The Accidental Tech Podcast

112: The Problem Is You


00:00:00   well as the other one year later but the one shown it can be the one I like that [TS]

00:00:04   because it sounds like you know the one as in the person your goin to marry this [TS]

00:00:07   watch can't be the one not the matrix no not that one would work so did the way [TS]

00:00:14   you got to watch to be the one is by telling it that it's not the one I [TS]

00:00:18   understood that reference to them we have a tremendous amount of follow-up [TS]

00:00:25   today everyone look at the time I think we should I think we should start by [TS]

00:00:32   genuinely saying that we got a lot of really really lovely and wonderful [TS]

00:00:36   feedback with regard to our Twitter conversation that happened in the after [TS]

00:00:41   show in the last show and and i hope i dont sound sarcastic As I am really [TS]

00:00:45   being genuine we got a ton of really great feedback and even even the [TS]

00:00:50   feedback that I saw that was constructively criticize criticizing US [TS]

00:00:55   was constructive and and I and i was appreciative of that we had a lot of [TS]

00:01:00   drive-by tweet thanks and tweet love and that was extremely refreshing given that [TS]

00:01:06   we spoke a lot about drive-by tweet hate so I just want to thank everyone that [TS]

00:01:11   you guys were really kind of us last week and I'm pretty sure I speak for the [TS]

00:01:15   to the other two to say it's very kind of you and we really appreciate it [TS]

00:01:20   we also got a lot of feedback about how many external displays modern max can [TS]

00:01:29   drive and I don't we got this from several different people but I think [TS]

00:01:34   just moments ago we got a pretty good summary John do you wanna go over that I [TS]

00:01:38   think this was the most popular correction from last week everybody just [TS]

00:01:42   wanted to come in and say that they have [TS]

00:01:45   have a MacBook Pro and that they have more than two external displays on it [TS]

00:01:48   some people are sending us pictures of their set up some people are confused [TS]

00:01:53   about which MacBook Pro we're talking about it last [TS]

00:01:56   feedback regret the most recent models but even among those people they sent [TS]

00:02:00   here I but the most recent model and here it is but you no more than two [TS]

00:02:04   external displays what's up with that and so of course if you go to the [TS]

00:02:09   MacBook Pro specs page at apple.com for both the 13 inch of a dancer says talk [TS]

00:02:15   about their external display capabilities in a says up to two [TS]

00:02:18   external displays up to two external displays for both of them so what's the [TS]

00:02:22   deal here and Nathan Anderson is not the only person to send information but it [TS]

00:02:27   happened to come in late breaking into his reasonable summary that deal as far [TS]

00:02:31   as I can tell based on all the people who sent in both their pictures and [TS]

00:02:34   their information is that if you have a 13 inch MacBook Pro you can only do to [TS]

00:02:41   extremist players if you have a fifteen-inch you can do more than two of [TS]

00:02:45   you have the discrete graphics with Nvidia chip and only two if you have the [TS]

00:02:50   integrated graphics and there's some strangeness about past models could or [TS]

00:02:58   couldn't do integrated so it seems like me the apples pages giving a [TS]

00:03:02   conservative answer if you read that and think you can only use to external [TS]

00:03:05   displays you happen to get on with discrete graphics and you can do more [TS]

00:03:08   than to be pleasantly surprised but he'll never be disappointed because the [TS]

00:03:12   upper to external displays is true for all the models and if you can do more [TS]

00:03:15   and maybe it's not even officially supported according to Apple but it does [TS]

00:03:18   work so here we go for all the people who wrote in you know you're not crazy [TS]

00:03:23   your particular model may be able to do more than two but it is apparently a [TS]

00:03:28   variation that Apple does not consider important enough to delineate on their [TS]

00:03:32   customer-facing spec page also let me just how amazing this is because it was [TS]

00:03:38   only a few years ago when if you want to have more than one extra display so more [TS]

00:03:44   than two displays total you had to have a Mac Pro and usually with more than one [TS]

00:03:49   video card [TS]

00:03:50   this is pretty amazing that ever since I believe injection of thunder but I don't [TS]

00:03:55   think the me too many DisplayPort line could detain them if that's great but [TS]

00:03:59   it's only very very recent since the era of the new book on the MacBook MacBook [TS]

00:04:04   and MacBook Pros that you can have more than one extra monitor hooked up and [TS]

00:04:08   that's pretty amazing progress man could definitely have the external monitor we [TS]

00:04:17   have some people at work who are trying to do like six external monitors and [TS]

00:04:21   they were reaching I'm not sure which limits to reaching basically many of the [TS]

00:04:25   people sit around had reached the limit of what their their machines can do I'll [TS]

00:04:30   provide either physically speaking or for a GPU eyes and it is comical to see [TS]

00:04:35   where the limits are a little tiny machine with this huge array of displays [TS]

00:04:39   on his crazy arm that but maybe five or six things and what's what's attached [TS]

00:04:44   that jane rest at a little laptop yeah I mean I think I think the actual limited [TS]

00:04:49   display is there is like sanity desk space / arm capacity in external [TS]

00:04:56   monitors are are kind of like cats like you know most people should have between [TS]

00:05:00   0 and one and you know it's really really easy once you have more than one [TS]

00:05:05   to go what's one more I could you know have all the texts refer at my house [TS]

00:05:09   like they're like there's some people like no number of monitors is enough for [TS]

00:05:15   them and because they haven't adopted a system like yours john we're like they [TS]

00:05:18   have some way to manage lots of windows on whatever space they're given know [TS]

00:05:22   they need more space and they always need more space and like oh I have 2 [TS]

00:05:27   wideout three other men monitors are pretty cheap these days when added two [TS]

00:05:31   more and let's get a double decker arm now we can have eight and it just never [TS]

00:05:35   enough then all of a sudden F fifteen cats and was like that the physical [TS]

00:05:38   incarnation of spaces there like I'm 1911 monitor for a text editor that will [TS]

00:05:45   be in portrait but only ever had one document open at once because I used by [TS]

00:05:48   Andrea launched every time on a data file [TS]

00:05:50   and one monitor open for like my phone went and like the opportunity does not [TS]

00:05:55   exist and if I need to have another window open I need another monitor now [TS]

00:05:58   because everything is all I know is I kind of I want to rig I would never do [TS]

00:06:07   it but i wanna rig that's like six monitor still wall of monitors in front [TS]

00:06:11   of me I would get lost in it but it sounds awesome you'll never find your [TS]

00:06:14   cursor let me tell you people have that at work you can never find your car show [TS]

00:06:17   you how to turn the giant cursor mode that my mom uses what was the setup that [TS]

00:06:22   that really nerdy guy in his boy used like a chair that was reclined in like [TS]

00:06:28   two or three monitors pitch down at him or something like that got him to watch [TS]

00:06:33   that movie again you will see that that sounds like a back problem and now trust [TS]

00:06:37   me it was like this whole pod thing that the dude hadn t seen Grandma's Boy John [TS]

00:06:41   you know I'm talking about I do not know which documents although I've seen [TS]

00:06:45   people I can picture the arrangement you're you're describing the pictures on [TS]

00:06:49   the internet if similar arrangements of people that are reclining and having [TS]

00:06:52   monitors suspended above the knee or the reverse where the money is a blow them [TS]

00:06:56   in their face down on a good economically speaking probably does this [TS]

00:07:01   count as the reference that I made that you didn't get I think so [TS]

00:07:05   admittedly is a very shaky and poor reference but well I mean is it [TS]

00:07:09   something that you had an expectation that I would get us a staple of pop [TS]

00:07:12   culture oh boy are you kidding it's a wonderful movie about computer geeks you [TS]

00:07:18   say so I'm gonna count that as a win and Casey column anyway we should probably [TS]

00:07:23   move on and speaking of movies and video John wanted to tell us about [TS]

00:07:27   with your whole scrubber conundrum yep talked about that last week at the [TS]

00:07:31   streaming television boxes in my big complaint aside from the video not [TS]

00:07:36   playing at all is that TV streaming television stations none of them do [TS]

00:07:40   moving around in the content and a reliable manner and I compared it to [TS]

00:07:46   YouTube web browser which sometimes is weird flaky in html5 player may or may [TS]

00:07:51   not be playing nicely with your browser but there's a little scrubber thing we [TS]

00:07:54   can you know little circular hand on the timeline he could move to different [TS]

00:07:57   positions and the video moves around eventually and any streaming television [TS]

00:08:02   boxes very frequently attempting to do anything with your position other than [TS]

00:08:06   play at what speed now he doesn't work as a result in a series of spinners are [TS]

00:08:11   blank screens but can very often lose your place and then your check back to [TS]

00:08:15   the beginning this happens by the way the worst case scenario is this your [TS]

00:08:18   children are on the couch watching a movie there 30 or 40 minutes in one of [TS]

00:08:22   them actually sits on part of the remote potential because they have to get out [TS]

00:08:27   of luck in there was still plenty of the TV it starts to fast-forward or rewind [TS]

00:08:31   or or do something we do one of those those actions and that throws things [TS]

00:08:35   into a tizzy and then you try to deposit it play again but maybe the baby is gone [TS]

00:08:39   too far forward or back or something and just lose place and now your kid is a [TS]

00:08:44   maybe they want the movie to resume playing where was but you're back at the [TS]

00:08:48   beginning of the movie and you can get to where they were even if you know the [TS]

00:08:51   exact time stamp because hey how would you get there you would have to remove [TS]

00:08:55   the scrubber essentially to that position and you have no way of doing [TS]

00:08:58   that because password doesn't work it just you know there's no jump is no [TS]

00:09:01   whatever it so this does not identify with me just emphasize that like I'm not [TS]

00:09:07   asking for let me smoothly scan through while seeing the video go by really fast [TS]

00:09:13   like the equivalent of video smart speed like I understand is there something [TS]

00:09:15   transcoding down there is only you can just magically slide forward and [TS]

00:09:21   backward in time while seeing the video flash before your eyes and variable [TS]

00:09:25   rates of speed when the video is actually being transcode on the fly by [TS]

00:09:28   some weak CPU and [TS]

00:09:29   nasa your basement or something right the minimum I'm asking for is one don't [TS]

00:09:35   lose my place no matter what I do and to give me the ability to in sort of [TS]

00:09:40   QuickTime Player parlance are you two pounds [TS]

00:09:43   move described her to an arbitrary position and start playing from there I [TS]

00:09:47   don't see anything that happens make this me entirely black in fact that [TS]

00:09:50   prefer that I hate it when I can't move the little screw everything both the [TS]

00:09:54   desktop an honest review box where it says no no no no you can't you can't [TS]

00:09:58   move that thing you have to wait for me due to load some are thumbnails our [TS]

00:10:02   streams of content and transcode things like just stop stop the video entirely [TS]

00:10:06   I'm gonna move the scrubber to position it's going to change the time stamp on [TS]

00:10:10   the corner [TS]

00:10:11   change the time stamp by all means as I move discover round when I'm done I say [TS]

00:10:15   now try to start playing from thirty minutes and 42 seconds now you can [TS]

00:10:19   resume whatever it is you're doing and and and and people run and tell you all [TS]

00:10:22   you understand but be friends and h264 symbolic I understand that this was also [TS]

00:10:28   difficult but this i think is the minimum bar for any device that plays [TS]

00:10:32   video don't lose my place and give me some way to start an arbitrary location [TS]

00:10:36   anything above and beyond that you wanna do find do whatever it is you have to do [TS]

00:10:41   to make that happen [TS]

00:10:42   free scan all the movies to find offsets find the closest offset to the thing [TS]

00:10:46   that I picked and try to play from there and only show the picture once you get [TS]

00:10:49   into it like whatever you do do it but I just want emphasized that I'm not asking [TS]

00:10:53   for the magic ability to see the video fly past my eyes it fast and slow speeds [TS]

00:10:59   because I understand it's very difficult course that would be nice and I'm hoping [TS]

00:11:01   that will happen someday but we're very far from that now fair enough [TS]

00:11:07   right well in how about the Koenigsegg and the odd model name that none of us [TS]

00:11:13   can figure out how you pronounce it yet apparently it's it's like we mentioned [TS]

00:11:17   it like the ratio 1 partial power to one kilogram or whatever but the name ont [TS]

00:11:22   colon and numeral one is pronounced 121 it's not 11 although I like 11 better [TS]

00:11:27   but anyway people want to know if you are considering buying what is 2.4 [TS]

00:11:32   million three million dollar hypercar it's called the 121 not the one [TS]

00:11:37   one that just sounds like going to visit a psychiatrist's office or something [TS]

00:11:41   like that let's have a one to 10 2011 2010 ones at work I don't think we call [TS]

00:11:46   them that but yes I do have a meeting with check the parking lot [TS]

00:11:50   Marco it's so hard to be retired isn't it but yeah we have meetings with our [TS]

00:11:56   immediate supervisors which we which we call personal development something PDP [TS]

00:12:01   personnel and planning something like that that's worse that sounds awful know [TS]

00:12:05   it sufficiently corporate speak which is funny because our company is all about [TS]

00:12:08   70 people or something like that but he yep that's a thing [TS]

00:12:13   PowerPC Macs and x86 hardware compatibility 11 percent over the story [TS]

00:12:19   that I thought was funny we're talking about the the rarity of these Macs that [TS]

00:12:22   had x86 hardware in them and they were indeed rare and Martin Road in to tell [TS]

00:12:27   us about his experience but these things he had a set of the forget which model [TS]

00:12:32   was but it's the 6100 cases the first to like to use this case you guys look at [TS]

00:12:38   the picture that I like they're in the shower it was the pizza box mac very [TS]

00:12:42   wide to very low optical drive in the middle floppy drive on the right and the [TS]

00:12:48   hard drive on the last and they had a bunch of people who were PC users [TS]

00:12:53   essentially using these because they sold the very end of this with a [TS]

00:12:57   different model number that had 46 insider maybe with a Pentium anyways I'm [TS]

00:13:03   x86 chip inside it and they had a problem when these PC users but use [TS]

00:13:07   these machines and you if you read this feedback you probably didn't spoil the [TS]

00:13:11   surprise but if you haven't read the feedback Marco perhaps take a look at [TS]

00:13:15   the picture and tell me the show was rigged to a baby shower together [TS]

00:13:21   looking at his picture 1 but problem my PC users have with this Mac as soon as I [TS]

00:13:25   saw the picture I didn't actually make it to the to the rest of the feedback to [TS]

00:13:30   see why the picture was being cited and the moment I saw the picture I knew [TS]

00:13:34   exactly where this feedback was going so I know people remember this is this just [TS]

00:13:39   so long ago the big thing for the Mac platform was that it had auto inject an [TS]

00:13:45   auto eject floppy drives hardware wise so auto injector meant that when you [TS]

00:13:50   push the floppy disk in a certain point the mechanism would like something out [TS]

00:13:54   of your hand and see it and auto eject means that the ejection was done by but [TS]

00:14:01   initiated by the drive itself and in the operating system and the ejection be [TS]

00:14:05   triggered by the wonderfully intuitive to PC users activity of dragging the [TS]

00:14:11   disc that had all the important files on it to the trash that was a short but you [TS]

00:14:15   can also select additions like the jack from the File menu which was totally [TS]

00:14:17   interred anyway yes you would initiate the the unmount essentially from the OS [TS]

00:14:23   and unlike PCs were you good eject the disc at any time by pressing a button [TS]

00:14:28   next to the thing and you know the OS might complain if you did that if you [TS]

00:14:32   did it when the light was blinking then you may have heard at all sorts of other [TS]

00:14:35   things that relied on the user to sort of know when it's safe to eject the disc [TS]

00:14:39   the Mac operating system goes to control over magic media and and you aren't [TS]

00:14:43   involved in the process of ejecting the disc from a hardware perspective [TS]

00:14:46   software respected you on man to the desk in the active on mounting it also [TS]

00:14:50   rejected because the mechanisms all have the ability two centuries back at you so [TS]

00:14:54   when PC users use this Mac they would see the floppy drive to stick the disc [TS]

00:15:00   in and maybe they didn't notice the auto injector might've been gone by then I [TS]

00:15:04   don't know anyone and they do their thing both right and when they were done [TS]

00:15:08   with their desk they would do it all PCs years do as I guess look at look at the [TS]

00:15:12   drive to see if any blinking lights near it is no blinking lights press the [TS]

00:15:15   button to eject the disc unfortunately on this pizza box mac the button that [TS]

00:15:20   was in the lower right corner below the floppy drive was not a disconnect fun [TS]

00:15:25   there is no disconnect but another [TS]

00:15:26   tiny hole you can see there were you stick a paperclip to get it out when the [TS]

00:15:30   thing freezes it was the power button to the entire machine so everybody when [TS]

00:15:33   they were done and want to check their floppy disk and press the power button [TS]

00:15:36   machine tournament I machine oh nice which must have been hilarious but still [TS]

00:15:41   in PC users at the time defense which I was one if you look at this machine the [TS]

00:15:47   CD ROM Drive immediately adjacent to this has a physical eject button so it [TS]

00:15:52   looks like two drives side-by-side with each with an eject button if you're [TS]

00:15:59   coming from though the paradigm it does make sense although I mean there is a [TS]

00:16:01   giant power symbol on the paradigm separate separately from the paradigm [TS]

00:16:05   this is like a consistency design flaw which is that there is an eject button [TS]

00:16:10   right next to it in in the spot you'd expect and so it looks like here you [TS]

00:16:14   don't hear the whole four disks here the whole floppies here the eject button [TS]

00:16:17   from here the check button for puppies they're very differently sized ones Mike [TS]

00:16:22   said one of the police believe you press the if you press the optical drive but [TS]

00:16:27   it wouldn't actually inject because they believe the operating system had control [TS]

00:16:31   over it is this it IT hardware eject button on the optical drives on my Mac [TS]

00:16:35   Pro two you just have to slide open a little guilty indoors and Chevy little [TS]

00:16:38   finger and you can fuck yeah they also don't work on you know until the USA [TS]

00:16:44   checked it but still i mean you're saying this is a problem with PC users [TS]

00:16:49   I'm saying this is a very confusing designed for everybody [TS]

00:16:53   well it wasn't wasn't confusing for Mac users it's a parent and things like do [TS]

00:16:56   you think the operating system has control over floppy disks or do you [TS]

00:17:00   think in the user has control over it and the right answers to have the OS [TS]

00:17:04   have control over but if you come from the other thing where would you think [TS]

00:17:06   the user has control over and you're looking for a button and you can get [TS]

00:17:09   whatever but you find and that's the only buttons remotely near there so [TS]

00:17:12   that's the one you go ahead and the new gonna be said the right answer is floppy [TS]

00:17:16   disks are always awful and we're so clever pass them anything with [TS]

00:17:21   even even thumb drives now I feel like we have the same exact problem we [TS]

00:17:25   haven't gotten rid of it people stick a thumb drive into computer [TS]

00:17:27   desktop files back and forth and they just want to yank the thumb drive out [TS]

00:17:31   and if you do that on a Mac and yells at you it says whoa whoa whoa whoa that was [TS]

00:17:35   not properly rejected by both lost and above all please log back in Baba blah [TS]

00:17:39   but by then it's too late I do like cameras because some of my cameras can [TS]

00:17:43   be unplugged at any time and other cameras have to be unmounted from iPhoto [TS]

00:17:47   or whatever before they can be unplugged and I forget I forget which is which he [TS]

00:17:51   and some important programs will automatically eject the camera logically [TS]

00:17:54   after its imported in some won't so that's also another level of confusion [TS]

00:17:58   here and the power button on the camera even if you don't unplug the USB cable [TS]

00:18:02   what if you just turn on the camera that will also and effectively unmounted [TS]

00:18:06   fun anyway removable media is confusing and then the final piece of follow-up we [TS]

00:18:14   have is a important service announcement for listeners of the show and I think [TS]

00:18:20   John that you are best equipped to handle this I feel kind of bad talking [TS]

00:18:24   about this how many episodes every in over a hundred right hundred and twelve [TS]

00:18:28   so someone who endured a tax ATX and our feedback form as their name says that he [TS]

00:18:36   may listen to the show and he's using the iOS podcast app on iPhone 6 and he [TS]

00:18:42   says he'll ATP and only ATP to the podcast and jumped around wildly within [TS]

00:18:47   the episode first few times I thought it was because one edition had finished and [TS]

00:18:51   it jumped in the middle of the one before that I hadn't finished but with [TS]

00:18:54   the bombshell I'm certain that I heard the outro and then again discussion [TS]

00:18:58   about jobs versus cook and then about this leads me to suspect that there some [TS]

00:19:03   evil commercial break a chapter food for thought their podcast up was buggy and [TS]

00:19:10   this is a reasonable conclusion right if you are new especially if you're new to [TS]

00:19:14   the shower and I think we talked about this on Twitter and a bunch of people [TS]

00:19:17   replied so I'll spoil the secret is not really a secret the format of the show [TS]

00:19:24   is we talk about technology stuff we have a bunch a sponsor breaks then a [TS]

00:19:29   song by Jonathan man plays where he reads out our Twitter handles and tells [TS]

00:19:34   you where you can find the show notes and says now the show is over [TS]

00:19:37   right now the show is over didn't even mean to be in you know hope though and [TS]

00:19:42   after that song is over the show continues often for a substantial period [TS]

00:19:47   of time that's what we call the after show and like it did in shots here to [TS]

00:19:53   the secret menu at in-n-out knowing which by the way I've never been to I [TS]

00:19:58   would like to try but have never been really never been in California but [TS]

00:20:03   haven't been to one of my life there anyway it's not really a secret menu [TS]

00:20:06   everybody knows about it but if you really really don't know about it it's [TS]

00:20:11   not going to occur to you that it exists so if you really really don't know about [TS]

00:20:14   the after show when the song says now the show is over you know you turn the [TS]

00:20:18   thing off or go to the next podcast right you never know that there's [TS]

00:20:21   anything after it I think actually that's ok if you want to stop listening [TS]

00:20:26   to the show there whether accidentally or on purpose I think that's fine [TS]

00:20:29   because the way to structure the show is we try to talk about all the things [TS]

00:20:32   we're going to talk about before the song and then after the song we feel [TS]

00:20:36   like we are free to talk about whatever we want well thats cars something silly [TS]

00:20:41   that we did but sometimes it's also reflecting on the show we just had and [TS]

00:20:46   talking about the same targets from a different angle maybe in a more casual [TS]

00:20:49   way that's the after show and i was just an upgrade of its agents known we were [TS]

00:20:54   talking about the format of the show what distinguishes the after show from [TS]

00:20:57   the rest of the show isn't it just more of the same sometimes it seems like that [TS]

00:21:01   but from our perspective is like we feel like the show is over and now we are [TS]

00:21:04   talking about I don't know like even if we didn't record it will probably have [TS]

00:21:09   to that same the conversation after the show but we do recorded and there's also [TS]

00:21:13   stuff that happens after the the song that we don't put in the show right so [TS]

00:21:17   there is some distinction between the after show and then like the sort of [TS]

00:21:20   stuff that's just what libelous anyway if you have to listen to the show her [TS]

00:21:24   how many episodes and had no idea that after the song we kept talking we do and [TS]

00:21:29   you can feel free to listen to it if you want or not like whatever you can listen [TS]

00:21:33   however you want but what I was surprised by Twitter with many people [TS]

00:21:37   said they had to show for like 20 episodes before they realize the show [TS]

00:21:41   continued after the song and that blows my mind if only because like the lazy [TS]

00:21:45   thing to do is just like just let it keep playing like let's play our next [TS]

00:21:49   guest list [TS]

00:21:50   pit stop in manually delete the podcast or something like you just let it play [TS]

00:21:53   the song will end and we will continue talking so anybody can do it again today [TS]

00:21:58   we've been doing it since the advent of the song I think there is the show and [TS]

00:22:03   there's the song and there is the after show and that is the podcast that you're [TS]

00:22:07   listening to [TS]

00:22:07   if you didn't know that your mind is now open and will end and we also I mean [TS]

00:22:11   exacerbate this problem not only by never actually saying you know we'll see [TS]

00:22:16   you in the after show he not not by pronouncing it but also one common [TS]

00:22:20   complaint that we get especially from other listeners the show that live in my [TS]

00:22:25   house are you at the there's no like sound or anything to indicate when the [TS]

00:22:32   actual actress Joanna like when the actual episode file ends there is no [TS]

00:22:37   like closing sound or goodbye so it's very it's very easy to miss the end of [TS]

00:22:43   one episode transitioning into the beginning of the next one [TS]

00:22:47   yeah yeah that's true that is also true I don't particularly find that to be a [TS]

00:22:52   bad thing but I understand people not being confused by that I guess what you [TS]

00:22:57   can use the visual marker looking for playback app like the little plaid get [TS]

00:23:00   to the end and there are audio markers from we start talking about cars and as [TS]

00:23:07   an audio marker for when he mentioned HFS plus the secret menu in and out it [TS]

00:23:15   is very similar like you learn these things and I just listened to a lot of [TS]

00:23:21   shows are being in the community people listen to a lot of shows that it becomes [TS]

00:23:24   just accepted that the format of the show but if you don't know the things [TS]

00:23:28   you can still go there and order a burger and it s fine like stopped [TS]

00:23:32   listening whenever you feel like you wanna stop listening but if you are [TS]

00:23:33   unaware that we keep talking we do is we can show you know there's two [TS]

00:23:37   interesting pieces here to me anyway the first is for the three of you that [TS]

00:23:42   listen to the show that also look at the show nodes we clearly delineate that [TS]

00:23:47   there is a post-show section that has usually links and bullet bullet items [TS]

00:23:54   that are in no way related to anything that we have said thus far in the [TS]

00:23:58   episode in so maybe this is a lesson to everyone that you should consider [TS]

00:24:02   looking at the show no [TS]

00:24:03   that market and I work on every single week mostly you where can you find the [TS]

00:24:07   show notes casey you can find the show notes for your ATP program at ATP . FM / [TS]

00:24:13   episode number which in this case will be 112 so thats ATP . FM / 112 you're [TS]

00:24:20   supposed to sing the line from the song it's so informative I can't sing but you [TS]

00:24:26   can find the show notes that ATP . FM that's right it's really are you know [TS]

00:24:30   you literally can find them there I believe you can have some six months [TS]

00:24:34   from now I believe you can find them that's all that's there like that is the [TS]

00:24:39   only thing on the same series of shows but numbers in China that tomorrow if [TS]

00:24:44   you're in if you're listening to some overcast you can swipe up on the album [TS]

00:24:47   are we know that people don't know that's not also my fault yes I i do [TS]

00:24:52   blink the scroll indicator the way as system standard is like when the screen [TS]

00:24:55   shows up but no one knows that and it's really hard to make it really easy to [TS]

00:24:58   miss so yet that that is a bad design on my part that I have yet to figure out [TS]

00:25:03   how to resolve in a way that I don't heat but once you know that it's there [TS]

00:25:07   like the at the show if you're using overcast you're looking at the Now [TS]

00:25:10   Playing screen that shows the big level meters in the Big John album art just [TS]

00:25:14   put your finger on that album art and slide upwards 10 you will see the shots [TS]

00:25:17   and then the other interesting thing to me that I find a little bit surprising [TS]

00:25:21   this is kind of building up what you were saying john is we start the after [TS]

00:25:26   show the polls show immediately after the song ends this isn't like in 1997 [TS]

00:25:31   secret song at the end of the CD I have like a 30 minute track 25 minutes of [TS]

00:25:36   witches or 20 minutes of silence and then all of a sudden you have this new [TS]

00:25:41   song twenty minutes after you thought the CD was over like it to meeting its [TS]

00:25:45   so I agree with you that that it's a little kooky to me that people would [TS]

00:25:49   think of the songs over well better go change my podcast in not just let it run [TS]

00:25:55   its course but you know they stop it because they don't hear this time it [TS]

00:25:59   just seems the song starts like well as a top rate is a reasonable assumption so [TS]

00:26:03   anyway I tax your podcast player is almost certainly not broken but it's [TS]

00:26:08   just the way we structure the show why we do it that way [TS]

00:26:11   I'm not entirely sure but it is what we do and this is the show let's talk about [TS]

00:26:16   something that's awesome [TS]

00:26:17   our first budget this week is igloo igloo is an internet you will actually [TS]

00:26:22   like igloo software dot com slash ATP now corporate internets are usually [TS]

00:26:29   really miserable things a clue is the internet really done right it is done by [TS]

00:26:35   people who who are familiar with the modern web and who respect innovations [TS]

00:26:40   from the modern web things like you know counters microblogs file-sharing task [TS]

00:26:45   management things like Twitter things like quickies all this and it brings all [TS]

00:26:49   this to the corporate internet space and so you can actually have like modern [TS]

00:26:54   functionality and also really good design and of course you know actual [TS]

00:26:59   functionality on on mobile devices all this stuff it brings all this to an area [TS]

00:27:04   that usually is pretty short of his features let's be honest so with a glue [TS]

00:27:09   you can share news organize your files coordinate counters and manage projects [TS]

00:27:13   all in one place it really combined the best of all these consumer web apps it [TS]

00:27:18   with productivity apps and with the needs of the enterprise all double [TS]

00:27:23   privately and securely for your company or small group you're a clue interest is [TS]

00:27:29   highly functional stylish and easy to use with a widget based drag-and-drop [TS]

00:27:32   interface to change it up or customized are setting up the way you like there's [TS]

00:27:37   an upgrade recently called Viking it basically it revamped how you interact [TS]

00:27:41   with documents how you gather feedback and you make changes you can track [TS]

00:27:45   changes you can track who has read documents you can you can require people [TS]

00:27:49   to agree to that they read certain documents for certain legal RHR [TS]

00:27:53   compliance reasons read receipts an email but less annoying this is very [TS]

00:27:59   important for certain policies of the legal reasons and everything and all [TS]

00:28:02   this is built on their very advanced platform all with modern responsive [TS]

00:28:07   html5 and that's why it worked on mobile devices so whatever customizations you [TS]

00:28:12   make they work on the mobile view it's fully responsive and they've crammed so [TS]

00:28:17   much into html5 you don't need some like you know Flash or Java whatever if you [TS]

00:28:21   only preview and office document for example they built their previewing [TS]

00:28:25   engine alt html5 so that that will work on a device no matter what you know even [TS]

00:28:31   if even if there's no flash because you're a good person [TS]

00:28:33   evening doesn't have flash it'll still work even if you're on an iPhone and [TS]

00:28:37   Android device even a blackberry it even works fully fully functionally on [TS]

00:28:42   blackberrys they really are committed to making sure it works on every device and [TS]

00:28:48   the end when new devices at the market with his new screen size or anything [TS]

00:28:51   igloo already works on them so if your company has a legacy internet that looks [TS]

00:28:55   like it was built in the nineties you should really give a clue a try and it's [TS]

00:28:59   free to use for as long as you want for groups of 10 or fewer people and for [TS]

00:29:04   larger groups it is very reasonably priced check it out [TS]

00:29:07   igloo software dot com slash ATP thanks let a little rain so we are recording [TS]

00:29:14   this on Wednesday April 8th and this morning at about eight o'clock in the [TS]

00:29:22   one true time zone the watch embargo was lifted so we had a lot of reading to do [TS]

00:29:28   and I'm assuming Marco that you read none of it I actually read most of them [TS]

00:29:33   I read all the ones I found so far I really enjoyed the one at the verge by [TS]

00:29:38   Nilay Patel even though he hates me because he really gave his and and [TS]

00:29:44   Joanna stern's a wall street journal of those at the former to favorites because [TS]

00:29:49   they really gave a lot of like Hannah like the everyday usage like what like [TS]

00:29:54   what what really are the pros and the cons to the everyday usage of these [TS]

00:29:58   things and is also both of them really good videos I'm very good pictures so I [TS]

00:30:03   I was very impressed by these and I what do you guys think of what you've seen so [TS]

00:30:09   far like this make you is at roughly what you expected to make you more or [TS]

00:30:13   less excited about the watch is one thing I noticed was that none of them [TS]

00:30:17   really said oh my god this is amazing it's a blockbuster yeah yeah almost all [TS]

00:30:21   of them were like yet it's pretty good at a certain things pretty well certain [TS]

00:30:26   things aren't so great it's definitely a virgin 10 what do you think you know I [TS]

00:30:30   read a handful of them I did not rejoin us turns I did read anyway Patel's and I [TS]

00:30:35   agree with you Marco that I thought that was excellent I like the way I like the [TS]

00:30:39   way that he had raised it or converted from the perspective here's what I did [TS]

00:30:45   throughout the day it also really made me feel gross that I kinda like the [TS]

00:30:48   scroll hijacking frames of video as I know I should hate that but I actually [TS]

00:30:52   kinda liked it so I had that so much and that's that's the one thing like it was [TS]

00:30:57   ranting about this to you privately earlier but it oh my god modern web [TS]

00:31:02   design drives me crazy because it used to be back [TS]

00:31:06   back in the day of five years ago not that long ago it used to be the most [TS]

00:31:11   distracting thing as a web page that would make it difficult to read articles [TS]

00:31:14   were ads all over the sides and top now the most distracting thing about web [TS]

00:31:19   pages is the content because it's jammed with all this crazy designs girl jacking [TS]

00:31:24   stuff in a meeting in when you scroll and flying in and everything it's [TS]

00:31:28   horrendous I like oh my god it is so hard for me to read a modern music's [TS]

00:31:35   over design web pages like it's like these companies have way way way too [TS]

00:31:41   much money and resources devoted to over producing these articles when and when [TS]

00:31:47   the reality is like if you would have put UEFA tells article into John [TS]

00:31:53   Gruber's layout it would have been just as good [TS]

00:31:56   like it it gain nothing from having this giant like overwrought scroll jacki [TS]

00:32:03   we're loading distracting animated garbage all all in and out and [TS]

00:32:07   throughout it and and it wasn't just him and I saw the other one I someone in a [TS]

00:32:10   Bloomberg was pretty good but just a policy that will also had not as [TS]

00:32:15   egregious but similar over designed issues I don't know why this isn't style [TS]

00:32:20   right now but I don't remember I was trying to remember the terms of this but [TS]

00:32:23   they were but they called splashed things are entryways our gateways I'm [TS]

00:32:28   mercifully forgotten this term when you made a site you had to have a screen [TS]

00:32:33   that you had to go through to get to the site first the splash page designers [TS]

00:32:37   wanted to show off and they wanted to they wanted to establish their brand [TS]

00:32:42   they were they were accustomed to them are linear [TS]

00:32:44   kind of sort of linear storytelling thing where you have a title sequence in [TS]

00:32:48   the front of your thing or you have a cover page for a magazine or book or a [TS]

00:32:52   title page her amazing story and they said before anyone gets to my whatever I [TS]

00:32:57   want to show them are awesome logo and maybe you'll be animated movie sparkly [TS]

00:33:01   stars around on the click-through logo to get through it [TS]

00:33:04   landing page portal page of people saying I'm almost don't want to remember [TS]

00:33:08   this because there was an epidemic in there was there was a lot of people who [TS]

00:33:12   are railing against this album is one of them to say this is not how you designed [TS]

00:33:16   the Bristol people can come to your condom anywhere second of all just get [TS]

00:33:18   to the content and that trend went away people say you can't do that cuz it [TS]

00:33:22   makes no sense people don't go through there if you try to read them to just [TS]

00:33:26   get right to the content right and we had some of the middle period where [TS]

00:33:29   things come down and now marcus said people are able to incorporate all those [TS]

00:33:35   instincts to to show off their brand to make things that are visually [TS]

00:33:39   stimulating to highlight the technical child to make a sort of movies to turn [TS]

00:33:44   but an article instead of more of a movie or a slideshow with this [TS]

00:33:47   transitions between paragraphs and screens and one picture fades into the [TS]

00:33:51   next in the background of the animated showing a clip from the relevant to the [TS]

00:33:56   thing the Texas talking about next to it it's the resurgence of those those [TS]

00:34:01   landing pages or splash pages only integrated into the article and I are [TS]

00:34:04   gonna go one further and say I I have a theory about why this bothers me [TS]

00:34:08   specifically and it's not just the stuff that's on the verge as a reporter going [TS]

00:34:12   off on the watch thing but i wanna talk about this much attention I'm even [TS]

00:34:17   annoyed by web pages where when I scroll the webpage the you know basically [TS]

00:34:22   position fixed and CSS anything on the page doesn't like what's the big deal [TS]

00:34:26   that what about just like a top menu bar like a top navigation bar that stays [TS]

00:34:30   there when you scroll writer or footer that I'm even annoyed by that because it [TS]

00:34:35   breaks my heart breaks the mental model my mental model of the scrollbar because [TS]

00:34:40   the scrollbars on the entire webpage content region and get some things [TS]

00:34:44   within that region don't scroll the scrollbars not embedded and that its [TS]

00:34:47   roll bars ER and even on their own [TS]

00:34:49   doesn't really make it better if you put like an iframe in the page for your [TS]

00:34:52   article content as you go by there I conceptualize a web page and this is you [TS]

00:34:57   know an old fashioned notion or whatever but especially when the whole bunch of [TS]

00:34:59   texts as a scrollable region and when I move the scrollbar the entire region [TS]

00:35:03   moves as a piece as if it was yes a printed page as I was not a print paid [TS]

00:35:08   to web is not printing shouldn't expect if I don't expect you to be like printed [TS]

00:35:11   all the way that you know people mean when they said I like I want to be able [TS]

00:35:15   to change the font size on the ultimate the window bigger and had the text [TS]

00:35:18   change size and when I have you not responsive design of the images and so [TS]

00:35:20   is over whenever reading along from article how everything is rendered [TS]

00:35:26   didn't hear anything like it would be a paper once I start scrolling it the [TS]

00:35:29   scrolling model is I move scrollbar content moves right and anything that [TS]

00:35:34   doesn't move is a violation of that model it's not so bad and you got a [TS]

00:35:37   header or footer but these models like all the scrollbar does like dragons let [TS]

00:35:42   us grow by just triggers the next animation sequence right you move the [TS]

00:35:45   scrollbar certain amount of nothing happens like driving you know and [TS]

00:35:48   underpowered car you push the gas pedal nothing happens right and then all of a [TS]

00:35:51   sudden the giant image that was entirely in the background that wasn't moving [TS]

00:35:54   slides up and a new one comes in and maybe to text moves but then the [TS]

00:35:58   background doesn't fit into certain point the background does move in a new [TS]

00:36:00   background comes in like 10 texts a doubt it moves up it's like the model [TS]

00:36:06   there is part the screen until you can see more texts and a bunch of crap going [TS]

00:36:10   on behind the scenes that you have no idea has any relation to how you're [TS]

00:36:13   doing is like just make more now me Apple those itself on their web pages [TS]

00:36:17   return to scroll and like these Mac Pro animations are going to just wanna get [TS]

00:36:20   down the Tech Specs sections you not sure be at the click the dot the [TS]

00:36:23   scrollbar nothing's happening oh wait now transitioning this this breaks my [TS]

00:36:27   model of the web pages looks a bit maybe I'm an old fogey but I feel like I've [TS]

00:36:31   seen enough people interact with those pages they're not sure what to do either [TS]

00:36:33   and it's like oh well I guess I did something in new taxes here maybe I can [TS]

00:36:37   read it it looks cool it's interesting Apple does it in a tasteful manner but I [TS]

00:36:41   just wanna grow and i just want to see the page move you know what [TS]

00:36:44   even Apple's product pages though like it like when the Mac Pro came out of [TS]

00:36:47   that was like one of the first ones that really irritated me that those sections [TS]

00:36:51   have to scroll between and then wait for the scroll to logically catch up from [TS]

00:36:54   the JavaScript and everything that's cool jacked everything unloaded it and [TS]

00:36:57   makes it impossible to like if you like it command up to find something in the [TS]

00:37:01   page you will actually [TS]

00:37:02   looking for then everything would break in after reloading his people just keep [TS]

00:37:07   their brands themselves i mean if these companies that that do this I mean you [TS]

00:37:11   know it's one thing for a product of the Apple that's you know they have [TS]

00:37:13   different motivations I guess that's not good but for a content company like the [TS]

00:37:18   verge or Bloomberg or any of these like big magazines if he spent half of the [TS]

00:37:28   money and resources they spent on those over designs on actually paying writers [TS]

00:37:32   and hiring more writers I think they would see a bigger return and the [TS]

00:37:36   constant we better it just seems like a tremendous waste of money to to do [TS]

00:37:42   things that ultimately annoy your readers and I like I guess you can look [TS]

00:37:47   at it and say well that kind of looks cool yeah but if you actually try to [TS]

00:37:51   read the articles it's miserable it's full of problems and what we had before [TS]

00:37:58   worked great there was no reason to change it you know you get with the [TS]

00:38:02   times she's the fun maybe you know to meet the little bit that's fine you can [TS]

00:38:07   keep it fresh and interesting without making it unreadable you know I agree [TS]

00:38:12   with everything you guys said but I got it so I actually did kinda like the [TS]

00:38:15   first so that's why they do it because it does look cool and it is interesting [TS]

00:38:20   I think you can incorporate I I can imagine you know it without breaking the [TS]

00:38:24   scrolling paradigm I can imagine a predawn flashy thing for this video go [TS]

00:38:27   and then when you know even allow you to start playing video when I scroll to the [TS]

00:38:31   region gotta do something interesting right like I'm not even opposed to that [TS]

00:38:35   entirely if it makes for a cool app because people do find it interesting [TS]

00:38:39   like it keeps your attention like you know like a jingling he's afraid of a [TS]

00:38:42   toddler who you know just like succeeding in front of a TV like things [TS]

00:38:46   are moving things a colorful things are flashy right people actually read the [TS]

00:38:50   article to me that's why the top of the article edit video review which is like [TS]

00:38:53   you know most people just watch that and feel like they're done but it's been [TS]

00:38:57   like it does a disservice to the paradigm of the web when you break [TS]

00:39:02   scrolling in that way not because scrolling it's a good ranking but just [TS]

00:39:05   simply because it's you you're inducing a custom one off mismatch between the [TS]

00:39:10   user's mental model of how scrollbar [TS]

00:39:12   works and how your thing works and your thing is gonna be different than [TS]

00:39:14   Bloomberg thing is gonna be different than everybody else's thing and it's [TS]

00:39:17   just it's that's that's not good UI design aside from all the other stuff of [TS]

00:39:22   being is a good brand name is good for traffic dude you know [TS]

00:39:26   a/b test these things and more people click when we had this crazy scrolling [TS]

00:39:29   thing like I believe it is possible to do something that still annoys Marco but [TS]

00:39:33   that is still good you I that's all I don't you'll never not you know do [TS]

00:39:38   something flashy that annoys market but do it in a way that doesn't break [TS]

00:39:42   people's knowledge about how like a scrolling region works in a page of web [TS]

00:39:48   page or anything like that it's a breaking the back button you know it's [TS]

00:39:52   like it breaks the way people interact with the web or have you tried to move a [TS]

00:39:56   window you grab the title bar between don't try to move no people do this [TS]

00:39:58   anymore because they don't understand the windows move but if you did actually [TS]

00:40:01   trying to move a window and instead of the window moving like it didn't move [TS]

00:40:05   and then all of a sudden it did move when you got halfway across the screen [TS]

00:40:08   like you know like you did that you know the things to the next level the windows [TS]

00:40:12   8 thing where snaps to fill the screen or whatever like it just didn't movie [TS]

00:40:15   Black wait I clicked and I started dragging and we know now it's moving [TS]

00:40:18   wait no that's what it's like throwing these things like we thought scrolling [TS]

00:40:22   would make the content move but now wait no it is moving those that are spinning [TS]

00:40:25   out know the background is changing terrible don't do it let me ask you guys [TS]

00:40:29   let me start with Marco when the 125 K iMac came out I remember vividly and I [TS]

00:40:34   was just looking for and I can't find it anymore date they had a picture of like [TS]

00:40:38   a guy in like a nature scene and it was hyper zoomed in on the guy and as you [TS]

00:40:42   scrolled it's doomed out indicate how big a five k images do you know what I'm [TS]

00:40:48   talking about [TS]

00:40:49   keno and then I did they put on the web there was I'm almost positive it was on [TS]

00:40:53   the web I think I recalled ok so let me start with Marco and then johnnie your [TS]

00:40:58   two cents did you like that as well or do you also find that to be distasteful [TS]

00:41:02   to a certain point Marco you're not showing your not showing text you know [TS]

00:41:07   where to go a certain point what you're doing you have an interactive and like [TS]

00:41:11   the little interactive movie right and there's a lot you get a lot of leeway if [TS]

00:41:15   it's like a marketing sliding to trying to demonstrate a feature but if i if I [TS]

00:41:19   find myself trying to read many many paragraphs of text that are you know [TS]

00:41:23   just a series of paragraphs attacks from top to bottom [TS]

00:41:26   especially something like that like the verge Apple watcher of you like it's not [TS]

00:41:30   a marketing site with two tiny paragraphs of marketing text with a [TS]

00:41:35   bunch of you know that's like infographics little animations the [TS]

00:41:38   machine spinning and exploding like I give a lot of we wait leeway for that [TS]

00:41:42   type of thing but for specifically long form text articles you have to you have [TS]

00:41:49   to serve that need first before and you have a lot less leeway I think 22 people [TS]

00:41:54   are less comfortable the idea that this is a web page anymore now it's kind of [TS]

00:41:59   like an interactive advertisement would UD / whatever thing labor sure you know [TS]

00:42:06   so real-time follow up a few people in the chat I think starting with Moyes [TS]

00:42:11   have found the page that I was talking about it is like a hiker explorer guy [TS]

00:42:16   with his arms in the air and as you scroll down the image zooms away out and [TS]

00:42:22   you see just how big the five k display is and I i completely agree with what [TS]

00:42:29   you guys are saying like I understand what you saying I think you're right but [TS]

00:42:32   there are times and this is an example and I i dont know I really thought the [TS]

00:42:36   the frame by frame video on the on the verge article I just think they're [TS]

00:42:40   really well done an interesting and I and i i enjoy it and I know why [TS]

00:42:44   conceptually in my head that I probably shouldn't like these things but I kinda [TS]

00:42:48   like you know you should that's why they put in there because they're visually [TS]

00:42:50   attractive but I like the iMac site because the whole plan that side as you [TS]

00:42:54   gonna look at like beauty shots of this thing and they're emphasizing one [TS]

00:42:58   particular part of a new zoom is cool and it does emphasize the right now part [TS]

00:43:01   because I mean it's a great example of like how do you how do you show people [TS]

00:43:04   the Retina screen when they're probably viewing it on the screen is not written [TS]

00:43:08   it's like trying to show them some 13 television but they're watching an eye [TS]

00:43:11   to DTV like and this is a clever solution we're gonna show it to you [TS]

00:43:14   zoomed it like one x pixels on your screen but then show you how much more [TS]

00:43:17   there actually is in a dramatic way and this page is mostly pictures and sort of [TS]

00:43:22   infographics right it's not [TS]

00:43:25   tax I think there's a little bit of a hit in the middle of the SME section [TS]

00:43:28   because the image stop scrolling the text keeps drawing but then the image [TS]

00:43:31   catches up again and it's a little bit cranky but overall this like less than a [TS]

00:43:36   thousand words or text them as they will probably less than 500 words of Texas [TS]

00:43:39   state line 44 the verge thing that's thousands upon thousands of words of [TS]

00:43:44   text and impairs the readability of that text in the comfort of reading that text [TS]

00:43:49   and I i get home I'm afraid that I miss a paragraph did one of the animations [TS]

00:43:53   scroll something away I missed an entire section that in realize it because I [TS]

00:43:57   have no connection between my action with you the page up and page down key [TS]

00:44:01   or the scrollbar this girl rely on my finger swiping or whatever and what's [TS]

00:44:04   happening on the screen very easy to actually do stuff they started [TS]

00:44:08   disconnect mister think so [TS]

00:44:10   time and place for everything and you're not wrong to enjoy the cool animated [TS]

00:44:14   effects are not wrong to enjoy the video I thought the video was pretty well done [TS]

00:44:17   as well but it does not serve the needs of the text very well yeah I agree with [TS]

00:44:22   that and I should point out this for 25 k I'm excited that you're saying is fine [TS]

00:44:26   the first time I've loaded it it didn't load properly and I like it mostly lower [TS]

00:44:30   after installing and it popped in and broke and and the thing in the middle of [TS]

00:44:34   it catches and girls again that broke and these are assuming this is this is [TS]

00:44:40   like the like the Facebook designer problem we're like all these these new [TS]

00:44:46   facebook apps are so often designed to assume that all your friends are like [TS]

00:44:50   beautiful models with three photography that are going on vacation in California [TS]

00:44:54   and lake with its assuming that it's all gonna load immediately and and and the [TS]

00:45:02   person navigating is going to navigate exactly the way you expect them to in [TS]

00:45:06   exactly the way you want them to stop and see every section and it's just [TS]

00:45:10   reality doesn't work that way and the web to daily to standard web is very [TS]

00:45:16   adaptable to a reality works when properly designed it if it falls back so [TS]

00:45:22   that it you know if they haven't loaded fully it still works for the most part [TS]

00:45:26   if you do your job rate if you want to jump around you can do that if if [TS]

00:45:31   something weirdly break source transformed or using some kind of [TS]

00:45:34   assistive technology to actually transform the content or read it in [TS]

00:45:37   different ways [TS]

00:45:37   weighs nothing breaks for the most part like if you do your job right the web [TS]

00:45:42   falls back gracefully graceful degradation does not work very well [TS]

00:45:46   these things exactly it doesn't work at all usually usually breaks horribly and [TS]

00:45:50   you're lucky you can even see any of the content especially anything off the [TS]

00:45:54   first page and there's more like ads because unlike their their optimized for [TS]

00:45:58   the first time experience but if you want to go back to that page like this [TS]

00:46:01   with the Mac Pro pages for a great example like we all went to it and so [TS]

00:46:05   it's like you know whatever when the next time you go you like I want to get [TS]

00:46:09   to the GPU section as fast as possible and you can't just take the scroll down [TS]

00:46:14   to 75 percent down the bottom of it is that you remember like the GPU section [TS]

00:46:18   was near the end you can't just do that I think happens all the way through [TS]

00:46:21   these animations to have to click through them what do I have to do now [TS]

00:46:24   you're playing a game at like a puzzle game on iOS we're like you know what [TS]

00:46:27   you're playing mister yet to figure out what do I poked which takes a hit what I [TS]

00:46:31   have to do to I just have to wait here you just wanna learn about the GPU it is [TS]

00:46:34   not as soon as you start using it as an informational thing there is you know it [TS]

00:46:39   falls down we respond to this week by Audible there the leading provider of [TS]

00:46:45   downloadable audiobooks but over a hundred and fifty thousand titles and [TS]

00:46:49   virtually every genre and they're always adding new titles so if you want to [TS]

00:46:54   listen to something audible has no audio books are great I mean you listen to [TS]

00:46:58   them anytime anywhere [TS]

00:47:00   audible is offering our listeners a free audiobook along with a 30 day trial go [TS]

00:47:05   to audible podcast dot com slash ATP to get your free audiobook once again [TS]

00:47:11   audible podcast dot com slash ATP now there's a book that we are supposed to [TS]

00:47:17   have been reading but we haven't yet what is that pledge on yourself I I read [TS]

00:47:23   the first in a few percentage points of it but I had a been listened to it and [TS]

00:47:29   audible of her would have gone further what book is this John that's the title [TS]

00:47:33   becoming Steve Jobs I don't even know title is that's right yeah it is the [TS]

00:47:37   latest Steve Jobs biography [TS]

00:47:40   that has been getting a lot of press this is the barbed wire has gotten [TS]

00:47:45   nearly unprecedented access to Apple executives and people who knew steve [TS]

00:47:49   obviously does not access to Steve himself anymore but is written by [TS]

00:47:53   someone who has had a many years relationship with Steve as a as a [TS]

00:47:56   journalist and the Apple executives who did talk to this author is it to other [TS]

00:48:03   book actually a 4-2 did talk to him had said have been saying in the press that [TS]

00:48:08   they like this biography and that they don't like the authorized biography [TS]

00:48:12   anyone who has listened to hypocritical knows that I also don't like the Walter [TS]

00:48:15   Isaacson biography but I'm also slightly uncomfortable with the idea of Apple [TS]

00:48:21   executives endorsing a biography is being better than some other one I mean [TS]

00:48:25   I guess it makes perfect sense like you new Steve Jobs like if you actually knew [TS]

00:48:29   him and you know he's being not well represented by another book and a new [TS]

00:48:33   book comes out that does represent him well it's natural for you to say this is [TS]

00:48:37   the better one because this is more like the Steve then I knew but it's very it's [TS]

00:48:41   like you know the appearance of impropriety like it's it's a little bit [TS]

00:48:44   weird to be endorsing about you than most people I think this is just a rival [TS]

00:48:51   is great kind of book I'm only about 10% in this book I talked about it on the [TS]

00:48:55   episode to upgrade I was really i'ma Jason Snell I talked about the first ten [TS]

00:48:59   percent of the book he has written that Jason and read the whole books we talked [TS]

00:49:01   about the entire thing we went back and forth a bit but I am reading it and [TS]

00:49:06   regardless of who these two guys read it I'm going to talk about the book when [TS]

00:49:10   I'm done reading it and I'm going to talk about an ATP so the reason you [TS]

00:49:13   should get this book on audible is so that you unlike the other two guys hey [TS]

00:49:17   hey hey hey I am like a hundred and ten pages in thank you very much I actually [TS]

00:49:22   bought it on dead trees that was a mistake probably but I S devices only [TS]

00:49:29   there is green choices to choose it anyway whatever it takes you to get if [TS]

00:49:32   you've got an audiobook you can listen to it by you walk the dog or jog or [TS]

00:49:37   whatever so that you the listener [TS]

00:49:39   done your homework and when the time comes and i'm by the way very slow [TS]

00:49:41   readers you have plenty of time to do this is going to look at the Reebok when [TS]

00:49:45   we talk about it you'll be prepared [TS]

00:49:47   perfect audible podcast dot com slash ATP to start this book or any other one [TS]

00:49:53   thanks a lot to audible for sponsoring our show alright I really am like a [TS]

00:49:58   hundred pages into that book so don't don't love me in with that Marco [TS]

00:50:02   characters Jesus to do any homework he should I do but you never you never read [TS]

00:50:06   books they know I read it on my giant iPhone on the plane on the way to [TS]

00:50:10   ireland and then promptly forgot to keep reading it once I got there I think it [TS]

00:50:15   gets better toward the end Jason the saying that the beginning part like the [TS]

00:50:18   authors don't have much first-hand experience history has a lot of stuff [TS]

00:50:20   but towards the end they get all the good interviews in new stuff comes out [TS]

00:50:23   so you should read it or listen to it I got there I I have to agree with you [TS]

00:50:27   Marco that the beginning through around about the time when when steve got fired [TS]

00:50:34   I didn't really care for it but now I feel like it's getting a little more [TS]

00:50:39   opinionated which I like and it's getting a little more interesting but it [TS]

00:50:44   was it was hard to get going for me so I don't blame you for forgetting to pick [TS]

00:50:49   it back up okay so now that we started to an aborted talking about what [TS]

00:50:53   happened we can do it again [TS]

00:50:56   it almost worked at the end of the show next week so we should probably talk [TS]

00:51:05   about the talk about the it lifted embargo in the reviews I've read so I [TS]

00:51:09   think we've already a smattering of them I've read some of the ones that Mark as [TS]

00:51:13   Read operate I've not read some of the ones that Marcos read John I assume [TS]

00:51:16   you've read all the things because you do homework even we don't want you to so [TS]

00:51:20   the interesting thing to me about this and we were talking privately about it [TS]

00:51:24   the three of us with a few other people and Steve Hackett said to us it seems [TS]

00:51:31   like a lot of the reviews are kinda disappointed a little bit especially [TS]

00:51:35   about performance in he had said and I agree we should have seen that coming [TS]

00:51:40   but it still feels a little bit surprising that that's the that's to me [TS]

00:51:46   like the most worrisome but also unsurprising part because I'm you know [TS]

00:51:52   I'm all excited as everyone else's you know which one do I get and I guess [TS]

00:51:55   we'll talk about that but like you know I want to get some is to be really [TS]

00:52:00   awesome and if I'm going to get like a nice steal one edition but if I can I [TS]

00:52:05   steal one [TS]

00:52:06   maybe the link really wanna kill you no good I said hi and on that I would [TS]

00:52:10   really want it to be like an amazing thing and it it sounds like the other [TS]

00:52:15   reviews its a first generation device and you really shouldn't be surprised by [TS]

00:52:19   that but it's a first generation device and especially the things that that [TS]

00:52:23   caught up to me that I really noticed not only does everybody say it's a [TS]

00:52:27   little bit slow sometimes which which is certainly disappointing but you can see [TS]

00:52:32   in some of the videos and one of the reviews I forget which one it might have [TS]

00:52:36   been a lie and he was one of the review said that you can you can see the air [TS]

00:52:41   gap between the screen and the cover glass or the cover sapphire and I saw [TS]

00:52:47   one of the videos too and it's it's very clear like you can see the rectangle [TS]

00:52:52   outline of the actual screen inside that nice big flat black top and it does kind [TS]

00:52:57   of ruined the illusion of his being like one seamless thing and I look at things [TS]

00:53:02   like that if it like that the the screen air gap being visible and and the [TS]

00:53:07   slowness people are talking about and i know i kno also for the slowness thing [TS]

00:53:11   you know watch kidnaps you know you can see even in the simulator on watch [TS]

00:53:17   kidnaps you can see that there's like some inherent lag in this process of [TS]

00:53:21   like kind of throwing the interface from the phone to the watch over Bluetooth [TS]

00:53:25   but just how much could actually work that's probably going to be sluggish too [TS]

00:53:29   and so it seems like there's there's a theme of this is a really cool device [TS]

00:53:35   with some really cool features however it's a little bit slow sometimes watch [TS]

00:53:38   caps a little bit slow and there's a couple of looking a little niggling [TS]

00:53:42   points like you know like that late the visible air gap on the display so I see [TS]

00:53:47   all these things that I think obviously you know its speed and display [TS]

00:53:52   elimination these are the kind of things that Apple always improves over time and [TS]

00:53:56   so I I know that version two is gonna come out and be significantly better in [TS]

00:54:02   some of these areas that's what always happens probably only a year from now [TS]

00:54:06   it's going to be that far from now and think to it the hard way so we we've all [TS]

00:54:11   heard the same rumors I think the rumors that said that this was supposed to come [TS]

00:54:15   out last fall [TS]

00:54:17   so we're kinda like six months later then if that's accurate nearly six [TS]

00:54:22   months late I'm rely on average number of these when it was shown to the public [TS]

00:54:25   last fall it sure looked at the hardware is pretty much done [TS]

00:54:29   yeah it's it seemed like the software was probably what was holding up all [TS]

00:54:33   this time and that's you know as we know from engineering that's that's way more [TS]

00:54:37   likely to be the case then the other way around it seems like this is definitely [TS]

00:54:40   like the hardware is fine the software needed more time right not not a big [TS]

00:54:44   surprise so I kind of think that we might be seeing like jet like half [TS]

00:54:49   generation older hardware if if they were going to ship this hardware last [TS]

00:54:54   fall [TS]

00:54:54   originally then what's good what's good what's the harbour gonna be like next [TS]

00:54:59   spring presumably when there is you know Apple watch to wear whatever I feel like [TS]

00:55:03   we're gonna jump ahead even further than we usually do in the first to second [TS]

00:55:07   generation migration because you had after six months rather than jumping [TS]

00:55:12   ahead a year you might jump ahead 18 months that makes sense and he very well [TS]

00:55:18   could be right in [TS]

00:55:19   in John a chance to talk here in a second but one of the things that I was [TS]

00:55:24   really looking forward to once I realized today was embargo day was [TS]

00:55:28   hoping that I could really solidify my plans for what to do because I've talked [TS]

00:55:34   on the show in and on analog about well maybe I'll get one but maybe I won't [TS]

00:55:39   which which typically in my history means I'm absolutely getting one but I [TS]

00:55:44   just haven't convinced myself yet and I gotta tell you after reading these I had [TS]

00:55:49   been hemming and hawing between one because God that $1,100 one looks like [TS]

00:55:56   one hour at least two dozen screen who knows what it's like a real life but on [TS]

00:56:00   screen looks so good inside but I don't flip flopping back and forth back and [TS]

00:56:04   forth in the one thing that I think I've concluded based on all these reviews is [TS]

00:56:08   if I'm gonna do it at all which knowing me I probably will I should definitely [TS]

00:56:12   get a sport because it sounds like I'm gonna want to replace the same here just [TS]

00:56:16   like you were saying Marco [TS]

00:56:17   John yeah I think for both of you are buying and buying when I magnin a lot of [TS]

00:56:23   these early reviews are pushing it pushing them to the sport of saying I [TS]

00:56:27   had all sorts of plans about which one is going to get it was picking and [TS]

00:56:30   choosing with matching things when I read these reviews protect people who [TS]

00:56:33   read 5 reviews of the watch all of them were thinking yeah maybe ok with sport [TS]

00:56:37   and you know if you still want Monica seems like it's cool but it's so clear [TS]

00:56:42   that you're only going to want it for a little while a couple things on the [TS]

00:56:48   water use first is that you choose knowing a lot of people who have had [TS]

00:56:54   interactions with the watch it was nice to see that there's nothing [TS]

00:57:01   unsurprisingly reviews if you know people who have gone to the press events [TS]

00:57:05   whose touch the watches who are you know have experience with everything that was [TS]

00:57:10   in the reviews everything like sort of objective not like how does this fit [TS]

00:57:17   into my life I like how does the device reform and what features does it have [TS]

00:57:20   like we knew that already I think part of that has to do with Apple's big press [TS]

00:57:23   push and the sort of long slow-motion rollout where they just released [TS]

00:57:28   information and you going to the store is a mess with them you can do it like [TS]

00:57:31   it was different then boy known as ever touch one of these things for now gonna [TS]

00:57:35   read about it and learn about all these stories were all kind of on the same [TS]

00:57:38   page in all things that we kind of knew already so it's good to see the one [TS]

00:57:43   aspect that maybe people who aren't in as close touch with people who play with [TS]

00:57:48   the watches have been surprised about the market is mention that there but [TS]

00:57:52   slower than people expected and didn't even see a lot of that even the press [TS]

00:57:55   hands on because it wasn't quite as hands-on as you would expect but the [TS]

00:58:00   fact that it feels sluggish i think is catching people little bit by surprise [TS]

00:58:02   for a couple reasons first that the first iPhone despite like if you go back [TS]

00:58:08   and look at it now actually being more sluggish than say an iPhone 6 it didn't [TS]

00:58:12   feel sluggish because they had removed everything from that the original iPhone [TS]

00:58:17   except for like the bare minimum like the entire phone was concentrating as [TS]

00:58:22   hard as I could on doing whatever it is that you establish your finger [TS]

00:58:24   hardcore it was you know it was like the old Mac menu or yell down then hold down [TS]

00:58:29   the button to pull down menu from the menu bar the entire machines Tisdale [TS]

00:58:33   began really responsive animation when you're scrambling through the menu and [TS]

00:58:37   it was necessary 128 came back just carried over for way too long because [TS]

00:58:40   you can get its act together but that whole idea of like version one of this [TS]

00:58:45   product [TS]

00:58:45   interactivity above all stopped everything else is going on the machine [TS]

00:58:48   just this one thing and then went to watch because the screen is so small and [TS]

00:58:52   peace is a very someone like there is an expectation I think they would do the [TS]

00:58:56   same thing that because it's pushing so few pixels and because the watch does so [TS]

00:59:01   that'll surely there won't be anything can happen to watch that would be [TS]

00:59:04   sluggish I mean why would it but kind of like the you know the iPhone sort of [TS]

00:59:10   pushed back to level a distraction by have incredibly weak hardware the [TS]

00:59:15   hardware in in the watch is pretty darn we can mean people talk about what the [TS]

00:59:19   s1 might be best on which a series chipset might be based on regardless of [TS]

00:59:22   which one is based on it surely under clocked right compared to what it was in [TS]

00:59:26   whatever the top and iPad iPhone that had the same CPU architecture that it is [TS]

00:59:31   a relatively weak CPU and GPU in there and unlike the original iPhone the watch [TS]

00:59:36   has to do all sorts of stuff and that brings me to the second sort of [TS]

00:59:39   realization after reading all these reviews is that I don't think things are [TS]

00:59:44   going to get all that much better for the worst case scenarios of performance [TS]

00:59:48   and people talked about I launched a watch kidnap and I just saw spinner for [TS]

00:59:52   a long time are lots of waiting screens and and a lot of the video reviews you [TS]

00:59:55   get to see the various waiting screens of the various out one shows an [TS]

00:59:59   animation of different modes of transportation when she was a little dot [TS]

01:00:02   spinner when she was just a black screen sometimes this thing doesn't launch at [TS]

01:00:05   all that's an architectural thing we're watching it apps are really iPhone apps [TS]

01:00:10   that are sort of projecting their their interface onto the phone interacting [TS]

01:00:13   back and forth across a wireless connection and there's nothing you can [TS]

01:00:19   really do with either the phone hardware or the watch hardware make them both [TS]

01:00:23   infinitely fast make them both have huge amounts of RAM make them have incredibly [TS]

01:00:26   powerful CPUs and GPUs if you're trying to do some of the remote control [TS]

01:00:31   interface you know you're gonna be constrained by opening and closing [TS]

01:00:36   connection [TS]

01:00:36   communicating over Bluetooth having interference problems caused your phone [TS]

01:00:40   is in your pocket in your pocket align with 10 for like whatever it is you [TS]

01:00:44   can't do that that's like an architectural thing that version 2 of [TS]

01:00:48   the phone is not going to fix that what's going to fix that is native phone [TS]

01:00:50   app then what's going to make it a phone apps more feasible is going to be faster [TS]

01:00:53   harder and more RAM so on and so forth that the problem will fix itself but [TS]

01:00:56   this particular model of doing third-party applications by having the [TS]

01:01:01   projected from the phone onto the watch not literally as a display poster for [TS]

01:01:05   anything but like that whole model of two devices cooperating to to work on [TS]

01:01:09   the UI together that puts kind of a ceiling on how nicely interactive this [TS]

01:01:13   is and then to add insult to injury even on the native apps it seems like in the [TS]

01:01:17   video sometimes a little study with an animation there with the swipe or [TS]

01:01:20   something like that and i dont that can be solved by hardware and software that [TS]

01:01:24   could help I can be resolved by a revision to iOS to to make things [TS]

01:01:28   smoother in the same way that they really hammered on some of the scrolling [TS]

01:01:31   table using the original versions of what was then called iPhone OS for the [TS]

01:01:36   iPhone so I think not only is the version one product definitely kind of [TS]

01:01:41   compromise but like well I guess I was a compromise in in more ways in different [TS]

01:01:48   ways the iPhone the iPhone original iPhone was compromised but had no third [TS]

01:01:52   party apps no multitasking know nothing right and so that was their compromise [TS]

01:01:56   we're going to make the things that we have really responsive in the cameras [TS]

01:01:58   you lose you lose all this functionality to compromise for the watch [TS]

01:02:01   necessarily because of the way it's done and because the way it interacts with [TS]

01:02:04   the iPhone is we can't sacrifice features interactivity we have to add [TS]

01:02:08   apps because it's just like a new week we created the App Store age and I were [TS]

01:02:11   living in it and things got out to be a big problem so you gotta have apps we [TS]

01:02:16   gotta have them in some way if we can't do native apps right away do this we [TS]

01:02:18   watched it [TS]

01:02:19   type thing we've got to have wireless communication and things going on in the [TS]

01:02:24   background because how do you know you tapping on the watch and we have a [TS]

01:02:27   telethon the phone to launch maybe that's not even launching the app we [TS]

01:02:30   have to launch a thing load that code have that code projectors display back [TS]

01:02:33   here and while that's not like that's the that is their baseline functionality [TS]

01:02:38   and involves a lot more things going on at the same time the original iPhone did [TS]

01:02:41   so it's a different set of compromises and I don't think that sluggishness is [TS]

01:02:46   gonna get better until they change and a tornado watch [TS]

01:02:50   apps call me to watch it at the end of watch out to get here until those get [TS]

01:02:56   here and those aren't going to really be great in till the hard ones offers [TS]

01:03:00   advice so I would say wait two or three regions is expected next version to be [TS]

01:03:04   the same physical form factor just maybe with a better CPU and a couple of weeks [TS]

01:03:08   and software tweaks in the third one and that's what you get into something that [TS]

01:03:12   works like they thought the first was good but it's not slamming it like [TS]

01:03:18   that's the true of all of these products right like I don't think anyone is [TS]

01:03:21   shocked by this is when you say that people think you're telling them not to [TS]

01:03:24   buy an Apple watch but like you know that that was true of the first MacBook [TS]

01:03:30   Air and or the first I reckon first retina MacBook Pro for strain iMac like [TS]

01:03:37   that's that's how things work [TS]

01:03:39   the tech world as a first gen product that the things people are citing as as [TS]

01:03:44   issues or shortcomings are not significantly worse than other first gen [TS]

01:03:49   shortcomings other product lines like it doesn't seem like there's like one fatal [TS]

01:03:53   flaw here or you know one like a really big problem it just seems like yeah you [TS]

01:03:58   know kind of slow sometimes certain things are that smooth yet you know and [TS]

01:04:01   some of the victims in software as a software matures some of it will just be [TS]

01:04:06   hardware limitation they'll have to buy a new watch for and yeah I guess we'll [TS]

01:04:10   see I agree to like that the whole designer watched it being this Bluetooth [TS]

01:04:14   projection turning the phone back and forth like that is so fragile and and [TS]

01:04:20   complicated and there's so much [TS]

01:04:22   inherent latency and weirdness there that we really do have to wait for [TS]

01:04:26   native watch absurd and it's it's it's worth asking like let's let's suppose [TS]

01:04:33   watched it absolutely don't work very well in reality it seems from the [TS]

01:04:37   reviews that might be the case that you know they might just like one of them I [TS]

01:04:41   think it was until I was really just an excuse how slow they recently you take [TS]

01:04:46   your phone in your pocket and do it on their faster than you could do i watch [TS]

01:04:48   assume let's assume the watch Cavs in reality our little bit iffy or at least [TS]

01:04:54   not quite worthwhile do you think you know people are going to judge the Apple [TS]

01:04:59   watch based on [TS]

01:05:01   watched it and and if any any flaw or shortcomings get apps have will reflect [TS]

01:05:07   badly on the watch on people's perceptions of the watch as a whole [TS]

01:05:12   do you think releasing watched it the way they did now is better overall than [TS]

01:05:18   if they hadn't released at all just said no third party apps yet have [TS]

01:05:23   notifications which is probably better to do what they did because I think [TS]

01:05:28   there is a chance that people will get the watch it all with third party apps [TS]

01:05:35   enough to let them know that I as useful as I thought they were going to be but [TS]

01:05:40   they may still end up with a product whose functionality they're happy with [TS]

01:05:46   like I'm not entirely sure that the watch loses any value by not being able [TS]

01:05:53   to have a giant world applications like I think the core functionality of [TS]

01:05:57   telling time doing the fitness tracking providing a small window into [TS]

01:06:02   notifications tapping you you know like that core set of functionality may be [TS]

01:06:09   enough to to make this product worth its value because it is it's a novelty so [TS]

01:06:14   they'll be something into that and to let people know do do I want to wear a [TS]

01:06:18   smart much is there a place for us who are smart watch in my life I don't think [TS]

01:06:23   the answer to that question hinges on the performance of or even the existence [TS]

01:06:28   of third-party apps it will be nice if they worked and maybe they'll be one or [TS]

01:06:33   two third party apps that work and I think it's important to them do it [TS]

01:06:36   because for the one or two things where they like I mostly don't use their party [TS]

01:06:39   out but I I do use you know overcast when I go running and I do this you know [TS]

01:06:43   like one or two that work well enough that they're willing to deal with the [TS]

01:06:46   compromises having them there adds value the fact that a bunch of their apps are [TS]

01:06:50   flaky or he would be there soon your phone people just right and they'll just [TS]

01:06:56   move on and I think this product lives or dies by the functionality that [TS]

01:07:00   Apple's providing in terms of is it a thing that people are going to want to [TS]

01:07:04   do and it will be a pleasant surprise and it will open up new worlds of [TS]

01:07:07   functionality in [TS]

01:07:09   watchman three years from now third party apps are really a thing and do [TS]

01:07:13   interesting stuff and have access to like you know the speaker and the camera [TS]

01:07:18   that's on the third model and the third generation models of the stuff like this [TS]

01:07:21   world will blossom but right now out of the gate I think just the core [TS]

01:07:25   functionalities enough to to set this watch on its way [TS]

01:07:30   yeah I mean I I think the the built-in functionality from day one and and this [TS]

01:07:34   one of us might even be like too much stuff it does seem a number of the [TS]

01:07:39   reviews mention this including me like it does seem that there's a there's [TS]

01:07:44   almost a lack of focus and maybe that's a good thing you know maybe this is very [TS]

01:07:49   much in a have like the 80% problem of you know eighty percent of the users are [TS]

01:07:54   going to use 2010 features but it seemed to be a different twenty percent of the [TS]

01:07:57   features for each user so I see why they give us so many options of what this [TS]

01:08:01   thing could do for us and that end and that also support the idea of it should [TS]

01:08:07   support their party asked because like what I'm going to do with it is probably [TS]

01:08:11   going to use like four built-in functions plus one or two third party [TS]

01:08:16   apps like it's not going to be a very large number of things I'm doing with it [TS]

01:08:21   but it's going to include at least one third party at least my own and and you [TS]

01:08:29   know maybe like you know clear shopping for groceries if they if they haven't [TS]

01:08:32   they do but I i suspect the number of apps on on the average person's watch is [TS]

01:08:38   gonna be pretty small if the number of apps they actually use is going to be [TS]

01:08:42   probably certainly under 10 you know that that actually is a regular basis I [TS]

01:08:49   would say it might even be under five hits and it's gonna be a small number of [TS]

01:08:53   the two me if you look at the watch the the higher the navigational hierarchy of [TS]

01:08:58   you know you go through you can see a lot of their videos now and you can see [TS]

01:09:02   if you if you play with watch Kate and see him to glance stuff and you can see [TS]

01:09:07   the hierarchy here so that when you when you first unlock it you see the case so [TS]

01:09:12   that's like environment one is the watch face and you can get notifications from [TS]

01:09:15   there and then you can go to glances from there and the glasses are getting [TS]

01:09:19   this page interface you swipe their you see your glance [TS]

01:09:22   and then tap into open the app whatever that's all right there and then you hit [TS]

01:09:26   the crown and then you go into the home screen then that whole environment zooms [TS]

01:09:31   out you get when you get the home screen a little you know the the home honeycomb [TS]

01:09:35   thing and then you can look after their what if the watch didn't have the home [TS]

01:09:40   screen part of it what if it was only the watch face with notifications on top [TS]

01:09:45   and the glasses on the bottom they waited like the way it is now the whole [TS]

01:09:48   interface the way it is now but without a home screen so that the glasses were [TS]

01:09:52   your launchers I think that not only would that be easier product to navigate [TS]

01:09:57   but I think that might even focus a little bit to help people in approving [TS]

01:10:02   the list of what they want to do to make it easier and lighter weight and take up [TS]

01:10:06   less space have fewer things need to be updated in and need to be running and [TS]

01:10:10   everything I think that might be a better product but I don't know I mean [TS]

01:10:13   time will tell you actually have these things I think the other aspect to [TS]

01:10:18   reading out looking at these reviews lined up here we have to keep in mind is [TS]

01:10:21   when people are reviewing a technology projects part of their job to sort of [TS]

01:10:25   take it through its paces they're going to dig into all the menus they're going [TS]

01:10:29   to try all the advertised features they want to evaluate you know here's the [TS]

01:10:33   nineteen things out as this can do its gonna go through everything one that's [TS]

01:10:38   not a regular people use products as a product review is used products I think [TS]

01:10:42   you are going to buy this thing and you know maybe around with it a little bit [TS]

01:10:48   but mostly it'll soon be like ambient feature discovery when a notification [TS]

01:10:53   compared with their phone notification appears they will discover the sort of [TS]

01:10:57   context sensitive replying thing is and how the wheel scroll through things when [TS]

01:11:03   they hit that button on the side will bring up the little to no contact thing [TS]

01:11:06   and that's all I can you know i can text my contacts so I can call them from the [TS]

01:11:10   watch to like they will discover things as they do them but they're not going to [TS]

01:11:14   go into every single menu and find every single feature and try them all out [TS]

01:11:17   extensively like people are not interested in fitness tracking may not [TS]

01:11:20   even know that it can cost up because they don't even care like it will be you [TS]

01:11:23   know people smart watches not a thing that most people have any familiarity [TS]

01:11:28   with all the regular watches just look at them [TS]

01:11:30   the time this is like right well we're starting from their regular watcher but [TS]

01:11:35   I'm sure you had a lot of good content concentrating on how well does it feel [TS]

01:11:38   that job the answer is not really that well because the screen capture all the [TS]

01:11:41   time but I'm sure they'll get better as time goes on anyway but that's where the [TS]

01:11:45   starting from like well I can't tell time in this much too and it looks kind [TS]

01:11:49   of nice apparently into the water bottle but then I thought look nice and also I [TS]

01:11:54   can get notifications and apparently I can text people who look I can scribble [TS]

01:11:57   things to like everything is a bonus above I can tell time I don't think [TS]

01:12:03   people are gonna buy anything like well it was $150 his every single one of the [TS]

01:12:06   apps that I tried didn't work too didn't meet my expectations like they're just [TS]

01:12:11   gonna they're going to use a small car the functionality slowly revealing [TS]

01:12:15   itself over time by the time you leavin make it at home screening get obsessed [TS]

01:12:18   with like people try to view the app's like oh I didn't go back to doing these [TS]

01:12:22   things whether they'll regret purchasing it because I think there's not enough [TS]

01:12:25   functionality I don't know but I just feel like people are not going to [TS]

01:12:30   they're not going to use it like a tech reviewer they're going to use it like a [TS]

01:12:33   regular person and you see regular people use their phones even if you give [TS]

01:12:38   a person and i phone and you don't like that but you gotta have that are you [TS]

01:12:42   don't like a tech nerd setting up to them you just give them an empty phone [TS]

01:12:45   and let them use it it may be a long time before they even tap on the icon [TS]

01:12:49   that comes on the phone could be months before that happens right that's how [TS]

01:12:51   regular people use products and all that it is you know is in Apple's favor here [TS]

01:12:57   because the longer people take to sort of take the watch through its paces the [TS]

01:13:00   more equipped Apple hopefully will be with its hardware and software stack and [TS]

01:13:04   potentially its next model watch just say oh that's actually much better now [TS]

01:13:07   I'm really curious what to make of all of this because I like I was saying [TS]

01:13:15   earlier that I feel like my anticipation which was tempered but enthusiastic [TS]

01:13:21   nonetheless I feel like there's been some water poured on that fire and now [TS]

01:13:26   I'ma lot less sure what I wanna do and I'm pretty darn sure unless I have some [TS]

01:13:32   sort of epiphany tomorrow that come Friday morning whenever it is I wake up [TS]

01:13:37   I'm not gonna be waking up in the middle of the night i think im just gonna [TS]

01:13:40   schedule a trial [TS]

01:13:41   and then see where to go from there because my livelihood doesn't depend on [TS]

01:13:46   it like Marcos sort of does and I don't know if this is if it's really worth [TS]

01:13:52   jumping in the first generation and you could consider all that claim [TS]

01:13:57   Chatterjee's against me in like three weeks but for now I'm really not sure [TS]

01:14:02   what to make of it in one of the things I wanted to discuss was a few of the [TS]

01:14:06   more interesting things have noted here that all of us have noted news reviews [TS]

01:14:10   and one of the common themes I heard was well you know it's being sold as a way [TS]

01:14:15   to get back to real life so you can just quickly glanced at whatever it is that's [TS]

01:14:20   just come in and then you can go back to the things that actually matter and I [TS]

01:14:24   was really looking forward to that because i dont have a lot of self [TS]

01:14:27   control when it comes to hear my phone and I thought well maybe i'd be able to [TS]

01:14:30   glance down at my watch and move on and a lot of these reviews are saying WOW [TS]

01:14:34   factor quote nearly so far mostly used to watch either alone in an office [TS]

01:14:41   environment but it's really different to have a SmartWatch in a bar here even [TS]

01:14:45   small distractions make you seem like a jerk sony's trying to describe the [TS]

01:14:49   project to me and find ways to work together but I keep clancy my wrist [TS]

01:14:52   hurts to see extremely on important emails fly-by it turns out that checking [TS]

01:14:56   your watch over and over again as a gesture that carries a lot of cultural [TS]

01:14:59   wait eventually soon he asked me if I need to be somewhere else where both [TS]

01:15:02   embarrassment and I've mostly just ignored everyone this is a little too [TS]

01:15:06   much feature all at once now in a lot in a large way I think that's kind of a [TS]

01:15:10   self-created problem because if you allow all the notifications to come [TS]

01:15:13   through then that's what's going to happen and I think we're gonna have to [TS]

01:15:18   be pretty good janitors and stewards of what what notifications come in but it [TS]

01:15:23   was kind of disappointing to me that that it seems like the black hole that [TS]

01:15:28   I'm so tempted to allow myself to get sucked into its just moved from my [TS]

01:15:33   pockets my wrist never look for a product to change your habits and that [TS]

01:15:38   way you don't feel like there is it there's a kernel of truth that aspect of [TS]

01:15:42   it is the kernel of truth is what we talk about when you're first entertain [TS]

01:15:44   the idea of an awful lot like what would you think possibly have [TS]

01:15:48   and the core kernel is that it really is much easier better lower fraction more [TS]

01:15:54   convenient to just pick it up to your face look at something and deal with [TS]

01:15:58   their than it's official phone in your pocket by now we are all experts [TS]

01:16:01   extracting our phone with whatever and we prefer from whatever pocket we always [TS]

01:16:05   do then where the top pants pocket jacket pocket depending on the weather [TS]

01:16:08   whatever all experts at doing that right but it's a pain right and there's a [TS]

01:16:12   potential that you could drop the thing when you're trying to pull it out [TS]

01:16:14   quickly [TS]

01:16:15   having a thing on your wrist this is this is the big killer feature of like [TS]

01:16:18   it is more accessible it is smaller lighter weight it it's there you don't [TS]

01:16:23   do anything at the attached to you are ready you're not going to drop it right [TS]

01:16:26   that's the core everything else is people projecting like now I'm going to [TS]

01:16:32   be better about you know not having notifications and paying more attention [TS]

01:16:37   to people and I'm going to pay attention to my family because I have a phone like [TS]

01:16:39   it if your ideas that you will be able to serve dishes they steal glances at [TS]

01:16:45   notifications in a way that doesn't annoy people whereas previously you had [TS]

01:16:47   two more obviously fish out your phone or do that thing where you put your [TS]

01:16:50   hands down its like that's you doing that and you're going to do the same [TS]

01:16:55   things with this thing and it's just like wherever you go there you are that [TS]

01:16:58   is this this device is not going to help you change your life in that way but [TS]

01:17:02   that story spins out from the kernel of truth about yes it really is way more [TS]

01:17:06   can be in the same way they like small changes in screen size can be revelatory [TS]

01:17:10   with the whole you know small iPhone to the big iPhone six-plus and all that [TS]

01:17:14   like small changes in form factor and I would say or watch it pretty darn big [TS]

01:17:18   change in form factor in a very fundamental ways from a low of rectangle [TS]

01:17:22   less than you hold can make big differences but you have a separate [TS]

01:17:25   problem with how you balance people who are not their and their electronic [TS]

01:17:30   communication with you and people who are there like that is a separate issue [TS]

01:17:33   no products probably ever going to change that for you and you can solve [TS]

01:17:37   that problem or not with any set of products with the other flip phone that [TS]

01:17:41   your texting people and we're pager that you're looking at or if you just [TS]

01:17:44   daydreaming and you can't pay attention to people because you think about a [TS]

01:17:46   program problem you're trying to ask what you want for dinner like these are [TS]

01:17:49   all problems that are that happened to launched just told The all hypothetical [TS]

01:17:54   scenario [TS]

01:17:55   know you know no resemblance to real person or events 1200 block those [TS]

01:18:01   problems are gonna be there no matter what so you shouldn't feel disappointed [TS]

01:18:05   that this doesn't solve that problem for you and even tracking thing as well like [TS]

01:18:10   the Fitbit whenever like if I get if I get a fitness tracker is gonna help me [TS]

01:18:13   they do I can motivate you can game if I things right but if your problem is that [TS]

01:18:18   I had a Fitbit and I use it for a while but then I got bored I stopped [TS]

01:18:22   exercising when I got the Apple watch then I'm really gonna do fitness stuff [TS]

01:18:26   I'll be so excited about its like if you already traveled that route like the [TS]

01:18:29   problem is not the fitness tracker the problem is you [TS]

01:18:32   yeah exactly and we're going to see this story unfolding over and over again over [TS]

01:18:38   the next year of somebody getting an apple picking it will solve their overly [TS]

01:18:43   distracted by notifications problem and it just makes it worse or it doesn't [TS]

01:18:47   have any meaningful improvement because this requires a level of presence and [TS]

01:18:54   and self discipline that if you don't already have it it's this is not going [TS]

01:18:59   to give it to you like it if your phone [TS]

01:19:03   first of all if you're getting invitations constantly notification [TS]

01:19:06   should be meaningful it should be actions or events that you need to or [TS]

01:19:12   really want to be notified of immediately not something you can check [TS]

01:19:17   when you have a chance something you actually like for example almost nobody [TS]

01:19:22   needs to be notified that a Twitter at reply to that something you can just [TS]

01:19:26   check later when you have a chance thank framing it the way as like need to or [TS]

01:19:31   want to like that that's going to be so different people that is probably not a [TS]

01:19:34   usual definition what it really comes down to is are you serving advisers the [TS]

01:19:39   device serving you because framing of that with its people decide for [TS]

01:19:43   themselves [TS]

01:19:44   know the devices serving me because I really need to know everything about [TS]

01:19:47   reply or whatever right yet to be honest with yourself about that had to say well [TS]

01:19:51   I guess it comes down to is if something happens on the electronic devices and [TS]

01:19:57   you find yourself compelled to address that on those devices that thing is and [TS]

01:20:04   you find yourself [TS]

01:20:05   regretting [TS]

01:20:06   while you're doing it like that you that you feel compelled that like you are [TS]

01:20:11   being torn away from something else that would you say to yourself I would rather [TS]

01:20:15   not be torn away right now but I have to because whatever now sometimes it's a [TS]

01:20:19   real have to like you have on the job for your boss can call you are hours in [TS]

01:20:23   which case you should do job but the Twitter @ replies people like turn that [TS]

01:20:29   on because they really get our replies but if not reply comes and there in the [TS]

01:20:32   middle like a meaningful conversation with their spouse and they feel like [TS]

01:20:34   they have to go get that thing and then their spouse gets angry you will regret [TS]

01:20:39   having gone to look at that notification even though you set that up yourself so [TS]

01:20:44   a certain point you are serving the device like the device has a mastery [TS]

01:20:48   over your life you've given it more power than you really really want to and [TS]

01:20:52   then have to start to question like when whatever that thing was happened and I [TS]

01:20:56   did it like sort of compulsively instinctively went to look at it was I [TS]

01:21:00   being thoughtful amount that did I think about the fact that did I weigh the [TS]

01:21:04   potential importance of that Twitter at reply against what I was doing at this [TS]

01:21:08   moment because just having a notification to our place yet with its [TS]

01:21:12   not for most people I think but just having it in a cell this is a reasonable [TS]

01:21:17   thing to do especially if you don't get a lot of fun but feeling compelled to [TS]

01:21:21   look at it in a context where if removed the situation you would say that was a [TS]

01:21:26   bad call now is not a time to look at whether a dimension but you just do it [TS]

01:21:30   can possibly that's when you know you have a problem with the way to address [TS]

01:21:33   that problem is probably true that notification and I think every [TS]

01:21:36   individual person decide for themselves at what point they feel like the device [TS]

01:21:39   is now in control of them rather [TS]

01:21:42   as opposed to them being control the device yeah that's a really good way of [TS]

01:21:46   looking at it and now I'm feeling Tara terribly terribly guilty so thanks for [TS]

01:21:50   the shaming [TS]

01:21:51   hopefully this will cost me to reform my way so I mean like that's why I want [TS]

01:21:56   everyone to know judge for themselves like do you feel that dole other people [TS]

01:21:59   tell you you know he said don't let people tell you that you're looking at [TS]

01:22:03   your phone too much right but if someone tells you look at your phone too much [TS]

01:22:06   and you feel bad about it that means you agree with them right [TS]

01:22:09   figures that you know even if just like it is your phone making your life worse [TS]

01:22:15   or better and only you can decide that but if enough people are annoyed at you [TS]

01:22:19   then being annoyed use making your life worse so it's an indirect thing you know [TS]

01:22:23   me and like that's that's the balances and I don't get back to the kernel of [TS]

01:22:26   truth about the phone about the watch being you know closer to you if you have [TS]

01:22:31   a problem with notifications and sort of like electronic balance bouncing with [TS]

01:22:36   like a wife that happening in front of your eyes [TS]

01:22:39   the phone to watch my gonna make that worse because it gives you a more [TS]

01:22:42   vectors for hardware to control you if you don't have a problem with that the [TS]

01:22:47   watch has the potential to make it much much better because you're going to be [TS]

01:22:50   doing the same things that you know you're managing you notifications you're [TS]

01:22:53   not dealing with electronic devices when you don't want to they're not [TS]

01:22:55   controlling you controlling them is just one aspect of it now becomes more [TS]

01:22:59   efficient now you don't have to fish or other pockets like say you have 10 [TS]

01:23:02   notifications during the day if six them you know the picture for another target [TS]

01:23:06   that's a big win and you think well who cares it's a big win at like who cares [TS]

01:23:10   the phone screen of my phone is a couple millimeters diggers I really make a big [TS]

01:23:14   deal [TS]

01:23:15   small change like that can make a big difference and that's that's the big [TS]

01:23:19   winner of the watch it like you know how to article about giving you time back it [TS]

01:23:26   will because if you take the same and directions you were going to have a make [TS]

01:23:29   whole bunch of them way more efficient and faster and like less less unlocking [TS]

01:23:34   your phone and doing touch I D rendering your code of your touch I D and then [TS]

01:23:38   swiping the notification and Bob of you just turn your wrist up there is a huge [TS]

01:23:42   win but if your problem is that your hardware is controlling you know you [TS]

01:23:46   just took another hard you just send another email and slept in and arresting [TS]

01:23:50   her kinda line parlance and they're just gonna make your life [TS]

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01:25:59   transfer domains like there's a couple of little fiddly steps you get the [TS]

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01:27:20   other one that I saw was on groomers review he was extremely effusive about [TS]

01:27:27   the sport band and all readers small segment here the sport band is a [TS]

01:27:32   downright revelation I'd go so far as to call it the most comfortable watch band [TS]

01:27:36   I've ever worn have rolled my eyes at Apple's use of floor elastomer in lieu [TS]

01:27:40   of rubber to describe the material of these bands but it truly does have a [TS]

01:27:43   premium rich supple feel to it the way the end of the band tucks under the [TS]

01:27:47   other side of the strap design Marc Newson first used iPod is brilliant up [TS]

01:27:52   until now it struck me as odd that the $10,000 edition models came at the same [TS]

01:27:56   bands as the entry model 349 399 sport watches having worn it strikes me the [TS]

01:28:01   other way around the 349 399 sport watches are equipped with straps that [TS]

01:28:05   can genuinely be described as luxurious 4040 elastomer or not [TS]

01:28:09   that was pretty surprising because I have tried to dig in and figure out from [TS]

01:28:16   people who may have had one of these on at one point or another whether or not [TS]

01:28:19   the sport being was any good and that seems to be nobody has said oh my god [TS]

01:28:24   it's the best a lot of people have said no and a lot of people said yeah it's [TS]

01:28:29   pretty good but this was like really exciting john was really excited about [TS]

01:28:34   it and that surprised me and I don't know if you guys have any interesting [TS]

01:28:37   thoughts on that and I've heard I've also been poking around with anybody who [TS]

01:28:42   I can find and I've heard all over the map responses it really does seem very [TS]

01:28:47   polarizing some people just hate it [TS]

01:28:51   some people love it some people think it feels good looks bad I've heard the [TS]

01:28:55   entire range it just seems very polarizing and I think this is the case [TS]

01:28:59   with a lot of the bands and part of the reason why I've had such anxiety trying [TS]

01:29:03   to figure out what the heck to pre-order at 3 a.m. if I do that because like you [TS]

01:29:07   to be sleepy or something and then before you can even try it didn't go try [TS]

01:29:11   and then maybe cancel or modify your order if you change your mind and then [TS]

01:29:16   who knows if there's going to be like you know four to six-week delay in [TS]

01:29:19   shipping some rumors say you know i dont wanna like be without a lot for a while [TS]

01:29:24   as people are getting my app and tell me all the way it's breaking so it is [TS]

01:29:28   tempting to pre order something at 3 a.m. and I don't really know which one [TS]

01:29:32   yet because again I teased the bands are going to be just all over the map of [TS]

01:29:36   personal preference [TS]

01:29:37   you know some people think certain ones are ugly the other people think our [TS]

01:29:41   beautiful some people go into you know you're gonna think something will be [TS]

01:29:45   good until you actually try it never lies over this user doesn't look good on [TS]

01:29:49   me or it I don't like the way it feels or at least the way it works or whatever [TS]

01:29:54   and it it's going to be all over the map I I think we're not gonna get a major [TS]

01:30:00   consensus on band opinions because it is released so up to personal preference [TS]

01:30:06   yeah I tend to think you're right john anything down maybe some people think [TS]

01:30:10   that risks are generally the same shape right all the matters maybe amount of [TS]

01:30:17   arm hair something like [TS]

01:30:19   but in my experience as someone with a very strangely shaped this very issue [TS]

01:30:23   just just variations in like bone structure of the rest can make one type [TS]

01:30:27   of band so uncomfortable that is not feasible or can make one type of and [TS]

01:30:34   feel really good and so is right that like any watch the fact they have a [TS]

01:30:40   million bands is good because some bands are going to look really good but being [TS]

01:30:46   comfortable or the opposite and that's why I think for people who are thinking [TS]

01:30:50   of buying one you should probably try them on [TS]

01:30:54   just to make sure because none of these bands differently designed a lot of [TS]

01:30:57   watch bands that i've seen but also especially for women used to wearing a [TS]

01:31:02   woman's watches very with a very thin band all these bands are pretty wide and [TS]

01:31:06   the same type of strap that you liked when you had a very thin band you might [TS]

01:31:13   like that same material and it's thicker you could see it differently on your [TS]

01:31:16   wrist and of course the watch itself is much larger than some ladies watches are [TS]

01:31:20   like that even the small and it's a big rectangle of metal so by all means [TS]

01:31:24   everybody please go to the store and try to use on and spend some time with them [TS]

01:31:28   the best of course is to find a friend was an early adopter who bought their [TS]

01:31:31   sight unseen and try their hands on because they maybe you can use it for [TS]

01:31:34   like a day or a couple hours instead of just trying another few minutes in store [TS]

01:31:38   you any other thoughts on the watch reviews if I was gonna write a review of [TS]

01:31:43   this thing I would take is relevant to this whole the idea of launching the [TS]

01:31:47   launch excitement so that the way up a framing this agreement as well as like [TS]

01:31:51   that's why they had about like well [TS]

01:31:55   revolutions and products we have like the original Mac [TS]

01:31:58   and the iPod and the iPhone and the iPad and the watch the next one and you see [TS]

01:32:02   that grouping and it seems like a reasonable grouping of things and they [TS]

01:32:06   they were targeted specifically with the input methods like the mouse and the [TS]

01:32:09   click wheel the iPod a touch screen and digital crown or whatever but I think [TS]

01:32:15   the watch is more derivative than any of those the reason the phone was so [TS]

01:32:22   technology temple was the reason the phone was so exciting was because it was [TS]

01:32:26   the you know it was my compliments of several vantage change the form factor [TS]

01:32:31   the phone call screen what it put on that screen with touch screen that [TS]

01:32:35   wasn't going to use like it was there was a you know i John redefining [TS]

01:32:40   interface and so people are just excited about a bit like the future like what is [TS]

01:32:45   this crazy thing I've never seen anything like this you know that the [TS]

01:32:48   same story about the other phone makers taking all the demos perfect because [TS]

01:32:52   there's no way they can make it real thing like this like it was amazing [TS]

01:32:55   right and that's why the iPhone mantras big deal was blown away by the tack and [TS]

01:32:59   it was just something they've never seen before [TS]

01:33:02   incredibly radical in new and even given you know the price of a single only like [TS]

01:33:07   it was a slow sales burn but there was huge amounts of excitement that they all [TS]

01:33:10   start giving a call you the jesus prayed with the watch touchscreens are not that [TS]

01:33:17   new hire a speech seen the a paradigm as as you know we understand that in many [TS]

01:33:23   respects it looks like it differently sized iPhone the strap on your way more [TS]

01:33:27   important the wrist and more importantly it looks like other smart watches yet [TS]

01:33:30   screen thing with the band around it looks like a watch their been bunch [TS]

01:33:33   other ones of those there's not as much excitement in terms of everyone's gotta [TS]

01:33:39   be there you know on day one to get this thing at launch and I i what i'm saying [TS]

01:33:45   is I don't expect I don't think this is going to be as big a bank PR wise launch [TS]

01:33:51   wise as the phone was it will probably sell more than thundered example so much [TS]

01:33:54   bigger now whatever like but I think this will be a slow burn and it's [TS]

01:34:00   because it doesn't have the not such a radical break as the other ones the Mac [TS]

01:34:04   was a big things like this crazy computer [TS]

01:34:07   mouse and the graphical interface and Matt displays and like just so much new [TS]

01:34:11   on once I think the watch will be more like the iPod or it's like an mp3 player [TS]

01:34:16   I've seen those before what's the big deal about this now this is an mp3 [TS]

01:34:19   player like the wheel to wheel I guess how did that change things what you know [TS]

01:34:24   it was like well you understand it changes things because the hard drive in [TS]

01:34:28   the firewire loading and the interface integration with iTunes and we're going [TS]

01:34:32   to the store in like it's a big story you don't see the whole picture now but [TS]

01:34:35   eventually I hope it's going to be a big deal but the iPad was a slow about the [TS]

01:34:38   iPod was a slow burn the watch is going to be like that like a smart watch the [TS]

01:34:43   iPhone understanding a little down there so I guess you probably have apps but [TS]

01:34:46   what you know what's the big deal and if all goes to plan this will be a you know [TS]

01:34:53   I think the launch is going as well as Apple could have hoped it was and people [TS]

01:34:57   are going to try them on and sort of come in and they'll be so big sales day [TS]

01:35:00   or whatever and assist its gonna be cut to gain momentum and build its not going [TS]

01:35:04   to be as big of a PR bang as the Mac or iPhone was and hopefully the press and [TS]

01:35:11   the public will give the watch time to grow into what Apple thinks it can be [TS]

01:35:15   because if they are placed our on it because of the bad version 1 it's much [TS]

01:35:21   worse to have to dig yourself a hole that the momentum of the the phone with [TS]

01:35:26   such that even though the first time was kind of cruddy in retrospect it was just [TS]

01:35:29   so huge that it just carried us through the 3G 3G s and by the time people [TS]

01:35:32   started really pay attention the bomb is actually good right [TS]

01:35:35   the watch may not have that luxury because the scrutiny as higher but I [TS]

01:35:39   fully expect the watch to to reveal itself slowly to customers rather than [TS]

01:35:46   to be a gigantic bang out of the eighth and there's reviews the proper reviews [TS]

01:35:50   for the first version fit into that idea of the water viewing is also we feel [TS]

01:35:57   like it's revealing itself to these reviewers slowly as well and it will you [TS]

01:36:01   know maybe this one very much you know i think is there an accurate reflection of [TS]

01:36:06   the version 1 pride but I don't think that reflection [TS]

01:36:10   says much about the future of this product line as a as a thing inside [TS]

01:36:15   Apple right before we go i have already spilled the beans and told you that I am [TS]

01:36:23   intending as I sit here tonight to simply scheduled the trial an [TS]

01:36:27   appointment and then regret not having pre ordered one as I fall in love with [TS]

01:36:32   what the watch what you told us so far is that is everything from your not [TS]

01:36:37   getting the first version getting the sport version to you you're getting the [TS]

01:36:41   black link bracelet which is the highest anyone that's not ridiculously cold [TS]

01:36:44   right and and the one that I'm sticking by its I'm going to make a try an [TS]

01:36:49   appointment see how I feel but you're getting my hope not because God even [TS]

01:36:55   though I am such a sucker for the look of it I think first gen is that's that's [TS]

01:37:00   aggressive you might be able to reuse the bracelet with the NextGen maybe and [TS]

01:37:05   that's that's an interesting point like that but the problem is that still just [TS]

01:37:09   a maybe that's a pretty big problem I'm just trying to bring Casey into his link [TS]

01:37:15   bracelet destiny and I mean the reality is Casey like when you when there is one [TS]

01:37:20   that you really really want I think you should get the bracelet the question is [TS]

01:37:25   whether this is that one and I think that's where that's where we're all [TS]

01:37:28   hesitating like it's definitely not that one it certainly you know it's you know [TS]

01:37:33   everybody knows this is not that one it can't be can't possibly the first [TS]

01:37:37   version like you absolutely positively no this is not going to be like you're [TS]

01:37:41   not going to get this and be super happy with her five years guarantee like you [TS]

01:37:45   are not going to be super happy five years because in five years can you [TS]

01:37:50   imagine how much better the swatches gonna be your gonna know how much better [TS]

01:37:53   it is and you're gonna be looking at your own anything going on [TS]

01:37:56   just yeah that's that's not going to happen so by accordingly but at the same [TS]

01:38:04   time though it's a balance you know this is a fashion item and many of us myself [TS]

01:38:10   included Casey I think you to John will see many of us into the fashion ability [TS]

01:38:17   to ourselves is important to me it's and I think he's please let me know but I [TS]

01:38:23   bet you'll see you'll agree it's less about how it looks to other people and [TS]

01:38:27   more about how it looks to us how it makes us feel and so with a watch with [TS]

01:38:32   something like this like you know a lot of techniques like us are going to just [TS]

01:38:37   go with the sport because the cheapest and does the same thing as the other [TS]

01:38:40   ones and that's fine or they want to wait till version 2 and that's fine too [TS]

01:38:43   I stole my coat the sport we'll get to that in a minute I'll see what happens [TS]

01:38:47   but you can't deny that a big part of the appeal of these devices at all is [TS]

01:38:52   the way they make you feel about seeing it on your wrist and so i think you have [TS]

01:38:58   to balance that with your with the realities of the technology and the [TS]

01:39:02   realities of this being the version 1 you shouldn't get something that you're [TS]

01:39:06   going to really not like we're you know but the same time you should be [TS]

01:39:09   cognizant of the fact that you're probably be replacing it in two years or [TS]

01:39:14   possibly less yeah I completely agree and I think you guys both hit the nail [TS]

01:39:18   on the head that if I was convinced that I was going to just fall in love with [TS]

01:39:23   this device leaving aside the aesthetics of it but I knew I'm just gonna freakin [TS]

01:39:28   love this thing that I would probably get the the ridiculously expensive space [TS]

01:39:35   black some black lace black link bracelet with the letterbox right if I [TS]

01:39:41   was condensed that then I was going to love this device I wouldn't lie I would [TS]

01:39:47   have to think hard long and hard about whether or not I really wanna spend over [TS]

01:39:50   $1000 on this thing but i would i would do it because it would I think it would [TS]

01:39:55   make me happy every time I looked down at my wrist and market [TS]

01:39:58   had the problem of having those and getting less and less convinced I'm [TS]

01:40:01   going to really fall in love with this device and if I'm not gonna fall in love [TS]

01:40:04   with device and if I were to get one at all which i'm still telling myself as [TS]

01:40:08   questionable even though it probably isn't then why not get a sport and so I [TS]

01:40:13   don't regret it down the road now with that said Marco what's your plan my plan [TS]

01:40:18   changes like everyday so as the new information comes out as a think about [TS]

01:40:26   some other consideration will wait a minute what about my my my worries here [TS]

01:40:32   as as somebody who has not wanna watch for twenty years primarily for comfort [TS]

01:40:37   and convenience and so comfort includes both the weight and the type of band and [TS]

01:40:42   inconvenience includes how easy is it to to take on and off and the sizing that [TS]

01:40:48   goes along with that so like I said a number of times earlier my ideal band [TS]

01:40:53   would be one that is fixed in size to the ice said it however fits me best and [TS]

01:40:58   then I can attach and detach it without that size changing so I don't have to [TS]

01:41:02   like find my side every time put it on and off the only band The do that are [TS]

01:41:07   the modern buckle which is too small for me and the link bracelet from that point [TS]

01:41:12   of view the link bracelet is tempting but I think it'll be really convenient [TS]

01:41:15   as you're gonna take this thing off every night and possibly like you know [TS]

01:41:20   submerge your hands for some reason to take it out there like you to be taking [TS]

01:41:23   these things on an awful lot possibly more than other watches depending on [TS]

01:41:27   what your what your habits are their watches but either way it's going to [TS]

01:41:31   going on and off a lot so he wanted to be as annoying as possible [TS]

01:41:36   process so with that said I think the link bracelet would be the ideal choice [TS]

01:41:41   for that however I also am worried about comfort and a non much wear and wait I'm [TS]

01:41:47   worried I kind of run hot compared to other people I guess I'm worried about [TS]

01:41:51   sweetness and I'm worried about [TS]

01:41:54   really heavy the link bracelet is the heaviest one that's not in addition I [TS]

01:41:59   worry about that and i also again like you I don't want to have spent $1100 on [TS]

01:42:07   this first generation watch and then in a year or at most two years a much [TS]

01:42:15   better one comes out and in this thing as worthless look back I was such a fool [TS]

01:42:19   for spending that much money on version one so and also you gotta figure out [TS]

01:42:25   like you know from a non watch whereas point of view there are other [TS]

01:42:28   considerations for example if you ever type on a laptop metal watches click [TS]

01:42:33   against the wrist rest it's not a wrist rest I know that the wrist area below [TS]

01:42:37   your wrist that is made of metal that many ppl rest their ass on you can [TS]

01:42:41   scratch the heck out of one of those things with a metal watch at least [TS]

01:42:44   clicks and is very annoying if you're in a wrister armond on a hard surface a [TS]

01:42:48   desperate able to click there with metal and you can you should over time like a [TS]

01:42:52   wedding ring but it's still like it you will be clicking on metal thing against [TS]

01:42:56   the service a lot every single band they offer has something on the bottom even [TS]

01:43:01   the sport band has a metal pin on the bottom that will hit whatever service [TS]

01:43:05   here near except the letter loop every other one has something like that so [TS]

01:43:10   that is a concern as well you know sweating us concerns that's one of my [TS]

01:43:15   worries with the floor that her band is 20 anys have never ever there you know [TS]

01:43:20   against my skin that I think that would be a problem and for me having all this [TS]

01:43:24   can all those considerations the the three that I was considering finally are [TS]

01:43:30   the Milanese loop the leather loop and the link bracelet the link bracelet I I [TS]

01:43:36   have basically ruled out for for cost reasons I also like other people love [TS]

01:43:40   the way they look to me i i dont have any association with that except for [TS]

01:43:45   older men older men always seem to have watches billing bracelets I don't care [TS]

01:43:50   either way on them so I look at link bracelets and they kinda look [TS]

01:43:53   old-fashioned to me and because of the weight and the prices well I'm ruling [TS]

01:43:58   that out and militaries versus later loop they're very similar to one made of [TS]

01:44:03   metal ones letter really they work the same way basically and I think between [TS]

01:44:07   those [TS]

01:44:07   to attend going literally because I believe it will be more comfortable on [TS]

01:44:11   me even though I think of a more comfortable I think it will probably [TS]

01:44:15   look better on me I really dressed very casually and the known as a little bit [TS]

01:44:20   formal so I'd I dressed very casually black t-shirt and jeans most of the time [TS]

01:44:25   so I think black leather loop and sorry for this massive discussion but this is [TS]

01:44:31   actually thought I put into this so anyway what I will be pre-ordering will [TS]

01:44:35   be the 42 black leather loop and I'm going to steal so one of the options [TS]

01:44:40   that I could do instead [TS]

01:44:43   get one of the sport watches and then add a little lube and separately for [TS]

01:44:46   $150 more you can do that with any of the bands except for the black link for [TS]

01:44:52   the additions that end and that would cost about $150 less if I did that the [TS]

01:44:58   problem is I think I like what I said earlier about balancing like how much [TS]

01:45:02   how much will I be happy looking at this thing on my wrist how much how much am I [TS]

01:45:07   gonna want to wear this thing as a fashion item versus not want to spend [TS]

01:45:11   too much on generation one I think the the sport I'm not I'm just not gonna [TS]

01:45:17   feel good about I don't look at the support and and and say wow I want that [TS]

01:45:21   on my wrist I just don't that applies to both the bands and and the appearance of [TS]

01:45:25   the water body itself even though it would be lighter but I think the maximum [TS]

01:45:30   comfort option for people who are very concerned about comfort the maximum [TS]

01:45:35   comfort option I i believe will be the sport and even even if you don't like [TS]

01:45:41   the sport band didn't get a sport watching at the loop and you know you're [TS]

01:45:45   still coming in cheaper than this deal with leather loop and it'll be lighter [TS]

01:45:49   but for me to strike that balance between what I actually want to see to [TS]

01:45:55   see a my wrists were actually think will look good on me I'll be proud to wear [TS]

01:45:59   but not having spent too much money on it I like the 42 steel letter luc lac [TS]

01:46:04   that was me entering but I hear you and it makes sense and and I'm with you now [TS]

01:46:11   john has the hairiest of the three of us probably most concerned about the status [TS]

01:46:18   of your arm [TS]

01:46:19   care what is your intention [TS]

01:46:22   nice available just send me one to review and never talk about an hour talk [TS]

01:46:27   about it on the show because like I'm not why are you the only one I would [TS]

01:46:32   like one too many to send you want but I'm I'm not to have to woo you I'm not a [TS]

01:46:37   watch where I don't wear watches I'm really curious about about this device [TS]

01:46:43   you have to get your making an app for it you have to get right but I'm curious [TS]

01:46:49   about the device I'm curious if this can make me wear a watch but it's very [TS]

01:46:53   likely that if I were to get one it would end up in a drawer right I would [TS]

01:46:59   not take it would be like I would try it out I would understand experience [TS]

01:47:03   providing and I would say you know what I still don't like ever wearing anything [TS]

01:47:06   on my wrist because I don't generally like wearing this is why I don't wear [TS]

01:47:11   something Mrs but I am willing to believe that this could change my mind [TS]

01:47:14   about that so if I didn't get one I think we just have to get the cheapest [TS]

01:47:19   possible on because I have no faith in this thing being a longstanding thing I [TS]

01:47:22   know the next versions are going to be better I don't wanna think it's like it [TS]

01:47:26   actually worth it I didn't really like him to watch like oh this is really now [TS]

01:47:30   interview part of my life for whatever reason I would regret even more getting [TS]

01:47:34   the you know the crappy model or the fact that the diversion on this crappy [TS]

01:47:39   oh man if I knew that the water is going to be such an important part of my life [TS]

01:47:43   I should wait till version to version 3 hell I waited for the iPhone 6 to get an [TS]

01:47:47   iPhone I probably would still be getting iPod Touch like I did I just don't [TS]

01:47:53   entirely see the place this fits into my life but because an interesting gadget I [TS]

01:47:57   would like to play for a play within four weeks it would be ideal if Apple [TS]

01:48:01   would send me one and they're playing with it for a week and then guilt-free [TS]

01:48:04   the net week is over send it back to Apple and say I've gotten the upper [TS]

01:48:07   watch experience at the end of experience either know that I should go [TS]

01:48:11   out and buy the sport model because I really like this watch and i buy the [TS]

01:48:15   cheapest one now get version 2 or I would know that I should go out and buy [TS]

01:48:20   the sport model because that models actually gonna be sufficient for my [TS]

01:48:24   needs and I can use it for a long period of time there's pretty much no world in [TS]

01:48:27   which I pay a thousand bucks one of these things [TS]

01:48:30   without knowing first that it's just no way because I know that it's it's like [TS]

01:48:35   sluggish and doesn't quite you know it's a virgin one product is no way I can [TS]

01:48:39   justify spending $1000 even though I really hate to look at this bar models I [TS]

01:48:44   don't like the sort of nine shiny aluminum I don't like the florists and [TS]

01:48:49   bands before us the florist number whatever it is for us and bands I like [TS]

01:48:53   the colors I don't like the white the black is the only way I can tolerate [TS]

01:48:56   don't really like the sport band I have risked shaping hair concerns like it [TS]

01:49:02   just you know I'm almost it's almost like I would but the thing take off the [TS]

01:49:07   straps and then like use it in the pocket watch is like at the world's [TS]

01:49:10   tiniest iPod tell I guess you have to strap it isn't that an iPhone like i [TS]

01:49:17   just i just wanna watch a guy I don't know so right now especially you to get [TS]

01:49:22   them I feel like we'll have the show cover the you can talk about them and I [TS]

01:49:26   can go to the store and I'll play with them but I really don't see myself [TS]

01:49:29   getting one of these although I would definitely play with one for a week so [TS]

01:49:33   that's that's situation myself then if I do get one it's going to be the cheapest [TS]

01:49:37   possible and then I look at the cheap ones I know what the heck are we get I [TS]

01:49:40   guess the gray aluminum with black but you don't find attractive at all but at [TS]

01:49:45   least it's not a day goes green her wider and no I really do like the stand [TS]

01:49:52   was the one that has a little piece of a little piece of sculpture 2011 arrest [TS]

01:49:56   but I think those look nice alright so in summary I definitely won't be getting [TS]

01:50:02   the forty two millimeter black link bracelet Marco definitely will be [TS]

01:50:05   getting the 42 millimeters stainless steel with the black leather I said I [TS]

01:50:09   would be pre-ordering that one but that's a maybe for have a chance to try [TS]

01:50:13   any of them so I might change my mind but i i don't think so I and John [TS]

01:50:20   definitely in when I said definitely I really mean it this time won't be [TS]

01:50:24   getting the 42 millimeters space grey sport and I haven't even seen his watch [TS]

01:50:29   in person either by the way in any context so I would I will look at them [TS]

01:50:34   at the store in person it could be that the that maybe I'll be won over by [TS]

01:50:38   something that I think is [TS]

01:50:39   pictures or vice versa be there are no plans to buy one now I think he would be [TS]

01:50:46   silly of me not to ask our our spouses looking into buying them and I can tell [TS]

01:50:52   you that aaron is completely uninterested in everything [TS]

01:50:55   plausible and possible way so marco was tipped think she is is interested in [TS]

01:51:01   general the concept but not that excited about version one and she she knows [TS]

01:51:08   she's playing it smart she said that she knows version tuzla be way better and so [TS]

01:51:13   is she she's going to wait she does she really actually doesn't want version one [TS]

01:51:18   and she also has a little bit of skepticism about whether she wants to [TS]

01:51:22   wear a watch it all cuz she also right now it doesn't we are watching us family [TS]

01:51:25   right now so so she's going to at least sit out version one as far as you know [TS]

01:51:30   so far and of course you know look all of our opinions should change you know [TS]

01:51:34   maybe once we see them things will be different but right now she is saying [TS]

01:51:38   wait for version two version 3 though because like you imagine if we do we [TS]

01:51:43   agree that version to have the same cases this no you don't think so [TS]

01:51:47   iPad 2 did everything is that had won the iPhone to do the same as the iPhone [TS]

01:51:51   10 but I think the watch specifically I i mean with the exception of possible [TS]

01:51:56   changes to the air gap I expect the second version especially becomes like [TS]

01:52:00   you said it has early you know if you can sit a six-month delayed product I [TS]

01:52:03   think that the next version of this watch will externally look more or less [TS]

01:52:07   the same and just have an upgraded CPU and maybe a better / different screen [TS]

01:52:12   and come out fairly shortly after this one that's that's my prediction there so [TS]

01:52:15   if that's the case [TS]

01:52:17   version 3 of the watches the one you want because you're hoping at that point [TS]

01:52:20   it slims down or has a different look at how much you like to see I think that [TS]

01:52:25   the next one version 2 will retain the same connections for the for the bands [TS]

01:52:31   but I think it physical dimensions may change so it'll be a little thinner but [TS]

01:52:37   the but the bands will remain functional on the new one on the 2nd gen shave a [TS]

01:52:42   few millimeters if they did the screen [TS]

01:52:44   nation I suppose then that case it wouldn't strictly be exactly identical [TS]

01:52:47   you know like that it would actually be thinner but not like the same same [TS]

01:52:52   little Airstream trailer same number buttons a middle ground design like the [TS]

01:52:55   whole you know that it would be recognizably the same watch maybe I i [TS]

01:53:00   dont [TS]

01:53:00   I wouldn't libete competently either way right and then John what is Tina [TS]

01:53:05   planning I tried to picture on it like because it's it's better for me if I can [TS]

01:53:10   get someone else that they really wanted like it she was super excited about [TS]

01:53:16   about means we would get whatever when she super excited about as long as it's [TS]

01:53:19   not cold and then she would be the eBay Inc what do you think house is working [TS]

01:53:24   you know but I would have to have something amiss but she's not excited [TS]

01:53:27   about it so I can either so only two of the six of us are getting what I i'm not [TS]

01:53:35   admitting it to myself in your probably right but sitting here now know it's [TS]

01:53:39   only you know you're you're definitely getting one question is which one remind [TS]

01:53:45   me of all of this in like two weeks thanks like two or three sponsors this [TS]

01:53:49   week [TS]

01:53:50   igloo audible and hover and we will see you next week [TS]

01:53:56   now the show they didn't even mean to begin accidental accidental john Kasay [TS]

01:54:12   it was accidental and a team are cool [TS]

01:54:55   have no doubt that the best selling one among nerds a best-selling one among [TS]

01:55:03   listeners of our show among listeners of any tech podcast possibly among [TS]

01:55:08   listeners have any podcast and definitely among attendees of WTC this [TS]

01:55:13   year will be the forty two millimeter space great sport model with the black [TS]

01:55:18   band that is like we're gonna see a million of those things among people we [TS]

01:55:23   know yeah I think you're probably right because of the sport I think the Space [TS]

01:55:27   Gray is far and away the best looking one just a little ones kinda like the [TS]

01:55:32   empty the lifesavers iMac cases remember those at CompUSA when I'm a caminho much [TS]

01:55:38   of colors they gave retailers empty I'm a cases with no guts inside them adjust [TS]

01:55:43   the case themselves to see whether different colors look like I would like [TS]

01:55:46   a watch that is a strap the case the glass but nothing inside it [TS]

01:55:51   no screen no internals right just you could have it on your wrist occasionally [TS]

01:55:55   like the dial I guess that was thought to have the dow connected to something [TS]

01:55:58   or whatever [TS]

01:55:59   press the button may be the only a vibration engineer to it would also [TS]

01:56:02   occasionally vibrate but but nothing doesn't actually function just to get [TS]

01:56:07   used to the idea do you want something on your wrist because that's what I need [TS]

01:56:11   is like a training bra for watches and in some getting used to the idea or [TS]

01:56:16   whatever the equivalent is in like a horse bridles or whatever someone who [TS]

01:56:20   knows someone who plays poker tells all about like something to put on and get [TS]

01:56:23   used to the idea that something is going to be gripping my risk and then maybe [TS]

01:56:27   I'll pay the extra money to get the fully functional version I find it a [TS]

01:56:30   little weird that you're so stressed out both of you are so stressed out about [TS]

01:56:33   having something on your risk because I wasn't watching person for forever and I [TS]

01:56:38   gave it up for years I couldn't say how many outside maybe 45 years I gave it a [TS]

01:56:43   prime or not actually and i didnt wear watch in when I started wearing a watch [TS]

01:56:49   again which was maybe years ago at first I was like oh my wrist and that lasted [TS]

01:56:56   like two days and that was it and then suddenly I was extremely happy about [TS]

01:57:00   having a super convenient time piece right on my [TS]

01:57:02   so i John Deere here challenges aside I think they hear over blowing a bit [TS]

01:57:09   you're over blowing a bit how difficult to do keep in mind that I don't know [TS]

01:57:15   where my wedding ring any Mart I wore my wedding ring four years after getting [TS]

01:57:19   married and you're right you do basically get used to it eventually I [TS]

01:57:23   got used to it again in the wedding ring went off so like this type of thing [TS]

01:57:29   where you do kind of get used to it but it is still kind of slightly [TS]

01:57:33   inconvenient and occasionally snag some things and occasionally performed and [TS]

01:57:38   you got a you know remember it and deal with it that's the type of thing that I [TS]

01:57:42   say that I have antibodies against that I will eventually yes it's not a big [TS]

01:57:49   deal at a wedding all time yes it's a very comfortable during its fine but [TS]

01:57:52   every once in awhile it annoys me so why am I doing this and so no I don't want [TS]

01:57:56   my wedding ring and you know it [TS]

01:57:59   this March would have to earn its place them at risk by doing something useful [TS]

01:58:03   for me I'm not even entirely sure that my phone has earned its place [TS]

01:58:07   speaking of they continue to update the iPod Touch are probably still be buying [TS]

01:58:12   them now to you when you go out do you feel naked if you don't have your phone [TS]

01:58:17   on your person because when I absolutely not [TS]

01:58:19   ok now what about you Marco oh yeah i wud [TS]

01:58:23   when I go walk the dog I don't bring a wallet or usually any kind of keys or [TS]

01:58:30   anything no cash on occasion but everyone thought I like I feel ok [TS]

01:58:34   leaving the house without a wallet on foot at least but I would not leave it [TS]

01:58:39   on my phone [TS]

01:58:40   yes and I think they well jon is John but I think that [TS]

01:58:45   you will come to that point with the watch it very quickly much quicker than [TS]

01:58:49   you expected it does something useful for you I mean like to think think of [TS]

01:58:52   all the all the times you say you saw me before I got my phone sex is like I was [TS]

01:58:56   carrying out their cell phone with me most of the time it's like I didn't have [TS]

01:58:59   a phone I don't care I have to tell you were hiding it from us know but I have [TS]

01:59:04   you know sometimes you see me take or make a call on that phone message time [TS]

01:59:08   it wasn't with me that wasn't me what to do anything or the only be with me like [TS]

01:59:11   like a little thing to keep in the pocket by your door to break the glass [TS]

01:59:15   in case your car [TS]

01:59:16   the water like it's only there for emergencies not there actually be used [TS]

01:59:21   it does not replace my life I have to remember to bring my wallet with me so I [TS]

01:59:24   don't get you know pulled over and not have my license right I am I travel [TS]

01:59:28   light and the watch it has the events that I guess I have to strap it to [TS]

01:59:34   myself in the morning and I just always be with me but I can imagine forgetting [TS]

01:59:38   to do that game they were going up another morning effort to put on my [TS]

01:59:41   watch that thing that I bought for $300 that I found a use for [TS]