186: Jony Ive Has a Lot of White Pants
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- Do you think this is the biggest show of the year
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or do you think the WWDC one is the biggest show of the year?
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- I think WWDC.
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I wouldn't say it's by a large margin,
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but I think it's a dub dub episode.
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Which, P.S., I've noticed myself just in the last
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six to 12 months embracing dub dub,
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which I always used to hate so much,
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like the phrasing, D-U-B-D-U-B.
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I always used to hate it so much,
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but yeah, I've been broken.
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- Yeah, they totally wore me down.
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I too, I'm not usually a trendy word shortener,
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but that one, it's just so clumsy to say WWDC
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that that one just wore me down.
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- Although, curiously, dub dub dub,
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as in dub dub dub dub dot caselist dot com,
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I can't do it, it drives me insane.
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Like, I'm like hunching up as I'm saying it
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because it just drives me so crazy.
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- No, that is too far.
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That one I was willing to just wait
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until we drop that prefix for most domain names.
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We're going to talk about the September 2016 Apple event.
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We are going to try to do this in chronological order.
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We will probably miss a little bit, but here we go.
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We started out with Tim Cook and James Corden doing carpool karaoke, which as soon as I
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saw this I thought, "Oh God.
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This is not going to be good."
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Pleasantly surprised.
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I thought it was great.
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I thought Tim did a great job.
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a little awkward, but I'd have been ten times more awkward if I were there.
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Could sing enough. I mean, he sang more than Britney Spears did, so that's a thing.
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I thought it was really well done and a really good intro.
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I thought it was the best interaction Tim has ever shown with a celebrity as part of an event.
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Well, that's not a very high bar, but yes, I agree.
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Why were you afraid? Why did you think this was going to be cringe-worthy?
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Just because, like Tim and Bono, for example. It's just not usually good.
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But it was great.
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But that's not the same context.
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That's the context of him on stage having to stand out next to his tame racing driver,
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tame celebrity.
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Look what I have brought you.
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It is a Bono.
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And I have brought you him.
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And now I stand next to him.
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The context is weird where you have to just be like, is this great, guys?
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Look, celebrity.
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Whereas we've all seen the carpool karaoke, I'm assuming.
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And that is a much more relaxed environment.
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- Yep, Marco, Jesus Christ.
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- You don't have to be proud of you, Marco.
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- Never seen car, never, not once.
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- I mean, technically, I guess now I have seen it once.
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- Right, but before that, when this came on,
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when you saw the back of the SUV,
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you didn't immediately know what it was,
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but you saw that guy sitting behind the wheel, nothing?
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- I asked Tiff who the guy was,
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and then when the second guy got in the car,
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I had to ask who he was too.
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- I feel like we need to have
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some kind of pop culture intervention.
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- Yeah, I mean, I am not one to really be throwing stones
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in the glass house in which I live,
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but holy God, Marco, you need to get a grip.
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I don't mean you have to have seen it.
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I don't even know what that guy's name is.
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Just to know that this is a thing.
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And like, oh, I recognize it.
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It's that thing that I never watch, but not even that.
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Anyway, that environment is much more relaxed.
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And I knew he would do fine.
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I should rewatch it 'cause some people
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were trying to find issue with him.
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But I was surprised that he would agree to it
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because the people who usually are on that
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are people who want to sort of unabashedly sing in a car,
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but like in front of everybody.
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It's like, you know, dance like nobody's watching
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Carpool Karaoke is sing like you're in your own car and no one can see you but everybody
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can see you because you're on the internet. I'm assuming Tim Cook must be a fan of that
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and said, "You know what? I'd like to do that." Because if someone who didn't want to sing
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in front of the world was forced to do it, they would look way worse. I mean, I know
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I would never want to do this and I can't imagine faking it to the degree that he did.
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So I think he really wanted to be on this thing because he likes to sing and he got
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All right, so I thought the intro was great. I also really liked when was it that they did the
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Bill Hader introduction when he was like doing he was directing the big
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the big show intro. Do you know what I'm thinking of? Was that dub dub?
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Yeah, yeah, but this was better because this this had this was sort of of the moment in a
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way that didn't look like they were trying to cash in because I think it was just at the right
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point for carpool karaoke where it's not at the peak but it's not at the beginning it's like
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like, but it's not old hat.
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And I really, he looked like he had genuine enthusiasm
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for being on this thing that he had seen other people on.
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And it was like, relaxed.
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And I know what you're talking about.
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The Bill Hader thing was funny,
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but that was like more higher budget, more complicated.
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Like this, I feel like it was just simple.
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It's like person in a car.
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It's funny to see Tim Cook in that context.
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It was short.
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I really liked it.
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One of the best intros to an Apple event ever.
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Although it's kind of a shame that it was totally unrelated
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to anything that was presented really, but that's fine.
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- The joke that James Corden made about how he had heard
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that the new iPhone, or perhaps it was the new version
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of iOS, was the most secure ever, and Tim, do you know
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where I read that?
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On a leak posted to the internet?
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- That was my least favorite part because--
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- Oh, I thought it was funny.
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- It shows that the host doesn't understand the nuance
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of what he's talking about, because is this gonna be
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the most secure iPhone?
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We know what he means when he says that.
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I'm assuming that's a plant from Apple or something like
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that to say, hey, ask us about the security,
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because it's gonna be, I'm assuming, more secure
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than the past ones learning from everything they've learned
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from all the previous iPhones and all the different FBI
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court orders and everything, right?
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But that has nothing to do with whether rumors
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of how the phone is being designed leak onto the internet.
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That has nothing to do with the security of the phone.
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They're totally unrelated except for the fact
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that the word security can be applied to both of them.
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- Why you gotta be such a buzzkill?
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- I'm just saying, like it's a typical sort of,
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you wanna make a tech joke, but you're not a tech person,
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So you think you really nailed it?
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Ha ha, isn't that funny?
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And I feel like Tim Cook was like,
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do you see the irony in that?
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Tim Cook should have been like, yes,
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I see the irony in that.
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Actually, I don't because it doesn't make any sense,
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but I will humor you because I know
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if I have to explain it to you, that won't work.
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But I'm explaining it to you because Tim Cook wouldn't.
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That joke didn't make any sense
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and therefore was less funny than it should have been.
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- Ah, you need to turn your brain off
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and turn on the emotion chip from time to time.
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I thought it was funny.
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- Nothing to do with emotion chip.
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Good humor makes sense.
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The best humor makes sense and it's funny.
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That's why it's funny, because it makes sense.
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I love this show.
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I do too, but I'm going to kill one or both of you by the end of it.
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Anything else about Tim and James?
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They had a big opening thing about Apple Music too.
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Oh yeah, yeah, I guess you're right.
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It was just like, "Hey, Apple Music exists.
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You guys should try it.
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Here's your semiannual reminder to please subscribe to Apple Music.
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Here's how awesome it is."
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Yeah, 17 million subscribers or something.
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I'm watching the thing run in the background now.
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I'm assuming we'll comment on it almost in real time.
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But they're pushing it, like, this is what they usually do at the beginning of the thing.
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They have some feel-good stuff, some funny stuff, and some "hey, let me remind you about
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whatever it is that I'm pushing that we think we've done recently that's good or doing well
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or whatever."
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So Apple Music is getting the push here.
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How do you guys feel about Apple Music right now?
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I haven't used it since the demo period ran out.
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At that time, I thought it was okay, but I'm a pretty loyal Spotify user, and the only
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thing that Apple Music brought to me as a Spotify user that I didn't already have was
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being able to play things via Siri, which I did really, really like.
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Other than that, I haven't really looked back since, to be honest with you.
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- Yeah, I mean, I've been a subscriber the whole time.
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In fact, we even have the family plan, but it's kind of like when I get a Netflix disc
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back in the day, back when that was a thing,
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and you'd let the disc sit there for like three months
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and start realizing how much you effectively paid
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for that disc.
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That's kinda how I am about Apple Music.
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We have the membership,
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and I do occasionally place something on it,
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but if I actually work out how much I've paid
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for each one of those tracks that I've played off of it,
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I probably shouldn't be using it.
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I think I've determined that I'm just not
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really a stream music customer,
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because most of what I listen to is either podcasts or fish,
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neither of which are on there. I think I kind of split the difference between you guys. I
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subscribed during the trial period. I thought I would have no interest in it whatsoever. I was
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surprised that I actually discovered new music with it. Not that their "For You" and "Suggestions"
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things are all that great, but that was the point where I'm trying a free trial. I'm gonna, you know,
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put some time into going through it, and I did find some music that I like. What I did when I found
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that music is that I bought it because I didn't know I was going to continue the Apple Music trial,
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so I just purchased all the songs that I found that I liked, which is nice, and then I let the thing lapse because I'm like
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Yeah, doesn't I don't use it kind of like Marco
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I'm not a streaming music kind of person and it was fairly expensive or something that I was just gonna let run in the background
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Now I find myself kind of missing
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the fact that I don't have access to all the music that Apple music makes available and sometimes I'm like
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You know what? I like to hear some new music and I can't because I don't have Apple music
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But anyway, I'm probably just not a stream music subscriber my experience out in the world with people who are
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are streaming music subscribers is I still see Spotify having a pretty good hold on things.
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So I don't think Apple Music has bumped them out, but Apple Music seems like the kind of Apple Maps
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where even if it's not better than Google Maps, just by being the default and being constantly
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promoted in this way, I think they're going to start to erode some of the competitors just
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for the sheer force of constant promotion and defaultedness and Siri integration from Apple,
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essentially. Next thing I believe was iWork, which they said they were doing some updates,
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but most importantly and interestingly, selfishly anyway, was real-time collaborative editing,
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which I believe they said was going to be both native and web-based. Is that true?
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Actually, that came after Nintendo, but a lot of it's a lot. Yes, they did say there was a web.
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They said you can do this on your Mac, on your iOS devices, and even on the web. They didn't show
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any of those things, but yeah. Is the web the same thing they launched two years ago, or is it like
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like a new version based on whatever's underpinning this stuff?
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I don't know. Like, it's hard to, like, what they were demoing in some ways is a total
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Apple move where it's like, Google, that, you know, Google the most well-known thing
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where a bunch of people can edit a document at the same time. That's just a bunch of colored
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cursors in text. But we're going to do a presentation with graphics, and look how beautiful the
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presentation, you know, it's more complicated, it's more visually complicated to have multiple
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people doing graphics at the same time without having them, like, flash and clip over each
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each other, everything's beautifully composited
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and multiple people are collaborating
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on this graphic document or whatever.
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So that is more impressive than just a bunch of cursors
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moving around a text field.
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But almost everything about iWork has always been,
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has looked nicer visually, whether it's on the Mac
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or even on the web, it looks really nice.
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But in the end, what people care about is,
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does it always work?
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Is the performance good?
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Like simple and reliable is better than super fancy
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and not so reliable.
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And thus far, all of Apple's sort of collaborative editing,
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I work on the web on all platforms all at the same time,
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document syncing crap has been nice to look at,
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but ranging from clunky to downright broken,
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downright broken being me fruitlessly trying
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to get my daughter to edit the same document
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using entirely Apple native apps
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on all the Apple's latest operating system
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and getting repeatedly locked out from inability
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to even save on any platform.
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That's the worst case.
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I don't know what to say about this
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'cause I haven't tried it yet,
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but I can tell you that my confidence is not high
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that this is gonna take the world by storm.
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- Yeah, I mean, that's a pretty good summary.
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Like, it remains to be seen, basically.
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Nobody has really had time to use this yet.
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The credibility level here is low,
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the expectations are low because of the mediocre
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and poor past performances in this department.
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So we'll see what happens.
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- Yeah, so maybe we got the order wrong,
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as Jon alluded to, but hell has frozen over-ish,
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and Nintendo and Apple are sitting in a tree, K-I-S-S-I-N-G.
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Pretty much the entire internet had the same reaction I did,
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which was, "Holy crap, is John Syracuse still breathing?"
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- I did have it on in the background,
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but I don't see how this is such a big deal for most people
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because like Pokemon Go,
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I know it wasn't Nintendo developing it,
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it was Niantic or whatever, but it's Nintendo's property.
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And like that was the beachhead, you know?
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It's an incredibly popular game based on Nintendo IP on your phone.
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It's not the same as Mario coming to your phone, but the big event was, "Hey, Nintendo
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has finally..."
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I mean, we knew this from months and months and months ago, where they announced, "We're
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going to make games for mobile phones."
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And the announcement was not, "We're going to stop making games for our own platforms.
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In fact, we're going to continue making platforms.
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We're going to make a new platform.
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We won't tell you anything about it, but it's a code name NX and blah, blah, blah."
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Like they're still doing that, but they're also doing stuff for phones.
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And we knew that for a long time.
00:12:52
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And Pokemon Go shows they're doing stuff for phones and they're successful at it.
00:12:56
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And this is just a continuation of that strategy.
00:12:57
◼
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Now I think the impressive thing is that Nintendo saw fit to, or I don't know, I don't know
00:13:03
◼
►
who's pulling it, who's pushing here.
00:13:04
◼
►
Is Nintendo coming to Apple and saying we'd like to do this and let's work out a deal?
00:13:08
◼
►
Because it's good publicity for Nintendo to be in this presentation, right?
00:13:12
◼
►
And it's good for Apple to say which phone platform is Mario on first, and I assume exclusively
00:13:18
◼
►
for some period of time anyway, our platform.
00:13:20
◼
►
So I would imagine that it was Apple coming to Nintendo, but Nintendo was probably receptive
00:13:24
◼
►
to the idea that we're already entering this phone thing.
00:13:27
◼
►
Pokemon Go is a big hit that we sort of outsource to have some other developer do.
00:13:31
◼
►
If we're going to bring our crown jewels, we want to have the best possible experience,
00:13:37
◼
►
come with the highest end phone vendor, the most successful phone vendor, the one with
00:13:41
◼
►
the best reputation.
00:13:42
◼
►
And honestly, there's a better fit between Apple and Nintendo in terms of their philosophy
00:13:50
◼
►
and sort of like kid-friendliness and how Apple patrols the App Store and tries to keep
00:13:56
◼
►
it, you know, nice.
00:13:58
◼
►
Like that's, it reminds me a lot of the Nintendo seal of quality, right?
00:14:00
◼
►
So I think there's a good meeting of the minds between these two companies here.
00:14:03
◼
►
But then to have Miyamoto come out as if it's like an E3 presentation, Nintendo doesn't
00:14:07
◼
►
even do E3 presentations anymore because they always do this Nintendo Direct stuff, to come
00:14:10
◼
►
out on stage himself. That's a pretty big deal. Now, I feel bad because he didn't do
00:14:16
◼
►
particularly well. He always insists on saying something in English before playing in the
00:14:19
◼
►
translator. This is not a new thing. He does this very frequently. But he seemed nervous
00:14:23
◼
►
or badly rehearsed or both, and he kind of stumbled through his presentation. But in
00:14:29
◼
►
the end, I don't think it's that big a deal. It's not a shock. We're not shocked that this
00:14:33
◼
►
happened. It's just a straight line from everything that has come before. The games that they
00:14:39
◼
►
showed are not particularly revolutionary. It's a runner game with Mario and some other
00:14:44
◼
►
things that are already known to be well suited. If anything, Pokemon Go was a more interesting
00:14:52
◼
►
and daring game than the stuff they showed today because, I mean, what was that game
00:14:59
◼
►
before Pokemon Go from the company that made it? That was the same idea and then brought
00:15:05
◼
►
to an important property, but it is more of a risk to say we're going to take this very
00:15:08
◼
►
important property, Pokemon, and try it on a gameplay style that is very phone dependent,
00:15:14
◼
►
that was not wildly successful, Ingress is what I called it, was not wildly successful
00:15:20
◼
►
on this previous game, but maybe the combination will be good, and it was, and these Mario
00:15:24
◼
►
games are even more conservative than that.
00:15:26
◼
►
You know, tried and true gameplay styles with the crown jewels, intellectual property from
00:15:31
◼
►
Nintendo. I'm sure they'll do well. I'm not sure they'll do as well as Pokemon Go because
00:15:37
◼
►
that was kind of like a craze and as we talked about before, a great time for it because
00:15:43
◼
►
it's the summer and people are outdoors and it became a big news story or whatever. But
00:15:48
◼
►
otherwise I'm happy to see Nintendo continuing to plot along in its strategy. I'm happy to
00:15:53
◼
►
see perhaps, I'm assuming they're developing things in-house, perhaps they could get more
00:15:57
◼
►
of the money from this that will help them fund the whole rest of their company and make
00:16:02
◼
►
sure the NX isn't a piece of crap, even if it uses cartridges.
00:16:08
◼
►
I'm shocked.
00:16:09
◼
►
I mean, what do you guys think about it?
00:16:11
◼
►
Are you looking forward to buying this game or do you just not care?
00:16:14
◼
►
I mean, I'll probably buy it.
00:16:17
◼
►
They had made some sort of reference to, I forget how they phrased it, but "you'll have
00:16:21
◼
►
to pay for it, and then they kind of implied that there wouldn't really be any IAP in-app
00:16:29
◼
►
I forget exactly what was said, but then I thought Underscore had noticed that actually
00:16:33
◼
►
there will be IAP.
00:16:35
◼
►
I imagine there has to be.
00:16:36
◼
►
And by the way, last time we talked about Pokémon GO, I said that my family was playing
00:16:40
◼
►
it but I wasn't, and so far they were all playing it for free.
00:16:42
◼
►
That has passed.
00:16:43
◼
►
My wife has spent God knows how much money on this game.
00:16:46
◼
►
Whatever monetization strategy they have or whatever scarce resource is required, either
00:16:50
◼
►
her play style or the game itself leads to you eventually running out of some resource
00:16:54
◼
►
that you want and you don't want to wait or get it by grinding, so she just buys it.
00:16:58
◼
►
I think she spent like 40 bucks on this game, probably more.
00:17:01
◼
►
I try not to even look anymore.
00:17:02
◼
►
So I mean in all fairness, like if you had three people in your house playing a single
00:17:08
◼
►
Nintendo game, how much would you spend if it was any other Nintendo product?
00:17:13
◼
►
If you spent 60 bucks, then play it for like hundreds of hours like a Zelda game.
00:17:18
◼
►
Like that's the old.
00:17:19
◼
►
But then you'd also have like, you know, the in your hands you'd be burning through like this $50 controller and the $40 nunchuck and all
00:17:25
◼
►
This other garbage you have to plug into it. I mean Nintendo doesn't sell much for less than 40 bucks
00:17:29
◼
►
I know but but yeah
00:17:30
◼
►
You buy you buy that's you buy that stuff already like the whole idea with the old console thing was you buy the console for?
00:17:35
◼
►
500 bucks with all the accessories then you buy a series of $60 games each one gives you
00:17:39
◼
►
What you hope is $60 worth of enjoyment some games last longer some games are shorter
00:17:43
◼
►
But it's like you pay 60 bucks and you get the whole thing
00:17:46
◼
►
I play destiny which is like 60 bucks plus 20 or 30 bucks a year for the expansions plus the monthly fee for
00:17:54
◼
►
PlayStation Network, but that that still works out money wise now Pokemon go the problem is it's basically limitless
00:18:00
◼
►
Like you can't spend that there's a limit to how much you can spend on destiny per year minus the silver stuff
00:18:06
◼
►
But even that I feel like even if you've got a limited money to spend there's not that much to buy in the game and
00:18:11
◼
►
Everything you can buy in the game is cosmetic
00:18:12
◼
►
So if you buy every single expansion and you pay for PSN and you buy your PlayStation,
00:18:17
◼
►
there's a limit.
00:18:18
◼
►
Whereas with Pokemon Go, you could spend your entire life savings buying Pokeballs and using
00:18:23
◼
►
It seems like it's an unlimited potential pit of money.
00:18:25
◼
►
And so, I don't know.
00:18:27
◼
►
Those games bother me a little bit more because in order to continue to have fun with the
00:18:32
◼
►
game, you have to spend money.
00:18:34
◼
►
And you don't get new content for that money.
00:18:36
◼
►
You just get the ability to continue playing the content you have.
00:18:39
◼
►
hoping the Mario games aren't like that, but that's a winning monetization strategy that
00:18:43
◼
►
people seem comfortable with, which is if you want to grind, grind. If you don't want
00:18:46
◼
►
to grind, pass money and we'll shortcut that for you. Pokemon Go doesn't seem abusive in
00:18:51
◼
►
that way, and I'm assuming the Mario games won't be either, but I certainly prefer the
00:18:57
◼
►
other proposition, even the proposition of destiny, which I think is striking a reasonable
00:19:00
◼
►
balance of extracting money from me steadily over the course of years, but also giving
00:19:05
◼
►
me hundreds and hundreds of hours of entertainment.
00:19:07
◼
►
Yeah, so a couple other quick thoughts on Nintendo.
00:19:10
◼
►
First of all, Super Mario Go already has an entry that you can search for and find in
00:19:17
◼
►
the App Store.
00:19:18
◼
►
I'm sorry, Super Mario Run, I just called it Super Mario Go.
00:19:21
◼
►
It has an entry, a page if you will, on the App Store where you would typically see "Buy"
00:19:29
◼
►
It says "Notify," which I've never seen for an app before, which I thought was kind of
00:19:34
◼
►
This is the first.
00:19:35
◼
►
So that's different and it would be super cool if developers could leverage that, like
00:19:41
◼
►
not blessed developers but regular schmoes like us could use this to leverage the App
00:19:46
◼
►
Store to kind of generate a little bit of buzz about forthcoming apps if you so chose.
00:19:51
◼
►
But still, that's kind of neat and any thoughts on that before I get to my other thought?
00:19:57
◼
►
So the iBook Store, I used this for when I was selling my iBooks, has a pre-order system
00:20:01
◼
►
where you can put the book up and people can't buy it but they can pre-order, which is even
00:20:04
◼
►
better. Instead of just notifying people when it's available, they can give you the money
00:20:06
◼
►
right up front. And I made a lot on the pre-orders because people who were anxiously awaiting
00:20:10
◼
►
the book, most of them pre-ordered. So I guess that type of thing should come to the iOS
00:20:16
◼
►
Yeah. And then the other interesting thing, which I think is worth briefly mentioning,
00:20:21
◼
►
is that they specifically said on stage that there will be a sticker pack for iMessage
00:20:26
◼
►
that is themed around Super Mario Run, which is what I think they've been pushing. It runs
00:20:34
◼
►
relatively heavily since iOS 10 was announced at WWDC.
00:20:37
◼
►
So I'm curious to see if anything comes of that,
00:20:39
◼
►
but I thought that tie-in was kind of neat.
00:20:41
◼
►
- Yeah, sticker patch of the new ringtones.
00:20:42
◼
►
It's an opportunity for lots of tie-in
00:20:44
◼
►
to the big companies and big promotions.
00:20:46
◼
►
- I wonder if there will be more strict policing
00:20:49
◼
►
of copyright infringement.
00:20:51
◼
►
I know Apple in the past, specifically with Nintendo,
00:20:54
◼
►
has actually been pretty good about tracking down
00:20:57
◼
►
like at the very least NES emulators and Mario things.
00:21:00
◼
►
They still snuck through.
00:21:01
◼
►
But now that Nintendo itself is in the store, is Nintendo more motivated to have its team
00:21:07
◼
►
of lawyers wandering the store and stomping on anything that uses Mario in the name, uses
00:21:11
◼
►
its artwork, the million people trying to sell sticker packs that have pictures of Goombas
00:21:17
◼
►
and mushrooms and all the other stuff?
00:21:22
◼
►
You're one Google search away from trying to sell a 99.7-cent sticker pack full of someone
00:21:27
◼
►
Now that Nintendo is actually trying to sell its own version of that stuff
00:21:30
◼
►
I imagine it will be harder to sneak that stuff through if not
00:21:34
◼
►
That's gonna be weird when you do a search for Nintendo sticker pack
00:21:38
◼
►
You find a million sticker packs and buried somewhere in there because Apple search is awful as the real Nintendo one
00:21:43
◼
►
That will be super weird. We'll see
00:21:45
◼
►
In real time follow up from the chat room people are saying that I think they're talking about Mario run
00:21:50
◼
►
Paid up front knowing that purchase. That's what I'm reading in the chat room. Who knows mystery
00:21:55
◼
►
- That's not what it says on the iTunes store page.
00:21:57
◼
►
- Well it says here, user RT98_ says,
00:22:00
◼
►
basically that there's gonna be like a trial level
00:22:03
◼
►
first for free, and then you pay one fixed
00:22:06
◼
►
in-app purchase price to unlock the rest of the game.
00:22:08
◼
►
- Right, so it's not like you have to keep buying
00:22:11
◼
►
more energy or coins or whatever to be able to play.
00:22:15
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what DNS do I put in here to make this work.
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(upbeat music)
00:23:50
◼
►
So next thing in the presentation was the Apple Watch, and we can start with the name,
00:23:56
◼
►
I suppose. It is now called the Apple Watch Series 2.
00:23:59
◼
►
I think you mean Season 2.
00:24:02
◼
►
I see what you did there. I dig it, though. I really do like this name. I don't know what
00:24:09
◼
►
alternatives were kicked around. I'm not sure what I would have recommended, but I really
00:24:13
◼
►
like the idea of Series 2. I don't know why I prefer it over just Apple Watch 2, but I
00:24:21
◼
►
think I do prefer it. Maybe because it's more about fashion than the iPhone arguably is,
00:24:27
◼
►
but two thumbs up for the name in my opinion. What do you guys think about the name alone?
00:24:30
◼
►
Oh, I think it's great. I mean, the Apple, the first Apple Watch, which now has no name,
00:24:36
◼
►
because it's not the Series 1, that's different, which we'll get to. The first Apple Watch,
00:24:41
◼
►
Apple Watch Series Zero, that had kind of an odd naming structure where you had the
00:24:47
◼
►
Apple Watch Sport, which is the one that everybody actually bought, you had just the Apple Watch
00:24:51
◼
►
with no modifiers, which is the steel one, which is like the middle one, and you had
00:24:55
◼
►
the Apple Watch Edition, which nobody bought.
00:24:57
◼
►
And so you have, it was this weird combo, and nobody really knew what to call the steel
00:25:03
◼
►
one, and everyone would call the Sport one the Apple Watch, even though technically that
00:25:07
◼
►
was the name of a different model.
00:25:09
◼
►
So now they've kind of unified the naming.
00:25:11
◼
►
Now it seems from their website that the entire series two
00:25:15
◼
►
is just called Apple Watch series two.
00:25:17
◼
►
There is no more sport or steel distinction.
00:25:19
◼
►
- Oh is that right?
00:25:20
◼
►
- From what I can find, I could be wrong,
00:25:23
◼
►
but it sure looks like they're dropping
00:25:25
◼
►
like the sport distinction, now it's just,
00:25:28
◼
►
now they're just Apple Watch.
00:25:29
◼
►
And you can get the Apple Watch in steel,
00:25:31
◼
►
or all these wonderful aluminum colors,
00:25:33
◼
►
or the Apple Watch edition still has its own name,
00:25:35
◼
►
and the Apple Watch Hermes has its own name.
00:25:38
◼
►
I apologize to the great nation of France
00:25:40
◼
►
for how I'm pronouncing Hermes, it's probably wrong.
00:25:42
◼
►
And I apologize.
00:25:43
◼
►
- The Apple Watch and Nike Plus,
00:25:45
◼
►
which is another weird, like another company's name
00:25:47
◼
►
gets to define a single product.
00:25:49
◼
►
- Yeah, so they're basically moving into these like,
00:25:52
◼
►
you know, these major brand affiliations now
00:25:55
◼
►
with like fashion and sport brands.
00:25:56
◼
►
And you know, whatever, I don't know anything
00:25:58
◼
►
about that world, so that probably makes sense,
00:26:00
◼
►
I can't say.
00:26:01
◼
►
But overall, naming-wise, this is a very,
00:26:05
◼
►
I think it's a decent update.
00:26:06
◼
►
The only weird thing about it though,
00:26:07
◼
►
is as mentioned earlier, so there's a Series 2, that's fine.
00:26:11
◼
►
There's also a Series 1.
00:26:12
◼
►
Now this is almost the original Apple Watch,
00:26:15
◼
►
but with a really major difference,
00:26:17
◼
►
and that is with the new Apple Watch,
00:26:20
◼
►
they have upgraded the CPU to a pretty substantial upgrade.
00:26:23
◼
►
Now it's a dual-core one, which is allegedly a lot faster,
00:26:27
◼
►
but they said up to 50%,
00:26:28
◼
►
so they're probably clocked lower, who knows?
00:26:30
◼
►
Whatever it is, it's a dual-core model,
00:26:33
◼
►
it's a different CPU that is probably
00:26:35
◼
►
a lot faster in practice.
00:26:37
◼
►
and they're in what I commend as a great move
00:26:40
◼
►
for everybody, owners, developers.
00:26:43
◼
►
They have, they're basically retroactively installing
00:26:47
◼
►
this new CPU in the old model as they continue
00:26:51
◼
►
to sell the old model which is now called
00:26:53
◼
►
Apple Watch Series 1.
00:26:54
◼
►
So you can get Series 1 which is just the old Apple Watch
00:26:57
◼
►
with a faster CPU which is a big difference.
00:26:59
◼
►
Then you can get Series 2 which is the newest model
00:27:02
◼
►
which is that same CPU but with a higher grade
00:27:06
◼
►
waterproofing with GPS and a brighter screen. Is that it?
00:27:10
◼
►
I mean it's totally different, the inside. Like if you looked at the speaker diagram,
00:27:15
◼
►
the speaker is different, all the insides are different. For all I know the battery
00:27:17
◼
►
is a different size. It just looks the same on the outside for the most part, but inside
00:27:21
◼
►
it's basically all new. Every part of it is new. It seems the screen is new, the system
00:27:25
◼
►
on the chip thingy, whatever, is new. The battery is probably new, the speaker is new,
00:27:29
◼
►
the thing between the dial, the ceiling, like it just looks the same on the outside.
00:27:33
◼
►
It's actually thicker.
00:27:35
◼
►
- Is it actually?
00:27:36
◼
►
- Yeah, it's one millimeter thicker.
00:27:37
◼
►
It went from like 11 points to something like 12 point,
00:27:40
◼
►
- Oh, that's kind of a shame.
00:27:41
◼
►
- Honestly, and honestly, like, you know, for a watch,
00:27:43
◼
►
going from 11 to 12 is noticeable.
00:27:45
◼
►
That is a noticeable thickness increase.
00:27:46
◼
►
It's unfortunate, it's still not gonna be like,
00:27:49
◼
►
it's not gonna be like chunky or anything.
00:27:51
◼
►
Basically, whatever you thought about thickness before,
00:27:54
◼
►
you will still think that, but it is kind of unfortunate
00:27:56
◼
►
that it went in that direction on one of the products
00:27:58
◼
►
that could have used thinning out.
00:28:00
◼
►
- Yeah, it's nice though that they don't sell
00:28:03
◼
►
the Apple Watch anymore.
00:28:04
◼
►
First of all, it kind of makes it like, like Macintosh.
00:28:07
◼
►
The first Macintosh they introduced was not called the Mac 128K, because why would they
00:28:11
◼
►
need a distinction?
00:28:12
◼
►
It was just Macintosh, period.
00:28:13
◼
►
Uh, app, I, first iPhone was just iPhone, period.
00:28:16
◼
►
And the first Apple Watch was just Apple Watch, even though it had all those suffixes like
00:28:19
◼
►
addition and sport and so on and so forth, but there was no number or anything.
00:28:22
◼
►
So now that product that we all own is gone.
00:28:25
◼
►
Like, you can't buy it anymore.
00:28:27
◼
►
And imagine if that happened with phones.
00:28:28
◼
►
Like imagine if, if when they took the 6s and 6s plus and moved them down, they said,
00:28:33
◼
►
And by the way, put the A10 in all of those too. That would be like amazing
00:28:36
◼
►
Like this is it's kind of like the the series one is like the apology watch like we're sorry
00:28:40
◼
►
That's first Apple watch CPU was so darn slow
00:28:43
◼
►
but you see was supposed to ship way earlier, but the software wasn't ready so we had to hold it back for many months and
00:28:47
◼
►
Yada yada yada also we didn't have watch OS 3 ready and we didn't quite know what we were doing
00:28:52
◼
►
And so just forget about that watch second attempt at the same watch twice as fast inside watch OS 3
00:28:59
◼
►
Just forget about that old one and the old one I think will have sentimental though. It's like it's the first watch
00:29:03
◼
►
I honestly I don't think it was a bad product. I think
00:29:05
◼
►
It was good hardware wise the software. They hadn't figured out yet. I forgive all of it
00:29:11
◼
►
Series one is like the series one makes me more excited than the other ones because basically anyone making a watch OS app now
00:29:16
◼
►
It doesn't have to be like oh I have to support
00:29:18
◼
►
The the old watches like I guess they do for whoever bought those things
00:29:22
◼
►
But like the window has moved up so rapidly all of a sudden everybody who buys one even if they buy the cheap one
00:29:27
◼
►
this holiday season will be way faster and watchOS 3 will be way faster too.
00:29:31
◼
►
So even though, I mean, this is not an entirely redesigned watch, I don't think anyone expected
00:29:37
◼
►
it to be, but it's exactly what we thought it would be.
00:29:40
◼
►
Bigger battery, used to power GPS that can be on all the time, great for workouts and
00:29:44
◼
►
stuff like that.
00:29:45
◼
►
Better waterproofing, which is hard for me to believe considering how waterproof the
00:29:49
◼
►
other one was.
00:29:51
◼
►
And keeping the old watch around but not leaving it around and being crappy, so I give this
00:29:54
◼
►
- Give us thumbs up.
00:29:57
◼
►
It's nice that they didn't just keep selling the same one
00:30:00
◼
►
without changing it, just because like,
00:30:03
◼
►
the first Apple Watch is really, really slow.
00:30:07
◼
►
And it's good now to be able to tell somebody,
00:30:09
◼
►
to go into a store and just buy an Apple Watch.
00:30:11
◼
►
You don't have to tell them like,
00:30:12
◼
►
"Oh, don't get this model, that's the old one that sucks."
00:30:14
◼
►
Like, because you have to do that a lot of times
00:30:16
◼
►
with iPads and iPhones, but now you don't have to do that
00:30:18
◼
►
anymore, and well, all the Macs,
00:30:20
◼
►
you don't have to do that anymore now with the watch.
00:30:22
◼
►
Which is great because they're just all good.
00:30:26
◼
►
And I've noticed, I've taken note recently,
00:30:30
◼
►
whenever I've been out in the world,
00:30:31
◼
►
like we mentioned I spent a week
00:30:33
◼
►
in this beach town recently,
00:30:36
◼
►
and I looked around constantly
00:30:37
◼
►
kinda like taking inventory of watches,
00:30:39
◼
►
'cause now I'm a watch nerd
00:30:40
◼
►
and this is just what I do everywhere I go.
00:30:42
◼
►
And I've kinda noticed roughly what percentage I see
00:30:46
◼
►
of different smartwatches.
00:30:48
◼
►
How many Apple watches do I see?
00:30:49
◼
►
How many dumb watches do I see?
00:30:51
◼
►
how many different Android, things that look like
00:30:54
◼
►
Android Wear versus Pebble versus the Fitbit
00:30:57
◼
►
and Garmin watches.
00:30:58
◼
►
The single model I do see the most is the Apple Watch,
00:31:03
◼
►
but I would not say the Apple Watch has more than 50%
00:31:06
◼
►
of the share of smart watches I see.
00:31:08
◼
►
It's kinda like the iPhone in that way.
00:31:10
◼
►
It's like if you measure phone model
00:31:14
◼
►
versus other individual phone models,
00:31:16
◼
►
the iPhone is usually the best selling single phone
00:31:18
◼
►
in the world or US or whatever,
00:31:20
◼
►
But like the market share of iPhones versus all other
00:31:23
◼
►
Android phones combined, the iPhone is not more than 50%.
00:31:26
◼
►
It's usually a lot less.
00:31:28
◼
►
That's kinda how I see in the watch world now,
00:31:31
◼
►
in the smartwatch world, where when I,
00:31:32
◼
►
just out and about anecdotally,
00:31:34
◼
►
I see a ton of people wearing smartwatches.
00:31:36
◼
►
I was totally wrong.
00:31:38
◼
►
I thought this category was gonna be a little bit weird
00:31:39
◼
►
and people were gonna be very slow to adopt it.
00:31:41
◼
►
Nope, people love smartwatches.
00:31:43
◼
►
However, the ones I see the most,
00:31:47
◼
►
Apple is the single model I see the most,
00:31:49
◼
►
but most people are wearing either an Android one
00:31:52
◼
►
that I have a hard time recognizing,
00:31:53
◼
►
like which one in particular,
00:31:54
◼
►
or I do see a lot of the Fitbit ones,
00:31:57
◼
►
either the skinny, like cuff band things,
00:32:01
◼
►
or the square one with the diagonal bezel on it.
00:32:05
◼
►
You know what I'm talking about?
00:32:06
◼
►
- Yeah, I see a lot of Fitbits too,
00:32:08
◼
►
and I think that, I mean,
00:32:09
◼
►
I don't know what the numbers are like,
00:32:11
◼
►
I don't know how Fitbit is doing,
00:32:12
◼
►
but in my experience, like when you say smartwatches,
00:32:15
◼
►
I was wondering if you were encountering Fitbit,
00:32:16
◼
►
because people aren't wearing that as a watch,
00:32:18
◼
►
to wearing it essentially as a stay fit, stay healthy,
00:32:21
◼
►
lose weight, remain active measurement thing
00:32:25
◼
►
because Fitbit, even more so than the Pebble,
00:32:28
◼
►
Fitbit has the advantage of like,
00:32:30
◼
►
it's totally focused on fitness, it's cheap,
00:32:32
◼
►
it's practically disposable,
00:32:34
◼
►
battery lasts a really, really long time
00:32:36
◼
►
and it syncs with your phone
00:32:37
◼
►
and it just does the one thing they want it to do.
00:32:38
◼
►
Whereas the Apple Watch still seems like
00:32:40
◼
►
sledgehammer to kill an ant.
00:32:41
◼
►
If you just wanna keep track of your steps,
00:32:44
◼
►
you're gonna spend like hundreds of dollars
00:32:45
◼
►
to this fancy full featured giant watch
00:32:48
◼
►
with a screen that has software,
00:32:50
◼
►
or just buy a crappy little rubber Fitbit
00:32:52
◼
►
that if you lose it you don't care about it
00:32:54
◼
►
and you have five of them?
00:32:55
◼
►
- Well, so this is what I'm getting at though.
00:32:57
◼
►
So it certainly appears as though the market is really,
00:33:02
◼
►
you know, it's doing very well in the like
00:33:04
◼
►
basic fitness tracking and maybe notifications
00:33:07
◼
►
and you know, maybe some smart stuff,
00:33:08
◼
►
but like it seems like these,
00:33:09
◼
►
what people want most of the time from these
00:33:12
◼
►
is a fitness tracker.
00:33:13
◼
►
And because of that, and because all the other ones
00:33:16
◼
►
that I'm seeing that are kind of exploding recently,
00:33:18
◼
►
it does seem like there's a lot
00:33:19
◼
►
of downward price pressure here.
00:33:21
◼
►
So right now, the Apple Watch Series 2,
00:33:25
◼
►
the new default Apple Watch, is now $369 starting price.
00:33:29
◼
►
Before, was that, that was the one that was $399 before?
00:33:32
◼
►
Right, so it was like a minor--
00:33:33
◼
►
- I believe that's right. - Minor drop.
00:33:34
◼
►
So to have the Apple Watch still be nearly $400
00:33:37
◼
►
for the main one, when all the competition
00:33:40
◼
►
is offering these like 150 or $200 watches
00:33:44
◼
►
that are doing what most people actually want
00:33:46
◼
►
their smartwatch to do, it turns out.
00:33:48
◼
►
That's gonna put a lot of pressure on this market,
00:33:50
◼
►
especially in the holiday season this year.
00:33:52
◼
►
So to keep the Series 1 around at $100 less, it's $269,
00:33:57
◼
►
to keep that around is really smart
00:34:00
◼
►
because they have to find some way
00:34:02
◼
►
to drop the price on these by a lot.
00:34:04
◼
►
It is like, they can't just like get near it
00:34:08
◼
►
the way they did with iPads,
00:34:09
◼
►
'cause look what happened with low end
00:34:10
◼
►
tablet market share.
00:34:11
◼
►
Like Apple just lost it all because it turns out
00:34:13
◼
►
you can make tablets really cheaply
00:34:14
◼
►
and most people need a cheap tablet for tablet for
00:34:16
◼
►
is videos and basic browsing and games
00:34:19
◼
►
and that's fine to get the Amazon six pack.
00:34:21
◼
►
But like it is very important for Apple
00:34:24
◼
►
for the watch's future success to get that starting price
00:34:27
◼
►
as cheap as possible and to do it like this
00:34:29
◼
►
in a way that doesn't just sell the old one
00:34:31
◼
►
that actually makes it like a really good model
00:34:33
◼
►
'cause like looking at these models
00:34:35
◼
►
if I were buying one today I'd probably get the series one
00:34:38
◼
►
Also, because I don't care about GPS or water resistance.
00:34:41
◼
►
So I'd probably get that one because it's a little bit smaller and $100 cheaper, let's
00:34:46
◼
►
put that money towards a better band for it.
00:34:48
◼
►
That's a great thing to have in the lineup.
00:34:50
◼
►
So to have that be the entry price and to have that be the entry model is very, very
00:34:54
◼
►
But they are going to have to get that price down even further.
00:34:56
◼
►
Well, I think they're following the iPod playbook here where it's really expensive, Mac only
00:35:02
◼
►
in the beginning, whatever.
00:35:04
◼
►
Or like the iPhone thing, diversifying the line.
00:35:06
◼
►
iPods diversified and went downmarket really far to the point where it was like a $49 stick
00:35:11
◼
►
of gum thing, right?
00:35:12
◼
►
I don't think the watch is ever going to go down that far, but like the phone started
00:35:16
◼
►
as a singular product and diversified and kept the old models around and did stuff like
00:35:21
◼
►
And now that they're upgrading the old models, we'll get to that in the phone thing, that's
00:35:23
◼
►
also a viable strategy.
00:35:24
◼
►
But I totally see it like, I mean, this is the first design of the watch, right?
00:35:27
◼
►
Wait for the second or third design, it should start to diversify such that they are selling
00:35:32
◼
►
something that is more or less a direct competitor with the Fitbits at that point. Like Fitbit
00:35:39
◼
►
is pretty safe for now, hanging out with its little rubbery bands with the little turds
00:35:43
◼
►
inside them with a tiny LED display, right? But Apple will come for them eventually. Like
00:35:47
◼
►
Apple will not leave that market. But for now, Apple is content to... Like you were
00:35:52
◼
►
saying that the one you saw the most is the Apple Watch, as in the stainless steel one?
00:35:55
◼
►
Oh, no, no, no, no, no. I've seen a very small number of stainless steel ones ever in real
00:36:00
◼
►
life outside of WWDC. No, I would say by far the ones I saw the most were the sport ones,
00:36:07
◼
►
But like, the Apple Watch is still a bauble for people who shop in the Apple Store. Like,
00:36:12
◼
►
it assumes you have money to burn on fancy gadgets and you're already buying expensive
00:36:16
◼
►
crap at the Apple Store, buy some more expensive crap at the Apple Store, right? But iPod started
00:36:21
◼
►
out that way too. Do you have $500 to spend on a deck of cards at some music doohickey?
00:36:27
◼
►
Eventually they were selling those things at every increment of $50 from $50 up to several
00:36:33
◼
►
hundred and I think the watch can get there because as the, here's the thing, the CPU
00:36:40
◼
►
power and GPU power required to do a decent watch is within shooting distance in a generation
00:36:45
◼
►
or two of being acceptable and that will just shrink and shrink and shrink and shrink.
00:36:50
◼
►
And unlike a phone or something, you can make a watch, you know, if they work out this interface
00:36:56
◼
►
you can make the watch pretty slim and pretty small as long as it's still watch size and still keep most of the functionality
00:37:01
◼
►
So I think in several generations
00:37:04
◼
►
They'll have no place to go but down market to start pressing these things down
00:37:08
◼
►
I don't you know a hundred ninety nine dollar low-end Apple watch in a few years
00:37:12
◼
►
No problem hundred and fifty dollar one in four years. No problem
00:37:15
◼
►
And then where where is the room for your stupid rubbery band as Fitbit? There's no room left for you
00:37:19
◼
►
So I hope they execute on that strategy because I think it's a viable one
00:37:23
◼
►
but for now they seem mostly content to stay high-end.
00:37:27
◼
►
Although, speaking of high-end, I was interested to see that you don't hear about the edition much anymore,
00:37:32
◼
►
but they still have a product called Edition, and it's not gold anymore, it's ceramic,
00:37:36
◼
►
which looks cool, but it sure as hell isn't 17 grand anymore.
00:37:39
◼
►
Before we get to that, I wanted to just point something out about the other Apple Watches.
00:37:44
◼
►
So if you go to their interactive gallery, and we'll put a link in the show notes,
00:37:49
◼
►
the Edition isn't there, which I don't think it ever was, so that's not that terribly remarkable,
00:37:52
◼
►
But I was fiddling around on this while you guys were talking, and if you start with the cases,
00:37:57
◼
►
so you're picking effectively which watch to get,
00:37:59
◼
►
it shows you all the different sizes and colors and whatnot, and as you go through them and pick one,
00:38:06
◼
►
so if you take, for example, the 42 millimeter silver aluminum case, and then there's links at the bottom,
00:38:12
◼
►
I'm looking on a desktop, you know, buy model, and then that's where you go to actually buy it.
00:38:15
◼
►
What's interesting is it starts at
00:38:20
◼
►
269 for the 38 millimeter or 299 for the 42 millimeter, but then as you scroll down
00:38:24
◼
►
It's which series do you want?
00:38:26
◼
►
299 for the series 1 or 399 for the series 2 and I find that interesting because there's no clear distinction
00:38:33
◼
►
Like are you buying an iPhone 6 or you buy?
00:38:36
◼
►
6s actually or are you buying an iPhone 7 like the in my recollection is that was always a fork in the road?
00:38:44
◼
►
Whereas here it's just hey you want to get a 42 millimeter silver aluminum case Apple watch
00:38:49
◼
►
What flavor do you want? Do you want series 1, series 2, you know, 38, 42?
00:38:54
◼
►
Pick your poison. And that, to my recollection, is different than the way it used to be. And smart, because I think like you guys were saying,
00:39:01
◼
►
even though this is pitched as a fitness device,
00:39:04
◼
►
if you're not someone who's working out outside or working out in a swimming pool,
00:39:09
◼
►
why would you need the series 2? Maybe you always work out on a treadmill, or maybe you
00:39:15
◼
►
Never ever ever take this thing into any sort of water
00:39:19
◼
►
Save yourself the money like Marco was saying get the series one. It's it's effectively just as good if those things are not your priority
00:39:26
◼
►
I just thought that was cool. You lose the screens not as bright either. There are other actually that's true. That's true
00:39:31
◼
►
I'd forgotten about that
00:39:33
◼
►
But yeah, I just I think this is a very smart way of handling it now to come to the addition
00:39:38
◼
►
I did not realize that the ceramic was the addition until Marco mentioned it earlier. I heard them talk about the ceramic
00:39:45
◼
►
I didn't I didn't know that that was taking the moniker addition which apparently it is and so I'm sorry
00:39:50
◼
►
I interrupted interrupted you before I believe it was Marco that was talking. So tell me Marco as a watch nerd
00:39:56
◼
►
Why would I want a ceramic watch?
00:39:58
◼
►
Ceramic is really shiny. It looks really cool in person. It is an extremely hard material. It is very
00:40:06
◼
►
scratch and dent resistant
00:40:08
◼
►
More so than almost anything else you could make a watch out of it's kind of like sapphire in that way
00:40:13
◼
►
It's very high on the hardness scale,
00:40:16
◼
►
and you basically can't scratch it or dent it easily.
00:40:21
◼
►
However, it does shatter.
00:40:23
◼
►
All this hardness, typically for strength,
00:40:26
◼
►
you need to be able to take dents and flex.
00:40:29
◼
►
So typically materials that are extremely hard
00:40:32
◼
►
also have the problem of shattering
00:40:34
◼
►
if they get enough of an impact.
00:40:36
◼
►
So basically it would not be wise
00:40:39
◼
►
to use it on the sport model,
00:40:41
◼
►
and that's probably one of the reasons why they haven't.
00:40:43
◼
►
Now the other reason they haven't is because ceramic,
00:40:46
◼
►
for, you know, in the context of making watches out of it,
00:40:49
◼
►
ceramic is still fairly expensive
00:40:52
◼
►
and difficult to manufacture.
00:40:53
◼
►
It's just, you know, it's not that it can't be done,
00:40:56
◼
►
it just, it costs a lot to do it,
00:40:57
◼
►
and it takes, you know, a little more specialized machining
00:41:01
◼
►
and techniques and everything else.
00:41:02
◼
►
So, typically you don't find a lot of low-end watches
00:41:05
◼
►
made out of ceramic, it's just,
00:41:06
◼
►
it's not worth the cost to do it.
00:41:09
◼
►
this is exactly the kind of thing Apple should be doing.
00:41:11
◼
►
Because Apple is really good at exactly that kind of problem
00:41:15
◼
►
of mass producing things that most people
00:41:19
◼
►
can't make very well or at all,
00:41:21
◼
►
or to good quality or volume standards
00:41:24
◼
►
because it takes incredible manufacturing expertise
00:41:27
◼
►
or incredible investment up front in high end machines
00:41:30
◼
►
or something like that.
00:41:31
◼
►
Apple's very good at that.
00:41:33
◼
►
So like in the previous Apple Watch,
00:41:35
◼
►
They had the amazing DLC Space Black Steel Watch,
00:41:40
◼
►
they still sell, thank God, because it's amazing.
00:41:42
◼
►
The Space Black, which is what they call it,
00:41:45
◼
►
the Space Black Watch, the coating on that
00:41:47
◼
►
also is extremely hard and pretty much impossible
00:41:51
◼
►
to scratch or show any damage for,
00:41:53
◼
►
but because it is simply a coating on stainless steel,
00:41:56
◼
►
that will not have a shattering problem.
00:41:57
◼
►
So honestly, if you want a watch that's going
00:41:59
◼
►
to look really good, no matter how much damage it takes,
00:42:02
◼
►
get the Space Black Watch with the Link Bracelet.
00:42:04
◼
►
Like that's the one to get.
00:42:06
◼
►
But if you're gonna be doing high impact stuff,
00:42:11
◼
►
get the aluminum one and just accept that you might
00:42:14
◼
►
chip it or scratch it or scratch the screen
00:42:17
◼
►
just because if you hit it hard enough
00:42:18
◼
►
because that's better than shattering your whole watch.
00:42:20
◼
►
The ceramic one is gonna be really nice.
00:42:24
◼
►
I love that they have taken the edition
00:42:27
◼
►
which was completely out of reach
00:42:29
◼
►
for everybody who would buy an Apple Watch.
00:42:31
◼
►
Regular watches, if you go buy a solid gold regular watch,
00:42:35
◼
►
you're gonna spend over 10 grand, no question,
00:42:37
◼
►
and probably over 20.
00:42:38
◼
►
So that was not an unreasonable price
00:42:41
◼
►
for a solid gold high-end watch.
00:42:43
◼
►
But that's not really what people want
00:42:45
◼
►
if they're buying a solid gold high-end watch.
00:42:47
◼
►
They want a mechanical beauty piece
00:42:50
◼
►
that's going to last decades or more.
00:42:52
◼
►
They don't want a technology that's gonna perform
00:42:55
◼
►
like an iPad One and be about as useful
00:42:57
◼
►
as an iPad One in five years.
00:42:59
◼
►
So anyway, this is a smarter way to go.
00:43:01
◼
►
Bring the price way down,
00:43:03
◼
►
the addition, so the new edition, the ceramic is 1300 bucks.
00:43:06
◼
►
That's a great price point for this,
00:43:08
◼
►
'cause it's like, that's roughly
00:43:10
◼
►
what the high end link bracelet ones cost,
00:43:11
◼
►
plus like a couple hundred,
00:43:12
◼
►
and that's roughly what the Hermes ones cost.
00:43:15
◼
►
So that's a great price point for this.
00:43:17
◼
►
The one weird thing about it, I think,
00:43:19
◼
►
is that if you go to any place that sells ceramic watches,
00:43:22
◼
►
and you can't miss the ceramic watch case
00:43:24
◼
►
because it is glowing and bright,
00:43:26
◼
►
because ceramic, it's usually very highly polished,
00:43:28
◼
►
and they usually have link bracelets too,
00:43:30
◼
►
and so you see all these incredibly shiny white surfaces
00:43:34
◼
►
next to all the incredibly shiny black ceramic surfaces.
00:43:38
◼
►
And if I had to take a guess,
00:43:40
◼
►
black ceramic watches are probably way more popular
00:43:43
◼
►
than white ceramic watches, so I do wonder why now,
00:43:48
◼
►
a day after Labor Day,
00:43:50
◼
►
they've unveiled a white ceramic watch,
00:43:53
◼
►
and not a black one in addition or instead.
00:43:56
◼
►
- Johnny Ive has a lot of white pants.
00:44:00
◼
►
- Maybe in California they can wear white all year round.
00:44:03
◼
►
I don't know.
00:44:04
◼
►
So yeah, that's a weird thing.
00:44:05
◼
►
Maybe down the road we will get that.
00:44:09
◼
►
You get the black one maybe at the spring refresh event
00:44:11
◼
►
or something, who knows.
00:44:12
◼
►
But that is kind of a weird omission,
00:44:15
◼
►
to offer white ceramic in the edition
00:44:17
◼
►
and not offer black ceramic
00:44:19
◼
►
because black ceramic is very popular.
00:44:21
◼
►
So we'll see about that.
00:44:23
◼
►
The other thing about, you know,
00:44:24
◼
►
there's the entire Hermes collection
00:44:25
◼
►
and that's not entirely new,
00:44:27
◼
►
because we've had that for a while,
00:44:29
◼
►
but that too I think is interesting.
00:44:31
◼
►
If you look at an actual Hermes watch
00:44:34
◼
►
that's not an Apple watch,
00:44:35
◼
►
they sell lots of watches themselves.
00:44:37
◼
►
There's actually one that I really like a lot
00:44:39
◼
►
called the Slim, oh God, the Slim de Hermes, de Hermes.
00:44:44
◼
►
I'm so sorry to the entire nation of France.
00:44:46
◼
►
It's a beautiful watch, it's $7,000,
00:44:49
◼
►
and I don't think I wanna spend $7,000 on that watch
00:44:53
◼
►
even though it's beautiful.
00:44:54
◼
►
to get the Hermes name and an Hermes strap
00:44:58
◼
►
on a nice looking watch for a thousand bucks
00:45:01
◼
►
is actually a pretty good buy in the watch world.
00:45:04
◼
►
And that is expensive compared to the Apple Watch,
00:45:08
◼
►
well it used to be called the Apple Watch Sport,
00:45:10
◼
►
but for people who want something nice
00:45:12
◼
►
and are willing to spend a little bit more,
00:45:13
◼
►
that's not that different.
00:45:14
◼
►
That's within reach, right?
00:45:16
◼
►
It's still a lot of money, but it's within reach.
00:45:18
◼
►
So I think bringing the whole price ceiling down
00:45:21
◼
►
from literally $15,000 down to like $1400, I think is really smart.
00:45:28
◼
►
Yeah, I didn't realize until you just said that that the new ceramic edition is just
00:45:35
◼
►
barely more than the super fancy Darth Vader setup of stainless steel with space black
00:45:43
◼
►
and all that stuff. That's much, I mean, obviously $1300 or $1500 or whatever it is is a lot
00:45:49
◼
►
less than 10 plus thousand but I didn't realize it is just a hop skip and a jump away from
00:45:54
◼
►
from the more expensive regular ones that's that's impressive and I dig it.
00:45:59
◼
►
I imagine Johnny Ive has a white ceramic link bracelet that he's wearing right now with
00:46:03
◼
►
the ceramic watch edition.
00:46:05
◼
►
I'm kind of I'm also surprised they don't have black and I'm also surprised there's
00:46:08
◼
►
no ceramic link bracelet if that's even a thing that they do because it would just go
00:46:12
◼
►
together so nicely but gotta leave room for the you know twice yearly updates and I could
00:46:17
◼
►
totally see them making a black ceramic one of these. Yeah, I'm surprised there weren't
00:46:23
◼
►
that many new straps. There was, I mean, maybe there were some new colors mixed in there,
00:46:27
◼
►
but the only one I really noticed was the Nike one with the holes in it, which I thought
00:46:30
◼
►
looked pretty cool. Like, that whole watch, the Nike...
00:46:32
◼
►
Wait, hold on.
00:46:33
◼
►
Oh, God. Oh, no.
00:46:34
◼
►
I can't let that go.
00:46:36
◼
►
You thought that looked good?
00:46:38
◼
►
I mean, I wouldn't wear it on my wrist, but it doesn't look as cool as a sculpture, as
00:46:43
◼
►
like a product shot.
00:46:45
◼
►
- It looks as cool as the iPhone 5C hole cases.
00:46:49
◼
►
Remember those?
00:46:50
◼
►
- No, it's cooler than that.
00:46:52
◼
►
- I actually didn't think those were bad.
00:46:55
◼
►
This is, I think it's the colors that drive me so crazy.
00:46:58
◼
►
Like the look of it in and of itself,
00:47:00
◼
►
like if it was just black, let's say, or just white,
00:47:02
◼
►
I don't think the whole cutout,
00:47:04
◼
►
the cross drill look is that bad.
00:47:07
◼
►
But these god awful neon colors, oh no, thank you.
00:47:10
◼
►
- It's Nike branded, it's branded within an inch of its life
00:47:12
◼
►
Like the whole, you look at that,
00:47:13
◼
►
you know that's Nike branded.
00:47:15
◼
►
Like the whole thing, it's just the colors match
00:47:17
◼
►
on the screen and on the thing and the whole Nike
00:47:19
◼
►
with the font and everything, like that is a Nike sport.
00:47:23
◼
►
Look at the stuff that they sell.
00:47:24
◼
►
That is exactly on brand for them.
00:47:26
◼
►
And I even give them credit for saying,
00:47:28
◼
►
"You know what, we have holes in it."
00:47:29
◼
►
And it's not just like we had to come up
00:47:31
◼
►
with some way to add neon.
00:47:32
◼
►
It's vaguely functional.
00:47:34
◼
►
Like if it's gonna be a sport watch,
00:47:35
◼
►
this one will certainly breathe more than one
00:47:37
◼
►
that doesn't have holes
00:47:38
◼
►
because the holes are pretty darn big.
00:47:39
◼
►
So, you know, if you're already buying neon Nike running shoes and like headbands and
00:47:47
◼
►
like all the other outfits and just spandex or whatever, like this fits right in with
00:47:51
◼
►
that aesthetic.
00:47:52
◼
►
You're not going to wear it to dinner at night because it's like a glowing green black thing
00:47:57
◼
►
with this weird slanty font on it, but I think it is exactly on brand.
00:48:03
◼
►
I mean, you have a million different kinds of watch.
00:48:05
◼
►
I think it looks less ridiculous than that double cuff thing, that Hermes thing with
00:48:11
◼
►
I don't understand those.
00:48:13
◼
►
The one that wraps around twice?
00:48:14
◼
►
Yeah, I know what you're talking about.
00:48:15
◼
►
That's weird.
00:48:16
◼
►
The one that has two parallel straps?
00:48:18
◼
►
Like alright, do we have some sort of…
00:48:20
◼
►
Is this like some sort of disease where you're afraid that the watch is going to depart and
00:48:23
◼
►
you need to just keep adding more and more straps?
00:48:25
◼
►
Well, you'd put an 801 if that was the reason.
00:48:27
◼
►
No, but that's like…
00:48:28
◼
►
I'm looking at the picture of the one with the two buckles.
00:48:30
◼
►
It's like, how many hands do you need to put this watch on?
00:48:33
◼
►
Like, is this the only people with assistance
00:48:35
◼
►
to help them get dressed?
00:48:36
◼
►
- It's like a wrist corset.
00:48:38
◼
►
- Yeah, oh my god.
00:48:40
◼
►
- Eventually, people are gonna be lacing them up.
00:48:42
◼
►
- Definitely a part of, even though I'm so into watches,
00:48:44
◼
►
that's definitely a part of fashion
00:48:45
◼
►
I do not understand at all.
00:48:47
◼
►
- Goodness, all right.
00:48:48
◼
►
So all in all, to summarize the watch,
00:48:51
◼
►
I'm giving this two thumbs up.
00:48:53
◼
►
I think this looks great.
00:48:54
◼
►
A few people seemed perturbed
00:48:57
◼
►
that this didn't include a cellular modem.
00:49:01
◼
►
Maybe if and when that time comes, which presumably it will, maybe I'll think, "My goodness, I
00:49:07
◼
►
want this, it's amazing."
00:49:08
◼
►
But sitting here now, I don't think I really need or necessarily want a cellular modem
00:49:14
◼
►
on my watch.
00:49:15
◼
►
My watch is always within reach of my phone or within a Wi-Fi connection to my phone.
00:49:20
◼
►
I'm not disappointed by that.
00:49:22
◼
►
I think adding GPS is smart.
00:49:23
◼
►
I think adding the battery to offset that new power-hungry GPS is smart.
00:49:28
◼
►
I think this looks great and keeping the Series 1 around while giving it that shadow update
00:49:32
◼
►
like you guys were talking about is smart.
00:49:34
◼
►
I am all on board with this.
00:49:36
◼
►
I don't think I'm going to get a new one.
00:49:39
◼
►
I would like the GPS, but it's not do or die for me.
00:49:43
◼
►
I would like the better water protection, but again, not do or die for me.
00:49:49
◼
►
So I think I'm going to wait.
00:49:52
◼
►
But man, if you're thinking about an Apple Watch, now's the time.
00:49:56
◼
►
This is a great, great, great lineup.
00:49:57
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean like the cellular modem,
00:49:59
◼
►
that was never gonna happen this year.
00:50:01
◼
►
I mean, if you look at the limitations of,
00:50:04
◼
►
they have this very, you know, compared to a phone,
00:50:07
◼
►
this very, very small enclosure here
00:50:10
◼
►
that has to sell for a very low price point
00:50:12
◼
►
and has to have very long battery life,
00:50:15
◼
►
the limitations of what they can cram in there,
00:50:18
◼
►
both space-wise and for power and heat concerns,
00:50:21
◼
►
they can barely, just now, like a year and a half
00:50:24
◼
►
after they launched the original watch,
00:50:26
◼
►
they can now just barely get it performing well
00:50:30
◼
►
to just do local stuff,
00:50:31
◼
►
to just hit buttons and change screens.
00:50:34
◼
►
They can barely achieve that now.
00:50:37
◼
►
So the idea of throwing in a cellular modem
00:50:39
◼
►
and having enough free space and power and budget
00:50:44
◼
►
to have all that in there, I think it's just unrealistic.
00:50:48
◼
►
That was never going to happen this year.
00:50:50
◼
►
We're lucky we got GPS.
00:50:51
◼
►
- Yeah, I agree.
00:50:52
◼
►
But all in all, you're pleased with the Marco?
00:50:54
◼
►
- Absolutely.
00:50:55
◼
►
I still don't really think it's for me,
00:50:57
◼
►
but if I decided to go back to being
00:50:59
◼
►
an Apple Watch wearer every day,
00:51:01
◼
►
I would absolutely get one of the new Series 2 models.
00:51:04
◼
►
Probably the stainless steel like I had before,
00:51:07
◼
►
'cause that's a good balance for me
00:51:09
◼
►
of looks and budget and functionality.
00:51:13
◼
►
But yeah, a solid, solid update,
00:51:15
◼
►
and I think what remains to be seen
00:51:18
◼
►
is how much faster the CPU is in reality.
00:51:22
◼
►
That I think I'm looking forward
00:51:24
◼
►
to people's reactions and reviews to see that in practice,
00:51:27
◼
►
and to see if there's any other downsides,
00:51:29
◼
►
like is the battery life substantially different or worse
00:51:32
◼
►
under certain usage profiles or whatever else.
00:51:34
◼
►
But it's probably gonna be really good.
00:51:36
◼
►
So I would say if you are an Apple Watch user
00:51:38
◼
►
and you wouldn't miss a few hundred dollars,
00:51:41
◼
►
buy the new one.
00:51:43
◼
►
- And we haven't mentioned,
00:51:44
◼
►
and I don't wanna talk about it now
00:51:46
◼
►
'cause I think we covered it relatively well
00:51:48
◼
►
in the WWDC episode, but WatchOS 3 is great.
00:51:51
◼
►
I think it's a little overblown right now how much more instant everything is, but I
00:51:56
◼
►
think a lot of that is coming from me not having watchOS 3 built third-party apps.
00:52:02
◼
►
But watchOS 3 is great and made my Apple Watch Series 0 feel a heck of a lot better.
00:52:09
◼
►
And I really like the changes they've done to the way watchOS 3 works, or the changes
00:52:15
◼
►
they've done between 2 and 3.
00:52:16
◼
►
So all good things on the watch, but Jon, why don't you wrap it up for us?
00:52:20
◼
►
Yeah, as someone who has stopped wearing his Apple watch, I still have fond feelings about
00:52:25
◼
►
I still look at it occasionally.
00:52:26
◼
►
Once in a while, I wear it.
00:52:28
◼
►
Mostly I stopped wearing it just because I'm not a watch person and this wasn't able to
00:52:31
◼
►
get me over the hump.
00:52:32
◼
►
But all that said, none of these new watches are making me want to buy them.
00:52:35
◼
►
I'm still waiting to see the next generation to get it slimmed down to the actual big redesign.
00:52:43
◼
►
But I think Marco hit the nail on the head earlier when he said the most important aspect
00:52:48
◼
►
this watch design from the perspective of a technical person is that it is now 100%
00:52:53
◼
►
completely safe to tell anyone just go into the store and buy an Apple Watch because none of them
00:52:57
◼
►
are stinkers. I mean even if they had just done the hardware that would be true but the hardware
00:53:03
◼
►
plus watchOS 3 I feel confident that anybody who is vaguely interested in going there and whichever
00:53:10
◼
►
one you buy will be great and be aware like you know about the GPS because I think that is if they
00:53:14
◼
►
had to pick one feature to add for that big battery they picked the right one because I know
00:53:17
◼
►
I know a lot of people who, I mean, my wife included,
00:53:20
◼
►
she has this giant clunky Garmin GPS watch
00:53:23
◼
►
because if you're a runner
00:53:25
◼
►
and you want to keep track of your runs,
00:53:26
◼
►
you want to show me exactly where I ran,
00:53:28
◼
►
like my exact route.
00:53:30
◼
►
Like that's an important feature.
00:53:32
◼
►
And to have to have your big clunky phone with you,
00:53:35
◼
►
especially if it's a plus,
00:53:36
◼
►
is difficult to try to find like a belt to strap it to
00:53:38
◼
►
and then you're wearing your watch.
00:53:39
◼
►
And so she ends up just wearing the Garmin GPS thing
00:53:41
◼
►
because she can bring one thing with her.
00:53:43
◼
►
These are both good products.
00:53:46
◼
►
Series 1 and Series 2 are both good products.
00:53:49
◼
►
The fatter watch, now that I know it's an only meter fatter,
00:53:51
◼
►
reminds me a little bit of my beloved iPad 3.
00:53:55
◼
►
- But you know, like, the ceramic, everything about it,
00:53:59
◼
►
like this, I think is the right compromise
00:54:04
◼
►
between new features, new technology and everything
00:54:06
◼
►
while we wait for the big redesigned Apple Watch Series 3
00:54:10
◼
►
or whatever they change it to.
00:54:12
◼
►
So I'm not tempted to buy one,
00:54:14
◼
►
but I am happy with the update.
00:54:15
◼
►
The only thing I would say though is that
00:54:18
◼
►
with the exception of the GPS,
00:54:19
◼
►
which as you mentioned, that's no small thing
00:54:21
◼
►
because as we've been talking about,
00:54:24
◼
►
the Apple Watch has really found its market
00:54:26
◼
►
in fitness tracking.
00:54:27
◼
►
That's such a big part of it,
00:54:29
◼
►
of why people buy it and why people use it.
00:54:31
◼
►
So to add one big thing to help that market tremendously
00:54:36
◼
►
is totally worth it and totally the right call.
00:54:38
◼
►
But I will say though, other than GPS,
00:54:41
◼
►
they didn't really address any of the reasons
00:54:43
◼
►
why you wouldn't have wanted one before.
00:54:45
◼
►
So basically, if you were already into the Apple Watch,
00:54:48
◼
►
this is a great update.
00:54:49
◼
►
If you didn't buy one before for a particular reason,
00:54:53
◼
►
other than GPS, that reason probably still applies.
00:54:57
◼
►
- One more thing on the watch before we leave.
00:54:58
◼
►
I left out the most important reason for my life,
00:55:02
◼
►
my personal life.
00:55:04
◼
►
My wife, I assume, will be getting a new Apple Watch.
00:55:06
◼
►
She does not have an Apple Watch.
00:55:08
◼
►
She's thought about getting, she's seen mine,
00:55:10
◼
►
she knows what it's like, she's thought about getting it,
00:55:12
◼
►
but for a variety of reasons,
00:55:13
◼
►
just never gotten over the hump for that. I mean, part of it is that she can't wear
00:55:18
◼
►
it in all places at work, so she can wear a Fitbit everywhere at work, or most places
00:55:22
◼
►
at work, but can't wear the Apple Watch, which is kind of a pain. But like I said, she does
00:55:25
◼
►
run, she does use a big clunky Garmin GPS thing when she runs, she does have a Fitbit.
00:55:30
◼
►
So she's got the Garmin, she's got the Fitbit, and she's got the iPhone. The thing that's
00:55:35
◼
►
going to put her over the edge is Pokémon Go on the watch. That's what it's going to
00:55:39
◼
►
Because she is still playing Pokemon go and it's really difficult with a success plus
00:55:44
◼
►
like to just have that big phone out and the game makes you either have the phone out or have it in like
00:55:49
◼
►
It's supposed to have like the sleep mode where you turn it upside down and the screen goes off and it never quite works
00:55:53
◼
►
Right. It's a little bit buggy
00:55:54
◼
►
but to be able to do like I now I know enough about the game when they're showing like oh you can incubate your
00:55:59
◼
►
eggs and see how much time you have left and ba ba like I know what all those things are and I know that she
00:56:03
◼
►
Does it with her giant phone out if she could just do it with the watch?
00:56:06
◼
►
This is I almost guarantee that she's going to get an Apple watch and she'll claim it's not because of Pokemon go but it kind is
00:56:13
◼
►
We also sponsored this week by tracker now smart car smart phone smart home technology has made everything smart
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But losing stuff still makes people feel really dumb now people lose stuff all the time just misplacing things
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It's this little button thing.
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It's barely as big as a keychain.
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You pair Tracker to your smartphone.
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You can attach it to anything and then find
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It's that easy.
00:56:56
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So you lose your phone, push the button on Tracker,
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and your phone will ring.
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It'll make an alert sound even if it's on silent mode.
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You can also do it in reverse.
00:57:05
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You can, if you have the device,
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but you don't know where the tracker is,
00:57:10
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you can go to the tracker app on your phone
00:57:12
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and say, "Hey, find this device,"
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and then the tracker itself will beep.
00:57:15
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So it's really cool how you can find things
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both ways with this thing.
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It's great for any kind of misplaced,
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and you can have more than one paired to your phone.
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Thank you very much.
00:57:59
◼
►
(upbeat music)
00:58:03
◼
►
We have not yet mentioned vastly improved diversity of the presentation crew on this presentation.
00:58:11
◼
►
Yeah, from the start it was a lot, lot better.
00:58:15
◼
►
I was disappointed in it.
00:58:17
◼
►
God, I can never get her name pronounced right, but Bozema St. John, I believe, is it?
00:58:22
◼
►
I was disappointed she wasn't there because she just killed it at WWDC.
00:58:27
◼
►
But many, many, many more not white, not dude faces, which is a vast improvement I was really
00:58:34
◼
►
happy to see.
00:58:35
◼
►
Although Jason pointed out earlier, Jason Snell had pointed out earlier, that most of
00:58:41
◼
►
that diversity was either in the photography that was shown by the white dudes or by third
00:58:48
◼
►
parties that were coming on stage.
00:58:50
◼
►
Some of it was Apple themselves, but a lot of it was the third parties, which is a bit
00:58:53
◼
►
of a bummer.
00:58:54
◼
►
But I'll take any improvement at all.
00:58:58
◼
►
So that's a good step.
00:58:59
◼
►
>> Yeah, basically, it's progress, but we're not done.
00:59:02
◼
►
>> Yep, very well summarized.
00:59:04
◼
►
>> And I think the new factor here is they're finding new ways to make progress.
00:59:08
◼
►
Because again, it's Tim and Phil and what's his name on the watch?
00:59:14
◼
►
Sorry, I can't remember.
00:59:15
◼
►
There's a bunch of old white guys who are roughly the same age who are still in charge
00:59:17
◼
►
of all these major projects, right?
00:59:19
◼
►
So that isn't changing, and that's difficult to change on a dime.
00:59:22
◼
►
you can change who's in the product photos easily. And it's amazing that it hadn't occurred
00:59:26
◼
►
to them to lean on that more heavily in the past. Because they have. They've always done
00:59:30
◼
►
a pretty good job on that. But they're like, you know what? If we can't do it in this other
00:59:33
◼
►
area, if we can't fire fill and replace him, right? And we don't want to, we'll just lean
00:59:38
◼
►
really hard in the other area that we can control. They're finding more levers to pull
00:59:43
◼
►
to try to make an effort in this area. And it's good that they're not sort of deciding
00:59:47
◼
►
that they're done and just coasting.
00:59:49
◼
►
Yep, I was pleased to see that.
00:59:52
◼
►
So iPhone 7.
00:59:54
◼
►
Well, Phil came on stage.
00:59:57
◼
►
This is Phil, I think, at his best.
00:59:59
◼
►
Phil Schiller, just really happy, really enthusiastic.
01:00:04
◼
►
And he said that he was going to go through 10 different points to describe the new iPhone
01:00:11
◼
►
And I think we're just going to go through them one by one.
01:00:14
◼
►
The very first one, the refined was the word to use, design, which outside of colors basically
01:00:23
◼
►
meant move the antenna up to the top and to the bottom, and otherwise it looks about the
01:00:32
◼
►
same to my eye.
01:00:33
◼
►
Yeah, I tweeted this was hanging a lantern on it.
01:00:36
◼
►
It's the expression from like script writing where you have something that doesn't really
01:00:39
◼
►
make sense in the plot of your movie, and the way you handle it is by having one of
01:00:42
◼
►
characters in the movie say, "But this doesn't make sense! That shouldn't even be possible!"
01:00:46
◼
►
And once they say that, the audience accepts, "Oh, if no one says that the audience is insulted,
01:00:51
◼
►
like, you expect me to believe this, that's not how that works." But if someone in the
01:00:54
◼
►
movie says, "But that's not possible! That shouldn't be happening!" It's like, "Yeah,
01:00:58
◼
►
that's what I'm thinking too in the audience guy up on the screen, now I feel better about
01:01:01
◼
►
it!" So this is the same design. We've talked about this before. It's not, they haven't
01:01:04
◼
►
changed it. I think all the old cases fit too, like, is it exactly the same down to
01:01:08
◼
►
the millimeter?
01:01:09
◼
►
The cases won't fit because the camera openings are now totally different.
01:01:12
◼
►
- Even on the 7?
01:01:13
◼
►
- Yeah, it's a much bigger camera opening.
01:01:17
◼
►
'Cause my, so the exterior dimensions all told,
01:01:20
◼
►
leaving aside the camera bump,
01:01:22
◼
►
the exterior dimensions are identical,
01:01:26
◼
►
or if not identical, then so unbelievably fricking close
01:01:29
◼
►
that I don't know how you can tell the difference.
01:01:32
◼
►
But you make an interesting point, Marco,
01:01:34
◼
►
that I hadn't considered,
01:01:35
◼
►
that the camera bumps are different,
01:01:37
◼
►
so that might, well, certainly on the 7, 7 Plus.
01:01:41
◼
►
I mean, you don't have a hole for the headphone port coming,
01:01:43
◼
►
so at the very least it would be weird
01:01:45
◼
►
to put a six on there and have this hole
01:01:47
◼
►
where there's nothing.
01:01:48
◼
►
But at any rate, essentially the same design,
01:01:51
◼
►
and they lead with that, with the new design,
01:01:53
◼
►
and the Johnny Eye video is great because,
01:01:57
◼
►
what is he gonna say about this?
01:01:58
◼
►
Like he says all the things you would expect him to say,
01:02:00
◼
►
like this is our third bite of this apple.
01:02:02
◼
►
This is our third, you know,
01:02:02
◼
►
it's the ultimate refinement of this design, right?
01:02:04
◼
►
So this is a design they've had time to work on.
01:02:08
◼
►
First one was a little bendy, second one was stiffer,
01:02:10
◼
►
and now they're just like, the antenna lines,
01:02:12
◼
►
they're just, you can imagine if they were forced
01:02:16
◼
►
by some unseen, an alien to say,
01:02:19
◼
►
"You have to keep doing this design forever,"
01:02:21
◼
►
and just refining it,
01:02:22
◼
►
Johnny Eye would just continue to find ways
01:02:23
◼
►
to reduce moving parts and make it better
01:02:25
◼
►
and just, you know, thinner and lighter.
01:02:27
◼
►
But if you watch that video again,
01:02:29
◼
►
the Johnny Eye video is available on Apple's website,
01:02:31
◼
►
I think they call it the design video,
01:02:33
◼
►
"Wait until the last line he says,"
01:02:35
◼
►
which is, I forget the exact wording.
01:02:38
◼
►
He basically recaps what he said at the beginning.
01:02:40
◼
►
At the end, he says, this is the ultimate incarnation
01:02:44
◼
►
or whatever, I'm paraphrasing,
01:02:45
◼
►
I don't remember what he says, of this design.
01:02:47
◼
►
And the way he says it,
01:02:48
◼
►
he says this is the ultimate incarnation of this design.
01:02:51
◼
►
Like he says it as if he's holding,
01:02:53
◼
►
he's holding the iPhone 8 in his hand while he says it.
01:02:56
◼
►
It's like, I can't believe they let that intonation go in.
01:02:58
◼
►
They go listen to it again.
01:02:59
◼
►
Marco will put a clip in right here
01:03:01
◼
►
and we'll be able to hear how it is.
01:03:02
◼
►
It's totally weird.
01:03:03
◼
►
(upbeat music)
01:03:06
◼
►
When complete, iPhone 7 is the most singular,
01:03:11
◼
►
the most evolved representation of this design.
01:03:15
◼
►
- But honestly, hanging a lantern on it
01:03:21
◼
►
or lampshading it or whatever you wanna call it
01:03:24
◼
►
for the new design, I think it worked on me.
01:03:26
◼
►
You know why?
01:03:27
◼
►
Like we knew about the jet black ahead of time
01:03:28
◼
►
or you did if you were looking at rumor sites.
01:03:31
◼
►
I really liked the jet black.
01:03:32
◼
►
I think the product shots of this thing are amazing.
01:03:35
◼
►
I've never been a hater of this design as much a marker with.
01:03:37
◼
►
I think it is a perfectly cromulent design.
01:03:41
◼
►
It is a rounded rectangle.
01:03:43
◼
►
Shouldn't have been bendy, way too slippery.
01:03:46
◼
►
But aesthetically speaking, the jet black one
01:03:49
◼
►
is the first one of this design that I actually
01:03:51
◼
►
could say that I've liked.
01:03:52
◼
►
Not just tolerate it and say, yeah, it's fine, it's OK.
01:03:55
◼
►
I think the jet black one looks freaking cool.
01:03:58
◼
►
Can you tell me what cromulent means?
01:03:59
◼
►
It's not in the Apple dictionary.
01:04:01
◼
►
Just it would take too long.
01:04:03
◼
►
- Except for the other show.
01:04:07
◼
►
- So I agree with you that the Jet Black,
01:04:09
◼
►
at least aesthetically, looks awesome.
01:04:12
◼
►
I immediately thought to myself,
01:04:16
◼
►
oh, I know what I'm getting,
01:04:17
◼
►
I'm gonna be getting a Jet Black iPhone 7,
01:04:20
◼
►
and then I thought other things,
01:04:21
◼
►
which we'll talk about in a minute.
01:04:23
◼
►
But what was interesting was I had noticed earlier today
01:04:27
◼
►
that Apple basically comes out and all but says,
01:04:32
◼
►
Well, the JetBlack one is probably going to get the
01:04:37
◼
►
smithereens scratched out of it.
01:04:39
◼
►
So it says on the page that you go to go ahead and buy it,
01:04:43
◼
►
footnote number two.
01:04:44
◼
►
"The high gloss finish of the JetBlack iPhone 7 is achieved
01:04:47
◼
►
through a precision nine-step
01:04:48
◼
►
anodization and polishing process.
01:04:51
◼
►
Its surface is equally as hard as other
01:04:53
◼
►
anodized Apple products.
01:04:54
◼
►
However, its high shine may show fine
01:04:56
◼
►
microabrasions with use.
01:04:58
◼
►
If you are concerned about this, we suggest you use one of
01:05:00
◼
►
many cases available to protect your iPhone.
01:05:04
◼
►
Or just get the black one without the jet.
01:05:08
◼
►
I think that's the most important aspect of this, aesthetically speaking, before we get
01:05:11
◼
►
into how these things might feel, is that black is back.
01:05:13
◼
►
I hate the white front of all iOS devices.
01:05:16
◼
►
I think it's crazy to put an actual bright white physical device next to your screen.
01:05:21
◼
►
It just makes your screen look dingy because your screen is never going to be as white
01:05:24
◼
►
as a reflective white surface.
01:05:26
◼
►
Black, black, use it in all your product shots.
01:05:28
◼
►
It makes the surface look like one big giant featureless thing and the screen just comes out of it black everywhere black front black back
01:05:34
◼
►
Everywhere black is back. I'm happy about that and I have two blacks. It's so awesome
01:05:38
◼
►
They have not space black not space great
01:05:40
◼
►
Just black and jet black and I agree that the I wish they call the piano black
01:05:44
◼
►
But I agree that the shiny black one. I mean
01:05:47
◼
►
Can you even look at it? Can you even take it out of the case?
01:05:50
◼
►
Like it's like the guitar and spinal tap don't touch it. Don't even look at it
01:05:53
◼
►
Like you can't touch that with your fingers like it's just you know
01:05:56
◼
►
It's like the piano black and Marco's car right you have that friend and near a Tesla right mm-hmm though
01:06:01
◼
►
You can't touch it. You can't breathe on it
01:06:04
◼
►
You can't do anything with it
01:06:05
◼
►
But boy does it look good in product shots and it takes a lot to get me excited about the same laws in shape
01:06:10
◼
►
That's been here for three years, but they found a way to do it. Yeah visually visually. I think this looks unbelievably good, right?
01:06:18
◼
►
So now do you think this thing is gonna squirt out of our hands like oh like one of those little
01:06:21
◼
►
Inverted water balloon things you know what those are
01:06:24
◼
►
- Well, so, what's interesting about this,
01:06:28
◼
►
so Gruber was in the hands-on area
01:06:30
◼
►
doing a couple of periscopes earlier today,
01:06:32
◼
►
and he said that people were asking about the grippiness
01:06:37
◼
►
of the two different blacks, and he said that,
01:06:39
◼
►
and there was a couple people that backed this up
01:06:40
◼
►
so it's not just him, that the jet black super shiny one
01:06:44
◼
►
is almost tacky feeling, it is surprisingly grippier
01:06:48
◼
►
than the regular steel or the regular aluminum ones
01:06:51
◼
►
that we've had to date, and grippier
01:06:53
◼
►
than the matte black one.
01:06:55
◼
►
So this is gonna be interesting.
01:06:58
◼
►
Basically, what do you choose here?
01:07:00
◼
►
Do you choose something that looks better
01:07:03
◼
►
in pristine conditions, but is probably gonna look worse
01:07:08
◼
►
all times of day, every day in reality,
01:07:11
◼
►
and after the first day you have it,
01:07:13
◼
►
but is easier to hold?
01:07:14
◼
►
Or do you go with the one that is slippery
01:07:17
◼
►
and harder to hold, and you'll probably have
01:07:19
◼
►
to have a case with it?
01:07:20
◼
►
So to me, I'm kinda leaning towards glossy black,
01:07:23
◼
►
jet black, just because I like having
01:07:26
◼
►
the additional grip texture.
01:07:28
◼
►
And if it's gonna look crappy on the back, oh well.
01:07:31
◼
►
So I've been going caseless for the last few months.
01:07:36
◼
►
I got the D brand skin that MKBHD told everybody about.
01:07:40
◼
►
I got those 'cause they're like 12 bucks
01:07:42
◼
►
for both my 6S and then I also have the 6 non-S plus
01:07:50
◼
►
that I bought for testing back when the first Plus came out.
01:07:52
◼
►
And I put it on both of those,
01:07:54
◼
►
just a basic black vinyl skin basically.
01:07:57
◼
►
And it really does improve the grip by a decent amount.
01:08:01
◼
►
But this sounds like it might even be more than that.
01:08:04
◼
►
And so if I can get a very grippy back,
01:08:06
◼
►
like I wonder is it gonna be as grippy as the,
01:08:10
◼
►
like the old plastic cases on the 5C and the 3G and 3GS?
01:08:14
◼
►
'Cause that would be, like if it achieves
01:08:16
◼
►
that level of grip, I don't care how it looks.
01:08:18
◼
►
Like that would be amazing to hold
01:08:20
◼
►
for a new potentially giant phone.
01:08:24
◼
►
Because what you don't want with these big phones,
01:08:27
◼
►
you don't want to need a case because cases add size.
01:08:31
◼
►
So if your complaint is that the phone is too big
01:08:33
◼
►
in your hand or pocket, the last thing you wanna do
01:08:35
◼
►
is have to bulk it up just to add grip.
01:08:37
◼
►
'Cause then you're making that problem even worse.
01:08:39
◼
►
So ideally, the reason I switch back after about a year
01:08:43
◼
►
and a half of using the leather case,
01:08:44
◼
►
the reason I switch back to caseless with these vinyl things
01:08:47
◼
►
is because I wanted a smaller pocket size,
01:08:49
◼
►
like I wanted to minimize that, and it works great.
01:08:52
◼
►
And then I have the full usefulness of the left side,
01:08:57
◼
►
swipe, the pushing and the force touch
01:09:00
◼
►
for all the edge gestures and everything,
01:09:02
◼
►
which are a little bit harder using the leather case.
01:09:04
◼
►
So ideally, caseless but grippy is the way to go.
01:09:09
◼
►
So I am totally willing to get the fingerprint
01:09:13
◼
►
and scratch magnet and accept that it will just
01:09:15
◼
►
never look good as long as it works well in my hand.
01:09:19
◼
►
Because when I'm using the phone,
01:09:20
◼
►
I'm not looking at the back.
01:09:22
◼
►
- Fair enough.
01:09:24
◼
►
Also interesting, which was not mentioned
01:09:25
◼
►
during the keynote, but now is probably
01:09:26
◼
►
a pretty good time to say it,
01:09:28
◼
►
Apple quietly reduced the price of Apple,
01:09:32
◼
►
what is it, AppleCare screen replacements.
01:09:35
◼
►
It used to be, I believe, $100, and now it's only $30,
01:09:39
◼
►
which is probably going to be enough for me
01:09:43
◼
►
to buy AppleCare for the first time ever, and potentially enough for me to go caseless
01:09:49
◼
►
for the first time in quite a long time.
01:09:52
◼
►
I think I started using cases with the 4S, I think that's right, and I've been in cases
01:10:00
◼
►
of some flavor ever since.
01:10:02
◼
►
If AppleCare, if you get two accidental replacements for 30 bucks a pop with AppleCare, which I
01:10:06
◼
►
believe is the case, and I have yet to irreco—what, how do you pronounce that word?
01:10:12
◼
►
Anyway, I've yet to really destroy an iPhone.
01:10:15
◼
►
Not like that, but I know what you mean.
01:10:17
◼
►
I've yet to properly destroy an iPhone, knock on wood.
01:10:20
◼
►
I think I might go caseless and just get AppleCare for the first time and just take my chances
01:10:25
◼
►
because that's not a bad deal to get a whole new screen replacement, assuming there's no
01:10:30
◼
►
other damage to the phone.
01:10:32
◼
►
I have bad news for you.
01:10:34
◼
►
You have irrevocably destroyed your iPhone the second you get that screen replaced.
01:10:39
◼
►
You can't, these are not repairable devices.
01:10:43
◼
►
I'm sorry to tell you that, but once they open up to replace the screen and put it back
01:10:47
◼
►
together, it's never the same.
01:10:49
◼
►
Yeah, that's probably right.
01:10:50
◼
►
That's basically right, yeah.
01:10:51
◼
►
I don't know.
01:10:52
◼
►
I mean, it's not that I'm saying I'm planning on dropping the thing, but for the first time
01:10:56
◼
►
in a long time, caselists might be caseless.
01:11:01
◼
►
I'm so tempted to hit the bell, but I just can't.
01:11:03
◼
►
I just can't do it, Margo.
01:11:04
◼
►
Insert some terrible rim shot.
01:11:06
◼
►
He deserves it.
01:11:12
◼
►
oh so what about the the shiny uh the jet black business uh it's kind of i'm not gonna say this
01:11:21
◼
►
is the same as the ipod nano the scratch horrific ipod nano but this is aesthetics aside and
01:11:28
◼
►
grippiness aside um this is the wrong material to make super shiny i still maintain that my favorite
01:11:35
◼
►
and the best phone design, aesthetically speaking, as just an object that you hold in your hand
01:11:40
◼
►
setting aside most other things about it, is the 4 and 4S, and the black ones, obviously.
01:11:46
◼
►
The black 4 and 4S had a shiny black back to them, and that worked because it was glass,
01:11:52
◼
►
which is incredibly scratch-resistant, unlike this surface, which apparently, if you sneeze
01:11:57
◼
►
on it, it's gonna get scratched.
01:11:58
◼
►
Even if you put a case on it, it's gonna get scratched, because in between the case and
01:12:02
◼
►
And your shiny black back is going to be some tiny little piece of dust that's going to
01:12:05
◼
►
leave microscopic scratches on it, right?
01:12:08
◼
►
But speaking of $30 screen replacements, glass back, not a great idea because now you have
01:12:13
◼
►
two sides that can shatter and people did.
01:12:16
◼
►
So I'm assuming the 10th anniversary iPhone 8 complete edge-to-edge piece of glass, blah,
01:12:23
◼
►
That presentation should have parts of it that were omitted for this one.
01:12:27
◼
►
that emphasize how much stronger the glass is and how much it resists shattering and instead bends
01:12:33
◼
►
and how much stiffer the case is. Just all the damage aspects. They leaned on waterproofing and
01:12:40
◼
►
dustproofing, which is great, and I'm glad they're advancing on those fronts, but dropability-wise,
01:12:45
◼
►
this one is just as shattery as the other ones. And now, if you get the Jet Black one,
01:12:48
◼
►
it's like the scratchiest thing that Apple has ever shipped, according to their own documentation
01:12:54
◼
►
engineer except for the iPod nano. So I think if you just want it for grippiness, that's
01:13:00
◼
►
fine. I think if you buy this and use it without a case or even if you use it with a case,
01:13:04
◼
►
you have to embrace the idea that it's going to get scuffed up. And I don't know, maybe
01:13:06
◼
►
it will look good when it's scuffed up or maybe like Marco, you shouldn't care. But
01:13:11
◼
►
it's another one of those products that unfortunately you have to divorce the reality of Apple product
01:13:16
◼
►
shots from the product that you're going to actually unwrap because they're mostly unrelated
01:13:20
◼
►
to each other and just make your piece with what it's going to really be like to own it.
01:13:24
◼
►
But that aesthetic, shiny black that maintains, the 4 and 4S did that.
01:13:30
◼
►
Because you can make glass pretty hard and scratch proof.
01:13:34
◼
►
So if you didn't drop it and shatter either side of it, like I go look at my wife's 4S
01:13:38
◼
►
right now, it still looks pretty darn good.
01:13:41
◼
►
It looks almost like it's new.
01:13:42
◼
►
That was an incredibly good design.
01:13:44
◼
►
If you're going to do glossy, you have to do it something that's scratch resistant,
01:13:47
◼
►
otherwise you're just inviting trouble.
01:13:49
◼
►
So Apple's inviting trouble with this jet black thing,
01:13:51
◼
►
but it looks really cool.
01:13:53
◼
►
- Well, yeah, it looks really cool in pictures and videos.
01:13:57
◼
►
- Yeah, no one has ever touched it.
01:13:59
◼
►
- Yeah, if you look also in Gruber's periscope,
01:14:02
◼
►
I believe it was the second one in the hands-on area,
01:14:04
◼
►
you can see the phone that was in the hands-on area,
01:14:07
◼
►
at one point he does an angle shot,
01:14:09
◼
►
and you can just see it's covered in fingerprints.
01:14:12
◼
►
And that's from a few, and they had people,
01:14:16
◼
►
The staffers who were there running the hands-on area,
01:14:20
◼
►
people were saying that they would wipe them down
01:14:22
◼
►
with polishing cloths between each person handling them
01:14:24
◼
►
most of the time.
01:14:26
◼
►
And this one was just like one that was lying down
01:14:27
◼
►
flat on the table, which obviously was handled
01:14:29
◼
►
by like two or three people, maybe at most.
01:14:31
◼
►
And it was covered in fingerprints.
01:14:33
◼
►
Basically, your phone, if you get the jet black,
01:14:38
◼
►
will never look the way, like,
01:14:40
◼
►
by the time you're unwrapping it and plugging it in
01:14:43
◼
►
to sync everything over, if you do everything with iTunes,
01:14:44
◼
►
like a smart person with backups,
01:14:47
◼
►
because then you don't have to enter your password
01:14:49
◼
►
all over again if you click the encrypt backups box.
01:14:51
◼
►
Anyway, by the time you're done setting up your phone,
01:14:54
◼
►
it's not gonna look like that anymore.
01:14:55
◼
►
Like you won't even get a day with it looking like that.
01:14:57
◼
►
- Yeah, you can't touch it.
01:14:58
◼
►
You can't touch it, you can't expose it to the air,
01:15:00
◼
►
or dust, or anything like, you just can't.
01:15:02
◼
►
And here's the thing, the front of all of our phones
01:15:05
◼
►
already looks gross.
01:15:06
◼
►
Like we are exuding oil all the time.
01:15:08
◼
►
Our little fleshy appendages are just gross,
01:15:11
◼
►
and they're like constantly, like that's just the way it is.
01:15:13
◼
►
If you touch things with your bare fingers,
01:15:15
◼
►
they will be gross.
01:15:16
◼
►
Look at the front of your phone right now, it is a mess.
01:15:19
◼
►
It has to be, like the oleophobic coating on there
01:15:21
◼
►
to make the oil spread, but there's no getting around it.
01:15:25
◼
►
- Yeah, by the way, I was wondering,
01:15:26
◼
►
did they put that coating on the JetBlueye?
01:15:28
◼
►
'Cause they never mention it, so the answer's probably no.
01:15:30
◼
►
But it seemed like it would have benefited
01:15:33
◼
►
from the oleophobic coating.
01:15:35
◼
►
- I don't know if that would have made it slippier,
01:15:36
◼
►
but there's no hope.
01:15:39
◼
►
The smudges, there's nothing anybody could do about it.
01:15:41
◼
►
But I think, again, getting back to the 4 and 4S, they've smudged up and everything
01:15:45
◼
►
too, but smudges can buff right out.
01:15:48
◼
►
Scratches less so.
01:15:49
◼
►
So if it is scratchy, then it's just going to look like a big scuffed up mess.
01:15:53
◼
►
And it's like getting scratches in the clear coat of your car.
01:15:55
◼
►
Eventually it just looks like a mess.
01:15:57
◼
►
Whereas if your car was entirely made of glass, it wouldn't get scratches, but probably
01:16:01
◼
►
not a great material choice for a car.
01:16:03
◼
►
It's for many of the same reasons.
01:16:06
◼
►
- Yeah, the other thing I would say about these colors is
01:16:09
◼
►
the non-glossy black looks a little bit dated.
01:16:14
◼
►
It reminds me of the iPhone 5, before the 5S,
01:16:18
◼
►
when I had its own space black.
01:16:20
◼
►
It just kinda looks like, okay,
01:16:23
◼
►
you had a bunch of geeks pick some phone colors,
01:16:25
◼
►
and of course they're gonna pick black.
01:16:26
◼
►
- I like that it's actually black, though.
01:16:28
◼
►
I'm sick of all these different grays.
01:16:30
◼
►
Make it black.
01:16:31
◼
►
- But see, now we have two blacks, though.
01:16:34
◼
►
Do we really need two?
01:16:35
◼
►
'Cause then if you look at the rest of the colors,
01:16:37
◼
►
there's no more space grayish.
01:16:38
◼
►
Now you basically have light silver, gold, and pink.
01:16:42
◼
►
To me, the whole lineup,
01:16:45
◼
►
with the exception of the glossy black one,
01:16:48
◼
►
the colors look a little bit dated and stale to me.
01:16:50
◼
►
They look a little bit overplayed now,
01:16:51
◼
►
which is weird for a brand new high-profile device like this.
01:16:54
◼
►
Like, is it just me?
01:16:56
◼
►
Do those colors not look old to you?
01:16:59
◼
►
- Those colors don't do anything for this design.
01:17:02
◼
►
The reason I think the Jet Ball Black looks so good is that it accentuates the parts of
01:17:05
◼
►
this design that are interesting, which is basically the rounded edges.
01:17:08
◼
►
And the rounded edges just blend away into nothing if you have an entirely matte case
01:17:13
◼
►
When you have something that is glossy or even something that is black that's more reflective,
01:17:15
◼
►
it highlights the rounded edges and makes it look cool.
01:17:19
◼
►
Or even just the little highlights around the little speaker openings.
01:17:21
◼
►
If everything is matte, it's like, well there's a screen and then some amorphous blob back
01:17:26
◼
►
there that's like silvery or goldy, and that's not doing this design any favors.
01:17:30
◼
►
And you're right, they have repeated those colors for a long period of time, and they're
01:17:33
◼
►
not particularly helping it, but I think most people use cases.
01:17:36
◼
►
I think the black one is great, mostly because you get the black front with it and then just
01:17:39
◼
►
throw it in a case.
01:17:40
◼
►
And I don't even remember what color the back of my phone is.
01:17:42
◼
►
I assume it's grayish something, but I don't see it because it's inside my case.
01:17:46
◼
►
So I think it's appropriate.
01:17:49
◼
►
What else could they do with it?
01:17:50
◼
►
Could they make them really dark primary colors?
01:17:53
◼
►
I think that would be unwise at this point.
01:17:55
◼
►
It's best to just stick with colors.
01:17:58
◼
►
They know the relative popularity of those colors, add one or two new things in the mix,
01:18:02
◼
►
and interesting also that they're doing the Blackbook thing, $150 for black if you want
01:18:07
◼
►
your MacBook in black.
01:18:09
◼
►
Well, if you want the Jet Black one, you can't get the lower storage model.
01:18:13
◼
►
You have to get the 128 or 256, so it's a clear signal that the Jet Black one is supposed
01:18:17
◼
►
to be the fancy one.
01:18:18
◼
►
They're kind of punishing you for your desires for a shiny phone by A, giving you a phone
01:18:22
◼
►
that's never going to look like that, and B, making you pay more, which is totally in
01:18:25
◼
►
the Apple tradition and everyone who buys the Jet Black one, including me, are going
01:18:28
◼
►
to deserve it.
01:18:29
◼
►
So, you are getting a Jet Black one?
01:18:32
◼
►
I think so. I think I'm going to get one because I didn't know if there would be anything in
01:18:35
◼
►
the 7 to convince me to upgrade because it says it's my year. I have a 6. Mostly I was
01:18:39
◼
►
convinced by the things we haven't talked about yet, but the Jet Black didn't hurt.
01:18:44
◼
►
Fair enough.
01:18:46
◼
►
You are the perfect person to have a Jet Black because you are always slightly dissatisfied
01:18:51
◼
►
about everything and you will always be slightly dissatisfied with the condition of your jet
01:18:56
◼
►
black finish.
01:18:57
◼
►
I don't know if I think I'll probably still get a case for it.
01:18:59
◼
►
I'm generally dissatisfied with the state of my leather case.
01:19:02
◼
►
I don't know what's happened to it but it's starting to get like all rumply and pimply.
01:19:05
◼
►
So my leather case was awesome up until maybe three months ago and then it started to get
01:19:10
◼
►
rumply and now I'm like maybe I should get a black silicone case next time.
01:19:12
◼
►
But I have to hold it in person to see what it's like, how slippery it is because I would
01:19:16
◼
►
not use my 6 without a case ever.
01:19:19
◼
►
I don't think I would use a 6S without a case either.
01:19:21
◼
►
I'll have to try this one out to see how it is.
01:19:24
◼
►
I am really torn because I really like the look of the Jet Black, but I think even in
01:19:30
◼
►
a case I'm going to know that that thing's getting scratched crap, and I actually think
01:19:37
◼
►
the Black Black looks really darn good as well.
01:19:40
◼
►
I completely echo what Jon is saying, that to me, anything other than a black iPhone
01:19:44
◼
►
is kind of silly.
01:19:46
◼
►
Like, it would be one thing, I would actually really consider the silver phone if it had
01:19:50
◼
►
a black front, but these white faces just, oh no thank you.
01:19:54
◼
►
If there was a silver and black, I'd probably pull the trigger on that one, but since there's
01:19:58
◼
►
not, I think I'm going to go regular black, and I think I'm going to go 128, I don't think
01:20:06
◼
►
I need to go 256, and we'll talk more about that later.
01:20:09
◼
►
Marco, what are you planning on doing?
01:20:11
◼
►
So I'm going jet black for the grip,
01:20:15
◼
►
even though I know it's gonna look bad.
01:20:16
◼
►
It's like I'm tempted to take a piece of sandpaper
01:20:18
◼
►
to the back the very first day I have it
01:20:19
◼
►
and just give it a smooth coating.
01:20:21
◼
►
Just to be like, give me a nice matte finish here
01:20:24
◼
►
that's still grippy.
01:20:26
◼
►
- The soft matte.
01:20:28
◼
►
- Then it'll get slippery again.
01:20:30
◼
►
I think it won't be grippy anymore.
01:20:31
◼
►
I think part of the gripperiness is the shiny.
01:20:33
◼
►
It's kind of like the plastic back of the 5C.
01:20:35
◼
►
I think that's, so don't do that.
01:20:36
◼
►
It'll happen naturally on its own.
01:20:38
◼
►
- All right.
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◼
►
which is one of the things that was spilled
01:21:53
◼
►
by Apple's own tweets earlier in the presentation.
01:21:57
◼
►
So I don't have the term handy,
01:21:59
◼
►
but now it is meeting like IP67,
01:22:03
◼
►
something along those lines,
01:22:05
◼
►
that means that, if I remember correctly,
01:22:07
◼
►
you can submerge it not very deep for up to a half an hour
01:22:12
◼
►
and it should work just fine, which is excellent.
01:22:15
◼
►
I'm really excited about that.
01:22:17
◼
►
And that's an improvement for everyone.
01:22:22
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, you could tell a lot of the changes
01:22:26
◼
►
they've made this year are to,
01:22:28
◼
►
and we'll get to the other ones in a minute,
01:22:30
◼
►
but a lot of the changes they've made this year
01:22:32
◼
►
are to reduce the ways in which people's iPhones
01:22:35
◼
►
can fail or get killed, basically.
01:22:38
◼
►
Like reduce the number of moving parts,
01:22:40
◼
►
of parts that can get crap stuck in them
01:22:42
◼
►
or cables bent in them or whatever else.
01:22:44
◼
►
And this is just one other way.
01:22:46
◼
►
Like clearly Apple looks at its repair data
01:22:50
◼
►
from the Genius Bar and warranty claims and everything.
01:22:52
◼
►
Clearly they know like anything you can do
01:22:54
◼
►
to keep dust and water, especially water, out,
01:22:57
◼
►
you will do wonders in prolonging the lifetime
01:23:00
◼
►
of these devices and making people happier
01:23:03
◼
►
You know, I disagree with some of the reasons
01:23:05
◼
►
they've chosen to remove things like the headphone jack,
01:23:07
◼
►
but the result here is, you know, pretty good
01:23:10
◼
►
that now I don't have to worry if I get my phone
01:23:12
◼
►
really wet to the point where like,
01:23:14
◼
►
as Phil showed on stage, like somebody falling in a pool
01:23:17
◼
►
with a phone in their pocket, or like,
01:23:18
◼
►
I think the more pedestrian, horrible version of this
01:23:22
◼
►
is dropping your phone in the toilet,
01:23:24
◼
►
but there's lots of ways people can inadvertently
01:23:27
◼
►
submerge their phone briefly in water
01:23:29
◼
►
that used to most likely kill it,
01:23:32
◼
►
and now most of the time or all the time basically won't.
01:23:36
◼
►
And that's great.
01:23:37
◼
►
- I can't believe they didn't do the obvious demo.
01:23:40
◼
►
I wonder if it does this in real life.
01:23:41
◼
►
Remember in the watch thing where they're like,
01:23:42
◼
►
"Oh, we sealed up all the openings."
01:23:44
◼
►
So they did the same graphic for the phone.
01:23:45
◼
►
We sealed up all the openings.
01:23:46
◼
►
Now it's even more water resistant.
01:23:48
◼
►
Now the phone is water resistant,
01:23:50
◼
►
except for of course we couldn't seal up the speaker.
01:23:52
◼
►
So our solution here is that when water gets in the speaker
01:23:54
◼
►
after you end the workout,
01:23:55
◼
►
we push the water out of the speaker.
01:23:57
◼
►
Well, the one opening that they left
01:23:59
◼
►
aside from the speaker is on the phone
01:24:01
◼
►
that has been known to have problems
01:24:03
◼
►
is the lightning connector.
01:24:04
◼
►
So what they should have done is,
01:24:05
◼
►
we recommend once a month
01:24:06
◼
►
that you put your phone in the water
01:24:07
◼
►
and then the Taptic Engine will eject the water
01:24:10
◼
►
and all the scum that's gone in there.
01:24:12
◼
►
So you don't, because you get the Genius Bar,
01:24:13
◼
►
like that has to be one of the major reasons
01:24:15
◼
►
people go to the Genius Bar,
01:24:16
◼
►
oh, it's not charging anymore,
01:24:17
◼
►
I can't get the connector all the way in,
01:24:19
◼
►
it says this accessory is not made for this device,
01:24:22
◼
►
all the different problems that basically boil down
01:24:24
◼
►
to you have pocket lint in your lightning port,
01:24:27
◼
►
let me pick it out with this pointy little tool.
01:24:29
◼
►
- If it's water resistant,
01:24:30
◼
►
And if the Taptic Engine is right behind it, this is like a self-cleaning type of thing
01:24:34
◼
►
where it should be able to, it needs a medium so it'll probably get some water, but like
01:24:38
◼
►
eject the content like every once in a while your phone just like sneezes and ejects all
01:24:43
◼
►
the scum that's in there.
01:24:44
◼
►
That would be amazing.
01:24:45
◼
►
Watch for that in the next version of the iPhone.
01:24:51
◼
►
They did it in the watch!
01:24:52
◼
►
Anyway, that's what I was thinking.
01:24:54
◼
►
Can you imagine Phil explaining this feature?
01:24:56
◼
►
We call it "iPuke."
01:24:58
◼
►
- Like, oh God, but that would be really useful
01:25:01
◼
►
because people's phones, mine included,
01:25:03
◼
►
they always fill up with crap.
01:25:04
◼
►
Like, I have to take some kind of pointy prod tool,
01:25:07
◼
►
or often just a paperclip, and scrape out
01:25:10
◼
►
all the pocket links at a lightning center
01:25:11
◼
►
maybe every three or four months.
01:25:13
◼
►
- I have to tell you, I've still never had to do that,
01:25:15
◼
►
but I know that I am an outlier.
01:25:17
◼
►
- Of course. - Talking to all the other
01:25:18
◼
►
people I know with this phone, including my own parents.
01:25:20
◼
►
Everyone else seems to have to do this, but not me.
01:25:23
◼
►
- Now, the chat room has given us
01:25:26
◼
►
the real-time follow-up we needed.
01:25:28
◼
►
It is IP67 and the phones should be able to survive immersion
01:25:32
◼
►
in up to 3.2 feet of water, which is one meter,
01:25:36
◼
►
for up to 30 minutes.
01:25:37
◼
►
So basically don't go deeper than about a yard or a meter
01:25:41
◼
►
and don't leave it there for very long
01:25:43
◼
►
and you should be good to go.
01:25:44
◼
►
And that's super awesome.
01:25:45
◼
►
- Don't try to take like underwater pictures with it,
01:25:47
◼
►
by the way, like that's what it comes down to.
01:25:49
◼
►
Like if you drop it in the water, it'll be fine, right?
01:25:51
◼
►
But don't like, I'm gonna take it swimming
01:25:53
◼
►
and take movies underwater for an hour.
01:25:54
◼
►
Nope, don't do that.
01:25:55
◼
►
As the tipster puts it eloquently in the chat,
01:25:58
◼
►
it can survive me.
01:26:00
◼
►
- Wow. - Jerks.
01:26:01
◼
►
When we were going through our list of 10,
01:26:04
◼
►
I accidentally skipped number two.
01:26:07
◼
►
Water and dust resistance was number three.
01:26:09
◼
►
And coincidentally, one of the ways
01:26:11
◼
►
that they got to water and dust resistance
01:26:13
◼
►
was by swapping out the home button
01:26:15
◼
►
and it isn't really a button anymore.
01:26:19
◼
►
It's a, not piece of glass necessarily,
01:26:21
◼
►
but it's kind of like the new track pads
01:26:23
◼
►
that Marco is so in love with.
01:26:25
◼
►
And now it's all just smoke and mirrors
01:26:28
◼
►
and the taptic engine.
01:26:29
◼
►
- Straight out of Dune, buttoning without moving.
01:26:32
◼
►
A reference that you guys don't get.
01:26:35
◼
►
That's fine.
01:26:36
◼
►
Anyway, it doesn't move.
01:26:37
◼
►
It's a button that doesn't move.
01:26:38
◼
►
We have a bunch of buttons that don't move on our Macs.
01:26:40
◼
►
We're totally used to buttons that don't move.
01:26:42
◼
►
The screen is filled with buttons that don't move.
01:26:44
◼
►
Now the home button doesn't move anymore,
01:26:47
◼
►
but it's still got a little indentation,
01:26:49
◼
►
so it's nice that you could find it.
01:26:52
◼
►
We'll see how it is.
01:26:54
◼
►
Like Marco's least favorite non-moving trackpad is the one on the smallest device, and I'm
01:26:58
◼
►
assuming that's because on the really small MacBook One the Taptic Engine can't give
01:27:02
◼
►
the bump that he needs to feel like he's pressing something.
01:27:05
◼
►
I imagine that problem will also exist in the very tiny phone.
01:27:08
◼
►
Well it's worse than that even.
01:27:10
◼
►
I mean if you look at the impressions that the hands-on people have of it, they all basically
01:27:16
◼
►
say, "It actually doesn't feel anything like the Force Touch trackpads, and it doesn't
01:27:20
◼
►
feel button-like at all."
01:27:23
◼
►
- The opinions vary between the people who are there
01:27:26
◼
►
about whether they like it or not,
01:27:28
◼
►
but the overwhelming consensus is that it does not feel
01:27:32
◼
►
like you're clicking a button at all.
01:27:33
◼
►
- It doesn't fool you like the trackpad can fool you.
01:27:36
◼
►
- No, the way they describe it sounds a lot more like
01:27:39
◼
►
the Apple Watch's Taptic Engine, where like,
01:27:41
◼
►
you push hard on something and it vibrates,
01:27:43
◼
►
but it doesn't feel like you just clicked a button for real.
01:27:45
◼
►
- Yeah, that's another thing I think I'll have to try
01:27:47
◼
►
before I actually pull the trigger on the 7S.
01:27:50
◼
►
I'm not gonna pre-order one, I'm not gonna order one
01:27:52
◼
►
I don't see and I'm gonna wait, you know same stuff
01:27:54
◼
►
I really do let people get the crappy first batch that has all the problems and go into the Apple Store and try it
01:27:59
◼
►
I think no matter how bad it is
01:28:01
◼
►
I'll get over it because again, honestly the the current home button on my six that goes in and out
01:28:06
◼
►
I'm not a super big fan of that one
01:28:08
◼
►
It's sometimes it bothers me, especially when using my iPad my new iPad Pro frequently
01:28:13
◼
►
Especially with stupid iOS 10 with the little press the button to unlock. I don't want to press the button
01:28:18
◼
►
I just want to unlock like it used to anyway, I'm gonna I'll get used to it
01:28:21
◼
►
But pressing in, especially when I've got it on my lap, on my bed or something, I like
01:28:26
◼
►
being able to sort of graze my fingers across the surface of the screen, except when I realize,
01:28:32
◼
►
"Oh, I want to go back to the home screen."
01:28:33
◼
►
Then I have to actually press really hard on the thing.
01:28:36
◼
►
Now, Force Touch probably doesn't get rid of that hard pressing, but maybe it'll feel
01:28:41
◼
►
better that nothing moves in.
01:28:42
◼
►
I don't know.
01:28:43
◼
►
I totally defer to everyone in the hands-on area, and the fact that it's been split at
01:28:47
◼
►
this point probably means that this is not a slam-dunk home run, but I might not be bothered
01:28:53
◼
►
But as with so many things, as we'll get to later, this just feels like an inevitability
01:28:58
◼
►
where Apple gave all the examples.
01:29:02
◼
►
We remove moving parts from our products because overall it's better for reliability and you'll
01:29:07
◼
►
get used to it.
01:29:08
◼
►
And I think all that is true.
01:29:09
◼
►
Isn't the tapping engine a moving part that dies constantly?
01:29:12
◼
►
But it's inside the thing.
01:29:14
◼
►
Like it's not, you don't get the, it's a sealed unit.
01:29:16
◼
►
Like it's not, is it not a moving part that you get to move, we move it.
01:29:19
◼
►
- See this is like, I really, we'll get to this more, I really fundamentally disagree
01:29:25
◼
►
with the justification that this is the inevitable future, of course we're moving to get rid
01:29:30
◼
►
of all this stuff.
01:29:32
◼
►
Is that really inevitable?
01:29:33
◼
►
Like I think in a lot of these cases that's not really a valid argument or that's not
01:29:37
◼
►
a complete argument.
01:29:39
◼
►
- I don't know, I don't know if you've ever heard this podcast, Marco, called Hypercritical,
01:29:44
◼
►
this guy who hosted it used to talk about the naked robotic core of different devices,
01:29:49
◼
►
and I would say we're moving closer and closer to that.
01:29:52
◼
►
Well, we have volume buttons, we have the silent button—
01:29:55
◼
►
I was thinking of the volume buttons, right. Why do the volume buttons still move? And
01:29:58
◼
►
when I was thinking about why the volume—and the power button—why do the volume buttons
01:30:01
◼
►
and the power buttons still move? When I was thinking about that, I was thinking of my
01:30:04
◼
►
very weird, rumply and pimply leather case from my iPhone 6, which, by the way, someone
01:30:08
◼
►
in the chat room tells me that the 6S cases are actually manufactured differently, supposedly,
01:30:12
◼
►
I assume better, but anyway, when I use my iPhone 6 in the leather case and I operate
01:30:19
◼
►
the volume controls and the power button through this rumply leather case, they might as well
01:30:25
◼
►
I can't even tell that they're moving.
01:30:26
◼
►
I essentially just apply pressure to the bulges that are on the outside of the case and I'm
01:30:31
◼
►
pretty much fine with applying pressure to the bulges.
01:30:34
◼
►
I can't really feel them move underneath my fingers, but I don't have to apply that much
01:30:39
◼
►
made the volume buttons and the power buttons not move but feel the same as they do on my
01:30:45
◼
►
leather case, I think I would be fine with that too. So maybe I'm going to be in the
01:30:48
◼
►
camp that doesn't mind it, but the inevitability is just like moving parts break and get crap
01:30:55
◼
►
wedged in them and are bad for waterproofing and it's not, you get used to not having them.
01:31:00
◼
►
Like it's possible to make a good physical user interface with something that doesn't
01:31:05
◼
►
move or doesn't move that much. As we've seen, like the the force track pads, they do flex,
01:31:10
◼
►
they don't move, they don't go up and down, but they do actually flex if you were to look at with
01:31:14
◼
►
a microscope, they do actually bend and flex. Maybe if they gave the home button a little bit
01:31:19
◼
►
of give, again I think we talked about this when we were talking about the force track pad of the
01:31:22
◼
►
F16, the control stick that doesn't move that much, it moves a little bit, they originally,
01:31:29
◼
►
I think we went through this in this follow-up, but we're just gonna repeat the same freaking
01:31:32
◼
►
follow-up. Like the control stick, normally when you play a control stick
01:31:35
◼
►
like in a flight simulator game or an airplane you move it up down left and
01:31:38
◼
►
right. Well in the f-16 the flight stick is not in between your legs but it's to
01:31:43
◼
►
the side and I think they originally made it so it didn't move at all but it
01:31:47
◼
►
was totally weird for for like pilots to just apply pressure and not have it move
01:31:51
◼
►
so then they made it move a little bit but in general it doesn't move as much
01:31:54
◼
►
so you're mostly just applying pressure. I think that kind of happy medium can
01:31:58
◼
►
make for a really good efficient user interface maybe they just haven't struck
01:32:01
◼
►
the right balance here, and when they come out with the 8, they will enhance it.
01:32:06
◼
►
The worst case scenario is the rumor at 8 that they keep mocking up, which is actually
01:32:12
◼
►
It's just a completely smooth surface, you can't even feel where it is, and it gives
01:32:16
◼
►
as much as the screen gives.
01:32:17
◼
►
And again, we all use buttons that don't give at all on the screen all the time, and we're
01:32:21
◼
►
fine with it, but the home button is like the last bastion of like, I can pull the thing
01:32:24
◼
►
out of my pocket and feel around to unlock the phone, and I think they can't really give
01:32:29
◼
►
Yeah, I'm curious to see how it feels. Very, very curious. I feel like every
01:32:33
◼
►
Apple device that I've owned that has a home button, over the year to two years that I use it,
01:32:41
◼
►
the home button just feels less and less crisp over time.
01:32:44
◼
►
Even though they've always worked, like I've never had a catastrophic failure of my home button,
01:32:49
◼
►
it just feels kind of gross after a long time. And if this prevents that because nothing is actually moving,
01:32:57
◼
►
I'm all for it. I mean, I'm a little worried based on the reviews like Marco was talking about, but in principle
01:33:03
◼
►
Sounds good to me. Also real-time follow-up IP67
01:33:07
◼
►
turns out that actually
01:33:09
◼
►
IP is ingress protection and then the 6 and 7 are
01:33:13
◼
►
How much dust protection you can get from 0 to 6, 6 being the most, and how much liquid protection you have
01:33:21
◼
►
between 0 and
01:33:25
◼
►
Where six I'm sorry seven is the immersion up to one meter in depth the two remaining options are immersion
01:33:31
◼
►
One meter or more depth and 9k is powerful high-temperature water jets
01:33:37
◼
►
So I guess if you wanted to bring it like a hot tub or something like that
01:33:40
◼
►
Which I did not know I thought that was kind of cool
01:33:42
◼
►
Anything else on home button design water dust resistance anything before the camera
01:33:48
◼
►
It all remains to be seen in practice
01:33:51
◼
►
Yeah, very much so but I mean so far this is sounding really good
01:33:55
◼
►
I mean these are these are incremental updates, but but I dig it. I'm looking forward to it
01:34:00
◼
►
All right captain negative. I I just I really don't like force tucks. That's it like I
01:34:05
◼
►
Everyone says this one's different from other ones
01:34:07
◼
►
So hey, maybe I could like this one a lot because it's not like the other ones who knows we'll see
01:34:11
◼
►
I don't know
01:34:12
◼
►
I really think that if you weren't told that you were trying a force touch
01:34:17
◼
►
Trackpad for the first time now you've been ruined for life
01:34:20
◼
►
But for the first time if you tried it on a MacBook Pro and not a MacBook and you weren't told beforehand
01:34:26
◼
►
I really think you would never be able to know the difference especially if it was cranked up to maximum
01:34:32
◼
►
Touchiness, I don't know what but maximum intensity
01:34:35
◼
►
I really don't think you could tell but now you it's like you've seen the arrow in the FedEx logo and you are forever ruined. I
01:34:42
◼
►
Don't know. Anyway, so let's talk cameras
01:34:46
◼
►
First, and most importantly to me, as someone who does not think he's going plus-club, optical
01:34:53
◼
►
image stabilization on the iPhone 7.
01:34:55
◼
►
Two thumbs up for that.
01:34:57
◼
►
F1.8 aperture, instead of, I think it was 2.2 before, is that right?
01:35:03
◼
►
I believe that's what Dan Sturm had said to me on Twitter.
01:35:07
◼
►
So a little bit wider aperture, which is really kind of exciting.
01:35:12
◼
►
The lens that I have for my Micro Four Thirds camera
01:35:14
◼
►
that I spent several hundred dollars on,
01:35:17
◼
►
I think can go to maybe 1.4, and we're talking 1.8 here.
01:35:21
◼
►
Like I don't know, I don't know like you guys do.
01:35:24
◼
►
- There is a very important distinction here though,
01:35:26
◼
►
and that is that the pairing of aperture to sensor size
01:35:31
◼
►
is the relevant part here.
01:35:34
◼
►
As you make the sensor smaller,
01:35:36
◼
►
the aperture equivalent goes up.
01:35:39
◼
►
So like an F1.8 aperture at the little tiny iPhone sensor
01:35:44
◼
►
size might have like the background blur capabilities
01:35:48
◼
►
of like an F4 or F5.6 lens on your size sensor.
01:35:52
◼
►
I don't know the exact ratio for these two,
01:35:55
◼
►
but it's like, and then like when you, you know,
01:35:57
◼
►
if you have an F1.8 lens on your sensor
01:36:01
◼
►
versus an F1.8 lens on a full frame sensor,
01:36:03
◼
►
the full frame one will have more background blur
01:36:06
◼
►
capable based on, yeah, there's all these like ratios
01:36:09
◼
►
and everything because of the optics,
01:36:10
◼
►
but basically the F1.8 is nice to have,
01:36:15
◼
►
you know, just for the amount of light it's letting in,
01:36:17
◼
►
but for background blur purposes,
01:36:19
◼
►
it is not comparable to the numbers you get from yours.
01:36:22
◼
►
- Oh, I did not know that.
01:36:23
◼
►
Well, that's really interesting.
01:36:25
◼
►
But still, I mean, it's fair to say it's an improvement,
01:36:27
◼
►
right, I mean, it's certainly not a bad thing.
01:36:29
◼
►
- Oh, it's great, yeah, I mean,
01:36:30
◼
►
the important thing is what Phil said on stage,
01:36:33
◼
►
50% more light being let in,
01:36:35
◼
►
and that is, you know, that means
01:36:37
◼
►
that you can get faster shutter speeds
01:36:40
◼
►
or you can get more light collected
01:36:42
◼
►
before you start getting noise issues
01:36:44
◼
►
and the pictures get all noisy.
01:36:46
◼
►
So yeah, anytime you can increase the aperture
01:36:48
◼
►
to get more light in while keeping what you want in focus,
01:36:52
◼
►
that is always a good thing for the quality of your photos.
01:36:56
◼
►
- They didn't say anything about sensor size.
01:36:58
◼
►
Is this bigger than the previous sensors?
01:37:00
◼
►
- I don't know if they changed it or mentioned it.
01:37:03
◼
►
I did see that it was backside illuminated,
01:37:07
◼
►
But I forget whether the 6S was also.
01:37:10
◼
►
- No, that's been around for a while.
01:37:11
◼
►
- That's what I thought, yeah.
01:37:12
◼
►
- That's where the rubber meets the road.
01:37:13
◼
►
Like they say a lot of stuff about the lens
01:37:14
◼
►
and the image stabilization,
01:37:15
◼
►
but the bottom line is how big is your sensor,
01:37:16
◼
►
and how big is the sensor,
01:37:18
◼
►
and how sensitive is it to light?
01:37:19
◼
►
And Apple has at various times touted both of those.
01:37:22
◼
►
Like, oh, we don't have as many pixels,
01:37:24
◼
►
but the pixels we have gather more light each
01:37:25
◼
►
so you can get better at the light photography, right?
01:37:27
◼
►
Or we made the sensor bigger,
01:37:29
◼
►
so now it gathers more light,
01:37:30
◼
►
and now they're making the aperture bigger.
01:37:31
◼
►
Like, you just, you gotta get as much light in as you can,
01:37:34
◼
►
and you have to be able to collect as much of that light on the largest area.
01:37:39
◼
►
To get the ideal would be the entire back of the phone is a giant sensor, but that's
01:37:43
◼
►
fantasy tech that doesn't exist at this point.
01:37:45
◼
►
Or even something like that, what, the Litro thing where you have like a thousand little
01:37:48
◼
►
cameras collecting the light field and doing all the crap.
01:37:51
◼
►
Like we said on the shows, we were talking about my big fancy camera.
01:37:55
◼
►
There are environments, primarily indoors or at night or whatever, where you're never
01:37:59
◼
►
going to get a good shot with an iPhone with its tiny, tiny sensor with the current technology
01:38:05
◼
►
of light gathering. And so that's why these big cameras, for most people's lives, take
01:38:09
◼
►
a lot of pictures indoors, and they're going to be dotty, or they're going to be blurry,
01:38:13
◼
►
and they're going to be noisy, and there's nothing you can do about it. And if you look
01:38:17
◼
►
at anyone's social media feed, people take tons of pictures with their phones in dark
01:38:23
◼
►
environments and they look terrible. Eventually they will not look terrible.
01:38:29
◼
►
Every little advance, every extra bit of light we're able to claw out of
01:38:33
◼
►
the environment and gather on a sensor means we're getting better and so Apple
01:38:37
◼
►
continues to claw up that slope and we'll get to the whole you know dual
01:38:43
◼
►
camera angle they're trying to pitch here but as far as the 7 is concerned I
01:38:47
◼
►
think this is a significant advancement of the camera but in the grand scheme of
01:38:52
◼
►
things, sort of like it's one of their good years,
01:38:55
◼
►
but it's not a gigantic advancement.
01:38:59
◼
►
It is just like one of their good bumps to the camera.
01:39:02
◼
►
For the single camera I'm talking about only.
01:39:03
◼
►
- I mean this is, again, this is one of those things
01:39:05
◼
►
that we're gonna have to see in reviews and in practice
01:39:07
◼
►
how it actually turns out, 'cause like, you know,
01:39:09
◼
►
they'll say whatever they want on stage,
01:39:11
◼
►
and you know, every iPhone has the best camera
01:39:14
◼
►
we've ever put into an iPhone.
01:39:15
◼
►
You know, like so, that's, you know,
01:39:17
◼
►
of course it got better.
01:39:18
◼
►
We won't know how much better for, you know,
01:39:20
◼
►
until we get these things.
01:39:22
◼
►
but it sure did sound like it was a good year for it.
01:39:26
◼
►
So, I mean, even with the single camera model,
01:39:29
◼
►
without going into the giant one yet,
01:39:31
◼
►
it sure does seem like it's a good year for it.
01:39:33
◼
►
I mean, that is a pretty notable aperture improvement.
01:39:36
◼
►
That is a substantial lens optics count
01:39:41
◼
►
of having the six elements and everything.
01:39:45
◼
►
It sounds good, and the optical image stabilization is good.
01:39:49
◼
►
So, we'll see how this turns out,
01:39:50
◼
►
but it's probably a pretty good upgrade year,
01:39:53
◼
►
even for the regular 7 non-plus.
01:39:56
◼
►
- Yeah, this is one of the factors in me wanting to upgrade,
01:39:58
◼
►
because remember I have a 6, not a 6S,
01:39:59
◼
►
so this is a huge leap over the 6,
01:40:01
◼
►
and as I do find myself taking a lot of pictures of my 6,
01:40:05
◼
►
because the camera is not that terrible,
01:40:07
◼
►
I would love to be able to take pictures
01:40:09
◼
►
in slightly more challenging environments,
01:40:10
◼
►
so this, if you have a 6,
01:40:12
◼
►
this is definitely a reason to get this phone,
01:40:14
◼
►
just your pictures will come out much better,
01:40:16
◼
►
because a two-year advancement is big.
01:40:17
◼
►
If you have a 6S, I don't know.
01:40:20
◼
►
I think someone's gonna have to do a comparison test
01:40:22
◼
►
and show me the practical realities
01:40:25
◼
►
of single camera seven versus single camera 6S,
01:40:27
◼
►
especially the 6S Plus, which is my wife's phone.
01:40:30
◼
►
I'm not sure how big of a jump that's gonna be,
01:40:32
◼
►
but they're making progress.
01:40:33
◼
►
They're doing all the right things,
01:40:34
◼
►
other than the bulge is still there,
01:40:37
◼
►
but I think they've just given up on that now.
01:40:39
◼
►
- Also notable is the inclusion
01:40:41
◼
►
of the wide color gamut photo shooting,
01:40:44
◼
►
which that is something that is very hard to find
01:40:47
◼
►
and do well in other cameras.
01:40:49
◼
►
Like, you know, they exist sometimes,
01:40:51
◼
►
or they have different color profiles they can use,
01:40:54
◼
►
but dealing with that is kind of a pain in the butt.
01:40:56
◼
►
And so to have this be built in,
01:40:58
◼
►
and just all your photos shot on the iPhone
01:41:01
◼
►
are just gonna have wide gamut support,
01:41:02
◼
►
and you're gonna view them on the iPhone,
01:41:04
◼
►
which itself also has wide gamut support on its display,
01:41:06
◼
►
and it'll just work.
01:41:07
◼
►
Like, that's awesome.
01:41:08
◼
►
And that is not an easy thing to do,
01:41:09
◼
►
and that's pretty good.
01:41:10
◼
►
The other thing to mention
01:41:11
◼
►
with the both camera capabilities thing is RAW shooting.
01:41:15
◼
►
This is, I really am gonna be interested
01:41:18
◼
►
to see how this turns out.
01:41:20
◼
►
The idea here is like, you know,
01:41:22
◼
►
for basically a very quick overview,
01:41:24
◼
►
most photos you get out of most cameras are JPEGs.
01:41:26
◼
►
The camera has done some processing
01:41:28
◼
►
to interpret the raw sensor data from the sensor
01:41:32
◼
►
to apply things like normalizing colors
01:41:35
◼
►
and white balance and sharpening,
01:41:37
◼
►
usually more sharpening and contrast boosting
01:41:39
◼
►
than you might realize,
01:41:41
◼
►
basically to try to make every photo look good
01:41:44
◼
►
and to apply slight processing.
01:41:46
◼
►
If there's flaws in the lens,
01:41:48
◼
►
the lens has like slight barrel distortion
01:41:51
◼
►
or slight vignetting where the corners don't capture
01:41:53
◼
►
quite as much light as the middle or things like that,
01:41:56
◼
►
those will all be corrected in that same procedure
01:41:58
◼
►
as you convert from the raw sensor data to the JPEG
01:42:01
◼
►
that you then store into the person.
01:42:03
◼
►
High-end cameras for a long time have offered the ability
01:42:06
◼
►
to save raw files, which basically just skips
01:42:09
◼
►
all that processing or defers it to later
01:42:12
◼
►
and saves onto the flash card the actual raw sensor data,
01:42:16
◼
►
which is massive, and then to view those
01:42:19
◼
►
and process them requires your computer
01:42:21
◼
►
or whatever else to do all that conversion
01:42:24
◼
►
and generation and everything.
01:42:25
◼
►
The advantage to that is that if you,
01:42:28
◼
►
usually the advantage to that,
01:42:29
◼
►
not only is like if you want to do less
01:42:33
◼
►
messing with the original data
01:42:34
◼
►
and you wanna do that in your own controlled way,
01:42:37
◼
►
to do it either differently or to do less or more of it,
01:42:40
◼
►
there's also other major advantages like
01:42:43
◼
►
JPEGs have a certain limit of how much
01:42:47
◼
►
dynamic range they can apply, or they can represent.
01:42:50
◼
►
So like, what the difference is between
01:42:52
◼
►
100% white and 100% black.
01:42:55
◼
►
JPEG has, you know, just like a certain limit
01:42:57
◼
►
of how much precision can be stored there,
01:42:58
◼
►
so there's a limit of how much dynamic range
01:43:00
◼
►
you can store in a JPEG.
01:43:01
◼
►
Raw, it doesn't have any kind of inherent limit there,
01:43:04
◼
►
it's basically whatever the sensor can represent.
01:43:06
◼
►
So, if you have areas of the picture that are blown out,
01:43:10
◼
►
that are bright white, and you wanna like,
01:43:11
◼
►
pull some detail out of there,
01:43:13
◼
►
or if you have areas that are just black
01:43:14
◼
►
and there might be some detail there
01:43:16
◼
►
in those shadows that you might wanna pull out,
01:43:18
◼
►
you can do that much more effectively with raw files
01:43:21
◼
►
because if that data was on the sensor at all,
01:43:24
◼
►
it's still there and you can process that
01:43:25
◼
►
and you can get a lot of detail out of that
01:43:28
◼
►
way more than you can out of just processing a JPEG
01:43:30
◼
►
'cause the JPEG already had all the
01:43:33
◼
►
very, very fine granularity thrown away
01:43:36
◼
►
in the processing step to make it from the sensor
01:43:38
◼
►
to a JPEG in the first place.
01:43:40
◼
►
Also, there's things like white balance on a raw
01:43:43
◼
►
is a lossless operation.
01:43:44
◼
►
So you can tweak the white balance and colors
01:43:46
◼
►
as much as you want on a raw file
01:43:47
◼
►
and it's not actually like destructively editing that
01:43:50
◼
►
in any way and you don't lose anything by doing that.
01:43:52
◼
►
So raw files are great for pro photographers.
01:43:54
◼
►
They're a bit of a pain to work with.
01:43:56
◼
►
They're really huge but they allow you a lot of flexibility.
01:43:59
◼
►
Now a camera like this, you might think,
01:44:03
◼
►
wow, this is gonna be great.
01:44:05
◼
►
I can't wait to have that kind of flexibility
01:44:08
◼
►
on my iPhone photos.
01:44:10
◼
►
The problem though is that when you get to a very,
01:44:12
◼
►
very tiny sensor like this with a very tiny lens
01:44:14
◼
►
that sells for something like $40,
01:44:16
◼
►
whatever the part is that the camera on the phone
01:44:19
◼
►
is a very, very constrained camera in both size and cost.
01:44:24
◼
►
So chances are the processing that the iPhone does
01:44:29
◼
►
to make its JPEGs is really necessary
01:44:32
◼
►
to make them look good.
01:44:34
◼
►
Chances are that it's doing a lot of corrections
01:44:37
◼
►
to things that you, like basically I question
01:44:41
◼
►
whether there's any more quality to be had
01:44:44
◼
►
from the RAWs on iOS, on iPhones.
01:44:47
◼
►
Because Apple is really good at this kind of processing.
01:44:49
◼
►
They're probably doing the best they reasonably can
01:44:52
◼
►
with their own built-in processing.
01:44:54
◼
►
So the idea of somebody else being able to tweak
01:44:57
◼
►
more data from those RAW files, I think is possible,
01:45:00
◼
►
but unlikely, and what it's more likely to be is
01:45:03
◼
►
just larger, slower to process images
01:45:06
◼
►
that don't have all the nice balancing
01:45:09
◼
►
and contrast and sharpness and lens corrections
01:45:12
◼
►
that the built-in ones will have.
01:45:13
◼
►
So again, we'll see how that goes.
01:45:16
◼
►
- I think there's a headroom there.
01:45:17
◼
►
I think they hinted at it with showing the Lightroom demo,
01:45:20
◼
►
is that if you really want to,
01:45:23
◼
►
the way I think of the raw to JPEG thing
01:45:24
◼
►
is that going from raw to JPEG is a lossy operation.
01:45:27
◼
►
You have to pick an exposure level,
01:45:29
◼
►
and if you pick an exposure level
01:45:30
◼
►
where all these shadows are black
01:45:33
◼
►
or all these highlights are blown out to white,
01:45:35
◼
►
you're never gonna get any new information out of that.
01:45:36
◼
►
Black is black and white is white.
01:45:39
◼
►
Whereas if you still have the RAW,
01:45:40
◼
►
and if you have it in a program like Lightroom,
01:45:42
◼
►
you can pick a particular shadow area
01:45:45
◼
►
and expose that differently to pull out detail
01:45:48
◼
►
from the shadows over there.
01:45:49
◼
►
But then in these highlights over here,
01:45:51
◼
►
expose a different, like you can actually,
01:45:52
◼
►
because the RAW sensor data is behind there,
01:45:55
◼
►
treat different areas of the photo differently
01:45:56
◼
►
based on the subject matter.
01:45:58
◼
►
And you're right that you will have to reapply
01:46:01
◼
►
all the stuff that Apple does,
01:46:02
◼
►
particularly probably noise reduction
01:46:04
◼
►
in anything that doesn't have really bright light
01:46:06
◼
►
because it's gonna be noisy on the little sensor.
01:46:09
◼
►
But I assume the ability to basically process the image
01:46:15
◼
►
in more or less the same way Apple does it
01:46:17
◼
►
will be available to third parties.
01:46:19
◼
►
And then on top of that, it's all just like,
01:46:22
◼
►
what do you want to do artistically speaking
01:46:24
◼
►
to this particular photo?
01:46:25
◼
►
So I think you will be able to pull out shadow detail
01:46:27
◼
►
and highlight stuff if you're willing to put in the time
01:46:30
◼
►
to treat different images of the area differently.
01:46:32
◼
►
I think you're right that the compromise
01:46:34
◼
►
for the entire image is probably,
01:46:35
◼
►
Apple's probably doing the best you can imagine,
01:46:38
◼
►
but the option makes sense,
01:46:42
◼
►
and I think it opens up the market for applications,
01:46:47
◼
►
more serious photography applications on the phones,
01:46:50
◼
►
especially if, I mean, you didn't mention anything
01:46:52
◼
►
about 4K 60 frames per second.
01:46:54
◼
►
It's not there, video, right?
01:46:56
◼
►
But so it will be in a few years,
01:46:57
◼
►
and that will open it up for video apps and video editing
01:47:00
◼
►
and stuff like that.
01:47:01
◼
►
So anyway, I encourage anything
01:47:03
◼
►
that gives these iOS devices more of a pro bent,
01:47:07
◼
►
and I think this is a move in that direction.
01:47:09
◼
►
Of course, it also means that you just fill up
01:47:11
◼
►
your photo allocation even faster.
01:47:13
◼
►
- Yeah, and the other thing too,
01:47:16
◼
►
if Apple really works on this full stack,
01:47:18
◼
►
which they probably should and probably will,
01:47:21
◼
►
what this could also enable, depending on how well they do,
01:47:25
◼
►
it is this could just enable the built-in editing controls
01:47:30
◼
►
in the Photos app.
01:47:31
◼
►
Like if you can, if there's a setting somewhere
01:47:33
◼
►
that says like always shoot in RAW or something like that,
01:47:36
◼
►
if you can get that in the Photos app,
01:47:38
◼
►
then the Photos app could itself keep doing
01:47:41
◼
►
over and over again all the cool Apple processing stuff
01:47:44
◼
►
as you adjust the various sliders and things
01:47:47
◼
►
to edit the RAW.
01:47:48
◼
►
So if you have, as you said, if you have a different opinion
01:47:50
◼
►
of what the highlights and shadows should be
01:47:52
◼
►
and what the white balance should be,
01:47:54
◼
►
you can have all that being done non-destructively
01:47:56
◼
►
on the RAW and still have all that processing done
01:47:59
◼
►
on the way out to view it, to display and to disk.
01:48:03
◼
►
- It's not quite that simple though,
01:48:04
◼
►
'cause Rene Ritchie had tweeted earlier,
01:48:05
◼
►
presumably because he was briefed by Apple,
01:48:07
◼
►
the camera app shoots JPEG.
01:48:09
◼
►
Only third-party apps can do RAW.
01:48:12
◼
►
- That's right.
01:48:13
◼
►
Well, hopefully in the future that might be a setting.
01:48:16
◼
►
- Yeah, the setting is called
01:48:18
◼
►
Fill My Phone Five Times Faster.
01:48:21
◼
►
- Well, look, they have a setting for video quality.
01:48:24
◼
►
By default, the iPhone 6S could shoot 4K
01:48:26
◼
►
and does a pretty good job of it,
01:48:27
◼
►
but that's not on by default.
01:48:29
◼
►
By default, it's 1080p, I think, might even be 1080p 30,
01:48:32
◼
►
but it can also 1080p 60 and 4K 30.
01:48:36
◼
►
And 4K is about a gig a minute at their bit rates.
01:48:40
◼
►
So you figure they're selling a 16 gig phone
01:48:42
◼
►
that can shoot a gig a minute worth of video,
01:48:44
◼
►
that's kind of a problem.
01:48:46
◼
►
So it's disabled by default, but it's still an option
01:48:48
◼
►
for those of us who bought the 128, right?
01:48:50
◼
►
So it's like, well, it's optional,
01:48:51
◼
►
but it's more practical for people with the bigger phones.
01:48:55
◼
►
This is the same kind of thing.
01:48:55
◼
►
If they wanna sell these big phones, here's a reason,
01:48:58
◼
►
here's a way that power users will want to buy
01:49:02
◼
►
the bigger phone so they can do this.
01:49:05
◼
►
So absolutely this is the kind of thing
01:49:07
◼
►
that they hopefully will do in the future
01:49:09
◼
►
because it seems weird to have that capability
01:49:11
◼
►
and to only let third party apps use it
01:49:13
◼
►
and to not do anything with your own built-in photos app
01:49:16
◼
►
that everybody uses and that has lossless editing controls.
01:49:20
◼
►
- I'll just add an SD card slot, don't worry.
01:49:22
◼
►
- Yeah, that's it.
01:49:24
◼
►
We should also talk about Phil's extra credit project,
01:49:27
◼
►
which was depth of field adjustments and enhancements
01:49:31
◼
►
by way of the magic of software
01:49:33
◼
►
and these seven pluses two lens camera system
01:49:38
◼
►
or two camera system.
01:49:40
◼
►
- Before we get to the depth of field thing,
01:49:42
◼
►
we just talk about the two cameras on their own merits
01:49:44
◼
►
before the software update,
01:49:45
◼
►
it's not even gonna be out when the phones are out, right?
01:49:47
◼
►
So the two cameras by themselves is you have two choices.
01:49:50
◼
►
You can take from this camera and from that camera
01:49:52
◼
►
and one of them is zoomed in twice as much as the other,
01:49:55
◼
►
which is nice.
01:49:56
◼
►
It's pretty straightforward.
01:49:56
◼
►
looking for maybe a little bit more magic,
01:49:58
◼
►
which they kind of delivered on
01:49:59
◼
►
in their extra credit assignment, but essentially.
01:50:02
◼
►
- Well, there actually, there is some magic
01:50:04
◼
►
in that it appears that you can zoom smoothly
01:50:07
◼
►
between those two focal lengths as well.
01:50:09
◼
►
- I think it was just tap from 1x to 2x
01:50:12
◼
►
and slide from 2x to 10x,
01:50:14
◼
►
but that's all software after that.
01:50:16
◼
►
- That is how I heard it as well
01:50:18
◼
►
is what John is describing,
01:50:19
◼
►
that one to two is a jump,
01:50:20
◼
►
and after two, it's a gradient.
01:50:24
◼
►
- You might be right.
01:50:25
◼
►
- I mean, they don't have,
01:50:26
◼
►
They could do a smooth slide, they just go,
01:50:27
◼
►
oh, here's the 1x image and I'll software scale
01:50:30
◼
►
until you get to 1.999 and then I'll switch
01:50:32
◼
►
to the other camera.
01:50:33
◼
►
But the bottom line is you have two different cameras,
01:50:34
◼
►
presumably both have equally high quality sensors,
01:50:37
◼
►
they're just one is telephoto as they said
01:50:40
◼
►
and one of them is wide angle.
01:50:41
◼
►
And that alone, even if that was the only feature they had,
01:50:44
◼
►
is that you have two choices of two different cameras,
01:50:47
◼
►
is nice because the default one is like wide angle
01:50:49
◼
►
is you wanna take a picture of a group of friends
01:50:51
◼
►
or whatever, but every once in a while,
01:50:53
◼
►
you see this a lot with like parents trying
01:50:55
◼
►
take pictures of kids at like assemblies or camp things or whatever and you know
01:50:59
◼
►
they're so far away they're holding up their phone in the audience you know
01:51:02
◼
►
their kid is going to be a speck because it's a wide-angle lens and they're
01:51:05
◼
►
they're towards the middle or the back there's no way they're gonna even be able
01:51:08
◼
►
to recognize their kids face if they had a 2x zoom on that they would go a long
01:51:11
◼
►
way towards them be able to recognize where a little Timmy is in the picture
01:51:15
◼
►
so that's a great idea and hey the the 7 plus is gigantic you have plenty room on
01:51:20
◼
►
the back you've already got a wart there why not make it a double wart hell put
01:51:23
◼
►
five cameras on there at five different zoom levels.
01:51:25
◼
►
Like just keep adding cameras along the top of it
01:51:27
◼
►
at different zoom levels.
01:51:29
◼
►
This is a little bit barbaric.
01:51:31
◼
►
It will be looked back on as like,
01:51:33
◼
►
remember when we couldn't do the entire back
01:51:34
◼
►
of the camera as a sensor?
01:51:36
◼
►
And instead we just kept adding more cameras.
01:51:39
◼
►
But for now I think it's a reasonable compromise.
01:51:42
◼
►
And then what I was looking for after that is,
01:51:44
◼
►
okay, you got the two cameras, that's good.
01:51:46
◼
►
They are good for all the things they're good at.
01:51:49
◼
►
What kind of magic can you do with these two cameras
01:51:52
◼
►
when they work together.
01:51:54
◼
►
And the magic is not shipping on release
01:51:56
◼
►
and not that amazing,
01:51:59
◼
►
especially in light of the light field cameras
01:52:01
◼
►
and all that other stuff where they're like,
01:52:02
◼
►
we just gather all the light
01:52:04
◼
►
and do these amazing things in software.
01:52:06
◼
►
Apple has less ambitious goals,
01:52:09
◼
►
but I think the result will be a little bit better.
01:52:11
◼
►
- So real-time follow-up,
01:52:12
◼
►
Srendy Caldwell has said,
01:52:15
◼
►
"You can absolutely pinch or really scroll
01:52:17
◼
►
to zoom between each lens,
01:52:19
◼
►
but the button allows you to be specific."
01:52:21
◼
►
- Right, but like I said, I think all it's doing
01:52:22
◼
►
is software zooming the one until it gets to actual two
01:52:25
◼
►
and then it switches.
01:52:26
◼
►
Like it would be fun to play with that and go like,
01:52:27
◼
►
get it up to 1.99 and then switch to two
01:52:29
◼
►
and watch it all of a sudden get clearer, you know,
01:52:31
◼
►
'cause then it goes to the other lens.
01:52:32
◼
►
- Well, just like put your finger over one of the lenses
01:52:34
◼
►
and just like see when it switches.
01:52:37
◼
►
- Oh, that's an interesting point.
01:52:37
◼
►
I didn't think of it that way.
01:52:38
◼
►
That's funny.
01:52:39
◼
►
- Yeah, no, I mean, so this is gonna be great.
01:52:42
◼
►
Like this is one of the reasons why I'm most likely
01:52:44
◼
►
getting the plus that I want this.
01:52:47
◼
►
And like I love shooting photos with my iPhone.
01:52:51
◼
►
and like many people do, I shoot tons of photos
01:52:53
◼
►
with my iPhone, I shoot most of my photos with my iPhone,
01:52:55
◼
►
to have there be finally like a new optic to it
01:52:59
◼
►
that's built in, that's always there.
01:53:01
◼
►
You know, you've always been able to get
01:53:02
◼
►
little bolt-on lenses that you like slide on somehow
01:53:06
◼
►
or that rest there, clip on or something,
01:53:07
◼
►
and they're okay, but it's never as good
01:53:09
◼
►
as having the built-in one that's always there.
01:53:11
◼
►
So to have this additional lens on there
01:53:14
◼
►
is gonna be great.
01:53:15
◼
►
My only little nitpick, you know with me
01:53:17
◼
►
there's always a nitpick, is that I do kind of wish
01:53:19
◼
►
was a little bit more zoomed in.
01:53:22
◼
►
So the regular lens that's always been there,
01:53:25
◼
►
I had said a few episodes back that it was
01:53:26
◼
►
a 35 millimeter equivalent most of the time.
01:53:28
◼
►
That was wrong, it's actually a 28 millimeter equivalent
01:53:30
◼
►
in most recent models.
01:53:32
◼
►
And so the new one being twice that
01:53:35
◼
►
is a 56 millimeter equivalent,
01:53:37
◼
►
which I said in the presentation.
01:53:39
◼
►
And that is, and so it's similar to a 50 millimeter lens
01:53:43
◼
►
that many people have used, but only on full frame.
01:53:46
◼
►
If you've used a 50 millimeter lens like on a Rebel
01:53:49
◼
►
or like a smaller camera like it's not full frame,
01:53:51
◼
►
it's actually more zoomed in
01:53:53
◼
►
than what you're getting with the iPhone.
01:53:54
◼
►
It's the iPhone, you know, that is really,
01:53:58
◼
►
they kept calling it a telephoto,
01:53:59
◼
►
but I don't know any photographer
01:54:01
◼
►
who would describe a 56 millimeter lens
01:54:03
◼
►
as a telephoto lens.
01:54:04
◼
►
That is a medium lens or a normal lens.
01:54:07
◼
►
The 28 that you normally get with it is a wide.
01:54:10
◼
►
So anyway, they now have a wide and a normal.
01:54:14
◼
►
I do wish they would have gone a little further,
01:54:16
◼
►
maybe given like an 85 millimeter equivalent.
01:54:18
◼
►
that would have been great,
01:54:20
◼
►
because as you get a little further into that range,
01:54:23
◼
►
it starts looking a lot nicer for portraits
01:54:25
◼
►
and just pictures of people in general.
01:54:27
◼
►
The more you get in there, the better it looks generally.
01:54:30
◼
►
You have to take a couple steps back sometimes,
01:54:33
◼
►
but it's usually worth it.
01:54:35
◼
►
So hopefully they will move in that direction.
01:54:38
◼
►
I mean, in my wildest dreams, heck, I had a third one.
01:54:41
◼
►
As you were saying, Sean, you got camera one, camera two,
01:54:45
◼
►
go below it, add a giant circle
01:54:47
◼
►
and so as wide as both of those,
01:54:48
◼
►
give me like a 135 there or something,
01:54:50
◼
►
like that would be amazing.
01:54:52
◼
►
Probably not gonna happen, but you know,
01:54:55
◼
►
physics is kind of a problem here in a number of ways,
01:54:57
◼
►
but to have something a little more zoomed in would be nice.
01:55:02
◼
►
Also, the 56 millimeter lens, I believe,
01:55:06
◼
►
it has a lower aperture than the wide ones.
01:55:08
◼
►
I believe on the side it said it was an f/2.8,
01:55:11
◼
►
so the zoomed in lens will be worse at low light situations,
01:55:17
◼
►
And whether it can perform,
01:55:20
◼
►
or whether it can produce genuine background blur,
01:55:23
◼
►
which we'll get to in a minute,
01:55:25
◼
►
is not gonna be as good as if it were F1.8,
01:55:30
◼
►
but because it is more zoomed in,
01:55:32
◼
►
basically the more zoomed in you are, focal length wise,
01:55:35
◼
►
the more background blur you can tend to produce,
01:55:39
◼
►
especially if your subject is fairly close to you.
01:55:42
◼
►
So the formula for background blur usually is
01:55:46
◼
►
subject very close to you,
01:55:48
◼
►
and also using a very long lens,
01:55:49
◼
►
like a very zoomed in lens.
01:55:51
◼
►
That's how you get blur.
01:55:51
◼
►
And you can actually get blur on today's iPhones.
01:55:54
◼
►
On every iPhone, basically,
01:55:56
◼
►
you can get some background blur
01:55:57
◼
►
if you have something close up enough.
01:55:59
◼
►
You gotta be pretty close,
01:56:00
◼
►
'cause it's a pretty wide lens on a little phone sensor,
01:56:02
◼
►
but if you put something really close to your iPhone,
01:56:05
◼
►
you will get a blurred background
01:56:07
◼
►
if the background is far enough away from you.
01:56:09
◼
►
So anyway, new dual lens camera thing,
01:56:12
◼
►
just for the sake of photography, just basic photography,
01:56:15
◼
►
that is awesome.
01:56:16
◼
►
the ability to very quickly switch,
01:56:17
◼
►
the fact that it isn't only a pinch zoom,
01:56:19
◼
►
the fact that you can just hit that little button
01:56:20
◼
►
and it toggles to 2x, that is awesome,
01:56:23
◼
►
and I will probably use that a lot.
01:56:26
◼
►
- So you're going plus club?
01:56:27
◼
►
- I think so, for that reason alone.
01:56:30
◼
►
The blur thing they show,
01:56:32
◼
►
so let's talk about the blur thing.
01:56:33
◼
►
You wanna intro that?
01:56:34
◼
►
- Yeah, I certainly can, but before I do,
01:56:37
◼
►
Jon, are you going plus club?
01:56:39
◼
►
- No, come on.
01:56:42
◼
►
- Yeah, so I went back and forth on this,
01:56:45
◼
►
And I'm pretty sure, and we'll talk about why in a moment,
01:56:48
◼
►
I am not going Plus Club either.
01:56:50
◼
►
So before the presentation today,
01:56:56
◼
►
there was a lot of debate, especially
01:56:57
◼
►
because of the invitation that Apple had sent,
01:57:01
◼
►
a lot of debate over whether or not
01:57:03
◼
►
the Plus, with its supposed two-camera system that we now
01:57:07
◼
►
know is real, if it would be able to provide
01:57:10
◼
►
some really, really good bokeh.
01:57:12
◼
►
And I think we've talked about this in the past.
01:57:13
◼
►
But Boca is that background blur that Marco was just talking about.
01:57:16
◼
►
So it's where you have—
01:57:17
◼
►
Please email Casey.
01:57:18
◼
►
Yeah, please email me.
01:57:20
◼
►
So it typically—and I'm oversimplifying—but typically this is with a portrait, although
01:57:25
◼
►
not necessarily always, where you have, you know, the person relatively close to you,
01:57:30
◼
►
like Marco was just describing, and then the background is considerably more blurry.
01:57:35
◼
►
You know, hopefully the person is not blurry at all, and the background is very blurry.
01:57:39
◼
►
And people were saying beforehand that this 7+ will be able to give you legitimate, honest-to-goodness,
01:57:47
◼
►
visual bokeh, or that background blur.
01:57:50
◼
►
You can play those depth of field tricks.
01:57:53
◼
►
Now Phil said he gave his engineers an extra credit problem.
01:57:57
◼
►
And the extra credit problem was, "I want to see bokeh like you get out of a DSLR or
01:58:03
◼
►
equivalent."
01:58:04
◼
►
And that's one of the reasons I bought my Micro Four Thirds, was because I wanted to
01:58:08
◼
►
be able to do the same sort of thing.
01:58:11
◼
►
I want to be able to see that coming out of an iPhone.
01:58:14
◼
►
And so, coming later this year, I believe they said, certainly later in an iOS 10 update,
01:58:21
◼
►
7+ users will be able to do a portrait mode in the camera app that will synthesize the
01:58:32
◼
►
background blurring and give you synthetic bokeh.
01:58:37
◼
►
I really admire what they're doing here.
01:58:40
◼
►
It is really impressive, and I really think
01:58:43
◼
►
they're on the right track to something really awesome.
01:58:46
◼
►
- But? - The fact that
01:58:48
◼
►
it's totally synthetic, I don't know.
01:58:51
◼
►
- That's not, that's why it's not the right track.
01:58:53
◼
►
The right track is to be able to pull that off optically.
01:58:56
◼
►
Like, eventually with the, again, mythical sensor
01:58:59
◼
►
that is the entire back of your camera
01:59:00
◼
►
with the just light field gathering and blah,
01:59:02
◼
►
but like, to fake it, it's like,
01:59:04
◼
►
it's like you had taken a picture
01:59:07
◼
►
and then given to Todd Vaziri and told him pretend the background was blurred and like have them go in and mask out the part like
01:59:12
◼
►
I mean it's doing more than that because it's not just give me a flat image
01:59:15
◼
►
Let me find the people and blur the background because that would be awful
01:59:17
◼
►
I think it's also using the dual cameras to do it to make a depth map
01:59:20
◼
►
So it figures out like it's picking a focal distance
01:59:23
◼
►
Then it's trying to make a depth map by I'm assuming using like stereo vision from the two cameras and figuring out what's close
01:59:28
◼
►
And what's far by like, you know how far the images diverged from each other whatever making a depth map
01:59:33
◼
►
And then picking its focal plane and then saying anything behind that
01:59:36
◼
►
Then just applying like a blur filter to the stuff that is right behind it in these focal planes like and I guess that can
01:59:43
◼
►
Look okay in the shots
01:59:44
◼
►
but I honestly I think that the photos they chose to show us off were bad photos to show it off with like I
01:59:49
◼
►
the backgrounds were so
01:59:53
◼
►
Sort of bland that the blur didn't show anything like why did they do foliage fully just that is like the go-to right?
01:59:58
◼
►
it's green with splotches of yellow with the light going through it and like that's that's what you want to see the blur on and
02:00:04
◼
►
They didn't show any of those you're like a sky a gray sky with a suspension bridge
02:00:09
◼
►
And then a couple of lights which I guess are pretty standard like the invitation had lights in them
02:00:13
◼
►
And I had that person standing in front of a light field
02:00:15
◼
►
But I was not all that impressed with the shots
02:00:18
◼
►
And I worry that as this fake algorithm tries to make these depth maps
02:00:23
◼
►
And then just like does gauge and blur in the back
02:00:25
◼
►
that it's gonna look like that,
02:00:26
◼
►
that it's gonna look like a picture
02:00:28
◼
►
that a computer found the edges of your head
02:00:30
◼
►
and then blurred everything behind it.
02:00:32
◼
►
And that's, I'm not looking for that.
02:00:33
◼
►
- Well, 'cause that's exactly what's happening.
02:00:35
◼
►
And this is not new.
02:00:37
◼
►
You've been able to get apps on the App Store.
02:00:38
◼
►
Instagram does this.
02:00:39
◼
►
That's why I thought it was kind of funny
02:00:41
◼
►
to have Instagram out there to say,
02:00:42
◼
►
"Oh, we can't wait to use all this new stuff."
02:00:43
◼
►
It's like, Instagram's existing app
02:00:45
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has a background blur feature that does this.
02:00:48
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And there's, of course, lots of others.
02:00:50
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- But that's gotta work on 2D.
02:00:52
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It doesn't have the advantage of the depth field.
02:00:54
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So presumably the depth field, you don't have the problem of edge detection around their
02:00:57
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heads because you actually kind of have an idea.
02:00:59
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Because in an actual camera shot with depth of field, the focal plane, the things that
02:01:05
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are actually sharp are actually pretty narrow, and so the person's ears could start to be
02:01:09
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a little bit blurry because they're farther back than their eyeballs or their nose.
02:01:12
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And so you can't just find the edges of their hair and then blur everything behind it.
02:01:16
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So the depth thing does give them an advantage.
02:01:18
◼
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When they showed that it's an expansion, like how many depth levels is it finding?
02:01:21
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really how much depth can you find from two cameras that are within millimeters of each
02:01:25
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other, right? It's a challenging problem. I always wonder if like you could have gone
02:01:29
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3DS style and had the two cameras be separated more widely to get better depth on it, but
02:01:34
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honestly the only like fake it till you make it, sure, but eventually you should make it,
02:01:39
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which is do it for real with actual light.
02:01:41
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David: Yeah, because the problem is the way they're doing, so you know the general principle
02:01:46
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of find the subject, keep that in focus,
02:01:50
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and then the rest of the background apply,
02:01:53
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you know, a basic blur image filter too.
02:01:56
◼
►
That approach has been around for a while,
02:01:58
◼
►
and the new thing they're doing, as you said,
02:02:00
◼
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they have made advancements here in finding the subject,
02:02:04
◼
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like defining the edges of the subject,
02:02:06
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defining the area that will be sharp,
02:02:08
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and then blurring everything else.
02:02:10
◼
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That part they've made advances on,
02:02:12
◼
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made advances on, but this whole technique of take a regular photo that doesn't have
02:02:17
◼
►
good background blur because it doesn't have shallow depth of field in practice, and then
02:02:21
◼
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blur the parts that are supposed to be blurred in software, the whole problem with this approach
02:02:26
◼
►
is that the resulting picture, like that's not how real background blur looks.
02:02:31
◼
►
If you do that technique, even if you do that technique perfectly, even if you perfectly
02:02:35
◼
►
define which exact pixels in the frame are supposed to be sharp, and which ones are supposed
02:02:40
◼
►
to have the blur effect applied to them,
02:02:42
◼
►
it still doesn't look right,
02:02:44
◼
►
because that isn't how that actually looks in practice.
02:02:46
◼
►
Like, the regular image blur effect
02:02:49
◼
►
is not producing the same look you get
02:02:51
◼
►
from the out-of-focus areas in a shallot at the field photo.
02:02:54
◼
►
So, it never looks right.
02:02:56
◼
►
And I agree, I think the photos they picked,
02:02:58
◼
►
they didn't really do themselves a lot of favors there.
02:03:00
◼
►
I don't think those are very good examples.
02:03:01
◼
►
And if that's the best they could come up with,
02:03:03
◼
►
that might not be a good sign
02:03:06
◼
►
for the usefulness of this feature,
02:03:08
◼
►
or the overall quality of this feature.
02:03:11
◼
►
- So one thing it did show off is I thought it did show
02:03:13
◼
►
like you could see like their cheekbones were in focus
02:03:15
◼
►
but their ears were a little bit out of focus.
02:03:17
◼
►
That showed the hey, we're using depth,
02:03:18
◼
►
we're not just doing edge detection
02:03:20
◼
►
because you couldn't do that with the filters.
02:03:21
◼
►
- They actually weren't using depth properly.
02:03:24
◼
►
Like if you actually look, if you see like,
02:03:26
◼
►
you can look at certain areas or some of the photos
02:03:28
◼
►
and you can say, you know, you know this,
02:03:31
◼
►
'cause if, you know, in real photography,
02:03:33
◼
►
there is a plane of what is in focus.
02:03:36
◼
►
And that plane is not actually perfectly flat,
02:03:38
◼
►
it's actually curved because that's optics and physics,
02:03:41
◼
►
but anyway, there's a plane of what's in focus.
02:03:44
◼
►
So generally speaking, it's close to flat
02:03:46
◼
►
for the most purposes, so generally speaking,
02:03:48
◼
►
if somebody has two things on their face,
02:03:53
◼
►
like let's say their eyelash and their chin,
02:03:56
◼
►
two things that are the same depth away from the camera,
02:04:00
◼
►
if one's in focus, the other should be in focus.
02:04:03
◼
►
And that's, and Apple's test photos even had flaws
02:04:06
◼
►
in that kind of logic.
02:04:08
◼
►
And also I thought, one thing I noted on Twitter
02:04:11
◼
►
during the time, I thought that whatever is defined
02:04:14
◼
►
as the subject in focus, the edges of that,
02:04:16
◼
►
like in the one that was the portrait of the guy,
02:04:19
◼
►
his shoulders or his ears, they should have been in focus
02:04:23
◼
►
based on what was being shown and how it was supposed to be,
02:04:27
◼
►
basically what it was simulating,
02:04:29
◼
►
the edges should have been in focus there and they weren't.
02:04:32
◼
►
And so I'm not saying that average people
02:04:37
◼
►
are going to notice that necessarily
02:04:40
◼
►
and be able to nitpick on these little things like that.
02:04:42
◼
►
But I think people do generally notice like,
02:04:44
◼
►
hey, that looks fake or that looks like a filter.
02:04:49
◼
►
That doesn't look real.
02:04:50
◼
►
I think people do notice that.
02:04:53
◼
►
- They should save the, I don't know,
02:04:55
◼
►
maybe they're doing this 'cause we don't know,
02:04:56
◼
►
we don't have the thing in the shipping later,
02:04:58
◼
►
but if they took the picture and saved either the jpg
02:05:01
◼
►
and the raw plus also saved the depth field,
02:05:04
◼
►
that would have let you say, look,
02:05:05
◼
►
Here's the regular picture you took, and if you want,
02:05:07
◼
►
you can try this effect, but it's basically lossless.
02:05:10
◼
►
Having to choose at the time,
02:05:12
◼
►
even if you just say the JPEG with the depth field,
02:05:14
◼
►
you can still apply it after the fact.
02:05:16
◼
►
Having to choose at the time you take the picture,
02:05:17
◼
►
you could, like, I fear for people who accidentally
02:05:20
◼
►
put it into that mode and don't quite understand
02:05:21
◼
►
where all the pictures are all messed up,
02:05:22
◼
►
like they try to take a picture of a landscape
02:05:24
◼
►
with that thing on and it goes haywire.
02:05:26
◼
►
It would be much better if they just took
02:05:28
◼
►
the best pictures they can, honestly,
02:05:30
◼
►
from the optics and sensors they have.
02:05:32
◼
►
And if you wanna be fancy and save a bunch of depth fields
02:05:34
◼
►
another set of channels and have a fancy app
02:05:37
◼
►
that can apply them selectively
02:05:38
◼
►
and maybe it'll make some picture look better, that's fine.
02:05:41
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, this is a nice little trick.
02:05:44
◼
►
You know, it's fun, people are gonna have fun with it
02:05:47
◼
►
for a little while, but the thing is,
02:05:49
◼
►
if you have a 56 millimeter f/2.8 lens,
02:05:54
◼
►
you probably can get some background blur.
02:05:56
◼
►
Like, you know, not as much as you would
02:05:58
◼
►
on a larger sensor with those specs,
02:06:00
◼
►
but if you just get a subject close to the lens
02:06:03
◼
►
and have a background that's not that close to you,
02:06:05
◼
►
like you can get blur that's real optically.
02:06:08
◼
►
Again, probably not a ton of it, but you can get some.
02:06:11
◼
►
And if they just highlighted that,
02:06:12
◼
►
I think that would've just been a little bit,
02:06:14
◼
►
I don't know, I think it would've looked better.
02:06:16
◼
►
Anyway, doesn't matter.
02:06:18
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, I really think that this is the easiest way,
02:06:23
◼
►
well, maybe it's a poor choice of words,
02:06:24
◼
►
I really think that having this bokeh-like effect
02:06:29
◼
►
is the best way to make someone that is interested
02:06:32
◼
►
in more prosumer level photography like I am.
02:06:38
◼
►
And I'm getting better at understanding the academia behind it, if you will.
02:06:43
◼
►
But if you had told me two years ago, "Oh, you can get this depth of field effect from
02:06:48
◼
►
your brand new iPhone," it really would have made me think twice about spending $1500 on
02:06:54
◼
►
a Micro Four Thirds camera and a really nice lens.
02:06:57
◼
►
So I really think they're going in the right direction.
02:06:59
◼
►
Obviously, I agree that that doing this synthetically is definitely cheating, but as we've all been
02:07:06
◼
►
saying particularly Gruber and MG Sigler, we are marching closer and closer toward not
02:07:12
◼
►
necessarily needing a DSLR for most people.
02:07:16
◼
►
And that's a great thing.
02:07:18
◼
►
I think that's a wonderful thing.
02:07:20
◼
►
One of the biggest drawbacks, however, to this simulated bokeh is that the way you access
02:07:26
◼
►
it is by going into the camera app and selecting portrait mode, which implies to me that it's
02:07:33
◼
►
been tuned in such a way that it is looking for faces.
02:07:39
◼
►
And I think they said a little bit about this during the presentation, but it's tuned for
02:07:44
◼
►
And I don't know if it's really going to work, at least for now, very well with things that
02:07:48
◼
►
aren't faces.
02:07:49
◼
►
And there are times, like some of the pictures I'm most proud of, some of them don't include
02:07:56
◼
►
in the chat and I will put in the show notes a picture that I took at the beach a year or two ago
02:08:00
◼
►
which has that background blur but I don't know how to phrase this I deployed it tactically kind
02:08:06
◼
►
of like you deploy Merlin tactically but there's no faces in this picture and so how would that work
02:08:14
◼
►
with this simulated bokeh would it work like this is where I think it all starts to fall well
02:08:19
◼
►
on its face. But again, a step in the right direction.
02:08:24
◼
►
- I appreciated how Phil positioned it
02:08:27
◼
►
during the presentation.
02:08:28
◼
►
I mean, and because I didn't say it earlier,
02:08:30
◼
►
I think Phil was awesome.
02:08:31
◼
►
I think he was clearly the highlight of the show.
02:08:34
◼
►
He really had a lot of good stuff to say.
02:08:37
◼
►
He delivered it well, with one exception,
02:08:39
◼
►
which we got to about the headphone thing.
02:08:42
◼
►
But overall, I liked Phil today a lot.
02:08:44
◼
►
And I think the way he set expectations here was good.
02:08:48
◼
►
Like he said right in the keynote that this is not going to replace SLRs for pros.
02:08:55
◼
►
This is not going to do that.
02:08:57
◼
►
And that's really good to hear.
02:08:59
◼
►
It's good to keep expectations realistic and to tone down the hyperbole and stuff because
02:09:04
◼
►
if you set expectations accordingly then people will be pleased.
02:09:09
◼
►
But if you say we're going to kill SLRs for pros or for people who really like shooting
02:09:15
◼
►
real background blur, stuff like that.
02:09:18
◼
►
If you say that and then your solution to that
02:09:20
◼
►
is just software blur, that would be a big disappointment.
02:09:24
◼
►
So they actually did it pretty well.
02:09:27
◼
►
Let's do our fourth sponsor for this evening.
02:09:31
◼
►
This was unsolicited, but it's the right thing to do,
02:09:35
◼
►
and I think we did this last year.
02:09:37
◼
►
Dear friend of the show, Stephen Hackett,
02:09:39
◼
►
his eldest son has been affected with childhood cancer
02:09:45
◼
►
and for the month of September, it is Childhood Cancer Awareness Month.
02:09:51
◼
►
And so we'll put a link in the show notes to a brief post that Stephen put up on his
02:09:55
◼
►
website 512pixels.net, and it is a really touching post about what it's like to be the
02:10:01
◼
►
parent of a child, a young child with cancer.
02:10:05
◼
►
And so obviously we always like it if you are a patron of any of our sponsors, but I
02:10:12
◼
►
I know I speak for all three of us in saying we would really, really super mega ultra-like
02:10:16
◼
►
it if you could scrape together any amount of money to donate to St. Jude's Children's
02:10:21
◼
►
Research Hospital.
02:10:22
◼
►
There'll be links to all this in the show notes, probably in our sponsored by section.
02:10:28
◼
►
And I've donated, Marco's donated, I don't know if Jon has donated yet, but I know I
02:10:32
◼
►
am speaking for him and saying that if he hasn't, he will.
02:10:35
◼
►
>> Already did.
02:10:36
◼
►
>> Oh, there you go.
02:10:38
◼
►
And this is, even though I am lucky enough, or we are lucky enough not to have children
02:10:42
◼
►
with cancer, it's still near and dear to Steven's heart, and by virtue of it being near and
02:10:47
◼
►
dear to his heart, it's near and dear to ours.
02:10:48
◼
►
So if you could scrape together even just a couple of dollars and throw it St. Jude's
02:10:53
◼
►
way, I think all three of us would really appreciate it.
02:10:57
◼
►
This is a reverse sponsor.
02:10:58
◼
►
They're not giving us money.
02:10:59
◼
►
We're giving them money.
02:11:00
◼
►
Yeah, exactly.
02:11:01
◼
►
They're a reverse sponsor.
02:11:03
◼
►
So next on the list, Retina HD display.
02:11:04
◼
►
We've sort of kind of covered this already.
02:11:07
◼
►
There is wide gamut color.
02:11:10
◼
►
No True Tone though, which I'm disappointed by.
02:11:13
◼
►
I'm lucky that I haven't yet been ruined by seeing a True Tone display, or if I have, it's
02:11:17
◼
►
been for seconds.
02:11:19
◼
►
But I was looking forward to getting a True Tone device in my new iPhone, and as it turns
02:11:25
◼
►
out, not so much.
02:11:26
◼
►
No room for the light sensor.
02:11:28
◼
►
They need to remove another port.
02:11:29
◼
►
Yeah, I was going to say that...
02:11:31
◼
►
Sorry, the lightning port is gone.
02:11:34
◼
►
Yeah, just like that.
02:11:35
◼
►
- No, they won't get rid of that,
02:11:36
◼
►
'cause that's actually giving them lots of income and stuff.
02:11:39
◼
►
No, it'll get rid of the volume buttons,
02:11:40
◼
►
as you said earlier. - They'll remove the microphone
02:11:41
◼
►
because no one talks into their phones anyway.
02:11:45
◼
►
- Well, now we have another solution.
02:11:46
◼
►
You can buy a Bluetooth wireless microphone now for $169.
02:11:51
◼
►
- Oh, goodness, so yeah, I was disappointed by that,
02:11:54
◼
►
but the display in general,
02:11:55
◼
►
they also said it was 20% brighter, which is, that's cool.
02:11:59
◼
►
So I dig it in general,
02:12:02
◼
►
but I am sad that there is no true tone display.
02:12:04
◼
►
- And it's not OLED, we're saving that for next year.
02:12:07
◼
►
- Yeah, it did seem, given how they usually do things,
02:12:12
◼
►
like, all right, first we're gonna introduce
02:12:14
◼
►
this cool new advanced thing on one of our devices,
02:12:17
◼
►
then it's gonna move to the other ones.
02:12:18
◼
►
The fact that you had it on the iPad Pro 9.7,
02:12:22
◼
►
and then to not have it on the following flagship iPhone
02:12:28
◼
►
I think you're right, Jon, it probably was
02:12:31
◼
►
just for light sensor space reasons,
02:12:34
◼
►
but it does seem like an odd omission.
02:12:37
◼
►
- Also lead times, I think I imagine lead times,
02:12:39
◼
►
even though this phone came out after the small iPad Pro,
02:12:43
◼
►
I think this phone was probably developed,
02:12:45
◼
►
had a longer lead time in development.
02:12:47
◼
►
And so that's kind of the same reason
02:12:48
◼
►
the 12.5 inch didn't have the good,
02:12:50
◼
►
the quote unquote good or best display,
02:12:53
◼
►
even though it was out only a little bit before.
02:12:55
◼
►
Like I think it just comes down to lead times
02:12:57
◼
►
and the fact that it's so tight in there.
02:12:58
◼
►
So don't worry, it'll be on the 10th anniversary phone.
02:13:02
◼
►
Unless there's something specific about it
02:13:03
◼
►
in terms of processing and screen tech that makes it not fit in the thing, but I don't
02:13:08
◼
►
know of any limitation that just makes it not compatible with a phone-sized device for
02:13:13
◼
►
the foreseeable future, so I expect to see it in the next phone.
02:13:16
◼
►
I agree. Next on the list, audio. Not headphone audio, just audio audio. And Phil said the
02:13:25
◼
►
new iPhone has stereo speakers, which all of us I think were expecting, but all of us
02:13:31
◼
►
were kind of fearful, or most of us anyway, that there would be two speakers on the bottom
02:13:35
◼
►
of the phone, which would kind of defeat the whole purpose. But oh no, there's a speaker
02:13:39
◼
►
on the top and speaker on the bottom, which I'm actually pretty excited for. I listen
02:13:43
◼
►
to stuff off my iPhone semi-frequently. I listen to podcasts fairly frequently. Occasionally
02:13:50
◼
►
I'll listen to music if I'm too lazy to go turn on my main amplifier in the family room
02:13:56
◼
►
or connect to some other speaker system. I actually very rarely listen to any sort of
02:14:00
◼
►
headphone with my iPhone, we'll talk about that in a minute, but I'm really excited to
02:14:04
◼
►
have the stereo speakers because occasionally I watch movies on my iPhone. It doesn't happen
02:14:08
◼
►
often, but enough that I'm excited about it. And two times the volume? Heck yes. I am all
02:14:13
◼
►
in on that. Really excited. Genuinely. I'm not trying to be snarky. I am genuinely excited
02:14:18
◼
►
- No, that's because like, I mean, I also, I use my iPhone speaker all the time, usually
02:14:21
◼
►
for listening to podcasts, and to have, and you know, sometimes like YouTube videos too,
02:14:26
◼
►
to have any extra volume there,
02:14:29
◼
►
especially in the podcast use case,
02:14:30
◼
►
is going to be used a lot.
02:14:32
◼
►
People are going to love that.
02:14:33
◼
►
And I think the whole thing with worrying about it
02:14:36
◼
►
being two on one side or whatever,
02:14:38
◼
►
there's a lot of people who are like,
02:14:40
◼
►
"Oh, well, you're not gonna get
02:14:41
◼
►
"a lot of stereo separation there."
02:14:43
◼
►
And the point of adding more speakers
02:14:46
◼
►
on a little phone like this,
02:14:47
◼
►
the point is not stereo separation.
02:14:50
◼
►
It is not positional accuracy.
02:14:52
◼
►
It is not audio file quality here.
02:14:54
◼
►
I say this as an audio file.
02:14:56
◼
►
It is not for this purpose.
02:14:58
◼
►
The main reason that we would want it
02:15:02
◼
►
and would benefit from it is volume
02:15:04
◼
►
and additional directionality.
02:15:06
◼
►
So if you look at the iPad line,
02:15:09
◼
►
you know the iPads for years had like that one dumb speaker
02:15:12
◼
►
on the bottom like basically,
02:15:14
◼
►
as if they were a giant iPhone,
02:15:16
◼
►
just like having one right in the corner there.
02:15:17
◼
►
And then in the iPad Pro generation this last year,
02:15:21
◼
►
they basically made it so that there's a speaker
02:15:22
◼
►
on all four corners.
02:15:24
◼
►
and they treat it as like two with one being the woofer.
02:15:27
◼
►
Anyway, it doesn't matter.
02:15:28
◼
►
The result of this is that iPad speakers now are so good
02:15:32
◼
►
that compared to what they were before
02:15:34
◼
►
having just the one-on-one side,
02:15:37
◼
►
they are way louder at max volume,
02:15:39
◼
►
also way clearer, just way higher sound quality you get
02:15:42
◼
►
by just having four drivers working together
02:15:45
◼
►
to produce one set of sound.
02:15:47
◼
►
Basically, you can drive them a little bit less harshly
02:15:49
◼
►
and have a little less distortion.
02:15:50
◼
►
and then you have them firing now in two directions.
02:15:55
◼
►
And so that helps fill a room or a space better
02:15:59
◼
►
and more effectively.
02:16:00
◼
►
Or even just around a table or around a chair.
02:16:03
◼
►
It's better to have it coming out of more sides
02:16:06
◼
►
than just in one direction off to the side.
02:16:08
◼
►
On the phone it's gonna be a little bit different
02:16:10
◼
►
because what they did was they have the speaker
02:16:13
◼
►
on the bottom in the same place it always was.
02:16:15
◼
►
And the second speaker, they've basically,
02:16:17
◼
►
it seems like they've just kinda amped up
02:16:19
◼
►
the earpiece speaker where people's phone call voice
02:16:22
◼
►
comes out like that up top, the earpiece speaker.
02:16:24
◼
►
- Oh, is that right?
02:16:24
◼
►
- That is the second speaker.
02:16:26
◼
►
- Oh, I didn't know that.
02:16:27
◼
►
- Yeah, there's no top grill.
02:16:29
◼
►
The second speaker is a louder, amped up earpiece speaker.
02:16:35
◼
►
So what remains to be seen, basically,
02:16:38
◼
►
what you're gonna have, if you're holding the phone
02:16:41
◼
►
in landscape view with the home button on the right,
02:16:44
◼
►
the way you'd probably watch a YouTube video or a movie,
02:16:47
◼
►
You basically have one speaker,
02:16:49
◼
►
that's where the old one always was,
02:16:51
◼
►
coming out into your right hand,
02:16:53
◼
►
and the second speaker then is pointing towards you
02:16:57
◼
►
from your left thumb.
02:16:59
◼
►
So the sound is coming out at two different angles,
02:17:03
◼
►
and it's coming out from two
02:17:04
◼
►
probably different sounding speakers
02:17:07
◼
►
because they're not only pointing different directions,
02:17:09
◼
►
but they have different types of enclosures
02:17:11
◼
►
and ports around them to let the air in and out.
02:17:15
◼
►
So it's probably gonna sound weird,
02:17:18
◼
►
like if you try to treat it sideways like that.
02:17:20
◼
►
I don't know, I really am interested
02:17:23
◼
►
to see how this is in practice.
02:17:25
◼
►
Where it would be great is things like podcasts and music
02:17:27
◼
►
where you're laying the phone down on a table
02:17:30
◼
►
or maybe in your car's cup holder is a very popular one.
02:17:33
◼
►
Things like that where you're just putting the phone down
02:17:36
◼
►
somewhere and you just want volume.
02:17:37
◼
►
- Your car's cup holder?
02:17:39
◼
►
I don't understand how you people,
02:17:41
◼
►
Marco with the audio file and just anyone in general
02:17:43
◼
►
can tolerate the sound coming out of a phone,
02:17:45
◼
►
even for podcasts. - It's for podcasts.
02:17:47
◼
►
- I can't even, even for podcasts,
02:17:49
◼
►
I can't even understand what they're saying.
02:17:50
◼
►
Cup holder in a car?
02:17:51
◼
►
- Have you ever used overcast, man?
02:17:53
◼
►
I fixed this problem.
02:17:54
◼
►
- Is the car not running?
02:17:55
◼
►
Maybe you have better, maybe in your electric car
02:17:57
◼
►
with no internal combustion engine
02:17:59
◼
►
or your BMW is better sounding.
02:18:01
◼
►
My iPhone playing audio in my running car?
02:18:05
◼
►
- It's not me, I hear from my customers
02:18:08
◼
►
who people do this because--
02:18:09
◼
►
- Oh yeah, no, I know people do this.
02:18:11
◼
►
- Because lots of cars don't have good audio input options.
02:18:14
◼
►
But it just sounds so terrible so incredibly terrible
02:18:18
◼
►
And I think I mean the iPad pro the the small iPad pro with the four speakers huge upgrade and sound and yet still awful
02:18:23
◼
►
Still awful and so the phone I totally applaud the extra volume
02:18:27
◼
►
I think that's great anything you can give to give you more volume with less distortion
02:18:30
◼
►
So you have a chance of understanding? I think all this is great, but I still think the world's worst
02:18:36
◼
►
$5 earbuds are better than playing that damn phone on a counter
02:18:40
◼
►
And I don't understand how the two of you with your house full of Bluetooth speakers
02:18:43
◼
►
Choose to take your phone and chuck it on your kitchen counter instead of just bluetooth into a speaker
02:18:47
◼
►
You're right as we'll get to Bluetooth sucks
02:18:50
◼
►
That's why I have a house full of Bluetooth speakers
02:18:53
◼
►
And I hardly ever use them because they're a pain in the butt to each to each his own improvements in sound quality are good
02:18:59
◼
►
I'm glad that I'm glad the two speakers aren't next to each other although
02:19:02
◼
►
It does not give them a convenient excuse for why the headphone port is gone because guess what they didn't replace it with two speakers
02:19:08
◼
►
down there, the other one is up on the top and the one facing towards you, I think that's
02:19:12
◼
►
a benefit because everyone has done, I think the iPhone cup, where you cup your hand to
02:19:16
◼
►
aim the sound at you and are shocked by what a difference that makes.
02:19:20
◼
►
Having one actually pointed at you, it's got to be a big upgrade.
02:19:23
◼
►
So, all thumbs up on this.
02:19:25
◼
►
There's not room in this phone to put giant empty cavities like there is in the iPad Pros,
02:19:30
◼
►
So, thumbs up on making it better, but I still don't quite understand.
02:19:34
◼
►
Maybe it's because I'm getting old and my hearing is going bad, but I feel like it's
02:19:37
◼
►
Not like unless I'm all because it's terrible,
02:19:39
◼
►
because it is terrible, but like unless I'm on the like,
02:19:41
◼
►
I can't even understand what people are saying.
02:19:43
◼
►
- You know, I have a feature in Overcast
02:19:44
◼
►
that minimize the distortion when you're using the speaker.
02:19:47
◼
►
I've actually profiled this and measured it.
02:19:49
◼
►
- If I ever willingly listened, yes, I know.
02:19:51
◼
►
I've used that feature just to see if it made it better,
02:19:53
◼
►
and it does make it a little bit better,
02:19:55
◼
►
but it still sounds like garbage.
02:19:56
◼
►
So I put my earbuds in.
02:19:58
◼
►
- That's good.
02:19:59
◼
►
- The speaker is the size of like a pencil eraser,
02:20:01
◼
►
not even, it's terrible.
02:20:02
◼
►
- Well, like I actually have very low expectations
02:20:06
◼
►
for the quality that I'm going to get
02:20:08
◼
►
out of the earpiece speaker.
02:20:09
◼
►
Just because there's no room there for porting
02:20:13
◼
►
or shaping the sound at all
02:20:15
◼
►
or having a nice wide output port.
02:20:18
◼
►
It's just a little slit.
02:20:20
◼
►
So that's gonna be--
02:20:20
◼
►
- Maybe they do the same thing
02:20:22
◼
►
with you were saying with the iPad
02:20:23
◼
►
where they just send certain frequency cutoffs
02:20:25
◼
►
to use one as a tweeter or something.
02:20:29
◼
►
The biggest thing is volume.
02:20:31
◼
►
You're right, double the volume.
02:20:33
◼
►
That's the headline feature.
02:20:35
◼
►
- So really needed, everybody loves it, thumbs up.
02:20:39
◼
►
- All right, so next on the list, we've got four more.
02:20:43
◼
►
- Oh my God, how long is this show gonna be?
02:20:45
◼
►
- Yep, next on the list, Apple was courageous.
02:20:51
◼
►
- And they dropped the headphone port.
02:20:54
◼
►
John, can you explain to us why using the word courage
02:20:57
◼
►
was a interesting choice here?
02:20:59
◼
►
- Before we get here, can we just marvel
02:21:02
◼
►
at the skill of Apple PR during this transition
02:21:07
◼
►
of leaking this to the press like six months ago.
02:21:10
◼
►
So that way, we are now over two hours into our podcast
02:21:15
◼
►
talking about the new iPhone event
02:21:17
◼
►
before we even really talked about
02:21:19
◼
►
the headphone jack removal.
02:21:20
◼
►
- I don't know if Apple PR leaked it that early.
02:21:21
◼
►
I think the parts leak leaked before Apple PR did.
02:21:24
◼
►
- I think Apple PR leaked to major public,
02:21:27
◼
►
parts leak all the time,
02:21:29
◼
►
but you had the Wall Street Journal and Bloomberg,
02:21:32
◼
►
major public publications publishing as fact
02:21:35
◼
►
that the next iPhone was gonna have
02:21:36
◼
►
the same exterior case design and lose the headphone jack.
02:21:39
◼
►
So you see all the bad news early,
02:21:42
◼
►
so then by the time it actually comes around,
02:21:44
◼
►
now it's like old news.
02:21:46
◼
►
It's like no one's, well some people are talking about it,
02:21:48
◼
►
but most of the analysis and reviews of this thing
02:21:52
◼
►
are now just like, oh yeah, yeah, old, you know.
02:21:54
◼
►
- As you talk about that last show.
02:21:55
◼
►
- As you know, it's like, oh it sucks genius, sucks genius.
02:21:59
◼
►
- I don't attribute it to the genius of PR,
02:22:01
◼
►
I totally don't think it's a PR thing.
02:22:02
◼
►
I think it is completely,
02:22:04
◼
►
like if you want to attribute the cleverness of doing this,
02:22:07
◼
►
attribute it to the people who made the decision
02:22:09
◼
►
of what's gonna be in the product.
02:22:10
◼
►
And that's not PR, PR doesn't decide.
02:22:11
◼
►
PR takes the product that's there.
02:22:12
◼
►
And I know marketing has more of an influence
02:22:14
◼
►
in Apple's products and other companies,
02:22:15
◼
►
but in general, the clever thing was to decide
02:22:19
◼
►
that this phone and not the next year's eight
02:22:22
◼
►
is gonna be the one where they drop the head of important.
02:22:23
◼
►
Once they made that decision,
02:22:25
◼
►
it was inevitable that it would leak early
02:22:26
◼
►
and it was inevitable that everything would come out.
02:22:29
◼
►
And then maybe you can credit PR later for confirming to the big publications that yes, this really is true to get that all out of the way.
02:22:35
◼
►
But anyway, we talked about that all in the last show. This show, as Jason Snell put it in a Six Colors post,
02:22:39
◼
►
the number, I think it was the number one thing that he wanted to learn from this event is,
02:22:42
◼
►
"Apple, please tell me why you removed this port." Like a justification.
02:22:45
◼
►
We've all talked about many possible justifications. Now Apple had its time on stage to tell us in its own words
02:22:51
◼
►
why they did this. And the more I've been thinking about it, the more I'm kind of glad
02:22:58
◼
►
that they didn't go small, like for example the stereo speakers. Pretend that they had added a
02:23:03
◼
►
second speaker but it was right next to the other one, next to that little grill that actually isn't
02:23:06
◼
►
a grill in front of anything, right? If they had actually done that, it might have been easy for
02:23:10
◼
►
them to say, you know, "We removed the headphone jack." You might be wondering why. Well,
02:23:15
◼
►
once we removed it we had room for the second speaker and it's twice as loud, isn't that a
02:23:19
◼
►
great idea? Like, they didn't think small. They didn't say, "Let me just look at the physical
02:23:23
◼
►
design of this phone, tell you what is in the space where the headphone jack used to be."
02:23:26
◼
►
because there's something there, it's not an empty space, if you look at the little picture they showed, you know,
02:23:30
◼
►
you could see there's not this big place that holds the headphone jack, so there's something there, and they could have said,
02:23:35
◼
►
"We didn't have the headphone jack," kind of like many people did with the MacBook One,
02:23:40
◼
►
"We don't have the second USB port because look at the thing that's there, and there's not a millimeter to spare,
02:23:45
◼
►
I don't have a square to spare," right? They didn't say that. They said,
02:23:49
◼
►
they led with the number one thing, of courage. Like, they took the high road,
02:23:53
◼
►
We're just basically saying look we get rid of crap all the time we get rid of things that are old
02:23:57
◼
►
We make buttons not move
02:23:59
◼
►
It's it's the reason we say courage is because we know people are gonna be angry about it
02:24:05
◼
►
And it takes someone with the guts to drop
02:24:07
◼
►
Legacy serial ports or the floppy drive or optical drives from desktop computers that are gigantic
02:24:12
◼
►
We do that despite the fact that we know
02:24:16
◼
►
There will be backlash because we think it's the right thing to do in terms of driving progress and we're willing to take
02:24:22
◼
►
The you know the yelling which isn't really a justification. It's more of an explanation
02:24:28
◼
►
Why does Apple do things that make us mad?
02:24:31
◼
►
because they think it's right and they're willing to take the heat and
02:24:34
◼
►
The more I think about it the more I say that that is the in in the absence of any
02:24:39
◼
►
Actual concrete really compelling explanation like it makes our phones, you know now our phones don't break or something like fantastical or whatever
02:24:48
◼
►
That is the real honest and only explanation is it this is a thing that Apple does
02:24:53
◼
►
Because I think it's the right thing to do and come at me haters
02:24:56
◼
►
Like that's what that's what they basically said which I find the more I think about it more satisfying than
02:25:04
◼
►
Specific reasons that I could nitpick at because this is not a specific reason it is merely an explanation and I say yeah
02:25:11
◼
►
That's why they do it
02:25:12
◼
►
Yeah, I mean, you know if you look at like all the reasons that we've all been arguing about all summer about why
02:25:18
◼
►
why this is good or bad or justified or unjustified.
02:25:22
◼
►
The whole summer we kept saying,
02:25:24
◼
►
let's wait and see what Apple says on stage
02:25:26
◼
►
because let's see what their reason is.
02:25:27
◼
►
And it is disappointing to basically hear their reason
02:25:31
◼
►
is we felt like it.
02:25:33
◼
►
- Well it's not we felt like it,
02:25:34
◼
►
they did say they feel like it's moving progress forward.
02:25:38
◼
►
- That doesn't mean anything.
02:25:39
◼
►
- If you were looking for a justification,
02:25:41
◼
►
there is nothing that,
02:25:42
◼
►
because we've gone through all the reasons,
02:25:43
◼
►
there's nothing that they could say
02:25:45
◼
►
that is compelling enough to,
02:25:49
◼
►
like there's a trade-off,
02:25:50
◼
►
like we all know about the inconvenience and problems.
02:25:53
◼
►
What is balancing that on the other side?
02:25:55
◼
►
There is no specific feature or attribute of this phone,
02:25:58
◼
►
and there could never be any specific feature
02:26:00
◼
►
or attribute of this phone
02:26:01
◼
►
that would explain that adequately.
02:26:03
◼
►
The only explanation is the actual explanation,
02:26:05
◼
►
which is they do things like this
02:26:08
◼
►
to sort of push the human race forward,
02:26:11
◼
►
to quote from their ads,
02:26:12
◼
►
and they know people are mad about it
02:26:14
◼
►
and are going to be mad justifiably, not unjustifiably.
02:26:17
◼
►
They know there are reasons to get mad about it.
02:26:19
◼
►
Why does Apple do these things?
02:26:21
◼
►
Because that encourages a little bit of a r
02:26:21
◼
►
because that encourages a little bit of overblown,
02:26:23
◼
►
but because they're willing to take the heat for that.
02:26:26
◼
►
They're willing to plow bravely forward,
02:26:29
◼
►
allow people to be legitimately angry at them
02:26:31
◼
►
for legitimate inconveniences
02:26:34
◼
►
because they believe they will come out the other side
02:26:38
◼
►
They came out the other side of all the other ones,
02:26:39
◼
►
they're gonna come out the other side of this,
02:26:40
◼
►
and you can, as we did, argue about is it too soon?
02:26:45
◼
►
Is it too late?
02:26:46
◼
►
Did they get rid of the floppy too soon or too late?
02:26:48
◼
►
Or was it exactly the right time?
02:26:50
◼
►
maybe they were a little bit early on the floppy.
02:26:52
◼
►
Did we come out the other side of that?
02:26:54
◼
►
Yes, we did.
02:26:55
◼
►
Time was on their side.
02:26:56
◼
►
A lot of our determination 10 years from now
02:27:00
◼
►
about this, did they go too early, too late,
02:27:02
◼
►
or was it a mistake?
02:27:03
◼
►
Because they could backpedal
02:27:03
◼
►
like the glass front and back phone.
02:27:06
◼
►
Were they too early, too late,
02:27:07
◼
►
or was that not a great idea?
02:27:08
◼
►
Turns out, probably not a great idea
02:27:10
◼
►
with the current formulation of glass.
02:27:11
◼
►
So they didn't do that again.
02:27:12
◼
►
They're gonna try it again, maybe,
02:27:14
◼
►
with the iPhone 8 or whatever next year.
02:27:16
◼
►
So maybe they'll come back to it.
02:27:17
◼
►
But anyway, we'll have to be able
02:27:19
◼
►
to make those determinations in hindsight,
02:27:20
◼
►
But their explanation, like I said, it makes sense to me,
02:27:25
◼
►
and I feel like it's the only thing they could possibly say,
02:27:28
◼
►
and it's better than them trying to shuck and jive and dance
02:27:32
◼
►
and try to convince you,
02:27:33
◼
►
'cause they're not gonna convince you.
02:27:34
◼
►
It is gonna be inconvenient.
02:27:35
◼
►
And their main point was,
02:27:37
◼
►
we are willing to take your anger, bring it to us,
02:27:42
◼
►
and we will bring it to them,
02:27:43
◼
►
and people will bring it to them,
02:27:44
◼
►
and hey, they put the adapter in the box.
02:27:46
◼
►
So basically, they did basically everything they can
02:27:49
◼
►
short of not doing this.
02:27:50
◼
►
And I totally believe this is something
02:27:52
◼
►
that would have to happen eventually,
02:27:53
◼
►
infinite time scale, blah, blah, blah.
02:27:55
◼
►
This is when they've chosen to do it.
02:27:57
◼
►
They're willing to take the heat.
02:27:58
◼
►
I think they'll mostly be okay.
02:28:01
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, I agree that they did this
02:28:06
◼
►
in the best way they could.
02:28:07
◼
►
If they're going to remove the port,
02:28:09
◼
►
you know, good job including the adapter in the box
02:28:11
◼
►
and good job making additional adapters, $9.
02:28:14
◼
►
It'd be nice if the adapter was also
02:28:16
◼
►
a charge-through adapter because people do that a lot.
02:28:19
◼
►
But okay, we'll take what we can get for now.
02:28:22
◼
►
- Third parties will sell that, I guarantee it.
02:28:26
◼
►
- Anyway, I mean, timing-wise,
02:28:30
◼
►
if they did this without the AirPods,
02:28:32
◼
►
which we'll get to in a little bit,
02:28:33
◼
►
I think it would also be a little bit weaker.
02:28:35
◼
►
So, I mean, again, the AirPods are wildcard.
02:28:39
◼
►
We don't know how well they work
02:28:40
◼
►
and what they're gonna be like,
02:28:41
◼
►
and we'll talk about them in a little bit.
02:28:42
◼
►
but I think everything is in place for this
02:28:46
◼
►
to be fairly judged in hindsight five years from now.
02:28:50
◼
►
I guess we'll all just wait for the USA Today stories
02:28:53
◼
►
to come out about it in the complaints and whatever,
02:28:55
◼
►
but as you said, the tech press already went through this.
02:28:57
◼
►
The mainstream press is gonna have a big thing about it.
02:29:00
◼
►
It's too late.
02:29:02
◼
►
If this turns out to be a colossal mistake,
02:29:04
◼
►
it's too late for them to fix it on next year's phone
02:29:06
◼
►
by this point, which is kind of sad.
02:29:08
◼
►
I kind of like it was too late for them
02:29:10
◼
►
fix it on the 4S, right? But when the 5 came out, no glass on both sides. But I think they'll
02:29:15
◼
►
mostly be okay. And if anything, I think they spent more time trying to justify it than they
02:29:20
◼
►
needed to. Like they should, they could have just done, who is it? Tom Brokaw or Dan Rather, who
02:29:25
◼
►
signed off his last broadcast with the word "Courage." They could have just done that and
02:29:29
◼
►
then just moved on. But, yeah, the "Courage" thing, that was tone deaf. I mean, not tone deaf. Like,
02:29:35
◼
►
there's something to it. Like I said, they are in the abstract when talking about
02:29:40
◼
►
companies, why do some companies use things and other ones don't? It does come down to,
02:29:44
◼
►
I don't know, boldness. It is courage in the context of companies making decisions about
02:29:53
◼
►
their products. If that is your frame of reference, within that frame there are moves that are more
02:29:59
◼
►
courageous and less courageous, and Apple has historically been a company that's willing to do
02:30:03
◼
►
the more courageous things, even if it falls on its face sometimes. That's the defining
02:30:08
◼
►
fine characteristic of Apple as a company.
02:30:10
◼
►
And so if you don't want to,
02:30:11
◼
►
it's not the same as like real courage, real life,
02:30:12
◼
►
no it's not, it's a bunch of companies
02:30:13
◼
►
picking features for their products.
02:30:15
◼
►
But I'm hard pressed to find a better word.
02:30:20
◼
►
- Again, genius at Apple PR,
02:30:21
◼
►
there is nothing really left for me to say
02:30:23
◼
►
about the headphone jack removal at this point.
02:30:26
◼
►
We waited for there to be a reason, there wasn't one.
02:30:29
◼
►
None of the reasons they gave,
02:30:30
◼
►
with the exception of courage,
02:30:32
◼
►
were reasons that made this,
02:30:36
◼
►
reasons that you had to remove the port to achieve.
02:30:39
◼
►
Like, they could have launched AirPods,
02:30:41
◼
►
they could have promoted Lightning headphones
02:30:43
◼
►
and launched some of their own Lightning EarPods.
02:30:45
◼
►
They could have done all those things
02:30:46
◼
►
without removing the headphone port.
02:30:48
◼
►
Like, removing the headphone port was not a necessity
02:30:50
◼
►
for any of those advances.
02:30:52
◼
►
So, they never, so, the courageous part
02:30:55
◼
►
was really just saying, "All right, well,
02:30:57
◼
►
"I guess we're gonna anger everybody here
02:30:59
◼
►
"and to do something that serves a few of our goals
02:31:04
◼
►
"and doesn't really serve any of yours."
02:31:06
◼
►
Well, but it serves, it's just like the floppy disk though.
02:31:08
◼
►
Like what did it say?
02:31:10
◼
►
I think it's a floppy disk help users.
02:31:11
◼
►
They're all like, well, we think we should,
02:31:12
◼
►
you should use different, what different removable media?
02:31:15
◼
►
There's not any good different removable media.
02:31:17
◼
►
Zip disks are crappy and USB keys are really slow
02:31:19
◼
►
and small and thingy.
02:31:20
◼
►
Well, we think in the future you won't miss the floppy disk
02:31:22
◼
►
because other stuff will eventually replace it.
02:31:24
◼
►
Yeah, but what about now?
02:31:25
◼
►
I miss my floppy disk now.
02:31:26
◼
►
Well, they're doing the exact same thing with the audio part.
02:31:27
◼
►
Again, this doesn't justify it, doing it this instant,
02:31:30
◼
►
but they're saying like, well,
02:31:31
◼
►
but what do I do for my headphones?
02:31:32
◼
►
Oh, digital audio interface on lightning, blah, blah, blah.
02:31:34
◼
►
Never mind the half of things they should plug into there.
02:31:36
◼
►
Like I'm assuming their earbuds are not using digital audio
02:31:39
◼
►
because there's no DAC inside their little ear pods, right?
02:31:41
◼
►
Anyway, but they're saying the AirPods are their thing.
02:31:45
◼
►
Like, oh, you know, we think there's a better way
02:31:48
◼
►
for you to hear sound in your ears
02:31:50
◼
►
that come out of your phone
02:31:50
◼
►
than plugging in with this really old port.
02:31:53
◼
►
And they're offering an actual concrete product,
02:31:55
◼
►
not just like speculatively, like here are the AirPods.
02:31:57
◼
►
Maybe the AirPods suck.
02:31:58
◼
►
And that will definitely make it the wrong time
02:32:00
◼
►
to have done this
02:32:01
◼
►
because people will wanna plug their things in.
02:32:03
◼
►
But on the other hand, they do have answers.
02:32:05
◼
►
Why remove it?
02:32:06
◼
►
It makes more room in the phone,
02:32:07
◼
►
and we think there's better ways
02:32:08
◼
►
for you to listen to audio.
02:32:10
◼
►
And if the AirPods end up being really good
02:32:13
◼
►
and don't have any of the downsides of Bluetooth,
02:32:15
◼
►
they don't cut out on you,
02:32:15
◼
►
and the sound quality is pretty good,
02:32:17
◼
►
and they magically connect everything,
02:32:18
◼
►
and everything syncs up, whatever,
02:32:20
◼
►
I think there probably will be a better way
02:32:22
◼
►
to listen to audio from your phone
02:32:23
◼
►
than having a string going from your pocket
02:32:25
◼
►
up to your ear that gets snagged on things.
02:32:26
◼
►
- Oh, it'll be great for the people
02:32:28
◼
►
who are willing to spend $160 to buy those AirPods
02:32:31
◼
►
who don't lose them, who they are charged up for,
02:32:34
◼
►
and who can actually wear them.
02:32:35
◼
►
Like, one of the problems I have is like,
02:32:37
◼
►
Apple is replacing this port
02:32:39
◼
►
that I can use any headphone I want with,
02:32:41
◼
►
with a new, with, you know, allegedly,
02:32:44
◼
►
all these better things, one of the major ones of which
02:32:47
◼
►
is advanced earbuds.
02:32:49
◼
►
Well, I can't wear earbuds,
02:32:50
◼
►
'cause of whatever is wrong with my ears
02:32:52
◼
►
that makes them hurt like hell, like--
02:32:53
◼
►
- You got mutineers, yeah.
02:32:54
◼
►
I know a lot of people have mutineers,
02:32:56
◼
►
but you have the adapter, like,
02:32:58
◼
►
it's not like you don't have any solution.
02:32:59
◼
►
- Yes, but what I'm saying is like,
02:33:00
◼
►
There's lots of people, like that old analog port,
02:33:04
◼
►
one of the things great about it is that it is universal.
02:33:08
◼
►
It satisfies so many different people's needs and desires,
02:33:12
◼
►
and it is so broad in what it enables
02:33:16
◼
►
for so many different use cases,
02:33:18
◼
►
and Apple is replacing it with something
02:33:19
◼
►
that's actually extremely narrow.
02:33:21
◼
►
- I think I need to be the voice of reason on this one.
02:33:24
◼
►
I don't see why this is such a big problem,
02:33:29
◼
►
given that they're including the adapter in the box.
02:33:32
◼
►
And BuzzFeed had a really great article
02:33:34
◼
►
that actually Marco had sent to us privately
02:33:36
◼
►
before we recorded, where they talked
02:33:38
◼
►
to several different Apple employees and executives.
02:33:41
◼
►
And so Dan, is it Riccio or Ritchie-o?
02:33:46
◼
►
Said, this is a quote, "It was holding us back
02:33:50
◼
►
"from a number of things we wanted to put into the iPhone.
02:33:53
◼
►
"It was fighting for space with camera technologies
02:33:55
◼
►
"and processors and battery life.
02:33:56
◼
►
"And frankly, when there's a better modern solution available
02:33:59
◼
►
It's crazy to keep it around.
02:34:01
◼
►
I think that that's legitimately what they thought. Like one of you were saying earlier, I don't think this was nefarious.
02:34:09
◼
►
I don't think this was ill-intentioned.
02:34:10
◼
►
They genuinely just wanted the space in there. And one of the things we haven't talked about yet
02:34:15
◼
►
is that the battery life in the 7 is, I would say, considerably better than the success that it replaces.
02:34:22
◼
►
Some of that is because of a much better
02:34:25
◼
►
central processor which again we'll talk about sometime between now and tomorrow when we finally stop but
02:34:33
◼
►
Some of that is also I believe because of a bigger battery and let's suppose the battery is exactly the same size for the sake of
02:34:39
◼
►
Discussion there's a different placed taptic engine that presumably is a little larger
02:34:44
◼
►
There's things taking up space in this camera in this camera in this phone
02:34:48
◼
►
And I am more than willing to give up a headphone port that I personally don't
02:34:54
◼
►
Used very often at all in order to get those advancements and the thing that really bothers me that I truly don't understand is
02:35:02
◼
►
The entire internet getting their junk on a wad because they say Bluetooth sucks
02:35:07
◼
►
I use a really shitty pair of Bluetooth headphones
02:35:11
◼
►
Constantly I use them 40 hours a week at work. I
02:35:16
◼
►
Don't these headphones are like 20 bucks brand new there. We'll put a link in the show notes. I
02:35:22
◼
►
Don't have any problem with them. I use them for a day or two and then I charge them overnight. I
02:35:28
◼
►
Don't find any latency issues whenever I if I'm watching a video as long as I'm on the Mac
02:35:35
◼
►
from watching a video using either Safari or
02:35:38
◼
►
Any of the like quick time any of the media players that are built into the Mac no problems with latency
02:35:44
◼
►
They sound just fine for a regular person to Marco
02:35:49
◼
►
I am not saying they would sound good enough to me. They sound just fine. It wasn't those phone on his counter. I don't know
02:35:55
◼
►
Like that well either way either way either way the point is I
02:36:02
◼
►
Don't have any issues with disconnections
02:36:04
◼
►
And if I do it's very rare
02:36:07
◼
►
And it's only when I haven't been using them for the last 20 minutes, and they've like timed themselves out and gone to sleep
02:36:12
◼
►
I'm not saying these problems don't exist from other people but
02:36:16
◼
►
Golly I don't understand why I'm the special friggin snowflake of Bluetooth and why I am the only one that
02:36:23
◼
►
Doesn't have this problem
02:36:26
◼
►
Using in the challenging situation like Bluetooth has a bunch of things that it's supposed to do and it does a whole bunch of them
02:36:31
◼
►
really badly
02:36:32
◼
►
Pairing quickly it depends on your device. So my car doesn't do a good job
02:36:36
◼
►
disaster sharing a device between multiple things also a disaster if you only ever have it paired with one thing that you never move it away from
02:36:43
◼
►
from and it sits in one place, but you're not challenging.
02:36:47
◼
►
The job of Bluetooth is not just to fulfill that one use case you have.
02:36:50
◼
►
The job of Bluetooth is to be this wireless low-power tech.
02:36:52
◼
►
And I would say power-wise, I'm assuming Apple's one uses less power than Bluetooth, too.
02:36:57
◼
►
In theory, because we haven't tried this yet, Apple's solution is technically better than
02:37:01
◼
►
Bluetooth because it fixes the things that are clunky and annoying about Bluetooth, and
02:37:05
◼
►
I assume it also uses less energy.
02:37:07
◼
►
So that's why I tweeted the thing.
02:37:10
◼
►
I'm happy to see Apple moving beyond Bluetooth.
02:37:12
◼
►
They keep waiting and doing these different Bluetooth standards, and it's just annoying
02:37:17
◼
►
We have one little shared speaker in our bedroom that my wife uses sometimes from Bluetooth,
02:37:21
◼
►
and I use sometimes from Bluetooth, and I hate the fact that when I go to try to play
02:37:24
◼
►
from it, I can't just select it because, oh, now it's paired with my wife's phone and I
02:37:27
◼
►
have to go and manually reconnect it to my phone, right, by going through a series of
02:37:33
◼
►
Their attempt to solve this with this little magic case that you open up the lid on and
02:37:36
◼
►
it brings up a thing, who knows if that works, but there is a real problem they're trying
02:37:40
◼
►
to address. Just because your use case doesn't run into any of those problems doesn't mean
02:37:43
◼
►
that Bluetooth can't be bettered. And I think because Bluetooth is such a common complaint,
02:37:47
◼
►
like it's not terrible, it's better than nothing, it's good for the wireless things we use it
02:37:52
◼
►
for, I do use Bluetooth speakers, it's nice, but everyone who uses it a lot and uses all
02:37:56
◼
►
the different cases sees the weak spots and so is looking for usually the next version
02:38:01
◼
►
of Bluetooth that's going to fix all this, but in the end eventually we're just willing
02:38:04
◼
►
to throw ourselves at the mercies of Apple's proprietary thing. It's kind of like I said
02:38:09
◼
►
before about the little RF dongles for Logitech mice.
02:38:13
◼
►
Who knows what tech they're using there,
02:38:15
◼
►
but the batteries last forever
02:38:16
◼
►
and I never have any problems with it
02:38:17
◼
►
and I'm kind of glad they're not Bluetooth.
02:38:20
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, my main concern with things like this,
02:38:23
◼
►
the reason why I resist these things
02:38:27
◼
►
and I complain about these things when they happen,
02:38:29
◼
►
it's very similar between the headphone jack removal
02:38:33
◼
►
moving to Bluetooth and buttons on track pads
02:38:37
◼
►
and home buttons moving to 3D touch,
02:38:39
◼
►
vibration motors, whatever else.
02:38:41
◼
►
The main reason I complain about this kind of stuff
02:38:43
◼
►
is that the things that were there before,
02:38:46
◼
►
the simple, old, established ways of doing things,
02:38:50
◼
►
headphone jacks, buttons,
02:38:52
◼
►
those things have incredible advantages
02:38:55
◼
►
in simplicity and reliability.
02:38:58
◼
►
And I mean simplicity not just electrically
02:39:02
◼
►
or mechanically, but using them.
02:39:05
◼
►
There's great simplicity there.
02:39:06
◼
►
And there are so many cases in technology these days
02:39:09
◼
►
where we take something that is incredibly simple,
02:39:12
◼
►
that has worked forever like a button,
02:39:14
◼
►
and we say, you know what,
02:39:16
◼
►
we have a great solution to this problem.
02:39:18
◼
►
This problem, by the way, that we just invented,
02:39:19
◼
►
that we're now calling it a problem,
02:39:21
◼
►
and we're now saying it's inevitable
02:39:22
◼
►
these things are going away,
02:39:23
◼
►
even though that was not necessarily the case before.
02:39:25
◼
►
But now we're gonna solve this problem,
02:39:27
◼
►
everything in air quotes,
02:39:28
◼
►
I can't make enough air quotes for this whole discussion,
02:39:29
◼
►
everything in air quotes here.
02:39:31
◼
►
We're gonna solve this problem with this old thing
02:39:33
◼
►
that works just fine by making a new thing
02:39:35
◼
►
that is better but more complicated.
02:39:38
◼
►
And we're saying it's better,
02:39:40
◼
►
'cause in some ways it is better.
02:39:41
◼
►
In some ways it's more advanced.
02:39:43
◼
►
Maybe it's wireless, maybe it allows software control
02:39:45
◼
►
where there wasn't software control before.
02:39:47
◼
►
Whatever the case, that's what's so compelling
02:39:49
◼
►
about these things.
02:39:50
◼
►
They are better in many big ways,
02:39:53
◼
►
but they also get worse in a number of big ways
02:39:56
◼
►
that we tend to gloss over or minimize.
02:39:58
◼
►
Like, oh, yeah, you can't just pull anything in anymore,
02:40:00
◼
►
now you gotta do this pairing dance.
02:40:02
◼
►
Or you can't actually, this button is never gonna ever
02:40:04
◼
►
feel like a button again.
02:40:05
◼
►
There might be now software introduced delays
02:40:07
◼
►
into when this button feels like a button.
02:40:09
◼
►
Like, there's like, we do this to so many things
02:40:13
◼
►
in technology and it, you know, in general,
02:40:17
◼
►
we do get ourselves ahead and we do make progress,
02:40:21
◼
►
I think, on the whole.
02:40:23
◼
►
But I do think it's worth evaluating these things
02:40:26
◼
►
very critically with lots of scrutiny,
02:40:27
◼
►
these decisions we make before we say,
02:40:29
◼
►
yes, it is definitely better,
02:40:31
◼
►
yes, we need to get rid of this thing,
02:40:32
◼
►
yes, we need to replace this thing
02:40:33
◼
►
that has worked fine for 100 years.
02:40:36
◼
►
- But if you're just applying the blanket
02:40:37
◼
►
where every time there's any change like that,
02:40:39
◼
►
you're just always resistant.
02:40:41
◼
►
You're not good at identifying which ones are the ones,
02:40:43
◼
►
like I said, when I was speculating
02:40:44
◼
►
about the non-moving track matter,
02:40:45
◼
►
which of these ones will you look back on 10 years
02:40:48
◼
►
and say, "I can't believe I ever used the mechanical one,"
02:40:51
◼
►
the mechanical one, fierce, barbaric, and broken?
02:40:53
◼
►
And which of the ones are you gonna say,
02:40:55
◼
►
"In hindsight, it was a terrible mistake
02:40:57
◼
►
to move all these things to be solid state or whatever,
02:41:00
◼
►
and it should have, like the car interior,
02:41:03
◼
►
you need a certain number of knobs.
02:41:05
◼
►
If every time they do that move,
02:41:06
◼
►
your instinct is always to say,
02:41:08
◼
►
this is a mistake and you're making things worse,
02:41:10
◼
►
then you're probably not,
02:41:12
◼
►
the task is to discern,
02:41:15
◼
►
to look back at your history of judging these things
02:41:17
◼
►
and see when was I right, when was I wrong,
02:41:19
◼
►
and how can I apply that to new things
02:41:21
◼
►
that are like this that are presented for me?
02:41:23
◼
►
Will this be something that in hindsight
02:41:25
◼
►
I will look at and say is a no-brainer,
02:41:26
◼
►
like I think we all agree the floppy drive was?
02:41:29
◼
►
Or will it be something that we look back on
02:41:30
◼
►
and say that was a terrible mistake
02:41:31
◼
►
like so many things in car interiors in the 80s and 90s
02:41:35
◼
►
that ended up to be terrible ideas.
02:41:36
◼
►
They said, you know what, let's go back to the old idea
02:41:40
◼
►
because this new one turned out to be bad.
02:41:41
◼
►
And that's the challenge of figuring out technology.
02:41:44
◼
►
Now the headphone port, I feel like because it is a port
02:41:47
◼
►
and because we have so much past experience with ports,
02:41:49
◼
►
there is something on the side to say,
02:41:54
◼
►
this is something we should get rid of.
02:41:56
◼
►
There's also something on the other side
02:41:57
◼
►
because unlike all the other parts we talked about,
02:41:58
◼
►
this is so old and so common.
02:42:00
◼
►
is way more common than the serial printer port
02:42:03
◼
►
that was expunged from Macs or whatever, right?
02:42:05
◼
►
So it's difficult to judge,
02:42:09
◼
►
but I don't know if this is gonna end up being a mistake.
02:42:13
◼
►
All I can say is that their presentation of it was,
02:42:15
◼
►
I think, honest and direct.
02:42:17
◼
►
And like Casey said, they have reasons.
02:42:19
◼
►
None of those reasons justify it.
02:42:21
◼
►
In the end, I think the most important thing is
02:42:23
◼
►
that Apple thinks there's a better way
02:42:25
◼
►
to get audio out of your phones.
02:42:27
◼
►
And they may be wrong,
02:42:28
◼
►
'cause none of us have tried their new solutions,
02:42:30
◼
►
but the public will decide in many years
02:42:34
◼
►
if Apple's things have a rep--
02:42:35
◼
►
Even if Apple sticks to its guns,
02:42:37
◼
►
the reputation is, "Oh, I was getting an iPhone,"
02:42:38
◼
►
but just, you know, I like iPhones,
02:42:40
◼
►
but just be aware that they're annoying to use with audio.
02:42:43
◼
►
That will not be a success for Apple
02:42:44
◼
►
if that's what everyone says about iPhones in five years.
02:42:46
◼
►
But in five years, if no one mentions this,
02:42:48
◼
►
and the headphone part is gone from all phones,
02:42:50
◼
►
I think you have to put a notch
02:42:52
◼
►
in the win column for Apple on it
02:42:54
◼
►
and say, "People are cranky.
02:42:56
◼
►
"There was massive inconvenience,
02:42:58
◼
►
"just like there was with all the other transitions,
02:43:00
◼
►
and we got through it.
02:43:01
◼
►
Right now, I'm gonna give them better than 50% chance
02:43:03
◼
►
that they're gonna pull this off.
02:43:04
◼
►
- Oh, I think they are definitely gonna pull this off
02:43:06
◼
►
because no one else is making iPhones
02:43:08
◼
►
for people to buy instead.
02:43:10
◼
►
- I mean, do you think Android phones,
02:43:12
◼
►
Android phones will drop the headphone port?
02:43:13
◼
►
That's what I'm saying.
02:43:14
◼
►
Pull it off as in, eventually, nobody ships floppies
02:43:16
◼
►
with their PCs anymore.
02:43:17
◼
►
Although, I shouldn't say that because I'm sure
02:43:19
◼
►
there's some PC you can buy with a floppy drive.
02:43:21
◼
►
- I'm pretty sure you could still pay Dell 30 bucks
02:43:23
◼
►
to put a floppy drive in your new--
02:43:26
◼
►
Boy, that's too much.
02:43:27
◼
►
- No one's buying them anymore.
02:43:28
◼
►
They're a specialty item now.
02:43:30
◼
►
But anyway, they will succeed if this slowly fades
02:43:34
◼
►
from all products just like floppy drives did.
02:43:36
◼
►
- I mean, it will just because they,
02:43:39
◼
►
well, it'll at least fade from phones
02:43:41
◼
►
'cause they've now set the standard.
02:43:43
◼
►
- Will it fade from MacBooks and iPads too?
02:43:45
◼
►
- I don't know.
02:43:46
◼
►
I think it certainly says something
02:43:47
◼
►
that the MacBook has only one other port
02:43:50
◼
►
and yet they included a headphone port.
02:43:52
◼
►
- But that MacBook is like really old.
02:43:55
◼
►
- They deemed that important enough for that.
02:43:57
◼
►
No, I mean, I guess I'm done arguing this,
02:44:00
◼
►
but I just, I disagree with the fundamental premise
02:44:05
◼
►
that this port was doomed, period, and had to be replaced.
02:44:09
◼
►
I disagree with the time that it had to be replaced now.
02:44:12
◼
►
I don't think that's courage.
02:44:14
◼
►
I think that's other factors, that's other attributes,
02:44:16
◼
►
but I wouldn't call that courage.
02:44:18
◼
►
And I'm sad that--
02:44:21
◼
►
- If it's not courage, is it caution?
02:44:24
◼
►
What word would you use?
02:44:25
◼
►
It's not caution.
02:44:26
◼
►
It's not timidness.
02:44:30
◼
►
Maybe hubris?
02:44:31
◼
►
Well, yeah, but hubris would be like, maybe hubris would say, "We believe there's a better
02:44:37
◼
►
To believe that you have such a better way and actually you're mistaken.
02:44:40
◼
►
You really believe you have a better way than this headphone port that has proven itself
02:44:42
◼
►
over the line.
02:44:43
◼
►
I think that's a reasonable word to use, but hubris tends to go hand in hand with courage
02:44:48
◼
►
and to really believe you have this better way.
02:44:52
◼
►
There's a fine line between courage and stupidity, I guess.
02:44:55
◼
►
- And hubris is where that line is drawn, I suppose.
02:44:57
◼
►
- I mean, the reality is, again, they're gonna be fine.
02:45:00
◼
►
And we are gonna stop, we're just all gonna accept this
02:45:03
◼
►
as normal and stop talking about it in like a week.
02:45:05
◼
►
It's gonna be fine.
02:45:07
◼
►
But I do think we've lost something here,
02:45:10
◼
►
and I don't think this was necessarily the right decision.
02:45:12
◼
►
I think this was a decision made
02:45:15
◼
►
that's more in Apple's interest
02:45:16
◼
►
than its customers' interest.
02:45:18
◼
►
It's making the product worse for Apple's interests.
02:45:20
◼
►
- Oh, I disagree.
02:45:22
◼
►
So I understand that there are a lot of people
02:45:26
◼
►
that are not living the fancy Bluetooth lifestyle.
02:45:30
◼
►
Erin, in her car, does not have a Bluetooth connection.
02:45:35
◼
►
But at some point we have to say,
02:45:38
◼
►
enough is enough, this is the future.
02:45:39
◼
►
And they, Apple, if we believe them,
02:45:42
◼
►
and if we take them at face value,
02:45:44
◼
►
they have fixed all of the common complaints about Bluetooth
02:45:47
◼
►
or they were never a problem in the first damn place.
02:45:49
◼
►
- With a whole bunch of asterisks.
02:45:51
◼
►
I don't think so. So look at the people, look at the things everyone complains and moans about when it comes to Bluetooth.
02:45:58
◼
►
Oh, you have to charge it. Oh, now I have to worry about charging because, oh, life is so difficult and I have to worry about charging.
02:46:03
◼
►
Oh, well, look at-- you get three hours of charge on the AirPods for 15 minutes.
02:46:11
◼
►
Like, I could go and use the restroom in more time than it takes for these things to charge and give me three hours of charge.
02:46:19
◼
►
How long are you spending in the restroom? I'm speaking facetious, but my point is that like include a shower
02:46:24
◼
►
He dropped his phone on the toilet. He had to fish it out
02:46:27
◼
►
I was thinking about at work like the point is you can do you can go and talk to a friend at work in
02:46:37
◼
►
15 minutes and next thing you know your your earbud your air air pods are charged
02:46:44
◼
►
So I don't believe and if you find that charging is that frickin difficult? Oh, come on
02:46:49
◼
►
I don't see why that's a problem at all and
02:46:54
◼
►
Pairing that it has been fixed with the air pods and if it's fixed with the air pods and fixed with all these beat headphones
02:47:00
◼
►
Beats headphones it you have to assume that this is going to trickle down to other devices and other
02:47:07
◼
►
Manufacturers probably through an MFI program. It will probably be a common thing
02:47:13
◼
►
Oh, just like the battery case trickle down all the fancy integration that has with the phone that other battery cases can't do
02:47:19
◼
►
- Yeah, but I don't view that as an
02:47:21
◼
►
Apple to Apple's comparison at all.
02:47:22
◼
►
- Oh, I think it's very much so.
02:47:24
◼
►
I think Apple is very much okay with making standards
02:47:29
◼
►
and things and extending things that its own products
02:47:33
◼
►
get special treatment in the system and get more
02:47:37
◼
►
capabilities or better capabilities
02:47:39
◼
►
than what third party stuff can do.
02:47:41
◼
►
I would not at all expect Apple to share the abilities
02:47:45
◼
►
of this new W1 Bluetooth chipset that's in these things
02:47:49
◼
►
and all the various software integrations
02:47:51
◼
►
with pairing it with the quick little window
02:47:53
◼
►
and syncing your pair progress
02:47:55
◼
►
between all your different devices.
02:47:56
◼
►
I would never expect that to come to anything else
02:47:58
◼
►
that is not an Apple branded headphone.
02:48:01
◼
►
- I don't know about that.
02:48:02
◼
►
I give that a reasonable chance that they'll do that
02:48:03
◼
►
just because, I mean, obviously they'll charge you for it.
02:48:06
◼
►
They'll make money off it.
02:48:07
◼
►
It'll be more than just license fee
02:48:09
◼
►
because this is an Apple designed chip
02:48:11
◼
►
that you'll probably have to license from them.
02:48:12
◼
►
But I don't think it's likely
02:48:14
◼
►
because that tends not to be the thing out,
02:48:16
◼
►
but I think it's within the realm of possibility
02:48:17
◼
►
because there are a lot of, again,
02:48:20
◼
►
if this pairing thing works, we're just assuming it does,
02:48:22
◼
►
but if it really is as good as they say,
02:48:24
◼
►
it's kind of in Apple's interest
02:48:28
◼
►
to have as many products as possible
02:48:31
◼
►
that all only work with their things.
02:48:33
◼
►
So I'm gonna wait and see on that one.
02:48:35
◼
►
It really just depends on how much money
02:48:37
◼
►
they think there is or should they even bother.
02:48:38
◼
►
'Cause like, yeah, there's an accessory market for it,
02:48:40
◼
►
but we shouldn't bother 'cause Bluetooth fills that need.
02:48:42
◼
►
But if there's a lot of interest
02:48:44
◼
►
that doesn't cost them a lot of money to license these chips?
02:48:46
◼
►
You know, we'll say the AirPods aren't even shipping yet,
02:48:48
◼
►
so who knows what the, maybe the limitation
02:48:50
◼
►
is the new W1 chip or whatever.
02:48:51
◼
►
So it could be that W1 isn't licensed, but the W5 is.
02:48:56
◼
►
But it all depends on how successful this is
02:48:58
◼
►
and how successful the AirPods are
02:48:59
◼
►
and how successful Apple is at convincing people
02:49:04
◼
►
that they really do have a better way
02:49:06
◼
►
for you to get audio out of your phone
02:49:07
◼
►
than to plug it into the headphone port.
02:49:09
◼
►
- Yeah, so they've done batteries and charging
02:49:14
◼
►
as well as you possibly can in the year of 2016.
02:49:17
◼
►
They've done pairing from everything we've been told and taking them at face value as
02:49:21
◼
►
well as you can in 2016.
02:49:23
◼
►
Importantly, because you were right in calling me out on my love of my Bluetooth headphones
02:49:27
◼
►
at work, to be fair, I never ever pair those things with anything else, and it's a friggin'
02:49:32
◼
►
nightmare if I go to do that.
02:49:34
◼
►
But with the AirPods, that's been fixed.
02:49:37
◼
►
And apparently it's easy as pie and uses iCloud, which is really scary.
02:49:42
◼
►
As soon as you pair with any of your devices, like freaking magic, all of your devices are
02:49:48
◼
►
So, if we believe that iCloud is magical.
02:49:50
◼
►
So that's been fixed.
02:49:51
◼
►
The switching has been fixed, the pairing has been fixed.
02:49:54
◼
►
I kid you not, I don't ever see latency on my really crappy $20 Bluetooth headphones
02:50:01
◼
►
as long as I'm not in Chrome.
02:50:03
◼
►
If I'm in Chrome, it's latency city.
02:50:05
◼
►
I'll be the first to tell you.
02:50:07
◼
►
on Safari, on QuickTime, on Preview, on QuickLook, anything else, it's fine.
02:50:14
◼
►
I never get disconnected because my arm is in the way.
02:50:18
◼
►
I can walk like 20, 30 feet away.
02:50:20
◼
►
I'm still connected.
02:50:21
◼
►
I can still listen to music or podcasts or what have you.
02:50:24
◼
►
I don't see how latency is an issue.
02:50:27
◼
►
I don't see how any of this is an issue.
02:50:30
◼
►
And okay, the one thing you can come back to and say is, "Well, what we had was fine."
02:50:36
◼
►
Okay, I guess it was fine.
02:50:39
◼
►
And if you want to continue to have that thing that was fine, use the freaking adapter.
02:50:45
◼
►
But in the end of the day, Apple wanted to make a phone that was the same size, that
02:50:50
◼
►
was a design constraint for better or worse.
02:50:54
◼
►
And I'm getting dragged over the coals in the chat because, "Oh, we could have just
02:50:58
◼
►
made it bigger and added space for the for the headphone port sure they could
02:51:02
◼
►
have but for better or worse bet of good right or bad wrong or indifferent doesn't
02:51:08
◼
►
matter the point of the matter is they wanted to keep the thing the same size
02:51:12
◼
►
and in order to do that and make the improvements they wanted they had to
02:51:19
◼
►
ditch the headphone port it says it in this bud fees but buzz feed article they
02:51:23
◼
►
They had to do it.
02:51:26
◼
►
You're gonna get on the MacBook One argument again.
02:51:27
◼
►
- It actually kind of doesn't say that, by the way.
02:51:30
◼
►
- They shouldn't have gone.
02:51:32
◼
►
They didn't have to.
02:51:34
◼
►
They could have made room.
02:51:35
◼
►
There was room in there.
02:51:37
◼
►
They could have gotten room out of it somehow.
02:51:39
◼
►
They did it with all the other phones.
02:51:40
◼
►
They could do it again.
02:51:42
◼
►
Maybe they said it in a BuzzFeed article, but on stage, they shied away from that.
02:51:44
◼
►
Because like I said, there is something where the headphone port was, and that something
02:51:48
◼
►
is essential.
02:51:49
◼
►
If you were to cut it out with an X-Acto knife, the phone will not function anymore.
02:51:52
◼
►
But that's again true with the MacBook One.
02:51:54
◼
►
If you had designed it from the beginning, as they did with the 6s and the 6, you can
02:51:57
◼
►
find room for it, surprisingly.
02:51:59
◼
►
That's not the whole thing.
02:52:00
◼
►
I think one of the angles on it that they mentioned in passing that we haven't really
02:52:04
◼
►
talked about too much is the idea that it's a uni-tasker, that that port only serves one
02:52:08
◼
►
purpose as opposed to the multitasking lightning port that can do all sorts of different things.
02:52:12
◼
►
There's a plus and minus there in that multi-purpose means like, "Oh, but what if we want to charge
02:52:16
◼
►
at the same time?
02:52:17
◼
►
It's multi-purpose and it's just one port.
02:52:18
◼
►
Maybe they should have three lightning ports in the bottom and then they'll solve this
02:52:20
◼
►
problem, right? But, you know, there are other reasons to think that, like, you know, if
02:52:26
◼
►
you don't believe that this thing was inevitably doomed. It's hard to let go of something that's
02:52:29
◼
►
been around for so long because it's so compatible and it's so ubiquitous. But really, in the
02:52:35
◼
►
grand scheme of things, holes in computers that only perform one function and that function
02:52:39
◼
►
never changes over the years, they don't have a good life. Like, you know, we want ports
02:52:44
◼
►
to do multiple things. At this point, we have a port that, like, does power and runs monitors
02:52:49
◼
►
and you can run Ethernet over all in the same port.
02:52:51
◼
►
Obviously, if you just have one of those ports, it's crappy, but there are so many trends
02:52:58
◼
►
moving that direction.
02:52:59
◼
►
There's also minuses for wires that I feel personally.
02:53:03
◼
►
When I have my thing plugged in and there's a wire snaking from my arm, I do get it caught
02:53:10
◼
►
And we've all had the thing where the ear pods get yanked out of your ears, and I am
02:53:14
◼
►
instantly infuriated by that sensation.
02:53:16
◼
►
I hate it, and that's why I've been looking into these wireless things.
02:53:20
◼
►
Like, I'm not saying this justifies it, but there is another side.
02:53:23
◼
►
And everything that I've mentioned does not benefit Apple, except for the part where I
02:53:26
◼
►
pay them $160 for the little ear pods.
02:53:29
◼
►
But there are consumer benefits on the other side of it.
02:53:31
◼
►
So at this point, I'm still willing to give Apple the benefit of the doubt, which is why
02:53:34
◼
►
I'm willing to even try this phone out.
02:53:37
◼
►
If I try the phone out and it turns out their wireless solution is crap and I miss my headphone
02:53:42
◼
►
I'll be the first to say it, but right now I'm willing to give it a go.
02:53:47
◼
►
All right, let's move on.
02:53:50
◼
►
Performance was the last major category they had where they talked about the A10, which
02:53:56
◼
►
is the new chip.
02:53:57
◼
►
It is four core.
02:54:00
◼
►
There are two high performance cores, which are 40% faster than the outgoing A9, and two
02:54:06
◼
►
high efficiency cores, which run at 20% of the power of the other two cores.
02:54:11
◼
►
And that's a really interesting and really clever way of trying to squeeze a little more
02:54:16
◼
►
juice, or a little more runtime I should say, out of these phones.
02:54:20
◼
►
And it reminds me a lot to channel neutral.
02:54:22
◼
►
It reminds me a lot of the, what is it, the North Star that was the first to shut down
02:54:27
◼
►
cylinders if you didn't need a bunch of power as you were like driving on the highway for
02:54:31
◼
►
example and just maintaining your speed.
02:54:33
◼
►
So say you had this humongous V8 in your Cadillac, the thing would just shut down half of the
02:54:40
◼
►
V8 in order to save yourself a little gas.
02:54:43
◼
►
Maybe it wasn't the North Star, maybe it was a different one, but that same idea happened
02:54:48
◼
►
all over the place and still goes on from time to time.
02:54:50
◼
►
And it doesn't go on from time to time, it is everywhere.
02:54:53
◼
►
Cylinder deactivation is like a standard feature of every car with an engine that's too big
02:54:56
◼
►
for it nowadays.
02:54:57
◼
►
Yep, exactly.
02:54:58
◼
►
But sounds like it's really good.
02:55:00
◼
►
The performance improvements are impressive as always.
02:55:05
◼
►
The GPU, apparently 6-core, 50% faster than what's in the A9.
02:55:10
◼
►
Three times what's in the A8 that's in the 6 models.
02:55:14
◼
►
And most importantly to me, apparently we've found plenty of other things to talk about
02:55:18
◼
►
this episode, but most importantly to me, they said you will get two hours more than
02:55:23
◼
►
a 6s when you're using the 7, roughly, and one hour more on a 7+ than you got on the
02:55:32
◼
►
So we are actually seeing an increase in battery life, even without making the device bigger,
02:55:37
◼
►
which I am super on board with.
02:55:39
◼
►
I am genuinely stoked about this.
02:55:41
◼
►
And in fact, I was really debating going Plus Club this year because of that two-camera
02:55:46
◼
►
system like we were talking about earlier, and also because of the improved battery life.
02:55:51
◼
►
And granted, I would still get a lot more battery life if I went Plus Club at the 7.
02:55:54
◼
►
But the fact that I'm, what I, I feel like I'm on the ragged edge of comfortable on battery
02:56:00
◼
►
life on my 6s plus and this is going to give me another two hours in theory, well that
02:56:04
◼
►
should be great. I should be good to go outside of like conferences and then I'll use the
02:56:08
◼
►
super proprietary humpback if I need to. But I am all on board. I think this is all great
02:56:15
◼
►
things and not terribly unexpected outside of the battery stuff, but all good things
02:56:19
◼
►
all around. Well the battery stuff we expected too. This is exactly what we talked about.
02:56:22
◼
►
If they use the same case for three years in a row and the system on a chip becomes
02:56:25
◼
►
more efficient and this is before we even like this is better than you even thought
02:56:28
◼
►
because not only does the system on a chip become more efficient from a new process,
02:56:30
◼
►
but they have the little, the low-power sort of limp mode things, which is a very clever
02:56:34
◼
►
design. I'm not sure if other phones are doing that, but I think it's mostly unprecedented
02:56:38
◼
►
in desktop CPUs where you would have non-uniform cores, like you'd have these wussy cores
02:56:42
◼
►
that are just like one third of the die area, but otherwise presumably fully functional,
02:56:48
◼
►
and you would use them when you need to instead of just power cycling things or disabling
02:56:52
◼
►
cores. Anyways. Well, there's the whole, there's the ARM
02:56:54
◼
►
big dot little thing, but I think this is just one of those implementations. But I don't
02:56:58
◼
►
know of any other devices that use it in the phone or computer space.
02:57:01
◼
►
Yeah, and it'll only get better as they, I'm assuming the A11 and so on and so forth,
02:57:05
◼
►
get better about like being able to switch between them faster and getting smarter about
02:57:09
◼
►
when to use them and all sorts of other stuff. So anyway, we get the benefit of same size
02:57:13
◼
►
case, bigger battery because there's slightly more room or maybe even the same size battery,
02:57:18
◼
►
lower power system on a chip equals more battery. And I was saying like 10-15%, you know, I
02:57:22
◼
►
I can't do the math in my head, but two hours,
02:57:24
◼
►
that is, you know, if that is even remotely close to true,
02:57:28
◼
►
that is something that everybody will notice,
02:57:30
◼
►
and it is almost exactly, I mean, Mark,
02:57:33
◼
►
are you asking for double battery life?
02:57:34
◼
►
But I think-- - Oh, no, I was asking
02:57:36
◼
►
for four or five times more battery life.
02:57:38
◼
►
That's what I mean. - Well, you know what I mean.
02:57:39
◼
►
Like, I mean, we have to, you know, again,
02:57:40
◼
►
I could be carrying around a bar of soap,
02:57:42
◼
►
but if that two-hour figure is remotely close to true,
02:57:44
◼
►
I am really happy about that.
02:57:46
◼
►
As someone who doesn't have battery problems on my phone,
02:57:48
◼
►
because I feel like that is the substantial
02:57:50
◼
►
battery improvement we're talking about,
02:57:50
◼
►
Now granted, again, they got it by using the same size case for three years.
02:57:54
◼
►
You can probably kiss that goodbye for next year's super skinny phone, but enjoy it
02:57:58
◼
►
while you can.
02:57:59
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, this is great news if it works out the way they say with real world use,
02:58:05
◼
►
and it might.
02:58:06
◼
►
Apple is, they have kind of a mixed record of adhering to their benchmarks from reality.
02:58:14
◼
►
Usually if you do the things that are in their benchmarks, usually they're actually pretty
02:58:17
◼
►
pretty good, but the question is more like whether real world use is well reflected by
02:58:22
◼
►
the benchmarks.
02:58:24
◼
►
In this case, what we've seen for most of their most recent advances in battery life
02:58:31
◼
►
in devices, phones and laptops, the vast majority of recent advances have not really been in
02:58:37
◼
►
reducing the amount of power while you're using it heavily.
02:58:41
◼
►
It's mostly been in reducing power used while it's pretty much idle or doing very, very
02:58:46
◼
►
simple tasks. And that's what this most likely is. You know, because of that new asymmetric
02:58:51
◼
►
core design where you have the low power cores and the high power cores, that's awesome.
02:58:56
◼
►
Because of that, that's going to be most likely a savings only in like idle and low power
02:59:02
◼
►
states. I bet when it's in the high power states, it's still going to kill your battery
02:59:06
◼
►
just as much as it did before, maybe even more now.
02:59:08
◼
►
- Well, I don't know. Like, here's the reason I have some question on that. Because if the
02:59:14
◼
►
WIMPi cores are enough to accomplish the task.
02:59:18
◼
►
For instance, imagine there's a task that uses a lot of GPU,
02:59:21
◼
►
but you need just enough CPU
02:59:23
◼
►
that you can use the WIMPi cores.
02:59:24
◼
►
You'll still get the savings
02:59:25
◼
►
when quote unquote working flat out.
02:59:27
◼
►
You know what I mean?
02:59:28
◼
►
Like I'm imagining, say there's a game that you can play.
02:59:31
◼
►
The game is like two years old
02:59:33
◼
►
and you can run the whole game just using the WIMPi cores.
02:59:36
◼
►
You will see a huge savings
02:59:38
◼
►
just playing that game flat out.
02:59:39
◼
►
I don't know if we're close to that point.
02:59:40
◼
►
I don't know what the threshold is,
02:59:42
◼
►
but because we've come so far,
02:59:44
◼
►
you show that graph and everything,
02:59:45
◼
►
those two quote unquote wimpy cores
02:59:47
◼
►
are like faster than the iPhone 5 or whatever.
02:59:50
◼
►
Like I don't know what the actual specs on them are,
02:59:52
◼
►
but like there is some past phone
02:59:53
◼
►
that we used to think was fast
02:59:55
◼
►
that these little wimpy cores are faster than.
02:59:57
◼
►
So I feel like this one is more like
02:59:58
◼
►
you're driving most of the time on four cylinders
03:00:02
◼
►
and only when you put your foot down do they all come on.
03:00:04
◼
►
But this is just speculation
03:00:05
◼
►
'cause I have no idea what the threshold is.
03:00:06
◼
►
But what it comes down to is I think
03:00:10
◼
►
there are an increasing number of tasks on your phone
03:00:13
◼
►
that can be handled by the weak CPU.
03:00:16
◼
►
So I think he picked email,
03:00:18
◼
►
and maybe even web browsing is like that.
03:00:20
◼
►
And you just save the big guns for when you really need it,
03:00:23
◼
►
as opposed to the situation we are in like MacBooks,
03:00:25
◼
►
where it's like, look,
03:00:26
◼
►
if you're just gonna be compiling software for hours,
03:00:28
◼
►
everything's gonna be running Macs,
03:00:30
◼
►
and what can you do?
03:00:31
◼
►
Or you're playing a game,
03:00:33
◼
►
desktop games just run everything in Macs.
03:00:35
◼
►
There's no game that you're running
03:00:36
◼
►
with the wimpy cores, but on phones, who knows?
03:00:39
◼
►
- Yeah, I mean, it remains to be seen also,
03:00:40
◼
►
as a developer, can you set your process affinity to one of the,
03:00:44
◼
►
can you say, run this thread only on the wimpy cores?
03:00:48
◼
►
- Damn it, I was gonna ask that same question.
03:00:50
◼
►
- I really doubt that.
03:00:52
◼
►
This is totally the kind of thing that Apple
03:00:55
◼
►
is going to want to have complete control over,
03:00:57
◼
►
because they're gonna tweak it.
03:00:58
◼
►
They're gonna be like, well, the first version,
03:01:00
◼
►
we have this very simple algorithm, which isn't that great.
03:01:02
◼
►
In the second version, in the A11,
03:01:05
◼
►
we can change states like 100 times faster,
03:01:07
◼
►
and we're much smarter about doing it based on data.
03:01:10
◼
►
You gotta give them time to ramp up on this.
03:01:12
◼
►
I can't imagine them giving core affinity attributes,
03:01:17
◼
►
that type of low-level thing.
03:01:18
◼
►
It just doesn't seem like something they would do.
03:01:20
◼
►
- Yeah, well also, can you use all four cores at once?
03:01:23
◼
►
Or when the high power one is on,
03:01:25
◼
►
does it deactivate that low power one?
03:01:27
◼
►
That core's in costume. - I think you can use
03:01:28
◼
►
all four because I'm thinking of those Geekbench scores,
03:01:30
◼
►
and I bet the reason you get the multi-thread boost
03:01:32
◼
►
is I think you can use all four at once.
03:01:34
◼
►
- Yeah, maybe.
03:01:35
◼
►
I don't know, we'll find out.
03:01:36
◼
►
But yeah, that is very, just as a programmer,
03:01:39
◼
►
that is very interesting to me,
03:01:40
◼
►
to have this kind of architecture.
03:01:42
◼
►
Even if I can't manually direct it or hint it
03:01:46
◼
►
to do things the way I think they should be done,
03:01:49
◼
►
it will still be cool to try to target things
03:01:51
◼
►
to those low power cores.
03:01:52
◼
►
You'd be like, "All right, let me try it."
03:01:54
◼
►
It's kind of like the people who,
03:01:55
◼
►
back before the Prius had a plug-in variant,
03:01:59
◼
►
when they would try to get their Prius
03:02:01
◼
►
to stay on only electric mode for as long as possible
03:02:04
◼
►
on their daily driving.
03:02:05
◼
►
I feel like, as a developer,
03:02:06
◼
►
How can I write this queue or this thread
03:02:09
◼
►
or this entire app to try to stay on the low power core
03:02:13
◼
►
the entire time or as long as possible?
03:02:14
◼
►
- There'll be a WWDC session with some iOS instruments demo
03:02:18
◼
►
showing you that.
03:02:19
◼
►
Like as we can see here in the graph, this big jump,
03:02:21
◼
►
that's when it goes up to the bigger core.
03:02:22
◼
►
So if you can, keep it down below them.
03:02:24
◼
►
- Yeah, exactly.
03:02:25
◼
►
So yeah, that's gonna be cool.
03:02:27
◼
►
I'm looking forward to this.
03:02:28
◼
►
I do, I'm a little, I'm kind of like wait and see skeptical
03:02:32
◼
►
on the battery claims simply because it sure does sound
03:02:35
◼
►
They just improved idle power without really addressing usage power, but we'll see.
03:02:42
◼
►
So all in all, what would you say, since I haven't heard anything about ratings, and
03:02:48
◼
►
certainly I know that Jon loves to give numerical ratings, what would you say about the presentation
03:02:55
◼
►
I thought it was really good.
03:02:57
◼
►
I can't say—off the top of my head, I can't say I was really disappointed in anything.
03:03:02
◼
►
I'm not in love with the synthetic bokeh,
03:03:04
◼
►
but I still think it's a move in the right direction-ish.
03:03:08
◼
►
I was really pleased with this,
03:03:10
◼
►
and I think they did a really great job.
03:03:14
◼
►
- Yeah, overall, pretty good event,
03:03:15
◼
►
pretty good presentation, pretty good quality overall,
03:03:20
◼
►
and the products they announced seem like,
03:03:23
◼
►
nothing was incredibly surprising,
03:03:25
◼
►
except maybe the replacing of the Watch 1 CPU
03:03:28
◼
►
with the Watch 2 CPU, that was pretty cool.
03:03:31
◼
►
Other than that, nothing was an amazing surprise necessarily,
03:03:35
◼
►
but overall, solid updates to the watch on the phone.
03:03:40
◼
►
I do obviously very much miss the Mac
03:03:45
◼
►
as a thing that was updated and talked about ever,
03:03:48
◼
►
but hopefully that will be resolved soon.
03:03:50
◼
►
I really hope so.
03:03:51
◼
►
And otherwise though, for what was announced today,
03:03:54
◼
►
pretty solid updates, and I'm looking forward
03:03:57
◼
►
to getting my hands on the new phone.
03:03:59
◼
►
Well, getting both hands around my new phone,
03:04:01
◼
►
that's for sure.
03:04:02
◼
►
One won't be enough.
03:04:06
◼
►
- I miss the days when I didn't know things.
03:04:08
◼
►
Like it was kind of disappointing
03:04:09
◼
►
that we knew almost everything here,
03:04:10
◼
►
but I was excited by the things that I saw,
03:04:13
◼
►
almost all of the things they were doing.
03:04:15
◼
►
Well, there was no surprises except pleasant ones,
03:04:19
◼
►
let's put it that way,
03:04:20
◼
►
because all the things that were potentially disappointing,
03:04:22
◼
►
we knew about.
03:04:23
◼
►
And the pleasant surprise,
03:04:24
◼
►
we didn't talk about the storage tiers,
03:04:25
◼
►
but like we knew about all that ahead of time.
03:04:27
◼
►
We knew the, you know, basically knew the 32, 128, 256 thing or whatever, but the things
03:04:32
◼
►
we didn't know about were pleasant.
03:04:34
◼
►
We didn't know about the Series 1 getting the new CPU, and we didn't know about the
03:04:38
◼
►
6s and the 6s Plus getting rid of the 16s, which is a pleasant surprise and not typical
03:04:45
◼
►
of Tim Cook's Apple, and needless to say, absolutely the right thing to do, but 16 is
03:04:51
◼
►
It would be better if the current line was 64, 128, 256, but beggars can't be choosers.
03:04:56
◼
►
This is positive progress, so when I came out of the event, I was excited to try the
03:05:01
◼
►
products they showed.
03:05:03
◼
►
I'm excited to see my wife's inevitable new watch and see her play Pokemon Go on it, and
03:05:08
◼
►
the GPS features.
03:05:09
◼
►
I'm excited to check out the new phones and see what the new service is like and the grips
03:05:14
◼
►
and stuff like that.
03:05:15
◼
►
I'm excited that the new phone is faster and that the camera is better.
03:05:20
◼
►
We knew there was going to be no Macs for the most part.
03:05:22
◼
►
I still believe that they will be updated this year and I'll be probably more excited
03:05:28
◼
►
about that event than this thing, but overall I was satisfied with the presentation and
03:05:33
◼
►
happy with it and thought it was done well.
03:05:36
◼
►
I even kind of liked the weird musical act at the end.
03:05:38
◼
►
See ya is very good actually.
03:05:43
◼
►
All right, well, thank you very much to our three sponsors this week, Hover, Tracker,
03:05:48
◼
►
and Betterment, and we will see you next week.
03:05:50
◼
►
Now the show is over, they didn't even mean to begin
03:05:57
◼
►
Cause it was accidental, oh it was accidental
03:06:04
◼
►
John didn't do any research, Marco and Casey wouldn't let him
03:06:09
◼
►
Cause it was accidental, oh it was accidental
03:06:14
◼
►
And you can find the show notes at ATP.fm
03:06:18
◼
►
And if you're into Twitter, you can follow them at C-A-S-E-Y-L-I-S-S
03:06:29
◼
►
So that's Casey, Liz, M-A-R-C-O-A-R-M, N-T-M-A-R-C-O-R-M-N
03:06:36
◼
►
S-I-R-A-C-U-S-A-C-R-A-C-U-S-A
03:06:40
◼
►
It's accidental (it's accidental)
03:06:44
◼
►
♪ They didn't mean to accidental ♪
03:06:47
◼
►
♪ Accidental ♪
03:06:49
◼
►
♪ Tech podcast ♪
03:06:51
◼
►
♪ So long ♪
03:06:53
◼
►
- We did it.
03:06:54
◼
►
- Oh, I can't believe this is so long.
03:06:56
◼
►
- I know. - It's so hot in this room.
03:06:59
◼
►
- So I decided, I'm about to go to Portland
03:07:02
◼
►
for the last XOXO, and I decided a few days ago,
03:07:05
◼
►
in advance of ordering the new iPhone,
03:07:09
◼
►
in about 24 hours now, I think, right?
03:07:13
◼
►
- Oh, God, yes.
03:07:14
◼
►
- So in advance of that, I decided,
03:07:17
◼
►
let me switch back to my Plus that I had for a few days
03:07:22
◼
►
and take it on the beginning of this trip,
03:07:24
◼
►
and that'll kinda help me, give me one final thing,
03:07:26
◼
►
like do I want to go Plus?
03:07:28
◼
►
Because I really want the features
03:07:30
◼
►
and the battery of the Plus.
03:07:31
◼
►
I want that camera, I want the big battery,
03:07:33
◼
►
and when I'm actually using the Plus to do things,
03:07:36
◼
►
I do love having that big screen.
03:07:38
◼
►
I love having the extra screen space.
03:07:40
◼
►
I love seeing Instagram photos bigger.
03:07:42
◼
►
I love seeing any photos bigger, seeing my own photos,
03:07:44
◼
►
taking camera photos and processing and everything,
03:07:47
◼
►
just extra space on web pages, et cetera.
03:07:50
◼
►
So I thought, all right, let me move back to the Plus
03:07:51
◼
►
for a few days as one final sanity check
03:07:53
◼
►
to see if I can really live with it as a size.
03:07:57
◼
►
My Plus is 64 gigs.
03:08:00
◼
►
My 6S that I've been living on is 128.
03:08:02
◼
►
And I use iCloud Photo Library.
03:08:05
◼
►
You see where this is going?
03:08:07
◼
►
So. - Oh, God.
03:08:09
◼
►
So to transfer your current backup
03:08:14
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from a 128 gig device to a 64 gig device,
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when you're using iCloud photo library,
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so problem number one, I had forgotten
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about the size difference, try it,
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and of course it says, oh sorry,
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we can't restore this backup to this phone
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because there's not enough space, okay.
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So I go to my 6S, okay, how do I clear space
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from this device?
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Now, I've heard over the years
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that Apple's slowly getting better at this process.
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There's still some way to go, I would say.
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So problem number one,
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when you're using iCloud Photo Library,
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it smartly manages your storage,
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which means that unless the phone is incredibly low on space
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it never deletes anything.
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However, it also doesn't give you a way to delete anything
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without actually deleting it from your iCloud Photo Library.
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It's like deleting it everywhere.
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You can't, so normally, all the pictures and video
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that you take on the phone, even after they get uploaded
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to iCloud Photo Library, as far as I can tell,
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they don't leave the phone,
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like they don't get deleted off the phone,
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even when it's safe to.
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The old way to do this was to import your photos
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into a photo app on your computer,
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and then use the photo app or use image capture
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to open up the phone as if it were a camera
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and delete all the photos off the phone that way.
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'Cause there's nowhere in the system settings
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on the phone anywhere where you can delete photos
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out of your photo library.
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That's just not a thing.
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So as far as I can tell, I looked all over the place
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and couldn't find any.
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And in retrospect, that's probably a good thing.
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That isn't a thing because people would do it accidentally.
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Anyway, but even with iCloud Photo Library,
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you can't say, all right, there's no button that says,
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please free up as much space as you safely can.
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Anything that's in iCloud,
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please delete it off my phone right now.
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There's no button to do that anywhere.
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So I remove all the music.
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I remove all the podcasts I'm not listening to.
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I remove some big games I never play 'cause who cares.
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I remove GarageBand, all these things.
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Eventually, the only thing I can do is
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I have to get rid of this giant block of photos
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'cause everything else is not making enough space.
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To do this, I had to disable iCloud Photo Library,
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which is kind of a scary thing to do,
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even though I, like, here I am on my computer,
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I have all these, I have it in Photos app right there,
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so I know I'm not losing anything,
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and that's all backed up, even if iCloud gets all crazy.
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I have that, like, I have a Mac backup,
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like through Backblaze, through Time Machine,
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through Super Duper, okay.
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So I know I'm safe.
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Still a crazy thing to do from your phone,
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to disable that and then, because image capture
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won't let you delete photos off the phone
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if iCloud Photo Library is enabled.
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So the thing I had to do, and I'm not sure
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if I could have done anything better,
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what I had to do was disable iCloud Photo Library
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on the phone, open up image capture on my Mac,
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have it select all and delete all like 16,000 or whatever,
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it was something like that, photos that were on the phone,
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many of which I didn't even shoot on the phone,
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were just copied there for photo library purposes,
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like through sync. (laughs)
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Delete everything that way, then back that up,
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restore that to the 64 gig phone,
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and then re-enable iCloud photo library on the phone then.
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- All of this was to avoid iCloud backup, I guess.
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'Cause that's the other alternative, obviously,
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if you don't have the sizes.
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You were trying to do like an iTunes backup and transfer.
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What if you just said,
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I'm just gonna use iCloud backup for everything?
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I suppose that probably, yeah, 'cause that,
03:11:37
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I assume that would work.
03:11:39
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- It would, but it has other pain,
03:11:40
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is that you're waiting for the apps to download
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and waiting for your data to come back.
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- Yeah, and then I get none of my keychain items,
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so I have to reenter all my passwords everywhere,
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and that sucks. - That's true.
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- Like that, like, I'd rather have a brief,
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severe sucking of something than have like,
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than have like three days of annoyance
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as I have to reenter all the passwords into everything.
03:12:00
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Anyway, yeah, so this phone is ridiculous.
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This is so big, but I am kinda living with it right now,
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and I really want that good camera setup.
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And-- - And I'm sorry,
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you said that's a six plus or six S plus?
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- It's a six plus, which is interesting.
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Going back to, I mean, 3D touch, I don't miss,
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'cause I hardly ever use it for anything.
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I occasionally use it for cursor movement
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within a text block, but usually nothing else.
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I do miss the faster touch ID sensor quite a bit.
03:12:25
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That is a big thing I notice.
03:12:27
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And the six plus before the six S plus
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also was, it was the first plus phone,
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and it kinda didn't have enough RAM,
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and the GPU was kinda not powerful enough.
03:12:36
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So there's like animations a little bit sluggish sometimes,
03:12:39
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and just certain things are a little bit ew, you know?
03:12:42
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But for the most part, it's fine.
03:12:44
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It kinda makes me think like, wow,
03:12:47
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buying a new phone every year is kind of wasteful,
03:12:49
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because this two-year-old one is fine for the most part.
03:12:52
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It's totally fine.
03:12:54
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It's not great, it's not fast by my success standards,
03:12:58
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but it's good enough for most of what I'm doing with it.
03:13:00
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Touch ID is slower and that sucks,
03:13:02
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but I'm living with it, it's fine.
03:13:05
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But yeah, I think even though in so many ways it is worse,
03:13:09
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in so many ways it's harder to hold,
03:13:12
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I still don't like the way Springboard rotates.
03:13:15
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I still hate the way that apps like Mail and Messages
03:13:18
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get like the half iPad view in landscape mode.
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And as a result of hating the way it does landscape
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in every possible way, I usually have to keep
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the Plus phone in rotation lock mode,
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which is great until I wanna look at a photo.
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So it's a little bit annoying in those ways,
03:13:35
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but I really do love having the additional screen space.
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I love typing on it.
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I'm way more accurate with the text input on it.
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These because it's a bigger keyboard,
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fits my thumbs better, I guess.
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So I guess I'm gonna go Plus,
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but I'll decide again in 24 hours
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when we have to order them.
03:13:53
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- Oh my God.
03:13:54
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Well, it's a little over 'cause it's three in the morning.
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I'll be in Pacific time though. I'll be at XOXO.
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So I'll be exhausted, but I'll be awake.