The Accidental Tech Podcast

154: A Rich Toddler’s Toy


00:00:00   I hate looking at text manipulation and [TS]

00:00:01   JavaScript just makes me sad [TS]

00:00:03   of course we got a for loop with an [TS]

00:00:05   iterator that's great good language for [TS]

00:00:09   RI equal zero I less than words that [TS]

00:00:11   length i plus plus seriously that's [TS]

00:00:13   every sea-based language come on oh wait [TS]

00:00:16   no not necessarily it already even even [TS]

00:00:19   got objective c kit has been interesting [TS]

00:00:21   / collections without an explicit [TS]

00:00:22   iterator for many many years now in fact [TS]

00:00:24   it's been like seven different versions [TS]

00:00:26   of the iterating over collections even [TS]

00:00:28   PHP has that just depressing every [TS]

00:00:30   single javascript library influence [TS]

00:00:32   their on each thing you know and all the [TS]

00:00:34   the es6 and all the other you know yet [TS]

00:00:37   maybe even the later version cs5 have [TS]

00:00:40   stuff like this but then you gotta go [TS]

00:00:41   back down to just the very bottom [TS]

00:00:44   javascript is the new PHP I'm saying [TS]

00:00:46   don't forget to use triple equals avoid [TS]

00:00:49   those corporations we should probably do [TS]

00:00:53   some follow-up so chris adams in rodents [TS]

00:00:55   tell us about audio bus do you want to [TS]

00:00:57   talk to us about that John sure was I [TS]

00:00:59   think it was Marco who misled us on the [TS]

00:01:01   last program yet that's what about audio [TS]

00:01:04   bus being a network thing chris says the [TS]

00:01:07   audio was never relied on network back [TS]

00:01:09   for interprocess communication there's a [TS]

00:01:11   blog post by Michael tyson i think is [TS]

00:01:13   one of the creators will put a link in [TS]

00:01:14   the show notes and it explains that the [TS]

00:01:16   earliest versions of us used to midi sis [TS]

00:01:19   text messages which allow for arbitrary [TS]

00:01:20   buffers of data to be sent across the [TS]

00:01:22   minibus later migrated to mock reports I [TS]

00:01:24   know what those are which apples many [TS]

00:01:26   messaging is built on top of so there's [TS]

00:01:28   audio boss audio processor is getting a [TS]

00:01:29   bad rap on last episode is not as crazy [TS]

00:01:33   as we made it sound and how about the [TS]

00:01:36   internet audio framework [TS]

00:01:37   yeah and so the last episode we're also [TS]

00:01:39   talking about supported better supported [TS]

00:01:42   AP is rather not that put random [TS]

00:01:44   third-party thing is bad necessarily [TS]

00:01:45   especially since this building on top of [TS]

00:01:47   existing facilities like the midi thing [TS]

00:01:48   and mach port structure part of the [TS]

00:01:50   colonel that's underneath the iOS and OS [TS]

00:01:53   10 and apple TV OS and the watch OSN so [TS]

00:01:57   on and so forth [TS]

00:01:58   well there is added in ios7 to the audio [TS]

00:02:03   unit framework something called interact [TS]

00:02:05   audio IA [TS]

00:02:07   that enables a the ability to send midi [TS]

00:02:09   commands and stream audio between apps [TS]

00:02:11   on the same device and so if there are a [TS]

00:02:14   bunch of applications that support this [TS]

00:02:16   mechanism as I imagine there are after [TS]

00:02:18   iOS 7 things like you know virtual [TS]

00:02:21   effects pedals you know for audio [TS]

00:02:24   applications that you can send a new [TS]

00:02:25   audio for one out together but of course [TS]

00:02:27   says marker pointed out last time skype [TS]

00:02:29   doesn't support these type of things [TS]

00:02:30   probably is never going to support these [TS]

00:02:32   type of things so there's still a place [TS]

00:02:33   for and officially supported by the OS [TS]

00:02:36   way to route audio arbitrarily because [TS]

00:02:38   all the audio is going through or the OS [TS]

00:02:41   are being over the is aware that it's [TS]

00:02:43   happening and the routing capabilities [TS]

00:02:44   are probably in there which is how tools [TS]

00:02:47   like loopback and audio hijack work [TS]

00:02:49   their magic but they're the fact that [TS]

00:02:51   they're using private api's makes them a [TS]

00:02:53   little bit dangerous that too to support [TS]

00:02:58   over the long term home so be better of [TS]

00:03:01   apple instead of you know instead of [TS]

00:03:03   forcing every single application [TS]

00:03:04   developer on an entire system to write [TS]

00:03:06   to a new API especially those [TS]

00:03:10   applications don't consider themselves [TS]

00:03:11   audio apps like the most is a geyser for [TS]

00:03:14   people who are making music applications [TS]

00:03:16   to work together it would still be nice [TS]

00:03:17   for the OS to expose the mechanisms that [TS]

00:03:20   are so clearly there to control the [TS]

00:03:23   audio routing at the ls level rather [TS]

00:03:26   than just the individual app level [TS]

00:03:28   cooperating with each other through the [TS]

00:03:29   US so Marco tell us about lightning only [TS]

00:03:32   headphones as John Casey asked about yes [TS]

00:03:35   this is not confusing at all so John [TS]

00:03:36   Casey asked about something crazy and i [TS]

00:03:39   will be talking about [TS]

00:03:40   so basically he he throughout the [TS]

00:03:44   industry idea regarding the future of [TS]

00:03:45   the iphone 7 not having a headphone jack [TS]

00:03:48   probably and a future makes headphones [TS]

00:03:52   are lightning only he said many phones [TS]

00:03:55   come with detachable and replaceable [TS]

00:03:57   cables any chance Apple might make a [TS]

00:03:59   replacement cable not just an adapter [TS]

00:04:01   dongle the idea there would be that [TS]

00:04:03   apple sells you a eight just a straight [TS]

00:04:06   replacement cable for your for your [TS]

00:04:07   legacy headphones and so one and [TS]

00:04:11   highlighting the rain has a little [TS]

00:04:12   skinny to plug in the headphones at the [TS]

00:04:13   top and instead of just being this cold [TS]

00:04:15   feet after the bottom this and of course [TS]

00:04:17   in the middle they could put a really [TS]

00:04:18   good clicker it should be great so [TS]

00:04:21   this is a great idea in in theory in [TS]

00:04:23   practice it would probably not work very [TS]

00:04:26   well because the problem is the the end [TS]

00:04:28   of the cable at the headphone at the [TS]

00:04:30   earcups end of it that end is not [TS]

00:04:33   standard now usually it is either [TS]

00:04:36   another three-and-a-half a shack just [TS]

00:04:38   like that just like the end by the phone [TS]

00:04:40   or its it could be a smaller one the [TS]

00:04:42   two-and-a-half inch version of the two [TS]

00:04:44   and a half millimeter and then around it [TS]

00:04:46   you have a similar problem to the very [TS]

00:04:49   very first iphone or had that big [TS]

00:04:51   plastic surround and you couldn't fit [TS]

00:04:54   every kind of headphone plug into it [TS]

00:04:56   sometimes the plug would be too wide [TS]

00:04:57   like the the plastic around around the [TS]

00:05:00   plug would be too wide and it just [TS]

00:05:01   wouldn't fit around the housing around [TS]

00:05:03   the port that problem exists big time on [TS]

00:05:06   on headphones with replaceable cables [TS]

00:05:08   we're so often i'd say most of the time [TS]

00:05:12   a headphone can't actually even a [TS]

00:05:14   headphone that has a detachable cable [TS]

00:05:15   usually can't use another cable made for [TS]

00:05:19   a different headphone usually something [TS]

00:05:21   about it doesn't fit or it doesn't click [TS]

00:05:23   in right after some kind of locking [TS]

00:05:24   mechanism or something like that so in [TS]

00:05:27   practice the end of the headphone cable [TS]

00:05:29   on on the headphone on the earcup is not [TS]

00:05:32   standardized enough even among the ones [TS]

00:05:35   with removable cables to make it [TS]

00:05:37   possible for somebody to make like a [TS]

00:05:38   general-purpose aftermarket replacement [TS]

00:05:40   that fits a lot of them [TS]

00:05:42   that being said Apple could of course [TS]

00:05:44   make like one that works for all Beats [TS]

00:05:47   or at least the most common beats don't [TS]

00:05:48   have that many popular models they could [TS]

00:05:50   cover those and and cover a large [TS]

00:05:53   portion of the apple headphones using [TS]

00:05:55   population that is not saying it's [TS]

00:05:57   likely they would do this i think the [TS]

00:05:59   most likely answer is they wouldn't [TS]

00:06:01   dress at all and the answer would just [TS]

00:06:02   be well by new headphones or use our [TS]

00:06:04   adapter do all beats have detachable [TS]

00:06:07   cables my you know I don't know enough [TS]

00:06:09   about them to save all do i know many of [TS]

00:06:12   them do and and generally speaking [TS]

00:06:14   detachable cables are something i always [TS]

00:06:16   hope the headphones have and I always [TS]

00:06:18   always doing them if they don't in the [TS]

00:06:20   review because especially reporting for [TS]

00:06:23   desk headphones not as necessary because [TS]

00:06:25   you tend not to wear those out [TS]

00:06:27   portable headphones you know they are [TS]

00:06:29   constantly being wrapped up and [TS]

00:06:30   unwrapped and putting back to taking out [TS]

00:06:32   and everything and select there's a lot [TS]

00:06:33   of stress on the cable [TS]

00:06:34   in the end usually what makes headphones [TS]

00:06:37   died what makes it fun to go bad or stop [TS]

00:06:39   being usable is usually one of two [TS]

00:06:41   things usually either the wire phrase [TS]

00:06:44   near one of the ends usually the phone [TS]

00:06:46   and but if it's a permanent cable could [TS]

00:06:48   also frame at the place where it meets [TS]

00:06:49   the earcup or if their beats they [TS]

00:06:52   literally break in half because the head [TS]

00:06:55   literally because if you're if you're on [TS]

00:06:57   if you have a plastic headband when when [TS]

00:07:01   you put headphones on the headbands to [TS]

00:07:02   stretch out a little bit and that is so [TS]

00:07:04   it's constantly being stretched and on [TS]

00:07:06   stretching stretching and rest of the [TS]

00:07:07   stress of that if you have an all [TS]

00:07:09   plastic headband very often results in [TS]

00:07:12   the headband cracking right in the [TS]

00:07:13   middle that is usually how bad [TS]

00:07:15   headphones break good headphones usually [TS]

00:07:17   eventually break is the cables go bad [TS]

00:07:18   somewhere on the way [TS]

00:07:19   alright anyway we have some super [TS]

00:07:24   important follow-up the internet and [TS]

00:07:27   prosper possibly the country or maybe [TS]

00:07:29   even the world would like to know John [TS]

00:07:32   what's going on with your destiny had we [TS]

00:07:35   talked about my when I had to move my [TS]

00:07:38   playstation 4 off of my plasma [TS]

00:07:40   television onto a separate gaming [TS]

00:07:42   monitor because i was playing destiny a [TS]

00:07:43   lot and I noticed that the HUD is up on [TS]

00:07:46   the screen while playing destiny was [TS]

00:07:47   burning into my plasma screen so i had [TS]

00:07:49   to evict the entire console from the [TS]

00:07:51   television which is kind of a shame [TS]

00:07:52   because it looked way better my TV that [TS]

00:07:53   doesn't this terrible little monitor [TS]

00:07:55   that i'm using right now but when i [TS]

00:07:57   moved it away i also set a calendar [TS]

00:07:59   reminder for a year in the future to say [TS]

00:08:02   course mom it reminding me to check [TS]

00:08:06   whether the Destiny HUD has finally worn [TS]

00:08:09   off of my television because of what i [TS]

00:08:11   heard from people had people have the [TS]

00:08:13   same model as me is that yes and [TS]

00:08:15   retention is a problem but in most cases [TS]

00:08:17   it's not actually permanent it just [TS]

00:08:19   takes forever to go away so it's fine [TS]

00:08:21   i'll put a thing for years some people [TS]

00:08:22   say it took many months some people they [TS]

00:08:24   took multiple years so i figure i'll put [TS]

00:08:26   a reminder for a year [TS]

00:08:27   it's not like I forgotten about it i'm [TS]

00:08:28   watching TV and I've been looking at it [TS]

00:08:30   fact i'm always looking my television i [TS]

00:08:32   was noticing that the you know the [TS]

00:08:33   cartoon network along with that I've [TS]

00:08:34   complained about impact shows was [TS]

00:08:35   burning in anyway this is the year [TS]

00:08:38   anniversary today I think probably the [TS]

00:08:41   day so I took a look at my television in [TS]

00:08:44   the various ways that you can do what [TS]

00:08:46   you put in solid colors behind it and a [TS]

00:08:48   pure white screen and stuff like that [TS]

00:08:49   and i can say that the from a normal [TS]

00:08:54   setting distance if I didn't know where [TS]

00:08:56   the HUD was supposed to be I wouldn't be [TS]

00:08:58   able to see it i think a normal person [TS]

00:09:00   would not be able to see it I can barely [TS]

00:09:03   see only the superb are the big bar that [TS]

00:09:05   feels with a with color as your super [TS]

00:09:08   gets charged up and turns the other ones [TS]

00:09:10   for charge [TS]

00:09:11   I can barely kind of make out where that [TS]

00:09:14   used to be no other part of the hundred [TS]

00:09:16   visible and that even like I i got [TS]

00:09:18   really close to television like am I [TS]

00:09:19   just imagining that it's there because i [TS]

00:09:21   remember where it was trying to love to [TS]

00:09:24   see this [TS]

00:09:25   so I its it is almost entirely gone you [TS]

00:09:28   can totally see the big c and the little [TS]

00:09:30   bit of the end cartoon network's that's [TS]

00:09:31   a good you know [TS]

00:09:32   thing to compare it to like I can see [TS]

00:09:34   the CN and Cartoon Network has been [TS]

00:09:36   banned from this television as well now [TS]

00:09:37   but so I say that the the estimated [TS]

00:09:41   experiment is not coming back to my TV [TS]

00:09:42   ps4 is not coming that evo x I might [TS]

00:09:45   move back for individual game or two but [TS]

00:09:48   i won't play destiny over there anyway [TS]

00:09:51   it has faded substantially so what look [TS]

00:09:53   like a permanent image retention was not [TS]

00:09:55   actually permanent just took a really [TS]

00:09:56   really long time to go away so i suppose [TS]

00:09:58   i put another calendar on him for a year [TS]

00:10:00   from now or visit for a second year to [TS]

00:10:03   see if it's really really gone but at [TS]

00:10:04   some point is one replaces TV with the [TS]

00:10:06   fancy old one so people need to start [TS]

00:10:07   making better televisions the name of [TS]

00:10:11   every episode people to start making [TS]

00:10:13   better television they do John [TS]

00:10:15   Syracuse's our noses the bad time for [TS]

00:10:17   tvs trying to wait about I i bought i [TS]

00:10:20   felt like i bought at the right time [TS]

00:10:22   about the peak of the previous [TS]

00:10:23   generation of televisions and now just [TS]

00:10:26   got just endure this until we can't go [TS]

00:10:27   outside [TS]

00:10:28   yeah it does seem like you bought [TS]

00:10:29   probably the best 1080p plasma that will [TS]

00:10:32   ever exist and probably the best plasma [TS]

00:10:35   that will ever exist and now you just [TS]

00:10:37   kind of have to wait for like when 4k [TS]

00:10:39   gets non stupid [TS]

00:10:41   well yeah they got to work out all the [TS]

00:10:42   HDR [TS]

00:10:43   stuff and work out their standards there [TS]

00:10:45   and then get the the old kinks worked [TS]

00:10:47   out like there was a fancier model than [TS]

00:10:49   the 1i got but had started lower [TS]

00:10:50   brightness and so I sacrificed and it [TS]

00:10:52   was also more money and I was like it's [TS]

00:10:54   very similar it's really too close to [TS]

00:10:56   call and I think the extra brightness [TS]

00:10:58   will be a what i want to be i bought [TS]

00:11:00   pretty much at the right time and I [TS]

00:11:02   lucked out with the the fan noise and [TS]

00:11:04   everything which I was afraid of that [TS]

00:11:06   turned out not to be an issue especially [TS]

00:11:07   compared to my previous television but [TS]

00:11:09   right now I when I finally did read up [TS]

00:11:11   on all the tvs and see us and everything [TS]

00:11:12   and now it's like just a battle over the [TS]

00:11:15   high dynamic range standards and you [TS]

00:11:18   know that all those different standards [TS]

00:11:20   and which channels are going to support [TS]

00:11:23   what for broadcast and we'll netflix [TS]

00:11:25   supported and what things the ultra HD [TS]

00:11:28   blu rays are supporting and what [TS]

00:11:30   television manufacturers are and it's [TS]

00:11:32   just it's a big mess i really want to [TS]

00:11:34   just be settled and then it and then of [TS]

00:11:37   course i'll let you have to make you [TS]

00:11:38   have to make a few generations always [TS]

00:11:40   before they get that worked out so the [TS]

00:11:42   long way to go here I mean a lot of the [TS]

00:11:43   HDR standards are being supported by [TS]

00:11:45   televisions the can actually display the [TS]

00:11:46   entire range of the HDR stuff yet so [TS]

00:11:49   yeah two or three years probably [TS]

00:11:52   now just to prevent us from getting a [TS]

00:11:54   crudload of email would you mind [TS]

00:11:55   reminding listeners what TV you ended up [TS]

00:11:57   I oh I don't remember the name for its [TS]

00:12:00   panasonic a vt60 excellent the zt60 was [TS]

00:12:04   the fancy this is the slightly fancier [TS]

00:12:06   one [TS]

00:12:07   alright thank you very much now do you [TS]

00:12:09   want to tell us about pirate eye patches [TS]

00:12:11   because we got a surprising about 15 [TS]

00:12:14   back about pirate eye patch is never in [TS]

00:12:17   my life did I think we would be getting [TS]

00:12:18   this series about pirate eye patches on [TS]

00:12:20   the accidental text podcast but here we [TS]

00:12:22   are [TS]

00:12:23   I opened the door the pirate eye patch [TS]

00:12:24   organized well finish closing here so [TS]

00:12:26   the first thing to point out which is [TS]

00:12:27   not something we discussed last time is [TS]

00:12:29   not whether or not the things we said [TS]

00:12:32   about a pirate eye patch is helping you [TS]

00:12:34   see in the dark or actually you know it [TS]

00:12:37   was actually true doesn't actually help [TS]

00:12:38   you see in the dark as we didn't like [TS]

00:12:39   the Mythbusters episode about that but [TS]

00:12:41   the larger issue of did lots of pirates [TS]

00:12:44   have eye patches and the consensus on [TS]

00:12:47   that seems to be probably not like [TS]

00:12:50   there's no evidence of that the only [TS]

00:12:51   reason we think that is because you know [TS]

00:12:52   Hollywood [TS]

00:12:53   and various movies and stories and [TS]

00:12:55   famous pirates and black beard and all [TS]

00:12:57   that other business or whatever but [TS]

00:12:58   historical records of parts like for [TS]

00:13:00   there a lot of one re odd parts were all [TS]

00:13:02   the Pirates wearing eye patches i can [TS]

00:13:03   see better under decks there's no [TS]

00:13:05   evidence for that so that is basically [TS]

00:13:06   probably really powerful you know and [TS]

00:13:09   not really based on anything but the [TS]

00:13:12   other part that we're talking about it [TS]

00:13:14   does that actually help you see [TS]

00:13:15   underdecks and this I think is a great [TS]

00:13:17   example of what i would call testing [TS]

00:13:19   versus explaining some somebody sent us [TS]

00:13:22   a link to this other podcast that had I [TS]

00:13:25   was I forget what it's called but it's a [TS]

00:13:27   like acuminate I podcast we asked [TS]

00:13:29   questions that an expert on to answer [TS]

00:13:31   and the question was like hey if you put [TS]

00:13:32   an eye patch over your I would that help [TS]

00:13:34   you see better because 1i will be [TS]

00:13:36   adjusted to the dark or whatever and [TS]

00:13:37   then the person on the show said their [TS]

00:13:40   answer contained all correct information [TS]

00:13:42   but didn't really lead to the correct [TS]

00:13:43   conclusion and the idea was that you [TS]

00:13:45   keep one eye under an eye patch and the [TS]

00:13:48   other eye out of it it's not as if the [TS]

00:13:49   eye on the eye patch of the people is [TS]

00:13:51   going to dilate massively and the eyes [TS]

00:13:53   out of the eye patch that people's not [TS]

00:13:54   going to because in general if one of [TS]

00:13:57   your pupils is way bigger than the other [TS]

00:13:58   you probably just got hit really hard [TS]

00:14:00   you should see a doctor like they they [TS]

00:14:02   tend to be the same size favors called a [TS]

00:14:04   consensual response or whatever like [TS]

00:14:05   that your pupils are basically you've [TS]

00:14:07   heard on all the television shows you [TS]

00:14:08   know are equal and reactive when they [TS]

00:14:10   did a little nightlight thing in your [TS]

00:14:12   eyes to make sure that a your eyes [TS]

00:14:13   respond to light by you know you people [TS]

00:14:16   getting smaller and be that they're [TS]

00:14:17   equal if one of them stays open [TS]

00:14:20   they want you to go to the doctor really [TS]

00:14:22   quickly right and so they said therefore [TS]

00:14:25   the whole idea of our iPad is silly [TS]

00:14:28   because it's not as if the one under the [TS]

00:14:30   eye patch is going to have a really [TS]

00:14:31   dilated people just waiting for you to [TS]

00:14:33   go under decks and flip up the eye patch [TS]

00:14:34   right now what the Mythbusters did [TS]

00:14:36   instead was rather than trying to think [TS]

00:14:38   of a theory why when Morgan said well [TS]

00:14:39   this is easy enough to test we just make [TS]

00:14:40   a dark place and put my passion [TS]

00:14:42   someone's eye and given some silly task [TS]

00:14:44   let's see how fast that we're an episode [TS]

00:14:46   but see how fast they can accomplish a [TS]

00:14:48   bunch of tasks and its really dark room [TS]

00:14:49   and tried with throughout without the [TS]

00:14:51   eye patch and the eyepatch just crushed [TS]

00:14:52   the non eyepatch one it was extremely [TS]

00:14:55   efficient way to see better in the dark [TS]

00:14:56   and so how do you how do you square this [TS]

00:14:59   circle that where the explaining things [TS]

00:15:02   went wrong is [TS]

00:15:03   the idea that the size of your pupils [TS]

00:15:06   the only thing that determines how well [TS]

00:15:08   you see in the dark that is one aspect [TS]

00:15:09   that would people opens up more to let [TS]

00:15:11   more light in the other aspect of it is [TS]

00:15:13   how sensitive little things in the back [TS]

00:15:15   of your IR and someone sent us a link to [TS]

00:15:18   think about astronomy red lights in [TS]

00:15:20   astronomy and wide running these red [TS]

00:15:21   lights when you're you know looking up [TS]

00:15:22   at the stars and that contains another [TS]

00:15:25   another theory of what helps you see in [TS]

00:15:28   the dark and it's the sensitivity of the [TS]

00:15:30   rods at the back of your eye that help [TS]

00:15:32   you see in the dark from this article [TS]

00:15:35   during daylight hours you're Roger [TS]

00:15:36   overexposed and so they're less [TS]

00:15:37   efficient as life gets them are chemical [TS]

00:15:39   change allows them to become even more [TS]

00:15:40   sensitive in your eyes become dark [TS]

00:15:42   adapted it only takes brief exposure to [TS]

00:15:45   bright light for the rods to overexpose [TS]

00:15:47   once that happens you have a half an [TS]

00:15:48   hour or more to regain dark sensitivity [TS]

00:15:50   so you really wanted to be on the [TS]

00:15:53   eyepatch not to change the size of your [TS]

00:15:54   people but to get the rods in that I [TS]

00:15:56   which are not consensual with the [TS]

00:15:57   resonator I'm like your your iris [TS]

00:15:59   dilation to get them to be more [TS]

00:16:01   sensitive to light and it's important [TS]

00:16:03   because if you expose them just for a [TS]

00:16:04   short period of time it's gonna take [TS]

00:16:05   like half an hour for them to get back [TS]

00:16:07   to super dark sent away because chemical [TS]

00:16:08   change in the eye and not just a [TS]

00:16:10   physical change and you know that simply [TS]

00:16:12   adjusting the aperture of your eyeball [TS]

00:16:14   is over is aperture basically yeah [TS]

00:16:17   so there you go everything you ever [TS]

00:16:19   wanted to know about pirate probably not [TS]

00:16:21   because people are still gonna want to [TS]

00:16:22   know why the hell did we think parts of [TS]

00:16:24   ipads i forget which particular pop [TS]

00:16:27   culture thing cost us to think that but [TS]

00:16:29   we're going to see whether or not they [TS]

00:16:30   have I patches if they did they could [TS]

00:16:32   use them just like the Mythbusters and [TS]

00:16:34   would help them see in the dark better [TS]

00:16:36   fair enough when do you want to talk [TS]

00:16:40   about how this relates to programming [TS]

00:16:42   well I don't know how like the testing [TS]

00:16:44   versus explaining i guess like one of my [TS]

00:16:46   pet peeves as an old cranky programmer [TS]

00:16:48   is if you hear it whether it's going on [TS]

00:16:52   between you and another programmer are [TS]

00:16:53   you here to other programmers sitting [TS]

00:16:55   here you talking to each other about [TS]

00:16:57   usually some sleep corner of the [TS]

00:17:00   language things people have talked about [TS]

00:17:02   language but even Google be an API or [TS]

00:17:03   whatever well if you do this you do that [TS]

00:17:05   it does that and you know if you if you [TS]

00:17:08   call it this way that will happen and [TS]

00:17:10   this thing doesn't have blonde and let's [TS]

00:17:11   go back and forth for what seems like a [TS]

00:17:13   really long time especially if they're [TS]

00:17:14   sitting near you and talking to you [TS]

00:17:15   going to get work done and didn't try [TS]

00:17:18   morning last seconds [TS]

00:17:19   yeah trying to help with like you know [TS]

00:17:21   explain to each other no actually [TS]

00:17:24   language works with all your not [TS]

00:17:25   accounting visible blah where there's no [TS]

00:17:28   reason to have this discussion because [TS]

00:17:29   in 20 seconds of typing you can find the [TS]

00:17:31   answer definitively like you don't have [TS]

00:17:33   to speculate about what the language [TS]

00:17:35   features like so is that a syntax error [TS]

00:17:36   or how would you do that expression of [TS]

00:17:38   this is the correct way to do references [TS]

00:17:39   or whatever don't speculate not debated [TS]

00:17:42   for 10 minutes just type it in pop up [TS]

00:17:44   there's your answer and then you can [TS]

00:17:46   talk about why that's the answer or [TS]

00:17:48   whatever but you don't have to do Google [TS]

00:17:49   searches not doing anything like [TS]

00:17:50   especially if your language of the rebel [TS]

00:17:52   just just find out so it's testing [TS]

00:17:53   versus explaining that explaining and [TS]

00:17:56   theorizing and thought experience a good [TS]

00:17:57   idea but when it's really really easy or [TS]

00:18:00   you know simple or very rarely available [TS]

00:18:02   to test it just testing this is faster [TS]

00:18:04   and better and will lead you wrong in [TS]

00:18:08   its own type of ways if you do your [TS]

00:18:09   testing badly but sometimes it things [TS]

00:18:11   are just very simple so the eyepatch [TS]

00:18:12   thing is like we have a theory we think [TS]

00:18:14   I patches help you see better in the [TS]

00:18:15   dark [TS]

00:18:15   is that true so easy to test you can [TS]

00:18:18   spend all day talking to you know [TS]

00:18:20   doctors and neurologists and theorizing [TS]

00:18:23   about know probably get the right answer [TS]

00:18:24   but if you get off on the wrong track [TS]

00:18:26   and think about all the dilation that's [TS]

00:18:28   not you know that that's not going to [TS]

00:18:29   help you there [TS]

00:18:30   it's just so much easier to test [TS]

00:18:31   something advisors knows or cares why it [TS]

00:18:33   works [TS]

00:18:34   they just tested it and assuming the [TS]

00:18:36   test is reasonably sound they come to a [TS]

00:18:38   useful conclusion in much less time [TS]

00:18:40   before we do the last bit of incredibly [TS]

00:18:43   incredibly exciting follow up our first [TS]

00:18:46   bunch of this week is Harry's go to [TS]

00:18:48   Harry's calm and use promo code ATP to [TS]

00:18:50   say five dollars off your first purchase [TS]

00:18:51   Harry's offers high-quality razors and [TS]

00:18:54   blades for a fraction of the price of [TS]

00:18:56   the big razor brands they started by two [TS]

00:18:58   guys who wanted a better product without [TS]

00:19:00   paying an arm and a leg they make their [TS]

00:19:01   own blades from their own factory an [TS]

00:19:04   oblate factory in Germany that they [TS]

00:19:05   actually bought these are high quality [TS]

00:19:07   high performing German blades crafted by [TS]

00:19:09   shaping experts give you a better shave [TS]

00:19:11   respect your face and your wallet here [TS]

00:19:13   is our first factory direct pricing at a [TS]

00:19:15   fraction of the big-brand prices there [TS]

00:19:16   about half the price of what used to [TS]

00:19:18   paying for big brand razor blades in the [TS]

00:19:20   supermarket now the starter set is an [TS]

00:19:22   amazing deal for fifteen bucks you get a [TS]

00:19:24   razor moisturizing shave cream or gel [TS]

00:19:26   and three razor blade cartridges when [TS]

00:19:28   you need more [TS]

00:19:29   blades just two dollars each or less so [TS]

00:19:32   in a package is fifteen bucks a 16 pack [TS]

00:19:34   is just 25 bucks 16 blade for 25 bucks [TS]

00:19:38   is roughly half the price of what you [TS]

00:19:41   would pay for the big brands you're [TS]

00:19:43   probably thinking of that sells the [TS]

00:19:45   expensive razor blade in the store and I [TS]

00:19:46   would say these are very comfortable to [TS]

00:19:47   those quality and performance wise half [TS]

00:19:50   the price [TS]

00:19:50   so with Harry's you get comfort closest [TS]

00:19:53   and comedians at the ridiculously low [TS]

00:19:55   price of under two dollars per blade [TS]

00:19:57   it's also very tastefully designed to [TS]

00:19:59   get these nice you know heavy weighty [TS]

00:20:01   handles kinda like like a modern madmen [TS]

00:20:04   kind of aesthetic really nice aesthetic [TS]

00:20:06   high-quality stuff feels good looks good [TS]

00:20:08   comes in great packaging the website [TS]

00:20:10   nice and easy to use and shave quality [TS]

00:20:12   is very good with Harry's you get all [TS]

00:20:14   this all at the half the price of the [TS]

00:20:16   big brands get started today with a set [TS]

00:20:18   that includes handle three blades and [TS]

00:20:20   shaving cream for just 15 bucks [TS]

00:20:22   including free shipping right to your [TS]

00:20:23   door [TS]

00:20:24   harrods.com use promo code ATP to save [TS]

00:20:26   five dollars off your first purchase [TS]

00:20:28   thank you very much to harry's now the [TS]

00:20:31   incredibly interesting follow-up that [TS]

00:20:33   we've been holding off on this whole [TS]

00:20:34   time [TS]

00:20:35   yes this is riveting and really [TS]

00:20:37   important actually I joke because it is [TS]

00:20:40   kind of silly but I was really [TS]

00:20:41   interested to know where the crap is the [TS]

00:20:44   serial code or serial number on a visa [TS]

00:20:48   mounts imac and we discovered last week [TS]

00:20:51   that the serial number for a regular [TS]

00:20:53   imac with the Bigfoot is on the bottom [TS]

00:20:56   of the foot right and so the question [TS]

00:20:58   was if you get one with with the VESA [TS]

00:21:00   mount that is like that custom on around [TS]

00:21:03   the back doesn't have the foot doesn't [TS]

00:21:05   come with the foot where they put the [TS]

00:21:06   serial number right and so we figured [TS]

00:21:09   you know probably would be somewhere on [TS]

00:21:11   the mount or what-have-you because where [TS]

00:21:13   else would it be [TS]

00:21:14   and sure enough James McCain has written [TS]

00:21:17   in and included a picture this is [TS]

00:21:19   professional level follow up right here [TS]

00:21:21   included a picture of exactly where the [TS]

00:21:24   serial number is on his visa mount imac [TS]

00:21:27   and [TS]

00:21:27   and so it turns out it is if you flip [TS]

00:21:31   the entire machine upside down its kind [TS]

00:21:33   of printed in there right by the fan is [TS]

00:21:35   that the exhaust or intake in the back [TS]

00:21:37   that is exhaust intake is it is the big [TS]

00:21:39   bridge in the bottom enough so anyway so [TS]

00:21:41   that's where it is [TS]

00:21:42   as it turns out i was waiting for Jason [TS]

00:21:44   smell to let us know but apparently he's [TS]

00:21:46   not caught up on the show I'm very upset [TS]

00:21:47   him but James McCain has saved the day [TS]

00:21:50   so thank you James [TS]

00:21:51   i remember back in the day speaking of [TS]

00:21:52   serial numbers that if you've got [TS]

00:21:54   certain repairs done to say your laptop [TS]

00:21:56   mac the serial number would change [TS]

00:21:57   because they give you a full [TS]

00:21:58   motherboards a pop or whatever and if [TS]

00:22:01   that's still the case you especially [TS]

00:22:03   that's why i was asking if this is a [TS]

00:22:04   sticker or etched onto the thing you [TS]

00:22:06   could end up [TS]

00:22:07   I mean you could end up with that they [TS]

00:22:08   replaced the guts of your imac with a [TS]

00:22:11   machine that has a different serial [TS]

00:22:12   number than the one that is actually [TS]

00:22:13   etched into the metal on the device [TS]

00:22:14   which can be very confusing to all [TS]

00:22:15   involved if you're not aware that i [TS]

00:22:17   think i remember we actually had [TS]

00:22:18   repaired only that maybe to a white [TS]

00:22:20   ibook maybe like my mom's why I book or [TS]

00:22:22   something we had some repair and they [TS]

00:22:24   said just so you know your serial number [TS]

00:22:25   will be changing but even though have [TS]

00:22:27   the same external case anyway I don't [TS]

00:22:30   know if that's still an issue but it [TS]

00:22:31   always struck me as weird it that they [TS]

00:22:32   would attach the serial number 22 the [TS]

00:22:36   physical device but it's really [TS]

00:22:38   connected to the innards of the device [TS]

00:22:40   you could end up in these are scenarios [TS]

00:22:42   where things are wrong i think they can [TS]

00:22:43   also like I don't know what does nothing [TS]

00:22:45   for geniuses consensus I think they used [TS]

00:22:47   to be able to change the serial number [TS]

00:22:49   of your motherboard by like flashing it [TS]

00:22:50   back to the old value but I don't know [TS]

00:22:52   if that's the thing that they did [TS]

00:22:53   yes so as a friend of the show Stephen [TS]

00:22:55   hacking in the chat is saying crap i [TS]

00:22:58   lost now they have to reseal realize the [TS]

00:23:00   boards and usually that comes with a [TS]

00:23:02   sticker you put over the edge serial [TS]

00:23:04   number also the tipster the chat is [TS]

00:23:07   saying the serials change for laptops [TS]

00:23:08   they will often swap the bottom cover [TS]

00:23:10   with one that has no cereal like to give [TS]

00:23:13   you a sticker all the Indian the [TS]

00:23:15   indignities yeah we we fixed your mac [TS]

00:23:18   which by the way here's a sticker to put [TS]

00:23:19   over the the beautiful laser etched in [TS]

00:23:22   serial number that's there [TS]

00:23:23   no thanks yeah i would mean the good [TS]

00:23:25   thing is that they're you mean on [TS]

00:23:26   laptops is it a problem on the desktop [TS]

00:23:28   at least they're like hidden away in [TS]

00:23:29   places that you'd never see it but if it [TS]

00:23:31   sits on your laptop like now the modern [TS]

00:23:33   ones that's on the outside on the bottom [TS]

00:23:36   we you would totally see that [TS]

00:23:37   well as I'm getting about [TS]

00:23:38   thing that has no serial numbers and you [TS]

00:23:40   can be like steve jobs with no license [TS]

00:23:41   plates on his car [TS]

00:23:42   yeah totally off the grid untracked by [TS]

00:23:45   Apple serial number readers I'm [TS]

00:23:46   untraceable except every other aspect [TS]

00:23:49   trees will accept by all the software i [TS]

00:23:54   just love how deeply offended you guys [TS]

00:23:55   are about the thought of having a [TS]

00:23:56   sticker on your computer [TS]

00:23:58   look either you're a sticker person or [TS]

00:23:59   you're not if you're not the idea of any [TS]

00:24:02   sticker on there is like is horrible [TS]

00:24:04   that's the whole reason we buy max we [TS]

00:24:06   wouldn't have intel inside and video [TS]

00:24:08   power all these like powered by [TS]

00:24:10   invention by asus like all this stupid [TS]

00:24:12   so they put on their computers then and [TS]

00:24:14   on the pc world and here we don't have [TS]

00:24:16   that if you are a sticker person you [TS]

00:24:19   probably want better stickers then [TS]

00:24:21   stupid apple secret them open [TS]

00:24:24   alright so moving out of follow-up apple [TS]

00:24:27   earnings were as we record last night it [TS]

00:24:30   turns out they made a lot of money go [TS]

00:24:32   figure [TS]

00:24:33   but there's a couple things that I think [TS]

00:24:35   are interesting first of all their [TS]

00:24:38   guidance for iphone sales is down a bit [TS]

00:24:41   so they haven't said if I if I [TS]

00:24:44   understood things correctly they haven't [TS]

00:24:46   said that they've sold less iphones [TS]

00:24:47   already but they are expecting to sell [TS]

00:24:49   SI phones in the next quarter is that [TS]

00:24:51   accurate as compared to compared to the [TS]

00:24:53   year-ago quarter right unless you're [TS]

00:24:55   there were a number of reasons and [TS]

00:24:57   liking the last year they there were [TS]

00:24:58   some overflow from the holiday quarter [TS]

00:25:00   that was very strong like some of those [TS]

00:25:01   happen in the next in you know the next [TS]

00:25:03   quarter and so we're not going to have [TS]

00:25:05   that this year and also last year's tons [TS]

00:25:07   of pent-up demand for the bigger screen [TS]

00:25:09   phones and this year that has been [TS]

00:25:11   alleviated and then there's currency [TS]

00:25:13   fluctuations and economy fluctuations [TS]

00:25:16   and everything else and I do we care [TS]

00:25:18   doesn't matter well i mean i don't think [TS]

00:25:21   we care about the details in the way [TS]

00:25:22   that the people of financial called do [TS]

00:25:24   like tell us exactly why this quarter [TS]

00:25:26   will be weaker than ever but like I'm [TS]

00:25:29   looking at a Jason sex college course [TS]

00:25:31   with all the pretty graphs and [TS]

00:25:32   everything you just look at the you know [TS]

00:25:34   the 24 according to a quarter moving [TS]

00:25:36   average graphs and try to get a shape of [TS]

00:25:38   the lines of the various products and [TS]

00:25:39   how they're doing and it's some kind of [TS]

00:25:42   our job because a lot of it is revenue [TS]

00:25:43   instead of units in these graphs but you [TS]

00:25:46   can get a kind of idea of where the [TS]

00:25:48   company is that with it [TS]

00:25:49   various product lines you guys looking [TS]

00:25:51   at this page mhm like look at Apple [TS]

00:25:53   revenue for quarter moving average [TS]

00:25:55   showing the total and the iphone ipad [TS]

00:25:57   and the mac mhm right so wait you get a [TS]

00:26:01   picture of the company here the total [TS]

00:26:02   line shows you the company still going [TS]

00:26:04   you know from the lower left of the [TS]

00:26:07   upper right more or less if you could [TS]

00:26:08   enter a trend line growth right good and [TS]

00:26:11   then we're gonna come from using his [TS]

00:26:13   iphone line that is going up but it's [TS]

00:26:15   starting to get a little hump at the top [TS]

00:26:17   of it not you know it's not going hockey [TS]

00:26:19   stick it upwards now starting to go more [TS]

00:26:21   like you know ski mobile monkey know [TS]

00:26:27   whatever you want to call it a mound [TS]

00:26:29   right the the slope is decreasing right [TS]

00:26:31   along the bottom you have the mac which [TS]

00:26:33   always on these graphs looks like just a [TS]

00:26:34   flat line because the fluctuations the [TS]

00:26:36   mac is so low below the iphone the [TS]

00:26:38   fluctuations are barely visible and [TS]

00:26:40   maybe at the ipad which like starts off [TS]

00:26:42   around the same as the mac makes a [TS]

00:26:44   tentative bid to go to the higher parts [TS]

00:26:47   of the chart and says nevermind and [TS]

00:26:49   actually dips below the mac in the most [TS]

00:26:51   recent year [TS]

00:26:52   yeah this was not a good report for the [TS]

00:26:54   ipad no yes look at that look at the [TS]

00:26:57   ipad one look at ipad units for quarter [TS]

00:26:59   moving average that now it looks like [TS]

00:27:00   it's like you know it's a it's hump it's [TS]

00:27:03   an upside-down you [TS]

00:27:04   it starts at the bottom goes up top and [TS]

00:27:05   starts going down again and now we're [TS]

00:27:07   getting like an actual proper hump but i [TS]

00:27:09   think is a better one later on if you [TS]

00:27:10   ever see like the ipod graft your single [TS]

00:27:13   graph with the ipod on it to the ipod [TS]

00:27:15   just looks like it comes out of nowhere [TS]

00:27:16   makes this big lump and goes back down [TS]

00:27:18   to basically zero it makes a nice [TS]

00:27:20   mountain in the graph like hearing on [TS]

00:27:22   the ipod oh nevermind had a good run [TS]

00:27:26   yeah it's over the course of many many [TS]

00:27:28   years but like that official can find [TS]

00:27:30   that graph the things that struck [TS]

00:27:30   striking out looking at the ipod is like [TS]

00:27:33   that the ipod is like it's hump is even [TS]

00:27:35   smaller than the ipad some for similar [TS]

00:27:37   size to the iPads and we thought the [TS]

00:27:38   ipod was this whole big world changing [TS]

00:27:40   apples the ipod company kind of thing it [TS]

00:27:42   is nothing compared to the iphone the [TS]

00:27:44   problem with all these graphs as soon as [TS]

00:27:45   you put the iphone the graph it totally [TS]

00:27:47   blows the y-axis and you can't read [TS]

00:27:49   anything anymore because it's a [TS]

00:27:51   ridiculously huge make so much money so [TS]

00:27:54   many units that everything else starts [TS]

00:27:56   to kind of even out but anyway I I the [TS]

00:27:58   one thing I put in the journals about [TS]

00:27:59   this is I think the ipad is the the real [TS]

00:28:02   story that i'm interested in at least [TS]

00:28:03   and learning the results yet one also [TS]

00:28:06   want one thing before it before we move [TS]

00:28:08   onto the ipad is obviously the iphone is [TS]

00:28:11   the company you know the iphone is the [TS]

00:28:14   most important thing in the company by [TS]

00:28:16   numbers and then by many other metrics [TS]

00:28:19   it by a longshot it's not even close [TS]

00:28:21   like it says it down here in on those [TS]

00:28:23   charges cause it's the iphone made [TS]

00:28:26   sixty-eight percent of the revenue in [TS]

00:28:28   the entire company the average selling [TS]

00:28:30   price of the iphone is incredibly [TS]

00:28:32   important to the company's financial [TS]

00:28:35   outlook and this is why you know it when [TS]

00:28:39   I when I make predictions or when i try [TS]

00:28:40   to explain things that that use the [TS]

00:28:43   iphone average selling price as a [TS]

00:28:45   justification for why Apple did or might [TS]

00:28:48   do something this is this kind of shows [TS]

00:28:51   you why that might override decisions [TS]

00:28:54   from Apple about things like what's [TS]

00:28:56   actually best for the customer or what [TS]

00:28:59   actually might be the best product [TS]

00:29:00   because it's everything's in balance [TS]

00:29:03   with apple with any company everything's [TS]

00:29:05   in balance [TS]

00:29:06   no company is like pure good are pure [TS]

00:29:08   evil everything's always these you know [TS]

00:29:10   contending factors that are that are in [TS]

00:29:12   a trying to reach equilibrium but [TS]

00:29:13   there's there's always the always [TS]

00:29:15   contention between them i don't have [TS]

00:29:17   contending is a word but it is now [TS]

00:29:18   anyway so with Apple they're always kind [TS]

00:29:20   of fighting between what they can make [TS]

00:29:22   you know what's possible to make what [TS]

00:29:24   they can ship on time [TS]

00:29:25   what's profitable and what's best for [TS]

00:29:27   the customer in the case of like the [TS]

00:29:29   iphone average selling price i think [TS]

00:29:30   they are definitely willing to do moves [TS]

00:29:33   that will raise the average selling [TS]

00:29:34   price by a substantial amount even if [TS]

00:29:37   it's kind of crappy for the customer and [TS]

00:29:39   I think you can look at the 16 gig base [TS]

00:29:41   size of the phones as one of the biggest [TS]

00:29:45   examples of this that there is almost no [TS]

00:29:47   other justification for that you can [TS]

00:29:49   look at almost every other reason people [TS]

00:29:51   get for that back when we all you know [TS]

00:29:53   disgusted two years ago or whatever and [TS]

00:29:56   you can you can rule almost all them out [TS]

00:29:58   by other supporting reasons that people [TS]

00:30:00   like well we buy all these phones in our [TS]

00:30:02   company and no one ever uses more than [TS]

00:30:03   16 gigs [TS]

00:30:05   well you could also say a lot of phones [TS]

00:30:06   don't use the ear positive in the box [TS]

00:30:08   but they still include them like they're [TS]

00:30:10   or you don't [TS]

00:30:10   no your company doesn't use necessarily [TS]

00:30:12   like 3d touch but that thing's in every [TS]

00:30:14   phone to like so you can look at any [TS]

00:30:16   part of it and you can say like you [TS]

00:30:18   don't use this [TS]

00:30:19   that's not necessarily a reason why the [TS]

00:30:21   16 gig thing has to be there and be [TS]

00:30:23   sucking be problematic for so many [TS]

00:30:24   people anyway so Apple is willing and [TS]

00:30:26   possibly i wouldn't say forced to but [TS]

00:30:30   there's their strong pressure for Apple [TS]

00:30:33   to keep that iphone asp up and growing [TS]

00:30:35   and so for them to to do things that [TS]

00:30:38   will increase the average selling price [TS]

00:30:40   by even a little bit it matters enough [TS]

00:30:42   and there's huge motivation to do it and [TS]

00:30:45   so you look at something like the [TS]

00:30:45   headphone jack thing and we're all [TS]

00:30:47   saying Apple always includes headphones [TS]

00:30:49   in the box [TS]

00:30:50   what if this fall the iphone 7 comes out [TS]

00:30:53   with no headphone jack and they don't [TS]

00:30:54   include headphones in the box then a [TS]

00:30:57   huge portion of iphone buyers are gonna [TS]

00:30:59   go spend 30 more dollars when they buy [TS]

00:31:00   that phone that's gonna be attachments [TS]

00:31:02   that counts towards the average selling [TS]

00:31:04   price i think of the phone itself anyway [TS]

00:31:06   however they can't really account for [TS]

00:31:07   that they're going to make a lot more [TS]

00:31:08   money if they do that you know you can [TS]

00:31:10   look at the cynically and you can see [TS]

00:31:11   you know you can say like Apple will do [TS]

00:31:13   this for sure because it'll make them [TS]

00:31:15   more money and it sucks for us or you [TS]

00:31:16   can look at it the opposite way and you [TS]

00:31:18   can say Apple always wants to do what's [TS]

00:31:19   best for customers they would never do [TS]

00:31:21   that for that reason i do that the truth [TS]

00:31:22   is somewhere in the middle there so we [TS]

00:31:24   have to consider that meat and we look [TS]

00:31:26   at what Apple does with a product line [TS]

00:31:28   especially in regard to the iphone and [TS]

00:31:31   how that impacts their profitability [TS]

00:31:32   even for kind of sucks for us and all [TS]

00:31:35   this financial stuff that comes out [TS]

00:31:36   every quarter is a perfect reason why [TS]

00:31:39   they have very strong reasons to to have [TS]

00:31:41   some contention there don't feel like [TS]

00:31:44   they're so wet average selling price [TS]

00:31:45   because they have in the past I've done [TS]

00:31:47   things that have heard there is a low [TS]

00:31:48   cross selling price in their products to [TS]

00:31:50   you know like the iPad Mini is a great [TS]

00:31:51   example but margins I feel like a lot of [TS]

00:31:54   their those decisions are just as easily [TS]

00:31:57   explained if not better explained by [TS]

00:31:58   margins because like the 16 gig think [TS]

00:32:00   the average sales price selling price [TS]

00:32:02   argument is this is going to push pull [TS]

00:32:03   up to the bigger model because they [TS]

00:32:04   don't feel like they can fit in 16 but [TS]

00:32:06   also just result in more people like 16 [TS]

00:32:08   you don't quite know example doesn't [TS]

00:32:09   break it down like that for us right but [TS]

00:32:11   surely one thing it does is increase [TS]

00:32:12   margins because it's like 64 already had [TS]

00:32:14   good margins and by keeping the lower [TS]

00:32:16   116 you know like and try keeping the [TS]

00:32:20   price is basically the same that 16 gigs [TS]

00:32:22   they've including on there [TS]

00:32:23   the phone for years and years it just [TS]

00:32:24   got to be getting cheaper for them and [TS]

00:32:26   get the phone price hasn't been dropping [TS]

00:32:28   year-over-year over here so their [TS]

00:32:30   markets go up and I think there are [TS]

00:32:31   really sensitive to their margins their [TS]

00:32:33   margins of things like forty percent or [TS]

00:32:34   something across the board on all their [TS]

00:32:36   stuff so even if they have to drop the [TS]

00:32:39   average selling price by selling the [TS]

00:32:40   ipad mini I bet they're very sensitive [TS]

00:32:42   about what are the margins on the ipad [TS]

00:32:44   mini how can we bring that down by [TS]

00:32:46   putting crap your stuff in it you know [TS]

00:32:47   that's kind of always what they're [TS]

00:32:49   looking for [TS]

00:32:50   can we sell you something with last [TS]

00:32:53   year's technology and in some aspect [TS]

00:32:55   because it saves us money whether it's [TS]

00:32:57   like putting the the creditor camera and [TS]

00:32:59   the ipod touch that's not subsidizing [TS]

00:33:00   they have to have to maintain their [TS]

00:33:02   margins or you know whatever they put in [TS]

00:33:04   their low end phones or even on their [TS]

00:33:05   highest end phones will keep the price [TS]

00:33:07   is more or less the same but will give [TS]

00:33:08   you 16 gigs for years and years because [TS]

00:33:10   every year that gives us a little bit [TS]

00:33:12   more on the margins and like you said [TS]

00:33:14   Marko any anything you do whether it's [TS]

00:33:15   average selling price of margins [TS]

00:33:16   multiplied by the number of phones they [TS]

00:33:18   sell is a tremendous amount of money and [TS]

00:33:20   now that's a lot of what this call was [TS]

00:33:22   about was like a foreign exchange rates [TS]

00:33:25   and you know various other quote unquote [TS]

00:33:27   head winds these fluctuations and how [TS]

00:33:30   the dollar is valued against the other [TS]

00:33:32   currencies in the world as you know it [TS]

00:33:34   seems like it's not that big a deal it's [TS]

00:33:36   not like we're in some financial [TS]

00:33:37   meltdown where the dollar is like it [TS]

00:33:39   worthless or worth ten times more than [TS]

00:33:41   the other currencies in the world right [TS]

00:33:42   but even my new movement and in the [TS]

00:33:45   foreign exchange rates x apples revenue [TS]

00:33:48   equals these tremendous number of other [TS]

00:33:50   things that's all getting thrown around [TS]

00:33:51   on Twitter like the amount of money [TS]

00:33:54   Apple lost due to currency fluctuations [TS]

00:33:56   is larger than the amount of money [TS]

00:33:57   facebook made the entire year or [TS]

00:33:59   something like that like just the [TS]

00:34:00   numbers are so mind-bogglingly huge that [TS]

00:34:02   any like the fluctuations in the chart [TS]

00:34:04   looks like nothing like well you know [TS]

00:34:06   it's a few pixels lower or whatever but [TS]

00:34:07   like those pixels are billions and [TS]

00:34:09   billions and billions of dollars so it's [TS]

00:34:11   it's it's mind-boggling even consider [TS]

00:34:13   this and that's why I'm so glad another [TS]

00:34:15   financial world because trying to judge [TS]

00:34:18   Apple as a from a financial perspective [TS]

00:34:20   is just so so weird because of the way [TS]

00:34:23   the things they value seemed so out of [TS]

00:34:26   whack with the things that like a [TS]

00:34:27   regular person would value about a [TS]

00:34:29   company all they make a lot of money [TS]

00:34:30   they're profitable to have lot of money [TS]

00:34:31   in the bank boy that must be good stock [TS]

00:34:33   like no where's the growth [TS]

00:34:36   yeah this is like when something happens [TS]

00:34:38   i am so happy that I no longer buy or [TS]

00:34:41   sell individual stocks like you know i'm [TS]

00:34:44   i'm like why I have mutual funds that [TS]

00:34:46   include some of these things I'm sure [TS]

00:34:47   but I don't manage that myself and I [TS]

00:34:50   don't buy and sell stock anymore i'm so [TS]

00:34:53   glad because I like I would think of [TS]

00:34:54   things like you know the way you were [TS]

00:34:55   like I would think of things like well [TS]

00:34:57   you know apples doing great they have [TS]

00:34:58   great prospects they're making a lot of [TS]

00:35:00   money why this doctors take a dive like [TS]

00:35:02   and it would it would frustrate me like [TS]

00:35:03   crazy and of course that isn't how the [TS]

00:35:05   market works at all like the market [TS]

00:35:07   everyone says the market is stupid and [TS]

00:35:09   understand Apple know the market is [TS]

00:35:10   doing its own thing it's not stupid [TS]

00:35:12   there's a there's a lot to be said about [TS]

00:35:14   the bad but it's not stupid [TS]

00:35:16   there's some stupid like really doesn't [TS]

00:35:18   manifest in the other way where [TS]

00:35:19   companies are overvalued for like [TS]

00:35:23   because it means that my sister the farm [TS]

00:35:25   gambling buy low sell high how do I know [TS]

00:35:26   what slow well no it's something that's [TS]

00:35:29   gonna be high later and so people at a [TS]

00:35:30   bunch of people get together and say [TS]

00:35:32   look at that company that's going to be [TS]

00:35:34   super high later and you know it up and [TS]

00:35:37   have astronomical evaluation of it [TS]

00:35:39   because based on the potential this [TS]

00:35:40   could be really high later boys [TS]

00:35:42   everybody decides to buy this person's [TS]

00:35:44   thing [TS]

00:35:44   this will be great but you know it's [TS]

00:35:47   basically it's speculation what do you [TS]

00:35:49   thinks gonna be high next year is going [TS]

00:35:51   to be apple is Apple going to go up by [TS]

00:35:52   fifty percent by next year or this [TS]

00:35:54   little company never heard of you can [TS]

00:35:55   buy the stock for pennies you know so [TS]

00:35:57   that's yeah it's not it's kind of [TS]

00:35:59   soccer's bed [TS]

00:36:00   not really because you can in theory [TS]

00:36:02   have some knowledge that will help you [TS]

00:36:05   do better witness people like Warren [TS]

00:36:06   Buffett and everything are pretty sure [TS]

00:36:08   not cheating [TS]

00:36:09   they're just a little bit better playing [TS]

00:36:11   this particular game of poker than other [TS]

00:36:12   people [TS]

00:36:13   so there is a skits and it's not a walk [TS]

00:36:15   there is a skill-based aspect but for [TS]

00:36:17   the most part like I don't get too mad [TS]

00:36:20   about the way Apple is treated by the [TS]

00:36:22   market because i have to think like I [TS]

00:36:23   mean this is whatever is something for [TS]

00:36:24   years and years like well but there's [TS]

00:36:26   nowhere to go but down there at the top [TS]

00:36:28   if you had thought that five years ago [TS]

00:36:29   in five years before that in five years [TS]

00:36:31   you just put him in wrong wrong wrong [TS]

00:36:32   wrong that's what all the animals always [TS]

00:36:33   point out it's like every time someone [TS]

00:36:35   says that Apple's at the top and they [TS]

00:36:36   can only go down you just wait five [TS]

00:36:38   years and you make fun of those people [TS]

00:36:39   right but at some point they'll be right [TS]

00:36:41   because it's not apple have all the [TS]

00:36:42   money in the world [TS]

00:36:43   you literally have no money example at [TS]

00:36:44   all and it's like Moore's law you can't [TS]

00:36:46   you can't keep doubling forever because [TS]

00:36:49   eventually you will have all the monies [TS]

00:36:50   RX ponder this week is Squarespace start [TS]

00:36:54   building your website today at [TS]

00:36:55   squarespace.com enter offer code ATP at [TS]

00:36:58   checkout to get ten percent off [TS]

00:36:59   Squarespace build it beautiful now look [TS]

00:37:01   I've built many websites using [TS]

00:37:03   Squarespace now I've got many websites [TS]

00:37:04   using other means and Squarespace is by [TS]

00:37:07   far the easiest way to do it and it is [TS]

00:37:10   by far the least ongoing hassle and the [TS]

00:37:13   easiest way to get a lot of advanced [TS]

00:37:14   functionality up quickly start any [TS]

00:37:16   website you make today at Squarespace if [TS]

00:37:18   you have to make something try it there [TS]

00:37:20   first and see how much you can get done [TS]

00:37:23   in an hour and you will be shocked how [TS]

00:37:25   far you get [TS]

00:37:26   how much functionality it has and how [TS]

00:37:28   little work you have to do to get there [TS]

00:37:30   if you're going with it for other people [TS]

00:37:32   to even better is if someone asked you [TS]

00:37:33   but actual site for them if you don [TS]

00:37:35   Squarespace not only can you hand it off [TS]

00:37:37   to them and say here now you do it you [TS]

00:37:41   help yourself [TS]

00:37:42   not only that but if they need more help [TS]

00:37:44   if they need support if they need any [TS]

00:37:46   kind of hosting thing or any kind of [TS]

00:37:47   technical support they asked Squarespace [TS]

00:37:49   not you you don't support it [TS]

00:37:51   Squarespace does if that's not a reason [TS]

00:37:53   to do it I I can't help you if they hate [TS]

00:37:55   it here making a website for somebody [TS]

00:37:57   and you want to support yourself every [TS]

00:37:59   time something has to be changed or [TS]

00:38:01   something breaks or the help but more [TS]

00:38:03   power to you that is not me though [TS]

00:38:05   for me I tell people to build if it's on [TS]

00:38:06   Squarespace they can usually do it [TS]

00:38:08   themselves right from the start they use [TS]

00:38:10   a slight push me and say here try this [TS]

00:38:12   so that's what I advise all of you try [TS]

00:38:14   making a site on Squarespace to make a [TS]

00:38:16   website given our CFR you get and I bet [TS]

00:38:20   you will stick with it and just leave it [TS]

00:38:21   there because then you're done and you [TS]

00:38:22   can move on to do anything else with [TS]

00:38:24   your life [TS]

00:38:25   check it out today squarespace.com to [TS]

00:38:27   start your free trial site there's no [TS]

00:38:29   credit card required to do a free trial [TS]

00:38:31   Squarespace squarespace.com start a free [TS]

00:38:33   trial and make a site if you like it [TS]

00:38:35   please make sure to use the offer code [TS]

00:38:37   ATP when you sign up to get ten percent [TS]

00:38:40   off your first purchase once again its [TS]

00:38:41   code ATP and sign up to get ten percent [TS]

00:38:43   off your first purchase Squarespace [TS]

00:38:46   build a beautiful [TS]

00:38:47   what I found interesting about this is [TS]

00:38:50   that the ipads are down and down fairly [TS]

00:38:55   big [TS]

00:38:56   which in and of itself and we have [TS]

00:38:57   already covered that but having just [TS]

00:38:59   gotten a new ipad and now being able to [TS]

00:39:03   unlock if you will all the multitasking [TS]

00:39:05   features in iOS 9 I have fallen in love [TS]

00:39:10   with my ipad again and i know that a lot [TS]

00:39:13   of our friends even let in ones like my [TS]

00:39:16   curly who were kind of aggressively [TS]

00:39:20   anti-pattern very recently are now [TS]

00:39:23   falling in love with her iPad pros so [TS]

00:39:26   what gives am i weird in that I really [TS]

00:39:29   love my ipad mini and is Mike weird in [TS]

00:39:32   that he really loves his ipad pro a what [TS]

00:39:35   what is going on that apparently a lot [TS]

00:39:38   of people have fallen out of love with [TS]

00:39:39   the ipad can answer the easy questions [TS]

00:39:41   for us yes you're both weird but that's [TS]

00:39:42   not funny got there is a separate thing [TS]

00:39:45   exactly what i was thinking about this [TS]

00:39:47   and I think like now that we have a nice [TS]

00:39:48   shape to this graph and now you can [TS]

00:39:50   clearly see that it's like this [TS]

00:39:52   enough time has passed we could be like [TS]

00:39:53   it's not replacement cycle it's not some [TS]

00:39:56   other thing that would like it's just [TS]

00:39:58   basically like this this is starting to [TS]

00:39:59   take the shape of the other type of [TS]

00:40:00   devices and I'm although I still totally [TS]

00:40:03   saw and signed up with the idea of the [TS]

00:40:06   interface that we all know and love in [TS]

00:40:08   our phones being eventually being the [TS]

00:40:10   thing thats the plants will be currently [TS]

00:40:11   no is the pc whether or not the ipad [TS]

00:40:13   doesn't i'm not sure but what the way [TS]

00:40:16   I'm conceptualize the ipad now which I [TS]

00:40:18   think kind of explains like your case [TS]

00:40:20   your attitude towards it and Mike's and [TS]

00:40:21   everything is that currently for now the [TS]

00:40:24   ipad is a specific product not like the [TS]

00:40:27   tablet in general the ipad a specific [TS]

00:40:29   product ID c is to feeling two main [TS]

00:40:32   roles first it is a rich toddlers toy [TS]

00:40:37   and because i mean and i'm loving myself [TS]

00:40:41   in that my kids have iPads there-there [TS]

00:40:44   the kids rich people write in general [TS]

00:40:46   like I most of the people i know who [TS]

00:40:48   live in a similar place that I do have [TS]

00:40:50   suburban lies professional jobs they [TS]

00:40:53   have ipads think of to the kids [TS]

00:40:54   sometimes their hand-me-down iPads or [TS]

00:40:56   whatever but just like I CLI pads that [TS]

00:40:59   are used by kids right so it is it and I [TS]

00:41:02   say toddlers because once the kids all [TS]

00:41:03   they want to phone right [TS]

00:41:05   yep and that's that's obviously you know [TS]

00:41:07   that's everything any [TS]

00:41:08   other thing the ipad is is to you Steve [TS]

00:41:11   Jobs province [TS]

00:41:13   it's a truck the ipad has the truck of [TS]

00:41:16   the world of you know iOS and touch [TS]

00:41:19   devices or whatever [TS]

00:41:20   most people don't need a truck most [TS]

00:41:21   people get away with the car which is [TS]

00:41:23   called the phone that does everything [TS]

00:41:25   they could possibly need but some people [TS]

00:41:26   the weird people need a truck not just [TS]

00:41:29   add pros the truck but the entire ipad [TS]

00:41:31   line is now revealing itself as the [TS]

00:41:32   truck was everyone else is saying you [TS]

00:41:33   know what the phone is fine [TS]

00:41:35   the phone is all I need phone does [TS]

00:41:37   everything i want and then in the other [TS]

00:41:39   realm that you could say it's not a rich [TS]

00:41:41   tell their story what about the non-rich [TS]

00:41:43   toddlers I think tablet still have a [TS]

00:41:45   role for you know for everybody for [TS]

00:41:49   little kids in particular this is a [TS]

00:41:50   great that's like you know a great [TS]

00:41:51   little child's toy but this is my cheap [TS]

00:41:53   android tablets they can watch youtube I [TS]

00:41:54   think like if i replace my kids iPads [TS]

00:41:56   with like $99 android tablets just [TS]

00:41:59   played youtube they will be mostly [TS]

00:42:01   satisfied like that's mostly what they [TS]

00:42:03   do with it is used to watch youtube [TS]

00:42:04   doesn't take too much to run youtube so [TS]

00:42:06   in the current the current life of the [TS]

00:42:08   ipad product line they seem like you [TS]

00:42:12   know a a product that is as a much much [TS]

00:42:15   narrower appeal then the phone and [TS]

00:42:17   that's what they're really competing [TS]

00:42:18   with is the phone not the laptop at this [TS]

00:42:20   point or whatever so it in that light [TS]

00:42:22   I think it's a good move for Apple to [TS]

00:42:24   finally gotten off its button down the [TS]

00:42:26   ipad pro which by the way doesn't factor [TS]

00:42:27   at all these results and I wouldn't [TS]

00:42:29   expect them to move [TS]

00:42:31   I mean factor somebody like the ipad pro [TS]

00:42:33   came at the tail end of the results that [TS]

00:42:35   we're looking at right here but it's not [TS]

00:42:37   that's not a mainstream product right [TS]

00:42:38   it's never you know so anyway the ipad [TS]

00:42:40   is going to be a truck make a better [TS]

00:42:42   track for crying out loud right you know [TS]

00:42:44   what I mean that's I mean like you know [TS]

00:42:45   the in the in the original analogy the [TS]

00:42:47   pc or that you know that like that the [TS]

00:42:49   the computer was the truck and the you [TS]

00:42:52   know iOS devices were the cars and I [TS]

00:42:55   think like I think the pc still is the [TS]

00:42:57   truck and the ipad is like the maybe the [TS]

00:43:01   El Camino or like that whatever that [TS]

00:43:03   well that's your room half truck thing [TS]

00:43:05   oh god I know exactly what you think [TS]

00:43:07   about by can I can't place the Baja [TS]

00:43:09   that's it is yes it's like it's not even [TS]

00:43:12   it's neither a great car nor a great [TS]

00:43:15   truck it's it's kind of in the middle [TS]

00:43:17   there do it there's maybe there's a [TS]

00:43:19   reason why the El Camino is not made [TS]

00:43:21   anymore [TS]

00:43:21   the subaru baja is not is not the most [TS]

00:43:24   popular car I had nobody looks at the [TS]

00:43:27   subaru baja and said this is the future [TS]

00:43:29   of cars you know the same way like [TS]

00:43:31   everyone looks at the ipad and says this [TS]

00:43:33   is the future of computing but it is [TS]

00:43:35   what it is like a totally is like yet no [TS]

00:43:37   it totally is i mean we we have borne [TS]

00:43:39   out one way when they said that they [TS]

00:43:40   mean like us like that a thing that is [TS]

00:43:42   not a PC because it's totally not a pc [TS]

00:43:44   right that you interact with mostly by [TS]

00:43:46   touching and it is the future of [TS]

00:43:47   computing because that's what everybody [TS]

00:43:49   does it but it's also that they do it on [TS]

00:43:50   their phone it's like always the tablet [TS]

00:43:52   separate thing for the phone or is it [TS]

00:43:53   just the same exact thing as the phone [TS]

00:43:55   to get a bigger size and it is but it's [TS]

00:43:56   like why would you think that bigger [TS]

00:43:58   size so most people don't most people [TS]

00:43:59   especially the big honkin phones most [TS]

00:44:01   people that's all they're ever gonna [TS]

00:44:02   need like the pc is still this separate [TS]

00:44:04   separate thing but if you just set aside [TS]

00:44:06   the pc entirely and just look at the [TS]

00:44:09   computers that most people use for that [TS]

00:44:10   person their personal computers are [TS]

00:44:12   their smartphones at this point and why [TS]

00:44:14   would you ever need one that's bigger [TS]

00:44:16   than your big phone [TS]

00:44:17   well that's kind of like the truck of [TS]

00:44:19   the of the phone were like if you [TS]

00:44:20   pretend pcs don't exist which basically [TS]

00:44:21   as far as my kids are concerned they [TS]

00:44:22   might as well not exist like so many [TS]

00:44:24   kids like like your parents have a [TS]

00:44:26   computer but why would you like I'm [TS]

00:44:28   waiting to see if my kids will ever ask [TS]

00:44:30   to have their own computer they asked to [TS]

00:44:32   have their own iOS devices and phones [TS]

00:44:34   without any prompting very very early [TS]

00:44:35   none of them even said hey I'd like to [TS]

00:44:38   have my own computer because the [TS]

00:44:39   computer is something that your parents [TS]

00:44:40   you so it's categorically different [TS]

00:44:42   that's why I'm refocusing and saying now [TS]

00:44:43   forget about that crap that your parents [TS]

00:44:45   use that you don't understand that in [TS]

00:44:46   some other room has this thing attached [TS]

00:44:48   to it with a with or without a wire and [TS]

00:44:51   think about your world of computing [TS]

00:44:54   which is a bunch of these screens most [TS]

00:44:57   of them are like I just want to phone I [TS]

00:44:58   can talk my friends I can I can watch [TS]

00:44:59   youtube videos I guess music I'm good to [TS]

00:45:02   go right and maybe i'll go into my [TS]

00:45:04   parents room to type the papers or [TS]

00:45:06   whatever but sometimes they might want [TS]

00:45:07   something bigger to do more truck like [TS]

00:45:09   things and i'm not entirely sure that [TS]

00:45:11   this upcoming generation is going to [TS]

00:45:13   occur to them immediately to sail now [TS]

00:45:15   any DPC rather they might say I have [TS]

00:45:19   weird needs so I want one of those big [TS]

00:45:20   fancy iPads now that the subaru is the [TS]

00:45:23   by that was the brat but anyway that [TS]

00:45:25   they're they're both true the brad is [TS]

00:45:27   the very old one which is actually what [TS]

00:45:28   i was thinking of in the Baja the newer [TS]

00:45:30   one is actually called the brat [TS]

00:45:33   yes they read [TS]

00:45:34   it's written on the side of it was great [TS]

00:45:36   we're a little like a c-pillar [TS]

00:45:38   equivalent on the pickup truck hybrid [TS]

00:45:40   thing can't imagine why they changed it [TS]

00:45:42   yeah but like the reason that i think is [TS]

00:45:45   apt is because we all recognize that the [TS]

00:45:47   ipad is not a great truck and yeah I Pad [TS]

00:45:49   Pro is a step in the right direction to [TS]

00:45:52   say give us an even bigger screen gives [TS]

00:45:54   a stylist make more room for the [TS]

00:45:55   multitasking stuff that you've added [TS]

00:45:57   right it's a baby step in the right [TS]

00:45:59   direction to really being like if you're [TS]

00:46:00   gonna go truck go all the way but even [TS]

00:46:03   if they succeed in that endeavor even if [TS]

00:46:05   they say oh now the ipad is the truck of [TS]

00:46:07   the new family of computing devices [TS]

00:46:08   because this entire family collectively [TS]

00:46:10   as the future of computing and some [TS]

00:46:11   people need to do fancy stuff like say [TS]

00:46:13   run xcode on their iPad or wherever [TS]

00:46:14   they're going to be doing 10 years in [TS]

00:46:15   outright does that suddenly means this [TS]

00:46:18   ipad sales curve that we see making a [TS]

00:46:20   big humping on talent was gonna reverse [TS]

00:46:22   know because most people don't need [TS]

00:46:24   trucks like nothing nothing can save the [TS]

00:46:26   truck from being the truck nothing can [TS]

00:46:28   save the computer that most people don't [TS]

00:46:30   need nothing is ever going to make the [TS]

00:46:31   mac pro like sell like the iphone [TS]

00:46:34   nothing is ever going to hockey stick [TS]

00:46:35   any of these things up and so for now [TS]

00:46:37   for the ipad product specifically just [TS]

00:46:39   use pogo stick as a verb [TS]

00:46:40   that's right I did it it's a [TS]

00:46:42   well-established have on the show my god [TS]

00:46:45   yeah [TS]

00:46:46   nothing is going to change the the [TS]

00:46:47   inherent nature of of that the and even [TS]

00:46:50   even the pc is like what if i pass [TS]

00:46:52   replace all the pcs go look at the pc [TS]

00:46:54   trendlines those aren't great either the [TS]

00:46:55   only thing that is going that has been [TS]

00:46:57   going upward like a hockey stick has [TS]

00:46:59   been the phone and even the phone is [TS]

00:47:00   loving off a little bit at a certain [TS]

00:47:02   point and the reason the phone is [TS]

00:47:03   leveling off I feel like not that Apple [TS]

00:47:05   specifically but eventually with [TS]

00:47:06   everybody eventually there's only a [TS]

00:47:08   certain number of phones you can sell in [TS]

00:47:10   the world once every single human [TS]

00:47:11   everything human alive babies adults [TS]

00:47:14   everybody has a smartphone then you're [TS]

00:47:16   just fighting over how many you know [TS]

00:47:18   they're just fighting of who gets this [TS]

00:47:19   album right so you can have a hundred [TS]

00:47:21   percent market share I cell phones every [TS]

00:47:22   single human alive in the planet but [TS]

00:47:24   you're never gonna get more than that [TS]

00:47:25   right so eventually all these curves [TS]

00:47:27   have to level off and smartphone really [TS]

00:47:28   is a type of product that can have that [TS]

00:47:30   kind of penetration so I when I look at [TS]

00:47:33   the ipad curve and I see it going down [TS]

00:47:36   and I see the phone leveling off the [TS]

00:47:38   phone is like well Apple you gotta [TS]

00:47:40   compete with the other phones that are [TS]

00:47:41   out there to make sure you maintain your [TS]

00:47:43   market share in the ipad i just feel [TS]

00:47:44   like it is slowly growing in [TS]

00:47:47   it's destiny as the truck of the new [TS]

00:47:49   world of computing but I just just like [TS]

00:47:52   it should be a better truck i agree with [TS]

00:47:55   some of what you just said but I i just [TS]

00:47:57   i see a better future for the pc than [TS]

00:47:59   that I think you do and a lot of people [TS]

00:48:01   do and you and again I think you're [TS]

00:48:03   right it's not going to be it's not [TS]

00:48:05   going to really go up from from where it [TS]

00:48:07   has been you know I i think it's gonna [TS]

00:48:09   go down a little bit and then just kind [TS]

00:48:11   of level off at some point where like [TS]

00:48:13   the pc really is the general utility [TS]

00:48:15   computing device and and that is [TS]

00:48:18   incredibly powerful and there are so [TS]

00:48:20   many things that you know we we can all [TS]

00:48:23   call them edge cases we can we can say [TS]

00:48:25   like you know like you like you look at [TS]

00:48:27   you look at so much of of what iOS [TS]

00:48:30   devices can't do and so many of them [TS]

00:48:32   seem like well almost no one needs that [TS]

00:48:34   and that's true but almost everyone [TS]

00:48:37   needs like one of those things and it's [TS]

00:48:40   kind of like that the world of of people [TS]

00:48:43   who need computing computing tasks or or [TS]

00:48:47   abilities that the iOS devices and and [TS]

00:48:49   that that worldview of computing can't [TS]

00:48:52   address is a pretty big group of people [TS]

00:48:54   so i think the computer will always be [TS]

00:48:57   relevant in the same way like Microsoft [TS]

00:48:59   has always been relevant they used to be [TS]

00:49:01   dominant and the only game in town and [TS]

00:49:03   now Microsoft is this kind of like [TS]

00:49:05   mostly ignored boring company that no [TS]

00:49:10   one talks about but that still has a [TS]

00:49:11   great business and still you know very [TS]

00:49:14   useful to a lot of people no one we [TS]

00:49:16   talked about microsoft but their stuff [TS]

00:49:19   is still very very popular it's [TS]

00:49:21   financially seemingly ok and the end [TS]

00:49:24   like a lot of people relying on stuff [TS]

00:49:26   together worked on and i think that the [TS]

00:49:28   pc in general whether it's windows or [TS]

00:49:30   mac and I don't make that distinction [TS]

00:49:31   right now I like the pc in general is so [TS]

00:49:35   general purpose it is so capable [TS]

00:49:38   it is so unbounded by so many of the [TS]

00:49:41   restrictions that modern mobile devices [TS]

00:49:43   have it both physical and software [TS]

00:49:45   restrictions there is always going to be [TS]

00:49:47   a market for a more customizable more [TS]

00:49:51   open architecture more like hardware [TS]

00:49:53   diversity kind of platform because [TS]

00:49:55   there's always going to be edge cases [TS]

00:49:57   and as these mobile devices get smaller [TS]

00:50:01   simpler more lockdown fewer ports [TS]

00:50:04   everybody come on you know if you like [TS]

00:50:06   all the all the stuff that we celebrate [TS]

00:50:07   as consumers as like oh wow this is [TS]

00:50:10   great is getting thinner and lighter and [TS]

00:50:11   and everything is even more lockdown was [TS]

00:50:13   before thanks a lot like this all that [TS]

00:50:16   is very powerful in certain ways and if [TS]

00:50:18   you're making something that's going to [TS]

00:50:19   sell as many units as possible to as [TS]

00:50:21   many people as possible that is a good [TS]

00:50:23   way to do it and that's that's going to [TS]

00:50:25   keep working i always say never bet [TS]

00:50:26   against the smartphone's very powerful [TS]

00:50:28   but i don't think that has to come at [TS]

00:50:31   the expense of the entire pc business it [TS]

00:50:35   will come at the expense of some of the [TS]

00:50:36   pc business but again I don't think like [TS]

00:50:39   not a lot of people are saying you know [TS]

00:50:42   what I don't even need of computer [TS]

00:50:44   anymore i'm just going to use my phone [TS]

00:50:45   for everything [TS]

00:50:46   some people say that with the ipad and [TS]

00:50:48   so the ipad is certainly more of a [TS]

00:50:50   threat than the phone is but i think [TS]

00:50:52   it's much more likely that like the [TS]

00:50:55   people who are still using PC's today [TS]

00:50:57   even when good tablets are available i I [TS]

00:51:01   don't see a whole ton of them making [TS]

00:51:04   that jump if they haven't already know [TS]

00:51:06   what those people died i guess that's [TS]

00:51:08   the way it works those people died and [TS]

00:51:09   the people who were formerly using PC's [TS]

00:51:11   like we're waiting for maybe not the [TS]

00:51:13   ipad specifically but tablets in general [TS]

00:51:15   the idea that something without the the [TS]

00:51:18   paradigms and the complexities that we [TS]

00:51:20   currently associated with the personal [TS]

00:51:22   computers that tablets can eventually [TS]

00:51:25   replace them and that maybe eventually [TS]

00:51:28   the things that we think of as tablets [TS]

00:51:30   now will eventually be called pcs that [TS]

00:51:31   to distinguish them from the phones but [TS]

00:51:33   they won't because they won't be running [TS]

00:51:34   windows are running OS 10 they won't [TS]

00:51:36   have that they won't have like discs [TS]

00:51:39   that you mount and volumes and expose [TS]

00:51:42   file systems and all the things that we [TS]

00:51:43   associate with personal computing now I [TS]

00:51:46   like that's why I'm starting its do [TS]

00:51:48   important to differentiate between the [TS]

00:51:49   ipad is a product which apple may never [TS]

00:51:50   get their act together on right and the [TS]

00:51:53   tablet is a whole the idea that a future [TS]

00:51:56   computing device should be more [TS]

00:51:57   appliance like and probably also mobile [TS]

00:52:00   visiting with the moore's law stuff like [TS]

00:52:02   having lots of headroom to put powerful [TS]

00:52:03   he hungry things and there is fine but [TS]

00:52:05   at a certain point you can't like a [TS]

00:52:07   certain point we need another [TS]

00:52:08   technological breakthrough to think [TS]

00:52:10   we compute and if we can't do that then [TS]

00:52:14   you just basically say well the fastest [TS]

00:52:16   cpu and the entire world that's in a [TS]

00:52:17   battery-powered device and we haven't [TS]

00:52:19   figured out how to make faster because [TS]

00:52:20   we have very bad into quantum computers [TS]

00:52:21   or optical computing or anything yet so [TS]

00:52:23   in the meantime enjoy your quote-unquote [TS]

00:52:25   pc which is basically a big honkin [TS]

00:52:29   tablet because that's what are the two [TS]

00:52:30   generations of children know how to use [TS]

00:52:32   and they have no idea what the hell [TS]

00:52:33   you're doing with that freaking mouth I [TS]

00:52:34   just want to touch the screen right so [TS]

00:52:36   whether Apple is the one that does that [TS]

00:52:37   to somebody else long-term after we're [TS]

00:52:39   all dead [TS]

00:52:40   i think the the total market for people [TS]

00:52:42   who need to computing besides using the [TS]

00:52:44   appliances in their home and their phone [TS]

00:52:45   will probably about the similar size of [TS]

00:52:49   the quote-unquote pc market today but i [TS]

00:52:52   would expect tablets to slowly [TS]

00:52:53   cannibalize that but maybe the whole [TS]

00:52:55   line on the graph stays about the same [TS]

00:52:57   while above it floats all the other [TS]

00:52:58   mass-market devices but that's that's [TS]

00:53:01   where the tablets are battling down [TS]

00:53:02   there with the pcs who is going to who [TS]

00:53:05   is going to be to get these people who [TS]

00:53:07   need more than a phone can do their job [TS]

00:53:09   who who's going to serve them and right [TS]

00:53:12   now it's the mac vs windows computers [TS]

00:53:15   versus a whole panoply of tablets vs [TS]

00:53:17   surface vs chromebook sources you know [TS]

00:53:19   all these things that are like pcs and [TS]

00:53:22   post pcs battling and I just have to [TS]

00:53:23   give the edge to the ones with less [TS]

00:53:26   legacy crap that are more understandable [TS]

00:53:28   for people to use even if right now [TS]

00:53:30   they're just not powerful enough as we [TS]

00:53:31   talked about the last show to actually [TS]

00:53:33   replace those i think i think we'll be [TS]

00:53:34   gone by the time it happens by just look [TS]

00:53:36   at my kids and my kids kids having a [TS]

00:53:39   television is gonna be I can't even [TS]

00:53:40   think of a good analogy but it's just [TS]

00:53:41   it's going to seem like having like a a [TS]

00:53:44   plow in your backyard to tell the fields [TS]

00:53:46   i don't know it seemed the same same but [TS]

00:53:48   you know I agree with you John more than [TS]

00:53:51   I do Marco that I think that the pc as [TS]

00:53:53   we know it again like Marco said Mac or [TS]

00:53:55   PC that the personal computers we know [TS]

00:53:57   it is not terribly long for this world [TS]

00:53:59   for almost everyone and i agree John [TS]

00:54:02   that the future is going to be touched [TS]

00:54:03   the futures or you know something after [TS]

00:54:05   touch or VR writing or Bihar well i [TS]

00:54:08   think the future is not the this [TS]

00:54:11   beautiful new imac that i just bought [TS]

00:54:13   myself but what I'm where I'm having [TS]

00:54:16   trouble is why then is the ipad so [TS]

00:54:20   sharply down like I understand what [TS]

00:54:21   you're saying is powerful [TS]

00:54:23   if it's not doing enough right now but [TS]

00:54:24   she's if the IP it really is the futures [TS]

00:54:27   truck [TS]

00:54:28   don't you think it would at least [TS]

00:54:30   maintain or not have such a stark [TS]

00:54:32   downward slope now because i think that [TS]

00:54:35   misfired on the ipad i think i think [TS]

00:54:37   they they thought things were further [TS]

00:54:39   along than they were and so there was [TS]

00:54:40   the initial burst of like a this is the [TS]

00:54:42   future everyone's going to love it and I [TS]

00:54:44   never realized you know what i can do [TS]

00:54:45   all the same stuff on my phone [TS]

00:54:46   especially when the phones got bigger [TS]

00:54:48   and more powerful than was like oh well [TS]

00:54:50   nevermind just get those ones to the [TS]

00:54:51   kids like it sits like a burst of [TS]

00:54:53   enthusiasm followed by the realization [TS]

00:54:55   that it does not provide enough [TS]

00:54:57   additional value and so that's that's [TS]

00:54:58   why I feel like it's tapering off [TS]

00:55:00   well I think there's I mean there's a [TS]

00:55:01   number of factors here first of all I [TS]

00:55:03   think that the the value of a tablet in [TS]

00:55:06   general if you use it for productivity [TS]

00:55:09   tasks then the the ipad is is very [TS]

00:55:13   competitive but i think what most people [TS]

00:55:15   use tablets for is entertainment and i [TS]

00:55:18   think i'm not saying you can't do work [TS]

00:55:21   on ipad but i think a lot of people i [TS]

00:55:22   think the market bears that out that a [TS]

00:55:24   lot of people use their tablets [TS]

00:55:25   primarily for entertainment purposes and [TS]

00:55:27   if you're doing that there's a lot less [TS]

00:55:30   reason to get specifically an ipad over [TS]

00:55:34   any other tablet out there and there's [TS]

00:55:36   tablets you know its cost nothing [TS]

00:55:37   expenses at tablets are cheaper than [TS]

00:55:40   like gasps big if you can put if you can [TS]

00:55:42   play play flappy bird and you can watch [TS]

00:55:45   youtube videos like yet cover you know [TS]

00:55:47   you can play a couple of really simple [TS]

00:55:49   games and watch YouTube as far as my [TS]

00:55:51   kids are concerned it would be like [TS]

00:55:52   indistinguishable from an ipad because [TS]

00:55:54   they are not using any of the ipad eNOS [TS]

00:55:56   of the ipad they're just literally [TS]

00:55:57   watching YouTube forever and then [TS]

00:55:59   playing a couple games [TS]

00:56:00   exactly so that's problem number one [TS]

00:56:03   that has is that like in phones i think [TS]

00:56:05   what people tend to use phones for kids [TS]

00:56:07   are a different story and and I i do [TS]

00:56:10   want to separately address that you know [TS]

00:56:11   John you you and and many other people [TS]

00:56:14   make predictions about the future pcs [TS]

00:56:17   being dead because their kids don't ever [TS]

00:56:19   want to use a pc but a lot of people are [TS]

00:56:21   making that assumption on based on kids [TS]

00:56:25   who are I think too young to make that [TS]

00:56:28   determination because like if you think [TS]

00:56:29   about the kind of things that has really [TS]

00:56:31   good at the kind of things computers [TS]

00:56:33   really good at ipad isn't very good at [TS]

00:56:35   the overlap [TS]

00:56:36   between like what most kids used to use [TS]

00:56:38   computers for which is a lot of [TS]

00:56:40   entertainment stuff and like some very [TS]

00:56:42   light browsing and light work like that [TS]

00:56:44   kind of stuff you can do i have had much [TS]

00:56:46   better but that's not to say like what [TS]

00:56:49   if your kid starts wanting to like be [TS]

00:56:50   productive in different like [TS]

00:56:53   multitasking kind of ways think things [TS]

00:56:55   that you can do on the ipad but it's [TS]

00:56:58   easier or better on a computer or if [TS]

00:57:00   they develop a hobby of like you know [TS]

00:57:02   what I want to try programming that's [TS]

00:57:03   hard to do one right again not [TS]

00:57:05   impossible but hard and sometimes aren't [TS]

00:57:07   possible and so far but you know they're [TS]

00:57:10   there are things that like as kids get [TS]

00:57:11   older if they want to type a type of [TS]

00:57:14   paper for school or whatever like you [TS]

00:57:16   yes you can do it on ipad but in many [TS]

00:57:19   ways it's easier on a computer and you [TS]

00:57:20   haven't met any kids who prefer using [TS]

00:57:22   the keyboard on a screen a physical one [TS]

00:57:24   have you met those kids yet because they [TS]

00:57:26   exist you know I know they exist but [TS]

00:57:27   terrifying [TS]

00:57:29   what I'm saying is I don't think we can [TS]

00:57:31   make the call to say kids these days are [TS]

00:57:33   going to ever use computers because i [TS]

00:57:35   think his these days are too young to [TS]

00:57:37   know that everything's computers and for [TS]

00:57:38   us to know that well I mean it takes it [TS]

00:57:40   takes multiple generations they were [TS]

00:57:41   just like it takes multiple generations [TS]

00:57:43   for turnover like I said we were all [TS]

00:57:45   going to be that maybe our kids will be [TS]

00:57:46   dead because it's the same way that like [TS]

00:57:47   you still do things that your parents do [TS]

00:57:48   just because your parents didn't like it [TS]

00:57:50   takes a while to turn over but I the [TS]

00:57:54   options available you said the options [TS]

00:57:55   available to them let like my kids are [TS]

00:57:58   all in a house with plenty of Max and [TS]

00:58:00   plenty of iOS devices and the only [TS]

00:58:02   reason they ever touch the max is to [TS]

00:58:05   play Minecraft on a bigger screen and [TS]

00:58:06   maybe that's a valid use cases like all [TS]

00:58:08   see they like they like the big screen [TS]

00:58:10   but if I had my playstation attached to [TS]

00:58:12   the television that probably played [TS]

00:58:13   their the controller i don't know anyway [TS]

00:58:15   as we can see from the ipad curve i [TS]

00:58:18   think the current crop of tablets ipad [TS]

00:58:21   and always included are not yet up to [TS]

00:58:23   the task of doing things of the cases so [TS]

00:58:25   the kids have to type papers they do end [TS]

00:58:27   up using it or like using Chromebooks [TS]

00:58:28   and school or something like that and [TS]

00:58:29   the microwave services another take on [TS]

00:58:31   this is like hey we're both things at [TS]

00:58:32   one where the old computer and the new [TS]

00:58:34   computer the same time that definitely [TS]

00:58:35   seems like a transitional fossil to me [TS]

00:58:37   but what I'm looking at long-term is [TS]

00:58:41   like we're not there yet but that seems [TS]

00:58:43   the direction things are going and it [TS]

00:58:44   only takes a couple of generations of [TS]

00:58:46   people dying [TS]

00:58:47   before all these concerns that we have [TS]

00:58:49   on someone listens to this podcast like [TS]

00:58:51   a hundred years from now it will seem [TS]

00:58:53   ridiculous that we even debating this in [TS]

00:58:55   the same way they would seem ridiculous [TS]

00:58:56   of something if you're listening to [TS]

00:58:58   people debate about whether you know [TS]

00:59:00   people actually be able to use a [TS]

00:59:01   computer with the mouse to the real work [TS]

00:59:03   i mean i was alive for that debate and [TS]

00:59:05   it was fierce and and people were like [TS]

00:59:07   you included in the same things like [TS]

00:59:10   well my kids been born into a world with [TS]

00:59:12   mice and they're going to only use [TS]

00:59:13   myself when i get a job they'll have to [TS]

00:59:15   use a computer without a mouse to do [TS]

00:59:16   actual work because the only computer [TS]

00:59:18   that miser toy computers [TS]

00:59:20   that's just the way things go like so it [TS]

00:59:22   maybe it's a it's a pointless thing to [TS]

00:59:23   even talk about because of all dead do [TS]

00:59:25   we really care that much but i think [TS]

00:59:28   it's interesting in light of this ipad [TS]

00:59:29   graph because it's like the it's the [TS]

00:59:32   future that we think is coming but the [TS]

00:59:34   graph shows that it's not here yet and [TS]

00:59:36   what the graph may also show is that [TS]

00:59:38   Apple may not be the company to to nail [TS]

00:59:41   it because this was their shot and [TS]

00:59:43   either they were too early or they just [TS]

00:59:45   they just fumbled the ball and didn't [TS]

00:59:47   you know I didn't hit the mark with [TS]

00:59:50   their first attempt this type of product [TS]

00:59:51   and you know as we keep saying we're [TS]

00:59:53   basically you know totally outplayed by [TS]

00:59:57   their star product the iphone which [TS]

00:59:57   their star product the iphone which [TS]

01:00:00   everyone has basically voted with their [TS]

01:00:01   wallets Neffe to say this is what we [TS]

01:00:03   want right now [TS]

01:00:04   ipads you know convinces later maybe [TS]

01:00:07   I'll because like at the same time that [TS]

01:00:09   the ipad has been you know going along [TS]

01:00:12   and and getting into improving every [TS]

01:00:13   generation the iphone has gotten better [TS]

01:00:17   and bigger and the mac has gotten [TS]

01:00:21   smaller and lighter and so it's it [TS]

01:00:23   really is being squeezed on both ends if [TS]

01:00:26   you if you're willing to carry something [TS]

01:00:28   now especially with the macbook one only [TS]

01:00:30   a little bit bigger than ipad then if [TS]

01:00:34   you if you need keyboard and touch input [TS]

01:00:37   and a pc style OS the macbook one is [TS]

01:00:40   going to be better for you than an ipad [TS]

01:00:41   even an ipad pro at that kind of task on [TS]

01:00:45   the lower on the small and if you need a [TS]

01:00:47   portable entertainment and consumption [TS]

01:00:50   and communication kind of device an [TS]

01:00:54   iphone is now you know able to take a [TS]

01:00:57   lot of that and especially with the six [TS]

01:00:59   plus line it's taking even more of a [TS]

01:01:02   potentially and cuz that's has the [TS]

01:01:03   benefit of its always in your pocket is [TS]

01:01:05   always with you and you probably paid [TS]

01:01:06   less for it up front then you would [TS]

01:01:08   refer not always always benefits so it's [TS]

01:01:10   being squeezed on both sides then it's [TS]

01:01:12   being squeezed from the bottom with the [TS]

01:01:13   low end because all these cheaper [TS]

01:01:15   tablets that also can play youtube and [TS]

01:01:18   play some games and browse the web all [TS]

01:01:21   those cheaper tablets are coming and [TS]

01:01:23   eating the whole bottom end of it so [TS]

01:01:25   it's it's being attacked on so many [TS]

01:01:27   fronts and you know the good thing is [TS]

01:01:29   two of his friends are owned by apple [TS]

01:01:31   and so you know it being cannibalized by [TS]

01:01:33   other parts of Apple so it's not [TS]

01:01:34   necessarily a horrible thing for Apple [TS]

01:01:36   but I think I I don't see a way out of [TS]

01:01:40   this for the ipad anytime soon I may be [TS]

01:01:42   long-term maybe you're right you might [TS]

01:01:44   be right long-term I'll give you that [TS]

01:01:45   but in in the near-term the things that [TS]

01:01:48   tend to improve quickly and relatively [TS]

01:01:50   in computing is like you know that the [TS]

01:01:53   basic hardware specs the speed the the [TS]

01:01:56   you know the quality of like the screen [TS]

01:01:58   and stuff like that like that stuff [TS]

01:01:59   improves in the short-term the biggest [TS]

01:02:03   challenges to the ipad i think are [TS]

01:02:05   pretty deeply rooted software [TS]

01:02:08   architecture and software limitations [TS]

01:02:10   and input both of which are not [TS]

01:02:13   it's also quickly and easily so I i [TS]

01:02:16   don't think you like to talk about like [TS]

01:02:18   how how iOS could get better for [TS]

01:02:20   productivity use this it's things like [TS]

01:02:22   it'sit's things like rethink [TS]

01:02:24   multitasking and files and hits like [TS]

01:02:27   those are big things those take years to [TS]

01:02:30   to possibly develop or 2222 realize that [TS]

01:02:34   you need to rethink if you do that's a [TS]

01:02:37   very slow-moving thing and then input is [TS]

01:02:40   oftentimes not solvable like there just [TS]

01:02:44   isn't a way to make like a nine inch [TS]

01:02:46   laptop with a keyboard that humans can [TS]

01:02:48   use comfortably you like this like [TS]

01:02:50   there's like there's limitations like [TS]

01:02:51   that where you're just fighting physics [TS]

01:02:54   and you know the physical world and you [TS]

01:02:57   just can't win those fights a lot of [TS]

01:02:58   times and tablets certainly are [TS]

01:03:00   challenging in in regards to have him [TS]

01:03:02   how to fix input how to make input that [TS]

01:03:05   is that is good for both casual lean [TS]

01:03:07   back on the couch use and also [TS]

01:03:08   productivity use and that is a very hard [TS]

01:03:11   problem it might not be possible to [TS]

01:03:13   solve and it's the kind of thing where [TS]

01:03:15   progress is made very slowly if at all [TS]

01:03:18   now you're talking about cannibalization [TS]

01:03:19   and thats enough thats a the other [TS]

01:03:20   takeaway of this thing is like when you [TS]

01:03:22   look at these little lines like you look [TS]

01:03:23   at that ipod hump it's like here comes [TS]

01:03:25   the ipod and then it did marks over and [TS]

01:03:27   then you look at the mac that like every [TS]

01:03:29   time I try to find this graph but I [TS]

01:03:30   think someone tweeted and i can't find [TS]

01:03:32   it but it was a graph over many many [TS]

01:03:33   years not just like the last five or ten [TS]

01:03:35   years but like from the nineties all the [TS]

01:03:37   way up to the current time and you look [TS]

01:03:40   at the products and it's like a little [TS]

01:03:41   fireworks like the ipod launches up into [TS]

01:03:43   the sky not to higher than its the [TS]

01:03:44   ground again right and the ipad launches [TS]

01:03:47   up into the sky and is arcing over to [TS]

01:03:48   starting to be on its way down again you [TS]

01:03:50   look at the phone and if the iphone goes [TS]

01:03:52   like an stratosphere with and eventually [TS]

01:03:53   starts leveling off right and so you [TS]

01:03:56   can't see the other side of that things [TS]

01:03:57   are the only line and the entire graph [TS]

01:03:59   that is basically has any kind of you [TS]

01:04:02   know uphill slope for the entire length [TS]

01:04:05   of it is the mac and it's like way down [TS]

01:04:07   at the bottom kind of blending with with [TS]

01:04:09   the x-axis you can barely see it but you [TS]

01:04:11   can see it is little bit higher it does [TS]

01:04:13   go up over Europe you are tiny little [TS]

01:04:15   bit and it's insignificant or whatever [TS]

01:04:17   but it's interesting that that trend [TS]

01:04:19   line because it because it started off [TS]

01:04:21   as like the loser in the pc market so it [TS]

01:04:23   never had a lot of money [TS]

01:04:24   never had a high to come down from and [TS]

01:04:26   it has been steadily gaining on you know [TS]

01:04:28   has been gaining market share while [TS]

01:04:29   windows loses it whatever so it does [TS]

01:04:31   have a good graph you know an uphill [TS]

01:04:33   climb even though it's insignificant but [TS]

01:04:35   we look at all those other things what [TS]

01:04:36   Apple is hoping for when you mentioned [TS]

01:04:38   is alright so Apple makes products that [TS]

01:04:40   make these little arcs right every [TS]

01:04:41   product has a lifetime the iphone arc [TS]

01:04:43   doesn't seem like it's even half over [TS]

01:04:44   maybe it's exactly half over right maybe [TS]

01:04:47   you would extend that graph out however [TS]

01:04:49   optimistic and pessimistic you want to [TS]

01:04:50   be about the iphone arc you draw that [TS]

01:04:53   what you need is another lump you need [TS]

01:04:55   another big arch in that thing [TS]

01:04:57   so what is the new product that is going [TS]

01:04:59   to come like the watches invisible [TS]

01:05:01   because it's to know so who knows what [TS]

01:05:02   that's gonna be like but apples whole [TS]

01:05:05   thing is what is the next big thing what [TS]

01:05:08   is the next line is going to be on our [TS]

01:05:09   graph maybe i will never grow up as high [TS]

01:05:11   as the phone or whatever maybe we will [TS]

01:05:12   maybe some be our thing out there maybe [TS]

01:05:15   it's the car if you want to do revenue [TS]

01:05:16   because a lot of people have cars and [TS]

01:05:18   they cost a lot more than a mac or phone [TS]

01:05:20   so the ESPYs really good on cars but the [TS]

01:05:23   margins are much lower you know so I [TS]

01:05:25   don't know what it is but like that's [TS]

01:05:26   that's one of the reasons that investors [TS]

01:05:28   are cranky about Apple because they look [TS]

01:05:30   at all these lines and see all these [TS]

01:05:31   little arcs and like all right well I [TS]

01:05:33   think we've played this out and we feel [TS]

01:05:36   pessimistically that the iphone is at [TS]

01:05:37   its peak and how it's gonna go down [TS]

01:05:39   so where is the next arc apple and right [TS]

01:05:42   now there is no convincing answer and [TS]

01:05:44   it's apples job to complement like and i [TS]

01:05:45   agree with you the ipad pro is not going [TS]

01:05:47   to turn the ipad thing around cause even [TS]

01:05:48   if if professionals love the ipad pro [TS]

01:05:51   there's not a lot of them right so you [TS]

01:05:53   have to either let the ipad arc follow [TS]

01:05:56   its course down to the baseline and [TS]

01:05:58   start again within the tablets product [TS]

01:05:59   or you need to somehow transform the mac [TS]

01:06:02   into a tablet is product I don't know [TS]

01:06:04   how you do that like just you know [TS]

01:06:07   semantically how you could ever get [TS]

01:06:09   that's why I still feel like the ipad [TS]

01:06:10   must rise again in a new form some point [TS]

01:06:13   in the future or if not then maybe Apple [TS]

01:06:15   losses that someone else does it right [TS]

01:06:17   maybe you know who knows what ends up [TS]

01:06:20   winning this but I just feel confident [TS]

01:06:21   that the pc is the past and we are the [TS]

01:06:25   left the last great pc generation is [TS]

01:06:27   already alive of people i mean well it [TS]

01:06:30   it also you know a lot of a lot of [TS]

01:06:33   people like in our in our walk of life [TS]

01:06:35   here and by that I mean geeks like us a [TS]

01:06:38   lot of geeks just deny the role of [TS]

01:06:42   fashion and trends in things and you [TS]

01:06:46   know we try to make everything more [TS]

01:06:48   logical we try to justify things and and [TS]

01:06:50   and we don't understand fashions for [TS]

01:06:53   fads really what if tablets have been a [TS]

01:06:58   fat i know this is crazy i know this [TS]

01:07:00   sounds like the the champion of the [TS]

01:07:03   computer trying to optimistically say [TS]

01:07:05   that the tablet or just a fad and [TS]

01:07:07   computers are going to come back you [TS]

01:07:09   know so that i know this sounds crazy [TS]

01:07:10   and i'm not even said I'm not even [TS]

01:07:12   saying I believe this but I think it's [TS]

01:07:14   worth thinking about you're not you're [TS]

01:07:15   not saying computers are going to come [TS]

01:07:16   back [TS]

01:07:17   are you just saying tablets are fast two [TS]

01:07:18   separate things right right so I i think [TS]

01:07:21   it's worth considering though what if [TS]

01:07:23   the entire idea of tablets had their [TS]

01:07:26   peak already and that you know in the [TS]

01:07:30   future like the kind of casual the the [TS]

01:07:33   future of computing was already here [TS]

01:07:35   earlier than that it's the mobile phone [TS]

01:07:37   is the smartphone and and that you know [TS]

01:07:40   what if that is really the future and [TS]

01:07:43   the tablets were just kind of this thing [TS]

01:07:44   that for a brief time the whole world [TS]

01:07:46   was kind of like in love with it kind of [TS]

01:07:48   infatuated with but it was actually just [TS]

01:07:50   a fad and now we're kind of Rosings and [TS]

01:07:52   you know what I think I'd rather just [TS]

01:07:54   have a good phone and then maybe a good [TS]

01:07:56   laptop also alright I've considered and [TS]

01:07:58   rejected that's fair but but i think a [TS]

01:08:01   lot of people are not considering that [TS]

01:08:02   as a possibility but i think i think the [TS]

01:08:04   data actually like if you look at this [TS]

01:08:06   ipad sales graph that looks exactly like [TS]

01:08:08   what's going on but that but that's just [TS]

01:08:10   the ipad that's why keep differentiating [TS]

01:08:12   like there's the ipad which may be a [TS]

01:08:14   blue it on and then there's the concept [TS]

01:08:16   of a screen about the size of a piece of [TS]

01:08:18   paper or bigger that you hold in your [TS]

01:08:19   hands and i would even including tablets [TS]

01:08:21   the screen that's much bigger than a [TS]

01:08:23   piece of paper like the ipad [TS]

01:08:24   bro that you hold in your hand right or [TS]

01:08:26   even a bigger thing that sits on your [TS]

01:08:28   desk i would say is basically a big [TS]

01:08:29   piece of glass that you touch dead [TS]

01:08:31   extends down into the portable range but [TS]

01:08:34   I've always said i can imagine a desktop [TS]

01:08:35   replacement that is like more like a [TS]

01:08:37   drafting table and just the utility of [TS]

01:08:40   essentially having a magic piece of [TS]

01:08:41   paper that can show anything that is [TS]

01:08:43   piece of paper size like what's that [TS]

01:08:45   becomes like ninety-nine cents like that [TS]

01:08:47   did the computing part of that is so you [TS]

01:08:49   know again as the price of compute drops [TS]

01:08:50   to 0 of course people are gonna want [TS]

01:08:52   that people want to hold things in their [TS]

01:08:53   hand and read them and look at them and [TS]

01:08:55   watch a video and maybe that won't be an [TS]

01:08:58   ipad anymore maybe it'll be something [TS]

01:09:00   that comes in your cereal box that you [TS]

01:09:01   unroll and it's like there's no and you [TS]

01:09:03   say oh that's not a tablet it is though [TS]

01:09:05   it's like basically a screen that you [TS]

01:09:06   hold in your hand is way bigger than a [TS]

01:09:07   phone and that is absolutely not going [TS]

01:09:09   to die whether Apple has any role at all [TS]

01:09:12   in that product line remains to be seen [TS]

01:09:14   which is why i say the ipad is an open [TS]

01:09:15   question but there's a reason everyone [TS]

01:09:17   was all gaga like the fat part that I [TS]

01:09:19   think you're sensing about tablets was [TS]

01:09:20   like oh this is like the science fiction [TS]

01:09:22   books i read this is like those movies i [TS]

01:09:24   saw its like the future like how many [TS]

01:09:25   movies had no you just hold this magic [TS]

01:09:27   even before you know flat-screens [TS]

01:09:28   existed when everything was all CRT's [TS]

01:09:30   every science fiction story you know [TS]

01:09:32   back hundreds of years like oh I just [TS]

01:09:34   hold something that looks like a piece [TS]

01:09:35   of paper but I can show them any image [TS]

01:09:36   anywhere i can see anywhere in the world [TS]

01:09:37   and I can watch moving pictures on that [TS]

01:09:40   idea is never going away because it has [TS]

01:09:41   amazing utility for people like us who [TS]

01:09:43   have eyeballs in the front of her head [TS]

01:09:45   and hands that we can hold things up [TS]

01:09:46   with like it's you know unless vr [TS]

01:09:49   retinal imaging or other any sort of [TS]

01:09:51   like interior mind type thing happens or [TS]

01:09:54   scrapped your eyes thing until that [TS]

01:09:56   comes and wipes all this away having [TS]

01:09:59   something big that you hold in your hand [TS]

01:10:00   that is a screen that idea it will never [TS]

01:10:03   die because it has such amazing utility [TS]

01:10:05   it just could be that Apple is not the [TS]

01:10:07   company that he brings that to us [TS]

01:10:09   benefits from it or like it gets it [TS]

01:10:12   right because if you just play out [TS]

01:10:14   current trends eventually what will it [TS]

01:10:17   take to have something that to give your [TS]

01:10:19   toddler to watch whatever the equivalent [TS]

01:10:20   of YouTube is right maybe that'll be a [TS]

01:10:23   dollar ninety-nine in a drugstore that's [TS]

01:10:25   a rolled-up piece of plastic that the [TS]

01:10:27   kid can just do anything they want to [TS]

01:10:29   when i get somebody gets destroyed us [TS]

01:10:30   throw it away right because seriously [TS]

01:10:32   the the electronics the cost of the [TS]

01:10:35   electronics and everything to sort of [TS]

01:10:37   get into [TS]

01:10:37   and access and play video and stuff [TS]

01:10:39   that's going to in our lifetimes be so [TS]

01:10:42   incredibly trivial little bit nothing [TS]

01:10:43   you know I was going to ask you [TS]

01:10:47   John what what would make the ipad you [TS]

01:10:50   know cross that hump in and be the thing [TS]

01:10:52   or burst any tablet but and I think it [TS]

01:10:55   just just covered in a lot of ways but I [TS]

01:10:56   was thinking you know when I got my [TS]

01:10:59   first ipad mini so this is two years ago [TS]

01:11:01   now the the ipad mini with retina [TS]

01:11:03   display i had given air in my ipad3 so [TS]

01:11:08   the first full-size iPad with Retina [TS]

01:11:10   display and I given to our night set it [TS]

01:11:12   up with her iCloud account and I message [TS]

01:11:14   account and you know some of the apps i [TS]

01:11:16   thought she would use a lot and I gave [TS]

01:11:18   it to her and I think in those two years [TS]

01:11:22   she is used that ipad 5 or 10 times [TS]

01:11:26   because it always ends up that she's [TS]

01:11:29   either what she starts with her phone [TS]

01:11:31   almost always everything she does is on [TS]

01:11:34   her phone and then if for some reason [TS]

01:11:36   something she's working on it is easier [TS]

01:11:39   or just better suited for the truck for [TS]

01:11:42   her mac then she'll go to her macbook [TS]

01:11:45   air and do that thing there but [TS]

01:11:47   generally speaking for Aaron it's her [TS]

01:11:50   phone and the ipad isn't even a thought [TS]

01:11:52   in fact most of the last two years the [TS]

01:11:54   battery has been dead because neither of [TS]

01:11:55   us ever touches it and granted this is [TS]

01:11:58   only one data point that doesn't exactly [TS]

01:11:59   make a line by any stretch of the [TS]

01:12:01   imagination but it's certainly bears [TS]

01:12:05   what Apple's results are seeing which is [TS]

01:12:08   that the iphone is going crazy the Mac [TS]

01:12:12   isn't doing that and the ipad is just [TS]

01:12:13   not even their well-being like but you [TS]

01:12:16   know by three fair by like unit sales [TS]

01:12:18   the ipad in the matter are kind of neck [TS]

01:12:21   and neck right now but at the trendline [TS]

01:12:23   is very clear that the ipad is on its [TS]

01:12:25   way down while the mac is still on its [TS]

01:12:27   way up [TS]

01:12:27   yeah barely out of the way I played with [TS]

01:12:29   dice security and tried to give a bunch [TS]

01:12:32   of charge that's not the one I was [TS]

01:12:33   thinking one showed all the lines [TS]

01:12:35   together all different colors you just [TS]

01:12:36   saw the only one that was like steadily [TS]

01:12:38   climbing up like a snail over the course [TS]

01:12:40   of decades was the mac and it was just [TS]

01:12:42   like hugging the bottom of the graph [TS]

01:12:44   totally insignificant volumes compared [TS]

01:12:46   to the other [TS]

01:12:46   kharghar products but it's like we're [TS]

01:12:48   still here still call on our way up like [TS]

01:12:50   you know that's that's both sad and [TS]

01:12:54   hardening at the same time and I yeah I [TS]

01:12:57   what I think about the car and there [TS]

01:12:59   were some rumors about the car this this [TS]

01:13:00   week everything I think like is that the [TS]

01:13:02   next thing that's going to I try to [TS]

01:13:04   imagine what a car line would look like [TS]

01:13:05   on this graph like imagine they do as [TS]

01:13:07   well as Tesla and they sell you know [TS]

01:13:09   some piddling amount of really expensive [TS]

01:13:11   cars two people a lot of money and the [TS]

01:13:14   self-driving stuff doesn't work yet [TS]

01:13:16   because it's not ready [TS]

01:13:17   like what cars are really expensive and [TS]

01:13:19   so the revenues will be high but the [TS]

01:13:21   margins will necessarily be lower and [TS]

01:13:22   it's like what does that look like [TS]

01:13:24   does does the carline look like the ipod [TS]

01:13:27   line doesn't look that certainly was [TS]

01:13:28   more like the iphone line because it [TS]

01:13:30   looks like the mac line where claws its [TS]

01:13:31   way up or do they just can't the car and [TS]

01:13:33   it's a bad idea and they should really [TS]

01:13:35   concentrate on something else like and [TS]

01:13:36   then the lines we can't even think of [TS]

01:13:37   the ER is the current ? in the world of [TS]

01:13:41   like it's something people are going to [TS]

01:13:42   want to do because at this point the [TS]

01:13:44   number of people who have done vr stuff [TS]

01:13:45   is just a bunch of gaming enthusiasts [TS]

01:13:47   and that will be the case for a long [TS]

01:13:49   time I don't know what the next big [TS]

01:13:52   thing I remember several years ago we [TS]

01:13:54   were talking on the show like maybe the [TS]

01:13:56   watch is the next big thing [TS]

01:13:57   maybe it is but if it is definitely got [TS]

01:13:59   a slower ramp up its as far as we can [TS]

01:14:01   tell [TS]

01:14:01   well you know like at this point it's [TS]

01:14:03   still early right but the watches the [TS]

01:14:05   next ipod it in the sense that not [TS]

01:14:08   listen to the ipod like it was gone now [TS]

01:14:10   but in the sense that like it's an [TS]

01:14:11   accessory [TS]

01:14:12   it's something that serves a narrow [TS]

01:14:14   range of roles very well but not [TS]

01:14:18   everybody needs the devices for that [TS]

01:14:19   narrow range of roles and also that is [TS]

01:14:21   not going to replace your phone [TS]

01:14:23   yeah i mean like our maybe just [TS]

01:14:25   wearables in general like it'sit's just [TS]

01:14:26   it's very difficult to think of [TS]

01:14:28   something that is ever going to be like [TS]

01:14:31   the next iPhone because the very thing [TS]

01:14:32   about a phone is that literally every [TS]

01:14:34   every adult in the world probably could [TS]

01:14:37   conceivably use one right and that's a [TS]

01:14:39   big market now how many products can you [TS]

01:14:41   say that about maybe cars not really [TS]

01:14:44   because most people don't have cars in [TS]

01:14:46   the world have bicycles motorcycles are [TS]

01:14:48   lucky and you know whatever like you're [TS]

01:14:49   just trying to think of something that [TS]

01:14:50   that everybody could find some utility [TS]

01:14:55   for some values of everybody and it's [TS]

01:14:56   very difficult to think about a watch [TS]

01:14:58   is one like well sure of something you [TS]

01:15:00   hold your wrists and tells you the time [TS]

01:15:01   that seems like a brother useful thing [TS]

01:15:02   you could sell a lot of but can someone [TS]

01:15:04   for that much money and I don't know if [TS]

01:15:08   you're ever going to be able to sell [TS]

01:15:09   everybody in the world at 691 dollar [TS]

01:15:12   which I think was there asking you what [TS]

01:15:13   I phone 691 dollar watched everyone the [TS]

01:15:15   world know like somebody just get the [TS]

01:15:18   high end of the watch market just like [TS]

01:15:19   they had behind the phone market i don't [TS]

01:15:21   know i'm i don't know what the next [TS]

01:15:23   thing for apple is but when i look at [TS]

01:15:25   these graphs of everyone if i was to [TS]

01:15:27   continue the x-axis and your girlfriend [TS]

01:15:30   2016 and extend that out for another 50 [TS]

01:15:32   years and let me just draw it continue [TS]

01:15:35   drawing the lines of all their current [TS]

01:15:36   product lines i see like how optimistic [TS]

01:15:40   can you be with the iphone like you're [TS]

01:15:42   going to continue to draw the iphone [TS]

01:15:43   line you know it looks like it's a big [TS]

01:15:44   thing goes up up in the slow parts love [TS]

01:15:46   how do you do that let us draw a [TS]

01:15:47   straight line and into the future and [TS]

01:15:49   say well smartphones will continue for [TS]

01:15:51   the next 50 years pretty much as is or [TS]

01:15:53   do you make it go up more or do you make [TS]

01:15:55   it slowly go down like the rest of the [TS]

01:15:56   things I don't know we also sponsor this [TS]

01:15:59   week by fracture fracture prints photos [TS]

01:16:02   in vivid color directly on glass go to [TS]

01:16:05   fracture me.com and use code ATP 10 to [TS]

01:16:08   get ten percent off now fracture prints [TS]

01:16:11   look amazing [TS]

01:16:12   they are these nice little like squares [TS]

01:16:13   or rectangles or big if you want to go [TS]

01:16:15   big go bigger home [TS]

01:16:17   nice these nice little or big squares [TS]

01:16:19   where you can close that they offer what [TS]

01:16:21   options and these prints look great [TS]

01:16:23   they're modern they're clean they go [TS]

01:16:25   edge-to-edge they don't need a frame or [TS]

01:16:27   anything they are their own [TS]

01:16:27   self-contained thing that they may [TS]

01:16:29   replace the need for a frame it just [TS]

01:16:31   looks like a nice modern photo [TS]

01:16:33   presentation you can hang it on a wall [TS]

01:16:35   you stand up on a desk they make [TS]

01:16:37   fantastic gifts and we have them all [TS]

01:16:40   around the house we've given many of [TS]

01:16:41   them as gifts as well [TS]

01:16:42   people love these things they always [TS]

01:16:43   they always compliment them we always [TS]

01:16:45   hear about people how much people love [TS]

01:16:47   them and you can do everything of course [TS]

01:16:48   online so it'sit's great like if you [TS]

01:16:50   need last minute gift for somebody you [TS]

01:16:52   know do it online have it sent to them [TS]

01:16:54   and and you're all set [TS]

01:16:55   it's a perfect way to celebrate holidays [TS]

01:16:57   fun whatever else you know Valentine's [TS]

01:17:00   Day is coming up you do it for that i [TS]

01:17:02   really recommend checking out fracture [TS]

01:17:03   for these beautiful photo prints in [TS]

01:17:06   vivid color directly on glass and [TS]

01:17:08   they're all assembled by by hand by the [TS]

01:17:10   small team in gainesville florida [TS]

01:17:12   so there's quality checking in [TS]

01:17:13   everything and is a very very nice human [TS]

01:17:15   you know small company here you're [TS]

01:17:16   dealing with some good people over there [TS]

01:17:18   you can get ten percent off with code [TS]

01:17:20   ATP 10 just go to fracture me.com to [TS]

01:17:23   check it out thanks a lot to fracture [TS]

01:17:24   once again code ATP tend to get ten [TS]

01:17:26   percent off thanks to fracture for [TS]

01:17:28   sponsoring our show [TS]

01:17:29   alright Marco is the iphone 7 going to [TS]

01:17:32   be waterproof running a bit long so [TS]

01:17:34   let's keep it to just that question is [TS]

01:17:36   going to be waterproof why I mean my we [TS]

01:17:40   talked about this and I i think the [TS]

01:17:41   answer i think the answer is probably [TS]

01:17:43   it'll probably be very close it you know [TS]

01:17:48   just just like the iphone 6s is very [TS]

01:17:52   water resistant it is not waterproof but [TS]

01:17:54   if if you if it happens to get wet [TS]

01:17:56   bye-bye most people's estimation and [TS]

01:17:58   some little test here and there it seems [TS]

01:18:00   to fare better than the other ones [TS]

01:18:02   it gives water a stern talking to ya [TS]

01:18:04   because ya know it has extra seals it [TS]

01:18:07   has like these extra little like little [TS]

01:18:09   seals like all over all the things on [TS]

01:18:10   the board and everything and so it is [TS]

01:18:12   certainly water resistant to some degree [TS]

01:18:15   it's on advertise this way but it that [TS]

01:18:17   is how they seem to do it if they drop [TS]

01:18:19   the headphone jack [TS]

01:18:20   you know it that might be a reason to to [TS]

01:18:23   make waterproofness a headlining feature [TS]

01:18:25   because that might that might help tame [TS]

01:18:28   some of the anger that will result from [TS]

01:18:30   losing the headphone jack from from [TS]

01:18:31   customers so i think it's it's possible [TS]

01:18:34   I i think the 6s and the watch both show [TS]

01:18:38   that Apple is and at the watch i think [TS]

01:18:41   is it is a more interesting example of [TS]

01:18:43   this because the watch has openings it [TS]

01:18:45   has a speaker it has a microphone as as [TS]

01:18:49   the crown to oh yeah right yeah and [TS]

01:18:52   actually an international watches the [TS]

01:18:54   crown is usually the hardest part to [TS]

01:18:55   water prevents its opening with a moving [TS]

01:18:57   partner and everything anyway so you [TS]

01:18:59   know you have a date they clearly have [TS]

01:19:01   the ability to make things that are very [TS]

01:19:02   water resistant possibly waterproof the [TS]

01:19:04   only question i think is how waterproof [TS]

01:19:07   will it be and whether they will [TS]

01:19:09   advertise this as a feature or whether [TS]

01:19:11   it just be quietly water resistant to [TS]

01:19:13   his successes [TS]

01:19:14   yes that was the question what's your [TS]

01:19:17   answer right i would say probably too [TS]

01:19:22   which one of those like that [TS]

01:19:23   rising over the the fact that will [TS]

01:19:24   actually be i would say it is very [TS]

01:19:27   likely that it will be that it will be [TS]

01:19:29   more water resistant than the success [TS]

01:19:30   which is already pretty good so I say [TS]

01:19:32   the the chances of it getting getting [TS]

01:19:35   more water resistant are very good the [TS]

01:19:37   chance of the advertising that i would [TS]

01:19:38   give it maybe like a sixty percent [TS]

01:19:40   chance they probably will advertise it [TS]

01:19:43   but not necessarily but i do think if [TS]

01:19:45   they do actually delete the headphone [TS]

01:19:47   jack then that would be that would make [TS]

01:19:49   it more likely that they would advertise [TS]

01:19:51   that is a feature because that would [TS]

01:19:52   help justify that decision [TS]

01:19:54   yeah i think i'm mostly agree like the [TS]

01:19:56   reason i put this in there is because [TS]

01:19:57   like electronic devices don't become [TS]

01:20:00   more water resistant by accident so in [TS]

01:20:03   the past phones that have been at that [TS]

01:20:05   Apple seems to have been taking making [TS]

01:20:07   more of an effort to seal them up [TS]

01:20:09   getting totally not advertised as you [TS]

01:20:11   probably shouldn't you know put your [TS]

01:20:12   phone in water many people killed our [TS]

01:20:14   phones by putting them in water right [TS]

01:20:16   but some part of the engineering process [TS]

01:20:18   of these phones is even if it's not [TS]

01:20:20   about water maybe just about dust or [TS]

01:20:22   whatever like they're making an effort [TS]

01:20:23   to see all these phones up tighter [TS]

01:20:26   I don't see any reason that effort trend [TS]

01:20:29   would diminish especially since many of [TS]

01:20:32   their competitors do try to advertise [TS]

01:20:35   advertise their phones as waterproof and [TS]

01:20:37   Apple knows better than anybody how many [TS]

01:20:38   people drop their phones in the toilet [TS]

01:20:40   and come into the store said about [TS]

01:20:41   another whole water resistance for their [TS]

01:20:42   warranties like they have this info they [TS]

01:20:45   are trying to make their phones more [TS]

01:20:46   order system so i think the only [TS]

01:20:48   question is do they start advertising [TS]

01:20:51   they're like have they crossed the [TS]

01:20:52   threshold at which they can start [TS]

01:20:54   advertising is obviously they know like [TS]

01:20:55   they're not going to advertise until [TS]

01:20:57   they can be very sure like they are with [TS]

01:20:58   the watch like to spec it out and say [TS]

01:21:00   here's how we think will perform a ball [TS]

01:21:02   right over even the watch [TS]

01:21:04   they barely advertise that it's [TS]

01:21:06   water-resistant everybody's expectations [TS]

01:21:07   while I get under promise and over [TS]

01:21:09   deliver the watch because it's like you [TS]

01:21:11   totally shouldn't put this in the water [TS]

01:21:12   but realistically speaking it's like and [TS]

01:21:14   cranberry swimming in the ocean with his [TS]

01:21:16   like every single week for God's how [TS]

01:21:19   long like if when he tells us that his [TS]

01:21:21   watch has been killed by the water them [TS]

01:21:23   well maybe know that they know what the [TS]

01:21:25   limits are but seriously like it's [TS]

01:21:27   basically well you know waterproof [TS]

01:21:29   enough but they don't say it like you're [TS]

01:21:31   right they don't say much about it [TS]

01:21:32   because like they have the specs and [TS]

01:21:33   it's like it's like watch specs in going [TS]

01:21:35   and you can see with low number [TS]

01:21:36   bizarre on the help of these standards [TS]

01:21:37   or whatever but the phone they don't say [TS]

01:21:39   anything about that i do not bring your [TS]

01:21:41   phone your water in anyway right [TS]

01:21:43   and so some point they'll be able to say [TS]

01:21:45   something about the phone with respect [TS]

01:21:47   to water so I i think that is coming [TS]

01:21:50   I just don't know if it's the iphone 7 [TS]

01:21:52   or 8 or 9 or whatever and ever had to [TS]

01:21:54   put a percentage on it for the seven i [TS]

01:21:56   would say I i I'm so the reason is i so [TS]

01:22:02   want this to be an advertising feature [TS]

01:22:04   of the iphone 7 but I just I just feel [TS]

01:22:06   like that even if it is the headphone [TS]

01:22:08   port they need one more generation to [TS]

01:22:09   really go for water but I hope I'm wrong [TS]

01:22:11   so I'm going to put it slightly under [TS]

01:22:13   fifty percent but I hope I'm wrong so [TS]

01:22:14   even if they ditched the headphone port [TS]

01:22:17   there's still lightning port right [TS]

01:22:19   unless we go full inductive yeah i mean [TS]

01:22:21   like this there's always going to be [TS]

01:22:22   openings i don't think the headphone i [TS]

01:22:23   did at put marker said like it's not so [TS]

01:22:26   much to get into the headphone something [TS]

01:22:27   makes it possible to waterproof it's [TS]

01:22:29   that it's a nice it's a nice thing to be [TS]

01:22:31   able to say when telling people that you [TS]

01:22:32   took away their headphone port [TS]

01:22:34   yeah they like because you know there [TS]

01:22:36   are ways to to waterproof certain ports [TS]

01:22:38   and and the design of the poor can make [TS]

01:22:40   it easier or harder [TS]

01:22:41   I'm sure lightning was probably designed [TS]

01:22:44   with that in mind with with in mind to [TS]

01:22:47   to have future devices be more water [TS]

01:22:49   resistant or to make it easier to do it [TS]

01:22:51   well it all that being said one thing [TS]

01:22:53   that I find promising about this is that [TS]

01:22:56   one of my common criticisms of apple [TS]

01:22:58   design especially recently that I think [TS]

01:23:00   seems to be getting worse honestly it [TS]

01:23:03   seems like the the newer products that [TS]

01:23:04   come out oftentimes seem to ignore what [TS]

01:23:08   customers actually need like the [TS]

01:23:09   problems that we face in the real world [TS]

01:23:11   and what we actually one of our devices [TS]

01:23:13   instead you know give us things that we [TS]

01:23:15   were really asking for even though they [TS]

01:23:18   might be nice but just things we were [TS]

01:23:19   only asking for like you know increased [TS]

01:23:21   thinnest and lightest is one more cut [TS]

01:23:22   most common things so you know yet [TS]

01:23:24   things like you know like the macbook [TS]

01:23:26   one with it's you know really [TS]

01:23:27   controversial keyboard [TS]

01:23:30   I'll be nice to it tonight well I really [TS]

01:23:31   controversial keyboard that's that was [TS]

01:23:33   made in the name of thinness it's like [TS]

01:23:35   we didn't need to be that the necessary [TS]

01:23:37   things like the iphone it in the best [TS]

01:23:39   example that I can give on the phone is [TS]

01:23:41   battery life where so many people with [TS]

01:23:43   love their phone to get better battery [TS]

01:23:45   life and most people don't say I wish my [TS]

01:23:48   phone was thinner [TS]

01:23:49   in general I I see some I see this [TS]

01:23:51   happening at apple and I'm a little a [TS]

01:23:53   little saddened by some of this however [TS]

01:23:54   if you look at what else [TS]

01:23:57   people really want out of their iphones [TS]

01:23:59   very high on the list is resistance to [TS]

01:24:02   damage and the two kinds of damage that [TS]

01:24:04   happen most phones is water damaged and [TS]

01:24:07   dropping damage and so if they can make [TS]

01:24:09   it more more durable and more more [TS]

01:24:13   resistant to shattering or scratching or [TS]

01:24:16   cracking of the glass surfaces and if [TS]

01:24:19   they can make it more water resistant [TS]

01:24:20   that will seriously benefit a large [TS]

01:24:23   number of customers that is very [TS]

01:24:25   promising and that Apple is clearly [TS]

01:24:28   trying not only to make things super [TS]

01:24:30   thin so Johnny I can be proud of them [TS]

01:24:31   because it seems like they don't really [TS]

01:24:33   know what else to do with the physical [TS]

01:24:34   designs but they can also at least solve [TS]

01:24:37   real customer problems things that were [TS]

01:24:40   really big and really affect a lot of [TS]

01:24:41   people so that i think is great and if [TS]

01:24:44   they're if they're doing stuff like this [TS]

01:24:45   if they're improving waterproofness and [TS]

01:24:48   shockproof penis at all those will pay [TS]

01:24:50   off big time and an actual customer [TS]

01:24:52   benefit [TS]

01:24:53   ok so what's your answer I think that if [TS]

01:24:56   the headphone port goes absolutely i [TS]

01:24:59   think it might even be so far as hey we [TS]

01:25:02   made it waterproof but oops we had to [TS]

01:25:04   make the headphone port go away it's [TS]

01:25:05   just the way it had to be I think it's [TS]

01:25:07   probably going to be I don't know if it [TS]

01:25:09   will be advertised as you know full-on [TS]

01:25:11   waterproof but i do think we will hear [TS]

01:25:13   something advertised about it [TS]

01:25:14   significantly increased water protection [TS]

01:25:18   for like a better way of phrasing it a [TS]

01:25:20   more water resistance i guess i'm having [TS]

01:25:23   trouble wrapping my mind around how this [TS]

01:25:25   would work while still having a [TS]

01:25:27   lightning port I can't help but wonder [TS]

01:25:28   you could we do not only inductive [TS]

01:25:32   charging but inductive data I believe [TS]

01:25:35   that's called Wi-Fi well how to chez [TS]

01:25:37   Pierre point [TS]

01:25:38   yeah but like I don't think you died I [TS]

01:25:39   think they're going to still have a [TS]

01:25:41   lighting board and I think lighting port [TS]

01:25:42   probably because it's their own part and [TS]

01:25:45   they can do whatever the hell they want [TS]

01:25:46   with it and it has always been kind of [TS]

01:25:47   like a non-traditional sort of software [TS]

01:25:50   control port where it's not as if you're [TS]

01:25:51   making aspect for the whole world to [TS]

01:25:52   build you tell them with the pinouts are [TS]

01:25:54   you have no control of what's at the [TS]

01:25:55   other end of those pins because they're [TS]

01:25:56   all like hardwired pins for different [TS]

01:25:58   voltage levels or whatever like it is [TS]

01:26:00   entirely up to the apple so I feel like [TS]

01:26:01   lightning port [TS]

01:26:02   the least of their concerns like [TS]

01:26:03   probably the trickiest parts are like [TS]

01:26:05   the battles around the speakers and [TS]

01:26:07   microphones and stuff because I mean [TS]

01:26:09   they've done it on the watch already but [TS]

01:26:10   to do that and still have a reasonably [TS]

01:26:12   high quality speaker and microphone [TS]

01:26:14   assembly which they seem to be [TS]

01:26:15   concentrating on and recent iOS devices [TS]

01:26:17   it all seems a little bit around [TS]

01:26:19   possibility that's why I think like in [TS]

01:26:20   the past the past few years of devices [TS]

01:26:22   they have been slowly but surely gain [TS]

01:26:24   expertise in how to do this all the [TS]

01:26:27   while not telling you anything about it [TS]

01:26:28   all the only reason we're finding out [TS]

01:26:29   about it is because people youtuber [TS]

01:26:31   dropping their phones in the water and [TS]

01:26:33   then fill me getting see what happens [TS]

01:26:34   when i was at least gonna start blending [TS]

01:26:36   them i think that phase is probably over [TS]

01:26:38   did you hurt your all the things like [TS]

01:26:39   the best the best waterproof electronic [TS]

01:26:41   things they just use distilled water or [TS]

01:26:43   something without any like free ions or [TS]

01:26:45   whatever so they can conduct electricity [TS]

01:26:46   you put present any electronics in that [TS]

01:26:48   or so the theory goes [TS]

01:26:50   whereas if you use tap water or [TS]

01:26:51   something with minerals or impurities or [TS]

01:26:52   whatever that it'll short out your phone [TS]

01:26:54   uh-huh yeah do not put your phone in [TS]

01:26:57   water the lesson like even when if they [TS]

01:27:00   make the water-resistant one don't make [TS]

01:27:01   it and I think marco was never trying to [TS]

01:27:03   give us just a waterproof like that is [TS]

01:27:05   smart to bring up the the dropping thing [TS]

01:27:07   because Apple is kind of stuck on that [TS]

01:27:11   one until some kind of materials change [TS]

01:27:15   because they picked last for a reason [TS]

01:27:16   they try to keep making tougher glass [TS]

01:27:18   the glass that is that's more resistant [TS]

01:27:20   to to breaking and bending like that [TS]

01:27:22   super gorilla whatever glass and trying [TS]

01:27:24   sap like but bottom line is if you put [TS]

01:27:27   plastic on it would be super durable [TS]

01:27:28   that it would be terrible you think [TS]

01:27:30   Johnny I've can handle things now with [TS]

01:27:32   the camera protruding although entirely [TS]

01:27:35   agree with that but uh forget it then [TS]

01:27:37   they want glass because it is it feels [TS]

01:27:39   nice it feels expensive it doesn't get [TS]

01:27:42   all scratched up and gross like it all [TS]

01:27:44   of the great qualities of glass that we [TS]

01:27:45   love the reason why glasses the right [TS]

01:27:47   choice for the thumb the one thing as [TS]

01:27:48   against it is does tend to shatter if [TS]

01:27:51   you drop it onto asphalt just the right [TS]

01:27:52   way so I don't know how they get out of [TS]

01:27:55   that [TS]

01:27:55   find because if the whole if the goal [TS]

01:27:57   was make it so i can take this phone and [TS]

01:28:00   throw it on the ground like I'm spiking [TS]

01:28:01   the football and it survives make the [TS]

01:28:03   whole thing out of fisher-price plastic [TS]

01:28:04   like it's not as if there's a hard drive [TS]

01:28:06   disk head to crash inside there is [TS]

01:28:08   extremely durable all except for the [TS]

01:28:10   fact but it would feel terrible if we [TS]

01:28:11   made it official price plastic and we [TS]

01:28:13   get scratched up and it would look gross [TS]

01:28:14   and it would be a worse product so at [TS]

01:28:16   least waterproof something I can do with [TS]

01:28:19   with dropping not quite sure what they [TS]

01:28:21   can do their and instead we all just [TS]

01:28:23   cover our phones in cases that look like [TS]

01:28:25   big fisher-price plastic well some [TS]

01:28:27   people do I mean my case is not saving [TS]

01:28:29   my phone that I tell you my wife dropped [TS]

01:28:31   her her big plus [TS]

01:28:34   no success that was awhile ago it was [TS]

01:28:36   like a week after she got it and it just [TS]

01:28:38   like slipped out of her pocket or [TS]

01:28:40   whatever from basically waist height [TS]

01:28:41   onto the cement sidewalk completely [TS]

01:28:43   shattered [TS]

01:28:44   well that's why you get applicator plus [TS]

01:28:47   yeah well in her defense the plus is [TS]

01:28:49   really easy to drop [TS]

01:28:50   yeah well it was her first like she's [TS]

01:28:52   gonna use it was in the silicon case but [TS]

01:28:53   that didn't save it but ya know and [TS]

01:28:55   shattered we also chatter phones all the [TS]

01:28:57   time I just thought there's no way out [TS]

01:29:00   of that other than to keep leaning on [TS]

01:29:01   your last manufacturers to make it [TS]

01:29:03   stronger and better but the you know [TS]

01:29:05   until we get transparent aluminum I [TS]

01:29:07   guess from the star trek movie [TS]

01:29:08   Wow would that be worth something to you [TS]

01:29:11   and we're done [TS]

01:29:14   alright thanks 143 sponsors this week [TS]

01:29:16   Harry's Squarespace and fracture and we [TS]

01:29:18   will see you next week [TS]

01:29:22   now the show is over they didn't even [TS]

01:29:25   mean to begin as it was accidental [TS]

01:29:29   it was accidental [TS]

01:29:32   John didn't research Marco and Casey [TS]

01:29:36   would let down [TS]

01:29:37   because it was accidentally was [TS]

01:29:40   accidental and you can find show know [TS]

01:29:45   today [TS]

01:29:45   DP died and it for twitter you can [TS]

01:29:51   follow them [TS]

01:29:53   yes eyl ISS so that's Casey listen ma [TS]

01:29:58   osseo erm Angie Marco Arment our AC at [TS]

01:30:07   Syracuse it [TS]

01:30:19   why do we still have a liking for why [TS]

01:30:23   not go inductive charging and just say [TS]

01:30:25   the hell with it to having a port at all [TS]

01:30:27   my friend has one of those things I [TS]

01:30:28   forget what it's called like the key [TS]

01:30:30   charger or something q I or whatever you [TS]

01:30:33   use it with his iOS devices a case that [TS]

01:30:35   you basically put on your phone and it [TS]

01:30:36   plugs into your lighting board and it's [TS]

01:30:37   a very thin case because all really has [TS]

01:30:39   to do is have a big like sort of [TS]

01:30:40   inductive contact thing and you just put [TS]

01:30:42   it on he likes it he just put it on [TS]

01:30:44   these little stands and charges that i [TS]

01:30:46   would assume slightly slower than the [TS]

01:30:48   other things but why do they not have [TS]

01:30:50   that i don't know i'm not entirely sure [TS]

01:30:54   it is a clean windows like isn't that [TS]

01:30:56   better in all ways than a wire setting [TS]

01:30:59   aside performance entirely I is it [TS]

01:31:02   better [TS]

01:31:02   I don't think it's better and always [TS]

01:31:04   been a wire because the charging them [TS]

01:31:06   takes up more room [TS]

01:31:07   yeah it's like imagine imagine if you're [TS]

01:31:09   traveling with your phone you go to plug [TS]

01:31:10   it in like a hotel or something [TS]

01:31:12   look at what is with the watch today and [TS]

01:31:14   imagine imagine like the watch but [TS]

01:31:15   bigger basically like bringing the watch [TS]

01:31:18   with you is kind of a pain in the butt [TS]

01:31:19   because that big table and it like [TS]

01:31:21   doesn't really stick very well to it [TS]

01:31:23   like when you're like traveling [TS]

01:31:25   somewhere that kind of sucks [TS]

01:31:26   where's the phone like you plug in this [TS]

01:31:27   thing and it holds you can like you can [TS]

01:31:29   swing the phone around like like a rope [TS]

01:31:31   from the cord and it holds it i mean you [TS]

01:31:35   shouldn't but you probably can and it [TS]

01:31:37   will probably hold like it its it [TS]

01:31:39   accords are just really really practical [TS]

01:31:42   in the real world even though they are [TS]

01:31:44   totally unsexy and they may offend the [TS]

01:31:48   sensibilities of the key slice like why [TS]

01:31:50   can't everything be Wireless but the [TS]

01:31:51   reality is like in practice they are [TS]

01:31:54   just really good really simple really [TS]

01:31:57   cheap and they they suffer from very few [TS]

01:32:00   of the downsides of inductive charging [TS]

01:32:03   for like I know speed is actually a big [TS]

01:32:05   issue of that how much current you can [TS]

01:32:07   get through another charger once safely [TS]

01:32:10   and i kinda in that kind of situation [TS]

01:32:12   and i'm pretty sure that a pretty sure [TS]

01:32:15   that the court still wins at a pretty [TS]

01:32:17   big margin and looking forward to the [TS]

01:32:19   future it would be ideal of our phones [TS]

01:32:22   charged even faster especially the [TS]

01:32:24   batteries keep getting smaller it would [TS]

01:32:26   be idealistic if they could charge [TS]

01:32:27   faster which means more current which [TS]

01:32:30   means the capable still win so they're [TS]

01:32:31   capacitors that's all you need to be [TS]

01:32:33   dr. that supercapacitors that's the [TS]

01:32:35   current 5-10 year technology is going to [TS]

01:32:37   make a phone started 15 seconds [TS]

01:32:38   Emily study together the current across [TS]

01:32:40   though but you were mostly interesting [TS]

01:32:42   inductive but i think the other thing [TS]

01:32:43   out there is the whole trying to cook [TS]

01:32:47   the people in the room by carefully [TS]

01:32:48   directing microwaves to exactly where [TS]

01:32:50   your phone is sitting in that case you [TS]

01:32:51   would go to the hotel you have all your [TS]

01:32:53   devices with you and all you do is plug [TS]

01:32:54   one wall art into the wall and it would [TS]

01:32:56   charge every device in the room at the [TS]

01:32:57   same time hopefully not cooking your [TS]

01:32:59   insides when it doesn't [TS]

01:33:01   yeah you'd be sleeping five inches away [TS]

01:33:03   from one of them yeah well you know like [TS]

01:33:05   it technically you can do that kind of [TS]

01:33:07   sort of i don't know if that would be [TS]

01:33:09   legal but like I'm trying to think of [TS]

01:33:10   things that like I'm trying to think of [TS]

01:33:12   things that would be with that would be [TS]

01:33:14   a clean way because I think we would all [TS]

01:33:15   agree that that could work and not cook [TS]

01:33:18   people you know we're using whatever [TS]

01:33:19   technology want to make up about some [TS]

01:33:21   future technology that would be win [TS]

01:33:23   because it's better than plugging things [TS]

01:33:24   in you don't have to have a bunch of [TS]

01:33:26   pads with you it does all of them at [TS]

01:33:27   once and it's just it's fire-and-forget [TS]

01:33:29   like the same way that Wi-Fi is like oh [TS]

01:33:31   now you know for most people i don't [TS]

01:33:33   have to wire my house so I just put this [TS]

01:33:34   one thing in the corner of my house and [TS]

01:33:36   then internet is everywhere people what [TS]

01:33:38   is one thing in the corner of my house [TS]

01:33:39   and charging is everywhere [TS]

01:33:41   that would be cool i would buy that if [TS]

01:33:43   it didn't cook me [TS]