The Accidental Tech Podcast

217: Apology Mac Pro


00:00:00   we need more investigative journalism [TS]

00:00:02   known actually I mean with the exception [TS]

00:00:03   of I guess 9to5 mac and Bloomberg [TS]

00:00:07   because they got what's-his-name like [TS]

00:00:09   who's out there digging through [TS]

00:00:10   dumpsters to find out what the new Mac [TS]

00:00:12   Pro is going to be let's get some [TS]

00:00:13   journalism old fashion journalism on [TS]

00:00:15   this I think first Apple needs to figure [TS]

00:00:18   out what the new Mac Pro suppose yeah [TS]

00:00:19   well you know if you dig through [TS]

00:00:20   dumpsters and find out like you know too [TS]

00:00:23   bad they don't use paper anymore but [TS]

00:00:24   like find out there just now having [TS]

00:00:26   meetings about what they might do about [TS]

00:00:27   this like you can get time lines on it [TS]

00:00:29   but anyway as time passes and we wait [TS]

00:00:31   for wec to appear things could leak [TS]

00:00:33   let's you know let's find stuff out [TS]

00:00:36   let's get some engineers drunk let's [TS]

00:00:38   find out some answers yeah because that [TS]

00:00:40   always works all that gets you as a [TS]

00:00:42   pre-release iphone yeah that's the only [TS]

00:00:44   thing that works yeah I mean I can spoil [TS]

00:00:46   it for you right now John you're not [TS]

00:00:48   going to know until like it launches the [TS]

00:00:51   two things that you're going to complain [TS]

00:00:52   about and commit yourself not to buy it [TS]

00:00:54   about you're not gonna know the price [TS]

00:00:55   ain't not going to know the GPU choice [TS]

00:00:57   ah the GPU choice could leak like if [TS]

00:01:00   they're using nvidia i feel like i could [TS]

00:01:01   leak right and if they are using nvidia [TS]

00:01:03   they're going to be they're going to be [TS]

00:01:04   using pascal it might leak that they're [TS]

00:01:06   using in video but it wouldn't it [TS]

00:01:07   wouldn't leak like which one they're [TS]

00:01:09   using you know that it would leak that [TS]

00:01:10   are using pascal architecture would just [TS]

00:01:12   be a question of like which part but [TS]

00:01:14   like even that would be enough like I [TS]

00:01:15   said you know to be exciting it's been [TS]

00:01:20   so long since we talked a lot has [TS]

00:01:23   happened in the news this week of april [TS]

00:01:25   eighth or ninth or whatever right you [TS]

00:01:29   know today as we talk has obviously got [TS]

00:01:31   to be april 12 2017 of course this but [TS]

00:01:35   rather than talk about the exciting news [TS]

00:01:38   that has happened this week we thought [TS]

00:01:40   we'd talk more about what has happened [TS]

00:01:42   say early last week maybe before april [TS]

00:01:46   sixth indeed yeah we thought we'd just [TS]

00:01:49   do a recap because why wouldn't we and [TS]

00:01:51   and so here we are and so that that [TS]

00:01:55   amazing news about nintendo that [TS]

00:01:57   happened you know just a couple of days [TS]

00:01:59   ago on the 10th through the 11th we're [TS]

00:02:01   going to save that for next week the [TS]

00:02:03   good news is we've covered everything [TS]

00:02:04   that we could possibly cover about the [TS]

00:02:05   mac pro so we don't have to talk about [TS]

00:02:06   it until it comes out in 2019 so let's [TS]

00:02:09   talk about some other things do we [TS]

00:02:10   really have no follow-up trademark [TS]

00:02:13   about the mac bro that Casey get through [TS]

00:02:15   his little song and dance don't worry [TS]

00:02:17   don't you worry all right I can't even [TS]

00:02:23   take this seriously because I know that [TS]

00:02:24   I'll be murdered if I don't bring up Mac [TS]

00:02:26   Pro stuff so here we go kids that crunch [TS]

00:02:31   the things I do for you to I hope you [TS]

00:02:33   appreciate me I'm so sorry Casey I'm [TS]

00:02:36   just so sorry for you for during this [TS]

00:02:38   time I know this is this is a very [TS]

00:02:41   difficult time to be on on our podcast [TS]

00:02:44   during Mac for a week and back for a [TS]

00:02:47   week a week right you should be me it's [TS]

00:02:50   Mac Pro's ear yeah i'm going to call [TS]

00:02:53   this the the year of mac pro and we're [TS]

00:02:55   just going to keep calling it the year [TS]

00:02:56   of mac pro until they release one right [TS]

00:02:58   which might be a whole other year right [TS]

00:02:59   uh anyway all right let's do a little [TS]

00:03:02   follow-up about the mac pro and then [TS]

00:03:04   hopefully we can move on techcrunch matt [TS]

00:03:07   pans reno and team at techcrunch have [TS]

00:03:10   posted the full transcript of their [TS]

00:03:12   meeting i guess he recorded it by some [TS]

00:03:14   mechanism and had hammer one of his [TS]

00:03:17   people go ahead and transcribe it also [TS]

00:03:20   we will put that in the show notes i've [TS]

00:03:22   yet to have a chance to even look at it [TS]

00:03:24   there are definitely parts as much as I [TS]

00:03:26   snark that um that I that I think are [TS]

00:03:28   interesting that I'd like to read a [TS]

00:03:29   little more about but I have another [TS]

00:03:30   chance yet so you can check that out in [TS]

00:03:33   the show notes is that really the only [TS]

00:03:36   Mac Pro follow because how many other [TS]

00:03:38   topic I see the topic is anyway we'll [TS]

00:03:40   get to it on the transcript I read the [TS]

00:03:43   whole transcript and of course surprise [TS]

00:03:45   surprise the you know the people they [TS]

00:03:47   had their reporting on it did a good job [TS]

00:03:49   reporting on it like there's any [TS]

00:03:51   important information in the transcript [TS]

00:03:53   that you're missing you can read it just [TS]

00:03:54   to get a flavor of what they said and [TS]

00:03:56   stuff like that but this it was well [TS]

00:03:59   covered but you know it's not as if they [TS]

00:04:01   left out of major sections that were [TS]

00:04:02   important the only fun thing about the [TS]

00:04:05   transcript as you can see since it's a [TS]

00:04:06   fairly faithful transcript I would [TS]

00:04:08   imagine because it's got all people's [TS]

00:04:09   false starts and weird sentence [TS]

00:04:11   structures and stuff it's just what [TS]

00:04:13   happens when people speak you can see [TS]

00:04:17   occasionally people getting their [TS]

00:04:21   raining in their instincts one [TS]

00:04:22   particular instance is a Craig federighi [TS]

00:04:24   talking about [TS]

00:04:25   you know the old Mac Pro and the [TS]

00:04:28   architecture with the tube in the [TS]

00:04:29   heating and you know how it was [TS]

00:04:31   difficult to put different components [TS]

00:04:34   and everything and so he talks about all [TS]

00:04:35   of that and then he said how they really [TS]

00:04:39   put a lot of energy behind that design [TS]

00:04:41   and his the next bit is in retrospect [TS]

00:04:43   that was dot dot dot and he's about to [TS]

00:04:47   say in retrospect that was it that was a [TS]

00:04:48   mistake that was the right idea that was [TS]

00:04:50   not the right thing to do but he doesn't [TS]

00:04:52   say that because he's disciplined he [TS]

00:04:54   gets into the sentence for that he is [TS]

00:04:55   abort abort in retrospect that was new [TS]

00:04:58   sentence while that system is going to [TS]

00:04:59   be fantastic for a huge number of [TS]

00:05:01   customers we want to do more there you [TS]

00:05:03   go and fill smiles next to us it's a [TS]

00:05:05   good job Greggy almost you almost landed [TS]

00:05:06   in it there but anyway they're very [TS]

00:05:09   disciplined with their message Craig [TS]

00:05:12   still manages to be funny and witty [TS]

00:05:13   within the bounds of being disciplined [TS]

00:05:16   for PR and Phyllis is Phyllis fell he's [TS]

00:05:20   the guy we know and love so if if you [TS]

00:05:23   have seen a lot of presentations with [TS]

00:05:25   the people who are at this meeting then [TS]

00:05:28   you will definitely get the flavor of [TS]

00:05:29   them just reading the transcript and I [TS]

00:05:31   don't know much about John Curtis I'm [TS]

00:05:33   not sure I've ever seen him on stage but [TS]

00:05:34   he's the other guy fair enough alright [TS]

00:05:38   moving on that's then just like that [TS]

00:05:39   we're done with Mac Pro right kids right [TS]

00:05:41   okay so work alone so somebody that [TS]

00:05:44   listen star show had a conversation with [TS]

00:05:46   the support team at work flow and they [TS]

00:05:50   received the following email which was [TS]

00:05:53   then forwarded on to us the person at [TS]

00:05:55   work flow said you know blah blah blah [TS]

00:05:58   fix for your problem blah blah blah but [TS]

00:06:01   just so you know we have no further [TS]

00:06:03   planned updates for workflow that being [TS]

00:06:06   said we are continuing to support [TS]

00:06:08   workflows current functionality have no [TS]

00:06:09   plans to end supports let me know if you [TS]

00:06:11   run across any buds or crashes cue the [TS]

00:06:14   sad trombone here Marco womp womp yeah I [TS]

00:06:18   mean to be honest like you know when we [TS]

00:06:20   when workflow was acquired and we did [TS]

00:06:22   mention like you know they they might [TS]

00:06:24   just let it die or kill it outright and [TS]

00:06:27   you know have have the staff work on [TS]

00:06:29   other stuff built into iOS that was kind [TS]

00:06:31   of the the long term idea that was most [TS]

00:06:33   likely to happen I will admit I did not [TS]

00:06:36   foresee them [TS]

00:06:38   because of the way it was bought and [TS]

00:06:41   because of the messaging around the time [TS]

00:06:42   that it was bought and and what they [TS]

00:06:44   told the users I did not foresee them [TS]

00:06:47   totally stopping all updates to the app [TS]

00:06:50   right now or at least like I think what [TS]

00:06:52   what what this the other way this reads [TS]

00:06:54   it's like they might do bug fix updates [TS]

00:06:57   but that's it like no new features are [TS]

00:06:59   coming to work flow and that is [TS]

00:07:02   unfortunate but i guess not a huge [TS]

00:07:06   surprise you know because like that's [TS]

00:07:08   that's what happens with you know this [TS]

00:07:09   was clearly an aqua hire you know in the [TS]

00:07:13   sense that Apple wanted the staff more [TS]

00:07:15   than the product and whether that was to [TS]

00:07:17   make the staff work on something boring [TS]

00:07:19   like you know Mail app probably not it [TS]

00:07:22   was probably to have the staff work on [TS]

00:07:23   workflow like functionality you know the [TS]

00:07:26   automation technologies for iOS that you [TS]

00:07:28   know that's that's my guess but the fact [TS]

00:07:32   is if you're a workflow user this [TS]

00:07:33   doesn't make it any easier to take that [TS]

00:07:35   basically workflow is effectively dead [TS]

00:07:39   in in the sense that no one will really [TS]

00:07:41   be working on it anymore unless they [TS]

00:07:44   want to fix some bugs for some reason [TS]

00:07:46   but that's about it so that that is [TS]

00:07:48   pretty unfortunate for workflow users [TS]

00:07:49   and i hope i hope that in the end this [TS]

00:07:52   will prove worth it you know like in in [TS]

00:07:55   in many aqua hires what happens is the [TS]

00:07:59   product gets shut down the team goes to [TS]

00:08:01   work on something similar within the [TS]

00:08:02   bigger acquiring company and sometimes [TS]

00:08:05   that sees the light of day and sometimes [TS]

00:08:07   it doesn't or sometimes what what [TS]

00:08:09   eventually comes out of that from the [TS]

00:08:10   bigger company is not nearly as good as [TS]

00:08:12   the acquired app was and it's kind of a [TS]

00:08:16   crapshoot you don't really know so I I [TS]

00:08:17   hope that this will lead to better stuff [TS]

00:08:20   in iOS that will replace the need for [TS]

00:08:22   workflow for the people who use it today [TS]

00:08:24   but honestly you know that's not the [TS]

00:08:27   most likely outcome the most likely [TS]

00:08:29   outcome is iOS stove moves forward a [TS]

00:08:32   little bit you know we get some part of [TS]

00:08:36   this in a future version of iOS and then [TS]

00:08:40   maybe maybe you know the original staff [TS]

00:08:42   who created it goes to work on other [TS]

00:08:44   things with an apple or maybe after a [TS]

00:08:45   few years they got unhappy and leave and [TS]

00:08:46   do something else that's that kind of [TS]

00:08:49   thing is more likely to happen [TS]

00:08:51   then then iOS gaining complete [TS]

00:08:55   functionality like workflow or even [TS]

00:08:57   something close to it I tell you I I [TS]

00:09:01   place much higher odds on workflow being [TS]

00:09:05   an apple-branded application for some [TS]

00:09:07   period of time you know like that it [TS]

00:09:09   would be brought into the fold workflow [TS]

00:09:11   by Apple as a downloadable thing on the [TS]

00:09:14   App Store possibly bundled with the [TS]

00:09:16   future Wes update wild you know while [TS]

00:09:18   they worked on the next integration of [TS]

00:09:20   you know and just this is pretty quick [TS]

00:09:22   it wasn't like you said the the press [TS]

00:09:24   releases and then very shortly after [TS]

00:09:27   yeah we're not doing that in what's been [TS]

00:09:29   like 10 days like it has not been very [TS]

00:09:31   long yes at times hi I don't know I mean [TS]

00:09:34   I don't know what to make of all this [TS]

00:09:36   it's just gonna be interesting watching [TS]

00:09:39   Mike have to become a real true [TS]

00:09:42   honest-to-goodness programmer and [TS]

00:09:43   writing Python easter spells cause he's [TS]

00:09:45   gonna be he's gonna have no other choice [TS]

00:09:46   so Mike welcome to our world well no cuz [TS]

00:09:49   workflow will keep working like I think [TS]

00:09:51   they will keep it working it's just like [TS]

00:09:53   I've been flowing you know well yeah [TS]

00:09:55   well what are were their major features [TS]

00:09:57   that people want add to work for like [TS]

00:09:58   you can you can add workflows people can [TS]

00:10:01   continue to do that and share and [TS]

00:10:02   distribute those isn't the workflow app [TS]

00:10:04   is just the engine so I feel like it [TS]

00:10:06   should last people until something new [TS]

00:10:10   comes but so that that's a good outcome [TS]

00:10:12   but if you were if you were really [TS]

00:10:13   excited about the engine gaining [TS]

00:10:15   features then you're sad well so you [TS]

00:10:17   know what if you know in in the past I [TS]

00:10:20   remember like what extensions came out [TS]

00:10:21   and I think even sometime last year for [TS]

00:10:23   some reason I've discussed on this show [TS]

00:10:25   how I think the future of you are of URL [TS]

00:10:29   scheme usage on iOS is probably limited [TS]

00:10:32   because you know now Apple has things [TS]

00:10:34   like universal links which replace a lot [TS]

00:10:37   of the need for URL schemes for like [TS]

00:10:39   average juices and X callback URL and [TS]

00:10:42   things like that are used only by a [TS]

00:10:45   narrow amount of power users for like [TS]

00:10:48   legitimate purposes and there's lots of [TS]

00:10:50   abuses that they're used for and Apple [TS]

00:10:53   has slowly clamped down that over time [TS]

00:10:55   to the degree that they can with various [TS]

00:10:58   iOS changes like having to declare your [TS]

00:11:00   URL schemes that you that you query for [TS]

00:11:02   in your info type plist file and stuff [TS]

00:11:04   like that [TS]

00:11:04   but it's it's no real secret that Apple [TS]

00:11:08   is not a huge fan of URL schemes being [TS]

00:11:10   used for purposes like this that i would [TS]

00:11:13   guess Apple probably wants to get rid of [TS]

00:11:14   them and you know make them actually [TS]

00:11:15   impossible for various privacy and [TS]

00:11:18   security reasons which is completely [TS]

00:11:20   reasonable so it would not surprise me [TS]

00:11:22   at all if you know say I maybe not iOS [TS]

00:11:26   11 but maybe iOS 12 maybe end support [TS]

00:11:30   for calling other apps via openurl and [TS]

00:11:34   can open URL and at that point workflow [TS]

00:11:38   would you know they're there are still [TS]

00:11:39   other features of workflow as it exists [TS]

00:11:41   today it could do other things but that [TS]

00:11:44   would lop off such a big portion of what [TS]

00:11:46   it could do that I think that would [TS]

00:11:48   effectively kill the app and hopefully [TS]

00:11:51   by the time Apple does something like [TS]

00:11:52   that if they're going to do something [TS]

00:11:53   like that hopefully they would have some [TS]

00:11:55   kind of replacement in mind like maybe [TS]

00:11:57   whatever the workflow staff is working [TS]

00:11:59   on an apple now I hope that's how it [TS]

00:12:02   would go but the thing is with big [TS]

00:12:03   companies and with acquisitions you [TS]

00:12:05   don't know that's gonna it's actually [TS]

00:12:06   gonna go that way like that could be [TS]

00:12:08   everyone's intention and plan now but at [TS]

00:12:11   big companies things change you know in [TS]

00:12:13   six months there something else might be [TS]

00:12:15   a bigger priority they might be [TS]

00:12:16   reassigned to work on that and this [TS]

00:12:18   project just doesn't continue or [TS]

00:12:20   anything like that I mean this is kind [TS]

00:12:21   of just a side effect of the the [TS]

00:12:25   economy's going on here you know if you [TS]

00:12:29   know like I had a early on in insta [TS]

00:12:32   papers days I had a couple of early [TS]

00:12:34   discussions about aqua hires companies [TS]

00:12:38   you know some some of the big tech [TS]

00:12:39   companies wanting to buy Instapaper for [TS]

00:12:42   some relatively insignificant amount in [TS]

00:12:45   order to get me to come work for them [TS]

00:12:47   and these conversations always stopped [TS]

00:12:49   pretty early on because at that time is [TS]

00:12:52   people was making very good money [TS]

00:12:54   because it was selling for like ten [TS]

00:12:56   bucks and then later five bucks in the [TS]

00:12:58   app store and it was selling pretty well [TS]

00:12:59   and so whenever I would whenever we get [TS]

00:13:03   to them to the money part of the early [TS]

00:13:06   conversations it would very quickly end [TS]

00:13:07   the conversations because it was like [TS]

00:13:09   well it for me to stop making this money [TS]

00:13:11   from this app you're going to have to [TS]

00:13:12   pay at least X for it and that was more [TS]

00:13:15   than they were willing to pay to just [TS]

00:13:17   get some engineer to come work for [TS]

00:13:18   and the problem is that as the app [TS]

00:13:22   economy has gotten worse and as the the [TS]

00:13:26   you know big handful of tech companies [TS]

00:13:29   have gotten bigger and have had more [TS]

00:13:31   money and have even tighter competition [TS]

00:13:34   for engineering talent the reishi like [TS]

00:13:36   the the economics of this have shifted [TS]

00:13:38   so much so that it is very hard for most [TS]

00:13:42   app developers to turn down a decent [TS]

00:13:45   aqua hire deal today because most apps [TS]

00:13:48   are not making that much money anymore [TS]

00:13:51   and these companies can now afford to [TS]

00:13:53   pay a lot for good engineering talent [TS]

00:13:55   and they would rather and they're soaked [TS]

00:13:58   there's so much competition for that [TS]

00:13:59   they would rather do that then then you [TS]

00:14:03   know let these apps continue I guess and [TS]

00:14:05   so the and again like as the developers [TS]

00:14:07   of these apps you can't really fault [TS]

00:14:08   them because if someone comes around [TS]

00:14:10   offering them like you know ten times [TS]

00:14:12   what they're making now per year in an [TS]

00:14:14   upfront some to buy their app and then [TS]

00:14:16   oh you'll also have a nice stable job [TS]

00:14:19   with us instead of having to rely on the [TS]

00:14:21   ups and downs of your apps on the App [TS]

00:14:22   Store I don't blame developers at all [TS]

00:14:24   for taking those offers they you know in [TS]

00:14:26   many ways like well you can't really say [TS]

00:14:28   no to to some of these offers because [TS]

00:14:29   they're so good and the only way this is [TS]

00:14:31   ever going to change is if the economics [TS]

00:14:33   of of app development change such that [TS]

00:14:36   it is more worthwhile for people to keep [TS]

00:14:38   their apps and not sell them and not [TS]

00:14:40   take jobs somewhere else then to do that [TS]

00:14:43   but I don't see that happening in the [TS]

00:14:45   near future right if anything I see [TS]

00:14:47   things going the other direction just [TS]

00:14:49   assume the work will developers have [TS]

00:14:50   gotten to work on the Mac Pro it's a [TS]

00:14:52   safe bet rent no because apparently the [TS]

00:14:55   Mac Pro is only started a week ago and [TS]

00:14:56   they they went there 10 days ago we're [TS]

00:14:58   getting to that we'll get to it oh my [TS]

00:15:01   word you guys I didn't even start my [TS]

00:15:03   holiday party yet this is gonna be a [TS]

00:15:04   long show for me probably should we were [TS]

00:15:08   sponsored this week by fracture printing [TS]

00:15:10   vivid color photos directly onto glass [TS]

00:15:12   go to fracture me calm / podcast and [TS]

00:15:16   pick ATP to get ten percent off your [TS]

00:15:18   first order fracture lets you bring [TS]

00:15:20   special memories and your photos to life [TS]

00:15:23   they want to rescue your photos from [TS]

00:15:25   your social media feeds because if you [TS]

00:15:27   just put your photos out there on [TS]

00:15:29   Facebook or Instagram or whatever else [TS]

00:15:31   you look at them for [TS]

00:15:32   a day or two maybe and then they're gone [TS]

00:15:34   they're just into the digital ether [TS]

00:15:36   forever fracture wants you to pull your [TS]

00:15:38   favorite photos out of the digital ether [TS]

00:15:40   and get them printed and hang them on [TS]

00:15:42   your wall or give them as gifts because [TS]

00:15:44   these these prints look amazing they go [TS]

00:15:47   edge to get edge to edge right on this [TS]

00:15:49   wonderful piece of glass too thin little [TS]

00:15:51   piece of glass with this foam core [TS]

00:15:53   backing behind it so it's very [TS]

00:15:54   lightweight on the wall you don't have [TS]

00:15:55   to worry about it like falling off the [TS]

00:15:56   wall and shattering but it looks amazing [TS]

00:15:59   because it's glass across the whole [TS]

00:16:01   front surface so you don't need to frame [TS]

00:16:03   them or get them custom frame to some [TS]

00:16:04   expensive place or anything like that [TS]

00:16:05   they are their own standalone thing and [TS]

00:16:07   your photos look great these look so [TS]

00:16:11   good every time you know we have I don't [TS]

00:16:12   know probably seven or eight of these [TS]

00:16:13   around my on my office now and a few [TS]

00:16:15   more than that around the house and [TS]

00:16:16   every time somebody comes here who [TS]

00:16:18   hasn't been here before they always [TS]

00:16:19   complement these fracture Prince's hey [TS]

00:16:21   what's that those look great so you can [TS]

00:16:23   see this for yourself at fracture me [TS]

00:16:25   calm / podcast and if you pick a TP out [TS]

00:16:29   of that list we will get credit for you [TS]

00:16:31   supporting you know us and them and then [TS]

00:16:34   you will get a ten percent discount I [TS]

00:16:36   highly suggest that you check out [TS]

00:16:38   fracture for all your photo printing [TS]

00:16:40   needs and they're so inexpensive to you [TS]

00:16:42   can just get one on a lark to just see [TS]

00:16:44   how it is there they make great gifts [TS]

00:16:46   too for all the different various [TS]

00:16:47   holidays you know Mother's Day Father's [TS]

00:16:49   Day and like you know birthdays [TS]

00:16:51   anniversaries they are such great gifts [TS]

00:16:53   to give a personal photo to someone who [TS]

00:16:55   it's meaningful to check it out today [TS]

00:16:57   fracture me calm / podcast and pick ATP [TS]

00:17:00   to get ten percent off thank you to [TS]

00:17:02   fracture for sponsoring our show tell me [TS]

00:17:07   John about a possible explanation for [TS]

00:17:09   increased free space with a PFS on 10.3 [TS]

00:17:12   if you please continuing the streak of a [TS]

00:17:15   PFS follow-up and what are we on like [TS]

00:17:17   five shows in a row now I don't know [TS]

00:17:19   we're keeping the streak alive some show [TS]

00:17:23   in the past we talked about people [TS]

00:17:25   upgrading to iOS 10.3 and saying hey I [TS]

00:17:27   have more free space available on my iOS [TS]

00:17:30   device now and you know that could have [TS]

00:17:33   been clearing caches or just rebooting [TS]

00:17:35   or other things related to the upgrade [TS]

00:17:37   and not related to the file system [TS]

00:17:38   itself I heard one theory that I thought [TS]

00:17:40   was worth pondering it has to do with a [TS]

00:17:44   PFS space sharing [TS]

00:17:46   I thought you guys remember what that is [TS]

00:17:48   because I think your eyes glad we're [TS]

00:17:50   going to talk about a PFS but yep I do [TS]

00:17:52   hey it's basically copy-on-write right [TS]

00:17:54   no no it's the that's one of the [TS]

00:17:56   features but the thing they caught refer [TS]

00:17:58   to a space sharing is well is this the [TS]

00:18:00   thing where you can have like two [TS]

00:18:01   different partitions that both kind of [TS]

00:18:02   share some space and so it's kind of [TS]

00:18:04   like whoever fills the first gets to [TS]

00:18:06   keep it exactly so you got a one gig [TS]

00:18:09   disk and you can put two partitions on [TS]

00:18:10   it you can put 21 gig partitions on it [TS]

00:18:12   you're like how can you put 21 gig [TS]

00:18:14   partitions on a one gig disk can't you [TS]

00:18:15   put two partitions that are like 500 and [TS]

00:18:17   500 + 250 or 750 how can you have 21 gig [TS]

00:18:21   partitions that makes no sense as [TS]

00:18:22   exactly how space sharing works that I [TS]

00:18:24   figure with the terms are they call it a [TS]

00:18:25   container or something and within the [TS]

00:18:27   container you could have separate [TS]

00:18:28   volumes and they share that space and [TS]

00:18:30   like Marco said whoever fills it first [TS]

00:18:32   wins right and that produces weird weird [TS]

00:18:35   results for saying how much free space [TS]

00:18:37   you have any way so this theory goes [TS]

00:18:40   that iOS has I don't know if this is [TS]

00:18:42   true maybe Marco does although I've [TS]

00:18:44   heard it before that as to places where [TS]

00:18:47   put stuff one is sort of the OS [TS]

00:18:49   partition and one is the user space [TS]

00:18:51   partition and they are separate from [TS]

00:18:52   each other does that sound familiar [TS]

00:18:53   Marco honestly I've never looked that [TS]

00:18:55   low level at the OS that's a question [TS]

00:18:57   for seat for Steve trout and Smith not [TS]

00:18:58   me yeah anyway um the idea is that yeah [TS]

00:19:02   there's an arrangement that has been [TS]

00:19:03   there for a while but with a PFS and [TS]

00:19:05   space sharing it changes the way free [TS]

00:19:07   space is reported and that the increase [TS]

00:19:10   in free space you're seeing is related [TS]

00:19:12   to that now I tried to think through [TS]

00:19:13   this to say well how does that work [TS]

00:19:15   exactly what would that do and what you [TS]

00:19:16   know having the notes your experiments [TS]

00:19:19   required unfortunately because we just [TS]

00:19:20   record four days ago I have not done [TS]

00:19:21   these experiments but changing the way [TS]

00:19:25   space is both shared and reported with [TS]

00:19:27   the file system could possibly account [TS]

00:19:29   for discrepancies in what is reported in [TS]

00:19:32   the u.s. you would think that apple [TS]

00:19:33   would work this out but you know in that [TS]

00:19:36   example I just gave what is the right [TS]

00:19:38   thing to do if you have 21 gig [TS]

00:19:40   partitions on a one gig disk and you ask [TS]

00:19:43   one of them how much free space it's [TS]

00:19:44   going to say I have one gig available [TS]

00:19:45   and the ass the other one it's going to [TS]

00:19:46   say I have one gig available that's kind [TS]

00:19:48   of the truth because there's nothing in [TS]

00:19:50   the disk that both technically do have [TS]

00:19:51   one gig available but if they were to [TS]

00:19:53   both start filling really fast you're [TS]

00:19:55   not going to fit one gig into each one [TS]

00:19:56   of those things so now you have like [TS]

00:19:58   smartass file systems now [TS]

00:19:59   like well technically I have one gig [TS]

00:20:01   available I didn't lie to you right you [TS]

00:20:03   could put what you could put one gig be [TS]

00:20:05   as long as you put nothing in any of the [TS]

00:20:06   other partitions that are sharing the [TS]

00:20:08   same space yeah anyway I I really you [TS]

00:20:12   know i wish i had more information to [TS]

00:20:13   provide but i just want to bring up [TS]

00:20:14   space sharing to remind people that [TS]

00:20:16   space sharing a pms is the thing and [TS]

00:20:17   it's weird and it's this is one of those [TS]

00:20:19   things where it's difficult from user [TS]

00:20:20   interface perspective to determine what [TS]

00:20:22   is the right thing to do it's not like [TS]

00:20:23   oh you just need to update your [TS]

00:20:24   operating system to report to understand [TS]

00:20:27   a PFS and report the right thing [TS]

00:20:28   people's mental model of how space works [TS]

00:20:30   on disks does not match how a PFS file [TS]

00:20:32   you know space sharing works so i don't [TS]

00:20:35   know what they're going to do on mac OS [TS]

00:20:36   iOS you don't this doesn't manifest in [TS]

00:20:39   any way that you can see except perhaps [TS]

00:20:40   in this free space thing but further [TS]

00:20:43   news as events warrant maybe next week i [TS]

00:20:45   will have some experiments and next week [TS]

00:20:47   is actually two weeks from now oh [TS]

00:20:48   goodness alright fair enough can we talk [TS]

00:20:54   about t-shirts because we've had a [TS]

00:20:57   little bit of agita with our t-shirt [TS]

00:20:59   rolled out this year so you guys have [TS]

00:21:02   been generous enough to spend most of [TS]

00:21:04   your time doing this I have been [TS]

00:21:06   completely swamped in all aspects of [TS]

00:21:09   life this week so take me through the [TS]

00:21:11   pain and suffering that you've gone [TS]

00:21:13   through to bring t-shirts to our lovely [TS]

00:21:14   listeners I don't want to go through the [TS]

00:21:16   pain and suffering but I do want to say [TS]

00:21:18   that as usual every time we do a t-shirt [TS]

00:21:20   launch there's something that's weird or [TS]

00:21:21   wrong and hot about it and we work it [TS]

00:21:23   out this time it was about mostly about [TS]

00:21:26   size availability where as far as we're [TS]

00:21:29   able to determine we had no visibility [TS]

00:21:30   into what sizes will be available until [TS]

00:21:32   after we launch it and in that and then [TS]

00:21:35   when we launched it like the you can go [TS]

00:21:38   to the size pop-up menu like I pick the [TS]

00:21:40   shirk that I want now I need to pick my [TS]

00:21:41   size and you will see all the sizes [TS]

00:21:43   listed all the sizes that we could see [TS]

00:21:45   before lunch we can see this shirt is [TS]

00:21:46   available from extra small to 3x L right [TS]

00:21:48   and then we launched it and you go to [TS]

00:21:51   the shirt and you see that pop-up menu [TS]

00:21:52   with those sizes in it but only two of [TS]

00:21:54   them would be selectable if I usually [TS]

00:21:56   extra small and some other weird size [TS]

00:21:57   like none of the common sizes would be [TS]

00:21:59   available to you and that's bad we want [TS]

00:22:02   the shirt to be available in all sizes [TS]

00:22:03   so what we had to do for a lot of the [TS]

00:22:06   shirts is sort of delete or end the [TS]

00:22:09   campaigns which by the way some people [TS]

00:22:11   bought shirts and those campaigns and my [TS]

00:22:12   understanding is they [TS]

00:22:13   we'll get delivered it is kind of weird [TS]

00:22:14   that you you were the one of the two or [TS]

00:22:16   three lucky people who got that shirt [TS]

00:22:17   before we frantically deleted it and [TS]

00:22:19   you're sure might be titled ATP shirt [TS]

00:22:21   delete me in the emails that you get a [TS]

00:22:22   better if you get an email and it says [TS]

00:22:24   delete me that's us trying to keep track [TS]

00:22:26   of which ones are the old bad ones and [TS]

00:22:28   which ones are the new good ones and [TS]

00:22:30   anyway and we replace them with [TS]

00:22:32   identical-looking shirts but with shirts [TS]

00:22:34   from a different vendor who had stock in [TS]

00:22:36   all sizes and we've been working on that [TS]

00:22:38   working with teespring to get more size [TS]

00:22:40   it's available and recreating them and [TS]

00:22:42   so on and so forth all this is to say [TS]

00:22:44   that have you tried to buy a shirt [TS]

00:22:45   because you heard the show last week or [TS]

00:22:48   whenever and you went there and you [TS]

00:22:50   couldn't find the shirt in the size you [TS]

00:22:52   wanted or the shirt wasn't available in [TS]

00:22:54   any sizes which was true or some cases [TS]

00:22:56   like the purple one that I really loved [TS]

00:22:57   was literally available in 0 sizes like [TS]

00:22:59   you could no one could order it because [TS]

00:23:00   you could not select any sizes at all it [TS]

00:23:03   would let you hit by now and then it's a [TS]

00:23:04   please pick your size and they were all [TS]

00:23:05   disabled so that's fixed you get your [TS]

00:23:08   purple shirts now we added a few shirts [TS]

00:23:11   to be larger sizes because some of the [TS]

00:23:12   other shirts only went up to 2 XL and [TS]

00:23:14   now we have three XL and I think up to [TS]

00:23:16   5xl on the European one so and also [TS]

00:23:20   finally teespring is told us that as [TS]

00:23:22   stock comes in four different sizes and [TS]

00:23:25   different colors those sizes will become [TS]

00:23:28   available so technically if you just [TS]

00:23:31   want to you know wait and check back [TS]

00:23:33   next week or something even if the size [TS]

00:23:35   isn't available right now maybe it will [TS]

00:23:36   become available so we apologize for [TS]

00:23:38   this it's difficult we'll try to do [TS]

00:23:42   better next year as always every year we [TS]

00:23:44   have to have something last year it was [TS]

00:23:45   really expensive shipping outside the US [TS]

00:23:47   this year we do not have super duper [TS]

00:23:49   expensive shipping outside the US which [TS]

00:23:50   is good but we have some size issues so [TS]

00:23:53   thank you to everybody who's bought [TS]

00:23:55   shirts and good luck out there yeah we [TS]

00:23:58   you know last year we had to apologize [TS]

00:24:00   for the expensive international shipping [TS]

00:24:02   and this year we're having to apologize [TS]

00:24:03   for some of these operational issues and [TS]

00:24:05   we we are sorry that we have to deal [TS]

00:24:07   with this and you have to deal with this [TS]

00:24:08   the reality is that printing and [TS]

00:24:11   shipping shirts all over the world is [TS]

00:24:13   complicated and you know we every vendor [TS]

00:24:17   who does it has different trade-offs [TS]

00:24:18   we've now tried you know two of the [TS]

00:24:20   major vendors and each one has strengths [TS]

00:24:23   and weaknesses and you know we've chosen [TS]

00:24:25   a different set of trade-offs this year [TS]

00:24:26   saal [TS]

00:24:26   but we have not yet found a perfect [TS]

00:24:29   solution and we hope in the future that [TS]

00:24:31   one materializes or that we can tweak [TS]

00:24:34   things a little bit better but in the [TS]

00:24:35   meantime we're sorry please buy our [TS]

00:24:37   shirts now thank you one more thing we [TS]

00:24:40   are thinking about this is not yet [TS]

00:24:42   happened but the thing that may happen [TS]

00:24:43   is that you may get your shirts earlier [TS]

00:24:45   than you would expect we had said all [TS]

00:24:47   these things to be like a time-limited [TS]

00:24:48   campaign that we're going to end about [TS]

00:24:49   20 days from now we're still going to [TS]

00:24:51   end it that's still going to happen so [TS]

00:24:52   buy your shirts because we're going to [TS]

00:24:53   end this thing right but during the time [TS]

00:24:56   that it is running there is some [TS]

00:24:57   potential not a sure thing that your [TS]

00:24:59   church could ship like shortly after you [TS]

00:25:02   are them instead of having everybody [TS]

00:25:04   wait till the end of the 20 days and [TS]

00:25:05   then all the shirts go out at once and [TS]

00:25:06   the reason we're thinking about that is [TS]

00:25:08   it it gives you more time to hopefully [TS]

00:25:10   get your shirt in time for ww see if [TS]

00:25:12   you're coming or so you don't have to [TS]

00:25:13   wait so long or if their issues with it [TS]

00:25:15   you know anyway that's why we're [TS]

00:25:17   thinking about that and that may be a [TS]

00:25:18   thing so if your shirt suddenly arrives [TS]

00:25:20   and you didn't expect over 20 days don't [TS]

00:25:22   be surprised so apples clips app came [TS]

00:25:26   out today and I think we should spend a [TS]

00:25:28   lot of time talking about that because [TS]

00:25:30   it's my turn to talk about something [TS]

00:25:31   that I want to talk about didn't I put [TS]

00:25:33   that in there way way down below all [TS]

00:25:35   this cool new Mac Pro stuff well guess [TS]

00:25:37   what buddy it just got escalated and [TS]

00:25:41   actually I don't have too much to say if [TS]

00:25:43   I'm really honest with you so this is [TS]

00:25:44   only going to take a moment but Clips [TS]

00:25:46   came out today I played with it very [TS]

00:25:48   very very briefly and it's pretty cool I [TS]

00:25:51   like the I don't know what the official [TS]

00:25:54   term for it is but the transcribe what [TS]

00:25:56   you're saying as you're saying it [TS]

00:25:59   feature so you can turn on a like text [TS]

00:26:04   mode or it's a little speech bubble and [TS]

00:26:06   as you record speech will or your speech [TS]

00:26:10   will appear on screen so you know you [TS]

00:26:12   can hold to record and then as you talk [TS]

00:26:15   you can make it show the words that [TS]

00:26:18   you're speaking I just did that as we [TS]

00:26:20   were recording as I was saying those [TS]

00:26:22   words and it says honda accord instead [TS]

00:26:26   of hold while you record so this is [TS]

00:26:27   already going well I mean you know [TS]

00:26:30   automated transcription is still a very [TS]

00:26:33   very long way away from being good [TS]

00:26:36   reliably like even you know we you know [TS]

00:26:39   we we can criticize Apple for [TS]

00:26:40   like not being good at some of these [TS]

00:26:41   things sometimes but nobody can do this [TS]

00:26:43   very well yet you know even like the [TS]

00:26:45   fancy Google algorithms that do YouTube [TS]

00:26:48   transcription and everything like even [TS]

00:26:50   they are pretty bad at this so it's [TS]

00:26:53   going to be a fun little thing finding [TS]

00:26:55   like you know funny mistranslation to [TS]

00:26:56   people's videos sometimes and otherwise [TS]

00:26:59   it's a cool idea it's a cool use of [TS]

00:27:01   technology but yeah it's going to be [TS]

00:27:03   pretty imperfect for possibly ever if [TS]

00:27:07   not a long time it's going to make [TS]

00:27:08   people enunciate that's what it's going [TS]

00:27:10   to do I tried that feature as well [TS]

00:27:11   because I was excited to see if I could [TS]

00:27:13   do the thing that I talked about when we [TS]

00:27:15   first talked about clips which is make [TS]

00:27:18   the words appear over the video with [TS]

00:27:20   with a cadence with the purpose like say [TS]

00:27:22   things in a certain way and emphasize [TS]

00:27:24   certain things to have the words appear [TS]

00:27:25   with that rhythm and the lag seem to be [TS]

00:27:28   so big I'm not quite sure why whether [TS]

00:27:30   it's the you know rendering it on top of [TS]

00:27:31   the video versus understanding the [TS]

00:27:33   speech or whatever but the lag was so [TS]

00:27:35   much worse than for example when you [TS]

00:27:37   talk to one of Google now or the hell [TS]

00:27:39   they call it hard work where it shows [TS]

00:27:41   your words in real time or even Siri [TS]

00:27:42   these days but Google now was the first [TS]

00:27:44   one I remember being startled by exactly [TS]

00:27:46   how fast the words were appearing as I [TS]

00:27:47   spoke them that there wasn't a delay [TS]

00:27:49   that it wasn't like let me just think [TS]

00:27:50   about what you just said and make it [TS]

00:27:52   appear that it seemed to follow my [TS]

00:27:53   cadence and clips clips lags I found it [TS]

00:27:57   difficult even when trying to emphasize [TS]

00:27:59   in a very exaggerated rhythm to get that [TS]

00:28:02   rhythm to manifest in the video so oh [TS]

00:28:04   well the people using real video editors [TS]

00:28:06   can continue to dominate in the perfect [TS]

00:28:09   timing of their word appearances and [TS]

00:28:11   transitions but the meantime yeah it is [TS]

00:28:13   a cool app and the effects are really [TS]

00:28:15   neat and it makes it so easy to do [TS]

00:28:17   something you don't need any expertise [TS]

00:28:19   in any kind of video editing or [TS]

00:28:20   production you just need to be able to [TS]

00:28:22   tap things on the screen and hold your [TS]

00:28:24   finger on a giant red button and you [TS]

00:28:26   will make cool videos yeah i like i said [TS]

00:28:29   i only played with it briefly but really [TS]

00:28:30   really impressed with what I've seen so [TS]

00:28:32   far I also really like I think this was [TS]

00:28:35   covered on connected recently I forget [TS]

00:28:38   where I heard it but um rather than [TS]

00:28:41   rather than Apple trying to make their [TS]

00:28:44   own social network and do something [TS]

00:28:45   ridiculous like that they're actually [TS]

00:28:46   just embracing other social networks so [TS]

00:28:50   this is an app to pipe your video into [TS]

00:28:53   other [TS]

00:28:54   faces which i think is really smart did [TS]

00:28:56   you see her that I'm connected what did [TS]

00:28:58   we talk about it it's fine damn fine [TS]

00:29:00   it's like you thought you're on the show [TS]

00:29:02   with me when I said that same thing but [TS]

00:29:04   it's fine you can cite connected it's [TS]

00:29:06   all a blur monette event follow-up Casey [TS]

00:29:08   yeah you know they did it's it's weird [TS]

00:29:10   we appropriated it but it was all that I [TS]

00:29:11   actually heard that from some wasn't [TS]

00:29:13   connected with what was it bonanza that [TS]

00:29:14   did the the thing with like the echo and [TS]

00:29:16   reverb good god no that was that was [TS]

00:29:19   either the prompter connected all right [TS]

00:29:20   well anyway someone wrote me to say I [TS]

00:29:23   totally thought they invented it because [TS]

00:29:24   they had a cool sound effect follow [TS]

00:29:25   anyway they've been said they've been [TS]

00:29:27   set straight oh good so anyhow my very [TS]

00:29:33   brief playing with this app I definitely [TS]

00:29:35   like it although it confirmed to some [TS]

00:29:37   degree that I'm an old man because I it [TS]

00:29:40   took me a minute to realize how to share [TS]

00:29:42   a video that I created because it didn't [TS]

00:29:46   it wasn't obvious to me that in the like [TS]

00:29:48   creation screen is where you're doing [TS]

00:29:52   all your mod modifications and edits and [TS]

00:29:54   whatnot and from what I can tell you [TS]

00:29:56   have to back out to your like library [TS]

00:29:58   screen in order to actually share [TS]

00:30:00   something which I thought was a little [TS]

00:30:01   peculiar but you know whatever but [TS]

00:30:04   either way I in my very brief playing [TS]

00:30:06   with it I I really really like it and I [TS]

00:30:09   don't know that i'll use it that much [TS]

00:30:10   but it was really cool the only [TS]

00:30:12   complaint I have about it which actually [TS]

00:30:15   is probably for the best is that I kind [TS]

00:30:18   of wish it wasn't just square so as an [TS]

00:30:20   example I had recorded a video of myself [TS]

00:30:24   and Declan very quickly and I wanted to [TS]

00:30:27   share it as an Instagram story and when [TS]

00:30:30   I sucked it into Instagram it looked [TS]

00:30:32   awful and it was like only the center of [TS]

00:30:35   the of the video and it took me a second [TS]

00:30:38   to realize oh it's scaling it because [TS]

00:30:41   the video is square but Instagram [TS]

00:30:43   stories annoyingly our portrait only and [TS]

00:30:46   so it's just doing the best I can but [TS]

00:30:48   that ruined my video and so that was a [TS]

00:30:50   little frustrating but to be honest it's [TS]

00:30:52   probably for the best that um that that [TS]

00:30:56   that it is square because it's kind of [TS]

00:30:58   generic I also didn't see a way to share [TS]

00:31:00   to twitter but that again could be user [TS]

00:31:02   error and i only looked for a moment but [TS]

00:31:04   all in all I definitely liked it and I [TS]

00:31:05   think it's pretty good they gotta fix [TS]

00:31:07   that the answer [TS]

00:31:08   story thing that's not a minor issue is [TS]

00:31:09   that like I said the whole point of this [TS]

00:31:11   is to is to share another networks and [TS]

00:31:13   you have Instagram stories is does the [TS]

00:31:15   particular format the app needs to [TS]

00:31:17   support that in some way you can leave [TS]

00:31:19   the defaults is whatever they are but [TS]

00:31:21   someone who wants to use this app [TS]

00:31:23   primarily as a way to do instrum stories [TS]

00:31:25   that is not going to do it if they you [TS]

00:31:27   know it just won't feel it won't feel [TS]

00:31:29   right to not be able to shoot it in the [TS]

00:31:31   same aspect ratio so get on that clip [TS]

00:31:33   steam all right uh let's see what else [TS]

00:31:37   has happened recently now that was your [TS]

00:31:39   one you get your one that all cheese dad [TS]

00:31:42   wow that's how it is hi fine let me go [TS]

00:31:46   pass out hi kids have fun I'll see them [TS]

00:31:48   I'll see you next week make a drink I [TS]

00:31:50   can't it's all the way downstairs [TS]

00:31:51   there's non Mac Pro stuff will clear the [TS]

00:31:54   mac pro eventually and come out the [TS]

00:31:57   other side in 2019 into the sunlight [TS]

00:32:00   where we'll discuss patents and nvidia [TS]

00:32:03   drivers and all sorts of other things i [TS]

00:32:05   think we'll make it okay see you guys [TS]

00:32:07   next week so this is more mac pro ! the [TS]

00:32:11   show notes say i'm pretty sure i didn't [TS]

00:32:13   do that i I you know I didn't do it I [TS]

00:32:15   think I put the word more in there the [TS]

00:32:18   first bit is a rumor that I don't know [TS]

00:32:21   how much you know worth too attached to [TS]

00:32:25   but it is a rumor and it has been [TS]

00:32:27   reblogged as we used to say all over the [TS]

00:32:30   place which does not make it any more [TS]

00:32:32   true but anyway it's from OS news OS [TS]

00:32:36   news com and it is a rumor cited to [TS]

00:32:40   people and sources who know their stuff [TS]

00:32:43   that kills confidence that definitely [TS]

00:32:48   means it's true that's that's the way [TS]

00:32:52   rumors should be cited because that [TS]

00:32:54   again matches the the reliability this [TS]

00:32:59   says the macro was in limbo in size [TS]

00:33:00   Apple the decision to go ahead and [TS]

00:33:02   develop a modular Mac blurp low [TS]

00:33:04   replacement seems to have been made only [TS]

00:33:06   in recent months with development [TS]

00:33:08   starting only a few weeks ago so we were [TS]

00:33:11   last year we're talking about all this [TS]

00:33:12   you know seems like it must have [TS]

00:33:13   happened at the earliest during the last [TS]

00:33:16   12 months probably during last six [TS]

00:33:18   months this one says in recent months [TS]

00:33:19   the decision was made [TS]

00:33:21   and development started only a few weeks [TS]

00:33:22   ago so that is the tightest timeline i [TS]

00:33:25   have seen even suggested and then it [TS]

00:33:27   goes on to say why why did Apple do this [TS]

00:33:29   what why did Apple make them 180 on the [TS]

00:33:31   mac pro and the reason cited is a more [TS]

00:33:34   specific version of a thing we've talked [TS]

00:33:35   about a lot that apple was surprised by [TS]

00:33:38   the reaction of the macbook pro with [TS]

00:33:40   touch bar which heard from many [TS]

00:33:42   different places in a vague sort of [TS]

00:33:44   Apple thought that everyone was going to [TS]

00:33:47   love their product and the negative [TS]

00:33:50   reaction in the press if not in the [TS]

00:33:52   sales numbers caught them by surprise [TS]

00:33:53   and so this adds some more detail to [TS]

00:33:56   that with some more vaguely source [TS]

00:33:58   rumors after it says after announcement [TS]

00:34:02   of the new mac pro with the macbook pro [TS]

00:34:04   with touch bar orders for refurbished [TS]

00:34:06   old macbook pro supposedly went through [TS]

00:34:08   the roof and after the initial batch of [TS]

00:34:10   reviews came out they shot up even [TS]

00:34:11   higher so that would be a signal that I [TS]

00:34:14   think Apple would pay attention to hey [TS]

00:34:16   we've got the new macbook pro a touch [TS]

00:34:17   bar and the refurbished version of the [TS]

00:34:20   old one goes up really high now to [TS]

00:34:23   believe this you have to a believe this [TS]

00:34:24   is founded on anything and be you have [TS]

00:34:26   to believe that this is not something [TS]

00:34:27   that always happens every time a new [TS]

00:34:28   model is introduced which I'm not [TS]

00:34:30   entirely sure because maybe every time [TS]

00:34:31   you introduce two new model is different [TS]

00:34:32   from the old one people by the [TS]

00:34:34   refurbished ones really quickly because [TS]

00:34:35   they want to get their last chance to [TS]

00:34:36   get the model they know and love but [TS]

00:34:38   anyway that is a suggestion how that [TS]

00:34:42   would reflect on the Mac Pro it would be [TS]

00:34:44   just basically like we thought we knew [TS]

00:34:45   what pros wanted but we seem to be wrong [TS]

00:34:48   and they say similar combined with the [TS]

00:34:50   problems of the LG Display and stuff [TS]

00:34:53   like that and then finally to add more [TS]

00:34:56   exciting on source rumors that will make [TS]

00:34:58   Marco happy if you can bring himself to [TS]

00:35:00   believe in briefly so far I can't go [TS]

00:35:03   ahead yeah Apple is said to be exploring [TS]

00:35:05   additional retina macbook pro models [TS]

00:35:07   without the touch bar Oh wouldn't you [TS]

00:35:09   love that so there's something for [TS]

00:35:12   everybody in this vaguely source rumor [TS]

00:35:14   but again I you know since since people [TS]

00:35:18   are talking about it like I do believe [TS]

00:35:22   that the the new Mac Pro decision end [TS]

00:35:24   project were very recent I'm not sure [TS]

00:35:28   her believed a few weeks ago but very [TS]

00:35:30   recent and I do believe that Apple was [TS]

00:35:32   surprised by the press react [TS]

00:35:35   to the macbook pro with touch bars as [TS]

00:35:37   Apple emphasizes every time you talk to [TS]

00:35:39   them about it including the transcript [TS]

00:35:40   that we cited before the new macbook pro [TS]

00:35:42   would touch bar is incredibly popular [TS]

00:35:44   and has the most orders ever of any [TS]

00:35:45   laptop evel's ever produced people love [TS]

00:35:48   it and it's awesome and all the numbers [TS]

00:35:49   are great for it but like so many other [TS]

00:35:51   things Apple said in that transcript and [TS]

00:35:53   about the Mac Pro and everything they [TS]

00:35:56   may be true but if you don't update a [TS]

00:35:59   model for a really long time some of [TS]

00:36:02   these results fall out of it you know [TS]

00:36:04   like we're not really selling a lot of [TS]

00:36:06   mac pro screw people buy them well you [TS]

00:36:08   haven't updated it in years so that's a [TS]

00:36:10   self-fulfilling prophecy as we've [TS]

00:36:12   discussed before and the mac pro pro [TS]

00:36:14   touch bar is the best-selling model ever [TS]

00:36:15   well again the macbook pro was a little [TS]

00:36:18   bit overdue for an update so there's [TS]

00:36:20   pent-up demand for it and the then you [TS]

00:36:25   have to map and like the curve like our [TS]

00:36:26   mac sales increasing overall I think the [TS]

00:36:29   macbook pro is a successful product for [TS]

00:36:31   them but again I do believe that Apple [TS]

00:36:32   was surprised by the negative reaction [TS]

00:36:35   of some of the press about it they even [TS]

00:36:37   emphasized in the transcript by the way [TS]

00:36:38   went back to the well on the battery [TS]

00:36:41   life of like their metrics say that the [TS]

00:36:43   battery life for the new macbook pro [TS]

00:36:45   with touch bar is better than the [TS]

00:36:46   outgoing ones I believe that too you [TS]

00:36:48   know what because the outgoing ones are [TS]

00:36:50   old and the new models are brand-new [TS]

00:36:52   don't feel that I'm sure they factor [TS]

00:36:55   that in and I'm sure they can tell the [TS]

00:36:56   age and normalize for it or whatever but [TS]

00:36:58   it's difficult to to hang your hat on a [TS]

00:37:01   lot of the stats because every what's [TS]

00:37:02   that they say I'm like a hundred percent [TS]

00:37:04   believe that but I also don't have [TS]

00:37:06   enough information to to really tell [TS]

00:37:09   whether it shows the thing you're saying [TS]

00:37:12   that it shows what they're trying to say [TS]

00:37:14   it shows this name the new macbook pro [TS]

00:37:15   with touch bar has better battery life [TS]

00:37:17   than our outgoing model but you haven't [TS]

00:37:19   given me enough information to believe [TS]

00:37:20   that all you've said is the stats say [TS]

00:37:23   people are getting better a better [TS]

00:37:24   battery life out of it than the old one [TS]

00:37:26   you don't tell me whether you've [TS]

00:37:26   controlled for the age of the machines [TS]

00:37:28   and you know you don't tell me if it's [TS]

00:37:32   an average or usage of what the [TS]

00:37:33   percentiles are what the histogram looks [TS]

00:37:35   like and also as well as tough as Marcos [TS]

00:37:36   pointed out many other times you get [TS]

00:37:38   fantastic battery life out of these new [TS]

00:37:39   models until you do something intensive [TS]

00:37:41   and then I tank and I bet if more people [TS]

00:37:43   don't do in terms of things people [TS]

00:37:44   aren't playing games with their laptop [TS]

00:37:46   unplugged because they did their game [TS]

00:37:48   be over in two and a half hours they're [TS]

00:37:50   lucky yeah and that would really bring [TS]

00:37:52   the numbers down but most people just [TS]

00:37:53   don't play and don't do that so that [TS]

00:37:54   doesn't show up in the stat so anyway I [TS]

00:37:56   want to go off on that tangent but [TS]

00:37:57   that's that's where my men mind went [TS]

00:38:00   when reading this weird rumor believe it [TS]

00:38:02   if you want to feel good for a little [TS]

00:38:03   while yeah i mean this this is not an [TS]

00:38:06   incredibly reliable source this is not [TS]

00:38:09   like somebody with a great track record [TS]

00:38:11   I don't lend a lot of credibility to [TS]

00:38:13   this basically it lines up with solemn [TS]

00:38:16   the other thing is that we've heard here [TS]

00:38:17   and there but not very strongly and [TS]

00:38:19   honestly for the most part it doesn't [TS]

00:38:22   really matter I think what matters is [TS]

00:38:24   Apple is at least you know if we believe [TS]

00:38:29   what they said and I don't think we have [TS]

00:38:30   any reason not to they were on a bad [TS]

00:38:33   path before they have finally recognized [TS]

00:38:36   that and yes they did recognize it [TS]

00:38:38   pretty late down that path they did not [TS]

00:38:41   recognize they were on a bad path in [TS]

00:38:42   2013 like it took a lot longer than that [TS]

00:38:45   I would guess they recognize it in 2016 [TS]

00:38:48   sometime possibly even 2017 but the fact [TS]

00:38:52   is they are on the path to fixing it [TS]

00:38:56   something has clearly switched an apple [TS]

00:39:00   it's like something has clearly flipped [TS]

00:39:02   over or changed to to make them make [TS]

00:39:05   this decision because before this it was [TS]

00:39:09   very clear that they were doing things [TS]

00:39:13   their way what they thought was right [TS]

00:39:14   which involved a lot of things that did [TS]

00:39:17   not serve Pro users basically he [TS]

00:39:19   involved Singh saying no a lot and [TS]

00:39:22   taking a long time to do pretty much [TS]

00:39:24   everything and ignoring a lot of product [TS]

00:39:26   lines and and and to some degree this is [TS]

00:39:29   still what they're doing you know the [TS]

00:39:31   not a lot has changed in in their actual [TS]

00:39:34   actions here I think it probably will [TS]

00:39:37   over the next you know two years or so [TS]

00:39:39   as some of the stuff shakes out because [TS]

00:39:41   clearly something has changed to to make [TS]

00:39:44   them do this 180 on the Mac Pro because [TS]

00:39:45   again like they didn't decide three [TS]

00:39:49   years ago that this design needed to be [TS]

00:39:51   replaced and it took them three years [TS]

00:39:54   plus whatever is going to be nowt to do [TS]

00:39:55   it no they decided three years ago to [TS]

00:39:57   stop development Mac Pro and they have [TS]

00:40:00   been effectively [TS]

00:40:02   looking for what however many you know [TS]

00:40:04   whatever time span between then and [TS]

00:40:07   within the last few months they have [TS]

00:40:10   thought we don't need it we don't need [TS]

00:40:11   to develop mac pro anymore this is a [TS]

00:40:13   dead product line it is no longer [TS]

00:40:15   necessary for us to do we won't do it [TS]

00:40:17   well it's not like they weren't [TS]

00:40:18   developing in the buzz that something [TS]

00:40:19   came on the transcript like that they [TS]

00:40:21   further emphasized in the details that [TS]

00:40:23   they did think about upgrading this [TS]

00:40:26   component or that component they didn't [TS]

00:40:27   say that they actually tried it out but [TS]

00:40:29   how else would they have known that they [TS]

00:40:30   couldn't support like some one of the [TS]

00:40:32   the people present or one of the press [TS]

00:40:34   people present asked them specifically [TS]

00:40:35   oh so you I think maybe as panzram [TS]

00:40:37   saying so you were thinking like oh we [TS]

00:40:38   could increase the GPU frequency by 300 [TS]

00:40:41   megahertz because that doesn't quite [TS]

00:40:42   seem worth it so we won't bother [TS]

00:40:43   updating it and one of the apple evil [TS]

00:40:46   said yes exactly yet that what you said [TS]

00:40:48   is what happened like so it they stopped [TS]

00:40:51   developing it in terms of ever releasing [TS]

00:40:54   products but it seemed like at least in [TS]

00:40:56   the beginning they would love to have [TS]

00:40:57   done a spec bump or component bump but [TS]

00:40:59   they just couldn't do it because the [TS]

00:41:01   design they had didn't support what they [TS]

00:41:03   had decided is basically we're not going [TS]

00:41:05   to invest in entirely new model so if [TS]

00:41:07   you can't update this one and the [TS]

00:41:08   engineer say we can't because they [TS]

00:41:10   either tested or ran the numbers or [TS]

00:41:11   whatever we'll look into it again when [TS]

00:41:13   the next round of GPUs and CPUs comes [TS]

00:41:15   out but in the meantime no you can't [TS]

00:41:17   have the budget to make a new one so [TS]

00:41:19   it's semantics say does that mean [TS]

00:41:20   stopping support or whatever but it does [TS]

00:41:21   mean that they they they would have [TS]

00:41:23   liked to have been able to offer speed [TS]

00:41:26   bumps in this one because it is [TS]

00:41:27   embarrassing to offer the same high-end [TS]

00:41:29   computer for multiple years without not [TS]

00:41:31   making it any faster well I die I would [TS]

00:41:34   nitpick a little about that I'm not [TS]

00:41:35   gonna go too far into it now for KC sake [TS]

00:41:37   but that's buddy but yeah I think they [TS]

00:41:40   could have done more in the meantime [TS]

00:41:42   like they could have updated to see the [TS]

00:41:45   CPU was thermally fine it was only the [TS]

00:41:47   GPU thermal balance that was the issue [TS]

00:41:49   with that design they could have updated [TS]

00:41:52   the CPU to the same model like the [TS]

00:41:54   equivalent models in the new families [TS]

00:41:56   and then they could have updated the [TS]

00:41:58   GPUs to more mid-range mid temperature [TS]

00:42:02   models over the years like they didn't [TS]

00:42:04   have to keep selling three and a half [TS]

00:42:05   year old parts like they could have [TS]

00:42:08   updated it by using similar class parts [TS]

00:42:11   there that they already used in that [TS]

00:42:12   design it wouldn't have been as [TS]

00:42:15   competitive but it is even less [TS]

00:42:18   competitive with three year old parts [TS]

00:42:19   they were saying they didn't think that [TS]

00:42:21   trade-off was worth it like the yep we [TS]

00:42:22   could have the parts that would fit in [TS]

00:42:24   there weren't better enough to warrant [TS]

00:42:26   it now arguably after three years if you [TS]

00:42:27   had merely done that thing that you [TS]

00:42:29   never thought was worth it a couple of [TS]

00:42:30   times then you would be farther from [TS]

00:42:31   where you are or even he wait till the [TS]

00:42:33   end and done it that's definitely [TS]

00:42:35   arguable but you know at some point I [TS]

00:42:37   think it really was you know so far on [TS]

00:42:40   the back burner that they weren't even [TS]

00:42:41   entertaining updates to it but what they [TS]

00:42:44   said in this thing was you know even [TS]

00:42:46   though we could have made incremental [TS]

00:42:47   improvements the incremental [TS]

00:42:48   improvements didn't seem worthwhile I [TS]

00:42:50   guess I couldn't justify whatever it [TS]

00:42:52   would take to you know the basically the [TS]

00:42:53   overhead of ever doing a spec bump and [TS]

00:42:55   making new models and doing all the [TS]

00:42:57   stuff or whatever this is taking [TS]

00:42:59   everything they said at face value who [TS]

00:43:00   knows but actually what's actually going [TS]

00:43:01   on and how far along they got with any [TS]

00:43:03   kind of upgrades this thing and at what [TS]

00:43:06   point they were nixed whether in the [TS]

00:43:08   idea phase or after it had been almost [TS]

00:43:10   ready for sale you never tell because [TS]

00:43:11   all we see is what they actually release [TS]

00:43:13   right but anyway so the point I was [TS]

00:43:15   trying to make is obviously something [TS]

00:43:17   has changed with with apples philosophy [TS]

00:43:21   or the whatever they're using to make [TS]

00:43:24   these decisions of whether to invest in [TS]

00:43:26   certain product lines whether to update [TS]

00:43:28   them or not because they were clearly [TS]

00:43:30   going in one direction for some time and [TS]

00:43:32   they are still going in that direction [TS]

00:43:33   for most the product lines I mean you [TS]

00:43:35   know nothing has changed in their [TS]

00:43:37   releases yet but it's pretty clear if [TS]

00:43:39   you look at the release schedule since [TS]

00:43:41   about 2012 everything slowed down and it [TS]

00:43:45   seemed like they went from releasing as [TS]

00:43:48   much as they could in most the product [TS]

00:43:50   lines to releasing as little as they [TS]

00:43:53   could get away with and that is [TS]

00:43:56   worrisome and that's what we've been [TS]

00:43:57   complaining about for years and so it [TS]

00:44:00   does it seems like whatever was causing [TS]

00:44:03   that to be the result maybe a maybe a [TS]

00:44:07   change has happened there in their [TS]

00:44:09   thinking or their decision making or [TS]

00:44:12   whatever else something has changed to [TS]

00:44:14   make apple flip around on the mac pro [TS]

00:44:17   and on displays and have this meeting [TS]

00:44:20   and tell us what they were thinking like [TS]

00:44:22   I hope that doesn't just apply to [TS]

00:44:25   placating the media enough for the mac [TS]

00:44:28   pro [TS]

00:44:29   thing to say okay well now Apple cares [TS]

00:44:30   about us again in the end I hope that [TS]

00:44:32   applies to their entire thinking about [TS]

00:44:34   all their products I'm tired of Apple [TS]

00:44:39   seemingly thinking you know what if we [TS]

00:44:41   can't do something incredibly innovative [TS]

00:44:43   and awesome we're better off just doing [TS]

00:44:45   nothing you know I think that's the [TS]

00:44:47   wrong approach I think they should they [TS]

00:44:49   should be saying yes to things that are [TS]

00:44:52   simple updates to their products like [TS]

00:44:53   it's one thing to spread yourself too [TS]

00:44:56   thin with new stuff you know new [TS]

00:44:58   initiatives new you know new heart [TS]

00:45:01   entire product lines things like that [TS]

00:45:02   that you could make an argument and we [TS]

00:45:05   have that they should you know be really [TS]

00:45:07   careful with that because it's hard it's [TS]

00:45:09   it's a huge risk of spread themselves [TS]

00:45:10   too thin but it is not hard it shouldn't [TS]

00:45:14   you know it if it's hard for them to [TS]

00:45:16   like update the Mac Mini with the same [TS]

00:45:18   processor line but the new version of it [TS]

00:45:21   like if that's hard they've set that up [TS]

00:45:23   wrong like they are a huge company with [TS]

00:45:26   tons and tons of money and tons of [TS]

00:45:28   engineering resources they should be [TS]

00:45:31   able to do what I described last week as [TS]

00:45:33   like boring updates like what if there's [TS]

00:45:35   a new processor put it in and start [TS]

00:45:37   selling it to all the products that [TS]

00:45:38   could use it like that there is no [TS]

00:45:40   reason why they need to do things like [TS]

00:45:43   what like what the Mac Mini is right now [TS]

00:45:45   right which is like sitting around with [TS]

00:45:48   ancient parts being neglected the last [TS]

00:45:50   he made it worse than it was before [TS]

00:45:52   there's nothing stopping them from doing [TS]

00:45:54   a new mac mini except high high up [TS]

00:45:57   somewhere they have decided that that is [TS]

00:45:59   not worth investing any resources into [TS]

00:46:00   at all and I think that's a mistake and [TS]

00:46:03   maybe we'll see something that turn [TS]

00:46:05   around again probably not especially [TS]

00:46:06   like the mac mini has always been a very [TS]

00:46:08   diluted product but I don't think that's [TS]

00:46:11   that's not a good excuse like if Apple [TS]

00:46:13   really wants like to fulfill what they [TS]

00:46:16   say they are and make the best products [TS]

00:46:18   for people that they can and only make [TS]

00:46:20   great stuff like they sit that's what [TS]

00:46:22   they say they do that isn't always true [TS]

00:46:23   but that is what they say to do and I [TS]

00:46:25   believe that's what they want to do and [TS]

00:46:26   that is what that is what they want to [TS]

00:46:27   be then they have to set up their [TS]

00:46:30   product line in a way that allows them [TS]

00:46:33   and end their management structure and [TS]

00:46:35   their priorities they have to set this [TS]

00:46:36   up in a way that allows them to not [TS]

00:46:40   leave things in complete neglect for [TS]

00:46:42   years because they aren't the most [TS]

00:46:45   profitable product lines in the world [TS]

00:46:46   like you know they sell a lot of all [TS]

00:46:49   these things all these products like and [TS]

00:46:51   we mentioned last week like they like [TS]

00:46:53   the one percent or whatever of mac sales [TS]

00:46:55   asst is like still like 200,000 a year [TS]

00:46:57   and like as many as the B interview x5 [TS]

00:46:59   like it is worth them if they're going [TS]

00:47:01   to have a product line at all I think [TS]

00:47:05   it's worth it's worth them keeping it [TS]

00:47:06   minimally updated and what that means is [TS]

00:47:09   not every four years you make it worse [TS]

00:47:11   what that means is you keep it updated [TS]

00:47:14   every time you can and you don't have to [TS]

00:47:17   do a whole new case design you know that [TS]

00:47:20   like that's that I feel like you know [TS]

00:47:22   but like last week discussing about how [TS]

00:47:24   like Apple needs like the audacity and [TS]

00:47:26   confidence to release boring products [TS]

00:47:29   sometimes it seems like it seemed like [TS]

00:47:30   they would rather you know that they [TS]

00:47:31   would rather do nothing and neglect [TS]

00:47:33   something for years then release [TS]

00:47:35   something that isn't that exciting and I [TS]

00:47:37   just think that's the wrong decision I [TS]

00:47:38   think that they need to start thinking [TS]

00:47:40   either way of like that might be true [TS]

00:47:42   for certain products I don't know [TS]

00:47:43   certain like you know mass consumer [TS]

00:47:45   fashion type of products maybe the [TS]

00:47:47   iphone although that's kind of its own [TS]

00:47:49   schedule anyway you know not true the [TS]

00:47:51   watch they just gave that a speed bump [TS]

00:47:52   yeah what's your name on the outside [TS]

00:47:54   better stuff on the inside that's your [TS]

00:47:55   thicker but really I feel like they need [TS]

00:47:59   to bring that same philosophy to all [TS]

00:48:01   their products of just like you know [TS]

00:48:02   what when when there's like if the mac [TS]

00:48:05   mini can't be updated at least every two [TS]

00:48:08   years you know the stuff goes into it [TS]

00:48:10   like every year if the mac mini can't [TS]

00:48:12   consider at least every two years to [TS]

00:48:14   whatever's current first form factor [TS]

00:48:15   then it was badly designed and it should [TS]

00:48:17   be redesigned at me neither it is the [TS]

00:48:19   problem with the map really you know if [TS]

00:48:21   the mac pro can't be updated easily then [TS]

00:48:23   that they then they did a horrible job [TS]

00:48:25   designing it and so any of their [TS]

00:48:28   products that that you can say that [TS]

00:48:29   about like I feel like they they need to [TS]

00:48:32   and maybe this is what it to it like [TS]

00:48:35   they need to get like some humility in [TS]

00:48:37   the sense that like their designs need [TS]

00:48:39   to be a little more humble and they have [TS]

00:48:42   to be okay releasing you know like a [TS]

00:48:44   slightly more utilitarian version of [TS]

00:48:46   some of these products not all of them [TS]

00:48:48   but some of them and then they also then [TS]

00:48:50   have to have the confidence as I said [TS]

00:48:51   last week they have a confidence that [TS]

00:48:53   they you know what it's okay [TS]

00:48:55   to release a boring Mac Pro update and a [TS]

00:48:58   boring mac mini update that's okay no [TS]

00:49:01   one's gonna say Apple kit enemy anymore [TS]

00:49:03   anybody's ass because the mac mini got [TS]

00:49:05   updated again like that I don't think [TS]

00:49:08   that's true at all it's Tyra because [TS]

00:49:10   because the thing he's talking about [TS]

00:49:11   speed bumps we have a name for them [TS]

00:49:13   because they were so common so so common [TS]

00:49:16   for a long time for years and years and [TS]

00:49:19   years this was just a thing that [TS]

00:49:20   happened just like model years of cars [TS]

00:49:22   they were introduced a model and then [TS]

00:49:24   there would be speed bumps and that [TS]

00:49:26   eventually there would be a new model [TS]

00:49:27   that's fancier in some way that's how [TS]

00:49:29   Apple products work for a long time and [TS]

00:49:31   during that time every time there was a [TS]

00:49:33   speed bump nobody says oh no Apple can't [TS]

00:49:36   innovate anymore because we understood [TS]

00:49:37   with speed bumps were the fancy new one [TS]

00:49:40   is in here it's just a speed bump for [TS]

00:49:41   the other one and people go oh this is [TS]

00:49:43   boring announcement it's just a speed [TS]

00:49:45   bump but we had a word for it because it [TS]

00:49:47   was a thing that happened routinely [TS]

00:49:48   little did we know that you may not you [TS]

00:49:51   may like I don't want speed bumps I want [TS]

00:49:52   a fancy new one every time you know [TS]

00:49:53   what's worse than speed bumps no speed [TS]

00:49:55   bumps yeah exactly just nothing new at [TS]

00:49:58   all so I think there is no PR damage of [TS]

00:50:03   speed bumps it's just that at some point [TS]

00:50:04   Apple decided that speed bumps weren't a [TS]

00:50:08   thing they wanted to do and I have my [TS]

00:50:10   own completely unverified anonymous [TS]

00:50:12   sources who are not the ATP tipster or [TS]

00:50:14   they could be for all we know because [TS]

00:50:15   it's just email man I don't know where [TS]

00:50:16   the exit stuff comes from who conveyed [TS]

00:50:20   this again completely on source [TS]

00:50:22   information that the high-end imac was [TS]

00:50:25   the thing that Apple isn't playing for a [TS]

00:50:27   while so there are hopes for that to [TS]

00:50:29   have good internal who talk a bit more [TS]

00:50:30   about that with more on source rumors [TS]

00:50:32   later this is the unsourced rumor show [TS]

00:50:33   but the decision about the new Mac Pro [TS]

00:50:37   and display were made fairly recently [TS]

00:50:39   and the summary is neither of these [TS]

00:50:42   products meaning the high-end imac and [TS]

00:50:44   the new Mac Pro are a good financial roi [TS]

00:50:46   but there is now recognition to the [TS]

00:50:48   senior VP and CEO level that's important [TS]

00:50:51   for the company to make them and that's [TS]

00:50:52   what it boils down to like that I can [TS]

00:50:55   totally imagine all these products not [TS]

00:50:56   being a good return on investment [TS]

00:50:58   doesn't mean that they're they make [TS]

00:51:00   losses but you know good ROI means i put [TS]

00:51:02   x em on in and I want to get x times [TS]

00:51:04   some large number amount out and a [TS]

00:51:07   better ROI me like [TS]

00:51:08   yeah it doesn't seem like I make enough [TS]

00:51:09   money on speed bump Mac minis to even [TS]

00:51:11   bother doing that at all what if we just [TS]

00:51:13   don't do it how did the sales look it's [TS]

00:51:15   like up sales are flat it's like great [TS]

00:51:17   we just saved some money I just [TS]

00:51:18   increased the ROI and the mac mini by [TS]

00:51:20   not speed bumping it and they did they [TS]

00:51:21   did increase the ROI in the mac mini and [TS]

00:51:23   I think they can kind of get away with [TS]

00:51:24   that in the mac mini but a reasonable [TS]

00:51:25   amount but like one Mac Pro's what if we [TS]

00:51:28   just don't ever update the mac pro [TS]

00:51:30   because engineering says it would cost a [TS]

00:51:31   lot of money in require a redesign what [TS]

00:51:33   are the sales look like they go down a [TS]

00:51:34   little bit but they're about the same [TS]

00:51:35   great we just increased the ROI on the [TS]

00:51:37   Mac Pro and you know the what this [TS]

00:51:40   bullion source rumor now conveys is that [TS]

00:51:43   even though it's not a good ROI which is [TS]

00:51:46   a point I've been emphasizing since 2013 [TS]

00:51:48   it's important for the company to make [TS]

00:51:50   these products anyway an apple is [TS]

00:51:52   totally on that page now and again [TS]

00:51:55   another thing you can pick up from the [TS]

00:51:56   transcript is everything Marco said [TS]

00:51:57   about frequent updates that was in all [TS]

00:51:59   the summary articles like that apple [TS]

00:52:01   says they want to make a new Mac Pro [TS]

00:52:02   that can have frequent updates it is [TS]

00:52:04   further emphasizing the transcript like [TS]

00:52:06   further in detail emphasizes like they [TS]

00:52:08   want to make a Mac Pro that they can [TS]

00:52:10   make the parts inside of it better on a [TS]

00:52:13   regular basis they don't commit to doing [TS]

00:52:15   it on a particular schedule but they [TS]

00:52:16   emphasize this is the thing we did wrong [TS]

00:52:19   and we're going to fix it by doing it [TS]

00:52:21   right we want a machine that without [TS]

00:52:23   redesigning the machine we can regularly [TS]

00:52:26   and steadily and easily and cheaply do [TS]

00:52:28   this things that we used to think are [TS]

00:52:30   boring which are called speed bumps and [TS]

00:52:32   so you know that's why we're all so [TS]

00:52:33   happy about this is because they didn't [TS]

00:52:35   just say we're going to make a new pro [TS]

00:52:36   mac pro and trust us you really like it [TS]

00:52:37   just wait they said specific things [TS]

00:52:39   about and the specific things they said [TS]

00:52:41   and emphasized are exactly what we want [TS]

00:52:43   so yay Apple let's now fast-forward for [TS]

00:52:46   two years we are sponsored this week by [TS]

00:52:49   Squarespace go to squarespace com enter [TS]

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00:53:06   can waste tons of time installing your [TS]

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00:53:16   almost no time and do it in like an hour [TS]

00:53:18   and be done with it with squarespace [TS]

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00:53:37   tweak a few little things like a couple [TS]

00:53:38   of colors here and there or a logo here [TS]

00:53:40   and there or you can go full-blown and [TS]

00:53:42   customize all sorts of stuff about it [TS]

00:53:43   you can drag stuff around everything is [TS]

00:53:45   visual what you see is what you get with [TS]

00:53:47   a live preview of everything you're [TS]

00:53:48   doing it's incredibly easy and [TS]

00:53:50   incredibly powerful and Squarespace has [TS]

00:53:52   tons of building capabilities not only [TS]

00:53:54   you know the basics like you know news [TS]

00:53:57   feeds and calendars and blogs but even [TS]

00:53:59   full-blown storefronts if you want to [TS]

00:54:01   sell digital or physical goods [TS]

00:54:03   Squarespace has entire store [TS]

00:54:04   functionality built in along with all [TS]

00:54:06   the wonderful content management stuff [TS]

00:54:08   so check it out today whether you're [TS]

00:54:09   making a site for yourself or even if [TS]

00:54:12   you're making a site for somebody else [TS]

00:54:13   if someone else has asked you if you're [TS]

00:54:15   like the nerd in the in the community [TS]

00:54:16   and someone someone has asked you to [TS]

00:54:18   make a site for them we've all been [TS]

00:54:19   there make it on Squarespace and then [TS]

00:54:21   just hand it to them and say here I did [TS]

00:54:23   it and you can do it from now on here it [TS]

00:54:25   is and they will support it so you don't [TS]

00:54:28   have to which is really nice so check it [TS]

00:54:30   out today at squarespace.com start a [TS]

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00:54:35   can just build a site and see how it [TS]

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00:54:40   ATP at checkout and that will get you [TS]

00:54:42   ten percent off and it will tell them [TS]

00:54:44   that you came from here thank you very [TS]

00:54:46   much to Squarespace for sponsoring our [TS]

00:54:47   show Squarespace make your next move oh [TS]

00:54:50   goodness do you have any other thoughts [TS]

00:54:55   about this particular rumor I wouldn't [TS]

00:54:58   put too much into it you know and the [TS]

00:55:00   theta the other parts a bit about how [TS]

00:55:01   like you know like Apple is said to be [TS]

00:55:03   making a non-touch bar 15-inch MacBook [TS]

00:55:05   Pro option yeah that does just trolling [TS]

00:55:08   Marco I I honestly first of all you know [TS]

00:55:12   I want to be clear I don't hate the [TS]

00:55:14   touch bar that much I would just given [TS]

00:55:16   the choice to get it or not get it right [TS]

00:55:18   now I chose not get it and they're added [TS]

00:55:21   like that's due to other factors also [TS]

00:55:22   like like I wanted something smaller and [TS]

00:55:24   the the 13-inch that comes in both touch [TS]

00:55:27   bar on non touch bar like the non-touch [TS]

00:55:29   bar gets better battery life by a lot [TS]

00:55:31   and I really and better life is very [TS]

00:55:33   important to me right now so like you [TS]

00:55:35   know [TS]

00:55:35   it's obviously like you know other [TS]

00:55:38   factors have go into this decision for [TS]

00:55:40   everybody you know there's cost [TS]

00:55:41   considerations for a lot of people in it [TS]

00:55:43   so like I don't think there's actually [TS]

00:55:46   that much demand to make 15-inch MacBook [TS]

00:55:49   Pros without the touch bar and I also [TS]

00:55:52   would be incredibly surprised if Apple [TS]

00:55:56   did that for user satisfaction reasons [TS]

00:56:00   now what they might do you know there's [TS]

00:56:03   also a lot of complaints about the [TS]

00:56:04   pricing of the new macbook pros because [TS]

00:56:05   it is higher so I could see them may be [TS]

00:56:08   offering you know in in the next update [TS]

00:56:11   to the macbook pro generation whenever [TS]

00:56:14   that comes I don't know if it's I don't [TS]

00:56:15   know when the chips are coming out maybe [TS]

00:56:16   this fall or next spring who knows but [TS]

00:56:18   whenever that happens it would not [TS]

00:56:20   surprise me if they made an entry level [TS]

00:56:22   15 inch model that was maybe you know [TS]

00:56:26   1999 and that one had no discrete GPU [TS]

00:56:30   and no touch bar to hit that price point [TS]

00:56:33   the 15 inch escape yeah basically you [TS]

00:56:36   know it cuz in the past they you know [TS]

00:56:38   they've done that with the GPU selection [TS]

00:56:39   which I've talked about before where is [TS]

00:56:40   like in the past like the retina [TS]

00:56:41   generation everything the and even the [TS]

00:56:43   one right before that they had like the [TS]

00:56:45   base model which was about two thousand [TS]

00:56:47   bucks had only the Intel integrated GPU [TS]

00:56:50   and you had to spend a few hundred more [TS]

00:56:52   to get one with a little bit more stuff [TS]

00:56:54   in an end to discrete GPU and it would [TS]

00:56:57   not surprise me at all to see them to [TS]

00:56:58   the same thing here she just give it [TS]

00:57:00   another one that is 1999 so people will [TS]

00:57:03   stop complaining about the price and has [TS]

00:57:04   a few things cut out of it and one of [TS]

00:57:05   them would probably be this discrete GPU [TS]

00:57:07   and one of them might be the touch bar [TS]

00:57:08   and that would be totally fine like but [TS]

00:57:11   that wouldn't be because quote everyone [TS]

00:57:13   hates the touch bar it would be because [TS]

00:57:15   they want to hit a price point yeah they [TS]

00:57:18   did also mention the transcripts people [TS]

00:57:19   have some questions about ports they [TS]

00:57:21   didn't say they were going to even [TS]

00:57:22   entertain this idea but it was mentioned [TS]

00:57:25   as an idea that exists just like the mac [TS]

00:57:27   mini as a product that exists in the [TS]

00:57:28   lineup of having a macbook pro like with [TS]

00:57:37   legacy ports like that the only things [TS]

00:57:39   on the side of it wouldn't be the [TS]

00:57:40   Thunder ball three USB a few things that [TS]

00:57:43   was there was brought up as a question [TS]

00:57:44   and Apple didn't immediately shut the [TS]

00:57:46   door and say we are never doing that and [TS]

00:57:48   that's you know in the Apple it's like [TS]

00:57:50   wow they're entertaining the idea of [TS]

00:57:52   possibly having a macbook pro with [TS]

00:57:53   different ports on the side of it may be [TS]

00:57:55   an SD card slot I don't would hold your [TS]

00:57:56   breath for it but you know that's what [TS]

00:57:58   Apple does like they said they make a [TS]

00:57:59   product we do the best we can see what [TS]

00:58:01   people think of it what their behavior [TS]

00:58:03   indicates and then for the next one you [TS]

00:58:05   know they said for the next one we're [TS]

00:58:06   going to do better and we'll take what [TS]

00:58:08   we've learned and you know and Marco [TS]

00:58:10   suggestion sounds totally plausible both [TS]

00:58:12   because it makes sense from a business [TS]

00:58:13   perspective and also because if that's [TS]

00:58:15   what people are telling them based on [TS]

00:58:16   like you know this rumor of buying [TS]

00:58:18   refurbished ones or people buying the [TS]

00:58:20   escape or whatever they'll do that to [TS]

00:58:22   fill a market need and the same by the [TS]

00:58:23   same token like this is something that [TS]

00:58:26   didn't get too much discussion in the [TS]

00:58:27   Articles that was mentioned a few times [TS]

00:58:28   apple said and we've been hearing about [TS]

00:58:31   for a while that they went they have [TS]

00:58:33   been going out to Pro users reaching out [TS]

00:58:35   to just regular people like hey you use [TS]

00:58:37   our products in a pro capacity tell us [TS]

00:58:39   about it for a long time now leading up [TS]

00:58:41   to this Mac Pro announcement and they do [TS]

00:58:43   this stuff like that all the time so [TS]

00:58:44   just just knowing that it's like that's [TS]

00:58:45   they're gonna make a new mac what they [TS]

00:58:46   do that all the time like they say even [TS]

00:58:48   when you just go to the apple store buy [TS]

00:58:49   a new mac get new iphone sometimes they [TS]

00:58:51   send your random survey about it [TS]

00:58:52   whatever but they were going to people [TS]

00:58:53   and saying tell us how you use our pro [TS]

00:58:55   hardware what do you like about it what [TS]

00:58:56   do you not like about it what things are [TS]

00:58:58   important to you what things are not [TS]

00:58:59   important to you to try to gauge you [TS]

00:59:01   know whether they should make a new mac [TS]

00:59:03   pro and the decision they came to is yes [TS]

00:59:04   they should and probably like what do [TS]

00:59:06   you think about the new macbook pros and [TS]

00:59:08   what you know if we made a new one what [TS]

00:59:11   would you want to see in it and stuff [TS]

00:59:11   like that so they're they're doing their [TS]

00:59:13   job they're doing what they're supposed [TS]

00:59:15   to be doing and hopefully we'll see this [TS]

00:59:18   feedback loop closed with the next round [TS]

00:59:20   of macbook pros and I mean I don't want [TS]

00:59:24   to call like if the next round of macros [TS]

00:59:26   has the 15 inch escape and has an SD [TS]

00:59:30   card slot and has better batteries that [TS]

00:59:33   they supposedly couldn't fit in this one [TS]

00:59:35   for some reason I forget that this is [TS]

00:59:36   the model or it was another one that the [TS]

00:59:37   rumor was about anyway if they come out [TS]

00:59:40   with that it doesn't mean that they made [TS]

00:59:42   a terrible mistake and have fixed it [TS]

00:59:43   just means they're making their products [TS]

00:59:44   better over time that's what they always [TS]

00:59:46   do but for the mac pro I was thinking [TS]

00:59:49   that this Mac Pro that comes out that in [TS]

00:59:51   theory i will buy [TS]

00:59:53   Yeah right Ellen yeah is elevated is [TS]

00:59:57   worthy of being elevated to the [TS]

00:59:57   worthy of being elevated to the [TS]

01:00:00   holder of the coveted title of apology [TS]

01:00:03   Mac Pro right alongside the apology [TS]

01:00:05   mouse people don't remember the apology [TS]

01:00:07   mouse is the mouse apple released was [TS]

01:00:09   much fanfare after subjecting the world [TS]

01:00:12   to the completely circular puck based [TS]

01:00:13   mouse on the original iMac and they [TS]

01:00:16   apologized for that by making a mess [TS]

01:00:18   that was not completely circular and [TS]

01:00:19   therefore easier to a line and it was [TS]

01:00:21   under everybody seat at a macworld expo [TS]

01:00:24   keynote and i got one because i was [TS]

01:00:27   there and the mouse wasn't undo seat it [TS]

01:00:29   was like a little card and you go to the [TS]

01:00:30   back of the room and gives him on a cart [TS]

01:00:31   and they give you an apology mouse and i [TS]

01:00:33   still have it and it's awesome and i [TS]

01:00:35   would love an apology mac pro and it [TS]

01:00:36   looks like i'm going to get one well [TS]

01:00:38   you're going to have one released are [TS]

01:00:40   you going to buy one area luckily get [TS]

01:00:43   one unlike if it's not going to be a [TS]

01:00:44   card under my seat at ww sees as i get a [TS]

01:00:46   free one but yeah oh and i'm on the [TS]

01:00:49   topic of other were i'm skipping a bunch [TS]

01:00:51   of the mac pro a more mac pro topic for [TS]

01:00:55   your case but what i mean though that's [TS]

01:00:57   too bad no one thing i want to talk [TS]

01:01:00   about is this from we want to hit every [TS]

01:01:02   single person who was in that meeting [TS]

01:01:03   he's always like five journalists this [TS]

01:01:04   is from lancelin off at Mashable he I [TS]

01:01:08   quoted this because I didn't have the [TS]

01:01:09   transcript of time but let's give him [TS]

01:01:10   credit he be reported and I pulled it [TS]

01:01:12   out when I asked if Apple might consider [TS]

01:01:15   a touchscreen Mac Shilla shook his head [TS]

01:01:17   and said no he told me it's simply not a [TS]

01:01:20   big request from Mac Pro customers we're [TS]

01:01:22   talking to them and the things they're [TS]

01:01:24   most interested in this doesn't even [TS]

01:01:25   register he had you can see the full [TS]

01:01:27   quotes in the transcript if you're [TS]

01:01:28   interested but it was basically he just [TS]

01:01:29   like cut them off and like said no no [TS]

01:01:32   touchscreen Mac this is not something [TS]

01:01:34   customers interests and have it know [TS]

01:01:35   what customers are interested is because [TS]

01:01:36   they're talking to them right this is a [TS]

01:01:38   great example of I feel like if I was in [TS]

01:01:41   that meeting I mean I don't know I'm [TS]

01:01:42   it's hard to say what you were doing [TS]

01:01:44   your in these meetings but in a relaxed [TS]

01:01:47   environment where I didn't feel pressure [TS]

01:01:48   to be well behaved I would say but come [TS]

01:01:52   on guys you know you can't just ask [TS]

01:01:53   customers what they want like new yeah [TS]

01:01:55   you have to do that but customers don't [TS]

01:01:57   always know what they want until you [TS]

01:01:58   showed them no one would know customer [TS]

01:02:00   would have ever requested the iphone but [TS]

01:02:01   guess what when you made it there like [TS]

01:02:03   yes that if you ask them what they [TS]

01:02:04   wanted they would have been like a [TS]

01:02:05   fancier version of whatever nokia [TS]

01:02:07   smartphone they had right now right I [TS]

01:02:09   don't I think Matt custom Mac Pro [TS]

01:02:12   customers aren't requesting a touch [TS]

01:02:13   screaming but if it turns out that the [TS]

01:02:16   surface to do is a good idea that has [TS]

01:02:18   legs by the time your customers are [TS]

01:02:21   requesting it it's way too late because [TS]

01:02:23   of because of the the things you would [TS]

01:02:25   have to do to your OS or you know to [TS]

01:02:28   your to App Store economy depending on [TS]

01:02:30   whether you're trying to make a mac into [TS]

01:02:31   that or make an iOS device into that [TS]

01:02:33   will take you a long time so Apple [TS]

01:02:36   should not be asking its customers like [TS]

01:02:38   you know not be deciding just because [TS]

01:02:40   its customers don't want one now that [TS]

01:02:42   it's not a good idea clearly Apple [TS]

01:02:44   thinks it's still not a good idea and [TS]

01:02:45   I'm sure that experimented with and I'm [TS]

01:02:46   sure they use the service studio prop [TS]

01:02:48   they even even a dumped on the surface [TS]

01:02:50   studios like a drawing experience like [TS]

01:02:53   they basically said the ipad pro has a [TS]

01:02:54   better drawing experience i'm assuming [TS]

01:02:55   you mean more responsive and less [TS]

01:02:57   parallax because you did this you know [TS]

01:02:58   like which is true right it totally true [TS]

01:03:01   but I you know they may be right this is [TS]

01:03:05   not that the surface to do idea it [TS]

01:03:07   doesn't have legs in the design [TS]

01:03:09   community but the reason I would cite [TS]

01:03:11   for that is not that the first iteration [TS]

01:03:13   of this has flaws versus some existing [TS]

01:03:15   tech because that's just like I'm you [TS]

01:03:17   know a PR whatever like the first [TS]

01:03:19   version of everything is wonky right you [TS]

01:03:22   know the first Mac web was Ram starve [TS]

01:03:24   the first iphone like didn't even shoot [TS]

01:03:26   video right you know so you can't cite [TS]

01:03:28   that right that doesn't mean and you [TS]

01:03:29   also can't site of our customers aren't [TS]

01:03:31   asking this of course they're not asking [TS]

01:03:32   for they're never going to ask for the [TS]

01:03:34   visionary next big thing is they don't [TS]

01:03:35   know they want it yet but if the server [TS]

01:03:37   studio starts getting penetration and [TS]

01:03:38   starts being used by more people [TS]

01:03:40   eventually they will be saying hey I why [TS]

01:03:42   don't you have something like this and [TS]

01:03:43   maybe Apple will say take this humongous [TS]

01:03:46   iPad pro and try to find pearl apps for [TS]

01:03:48   it or something so anyway that bothered [TS]

01:03:50   me a little bit because I don't like to [TS]

01:03:51   say no and then you're not thinking [TS]

01:03:53   about it is fine but to cite those [TS]

01:03:55   reasons like those are those are not [TS]

01:03:58   those are not reasons that should be [TS]

01:04:00   convincing to you internally if their [TS]

01:04:01   reasons you want to pair it back to the [TS]

01:04:02   press to give explanations that's fine [TS]

01:04:04   but I really hope internally like there [TS]

01:04:06   does that fear I get especially want to [TS]

01:04:08   hear people who are good at talking to [TS]

01:04:10   the press at Apple the fear I get that [TS]

01:04:13   they believe their own hype that the [TS]

01:04:15   reasons they give externally for things [TS]

01:04:17   are also the reasons they use internally [TS]

01:04:19   to justify their decisions which I [TS]

01:04:20   sincerely hope is not the case because [TS]

01:04:22   so many of the reasons are our bad [TS]

01:04:24   reasons you know like they're there [TS]

01:04:26   like their their Apple 101 bad reasons [TS]

01:04:29   like the whole history of Apple shows [TS]

01:04:30   this is not how you should be making [TS]

01:04:31   decisions because every success you had [TS]

01:04:33   you know defied these or even just like [TS]

01:04:35   plain old you know ed catmull creativity [TS]

01:04:37   and success hides problem reasons what [TS]

01:04:39   evers like it's fine to tell them to [TS]

01:04:41   other people but i really hope you don't [TS]

01:04:43   believe like because this first server [TS]

01:04:45   studio has technical flaws that that's [TS]

01:04:47   why it's a terrible idea if you're going [TS]

01:04:49   to say we've tried the idea internally [TS]

01:04:51   and we found out that it's terrible [TS]

01:04:52   which they have said in the past that at [TS]

01:04:54   least I give more credence to because it [TS]

01:04:55   shows you are seriously pursuing the [TS]

01:04:57   idea but anyway that bothered me I still [TS]

01:05:00   think the server studio is an idea that [TS]

01:05:02   has some potential some artists also [TS]

01:05:04   agree I just hope apple doesn't get [TS]

01:05:08   caught flat-footed on this one because [TS]

01:05:10   again it's not like oh well so it [TS]

01:05:11   becomes accessible Apple can make one [TS]

01:05:13   they have a serious software and [TS]

01:05:14   platform thing to resolve to ever ship [TS]

01:05:16   anything like that they have to decide [TS]

01:05:18   whether it's a mac or an iPad and either [TS]

01:05:20   decision they make their a bunch of [TS]

01:05:21   other software and ecosystem things they [TS]

01:05:23   have to do to make that work yeah I mean [TS]

01:05:25   like everyone I've known who has bought [TS]

01:05:28   a surface to do or used one and the [TS]

01:05:30   granite this is not a large group of [TS]

01:05:31   people but you know it's like people on [TS]

01:05:33   Twitter and stuff the responses are all [TS]

01:05:35   are pretty consistent which is this is [TS]

01:05:39   really cool there's really something to [TS]

01:05:41   this but windows sucks like we we all [TS]

01:05:44   know that I really like this is no [TS]

01:05:46   surprise to anybody listen to this show [TS]

01:05:47   and I like no likelihood but you know [TS]

01:05:50   there is clearly like you know there's [TS]

01:05:52   something there's something here and I [TS]

01:05:54   think if Apple chose to do something [TS]

01:05:57   with that they might be able do a really [TS]

01:05:59   good job with it I mean there would be [TS]

01:06:01   certain limitations there's you know [TS]

01:06:03   every computer input method has weird [TS]

01:06:07   limitations to it the ipad you know has [TS]

01:06:10   problems with text entry unless you do [TS]

01:06:12   keyboards but that's a weird hack you [TS]

01:06:14   know the computers have problems with [TS]

01:06:17   you know direct interaction and maybe [TS]

01:06:18   leash in like at least there's all sort [TS]

01:06:20   of like everything you do is get it is [TS]

01:06:21   going to be imperfect but i think you [TS]

01:06:23   know the the kind of the model for [TS]

01:06:25   modern computing and devices and in like [TS]

01:06:28   the last decade has really just been [TS]

01:06:29   like well you know what we're going to [TS]

01:06:31   embrace that we can't get this perfect [TS]

01:06:33   and we're going to make things anyway [TS]

01:06:35   the best we can that take advantage of [TS]

01:06:38   what they are and [TS]

01:06:39   leave what they aren't to other devices [TS]

01:06:41   so like you know because if you didn't [TS]

01:06:44   if you weren't willing to do things that [TS]

01:06:45   way tablets wouldn't exist because [TS]

01:06:47   tablets are this this kind of weird [TS]

01:06:49   hybrid that is good at certain things [TS]

01:06:51   computers are good at terrible other [TS]

01:06:53   things are good at and but but they can [TS]

01:06:56   do things the computer can't you know [TS]

01:06:58   it's like it when apple says like oh [TS]

01:07:00   this this we've tried this and it [TS]

01:07:02   doesn't work it can't be done there's [TS]

01:07:03   lots of problems or whatever you could [TS]

01:07:05   have said the same thing about tablets [TS]

01:07:06   in 2009 but they made the ipad anyway [TS]

01:07:10   they found a way they found like like a [TS]

01:07:12   slot for it to fit in in the way people [TS]

01:07:16   use things they there there were things [TS]

01:07:18   that it was really good at and that made [TS]

01:07:20   it worth doing despite all the you know [TS]

01:07:22   downsides of tablets and those downsides [TS]

01:07:25   are still there today but it doesn't [TS]

01:07:26   matter because the things that good at [TS]

01:07:28   it's really good at for certain people [TS]

01:07:29   and so any kind of like touch or pen Mac [TS]

01:07:34   hybrid might be the same thing it might [TS]

01:07:37   be like you know this is kind of weird [TS]

01:07:39   for these reasons over here but it's [TS]

01:07:42   really good at these things and I think [TS]

01:07:44   the surface studios you know slight [TS]

01:07:46   success among among some artisan stuff [TS]

01:07:49   shows that to be the case that like you [TS]

01:07:51   know the drawing on Windows is weird you [TS]

01:07:54   know using a pen and touched on this [TS]

01:07:56   giant you know like drafting table form [TS]

01:07:59   factor pc running a PCOS is weird and [TS]

01:08:04   does have downsides but it also has [TS]

01:08:07   really cool upsides so there I think [TS]

01:08:09   there might be something there and and I [TS]

01:08:10   think it would be it would be [TS]

01:08:14   unfortunate if there was something there [TS]

01:08:17   and Apple wasn't able to or wasn't [TS]

01:08:19   willing to find it and deliver it [TS]

01:08:22   because they either are making bad [TS]

01:08:25   assumptions or that they aren't willing [TS]

01:08:28   to tackle the you know the software [TS]

01:08:31   integration costs that would result in [TS]

01:08:33   doing this kind of like Mac iOS touch [TS]

01:08:36   kind of hybrid OS and because those [TS]

01:08:38   aren't small problems you know those are [TS]

01:08:40   big problems but but I do think it would [TS]

01:08:43   be kind of a shame if there was really a [TS]

01:08:45   product here to be had that could be [TS]

01:08:46   really useful to some people and that we [TS]

01:08:48   weren't ever going to get it because of [TS]

01:08:49   these other issues you know that being [TS]

01:08:52   said [TS]

01:08:53   one of the other things I'm concerned [TS]

01:08:55   about is it does kind of seem like at an [TS]

01:09:00   increasing pace Apple is being surprised [TS]

01:09:04   by customer reactions to what they do [TS]

01:09:07   and that's a little concerning like we [TS]

01:09:11   keep like you know first like when you [TS]

01:09:13   know with with the the 2016 MacBook Pros [TS]

01:09:15   those came out and were you know really [TS]

01:09:18   met with a lot of ambivalence from [TS]

01:09:19   people head and a lot of criticism and a [TS]

01:09:22   lot of anger that they weren't certain [TS]

01:09:24   other things and an apple was you know [TS]

01:09:27   allegedly they were like shocked by this [TS]

01:09:29   that they were like we thought this was [TS]

01:09:30   and you know say the touch bar think we [TS]

01:09:32   thought we thought this was amazing like [TS]

01:09:34   it seems like it's actually not being [TS]

01:09:35   well-received like what how did this [TS]

01:09:37   possibly happen why is it so different [TS]

01:09:39   from what we expected and similar with [TS]

01:09:41   the mac pro you know it turns out that [TS]

01:09:42   if you kill your pro hardware line [TS]

01:09:45   slowly over years with you know neglect [TS]

01:09:48   after releasing and already polarizing [TS]

01:09:50   product then it turns out people get mad [TS]

01:09:53   who like the old thing or one of the [TS]

01:09:54   current things stay current and they [TS]

01:09:56   seemed greatly surprised by that as well [TS]

01:09:59   that reminds me of something else that i [TS]

01:10:01   forgot to address there on that exact [TS]

01:10:02   topic of hey you know what happens if [TS]

01:10:04   you don't up you're at you're you're [TS]

01:10:06   Mike proprio it's not one of the things [TS]

01:10:07   they cited in this very strange lead-up [TS]

01:10:09   that I think a few of the journalists [TS]

01:10:10   over there noted is very strange lead-up [TS]

01:10:12   to this announcement of this meeting was [TS]

01:10:13   let me tell you how few people use the [TS]

01:10:17   mac pro and let me tell you how many [TS]

01:10:19   pros use other products how many pros [TS]

01:10:21   use MacBook Pros uh i think i flubbed [TS]

01:10:25   that let me tell you how many people do [TS]

01:10:28   not use the mac pro and instead write [TS]

01:10:30   use imax or macbook pros right that was [TS]

01:10:32   their whole intro if you read the [TS]

01:10:34   transcript it was all about that right [TS]

01:10:36   it's like and this is a thing where [TS]

01:10:38   they're going to announce guess what [TS]

01:10:39   we're making a new mac pro if you had [TS]

01:10:41   just heard the intro it's like this is [TS]

01:10:42   leading up to them telling us why they [TS]

01:10:43   don't need to have a micro anymore [TS]

01:10:45   because they're saying look at all these [TS]

01:10:46   pros and we're defining probes is [TS]

01:10:47   someone who uses a pro app at least once [TS]

01:10:49   a week or someone who uses it every few [TS]

01:10:51   weeks and they does all you know the [TS]

01:10:54   number one piece of hardware used by our [TS]

01:10:55   prose is guess what the macbook pro the [TS]

01:10:57   number two piece of hardware you buy our [TS]

01:10:58   pros guess what the imac right and the [TS]

01:11:01   distant third is this mac pro such a [TS]

01:11:03   small percentage all that a hundred [TS]

01:11:06   percent believe [TS]

01:11:07   but if you don't update the mac pro for [TS]

01:11:10   three years of course they're gonna flee [TS]

01:11:12   elsewhere of course they're gonna start [TS]

01:11:13   buying I maxamed but what choice do they [TS]

01:11:15   have what choice like and again I [TS]

01:11:19   totally understand from PR perspective [TS]

01:11:21   this is this is the line this is the [TS]

01:11:23   move I just sincerely hope that [TS]

01:11:24   internally that they they have there are [TS]

01:11:27   clear-eyed about all this and you can't [TS]

01:11:29   tell they're not going to tell you what [TS]

01:11:30   but they talk about in their boardrooms [TS]

01:11:32   what do they put up in their slides and [TS]

01:11:33   I really believe they are clear I've is [TS]

01:11:34   it remember they had like a leak of the [TS]

01:11:36   like slideshow many years ago samsung [TS]

01:11:40   thing about it like like we don't have [TS]

01:11:41   bigger phones and customers want them [TS]

01:11:43   yeah right we'd we do not have what [TS]

01:11:44   customers want we need to make a bigger [TS]

01:11:46   phone yeah yeah that's that's how you [TS]

01:11:48   talk to yourself internally in a healthy [TS]

01:11:50   way and I'm sure they do but like it's [TS]

01:11:51   when you only get the external like the [TS]

01:11:54   you know the party line of like here's [TS]

01:11:55   what we have to tell you it makes me [TS]

01:11:59   worried sometimes because it's just so [TS]

01:12:00   hard like they'll they'll never they'll [TS]

01:12:03   never tell you what they tell themselves [TS]

01:12:04   internally and you just worry that their [TS]

01:12:06   believe in their own height because they [TS]

01:12:07   are so consistent and disciplined with [TS]

01:12:09   their message to the outside world and [TS]

01:12:10   because they choose to offer up these [TS]

01:12:12   things like this that are just like [TS]

01:12:13   instantly refutable like oh people who [TS]

01:12:16   are moving to I'm accent and macbook [TS]

01:12:18   pros like well duh like like why even [TS]

01:12:21   tell us that aren't we all smart here [TS]

01:12:23   don't of course they're moving to like [TS]

01:12:25   what else are they gonna do I guess I [TS]

01:12:26   could go to Windows is the other choice [TS]

01:12:27   right which is also happening by the way [TS]

01:12:29   and you're not going to tell us about [TS]

01:12:30   that so that anyway sorry to derail [TS]

01:12:33   there yeah anyway so all that is to say [TS]

01:12:36   that it it it certainly has seemed in in [TS]

01:12:40   recent times that Apple seems to be [TS]

01:12:42   increasingly surprised that people don't [TS]

01:12:44   universally loved what they brew what [TS]

01:12:46   they put out there and that that [TS]

01:12:49   concerns me and I hope in in whatever [TS]

01:12:53   has kind of flipped around or changed [TS]

01:12:55   that has caused them to decide to do the [TS]

01:12:57   Mac Pro again and to start you know [TS]

01:12:59   really serving pros well hopefully again [TS]

01:13:01   whatever whatever has changed to cause [TS]

01:13:05   that I hope it has also fixed whatever [TS]

01:13:07   was causing them to put out products [TS]

01:13:11   with with a very different internal [TS]

01:13:15   impression of what was going to happen [TS]

01:13:16   or how they're going to be received then [TS]

01:13:19   what public actually delivery because [TS]

01:13:20   that is worrisome [TS]

01:13:21   like Apple should not be that caught off [TS]

01:13:25   guard by their reactions to their [TS]

01:13:27   products you know Apple is really good [TS]

01:13:30   most of the time at product design they [TS]

01:13:33   have a huge history doing it very well [TS]

01:13:35   the track record is very very good they [TS]

01:13:37   have incredible talent within the [TS]

01:13:39   company you know and like you know if [TS]

01:13:41   they're going to do something like the [TS]

01:13:43   Apple TV remote that is incredibly bad [TS]

01:13:46   just terrible good thing they update the [TS]

01:13:49   Apple TV every year so that will have to [TS]

01:13:51   deal with that bad remote for a long [TS]

01:13:52   time right yeah like to get something [TS]

01:13:55   like that out into the world there are [TS]

01:13:57   people inside of the company who are [TS]

01:13:59   smart enough and clearly and [TS]

01:14:01   clear-headed enough to look at that and [TS]

01:14:03   say you know what this is kind of a bad [TS]

01:14:04   idea and here's why but for some reason [TS]

01:14:07   they weren't listen to so I just I hope [TS]

01:14:09   something that whatever has changed that [TS]

01:14:12   caused this Mac Pro thing is also going [TS]

01:14:15   to let them be a little bit more honest [TS]

01:14:18   about their own product reactions [TS]

01:14:20   internally before they decide to release [TS]

01:14:23   things or go ahead with things so that [TS]

01:14:25   they are less surprised when the public [TS]

01:14:27   doesn't love every weird beautiful [TS]

01:14:29   useless thing they release chatroom [TS]

01:14:31   points out a quick real-time follow-up [TS]

01:14:34   that federighi said and the things the [TS]

01:14:36   Mac Pro sales didn't fall off that's [TS]

01:14:37   what I said before when I said oh you [TS]

01:14:38   releasing Mac Pro and trash can and then [TS]

01:14:40   sales are kind of level it's another one [TS]

01:14:43   of those facts that could be a hundred [TS]

01:14:44   percent true but it doesn't tell you [TS]

01:14:46   what the initial value was so if the if [TS]

01:14:48   the trashcan Mac Pro was only appealing [TS]

01:14:50   to a certain very small subset of people [TS]

01:14:52   and those people were trapped into but [TS]

01:14:53   repeatedly buying it year after year [TS]

01:14:54   even though it didn't get updated [TS]

01:14:55   without result in flat sales and because [TS]

01:14:58   it's such a small percentage it would [TS]

01:15:00   result in look how many people who we [TS]

01:15:01   classify as pros according to the [TS]

01:15:03   wheeled met weird metric by our much [TS]

01:15:05   more popular machines well of course [TS]

01:15:07   they do those are your most popular [TS]

01:15:07   machines and you know like anyway stats [TS]

01:15:11   that are true but do not necessarily [TS]

01:15:13   prove the thing you're saying that they [TS]

01:15:14   prove it's it's a frustration yeah we go [TS]

01:15:16   ahead ukz now it's some it's curious [TS]

01:15:21   tread reason through what Apple is [TS]

01:15:23   thinking with regard to their products [TS]

01:15:27   and how they're received because you [TS]

01:15:29   know anyone I've ever spoken to us who [TS]

01:15:31   has spent any amount of time as an apple [TS]

01:15:34   employee has all [TS]

01:15:35   he's vehemently said that their biggest [TS]

01:15:39   critics are themselves and I completely [TS]

01:15:42   agree with you guys that from the [TS]

01:15:43   outside it seems clear that they offered [TS]

01:15:46   up this you know touch bar macbook pro [TS]

01:15:48   on a platter and said look at this [TS]

01:15:49   magnificent piece of electronics you [TS]

01:15:52   should be blessed enough to be able to [TS]

01:15:54   give us a whole pile of money for one of [TS]

01:15:56   these and then it did seem from the [TS]

01:15:59   outside like they were surprised that [TS]

01:16:00   people were like yeah we're good but I [TS]

01:16:03   don't know on the inside it's it's it's [TS]

01:16:06   a bold claim for any of us to make if if [TS]

01:16:09   we think that on the inside they were [TS]

01:16:10   really taken aback by it because as you [TS]

01:16:13   said John you know the messaging from [TS]

01:16:14   the out to the outside will always be oh [TS]

01:16:16   no this is exactly what we planned but [TS]

01:16:18   the inside I bet that they're being [TS]

01:16:21   pretty darn honest with themselves and [TS]

01:16:23   maybe the expectation was different but [TS]

01:16:27   I don't think it took them very long to [TS]

01:16:28   realize that who this didn't go the way [TS]

01:16:30   we thought it did and now they're [TS]

01:16:33   turning around now I will concede that [TS]

01:16:34   it certainly seems like the mac pro [TS]

01:16:36   something just went totally wrong there [TS]

01:16:39   because I concede and agree that it took [TS]

01:16:41   way too long way way way too long for [TS]

01:16:45   them to make any statement about what's [TS]

01:16:47   coming and and the consistent reports [TS]

01:16:50   you neyo be that rumors that it's been [TS]

01:16:53   in the last six weeks to six months that [TS]

01:16:55   they've really gotten in on a new mac [TS]

01:16:57   pro like that's kind of alarming but at [TS]

01:17:00   least they're turning the ship around no [TS]

01:17:03   it's just it seems weird it seems weird [TS]

01:17:05   to meet it for us to assume that that [TS]

01:17:08   there aren't some very vocal critics [TS]

01:17:10   within Apple of Apple Oh totally are [TS]

01:17:13   leavin marco was saying that they are [TS]

01:17:14   it's just a question of like they don't [TS]

01:17:15   win they don't win the argument because [TS]

01:17:17   we can tell who wins by what they [TS]

01:17:18   actually ship and yeah and the and like [TS]

01:17:21   i said i think that the presentation [TS]

01:17:22   about the iphone before they had a big [TS]

01:17:24   iphone with a slide i was trying to [TS]

01:17:26   quote was like you know customers want [TS]

01:17:29   what we don't have or something similar [TS]

01:17:30   phrasing like they were just totally [TS]

01:17:32   brutal about we don't have big phones [TS]

01:17:33   customers want them we should make one [TS]

01:17:36   and they did and guess what it sold [TS]

01:17:37   really really well so like I believe [TS]

01:17:39   internally that everything we're saying [TS]

01:17:41   has been said internally by multiple [TS]

01:17:43   people and it's just a question of who [TS]

01:17:45   wins the argument and my general [TS]

01:17:47   frustration is because [TS]

01:17:48   they have executives who are so good at [TS]

01:17:50   talking to the public so good at talking [TS]

01:17:53   to the public in terms of they'll never [TS]

01:17:55   get off message and also like they're [TS]

01:17:58   willing to throw out things that don't [TS]

01:18:00   actually support what they're saying but [TS]

01:18:01   sound like they do at first at first [TS]

01:18:02   glance and I find it frustrating to [TS]

01:18:04   never be able to get to the no seriously [TS]

01:18:06   just talk to me like a human being like [TS]

01:18:07   I guess you'd have to be off the record [TS]

01:18:09   on the record they're never going to do [TS]

01:18:10   that but because because in the end it [TS]

01:18:13   doesn't matter like who cares about the [TS]

01:18:14   internal politics so the products are [TS]

01:18:15   what they are when you ask me questions [TS]

01:18:17   about it i'm not going to trash my own [TS]

01:18:18   product and i'm not going to tell you [TS]

01:18:20   about future ones they could be working [TS]

01:18:21   on a surface studio style computer they [TS]

01:18:23   could have had it in the works for three [TS]

01:18:25   years now and they're trying to get it [TS]

01:18:26   right there never tell you that they're [TS]

01:18:28   you know they're just going to say right [TS]

01:18:29   to the point where they release it Steve [TS]

01:18:30   Jobs style that's not a good idea we [TS]

01:18:32   don't think it's a good idea until they [TS]

01:18:33   come out and say we finally cracked it [TS]

01:18:34   here it is and now it's a great idea [TS]

01:18:36   because we did it right that's just the [TS]

01:18:37   way they work and it can just be [TS]

01:18:38   frustrating from the outside but but [TS]

01:18:41   yeah when when the when the stuff that's [TS]

01:18:43   coming out that tells you that tells you [TS]

01:18:45   who won arguments and what decisions [TS]

01:18:47   were made and that we can judge them [TS]

01:18:48   based on and so yeah it's also it's hard [TS]

01:18:52   to like you know if if you are like you [TS]

01:18:56   know an engineer working on you know [TS]

01:18:58   photos app or something like that are [TS]

01:19:01   you really gonna be willing to take the [TS]

01:19:03   the political hit internally to [TS]

01:19:06   criticize a wrote that was designed by [TS]

01:19:09   jony ive or richard how earth-like is [TS]

01:19:12   that really going to be a wise career [TS]

01:19:14   move you know like the company is set up [TS]

01:19:16   in a way you know it's a big company [TS]

01:19:18   there's there's rank there's politics [TS]

01:19:21   internally there's you know every big [TS]

01:19:23   company has this stuff so like not [TS]

01:19:25   everybody can get their voice heard if [TS]

01:19:29   they have a criticism about a product [TS]

01:19:30   that's that that is being considered for [TS]

01:19:32   being designed like it's up to there [TS]

01:19:35   have to be people who it has to be set [TS]

01:19:38   up in a way that like high up people can [TS]

01:19:41   criticize and that and the people who [TS]

01:19:43   are at the high up levels need to [TS]

01:19:45   criticize when necessary and this is you [TS]

01:19:48   know like we talked before about like [TS]

01:19:50   this is one of one of Steve Jobs [TS]

01:19:52   greatest strengths and and one of the [TS]

01:19:54   reasons why he had such a great [TS]

01:19:57   relationship with Johnny ive and with [TS]

01:20:00   the engineering is like there was a [TS]

01:20:01   great balance [TS]

01:20:02   of editing and criticism and honesty [TS]

01:20:05   internally that resulted in mostly only [TS]

01:20:08   great stuff coming out like the hit rate [TS]

01:20:09   was pretty good there and and when [TS]

01:20:11   things did come out there weren't a lot [TS]

01:20:13   of controversial or polarizing [TS]

01:20:16   attributes of new products as there are [TS]

01:20:18   now like now it seems like almost [TS]

01:20:21   everything that comes out there's you [TS]

01:20:24   know great advances in some areas but [TS]

01:20:26   almost all those advances come at some [TS]

01:20:29   kind of massively polarizing cost and I [TS]

01:20:32   feel like that's happening more recently [TS]

01:20:34   than it used to and maybe that's because [TS]

01:20:36   the the collaboration or the editing up [TS]

01:20:40   top is not happening it with the same [TS]

01:20:42   health and same balance that it used to [TS]

01:20:45   we are sponsored this week by audible [TS]

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01:21:54   audible.com slash ATP that's audible.com [TS]

01:21:58   slash ATP thank you to audible for [TS]

01:22:00   sponsoring our show I wanted to go back [TS]

01:22:06   just briefly I thought that the [TS]

01:22:09   statistic that John it brief that had [TS]

01:22:12   talked about earlier very quickly was [TS]

01:22:14   just fascinating and this is [TS]

01:22:16   voting from Gruber apples research shows [TS]

01:22:18   that fifteen percent of all mac users [TS]

01:22:20   use at least one pro app frequently [TS]

01:22:22   these are apps for things like music [TS]

01:22:24   creation video editing graphic design [TS]

01:22:26   and software development basically apps [TS]

01:22:28   at our performance intensive and [TS]

01:22:29   additional fifteen percent of all mac [TS]

01:22:31   users use pro apps less frequently but [TS]

01:22:34   at least a few times per month per month [TS]

01:22:36   that thirty percent of the overall Mac [TS]

01:22:38   user base is what Apple considers the [TS]

01:22:40   pro market I don't really have a lot to [TS]

01:22:42   extrapolate from this but I just thought [TS]

01:22:44   it was very very interesting that [TS]

01:22:46   according to Apple fifteen percent of [TS]

01:22:49   users uses them uses a pro app [TS]

01:22:52   frequently whatever that definition is [TS]

01:22:55   be that daily or multiple times a week [TS]

01:22:56   or what have you and then another [TS]

01:22:58   fifteen that uses them at least a few [TS]

01:23:01   times a month and I just thought that [TS]

01:23:04   was a really fascinating statistic that [TS]

01:23:06   I never expected to come out of that [TS]

01:23:08   meeting yeah that's that's a lot higher [TS]

01:23:10   than I would have guessed for is you [TS]

01:23:11   know especially like the thirty percent [TS]

01:23:12   total that's kind of amazing well they [TS]

01:23:16   didn't clearly communicate that because [TS]

01:23:18   if you read the transcript and it was [TS]

01:23:19   much debate about this but many people [TS]

01:23:21   interpreting but now having read the [TS]

01:23:22   transcript it is no more clear to me the [TS]

01:23:25   question is first one is clear fifteen [TS]

01:23:28   percent use use what they classify as a [TS]

01:23:30   pro app at least once a week totally [TS]

01:23:32   clear the second one is the problem [TS]

01:23:33   because they say this group of users [TS]

01:23:35   uses a pro app like once every few weeks [TS]

01:23:40   or whatever was some longer period and [TS]

01:23:41   the question is does that second group [TS]

01:23:43   of users include the first Gruber [TS]

01:23:45   clearly thinks it does because whether [TS]

01:23:47   Apple said was thirty percent use it you [TS]

01:23:50   know in the longer period and 15 in the [TS]

01:23:52   shorter but I can't tell up the 15 is [TS]

01:23:54   part of the 30 like other exclusive [TS]

01:23:56   groups are they inclusive and so you [TS]

01:23:57   can't tell if the total is thirty [TS]

01:23:59   percent or 45 Apple could have [TS]

01:24:02   communicated that better like perhaps [TS]

01:24:03   than text or in some other fashion or it [TS]

01:24:05   could have been clarified so depending [TS]

01:24:07   on how you interpret what they said in [TS]

01:24:09   the transcript and I think it's a big [TS]

01:24:12   difference are are forty-five percent of [TS]

01:24:14   mac users classified as occasional or [TS]

01:24:17   frequent Pro users or is it thirty [TS]

01:24:20   percent and 15 of them are once a week [TS]

01:24:23   either way these are very nice high [TS]

01:24:25   numbers higher than I would have guessed [TS]

01:24:26   but Apple pics what it means to be a pro [TS]

01:24:29   user they use a pro app which they don't [TS]

01:24:30   tell us what it is that it's that oh you [TS]

01:24:31   know like one of those apps use to make [TS]

01:24:33   things right well I think it's I think [TS]

01:24:36   it's pretty clear that what they mean by [TS]

01:24:37   pro app is anything Apple makes it ends [TS]

01:24:40   in pro so logic pro Final Cut Pro also [TS]

01:24:42   probably like I would say adobe creative [TS]

01:24:44   suite apps make sense there and i think [TS]

01:24:46   it was also very clear they meant xcode [TS]

01:24:47   and that includes a lot of people yeah I [TS]

01:24:50   would agree with all of those but there [TS]

01:24:52   how many other things are in that [TS]

01:24:54   categories they didn't give us an [TS]

01:24:55   exhaustive like you're just going by [TS]

01:24:57   their metrics and I bet they're picking [TS]

01:24:58   something pretty broad for example there [TS]

01:25:01   could be just one application that is [TS]

01:25:02   frequently used that they happen to [TS]

01:25:03   classify as pro that pulls up the [TS]

01:25:05   average everything else these are you [TS]

01:25:07   know we have no visibility duties the [TS]

01:25:08   Apple has all the information so I'm not [TS]

01:25:10   surprised that number it sounds about [TS]

01:25:12   what I would think they would because of [TS]

01:25:13   their very broad definition of pro [TS]

01:25:15   everything you defined like I don't [TS]

01:25:16   think that's brought but I'm gonna try [TS]

01:25:18   to think of like one other applications [TS]

01:25:19   they could throw in there there would be [TS]

01:25:21   like oh if you if you ever launched [TS]

01:25:22   terminal you count as a pro app you [TS]

01:25:24   could argue for that but there's [TS]

01:25:25   millions of people who are launching [TS]

01:25:27   terminal just so they can use their mac [TS]

01:25:28   desis a Shinto something to do something [TS]

01:25:30   and they're not using their makina [TS]

01:25:32   Procope asset it's it's a you know it's [TS]

01:25:34   a glass TTYL is we used to say back in [TS]

01:25:36   the day and that is not a pro use [TS]

01:25:38   because you can do that from the macbook [TS]

01:25:40   adorable and it works fine but if you [TS]

01:25:43   classify terminal as a pro app suddenly [TS]

01:25:45   that brings up your numbers play pro is [TS]

01:25:47   a state of mind oh my goodness alright [TS]

01:25:53   what else do we have to talk about with [TS]

01:25:55   regard to the mac pro well we can move [TS]

01:25:56   on to the imac pro because there was [TS]

01:25:58   another completely on source rumor and [TS]

01:25:59   this is a place where we're dumping them [TS]

01:26:00   all on the show right this is from all [TS]

01:26:03   of them on this episode yet all of them [TS]

01:26:06   job this one also got reblogged [TS]

01:26:08   everywhere i'm surprised like people [TS]

01:26:10   reblogging i thought that the mac [TS]

01:26:11   blogosphere had gotten over that like [TS]

01:26:15   that there'll be one completely [TS]

01:26:16   unsourced rumor and some random thing in [TS]

01:26:18   it everybody else will grab it and [TS]

01:26:19   you'll see it appear on every site and [TS]

01:26:21   sometimes you'll have to like pour over [TS]

01:26:24   the site to try to figure out they just [TS]

01:26:25   signing that one thing i read on that [TS]

01:26:26   totally unsourced vlog and sometimes [TS]

01:26:29   they don't link to it and sometimes they [TS]

01:26:30   don't source it until the very end and [TS]

01:26:32   you trying to figure out and you see it [TS]

01:26:33   in so many places like well it must be [TS]

01:26:34   true i seen every mac side i've seen [TS]

01:26:36   it's been telling me about this these [TS]

01:26:37   the specs of this new imac pro like you [TS]

01:26:41   trace it all back and it's just this one [TS]

01:26:42   completely on [TS]

01:26:43   source thing anyway this completely [TS]

01:26:44   unsourced thing is giving us supposed [TS]

01:26:46   specs for the imac pro and this one says [TS]

01:26:49   it will have a intel III 1285 v6 i have [TS]

01:26:53   no idea what the hell that is it's [TS]

01:26:55   nothing yeah i think is ram upgrade over [TS]

01:26:58   32 or 64 ECC memory faster SSDs and up [TS]

01:27:04   to two terabytes of the SSD size and AMD [TS]

01:27:07   graphics with support for VR and pro [TS]

01:27:09   apps whatever the hell that means [TS]

01:27:10   Thunderbolt 3 USBC gentoo with tada a [TS]

01:27:13   brand new keyboard for Casey oh right [TS]

01:27:15   something for everybody alright so [TS]

01:27:18   basically just to summarize quickly here [TS]

01:27:20   Xeon e3 it might as well not be as easy [TS]

01:27:24   on the Xeon e3 is only barely different [TS]

01:27:29   from the consumer chips the imac already [TS]

01:27:32   uses the only thing that we get you is [TS]

01:27:35   support for ECC ram that's pretty good [TS]

01:27:37   though that's so that that that is [TS]

01:27:39   something but and so like that i feel [TS]

01:27:42   like you know if if the imac pro which [TS]

01:27:45   you know i just assumed whenever we say [TS]

01:27:47   I'm night pro its and thinker quotes if [TS]

01:27:50   if the imac pro is something to handle [TS]

01:27:55   like you know heavy horsepower then [TS]

01:27:57   that's not gonna do it you know that [TS]

01:27:58   that's that's what the old imac already [TS]

01:28:00   has had if it's something to add check [TS]

01:28:03   marks to make pro stop complaining about [TS]

01:28:05   certain things it helps a little bit in [TS]

01:28:07   that area in this is in the sense that [TS]

01:28:08   it enables ECC ram but that's about it [TS]

01:28:11   and thunderbolt three and USBC like i'm [TS]

01:28:13   assuming it has a lot of pci express [TS]

01:28:15   lanes does i don't know i don't know i [TS]

01:28:17   don't think it has any more get you have [TS]

01:28:18   to go to the e5 series like they they're [TS]

01:28:21   i'm pretty sure has the same pci express [TS]

01:28:23   configuration as the regular i7 high-end [TS]

01:28:25   chips because it really is just an i7 [TS]

01:28:27   with like ECC compatibility basically [TS]

01:28:30   there's there's there's really nothing [TS]

01:28:33   else to it that's that's literally all [TS]

01:28:34   it is it is a way you know the III line [TS]

01:28:38   it is mostly it mostly exists to make [TS]

01:28:41   cheap server options because it you know [TS]

01:28:44   servers almost always want to ECC and [TS]

01:28:46   you know server needs almost always use [TS]

01:28:48   that like in data centers and stuff and [TS]

01:28:51   it's a way to basically bring the [TS]

01:28:52   wonderful economy and power of the [TS]

01:28:55   consumer i7 line [TS]

01:28:56   into cheap 1u rackmount servers so it's [TS]

01:29:00   there's not really a huge benefit and [TS]

01:29:03   that's why I like remember like about [TS]

01:29:05   two years ago they started selling not [TS]

01:29:07   they not Apple but like the pc enter [TS]

01:29:09   start selling xeon laptops and that was [TS]

01:29:13   the same kind of thing it was it was [TS]

01:29:14   based it was like using this III line [TS]

01:29:15   where it's like yeah that's that's not [TS]

01:29:17   really anything more than what we had [TS]

01:29:18   before it's not really anything more [TS]

01:29:20   than the consumer line so that's same [TS]

01:29:22   thing here like it would enable ECC but [TS]

01:29:25   that would be the only advantage that it [TS]

01:29:26   would have over what we already have any [TS]

01:29:28   imac that being said it would also not [TS]

01:29:31   require any additional thermal head room [TS]

01:29:33   because it isn't a bigger chip it isn't [TS]

01:29:36   it doesn't have more cores it doesn't [TS]

01:29:37   have a higher tdv like you know it would [TS]

01:29:40   be very easy for apple to configure an [TS]

01:29:42   imac with an e3 so if the idea of the [TS]

01:29:44   imac pro is to do as little work as [TS]

01:29:48   possible and check off a few more boxes [TS]

01:29:50   for pros while changing almost nothing [TS]

01:29:52   about the imac then okay maybe but [TS]

01:29:55   that's probably not like that wouldn't [TS]

01:29:58   be a very compelling product for almost [TS]

01:29:59   anybody so i hope that isn't what [TS]

01:30:01   they're doing i hope they're doing more [TS]

01:30:02   than that well if it's the only one that [TS]

01:30:05   comes with Thunderbolt three in USBC [TS]

01:30:06   then something that becomes a lot more [TS]

01:30:08   attractive because it's not just people [TS]

01:30:09   who are looking for pro we're buying it [TS]

01:30:10   it's like anybody who wants basically a [TS]

01:30:12   modern 105 k imac would buy it's like [TS]

01:30:14   well if that's the only one that has all [TS]

01:30:16   the new ports on it I'll get it and if [TS]

01:30:18   they want that fancy new keyboard right [TS]

01:30:19   other other ancillary rumors attach this [TS]

01:30:22   and I keep seeing this and I haven't [TS]

01:30:24   traced this back to the origin to the [TS]

01:30:25   fantastical origin but the 8k display [TS]

01:30:29   apples working on an 8k display for the [TS]

01:30:30   next generation of macros 8k display has [TS]

01:30:34   been floating around for a long time is [TS]

01:30:35   that thing something that anyone is it [TS]

01:30:38   asking for will tell just shipped one [TS]

01:30:41   you see like Dell just shipped 145 grand [TS]

01:30:43   I know I know all right so yeah right [TS]

01:30:45   but my question is like you like it like [TS]

01:30:47   it does the size math work out to be [TS]

01:30:49   something reasonable like like how big [TS]

01:30:51   would it have to be to keep the current [TS]

01:30:53   DPI yeah like I think would have to be [TS]

01:30:54   like 40 inches would it would have to be [TS]

01:30:56   pretty big I i think you know we we [TS]

01:30:59   learned from past monitor things and [TS]

01:31:01   some some like current day ones where [TS]

01:31:04   you know like you have like that one LG [TS]

01:31:06   like super wide 35 inch or whatever [TS]

01:31:09   yep so like we've seen like kind of you [TS]

01:31:12   know rough idea of what these you know [TS]

01:31:13   what monitor sizes are and what works [TS]

01:31:15   and what doesn't we can we can probably [TS]

01:31:17   agree actually I'm curious John because [TS]

01:31:20   you're probably the contrarian here what [TS]

01:31:23   do you think is the largest you know [TS]

01:31:25   inch diagonal measurement that that a [TS]

01:31:28   single monitor could reasonably be for [TS]

01:31:31   practical desktop computer use where you [TS]

01:31:34   wouldn't have to sit so far back from it [TS]

01:31:35   that the resolution would be wasted so [TS]

01:31:38   my answer to that question would [TS]

01:31:39   probably be maybe like 32 inches maybe [TS]

01:31:44   at most 35 what do you think I would go [TS]

01:31:48   up to 42 because I know people who use [TS]

01:31:50   televisions as their monitors obviously [TS]

01:31:52   the resolution is horrendous right but [TS]

01:31:54   they're using like actual televisions as [TS]

01:31:56   their monitors because they can get to [TS]

01:31:57   me really big sizes and why because if [TS]

01:31:59   you have any kind of vision impairment [TS]

01:32:01   you can't buy a computer monitor that [TS]

01:32:03   makes things as big as you want that [TS]

01:32:05   doesn't make it look like you're looking [TS]

01:32:06   through a tiny little portal so they [TS]

01:32:08   will get a 42 inch television and putted [TS]

01:32:10   it like a resolution that we would run a [TS]

01:32:13   23 inch display at and keep it like [TS]

01:32:16   normal computer distance from them and [TS]

01:32:17   just let them see things better so I [TS]

01:32:18   think it's actually surprising [TS]

01:32:20   surprisingly big but but that wouldn't [TS]

01:32:22   be a use case for 8k though ak is [TS]

01:32:24   talking about like right now you but you [TS]

01:32:25   just asked about the inch sizes right [TS]

01:32:27   now in case specifically the reason the [TS]

01:32:28   reason I'm skeptical the 8k thing is not [TS]

01:32:30   because I think 8k is not a thing right [TS]

01:32:32   but just when I envision Apple making a [TS]

01:32:34   monitor for its Mac Pro I envisioned 8k [TS]

01:32:37   as a thing that only people who are [TS]

01:32:39   working like at ILM yet so they can look [TS]

01:32:41   at their 8k video you know composites or [TS]

01:32:43   whatever like that you know people who [TS]

01:32:44   are working with source material shot an [TS]

01:32:46   8k but traditionally Apple has left that [TS]

01:32:49   market to like the super duper high end [TS]

01:32:52   color calibrated weird monitors with [TS]

01:32:55   hoods over them and like like that type [TS]

01:32:57   of thing Apple has never sold one of [TS]

01:32:58   those they've always sold a really good [TS]

01:33:01   monitor for regular people it has great [TS]

01:33:02   color calibration but always during the [TS]

01:33:04   entire history of Apple if you go into a [TS]

01:33:06   very fancy place that even just does [TS]

01:33:08   stuff with Photoshop or with special [TS]

01:33:10   effects or whatever you will see one of [TS]

01:33:12   those really weird i don't think any [TS]

01:33:13   seam makes a bunch of them or you know [TS]

01:33:14   one of those really weird monitors just [TS]

01:33:17   for this specific industry and right now [TS]

01:33:20   I feel like 8k is in that category the [TS]

01:33:22   only people who knew [TS]

01:33:23   k our people who are shooting 8k footage [TS]

01:33:25   who want to see it displayed in 8k so [TS]

01:33:28   you want it k monitor but like I'm not [TS]

01:33:31   going to be sad if Apple makes one I [TS]

01:33:32   think it'll be awesome but that seems [TS]

01:33:34   such like such a narrow thing that Apple [TS]

01:33:37   is going to go from we're not making a [TS]

01:33:38   matter at all to guess what i'm making [TS]

01:33:40   an 8k one and to get back to where you [TS]

01:33:41   were saying Marco if they do make an 8k [TS]

01:33:43   one I hope it's not the only one because [TS]

01:33:46   i really don't i personally don't [TS]

01:33:49   actually want a 40 inch monitor and I [TS]

01:33:51   think 8k at 27 or 30 inches is overkill [TS]

01:33:54   for my needs so if they only make an 8k [TS]

01:33:56   monitor it's going to be super expensive [TS]

01:33:58   and be oh god I probably actually buy it [TS]

01:34:01   too would not like oh you would it's not [TS]

01:34:05   it's not what I want out of modern I'm [TS]

01:34:06   thinking they're going to make a 5k [TS]

01:34:08   display because I think 5k is in the [TS]

01:34:09   spot where Apple usually makes monitors [TS]

01:34:11   and they leave a k2 Dell and NEC and [TS]

01:34:14   viewsonic and whoever else is making [TS]

01:34:16   these monitors for for professional [TS]

01:34:18   things that you can already buy today [TS]

01:34:20   but we'll see the 8k rumor won't die [TS]

01:34:23   anything else on the mac pro kids [TS]

01:34:26   there's always said you why do you even [TS]

01:34:28   keep asking that you know if you just [TS]

01:34:29   stopped asking that and just moved on [TS]

01:34:31   you would like catch us off guard no [TS]

01:34:34   because that there's more unfortunately [TS]

01:34:35   perkasie two related stories that were [TS]

01:34:39   in the notes last week or what least one [TS]

01:34:41   of them was and we didn't get to it that [TS]

01:34:43   may or may not be related the more [TS]

01:34:45   recent one is Nvidia's announcement that [TS]

01:34:48   their new graphics cards have mac [TS]

01:34:51   support and you're like what what do you [TS]

01:34:54   mean by that there are no max with card [TS]

01:34:56   slots what are you talking about how can [TS]

01:34:58   you have mac support but it's like oh [TS]

01:35:00   yeah all those cheese graters yeah you [TS]

01:35:02   can put these things in there so Nvidia [TS]

01:35:04   is offering drivers for its Pascal based [TS]

01:35:08   GPUs that's their latest architecture of [TS]

01:35:09   GPUs and this is the the titan nvidia [TS]

01:35:12   titan XP as their product they are [TS]

01:35:13   launching but the drivers they're making [TS]

01:35:15   will work with any pascal based GPU [TS]

01:35:17   apparently on the mac and why would they [TS]

01:35:20   do that I mean people will choose [TS]

01:35:23   graders can buy them and you know or [TS]

01:35:25   people with hackintosh is right we want [TS]

01:35:27   to run mac OS and do all this stuff and [TS]

01:35:29   Apple didn't ship drivers for this [TS]

01:35:32   because they don't ship any machines [TS]

01:35:34   with Pascal GP using them as far [TS]

01:35:35   I'm aware like it do they have a Pascal [TS]

01:35:37   base 11 of the portables I forget maybe [TS]

01:35:39   the chat room people tell me but anyway [TS]

01:35:40   I don't think Apple ships nvidia [TS]

01:35:42   anything right now apple an apple an [TS]

01:35:44   nvidia had seemed to have some kind of [TS]

01:35:46   major fallout and they I think they ship [TS]

01:35:48   ati stuff or AMD stuff now everywhere [TS]

01:35:51   which is kind of a problem like you know [TS]

01:35:53   we we keep hearing I don't want to see [TS]

01:35:56   what you're going to say if you're gross [TS]

01:35:56   sales but we keep hearing from people [TS]

01:35:58   who know this stuff that like really [TS]

01:36:01   NVIDIA has has kicked AMD's butt so hard [TS]

01:36:03   and GPUs and things like GPUs like those [TS]

01:36:06   like parallel computing cards recently [TS]

01:36:08   that Apple really really apparently if [TS]

01:36:13   they want to be competitive in these [TS]

01:36:14   high-end GPU areas they should really [TS]

01:36:17   consider going back to Nvidia and it [TS]

01:36:20   seems like for for whatever reason [TS]

01:36:22   possibly some kind of weird like [TS]

01:36:24   business disagreement or history they [TS]

01:36:26   have been unwilling to do that so far [TS]

01:36:28   but maybe they should reconsider now [TS]

01:36:30   they're try to address pros better so [TS]

01:36:33   that balance of power between AMD and [TS]

01:36:35   NVIDIA it has swung around it's not like [TS]

01:36:37   Intel and AMD where Intel just dominated [TS]

01:36:40   it has come back from the bruising of [TS]

01:36:43   the athlon age as we discussed in a past [TS]

01:36:45   show has just dominated for a long time [TS]

01:36:47   and like rising is just like the the [TS]

01:36:49   turn around possibly now but AMD Nvidia [TS]

01:36:52   have traded the lead many times and [TS]

01:36:54   specifically for apples purposes not [TS]

01:36:58   talking about the highest the high end [TS]

01:36:59   which Apple has been ignoring anyway [TS]

01:37:01   very often the ati or AMD part actually [TS]

01:37:03   is the right choice for specific things [TS]

01:37:06   but if your concern is i want the best [TS]

01:37:10   performance in a given thermal envelope [TS]

01:37:12   or whatever and that thermal envelope [TS]

01:37:14   isn't really really low nvidia is [TS]

01:37:16   currently the leader that could change [TS]

01:37:19   with the next generation of GPUs but [TS]

01:37:22   either way Apple has nothing in any of [TS]

01:37:25   its product and hasn't for many many [TS]

01:37:26   years that could be considered a [TS]

01:37:28   high-end GPU none just they don't they [TS]

01:37:30   don't sell them they didn't even when [TS]

01:37:32   the 2013 trashcan Mac Pro was brand new [TS]

01:37:35   the day it was released today was [TS]

01:37:38   announced for that matter you could buy [TS]

01:37:40   faster cards and put the new pcs single [TS]

01:37:42   cards double cards everything I'm pretty [TS]

01:37:44   sure like the last time they had [TS]

01:37:46   competitive GPUs was when [TS]

01:37:49   you and at the time i bought the 2008 [TS]

01:37:51   mac pro and you could for two hundred [TS]

01:37:54   dollars get an nvidia 8800 GT and at the [TS]

01:37:57   time that was like an upper mid-range [TS]

01:37:58   card and we're like oh that's Brett's a [TS]

01:38:00   nice option thanks yeah it was it was a [TS]

01:38:02   decent car long time ago yeah and always [TS]

01:38:04   there has been there have been [TS]

01:38:06   third-party people like buying pc cards [TS]

01:38:08   and flashing the firmware and stuff and [TS]

01:38:09   it was just a matter of like does apple [TS]

01:38:11   support this GPU architecture because if [TS]

01:38:12   they supported it sometimes the drivers [TS]

01:38:14   would work with the higher end cards [TS]

01:38:15   that were just overclocked or just had [TS]

01:38:16   more vram and stuff like that and so [TS]

01:38:18   this announcement by nvidia has a lot of [TS]

01:38:21   people thinking maybe maybe the new pack [TS]

01:38:23   that apple just admitted they were [TS]

01:38:25   creating like three days ago maybe it's [TS]

01:38:27   going to use pascal base GPUs and and [TS]

01:38:29   you know what that would be awesome and [TS]

01:38:31   i hope it does because they're really [TS]

01:38:33   good right but i can't draw any kind of [TS]

01:38:36   same connecting line between nvidia [TS]

01:38:38   supporting max with its current crop of [TS]

01:38:42   lines and anything that Apple's going to [TS]

01:38:44   do by its as-yet-unknown to anybody [TS]

01:38:46   outside Apple Mac Pro project so I can't [TS]

01:38:51   connect those lines but I really [TS]

01:38:52   sincerely do hope that an option on the [TS]

01:38:56   new Mac Pro is the highest of high end [TS]

01:38:58   video cards from Nvidia because that [TS]

01:39:01   would be awesome and they kept talking [TS]

01:39:03   about how people want a single really [TS]

01:39:05   fast GPU and this is sing a really fast [TS]

01:39:07   EPO for all we know Apple could have [TS]

01:39:09   made a deal with NVIDIA for them to [TS]

01:39:10   develop these drivers because like [TS]

01:39:12   that's that's the only line i can draw [TS]

01:39:13   is like why the heck is envy doing this [TS]

01:39:14   are they so desperate for money that [TS]

01:39:15   they want the seven people who have hack [TS]

01:39:17   and dodges to buy this card and put it [TS]

01:39:18   in right like what why because making [TS]

01:39:22   drivers for making mac drivers for a [TS]

01:39:25   video card is non-trivial it's it's a [TS]

01:39:28   difficult thing to do working with [TS]

01:39:30   apples you know driver stack so [TS]

01:39:32   different from windows and for what [TS]

01:39:34   benefit so maybe there was some kind of [TS]

01:39:37   agreement or money changing hands to [TS]

01:39:39   have nvidia do this sometime in the [TS]

01:39:42   past-- and they're just like well while [TS]

01:39:44   we wait to be in the new mac pro will [TS]

01:39:45   sell this to people or whatever i don't [TS]

01:39:48   know but anyway i'm excited about this [TS]

01:39:49   people who have cheese graters who are [TS]

01:39:51   more that are more modern than mine that [TS]

01:39:53   actually run this i believe i can't run [TS]

01:39:54   this in mind because i think it requires [TS]

01:39:55   more pieces you can even run sierra you [TS]

01:39:59   know yeah I can hear it anyway this [TS]

01:40:02   seems like an X [TS]

01:40:03   announcement for a very small group of [TS]

01:40:04   mech nerds I'm excited by the prospect [TS]

01:40:06   of a very super high-end GPU and if [TS]

01:40:09   you're dramatic pro but for now I can't [TS]

01:40:13   I can't connect the dots on this to say [TS]

01:40:15   that this means anything about what what [TS]

01:40:17   GPU the next Mac Pro is going to have [TS]

01:40:18   and related to this is the older story [TS]

01:40:22   which is about apple moving away from [TS]

01:40:25   imagination the power be our power VR [TS]

01:40:29   GPUs that it uses in all of its iOS [TS]

01:40:31   products for many many years speaking of [TS]

01:40:33   of GPUs Apple's GPUs in its iOS devices [TS]

01:40:36   have been awesome they have been [TS]

01:40:39   amazingly good they always show that [TS]

01:40:41   graph that shows look how crappier GPUs [TS]

01:40:43   were in the beginning of the of the iOS [TS]

01:40:45   devices before we even called it iOS and [TS]

01:40:47   look at this curve every time we come up [TS]

01:40:50   with the new product the GP was like [TS]

01:40:51   super duper faster it's like it's not [TS]

01:40:53   linear it's like going up like a hockey [TS]

01:40:55   stick if we are kicking butt on GPUs and [TS]

01:40:57   look what we can do with these games and [TS]

01:40:58   you know and it's true they have been [TS]

01:41:01   doing a really good job with the GPUs [TS]

01:41:02   and for I think for the entire life of [TS]

01:41:05   iOS devices they have been using power [TS]

01:41:09   vr base GPUs with intellectual property [TS]

01:41:12   license from imagination technology and [TS]

01:41:14   imagination technology put out this [TS]

01:41:18   press release is very sad angry press [TS]

01:41:20   release that's like Apple tells us [TS]

01:41:23   they're not going to be using our [TS]

01:41:24   intellectual property anymore and Apple [TS]

01:41:27   by the way is like more than fifty [TS]

01:41:28   percent of our revenue but we think [TS]

01:41:30   basically it's impossible to make a [TS]

01:41:33   modern GPU without infringing our [TS]

01:41:35   intellectual property which by the way [TS]

01:41:36   is another reason the patent system is [TS]

01:41:38   ridiculous I like little biz Apple no is [TS]

01:41:40   literally impossible to make a modern [TS]

01:41:42   GPU without our intellectual property [TS]

01:41:43   right so we own these ideas forevermore [TS]

01:41:47   or like whatever the ridiculous term [TS]

01:41:49   limit is on patents but Joanne patents [TS]

01:41:53   are to foster innovation without patents [TS]

01:41:56   nobody would innovate no one would ever [TS]

01:41:58   be able to make a GP without these ideas [TS]

01:42:00   that are not obvious to everybody who is [TS]

01:42:02   what is it obvious to people verse the [TS]

01:42:05   well versed in the art anyway I hate [TS]

01:42:06   patents but but apple says there they [TS]

01:42:10   are not licensing this technology which [TS]

01:42:12   means that Apple is going to make GPUs [TS]

01:42:14   for its iOS devices presumably [TS]

01:42:16   or when you know whatever they do [TS]

01:42:18   they're not going to make GPUs or [TS]

01:42:19   they're going to make GPUs license from [TS]

01:42:21   somebody else or they're going to make [TS]

01:42:22   their own Apple has as Phil Schiller [TS]

01:42:25   points out or one of the people points [TS]

01:42:26   out one of the best chip design groups [TS]

01:42:29   in the world arguably the best going [TS]

01:42:31   based on how good their system-on-chips [TS]

01:42:33   are for their devices and like have you [TS]

01:42:35   seen like have you seen liked hit the [TS]

01:42:36   benchmarks of the new samsung s 80 River [TS]

01:42:39   it's like it matches the performance of [TS]

01:42:41   like the iphone 6s like two generations [TS]

01:42:43   behind and yeah their apple is doing [TS]

01:42:46   amazing like they're making these chips [TS]

01:42:48   themselves yes its arm its arm based [TS]

01:42:50   technology and they have that license [TS]

01:42:51   from arm to use the instruction set and [TS]

01:42:53   all that other stuff or whatever and yes [TS]

01:42:54   their licensing GPU stuff from power boo [TS]

01:42:57   yarbrough but Apple make no mistake [TS]

01:42:59   Apple is designing these things ever [TS]

01:43:00   since the the confusingly named swift [TS]

01:43:02   CPU actually it was the first one that [TS]

01:43:04   they really like did themselves from [TS]

01:43:06   scratch as the iphone 5 right yeah [TS]

01:43:08   they're they're doing amazing so I have [TS]

01:43:11   zero doubt that if Apple wanted to they [TS]

01:43:13   have the in-house expertise to make an [TS]

01:43:15   amazing GPU for the next iPhone whether [TS]

01:43:18   or not infringed on patents who the hell [TS]

01:43:20   knows what the lawyers fight it out if [TS]

01:43:21   the camels going to win that one because [TS]

01:43:22   they have more money and that's how our [TS]

01:43:23   legal system works like you know what if [TS]

01:43:27   you imagination we're going to buy your [TS]

01:43:28   company done and done we win and that's [TS]

01:43:32   and that's their worst case scenario so [TS]

01:43:34   Apple will not lose this or they could [TS]

01:43:39   be licensing someone else's think but [TS]

01:43:41   combining the new Mac Pro rumor which [TS]

01:43:43   now it affects everything but that is [TS]

01:43:46   discussed at surrounding the Mac it's [TS]

01:43:48   like does this mean Apple is going to [TS]

01:43:49   make their own GPUs for the new Mac Pro [TS]

01:43:51   and while I think that would be amazing [TS]

01:43:54   and fantastical i'm going to say Noah [TS]

01:43:56   yeah that makes no sense because because [TS]

01:43:59   Apple already doesn't like the ROI on [TS]

01:44:02   the Mac Pro reportedly and and in fact [TS]

01:44:05   they seem to not like it so much they [TS]

01:44:07   didn't even make one they just barely [TS]

01:44:08   decided to make one the if Apple is [TS]

01:44:11   making a GPU architecture they're making [TS]

01:44:13   it for iOS devices and I have a hard [TS]

01:44:16   time believing that the GPU design could [TS]

01:44:19   even be adapted from iOS devices to [TS]

01:44:23   something like the new mac pro so I'm [TS]

01:44:25   thinking the new Mac Pro will not have a [TS]

01:44:27   GPU of Apple's own design [TS]

01:44:29   I'm hoping it will have a super I an [TS]

01:44:32   NVIDIA GPU or at least the the best [TS]

01:44:34   whatever the best architecture is that [TS]

01:44:36   AMD has Africa what this is called is it [TS]

01:44:38   Maxwell and I remember maybe that's [TS]

01:44:40   another end video on and I don't think [TS]

01:44:44   the the imagination rumor is connected [TS]

01:44:46   to the mac pro either it does make me [TS]

01:44:47   kind of excited about what the next [TS]

01:44:49   iPhone you know and the GPUs are going [TS]

01:44:52   to look like they're because like [TS]

01:44:53   presumably Apple is ditching imagination [TS]

01:44:57   for some benefit and I don't think the [TS]

01:44:59   benefit is the relatively piddling [TS]

01:45:02   amount of money they pay it's like only [TS]

01:45:03   so only 75 million dollars a year which [TS]

01:45:06   is a lot of money to imagination [TS]

01:45:07   technologies apparently is like you know [TS]

01:45:08   the Apple is their biggest customer it's [TS]

01:45:10   like more than half of their revenue but [TS]

01:45:12   Apple sneezes in 75 million dollars [TS]

01:45:14   comes out and falls on the carpet like I [TS]

01:45:15   thought that's how much they got so much [TS]

01:45:16   they they spend for snacks at the the [TS]

01:45:19   defunct Apple car project right yeah so [TS]

01:45:25   I think they wanted to do it for the [TS]

01:45:27   same reason they do or they want I want [TS]

01:45:28   to control the blah blah blah technology [TS]

01:45:30   blah blah blah and I bet they have some [TS]

01:45:32   good ideas about you know that that chip [TS]

01:45:35   team is like we have some good ideas [TS]

01:45:36   about how to do a GPU in ways that are [TS]

01:45:40   are there our own our own ideas why [TS]

01:45:43   don't we do it why do we need this [TS]

01:45:44   imagination technology stuff anymore we [TS]

01:45:46   have all the expertise in-house to make [TS]

01:45:47   an amazing GPU ourselves we don't need [TS]

01:45:49   them anymore it will free us up to do [TS]

01:45:51   what we want now there's a couple of [TS]

01:45:53   good articles about this is saying all [TS]

01:45:54   right so Apple could do this but there [TS]

01:45:57   is an entire software ecosystem built up [TS]

01:45:59   around the power of the architecture [TS]

01:46:02   that take advantage of features of the [TS]

01:46:05   power of ER architecture that are tuned [TS]

01:46:08   to work well on that architecture in [TS]

01:46:10   terms of you know for games you can get [TS]

01:46:12   really low level type of stuff like [TS]

01:46:14   things that perform particularly well on [TS]

01:46:15   a particular chip with a particular set [TS]

01:46:17   of execution units in a particular [TS]

01:46:18   arrangement with particular latencies [TS]

01:46:20   that's how game development works a lot [TS]

01:46:21   of the time especially as you get up [TS]

01:46:23   towards the high end if Apple makes a [TS]

01:46:25   new GPU that has very different [TS]

01:46:28   characteristics or that doesn't support [TS]

01:46:29   any of these weird power vr specific [TS]

01:46:32   extensions that are there are things [TS]

01:46:35   that game developers can use or could [TS]

01:46:38   have used in the past that may be a [TS]

01:46:40   problem for iOS game compatibility [TS]

01:46:43   like metal may help with this because [TS]

01:46:46   presumably metal provides I mean it's [TS]

01:46:49   it's less of an abstraction layer than [TS]

01:46:51   OpenGL but it's more than like writing [TS]

01:46:54   against the you know the bare metal of [TS]

01:46:56   the GPU so there could be troubled [TS]

01:46:59   waters at for iOS game performance but I [TS]

01:47:02   have faith that Apple knows about all [TS]

01:47:04   these issues and will have software [TS]

01:47:06   based solutions and because their new [TS]

01:47:07   GPU will be so much faster than the old [TS]

01:47:09   ones games tuned for the power via our [TS]

01:47:11   performance specifics they'll get by on [TS]

01:47:13   the know in just because it's it's so [TS]

01:47:14   much faster so this this development [TS]

01:47:17   this sort of corporate divorce divorce [TS]

01:47:19   makes me excited to see what what the [TS]

01:47:22   next GPU will be like and I assume it's [TS]

01:47:25   like the not this year's one but next [TS]

01:47:27   year's like might as well find out this [TS]

01:47:29   soon as the iphone 8 or whatever they're [TS]

01:47:30   going to call it comes out and someone [TS]

01:47:31   checks it out and see it sees if it has [TS]

01:47:33   a power via our base to GPU in there but [TS]

01:47:36   i'm kind of excited about that but i [TS]

01:47:38   don't think it's related to the mac pro [TS]

01:47:40   yeah i agree completely there's no way [TS]

01:47:43   that is connected to the mac pro the [TS]

01:47:45   timing is a coincidence yeah there's no [TS]

01:47:47   way i also think you know with with the [TS]

01:47:49   with the idea of like you know changing [TS]

01:47:51   it and being a problem for games i don't [TS]

01:47:54   think it's that big of a deal because [TS]

01:47:56   there aren't that many people writing [TS]

01:47:59   high-performance low-level game engines [TS]

01:48:01   at that you know at that level on for [TS]

01:48:04   iOS or for anything really you know [TS]

01:48:06   there's not a lot of original low-level [TS]

01:48:08   game engines being written at any given [TS]

01:48:10   time you know most games that come at [TS]

01:48:12   are using someone else's engine so it's [TS]

01:48:16   it's a relatively small number of like [TS]

01:48:19   engine providers and authors that will [TS]

01:48:21   need to adapt to any changes like this [TS]

01:48:23   anyway and the fact is enough I phones [TS]

01:48:27   are sold that if the new iPhones from [TS]

01:48:30   this point forward have this [TS]

01:48:31   architecture every mobile game developer [TS]

01:48:34   is going to demand support for that and [TS]

01:48:36   so the engine makers are going to do it [TS]

01:48:38   so it it's really not an issue like [TS]

01:48:41   that's that's not going to be a problem [TS]

01:48:42   at all yeah it's still it's still better [TS]

01:48:45   at same thing on game columns like [TS]

01:48:46   consoles these days we're like game [TS]

01:48:48   consoles will feel free to rev their [TS]

01:48:50   hardware and then [TS]

01:48:51   console game developers just deal with [TS]

01:48:53   it like when the PSP s4 pro comes out or [TS]

01:48:56   the Scorpio like this lik well the [TS]

01:48:58   hardware changed in a way that we have [TS]

01:49:00   never optimized for but then again also [TS]

01:49:02   the hardware is faster as this new GPU [TS]

01:49:03   will faster as well and they figure it [TS]

01:49:05   out because that's how you make as how [TS]

01:49:07   you make the money how you sell the [TS]

01:49:09   games thanks for our three sponsors this [TS]

01:49:12   week Squarespace audible and fracture we [TS]

01:49:15   will see you next week now the show is [TS]

01:49:21   over they didn't even mean to begin cuz [TS]

01:49:25   it was accidental oh it was accidental [TS]

01:49:28   John didn't do any research Marco and [TS]

01:49:33   Casey wouldn't let him cuz it was [TS]

01:49:36   accidental it was accidental and you can [TS]

01:49:41   find the show notes at ATP FM and if [TS]

01:49:46   you're into twitter you can follow them [TS]

01:49:50   at cas Eyl ISS so that's Casey list ma [TS]

01:49:56   RTO a RM can t marco arment as I r kc [TS]

01:50:03   USA Syracuse [TS]

01:50:18   ah so once i went back and listened to [TS]

01:50:21   the tape last time it certainly does [TS]

01:50:23   appear that i'm going to win the bet in [TS]

01:50:24   all likelihood because I never I never [TS]

01:50:27   bet on it being unmodified I just said [TS]

01:50:29   if the 2013 Mac Pro is still for sale on [TS]

01:50:31   january first that's gonna make someone [TS]

01:50:35   did provide a link that i actually [TS]

01:50:37   removed from follow up that was like see [TS]

01:50:39   look they didn't change the name of it [TS]

01:50:40   and they gave me a link to the page that [TS]

01:50:42   talks about the 2013 but i couldn't find [TS]

01:50:44   anything on the page that said that it [TS]

01:50:46   wasn't just like a page hadn't yet been [TS]

01:50:47   updated like nothing about it indicated [TS]

01:50:49   that that page was aware that they did [TS]

01:50:51   the reconfiguration thing but anyway I [TS]

01:50:53   everything that I've seen indicates to [TS]

01:50:56   me that this is just a price drop and a [TS]

01:50:59   model elimination and everything about [TS]

01:51:01   them will be exactly the same including [TS]

01:51:04   the name and the model number and so no [TS]

01:51:06   even on the strictest possible [TS]

01:51:08   definition they could still be for sale [TS]

01:51:10   yeah so I won't do clear victory until [TS]

01:51:12   January first but I am confident that [TS]

01:51:14   i'm most likely to win this you should [TS]

01:51:17   just start scrounging for money in your [TS]

01:51:18   couch kch day if you find any change [TS]

01:51:20   there a little jar and by the end of the [TS]

01:51:23   air you'll have five dollars now [TS]

01:51:24   remember I found five dollars at the end [TS]

01:51:26   of last week's story so we're going and [TS]

01:51:32   some well we don't worry at some point [TS]

01:51:33   we're going to talk about something else [TS]

01:51:34   just that time is not today I'm [TS]

01:51:37   skeptical it's probably not until 2018 [TS]

01:51:41   actually no and then in 2018 it'll be Oh [TS]

01:51:44   where's the mac pro where's the mac pro [TS]

01:51:46   where's the macro it's not here where's [TS]

01:51:48   Mac Pro it's not here why isn't it here [TS]

01:51:50   Apple is doomed where's the mac pro it's [TS]

01:51:52   not here they already said it didn't [TS]

01:51:54   even say was gonna come in 2018 so we're [TS]

01:51:56   already we're already saying it might [TS]

01:51:58   not be here to play 19 so our [TS]

01:51:59   expectations are appropriately set will [TS]

01:52:01   be like that's gonna stop you too they [TS]

01:52:04   totally like this I seriously though [TS]

01:52:06   this announcement that they're doing [TS]

01:52:08   this thing gets rid of a lot of anxiety [TS]

01:52:12   it's like it's just a matter of what we [TS]

01:52:13   used to before say it's just a matter of [TS]

01:52:15   when but we didn't know now we know they [TS]

01:52:17   put a stake in the ground they said [TS]

01:52:19   words they made promises they're going [TS]

01:52:20   to keep them like it's gonna happen it's [TS]

01:52:22   gonna happen for us I know it mmm then [TS]

01:52:26   we can plan what they release that's [TS]

01:52:27   where the good stuff is after they [TS]

01:52:29   release something or announce it [TS]

01:52:30   everything in between to like [TS]

01:52:32   if they preview it at you know a fall [TS]

01:52:34   event or WTC or whatever else then we [TS]

01:52:37   can nitpick the preview to death that [TS]

01:52:39   that's at least two episodes yep then we [TS]

01:52:41   can say like they said they were gonna [TS]

01:52:43   make the parts upgradeable but [TS]

01:52:44   everything is soldered to this [TS]

01:52:45   motherboard what were they thinking that [TS]

01:52:46   they just mean that they're gonna create [TS]

01:52:48   an a they won't even upgrade it if [TS]

01:52:49   everything is soldered on yeah well have [TS]

01:52:52   fun there but but now they said so many [TS]

01:52:54   of the right things is just that this [TS]

01:52:56   this is going to be a long honeymoon [TS]

01:52:57   period for me to just imagine how [TS]

01:52:59   awesomeness things going to be and then [TS]

01:53:01   a three-year-long just tirade about how [TS]

01:53:06   it doesn't meet your every expectation [TS]

01:53:07   I'm still even considering buying the [TS]

01:53:11   imac pro like in addition to the mat [TS]

01:53:14   just has been so long so they bought a [TS]

01:53:16   mac i should do a marco thing where i'm [TS]

01:53:17   gonna buy the imac pro keep it for a [TS]

01:53:19   little while sell it by the mac pro [TS]

01:53:21   because I i had the mac pro for only [TS]

01:53:23   about 9 or 10 months before the 5k came [TS]

01:53:26   out and i didn't lose that much money on [TS]

01:53:28   it like I lost I think like fifteen [TS]

01:53:31   percent or something over like you know [TS]

01:53:34   almost a year that I consider that [TS]

01:53:36   pretty good yeah do you think I a [TS]

01:53:38   macbook adorable update is eminent cuz [TS]

01:53:41   I'm really itching to buy one you mean [TS]

01:53:42   the speed bump sorry I blows and do [TS]

01:53:44   those anymore it's really it honestly is [TS]

01:53:48   a very good question like where the heck [TS]

01:53:50   that is because it sure seems like you [TS]

01:53:53   know that that probably should have come [TS]

01:53:54   out this spring pretty sure the trip was [TS]

01:53:56   available but you know at me there could [TS]

01:53:59   be seen a like now we don't know before [TS]

01:54:01   we could just say it's just Tim Cook [TS]

01:54:03   being you know Tim Cook now we can say [TS]

01:54:05   maybe they're rethinking things maybe [TS]

01:54:06   like now we can be a little more [TS]

01:54:08   optimistic and like well maybe maybe [TS]

01:54:09   they're doing something else well like I [TS]

01:54:12   said when you talked about the mac mini [TS]

01:54:13   just because they've realized that if [TS]

01:54:16   you want a high-end computer you have to [TS]

01:54:17   update it like they've clearly made that [TS]

01:54:19   realization that a they do want a lion [TS]

01:54:21   computer and be you can't have my [TS]

01:54:22   computer you don't update it right that [TS]

01:54:24   doesn't mean they made that same [TS]

01:54:25   realization but anything else in the [TS]

01:54:26   product line because they could be [TS]

01:54:28   saying as you go down the line it's like [TS]

01:54:29   you can have a macbook adorable that we [TS]

01:54:31   never update it's not a high-end product [TS]

01:54:33   nobody cares about performance it's fine [TS]

01:54:34   why why waste time updating it every [TS]

01:54:36   year with speed bumps you know and like [TS]

01:54:38   that that's one of those things like so [TS]

01:54:40   many things that Apple reconsider is [TS]

01:54:41   like why does a computer have to have an [TS]

01:54:43   opt [TS]

01:54:43   dr why why the batteries have to be [TS]

01:54:45   removable laptops right all these things [TS]

01:54:47   that other companies won't consider one [TS]

01:54:50   of the one of the recent ones that Apple [TS]

01:54:52   has adopted is do you have to speed bump [TS]

01:54:56   computers every year just because new [TS]

01:54:57   components are available and apples [TS]

01:54:59   answer bus no no you don't like our [TS]

01:55:02   sales don't seem to suffer from it in [TS]

01:55:04   fact maybe they do better because we [TS]

01:55:05   built up all this demand among the [TS]

01:55:06   people who know that our computers are [TS]

01:55:08   old and crappy that we have these big [TS]

01:55:09   spikes when we release new things so [TS]

01:55:12   maybe you don't have to do that now on [TS]

01:55:13   the high end they've changed their mind [TS]

01:55:15   but the whole rest of the line I will [TS]

01:55:18   need to be convinced that they realize [TS]

01:55:19   that speed bumps are a thing that they [TS]

01:55:20   should go back to doing and honestly I [TS]

01:55:22   don't know if they should quote unquote [TS]

01:55:24   should for the business we all want them [TS]

01:55:26   tech nerds get upset that like speed [TS]

01:55:29   bumps don't happen but maybe they're [TS]

01:55:31   right for non high-end products that the [TS]

01:55:33   customers for those products don't care [TS]

01:55:36   and we'll just keep buying the macbook [TS]

01:55:37   adorable and updated every two years or [TS]

01:55:39   every three years or whatever and it [TS]

01:55:40   will be fine and and honestly I can kind [TS]

01:55:42   of get on the same page with them if [TS]

01:55:44   they have the numbers to back that up [TS]

01:55:45   because the role of those products is [TS]

01:55:47   not to be the very fastest thing you can [TS]

01:55:49   get and when you do comparisons against [TS]

01:55:51   competitive products it's like what we [TS]

01:55:53   got mac OS you can't design apples to [TS]

01:55:55   apples comparison haha because who cares [TS]

01:55:57   if you can buy a dell laptop for way [TS]

01:55:59   cheaper that has updated components no [TS]

01:56:02   Mac OS so that could be what they're [TS]

01:56:05   saying now I hope they go back to speed [TS]

01:56:08   bumps because I think it's just a [TS]

01:56:09   healthier thing to do overall and the [TS]

01:56:10   lack of speed bumps makes technical [TS]

01:56:12   people angry at Apple which spills over [TS]

01:56:14   into our attitudes about everything else [TS]

01:56:15   that they do but who knows but anyway [TS]

01:56:17   they made the right decision in the mac [TS]

01:56:18   pro again I'm still basking in that some [TS]

01:56:20   honeymoon period you know if you look at [TS]

01:56:24   the if you look at the macrumors buyer's [TS]

01:56:26   guide macbook don't buy macbook air [TS]

01:56:28   don't buy macbook pro yeah imac don't [TS]

01:56:31   buy mac mini don't buy mac pro by now i [TS]

01:56:35   can't i can't believe they did that like [TS]

01:56:37   it's like a bug in their systems like [TS]

01:56:38   yeah i know they quote unquote updated [TS]

01:56:42   it by changing prices but like you got [TS]

01:56:44   to turn that back to don't buy like [TS]

01:56:47   don't don't buy that yeah there's no way [TS]

01:56:49   that is earned there is no way that's a [TS]

01:56:52   bug that is earned even less than the [TS]

01:56:54   new badge was when we started this show [TS]

01:56:55   from 10-12 mac pro [TS]

01:56:57   is it still that way because I saw those [TS]

01:56:59   same screen shots when people screens [TS]

01:57:00   haha look at this isn't as funny their [TS]

01:57:02   buggy software put it as a bi but it's [TS]

01:57:04   still there maybe I mean someone at [TS]

01:57:05   macrumors actually think so it's I would [TS]

01:57:06   looked a minute ago they never change [TS]

01:57:08   still there it right there right on top [TS]

01:57:10   by now it says buy now price drop so it [TS]

01:57:13   at least clarifies that it's not an [TS]

01:57:15   update but but don't but don't buy now [TS]

01:57:18   no one should buy those unless you have [TS]

01:57:20   less you have to less you know you have [TS]

01:57:23   to because like whatever reason that [TS]

01:57:25   Casey's co-worker means about right but [TS]

01:57:27   regular people don't buy those it did [TS]

01:57:29   not improve no and the price drop if if [TS]

01:57:32   they had dropped the price is fifty [TS]

01:57:33   bucks yeah definitely buy right but I [TS]

01:57:35   didn't know it feel pretty darn [TS]

01:57:38   expensive you should not buy it yeah now [TS]

01:57:41   to get a good configuration instead of [TS]

01:57:42   spending seven thousand dollars you'll [TS]

01:57:43   spend five thousand dollars still [TS]

01:57:45   probably not or spending for almost four [TS]

01:57:48   year old computer for a computer that [TS]

01:57:50   your phone beats into yeah marks well [TS]

01:57:52   it's not that bad but it's not great [TS]

01:57:54   there's a refurb macbook adorables I [TS]

01:57:58   know my brain is telling me no but my [TS]

01:58:01   heart is saying yes don't just don't I I [TS]

01:58:04   want one though I'm sick of having an [TS]

01:58:07   iPad that doesn't let me get anything [TS]

01:58:08   done on it imagine if I pets actually [TS]

01:58:12   worked for getting things done I'd be [TS]

01:58:13   amazing oh my god [TS]