The Accidental Tech Podcast

170: Casey Beats John, 29–29


00:00:00   that is the challenge of pixel art isn't [TS]

00:00:01   it to make a picture look good using [TS]

00:00:04   pixels or we could rotate the pixels 45 [TS]

00:00:06   degrees and pretends i'm crazy land [TS]

00:00:09   hey everyone just me for a second we [TS]

00:00:12   just put up our 2016 t-shirts [TS]

00:00:14   finally they're only available until [TS]

00:00:16   june third and they won't be delivered [TS]

00:00:18   in time 4wd see because we took too long [TS]

00:00:20   to decide but these are awesome and I [TS]

00:00:22   think they're gonna be worth the wait [TS]

00:00:24   so see for yourself at ATP dot FM / [TS]

00:00:27   shirt [TS]

00:00:28   thanks a lot hashtag Casey was right [TS]

00:00:33   maybe it's it's been stunning watching [TS]

00:00:37   the fallout from fast food gate 2016 [TS]

00:00:40   which I just coined moments ago a lot of [TS]

00:00:44   people have been on my side I wouldn't [TS]

00:00:46   say it's it's overwhelming but the fact [TS]

00:00:48   that i think the feedback I've seen has [TS]

00:00:50   been roughly 5050 [TS]

00:00:52   I'm counting that as a win for me I hit [TS]

00:00:54   that little bit of my wedding works [TS]

00:00:56   exactly roughly 5050 and I declare [TS]

00:00:59   victory now that would John if there's [TS]

00:01:02   one universal truth to the internet it's [TS]

00:01:05   that the internet believes that John [TS]

00:01:07   siracusa can do not know how does not a [TS]

00:01:08   universe that is fact here its own if [TS]

00:01:12   perhaps that's neither here nor there [TS]

00:01:15   the the internet is of the belief that [TS]

00:01:17   John circus can do no wrong and parts of [TS]

00:01:21   the internet have said John staircases [TS]

00:01:24   done wrong and actually it's funny [TS]

00:01:26   because some people and this is not a [TS]

00:01:28   joke [TS]

00:01:29   some people have written in and said and [TS]

00:01:31   I don't have an exact verbatim quote in [TS]

00:01:32   front of me but something along the [TS]

00:01:33   lines up I thought John could never be [TS]

00:01:36   wrong but he's wrong about this food [TS]

00:01:38   conversation which has made me so happy [TS]

00:01:42   so to clarify John being wrong means [TS]

00:01:45   that people think subway is better than [TS]

00:01:48   sbarros is that is that what yes or is [TS]

00:01:51   not in utter unequivocal abomination [TS]

00:01:54   well as in all things like the the [TS]

00:01:56   actual points that people respond to [TS]

00:01:57   wear only tangentially related two [TS]

00:01:59   points made by the most solid ones were [TS]

00:02:03   I felt like four people were just saying [TS]

00:02:05   I like or don't like a particular [TS]

00:02:07   restaurant that's fair that's fair right [TS]

00:02:09   and because then you get all right but [TS]

00:02:11   we were talking about restaurants you [TS]

00:02:12   could say [TS]

00:02:13   I loves a boy or I hate subway i love [TS]

00:02:15   the bar I hate so far right but the ones [TS]

00:02:17   who came away with the conclusion that [TS]

00:02:19   there was that the comparisons were made [TS]

00:02:21   they were actually not made for example [TS]

00:02:23   comparing subway and tomorrow and what [TS]

00:02:25   you would rather eat in a show in which [TS]

00:02:27   I said I you know our mcdonalds even the [TS]

00:02:29   show which I said I eat subway more than [TS]

00:02:31   mcdonalds and yet you have people saying [TS]

00:02:32   that that meant the mcdonalds was better [TS]

00:02:34   than subway or are somewhat better than [TS]

00:02:36   mcdonalds anyway lots of people watching [TS]

00:02:38   on to their own particular competitions [TS]

00:02:40   but i would say in the realm of subways [TS]

00:02:42   good subways bad [TS]

00:02:44   tomorrow's good sbarros bad where they [TS]

00:02:46   didn't try to compare the two of them it [TS]

00:02:48   was about 50 50 and it's like the which [TS]

00:02:50   i just googled the 1960s yell vs hard [TS]

00:02:52   football game which was listed in the [TS]

00:02:54   newspaper going to find this all right [TS]

00:02:58   here is the famous headline which they [TS]

00:02:59   bury in the last sentence of the [TS]

00:03:01   paragraph they headline after this [TS]

00:03:03   football game and 268 was Harvard BTL [TS]

00:03:06   2929 it was a game that ended in a tie [TS]

00:03:10   so this is yeah Casey beats John 50-50 [TS]

00:03:13   split [TS]

00:03:14   I'll take it I'm good with that you're [TS]

00:03:16   not going to be complete anyway I would [TS]

00:03:18   just point out that literally all these [TS]

00:03:21   issues are a matter of taste in all [TS]

00:03:23   senses of that word so they're there can [TS]

00:03:25   be no victory unless one of these food [TS]

00:03:27   items uh is going to kill you which I [TS]

00:03:30   don't think that one well that's true [TS]

00:03:32   these issues are a matter of taste but [TS]

00:03:33   my tastes better than your taste well [TS]

00:03:35   that's how it tastes works doesn't it [TS]

00:03:36   but anyway it's not that there isn't [TS]

00:03:38   definitive answer [TS]

00:03:39   you know I mean goodness yet but a but [TS]

00:03:42   I'd i will take the John be a John loses [TS]

00:03:45   to kc 5050 or Casey beats John 5050 are [TS]

00:03:49   you 21 you do one to 1 out of 50 50 [TS]

00:03:51   producing as percentages but since this [TS]

00:03:52   is a football scores points so maybe [TS]

00:03:54   it's one-to-one yeah I I'll take me [TS]

00:03:56   beating you with the tie that that is [TS]

00:03:59   good in my book anyway just so you know [TS]

00:04:01   since you don't read my ad mentions [TS]

00:04:02   every time i say anything somebody says [TS]

00:04:04   boy usually agree with what you say but [TS]

00:04:06   you're really wrong about X that happens [TS]

00:04:07   all the time that's like fifty percent [TS]

00:04:09   of my replies are people calling me [TS]

00:04:11   usually agree with me but they disagree [TS]

00:04:13   with me about insert whatever and [TS]

00:04:15   whatever you can think of has been there [TS]

00:04:17   yeah but to be fair people start from [TS]

00:04:20   the position of Oh John is right about [TS]

00:04:22   this [TS]

00:04:23   whereas without turning this into analog [TS]

00:04:25   I'm not as convinced people [TS]

00:04:27   go that way about me well then you're [TS]

00:04:28   spared all the all the tweets about [TS]

00:04:30   however and so disappointed in you every [TS]

00:04:31   time yet another great things usually [TS]

00:04:33   agree with everything you say Casey but [TS]

00:04:35   very disappointed in your opinion on the [TS]

00:04:36   windows XP bumper sound or cars or the [TS]

00:04:40   restaurant you want to go to or your [TS]

00:04:42   choice of you know and any other thing [TS]

00:04:45   you possibly anyway uh yeah you're right [TS]

00:04:47   those those replies do show a sort of [TS]

00:04:50   the baseline assumption but another hand [TS]

00:04:53   if that based on assumption doesn't [TS]

00:04:54   exist i don't get those tweets there's [TS]

00:04:56   that but all I'm gonna say is I will [TS]

00:04:58   take your struggle which is also real [TS]

00:05:00   over looking for me haha anyway but no [TS]

00:05:04   other I'm really happy that we kept in [TS]

00:05:07   that we / Marco kept that conversation [TS]

00:05:09   in the show because I thought it was [TS]

00:05:10   really funny in and as much as the [TS]

00:05:12   bickering back and forth between [TS]

00:05:13   listeners in between us went on I I [TS]

00:05:16   still appreciate the fact that everyone [TS]

00:05:19   seemed to take it for what it was meant [TS]

00:05:21   to be which was yes we were killing each [TS]

00:05:23   other but it was all in good fun and [TS]

00:05:24   then we got some good feedback about the [TS]

00:05:26   the segment in general which made me [TS]

00:05:29   really happy so and like I said casing [TS]

00:05:32   beats John 5050 so i'm good with that [TS]

00:05:33   massive overwhelming agreement that it [TS]

00:05:36   was fun listening to us argue and the [TS]

00:05:38   after-show the one person didn't like an [TS]

00:05:40   important marker had to say you are [TS]

00:05:41   literally the only person he was [TS]

00:05:43   we have we got literally one complaint [TS]

00:05:45   yeah it was funny [TS]

00:05:46   I mean that person they believe was like [TS]

00:05:48   I'm sure I'm not the first person to say [TS]

00:05:50   this but that was not good [TS]

00:05:52   yeah and as it turns out the individual [TS]

00:05:55   you were the first person to say that [TS]

00:05:57   and the only person to say that I i [TS]

00:06:00   thought was a lot of fun and even i [TS]

00:06:01   wanted to kill both of you particularly [TS]

00:06:04   John because I think Marco kind of ended [TS]

00:06:06   up in switzerland by the end of the [TS]

00:06:07   conversation I don't know why you focus [TS]

00:06:09   all your anger on me because I really [TS]

00:06:10   listen to that thing and marco was the [TS]

00:06:12   one constantly poking and prodding you [TS]

00:06:13   and anyone i was elected to bring it [TS]

00:06:15   back to like Syria and even stuff and [TS]

00:06:18   Margo's like throwing these little bombs [TS]

00:06:19   then walking away with America's fault [TS]

00:06:21   it was not me go back but I i also was [TS]

00:06:25   not really a hundred percent either of [TS]

00:06:27   your sides but I was mostly it was the [TS]

00:06:29   instigator cabinet i was actually [TS]

00:06:31   waiting mostly towards Casey side now [TS]

00:06:34   that's the stuff was very good but that [TS]

00:06:35   I thought that subway was less terrible [TS]

00:06:39   than sbarro [TS]

00:06:40   now I know at least like when we're all [TS]

00:06:42   at WTC in a few weeks we have to go to [TS]

00:06:45   that mall food court and they don't have [TS]

00:06:47   any of those brands that they all have [TS]

00:06:48   weird stuff [TS]

00:06:49   yeah what hair is that here's the one we [TS]

00:06:51   can put in the after-show WBC box lunch [TS]

00:06:54   vs any fast food sometimes box lunches [TS]

00:06:58   are bad sometimes they're not sometimes [TS]

00:07:01   sometimes they are [TS]

00:07:02   yeah it was actually the problem with [TS]

00:07:05   the box lunches is that they basically [TS]

00:07:08   all just tastes like whatever the salad [TS]

00:07:11   dressing was they used to coat every [TS]

00:07:13   ingredient that day [TS]

00:07:14   yeah it's probably fair and ingredients [TS]

00:07:16   themselves are often made of cardboard [TS]

00:07:18   yes so you're basically tasting very [TS]

00:07:20   chewy cardboard that tastes like salad [TS]

00:07:22   dressing [TS]

00:07:23   that's not a bad it's not about summary [TS]

00:07:26   yeah although apparently had a google [TS]

00:07:28   i/o which were going to talk about quite [TS]

00:07:29   a bit later they don't serve you lunch [TS]

00:07:32   it seems like they don't even serve you [TS]

00:07:34   a roof outside in the sun at 90-degree [TS]

00:07:39   he's like lizards on hot rocks [TS]

00:07:42   oh goodness I can't I can't handle this [TS]

00:07:45   already so Lina friend of Sholay assumes [TS]

00:07:49   wrote in and said in and out does not [TS]

00:07:51   use frozen burger patties I remember [TS]

00:07:54   when or how that came up i said that we [TS]

00:07:56   we regret the error [TS]

00:07:58   they're not sorry and I'd only been out [TS]

00:08:00   like four times i'm not into I've seen [TS]

00:08:02   cut the fries so I know they're taking [TS]

00:08:04   potatoes and running through machine [TS]

00:08:05   cutting the frys but i lumped them in [TS]

00:08:06   with the the like the taste more like a [TS]

00:08:09   fast-food chain lets people get frozen [TS]

00:08:10   patties like McDonald's or Burger King [TS]

00:08:12   up in and out does not do that [TS]

00:08:14   excellent yeah and i was very good but I [TS]

00:08:15   think as we said the last episode I [TS]

00:08:17   wonder if the reason i like it so much [TS]

00:08:19   it's just because I can never have it [TS]

00:08:21   and if it was somewhere if it was like [TS]

00:08:23   five guys when I could consume it all [TS]

00:08:24   the time I'd be like well actually like [TS]

00:08:26   five guys and i'd be yeah yeah I had I [TS]

00:08:28   had in and out two times in one weekend [TS]

00:08:30   by the second time I was like all right [TS]

00:08:32   quality is wearing off [TS]

00:08:34   yep completely agree that's what I did [TS]

00:08:35   when I was in California and I felt the [TS]

00:08:37   exact same way now this is more fun we [TS]

00:08:39   agree with each other so yes you [TS]

00:08:41   tomorrow [TS]

00:08:42   give it time I don't tell me John about [TS]

00:08:47   tech support ads being banned from being [TS]

00:08:48   a couple shows back i talked to my mom [TS]

00:08:51   falling for tech support scam [TS]

00:08:53   we're by the way that the consensus [TS]

00:08:54   seems to be that these tech support [TS]

00:08:56   scams really want is not to steal your [TS]

00:08:57   information or and put ransomware in [TS]

00:08:59   your machine of those are all definitely [TS]

00:09:00   possible and I'm sure have happened but [TS]

00:09:02   percentage-wise it seems like the thing [TS]

00:09:05   that most of them are doing is trying to [TS]

00:09:06   scare you into thinking your computer is [TS]

00:09:08   something wrong with it and getting you [TS]

00:09:09   to sign up to a monthly fee for them to [TS]

00:09:11   essentially do nothing so they make your [TS]

00:09:13   computer seem like it's haunted and say [TS]

00:09:14   oh you have a serious problem here you [TS]

00:09:15   pass five dollars a month will make sure [TS]

00:09:17   your computer stays clean [TS]

00:09:18   so it's a slightly different kind of [TS]

00:09:21   fraudulent scam then the kind of [TS]

00:09:23   installs a rootkit or malware but you [TS]

00:09:26   can never know which one of those things [TS]

00:09:27   are doing and my mother hung up in this [TS]

00:09:29   person be you know without before [TS]

00:09:32   finding out exactly what the scam was [TS]

00:09:33   and so wiping computer is the best thing [TS]

00:09:35   to do but anyway the story recently was [TS]

00:09:37   that Byng Microsoft's still existing [TS]

00:09:40   apparently competitor to google search [TS]

00:09:42   is now banning all third-party tech [TS]

00:09:45   support services from being a dad like [TS]

00:09:48   some of the ads they serve with the [TS]

00:09:49   search results just because so many of [TS]

00:09:51   them are fraudulent as an entire [TS]

00:09:53   category of business that is that cannot [TS]

00:09:55   advertise on being now again advertising [TS]

00:09:57   I'm being maybe it's not the biggest [TS]

00:09:58   thing in the world but google has done [TS]

00:10:00   similar things and trying to find is [TS]

00:10:02   trying to get businesses that are [TS]

00:10:04   fraudulent stop them from buying [TS]

00:10:06   keywords or ads because as we all know [TS]

00:10:08   in the search results a lot of times the [TS]

00:10:09   first two items are actually adds and [TS]

00:10:11   not legitimate search results and most [TS]

00:10:13   people i found are not good at [TS]

00:10:15   distinguishing what's an ad was not even [TS]

00:10:17   though i clearly labeled or in boxes or [TS]

00:10:19   whatever and I have no doubt that the [TS]

00:10:22   thing my mother click on was not [TS]

00:10:23   actually a search result but an ad [TS]

00:10:26   because I know she doesn't know the [TS]

00:10:27   difference [TS]

00:10:27   thanks just one of the top hits all [TS]

00:10:29   right so anyway it's sad this entire [TS]

00:10:31   what could be an entirely legitimate [TS]

00:10:33   category of businesses like oh you have [TS]

00:10:35   problems with the computer there's a [TS]

00:10:36   market need we can help you with your [TS]

00:10:37   problems instead they're all just camps [TS]

00:10:39   and so there's been completely pretty [TS]

00:10:41   crappy [TS]

00:10:41   yep and a lot of people wrote in with [TS]

00:10:44   regard to our conversation about [TS]

00:10:45   podcasting last episode and many many [TS]

00:10:49   tin foil hats were worn as emails are [TS]

00:10:51   sent in saying out obviously apple is [TS]

00:10:54   the source of that New York Times [TS]

00:10:56   podcasting story that it's so clear I [TS]

00:10:59   didn't think that was the case but I [TS]

00:11:02   don't know Marco did you have any [TS]

00:11:04   thoughts on that [TS]

00:11:05   I mean it didn't paint apple on a very [TS]

00:11:07   good light so i don't think they would [TS]

00:11:09   have been the source of that story also [TS]

00:11:12   like things that are Apple controlled [TS]

00:11:14   leaks tend to read a certain way [TS]

00:11:17   also i can't recall a time the New York [TS]

00:11:19   Times was publishing those it seems like [TS]

00:11:22   apples controlled leaks in recent years [TS]

00:11:24   have gone to the wall street journal and [TS]

00:11:26   Bloomberg usually so I i would not I I [TS]

00:11:31   think it's pretty unlikely [TS]

00:11:33   basically yeah I completely agree and [TS]

00:11:35   especially since like the idea was that [TS]

00:11:36   you know like i was saying the past show [TS]

00:11:39   all these things that they're suggesting [TS]

00:11:40   would just give Apple tremendous amount [TS]

00:11:42   of power and that's bad for cod [TS]

00:11:43   podcasters and that was about to leading [TS]

00:11:45   people to say oh well it because Apple [TS]

00:11:46   tremendous power and speed for [TS]

00:11:48   podcasters don't stop thinking about it [TS]

00:11:49   is though isn't it weird that podcasters [TS]

00:11:51   would say that I think about it all this [TS]

00:11:53   is exactly what Apple would want but if [TS]

00:11:55   Apple wanted to grab power in the [TS]

00:11:57   podcast market a could have done that [TS]

00:11:59   years ago and be it doesn't need to leak [TS]

00:12:01   anything to do it would just have to do [TS]

00:12:02   it so I don't see the purpose of that [TS]

00:12:04   leak even if that even the dastardly [TS]

00:12:05   Apple did want on podcasting which they [TS]

00:12:08   totally have seemed like they don't they [TS]

00:12:10   don't need the New York Times to do that [TS]

00:12:11   yes it seems like you know that what we [TS]

00:12:14   already knew which is that Apple is a [TS]

00:12:17   very very big player in podcasting but [TS]

00:12:20   that it doesn't it's not really like top [TS]

00:12:22   of their radar it's not like a huge [TS]

00:12:23   priority for them they have much bigger [TS]

00:12:25   things to deal with so and i don't i [TS]

00:12:28   don't see that changing you know like [TS]

00:12:30   seeing what Apple has to deal with their [TS]

00:12:32   other product lines various market [TS]

00:12:34   pressures you know various internal and [TS]

00:12:37   external needs a podcasting is just not [TS]

00:12:40   very high rating on that list and I [TS]

00:12:43   don't see that changing for the [TS]

00:12:44   foreseeable future it might be way down [TS]

00:12:46   the road but i really wouldn't assume [TS]

00:12:49   that it's going to suddenly become a big [TS]

00:12:51   thing for them we are sponsored tonight [TS]

00:12:54   by ring the ring video doorbell go to [TS]

00:12:57   ring dot com / ATP now there are so many [TS]

00:13:01   reasons to have a video doorbell you can [TS]

00:13:03   actually see who's ringing your doorbell [TS]

00:13:04   and you can respond from your phone [TS]

00:13:06   whether your home or not [TS]

00:13:08   so you can pretend like you're home to [TS]

00:13:10   maybe ward off burglars you can tell a [TS]

00:13:13   package delivery person hey leave it on [TS]

00:13:15   the doorstep I'm in the shower even if [TS]

00:13:16   you're like at work [TS]

00:13:17   and you know you can have package left [TS]

00:13:19   all sorts of good reasons why you want a [TS]

00:13:21   video doorbell [TS]

00:13:22   there's also incredibly advanced motion [TS]

00:13:25   detection here so that even if somebody [TS]

00:13:27   doesn't ring your doorbell ringing can [TS]

00:13:29   turn itself on and alert you that [TS]

00:13:31   somebody is at your door looking around [TS]

00:13:33   your whore looking around your porch or [TS]

00:13:35   wherever you have it have it aimed and [TS]

00:13:37   this can actually help you both deter [TS]

00:13:39   and prevent home break-ins and they have [TS]

00:13:42   actually run studies they've actually [TS]

00:13:43   been able to been able to decrease the [TS]

00:13:45   rate of home break-ins in neighborhood [TS]

00:13:47   have a bunch of ring video doorbell is [TS]

00:13:48   installed and home break-ins usually [TS]

00:13:51   happen during the day that some people [TS]

00:13:53   aren't home so this could really help [TS]

00:13:54   out a lot i'm installing ring is very [TS]

00:13:56   easy it takes only minutes you can [TS]

00:13:58   either work with your current wiring or [TS]

00:14:00   they have a built-in rechargeable [TS]

00:14:00   battery model so John you have one of [TS]

00:14:03   these right i installed mine i got the [TS]

00:14:05   they sent me one of the just the cameras [TS]

00:14:07   that's not the doorbell thing that's [TS]

00:14:08   interesting what is that it's just [TS]

00:14:09   wrapped up like a mounting bracket you [TS]

00:14:11   gotta stick anywhere and came up a name [TS]

00:14:12   down and you know so you don't have to [TS]

00:14:14   put it over your doorbell be and it [TS]

00:14:15   doesn't have a button on it is basically [TS]

00:14:17   just a camera and I put it [TS]

00:14:18   guess what raising my driveway because [TS]

00:14:19   that's what i want to do with these [TS]

00:14:20   things and maybe call anybody sneaking [TS]

00:14:22   around your car yet [TS]

00:14:24   no just us every time we come home and [TS]

00:14:26   the kids go out and and you know stuff [TS]

00:14:28   like that so I'm so I'm observing it [TS]

00:14:31   when I mean it works fine i'm amazed [TS]

00:14:32   that one of the batteries last thing I [TS]

00:14:34   guess like it's basically offer asleep [TS]

00:14:35   the entire time and then you trip the IR [TS]

00:14:37   sensor it turns on i think it's not like [TS]

00:14:39   ninety percent battery has been out [TS]

00:14:40   there for like five days and it sends [TS]

00:14:41   alerts to my iOS devices when this [TS]

00:14:43   motion and I can look at it and you know [TS]

00:14:45   i can see my daughter scraping her [TS]

00:14:47   bicycle again side of my car it's great [TS]

00:14:49   i can't feel bad though for my kids [TS]

00:14:51   because I think about it when you were a [TS]

00:14:53   kid like you get away with a lot of [TS]

00:14:55   stuff of your parents didn't see it now [TS]

00:14:56   had literally have a video camera [TS]

00:14:57   catching them you know scraping the bike [TS]

00:14:59   and the side of my car feel kind of bad [TS]

00:15:01   and they can't pin that look I've got [TS]

00:15:03   video let's come look at it together the [TS]

00:15:05   other bikes not supposed to touch the [TS]

00:15:06   car bad [TS]

00:15:08   yes I feel bad but yeah that's that's [TS]

00:15:09   there that's the non front door product [TS]

00:15:12   because again have after my ipad ipod [TS]

00:15:15   being stolen out of my car [TS]

00:15:16   what I really wanted was to see what the [TS]

00:15:19   deal is and so far no one has come to [TS]

00:15:21   visit my car as far as I've been able to [TS]

00:15:22   determine also my ipod is not been [TS]

00:15:24   stolen from my car yet [TS]

00:15:25   thumbs up so far yeah maybe just the [TS]

00:15:28   presence of the camera will the terrible [TS]

00:15:29   kinda like this fake [TS]

00:15:30   security signs that you put on your lawn [TS]

00:15:32   or on your windows we don't actually [TS]

00:15:33   have a security system but this is a [TS]

00:15:35   real camera so it is it is mostly going [TS]

00:15:37   my family now it's fun i thought a lot [TS]

00:15:39   about what you were saying about getting [TS]

00:15:42   away with things because especially when [TS]

00:15:44   it came to like driving i did terrible [TS]

00:15:47   things in my 1994 well actually was [TS]

00:15:50   dad's 1994 saturn sl2 that really was [TS]

00:15:53   not designed to do the terrible things I [TS]

00:15:55   did it [TS]

00:15:55   hold that thought of expenses automatic [TS]

00:15:57   yeah fair enough but suffice to say they [TS]

00:16:01   find my friends or whatever was the [TS]

00:16:03   thing or glimpse was the thing back when [TS]

00:16:05   i was 16 i would have a very different [TS]

00:16:07   childhood than I did so our listeners [TS]

00:16:10   get free extra fedex shipping when you [TS]

00:16:12   go to ring dot com / ATP that your ring [TS]

00:16:15   dot com / ATP for free fast shipping [TS]

00:16:17   with the ring video doorbell you're [TS]

00:16:19   always home thanks a lot to ring for [TS]

00:16:21   sponsoring our show [TS]

00:16:22   ah alright so this was discussed a bit [TS]

00:16:28   on the latest under the radar which [TS]

00:16:31   almost accidentally called under the [TS]

00:16:33   weather but appstore approval times if [TS]

00:16:35   you're always making fun of me for being [TS]

00:16:36   sick I haven't actually meant to ask you [TS]

00:16:39   if you were sick right now are you sick [TS]

00:16:41   right now I think it's on its way out [TS]

00:16:44   ok so on episode 27 of you're under the [TS]

00:16:46   weather program you discussed fast app [TS]

00:16:50   review and it's worth at least quickly [TS]

00:16:52   touching upon here [TS]

00:16:53   appstore review times which typically [TS]

00:16:55   hovered about a week are now really [TS]

00:16:58   really fast so cable sasser tweeted [TS]

00:17:02   earlier tonight [TS]

00:17:03   Logan sent a non panic apt to the mac [TS]

00:17:05   app store at ten-thirty it was in review [TS]

00:17:08   i'm assuming that I am it was interview [TS]

00:17:10   at three rejected for a crash at [TS]

00:17:12   five-thirty they fixed it submitted at [TS]

00:17:14   six-thirty approved at eight o'clock so [TS]

00:17:16   in the span of what is that 10 hours [TS]

00:17:19   they made two submissions and gather [TS]

00:17:21   their app approved that's impressive [TS]

00:17:24   and in fact i can i can also confirm [TS]

00:17:25   that this morning I submit an overcast [TS]

00:17:28   update and it was approved and in the [TS]

00:17:31   store nine hours later I didn't listen [TS]

00:17:33   to the [TS]

00:17:35   helping under the weather perspective [TS]

00:17:36   podcast about that but right when I [TS]

00:17:39   think about a lot of people are asking [TS]

00:17:40   like OS does this have to do with phil [TS]

00:17:42   schiller maybe it does so on and so [TS]

00:17:44   forth like how is this possible and [TS]

00:17:47   they're there are so many ways that [TS]

00:17:49   could be possible but the thing that [TS]

00:17:51   ones that spring to mind me are you can [TS]

00:17:54   use heuristics to assess the risk of [TS]

00:17:58   each application submission and what you [TS]

00:18:01   can mix into those heuristics are how [TS]

00:18:05   many absences developer put in have we [TS]

00:18:06   had any problems before is this a [TS]

00:18:09   entirely new a person update to an [TS]

00:18:10   existing one [TS]

00:18:11   I mean they can go down to the point [TS]

00:18:12   where they're doing like binary dips or [TS]

00:18:14   something but the whole mess of your [TS]

00:18:16   astex you can do and of course that is [TS]

00:18:18   hiring more people but but this dramatic [TS]

00:18:20   decrease from like days two hours [TS]

00:18:22   I don't think you can do that by even [TS]

00:18:26   like hiring ten times as many people are [TS]

00:18:28   they must they must be having better [TS]

00:18:30   rules about like how much do we have to [TS]

00:18:33   scrutinize this or how much can we [TS]

00:18:36   automated no increased automation is [TS]

00:18:38   another thing but again it seems like it [TS]

00:18:39   would have to you know come out of [TS]

00:18:40   nowhere when when a developer can who's [TS]

00:18:43   never had any promises but we always [TS]

00:18:45   entirely developer who never had any [TS]

00:18:46   problems with conscientious who is [TS]

00:18:48   submitting an app it looks fairly [TS]

00:18:49   straightforward to get them through and [TS]

00:18:53   like it like this you know one day [TS]

00:18:54   turnaround time where you you passed it [TS]

00:18:56   gets rejected you fix it you pass it [TS]

00:18:57   goes back out again this is not enough [TS]

00:18:59   time in there to do like a you know it [TS]

00:19:03   to give it a huge amount of scrutiny and [TS]

00:19:05   go through every single screen and you [TS]

00:19:07   know do all stuffy even automated [TS]

00:19:09   testing tools could take you know you [TS]

00:19:10   could run through automated testing for [TS]

00:19:12   a certain amount of time and maybe that [TS]

00:19:14   wouldn't even fit in this is almost like [TS]

00:19:15   they're saying this one is probably fine [TS]

00:19:17   right guys run the fast automated tests [TS]

00:19:20   give it a once-over two seconds and let [TS]

00:19:23   it sail through which is what developers [TS]

00:19:24   have been asking like and again this was [TS]

00:19:26   in a panic a panic were saying like look [TS]

00:19:27   seriously Apple you know are we burying [TS]

00:19:30   malware and our applications like you're [TS]

00:19:32   never going to catch if we do anyway so [TS]

00:19:33   you might as well just accept the [TS]

00:19:35   reality that the only thing you can [TS]

00:19:37   really do is assume good intent and [TS]

00:19:40   punished after the fact [TS]

00:19:42   right because if you say oh we don't [TS]

00:19:43   like that that's not a secure way to do [TS]

00:19:44   we want to do on a start that stuff and [TS]

00:19:45   getting the store in the first place [TS]

00:19:47   hey that's not pass [TS]

00:19:48   people & B it just punishes everybody [TS]

00:19:50   for the possibility they might suddenly [TS]

00:19:51   turn one day and panic becomes infected [TS]

00:19:53   by malware you even there no fault of [TS]

00:19:55   their own like that happens almost smell [TS]

00:19:56   right to the map app there's only so [TS]

00:19:58   much that you can detect in review so it [TS]

00:20:02   you know the the calculus may be right [TS]

00:20:04   you know develop these heuristics so [TS]

00:20:06   that most normal developers get there we [TS]

00:20:08   do less we do let's review basically [TS]

00:20:10   foremost normal developers and we'll [TS]

00:20:12   catch the matter of fact because history [TS]

00:20:14   has proven that you catch tons of stuff [TS]

00:20:16   after the fact anyway tons of things get [TS]

00:20:17   through even obvious things that [TS]

00:20:19   should've been caught so why pretend [TS]

00:20:21   that your entire system is predicated on [TS]

00:20:23   the idea that we must catch bad things [TS]

00:20:26   before they get through the store at all [TS]

00:20:27   costs and then take a day or a week or [TS]

00:20:29   wherever to do it so this is definitely [TS]

00:20:31   awesome and I have to think that it has [TS]

00:20:33   been that it's happening because they're [TS]

00:20:36   just getting there working smarter not [TS]

00:20:38   harder as they say as the bosses say [TS]

00:20:41   whatever it is it's dramatic and we [TS]

00:20:46   talked about a lot on under-the-radar [TS]

00:20:47   last week that the gist of it basically [TS]

00:20:50   means further for those of you who don't [TS]

00:20:51   know after you used to take roughly a [TS]

00:20:53   week and throughout the entire history [TS]

00:20:56   of the app store and back 2008 and there [TS]

00:20:59   have been a couple ups and downs here [TS]

00:21:00   and there but for the most part it's [TS]

00:21:02   been pretty consistent taking about a [TS]

00:21:04   week ago when you have when you want a [TS]

00:21:05   preview goes from taking a week to a day [TS]

00:21:09   or less it makes a lot of app review [TS]

00:21:12   problems less severe and it makes it [TS]

00:21:15   basically lets you iterate faster on [TS]

00:21:17   your software and so yes it does create [TS]

00:21:19   the potential to kind of play fast and [TS]

00:21:22   loose and ship more bugs but it also [TS]

00:21:25   gives you the ability to fix bugs faster [TS]

00:21:26   and so I have to imagine is going to [TS]

00:21:28   lead overall to better quality software [TS]

00:21:31   and it has certainly led to better [TS]

00:21:34   quality better developer morale and [TS]

00:21:36   better developer feelings towards the [TS]

00:21:37   platform and as the economics have [TS]

00:21:40   gotten more challenging over the years i [TS]

00:21:42   think that's something that Apple is his [TS]

00:21:45   right to be apparently focusing on [TS]

00:21:47   because you know that the app stores its [TS]

00:21:50   it's pretty easy to become bitter after [TS]

00:21:53   a while the app store in trying to sell [TS]

00:21:54   something trying trying to make some [TS]

00:21:55   money cuz its it just gets harder and [TS]

00:21:57   harder every year as there's increasing [TS]

00:21:58   competition for everywhere [TS]

00:22:00   and so to have signs the Apple is trying [TS]

00:22:02   to make our lives better as developers [TS]

00:22:04   is is very promising and it this kind of [TS]

00:22:07   thing is is a huge improvement to be an [TS]

00:22:10   iOS developer it's an improvement that I [TS]

00:22:12   don't think any of us were expecting to [TS]

00:22:13   ever get and all of a sudden it just [TS]

00:22:15   kinda here it's gonna be on the sly WWDC [TS]

00:22:18   i would imagine but yeah like it so [TS]

00:22:19   there are still remaining problems of [TS]

00:22:21   the main one I can think of is you have [TS]

00:22:23   been developing an app for a while [TS]

00:22:24   releasing updates to our regular [TS]

00:22:26   schedule and then along the way if [TS]

00:22:29   you're if you're lucky just a routine [TS]

00:22:30   update but if you're unlucky a bug fix [TS]

00:22:32   update gets hung up as they say [TS]

00:22:33   something fundamental about your app is [TS]

00:22:36   against the rules [TS]

00:22:36   you're like I've been releasing this app [TS]

00:22:38   for a year I have this is like the 17th [TS]

00:22:39   update and all of a sudden the major [TS]

00:22:41   feature of my application is a violation [TS]

00:22:43   of the guidelines and that's preventing [TS]

00:22:44   me from getting this bug fix update or [TS]

00:22:45   this routine update out the door and [TS]

00:22:47   faster doesn't help that because no [TS]

00:22:49   matter how fast you iterate on that you [TS]

00:22:51   still the second problem is can i [TS]

00:22:53   connect to a human being who understands [TS]

00:22:56   the words of my mouth is making right [TS]

00:22:57   now like I think nothing fundamental has [TS]

00:23:00   changed about my app this app has [TS]

00:23:01   existed for a long time are you telling [TS]

00:23:03   me that the end of this app is no longer [TS]

00:23:05   welcome in the store tell me now I will [TS]

00:23:07   cease development or are you telling me [TS]

00:23:09   you don't understand something basic [TS]

00:23:11   about my happen I need to explain it to [TS]

00:23:12   you and those type of situations with [TS]

00:23:14   like the wall of silence and just trying [TS]

00:23:15   to send it back again and again and [TS]

00:23:17   getting computerized responses fast [TS]

00:23:19   iteration time doesn't help with that [TS]

00:23:20   kind of frustration because then you're [TS]

00:23:21   like blocked on something like I don't [TS]

00:23:22   understand i'm trying to fix a crashing [TS]

00:23:24   bug and you're telling me my application [TS]

00:23:26   that's been on the store for years now [TS]

00:23:28   like illegal for some you know so that [TS]

00:23:30   frustration can still exists with fast [TS]

00:23:32   iteration time boy like Marcus said [TS]

00:23:34   having the time get faster whole message [TS]

00:23:38   of complaints and the things that people [TS]

00:23:39   like national chief about the app store [TS]

00:23:42   just go away when the timescale shrink [TS]

00:23:45   to a single day then it's like a mild [TS]

00:23:47   annoyance vs like I have to plan my [TS]

00:23:49   entire business about around allowing [TS]

00:23:50   for a week to a month of review time [TS]

00:23:53   which is just just destroys your you [TS]

00:23:56   know your ability like just go to market [TS]

00:23:58   to compete that 22 to serve your [TS]

00:24:02   customers like it was a problem with the [TS]

00:24:03   one point and you gotta wait a week for [TS]

00:24:05   the 1.01 why this if i don't really help [TS]

00:24:08   the stick will be promising is if Apple [TS]

00:24:11   publicly knowledge is this [TS]

00:24:13   and in any way at all that with every [TS]

00:24:15   city man that you think they're not [TS]

00:24:16   gonna brag about this how can they not [TS]

00:24:18   is gonna be graph right but if they if [TS]

00:24:20   they don't mention it at all it could [TS]

00:24:22   plausibly be like a flu is an accident [TS]

00:24:26   someone was just hitting the approve [TS]

00:24:27   button little drinking bird from the [TS]

00:24:29   simpsons do is just that reference movie [TS]

00:24:32   do I told us from the simpsons though [TS]

00:24:34   yeah but again I giving you the [TS]

00:24:36   reference is that from the simpsons well [TS]

00:24:38   you had I mean we know what drinking [TS]

00:24:40   bird is separately now I know so you can [TS]

00:24:42   add sound it just sounds weird to me but [TS]

00:24:45   you're like a showbusiness mom an [TS]

00:24:47   impossible to please no wire hangers [TS]

00:24:50   that that when I didn't get no that's [TS]

00:24:53   not a showbusiness mom know is it is [TS]

00:24:55   that that was a mommy dearest but I [TS]

00:24:57   don't think it was a showbiz angle on [TS]

00:24:58   that [TS]

00:24:58   yeah went right over my head and [TS]

00:25:00   everything is back to normal [TS]

00:25:02   our next sponsor this week is automatic [TS]

00:25:06   now chances are your car has not fully [TS]

00:25:09   kept up with technology this is [TS]

00:25:11   automatic comes in automatic is a small [TS]

00:25:13   adapter that turns any car into a [TS]

00:25:15   connected smart car just plug in the [TS]

00:25:17   automatic into the same port your [TS]

00:25:19   mechanic used to diagnose engine [TS]

00:25:20   problems usually it's in the footwell [TS]

00:25:23   area and it opens up a world of [TS]

00:25:25   possibilities now automatically to keep [TS]

00:25:27   tracking a few mileage vehicle Health [TS]

00:25:29   lets you expense business trips with one [TS]

00:25:32   tap and link your car the connected [TS]

00:25:34   devices the power your life so what does [TS]

00:25:36   that check engine light actually mean [TS]

00:25:38   automatic can tell you through your [TS]

00:25:40   phone before you even have to go to the [TS]

00:25:42   shop [TS]

00:25:42   you can also integrate with your nest [TS]

00:25:44   thermostat to know when your home and [TS]

00:25:46   can provide the answer one of life's [TS]

00:25:48   most common questions dude where's my [TS]

00:25:50   car [TS]

00:25:50   automatic works on nearly every car made [TS]

00:25:54   after 1996 and it takes only minutes to [TS]

00:25:56   install and connect to your iPhone or [TS]

00:25:58   Android device over Bluetooth this gives [TS]

00:26:01   you real-time performance data all the [TS]

00:26:03   Diagnostics i mentioned earlier it can [TS]

00:26:05   even use intelligent coaching to [TS]

00:26:07   maximize fuel economy and reduce wear [TS]

00:26:09   and tear so for example you can say if I [TS]

00:26:11   am getting fuel economy below this [TS]

00:26:14   target that I want to hit that I want to [TS]

00:26:15   hit beep at me or tell me so I could [TS]

00:26:18   like you know adjust the habit of doing [TS]

00:26:20   if I just gave my my teenage son Casey [TS]

00:26:23   the car for the night [TS]

00:26:25   and in case he decides to drive super [TS]

00:26:27   fast I can have a report of that 1994 [TS]

00:26:30   saturn sl2 does never go a day never [TS]

00:26:32   goes fast it just goes quicker than the [TS]

00:26:34   roads intended that's all [TS]

00:26:36   alright i also have a webapp dashboard [TS]

00:26:39   provides greater information lets you [TS]

00:26:40   import and export data gives you [TS]

00:26:43   planning regulations here check check [TS]

00:26:44   engine light they also have this [TS]

00:26:46   incredible app platform now when you [TS]

00:26:48   have smarts and you have connectivity [TS]

00:26:50   you can have integration so i mentioned [TS]

00:26:52   earlier the nest integrations also [TS]

00:26:53   integration with your mechanic [TS]

00:26:54   freshbooks and more you can file [TS]

00:26:56   business expenses of popular apps like [TS]

00:26:58   current Expensify and it works with [TS]

00:27:00   ifttt for even more possibilities [TS]

00:27:02   integrate your car into your digital [TS]

00:27:04   life and support apple watch it supports [TS]

00:27:07   pebble watches and all this is available [TS]

00:27:09   for no monthly fees and no subscriptions [TS]

00:27:12   and they never sell your data that's not [TS]

00:27:14   their business their business is selling [TS]

00:27:16   you the automatic device the automatic [TS]

00:27:18   device is normally 9,500 bucks but use [TS]

00:27:22   our special offer code ATP 03 15 you'll [TS]

00:27:26   save twenty percent that makes it just [TS]

00:27:28   80 bucks with code ATP 03 15 so go to [TS]

00:27:31   all right calm / ATP these offer code [TS]

00:27:35   8003 15 to save twenty percent off the [TS]

00:27:38   regular price gets of q4 80 bucks that's [TS]

00:27:40   automatic calm / ATP thanks a lot for [TS]

00:27:43   supporting the show [TS]

00:27:45   alright so Google i/o keynote was today [TS]

00:27:50   and I actually watched it which is the [TS]

00:27:54   first time i think i've ever watched [TS]

00:27:55   google i/o keynote but now that I'm in [TS]

00:27:57   this whole brand-new world where I work [TS]

00:28:00   alongside Android developers and they [TS]

00:28:02   were really into it and they did what I [TS]

00:28:05   usually do for Apple keynotes and we all [TS]

00:28:07   piled in a conference room where they [TS]

00:28:09   put it on the big screen and we watched [TS]

00:28:11   it together and it was pretty good [TS]

00:28:15   all-in-all and we'll go through each [TS]

00:28:16   thing you know in a moment but i was [TS]

00:28:18   impressed i heard rumblings and in [TS]

00:28:21   descriptions of past google i/o is that [TS]

00:28:24   they were meandering and long and often [TS]

00:28:27   boring much like the talent of the last [TS]

00:28:29   wdc keynote and so Pam and a total [TS]

00:28:33   disaster kind of like the end of the [TS]

00:28:36   last WBC keynote [TS]

00:28:38   and also i'm curious i was talking about [TS]

00:28:40   this recently with tiff which do you [TS]

00:28:42   think was the worst moment in recent [TS]

00:28:45   apple keynote memory was it the app [TS]

00:28:48   music introduction or the u2 album [TS]

00:28:51   finger-touch thing o.o finger-touch was [TS]

00:28:53   nothing compared to the end of last [TS]

00:28:55   year's wcu kidding finger-touch was a [TS]

00:28:57   brief moment kind of silly excusable by [TS]

00:29:00   celebrity the other was just in terminal [TS]

00:29:02   watching neq vamp and then having to [TS]

00:29:05   have Drake be up there and just ramble [TS]

00:29:07   and it was it was bad but to keep in [TS]

00:29:09   mind though I think contributing to the [TS]

00:29:11   side of the argument though is like the [TS]

00:29:13   finger-touch was part of a very very [TS]

00:29:15   awkward moment [TS]

00:29:17   yeah that when also led into this giant [TS]

00:29:21   thing nobody wanted which is everybody [TS]

00:29:23   getting this album pushed into the eye [TS]

00:29:25   and it was fine [TS]

00:29:27   you like you too yeah you're matter and [TS]

00:29:29   even if they don't it was fire was that [TS]

00:29:31   it was a fumble who cares they gave you [TS]

00:29:33   free stuff and took up space in your [TS]

00:29:34   phone and they gave you a way to opt out [TS]

00:29:36   of it and it was silly but like you're [TS]

00:29:37   talking about the keynote itself finger [TS]

00:29:39   touches nothing I don't know man i'm [TS]

00:29:41   kinda with mark on this I think it was [TS]

00:29:42   an approximately equivalent amount of [TS]

00:29:45   awkward it's just that the density in [TS]

00:29:47   the finger-touch was considered if mary [TS]

00:29:50   has made you watch one of those things [TS]

00:29:51   over again and you have to watch the [TS]

00:29:53   finger-touch you have to watch the [TS]

00:29:54   entire neq and Drake segment which to [TS]

00:29:56   choose what I have to watch the YouTube [TS]

00:29:57   performance before the finger-touch I [TS]

00:30:02   think it's a community [TS]

00:30:03   I mean it don't know if you're including [TS]

00:30:05   musical performance has been a long line [TS]

00:30:06   of musical performance that people don't [TS]

00:30:07   care but I was trying that I put all [TS]

00:30:09   these notes in here by google I was [TS]

00:30:10   trying not to talk about the the [TS]

00:30:12   showmanship or compared to apple because [TS]

00:30:14   the outdoor thing that the set [TS]

00:30:16   decoration on that stage was not good [TS]

00:30:19   hold on can we can we paint a word [TS]

00:30:21   picture please I don't want to paint the [TS]

00:30:23   word picture i gotta bring up to i [TS]

00:30:24   thought i had the video i hear something [TS]

00:30:25   I don't know what they're decorating [TS]

00:30:26   theme was it like needed to do material [TS]

00:30:29   chaos was that the beam SE the material [TS]

00:30:33   design colors kind of i can see that [TS]

00:30:35   theme and you kind of saw echoed in [TS]

00:30:38   their slides but the set design for the [TS]

00:30:40   stage just was not aesthetically [TS]

00:30:42   pleasing and didn't enhance they have [TS]

00:30:43   these did enhance their presentation of [TS]

00:30:45   the bright colored lights underneath the [TS]

00:30:47   screen like [TS]

00:30:49   I just want to focus on your content the [TS]

00:30:50   content i thought was pretty good and I [TS]

00:30:52   really liked a lot of the things they [TS]

00:30:53   announced but the set duration was great [TS]

00:30:55   but anyway my point is I don't want to [TS]

00:30:57   talk about a set decoration or how [TS]

00:30:59   polished presenters were or whether or [TS]

00:31:01   not Drake wear vintage apple jacket [TS]

00:31:03   while he said nothing of interest or a [TS]

00:31:05   very cute dance you have to google he [TS]

00:31:08   did write a damn he did anyway I want to [TS]

00:31:12   talk about the products and other [TS]

00:31:13   thought there was a lot of cool stuff [TS]

00:31:15   yeah i mean there is there is siri there [TS]

00:31:17   is the echo I'm not even tries time [TS]

00:31:20   trying to say they're just doing things [TS]

00:31:21   other people are doing because that is a [TS]

00:31:23   ridiculous argument that is the only [TS]

00:31:25   thing I give you that on his foot screen [TS]

00:31:26   because I was really expecting to have [TS]

00:31:29   something more than exactly what Apple a [TS]

00:31:30   split-screen picture-in-picture but [TS]

00:31:32   anyway we're getting an overall but yeah [TS]

00:31:33   the there's that's not an exact Apple [TS]

00:31:36   rip I actually I give them in ok on that [TS]

00:31:39   but we will go in the order of the show [TS]

00:31:41   notes and it begins with google home [TS]

00:31:44   which is the Amazon echo / alexa product [TS]

00:31:49   but google see this actually like I'm [TS]

00:31:51   this might be really good [TS]

00:31:54   it's obviously a big risk you know [TS]

00:31:55   because first of all it's google doing [TS]

00:31:57   its own hardware and their record for [TS]

00:32:00   that is about as good as Amazon's record [TS]

00:32:02   is for the friends into its own hardware [TS]

00:32:04   so like they have had some things that [TS]

00:32:06   have worked some of the nexus have been [TS]

00:32:07   decent but a lot of their stuff has been [TS]

00:32:09   flops and so it's it it's a huge wild [TS]

00:32:14   card but separate the flop from as if [TS]

00:32:16   they don't sell a lot of them from paw [TS]

00:32:19   is the hardware actually good without a [TS]

00:32:21   google has probably done multiples of [TS]

00:32:23   both like I think that ball thing I [TS]

00:32:25   don't know whatever shipped or whatever [TS]

00:32:26   that was like not a good idea and one of [TS]

00:32:28   the things they make don't sell a lot [TS]

00:32:30   but it's not like they're bad i mean i [TS]

00:32:33   don't think they sell a lot of not even [TS]

00:32:35   like the Chromebook pixel how many grow [TS]

00:32:37   pixels this so i don't know but the [TS]

00:32:38   hardware wasn't terrible right and no [TS]

00:32:42   not at all i thought the hardware look [TS]

00:32:43   great and the same thing when you know [TS]

00:32:45   the tablets and all the Nexus phones [TS]

00:32:47   especially like the Nexus phones didn't [TS]

00:32:48   sell that many you know I think people [TS]

00:32:51   thought they were going to sell more [TS]

00:32:52   than they did and then the other vendors [TS]

00:32:53   took over but the hardware they actually [TS]

00:32:56   make I don't think it's bad hardware so [TS]

00:32:58   I have some vague hope that this little [TS]

00:33:00   the squat little weeble that's their [TS]

00:33:03   Amazon echo competitive everything is a [TS]

00:33:06   weeble to you it's shaped like a weeble [TS]

00:33:08   wobble they don't fall down right [TS]

00:33:10   how many times have you made that joke [TS]

00:33:11   on our shows but they don't know about [TS]

00:33:14   the weebles please don't make me tell [TS]

00:33:16   you again about the weebles but now this [TS]

00:33:19   is this is literally we will shape right [TS]

00:33:20   it's fat on the bottom and it's like [TS]

00:33:22   anyway like I i have some faith that the [TS]

00:33:26   hardware will be ok i don't think that's [TS]

00:33:29   been the problem with Google's hardware [TS]

00:33:31   products of the hardware as bad I feel [TS]

00:33:33   like they've just you know falling down [TS]

00:33:35   other I like the google TV stuff and [TS]

00:33:37   maybe you know that really goes remote [TS]

00:33:39   was there was it made badly [TS]

00:33:41   no it was just a bad idea so if it's a [TS]

00:33:43   good idea and I think they can make it [TS]

00:33:45   and you know reasonably well I i think i [TS]

00:33:48   have i've seen no reason why this device [TS]

00:33:49   shouldn't sell just as well as the [TS]

00:33:53   Amazon echo message the amazonica was [TS]

00:33:55   already tired of that entire market [TS]

00:33:56   which is possible but other than that [TS]

00:33:58   the people about the echo why would they [TS]

00:34:00   buy this to its like the same thing [TS]

00:34:02   yeah i mean really like this kind of [TS]

00:34:05   thing is the kind of thing that google [TS]

00:34:07   should be really good at and again this [TS]

00:34:11   isn't to say that they definitely will [TS]

00:34:13   but i think the they clearly are likely [TS]

00:34:16   to succeed here because it combines the [TS]

00:34:18   types of things are really good at with [TS]

00:34:20   the kind of market they can get in [TS]

00:34:22   succeeded which is like so far mostly [TS]

00:34:25   like Aggie Aggie market very tech-savvy [TS]

00:34:28   market of people who have like smart [TS]

00:34:30   home stuff [TS]

00:34:31   the main problem we're gonna have is [TS]

00:34:32   there is the lack of retail presence [TS]

00:34:35   because I can you know we've seen like [TS]

00:34:37   Amazon is so powerful [TS]

00:34:40   amazon is the place where most people [TS]

00:34:42   would go to buy this kind of thing so [TS]

00:34:45   and i'm sure Amazon not gonna be too [TS]

00:34:47   happy to carry it or if they do carry [TS]

00:34:49   it's really not going to ever promote it [TS]

00:34:51   but I'm guessing they don't carry it all [TS]

00:34:53   so this is going to be interesting had [TS]

00:34:57   to see how Google can try to market this [TS]

00:35:00   and and and sell the crap out of this [TS]

00:35:02   because from a technical perspective [TS]

00:35:03   google should be better than amazon at [TS]

00:35:06   this stuff [TS]

00:35:07   I don't know that they will be but they [TS]

00:35:08   should be yeah i Ike's expect them to be [TS]

00:35:11   yet because I mean the only thing I feel [TS]

00:35:13   like they might not [TS]

00:35:14   better at is maybe this is the first try [TS]

00:35:17   at putting something out that has 10 [TS]

00:35:18   microphones and all sorts of noise [TS]

00:35:20   cancelling stuff so maybe amazon it was [TS]

00:35:22   amazon's first try and they gotta try [TS]

00:35:23   know I know but they it's been out for [TS]

00:35:25   awhile and the quality is really good so [TS]

00:35:27   I think they basically that Amazon hit [TS]

00:35:29   out of the park in that particular [TS]

00:35:30   feature right so I don't think that's a [TS]

00:35:32   given for your first try the Amazon did [TS]

00:35:34   a really good job with does this thing [TS]

00:35:36   understand me from across the room [TS]

00:35:37   google says they do a good job with that [TS]

00:35:38   but they like amazon had an exemplary [TS]

00:35:41   first try right and i have the second [TS]

00:35:43   and third try with the dot and although [TS]

00:35:44   there whatever the the derivative [TS]

00:35:46   products but i think they did a really [TS]

00:35:47   good job but other than that everything [TS]

00:35:49   else about this google I think should be [TS]

00:35:52   better and will be better like things [TS]

00:35:54   that you can say to it natural language [TS]

00:35:56   processing back-end querying the only [TS]

00:35:58   thing a man can do better i was buying [TS]

00:35:59   stuff right because ma'am but every [TS]

00:36:02   other part of it [TS]

00:36:03   google damn well better be better than [TS]

00:36:04   amazon at because you know amazon he [TS]

00:36:06   doesn't have any of the the strength [TS]

00:36:09   behind it to do all the language [TS]

00:36:11   processing and search queries in the [TS]

00:36:12   deep hooks into all that type of stuff [TS]

00:36:14   and the thing that really blew me away [TS]

00:36:17   about this demo was la thinking about [TS]

00:36:20   why the hell does Apple not have one of [TS]

00:36:21   these things that I guess maybe it's [TS]

00:36:23   beneath their concern but be when they [TS]

00:36:25   did the thing like the kids talking to [TS]

00:36:27   it and doing the conversations that show [TS]

00:36:28   me on the TV like that is an apple move [TS]

00:36:31   yeah i do that yet because we make a TV [TS]

00:36:33   device and of course our little weeble [TS]

00:36:35   knows about the TV the chromecast catch [TS]

00:36:37   the TV show me on the TV like that is [TS]

00:36:40   that the type of thing we used to have [TS]

00:36:41   to be the apple ecosystem for which is [TS]

00:36:43   all i have tons of Apple crap around the [TS]

00:36:45   house and they all know about each other [TS]

00:36:46   and they all just work together and it's [TS]

00:36:49   like airplane to your appletv the first [TS]

00:36:50   time that works like it was amazing [TS]

00:36:52   because I happy to apple devices really [TS]

00:36:53   easy to put a video up on my TV [TS]

00:36:55   well see all the time that worked yeah I [TS]

00:36:58   know much about hitting and that was the [TS]

00:36:59   first time you know it was impressive [TS]

00:37:01   the first time and yet this is google [TS]

00:37:03   saying hey we actually have stuff around [TS]

00:37:05   here they and they put a little nest [TS]

00:37:07   icon on there to say connecting the [TS]

00:37:09   thermostat and and third-party to [TS]

00:37:11   integrate with your third party lights [TS]

00:37:12   and stuff like that they're not being [TS]

00:37:14   like Apple would only work would only [TS]

00:37:15   work with your Apple lights or whatever [TS]

00:37:16   they're all big on third-party [TS]

00:37:17   integrations they already announced an [TS]

00:37:19   API which we still don't have four [TS]

00:37:20   series over for developers [TS]

00:37:23   unless unless Google homeless this is [TS]

00:37:26   the nest hub that we read about [TS]

00:37:27   and all those tell articles about next [TS]

00:37:29   about honest was going down in flames [TS]

00:37:30   and everything was breaking I really [TS]

00:37:31   hope this is not the long-delayed hub [TS]

00:37:34   from the nest people because the [TS]

00:37:36   dysfunctional organization is not gonna [TS]

00:37:37   make a good product but assuming this is [TS]

00:37:39   made by functional organization I i [TS]

00:37:42   think this will be an impressive Brock [TS]

00:37:43   and I think I might actually get 1 i've [TS]

00:37:45   been holding off on the echo just [TS]

00:37:46   because it's the first generation [TS]

00:37:47   product or whatever but if this gets [TS]

00:37:49   really good reviews i think the reason i [TS]

00:37:51   will buy it because I basically I have [TS]

00:37:52   more faith in google that amazon in [TS]

00:37:55   terms of supporting and evolving this [TS]

00:37:58   product and being good at the more [TS]

00:38:00   interesting sophisticated parts of it he [TS]

00:38:02   told that the downside though I mean [TS]

00:38:04   that the counter-argument to that first [TS]

00:38:05   of all there is this the big privacy ? [TS]

00:38:07   we should address because a lot of [TS]

00:38:09   people are like you know I was one of [TS]

00:38:12   the people I I freaked out when Amazon [TS]

00:38:13   be released i realize the echo and I was [TS]

00:38:16   like you're you know you're not Amazon [TS]

00:38:17   put a speaker and a microphone in your [TS]

00:38:19   house is listening to everything you say [TS]

00:38:21   all the time and similarly we know when [TS]

00:38:23   google bought nest everyone's like [TS]

00:38:24   you're gonna have you want Google to own [TS]

00:38:27   this thermostat that can look in your [TS]

00:38:28   house and stuff and and there's a lot of [TS]

00:38:31   people my past self included who are [TS]

00:38:34   uncomfortable with that and and they're [TS]

00:38:35   just not gonna want that product in [TS]

00:38:37   their house and that's fine that's you [TS]

00:38:38   know that's your decision if it you know [TS]

00:38:40   for me what tip the scale is what every [TS]

00:38:43   Google fan usually says when asked about [TS]

00:38:45   privacy things which is basically what [TS]

00:38:47   this girl for me when with letting the [TS]

00:38:48   Amazon echo in my house was I saw how [TS]

00:38:51   good it was [TS]

00:38:52   I other people's houses like I saw how [TS]

00:38:54   good it was and I decided you know what [TS]

00:38:57   it's worth the trade-off [TS]

00:38:59   I'll take the risk I'll put this thing [TS]

00:39:00   in my kitchen because it is so good as [TS]

00:39:03   worth the trade-off and this is the same [TS]

00:39:04   thing that most google people say when [TS]

00:39:07   you know when they say they don't wait [TS]

00:39:09   if people like me ask them like you know [TS]

00:39:10   why do you want Google to have access to [TS]

00:39:12   all your data and to be analyzing [TS]

00:39:14   everything you do and and selling ads [TS]

00:39:16   against it and everything and the answer [TS]

00:39:17   I get most commonly is well worth it to [TS]

00:39:20   me because it's convenient in these [TS]

00:39:21   features of things that i want to have [TS]

00:39:22   made the decision and you know I can't [TS]

00:39:24   really argue with that if you know if [TS]

00:39:25   you decide it's worth it to you then [TS]

00:39:26   it's worth it to you [TS]

00:39:27   I haven't just clarifying where iphone [TS]

00:39:31   that I don't see it as a trade office in [TS]

00:39:34   like okay well there are detriments but [TS]

00:39:36   there are benefits i mean the trade-off [TS]

00:39:37   is there but like I would put it more [TS]

00:39:39   succinctly for [TS]

00:39:40   myself is that basically I trust Google [TS]

00:39:43   like I don't trust them with everything [TS]

00:39:44   I don't trust them like implicitly I [TS]

00:39:46   don't give the ball my trust but in the [TS]

00:39:48   grand scheme of things I trust apple and [TS]

00:39:50   I trust Google to basically be companies [TS]

00:39:53   that are trying to do the right thing [TS]

00:39:54   and are not like you just inherently [TS]

00:39:56   evil like I don't know insert the name [TS]

00:39:58   your favorite company although it's [TS]

00:39:59   weird that I was just about to say [TS]

00:40:00   oracle but you don't really get back [TS]

00:40:02   into that and anyway I mean I would [TS]

00:40:03   trust Google before I trust facebook [TS]

00:40:05   oh yeah he's a great example right or [TS]

00:40:07   even antitrust amazon you know for the [TS]

00:40:08   most part and again don't trust them [TS]

00:40:10   entirely [TS]

00:40:11   I you have to be vigilant and so on and [TS]

00:40:13   so forth don't say oh I just trust them [TS]

00:40:14   to listen to everything my house that [TS]

00:40:15   never gonna do anything you will never [TS]

00:40:16   gonna sell me to advertise like I trust [TS]

00:40:18   them in that I kind of I know what [TS]

00:40:19   they're gonna do I know what they're [TS]

00:40:20   about but in general [TS]

00:40:21   still the company seems to me to be [TS]

00:40:23   mostly trying to do the right thing as [TS]

00:40:25   long as you understand their business [TS]

00:40:26   and how much advertising is a part of it [TS]

00:40:28   and what is probably gonna happen to all [TS]

00:40:29   your data and the fact that the u.s. [TS]

00:40:32   government is probably going to have [TS]

00:40:33   hooks into all this stuff and they're [TS]

00:40:35   not going to tell you about like as long [TS]

00:40:36   as you go on with a clear head [TS]

00:40:37   the bottom line is that by I I trusted [TS]

00:40:40   this is not i'm not like backdooring my [TS]

00:40:43   entire house forever and ever and I you [TS]

00:40:46   know and I wouldn't install a device [TS]

00:40:47   from a company that I trusted less or [TS]

00:40:49   company that was less competent or more [TS]

00:40:51   likely to go out of business or more [TS]

00:40:53   likely to get to do something in [TS]

00:40:55   desperation for money [TS]

00:40:56   you know what I mean like there's so [TS]

00:40:57   many things it for me in favor of google [TS]

00:40:59   so yes it is a trade-off but mostly what [TS]

00:41:01   it comes down to is that you know I [TS]

00:41:04   trust Google enough to put something [TS]

00:41:05   like this in my house you know I I spoke [TS]

00:41:09   about i think that i am a brand new [TS]

00:41:12   google photos user and the more i use [TS]

00:41:16   this app that both web app in the native [TS]

00:41:18   apps the more i like it in the morn [TS]

00:41:20   amazes me and and quickly during the [TS]

00:41:22   keynote they said oh and you know google [TS]

00:41:25   photos does some incredible things than [TS]

00:41:27   I think it's what 200 million active [TS]

00:41:28   users on it or something like that [TS]

00:41:29   whatever the number is but you can even [TS]

00:41:31   search for something like hugs and of [TS]

00:41:33   course in the room I mean it was half [TS]

00:41:35   Android developers are mostly Android [TS]

00:41:36   developers and a couple of theirs and so [TS]

00:41:38   I immediately hopped on google photos [TS]

00:41:39   and tighten hugs and sure enough there [TS]

00:41:41   are a bunch of people hugging each other [TS]

00:41:43   like usually Aaron me and Declan that [TS]

00:41:46   show up immediately like this stuff [TS]

00:41:47   google photos does is amazing and [TS]

00:41:51   seeing how good it is makes me wonder [TS]

00:41:53   then [TS]

00:41:55   well if they're this good with photos i [TS]

00:41:57   wonder how could they would be with this [TS]

00:41:58   google home thing so I agree with you [TS]

00:42:00   John that this it the the google photos [TS]

00:42:02   as kind of been my gateway drug back [TS]

00:42:05   into google like I still use gmail for [TS]

00:42:07   both work and personal mail but that's [TS]

00:42:09   just kind of a thing in the background I [TS]

00:42:11   don't ever use the web app it's all just [TS]

00:42:13   basically I'm apt to me but man google [TS]

00:42:15   photos has really changed my tune as to [TS]

00:42:17   how I think about Google these days and [TS]

00:42:19   i'm giving some serious positive side I [TS]

00:42:22   to this google home thing because it's [TS]

00:42:24   aesthetically pleasing be that being a [TS]

00:42:27   weeble or not it still looks good and [TS]

00:42:30   I'm tentatively interested in what the [TS]

00:42:34   springs in a way that I haven't really [TS]

00:42:35   been in the echo and not to bring this [TS]

00:42:38   back tough to food again but they were [TS]

00:42:41   here we go one that said show was [TS]

00:42:44   talking to maybe this was the ethics is [TS]

00:42:46   this one [TS]

00:42:46   talk about a I think getting the aloe [TS]

00:42:49   thing later but it's all tied up in the [TS]

00:42:51   same sort of natural language processing [TS]

00:42:53   type where they're asking questions of [TS]

00:42:56   these products and having it do things [TS]

00:42:57   for you and they always want to demo [TS]

00:42:59   those because they always want to show [TS]

00:43:00   that the video of like an entire family [TS]

00:43:02   talking to the to the google home device [TS]

00:43:04   which is a little bit overblown because [TS]

00:43:05   I can you know the impression you get is [TS]

00:43:07   this entire family spends its entire day [TS]

00:43:09   living in the same house but all all [TS]

00:43:10   their their words are addressed towards [TS]

00:43:13   the inanimate object instead of the [TS]

00:43:14   other people which I you know you kind [TS]

00:43:16   of get that because you have to you have [TS]

00:43:18   to fit in lots of examples of uses in a [TS]

00:43:20   single you know too many commercial and [TS]

00:43:23   anyway that aside a lot of what the [TS]

00:43:25   things are doing is trying to sell the [TS]

00:43:28   fantasy that it's like a personal [TS]

00:43:30   assistant where flight is delayed and [TS]

00:43:33   you want to move your dinner [TS]

00:43:34   reservations and you just wanted to [TS]

00:43:36   handle things for you and i start i [TS]

00:43:39   think those make for good good demos but [TS]

00:43:42   also bad demos because think they raise [TS]

00:43:44   expectations on reasonable levels [TS]

00:43:46   because every time they do something [TS]

00:43:46   like that [TS]

00:43:47   I see sort of like scrolling down the [TS]

00:43:49   side of my virtual screen like all the [TS]

00:43:51   cascading number of assumptions that are [TS]

00:43:53   in there that your restaurant has an [TS]

00:43:54   open table reservation that it [TS]

00:43:56   understands that you know that the [TS]

00:43:57   restaurant thing you're talking about [TS]

00:43:59   that is that that it knows about your [TS]

00:44:00   flight that you know like that you [TS]

00:44:02   didn't use a different email [TS]

00:44:03   just for this that it wasn't sent to a [TS]

00:44:04   different person that like that just so [TS]

00:44:07   many things have to go right for that to [TS]

00:44:09   work and they make it seem like you [TS]

00:44:11   don't have to worry about a care about [TS]

00:44:12   those but you do because if you're [TS]

00:44:13   flying on an airline that doesn't have [TS]

00:44:15   integration in the same way or you want [TS]

00:44:17   to go to restaurant that doesn't support [TS]

00:44:18   opentable or you something was done on a [TS]

00:44:21   spouse's account and not yours so you're [TS]

00:44:23   talking to but it doesn't understand it [TS]

00:44:25   doesn't know anything about that flight [TS]

00:44:26   because it's done through a different [TS]

00:44:27   google ID or you know like so many [TS]

00:44:30   possible things can go wrong to make [TS]

00:44:32   them not working when they do go wrong [TS]

00:44:34   even in the slightest way it's like the [TS]

00:44:36   old you know give up and use tables [TS]

00:44:37   website it's like if anything goes wrong [TS]

00:44:39   at all right forget how to do an iphone [TS]

00:44:41   or I'll sit down in front of the [TS]

00:44:41   computer because no I'm trying to have [TS]

00:44:43   an argument and getting a text adventure [TS]

00:44:45   syntax game with this thing so it all [TS]

00:44:47   looks magical and and the same thing [TS]

00:44:49   with like ordering food all the food [TS]

00:44:50   waiting for you to get home [TS]

00:44:52   food from where you want korean found in [TS]

00:44:54   your restaurant you just accepting the [TS]

00:44:55   restaurant that he gave you what if you [TS]

00:44:57   don't like the restaurant doesn't learn [TS]

00:44:58   which restaurant you like does it like [TS]

00:44:59   there [TS]

00:45:00   there's still this is so primitive where [TS]

00:45:02   it's not and I don't feel like it's [TS]

00:45:03   going to help me with my life unless I [TS]

00:45:05   just don't care where things come from [TS]

00:45:07   want the most generic things like I [TS]

00:45:08   wanted to know i always get indian food [TS]

00:45:11   from this place or if it's not sure they [TS]

00:45:14   should ask me do you want to get into [TS]

00:45:15   place you got last time and it's all [TS]

00:45:16   predicated on the fact that it can order [TS]

00:45:18   from those places you probably can't [TS]

00:45:19   because your favorite in places no idea [TS]

00:45:20   what computers are and they only take [TS]

00:45:21   cash and it's it just doesn't [TS]

00:45:24   we're not there yet and these ads make [TS]

00:45:26   it seem like they are there but I don't [TS]

00:45:28   know anybody except like mattis maybe [TS]

00:45:30   who can actually live this life like [TS]

00:45:32   where you just touch talking to the air [TS]

00:45:34   and everything you do is exactly [TS]

00:45:36   integrated and well he wouldn't like it [TS]

00:45:38   because you have know exactly where [TS]

00:45:39   everything is coming from you can't you [TS]

00:45:41   can't just say army indian food is the [TS]

00:45:42   safe Casey we talk about anybody can [TS]

00:45:44   just say army needs will be waiting for [TS]

00:45:46   you yet you'll be happy [TS]

00:45:47   order what what do you want to order [TS]

00:45:48   from where like it just it grinds my [TS]

00:45:52   gears to see that but anyway I i do have [TS]

00:45:55   confidence that google is going to be [TS]

00:45:56   better at this natural language stuff [TS]

00:45:58   than amazon just because they have so [TS]

00:46:00   many smart people doing this and Amazon [TS]

00:46:02   probably has a smaller slightly smaller [TS]

00:46:04   number of smart people dying but amazon [TS]

00:46:06   has has I think two big strains I mean [TS]

00:46:09   number one first of all I mentioned they [TS]

00:46:10   have massive retail power here to push [TS]

00:46:13   these things and [TS]

00:46:14   by all accounts the echo had probably [TS]

00:46:16   already has a a decent-sized install [TS]

00:46:19   base so that's that's you know barrier [TS]

00:46:21   number one for Google to try to overcome [TS]

00:46:22   you can you can overcome like the head [TS]

00:46:25   start the echo has gotten with a good [TS]

00:46:27   product but it's gonna be really hard to [TS]

00:46:29   overcome the massive retail and [TS]

00:46:31   promotional advantage you know just [TS]

00:46:33   asking just ask anybody who has tried to [TS]

00:46:35   make a successful technically advanced [TS]

00:46:38   e-reader in the last you know eight [TS]

00:46:40   years or so but that google has a big in [TS]

00:46:43   there because google home [TS]

00:46:45   who cares if the little turd that's an [TS]

00:46:48   outer downgraded from people ever sell [TS]

00:46:50   because all the set the same thing is [TS]

00:46:51   all powered by the whole assistant thing [TS]

00:46:53   and that's going to be on all their [TS]

00:46:54   phones and they have a ton of phone so [TS]

00:46:57   that is there that is the wedge [TS]

00:46:58   basically like look maybe the home never [TS]

00:47:00   beats out the echo but if we can make [TS]

00:47:02   this thing on all of our phones so that [TS]

00:47:04   you know the the 50-percent plus of the [TS]

00:47:07   world that has android smartphones gets [TS]

00:47:08   used to using this on their phones then [TS]

00:47:11   they'll still win because again the [TS]

00:47:13   phone is going to swap how many people [TS]

00:47:14   bought a little Solis cylinder even if [TS]

00:47:16   people just shout across the room to [TS]

00:47:17   their phones and people started adding [TS]

00:47:18   multiple microphone so you're right that [TS]

00:47:20   is a barrier but google already has like [TS]

00:47:23   a beachhead there they have they have a [TS]

00:47:24   way around like I think google care less [TS]

00:47:27   whether Google home succeeds then [TS]

00:47:29   whether this assistive technology [TS]

00:47:30   becomes sort of what Google is known for [TS]

00:47:32   in the modern error instead of just web [TS]

00:47:34   search [TS]

00:47:35   that's fair well so-and-so the other the [TS]

00:47:37   other all gather at the advantage that [TS]

00:47:39   amazon has right now is that the echo is [TS]

00:47:42   not trying to be that kind of like super [TS]

00:47:44   smart fantasy California land you know [TS]

00:47:48   or community food which magically does [TS]

00:47:49   exactly the right thing you want like [TS]

00:47:50   the echo is more like a really simple [TS]

00:47:54   command-line and once you learn the [TS]

00:47:57   relatively small vocabulary and and [TS]

00:48:00   syntax that a dead it supports it's [TS]

00:48:03   incredibly reliable doing those things [TS]

00:48:05   and so it I think while it might at [TS]

00:48:08   first have a slightly higher learning [TS]

00:48:11   curve for like you know day one two [TS]

00:48:13   three [TS]

00:48:13   I think once you get past the very very [TS]

00:48:16   initial part of it i would say the [TS]

00:48:18   echoes actually easier to use once you [TS]

00:48:20   figure out things the kind of things [TS]

00:48:21   that work with it [TS]

00:48:22   those things work incredibly reliably [TS]

00:48:24   and so that's that's the challenge [TS]

00:48:26   anybody has commanded us like I think [TS]

00:48:27   serie doesn't do as well that because [TS]

00:48:29   serie tries to do more doesn't have an [TS]

00:48:32   API that to Siri tries to do more but it [TS]

00:48:36   doesn't it doesn't really do any of them [TS]

00:48:39   reliably enough it and it's hard to know [TS]

00:48:41   before you before you ask Siri something [TS]

00:48:44   it's hard to know whether you will [TS]

00:48:46   succeed or not [TS]

00:48:47   whereas with the echo it's you get you [TS]

00:48:50   you figure it out within a few days to [TS]

00:48:51   figure out okay this is the kind of [TS]

00:48:52   thing will succeed this is the kind of [TS]

00:48:53   want google is obviously trying to be [TS]

00:48:57   very ambitious with with the kinds of [TS]

00:48:59   things that that their thing can do the [TS]

00:49:01   google home can do we will see if it [TS]

00:49:03   works I think if anybody can do that [TS]

00:49:05   kind of complexity it's them so it might [TS]

00:49:09   work to me I think the biggest risk for [TS]

00:49:12   buying into the google home ecosystem is [TS]

00:49:15   whether Google themselves will lose [TS]

00:49:18   interest or it will fail within a few [TS]

00:49:21   years because you know their track [TS]

00:49:24   record for that isn't great either [TS]

00:49:26   something is not working they're the [TS]

00:49:27   first ones to to kill it usually just [TS]

00:49:30   don't tell them to feedburner is still [TS]

00:49:31   running because i think they thought I [TS]

00:49:33   think about it but anyway you know [TS]

00:49:36   google is they [TS]

00:49:39   if you look at the history of like [TS]

00:49:40   various initiatives they've had various [TS]

00:49:42   like big platforms have tried to launch [TS]

00:49:44   its it's littered it's a huge graveyard [TS]

00:49:47   stuff they've shut down so it's no [TS]

00:49:50   different than amazon well that's true [TS]

00:49:51   but if they try this out if it doesn't [TS]

00:49:55   get very far in the market it you know [TS]

00:49:57   they could choose to fight harder and to [TS]

00:50:00   keep going or to shut it down so and if [TS]

00:50:03   you if you like bought the wrong [TS]

00:50:04   hardware and they shut yours down like [TS]

00:50:06   that kind of sucks it's kind of like a [TS]

00:50:08   format war going on but don't you think [TS]

00:50:10   this this has a big advantage in that [TS]

00:50:11   the underlying technology was under like [TS]

00:50:13   this and aloe and all that stuff but the [TS]

00:50:16   underlying sort of machine intelligence [TS]

00:50:17   natural language processing speech [TS]

00:50:20   interface that I feel like is a core [TS]

00:50:23   technological effort to google that is [TS]

00:50:26   not going away like a hundred percent [TS]

00:50:27   guaranteed not going away right now the [TS]

00:50:30   individual products you're right maybe [TS]

00:50:31   they get google home and end up like oh [TS]

00:50:33   we have the second version is not [TS]

00:50:34   compatible and you're stuck with some [TS]

00:50:36   bad hardware and they meant to stop [TS]

00:50:37   supporting I could totally see that [TS]

00:50:38   happening [TS]

00:50:38   that's a danger in any sort of product [TS]

00:50:40   like this and there you know [TS]

00:50:41   historically because i have not been [TS]

00:50:42   particularly good about preserving that [TS]

00:50:44   but I if you're going to have any faith [TS]

00:50:47   in any sign of product efforts it's not [TS]

00:50:48   going to be like the the weather [TS]

00:50:50   balloons that give you Wi-Fi or the [TS]

00:50:51   self-driving cars is going to be the [TS]

00:50:54   natural extension of basically the [TS]

00:50:56   Google's core product which is search [TS]

00:50:58   which is that taking that to the next [TS]

00:51:00   level also because it ties into [TS]

00:51:01   advertising if you can be honest like a [TS]

00:51:03   why would Google stick with this time [TS]

00:51:05   ever they've been doing it for years [TS]

00:51:06   right and be it totally fits with web [TS]

00:51:09   search both web search and advertising [TS]

00:51:11   so i have to think that this effort will [TS]

00:51:14   continue to go on and if these products [TS]

00:51:16   are like that they will iterate on them [TS]

00:51:18   that they will they will make future [TS]

00:51:19   versions of and then we'll keep going [TS]

00:51:20   and there is a still slim chance that [TS]

00:51:22   you buy some hardware might be offered [TS]

00:51:24   because they bail on that have a new [TS]

00:51:25   iteration with a new name or whatever [TS]

00:51:27   but I really think this is not esoteric [TS]

00:51:32   or in in fear of being a [TS]

00:51:34   flash-in-the-pan simply because it just [TS]

00:51:36   read so much as Google to be a not [TS]

00:51:38   tangential like I feel like this is if [TS]

00:51:40   you were to say what does google like 50 [TS]

00:51:42   years in the future [TS]

00:51:43   it looks less like typing in text boxes [TS]

00:51:45   and more like a much better version of [TS]

00:51:46   this because it's just such a natural [TS]

00:51:48   extension and certainly wasn't machine [TS]

00:51:51   learning was their version of customer [TS]

00:51:54   SAT like if we were doing a drinking [TS]

00:51:57   game and machine learning caused you to [TS]

00:51:58   drink you would have been under the [TS]

00:52:00   table after the first 20 minutes because [TS]

00:52:02   that's all we heard about and I mean [TS]

00:52:03   Apple has its own foibles and very [TS]

00:52:05   similar ways like customer SAT but [TS]

00:52:07   machine learning was all over this [TS]

00:52:09   keynote and i agree with you John but [TS]

00:52:10   that seems to be where they're pushing [TS]

00:52:12   as a company is is trying to leverage [TS]

00:52:14   that machine learning in in any possible [TS]

00:52:17   way that they can and in some of those [TS]

00:52:18   ways like I've been talking about with [TS]

00:52:20   google photos and with google home [TS]

00:52:22   I think it looks really promising and [TS]

00:52:24   really really interesting and like it [TS]

00:52:27   sits there was their their their logo or [TS]

00:52:30   their motto revision state whatever like [TS]

00:52:32   organizing the world's information [TS]

00:52:33   they've been slowly but steadily doing [TS]

00:52:36   that over the course of many many years [TS]

00:52:37   trying to get semantics into the [TS]

00:52:39   information so i don't understand not [TS]

00:52:41   just like oh this word appears there and [TS]

00:52:43   these people link to that page but [TS]

00:52:44   understanding what the information is [TS]

00:52:45   that is actually looking at two [TS]

00:52:46   that's how we can do that photo stuff [TS]

00:52:48   isn't the photos that doesn't just come [TS]

00:52:49   out of nowhere get a one-year project to [TS]

00:52:51   do it that's based on years and years of [TS]

00:52:53   research outside google and within and [TS]

00:52:56   just working on it working on their [TS]

00:52:58   their language parsing that open source [TS]

00:52:59   that big you know natural language [TS]

00:53:01   processing thing and image recognition [TS]

00:53:04   and then stuffed with robotic this is [TS]

00:53:06   all about taking in information and then [TS]

00:53:09   developing an understanding of it that [TS]

00:53:11   can be encoded by computer so the [TS]

00:53:13   computers can act on it so it's not just [TS]

00:53:15   text so that they understand the meaning [TS]

00:53:18   behind things once you have even the [TS]

00:53:19   barest meaning or the barest sort of [TS]

00:53:22   sensory perception of like is a car as a [TS]

00:53:24   hug [TS]

00:53:25   what language this end where the words [TS]

00:53:26   mean that previous sentence when I say [TS]

00:53:29   said he and the next sense what are they [TS]

00:53:30   talking about like it's really basic [TS]

00:53:33   stuff [TS]

00:53:33   conceptually but it's really hard to do [TS]

00:53:36   for computers and they're doing on such [TS]

00:53:38   a massive scale that that that effort in [TS]

00:53:40   that research just is going to underlie [TS]

00:53:42   all their products from from here going [TS]

00:53:44   forward and maybe they're gonna hit that [TS]

00:53:46   inflection point where suddenly becomes [TS]

00:53:48   acceptable and and like it passes the [TS]

00:53:51   barrier from tech curiosity that were [TS]

00:53:53   all impressed by that but then only [TS]

00:53:55   nerds really use to just a normal thing [TS]

00:53:57   that everybody does [TS]

00:53:58   we may be getting close to that if only [TS]

00:54:00   because people don't like typing stuff [TS]

00:54:03   is all someone tweeting when the i/o [TS]

00:54:04   things going on at like how many people [TS]

00:54:06   will still see interacting with their [TS]

00:54:09   android phones or there you know iOS [TS]

00:54:12   devices purely by speech even though a [TS]

00:54:15   computer nerd looking at them with just [TS]

00:54:17   cringe and how incredibly inefficient is [TS]

00:54:19   to essentially be arguing with your [TS]

00:54:21   phone and saying things over and over [TS]

00:54:22   again and trying to type things just [TS]

00:54:24   just just give me your phone let me show [TS]

00:54:25   you how to do this but people prefer it [TS]

00:54:28   even when it's totally broken and crappy [TS]

00:54:30   and doesn't work right [TS]

00:54:31   just because it's more comfortable for [TS]

00:54:33   them so i think we're probably closer to [TS]

00:54:35   the inflection point where most people [TS]

00:54:37   use what will continue to be the most [TS]

00:54:39   massively inefficient way to do anything [TS]

00:54:41   especially when it has any sort of error [TS]

00:54:42   simply because it's just more [TS]

00:54:43   comfortable for them then trying to [TS]

00:54:46   figure out what things to tap on or what [TS]

00:54:48   to type our final sponsor this week is [TS]

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00:55:22   in searching and a lot more i have used [TS]

00:55:24   kingdom to monitor the stuff i do since [TS]

00:55:27   2007 all tumblr all events the paper all [TS]

00:55:31   of overcast and marketed or the entire [TS]

00:55:33   time it is great it alerts meet whenever [TS]

00:55:36   anything is and I i usually do to alert [TS]

00:55:39   levels i do one called vitals which is I [TS]

00:55:42   have all the servers report they're like [TS]

00:55:44   disk space and free memory and [TS]

00:55:45   everything so that I have like a low [TS]

00:55:47   alert level 40 you know what this then [TS]

00:55:50   one of the five web servers is not rape [TS]

00:55:52   is not responding or the server has it [TS]

00:55:55   has a very limited space or something [TS]

00:55:56   and that just sends me emails and [TS]

00:55:59   notifications and then I have another [TS]

00:56:01   alert level if the whole site is down [TS]

00:56:02   that sets off the alarm bells that sends [TS]

00:56:05   me text messages that is like a type you [TS]

00:56:07   know loud notifications it's like the [TS]

00:56:09   different level of alerts what they know [TS]

00:56:11   i've also used in the past to do things [TS]

00:56:13   like like monitor the Apple WC website [TS]

00:56:17   to see when WC was announced every year [TS]

00:56:19   because we monitor the page for change [TS]

00:56:22   it is so you don't actually have to own [TS]

00:56:23   the sites are monitoring the kingdom [TS]

00:56:25   it's great i recommend them I use it [TS]

00:56:27   myself i have used it literally since [TS]

00:56:29   2007 so i use it now for nine years and [TS]

00:56:33   i will continue using it because it is [TS]

00:56:35   awesome used before they were sponsor [TS]

00:56:37   now they are sponsor that's amazing so [TS]

00:56:38   anyway give me your other monitor and [TS]

00:56:41   optional conditions to check for orders [TS]

00:56:43   check whether something's up and 187 [TS]

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00:56:47   can fix the problem before it becomes a [TS]

00:56:49   much bigger and more costly adage you [TS]

00:56:51   should not be learning your site is down [TS]

00:56:52   from people on Twitter that's [TS]

00:56:53   embarrassing it's unprofessional be the [TS]

00:56:55   first to know [TS]

00:56:56   with kingdom and then you can fix your [TS]

00:56:58   site before too many customers our [TS]

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00:57:10   our show [TS]

00:57:11   let's talk about allow governor og's and [TS]

00:57:17   you still wanted to say that i know i [TS]

00:57:19   just wanted to say i did i did the this [TS]

00:57:21   is going to be the week of bad podcast [TS]

00:57:23   british accents [TS]

00:57:24   hey yeah if they didn't put an [TS]

00:57:25   apostrophe before the a that's true [TS]

00:57:28   that's true i'll buy it reminds me a lot [TS]

00:57:30   of fellow that weird social network that [TS]

00:57:33   didn't go anywhere [TS]

00:57:33   it's still spams me for every few days [TS]

00:57:35   but something that subscribe button [TS]

00:57:37   subscribe for all those i have anyway so [TS]

00:57:41   Google LOL is the UH I message knock off [TS]

00:57:46   but with a lot more it's not just [TS]

00:57:48   something I message along I was like a [TS]

00:57:50   line knock off or what's that love hurts [TS]

00:57:53   it's much more likely be much more [TS]

00:57:55   sophisticated messaging apps that are [TS]

00:57:57   used outside the apple ecosystem it's [TS]

00:57:58   got stickers for crying out loud [TS]

00:58:02   fair enough that's a big text yeah so [TS]

00:58:04   actually that was a very interesting [TS]

00:58:05   interaction so they went i forget which [TS]

00:58:08   person is presented with this the [TS]

00:58:10   British woman that was presenting at [TS]

00:58:11   this point in any case somebody whoever [TS]

00:58:14   was presenting was talking about how [TS]

00:58:16   there are times when you want to kind of [TS]

00:58:19   shout when it in a text message [TS]

00:58:21   conversation there's times where you [TS]

00:58:22   kind of want to whisper and so they [TS]

00:58:25   allow you to change the font size within [TS]

00:58:27   a low which in and of itself doesn't [TS]

00:58:30   seem that impressive but I thought the [TS]

00:58:31   interaction is pretty cool [TS]

00:58:33   we're on iOS in the messages app you [TS]

00:58:35   have a little microphone icon and you [TS]

00:58:37   can swipe up and down to like send an [TS]

00:58:39   audio message what they do is they [TS]

00:58:42   if you tap and hold roughly where our [TS]

00:58:45   microphone icon is it will let you kind [TS]

00:58:47   of drag a slider up and down to change [TS]

00:58:50   the the size of the fund which I thought [TS]

00:58:52   again was a very clever interaction so [TS]

00:58:54   many things wrong with that from a [TS]

00:58:55   usability perspective that I can you [TS]

00:58:57   like and from a taste perspective like [TS]

00:58:59   this is just such a totally a google [TS]

00:59:00   thing to do [TS]

00:59:01   where someone thinks is a cool feature [TS]

00:59:03   and it seems like they don't think quite [TS]

00:59:05   enough about the implications both [TS]

00:59:06   aesthetically where you can make really [TS]

00:59:08   ugly look at even the demo screenshots [TS]

00:59:10   looking for the ugly and I was thinking [TS]

00:59:11   to myself that there's anything wrong [TS]

00:59:13   with ugly and garish like it that's the [TS]

00:59:14   SI you're going for but i was thinking [TS]

00:59:16   like this is the opposite of the Apple [TS]

00:59:19   aesthetic and it can be more fun like [TS]

00:59:21   the APIs that it can be boring right you [TS]

00:59:23   know or [TS]

00:59:23   everything is all hell that again [TS]

00:59:24   everything is the same size and [TS]

00:59:25   everything is sort of clean and [TS]

00:59:26   button-down like you know I'm not I'm [TS]

00:59:28   not slamming i'm really not like but I [TS]

00:59:30   saw him like wow this is definitely [TS]

00:59:32   something that wouldn't do and for the [TS]

00:59:34   shouting find fun make your text bigger [TS]

00:59:36   it's fun to shout so on and so forth [TS]

00:59:38   whispering not good for usability you [TS]

00:59:40   telling me i can make the text [TS]

00:59:41   microscopic boy of my age relatives will [TS]

00:59:44   love to squinted that when I owe you [TS]

00:59:46   don't understand great on whispering no [TS]

00:59:48   you can't I mean maybe it's over right [TS]

00:59:50   about the local level but it just [TS]

00:59:52   doesn't make for a good demo because the [TS]

00:59:54   obvious question which is really i can [TS]

00:59:57   make text so small that my recipient can [TS]

00:59:59   even region [TS]

00:59:59   even region [TS]

01:00:00   the squint that's the question in [TS]

01:00:02   people's minds if they're looking at it [TS]

01:00:03   from an accessibility perspective so [TS]

01:00:05   just throw a sentence out there that [TS]

01:00:06   says the thing that I really hope is [TS]

01:00:08   true which is like oh and of course the [TS]

01:00:09   recipients at a minimum font sizes in [TS]

01:00:10   like whatever you have to say address [TS]

01:00:13   the will get this later with some more [TS]

01:00:15   stuff from the the knock-knock duo what [TS]

01:00:18   do you call a videoconferencing thing [TS]

01:00:20   like if there's an obvious there should [TS]

01:00:22   be an obvious question most people's [TS]

01:00:24   minds about the future you're going [TS]

01:00:25   throw out a sentence or two to reassure [TS]

01:00:27   us that the feature that you surely [TS]

01:00:29   added to account for this is there [TS]

01:00:30   because if you don't say it or left to [TS]

01:00:32   think that you haven't thought of it and [TS]

01:00:34   even if that's not true gives a bad [TS]

01:00:35   impression and in this case I don't [TS]

01:00:37   trust cool to think these things they [TS]

01:00:39   very often do things that like you know [TS]

01:00:42   that the company the company's persona [TS]

01:00:44   is that of an individual that doesn't [TS]

01:00:50   account for the variety of different [TS]

01:00:52   kinds of people on lives that are out [TS]

01:00:54   there and I know they're fighting very [TS]

01:00:56   hard against that don't know it's kind [TS]

01:00:57   of unfair but a lot of times I see [TS]

01:00:59   Google do things with obvious problems [TS]

01:01:02   that i assume that they have accounted [TS]

01:01:04   for [TS]

01:01:04   then they release a product I said oh [TS]

01:01:06   they didn't account for that in fact it [TS]

01:01:08   seems like that even think of that and [TS]

01:01:09   they'll fix it after the fact their [TS]

01:01:10   credit and it's not like they're trying [TS]

01:01:11   to to do something wrong but sometimes [TS]

01:01:13   they dropped the ball so I'm saying [TS]

01:01:15   Google your presentations for the [TS]

01:01:16   foreseeable future when you'd show a [TS]

01:01:18   feature that has obvious problems [TS]

01:01:21   throughout to us APPL assault I'm short [TS]

01:01:23   two or three words to say oh and of [TS]

01:01:25   course don't worry about this because we [TS]

01:01:27   handle it an XY way like in the obvious [TS]

01:01:29   way because I don't think for me anyway [TS]

01:01:31   they get the past making me think that [TS]

01:01:33   they thought of that I think that's [TS]

01:01:34   understandable [TS]

01:01:35   we should also talk about the predictive [TS]

01:01:37   replies are suggested replies with King [TS]

01:01:41   machine-learning ding that seems weird [TS]

01:01:46   to me and I very conflicting thoughts [TS]

01:01:48   about this which is actually kind of a [TS]

01:01:49   theme for most of what I what I thought [TS]

01:01:51   of google i/o but it seemed odd to me to [TS]

01:01:54   have suggested replies on a phone or a [TS]

01:01:58   tablet where it's relatively easy to [TS]

01:02:01   type like I don't have I don't really [TS]

01:02:04   have a problem with it on the Apple [TS]

01:02:06   watch partially because it's so terrible [TS]

01:02:07   in partially because partially because [TS]

01:02:10   you can't exactly type on an Apple watch [TS]

01:02:12   it [TS]

01:02:12   going to get to that later as well [TS]

01:02:13   hopefully but on a device where there's [TS]

01:02:16   some reasonable approximation of a [TS]

01:02:19   keyboard it just seems insensitive like [TS]

01:02:22   one of the examples they use like a [TS]

01:02:23   picture of a kid uh how cute was one of [TS]

01:02:26   the replies like I don't know it just [TS]

01:02:27   seems insensitive or Colton both so [TS]

01:02:32   here's an example a great following fri [TS]

01:02:34   said he remember where they did realize [TS]

01:02:37   what the obvious objection to this [TS]

01:02:38   feature would be and address it with the [TS]

01:02:40   sensor choose so the obvious objection [TS]

01:02:42   for the demos is like I would never tap [TS]

01:02:44   any of those circles because all of them [TS]

01:02:46   sound like inane things like that that's [TS]

01:02:48   not how I communicate right just like [TS]

01:02:50   you were saying like really all how cute [TS]

01:02:52   am I going to send that like or it's [TS]

01:02:54   going to look like a form letter or it's [TS]

01:02:56   gonna look like an reply nomid similar [TS]

01:02:58   complaints about the inbox software they [TS]

01:03:01   have her auto replying to emails and [TS]

01:03:02   stuff like that [TS]

01:03:03   that's the obvious objection to any sort [TS]

01:03:05   of hey we'll figure out what you're [TS]

01:03:06   gonna reply and give it to you in a box [TS]

01:03:07   right and they addressed immediately [TS]

01:03:09   with a single sentence which may or you [TS]

01:03:10   know maybe we're not actually address [TS]

01:03:12   the issue in the product but they're [TS]

01:03:12   saying oh and don't worry we will learn [TS]

01:03:15   from what you actually reply and suggest [TS]

01:03:17   things that are essentially things that [TS]

01:03:18   you have said before that are otherwise [TS]

01:03:19   in your voice now will they be [TS]

01:03:21   successful at that [TS]

01:03:23   well they just literally have replies [TS]

01:03:24   have had before and it'll sound dumb and [TS]

01:03:25   none of that none of the boxes look [TS]

01:03:27   right but at least they understand that [TS]

01:03:29   they can't suggest replies without [TS]

01:03:32   taking what you how you actually [TS]

01:03:33   communicate as an input and so they said [TS]

01:03:35   no that's exactly what we're doing now [TS]

01:03:37   again they can do a bad job of it and [TS]

01:03:39   will still be a stupid feature that that [TS]

01:03:40   people want to turn off but if they do a [TS]

01:03:42   good job but it's like yes that's [TS]

01:03:43   exactly what I want I want you to watch [TS]

01:03:45   how i type to people and preferably how [TS]

01:03:48   I communicate with different people how [TS]

01:03:49   do i reply to my mom vs my wife vs my [TS]

01:03:51   friend you know what I mean that's [TS]

01:03:53   machine learning and again they keep [TS]

01:03:55   bleeding on that hopefully that's what [TS]

01:03:56   they're aiming for [TS]

01:03:57   they're not saying oh we're just going [TS]

01:03:59   to give you a bunch of kin replies like [TS]

01:04:02   the Apple watch does our [TS]

01:04:03   probabilistically try to make a reply [TS]

01:04:06   that would make some sense you know [TS]

01:04:07   Apple watch is not learning our applied [TS]

01:04:09   has no way to learn from our reply apple [TS]

01:04:11   doesn't have that information or [TS]

01:04:12   whatever but google at least says this [TS]

01:04:15   is what we're trying to do and I really [TS]

01:04:16   hope they do because that's that's the [TS]

01:04:18   dream right [TS]

01:04:19   yeah that's where they also have plenty [TS]

01:04:23   of third-party integrations in ello [TS]

01:04:26   and I initially was really keen on this [TS]

01:04:30   so i forget the exact example they used [TS]

01:04:32   but say you're talking with your wife [TS]

01:04:34   about where you want to go to dinner and [TS]

01:04:35   you know so I'm talking about it she so [TS]

01:04:37   would you like pizza and I say yes I'd [TS]

01:04:39   love some cc's then it will try to [TS]

01:04:42   figure out some sort of contextual e [TS]

01:04:45   relevant information like if it's [TS]

01:04:47   something nicer than CC so can i get [TS]

01:04:48   your reservation or perhaps here's [TS]

01:04:50   directions there cetera and on the wall [TS]

01:04:53   at first i thought wow that's super [TS]

01:04:55   convenient really useful but then I [TS]

01:04:57   thought about it and I thought I don't [TS]

01:04:58   know if I'd really want that in an [TS]

01:05:00   iMessage conversation which obviously [TS]

01:05:02   heroes are approximately equivalent with [TS]

01:05:04   aaron like that just seems weird to me [TS]

01:05:07   and and I can't I haven't put my finger [TS]

01:05:09   on which 1i think more [TS]

01:05:11   well it's great that they kept leaning [TS]

01:05:13   on this and I think it is a great [TS]

01:05:14   features that you don't have to leave [TS]

01:05:15   the apt this frustrates me when I'm on [TS]

01:05:17   my phone communicate with somebody that [TS]

01:05:18   i have to like wait let me go google [TS]

01:05:20   that or we know wait let me go to the [TS]

01:05:22   other apt to do the thing having [TS]

01:05:24   everything in line one aspect of it is [TS]

01:05:26   like do I want the other person to see [TS]

01:05:27   sort of the research I'm doing here do i [TS]

01:05:29   want to share these things that's [TS]

01:05:31   questionable debatable though if you're [TS]

01:05:33   trying to decide in restaurants maybe [TS]

01:05:34   they do want to see them so you don't [TS]

01:05:35   have to describe the restaurants are [TS]

01:05:36   typed them all in so i can see the [TS]

01:05:39   deciding what to share versus what's [TS]

01:05:40   your own but the big advantage that [TS]

01:05:41   Apple that google is selling and i think [TS]

01:05:43   is a real advantages you don't switch to [TS]

01:05:45   15 different apps you can get it all [TS]

01:05:47   done here mostly because sort of the [TS]

01:05:49   power of google is showing through [TS]

01:05:50   inside this chat application we will do [TS]

01:05:54   all the searching in the pulling of the [TS]

01:05:55   search results in smart ways and even [TS]

01:05:57   the ordering in the making the [TS]

01:05:58   reservation and again it falls back on [TS]

01:06:00   like that's a silly scenario unless [TS]

01:06:02   everything in your life is integrated [TS]

01:06:04   with google and all the things you care [TS]

01:06:05   about their party integration but hey at [TS]

01:06:07   least they have third-party integrations [TS]

01:06:08   and third-party really care about this [TS]

01:06:10   they can integrate and never a start [TS]

01:06:11   really cares and wants to sell to tech [TS]

01:06:13   nerds in the san francisco area they can [TS]

01:06:15   integrate with it doesn't help [TS]

01:06:17   most of the rest of the country whose [TS]

01:06:18   favorite restaurants are not integrated [TS]

01:06:20   in this way but at least maybe you can [TS]

01:06:21   get directions to them assuming the [TS]

01:06:23   google has accurate information for [TS]

01:06:25   where they are so of this one is a [TS]

01:06:28   little bit fantasy but Google is doing [TS]

01:06:31   all the right things I think making [TS]

01:06:34   people not leave the app is actually the [TS]

01:06:35   right thing is just difficult to draw [TS]

01:06:37   line of how much crap to any of the [TS]

01:06:39   other person to see versus how much [TS]

01:06:41   stuff do I need to see to make a [TS]

01:06:43   decision [TS]

01:06:44   yep they also allow you to play what [TS]

01:06:46   they call the emoji game in line so if [TS]

01:06:49   you get bored talking to your spouse you [TS]

01:06:52   can play the guess the movie title by [TS]

01:06:53   emojis game which strikes me as the one [TS]

01:06:58   they call a digital touch features on [TS]

01:07:01   the Apple watch but but it's not though [TS]

01:07:04   because this was just there sort of like [TS]

01:07:06   hello world example program the ideas [TS]

01:07:09   that again third parties can make actual [TS]

01:07:11   fun teams with this API this is more [TS]

01:07:13   like see its name it's like making a you [TS]

01:07:16   know an echo server for demonstrating [TS]

01:07:18   your like simple you know server-side [TS]

01:07:20   concurrency framework right it just goes [TS]

01:07:22   back whatever you put in [TS]

01:07:23   it's not a real thing it's an API and [TS]

01:07:26   they fully expect people to make real [TS]

01:07:28   fun games out of this and you know [TS]

01:07:30   integrations with third-party products [TS]

01:07:32   games leading third-party products like [TS]

01:07:34   there are many opportunities for both [TS]

01:07:36   advertising and commerce integrated into [TS]

01:07:39   this and so I think I think showing that [TS]

01:07:42   and by the way onstage essentially [TS]

01:07:44   saying shall we play a game to your [TS]

01:07:46   computer is not a good look so maybe [TS]

01:07:48   stay away from that but the big thing I [TS]

01:07:52   think they weren't selling is that we [TS]

01:07:54   didn't just make a chat app that has [TS]

01:07:55   some features in this version of Android [TS]

01:07:57   this is now another platform for you to [TS]

01:08:00   target all your stuff that you people [TS]

01:08:02   out there who have products and [TS]

01:08:04   applications and services can integrate [TS]

01:08:06   with this and be integrated with it in a [TS]

01:08:08   way that you people can buy your stuff [TS]

01:08:10   and find their way to your thing and [TS]

01:08:12   play your game that advertises your [TS]

01:08:14   thing or whatever like that's the [TS]

01:08:16   feature the actual like emoji game I i [TS]

01:08:19   don't think that was it was probably [TS]

01:08:21   clear to developers but a regular person [TS]

01:08:22   saw they'll be like oh I'm not [TS]

01:08:23   interested in mochigames I'm gonna [TS]

01:08:25   ignore the emoji game that is just a [TS]

01:08:26   proof-of-concept hello world type thing [TS]

01:08:28   other integrations is what you're [TS]

01:08:30   looking for here [TS]

01:08:31   fair enough then they made mention [TS]

01:08:35   during the yellow conversation and a [TS]

01:08:37   couple other times about security which [TS]

01:08:40   I really really liked that Google and [TS]

01:08:42   Apple seem to be quietly colluding in [TS]

01:08:45   the good way to try to make their their [TS]

01:08:48   platforms more secure but that being [TS]

01:08:50   said I wasn't entirely clear on what the [TS]

01:08:53   security situation is in l.o it seems [TS]

01:08:56   that there's kind of two modes there's [TS]

01:08:58   the general normal use mode which is [TS]

01:09:02   encrypted ish i guess it's encrypted [TS]

01:09:06   enough to prevent snooping by anyone but [TS]

01:09:11   google because they need to have their [TS]

01:09:12   equivalent of slackware yes [TS]

01:09:15   yeah the slack bought in there in order [TS]

01:09:17   to see offer all these suggestions and [TS]

01:09:21   then there's an incognito mode which is [TS]

01:09:23   just like chrome in your messaging app [TS]

01:09:27   which is apparently encrypted et tui for [TS]

01:09:29   end-to-end that just I i like it overall [TS]

01:09:34   but that just seems weird to me to have [TS]

01:09:36   to think about whether or not you want [TS]

01:09:38   this to be indented encrypted yeah and I [TS]

01:09:41   wasn't clear to ride but i watch most of [TS]

01:09:44   this presentation but didn't get a [TS]

01:09:45   chance to really watch the segment in [TS]

01:09:46   incognito mode doesn't hide you as the [TS]

01:09:48   centre-right like it's it it's the other [TS]

01:09:50   person still knows it's you talking [TS]

01:09:52   right you just initiated a new [TS]

01:09:53   end-to-end encrypted sighs I think [TS]

01:09:55   that's correct yeah alright so anyway [TS]

01:09:57   yeah it's it's it's I think you you got [TS]

01:10:01   exactly right it it's a difference [TS]

01:10:03   between can could google encrypt this if [TS]

01:10:05   they wanted to [TS]

01:10:07   in theory or can't nobody do it and as [TS]

01:10:10   has been talking discussed at length [TS]

01:10:12   with iMessage even though I messages and [TS]

01:10:14   encrypted well because Apple has control [TS]

01:10:16   over the key servers still technically [TS]

01:10:18   of Apple wanted to be in the various [TS]

01:10:20   they could you know to grip your [TS]

01:10:23   conversations as they happen they don't [TS]

01:10:25   do that and they don't plan to do that [TS]

01:10:27   and they and they say they'll fight the [TS]

01:10:28   government steps to make them do that [TS]

01:10:29   but there's so many other ways to get [TS]

01:10:31   the information like the I could be [TS]

01:10:33   encrypted iCloud backups of your [TS]

01:10:34   conversations and yeah it's much more [TS]

01:10:36   complicated than simply putting into we [TS]

01:10:38   open screen especially with it with it [TS]

01:10:41   with the government climate the way it [TS]

01:10:42   is but yeah the reason google I think [TS]

01:10:45   doesn't didn't have I message that [TS]

01:10:46   encryption for the beginning is because [TS]

01:10:48   google wants to be able to see [TS]

01:10:51   everything that you type and it wants to [TS]

01:10:53   have a participant in the conversation [TS]

01:10:55   was in on it even if you didn't end and [TS]

01:10:56   encryption one of your authenticated and [TS]

01:10:59   then recipients would be [TS]

01:11:01   something on Google server somewhere [TS]

01:11:02   like I don't think they're anonymizing [TS]

01:11:04   when they go back like a palace when [TS]

01:11:06   they go back to the serious stuff is [TS]

01:11:07   they kind of have to know things about [TS]

01:11:08   you and know who you are to do smart [TS]

01:11:11   server-side things I don't think all [TS]

01:11:13   this is happening on the phone right [TS]

01:11:14   there is a service I component so it's [TS]

01:11:15   the attention we always talked about is [TS]

01:11:17   like that Apple's trying to be good [TS]

01:11:18   about privacy and I don't even want to [TS]

01:11:20   know your stuff but if you want [TS]

01:11:22   personalized service from you know in an [TS]

01:11:25   intelligent agent with machine learning [TS]

01:11:27   television has to know how you who you [TS]

01:11:29   are i mean i wanted to know who i am but [TS]

01:11:31   now all of a sudden this intelligent [TS]

01:11:33   agent is privy to my conversations and [TS]

01:11:35   it's not a person and it's essentially [TS]

01:11:38   only controlled by google so end and [TS]

01:11:40   contribute and encrypting it with the [TS]

01:11:42   agent is not really helping things are [TS]

01:11:44   you worried about the the government [TS]

01:11:47   forcing google to get records anyway I [TS]

01:11:50   think in this day and age if there's [TS]

01:11:51   something you don't want the government [TS]

01:11:53   to see don't send it through google or [TS]

01:11:57   any other service probably even Apple I [TS]

01:11:59   mean apples probably your best bet but [TS]

01:12:00   in general you have to take encryption [TS]

01:12:02   into your own hands you actually I was [TS]

01:12:04   just fairly easy to do like it you know [TS]

01:12:06   the math exists out there you can get [TS]

01:12:08   encryption software and use it yourself [TS]

01:12:09   and communicate with somebody in a way [TS]

01:12:11   that the government can subpoena anybody [TS]

01:12:13   to get but the end you'll probably just [TS]

01:12:14   screwed up and they'll be able to social [TS]

01:12:16   engineer something out of goodness [TS]

01:12:20   alright let's talk about duo and knock [TS]

01:12:23   knock so duo is facetime but not there's [TS]

01:12:28   more to it than that and then what is [TS]

01:12:30   knock-knock that's the intro mode in duo [TS]

01:12:32   is that right yeah but that's enough [TS]

01:12:35   this is another one of the demos where [TS]

01:12:36   they didn't say the obvious thing like [TS]

01:12:38   oh and when someone's calling you look I [TS]

01:12:40   can see my daughter and I you know it's [TS]

01:12:41   like you're your phone is ringing [TS]

01:12:42   centers like FaceTime ringing right and [TS]

01:12:45   rather than just seeing the name of the [TS]

01:12:47   caller and maybe like a little picture [TS]

01:12:48   of them from your contacts or whatever [TS]

01:12:50   like you know your daughter is calling [TS]

01:12:52   and you see the daughters name and yet [TS]

01:12:54   still picture your daughter what you [TS]

01:12:56   instead see is video from the the caller [TS]

01:13:00   side before you've decided whether you [TS]

01:13:03   want to pick up or not right [TS]

01:13:05   how can you do that demo on stage and [TS]

01:13:08   not immediately say but don't worry this [TS]

01:13:11   only happens for known contacts that are [TS]

01:13:13   in your address [TS]

01:13:14   spoken communication surely that is the [TS]

01:13:16   case to say that you have to actually [TS]

01:13:19   say the words it takes two seconds to [TS]

01:13:21   say the words otherwise the entire [TS]

01:13:22   audience is going oh my god naked people [TS]

01:13:25   are gonna be calling me constantly and [TS]

01:13:26   i'm going to instantly see their video [TS]

01:13:27   because i can't stop them it's like I [TS]

01:13:29   like do they not have women the company [TS]

01:13:31   like this is it that women would say i [TS]

01:13:33   do not want to see a million guys junk [TS]

01:13:36   as they randomly dial me and I have no [TS]

01:13:38   choice and I see video of it immediately [TS]

01:13:39   like and again I don't think that's [TS]

01:13:42   gonna happen [TS]

01:13:42   surely this only works for like your [TS]

01:13:44   favorite so you're known contacts like [TS]

01:13:45   that's got to be a feature but you have [TS]

01:13:47   to say it onstage because otherwise i [TS]

01:13:49   think google seriously do you know I [TS]

01:13:52   don't get that really bothered me that [TS]

01:13:54   went unmentioned I I feel like even [TS]

01:13:56   Apple would say and don't worry this [TS]

01:13:59   only works for your contacts [TS]

01:14:00   see how easy that is google I mean and [TS]

01:14:02   again surely that's the case I think [TS]

01:14:03   they have to be engineered inside Google [TS]

01:14:05   you know who understand the privacy [TS]

01:14:08   implications of unsolicited video from [TS]

01:14:11   strangers appearing on your phone screen [TS]

01:14:12   but they didn't say it in the [TS]

01:14:14   presentation or they didn't i missed it [TS]

01:14:16   on i'm sorry now i don't think they did [TS]

01:14:17   boy boy is someone put on the chatroom [TS]

01:14:20   junk time to face so the thing that [TS]

01:14:24   bothered me about the knock knock [TS]

01:14:26   to be honest I didn't think about that [TS]

01:14:27   but you're absolutely right but I think [TS]

01:14:29   about me about knock-knock was they [TS]

01:14:30   started from a good place which was [TS]

01:14:32   video calling phone calls in general but [TS]

01:14:35   particularly video calls are extreme [TS]

01:14:37   extreme interruption and you have to [TS]

01:14:39   really dedicate your entire attention to [TS]

01:14:42   a video call and sometimes it is not a [TS]

01:14:45   convenient time for that but then again [TS]

01:14:48   I'm not in on the other side of the coin [TS]

01:14:50   what if what if Aaron is calling me to [TS]

01:14:52   say oh my god Declan just took his first [TS]

01:14:54   steps or something like that so they [TS]

01:14:56   what knock does is it lets you see what [TS]

01:14:59   this person is calling about so i can [TS]

01:15:01   see Aaron in Declan and I can see her [TS]

01:15:03   freaking out and they in their little [TS]

01:15:04   demo reel video they showed a guy who's [TS]

01:15:06   holding up to ticket stubs like he had [TS]

01:15:08   gotten tickets to a concert or something [TS]

01:15:09   like that and then they showed another [TS]

01:15:11   person who hold it up there left hand to [TS]

01:15:13   show i think was their engagement ring [TS]

01:15:15   and so the problem i had with this and [TS]

01:15:19   maybe I'm maybe I'm just being a jerk [TS]

01:15:20   about it but it was like you have to [TS]

01:15:23   earn your right for them to pick up your [TS]

01:15:25   phone call when you have to earn it and [TS]

01:15:27   you can't just call and be smiling you [TS]

01:15:29   gotta perform you gotta put on a show [TS]

01:15:31   for I'm not picking up the damn phone [TS]

01:15:33   more than I gotta go bye [TS]

01:15:35   I don't think the real problem is again [TS]

01:15:36   I it's only gonna be your actual people [TS]

01:15:38   you know doing this right who's video [TS]

01:15:40   calling you anyway no one is cold video [TS]

01:15:42   calling you or any case you wouldn't [TS]

01:15:43   pick up it's going to be able you know [TS]

01:15:45   and the only time they would video call [TS]

01:15:47   you instead of regular call you is if [TS]

01:15:49   they have something to show off or [TS]

01:15:50   they're an adorable right right [TS]

01:15:52   why else are they gonna know what to get [TS]

01:15:53   a video call you just to essentially [TS]

01:15:55   have a phone conversation because who [TS]

01:15:57   wants people looking at them unless they [TS]

01:15:59   have something to show are they and [TS]

01:16:00   their an impressive place so I don't [TS]

01:16:02   know I don't know I guess it depends on [TS]

01:16:04   who you talk to but i don't feel like [TS]

01:16:06   anybody who I would ever video call [TS]

01:16:08   would deny my call because I was not [TS]

01:16:10   sufficiently excited while the other [TS]

01:16:12   thing is any first-time conversation [TS]

01:16:14   I've ever had has almost always been [TS]

01:16:17   preceded by an iMessage conversation [TS]

01:16:20   being saying head like to facetime your [TS]

01:16:22   you cool you know it's almost to your [TS]

01:16:24   point John it's an almost never me cold [TS]

01:16:27   calling or somebody cold calling me [TS]

01:16:29   saying you're with no for previous [TS]

01:16:32   warning but is that perhaps because [TS]

01:16:34   there is no knock-knock like feature for [TS]

01:16:36   me to kind of screen that call [TS]

01:16:38   maybe I do get those by the way I do get [TS]

01:16:41   a surprising number of not not phone [TS]

01:16:43   calls but facetime calls randomly on my [TS]

01:16:47   phone and of course I'm max integrated [TS]

01:16:49   with my father and throwing you [TS]

01:16:50   strangers know it's like an unknown [TS]

01:16:52   yes that's unknown caller really number [TS]

01:16:54   and and not a phone call and not a [TS]

01:16:56   FaceTime audio called actual facetime [TS]

01:16:58   video cool i don't know if there's like [TS]

01:17:00   war dialers out there every single [TS]

01:17:01   number [TS]

01:17:02   no I've never answered one of them so i [TS]

01:17:03   have no idea what's going on but it's [TS]

01:17:04   annoying that it makes the facetime like [TS]

01:17:06   bloop bloop sound like I've had like it [TS]

01:17:11   i have a few relatives who basically [TS]

01:17:14   treat facetime like phone calls and so [TS]

01:17:15   they will just call me on facetime like [TS]

01:17:17   you know unannounced and that's their [TS]

01:17:19   goal they can still do that I think yes [TS]

01:17:20   I'm and but I you know I've never wish [TS]

01:17:22   for this feature I'm sure it's fine it [TS]

01:17:25   it's really going to be odd at first [TS]

01:17:27   before anybody is used to it because [TS]

01:17:29   that's not how things have gone so far [TS]

01:17:32   with these kind of video calling things [TS]

01:17:34   like so there's there's kind of an [TS]

01:17:36   expectation that you are not being [TS]

01:17:38   broadcast before the person picks up so [TS]

01:17:40   I think you're going [TS]

01:17:41   you picking their nose and adjusting [TS]

01:17:43   their hair and stuff like that it just [TS]

01:17:45   like you know embarrassing prep before [TS]

01:17:47   they think they're being watched [TS]

01:17:49   yeah I mean yeah there's something that [TS]

01:17:51   people have to get used to but that I [TS]

01:17:52   think they will be so hopefully it's an [TS]

01:17:54   optional feature again something that [TS]

01:17:55   didn't mention like is this optional [TS]

01:17:57   yeah it should be for only known [TS]

01:17:58   contacts and for known contacts should [TS]

01:18:00   be an option because maybe you don't [TS]

01:18:01   want that to be the case so really [TS]

01:18:03   exactly the way you said you just more [TS]

01:18:04   used to like until they pick up i'm not [TS]

01:18:06   on camera yeah a couple of quick notes [TS]

01:18:07   about this it apparently does really [TS]

01:18:11   really well with graceful degradation as [TS]

01:18:15   the connection gets crappier and then [TS]

01:18:17   whatever the opposite of that his things [TS]

01:18:20   get better and the thing that I'm most [TS]

01:18:24   excited about about this is that it's [TS]

01:18:26   multi-platform and i believe at one [TS]

01:18:28   point or another they had said that LOL [TS]

01:18:30   and presumably duo operates where your [TS]

01:18:35   phone numbers kind of your user ID if [TS]

01:18:37   you will and something that I've [TS]

01:18:39   struggled with is aaron side of the [TS]

01:18:41   family with the exception of aaron is [TS]

01:18:43   exclusively android and there have been [TS]

01:18:46   several times where we'd like to have a [TS]

01:18:48   video chat with her mom which in [TS]

01:18:49   normally looks about 20 minutes away but [TS]

01:18:51   maybe Declan is doing something funny or [TS]

01:18:53   maybe I don't know is we want to show [TS]

01:18:56   her something in the house we'd like to [TS]

01:18:58   do video chat and we don't feel like we [TS]

01:19:01   have a mechanism to do that now yes i [TS]

01:19:03   know that skype exist yes i know that [TS]

01:19:05   hangouts exist [TS]

01:19:07   yes i know that there are many other [TS]

01:19:08   video chat apps that exists but there's [TS]

01:19:11   nothing that i personally have used that [TS]

01:19:14   is as easy as facetime and i hope that [TS]

01:19:17   this duo thing will be as easy as [TS]

01:19:20   facetime and so will be able to install [TS]

01:19:21   this on our iphones and my in-laws will [TS]

01:19:24   be able to install it on their android [TS]

01:19:26   phones and we'll be able to do these [TS]

01:19:27   very quick very simple video chats on a [TS]

01:19:31   whim which would be really really [TS]

01:19:33   awesome and I'm really looking forward [TS]

01:19:34   to that hopefully working or you can [TS]

01:19:37   just wait for facetime to become an open [TS]

01:19:39   standards because they're what they're [TS]

01:19:40   going to the standards bodies today with [TS]

01:19:43   that it's just a matter of time now [TS]

01:19:45   yeah this is another thing that that's [TS]

01:19:47   google's strength is in my experience [TS]

01:19:49   with google hangouts for example is it [TS]

01:19:51   is the the first and best sort of [TS]

01:19:53   multiple people on a video stream thing [TS]

01:19:55   that I've ever used and I was the [TS]

01:19:56   quality great no but they like like [TS]

01:19:59   really good video games and good iOS [TS]

01:20:01   applications and so many good things [TS]

01:20:02   they are they understand that the most [TS]

01:20:04   important thing like they understand the [TS]

01:20:06   hierarchy of needs in a video call [TS]

01:20:10   number one audio if you have to drop the [TS]

01:20:13   video committee on the audio do it [TS]

01:20:14   because nothing is it is more annoying [TS]

01:20:16   than not being able to hear people and [TS]

01:20:18   then number two responsiveness video [TS]

01:20:20   rather than quality if you have to drop [TS]

01:20:22   the quality too obscene level just to [TS]

01:20:23   keep track of someone waving their and [TS]

01:20:25   then do it like responsiveness and an [TS]

01:20:27   understanding the audio is the most [TS]

01:20:28   important thing and my frustrations [TS]

01:20:30   faint facetime is often that the audio [TS]

01:20:33   will start coming out and makes it [TS]

01:20:34   impossible to even communicate about the [TS]

01:20:35   bed video and the video like will have [TS]

01:20:38   higher overall quality when it's working [TS]

01:20:40   but when my parents terrible internet [TS]

01:20:42   connection starts droppings and becomes [TS]

01:20:44   like a slideshow I wish it would just [TS]

01:20:46   degraded to a much uglier algorithm or I [TS]

01:20:49   mean facetime will do this time we'll [TS]

01:20:50   turn off the the video entirely to go to [TS]

01:20:52   the audio but in practice it does not do [TS]

01:20:54   that soon enough it very often struggles [TS]

01:20:57   with stuttering audio and I wish I could [TS]

01:20:58   just like just you know dropped entirely [TS]

01:21:01   very often facetime calls have been [TS]

01:21:03   derailed by saying just call the phone [TS]

01:21:05   because we know the phone will work and [TS]

01:21:06   i'll be able to hear your words so I'm [TS]

01:21:09   gonna have you know the only thing I've [TS]

01:21:10   used video from google is you know [TS]

01:21:12   YouTube which of course is only cool [TS]

01:21:14   back position and google hangouts and [TS]

01:21:16   I've always been impressed by the [TS]

01:21:18   performance under pretty you know dire [TS]

01:21:20   conditions of so many people all across [TS]

01:21:22   the country doing one big giant multi [TS]

01:21:24   video conference call think so I if this [TS]

01:21:28   do all things works and because it's [TS]

01:21:30   cross-platform it may end up being an [TS]

01:21:33   easier like I will see evidence of being [TS]

01:21:35   like my go-to like I probably still do [TS]

01:21:37   face time with my parents because that's [TS]

01:21:38   just what they're used to but if it's [TS]

01:21:39   but a facetime is messing up i will have [TS]

01:21:41   this app install them make sure they [TS]

01:21:42   have it installed two and i'll say [TS]

01:21:44   switch to this happened we'll just do a [TS]

01:21:46   be testing out facetime is dying because [TS]

01:21:48   of your internet weather over there [TS]

01:21:49   trying to sell their app that i showed [TS]

01:21:51   you and hopefully it'll be simple enough [TS]

01:21:53   that they can figure it out and it will [TS]

01:21:55   you know be connected up and i was like [TS]

01:21:56   i'm i'm optimistic about this is being a [TS]

01:21:59   decent product and like marco was [TS]

01:22:01   ridiculing apple for the open sent like [TS]

01:22:03   this you know Apple [TS]

01:22:04   could have done this but hasn't that how [TS]

01:22:06   a spacetime gotten appreciably better [TS]

01:22:08   since it was rolled out i'm sure it has [TS]

01:22:09   i'm sure it's got more reliable the [TS]

01:22:11   algorithm has gotten better and the [TS]

01:22:13   quality is probably better at the top [TS]

01:22:15   and then Google's things going to be but [TS]

01:22:17   that doesn't matter what I can hear [TS]

01:22:18   every fifth word that my parents are [TS]

01:22:19   saying yeah and also facetime notably [TS]

01:22:22   does not support more than two people on [TS]

01:22:24   a call yet and I i hope we get that at [TS]

01:22:27   some point is like you know I chat had [TS]

01:22:29   that before [TS]

01:22:30   facetime was a thing like we had that 10 [TS]

01:22:32   years ago so I know it's more [TS]

01:22:35   challenging on mobile on cell [TS]

01:22:36   connections and everything it is not an [TS]

01:22:38   easy problem by any means but I do hope [TS]

01:22:40   we get there but these duo i have been [TS]

01:22:43   mean it duo itself and implies to I [TS]

01:22:46   don't think that duo is going to be more [TS]

01:22:48   than one person is it hurt more than two [TS]

01:22:50   people i should say look I mean if [TS]

01:22:52   nobody actually has like more than one [TS]

01:22:54   of the person with an android phone [TS]

01:22:55   right are you talking about their more [TS]

01:22:58   than fifty percent of the market [TS]

01:22:59   the other thing is supposedly ete [TS]

01:23:02   encrypted always enterprise to [TS]

01:23:04   enterprise [TS]

01:23:05   yeah that one's easy to encrypted always [TS]

01:23:08   there was just that end-to-end [TS]

01:23:10   encryption they didn't give a [TS]

01:23:11   qualification so I'm sure this means [TS]

01:23:12   always mostly because at this point I [TS]

01:23:15   wouldn't say this is going to be true [TS]

01:23:16   forever but at this point there is no [TS]

01:23:18   Googlebot equivalent need to see every [TS]

01:23:20   frame your video do something [TS]

01:23:21   intelligent but if there were sufficient [TS]

01:23:23   bandwidth both in terms of cpu and you [TS]

01:23:26   know and and data throughput throughput [TS]

01:23:27   I'm sure like under on unlimited [TS]

01:23:30   conditions in a local environment google [TS]

01:23:32   would love to have an intelligent agent [TS]

01:23:33   watching every frame for video and doing [TS]

01:23:35   intelligent things based on it because [TS]

01:23:37   you know in this still image recognition [TS]

01:23:39   is you can do that on video and then [TS]

01:23:42   video recognition where you're actually [TS]

01:23:44   not just looking at individual frames [TS]

01:23:45   with the actual video and having [TS]

01:23:47   something realize where you are what [TS]

01:23:50   you're talking about being able to do [TS]

01:23:52   hand gestures seeing your facial [TS]

01:23:53   expressions and then Google you know [TS]

01:23:57   with need to see your video and on local [TS]

01:24:00   device maybe maybe you could still be in [TS]

01:24:01   description but again there's probably [TS]

01:24:03   only is almost certainly a server [TS]

01:24:04   component to this and so I don't know [TS]

01:24:06   how long and 10 encryption and [TS]

01:24:09   decryption on [TS]

01:24:10   you only last until google realizes that [TS]

01:24:13   they can do intelligent helpful things [TS]

01:24:14   by looking at your video so that's [TS]

01:24:17   probably still a ways off because of [TS]

01:24:19   spam with concerns and everything else [TS]

01:24:20   but i wouldn't expect it to be always [TS]

01:24:22   fair enough [TS]

01:24:24   alright so update Stan droid yeah we're [TS]

01:24:26   getting towards the end of it I was [TS]

01:24:28   getting towards the end of this section [TS]

01:24:29   I had to skim some of this but I i tried [TS]

01:24:31   to put some highlights in your answer [TS]

01:24:32   these things and i'm missing Vulcan [TS]

01:24:34   Vulcan was kind of depressing because I [TS]

01:24:37   mean Apple Apple has been so far ahead [TS]

01:24:40   with the graphics performance on their [TS]

01:24:42   devices for so long especially compared [TS]

01:24:44   to like the average of Android versus [TS]

01:24:46   just like the high-end Android and then [TS]

01:24:48   Apple you know that OpenGL ES and they [TS]

01:24:50   did the metal thing which is a lower [TS]

01:24:52   level thing and that was great and I i [TS]

01:24:54   I'm sure it's good for iOS game [TS]

01:24:56   developers and everything but on the [TS]

01:24:58   other side of the coin is the sort of [TS]

01:24:59   open standard opengl khronos group thing [TS]

01:25:02   which is a Vulcan which is based on [TS]

01:25:04   mantle from AMD and a bunch of other [TS]

01:25:06   stuff and it's very much like metal and [TS]

01:25:07   you know these all these ideas have been [TS]

01:25:09   floating around the greatest community [TS]

01:25:10   for a while I don't like to see Apple as [TS]

01:25:12   the sky like the facetime situation oh [TS]

01:25:15   we've got our own thing [TS]

01:25:17   the only good thing about it is that [TS]

01:25:19   Apple's own thing is actually pretty [TS]

01:25:20   influential because Apple a lot of game [TS]

01:25:23   shop on Apple's platforms and they make [TS]

01:25:25   a lot of money so maybe they could [TS]

01:25:27   quote-unquote win just because most of [TS]

01:25:30   the money and game development is [TS]

01:25:31   happening on iOS that would really [TS]

01:25:33   rather see Apple supporting the industry [TS]

01:25:37   standard like let's get everybody [TS]

01:25:39   working together to make the low-level [TS]

01:25:41   graphics API that everybody's going to [TS]

01:25:43   use one as opposed to apple having its [TS]

01:25:45   own but having its own is probably kind [TS]

01:25:46   of a competitive advantage and they are [TS]

01:25:48   so big they can probably get away with [TS]

01:25:49   it but it just depresses me a little bit [TS]

01:25:52   fair enough let's see what else they did [TS]

01:25:56   a lot with just-in-time compilation [TS]

01:25:59   which is kind of exciting and even just [TS]

01:26:03   in time [TS]

01:26:04   installation which is weird [TS]

01:26:08   well I that the instant apps think [TS]

01:26:10   that's like about the just-in-time [TS]

01:26:11   compilation is with the flip side where [TS]

01:26:12   I start to feel bad for google that they [TS]

01:26:14   still dealing with the jiggle ago will [TS]

01:26:17   will like profile the code [TS]

01:26:19   and write the optimized version of the [TS]

01:26:21   flash to make a faster launches time and [TS]

01:26:23   I know they have pre-compiled apps to [TS]

01:26:25   but just that technical decision to go [TS]

01:26:28   with the initially a weird job ish [TS]

01:26:30   language and just-in-time compilation [TS]

01:26:32   and everything like they're still kind [TS]

01:26:34   of paying the price of like having to [TS]

01:26:36   having to try to match apple which is [TS]

01:26:40   shipping pre-compiled band binary is [TS]

01:26:41   right bring about pre optimized binaries [TS]

01:26:44   that are you know they're smaller than [TS]

01:26:46   they don't have to have the the yeah but [TS]

01:26:48   they're doing playing catch-up here and [TS]

01:26:51   maybe long-term they're still doing the [TS]

01:26:52   right thing and maybe still in [TS]

01:26:54   advancement in the current stage there's [TS]

01:26:56   lots of weird compromises their digging [TS]

01:26:57   out from underneath and so there's a [TS]

01:26:59   whole section of the slides that are [TS]

01:27:00   just things that Apple is just not [TS]

01:27:01   concerned about because they don't have [TS]

01:27:03   these problems because they don't have a [TS]

01:27:04   jet [TS]

01:27:05   indeed they have what multitasking [TS]

01:27:09   yeah that was like that was the part [TS]

01:27:11   where it's like all right you did pretty [TS]

01:27:13   much what Apple did which is not that [TS]

01:27:14   imaginative when Apple did it's not that [TS]

01:27:16   imaginative when you did it [TS]

01:27:17   which part did you think was novel I [TS]

01:27:18   mean split-screen picture-in-picture [TS]

01:27:19   it's like literally like word-for-word [TS]

01:27:21   the the you know iOS ipad much as they [TS]

01:27:25   did on the phone which i think is [TS]

01:27:27   something that Apple didn't do like that [TS]

01:27:29   they would disable them what to do [TS]

01:27:30   splitscreen on that the mini does that [TS]

01:27:32   yep they don't know what the limits of [TS]

01:27:33   that features anyway on the iphone no [TS]

01:27:36   but they showed it on the phone [TS]

01:27:37   basically top/bottom split instead of [TS]

01:27:39   from the side [TS]

01:27:40   yeah well as you wouldn't want like two [TS]

01:27:42   inch wide absolutely side-by-side that [TS]

01:27:45   would be awkward [TS]

01:27:46   yeah well I don't know depends on the [TS]

01:27:48   app but uh you can scroll the text [TS]

01:27:50   sideways it was and then they had like [TS]

01:27:53   the double tap to switch back really [TS]

01:27:55   fast out here is here is the thing that [TS]

01:27:57   killed Amos presentation I can't [TS]

01:27:59   understand why they did it they showed [TS]

01:28:01   their app switcher which looks like all [TS]

01:28:02   apps which is like these days a bunch of [TS]

01:28:04   little cards look like webos for many [TS]

01:28:06   years ago showing all your applications [TS]

01:28:07   and I said by popular demand they added [TS]

01:28:11   a clear all button and that is [TS]

01:28:13   essentially recognizing the fact that [TS]

01:28:15   lots of people either based on [TS]

01:28:18   superstition or bed reasoning related to [TS]

01:28:21   the iOS multitasker or on the Android [TS]

01:28:23   side probably both of those as well but [TS]

01:28:26   also on both sides based on just the [TS]

01:28:29   idea that some people want to clean up [TS]

01:28:31   messes [TS]

01:28:32   that having a bunch of courting quote [TS]

01:28:34   open application is visual clutter right [TS]

01:28:37   and they just want to clear out so that [TS]

01:28:39   the new version and the two things one [TS]

01:28:41   limited to only seven so it's just they [TS]

01:28:43   go off the end you know they don't they [TS]

01:28:44   just don't show them which is kind of [TS]

01:28:46   nice for reducing clutter but I hope [TS]

01:28:48   that's adjustable somewhere probably is [TS]

01:28:50   because what if you want to see more [TS]

01:28:51   than seven and the second thing is the [TS]

01:28:52   clear all button is like sometimes I [TS]

01:28:54   just want to clean everything up [TS]

01:28:56   i mean i-i don't think I mentioned this [TS]

01:28:57   before I've seen my son do it i saw him [TS]

01:28:59   using his iphone everything goes into [TS]

01:29:01   the app switcher and flip the [TS]

01:29:02   applications up like whoa was like where [TS]

01:29:04   did you learn this who tipped like it's [TS]

01:29:07   just they pick it up on the streets and [TS]

01:29:09   kind of like force quitting application [TS]

01:29:11   so i had to explain to him you know the [TS]

01:29:13   whole the we don't talk about that much [TS]

01:29:15   on the show but the angle that i gave [TS]

01:29:17   them I didn't explain them about [TS]

01:29:19   multitasking suspended processes and [TS]

01:29:21   everything I said look but when you do [TS]

01:29:23   that it's gonna actually exit the [TS]

01:29:26   program it's going to the United know if [TS]

01:29:27   I said force quit or whatever which [TS]

01:29:29   means the next time you launch it will [TS]

01:29:30   probably be two and a half minutes from [TS]

01:29:32   now it has to launch from a completely [TS]

01:29:34   fresh state whereas before it was just [TS]

01:29:36   spend it in memory ready to go the next [TS]

01:29:38   time you used it so you think your [TS]

01:29:39   quote-unquote saving battery which is [TS]

01:29:41   excuse he gave me but you're probably [TS]

01:29:43   not because launching from a fresh state [TS]

01:29:45   takes more energy than unsuspecting the [TS]

01:29:47   application soldiers don't worry about [TS]

01:29:48   and don't leave them but the other [TS]

01:29:49   angles in which you have no argument [TS]

01:29:50   yeah it's like I just don't like seeing [TS]

01:29:52   their well so Android users apparently [TS]

01:29:54   have the exact same problems the game [TS]

01:29:56   big button that says clear all what I [TS]

01:29:58   hope the clear all button does is remove [TS]

01:30:00   the graphics but do nothing else [TS]

01:30:01   yeah suspended because that's what [TS]

01:30:04   people want they just don't want to see [TS]

01:30:05   the squares there that's what Apple [TS]

01:30:07   should do it i mean that have to add a [TS]

01:30:08   new feature for actual force quit but I [TS]

01:30:10   wish flicking up the squares didn't do [TS]

01:30:12   anything except for remove them from the [TS]

01:30:14   multitasking switcher but everything [TS]

01:30:15   else take this and they just ate [TS]

01:30:16   suspended and imagine a normal way but [TS]

01:30:18   boy this this ailment this is like that [TS]

01:30:22   the the zapping the pier am of the [TS]

01:30:24   mobile age or rebuilding the desktop and [TS]

01:30:26   how far back you can go and repairing [TS]

01:30:28   permissions for building that's older [TS]

01:30:29   like these little solutions but this one [TS]

01:30:32   I think there's a foundation that people [TS]

01:30:33   just don't like to see the mess so I [TS]

01:30:35   hundred is giving them a clear all [TS]

01:30:36   button that lead to have like a somewhat [TS]

01:30:38   like it like a g8 summit for like people [TS]

01:30:41   who make computer devices to talk about [TS]

01:30:43   mythology is related to the multi-tap [TS]

01:30:46   switcher it's not there are a lot of [TS]

01:30:49   them [TS]

01:30:49   yeah I mean and I mean the sad part with [TS]

01:30:51   the apple one is like it would be nice [TS]

01:30:53   if we didn't have to do that and if they [TS]

01:30:55   remove the ability to this so that [TS]

01:30:57   people could stop doing this stupid [TS]

01:30:58   thing but unfortunately it does [TS]

01:31:00   occasionally soft published yet you [TS]

01:31:03   yummy way to force quit things like you [TS]

01:31:05   did badly behaved you do need a way to [TS]

01:31:06   do that so you have two you can't take [TS]

01:31:08   that away and just I don't worry we'll [TS]

01:31:09   manage all for you but the obsessive [TS]

01:31:11   need to do it every time I've seen my [TS]

01:31:14   son do i watch them it's just he just [TS]

01:31:15   like it's just part of his routine it's [TS]

01:31:17   like there's no point in that you know [TS]

01:31:19   especially because you just convince [TS]

01:31:21   yourself that if i don't do this [TS]

01:31:22   something bad will happen like oh I just [TS]

01:31:24   wish I just wish that it just it just [TS]

01:31:26   move the graphics but i think i think [TS]

01:31:28   that's like ninety percent of it people [TS]

01:31:29   just don't want to see the squares they [TS]

01:31:30   don't want to see the little rectangles [TS]

01:31:31   they want they want to feel like [TS]

01:31:33   everything is a clean slate so fun get [TS]

01:31:35   rid of the rectangle right but then you [TS]

01:31:37   know when the facebook app starts going [TS]

01:31:38   crazy you do need some way to actually [TS]

01:31:40   kill it or sometimes it applications get [TS]

01:31:42   all screwed up which happens as well [TS]

01:31:44   like perfectly well-behaved applications [TS]

01:31:45   with this a bug in them all of a sudden [TS]

01:31:47   and every time you bring them to the [TS]

01:31:48   front they're just not working that [TS]

01:31:50   happens and you need a way to get rid of [TS]

01:31:52   them get rid of them [TS]

01:31:54   I know it's a difficult situation all [TS]

01:31:56   right I got it [TS]

01:31:57   this is how absolutely solve all the [TS]

01:31:59   problems you get one free clear all a [TS]

01:32:03   day and then if you want you are more [TS]

01:32:07   than a purchase yeah you can you can buy [TS]

01:32:09   one for a dollar each [TS]

01:32:11   if you want more after that that their [TS]

01:32:13   growth issue with iphone revenue is [TS]

01:32:15   solved [TS]

01:32:16   yeah if it's an its article is it's an [TS]

01:32:19   energy-based mechanic where you can you [TS]

01:32:21   exhaust your energy have to do that [TS]

01:32:22   purchase to get more fit but clear all I [TS]

01:32:27   would I don't know I wasn't there in the [TS]

01:32:29   crowd i wonder if that was like a big [TS]

01:32:30   applause feeder but they did say by [TS]

01:32:32   popular demand I someone someone who [TS]

01:32:36   works at Google please tell me that [TS]

01:32:37   doesn't actually do anything except [TS]

01:32:38   remove the graphics it'll make me so [TS]

01:32:39   much happier right we should quickly [TS]

01:32:42   talk about instant apps at this is a [TS]

01:32:45   really big hairy technical mess that [TS]

01:32:50   might end up being really good has a lot [TS]

01:32:53   of potential risks a lot of potential [TS]

01:32:55   ramifications good and bad [TS]

01:32:57   and I we don't really know enough about [TS]

01:33:00   it yet [TS]

01:33:01   I don't think to really to really say [TS]

01:33:03   like whether this is going to work with [TS]

01:33:06   the risks totally are [TS]

01:33:08   but what about security risks everything [TS]

01:33:09   on hold on hold on let me let me kind of [TS]

01:33:11   explain what's going on here so yeah [TS]

01:33:13   explain sheeting summarizes some are [TS]

01:33:15   certain chief so it makes it longer what [TS]

01:33:17   you're doing it because you don't [TS]

01:33:20   provide haha the idea within snaps is [TS]

01:33:24   you're in a situation where you really [TS]

01:33:26   want to consume some content that is [TS]

01:33:28   associated with a nap so they gave an [TS]

01:33:31   example of wanting to watch [TS]

01:33:32   buzzfeedvideo they gave an example of [TS]

01:33:34   walking up to an nfc-enabled parking [TS]

01:33:36   meter maid is critically it's you want [TS]

01:33:38   you want to do something with with an [TS]

01:33:39   app that you don't have installed sorry [TS]

01:33:42   yes yes so you don't have this installed [TS]

01:33:43   and you walk up this parking meter and [TS]

01:33:46   the parking meter has some NFC ID that [TS]

01:33:49   some way somehow google and android know [TS]

01:33:52   are associated with such-and-such [TS]

01:33:54   happening in the Play Store so what-what [TS]

01:33:57   instant apps will do is it will [TS]

01:34:00   behind-the-scenes instantly download the [TS]

01:34:04   subset of the app that you need to [TS]

01:34:06   perform the particular function you're [TS]

01:34:08   trying to do be that watch the [TS]

01:34:09   buzzfeedvideo or pay for parking or what [TS]

01:34:11   have you and it will do that and loaded [TS]

01:34:14   instantly or thereabouts-- so it's [TS]

01:34:17   available to you walk up to the parking [TS]

01:34:18   meter you swipe your phone near it the [TS]

01:34:20   NFC thing kicks in [TS]

01:34:22   it will download the you know parking [TS]

01:34:25   meter app you can put money into it you [TS]

01:34:28   can use your android pay and walk away [TS]

01:34:30   and everything is good and you haven't [TS]

01:34:32   downloaded the entire app you've just [TS]

01:34:34   downloaded the pieces i'm assuming the [TS]

01:34:36   intense in the Android system that on [TS]

01:34:38   that are required for the operations are [TS]

01:34:41   trying to perform at first glance it [TS]

01:34:43   sounds kind of good because i don't like [TS]

01:34:46   downloading apps just for single-use [TS]

01:34:49   events like this and actually i have in [TS]

01:34:51   the past downloaded a parking meter app [TS]

01:34:53   in the DC area specifically to park in [TS]

01:34:55   DC and then I've never used since and so [TS]

01:34:59   in theory this sounds kind of good but [TS]

01:35:04   what happens then when I walk away from [TS]

01:35:07   the meter [TS]

01:35:08   I didn't pay close attention to what the [TS]

01:35:11   the brand of meter was or what app I [TS]

01:35:13   just got quietly installed for me and I [TS]

01:35:16   need to add time like what do i do then [TS]

01:35:18   does it say oh you've just installed the [TS]

01:35:21   park minder app does it allow you to [TS]

01:35:23   download the park binder app from the [TS]

01:35:25   play store because you've instant [TS]

01:35:27   downloaded it recently like how does [TS]

01:35:29   that all work i'm actually less [TS]

01:35:31   concerned about android apps splitting [TS]

01:35:33   themselves up into pieces because they [TS]

01:35:36   tend to be from what I gather from our [TS]

01:35:37   Android developers a lot more modular [TS]

01:35:39   but this whole like user interaction i [TS]

01:35:43   think they leaves a lot of questions in [TS]

01:35:45   my mind [TS]

01:35:47   well I mean they put the machine [TS]

01:35:48   learning in the context thing like that [TS]

01:35:49   they said oh and you can add more time [TS]

01:35:51   later I thought the same thing like how [TS]

01:35:53   do I know what how to add time but [TS]

01:35:55   contextually basic machine learning [TS]

01:35:57   stuff that they've already got it knows [TS]

01:35:59   what you're talking about because you [TS]

01:36:00   just did did a parking meter thing and [TS]

01:36:03   so if you just yell into your phone or [TS]

01:36:05   type in to your Google assistant app add [TS]

01:36:08   another minute to the meter it should [TS]

01:36:10   know what the heck you're talking about [TS]

01:36:11   from context and I think it can already [TS]

01:36:12   do that but i think the idea is that [TS]

01:36:15   from this kind of like getting more into [TS]

01:36:18   the open docx model from a phone users [TS]

01:36:21   perspective for certain classes of [TS]

01:36:23   things and perhaps a very large class of [TS]

01:36:26   things they don't care so much about [TS]

01:36:28   your app your app is important to you is [TS]

01:36:30   the app developer they just want to [TS]

01:36:32   accomplish something in the world but [TS]

01:36:34   it's paying for parking meter or buying [TS]

01:36:36   a movie ticket or you know making a [TS]

01:36:38   reservation at a restaurant there in [TS]

01:36:39   front of and they just want to [TS]

01:36:42   accomplish that task they don't want to [TS]

01:36:44   find the app that need to download do i [TS]

01:36:46   found myself in a position where I want [TS]

01:36:47   to do something and I've heard that you [TS]

01:36:50   can do something with this store that I [TS]

01:36:51   know like what is their app called or [TS]

01:36:53   what was the name of that app that I [TS]

01:36:54   heard or like just based on other [TS]

01:36:57   contextual clues and having an open API [TS]

01:36:59   to say from the users perspective the [TS]

01:37:01   phone will just do this something that [TS]

01:37:03   phone couldn't do before it's something [TS]

01:37:04   they can do and fairly quickly without [TS]

01:37:06   them having to search the appstore for [TS]

01:37:08   an app and download I think that's a [TS]

01:37:10   good user experience in something that [TS]

01:37:11   can be shooting for many problems exist [TS]

01:37:13   in it security is probably one of the [TS]

01:37:15   big ones but like you said like is just [TS]

01:37:17   spamming my phone with apps that are [TS]

01:37:20   installing I walked past parking meters [TS]

01:37:22   or even if I initiated how do I keep [TS]

01:37:24   track of all [TS]

01:37:24   crap that's getting installed like [TS]

01:37:26   there's a potential downside for this to [TS]

01:37:29   be abused but on the other hand is a [TS]

01:37:30   very apple-like feature an apple is the [TS]

01:37:32   company that dreamed up open docx of [TS]

01:37:34   like I'm not so concerned with your [TS]

01:37:36   application i'm concerned with my task [TS]

01:37:38   and it's like computers of the future [TS]

01:37:40   like how does that thing all of a sudden [TS]

01:37:42   know how to work with this thing it's [TS]

01:37:43   like magic really like oh I've never [TS]

01:37:45   used this thing before in my life but it [TS]

01:37:47   has android integration I don't have to [TS]

01:37:48   do anything all of a sudden my phone can [TS]

01:37:50   do this thing that it couldn't do before [TS]

01:37:51   and I think that's awesome i'm not [TS]

01:37:54   entirely sure google is the company to [TS]

01:37:56   pull that off based on the amount of [TS]

01:37:58   weird things that go on in the Android [TS]

01:38:00   ecosystem but I i endorse the idea that [TS]

01:38:03   like like chrome books for example in [TS]

01:38:05   like the hole through your computer like [TS]

01:38:07   it doesn't matter because everything in [TS]

01:38:08   the cloud [TS]

01:38:09   I like the idea I like it's a goal I [TS]

01:38:12   don't know how close we are gonna get [TS]

01:38:13   through with this particular [TS]

01:38:13   implementation but we'll see anything [TS]

01:38:16   else on Android and they didn't actually [TS]

01:38:19   announced the name their soliciting [TS]

01:38:20   names they made the joke about don't [TS]

01:38:22   call it something makes something face [TS]

01:38:24   but anything else on Android and I mean [TS]

01:38:28   I think it's gonna be interesting to see [TS]

01:38:29   how much of this stuff you know plays [TS]

01:38:31   out and develops none of us use android [TS]

01:38:34   really ever so I think it's funny that [TS]

01:38:36   we just spent two hours talking about [TS]

01:38:38   this stuff but hey you know it's it's [TS]

01:38:39   industry news i think it's also [TS]

01:38:41   interesting to see you know a lot of the [TS]

01:38:43   commentary so far has been that this is [TS]

01:38:46   a lot of like underwhelming stuff a lot [TS]

01:38:49   of it is kind of just matching Apple [TS]

01:38:51   features or giving their response to [TS]

01:38:53   apple features and you know that's just [TS]

01:38:55   how the industry goes you know that it [TS]

01:38:56   there are some years where Apple borrows [TS]

01:38:58   heavily from google features and there [TS]

01:39:00   are some here for the reverse happens [TS]

01:39:01   and this is a very mature market of like [TS]

01:39:05   these advanced smartphone OS is where I [TS]

01:39:08   don't think we can really expect changes [TS]

01:39:11   that are on a much bigger scale than [TS]

01:39:13   this most years because it just doesn't [TS]

01:39:16   know we're to the point where this stuff [TS]

01:39:18   is mature and the low-hanging fruit is [TS]

01:39:20   often picked and and is that really what [TS]

01:39:22   you think after seeing this impression [TS]

01:39:24   like Oh low hanging fruit they're doing [TS]

01:39:25   kind of similar things we shouldn't [TS]

01:39:27   expect big changes that was not my [TS]

01:39:28   impression i got this all I mean like at [TS]

01:39:30   the OS level like these kind like you [TS]

01:39:32   know that the stuff they're doing with [TS]

01:39:34   with like data services and machine [TS]

01:39:36   learning ding ding is like you know that [TS]

01:39:38   that is where the advancements happening [TS]

01:39:40   for google now you don't think in snaps [TS]

01:39:42   is like having implementation was [TS]

01:39:43   Bruno's and by the way this implication [TS]

01:39:45   work our way back to jelly bean which is [TS]

01:39:47   another kind of sad part of the [TS]

01:39:48   presentation was like oh look good we [TS]

01:39:49   are about backward compatibility and now [TS]

01:39:51   it's because you can't move your [TS]

01:39:52   installed base to your most recent ok [TS]

01:39:53   but anyway um I think that is an [TS]

01:39:56   admirable and interesting goal that no [TS]

01:39:59   one else is even touching like that is [TS]

01:40:01   where have you seen something like that [TS]

01:40:03   before I think it's an awesome idea and [TS]

01:40:06   there are the first big player to say [TS]

01:40:08   it's a thing and you can try to do it [TS]

01:40:10   then you know lots of caveat about it [TS]

01:40:12   but that's you know opendocument working [TS]

01:40:14   maybe this won't work either but from a [TS]

01:40:16   user perspective i think it is [TS]

01:40:17   significant [TS]

01:40:18   I guess again that i would call that in [TS]

01:40:20   OS feature like that'sthat's you know [TS]

01:40:22   what else is like launching and [TS]

01:40:23   installing launching and running apps [TS]

01:40:25   that's that's significant [TS]

01:40:27   I don't know that it's potentially so [TS]

01:40:29   problematic like from just like a [TS]

01:40:31   security and technical perspective like [TS]

01:40:33   nothing it can't be done but just [TS]

01:40:35   thought like it's going to come with [TS]

01:40:37   yeah yeah it's gonna be hard to do it [TS]

01:40:39   well and correctly and safely at and it [TS]

01:40:42   depends on supports like Apple pay would [TS]

01:40:44   be crap if I couldn't use it anywhere [TS]

01:40:45   but you know it and it is that like the [TS]

01:40:48   technology and the idea behind applebees [TS]

01:40:50   could be great but if I can use it any [TS]

01:40:51   of the stores that would be a total [TS]

01:40:52   failure so there is the the [TS]

01:40:54   infrastructure project which is weird [TS]

01:40:55   because you're like oh androids the [TS]

01:40:56   majority they should be great on the [TS]

01:40:57   infrastructure but like they're the [TS]

01:41:00   majority but they're not always where [TS]

01:41:02   the money is and that kind of tends to [TS]

01:41:03   lead with two what you know so this is [TS]

01:41:05   let's put it this way [TS]

01:41:06   well this is an idea that I think Apple [TS]

01:41:08   should share and i think my overwhelming [TS]

01:41:10   impression of this entire presentation [TS]

01:41:11   is so how incredibly far behind apple is [TS]

01:41:16   in so many of these areas and how I [TS]

01:41:17   don't see any hope of them catching up [TS]

01:41:19   like all the things that Google [TS]

01:41:20   emphasize all their strength [TS]

01:41:22   machine-learning server-side stop all [TS]

01:41:25   that I just look at that and I feel like [TS]

01:41:27   it was an apple-like we can't do that [TS]

01:41:29   we're terrible this stuff we're so far [TS]

01:41:31   behind them i can't even see them in the [TS]

01:41:32   distance anymore they're this tiny speck [TS]

01:41:35   like they apples just trying to take its [TS]

01:41:36   basic services and make them reliable [TS]

01:41:38   and have some sort of infrastructure for [TS]

01:41:40   doing things that Google is doing [TS]

01:41:41   reliably like five years ago this all [TS]

01:41:43   this stuff is not a glimmer anyone's I'd [TS]

01:41:45   Apple they've got Syrian haven't been [TS]

01:41:46   able to advance it i think is dancing / [TS]

01:41:49   series grave like [TS]

01:41:50   hi just if you're an apple fan like this [TS]

01:41:54   makes me think about the good old days [TS]

01:41:55   when applicable working together on the [TS]

01:41:57   iphone how awesome would have been if [TS]

01:41:58   they had like you know divide the labor [TS]

01:42:01   is Apple you make the hardware in the US [TS]

01:42:03   and we'll do the services and together [TS]

01:42:04   we'll make the awesome platform in the [TS]

01:42:05   future I didn't happen unfortunately but [TS]

01:42:09   now we have the situation where Google [TS]

01:42:11   is just so much better it's so many [TS]

01:42:13   things than apple and that it doesn't [TS]

01:42:15   seem like apples getting better not get [TS]

01:42:17   not getting better fast enough or [TS]

01:42:18   something i'm not getting better at all [TS]

01:42:19   at and it's just it depresses me [TS]

01:42:21   I guess on the bright side as long as [TS]

01:42:23   apple continues to make a good quality [TS]

01:42:25   hardware and a pretty good OS that sells [TS]

01:42:26   a lot of copies will continue to be [TS]

01:42:28   forced to make like it's do application [TS]

01:42:30   for iOS but the other features again [TS]

01:42:33   snaps we have to wait for Apple to copy [TS]

01:42:35   and all the machine learning stuff i [TS]

01:42:37   don't have any real hope of Apple ever [TS]

01:42:39   copying if their past history is any [TS]

01:42:41   judge so boy this i think this was it's [TS]

01:42:45   not like a giant victory of google also [TS]

01:42:47   apple because again there's things that [TS]

01:42:48   Apple does better as well and each one [TS]

01:42:50   is obviously going to emphasize the area [TS]

01:42:51   where they're stronger but this I feel [TS]

01:42:54   like at Google is accelerating away from [TS]

01:42:57   Apple not just barely staying ahead in [TS]

01:42:58   the areas that has always been ahead [TS]

01:43:00   yeah I think that's really stupid one of [TS]

01:43:03   the quick point I wanted to make and [TS]

01:43:04   then we should probably wrap is they [TS]

01:43:06   talk about android wear to a couple of [TS]

01:43:09   quick thoughts about that number one I [TS]

01:43:11   understand why the watch i carry on my [TS]

01:43:13   wrist today and everyday is a rounded [TS]

01:43:16   rect but man that circles looks so much [TS]

01:43:19   better and number two they had a couple [TS]

01:43:24   of different means of input including [TS]

01:43:26   like a swype keyboard which strikes me [TS]

01:43:27   is freaking terrible but they also had [TS]

01:43:31   handwriting where as you write it [TS]

01:43:35   Scrolls to the left automatically which [TS]

01:43:38   i think i've seen in like one note or [TS]

01:43:40   something like that in years past but it [TS]

01:43:43   seemed like an incredibly clever way to [TS]

01:43:44   handle text input on a watch because you [TS]

01:43:47   can put you know about a character on [TS]

01:43:49   the screen at a time and if it's [TS]

01:43:51   scrolling automatically you know under [TS]

01:43:53   your finger it looked at a glance like [TS]

01:43:55   it worked really really well and I'm [TS]

01:43:58   very curious to hear if that is [TS]

01:44:00   implemented well and if it is then I [TS]

01:44:03   wanted on my watch [TS]

01:44:04   I i still believe that anytime you're [TS]

01:44:06   doing text input on my watch you've lost [TS]

01:44:08   i agree but in a pinch it would be nice [TS]

01:44:11   to not have to use Siri just use [TS]

01:44:13   graffiti yeah let's draw the same draw [TS]

01:44:15   the same letter or the same spot you [TS]

01:44:16   don't need to scroll just keep doing the [TS]

01:44:18   same letter on the watch face yep and [TS]

01:44:20   the android wear what has going for it [TS]

01:44:22   is they're trying over the head right [TS]

01:44:25   well honestly I mean that the way I'm [TS]

01:44:28   not gonna get too far into this next [TS]

01:44:29   craft time but honestly i-i think you [TS]

01:44:31   know case you mention like man round [TS]

01:44:33   look so good [TS]

01:44:34   android wear can do different shapes an [TS]

01:44:37   apple can because the design of the [TS]

01:44:39   platform from the beginning was in a [TS]

01:44:41   very android way to to have a scalable [TS]

01:44:45   system that could apply to you know any [TS]

01:44:48   large set of different device sizes and [TS]

01:44:51   shapes and characteristics that i think [TS]

01:44:53   ultimately will prove to be the better [TS]

01:44:56   way for wearables to be designed for [TS]

01:44:58   wearable platform to be designed I i [TS]

01:45:00   don't think the Apple the current Apple [TS]

01:45:03   watch model of we're just going to make [TS]

01:45:05   one type of watch in one shape with one [TS]

01:45:10   configuration basically you know like [TS]

01:45:12   you know they yeah they allow all the [TS]

01:45:13   different bands and there's two [TS]

01:45:14   different sizes of the same shape but [TS]

01:45:16   it's basically one configuration of the [TS]

01:45:19   watch and I I think ultimately the [TS]

01:45:22   android version of you can have all [TS]

01:45:25   sorts of different sizes and shapes and [TS]

01:45:28   different capabilities [TS]

01:45:30   you know I think that will ultimately [TS]

01:45:31   prove correct for wearables where it [TS]

01:45:34   didn't really necessarily prove correct [TS]

01:45:35   for phones but because most people just [TS]

01:45:37   want a rectangle phone with decent I [TS]

01:45:40   screen that has a whole bunch of you [TS]

01:45:42   know hardware in it and stuff but I [TS]

01:45:43   think watches and wearables it'll prove [TS]

01:45:46   the opposite direction and then I I [TS]

01:45:47   wonder and i'll be very curious to see [TS]

01:45:49   if apple takes the watch in that kind of [TS]

01:45:52   direction because honestly I don't think [TS]

01:45:54   they are headed that direction and I get [TS]

01:45:56   that worries me but we will see [TS]

01:45:58   alrighty thanks a lot 23 sponsors this [TS]

01:46:01   week ring automatic and pingdom and we [TS]

01:46:03   will see you next week [TS]

01:46:06   now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

01:46:10   mean to begin as it was accidental [TS]

01:46:14   it was accidental John didn't [TS]

01:46:19   any research Marco in kc wouldn't let [TS]

01:46:22   him [TS]

01:46:22   because it was accidental was accidental [TS]

01:46:27   and you can find the show know today p [TS]

01:46:31   dot and if your twitter follow them [TS]

01:46:39   yes byl ISS so that's Casey list and a [TS]

01:46:44   co-pay rm20 Marco Arment and our AC [TS]

01:46:51   syracuse it's [TS]

01:47:00   what [TS]

01:47:05   somebody who shall remain nameless and [TS]

01:47:09   who is too embarrassed to be named on [TS]

01:47:11   this particular podcast tells me tells [TS]

01:47:14   us our tells me specifically that I'm [TS]

01:47:16   wrong about quitting iOS and he says [TS]

01:47:20   it's his only salvation salvation from [TS]

01:47:22   what from my assuming is battery [TS]

01:47:25   draining places you want a video it's [TS]

01:47:27   completely replicable and I thought I [TS]

01:47:29   told him and in the track here is that I [TS]

01:47:33   thought covered all bases [TS]

01:47:34   yes sometimes isn't badly behaving app [TS]

01:47:37   that you have to force quit [TS]

01:47:38   sometimes an application is in a weird [TS]

01:47:40   state that the only way you can get it [TS]

01:47:41   to work again this force quitting it and [TS]

01:47:45   some applications even when they're [TS]

01:47:46   working perfectly [TS]

01:47:46   you need to force quit right when you're [TS]

01:47:47   done with them if you don't want them [TS]

01:47:48   sucking your battery down true all true [TS]

01:47:51   and yet i still say the reflexive habit [TS]

01:47:54   of force quitting every single [TS]

01:47:55   application every time you're done with [TS]

01:47:56   it is crazy because you were draining [TS]

01:47:58   your battery more because you're just [TS]

01:47:59   launching them fresh the next time use [TS]

01:48:00   them which is gonna be 30 seconds from [TS]

01:48:02   now when you launch your twitter [TS]

01:48:02   applicant crazy what I'm against is the [TS]

01:48:05   reflexive routine force quitting of [TS]

01:48:08   everything and that is the habit i see [TS]

01:48:09   not the selected based on past [TS]

01:48:11   experience that I have to fit force quit [TS]

01:48:13   this application or drains my battery [TS]

01:48:14   no that's not how people act most people [TS]

01:48:16   it's just like lick lick lick lick you [TS]

01:48:18   select use like use flick their double [TS]

01:48:20   tapping the home but my crazy they [TS]

01:48:22   cannot have a single they can only ever [TS]

01:48:24   have one thing there when they're done [TS]

01:48:25   with it it's like it so I can go back to [TS]

01:48:26   springboard and see nothing [TS]

01:48:28   it's you know it's and he's saying it's [TS]

01:48:33   not about that about a possible launch I [TS]

01:48:35   said sometimes you begin to a state [TS]

01:48:36   where you bring them to the foreground [TS]

01:48:38   they do nothing you have to force quit [TS]

01:48:39   them to be able to launch them again [TS]

01:48:41   I understand that and yes sometimes the [TS]

01:48:42   OS get so host you gotta reboot but none [TS]

01:48:46   of this argues for you must reflexively [TS]

01:48:48   force quit every single application on [TS]

01:48:50   your phone every time you use it and [TS]

01:48:51   which again is exactly what i see that's [TS]

01:48:53   what I see my son doing and trying to [TS]

01:48:55   reason with him has not worked me still [TS]

01:48:56   does it and it's an embarrassment [TS]

01:48:58   ok to talk about me like any reason that [TS]

01:49:04   any legitimate reason that you need to [TS]

01:49:07   force quit all these apps all the time [TS]

01:49:09   is probably either a bug or short coming [TS]

01:49:13   in the operating system and so like yeah [TS]

01:49:15   apple should fix those like it is [TS]

01:49:18   totally valid today [TS]

01:49:19   a say I need to I need the ability to [TS]

01:49:22   force quit apps because sometimes they [TS]

01:49:24   don't want right or whatever you are [TS]

01:49:25   you're always gonna need the ability but [TS]

01:49:27   just turn to be a hundred percent [TS]

01:49:29   blanket habit is not good yeah i mean [TS]

01:49:32   like the Apple watch it [TS]

01:49:34   this is not a good example in general of [TS]

01:49:36   how to design a responsive and stable [TS]

01:49:38   software platform but the apple watch [TS]

01:49:40   has a way to force quit apps without [TS]

01:49:43   having app switcher most little know [TS]

01:49:45   about it but you can do it it's you know [TS]

01:49:47   we basically hit the sleep button yet [TS]

01:49:49   again it's a look it up but yeah it it [TS]

01:49:53   has a way to do that so like it is [TS]

01:49:56   possible to still have some kind of [TS]

01:49:58   gesture involving the the sleep/wake [TS]

01:50:00   button and holding it down in certain [TS]

01:50:02   certain way to have a force quit a [TS]

01:50:04   method without having without putting it [TS]

01:50:08   in the switcher and having that be the [TS]

01:50:09   method but i don't know that i think the [TS]

01:50:11   whole design of the most items which are [TS]

01:50:12   itself needs a lot of help in a lot of [TS]

01:50:15   ways not least of which is that [TS]

01:50:17   conceptually everybody thinks all those [TS]

01:50:19   are always running all the time and it's [TS]

01:50:21   clear mount so that's that's one of the [TS]

01:50:22   many problems with the current iOS app [TS]

01:50:24   switcher that is ultimately a design [TS]

01:50:27   problem non-technical one and the [TS]

01:50:29   technical problem is when when you know [TS]

01:50:31   that get stuck in that state where you [TS]

01:50:32   have to kill it because it won't watch [TS]

01:50:34   again like it will launch and you can [TS]

01:50:35   you know run it and use it but it's [TS]

01:50:37   useless or like you'll tap the icon and [TS]

01:50:40   nothing will happen [TS]

01:50:40   yeah and then like or just memory gets [TS]

01:50:43   filled or corrupted as an OS bug that [TS]

01:50:45   happens but none of that argues for [TS]

01:50:47   hands-on time first of all you got a [TS]

01:50:49   problem with your phone and it's it's at [TS]

01:50:51   obviously otherwise probably has plenty [TS]

01:50:53   of people use their phones and like I [TS]

01:50:55   don't force quit anything ever [TS]

01:50:56   essentially cuz i don't use the Facebook [TS]

01:50:58   and bounds anything and i used to use [TS]

01:50:59   iOS devices for years not for escorting [TS]

01:51:01   everything so it's always in an endemic [TS]

01:51:03   bug that that affects every single [TS]

01:51:04   device this happened to yours who knows [TS]

01:51:06   what's going on maybe have a problem [TS]

01:51:07   don't accept it as the status quo as [TS]

01:51:10   things working correctly and even when [TS]

01:51:11   it you do have a problem like that like [TS]

01:51:13   you can target but figure out which [TS]

01:51:15   applications of the problem when do I [TS]

01:51:16   need to do this because if you can't do [TS]

01:51:19   that every if you just give up and say I [TS]

01:51:21   have to do this all the time it's just [TS]

01:51:23   the easiest system that works like I [TS]

01:51:25   feel like a total failure of the product [TS]

01:51:27   like it's not the users fault at that [TS]

01:51:28   point it's just like the product is so [TS]

01:51:30   frustrated the user that they can't [TS]

01:51:32   that this is their tools for dealing [TS]

01:51:33   with it which is blanket force quitting [TS]

01:51:35   and they will never move away from it [TS]

01:51:36   because it's the only thing that's [TS]

01:51:37   giving them salvation on whatever weird [TS]

01:51:39   things going on their phone or the apps [TS]

01:51:41   that use and I feel like a papal saw you [TS]

01:51:44   do that they would feel that they have [TS]

01:51:45   failed you as a vendor of our products [TS]

01:51:47   because they don't want you to use it [TS]

01:51:49   that way and you shouldn't have to use [TS]

01:51:50   that way and you feel like you do [TS]

01:51:51   whether it's true or not whether you [TS]

01:51:53   have to if you feel like you do [TS]

01:51:55   that's a that's a break down there but [TS]

01:51:57   anyway I would say if you if you're [TS]

01:51:59   listening to this and you're effectively [TS]

01:52:00   force quit all your apps consider trying [TS]

01:52:05   to target your force quitting trying to [TS]

01:52:07   target better and maybe if there's an [TS]

01:52:09   application that's a particular problem [TS]

01:52:11   get off your phone i know you can't tell [TS]

01:52:12   people to get rid of facebook it's like [TS]

01:52:14   telling people i don't know like to give [TS]

01:52:16   up their firstborn but if that's not an [TS]

01:52:19   option for you in the face gives the [TS]

01:52:20   book is problematic one just trying [TS]

01:52:22   reflexively force quitting facebook but [TS]

01:52:24   don't say reflexively force quit your [TS]

01:52:26   favorite twitter app because it's [TS]

01:52:27   probably fine or maybe two rappers the [TS]

01:52:29   problem i don't know i just i'm telling [TS]

01:52:30   you is that it's not normal that you [TS]

01:52:33   shouldn't have to do this and and I know [TS]

01:52:35   many people who spend years and years [TS]

01:52:37   using iOS devices across multiple [TS]

01:52:39   hardware models and multiple OS miles [TS]

01:52:41   with multiple apps who don't even know [TS]

01:52:43   how to force quit and they're fine [TS]

01:52:45   so it is not like a fact of life on iOS [TS]

01:52:48   and people should not be doing it [TS]