343: The Stand Is Your Hand


00:00:00   Unfortunately, my bell is broken.

00:00:03   Here, I'll show you.

00:00:04   - Is that an euphemism?

00:00:05   - I wish.

00:00:05   No, so,

00:00:06   (laughing)

00:00:07   so,

00:00:08   (bell ringing)

00:00:09   this is just hitting the top,

00:00:10   and you can see it's kinda rattly.

00:00:11   (bell ringing)

00:00:13   I can loosen it a little bit.

00:00:14   (bell ringing)

00:00:16   See, it gets all rattly, like,

00:00:17   I took it apart earlier to try to figure it out,

00:00:19   but I think the transport to and from the beach

00:00:23   is finally what killed it after,

00:00:25   I mean, I've,

00:00:26   I got this bell in,

00:00:28   jeez, I mean, when was the file system ding in the keynote?

00:00:31   - Oh, I know, forever ago,

00:00:33   I mean, this show has been going for effectively forever,

00:00:35   it's a miracle we haven't been kicked off the internet.

00:00:37   - It was in San Francisco, which is how we know.

00:00:38   Hey, John, we're live.

00:00:40   - Skype is not my friend.

00:00:41   (laughing)

00:00:43   So, are you recording?

00:00:45   'Cause we are.

00:00:45   (laughing)

00:00:46   Yeah, I think I have everything sorted out, I don't know.

00:00:50   - Oh, that's not ominous at all.

00:00:51   - Oh, great.

00:00:52   Do I sound okay?

00:00:54   Yeah, you sound, I mean, from here, yeah.

00:00:56   I don't know, whatever.

00:00:57   (electronic beeping)

00:00:59   Okay, so this is one of the most popular/important,

00:01:04   question mark, shows of the year,

00:01:05   because we're going to recap the Apple event

00:01:08   that happened yesterday as we record,

00:01:10   but this is also one of the most important shows of the year

00:01:14   because even though ATP is not officially part of Relay FM,

00:01:18   we are basically part of Relay FM,

00:01:20   and because of that,

00:01:21   we are jumping on the Relay FM bandwagon for St. Jude.

00:01:25   So, September is Childhood Cancer Awareness Month,

00:01:29   and our dear friend, Steven Hackett,

00:01:31   who is one of the co-founders of Relay FM,

00:01:33   his eldest son has battled childhood cancer

00:01:38   for his entire young life,

00:01:39   and thankfully for their entire family,

00:01:42   they live in Memphis, Tennessee,

00:01:43   which is where St. Jude is.

00:01:45   And St. Jude is a children's research hospital

00:01:49   that has helped push

00:01:51   the overall childhood cancer survival rate

00:01:52   from 20% to more than 80% in 50 years.

00:01:56   And the thing is that they don't charge the families

00:02:00   that see them a dime,

00:02:02   and that often includes flying the families to Memphis,

00:02:06   and not in a FedEx box, mind you.

00:02:07   They actually put them in a regular plane

00:02:09   and fly them to Memphis to get treatment in some cases.

00:02:13   It is incredible the things that St. Jude does,

00:02:17   and it does it by just depending on donations

00:02:21   from people like the three of us,

00:02:24   and like you, our beloved listeners.

00:02:26   So, Relay has decided that last year,

00:02:30   what was the goal, like 50 grand, I think,

00:02:32   or something like that that they tried to raise in September?

00:02:34   It was something along those lines.

00:02:35   And this year, Relay is pushing for $75,000

00:02:39   raised in the month of September.

00:02:42   As we record this, they are $75 shy of $60,000.

00:02:47   So, I expect by the end of this recording,

00:02:50   I would like to see that $60,000 number hit, please,

00:02:53   those of us who are listening live.

00:02:54   That being said, they're trying to get $75,000.

00:02:58   If you listen to this entire program

00:03:00   and then drop $1,000 plus on a new iPhone,

00:03:04   you can send $10 to St. Jude, maybe 50, maybe 100,

00:03:08   maybe even another $1,000.

00:03:11   So, any amount will help.

00:03:13   And this is near and dear to all three of our hearts.

00:03:16   We really would appreciate it

00:03:18   if you could scrape together any amount of money

00:03:20   and please give it to St. Jude.

00:03:22   So, you can go to, and how fancy is this?

00:03:26   You can go to stjude.org/atp.

00:03:30   That's S-T-J-U-D-E.org/atp.

00:03:33   And we will get lumped in with the Relay money,

00:03:36   except we will, I guess, be somewhat special

00:03:38   because it's somehow attributed to us as well.

00:03:40   Who knows?

00:03:41   It's not a competition because all that matters

00:03:42   is we get these kids money, or the doctors, I should say.

00:03:45   So, anyways, stjude.org/atp.

00:03:48   Please, if you're buying a $1,000 plus iPhone,

00:03:50   I bet you can afford 10 bucks for childhood cancer.

00:03:55   Or perhaps if you're buying a $5 to $10 Starbucks coffee,

00:03:59   like Marco does every day,

00:04:00   I bet you could just skip the coffee one day

00:04:03   and go to stjude.org/atp.

00:04:06   - I'm gonna go even further.

00:04:07   I'm gonna say, and I think, first of all,

00:04:09   man, I was so mad when I heard John's pitch for this

00:04:14   on Rec. Diff. this past week.

00:04:15   - Oh, I haven't heard it.

00:04:16   I haven't heard it.

00:04:17   - It was so good, and I was so frustrated

00:04:19   that I didn't think of it,

00:04:20   and that he did it before we got a chance to.

00:04:23   But, as John loves, I will summarize him poorly.

00:04:26   (laughing)

00:04:28   The gist of it was basically,

00:04:32   it's hard to even imagine,

00:04:35   for those of us who have not been faced with

00:04:39   having one of our children have cancer.

00:04:41   That's a horrible thing to put a family and a child through.

00:04:45   And the amazing thing about St. Jude,

00:04:47   as you touched on a minute ago, Casey,

00:04:49   is that they treat children with cancer,

00:04:52   but they don't charge the families any money.

00:04:56   They pay for it with things like this.

00:04:58   And to have this horrible thing

00:05:01   that you have to deal with as a family,

00:05:03   to also have a financial burden on top of that

00:05:05   is horrendous.

00:05:07   It's the reality of our American medical system,

00:05:10   unfortunately, that you have to be faced

00:05:12   with massive financial ruin

00:05:14   in order to get your kid life-saving treatment,

00:05:17   but that's the reality we live in.

00:05:18   So to have something like St. Jude,

00:05:20   where you're fighting through this horrible time,

00:05:23   and they just take away this giant concern

00:05:26   that you would otherwise have to deal with,

00:05:28   that is such a big deal.

00:05:30   It's so life-changing, and so just merciful,

00:05:35   and graceful for the people who have to go through this.

00:05:37   It is incredibly meaningful.

00:05:38   And so, we are about to talk for two hours

00:05:40   about how amazing it is that these $1,000-plus products,

00:05:45   by the way, multiple $1,000-plus products

00:05:49   that we're in, are 20% better than they were last year,

00:05:53   and how we're all gonna upgrade to them.

00:05:55   Even though we don't need them, our phones work fine,

00:05:57   and we're gonna upgrade anyway.

00:05:58   And I have a feeling, based on our listenership,

00:06:00   a large portion of you out there are in a similar situation

00:06:03   where a large portion of you out there

00:06:06   are going to replace a phone or a watch

00:06:11   that doesn't really need to be replaced.

00:06:14   It still works, but the new shiny just came out,

00:06:17   and you're gonna go buy it.

00:06:18   And that's great, I'm one of you.

00:06:19   I'm gonna go buy it too.

00:06:21   But I'm gonna say, don't give them $10.

00:06:24   If you're one of these people who can afford

00:06:26   to replace a perfectly working phone

00:06:27   because the new one is shiny and better,

00:06:29   I honestly think, give them a minimum of $100.

00:06:33   You can do it.

00:06:34   If you're listening to this show,

00:06:35   you are disproportionately likely

00:06:37   to be one of these people.

00:06:38   And look, if you can't afford it, I understand, that's fine.

00:06:41   I understand completely.

00:06:41   But many of our listeners can, I know that.

00:06:45   And so if you can afford a new phone or a new watch

00:06:49   next week or whenever these things ship

00:06:50   or whenever you get your hands on them,

00:06:52   you can probably afford $100 to St. Jude.

00:06:54   So I'm gonna say throw in at least $100.

00:06:57   That's my command to our audience.

00:06:59   (laughing)

00:07:00   - Your command? - Yep.

00:07:01   - Very commandeering.

00:07:02   I thought Casey's pitch was much better than any of mine.

00:07:05   - I took two attempts to do it on Rectives.

00:07:07   I tried to do it one week and then the second week

00:07:08   I came back and tried to do it again.

00:07:10   But I think you two have covered well.

00:07:13   We'd like to see this number go up.

00:07:14   Please give generously.

00:07:16   - Indeed.

00:07:17   All right, with that out of the way,

00:07:19   I have a little bit of follow up with regard to SiriusXM,

00:07:22   which I know everyone--

00:07:22   - There's no follow up on Apple event shows.

00:07:24   What are you doing?

00:07:25   - No, come on, it's brief.

00:07:26   It'll be quick. - No, Casey.

00:07:27   John just said no follow up.

00:07:28   Don't touch it.

00:07:29   - We never do it on event shows.

00:07:30   - That's true.

00:07:31   All right, I'm walking away.

00:07:32   I'm walking away.

00:07:33   All right, we'll save for next week.

00:07:34   - So, Wyatt, what even made you think you were doing it?

00:07:35   You just leave it out there for next week.

00:07:37   - What was it so small? - You thinking, Casey?

00:07:38   Geez.

00:07:39   - It's so little.

00:07:40   - We've only been doing this show for seven years.

00:07:41   We don't do follow up on events.

00:07:42   - Oh my God, all right, fine.

00:07:44   I was gonna make the point.

00:07:45   - What was it about anyway?

00:07:46   I mean, look.

00:07:48   - It was funny.

00:07:49   It was funny.

00:07:49   That's why I wanted to do it.

00:07:51   - Too bad, can't do it.

00:07:52   Seven years.

00:07:53   - You're gonna have to wait.

00:07:54   You're gonna have to wait, listeners.

00:07:54   Let it be known.

00:07:55   This is gonna be a funny anecdote.

00:07:57   You're gonna have to wait a week.

00:07:58   Okay, so there was an Apple event, guys, and I think I liked

00:08:03   it, but I don't think I'm supposed to if you read

00:08:06   the New York Times.

00:08:07   - That article was terrible.

00:08:10   - I thought it was a pretty good event.

00:08:12   Like, yeah, the game demos stank, and I'd like to,

00:08:14   obviously, just get an overview real quick.

00:08:17   The game demos, whatever.

00:08:18   Not really for me.

00:08:20   I thought that the retail update being at the end was

00:08:22   a little weird, but ultimately probably for the best,

00:08:24   especially since it was quick.

00:08:26   The hardware seems real good.

00:08:28   Again, we'll dive into more detail in just a moment.

00:08:31   I have already spent hundreds of dollars on new Apple watches

00:08:35   for Aaron and myself because we're both rocking

00:08:37   Series 3 watches.

00:08:38   We both like our watches, but we are both ready

00:08:40   for new watches.

00:08:41   So we are already like almost $1,000 in the hole on watches,

00:08:46   and we haven't even bought phones yet.

00:08:49   So this is going to be a very expensive fall

00:08:50   for the Lis family.

00:08:52   We are also on iPhone 10s.

00:08:54   We did not get any new hardware last year because we were

00:08:57   good little boys and girls who had just quit their jobs.

00:08:59   So anyway, point is, I thought the event was pretty good.

00:09:02   I liked that it wasn't two plus hours.

00:09:06   It also makes me think that maybe some things were missed,

00:09:09   but you know, that's okay.

00:09:10   I thought it was mostly paced reasonably well,

00:09:14   and I thought it was pretty good, all told.

00:09:17   Marco, let's start with you.

00:09:19   Just overall, you know, macro level impressions.

00:09:23   I mean, I think, you know, there's things that I'm going

00:09:25   to nitpick, like the game demos.

00:09:27   We'll get to that in a few minutes, but ultimately,

00:09:31   I think the complainants and the press are being unreasonable

00:09:36   for the most part, and/or they are acting like aspects

00:09:41   of this are new when they're not new.

00:09:44   Apple did two major product revisions here,

00:09:47   you know, the iPhone and the watch, and the iPad was minor,

00:09:49   but you know, they did two major product revisions here.

00:09:52   The iPhone was about the same magnitude of update

00:09:57   that it usually is, not earth shattering, but good.

00:10:01   You know, there are some nice improvements,

00:10:03   nice iterative improvements, and you know,

00:10:05   things that we're all gonna want, so that's good.

00:10:09   And the watch, while it didn't have a ton of improvements,

00:10:13   had one really big one, so that's really good.

00:10:17   And that really big one was something that we didn't think

00:10:19   we would get for a long time, if ever.

00:10:21   I would say overall, like product-wise,

00:10:24   it was actually a pretty straight down the middle,

00:10:27   decent keynote.

00:10:28   I don't know what everyone's complaining about product-wise,

00:10:31   except that everyone's saying, oh, they should've done more,

00:10:33   or should've done more, these products are boring,

00:10:35   whatever, but you know what?

00:10:36   If you look at, you know, these are mature product categories

00:10:39   for the most part now, you don't get a ton

00:10:41   of like earth-shattering change anymore.

00:10:43   You get occasional earth-shattering stuff,

00:10:45   which people, by the way, promptly forget about,

00:10:48   and then expect it again the next time,

00:10:50   and every time after that.

00:10:51   But you know, this was, I think,

00:10:53   a solid down the middle event.

00:10:55   It was not great, it was not bad,

00:10:57   it was right down the middle, it was fine.

00:10:59   The problem, though, is that people expect like Santa Claus,

00:11:03   every event and every year, and that's just, you know,

00:11:06   it's not, every year is not gonna be

00:11:08   the original iPhone keynote.

00:11:09   Every year is not gonna be the original,

00:11:10   like some big innovative thing, although there might be

00:11:14   this weird AR thing later, but we'll see where that goes.

00:11:17   But on the other hand, I think where the complaints

00:11:19   are valid, the events really are pretty low

00:11:24   on personality and humanity.

00:11:26   You could, you know, you can see how incredibly scripted

00:11:31   and rehearsed and rigid they are.

00:11:33   They really feel more and more just like commercials

00:11:37   by boring people as the years go on.

00:11:42   And that is a, I think that is a totally valid criticism

00:11:45   of these events, they really do just feel like commercials,

00:11:48   and they're slow, and the formula is kind of stale,

00:11:53   and they are super painful at times when, you know,

00:11:57   when certain people maybe aren't the best presenters

00:11:59   and it's super awkward or you're sitting through

00:12:01   some boring demo, like, those are all valid complaints

00:12:05   that really make them feel like dull,

00:12:08   corporate event meetings.

00:12:10   And with one exception, which I'll get to in a moment,

00:12:12   this has really been happening for such a long time now

00:12:16   that I don't know why you would start

00:12:17   complaining about it now.

00:12:18   The events have been heading in this direction for years.

00:12:21   They've been for years going towards boring,

00:12:24   long, formulaic commercials by boring people on the stage.

00:12:29   Anybody who's criticizing that now,

00:12:31   like, you haven't been paying attention.

00:12:32   However, there is this one aspect,

00:12:34   it kind of makes me uneasy.

00:12:36   I don't know when this started.

00:12:38   I don't know if it's a difference in seating

00:12:42   or if it's a difference in how the audience is miked

00:12:45   and mixed with the audio, but in recent events,

00:12:50   Apple has been basically packing the seats

00:12:54   with retail employees.

00:12:56   I don't know how exactly it works,

00:12:58   but not everyone in these events is press.

00:13:02   There's a large number of retail employees

00:13:04   that get to sit in the audience.

00:13:06   Apple retail employees are trained and selected

00:13:10   for how much they cheer for everybody

00:13:13   and make everyone feel good when you're coming into the store

00:13:15   and all that stuff.

00:13:16   And the WBDC staff was also very much significantly

00:13:21   augmented by retail employees who themselves were, again,

00:13:23   like, selected for how much they would cheer for everyone.

00:13:26   And that's why they would cheer for you

00:13:28   walking down the stairs and cheer for you

00:13:29   going into sessions and everything.

00:13:30   And at the events, you have what seems like

00:13:34   similar selection of retail employees,

00:13:36   where they are just incredibly happy

00:13:40   and applauding hugely, outrageously strongly

00:13:45   at everything and everyone on stage.

00:13:48   And because they're retail employees, it's like,

00:13:50   well, it doesn't feel genuine.

00:13:53   It feels like there are plants in the audience.

00:13:54   And I know some of them really are genuinely excited,

00:13:56   I'm sure, but just because they are retail employees

00:13:58   and because they are cheering so loudly

00:14:01   and because they're cheering totally for their bosses

00:14:04   who were on stage, it feels disingenuous.

00:14:08   And that part of the way these audiences

00:14:12   and the way the sound is mixed and wherever they're sitting,

00:14:14   whatever it is, whatever is making this so prevalent,

00:14:16   it's kind of creepy to me.

00:14:18   It makes it seem like I'm at almost like a cult event.

00:14:22   And I know that's a tuck-she-word for Apple fans,

00:14:24   'cause people who aren't Apple fans

00:14:25   accuse us of being in a cult just by liking Apple stuff.

00:14:27   But it really does feel kind of like a cult event

00:14:29   when you have a large number of people

00:14:32   just screaming and yelling with massive applause

00:14:35   for things that maybe don't fully deserve

00:14:37   that level of enthusiasm.

00:14:39   And it just feels kind of fake and forced

00:14:42   and corporate and weird.

00:14:44   So I would hope that they can somehow adjust that balance,

00:14:48   turn that down a little bit,

00:14:50   rein that in a little bit, because that is strange to me.

00:14:53   It kind of sours the attitude of the event

00:14:57   because it seems fake.

00:15:00   And there's enough enthusiasm that's genuine

00:15:03   for Apple products, even among the press who are there,

00:15:06   there's enough enthusiasm,

00:15:07   they don't need to stack the audience.

00:15:09   They don't need to have people who are going to be

00:15:12   artificially seeming outrageously applauding over everything

00:15:16   just because it's their boss on stage.

00:15:19   They don't need that so much.

00:15:20   They need to turn that down.

00:15:21   Because let the product speak for themselves,

00:15:24   let the people speak for themselves, it's a bit much.

00:15:26   - John?

00:15:28   - I thought it was kind of above average

00:15:32   as far as these things go.

00:15:33   I agree that I don't see any particular change

00:15:36   from this one from the next one.

00:15:37   There's such a thing as fatigue and there's news cycles

00:15:39   and these things come and go and there's backlash

00:15:41   and there's backlash to the backlash

00:15:43   and there's all those sorts of things.

00:15:44   But based on the substance of the presentation,

00:15:46   both the substance and the presentation style,

00:15:49   there was nothing new in this.

00:15:50   They say things like this all the time.

00:15:52   They have product announcements like this all the time.

00:15:53   There was nothing particularly awful

00:15:55   about this presentation,

00:15:56   maybe nothing particularly sterling either,

00:15:58   but it was fine.

00:15:59   And as Marco pointed out,

00:16:01   I think the actual things that were announced,

00:16:03   we had one very surprising good thing

00:16:05   and everything else was okay and what we expected.

00:16:08   So I personally don't have any real issue with it.

00:16:11   As for the applauding and stuff, that's also not new.

00:16:14   I don't mind it because I think

00:16:16   if you don't intentionally have, not having plans,

00:16:20   if you don't have Apple employees in the audience

00:16:23   who you know are going to cheer,

00:16:24   it's not like they're being commanded to cheer.

00:16:26   You know they're going to cheer

00:16:27   because they're cheering for themselves

00:16:28   and their colleagues and yes, sometimes their bosses.

00:16:30   But if you don't have them there

00:16:33   and if it's a press event and an event

00:16:36   that doesn't have the public,

00:16:38   there will be substantially less applause.

00:16:40   Not because the press never applauds,

00:16:42   because some of them do,

00:16:43   but because they're all typing.

00:16:45   They're all doing things, they're preoccupied.

00:16:48   And if you have a presentation

00:16:49   where they announce something that is really good

00:16:52   but everyone in the audience is too busy to applaud,

00:16:54   it sounds bad.

00:16:55   Like they're putting on a show, okay?

00:16:57   And part of the show is the applause track

00:17:00   and the applause sign.

00:17:00   Like there's a real reason this is a thing in show business.

00:17:03   It's just something that needs to be there

00:17:05   so that people watching at home alone

00:17:08   feel like Apple is not bombing on stage.

00:17:10   So I understand the need to do it.

00:17:12   I do agree though that maybe it has been amped up

00:17:16   to a degree where they're applauding very loudly

00:17:20   for things that don't really warrant even any applause.

00:17:23   So they need to find a middle ground.

00:17:25   But again, that's not new either.

00:17:27   Go look at the last presentation

00:17:28   and the presentation before that.

00:17:30   Like for the past several years,

00:17:32   there has been substantial unwarranted applause

00:17:35   at many phases of the presentation.

00:17:37   And like, honestly, it doesn't bother me that much.

00:17:39   Like I think it's fine, I'm used to them.

00:17:41   I can understand why it would be off-putting

00:17:42   to somebody else, but all that said,

00:17:46   speaking of reconcilable differences,

00:17:47   the show I just recorded about that,

00:17:49   Merlin had, maybe Casey will know this expression,

00:17:53   Merlin had a feeling, Merlin felt a certain way.

00:17:56   Merlin felt a way.

00:17:56   What is that expression, Casey?

00:17:58   - I have no idea.

00:17:59   - You're my last hope

00:18:00   'cause you know all the weird kid expressions.

00:18:02   Anyway, I try to get on the show

00:18:05   and Merlin doesn't know either.

00:18:05   Merlin had some strong feelings

00:18:07   in reaction to the presentation

00:18:09   and we talked about them at length.

00:18:10   He was very emotional about them.

00:18:13   But I feel like that's the frame,

00:18:16   the proper frame for all this stuff.

00:18:17   It's like, look, if you watch this presentation

00:18:19   and feel bad about it in some way,

00:18:21   most of that is probably based on you

00:18:27   and not the presentation.

00:18:28   Like the presentations haven't changed.

00:18:30   Maybe something in you has changed.

00:18:32   Maybe your tastes have changed.

00:18:33   Maybe you have fatigue.

00:18:34   Maybe you think differently about it.

00:18:36   Maybe the place you're in that day

00:18:38   or the place you're in in your life makes it,

00:18:40   that's all perfectly valid.

00:18:42   I just feel like the takes that are written

00:18:45   in the opposite direction,

00:18:46   that somehow Apple is either A,

00:18:48   doing something terribly wrong

00:18:49   or B, doing something worse or different

00:18:52   than they did before, I don't see that.

00:18:54   I don't think what they're doing is terribly wrong.

00:18:56   I mean, maybe they're not putting on a great show,

00:18:58   but it's an okay show,

00:18:59   and I don't think it's particularly different.

00:19:01   So overall, I thought the event was fine.

00:19:03   I understand people having strong reactions to it,

00:19:06   positive or negative, and that's their reaction to have.

00:19:09   My reaction was fairly neutral, though.

00:19:11   - So you had all the feels?

00:19:13   Is that what you're looking for?

00:19:14   - No, I didn't.

00:19:15   I was like, you know.

00:19:16   - No, I'm saying the phrase, the phrasing.

00:19:18   The Joe Steele and Jelly. - No, I know that one.

00:19:19   It wasn't feels.

00:19:20   We couldn't, we tried,

00:19:21   and you'll hear it in a rec, this, if you listen.

00:19:22   We tried to figure it out, and we couldn't figure it out.

00:19:25   - No, Joe Steele and Jelly,

00:19:26   we're trying to pinch in and help, and I got,

00:19:29   I'm sure once I eventually hear it,

00:19:31   I'm gonna think myself an idiot for not thinking of it,

00:19:33   but that's okay.

00:19:34   Marco, tell me about game demos, because--

00:19:37   - That's not Marco's item, come on.

00:19:39   - Hold on, hold on.

00:19:40   I wanna hear the negative net version,

00:19:43   because I'm gonna agree with probably every word of it,

00:19:45   and then I'm hoping that you can give us, John,

00:19:47   the more optimistic--

00:19:48   - No, I wrote the negative thing that is at the top of,

00:19:50   all right, go ahead.

00:19:51   God.

00:19:52   (laughing)

00:19:53   - Sorry, John.

00:19:54   - For the record, listeners, what it reads in the show notes

00:19:57   is, quote, "Why Apple's game demos are bad," quote--

00:20:00   - I should've signed it, I guess.

00:20:01   I thought it was obvious that I wrote that.

00:20:03   (laughing)

00:20:06   Bye, John.

00:20:06   (laughing)

00:20:08   - With love, John C.

00:20:10   - Anyway.

00:20:13   I guess I'll take this, then.

00:20:16   - Feel free, Marco.

00:20:18   - I mean, the game demos, I mean, look,

00:20:21   again, we were all complaining about it.

00:20:22   I don't know why they led with the game demo.

00:20:25   I mean, I guess I know why,

00:20:25   'cause they wanted to push Apple Arcade,

00:20:28   but I have never seen a game demo

00:20:32   that was remotely engaging,

00:20:34   that I thought looked fun at all,

00:20:37   and that made me wanna go buy the game.

00:20:38   Not once.

00:20:40   The problem is, you have people on stage

00:20:44   who are not used to it, so they're nervous,

00:20:47   and they're demoing something which is incredibly risky,

00:20:50   and it does sometimes go wrong,

00:20:51   'cause that's just the nature of these things, right?

00:20:53   So they're super nervous.

00:20:54   Things could break at any moment,

00:20:56   and you could tell the whole thing

00:20:59   is super, super rehearsed and canned.

00:21:03   Every single line that people say is scripted.

00:21:06   They try to make it sound like it's not, but it is,

00:21:09   and so it just comes off sounding really fake and forced.

00:21:13   It just falls flat for me, and then the problem is,

00:21:16   you can't demo a game in this way,

00:21:20   in any kind of large corporate media event,

00:21:25   and make it look fun.

00:21:25   You just can't.

00:21:26   The games that people actually play on their phones

00:21:30   are the ones that either trick them into being fun,

00:21:35   or the ones that are actually fun,

00:21:36   and I don't see a lot of people ever playing the games

00:21:40   that get demoed on stage with these big, rich graphics

00:21:43   that you gotta sit there and play for hours.

00:21:46   That's not what I find fun on a phone,

00:21:50   and I don't think that's what most people

00:21:52   find fun on a phone.

00:21:53   What most people play on their phone

00:21:55   are different kinds of games.

00:21:56   They're more casual.

00:21:58   They're more in and out in a minute or less.

00:22:01   They're more things that don't have cutting-edge graphics.

00:22:05   It's a lot of games that are just basic 2D,

00:22:10   basic movement animations that can be easily cross-platform

00:22:14   and stuff like that.

00:22:15   It's not these big, 3D, cutting-edge games,

00:22:17   but also anybody can make games good graphics these days.

00:22:21   There's a billion games out there.

00:22:23   The App Store and Apple and the world at large

00:22:26   outside of Apple, there is no shortage of games.

00:22:29   What there is always demand for,

00:22:31   and seemingly a shortage of, is great games,

00:22:36   and these games usually aren't great games.

00:22:39   They're just mediocre, like, "Here, look at this graphic.

00:22:42   "Here's a dragon, woo!"

00:22:45   But yeah, is it fun?

00:22:46   There's no way to really demo, is it fun, on stage.

00:22:50   So you end up seeing, "Ooh, graphics, who cares?

00:22:53   "We're not here for the graphics of the games.

00:22:56   "No one is playing phone games for their graphics.

00:22:59   "Even the really good ones, I know they're up there

00:23:01   "trying to show off Metal and the GPUs and everything,

00:23:03   "but you know what, even the really good games,

00:23:04   "no one cares because no one plays phone or iPad games

00:23:07   "because they have amazing graphics."

00:23:09   People play these games because they're fun

00:23:11   and they're on the thing that's always with them.

00:23:12   So the demos are trying to sell us on things

00:23:17   we don't care about in a way that seems

00:23:20   super disingenuous and is very boring

00:23:23   and is never what we want the presentation

00:23:25   to grind to a halt to see.

00:23:26   And on top of that, the thing that's really important

00:23:30   about a game, which is whether it's fun or not,

00:23:32   is almost never apparent.

00:23:35   And I would say largely that all applies, for me,

00:23:41   that all applies to everything we've seen so far

00:23:44   about Apple Arcade.

00:23:46   In Apple Arcade, I know this is moving on slightly,

00:23:48   but Apple Arcade, to me, has the exact same problem so far,

00:23:52   which is, great, I can pay five bucks a month

00:23:55   for 100 games, that sounds awesome,

00:23:58   but I don't want 100 games, I want three great ones.

00:24:02   And I don't know if out of those 100 games,

00:24:04   if I'm gonna find three great ones, or what they are,

00:24:06   or how I would even find them.

00:24:07   So until it launches, and until people start talking about

00:24:11   a couple of games that are super good in it,

00:24:13   I have a hard time getting excited about it.

00:24:15   Because, you know what, I have a Nintendo Switch,

00:24:18   there's hundreds of games on that, too.

00:24:19   I already have a phone, there's millions of games, probably.

00:24:24   There's hundreds of thousands of games, at least,

00:24:26   on the App Store already.

00:24:28   Many of them are free or very low cost.

00:24:30   I could buy lots of them for $5 a month total.

00:24:33   I already have lots of them on the phone, I never play.

00:24:35   Because most of them aren't fun.

00:24:37   The App Store is full of simple, not very fun,

00:24:42   non-noteworthy games.

00:24:44   And there's a few gems, there's a few real standouts.

00:24:48   I don't care about Apple Arcade, unless and until

00:24:53   it has those few standouts for me.

00:24:54   Because I don't want 100 mediocre games

00:24:56   that make good two second demos.

00:24:58   I want those three great games that wouldn't be

00:25:02   otherwise available to me.

00:25:04   I want those, and so until we get those,

00:25:06   it's really hard to get excited about it.

00:25:09   - John, tell me why Apple's game demos are bad.

00:25:12   - Thank you, Casey, I think I will.

00:25:14   (laughing)

00:25:16   I differ a little bit on Marco, but not in the fact

00:25:19   that Apple's game demos are bad.

00:25:20   And this is, again, not a new thing.

00:25:22   Apple's been doing game demos forever.

00:25:24   They have been bad the whole time, they continue to be bad.

00:25:27   And people getting, maybe this is, again, fatigue,

00:25:30   it's just coming to a head, because we've seen so many

00:25:32   bad demos that in this particular one, people are getting

00:25:34   all up in arms, but you could have had this exact same

00:25:35   conversation for name the bad game demo.

00:25:38   I'm gonna set aside the Anki Drive thing,

00:25:40   because that was a physical real world thing,

00:25:42   so at least you got to see people on stage

00:25:43   with physical objects, sort of.

00:25:45   Anyway, this is like so many other things related

00:25:48   to Apple and games, where they seem not to be aware

00:25:52   that other people have figured this out.

00:25:54   So, games and showing on a big stage in front of an audience,

00:25:59   including lots of press, to try to show people games

00:26:02   in an enticing way, is something that happens

00:26:05   all the time successfully.

00:26:07   Not by Apple, but the rest of the gaming industry

00:26:09   does this all the time, and it's not a big mystery.

00:26:12   E3 happens every year, or PAX, or any of the other

00:26:16   gaming expos, TGS, right?

00:26:19   There are tons of places where this happens.

00:26:21   If Apple would just go to one of them and say,

00:26:23   "How did they do it?

00:26:24   "Their whole conference is about games,

00:26:26   "and the audience seems excited when they show games.

00:26:29   "How did they do that?"

00:26:30   'Cause it never happens for us.

00:26:31   We show games, and the audience is like,

00:26:32   "Eh," and then the Apple retail's cheering or whatever,

00:26:34   but what happens?

00:26:36   And I don't understand why they can't figure that out,

00:26:39   but there are a few fairly simple rules,

00:26:42   and there are things that are not in their favor.

00:26:44   First of all, show your games to an audience

00:26:46   that cares about games.

00:26:47   Now, I know it's hard when it's press,

00:26:49   'cause in theory, the press cares about

00:26:50   whatever you have to say, and if you're gonna be

00:26:51   talking about games, they care about games or whatever,

00:26:53   but all those things I just described

00:26:54   are gaming conferences.

00:26:55   You can be pretty sure that the people in the audience

00:26:57   there are interested in games, whether they be press,

00:26:59   or the general public, or whatever.

00:27:01   So you have to do that.

00:27:02   Second is, when you show someone a game,

00:27:04   when you're having a demo of a game,

00:27:06   it's very much like demos for movies or television shows,

00:27:10   which we'll get to in a little bit.

00:27:12   You have to show them something

00:27:15   that's going to entice them.

00:27:16   When it comes to games, there's a couple of broad categories

00:27:19   that you can do.

00:27:19   One, and these are the obvious ones,

00:27:21   if it's an IP that they already like,

00:27:24   if it's a franchise, if it's a sequel,

00:27:26   if everybody loved the first game in the series,

00:27:28   you're showing them the second game in the series,

00:27:30   they're primed to like that.

00:27:32   It's part of the reason why we're excited about the iPhone,

00:27:33   because we like the previous iPhone,

00:27:35   and we assume the next one's going to be good,

00:27:36   so we're all ready to see what's the next iPhone.

00:27:38   The second thing is, if you're going to have a product

00:27:44   from a creator that people don't,

00:27:45   I know it's weird, 'cause Apple's the only creator in here,

00:27:47   but like a game expo, or like at a gaming conference,

00:27:50   if there's a director or a publisher that you really like,

00:27:53   the latest game from Kojima, from Miyamoto, right?

00:27:58   People will be excited about that,

00:27:59   because it's the person making the game, or the company,

00:28:01   the next Bungie game, or whatever, right?

00:28:04   Again, Apple has no track record

00:28:06   of being a great publisher of games,

00:28:07   or a great contributor to games anyway,

00:28:10   except for that they run the store,

00:28:11   that has had some good games on it,

00:28:12   but not that many, proportionally, percentage-wise.

00:28:15   The next thing you can do is wow the audience

00:28:19   with something they've never seen before.

00:28:21   Yes, that includes amazing graphics,

00:28:23   or things that were not technically possible before.

00:28:25   What are the odds of Apple doing that on a phone platform?

00:28:27   Pretty slim.

00:28:28   I mean, Apple loves to say, look,

00:28:29   this is an amazing thing you can have on a phone.

00:28:31   Okay, maybe, sure, but you're like,

00:28:34   that's not how game demos work.

00:28:36   No one does a game demo and say,

00:28:37   isn't this the best looking game you've ever seen on the Wii?

00:28:40   It's like, yeah, this is the best looking game on the Wii,

00:28:42   but it's not impressive.

00:28:44   We're not impressed by this Wii game,

00:28:46   'cause overall you're not showing us

00:28:47   something we haven't seen before.

00:28:48   Every other console has better graphics than this,

00:28:50   or whatever, and in that same category is,

00:28:54   show a gameplay innovation that's never been seen before.

00:28:56   You've never seen a first-person shooter,

00:28:58   and all of a sudden, a first-person shooter comes along,

00:29:00   and you're like, wow, I've never seen a game

00:29:02   where it looks like you're actually looking through your eyes

00:29:04   and running down a hallway.

00:29:05   I've never seen anything like that before.

00:29:08   That will entice the audience to be interested

00:29:10   in what you have to show.

00:29:11   Some very interesting kind of gameplay,

00:29:13   or some kind of twist, and even those little games

00:29:15   that Marco was talking about, like casual games,

00:29:17   if you have a clever twist on those

00:29:18   that actually works as a pitch,

00:29:20   that's a place where Apple could show,

00:29:22   here's something you've never seen before.

00:29:23   Think back on all the game demos that you've seen Apple do.

00:29:26   Have they fallen into any of these categories?

00:29:28   An established IP, a franchise, a creator that you love,

00:29:31   incredibly impressive graphics and absolute values,

00:29:33   not just for a phone, gameplay innovations?

00:29:36   They strike out on all of these,

00:29:38   and they wonder why we show these games,

00:29:40   and no one is enticed by them,

00:29:41   and by the way, they're showing it to an audience

00:29:43   who is not necessarily primed to love games.

00:29:45   They're just blanks across the board.

00:29:47   They have no checks in any of those check boxes.

00:29:50   There's no way these game demos are going to be successful.

00:29:54   You need to wow people, you need to impress people,

00:29:57   you need to entice people, you need to grab people,

00:29:59   and they just don't do any of those things,

00:30:01   and if you go to E3, right,

00:30:03   and when they used to have the big three conferences,

00:30:06   everyone's excited to see what Nintendo's doing next,

00:30:08   'cause Nintendo is an established creator

00:30:10   that everyone knows Nintendo makes good games.

00:30:11   In particular, maybe they're looking for the next Zelda game

00:30:14   'cause they loved all the other Zelda games,

00:30:16   or maybe there's a new Miyamoto game

00:30:17   'cause they love Miyamoto, and they show the game,

00:30:19   or they show a new kind of gameplay

00:30:21   of a Super Mario Galaxy where you're on a planet,

00:30:22   and we've never seen a platformer like that before,

00:30:24   or an open world Zelda game which has never existed before,

00:30:27   or amazing new graphics on the PS7,

00:30:30   or Xbox 1280 or whatever, you know what I mean?

00:30:34   These are all tried and true ways

00:30:36   that you get audiences excited for games

00:30:37   that Apple never does a single one of them,

00:30:40   and I don't know what they're expecting.

00:30:41   It's like they expect a participation medal.

00:30:43   We have a game, and it's on our phone,

00:30:45   and it uses modern 3D graphics.

00:30:48   You can't tell if it's fun.

00:30:49   It's not an established franchise that you care about.

00:30:51   You're not a gaming audience.

00:30:52   It doesn't wow you with innovative gameplay or graphics,

00:30:55   but please applaud.

00:30:56   I mean, it's not the end of the world.

00:31:00   Mostly, we just roll our eyes at the game demos

00:31:02   and just go look at something else

00:31:03   or see what people are tweeting about

00:31:04   'cause, again, it doesn't engage us.

00:31:06   I'm a gamer.

00:31:07   I'm ready to be shown something impressive,

00:31:10   but they just almost never do it.

00:31:11   I think the closest they came to getting me

00:31:13   was when they had Jenova Chen talk about Sky,

00:31:16   but that was such a bare presentation.

00:31:19   Let's think of this.

00:31:20   What's one time,

00:31:21   let's see if you guys can remember back this far,

00:31:23   where there was a successful enticing game demo

00:31:25   at an Apple event?

00:31:27   It might've been before your time.

00:31:30   - I can't think of a single one.

00:31:32   - Oh, what about, did they demo the Halo that wasn't Halo

00:31:35   at any Apple event?

00:31:36   - It was absolutely Halo.

00:31:37   Halo was the most successful game demo

00:31:40   that has ever been done at an Apple press conference.

00:31:42   It has a sad story after that, but at the time,

00:31:45   and why did it work, okay?

00:31:48   Was it to an audience of people who love games?

00:31:50   Not really, but it was Macworld,

00:31:51   so at least the public was there,

00:31:52   and there's some people who are into games in the audience,

00:31:55   so it's not entirely unfamiliar, the audience.

00:31:58   Was it a franchise or a creator that they knew?

00:32:01   Not a franchise, 'cause it was a new franchise at the time,

00:32:03   but was it a creator that they knew?

00:32:04   It was Bungie, and who is Bungie?

00:32:05   The savior of Mac gaming, makers of Marathon and Myth

00:32:09   and other games that Mac users loved

00:32:11   because they were a game developer

00:32:12   that actually paid attention to the Mac and made great games.

00:32:15   And so this developer, who the audience already loves

00:32:19   if they know anything about games,

00:32:20   specifically Mac fans love this developer,

00:32:22   comes on stage and shows a game

00:32:24   that has graphics that were okay for the time,

00:32:28   but innovative gameplay.

00:32:29   Look at that Jeep.

00:32:30   Did you see how the Jeep went over the hill?

00:32:32   And it's also a first-person game,

00:32:33   and you can get in vehicles, and the aliens look cool,

00:32:35   and there was really good music.

00:32:37   Successful game demo, congratulations.

00:32:39   You did one successful game demo in like three decades.

00:32:42   (laughing)

00:32:43   - Wow.

00:32:44   - I mean, I'd say that they dusted to Quake 3, I think,

00:32:47   where we were excited that Quake 3 was on the Mac,

00:32:50   but that was more of a narrow thing.

00:32:51   But it can be done, but repeatedly showing phone games,

00:32:56   it's not going to wow anybody who's into games.

00:32:57   Now, all that said, I'm not saying

00:32:59   they should never have game demos,

00:33:00   because you do have to show,

00:33:01   here's what Apple Arcade has to offer,

00:33:03   and where I differ from Marco is that

00:33:05   the reason Apple Arcade is appealing is because,

00:33:07   are any of those 100 games good?

00:33:10   You don't have to pay for all 100.

00:33:11   You pay the flat fee, and you can find the better one,

00:33:13   whereas if you're looking at the millions of stores

00:33:15   in the App Store, and you don't have word of mouth,

00:33:16   you have to buy them to find out,

00:33:17   or find out which one is a bad free-to-play mechanic,

00:33:19   or whatever, but they have to show,

00:33:20   here are the games that we have,

00:33:21   and what they want to show is this.

00:33:23   The games that are in Apple Arcade

00:33:25   are high-quality, competently-made games,

00:33:28   but you don't have to show an in-depth demo

00:33:30   with the developers of the game showing you the gameplay,

00:33:33   and that's still a good way to do that.

00:33:35   But we do need to see, what do I get?

00:33:36   What do I get from my $5 a month for my whole family?

00:33:40   And Apple needs to say, you get these games,

00:33:42   which, you know, they look like good,

00:33:45   high-quality, interesting games,

00:33:46   and what they should show is, we have a game like this,

00:33:48   we have a card game, we have a racing game,

00:33:50   we have an, and just, you know,

00:33:51   show all the games with little pieces of them,

00:33:53   but you don't have time to go into depth on any of them,

00:33:55   because you want people to understand,

00:33:57   if I pay this money, I will get good games,

00:34:00   and if they were a little bit more savvy,

00:34:01   they would emphasize what I think

00:34:03   is the main selling point of Apple Arcade,

00:34:04   but they rarely talk about when they bring it up

00:34:07   to a larger audience, which is that

00:34:10   they're not exploitive, free-to-play games,

00:34:12   there's no in-app purchases,

00:34:13   it's a game that we couldn't cause to be created

00:34:16   because of the incentives we created over there,

00:34:18   so we have an entirely different set of incentives over here,

00:34:21   which is going to make these games

00:34:22   substantially different than those games.

00:34:25   You know, like, a lot of the things that annoy you

00:34:27   about those other games in our App Store,

00:34:28   which is probably why Apple doesn't talk about it,

00:34:30   don't exist in these games, and I kind of understand

00:34:32   why they don't want to emphasize that,

00:34:33   but I think if and when people start

00:34:35   actually using the service, they will notice that difference

00:34:38   and feel more comfortable letting their kids

00:34:39   play any of those hundreds of games for the flat fee,

00:34:41   knowing that they're not going to be exploited

00:34:44   or accidentally spend $3,000 on dino eggs

00:34:47   or whatever the hell they're getting.

00:34:48   Anyway, we spent too long on games.

00:34:51   - So did Apple.

00:34:52   - Yeah, but there's no reason to bash on Apple

00:34:55   particularly about games now, you could do this at any time,

00:34:58   feel free to replay this segment

00:34:59   anytime in the past or future.

00:35:00   - We are sponsored this week by Mack Weldon,

00:35:04   better than whatever you're wearing right now.

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00:37:05   (upbeat music)

00:37:08   All right, I forgot to mention the opening video

00:37:11   which I thought was really good with the art

00:37:15   of all the different Apple products

00:37:16   kind of morphing into each other.

00:37:18   I effectively am brand new to Apple compared to

00:37:22   the old man in the room and I thought that was great

00:37:24   and I recognized a lot of stuff that I didn't even own

00:37:26   and I thought it was awesome.

00:37:29   Marco, John, what did you guys think?

00:37:31   Let me start again with Marco since you probably have

00:37:33   less emotional attachment like I do to a lot of this.

00:37:35   Marco, what did you think of that opening video?

00:37:37   - I liked it.

00:37:38   I mean, my main issue with all the videos they do now

00:37:42   is similar to what I was saying earlier of like,

00:37:45   they just seem so like boring and corporate.

00:37:48   It's like, here's some art, it's fun,

00:37:50   look at how happy we all are about our products and services

00:37:53   and it's like, I like the ones with a little bit more

00:37:56   personality but Apple has a hard time showing

00:37:59   interesting personality in their videos these days

00:38:03   without it coming across as weird or cheesy.

00:38:05   Like, I think they're going through kind of a rough time

00:38:08   of like the attitude that they present to the world,

00:38:10   trying to appear not like the world's biggest,

00:38:14   richest corporation that they are

00:38:16   and trying to appear like friendly and human

00:38:19   without it being fake and saccharine.

00:38:23   So this opening video with little rainbow line art

00:38:27   and stuff about their products, it was nice, it was fun.

00:38:30   I think it set expectations that weren't met,

00:38:33   that we were gonna see some kind of rainbow involvement

00:38:35   in the products and that didn't happen,

00:38:37   but as was rumored, but we'll see what happens later.

00:38:40   - John.

00:38:43   - Yeah, those things are fine and cute but they're,

00:38:46   I think that this video was perfectly fine

00:38:49   but in the past, they have had these intro videos

00:38:54   not just be passive eye candy to make you

00:38:59   like appreciate the company and its products

00:39:02   and then go into the presentation,

00:39:03   but they've been like the start of the message,

00:39:07   there's been a theme to the presentation.

00:39:09   It's like we're going to pitch you on some particular thing.

00:39:11   Think of the iOS 7 one, remember that whole presentation?

00:39:13   That was not just a cool looking video,

00:39:15   it was also part of the pitch.

00:39:17   It was preparing you for what was to come,

00:39:19   was to say we are doing a particular thing starting now

00:39:24   and here's how we think about it,

00:39:26   here's what we're going to show you,

00:39:27   here's our new attitude or angle on this particular thing.

00:39:32   Those are the best movies, so yes,

00:39:35   they're beautifully done and they're nice or whatever,

00:39:36   but it's like sort of the intro paragraph to the essay

00:39:40   that is the presentation and this one was just like

00:39:42   a frilly cover page, it's like yep, Apple, fun, okay.

00:39:47   And I think that's perfectly fine,

00:39:48   you don't have to have the pitch,

00:39:49   but because we've had the ones that have more portent,

00:39:53   we've had things in the past that have led

00:39:55   into the presentation, it's natural for us long time fans

00:39:59   to read into it like Marco did and say,

00:40:01   ooh, they're showing rainbow stuff,

00:40:02   maybe that's that rainbow rumor, right?

00:40:04   And so it's almost hard for them to avoid that,

00:40:05   so I don't fault them for having a fun little presentation,

00:40:08   but I do think it's more exciting for me

00:40:11   and more engaging for these super diehard fans

00:40:13   to have an intro video that points in a particular direction

00:40:17   and fits with the theme.

00:40:19   - Fair enough, I can't say I disagree.

00:40:22   All right, so we saw Apple Arcade,

00:40:24   five bucks for an entire family one month free trial,

00:40:27   which comes out on the 19th, I believe,

00:40:30   which is a Thursday, oddly,

00:40:31   and in 150 countries, which is good.

00:40:34   We've talked a lot about games

00:40:35   and it sounds like most of us don't care.

00:40:38   - Oh, I would say like the $5 price

00:40:39   is about what people were thinking

00:40:41   and I think it's a good deal.

00:40:42   If you want to have a bunch of games

00:40:44   where you don't have to worry about your kids

00:40:45   getting sucked into some seedy underbelly of games

00:40:48   on the platform, it's a great idea to spend five bucks

00:40:51   and let them give it a try

00:40:52   and maybe all the games will stink,

00:40:55   but I bet there'll be some good ones in there.

00:40:57   So I think the, I'm probably gonna sign up for it.

00:41:02   I mean, I think I will probably

00:41:03   un-sign up for it fairly quickly,

00:41:05   but I do want to say,

00:41:07   because I don't play a lot of games on iOS,

00:41:08   but I do want to actually see the game.

00:41:09   So pay five bucks, try out as many games as you can tolerate

00:41:12   and then unsubscribe.

00:41:14   But for everyone else, I think this is a pretty,

00:41:16   as many people have said,

00:41:17   of all the services Apple offers,

00:41:19   despite their complete inability to demo games on stage,

00:41:22   this one looks like it has the highest chance

00:41:24   of being worth the five dollars

00:41:26   to a fairly large number of people.

00:41:29   - Yeah, and again, I don't want to end on two,

00:41:32   I don't have an end on it.

00:41:33   I think it is a great price and a great setup

00:41:36   and a great set of rules

00:41:38   and value proposition for a gaming service,

00:41:41   but none of that will matter if all the games are mediocre.

00:41:44   What I want to know is what's the first game

00:41:47   on Apple Arcade that I really got to play?

00:41:50   And I'm gonna wait until somebody else tells me that

00:41:52   before I actually jump in.

00:41:53   - I mean, and it's not just you, 'cause it's a family thing.

00:41:55   What's the first game that your kid's gonna play?

00:41:56   That's another place where I differ,

00:41:57   where no one cares about impressive graphics in games.

00:42:00   When I see my cousins play games on their iPads,

00:42:02   they all love to play what I think are these garbagey games

00:42:05   because they have super cool graphics of a motorbike

00:42:07   or a jet plane or lots of vehicle or driving games

00:42:10   or side-scrollers with huge explosions.

00:42:12   No, they're not particularly impressive graphics

00:42:14   when it comes to young children and preteens

00:42:17   who want to play something on their iPad.

00:42:19   They're absolutely drawn to spectacle

00:42:21   and ridiculous explosions and silly things like that.

00:42:24   And yes, they also like the games that are just fun,

00:42:26   little dorky, simple games.

00:42:27   But I mean, there's no appeal to us,

00:42:29   'cause like that hack and slash game with the big sword

00:42:31   and the dragons and all that stuff

00:42:32   that we've seen a million times has no appeal

00:42:34   to anyone who's super into games and most adults.

00:42:38   But to young kids, there is a certain novelty and shininess

00:42:42   and they don't care that the game plays bad

00:42:43   and they'll just think it's cool to, you know,

00:42:45   maybe they'll get sucked into one

00:42:46   or maybe they'll just get it and play it,

00:42:48   but that's what they're drawn to.

00:42:49   So I don't entirely discount the sort of mediocre game

00:42:52   with reasonably cool graphics.

00:42:54   And it's a bit of a slight to say

00:42:56   anybody can have good graphics,

00:42:57   'cause like technically, yes, but artistically,

00:42:59   someone has to make all that art

00:43:01   and it's hard to make good art.

00:43:02   And some of the things they show do have good art.

00:43:04   It's just not gonna impress someone

00:43:06   who wants to be wowed by a game demo,

00:43:08   but you know, a seven-year-old kid left to their own devices,

00:43:13   they're not gonna watch this presentation,

00:43:14   but they are gonna go to Apple Arcade and just say,

00:43:16   I like the icon of that game, I'm gonna download it.

00:43:18   Ooh, this looks cool and I'm gonna play with it.

00:43:19   And they will have a good time,

00:43:20   despite the fact that the game will never appeal to any of us.

00:43:24   - Indeed, Apple TV Plus,

00:43:25   they showed us a trailer for the show CSEE,

00:43:29   which is about a future where nobody in the world

00:43:31   can see anything, but apparently--

00:43:34   - I get it. - They're just born.

00:43:35   Yeah, exactly.

00:43:36   Then two kids are born that can.

00:43:38   This had a very children of men feel to it to me,

00:43:40   which is a compliment.

00:43:41   I like that they called out that they actually consulted

00:43:44   with blind and low vision cast crew and consultants, etc.

00:43:47   First shows will be available November 1, 100 plus countries,

00:43:49   $5 a month for the entire family.

00:43:51   And you use it with the Apple TV app on iPhone, iPad,

00:43:56   and presumably the Mac, question mark.

00:44:01   And then what's interesting is,

00:44:04   if you buy any new physical device, well, not any,

00:44:08   but you know what I mean, like iPhone, iPad, etc.,

00:44:10   you get a year of free Apple TV Plus,

00:44:13   which as with so much with Apple,

00:44:16   in retrospect seems obvious.

00:44:17   I never would have guessed it leading into the event though.

00:44:20   And I think that's a really, really solid plan

00:44:22   because honestly, nothing I've seen yet on Apple TV Plus

00:44:25   is really revving my engine,

00:44:27   but I would certainly give it a shot

00:44:29   if it's free for a year.

00:44:30   - So there's some questions about this deal.

00:44:32   First is, I haven't, sorry,

00:44:34   I haven't had time to look this up,

00:44:36   but like you get a year free if you buy an iPhone,

00:44:39   iPad or Apple TV.

00:44:40   Okay, so if I buy a new iPhone every year,

00:44:42   do I essentially never have to pay for Apple TV Plus?

00:44:44   So on upgrade, Jason and Mike were going through,

00:44:48   I think Jason was looking at the terms,

00:44:49   and there's a limit of one of these trials

00:44:52   per Apple ID family unit.

00:44:55   - Forever?

00:44:56   - Yeah, so like if you, the way he was describing it,

00:44:58   it sounds like it might be implemented

00:45:00   as a regular App Store recurring subscription,

00:45:04   where I think if you don't cancel, I think you get charged.

00:45:08   It's like after a year, so that's a thing.

00:45:12   But it seems to, the way he was describing,

00:45:14   I should have looked this up, I'm sorry,

00:45:15   but yeah, it seemed the way he was describing it

00:45:16   that it was basically applying it to either your Apple ID

00:45:19   if you're an individual, or if you're in an Apple ID family,

00:45:22   then it applies to your family.

00:45:24   And so if it works that way,

00:45:25   like App Store trial subscriptions,

00:45:27   then you only get one, and that's it.

00:45:30   - Yeah, and the other way they could handle this,

00:45:32   regardless of what the rules are,

00:45:33   is they could just discontinue this year free trial next year.

00:45:36   - Sure.

00:45:37   - So then you'd get your year, and it's all right.

00:45:39   So anyway, this whole scheme, it makes sense

00:45:44   from their perspective, but the whole structure

00:45:47   of Apple TV+, them giving the free trial

00:45:51   and pricing it at $5 a month,

00:45:54   we always knew this was gonna be the case.

00:45:56   We know what shows they're gonna have.

00:45:57   They have that whole big thing

00:45:58   with Oprah and Steven Spielberg.

00:45:59   We kinda know all the shows.

00:46:00   They have a limited number of shows.

00:46:02   They apparently don't have anything else.

00:46:04   It's not like they bought Friends for 100 million,

00:46:07   and they don't have this giant back catalog

00:46:08   of movies that you can watch for free.

00:46:09   They're not Netflix, right?

00:46:11   They're not even Hulu with that number of shows.

00:46:13   They have a limited number of boutique shows they made.

00:46:16   They're much more like HBO, right?

00:46:18   But they have no track record.

00:46:20   They have no shows that everyone knows they're gonna want.

00:46:23   They have stars, and they have things made by creators

00:46:25   that you may know, but there's a lot of doubt.

00:46:27   And so before anyone has actually seen any of these shows

00:46:29   for any customers who've seen them,

00:46:31   they have to get you in the door somehow.

00:46:34   And they've, I think, correctly decided

00:46:37   that on the strength of our shows,

00:46:39   we can't get enough people to sign up for this,

00:46:41   because they haven't seen the shows yet.

00:46:43   So how do I get over the hurdle?

00:46:44   And they're also not confident that,

00:46:46   oh, well, no one's seen them yet,

00:46:48   but boy, once people see the first two episodes of C,

00:46:50   it's gonna be the next Game of Thrones,

00:46:51   and everybody's gonna tell all their friends,

00:46:53   oh my god, you've gotta get this service.

00:46:55   They don't have that confidence.

00:46:56   I think they're right not to have that confidence.

00:46:58   They're probably not gonna get a smash hit

00:47:00   right out of the gate.

00:47:01   So year-free trial.

00:47:03   That gives Apple a year to find one or two hit shows,

00:47:07   or to turn one or two of their shows,

00:47:08   it starts off shaky, but it finds its legs right.

00:47:11   Gives them a chance to do that.

00:47:12   It gets the numbers up, 'cause hey,

00:47:14   you're gonna get it for free or whatever.

00:47:16   And because they're recurring,

00:47:18   and it's only $5 a month,

00:47:19   maybe people will drift into next year

00:47:22   and still keep paying for it,

00:47:23   or if they're into a particular show.

00:47:24   So it's not a strength move,

00:47:27   but I think it's the right thing for Apple to do,

00:47:28   because they're not in a position of strength.

00:47:30   And that C trailer, I was looking forward to that show.

00:47:33   That was not a good trailer.

00:47:35   I think Apple does know how to make a good trailer

00:47:37   for a TV show, but what they showed

00:47:39   did not give me high hopes for that particular program.

00:47:42   But hey, they can't all be hits, so you know.

00:47:45   I'm absolutely going to,

00:47:47   well, I'm gonna get Apple TV for free,

00:47:50   'cause my wife is buying all the things this year.

00:47:52   But yeah, I'm gonna try a whole bunch of these shows,

00:47:56   'cause I actually am interested in them.

00:47:57   And because I subscribe to every streaming service

00:48:00   in the entire world,

00:48:01   I will probably continue to pay for it next year.

00:48:04   I feel similarly about Apple TV Plus

00:48:06   as I do about Apple Arcade,

00:48:07   which is the pricing seems fine,

00:48:09   the terms and the metrics and everything all sound fine.

00:48:14   I will care when there's a hit.

00:48:15   And if there isn't a hit,

00:48:17   I'm not gonna buy it and subscribe to it

00:48:19   just for the sake of maybe it'll get better.

00:48:22   When there's a hit that I start hearing that I have to see,

00:48:25   that's when I'll jump in.

00:48:26   - And these monthly things are great.

00:48:28   I subscribe to CBS long enough to watch Star Trek,

00:48:31   and then I unsubscribe,

00:48:32   and then the new season comes out and I subscribe,

00:48:33   and I watch Star Trek, and then I unsubscribe.

00:48:35   It's not a particularly bad model.

00:48:37   Managing on an Apple device is not that hard.

00:48:40   I can watch it on my television,

00:48:41   I can watch it on my iPad.

00:48:43   It's cheaper for me to subscribe to CBS,

00:48:45   All Access or whatever it's called, for one month

00:48:47   than it would be for me to try to rent it

00:48:50   or buy it all from iTunes or any of the other past things.

00:48:52   So yeah, Apple should just keep trying to make good shows.

00:48:56   And if they get a hit or two,

00:48:57   people will subscribe and watch a show and unsubscribe,

00:48:59   and it's on Apple to keep making good shows.

00:49:01   It's exactly what HBO has to do,

00:49:03   which is the closest analog.

00:49:04   You know, Game of Thrones ends,

00:49:05   why are people still watching it?

00:49:06   Oh, it turns out succession's pretty good.

00:49:07   Like, HBO finds a way to keep me watching anyway,

00:49:10   so that's what Apple's gotta do.

00:49:13   - Indeed.

00:49:14   Alrighty, so let's move on.

00:49:16   Let's talk about iPad.

00:49:18   I think we can make this probably pretty quick,

00:49:20   famous last words.

00:49:21   Seventh-generation iPad with Touch ID, it lingers on.

00:49:24   A 10.2-inch display.

00:49:26   It is a new resolution.

00:49:28   We were not sure about that

00:49:28   when we were writing the show notes.

00:49:30   If I did my research correctly,

00:49:33   it is 2160 by 1620 instead of 2048 by 1536.

00:49:38   So just a little bit bigger.

00:49:40   It has a generation one Apple Pencil,

00:49:43   a 3.7-inch, my goodness,

00:49:45   3.7 times wider viewing angle,

00:49:48   and an A10 Fusion, which is from 2016,

00:49:51   and that's from the iPhone 7, is that right?

00:49:53   - Right, 'cause it isn't the A10X,

00:49:54   which was the iPad version with the bigger GPU.

00:49:56   It's just the A10, which is what the,

00:49:58   they usually, you know, that isn't unusual.

00:50:00   Usually on the lower-end iPad models,

00:50:02   they don't usually give the X version of the chip

00:50:04   that has the bigger, bigger GPU.

00:50:05   They just do the regular phone version of the chip.

00:50:08   The minis like that,

00:50:09   and usually the low-end ones are as well.

00:50:10   But yeah, A10, you know,

00:50:13   the A10 was a fine chip when it came out.

00:50:14   It's getting a little old,

00:50:16   but for the products that are super low in the lineup,

00:50:19   that's fine, I guess.

00:50:21   - Yeah, I think it's,

00:50:23   that's the part that's most disappointing about this model,

00:50:25   but it's not that disappointing,

00:50:27   because the A10, like just thinking of, again,

00:50:30   people who I see, kids I see playing with iPads and stuff,

00:50:32   like you'd wanna get your kid the cheapest iPad,

00:50:34   but they eventually want the bigger one usually.

00:50:36   This can play most of the games that they,

00:50:40   that kids, young kids would be into playing.

00:50:42   Like you don't, no, they can't play

00:50:44   the super duper cutting edge graphics,

00:50:45   but the App Store is not filled with games like that.

00:50:47   The App Store, anyone who puts something in the App Store

00:50:48   and spends that money making a game,

00:50:50   wants to target a wadowing.

00:50:52   So an A10 can play all those games,

00:50:54   and aside from games,

00:50:55   there's no reason they need anything stronger.

00:50:56   It would be better if it had an A11 or an X

00:50:59   or something like that, but overall,

00:51:02   this is the cheap iPad, the cheap, cheap iPad.

00:51:06   This is the best cheap, cheap iPad I think they've ever had,

00:51:08   because it has almost all of the features

00:51:11   that you care about, albeit in lesser form

00:51:13   as the pro models.

00:51:15   Pencil support, but not as good.

00:51:17   Smart connector support,

00:51:18   but doesn't have the newest keyboard thing.

00:51:21   It doesn't have Face ID, but no one cares about that.

00:51:23   It's got a screen, and it's bigger,

00:51:25   it's not as nice as the other screens,

00:51:26   but it's still nicer than it was.

00:51:27   I would have no problem recommending this

00:51:30   as a good big iPad to get for anybody

00:51:34   who knows they're not going to be particularly demanding,

00:51:37   and they're not into the pencil.

00:51:38   The pencil is where I kind of draw the line of like,

00:51:40   look, if you're gonna use the pencil all the time,

00:51:42   there's no need for you to go through fumbling

00:51:43   with that round thing.

00:51:45   (laughing)

00:51:46   Well, there is a need if you can't afford

00:51:48   the much more expensive pro thing.

00:51:50   - That's the thing, it's so much more expensive

00:51:52   to get the iPad Pro.

00:51:53   - Yeah, maybe you get a case with a little slot

00:51:55   to put the pencil in, I guess.

00:51:56   - Yeah, and I mean, if anything, like this new cheap iPad,

00:52:00   I think really takes a lot of the wind out of the sales

00:52:02   of the iPad Air, which is that kind of mid-priced model,

00:52:05   which is not that much better than it.

00:52:07   - Yeah, when I do that line up, I'm like,

00:52:08   why is that still there?

00:52:10   And it's so clearly not long for this world

00:52:13   or going to be upgraded.

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00:54:06   (upbeat music)

00:54:09   - Moving on to the watch.

00:54:11   That video punched me right in the feels, just so good.

00:54:15   I don't say that sarcastically, I really mean it.

00:54:17   I thought that video was great.

00:54:19   - Yeah, I think, and speaking of like,

00:54:20   what is modern Apple's face to the world?

00:54:22   They're a big corporation, and like,

00:54:23   what is their message or whatever?

00:54:24   One thing that Apple has been fairly consistently,

00:54:27   fairly on message about, and I think good about,

00:54:29   is that like, in the sort of Tim Cook era,

00:54:32   the message to Apple to the world about its products,

00:54:36   like the strongest one that is coherent is,

00:54:39   here are the real people that use our products,

00:54:41   and the value they derive from them in their lives, right?

00:54:45   And obviously that's the world's most generic pitch

00:54:47   for a thing, but they make really good videos

00:54:51   showing real people being genuine on camera

00:54:54   about things that have happened in their life

00:54:57   that are tangentially related to Apple products,

00:54:59   because they have to work in the Apple product,

00:55:01   but I think they do it in a way that we buy it.

00:55:02   We say, it's not like where they're, you know,

00:55:05   Burger King gets someone to say,

00:55:06   "I saw my kid born and I had a Burger King burger

00:55:08   "next to me."

00:55:09   Like, that's not connected.

00:55:10   (laughing)

00:55:11   There's no connection right there,

00:55:12   but like this video with the Apple Watch.

00:55:14   I had a health issue and Apple Watch participated

00:55:18   in my health crisis in a positive way.

00:55:21   Like, the connection is clear, the people are clear,

00:55:24   they're really well done videos, you know,

00:55:26   it's hitting Casey in the feels, this is good advertising.

00:55:29   It is well done advertising,

00:55:30   and Apple does these things a lot,

00:55:32   and we see them and we feel like they're genuine,

00:55:35   and we say, "Yeah, okay, I see that.

00:55:37   "I see the benefit you're pitching.

00:55:39   "I believe that there is a connection,

00:55:40   "and I believe because of the way you made your products,

00:55:43   "they have made these people's lives better in this way."

00:55:46   Total success, they do these all the time,

00:55:48   and they're not getting old to me.

00:55:52   I'm not so jaded that I don't believe that they're real.

00:55:55   Now, on the other hand, you know, you could say,

00:55:59   "Okay, that's fine, but what about,"

00:56:02   and then put on a giant pile of other things,

00:56:04   all the way up to and including the keyboard

00:56:06   that we all hate or whatever,

00:56:07   but for the moments while you're watching those videos

00:56:09   because they do a good job, we're all like,

00:56:11   "Yep, you did it, yep, good job.

00:56:14   "We believe you, we like you.

00:56:15   "This is one of the things we like about Apple."

00:56:16   And I would file into that category also,

00:56:19   what you just mentioned about the iPad.

00:56:22   The whole environmental stuff that they keep doing

00:56:24   with their little checklist that gets longer,

00:56:25   and now they're adding 100% recycled aluminum

00:56:27   and everything like that, people roll their eyes at that.

00:56:29   I don't roll my eyes at it.

00:56:30   Could they be better?

00:56:31   Of course, they can always be better,

00:56:32   but they stubbornly insist to continue

00:56:34   to put that in their presentations.

00:56:36   I think they're hoping,

00:56:37   "Hey, why don't you ask every other tech company

00:56:40   "why they don't do all these things?"

00:56:42   Like, whatever they are, BPA-free, lead-free,

00:56:46   what percentage of recycling,

00:56:47   how much renewable energy do they use?

00:56:48   Obviously, Apple is bragging,

00:56:50   but trying to say that they're a better company

00:56:52   than other people, but they're doing these things.

00:56:54   It costs them more money to do these things

00:56:56   than it would otherwise in the short term, right?

00:56:59   These are positive things that Apple's doing.

00:57:01   They keep hammering on them.

00:57:02   It's been a very consistent message.

00:57:03   It's much more boring than the videos

00:57:05   that hit you in the feels,

00:57:06   but I feel like it is another consistent message

00:57:08   out of Tim Cook's Apple.

00:57:09   It's a positive message,

00:57:10   and despite the fact that we see it

00:57:12   over and over and over again,

00:57:13   I say keep putting it up on the slides

00:57:14   'cause it's something that the world needs to see.

00:57:18   - Yep, agreed.

00:57:19   Following that, they had a woman whose name I did not catch.

00:57:22   In fact, most of the presenters,

00:57:23   I did not catch their names, and I apologize for that.

00:57:25   - Wait, I actually did.

00:57:26   Can I make a quick little thing about this?

00:57:28   I don't know what this was about.

00:57:30   So yeah, so Apple Arcade,

00:57:31   the presenter was introduced simply as Anne.

00:57:34   There were a whole bunch of people brought up on stage

00:57:36   only with first name and no title,

00:57:39   and I feel like that was a little bit odd.

00:57:42   - Yeah, I agree.

00:57:43   - Yeah, they need some consistency.

00:57:44   Especially if it's a new person

00:57:45   that hasn't been in a presentation before,

00:57:47   it's good to say and welcome blah, blah, blah,

00:57:49   director of blah, blah, blah,

00:57:51   so we know what connection they have

00:57:52   to the product that they're showing.

00:57:54   I always think, I know this can't possibly be true

00:57:58   because of how much they rehearsed these things,

00:57:59   but I'm like, maybe they just forgot the last name.

00:58:01   (laughing)

00:58:02   Maybe the last name is difficult to pronounce,

00:58:05   and they bailed on it in a panic,

00:58:06   which we can all relate to,

00:58:07   having to speak people's unfamiliar names,

00:58:11   but maybe they just don't care that much

00:58:13   about the consistency,

00:58:14   but titles would be great,

00:58:16   'cause okay, we know the person's first name

00:58:19   and maybe their last name and they're presenting,

00:58:20   but who are they?

00:58:22   Are they an engineering manager?

00:58:24   Are they a director?

00:58:25   Are they a marketing executive?

00:58:26   Who are they in relation to this product?

00:58:28   I think that would help frame the presentation,

00:58:30   but as usual, everyone who presented,

00:58:32   I thought did such a good job

00:58:34   that it didn't even occur to me

00:58:36   to think about what kind of job they did.

00:58:37   Again, setting aside the non-Apple employees,

00:58:40   those poor people from game studios

00:58:41   who are up there trying to demo their games

00:58:43   when they're already set up to fail,

00:58:44   but the Apple people,

00:58:46   the Apple people are all great.

00:58:47   - Yeah, I agree.

00:58:48   Going back a moment, just to the last name thing,

00:58:50   and the titles,

00:58:51   I think another way that that matters

00:58:54   is in realizing and recognizing diversity.

00:58:58   We've been talking about diversity,

00:59:00   everyone's been talking about diversity in tech companies

00:59:02   and tech presentations for years now,

00:59:04   and Apple is getting a lot better at it.

00:59:08   But one of the ways that it helps

00:59:11   is if you can tell whether the person on stage

00:59:15   has a really strong position in that product or not.

00:59:19   John was saying you could tell,

00:59:20   are they an engineer, are they a marketing person,

00:59:22   are they in charge of a lot of things,

00:59:24   are they just somebody they hired to do a demo?

00:59:27   You don't know, right?

00:59:28   A title gives legitimacy.

00:59:29   A title says if you're seeing a kind of person up there

00:59:33   that you don't usually see in the board of,

00:59:35   the panel of bland white guys up there,

00:59:38   it means a lot more if they also tell you,

00:59:42   this person's the product manager on this product,

00:59:43   or something like that, right?

00:59:45   They lend legitimacy to these people to say,

00:59:48   not only here's somebody named Anne,

00:59:51   but no, here's Anne and she's the boss of this division.

00:59:55   That's a lot better.

00:59:56   - What was the woman who does the iMac?

01:00:00   Wasn't that a good example of them saying--

01:00:02   - Yes.

01:00:03   - She was the product manager for the whole iMac.

01:00:05   - Exactly, exactly.

01:00:06   - And interestingly, that's not her only job.

01:00:09   We found out later with all the interviews with her,

01:00:11   she doesn't just oversee the iMac,

01:00:13   she oversees a bunch of stuff,

01:00:14   but she was presented in the presentation pointedly as,

01:00:17   the iMac, she's in charge of it.

01:00:19   And they didn't have to mention,

01:00:20   oh, and by the way, also these other things, right?

01:00:22   So it immediately gave her legitimacy.

01:00:23   - That's Colleen Novielli is her name.

01:00:26   - Yes, thank you.

01:00:27   - It immediately gave her legitimacy

01:00:28   to speak authoritatively, to Marco's point,

01:00:31   of seeing the title, whether it's like,

01:00:33   director, vice president, like those words,

01:00:35   that carry weight.

01:00:37   Worldwide director of product marketing?

01:00:40   We all know who that is, right?

01:00:42   We put worldwide in front of things,

01:00:44   it sounds so much more impressive.

01:00:45   - So anyway, so after that video that punched me

01:00:49   in the feels, we had one of the women who was on stage,

01:00:52   whose again, name escapes me and I'm sorry,

01:00:55   who did the new health studies,

01:00:57   which I was excited to see the Apple Watch hearing study,

01:01:00   the Apple hearing study,

01:01:01   which is largely about the Watch--

01:01:01   - Her name given was Sambal, but no last name, no title.

01:01:05   - Wonderful.

01:01:06   The Apple hearing study, which is because the Watch

01:01:09   can obviously hear your environment.

01:01:12   The thing that I was most excited about and impressed by

01:01:15   was the Apple women's health study,

01:01:16   which includes infertility,

01:01:18   which is near and dear to my heart and osteoporosis,

01:01:21   and the Apple heart and movement studies.

01:01:23   So I don't think we need to talk too much about these,

01:01:26   but I think these are all really great examples of,

01:01:28   yeah, Apple can do some really navel-gazey,

01:01:31   really, you know, really selfish stuff,

01:01:34   but I feel like these health studies,

01:01:38   from everything I can tell as a non-doctor,

01:01:40   really do seem like Apple genuinely trying

01:01:43   to improve the world.

01:01:45   And they may or may not make a dent on the universe,

01:01:47   so, you know, if you will,

01:01:49   but I do think that they're doing the right thing here

01:01:52   and I am all on board for them continuing

01:01:55   to go down this path.

01:01:56   - Yeah, then we had another topic

01:01:58   that we'll probably actually talk about another day

01:01:59   of exactly how Apple is currently trying to address

01:02:03   the healthcare market and how they could best address it,

01:02:05   but right now this is what they're doing with these,

01:02:07   you know, they have devices that can participate

01:02:09   in healthcare in various ways and they are pursuing

01:02:12   sort of the, I don't wanna say the obvious things,

01:02:15   but like, look, they made a watch,

01:02:16   they intentionally put a bunch of health sensors in it,

01:02:18   they can record data,

01:02:19   then they can sort of alert based on that data,

01:02:22   and the fact they have these devices

01:02:23   that are attached to people that can do things for you

01:02:25   makes it the perfect tool for like, you know,

01:02:28   widespread studies where they need lots of participants

01:02:31   and Apple's like, we've got lots of customers,

01:02:33   we can actually help there.

01:02:34   You don't have to get, recruit a bunch of people

01:02:37   and get them to do some weird thing

01:02:38   if we can just gather data from people

01:02:40   who already have Apple Watches, you know, that's great.

01:02:43   - Yep, so speaking of Apple Watches,

01:02:44   now we're getting into the meat of the show,

01:02:46   the new Apple Watch Series 5.

01:02:50   The highlight feature here,

01:02:53   which has gotten us to the point that Marco

01:02:55   has already bought himself an Apple Watch

01:02:57   and he has sworn off his mechanical BS from 1812,

01:03:01   the display is always on, Marco, how excited are you?

01:03:05   - Finally, I can see the mediocre watch faces all the time.

01:03:08   (laughing)

01:03:09   - I can't believe you could be negative about that.

01:03:11   (laughing)

01:03:12   Finally, what do you mean finally?

01:03:14   Nobody expected always on watch display this year.

01:03:16   This is the standout announcement

01:03:19   of the entire presentation,

01:03:20   which is this alone puts this presentation above average.

01:03:23   That's why I didn't just say it's average.

01:03:24   - No, I completely agree.

01:03:26   Like in all seriousness,

01:03:28   this is a really huge upgrade to the watch

01:03:30   that I didn't think we were ready for yet.

01:03:32   Like I didn't think we were there battery life wise

01:03:35   to do this and you know, none of us have these yet.

01:03:37   We don't know what the trade-offs really are yet.

01:03:39   We'll find out, maybe there's some kind of weird thing,

01:03:41   but it seemed that they really pulled it off

01:03:42   and you know, even though the Apple Watch

01:03:46   is mostly not for me,

01:03:49   this was one of the huge reasons why I didn't like it.

01:03:52   That every time I glance at it,

01:03:54   there would just be a black rectangle

01:03:55   and I'd have to like twist my arm in a weird way

01:03:57   a lot of times and a lot of times it just wouldn't work.

01:04:00   It's funny, one of the,

01:04:02   so I do usually wear it during workouts

01:04:04   and one of the pictures they showed

01:04:07   was somebody holding a plank.

01:04:08   (laughing)

01:04:09   And like I have actually been doing that exact thing,

01:04:12   wearing a watch, wanting to see what's on the screen

01:04:14   and not being able to.

01:04:15   I can't rotate my wrist at that moment.

01:04:17   And I was like well I guess I'll just micro-targeted

01:04:19   advertising just at you.

01:04:20   - Yeah right, so like.

01:04:21   - It applies to me too, but yes, I agree.

01:04:24   - So like it actually, it's a huge upgrade.

01:04:26   That will, I don't know how, you know, how great it is yet,

01:04:30   but that will dramatically change

01:04:33   what it's like to wear the watch.

01:04:35   That's a huge, huge deal.

01:04:38   And you know, there's lots of details to work out,

01:04:40   lots of you know, design issues and questions.

01:04:44   One of the biggest things I wanna know is like,

01:04:46   what's it like to be in a room

01:04:47   with a bunch of these things?

01:04:49   You know like, if you're like in a room

01:04:51   and a bunch of people have watches,

01:04:52   is it gonna be distracting?

01:04:53   Like is it, or have they tweaked

01:04:54   the brightness algorithms enough

01:04:56   so that it doesn't seem like you're in like a sports bar

01:05:00   full of little tiny TVs on your body's wrists, you know?

01:05:01   - It is dimmer, it is dimmer in the ambient mode.

01:05:04   I'm assuming mostly to discharge, to say a battery,

01:05:06   but as far as I would tell from the people

01:05:08   taking pictures of the thing,

01:05:09   there is like a dim mode, which is kind of

01:05:10   the always on display, and then there's

01:05:12   I'm interacting with it, which is a higher brightness.

01:05:15   - Right, and the dim mode also simplifies

01:05:16   what's on screen, so any watch face

01:05:19   that has a white background, it switches it to black,

01:05:21   so it uses fewer pixels and saves energy.

01:05:23   It also removes the animated seconds hand

01:05:25   from the analog faces, so it doesn't have to keep

01:05:27   updating the screen at 60 hertz.

01:05:29   Like they said, they can slow down the refresh rate

01:05:31   to what they said one hert, which is one hertz in reality.

01:05:36   The unit is not called hert if it's only one.

01:05:39   But anyway, so that's a huge deal.

01:05:42   Like all the tech going into that,

01:05:44   all the advancement, the battery optimization,

01:05:47   the adjusting all the watch faces to support this,

01:05:51   I do think that this is probably the nail in the coffin

01:05:56   for any hope of there ever being third party watch faces.

01:06:00   Because this is the kind of thing that Apple really,

01:06:02   if there were third party watch faces,

01:06:05   they basically couldn't have done this,

01:06:07   or they would have had to put weird restrictions on them,

01:06:09   or things like that, and I can see them

01:06:11   just wanting to keep that control for themselves forever.

01:06:15   And that's unfortunate for me because

01:06:17   I really want third party watch faces.

01:06:20   One of the reasons why the Apple Watch

01:06:23   is not currently my favorite is because

01:06:25   I don't really love any of the faces right now.

01:06:28   I have minor or major problems with almost all of them.

01:06:33   And so it's not really for me,

01:06:35   but for everyone who it is for, this is a massive upgrade.

01:06:40   I'll also say, otherwise, we didn't get a lot of other detail

01:06:44   about what else is different about it, but that alone,

01:06:47   I don't think I'm gonna get one,

01:06:50   'cause I don't use my Series 4 enough.

01:06:53   For my purposes of developing the app,

01:06:55   the Series 4 is probably fine.

01:06:57   My app doesn't even have a meaningful complication,

01:07:00   so I can't even say, oh, I have to test my complication

01:07:02   on the new Always On screen, nope, I really don't.

01:07:04   But anyway, it looks like a really good upgrade.

01:07:09   And if I were an everyday Apple Watch wearer,

01:07:13   I would seriously consider it because of how

01:07:16   incredibly different that the screen thing will make it

01:07:19   as just an overall experience.

01:07:21   As for the finishes, by the way, before I forget,

01:07:24   people ask me a lot about watch stuff

01:07:26   and the watch finishes.

01:07:28   I love that they introduced titanium.

01:07:31   I love that they brought back white ceramic.

01:07:33   The white ceramic, I can tell you, is fantastic.

01:07:35   I don't love with these new ones

01:07:37   that they've made the crown black on it.

01:07:41   It's kind of a weird contrast with the white.

01:07:44   I don't love that.

01:07:46   But otherwise, in the pictures so far,

01:07:49   the titanium really looks fantastic.

01:07:53   The one thing, though, and the hands-on people

01:07:57   who were there say that it was noticeably lighter as well,

01:08:00   which is nice.

01:08:02   The one thing that I will say, though,

01:08:03   is that I would strongly suggest anybody

01:08:06   who was on the fence about which one of these to get

01:08:07   or who was interested in the titanium maybe,

01:08:10   wait until you can see it in person

01:08:13   because it's a very different finish.

01:08:15   It is a brushed, it's like a horizontally brushed finish,

01:08:19   it looks like on the titanium from the pictures,

01:08:21   which the steel models are polished,

01:08:24   so they're high-polished, like mirror finish,

01:08:26   and then the aluminum models have that

01:08:29   kind of sandblasted look.

01:08:31   So titanium being a brushed finish is a very different look

01:08:36   and I don't know how that will appear or not in person.

01:08:40   I haven't ordered one yet, in part because I'm trying

01:08:43   to rationalize myself out of it,

01:08:45   but also in part because I can't decide which one to order.

01:08:47   I think, off the top of my head,

01:08:50   I think the light-colored titanium

01:08:54   is probably gonna look the best,

01:08:56   but until I see it in person, I wouldn't make that call

01:08:58   and I would suggest to you, our dear listeners,

01:09:01   you might not want to either

01:09:02   because these things can look very different in person.

01:09:05   - So I am extremely stoked to receive mine.

01:09:08   As I've said earlier, Aaron and I both ordered new ones.

01:09:11   I finally took the plunge on the smaller watch.

01:09:14   I'm rolling a, what is it, 42 millimeter series three.

01:09:18   I have little teeny tiny wrists,

01:09:19   so I went for the 40 millimeter series five cellular again

01:09:23   because I do love having it when I go running.

01:09:25   I am super pumped.

01:09:27   I want the titanium really badly,

01:09:29   but it's something that I don't see sticking around

01:09:31   for a long time.

01:09:33   I can't justify the cost.

01:09:35   I'll probably keep this watch for a year or two,

01:09:37   hopefully two.

01:09:38   As much as I like to snark on Marco,

01:09:41   I can't appreciate an honest-to-goodness mechanical watch.

01:09:44   And if this was a mechanical watch

01:09:45   that I was keeping forever,

01:09:46   I probably would do the $700 or whatever it is, titanium,

01:09:50   but no, I just went whatever the cheapo one was,

01:09:52   well, with cellular, the sport model with cellular,

01:09:55   and Aaron got the non-cellular one,

01:09:58   and I'm really excited about it.

01:09:59   Also worth noting that you can choose,

01:10:02   I think for the first time, right, that--

01:10:05   - Yeah, this is huge. - You can choose,

01:10:06   you can choose any watch case with any band.

01:10:09   It used to be that if you got a sport watch,

01:10:11   you could only get like sport bands

01:10:12   or a subset of the available bands.

01:10:15   Now you could get the cheapo watch with the link bracelet

01:10:19   or whatever the most expensive band of the day is.

01:10:21   And I think that's really great.

01:10:23   And I did their little online configurator thing

01:10:28   to use car parlance, which was good,

01:10:31   and it let you kind of visualize what you were gonna get.

01:10:34   I have a feeling this is gonna be really great in stores.

01:10:36   I'm a little curious how the packaging

01:10:39   is going to be for this,

01:10:40   especially if you buy this in store.

01:10:42   Do they hand you two different boxes?

01:10:45   Do they have an infinite array of combinations in the back?

01:10:48   I would assume not.

01:10:49   I'm curious to see how this works out, but--

01:10:52   - Well, do you buy a Series 4?

01:10:53   - No, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm still rocking the 3.

01:10:56   - Because the Series 4, the packaging for the Series 4

01:11:00   was separated.

01:11:01   It was like, there was a very thin outer box,

01:11:04   but inside that box were two totally separate boxes.

01:11:07   One had the strap and one had the watch.

01:11:10   And then you had to assemble it after the fact.

01:11:12   So it seemed almost like they were kind of preparing for it

01:11:14   with the Series 4, and maybe just didn't get it all together

01:11:17   in time or whatever.

01:11:18   But yeah, it's already been separate for a year,

01:11:22   like in the packaging and everything.

01:11:23   - Gotcha, gotcha. - They were just bundled

01:11:24   together with a thin black outer box.

01:11:27   - That is some quality RTFU, thank you.

01:11:29   So anyway, I am really stoked to get these.

01:11:31   I am really stoked to have Always On watch face.

01:11:35   It doesn't bother me as much as I think it bothers you,

01:11:37   Marco, but it definitely bothers me.

01:11:38   I'm not sitting here and saying it's a non-issue.

01:11:41   It's an issue, and I am excited.

01:11:43   I'm really excited to have this on my wrist.

01:11:46   I really honestly am.

01:11:47   The GPS starts at $400, cellular starts at $500.

01:11:51   And also, we haven't touched on this yet,

01:11:54   and we're gonna touch on it more in a minute.

01:11:56   I am not even kidding.

01:11:58   When I tell you possibly my favorite announcements

01:12:01   of this entire event were the means

01:12:03   by which I can throw piles of cash at Apple.

01:12:05   Because literally as soon as the event was over,

01:12:08   I ordered two Apple watches.

01:12:10   I didn't have to wake up at midnight

01:12:11   or three in the morning or anything like that.

01:12:14   The keynote was over.

01:12:15   I went to the Apple website,

01:12:17   and I bought myself two Apple watches.

01:12:20   Or I bought the family two Apple watches.

01:12:22   That was awesome.

01:12:23   It was incredible.

01:12:24   There was nothing to worry about.

01:12:25   I wish I would've had a choice. (laughs)

01:12:28   If I would've known which titanium I was interested in,

01:12:31   if any, I might've already ordered one.

01:12:34   - Yeah, and we're gonna get on a deep tangent,

01:12:37   which we don't have time for.

01:12:37   But I would like to just say,

01:12:40   if you're not gonna let us order something today,

01:12:44   which they did with the watch, which I commend,

01:12:46   and I think in a perfect world, that's what I would want.

01:12:48   But if you have something like the phones

01:12:50   where you're gonna make us wait

01:12:51   a couple of days before we order,

01:12:52   why doesn't retail get examples of these phones

01:12:56   to put out right after the keynote?

01:12:58   And yes, I know, okay, leaks, yeah, yeah, I get it.

01:12:59   I'm just saying, in my perfect fantasy world,

01:13:02   it should be that the keynote is over,

01:13:04   and either that day or the next day,

01:13:07   I can go to my local Apple store and see these in person

01:13:10   so I can figure out what I want.

01:13:12   This is the firstest of first world problems.

01:13:14   But if you're gonna give us that delay,

01:13:16   then put the damn devices in the store so we can see them.

01:13:19   That would make it so much nicer.

01:13:21   - Yeah, that would be amazing.

01:13:23   - Finally, the Series 3 persists.

01:13:26   It is $200 for a GPS model.

01:13:28   I don't think they have cellular models

01:13:30   of the Series 3 anymore, but that is the cheapo watch.

01:13:33   And you know what, $200 for a not that old Apple watch,

01:13:38   I don't think that's a bad deal.

01:13:40   I think that's pretty good all in all.

01:13:41   - Yeah, that's a great, I mean, the Series 3,

01:13:43   yes, it is now two years old, but it's also still fine.

01:13:46   - Yeah, mine feels good.

01:13:47   I mean, granted, I don't really have a lot to compare to,

01:13:49   but I haven't felt like it's slow in the same way

01:13:53   my Series 0 absolutely did at this point in its life.

01:13:58   - No, I mean, the Series 0 was ungodly slow

01:14:02   on day one of its life.

01:14:03   - Well, fair, fair, fair.

01:14:04   - The Series 1 and 2, which are the same watch,

01:14:07   confusingly, but the Series 1 and 2 were faster,

01:14:12   in the sense they were less slow.

01:14:15   The Series 3 was the one that made

01:14:17   a massive jump forward in performance.

01:14:19   For them to keep that one around is totally fine.

01:14:23   I would have preferred the Series 4 as a developer.

01:14:25   I would have preferred that one to be the one

01:14:27   that sticks around longer because it has

01:14:28   the different screen shape with the rounded corners

01:14:30   and everything, and that would mean that all the old

01:14:33   square screens I could stop supporting a few years earlier

01:14:36   than I now have to support them,

01:14:37   but that's fine, we can deal with that.

01:14:40   I do wonder why the Series 4 wasn't the one kept around.

01:14:44   - Yeah.

01:14:45   - Either instead of or in addition to the Series 3,

01:14:49   why you have $200 for the Series 3

01:14:53   and then $400 for the Series 5, okay,

01:14:57   what happened to the Series 4?

01:14:59   It seemed totally fine, we have two of them in our house.

01:15:02   They're wonderful, I don't know, but oh well.

01:15:04   - Yeah, oh, and real time follow up,

01:15:06   the cellular Series 3 is available,

01:15:09   and that is $300 as you would expect.

01:15:11   - I wonder if the Series 4 is a manufacturing line thing,

01:15:14   'cause the Series 5 is basically, as far as I can tell,

01:15:16   physically identical on the outside

01:15:18   in terms of dimensions and everything as the Series 4,

01:15:21   so maybe there's some-- - Ah, that's a good point.

01:15:23   - Some shares, I don't, maybe they're not in volumes

01:15:25   where that matters, I don't know, that's just, I'm just,

01:15:27   like, the Series 3 price for 200 is,

01:15:31   oh god, my phone is activating again, this has become--

01:15:33   - Okay, I-- (laughing)

01:15:35   - Oh, you said Series 3.

01:15:37   - Check.

01:15:38   - Yeah, this has been a problem recently,

01:15:40   I don't, something about, anyway.

01:15:42   - Yeah, my home, I started playing music during the keynote

01:15:44   because of something they said on screen.

01:15:47   - Yeah, this has been happening to me during podcasts,

01:15:48   I just turn off that feature, I so rarely use it, huh?

01:15:51   Anyway, I feel like there's a sort of a line,

01:15:53   there's two lines here, one is the, you know,

01:15:55   the curved display on the Series 4,

01:15:56   like, this dividing line between the old Apple Watches

01:15:59   and the new, just visually, and now with the Always On

01:16:02   Display, there's a second, perhaps even darker line,

01:16:04   depending on how much of an impact that has on people.

01:16:06   And speaking of the Always On Display,

01:16:08   I don't think that puts a nail in any kind of coffin

01:16:11   for custom watch faces, that custom watch faces

01:16:14   are still totally a thing that Apple could do,

01:16:15   if you made one, you'd have to deal with Always On Display

01:16:17   the same way your apps deal with dark mode,

01:16:19   like, is this a thing that you would have to deal with?

01:16:21   Doesn't mean they're ever gonna do it,

01:16:23   but I don't think Always On Display changes the odds

01:16:26   one way or the other, and I feel like as time goes on,

01:16:28   the odds slowly increase.

01:16:30   I always just think about third-party keyboards,

01:16:32   like, eventually, you start running out of features to add,

01:16:35   and you're like, you know what, okay, fine, watch faces.

01:16:37   And really, if I had to pitch them, I'd say,

01:16:39   don't put that one off, don't leave it until you're

01:16:41   scraping a bottle in a barrel, 'cause it's another,

01:16:44   like, you love app stores, don't you?

01:16:46   Like, you love to sell things, people will sell watch faces,

01:16:49   and you'll get a cut, and it will work out great for you.

01:16:52   Like, I don't understand what, you know,

01:16:53   maybe they just haven't gotten around to it.

01:16:54   I don't know if there's any actual resistance,

01:16:56   but if I had to pitch them, I'd say, look,

01:16:57   I know this is lower priority, and you should definitely

01:16:59   work on the other stuff, like cellular

01:17:00   and Always On Display first, but eventually,

01:17:03   I hope you do get to that.

01:17:04   And I do like this, these set of models,

01:17:07   I like that all the different materials are coming back,

01:17:10   but I share Marco's trepidation about titanium,

01:17:12   'cause just based on the pictures,

01:17:13   you can't tell anything about, you have to see it in person

01:17:15   to see whether you're gonna hate it or like it.

01:17:17   (upbeat music)

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01:19:01   from Squarespace.

01:19:02   The iPhone 11.

01:19:08   Now, this gets a little weird.

01:19:11   So last year, or this, I guess last year,

01:19:14   you had the XS, the XS Max, and the XR.

01:19:19   The iPhone 11 replaces the XR,

01:19:24   which is what we all expected,

01:19:26   but when we were listening to it in the keynote,

01:19:28   I got my wires crossed a couple times.

01:19:30   The iPhone 11, this is the replacement for the XR,

01:19:33   has an A13, anodized aluminum and glass,

01:19:37   seems like no writing on the back of it.

01:19:39   They touted several times,

01:19:40   toughest glass ever on a smartphone,

01:19:42   including a glass camera bump,

01:19:44   which they talked about for a while.

01:19:45   Six colors, purple, white, yellow, green, black,

01:19:47   and product red.

01:19:48   It remains at 6.1 inches.

01:19:50   It has haptic touch, spatial audio,

01:19:52   a U1 chip with directional air drop.

01:19:55   They did not release any sort of Apple tile yet.

01:19:59   30% better face ID, including better angles.

01:20:02   And it has two cameras instead of the one

01:20:05   from the XR last year.

01:20:06   It has the wide camera, which is F1.8,

01:20:09   and the ultra wide camera,

01:20:11   which is F2 point something or other.

01:20:13   They also are introducing night mode across the iPhone line.

01:20:16   This is like night sight or whatever Google calls it.

01:20:19   - This one deserves a finally.

01:20:21   - Yeah, that sounds great.

01:20:22   And I'm really anxious to try this.

01:20:25   They did a video demo of old muscle cars on salt flats,

01:20:28   which I was definitely there for, loved it.

01:20:32   I should go back a half step, I'm sorry.

01:20:34   Night mode from what I've gathered does have a live preview,

01:20:37   which Android does not do.

01:20:39   I have not verified that,

01:20:41   but I have heard rumblings that that's the case.

01:20:44   - Yeah, I saw a video of it being done.

01:20:46   It does show something on the screen.

01:20:48   The other thing that I saw,

01:20:50   I think it was the MKBHD video,

01:20:52   like you can't turn on night mode.

01:20:54   It automatically turns on when the light gets dim.

01:20:57   So in the Apple room, you have to put your hand

01:20:59   over the phone to trip the sensors

01:21:01   to make it think it's dark.

01:21:02   But once you did that, you could see a live view

01:21:04   of the palm of his hand in the thing.

01:21:07   It wasn't a great demo,

01:21:09   but those two features are weird,

01:21:10   like that Apple wouldn't actually have a night mode switch.

01:21:14   It would only go on automatically.

01:21:15   I wonder if it's gonna make people not realize.

01:21:17   It doesn't go on automatically.

01:21:18   What happens is UI appears.

01:21:21   So the UI to turn on night mode appears,

01:21:23   but it only appears on the screen when it is dark enough

01:21:26   that it is a valid thing to do.

01:21:27   It's a little strange.

01:21:28   - I think it's great.

01:21:29   If it was something that you had to go specifically turn on

01:21:34   that would work totally differently,

01:21:35   I feel like people wouldn't know about it.

01:21:37   - But you do have to turn it on.

01:21:39   You have to notice that a new UI blob

01:21:40   has appeared on the screen

01:21:41   and you have to tap it to turn on night mode.

01:21:44   I don't know, I mean, I'm sure it'll work itself out.

01:21:45   Like the camera UI, despite it being a little bit wonky,

01:21:48   it's so frequently used that people eventually figure it out.

01:21:50   I hope people figure it out.

01:21:51   Like I'm still kind of amazed,

01:21:52   and I think we've all seen this in years past

01:21:55   of like when they rejiggered the camera UI

01:21:58   and people would be like touching or swiping

01:22:01   on the individual words to change modes,

01:22:02   not realizing that you could essentially swipe

01:22:04   on the entire screen or the whole bottom of the screen

01:22:06   to change modes.

01:22:07   Like it's not an obvious UI.

01:22:08   It's Apple Snapchat basically.

01:22:10   Where there's lots of non-obvious ways

01:22:12   you can interact with it, but the obvious way will work.

01:22:15   So it's a fairly friendly UI,

01:22:17   but the obvious way is also harder than the non-obvious way,

01:22:21   which is like, you don't realize it,

01:22:22   but you can swipe anywhere and you can just jab over here

01:22:25   and get this control.

01:22:26   Anyway, they've continued to advance that UI.

01:22:28   And I think it looks a little bit nicer than it did,

01:22:31   but I'm wondering if they're stringing against the limits

01:22:33   of what you can do in a camera UI.

01:22:35   - Indeed, extended dynamic range video at 4K

01:22:39   at 60 frames a second.

01:22:40   - I love that, before you go past that.

01:22:43   I love that because here's, so this is what this means.

01:22:45   A lot of people missed this last year.

01:22:47   When the iPhone XS and XS Max generation and XR,

01:22:51   when those were introduced last year,

01:22:53   they added a feature, so I believe it was the X

01:22:55   that first added 4K 60, but then the XS and XS Max and XR,

01:23:00   when you were shooting at only 30 frames a second,

01:23:04   the sensor was still taking 60 frames a second video,

01:23:07   and what it would do would be it would take,

01:23:09   it would alternate between a high exposure

01:23:11   and a low exposure with every frame it captured,

01:23:13   and then merge them live into basically almost like an HDR,

01:23:18   like so what they're calling extended dynamic range,

01:23:22   merge it into a video that had more dynamic range

01:23:24   because it's basically doing exposure bracketing live

01:23:27   with every two frames that it was shooting

01:23:30   to take the 4K 60 sensor and make 30 frames a second video.

01:23:34   This wouldn't happen, because it couldn't,

01:23:37   if you were shooting at 4K 60.

01:23:39   I like to shoot 4K 60 because it looks lifelike

01:23:44   and I have all the resolution and it's wonderful,

01:23:46   and I know it doesn't look right for cinematic purposes,

01:23:49   but for home videos, it looks amazing

01:23:51   'cause it looks like you're really there, and I love it,

01:23:53   and so I love shooting 4K 60,

01:23:54   but I was always torn between should I go change it

01:23:58   and toggle it off when I'm shooting video in the sunset,

01:24:02   when I want more dynamic range,

01:24:04   'cause you had to choose with the 10S generation,

01:24:07   you had to choose do I want 60 frames a second

01:24:10   or do I want nice dynamic range?

01:24:13   And with the 11 generation now,

01:24:16   they have removed the need to make that choice.

01:24:19   It seems like what I'm guessing, the way it's implemented,

01:24:21   I'm guessing the sensor is just running at 4K 120

01:24:23   the whole time and outputting 4K 60,

01:24:25   but whatever it is, you can now do 4K 60

01:24:28   with the extended dynamic range.

01:24:31   However they're doing it, they didn't really say

01:24:33   how this was achieved, but the way they were talking about it

01:24:37   makes it sound like that's what this is,

01:24:40   and so that's a great thing for me,

01:24:42   'cause in the same way that when 4K 60

01:24:45   finally came out with the 10,

01:24:47   I no longer had to choose with every video

01:24:50   do I want high resolution or high frame rate.

01:24:52   I could have both.

01:24:53   Now with the 11, I don't have to choose

01:24:56   do I want good dynamic range or do I want 4K 60.

01:25:00   Now I can have both, and that's really cool.

01:25:03   - Yeah, I'm super excited for this

01:25:04   'cause I'm rocking an iPhone 10, as is Aaron.

01:25:07   It seemed imprudent last year to have just quit my job

01:25:11   and then spend a whole bunch of money on hardware,

01:25:13   but now that I know I am not yet in the poor house,

01:25:15   I am going to put myself in the poor house

01:25:17   with all of this new Apple hardware.

01:25:18   - Well you're not getting an 11, right?

01:25:21   - Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

01:25:22   - You're getting an 11 Pro, right?

01:25:23   - Oh, I'm sorry, no, I misread your question.

01:25:25   - You're already confusing yourself again.

01:25:26   - I am, I am, I'm telling you, I know what my deal is.

01:25:29   - Can we take a moment to appreciate

01:25:31   what Apple has done here?

01:25:32   This is really something.

01:25:33   When the 10 came out, it was like this is the phone

01:25:36   that you should get if you care about iPhones.

01:25:38   This is amazing and this is the new,

01:25:40   'cause there used to only be one new phone every year

01:25:43   that you would wanna get.

01:25:45   It came in two sizes for a while,

01:25:46   but there was one good flagship iPhone

01:25:50   that came out every year.

01:25:51   And then when the 10 came out,

01:25:53   they had this weird thing with the 10 and the 8,

01:25:56   and then when the 10s came out,

01:25:57   they had the weird thing with the 10s and then the 10r,

01:26:00   and the 10r and the 8 were both kind of like,

01:26:04   here's the low-end one, that's the afterthought,

01:26:06   after we spent all the attention on the nice big new one.

01:26:09   People don't like buying the afterthought.

01:26:10   It isn't a great feeling to go into the store

01:26:13   and be like, well, there's the one I actually want,

01:26:15   but it's too expensive, so I'm gonna buy the cheap one.

01:26:17   Apple had to make the cheap one sound good again.

01:26:21   And what they did here, I think, was masterful in like,

01:26:26   it isn't some secondary name.

01:26:28   It isn't like, the iPhone special, the iPhone C,

01:26:32   like, you know, nothing like that.

01:26:33   It's just, this is the iPhone 11.

01:26:37   There's also the Pro over there,

01:26:38   but this is the iPhone 11.

01:26:40   And it is the new 10r.

01:26:42   It is the new, I say cheap, but you know, it's lower end,

01:26:45   I guess it's the less expensive phone.

01:26:48   It's the phone that's at the price

01:26:50   that the expensive phones used to be.

01:26:52   (laughs)

01:26:53   But they really very hard positioned the 11

01:26:58   as this is the regular one,

01:27:01   this is the one you should probably buy.

01:27:04   And I think that's really smart,

01:27:05   because it reflects what the market really wanted,

01:27:07   which is like, okay, you made these super expensive ones

01:27:09   at the high end, that's nice for the nerds

01:27:12   and the rich people, but for everyone else,

01:27:13   like, we don't really want our phone to cost that much.

01:27:16   We'd rather have this other one.

01:27:17   So they marketed the 11 series in such a way

01:27:21   that doesn't make all those buyers feel bad

01:27:24   about what they're gonna buy.

01:27:25   It makes the 11 the default choice,

01:27:28   instead of trying to make the expensive one the default

01:27:32   and then having people say, ooh, that's too expensive,

01:27:35   cut it down for me, you know.

01:27:37   Now it's like, we're gonna come in at like the quote,

01:27:39   regular price of the $700-ish range

01:27:42   that these now sit at again, and say, all right,

01:27:45   the 11 is the default phone, you shouldn't,

01:27:47   nobody should feel bad about choosing the 11,

01:27:50   it's great, it's the new iPhone, period.

01:27:53   And also we have these other ones over here,

01:27:54   but the 11 is the new iPhone, period.

01:27:57   - I think they did a pretty good job with the XR and XS,

01:27:59   like obviously the 8 was the, you know, also ran silly,

01:28:01   like it was so clear that it was the lesser phone,

01:28:03   but the XR and the XS, like, both of them are modified,

01:28:08   neither is just the X, they both have a letter.

01:28:11   Obviously the letter is one earlier in the alphabet

01:28:14   for the lesser phone, right?

01:28:16   But the important thing about them

01:28:19   was that they had essentially the same system on a chip,

01:28:22   like it wasn't like a last year's CPU, GPU combo,

01:28:25   it wasn't, you know, like it was lesser

01:28:27   so it could be lower priced and it had one letter less,

01:28:30   but the insides didn't make you feel

01:28:32   like you were buying an iPhone 8.

01:28:33   And I think that experiment of having them

01:28:36   both be equally adorned, they both had a letter after them,

01:28:40   was to figure out, you know, 'cause the 8 is like,

01:28:43   well, whatever, you know, we know the deal with the 8,

01:28:44   and it totally looked different, didn't have the,

01:28:46   you know, had touch ID and all that stuff,

01:28:48   that's not much of an experiment.

01:28:49   This experiment was, which one will people actually buy?

01:28:52   And I think the consensus is that the XR

01:28:54   sold really, really well.

01:28:56   And so that gives them the confidence

01:28:58   to do this move this time, it's like, all right,

01:29:00   no more suffixes, and the completely unadorned one

01:29:04   is the default, and that's the XR, why?

01:29:06   Because we know people love that phone.

01:29:08   We know 'cause they bought tons of XRs, right?

01:29:10   And the same strategy, it doesn't have lesser system

01:29:14   on a chip, it's got the A13, right?

01:29:16   It has one fewer camera, LCD instead of all,

01:29:18   it's the XR formula all over again.

01:29:20   It has just graduated to now,

01:29:22   now there is a distinction in games.

01:29:24   One name is unadorned, and the one that's unadorned

01:29:26   is not the fancy one, it's the slightly less fancy one, so.

01:29:30   I think like its trial run and then XR was just to see,

01:29:33   'cause for all we knew, the XR could have been a dud,

01:29:35   and it was like, oh no, everyone wants the XS

01:29:37   because the world like magically detects that one's better.

01:29:39   Or it could have even been the people prefer the XS

01:29:41   because it's a smaller size,

01:29:42   which is a thing a lot of people forget, but it is.

01:29:44   But maybe they like the bigger one,

01:29:45   and I feel like the people have spoken with their wallets

01:29:48   and what they've said is, we love the XR,

01:29:51   and so now it gets to be the iPhone 11,

01:29:52   and I think that's fine,

01:29:53   even though I think it's slightly too big for me.

01:29:56   - Yeah.

01:29:57   We also should mention that it has the return

01:30:01   of the Quick Take camera,

01:30:02   which I'm sure Jon has thoughts about.

01:30:05   That is, when you take video, it used to be that

01:30:08   to do a burst, you would tap and hold on the shutter,

01:30:11   and it would just click, click, click, click, click, click,

01:30:13   and generate a mile long burst,

01:30:15   which if you have small kids, happens all the time.

01:30:17   Now, instead, if you tap and hold, you'll get a video,

01:30:21   which I think is really great, actually,

01:30:22   and nobody really knew if burst mode died or not,

01:30:25   but apparently, I believe it's if you swipe left,

01:30:28   you get burst mode, so you tap and hold and swipe left

01:30:31   or something like that. - It's Snapchat.

01:30:32   Don't you?

01:30:33   - Yeah, you're not wrong.

01:30:34   But yeah, Quick Take is back, Jon.

01:30:36   You excited?

01:30:37   - Yeah, I think I missed that.

01:30:38   Did they actually intercap it,

01:30:39   just like the digital camera?

01:30:41   - I don't know.

01:30:42   - Didn't even see, and then, no, it's just not intercapped,

01:30:43   but yeah, they can reuse names.

01:30:45   No one remembers the Quick Take cameras, come on.

01:30:47   And they weren't good anyway, so it's fine.

01:30:50   - Fair enough.

01:30:51   They also said, "Faster Face ID, Wi-Fi 6,"

01:30:54   whatever that means, and it starts at 700 bucks.

01:30:57   This is a really compelling phone,

01:30:59   and I gotta tell you, my mom has a XR,

01:31:02   and I think you said it a minute ago, Jon,

01:31:04   it's a little too big for me.

01:31:05   I'm not entirely in love with the XS/11 Pro

01:31:10   regular-sized version.

01:31:12   I think that's even a little too big for me, too,

01:31:14   but it works.

01:31:15   The XR is definitely too big for me,

01:31:19   but that said, what a great and compelling phone

01:31:22   for any normal person who doesn't like setting money on fire.

01:31:25   I really think that, as you guys had talked about earlier,

01:31:28   this is the correct default choice,

01:31:31   and only if you really, really, really have needs,

01:31:34   including setting money on fire,

01:31:36   should you even consider the 11 Pro.

01:31:38   - It's $100 less, right?

01:31:40   The XR started at 799, and this starts at 699?

01:31:43   Oh, yeah, Ben Thompson had a really great piece on that.

01:31:46   - Yeah, it actually is cheaper.

01:31:48   - Yeah, so it is a rare thing that happens.

01:31:51   About this phone, the back of the XR was also glass, right?

01:31:55   But this has the glass with the much larger camera bump

01:32:00   to fit all the extra cameras,

01:32:01   which was kind of weird that the iPhone 11

01:32:04   gets the same size camera bump,

01:32:05   even though it has one fewer camera in it, but anyway.

01:32:09   That whole idea of carving out the glass on the back

01:32:12   to handle the bump is, I think,

01:32:14   they're coming up with more and more clever ways

01:32:16   of sort of minimizing the facial blemish

01:32:19   that is the camera bump, right?

01:32:21   It's like, you want, it's gonna be there.

01:32:23   It's like my nose, it's gonna be there,

01:32:25   but makeup, you can minimize it, right, if you want to.

01:32:27   I think that is successful, at least in the pictures.

01:32:31   We'll see how successful it is in real life.

01:32:33   But the other thing about this sort of

01:32:35   milled from a single thick piece of glass back

01:32:38   that I thought they fumbled in the presentation

01:32:40   was that their video, I think this was the 11,

01:32:43   their video for it was showing the 11

01:32:45   getting chucked into people's purses

01:32:46   and getting things spilled on it

01:32:48   and falling off of tables and all sorts of stuff

01:32:52   that was talking about the durability.

01:32:54   But they didn't, they didn't back that up

01:32:58   as part of the presentation.

01:33:00   Yeah, they mentioned toughest glass, whatever,

01:33:01   but it was just sort of a drive-by.

01:33:03   Is the pitch that the iPhone 11

01:33:05   is substantially more durable than the XR

01:33:07   how much more durable and why?

01:33:10   I think that would be a great pitch.

01:33:11   People break their phones all the time,

01:33:12   especially ones that are made of glass,

01:33:14   and they could lean into this and say,

01:33:15   yeah, we continue making them out of glass,

01:33:17   and you know why?

01:33:18   'Cause it's incredibly tough,

01:33:19   and this phone is even tougher than before.

01:33:22   Put some numbers behind it, but they didn't.

01:33:24   They just went with the advertising thing of,

01:33:25   like, look, if we show you the phone

01:33:27   being jostled and dropped, or like,

01:33:29   again, put it in the purse with a bunch of other stuff,

01:33:31   like your keys and whatever that are scratching up against it

01:33:33   is it more scratch-resistant?

01:33:35   Is it gonna get scratched up?

01:33:36   Is it more scratch-resistant than these similar glass phones?

01:33:39   Like, what are you trying to say here?

01:33:40   Like, they made that video,

01:33:42   but then they didn't back it up.

01:33:44   I'm hoping that the truth is that it is more durable

01:33:47   than the XR was.

01:33:49   I think glass is pretty good in terms of scratch-resistance.

01:33:51   It's why they make the screen out of it,

01:33:53   and making the back out of it is a good idea.

01:33:55   I have no idea how it's gonna do in terms of shattering.

01:33:57   Like, they showed it being dropped by a little robot,

01:33:59   but they didn't put any numbers behind it,

01:34:00   and I felt like that was a missed opportunity,

01:34:03   because I think the 11 is a great phone.

01:34:07   I think it has all the things.

01:34:09   I think it looks nice and fancy.

01:34:11   I think the things that it's missing

01:34:12   are things that most people probably don't care about

01:34:15   and probably shouldn't care about,

01:34:16   and I think despite it being a size

01:34:18   that Casey and I are not into,

01:34:20   it's probably the right size for most people,

01:34:21   because people seem to like really big phones.

01:34:23   Setting aside the always angry and untapped world

01:34:27   of people who want smaller phones,

01:34:29   this iPhone 11 looks like a great phone.

01:34:32   - Yeah, I really agree.

01:34:35   - We'll get to the Pro in a second,

01:34:36   but honestly, for the 11 and the 11 Pro,

01:34:38   I think these are very impressive phones,

01:34:40   and I like the colors of the XR better,

01:34:43   but I'm happy to see them change up the color scheme

01:34:45   from year to year.

01:34:46   If they wanna go for a more pale pastel thing

01:34:48   with the frosty camera bump and the glossy back on the 11,

01:34:53   fine, that's good for this year.

01:34:55   We'll change up next year.

01:34:57   - Yeah, I don't think the colors are quite as good.

01:34:59   I agree with you there, but I do like

01:35:01   that there are a bunch of colors for these phones,

01:35:03   and I do wish, even as someone who has literally

01:35:05   never bought any phone other than black for himself,

01:35:07   I do wish that the most fancy models had more colors,

01:35:12   which we'll talk about basically right now.

01:35:14   Okay, iPhone 11 Pro, this is what I will be getting.

01:35:17   The line that I copied down in the notes,

01:35:20   which I think is verbatim, this is from Phil Schiller,

01:35:23   this is for people who want the best product made

01:35:26   even if we are not a Pro,

01:35:28   which I don't really care for the Pro name

01:35:31   because I think it means so many different things

01:35:34   in so many different cases to Apple,

01:35:35   but I thought that was a pretty good way to pitch it,

01:35:38   so I'm kind of on board with that.

01:35:40   Most of this is the same with the 11.

01:35:43   The difference is the color, which--

01:35:46   - It's not the same with the 11.

01:35:47   It's the same with the XS.

01:35:49   - Well, sure.

01:35:50   - Right, 'cause it's totally,

01:35:52   this is another source of confusion.

01:35:54   Some people were adamant that the iPhone 11 Pro

01:35:57   was the same size as the XR 'cause they're close enough

01:36:00   and it's hard to see in pictures, right?

01:36:01   So the XR is more or less the same size

01:36:05   and shape as the iPhone 11,

01:36:07   and the XS is more or less the same size

01:36:08   and shape as the 11 Pro.

01:36:09   This'll all be much easier next year with the 12s

01:36:11   when we presumably go into a more sane numbering scheme.

01:36:14   But yeah, the construction of this phone

01:36:17   is very much like the XS.

01:36:19   The thing that they share, I guess,

01:36:20   is the frosted glass back.

01:36:21   - Yeah, what I was trying to say is all the features

01:36:24   are more like the 11, but that was very ambiguous of me.

01:36:26   Yes, this is physically far more like the XS,

01:36:31   but the feature set is almost exactly the same as the 11.

01:36:36   So the difference between the 11 and the 11 Pro,

01:36:39   the color, which extends into the camera bump on the 11 Pro,

01:36:42   midnight green, space gray, silver, and gold,

01:36:45   I don't really, on my list of favorite colors,

01:36:48   green is not high up on this list, but man.

01:36:52   - How do you feel about midnight green?

01:36:53   It's not regular green.

01:36:54   - Who had green on the bingo card?

01:36:56   Like if you had to pick, all right,

01:36:58   on the high-end phones,

01:36:59   they're gonna introduce one new color.

01:37:01   What's it gonna be?

01:37:02   Who the hell would have ever picked dark green?

01:37:05   - So I think someone, what I had heard

01:37:07   is that this is a popular color in China.

01:37:09   So obviously we don't know that,

01:37:11   but if that, maybe someone who knew us more

01:37:13   about the current phone scene in China

01:37:15   or Chinese culture could have predicted that.

01:37:18   'Cause usually, there's usually one phone

01:37:19   that's like the China color.

01:37:21   Like that's like, what is popular with the country

01:37:24   with like billions of people in it,

01:37:25   it totally makes sense for them to cater to that.

01:37:27   And when something is inexplicable to us in the US,

01:37:30   I think maybe it's something, you know,

01:37:32   and I don't know if that's true.

01:37:33   We'll find out in, you know,

01:37:34   someone will send us a follow-up or whatever,

01:37:35   but once I heard that, I'm like, oh, that makes total sense.

01:37:38   This is not for you.

01:37:39   - So I've heard from people that have seen it in person

01:37:43   that it is very similar to British racing green,

01:37:46   which a lot of people even outside Britain have.

01:37:49   Hey, this is what I'm being told,

01:37:50   this is what people have seen it.

01:37:52   People even outside Britain have a lot of affinity for that.

01:37:54   I gotta tell you, I'm a little worried

01:37:57   about the pre-orders being sold out of green immediately

01:38:01   because oh my God, I want the green.

01:38:04   I am not even kidding.

01:38:05   This would be the worst time.

01:38:06   - I've been trying to talk my wife out of the green.

01:38:08   Let me tell you why, right?

01:38:09   It's not that I have anything against the green,

01:38:12   but maybe this doesn't apply to you, but here.

01:38:15   So I mentioned this in the notes

01:38:16   and this is true of the 11 and the 11 Pro,

01:38:18   that the color is, basically what we're talking about,

01:38:21   the color is on the back 'cause the front has no color.

01:38:23   It's like an edge to edge screen.

01:38:24   And then, you know, the color is basically

01:38:26   the back and the sides, the back case thing, all right?

01:38:29   And on both of these phones,

01:38:30   'cause it's a single piece of glass

01:38:31   that they shaved down to make the camera bump,

01:38:33   the camera bump is the same color

01:38:35   as the rest of the back of the phone.

01:38:38   If you're going to put a case on this

01:38:40   and you choose midnight green,

01:38:42   now you kinda have to deal with the fact

01:38:44   that there's gonna be a fairly large square

01:38:46   on the back of your phone

01:38:47   that's going to be substantially midnight green.

01:38:50   And that's not a neutral color.

01:38:51   Now I know the green is very subtle

01:38:53   and it barely looks green,

01:38:55   but I'm just saying from a fashion perspective,

01:38:57   getting your phone in a neutral color,

01:38:59   it's a lot easier to accessorize.

01:39:01   You can have, my wife has multiple cases.

01:39:05   She's got a red case, she's got a purple case,

01:39:07   she's got a peach case.

01:39:08   If you get a silver phone or a black phone,

01:39:09   you can put any of those colors on it and it goes.

01:39:12   If you get a midnight green phone,

01:39:13   as much as you may love that peach case,

01:39:16   how do you feel with a pale green lump

01:39:19   sticking out of it in the corner?

01:39:21   - Okay, first of all, if I were to get a case for this,

01:39:23   which I might go back to being caseless, casy-less,

01:39:26   we'll see what happens.

01:39:27   - Hey!

01:39:28   - If I go with a case for this,

01:39:30   it will either be the clear case

01:39:33   or a black leather case where I don't think that it'll be--

01:39:35   - So you're not neutral with the case, you don't have,

01:39:37   I guess if you don't wanna accessorize with fun cases

01:39:40   and you're just gonna get a neutral case,

01:39:42   then I suppose, then you're just left

01:39:43   with a kind of an ugly green phone.

01:39:45   - No, I don't.

01:39:46   - Well, see, but I think it looks,

01:39:48   having never seen it in person, Apple,

01:39:49   I would love to go to the store tomorrow and see it,

01:39:51   hint, hint.

01:39:52   But having not seen it in person,

01:39:54   it looks really good to me,

01:39:55   and so I will be ordering a midnight green for myself

01:39:58   unless it's sold out instantly like Jet Black was,

01:40:00   in which case I'll just get black like I always do,

01:40:01   or space gray as I always do.

01:40:03   - Having not seen these in person,

01:40:05   I'm always attracted to the white one that's not white.

01:40:09   Whatever they call it, silver,

01:40:11   but it always looks white in Apple's photos.

01:40:13   What do they call it?

01:40:14   They call it silver.

01:40:14   - Silver, yeah.

01:40:15   - They have made white phones in the past.

01:40:18   The iPhone 4 was white and everything.

01:40:19   I kind of like that look,

01:40:20   and I almost bought my XS in that color,

01:40:23   but the XS, the silver was kind of like,

01:40:27   I don't know, like uncooked shrimp color.

01:40:29   It was just kind of like pale, translucent, grayish,

01:40:33   and I couldn't pull the trigger on it.

01:40:34   But in Apple's publicity shots,

01:40:36   once again, the silver looks really cool in white.

01:40:38   I'll have to see what it looks like.

01:40:39   I'm not getting this funny, whatever I care.

01:40:41   But that's the phone that stood out to me.

01:40:44   But I do definitely also want to see them in person

01:40:46   because I want to feel the frosted glass.

01:40:49   We're getting reports that it feels good

01:40:51   from the people who are there,

01:40:52   but it's kind of, I'm thinking of Marco

01:40:54   and his grippy, polished iPhone 7

01:40:57   that he used without a case.

01:40:59   I don't know how, I can imagine Matt being more slippery

01:41:02   than that grippy one,

01:41:03   but I guess we'll all have to just hold them and find out.

01:41:06   - Yeah, I'm really looking forward to this.

01:41:08   - Few things.

01:41:09   Number one, I did get the silver/white one

01:41:14   for the XS and the X before that,

01:41:17   and I like it a lot.

01:41:19   The reason I got it in the first place on the X

01:41:21   is that, it was a combination of factors.

01:41:23   Number one was that I like the shiny silver band

01:41:27   around the sides better than the black band

01:41:29   on the space gray one.

01:41:30   And I also just think the space gray X series phones

01:41:35   just look really, just like, here's a blob of black.

01:41:38   The front is black, the sides are black,

01:41:40   the back is black, it's all just a big blob of black.

01:41:43   And I feel like this industrial design looks better

01:41:47   when you have the contrast of that shiny edge

01:41:49   to the black screen to a light back.

01:41:51   I just think it looks better that way.

01:41:53   That being said, I will say to Casey,

01:41:57   I encourage you to get the green.

01:41:59   Go bold, get the new color, because look--

01:42:02   - It's not a bold green, though.

01:42:04   - I know, it really isn't.

01:42:05   I mean, if you wanna go bold, get the XR, actually.

01:42:08   It's much, much more bold.

01:42:09   I don't mean the 11, I mean the XR.

01:42:11   But anyway, we nerds, look, again, I'm one of you here.

01:42:16   I'm speaking with you, not at you.

01:42:19   We tend to default to just black everything.

01:42:21   We're obsessed with black, black mode, dark mode,

01:42:24   black shirts, black cars, all this stuff,

01:42:25   black everything, black phones, black iPads.

01:42:28   In the last couple of years,

01:42:30   I started buying the light ones again.

01:42:32   And I kinda like it.

01:42:33   I feel like I'm tired of black.

01:42:36   There's too much black everywhere.

01:42:37   Everything I am as a nerd, it's always black.

01:42:39   I bought a red car a few years ago, I love it.

01:42:42   Now I'm buying white phones, I love those.

01:42:45   I look at the MacBook Air and I'm like,

01:42:46   "Wow, the global looks pretty good."

01:42:47   (laughs)

01:42:49   - Let's not go too far.

01:42:49   - I encourage you all out there,

01:42:52   from Casey to the audience, John, you're hopeless,

01:42:56   but from Casey to the audience--

01:42:57   - I was making the exact same pitch.

01:43:00   I'm not hopeless.

01:43:01   - I encourage all of you, get a color.

01:43:03   Don't just get black, just mix it up sometime.

01:43:06   Get the gold if you like the gold.

01:43:08   Who knows, just everything in your entire life

01:43:10   doesn't have to be black.

01:43:12   I understand as a nerd, as a fashion challenge nerd especially,

01:43:17   that black is a safe choice.

01:43:19   You can buy black and you can know,

01:43:21   I'm never gonna have a mismatched case color

01:43:23   like what John was just talking about.

01:43:24   I'm never gonna have a fashion faux pas,

01:43:26   I'm never gonna mismatch, black goes with everything.

01:43:28   Yes, but--

01:43:28   - But yeah, it was a way for you to be able

01:43:31   to get a bold colored case, because that's how people

01:43:34   accessorize and express themselves.

01:43:35   So you can get a bright purple or a green or yellow

01:43:38   and you can get multiple cases,

01:43:39   which is a thing that I like to have.

01:43:40   She has multiple cases and they're all very bright colors

01:43:43   and she uses them all.

01:43:44   I'm saying if you get a neutral phone,

01:43:46   you are free to express yourself

01:43:48   with the boldest possible colors,

01:43:49   whereas if you get a green phone,

01:43:51   some of those bold colors are gonna look gross

01:43:53   with your cool case.

01:43:54   - That's fair.

01:43:55   I would say if your move is to let the case be your color,

01:44:00   I would say either go with silver,

01:44:04   which is the one I have, the white phone,

01:44:06   because then you have the nice neutral silver band

01:44:08   and the little bit of it that you see

01:44:09   poking out the bottom of most cases looks nicer,

01:44:12   or get gold, because gold matches cases

01:44:17   in a cool, different way.

01:44:19   Not every color case will look good with it.

01:44:21   - Yeah, it's more limiting than neutral,

01:44:23   but it's much better than green

01:44:25   in terms of you can accessorize with gold,

01:44:26   'cause she's got a gold watch and she has lots of bands

01:44:28   and lots of bands do look good with the gold watch.

01:44:30   - Yeah, yeah.

01:44:31   So yeah, I would just encourage you all, get some color.

01:44:34   If you're gonna get a case, as most people will,

01:44:37   it's funny, we all have so much focus on the colors here,

01:44:42   but the reality is 99.9% of these phones

01:44:46   are gonna go right into cases and never see the light of day.

01:44:48   I've been back on my XS ever since I switched

01:44:51   from shorts to pants for the last couple of weeks.

01:44:53   I've been back into caseless mode.

01:44:56   In shorts it just slides out too easily, the pockets,

01:44:59   but in pants I can do it.

01:45:01   And so I've been caseless for a little while now

01:45:03   and I like it a lot.

01:45:04   I'm looking around the world and noticing

01:45:07   how many other phones with no cases do I see in the world?

01:45:11   And I swear it's close to zero.

01:45:13   It might be zero.

01:45:16   I'm looking around, unless I'm hanging out

01:45:18   with John Gruber or an Apple staffer,

01:45:20   no one is using phones without cases out there.

01:45:25   Effectively no one.

01:45:28   It might be more than zero, but it's basically zero.

01:45:32   And so actually what matters more is

01:45:34   what color case do you put on it?

01:45:36   And most people aren't even using Apple's cases

01:45:40   and most non-Apple cases cover the bottom

01:45:43   of the phone as well and just have little cutouts

01:45:46   for the speakers.

01:45:46   - Yeah, those are the worst.

01:45:47   I do see a lot more clear cases though.

01:45:48   Have you seen a lot more clear cases?

01:45:50   Not just Apple but Android phones and everything.

01:45:51   I see more clear cases and I'm glad Apple's

01:45:53   getting in on that because that's the way

01:45:55   to have your cake and eat it too.

01:45:56   Make a bold phone color and then put a clear case on it.

01:45:59   You can let your bold color show.

01:46:01   I think it dims the bold color a little bit

01:46:04   as opposed to having a very bright case.

01:46:05   And I have to give this pitch for Apple's silicone cases

01:46:09   in very bright colors, they look amazing.

01:46:12   There's still the aging factor and some of them

01:46:13   if you get a white one it's gonna look amazing

01:46:15   for the first week and then not so much after that.

01:46:17   But the really strong purple and really bright red,

01:46:22   those things look great.

01:46:23   - And I would also say to all of you nerds out there,

01:46:25   when you do select a case, don't just get

01:46:27   the black Apple case.

01:46:29   - Oh, that's what I do every year.

01:46:31   - I know, but you're missing out.

01:46:33   Having a brightly colored phone is fun

01:46:35   and we all deserve to have some fun sometimes.

01:46:38   - Indeed, so I am all in on the midnight green.

01:46:43   Marco, what are you gonna be doing

01:46:44   'cause you will be buying one of these?

01:46:46   - I'm going white again, slash silver.

01:46:49   For all the reasons I can say, I like it a lot.

01:46:51   I respect the green as a choice, it's not for me.

01:46:55   And for most of the pictures the green looks very similar

01:46:57   to the space gray in how dark and relatively unsaturated

01:47:02   it is and from what people are saying

01:47:05   who are in the hands-on, basically they say

01:47:07   the similar thing of it's very similar to space gray.

01:47:09   And so for all the same reasons I don't want space gray,

01:47:13   I don't want the green either.

01:47:15   I would love, I really hope someday they make a product red,

01:47:19   high-end phone 'cause I think the red XR looked fantastic.

01:47:24   And I haven't seen the red 11 yet,

01:47:25   but it probably also looks fantastic.

01:47:27   I would love a red phone.

01:47:28   Red is my color, if I'm gonna have a color,

01:47:30   it's gonna be red, but unfortunately it's not available.

01:47:35   - Yeah, so these come in two models, the iPhone 11 Pro,

01:47:39   the 5.8 inch and 6.5 inch, which is called the Pro Max.

01:47:42   Again, I don't love these names, but I understand them.

01:47:45   We talked about that a lot last episode,

01:47:47   so I don't think there's too much to go into here.

01:47:49   No 3D touch, which bums me out.

01:47:51   I might be the only person that uses 3D touch

01:47:55   and likes it a lot for peak and pop among other things.

01:47:58   So we'll see what this whole haptic touch thing is all about.

01:48:01   I know a lot of you have lived with it already,

01:48:03   but I have not.

01:48:04   - It's a long press.

01:48:05   - Yeah, I mean, I'm sure it'll be fine.

01:48:07   I'm bummed about not being able to move the cursor

01:48:10   quite so easily on the keyboard,

01:48:12   or at least, or maybe I just don't understand it yet.

01:48:14   We'll see what happens when I get the phone.

01:48:15   - Well, I think you long press the space bar now, right?

01:48:18   - Yeah, something like that.

01:48:19   - I mean, and honestly, I think that's fine.

01:48:21   3D touch has always been a little problematic.

01:48:26   Not only, people always try to speculate,

01:48:29   like what do normal people think?

01:48:31   What can normal people understand and not understand?

01:48:33   But I don't even need to go there.

01:48:35   I had a hard time with 3D touch all the time.

01:48:38   I so often accidentally invoke it,

01:48:41   or can't get it to invoke right,

01:48:44   and it interferes with so many things.

01:48:45   It interferes with holding down

01:48:48   for long press menus on links in Safari.

01:48:50   It interferes with moving icons in jiggle mode.

01:48:53   There's so much around the OS and in apps

01:48:57   that 3D touch just gets in the way or delays,

01:49:00   and so many invocations of 3D touch for me over the years

01:49:04   have been accidental or have failed.

01:49:06   I can't even imagine what normal people are going through

01:49:09   if I, as a fairly dexterous expert

01:49:13   on how these platforms work,

01:49:16   even I mess it up tons of the time.

01:49:20   I can't even imagine how the rest

01:49:22   of the iPhone population does with it.

01:49:24   So I think removing it is probably the right call,

01:49:28   and that they probably found like, you know what,

01:49:30   most people aren't using this,

01:49:32   or at least they aren't intentionally using this,

01:49:35   and they don't understand it, and it's too error prone,

01:49:37   and it gets in the way, and it makes conflicts,

01:49:39   and it makes everything actually harder to use

01:49:42   for most of the time.

01:49:43   So I think it's the right move to remove 3D touch.

01:49:47   It was a cool idea.

01:49:48   It was fun as a few little shortcuts here and there.

01:49:50   Ultimately, we're probably not gonna miss it much.

01:49:54   - I think even I won't miss it.

01:49:56   I think I'll get used to the new world,

01:49:58   but sitting here now, I feel like I'm going to miss it,

01:50:02   and it just bums me out.

01:50:03   - I would like to hear the tell-all book about the decision

01:50:06   because we know there's also a technical aspect of this.

01:50:08   You need sensors to do the pressure sensitivity,

01:50:12   and apparently it was hard to put them on the iPads

01:50:15   because the screen would flex or whatever,

01:50:17   so there is that angle on it,

01:50:18   but at the Marcos point, there's also the metrics.

01:50:22   I'm sure they measure how much people use 3D touch,

01:50:24   and I've not seen people using it that much,

01:50:27   so I bet it didn't get much usage,

01:50:28   and it was an engineering, not difficulty,

01:50:32   but another thing you had to deal with engineering-wise,

01:50:34   and it was potentially a semi-permanent difference

01:50:37   between iPads and iPhones, so all that combines to say no,

01:50:41   but I would love to know what the ratio is.

01:50:42   Was it mostly an engineering decision

01:50:43   about sensors and the screen,

01:50:45   or was it mostly that nobody's using it?

01:50:46   And the reason I'm thinking about that

01:50:48   is because I think about, you know,

01:50:50   Marco just explained the reasoning

01:50:51   of why you would think it was good to get rid of it.

01:50:53   I'm thinking about the touch bar.

01:50:55   How many people use the touch bar,

01:50:56   and how easy is it to use,

01:50:57   and what benefits does it provide?

01:50:58   'Cause Apple could go the other way and say,

01:51:01   not enough people are using 3D touch.

01:51:02   We need to push it harder.

01:51:04   We need to revise the APIs.

01:51:05   We need to integrate it into more parts of the system

01:51:07   because we need to let people know how awesome 3D touch is,

01:51:09   and then we need to get them to use it more.

01:51:10   That's not the approach they took with 3D touch.

01:51:13   Kind of the approach they took with the touch bar,

01:51:14   which is it's gonna be on our laptops.

01:51:16   You're just gonna deal with it,

01:51:17   and we're gonna still tell you

01:51:18   that you need to support it in your apps,

01:51:20   albeit in a slightly more half-hearted way

01:51:23   than they've done with other technologies.

01:51:24   So I was wondering, like, how do they decide

01:51:27   which of their technologies are taking off?

01:51:29   What criteria do they use to decide,

01:51:30   we're gonna keep pushing this?

01:51:31   We think it has legs.

01:51:33   We think it's just a matter of education,

01:51:35   or we're just gonna back off and say

01:51:36   a combination of factors tells us that we're, you know,

01:51:39   the 3D touch experiment has ended, and it's going away now.

01:51:42   - I think it's a combination of three things, right?

01:51:46   It's that nobody uses it.

01:51:48   It's the inconsistency between iPhone and iPad,

01:51:50   like you said, and it is a sensor

01:51:53   that adds both thickness and cost,

01:51:55   and I think the three of those things put together

01:51:57   would cause any, you know, any smart engineering team

01:52:01   to say, eh, is this really worth it?

01:52:03   - I think I'd say the same thing about the touch bar.

01:52:05   - Yeah, well, fair, fair. - Yep.

01:52:06   - But I would bet you the usage of the touch bar

01:52:08   is far higher than the usage of 3D touch,

01:52:10   which pains me, because I love 3D touch,

01:52:12   but again, I think I'm the only one.

01:52:13   - Yeah, I think you're right.

01:52:14   I mean, for one thing, you can see it.

01:52:15   - Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:52:16   (laughing)

01:52:17   You know, that helps a lot.

01:52:18   - Think about how much more accidental usage it gets.

01:52:20   - That's also probably true. - People brushing it

01:52:22   with their fingers.

01:52:23   And activating Siri, 'cause they don't know

01:52:25   how to customize it to get rid of that stupid thing.

01:52:27   - Yeah, all right, so the 11 pros have spatial audio,

01:52:31   and I am happy to announce that to match

01:52:34   your forthcoming monitors, gentlemen,

01:52:37   you have Super Ratna XDR.

01:52:40   - This is one case where Apple's marketing

01:52:42   just totally threw me for a loop in the moment,

01:52:44   'cause I'm like, what, I took it too seriously,

01:52:46   and I shouldn't have, like sometimes the marketing terms

01:52:49   mean something, and sometimes they don't,

01:52:51   and they even, I think they made reference

01:52:53   to the Mac Pro display, and it's like, what do you mean?

01:52:57   Like, at first I thought, so it's not OLED anymore,

01:52:59   because everything about the big cinema display XDR thing

01:53:03   is all about like, controlling, advanced control

01:53:07   of a dynamic backlight with clever gating

01:53:09   of that backlight to provide high contrast,

01:53:11   but control over the, like it's all about

01:53:13   LCD technology, OLEDs don't have a backlight,

01:53:16   so what are you even talking about?

01:53:17   I'm like, oh my god, they got rid of the OLED,

01:53:19   maybe the liquid retina display on the XR was so good

01:53:22   that the flagship phone now has an LCD,

01:53:26   and they're saying it's XDR technology,

01:53:27   'cause here's the thing about the cinema display XDR,

01:53:31   that technology works, like it's used

01:53:32   in reference displays, it's increasingly used

01:53:34   in televisions that are in the planning stages

01:53:36   or very high end televisions that you could buy now,

01:53:39   it actually has advantages over OLED,

01:53:41   but it's also really hot, really thick, and really expensive,

01:53:45   I'm like, but they couldn't have put that in a phone,

01:53:46   but the reason I entertained it at all is because like,

01:53:48   oh my god, they found a way to take the technology

01:53:51   from the cinema display XDR and squish it into a phone,

01:53:55   and now it's like the best of both,

01:53:56   no, it's just an OLED screen, they just put the letters,

01:53:59   they just put the letters on the end of it,

01:54:00   'cause it's the same letters they used before,

01:54:02   XDR means nothing, it doesn't mean 10R, 10DR,

01:54:05   it doesn't mean 10 Doctor, it's just a marketing thing

01:54:09   for a better OLED than they had last year, which is fine,

01:54:13   but boy, I was definitely thrown for a loop

01:54:16   for a period there during this presentation.

01:54:19   - But there is one consistent part of it,

01:54:21   the iPhone 11 Pro does not come with a stand.

01:54:24   (laughing)

01:54:26   - The stand is your hand.

01:54:27   - Well done.

01:54:28   All right, so this Super Retina XDR,

01:54:31   it does not have ProMotion, it's 1200 nits,

01:54:33   P3 wide color, HDR 10, Dolby Vision, Dolmi Atmos,

01:54:36   it's OLED, and it's apparently very durable,

01:54:39   but we don't really know in what ways.

01:54:42   - Yeah, they again mention the durability,

01:54:44   like oh, it's the most durable screen we made,

01:54:46   no, I bet it is.

01:54:47   - 'Cause they did run that whole video,

01:54:50   that little ad for the phone,

01:54:52   and durability was a huge focus of that.

01:54:55   So I thought it was interesting how little

01:54:57   they actually talked about durability.

01:54:59   - Yeah, so same thing with the 11,

01:55:01   I felt like there was a disconnect,

01:55:03   they had the content, they had the media for it,

01:55:06   they didn't have the spoken pitch,

01:55:08   they didn't even say how much more durable,

01:55:11   twice as durable, 10 times as durable,

01:55:14   the typical Apple thing would be to find

01:55:15   one particular test, like in our drop test,

01:55:18   it could be dropped from twice as high,

01:55:20   and not mention any other tests,

01:55:21   like what about your bend test,

01:55:22   what about your twist test, what about your crush test,

01:55:24   like just pick one test that it does better on

01:55:25   and give us a number, and we'll, you know,

01:55:27   anyway, we'll all find out when we use these phones.

01:55:29   I'm not a phone breaker, so I don't know

01:55:32   how durable the XS is compared to any past phones,

01:55:35   but these things will go out into the real world

01:55:37   and we'll find out, I'm hoping that, you know,

01:55:39   when they say it's more durable,

01:55:40   I'm sure that's pretty, you know, net net

01:55:42   of all the things they do to test their phones,

01:55:45   that this one is more durable, but in various times,

01:55:48   they have changed the characteristics of it,

01:55:51   we talked about it with the screen,

01:55:52   like if you make the screen softer,

01:55:55   it's less likely to shatter, but more likely

01:55:56   to get fine scratches on it, and they've swung

01:55:59   that needle in various directions,

01:56:01   does this change the equation, is this going more

01:56:04   towards a harder screen that shatters more

01:56:05   or going even farther in the softer screen

01:56:07   that nicks but doesn't shatter?

01:56:10   I don't know, we'll all find out when we get them

01:56:12   on our hands, but Apple was not very forthcoming,

01:56:13   but they, like, the reason it frustrated me

01:56:17   is this is a fruitful angle, a fruitful avenue

01:56:20   for advertising, this is a thing that resonates with users.

01:56:24   Everybody drops their phones, everybody like breaks them,

01:56:27   like Apple should be leaning on this heavily,

01:56:30   they just need to have a stronger pitch than a vague,

01:56:33   eh, it's pretty durable, like it's not strong.

01:56:35   - All right, so much better performance,

01:56:39   particularly in machine learning,

01:56:41   and way better low-power design.

01:56:44   I really did like, and no joke,

01:56:46   the like mini WWDC engineering session

01:56:48   about how they got this low-power design,

01:56:50   I thought it was really, really, really cool.

01:56:52   I don't know, I was gonna breeze past this,

01:56:56   but I assume, Jon, you're gonna have some thoughts about it.

01:56:58   - No, I mean, like, what they were saying

01:57:00   was sort of like a high-level version of all the same talks

01:57:03   that Intel and all the other, you know,

01:57:05   desktop chip manufacturers have been getting for years,

01:57:07   albeit in a more advanced form, I'm sure,

01:57:09   of like, this is how you make chips power-efficient,

01:57:11   you gotta only use the parts of it that you're using

01:57:13   and only run them as fast as they need to run,

01:57:15   and it's very complicated, like,

01:57:17   the desktop thing went from like,

01:57:18   we run the whole chip at the same speed all the time forever

01:57:21   as the starting point, and then it was like, okay,

01:57:23   but now we occasionally slow the whole chip down

01:57:26   and then speed the whole chip up,

01:57:26   and now we can speed up and slow down

01:57:30   two different sections of the chip,

01:57:31   and it just keep getting finer and finer and finer grain,

01:57:33   and their explanation is like, this is the state of the art,

01:57:35   like, at a very low level, we are just barely giving power

01:57:39   to the things that we need to run right now

01:57:41   and clocking them just as high as they need to be clocked,

01:57:43   and it's all famously complicated,

01:57:45   and like, I think the summary thing to say here,

01:57:48   and I've seen some people waffling on this,

01:57:50   and I understand how people are waffling,

01:57:52   Apple has the best system on the chips

01:57:53   of any phone manufacturer,

01:57:54   they have had the best ones for years and years,

01:57:56   they are dominating the industry

01:57:58   in such an embarrassing, ridiculous way

01:58:00   that it's not even a question.

01:58:01   If anybody says, oh, I kinda believe Apple's claims

01:58:04   they have the best chips, are you kidding me?

01:58:05   These chips on their phones are so far ahead

01:58:08   of anybody else in the industry, it's not even funny,

01:58:11   that, I mean, you can lose your lead just look at Intel,

01:58:14   but for now, let's just say that Apple has,

01:58:16   at the very least, maintained their lead,

01:58:18   which is substantial, if not extending it,

01:58:21   so, you know, good chips, as always.

01:58:24   - There's a fast charger in the box,

01:58:26   which is the 18-watt version,

01:58:29   and is this the exact same one that comes with the iPad Pro,

01:58:32   so it's USB-C out?

01:58:33   - I believe so, I mean, it has the same specs,

01:58:35   it looks the same, so it's probably the same one.

01:58:37   It is probably the 18-watt power charger

01:58:41   that came with the iPad Pro as of this past fall,

01:58:43   has a USB-C to Lightning cable,

01:58:45   which is, you know, finally, right?

01:58:47   Like, I'm disappointed that the entire phone isn't USB-C,

01:58:51   as we discussed last episode,

01:58:52   but I'm at least very happy there.

01:58:55   They took this baby step towards it.

01:58:57   You know, the 18-watt charger is a substantial step up

01:59:01   from the five-watt charger, and even the 10-watt iPad ones.

01:59:05   You do need USB-C, I believe, to reach those.

01:59:08   I don't think the USB-A specs allow that much power,

01:59:12   at least not without going to, like,

01:59:14   the weird, like, fast-charged Qualcomm things,

01:59:15   maybe, I don't know, but the regular ones don't.

01:59:18   So that's probably why they want USB-C.

01:59:21   I'm just happy.

01:59:22   The faster we can get to a USB-C world in the charging area,

01:59:26   the better, because it really is way better than A for that.

01:59:29   I wish the whole phone went to C, but oh well.

01:59:31   - The 11 doesn't get it, which is kind of disappointing.

01:59:33   - Right, only the Pro, which, I mean,

01:59:36   that's kind of a stupid little thing to be different,

01:59:38   if I'm honest.

01:59:39   Like, I don't think it's a significant cost difference.

01:59:43   It might be some kind of weird market segmentation thing.

01:59:46   I don't know, it's kind of a weird thing.

01:59:49   - Nevertheless, I am excited for it.

01:59:52   New reverse wireless charging, we had heard lots of rumors

01:59:54   that you'd be able to either charge AirPods

01:59:55   or charge even another phone from your phone.

01:59:58   Turns out that didn't ship.

01:59:59   There's rumors that we heard that it got pulled

02:00:01   at the last minute.

02:00:02   I have no idea if that's true or not,

02:00:04   but you know, it is what it is.

02:00:05   - That, see, I don't even care about that either.

02:00:07   Like, that-- - Nah, I don't either.

02:00:09   - Usually, the last thing I wanna do

02:00:12   is give up some of my phone's battery life.

02:00:16   - Yeah. - Like, I don't know

02:00:16   a lot of people who go around with so much extra phone

02:00:19   battery life all the time that they're willing to charge

02:00:22   other devices with their phone, even low power things.

02:00:25   - I would use it. - Of course you would.

02:00:26   But no normal human. - I've got access,

02:00:28   yeah, well, I've got access power on my phone,

02:00:31   and I very often, I carry sort of a combination.

02:00:33   I carry my AirPods and my phone with me

02:00:35   kind of in the same pocket, and sometimes I'll put

02:00:37   the phone down, and I'll take the AirPods out

02:00:40   and put them in the case, and I put the AirPod case

02:00:42   on the back of my phone, which is face down,

02:00:44   but they don't charge, but they could.

02:00:46   If they have, you know, 'cause the battery

02:00:48   in the AirPod case is so tiny, I know,

02:00:50   it's not like the Apple Pencil, but it's close.

02:00:52   Like, yes, it would take power from my phone,

02:00:54   but I've got a square to spare for that little guy.

02:00:57   (laughing)

02:00:58   - Wow.

02:00:59   I agree with you, Marco.

02:01:02   I don't think I would use this for AirPods,

02:01:04   'cause my AirPods are extremely rarely that discharged.

02:01:08   I could see myself using this in a pinch with another phone.

02:01:12   Like, let's say I'm out with Erin, and her phone is at 20%,

02:01:15   mine's at 80% or something like that.

02:01:17   I could see maybe doing a phone-to-phone transfer,

02:01:21   if you will, a juice transfusion, I guess, between the two,

02:01:25   but I don't think I would use this for much else.

02:01:27   But, you know, it doesn't bum me out that it's not there,

02:01:30   but I'm sure I'd like it if it was.

02:01:32   - Like, think about the practical side of it, too.

02:01:33   Like, there's a number of issues

02:01:35   with bi-directional charging.

02:01:36   Like, I think this is why it's kind of a gimmick so far

02:01:38   in the Android world, and it's not really taking off.

02:01:40   First of all, Qi charging is not very efficient.

02:01:43   So it's not like, you know, if you have the same phone,

02:01:46   and yours is at 80%, and your wife's is at 40%,

02:01:49   and you put them together,

02:01:50   they're not gonna meet in the middle.

02:01:51   - Yeah. - Yeah.

02:01:52   - You're gonna spend a lot more of yours

02:01:54   to charge hers up a little bit, you know,

02:01:57   because it's not anywhere near 100% efficient

02:01:59   in the transfer, or the battery itself, charging itself.

02:02:02   Like, all these processes have losses,

02:02:04   especially the Qi part of it.

02:02:06   That's a pretty big loss on that.

02:02:08   So like, you have, it's inefficient, it's also slow,

02:02:12   and during the part that it's charging,

02:02:16   like, for the most part, it's going to immobilize

02:02:20   both of the things that are involved here.

02:02:21   So like, if you imagine the scenario of like,

02:02:24   oh, my watch is low for the day,

02:02:26   I will charge my watch with my phone.

02:02:29   Okay, well you gotta set the phone down,

02:02:32   set the watch exactly across the back of it,

02:02:34   make sure it's exactly centered, let it charge,

02:02:36   and then you have no phone and no watch

02:02:38   for the next, what, 20 minutes?

02:02:40   Like, it's gonna take a while

02:02:41   to give it like a meaningful charge,

02:02:43   like, that will actually get you very far through the day.

02:02:46   Right, you know, similar thing,

02:02:47   like if you look at AirPods, I mean,

02:02:48   AirPods are a little bit better in that

02:02:49   you can at least charge the case

02:02:51   while they're in your ears, like Jon was saying.

02:02:53   But still, like, how many people are gonna want their phone

02:02:57   to be totally incapacitated and face down,

02:03:00   you know, on whatever surface,

02:03:01   while it is losing quite a bit of its battery

02:03:05   to inefficiently and slowly charge something else?

02:03:08   Like, it just sounds not that good,

02:03:12   and that alone could be why they seem to have pulled it.

02:03:17   It doesn't seem like it's that useful in practice.

02:03:21   - Yeah, I don't know whether it was pulled

02:03:23   or whether it was never there to begin with,

02:03:24   'cause it was just a rumor, but it seems to me

02:03:26   that it's the type of features

02:03:27   that they could actually enable with software.

02:03:29   Like, they could actually, the hardware could be there

02:03:32   for it and they could just either never enable it

02:03:33   and like, so fine, we never get it,

02:03:35   but if they decide, oh, it's a thing we can do,

02:03:36   they could enable it in a point update,

02:03:38   like, it could be one of the things

02:03:39   that got pulled from point O,

02:03:40   or they could just never end up doing it,

02:03:41   but like, I don't think phone to phone

02:03:44   was ever in the cards, but like,

02:03:47   it's for their one access, it's for the AirPods.

02:03:48   The battery's very small, people put it

02:03:50   on the back of their phone already,

02:03:51   but I don't care that it wasn't there.

02:03:53   It's just, it was widely rumored,

02:03:54   and it's the type of thing where,

02:03:56   kind of like the U1, which we haven't talked about too much,

02:03:59   they didn't talk about the U1 at all,

02:04:00   but it's on their slides, they didn't introduce

02:04:02   like the tile thing that keeps track of your stuff,

02:04:05   but like, they basically shipped the hardware for it,

02:04:07   and apparently shipped most of the software for it,

02:04:09   but it's not an announced product or feature at this point.

02:04:11   Right, so the reverse wireless charging,

02:04:14   I'm binning into that same thing of like,

02:04:16   you don't know that they didn't ship everything

02:04:19   except for the software, so stay tuned, I suppose.

02:04:22   - Pro cameras, three cameras in a peculiar looking

02:04:28   camera bump, like, I'm not as deeply offended

02:04:32   as some are by the look of this.

02:04:34   It does not look good, the camera bump, I don't think.

02:04:36   - It doesn't look as good as the old one,

02:04:38   but it's growing on me.

02:04:39   It's more of a camera plateau anyway.

02:04:41   (laughing)

02:04:42   - I think it's fine, like who cares, it's fine.

02:04:44   - It's okay.

02:04:46   - We're all gonna get used to it,

02:04:47   like every time the camera bump has changed,

02:04:51   there have been a certain number of us who've been like,

02:04:52   oh, it's so ugly, I can't believe they did that,

02:04:55   who could live with that ugly, unsightly camera bump?

02:04:57   And then like a week later, we all forget about it

02:04:59   and we all have the phone, it's fine.

02:05:01   - Yeah, odd numbers are problematic though,

02:05:02   like when they go to four, it will really look like

02:05:05   the stove top that we all wanted it to be.

02:05:07   What they really need to do is start making,

02:05:08   they really, they'll screw up that symmetry,

02:05:10   or not screw up, but like there is an opportunity

02:05:12   to make the circles not all the same size.

02:05:15   I know that aesthetically that's not great,

02:05:19   but optically, there may be opportunity for that to happen.

02:05:22   Anyway, we should just resign to the fact

02:05:25   that the back of our phones is going to increasingly

02:05:26   look like the, what are they, the sentinels from the Matrix

02:05:28   with the million mechanical eyes.

02:05:30   - Yeah, yeah.

02:05:31   They should start making little face arrangements with them.

02:05:33   - Yeah.

02:05:34   - Like a little smile on the back, hey, I'm your camera.

02:05:36   - Well, you do have to kind of like,

02:05:37   that's why the bump is the same on the,

02:05:40   packaging-wise, it's good to be able to kind of say,

02:05:43   here is the camera cluster, 'cause there's also,

02:05:45   it's not just the cameras, there's also the little

02:05:47   flash thingy and the microphone,

02:05:48   and you have to find some place to put all this stuff.

02:05:50   But yeah, the 11, it looks a little spare,

02:05:54   'cause like, really, the same size bump as the Pro,

02:05:57   but one fewer camera, you got a lot of empty space there.

02:06:01   Anyway, but it's fine.

02:06:03   - So there are three cameras wide,

02:06:05   which is 26 millimeter f/1.8, telephoto 52 millimeter f/2,

02:06:09   and ultra wide f/2.4, which has 120 degree field of view.

02:06:14   - 13 millimeter, by the way.

02:06:15   - Oh, sorry.

02:06:17   So I have, sitting here now,

02:06:19   I have mixed feelings about this.

02:06:20   I bet you anything that as soon as I get this,

02:06:22   I'm gonna think it's amazing.

02:06:23   But sitting here now, I feel like if I were to ask

02:06:27   for another lens on my camera, it would not be ultra wide,

02:06:32   it would be more zoom.

02:06:35   Because if anything, I wanna get closer

02:06:37   to what I'm trying to photograph,

02:06:39   not further away from it.

02:06:41   - Is this not more zoomed?

02:06:43   - The zoom and the now middle one are exactly the same.

02:06:46   - All right.

02:06:47   - And now the only thing that's been added

02:06:49   is that the wide is now added,

02:06:51   but the other two are exactly the same

02:06:52   that they were before.

02:06:53   - Are they literally exactly the same camera and sensor?

02:06:55   Or is it the same focal length?

02:06:56   - That's a good question.

02:06:58   They didn't talk much about it.

02:06:59   - No, they did not.

02:07:01   - They said something about,

02:07:02   they said some statement that made it sound like

02:07:05   it's a minor improvement on the main sensor.

02:07:07   - Well, the front one is a different camera.

02:07:10   Because it has a different, well,

02:07:12   actually I can't even say that definitively.

02:07:13   The front one now captures more pixels than it did before.

02:07:17   I'm assuming it's also a different camera mechanism,

02:07:19   but the back ones, I don't know.

02:07:21   - I mean, they're probably all revised sensors of some kind,

02:07:24   but it seemed like, oh, and the telephoto

02:07:28   has a wider aperture now, it's now f/2.0.

02:07:31   I forget what it was before,

02:07:32   but it was not that wide before.

02:07:33   So it was like, they've been improved,

02:07:36   but it seems like they haven't been improved in massive ways.

02:07:40   The main thing is the software changes,

02:07:44   things like the night mode,

02:07:45   the extended dynamic range of video, stuff like that.

02:07:48   That's very new.

02:07:49   And then also now the ultra wide, which is interesting.

02:07:54   - And the deep fusion.

02:07:55   So I think Apple's got a team, obviously,

02:07:57   that does their computational photography stuff,

02:07:59   and there's sort of one glamor feature each year of this,

02:08:02   like portrait mode as an example.

02:08:04   And they seem to be on a cadence

02:08:05   that's like three months off of the September Apple.

02:08:08   (laughing)

02:08:09   It's like, can we just shift, I know it's hard,

02:08:12   give them a time machine or some kind of stasis capsule,

02:08:14   because the cool computation photography thing

02:08:17   is always like, coming later.

02:08:18   It's like, oh, you just missed it, you just missed it.

02:08:20   And they're gonna keep just missing it

02:08:21   if they take a year to work on the next, anyway.

02:08:23   That deep fusion thing looked pretty cool.

02:08:25   I'm much more excited about that than I am

02:08:28   for portrait mode, which I basically never use

02:08:29   and I'm not a fan of, 'cause this is just straight up like,

02:08:33   when you take a picture with this,

02:08:35   it shouldn't jump out at you.

02:08:37   If it jumps out at you that we did anything weird

02:08:39   to the picture, we've not done our job.

02:08:41   Kind of like HDR, where if you're in the know,

02:08:43   you can kind of tell an HDR picture,

02:08:45   but the deep fusion thing is, I think,

02:08:46   trying to be even more subtle.

02:08:48   It's like, it's just gonna look like

02:08:49   a better exposed picture with more detail,

02:08:51   and you're not gonna know how we did it.

02:08:52   And the answer is how we did it was we used

02:08:54   all three of our cameras, and we took a bazillion pictures

02:08:56   and we mushed them all together,

02:08:58   and hopefully, as far as you're concerned,

02:09:00   you just got one great picture

02:09:01   and you don't have to know how it happened.

02:09:02   And that's the dream we all want from our phone cameras,

02:09:05   which can't physically be as good as a quote unquote

02:09:07   real camera, but computationally,

02:09:09   they can try to make up for it.

02:09:11   - Yeah, and there's all sorts of tricks to do now that,

02:09:14   like, I think one of the biggest parts of the camera story

02:09:17   of all three of these new phones is just how much smarter

02:09:21   they're able to be with the software now.

02:09:24   And some of the under the hood changes that aren't,

02:09:28   it's hard to really explain.

02:09:29   So for instance, like they were saying about,

02:09:31   like there was that wonderful demo from Filmic Pro

02:09:33   where you're actually shooting from multiple cameras at once.

02:09:38   There was a part that Phil, I think, was saying about how,

02:09:40   like, when you're zooming between the cameras,

02:09:44   like all the lenses are always activated.

02:09:47   They're already like primed for auto focus,

02:09:48   auto exposure, and white balance and everything,

02:09:50   so that when it switches between two cameras

02:09:54   as you're zooming, you don't see the change.

02:09:57   It just kinda, it doesn't jump in, it's already there.

02:10:01   It seems like they are actually just running all three

02:10:04   cameras all the time whenever any one of them is open.

02:10:06   - That's how Deep Fusion thinks, it's like nine images

02:10:09   before you press the shutter.

02:10:10   All cameras are all constantly recording pictures

02:10:13   into this giant rolling buffer.

02:10:14   - Right, and when you look at something like that,

02:10:17   and the whole thing earlier about the extended dynamic range

02:10:19   in video where it seems like they're probably gonna be

02:10:21   shooting 120 frames a second at 4K from all three cameras

02:10:26   at the same time, this is an incredible feat

02:10:31   of camera sensor bandwidth and then the image

02:10:35   signal processor.

02:10:36   The pipeline that they have here of just dumping out

02:10:41   so much pixel data from these cameras all the time,

02:10:45   that they're operating at least,

02:10:47   dumping out all this picture data and then the amount

02:10:49   of processing it has to do in real time in a phone

02:10:54   is amazing.

02:10:55   That to me is the biggest part of this story

02:10:59   is all this under the hood stuff that most people

02:11:02   wouldn't even know why that's impressive,

02:11:05   but even if you know the slightest little bit

02:11:07   about how any of this works, you're like,

02:11:08   wait a minute, that means they're reading all three sensors,

02:11:11   dumping off 4K 120 of all of them and processing

02:11:15   all of that live?

02:11:17   It's crazy and it's really quite something else

02:11:21   to think about all that they're doing here to achieve this.

02:11:24   And I think that's why they went into a little bit,

02:11:28   why they called out some of the things,

02:11:29   like how the cameras are all active as you zoom.

02:11:32   They wanna call that out because otherwise we'd never

02:11:35   know this stuff or we'd never think about this stuff

02:11:36   and we wouldn't appreciate it, but if you're a camera nerd

02:11:40   or just a data processing nerd and you hear this,

02:11:43   you're like, whoa, that's actually, that's pretty impressive.

02:11:47   So in real terms, it's just gonna mean the camera

02:11:51   is more invisible.

02:11:54   We are not going to constantly be hit over the head

02:11:57   as users of these cameras how awesome they are.

02:12:01   It's just gonna work nicely and we are gonna have

02:12:03   zero appreciation for all this work and tech

02:12:07   that are going into it as we're using it,

02:12:09   but it's just gonna be nicer.

02:12:11   And that I think, that's why every year I tell myself,

02:12:16   maybe I shouldn't get the new phone, it's so wasteful,

02:12:18   my phone is fine, and then every year they get me

02:12:20   with the camera stuff, they always get me

02:12:21   with the camera stuff and this is one of those years,

02:12:23   by the way, they also say Face ID is faster

02:12:26   and works from more angles and further distance away,

02:12:29   which that would probably have gotten me alone,

02:12:32   but the fact is these camera improvements,

02:12:35   even though, as we just said, it sounds like

02:12:37   the actual sensors themselves on the previous two cameras

02:12:41   aren't that different, although someone in the chat

02:12:44   reported that the telephoto before was F2.4, now it's F2.0,

02:12:51   that's a pretty big increase in light coming into it.

02:12:54   So the telephoto before, the telephoto was noticeably

02:12:57   worse picture-wise before, now that difference

02:13:00   should be a lot smaller.

02:13:02   So the telephoto's F2.0, the wide is F1.8, so it's close,

02:13:06   I believe that's a half stop down, something like that.

02:13:09   So it's now significantly better on the telephoto end

02:13:14   and you have this new ultra wide, which again, like Casey,

02:13:17   if I had a choice of where to get more zoom range,

02:13:20   I would have picked more telephoto zoom range, for sure.

02:13:24   I would use that a lot more, I want more reach

02:13:26   so I can take pictures of things further away from me.

02:13:29   However, I will use the ultra wide, and especially as,

02:13:33   I think Jason was saying on Upgrades,

02:13:36   that rumored feature about how you'll be able to crop

02:13:39   after the fact did actually seem to ship,

02:13:42   you'll be able to reverse crop out from a wide shot

02:13:45   into an ultra wide for some period of time.

02:13:47   All the time I take pictures where, oh I accidentally

02:13:50   cut off somebody's feet or something,

02:13:52   and it looks a little bit wrong.

02:13:53   It's like, oh if I just had a little bit more width,

02:13:55   I could fix this picture, this could be a much better

02:13:57   picture, and so I will actually probably use that a lot.

02:14:02   Again, I would have preferred telephoto,

02:14:03   but that's still pretty cool.

02:14:04   So anyway, all this stuff, this is a massive camera update.

02:14:09   Even if you just get the 11 and you don't have

02:14:10   the telephoto, it's still a pretty impressive camera update.

02:14:13   And the telephoto just adds to it on the Pro.

02:14:16   It's just, I think it's great.

02:14:17   And that will, like that unquestionably makes me ignore

02:14:22   all my guilt about buying a new phone every year.

02:14:24   I just, nope, I'm buying it.

02:14:25   I need these camera updates.

02:14:27   - I also am really amped to get a better camera

02:14:31   because I didn't get the 10S as I mentioned a couple times,

02:14:34   and I always slightly regretted it

02:14:36   because the cameras were better.

02:14:37   And the more cool camera tech that Apple introduces,

02:14:43   the less excited I am about picking up my quote unquote,

02:14:46   big camera.

02:14:47   And the reason I still pick up my big camera

02:14:49   is because the zoom is much better.

02:14:52   And because the bokeh, bokeh, however you pronounce it,

02:14:54   is also much better.

02:14:55   And I don't feel like it would serve anyone

02:14:58   for us to go on another tangent about portrait mode.

02:15:00   But what I will say is even leaving bokeh aside,

02:15:05   all of the pictures that my iPhone takes and has taken

02:15:08   for years and years and years now are automatically geotagged.

02:15:11   And over time, they're getting better

02:15:14   at doing auto aperture setting, auto exposure setting.

02:15:17   I will be able to do this, what is it,

02:15:20   was it Night Sight, is that right?

02:15:21   Where it'll brighten up--

02:15:23   - It's not right, that's the good name that Google took.

02:15:25   - It's Night Trap.

02:15:26   - Well, in any case, whatever they call it.

02:15:28   Whatever they call it, you'll be able to see in the dark now.

02:15:31   This computational photography stuff

02:15:34   is just getting to the point that it is utterly bananas.

02:15:37   What did Phil say?

02:15:38   Computational photography, mad science.

02:15:40   And it's true.

02:15:41   And there's going to come a time,

02:15:43   I would guess in the next couple of years,

02:15:45   where I might decide subconsciously,

02:15:49   yeah, I might not get the perfect bokeh, bokeh, whatever,

02:15:52   that I want from my phone,

02:15:54   but everything else will be so much better

02:15:58   that I might just stop picking up my big camera,

02:16:00   which stinks 'cause there's some,

02:16:01   what was it, tea ceremony or whatever

02:16:04   we joked about for my vinyl.

02:16:05   There's some tea ceremony stuff with the big camera

02:16:07   that I still appreciate, but--

02:16:09   - Of course there is.

02:16:10   - Of course there is.

02:16:11   But there's so much about the cameras on these phones

02:16:16   that are, it's just preposterous.

02:16:18   And the YouTuber that hasn't quite died completely within me

02:16:22   but is mostly dead within me,

02:16:24   was looking at this filmic demo

02:16:26   and just my jaw hit the floor.

02:16:29   It looked incredible.

02:16:31   Oh my goodness, how cool would it be

02:16:34   to get basically two or maybe even three

02:16:37   simultaneous cameras shot all at once

02:16:39   so I can ping pong between the wide

02:16:41   and the not so wide shots.

02:16:43   All of that looked amazing.

02:16:45   And by the way, quick aside,

02:16:46   the filmic employee that was off to the right of the screen,

02:16:51   which I think is stage left, so it doesn't matter.

02:16:53   Anyway, the guy who was on the right

02:16:54   as you watch the video or watch the keynote,

02:16:56   I thought he was the most polished by far

02:16:59   of the non-Apple presenters.

02:17:00   I thought he was great.

02:17:01   But anyways, all of this camera stuff

02:17:04   is getting me to the point that even though

02:17:06   I love having a big camera and I love the pictures

02:17:10   that come off of it, you know,

02:17:11   I just came back from the beach for a week

02:17:13   and some of those pictures that I was able to take

02:17:16   are just truly phenomenal.

02:17:18   But there were a lot of pictures that I didn't get

02:17:22   because the light wasn't good enough

02:17:24   or because it was too dark or whatever the case may be

02:17:27   or maybe I'm just not a good enough photographer.

02:17:28   But so much of this I think might be able to be fixed

02:17:31   or even synthetically with some of this

02:17:34   computational photography mad science.

02:17:36   And I am, in some ways, I wonder if these improvements

02:17:41   are the improvements that will make

02:17:44   the most difference in my life.

02:17:45   You know, I think if you look at what does an iPhone do

02:17:48   for Casey List, number one, it lets me communicate

02:17:50   with people, but number two, it lets me document my life

02:17:53   and my children's lives in a way that is getting

02:17:56   ever more impressive with every year.

02:17:58   And I think all of us, myself especially,

02:17:59   lose sight of that and how important that is

02:18:02   and how incredible that is.

02:18:03   And this is not even to get started on the Apple Watch

02:18:06   and all the health benefits it's had in my life as well.

02:18:08   But just the camera stuff on the iPhone is incredible

02:18:11   and I'm really, really looking forward to getting

02:18:14   this three camera setup and seeing what I can do with it.

02:18:17   - So Marco mentioned before that the cameras

02:18:20   are recording all these images all the time

02:18:23   and then you add the caveat, well of course,

02:18:25   when the cameras are on, meaning like when the camera app

02:18:27   is launched, and that made me think about

02:18:29   this other angle of these phones.

02:18:30   You mentioned the Yuan before.

02:18:32   And also I mentioned the A13, the Matrix math unit

02:18:36   or whatever, we've had a topic in the notes

02:18:39   that we haven't gotten to because there's been

02:18:40   more pressing stuff, but I think we'll get to eventually

02:18:42   about the AR stuff.

02:18:44   So I feel like these phones are at the point now,

02:18:49   and I think there were some rumors about this potentially

02:18:50   being a feature that's used where even when you're not

02:18:55   in the camera app, for the purposes of orienting the phone

02:19:00   for its ultra wide band near field,

02:19:02   communication with things, like all the different sensors

02:19:04   that are in this phone, it's got a GPS,

02:19:06   it's got a gyroscope, it's got this ultra wide band thing,

02:19:08   it's got a bunch of cameras, it's got accelerometers in it.

02:19:11   And the new Matrix math thing, which is yes,

02:19:14   I'm sure useful for lots of other things,

02:19:15   but also would be useful for dealing with orientation

02:19:18   and telemetry for a head mounted display.

02:19:20   This is another situation where I feel like the hardware

02:19:24   for lots of stuff that has not been announced

02:19:26   has nevertheless shipped.

02:19:28   When we get these iPhone 11s, they are ready and capable

02:19:33   to do AR, both with and without a head mounted display

02:19:40   in a much more sophisticated way

02:19:43   than even just their predecessors,

02:19:45   down to potentially constantly pulling in camera data

02:19:49   to help orient.

02:19:50   The one feature I think they ship with this

02:19:52   is the people we're playing with in the demo room

02:19:54   is if you airdrop to somebody and they have another one

02:19:57   of these fancy iPhones, that the phones kind of know

02:20:00   where they are and where they're pointing

02:20:02   in relation to each other by fusing together

02:20:04   all their various sensors, including especially the new U1,

02:20:07   which is the extra bit that they didn't have before.

02:20:10   And so you can kind of point your phone at somebody

02:20:12   to airdrop to them and point at a different person.

02:20:14   I don't know how it works, I didn't see anyone

02:20:15   demonstrating this, but this is another reason

02:20:20   that the 11, I don't, yeah, it's in both of them, right?

02:20:22   The U1 is in both of them and the camera,

02:20:24   like the 11 and the 11 Pro are interesting to me

02:20:27   from an AR perspective, even though Apple didn't announce

02:20:31   any AR stuff or any AR headset and they didn't announce

02:20:33   their tile replacement, they didn't announce any

02:20:34   of that stuff, but they kind of shipped it as well.

02:20:36   Like even people were pulling apart the headers

02:20:38   and saying like, all the head-mounted display stuff

02:20:40   is actually shipping in the iOS 13 GM,

02:20:42   like they didn't even remove it.

02:20:43   It's like, there's frameworks, there's APIs,

02:20:46   there's Starboard, which is kind of a play on Springboard,

02:20:49   it's like kind of the environment that controls

02:20:51   the head-mounted displays, the theory is that Star

02:20:54   stands for stereo AR.

02:20:56   - Oh. - It's, yeah, like,

02:20:58   it's a very strange situation, but like,

02:21:01   there is another shoe that has to drop.

02:21:02   Maybe it won't even drop this year, but you know,

02:21:05   if you, it's kind of like buying a Tesla

02:21:07   where you think it's gonna be automatic self-driving.

02:21:09   If you get an iPhone 11-- - Oh, sick burn.

02:21:10   - If you get an iPhone 11, it might be like totally ready

02:21:14   to do super-duper head-mounted AR in a way

02:21:16   that previous phones could not do, or maybe not, we'll see.

02:21:20   - Yeah, it's a really good point, Jon,

02:21:21   and I am interested in a way I don't think

02:21:24   I ever have been before in what software updates

02:21:27   will come to these devices over the next year or two,

02:21:30   because as you said, we don't know, but it stands to reason

02:21:34   that a lot of software updates could come to these

02:21:37   that enable things that we didn't even realize

02:21:39   that the hardware had. - Yeah, and then,

02:21:40   just setting aside the things they announced,

02:21:41   like the, whatever that was, the Deep Fusion mode,

02:21:43   which they said they're gonna do, iCloud shared folders,

02:21:46   and all the other stuff that got punted at 13.0,

02:21:49   and we should mention that, by the way,

02:21:51   the ship dates for the OS stuff, what was it?

02:21:54   They had it at the bottom, oh, iOS 13

02:21:57   is coming September 19th, but I'm not sure

02:22:00   if that's to everybody, maybe, it only,

02:22:03   like, I think they said the iPads

02:22:04   will only come with 13.1, anyway, 13.1 is supposedly

02:22:08   coming the 30th, 13.0 is coming the 19th.

02:22:10   Those are the announced dates for those two point releases.

02:22:14   What hardware you get and what OS will ship with

02:22:16   and what OS will be available by the time you get it,

02:22:18   we'll see, but this is, we've talked about this before,

02:22:21   this is gonna be a weird staggered release,

02:22:22   and 13.0 is probably going to be a short-lived OS

02:22:26   in the hearts and minds and hopefully devices

02:22:28   of all the people out there.

02:22:30   - Mm-hmm, let's see what else for these.

02:22:33   I was looking at what model to buy,

02:22:36   because every year we always have the dance of,

02:22:38   do you get the AT&T one, do you get the T-Mobile one?

02:22:41   There are A2160 and A2161.

02:22:44   I was looking through the tech details of, like,

02:22:48   the LTE bands and this and that and the other thing,

02:22:51   there's a difference, but darned if I know where this is.

02:22:54   I looked at all the FDD LTE bands, all the TD LTE bands,

02:22:57   the CDMA bands, et cetera, et cetera.

02:22:59   I don't know what the difference is.

02:23:00   So out of pure curiosity, I would like to know

02:23:02   if there's any empirical difference between 2160 and 2161.

02:23:05   There must be if there's two models,

02:23:07   but write me on Twitter if you can tell the difference.

02:23:10   There will be clear cases for all three models of phones.

02:23:13   The 11 Pro starts at 1,000 bucks,

02:23:15   the 11 Pro Max starts at 1,100 bucks.

02:23:19   I am, I'm moved to tears.

02:23:22   Pre-orders start at 8 a.m. one true time zone.

02:23:26   - (laughs) Yes! (claps)

02:23:29   We should play We Are The Champions for this.

02:23:31   - I know, seriously! (laughs)

02:23:33   I am being a little bit facetious

02:23:36   when I'm clapping and all that, but no, really and truly,

02:23:39   the West Coast has had, what was it,

02:23:42   midnight West Coast time for a decade plus.

02:23:46   Finally, if there was ever a time

02:23:48   for me to use finally, finally, this coming Friday

02:23:53   at the slightly unfortunate time of 5 a.m. Pacific,

02:23:57   but the delightful time of 8 a.m. one true time zone,

02:24:02   that is when we will be doing pre-orders.

02:24:04   Now, of course, I'm gonna regret this

02:24:05   when I don't get my green because everyone else

02:24:07   is going to be awake at that point doing their pre-orders,

02:24:09   but sitting here now, I am overjoyed

02:24:13   that finally, at a reasonable time for the East Coast,

02:24:18   we can do our pre-orders.

02:24:19   I am so very excited.

02:24:22   Thank you, Apple.

02:24:23   This is great news.

02:24:24   Finally, on the presentation,

02:24:28   Jirja came up for the retail update.

02:24:31   We already talked about the Apple Watch Studios,

02:24:33   as they call it.

02:24:34   They talked a bit about Apple trade-in,

02:24:36   so they said that the 11 Pro could be as cheap as $600

02:24:39   with an iPhone X trade-in.

02:24:41   I put a pretty bad gouge in my screen

02:24:44   when I was at the beach by accident,

02:24:46   and so I probably would have kept this phone anyway,

02:24:48   just because I'd like to have a relatively modern backup,

02:24:52   but as soon as I said to them,

02:24:53   "Oh yeah, there's a kind of big gouge in the screen

02:24:55   "during the trade-in mock-up or rough draft or whatever,"

02:25:00   they were basically like, "Oh yeah, that's worth nothing.

02:25:02   "Have fun."

02:25:03   - Like in the movie where you go into the big biker bar

02:25:06   where you aren't one of the people who goes there,

02:25:08   and the record scratches and everyone turns

02:25:09   and looks at you, that's like,

02:25:10   "Oh yeah, my phone is great,

02:25:12   "but yeah, the screen is damaged."

02:25:14   Nope, that's it.

02:25:16   It's all over, all over.

02:25:17   And then, so these will ship on the 20th of December,

02:25:22   which is the same time as the watches,

02:25:24   that is next Friday as we record.

02:25:28   They also made mention that they're doing monthly payments

02:25:30   for the new phones,

02:25:32   which does not appear to be the iPhone upgrade program,

02:25:35   mind you, this is just a straight-up monthly payment.

02:25:38   And they also made mention in the retail section

02:25:40   that the Apple Fifth Avenue Cube reopens on that same day.

02:25:43   We already talked about the iOS release schedule.

02:25:46   One other thing I wanted to quickly mention

02:25:47   is that I was looking at the iPhone X Pro website

02:25:52   on my iPad. - 11 Pro?

02:25:54   - Sorry, God, I am a disaster.

02:25:56   - This is a rough naming transition here.

02:25:57   - It really is. - It's pronounced X Pro.

02:25:59   - The iPhone X Pro.

02:26:00   I was looking at the 11 Pro website on my iPad Pro,

02:26:05   and they had a little link for a button or whatever

02:26:08   for Look At It In AR.

02:26:09   I thought, "Yeah, I'll give it,

02:26:11   "I don't know what I'm gonna discover by this,

02:26:12   "but yeah, let me look at it in AR."

02:26:14   And so I was sitting on my living room floor,

02:26:16   and I waved my iPad around,

02:26:18   and thankfully Erin wasn't paying attention

02:26:19   'cause she would've looked at me like a crazy person.

02:26:21   But eventually, a iPhone 11 Pro showed up

02:26:24   on my living room floor.

02:26:26   And I know this is old news to everyone else,

02:26:28   but that thing looked incredibly real.

02:26:30   And just for grins, I held up my iPhone X next to it,

02:26:35   and they were basically identically sized,

02:26:37   which is exactly what it should be.

02:26:38   It was extremely, extremely cool.

02:26:41   I was very impressed.

02:26:42   - Yeah, it's like the demos when we were at WWDC

02:26:45   and saw the Mac Pro demos and everything.

02:26:47   The thing they added that finally got it over the line

02:26:50   of looking close to real is the lighting.

02:26:54   I don't know which particular thing.

02:26:56   Some form of mostly faked, quote, unquote,

02:27:00   faked global illumination

02:27:01   'cause they can't do the real thing.

02:27:03   But having some kind of global illumination

02:27:06   where it reflects the environment back onto the device

02:27:08   and there's an ambient diffuse light,

02:27:10   it places the element in its environment

02:27:14   much more convincingly than the old ones

02:27:16   which just look like you're drawing a 3D rendered thing

02:27:19   that has no awareness that it's on a green carpet

02:27:21   or something.

02:27:22   And that little bit plus a little bit of extra

02:27:24   ambient fake game-derived bounce lighting,

02:27:27   I figure with the branding they put on this,

02:27:28   the reality composer or whatever.

02:27:31   They have frameworks for this.

02:27:32   It's established game tech,

02:27:35   but using it in AR really gives a big boost to AR

02:27:38   to make it more convincing and more sort of like,

02:27:41   it's a thing that regular people will notice.

02:27:42   It's like, oh, it's cool.

02:27:43   It's like there's a phone there.

02:27:45   But it's a big step up.

02:27:46   And I think that's what you're seeing.

02:27:47   It's like, I didn't realize AR was this good.

02:27:49   It's the magic of slightly better lighting.

02:27:52   - Thanks for our sponsors this week,

02:27:53   Mack Weldon, Squarespace and Fracture,

02:27:55   and we will see you next week.

02:27:58   (upbeat music)

02:28:01   ♪ Now the show is over ♪

02:28:03   ♪ They didn't even mean to begin ♪

02:28:06   ♪ 'Cause it was accidental ♪

02:28:07   ♪ Accidental ♪

02:28:08   ♪ Oh, it was accidental ♪

02:28:10   ♪ Accidental ♪

02:28:11   ♪ John didn't do any research ♪

02:28:13   ♪ Marco and Casey wouldn't let him ♪

02:28:16   ♪ 'Cause it was accidental ♪

02:28:18   ♪ Accidental ♪

02:28:19   ♪ It was accidental ♪

02:28:20   ♪ Accidental ♪

02:28:22   ♪ And you can find the show notes at ATP.fm ♪

02:28:27   ♪ And if you're into Twitter ♪

02:28:30   ♪ You can follow them at C-A-S-E-Y-L-I-S-S ♪

02:28:36   ♪ So that's Casey List M-A-R-C-O ♪

02:28:39   ♪ A-R-M ♪

02:28:40   ♪ Auntie Marco Armin ♪

02:28:43   ♪ S-I-R-A-C ♪

02:28:45   ♪ U-S-A-C-R-A-C-U-S-A ♪

02:28:48   ♪ It's accidental ♪

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02:28:56   ♪ Tech podcast ♪

02:28:58   ♪ So long ♪

02:29:00   - Do we wanna have an after show?

02:29:03   'Cause this ran damn long.

02:29:04   - Oh my God, this was so long.

02:29:06   - Well, a lot of stuff to talk about.

02:29:09   - I feel like we haven't had a real long one

02:29:10   in a real long time though, so that may give us a pass.

02:29:12   - That makes it okay.

02:29:13   - We can trim it a little bit.

02:29:15   You can tighten it, and plus we had the St. Jude thing.

02:29:18   It all went over.

02:29:19   By the way, good job everyone on St. Jude.

02:29:21   We crossed 60K.

02:29:22   - Nice. - What are we up to now?

02:29:23   We are up to 61, 231.

02:29:26   Good job. - Well done live people.

02:29:28   - That's awesome. - We'll assume

02:29:29   it was all you and not other people.

02:29:31   - Yeah, fair point, fair point.

02:29:33   But still, well done live people.

02:29:35   You make us proud.

02:29:36   - Yep, and non-live people, let's kick their butts.

02:29:39   (laughing)

02:29:41   Kick the live people's butts.

02:29:42   Let's really blow this out.

02:29:43   - 'Cause live people are great, but they are few.

02:29:46   - Yeah, there's a heck of a lot more non-live people

02:29:49   than there are live people.

02:29:50   - This was in my record of show notes

02:29:53   for the episode I just recorded,

02:29:55   and I forgot to mention it, so I'll mention it here.

02:29:57   Actually, you touched on it at the beginning, right?

02:29:59   So we have our own URL, stjude.org/atp.

02:30:02   Everyone has their own URL on Relay.

02:30:04   It's like stjude.org/name of the show

02:30:06   or abbreviation for the show, right?

02:30:09   And those are all the URLs we're giving.

02:30:11   But I haven't heard anyone discuss,

02:30:12   and I started thinking, does this mean someone is tracking

02:30:16   how much money comes from each show?

02:30:19   Is this a competition?

02:30:21   What do you win if you send the most money to the thing?

02:30:26   What is it even?

02:30:28   It hasn't been gamified, but yet we look at the URLs

02:30:31   and we know there must be tracking for it.

02:30:33   So I feel like there's this competitive element

02:30:35   that is unspoken, but I'm speaking it now, saying,

02:30:38   if someone could be tracking this,

02:30:41   someone should be tracking this,

02:30:42   and that means it's a game that we can win.

02:30:45   - And here's the thing, listeners, let me tell you.

02:30:48   For them, to make up the difference right now,

02:30:50   to push them over the goal right now,

02:30:53   I told you earlier, listeners,

02:30:56   that I want you to really consider giving at least $100.

02:30:59   Do you know how many of you need to give $100

02:31:02   to push them over the limit?

02:31:03   0.1% of you.

02:31:06   That's all it will take.

02:31:09   So as long as more than 0.1% of all of you

02:31:14   give them at least $100, they're gonna hit their goal.

02:31:17   They're gonna blow past their goal.

02:31:18   So that should be a minimum bar.

02:31:21   That's the least we can do.

02:31:22   We can do even better than that.

02:31:24   [beeping]

02:31:26   [ Silence ]