The Accidental Tech Podcast

173: A Series of Heartbreaking Rejections


00:00:00   but I put my photos and google photos oh [TS]

00:00:03   yeah you know I finally ended up doing [TS]

00:00:05   it because like that thing I just [TS]

00:00:06   tweeted about my controller my [TS]

00:00:08   playstation controller with the worn-out [TS]

00:00:09   thing on the bottom [TS]

00:00:10   mm-hmm i was trying to find the old [TS]

00:00:12   picture like the original ones i wanted [TS]

00:00:13   to the tweet like here's the new one [TS]

00:00:15   yeah uh-huh and i could not find that [TS]

00:00:17   picture i'm scrolling through my photos [TS]

00:00:18   library I just like I could not find I [TS]

00:00:21   couldn't even narrow down to like was [TS]

00:00:23   trying to look at the release date [TS]

00:00:24   destiny but I didn't get in the release [TS]

00:00:25   date i'm scrolling and I know it's like [TS]

00:00:27   one picture i could not find it so I'm [TS]

00:00:28   like okay so to find one picture you [TS]

00:00:30   upload your entire photo collection [TS]

00:00:32   google photos and that was easier [TS]

00:00:33   yes to fight because how else are you [TS]

00:00:35   gonna find the one picture if I knew [TS]

00:00:36   which photo upload like I have to upload [TS]

00:00:38   the whole thing I want to try it anyway [TS]

00:00:40   that's just push me over the edge that's [TS]

00:00:41   amazing so as uploading to literally [TS]

00:00:43   70,000 photos i'm typing in searches [TS]

00:00:47   like as you can search while it's [TS]

00:00:48   uploading trying to think of searches [TS]

00:00:50   that will find this so i type in [TS]

00:00:51   controller [TS]

00:00:52   no matches ps4 no matches black plastic [TS]

00:00:56   matches but none of the ones i wanted [TS]

00:00:58   then I was thinking maybe it's not in my [TS]

00:01:00   photo library maybe some other trapped [TS]

00:01:02   in some iOS device so i start putting up [TS]

00:01:04   and I think it was actually trapped in [TS]

00:01:05   my phone so now i'm uploading from my [TS]

00:01:07   phone like photos that appears again [TS]

00:01:08   Tina has the library not me [TS]

00:01:10   right so it's her photo things so [TS]

00:01:12   uploading from google photos of Google's [TS]

00:01:15   from our mac is pushing those pictures [TS]

00:01:17   up but it's not pushing any of the [TS]

00:01:18   pictures up from my phone so now I'm [TS]

00:01:20   trying to push up my phone into the [TS]

00:01:21   thing and I just had control into the [TS]

00:01:23   search and found two pictures of [TS]

00:01:25   gamecube controllers and a picture of my [TS]

00:01:28   brother getting a playstation 2 in 2004 [TS]

00:01:30   seriously it's magic [TS]

00:01:32   it is but it still didn't find the damn [TS]

00:01:34   picture i mean i found myself eventually [TS]

00:01:35   because I figured out that i had tweeted [TS]

00:01:37   it and i found the tweet based on [TS]

00:01:38   searching the tweet so all that and it [TS]

00:01:41   still didn't you still didn't actually [TS]

00:01:42   find the 5th with 3 it found three [TS]

00:01:44   controllers [TS]

00:01:45   the problem is I don't know if that [TS]

00:01:46   picture has been pushed tapenade the [TS]

00:01:48   whole time we've been recording my phone [TS]

00:01:49   has been in theory pushing photos up and [TS]

00:01:53   I guessing that's where it is and the [TS]

00:01:54   seven thousand photos that are on my [TS]

00:01:55   phone anyway it did find pictures of [TS]

00:01:57   controller so I have some help now we [TS]

00:02:01   should do a little bit of John's [TS]

00:02:02   favorite thing in the world we should do [TS]

00:02:03   some follow-up and there's some very [TS]

00:02:05   very sad follow-up there's not going to [TS]

00:02:08   be a 5k monitor at WCC but we don't know [TS]

00:02:11   but that's the rumor [TS]

00:02:12   was there was there ever going to be the [TS]

00:02:13   5k monitor was that really a strong we [TS]

00:02:16   did a whole show last week all about all [TS]

00:02:19   the hardware that we were excited for [TS]

00:02:21   and then like immediately after that all [TS]

00:02:23   the rumor sites said you know you're [TS]

00:02:25   looking for a five-game honors with gpus [TS]

00:02:27   forget it you're looking for new [TS]

00:02:28   macbooks those might not even be there [TS]

00:02:30   no hardware it's gonna be all about [TS]

00:02:31   software don't get your hopes up and of [TS]

00:02:33   course no one even bothered to reshoot [TS]

00:02:34   the idea that they're going to make a [TS]

00:02:35   new back progress don't care about that [TS]

00:02:36   enough to even put on the Riverside yeah [TS]

00:02:38   there's not gonna be any of those either [TS]

00:02:39   so yesterday I was all helpful and now [TS]

00:02:41   the prevalent rumors are all the [TS]

00:02:44   hardware you hope for may still come but [TS]

00:02:47   not at WTC that's not a huge surprise i [TS]

00:02:50   mean the the nomadic prose is a little [TS]

00:02:53   bit surprising but i would expect the [TS]

00:02:55   display to come with an expert to the [TS]

00:02:56   mac pro and whether it's the same time [TS]

00:02:58   is the macbook pro or not who knows but [TS]

00:03:01   it does seem like it's probably going to [TS]

00:03:03   be a a high-end mostly pro products for [TS]

00:03:07   a while I don't think a lot of people [TS]

00:03:08   who are like mid-range buyers who have a [TS]

00:03:11   13 macbook pro are going to be buying [TS]

00:03:13   the very first Apple 5k display it's [TS]

00:03:16   probably going to be expensive [TS]

00:03:17   it's probably going to be you know [TS]

00:03:18   there's this big special thing to [TS]

00:03:20   require the brand-new computers i [TS]

00:03:22   wouldn't expect this to be like just an [TS]

00:03:24   average consumer release i would expect [TS]

00:03:25   us to wait for the background to the mac [TS]

00:03:27   pro but I could be wrong [TS]

00:03:28   I i would think the opposite i would [TS]

00:03:30   think that the whole purpose of this [TS]

00:03:31   monitor is so people who buy macbook [TS]

00:03:33   pros can have a really big screen when [TS]

00:03:35   they said down at their desks and that [TS]

00:03:37   the whole point of this entire product [TS]

00:03:38   is that's why it's got a GPU inside so [TS]

00:03:40   even our lowly macbooks that don't [TS]

00:03:43   actually have a GPU that can drive it no [TS]

00:03:45   problem [TS]

00:03:45   the GPU is inside the screen is enough [TS]

00:03:47   to drive it you're not going to play [TS]

00:03:48   games on it or anything but it's just [TS]

00:03:49   it's enough to actually drive that many [TS]

00:03:51   pixels so now look at all these great [TS]

00:03:53   laptops they're great laptops on the go [TS]

00:03:55   and sit down at your desk and you have [TS]

00:03:56   essentially a 5k imac style screen in [TS]

00:03:59   front of you and they don't even mention [TS]

00:04:01   the macro because who the hell cares [TS]

00:04:02   about the mac pro because if this was [TS]

00:04:04   like a regular update like when they [TS]

00:04:05   when they went from 27 inch LED 227's [TS]

00:04:09   thunderbolt display that was like okay [TS]

00:04:10   we already know how to make screens this [TS]

00:04:12   sighs we've been making them for a long [TS]

00:04:13   for a few years for that point and [TS]

00:04:15   before that we made 30 inch screens for [TS]

00:04:16   even more years like this is no big deal [TS]

00:04:18   it's like mostly existing technology put [TS]

00:04:21   together in a new way in this case this [TS]

00:04:23   is a 5k screen this is still very high [TS]

00:04:25   Empress [TS]

00:04:25   but there still are very few five [TS]

00:04:27   countries in the market so you gotta [TS]

00:04:28   figure out this is going to be expensive [TS]

00:04:30   it's probably not going to be a thousand [TS]

00:04:32   dollars it's probably gonna be a little [TS]

00:04:33   more and even even if it was a thousand [TS]

00:04:35   dollars that still compared to other [TS]

00:04:38   monitors that people would have to put [TS]

00:04:40   on investment that's that's still a [TS]

00:04:41   pretty expensive monitor so I i would [TS]

00:04:44   expect this to be a high-end thing at [TS]

00:04:47   first and then maybe in a few years when [TS]

00:04:48   they update it next to add whatever new [TS]

00:04:50   you know screen construction technique [TS]

00:04:53   developed by then then it'll be more [TS]

00:04:54   consumer e but i would expect version [TS]

00:04:56   want to be [TS]

00:04:58   yeah i agree with that uh however I do [TS]

00:05:01   think that there is some very very big [TS]

00:05:03   demand for this say for example you are [TS]

00:05:06   in iOS developer and say just for the [TS]

00:05:09   sake of discussion you have an actual [TS]

00:05:11   job and you go to an office and that [TS]

00:05:14   office issues you a 15-inch macbook pro [TS]

00:05:17   but they issue you to lenovo displays [TS]

00:05:21   that are of unremarkable resolution and [TS]

00:05:24   so every time you're running iOS [TS]

00:05:28   simulator you're running it at like half [TS]

00:05:29   size even for like an iphone 6 simulator [TS]

00:05:32   so that can cause problems such as [TS]

00:05:35   you're doing something with a [TS]

00:05:37   uitableview and you don't want it to [TS]

00:05:40   look like a uitableview you don't want [TS]

00:05:42   any separators between all the high [TS]

00:05:43   table these cells and when you're just [TS]

00:05:45   looking at the simulator stationary the [TS]

00:05:48   divider lines separator lines between [TS]

00:05:51   each cell disappear because it's at half [TS]

00:05:54   zoom and then suddenly you go and you [TS]

00:05:57   start playing around with your UI [TS]

00:05:58   tableview and suddenly these magical [TS]

00:06:00   lines appear from nothingness and it's [TS]

00:06:03   very freaking annoying because you wish [TS]

00:06:04   you had noticed in the first place [TS]

00:06:06   very not a very big deal but still [TS]

00:06:08   annoying and then you come home to your [TS]

00:06:10   beautiful 5k display and think to [TS]

00:06:11   yourself wow [TS]

00:06:13   would it be nice to have something like [TS]

00:06:14   this at work so i didn't have to run the [TS]

00:06:15   simulator at half height [TS]

00:06:17   I mean just hypothetically anyway I [TS]

00:06:19   would kill for a thunderbolt retina [TS]

00:06:23   display i would kill both of you for a [TS]

00:06:25   thunderbolt display thanks at work hard [TS]

00:06:28   yeah i know you are on I don't think [TS]

00:06:31   work would pay for it because I agree [TS]

00:06:33   with you it'll probably be very [TS]

00:06:34   expensive but man would that be awesome [TS]

00:06:38   Jericho and before the entire internet [TS]

00:06:41   or writes me I i have the two displays [TS]

00:06:44   like and I have a standing desk so I run [TS]

00:06:46   my macbook pro in clamshell mode [TS]

00:06:50   yes I know you don't think that's a good [TS]

00:06:51   idea yes I'm aware that there's heat [TS]

00:06:53   potential heat problems yes I know the [TS]

00:06:55   simulator would be able to run full [TS]

00:06:56   height if i did use the onboard display [TS]

00:06:59   I understand all those things I I'm my [TS]

00:07:01   own man and i do what i want to do all [TS]

00:07:03   right which one of you decided you [TS]

00:07:05   wanted to talk about the iphone SE you [TS]

00:07:07   know it's all about it's all like me to [TS]

00:07:08   add follow-up to the show yeah it was a [TS]

00:07:11   big as a lot of people sent us this [TS]

00:07:13   follow-up it last week we talked about [TS]

00:07:16   the upcoming iPhone and how it might [TS]

00:07:19   look very similar to the 6 and 6s and if [TS]

00:07:21   that was a big deal and one of the [TS]

00:07:24   ending points was like this is their [TS]

00:07:25   third shot at the same form factor and [TS]

00:07:27   if they do a really good job like the [TS]

00:07:28   second second iteration phones usually [TS]

00:07:30   are really good and the third one could [TS]

00:07:31   be even better and we talked about all [TS]

00:07:33   the reasons that might be and a lot of [TS]

00:07:35   people said hey the iphone SE is [TS]

00:07:36   basically the third shot at the same for [TS]

00:07:38   rfactor albeit separated in time by you [TS]

00:07:40   know by quite a few other models in [TS]

00:07:42   between but it really is the third shot [TS]

00:07:45   at five style form factor i don't think [TS]

00:07:47   the SE change that much about the case [TS]

00:07:51   like it's not like the second successive [TS]

00:07:52   being like les bendiga and less slippery [TS]

00:07:54   good to you know trying to do minut [TS]

00:07:57   changes you might not even notice but [TS]

00:07:58   it's still improving on the six does the [TS]

00:08:01   SEC improve on the 5s case in any way [TS]

00:08:04   other than possibly being cheaper to [TS]

00:08:06   manufacture because they didn't have the [TS]

00:08:08   shiny chamfered edge around it [TS]

00:08:11   gosh yeah I don't remember but i think [TS]

00:08:14   there's nothing i can think of and I [TS]

00:08:15   guess different colors but anyway [TS]

00:08:16   everyone loves a phone i see i don't [TS]

00:08:18   know if it's because the third shot of [TS]

00:08:19   the same form factor but it is a [TS]

00:08:21   precedent for doing doing a phone that [TS]

00:08:24   they had two models experience with and [TS]

00:08:25   doing it again and they can do it even [TS]

00:08:28   better [TS]

00:08:28   alright and yet another instance of [TS]

00:08:32   lowercase M act 0 capital OS mac OS as [TS]

00:08:37   husbands [TS]

00:08:37   yeah that's exactly how you pronounce it [TS]

00:08:39   lowercase M back in echo s yeah that's [TS]

00:08:42   how you pronounce it had been seen in [TS]

00:08:45   the wild but apparently has been [TS]

00:08:48   killed and brought back to the farm well [TS]

00:08:51   i think i've seen it before it with a [TS]

00:08:53   capital m and some like apple thing it [TS]

00:08:56   just looks like they forgot the space or [TS]

00:08:58   another thing makes sense that anyway [TS]

00:09:00   they hadn't seen before an apple stuff [TS]

00:09:01   with the capital and I think quickly [TS]

00:09:03   removed as we're recording this right [TS]

00:09:05   now or you can click on the URL that [TS]

00:09:07   were pasted into the chatroom you would [TS]

00:09:09   see an official apple page that lists [TS]

00:09:11   will not [TS]

00:09:12   it's already been changed already [TS]

00:09:14   checked it that you like five minutes [TS]

00:09:16   before the show started [TS]

00:09:17   well is is there a spy in our document [TS]

00:09:19   you know it was this is a 9to5 mac it [TS]

00:09:23   was tweeted all over the place is not a [TS]

00:09:24   secret URL that we just figured out like [TS]

00:09:26   I guess yeah they're on top i was i [TS]

00:09:28   purposely check just before we [TS]

00:09:29   reconnected the sky to call I wonder [TS]

00:09:31   think change it like nope still there [TS]

00:09:32   and I copied and pasted it right that [TS]

00:09:34   document into the notes mere moments ago [TS]

00:09:36   but apparently the little elves are [TS]

00:09:38   really fast anyway that's probably a [TS]

00:09:40   fairly telling slip up because when you [TS]

00:09:45   have the list of us all in order like [TS]

00:09:46   that you know iOS Mac OS TV us and watch [TS]

00:09:49   us they all look like the same when you [TS]

00:09:51   write them like that and I know if it [TS]

00:09:53   turns out they don't rename it like this [TS]

00:09:55   this will be a weird series of slip-ups [TS]

00:09:57   yeah i think at this point it's over [TS]

00:09:59   that's that's the name period if you [TS]

00:10:02   don't like it [TS]

00:10:03   sorry I really hear the name macbook [TS]

00:10:05   when like the very first macbook and [TS]

00:10:07   macbook pro I really hated the name [TS]

00:10:08   macbook at the powerbook was such a [TS]

00:10:10   better name so it still is a better name [TS]

00:10:12   and macbook still has a terrible man [TS]

00:10:13   it's still I agree but I got used to it [TS]

00:10:15   and now I don't care you know so that's [TS]

00:10:17   something that if you if you hate [TS]

00:10:19   lowercase mac OS okay you know it's [TS]

00:10:21   gonna suck for a little while and then [TS]

00:10:23   you're gonna move on and life will go on [TS]

00:10:25   our first sponsor tonight is hover go to [TS]

00:10:29   hover com and use promo code this week [TS]

00:10:32   k 56 flex at checkout to save ten [TS]

00:10:35   percent off your first purchase but x2 [TS]

00:10:37   was better [TS]

00:10:38   it was like a few successes of my coupon [TS]

00:10:40   code so hover is really go to buy domain [TS]

00:10:43   names and this is a great place to go I [TS]

00:10:46   use it a lot of people have no use it it [TS]

00:10:48   is so great when you want to make a name [TS]

00:10:50   for project go to hover they make it [TS]

00:10:52   easy to search for it and make it easy [TS]

00:10:54   to buy everything is very fairly priced [TS]

00:10:56   you get a whole bunch of stuff included [TS]

00:10:57   at no additional cost such as who is [TS]

00:10:59   privacy very important [TS]

00:11:00   and they support all the domain [TS]

00:11:02   extensions out there they have you know [TS]

00:11:03   all the crazy ones like dot design dot p [TS]

00:11:06   2 dot horse all these crazy ones plus [TS]

00:11:08   all the nice new all the nice old ones [TS]

00:11:10   like calm and dotnet and if you need a [TS]

00:11:12   hand hovers awesome support team is [TS]

00:11:14   there to help you can give them a call [TS]

00:11:16   if you want you can email them of course [TS]

00:11:17   you can also call them on the phone and [TS]

00:11:19   an actual person will pick up the phone [TS]

00:11:21   answer whatever questions you have no [TS]

00:11:23   annoying phone trees no transfers no on [TS]

00:11:25   hold no weights [TS]

00:11:26   it's amazing check it out today hover [TS]

00:11:29   dot-com and use the promo code [TS]

00:11:31   k 56 flex at checkout to save ten [TS]

00:11:34   percent off your first purchase thanks [TS]

00:11:35   to her for sponsoring our show so i'm [TS]

00:11:40   happy to report that Apple apparently [TS]

00:11:44   knew that I had not spent the time to [TS]

00:11:47   figure out my WWDC predictions yet and [TS]

00:11:50   has decided to drop some very [TS]

00:11:52   interesting news and thus me take away [TS]

00:11:55   most of the time that we're gonna be [TS]

00:11:57   able to talk about Doug predictions and [TS]

00:11:59   instead well we'll just have to talk [TS]

00:12:02   about some app store changes so thank [TS]

00:12:04   you people at Apple for timing it [TS]

00:12:05   appropriately because I haven't thought [TS]

00:12:07   about my depth of predictions yet and [TS]

00:12:08   you can hear me fumble about it in [TS]

00:12:10   probably about an hour and a half but [TS]

00:12:12   then Marco had to go and ruin it by [TS]

00:12:13   having an entire podcast about this [TS]

00:12:15   earlier today so he's all got all these [TS]

00:12:17   thoughts out of a system already about [TS]

00:12:19   this [TS]

00:12:19   oh yeah cuz all my thoughts on this [TS]

00:12:20   totally fit in 30 minutes well it's your [TS]

00:12:22   own fault for having a short while I [TS]

00:12:25   save minutes 31 through 90 for you guys [TS]

00:12:28   haha alright so what we're talking about [TS]

00:12:31   is that phil schiller went to I think [TS]

00:12:34   was the verge that broke the news is [TS]

00:12:35   that correct it was a whole bunch of [TS]

00:12:37   sites actually I saw it on a loop first [TS]

00:12:39   actually yeah wewe my twitter feed which [TS]

00:12:41   is now the substitute RSS the loop is [TS]

00:12:42   the first one that tweeted about it and [TS]

00:12:44   i think i saw the verge next or maybe [TS]

00:12:46   group after that [TS]

00:12:47   yeah loop verge Gruber Telegraph had 1i [TS]

00:12:51   think that was it that was all the ones [TS]

00:12:52   I saw although be it's actually like who [TS]

00:12:55   who got this story and who didn't I [TS]

00:12:57   don't know how they made those decisions [TS]

00:12:58   but you could probably read something [TS]

00:13:00   into the favorability of the various [TS]

00:13:02   outlets based on who got this [TS]

00:13:04   yeah it was so basically the story is [TS]

00:13:06   that there are some substantial changes [TS]

00:13:09   to the appstore that are happening now [TS]

00:13:11   so the first one I think is it gimme [TS]

00:13:13   that [TS]

00:13:14   first one is these really suspiciously [TS]

00:13:17   fast a preview times that we've seen the [TS]

00:13:19   last few weeks [TS]

00:13:20   this is not just a fluke it is not an [TS]

00:13:22   accident and it is apparently not [TS]

00:13:23   temporary [TS]

00:13:24   Apple has officially acknowledged that [TS]

00:13:26   these things are real that yes indeed a [TS]

00:13:28   preview is much faster they they have [TS]

00:13:31   made some changes to allow it to be [TS]

00:13:34   faster and to probably stay faster and [TS]

00:13:36   that is really good because before it [TS]

00:13:37   was like well this could be an accident [TS]

00:13:39   that you know it just happens to be [TS]

00:13:40   really fast but it will you know if they [TS]

00:13:42   don't mention it ever then i could [TS]

00:13:44   probably go back at any time but now [TS]

00:13:45   that they've mentioned it in public [TS]

00:13:47   they've they've like brag about how good [TS]

00:13:49   this is it is way more likely i think to [TS]

00:13:51   to stay this way or order for this to be [TS]

00:13:54   the new target standard rather than just [TS]

00:13:57   a fluke i wonder if i'll get a WMD slot [TS]

00:13:59   now maybe like they've and by the way [TS]

00:14:01   before we even continue with these [TS]

00:14:02   things that the very fact that all [TS]

00:14:04   everything we're going to talk about [TS]

00:14:05   these apps are changes is being [TS]

00:14:07   announced now like days before WWDC but [TS]

00:14:11   presumably you know not saving it for WC [TS]

00:14:13   of this lot of speculation why that [TS]

00:14:16   maybe the course the party line is we [TS]

00:14:17   have so much good stuff to tell you [TS]

00:14:18   about WWE just just wouldn't fit so here [TS]

00:14:21   a couple days early here is this news [TS]

00:14:22   and the more pessimistic take is there's [TS]

00:14:25   enough in this announcement to cause [TS]

00:14:28   discussion consternation and worry among [TS]

00:14:31   developers in addition to like [TS]

00:14:32   excitement or whatever that if this was [TS]

00:14:35   in the keynote this is all people will [TS]

00:14:36   be talking about afterwards and Apple [TS]

00:14:37   wants people to come out of the [TS]

00:14:39   community not not talking about App [TS]

00:14:42   Store pricing but instead talking about [TS]

00:14:43   insert thing that they're going to [TS]

00:14:45   announce yeah I mean it's AII think [TS]

00:14:48   there's a few different takes on this [TS]

00:14:50   that are plausible certainly a [TS]

00:14:52   pessimistic take of like well developers [TS]

00:14:54   are gonna hate these changes i don't [TS]

00:14:56   think that was it honestly because i [TS]

00:14:58   think most of these changes are good but [TS]

00:15:00   not hate them but that they will be [TS]

00:15:01   talking about them they'll be a [TS]

00:15:03   top-of-mind for developers is not you [TS]

00:15:05   know it goes towards RWC being yet to [TS]

00:15:08   developers conference monies key notice [TS]

00:15:09   for the public and they didn't want they [TS]

00:15:12   want developer oriented news dominating [TS]

00:15:15   their let's talk to the public one time [TS]

00:15:17   a year that's not a special event thing [TS]

00:15:19   well that's the thing too I think we [TS]

00:15:22   have to realize like yeah there are 5000 [TS]

00:15:24   developers who watched that keynote in [TS]

00:15:26   that room [TS]

00:15:27   and there's another you know another [TS]

00:15:29   handful of thousands of developers [TS]

00:15:31   impact knows who probably probably [TS]

00:15:33   another like 10 to 15,000 developers who [TS]

00:15:36   are watching a keynote livestream to [TS]

00:15:38   various places and there's also like [TS]

00:15:41   thousands and thousands thousands of [TS]

00:15:43   people who just walked the keynote is [TS]

00:15:44   their apple fans are their apple [TS]

00:15:46   customers or their press or whatever and [TS]

00:15:48   and then whatever is announced in the [TS]

00:15:50   keynote gets reported on mainstream news [TS]

00:15:52   gets reported all over the web is [TS]

00:15:54   reported on TV on like CNN and stuff [TS]

00:15:56   this is a mass media event that happens [TS]

00:15:59   to be the beating of of a developer [TS]

00:16:01   conference so the focus of whatever is [TS]

00:16:04   in that main keynote is going to be more [TS]

00:16:06   mainstream then just talking to [TS]

00:16:09   developers you know like that thats why [TS]

00:16:12   i like you know there it was also kind [TS]

00:16:13   of surprising that Swift was controlling [TS]

00:16:15   the key because it was so like technical [TS]

00:16:18   you know even though is barely unveiled [TS]

00:16:19   but it was but you know generally you [TS]

00:16:21   know you don't see like source code on [TS]

00:16:23   you know in the in the key in the main [TS]

00:16:25   keynote you you don't hear about a lot [TS]

00:16:27   of low level changes here but some maybe [TS]

00:16:29   we'll be like one of those like word [TS]

00:16:32   cloud slides there's like a whole bunch [TS]

00:16:34   of little words on a slide and everyone [TS]

00:16:36   like rush take a picture of it can wait [TS]

00:16:37   there's a whole bunch of stuff buried in [TS]

00:16:38   there and they just kind of move on and [TS]

00:16:40   tell you more detail later like after [TS]

00:16:41   the public has gone away and tell you in [TS]

00:16:43   the session so you know that that [TS]

00:16:46   keynote is a is mostly a consumer event [TS]

00:16:50   is barely a developer keynote and so it [TS]

00:16:53   could be that this stuff is really [TS]

00:16:55   mostly only relevant to developers and [TS]

00:16:57   so they and the stuff that they had that [TS]

00:16:59   they are leaving in the keynote is just [TS]

00:17:02   more than this is Apple summer [TS]

00:17:03   announcements and getting people ready [TS]

00:17:05   for the big stuff that's happening in [TS]

00:17:07   the fall so you know that they're just [TS]

00:17:09   like how last year they spent so much [TS]

00:17:12   time on Apple music and developers could [TS]

00:17:14   do nothing with that and that turns out [TS]

00:17:17   neither could the public haha great but [TS]

00:17:20   like it was like that this is mostly a [TS]

00:17:22   consumer advantages and so you know [TS]

00:17:24   having some developer stuff that's [TS]

00:17:26   that's of you know possibly large [TS]

00:17:28   importance happen outside that main [TS]

00:17:30   keynote is totally understandable [TS]

00:17:32   absolutely the appstore of your times [TS]

00:17:34   may or may not going to slide if they [TS]

00:17:36   did I mean you can do it the one brief [TS]

00:17:37   slide as we talked about earlier in the [TS]

00:17:39   week review times are down isn't felt [TS]

00:17:41   really great everybody loves it and the [TS]

00:17:43   answer to the question of we discuss a [TS]

00:17:44   couple weeks ago if things are actually [TS]

00:17:47   faster how might they do this we did [TS]

00:17:49   talk about many possibilities that they [TS]

00:17:51   could change the rules that govern how [TS]

00:17:53   they do things that they can have better [TS]

00:17:54   automated tools and there are some [TS]

00:17:56   rumors of management changes i think [TS]

00:17:58   there was a couple stories about that on [TS]

00:18:00   the web [TS]

00:18:00   earlier the answer from phil schiller [TS]

00:18:02   when he did his media tour was basically [TS]

00:18:05   everything we said contributed to the [TS]

00:18:07   thing that's all its everything to [TS]

00:18:09   improvement on the Apple staffing [TS]

00:18:10   changes in policy changes i think what [TS]

00:18:12   group are listed so there is no one [TS]

00:18:14   thing that is making this faster it's a [TS]

00:18:16   series of changes but some up to the the [TS]

00:18:19   status of their touting now which is [TS]

00:18:20   fifty percent of apps are reviewed [TS]

00:18:22   within 24 hours and ninety percent [TS]

00:18:23   within 48 hours [TS]

00:18:25   yeah this is this is awesome it's just [TS]

00:18:27   so so awesome [TS]

00:18:29   yeah I've been stunned by this and I [TS]

00:18:33   think it's a good thing that the two [TS]

00:18:35   improvements and just trusting their [TS]

00:18:38   tools to suss out any like private api [TS]

00:18:41   violations and crashes potentially [TS]

00:18:43   things like that i mean trusting your [TS]

00:18:44   tools that's a good thing I mean this is [TS]

00:18:46   why i write unit tests mm-hmm that makes [TS]

00:18:50   one of the other no i mean like it to me [TS]

00:18:52   like this is it this kind of just shows [TS]

00:18:54   the potential of you know before Phil [TS]

00:18:57   took over the app store [TS]

00:18:59   I don't wanna you know throw anybody [TS]

00:19:01   under the bus or anything but it sure [TS]

00:19:04   seemed like it was not progressing at [TS]

00:19:07   all and that basically nobody was [TS]

00:19:09   working on progressing it and filter / [TS]

00:19:13   not that long ago and a lot of stuff is [TS]

00:19:16   changing and a lot of progress is being [TS]

00:19:18   made for the better so I'm kind of [TS]

00:19:21   excited like if all this change in such [TS]

00:19:24   a short time while there's been kind of [TS]

00:19:27   you know finally somebody literally [TS]

00:19:29   running the store what else is gonna [TS]

00:19:32   change you know if this is a a and even [TS]

00:19:34   you know in the big picture even if some [TS]

00:19:37   of these things don't work out or don't [TS]

00:19:39   do you know it don't do as well as they [TS]

00:19:40   wanted or whatever or you know make [TS]

00:19:42   things harder for in certain ways or an [TS]

00:19:43   easier in other ways whatever happens [TS]

00:19:45   with these changes there that they're [TS]

00:19:46   doing they're making changes [TS]

00:19:49   that's amazing because for like eight [TS]

00:19:51   years they changed almost nothing [TS]

00:19:52   so this is this is real progress and [TS]

00:19:55   this is a a rapid and dramatic change [TS]

00:20:00   almost all if not all for the better you [TS]

00:20:03   know the the again the pessimistic take [TS]

00:20:06   is this was management change like [TS]

00:20:08   Phil's just taken over control of your [TS]

00:20:11   previously didn't have control over and [TS]

00:20:12   when you switch in your manager on to a [TS]

00:20:14   new project and it's important and they [TS]

00:20:15   want to make a good showing they want to [TS]

00:20:17   come out of the gate and say okay you [TS]

00:20:19   put me in charge of this and in short [TS]

00:20:20   order i did these things that made it [TS]

00:20:22   better isn't that great [TS]

00:20:23   that's a pressing need within a typical [TS]

00:20:27   you know bozo corporation which we [TS]

00:20:29   assume Apple isn't but anyway that's one [TS]

00:20:31   person taking the other one is we were [TS]

00:20:33   all excited when they finally turned [TS]

00:20:35   their attention to the mac pro that when [TS]

00:20:36   they collected for a long time and came [TS]

00:20:37   up with this amazing radical new [TS]

00:20:38   computer that shows they really do care [TS]

00:20:40   about the macro pro and surely this [TS]

00:20:42   means that the mac pro is off to a new [TS]

00:20:43   brighter healthier future involving lots [TS]

00:20:47   of updates and lots of future changes [TS]

00:20:48   not that I'm predicting this for the app [TS]

00:20:50   store but if you want to be pessimistic [TS]

00:20:51   about it and and you know it is possible [TS]

00:20:55   that there's enough is enough [TS]

00:20:56   the reasons why this might be a bunch of [TS]

00:20:59   big dramatic changes that have been a [TS]

00:21:00   long time coming sort of like pent-up [TS]

00:21:01   demand and they'll let this stew for a [TS]

00:21:03   year not because they don't care anymore [TS]

00:21:05   but even just like like the idea that [TS]

00:21:07   they're going to be court sort of let's [TS]

00:21:10   try a bunch of things and fail faster [TS]

00:21:11   whatever like I think their appetite for [TS]

00:21:12   turn in the app store rules has [TS]

00:21:14   obviously increased but I don't think [TS]

00:21:16   it's that great so I would expect this [TS]

00:21:18   set of rules to possibly be tweaked and [TS]

00:21:20   sussed out over the next year and then [TS]

00:21:21   maybe you know I think we'd all be happy [TS]

00:21:24   if every year they revisited the rules [TS]

00:21:25   of the store and so how they did for a [TS]

00:21:27   year because you can't really change it [TS]

00:21:28   every week what you can change in [TS]

00:21:30   response to you don't have enough data [TS]

00:21:31   to know whether it's a good idea or bad [TS]

00:21:32   idea so unlike perhaps the operating [TS]

00:21:35   systems a yearly pretty regularly [TS]

00:21:37   scheduled update to appstore rules is a [TS]

00:21:40   reasonable idea if you tried to update [TS]

00:21:41   the rules radically more often than that [TS]

00:21:43   I think it would be too much turn for [TS]

00:21:45   developers [TS]

00:21:46   I mean even if they change the change me [TS]

00:21:48   with the store every two years just like [TS]

00:21:50   more than once every eight years [TS]

00:21:52   yes that would still be like radically [TS]

00:21:53   more progressive than the way it's been [TS]

00:21:56   all this time [TS]

00:21:57   yeah that bundles right sort of the [TS]

00:22:02   other good thing by the way about all [TS]

00:22:03   these changes are going to go through is [TS]

00:22:04   they all apply to all stores [TS]

00:22:06   including the mac app store the TV a TV [TS]

00:22:08   OS store [TS]

00:22:10   yeah alright so that's a that's faster [TS]

00:22:12   few times good good for Phil the next [TS]

00:22:14   thing is subscription pricing available [TS]

00:22:16   for all app types which is by far the [TS]

00:22:19   most interesting and most fraught with [TS]

00:22:22   doubt announcement across were only like [TS]

00:22:25   you know one day into this announcement [TS]

00:22:27   but the the gist of it is that hot in it [TS]

00:22:31   previously if you want to sell an app on [TS]

00:22:33   the App Store the descriptions that had [TS]

00:22:35   to be a subscription to some kind of [TS]

00:22:36   media thing like television or like a [TS]

00:22:38   new service or audio or whatever and now [TS]

00:22:41   subscription pricing is open to all [TS]

00:22:43   kinds of apps and so a quick naive [TS]

00:22:47   reading of that could be like great then [TS]

00:22:49   basically no more restrictions [TS]

00:22:50   previously I had to follow the special [TS]

00:22:52   rules to be super map now anybody can [TS]

00:22:54   just say i want to have to use [TS]

00:22:55   encryption app and then you start [TS]

00:22:56   reading the rules and you like is that [TS]

00:22:58   what they're saying that any app can be [TS]

00:23:00   a significant apples you just say that [TS]

00:23:02   any app can potentially be a [TS]

00:23:04   subscription happened that is the [TS]

00:23:05   current source of data generated one day [TS]

00:23:08   and I'm sure Apple clarify sure things [TS]

00:23:09   will get worked out but right now [TS]

00:23:12   there's still some doubt about it so [TS]

00:23:13   it's hard to know entirely how to feel [TS]

00:23:16   about this because all the debates about [TS]

00:23:18   does this enable sustainable development [TS]

00:23:20   is this you know all the things the mark [TS]

00:23:22   I'm sure talked about on his a developer [TS]

00:23:24   podcast whose name I can never remember [TS]

00:23:25   earlier today it we don't know if this [TS]

00:23:30   is going like should we indulge in in [TS]

00:23:33   speculation about how this model might [TS]

00:23:35   work particular particular kinds of apps [TS]

00:23:37   before we even know whether Apple will [TS]

00:23:39   allow it [TS]

00:23:40   yes mom we should indulge in that yes [TS]

00:23:42   we're yeah because I mean look at so if [TS]

00:23:47   you did you just look at this as like [TS]

00:23:49   the most conservative reading of the [TS]

00:23:51   rules that they put on that page then [TS]

00:23:54   it's basically no change from what we [TS]

00:23:56   already had that policy was I mean there [TS]

00:23:59   are some technical changes but [TS]

00:24:00   policy-wise it would say you don't have [TS]

00:24:02   to be a media [TS]

00:24:02   yeah but you already didn't have to be a [TS]

00:24:04   media app like it's papers has a kind of [TS]

00:24:06   description now everyone has had it [TS]

00:24:07   forever [TS]

00:24:08   instapaper counts as a news thing [TS]

00:24:10   Evernote no it doesn't cause it's not [TS]

00:24:12   sure when it believe me i look at this [TS]

00:24:14   back when the woods when these first [TS]

00:24:16   launched in the in the days of newsstand [TS]

00:24:18   when newsstand launch [TS]

00:24:19   nothing 2011 or something like that it [TS]

00:24:21   was only newsstand apps and then shortly [TS]

00:24:24   afterwards I think maybe like a year [TS]

00:24:26   afterwards it became available to any [TS]

00:24:29   app that was delivering periodic content [TS]

00:24:31   of some kind but it could have to be [TS]

00:24:34   like like issues or episodes and had to [TS]

00:24:36   be like you know they couldn't be for [TS]

00:24:37   like I guess it couldn't be that we [TS]

00:24:39   don't know but like if you're delivering [TS]

00:24:40   video because HBO going everything has a [TS]

00:24:42   lot of stuff outside it could have been [TS]

00:24:44   but it had to be like episodic content [TS]

00:24:46   that you know it couldn't just be like [TS]

00:24:48   you just have access to this thing [TS]

00:24:49   forever but it could be like you have [TS]

00:24:51   access to this new thing every week or [TS]

00:24:53   month or whatever and then that then [TS]

00:24:54   quickly got like semi relaxed into kind [TS]

00:24:59   of the where it stayed between then and [TS]

00:25:01   now which is you could kind of do it for [TS]

00:25:05   any kind of recurring service but it was [TS]

00:25:07   it was risky weather app would approve [TS]

00:25:09   you or not because the definitions [TS]

00:25:11   around it were fairly vague as to what [TS]

00:25:13   would qualify but it was clear that you [TS]

00:25:16   have to have some kind of recurring [TS]

00:25:18   service like some kind of you know [TS]

00:25:21   backing web service that had like you [TS]

00:25:22   know cloud storage or content available [TS]

00:25:27   on the service or something it was it [TS]

00:25:29   was it like most apps would not qualify [TS]

00:25:31   for that but all that language is still [TS]

00:25:34   there though everything you just said [TS]

00:25:35   that that's the problem so I I know like [TS]

00:25:38   any like Branson Missouri compose [TS]

00:25:40   basically asking clarification on this [TS]

00:25:42   and because like if you read Phil's [TS]

00:25:44   comments in these interviews [TS]

00:25:46   it sounds like now any app can do this [TS]

00:25:48   no matter what but if you look at that [TS]

00:25:50   page it looks like that's not the case [TS]

00:25:52   looks like it's still the old rules of [TS]

00:25:54   it and it depends a lot like the [TS]

00:25:56   interpretations of some words on the [TS]

00:25:58   page like it has like all apps are [TS]

00:26:00   eligible to use this but it's only up [TS]

00:26:04   but it's appropriate for this is for [TS]

00:26:06   these types of roles so does that mean [TS]

00:26:08   they would approve it for inappropriate [TS]

00:26:10   uses it you know it it depends on how [TS]

00:26:12   things are but you know I think what's [TS]

00:26:14   going to happen is like most times when [TS]

00:26:16   a new app review policy gets put into [TS]

00:26:19   place and details aren't quite worked [TS]

00:26:21   out yet [TS]

00:26:21   what's almost certain to happen is [TS]

00:26:23   either in the next few days are going to [TS]

00:26:26   edit the language and that page to be [TS]

00:26:27   more clear and to like firmly fall on [TS]

00:26:30   one side or the other or [TS]

00:26:32   unfortunately more likely they're gonna [TS]

00:26:34   figure it out through rejections later [TS]

00:26:36   this fall and then we'll kind of sort of [TS]

00:26:39   policy and that that would suck i hope [TS]

00:26:40   that's how they do it but you know I [TS]

00:26:42   because phil is like the guy on top of a [TS]

00:26:46   preview you know one in the grand scheme [TS]

00:26:48   of things and because his actual [TS]

00:26:51   statements really strongly say otherwise [TS]

00:26:54   than that page i'm guessing this was [TS]

00:26:56   probably like a deviated thing [TS]

00:26:58   internally until very recently and they [TS]

00:27:00   they just kinda haven't worked out like [TS]

00:27:02   the details yet but i don't know is for [TS]

00:27:04   peace from marketing they always want to [TS]

00:27:06   put on to give you the bright side of it [TS]

00:27:08   that's what this whole role is let me [TS]

00:27:09   tell you what's great about this so even [TS]

00:27:11   if it was exactly as you said where [TS]

00:27:13   maybe they'll reject it maybe they won't [TS]

00:27:15   he's not gonna come and tell you that is [TS]

00:27:17   gonna come and tell you it's open to [TS]

00:27:18   everybody and then sort of allow the [TS]

00:27:20   chips fall away and I think they did [TS]

00:27:22   update the copy on this page because a [TS]

00:27:24   lot of the language is about all you [TS]

00:27:25   have to have like a you know content or [TS]

00:27:27   services or you know issues or whatever [TS]

00:27:30   but then certain sense is explicitly [TS]

00:27:32   called exactly what we're talking about [TS]

00:27:34   like this is no like many freemium apps [TS]

00:27:36   successful auto-renewal subscription [TS]

00:27:37   apps operated services that are [TS]

00:27:38   continuously supported and often require [TS]

00:27:40   sustained content development that would [TS]

00:27:42   be like you get a new you know a new [TS]

00:27:44   level every week or something for a game [TS]

00:27:45   or feature enhancements to retain users [TS]

00:27:49   feature enhancements is exactly what [TS]

00:27:51   we're talking about we're saying hey I [TS]

00:27:52   want to add a new feature to my app that [TS]

00:27:54   you use to take notes with there is no [TS]

00:27:56   service there's not even a sink service [TS]

00:27:58   let's say there is no that's just an [TS]

00:27:59   application that runs on your phone [TS]

00:28:01   I just want to add feature enhancements [TS]

00:28:03   can I charge you a subscription for that [TS]

00:28:05   it's right there in the language but [TS]

00:28:06   that every other thing on the page it [TS]

00:28:08   just leads you back into the hall but of [TS]

00:28:10   course you have to be providing a [TS]

00:28:11   service or you know periodic content or [TS]

00:28:14   whatever so it's I don't think feature [TS]

00:28:16   enhancements was there before I like [TS]

00:28:17   that it does not real to those pages of [TS]

00:28:18   things are on the pages right yeah but I [TS]

00:28:21   don't think that language so someone put [TS]

00:28:22   that those words there but then didn't [TS]

00:28:24   get on didn't like it's like the rest of [TS]

00:28:26   the page doesn't agree with its your [TS]

00:28:27   right kind of looks like it might be [TS]

00:28:28   conflicted but again the pessimistic [TS]

00:28:31   take and pessimistic not because we're [TS]

00:28:33   just mean people but founded on past [TS]

00:28:35   history like the past has been very much [TS]

00:28:37   like the rules are kind of vague it will [TS]

00:28:40   will nail it down through a series of [TS]

00:28:42   heartbreaking rejections to a bunch of [TS]

00:28:43   small developers [TS]

00:28:44   and then when you see their bodies fall [TS]

00:28:46   below you like oh don't do that what [TS]

00:28:48   that guy did [TS]

00:28:49   don't do that that's a waste of time [TS]

00:28:50   they can put those guys wait six months [TS]

00:28:51   in their app can get on the store right [TS]

00:28:52   you know you know it's gonna be James [TS]

00:28:54   Thompson again he gets he gets like the [TS]

00:28:56   worst luck with a preview get sick you [TS]

00:28:58   know it's gonna be like james thompson [TS]

00:29:00   come to have a calculator app and you [TS]

00:29:02   have a subscription and each month you [TS]

00:29:04   get a new number [TS]

00:29:05   so once you have all the digits 10 plus [TS]

00:29:09   two operators so he's like the stop [TS]

00:29:12   making sense of calculator apps i see [TS]

00:29:14   you notice [TS]

00:29:15   yeah yeah yeah I I i think that if I [TS]

00:29:19   were apple i would do pretty much [TS]

00:29:23   exactly what they did which is i would [TS]

00:29:25   write the the verbiage verbiage however [TS]

00:29:27   you pronounce the word for biaggi I [TS]

00:29:29   never be right I would write the text [TS]

00:29:31   such that it leaves plenty of room for [TS]

00:29:35   Apple to put the kibosh on anything that [TS]

00:29:38   they don't think is appropriate but that [TS]

00:29:43   doesn't mean they'll actually wield that [TS]

00:29:45   hammer it just means the Hammers [TS]

00:29:47   available to them if they so desire [TS]

00:29:48   would you do that because you because [TS]

00:29:50   your apple and you're trying to act like [TS]

00:29:52   a big jerk because that's what that's [TS]

00:29:53   like let's write it real vague to [TS]

00:29:55   believe everyone and out so we retain [TS]

00:29:57   all the power and can make arbitrary [TS]

00:29:58   decisions features know Apple decide [TS]

00:30:00   what you want now and if you can't [TS]

00:30:02   decide even to be honest about that this [TS]

00:30:04   is the worst like if you get like [TS]

00:30:07   seriously it's their job to come up with [TS]

00:30:09   a policy do you want people to be able [TS]

00:30:11   to charge money for an app that just [TS]

00:30:12   adds new features every year and has no [TS]

00:30:13   backend services decide that before you [TS]

00:30:15   write the policy don't ride in biggest [TS]

00:30:17   well how are they going to whatever [TS]

00:30:19   mechanism they're going to use to make [TS]

00:30:21   that decision later when they decided to [TS]

00:30:22   reject someone zap do that now is a [TS]

00:30:24   thought experiment don't wait until it [TS]

00:30:26   comes it's so asinine to not i mean if [TS]

00:30:28   they're in a hurry and they have to put [TS]

00:30:29   the sound they have decided fine but I'm [TS]

00:30:30   saying like that is a general policy to [TS]

00:30:32   like retain reserve the right to like be [TS]

00:30:35   vague and just let people send things in [TS]

00:30:37   and then decide then don't wait for that [TS]

00:30:39   to happen with relapse the run a thought [TS]

00:30:40   experiment and decide now they should be [TS]

00:30:42   able to decide i think very clearly is [TS]

00:30:45   this a valid thing to do for just plain [TS]

00:30:46   old apps that ad features that have no [TS]

00:30:48   back-end service and no peer at content [TS]

00:30:50   yes or no pick something now write it [TS]

00:30:52   down clearly i I'm not even a developer [TS]

00:30:55   but i'm super angered by [TS]

00:30:56   inability to communicate clearly on this [TS]

00:30:58   topic and if it's just an error in the [TS]

00:31:00   text into fixing three days then find [TS]

00:31:02   you no good on Apple you know i should [TS]

00:31:04   give them break it's only been a day but [TS]

00:31:06   I don't buy that whole this is what i [TS]

00:31:09   would do too because it remains maximum [TS]

00:31:10   power for me like that's gross right and [TS]

00:31:13   and the big thing is like this you know [TS]

00:31:16   in addition to you know hurting all the [TS]

00:31:18   biggest developers to her and try this [TS]

00:31:20   and hurting you know new stuff what this [TS]

00:31:22   is really going to hurt if they can [TS]

00:31:23   clarify this or if they don't clarify [TS]

00:31:25   this or if it stays in in the more [TS]

00:31:27   restrictive interpretation of these [TS]

00:31:28   things which is only apps with services [TS]

00:31:30   and content stuff then with this won't [TS]

00:31:32   apply to things like a pro content [TS]

00:31:35   editing or pro content creation apps and [TS]

00:31:37   that seems like a perfect candidate for [TS]

00:31:40   subscription pricing in the app store [TS]

00:31:41   something like you know if you're gonna [TS]

00:31:42   have like a pro image editor or pro [TS]

00:31:44   audio editor or you know the content [TS]

00:31:47   creating a drawing pro drawing apps like [TS]

00:31:48   pro apps usually don't have backing web [TS]

00:31:52   services usually don't have like a [TS]

00:31:54   magazine built into them like what would [TS]

00:31:56   you can have a backing drm service like [TS]

00:31:58   i was saying before shot don't have a [TS]

00:32:00   back in service but it does just for DRM [TS]

00:32:02   but I guess you don't know what has all [TS]

00:32:03   this be hansberry's nobody wants you [TS]

00:32:05   know it pro apps are a perfect use for [TS]

00:32:08   first subscription pricing on an iOS [TS]

00:32:10   because it kind of solves free trials it [TS]

00:32:14   completely in my opinion solves upgrades [TS]

00:32:16   if you can get people to pay and the [TS]

00:32:18   people who are most likely to pay our [TS]

00:32:20   people who use pro apps to get advanced [TS]

00:32:23   functionality on things like their ipad [TS]

00:32:25   pro is that they're like desperate for [TS]

00:32:26   amazing software on it seems like this [TS]

00:32:29   is the most clear need a first edition [TS]

00:32:31   pricing is like you know a video apps on [TS]

00:32:35   the appletv be pro stuff on the ipad and [TS]

00:32:38   if they don't clarify this rule I don't [TS]

00:32:41   know it would be royally stupid for any [TS]

00:32:43   pro app developers to start developing [TS]

00:32:46   their pro a porter pro app over to the [TS]

00:32:49   ipad or the iphone is you know suppose [TS]

00:32:51   you make like an amazing you know music [TS]

00:32:53   app for for pros or if profoto avenue [TS]

00:32:56   you bring it to ipad you won't want to [TS]

00:32:58   charge like 40 bucks a year or something [TS]

00:32:59   and then [TS]

00:33:01   oh you can't do it rejected sorry you [TS]

00:33:03   don't have a web service like that's [TS]

00:33:04   horrible and and most smart business [TS]

00:33:07   people won't even start the development [TS]

00:33:08   too [TS]

00:33:08   clarified so it seems like it this is a [TS]

00:33:11   great way to incent or incentivize [TS]

00:33:14   thanks to phil's quotes on these on [TS]

00:33:16   these websites it looks like incense is [TS]

00:33:18   actually a word I'd I thought the same [TS]

00:33:20   thing I was like wait I thought that was [TS]

00:33:21   incentivize I guess not I guess I'm [TS]

00:33:22   wrong yeah I looked it up it's in [TS]

00:33:24   Apple's dictionary on on on max so I [TS]

00:33:27   assume it's a real so I think you're [TS]

00:33:29   thinking of em a cost that's what I'm [TS]

00:33:33   thinking about his ex people going to [TS]

00:33:37   hit a solo voy [TS]

00:33:38   yes anyway but yeah I get so anyway that [TS]

00:33:40   it this is a great incentive for pro app [TS]

00:33:44   development on iOS or wood or would be [TS]

00:33:47   if they were clear about it and I'm like [TS]

00:33:48   and tributaries it's not as if this rule [TS]

00:33:52   this new rule necessarily needs to be [TS]

00:33:54   the thing that solves the problem we've [TS]

00:33:55   identified as a potential problem it [TS]

00:33:56   could be that these changes just not [TS]

00:33:58   addressing that which is fine too but if [TS]

00:34:01   they think they're addressing it for all [TS]

00:34:02   the reasons morrow said they're not [TS]

00:34:03   really because pro at the reason perhaps [TS]

00:34:06   are scared away from other you know the [TS]

00:34:09   ipad pro and to some degree these days [TS]

00:34:11   you know the mac app store some degree [TS]

00:34:13   heat [TS]

00:34:13   yeah well all apps are so you can tell [TS]

00:34:15   us just because the process but I'm it [TS]

00:34:17   that they don't think they can't be sure [TS]

00:34:19   that there is a business model that will [TS]

00:34:21   support sustained development of a pro [TS]

00:34:22   application that's and because they're [TS]

00:34:24   so expensive because they're you know [TS]

00:34:26   because the abbey barrier to entry of [TS]

00:34:29   like what does it take to make a real [TS]

00:34:30   full-featured pro application at the [TS]

00:34:32   gate that takes a lot of money initially [TS]

00:34:33   you have to have a plan going forward [TS]

00:34:35   you could try like I think it might be [TS]

00:34:37   fun to make it you know a silly free [TS]

00:34:40   play game you know or 99-cent thing like [TS]

00:34:42   you can try that and it can be a [TS]

00:34:43   throwaway thing if you have the money to [TS]

00:34:45   spare but if you're going to embark on [TS]

00:34:46   making a pro app you have to have a [TS]

00:34:48   solid go-to-market strategy where you [TS]

00:34:50   understand how it's going to be sold how [TS]

00:34:52   you're going to get money [TS]

00:34:53   how are you going to fund development [TS]

00:34:54   are you gonna make the money back that [TS]

00:34:56   you spend on it and how you're going to [TS]

00:34:57   continue to pay for it and that same [TS]

00:35:00   uncertainty still exists if these rules [TS]

00:35:03   are still fake like is that this rule [TS]

00:35:04   doesn't necessarily have to make that [TS]

00:35:06   possible but when i first heard no [TS]

00:35:08   subscription pricing opened all that's [TS]

00:35:10   the first thing I thought of was finally [TS]

00:35:11   there's a way to sustain you know [TS]

00:35:14   basically I've had pro applications [TS]

00:35:16   expensive to develop full-featured [TS]

00:35:18   applications that are important for [TS]

00:35:19   people to do their jobs [TS]

00:35:21   aren't just put on the app store and [TS]

00:35:22   then forgotten about and like you make [TS]

00:35:23   your money back and then you move on to [TS]

00:35:24   the next thing that's what this seems [TS]

00:35:26   like and again a lot of language and [TS]

00:35:28   almost everything phil has said makes [TS]

00:35:30   that clear a lot of the other language [TS]

00:35:32   makes it not clear so hopefully this [TS]

00:35:34   will be clarified you know again where [TS]

00:35:36   we are less than 24 hours after this [TS]

00:35:38   announcement so maybe we're being too [TS]

00:35:39   harsh but I just find it frustrating to [TS]

00:35:42   for the press tour to be leaning so [TS]

00:35:46   heavily on all our hopes and dreams and [TS]

00:35:48   in the actual text of all the web pages [TS]

00:35:50   to be just making everything is clear as [TS]

00:35:52   mud again you know maybe it's freaky [TS]

00:35:54   friday or i guess since it's Wednesday [TS]

00:35:56   wacky wednesday because Marco is [TS]

00:35:58   SuperDuper enthusiastic and chipper [TS]

00:36:01   about this and I'm I don't know man I [TS]

00:36:04   don't know how i feel about this and I [TS]

00:36:05   think the reason I'm having hauling a [TS]

00:36:07   little bit is because looking at this [TS]

00:36:10   from the perspective of a very cheap [TS]

00:36:12   consumer who is happy to pay for apps [TS]

00:36:14   for sure but I don't want every app that [TS]

00:36:19   is even remotely decent to think of [TS]

00:36:22   themselves as oh I certainly am a [TS]

00:36:25   professional app and I can go [TS]

00:36:27   subscription and i can charge you know [TS]

00:36:29   five or ten or fifteen or twenty bucks a [TS]

00:36:31   year because i'm worth it [TS]

00:36:32   where some apps like twee pop I freaking [TS]

00:36:34   live in Tweetbot and overcast actually I [TS]

00:36:37   spend a lot of time and overcast i would [TS]

00:36:39   pay twenty dollars a year for those apps [TS]

00:36:41   but there's a lot of apps that i worry [TS]

00:36:45   their developers will think oh we are [TS]

00:36:47   definitely a pro app we deserve a [TS]

00:36:49   subscription pricing blah blah where I [TS]

00:36:52   really don't think that's the case I [TS]

00:36:53   think it should be there a one-time fee [TS]

00:36:55   or perhaps one time in a purchase or [TS]

00:36:57   something along those lines and i don't [TS]

00:37:00   know i just i'm hopeful that this does [TS]

00:37:03   solve all of our problems like like [TS]

00:37:05   Marco seems to think that it will but I [TS]

00:37:08   really just don't want to end up paying [TS]

00:37:11   a monthly fee or yearly fee or [TS]

00:37:13   what-have-you for every damn app on my [TS]

00:37:15   home screen it'll sort itself out though [TS]

00:37:17   it'll sort of somehow in the market like [TS]

00:37:18   it's not going to developers are free to [TS]

00:37:21   try whatever they want but if it but i [TS]

00:37:23   don't think i don't think these rule [TS]

00:37:25   changes especially in the short term [TS]

00:37:26   will change what people are willing to [TS]

00:37:29   pay [TS]

00:37:30   for applications all it will do is make [TS]

00:37:33   it so that the sort of like the [TS]

00:37:35   unrealized online marketing with Pickard [TS]

00:37:37   patronage there's untapped money like [TS]

00:37:39   money that people would be willing to [TS]

00:37:41   give but have no way to give to stay in [TS]

00:37:43   the development of the apps that use [TS]

00:37:44   regularly like that's what basically [TS]

00:37:45   patron is like you care enough about [TS]

00:37:47   overcast you want to make sure that [TS]

00:37:48   overcast continues to exist you know [TS]

00:37:50   subscribe right and like you said you [TS]

00:37:52   listened to have to use all the time [TS]

00:37:53   that you would gladly subscribe for [TS]

00:37:54   without any kind of description and [TS]

00:37:56   without like a patronage thing that [TS]

00:37:59   Marcos doing [TS]

00:38:00   there's no one someone buys it for me [TS]

00:38:01   there's no way for them to give you [TS]

00:38:02   money unless market that's the thing [TS]

00:38:03   where he makes an entirely new overcast [TS]

00:38:04   to and you know all the things we've [TS]

00:38:05   talked about in the past right so this [TS]

00:38:08   releases that money from the people who [TS]

00:38:10   are willing to pay it but it doesn't [TS]

00:38:11   make everyone else suddenly willing to [TS]

00:38:13   pay way more for the software they have [TS]

00:38:14   now we could make developers be all like [TS]

00:38:17   oh I want to try this the hot new thing [TS]

00:38:18   but those developers will be sad because [TS]

00:38:20   they'll find out what is the actual [TS]

00:38:22   appetite to pay a monthly subscription [TS]

00:38:23   for apt they'll realize that many people [TS]

00:38:26   you know installed there 99 cents that [TS]

00:38:27   never looked at it again or you know or [TS]

00:38:30   or whatever like i don't i don't think [TS]

00:38:32   you have too much to worry about because [TS]

00:38:33   I really don't think this will change [TS]

00:38:34   the hearts and minds of users in the [TS]

00:38:36   short term especially and so if [TS]

00:38:38   developers change their plans they will [TS]

00:38:41   be punished by not getting a lot of [TS]

00:38:43   sales and people stop using their app [TS]

00:38:44   and move to competitors and then they'll [TS]

00:38:45   change back and we'll sort of settle [TS]

00:38:47   down again right that's the thing is [TS]

00:38:49   that i agree with you that users aren't [TS]

00:38:51   going to look at this [TS]

00:38:52   generally speaking that differently but [TS]

00:38:54   what I'm worried about is that even in a [TS]

00:38:57   run-of-the-mill developer with a good [TS]

00:39:00   but not world-class app is going to [TS]

00:39:03   think oh well darn it my apps great and [TS]

00:39:05   I think everyone is gonna pay [TS]

00:39:06   subscription for me and you're right [TS]

00:39:09   that this will kind of sauce itself out [TS]

00:39:10   over time but i really hope that [TS]

00:39:13   everyone in the app store doesn't [TS]

00:39:15   immediately run to subscription pricing [TS]

00:39:17   when really at least on my phone in my [TS]

00:39:19   ipad anyway there's a very small subset [TS]

00:39:22   of apps that I think really should [TS]

00:39:24   consider subscription pricing that I [TS]

00:39:26   think really should that should be worth [TS]

00:39:30   it and granted by handful my five apps [TS]

00:39:34   are different than your five apps are [TS]

00:39:35   different from archos five apps so maybe [TS]

00:39:37   that will sort itself out that way as [TS]

00:39:39   well but I don't know I just really hope [TS]

00:39:42   that everyone [TS]

00:39:43   and the app store doesn't immediately [TS]

00:39:45   run subscription pricing i I've heard [TS]

00:39:47   from a number of people now saying [TS]

00:39:49   basically especially the same sentiment [TS]

00:39:51   of you know III as user don't want [TS]

00:39:55   everything on my phone and all of a [TS]

00:39:57   sudden be charging me like two dollars a [TS]

00:39:58   month or whatever to some degree that's [TS]

00:40:00   reasonable to some degree jon is right [TS]

00:40:02   that the market will sort this out and [TS]

00:40:05   and also to some degree i think this is [TS]

00:40:07   an improvement over the reality that we [TS]

00:40:09   have now so right now if you consider [TS]

00:40:11   the example of say tweet by like you [TS]

00:40:14   mentioning tweet by releases a brand-new [TS]

00:40:16   version of the app and teapot is a paid [TS]

00:40:18   upfront app and then about every one [TS]

00:40:21   year too [TS]

00:40:22   yeah they they release a new version [TS]

00:40:23   that is a brand new standalone app for [TS]

00:40:26   what is a few blocks like five bucks [TS]

00:40:28   four bucks whatever so basically you're [TS]

00:40:31   already you're almost already paying [TS]

00:40:33   three or four hours a year for thuy pot [TS]

00:40:36   if you move to subscription pricing [TS]

00:40:38   there's not really much of a change [TS]

00:40:40   except it's easier and better for [TS]

00:40:43   everybody was a psychological change you [TS]

00:40:46   know they don't want to sign up for [TS]

00:40:47   another Zealander online Parliament no [TS]

00:40:49   I'll get there but so you know and then [TS]

00:40:51   the customers like you don't have to go [TS]

00:40:53   through the stupid hoops of like will [TS]

00:40:54   download the new app that true hopefully [TS]

00:40:56   transfer all your accounts over delete [TS]

00:40:58   the old apt change all your settings all [TS]

00:40:59   the stupid stuff like a you know that it [TS]

00:41:01   avoids all that all the cumbersome [TS]

00:41:02   complexity of like replacing the paid [TS]

00:41:04   app with the next paid version do the [TS]

00:41:08   developers will make more money this way [TS]

00:41:10   because of the new 8515 split that you [TS]

00:41:13   get in years two through infinity which [TS]

00:41:16   is a whole other thing that's really [TS]

00:41:17   cool and most likely related to appletv [TS]

00:41:20   negotiations but you know with look like [TS]

00:41:23   video providers and possibly amazon and [TS]

00:41:25   that but anyway the consumer side of [TS]

00:41:27   this is it everyone saying you know I [TS]

00:41:29   don't want everything on my screen all [TS]

00:41:31   of a sudden charge me you know X dollars [TS]

00:41:32   a month if you instead think about it as [TS]

00:41:35   X dollars a year which is probably going [TS]

00:41:37   to be a more common price point because [TS]

00:41:39   you don't want to ideally you don't want [TS]

00:41:41   to be like bugging people every like you [TS]

00:41:43   don't want to be reminding people every [TS]

00:41:44   month that they could cancel your [TS]

00:41:46   subscription if they want to like it [TS]

00:41:47   because every time that email comes in [TS]

00:41:49   for Apple saying follow instructions are [TS]

00:41:51   about to renew again in a few days or [TS]

00:41:53   whatever like that's that's like a [TS]

00:41:54   prompt for people to cancel your [TS]

00:41:55   subscription so [TS]

00:41:57   really want to do that if you can help [TS]

00:41:58   if you can charge a few dollars a year [TS]

00:42:01   instead of a few dollars a month that is [TS]

00:42:03   probably a better idea as long as you [TS]

00:42:05   can still make enough money that way and [TS]

00:42:07   so if you think about like you know from [TS]

00:42:09   it from like a paid app perspective like [TS]

00:42:12   if you're if you're paying five bucks or [TS]

00:42:15   four bucks for three bucks every year or [TS]

00:42:18   18 months whatever whatever look at new [TS]

00:42:21   standalone paid app version of something [TS]

00:42:22   that's upgrade upgrade that way versus [TS]

00:42:25   if you have like a four-hour year [TS]

00:42:26   subscription [TS]

00:42:27   it's not that different and it's [TS]

00:42:29   actually way easier for you [TS]

00:42:31   with description so i think this is the [TS]

00:42:33   kind of thing we're not every Apple do [TS]

00:42:35   it in fact i would guess very few actual [TS]

00:42:37   do it for the same reason very few after [TS]

00:42:39   paid upfront anymore [TS]

00:42:40   most people won't pay for most apps [TS]

00:42:42   that's not going to change most apps are [TS]

00:42:45   still going to be free with garbage [TS]

00:42:46   inside of them to fund it somehow most [TS]

00:42:48   apps are still going to be like you know [TS]

00:42:50   you don't really have to pay for really [TS]

00:42:52   anything but you could pay if you want [TS]

00:42:54   to all the big you know in a purchase [TS]

00:42:56   Premium your mind trick games are still [TS]

00:42:59   going to make all the money in the app [TS]

00:43:00   store all those like all the market [TS]

00:43:03   forces around this aren't really going [TS]

00:43:04   to change that much as far as far as I [TS]

00:43:06   as far as I can guess what will change [TS]

00:43:08   is apps that are already now earning [TS]

00:43:12   money through some way that's a little [TS]

00:43:14   bit clunkier now have a smoother easier [TS]

00:43:16   way to do it where they will probably [TS]

00:43:18   also make more in the process and it's [TS]

00:43:20   easier for both them and for users so [TS]

00:43:22   you know don't think about it as [TS]

00:43:23   everything on your homescreen charging [TS]

00:43:25   two hours a month [TS]

00:43:26   think about it as maybe two or three [TS]

00:43:28   apps that you really use gonna charge [TS]

00:43:30   you four bucks a year thats that's more [TS]

00:43:32   likely to be the outcome anything about [TS]

00:43:34   it that way it's pretty awesome [TS]

00:43:37   well i agree i completely agree I just [TS]

00:43:40   hope that the people who are writing [TS]

00:43:41   these apps that the developers writing [TS]

00:43:43   these apps have the self-awareness to [TS]

00:43:44   realize whether or not it's appropriate [TS]

00:43:47   for them to to move to subscription [TS]

00:43:51   pricing and if they don't realize it [TS]

00:43:53   that's why coming back around I think [TS]

00:43:55   some of this verbiage is written the way [TS]

00:43:57   it is on the website that gives Apple [TS]

00:43:59   the the leverage and ammunition with [TS]

00:44:02   which is already have the leverage but [TS]

00:44:04   the ammunition with which to say now [TS]

00:44:06   this is not an appropriate use of a [TS]

00:44:08   subscription [TS]

00:44:09   again that the market will sort this out [TS]

00:44:11   like developers will very very quickly [TS]

00:44:13   learn that you know pricing well above [TS]

00:44:17   what people are willing to pay for their [TS]

00:44:18   app is is probably going to work for [TS]

00:44:20   them on the other hand you know suppose [TS]

00:44:22   you have an app on your home screen and [TS]

00:44:24   then they and they start charging for [TS]

00:44:26   bucks a month if they can make enough [TS]

00:44:29   money doing it that way and you don't [TS]

00:44:32   want to pay good for them and that's not [TS]

00:44:34   and that's you know too bad for you you [TS]

00:44:36   know like it so yeah I think that like [TS]

00:44:38   that again the markets work this out you [TS]

00:44:41   know that the developers who overpriced [TS]

00:44:43   their apps past with the market will [TS]

00:44:44   bear will adjust it and you as a [TS]

00:44:47   consumer might have to pay more but you [TS]

00:44:50   know i would argue that prices for [TS]

00:44:52   software have been artificially [TS]

00:44:53   depressed for quite some time and a lot [TS]

00:44:55   of kind of subsidized by a combination [TS]

00:44:57   of hope and VC money i think that it's [TS]

00:45:01   really good to have this option and not [TS]

00:45:03   every developer will use it you know [TS]

00:45:05   implementing these these subscriptions [TS]

00:45:07   is not that easy and it's kind of a pain [TS]

00:45:10   and it you know it's it's not as easy as [TS]

00:45:13   putting a paid app up there you have to [TS]

00:45:14   like code in this and purchase and have [TS]

00:45:16   the backend to verify the receipts and [TS]

00:45:18   keep track of who subscribe and [TS]

00:45:19   everything so like it's not simple to do [TS]

00:45:22   this so not every app will do this even [TS]

00:45:24   if Apple to prove them which we don't [TS]

00:45:25   know so i think this is going to be a [TS]

00:45:28   much smaller deal than you expect to [TS]

00:45:31   like apps as on a whole life as a whole [TS]

00:45:33   but it will make a really big difference [TS]

00:45:35   to the relatively low percentage of apps [TS]

00:45:39   that will actually abusing it and one [TS]

00:45:41   thing that developers who decided to go [TS]

00:45:42   subscription should factor and i'm sure [TS]

00:45:44   they're all are all thinking about this [TS]

00:45:45   already but like the psychological [TS]

00:45:47   barrier to signing up for a recurring [TS]

00:45:50   payment even if the recurring payment is [TS]

00:45:51   actually less than what you've actually [TS]

00:45:52   been paying like for example say your [TS]

00:45:54   twitter client updates every year and [TS]

00:45:55   every year you buy a new copy for five [TS]

00:45:57   bucks and they go to two years two [TS]

00:45:58   dollars a year you're like great that's [TS]

00:46:00   like half price you like but what if at [TS]

00:46:03   the end of this year I don't want to [TS]

00:46:04   upgrade right as always you know the [TS]

00:46:06   whole like if you're signing up for a [TS]

00:46:08   building like well how am I going to [TS]

00:46:10   keep track of bills how am I gonna know [TS]

00:46:11   when it renews like and we know that [TS]

00:46:13   Apple house is pretty well-liked in [TS]

00:46:14   terms of sending you an email letting [TS]

00:46:16   you know [TS]

00:46:16   that your thing is up for renewal that [TS]

00:46:19   there and let you know if the price [TS]

00:46:20   changes like that you know apples doing [TS]

00:46:21   a good job at it but just the mere [TS]

00:46:24   concept of signing up for a recurring [TS]

00:46:26   payment even if it is less money now and [TS]

00:46:28   less money in the long term bothers [TS]

00:46:30   people and then the technology angle is [TS]

00:46:33   and also what if i just want to keep [TS]

00:46:34   using the old version right and and [TS]

00:46:36   honestly like as a developer i say too [TS]

00:46:39   bad you know like so so we'll take these [TS]

00:46:41   things separately first of all day like [TS]

00:46:43   Superman prices like yes but as i said [TS]

00:46:45   before people people sure that you want [TS]

00:46:49   to pay between 0 and 1 times and and and [TS]

00:46:54   then have functionality is updated [TS]

00:46:55   forever and that's that's not [TS]

00:46:57   sustainable right well nobody not even [TS]

00:46:59   you want to be updated forever it's just [TS]

00:47:01   that you like the idea that the thing [TS]

00:47:02   that goes on in the background you have [TS]

00:47:04   to be aware that it exists like the the [TS]

00:47:06   perhaps a rational in the case of Apple [TS]

00:47:07   fear that you will forget this thing [TS]

00:47:09   existed that you're being charged you [TS]

00:47:10   know five dollars a year forever kind of [TS]

00:47:13   like an AOL dial subscription that you [TS]

00:47:14   just forgot the canceled in nineteen [TS]

00:47:15   ninety-seven like that that's what I'm [TS]

00:47:18   talking about mostly not the idea that [TS]

00:47:19   you just want to pay once and future [TS]

00:47:21   space again say your gladly paying like [TS]

00:47:23   you know so you're paying like five [TS]

00:47:24   dollars for nuclear client every nine [TS]

00:47:26   months and you're happy to do is you [TS]

00:47:28   think it's awesome every single time [TS]

00:47:29   when they ask you to pay two dollars a [TS]

00:47:31   year you're like what in perpetuity like [TS]

00:47:34   I'm signing up for something that you [TS]

00:47:35   know like it doesn't make sense but [TS]

00:47:37   especially again especially since Apple [TS]

00:47:39   is so good about like not letting you [TS]

00:47:40   forget these things there's not as if [TS]

00:47:41   you're going to not know that you're [TS]

00:47:42   being built for this and everything in [TS]

00:47:44   fact I think isn't like if you don't do [TS]

00:47:46   something it wont autore no I don't know [TS]

00:47:47   how how good is it [TS]

00:47:49   no no it does that's only if you raise [TS]

00:47:51   the price it will it will continue to [TS]

00:47:53   Bill you until you stop it [TS]

00:47:54   and right now the interface to stop [TS]

00:47:56   these descriptions is awful and buried [TS]

00:47:58   is something this will all be better [TS]

00:48:00   yeah but they have said like part of [TS]

00:48:03   this announcement was that all this is [TS]

00:48:04   getting an overhaul so it a lot of this [TS]

00:48:07   depends on the implementation details [TS]

00:48:09   it really does and so we will see that [TS]

00:48:10   the the previous redoing subscription [TS]

00:48:13   system was really rough there were a lot [TS]

00:48:15   of things about it that were really just [TS]

00:48:18   badly done or inconvenient or consumer [TS]

00:48:20   hostile or developer hospital so this a [TS]

00:48:23   lot of this depends on the details so I [TS]

00:48:25   I'm just assuming with with my [TS]

00:48:27   predictions here i'm assuming that they [TS]

00:48:28   have made it [TS]

00:48:29   are enough that we can overcome those [TS]

00:48:32   problems I I see what you're saying I [TS]

00:48:34   agree that it is a bigger barrier but I [TS]

00:48:38   you know the reality is paying it all as [TS]

00:48:40   a big barrier and once you're over the [TS]

00:48:41   hump of paying at all [TS]

00:48:43   yes people would choose to pay once if [TS]

00:48:45   given the option of you i want to pay [TS]

00:48:47   four dollars once or four hours every [TS]

00:48:48   year of course you're going to choose [TS]

00:48:49   the first one but that is not [TS]

00:48:51   sustainable like it and we've seen this [TS]

00:48:54   over and over and over again [TS]

00:48:56   software these days people expect [TS]

00:48:59   continuous updates and the end up a [TS]

00:49:02   wants model whether it's pay once [TS]

00:49:04   forever or whether it's pay once every [TS]

00:49:07   like 18 months than the others upgrades [TS]

00:49:08   in separate apps [TS]

00:49:09   both of those are dysfunctional in a lot [TS]

00:49:11   of ways you're saying it's not feasible [TS]

00:49:13   for developers right but i'm thinking it [TS]

00:49:15   from from the perspective of the [TS]

00:49:16   customers perfectly it's perfectly [TS]

00:49:18   sustainable from the perspective of the [TS]

00:49:20   customer because the customers like i [TS]

00:49:22   buy twitter client a year later that [TS]

00:49:24   developers out of business because no [TS]

00:49:25   never could find a way to get more money [TS]

00:49:27   and then I pick a new Torah client the [TS]

00:49:29   year goes by and then new character [TS]

00:49:31   developer releases a new versions [TS]

00:49:33   application i can use it or not you know [TS]

00:49:35   like like buying a new application every [TS]

00:49:38   year is the model that they've been [TS]

00:49:39   going on if the new application is from [TS]

00:49:41   the same developer find something that's [TS]

00:49:43   sustainable from the developers correct [TS]

00:49:45   perspective if that new application is a [TS]

00:49:46   different one [TS]

00:49:47   it's still the same money from the the [TS]

00:49:49   user's perspective right we're just [TS]

00:49:50   looking from the developer's perspective [TS]

00:49:51   saying it's not sustainable therefore [TS]

00:49:53   are going to go to subscriptions [TS]

00:49:54   subscriptions are not going to help you [TS]

00:49:55   if Pete if your application is not [TS]

00:49:57   attractive enough to get people over the [TS]

00:49:59   heel barrier but be sure [TS]

00:50:01   however the the other model has a whole [TS]

00:50:05   bunch of problems so for instance why [TS]

00:50:07   are you not considering buying a mac pro [TS]

00:50:09   today John my process cost way more than [TS]

00:50:12   apps i don't think that this is [TS]

00:50:13   applicable time I short-circuit [TS]

00:50:14   short-circuiting this analogy believe me [TS]

00:50:17   it works exactly the same way [TS]

00:50:19   why you're not buying a mac pro right [TS]

00:50:20   now because crappy I don't want that one [TS]

00:50:22   because you know a new ones coming out [TS]

00:50:25   soon [TS]

00:50:26   no i don't i don't know that all nobody [TS]

00:50:28   knows that well the current was three [TS]

00:50:29   years old and the same that's why I [TS]

00:50:31   don't want to buy it doesn't have its [TS]

00:50:33   not like a good product about you expect [TS]

00:50:35   there's probably going to be an update [TS]

00:50:37   to it coming soon and if you buy it now [TS]

00:50:39   you won't get the updated one for free [TS]

00:50:41   ya know I know [TS]

00:50:42   although the anti-piracy i'm not saying [TS]

00:50:44   this is not bad i'm just i'm saying that [TS]

00:50:45   by the started with me giving advice to [TS]

00:50:47   developers hey developer you're thinking [TS]

00:50:48   of changing your applications too [TS]

00:50:49   surprising if you only think about how [TS]

00:50:51   this will affect your revenue you're not [TS]

00:50:54   factoring everything you also have to [TS]

00:50:55   factor in how unattractive the idea of [TS]

00:50:58   of a pay this amount on this interval [TS]

00:51:01   forever and ever until you cancel is to [TS]

00:51:04   people that is very unattractive to a [TS]

00:51:06   lot of people more so then every year [TS]

00:51:10   after my favorite app developer goes out [TS]

00:51:11   of business find the next client that I [TS]

00:51:13   want to buy for toolbox even though or [TS]

00:51:15   five bucks even though it may be costing [TS]

00:51:16   the user more to do it the other way [TS]

00:51:18   people are more comfortable that and not [TS]

00:51:20   just because there was used to because [TS]

00:51:22   people have a real fear of recurring [TS]

00:51:24   bills of all kinds like even if it's a [TS]

00:51:27   one-dollar year it like and I think the [TS]

00:51:30   older you get the more like younger [TS]

00:51:32   people may eventually get ok with you [TS]

00:51:34   just get used to whatever like the [TS]

00:51:35   status quo is like so if you're coming [TS]

00:51:36   of age during this time I won't be a big [TS]

00:51:38   deal but the older you get like I have [TS]

00:51:40   trouble convincing my parents to buy two [TS]

00:51:42   dollar application i could never [TS]

00:51:43   convince them to buy a one-dollar your [TS]

00:51:45   application even if they use that [TS]

00:51:46   application every single day my parents [TS]

00:51:48   have one-dollar year to spend but if I [TS]

00:51:50   try to say what I have to pay that every [TS]

00:51:52   year for how long forever and if I stop [TS]

00:51:55   paying do I stop being able to use the [TS]

00:51:57   app doesn't make any sense [TS]

00:51:58   people do not like recurring payments [TS]

00:52:00   that you're right there are a lot of [TS]

00:52:03   people who don't it's not everybody a [TS]

00:52:05   lot of you don't care but there are a [TS]

00:52:06   lot of people who don't certainly but [TS]

00:52:08   not like I think so many of those people [TS]

00:52:10   will wouldn't pay for these things [TS]

00:52:12   anyway that it's not is I don't think [TS]

00:52:14   it's as big of a problem is you think [TS]

00:52:15   I'm thinking I'm thinking of applicants [TS]

00:52:18   they're changing their things like it [TS]

00:52:19   like the the topside the upside this and [TS]

00:52:22   it is very large for applications that [TS]

00:52:23   like the ones the case he said we all [TS]

00:52:25   have applications that our phones that [TS]

00:52:26   we hope continue to be updated improve [TS]

00:52:29   that we will gladly pay a yearly fee for [TS]

00:52:31   everybody has stuff like that on the [TS]

00:52:33   phone [TS]

00:52:34   those developers now have a way to [TS]

00:52:36   unlock that money that we were ready to [TS]

00:52:38   give them but usually didn't have a way [TS]

00:52:40   to do so like so that is the big upside [TS]

00:52:42   to this the only potential downsides [TS]

00:52:44   developers miscalculating if their [TS]

00:52:47   application is one of those ones that [TS]

00:52:48   has that on tap [TS]

00:52:49   market like or if that on top marketers [TS]

00:52:51   is big enough or whatever and so I guess [TS]

00:52:54   you have to know as a developer who are [TS]

00:52:55   my customers who are my potential [TS]

00:52:57   customers if i change the description [TS]

00:52:59   pricing is my it does my appt have that [TS]

00:53:01   much potential value to that many [TS]

00:53:03   potential people that it is one of those [TS]

00:53:04   apps you can get away with subscriptions [TS]

00:53:06   or does it not [TS]

00:53:07   and the the things that case was worried [TS]

00:53:09   about is that a hundred a bunch of [TS]

00:53:11   developers will miscalculate will think [TS]

00:53:15   that they can do it and it will be like [TS]

00:53:17   maybe not company killing but like [TS]

00:53:20   they'll be a short-term loss of [TS]

00:53:22   application has a bunch of them try out [TS]

00:53:24   the subscription model lose all the [TS]

00:53:25   customers who are willing to do that [TS]

00:53:26   people seek out alternatives and then [TS]

00:53:28   when they change their mind and realized [TS]

00:53:29   that they're not the one of those people [TS]

00:53:30   who can sustain subscription pricing [TS]

00:53:32   then switch back into it they lost [TS]

00:53:34   everything and that would be like a net [TS]

00:53:35   loss of like it would be your perturb [TS]

00:53:37   users who lose a bunch of applications [TS]

00:53:39   and was at like I said that the market [TS]

00:53:40   will start out eventually but there [TS]

00:53:41   could be some short-term turn and pain [TS]

00:53:44   from user perspective as developers try [TS]

00:53:47   things out [TS]

00:53:48   yeah but ultimately i think this is [TS]

00:53:51   going to be a very short-lived [TS]

00:53:53   experimentation period you know it [TS]

00:53:55   people are going to realize very quickly [TS]

00:53:56   whether this is working with them or not [TS]

00:53:57   and honestly most developers underpriced [TS]

00:54:00   their work anyway so I think if the [TS]

00:54:02   opposite profitable Edward not enough [TS]

00:54:04   people will try this now that although [TS]

00:54:06   that is speaking at speaking of the [TS]

00:54:07   short-term thing that is another [TS]

00:54:09   phenomenon is that if you are the first [TS]

00:54:11   application and a set of users [TS]

00:54:13   applications that they have on the home [TS]

00:54:15   screen or whatever to go subscription [TS]

00:54:17   they might be like you know what I [TS]

00:54:18   really don't like subscriptions but I've [TS]

00:54:20   been hearing a lot of Medicine [TS]

00:54:21   description thinking maybe i'll try it [TS]

00:54:22   if you are the tenth one to do that [TS]

00:54:24   subscription fatigue may said and so [TS]

00:54:25   like it like so many changes in the app [TS]

00:54:27   store like the app store itself there is [TS]

00:54:28   probably a gold rush period where if you [TS]

00:54:32   can get me know [TS]

00:54:32   decide now like if you want to run this [TS]

00:54:34   experiment it's probably better to start [TS]

00:54:36   soon rather than you know three weeks in [TS]

00:54:39   after everyone has been prompted three [TS]

00:54:41   times on their home screen if they want [TS]

00:54:42   to you know change the description or [TS]

00:54:44   whatever could be the first one that is [TS]

00:54:46   definitely an advantage and there is it [TS]

00:54:47   definitely a first mover advantage and [TS]

00:54:49   then I guess you'll find out if your [TS]

00:54:50   model is sustainable before anyone else [TS]

00:54:52   does i think most people don't really [TS]

00:54:56   use that many apps on a regular basis [TS]

00:54:59   that they even pay for let alone that [TS]

00:55:01   would be subscription-based [TS]

00:55:03   i'm guessing the average number of apps [TS]

00:55:06   on somebody's phone that are going to [TS]

00:55:07   attempt this at all [TS]

00:55:09   it's probably something like three at [TS]

00:55:11   most I mean like it's probably not that [TS]

00:55:12   many you know that that's why I think I [TS]

00:55:14   don't think the fatigue issue or the [TS]

00:55:17   like too many eels issue i don't think [TS]

00:55:18   these will be prevalent because 33 is [TS]

00:55:21   fatigue the third one people are gonna [TS]

00:55:22   be like that's it no more of these [TS]

00:55:24   applications asking me for subscriptions [TS]

00:55:26   three is definitely over the fatigue [TS]

00:55:28   bury one is the honeymoon period two is [TS]

00:55:30   you're getting grumpy three is like nope [TS]

00:55:32   i'm out for regular people [TS]

00:55:33   yeah i agree i really i really think [TS]

00:55:35   these are gonna be mostly single digit [TS]

00:55:38   number of dollars per year [TS]

00:55:40   most people won't have a whole lot of [TS]

00:55:42   those in their phone except like that [TS]

00:55:43   the most power of the power users you [TS]

00:55:46   know then it's gonna be very small [TS]

00:55:48   amounts per year and it's going to be [TS]

00:55:49   fine and just going to be easier for [TS]

00:55:51   everybody once it's all established but [TS]

00:55:53   we'll see any way to stop this thing I [TS]

00:55:56   think any kind of change description to [TS]

00:55:59   it to broadening it in anyway even if [TS]

00:56:01   it's a given whatever is a good thing [TS]

00:56:03   because I mean I'm talking about all the [TS]

00:56:05   potential bad sides but net [TS]

00:56:07   this is going to be an improvement like [TS]

00:56:09   this is a positive change for all were [TS]

00:56:11   arguing about is exactly how positive [TS]

00:56:13   because it could potentially be really [TS]

00:56:14   really positive or just a little bit [TS]

00:56:16   positive but it's going to be positive [TS]

00:56:17   like make no mistake about that even [TS]

00:56:19   though it sounds like we're i'm just [TS]

00:56:20   complaining about all the potential [TS]

00:56:21   downsides and how things can go wrong [TS]

00:56:23   like anytime there's any change people [TS]

00:56:24   can go wrong and developers can make bad [TS]

00:56:26   choices about how to change the pricing [TS]

00:56:28   structure of the application or which [TS]

00:56:30   applications to make but I can't see any [TS]

00:56:32   way that this could make things worse [TS]

00:56:34   this is going to make things better it's [TS]

00:56:35   going to make us have better [TS]

00:56:36   applications on the phone it's going to [TS]

00:56:38   make it so that our favorite [TS]

00:56:40   applications don't go out of businesses [TS]

00:56:41   often after whatever the initial [TS]

00:56:43   shakeout period and people figure this [TS]

00:56:45   out right and it could potentially [TS]

00:56:47   finally solve the problem of how do you [TS]

00:56:50   get pro level features full applications [TS]

00:56:53   on all of apple's platforms in a way [TS]

00:56:55   that can be ongoing just like it was a [TS]

00:56:58   box software you after year they would [TS]

00:56:59   make new versions and charge of [TS]

00:57:01   everything so and we didn't talk about [TS]

00:57:03   8515 split except mentioned briefly also [TS]

00:57:06   obviously a positive change for [TS]

00:57:08   everybody except for Apple you know okay [TS]

00:57:12   we respond to this week by Ringo to ring [TS]

00:57:16   dot com / ATP for fifty dollars off the [TS]

00:57:19   ring video doorbell there are very often [TS]

00:57:22   home burglaries every 13 seconds on [TS]

00:57:24   average most things happen in the middle [TS]

00:57:26   of the day with burgers ringing your [TS]

00:57:28   doorbell first to make sure you're away [TS]

00:57:30   before they try to break into your house [TS]

00:57:31   now the ring video doorbell is improving [TS]

00:57:34   stop burglaries before they happen by [TS]

00:57:35   allowing you to see and speak to through [TS]

00:57:38   the doorbell anyone approaching your [TS]

00:57:39   door using your smartphone even if [TS]

00:57:41   you're not home and now rings using [TS]

00:57:44   their advanced motion detection [TS]

00:57:45   technology to protect your entire [TS]

00:57:47   property with the ring of security kit [TS]

00:57:49   this includes a ring video doorbell for [TS]

00:57:51   the front door and a ring stick-up cam [TS]

00:57:53   the wireless weatherproof HD camera to [TS]

00:57:55   keep an eye on other parts of your [TS]

00:57:56   property or the side of John's car now [TS]

00:57:58   the ring video doorbell and stick-up [TS]

00:57:59   campus install minutes and working [TS]

00:58:01   together they provide 24 7 monitoring of [TS]

00:58:03   your entire home whether you're right [TS]

00:58:05   there in the house or thousands of miles [TS]

00:58:06   away now Casey you have one of these [TS]

00:58:08   right at both you do in case you you [TS]

00:58:10   have won this time I actually really [TS]

00:58:12   honestly like this thing a lot when [TS]

00:58:14   somebody rings the doorbell it [TS]

00:58:15   immediately pushes to not only my phone [TS]

00:58:18   but I've set up Aaron as a shared owner [TS]

00:58:20   so her phone with her own ring account [TS]

00:58:22   you can answer that push and it will [TS]

00:58:25   show you live video what's going on in [TS]

00:58:27   the front door it will allow you to [TS]

00:58:30   listen [TS]

00:58:30   it will allow you like you said to talk [TS]

00:58:32   back I really really like this thing I [TS]

00:58:35   wasn't sure what to make of it to make [TS]

00:58:36   it at first then I am definitely a [TS]

00:58:38   convert I'm really pleased with it [TS]

00:58:40   user link ring dot com / ATP for fifty [TS]

00:58:43   dollars off the ring of security kit [TS]

00:58:45   join the hundreds of thousands of others [TS]

00:58:46   who protect their home with the ring [TS]

00:58:48   video doorbell to ring calm / ATP once [TS]

00:58:50   again for fifty dollars off thats ring [TS]

00:58:52   com /a TV thanks a lot to ring for [TS]

00:58:55   sponsoring our show [TS]

00:58:59   we were talking earlier about the 8515 [TS]

00:59:02   split so Apple is said if you keep if [TS]

00:59:04   you have a subscription with a user and [TS]

00:59:07   that user keeps the subscription for at [TS]

00:59:08   least a year [TS]

00:59:09   subsequent to that first year being [TS]

00:59:11   completed apple will only take fifteen [TS]

00:59:14   percent and they will give eighty-five [TS]

00:59:15   percent of the revenue back to the [TS]

00:59:16   developer and John had made a kind of [TS]

00:59:20   offhanded comment that oh that's bad for [TS]

00:59:22   apple and and I presume John you don't [TS]

00:59:24   mean that no literal sense that's good [TS]

00:59:26   for everybody except that was mostly [TS]

00:59:27   joking obviously it's good for Apple [TS]

00:59:28   more people develop the app store and [TS]

00:59:30   all you know more sustainable [TS]

00:59:31   applications more people developed for [TS]

00:59:33   longer they're motivated to make their [TS]

00:59:35   customers happy and keep them for a year [TS]

00:59:36   like obviously there is upside for Apple [TS]

00:59:38   but i'm saying is there isn't [TS]

00:59:41   you know it's all upside for developers [TS]

00:59:44   getting more money and for users [TS]

00:59:46   it's upside because that the price to [TS]

00:59:47   the user doesn't change at all they [TS]

00:59:48   don't really care how the money split up [TS]

00:59:49   except for the fact that they they [TS]

00:59:51   probably like it that the developers are [TS]

00:59:53   getting more money because I'm not [TS]

00:59:54   really worried about Apple being [TS]

00:59:56   cash-strapped at this point this is [TS]

00:59:58   great because first [TS]

00:59:58   great because first [TS]

01:00:00   vol shows that Apple can lower their cut [TS]

01:00:02   and that they're willing to selectively [TS]

01:00:03   lower their cut now for for the right [TS]

01:00:05   reason we always do they could just [TS]

01:00:07   didn't really say whether they would [TS]

01:00:09   yeah exactly so so this is interesting [TS]

01:00:11   so now they can lower their cut to [TS]

01:00:15   incent behavior that they need or want [TS]

01:00:18   so i mentioned under the radar like this [TS]

01:00:20   would be a great thing to do to so for [TS]

01:00:21   instance like if they really wanted to [TS]

01:00:23   to kind of juice or subsidized more [TS]

01:00:26   growth of certain kinds of apps or [TS]

01:00:28   certain platforms like if they wanted to [TS]

01:00:30   say like all right anything bought an [TS]

01:00:32   ipad pro would be this or anything any [TS]

01:00:35   apple TV apps would have this split this [TS]

01:00:38   is a way for them to you know turn some [TS]

01:00:40   levers 22 juice development of certain [TS]

01:00:42   kinds of apps that they want or need you [TS]

01:00:45   know it's like edge I think they've seen [TS]

01:00:46   the things like the watch in the apple [TS]

01:00:48   TV & and the ipad pro like having having [TS]

01:00:51   their app stores take off probably more [TS]

01:00:53   slowly than apple wanted them to [TS]

01:00:55   I think this is it's good for them to [TS]

01:00:57   develop incentive systems that they can [TS]

01:00:59   use to to help juice app development in [TS]

01:01:03   the right and in sustainable ways so [TS]

01:01:06   that's good [TS]

01:01:07   it's also interesting that you know this [TS]

01:01:08   is probably part of the negotiation of [TS]

01:01:11   things like getting netflix and HBO go [TS]

01:01:13   to allow signups on the appletv you know [TS]

01:01:16   and there was actually a report like [TS]

01:01:17   that country code like an april that [TS]

01:01:18   this was the case that they were [TS]

01:01:20   actually getting fifteen percent you [TS]

01:01:22   know from the beginning on those things [TS]

01:01:23   for the longest time for the entire list [TS]

01:01:25   of the app store until possibly this or [TS]

01:01:28   until possibly you know this Apple TV [TS]

01:01:29   deal all developers were given the exact [TS]

01:01:32   same terms and the and had to follow the [TS]

01:01:34   exact same rules everybody from like [TS]

01:01:36   Facebook down to you know the the 123 [TS]

01:01:39   note-taker lon connected like every app [TS]

01:01:42   was given the same terms and that it was [TS]

01:01:44   very kind of like fair and democratic in [TS]

01:01:46   that way and and that was actually from [TS]

01:01:48   understand that was kind of like a big [TS]

01:01:49   part of the culture of the Eddy Cue [TS]

01:01:51   appstore team so good on them for that [TS]

01:01:53   this is interesting in that like [TS]

01:01:55   obviously they're there have been market [TS]

01:01:57   pressures for Apple to lower that rate [TS]

01:02:01   for certain big companies a big one is [TS]

01:02:04   amazon right I'm sure part of the [TS]

01:02:05   negotiations amazon are that Amazon does [TS]

01:02:08   not want to get apple thirty percent of [TS]

01:02:09   things that are bought in there after or [TS]

01:02:11   no memberships are starting their apps [TS]

01:02:12   apple doesn't budge on that an Amazon [TS]

01:02:15   doesn't budge on that and that that's [TS]

01:02:16   why we don't have a music video on the [TS]

01:02:17   appletv this is interesting in that it [TS]

01:02:20   looks like Apple is now bugging on that [TS]

01:02:22   for the right reasons which include [TS]

01:02:24   things like getting important partners [TS]

01:02:25   in the apple TV and that as they're [TS]

01:02:27   doing that for them they're also then [TS]

01:02:30   bringing in any developer under certain [TS]

01:02:32   terms with that too so yeah it'd be nice [TS]

01:02:35   if all apple TV apps or 8515 for [TS]

01:02:38   everything that's going to happen at [TS]

01:02:41   least not yet but this is nice that like [TS]

01:02:43   that kind of like everybody gets the [TS]

01:02:45   same deal thing seems to be still either [TS]

01:02:48   continuing or mostly continuing and also [TS]

01:02:51   this is great because like that cut [TS]

01:02:53   being so high in thirty percent is a lot [TS]

01:02:55   that cut being so high [TS]

01:02:57   make certain business models either [TS]

01:03:00   impossible or at least not very [TS]

01:03:02   compelling to even try to do on Apple's [TS]

01:03:05   platforms the more they can lower that [TS]

01:03:07   or the more places in which they can [TS]

01:03:09   lower that the more it makes completely [TS]

01:03:12   new business models possible or or more [TS]

01:03:15   practical on Apple's platforms and [TS]

01:03:17   that's good for everybody that's good [TS]

01:03:18   for the developers and the users and [TS]

01:03:20   apple everything won't suddenly possible [TS]

01:03:22   because you know for a lot of business [TS]

01:03:24   models fifteen percent is still too much [TS]

01:03:25   for somebody else to be taking still [TS]

01:03:27   can't sell ebooks fifteen percent is too [TS]

01:03:28   high for that to get one example [TS]

01:03:30   yeah probably but you know and you know [TS]

01:03:32   amazon is is not going to be happy with [TS]

01:03:34   that either [TS]

01:03:35   amazon is only going to be happy when [TS]

01:03:36   they can have their own check out with [TS]

01:03:38   their own stuff and not pay apple [TS]

01:03:39   anything and that's I don't expect [TS]

01:03:41   Amazon Apple to resolve that anytime [TS]

01:03:43   soon because apples are not gonna budge [TS]

01:03:45   on that and Amazon is not going to [TS]

01:03:47   accept anything else from Apple [TS]

01:03:48   especially at least not for the apple TV [TS]

01:03:50   where Amazon kind of you know where [TS]

01:03:52   Amazon can afford to lose the appletv [TS]

01:03:55   can't they can't just do a like what [TS]

01:03:58   you're talking about just for people who [TS]

01:03:59   subscribe to the app but don't a lot of [TS]

01:04:01   the video apps say like oh if you [TS]

01:04:03   subscribe to the web that apple doesn't [TS]

01:04:05   get any of that money yeah and then you [TS]

01:04:06   just sign like why does an amazon just [TS]

01:04:08   do that they they already do that on all [TS]

01:04:10   up on all Apple other platforms that's [TS]

01:04:12   exactly what they do the the only reason [TS]

01:04:14   they don't do it on the appletv is [TS]

01:04:16   because they're there are so few apple [TS]

01:04:19   tv's out there of the generation that [TS]

01:04:21   Amazon is is gambling that they can just [TS]

01:04:24   afford [TS]

01:04:24   to not be there and that they are in the [TS]

01:04:26   they have the upper hand in the [TS]

01:04:27   negotiation whether it's true or not so [TS]

01:04:29   that self fire TV boxes so that you can [TS]

01:04:32   check them to be for free this packing [TS]

01:04:34   material but that's the whole thing with [TS]

01:04:36   amazon its I i have no pity for their [TS]

01:04:38   it'sit's to eat you have two stubborn [TS]

01:04:41   monopolist fighting over who gets to be [TS]

01:04:42   the summer monopolist like okay that's [TS]

01:04:44   good luck with the fact that but yeah [TS]

01:04:47   anyway so I think this is great this a [TS]

01:04:50   15 thing is great i would love to see [TS]

01:04:52   this in more places I I wouldn't hold my [TS]

01:04:54   breath on that yet but I'm glad to see [TS]

01:04:56   it anywhere and and to have to have this [TS]

01:04:59   makes make things possible the word [TS]

01:05:01   impossible before entering and to give [TS]

01:05:02   to reward developers who are who have [TS]

01:05:05   that kind of like long-standing customer [TS]

01:05:07   base to reward them with basically a [TS]

01:05:09   raise is really cool and it's the only [TS]

01:05:13   downside to it is that I think for the [TS]

01:05:15   foreseeable future it's probably going [TS]

01:05:17   to benefit very few people like it's [TS]

01:05:19   good that there's going to be very few [TS]

01:05:20   developers who have a subscription [TS]

01:05:23   priced apps and who has user sticking [TS]

01:05:25   around that long it is i think it's [TS]

01:05:27   gonna be a small group but for those [TS]

01:05:29   people this is really nice and it's the [TS]

01:05:31   second the second change that we've gone [TS]

01:05:33   through so far that no matter how you [TS]

01:05:35   look at it definitely seems focused on [TS]

01:05:38   what we always talk about sustainable [TS]

01:05:39   development [TS]

01:05:40   how do i make it more feasible for a [TS]

01:05:42   developer to make something for the [TS]

01:05:45   platform and then keep improving it year [TS]

01:05:47   after year rather than doing the [TS]

01:05:48   hit-and-run or the one-hit wonder or the [TS]

01:05:50   game or other throwaway type of thing [TS]

01:05:52   how do we make that possible [TS]

01:05:53   subscriptions no matter how we slice [TS]

01:05:55   them either make that a little bit [TS]

01:05:57   better or a lot better than 80 15 after [TS]

01:05:59   the first year couldn't be more clear we [TS]

01:06:01   want you to keep your customers for an [TS]

01:06:02   entire year if you can do that there [TS]

01:06:04   will be a reward at the end of it you [TS]

01:06:05   are now and sent devised motivated to do [TS]

01:06:08   this not presented because I'm like that [TS]

01:06:11   it's a weird word [TS]

01:06:12   yeah and so you know that's that's 242 [TS]

01:06:15   and trying to make a more sustainable [TS]

01:06:17   the only question I have about it I'd [TS]

01:06:18   look into it deeply is like the the [TS]

01:06:20   loophole of like it so its bits per [TS]

01:06:22   customer so it's like you Joe Schmo have [TS]

01:06:25   been a customer for a year Joe schmo's [TS]

01:06:27   subscription money after the first year [TS]

01:06:29   changes / day 15 but they get but the [TS]

01:06:32   guy who signed up six months later it [TS]

01:06:34   doesn't change 2015 innocence [TS]

01:06:35   it's not counting it's like customer [TS]

01:06:37   year but so if your customer if you have [TS]

01:06:38   a customer who has been subscribing [TS]

01:06:40   every month for 12 months and then the [TS]

01:06:42   13th month ago you know what I'm not [TS]

01:06:44   subscribing anymore and cancel the [TS]

01:06:46   subscription and then five minutes later [TS]

01:06:47   resubscribe or a month later resubscribe [TS]

01:06:49   like it is a gap in the year long thing [TS]

01:06:52   that you lose out a native team to the [TS]

01:06:54   clock start over again or visit the [TS]

01:06:56   cumulative 11 months that they were [TS]

01:06:57   subscriber and then after their 12-month [TS]

01:06:59   like details like that about it doesn't [TS]

01:07:01   have to be continuous streak if they [TS]

01:07:04   bail on the last month but changed their [TS]

01:07:06   mind five minute later five minutes [TS]

01:07:07   later or day later or a month later what [TS]

01:07:09   are all the rules surrounding that [TS]

01:07:10   because it would seem kind of cruel to [TS]

01:07:12   like say you're a really good customer [TS]

01:07:15   for an application and you want to be [TS]

01:07:18   sustainable and you were really excited [TS]

01:07:19   about being able to fund for an entire [TS]

01:07:21   year bc nude in your second year that [TS]

01:07:23   the developer would be getting more of [TS]

01:07:25   your money but for whatever reason you [TS]

01:07:28   either accidentally or you changed your [TS]

01:07:29   mind briefly or something you can select [TS]

01:07:31   it and then you re subscribe and i [TS]

01:07:33   gotta-i gotta use that for another year [TS]

01:07:34   before the developer it's not that [TS]

01:07:36   people care much about so much about [TS]

01:07:37   developers that they're worried about it [TS]

01:07:39   but I'm just trying to like I hope there [TS]

01:07:42   are rules in there that have reasonable [TS]

01:07:45   buffers to make it so that you don't [TS]

01:07:47   visit you you have to keep the customer [TS]

01:07:49   for a year [TS]

01:07:50   you wouldn't want to lose out on that [TS]

01:07:52   money due to a technicality or silly [TS]

01:07:54   mistake real-time follow-up from pat [TS]

01:07:56   Murray there's a 60 day grace period on [TS]

01:07:58   the 1815 split that's pretty generous [TS]

01:08:00   and it's pretty quiet into that are [TS]

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01:08:23   client is native it runs really well [TS]

01:08:25   i've been using it now for a number of [TS]

01:08:28   years since before they were sponsor I [TS]

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01:08:32   up with them very very easy to restore [TS]

01:08:34   things you want to restore just one file [TS]

01:08:36   you can do that or you can restore your [TS]

01:08:37   entire drive you can download files from [TS]

01:08:39   online so if you want to like you know [TS]

01:08:41   restore a file when you're on vacation [TS]

01:08:43   just get a file from your home computer [TS]

01:08:44   you can do that it's really convenient [TS]

01:08:46   for that you can also restore and [TS]

01:08:48   our hard drive with the files and they [TS]

01:08:50   can you can download if you want to or [TS]

01:08:52   they can actually mail you a hard drive [TS]

01:08:55   they can you restore my mail overnight [TS]

01:08:57   to you with fedex mail you a hard drive [TS]

01:08:59   and if you return it to them within 30 [TS]

01:09:01   days he had a refund on the hard drive [TS]

01:09:03   I still suggest you have local backups [TS]

01:09:05   because local backups are just faster [TS]

01:09:07   and more convenient and everything [TS]

01:09:08   because they're right there was no [TS]

01:09:09   internet involved but you should have [TS]

01:09:11   backblaze as an insurance policy just in [TS]

01:09:14   case something happens to your local [TS]

01:09:15   bank is also so if you have something [TS]

01:09:16   like a fire or flood or a power surge or [TS]

01:09:19   just human error there are so many [TS]

01:09:20   things that can affect your local [TS]

01:09:22   backups as well as your main computer [TS]

01:09:24   you need online backup as a as like a [TS]

01:09:27   whole failsafe insurance policy against [TS]

01:09:29   those kind of conditions and if you're [TS]

01:09:30   going to online backup backblaze is the [TS]

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01:09:34   believe me I have tried the other ones [TS]

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01:09:39   there's no weird throttling are slow [TS]

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01:09:56   there 18 listen to get a free 15 day [TS]

01:09:58   free trial at backpage.com / ATP thanks [TS]

01:10:01   a lot [TS]

01:10:05   alright so another big change to the way [TS]

01:10:08   the appstore works you can [TS]

01:10:11   hey to get placement in search results [TS]

01:10:14   sort of kind of i'm not entirely clear [TS]

01:10:18   on how this is all held together and I'm [TS]

01:10:20   guessing Marco you probably have the [TS]

01:10:22   best overall understanding of it so it [TS]

01:10:24   can you can you take the summarizer in [TS]

01:10:27   chief mantle from me and kind of give us [TS]

01:10:28   the quick quick and dirty version just [TS]

01:10:31   go if you're if you're interested in [TS]

01:10:32   these search ads go to the link that [TS]

01:10:34   we're gonna put the show notes apples [TS]

01:10:36   page on this because they they have [TS]

01:10:37   screenshots and it explains better than [TS]

01:10:39   we can in the text but in the audio [TS]

01:10:41   basically the gist of this is they are [TS]

01:10:44   now offering search ads for developers [TS]

01:10:47   so that when you search you can pay for [TS]

01:10:49   your app to show up for certain relevant [TS]

01:10:51   search keywords when people you know [TS]

01:10:53   people search warrant after you can pay [TS]

01:10:55   for it to take there's a single spot on [TS]

01:10:58   top it's highlighted in blue so it's you [TS]

01:10:59   know you don't like fooling people into [TS]

01:11:01   thinking this is a real result it looks [TS]

01:11:02   like an ad it's labeled as an ally I [TS]

01:11:04   think you are fooling people but forget [TS]

01:11:06   that after years after you finish [TS]

01:11:07   summarizing good so it's basically it's [TS]

01:11:08   very similar to what we've seen from [TS]

01:11:11   search engines like Google from from [TS]

01:11:13   search ads for over a decade [TS]

01:11:15   it's the very similar kind of thing so [TS]

01:11:17   that and I think Apple has put in place [TS]

01:11:19   certain limits and controls that that [TS]

01:11:22   are better there to limit potential [TS]

01:11:24   abuse and annoyance and you know [TS]

01:11:26   possible fraud issues and it sounds like [TS]

01:11:29   they've actually a really good job at it [TS]

01:11:30   looks pretty good to me [TS]

01:11:32   the restrictions they put in place sound [TS]

01:11:34   pretty good if they work as well as they [TS]

01:11:36   sound [TS]

01:11:37   I think it'll actually be a really good [TS]

01:11:38   system you know and there's there's a [TS]

01:11:41   lot of beds and better just briefly some [TS]

01:11:43   of those restrictions are things like [TS]

01:11:44   that obviously the only one AD being [TS]

01:11:47   shown at a time so you don't have to [TS]

01:11:48   worry about like a giant stack of ads [TS]

01:11:49   above the real search results because [TS]

01:11:52   the ads only take up like at most half [TS]

01:11:54   of the of the viewport of the other [TS]

01:11:56   before you're still seeing you know [TS]

01:11:58   whatever the top couple results are you [TS]

01:11:59   still going to see those pretty easily [TS]

01:12:00   on screen so it's not really gonna like [TS]

01:12:02   bury their the organic search results 1 [TS]

01:12:05   worried that i saw a lot of people site [TS]

01:12:06   is was basically like keyword squatting [TS]

01:12:09   of of like of bitters of like you know [TS]

01:12:11   big-budget games bidding on like on your [TS]

01:12:14   keywords like image editor or podcast [TS]

01:12:17   player like just to get their big 12 [TS]

01:12:18   game [TS]

01:12:18   squatting on your trademarks like they [TS]

01:12:20   would actually register your products [TS]

01:12:22   exact name as a as a keyword right [TS]

01:12:24   exactly and and apple apple says on this [TS]

01:12:27   page that you're only going to show up [TS]

01:12:30   on searches for which your result would [TS]

01:12:32   be relevant [TS]

01:12:33   no matter how much you're willing to pay [TS]

01:12:35   and so will see like what that means in [TS]

01:12:37   practice that sounds a lot like a big [TS]

01:12:39   data search problem apples usually not [TS]

01:12:40   very good at but we'll see i can i'm [TS]

01:12:43   gonna get into the benefit of that at [TS]

01:12:45   least let's see what this is because if [TS]

01:12:48   they do this well and you know it looks [TS]

01:12:51   good so far in in their press shots [TS]

01:12:53   we'll see how it is again if they do [TS]

01:12:55   this well I think this is great you know [TS]

01:12:57   other developers are I have not heard [TS]

01:13:00   from any other developers who are as [TS]

01:13:02   excited about this as I am and maybe [TS]

01:13:03   that's a bad sign i don't know but if [TS]

01:13:05   you have a big budget and you want more [TS]

01:13:07   growth you now have a way to get more [TS]

01:13:09   growth you can bid on some search [TS]

01:13:11   keywords or there's even what i thought [TS]

01:13:12   was interesting [TS]

01:13:13   there's an option in in the screenshot [TS]

01:13:15   they show there's an option to not [TS]

01:13:17   specify the keywords and just let Apple [TS]

01:13:19   kind of put you into things it thinks [TS]

01:13:21   are relevant not just the option i think [TS]

01:13:23   that's the default I think you're right [TS]

01:13:25   so that i think is more interesting [TS]

01:13:28   because honestly trying to keep track of [TS]

01:13:30   what keywords you should be bidding on [TS]

01:13:31   is a lot of work and a lot of kind of [TS]

01:13:34   voodoo and a lot of some data some [TS]

01:13:36   guessing and it's just it's just it [TS]

01:13:38   makes it more work so if Apple can do a [TS]

01:13:40   decent enough job and get you a decent [TS]

01:13:42   return or you know decently low cost per [TS]

01:13:44   tap for automatic searches you actually [TS]

01:13:48   get more places like you'll be on on [TS]

01:13:50   keywords you wouldn't have thought of [TS]

01:13:51   that you know and if they work then [TS]

01:13:54   great so that i think is interesting but [TS]

01:13:56   if the system works so it's a way for [TS]

01:13:58   both people with a budget to spend to [TS]

01:14:01   get more people to download their app so [TS]

01:14:04   that's cool and also you know people [TS]

01:14:07   keep saying like oh what's what's going [TS]

01:14:08   to happen to like the small developers [TS]

01:14:10   who can't afford this [TS]

01:14:11   if you're a small developer trying to [TS]

01:14:14   trying to break into a market it is [TS]

01:14:16   almost impossible to get meaningful [TS]

01:14:19   exposure unless you like with the press [TS]

01:14:22   and and get them to write about you [TS]

01:14:24   somehow this is easier and more reliable [TS]

01:14:26   and yes it costs some money but you know [TS]

01:14:29   it's a crowded market sometimes you [TS]

01:14:31   gotta pay some money to get noticed [TS]

01:14:32   just by you have to buy promotional [TS]

01:14:33   spots if you are going to try to break [TS]

01:14:37   into a category where no one's really [TS]

01:14:39   going to write about your app or you [TS]

01:14:41   haven't gotten the kind of press you [TS]

01:14:42   want or it's too narrow a category for [TS]

01:14:44   the press to care [TS]

01:14:46   this is great this is a way for you to [TS]

01:14:48   get to your customers and to be visible [TS]

01:14:50   if you're launching a new photo editor [TS]

01:14:52   there is no way you're going to show up [TS]

01:14:54   in that number one spot at any piano [TS]

01:14:56   before this you you could not show up [TS]

01:14:58   there if people search for image editor [TS]

01:15:00   and they got this one camera verse [TS]

01:15:01   number one spot that's it that's what [TS]

01:15:03   they're seeing your app doesn't stand a [TS]

01:15:04   chance [TS]

01:15:05   now you have a way to get there and [TS]

01:15:08   maybe you don't do it forever [TS]

01:15:09   maybe you do it only like Bill your [TS]

01:15:11   initial audience then you then you [TS]

01:15:12   depend on you know organic spreading of [TS]

01:15:14   your app after that but this gives you [TS]

01:15:17   an option where there was no option [TS]

01:15:18   before I don't see how you can look at [TS]

01:15:20   this and say this is a bad thing the [TS]

01:15:21   only major valid criticism of this is [TS]

01:15:25   yeah they really should make the actual [TS]

01:15:27   search better be before worrying about [TS]

01:15:30   things like this but ultimately ok that [TS]

01:15:33   this is reality that's not going to [TS]

01:15:34   happen the old the original search will [TS]

01:15:36   will get better or not separately from [TS]

01:15:39   this that is independent of this so in [TS]

01:15:42   the reality that we live in make this [TS]

01:15:43   happen independently i would much rather [TS]

01:15:45   have an app store where I as a developer [TS]

01:15:48   can buy keywords for to promote my apps [TS]

01:15:50   and we'll see you know maybe the pricing [TS]

01:15:53   will will make this impossible but at [TS]

01:15:54   least rather have the option to try then [TS]

01:15:57   to have something where if I want to [TS]

01:15:59   break into a new market i have to either [TS]

01:16:02   already be famous or get the press to [TS]

01:16:03   write about me because that's that is [TS]

01:16:06   not nearly as open and democratic as [TS]

01:16:09   this is they're trying to be helpful it [TS]

01:16:11   seems like two people who have [TS]

01:16:13   experienced these things by giving you [TS]

01:16:15   the tools to do the fairly simple [TS]

01:16:16   multiplication and division to say look [TS]

01:16:19   it you're gonna lose money if you bid is [TS]

01:16:23   an auction system if you bid too high [TS]

01:16:25   but this is a very popular keyword and a [TS]

01:16:27   lot of people are bidding on there being [TS]

01:16:29   it up and up and you get caught up in [TS]

01:16:31   that you won't make that money back [TS]

01:16:33   because it costs so much money and its [TS]

01:16:36   part app by the way like it's not per [TS]

01:16:37   purchase it's not for time period its [TS]

01:16:39   how many people tap on your [TS]

01:16:41   are your results right you have to kind [TS]

01:16:43   of guess what do I think my conversion [TS]

01:16:45   rates going to be of all the people who [TS]

01:16:46   tap on my ad how many of them are [TS]

01:16:47   actually going to buy it for each one [TS]

01:16:48   who buys it how much do i how much money [TS]

01:16:51   am I going to make and therefore how [TS]

01:16:53   much money does it cost me an aggregate [TS]

01:16:54   during this ad campaign to acquire each [TS]

01:16:57   customer who will give me a certain [TS]

01:16:58   amount of money and apple actually have [TS]

01:16:59   a little tool where you can say look if [TS]

01:17:01   you don't want to do this very [TS]

01:17:02   complicated multiplication and division [TS]

01:17:03   in your own head [TS]

01:17:04   just put your cost per acquisition your [TS]

01:17:06   CPA goal in there and then they'll [TS]

01:17:08   figure out how to maximize your app [TS]

01:17:10   downloads like you just give them your [TS]

01:17:11   target number where you feel like this [TS]

01:17:13   ad campaign will be worthwhile for you [TS]

01:17:15   whether it's you put in a number that [TS]

01:17:16   makes you feel like you won't lose any [TS]

01:17:18   money or that you're willing to lose a [TS]

01:17:19   certain amount of money like how much [TS]

01:17:20   how much do you want to cost you to get [TS]

01:17:22   a new customer if you want to cost you [TS]

01:17:24   fifty cents to get into customer you [TS]

01:17:25   call the customer gives you a dollar [TS]

01:17:27   you're going to come out ahead maybe it [TS]

01:17:28   cost you you get a dollar for every [TS]

01:17:30   customer but you're willing to pay two [TS]

01:17:32   dollars to acquire your first set of [TS]

01:17:33   customers like marker was saying on your [TS]

01:17:34   launch day or whatever you can do that [TS]

01:17:36   just put that number in Italy like [TS]

01:17:38   everything they say about the sounds [TS]

01:17:39   good down to have heard I don't know if [TS]

01:17:41   this is text from the ads or still show [TS]

01:17:43   talking to people the idea that like say [TS]

01:17:45   your application is terrific and someone [TS]

01:17:47   types twitterrific into the search thing [TS]

01:17:49   I had heard that there would be no add [TS]

01:17:51   their the twitter if we will be the [TS]

01:17:52   number one hit and there'll be no ad [TS]

01:17:54   displayed because it is exact match for [TS]

01:17:55   the name of an existing application in [TS]

01:17:57   other words nobody can buy the [TS]

01:17:59   twitterrific keyword to make their thing [TS]

01:18:03   show up as the number one head when [TS]

01:18:04   someone searches for twitterrific again [TS]

01:18:05   i don't know if this is official or [TS]

01:18:07   something that was like floating around [TS]

01:18:08   but that is exactly the type of thing [TS]

01:18:10   that i would expect from Apple to try to [TS]

01:18:12   have tried to be classy and and not [TS]

01:18:15   sleazy friend for the reason that like i [TS]

01:18:17   posted about this early on Twitter today [TS]

01:18:18   i mentioned earlier when Marco we said [TS]

01:18:20   that the ads are clearly marked doesn't [TS]

01:18:22   quite work on Twitter when I what I said [TS]

01:18:24   was that I had heard a couple stories [TS]

01:18:27   about how the ads how you know as will [TS]

01:18:29   be in search results and all of them had [TS]

01:18:30   the same screenshot ice and provided by [TS]

01:18:32   Apple that shows the search and shows [TS]

01:18:35   and at the top and I saw that picture [TS]

01:18:37   four separate times on four separate [TS]

01:18:39   websites each time i looked at it it was [TS]

01:18:41   like you know in the mix with an article [TS]

01:18:43   that I like skimming and reading or [TS]

01:18:44   whatever I look at the screenshot like I [TS]

01:18:46   guess best this is showing an ad result [TS]

01:18:48   and I looked at and go oh no it's not [TS]

01:18:49   showing a result this is just regular [TS]

01:18:50   search results because at that point I [TS]

01:18:52   didn't know it [TS]

01:18:53   from Apple I thought people were just [TS]

01:18:54   showing what the App Store search looks [TS]

01:18:55   like four times I looked at it only on [TS]

01:18:58   the fourth time did I realize they're [TS]

01:19:01   trying to show this as one of those ads [TS]

01:19:03   search results and I looked at it a [TS]

01:19:04   little closer and then I saw the tiny [TS]

01:19:06   letters ad in a little tiny blue light [TS]

01:19:08   blue box in a light blue thing and so i [TS]

01:19:10   posted to Twitter course everyone said [TS]

01:19:12   it once you say this is including mark [TS]

01:19:14   is an added you know I basically posted [TS]

01:19:16   the store and I saw this image four [TS]

01:19:18   times before i realized that it was an [TS]

01:19:19   ad when you said that everyone looks [TS]

01:19:21   little things add right there you clear [TS]

01:19:22   seems clear that if you're looking with [TS]

01:19:25   that mindset yes and other people like [TS]

01:19:26   how can you not tell it's blue blue [TS]

01:19:28   doesn't mean add I thought it was like [TS]

01:19:30   the top hit a selected hit I have no [TS]

01:19:32   idea why it was blue and this is this is [TS]

01:19:36   a real phenomenon someone posted a tweet [TS]

01:19:38   with a study showing something like [TS]

01:19:40   fifty-seven percent of people don't [TS]

01:19:44   identify ads in my google search results [TS]

01:19:46   as ads even though they're also clearly [TS]

01:19:48   marked again with a little tiny yellow [TS]

01:19:50   thing that says add them or whatever if [TS]

01:19:52   you're not going into with the mindset [TS]

01:19:54   that some of the things are going to be [TS]

01:19:55   ads and that you should look to see how [TS]

01:19:56   they're identified you won't recognize [TS]

01:19:58   this as an ad it will look like the most [TS]

01:20:00   prominent and the most important [TS]

01:20:02   especially if it's colored differently [TS]

01:20:03   and it's on the top but there's a [TS]

01:20:06   difference between recognizing that you [TS]

01:20:09   know people say what do you care about a [TS]

01:20:10   good analogy some given Twitter was like [TS]

01:20:12   when you go into the store to buy DVDs [TS]

01:20:13   which i guess is an old person who said [TS]

01:20:15   this and you see the video and you see a [TS]

01:20:17   DVD on the end cap of the display right [TS]

01:20:20   someone paid for that end cap place was [TS]

01:20:22   all retail thing where you pay the [TS]

01:20:23   retailer more money to have your thing [TS]

01:20:24   more prominently placed do you care that [TS]

01:20:27   they paid for that placement or do you [TS]

01:20:29   just care that all that's the [TS]

01:20:30   application that i want but that analogy [TS]

01:20:32   does not work at all because what you [TS]

01:20:34   want people to know is again in theory [TS]

01:20:37   this breakdown for example searches so [TS]

01:20:38   bad you want them to think when I do a [TS]

01:20:41   search the things near the top of the [TS]

01:20:43   search are the most relevant to the [TS]

01:20:44   thing i searched ads don't care about [TS]

01:20:47   your relevance again modulo apples rules [TS]

01:20:49   the thing at the top when it's an ad is [TS]

01:20:51   not there because Apple search out room [TS]

01:20:53   thinks this is the most relevant [TS]

01:20:54   application for your search [TS]

01:20:56   it's there because someone paid for it [TS]

01:20:57   to be there for your search and that is [TS]

01:20:59   different is different you know from the [TS]

01:21:01   users perspective you want to know [TS]

01:21:03   oh this must be the thing you know I [TS]

01:21:04   searched for [TS]

01:21:06   no Twitter and this is the top one this [TS]

01:21:07   must be the best twitter application the [TS]

01:21:10   most popular Twitter application the [TS]

01:21:13   most downloaded to upper application the [TS]

01:21:14   application that most matches the [TS]

01:21:16   keyword Twitter or is it more [TS]

01:21:17   complicated thing or whatever [TS]

01:21:19   none of those things are true if it's an [TS]

01:21:20   ad it is an ad the answer is it's [TS]

01:21:22   because someone paid a lot of money to [TS]

01:21:23   put it there which is totally different [TS]

01:21:25   and it totally a misaligned incentives [TS]

01:21:26   love the user was expecting now because [TS]

01:21:28   Apple search results are so terrible [TS]

01:21:30   maybe a paid ad is just as relevant is [TS]

01:21:32   that important in many cases but but you [TS]

01:21:34   know in theory it's not i'm not saying [TS]

01:21:37   that shouldn't be at having only one and [TS]

01:21:38   it's good having it you know having you [TS]

01:21:40   not be able to fill it with with garbage [TS]

01:21:42   lies and well I know that's it again we [TS]

01:21:45   fall back on the App Store not doing [TS]

01:21:46   that great i was going to say that [TS]

01:21:47   because the ads themselves can only [TS]

01:21:49   contain text from your actual [TS]

01:21:50   application like you don't get to write [TS]

01:21:52   and add you don't get the right like [TS]

01:21:53   your own ad copy it just pulls from your [TS]

01:21:56   actual application on the story you have [TS]

01:21:58   to have an application on the store and [TS]

01:21:59   all this does is pull your icon your [TS]

01:22:01   name your description everything from [TS]

01:22:03   your actually entry that should go [TS]

01:22:05   towards making sure that you can't make [TS]

01:22:07   it misleading and or fake at [TS]

01:22:09   unfortunately as we see many times over [TS]

01:22:12   you can make it misleading application [TS]

01:22:13   icon you can make misleading application [TS]

01:22:15   name and you can make your description [TS]

01:22:16   misleading and those can all be in the [TS]

01:22:18   store so this doesn't really say this [TS]

01:22:19   but again in theory the rule system is [TS]

01:22:21   correct [TS]

01:22:22   you don't get to write your own custom [TS]

01:22:23   and so it's very classy there's only one [TS]

01:22:24   of them is limited [TS]

01:22:26   if everything goes well they should all [TS]

01:22:27   work out really well and still I say [TS]

01:22:29   that it's not even a passport no matter [TS]

01:22:31   how prominently apple says this is an ad [TS]

01:22:34   most people i feel not realize it's an [TS]

01:22:36   ad they could but ad and gigantic black [TS]

01:22:38   letters and people like huh weird ad [TS]

01:22:41   letters because they could put this is [TS]

01:22:42   an advertisement surgeon general's [TS]

01:22:44   warning smoking causes cancer and giant [TS]

01:22:46   box people would still not see it this [TS]

01:22:48   this is a real phenomenon happens all [TS]

01:22:50   the time and apples being so super [TS]

01:22:52   subtle about it there's no chance to [TS]

01:22:53   people regular people are going to [TS]

01:22:55   realize this is an endless someone [TS]

01:22:56   pointed out to them even if they notice [TS]

01:22:58   the ad they be like that mean is this an [TS]

01:23:01   advanced copy or business application [TS]

01:23:04   contain ads like it is not clear at all [TS]

01:23:06   now maybe it doesn't really matter in [TS]

01:23:08   the grand scheme of things whether it's [TS]

01:23:09   clear because it most of the top Google [TS]

01:23:11   search results are also adds and nobody [TS]

01:23:13   knows when people click on them in the [TS]

01:23:14   world turns on and everything is fine [TS]

01:23:15   but i think that is the final barrier to [TS]

01:23:18   like [TS]

01:23:18   a completely clean totally classy sound [TS]

01:23:22   like Donald Trump now you know like [TS]

01:23:24   believe me you don't it yeah an apple [TS]

01:23:27   style [TS]

01:23:29   how does Apple do advertising in a way [TS]

01:23:31   that avoids all the pitfalls of [TS]

01:23:34   advertising I think they have avoided [TS]

01:23:35   pretty much every single one of them in [TS]

01:23:37   theory except for the part where people [TS]

01:23:38   just absolutely cannot tell that this [TS]

01:23:40   thing is an ad [TS]

01:23:41   well I think the reason that well one of [TS]

01:23:44   the reasons it's so hard to tell it's an [TS]

01:23:45   ad is one of the really great decisions [TS]

01:23:49   they've made which is what you were just [TS]

01:23:50   talking about that you can't really [TS]

01:23:51   write an ad for your app it just shows [TS]

01:23:56   your apps search results at the top and [TS]

01:23:59   labels it as an ad and I think that's [TS]

01:24:01   really smart because then you're not [TS]

01:24:02   gonna have a bunch of like really [TS]

01:24:03   obnoxious like you punch the monkey sort [TS]

01:24:05   of things going on but on the other side [TS]

01:24:08   of the coin it makes it nearly [TS]

01:24:09   indistinguishable from all the genuine [TS]

01:24:12   search results below it so it's kind of [TS]

01:24:14   a double-edged sword but I will [TS]

01:24:17   absolutely take this approach over [TS]

01:24:19   allowing any sort of image there in or [TS]

01:24:22   you know god-awful punch the monkey sort [TS]

01:24:24   of things [TS]

01:24:25   this is a much class here much better [TS]

01:24:27   approach even despite the fact that by [TS]

01:24:30   forcing it to look like the search [TS]

01:24:31   results below it [TS]

01:24:33   it does kind of blend in a bit and the [TS]

01:24:35   thing is not to blame them because it [TS]

01:24:37   does look distinct it's not like oh this [TS]

01:24:38   is just like all of it but it looks like [TS]

01:24:40   the best result like that was that I [TS]

01:24:42   gotta find the survey for the show notes [TS]

01:24:43   but the survey result was like they [TS]

01:24:44   showed people search results and others [TS]

01:24:46   google but like from a search engine and [TS]

01:24:47   I asked them what do you think these top [TS]

01:24:49   results are and people would say these [TS]

01:24:51   are the most popular results [TS]

01:24:53   these are the most relevant results [TS]

01:24:54   these are the results than most other [TS]

01:24:56   the most other people clicked on like [TS]

01:24:57   this is what people thought those [TS]

01:24:58   results for what they actually wears ads [TS]

01:25:00   people could tell they were different [TS]

01:25:02   that they were highlighted they were [TS]

01:25:03   prominent but what they would read that [TS]

01:25:05   as is [TS]

01:25:06   these are the best like it is it does [TS]

01:25:08   look different you can tell there's the [TS]

01:25:10   white results and then there's the one [TS]

01:25:11   blue and on top but how you interpret [TS]

01:25:13   that blueness is not built into the [TS]

01:25:15   blueness like you can tell that's blue [TS]

01:25:17   are you colorblind know you can see that [TS]

01:25:18   it's different everyone sees it is [TS]

01:25:19   different but if you ask them you know [TS]

01:25:21   again you know prime by giving the [TS]

01:25:23   answer and say can you tell this is an [TS]

01:25:24   ad you say what do you think the blue [TS]

01:25:26   results were I bet people are going to [TS]

01:25:28   say that's the best result that's the [TS]

01:25:29   one that's the most downloaded that's [TS]

01:25:30   you know like that's the highest rated [TS]

01:25:32   some people are going to say even though [TS]

01:25:33   it says right in their face capital a [TS]

01:25:35   lowercase D a tiny little blue box that [TS]

01:25:37   I guarantee my parents cannot see by the [TS]

01:25:38   way even if you made it bigger people [TS]

01:25:41   won't read it or people will think that [TS]

01:25:42   meant the application contains ads which [TS]

01:25:44   by the way is the thing that should [TS]

01:25:45   probably tell you when they do tell you [TS]

01:25:46   that contains an app purchases but [TS]

01:25:47   anyway not clear [TS]

01:25:50   not really apple's fault entirely [TS]

01:25:52   probably almost nothing we can do about [TS]

01:25:53   it but it's one of the reasons that i [TS]

01:25:56   was asking me if I was for or against [TS]

01:25:57   this change [TS]

01:25:58   um I'm think I'm slightly against it [TS]

01:26:01   because i don't i would rather just have [TS]

01:26:02   a really good search i see all the [TS]

01:26:04   things that Marco saying about it from a [TS]

01:26:06   user perspective how applications gain [TS]

01:26:10   traction in the market is not my problem [TS]

01:26:11   and i just want really relevant search [TS]

01:26:13   results without any ads that have to [TS]

01:26:14   skip over honestly like I as a user I [TS]

01:26:17   mean maybe I'm biased I'm a developer [TS]

01:26:19   and I kind of understand that the back [TS]

01:26:21   workings of this but like as a user I [TS]

01:26:23   think it also might be helpful to know [TS]

01:26:25   like you know because the searches [TS]

01:26:27   usually pretty pretty poor if you're [TS]

01:26:30   looking for something decent [TS]

01:26:31   if an app is advertising there's a [TS]

01:26:34   better i think there's a there's a [TS]

01:26:35   better chance it's a decent app because [TS]

01:26:37   like all this happens that is like being [TS]

01:26:38   cared for it has a budget like or it has [TS]

01:26:40   a really good free-to-play hooks and [TS]

01:26:42   it's gonna it's a it's going to bankrupt [TS]

01:26:44   me my kids spend lots of money and I [TS]

01:26:46   mean obviously like you know games or [TS]

01:26:48   games or a different story here and and [TS]

01:26:49   games I i think we we don't usually when [TS]

01:26:52   we're talking about like act pricing and [TS]

01:26:54   issues and so I think we aren't usually [TS]

01:26:56   talking about games which is worth [TS]

01:26:58   clarifying because games are obviously [TS]

01:27:00   not only are they a massive part of the [TS]

01:27:03   app store and we should be talking about [TS]

01:27:05   them the majority of the appstore [TS]

01:27:06   exactly but but but they also work very [TS]

01:27:09   differently in a lot of different ways [TS]

01:27:10   and and so you know if you're thinking [TS]

01:27:13   if you're talking apps like yunnan game [TS]

01:27:16   apps if you're searching for something [TS]

01:27:18   to do something a certain type of app [TS]

01:27:20   whatever the one that advertises their [TS]

01:27:22   and this shows up there and that Apple [TS]

01:27:24   has deemed relevant to your search query [TS]

01:27:25   enough to show you that add that [TS]

01:27:28   honestly to me is is one signal of of [TS]

01:27:31   many that you should take with like [TS]

01:27:33   whether this is the this is the one you [TS]

01:27:35   look at or not you know because it's you [TS]

01:27:37   know it's like having a high-quality [TS]

01:27:38   icon or high quality screenshot so you [TS]

01:27:40   know or like you know having whether you [TS]

01:27:42   like garbage up your name with a whole [TS]

01:27:43   bunch of crap or whether you leave a [TS]

01:27:45   fairly clean like [TS]

01:27:46   it just is one signal of many that you [TS]

01:27:48   can use try to figure out when you're [TS]

01:27:51   searching for something [TS]

01:27:52   what should i do what should i look [TS]

01:27:53   further into then the search results [TS]

01:27:55   screen like you know what way to tap [TS]

01:27:57   into to glance at to evaluate and decide [TS]

01:27:59   whether to download or not an app that [TS]

01:28:01   has decided to pay for an ad and the can [TS]

01:28:03   pay for an ad and that is running an [TS]

01:28:05   active ad campaign and that Apple has [TS]

01:28:07   deemed relevant those are all useful [TS]

01:28:09   signals to use that same logic when you [TS]

01:28:11   do Google searches you click on the [TS]

01:28:12   first five things which are all ads I [TS]

01:28:14   don't do this which is anymore but but [TS]

01:28:16   oftentimes 4dr go i do pictures I don't [TS]

01:28:20   that guy I I'm to kc you use DuckDuckGo [TS]

01:28:23   you got all your photos and google [TS]

01:28:24   phones they have every picture your [TS]

01:28:26   family but you don't give them your [TS]

01:28:27   searches right because i actually think [TS]

01:28:29   that dr. go has been better for me those [TS]

01:28:31   those banks shortcuts whatever they call [TS]

01:28:34   them are the best those are great those [TS]

01:28:36   docs man that sucks really getting to [TS]

01:28:38   you they're really going now so it's [TS]

01:28:40   like but you know in general search [TS]

01:28:43   search result ads I do occasionally [TS]

01:28:45   click on because they are cases when i'm [TS]

01:28:47   looking for like you know it not every [TS]

01:28:50   time certainly but sometimes sometimes [TS]

01:28:52   when i search amazon amazon has like has [TS]

01:28:54   sponsored listings and like sponsor [TS]

01:28:56   alternatives to products [TS]

01:28:57   something-something on those two not all [TS]

01:29:00   the time but sometimes I you know I know [TS]

01:29:02   what that means [TS]

01:29:03   and I just so you know I i use that as [TS]

01:29:05   again one input of many to decide what [TS]

01:29:08   to do with these results i will see how [TS]

01:29:10   it works out i can see many scenarios in [TS]

01:29:12   which the people with the most money to [TS]

01:29:13   spawn spend on ads are going to be the [TS]

01:29:15   worst developers with the worst apps but [TS]

01:29:17   it's only one and realistically speaking [TS]

01:29:19   most of the time searching for a nap [TS]

01:29:21   because of the the technique that i am [TS]

01:29:23   already know exactly what I'm looking [TS]

01:29:24   for I don't spend a lot of time browsing [TS]

01:29:25   so maybe it's not particularly relevant [TS]

01:29:27   to my life but in general I don't really [TS]

01:29:30   like the idea of advertisements can [TS]

01:29:32   bring themselves into the store in this [TS]

01:29:35   way but you know if I can see the [TS]

01:29:38   potential upside for developers on many [TS]

01:29:40   fronts so if it helps more good [TS]

01:29:42   developers that helps bad developers I [TS]

01:29:44   guess the net win for users as well [TS]

01:29:46   yeah and and honestly if you think about [TS]

01:29:48   like big picture you know long-term [TS]

01:29:51   stuff here [TS]

01:29:52   I think not only does this make it [TS]

01:29:53   easier for less known developers to get [TS]

01:29:57   better known and it makes it way easier [TS]

01:29:59   to [TS]

01:30:00   launched a new app in a crowded category [TS]

01:30:02   but also long-term I think this helps [TS]

01:30:05   kind of support higher prices were like [TS]

01:30:08   if we if we're trying to move towards an [TS]

01:30:10   app store where developers have good [TS]

01:30:13   reasons to charge higher prices and can [TS]

01:30:15   sustain those prices [TS]

01:30:17   one of the ways you can get higher [TS]

01:30:18   prices is by getting your app in front [TS]

01:30:21   of a better targeted audience for people [TS]

01:30:24   to be to potentially buy it and so this [TS]

01:30:26   the as well help on that front also [TS]

01:30:28   developers want to consider the cost of [TS]

01:30:31   the ads when considering how to price [TS]

01:30:33   their apps will have how high they can [TS]

01:30:35   price them how how low they can afford [TS]

01:30:37   to price them are not afford to price [TS]

01:30:38   them this is all going to be kind of [TS]

01:30:40   added into the all this calculus and all [TS]

01:30:42   this marketing so like this will in [TS]

01:30:44   general I think helped slightly raised [TS]

01:30:47   at prices and better reward developers [TS]

01:30:51   who who can find a target market this [TS]

01:30:53   way I mean it's AI think i think this is [TS]

01:30:55   a really big move towards higher quality [TS]

01:30:59   more sustainable software and and making [TS]

01:31:01   it easier not harder for new developers [TS]

01:31:03   to break in the market [TS]

01:31:05   alright so a couple of quick points and [TS]

01:31:07   then we really need to get in some wdc [TS]

01:31:09   talk beta will be over the summer and [TS]

01:31:12   they're not going to charge people [TS]

01:31:13   during the beta they are not showing ads [TS]

01:31:15   to anyone 13 or younger which i think is [TS]

01:31:19   excellent and they're not going to do [TS]

01:31:23   any terribly crazy tracking outside of [TS]

01:31:26   location tracking which you cannot be [TS]

01:31:28   pretty easily turn off in settings so [TS]

01:31:30   this is I mean as advertising goes it's [TS]

01:31:34   a pretty Apple pretty classy approach to [TS]

01:31:37   it but it is still advertising in a [TS]

01:31:39   place that we may or may not want it so [TS]

01:31:42   we'll see but I'm hopeful I'm hopeful [TS]

01:31:45   mitt and this is like apples second move [TS]

01:31:48   into a second or third depending how you [TS]

01:31:50   can move into google style businesses [TS]

01:31:53   tried to do i add a serious kind of [TS]

01:31:56   google style thing and maybe this is [TS]

01:31:59   what you know google and facebook like [TS]

01:32:01   their businesses are based on this type [TS]

01:32:02   of thing and so it's about time because [TS]

01:32:05   certainly google has done tons of apple [TS]

01:32:07   style things including making their own [TS]

01:32:09   hardware and making a phone [TS]

01:32:10   and you know doing all this stuff and [TS]

01:32:11   trying to have a desktop operating [TS]

01:32:12   system and facebook name is calculus [TS]

01:32:15   with on the harbourfront then they try [TS]

01:32:17   to make a phone once to anyway [TS]

01:32:19   yeah you know what's good for the goose [TS]

01:32:21   is good for the gander it's nice to see [TS]

01:32:22   Apple like yeah I know it's nice to see [TS]

01:32:26   if I'm not that into the advertising but [TS]

01:32:28   like for so long it seems that every [TS]

01:32:30   other company was willing to try to do [TS]

01:32:31   the things that Apple was good at and [TS]

01:32:32   there were certain things that those [TS]

01:32:34   other companies that to make lots of [TS]

01:32:35   money that Apple decided but not worth [TS]

01:32:38   really looking into selling ads against [TS]

01:32:42   search is not a speculative business [TS]

01:32:44   model at this point it is it is a known [TS]

01:32:47   quantity and the fact that Apple just [TS]

01:32:49   didn't do it for so long [TS]

01:32:52   other than selling this Safari search [TS]

01:32:54   particle but that's kind of more of a [TS]

01:32:55   corporate thing and then an individual [TS]

01:32:57   building on keywords ya ever want to [TS]

01:33:00   make more money from services [TS]

01:33:02   this couldn't work out i saw someone [TS]

01:33:03   joking in the again on the the [TS]

01:33:05   pessimistic angle that the 1815 split [TS]

01:33:08   all the extra money that the developers [TS]

01:33:09   make will get fun right back into apple [TS]

01:33:11   in the form of thing for keyword search [TS]

01:33:13   ads but hey if that is a virtuous cycle [TS]

01:33:15   that it produces more and more revenue [TS]

01:33:17   and more and more customers i think [TS]

01:33:19   everyone will still be happy [TS]

01:33:20   yeah i agree let's talk to BBC swc it's [TS]

01:33:25   the thing that you two are going to that [TS]

01:33:26   I'm not [TS]

01:33:27   thanks for that uh-huh so this is [TS]

01:33:31   wednesday that we're recording the [TS]

01:33:33   eighth of june this coming monday the [TS]

01:33:36   13th of june is the big keynote and then [TS]

01:33:39   following the keynote as a developer [TS]

01:33:40   state of the union [TS]

01:33:41   so what are we expecting Apple will [TS]

01:33:44   announce we are hearing no hardware [TS]

01:33:46   we're hearing a lot of rumors about [TS]

01:33:49   Syrian OS 10 / a mac OS what are we [TS]

01:33:54   thinking let's start with Marco [TS]

01:33:55   basically you know its software update [TS]

01:33:58   that I think maybe the big thing you [TS]

01:33:59   know what what's new in iOS what's new [TS]

01:34:02   one on max what is new [TS]

01:34:04   no TV watching mean look apple now has [TS]

01:34:07   four platforms that they are hopefully [TS]

01:34:10   evolving at [TS]

01:34:11   at a steady pace you know like iOS is i [TS]

01:34:15   mean i would imagine it's got a slow at [TS]

01:34:17   some point going to mature at some point [TS]

01:34:19   but you know apple always pushes that [TS]

01:34:20   one really hard [TS]

01:34:22   the ipad is probably has like separate [TS]

01:34:24   enhancements for multitasking and [TS]

01:34:25   everything so that's it was gonna be [TS]

01:34:28   like probably especially example still [TS]

01:34:29   is pushing the ipad hard trying to try [TS]

01:34:32   to save its its sales decline so you [TS]

01:34:35   know I expect to see major time and [TS]

01:34:38   energy devoted to ipad software [TS]

01:34:39   improvements for pro use in all [TS]

01:34:42   likelihood things like multitasking [TS]

01:34:44   so you know what's new on the iphone [TS]

01:34:46   that's gonna take some big stuff [TS]

01:34:47   what's new in mac OS 12 well you know [TS]

01:34:50   that's that's obviously going to be a [TS]

01:34:52   part of it [TS]

01:34:52   anything that's new you know if there's [TS]

01:34:54   you know any new major underlying [TS]

01:34:56   technologies any new method of storing [TS]

01:35:00   files on the on the local disk John you [TS]

01:35:04   know if there's anything you know it [TS]

01:35:06   shared technology that's gonna get some [TS]

01:35:08   time and then you gotta figure like this [TS]

01:35:10   is going to be the first WTC since the [TS]

01:35:14   appletv was launched [TS]

01:35:15   it's probably going to be something [TS]

01:35:18   Apple TV lady no major new stuff and [TS]

01:35:20   apple TV OS whatever tos and then I i [TS]

01:35:25   honestly hope there's significant [TS]

01:35:27   changes to watch us too because I'm [TS]

01:35:28   sorry you're out you're out of time in [TS]

01:35:30   the keynote exactly like you know they [TS]

01:35:33   they invited us to all this like [TS]

01:35:34   developer after changes today because [TS]

01:35:36   you know if you think about like all the [TS]

01:35:38   software platforms that need to go into [TS]

01:35:40   that keynote at that are especially the [TS]

01:35:42   ones that are still fairly young like [TS]

01:35:44   ipad pro and TV OS and watch us that [TS]

01:35:47   still have like lots of room for major [TS]

01:35:49   improvements I i think it's gonna be a [TS]

01:35:51   pretty funky not to mention if they [TS]

01:35:53   actually shovin the app music updated [TS]

01:35:55   damage was rumored I hope they don't but [TS]

01:35:57   I think they probably will you know if [TS]

01:35:59   they actually shove that in there too [TS]

01:36:00   that that takes even more time and then [TS]

01:36:02   we know try to keep the keynotes to [TS]

01:36:03   under two hours so like I think it's [TS]

01:36:05   gonna be you know software updates the [TS]

01:36:07   whole thing basically software software [TS]

01:36:09   it's almost the whole time and then [TS]

01:36:10   maybe maybe a little bit for Apple music [TS]

01:36:12   and and that's that's two hours easily [TS]

01:36:14   the thing I'm most interested in is [TS]

01:36:17   there's been a humongous push towards [TS]

01:36:20   cloud data and big data and in [TS]

01:36:23   processing [TS]

01:36:24   yo huge quantities of data in doing its [TS]

01:36:28   server side like Google photos as a [TS]

01:36:30   great example and i'm really curious to [TS]

01:36:32   see and actually alexa from amazon Kurt [TS]

01:36:35   really curious to see what is Apple's [TS]

01:36:38   answer to this or maybe even not answer [TS]

01:36:41   but what is their approach to solving [TS]

01:36:43   similar problems and they're not even [TS]

01:36:45   necessarily with photos but just in [TS]

01:36:48   general everyone who has Alexis seems to [TS]

01:36:50   fall in love with her [TS]

01:36:51   so what is Apple doing with Siri or [TS]

01:36:55   inequivalent technology to to keep our [TS]

01:36:58   attention on products that they create [TS]

01:37:00   and I don't know what it's gonna be but [TS]

01:37:03   I'm very curious to see what they do in [TS]

01:37:07   that department because I suspect [TS]

01:37:08   they're going to do something that that [TS]

01:37:10   is a little bit different than everyone [TS]

01:37:12   else a little bit more apple than [TS]

01:37:14   everyone else which is obvious but [TS]

01:37:16   something that we didn't really expect [TS]

01:37:17   in and I'm looking forward to seeing [TS]

01:37:19   what that is here Marco make his a [TS]

01:37:21   snarky filesystem comment about new ways [TS]

01:37:24   of storing it's the disk or whatever we [TS]

01:37:28   realize they were all entering the the [TS]

01:37:31   the the age where we say things like I'm [TS]

01:37:34   gonna did you tape that on TV I think we [TS]

01:37:36   also taped you guys say tape that you [TS]

01:37:38   should take that not I know what you're [TS]

01:37:40   saying but I think I usually say record [TS]

01:37:42   and you may be past that but I'm [TS]

01:37:44   borderline in my generation we all take [TS]

01:37:46   things you know and it doesn't make any [TS]

01:37:48   sense because for such a long time we [TS]

01:37:50   haven't been using VCRs for anything [TS]

01:37:52   that has actual tape so we still on [TS]

01:37:54   phones and even you watch the WC [TS]

01:37:56   presentations unless it's being done by [TS]

01:37:58   a very young person will talk about you [TS]

01:38:01   know dis guy or writing things the disc [TS]

01:38:03   there's no disc never has been a disk in [TS]

01:38:04   a phone right as in a round thing that [TS]

01:38:07   spins but we still say disk so disc is [TS]

01:38:09   the new tape [TS]

01:38:10   what else is new anyway speaking of that [TS]

01:38:12   you know if they want to know fossil [TS]

01:38:15   that's fine [TS]

01:38:16   like whatever I still say 2017 is you're [TS]

01:38:19   not going to see this thing on people's [TS]

01:38:20   computers so 27 but you want to announce [TS]

01:38:22   the early i'm all for it [TS]

01:38:24   bring it on any way to more serious [TS]

01:38:26   predictions [TS]

01:38:27   I'm really said if the always rumors [TS]

01:38:29   about no hardware going to be our true [TS]

01:38:31   because I'm excited about hardware but [TS]

01:38:34   you know what can you do if it's just [TS]

01:38:35   the obvious ones are [TS]

01:38:37   no the the mac and iOS updates because [TS]

01:38:39   we know the iOS upstate like whatever we [TS]

01:38:42   know that's happening the mac one we [TS]

01:38:44   also kind of know what's happening you [TS]

01:38:45   know about a rebrand we know about [TS]

01:38:46   cerium on on the Mac I don't know what [TS]

01:38:50   other features are going to mix that [TS]

01:38:50   that's all well and good [TS]

01:38:52   based on the the marketing and the [TS]

01:38:57   design of the WTC site and also all the [TS]

01:39:00   activity on swift evolution which has [TS]

01:39:02   been totally out in the open [TS]

01:39:03   surely there will be stuff in there [TS]

01:39:04   about the new version of Swift I mean we [TS]

01:39:06   have we already know everything about [TS]

01:39:07   two or three look at the mentalist all [TS]

01:39:09   public you know what's going to be in [TS]

01:39:10   that I don't think it's gonna be any [TS]

01:39:11   surprises they're like oh there's a [TS]

01:39:12   secret Peter Swift three that we didn't [TS]

01:39:13   reveal maybe one or two minor ones like [TS]

01:39:16   that but nothing earth-shattering but [TS]

01:39:17   they will emphasize that you know it [TS]

01:39:19   will get a slider too and the keynote [TS]

01:39:20   and much more in the state of the union [TS]

01:39:21   hey if you haven't been paying attention [TS]

01:39:22   Swift 3 is actually pretty difference [TS]

01:39:24   with 2.2 in a bunch of ways they're [TS]

01:39:25   gonna break your apps but don't worry ! [TS]

01:39:27   for you [TS]

01:39:28   well in speaking of xcode you know you [TS]

01:39:31   said that you there's not a lot of [TS]

01:39:32   surprises they can have with regard to [TS]

01:39:33   Swift because it's all out in the open [TS]

01:39:35   and i agree but they could certainly [TS]

01:39:37   have some surprises around xcode for [TS]

01:39:39   example much better switch support for [TS]

01:39:41   example syntax highlighting that doesn't [TS]

01:39:43   crash constantly for example segfaults [TS]

01:39:46   11 going away maybe crashes even more is [TS]

01:39:50   that a feature a bucket historically [TS]

01:39:52   speaking they've done a lot of changes [TS]

01:39:53   to 2x go to support Swift and not all of [TS]

01:39:56   them have reduced the number of crashes [TS]

01:39:57   yeah so we'll see i would love God what [TS]

01:40:01   I ever loved to have some improvements [TS]

01:40:03   tax code with regard to Swift and [TS]

01:40:05   actually I like xcode I don't I don't [TS]

01:40:07   begrudge it like so many people seem to [TS]

01:40:09   perhaps because i haven't been using it [TS]

01:40:11   long enough but they're definitely [TS]

01:40:13   annoyances that I run into pretty much [TS]

01:40:15   daily that I would read typically around [TS]

01:40:18   Swift that I would love to see improved [TS]

01:40:20   so fingers crossed your mind that you're [TS]

01:40:23   pretty much guaranteed to get that [TS]

01:40:24   there's going to be a new version of [TS]

01:40:25   xcode it's going to have better Swift [TS]

01:40:26   supports going to fewer bugs going to be [TS]

01:40:28   faster it's going to support all the [TS]

01:40:29   news but like that's going to happen it [TS]

01:40:30   happens every year that's gonna happen [TS]

01:40:32   as well it's also that's also give me I [TS]

01:40:34   think the wild cards for me are again [TS]

01:40:38   still sticking the software watching TV [TS]

01:40:40   I don't know first water how much room [TS]

01:40:43   there is it the things i just listed [TS]

01:40:44   you're already at the point where you [TS]

01:40:46   have room for maybe one or two more [TS]

01:40:48   segments how much can you really say [TS]

01:40:50   about why [TS]

01:40:50   NTV i also have a hundred the impression [TS]

01:40:53   that one of those two platforms is not [TS]

01:40:55   going to have that much knew about it I [TS]

01:40:57   just don't know which one it is right i [TS]

01:40:58   hope its TV because the newer one and [TS]

01:41:00   the watch could really use some some TLC [TS]

01:41:04   but i'm not quite sure what to expect [TS]

01:41:07   their TV doesn't really need a whole lot [TS]

01:41:10   right now like but it needs a lot of [TS]

01:41:13   things in a remote but they're not going [TS]

01:41:14   to announce that WC yeah like that that [TS]

01:41:16   would be a fall harbor update thing ate [TS]

01:41:18   and I honestly I'm not expecting the [TS]

01:41:20   appletv updated every year i'm guessing [TS]

01:41:23   we don't get a new one this fall i'm [TS]

01:41:24   guessing maybe some two-year cycle but [TS]

01:41:26   we will see that that's we'll talk about [TS]

01:41:28   that later but the teeth tdos in general [TS]

01:41:31   like it's it's fine it's it's not you [TS]

01:41:33   know it's not perfect but it's fine [TS]

01:41:35   the watch really needs a lot of help in [TS]

01:41:37   a lot of areas and and it's also as you [TS]

01:41:39   said it's also the older platform so I [TS]

01:41:42   would expect i hope that if they if [TS]

01:41:45   they're trying to figure out how to [TS]

01:41:47   allocate resources here I hope watch OS [TS]

01:41:49   gets more attention a reality from what [TS]

01:41:52   i've heard watch us is still like a very [TS]

01:41:55   separate team from the rest of the [TS]

01:41:56   organization but I i really hope we see [TS]

01:41:59   something significant from watch us and [TS]

01:42:02   I think we will i think i think the time [TS]

01:42:03   is right [TS]

01:42:04   anything didn't have time to do like a [TS]

01:42:06   whole rethink and revamping just a [TS]

01:42:07   custom watch faces to get a lot of [TS]

01:42:08   applause everybody comes out smiling [TS]

01:42:10   right doesn't take much you know like [TS]

01:42:12   because that's a significant enough [TS]

01:42:14   feature where they don't have time to [TS]

01:42:15   really delve into all the details of how [TS]

01:42:18   water is the role of the watching balls [TS]

01:42:19   off you just do custom watched races [TS]

01:42:21   that opens up such a market and people [TS]

01:42:23   will attend the sessions and everyone [TS]

01:42:25   want to make one and people have watches [TS]

01:42:26   will be excited about the idea that's [TS]

01:42:28   just you know i'm not saying that I'm [TS]

01:42:30   not predicting this is something going [TS]

01:42:31   to do but all you need is one [TS]

01:42:33   announcement of that caliber it will [TS]

01:42:34   tamp down a lot of the grumbling and I [TS]

01:42:37   don't think they have I don't think we [TS]

01:42:38   have time even the presentation if [TS]

01:42:40   they've totally thought watch OS like a [TS]

01:42:42   Marco style we think we're like you know [TS]

01:42:44   we've learned a lot from years of work [TS]

01:42:46   and turns out we were totally wrong [TS]

01:42:47   about a hundred ways that people use [TS]

01:42:49   their watches I don't know if you have [TS]

01:42:50   time to talk about that with everything [TS]

01:42:51   else because the my final prediction is [TS]

01:42:53   like if this is ready [TS]

01:42:55   this will be a cornerstone of the [TS]

01:42:57   presentation which is really no series [TS]

01:42:59   coming to the mac and everything but [TS]

01:43:00   like if there is a radically new better [TS]

01:43:02   version of Siri which I really hope [TS]

01:43:04   there is I think Apple that will be a [TS]

01:43:07   fairly big leg on the stool that is this [TS]

01:43:09   presentation just if not just simply [TS]

01:43:11   because those things are prominent now [TS]

01:43:13   with the echo and with uh Alexa and with [TS]

01:43:17   google i/o lean so heavily on that and [TS]

01:43:20   with the rumors of apple improving serie [TS]

01:43:22   they will spend time in the keynote [TS]

01:43:25   saying series better than ever and i [TS]

01:43:29   think they have to just show that they [TS]

01:43:31   are still there still relevant in that [TS]

01:43:33   market they were one of the the pioneers [TS]

01:43:35   in that market and they everyone else [TS]

01:43:38   seemed to be eclipsing they have to say [TS]

01:43:39   that at least say hey we're still here [TS]

01:43:41   and I think that would be what they [TS]

01:43:42   would like to say is in fact the new [TS]

01:43:45   version of Siri is the most amazing [TS]

01:43:46   thing you've ever seen and we're going [TS]

01:43:47   to burn a lot of keynote time showing [TS]

01:43:49   you the most people talking to a [TS]

01:43:51   computer that they hope to god listens [TS]

01:43:52   to them and doesn't want to do live on [TS]

01:43:55   stage right so I don't know anything [TS]

01:43:57   about whether a amazing new suit version [TS]

01:43:59   series ready but if it is i think that's [TS]

01:44:01   going to get a lot of time so my vision [TS]

01:44:03   this keynote I see lots of software [TS]

01:44:05   every single update has something that [TS]

01:44:07   you like and tentpole features the [TS]

01:44:12   really new version of Siri Swift in the [TS]

01:44:15   new version of xcode is that the little [TS]

01:44:16   developer nugget and then some of the [TS]

01:44:18   wild card for maybe watch or something [TS]

01:44:20   else not even thinking of [TS]

01:44:21   yeah i forgot about Cirie but that's [TS]

01:44:23   obviously you're totally right and they [TS]

01:44:24   like you know in the current landscape [TS]

01:44:26   they they need to say something about [TS]

01:44:29   series so I i'm totally with you i think [TS]

01:44:31   i think they will present a new a new [TS]

01:44:35   version of Syria that appears to be very [TS]

01:44:37   much improved whether it is actually [TS]

01:44:39   very much improved we don't know yet and [TS]

01:44:41   it might not be but they I think they [TS]

01:44:44   will definitely presented as if it is [TS]

01:44:46   regardless and if there's an API even [TS]

01:44:49   better i really really hope there is a [TS]

01:44:51   serious pii think we are way past due [TS]

01:44:54   for that but that's part of the number [TS]

01:44:56   of Siri not just that listens to better [TS]

01:44:57   with it and it's like those other ones [TS]

01:44:59   where they all have api's an apple [TS]

01:45:00   doesn't yet yeah i mean if if there's [TS]

01:45:02   really an API to Siri that and in and [TS]

01:45:04   it's done in a way that you know maps [TS]

01:45:06   can actually take advantage of not just [TS]

01:45:08   like a handful of contain China use [TS]

01:45:09   cases but like if it's done well and if [TS]

01:45:11   it done broadly so the lots of apps can [TS]

01:45:13   use it for good for lots of good things [TS]

01:45:16   it almost wouldn't matter how [TS]

01:45:17   whether the weather underlying service [TS]

01:45:18   improved at all otherwise or not like [TS]

01:45:20   that would be enough that is that is [TS]

01:45:22   such a big deal to do that that would [TS]

01:45:24   certainly be a much better Cirie and i [TS]

01:45:26   think the last year i think maybe the [TS]

01:45:29   past I think my track record for WC [TS]

01:45:31   predictions the week before have been [TS]

01:45:32   awful like that I just like totally [TS]

01:45:34   wrong about everything thats my that [TS]

01:45:37   just take that in Council is much easier [TS]

01:45:39   for me to do the next thing which is [TS]

01:45:41   like which announcements would you must [TS]

01:45:43   be excited about and the more I think [TS]

01:45:44   about it the more I think that I would [TS]

01:45:46   actually be more excited by new macro [TS]

01:45:48   the new file system not because i think [TS]

01:45:50   the new mac pro's more need there's a [TS]

01:45:51   new file system but because that because [TS]

01:45:54   like the Last Guardian I'm willing to [TS]

01:45:56   wait till you know I don't have to wait [TS]

01:45:58   to 2017 Last Guardian right guys 2016 [TS]

01:46:00   anyway I'm willing to wait 20 17 is my [TS]

01:46:03   file system year I'm filing it away it's [TS]

01:46:05   over there 2017 new file system if you [TS]

01:46:08   want to announce in a fine but if not i [TS]

01:46:09   will be broken up but this is the year [TS]

01:46:11   of the new mac pro if you're going to [TS]

01:46:12   keep making the mac pro it's time so i [TS]

01:46:14   will that is the b.s announcement that [TS]

01:46:17   WC will get me personally the most [TS]

01:46:19   excited is new mac pro not probably [TS]

01:46:21   nothing but most excited to almost [TS]

01:46:23   anyone else in the entire audience [TS]

01:46:24   especially Casey but that's that's what [TS]

01:46:27   I want if they do new fascism and not [TS]

01:46:30   the mac pro i'll be like you couldn't [TS]

01:46:32   save the process until next year [TS]

01:46:34   give me the mac pro this year because [TS]

01:46:35   the honestly a new faucet is not going [TS]

01:46:36   to help anybody not going to help my [TS]

01:46:38   poor 2008 mac pro right now like its new [TS]

01:46:40   faucets not even are probably run on it [TS]

01:46:42   will maybe on the SSD but anyway I want [TS]

01:46:45   a new mac pro in this completely [TS]

01:46:47   hardware freaky no time almost certainly [TS]

01:46:49   not going to get one but that's my [TS]

01:46:50   pie-in-the-sky dream but if you could [TS]

01:46:51   pick any feasible announcement for WC is [TS]

01:46:54   your number one what would it be [TS]

01:46:56   that's a really good question hmm maybe [TS]

01:47:01   if we already got like you know [TS]

01:47:02   substantial app store business model [TS]

01:47:04   changes today so yeah you can pick that [TS]

01:47:06   one died was said becomes unfeasible [TS]

01:47:08   because they were there they recommend [TS]

01:47:10   this announcement said no longer [TS]

01:47:11   feasible that they can't do them but [TS]

01:47:13   it's just that you got them right here [TS]

01:47:14   talking just keynote not like the whole [TS]

01:47:16   conference just keynote announcements [TS]

01:47:18   basically yeah mu1 the wild-card that [TS]

01:47:21   people are asking for the people are [TS]

01:47:22   predicting possibly is some kind of [TS]

01:47:25   developer tools for the ipad of xcode or [TS]

01:47:27   playgrounds or something else you know [TS]

01:47:28   some kind of developer story for ipad [TS]

01:47:30   last [TS]

01:47:30   year or the year before I thought they [TS]

01:47:31   were gonna announce that I fully expect [TS]

01:47:33   has arrived Sunday but i haven't heard [TS]

01:47:34   enough around like to think this is the [TS]

01:47:36   year but who knows [TS]

01:47:37   yeah that's I mean it eventually will [TS]

01:47:39   you know what's that will be the scope [TS]

01:47:40   of it like if they wanted to bring just [TS]

01:47:42   Swift playgrounds you didn't do just [TS]

01:47:46   that to the ipad without like the whole [TS]

01:47:48   developer tools stack that's obviously a [TS]

01:47:50   much smaller problem set to bring over [TS]

01:47:52   and that is more plausible like you just [TS]

01:47:54   have playgrounds to bring over like [TS]

01:47:57   xcode for the ipad yeah i think people [TS]

01:48:00   who are predicting that maybe don't [TS]

01:48:01   understand or don't know quite how [TS]

01:48:04   complex of a job that would be because [TS]

01:48:05   it isn't just like the xcode interface [TS]

01:48:08   it's the entire system of you know the [TS]

01:48:12   massive ecosystem ends and pile of tools [TS]

01:48:16   and frameworks and everything that goes [TS]

01:48:18   under xcode everything xcode is like [TS]

01:48:20   calling out to 22 all the work and and [TS]

01:48:24   all these build tools and integration [TS]

01:48:26   with other things that are part of [TS]

01:48:27   people's build needs and everything like [TS]

01:48:28   it it's so complex to bring over all of [TS]

01:48:31   xcode I don't think it's going to happen [TS]

01:48:33   in the near future because it just [TS]

01:48:34   depends on its common I think it's [TS]

01:48:36   pretty near there's a reason i pad press [TS]

01:48:38   four gigs like if I'm not saying it's [TS]

01:48:41   going to be this year but i think is [TS]

01:48:42   totally feasible this year and next year [TS]

01:48:44   is when you should really be on the [TS]

01:48:45   lookout if it doesn't happen this year [TS]

01:48:46   because i think it's coming full on [TS]

01:48:48   xcode or just like a playground [TS]

01:48:50   equivalent obviously it will be a [TS]

01:48:51   different application you can have a [TS]

01:48:52   short nose and everything right but like [TS]

01:48:54   all those tools that mark was talking [TS]

01:48:56   about like I said that so I think that's [TS]

01:48:58   why the ipad pro is for geeks whilst the [TS]

01:48:59   ipad pro 4 gigs doesn't make any sense [TS]

01:49:01   unless unless it is allowing for a class [TS]

01:49:03   of application that does not yet exist [TS]

01:49:04   on the ipad and one of those classes of [TS]

01:49:07   applications would be a ever-so-slightly [TS]

01:49:10   cut-down version of xcode i don't know i [TS]

01:49:12   think it has that much ram just so i can [TS]

01:49:13   multitask efficiently and well but why [TS]

01:49:16   doesn't mine up for geeks I like the [TS]

01:49:19   multipath no I I think I think long-term [TS]

01:49:22   xcode will you know or did you know [TS]

01:49:24   developer tools will come to the ipad [TS]

01:49:27   but i don't think we're there yet [TS]

01:49:28   because it is such a big job playground [TS]

01:49:31   was it some kind of like very cut down [TS]

01:49:34   subset of it maybe but like whatever we [TS]

01:49:38   would call like it's something that we [TS]

01:49:39   would consider xcode or equivalent can [TS]

01:49:42   you make an apple [TS]

01:49:43   on the app star maybe but they're so I [TS]

01:49:47   mean there's so much there that that is [TS]

01:49:51   that you need for the platform to [TS]

01:49:53   support that it just doesn't yet or that [TS]

01:49:55   it does very clinically so far for [TS]

01:49:57   developer tools but it wouldn't have to [TS]

01:49:59   be sandbox you know it would be the one [TS]

01:50:01   happen to you no rules would apply to [TS]

01:50:03   that like know but it's so I mean it's [TS]

01:50:05   so much to bring over and so much change [TS]

01:50:08   and so much that like you know that [TS]

01:50:10   people don't worry if you just think [TS]

01:50:12   about the idea just if you start out [TS]

01:50:14   there you realize like quite how much [TS]

01:50:16   more is involved like until you really [TS]

01:50:17   start thinking about okay well let's [TS]

01:50:19   bring over things like version control [TS]

01:50:20   and package management and all the [TS]

01:50:22   compilers all the linkers all the [TS]

01:50:23   libraries and all the tools and i think [TS]

01:50:25   that i think i think they're all running [TS]

01:50:26   for gigs [TS]

01:50:27   oh geez I mean it's your menu compile [TS]

01:50:29   times will not be good know right i [TS]

01:50:32   don't know any of its already slow on [TS]

01:50:35   like an imac he goes into building [TS]

01:50:37   bricks with project it's not it's not [TS]

01:50:39   fast you know it's something like I [TS]

01:50:41   think you know long-term I think we'll [TS]

01:50:43   probably get there but I i would not [TS]

01:50:45   expect this to be imminent you know [TS]

01:50:47   unless it is it only a very cut-down [TS]

01:50:49   version like playgrounds only yeah i [TS]

01:50:52   agree i had a vision in the audience was [TS]

01:50:55   announced in my vision was xcode for [TS]

01:50:57   ipad and now just because i had that [TS]

01:50:58   vision I feel like it's closer than [TS]

01:51:00   other people but it doesn't make it any [TS]

01:51:02   way that wouldn't be your most exciting [TS]

01:51:03   still haven't said but what you'd be [TS]

01:51:05   most excited about this feasible i guess [TS]

01:51:08   it would probably be mac pro plus 5k but [TS]

01:51:10   I i think it's a no Apple PR has been so [TS]

01:51:13   clearly leaking to everybody that [TS]

01:51:15   there's not gonna be any new hardware so [TS]

01:51:17   I think that's still still feasible that [TS]

01:51:19   you can have that as your pic i had it [TS]

01:51:20   is you know what i would do I would even [TS]

01:51:22   argue it's not feasible because Apple PR [TS]

01:51:24   has basically said it's not happening [TS]

01:51:26   I mean like technically feasible like [TS]

01:51:28   the reason that the appstore changes are [TS]

01:51:29   feasible because they already did that [TS]

01:51:31   not because you like you know anyway if [TS]

01:51:33   you want to pick that I would have [TS]

01:51:35   picked for you watch her out but you [TS]

01:51:36   don't wear the watch them are never mind [TS]

01:51:37   you were so excited about watch races [TS]

01:51:39   until you stop wearing well and you know [TS]

01:51:41   i would certainly be interested in [TS]

01:51:43   developing watch faces i but i think i [TS]

01:51:45   would be I'd be more interested if the [TS]

01:51:48   watch hardware also changed have some [TS]

01:51:50   kind of always-on screen mode because [TS]

01:51:52   that like what what now I've gotten [TS]

01:51:54   accustomed to the regular watches [TS]

01:51:56   the one thing I really they really [TS]

01:51:58   irritates me when I when I go back to [TS]

01:52:00   the apple watch for like a day here [TS]

01:52:01   there is the that the face isn't always [TS]

01:52:04   on so I can glance out you have to wait [TS]

01:52:06   for it to turn on and sometimes it [TS]

01:52:08   doesn't and you know it like that it [TS]

01:52:10   adding that level of adding that amount [TS]

01:52:11   of friction to every little interaction [TS]

01:52:13   that when your lesson [TS]

01:52:14   listen you're watching you aren't used [TS]

01:52:15   to it is is very just kinda just grinds [TS]

01:52:19   like it just it just kinda it's [TS]

01:52:21   irritating you know so for me to get [TS]

01:52:24   back into wearing the apple watch and [TS]

01:52:26   and using it for any meaningful amount [TS]

01:52:28   of time I would need I think to change [TS]

01:52:31   out the first I would want custom watch [TS]

01:52:33   faces and excited and I want to make my [TS]

01:52:34   own of course and then second i would [TS]

01:52:37   want some kind of always-on screen and I [TS]

01:52:39   don't I just don't think that's feasible [TS]

01:52:40   this year you know that maybe maybe in [TS]

01:52:43   any hardware event later this year or [TS]

01:52:45   next year when our new watches unveiled [TS]

01:52:47   maybe then but honestly given given the [TS]

01:52:50   state of the watch hardware and software [TS]

01:52:52   today it doesn't seem like an always-on [TS]

01:52:55   screen mode is is even in the plans but [TS]

01:52:57   I don't know why your inability to pick [TS]

01:53:00   one is in keeping with your top for [TS]

01:53:02   performance exactly what it is you're i [TS]

01:53:05   will partially not pick three options [TS]

01:53:07   here [TS]

01:53:07   hey your feasible announcement they [TS]

01:53:10   would you be most excited about [TS]

01:53:12   mmm SI topics far i don't know i mean i [TS]

01:53:19   can have answers to both of you going I [TS]

01:53:20   already gave marcos answer should be on [TS]

01:53:22   the watch face one cases answer is the [TS]

01:53:25   the new macbook pro now because I'm not [TS]

01:53:29   gonna get 1i know what you would be most [TS]

01:53:31   excited about you want one you know you [TS]

01:53:33   shouldn't get one you feel ashamed but [TS]

01:53:35   you'd be like all those are awesome and [TS]