The Accidental Tech Podcast

209: Making Sausage-Making Glamorous


00:00:00   I just feeling out to see whether you're [TS]

00:00:01   making a legit mistake or troll in and [TS]

00:00:05   use trollin I patrolling use myriapods [TS]

00:00:10   anymore [TS]

00:00:11   I thought I am NOT tiff uses the more [TS]

00:00:14   than I do now because did you get one [TS]

00:00:17   pair or two pair [TS]

00:00:18   I got one pair which is two airports but [TS]

00:00:22   yes it how you got three air pods yeah [TS]

00:00:25   how many how many your holes can you [TS]

00:00:27   fill with the air pods that are in the [TS]

00:00:29   house too [TS]

00:00:31   okay that's what I thought okay so you [TS]

00:00:32   have a single-payer like you said yes [TS]

00:00:35   and tiff is using the more than you [TS]

00:00:37   yeah she uses them actually often with [TS]

00:00:38   the apple TV like when I'm podcasting [TS]

00:00:40   frequently on gets it isn't as nice [TS]

00:00:43   using it with other stuff but it does [TS]

00:00:44   work and there's a couple of the [TS]

00:00:47   niceties like when you when you when you [TS]

00:00:48   use the volume up and down on the apple [TS]

00:00:50   TV remote with airports connected it [TS]

00:00:52   does the volume to them instead of like [TS]

00:00:53   your speakers so it doesn't do it the [TS]

00:00:55   auto pairing thing the way it doesn't [TS]

00:00:56   iOS devices but once you have it paired [TS]

00:00:59   it works nicely so how does that was [TS]

00:01:01   happening i'm not trying to be funny how [TS]

00:01:02   does that work then do you have to like [TS]

00:01:03   go into settings in the apple TV & and [TS]

00:01:05   say connect to the air pods every single [TS]

00:01:07   time I forget if we do every single time [TS]

00:01:11   I i think it was the first time I don't [TS]

00:01:12   usually she just does it [TS]

00:01:13   I think once they're paired as long as [TS]

00:01:15   you don't pair them with something else [TS]

00:01:17   though right [TS]

00:01:17   that's the issue and and so we've [TS]

00:01:19   actually I've actually seen a number of [TS]

00:01:21   times i was doing was trying to testing [TS]

00:01:23   between like the phone the TV ipad watch [TS]

00:01:27   a mac like you testing all these [TS]

00:01:29   different things and I found that it air [TS]

00:01:32   pods are a little bit frustrating in [TS]

00:01:35   trying to share between different [TS]

00:01:37   devices and having a not-quite always do [TS]

00:01:39   what you want [TS]

00:01:41   like even though the old way of doing [TS]

00:01:43   bluetooth for you have to like one pair [TS]

00:01:45   from 12 fights appeared something else [TS]

00:01:46   that's also terrible but the way [TS]

00:01:49   airports do it is not quite flawless but [TS]

00:01:52   how do they do it [TS]

00:01:53   that's my question because i have used [TS]

00:01:55   my ear pods with my phone in my ipad [TS]

00:01:57   right those are two two devices [TS]

00:01:59   yeah is something supposed to happen [TS]

00:02:02   other than me going to settings and [TS]

00:02:04   tapping bluetooth and tapping air pods [TS]

00:02:06   because that's what I've been doing my [TS]

00:02:08   favorite thing is occasionally I'll put [TS]

00:02:10   in a single airpot [TS]

00:02:11   and i'll be in like the bedroom and I'm [TS]

00:02:13   listening to a podcast or something like [TS]

00:02:15   that and then i'll put in like five or [TS]

00:02:18   ten minutes later i'll put in another [TS]

00:02:20   the the other air pod and it will go to [TS]

00:02:23   connect and for whatever reason it will [TS]

00:02:26   semi consistently connect the iMac which [TS]

00:02:28   is in the next room over the office and [TS]

00:02:30   so I have one Airport connected to my [TS]

00:02:33   phone and one connected to my my mac and [TS]

00:02:35   so i'll double tap like the the one [TS]

00:02:38   connected the iMac which I still haven't [TS]

00:02:40   changed to do play pause so I'll here [TS]

00:02:42   Syria of one here and then like whatever [TS]

00:02:44   podcast was need to out of the other [TS]

00:02:46   year it's actually quite funny and and I [TS]

00:02:49   could see how that would be really [TS]

00:02:50   frustrating to someone who isn't like a [TS]

00:02:53   developer perhaps or who doesn't think [TS]

00:02:54   about how difficult it is to implement [TS]

00:02:56   all this but to me I just find it to be [TS]

00:02:58   hysterical [TS]

00:02:59   yeah I still got some weird audio sync [TS]

00:03:01   problems sometimes but overall they're [TS]

00:03:02   still there still winning just because I [TS]

00:03:04   guess my hatred of chords and snags has [TS]

00:03:06   a mandarin house I i find it very [TS]

00:03:09   frustrating that I can't change volume [TS]

00:03:10   and I have all these crazy schemes on [TS]

00:03:12   how to adjust the volume by like [TS]

00:03:14   reaching into my pocket and feeling for [TS]

00:03:16   which side of the phone is face up so I [TS]

00:03:18   know whether I have to reach the side [TS]

00:03:20   with the power button never order the [TS]

00:03:22   volume thing like little slow down like [TS]

00:03:25   that [TS]

00:03:25   slow down we are you talking pant pocket [TS]

00:03:28   of jacket pocket jacket [TS]

00:03:29   ok then night night than i i i i mean [TS]

00:03:32   like my winter jacket and you know reach [TS]

00:03:35   around to change they are like what I do [TS]

00:03:37   in the kitchen except I don't put the [TS]

00:03:38   phone in the kitchen the phone is in the [TS]

00:03:39   dining room [TS]

00:03:40   so if i want to change the volume i have [TS]

00:03:42   like take a few steps into our room and [TS]

00:03:44   on the little sideboard thing the volume [TS]

00:03:47   up or down but i'm living within [TS]

00:03:49   apparently you know personal putting I'm [TS]

00:03:51   people hate when i said is not correct [TS]

00:03:53   but deal with it you know what I mean [TS]

00:03:54   that i i'm i'm now using them despite [TS]

00:04:00   the fact that double tapping my ear is [TS]

00:04:02   uncomfortable and despite the fact that [TS]

00:04:04   double tapping works weirdly in [TS]

00:04:06   consistently some people have suggested [TS]

00:04:08   the triple tap to try to you know I have [TS]

00:04:11   a mulligan in there if one of them [TS]

00:04:12   doesn't register [TS]

00:04:13   sometimes I blame overcast or indoor / [TS]

00:04:16   iOS first taking over cast out of memory [TS]

00:04:19   so that it has to launch again before i [TS]

00:04:21   can start playing and I question whether [TS]

00:04:23   it it registered my taps and doesn't [TS]

00:04:27   have just haven't started playing yet [TS]

00:04:28   sometimes it's so far out of memory that [TS]

00:04:30   it starts playing music despite the last [TS]

00:04:32   thing the fact the last thing I was [TS]

00:04:33   listening to the podcast very confusing [TS]

00:04:36   but anyway [TS]

00:04:37   all that said i'm still using them [TS]

00:04:39   instead of my wired ones the only place [TS]

00:04:41   i've used my wire was recently was [TS]

00:04:43   watching my ipad in case where my ear [TS]

00:04:47   pods were downstairs and it's like well [TS]

00:04:48   i got the wired headphones here and I'm [TS]

00:04:50   not going anywhere i'm just watching [TS]

00:04:52   something on my iPad on my bed or [TS]

00:04:53   something [TS]

00:04:54   I'm like the wireless i'm totally sold [TS]

00:04:56   on and as I mentioned earlier like I [TS]

00:04:58   love the idea of the airport is just how [TS]

00:05:00   incredibly small and pocketable they are [TS]

00:05:02   they don't fit me comfortably and they [TS]

00:05:04   don't really work for my life as a [TS]

00:05:06   result and so that's why I'm not really [TS]

00:05:07   using my tips and more than i am but [TS]

00:05:10   that being said all those limitations [TS]

00:05:12   about what you can and can't easily [TS]

00:05:14   control from them like volume and play [TS]

00:05:16   pause being finicky and stuff like that [TS]

00:05:17   when i switch back to my beloved old [TS]

00:05:22   sennheiser PX 2 10 BTW when it has its [TS]

00:05:25   giant you know that this little like you [TS]

00:05:27   know on a year [TS]

00:05:28   bluetooth said that I've had for a [TS]

00:05:30   couple years now that I walk my dog [TS]

00:05:32   every day with and it just has these big [TS]

00:05:35   plastic buttons on the right earcup and [TS]

00:05:38   I can play pause volume up and down [TS]

00:05:40   seat back seat forward next track [TS]

00:05:42   previous track all with these five [TS]

00:05:43   buttons on the right earcup and it is [TS]

00:05:46   just so convenient and every time I try [TS]

00:05:48   other headphones for a little while to [TS]

00:05:50   review them or talk about on the show [TS]

00:05:52   whatever else [TS]

00:05:53   whenever I go back to my crappy little [TS]

00:05:55   sanitizer bluetooth headphones i am so [TS]

00:05:58   happy with the amount of control and [TS]

00:06:00   comedian that I have them even though [TS]

00:06:01   they sound like crap and they're pretty [TS]

00:06:03   ugly and they are you know still like [TS]

00:06:06   over the head headphones even if they're [TS]

00:06:08   compact ones so they don't fit in any [TS]

00:06:10   pocket really they'll fit jacket pockets [TS]

00:06:12   but not like a pants pocket and it is [TS]

00:06:15   just so nice to have those and I it i've [TS]

00:06:18   tried now I still haven't done a review [TS]

00:06:20   i keep meaning to maybe do video reviews [TS]

00:06:22   and I keep putting it off because it [TS]

00:06:23   turns out videos a lot of work but uh [TS]

00:06:25   I've tried now many high-end bluetooth [TS]

00:06:30   headphones including the air pods but [TS]

00:06:32   also including like all like the the [TS]

00:06:34   former dollar crazy ones from like piano [TS]

00:06:36   and BMW and bows all these other I [TS]

00:06:39   headphone companies and the convenience [TS]

00:06:42   of my relatively cheap bluetooth [TS]

00:06:45   headphones just have big plastic buttons [TS]

00:06:46   on the side cannot be like it is there [TS]

00:06:49   so convenient for everyday use that's [TS]

00:06:52   why i use them for podcast like and I [TS]

00:06:53   would never recommend them for music [TS]

00:06:54   because they sound like they sound like [TS]

00:06:56   trash that they just have the worst [TS]

00:06:58   sound music ever before podcasts totally [TS]

00:07:00   fine and 80 man it's just so nice having [TS]

00:07:03   those physical controls right in the eye [TS]

00:07:05   can operate with gloves on [TS]

00:07:07   i don't use any voice assistance they [TS]

00:07:08   work every single time like it's just [TS]

00:07:10   reliable physical controls and they're [TS]

00:07:13   not sexy and they're not cool but they [TS]

00:07:15   work and it's really hard to beat that [TS]

00:07:17   for me [TS]

00:07:17   yeah if only there was a device you [TS]

00:07:20   could like I don't know strapped to your [TS]

00:07:22   body somehow that would give you all of [TS]

00:07:25   those physical controls and also let you [TS]

00:07:27   like get a text message and also let you [TS]

00:07:29   reply to a text message and also let you [TS]

00:07:32   get other notifications would not be [TS]

00:07:33   awesome [TS]

00:07:34   ok let's go and all i remember I I said [TS]

00:07:36   that it works every time that your cum [TS]

00:07:38   buttons work everytime not eighty [TS]

00:07:40   percent of the time and I can use them [TS]

00:07:42   with gloves on and yeah speaking of that [TS]

00:07:44   i keep forgetting to try that was [TS]

00:07:46   suggested so long ago and still hasn't [TS]

00:07:48   occurred to me to try to give that a try [TS]

00:07:49   by really trying to watch using the [TS]

00:07:51   watch [TS]

00:07:52   yeah but to as as an example of like [TS]

00:07:54   having a physical volume control is [TS]

00:07:55   easier than reaching into my pocket and [TS]

00:07:57   and finding my phone's volume button and [TS]

00:07:59   stuff like that [TS]

00:08:00   truth be told finding the volume button [TS]

00:08:02   is probably easier but it did this is a [TS]

00:08:05   solvable problem it's just that you [TS]

00:08:07   don't want to solve it you don't want it [TS]

00:08:08   to be solved the way it has been solved [TS]

00:08:10   sounds like me in cars let's do so was [TS]

00:08:12   actually a solution i already have it [TS]

00:08:14   was really cheap a few years ago and it [TS]

00:08:16   works perfectly every time and and the [TS]

00:08:19   the newfangled solution is both [TS]

00:08:22   something like four times the price and [TS]

00:08:25   worse so know that this actually is a [TS]

00:08:27   case for the old solution was totally [TS]

00:08:30   fine and the good thing is like this is [TS]

00:08:32   this is one of the areas were like you [TS]

00:08:34   know as you Casey have been an advocate [TS]

00:08:35   for so long [TS]

00:08:37   cheap bluetooth headphones are [TS]

00:08:39   plentiful these days tons of people make [TS]

00:08:41   cheap bluetooth headphones and they're [TS]

00:08:43   largely pretty decent they're not good [TS]

00:08:45   but they're decent and and for their [TS]

00:08:48   price they're usually fairly reasonable [TS]

00:08:50   and these headphones were at the time i [TS]

00:08:54   bought them kind of expensive at [TS]

00:08:56   something like a hundred dollars are [TS]

00:08:57   hundred and ten dollars they're not [TS]

00:08:59   worth more than that if you see them for [TS]

00:09:00   sainthood two people more than that but [TS]

00:09:02   there anymore that really these days [TS]

00:09:05   however that you know these are there [TS]

00:09:06   doesn't like a five-year-old pair of [TS]

00:09:07   headphones [TS]

00:09:08   this is one of the areas where like the [TS]

00:09:09   higher-end headphones the higher-end [TS]

00:09:11   wireless headphones are nicer in certain [TS]

00:09:14   ways they are possibly more portable [TS]

00:09:16   like air pods they are better sounding [TS]

00:09:19   like some of the high-end ones from like [TS]

00:09:20   piano and stuff they are you know better [TS]

00:09:23   noise cancellation and maybe more [TS]

00:09:24   comfortable with their larger on your [TS]

00:09:26   things [TS]

00:09:27   however for practicality of just like [TS]

00:09:29   Wireless wearing them while walking or [TS]

00:09:32   running or around the house doing stuff [TS]

00:09:34   like John cooking the cheap ones with [TS]

00:09:37   plastic buttons on them are actually [TS]

00:09:38   better for almost all purposes for that [TS]

00:09:41   kind of use than the high-end expensive [TS]

00:09:43   ones i'm mostly agree with you if you [TS]

00:09:46   ever need to flip between it devices [TS]

00:09:49   then the air pods or anything really [TS]

00:09:52   with the w1 chip start to make a lot [TS]

00:09:54   more sense but in if you are consistent [TS]

00:09:57   with one machine for example my $25 [TS]

00:10:00   bluetooth headphones i bought literally [TS]

00:10:01   five years ago I believe that are still [TS]

00:10:03   kicking I just don't use them because my [TS]

00:10:05   ear pods I only ever use those with my [TS]

00:10:07   work my work computer and it was great [TS]

00:10:10   you'll see that's the sound was [TS]

00:10:11   acceptable and they had buttons on the [TS]

00:10:15   side if I really needed him although i [TS]

00:10:16   did you know keyboard right in front of [TS]

00:10:17   me but anyway yeah there they work just [TS]

00:10:20   fine and I do agree with you you know I [TS]

00:10:22   i freaking love my ear pods but [TS]

00:10:25   nonetheless if you don't feel like [TS]

00:10:27   spending on sixty dollars on a set of [TS]

00:10:29   little earbuds you can easily spend [TS]

00:10:31   between 20 and a hundred and get [TS]

00:10:33   something that's nearly as good as long [TS]

00:10:35   as you're not switching between devices [TS]

00:10:37   frequently as long as you don't mind a [TS]

00:10:39   giant thing like I would never trade my [TS]

00:10:41   ear pods I would ever go back to Wired [TS]

00:10:43   earbuds before I would go to a big thing [TS]

00:10:45   that goes over my head with a big band [TS]

00:10:46   and put stupid squishy circles on my [TS]

00:10:48   ears like I'm [TS]

00:10:49   humph i want the buds that's what i want [TS]

00:10:51   and so wired or wireless those are my [TS]

00:10:53   choices and then a distant third would [TS]

00:10:55   be okay if I can't have any kind of year [TS]

00:10:57   but then I guess I'll going over your [TS]

00:10:58   thing [TS]

00:10:59   enough all right let's a start the show [TS]

00:11:02   to send a follow up John wanted to tell [TS]

00:11:07   me about a phone contracts and other [TS]

00:11:09   ways that you can make people buy [TS]

00:11:11   iphones if this is much more interesting [TS]

00:11:13   thanks know the last week we talked [TS]

00:11:16   about the different tractors that make [TS]

00:11:17   people feel like they need to get a new [TS]

00:11:20   device on a run faster schedule than [TS]

00:11:23   people apparently and/or supposedly get [TS]

00:11:25   new ipads and I was bringing up the idea [TS]

00:11:28   that phones get dropped and break more [TS]

00:11:30   often than iPads just by their nature so [TS]

00:11:33   that could be one thing that will make [TS]

00:11:34   people turn them over a couple people [TS]

00:11:36   wrote in to bring up the idea of [TS]

00:11:39   contracts which are less prevalent now [TS]

00:11:41   than they used to be in the u.s. it used [TS]

00:11:44   to be that the phone was like oh it's [TS]

00:11:45   you know $200 this phone on a two-year [TS]

00:11:48   contract with all blonde it was just a [TS]

00:11:50   typical money hiding schemes where you [TS]

00:11:52   know human nature makes you not see the [TS]

00:11:54   upfront costs and you read don't do the [TS]

00:11:56   multiplication your head so it seems [TS]

00:11:58   like a cheaper deal these days it seems [TS]

00:12:00   to me that someone who does not buy a [TS]

00:12:02   new phone that often that the shift is [TS]

00:12:04   more towards you bought a new phone [TS]

00:12:05   exactly once [TS]

00:12:07   yeah well now that you know I've i M i [TS]

00:12:10   suppose the I brought my tracfone so [TS]

00:12:12   that I that the movies away from [TS]

00:12:16   contracts and more towards buying them [TS]

00:12:18   up front unlocked [TS]

00:12:20   I don't know if that's a just an iphone [TS]

00:12:22   thing or just my personal experience [TS]

00:12:24   thing but either way [TS]

00:12:25   historically that has been a big [TS]

00:12:27   motivator to get people to buy a new [TS]

00:12:28   phone every few years because it seems [TS]

00:12:30   like a good deal because they hide all [TS]

00:12:32   the costs from you in a way that makes [TS]

00:12:33   your your silly fallible brain feel like [TS]

00:12:37   you're not spending the money that you [TS]

00:12:38   are spending anyone else here for a [TS]

00:12:40   moment [TS]

00:12:41   am I supposed to be paying less on my [TS]

00:12:44   cell phone bill now that I by my phones [TS]

00:12:45   that right because I'm not know you [TS]

00:12:48   shouldn't be but that such as well it [TS]

00:12:51   depends on how bad of a deal you got but [TS]

00:12:53   the strange thing about the deals now is [TS]

00:12:55   that they psychologically see more [TS]

00:12:58   expensive know like mine just is more [TS]

00:13:00   expensive like like so i have AT&T [TS]

00:13:02   and I started by my phones outright not [TS]

00:13:05   taking their subsidies anymore and the [TS]

00:13:07   plans are also the same prices and I [TS]

00:13:09   like I'm not I'm just spending more [TS]

00:13:11   money now [TS]

00:13:12   no you should be spending you should be [TS]

00:13:14   spending a little bit less i'm logging [TS]

00:13:15   into the AT&T right now but what happens [TS]

00:13:17   is the plans cost the same however they [TS]

00:13:23   give you a very peculiar Lee peculiar [TS]

00:13:27   named discount once you're no longer [TS]

00:13:30   subsidizing a phone and it's gonna take [TS]

00:13:32   me like three hours to figure out where [TS]

00:13:34   in my bill this is listed [TS]

00:13:36   yeah they did that I remember hearing [TS]

00:13:37   the same thing from my wife who wrangles [TS]

00:13:40   the the phone contracts that sometimes [TS]

00:13:42   you have to call them to remind them to [TS]

00:13:44   give you the better deal once you're off [TS]

00:13:46   contract and that deal gets discount [TS]

00:13:48   discount for access which is on the [TS]

00:13:51   mainline $25 off your total cost but a [TS]

00:13:54   great because discount for access hole [TS]

00:13:56   actually it's on both lines it's $25 off [TS]

00:13:59   because when I think discount for access [TS]

00:14:01   I think this is offsetting the subsidy [TS]

00:14:03   cost don't you [TS]

00:14:05   that's fantastic yeah whatever it is an [TS]

00:14:08   interesting change that they're getting [TS]

00:14:10   brave enough to reveal the price in a [TS]

00:14:13   way that will register with consumers [TS]

00:14:15   brains in the way that you know is much [TS]

00:14:18   scarier than the old way of like you [TS]

00:14:19   know every new iPhones $200 now every [TS]

00:14:22   new iphone is eight hundred dollars you [TS]

00:14:23   like whoa later dollars it's it's like [TS]

00:14:26   you just didn't do the math before send [TS]

00:14:29   the other factor that people would talk [TS]

00:14:31   about for getting new phones it's gonna [TS]

00:14:33   make you get a new phone before you get [TS]

00:14:35   a new ipad row or even knew you know [TS]

00:14:37   laptop is battery life which you think [TS]

00:14:39   would make a difference cool ipad and [TS]

00:14:40   laptop batteries too but phones [TS]

00:14:42   batteries are really really small and [TS]

00:14:44   they're much closer to the ragged edge [TS]

00:14:46   of acceptable in terms of battery life [TS]

00:14:48   so when the tiny little battery that [TS]

00:14:50   probably is subjected to much harsher [TS]

00:14:52   environmental conditions than your iPad [TS]

00:14:54   or your laptop in terms of putting in [TS]

00:14:57   pockets or maybe leaving in cars and [TS]

00:14:59   stuff like that like I feel like it big [TS]

00:15:01   in the same way of dropping the phone [TS]

00:15:02   goes everywhere with you so there's more [TS]

00:15:05   variability even just being your outside [TS]

00:15:06   jacket pocket during the winter which [TS]

00:15:07   I'm guilty of me know when I'm shoveling [TS]

00:15:09   snow i have my phone in my jacket pocket [TS]

00:15:10   that can't be good for the battery to [TS]

00:15:12   deal with those temperatures anyway the [TS]

00:15:15   phone battery starts to go south [TS]

00:15:17   it's a bad scene you can deal with a [TS]

00:15:20   many years old ipad battery because then [TS]

00:15:23   it drops from 10 hours 25 but because of [TS]

00:15:27   the way we use iPads that's ok but if [TS]

00:15:29   your phone drops from making it in till [TS]

00:15:32   6pm into making it to only 4pm that's a [TS]

00:15:35   no-go and you're gonna be like oh I need [TS]

00:15:36   a new phone because my battery sucks so [TS]

00:15:38   more hardware-based reasons that people [TS]

00:15:41   want new phone soon as they want two [TS]

00:15:42   ipads also there's the Apple whatever [TS]

00:15:46   upgrade program I forget what it's [TS]

00:15:47   called now but I feel like several like [TS]

00:15:51   normal people that I know have started [TS]

00:15:53   doing that was that call it just upgrade [TS]

00:15:55   iphone upgrade program but anyway I feel [TS]

00:15:59   like that [TS]

00:16:00   yes iphone upgrade program and that and [TS]

00:16:02   there are equivalents with each carrier [TS]

00:16:03   that are roughly the same money so I [TS]

00:16:05   feel like that's what's going on is it's [TS]

00:16:07   your sort of kind of leasing your phone [TS]

00:16:09   now I mean honestly this this is really [TS]

00:16:12   a better system [TS]

00:16:14   I mean this is like most of the rest of [TS]

00:16:16   the world outside of the US was we're [TS]

00:16:18   doing systems that were more like this [TS]

00:16:21   long before we were we're like for you [TS]

00:16:23   you little just bought the phone [TS]

00:16:24   outright and then paid like cheaper [TS]

00:16:26   plans like it does make more sense this [TS]

00:16:28   way things are a little bit more honest [TS]

00:16:31   even if even if even though the as usual [TS]

00:16:34   America has taken a straight normal [TS]

00:16:36   honor system and has twisted it and [TS]

00:16:38   sexually that's really confusing and [TS]

00:16:39   complicated and tries to hide all the [TS]

00:16:41   actual cause still called capitalism [TS]

00:16:43   that's called something but uh yeah i [TS]

00:16:47   mean it i think this is still this is [TS]

00:16:49   long-term a better system even if it is [TS]

00:16:51   somewhat confusing in the short term as [TS]

00:16:53   we have made the transition over the [TS]

00:16:55   last few years [TS]

00:16:56   alright John tell me if I take a [TS]

00:17:00   photograph of you flashing me the peace [TS]

00:17:03   sign is that a problem [TS]

00:17:04   this is related to the idea of [TS]

00:17:08   biometrics and how accessible the [TS]

00:17:11   features of your body maybe to other [TS]

00:17:13   people because once they have them and [TS]

00:17:16   if you use them [TS]

00:17:17   as a means of security on your devices [TS]

00:17:19   and you've got a problem because as we [TS]

00:17:21   establish that show your faces indeed [TS]

00:17:23   your face and your fingers are your [TS]

00:17:25   fingers and so I i was about how it is [TS]

00:17:27   easier to get pictures of someone's face [TS]

00:17:30   that is the pictures of their [TS]

00:17:31   fingerprints to articles related to this [TS]

00:17:35   one from Japan where cultural custom is [TS]

00:17:38   to flash the peace sign two fingers up [TS]

00:17:40   in the air in photos and if you do that [TS]

00:17:43   obviously you're facing two of your [TS]

00:17:44   fingerprints right at the camera get [TS]

00:17:47   good enough lighting you get enough [TS]

00:17:48   megapixels you can lift your prints off [TS]

00:17:51   of that so there's an article about that [TS]

00:17:53   happening and being careful about it [TS]

00:17:56   because you are literally showing them [TS]

00:17:57   your fingerprints here they are and you [TS]

00:17:59   know technology is amazing we can lift [TS]

00:18:01   fingerprints format and the second [TS]

00:18:02   article was in a more challenging [TS]

00:18:04   scenario can we pull fingerprints from a [TS]

00:18:07   photo where someone's not flashing a [TS]

00:18:09   peace sign but we just happened to catch [TS]

00:18:11   their finger at the right angle at the [TS]

00:18:13   right time but they would be video or [TS]

00:18:14   still photos and the answer is yes you [TS]

00:18:17   can do that as well if you get the right [TS]

00:18:19   shot all which is scary and all of which [TS]

00:18:22   leads to the idea that especially for [TS]

00:18:25   public figures or people who expect to [TS]

00:18:27   be photographed or people who have [TS]

00:18:29   access to things that are highly [TS]

00:18:31   desirable as opposed to just like your [TS]

00:18:32   personal email account but if you are [TS]

00:18:34   someone who is a head of state or [TS]

00:18:35   something and you're using your [TS]

00:18:37   fingerprints for something important [TS]

00:18:38   than people are highly motivated to get [TS]

00:18:40   them so yeah be careful out there don't [TS]

00:18:44   show people your fingers or your face I [TS]

00:18:45   suppose it just never be photographed in [TS]

00:18:48   any capacity ever [TS]

00:18:49   yep this episode is brought to you by [TS]

00:18:53   Squarespace start building your website [TS]

00:18:55   today at squarespace.com enter offer [TS]

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00:19:02   start today almost any new project or [TS]

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00:19:07   websites and nobody wants to spend a lot [TS]

00:19:10   of time on the website itself you just [TS]

00:19:12   want the website to be there and to be [TS]

00:19:14   awesome and to be easy to design and [TS]

00:19:16   make an update but you don't want to [TS]

00:19:18   have to worry about the actual [TS]

00:19:20   infrastructure that the website is [TS]

00:19:21   running the CMS the hosting and everyone [TS]

00:19:24   that you just want that to be done for [TS]

00:19:25   you in a nice way that you don't have to [TS]

00:19:28   really manage to think about because [TS]

00:19:29   what you really should be thinking about [TS]

00:19:31   what is your project your business [TS]

00:19:33   that's what Squarespace lets you do [TS]

00:19:35   Squarespace is an amazing platform that [TS]

00:19:38   lets you make beautiful professionally [TS]

00:19:40   designed websites it almost no time it [TS]

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00:19:45   what your skill level is from novice to [TS]

00:19:46   expert you can use Squarespace to make a [TS]

00:19:49   beautiful website customized to your [TS]

00:19:50   heart's content in no time if you need [TS]

00:19:53   help [TS]

00:19:53   Squarespace is there for you with [TS]

00:19:55   world-class support if you're making a [TS]

00:19:57   website for somebody else to that's [TS]

00:19:58   especially important because that means [TS]

00:20:00   when you hand over the website to them [TS]

00:20:01   they can ask where space for support [TS]

00:20:04   whenever they needed instead of asking [TS]

00:20:05   you [TS]

00:20:06   it's an incredible platform it's [TS]

00:20:08   incredibly advanced i highly suggest you [TS]

00:20:11   start you try squarespace whenever you [TS]

00:20:13   make a website next for whatever project [TS]

00:20:15   you're doing next start their first see [TS]

00:20:17   what see what you can get done there [TS]

00:20:19   because I bet what you'll find is you [TS]

00:20:21   can get it all done there and then [TS]

00:20:22   you're out what a half hour to just see [TS]

00:20:24   for yourself not even a credit card [TS]

00:20:26   just try it for a half hour see how far [TS]

00:20:29   you get [TS]

00:20:29   I bet you'll be shocked and I bet you'll [TS]

00:20:31   decide you know what this is great i'm [TS]

00:20:33   staying right here this is perfect i'm [TS]

00:20:35   done and then you can get back to your [TS]

00:20:36   actual project instead of us fighting [TS]

00:20:38   with your website for months [TS]

00:20:40   check it out today go to squarespace.com [TS]

00:20:42   enter offer code ATP and check out to [TS]

00:20:45   get ten percent off make your next move [TS]

00:20:47   with a great website at Squarespace [TS]

00:20:53   continuing John can you tell me about [TS]

00:20:55   chromebooks and chrome OS and how that [TS]

00:20:58   relates to our max we talked about the [TS]

00:21:01   arm macromer a idea from slashdot and as [TS]

00:21:05   a Morlock down Mac type system and a lot [TS]

00:21:08   of people brought up Chromebooks which [TS]

00:21:09   we have talked about in the past as an [TS]

00:21:11   example of a very similar type of thing [TS]

00:21:13   that has existed for a while [TS]

00:21:15   it's taking it more of the extreme and [TS]

00:21:16   not only is the Chromebook obviously [TS]

00:21:18   like lockdown in the way that this you [TS]

00:21:23   know fantasize / rumor are Mac was but [TS]

00:21:25   also it shifts everything network which [TS]

00:21:28   this rumor did not mentioning anything [TS]

00:21:30   about the mac being but it all boils [TS]

00:21:32   down to the piece of hardware being more [TS]

00:21:37   robust in the face of user indifference [TS]

00:21:40   and my god how to phrase it like you [TS]

00:21:43   don't have to know how to you can you [TS]

00:21:46   can know less about using a personal [TS]

00:21:48   computer and be successful within the [TS]

00:21:50   same way that you don't need to know as [TS]

00:21:51   much about personal computing to be [TS]

00:21:52   successful with an iPad or an iPhone as [TS]

00:21:54   opposed to a macbook so Chromebooks [TS]

00:21:56   there are far fewer places where you can [TS]

00:21:58   get into trouble software installing [TS]

00:22:00   software is more straightforward the [TS]

00:22:02   number of things you can do to it mess [TS]

00:22:04   it up as much lower the overall system [TS]

00:22:06   is simpler obviously Chromebook and [TS]

00:22:08   chrome OS are far cry from the mac [TS]

00:22:11   operating system with a heavy focus on [TS]

00:22:13   doing stuff with web technologies [TS]

00:22:15   through a browser with many things being [TS]

00:22:18   put into the cloud and i think thats [TS]

00:22:19   implication in fact is a big advantage [TS]

00:22:21   Chromebooks have over any of apples [TS]

00:22:23   devices the aggressively count cloud [TS]

00:22:27   centric focus that this thing you're [TS]

00:22:29   holding your hand is nothing everything [TS]

00:22:31   you do if you have access to the network [TS]

00:22:33   is saves than at work aggressively so [TS]

00:22:37   that pretty much at any point when [TS]

00:22:38   you're working on a Chromebook you can [TS]

00:22:40   do a five-count and throw the thing out [TS]

00:22:42   the window into a lake and then go get [TS]

00:22:44   another Chromebook back room and sign-in [TS]

00:22:46   and resume where you left off [TS]

00:22:48   you cannot do that with any Apple device [TS]

00:22:49   right that's the dream of the Chromebook [TS]

00:22:51   I've always thought it was a brilliant [TS]

00:22:52   idea perhaps not very well executed but [TS]

00:22:55   every time we talk about ipads or max [TS]

00:22:58   especially as they relate to education [TS]

00:23:00   people come out of the woodwork to tell [TS]

00:23:02   us how Chromebooks are kicking apples [TS]

00:23:04   but in education because what a dream [TS]

00:23:07   machine [TS]

00:23:07   you educational institutions do not want [TS]

00:23:09   to deal with wrangling computers or [TS]

00:23:12   software anything like that you have a [TS]

00:23:14   bunch of computers that you're gonna put [TS]

00:23:15   a bunch of students in front of that's [TS]

00:23:17   just you know that they're gonna do [TS]

00:23:19   everything they can to mess things up [TS]

00:23:21   and even if they don't the computers [TS]

00:23:23   like eventually we'll mess themselves up [TS]

00:23:25   especially if there are you know if it's [TS]

00:23:27   windows and we're in a decade ago I [TS]

00:23:29   assume it's better now [TS]

00:23:30   Chromebooks are very results are iPads [TS]

00:23:32   for that matter but Chromebooks even [TS]

00:23:34   more so in that they they are resistant [TS]

00:23:37   to slowly degrading and or being [TS]

00:23:40   compromised by devious students and [TS]

00:23:43   there's lots of good tools for managing [TS]

00:23:46   fleets of these things that were having [TS]

00:23:47   multiple students signed into them and [TS]

00:23:49   apples made some strides here with their [TS]

00:23:51   weird multi-user sign in and out sync [TS]

00:23:53   everything from iCloud things they've [TS]

00:23:55   been doing with the ipad lately but [TS]

00:23:56   Chromebooks almost always been on price [TS]

00:24:00   you can get cheap crappy ones and you [TS]

00:24:01   know cash-strapped school of that and [TS]

00:24:04   they're doing very well in management i [TS]

00:24:06   always wonder if Apple cares that much [TS]

00:24:09   about that market or did they just like [TS]

00:24:11   the rest of the many markets that isn't [TS]

00:24:12   too high into that market they just want [TS]

00:24:13   to sell ipads to the rich schools and [TS]

00:24:15   let everyone else have chrome books or [TS]

00:24:16   something but I worry that the value [TS]

00:24:21   proposition represented by Chromebooks [TS]

00:24:23   in the ideal if not in in actuality is [TS]

00:24:26   not falling on deaf ears at Apple but is [TS]

00:24:30   not valued by the people inside Apple as [TS]

00:24:32   much as it should be because talk about [TS]

00:24:34   future of computing many of the aspects [TS]

00:24:36   promised by Chromebooks and many of them [TS]

00:24:39   delivered by Chromebooks definitely feel [TS]

00:24:41   more like the future of computing in [TS]

00:24:43   terms of having to worry less about [TS]

00:24:45   managing the Machine and having to worry [TS]

00:24:48   less about the machine itself because in [TS]

00:24:50   in a network connected world [TS]

00:24:52   yes you can work offline but it would be [TS]

00:24:54   great if the source of truth with some [TS]

00:24:56   place fast and reliable that is not [TS]

00:24:57   sitting in front of you [TS]

00:24:59   well this is part of what last last week [TS]

00:25:01   we were talking about that that rumored [TS]

00:25:03   slashdot comment lockdown [TS]

00:25:05   next-generation our mac [TS]

00:25:07   even though again disclaim already that [TS]

00:25:10   was very unlikely to be true [TS]

00:25:12   however one thing I forgot to mention [TS]

00:25:13   during my rant about how good that might [TS]

00:25:16   be is that that might address the [TS]

00:25:18   Chromebook market pretty well to like [TS]

00:25:20   that wouldn't have to be a high-end [TS]

00:25:22   hardware device that could run on ipad [TS]

00:25:25   class hardware and be passable and so [TS]

00:25:28   they they could if Apple wanted to [TS]

00:25:31   address this market which you as you [TS]

00:25:32   pointed out they might not want to [TS]

00:25:34   although i think it's aight i'm with you [TS]

00:25:36   i think they they should address it if [TS]

00:25:39   they reasonably can which is not save [TS]

00:25:42   definitely yes or no but I think if they [TS]

00:25:43   if they reasonably can address that i [TS]

00:25:45   think they should because having mass [TS]

00:25:48   numbers of students growing up using all [TS]

00:25:51   google services on all google computers [TS]

00:25:53   is probably not good for Apple long-term [TS]

00:25:55   but that being said if Apple could take [TS]

00:25:58   that kind of next-gen mac on arm concept [TS]

00:26:01   and make a very low and hardware device [TS]

00:26:04   that was basically like you know mid [TS]

00:26:06   generation ipad level hardware like [TS]

00:26:08   suppose that is two years away they [TS]

00:26:10   could take two days like ipad air 2 [TS]

00:26:12   hardware sell it in two years in this [TS]

00:26:15   little like you know macbook one size [TS]

00:26:17   case for 400 bucks maybe I mean like it [TS]

00:26:21   that could actually get them get them a [TS]

00:26:24   lot of the way there and that and that [TS]

00:26:26   and that OS is additional lockdown miss [TS]

00:26:29   and easy management an easy secured and [TS]

00:26:31   everything would all help in that regard [TS]

00:26:33   to so i think that one that one of the [TS]

00:26:36   things that that made me consider that [TS]

00:26:38   that comment as possibly interesting and [TS]

00:26:41   possibly plausible is that Apple has to [TS]

00:26:45   be feeling there they have to be feeling [TS]

00:26:49   like to hurt a little bit from the [TS]

00:26:51   massive success of Chromebooks and [TS]

00:26:52   schools they have to be feeling that on [TS]

00:26:54   some level whether they choose your [TS]

00:26:55   dress yet is another question but I [TS]

00:26:57   think if they're going to address it [TS]

00:26:58   that hypothetical lockdown are Mac would [TS]

00:27:01   be a really nice way to address it [TS]

00:27:03   because obviously they can try pushing [TS]

00:27:05   iPads they have as much as they want and [TS]

00:27:07   they have gotten decent numbers of ipads [TS]

00:27:09   sold into schools but there's a reason [TS]

00:27:11   why those Chromebooks keep selling so [TS]

00:27:13   well and and a big reason is price no [TS]

00:27:14   question and it's you know again it's [TS]

00:27:17   question whether Apple is is willing to [TS]

00:27:19   or should compete [TS]

00:27:21   on price to that level but also a big a [TS]

00:27:23   big reason for that is that a lot of [TS]

00:27:26   schools and students do prefer working [TS]

00:27:29   on some kind of laptop shaped device [TS]

00:27:31   with a laptop keyboard instead like it [TS]

00:27:34   yes you can put keyboards and iPads but [TS]

00:27:37   we all know from trying that like that's [TS]

00:27:39   not really what they're great at that's [TS]

00:27:40   not really but they're designed for and [TS]

00:27:42   if you're trying to manage a fleet of [TS]

00:27:44   student devices the last thing you want [TS]

00:27:46   is detachable expensive accessories you [TS]

00:27:49   know you wanted to be one integrated [TS]

00:27:50   unit you can manage the one in the [TS]

00:27:51   ground unit so that actually might be [TS]

00:27:55   part of their strategy to combat [TS]

00:27:56   Chromebooks long-term and if it isn't I [TS]

00:27:58   think it might be worth considering [TS]

00:27:59   whether it should so this is yet another [TS]

00:28:02   time we have to bring up that one of the [TS]

00:28:04   big advantages google has in terms of [TS]

00:28:05   management is the fact they do do [TS]

00:28:07   everything server side and that is [TS]

00:28:08   google strength and historically has not [TS]

00:28:10   been Apple strength to have a very [TS]

00:28:12   robust cloud services with the source of [TS]

00:28:16   truth is in the cloud not on the device [TS]

00:28:18   in the same way you know it doesn't [TS]

00:28:21   necessarily have to be web-based tools [TS]

00:28:22   like Google Docs up which by the way is [TS]

00:28:25   an extensive use in schools i'm using it [TS]

00:28:29   work now too and we mentioned before we [TS]

00:28:32   use it for our show notes it's it's the [TS]

00:28:35   point where like I'm waiting for it to [TS]

00:28:39   unseat microsoft word the entire [TS]

00:28:40   corporate world i know that's going to [TS]

00:28:41   take so freaking long but o among [TS]

00:28:44   certain wings of large corporations it [TS]

00:28:46   is possible to do this place word and [TS]

00:28:48   everybody is happier and seeing my kids [TS]

00:28:49   do everything google access like Marco [TS]

00:28:51   Verratti view if you grew up doing that [TS]

00:28:52   you just like a word-processing equals [TS]

00:28:54   google docs and his google docs work you [TS]

00:28:57   need servers the service needs to be [TS]

00:28:58   reliable they need to be fast need to be [TS]

00:29:01   always up things not lose data google is [TS]

00:29:04   really good at that Apple is not as good [TS]

00:29:08   at it so that's one weakness Apple [TS]

00:29:10   hasn't in doing that and the other [TS]

00:29:11   reason I think Apple should be thinking [TS]

00:29:13   about this market where Chromebooks are [TS]

00:29:14   giving them a run for their money with [TS]

00:29:15   iPads and everything is like it is a [TS]

00:29:19   demanding environment public schools [TS]

00:29:22   with a bunch of kids messing with your [TS]

00:29:25   stuff is demanding physically speaking [TS]

00:29:28   is demanding from a management [TS]

00:29:29   perspective because you have a lot of [TS]

00:29:31   devices you have people managing them [TS]

00:29:32   who perhaps are not [TS]

00:29:34   the most technically savvy because [TS]

00:29:35   that's not their job like teachers have [TS]

00:29:37   to deal with them and they don't they [TS]

00:29:38   want to be teachers they don't want to [TS]

00:29:39   be like IT managers right so the easier [TS]

00:29:42   it is to manage the better but in like [TS]

00:29:46   making a device that is successful in [TS]

00:29:49   that environment like that is very [TS]

00:29:50   hostile much more hostile than corporate [TS]

00:29:51   IT much more hostile than an individual [TS]

00:29:54   user's house who buys the thing and post [TS]

00:29:56   unboxing video and treats you like a [TS]

00:29:57   little perfect baby right schools are [TS]

00:29:59   brutal but in the same way that cock so [TS]

00:30:03   good grips company that I believe I [TS]

00:30:06   don't know it was founded on this or was [TS]

00:30:07   this originally but the story I've [TS]

00:30:09   always heard and I like it's all keep [TS]

00:30:10   repeating as if it's true [TS]

00:30:12   was that they were making tools for [TS]

00:30:14   people with arthritis and other sort of [TS]

00:30:17   motor difficulties with their hands if [TS]

00:30:19   you have trouble operating a regular can [TS]

00:30:20   opener try the ox 0 can opener because i [TS]

00:30:23   know i know you can't like it hurts to [TS]

00:30:25   turn a regular can opener but here we [TS]

00:30:28   have one that has very grippy material [TS]

00:30:30   and a big rounded attorney thing with [TS]

00:30:32   lots of leverage and so you know and it [TS]

00:30:35   turns out good old turns out everyone [TS]

00:30:37   loves it [TS]

00:30:38   if you make two lists that are easy that [TS]

00:30:41   are easy for people to use who have hand [TS]

00:30:43   mobility of strength problems people who [TS]

00:30:46   do not have hand or mobility of strength [TS]

00:30:48   problems also love them because they're [TS]

00:30:50   just better tools they give you better [TS]

00:30:52   mechanical advantage they work more [TS]

00:30:54   smoothly so if you make something for an [TS]

00:30:56   environment that is demanding in some [TS]

00:30:59   way [TS]

00:30:59   o our customers only have this amount of [TS]

00:31:02   hand strengthen the average adult has [TS]

00:31:03   five times that can you make an open to [TS]

00:31:07   the works and if you successfully do [TS]

00:31:09   that you haven't made all this is only a [TS]

00:31:11   nice device for people who have mobility [TS]

00:31:13   problems with their hands know what [TS]

00:31:15   you've made is an amazing can opener so [TS]

00:31:17   if you make a laptop that can survive [TS]

00:31:20   and continue functioning and be [TS]

00:31:22   manageable by teachers and students in a [TS]

00:31:24   public school environment you just [TS]

00:31:25   happen to have also made an awesome [TS]

00:31:27   laptop that you can put into the guys [TS]

00:31:29   house who's going to you know treat it [TS]

00:31:30   like a perfect little baby and always [TS]

00:31:32   liked do everything nice within read [TS]

00:31:33   articles about and all that stuff [TS]

00:31:34   they'll love it too because guess what [TS]

00:31:37   it's just easier to manage it works more [TS]

00:31:39   often there are fewer problems that is [TS]

00:31:41   just a better product all around so I [TS]

00:31:43   would never want to see Apple surrender [TS]

00:31:46   this market if all [TS]

00:31:47   because it acts as a crucible for [TS]

00:31:49   testing the the the durability of every [TS]

00:31:54   part of your product from the harbor to [TS]

00:31:55   the software to the management the whole [TS]

00:31:57   nine yards [TS]

00:31:58   let's talk about a hour elling who [TS]

00:32:01   writes i bought my first mac pro for [TS]

00:32:03   work last year since my job is what [TS]

00:32:05   development and thus I target that the [TS]

00:32:07   the target is obviously linux I chose to [TS]

00:32:09   go case sensitive to avoid trouble as [TS]

00:32:12   much as possible [TS]

00:32:14   I've been burned by windows k Sigma and [TS]

00:32:15   file system in the past [TS]

00:32:17   given how long OS 10 hfs+ being have [TS]

00:32:21   been around i expected that most modern [TS]

00:32:24   software would run on either set up but [TS]

00:32:26   now have learned that both steam and [TS]

00:32:29   adobe creative suite will not run on my [TS]

00:32:31   machine unless every 4matic loops i [TS]

00:32:33   would love to hear your opinion on the [TS]

00:32:34   state of this and who you think is to [TS]

00:32:37   blame for this mess [TS]

00:32:38   John as our file system expert humans [TS]

00:32:41   are to blame as always [TS]

00:32:43   so yeah the case sensitive vs instance [TS]

00:32:45   of HFS plus + hrs before it and MF s I [TS]

00:32:49   believe we're all case-insensitive made [TS]

00:32:53   you could not have two files whose [TS]

00:32:56   filenames different only in [TS]

00:32:57   capitalization and there's a whole bunch [TS]

00:32:58   of unicode normalization rules revolving [TS]

00:33:02   around that let's just talk about ascii [TS]

00:33:03   capital lowercase letters you had a file [TS]

00:33:06   name my file all caps you could not have [TS]

00:33:09   a file right next to it in the same [TS]

00:33:10   directory called my file all lowercase [TS]

00:33:12   cause guess what hfs+ does not [TS]

00:33:14   distinguish between those which is [TS]

00:33:17   mostly human factors choice on the [TS]

00:33:19   original mac because regular people [TS]

00:33:21   don't consider those different things [TS]

00:33:23   like find me the file name Jerry no not [TS]

00:33:27   the one with the lowercase J the moment [TS]

00:33:28   the capital j being able to not having [TS]

00:33:32   files a different in case because people [TS]

00:33:34   will type the wrong file names into [TS]

00:33:35   think they didn't save and stuff like [TS]

00:33:36   that so it is an important user [TS]

00:33:37   interface thing but they implanted down [TS]

00:33:39   at the file system level which means not [TS]

00:33:41   only does the interface present in that [TS]

00:33:43   way but you physically can't save files [TS]

00:33:47   to differ on the incase now why would [TS]

00:33:48   anybody want files differently it [TS]

00:33:49   sometimes case it contains information [TS]

00:33:51   if you have acronyms or abbreviations or [TS]

00:33:55   other type of things in your file names [TS]

00:33:57   and they happen to spot words like a ND [TS]

00:34:00   or something and [TS]

00:34:01   happen to have another file name that [TS]

00:34:02   has the lower case because they wanted [TS]

00:34:03   the thing and you know case does have [TS]

00:34:05   meaning in some cases but the most [TS]

00:34:08   important reason that case insensitivity [TS]

00:34:10   the historic multi-decade case in [TS]

00:34:12   sensitivity on the mac is a potentially [TS]

00:34:15   problem is if you ever change your mind [TS]

00:34:19   yoursay actually we've decided for the [TS]

00:34:21   future that's people don't really deal [TS]

00:34:22   with the process and how much anyway say [TS]

00:34:23   on your phones on your iOS devices where [TS]

00:34:25   people don't see the file system we [TS]

00:34:29   don't need that extra complexity because [TS]

00:34:30   it is an extra complexity every time you [TS]

00:34:31   look up a file you have to see if [TS]

00:34:33   there's any variation that van on that [TS]

00:34:34   files case in the same thing for writing [TS]

00:34:36   a file you have to make sure no files [TS]

00:34:37   exist with any variation of that finance [TS]

00:34:39   case and practically speaking lots of [TS]

00:34:43   software made for other platforms likes [TS]

00:34:45   a unique software open source software [TS]

00:34:46   has files that are part of either the [TS]

00:34:49   source code or the actual operation of [TS]

00:34:51   the of the the binaries in practice that [TS]

00:34:54   differently in case and if you can't [TS]

00:34:57   store them on the file system you can [TS]

00:34:58   even like intar you know the source of [TS]

00:35:02   an open-source tool and build it because [TS]

00:35:03   it's got lowercase C files about capital [TS]

00:35:05   C files because someone thought capital [TS]

00:35:07   C was great for c++ you know many [TS]

00:35:10   decades ago and it will either puke or [TS]

00:35:13   just randomly overwrite files and you [TS]

00:35:15   will have things don't build their this [TS]

00:35:17   plenty of open source software that has [TS]

00:35:19   plain old source files and food at sea [TS]

00:35:21   and capital f 00 dot C in the same [TS]

00:35:24   directory that this happens its thing [TS]

00:35:26   and if you can't deal with it at all he [TS]

00:35:29   has to make like disk images or virtual [TS]

00:35:31   machines are all sorts of stuff like [TS]

00:35:32   that but the real whammy is for decades [TS]

00:35:37   and decades the mac has been like this [TS]

00:35:39   and human beings have been writing [TS]

00:35:41   software for the mac and those human [TS]

00:35:44   beings have put file paths in their [TS]

00:35:48   software they've written code that reads [TS]

00:35:50   things from the file system based on [TS]

00:35:52   their path and a surprising amount of [TS]

00:35:55   time those file paths that the software [TS]

00:35:58   is trying to read from the file system [TS]

00:36:00   do not match the case of the files on [TS]

00:36:02   disk and nobody notices when you run it [TS]

00:36:05   on a case-insensitive file system [TS]

00:36:06   because if you were looking for you know [TS]

00:36:08   you know file dot com for the where the [TS]

00:36:12   eff is capital but on the on the file [TS]

00:36:14   system is actually lower case your [TS]

00:36:16   program works fine because it says open [TS]

00:36:17   be filed by comp with the capital after [TS]

00:36:19   this as I here i found it opens lower [TS]

00:36:21   case file that comes and you're good to [TS]

00:36:22   go because that's how the api's work you [TS]

00:36:25   try to run that ok sensitive file system [TS]

00:36:27   and the wheels fall off the wagon all of [TS]

00:36:29   a sudden the thing doesn't work can't [TS]

00:36:31   even start up you know you're using it [TS]

00:36:33   does weird stuff in it doesn't function [TS]

00:36:34   correctly and steam which isn't even [TS]

00:36:38   that long on the mac platform i guess [TS]

00:36:39   it's been a few years now but adobe [TS]

00:36:41   creative suite has deep roots lots of [TS]

00:36:43   complicated software inevitably has some [TS]

00:36:46   part that either assumes case in [TS]

00:36:48   sensitivity as like a foundational [TS]

00:36:51   assumptions of some section of the code [TS]

00:36:52   or accidentally assumes case in [TS]

00:36:54   sensitivity by looking up files based on [TS]

00:36:57   paths that don't match the actual case [TS]

00:36:58   of the files on disk or you know very [TS]

00:37:01   more complicated variations of that [TS]

00:37:02   we're one part of the thing will write a [TS]

00:37:04   file the other thing will read it but [TS]

00:37:06   they won't agree on the case and it's [TS]

00:37:07   just there are so many places where [TS]

00:37:09   things go wrong and this is where the [TS]

00:37:10   conventional wisdom goes that if you [TS]

00:37:11   format your mac as case-sensitive be [TS]

00:37:14   prepared for a whole bunch of your [TS]

00:37:15   software not to work and for your only [TS]

00:37:17   alternative to be to reformat is [TS]

00:37:19   case-insensitive get stopped working you [TS]

00:37:20   might say well why doesn't everyone just [TS]

00:37:22   fix their software [TS]

00:37:23   well it's a chicken egg thing we need to [TS]

00:37:24   fix this offer because nobody runs [TS]

00:37:26   case-sensitive hfs+ on their macs and no [TS]

00:37:29   one's HFS case-sensitive a transponder [TS]

00:37:31   max because now the software works and [TS]

00:37:33   so they're an impasse their iOS devices [TS]

00:37:36   that make a sensitive from day one which [TS]

00:37:37   is a wise choice so there's there are [TS]

00:37:39   not a bunch of iOS developers out there [TS]

00:37:41   writing applications that expect to read [TS]

00:37:43   files with past them at the case could [TS]

00:37:44   guess what they wouldn't work so that's [TS]

00:37:46   great but with a PFS i'm not even sure [TS]

00:37:50   what they're gonna end up doing on the [TS]

00:37:51   mat because the apms is not officially [TS]

00:37:53   released on the maggots only on iOS but [TS]

00:37:56   it one way to solve the chicken egg [TS]

00:37:58   thing and say hey guess what a PFS is [TS]

00:37:59   case-sensitive only I can't imagine them [TS]

00:38:01   doing that because as we can see adobe [TS]

00:38:03   creative suite and steam wouldn't work [TS]

00:38:05   as an obscure applications so yeah so [TS]

00:38:09   sorry bad news you probably have to [TS]

00:38:11   reformat your disk as case insensitive [TS]

00:38:13   to get your software to work again [TS]

00:38:14   inscrutable humans got you again [TS]

00:38:18   it yeah you know by the way is marco was [TS]

00:38:23   like this marker happening mac apps do [TS]

00:38:24   that it's like it's a good thing if you [TS]

00:38:26   write it at an application or any kind [TS]

00:38:28   of song for the mac to find out do you [TS]

00:38:30   have these kind of problems in your [TS]

00:38:31   summer because you'll never know if you [TS]

00:38:32   just run a regular mac all the time but [TS]

00:38:34   you'll be surprised they're lurking i [TS]

00:38:35   probably have them in my stupid blog [TS]

00:38:37   system that I used to publish my blog [TS]

00:38:39   once a year because i've only ever run [TS]

00:38:40   it from a case-insensitive file system [TS]

00:38:42   is probably in that tiny little piece of [TS]

00:38:44   code someplace where i do something [TS]

00:38:46   stupid about case without that's respond [TS]

00:38:49   to this week by eero go to ero calm and [TS]

00:38:52   use promo code ATP at checkout to get [TS]

00:38:55   free expedited shipping Wi-Fi in our [TS]

00:38:57   houses just isn't good enough when you [TS]

00:39:00   only have one router which is the model [TS]

00:39:01   we've been sold on forever no matter how [TS]

00:39:03   many antennas you put on no matter how [TS]

00:39:05   high powered it is there's gonna be dead [TS]

00:39:07   spots and weak spots in most houses or [TS]

00:39:09   apartments we've all been there we all [TS]

00:39:11   have like the one room where the Wi-Fi [TS]

00:39:13   only gets like one little arcade doesn't [TS]

00:39:14   really work that you hold the ipad [TS]

00:39:16   upside down [TS]

00:39:16   I've actually done that and this just is [TS]

00:39:19   not a very good system for today we have [TS]

00:39:20   so many Wi-Fi devices that depend on a [TS]

00:39:23   solid connection in our homes you know [TS]

00:39:25   it [TS]

00:39:25   what year is this we should have [TS]

00:39:26   reliable Wi-Fi in our entire houses an [TS]

00:39:29   ear let us do that by having multiple [TS]

00:39:31   access points work together from [TS]

00:39:33   different points in the house to this [TS]

00:39:34   blanket your entire place in solid [TS]

00:39:37   strong fast Wi-Fi coverage the way to do [TS]

00:39:40   this so they sell the little 0 units [TS]

00:39:42   that they're kinda size of an apple tv's [TS]

00:39:44   little nicely designed little things and [TS]

00:39:46   you plug one of them in the same we plug [TS]

00:39:48   in any other Wi-Fi router you plug it [TS]

00:39:49   into your internet connection so you [TS]

00:39:51   know where that is and then you can plug [TS]

00:39:52   the other ones in anywhere else in your [TS]

00:39:54   house and they talk to each other over a [TS]

00:39:56   separate mesh network they make and then [TS]

00:39:58   they blanket your home in pure [TS]

00:40:00   high-speed Wi-Fi from each one and they [TS]

00:40:02   all work together to form one giant [TS]

00:40:04   network its way faster than traditional [TS]

00:40:06   repeaters or anything like that because [TS]

00:40:08   of the seventh-best network thing check [TS]

00:40:11   out the reviews you will see for [TS]

00:40:12   yourself and they sent us some too and [TS]

00:40:15   we try to map we've had similarly great [TS]

00:40:16   experiences heroes are fast and they are [TS]

00:40:20   so easy to set up with their app and [TS]

00:40:21   they have tons of great features they [TS]

00:40:23   have things like parental controls and [TS]

00:40:25   all sorts of new features being added in [TS]

00:40:27   very very easy-to-use app all the time [TS]

00:40:30   they've added so many features already [TS]

00:40:31   been sold out for [TS]

00:40:32   a year so many had so many features [TS]

00:40:33   already is very highly rated x rated [TS]

00:40:35   currently 4.4 stars and Amazon with over [TS]

00:40:38   750 reviews [TS]

00:40:40   there's a there's a one-year warranty [TS]

00:40:42   there's a return period if you don't [TS]

00:40:43   like it [TS]

00:40:44   check it out we highly recommend 0 it is [TS]

00:40:47   so much better than just using one [TS]

00:40:48   router go to 0 comments the ero calm and [TS]

00:40:52   use code ATP at checkout to get free [TS]

00:40:54   expedited shipping [TS]

00:40:56   thank you very much 20 for sponsoring [TS]

00:40:57   our show once again [TS]

00:40:59   ah so John happy birthday to you [TS]

00:41:07   your birthday was actually what a month [TS]

00:41:10   and a half ago but the gods have [TS]

00:41:13   delivered you the ultimate birthday [TS]

00:41:15   present [TS]

00:41:17   sort of what's uh what's going on [TS]

00:41:20   Kickstarter these days John my favorite [TS]

00:41:23   twitter client has been from the moment [TS]

00:41:27   i started using twitter twitter epic [TS]

00:41:29   which I think was the very first twitter [TS]

00:41:31   client [TS]

00:41:32   certainly it was the first thing I ever [TS]

00:41:34   used Twitter with I did not sign up for [TS]

00:41:36   twitter based on their terrible website [TS]

00:41:37   I only signed up for it once [TS]

00:41:39   twitterrific without my car out this [TS]

00:41:41   this is a good thing to do you know if [TS]

00:41:43   it wasn't like truly the first app that [TS]

00:41:44   uses twitter api it was at least the [TS]

00:41:46   first app that anyone ever used that [TS]

00:41:48   uses twitter api and it was by far the [TS]

00:41:51   first app that mattered [TS]

00:41:52   yeah and so it was an iOS app and there [TS]

00:41:55   was a but before that there was a mac [TS]

00:41:57   app i think the backup came first anyway [TS]

00:41:59   yeah so Twitter clients have had a bumpy [TS]

00:42:03   road a couple years back Twitter decided [TS]

00:42:05   that didn't really want third parties to [TS]

00:42:06   make apps and it started this whole [TS]

00:42:08   thing where you can only make apps if [TS]

00:42:09   you have these special tokens and his [TS]

00:42:11   limited number of those the song [TS]

00:42:12   absolute grandfathered in and by the way [TS]

00:42:14   a bunch of new features are rolling out [TS]

00:42:15   can't be used by third-party clients you [TS]

00:42:17   really don't like you third-party [TS]

00:42:18   clients and it's made the market for [TS]

00:42:21   twitter apps very difficult for [TS]

00:42:22   third-party towards very difficult [TS]

00:42:24   Twitter her iOS has continued to be [TS]

00:42:27   updated nevertheless gone through many [TS]

00:42:28   major revisions and if you were to go [TS]

00:42:30   buy it on the app store today which i [TS]

00:42:32   recommend it is a great trap [TS]

00:42:34   I've never I've never waver despite also [TS]

00:42:37   buying many other twitter apps and [TS]

00:42:38   having them installed either left or if [TS]

00:42:40   it's because of its unified timeline [TS]

00:42:41   where it makes everything that has [TS]

00:42:43   happened on Twitter I related to the [TS]

00:42:45   people you follow a single list sorted [TS]

00:42:48   by time mentions tweets direct messages [TS]

00:42:51   your own tweets that go out just all [TS]

00:42:53   ordered by time that's it you know you [TS]

00:42:55   can view them separately if you want but [TS]

00:42:57   i like it just be one big list that's [TS]

00:42:58   the unified timeline anyway the mac [TS]

00:43:00   client on the other hand has not been [TS]

00:43:02   updated in many many years because it [TS]

00:43:04   just hasn't been economically feasible [TS]

00:43:06   to update it because the market for [TS]

00:43:08   third-party Mac Twitter clients is just [TS]

00:43:11   not sustainable anymore [TS]

00:43:13   the market for third-party iOS to the [TS]

00:43:16   clients basically barely sustainably so [TS]

00:43:18   many people use the official app and [TS]

00:43:20   there are still features that you can [TS]

00:43:21   only do in the official app I hate the [TS]

00:43:23   official app even though i have [TS]

00:43:24   installed [TS]

00:43:25   oh it's the warning i don't understand [TS]

00:43:28   how anyone uses it [TS]

00:43:29   it's confusing to people people use [TS]

00:43:31   their twitter and all sorts of different [TS]

00:43:32   ways so I happen to know a some of the [TS]

00:43:37   people who work at icon factory who make [TS]

00:43:40   twitterrific and for many years I have [TS]

00:43:41   been begging them half-jokingly to fix [TS]

00:43:45   whatever the mac which by the way i [TS]

00:43:46   continue to use despite the fact that it [TS]

00:43:49   is slowly crumbling like you know when [TS]

00:43:51   they added the thing where the tweets [TS]

00:43:52   can be longer than you would have [TS]

00:43:54   expected and we would like it doesn't [TS]

00:43:58   count like the mentions that everything [TS]

00:43:59   towards the URLs are mentions towards [TS]

00:44:01   the character camp some some change [TS]

00:44:03   related to the length of of tweets and [TS]

00:44:06   if you don't support like the new longer [TS]

00:44:09   tweet thing what you get from the old [TS]

00:44:12   version of the API is a tweet that is [TS]

00:44:15   truncated and it goes like it like [TS]

00:44:17   towards the end of the tweeters goes dot [TS]

00:44:19   and then has a URL but you can click on [TS]

00:44:21   to read the whole tweet on Twitter [TS]

00:44:22   website that's what long tweets look [TS]

00:44:24   like and twitter for the mac and yet i [TS]

00:44:26   still continue to use that I can't I [TS]

00:44:28   can't do so many things from the mac [TS]

00:44:30   version of the client that I can do from [TS]

00:44:32   the iOS one but I still continue to use [TS]

00:44:33   it because i like it and every other mac [TS]

00:44:35   client that I've tried i dislike [TS]

00:44:37   strongly in some way so I I really [TS]

00:44:40   wished for Twitter its comeback comeback [TS]

00:44:43   but I understood like look you can't you [TS]

00:44:45   know if it's not a viable arc is not [TS]

00:44:47   available market even offered to pay up [TS]

00:44:49   seeing amounts of money [TS]

00:44:50   for whatever put it back in fact I [TS]

00:44:53   believe it was only last week or the [TS]

00:44:55   week before that you said I would pay a [TS]

00:44:57   hundred dollars for updated version of [TS]

00:44:59   terrific for the Mac I've said that many [TS]

00:45:01   times and I may or may not have been [TS]

00:45:03   saying that because i may or may not [TS]

00:45:04   have known about this project a plan but [TS]

00:45:06   anyway now there's a Kickstarter like [TS]

00:45:11   everything thing that we've joked about [TS]

00:45:12   for so many years like how much money [TS]

00:45:14   would it take to fund the number of [TS]

00:45:15   developers who need to make this [TS]

00:45:17   application let's just do a Kickstarter [TS]

00:45:18   and if enough people want Twitter her [TS]

00:45:22   for the mac they will find this thing [TS]

00:45:24   and they will make this application like [TS]

00:45:26   it's it's an easy way to know that yes [TS]

00:45:28   you will have the money to pay for the [TS]

00:45:30   development of this project because you [TS]

00:45:31   get the money upfront ish in exchange [TS]

00:45:34   for the application so i'm not i have [TS]

00:45:37   back to this kickstarter I'm not going [TS]

00:45:39   to tell you how much money i pledge but [TS]

00:45:41   it was a lot of it they are the goal is [TS]

00:45:46   75,000 but i want you all to ignore that [TS]

00:45:49   because the real goal is a hundred [TS]

00:45:50   thousand to stretch the so-called [TS]

00:45:52   stretch goal because the stretch goal [TS]

00:45:54   includes all the features that i want [TS]

00:45:55   including fairly essential things like [TS]

00:45:57   direct messaging so I really want this [TS]

00:45:59   kickstarter to get 200,000 if it doesn't [TS]

00:46:01   it will just be proving what i can [TS]

00:46:02   factor has been saying all along is [TS]

00:46:04   there's just not enough people who want [TS]

00:46:06   this who are going to pay for it even [TS]

00:46:08   though some of us are paying very much [TS]

00:46:10   more than five dollars for the privilege [TS]

00:46:12   of having this application so you may [TS]

00:46:15   not like using Twitter on the mac period [TS]

00:46:18   because many people just don't use it on [TS]

00:46:19   the mac at all maybe use the website or [TS]

00:46:20   whatever but if you are using an [TS]

00:46:23   existing Mac twitter client and don't [TS]

00:46:26   like it or it seems like it hasn't been [TS]

00:46:29   updated my electorate herd for the mac [TS]

00:46:31   or it doesn't work the way you want it [TS]

00:46:32   to this is an opportunity to get a shiny [TS]

00:46:37   new twitter client from a company that [TS]

00:46:39   really knows how to make Twitter clients [TS]

00:46:41   44 only as much money as you can [TS]

00:46:46   possibly afford so please PLEASE back [TS]

00:46:48   this is up to 35 thousand dollars now [TS]

00:46:50   and has been open [TS]

00:46:51   it's got 28 days to go and it's 35 [TS]

00:46:54   thousand dollars out of a goal of not 75 [TS]

00:46:56   north at go a hundred [TS]

00:46:58   please everybody make this happen [TS]

00:46:59   because i want this to the client but if [TS]

00:47:02   we don't make it happen does that mean [TS]

00:47:04   we will finally break you of your [TS]

00:47:06   ridiculous insistence on the unified [TS]

00:47:07   timeline i know i will never gonna use [TS]

00:47:10   whatever the magnet until it doesn't [TS]

00:47:12   launch anymore after that I'm gonna I'm [TS]

00:47:14   gonna beg my friends and i can factor to [TS]

00:47:16   give me a special building does blanch [TS]

00:47:17   em I'm just giving you a hard time no I [TS]

00:47:20   i know some of the folks from the icon [TS]

00:47:22   factory we all do actually and they're [TS]

00:47:24   great people so definitely check out [TS]

00:47:26   this kickstarter and throw a few dollars [TS]

00:47:29   if you can because it would make John [TS]

00:47:31   happy it would make the folks at icon [TS]

00:47:33   factory happy and they're good people [TS]

00:47:35   and you could swag have t-shirts they [TS]

00:47:37   have little you know vinyl Holly dolly [TS]

00:47:40   is their little blue Twitter bird you [TS]

00:47:43   should be some history i think i can [TS]

00:47:44   factor website link to it the history [TS]

00:47:46   between icon factory and Twitter many of [TS]

00:47:48   the things that you associate with [TS]

00:47:50   Twitter were in fact invented by icon [TS]

00:47:52   factory terminology iconography so much [TS]

00:47:55   icon factory is like practically part of [TS]

00:47:59   Twitter only non financial sense because [TS]

00:48:01   they do not have thousands of employees [TS]

00:48:02   and billions of dollars of investment [TS]

00:48:05   didn't Hockenberry come up with tweet [TS]

00:48:08   sent him knows co-worker that right i [TS]

00:48:12   think so sorry that you have to get the [TS]

00:48:13   details when I like oh my you tried like [TS]

00:48:16   yeah the I believe they were the first [TS]

00:48:18   ones to actually use a bird as part of [TS]

00:48:20   the logo that you at the word we [TS]

00:48:22   they might even invented at replies I [TS]

00:48:24   don't know it's they did a lot like a [TS]

00:48:26   lot a lot of of Twitter like standard [TS]

00:48:28   things and practices and mechanisms and [TS]

00:48:30   everything were invented by icon factory [TS]

00:48:33   or by there by like their developers for [TS]

00:48:36   their apps and Ollie the blue [TS]

00:48:38   twitterrific bird is along with the with [TS]

00:48:41   panik's transmit truck one of the most [TS]

00:48:43   ripped off i constantly entire internet [TS]

00:48:45   you see everywhere like that's just a [TS]

00:48:47   generic representation of Twitter that [TS]

00:48:48   Twitter's logo nope nope not not twitter [TS]

00:48:51   logo at all in fact or logos worse than [TS]

00:48:53   I contractors like they should have paid [TS]

00:48:54   them to make their logos for them but [TS]

00:48:57   they didn't cool well good luck [TS]

00:48:59   I don't know if I'm if I should wish you [TS]

00:49:02   good luck John official wish the icon [TS]

00:49:03   factory good luck I guess a little boat [TS]

00:49:05   should do either you should pledge money [TS]

00:49:07   that's what you should do [TS]

00:49:08   here's here's why you shall pledge money [TS]

00:49:10   so a this is great software supported by [TS]

00:49:13   great people doing great things great be [TS]

00:49:15   Twitter needs more diversity in software [TS]

00:49:18   and and twitterrific is one of the very [TS]

00:49:21   few clients that grandfather in with a [TS]

00:49:23   very large amount of user tokens and so [TS]

00:49:26   they actually can make their like one of [TS]

00:49:29   the only companies that could make a [TS]

00:49:30   widespread twitter client and see if [TS]

00:49:34   this kickstarter doesn't fund John gets [TS]

00:49:37   to keep all his money and so we want [TS]

00:49:40   John we want John to have spent a [TS]

00:49:42   ridiculous amount of money on his [TS]

00:49:43   twitter client i can say is like the [TS]

00:49:45   second most expensive application of my [TS]

00:49:47   computer after photoshop exactly what [TS]

00:49:49   exactly we want John's copy of [TS]

00:49:52   twitterrific to be the this ridiculous [TS]

00:49:55   investment he has made and so please [TS]

00:49:57   everyone go fund this so that his pledge [TS]

00:49:58   will go through it really is just all [TS]

00:50:00   the money that I want to spend on a mac [TS]

00:50:02   pro is just my software Kickstarter's [TS]

00:50:06   oh my goodness alright moving on let's [TS]

00:50:10   see what we have here at planet of the [TS]

00:50:12   apps [TS]

00:50:13   oh god what can we start with before we [TS]

00:50:16   start talking about this show can we [TS]

00:50:17   start with the I someone maybe we have a [TS]

00:50:20   lawyer and I'm how can they get away [TS]

00:50:21   with calling it planet of the apps when [TS]

00:50:23   it sounds like planet of the apes is [TS]

00:50:24   there any that is it doesn't fall under [TS]

00:50:26   the cat the like parody we're like it's [TS]

00:50:29   referencing thing a thing but in a [TS]

00:50:31   joking way so it is almost like trade [TS]

00:50:34   dress like I don't know I don't know the [TS]

00:50:36   the the legal things about that just [TS]

00:50:38   seems too weird to me that they can get [TS]

00:50:39   away with planet of the apps without [TS]

00:50:40   paying somebody who has the right to [TS]

00:50:42   Planet of the Apes Oh fall for next week [TS]

00:50:44   someone tell me what the deal is [TS]

00:50:46   yeah i mean three things like a we [TS]

00:50:48   aren't trademark lawyers be they might [TS]

00:50:50   have paid someone to license it can see [TS]

00:50:53   they might just not care and just accept [TS]

00:50:55   it and if anybody threaten them and they [TS]

00:50:57   will just settle it because allegory of [TS]

00:50:59   being apple and exactly the top of a [TS]

00:51:00   mountain of cash so high you can't even [TS]

00:51:02   hear the people yelling at you [TS]

00:51:03   exactly like it's probably we will buy [TS]

00:51:06   the planet of the apes franchise from [TS]

00:51:08   universal over the hell owns it but you [TS]

00:51:10   know when we sneeze the money falls out [TS]

00:51:11   of our pockets [TS]

00:51:12   yeah exactly like it's probably I mean [TS]

00:51:14   it you know as as amateurs hear it does [TS]

00:51:17   kind of seem like it might be considered [TS]

00:51:19   like generic enough or [TS]

00:51:22   clearly clear enough parody or satire [TS]

00:51:23   that it might not be a clear-cut case of [TS]

00:51:26   actual infringement humor the camera [TS]

00:51:29   angle is the strongest one but I'm right [TS]

00:51:31   that funny [TS]

00:51:32   no it's not apples not good at being [TS]

00:51:34   funny and I was like how bad is your [TS]

00:51:36   plan have to be before it stops being [TS]

00:51:38   humor I i think what one thing that you [TS]

00:51:42   know I I don't want to bash chapel too [TS]

00:51:44   much about this but i do think that one [TS]

00:51:47   very clear difference between apple now [TS]

00:51:49   vs apple under steve is that Steve was a [TS]

00:51:52   cool person like not and and not in all [TS]

00:51:55   ways and and he knew the ways in which [TS]

00:51:56   she wasn't cool to kind of kind of [TS]

00:51:58   played off of them but he was [TS]

00:52:00   fundamentally like pretty cool person to [TS]

00:52:02   to the people who follow apple and then [TS]

00:52:04   to apple customers and I don't think [TS]

00:52:06   anybody at apple now is cool at least in [TS]

00:52:10   the senior leadership but i'm not sure [TS]

00:52:12   they know that it actually kind of seems [TS]

00:52:14   like they don't know that and are [TS]

00:52:16   actually under the opposite impression [TS]

00:52:17   see fed is cool come on [TS]

00:52:19   what does not know bc Fed is is he is [TS]

00:52:23   like the dad joke but he knows that and [TS]

00:52:25   he plays that so he actually doesn't [TS]

00:52:27   have a pretty good job of managing but [TS]

00:52:29   he's not much in the public eye I i get [TS]

00:52:33   like I don't like him i think is [TS]

00:52:36   profoundly deeply uncool but is under [TS]

00:52:39   the opposite impression he doesn't think [TS]

00:52:42   he's cool yeah i agree he's he's just [TS]

00:52:45   he's comfortable zone skin you think of [TS]

00:52:47   any cute whooping well no yeah yeah he's [TS]

00:52:49   a whole different level but uh but yeah [TS]

00:52:53   I mean I I i wish the like basically [TS]

00:52:56   apple today is run by a bunch of [TS]

00:52:59   middle-aged white men and it seems like [TS]

00:53:03   he that is showing a lot recently and [TS]

00:53:08   it's unfortunate and that isn't to say [TS]

00:53:11   that they can still make good stuff but [TS]

00:53:13   I think some of their decisions are a [TS]

00:53:15   little odd you know in in context anyway [TS]

00:53:19   back to get off the name though [TS]

00:53:22   but yes just to defend or the opposite [TS]

00:53:24   to condemn Steve Jobs coolness remember [TS]

00:53:27   that he wanted to call the imac mac [TS]

00:53:29   man move we all have bad days remember [TS]

00:53:32   that talked out of it by advertising [TS]

00:53:35   executives macman I believe them [TS]

00:53:37   my memory is correct that someone Google [TS]

00:53:39   and correct me if I'm screwing up but [TS]

00:53:40   thank goodness for imac yeah [TS]

00:53:42   to be fair that was a long time ago I [TS]

00:53:44   know but it's just like the name and [TS]

00:53:47   tastes like it Steve wasn't as cool back [TS]

00:53:49   then in in the mid-nineties Steve wasn't [TS]

00:53:52   as cool 1998 I'm acting but anyway [TS]

00:53:58   alright so there was a trailer for apple [TS]

00:54:02   while really I guess Apple musics TV [TS]

00:54:05   show so the Apple music TV show and it's [TS]

00:54:07   a little weird like music television [TS]

00:54:09   yeah thanks you too there so it's called [TS]

00:54:13   planet of the apps i only saw the [TS]

00:54:15   trailer once it's like two and a half [TS]

00:54:16   minutes so it at this point if you [TS]

00:54:18   listen to the show feel free to pause [TS]

00:54:19   and watch it [TS]

00:54:20   I it so I mixed feelings about this it [TS]

00:54:25   is clearly unequivocally not a show [TS]

00:54:28   meant for the three of us and that's [TS]

00:54:30   okay i can move itself that's not a bad [TS]

00:54:32   thing [TS]

00:54:33   the idea is I if I understand this right [TS]

00:54:37   a bunch of app developers or potential [TS]

00:54:40   app developers come in and do an [TS]

00:54:43   escalator pitch so they are on an [TS]

00:54:45   escalator and as the escalators moving [TS]

00:54:48   down they have like 60 seconds to make a [TS]

00:54:50   pitch to will I am one of paltrow [TS]

00:54:52   jessica alba and gary vaynerchuk who I [TS]

00:54:57   guess at that point get to choose if [TS]

00:54:59   they want to tutor any of these teams [TS]

00:55:02   and then I guess there's a competition [TS]

00:55:04   at the end and if you win [TS]

00:55:06   among other things you get special [TS]

00:55:08   placement in the app store which most [TS]

00:55:10   people would probably give an appendage [TS]

00:55:11   to get wait so you can i first started [TS]

00:55:16   out with the escalator pitch thing [TS]

00:55:18   yeah yeah as a brief diversion here okay [TS]

00:55:20   so i have a question obviously I've ever [TS]

00:55:23   pitched Avicii I've been around vc's [TS]

00:55:25   I've been bored BDCs I've interacted [TS]

00:55:27   with a lot of pieces but never actually [TS]

00:55:28   pitched to one that was always done by [TS]

00:55:31   david and other people who are around me [TS]

00:55:33   that being said i am familiar with the [TS]

00:55:36   concept of the elevator pitch where the [TS]

00:55:38   idea is you're in an elevator with the [TS]

00:55:40   VC only have like until that you only [TS]

00:55:42   like they'll be arrived [TS]

00:55:43   to pitch them on your idea and then you [TS]

00:55:45   gotta convince them in a short amount of [TS]

00:55:46   time it's supposed to be like a man or [TS]

00:55:47   something like that [TS]

00:55:48   however how did this come about because [TS]

00:55:51   silicon valley has very few tall [TS]

00:55:53   buildings [TS]

00:55:54   that's an interesting point there aren't [TS]

00:55:56   that many elevators there to begin with [TS]

00:55:58   and the ones that are there are probably [TS]

00:56:00   going over like three floors the [TS]

00:56:02   elevator right they are lazy people and [TS]

00:56:03   have elevators in two-story buildings [TS]

00:56:05   but it but still it's not like a [TS]

00:56:06   one-minute pitches like an eight second [TS]

00:56:08   pitch like that where where did this [TS]

00:56:10   idea come about [TS]

00:56:12   maybe in New York taller buildings but [TS]

00:56:14   silicon valley of money has always been [TS]

00:56:16   west coast vc's there there are very [TS]

00:56:18   very few new york vc's that actually fun [TS]

00:56:20   Silicon Valley or tech project I think [TS]

00:56:23   elevator pitch pretty silicon valley but [TS]

00:56:24   going back into steve jobs again [TS]

00:56:26   remember the story about being trapped [TS]

00:56:27   in an elevator with steve jobs and he [TS]

00:56:29   has enough time to fire you in there so [TS]

00:56:30   it for you to say the wrong thing for [TS]

00:56:32   him to decide that you're fired and he [TS]

00:56:34   was remarkably efficient but wow anyone [TS]

00:56:37   everything that I think elevator pitch [TS]

00:56:39   predates silicon valley but if not like [TS]

00:56:41   it's metaphorical more than it is actual [TS]

00:56:43   but you but you got to the heart of the [TS]

00:56:44   idea is that if you have to sum up your [TS]

00:56:47   idea in a short amount of time you [TS]

00:56:48   should be able to say something that's [TS]

00:56:49   compelling instead of like just rambling [TS]

00:56:51   on for 20 minutes and people not knowing [TS]

00:56:52   what you're selling [TS]

00:56:53   you need to have an elevator pitch and [TS]

00:56:55   people in the end the the chat room or [TS]

00:56:56   like don't you mean we said escalator [TS]

00:56:59   pitch do you must speak to you mean [TS]

00:57:01   elevator pitch no that's left planet of [TS]

00:57:03   the apps get it apps instead of apes you [TS]

00:57:07   think that would be an elevator pitch [TS]

00:57:08   but you see what we did there someone [TS]

00:57:11   who we all know would say they took it [TS]

00:57:12   and they turned it it's not an elevator [TS]

00:57:15   bit [TS]

00:57:15   it's an escalator between makes even [TS]

00:57:17   less sense because we're you to a cost [TS]

00:57:19   somebody on an escalator that would be [TS]

00:57:20   super weird because you wouldn't even be [TS]

00:57:22   facing them you'll be there above them [TS]

00:57:23   are below them and the second thing is [TS]

00:57:25   an escalator riding lesson time then an [TS]

00:57:27   elevator ride so it is it is [TS]

00:57:30   ill-conceived in every possible way [TS]

00:57:31   except for one and that one way is is [TS]

00:57:34   that an idea that fits in with the [TS]

00:57:35   reality show answer yes well and it's [TS]

00:57:38   easier to film an escalator moving [TS]

00:57:40   towards the host then it are the the the [TS]

00:57:42   dc's whatever then it is an elevator [TS]

00:57:45   moving up from the basement and I guess [TS]

00:57:48   the the four like sponsors host [TS]

00:57:51   whateverrr looking at a video feed until [TS]

00:57:53   they arrive until the the purchase [TS]

00:57:55   it's arrived like it's this weird anyway [TS]

00:57:57   the name elevator pitch reflects the [TS]

00:57:59   idea that it should be possible to [TS]

00:58:00   deliver the summary in the summer time [TS]

00:58:02   span of an elevator ride or [TS]

00:58:03   approximately 30 seconds to 2 minutes [TS]

00:58:04   and is widely credited to Eileen Rossen [TS]

00:58:07   swag and Michael Caruso while he was an [TS]

00:58:10   editor for Vanity Fair for its word [TS]

00:58:13   origins so presumably this well predate [TS]

00:58:16   Silicon Valley so Believe It or Not [TS]

00:58:17   Silicon Valley the world did not always [TS]

00:58:20   running around you [TS]

00:58:21   truth be told CSO this this show so I me [TS]

00:58:25   I don't intrinsically have anything [TS]

00:58:27   against reality shows in fact i watch [TS]

00:58:29   some truly and utterly atrociously [TS]

00:58:33   terrible reality shows not often [TS]

00:58:34   competitions but be that as it may I [TS]

00:58:37   have watched season of american idol in [TS]

00:58:39   the past so I i have seen my fair share [TS]

00:58:41   of reality shows i've seen the voice [TS]

00:58:43   many times I want a reality show friend [TS]

00:58:46   yeah right exactly this this show does [TS]

00:58:50   not speak to me at all and i find it to [TS]

00:58:53   be fairly preposterous but I don't [TS]

00:58:57   necessarily think that's a bad thing [TS]

00:58:59   because i don't think the show is really [TS]

00:59:01   for me because it's to my know too much [TS]

00:59:05   about how the sausage is made and this [TS]

00:59:07   is not a show about how sausages made [TS]

00:59:09   despite how their pitching it's a show [TS]

00:59:11   about making sausage making glamorous [TS]

00:59:14   and my head until this analogy but be [TS]

00:59:16   that as it may I don't have anymore [TS]

00:59:18   thanks a lot [TS]

00:59:19   yeah it's so I mean I can't watch it i [TS]

00:59:23   presume because i do not pay for Apple [TS]

00:59:25   music I never have I used it for the [TS]

00:59:28   free trial and then never paid for it [TS]

00:59:30   I i would probably watch it if i could [TS]

00:59:34   for an episode or two just to see what I [TS]

00:59:37   thought I don't expect I would like it [TS]

00:59:39   and I don't think that's a problem [TS]

00:59:41   Marco what do you think I mean obviously [TS]

00:59:45   I've had similar reactions to most [TS]

00:59:48   programmers looking at this of just like [TS]

00:59:50   wow this this kind of looks awful from [TS]

00:59:53   the trailer it is very clear that it's [TS]

00:59:55   really meant as a ripoff of shark tank [TS]

00:59:57   and whatever the original version shark [TS]

00:59:59   tank was called so [TS]

00:59:59   tank was called so [TS]

01:00:00   or else not probably in your because we [TS]

01:00:01   still have their TV and rename it and [TS]

01:00:02   everyone thinks we invented it but it [TS]

01:00:05   might be entertaining show in the same [TS]

01:00:08   like like what was that not freaks and [TS]

01:00:11   geeks a beauty and the geek like it was [TS]

01:00:13   at this horrible dating reality show i [TS]

01:00:16   think i saw that it was delightful [TS]

01:00:18   it was terrible but it was delightful [TS]

01:00:20   yeah and like as a geek watching that [TS]

01:00:23   your you could you see what you saw all [TS]

01:00:25   the ridiculous holes in the show but it [TS]

01:00:27   was still fun to watch as like a fun [TS]

01:00:29   garbage TV show and this could probably [TS]

01:00:31   be that too for anybody who is remotely [TS]

01:00:34   familiar with software development and [TS]

01:00:36   and building at absent building [TS]

01:00:38   businesses this might be that kind of do [TS]

01:00:40   it might be a fun garbage watch it's [TS]

01:00:42   fine you know I think a lot of people [TS]

01:00:44   are reading audience because I don't I [TS]

01:00:46   wouldn't read much into this [TS]

01:00:48   there's a lot of arguments against it [TS]

01:00:49   that Apple maybe shouldn't be doing this [TS]

01:00:51   or that it's going to cast app [TS]

01:00:53   development in a bad light or it's going [TS]

01:00:55   to distort people's view and apps and i [TS]

01:00:57   think most of those things are both true [TS]

01:01:01   on some level but not a big deal and in [TS]

01:01:04   reality and all likelihood like they're [TS]

01:01:06   not going to be enough of an effect on [TS]

01:01:07   anything to really matter because [TS]

01:01:08   chances are this is going to go [TS]

01:01:11   not very far it's going to be watched by [TS]

01:01:13   not that many people and it's going to [TS]

01:01:15   make not that big of a cultural impact [TS]

01:01:16   of any sort [TS]

01:01:17   so it's probably going to be fun garbage [TS]

01:01:19   TV for some people to watch [TS]

01:01:21   I think it's weird that the music app [TS]

01:01:23   everywhere and it's only an apple music [TS]

01:01:24   a lot of people are going to have [TS]

01:01:26   trouble ever even knowing it exists as a [TS]

01:01:28   result those people who do it exists are [TS]

01:01:30   gonna have trouble finding it so that's [TS]

01:01:32   all going to hurt viewership probably [TS]

01:01:33   but anyway you know the actual show [TS]

01:01:36   itself you know it's it's it's a garbage [TS]

01:01:39   reality TV show the host of it are have [TS]

01:01:44   I think limited knowledge about the [TS]

01:01:47   reality of a building [TS]

01:01:49   gary vaynerchuk I like a lot I I think [TS]

01:01:52   he he really he is the person on the [TS]

01:01:54   show i'm most interested to to see I i [TS]

01:01:57   I've followed his work back in the day I [TS]

01:01:59   met him a couple times he's super nice [TS]

01:02:01   he is the real deal he knows what he's [TS]

01:02:03   talking about not necessarily an app [TS]

01:02:06   development as far as i know but you [TS]

01:02:08   know he's more like a business [TS]

01:02:09   consultant but that's what i wanted to [TS]

01:02:12   get to though is that [TS]

01:02:13   that's kind of more with the show is [TS]

01:02:15   about like it's called planet of the [TS]

01:02:17   apps and its focus on apps because [TS]

01:02:19   apples funding it and making it and [TS]

01:02:22   promoting it so the Apple wanted to be [TS]

01:02:24   all about them and the world they think [TS]

01:02:25   they created so of course they're [TS]

01:02:27   focusing the marketing and the naming [TS]

01:02:29   everything else on apps and all the app [TS]

01:02:31   developers are saying this is crazy [TS]

01:02:33   because this isn't how apps are made but [TS]

01:02:36   the show really isn't about apps it's [TS]

01:02:38   like if the show was called planet of [TS]

01:02:41   the websites and you know it's like the [TS]

01:02:43   website is like an interface to the [TS]

01:02:46   business and you eat you don't go around [TS]

01:02:49   saying hey I'm making the new website [TS]

01:02:52   like no you may dig 1993 lemme tellya [TS]

01:02:55   well yeah but the point is like for the [TS]

01:02:59   for the types of things that most people [TS]

01:03:01   long shade that would be entertaining to [TS]

01:03:03   watch at all no one's gonna watch a show [TS]

01:03:06   about you making a bespoke note-taking [TS]

01:03:08   app or something like that like they're [TS]

01:03:10   gonna watch a show that's kinda like [TS]

01:03:12   shark tank or america's got talent or [TS]

01:03:15   stuff like that that's what people [TS]

01:03:16   actually want to watch this garbage [TS]

01:03:17   reality shows for and so they want to [TS]

01:03:20   hear like the big business idea because [TS]

01:03:22   this is a show i I'm a tweet about this [TS]

01:03:24   is kind of like a show for the idea [TS]

01:03:25   people those people who was a cost [TS]

01:03:27   app-developers at-bat got at gathering [TS]

01:03:29   stuff like I had this great idea for an [TS]

01:03:31   app i will you not tell me about you you [TS]

01:03:34   can't steal it you do 50 with me I'll be [TS]

01:03:37   the idea guy you you make the appt ok [TS]

01:03:39   here's my idea and they tell you some [TS]

01:03:41   ridiculous idea that is usually [TS]

01:03:43   impossible and/or terrible this show is [TS]

01:03:47   for those people to watch kind of like [TS]

01:03:50   aspirationally because they think that [TS]

01:03:51   could be them someday that's who this is [TS]

01:03:53   actually for or people i guess you just [TS]

01:03:54   want garbage TV to watch sometimes but [TS]

01:03:57   the point is like this is not going to [TS]

01:03:59   reflect what it's like to be an indie [TS]

01:04:01   app developer because not only do people [TS]

01:04:04   not really want to watch that but most [TS]

01:04:06   app development isn't in the app [TS]

01:04:08   developers most app development is [TS]

01:04:11   in-house employees or contractors for up [TS]

01:04:14   for like bigger businesses that where [TS]

01:04:16   the error is not exactly the app itself [TS]

01:04:18   is not the business [TS]

01:04:21   the app is just an interface to the [TS]

01:04:23   business in the same way that 10 years [TS]

01:04:25   ago the website was the inner [TS]

01:04:27   face to most businesses that were made [TS]

01:04:28   in our in our industry right so we want [TS]

01:04:32   this to be some other things like people [TS]

01:04:34   like this working we wanted to be like [TS]

01:04:36   this beautiful story about app [TS]

01:04:38   developers and it's just not going to be [TS]

01:04:40   that it's gonna be the exact same thing [TS]

01:04:44   that would have been 10 12 years ago [TS]

01:04:47   people pitching vc's about ideas that [TS]

01:04:50   were based on web apps and web services [TS]

01:04:52   at social networks and you know very [TS]

01:04:54   like that's it's gonna just be that but [TS]

01:04:57   where the interface to it happens to be [TS]

01:05:00   an app in the app store it's not gonna [TS]

01:05:02   be great you know academically it's not [TS]

01:05:05   going to be a high quality TV but I [TS]

01:05:08   don't think it's going to meaningfully [TS]

01:05:09   impact the app business or people's [TS]

01:05:12   perception of it for lots of reasons not [TS]

01:05:15   least two books i don't think many [TS]

01:05:16   people watch it but also just as I just [TS]

01:05:18   I don't think it really has much bearing [TS]

01:05:21   on what most of us actually do but i [TS]

01:05:24   also think it doesn't really purport to [TS]

01:05:25   because that doesn't because what most [TS]

01:05:26   of us really do or what we think we want [TS]

01:05:28   to do with India and development is such [TS]

01:05:30   a very very tiny sliver of the world out [TS]

01:05:33   of that development as a whole [TS]

01:05:35   thinking back to when we first talked [TS]

01:05:37   about this and we have this you know [TS]

01:05:38   there's so little information like [TS]

01:05:40   apples making a show about app [TS]

01:05:41   development something something and then [TS]

01:05:43   if you like celebrity names attached to [TS]

01:05:44   it and we had that brief moment where we [TS]

01:05:48   could talk about the possibility of this [TS]

01:05:51   being a show that is actually about app [TS]

01:05:53   development and I think the time we said [TS]

01:05:54   how can that they can't make that [TS]

01:05:55   interesting does not want to see someone [TS]

01:05:56   sitting there encoding like that's not [TS]

01:05:58   going to be on the show right but still [TS]

01:06:00   we were we were entertaining the idea of [TS]

01:06:03   a show about app development but of [TS]

01:06:04   course like when the show comes out it's [TS]

01:06:06   not about app development as Mark [TS]

01:06:07   pointed out is it is basically like a [TS]

01:06:10   subset of shark tank imagine shark tank [TS]

01:06:13   except the only thing you can pitch our [TS]

01:06:14   businesses represented by an application [TS]

01:06:17   you're writing your own bad pitch right [TS]

01:06:20   that's what it is [TS]

01:06:21   okay I have this great idea for a show [TS]

01:06:23   are you ready i'll be the idea guy you [TS]

01:06:24   make the entire show okay it's like [TS]

01:06:26   shark tank but for apps [TS]

01:06:28   yeah but all but only but only apps like [TS]

01:06:30   if you see if your business can isn't [TS]

01:06:32   like Rep like Instagram would be [TS]

01:06:34   business represented by napisal sorts of [TS]

01:06:36   things would be like is the appt the [TS]

01:06:38   sort of standard bearer for your [TS]

01:06:39   business [TS]

01:06:40   is that how people deal with your [TS]

01:06:41   business is it through a nap then you're [TS]

01:06:44   fine but if you have any other business [TS]

01:06:45   idea [TS]

01:06:46   no sorry got to go on shark tank right [TS]

01:06:48   so it's a narrow slice thing and [TS]

01:06:49   presumably Apple does this because [TS]

01:06:51   they're the app company and so there's [TS]

01:06:53   some kind of synergy there but this [TS]

01:06:54   brings up a a tweet that uh our friend [TS]

01:06:57   cable SAS or panic [TS]

01:06:58   posted today yesterday I forget it was [TS]

01:07:01   arguing with grouper about something in [TS]

01:07:03   you and his reply was you can't just say [TS]

01:07:07   well that's route reality TV [TS]

01:07:10   he's he's using well that's reality TV [TS]

01:07:13   as a verb so I'm going to try to read [TS]

01:07:15   this in the way that it says you can't [TS]

01:07:17   quote well that's reality TV a thing [TS]

01:07:19   from Apple does that sentence makes [TS]

01:07:21   sense to people that's what he wrote I'm [TS]

01:07:22   trying real hard here on an actor it's [TS]

01:07:25   from Apple the experts of good taste now [TS]

01:07:27   get a free pass for junk like the ideas [TS]

01:07:29   you can't just always reality or [TS]

01:07:30   whatever because it's more apple we have [TS]

01:07:32   some expectations of taste which would [TS]

01:07:34   you know get it [TS]

01:07:35   planet of the apps and perhaps not [TS]

01:07:37   getting off on the right foot right from [TS]

01:07:38   the title when I saw the sweet i was [TS]

01:07:41   thinkin like we talked two passions [TS]

01:07:44   about Apple getting into the content [TS]

01:07:45   market and i still think that makes [TS]

01:07:47   sense because if they are going to try [TS]

01:07:49   to compete with the netflix in there an [TS]

01:07:51   amazon and stuff and netflix and amazon [TS]

01:07:53   are doing original content apple should [TS]

01:07:55   be doing original content to but the [TS]

01:07:57   thing about content is if you're doing [TS]

01:08:01   original content well not saying you [TS]

01:08:05   can't but probably you shouldn't imbue [TS]

01:08:09   that content with any of the [TS]

01:08:10   sensibilities from your company which [TS]

01:08:12   sounds like was not an apple whole thing [TS]

01:08:13   is everything they do imbued with the [TS]

01:08:14   sensibility of Apple but content is [TS]

01:08:17   different there is nothing particularly [TS]

01:08:19   about stranger things are man in the [TS]

01:08:22   high castle that makes me think Netflix [TS]

01:08:24   or Amazon like there's no one of their [TS]

01:08:26   corporate DNA and those shows creative [TS]

01:08:28   content especially entertainment has to [TS]

01:08:31   be true to its genre so it's a sci-fi [TS]

01:08:34   show make a good sci-fi show if it is a [TS]

01:08:37   family drama make a good family drama if [TS]

01:08:39   it's a wacky comedy make a good webcam [TS]

01:08:41   it doesn't matter how well wacky comedy [TS]

01:08:43   family drama sci fi fit with your [TS]

01:08:45   corporate branding and it's weird [TS]

01:08:47   because Amazon and Netflix and Apple are [TS]

01:08:49   these tech based companies that do [TS]

01:08:51   fairly different things with some over [TS]

01:08:54   app but none of them having to do with [TS]

01:08:55   creativity but I think netflix amazon [TS]

01:08:57   has shown if you get the right people [TS]

01:09:00   involved basically like what is being [TS]

01:09:02   supplied by Netflix and Amazon obviously [TS]

01:09:04   there's a venue for viewing but the most [TS]

01:09:06   important thing is money [TS]

01:09:08   here you go people who know how to get [TS]

01:09:10   creative things created by creative [TS]

01:09:12   people [TS]

01:09:13   here's a bucket of money can you make a [TS]

01:09:15   good show and out pops house of cards [TS]

01:09:17   answer yes if you throw enough money [TS]

01:09:19   that you hire the right people [TS]

01:09:20   netflix a company that delivers plastic [TS]

01:09:24   discs and streaming video to people's [TS]

01:09:25   houses you know used to plant uses the [TS]

01:09:28   lastest can make good content and same [TS]

01:09:31   thing with amazon the place that you buy [TS]

01:09:33   stuff from they deliver for you in boxes [TS]

01:09:35   can make original content so if Apple [TS]

01:09:39   has decided you can our debate the [TS]

01:09:40   merits of this that they're going to [TS]

01:09:42   make a reality show [TS]

01:09:44   I think we're getting a little bit [TS]

01:09:46   confused by the fact that involves apps [TS]

01:09:48   the bottom line is all right if you're [TS]

01:09:50   gonna make a reality show what our [TS]

01:09:52   reality shows like and can you make a [TS]

01:09:54   good one and i'm going to defend reality [TS]

01:09:55   shows as a long time for your reality [TS]

01:09:58   shows from from the very beginning I [TS]

01:10:00   still watching enjoy many of them that [TS]

01:10:02   there is such a thing as a good reality [TS]

01:10:04   show and a bad reality show [TS]

01:10:06   oh yeah but but within the genre like [TS]

01:10:09   there is a genre and if you look at this [TS]

01:10:11   trailer you go that's a reality show [TS]

01:10:13   like it is clearly recognizable as a [TS]

01:10:15   reality show and I think it could be a [TS]

01:10:18   good reality show if done well because [TS]

01:10:22   it involves people with the skill and an [TS]

01:10:27   ambition and a dream or whatever and [TS]

01:10:30   they are going to you know in all these [TS]

01:10:33   scenarios where you have the panel of [TS]

01:10:34   experts to pick them on them that can be [TS]

01:10:36   very bad or it can be good where they're [TS]

01:10:38   trying to encourage people after the [TS]

01:10:40   initial like let's make fun of the other [TS]

01:10:42   people who are really bad you know sort [TS]

01:10:44   of American i'll type thing like that I [TS]

01:10:45   feel like a bad aspect of it but either [TS]

01:10:46   way once you get into the human story of [TS]

01:10:49   like I what I want to do this thing you [TS]

01:10:51   don't need to know what the details of [TS]

01:10:53   the struggle our this won't be about [TS]

01:10:54   application development probably mostly [TS]

01:10:56   be about starting a new business and [TS]

01:10:58   business ideas and in the end unlike for [TS]

01:11:01   example american idol in the end there [TS]

01:11:03   is much less ability to make these [TS]

01:11:05   people into Superstars I'm even know [TS]

01:11:07   Kyle had trouble eventually but like [TS]

01:11:08   Carrie Kelly Clarkson had a reasonable [TS]

01:11:11   expectation that if she won this reality [TS]

01:11:14   show she would have a viable recording [TS]

01:11:17   career a because the people picking her [TS]

01:11:19   are going to pick people based on talent [TS]

01:11:21   and be because you get an in with the [TS]

01:11:24   recording industry which is way more [TS]

01:11:25   monolithic and actually back then had [TS]

01:11:27   even more power than it does today to [TS]

01:11:29   make you a star [TS]

01:11:31   uh because they control distribution and [TS]

01:11:33   so it's always much less so than they [TS]

01:11:34   used to in the old days but still it was [TS]

01:11:36   a think but for this for the app show i [TS]

01:11:41   don't particularly trust that the four [TS]

01:11:42   people on the expert panel have any idea [TS]

01:11:45   what is going to be a successful app [TS]

01:11:46   beyond like any for random people that [TS]

01:11:48   you picked in the tech industry and [TS]

01:11:50   furthermore i don't particularly think [TS]

01:11:52   that even Apple itself by featuring you [TS]

01:11:54   in the app store and heavily pushing you [TS]

01:11:55   is going to turn your idea into a viable [TS]

01:11:58   business for the long term but I think [TS]

01:12:02   none of that matters for reality shows [TS]

01:12:04   because at this point we are perfectly [TS]

01:12:06   willing to accept that winning a reality [TS]

01:12:08   show is its own reward and whatever they [TS]

01:12:10   promised you know yeah you'll be rich [TS]

01:12:12   and famous river or forget you by next [TS]

01:12:14   season because that's not what it's [TS]

01:12:16   about is an entertainment program and [TS]

01:12:18   you want and like that can be done badly [TS]

01:12:19   and explosively or could be done in a [TS]

01:12:21   way that people enjoy where you get to [TS]

01:12:23   see plain old human drama and people [TS]

01:12:25   with skills trying to apply those skills [TS]

01:12:27   and challenging situation hopefully the [TS]

01:12:28   judges and the sponsors are supportive [TS]

01:12:31   and encouraging and it is a positive [TS]

01:12:33   type of program with good production [TS]

01:12:35   values that treats its intestines well [TS]

01:12:37   that has smart funny and interesting and [TS]

01:12:39   charming judges i believe a good reality [TS]

01:12:42   show as possible i don't know whether [TS]

01:12:43   this will be one but i think the fact [TS]

01:12:46   that this reality show involves apps is [TS]

01:12:48   a distraction and a thing that skews [TS]

01:12:51   people's thinking about it but i guess [TS]

01:12:53   the only thing you really debated is [TS]

01:12:54   should the first major piece of original [TS]

01:12:56   content that Apple made not counting [TS]

01:12:58   carpool karaoke was resisting franchise [TS]

01:13:00   should be a reality show [TS]

01:13:02   maybe maybe not but again i don't think [TS]

01:13:05   it by judging based on that you could [TS]

01:13:07   say you shouldn't be trying to figure [TS]

01:13:09   out how well does reality show fit with [TS]

01:13:11   apples evils that's not the question at [TS]

01:13:12   all questions are reality shows popular [TS]

01:13:14   yes they are popular so if if you were [TS]

01:13:18   picking genre and it's also different [TS]

01:13:19   than other people there now [TS]

01:13:21   doing a sci-fi ray retro sci-fi show or [TS]

01:13:26   a show based on you know [TS]

01:13:28   scifi books from well-known author write [TS]

01:13:31   that that has been well-trod territory [TS]

01:13:33   they're doing a reality show is their [TS]

01:13:35   first thing which is a little bit [TS]

01:13:36   different than doing a superhero thing [TS]

01:13:37   or anything like that so I think that's [TS]

01:13:39   a reasonable choice and at some point [TS]

01:13:41   someone convince them if we are doing a [TS]

01:13:42   reality show there's a little bit of [TS]

01:13:43   energy if we do and perhaps but i'm [TS]

01:13:46   willing to give this show all the [TS]

01:13:48   benefit of the doubt even though I [TS]

01:13:49   certainly won't watch him and I'm not [TS]

01:13:51   interested in that I don't watch shark [TS]

01:13:52   tank either all the benefit of the doubt [TS]

01:13:54   but what I would say is if Apple serious [TS]

01:13:57   about content i hope it doesn't only do [TS]

01:14:00   reality shows because there's no reason [TS]

01:14:03   Apple can't do original content in any [TS]

01:14:04   genre that it wants because it has that [TS]

01:14:06   same thing amazon netflix have mountains [TS]

01:14:09   of money and if they are wise and hire [TS]

01:14:11   the right people's and you throw amount [TS]

01:14:13   of money at them they can make a good [TS]

01:14:15   video content in any genre you can [TS]

01:14:18   imagine and i love that that's happening [TS]

01:14:20   with amazon netflix and i would like [TS]

01:14:21   that for that to happen apple because [TS]

01:14:23   one of the house so they going to do [TS]

01:14:24   with their money that I make it a car or [TS]

01:14:25   whatever so I'm all for it even if it is [TS]

01:14:28   weirdly connected with Apple music and [TS]

01:14:30   even if I will never ever watch the show [TS]

01:14:33   yeah i mean i-i understand why everyone [TS]

01:14:38   was perturbed about it and I understand [TS]

01:14:40   that it's over this is a distraction in [TS]

01:14:42   yeah I guess maybe for some of Apple but [TS]

01:14:47   I mean for the developers that are that [TS]

01:14:50   are doing the sorts of things said that [TS]

01:14:52   the three of us really care about I [TS]

01:14:53   don't think it's much more distraction [TS]

01:14:55   at all [TS]

01:14:55   1 like it's not like it the the people [TS]

01:14:58   who are making this show we're not [TS]

01:15:00   taking off new mac pro hardware to make [TS]

01:15:02   this show [TS]

01:15:03   yeah exactly yeah that involved the mac [TS]

01:15:05   pro hardware team as is Billy assembling [TS]

01:15:07   the escalator exactly yeah and I don't [TS]

01:15:09   think it's a distraction because apples [TS]

01:15:11   in the TV connected box business and [TS]

01:15:13   they're in the streaming video business [TS]

01:15:15   like they have been you know from old [TS]

01:15:17   like so this is not a new venture where [TS]

01:15:19   they will sell you a rent movies and [TS]

01:15:21   video like everybody else was in that [TS]

01:15:23   business is doing original content and I [TS]

01:15:25   think it's that's been shown to be a [TS]

01:15:26   model that works so they're late comers [TS]

01:15:28   to this all they're doing is continuing [TS]

01:15:30   to compete in the market they were [TS]

01:15:31   already in it's like why are you making [TS]

01:15:33   TV shows you destroy [TS]

01:15:34   you know they were already there already [TS]

01:15:35   in that market they've been selling [TS]

01:15:36   apple tv's of various kinds for a long [TS]

01:15:38   time they've been selling video of the [TS]

01:15:39   itunes store for a long time [TS]

01:15:41   that's a market there in there just [TS]

01:15:42   competing it people should be [TS]

01:15:43   encouraging them like to encourage them [TS]

01:15:45   to compete in the personal computer [TS]

01:15:46   market [TS]

01:15:47   yes by all means look at what your [TS]

01:15:48   competitors doing and try to make your [TS]

01:15:50   product more valuable and desirable good [TS]

01:15:52   job not a distraction at all [TS]

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01:17:42   nearly 10 years go to pingie.com /a TPI [TS]

01:17:46   cheese what it was i used for 10 [TS]

01:17:47   years like I looking around my entire [TS]

01:17:50   technology world there's almost nothing [TS]

01:17:52   else I've used for 10 years I've only [TS]

01:17:54   used coffee for like 12 years [TS]

01:17:56   it's incredible check out pingdom it is [TS]

01:17:59   so so good [TS]

01:18:00   bing.com / ATP for a 14-day free trial [TS]

01:18:04   and get twenty percent of your first [TS]

01:18:05   invoice with offer code ATP thank you to [TS]

01:18:08   kingdom for sponsoring our show I don't [TS]

01:18:13   even know how to pronounce this tavo [TS]

01:18:15   kavo cavo that's it that's exactly how [TS]

01:18:20   you have to say it now [TS]

01:18:21   alright good i'm glad i'm glad i got its [TS]

01:18:23   protector II yeah [TS]

01:18:26   nicely done nicely done i always feel [TS]

01:18:30   bad about that and primer you guys that [TS]

01:18:33   don't know you don't like being humble [TS]

01:18:34   enough but you know you know them you [TS]

01:18:35   don't move either do you can i'm aware [TS]

01:18:37   of its existence not gonna take that is [TS]

01:18:40   only mark hope no one was at the time [TS]

01:18:42   traveling one with the box at the [TS]

01:18:44   refrigerator size box [TS]

01:18:46   yes no I have seen that actually I don't [TS]

01:18:48   detect right that's it [TS]

01:18:50   anyway the title that movie is PR imer [TS]

01:18:52   and the person who made that movie i [TS]

01:18:55   initially expected people and prefer [TS]

01:18:58   people to pronounce it primer know but [TS]

01:19:01   eventually gave up because everybody [TS]

01:19:03   everybody who saw that word pronounced [TS]

01:19:05   the primer which is an alternate [TS]

01:19:07   translation of that word with a [TS]

01:19:08   different meaning and so the creator of [TS]

01:19:11   the movie had to cover and protect curry [TS]

01:19:13   same situation i believe the original [TS]

01:19:15   logo had a bar over the e to try to tell [TS]

01:19:18   you with a long e stay strategery right [TS]

01:19:21   now is correct but that didn't work and [TS]

01:19:24   the public has spoken and now the [TS]

01:19:26   creator of that site says trajectory [TS]

01:19:28   truth sorry Ben Thompson anyway I've [TS]

01:19:31   known as well so tell me about God lot [TS]

01:19:35   of people were tweeting this with the [TS]

01:19:38   idea this is the omnivorous box that I [TS]

01:19:40   talked about on hypercritical and [TS]

01:19:42   earlier on [TS]

01:19:43   earlier episodes of ATP it's such an all [TS]

01:19:46   idea from like 2011 over the [TS]

01:19:48   hypocritical was goes back when I was [TS]

01:19:51   complaining a lot about tivo and what I [TS]

01:19:53   wanted was someone to make a box [TS]

01:19:56   it would be nice if it was apple that [TS]

01:19:57   sat on my TV and had a whole bunch of [TS]

01:20:01   inputs took video from all the places [TS]

01:20:02   that I pay for stuff back in two [TS]

01:20:04   thousand and was like hey I pay for [TS]

01:20:05   cable and also pay for netflix and i [TS]

01:20:08   also have a you know a blu-ray player or [TS]

01:20:10   Playstation you know all these different [TS]

01:20:12   places that i can get video into my TV i [TS]

01:20:15   would like all those inputs to go into [TS]

01:20:17   this thing that I called an omnivorous [TS]

01:20:19   box because it would assume anything and [TS]

01:20:22   then I wanted one cable coming out of [TS]

01:20:24   India I'm not nervous box into my [TS]

01:20:26   television and one remote that controls [TS]

01:20:27   the omniverse box and I would be able to [TS]

01:20:31   through a single interface have access [TS]

01:20:33   to all the video that i pay for to pay [TS]

01:20:35   for cable subscription cables TV shows [TS]

01:20:37   they come on my tivo record them i want [TS]

01:20:40   access to all the shows both live and [TS]

01:20:42   recorded i pay for netflix and that you [TS]

01:20:45   know there's a netflix client either on [TS]

01:20:47   my television or on their neighbors box [TS]

01:20:48   yourself or on apple TV or something i [TS]

01:20:50   want to be able to see that stuff i have [TS]

01:20:52   a plaque server running and that's you [TS]

01:20:54   know or ps3 media server back then and [TS]

01:20:57   that has the complaint files from a hard [TS]

01:20:59   drive somewhere in my basement want to [TS]

01:21:00   watch that kind as well I wanted to be [TS]

01:21:02   one big unified interface so when I look [TS]

01:21:05   through the show's available for me to [TS]

01:21:06   watch it does not express to me in any [TS]

01:21:08   way where this stuff comes from it's [TS]

01:21:10   just like yes this video comes from many [TS]

01:21:12   different sources but I give you a [TS]

01:21:13   unified interface to it's just a series [TS]

01:21:15   of things that you can watch things that [TS]

01:21:17   might come on the future things that [TS]

01:21:19   haven't come on come on the past things [TS]

01:21:21   you can stream right now just one big [TS]

01:21:23   continuous clean interface and that is a [TS]

01:21:25   super hard problem to solve because all [TS]

01:21:27   those people who distribute that content [TS]

01:21:29   cable companies netflix even like the [TS]

01:21:32   ps3 media server people do not want you [TS]

01:21:34   to make that box they want you to use [TS]

01:21:35   their box and their remote and all that [TS]

01:21:37   other stuff especially cable companies [TS]

01:21:40   that making that box is would be [TS]

01:21:43   finished difficult many companies try [TS]

01:21:45   google gave probably the best run but [TS]

01:21:47   it's absurd cool TV thing with the crazy [TS]

01:21:50   remote remember that [TS]

01:21:52   yep it was like to Google TV's ago I [TS]

01:21:54   forget which link yeah [TS]

01:21:55   I was remember that was one of the irish [TS]

01:21:57   myths that was gonna be on every TV [TS]

01:21:58   right [TS]

01:21:59   no that was the second one this one [TS]

01:22:01   before that yeah anyway it's a really [TS]

01:22:04   hard problem both technically because [TS]

01:22:05   how would you even solve the technical [TS]

01:22:07   problem and business-wise because [TS]

01:22:09   everybody who's injured whose input is [TS]

01:22:11   going into your nervous box does not [TS]

01:22:13   want people to get their content through [TS]

01:22:15   your neighbors box and they will fight [TS]

01:22:16   you on it like they will make it so your [TS]

01:22:18   box stops working on purpose because [TS]

01:22:20   they don't want you to be the middleman [TS]

01:22:22   it's like no they don't want that at all [TS]

01:22:25   and so no one ever did make that box [TS]

01:22:26   tivo came the closest because tivo get [TS]

01:22:29   takes the cable input because of cable [TS]

01:22:31   card which is the thing that happened [TS]

01:22:33   when there was a brief moment of semi [TS]

01:22:34   sanity and our lovemaking institutions [TS]

01:22:36   in this country that allowed third-party [TS]

01:22:39   products to accept cable signals with [TS]

01:22:41   some caveats so that's why I can even [TS]

01:22:43   use acute a tivo and why don't have to [TS]

01:22:45   have a cable box so we could get cable [TS]

01:22:46   television and record that and then [TS]

01:22:48   eventually tivo added some fairly grim [TS]

01:22:51   streaming video clients their platform [TS]

01:22:53   so you can watch netflix your tivo & [TS]

01:22:55   amazon through your TiVo and all and [TS]

01:22:56   because the plex client i forget anyway [TS]

01:22:58   not quite omnivorous because you can [TS]

01:23:01   watch itunes coming through there and [TS]

01:23:03   you can't watch my blu-ray player [TS]

01:23:05   through there and you know all sorts of [TS]

01:23:06   stuff like that so I'm never spoke never [TS]

01:23:08   came to be enter cabo with 2 a's and no [TS]

01:23:11   bar over any of them [TS]

01:23:12   this is a set-top box that takes a whole [TS]

01:23:15   bunch of hdmi inputs and has one output [TS]

01:23:17   and it tries to do something like what i [TS]

01:23:21   described that you have one convo remote [TS]

01:23:25   he used that remote and with it you can [TS]

01:23:28   see all the video that is available on [TS]

01:23:30   all the different devices that are [TS]

01:23:31   plugged into it and you can watch video [TS]

01:23:33   friend of them any of them I it is not i [TS]

01:23:37   think really an omnivorous box because [TS]

01:23:39   one of my requirements from nervous [TS]

01:23:40   boxes that provides one interface it [TS]

01:23:43   doesn't make you have to be aware of [TS]

01:23:46   where stuff comes from and one of combos [TS]

01:23:49   primary interfaces is a series of boxes [TS]

01:23:51   that say roku ps4 Amazon Apple TV Direct [TS]

01:23:55   TV like when I first saw it I thought [TS]

01:23:59   this is a glorified hdmi switcher it's [TS]

01:24:02   like great all you're basically my [TS]

01:24:04   things go into one box and add that box [TS]

01:24:07   it connects your television [TS]

01:24:08   and then when you turn on with the one [TS]

01:24:09   remote you can pick which thing you want [TS]

01:24:10   to do and then you just get the [TS]

01:24:11   interface that thing that's not quite [TS]

01:24:13   how it works will link in the show notes [TS]

01:24:14   to this video from the verge which is [TS]

01:24:17   very long kind of boring but just scrub [TS]

01:24:18   through until you soon start actually [TS]

01:24:19   using the device of the creators of this [TS]

01:24:22   thing talking to her talking to walt [TS]

01:24:24   mossberg highly recognized because of [TS]

01:24:27   his silly beard and someone else and [TS]

01:24:33   they give demos of the product and it [TS]

01:24:34   tries to do more than that it tries to [TS]

01:24:36   give you an interface to all the things [TS]

01:24:38   that are available on all the devices [TS]

01:24:39   it's not particularly pretty to look at [TS]

01:24:40   but it will try to say hey here is the [TS]

01:24:43   show is available for you to watch [TS]

01:24:44   without expressing to where they are [TS]

01:24:46   from it it has amazon echo integrations [TS]

01:24:51   they keep doing this demo of like you [TS]

01:24:52   know watch stranger things and you have [TS]

01:24:54   like a preference list of like when I [TS]

01:24:56   say watch stranger things and you [TS]

01:24:58   determine the stranger things that shows [TS]

01:24:59   on netflix and i have three boxes [TS]

01:25:01   connected that can all do netflix I I [TS]

01:25:03   want you to prefer to use the apple TV [TS]

01:25:05   for netflix for whatever reason so we'll [TS]

01:25:07   start playing stranger things from [TS]

01:25:09   netflix through the apple TV if you say [TS]

01:25:12   watching my castle it will determine [TS]

01:25:14   that that is only on amazon and you have [TS]

01:25:16   an amazon streaming thing connected [TS]

01:25:18   somewhere and so it will start playing [TS]

01:25:19   it from that for you so the voice [TS]

01:25:21   control interfaces like you know one [TS]

01:25:23   level up from what each of these devices [TS]

01:25:25   do individually same thing with the [TS]

01:25:27   remote remote you're controlling the [TS]

01:25:28   combobox the combo box is controlling [TS]

01:25:30   the inputs [TS]

01:25:31   I wonder how they're doing the unified [TS]

01:25:35   interface it doesn't look that great [TS]

01:25:37   it's mostly just text it's not a [TS]

01:25:39   particularly rich interface if you were [TS]

01:25:40   to go to the interface to any of these [TS]

01:25:42   boxes or services it would look better [TS]

01:25:44   and have nice pictures and more metadata [TS]

01:25:45   and stuff but at least at least they're [TS]

01:25:49   trying i think this box faces the same [TS]

01:25:52   challenges as a real omnivorous boxwood [TS]

01:25:54   and that the companies that they are [TS]

01:25:56   sort of trying to insert themselves [TS]

01:25:59   between you know the customer and these [TS]

01:26:01   other boxes those boxes aren't going to [TS]

01:26:03   like that and if they don't [TS]

01:26:04   intentionally break them they will [TS]

01:26:05   accidentally break them especially if [TS]

01:26:06   their means of control involves I mean [TS]

01:26:08   like are they doing screen scraping are [TS]

01:26:11   they trying to use API is documented or [TS]

01:26:13   otherwise how are they even doing this [TS]

01:26:15   they have separate metadata somewhere [TS]

01:26:17   that's like in the cloud so it's not [TS]

01:26:19   actually [TS]

01:26:22   looking at the content or the hdmi think [TS]

01:26:23   so i don't know i don't know how they're [TS]

01:26:25   doing it it doesn't look that impressive [TS]

01:26:26   but at least they're giving it up it you [TS]

01:26:29   know giving it the old college try the [TS]

01:26:33   most interesting thing about this demo [TS]

01:26:35   are the things that are probably the [TS]

01:26:38   least technically cool in that you know [TS]

01:26:42   what calling as a glorified hdmi switch [TS]

01:26:44   is kind of mean but calling a glorified [TS]

01:26:45   receiver less less mean but if you if [TS]

01:26:50   you have a receiver or any other box it [TS]

01:26:51   takes a whole bunch of hdmi inputs and [TS]

01:26:53   one output your television you know that [TS]

01:26:56   strangely one of the challenges is aside [TS]

01:26:59   from having a million different modes [TS]

01:27:00   and having to switch inputs that's [TS]

01:27:03   that's cumbersome so one of the demos [TS]

01:27:04   they give is what if someone comes over [TS]

01:27:07   your house and they don't know how to [TS]

01:27:08   use the 17 remotes that are on your end [TS]

01:27:10   table right or even the one logitech [TS]

01:27:12   harmony remote that you have because [TS]

01:27:13   that is generally complicated an example [TS]

01:27:16   they gave the demos like what if someone [TS]

01:27:19   comes out of your house and they see you [TS]

01:27:20   have a playstation 4 BC the controller [TS]

01:27:22   sitting on the end table and they just [TS]

01:27:24   pick up the PlayStation control off the [TS]

01:27:26   end table [TS]

01:27:26   nothing is you know you just come into [TS]

01:27:28   the room nothing is turned on and just [TS]

01:27:29   pick up the PlayStation controller and [TS]

01:27:30   turn it on any reasonably good receive [TS]

01:27:33   your should be able to notice that hey I [TS]

01:27:37   was sitting here and everything is off [TS]

01:27:38   but i noticed that the PlayStation came [TS]

01:27:41   on and started sending video output so i [TS]

01:27:44   am going to see some other thing that [TS]

01:27:46   supposed to work but doesn't turn on [TS]

01:27:47   your television switch the input to the [TS]

01:27:51   you know switch my input as the receiver [TS]

01:27:52   whatever I'm to the ps4 thing and so now [TS]

01:27:54   merely by pressing the PlayStation on [TS]

01:27:57   button on the PlayStation controller [TS]

01:27:59   there it is on your screen [TS]

01:28:02   you don't have to know oh if you want to [TS]

01:28:03   play playstation pick up the receiver [TS]

01:28:05   remote switch the input number two then [TS]

01:28:06   turn on the tivo or then then turn on [TS]

01:28:08   the PlayStation make sure you do it in [TS]

01:28:10   that order [TS]

01:28:10   if you want to hear it through the [TS]

01:28:11   receiver speakers also turn the receiver [TS]

01:28:13   on but if you don't go through the [TS]

01:28:14   television they probably know you don't [TS]

01:28:15   have to know how to do that and then if [TS]

01:28:17   someone comes along and they turn the [TS]

01:28:19   roku on it will notice even the [TS]

01:28:21   playstation 4 is already on because you [TS]

01:28:23   just activated the roku using the roku [TS]

01:28:25   remote because maybe all you know is the [TS]

01:28:26   Roku but you know to help his capital [TS]

01:28:28   thing is you don't know the place in UCL [TS]

01:28:29   Roker about I work with and you just [TS]

01:28:31   turn the roku [TS]

01:28:32   one-two combo box will see it well even [TS]

01:28:35   though playstation is on someone just [TS]

01:28:38   turned the rocker arms i'm going to [TS]

01:28:39   switch the roku input and let you [TS]

01:28:40   control it with the roku remote that's [TS]

01:28:43   type of functionality should be in every [TS]

01:28:44   decent receiver and probably isn't a lot [TS]

01:28:46   of decent receivers but to me that was [TS]

01:28:49   the most impressive because it's like [TS]

01:28:50   yes that's how r receiver should work [TS]

01:28:53   and I'm glad that someone that has [TS]

01:28:56   realized this and tried to build it into [TS]

01:28:57   a box so I i start off thinking this is [TS]

01:28:59   a glorified hdmi switcher receiver and i [TS]

01:29:02   ended up thinking this is a really good [TS]

01:29:04   hdmi switcher / receiver now but not the [TS]

01:29:08   bad news the bad news is it's four [TS]

01:29:11   hundred dollars [TS]

01:29:12   alright and this forty dollars does not [TS]

01:29:15   include any of the boxes that you [TS]

01:29:16   connect to it which doesnt a problem [TS]

01:29:18   because i already have a million TV [TS]

01:29:19   boxes but like the ideas you buy this [TS]

01:29:21   box you and it's like you get nothing [TS]

01:29:22   it's like it's like buying a technology [TS]

01:29:24   with the discs in it's like yeah it's [TS]

01:29:26   there it's ready for you to plug things [TS]

01:29:27   into but it's no good to you until you [TS]

01:29:29   plug-in puts into it so four hundred [TS]

01:29:32   dollars and then hundred dollars for [TS]

01:29:35   every box depending on what am I guess [TS]

01:29:36   the apple ones are expensive you know [TS]

01:29:37   sixty dollars for chromecast six dollars [TS]

01:29:40   for cheap recall roku hundred dollars [TS]

01:29:42   for a good one whatever but if you [TS]

01:29:44   already have all those boxes and maybe [TS]

01:29:46   if you don't have a receiver [TS]

01:29:48   oh and also it's pretty big and it's [TS]

01:29:49   weird it would and it's probably not [TS]

01:29:51   going to be available to consumers until [TS]

01:29:53   2018 so always caveat besides all the [TS]

01:29:56   head [TS]

01:29:57   it's great yeah that they're gonna sell [TS]

01:29:58   5,000 sometime this year you can pick [TS]

01:30:01   three different kinds of wood three [TS]

01:30:03   different kinds of ugly would be on top [TS]

01:30:04   of it don't now that you told me that I [TS]

01:30:06   man you're really doing a great job of [TS]

01:30:08   selling this to I know yeah I don't [TS]

01:30:10   think this product is really going [TS]

01:30:11   anywhere but I was excited by the idea [TS]

01:30:13   that someone is tackled some of the very [TS]

01:30:16   basic problems of this terrible terrible [TS]

01:30:17   television age we live in where we all [TS]

01:30:19   have way too many pucks or other kinds [TS]

01:30:23   of boxes connected to our televisions [TS]

01:30:25   and very frequently watching any video [TS]

01:30:30   content involved switching inputs and [TS]

01:30:32   possibly also fishing remotes and all [TS]

01:30:35   the solutions that try to make it easier [TS]

01:30:36   are bad in some way including this one [TS]

01:30:38   but in the absence of a true omnivorous [TS]

01:30:41   box which can probably never exist the [TS]

01:30:43   same region open doctor [TS]

01:30:44   we never exist business reasons on top [TS]

01:30:46   of technical reasons equals death [TS]

01:30:48   I i like the fact that someone is trying [TS]

01:30:53   to push the envelope forward and help [TS]

01:30:55   somebody buys this company and [TS]

01:30:57   incorporates they're good ideas into [TS]

01:30:58   their own products like tivo I assume [TS]

01:31:00   now there [TS]

01:31:02   come on come on I just want to stay in [TS]

01:31:06   business they're not by anybody please [TS]

01:31:08   do not waste your money buying these [TS]

01:31:09   people [TS]

01:31:09   well I want to buy them make their apple [TS]

01:31:13   TV better Apple gonna make a box like [TS]

01:31:15   this across the neverwood but like the [TS]

01:31:17   type of the type of functionality of [TS]

01:31:18   just like can we stop people from having [TS]

01:31:20   to do a switch inputs that would be good [TS]

01:31:23   like can't just do what I mean you just [TS]

01:31:26   notice because i turn the PlayStation on [TS]

01:31:27   it probably want to play with [TS]

01:31:28   playstation just switched and put [TS]

01:31:29   automatically nice thanks for three [TS]

01:31:33   sponsors this week 0 square space and [TS]

01:31:36   Kingdom and we'll see you next week [TS]

01:31:38   now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

01:31:44   mean to be in because it was accidental [TS]

01:31:47   death was accidental [TS]

01:31:50   John did [TS]

01:31:52   research Marco in kc would let him [TS]

01:31:56   because it was accidentally was [TS]

01:31:59   accidental and you can find the show [TS]

01:32:03   know today p dot and if twitter follow [TS]

01:32:11   them [TS]

01:32:12   s/he yl ISS so that's Casey list and a [TS]

01:32:17   co-pay rm20 Marco Arment and our AC AC [TS]

01:32:26   recuse it [TS]

01:32:34   what [TS]

01:32:39   we have an odd note in the show notes it [TS]

01:32:44   says John's Mac throws some more ram [TS]

01:32:49   with more in parentheses to ya throws in [TS]

01:32:53   there's the failure throws as in it [TS]

01:32:57   ejected it it's a bit like a loogie [TS]

01:33:00   across the room kind of exception [TS]

01:33:01   handling we've talked about this before [TS]

01:33:04   that's why this is this is a second the [TS]

01:33:06   second time this has happened i think [TS]

01:33:07   i'm gonna run of ATP and i think i use [TS]

01:33:09   the same language last time the analogy [TS]

01:33:11   in trying to make here and failing [TS]

01:33:13   obviously is when a horse throws a shoe [TS]

01:33:15   you know that expression [TS]

01:33:16   mhm yeah it you know i was raised in [TS]

01:33:18   ohio where we had lots of horses [TS]

01:33:20   no I what no I don't know what that [TS]

01:33:22   means horse throws a shoe my [TS]

01:33:24   understanding I was not raised with [TS]

01:33:25   horses easier either [TS]

01:33:26   disclaimer disclaimer disclaimer you [TS]

01:33:28   know you tortures you know the little [TS]

01:33:30   metal bendy u-shaped things you put on [TS]

01:33:32   those the body and yeah i know that part [TS]

01:33:34   at least yeah and they're attached [TS]

01:33:35   somehow with like these weird-looking [TS]

01:33:37   spikes or nails or something [TS]

01:33:39   it's scary and I don't understand it [TS]

01:33:40   anyway the horses galloping along those [TS]

01:33:43   little metal u-shaped things are [TS]

01:33:45   supposed to say on the bottom of the [TS]

01:33:46   little feets but sometimes when the [TS]

01:33:48   galloping along one of them goes flying [TS]

01:33:50   off the foot and that's bad because now [TS]

01:33:52   your horses lost a shoe and it needs it [TS]

01:33:55   to walk comfortably where the horses are [TS]

01:33:58   for and it's throwing isn't like it [TS]

01:34:00   could go flying because as the horses [TS]

01:34:01   galloping the shoe goes flying so [TS]

01:34:03   basically wild like doing something [TS]

01:34:05   strenuous like encoding a video your mac [TS]

01:34:07   pro forcefully ejected one of its ram [TS]

01:34:10   sticks from its lot that's what I'm [TS]

01:34:11   hearing or not strenuous as the case may [TS]

01:34:14   be so my mac pro is very old the ramp [TS]

01:34:16   it's also very old is 2008 mac pro now [TS]

01:34:20   it is a good solid eight years old [TS]

01:34:22   pushing up on 9a forget when i bought [TS]

01:34:24   the thing throwing some ram means i have [TS]

01:34:28   86 of ramen there and every once in [TS]

01:34:31   awhile [TS]

01:34:32   what should stop working and it's like [TS]

01:34:35   my horse threw a shoe my macbook pro [TS]

01:34:37   through some ram so I came in the other [TS]

01:34:38   day and tried to wake my macpro from [TS]

01:34:40   sleep and the fans spin up at the screen [TS]

01:34:43   did not turn on and the power light on [TS]

01:34:45   the front of my macpro was blinking in a [TS]

01:34:47   very concerning way and unlike later Mac [TS]

01:34:51   Pro [TS]

01:34:52   including even the 2009 but I don't know [TS]

01:34:53   how far they went my mac does not have a [TS]

01:34:57   little set of red leds on the banks of [TS]

01:34:59   dims to tell you which ones are bad [TS]

01:35:02   all I knew is that I had a computer with [TS]

01:35:05   eight games of ram onto daughter cards [TS]

01:35:07   for NH that would not boot it just [TS]

01:35:11   wouldn't post wouldn't do the chime when [TS]

01:35:13   do anything because you know this is bad [TS]

01:35:15   around there and this has happened [TS]

01:35:17   before [TS]

01:35:18   multiple times I think I brought up in [TS]

01:35:19   case he had bad around that I had a WC [TS]

01:35:22   ramen my thing and that despite the fact [TS]

01:35:24   that my computer is so many years old [TS]

01:35:26   every time it throws throws a dim if [TS]

01:35:29   it's a no wc1 that is the problem [TS]

01:35:31   I just call them up and they sent me a [TS]

01:35:32   new one and it would be better if they [TS]

01:35:35   didn't break but after eight years to [TS]

01:35:37   throw the dim and I get a new one for [TS]

01:35:39   free [TS]

01:35:40   I still consider that pretty amazing and [TS]

01:35:43   in the the age of like you know two year [TS]

01:35:45   warranties and hard drives or whatever [TS]

01:35:47   so I had a fun afternoon of unseating [TS]

01:35:53   daughter cards removing dims putting [TS]

01:35:55   them back in every valid configuration [TS]

01:35:58   to by process of elimination find the [TS]

01:36:00   pair of them that they have to be in [TS]

01:36:02   Paris find the match pair of games that [TS]

01:36:04   don't work and even with the parents all [TS]

01:36:06   I can tell you is that one of the two [TS]

01:36:07   doesn't work out or they might both be [TS]

01:36:09   bad so eventually after many many boots [TS]

01:36:12   and and I'm good at this now many many [TS]

01:36:14   sizes of seating and seeing which is [TS]

01:36:17   actually kind of satisfying with little [TS]

01:36:18   clips that have them and everything and [TS]

01:36:19   how you shoved them in eventually did [TS]

01:36:23   find the pair of games that was bad [TS]

01:36:26   they were already see dims and I am they [TS]

01:36:29   are sending the new ones for free [TS]

01:36:32   nice so I'm down I'm down the other two [TS]

01:36:36   gigs or four gigs of ram right now still [TS]

01:36:39   doing okay let's see what I got here 14 [TS]

01:36:42   gigs of ram so i should have 18 sigh [TS]

01:36:44   come down for ok dear apple if if you [TS]

01:36:48   are still listening to this somehow for [TS]

01:36:50   some reason please put this computer out [TS]

01:36:54   of its misery [TS]

01:36:54   give John a new mac pro two x so he can [TS]

01:36:58   finally stop using this ancient one [TS]

01:37:01   please attend the terror that fills my [TS]

01:37:03   heart when I think is the time that it [TS]

01:37:05   it's like that is just dead like the [TS]

01:37:06   motherboard is dead you know that it's [TS]

01:37:08   just not going to boot right because [TS]

01:37:10   then I think about like I would have I [TS]

01:37:12   don't have to buy an imac or should I [TS]

01:37:14   just like buy the cheapest laptop i can [TS]

01:37:15   do or what I do with all my data I just [TS]

01:37:17   it's terrifying [TS]

01:37:19   so what you know I was afraid I got down [TS]

01:37:21   to this point where I was like maybe [TS]

01:37:23   just not going to boot because I got it [TS]

01:37:24   down to like just just two dimms you [TS]

01:37:27   know that the 210 configuration of the [TS]

01:37:29   two that i thought were like the newest [TS]

01:37:31   and most reliable ram and it still [TS]

01:37:32   wouldn't boot and the trick i learned [TS]

01:37:35   this time is occasionally also need to [TS]

01:37:36   do an smc reset to make it happy not [TS]

01:37:39   small-time but occasionally because i [TS]

01:37:41   was in one ram configuration and it [TS]

01:37:43   would not boot and then I did an smc [TS]

01:37:45   reset and it did boot with the same ram [TS]

01:37:46   configuration and so once I learned that [TS]

01:37:48   trick that was the easy way to make sure [TS]

01:37:50   i was you know actually testing the [TS]

01:37:53   games and I eventually did narrow down [TS]

01:37:55   and found the two that were bed so I [TS]

01:37:57   look I've gotten my thing in one bank [TS]

01:38:00   I've got two gig to gig for gig for gig [TS]

01:38:02   and the other bank i have one big one [TS]

01:38:03   big empty empty such a motley collection [TS]

01:38:05   of ram some of it Apple somewhat [TS]

01:38:08   purchase from owc in like three [TS]

01:38:09   different shipments that some of it [TS]

01:38:12   replaced over time [TS]

01:38:13   yeah my word Oh kill this machine though [TS]

01:38:17   takes a lickin and keeps on ticking ok [TS]

01:38:20   please Apple please just let John [TS]

01:38:23   replace this please [TS]

01:38:24   well it was like it's going to show up [TS]

01:38:26   slower than the apple watch but I'm [TS]

01:38:28   again yeah exactly like by the time the [TS]

01:38:31   new by the time the new Mac Pro comes [TS]

01:38:33   out if it ever does your mac pro is [TS]

01:38:36   probably going to be slower than every [TS]

01:38:38   mac for sale at that time [TS]

01:38:39   oh I'm iOS devices i think that the [TS]

01:38:41   iphone is already faster but it isn't i [TS]

01:38:43   believe at least is single threaded pass [TS]

01:38:45   that I think two generations ago [TS]

01:38:46   multi-threaded I think it still hasn't [TS]

01:38:48   but it's close [TS]

01:38:50   yes i'm saying i'm gonna watch for those [TS]

01:38:51   four the watch to start lapping me [TS]

01:38:53   yeah i mean at least if you limit just a [TS]

01:38:56   single performance it would [TS]

01:38:57   you're really looking bad compared to [TS]

01:39:00   all the iOS device but I had more ran [TS]

01:39:03   the iOS devices and have a one terabyte [TS]

01:39:04   of flash storage so take that iOS yeah [TS]

01:39:07   but they're am works all the time who 64 [TS]

01:39:10   well you don't know that until you use [TS]

01:39:11   it for eight years of the ram doing on [TS]

01:39:14   that iphone after eight years after [TS]

01:39:16   eight years that thing won't even turn [TS]

01:39:17   on it's not plugged in [TS]

01:39:18   yeah I'm sorry to hear that someone [TS]

01:39:21   who's lived through ram problems [TS]

01:39:22   recently that is no fun and i feel you [TS]

01:39:25   see how much quicker i diagnosed and [TS]

01:39:27   dealt with it rather than the rather [TS]

01:39:28   than like pretending it doesn't exist i [TS]

01:39:30   guess you can pretend business when your [TS]

01:39:31   machine doesn't boot but addressed [TS]

01:39:33   immediately [TS]

01:39:34   problem solved and also that like [TS]

01:39:37   audience he wasn't open like their phone [TS]

01:39:39   line wasn't going to just call them and [TS]

01:39:41   deal with the nice people there and just [TS]

01:39:42   read them I serial numbers and they're [TS]

01:39:43   like okay well Senor ramp I did it [TS]

01:39:45   through chat which it worked fine like [TS]

01:39:47   is their phone lines were nothing but [TS]

01:39:49   the chat was but chat i find infuriating [TS]

01:39:51   a customer support chat because I don't [TS]

01:39:55   know why take so long for there to be a [TS]

01:39:57   response because like hello my name is [TS]

01:39:59   blah blah how can I help you and then i [TS]

01:40:01   pasted in my prepared sense of what my [TS]

01:40:03   problem is that is formatted in a way [TS]

01:40:05   formatted in a way that I notice will be [TS]

01:40:08   no follow-up questions that contains all [TS]

01:40:10   the information appears here is the [TS]

01:40:14   problem [TS]

01:40:14   here's why I think this is helping how [TS]

01:40:16   long does it take you to compose that [TS]

01:40:17   sense three days i can do it on the fly [TS]

01:40:19   was it's very easy very concise right [TS]

01:40:21   but it contains all the information [TS]

01:40:22   right but here's here's my problem [TS]

01:40:25   here's why I know it's my problem [TS]

01:40:26   putting enough information to let them [TS]

01:40:28   know they don't need to take me through [TS]

01:40:29   troubleshooting steps and crap right and [TS]

01:40:31   here's what I want to happen i want you [TS]

01:40:32   to send me new ramp right like it in a [TS]

01:40:34   nice way but like all the information is [TS]

01:40:36   there and then you wait literally 10 [TS]

01:40:38   minutes for the reply and the reply is [TS]

01:40:41   can you give me the order number serial [TS]

01:40:44   number of our blog which of course i [TS]

01:40:45   have ready for them but I didn't want to [TS]

01:40:46   confuse them within the original message [TS]

01:40:47   and paste that in but by 10 more minutes [TS]

01:40:51   ten more minutes of that chat window [TS]

01:40:52   just off the side to the credit of the [TS]

01:40:54   chat thing in WC it has like a child let [TS]

01:40:56   you know in their reply because you [TS]

01:40:57   can't be sitting there waiting like [TS]

01:40:58   there's not even a typing indicator like [TS]

01:41:01   just just 10 minutes like they just [TS]

01:41:03   chatting with their friends that they go [TS]

01:41:04   for a coffee break [TS]

01:41:06   they're surely not spending this time [TS]

01:41:07   typing especially for the first message [TS]

01:41:09   there was no things and looking up in [TS]

01:41:11   the system of the system is slow we're [TS]

01:41:12   looking at the order they didn't even [TS]

01:41:13   have my order number at that point I [TS]

01:41:15   just told them what the situation is bad [TS]

01:41:17   ram want new ram here's how I know it's [TS]

01:41:19   bad [TS]

01:41:20   don't ask me to blow the dust out of my [TS]

01:41:22   socket basically like you know 10-minute [TS]

01:41:25   replying that and then so it just took [TS]

01:41:27   it an incredible amount of time but [TS]

01:41:29   during that time I was like present ever [TS]

01:41:31   we didn't bring Twitter while waiting [TS]

01:41:32   while waiting for them to reply [TS]

01:41:33   sometimes I forgot that I was still in [TS]

01:41:34   the middle of the chat like you know [TS]

01:41:36   it's long when you forgotten like a [TS]

01:41:37   little boot goes off like oh that's [TS]

01:41:38   right I my customers a partnership to [TS]

01:41:41   get new ram so hopefully that will be on [TS]

01:41:44   the way soon i'm surprised at this point [TS]

01:41:46   you don't just call them up on the phone [TS]

01:41:47   and just be like hey it's me again [TS]

01:41:49   they're like all right how big to big [TS]

01:41:51   good to all right just send it out yeah [TS]

01:41:53   i mean like if they feel they have his [TS]

01:41:55   lifetime or maybe they'll don't know [TS]

01:41:56   don't realize you by random odbc like if [TS]

01:41:59   it goes bad they'll just keep replacing [TS]

01:42:00   it forever like I think that's how it [TS]

01:42:02   works like you do have to pay to ship [TS]

01:42:04   your old room back to them but that's [TS]

01:42:06   cheap it's very lightweight right so [TS]

01:42:07   it's a couple bucks to ship over and [TS]

01:42:09   that is why by the way I saved the boxes [TS]

01:42:11   I never throw out the boxes the new ram [TS]

01:42:12   comes in [TS]

01:42:13   I just you know i'll just keep going to [TS]

01:42:16   keep getting ram forever for this [TS]

01:42:17   machine and it's fine with me write it [TS]

01:42:19   and I think it's like every every two or [TS]

01:42:21   three years that throws a dim and you [TS]

01:42:23   know I'm okay with that [TS]

01:42:25   it's like cases a BMW every once in a [TS]

01:42:27   while you know 6,000 miles the water [TS]

01:42:28   pump to go like okay so it would be like [TS]

01:42:31   after two years you just lost two cpus [TS]

01:42:33   well the CPUC that's what I'm always [TS]

01:42:36   afraid I mean ram like I could just say [TS]

01:42:38   I'm always afraid that the slots are [TS]

01:42:40   gonna go bad like that but even if that [TS]

01:42:41   did I can get by with 14 gigs ram [TS]

01:42:43   instead of 18 like I'm okay I've had [TS]

01:42:45   such a motley collection of rams machine [TS]

01:42:47   like weird amounts and weird [TS]

01:42:49   combinations is but as long as on as [TS]

01:42:52   long as I'm in the team's I'm okay for [TS]

01:42:53   what I do with this neck [TS]

01:42:55   it's just I'm trying to predict like it [TS]

01:42:58   during which year will you stop using [TS]

01:43:00   this mac with it when it dies that will [TS]

01:43:04   stop me right so it actually dies what [TS]

01:43:06   am I going to do but if it doesn't dive [TS]

01:43:08   my current plan is look this is the year [TS]

01:43:10   way to wwc there's still no mac pro for [TS]

01:43:13   it's an iMac pro either way like it was [TS]

01:43:15   a macpro maybe maybe not but if there is [TS]

01:43:18   no mac pro then I'm getting an imac and [TS]

01:43:20   if there's an imac pro I'm getting an [TS]

01:43:22   imac pro so my wife's want to just get [TS]

01:43:24   an imac now it's like I'm resigned to [TS]

01:43:26   the fact that i'm going to buy something [TS]

01:43:27   that looks for all the world like a 5pm [TS]

01:43:29   I can pretty much okay without having [TS]

01:43:30   used her as a lot of whatever they're [TS]

01:43:32   not going to make it active anymore [TS]

01:43:33   what the hell can I do the next best [TS]

01:43:34   thing is the 5k I'll be okay with it but [TS]

01:43:37   i'm not going to buy and now i have to [TS]

01:43:39   wait to see it w see what the thing is [TS]

01:43:41   is there going to be another [TS]

01:43:43   Mac Pro is there going to be a special [TS]

01:43:44   imac for pros either called I mac pro or [TS]

01:43:47   not that's when I make my buying [TS]

01:43:49   decision but the thing of it is is you [TS]

01:43:51   had a new mac pro what was it 15 years [TS]

01:43:54   ago now when when the trashcan came out [TS]

01:43:56   you had a new mac pro and you didn't [TS]

01:43:58   want that one so what makes you think [TS]

01:44:00   you're going to suddenly decide that [TS]

01:44:02   this one is ok if i have to reconsider [TS]

01:44:04   well the problem with knowing what I [TS]

01:44:05   know now is I also know about the [TS]

01:44:07   reliability issues of that one [TS]

01:44:09   like when it came out the reason i [TS]

01:44:11   didn't buy it was like well is this [TS]

01:44:13   doesn't quite suit my needs like I don't [TS]

01:44:15   think that much cpu and GPU is aren't [TS]

01:44:17   that great and it's super expensive and [TS]

01:44:18   so on and so forth but all our [TS]

01:44:20   conversations about that for with the [TS]

01:44:22   expectation that they'll wait for the [TS]

01:44:24   next Mac Pro like when they revise it [TS]

01:44:26   right like and it wasn't such a crazy [TS]

01:44:28   assumption i thought that happen maybe [TS]

01:44:30   they even did it for the cheese graters [TS]

01:44:32   even like that you know the fake new one [TS]

01:44:34   for the show was founded on like it was [TS]

01:44:36   still a revision it was still like bait [TS]

01:44:37   they change some stuff I none of us I [TS]

01:44:40   think could have predicted like there [TS]

01:44:42   were literally not release another [TS]

01:44:44   version of the machine-like ever like [TS]

01:44:47   just no no I forgot one here to you [TS]

01:44:49   through it like they just won't do it [TS]

01:44:50   and that was not in my head so it's like [TS]

01:44:52   me passing on that mac pro feel like you [TS]

01:44:54   know it's the first one like wait for [TS]

01:44:56   the second division i kinda like a dude [TS]

01:44:57   with the five-time accident by the first [TS]

01:44:59   one like marketed or even those good [TS]

01:45:00   machine like the second one came out [TS]

01:45:01   okay this is the one to get it seems [TS]

01:45:03   like it's you know everything settled [TS]

01:45:04   down there's no big problems got the p3 [TS]

01:45:06   screen that's totally what i was [TS]

01:45:08   expecting to do with trash can [TS]

01:45:09   they just never made another one and so [TS]

01:45:11   you know what can you do you make any [TS]

01:45:15   progress in your car decision we heard [TS]

01:45:18   we had a lot of feedback on that my [TS]

01:45:20   lovely if I love sweetheart can I kind [TS]

01:45:22   of do this for you Casey please Casey [TS]

01:45:25   wants a stick shift that was apparently [TS]

01:45:27   not emphasize enough in the past show in [TS]

01:45:30   the past 18 shows and the entire run of [TS]

01:45:33   neutral right if I he hasn't been [TS]

01:45:35   keeping it a secret but people keep [TS]

01:45:36   forgetting keep forgetting or people say [TS]

01:45:39   I know you said you wanted to stick [TS]

01:45:40   shift but if you considered not a stick [TS]

01:45:41   shift [TS]

01:45:42   yeah consider that case you considered [TS]

01:45:44   not a stick shift because i know you [TS]

01:45:45   said you wanted one but think about this [TS]

01:45:46   not oh you really put that when you put [TS]

01:45:51   it that way I see so not a stick shift [TS]

01:45:54   that's that what you're saying not [TS]

01:45:55   thing i want right also a pretty close [TS]

01:45:58   number two on that list was not [TS]

01:46:00   front-wheel drive [TS]

01:46:02   mmhmm yeah a lot of people say no you [TS]

01:46:06   see you don't worry about that don't [TS]

01:46:07   worry about a stick shift worry about [TS]

01:46:08   front-wheel-drive you know I got a [TS]

01:46:09   perfect front-wheel-drive battleship in [TS]

01:46:13   car for you that you're looking alright [TS]

01:46:15   that seems like that's exactly your [TS]

01:46:17   criteria [TS]

01:46:18   I mean everything exactly as they were [TS]

01:46:19   they were arguing you know they were [TS]

01:46:21   saying most people like yeah some people [TS]

01:46:23   just plain forgot because i was like [TS]

01:46:24   they were doing a whole email about the [TS]

01:46:26   the car you should get but other people [TS]

01:46:28   pitching you're saying here's why you [TS]

01:46:30   should consider four-wheel-drive it's [TS]

01:46:31   not your father's from blah blah and [TS]

01:46:33   mostly respect those pitches but maybe [TS]

01:46:35   they just don't know your stubbornness [TS]

01:46:37   now would you call that an elevator [TS]

01:46:39   pitch or an escalator pitch called an [TS]

01:46:42   email pitch and I think people need some [TS]

01:46:44   have said oh I have to think a lot of [TS]

01:46:46   people made good arguments like if you [TS]

01:46:48   were going to try to talk you out of it [TS]

01:46:50   yeah stick shift or we will drive people [TS]

01:46:52   had some good arguments based on their [TS]

01:46:54   actual experiences driving these cars so [TS]

01:46:56   I think there was a good quality [TS]

01:46:57   feedback in there but i'm not sure how [TS]

01:46:58   much help you [TS]

01:46:59   my other favorite was everyone in the [TS]

01:47:02   entire world i counted it's true telling [TS]

01:47:05   me you should buy WRX in fact in the [TS]

01:47:07   chat room as we speak two different [TS]

01:47:09   individuals are telling me to buy a [TS]

01:47:12   subaru WRX no I want allow it [TS]

01:47:15   no well so here's the thing like I [TS]

01:47:16   tweeted within a day of the show coming [TS]

01:47:19   out because I was already getting [TS]

01:47:20   inundated by it [TS]

01:47:22   two things I said you know number one I [TS]

01:47:25   think the WRX isn't classy enough I i [TS]

01:47:29   want something that's a little bit less [TS]

01:47:30   boy racer [TS]

01:47:31   secondly this is my past subaru and it's [TS]

01:47:35   a picture of my legacy GT now this was [TS]

01:47:37   after I sold it i think we might discuss [TS]

01:47:39   on the show but it was after I sold it [TS]

01:47:41   and it was dotted literally died in a [TS]

01:47:45   fire you know that phrase that I love so [TS]

01:47:47   very much died any friggin fire [TS]

01:47:50   attributing that to the car or is that [TS]

01:47:53   the owner like I picture to but because [TS]

01:47:55   you didn't own the car you don't know [TS]

01:47:56   how that happened [TS]

01:47:57   that's true however I let me remind you [TS]

01:48:00   that car smelled of gasoline / petrol [TS]

01:48:03   for most of the time that I the wheels [TS]

01:48:05   all stayed on it though unlike industry [TS]

01:48:08   this is true which was an improvement a [TS]

01:48:10   little borrow oh yeah we have a case [TS]

01:48:13   against the car wheel falls off next car [TS]

01:48:15   dies in a fire that he's doing pretty [TS]

01:48:17   well I think I didn't hear this was [TS]

01:48:19   actually just consuming its engine parts [TS]

01:48:22   in a hail of medication only yeah the no [TS]

01:48:24   big deal right [TS]

01:48:25   oh it's not what i'm going to factor [TS]

01:48:27   here Casey maybe you drive really [TS]

01:48:29   weirdly i guess i don't know but i [TS]

01:48:33   thought i had a like a few people reach [TS]

01:48:35   out with the interesting ideas and I had [TS]

01:48:38   a handful of people reach out and say [TS]

01:48:40   the Golf R is just as good as you think [TS]

01:48:41   it is [TS]

01:48:43   I had a handful of people with various [TS]

01:48:45   degrees of aggression say stop fighting [TS]

01:48:48   with this just least your damn car which [TS]

01:48:51   i think i understand that in their [TS]

01:48:54   prayers probably some truth to it in [TS]

01:48:56   fact Marco you made a pretty good pitch [TS]

01:48:57   for I don't remember that was on slacker [TS]

01:48:59   and Twitter but regardless leasing would [TS]

01:49:03   surely fix many if not all of these [TS]

01:49:05   problems but it creates other problems [TS]

01:49:08   which is you know i'm just throwing [TS]

01:49:10   money into a pit i'm borrowing a call [TS]

01:49:12   but you're doing that man therefore [TS]

01:49:13   you're there you're any ownership of a [TS]

01:49:16   car is throwing money into a pit and [TS]

01:49:18   only borrowing it no matter how you do [TS]

01:49:20   it that is the result [TS]

01:49:22   it's only a difference of of like [TS]

01:49:24   mechanics of how that actually happens [TS]

01:49:26   and it on what time scale and input [TS]

01:49:28   pattern and like what I like about [TS]

01:49:30   leasing which I said before i'll just go [TS]

01:49:32   to the very quick summary you know it is [TS]

01:49:34   not the absolute least money to spend on [TS]

01:49:37   a car like that at least one defending a [TS]

01:49:39   car is to buy a lightly used honda or [TS]

01:49:43   toyota and drive it until it doesn't [TS]

01:49:44   drive anymore that is by far the [TS]

01:49:46   cheapest and the cheapest way to own a [TS]

01:49:48   car but if you're going to go the route [TS]

01:49:51   of nice cars and in particular for go [TS]

01:49:54   the route of buying new usually Elise is [TS]

01:49:57   really nice for that because it is [TS]

01:50:00   predictable and fixed and you put the [TS]

01:50:04   risk of market fluctuations the value of [TS]

01:50:07   your car whether it ever gets in an [TS]

01:50:10   accident that like you put the risk of [TS]

01:50:12   all that and the eventual resale value [TS]

01:50:15   back on the manufacturer know and so you [TS]

01:50:18   have a very predictable guaranteed [TS]

01:50:21   next three years of here's what this is [TS]

01:50:23   going to cost me every year or every [TS]

01:50:25   month or whatever and then at the end it [TS]

01:50:28   is done it is over you don't have to [TS]

01:50:30   worry about it and am I gonna lose a lot [TS]

01:50:32   of resale for this little scratch i have [TS]

01:50:34   over here or whatever else I and like [TS]

01:50:37   and all the maintenance is included so [TS]

01:50:39   like it's just it's a way to just take [TS]

01:50:41   this weird like severe up-and-down spiky [TS]

01:50:44   expense pattern of owning a car and just [TS]

01:50:46   make it flat make it flat but expensive [TS]

01:50:49   but financing for financing new versus [TS]

01:50:53   leasing new it's kind of a toss-up most [TS]

01:50:56   it depends on the on the incentives and [TS]

01:50:58   the interest rates of of the current [TS]

01:51:00   month and and that brand-new [TS]

01:51:01   configuration looking at sometimes leads [TS]

01:51:03   actually cheaper because what a lot of [TS]

01:51:05   the brands will do is they will they [TS]

01:51:07   will use lease incentives at least [TS]

01:51:09   specials to help them reach you know [TS]

01:51:12   earnings for this quarter at it at their [TS]

01:51:15   own expense basically like the kind of [TS]

01:51:16   like borrowing as their own future [TS]

01:51:18   so you can actually that the best deals [TS]

01:51:20   in the car industry usually are for new [TS]

01:51:22   cars at least usually our lease specials [TS]

01:51:24   for that reason that you're not taking [TS]

01:51:26   advantage of the manufacturers need to [TS]

01:51:28   boost their numbers in a certain times [TS]

01:51:30   man or whatever but that that's going to [TS]

01:51:32   be less applicable to the kinds of cars [TS]

01:51:33   you're looking at honestly but anyway [TS]

01:51:35   that's where Lisa's are good they're [TS]

01:51:37   they're fixed their predictable and [TS]

01:51:39   they're kind of like if your usage [TS]

01:51:41   pattern like if your mileage driven fits [TS]

01:51:44   within one at least can do with yours [TS]

01:51:45   does then it really makes a lot of sense [TS]

01:51:48   especially for the kind of cars you're [TS]

01:51:51   looking at which are fast car sports [TS]

01:51:53   cars and you know it's one thing to like [TS]

01:51:56   to leave something more conventional and [TS]

01:51:59   more like you know low key with like a [TS]

01:52:00   lower-key not as tweaked up engine and [TS]

01:52:03   not high-performance breaks not [TS]

01:52:04   high-performance parts you know that's [TS]

01:52:06   one thing but the kind of car you're [TS]

01:52:08   looking at as you know too well now are [TS]

01:52:11   very expensive to maintain that you're [TS]

01:52:14   gonna have a problem with any any way [TS]

01:52:16   you look at this that still involves you [TS]

01:52:18   having a soul so because of that [TS]

01:52:21   that's why I think she's going to go to [TS]

01:52:23   leasing because again you're you're [TS]

01:52:25   losing a bunch of money about how you do [TS]

01:52:27   this with leasing at least it's more [TS]

01:52:29   compatible with the kind of like [TS]

01:52:31   high-powered sporty cars that you're [TS]

01:52:33   looking at [TS]

01:52:34   and it allows it to be predictable [TS]

01:52:37   there's no more surprises and I tell you [TS]

01:52:40   what that is a freeing decision like [TS]

01:52:43   because I i I've done now every method [TS]

01:52:45   of owning a car i have i have bought [TS]

01:52:47   used i have bought new buyer financing [TS]

01:52:49   and I have leased and leasing is the [TS]

01:52:53   only one of those I did more than once [TS]

01:52:55   and here's some reason for that because [TS]

01:52:58   my experience doing the other two were [TS]

01:53:00   both very poor when i bought used I had [TS]

01:53:02   a maintenance nightmare when I finance [TS]

01:53:05   knew I lost a killing on on resale value [TS]

01:53:09   because at one time had a door panel [TS]

01:53:11   replace not my fault the car was parked [TS]

01:53:13   and somebody back into my door and [TS]

01:53:15   you're gonna replace and they saw that [TS]

01:53:17   when i went to resell it and they're [TS]

01:53:19   like they could tell that it had been [TS]

01:53:20   repainted from looking at the Villa take [TS]

01:53:22   a look at like the edge on the inside [TS]

01:53:23   you can see all this repair panel even [TS]

01:53:25   look from the outside but anyway yeah I [TS]

01:53:28   i lost like five thousand dollars off [TS]

01:53:30   the resale price on that car like it was [TS]

01:53:32   horrible and it just sunk all like it [TS]

01:53:35   was it that was my cord and like all the [TS]

01:53:38   all the calculations i didn't think is [TS]

01:53:39   the best value car that best value was [TS]

01:53:42   destroyed because that resale loss so [TS]

01:53:45   everything that I thought I was doing [TS]

01:53:46   right was out the window because i had [TS]

01:53:48   bad luck similar to what you're seeing [TS]

01:53:50   out there be like everything you thought [TS]

01:53:52   of your calculation of what you're going [TS]

01:53:55   to spend in this car is being thrown out [TS]

01:53:56   the window because weird stuff is going [TS]

01:53:58   wrong and you just happen to have bad [TS]

01:53:59   luck with the maintenance on this one [TS]

01:54:01   that can happen with any car you get no [TS]

01:54:02   matter how reliable is that's it [TS]

01:54:04   this is all too silly this is why Lisa [TS]

01:54:06   and she's releasing you get the new car [TS]

01:54:09   and yes it you're paying what you're [TS]

01:54:11   paying the cost for a new car right that [TS]

01:54:13   and that's never gonna be cheap [TS]

01:54:14   no matter how you do it but if you're [TS]

01:54:16   going to get a new or newish car with a [TS]

01:54:18   lease you pay every month you get the [TS]

01:54:21   car brand-new how the exactly the spec [TS]

01:54:23   you want you custom order exactly what [TS]

01:54:25   you want you get every option every [TS]

01:54:26   color whatever you want your stick shift [TS]

01:54:28   you can get you don't have to wait and [TS]

01:54:29   find one you can get exactly what you [TS]

01:54:31   want [TS]

01:54:31   three years later you turn into the [TS]

01:54:33   dealer and you get something else and [TS]

01:54:36   you don't have to worry during that time [TS]

01:54:37   if you get like a scratch in months six [TS]

01:54:41   police [TS]

01:54:42   you don't have to look at that and say a [TS]

01:54:45   am I going to look at the scratch for [TS]

01:54:47   the next 10 years [TS]

01:54:48   and B what is gonna kill my resale value [TS]

01:54:51   or do I have to like go get this fixed [TS]

01:54:52   some really expensive because you know [TS]

01:54:54   what Lisa's have scratches Lawtons [TS]

01:54:55   built-in you don't have to pay anything [TS]

01:54:57   unless it's a really huge dent or [TS]

01:54:59   something like it just fine you just [TS]

01:55:01   turn back in and that you have a certain [TS]

01:55:03   allowance and just fine [TS]

01:55:04   like it's it's just so much easier [TS]

01:55:08   there's there's so much less also like [TS]

01:55:10   if you're kind of unsure about whether [TS]

01:55:13   you want like one of the reasons i got a [TS]

01:55:14   red car this time i'm not sure like [TS]

01:55:16   having never owned a car that was a bold [TS]

01:55:19   color before I wasn't sure I would like [TS]

01:55:21   it and but you know i'm not buying this [TS]

01:55:23   car for ten years i'm leaving this car [TS]

01:55:24   for three years so i can take a bit of a [TS]

01:55:26   risk [TS]

01:55:27   same thing with the m5 I wasn't sure if [TS]

01:55:29   I if I could deal with a [TS]

01:55:30   rear-wheel-drive car in a place that has [TS]

01:55:32   winters and if i was buying a car for [TS]

01:55:35   ten years i'm not sure i would take that [TS]

01:55:37   risk but because it was only at least I [TS]

01:55:39   knew that it was you know a much shorter [TS]

01:55:42   commitment and so I did it and it worked [TS]

01:55:45   out great now I have my red car that's [TS]

01:55:47   working out great like so I you're able [TS]

01:55:49   to take more risks with with the choices [TS]

01:55:50   you make because it isn't a long-term [TS]

01:55:52   commitment and the psychology is so much [TS]

01:55:54   more relaxed because you know it's just [TS]

01:55:57   a lease and the time you're giving it up [TS]

01:56:00   is fixed the value that you're going to [TS]

01:56:02   get it fixed [TS]

01:56:04   what you're paying every month is fixed [TS]

01:56:05   and at the end you just repeat you order [TS]

01:56:07   something else and process repeats and [TS]

01:56:10   you can you know every three years you [TS]

01:56:11   have a chance to stop doing that if you [TS]

01:56:12   want to but you know honestly once you [TS]

01:56:15   start asking hard to stop because it's [TS]

01:56:16   really really nice because he doesn't [TS]

01:56:19   want a three-year stand with a car he's [TS]

01:56:21   looking for a long-term relationship [TS]

01:56:23   anything you can also get 45 year leases [TS]

01:56:25   I I just don't know if anybody really [TS]

01:56:27   does but you can but every every choice [TS]

01:56:30   you have for that in front of you [TS]

01:56:32   you're going to have to make some kind [TS]

01:56:34   of major compromise on what you would [TS]

01:56:35   ideally want write it no matter what [TS]

01:56:38   choice you have in front of you you have [TS]

01:56:39   to compromise on something in it yet [TS]

01:56:42   like one big compromise to avoid making [TS]

01:56:45   a whole bunch of other smaller ones if [TS]

01:56:47   you choose leasing as that compromise to [TS]

01:56:49   make value you know you you object to [TS]

01:56:51   leasing seems like mostly a moral [TS]

01:56:53   standpoint you know it's it's less about [TS]

01:56:55   like whether you can afford more that [TS]

01:56:57   you just don't like the idea of it [TS]

01:56:59   if you can compromise on that everything [TS]

01:57:03   else you can get exactly what you want [TS]

01:57:06   yeah sort of i mean i guess that's true [TS]

01:57:10   but the only the only things that would [TS]

01:57:14   give me access to really is BMWs and I [TS]

01:57:19   could just buy used one or a Cadillac [TS]

01:57:21   and I can i I don't think I want a [TS]

01:57:23   Cadillac so I won't let you get the [TS]

01:57:25   Cadillac well I mean I guess what I'm [TS]

01:57:27   saying is I don't know what real at [TS]

01:57:28   leasing doesn't really open any doors I [TS]

01:57:31   don't think that aren't already in front [TS]

01:57:33   of me it just solves the maintenance [TS]

01:57:35   problem because the everything will be [TS]

01:57:38   on the I will forever be under warranty [TS]

01:57:40   what's next marker you're gonna [TS]

01:57:42   recommend a three-year marriage yeah [TS]

01:57:44   that's just what you're suggesting to do [TS]

01:57:47   our owners that's right whatever your [TS]

01:57:50   marriages and five-year marriage that's [TS]

01:57:51   great [TS]

01:57:52   try it like now that's not you don't [TS]

01:57:54   understand the relationship between him [TS]

01:57:57   and his car know you enjoyed you are [TS]

01:57:59   doing what are my other recommended [TS]

01:58:00   plans [TS]

01:58:01   not quite i would recommend if you're [TS]

01:58:03   gonna do like the maximize value plan i [TS]

01:58:05   would recommend buying a HS off lease [TS]

01:58:07   toyota or honda and then owning that [TS]

01:58:10   into the ground [TS]

01:58:11   you're doing it all you're doing almost [TS]

01:58:12   that which is by a new Honda and went [TS]

01:58:14   into the ground like that is also a [TS]

01:58:16   totally valid way to do it you know I [TS]

01:58:18   can't do the leases for two reasons one [TS]

01:58:20   try finding a stick shift undercard [TS]

01:58:24   Delise it's hard enough to find someone [TS]

01:58:26   who will sell you one from the factory [TS]

01:58:27   they do not exist and to i have a new [TS]

01:58:31   car [TS]

01:58:32   I like having a brand-new car brand-new [TS]

01:58:34   cars are awesome and together with the [TS]

01:58:35   least do it right [TS]

01:58:36   brand-spanking-new that's one of the [TS]

01:58:39   great things in life is getting a new [TS]

01:58:41   car I would never go that for like a [TS]

01:58:42   one-year-old i will eat the 5k that I in [TS]

01:58:45   depreciation that's very surprising to [TS]

01:58:47   me who doesn't like a new car come on i [TS]

01:58:49   love in your heart but so my perfect [TS]

01:58:52   scenario like if I could just invent the [TS]

01:58:54   perfect scenario i would get like a one [TS]

01:58:57   or two-year old car that was exactly the [TS]

01:59:01   build i wanted that we used by to farm [TS]

01:59:03   and driven 500 miles [TS]

01:59:05   yeah exactly that's true it and that's [TS]

01:59:07   into truth be told that was my BMW now [TS]

01:59:10   he had been driven many many miles but [TS]

01:59:12   but the only way those miles could have [TS]

01:59:14   been accrued in the time and in which [TS]

01:59:16   the first owner had it was on the [TS]

01:59:17   highway and so on paper might be my car [TS]

01:59:20   was perfect it was a relatively decent [TS]

01:59:22   turns out he was a mailman additional I [TS]

01:59:25   think that my understanding was he was [TS]

01:59:26   actually insurance stopping gonna stop [TS]

01:59:28   and go and what happens happens [TS]

01:59:30   could be but now my understanding was he [TS]

01:59:32   was an insurance like agents or [TS]

01:59:34   something like that but we will problem [TS]

01:59:36   market will probably in just 25 we cut [TS]

01:59:38   this from the show but as you guys were [TS]

01:59:40   talking I went to auto trader and [TS]

01:59:42   quickly amassed the list of makes that [TS]

01:59:45   are reasonably easily available to me in [TS]

01:59:47   the united states and i will run through [TS]

01:59:49   them alphabetically so everyone will [TS]

01:59:51   know the options in front of me and the [TS]

01:59:53   answer is that there are almost none [TS]

01:59:54   acura accurate does not believe in a [TS]

01:59:57   stick shift anymore [TS]

01:59:58   alpha [TS]

01:59:58   alpha [TS]

02:00:00   although no sticks done any other [TS]

02:00:04   questions a couple other quick notes [TS]

02:00:07   first of all porsche is theoretically an [TS]

02:00:10   option which I had forgotten but a it's [TS]

02:00:12   way too expensive be have you seen the [TS]

02:00:13   Panamera it's freaking hideous as though [TS]

02:00:15   if there's no forward our sticks the [TS]

02:00:17   Panamera doesn't come to stick doesn't [TS]

02:00:18   how you know now that you say that [TS]

02:00:20   you're probably right [TS]

02:00:21   secondly in cat in this individual is [TS]

02:00:23   not the only person who said this but [TS]

02:00:24   you're too picky [TS]

02:00:26   well thank you this is what i want i [TS]

02:00:28   don't know this is what i want i am [TS]

02:00:31   allowed to be picky from spending [TS]

02:00:32   between 20 and 80 thousand dollars i am [TS]

02:00:35   allowed to be picky so sorry tough [TS]