ATP

00:00:00 ◼   ► I just said in the last show how I had finally broken a phone. I finally broke the back of my iPhone 16 Pro. I did. I decided to go against Casey's recommendation and order myself an Express replacement through AppleCare.

00:00:12 ◼   ► I mean, it's great if you're willing to spend the extra money, which I think in retrospect, I probably still would have done it. I just felt a little bit hoodwinked by my own ignorance. But nevertheless, it did work out pretty well for me. So how did it work out for you?

00:00:25 ◼   ► Out of curiosity, how smooth was the process of getting the Express replacement for you?

00:00:30 ◼   ► I thought it was fairly straightforward. How fast did it come?

00:00:35 ◼   ► A day or two. I think it was maybe two days at most. I don't think it was very long at all.

00:00:40 ◼   ► Hmm. Yeah, that's not the experience I had.

00:00:42 ◼   ► Oh, no.

00:00:43 ◼   ► When it came, how easy was it to send the old one back?

00:00:46 ◼   ► I'm pretty sure I just put it in the exact same box and then dropped it off at like a UPS store or FedEx store or whatever the case may be.

00:00:52 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:00:53 ◼   ► Because they included like a shipping label and they even included the tape with which to reseal the box.

00:00:57 ◼   ► Like genuinely, my experience was really good as long as you can get over the fact that it was not as cheap as it could have otherwise been had I gone into the store.

00:01:05 ◼   ► Hmm.

00:01:05 ◼   ► You seem deeply dissatisfied.

00:01:08 ◼   ► Well, I ordered mine on the Friday.

00:01:12 ◼   ► It said estimated, you know, one to two business days.

00:01:15 ◼   ► I was like, wait, maybe I'll have it like Tuesday.

00:01:16 ◼   ► By the following like Thursday, I'm like, hey.

00:01:20 ◼   ► Oh, no, no, no, no.

00:01:21 ◼   ► I don't have it yet.

00:01:22 ◼   ► And the online tracking status page still hasn't, it still says it hasn't even shipped yet.

00:01:27 ◼   ► No, if I recall correctly, I did it late-ish in the day.

00:01:31 ◼   ► I'm going to make this up on like a Wednesday.

00:01:33 ◼   ► And I think midday Thursday it shipped and I think I got the package, you know, like you said, like two business days later, something like that.

00:01:40 ◼   ► I don't remember exactly, but it was something along those lines.

00:01:43 ◼   ► Yeah, that's how it says it's supposed to go.

00:01:45 ◼   ► Yeah, and that's what it did roughly.

00:01:47 ◼   ► Mine hadn't shipped for a week, and so I messaged support saying, hey, you know, can you give me an update on this?

00:01:53 ◼   ► Like, what am I looking at here?

00:01:54 ◼   ► And after a lot of chatting, because like now Apple like support chat is very defended by AI chatbot walls.

00:02:04 ◼   ► I mean, they all are, but yeah.

00:02:05 ◼   ► I know, but like you really have to like bust through a lot of AI support bot walls before you can get an actual bot person talking to you.

00:02:14 ◼   ► Anyway, after a week they hadn't sent it, after I messaged support, all of a sudden it gets sent like, you know, the following day I get it.

00:02:20 ◼   ► So I get it.

00:02:23 ◼   ► And at this point, it still says it hasn't even been shipped on the status page, but a box shows up with an AI.

00:02:28 ◼   ► I'm like, okay, great.

00:02:28 ◼   ► And you're right, it had a little piece of tape to send the phone back.

00:02:32 ◼   ► Did not, however, have a return shipping label.

00:02:35 ◼   ► Now, I've done trade-ins before with Apple.

00:02:37 ◼   ► I know the trick of like, oh, you peel off the top label and below it is the return label.

00:02:41 ◼   ► And that was not the case here.

00:02:43 ◼   ► It was like a single layer sticker label.

00:02:44 ◼   ► There was nothing below it.

00:02:45 ◼   ► There was no return label.

00:02:47 ◼   ► So I'm like, all right, go back to Apple support.

00:02:49 ◼   ► The chat is useless and won't get me anywhere.

00:02:51 ◼   ► I finally call them, sitting on hold, 40 minutes.

00:02:55 ◼   ► After all that time, they finally like, well, I don't know what happened, but here, we'll dispatch you a new one.

00:03:00 ◼   ► And, you know, you should get it by email within the hour.

00:03:01 ◼   ► Okay, bye.

00:03:02 ◼   ► Never shows up by email.

00:03:05 ◼   ► I know you did, but can you just state, can you just state plainly that you checked all the spams, all the saves?

00:03:11 ◼   ► If you don't say that, you know, somebody's going to be like, wow, didn't you check your spam folder?

00:03:15 ◼   ► Also, when a support person says they're emailing you something, you might as well stay on the line until you get the email.

00:03:22 ◼   ► That tends to keep them honest.

00:03:23 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:03:24 ◼   ► Well, and they sent me an email confirmation that even told me the tracking number on the label, but there was no label.

00:03:31 ◼   ► They said, oh, it'll come in a separate email.

00:03:32 ◼   ► I never did.

00:03:32 ◼   ► So the next day, I have to contact them again.

00:03:34 ◼   ► So, like, then I have to call them again.

00:03:37 ◼   ► And finally, they dispatch another one.

00:03:39 ◼   ► Then I get that actual FedEx label email.

00:03:41 ◼   ► So I now have FedEx box ready to go.

00:03:44 ◼   ► I packed it all up.

00:03:45 ◼   ► And then about an hour ago, I get an email saying my replacement has shipped.

00:03:50 ◼   ► What?

00:03:52 ◼   ► Nice.

00:03:52 ◼   ► Free phone.

00:03:53 ◼   ► So I'm like, I don't know what's going on.

00:03:56 ◼   ► Like, I needless to say, express replacement was not express.

00:04:02 ◼   ► And I've now had to spend like over probably over two hours of total time dealing with it.

00:04:08 ◼   ► And it's like, this is this is not at all a convenience.

00:04:10 ◼   ► Meanwhile, like when I went to the Apple store to pick up my new iPhone, I did some logistics there.

00:04:15 ◼   ► And the people in the store are awesome.

00:04:18 ◼   ► I've never had a bad staff experience at the Apple store.

00:04:22 ◼   ► Like even when I do what I think is a little bit ridiculous, like trading in three phones for one, they handle it with grace.

00:04:29 ◼   ► Like the people in the stores are awesome.

00:04:30 ◼   ► And dealing with the mailing part of this has been horrendous.

00:04:35 ◼   ► So like, OK, I'm just I'll just go to the store next time.

00:04:37 ◼   ► So I recommend everyone go to the store.

00:04:42 ◼   ► I mean, I will say that my experience was vanilla in the best possible way.

00:04:47 ◼   ► It shipped the following day after I made the request.

00:04:50 ◼   ► It arrived a couple of days later.

00:04:51 ◼   ► I shipped mine back.

00:04:53 ◼   ► You know, just boom, everything was fine.

00:04:55 ◼   ► And yeah, again, I was hoodwinked by my own ignorance because I didn't realize it was considerably more expensive than going into the store.

00:05:03 ◼   ► And so because of that, I probably would have just gone to the store.

00:05:06 ◼   ► That being said, I would generally recommend it.

00:05:09 ◼   ► I think you had a uniquely crummy experience.

00:05:11 ◼   ► And I know everyone is firing off emails about how no, no, no.

00:05:14 ◼   ► Marco's experience was not unique because this happened to me and blah, blah, blah.

00:05:17 ◼   ► I mean, whatever.

00:05:18 ◼   ► But in my personal experience, if you're willing to spend the extra money, I think it was convenient and did work well.

00:05:24 ◼   ► As long as you don't win the lottery, the nasty lottery that Marco seems to have won.

00:05:28 ◼   ► And we'll see how this ends.

00:05:30 ◼   ► Like, because, you know, once I mail this phone back, are they going to know that they have it?

00:05:33 ◼   ► Are they going to charge me a thousand dollars?

00:05:34 ◼   ► I have no idea.

00:05:35 ◼   ► Or is another phone on its way to you?

00:05:37 ◼   ► Right.

00:05:37 ◼   ► Exactly.

00:05:38 ◼   ► Who knows?

00:05:38 ◼   ► Well, the email, it said like old serial number, so-and-so, new serial number, and it was blank.

00:05:43 ◼   ► And I'm like, okay.

00:05:45 ◼   ► So something has gone badly.

00:05:49 ◼   ► This seems fraught.

00:05:50 ◼   ► Anyway, the good news is, you know,

00:05:53 ◼   ► Express Replacement went great for Casey, terribly for me.

00:05:57 ◼   ► But AppleCare 1, though it went terribly for John,

00:06:01 ◼   ► I decided to do it for myself with all this new stuff, and it's worked great for me

00:06:05 ◼   ► because I'm not touching my Macs with it.

00:06:08 ◼   ► I'm only doing phone.

00:06:10 ◼   ► Actually, no, I did do one Mac, but it's one that only my account is on.

00:06:15 ◼   ► So phone, travel laptop, and I believe that's it so far.

00:06:19 ◼   ► And it's still cheaper than what they already were, and it's great.

00:06:22 ◼   ► Watch your email.

00:06:23 ◼   ► Yeah, I will.

00:06:27 ◼   ► Let me tell you, I had a great experience last week, and that's because I went to Memphis,

00:06:31 ◼   ► Tennessee to go visit St. Jude Children's Research Hospital, and I did that because we recorded

00:06:36 ◼   ► the podcast-a-thon.

00:06:37 ◼   ► It is already over, but you can replay all 11 and three-quarters hours of it on YouTube.

00:06:43 ◼   ► We'll put a link in the show notes.

00:06:44 ◼   ► I strongly recommend if you have 11 and three-quarters hours to kill to give it a shot.

00:06:48 ◼   ► I thought we did a great job this year.

00:06:49 ◼   ► It was myself.

00:06:50 ◼   ► And let's be honest.

00:06:51 ◼   ► If you listen to this show, you probably have some time.

00:06:53 ◼   ► You're very right.

00:06:55 ◼   ► It was myself, Mike, and Jason from Upgrade, Kathy Campbell, Brad Doughty, and Stephen Hackett.

00:07:02 ◼   ► And I hope I'm not forgetting anyone.

00:07:03 ◼   ► I should have been counting, but I don't think I am.

00:07:06 ◼   ► Anyways, if I forgot you, I'm sorry.

00:07:08 ◼   ► But all of us, all six of us, we did a basically 12-hour live telethon on YouTube at St. Jude's

00:07:15 ◼   ► campus in Memphis, and we had a really great time.

00:07:18 ◼   ► We raised a little over $100,000 in that 12 hours or something like that, which I'm extremely

00:07:22 ◼   ► excited for and I am extremely thankful for.

00:07:24 ◼   ► So if you tuned in, even for just a moment, thank you.

00:07:26 ◼   ► As we sit here, as I record on the evening of Wednesday the 24th, for the entire month,

00:07:34 ◼   ► we have raised $522,836.

00:07:36 ◼   ► I think we can do better.

00:07:38 ◼   ► I challenge all of us and you to do better.

00:07:41 ◼   ► I think we absolutely can.

00:07:43 ◼   ► And so how do you help us raise more money?

00:07:45 ◼   ► You go to stjude.org slash ATP, S-T-J-U-D-E dot org slash ATP, and you throw a few bucks

00:07:50 ◼   ► our way.

00:07:50 ◼   ► We've talked about the Marco Offset.

00:07:52 ◼   ► I'm not going to belabor it because at this point you should have already paid it.

00:07:56 ◼   ► But if you bought a bunch of new technology over the last week or two and are feeling a

00:08:00 ◼   ► little guilty about your rampant consumerism, you can offset that rampant consumerism by going

00:08:05 ◼   ► to themarcooffset.com and calculate how much we recommend that you donate to offset your

00:08:11 ◼   ► rampant consumerism.

00:08:12 ◼   ► I will just say we have another story for maybe next week that we'll tell about the

00:08:17 ◼   ► importance of St. Jude.

00:08:18 ◼   ► But I will tell you that when I was there, I got to see a couple of things I had not seen

00:08:22 ◼   ► previously, including the Domino's Village, Domino's as in Domino's Pizza.

00:08:26 ◼   ► And they donate an absolutely astonishing amount of money to St. Jude, and I'm very thankful

00:08:32 ◼   ► for it.

00:08:32 ◼   ► And they have sponsored or fundraised or done something to get the Domino's Village

00:08:38 ◼   ► named after them.

00:08:39 ◼   ► So what is the Domino's Village?

00:08:40 ◼   ► It is housing.

00:08:42 ◼   ► It is semi-permanent housing for families that are getting treatment at St. Jude.

00:08:46 ◼   ► So, you know, if you have a child that is getting treated, they will fly you and the child into

00:08:51 ◼   ► Memphis.

00:08:52 ◼   ► They will put you up in Memphis, potentially at the Domino's Village, which has one, two and

00:08:56 ◼   ► three bedroom apartments.

00:08:57 ◼   ► We got to tour it, and it is incredible.

00:09:00 ◼   ► And the thought that they put into this place is phenomenal.

00:09:02 ◼   ► And I've been beating this drum for a while, and I have a blog post that I haven't posted

00:09:05 ◼   ► yet that talks about this as well.

00:09:07 ◼   ► But one of the things that's so incredible about St. Jude is how much they really give a

00:09:10 ◼   ► crap from top to bottom inside now.

00:09:12 ◼   ► And an example of this is at the Domino's Village, this is where, you know, you and your family

00:09:16 ◼   ► and potentially your, you know, sick child siblings, if necessary, can all stay and live

00:09:21 ◼   ► in Memphis for however long it takes to get this life-saving treatment for the ill child.

00:09:26 ◼   ► And as St. Jude has, you know, gone through the years and has had families not graduate,

00:09:32 ◼   ► that's not really the word I'm looking for, but, you know, move on from St. Jude because

00:09:35 ◼   ► their children are either maintaining or hopefully cured from their illness, they will still ask

00:09:40 ◼   ► the parents of these children and the children as well, like, hey, what could have made your

00:09:43 ◼   ► experience better?

00:09:44 ◼   ► And this is a great example of them just really caring.

00:09:46 ◼   ► And one of the things that parents and families have said is, hey, you know, for some cancers,

00:09:53 ◼   ► for some illnesses, you have to get, like, a pill or an injection at, like, 3 in the morning.

00:09:59 ◼   ► And even if you're staying on campus, it's not super convenient to have to trudge across

00:10:02 ◼   ► campus to go to a nurse to get the injection, to get the pill, whatever.

00:10:05 ◼   ► It would be so much nicer if we could just do that in the building in which we're sleeping.

00:10:10 ◼   ► And so I'll give you one guess what's in Domino's Village.

00:10:12 ◼   ► They have, like, a nurse's station.

00:10:13 ◼   ► I'm sure they have a different name for it, where you can, at any hour of any day, get whatever

00:10:17 ◼   ► life-saving medication you need.

00:10:19 ◼   ► So if you're into things like this, if you are into getting rid of childhood cancer, if

00:10:24 ◼   ► you're into giving these sick kids more tomorrows, and I certainly am, and I know that you two

00:10:29 ◼   ► are as well, go to stju.org.atp, s-t-j-u-d-e.org.atp.

00:10:33 ◼   ► Please throw whatever money you can their way.

00:10:36 ◼   ► Just because we have big, huge mega donors, which we are so very thankful for, that doesn't

00:10:41 ◼   ► mean that your $10 isn't useful, isn't worthwhile, isn't interesting, isn't great.

00:10:45 ◼   ► So please, please, please go to stju.org.atp.

00:10:49 ◼   ► John, did you want to mention any new top donors?

00:10:52 ◼   ► We don't have any new top donors, but I do want to recommend people check out the podcast

00:10:56 ◼   ► on, if only just by scrubbing around and looking for the parts with Casey when he does embarrassing

00:10:59 ◼   ► stuff.

00:11:00 ◼   ► It's highly entertaining.

00:11:00 ◼   ► If you enjoy this, like, a lot of these things are more entertaining when you know the people

00:11:03 ◼   ► who are there, and obviously we know most of the people who are in this podcast-a-thon,

00:11:07 ◼   ► but you're listening to the show, you probably know Casey.

00:11:09 ◼   ► Do you want to see him doing embarrassing things?

00:11:10 ◼   ► Do you want to see him playing game shows and stuff?

00:11:13 ◼   ► Check it out.

00:11:14 ◼   ► There's tons of good content there.

00:11:16 ◼   ► Yes, you can just treat it as entertainment, but if you happen to watch some of the inspirational

00:11:21 ◼   ► videos between and maybe donate a few bucks, that's the purpose of the podcast-a-thon.

00:11:24 ◼   ► You can donate it anytime, not just when it was airing live.

00:11:28 ◼   ► So please do check out that link.

00:11:30 ◼   ► Yep.

00:11:30 ◼   ► I think ATP can give Relay, you know, because we're part of the same community here, we can

00:11:35 ◼   ► give Relay that heave to get us to at least $600,000.

00:11:37 ◼   ► I'd like to see even more.

00:11:39 ◼   ► And thank you, by the way, to Captain America, Stephen Rogers, for donating $10,000.

00:11:42 ◼   ► I don't know if that's via ATP or just in general.

00:11:45 ◼   ► He's not affiliated with ATP.

00:11:46 ◼   ► I looked it up, unfortunately.

00:11:47 ◼   ► Still, Captain America is into it, so why aren't you?

00:11:49 ◼   ► Go to stu.org slash ATP.

00:11:52 ◼   ► I have possibly the most important follow-up that's ever reached the Accidental Tech Podcast.

00:11:57 ◼   ► I have sports ball follow-up.

00:11:58 ◼   ► And I wanted to let everyone know that I had brought up a couple of times that the colors

00:12:04 ◼   ► of the iPhone 17 Pro, the blue, the orange, and the kind of white-ish, right?

00:12:09 ◼   ► What's the third color?

00:12:10 ◼   ► There's blue, orange, and the one nobody cares about.

00:12:12 ◼   ► Silver.

00:12:12 ◼   ► There you go.

00:12:12 ◼   ► The blue and orange in particular, everyone says, oh, it must be because of Tim Cook.

00:12:17 ◼   ► Well, it's not because of Tim Cook, and it must be because of Auburn, because Tim Cook

00:12:21 ◼   ► went to Auburn for undergrad, if I'm not mistaken.

00:12:23 ◼   ► Auburn's colors are blue and orange.

00:12:25 ◼   ► And I kept saying, well, what about UVA?

00:12:26 ◼   ► What about UVA?

00:12:27 ◼   ► And Tony Sita, Ski-da, Ski-da, Ski-da, Ski-da, I don't know.

00:12:30 ◼   ► I'm so sorry, Tony.

00:12:31 ◼   ► We've communicated so many times.

00:12:32 ◼   ► I have no idea how to pronounce your surname, but here we are.

00:12:34 ◼   ► Tony pointed me to a link, which is admittedly the UVA magazine.

00:12:39 ◼   ► So, I mean, I will concede to consider the source, but it reads as follows.

00:12:43 ◼   ► An 1887 University of Virginia graduate, George Petrie, was the organizer and coach of Auburn's

00:12:48 ◼   ► first football team in 1892.

00:12:49 ◼   ► In honor of UVA, Petrie chose orange and blue as Auburn's official colors.

00:12:52 ◼   ► His contributions to Auburn didn't end there.

00:12:54 ◼   ► Petrie was the founder of the school's history department, graduate school, and athletics

00:12:58 ◼   ► department, as well as the author of the Auburn Creed.

00:13:00 ◼   ► There you go, kids.

00:13:01 ◼   ► They are UVA's colors.

00:13:03 ◼   ► Boom.

00:13:03 ◼   ► How about that?

00:13:04 ◼   ► All right.

00:13:05 ◼   ► Moving right along.

00:13:06 ◼   ► We got something wrong because 9to5Mac got something wrong, and we just parroted it.

00:13:12 ◼   ► We said last week that, as far as we understood, which was true, that the iPhone 17 Pro fast

00:13:19 ◼   ► charging requires the new dynamic power adapter that Apple's selling that has that new trick

00:13:25 ◼   ► USB power delivery thing where it'll do, like, tenths of a watt or amp or whatever.

00:13:30 ◼   ► I forget the details now.

00:13:31 ◼   ► But we thought that was absolutely required in order to make it, well, maybe it was volts,

00:13:35 ◼   ► in order to make it work.

00:13:36 ◼   ► Whatever it was.

00:13:37 ◼   ► A tenth of a something.

00:13:38 ◼   ► But, and so anyway, 9to5Mac has since updated that very same article, and it reads as follows.

00:13:43 ◼   ► An earlier version of this story said Apple's new dynamic power adapter was the only way

00:13:47 ◼   ► to charge the iPhone 17 as fast as possible.

00:13:49 ◼   ► This is not true.

00:13:50 ◼   ► You can use any power adapter that is 40 watts or faster.

00:13:53 ◼   ► It doesn't need to be Apple branded.

00:13:54 ◼   ► We regret the error.

00:13:55 ◼   ► And so do we.

00:13:55 ◼   ► And I guess we can do some iPhone Air follow-up.

00:13:59 ◼   ► John, tell me, why are people buying the Air or the 15-inch MacBook Air?

00:14:03 ◼   ► Yeah, last episode, we talked a lot, particularly Marco talked a lot about his doubts about how

00:14:08 ◼   ► much, how appealing the iPhone Air would be as compared to the other phones in the lineup.

00:14:13 ◼   ► And we also strayed off into thinking about the 15-inch MacBook Air, which we've talked

00:14:17 ◼   ► about in the past, and the Plus phones and stuff like that.

00:14:19 ◼   ► And the 13-inch iPad Air, all these, like, all these products that have the pattern of,

00:14:23 ◼   ► like, the bigger screen size that used to be only for a Pro model, then they make a kind

00:14:29 ◼   ► of mid- to low-tier model that has also the big screen size.

00:14:32 ◼   ► Right.

00:14:33 ◼   ► And we talked about when those products were introduced on the show, all of a sudden, this

00:14:36 ◼   ► is a great idea.

00:14:37 ◼   ► It fills an obvious hole in the lineup.

00:14:38 ◼   ► Why should you be forced to get the most expensive product if all you want is the big screen?

00:14:42 ◼   ► You don't care about the other features, yada, yada.

00:14:43 ◼   ► And then again, Marco had doubts about the iPhone Air.

00:14:46 ◼   ► What we got in response to that segment was tons and tons of people sending us email, writing

00:14:51 ◼   ► us messages online saying, here's why I'm getting the iPhone Air.

00:14:54 ◼   ► Here's why I like the 15-inch MacBook Air.

00:14:56 ◼   ► Here's why these people like the 15-inch MacBook Air.

00:14:58 ◼   ► And I'm here to say that we agree with all of you.

00:15:02 ◼   ► There are great reasons to buy all these products, which is why we think they make a lot of sense.

00:15:05 ◼   ► Even the iPhone Air.

00:15:06 ◼   ► The question is, and the point of the segment was, will these products sell well enough for

00:15:12 ◼   ► Apple to be satisfied?

00:15:13 ◼   ► Doesn't mean they're bad products.

00:15:14 ◼   ► Like, literally millions of people will buy all of these products.

00:15:17 ◼   ► That sounds like, well, it's a success.

00:15:18 ◼   ► Millions of people are buying them.

00:15:20 ◼   ► Yeah, but how many millions?

00:15:21 ◼   ► And so in the big numbers in the Apple ecosystem, our point with those segments last week was

00:15:26 ◼   ► not that there's no reason to buy an iPhone Air or 15-inch MacBook Air or a 13-inch iPad

00:15:30 ◼   ► Pro or whatever.

00:15:30 ◼   ► There's plenty of reasons to buy all those products.

00:15:33 ◼   ► They have a set of features that appeal to a lot of people.

00:15:35 ◼   ► Is it enough, people?

00:15:37 ◼   ► Just look what happened to the mini phones.

00:15:39 ◼   ► So there's tons of reasons to buy the mini phones.

00:15:41 ◼   ► People love them.

00:15:42 ◼   ► People love them so much that they were sad when Apple stopped selling them.

00:15:45 ◼   ► And why did Apple stop selling them?

00:15:47 ◼   ► They didn't sell enough.

00:15:48 ◼   ► Same thing with the Plus phones.

00:15:49 ◼   ► A lot of people like those, but not enough people.

00:15:52 ◼   ► So here are the iPhone Air.

00:15:53 ◼   ► And our fear is not that the iPhone Air is a bad product that no one should ever buy.

00:15:56 ◼   ► Our fear is that not enough people will find it appealing enough to buy.

00:15:59 ◼   ► And maybe it will have a difficult life continuing on.

00:16:02 ◼   ► But we'll see.

00:16:03 ◼   ► This is only the first week or so that these phones have been out.

00:16:06 ◼   ► We don't know what the future holds.

00:16:08 ◼   ► But that was our point.

00:16:09 ◼   ► So thank you for everybody for sending in your reasons why you love these products.

00:16:13 ◼   ► I see the reasons as completely valid.

00:16:16 ◼   ► In particular, I think the 15-inch MacBook Air is an amazing thing.

00:16:19 ◼   ► And we'll talk about the iPhone Air in a little bit with our experiences with it.

00:16:22 ◼   ► But yeah, just because you love a product and think it's great doesn't mean that it will have a bright future at Apple.

00:16:27 ◼   ► See also the Mac Pro.

00:16:30 ◼   ► Oh, the sadness of the week you said that.

00:16:33 ◼   ► Indeed.

00:16:34 ◼   ► It's killing me.

00:16:35 ◼   ► You know, you're going to have to move on.

00:16:37 ◼   ► 2024 is running out.

00:16:39 ◼   ► Remember the whole, I'm going to buy a new computer in 2024.

00:16:41 ◼   ► I just want to see what they do with the Mac Pro.

00:16:42 ◼   ► Anyway, moving on.

00:16:45 ◼   ► How's that going?

00:16:46 ◼   ► Terribly.

00:16:47 ◼   ► How's that working out for you?

00:16:48 ◼   ► All right.

00:16:49 ◼   ► Let's talk about Bendgate.

00:16:50 ◼   ► Bendgate 2025 edition.

00:16:52 ◼   ► Apple, via Tom's Guide, has provided a video.

00:16:56 ◼   ► We will link to both the Tom's Guide article and a direct link to the video in the show notes.

00:17:01 ◼   ► This is showing Apple's test harness for testing the iPhone Air.

00:17:05 ◼   ► And holy cow, this thing becomes concave, convex.

00:17:10 ◼   ► I can never tell them apart.

00:17:10 ◼   ► Doesn't matter.

00:17:11 ◼   ► It becomes a arc and springs right back to where it started.

00:17:15 ◼   ► It is very, very impressive.

00:17:17 ◼   ► This is something all the press got to see, apparently, or much of the press got to see at the phone introduction event.

00:17:23 ◼   ► Apple essentially took the press back into a room and said, here's our bend test robot.

00:17:26 ◼   ► And it's like this rig.

00:17:27 ◼   ► You'll see.

00:17:28 ◼   ► You can see it in the movie.

00:17:29 ◼   ► It's like a rig with these two little pressure points that press on the back of the phone while it's suspended from its ends.

00:17:34 ◼   ► And the phone bends and they showed it applying 130 pounds of pressure and then releasing that pressure and having the phone spring back to be entirely flat.

00:17:41 ◼   ► I think they must have done something where they took the phone off the bend ring and said, see, look, put it on the table.

00:17:46 ◼   ► It's totally flat.

00:17:46 ◼   ► It's not, you know, doesn't retain any of the bend.

00:17:49 ◼   ► That was the other impressive thing that Apple did to try to convince the press that this thing does not bend.

00:17:54 ◼   ► But I think the real commit, I said, well, we got to wait till the YouTube people get hold of this.

00:17:58 ◼   ► The real commissar, I think, was JerryRigEverything, which I believe is the premier destroyer of Apple things on YouTube.

00:18:04 ◼   ► At least he's the one I'm the most aware of.

00:18:06 ◼   ► On his channel, you know, he's going to break everything.

00:18:10 ◼   ► OK, but what he did as part of all the various tests for the iPhone Air was he did the typical test where you put it in your hands and you try to bend it.

00:18:18 ◼   ► Unlike the press people who were caught by surprise and had a phone thrown at them by Jaws and said, here, try to bend this.

00:18:24 ◼   ► JerryRig is an expert phone bender.

00:18:26 ◼   ► Like this is what he does on his channel.

00:18:29 ◼   ► He takes phones and bends them until they break.

00:18:31 ◼   ► It's a thing.

00:18:32 ◼   ► He's a big, strong man who literally bends phones for a living.

00:18:36 ◼   ► He could not bend an iPhone Air in such a way that it maintained a bend.

00:18:44 ◼   ► Forget about breaking it in half or cracking it with his two hands, holding the phone in the air.

00:18:48 ◼   ► No putting on the edge of a table.

00:18:49 ◼   ► No putting it over your knee.

00:18:50 ◼   ► No stepping on it.

00:18:51 ◼   ► Just two hands on the phone in the air.

00:18:53 ◼   ► He could not bend this phone in such a way that it retained a bend.

00:18:57 ◼   ► You could make it like do an arc, but as soon as he released the pressure, it went back to completely flat.

00:19:01 ◼   ► So the iPhone Air 100% passes the hands trying to bend test.

00:19:06 ◼   ► And like Marco said last time, surely Apple knew this, which is why they could throw this phone to people and say, here, try to bend it.

00:19:13 ◼   ► So the throwing was the dangerous part because it does break if you drop it.

00:19:15 ◼   ► But anyway, the glass cracks.

00:19:17 ◼   ► If he can't bend this thing, there's no way people caught by the press, probably surprised we're going to bend this just by bending in the air.

00:19:25 ◼   ► So amazing.

00:19:27 ◼   ► The iPhone Air, do not worry about bendability if you're trying to bend it, which you shouldn't be doing with your hands in the air.

00:19:32 ◼   ► Then, of course, everything being the channel that destroys Apple hardware, it's time to pull out the machinery.

00:19:38 ◼   ► So he got his machine-assisted bend test with like a force meter on it and like a two-inch like PVC cylinder or something pressing on the middle of the phone with the ends pressed up against something.

00:19:48 ◼   ► And it withstood 215 pounds of pressure before it cracked.

00:19:53 ◼   ► Absolutely bananas.

00:19:55 ◼   ► And the back of the phone cracked, but the screen did not.

00:19:58 ◼   ► The screen was still on at this point.

00:19:59 ◼   ► So, yes, obviously, you can break it in half.

00:20:01 ◼   ► But do you think you can apply 250 pounds of pressure directly to the center of the phone while keeping the end still?

00:20:07 ◼   ► I don't think you can.

00:20:08 ◼   ► Not without some mechanical advantages or some mechanical health.

00:20:12 ◼   ► So if you're worried about anything with the iPhone Air, worry about the back glass shattering if it slips out of your pocket, if you miss your pocket like Marco did and drop it on your driveway.

00:20:20 ◼   ► That will happen.

00:20:21 ◼   ► The glass will still crack.

00:20:22 ◼   ► But bending, I would say do not worry about it.

00:20:26 ◼   ► I'm trying to think about a scenario where how much would you have to weigh and what scenario would you have to be in where you would put this in your back pocket and sit on it and put a bend in it?

00:20:34 ◼   ► It seems very sturdy.

00:20:35 ◼   ► That's a test that nobody did.

00:20:36 ◼   ► But, again, it's not just like, oh, well, what if I'm 215 pounds?

00:20:40 ◼   ► This is 250 pounds of pressure pressed precisely in the center of the phone with the ends being held still by steel beams.

00:20:46 ◼   ► So it doesn't bend very easily.

00:20:49 ◼   ► In summary.

00:20:52 ◼   ► Yeah, and I believe somebody posted the comparison to the iPhone 6, which was the one that famously did fairly easily bend, especially the 6 Plus.

00:21:00 ◼   ► You can just blow on that one.

00:21:01 ◼   ► Yeah, I believe that was like less than half of the force required for this.

00:21:06 ◼   ► So they've made it very good.

00:21:08 ◼   ► The iPhone 6 you could easily do with your hands.

00:21:11 ◼   ► Anybody could bend it with their hands.

00:21:12 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:21:12 ◼   ► Yeah, good.

00:21:14 ◼   ► I mean, look, this is like, you know, this is one of those things where like Apple really never acknowledged that, you know, the iPhone 6 was bendable.

00:21:21 ◼   ► But you can tell that this was definitely like, hey, just so you all know, we know you think this is going to be bendable like that old iPhone was.

00:21:29 ◼   ► It's not.

00:21:30 ◼   ► Look how great it is.

00:21:31 ◼   ► It's like this was this was very good, you know, design and marketing by Apple about the bendability of the air.

00:21:36 ◼   ► Because that is like as soon as you see the air, it's the very first thing you think is, oh, is it fragile?

00:21:40 ◼   ► And they that's why Apple has been extremely, you know, strongly marketing the fact that it is not as fragile as it looks.

00:21:47 ◼   ► Oh, and the test that he did in addition to the million other ways he abused these things, he has the little scratchy little metal sticks of different hardness levels that go through like one through nine or whatever.

00:21:57 ◼   ► And the new ceramic coating, the second version of the ceramic coating, whatever thing is on on all the iPhones, it goes one number higher than the previous coating.

00:22:08 ◼   ► So it is, in fact, a better, more scratch resistant coating.

00:22:11 ◼   ► In other words, I think it was like the number six or number seven that would have scratched the iPhone 16 does not leave a mark on this phone.

00:22:16 ◼   ► You have to go up to one level of hardness higher.

00:22:18 ◼   ► So that scratch coating is also not BS.

00:22:20 ◼   ► It's real.

00:22:21 ◼   ► Yeah, I'm super duper impressed by all of this.

00:22:24 ◼   ► And so so is Jerry Rick everything.

00:22:26 ◼   ► Apparently, they he seemed very, very into it.

00:22:29 ◼   ► John, tell me about the battery life.

00:22:31 ◼   ► There's been a lot of tests done.

00:22:33 ◼   ► We have a couple of YouTube videos we'll link.

00:22:34 ◼   ► Tom's guide talked about it.

00:22:36 ◼   ► What's your conclusion here?

00:22:38 ◼   ► Battery life testing is difficult.

00:22:40 ◼   ► I mean, we just got done talking about Apple changing their methodology and having the numbers change.

00:22:45 ◼   ► The numbers change just because they change the methodology.

00:22:46 ◼   ► What is a good methodology?

00:22:48 ◼   ► What is, quote unquote, typical usage?

00:22:50 ◼   ► Doing something like playing video or whatever is really not exercising the entire phone and it's not realistic.

00:22:55 ◼   ► People don't just play a video all day long.

00:22:56 ◼   ► What is representative battery life testing?

00:22:59 ◼   ► And the difficulty of doing this.

00:23:01 ◼   ► I had to do this when I was doing battery testing, like doing laptop reviews as far as technique or whatever.

00:23:05 ◼   ► I made my own tests, but I don't think my tests were any better or worse than anyone else's.

00:23:08 ◼   ► I was just guessing.

00:23:09 ◼   ► Everyone's just saying, I think this is what a typical day looks like.

00:23:11 ◼   ► Load a web page.

00:23:13 ◼   ► Copy a file.

00:23:14 ◼   ► Do this.

00:23:15 ◼   ► Like, you just try to come up with something that looks like this is what it would be like if I was using it.

00:23:18 ◼   ► Do I throw compiling software in there?

00:23:20 ◼   ► Like, how do you make representative usage?

00:23:22 ◼   ► And so if you look at all the different reviews that are online that tested the battery life of the iPhone Air,

00:23:27 ◼   ► trying to answer the question everyone wants to know, hey, how bad is the battery life on the iPhone Air?

00:23:31 ◼   ► Because it's got a smaller battery than the other phones.

00:23:33 ◼   ► Widely varying results.

00:23:36 ◼   ► I've picked three sets of results here to try to give you some ranges, but I don't even know if these are representative.

00:23:42 ◼   ► I saw numbers that were all over the place, and it's mostly down to, I think, the different tests that these people run.

00:23:47 ◼   ► What do they think?

00:23:48 ◼   ► What is in their test?

00:23:49 ◼   ► What are they doing in their test?

00:23:50 ◼   ► Are they playing a 3D game the entire time?

00:23:51 ◼   ► Are they playing a 3D game half the time?

00:23:53 ◼   ► Are they loading web pages?

00:23:54 ◼   ► Are they playing audio?

00:23:55 ◼   ► Are they playing video?

00:23:56 ◼   ► What is the mixture of activities?

00:23:59 ◼   ► So anyway, let's start with Mr. Who's the Boss, which is a fairly big YouTuber who seems to know he's done.

00:24:05 ◼   ► On his test in the iPhone Air, the battery life for the iPhone Air was 30% less than the 17, 25% less than the 16, 32% less than the 17 Pro, and 43% less than the Pro Max.

00:24:21 ◼   ► One thing all the tests have in common is that the iPhone Air has the lowest battery life of the new iPhones that were introduced.

00:24:26 ◼   ► Makes sense.

00:24:27 ◼   ► It's got the smallest battery.

00:24:28 ◼   ► It's got the A19 Pro.

00:24:29 ◼   ► These, I think, are the worst results I saw.

00:24:32 ◼   ► So, like, how much worse is this than the plain iPhone 17?

00:24:34 ◼   ► 30% less is pretty significant.

00:24:37 ◼   ► Although, like, if you look at the phone, I think you would assume it would have, like, half the battery life.

00:24:44 ◼   ► Like, even in these worst case, the worst case scenario here is actually not that bad compared to, like, what you would expect by looking at and picking up the phone.

00:24:53 ◼   ► Yeah, but that's what people are trying to say.

00:24:54 ◼   ► Like, what is, how big, how big a factor is it?

00:24:56 ◼   ► All right.

00:24:56 ◼   ► So, the next one is from the tech chap.

00:24:58 ◼   ► In his test, he got only 3% less than the iPhone 17, 11% less than the Pro, and 15% less than the Pro Max.

00:25:07 ◼   ► And, in fact, also in his testing, the iPhone 17 Pro lasted 1% longer than the 16 Pro Max.

00:25:14 ◼   ► Just emphasizing how big the battery, how good the battery life is on the 17 Pro, coming close to matching the Pro Max from the previous generation is pretty good.

00:25:22 ◼   ► But, anyway, 3% less than the 17, that's just basically like a wash, like, that the Air basically has the same battery life as the 17.

00:25:29 ◼   ► And a few testers came up with numbers that were similar to that.

00:25:31 ◼   ► And the 17, by the way, has, he didn't test against the 16, but the 17 has better battery life than the 16.

00:25:37 ◼   ► So, that, in that case, these people were saying, hey, the Air has better battery life than the plain iPhone 16.

00:25:42 ◼   ► Again, Mr. Who's the Boss didn't find that, but some people did.

00:25:44 ◼   ► And then Tom's Guide had the Air at 6% less than the 17 and 33% less than the 17 Pro Max.

00:25:51 ◼   ► So, it's kind of all over the map, but it seems like if you get an iPhone Air, it's conceivable that it could have for you, for your usage, if you have light usage, the same battery life as if you got a plain 17.

00:26:04 ◼   ► On the other hand, if you're doing whatever the heck Mr. Who's the Boss was doing, you're going to have maybe 20 or 30% less.

00:26:09 ◼   ► I wish we could nail it down more than this to tell you how much worse is the battery, but it seems really variable, which makes sense for current SoCs because they're so good at power management that they're going to shut off or clock down the parts that they aren't using.

00:26:22 ◼   ► And certain parts can use a lot of energy all of a sudden, right?

00:26:25 ◼   ► And so, it depends on if you're, like, tickling those parts and getting them to burn up energy versus not doing it.

00:26:31 ◼   ► So, your mileage may vary, but I would say, you know, it does have a smaller battery than the other phones.

00:26:35 ◼   ► It does have an A19 Pro with one GPU disabled.

00:26:38 ◼   ► But it seems like, especially when you get it new, I think it will be fine for everybody.

00:26:43 ◼   ► After three years, maybe it will be a little bit weak, but considering how battery life has gone up over the years on the iPhone compared to, like, I don't know, like an iPhone 12 or something, I think the Air will be fine.

00:26:55 ◼   ► You know, the difficult thing for the Air is that its sibling phones are so good, right?

00:27:00 ◼   ► I think the Pro and Pro Max have ridiculously good battery life.

00:27:04 ◼   ► 17, you know, whatever, it's fine.

00:27:06 ◼   ► But anyway, that's the choice you have.

00:27:09 ◼   ► Do you want the skinny iPhone Air?

00:27:10 ◼   ► Don't worry about it bending.

00:27:12 ◼   ► If you can handle the battery in the single camera, this could be the phone for you.

00:27:15 ◼   ► Tell me about the speaker then, please.

00:27:18 ◼   ► Steve Troughton Smith chiming in to say that the iPhone Air speaker is so much louder than his 12 Pro Max speaker that he had to double check his EU volume limit settings.

00:27:26 ◼   ► It must be double the volume of his 12 Pro Max at its loudest, he said.

00:27:29 ◼   ► Now, comparing it to a 12, again, that's not, you know, Apple's, that's a pretty old phone.

00:27:34 ◼   ► But apparently the Air, even though it's just got that one speaker, it's still pretty loud.

00:27:39 ◼   ► You know, in one of the Max Tech videos that we're going to bring up, Max Tech, or what's the guy's name?

00:27:45 ◼   ► I always forget his actual name.

00:27:46 ◼   ► Is it not Max?

00:27:46 ◼   ► No, it isn't.

00:27:48 ◼   ► No, it's Vadim and the other guy.

00:27:50 ◼   ► I think Vadim.

00:27:50 ◼   ► Anyways, he was saying that he really, really finds it important, the quality of the speakers in the iPhone,

00:27:57 ◼   ► which to me, that is like very low on the list of things that I consider.

00:28:02 ◼   ► But I guess to Vadim, it was very important.

00:28:04 ◼   ► He was saying that the iPhone Air speaker, speaker, not speakers, is freaking terrible and like tinny as anything,

00:28:10 ◼   ► which is exactly what you would expect for the record.

00:28:12 ◼   ► I have some thoughts on that that will come up later.

00:28:14 ◼   ► Oh, all right.

00:28:15 ◼   ► Excellent.

00:28:16 ◼   ► So anyway, speaking of Max Tech, Max Tech did some heat-related testing, and it sure seems like the, what do you call them?

00:28:22 ◼   ► Not thermocouple, the vapor chamber, whatever it's called.

00:28:26 ◼   ► That seems to be doing some stuff.

00:28:28 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:28:28 ◼   ► So he's got like a heat-sensing camera that shows hotter areas as white and cooler areas as blue or black,

00:28:34 ◼   ► with like shades of red and orange in between.

00:28:37 ◼   ► And one of the tests, you can see they turned over an Air and a Pro to the backside of the phone.

00:28:45 ◼   ► And boy, you can see where the SoC is in the air, because it's glowing white.

00:28:48 ◼   ► When you look at the Pro, which has the same SoC that's even hotter, actually, because it's got all the GPU cores enabled,

00:28:55 ◼   ► instead of there being a bright, glowing white spot surrounded by orange and red, the whole back of the phone is like yellow.

00:29:02 ◼   ► That's the vapor chamber at work.

00:29:04 ◼   ► That's the aluminum at work.

00:29:05 ◼   ► It's taking that heat from the SoC, and it's spreading it over a much, much bigger area.

00:29:09 ◼   ► Like in this picture, like the bottom of the iPhone Air is still like a cool, like reddish-purple color.

00:29:14 ◼   ► But the 17 Pro is yellow, like all the way across.

00:29:18 ◼   ► Check out the video to see the difference.

00:29:19 ◼   ► If you want a visual representation of what the vapor chamber and the aluminum body will do for you.

00:29:25 ◼   ► Indeed, it is very impressive.

00:29:27 ◼   ► And then we have a bunch of teardowns, starting with iFixit.

00:29:31 ◼   ► It turns out that our assertion from last episode, which we were parroting, I think, other people, but here again, I mean, we said it.

00:29:39 ◼   ► We, our assertion was that the entire logic board is in the camera bump, and it turns out that's actually untrue.

00:29:45 ◼   ► It appears that the A19 Pro is in the camera bump or under the camera bump, but everything else is actually hanging out below.

00:29:51 ◼   ► Yep.

00:29:52 ◼   ► It's like a T-shaped logic board.

00:29:54 ◼   ► So the A19 Pro is in the camera bump, but the whole rest of the logic board is below it.

00:29:59 ◼   ► And speaking of the iPhone Air, iFixit also tore down the iPhone Air MagSafe battery pack.

00:30:05 ◼   ► And inside that battery pack is the exact same battery as in the iPhone Air, like literally the exact, like you can swap it into an iPhone Air.

00:30:13 ◼   ► That's a nice touch.

00:30:13 ◼   ► You open it up.

00:30:14 ◼   ► You're like, like what?

00:30:15 ◼   ► They did.

00:30:15 ◼   ► They swapped it in.

00:30:16 ◼   ► There's like, why is the battery shaped like this?

00:30:18 ◼   ► Because it's not like rectangular, it's shaped to fit into the iPhone Air with all the little, you know, bends and curves on it and stuff like that.

00:30:24 ◼   ► It's literally the exact same battery.

00:30:26 ◼   ► So if you get that battery pack, no, you're not doubling your battery life because you're losing like 35% of it to heat loss because it's, you know, the inductive coil or whatever.

00:30:35 ◼   ► But it is literally the exact same battery, which is interesting.

00:30:37 ◼   ► Yep.

00:30:38 ◼   ► Let's see.

00:30:40 ◼   ► What else do they have?

00:30:41 ◼   ► The weight, the mass distribution, they have a pie chart of what is taking up all the weight in the iPhone Air.

00:30:48 ◼   ► I love this.

00:30:49 ◼   ► This is such a dorky thing, and I'm so here for it.

00:30:52 ◼   ► The battery, of course, is 27.5%, the enclosure, 19-ish percent, back glass, another 19 or so display, 18%, and then basically everything else.

00:31:02 ◼   ► I'm shocked by the huge pie wedge taken up by the back glass.

00:31:06 ◼   ► I'm not.

00:31:06 ◼   ► The enclosure and the back glass are basically the same.

00:31:10 ◼   ► Like the entire enclosure, the entire, like the, you know, the-

00:31:13 ◼   ► The titanium frame and everything.

00:31:15 ◼   ► Yeah, the titanium frame weighs as much as the back glass.

00:31:18 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:31:18 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:31:19 ◼   ► Glass is heavy.

00:31:20 ◼   ► Yep.

00:31:20 ◼   ► And the enclosure and the back glass combined are more than the battery, but not by too much.

00:31:25 ◼   ► And the display, you know, that makes sense.

00:31:26 ◼   ► That's a lot.

00:31:27 ◼   ► But yeah, check out that distribution, spending a lot of weight on that back glass.

00:31:31 ◼   ► And that's a thing that can break, too.

00:31:33 ◼   ► And it doesn't conduct heat well.

00:31:34 ◼   ► Like, I do wonder how much, well, I don't know.

00:31:37 ◼   ► Maybe the back glass contributes to the non-bendability of it because it has, like, high tensile strength or whatever.

00:31:42 ◼   ► Like, when you're bending it, you're trying to essentially stretch out the glass.

00:31:45 ◼   ► I don't know.

00:31:46 ◼   ► I don't know if the glass is, if they couldn't have replaced the glass with some other material that might have been lighter.

00:31:53 ◼   ► But they're spending a lot of weight on it.

00:31:54 ◼   ► All right, John, tell me about the iPhone Air thickness and camera bumps, please.

00:31:59 ◼   ► This Reddit post is just for Marco.

00:32:01 ◼   ► It shows the outline of some recent phones showing how the camera bump has gotten bigger while the phones have gotten thinner, kind of.

00:32:09 ◼   ► I thought the most interesting thing was to see the iPhone 6, which you all remember is that bendy but also very, very thin phone.

00:32:15 ◼   ► The iPhone 6 was significantly thicker than the iPhone Air.

00:32:19 ◼   ► Not counting the camera bump, obviously.

00:32:21 ◼   ► But if you look at the iPhone 6, the iPhone 6's thickness, excluding its tiny camera bump, the iPhone 6's thickness extends into the iPhone Air's camera bump.

00:32:29 ◼   ► So, like, maybe a quarter of the iPhone Air's camera bump, you can spend that quarter and still be the same thickness as the iPhone 6.

00:32:37 ◼   ► And obviously, the 17 Pro's camera bump is huge.

00:32:39 ◼   ► But I just thought this was a fun graphic that somebody did with line art that I'm assuming is accurate.

00:32:42 ◼   ► We'll put a link in the show notes that shows the iPhone 5, 6, Air, and 17 Pro all in silhouette.

00:32:48 ◼   ► Ian asks, what do you think is more likely to happen first with super thin phones?

00:32:51 ◼   ► No port or port in the camera plateau?

00:32:54 ◼   ► That would be so gross.

00:32:57 ◼   ► But I do – I'm picking up what Ian is putting down.

00:33:00 ◼   ► I think they would go no port, but I don't feel super strongly about that.

00:33:06 ◼   ► The problem with the port in the camera plateau is, you know, the charging port going from the top instead of the bottom.

00:33:13 ◼   ► We assume that the camera plateau will always be at the top, but it would be weird at the bottom.

00:33:17 ◼   ► But I think it would really invalidate a lot of sort of dock type things.

00:33:22 ◼   ► But maybe Apple doesn't care about that.

00:33:24 ◼   ► It could work.

00:33:25 ◼   ► It could work if they've got a bump and they've got a place to put it.

00:33:27 ◼   ► There's always the possibility of just making a charging bump, camera bump on the top, charging bump on the bottom.

00:33:32 ◼   ► We'll see.

00:33:33 ◼   ► I think just having the thickness of the phone be the thickness of a USB-C port is probably going to be fine.

00:33:39 ◼   ► I mean, if you look at the thinnest Android foldable phones, essentially each half is the thickness of a USB-C port.

00:33:46 ◼   ► Like, or one half will be just big enough to have a USB-C with like a piece of metal above and below it and that's it.

00:33:53 ◼   ► And if you do that and you have two halves that are that size, you get a phone that is reasonable thickness for today.

00:33:59 ◼   ► If that reasonable thickness for today becomes unreasonable in 10 years, then you don't see the no ports or it's a charging bump.

00:34:05 ◼   ► I'm not sure they would put it in the camera bump, but we'll see.

00:34:08 ◼   ► I mean, I think to be so thin that you couldn't fit a USB-C port, I think like looking at the Air, you'd probably have at least another half millimeter you could shave off the thickness and still fit the port just fine.

00:34:20 ◼   ► And like when you, if you hold an iPhone Air, which I'll get to later, if you hold an iPhone Air, you almost feel like it's probably not necessary to get anything other than this really, or at least to get much thinner than this.

00:34:33 ◼   ► Because you start to run into like actual ergonomic challenges holding a phone like that or using a phone like that.

00:34:38 ◼   ► It's actually not that desirable to get thinner.

00:34:42 ◼   ► That's why I was talking about folding phones because they, what if, what if that's just half the thickness, right?

00:34:46 ◼   ► When you unfold it, you know, I guess you could do a thing.

00:34:49 ◼   ► This would be fun.

00:34:50 ◼   ► Some Android phone maker would probably try it where you can't plug a USB-C plug into it when it's unfolded.

00:34:56 ◼   ► Only when you fold it together does the USB-C port like come together.

00:34:59 ◼   ► That would be difficult because of the way USB-C is.

00:35:01 ◼   ► Half a port on each one.

00:35:03 ◼   ► It has like a tongue inside the port, so you couldn't really do this, but someone, someone could try it.

00:35:06 ◼   ► But like I said, if you, I forget what the name of this phone is, but I saw one very thin phone that like one, it really was, you can't make this any thinner and have USB-C in it because it was, it was as thin as you can make it and still pick a USB-C port.

00:35:18 ◼   ► And two of those together is still reasonable thickness, but I get what you're saying.

00:35:23 ◼   ► Like, this is what I said when we were talking about the, the, on my blog post about the thin iMac.

00:35:26 ◼   ► There is kind of like an uncomfortable valley between barely thick enough to hold the USB-C port, which as you said, may be weird in terms of, oh, this feels too thin.

00:35:37 ◼   ► Then there's sort of like this no good area as you get thinner.

00:35:41 ◼   ► But then you cross a threshold and you get to the sort of credit card thickness, which is not particularly ergonomic to hold perhaps, but it starts to become like unbreakable because if you drop a credit card, it flutters to the ground and lands softly and is not going to break when it hits the ground.

00:35:57 ◼   ► And that would be an advantage for the phone.

00:35:59 ◼   ► On the other hand, who wants to hold something as skinny as a credit card in your hand?

00:36:03 ◼   ► It would be like, you know, even if you're round over the edges, it would be weird.

00:36:06 ◼   ► Anyway, well, we've got a long way to go before we get there.

00:36:08 ◼   ► The speaker would really suck.

00:36:10 ◼   ► Yeah, we've got a long way to go before we get there.

00:36:11 ◼   ► I'd love for someone to get a credit card thick phone and put a pop socket on the back.

00:36:14 ◼   ► That would be great.

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00:38:17 ◼   ► All right.

00:38:19 ◼   ► Let's talk iPhone 17 Pro and let's start with teardowns.

00:38:22 ◼   ► REWA's technology's teardown.

00:38:25 ◼   ► REWA technology.

00:38:26 ◼   ► They commented many times about how there's a lot of screws in this phone and that they were saying this in a complimentary way because that means there's a lot less adhesive.

00:38:37 ◼   ► Yeah, that's part of the advantage of making the thing out of a block of aluminum and machining it.

00:38:41 ◼   ► If you look at in the video, they show the sort of the chassis of the 17 Pro versus the chassis of the 16 Pro.

00:38:47 ◼   ► And obviously the 17 Pro because of the giant camera plateau, that's all aluminum.

00:38:51 ◼   ► And there are tons of places to put screws that are machined into the aluminum.

00:38:56 ◼   ► On the 16 Pro, there's nothing there because the 16 Pro basically has like the wraparound, kind of the shell around the outside, but the front and back are separate pieces that come off.

00:39:05 ◼   ► So they took advantage on the Pro of the fact that, hey, that entire camera bump, that's solid aluminum.

00:39:11 ◼   ► We can put screw, whatever they call it, the little screw holes all over that thing.

00:39:14 ◼   ► And so, so many more components are screwed in on the 17 Pro than they were on the 16 simply because it's easy to find places to screw them in.

00:39:21 ◼   ► Yeah, it's much easier to service and that's much better for longevity.

00:39:26 ◼   ► There's a lot of stuff in there though.

00:39:27 ◼   ► Check out this video if you want to see what's inside these phones.

00:39:29 ◼   ► There's so many things.

00:39:30 ◼   ► There's so many tiny little things, so many delicate, tiny things.

00:39:33 ◼   ► Be very careful.

00:39:34 ◼   ► Oh, and also their teardown was showing like, so the, the logic board and that's again, it's the logic board is horizontal, just like it is in the air.

00:39:41 ◼   ► It's near the top, but it has almost nothing in the bump area.

00:39:45 ◼   ► There's so much camera crap and other things up there that, you know, obviously the front facing camera, I think that one of the speaker or some other component is up there, but the logic board.

00:39:55 ◼   ► In the 17 Pro is almost entirely below the bump with only a little tiny part of it sticking up into the bump area.

00:40:02 ◼   ► Tell me about accessibility from the front versus the back, please.

00:40:07 ◼   ► Yeah, the, the, the REWA tech people basically just said, just treat this phone as only being accessible from the back or from the front.

00:40:14 ◼   ► You can get in through the back.

00:40:15 ◼   ► Like there's that big, there's a big cutout in the aluminum.

00:40:17 ◼   ► There's a big, you know, there you could, there's a way in, but there's like a black sheet of something or other on there.

00:40:22 ◼   ► And it, I'm assuming you'd have to like peel that out and unglue it.

00:40:26 ◼   ► And they, they basically consider this a phone that is only accessible from the front, which is a disadvantage of this unibody design.

00:40:31 ◼   ► But you know, you gotta, there's trade-offs.

00:40:34 ◼   ► And then they also took a look at the vapor chamber as well.

00:40:37 ◼   ► If you want to see what that looks like inside there, it's pretty cool.

00:40:40 ◼   ► We'll, we'll put a link in the show notes to a video that explains what vapor chambers are, how they work and how they're built.

00:40:46 ◼   ► And they can show one of the factories making them.

00:40:48 ◼   ► And it looks exactly like the one that you see in the iPhone and in tons of other Android phones before this.

00:40:54 ◼   ► It's a pretty cool video if you're curious about how they work.

00:40:56 ◼   ► But basically there's just water in there and it evaporates from the heat and then condenses and gets wicked back up to begin the journey again.

00:41:05 ◼   ► It's like a little miniature water cycle inside your phone.

00:41:07 ◼   ► It's kind of awesome.

00:41:08 ◼   ► Like I really enjoy, I watched that.

00:41:10 ◼   ► I really enjoyed it.

00:41:11 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:11 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:41:12 ◼   ► It's, it's, they're so delicate.

00:41:13 ◼   ► I love watching people tear them down and they're just like, because you can destroy them by essentially just squishing them or piercing them in any way.

00:41:20 ◼   ► Like they're very, as you can, they're very thin.

00:41:23 ◼   ► That's the whole magic of them.

00:41:24 ◼   ► They're very, very thin and very, very delicate.

00:41:26 ◼   ► And they have to pull a vacuum inside them.

00:41:28 ◼   ► So as soon as it's pierced in any way, it becomes entirely useless.

00:41:31 ◼   ► And it's just amazing.

00:41:32 ◼   ► They can make something that precisely in that small that can maintain a vacuum.

00:41:36 ◼   ► It's one of the things I talk about in the video.

00:41:37 ◼   ► How do you, how do you pull a vacuum?

00:41:38 ◼   ► How do you pull the air out of something that thin with not having it collapse on itself without having it just, well, I, it's like, you know, if you put a bag on your mouth and breathe in, the bag just collapses on itself and the two walls of the bag just touch each other.

00:41:49 ◼   ► How do you not do that with something that's this thin?

00:41:51 ◼   ► And the answer is tons and tons of tiny little divots that act as little, like standoffs, like the little plastic table in your pizza box to keep the box from touching the pizza.

00:41:59 ◼   ► It's pretty cool stuff.

00:42:02 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:42:03 ◼   ► All right.

00:42:03 ◼   ► Going to max text here down.

00:42:05 ◼   ► They talk about the speakers as we previously mentioned.

00:42:07 ◼   ► And they said, well, they talked about the speakers in the air, but we're now talking about the pro.

00:42:11 ◼   ► And they said the speakers on the 17 pro max are a lot louder than the 16 pro max.

00:42:15 ◼   ► That's interesting that they have a loudness delta year over year in the max phones.

00:42:19 ◼   ► I just, I think they're making a concerted effort to make them louder.

00:42:21 ◼   ► How well, how good they sound?

00:42:22 ◼   ► Who knows, but making them louder, just got to serve all those people who are on speakerphone walking down the street.

00:42:26 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:42:27 ◼   ► Not good.

00:42:27 ◼   ► And then as we already talked about, the heat is indeed more evenly spread.

00:42:31 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:42:31 ◼   ► And this is compared to a 16 pro.

00:42:33 ◼   ► So in the 16 pro, guess where the SOC is?

00:42:35 ◼   ► Well, I can see it.

00:42:36 ◼   ► There's the big white spot right there.

00:42:38 ◼   ► And then the 17 pro it's much harder to pinpoint.

00:42:40 ◼   ► It's more of an even distribution of heat.

00:42:42 ◼   ► All right.

00:42:43 ◼   ► Let's talk scratches.

00:42:45 ◼   ► There's been already a bit of a scratch gate, if you will.

00:42:48 ◼   ► There's talk that the iPhone 17 pro people that have gone to the store have noticed a lot of scratches,

00:42:55 ◼   ► particularly on the blue pro and the black air.

00:42:59 ◼   ► Reading from Bloomberg, the deep blue variants of the iPhone 17 pro and pro max exhibited scuffs after just a few hours of being on display.

00:43:05 ◼   ► Bloomberg news found from visits to Apple stores in New York, Hong Kong, Shanghai, and London.

00:43:08 ◼   ► The black air also showed itself to be prone to scratching.

00:43:11 ◼   ► The reporters observed in addition to Apple's magnetic mag safe charger can leave a visible circular mark on the back of the iPhone 17 pro models.

00:43:17 ◼   ► Bloomberg found.

00:43:18 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:43:19 ◼   ► Mac rumors had a bunch more pictures of them.

00:43:21 ◼   ► We had a couple of people write in to say that they saw the same thing and send in pictures of the phones that they saw.

00:43:25 ◼   ► But here's Jerry rig everything coming in to say, look, he is the expert damager of phones.

00:43:31 ◼   ► And in particular, he does scratch them up and everything.

00:43:33 ◼   ► And what he says, and I'm inclined to believe him, is that the anodized surface on the aluminum on these phones is tough enough that if you try to scratch it,

00:43:43 ◼   ► which he did with his various scratch hardness tools or whatever, you can leave a mark, but that mark just brushes off like that, that white dust that all these marks essentially will just brush.

00:43:53 ◼   ► He demonstrates it in the video.

00:43:54 ◼   ► He scratches it up.

00:43:55 ◼   ► He's like, listen, it looks like it's damaged.

00:43:56 ◼   ► But then he just takes his fingers, rub, rub, rub, and it just wipes off like he called it dust or something.

00:44:01 ◼   ► I don't know if it's dust from the scratching implement or whatever, but supposedly it just rubs off everywhere except the edge of the camera bump.

00:44:09 ◼   ► Apple made a very sharp edge of the camera bump.

00:44:11 ◼   ► Anybody who has ever painted something like painted your house knows that if you have a very sharp corner on where two walls meet and you try to paint it, getting paint to stay there is very difficult.

00:44:21 ◼   ► In the world of anodizing aluminum, there are international standards for how rounded over a surface has to be to keep an anodized finish on it of a given thickness, and Apple has not paid attention to those.

00:44:40 ◼   ► They made the corners of the camera bump very sharp, and so the anodization on those corners will come off the phone, will flake off.

00:44:49 ◼   ► If you take that thing that you were scratching on the surface of the thing, the left mark so you could just brush it off and it was fine, take that same exact thing, nick it on the edge of the camera bump, and that will take a piece of that anodization off the phone and it will never come back.

00:45:02 ◼   ► You can look at it under a microscope and you can see, ah, this used to be dark blue, but now I can see there's a little divot and there's shiny aluminum.

00:45:08 ◼   ► So it will get nicked up around the camera bump if you care about that.

00:45:11 ◼   ► The only thing I haven't seen conclusive testing on is the ceramic shield, don't call it glass, back panel on the Pro, which also gets scratched up.

00:45:20 ◼   ► I'm not sure if that also buffs out, but I went to an Apple store and I saw these phones, and they looked like the ones in these pictures, but I saw that before I saw the JerryRig Everything video, so I didn't try to buff them out.

00:45:31 ◼   ► The other thing is the MagSafe ring, it looks like a coffee ring, kind of.

00:45:34 ◼   ► I'm assuming that will also rub out if you care about it.

00:45:38 ◼   ► You can see this in a lot of cases, like if the phone itself, but also any case you put on your phone, very often if you use MagSafe a lot, you will see sort of the imprint indentation or a mark from the MagSafe puck on the back of your phone.

00:45:51 ◼   ► That just seems unavoidable if you keep pressing a circular thing to the back of your phone, but this is on the actual aluminum back of, or the actual glass back, for example, of the iPhone Air.

00:46:01 ◼   ► To see that thing there, I'm assuming that will rub out, but I don't know.

00:46:05 ◼   ► But anyway, these phones are not impervious to marks, especially the dark ones, because if you get a mark on the dark one, if you get all the way down to the aluminum, the aluminum is shiny silver, and the dark blue finish contrasts highly with that.

00:46:17 ◼   ► So if you want to show the least of scratches, get the silver iPhone Pro, I guess, and the white iPhone Air.

00:46:21 ◼   ► I did see Apple gave a statement to some news outlet, I forget which one, earlier today, saying that this was a result of material transfer from the chargers they use in the store, and that they would just clean right off.

00:46:34 ◼   ► So basically what Apple was saying is that the, quote, scratches you're seeing are not scratches in the iPhones.

00:46:40 ◼   ► They are rubbed off scuffs of metal or whatever from the chargers.

00:46:44 ◼   ► That's their official position.

00:46:46 ◼   ► Yeah, and that's what Jerry Rigg was saying.

00:46:48 ◼   ► He said, like, anodized finishes on aluminum are so hard, there's no way that, like, when he was rubbing his tools on it, you'd see these terrible scratches, like, oh, you've destroyed it.

00:46:55 ◼   ► But then he literally rubs it off with his finger and said, no, what you're seeing is what came off the tool, not what came off the phone.

00:47:01 ◼   ► Yeah, like, if you're scratching with your fingernail, like, you're seeing your fingernail, basically.

00:47:04 ◼   ► Yeah, but here's the thing, though.

00:47:06 ◼   ► All that said, the bottom line is, if you scratch things against the back of this phone, it will leave marks that you will see with your eyes.

00:47:13 ◼   ► So if your complaint is, I don't want ugly marks on my phone, and you use this phone without a case, it may have ugly marks on it.

00:47:20 ◼   ► The fact that those marks will rub out is only a comfort to you if you routinely clean the back of your phone to get rid of the marks.

00:47:26 ◼   ► And, like I said, around the edges of the camera bump, that will actually take off the anodization because the corner is too sharp.

00:47:32 ◼   ► They didn't round it over enough.

00:47:33 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:47:34 ◼   ► And also, like, if you are concerned about, you know, how scratches, how noticeable scratches will be on your aluminum devices, the best thing you can do is get silver ones.

00:47:44 ◼   ► Because, you know, if you scratch silver aluminum and you expose silver underneath it, it's a lot less noticeable than if you have, like, a dark, bold color and you scratch that and you see the silver peeking out.

00:47:54 ◼   ► So, you know, if that's a concern for you, I suggest maybe just getting the silver one to begin with.

00:47:58 ◼   ► And same thing with the white air for, like, if the MagSafe pucks are leaving, like, white dust, you're not going to see it on the white air as much.

00:48:05 ◼   ► I can tell you that I got a blue iPhone 17 Pro, and sure enough, I have a little baby mark on the ridge of the camera plateau, exactly as Jerry Rigg described, in that, you know, there's a little teeny tiny mark of silver.

00:48:19 ◼   ► The rest of it looks pristine, looks brand new.

00:48:22 ◼   ► I don't know. I mean, I did it. I'm not arguing that I didn't do it, but I don't know how it happened.

00:48:26 ◼   ► But, yeah, it's right on the corner. Off the corner, it's fine. It's just right on the corner there.

00:48:30 ◼   ► To be honest, and maybe I'm just convincing myself to make myself feel better, I actually do feel like it's kind of a lovely little patina there.

00:48:37 ◼   ► If it was, like, you know, a scratch clear across the entire aluminum back, or, like, on the Mesa, or Plateau, rather, I think I would be less enthusiastic about it.

00:48:46 ◼   ► But I kind of like that it's got a little patina there, if you will.

00:48:48 ◼   ► I don't have that same admiration for screen-related scratches, but this one doesn't really bother me, but it absolutely is a thing, and it's right on the corner, just like Jerry Rigg everything said.

00:48:59 ◼   ► All right. Talk to me about iPhone sales.

00:49:02 ◼   ► Apparently, the information, as summarized by MacRumors, said that Apple's increasing production of the standard iPhone 17 due to unexpected demand for the device.

00:49:10 ◼   ► Following a strong pre-order weekend, Apple told two suppliers to increase the daily iPhone 17 output by at least 30%.

00:49:17 ◼   ► Apple allocated 25% of its iPhone 17 production to the standard model, 10% to the Air, and 65% to the Pro and Pro Max, as those are typically Apple's best-selling devices.

00:49:26 ◼   ► Yeah. This is all from the information, which is paywalled, but I'm assuming they have good sources here.

00:49:30 ◼   ► And I was just really interested to see what Apple allocates on, like, launch weekend.

00:49:34 ◼   ► Obviously, launch weekend for the phones is not representative of their lifetime sales.

00:49:37 ◼   ► It's all the early adopters, all the tech enthusiasts, all the people who even know the new iPhones are coming out.

00:49:42 ◼   ► But I was surprised to see such a huge bias towards the Pro.

00:49:46 ◼   ► And then the percentages are, again, 25% for the plane 17, 65 for the Pro, and only 10 for the Air.

00:49:53 ◼   ► So Apple's confidence in the Air more or less matches Marco's confidence in the Air, which is, eh, it'll be okay.

00:49:59 ◼   ► Some people will want it, but it is by far less than half of the next nearest one.

00:50:04 ◼   ► It's only 10% of the ones they're allocating.

00:50:06 ◼   ► And the 17 selling well doesn't surprise me, because as we said in the earlier shows and the event show that we did, 17 is a great phone.

00:50:14 ◼   ► Like, it just, it has caught up to the Pro in so many ways that people care.

00:50:18 ◼   ► It's just a really good all-around, even though it doesn't have 12 gigs of RAM.

00:50:21 ◼   ► But other than that, right, it's a really good all-around, and USB 2, it's a really good all-around front.

00:50:25 ◼   ► So it doesn't surprise me that they had to up their percentage.

00:50:27 ◼   ► But again, 25% for 17, 10 for the Air, and 65 for the Pro and Pro Max.

00:50:31 ◼   ► Because people who want iPhones on iPhone day want the best, most expensive ones, and that's the Pro and Pro Max.

00:50:37 ◼   ► All right, and then finally, Faisal writes,

00:50:40 ◼   ► A while back we heard about Apple being able to update new iPhones in their boxes at Apple stores and then didn't hear anything again.

00:50:45 ◼   ► Is it actually live? Is it working?

00:50:47 ◼   ► The day one patch for the new iPhones reminded me of this, and how Apple supposedly was able to update phones while they're in storage.

00:50:53 ◼   ► My guess is the volume was just absurd to try to do this.

00:50:57 ◼   ► Like, when you go to an Apple store and you see how many iPhones they're selling on launch day,

00:51:03 ◼   ► the idea that they would be sitting back there with the big pizza box updaters that update the phones in the boxes,

00:51:10 ◼   ► I just don't think they could keep up the volume on a launch day.

00:51:14 ◼   ► I'm sure months from now, that's probably going to be happening, but I think it's unrealistic for the launch.

00:51:21 ◼   ► Yeah, these boxes do exist, they are real, they are being used, but it doesn't make the update go any faster.

00:51:26 ◼   ► If you've ever updated your phone, you know how long it takes.

00:51:29 ◼   ► So multiply that by however many phones.

00:51:32 ◼   ► And the pizza box things can host, I don't know, like a dozen, two dozen phones at the same time,

00:51:37 ◼   ► but they're selling so many phones during launch weekend that the Presto pizza box OS updater things

00:51:44 ◼   ► aren't absolutely a non-factor on launch day, probably in launch week,

00:51:48 ◼   ► because there's just so many phones flying through that store.

00:51:50 ◼   ► There is no time to sit each one in the pizza box and get it updated.

00:51:53 ◼   ► But yeah, they're real.

00:51:54 ◼   ► We had some follow-up about it a while ago, where they have it for phones.

00:51:58 ◼   ► I believe they also have new ones coming out for Macs, but it's not a factor on launch day.

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00:53:40 ◼   ► So let's start with some actual topics, and let's begin by answering the question we should have answered last week.

00:53:50 ◼   ► How do you set up a new iPhone?

00:53:52 ◼   ► And a lot of people have asked this, and my personal experience with this was use a cable.

00:53:57 ◼   ► Always use a cable.

00:53:58 ◼   ► And the reason I did that is because it was like the more modern version of doing an iTunes backup.

00:54:04 ◼   ► And the guidance years ago was that if you do an encrypted, and that's the key, an encrypted backup to your computer, which you can still do in Finder now, that will save all your Wi-Fi passwords.

00:54:15 ◼   ► It'll save basically as much as possible.

00:54:18 ◼   ► And then you can do the restore onto the new phone once it arrives.

00:54:23 ◼   ► And so you can back up your phone maybe the morning of delivery, if you will, and then restore the new phone from that backup.

00:54:28 ◼   ► And that was the guidance for years.

00:54:30 ◼   ► And then they started being able to do the whole thing without involving your computer at all.

00:54:35 ◼   ► And for a long time, what I decided to do for the last two or three years was use a Thunderbolt cable between the two phones.

00:54:41 ◼   ► Now, this becomes dodgy because then one phone's trying to charge the other, and you need to get power into the source phone or maybe into both phones.

00:54:49 ◼   ► And so that's a little squirrely, but you can use MagSafe and get around it.

00:54:53 ◼   ► And that's what I did for this phone.

00:54:56 ◼   ► But before I get derailed in my tale of woe, what is your guys' approach, and what do you recommend?

00:55:02 ◼   ► That's what I used to do.

00:55:03 ◼   ► Like, I used to do the backup to the computer with the encryption thing.

00:55:07 ◼   ► iCloud Keychain made that a lot less necessary because, again, it used to be the – like, to do the computer encrypted backup used to be the only way to transfer Keychain entries.

00:55:17 ◼   ► So that would be things like your logins and passwords.

00:55:18 ◼   ► But once iCloud Keychain launched and became, you know, well-supported by everything, that now includes your passwords that are stored in Keychain.

00:55:28 ◼   ► Now, not all passwords.

00:55:30 ◼   ► Apps can set basically, like, their storage class for – if you have a password stored in an app in Keychain, you can say, like, this should persist between boots.

00:55:41 ◼   ► This should be only after unlock.

00:55:43 ◼   ► And you can say this should, you know, this should basically be included in backups or not.

00:55:48 ◼   ► And many apps don't.

00:55:50 ◼   ► Slack.

00:55:51 ◼   ► I'm looking directly at you.

00:55:53 ◼   ► Slack is the worst.

00:55:54 ◼   ► Any app that you have to log in every time you change your iPhone, that's a choice those apps make.

00:56:01 ◼   ► They can choose to not suck, and they don't.

00:56:04 ◼   ► Brief sidebar on Slack.

00:56:06 ◼   ► Slack, yeah, okay, so it doesn't store your password stuff.

00:56:09 ◼   ► The worst thing about Slack, it doesn't even store all the Slacks that you're in and the order they are in in the sidebar.

00:56:17 ◼   ► Now, granted, I'm in a lot of Slack.

00:56:18 ◼   ► You don't have to store the password.

00:56:20 ◼   ► Just at least keep my Slacks.

00:56:22 ◼   ► Make me – fine.

00:56:22 ◼   ► Make me log into every single one of them.

00:56:24 ◼   ► Don't make me remember what they all were.

00:56:25 ◼   ► Mm-hmm.

00:56:26 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:56:27 ◼   ► Every social network app, every, you know, the banks, like, everything.

00:56:30 ◼   ► Anyway, so all that said, I just use iCloud now.

00:56:36 ◼   ► And the reason why is because I have had the phone-to-phone, like, the direct transfer thing, I've had that thing fail a lot, Casey.

00:56:46 ◼   ► I've had that fail frequently.

00:56:49 ◼   ► It just failed for us this weekend when I did Tiff's phone because we did hers that way.

00:56:53 ◼   ► It failed.

00:56:54 ◼   ► I always do mine with the option of, like, you know, I have the phone paired to set it up with the other phone.

00:56:59 ◼   ► But then when it asks you, like, do you want to do iCloud or direct transfer, I pick iCloud now because it works a lot better for me in practice.

00:57:07 ◼   ► That being said, there are some things that never transfer.

00:57:11 ◼   ► I've never once had it properly passed the Apple Watch to the new phone, ever.

00:57:15 ◼   ► Is it even supposed to do that?

00:57:17 ◼   ► Yes.

00:57:18 ◼   ► It even says it's doing it.

00:57:19 ◼   ► I've never seen that work either.

00:57:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

00:57:21 ◼   ► It even says it's going to do it for you.

00:57:22 ◼   ► And I've heard of other people, you know, the HDMI CEC unicorns.

00:57:27 ◼   ► There's somebody out there is having this work for them.

00:57:30 ◼   ► I've never seen it work.

00:57:31 ◼   ► It works for me.

00:57:32 ◼   ► Oh, there you go.

00:57:33 ◼   ► It works for me.

00:57:33 ◼   ► That was about the only thing that worked for me.

00:57:34 ◼   ► I don't have a watch.

00:57:36 ◼   ► My wife does.

00:57:36 ◼   ► It literally never worked for her.

00:57:38 ◼   ► Yeah, exactly.

00:57:39 ◼   ► In the same way, like I've never seen a watch transfer a cellular plan to another watch either.

00:57:42 ◼   ► Like that also.

00:57:43 ◼   ► Oh, God.

00:57:43 ◼   ► That's yeah, that's asking a lot.

00:57:45 ◼   ► Yeah, exactly.

00:57:45 ◼   ► But it works for Casey.

00:57:47 ◼   ► So I didn't even know it was supposed to work.

00:57:48 ◼   ► Honestly, I just always assume it won't be paired.

00:57:50 ◼   ► And sure enough, it isn't.

00:57:51 ◼   ► Yeah, they ostensibly they added that, I think, like three or four years ago.

00:57:54 ◼   ► And it's never worked for me.

00:57:57 ◼   ► Not even once.

00:57:57 ◼   ► That being said, also, before we get to your tail of oil, because I don't have any oil.

00:58:01 ◼   ► Mine worked fine for the most part.

00:58:03 ◼   ► However, since I forget which iPhone it was.

00:58:08 ◼   ► It's been a while now.

00:58:09 ◼   ► Apple started a while back trying to, I think, maybe boost their initial battery perceptions

00:58:18 ◼   ► of the iPhone by this annoying behavior that whenever a new iPhone has not been set up

00:58:23 ◼   ► and migrated all your stuff over to it yet, the screen turns off after effectively three

00:58:29 ◼   ► seconds.

00:58:31 ◼   ► And so and there's a lot of steps in the process where you have to like, all right, hit hit a

00:58:36 ◼   ► thing and then you see a spinner for a while while something activates against some server

00:58:39 ◼   ► somewhere and the phone just keeps turning off the screen.

00:58:43 ◼   ► And then you wake it up again to see where because you have to check to see, is it waiting

00:58:48 ◼   ► for me for the next step?

00:58:49 ◼   ► So you have to keep waking up the phone.

00:58:53 ◼   ► And this is before any stage where you can actually go in and change the sleep setting

00:58:57 ◼   ► because, you know, you don't have access to settings yet.

00:58:59 ◼   ► The process is so user hostile and tedious because you have to keep waking up the stupid

00:59:07 ◼   ► phone because the screen keeps going to sleep after two seconds.

00:59:10 ◼   ► You basically have to babysit it and be because like there's I only set up phones like once

00:59:15 ◼   ► a year either.

00:59:16 ◼   ► I'm setting up my wife's or I'm setting up mine.

00:59:17 ◼   ► There's just no way to remember all the steps and they change from year to year anyway to answer

00:59:23 ◼   ► the question, can I leave now and come back and it will be done?

00:59:26 ◼   ► Yeah, because there is a step that takes like hours in the middle and you, right, but you

00:59:30 ◼   ► can't leave.

00:59:31 ◼   ► You have to, it's going to ask you something else later.

00:59:33 ◼   ► It's going to say, okay, now what about this?

00:59:34 ◼   ► Okay, now what about this?

00:59:35 ◼   ► Okay, now 45 minutes.

00:59:36 ◼   ► Now what about this?

00:59:37 ◼   ► Okay, 30 minutes.

00:59:37 ◼   ► Now what about this?

00:59:38 ◼   ► And you're like, you can never leave.

00:59:39 ◼   ► You just have to constantly be checking.

00:59:40 ◼   ► How's it doing?

00:59:41 ◼   ► How's it doing?

00:59:41 ◼   ► How's it doing?

00:59:42 ◼   ► It is way too.

00:59:45 ◼   ► I understand there's a lot of steps in the process, but they really need to have some kind

00:59:48 ◼   ► of messaging that says, now you can go away and come back.

00:59:52 ◼   ► And when you come back, it will either still be going or it will be done.

00:59:55 ◼   ► We require nothing else of you.

00:59:57 ◼   ► But I don't even know if there is that step because there are just so many phases.

01:00:01 ◼   ► And my advice for it, like to answer the question, how should we set up the phone?

01:00:04 ◼   ► As you can see, people have varying experiences.

01:00:07 ◼   ► Some people have lots of success with one way, less success with another.

01:00:10 ◼   ► I started to have less success with the iTunes backup slash finder backup way.

01:00:14 ◼   ► So I switched to the device to device transfer, but wireless.

01:00:18 ◼   ► And the reason I was doing it wireless is because I was transferring mostly from

01:00:21 ◼   ► phones that had USB to speed connections to phones that don't.

01:00:27 ◼   ► And USB to speeds are slower than Wi-Fi.

01:00:29 ◼   ► So I was doing the wireless device to device transfer.

01:00:32 ◼   ► That is still sort of my go-to default.

01:00:34 ◼   ► I would say to characterize them, the iCloud one is probably the one that has the highest

01:00:39 ◼   ► success rate, but I think it is also has the lowest fidelity in terms of what it will copy.

01:00:44 ◼   ► The finder, I'm not sure if the finder copy or the device to device with or without the

01:00:50 ◼   ► wire are tied in fidelity or if the finder.

01:00:54 ◼   ► I think so.

01:00:54 ◼   ► Assuming that you encrypt, assuming you encrypt, then I think they're tied.

01:00:58 ◼   ► Yeah, so I would say the finder one has lost its dominant, like using your Mac has lost its

01:01:02 ◼   ► dominance as the highest fidelity in terms of we will keep the most stuff.

01:01:06 ◼   ► So I would say if you want to do it with your computer, fine.

01:01:09 ◼   ► Hopefully you have a fast wired connection on your phone.

01:01:11 ◼   ► But my default, and I think the default that Apple pushes you towards is device to device

01:01:16 ◼   ► wireless.

01:01:17 ◼   ► You can keep phones plugged into power the whole time.

01:01:20 ◼   ► You don't have to do the thing where you have MagSafe on the back plus the cord and stuff.

01:01:22 ◼   ► You don't have to have a cord.

01:01:23 ◼   ► You don't have to know, oh, does this phone have a slow connection or a fast connection?

01:01:26 ◼   ► Oh, I need a lightning to USB-C connector.

01:01:28 ◼   ► Device to device wireless is kind of the default.

01:01:31 ◼   ► But I do feel like iCloud is going to have the highest success rate.

01:01:35 ◼   ► It's not going to be as fast.

01:01:36 ◼   ► It's not going to be as high fidelity, but it will slowly trickle stuff over iCloud, assuming

01:01:41 ◼   ► you have a good backup.

01:01:41 ◼   ► So like there's there used to be a good answer.

01:01:44 ◼   ► Was that easier back in the years when we could say do an iTunes encrypted iTunes backup?

01:01:47 ◼   ► Just do it.

01:01:47 ◼   ► That's the number one thing you have because the other ones were so low fidelity in terms

01:01:51 ◼   ► of like they would leave so much of your crap behind.

01:01:52 ◼   ► But that's not the case anymore.

01:01:54 ◼   ► Now the fidelity of all of them is similar.

01:01:56 ◼   ► So, yeah, I would say do device to device wireless as your first choice.

01:02:00 ◼   ► And if you have bad luck with that, iCloud is second choice.

01:02:02 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:02:03 ◼   ► The problem with device to device transfer of any kind, wired, not wired, whatever.

01:02:08 ◼   ► The problem with that is you're losing both devices for anywhere between 15 minutes and

01:02:13 ◼   ► literally three hours.

01:02:14 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

01:02:15 ◼   ► That's why I tell everyone in my family, hey, if you're going to get a new phone, just

01:02:18 ◼   ► assume you're not going to have any phones for four hours.

01:02:19 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:02:20 ◼   ► But honestly, and this is why I like the iCloud option because the iCloud option minimizes

01:02:24 ◼   ► the time that both phones are out of commission.

01:02:26 ◼   ► It very much does.

01:02:27 ◼   ► Because the new phone still has a lot to download, but you can at least start using stuff.

01:02:32 ◼   ► Oh, and by the way, I think we are still in the phase, this is only a relevance to maybe

01:02:37 ◼   ► us and other developers, but are we still in the phase where no matter what you do, your

01:02:42 ◼   ► TestFlight apps will not make it to the new phone?

01:02:44 ◼   ► Oh, yeah.

01:02:44 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:02:45 ◼   ► TestFlight apps do not make it, period.

01:02:46 ◼   ► Which, like Apple owns TestFlight.

01:02:48 ◼   ► It's not a third party app anymore.

01:02:50 ◼   ► I don't know why they can't, I guess they don't care.

01:02:52 ◼   ► Like, who cares?

01:02:53 ◼   ► Yeah, they don't care.

01:02:53 ◼   ► You know, there's only a few million developers.

01:02:55 ◼   ► Who cares?

01:02:56 ◼   ► They have a large to-do list that is above that.

01:02:58 ◼   ► If you are a developer, take screenshots of your home screens because you'll forget where

01:03:03 ◼   ► that TestFlight app was.

01:03:04 ◼   ► Or just, you know, refer back to the old phone if at all possible.

01:03:07 ◼   ► Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:03:08 ◼   ► You know, and don't, do not erase.

01:03:09 ◼   ► Don't, they'll say, okay, my new phone is set up.

01:03:11 ◼   ► Now I can wipe my old phone.

01:03:12 ◼   ► They prompt you for that.

01:03:13 ◼   ► When you're done, especially if you do device-to-device transfer, when you're done, on the old phone,

01:03:17 ◼   ► they'll say, great, you got your new phone set up.

01:03:19 ◼   ► Do you want to erase this one?

01:03:20 ◼   ► Pay attention.

01:03:20 ◼   ► Don't get, like, prompt fatigue.

01:03:22 ◼   ► You do not want to erase your old phone as soon as you set up the new one.

01:03:25 ◼   ► Wait a week.

01:03:26 ◼   ► Find out what you're missing.

01:03:27 ◼   ► By the way, speaking of prompt fatigue, there are many steps to go through now after a

01:03:36 ◼   ► migration or after a new install.

01:03:37 ◼   ► So here, yeah.

01:03:38 ◼   ► Oh, gosh, yeah.

01:03:38 ◼   ► So I actually, I wrote it down because I was like, this is, as I'm going through this, and

01:03:43 ◼   ► for reasons I'll get to later, I went through it a lot.

01:03:45 ◼   ► So here's what you have to, you have to go through location services, Apple ID, Apple Pay.

01:03:51 ◼   ► Okay, those seem reasonable.

01:03:53 ◼   ► But then.

01:03:54 ◼   ► But before you move on, Apple Pay.

01:03:56 ◼   ► Apple Pay is not one step.

01:03:58 ◼   ► Let's say you have five credit cards in Apple Pay.

01:04:00 ◼   ► You need to enter the little three-digit code for five credit cards.

01:04:03 ◼   ► Then you need to wait for your phone to connect to whatever stupid server that is run by whatever

01:04:08 ◼   ► card you're trying to use and hope that thing responds and decide, oh, I'm just going to

01:04:12 ◼   ► do set up later.

01:04:13 ◼   ► Am I going to remember to do this one card set up later?

01:04:15 ◼   ► Just getting through the Apple Pay part can be incredibly, and you got to have all your

01:04:19 ◼   ► cards on you unless you've memorized all your three-digit codes.

01:04:21 ◼   ► Just that one step frustrates me to no end because I do want all the cards.

01:04:25 ◼   ► And sometimes the servers don't respond, but then you skip it, but then you forget that

01:04:28 ◼   ► you skipped it until you're trying to pay with it in a store and you realize, oh, I never

01:04:31 ◼   ► finished the setup.

01:04:31 ◼   ► Anyway, go on.

01:04:32 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:04:33 ◼   ► So that's, but like, even that, I feel like those things, like, I can see why those are

01:04:38 ◼   ► required.

01:04:38 ◼   ► Okay.

01:04:39 ◼   ► But then, Apple Intelligence.

01:04:42 ◼   ► Why?

01:04:43 ◼   ► Why do I need to, why do I need to turn this on?

01:04:44 ◼   ► It's, it says like, it's ready and you, there's only, the only option is next or whatever.

01:04:49 ◼   ► You can't not turn it on.

01:04:51 ◼   ► So it's just advertising to you.

01:04:52 ◼   ► Then it says, you want to, you want to summarize notifications?

01:04:55 ◼   ► Do you want priority notifications?

01:04:57 ◼   ► These are three different screens.

01:04:59 ◼   ► Then the camera control thing, which interestingly enough, the default state is no swipey actions,

01:05:04 ◼   ► which is pretty clear that that's where they're going.

01:05:07 ◼   ► Okay, good.

01:05:07 ◼   ► Visual intelligence.

01:05:09 ◼   ► After that, explaining to you how to use visual intelligence.

01:05:12 ◼   ► Again, this is just promos.

01:05:13 ◼   ► The action button, four screens of Siri, emergency SOS, welcome, then a liquid glass show off and

01:05:23 ◼   ► a liquid glass tour, which is itself like four screens.

01:05:26 ◼   ► The four screens of Siri, I believe, do not ask you to do anything, right?

01:05:31 ◼   ► No.

01:05:31 ◼   ► They're just telling you about Siri.

01:05:33 ◼   ► They're not saying, like, they're just, sometimes they make you say things like, hey, Siri,

01:05:36 ◼   ► what's the weather?

01:05:37 ◼   ► Like, they're, these are tutorial, this is like the tutorial level in a video game, where

01:05:41 ◼   ► it's just like, we want to teach you how to use your phone.

01:05:42 ◼   ► You're like, come on, come on, just get me to the game.

01:05:44 ◼   ► Yeah, hey, hey, hey, hey, come on.

01:05:45 ◼   ► Yeah, like this, like this, this is showing the kind of thing that we used to like make

01:05:50 ◼   ► fun of companies like Microsoft for back in the day was like, when you could kind of

01:05:54 ◼   ► see like the org chart coming out of the products in user hostile ways.

01:05:57 ◼   ► It's like, oh, every one of these departments wants their own promo screen in the setup.

01:06:01 ◼   ► And the problem is what we're seeing is like, it feels like every division has their own

01:06:06 ◼   ► pet projects that are spamming the user here without considering the like substantially ever

01:06:12 ◼   ► growing burden of this entire experience for a brand new iPhone setup.

01:06:17 ◼   ► And for the customer, like the customer going through this, it just feels like we're just

01:06:21 ◼   ► going through the motions and we're like, yeah, come on, come on.

01:06:23 ◼   ► Why, why is this so many screens?

01:06:25 ◼   ► This is, and it's, it's really, it has reached a point where it is beyond ridiculous now.

01:06:30 ◼   ► It's just, it's just a slog.

01:06:32 ◼   ► And that's the last thing you want when you're, when you're like, you're a customer setting up

01:06:36 ◼   ► your new phone.

01:06:37 ◼   ► This is supposed to be a happy, awesome time.

01:06:39 ◼   ► You're excited.

01:06:40 ◼   ► The last thing you want is to feel like it's a slog and there's enough steps involving,

01:06:45 ◼   ► you know, setting up a new phone that are kind of just technically or realistic, realistically

01:06:49 ◼   ► required things like, you know, logins and activations.

01:06:52 ◼   ► Like I understand that part, all this other crap on top of it is not actually necessary.

01:06:57 ◼   ► This is just like promos and BS from Apple.

01:07:00 ◼   ► They shouldn't be adding to the burden.

01:07:02 ◼   ► They should be trying to get you into the experience of using the phone faster, as fast as they possibly

01:07:08 ◼   ► can because that's what you're there for.

01:07:10 ◼   ► And instead they're just loading on more and more stuff thinking each one of these pebbles

01:07:15 ◼   ► is not going to, you know, break our backs, but it's too much.

01:07:18 ◼   ► I think they did have a year where they said we simplified the setup process and then they

01:07:23 ◼   ► added the first one of those things, which I think might've been the action button or maybe

01:07:26 ◼   ► it was Siri.

01:07:26 ◼   ► And then they had the second one.

01:07:27 ◼   ► Then they had the third one.

01:07:28 ◼   ► Like when they streamlined the process, we're like, wow, setup is so good now.

01:07:31 ◼   ► And then like the next year it's like, all right, well you have some new feature.

01:07:34 ◼   ► It's fine to put that one new feature to have some flashy screen because it's just

01:07:37 ◼   ► one new feature on top of the thing.

01:07:39 ◼   ► But like you said, fast forward a few years and now everybody has one of those things.

01:07:42 ◼   ► I think the thing I would suggest that maybe you can get past the MBAs at Apple is at the

01:07:46 ◼   ► very least when doing a phone to phone transfer or an iCloud backup restore or something, figure

01:07:53 ◼   ► out what OS the old phone was running.

01:07:56 ◼   ► I feel like this information is available during any kind of phone transfer or even an iCloud

01:08:00 ◼   ► backup and do not show me anything that's already on my old phone.

01:08:05 ◼   ► If my old phone had an Apple intelligence, never show me those screens.

01:08:08 ◼   ► I know what it is.

01:08:09 ◼   ► It's already, I set up the old phone somehow.

01:08:11 ◼   ► I was presented with this.

01:08:12 ◼   ► Like in other words, don't show me things I already know.

01:08:14 ◼   ► Camera control.

01:08:15 ◼   ► Does my old phone have a camera control?

01:08:16 ◼   ► Don't show the camera control stuff.

01:08:18 ◼   ► Assume I know what it is.

01:08:19 ◼   ► Assume that I've used the old phone for some period of time.

01:08:21 ◼   ► You don't need to show me anything that was on the old phone.

01:08:24 ◼   ► And that would save so much time because so many people are setting up a new phone to replace

01:08:29 ◼   ► an old iPhone.

01:08:30 ◼   ► Now, if you're replacing an iPhone 10 or something with an iPhone 17, by all means,

01:08:34 ◼   ► show me visual intelligence and show me because you don't know about these features.

01:08:37 ◼   ► You never, you never had them on your phone.

01:08:38 ◼   ► Like tutorial levels serve a purpose.

01:08:40 ◼   ► You're not going to get them to stop them.

01:08:42 ◼   ► But I would say A, streamline them.

01:08:43 ◼   ► And B, do not show things that were already on the old phone because that just doesn't

01:08:47 ◼   ► make any sense.

01:08:48 ◼   ► Yeah, they, they, they need, they need another one of those big, uh, you know, the big flushes

01:08:52 ◼   ► like they did.

01:08:53 ◼   ► Like, you know, you got to flush those toilet again.

01:08:55 ◼   ► It's, it's full.

01:08:56 ◼   ► Wow.

01:08:56 ◼   ► Or like even better would be, uh, only to show the assemble essential steps during setup and

01:09:01 ◼   ► then on essentially like first launch into springboard through the tutorial on our face.

01:09:05 ◼   ► No, they already do enough.

01:09:06 ◼   ► They, they already spam us enough with enough dialogues and red dots.

01:09:09 ◼   ► Separate the, separate the tutorial stuff from the stuff that's essential.

01:09:13 ◼   ► And when the tutorial stuff comes out, have a thing that says skip all and never show

01:09:17 ◼   ► again, one button gets rid of all because you know what you're dismissing is not something

01:09:21 ◼   ► you need to set up because you did the necessary setup things before you got to springboard.

01:09:24 ◼   ► But once you get to springboard, throw the tutorial on our face and have us say, nope, don't want

01:09:28 ◼   ► to see any of this crap.

01:09:29 ◼   ► Even the new stuff that I don't know about and just have it never appear again.

01:09:32 ◼   ► That would, that would be my second choice.

01:09:33 ◼   ► First one, just don't show me stuff that was in the old phone.

01:09:35 ◼   ► Second one, separate essential from non-essential and make the non-essential dismissible on mass

01:09:41 ◼   ► with a single button press.

01:09:42 ◼   ► All right.

01:09:43 ◼   ► So before I tell my tale of woe, I have one additional question about this.

01:09:47 ◼   ► So Marco, to the best that you can recall, and I know this is very unscientific, when

01:09:51 ◼   ► you did the iCloud transfer, so it took roughly how long from the start of that to you being

01:09:56 ◼   ► able to at least use and interact with your new phone?

01:09:59 ◼   ► Which new phone?

01:10:01 ◼   ► Oh gosh.

01:10:02 ◼   ► Take your pick.

01:10:03 ◼   ► I don't care.

01:10:06 ◼   ► Okay.

01:10:06 ◼   ► Well, I will say that I bought two new phones.

01:10:11 ◼   ► I bought the 17 Pro and I traded in three old test phones for one new iPhone Air to be an

01:10:20 ◼   ► iPhone Air test phone.

01:10:21 ◼   ► So I have an iPhone Air and an iPhone 17 Pro.

01:10:26 ◼   ► And I first transferred everything to the iPhone Air because I wanted to actually transfer to

01:10:32 ◼   ► it, make it my phone, move into it, and live with it for a little while, which is exactly

01:10:38 ◼   ► what I did.

01:10:38 ◼   ► Okay.

01:10:39 ◼   ► I will say I later transferred everything to the 17 Pro and I spent some time with that

01:10:44 ◼   ► as well.

01:10:44 ◼   ► So I could talk about both of them.

01:10:46 ◼   ► The process to go to the iPhone Air took substantially longer.

01:10:52 ◼   ► In both cases, I did the same iCloud transfer.

01:10:55 ◼   ► The iPhone Air was substantially longer in large part because that day one software update on the

01:11:03 ◼   ► iPhone Air took almost 20 minutes.

01:11:06 ◼   ► Gracious.

01:11:08 ◼   ► And on the iPhone Pro, when I did it later, that one took about two or three minutes.

01:11:13 ◼   ► Why?

01:11:14 ◼   ► Thermal throttling.

01:11:16 ◼   ► I mean, maybe, but was the Air on launch day and the Pro not on launch day?

01:11:22 ◼   ► They were both on launch.

01:11:23 ◼   ► Well, I didn't set up the Pro on launch day.

01:11:24 ◼   ► However, the part of the process that took so long was, quote, preparing update.

01:11:31 ◼   ► Not getting the update, not downloading the update, it's preparing update.

01:11:35 ◼   ► Now, my understanding, I think the preparing update step of an Apple software update, I think

01:11:39 ◼   ► it's basically like decompressing it or whatever.

01:11:41 ◼   ► I think it's like a local operation on the phone, I think.

01:11:44 ◼   ► I could be wrong, but the iPhone Air took a very long time on preparing update that the

01:11:50 ◼   ► iPhone Pro did not.

01:11:51 ◼   ► And it was very warm during that time.

01:11:54 ◼   ► My wife's 17 Pro took forever on preparing update on launch day.

01:11:58 ◼   ► So I don't know.

01:11:58 ◼   ► I don't know what it's doing.

01:12:00 ◼   ► I could be wrong.

01:12:01 ◼   ► I will say it was very warm and it took almost 20 minutes to do the update.

01:12:04 ◼   ► And the Pro done like a day later did it in like three minutes.

01:12:10 ◼   ► It flew right through it.

01:12:11 ◼   ► Yeah, I don't.

01:12:12 ◼   ► I did errands earlier today and it did not take three minutes.

01:12:15 ◼   ► It took a fair bit of time.

01:12:17 ◼   ► All right.

01:12:18 ◼   ► So I think we got distracted.

01:12:20 ◼   ► So you said, I know.

01:12:22 ◼   ► So ballpark in summary, it was about how long from start transfer to I can interact with

01:12:28 ◼   ► either the Pro or the Air.

01:12:30 ◼   ► The Air was over an hour.

01:12:32 ◼   ► The Pro was about an hour, I think.

01:12:35 ◼   ► And then subsequent to that hour being up.

01:12:37 ◼   ► So, you know, you've you've waited an hour ish, give or take roughly the same for both.

01:12:41 ◼   ► You are now and you're doing this iCloud restore.

01:12:43 ◼   ► And then you are the phone says, OK, I'm still doing a bunch of junk in the background, but

01:12:49 ◼   ► you can at least use me now.

01:12:52 ◼   ► Was everything there were some things there were Wi-Fi passwords there were photos there

01:12:56 ◼   ► were logins there or in were apps there or was it basically useless, even though

01:13:02 ◼   ► officially, strictly speaking, you could interact with it.

01:13:05 ◼   ► Most things were.

01:13:06 ◼   ► And now both of them I ran overnights, but but not like completely like, you know, I started

01:13:12 ◼   ► using them a little bit and like before I went to bed just to check to make sure everything

01:13:15 ◼   ► was there or everything had worked and it was fine.

01:13:18 ◼   ► Both transfers went very well overall with with a pretty big exception that when I when

01:13:23 ◼   ► I did the second one from Air to Pro, I lost all my Safari tabs and I'm a little annoyed

01:13:28 ◼   ► about that, but otherwise everything else went fine.

01:13:31 ◼   ► You know, passwords, passwords were things like Wi-Fi passwords.

01:13:36 ◼   ► Yeah, of course I had those.

01:13:37 ◼   ► I believe that's iCloud keychain.

01:13:38 ◼   ► Everything that seems to be in iCloud keychain, that all seemed to be just totally fine.

01:13:42 ◼   ► The only things I lost with each transfer are things I mentioned earlier that I lose with

01:13:46 ◼   ► every transfer like slack or ivory logins.

01:13:49 ◼   ► Right.

01:13:50 ◼   ► I mean, give me my timings on my thing.

01:13:52 ◼   ► Um, I, like I said, I always tell people four hours, even though it's a conservative estimate.

01:13:56 ◼   ► And part of the reason is I've just been on a streak, as you know, from listening to past

01:14:00 ◼   ► users of the show or I got a new phone, whether it's mine or my wife's or whoever's and set

01:14:04 ◼   ► it up takes a couple of hours to do the transfer.

01:14:10 ◼   ► Uh, but the phone number never transfers.

01:14:12 ◼   ► That's never going to work.

01:14:13 ◼   ► And so you always have to call Verizon on iPhone day.

01:14:15 ◼   ► And this year we had to do it again.

01:14:17 ◼   ► And so factor in.

01:14:18 ◼   ► I didn't have that problem either.

01:14:19 ◼   ► I know you never do.

01:14:20 ◼   ► And I always do.

01:14:21 ◼   ► And guess what?

01:14:21 ◼   ► We did again because it said, do you want to transfer the number to this new phone?

01:14:24 ◼   ► And I said, yeah, totally transferred.

01:14:26 ◼   ► It's like, sorry, you need to contact global one.

01:14:29 ◼   ► I'm like, okay, global one.

01:14:30 ◼   ► What?

01:14:30 ◼   ► What?

01:14:31 ◼   ► See that step also, that step works for me with AT&T every time.

01:14:35 ◼   ► No problem.

01:14:35 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:14:36 ◼   ► So this, in this case, um, the, our suspect is we're Verizon customers.

01:14:40 ◼   ► We are not global one customers, but my wife has traveled to, uh, overseas and has gotten

01:14:46 ◼   ► various overseas e-sim slash.

01:14:49 ◼   ► I don't know if you get physical sim, probably just, yeah, just e-sims.

01:14:52 ◼   ► And apparently if you have ever used one of those things, the transfer process flips out

01:14:57 ◼   ► and says, oh, talk to global one.

01:14:59 ◼   ► It's like, I don't care about the global one thing.

01:15:01 ◼   ► Maybe if he had deleted the, like the overseas e-sims before we had done the transfer, we would

01:15:05 ◼   ► have said, but we didn't think of it.

01:15:06 ◼   ► It's always something this year.

01:15:08 ◼   ► That's what it was.

01:15:09 ◼   ► We had to call Verizon on.

01:15:11 ◼   ► And I forgot.

01:15:11 ◼   ► I, if you listen to the older episodes, you're like, didn't you learn last time that there's

01:15:14 ◼   ► a webpage of Verizon where you can do this transfer yourself?

01:15:16 ◼   ► I think I did learn that.

01:15:18 ◼   ► And then I forgot it.

01:15:19 ◼   ► And then I remembered it again after we'd already been on the phone with Verizon.

01:15:21 ◼   ► So factor that into the setup time.

01:15:24 ◼   ► That's why I say four hours.

01:15:25 ◼   ► That's fair.

01:15:27 ◼   ► All right.

01:15:28 ◼   ► So the reason I ask is because I feel like in my personal experience in years past, and

01:15:35 ◼   ► I haven't done this for at least a couple of years, and iCloud backup doesn't bring that

01:15:41 ◼   ► much back in.

01:15:42 ◼   ► And I think that that information that I just stated as fact, I think that's outdated.

01:15:46 ◼   ► I don't think that's true anymore.

01:15:47 ◼   ► Like Marco said, you know, Wi-Fi passwords are now coming in.

01:15:51 ◼   ► A lot of this stuff is coming in.

01:15:52 ◼   ► Um, and even if photos don't come in, you know, like as in they're not the, the, the originals

01:15:58 ◼   ► aren't on the device.

01:15:59 ◼   ► If you use iCloud photo library as I do, I would almost argue that's a benefit, you know, in

01:16:04 ◼   ► that it will now recash only the stuff you've used recently.

01:16:08 ◼   ► Nevertheless, um, I'm in Memphis, Tennessee.

01:16:10 ◼   ► I've just spent 12 hours doing the podcast-a-thon.

01:16:13 ◼   ► I am on something like five or six hours sleep.

01:16:16 ◼   ► It's now Saturday.

01:16:17 ◼   ► We wake up, we go to the Memphis Tigers football game where it was approximately 17 billion

01:16:21 ◼   ► degrees.

01:16:22 ◼   ► Uh, we lasted through the first half and then bailed, went and got some incredible barbecue

01:16:26 ◼   ► at Central Barbecue, which I loved.

01:16:28 ◼   ► I'd been a couple of times before.

01:16:29 ◼   ► And we had all, uh, colluded in a happy way to do a 6.30 PM pickup at the Saddle Creek store

01:16:37 ◼   ► in Germantown, Tennessee.

01:16:38 ◼   ► We go at about 6.30, give or take a little bit.

01:16:41 ◼   ► And we, I got my new AirPods Pro, I got Aaron's orange iPhone 17 Pro, I got my blue, uh, iPhone

01:16:48 ◼   ► 17 Pro, uh, very quickly to go on a tangent and interrupt myself.

01:16:53 ◼   ► This blue is, this blue is way more purple than blue in my eyes.

01:16:57 ◼   ► I don't dislike it, but in most light, I view this as more purple than blue, which is a little

01:17:03 ◼   ► bit disappointing.

01:17:04 ◼   ► I really wanted like a true, a true to form blue.

01:17:06 ◼   ► Um, that being said, uh, Aaron freaking loves her orange phone in a way.

01:17:11 ◼   ► She has not ever really been enthusiastic about any of the phone colors she's had before,

01:17:15 ◼   ► even pink, which is probably her favorite color.

01:17:17 ◼   ► Um, but she really, really likes the orange phone.

01:17:20 ◼   ► And she said to me, and I'm quoting the orange is really cool.

01:17:23 ◼   ► I think I want a clear case, which is again, not something she's ever been into.

01:17:27 ◼   ► Um, I've only held her phone briefly, uh, but the orange is very, very, very good.

01:17:32 ◼   ► And I'm really glad that Apple did an honestly bold color.

01:17:35 ◼   ► So anyway, so it's six, six 30 ish, maybe seven o'clock by the time we are on our way

01:17:41 ◼   ► back to the hotel.

01:17:41 ◼   ► And I am, and I have, I have a decision to make.

01:17:44 ◼   ► It is seven o'clock PM.

01:17:46 ◼   ► I have a three 45 AM wake up for a four 30 departure for a six 30 flight to get back home.

01:17:53 ◼   ► I am a staunch and strong believer in online, you know, electronic boarding passes.

01:17:58 ◼   ► I've already received one on my old phone.

01:18:00 ◼   ► I really don't want to travel with the old phone.

01:18:03 ◼   ► I want to travel with the new hotness.

01:18:04 ◼   ► And I had had, because why not, man?

01:18:08 ◼   ► I want to have the new thing.

01:18:10 ◼   ► Did you hear me in your ear saying, do you have four hours to spend on it right now?

01:18:14 ◼   ► Or do you not have four hours?

01:18:15 ◼   ► I didn't, but I thought to myself, it's fine.

01:18:17 ◼   ► It's fine.

01:18:17 ◼   ► Cause here's the thing.

01:18:19 ◼   ► I brought with me in the car on the way back from the Apple store, I immediately opened

01:18:23 ◼   ► the phone and I brought with me a USB-C, like, I think it's a Belkin Mophie.

01:18:28 ◼   ► I forget what it is, but one of those, you know, uh, uh, 3d rectangle, uh, battery packs

01:18:33 ◼   ► that like John Voorhees loves.

01:18:34 ◼   ► I forget the model.

01:18:35 ◼   ► If you actually care, ask me about it.

01:18:37 ◼   ► But anyways, aren't all battery packs, 3d rectangles or what you know what I'm saying?

01:18:41 ◼   ► They're like, uh, not, not, um, not cylinders, but like a round rec cylinder, if you will.

01:18:46 ◼   ► I'm doing a terrible job describing it.

01:18:48 ◼   ► You know what I'm thinking of?

01:18:49 ◼   ► I'm, I'm doing a poor, like a candy bar form factor kind of, but no, no, no, not a candy

01:18:53 ◼   ► bar.

01:18:53 ◼   ► That's my whole point.

01:18:53 ◼   ► It's more of like a, like a square that's been extruded upwards.

01:18:57 ◼   ► Um, anyways, like an airport extreme.

01:18:59 ◼   ► Yes, actually.

01:19:01 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:19:01 ◼   ► Uh, so I have that.

01:19:04 ◼   ► I have my, I believe it's Mophie, uh, three in one travel charger, which is MagSafe and

01:19:09 ◼   ► charges really fast.

01:19:11 ◼   ► Then the second edition charges quite quickly.

01:19:13 ◼   ► Um, and I have a Apple Thunderbolt.

01:19:18 ◼   ► I think it's Thunderbolt three or four.

01:19:20 ◼   ► I don't recall now, but it's maybe, uh, two ish feet long.

01:19:25 ◼   ► So like two thirds of a meter.

01:19:26 ◼   ► Um, this thing cost me $11 million when I bought it.

01:19:30 ◼   ► It's seriously like a $70 cable or something like that.

01:19:32 ◼   ► And actually while we were there at the Apple store, Mike impulse bought, I think a one and

01:19:36 ◼   ► a half meter Thunderbolt five cable, maybe it was four for literally 150 bucks or thereabouts.

01:19:42 ◼   ► It was absurd.

01:19:43 ◼   ► There's an Apple cable.

01:19:44 ◼   ► Cable transfers are not this good.

01:19:46 ◼   ► Like this is, this is the problem.

01:19:48 ◼   ► Marco.

01:19:49 ◼   ► I had convinced myself, and this is a hundred percent my fault.

01:19:52 ◼   ► I'm not trying to blame anyone but myself.

01:19:55 ◼   ► Only the guy in the mirror is at fault here.

01:19:56 ◼   ► I had somehow convinced myself that these things support Thunderbolt and, and, and these things

01:20:02 ◼   ► have immensely fast transfer speeds.

01:20:05 ◼   ► The pros specifically.

01:20:06 ◼   ► Isn't it just USB, USB three at best?

01:20:09 ◼   ► I don't think the phones have ever supported Thunderbolt.

01:20:11 ◼   ► This is my question.

01:20:12 ◼   ► The iPads do.

01:20:13 ◼   ► I think I have convinced myself of something that is patently untrue.

01:20:17 ◼   ► I am owning that top to bottom inside now, but I thought to myself, all right, this has

01:20:22 ◼   ► got to be the year.

01:20:22 ◼   ► I have a half terabyte phone of which maybe two thirds is full or something like that.

01:20:27 ◼   ► And I think a lot of that is just photos that can be, you know, they're cast photos.

01:20:31 ◼   ► You know, I'm not trying to keep my whole photo library on the phone.

01:20:33 ◼   ► This has got to be fast.

01:20:35 ◼   ► It's got to be.

01:20:36 ◼   ► So I get in the car and I'm in the passenger seat.

01:20:39 ◼   ► I'm riding shotgun and I start the transfer and I do this from phone to phone in the middle

01:20:43 ◼   ► of the car with no wifi available.

01:20:45 ◼   ► And only one of these devices can get on the internet.

01:20:47 ◼   ► I do that.

01:20:49 ◼   ► And it asks me, do you want to do the cellular transfer?

01:20:51 ◼   ► Hell yeah, I do.

01:20:52 ◼   ► Why not?

01:20:52 ◼   ► This is going to be great.

01:20:53 ◼   ► And so I immediately transfer my cell plan from the old phone to the new phone.

01:20:57 ◼   ► You did this in a moving car and I can never successfully do it from my house.

01:21:00 ◼   ► While traveling, by the way.

01:21:02 ◼   ► And, and what, eight hours before a flight?

01:21:04 ◼   ► Something like that.

01:21:06 ◼   ► I can't do that mental math without distracting myself.

01:21:08 ◼   ► Okay, great.

01:21:08 ◼   ► This is so many good ideas.

01:21:10 ◼   ► Yeah, this is, this is just a litany of excellent ideas.

01:21:14 ◼   ► Like I said.

01:21:14 ◼   ► And by the way, you know, you just got through saying like how you were probably mistaken about

01:21:18 ◼   ► the transfer speeds of the wired connections on phones because you were misremembering about

01:21:21 ◼   ► the iPads, blah, blah, blah.

01:21:22 ◼   ► You know, but I just want to throw this out there.

01:21:23 ◼   ► You're not even going to be able to saturate the USB 3.0 whatever speeds of the phone when

01:21:30 ◼   ► transferring thousands and thousands of tiny files.

01:21:33 ◼   ► When creating thousands and thousands of tiny files.

01:21:35 ◼   ► Because you will get swamped by the file IO.

01:21:37 ◼   ► You will not saturate that bus unless you're transferring large individual files.

01:21:41 ◼   ► Like just the SSD speed and the file system speed alone will kill you on that.

01:21:46 ◼   ► Like it just, you can see it yourself.

01:21:48 ◼   ► Like even just in your house on your 2.5 gigabit per second ethernet connection, copy a 20 gig

01:21:54 ◼   ► file from one Mac to another and then copy 2 million 1k files.

01:21:58 ◼   ► You'll get slaughtered on the file system IO alone.

01:22:03 ◼   ► That I feel like is what is going to cause your phone setup to be slow because every application

01:22:09 ◼   ► is a bundle of tiny little files.

01:22:11 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:22:12 ◼   ► And I mean, again, looking back on it, I think that this was a litany of poor assumptions and

01:22:19 ◼   ► even poorer decision making.

01:22:21 ◼   ► But here we were.

01:22:23 ◼   ► So in the interest of telling the story, oh, and I should also interrupt myself and say, well,

01:22:26 ◼   ► no, I'll get there.

01:22:27 ◼   ► Actually, I'll get there.

01:22:28 ◼   ► So I'm in the car.

01:22:29 ◼   ► I'm with Mike and Jason.

01:22:31 ◼   ► Steven had gone back to his house.

01:22:34 ◼   ► So I'm with Mike and Jason and Jill from St. Jude, who was kind enough to travel to bring

01:22:40 ◼   ► us to and from.

01:22:41 ◼   ► And I'm doing this transfer and it's going.

01:22:44 ◼   ► It's not going quickly.

01:22:44 ◼   ► It's quoting two or maybe three hours, but it's going.

01:22:47 ◼   ► We get to the lobby of the hotel.

01:22:50 ◼   ► It's a very trendy, very not fancy in the traditional way, but fancy in the like, you know, look at

01:22:55 ◼   ► me, I'm hip and with it.

01:22:58 ◼   ► That's a reference, John.

01:23:00 ◼   ► Anyways, so we get to the hotel lobby and Erin is there because she did not go with us for

01:23:03 ◼   ► this adventure with Brad and Kathy.

01:23:06 ◼   ► And I think that was it.

01:23:07 ◼   ► And they basically said, hey, let's all have a drink together before we all go our separate

01:23:11 ◼   ► ways.

01:23:12 ◼   ► I say, OK, sure.

01:23:13 ◼   ► And I'm still allowing this transfer to happen.

01:23:15 ◼   ► I should note that while this hotel was very nice and I liked it quite a bit, the Wi-Fi at

01:23:20 ◼   ► the hotel was hilariously bad, hilariously bad Wi-Fi.

01:23:25 ◼   ► Now, how could you have possibly known ahead of time that a hotel Wi-Fi would be not amazing?

01:23:30 ◼   ► Yes.

01:23:31 ◼   ► And what really chaps my bottom is that I always will go and, I was going to say rent,

01:23:38 ◼   ► but borrow a hotspot from one of two different counties' local libraries because there's reciprocity

01:23:43 ◼   ► in the whole rigmarole.

01:23:44 ◼   ► And for this one trip, for some reason, I didn't do that.

01:23:48 ◼   ► I don't know what I was thinking.

01:23:49 ◼   ► I guess I wasn't thinking, but I didn't do that.

01:23:51 ◼   ► Now, granted, cellular Wi-Fi is still not stellar, but I guarantee it's a heck of a lot more stable

01:23:57 ◼   ► than the crappy hotel Wi-Fi was.

01:23:59 ◼   ► So we're all sitting around.

01:24:01 ◼   ► It's Jason, me, Mike, Aaron, Kathy, Brad, and I think that's it.

01:24:05 ◼   ► We're all sitting around and we're watching my transfer happening and everyone there is

01:24:11 ◼   ► making so much fun of me and deservedly so.

01:24:13 ◼   ► What are you doing?

01:24:14 ◼   ► Why would you do this?

01:24:15 ◼   ► Why can't you be an adult?

01:24:16 ◼   ► Why aren't you patient?

01:24:18 ◼   ► You will be home.

01:24:19 ◼   ► You will be in your house in like 16 hours where this will be so much less stressful

01:24:24 ◼   ► and so much easier.

01:24:25 ◼   ► Why did you not do that?

01:24:27 ◼   ► In all logic, every ounce of logic on the planet says that's exactly correct because it is,

01:24:32 ◼   ► but I'm me and I'm impatient and I wanted my new toy.

01:24:35 ◼   ► How well did it go?

01:24:36 ◼   ► So as we're sitting at the bar, all of a sudden the wired, you know, direct phone-to-phone

01:24:41 ◼   ► transfer fails and I have a red triangle on one of the phones and it says, this didn't

01:24:47 ◼   ► work.

01:24:49 ◼   ► Okay, now I'm in a bit of a pickle because the old phone is still the old phone and it

01:24:56 ◼   ► has the boarding pass and all that, except it now has no internet whatsoever because the

01:25:01 ◼   ► cellular, like a dummy, I moved over to the new phone.

01:25:04 ◼   ► This is not good.

01:25:06 ◼   ► At this point, everyone around me is basically in hysterics and Mike and Jason have this unbelievable

01:25:15 ◼   ► glee.

01:25:16 ◼   ► Their eyes are shining.

01:25:17 ◼   ► It's, it's eight o'clock at night or thereabouts.

01:25:19 ◼   ► Their eyes are like lighthouses because they know not only can they tell this story on upgrade,

01:25:26 ◼   ► but their recording upgrade, what was at the time tomorrow, which is I sit here now was four

01:25:32 ◼   ► days ago.

01:25:33 ◼   ► And they look at me dead in the eyes and they say to me, we're going to tell this story and

01:25:38 ◼   ► we're going to do it before you can.

01:25:40 ◼   ► We're going to tell it on our podcast before you can.

01:25:43 ◼   ► And this is going to be delicious.

01:25:45 ◼   ► And they're basically like cackling.

01:25:47 ◼   ► If I could do an evil laugh, I would do so.

01:25:49 ◼   ► I'm not capable of such things.

01:25:50 ◼   ► They are beside themselves with excitement.

01:25:52 ◼   ► And sure enough, if you listen to the latest episode of upgrade number 582, first chance

01:25:57 ◼   ► to make one impression, you will hear their retelling of the story, which I am very disappointed

01:26:03 ◼   ► to say is pretty accurate.

01:26:05 ◼   ► Actually, I'm a little sad about that.

01:26:07 ◼   ► I feel like, by the way, I feel like this now settles the debt of us stealing Ask Upgrade

01:26:11 ◼   ► from them.

01:26:12 ◼   ► I think that's true.

01:26:13 ◼   ► Actually, I think, I think that's fair.

01:26:14 ◼   ► See, I took one for the team, for you two.

01:26:16 ◼   ► I took one for the team.

01:26:17 ◼   ► You're welcome.

01:26:18 ◼   ► So at this point, I realized, okay, this is not good.

01:26:22 ◼   ► So I decide to, if I recall correctly, I should have taken notes, but I was in such a tizzy.

01:26:28 ◼   ► Jeez, I wonder why.

01:26:29 ◼   ► I believe at this point I did the direct transfer.

01:26:31 ◼   ► I'm sorry, the Wi-Fi direct peer-to-peer transfer.

01:26:34 ◼   ► So I'm not using a cable anymore.

01:26:35 ◼   ► I plug both of the phones into the wall and I let it run overnight.

01:26:40 ◼   ► At 1.15ish or thereabouts, I woke up and was like, oh my God, what's happening with

01:26:43 ◼   ► the phones?

01:26:44 ◼   ► Oh my God, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God.

01:26:45 ◼   ► Did you sleep at all?

01:26:46 ◼   ► I did.

01:26:46 ◼   ► I did.

01:26:47 ◼   ► I went, I was passed out at like nine, but at about 1.15, I woke up and was like, well,

01:26:51 ◼   ► I'm done because now I'm stressing out about the phones again.

01:26:54 ◼   ► And so I tossed and turned until basically 3.30 when we, or no, 3.45, I think it was when

01:27:01 ◼   ► we needed to get up to catch the 4.30 car.

01:27:03 ◼   ► But that being said, everything did transfer except, except, curiously, my entire iMessage

01:27:12 ◼   ► history disappeared from the new phone.

01:27:14 ◼   ► It was on the old one, disappeared from the new phone, which was annoying, but fine.

01:27:18 ◼   ► And I'm going to come back to this in a second.

01:27:19 ◼   ► So the whole question.

01:27:20 ◼   ► It didn't disappear from the new phone.

01:27:21 ◼   ► It was just never on the new phone.

01:27:22 ◼   ► Okay.

01:27:22 ◼   ► Sorry.

01:27:23 ◼   ► Yes.

01:27:23 ◼   ► Yes.

01:27:23 ◼   ► So that is fair.

01:27:24 ◼   ► And I'm going to come back around to this in just a second.

01:27:26 ◼   ► But this, at first I was like, oh, that's a bummer.

01:27:30 ◼   ► Like, I mean, there's times I'll refer back to old messages, but in the grand scheme of

01:27:33 ◼   ► things, it's probably fine.

01:27:34 ◼   ► And then I realized, oh, oh no, this isn't going to work because I'm in a handful of group

01:27:41 ◼   ► chats.

01:27:41 ◼   ► I wouldn't say it's an immense number, but enough.

01:27:44 ◼   ► And most of these group chats have images that represent the group chat.

01:27:49 ◼   ► You know what I'm saying?

01:27:49 ◼   ► Like little icons or whatever that have been stable for years, which means I basically have

01:27:54 ◼   ► the mental equivalent of muscle memory.

01:27:56 ◼   ► I guess mental memory, whatever memory, memory.

01:27:58 ◼   ► I have some sort of memory where I cannot find these frigging group chats unless they

01:28:02 ◼   ► have the particular icons I'm used to, and I'm screwed.

01:28:04 ◼   ► And so at that point, I realized, all right, I'm going to get home with this the way it is,

01:28:09 ◼   ► but I'm going to have to handle this differently.

01:28:11 ◼   ► So as an aside to this tale of woe, which is not done yet, do you guys use iMessage in iCloud

01:28:19 ◼   ► or whatever the heck it's called?

01:28:20 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:28:20 ◼   ► Because I don't.

01:28:22 ◼   ► Why don't you?

01:28:23 ◼   ► Why not?

01:28:24 ◼   ► Well, because...

01:28:25 ◼   ► I guess we just got him to use iCloud photo library.

01:28:26 ◼   ► I was just going to say, well, that's not going to be a problem because, of course,

01:28:30 ◼   ► he uses messages in iCloud and it'll just eventually sync.

01:28:32 ◼   ► Sometimes it takes a long time, but you know.

01:28:33 ◼   ► So I don't for two reasons.

01:28:35 ◼   ► Number one is uniquely me, which is that I don't know if you two have ever exchanged a message

01:28:40 ◼   ► with me, but I tend to lean heavily on GIFs and other pieces of media.

01:28:44 ◼   ► And over time, that adds up.

01:28:47 ◼   ► And so I think I have something like 100 gigs of messages on my phone right now.

01:28:51 ◼   ► And I don't necessarily want to take up 100 gigs of my iCloud account with my stupid

01:28:55 ◼   ► GIFs.

01:28:55 ◼   ► Like, as much as I love my GIFs, I don't think I need 100 gigs of the same five GIFs

01:29:00 ◼   ► or whatever rolling around in iCloud.

01:29:02 ◼   ► And the other reason was, I believe, and I'm probably going to get the details wrong, but

01:29:07 ◼   ► if you use messages in iCloud, Apple does have an encryption key to it.

01:29:12 ◼   ► And even though I really genuinely have nothing to hide, that just kind of creeps me out.

01:29:15 ◼   ► And it creeps me out that I'm also making a decision on your behalf, you, Marco, you,

01:29:20 ◼   ► John, who might text me or iMessage me, that whatever you send me, Apple could see.

01:29:26 ◼   ► Now, do they care about me?

01:29:27 ◼   ► No.

01:29:27 ◼   ► Would they ever bother?

01:29:28 ◼   ► No.

01:29:28 ◼   ► But it's something that could happen.

01:29:31 ◼   ► And so I've always been a little scared of it, but I'm starting to wonder if maybe I should

01:29:34 ◼   ► just go ahead and start using it.

01:29:35 ◼   ► You should.

01:29:36 ◼   ► Yes, you should.

01:29:37 ◼   ► All right.

01:29:37 ◼   ► All right.

01:29:38 ◼   ► So that's all that.

01:29:39 ◼   ► So I get home and I decide, all right, this is not going to work.

01:29:42 ◼   ► I know what I'm going to do.

01:29:44 ◼   ► I'm going to do a backup from the old phone, and then I'm going to do a restore to the new

01:29:50 ◼   ► phone.

01:29:51 ◼   ► I'm going to do a whole new restore.

01:29:52 ◼   ► I'm going to do this from home where everything is calm.

01:29:55 ◼   ► And by the way, I made it home.

01:29:56 ◼   ► No problem.

01:29:56 ◼   ► Everything worked great, except my iMessage, you know, snafu.

01:30:00 ◼   ► And so everything will be fine.

01:30:02 ◼   ► So I take a backup of the phone and then I have a brainwave and I think, oh, you know

01:30:07 ◼   ► what I should do just to make this easier and safer since I'm messing about with everything

01:30:11 ◼   ► now?

01:30:11 ◼   ► I should unpair my watch from the new phone and get it prepared for when I re-restore.

01:30:17 ◼   ► What I didn't think about, though, is that I now have rings from that day and I have some

01:30:25 ◼   ► other stuff that I had accumulated that day that never got backed up when I made the most

01:30:30 ◼   ► recent backup because the most recent backup was from the old phone, which was no longer

01:30:33 ◼   ► paired to the watch.

01:30:34 ◼   ► I'm such an idiot in summary, but here we are.

01:30:37 ◼   ► And so I did my backup, I did my restore, and I also thought to myself, you know what?

01:30:42 ◼   ► Maybe the Thunderbolt 4 cable that I'm using that cost me $11 billion, maybe that was the

01:30:48 ◼   ► issue.

01:30:48 ◼   ► So I took the Thunderbolt 5 cable from my brand new CalDigit TS5 Plus and I used that directly

01:30:56 ◼   ► plugged into my laptop to do the restore.

01:30:59 ◼   ► Do you want to guess if it made any difference with regard to speed?

01:31:01 ◼   ► No, it did not.

01:31:02 ◼   ► Of course not.

01:31:03 ◼   ► Just to give some stats on this, your new phone has 10 gigabits per second out of that port.

01:31:09 ◼   ► Thunderbolt 3 and 4 are 40.

01:31:10 ◼   ► Thunderbolt 5 is 80 up to 120.

01:31:14 ◼   ► So no, putting a faster than 40 gigabits per second thing into your 10 gigabit per second

01:31:19 ◼   ► port is not going to help you.

01:31:21 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:31:21 ◼   ► So this was a disaster through and through.

01:31:23 ◼   ► But I did the update or the restore and my iMessage stuff came back.

01:31:28 ◼   ► Everything was good to go.

01:31:29 ◼   ► And so now I think for me, I think, and I can't decide what's the right answers, but I'm starting

01:31:36 ◼   ► to wonder if I do this again, if I do the old school back to, you know, not Finder, I almost

01:31:42 ◼   ► said iTunes, but do a backup to Finder and then restore from Finder.

01:31:46 ◼   ► I, I'm really wondering if maybe I'll do that next time.

01:31:48 ◼   ► I got a noodle on it, but the right answer is probably what Marco said and just use iCloud.

01:31:52 ◼   ► But I'm wondering.

01:31:53 ◼   ► It's so much more reliable.

01:31:54 ◼   ► But you can only use iCloud if you do messages on iCloud, because otherwise your messages are

01:31:57 ◼   ► never coming back on that phone.

01:31:58 ◼   ► That's a good point.

01:31:59 ◼   ► That's a good point.

01:32:00 ◼   ► All right.

01:32:00 ◼   ► So I got a lot to think about.

01:32:01 ◼   ► But anyways, so I did all that.

01:32:03 ◼   ► It restored just great.

01:32:04 ◼   ► It, I got the watch repaired, but then I realized, oh no, oh no, my rings for the day are

01:32:12 ◼   ► gone and I'm not above adjusting the rings on a day.

01:32:15 ◼   ► You know, you can now do like bring, bring your ring back for one day, but I've got some

01:32:19 ◼   ► streaks to maintain and I really try to be honest about it.

01:32:22 ◼   ► I really, really do.

01:32:23 ◼   ► And so for several hours, that whatever background magical process that you can, of course, not

01:32:29 ◼   ► just kick off by hand, you have to wait for Apple to decide now it's the time to do it.

01:32:34 ◼   ► And for many hours, like five hours, it didn't ever re compute the status of my rings, but

01:32:40 ◼   ► I'm happy to say that eventually it did and all is well.

01:32:43 ◼   ► So I'm telling, I have a monthly FaceTime with our dear friend underscore David Smith and

01:32:48 ◼   ► I'm retelling the story.

01:32:49 ◼   ► I don't want to say it's like yesterday, the day before, I guess it was yesterday.

01:32:52 ◼   ► And I'm telling him about this and he says, you know what you should do?

01:32:57 ◼   ► Because you have the situation where you want to do a wire transfer, but you want it at the

01:33:02 ◼   ► highest speed possible and you want to provide power.

01:33:05 ◼   ► Here's what you do.

01:33:06 ◼   ► Disconnect your computer from the CalDigit.

01:33:08 ◼   ► When you do Aaron's phone, plug Aaron's phone into the CalDigit as like the source, or I'm

01:33:13 ◼   ► sorry, the old phone in the CalDigit is like the source.

01:33:16 ◼   ► Use your other Thunderbolt cable also into the CalDigit as the target and see if that works

01:33:21 ◼   ► any better.

01:33:22 ◼   ► Let me tell you, do you want to guess how much better that worked?

01:33:26 ◼   ► Made no difference whatsoever.

01:33:28 ◼   ► It made zero difference.

01:33:30 ◼   ► You cannot saturate that 10 gigabytes per second when you're transferring millions of tiny files

01:33:35 ◼   ► anyway.

01:33:35 ◼   ► Only when you're transferring a few large files will you saturate it if you're lucky.

01:33:38 ◼   ► It made zero difference whatsoever.

01:33:40 ◼   ► I'm a disaster.

01:33:41 ◼   ► This is all waste.

01:33:42 ◼   ► So I guess the official ATP guidance for the future, which I will forget.

01:33:47 ◼   ► So it's all, it's on you guys to remind me, you folks to remind me in the future.

01:33:50 ◼   ► I think the official ATP guidance is turn on messages in iCloud and just do a damn iCloud

01:33:55 ◼   ► back or iCloud restore and just be done.

01:33:57 ◼   ► I still say device to device should be your default.

01:33:59 ◼   ► iCloud is the second fallback, but you know, it depends on what you've had success with in

01:34:03 ◼   ► the past.

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01:36:00 ◼   ► So Marco, tell me about your iPhone 17 Air.

01:36:02 ◼   ► Okay.

01:36:03 ◼   ► Is that...

01:36:03 ◼   ► I know, iPhone Air.

01:36:04 ◼   ► No, I'm sorry.

01:36:05 ◼   ► Not iPhone 17 Air.

01:36:06 ◼   ► There you go.

01:36:06 ◼   ► iPhone Air.

01:36:06 ◼   ► Saved us from a lot of angry people.

01:36:08 ◼   ► All right.

01:36:08 ◼   ► Easy peasy.

01:36:09 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:36:09 ◼   ► All right.

01:36:10 ◼   ► So I first moved in to the iPhone Air.

01:36:13 ◼   ► It feels incredibly light for its size.

01:36:18 ◼   ► Let me just quickly interject.

01:36:19 ◼   ► I did briefly hold one in the Apple store when I was picking up my phones.

01:36:23 ◼   ► Oh, my God.

01:36:24 ◼   ► Yeah.

01:36:24 ◼   ► It feels incredible.

01:36:27 ◼   ► It is incredible how good that feels in hand.

01:36:31 ◼   ► Now, yes, it is big, but it's so thin and so light.

01:36:35 ◼   ► And oh, my God, I want it so badly.

01:36:37 ◼   ► It's almost like when I...

01:36:39 ◼   ► So in order to get the iPhone Air, I actually ended up paying like 50 bucks for it because

01:36:43 ◼   ► I had test phones that I traded in to get it.

01:36:47 ◼   ► As part of my pile of test phones I brought in, one of them had a case where I had popped

01:36:51 ◼   ► the case off of it so they could process the trade in.

01:36:53 ◼   ► And holding the empty phone case for my...

01:36:58 ◼   ► It was a 14 plus.

01:36:59 ◼   ► The empty case for that.

01:37:01 ◼   ► And then I picked up the Air.

01:37:02 ◼   ► I'm like, this feels very similar.

01:37:04 ◼   ► It's incredible.

01:37:05 ◼   ► It really...

01:37:05 ◼   ► I have a dissenting opinion on the feel of the Air.

01:37:08 ◼   ► I did also visit an Apple store to check out the new phones.

01:37:11 ◼   ► And here's the things that I was surprised by feeling the air.

01:37:15 ◼   ► Not for very long, obviously, but just, you know, playing with it on the table.

01:37:18 ◼   ► It was nicer looking in person than I thought it would be.

01:37:21 ◼   ► And I already liked how it looked, but I felt like the ugly camera thing at the top didn't

01:37:27 ◼   ► bother me as much, especially on the white phone because it kind of blends in.

01:37:30 ◼   ► Which of the whites?

01:37:31 ◼   ► Yeah, and it looks real good.

01:37:33 ◼   ► But also, what I realized is just how much I hate big phones.

01:37:38 ◼   ► Yes.

01:37:39 ◼   ► Although this phone was light and it felt very thin, all I could think was, this phone

01:37:45 ◼   ► feels too big.

01:37:45 ◼   ► And I know, it's like, how is the iPhone Air too big?

01:37:48 ◼   ► It's not too big thickness-wise.

01:37:49 ◼   ► It's too big for me personally, width-wise.

01:37:52 ◼   ► So all I could think of was this airing of this phone was like, oh man, can you give me

01:37:56 ◼   ► this phone in an iPhone 14, let's say, because that's my favorite size, probably.

01:38:02 ◼   ► Not the 17, it's a little bit bigger.

01:38:03 ◼   ► But you know, like the normal non-Mac size, the Air is in between the Macs and the Pro.

01:38:07 ◼   ► So give me the normal Pro size, maybe a little bit smaller.

01:38:12 ◼   ► But this thin, and with three cameras on it, someday in the future, that's going to be

01:38:17 ◼   ► an amazing phone.

01:38:17 ◼   ► But I can say right now, for the Air, despite me really liking how it looks and it being nicer

01:38:21 ◼   ► in person than I thought, it's just too darn wide for me.

01:38:25 ◼   ► John, you are spoiling my review.

01:38:27 ◼   ► I'm so mad.

01:38:28 ◼   ► But you use big phones, though.

01:38:30 ◼   ► I thought you weren't against them.

01:38:32 ◼   ► Well, no.

01:38:33 ◼   ► I've never been into like the Plus and Max.

01:38:35 ◼   ► Anyway, so let's go back to a second.

01:38:38 ◼   ► I'm going to go over this Plus a little more.

01:38:39 ◼   ► All right.

01:38:40 ◼   ► So let's first start with color.

01:38:43 ◼   ► I got the blue one.

01:38:44 ◼   ► No, I didn't.

01:38:45 ◼   ► I got one of the white ones.

01:38:46 ◼   ► What do you mean blue?

01:38:48 ◼   ► There's no blue one.

01:38:49 ◼   ► This phone is available in black and three whites.

01:38:52 ◼   ► They're all white.

01:38:53 ◼   ► Like, nothing about this looks blue at all.

01:38:56 ◼   ► If I didn't know I bought the blue and see on the box that it said blue, I would never

01:39:02 ◼   ► have guessed this was blue.

01:39:03 ◼   ► This does not come in colors.

01:39:05 ◼   ► It comes in black, white, white, and white.

01:39:07 ◼   ► It's comical.

01:39:08 ◼   ► Wait, is there a white one?

01:39:10 ◼   ► Yes, there really is.

01:39:11 ◼   ► Okay, so maybe I was holding a white one and maybe I wasn't.

01:39:14 ◼   ► But there is, in fact, a white one.

01:39:16 ◼   ► There's no way to know.

01:39:18 ◼   ► Even when you see them side by side in the store, you can barely even tell.

01:39:21 ◼   ► Like, it's comical.

01:39:23 ◼   ► These are the most homeopathic colors I've ever seen in Apple's lineup.

01:39:29 ◼   ► It is comical.

01:39:30 ◼   ► There is no blue in this blue.

01:39:32 ◼   ► So anyway, it does, you know, it feels very, you know, thin, light.

01:39:37 ◼   ► It feels like shocking.

01:39:38 ◼   ► However, you were right, John.

01:39:40 ◼   ► Like, this is not a thin Pro.

01:39:44 ◼   ► This is a thin Max phone.

01:39:47 ◼   ► It is noticeably bigger in, you know, length and width.

01:39:51 ◼   ► Noticeably bigger than the mid-sized Pro and, you know, base 17 lines.

01:39:56 ◼   ► It also, it behaves like them software-wise.

01:39:59 ◼   ► If you ever used a Plus or a Max phone, if you turn the phone in landscape, a lot of apps

01:40:05 ◼   ► will give you kind of an iPad-style sidebar layout.

01:40:08 ◼   ► This phone does that.

01:40:10 ◼   ► Like, even Apple's software considers this a Plus or a Max phone.

01:40:14 ◼   ► If you're coming from an iPhone Mini thinking that you might want an Air, I don't think you do.

01:40:20 ◼   ► Like, I think that's going to be a big jump in hand size.

01:40:25 ◼   ► And for me, I actually have found that the Air, the ergonomics of it are not a great fit for me.

01:40:32 ◼   ► And it comes down to some of those little differences about it being a bigger phone than the Pros.

01:40:39 ◼   ► Like, one of the simple things is, like, the sleep-wake button is a little bit too high for me to hit comfortably with my regular way I hold a phone.

01:40:47 ◼   ► Also, the exceptional thinness of it, I find, actually makes the ergonomics of using the phone a little bit worse in some ways.

01:40:56 ◼   ► And this is what I was saying earlier about, like, I don't think I would want a phone to be any thinner than this.

01:41:00 ◼   ► And you start running into, like, usability challenges.

01:41:02 ◼   ► So there's a couple things.

01:41:03 ◼   ► So, number one, the combination of the thinness and also the very thin screen bezels that modern phones have caused me to actually have a lot of accidental input on the touchscreen around the edges as I would just handle the phone.

01:41:18 ◼   ► More than the Pros do.

01:41:20 ◼   ► Like, you know, I've been using my phone without a case for a while or using, at best, one of those leather magnetic backs that just is the back only and no sides.

01:41:27 ◼   ► So I'm used to staying away from the sides holding this phone.

01:41:31 ◼   ► And I should clarify, I was using the Air without a case.

01:41:33 ◼   ► And also without the battery pack, just the regular, the phone by itself.

01:41:37 ◼   ► It is actually, it's so thin that it is hard for me to operate without causing error input on the sides of the screen.

01:41:46 ◼   ► It's also, because it's so thin, it's harder to pick up off a table.

01:41:50 ◼   ► Like, it's little things like that.

01:41:52 ◼   ► It also, if you lay it down on a surface, because it has that giant camera on one end but nothing on the other end, really,

01:41:58 ◼   ► it wobbles a lot more than the other phones on a flat surface.

01:42:02 ◼   ► And so all these things, like, the way it handles by being so big and so thin, it even, like, when you put it in your pants pocket,

01:42:10 ◼   ► it's nice that it's super light, but even just the additional size of it made me feel like I was putting, like, a dinner plate in my pocket.

01:42:18 ◼   ► Like, it's a big phone.

01:42:20 ◼   ► This is not, again, this is not a thin Pro.

01:42:23 ◼   ► This is a thin Plus or Max, really.

01:42:26 ◼   ► Like, it's closer to that in feel.

01:42:29 ◼   ► I think if I were to use this phone long term, I think I would want a case for it, just to improve the physical handling of it.

01:42:37 ◼   ► But that would also very much defeat the purpose of the air.

01:42:40 ◼   ► So the ergonomics alone, I decided after about one day, like, I don't think I'm going to stick with this phone.

01:42:47 ◼   ► But I was curious to try it anyway.

01:42:48 ◼   ► As for the other aspects, the battery, I didn't get enough chance to try it.

01:42:53 ◼   ► It seemed fine to me.

01:42:53 ◼   ► I'm sure it's not amazing, not awful.

01:42:56 ◼   ► We saw the test earlier.

01:42:57 ◼   ► It seems like it's actually not as bad as people thought.

01:42:59 ◼   ► It's not going to be great.

01:43:00 ◼   ► It'll be fine.

01:43:01 ◼   ► Camera and speaker.

01:43:03 ◼   ► The speaker volume, as discussed earlier, is not as bad as I expected.

01:43:10 ◼   ► The 17 Pro speaker, though, is way, way louder.

01:43:14 ◼   ► But the volume out of the air speaker is not bad.

01:43:19 ◼   ► It does have a bit of a rattling to it.

01:43:22 ◼   ► Like, if you turn it up all the way, and, like, oftentimes, I will be listening to podcasts out loud when I'm doing something like, you know, I'll have, like, the phone on the counter when I'm doing something in the kitchen.

01:43:31 ◼   ► Or I'll prop it up, like, on a shelf if I'm taking a shower and I want to listen to podcasts, like, stuff like that.

01:43:35 ◼   ► When you crank up the speaker that loud in the air, it's very rattly and tinny.

01:43:41 ◼   ► You almost hear, you hear, like, little bit of distortions at the very top of the volume range, almost as if you had, like, a little speck of dust in there or something.

01:43:48 ◼   ► But also just, like, the tone of it, it's very, it sounds like a very small speaker.

01:43:54 ◼   ► It sounds like the way phone speakers used to sound before they got less crappy.

01:43:58 ◼   ► Modern iPhone Pro speakers, and even the base iPhone speakers, like, modern iPhone speakers in other models sound remarkably good for how small they are.

01:44:07 ◼   ► The air does not.

01:44:08 ◼   ► The air sounds like a tiny, crappy, old-style phone speaker.

01:44:13 ◼   ► It does not sound good at all.

01:44:15 ◼   ► Unless you think Marco had, like, a broken one or something, lots of reviews have said essentially the same thing.

01:44:20 ◼   ► They said basically the air speaker gets really, really loud, but if you put it at max volume, basically there's, like, distortion of some kind, and you have to back it off a little bit.

01:44:27 ◼   ► So even when it's backed off, it is still louder than people expected it to be, but max volume becomes less usable due to these issues.

01:44:35 ◼   ► Yeah, it's very tinny and harsh, and generally it's an unpleasant speaker.

01:44:39 ◼   ► Cameras.

01:44:41 ◼   ► Well, camera.

01:44:44 ◼   ► I did, again, only a day, but I missed macro focus distance.

01:44:49 ◼   ► You know, you get macro focus distance from the wide-angle lens.

01:44:52 ◼   ► I missed, I mean, the ultra-wide.

01:44:53 ◼   ► I missed that.

01:44:55 ◼   ► I did try a test of, like, let me try to read that tiny, stupid, gray-on-gray text on the Apple power adapters to see, like, what wattage's power adapter is.

01:45:03 ◼   ► I did try that test with this phone and the other phones I had, and it was good enough that I could digital zoom, I could pinch in, and I could read small, like, tiny little text on things.

01:45:13 ◼   ► Using the regular camera on the air, so that's fine.

01:45:16 ◼   ► But generally speaking, like, macro distance stuff, it's much nicer to have the macro lens.

01:45:21 ◼   ► And I did miss the telephoto reach, even in just one day.

01:45:25 ◼   ► And then when I later went to the Pro, I've been taking photos of the Pro the last couple days, and it's like, oh, wow, I'm so glad I have this reach with the telephotos.

01:45:32 ◼   ► So, generally, I do miss that camera a lot.

01:45:35 ◼   ► Let's talk about heat.

01:45:37 ◼   ► The air does seem to overheat and thermal throttle itself very easily and very frequently.

01:45:44 ◼   ► I mentioned earlier how long that preparing update took, and it was really warm the whole time.

01:45:49 ◼   ► So, it could have been that.

01:45:50 ◼   ► It could have been something else.

01:45:51 ◼   ► If you look at benchmarks of the air, the benchmarks often show the air being a little bit slower than the 17 and 17 Pro in certain tests.

01:46:02 ◼   ► My guess is that it's throttling during benchmarking, and it seems very likely because doing almost anything to it, if you feel that camera bump, it's warm.

01:46:11 ◼   ► Now, you won't know if you're holding the phone using it regularly.

01:46:15 ◼   ► You might not realize this because the heat doesn't travel down to the middle of the phone.

01:46:20 ◼   ► Like, the heat stays up in that camera mesa or camera plateau area.

01:46:24 ◼   ► In some ways, that's nice in the sense that it's not heating up your hand uncomfortably, but it also makes it hard to dissipate the heat.

01:46:30 ◼   ► So, for instance, my MagSafe fans that I have, they don't work on the air.

01:46:35 ◼   ► They don't do anything because they're cooling the MagSafe area, but the MagSafe area doesn't get hot in the first place.

01:46:41 ◼   ► The heat doesn't get there.

01:46:42 ◼   ► It's all in the camera plateau.

01:46:44 ◼   ► You need a camera bump fan.

01:46:45 ◼   ► Yeah, I know.

01:46:46 ◼   ► And speaking of throttling on these phones, the people who've done the tests on them, like, all the phones throttle.

01:46:51 ◼   ► All of them thermal throttle.

01:46:52 ◼   ► But interestingly, what they found when doing, like, Air versus Pro tests, obviously, the pros come out ahead.

01:46:57 ◼   ► But looking at, like, the graph of how they throttle, what happens is that, like, a lot of these benchmarks would give, like, a stability score of, like, how even is, like, the frame rate in this game or whatever, you know, this benchmark.