The Accidental Tech Podcast

00:00:00 ◼   ► oh did you ever modify last week's show [TS]

00:00:01 ◼   ► notes mark when I had a bet going to see [TS]

00:00:03 ◼   ► when you would nothing [TS]

00:00:09 ◼   ► nothing dad don't look I'll look dad [TS]

00:00:10 ◼   ► don't look dad it's fine dad free show [TS]

00:00:15 ◼   ► Mike oh is it the title because it's all [TS]

00:00:16 ◼   ► like small caps on the website so I [TS]

00:00:18 ◼   ► can't tell if that title no no do you [TS]

00:00:20 ◼   ► still have your dollar signs in your [TS]

00:00:21 ◼   ► menu market is here have you fixed that [TS]

00:00:23 ◼   ► no I fixed it during recording oh yeah [TS]

00:00:25 ◼   ► okay you can play about the emoji foam [TS]

00:00:29 ◼   ► oh no yeah you you've already skipped [TS]

00:00:31 ◼   ► over it then tell me Sonos and google [TS]

00:00:36 ◼   ► sitting in a tree anchor and amazon kis [TS]

00:00:38 ◼   ► s ing you mess it up by putting the word [TS]

00:00:41 ◼   ► are in there are is not in the nursery [TS]

00:00:44 ◼   ► rhyme that is true that's all I can play [TS]

00:00:46 ◼   ► it about I have no problem with you [TS]

00:00:47 ◼   ► doing a cute thing in the show notes I [TS]

00:00:49 ◼   ► have a problem with you not knowing how [TS]

00:00:51 ◼   ► the KS Society song goes it would be [TS]

00:00:55 ◼   ► Sonos and Google sitting in a tree [TS]

00:00:57 ◼   ► ellipsis next line would be canker in [TS]

00:01:02 ◼   ► Amazon like have you not you messed it [TS]

00:01:03 ◼   ► up but it was two different topics I was [TS]

00:01:05 ◼   ► trying to I was trying to wrestle it [TS]

00:01:07 ◼   ► away well you blew it you blow it I'm [TS]

00:01:13 ◼   ► speaking to you two fine gentlemen [TS]

00:01:14 ◼   ► tonight from the peaks of High Sierra as [TS]

00:01:17 ◼   ► am I actually but for a bad reason well [TS]

00:01:20 ◼   ► that's surprising yeah well yeah epithet [TS]

00:01:24 ◼   ► and that should be a topic today I just [TS]

00:01:26 ◼   ► put it in and I now have moved it up to [TS]

00:01:29 ◼   ► the top but we can't get there yet [TS]

00:01:30 ◼   ► because we have to do some follow-up so [TS]

00:01:32 ◼   ► since we already are enticing the [TS]

00:01:35 ◼   ► listeners let's just dive right in John [TS]

00:01:37 ◼   ► can you tell me about Sky platform [TS]

00:01:39 ◼   ► exclusivity if you please [TS]

00:01:41 ◼   ► speculated in the last show that that [TS]

00:01:44 ◼   ► Sky's exclusivity to the Apple TV would [TS]

00:01:47 ◼   ► be just like every other exclusive in [TS]

00:01:49 ◼   ► the gaming world a timed exclusive and [TS]

00:01:51 ◼   ► that is actually confirmed on that game [TS]

00:01:52 ◼   ► company's website it says arriving first [TS]

00:01:55 ◼   ► on iPhone iPad and Apple TV additional [TS]

00:01:57 ◼   ► platforms to follow no time window given [TS]

00:02:00 ◼   ► but we'll see how that goes so I might [TS]

00:02:02 ◼   ► just be able to hold out until it comes [TS]

00:02:03 ◼   ► out on you know ps4 or whatever and tell [TS]

00:02:06 ◼   ► me about your chair please I have my [TS]

00:02:08 ◼   ► chair my ridiculously expensive [TS]

00:02:10 ◼   ► Herman Miller chair that [TS]

00:02:12 ◼   ► I've been sitting on since like the last [TS]

00:02:14 ◼   ► show that where we talked about it or [TS]

00:02:16 ◼   ► maybe two shows ago I forget but I just [TS]

00:02:18 ◼   ► want to give an update on how that's [TS]

00:02:19 ◼   ► going so I did take off both of the arms [TS]

00:02:22 ◼   ► I had to order another Torx wrench [TS]

00:02:24 ◼   ► because the one that I had couldn't fit [TS]

00:02:26 ◼   ► in a little space or whatever but it's [TS]

00:02:28 ◼   ► go is good to have more allen keys and [TS]

00:02:30 ◼   ► torque wrenches you know in in metric [TS]

00:02:32 ◼   ► and standards and all sorts of sizes [TS]

00:02:34 ◼   ► torques it just comes in its own little [TS]

00:02:36 ◼   ► sizes t3 is what I needed anyway [TS]

00:02:40 ◼   ► arms are off 30 I forget anyway one of [TS]

00:02:44 ◼   ► them I don't think it matters it matters [TS]

00:02:45 ◼   ► if you want to take the arms off your [TS]

00:02:47 ◼   ► chair I had a set of Torx Torx wrench [TS]

00:02:50 ◼   ► things but they didn't fit and they [TS]

00:02:52 ◼   ► don't make it a couple of those screws [TS]

00:02:54 ◼   ► are hard to get out because the levers [TS]

00:02:55 ◼   ► they come out to do that adjust the [TS]

00:02:57 ◼   ► cedar kind of in the way but it's not [TS]

00:02:58 ◼   ► that bad just Amazon or some home so [TS]

00:03:01 ◼   ► I've been sitting in that chair for a [TS]

00:03:02 ◼   ► while and I have of just some follow-up [TS]

00:03:04 ◼   ► impressions of it I like it you know [TS]

00:03:08 ◼   ► it's it takes a little bit of getting [TS]

00:03:10 ◼   ► used to because it feel like regular [TS]

00:03:11 ◼   ► chairs but I think I've settled into it [TS]

00:03:13 ◼   ► pretty well two things about it have [TS]

00:03:16 ◼   ► annoyed me so far one there is an [TS]

00:03:17 ◼   ► adjustment on it to make the seat length [TS]

00:03:20 ◼   ► like basically from the back to the [TS]

00:03:22 ◼   ► front of the seat to it to make it [TS]

00:03:23 ◼   ► longer which is great for people with [TS]

00:03:24 ◼   ► long legs like me because you're not [TS]

00:03:26 ◼   ► supposed to have like half your leg [TS]

00:03:27 ◼   ► hanging off the front of the thing so [TS]

00:03:29 ◼   ► you can make the seat longer I wish more [TS]

00:03:31 ◼   ► cars had that some of them do some cars [TS]

00:03:33 ◼   ► actually have this adjustment to sort of [TS]

00:03:34 ◼   ► support your legs more you know more [TS]

00:03:38 ◼   ► down towards your knee they say you're [TS]

00:03:39 ◼   ► supposed to have like you know two [TS]

00:03:40 ◼   ► inches between the back of your knee or [TS]

00:03:43 ◼   ► the back of your calf or whatever and [TS]

00:03:44 ◼   ► then the seat front so the her Miller [TS]

00:03:47 ◼   ► and body has two big handles that you [TS]

00:03:49 ◼   ► can grab and slide out the front part of [TS]

00:03:51 ◼   ► the chair which I do but unless you are [TS]

00:03:55 ◼   ► in a situation where you're sharing your [TS]

00:03:57 ◼   ► chair with somebody else and constantly [TS]

00:03:59 ◼   ► switching back and forth this like many [TS]

00:04:01 ◼   ► of the adjustments on chairs is [TS]

00:04:02 ◼   ► something that you'll do once or twice [TS]

00:04:05 ◼   ► in the beginning when you're getting [TS]

00:04:06 ◼   ► used to the chair and you'll eventually [TS]

00:04:07 ◼   ► decide what adjustment setting is right [TS]

00:04:10 ◼   ► for me there's only a few choices there [TS]

00:04:11 ◼   ► there's not like an infinite [TS]

00:04:12 ◼   ► adjustability and you find how the seat [TS]

00:04:15 ◼   ► is come feel for you and you leave it [TS]

00:04:16 ◼   ► there but for the entire time you own [TS]

00:04:19 ◼   ► this chair these two Mickey Mouse ears [TS]

00:04:22 ◼   ► coffee cup mug handles are going to be [TS]

00:04:25 ◼   ► sticking out the [TS]

00:04:26 ◼   ► of your chair and every time I get into [TS]

00:04:27 ◼   ► and out of my chair somehow I bump into [TS]

00:04:30 ◼   ► those things they're like ears like [TS]

00:04:31 ◼   ► useless ears fossilized ears poking out [TS]

00:04:34 ◼   ► at the front of the chair and I don't [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► like that [TS]

00:04:36 ◼   ► second thing is since I have it extended [TS]

00:04:39 ◼   ► almost as far as it will go I think [TS]

00:04:40 ◼   ► maybe I do have as far as it will go for [TS]

00:04:42 ◼   ► my long legs there's like a little bit [TS]

00:04:44 ◼   ► of a creak enos in the front of the [TS]

00:04:46 ◼   ► chair as that a little telescoping thing [TS]

00:04:48 ◼   ► kind of flexes and it's in its plastic [TS]

00:04:50 ◼   ► grooves [TS]

00:04:51 ◼   ► maybe that squeak will go away over time [TS]

00:04:53 ◼   ► maybe it won't but it's not a sort of [TS]

00:04:56 ◼   ► it's not a sound any feeling that [TS]

00:04:59 ◼   ► matches up with the price of this chair [TS]

00:05:01 ◼   ► so I really like that and then the final [TS]

00:05:03 ◼   ► thing there's a lot of stuff under this [TS]

00:05:05 ◼   ► chair for all of these spring-loaded [TS]

00:05:07 ◼   ► like mechanisms that handle the thing [TS]

00:05:10 ◼   ► where you lean back in the chair and [TS]

00:05:12 ◼   ► some of it probably also handles like [TS]

00:05:15 ◼   ► the the back tension and then there's [TS]

00:05:16 ◼   ► the gas cylinder thing for the height of [TS]

00:05:18 ◼   ► the chair that giant box of works that's [TS]

00:05:21 ◼   ► basically under your butt takes up a [TS]

00:05:23 ◼   ► surprising amount of room and you say [TS]

00:05:25 ◼   ► who cares about that room nothing's [TS]

00:05:26 ◼   ► going on on to your chair right well [TS]

00:05:27 ◼   ► apparently I'm someone who occasionally [TS]

00:05:30 ◼   ► crosses his legs and shoves both his [TS]

00:05:33 ◼   ► feet underneath the bottom of the seat [TS]

00:05:34 ◼   ► resting them on the top of the little [TS]

00:05:36 ◼   ► leg thingies and I didn't know I did [TS]

00:05:39 ◼   ► this as much as I do [TS]

00:05:40 ◼   ► until my heel started hitting that giant [TS]

00:05:42 ◼   ► box that I'm now sitting on and I [TS]

00:05:44 ◼   ► suppose I could get used to it but I'm [TS]

00:05:46 ◼   ► still hitting my heels in that box [TS]

00:05:47 ◼   ► surprising amount of time just like I [TS]

00:05:49 ◼   ► kind of wish I kind of wish that wasn't [TS]

00:05:51 ◼   ► there I kind of wish I had that free [TS]

00:05:52 ◼   ► space to shove my feet into again so [TS]

00:05:56 ◼   ► that's my update on the embody mostly I [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► like it [TS]

00:05:58 ◼   ► I think definitely gonna keep it but I [TS]

00:06:02 ◼   ► I'm sitting right now on the steel case [TS]

00:06:05 ◼   ► gesture chair which just arrived today [TS]

00:06:07 ◼   ► this still has arms on it and they're [TS]

00:06:10 ◼   ► gonna be much more difficult to take off [TS]

00:06:11 ◼   ► I'm already puzzling over how I'm going [TS]

00:06:13 ◼   ► to manage this but for now the arms are [TS]

00:06:14 ◼   ► on and I'm sitting on it definitely [TS]

00:06:16 ◼   ► feels different than the embody but and [TS]

00:06:20 ◼   ► and it has right away its adjustment for [TS]

00:06:23 ◼   ► the length of the seat is to move the [TS]

00:06:25 ◼   ► entire seat forward so it's all just one [TS]

00:06:26 ◼   ► unit there's no extended bit it has less [TS]

00:06:28 ◼   ► creaky bits on it and there's more room [TS]

00:06:31 ◼   ► underneath it for me to cross my legs [TS]

00:06:32 ◼   ► but it definitely feels different than [TS]

00:06:35 ◼   ► the embody feels more like a normal [TS]

00:06:36 ◼   ► chair and I'm not sure if I like it as [TS]

00:06:38 ◼   ► much [TS]

00:06:38 ◼   ► the embody but I'm just sitting in it [TS]

00:06:40 ◼   ► for five minutes here so probably make [TS]

00:06:42 ◼   ► sure I'll have a more longer-term update [TS]

00:06:44 ◼   ► on the comparison to these two chairs [TS]

00:06:46 ◼   ► and I better hurry up because I got like [TS]

00:06:47 ◼   ► 30 days for both of them to decide [TS]

00:06:49 ◼   ► whether I want my bazillion dollars back [TS]

00:06:52 ◼   ► for these chairs so last episode I was [TS]

00:06:56 ◼   ► lamenting the fact that if you have an [TS]

00:06:58 ◼   ► issue with your Google pixel phone you [TS]

00:07:00 ◼   ► can get online and you can tell Google [TS]

00:07:03 ◼   ► hey I've got an issue and they'll [TS]

00:07:05 ◼   ► overnight you a box with a replacement [TS]

00:07:06 ◼   ► pixel and then you put your broken pixel [TS]

00:07:09 ◼   ► into the box and ship it back to them [TS]

00:07:11 ◼   ► and I thought man that would be really [TS]

00:07:13 ◼   ► awesome to be able to do that with Apple [TS]

00:07:15 ◼   ► I wish that was a thing and a handful [TS]

00:07:17 ◼   ► people wrote in to say it is a thing [TS]

00:07:20 ◼   ► so John Tooker pointed me to Apple Care [TS]

00:07:23 ◼   ► Plus Xpress replacement service which is [TS]

00:07:26 ◼   ► if you have Apple Care plus a way that [TS]

00:07:30 ◼   ► you can basically do the exact same [TS]

00:07:31 ◼   ► thing they ship you a box and then you [TS]

00:07:33 ◼   ► put your thing in the box that the new [TS]

00:07:35 ◼   ► thing came in etc there's a joke here [TS]

00:07:37 ◼   ► from Saturday Night Live that I'm trying [TS]

00:07:38 ◼   ► to avoid anyway pram wrote in to say [TS]

00:07:42 ◼   ► I've done this and here's what it looks [TS]

00:07:44 ◼   ► like and so we'll put a link to that in [TS]

00:07:45 ◼   ► the show notes and it's exactly what you [TS]

00:07:47 ◼   ► would expect to see so turns out this is [TS]

00:07:50 ◼   ► an option I just had no idea which if [TS]

00:07:51 ◼   ► you live far away for an Apple Store [TS]

00:07:53 ◼   ► which most of the country probably does [TS]

00:07:55 ◼   ► that's pretty awesome and then [TS]

00:07:58 ◼   ► additionally via pram they pointed me to [TS]

00:08:01 ◼   ► a kbase article hi Steven entitled how [TS]

00:08:05 ◼   ► to use your Apple watch without your [TS]

00:08:07 ◼   ► iPhone nearby and it says a handful of [TS]

00:08:09 ◼   ► things in there but one of the things it [TS]

00:08:11 ◼   ► says is to receive SMS mms or push [TS]

00:08:14 ◼   ► notifications from third-party apps [TS]

00:08:16 ◼   ► you're on your Apple watch Series three [TS]

00:08:18 ◼   ► GPS and cellular you're paired iPhone [TS]

00:08:20 ◼   ► must be powered on and connected to [TS]

00:08:22 ◼   ► Wi-Fi or cellular but it doesn't need to [TS]

00:08:23 ◼   ► be nearby so that kind of hints to me [TS]

00:08:27 ◼   ► that that Apple is proxying push [TS]

00:08:31 ◼   ► notifications I have since heard reports [TS]

00:08:33 ◼   ► that whatsapp I believe that's what it [TS]

00:08:35 ◼   ► what the app was I know that that is an [TS]

00:08:38 ◼   ► app I just can't remember what people [TS]

00:08:39 ◼   ► were citing but a handful of people [TS]

00:08:41 ◼   ► cited something and I think it was [TS]

00:08:42 ◼   ► whatsapp as not having an Apple watch [TS]

00:08:44 ◼   ► app at all [TS]

00:08:45 ◼   ► yet people receiving push notifications [TS]

00:08:48 ◼   ► via cellular additionally the developers [TS]

00:08:51 ◼   ► of do [TS]

00:08:52 ◼   ► actually wrote us to say do useless [TS]

00:08:55 ◼   ► local notifications [TS]

00:08:56 ◼   ► I think the scheduled notifications were [TS]

00:08:58 ◼   ► copied from the iPhone to the watch the [TS]

00:09:00 ◼   ► last time they talked and I think one of [TS]

00:09:01 ◼   ► us had had theorized that that may be [TS]

00:09:03 ◼   ► the case but it sure sounds like and I [TS]

00:09:06 ◼   ► have since gotten tacit confirmation [TS]

00:09:08 ◼   ► from a couple of little birdies that [TS]

00:09:09 ◼   ► Apple is indeed proxying push [TS]

00:09:11 ◼   ► notifications via I guess iCloud or [TS]

00:09:13 ◼   ► something in order for watch your [TS]

00:09:15 ◼   ► cellular watch to receive push [TS]

00:09:16 ◼   ► notifications even if it's not in range [TS]

00:09:18 ◼   ► I have I I have had several people [TS]

00:09:21 ◼   ► explain to me that I'm a moron in that [TS]

00:09:23 ◼   ► actually Bluetooth works very far and [TS]

00:09:25 ◼   ► I'm a moron that the watch was on Wi-Fi [TS]

00:09:28 ◼   ► but I assure you I checked to see what [TS]

00:09:31 ◼   ► the watch says it was on and it said it [TS]

00:09:33 ◼   ► was on cellular at the time so yes I'm [TS]

00:09:36 ◼   ► aware that the watch does work on [TS]

00:09:39 ◼   ► Bluetooth and Bluetooth works further [TS]

00:09:41 ◼   ► away than one would expect I understand [TS]

00:09:43 ◼   ► it works on Wi-Fi I don't know why it [TS]

00:09:44 ◼   ► wasn't on Wi-Fi in this particular [TS]

00:09:46 ◼   ► instance but if the watch said it was on [TS]

00:09:48 ◼   ► cellular and I am inclined to believe [TS]

00:09:50 ◼   ► the watch so in summary it sure does [TS]

00:09:52 ◼   ► sound like that Apple is proxying iPhone [TS]

00:09:54 ◼   ► push notifications which is pretty cool [TS]

00:09:56 ◼   ► we are sponsored this week by a way for [TS]

00:09:59 ◼   ► $20 off your suitcase visit away travel [TS]

00:10:02 ◼   ► calm slash ATP and use promo code ATP [TS]

00:10:06 ◼   ► during checkout away makes high quality [TS]

00:10:10 ◼   ► thoughtfully designed luggage for the [TS]

00:10:12 ◼   ► modern age they use high quality [TS]

00:10:14 ◼   ► materials while offering much lower [TS]

00:10:16 ◼   ► price as compared to other brands by [TS]

00:10:18 ◼   ► cutting out middlemen and selling [TS]

00:10:19 ◼   ► directly to you they now offer nine [TS]

00:10:21 ◼   ► colors and four sizes from carry-ons all [TS]

00:10:25 ◼   ► the way up to giant suitcases for long [TS]

00:10:27 ◼   ► stays all their suitcases are made with [TS]

00:10:29 ◼   ► premium German polycarbonate unrivaled [TS]

00:10:31 ◼   ► in strength and impact resistance and [TS]

00:10:32 ◼   ► very light weight they have a [TS]

00:10:34 ◼   ► patent-pending compression system inside [TS]

00:10:36 ◼   ► which really helps for over packers they [TS]

00:10:38 ◼   ► have four spinning wheels that guarantee [TS]

00:10:40 ◼   ► a smooth ride and easy maneuverability [TS]

00:10:43 ◼   ► all of them have TSA approved [TS]

00:10:44 ◼   ► combination locks and they have [TS]

00:10:46 ◼   ► removable washable laundry bags to help [TS]

00:10:48 ◼   ► keep your dirty clothes separate from [TS]

00:10:50 ◼   ► your clean and the carry-on sizes are [TS]

00:10:52 ◼   ► also able to charge cell phones tablets [TS]

00:10:54 ◼   ► and anything else powered by a USB cable [TS]

00:10:57 ◼   ► because they have built-in batteries a [TS]

00:10:59 ◼   ► single charge of the built-in battery on [TS]

00:11:01 ◼   ► the away carry-on will charge your [TS]

00:11:03 ◼   ► iPhone five times [TS]

00:11:05 ◼   ► all of this is protected by a lifetime [TS]

00:11:07 ◼   ► warranty if anything breaks they'll [TS]

00:11:09 ◼   ► replace or fix it for life you can get [TS]

00:11:12 ◼   ► all this for yourself with a hundred day [TS]

00:11:14 ◼   ► trial get an away suitcase you can live [TS]

00:11:17 ◼   ► with it you can even travel with it [TS]

00:11:19 ◼   ► obviously because that's how you try out [TS]

00:11:20 ◼   ► a suitcase right travel with it for a [TS]

00:11:22 ◼   ► hundred days and if you decide it is not [TS]

00:11:24 ◼   ► right for you you can return it for a [TS]

00:11:26 ◼   ► full refund with no questions asked [TS]

00:11:28 ◼   ► check that today you can get free [TS]

00:11:30 ◼   ► shipping on any away order within the [TS]

00:11:32 ◼   ► lower 48 states to the US and they even [TS]

00:11:34 ◼   ► have a showroom in New York City if you [TS]

00:11:36 ◼   ► want to see them in person so check it [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► out today [TS]

00:11:38 ◼   ► Attaway travel.com slash ATP and you'll [TS]

00:11:41 ◼   ► get $20 off your suitcase use promo code [TS]

00:11:44 ◼   ► ATP during checkout once again away [TS]

00:11:47 ◼   ► travel calm / ATP and use promo code ATP [TS]

00:11:50 ◼   ► for 20 bucks off your suitcase thank you [TS]

00:11:52 ◼   ► so much - a way for sponsoring our show [TS]

00:11:55 ◼   ► [Music] [TS]

00:11:57 ◼   ► moving on to ask ATP Jason Townsend [TS]

00:12:02 ◼   ► writes in for those who run Plex on a [TS]

00:12:04 ◼   ► Mac how do you run it with no logged in [TS]

00:12:06 ◼   ► user and I can speak for myself and say [TS]

00:12:09 ◼   ► I don't it is running as part of my user [TS]

00:12:12 ◼   ► that that I'm using right now on this [TS]

00:12:15 ◼   ► very Mac and this users pretty much [TS]

00:12:16 ◼   ► always logged in and that's ok for me it [TS]

00:12:20 ◼   ► may not be okay for you listener but [TS]

00:12:22 ◼   ► it's okay for me I was hoping you had an [TS]

00:12:23 ◼   ► answer to this that's why I put it in [TS]

00:12:24 ◼   ► there I'm like okay she probably knows [TS]

00:12:25 ◼   ► how to do the same thing it's running as [TS]

00:12:28 ◼   ► actually running is my wife's user and [TS]

00:12:31 ◼   ► she's oh he's logged in now here's the [TS]

00:12:34 ◼   ► thing you don't have to be logged in but [TS]

00:12:38 ◼   ► you don't have to be the frontmost user [TS]

00:12:39 ◼   ► so if one of my kids comes up and do [TS]

00:12:41 ◼   ► this doing their homework on their [TS]

00:12:42 ◼   ► account on the same computer as long as [TS]

00:12:44 ◼   ► my wife is logged in in the background [TS]

00:12:46 ◼   ► Plex still works and runs so you don't [TS]

00:12:47 ◼   ► have to leave their account as the [TS]

00:12:49 ◼   ► frontmost but if there's a way to run it [TS]

00:12:52 ◼   ► without you being logged in like cron it [TS]

00:12:53 ◼   ► and run it as you know some other user [TS]

00:12:55 ◼   ► with no GUI or whatever I have honestly [TS]

00:12:59 ◼   ► I haven't even tried to do it but maybe [TS]

00:13:01 ◼   ► have you tried anything Casey are you [TS]

00:13:03 ◼   ► just like yeah well I guess I'm always [TS]

00:13:04 ◼   ► logged in so I have no need for this [TS]

00:13:05 ◼   ► exactly right I have no need for it [TS]

00:13:08 ◼   ► yeah so I say we're not gonna say that [TS]

00:13:09 ◼   ► it can't be done just that neither of us [TS]

00:13:12 ◼   ► has tried to do it Marco I assume the [TS]

00:13:14 ◼   ► same yeah I mean to me I the the idea of [TS]

00:13:17 ◼   ► running it like with [TS]

00:13:18 ◼   ► not having a logged in user basically [TS]

00:13:20 ◼   ► like as root never even occurred to me [TS]

00:13:22 ◼   ► because that's not how I would think to [TS]

00:13:25 ◼   ► run things that are on a Mac in a server [TS]

00:13:27 ◼   ► role like even though I know there are [TS]

00:13:29 ◼   ► things that Mac's can do as a server [TS]

00:13:31 ◼   ► with no user like you know the built-in [TS]

00:13:33 ◼   ► Apache server and stuff like that many [TS]

00:13:35 ◼   ► of the things that you would run a Mac [TS]

00:13:37 ◼   ► server for require there to be some kind [TS]

00:13:39 ◼   ► of application in user space running to [TS]

00:13:42 ◼   ► serve those tasks so the idea of running [TS]

00:13:45 ◼   ► a Mac in some kind of server role [TS]

00:13:47 ◼   ► without a logged in user and has never [TS]

00:13:49 ◼   ► even occurred to me to even think about [TS]

00:13:52 ◼   ► yeah I know that was not the answer that [TS]

00:13:54 ◼   ► you were looking for Jason and I'm sorry [TS]

00:13:56 ◼   ► that is the answer for us and if you [TS]

00:13:58 ◼   ► happen to know how to do this I would be [TS]

00:14:00 ◼   ► curious to hear it's not really solving [TS]

00:14:02 ◼   ► a need that I have but I'd be curious to [TS]

00:14:03 ◼   ► hear so I do write in and let us know [TS]

00:14:05 ◼   ► and Jason as well Tom Meyers asks could [TS]

00:14:09 ◼   ► you guys help explain why a massively [TS]

00:14:10 ◼   ► multi-core arm Mac Pro oh never mind we [TS]

00:14:13 ◼   ► don't have to talk about this moving on [TS]

00:14:16 ◼   ► for not picking the question I actually [TS]

00:14:18 ◼   ► meant to earlier today and I got [TS]

00:14:20 ◼   ► sidetracked at work and never did and [TS]

00:14:21 ◼   ► actually to be honest I'm curious to [TS]

00:14:23 ◼   ► hear your answer to this John so let me [TS]

00:14:24 ◼   ► let me reread it could you guys help [TS]

00:14:26 ◼   ► explain why I'm a swing multi-core arm [TS]

00:14:28 ◼   ► Mac Pro wouldn't be viable a sixty-four [TS]

00:14:31 ◼   ► core etc a 11x architecture for example [TS]

00:14:34 ◼   ► so it would be viable but we talked [TS]

00:14:36 ◼   ► about this on the show before there's a [TS]

00:14:39 ◼   ► couple of aspects of this you know so we [TS]

00:14:42 ◼   ► all know that Apple makes really fast [TS]

00:14:43 ◼   ► system ownerships for their phones and [TS]

00:14:45 ◼   ► they make even faster ones that they use [TS]

00:14:47 ◼   ► in their iPads and the number of cores [TS]

00:14:49 ◼   ► on them has been increasing from one and [TS]

00:14:51 ◼   ► now out there up to four and the in the [TS]

00:14:53 ◼   ► phone right is it four I forget it's [TS]

00:14:55 ◼   ► well is it with the eight series it's [TS]

00:14:57 ◼   ► now six six you got that you got the [TS]

00:14:59 ◼   ► four slow ones and the two fast ones [TS]

00:15:01 ◼   ► yeah anyway that's a lot of cores it's [TS]

00:15:03 ◼   ► more than they had before but as we [TS]

00:15:06 ◼   ► discussed last time this came up to make [TS]

00:15:09 ◼   ► something that doesn't you know it's not [TS]

00:15:12 ◼   ► like a little system on a chip that it [TS]

00:15:14 ◼   ► takes iPad power but instead takes 150 [TS]

00:15:16 ◼   ► watts or something like a you know a [TS]

00:15:17 ◼   ► Xeon class CPU that's a very different [TS]

00:15:22 ◼   ► kind of design you can't say well [TS]

00:15:24 ◼   ► because we've made a chip for the iPad [TS]

00:15:26 ◼   ► that's faster than all of our laptops [TS]

00:15:28 ◼   ► right there are all faster than our [TS]

00:15:30 ◼   ► cheap laptops we [TS]

00:15:32 ◼   ► we've done all the work to make the Seon [TS]

00:15:34 ◼   ► class thing and you haven't there's a [TS]

00:15:35 ◼   ► lot more that goes into making a zeon [TS]

00:15:37 ◼   ► class CPU than just saying oh we have a [TS]

00:15:40 ◼   ► quorum we'll just multiply it out it's [TS]

00:15:41 ◼   ► like a GPU where you just you know take [TS]

00:15:43 ◼   ► the execution unit and just add more of [TS]

00:15:44 ◼   ► them and even that gets more complicated [TS]

00:15:46 ◼   ► there's tons of things having to do with [TS]

00:15:48 ◼   ► IO and PCI Express Lanes and figuring [TS]

00:15:50 ◼   ► out the whole Thunderbolt thing and the [TS]

00:15:53 ◼   ► various chipsets not to mention all the [TS]

00:15:55 ◼   ► the multiple cores and the cache [TS]

00:15:57 ◼   ► coherency and the ECC Ram and all sorts [TS]

00:15:59 ◼   ► of other things that you know it's not [TS]

00:16:01 ◼   ► to say they couldn't do it they would [TS]

00:16:03 ◼   ► I'm sure they would do an excellent job [TS]

00:16:04 ◼   ► it's just to say that they by having [TS]

00:16:07 ◼   ► lappa by having an iPad and phone ships [TS]

00:16:09 ◼   ► they haven't done all the work so if [TS]

00:16:12 ◼   ► they wanted to make one they could but [TS]

00:16:15 ◼   ► it's a lot of additional work and the [TS]

00:16:17 ◼   ► question you've always had is is it [TS]

00:16:18 ◼   ► worthwhile for Apple to do all that [TS]

00:16:20 ◼   ► additional work to essentially compete [TS]

00:16:22 ◼   ► with Zeon's for a line of computers that [TS]

00:16:25 ◼   ► they sell very very few of compared to [TS]

00:16:27 ◼   ► anything else so maybe that's the answer [TS]

00:16:32 ◼   ► to the viability question technically [TS]

00:16:33 ◼   ► viable sure but Apple would have to do a [TS]

00:16:35 ◼   ► ton of work financially viable can Apple [TS]

00:16:37 ◼   ► justify that ton of work maybe they will [TS]

00:16:39 ◼   ► eventually because I mean as people have [TS]

00:16:41 ◼   ► been benchmarking the new iPhone 8 and 8 [TS]

00:16:44 ◼   ► plus against Mac laptops like modern Mac [TS]

00:16:47 ◼   ► laptops that you can buy right now that [TS]

00:16:49 ◼   ► are not like last year's models and [TS]

00:16:51 ◼   ► seeing how fast the the system-on-a-chip [TS]

00:16:53 ◼   ► is the case for arm powered Mac laptops [TS]

00:16:58 ◼   ► is getting stronger and stronger but the [TS]

00:17:01 ◼   ► case for arm powered Mac Pro's I mean if [TS]

00:17:04 ◼   ► Apple started this project four years [TS]

00:17:06 ◼   ► ago and has a Xeon class arm CPU waiting [TS]

00:17:08 ◼   ► in the wings for like next year's Mac [TS]

00:17:10 ◼   ► Pro then fine but if there haven't [TS]

00:17:11 ◼   ► started that project now you're not [TS]

00:17:14 ◼   ► gonna see one of these for a long time [TS]

00:17:15 ◼   ► it would cost a lot of money it would [TS]

00:17:17 ◼   ► take a lot of time and honestly I feel [TS]

00:17:22 ◼   ► like Intel does pretty well in the high [TS]

00:17:24 ◼   ► end perhaps better than they do in the [TS]

00:17:26 ◼   ► low end and the laptop space so [TS]

00:17:28 ◼   ► best-case scenario Apple makes something [TS]

00:17:30 ◼   ► that is some singles a double digit [TS]

00:17:32 ◼   ► percentage faster than Intel and you [TS]

00:17:35 ◼   ► don't really get a lot of extra points [TS]

00:17:36 ◼   ► for doing it with less power and is the [TS]

00:17:39 ◼   ► on class thing because you know you're [TS]

00:17:41 ◼   ► not running them off battery like the [TS]

00:17:42 ◼   ► whole point of these machines is they're [TS]

00:17:43 ◼   ► plugged into the wall and it's like a [TS]

00:17:45 ◼   ► huge amount of power going into them for [TS]

00:17:48 ◼   ► to power everything the RAM or you know [TS]

00:17:50 ◼   ► the GPU the separate GPU the multiple [TS]

00:17:52 ◼   ► GPUs and stuff like that so no I think [TS]

00:17:56 ◼   ► it's viable but it may not be [TS]

00:17:59 ◼   ► financially the best thing for Apple to [TS]

00:18:01 ◼   ► do and they have a lot of work to do [TS]

00:18:02 ◼   ► I'm still super curious to see if to one [TS]

00:18:07 ◼   ► day discover if we'll ever see a ARM [TS]

00:18:09 ◼   ► based MacBook Pro certainly Marco has [TS]

00:18:12 ◼   ► thoughts about MacBook Pros these days [TS]

00:18:14 ◼   ► mm-hmm [TS]

00:18:15 ◼   ► I didn't actually put that in as a topic [TS]

00:18:17 ◼   ► but we can't talk about that often but [TS]

00:18:19 ◼   ► before we leave this the I would be [TS]

00:18:22 ◼   ► super excited to see I think everybody [TS]

00:18:23 ◼   ► would be every computer nerd would be [TS]

00:18:25 ◼   ► like someone wants to compete with [TS]

00:18:28 ◼   ► high-end CPUs with Intel and that would [TS]

00:18:30 ◼   ► be great and like I said Apple has shown [TS]

00:18:32 ◼   ► that it's got really good talent to make [TS]

00:18:34 ◼   ► you know it's just a question of will [TS]

00:18:36 ◼   ► does Apple want to make a chip like this [TS]

00:18:37 ◼   ► because if they want to I bet they can [TS]

00:18:40 ◼   ► do a really good job and it would be [TS]

00:18:41 ◼   ► super cool but it still strikes me as [TS]

00:18:44 ◼   ► one of those fantasies like you know the [TS]

00:18:46 ◼   ► pale oak are kind of fantasy of like [TS]

00:18:48 ◼   ► apples gonna make everything its own and [TS]

00:18:51 ◼   ► it's gonna make a special computer [TS]

00:18:52 ◼   ► that's faster than anybody else's [TS]

00:18:53 ◼   ► because you know make their own CPU and [TS]

00:18:55 ◼   ► that would be super cool but I just feel [TS]

00:18:58 ◼   ► like it's still pipe dream let's baby [TS]

00:18:59 ◼   ► steps let's get let's get a new Mac Pro [TS]

00:19:01 ◼   ► sometime this century and then we'll [TS]

00:19:03 ◼   ► think about putting a 64 core ARM chip [TS]

00:19:07 ◼   ► in it [TS]

00:19:08 ◼   ► Richard Ernie writes in and asks a [TS]

00:19:11 ◼   ► disturbingly reasonable question and [TS]

00:19:14 ◼   ► that question is how many iMac pros do [TS]

00:19:17 ◼   ► you think Marco will buy before the [TS]

00:19:19 ◼   ► launch of the Mac Pro I have an either [TS]

00:19:21 ◼   ► I'd also have an answer okay I feel like [TS]

00:19:26 ◼   ► the answer should be one because you [TS]

00:19:30 ◼   ► will presumably buy the most expensive [TS]

00:19:33 ◼   ► and most ridiculous iMac pro you [TS]

00:19:36 ◼   ► possibly can in the way only Marco can [TS]

00:19:38 ◼   ► do and that should be it [TS]

00:19:40 ◼   ► but I fear you will somehow talked [TS]

00:19:43 ◼   ► yourself into oh this one thing I really [TS]

00:19:46 ◼   ► don't need and or will make it worse so [TS]

00:19:48 ◼   ► like as an example the dual graphics [TS]

00:19:51 ◼   ► card MacBook Pros I know there won't be [TS]

00:19:53 ◼   ► a direct equivalent of that in the iMac [TS]

00:19:54 ◼   ► Pro but something along those lines well [TS]

00:19:56 ◼   ► I understand that the dual graphics card [TS]

00:19:59 ◼   ► Macca pros are hypothetically better but [TS]

00:20:01 ◼   ► they're better in ways that don't matter [TS]

00:20:03 ◼   ► to me so I won't get the maxed out top [TS]

00:20:05 ◼   ► line MacBook Pro instead I'll get a [TS]

00:20:07 ◼   ► different MacBook Pro so that is the one [TS]

00:20:10 ◼   ► I don't know like wild card if you [TS]

00:20:13 ◼   ► somehow convince yourself that oh maybe [TS]

00:20:15 ◼   ► I don't need the cranked to 11 version [TS]

00:20:18 ◼   ► of the iMac Pro then I could see you in [TS]

00:20:21 ◼   ► for two because the first one will be [TS]

00:20:22 ◼   ► the the oh I don't need everything and [TS]

00:20:25 ◼   ► then you'll decide oh that was a [TS]

00:20:26 ◼   ► terrible mistake I need everything and [TS]

00:20:28 ◼   ► then you'll get the one you should've [TS]

00:20:29 ◼   ► gotten in the first place [TS]

00:20:30 ◼   ► John so you're you're overthinking it [TS]

00:20:31 ◼   ► but also under thinking it my answer so [TS]

00:20:39 ◼   ► he's overthinking it because he's got [TS]

00:20:41 ◼   ► his answer of one but then he's hedging [TS]

00:20:42 ◼   ► and what about two you're also under [TS]

00:20:44 ◼   ► thing you're forgetting a very important [TS]

00:20:46 ◼   ► factor when I read this question I had [TS]

00:20:48 ◼   ► an immediate answer and the answer is he [TS]

00:20:49 ◼   ► will buy two before the launch of the [TS]

00:20:51 ◼   ► macro why will he buy two because he'll [TS]

00:20:52 ◼   ► get one because he's impatient and he'll [TS]

00:20:54 ◼   ► buy one for TIF goodbye to iMac pros [TS]

00:20:59 ◼   ► before the Mac Pro you're right that is [TS]

00:21:02 ◼   ► the answer so Marco not that not that it [TS]

00:21:04 ◼   ► matters because you're gonna be wrong [TS]

00:21:06 ◼   ► but what do you think the answer is I [TS]

00:21:08 ◼   ► think the answer is most likely to be [TS]

00:21:12 ◼   ► one but might be zero [TS]

00:21:13 ◼   ► oh I call foul right now somebody marked [TS]

00:21:16 ◼   ► this date down I said most likely one [TS]

00:21:19 ◼   ► explained okay so in John way I'll tell [TS]

00:21:22 ◼   ► you that you're both right and wrong and [TS]

00:21:24 ◼   ► John is both wrong and right [TS]

00:21:27 ◼   ► so the generous plan that would happy [TS]

00:21:30 ◼   ► buying one is I buy one for myself when [TS]

00:21:34 ◼   ► the Mac Pro comes out I give it to TIFF [TS]

00:21:36 ◼   ► and I get myself a Mac Pro the case for [TS]

00:21:39 ◼   ► maybe being 0 it basically leads into [TS]

00:21:42 ◼   ► the first topic that we have on this [TS]

00:21:43 ◼   ► list which is labeled in the chat why is [TS]

00:21:45 ◼   ► Marco on his MacBook Pro and the reason [TS]

00:21:49 ◼   ► why is because my iMac has some issues [TS]

00:21:51 ◼   ► that I wanted to get repaired in the 8 [TS]

00:21:55 ◼   ► days left in the warranty I mean spiders [TS]

00:21:57 ◼   ► good call you know one of those is that [TS]

00:22:00 ◼   ► the screen has image retention that that [TS]

00:22:02 ◼   ► is probably the biggest issue the issue [TS]

00:22:04 ◼   ► that like for long term value and the [TS]

00:22:08 ◼   ► ability to sell it for a reasonable [TS]

00:22:09 ◼   ► price when I'm done with it [TS]

00:22:10 ◼   ► I want to get that fixed [TS]

00:22:12 ◼   ► the screen has a screen only issue I am [TS]

00:22:16 ◼   ► currently without my main desktop [TS]

00:22:18 ◼   ► computer for probably a week maybe a [TS]

00:22:21 ◼   ► little bit less I'm lucky and that is [TS]

00:22:23 ◼   ► horrible like it's incredibly disruptive [TS]

00:22:25 ◼   ► so I have let me show you my desktop [TS]

00:22:28 ◼   ► setup here I pasted the link in the chat [TS]

00:22:29 ◼   ► so the picture I've just shown you is my [TS]

00:22:31 ◼   ► is what I am it's like the old times you [TS]

00:22:43 ◼   ► need some soda can yeah I'm currently [TS]

00:22:46 ◼   ► very much not satisfied with owning an [TS]

00:22:49 ◼   ► iMac as my primary computer because as [TS]

00:22:51 ◼   ► much as I miss the crap out of it I [TS]

00:22:54 ◼   ► really wish it was separate from the [TS]

00:22:56 ◼   ► screen because then if something went [TS]

00:22:58 ◼   ► wrong with the screen I could just get [TS]

00:23:01 ◼   ► the screen fixed if something went wrong [TS]

00:23:03 ◼   ► with the Mac Pro I could plug in a [TS]

00:23:06 ◼   ► laptop to the screen on my desk and use [TS]

00:23:08 ◼   ► that as a stand-in desktop all I got the [TS]

00:23:10 ◼   ► desktop serviced but you're not enough [TS]

00:23:12 ◼   ► of a hardware hoarder to have extra [TS]

00:23:13 ◼   ► screens around so say it was separating [TS]

00:23:15 ◼   ► you just had to get the screen repaired [TS]

00:23:16 ◼   ► you'd have a headless computer with no [TS]

00:23:18 ◼   ► screen and you still have to use your [TS]

00:23:19 ◼   ► laptop because what are you gonna hook [TS]

00:23:20 ◼   ► up the body of your computer to well I [TS]

00:23:23 ◼   ► could get another screen like I could I [TS]

00:23:25 ◼   ► could please like overnight another [TS]

00:23:26 ◼   ► screen I forgot it but buying solves [TS]

00:23:28 ◼   ► everything buying solver an ice cream [TS]

00:23:30 ◼   ► get the other one fixed and that's [TS]

00:23:32 ◼   ► harder to do when it's time act like I'm [TS]

00:23:33 ◼   ► not gonna buy a whole new iMac to use [TS]

00:23:34 ◼   ► for a week and then return it or sell it [TS]

00:23:36 ◼   ► but you but you'd buy a new 5k monitor [TS]

00:23:39 ◼   ► four thousand bucks no problem [TS]

00:23:40 ◼   ► maybe honestly if I'm losing a week of [TS]

00:23:44 ◼   ► productivity here using my laptop as the [TS]

00:23:46 ◼   ► as my only computer it's it and like [TS]

00:23:48 ◼   ► trying to do iOS development on this [TS]

00:23:51 ◼   ► it's crazy [TS]

00:23:52 ◼   ► whoa you're not you're not losing a week [TS]

00:23:55 ◼   ► you're not losing a week you are you are [TS]

00:23:57 ◼   ► perfectly capable of being productive [TS]

00:23:58 ◼   ► you're just you're too fussy to want to [TS]

00:24:01 ◼   ► do no I am doing it like I am powering [TS]

00:24:03 ◼   ► through and doing it but it's exactly [TS]

00:24:05 ◼   ► and it's it's it's at substantial [TS]

00:24:08 ◼   ► reduction of productivity to have I to [TS]

00:24:11 ◼   ► lose you know eight inches of screen [TS]

00:24:13 ◼   ► space for a while so it's not great at [TS]

00:24:18 ◼   ► times like this I really make a mental [TS]

00:24:21 ◼   ► note to say just buy the desktop next [TS]

00:24:23 ◼   ► time like just like just buy the Mac Pro [TS]

00:24:24 ◼   ► next time so I really [TS]

00:24:26 ◼   ► like the the idea of spending a lot of [TS]

00:24:29 ◼   ► money on an iMac Pro that might [TS]

00:24:34 ◼   ► potentially still have that you know [TS]

00:24:35 ◼   ► that would still have this limitation of [TS]

00:24:37 ◼   ► like if anything goes wrong with it I [TS]

00:24:38 ◼   ► lose everything for the time it takes to [TS]

00:24:40 ◼   ► get a service also you know the sign Mac [TS]

00:24:44 ◼   ► is only three years old - eight days and [TS]

00:24:47 ◼   ► it already has like a few little [TS]

00:24:50 ◼   ► annoying things about it and I can [TS]

00:24:53 ◼   ► already see like I might not want to use [TS]

00:24:55 ◼   ► this after you know after the Mac Pro [TS]

00:24:58 ◼   ► comes out you know and I'm assuming for [TS]

00:25:00 ◼   ► this discussion that the Mac Pro scrum [TS]

00:25:02 ◼   ► is probably coming out next summer and [TS]

00:25:03 ◼   ► and so if the Mac Pro comes out way [TS]

00:25:06 ◼   ► later than that like if it ends up being [TS]

00:25:07 ◼   ► 2019 or next winter or like you know [TS]

00:25:09 ◼   ► this might change things but I might [TS]

00:25:12 ◼   ► actually just get zero iMac pros because [TS]

00:25:15 ◼   ► the iMac Pro concerns me in the sense [TS]

00:25:17 ◼   ► that it's really hard to get an iMac to [TS]

00:25:20 ◼   ► function well and be useful for 10 years [TS]

00:25:23 ◼   ► John's Mac Pro is actually doing that [TS]

00:25:26 ◼   ► and you're gonna pay the price of John's [TS]

00:25:30 ◼   ► Mac Pro for an iMac Pro you're gonna pay [TS]

00:25:33 ◼   ► the the zeon tax you're gonna pay the [TS]

00:25:35 ◼   ► pro tax you're gonna you were gonna pay [TS]

00:25:37 ◼   ► like what did they say the base price [TS]

00:25:39 ◼   ► was five thousand five thousand but you [TS]

00:25:41 ◼   ► forget how cheap this was even [TS]

00:25:42 ◼   ► accounting for inflation ten years ago [TS]

00:25:43 ◼   ► this is only like 20-some twenty-two [TS]

00:25:45 ◼   ► twenty three hundred dollars this was [TS]

00:25:48 ◼   ► back when the Mac pros were incredibly [TS]

00:25:50 ◼   ► cheap for what you got yeah exactly yeah [TS]

00:25:52 ◼   ► even with inflation your coming out I [TS]

00:25:53 ◼   ► think pretty far ahead with that and so [TS]

00:25:55 ◼   ► the Mac Pro to me like you do pay a lot [TS]

00:25:58 ◼   ► for it but they last pretty much [TS]

00:26:01 ◼   ► indefinitely like they like the it will [TS]

00:26:03 ◼   ► last as long as you need them to last [TS]

00:26:04 ◼   ► and if something does go wrong with them [TS]

00:26:06 ◼   ► you have a much better chance of being [TS]

00:26:08 ◼   ► able to practically and economically [TS]

00:26:10 ◼   ► service it yourself down the road when [TS]

00:26:11 ◼   ► it's out of warranty etc and so the [TS]

00:26:15 ◼   ► lifespan of a Mac Pro tends to be longer [TS]

00:26:17 ◼   ► than the lifespan if not and I'm not I'm [TS]

00:26:19 ◼   ► not considering the cylinder ones I'm [TS]

00:26:20 ◼   ► what I'm saying yeah that's what I'm [TS]

00:26:22 ◼   ► saying you're thinking of the old Mac [TS]

00:26:23 ◼   ► Pros that's like that's last that's last [TS]

00:26:25 ◼   ► decade thinking like okay so that was [TS]

00:26:27 ◼   ► the case but the most recent Mac Pro [TS]

00:26:29 ◼   ► Apple is made and none of those things [TS]

00:26:31 ◼   ► are true about it was unreliable from [TS]

00:26:33 ◼   ► the start it wasn't easy to repair [TS]

00:26:34 ◼   ► yourself and people aren't using them [TS]

00:26:36 ◼   ► well for 10 years so I think you kind of [TS]

00:26:38 ◼   ► have to take a wait-and-see [TS]

00:26:39 ◼   ► that maybe you won't have a choice of [TS]

00:26:41 ◼   ► something that is big reliable easy to [TS]

00:26:45 ◼   ► repair right maybe like maybe that won't [TS]

00:26:46 ◼   ► be one of your options your options said [TS]

00:26:48 ◼   ► will be you know a faster [TS]

00:26:50 ◼   ► hopefully quieter and more powerful [TS]

00:26:53 ◼   ► separate screen thing but that it's just [TS]

00:26:55 ◼   ► unreliable as you know as any of the [TS]

00:26:59 ◼   ► more recent Apple hardware is and just [TS]

00:27:01 ◼   ► as weird and flaky and the first [TS]

00:27:02 ◼   ► generation has strange problems and all [TS]

00:27:04 ◼   ► that stuff I'm not trying to be [TS]

00:27:06 ◼   ► pessimistic but like we're all we're all [TS]

00:27:08 ◼   ► kind of thinking like oh the new Mac [TS]

00:27:10 ◼   ► Pro's will be like the old ones in the [TS]

00:27:12 ◼   ► cylinder was an aberration I think [TS]

00:27:13 ◼   ► that's still an open question yeah [TS]

00:27:15 ◼   ► you're totally right it is and and you [TS]

00:27:18 ◼   ► know I think the cylinder has taught [TS]

00:27:20 ◼   ► them some lessons I would not expect a [TS]

00:27:22 ◼   ► return to a giant tower but I would [TS]

00:27:24 ◼   ► accept I would hope that it's maybe kind [TS]

00:27:26 ◼   ► of something in the middle there like [TS]

00:27:27 ◼   ► something between a shield of cylinder [TS]

00:27:29 ◼   ► that you can do nothing to and some kind [TS]

00:27:31 ◼   ► of interchangeable parts you know thing [TS]

00:27:33 ◼   ► maybe whether it's a tower or not you [TS]

00:27:35 ◼   ► know perhaps a magnesium cube yeah right [TS]

00:27:37 ◼   ► and so I not sure I want to commit to [TS]

00:27:40 ◼   ► and I'm right now if the Mac Pro was [TS]

00:27:42 ◼   ► totally dead and they said you know okay [TS]

00:27:44 ◼   ► we're launching the iMac Pro the Mac Pro [TS]

00:27:46 ◼   ► is is discontinued we're never gonna [TS]

00:27:47 ◼   ► make one again we're just doing the Mac [TS]

00:27:49 ◼   ► Pro then this decision was easy of [TS]

00:27:51 ◼   ► course I would buy one but because there [TS]

00:27:53 ◼   ► is a Mac Pro allegedly coming I want to [TS]

00:27:56 ◼   ► wait to see what that is first before I [TS]

00:27:59 ◼   ► decide because if it's closer to what I [TS]

00:28:01 ◼   ► want in having things separate and you [TS]

00:28:04 ◼   ► know maybe having even crazier [TS]

00:28:06 ◼   ► you know CPU options and stuff like that [TS]

00:28:07 ◼   ► who knows if it's more what I want I [TS]

00:28:10 ◼   ► would choose that the other thing I'm [TS]

00:28:11 ◼   ► worried about with the iMac Pro is [TS]

00:28:13 ◼   ► thermals this is a completely new [TS]

00:28:16 ◼   ► thermal design that basically they are [TS]

00:28:19 ◼   ► they are wedging much much higher hotter [TS]

00:28:24 ◼   ► higher wattage hotter running parts [TS]

00:28:26 ◼   ► inside of an enclosure that they didn't [TS]

00:28:30 ◼   ► design the size for like they took the [TS]

00:28:35 ◼   ► size of the other iMac and it seemed [TS]

00:28:37 ◼   ► that they basically had as a design goal [TS]

00:28:38 ◼   ► fit these higher-end hotter parts inside [TS]

00:28:42 ◼   ► of this case that we designed for this [TS]

00:28:43 ◼   ► other computer and while they seem to [TS]

00:28:45 ◼   ► have done a lot of work about the [TS]

00:28:47 ◼   ► internal design of it and dealing with [TS]

00:28:49 ◼   ► the internal arrangement to those [TS]

00:28:50 ◼   ► thermals and everything the fact that [TS]

00:28:52 ◼   ► they didn't design the X [TS]

00:28:53 ◼   ► criminal case for it that they basically [TS]

00:28:55 ◼   ► said you know wedge this into that that [TS]

00:28:59 ◼   ► well it's probably gonna have [TS]

00:29:00 ◼   ► limitations and side effects that I [TS]

00:29:02 ◼   ► don't like so maybe things were gonna [TS]

00:29:04 ◼   ► overheat and and you know be bad over [TS]

00:29:07 ◼   ► time that's another problem [TS]

00:29:08 ◼   ► I have with my iMac is that the GPU fan [TS]

00:29:10 ◼   ► is now or the GPU now runs too hot and [TS]

00:29:12 ◼   ► the fan goes up constantly and it's [TS]

00:29:14 ◼   ► audible of my recordings which is the [TS]

00:29:15 ◼   ► most one of the reasons I've finally got [TS]

00:29:17 ◼   ► it fixed because I can't have that and [TS]

00:29:20 ◼   ► you know maybe that's because these [TS]

00:29:23 ◼   ► parts in that in that case like I got [TS]

00:29:26 ◼   ► top-of-the-line parts when it was out so [TS]

00:29:28 ◼   ► these are you know running pretty hot [TS]

00:29:29 ◼   ► over three years and eventually that [TS]

00:29:30 ◼   ► starts to have problems with cooling I [TS]

00:29:33 ◼   ► fear whether the iMac pro will have [TS]

00:29:35 ◼   ► those problems or not because you're [TS]

00:29:37 ◼   ► taking these hot parts and putting them [TS]

00:29:38 ◼   ► into a case that is designed to be thin [TS]

00:29:40 ◼   ► for some reason even though nobody cares [TS]

00:29:42 ◼   ► about how thick their desktop display is [TS]

00:29:44 ◼   ► on the back but it's designed to be thin [TS]

00:29:46 ◼   ► rather than being designed to hold Pro [TS]

00:29:48 ◼   ► components the Mac Pro towers on the [TS]

00:29:51 ◼   ► other hand with the exception of the [TS]

00:29:52 ◼   ► cylinder of course although even that [TS]

00:29:54 ◼   ► the cylinder did have a really clever [TS]

00:29:55 ◼   ► cooling design that was really good as [TS]

00:29:57 ◼   ► long as you didn't use the GPUs but the [TS]

00:30:01 ◼   ► the Mac Pro towers were always like [TS]

00:30:03 ◼   ► we're gonna design a complete enclosure [TS]

00:30:07 ◼   ► a complete shape around being able to [TS]

00:30:11 ◼   ► hold and cool the entire range of [TS]

00:30:15 ◼   ► high-end pro parts that we're gonna sell [TS]

00:30:17 ◼   ► for this thing so I think it was always [TS]

00:30:20 ◼   ► more likely that there would be fewer [TS]

00:30:21 ◼   ► problems with thermals and things like [TS]

00:30:24 ◼   ► that with the Mac Pro towers then with [TS]

00:30:27 ◼   ► the IMAX so I'm again like with the iMac [TS]

00:30:31 ◼   ► Pro like I we still don't know how loud [TS]

00:30:34 ◼   ► is it going to be like are the fans [TS]

00:30:35 ◼   ► gonna spin up constantly and be audible [TS]

00:30:37 ◼   ► or not because the Mac pros are the same [TS]

00:30:40 ◼   ► noise level regardless of what they're [TS]

00:30:41 ◼   ► doing pretty much so like a Mac Pro you [TS]

00:30:44 ◼   ► know you don't really hear it and iMac [TS]

00:30:46 ◼   ► you hear it if you push it and that's [TS]

00:30:48 ◼   ► kind of ungraceful and I kind of suggest [TS]

00:30:50 ◼   ► thermals that don't have a lot of [TS]

00:30:51 ◼   ► headroom and everything else now there [TS]

00:30:52 ◼   ► was talk there was a weird Geekbench [TS]

00:30:55 ◼   ► result that may or may not be real we [TS]

00:30:58 ◼   ► don't really know people are believing [TS]

00:30:59 ◼   ► that it might be real that might be the [TS]

00:31:01 ◼   ► new iMac pro CPUs and they were they [TS]

00:31:06 ◼   ► were reporting that they were basically [TS]

00:31:07 ◼   ► an altar [TS]

00:31:07 ◼   ► version of the workstation class like [TS]

00:31:10 ◼   ► those eons typically the the highest [TS]

00:31:13 ◼   ► performance eons for desktops they end [TS]

00:31:15 ◼   ► in W for workstation at the end of their [TS]

00:31:17 ◼   ► model number and this usually means the [TS]

00:31:20 ◼   ► absolute highest clock speed for that [TS]

00:31:22 ◼   ► core account that is available because [TS]

00:31:24 ◼   ► it's going to burn lots of power so it's [TS]

00:31:25 ◼   ► not quite great for like big server [TS]

00:31:27 ◼   ► racks but it's gonna burn lots of power [TS]

00:31:29 ◼   ► but it's gonna be really really fast for [TS]

00:31:31 ◼   ► a desktop and it's gonna need a huge fan [TS]

00:31:32 ◼   ► so those parts usually end in W the ones [TS]

00:31:35 ◼   ► and Geekbench ended in W B or just be I [TS]

00:31:37 ◼   ► think anyway and they seem to be running [TS]

00:31:40 ◼   ► at lower clock speeds than what we did [TS]

00:31:42 ◼   ► what we'd expect still good still really [TS]

00:31:44 ◼   ► fast but it looks like they might be [TS]

00:31:47 ◼   ► having to use lower wattage chips in [TS]

00:31:49 ◼   ► these iMacs then what a full xeon [TS]

00:31:51 ◼   ► workstation chip would be in like a [TS]

00:31:53 ◼   ► tower and that's most likely for thermal [TS]

00:31:56 ◼   ► roots but those are 140 watt chips [TS]

00:31:57 ◼   ► hundred and 50 watt chips usually an [TS]

00:31:59 ◼   ► iMac chassis is usually designed to hold [TS]

00:32:02 ◼   ► like I think like a 60 or 80 watt chip [TS]

00:32:03 ◼   ► and yet again they have redesigned the [TS]

00:32:06 ◼   ► internals of this to be to offer more [TS]

00:32:08 ◼   ► cooling to fit higher wattage parts but [TS]

00:32:10 ◼   ► they also needs to leave room for the [TS]

00:32:11 ◼   ► GPU and so like there's basically I we [TS]

00:32:16 ◼   ► still don't know what the trade-offs are [TS]

00:32:19 ◼   ► to get workstation grade components into [TS]

00:32:22 ◼   ► an iMac pro into the same case size and [TS]

00:32:25 ◼   ► I'm guessing the trade-offs are going to [TS]

00:32:28 ◼   ► be related to fan noise under load and a [TS]

00:32:31 ◼   ► possible heat sealing that might limit [TS]

00:32:34 ◼   ► the range of performance they can get [TS]

00:32:36 ◼   ► out of those processors whereas the [TS]

00:32:38 ◼   ► full-blown Mac Pro that I hope will come [TS]

00:32:41 ◼   ► out sometime next year [TS]

00:32:42 ◼   ► that shouldn't have those limitations [TS]

00:32:44 ◼   ► that should be able to use full wattage [TS]

00:32:46 ◼   ► parts that should have a cooling system [TS]

00:32:48 ◼   ► that has lots of headroom and that can [TS]

00:32:50 ◼   ► cool quietly under load I don't know if [TS]

00:32:52 ◼   ► it will but it should and because the [TS]

00:32:54 ◼   ► previous ones did all of them even [TS]

00:32:55 ◼   ► though 2013 had that so I hope the Mac [TS]

00:32:59 ◼   ► Pro offers those things and if it does [TS]

00:33:01 ◼   ► that's the computer I want to buy not [TS]

00:33:03 ◼   ► the iMac Pro but because neither of [TS]

00:33:06 ◼   ► these computers are out yet there's [TS]

00:33:07 ◼   ► probably gonna be other factors that go [TS]

00:33:09 ◼   ► into it so if possible I will I hope [TS]

00:33:12 ◼   ► that my imac coming back from repair who [TS]

00:33:16 ◼   ► can last me until the Mac Pro comes out [TS]

00:33:19 ◼   ► so I can then decide then [TS]

00:33:21 ◼   ► there's no way you will see that [TS]

00:33:24 ◼   ► hot-looking new iMac Pro and say no [TS]

00:33:26 ◼   ► thank you all wait respond sir this week [TS]

00:33:30 ◼   ► by hover go to hover comm slash ATP to [TS]

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00:33:35 ◼   ► purchase and the month of October dot [TS]

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00:33:40 ◼   ► building your online brand has never [TS]

00:33:42 ◼   ► been more important show the world who [TS]

00:33:44 ◼   ► you are and what you're passionate about [TS]

00:33:46 ◼   ► without tying it to whatever publishing [TS]

00:33:48 ◼   ► platform or social network is popular [TS]

00:33:50 ◼   ► this year because that changes quickly [TS]

00:33:53 ◼   ► you know if you made your email address [TS]

00:33:55 ◼   ► or your website not that long ago it [TS]

00:33:58 ◼   ► would have been at Juno comm or at [TS]

00:34:00 ◼   ► Geocities comm that changes really fast [TS]

00:34:03 ◼   ► in this business the best thing you can [TS]

00:34:05 ◼   ► do to keep your email address and your [TS]

00:34:07 ◼   ► website timeless and future proof is to [TS]

00:34:09 ◼   ► host them at your own domain name and [TS]

00:34:11 ◼   ► hover is the best place to find buy and [TS]

00:34:14 ◼   ► manage domains there's no tricks no [TS]

00:34:16 ◼   ► shady upsells no scamming add-ons and [TS]

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00:34:21 ◼   ► it's very simple and easy to use and [TS]

00:34:22 ◼   ► they have amazing support and hover has [TS]

00:34:26 ◼   ► over 400 domain extensions to choose [TS]

00:34:28 ◼   ► from to help you bring herself online [TS]

00:34:29 ◼   ► there's lots of choices to help you find [TS]

00:34:31 ◼   ► the perfect domain name so if you are a [TS]

00:34:33 ◼   ► designer or a creative professional you [TS]

00:34:36 ◼   ► can use dot design instead of ending it [TS]

00:34:38 ◼   ► with just calm or not beige or some of [TS]

00:34:40 ◼   ► it some other generic domain by using [TS]

00:34:42 ◼   ► dot design you tell the world exactly [TS]

00:34:44 ◼   ► what you do built right into the name [TS]

00:34:46 ◼   ► stand out and brand yourself online with [TS]

00:34:48 ◼   ► the perfect domain name for you or your [TS]

00:34:49 ◼   ► business and dot design domain names are [TS]

00:34:51 ◼   ► on sale for the entire month of October [TS]

00:34:54 ◼   ► at hover for just $5.99 that's 85 [TS]

00:34:57 ◼   ► percent off your first year and half the [TS]

00:34:59 ◼   ► price of a dot-com so to learn more [TS]

00:35:01 ◼   ► visit hover comm slash ATP you can get [TS]

00:35:04 ◼   ► 10% off your first purchase hover get a [TS]

00:35:07 ◼   ► domain name for your passion also [TS]

00:35:13 ◼   ► speaking of industrial design and [TS]

00:35:15 ◼   ► cooling in one of the many interviews [TS]

00:35:18 ◼   ► and books that never seems to happen if [TS]

00:35:19 ◼   ► I could get like Johnny I've and all [TS]

00:35:22 ◼   ► John Rubinstein and all the people [TS]

00:35:24 ◼   ► together and ask them about like past [TS]

00:35:27 ◼   ► apples lines I would love to know what [TS]

00:35:30 ◼   ► what changed between like the the [TS]

00:35:34 ◼   ► you know nowadays and back one Apple [TS]

00:35:37 ◼   ► maid then you know the cheese grater [TS]

00:35:39 ◼   ► because if you think about the cheese [TS]

00:35:40 ◼   ► beer and this is what I always hope that [TS]

00:35:41 ◼   ► the the new Mac Pro design will be but [TS]

00:35:43 ◼   ► who knows what it'll actually be the [TS]

00:35:45 ◼   ► cheese grater as you noted and as they [TS]

00:35:48 ◼   ► as Johnny Ivan his white world said I [TS]

00:35:50 ◼   ► think in the introduction for the [TS]

00:35:51 ◼   ► original cheese where that you know the [TS]

00:35:52 ◼   ► power mac g5 the design of it was not so [TS]

00:35:59 ◼   ► much like all the modern Johnny I've [TS]

00:36:01 ◼   ► they're not just running out for the [TS]

00:36:02 ◼   ► modern Apple designs like bye-bye Johnny [TS]

00:36:04 ◼   ► F design team where it's like we've [TS]

00:36:06 ◼   ► wanted to boil it down to its essence [TS]

00:36:07 ◼   ► and find you know uncomplicated simple [TS]

00:36:11 ◼   ► direct blah blah blah all the things [TS]

00:36:13 ◼   ► they do for things that are like phones [TS]

00:36:14 ◼   ► or portable things where they don't want [TS]

00:36:16 ◼   ► a lot of geegaws hanging off it whereas [TS]

00:36:18 ◼   ► the cheese grater was we wanted to be [TS]

00:36:22 ◼   ► honest about the fact that the main job [TS]

00:36:24 ◼   ► of this thing is to to be a heat [TS]

00:36:27 ◼   ► exchanger like it was modeled off of [TS]

00:36:29 ◼   ► heat exchangers or air exchangers like [TS]

00:36:31 ◼   ► that are up in rooms that suck in air [TS]

00:36:33 ◼   ► and one with temperature on one side and [TS]

00:36:34 ◼   ► ejected out the other side a different [TS]

00:36:36 ◼   ► temperature I think somebody said like [TS]

00:36:37 ◼   ► that the actual cheese grater was [TS]

00:36:39 ◼   ► modeled off a heat exchanger right and [TS]

00:36:41 ◼   ► so it wasn't designed to be the most [TS]

00:36:43 ◼   ► sort of well you know it was designed to [TS]

00:36:47 ◼   ► be true to its purpose but its purpose [TS]

00:36:51 ◼   ► wasn't to be a beautiful object right [TS]

00:36:54 ◼   ► its purpose wasn't to be portable and [TS]

00:36:57 ◼   ► uncomplicated and you know simple and [TS]

00:37:00 ◼   ► obvious its purpose was to exchange heat [TS]

00:37:03 ◼   ► like that was the purpose and so it was [TS]

00:37:06 ◼   ► designed with that as a goal and it [TS]

00:37:09 ◼   ► seems like so many things that Apple [TS]

00:37:11 ◼   ► makes nowadays are designed with a with [TS]

00:37:14 ◼   ► a simplicity of form as a goal which is [TS]

00:37:16 ◼   ► a fine goal especially for portable [TS]

00:37:18 ◼   ► things but as you said nobody really [TS]

00:37:20 ◼   ► cares that much about the simplicity of [TS]

00:37:22 ◼   ► form like if a more honest I Mac Pro on [TS]

00:37:26 ◼   ► the back of it would have looked like [TS]

00:37:28 ◼   ► the back of a transformer like it would [TS]

00:37:30 ◼   ► look like a giant heatsink it would have [TS]

00:37:32 ◼   ► had bulges and flares and fins or what [TS]

00:37:34 ◼   ► it looked like the underside of like a [TS]

00:37:36 ◼   ► Ferrari like all sorts of ground effects [TS]

00:37:38 ◼   ► and like a diffuser like it would say [TS]

00:37:41 ◼   ► the back of this computer is all about [TS]

00:37:43 ◼   ► ejecting heat because honestly speaking [TS]

00:37:45 ◼   ► what is the purpose of this computer [TS]

00:37:47 ◼   ► it's the iMac [TS]

00:37:48 ◼   ► it's not the iMac that's simple and [TS]

00:37:49 ◼   ► elegant just looks like a screen and you [TS]

00:37:51 ◼   ► say where is the computer no this is the [TS]

00:37:53 ◼   ► iMac Pro its job is to be the fastest [TS]

00:37:56 ◼   ► possible all-in-one computer that human [TS]

00:37:59 ◼   ► beings can make and the main problem of [TS]

00:38:01 ◼   ► a fast all-in-one computer is getting [TS]

00:38:03 ◼   ► rid of the damn heat so the back of it [TS]

00:38:05 ◼   ► looks crazy and just as big and chunky [TS]

00:38:07 ◼   ► and as you know coming out the wazoo and [TS]

00:38:10 ◼   ► that's what the cheese grater is it was [TS]

00:38:12 ◼   ► a big giant thing cold air and front hot [TS]

00:38:14 ◼   ► air out back gigantic fans nine fans [TS]

00:38:17 ◼   ► Steve Jobs was raving or however many [TS]

00:38:18 ◼   ► the original on hand look at all these [TS]

00:38:20 ◼   ► fans they're all computer-controlled to [TS]

00:38:22 ◼   ► be just the right amount of cooling at [TS]

00:38:23 ◼   ► the right so then I'll run full blast [TS]

00:38:24 ◼   ► all the time you know there is an [TS]

00:38:26 ◼   ► elegance to it but it is so [TS]

00:38:28 ◼   ► purpose-built to let you house all that [TS]

00:38:30 ◼   ► hot stuff and get it cooled so I hope [TS]

00:38:34 ◼   ► the Mac Pro is not like the trash camera [TS]

00:38:36 ◼   ► it's like what is the essence or a form [TS]

00:38:38 ◼   ► of the Mac probably like I want it to be [TS]

00:38:41 ◼   ► functional and the function is heat [TS]

00:38:44 ◼   ► exchange and things whose function is [TS]

00:38:46 ◼   ► heat exchange don't look like lozenges [TS]

00:38:48 ◼   ► bars of soap or simple elegant design I [TS]

00:38:52 ◼   ► mean in many respects the chimney Mac [TS]

00:38:54 ◼   ► Pro the trashcan Mac Pro does have a [TS]

00:38:56 ◼   ► purity of purpose cold air and bottom [TS]

00:38:59 ◼   ► hot air out top just like the g4 cube [TS]

00:39:00 ◼   ► right but it was not designed to be like [TS]

00:39:03 ◼   ► how much heat can we get rid of because [TS]

00:39:06 ◼   ► they just had you know the two GPUs [TS]

00:39:08 ◼   ► there in the CPU and they couldn't even [TS]

00:39:10 ◼   ► cool them well enough like so it was a [TS]

00:39:11 ◼   ► clever design for its size but it was [TS]

00:39:13 ◼   ► very very small if you want to build [TS]

00:39:15 ◼   ► something with a massive heat exchange [TS]

00:39:16 ◼   ► and capacity you make it bigger you want [TS]

00:39:18 ◼   ► to have excess capacity not be right on [TS]

00:39:20 ◼   ► the borderline [TS]

00:39:21 ◼   ► so anyway getting back to what I said I [TS]

00:39:23 ◼   ► would ask them like it's like the same [TS]

00:39:25 ◼   ► people who were there Johnny I've made [TS]

00:39:27 ◼   ► the cheese grater but now he's making [TS]

00:39:29 ◼   ► all these beautiful featureless things [TS]

00:39:30 ◼   ► with no ports on them [TS]

00:39:31 ◼   ► what changed surely it wasn't Steve Jobs [TS]

00:39:34 ◼   ► saying please make me something that [TS]

00:39:35 ◼   ► looks like the underside of a Ferrari [TS]

00:39:37 ◼   ► right so someone there was like okay was [TS]

00:39:40 ◼   ► like in the design brief the main job of [TS]

00:39:43 ◼   ► the thing that you are making is to be [TS]

00:39:45 ◼   ► an efficient heat exchanger do that in [TS]

00:39:47 ◼   ► the most elegant way that you can and I [TS]

00:39:49 ◼   ► don't imagine Steve Jobs was forcing [TS]

00:39:51 ◼   ► Johnny I have to do that Steve Jobs [TS]

00:39:52 ◼   ► probably wanted it to be like the [TS]

00:39:53 ◼   ► trashcan like he doesn't like all the [TS]

00:39:55 ◼   ► big you know bins and and you know holes [TS]

00:39:58 ◼   ► all over the front and back and giant [TS]

00:39:59 ◼   ► fans and stuff he just accepts that as a [TS]

00:40:01 ◼   ► cost to do [TS]

00:40:01 ◼   ► business but they did the best job they [TS]

00:40:02 ◼   ► could with it but it's like the same [TS]

00:40:04 ◼   ► people are there but the philosophy has [TS]

00:40:07 ◼   ► changed and Apple has stopped making [TS]

00:40:09 ◼   ► computers like that whose purpose is not [TS]

00:40:12 ◼   ► to be simple obvious white Apple pencil [TS]

00:40:15 ◼   ► with no things on it and just this pew [TS]

00:40:17 ◼   ► who you know beautiful perfect form so [TS]

00:40:20 ◼   ► anyway when Johnny comes on the show ask [TS]

00:40:22 ◼   ► him about it and see like has he changed [TS]

00:40:24 ◼   ► his mind has his philosophy evolved was [TS]

00:40:28 ◼   ► there someone forcing him to make those [TS]

00:40:30 ◼   ► older computers the way they were was [TS]

00:40:32 ◼   ► someone forcing him to put all those [TS]

00:40:33 ◼   ► ports on the side of his laptops like I [TS]

00:40:35 ◼   ► don't know so many questions Johnny come [TS]

00:40:37 ◼   ► on the show will talk yeah that's gonna [TS]

00:40:39 ◼   ► have it no I mean I totally agree and I [TS]

00:40:42 ◼   ► wish Apple you know like you know Apple [TS]

00:40:45 ◼   ► is you know famously you know talked [TS]

00:40:47 ◼   ► about courage to remove the headphone [TS]

00:40:49 ◼   ► jack and you know that an Apple is a [TS]

00:40:51 ◼   ► very considered a very bold company for [TS]

00:40:53 ◼   ► that the courageous designs they make [TS]

00:40:55 ◼   ► what they lack it seems like in the in [TS]

00:40:59 ◼   ► the in the hardware designs of the [TS]

00:41:01 ◼   ► computers is not courage but confidence [TS]

00:41:04 ◼   ► they need the confidence to know that [TS]

00:41:09 ◼   ► they can make something that sacrifices [TS]

00:41:12 ◼   ► visual symmetry for functionality that [TS]

00:41:15 ◼   ► doesn't take courage it takes confidence [TS]

00:41:18 ◼   ► because you have to be able to to know [TS]

00:41:20 ◼   ► in your head that even if the press says [TS]

00:41:22 ◼   ► oh you know it got thicker or wow that [TS]

00:41:26 ◼   ► iMac it looks pretty thick from the back [TS]

00:41:28 ◼   ► or whatever like Apple has to be [TS]

00:41:30 ◼   ► confident enough to be able to say we we [TS]

00:41:34 ◼   ► believe in our design because it is [TS]

00:41:36 ◼   ► better that way even though you're [TS]

00:41:38 ◼   ► saying it doesn't look as good or [TS]

00:41:39 ◼   ► whatever we know that it works better [TS]

00:41:42 ◼   ► and it seems like they don't have that [TS]

00:41:44 ◼   ► confidence anymore or it's not being you [TS]

00:41:47 ◼   ► know properly enforced somewhere on the [TS]

00:41:49 ◼   ► way or something because a great [TS]

00:41:51 ◼   ► computer nothing about its physical form [TS]

00:41:54 ◼   ► should unnecessarily detract from how [TS]

00:41:58 ◼   ► great of a computer it can be and there [TS]

00:42:01 ◼   ► are certain models in the lineup where [TS]

00:42:02 ◼   ► you'd make a different choice you know [TS]

00:42:04 ◼   ► so things like the 12-inch MacBook where [TS]

00:42:06 ◼   ► the whole role of this computer is what [TS]

00:42:09 ◼   ► is the absolute smallest thinnest [TS]

00:42:10 ◼   ► lightest computer we can make and have [TS]

00:42:12 ◼   ► it still be remotely usable so then you [TS]

00:42:14 ◼   ► make different trade-offs [TS]

00:42:15 ◼   ► but as you go up the line as you get [TS]

00:42:17 ◼   ► more and more to the larger and higher [TS]

00:42:19 ◼   ► end and pro machines and especially once [TS]

00:42:21 ◼   ► you get into things like desktops which [TS]

00:42:23 ◼   ► are kind of pro by nature and have very [TS]

00:42:25 ◼   ► different you know physical demands [TS]

00:42:27 ◼   ► around them in very different usage [TS]

00:42:28 ◼   ► around them the decision always has to [TS]

00:42:31 ◼   ► be made the other way of yeah you know [TS]

00:42:33 ◼   ► what you can make it beautiful have the [TS]

00:42:35 ◼   ► confidence to know that you could make a [TS]

00:42:36 ◼   ► beautiful design while still letting it [TS]

00:42:39 ◼   ► function well as the computer that it [TS]

00:42:41 ◼   ► has to be and it seems like Apple [TS]

00:42:44 ◼   ► doesn't have that confidence anymore or [TS]

00:42:45 ◼   ► at least or they don't have that ability [TS]

00:42:47 ◼   ► anymore which is even more concerning I [TS]

00:42:50 ◼   ► understand your point I deeply disagree [TS]

00:42:53 ◼   ► and I think they're showing external [TS]

00:42:55 ◼   ► confidence by doing things like going [TS]

00:42:57 ◼   ► all-in on USB see right because USB see [TS]

00:43:01 ◼   ► was not it did not have a terribly great [TS]

00:43:04 ◼   ► story when the MacBook and the MacBook [TS]

00:43:06 ◼   ► Pros went all-in on USB see and it's [TS]

00:43:09 ◼   ► gotten better but as you recently wrote [TS]

00:43:11 ◼   ► about the story isn't that great now I [TS]

00:43:14 ◼   ► know that's exactly I was gonna say it's [TS]

00:43:16 ◼   ► gotten better but without question there [TS]

00:43:19 ◼   ► is a long way to go and I thought your [TS]

00:43:21 ◼   ► posts touched on that really well or I [TS]

00:43:23 ◼   ► shouldn't say touched on it handled it [TS]

00:43:24 ◼   ► really well so I think they're showing [TS]

00:43:28 ◼   ► external confidence but with a few [TS]

00:43:31 ◼   ► tweaks I think what I would say is it's [TS]

00:43:34 ◼   ► the internal confidence that they lack [TS]

00:43:36 ◼   ► it's the internal confidence for some [TS]

00:43:38 ◼   ► designer or whomever to go to Johnny and [TS]

00:43:42 ◼   ► say you know what maybe we should make [TS]

00:43:44 ◼   ► this a little thicker or you know what [TS]

00:43:46 ◼   ► and maybe more than one port on the [TS]

00:43:49 ◼   ► MacBook adorable would be useful or you [TS]

00:43:51 ◼   ► know what maybe MagSafe wasn't so bad [TS]

00:43:55 ◼   ► and I think the problem is internal [TS]

00:43:57 ◼   ► courage to stand up to whoever's calling [TS]

00:44:00 ◼   ► the shots on why it is these things are [TS]

00:44:04 ◼   ► as it appears to us very crippled like [TS]

00:44:08 ◼   ► they're great machines I love my macbook [TS]

00:44:10 ◼   ► adorable I really do but damned if it [TS]

00:44:13 ◼   ► wouldn't be great if I had one more port [TS]

00:44:14 ◼   ► on it you know or damned if it wouldn't [TS]

00:44:15 ◼   ► be great if I had MagSafe on it cuz just [TS]

00:44:18 ◼   ► yesterday I think it was I ripped it off [TS]

00:44:21 ◼   ► my nightstand it was charging on my god [TS]

00:44:23 ◼   ► I caught the cable with my foot and it [TS]

00:44:26 ◼   ► came flying off my nightstand it's fine [TS]

00:44:28 ◼   ► thankfully [TS]

00:44:29 ◼   ► but did it land in a pool of water and [TS]

00:44:31 ◼   ► no it did not land in a pool of water [TS]

00:44:32 ◼   ► thank goodness the water beds are not [TS]

00:44:35 ◼   ► trendy so we were safe there God can you [TS]

00:44:37 ◼   ► imagine me with a water bed that'd be [TS]

00:44:38 ◼   ► terrible they still have their fans in [TS]

00:44:40 ◼   ► any case the point I'm driving at is I [TS]

00:44:43 ◼   ► think it's the internal confidence it's [TS]

00:44:44 ◼   ► a problem that nobody's standing up to [TS]

00:44:46 ◼   ► Johnny or the the mythical version of [TS]

00:44:48 ◼   ► Johnny who know you even know it's [TS]

00:44:50 ◼   ► really Johnny anymore but the mythical [TS]

00:44:52 ◼   ► Johnny who is saying no this MacBook [TS]

00:44:54 ◼   ► adorable will have only one port no [TS]

00:44:56 ◼   ► these butterfly switches are the only [TS]

00:44:58 ◼   ► way to go you know whoever is making [TS]

00:45:01 ◼   ► those decisions be that an individual or [TS]

00:45:02 ◼   ► or a committee I think it's that lack of [TS]

00:45:05 ◼   ► internal confidence to say to them no [TS]

00:45:07 ◼   ► this isn't right [TS]

00:45:09 ◼   ► this isn't good enough they we do need [TS]

00:45:12 ◼   ► one more port on the adorable we do need [TS]

00:45:14 ◼   ► better keyboard switches or whatever the [TS]

00:45:17 ◼   ► case may be you know I think that's [TS]

00:45:18 ◼   ► where it's lacking like I said it's like [TS]

00:45:21 ◼   ► it's like what is the design brief what [TS]

00:45:23 ◼   ► is the goal here and I think you know [TS]

00:45:25 ◼   ► and the Philon I and philosophy and the [TS]

00:45:27 ◼   ► goal for a lot of portal devices is very [TS]

00:45:28 ◼   ► often don't have so much crap on it [TS]

00:45:31 ◼   ► don't have a million buttons don't have [TS]

00:45:33 ◼   ► a million ports it's easier to [TS]

00:45:34 ◼   ► waterproof it's simpler it should look [TS]

00:45:36 ◼   ► simple and obvious having the front be [TS]

00:45:38 ◼   ► all screen is a natural evolution of not [TS]

00:45:41 ◼   ► having a hardware keyboard one I just [TS]

00:45:42 ◼   ► have a screen and what a single button [TS]

00:45:44 ◼   ► on the front leave that kind of element [TS]

00:45:45 ◼   ► bill simplicity is very appropriate for [TS]

00:45:48 ◼   ► a certain class of devices that Apple [TS]

00:45:49 ◼   ► happens to sell love because you don't [TS]

00:45:51 ◼   ► want a phone with the million things [TS]

00:45:53 ◼   ► sticking out of it for most consumers [TS]

00:45:55 ◼   ► it's supposed to be a thing that fits in [TS]

00:45:57 ◼   ► your pocket and even laptops you can see [TS]

00:45:58 ◼   ► an argument for their laptop they're [TS]

00:46:00 ◼   ► simpler when there's less stuff when [TS]

00:46:02 ◼   ► there's fewer moving parts fewer seems [TS]

00:46:04 ◼   ► like you know just compare the original [TS]

00:46:07 ◼   ► aluminum you know PowerBook g4 to [TS]

00:46:10 ◼   ► occurring unibody one the design goals [TS]

00:46:13 ◼   ► and evolution of that trying to say [TS]

00:46:15 ◼   ► simplify simplify simplify a better [TS]

00:46:18 ◼   ► portable computer because it flexes less [TS]

00:46:19 ◼   ► because it's you know it has fewer seams [TS]

00:46:22 ◼   ► it has fewer things to go wrong on it [TS]

00:46:25 ◼   ► even the hinge is more robust and [TS]

00:46:27 ◼   ► everything about it is simpler and then [TS]

00:46:29 ◼   ► that extending to start taking ports off [TS]

00:46:31 ◼   ► now you start to get into you know I'm [TS]

00:46:32 ◼   ► not quite sure about that but you can [TS]

00:46:34 ◼   ► see kind of an argument for the [TS]

00:46:35 ◼   ► simplicity but where this goes awry is [TS]

00:46:38 ◼   ► on things like the iMac Pro it's [TS]

00:46:40 ◼   ► certainly the Mac [TS]

00:46:42 ◼   ► the story has to be different your goal [TS]

00:46:44 ◼   ► has to be different you can't take that [TS]

00:46:46 ◼   ► same design philosophy that works for [TS]

00:46:48 ◼   ► phones and tablets and possibly also [TS]

00:46:50 ◼   ► laptops especially the small ones and [TS]

00:46:53 ◼   ► say this same design philosophy should [TS]

00:46:55 ◼   ► apply to our professional modular [TS]

00:46:57 ◼   ► computer because that's not what it's [TS]

00:47:00 ◼   ► supposed to do as Marco said [TS]

00:47:02 ◼   ► professionals don't care what the hell [TS]

00:47:04 ◼   ► the back of their desk under desk [TS]

00:47:06 ◼   ► mounted computer does like it is [TS]

00:47:09 ◼   ► supposed to fulfill a job and its job is [TS]

00:47:12 ◼   ► to be really fast and capable and being [TS]

00:47:16 ◼   ► really fast and capable means ejecting [TS]

00:47:18 ◼   ► heat and having a lot of room inside and [TS]

00:47:20 ◼   ► being reliable and stuff and if that's [TS]

00:47:22 ◼   ► your goal like these are the most [TS]

00:47:25 ◼   ► important things it's got to be super [TS]

00:47:27 ◼   ► reliable and just chunky and very [TS]

00:47:31 ◼   ► powerful and like the maximum amount of [TS]

00:47:33 ◼   ► power and flexibility you design a [TS]

00:47:35 ◼   ► different thing I started thinking of [TS]

00:47:37 ◼   ► things like power tools or off-road [TS]

00:47:41 ◼   ► vehicles not like cars that you buy but [TS]

00:47:43 ◼   ► like actual like you know getting around [TS]

00:47:45 ◼   ► on the farm or going through the jungle [TS]

00:47:47 ◼   ► or whatever those things they can be [TS]

00:47:49 ◼   ► elegant and have nice designs but they [TS]

00:47:51 ◼   ► have a job to do and their design is [TS]

00:47:53 ◼   ► entirely focused around that job no one [TS]

00:47:56 ◼   ► is trying to say can we get huge ground [TS]

00:47:59 ◼   ► clearance and offer a vehicle but not [TS]

00:48:02 ◼   ► have like a big gap between the wheels [TS]

00:48:05 ◼   ► and the wheel well I can cover that over [TS]

00:48:07 ◼   ► with something I could we could make it [TS]

00:48:10 ◼   ► so that like that we have like a skirt [TS]

00:48:12 ◼   ► that when the wheels compressed the [TS]

00:48:13 ◼   ► skirt moves up so it looks more elegant [TS]

00:48:14 ◼   ► like what are you even doing are you [TS]

00:48:16 ◼   ► trying to make this car look like a [TS]

00:48:18 ◼   ► low-slung you know Tesla like the whole [TS]

00:48:22 ◼   ► point is supposed to go offer us like [TS]

00:48:23 ◼   ► yeah but it's so ugly when you can see [TS]

00:48:24 ◼   ► all the suspension bits and you can see [TS]

00:48:26 ◼   ► all this air under the car I don't that [TS]

00:48:28 ◼   ► skirt idea we can make the skirt work [TS]

00:48:29 ◼   ► it's like no don't try to make the skirt [TS]

00:48:31 ◼   ► work like just put huge amounts of [TS]

00:48:34 ◼   ► travel and big exposed springs and [TS]

00:48:36 ◼   ► shocks and don't worry about the skirt [TS]

00:48:38 ◼   ► don't worry about like the big gap [TS]

00:48:40 ◼   ► that's that's what it's supposed to do [TS]

00:48:42 ◼   ► just make the best off-road vehicle you [TS]

00:48:43 ◼   ► can make that's what I want them to do [TS]

00:48:46 ◼   ► with the Mac Pro and the iMac it's like [TS]

00:48:48 ◼   ► it has to be just as slim as the regular [TS]

00:48:51 ◼   ► iMac why why would you make it just as [TS]

00:48:53 ◼   ► slim as the regular yeah [TS]

00:48:54 ◼   ► maybe you can we're also smart with our [TS]

00:48:55 ◼   ► cooling worth like you already have the [TS]

00:48:57 ◼   ► iMac the iMac is oh I don't even know [TS]

00:48:59 ◼   ► where the computer is it's so skinny and [TS]

00:49:00 ◼   ► we got rid of the the optical drives [TS]

00:49:02 ◼   ► whoo you make it beer a thinner in the [TS]

00:49:03 ◼   ► edge it looks beautifully and that does [TS]

00:49:05 ◼   ► and I think an all-in-one computer that [TS]

00:49:06 ◼   ► is very thin and elegant and has [TS]

00:49:07 ◼   ► beautiful screen is a product they [TS]

00:49:09 ◼   ► should make and they do it's a 5k iMac [TS]

00:49:10 ◼   ► it's great when they go to make the iPad [TS]

00:49:12 ◼   ► pro wise like design brief hasn't [TS]

00:49:14 ◼   ► changed yeah it's supposed to be like [TS]

00:49:16 ◼   ► the fastest computer you could buy [TS]

00:49:17 ◼   ► especially remember as I pointed out [TS]

00:49:18 ◼   ► before they weren't gonna make the Mac [TS]

00:49:20 ◼   ► Pro the iMac pro was gonna be their [TS]

00:49:22 ◼   ► top-of-the-line and still they said it's [TS]

00:49:24 ◼   ► got to fit in the same case and that [TS]

00:49:25 ◼   ► that's what's wrong like they have the [TS]

00:49:28 ◼   ► wrong goal even before they begin [TS]

00:49:29 ◼   ► executing and I don't I don't know where [TS]

00:49:32 ◼   ► that comes from I don't know why that [TS]

00:49:34 ◼   ► philosophy is extended maybe it's they [TS]

00:49:35 ◼   ► just think all technology should be like [TS]

00:49:36 ◼   ► that but they didn't always think like [TS]

00:49:38 ◼   ► this and the cheese grater Mac Pro is [TS]

00:49:39 ◼   ► the the perfect proof Johnny I've made [TS]

00:49:42 ◼   ► that computer and talked about it his [TS]

00:49:44 ◼   ► team made that thing and it is perhaps [TS]

00:49:46 ◼   ► the most brutally utilitarian thing that [TS]

00:49:49 ◼   ► Apple has ever made it's a big silver [TS]

00:49:51 ◼   ► heat exchanger with freaking handles on [TS]

00:49:53 ◼   ► it with a huge amount of space in it [TS]

00:49:54 ◼   ► that's what I want [TS]

00:49:56 ◼   ► come on I mean that that exact design [TS]

00:49:57 ◼   ► but I want that philosophy executed well [TS]

00:50:00 ◼   ► yeah and the thing is like that like [TS]

00:50:03 ◼   ► that giant metal tower full of fans and [TS]

00:50:07 ◼   ► everything and ports in the back and [TS]

00:50:08 ◼   ► huge air holes in the front and back [TS]

00:50:10 ◼   ► that thing is beautiful that is the [TS]

00:50:14 ◼   ► nicest PC tower ever I've ever seen bar [TS]

00:50:17 ◼   ► none it's not even close and for people [TS]

00:50:20 ◼   ► who love computers and who need high-end [TS]

00:50:23 ◼   ► pro computers that is beautiful you [TS]

00:50:26 ◼   ► don't have to make it ugly people who [TS]

00:50:29 ◼   ► look at that and say that's ugly [TS]

00:50:31 ◼   ► are people who hate computers it seems [TS]

00:50:35 ◼   ► like the people who were responsible for [TS]

00:50:37 ◼   ► designing computers at Apple hate [TS]

00:50:39 ◼   ► computers and I don't say this lightly [TS]

00:50:41 ◼   ► what I mean to say here is literally [TS]

00:50:44 ◼   ► that it seems like the computers at [TS]

00:50:46 ◼   ► Apple are designed with the goal of [TS]

00:50:49 ◼   ► hiding and getting rid of as much of the [TS]

00:50:50 ◼   ► computer as possible and there is a [TS]

00:50:53 ◼   ► place for that again there's a place for [TS]

00:50:54 ◼   ► that in like the ultra-thin unlight the [TS]

00:50:57 ◼   ► MacBook you know 12-inch and everything [TS]

00:50:59 ◼   ► and even maybe the heirs although we're [TS]

00:51:01 ◼   ► going backwards in that direction as [TS]

00:51:02 ◼   ► well in the air range but at the [TS]

00:51:06 ◼   ► high-end you are selling to people who [TS]

00:51:09 ◼   ► need computers and in many cases who [TS]

00:51:12 ◼   ► love computers and those people don't [TS]

00:51:16 ◼   ► want you to hide everything away [TS]

00:51:18 ◼   ► especially when it comes at the cost of [TS]

00:51:21 ◼   ► practicality and functionality those [TS]

00:51:23 ◼   ► people are happy to see the computer we [TS]

00:51:27 ◼   ► are happy to have ports and air holes [TS]

00:51:30 ◼   ► and a little bit more thickness in order [TS]

00:51:33 ◼   ► to get like a better keyboard or better [TS]

00:51:35 ◼   ► battery life or something else like that [TS]

00:51:37 ◼   ► market isn't trying to get rid of the [TS]

00:51:40 ◼   ► computer they're buying a computer they [TS]

00:51:43 ◼   ► like computers and the pros want to see [TS]

00:51:47 ◼   ► like the pros want a pro piece of gear [TS]

00:51:49 ◼   ► the people who buy the giant off-road [TS]

00:51:52 ◼   ► vehicles are not looking at them and [TS]

00:51:54 ◼   ► saying man this thing's so ugly it's a [TS]

00:51:57 ◼   ► shame no one can make these things [TS]

00:51:58 ◼   ► prettier no they love the way they look [TS]

00:52:00 ◼   ► they buy them because of the way they [TS]

00:52:02 ◼   ► look partially and their functionality [TS]

00:52:03 ◼   ► as well some people just for the looks [TS]

00:52:05 ◼   ► but you know like so to make up to make [TS]

00:52:07 ◼   ► a hunk and MacPro tower that's full of [TS]

00:52:10 ◼   ► high high powered the the best [TS]

00:52:13 ◼   ► components they can make you know cooled [TS]

00:52:15 ◼   ► with giant slow fan so they can be [TS]

00:52:17 ◼   ► really efficient and really quiet even [TS]

00:52:19 ◼   ► under a load that is beautiful and that [TS]

00:52:22 ◼   ► is good design for a high end pro [TS]

00:52:24 ◼   ► computer what they seem to be doing now [TS]

00:52:26 ◼   ► instead is applying the wrong design [TS]

00:52:30 ◼   ► principles to it like you know what John [TS]

00:52:32 ◼   ► said like what these tools are here to [TS]

00:52:34 ◼   ► do they're applying the same principles [TS]

00:52:37 ◼   ► as they're applying to the ultra thin 12 [TS]

00:52:39 ◼   ► inch ultra portable that's not good [TS]

00:52:41 ◼   ► design design is how it works a famous [TS]

00:52:45 ◼   ► guy said that once like design is taking [TS]

00:52:49 ◼   ► the requirements that that people have [TS]

00:52:51 ◼   ► who were going to use this thing and [TS]

00:52:52 ◼   ► making something that works well with [TS]

00:52:56 ◼   ► those requirements and also hopefully [TS]

00:52:58 ◼   ► looks decent in the process but its [TS]

00:53:00 ◼   ► design is about those requirements and [TS]

00:53:02 ◼   ► and how you literally you know design in [TS]

00:53:04 ◼   ► the the work to accommodate those so [TS]

00:53:07 ◼   ► what they're doing when they make like a [TS]

00:53:10 ◼   ► pro computer that has massive practical [TS]

00:53:14 ◼   ► problems when used professionally or [TS]

00:53:15 ◼   ► when used by anybody that's actually bad [TS]

00:53:18 ◼   ► design [TS]

00:53:19 ◼   ► no matter how it looks and so they [TS]

00:53:22 ◼   ► really need I think to shift this [TS]

00:53:24 ◼   ► thinking and I hope they have with the [TS]

00:53:26 ◼   ► Mac Pro they really need to shift this [TS]

00:53:28 ◼   ► thinking back into it is okay to make a [TS]

00:53:32 ◼   ► computer that looks like a computer [TS]

00:53:34 ◼   ► there is nothing wrong with having a [TS]

00:53:38 ◼   ► high-end Pro desktop that's probably [TS]

00:53:41 ◼   ► gonna cost like eight thousand dollars [TS]

00:53:42 ◼   ► to have that be a little bit bulky and [TS]

00:53:45 ◼   ► to have that you know go into your desk [TS]

00:53:47 ◼   ► and to have that look like a square with [TS]

00:53:50 ◼   ► ports in the back and fans in the back [TS]

00:53:51 ◼   ► like that's fine that's actually what [TS]

00:53:55 ◼   ► people want and to those people if that [TS]

00:53:58 ◼   ► is designed well it will be beautiful no [TS]

00:54:01 ◼   ► matter how it looks they could have a [TS]

00:54:04 ◼   ► design like a Star Trek spaceship like [TS]

00:54:06 ◼   ► it can be cool but it has to be [TS]

00:54:09 ◼   ► fulfilling his job and his job is to [TS]

00:54:11 ◼   ► eject heed and hold lots of things and [TS]

00:54:12 ◼   ► be super fast and it's just you end up [TS]

00:54:14 ◼   ► with the different shape you end up with [TS]

00:54:15 ◼   ► the different everything about it [TS]

00:54:17 ◼   ► there's lots of options available lots [TS]

00:54:19 ◼   ► of things I'm imagining where it's [TS]

00:54:21 ◼   ► fuzzier I think and I was thinking about [TS]

00:54:22 ◼   ► this when I was sitting looking at the [TS]

00:54:24 ◼   ► bunch of laptops around the table at [TS]

00:54:26 ◼   ► work a lot of people work now have the [TS]

00:54:28 ◼   ► same thing I have a 2017 MacBook Pro [TS]

00:54:30 ◼   ► with its four little USB see slash [TS]

00:54:33 ◼   ► Thunderbolt three ports all around the [TS]

00:54:35 ◼   ► sides of it but then other people still [TS]

00:54:37 ◼   ► have the 2015 ones like an earlier right [TS]

00:54:40 ◼   ► and honestly when they're all sitting [TS]

00:54:42 ◼   ► around the table like that other than [TS]

00:54:43 ◼   ► the fact that the new ones are Space [TS]

00:54:44 ◼   ► Gray for the most part they don't look [TS]

00:54:46 ◼   ► that different like the you can tell [TS]

00:54:48 ◼   ► that the new ones are thinner and the [TS]

00:54:49 ◼   ► screens are a nicer right but the [TS]

00:54:52 ◼   ► elements don't look that bad but I look [TS]

00:54:54 ◼   ► at the sides of the other ones and like [TS]

00:54:56 ◼   ► they don't look that much thicker but [TS]

00:54:57 ◼   ► then I see SD card HDMI port MagSafe USB [TS]

00:55:03 ◼   ► a like and I and I think again we talked [TS]

00:55:06 ◼   ► about this when they did the am a [TS]

00:55:07 ◼   ► crowned table and I was like but they [TS]

00:55:09 ◼   ► said didn't they say something about [TS]

00:55:11 ◼   ► maybe they'll be reconsidering their [TS]

00:55:14 ◼   ► choices with the MacBook Pros and coming [TS]

00:55:16 ◼   ► out with new ones that appeal to people [TS]

00:55:18 ◼   ► more and I kept thinking like that maybe [TS]

00:55:21 ◼   ► in the future they would reconsider [TS]

00:55:24 ◼   ► their decisions and like put an SD card [TS]

00:55:25 ◼   ► slot on it or like just make different [TS]

00:55:27 ◼   ► decisions about ports and stuff like [TS]

00:55:29 ◼   ► that sort of [TS]

00:55:30 ◼   ► back pedal on the you know relentless [TS]

00:55:34 ◼   ► simplification on their biggest laptop [TS]

00:55:38 ◼   ► I'm not expecting them to make a [TS]

00:55:39 ◼   ► keyboard that's not the same size as the [TS]

00:55:41 ◼   ► small ones you know I'm not going crazy [TS]

00:55:42 ◼   ► yeah but I'm just saying like the the [TS]

00:55:45 ◼   ► utility of like I think a lot of people [TS]

00:55:47 ◼   ► are jealous at work of the people come [TS]

00:55:48 ◼   ► in with the old laptops and just plug [TS]

00:55:50 ◼   ► their thing right into the projector [TS]

00:55:51 ◼   ► with no dongles right or that you know [TS]

00:55:56 ◼   ► Matt you know MagSafe of ripping the [TS]

00:55:59 ◼   ► thing in and out of they get up from [TS]

00:56:00 ◼   ► their desks and then maybe they're also [TS]

00:56:02 ◼   ► jealous of me with my single wire [TS]

00:56:04 ◼   ► connecting with all the other stuff so [TS]

00:56:05 ◼   ► this advantages Thunderball as well but [TS]

00:56:07 ◼   ► like I think of it this way if they came [TS]

00:56:10 ◼   ► out with the new MacBook Pro that had an [TS]

00:56:13 ◼   ► SD card in HDMI on it a lot of people [TS]

00:56:16 ◼   ► would love it and I'm trying to think [TS]

00:56:21 ◼   ► who would hate it the people like I [TS]

00:56:23 ◼   ► don't want that additional complexity I [TS]

00:56:24 ◼   ► never use HDMI would they hate it would [TS]

00:56:26 ◼   ► they just be like oh whatever I don't [TS]

00:56:28 ◼   ► care I don't use those ports like who [TS]

00:56:31 ◼   ► would really hate it other than saying [TS]

00:56:32 ◼   ► you've just mucked up my perfect clean [TS]

00:56:34 ◼   ► symmetrical design but I don't think [TS]

00:56:36 ◼   ► people who buy them care that much about [TS]

00:56:38 ◼   ► it and the people who would love it boy [TS]

00:56:40 ◼   ► would they love it so the in this new [TS]

00:56:42 ◼   ► Mac Renaissance of where we all believe [TS]

00:56:44 ◼   ► apples turn the corner on the Mac and [TS]

00:56:46 ◼   ► it's paying more attention to it and [TS]

00:56:47 ◼   ► it's gonna make a Mac Pro and they're [TS]

00:56:48 ◼   ► making the iMac Pro and they're doing [TS]

00:56:50 ◼   ► all these things I'm waiting to see how [TS]

00:56:52 ◼   ► far does the Mac Renaissance go we know [TS]

00:56:54 ◼   ► it goes far enough that there are they [TS]

00:56:56 ◼   ► revive the line of computer that they [TS]

00:56:57 ◼   ► weren't going to do so that's great I [TS]

00:56:58 ◼   ► love it like and that gives me hope for [TS]

00:57:00 ◼   ► everything else but the real test may be [TS]

00:57:02 ◼   ► what happens to the 15-inch do they go [TS]

00:57:07 ◼   ► more utilitarian in any way do any ports [TS]

00:57:12 ◼   ► come back duh is there any recognition [TS]

00:57:14 ◼   ► that some decisions made with the [TS]

00:57:18 ◼   ► current line of computers may not be [TS]

00:57:19 ◼   ► exact even if it's the keyboard which is [TS]

00:57:21 ◼   ► a topic of conversation this week which [TS]

00:57:22 ◼   ► may or may not to get to in the show do [TS]

00:57:24 ◼   ► they change their thinking on the [TS]

00:57:27 ◼   ► keyboard and say we need to take another [TS]

00:57:29 ◼   ► run at this in a big way even if the new [TS]

00:57:32 ◼   ► keyboard is just as thin as the old one [TS]

00:57:33 ◼   ► to just have a different philosophy of [TS]

00:57:35 ◼   ► saying like you know we need we need to [TS]

00:57:39 ◼   ► rethink this like how much are they [TS]

00:57:41 ◼   ► willing to reconsider on the models the [TS]

00:57:44 ◼   ► are you know are not the the I was gonna [TS]

00:57:47 ◼   ► say they're not the very very top end [TS]

00:57:49 ◼   ► but the 15 inches they're topping yeah [TS]

00:57:50 ◼   ► right how much are they willing to to [TS]

00:57:53 ◼   ► reconsider and I'm still maintaining [TS]

00:57:55 ◼   ► fantasies that they're going to be [TS]

00:57:56 ◼   ► willing to reconsider a lot that the new [TS]

00:57:59 ◼   ► Mac Pro will will be the the giant [TS]

00:58:02 ◼   ► purpose-built heat exchanger that I was [TS]

00:58:03 ◼   ► describing that you know the iMac Pro [TS]

00:58:06 ◼   ► really will be amazingly fast and [TS]

00:58:08 ◼   ► competent even if it is in the same case [TS]

00:58:10 ◼   ► and that the new line of laptops like [TS]

00:58:12 ◼   ► that we'll see we'll see that they're [TS]

00:58:13 ◼   ► learning from their mistakes and they [TS]

00:58:14 ◼   ► make different decisions about it and [TS]

00:58:16 ◼   ► they can make a big deal out of it like [TS]

00:58:17 ◼   ► we heard you we know you don't want as [TS]

00:58:20 ◼   ► many dongles so now there's HDMI and an [TS]

00:58:22 ◼   ► SD card or whatever whatever they decide [TS]

00:58:24 ◼   ► like that would be a huge applause line [TS]

00:58:27 ◼   ► tons of people would love it it would [TS]

00:58:29 ◼   ► make the computers more popular some [TS]

00:58:32 ◼   ► people be disappointed that it's not as [TS]

00:58:34 ◼   ► simple but how many how many who don't [TS]

00:58:36 ◼   ► work in the sealed off frosted glass [TS]

00:58:38 ◼   ► area with Johnny I would actually be [TS]

00:58:39 ◼   ► disappointed by those computers yeah so [TS]

00:58:42 ◼   ► Jenny I've come come in the show we're [TS]

00:58:44 ◼   ► waiting for you we respond to this week [TS]

00:58:47 ◼   ► by betterment rethink what your money [TS]

00:58:49 ◼   ► can do visit betterment comm slash ATP [TS]

00:58:52 ◼   ► for more information betterment is a [TS]

00:58:54 ◼   ► largest independent online financial [TS]

00:58:56 ◼   ► advisor designed to help improve [TS]

00:58:58 ◼   ► customers long-term returns and lower [TS]

00:59:00 ◼   ► taxes for retirement planning a building [TS]

00:59:02 ◼   ► wealth and your other financial goals [TS]

00:59:04 ◼   ► betterment takes advanced investment [TS]

00:59:06 ◼   ► strategies and uses technology to [TS]

00:59:08 ◼   ► deliver them to more than two hundred [TS]

00:59:09 ◼   ► and seventy thousand customers [TS]

00:59:11 ◼   ► betterment experts have your back they [TS]

00:59:14 ◼   ► believe you should be able to get [TS]