up scales it at the monitor side kind of transparently
01:34:13 ◼ ► So it does appear from far away to be 5K like things are the right size for it to be 5K
01:34:20 ◼ ► but if you look up close the pixels are really kind of blurry and a little bit off like it's
01:34:23 ◼ ► just it's not quite right because it actually is down sampling and then put it back up.
01:34:27 ◼ ► So you can do that with the adapter and I have that adapter but it's not it's not something
01:34:41 ◼ ► The problem is once this summer is done like I don't have any use for that monitor anymore
01:34:48 ◼ ► That being said 4K monitors aren't that expensive it's one of the cheaper options I have it's
01:34:52 ◼ ► you know from my initial searching looks like I can get like a 4K 24 inch not 27 inch 27
01:35:08 ◼ ► So like this actually compared to some of these other options is actually a pretty reasonable
01:35:13 ◼ ► Well anyway so 24 inch monitor that's that's an option too probably the most sensible one.
01:35:25 ◼ ► Did you see oh god where is this it's called the La Volta iMac case did you see the picture
01:35:36 ◼ ► I could actually look like this guy with substantially less hair and a little bit more weight but
01:35:43 ◼ ► I could look like this guy carrying my iMac with a bespoke leather and whatever that cloth
01:35:55 ◼ ► I love that like they they can't really hide the fact that the stand is just poking out
01:36:08 ◼ ► But the funny thing is like I looked at various options for like you know iMac carrying cases
01:36:27 ◼ ► you want to transport your iMac safely you put it back in the original box and original
01:36:48 ◼ ► be like worrying about it and like because this isn't going to protect the thing if you
01:36:57 ◼ ► That's it like there's no there's no slimmer version that protects your thing just as much
01:37:28 ◼ ► Yeah like what if I like slightly jostle something inside or some component flakes out just a
01:37:43 ◼ ► don't I guess probably have air conditioning on a close but like it is a more hostile environment
01:37:48 ◼ ► Very yes no like everything out there like anything made of metal out there dies in like
01:37:54 ◼ ► three years like everything like you know appliances hardware on doors locks like everything
01:38:03 ◼ ► So yeah so like I don't think I want to bring my expensive iMac Pro there for lots of reasons.
01:38:10 ◼ ► So anyway that that option I don't love another option would be to like like get like a cheap
01:38:22 ◼ ► are things I could do but then it's like but I don't want a computer to be sitting there
01:38:35 ◼ ► Yeah but I mean like don't aren't you like the laptop isn't just about like the monitor
01:38:46 ◼ ► I honestly I think if you're going to spend substantial time there and you like working
01:39:02 ◼ ► when you leave the house pack it up in its original box and shove it somewhere like that
01:39:16 ◼ ► money by using your existing laptop with just a monitor and then just leaving it like just
01:39:21 ◼ ► just get the cheap iMac it seems that that's my vote for the path of least resistance that
01:39:33 ◼ ► If I didn't already have the 5k monitor out there I think that that seems like a better
01:39:38 ◼ ► option because I already have it out there like it seems like well what else like I don't
01:39:44 ◼ ► You're going to go out there and you're going to sell it that's what you're going to do.
01:39:48 ◼ ► I don't know this that I'm just I'm like I'm really I'm mostly just kind of annoyed like
01:40:01 ◼ ► like imagine like if Casey had to buy another BMW right now like that's deep right deep
01:40:10 ◼ ► for for what your stated priorities and needs are you still don't want to do it like that's
01:40:15 ◼ ► kind of how that's kind of how I feel about like ideally I think the actual option I should
01:40:24 ◼ ► inch I can get use it for the summer and then sell it or hopefully use it as my main one
01:40:28 ◼ ► if I can tolerate it that's what I should do but I just can't bear to do that like this
01:40:35 ◼ ► But wouldn't you rather be using an iMac like you're not you don't need the portability
01:40:47 ◼ ► I suppose I would but like but I'm still like my life's my the needs of my life are I do
01:40:53 ◼ ► need a laptop on a semi frequent basis so like I do need to maintain a laptop it doesn't
01:40:59 ◼ ► need to be the highest end laptop in the world but I do need a laptop so if I'm gonna have
01:41:04 ◼ ► a laptop anyway then I might as well have a laptop that can also serve this role because
01:41:09 ◼ ► it's way it's just a way more efficient allocation of computing resources and like number of
01:41:14 ◼ ► systems to maintain and everything then trying to have a desktop out there and desktop at
01:41:19 ◼ ► home and my laptop like that's that's getting a little bit crazy we'll get to that actually
01:41:22 ◼ ► in the in the SKTP but I just I don't want like I don't think I want a whole additional
01:41:31 ◼ ► You've got you've got a whole additional refrigerator and a whole additional washing machine you've
01:41:37 ◼ ► There's actually there's actually two refrigerators in it it came with two one of them was apparently
01:41:42 ◼ ► used for fish and so we don't use that so there's there's a second fridge in the living
01:41:49 ◼ ► room the fish fridge it's really high class yes and we just like leave it closed all the
01:41:56 ◼ ► time because we made the mistake of opening it a couple times and trying to clean it and
01:42:02 ◼ ► believe me this cannot be cleaned we we have tried we also tried giving it away surprise
01:42:14 ◼ ► just be slowly crumbling into you know rusty metal shards that's not a bad idea yeah take
01:42:19 ◼ ► advantage of the corrosion anyway so that's that's my beach computer problem this is admittedly
01:42:27 ◼ ► like massive first world problem you know white wine etc but I do think it's interesting
01:42:57 ◼ ► cheap and even I if were I in this situation I would just plunk down 250 bucks and call
01:43:04 ◼ ► today or you could have iCloud storage for like 20 years anyway ask ATP cw Bennett writes
01:43:12 ◼ ► what would be the best strategy to accidentally bump into you guys at WWDC I kept my eyes
01:43:17 ◼ ► open for you last year but had no luck if you're looking for Marco go to southern policy
01:43:22 ◼ ► if you're looking for John or well if you're looking for me social policy so sorry or if
01:43:41 ◼ ► actually because I'll be I'll be boinging through layers as well I'm gonna just be like
01:43:45 ◼ ► a Tasmanian devil but yeah any of those three places are well I guess for if you include
01:43:51 ◼ ► the beer the beer place that's the best bet for the three of us I reckon and I will also
01:43:58 ◼ ► reiterate as we do every year if you happen to see one of us in the streets and in a session
01:44:14 ◼ ► something like that so please don't take offense if we're if we're quick but please say hi
01:44:18 ◼ ► I love it when people say hi and say you know hey I really like the show that makes me feel
01:44:26 ◼ ► it's super fun and then I'm nobody just like always which is also super fun so please feel
01:44:33 ◼ ► free to say hi I think all three of us will probably have stickers is that right gentlemen
01:44:38 ◼ ► yeah I wanted to talk about that now because I'm gonna tweet about this too but it's easier
01:44:54 ◼ ► I will also have a small amount of hypercritical stickers which kind of look like the logo
01:45:10 ◼ ► I have because you want to stick it on something don't just ask for one because it sounds like
01:45:15 ◼ ► it might be neat to have a sticker right because I have a limited quantity and don't feel like
01:45:23 ◼ ► sticker and how can you tell whether you want them watch my Twitter feed and I will show
01:45:27 ◼ ► you pictures of the stickers and if you don't want that sticker do not ask for a sticker
01:45:38 ◼ ► or whatever don't because these are surprisingly expensive and people actually do want them
01:45:43 ◼ ► so if you don't want these stickers because they're ugly or stupid I will not be offended
01:46:00 ◼ ► whole year so that's not the smallest quantity because I got less than that oh well whatever
01:46:04 ◼ ► it is by all means if you see me even if you don't want a sticker ask for a sticker and
01:46:08 ◼ ► you can take one Margo needs to get rid of his stickers I have too many stickers so please
01:46:19 ◼ ► don't want the sticker like some people are not sticker people like I don't I don't put
01:46:26 ◼ ► people and they do want them and they're gonna stick them on a laptop those people should
01:46:29 ◼ ► have the stickers Wow leave it to John to have rules about whether or not you're allowed
01:46:34 ◼ ► to get a sticker from I'm just saying like sometimes people feel like they have to take
01:46:38 ◼ ► and they just chuck it right don't don't do that I will not be offended if you don't want
01:46:42 ◼ ► my stickers oh yeah I mean don't yeah don't don't take my stickers if you're gonna throw
01:46:52 ◼ ► other thoughts about where we can be found I mean obviously we'll have our Monday night
01:46:57 ◼ ► show the relay thing is Wednesday is that right talk show Tuesday app camp thing Wednesday
01:47:04 ◼ ► we'll be at all those places we'll be at our own live show surprise we'll all be at the
01:47:12 ◼ ► probably see us excellent Pat Murphy writes do any of you use multiple machines for development
01:47:17 ◼ ► and if so do you use any automation for that environment for example I understand Marco
01:47:22 ◼ ► does most of his dev work on a Mac on an iMac but he takes his laptop when he goes out to
01:47:26 ◼ ► WWC and I think he has said he does development while on the road do you just manually copy
01:47:32 ◼ ► drop drop box or iCloud gasp says Pat Murphy to sync folders or perhaps just do get sinks
01:47:48 ◼ ► may not be the bestest approach in the entire world but that's what works for me Marco what
01:47:54 ◼ ► do you do for your 13 different laptops that you're switching out every minute I I'm for
01:48:01 ◼ ► the most part until very recently I was doing what you do which is just have a different
01:48:10 ◼ ► working on and like just use git as the you know the merging and hosting platform to keep
01:48:15 ◼ ► everything in sync which of course has the downside of like you have to commit everything
01:48:21 ◼ ► to get it to sync to another machine so like if you if you're on your desktop and you gotta
01:48:25 ◼ ► run and you want to take your laptop and and start working on stuff you have to make sure
01:48:28 ◼ ► everything's committed and pushed before you can take your laptop and that's kind of cumbersome
01:48:34 ◼ ► and annoying and is is kind of violating like the purpose of the version control system
01:48:42 ◼ ► and shouldn't be using them and things like that so one thing that that underscore David
01:48:49 ◼ ► Smith told me on under the radar forever ago and he said it now it's like what that's crazy
01:48:55 ◼ ► he said he actually keeps his git checkouts in Dropbox and so he could just pick up his
01:49:06 ◼ ► desktop and it just syncs because it's Dropbox and you know still using git for its version
01:49:12 ◼ ► control but using Dropbox as the like sync mechanism between his own machines and I thought
01:49:19 ◼ ► that was the craziest thing in the world why did you think that was crazy it just seemed
01:49:34 ◼ ► in the old days we'd have our stuff in a common place and we'd have our stuff mounted on all
01:49:37 ◼ ► our machines and it was the same everywhere and how is this it's like a network file system
01:49:42 ◼ ► where it's not here but it's somewhere it's exactly the same thing only Dropbox is like
01:49:52 ◼ ► week and it's really cool like I gotta say it actually works props to underscore it sounded
01:50:11 ◼ ► different like I get really weird window sizing when the Xcode I think it's the XC user file
01:50:17 ◼ ► whichever one of the project files that you that you would never commit to a git repository
01:50:21 ◼ ► but that like it's like your local like window settings that file is now sinking so it kind
01:50:26 ◼ ► of makes weird things happen when you go between screen sizes but and I might try to look up
01:50:31 ◼ ► some hacks maybe make that file not sink or something but otherwise it's pretty cool like
01:50:35 ◼ ► having being able to just take my laptop and just continue what I was doing without anything
01:50:41 ◼ ► like without any effort really that's really cool word of warning though when you're doing
01:50:46 ◼ ► any specifically with Dropbox because it isn't NFS in the end and the end that is a is a
01:50:51 ◼ ► different thing with this offline process that's making a best effort to sink your crap
01:50:56 ◼ ► you will make Dropbox cry if you give it too many files so apparently Mark is using with
01:51:19 ◼ ► you should kind of know what they are before you commit to putting your substantial git
01:51:29 ◼ ► another Mac it will eventually but you will die waiting for it to happen I've also been
01:51:43 ◼ ► my like I use a bunch of tools from homebrew and I now have a shell script that I maintain
01:51:55 ◼ ► packages and tools that I use there and that way I can run it on any new Mac installation
01:51:59 ◼ ► or new Mac itself and it sets everything up in a consistent way also sometimes like when
01:52:04 ◼ ► I upgrade my OS that kind of stuff gets hosed for some reason even though it supposedly
01:52:08 ◼ ► shouldn't but it just does and so it's also really nice to be able to uninstall homebrew
01:52:22 ◼ ► things like the nginx configuration like where you have nginx include the list of sites and
01:52:34 ◼ ► know my local development for overcast versus like any other like you know little CMS things
01:52:39 ◼ ► I might be working on I can have all those things be synced up and then finally my bash
01:52:45 ◼ ► profile on each machine that I use I include a file that's on Dropbox for that too so I
01:52:56 ◼ ► Also worth noting that if you are living in that terrible world that I used to live in where you're doing all your work in VMs
01:53:03 ◼ ► one thing I used to do years ago when I was bouncing my VMs between computers was just getting like an external hard drive
01:53:09 ◼ ► and at this point this is before SSDs were affordable but just get an external hard drive preferably an SSD
01:53:15 ◼ ► and leave your VMs on there and just plug it into whatever computer you happen to be working with
01:53:19 ◼ ► obviously there's fragility there because if you jostle that you know connection even the littlest bit
01:53:24 ◼ ► and it falls down then you're gonna have a real world of hurt but by and large if your computers
01:53:31 ◼ ► are reasonably stationary when you're actively using them that ends up working out really well too.
01:53:35 ◼ ► Thanks to our sponsors this week Casper Squarespace and Eero and we'll talk to you next week.
01:53:50 ◼ ► John didn't do any research. Marco and Casey wouldn't let him because it was accidental.
01:54:01 ◼ ► It was accidental. And you can find the show notes at ATP.FM and if you're into Twitter you can follow them
01:54:14 ◼ ► @CASEYLISS so that's Casey Liss M-A-R-C-O-A-R-M-N-T-Marco-Arman S-I-R-A-C-U-S-A-S-T-R-A-C-U-S-A
01:54:45 ◼ ► So Casey how's your car doing? So where is your car right now? My car has been at BMW since Thursday
01:54:55 ◼ ► maybe Wednesday I forget exactly what day I dropped it off. It went in for a litany of problems I think
01:55:02 ◼ ► went in the day after we recorded so Thursday it doesn't really matter. It went in for a hum at
01:55:08 ◼ ► about 75 indicated miles an hour which is actually about 70 miles an hour. It went in for slow tire
01:55:13 ◼ ► leak. It went in for AC fans not working. It went in for brake fluid flush which is a maintenance
01:55:19 ◼ ► item and it went in for the brakes squealing like hell when I took off. So I got the call Friday that
01:55:29 ◼ ► the damage is $5,000. The car last I looked several months ago is worth $10,000 or thereabouts. So as
01:55:40 ◼ ► it turns out the brakes are the brake shoes within the drum brake that is the emergency brake that
01:55:51 ◼ ► lives within the disc brakes. So for a long time it's not the case anymore but for a long time
01:55:57 ◼ ► four-wheel disc cars actually had little tiny drum brakes kind of within the disc brakes as the
01:56:04 ◼ ► emergency brake. Now most of these are electronic and they'll actually I believe the caliper just
01:56:11 ◼ ► squeezes the brake disc and you can hear that whirring on Aaron's car when we hit the emergency
01:56:17 ◼ ► brake here as it's you know grabbing the disc. But anyway for me the brake shoes... Are you e-braking
01:56:24 ◼ ► on Aaron's car like drifting it around the neighborhood? What time do you have occasion to
01:56:29 ◼ ► engage the parking brake while the wheels are spinning? Please tell me. No no it's all when
01:56:33 ◼ ► the wheels are spinning. I'm saying you can hear the parking brake engage when you stop the car
01:56:38 ◼ ► and engage the parking brake. You hear the electric motor go "bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" as it's spinning. Oh I thought you heard the wheels spinning underneath the gripping calipers as you engage the parking brake at 30 miles an hour going around a right-hand turn. So yeah so the brake shoes needed to get replaced and I was told and I'm quoting that's not a normal failure item which made me
01:57:03 ◼ ► laugh more than I can tell you to which my immediate response was that is everything in this car.
01:57:09 ◼ ► Everything in this car has been a not has been not a normal failure. It sounds like they have a list of items in your car that they expect to fail so you should ask. Well fair but actually the reason this is relevant is because they said they needed to wait for those to come in because they don't even keep them in stock because they never brake. Anyway that so they needed to repair that.
01:57:32 ◼ ► I told them to go ahead and do that. The the blower issue was apparently a warranty. I think it was a warranty fix. I haven't picked up the car yet but it is ready. Is a warranty fix so I don't think I was charged for that. The slow tire leak is a cracked wheel. What? How? Like the rim? Apparently. So I told them so they wanted $500 to replace that and to which I said absolutely not. Don't do it. I'll deal with the slow leak.
01:58:00 ◼ ► My Accord wheels cost more than $500. That sounds like a bargain. Oh I didn't know that. That makes you feel slightly better but I still don't want them to do it. What was the brake fluid? You know whatever that's normal wear and tear. And then finally the hum at 75 miles an hour indicated is apparently my front differential which is shot. I don't know why. I don't know what specifically. I asked what specifically and I got kind of a in response. It's filled with metal confetti.
01:58:30 ◼ ► Yeah basically. So I told them don't fix the front diff. Don't replace the wheel and I'm not sure what my plan is from here. But I am going to either bring it to CarMax and see what they'll give me and you know just present it as is and see what they'll give me. Or maybe I will go to a local non BMW dealer but like a local BMW quote unquote specialist and see what they'll give me.
01:58:59 ◼ ► And see if that's demonstrably cheaper than repairing it at BMW. But my current intention is probably the moment I come back from DubDub is to attempt to sell it as is and then probably replace it with a brand new Wrangler.
01:59:17 ◼ ► Yeah what's the least you can get out of it? Like what's the least you can get out of paying for the current batch of repairs? Like I assume you're going to have to pay for some of these right?
01:59:33 ◼ ► Preposterous. But yeah. So I'm in for the brake pads. I'm in for the brake fluid. And I'm in of course they insisted on doing a cabin air filter and I'm too lazy to argue with them and that was probably $3000. But anyway.
01:59:45 ◼ ► So I'm in for like basic wear and tear stuff in the brakes and that was 750 bucks. So if I don't do the wheel and I don't do the front differential I'm still quote unquote saving you know what $4000 or thereabouts.
02:00:02 ◼ ► So my hope is I can find a way to unload this car. And by the way I'm not entirely convinced it really does need a differential. I think that's potentially not the case. But one way or another I'm going to attempt to unload the car and take that money and apply it to a probably a Wrangler but I'm not 100% sure that's where I'll end up.
02:00:24 ◼ ► But my thought is I am tired of performance cars because I always break them. I don't know how but I always do. German cars are unaffordable to maintain so I don't want to deal with that.
02:00:34 ◼ ► I don't really have a lot of interesting options in German performance cars anyway because I will end up divorced if I buy another BMW. The Audi is not as fast as I would like. The GTI is from everything I'm told pretty much perfect but it's German and it's front wheel drive and I'll probably drive one before I commit.
02:00:54 ◼ ► And then the Golf R is no sunroof and also fast in German and from what I understand not as good as the GTI anyway so that's not happening. I'm not buying a Model 3 because it's too much money. I'm not buying a Quadrifoglio because it's too much money and it will always break.
02:01:10 ◼ ► So my thought is as we've discussed previously and I will cut it short here just issue all performance and luxury and just get a box on wheels and enjoy it for what it is.
02:01:25 ◼ ► With a stick shift and it's fun. Although the new ones are ugly so I feel for you here.
02:01:30 ◼ ► Yeah the new ones are not good looking and I really did kick that idea around for a fleeting moment.
02:01:36 ◼ ► You should test drive it. You're going to test drive the GTI. You should also test drive a stick shift to the Accord if you can find one. Don't bother test driving the automatics because they're gross.
02:01:46 ◼ ► I've been in an automatic turbo Accord. A brand new one and it was reasonably quick. If you find me a stick shift Accord to try in Richmond I will happily go do it.
02:02:02 ◼ ► Well I mean look I think what you have here like your current your problems with your current car are substantial and possibly fatal for you owning the car.
02:02:14 ◼ ► That's fine. I'm not going to disagree with you there. I will caution you against rushing into a new choice. Even though I know you've been waffling about possibly getting a new/different car for a while now.
02:02:28 ◼ ► This is like being caused by a sudden impetus that you suddenly need something like now. Right?
02:02:35 ◼ ► Given how much you care about your car and how much enjoyment you get out of your car I don't think you should rush into whatever you buy next.
02:02:44 ◼ ► So that being said I mean I don't know how much I don't know what your situation will be like if you take this car home like how operable it will still remain for a while.
02:02:54 ◼ ► If it dies like what do you like can you can you get can you just be a one car family for a few weeks while you test drive other stuff like you know that so you have things like that to worry about.
02:03:03 ◼ ► But ultimately you know you do have a similar problem to my beach computer thing which is like I really so badly don't want to buy another one of these new generation laptops if it isn't fixed.
02:03:19 ◼ ► But ultimately my best solution is to just buy one of those laptops and your way to get most of what you want the most of what you want is to get another German sports car probably from BMW.
02:03:32 ◼ ► So it's it's it's never happened in both ways it's kind of a question like over like whether you can overcome how mad you are at them or or your your like you know identity being tied currently to like really hating them like that's like how how bad is it if I the the the master of the 2015 MacBook Pro like the biggest advocate decide in like a month.
02:03:53 ◼ ► Oh I actually need to need a new one instead like that's that's I'm trying to avoid that for lots of reasons but one of them is like identity and just how much I hated the previous ones right so like if you're you know looking at this trying to look at this a little more objectively like.
02:04:07 ◼ ► It really does seem like you are jumping through quite a lot of hoops to avoid the option of leasing something not necessarily from BMW but just to consider the option of leasing something because that is how you get high performance cars without having to deal with maintaining them over time.
02:04:26 ◼ ► Yeah and that's true but I mean even if I let's assume I wanted to lease I'm not going to lease some BMW because I just I need a break from it even if that is the empirically correct answer I just need a break from it.
02:04:39 ◼ ► Great thing about a lease it's three years so you can you can do something now realize you miss having a stick shift German car and go back to it in three years if you can still find one.
02:04:49 ◼ ► Yeah I mean that may be but I even if I even if I have leasing on the table the only thing I can think of that I that would maybe re enter the discussion is maybe the Alpha and it's still more expensive it's too expensive for what for what I want to pay even for a lease so I don't think that empirically changes anything and for Jeep it the residuals are so damn high it makes a lease terrible doesn't it or do I have that backwards.
02:05:14 ◼ ► A high residual is good residual is what percentage of the price it is worth at the end of the lease so a good residual is like in the 60s generally like you want it to be worth about 60% of its original value at the end of the lease that means you're paying over the span of three years 40% of the cost like that's that's like something like in the goodish range in among the cars that I tend to lease something that's better like like something like like a Honda or something Japanese like that probably has even better residuals if I had to guess but I haven't looked.
02:05:43 ◼ ► But yeah that's the like typically like 60% kind of thing is what you would get on like a hard to maintain German fast car.
02:05:52 ◼ ► And the thing is and so like a lot of people as I've been talking more and more about Wranglers a lot of people have been saying like oh they're so unreliable they're so unreliable maybe but let's assume for the sake of discussion.
02:06:02 ◼ ► Let's assume for the sake of discussion that that is a fact which I disagree with let's assume that Wranglers are unequivocally and unquestionably unreliable the critical difference that nobody seems to be thinking about is that doing a front differential for the sake of conversation maybe this is wrong but for the sake of conversation doing a front differential on a Wrangler has got to be like a third the cost of doing it on a 335 because it's a domestic car where all the parts are here they're already here all the parts are cheaper.
02:06:31 ◼ ► The labor is presumably either the same or cheaper and so it's going to be much much much cheaper even if it's broken all the time it's still gonna be way cheaper to fix the way I figure it.
02:06:45 ◼ ► So yeah I understand that may it may or may not be reliable now again my Anic data says that it's extremely reliable because data said three across 30 years and they've all been super reliable but admittedly Anic data.
02:07:04 ◼ ► And that's actually one thing that's a pellet that's compelling about the VW is to say if like a six or seven year bumper to bumper warranty now is a kind of the oops from dieselgate so that is slightly compelling about the Volkswagens but I don't know I don't know what I want to do.
02:07:18 ◼ ► I need to test drive a bunch of stuff but I don't have the time to do it especially now because I'm about to go out of town but I'm deeply deeply frustrated with my BMW and we have crossed the point of no return I think so it is getting sold sooner rather than later.
02:07:33 ◼ ► The question is as Marco said earlier will I jump immediately into something else or not and I don't think that I will and the main reason I don't think I will is that just like with the 335 I want a very particular set of options on this hypothetical Wrangler.
02:07:49 ◼ ► And when I looked a few days ago there were precisely three Wranglers with this set of options within 150 miles of me. Two of them or no all three of them I believe were spoken for and they were all more expensive than I wanted.
02:08:06 ◼ ► No I don't know which computer was I looking at this on hold on I can tell you because I think I took a screenshot.
02:08:12 ◼ ► Yes I did it was one blue and two gray actually that might be one blue one light gray one dark gray but no whites.
02:08:42 ◼ ► That being said though you know if you are going you know you mentioned you want to sell the BMW and then did I understand correctly that you might then not buy something immediately that you might go down to one car for a little while?
02:08:52 ◼ ► Yes so I my intention is to buy if I sell like my hypothetical wherein I sell the BMW within days of returning back here after dub-dub.
02:09:01 ◼ ► I think I would sell the BMW post haste so it doesn't explode on me you know what I mean?
02:09:08 ◼ ► Well see here's the thing though it's probably fairly stable if you don't drive it that much it's not gonna like explode in your garage.
02:09:14 ◼ ► You are in a much better bargaining position to apply that to a trade-in than you are to try to sell it in its you know needing expense state to anybody.
02:09:25 ◼ ► Who's gonna buy it like that but if you are in the process of buying or leasing a new vehicle the dealer has a strong incentive to take your trade-in.
02:09:33 ◼ ► So even so I think you are in a much better negotiating position using that as a trade-in than trying to sell it outside of a purchase.
02:09:43 ◼ ► Alright fair enough so maybe it'll just get parked and collect dust until I find a replacement.
02:09:51 ◼ ► Make sure it can drive onto the lot of the place you're buying it from that's all you need to do.
02:09:59 ◼ ► Yeah well and that's the thing that's why it fixed the the the screaming e-brake is because the second you move the car it was *screaming*
02:10:05 ◼ ► And so it was clear that that was going to have to be fixed if I wanted to get more than 10 bucks for this thing.
02:10:10 ◼ ► So yeah so we'll see what happens I mean it's first world problems but it's frustrating. Man is it frustrating.
02:10:15 ◼ ► Yeah take your time. We'll see. Drive test drive everything and and really I I strongly suggest that you consider the option of leasing.
02:10:26 ◼ ► You know I I know you have a lot of objections to it on like principal grounds but it really does solve a lot of your problems.
02:10:34 ◼ ► And I think overall once you could swallow that bitter pill of damn it I'm leasing like you know and it's against everything I believe in.
02:10:41 ◼ ► Once you can get past that everything else about it I think would make you a lot happier.
02:10:50 ◼ ► Well but but you your options greatly expand once that option is on the table. Once the leasing is on the table then you can get quote unreliable brands.
02:11:02 ◼ ► Or brands that you wouldn't want to be responsible for after they're three years old. Like you can get that. Things like the warranty stop mattering.
02:11:11 ◼ ► Yeah. Things like reliability and you know like that's just stops maintenance costs just stops mattering.
02:11:16 ◼ ► Yeah but again like I'm I'm I don't want to get a BMW. I don't want to get a BMW so your your lease idea would fix the BMW problem except I am petulantly refusing to get a BMW.
02:11:30 ◼ ► That yeah I mean you know obviously that would be like the most extreme example of like why it would beneficial to you because you could totally erase the maintenance headache from BMW.
02:11:40 ◼ ► But also if you're concerned about reliability for things like Audi or Alpha or VW like you know that does help you on those fronts as well or even heck even Jeep.
02:11:50 ◼ ► Like if they're if they're known to be unreliable yeah they are probably cheaper to service than the BMW but that's still something you probably want to be dealing with.
02:11:59 ◼ ► And so if you can lease one even better. That being said if you're going to buy one I think if you're going to buy one and your main justification for buying it is long term value you should be buying used.
02:12:12 ◼ ► I agree. I one hundred thousand percent agree. But the problem I'm running into with the Wrangler is the same damn problem that I put myself or box myself into a corner with with Aaron's car which is really two problems.
02:12:25 ◼ ► Number one I refuse to buy a car without CarPlay. Yes I know I could do some aftermarket mumbo jumbo but I am way too old and way too busy and way too boring for that.
02:12:43 ◼ ► But even more importantly than that because my BMW was bought when the F30 was brand new and mine's an E90.
02:12:48 ◼ ► So I've I've bought the old and busted design and by and large I stand by it for the BMW.
02:12:53 ◼ ► But the problem is is that I really would like CarPlay and the only way to get CarPlay in either of these cars is to get the brand new version.
02:13:06 ◼ ► But I totally agree with you. Like you're not wrong that that buying used is the more appropriate answer.
02:13:11 ◼ ► It's just in this especially actually if I were to go BMW because then I could get a CPO BMW which would have an even better warranty than a brand new one would.
02:13:30 ◼ ► Yeah it's a fair point. I think the the most useful tidbit you've given me though is to not insta-sell the BMW.
02:13:42 ◼ ► Like because of the condition it's in and because you do intend to have another car like use that use it as a trade-in.
02:13:58 ◼ ► And you don't want to deal with individuals with that because then you're selling somebody a broken car like they're going to know.
02:14:06 ◼ ► You definitely want like you want because what you know when a dealer buys a car as old as that they're not going to keep on their lot and resell it.
02:14:13 ◼ ► They're going to send it to an auction thing and they're going to get what some fixed price for it and that's it.
02:14:21 ◼ ► That's the way to do it. You do not want to sell it to an individual or anything like that.