The Accidental Tech Podcast

44: A Plague With Very Minor Effects


00:00:01   what does your application have going for a brand was that a hideous icon that [TS]

00:00:05   happens to include feet following following brands like a rebranding [TS]

00:00:13   effort all you've got going for you is the fact that your icon had feet and so [TS]

00:00:17   getting an Orange Julius icon has feet it's like like your own age you're [TS]

00:00:22   you're owning the feet so but what if I don't really need to worry about brand [TS]

00:00:26   recognition because only like three or four hundred people have ever bought the [TS]

00:00:29   damn thing in the first it doesn't matter is not going they're looking for [TS]

00:00:33   the feet that's what you've got his feet and you know I think being whimsical [TS]

00:00:37   like that was your instinct that's what you brought to the application you do [TS]

00:00:40   feed on that terrible icon you brought that they came from you that is your own [TS]

00:00:44   personal creative input into the branding of this application if you got [TS]

00:00:47   some other creative input put it in but don't like I wouldn't just throw that [TS]

00:00:50   away you wanted to feed you got feet I kept his feet [TS]

00:00:55   here's one from John dark spelled with an e at the end of dark it's pretty [TS]

00:01:02   awesome name of the issue really haven't eaten his first name but he brought up [TS]

00:01:07   an interesting point that I think of when we were talking about the Apple [TS]

00:01:11   lightning connector and the upcoming USB connector that we don't know anything [TS]

00:01:17   about other than it's not going to sock and it will be bidirectional wait we [TS]

00:01:20   don't know it's not going to say well it's still very much can suck it I guess [TS]

00:01:24   I suppose but they're saying all the right things about it and when we talked [TS]

00:01:28   about that I was saying like it's hard to think of that connect your doing [TS]

00:01:31   anything except for something like the Lightning connector not exactly but in [TS]

00:01:36   reverse with that but the contacts on the outside and a solid metal thing [TS]

00:01:38   instead of being like micro-usb mini-usb where it took a little bent piece of [TS]

00:01:42   metal crap on the inside because that is very delicate and annoying and crappy [TS]

00:01:47   and it seems crazy to me that they would make a new connector and make it like [TS]

00:01:52   it's like micro USB on our server ssible that's not really great for that [TS]

00:01:57   wouldn't be a very big improvement democracy right I suppose they could [TS]

00:02:00   still do that but anyway this blog post says okay so say my speculation and [TS]

00:02:05   being close to write and produce a connector that is in the style of the [TS]

00:02:11   Lightning connector but isn't obviously not allowed [TS]

00:02:13   connector and say that Apple eventually adopt that because it's a better [TS]

00:02:17   connector than the current full-sized USB input in all their products and all [TS]

00:02:20   that stuff you would end up with the cable like the one that's drawn in this [TS]

00:02:24   blog posted open link yet actually read this post earlier that cable would be [TS]

00:02:29   kind of a nightmare don't sugary cuz it looks like lightning on one end and they [TS]

00:02:34   made a USB connector on the other that looks like lightning but not really like [TS]

00:02:37   it's a little bit thinner and the context or longer and you lose all the [TS]

00:02:41   advantages of the reversible capable of the new USB thing and everything and you [TS]

00:02:46   know consumers would have trouble figuring out which ended which because [TS]

00:02:49   they look so similar and you have a linear revealed in overtime but maybe [TS]

00:02:53   even we were messin up of bleary-eyed in the morning trying to plug something in [TS]

00:02:57   so that's kind of like the the curse of being first for Apple came up with [TS]

00:03:01   lightning connector ball the USB guys kept screwing up their connectors making [TS]

00:03:05   their crappy things and not for a while now I can see Apple's get these great [TS]

00:03:08   connectors on their devices and of course the big fat ugly other end that [TS]

00:03:12   connects your computer is you never get a computer lightning connector right but [TS]

00:03:16   if the new USB connector look something like lightning Apple could find itself [TS]

00:03:19   in a stranger uncomfortable situation and I don't think they can go USB on [TS]

00:03:23   both ends because of all this you know planning they have a lightning connector [TS]

00:03:27   and how it works with all their devices and how that's and change the insides [TS]

00:03:30   will keep him that the characters and all that good stuff well first of all [TS]

00:03:34   I'm guessing that the USB reversible [TS]

00:03:37   to discuss calling it USB Type C as I do we have this unofficial name the type C [TS]

00:03:42   plug [TS]

00:03:43   thanks for the call in the thing that he likes for me [TS]

00:03:46   good so we can go so if this if this type C thing ends up coming out be [TS]

00:03:52   reversible and resembling lightning in its general design I would guess almost [TS]

00:03:58   certainly it would be wider but by a substantial amount to accommodate all [TS]

00:04:03   depends necessary do usb3 at a reasonable cost us money not the [TS]

00:04:08   Lightning country has very very tiny little contact pads and the and then the [TS]

00:04:13   port is required to have these little tiny pins all that signatures Asian I'm [TS]

00:04:18   guessing might run afoul of USB his desire to be super cheap and and [TS]

00:04:24   and to have pretty broad tolerances so that any idiot can make one of these [TS]

00:04:28   connectors or ports and at work I'm guessing the connector would not be [TS]

00:04:33   nearly as small as lightning and that alone would be a pretty big pretty big [TS]

00:04:36   switch also lets you might realistically speaking here like how likely is it that [TS]

00:04:42   the USB people are going to make aspect that's as good as lightning to be [TS]

00:04:46   actually easily confused with it like I'm guessing to be in some way clunkier [TS]

00:04:51   and I love you proven wrong and I hope I am wrong on that but I'm guessing you [TS]

00:04:55   know looking at their history of how they had to do things when they [TS]

00:04:58   prioritize I don't think what they make is going to end up being confusingly [TS]

00:05:03   similar to like Apple's easy Appleby that no matter what the Kinect looks [TS]

00:05:06   like make the plastic gravity in thinking on the Lightning connector just [TS]

00:05:10   massive so that it's like the same size as the current USB connector on a [TS]

00:05:14   lightning cable except maybe there's a little dinky thing so even if they made [TS]

00:05:17   the connectors activism size Apple since it marlys controls the Lightning [TS]

00:05:21   connector market or the people who want to use lighting connectors could dictate [TS]

00:05:24   that the end is not lightning has to be this big fat chunky thing I think also I [TS]

00:05:29   am pretty sure we can safely rule out the the latter two possibilities in [TS]

00:05:34   John's blog post about either Apple basically killing lightning and adopting [TS]

00:05:39   USB or Apple working together with the USB foreign people to to to make one [TS]

00:05:47   better standard together I think we can pretty safely pull those things out as a [TS]

00:05:51   very very unlikely though it up as motivation would be to standardize since [TS]

00:05:56   they they love having their very own connector with their own particular [TS]

00:05:59   attributes they can license accessory manufacturers and all I could see [TS]

00:06:04   exactly because you know that they do make a lot of money off those licensing [TS]

00:06:07   fees and and I think I think more than the money I think the money is a [TS]

00:06:11   secondary concern for them I I think the bigger reason they do is control you [TS]

00:06:16   know they love having control over what their devices can and can't do they love [TS]

00:06:22   having control over what accessories can you can do how they interact with the [TS]

00:06:26   device and then I think they also like that if you make a lightning port device [TS]

00:06:30   it's not going to work on somebody's Android phone you know all these things [TS]

00:06:34   really benefit apple and there's there's really no motivation to change [TS]

00:06:36   and the best thing about it is finally Apple has found a market in a position [TS]

00:06:41   in the market where this lack of compatibility with the other guys does [TS]

00:06:45   not hurt them because back in the day was like whoa real keyboards and mice [TS]

00:06:48   use insert connector here but Apple uses this crazy thing called ADB and so you [TS]

00:06:52   have to buy special Apple keyboard attended by a regular keyboard and [TS]

00:06:56   eventually adopted USB and moralistic and a USB keyboard connected either [TS]

00:07:01   computer so during the whole Mac PC era the Mac was doing that every single area [TS]

00:07:05   where it didn't conform to the rest of the industry now in the portable device [TS]

00:07:11   basin you know the iPod space Apple so dominated the portable music players [TS]

00:07:15   based at 30 pin became sort of the defacto standard and now in the phone [TS]

00:07:18   market people might not buy an iPhone because it doesn't have a big enough [TS]

00:07:21   screen or like some other things like that but I don't think people are saying [TS]

00:07:25   well I was gonna get an iPhone but it doesn't use USB uses this lightning [TS]

00:07:29   connector type thing people may still grab a lightning connector and the cost [TS]

00:07:32   of it but it doesn't hurt them as much as I think all their special Apple [TS]

00:07:36   specific weirdness used to hurt and this Apple always want to have its own weird [TS]

00:07:40   thing but it was the negatives were not overwhelming but kind of must have [TS]

00:07:45   annoyed apple now finally they have the portable device market place where they [TS]

00:07:51   can do their proprietary stuff and only take a min demoted in the market for [TS]

00:07:55   almost non-existent and people just grin and bear it he said that though but [TS]

00:08:00   grouper made a post about this week or two ago about how the lightning cable I [TS]

00:08:05   think it was something he was is the epitome of the difference in perspective [TS]

00:08:10   between Apple users and Android users and actually pointed this out I sent [TS]

00:08:14   this article to 100 loving friends and they were like yeah that's stupid why [TS]

00:08:19   would you want a proprietary cable and man it's just to me that makes no sense [TS]

00:08:24   I don't need to have a really clunky cable that I have three hundred of I'd [TS]

00:08:29   rather have one cable that works very well all the time and it just struck me [TS]

00:08:35   is so weird that that was the posters right about the difference in the news [TS]

00:08:40   for those users who have already made their choice or who has some sort of [TS]

00:08:42   like some allegiance to one side of the other regular people who have no [TS]

00:08:46   I don't care or know anything different about them like they expect when you get [TS]

00:08:51   a new thing nobody knew accessories that have to go with that I know people are [TS]

00:08:54   enough people are like well I can't reuse my charging cable then forget it [TS]

00:08:58   because across Android phones maybe you can reuse the same cables are the same [TS]

00:09:03   charges they don't work as well it's it's not a big deal because they come [TS]

00:09:06   with you no wonder two cables or whatever the iphone come with this guy I [TS]

00:09:11   think the experience of using lightning cable like you said Casey for regular [TS]

00:09:16   people is more important than the theoretical advantage of being able to [TS]

00:09:20   reuse cables across bones that you're right we also got a lot of feedback [TS]

00:09:26   about dual input displays because during the believe was last show we talk a lot [TS]

00:09:32   or was it one tweet [TS]

00:09:34   well I saw one to eat now pay people kept waiting and saying isn't it [TS]

00:09:38   possible they just hooked up to cable right from two cables from your Mac [TS]

00:09:42   grouchy reminder that does not solve the problem [TS]

00:09:45   you know do you think Apple could do this do you think Apple will do this [TS]

00:09:48   every variation so there were allowed to write but John you've put one specific [TS]

00:09:53   tweet into the show notes do you care to expound upon that the slide from Apple's [TS]

00:09:58   most recent presentation about the Mac Pro that showing the back of the [TS]

00:10:02   machines as next-generation video up to 34 K displays single and dual input [TS]

00:10:07   displays and I don't even know what that means I remember that being on the slide [TS]

00:10:11   but I guess I just forgot about entirely I'm not even sure what they're getting [TS]

00:10:15   ready they want you want to venture a guess [TS]

00:10:17   well last unless we we talked about how it was going to be pretty impossible for [TS]

00:10:24   them to ship a 50 120 pixels wide monitor what should be a perfect to exit [TS]

00:10:30   the current 27 they would be impossible because it would use more bandwidth than [TS]

00:10:34   wonderful 2.0 cable will support and now back in the days when these 30 inch [TS]

00:10:43   Cinema Display first came out it was one of the first monitors in the market [TS]

00:10:46   required dual link DVI and what dual-link DVI basically is is a whole [TS]

00:10:52   bunch more D it's basically you know to regular DVI channels into in one cable [TS]

00:10:58   that has [TS]

00:10:59   ton of tens and it requires special video card that would support this and [TS]

00:11:04   it was everything was very expensive and everything that was pretty much the same [TS]

00:11:08   idea which is like you have the standard and forgiveness wrongly please email us [TS]

00:11:12   actually from going from curious but it was it was you know this the standard is [TS]

00:11:17   not fast enough to support all the resolutions that have basically as far [TS]

00:11:20   as I know that they've basically divided the display and half logically in the [TS]

00:11:23   controllers and just like how you can render one-half so by doing something [TS]

00:11:28   similar if you could lay together say two Thunderbolt cables into one monitor [TS]

00:11:34   that was made to handle this and the video card for me to handle this is well [TS]

00:11:37   you could theoretically then have enough bandwidth to drive a 5120 pixel display [TS]

00:11:44   the new Mac Pro and and doesn't the new actually at the open to that the new [TS]

00:11:52   Retina MacBook Pro it also has the double to right now so far the only able [TS]

00:11:57   to computer that shipping from Apple that has two ports on it as well and I [TS]

00:12:03   don't know if it has this capability it might not I don't think they've [TS]

00:12:06   advertised but it's it's worth noting that that does have two ports but this [TS]

00:12:10   would be a way now so last last episode they were saying it's impossible to find [TS]

00:12:14   office monitor now with the proof from this slide from Nielsen thank you with [TS]

00:12:20   the perfect the slide actually shows that if a dual input display exists and [TS]

00:12:25   that works the way you think it would which is being able to combine the [TS]

00:12:28   bandwidth of both cables into one display like DVI cable but regardless if [TS]

00:12:35   this works the same way is that that theoretical displayed now is possible [TS]

00:12:40   again for the new member but isn't that what it means when it says dual input [TS]

00:12:44   displays I'm not sure that what it means is a display of it has two inputs and [TS]

00:12:48   you mean both inputs drive to display its native resolution it could just as [TS]

00:12:51   easily mean a display that has two different inputs so you can switch [TS]

00:12:56   between them sooo two different max could share the same monitor I don't I [TS]

00:12:59   don't know what do input display means it's what I'm getting at night what [TS]

00:13:03   value would I don't know I mean I've never bought like you know maybe this [TS]

00:13:07   maybe there's something about produce played with this is a common feature [TS]

00:13:09   what value would there be an apple advertising [TS]

00:13:13   ability to plug into like a switch to monitor the has two different inputs for [TS]

00:13:16   two different sources like I know it's one of those are getting out I think [TS]

00:13:18   this in context were missing from people who produce video pros or something and [TS]

00:13:22   I use this I'm sure we will get email from the people explain to us but busy [TS]

00:13:26   put it on a slide with the expectation that everyone knows what it means and I [TS]

00:13:30   hadn't heard anything about it meaning you know the equipment that you don't [TS]

00:13:34   have been with the run the resolution you can learn to sew the overall of [TS]

00:13:38   people asking is it possible to they could do this it seems technically [TS]

00:13:42   plausible vaguely plausible because doing TV I wasn't a standard that Apple [TS]

00:13:46   may I don't think it was part of the you know whatever the DVI consortium is [TS]

00:13:50   never there were some of the first ones to use it right this this sounds a [TS]

00:13:54   little weird you know especially since it would be 22 actual cables and they're [TS]

00:13:57   like bundled together or something I don't know but it's within the realm [TS]

00:14:01   father will Apple do this I think the costs of probably the cost of a display [TS]

00:14:06   of that resolution is put it outside the realm of things that Apple will do even [TS]

00:14:11   if they could definitely do it but I think the wild card is what did up on me [TS]

00:14:16   and my doin puts players and teams like none of us know for sure so if anyone [TS]

00:14:20   out there knows for sure exactly what happened but doing puts plays let us [TS]

00:14:24   know anything we should point out right now is that we are recording this on [TS]

00:14:28   Monday December 16th at night it is very very likely that the Mac Pros are coming [TS]

00:14:34   out tomorrow it's very likely that by the time most people here this the new [TS]

00:14:39   macros will already be out and if Apple is going to make any kind of display [TS]

00:14:44   announcement at that time that might have already happened as well and other [TS]

00:14:48   people might have already gotten these and tested them and we're saying all [TS]

00:14:50   this before the new macros actually out so this all could be irrelevant in 12 [TS]

00:14:56   hours why do you say that tomorrow will be the day which would be Tuesday the [TS]

00:15:00   17th because today they rushed out on a 10 91 update that supports the new Mac [TS]

00:15:06   Pro and that's what this is one of the lender like to do this in Tuesday's and [TS]

00:15:10   this is one of the last potential weeks them to release something and still be [TS]

00:15:15   in December cos have Apple shuts down next week and this was the rumored date [TS]

00:15:19   as of a couple of weeks ago [TS]

00:15:20   right yes so it's it's I'd say I would say the 10 91 released today all but [TS]

00:15:25   confirms it I would say it's almost certain that they're being released in [TS]

00:15:31   12 hours ago and it hasn't happened are based hardware in the recent past where [TS]

00:15:36   if you buy the new hardware you get a newer building the less than you could [TS]

00:15:39   get an existing MAC I don't know where you are you get you know you can get [TS]

00:15:44   10914 only to buy a Mac Pro and then a week later comes out for everybody else [TS]

00:15:48   but they have definitely done things for you if you want about his new harbour [TS]

00:15:51   you get it a newer build of iOS 10 than anybody else can getting you to wait [TS]

00:15:55   until the next update yet that they definitely have done that so with its [TS]

00:15:59   release imminent johnnie buying one tomorrow definitely come tomorrow now I [TS]

00:16:07   have to wait even if everything was just right I want to wait until every people [TS]

00:16:10   test that I wanna see gaming benchmarks you know as far as I know I don't think [TS]

00:16:15   I'm going to buy one tomorrow unless they actually announcement over the [TS]

00:16:20   display in which case I would I would buy both immediately but besides that [TS]

00:16:25   and i think im also gonna wait and see [TS]

00:16:27   I'm really curious to see from reports from people about how it compares to the [TS]

00:16:31   2010 Mac Pro in practice you know it has all sorts of the CPU improvements which [TS]

00:16:37   are you know there there there but it's not really what you'd expect from three [TS]

00:16:42   years of of CPU progress so besides the CPU appearance which are same moderate I [TS]

00:16:47   want to know is a whole new version of this system architecture like this all [TS]

00:16:52   PCI Express everywhere maximized for throughput and then these GPUs being [TS]

00:16:57   super high power like I want to know is it how big of an upgrade is that in [TS]

00:17:02   practice in regular use using not just you know 3d rendering absolute GPU the [TS]

00:17:08   easy just general apps development apps photo audio production stuff you know [TS]

00:17:14   that kind of stuff I would love to know how much of an upgrade is this really if [TS]

00:17:19   you already have a 2010 Mac Pro with gigantic pci-express SSD in a dirty [TS]

00:17:25   that's true well my highest is mediocre nothing like the disk throughput than [TS]

00:17:31   quote-unquote discs through [TS]

00:17:33   of of this solid state drives this thing are interested in that as well because I [TS]

00:17:38   think that we'll have more of an impact on my daily life than the speed of the [TS]

00:17:42   CPUs right exactly and in theory the way this is architected there's a lot of [TS]

00:17:49   stuff missing from it and what various card slots and a few new faces a [TS]

00:17:55   firewire one of the reasons they did all that was basically like devote all of [TS]

00:18:00   the PCI Express lanes available in the chipset and from the CPU devote all of [TS]

00:18:05   that to you know just maximum throughput for the core components and i wanna know [TS]

00:18:11   can you feel that it is a noticeable we are sponsored this week by our friends [TS]

00:18:16   at Backblaze it is unlimited and untroubled online backup planes and I i [TS]

00:18:23   used by please personally I've used it for years long before they were sponsor [TS]

00:18:26   and I did it just $5 a month for unlimited space it's really fantastic [TS]

00:18:32   and you know I've used my views other online backups back places my favorite [TS]

00:18:37   it can't be that price and other ones I've had problems with throttling that's [TS]

00:18:44   why they say I'm thrown in there a treat I think this is a problem the industry [TS]

00:18:47   where sometimes apparently some riders will throttle you after you've uploaded [TS]

00:18:53   a certain amount per time period like you're going too fast it can handle it [TS]

00:18:57   or discuss them too much to slow you down my problem with some of the other [TS]

00:19:00   ones is not necessarily that but their servers are just too slow degas like I [TS]

00:19:05   have this nice FiOS upstream of sixty-five megabits which is amazing and [TS]

00:19:10   most providers can take the files that quickly back please I've never had that [TS]

00:19:15   problem it is always rock-solid as always [TS]

00:19:18   uploaded as fast as I was willing to send the files and Italy fantastic so [TS]

00:19:23   they have is cool features too they have led to restore you can just pull one [TS]

00:19:27   file off if you want to very handy if there was one time I took a vacation [TS]

00:19:34   and there was a file on my home computer that I didn't have a Dropbox I just had [TS]

00:19:37   some on the hard drive and I want to access that and I had no way to go back [TS]

00:19:42   to my Mac worked for like a year and then stopped working [TS]

00:19:46   kid 2011 so I haven't about my Mac working for years I couldn't pull it off [TS]

00:19:50   that way back please I just logged in I was able to restore that file and get it [TS]

00:19:56   and work on it was fantastic everything work exactly as you'd expect to have an [TS]

00:20:00   iOS app you can also browse your files directly from their iOS app so it's like [TS]

00:20:05   you have access to all your stuff where ever you are and back plz was founded by [TS]

00:20:09   X Apple engineers it runs natively on your Mac and works perfectly with [TS]

00:20:14   maverick's I i've had zero problems with maverick's so it's pretty much it's [TS]

00:20:18   there no add-ons no gimmicks no additional charges $5 a month for [TS]

00:20:22   computer unlimited online backup it is the simplest online backup program to [TS]

00:20:27   use just install it and it does the rest [TS]

00:20:30   gonna Backblaze dot com slash ATP and thanks a lot to our sponsor backless $5 [TS]

00:20:36   a month for unlimited none throttled back up at least dot com slash ATP [TS]

00:20:40   everybody should have an offsite backup of some kind and online is the easiest [TS]

00:20:46   and probably also the cheapest offsite backup you can get you we just received [TS]

00:20:50   at least John and I received tweet from someone I don't have it handy [TS]

00:20:54   saying oh my goodness I should have listened to John about backing up [TS]

00:20:57   because I just lost twelve months worth of work because I didn't have a backup [TS]

00:21:02   just installed a piece of software in five minutes and paid $5 a month which [TS]

00:21:06   is not that much in the grand scheme of things just don't go out to lunch one [TS]

00:21:09   time of month you're fine and it would have had all the stuff and some peace of [TS]

00:21:13   mind [TS]

00:21:14   yep it's it's really great it's also you know that this is a great thing to if [TS]

00:21:18   you're like if you're visiting say your parents or grandparents and they have a [TS]

00:21:21   computer like I i you end up for my mom because I I got her computer few years [TS]

00:21:26   back she loves it she put everything on there but I know she's never going to [TS]

00:21:30   manage time if you need a laptop at all over the house [TS]

00:21:33   time capsules are unreliable I i dont even wanna mess with that I just wanna [TS]

00:21:36   know that she has online backup and I can check in I can go online I can make [TS]

00:21:41   sure her computer has been backed up recently and backless provides all that [TS]

00:21:45   nice piece of mind [TS]

00:21:46   fantastic for yourself and for setting up things for your for your relatives [TS]

00:21:51   who you don't want to lose data should make it as a Christmas gift idea when [TS]

00:21:55   you do the the annual visiting relatives in fixing their computer stuff just [TS]

00:21:58   installed backwards on the first for casual users who are not downloading [TS]

00:22:02   multi gigabyte things all the time and everything you say all did their [TS]

00:22:06   internet connection not fast enough to use online back the initial backup is [TS]

00:22:10   probably gonna take a long time on their terrible like DSL connection whatever [TS]

00:22:13   crazy thing they're using but once they get through that initial backup casual [TS]

00:22:17   computer users don't produce data that you know and that high-volume me back [TS]

00:22:21   plz will automatically you know not backup stuff it doesn't have to write so [TS]

00:22:26   you don't have to worry about all of it all their cache files from Safari when [TS]

00:22:30   the new web browsing it's not going to back up that stuff that just gonna [TS]

00:22:33   backup the data they their own data and casual users don't produce that much [TS]

00:22:36   data so he will have no problem keeping their update their backup up-to-date [TS]

00:22:42   practically in real time everyday once it gets caught up in it won't take that [TS]

00:22:45   long so I mean my mom's entire backup set is 30 gigs and how much is a great [TS]

00:22:50   day like you know that the daily the damn the daily turning that is probably [TS]

00:22:55   like a megabyte or two no problem uploading that right and and I you know [TS]

00:23:00   I can tell you to like me I have on my computer I have about 800 gigs and back [TS]

00:23:05   lays my wife has about one and a half terabytes and back live and I as it [TS]

00:23:09   reviews for years and never had a problem even with that much data we have [TS]

00:23:14   a little bit more follow-up specifically around TV related things johnnie went on [TS]

00:23:18   an absolutely fantastic ran last episode about your new TV and one thing in [TS]

00:23:23   particular that that in the the dueling display idea we got a lot of feedback [TS]

00:23:29   about so would you care to talk about how to calibrate your TV talk a little [TS]

00:23:33   bit about calibration last episode how I was there's lots of settings and I was [TS]

00:23:37   playing with all I'm trying to get it out and then I gotta [TS]

00:23:40   a bunch of treats people asking about this topic including some tweets and a [TS]

00:23:44   new jacket I just recently bought a Panasonic plasma television I was [TS]

00:23:47   talking to him about it is making me realize how few people know anything [TS]

00:23:52   about him even you guys who I calibrate my TV whatever you even talking about so [TS]

00:23:56   I figured I wouldn't go over just a couple of basic things you can do to [TS]

00:24:01   make your television look better almost anybody going to have a fancy TV doesn't [TS]

00:24:05   even need to be a plasma TV you know you can make it if you like that and then [TS]

00:24:09   basically what it comes down to is that your TV looks bad now and you probably [TS]

00:24:12   don't even note so the first thing lots of people tweeted about was a [TS]

00:24:16   calibration Appleton the App Store from the thx company Lucasfilm around and now [TS]

00:24:20   I believe it's pronounced thanks John I thought you're better than that you know [TS]

00:24:28   and it works if you have an iOS device and either an Apple TV so you gonna play [TS]

00:24:35   to your TV or some way to connect the iOS device to your TV with HDMI cable I [TS]

00:24:41   used airplanes my Apple TV ad that could happen sorry TMI but I don't know what [TS]

00:24:47   the options are there in terms of Cape so anyway it's like $2 don't buy the [TS]

00:24:50   application if you can't do one of those two things you can read read the [TS]

00:24:53   description to see if you can I bought just out of curiosity because I already [TS]

00:24:58   have a thx calibration thing that came with my Tivo that is basically the same [TS]

00:25:02   tests as a little bit of integration with your camera which is only so-so but [TS]

00:25:07   it's really simple really basic but even without that you can probably find [TS]

00:25:12   somewhere where you can download some test patterns or something to adjust [TS]

00:25:17   your television that thx out just happens to make it easy to do is that [TS]

00:25:21   the tricky part is to get a picture on your television and you don't want to go [TS]

00:25:26   through anything two screws at the picture so if you like [TS]

00:25:30   got an image on your computer and try to use like AirPlay Mirroring on your TV I [TS]

00:25:33   would worry that that would not be a good simulation of the images are you [TS]

00:25:38   want to adjust your blu-ray player really you probably need something on a [TS]

00:25:42   blu-ray to go out the Blu ray player and onto television [TS]

00:25:45   that's not to say that you need to calibrate every single input of your [TS]

00:25:48   television separately but it is possible that some devices you have to put [TS]

00:25:53   different kinds of signals than other devices so be careful about that but [TS]

00:25:57   anyway here's my quick tips for calibration first one is make sure the [TS]

00:26:02   devices that are connected to your television are outputting what you think [TS]

00:26:06   they're they're putting to your television set [TS]

00:26:08   so for example if you get cable or satellite TV or whatever something like [TS]

00:26:12   that it's sending you your television shows in a particular format and say you [TS]

00:26:18   have Comcast and the television and comes over as 1080 I make sure that it's [TS]

00:26:23   going into the back of your television as a 1080 i signal you be surprised at [TS]

00:26:28   how many people have things get figured where their television shows or 1080 I [TS]

00:26:31   but through the series of boxes are devices are inputs they're going through [TS]

00:26:35   its being converted to 720p to be shown on the television or vice versa you have [TS]

00:26:39   a 720p single and your TV could show 720p but it's up to show it has 1080 I [TS]

00:26:44   most televisions and the boxes and receivers and things that will convert [TS]

00:26:48   between 1080 and 7:20 p.m. [TS]

00:26:50   you know and even 1080p they will settle down sample do whatever it takes you [TS]

00:26:55   wanted to go through sort of natively whatever the need to visit the native [TS]

00:26:58   720 heavier TV show at 7:20 the natives 1080 I have it show that way that's not [TS]

00:27:04   even calibrations that this just you know look at all the settings and all [TS]

00:27:07   the devices are you trying to make sure you're not impossible that sometimes [TS]

00:27:10   easier said than done like all TV still available but different settings where [TS]

00:27:15   you could you put out like the cable goes into your TiVo like television say [TS]

00:27:18   no and then he comes out of your TiVo and say ok I can take the single coming [TS]

00:27:24   in and I can convert it to any format you want and send it to your television [TS]

00:27:27   or I could not touch it at all and just passing through and that's always the [TS]

00:27:30   one you want these to coordinate ever whatever nowadays with the modern [TS]

00:27:34   Tebow's I don't think they even have that option you have to know what the [TS]

00:27:36   input signal doesn't match up for the outlets in particular is if you hit the [TS]

00:27:42   up arrow button on the five-way selector it will change the format and if you [TS]

00:27:47   have children in your house they will accidentally hit that up our selectors [TS]

00:27:50   many many times and so you'll have everything figured that one day sit down [TS]

00:27:54   your television and wonder why things look a little weird [TS]

00:27:57   it's funny because when you get to the power there watching television and [TS]

00:27:59   change the format should check that the second thing is about the size of the [TS]

00:28:04   image on the screen and another I'm surprised that people know about if you [TS]

00:28:09   buy television logo 1080p FullHD 1080 resolution right and if you know that [TS]

00:28:15   the resolution I think it's 1920 by 1080 if you were to do in pixels and so you [TS]

00:28:20   figure if you're watching a television show and that television show put up a [TS]

00:28:23   test pattern image that showed one pixel wide rectangle that was 1920 by 1080 [TS]

00:28:28   pixels you would expect to see like around the edge of your screen that one [TS]

00:28:33   pixel wide bordering states like a white white rectangular black background in [TS]

00:28:37   reality on any television you by pretty much you will see nothing because they [TS]

00:28:41   will cut off the edges of the screen as holdover scan or lots of other different [TS]

00:28:45   names articles from the the CRT days where the images of the edges of CRT [TS]

00:28:50   we're really low quality and they would cover them on television sets with like [TS]

00:28:54   a plastic part of the best one everything and that someone is giving [TS]

00:28:59   more historical context and why they did that but the bottom line was that there [TS]

00:29:01   was a safe area where you can show an image or you were sure which opened [TS]

00:29:04   everybody's television set and it was unsafe area which are most people tell [TS]

00:29:07   them that would be covered by some other plastic trim piece there are no plastic [TS]

00:29:11   trim pieces covering the edges of your television set you have ADHD television [TS]

00:29:15   and it has 1080p resolution you can see all those pixels but all those [TS]

00:29:21   televisions will take your television signal and zoom it so it's bigger than [TS]

00:29:24   you television so you can only see sort of like the inner you know that will cut [TS]

00:29:28   off the frame of things I just two things one to make the misinformation [TS]

00:29:31   things that are outside outside of that area you won't see it all and the second [TS]

00:29:35   thing is it takes all those nice native if you're lucky [TS]

00:29:37   1080p or 1080 pixels and it will stretch it is like taking a picture taking a [TS]

00:29:42   desktop background picture of exactly fits your mantra and then making a size [TS]

00:29:45   bigger by 5% you're missing part of the picture on the part you see is blurry so [TS]

00:29:50   almost all televisions just a fancy ones have a setting somewhere in them are you [TS]

00:29:55   can tell it don't do that don't turn off over scans and those that have dipped [TS]

00:29:59   what size should be size one size to look in the manual for television but if [TS]

00:30:04   you can't find me over television just google for your televisions model [TS]

00:30:08   a manual pdf you'll find the manual vs online somewhere and find that setting [TS]

00:30:13   because if you paid for 1080p television or 720p whatever you should see all [TS]

00:30:19   those pixels at their native resolution to think of it in television parlance [TS]

00:30:23   this these are these two steps in front resolution and the size of the picture [TS]

00:30:27   two things that anybody can do you don't get an application to do it and they're [TS]

00:30:31   pretty much know down to downsize to a some people are saying that if you do [TS]

00:30:35   that you might see booms in the shot like a microphone booms because people [TS]

00:30:38   expect every television to be over scanning not in my experience running [TS]

00:30:41   television that proper size for four years now since I got my first HDTV that [TS]

00:30:46   has not been a problem I have not seen a bunch of you know boom Mikes coming down [TS]

00:30:51   from the top of the screen or things from the side but even if I did I would [TS]

00:30:54   say that the problem of the show is not mine I don't want all my television all [TS]

00:30:57   the images on my television to be assumed in and little bit blurry [TS]

00:31:01   woodstock offer yet [TS]

00:31:02   third item I would say that everyone should justin has renewed calibration [TS]

00:31:06   thing is brightness and contrast that to calibration things that you'll look at [TS]

00:31:10   indy this thx offer any other type of thing are one shows you a bunch of gray [TS]

00:31:14   boxes going from white down to black and you would just your brightness until a [TS]

00:31:20   certain number of boxes are visible will usually have it so you're not supposed [TS]

00:31:24   to all the boxes like you shouldn't see the last boxes second-to-last box or [TS]

00:31:27   whatever [TS]

00:31:28   adjusting that level is important because it lets you see some shadow [TS]

00:31:31   detail but you know not too much like the test images of you say you should [TS]

00:31:37   see a person in front of the background and it looks entirely black to you your [TS]

00:31:40   thing is is not dialed incorrectly and if it looks at ABC too much stuff on it [TS]

00:31:45   then it's too bright so you should just until you get just the right boxes [TS]

00:31:48   visible pretty easy tested do you need a special caught me just in your eyeball [TS]

00:31:52   they'll say something like make it is dark and you can still see box seven [TS]

00:31:56   that's nothing Anybody could do but looking at it maybe you want to do it in [TS]

00:31:59   a polite rumor darkroom depending on your watch television and contrasts [TS]

00:32:04   Emily the show you something like a series of four white boxes of this just [TS]

00:32:08   looks like a big white rectangle contrast is too high [TS]

00:32:11   turn the contrast down until you see actual four distinct white boxes of [TS]

00:32:15   varying levels of great should be lines between the white boxes if you're losing [TS]

00:32:19   line between the last two white boxes [TS]

00:32:21   time to blend together you need to die or contrast those two settings plus the [TS]

00:32:26   size and resolution will improve the picture on your television set not just [TS]

00:32:30   make me more accurate to what it's supposed to look like but generally [TS]

00:32:34   making things look nicer not look washed out not look too dark not look too [TS]

00:32:38   bright and I haven't even touched anything having to do with color in [TS]

00:32:42   terms of exactly dialing in the red green and blue and all that stuff [TS]

00:32:46   adjust brightness contrast size and resolution will go a long way in the [TS]

00:32:49   final thing I talked about this last show was turned off all the crazy [TS]

00:32:52   affects every television has crazy facts that probably does you just need to turn [TS]

00:32:58   them all off [TS]

00:32:59   LCDs you might wanna leave motion interpolation on it looked weird you [TS]

00:33:03   emotionally sweetie without it but other than that all the things about like [TS]

00:33:07   vivid color an extra brightness and the title last episode billions enhancer [TS]

00:33:11   often actually pasted into the show notes because I wanted to know these [TS]

00:33:15   actual names that have in front of the last time he heard the actual names of [TS]

00:33:18   the settings from my fancy new television set is not made up and these [TS]

00:33:23   are not like gathered from several different models these are all in one [TS]

00:33:26   television set [TS]

00:33:27   caption smooth MPEG remaster motion smoother resolution remastered video and [TS]

00:33:32   our C 80 s academic periods between letters photo enhancement vivid color [TS]

00:33:38   color remaster black extension and automatic gamma control and all those [TS]

00:33:42   things and explorations in the manual trying to explain what they do [TS]

00:33:46   the bottom line is just turn them all off every single one of them turn them [TS]

00:33:49   off what if I like cats cats and nobody know it like this they'd have terrible [TS]

00:33:55   names to you look up what they do all they do is mess with the picture in a [TS]

00:34:00   way they think might be helpful but generally is not helpful especially in a [TS]

00:34:04   plasma television to doesn't have the problems that need to be compensated for [TS]

00:34:07   by fax like this [TS]

00:34:09   demotions move there is the one that really galls me in plasma and LCD [TS]

00:34:13   television you'll have similar settings if you turn them all off and it looks [TS]

00:34:16   like crap figure out which one or two you need to turn on to make it look like [TS]

00:34:20   crap but do not leave them all on especially things like a vivid color or [TS]

00:34:25   color remaster things are going to school with the colors those just make [TS]

00:34:28   everybody look like [TS]

00:34:29   sounds and make things look totally wrong so you don't need you don't need [TS]

00:34:33   to hire someone to come into your house to do a professional calibration to to [TS]

00:34:37   improve the picture television those four things just turn off the effects [TS]

00:34:42   resolutions exercise and decorators in contrast it'll make a big difference in [TS]

00:34:46   your life [TS]

00:34:47   actually take a backseat yes ma'am I don't know I haven't read the manual we [TS]

00:34:54   are also sparked this week by hover over as is high quality no hassle domain name [TS]

00:34:59   registration for.com / ATP or use promo code ATP for 10% off however takes all [TS]

00:35:08   the hassle in fact owning and managing domain names for smart easy to use and [TS]

00:35:13   powerful Domain Name Management Tools however believes that everyone should be [TS]

00:35:17   able to take control of their online identity with their own domain name and [TS]

00:35:21   her makes it easy to do so they're part of two cows which is a company that's [TS]

00:35:24   been around basically forever and they're one of the largest domain [TS]

00:35:27   registrars in the world they offered tons of TLD the I dot net dot khou.com [TS]

00:35:32   of course . TV all sorts country could and many more domain names and are [TS]

00:35:38   always adding more you can get . just about anything so however does not [TS]

00:35:43   believe in heavy-handed cross-selling or really you know aggressive up selling [TS]

00:35:47   they don't believe in hiding functionality required extra payment for [TS]

00:35:51   things that really should be included for free with the main names such as [TS]

00:35:54   whois privacy subdomains and URL forwarding they also have their email [TS]

00:35:58   service Gmail makes it easy and affordable to create a memorable email [TS]

00:36:02   address and without having to use one of the impersonal forgettable web mail [TS]

00:36:07   addresses that you can get for free elsewhere they also offer Google Apps [TS]

00:36:10   for Business [TS]

00:36:11   domain new or old and one of the best things about her is that they have [TS]

00:36:15   amazing customer support so not only do they have excellent online help with all [TS]

00:36:20   sorts of documentation and tutorials but they also have this awesome no hold no [TS]

00:36:26   weight and no transfer fee telephone support policy so you can call this 866 [TS]

00:36:30   number [TS]

00:36:31   Monday through Friday 8:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. Eastern and a real live person [TS]

00:36:36   probably in Canada is there in Canada that means they're gonna be really nice [TS]

00:36:40   of course [TS]

00:36:41   cold maybe but really nice they're gonna be speaking to a live person picking up [TS]

00:36:46   the phone almost immediately [TS]

00:36:48   second ring maybe you make your way to the second ring but almost immediately [TS]

00:36:51   and the person who takes the phone will actually be able to help you they will [TS]

00:36:55   have the power to help you you want to be transferred to 10 different people [TS]

00:36:58   know you call them up anytime during business hours 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. Monday [TS]

00:37:03   through Friday and you are speaking to a person and that is incredibly unusual in [TS]

00:37:07   pretty much any business these days let alone something that takes place mostly [TS]

00:37:11   on the Internet domain name registration so go to hover dot com slash ATP for [TS]

00:37:16   high-quality no hassle domain name registration and don't forget to use [TS]

00:37:19   promo code ATP for 10% off any purchase you make a cover thanks love to show [TS]

00:37:25   again at a couple more things on the calibration you yeah one is frequent [TS]

00:37:32   suggestion by many people who have the same television here have other similar [TS]

00:37:36   television they say they go into a forum seen as forums like this is ABS forearms [TS]

00:37:40   has tons of websites but I don't have television television's on the web where [TS]

00:37:45   people by television's calibrate them either professionally are sorted by hand [TS]

00:37:49   by themselves and then they post to the forum group what their settings are [TS]

00:37:52   different settings for brightness contrast color 10th gamma like tons of [TS]

00:37:57   things you can adjust and they will just add to their liking or have it [TS]

00:38:01   professionally calibrated and post those numbers to the forum and seen at the [TS]

00:38:05   people to review televisions on CNN will also post their settings they we [TS]

00:38:08   calibrate the television before we did our testing for a review here in the [TS]

00:38:12   settings we use I tend not to just take those settings and use them like [TS]

00:38:17   television because particularly with plasma each individual example of a [TS]

00:38:21   particular model varies enough that you're not going to I don't think you're [TS]

00:38:25   going to get like you know ten-point fifteen-point white balance adjustment [TS]

00:38:30   of tiny minut degrees I don't think those settings that they use for their [TS]

00:38:36   television sets are going to work for mine even if we have the exact same make [TS]

00:38:39   model and year just because of variations than individual televisions [TS]

00:38:43   and then on top of that there is aging where the televisions look different as [TS]

00:38:48   used in Morgan particular class so I wouldn't blindly take any of those [TS]

00:38:52   settings and apply them to your television [TS]

00:38:54   back to you are seeing what they're seeing . I'm looking at them to give [TS]

00:38:57   myself sort of a ballpark idea of what are people doing in particular look at [TS]

00:39:01   the gamma settings to see you know what what gamma values they're using this [TS]

00:39:05   lots of weird stuff especially Panasonic televisions where they had a bunch of [TS]

00:39:10   preset tonight a custom setting and the if you pick one game level in the [TS]

00:39:14   customers not the same as it did on the presets you have to look at all the [TS]

00:39:16   details like they started with the same each week these things they started with [TS]

00:39:19   that in this week those and is also the super duper professional mode where you [TS]

00:39:24   can expose all the settings on television through some crazy interface [TS]

00:39:27   by typing in weird cause in your remote to get even more settings are screwed [TS]

00:39:31   those that level 13 doing that I would say don't do that hire professional do [TS]

00:39:35   that but if you want to look at these these forms and to get an idea of what [TS]

00:39:39   things to place setting for example if you did it visually like you do those [TS]

00:39:43   tests with the book but the black levels and contrasting you got two numbers [TS]

00:39:46   dialed in and then you go to a forum post you see seven different for [TS]

00:39:50   different website and everybody has their contracts at like 6362 and you [TS]

00:39:56   have your say twelve you probably did something wrong [TS]

00:39:58   right now it's just like I said he checks I wouldn't say copy those numbers [TS]

00:40:01   but that's a lot of people talked about that and asked me if I'd use the [TS]

00:40:06   settings no I don't use them directly but I do use them to just check that I'm [TS]

00:40:10   not entirely crazy thing that can be verified [TS]

00:40:13   well you know it's supporting evidence against war against alright so everyone [TS]

00:40:19   has been talking about raiding things so I think now is as good a time to any as [TS]

00:40:25   any to save rate the radio show on iTunes now seem to do that now [TS]

00:40:30   leader or not at all radar show well now or do you want to email us your negative [TS]

00:40:36   thoughts right or do any reminded to rate us well in two weeks or how bout [TS]

00:40:42   with every episode of the podcast will just ask you again during the show do [TS]

00:40:46   you want to rate us [TS]

00:40:47   yeah I realized how about halfway through that right down my throat so let [TS]

00:40:55   me move on and say market do you happen to have any thoughts about reading apps [TS]

00:40:58   and asking and soliciting users to rate ups ya don't [TS]

00:41:04   moving on this topic we figured it out i mean this this was discussed at length [TS]

00:41:12   in in last week's episode of John Gruber's the talk show with Dana jacket [TS]

00:41:17   and it was a really good discussions so i don't think we need to rehash most of [TS]

00:41:21   it they just have my position is really you know what we're talking about those [TS]

00:41:26   in case you couldn't tell we're talking about the rate these the rate this app [TS]

00:41:31   dialogues that pop up in many iOS apps big and small hey rate this app you want [TS]

00:41:38   to go you know leaving creating an hour remind me later or never do it again [TS]

00:41:42   they've kind of become this this like playing on iOS devices with a play with [TS]

00:41:47   very minor effects that it is it's like slightly annoying everybody you know [TS]

00:41:55   grouper started out about a week ago now saying like I've often thought about [TS]

00:42:00   starting a campaign online to just make everybody rate one-star when they see [TS]

00:42:04   one of those looks like his nice way of like kind of seating the idea without [TS]

00:42:08   saying I'm telling you all to do this right now is a masterful freezing you [TS]

00:42:14   know we've had a lot of discussion here in their various more people in the [TS]

00:42:18   community about the pros and cons of of these great the staff dialogues and and [TS]

00:42:24   the pros and cons of what would happen if the start of retaliating and and and [TS]

00:42:28   let you know reading everything one star or or reading everything only three [TS]

00:42:31   stars and a five or what we do whatever the case may be my position is not that [TS]

00:42:36   you should necessarily take any particular action towards the absolute [TS]

00:42:39   do this my position is really just telling developers you should not have [TS]

00:42:43   this in Europe because it really and I think group had a really good plan to [TS]

00:42:49   talk show about why this is so irritating is that a modal dialog box [TS]

00:42:55   that pops up in your face we try to do something with an app like thats a [TS]

00:42:59   Motorola box should be preserved for basically exceptions like in programming [TS]

00:43:03   parlance like something that is not supposed to be the common case you know [TS]

00:43:08   like there was some kind of weird server error and we can't do what you asked or [TS]

00:43:12   you could try to authenticate and you couldn't login because [TS]

00:43:16   refuse your password or like you're trying to do something right now and you [TS]

00:43:20   can't do it because you turned off [TS]

00:43:22   cellular data or location services or something like that you know that's the [TS]

00:43:26   kind of conditions in which a modal dialog box is appropriate [TS]

00:43:29   interrupting people to serve the developer like reading an app doesn't do [TS]

00:43:36   crap for the people who are doing it it it doesn't serve them at all it only [TS]

00:43:40   serves developer you're asking people to promote you or make you feel good about [TS]

00:43:44   yourself either way you're asking you you do that you develop her are asking [TS]

00:43:48   people to do something for you and your asking them that by interrupting them in [TS]

00:43:53   the middle of them trying to use your app and probably trying to get something [TS]

00:43:56   done you're interrupting them to say hey help me out here by 10 reviewing me and [TS]

00:44:02   and you know pimping me in the store and that seems like a very inappropriate use [TS]

00:44:07   of an interruption to your user like that you know I almost wonder if now is [TS]

00:44:12   a decent time to expose Marco to corporate culture and what I mean by [TS]

00:44:18   that is why I wonder if now is a good time for the five whys so Marco put on [TS]

00:44:25   new or not so awesome developer hat and you're thinking right now about putting [TS]

00:44:32   this into europe reaction let's say you just did put this into overcast for the [TS]

00:44:36   sake of conversation what do I know you never would just try try hard and for me [TS]

00:44:42   let me you're safer while we're on the topic I said in my post I am putting a [TS]

00:44:47   thing in the settings screen that like a button to say leave a review for this [TS]

00:44:52   happen historic up just a button there that is different if you want to make it [TS]

00:44:56   easy for people who do want to leave a review for you if you want to give them [TS]

00:45:00   a shortcut or suggest they might want to do that in a passive way like a button [TS]

00:45:05   and about so that's very different than interrupting them with it with a message [TS]

00:45:10   box in normal use of the app I don't have any problem with abundant in about [TS]

00:45:14   that whoever you want their I don't care that that doesn't interrupt me and if [TS]

00:45:19   I'm browsing in settings are about I might actually consider doing that [TS]

00:45:22   because the unlike him I'm playing with stuff I am exploring this app but you're [TS]

00:45:27   trying to do something [TS]

00:45:28   interrupted by a modal dialog box that's the problem so I want to the distinction [TS]

00:45:33   it's not that asking for reviews at all is bad or providing a shortcut at all is [TS]

00:45:38   bad it's the way you're asking by [TS]

00:45:42   by interrupting people in a modal right so you were writing overcast and you had [TS]

00:45:49   a brain fart I know maybe add too much May one night and you've put this into [TS]

00:45:54   europe why why did you put a video of a drunk featured [TS]

00:45:59   right that's what that's when the best work is done [TS]

00:46:03   why would you put a solicitation to rate your app into overcast if you were there [TS]

00:46:10   kinda developer that would do that sort of thing the main reason why people do [TS]

00:46:13   this and the reason why it hypothetical drunk me would do this and overcast if I [TS]

00:46:17   somehow I don't know when I have a lot of shit I i dont get bad taste if I [TS]

00:46:26   doubt I would argue for getting drunk on Sat May I think you're pretty good but [TS]

00:46:32   in all seriousness to borrow money or phrases I think the reason people do [TS]

00:46:38   this is very clear it works in this and in the definition of works where it does [TS]

00:46:44   get you more reviews now I don't know why would you want more reviews the [TS]

00:46:48   theory is I've heard different things obviously we know from just like a [TS]

00:46:53   customer perspective we know that when we are browsing for apps usually we do [TS]

00:46:58   read the reviews now or at least glanced at them or glance at the star rating the [TS]

00:47:02   average star rating and it is there is a distinction between ratings and reviews [TS]

00:47:06   you don't have to write a review TV star rating but I don't think for the purpose [TS]

00:47:10   of this discussion [TS]

00:47:11   matters so there there's one argument to say it when customers find it they will [TS]

00:47:18   read the reviews and if you don't have a lot of reviews if you have a couple of [TS]

00:47:21   bad reviews and no positive ones to offset them then that'll make unless I [TS]

00:47:25   thought about that that I can't argue with that is true however I've heard a [TS]

00:47:31   lot of people also say that reviews are correlated with rank and I don't think [TS]

00:47:37   we have any evidence to confirm that in a couple people said that [TS]

00:47:41   doesn't do that so that's all over the map I would love to hear from anybody [TS]

00:47:45   who has actual evidence to support whether that's true or false or not as [TS]

00:47:50   far as I know rank is all about sales volume and it's like sales volumes per [TS]

00:47:55   time interval I don't think it has anything to do with with their reviews [TS]

00:47:59   but that could change I don't know why do you want more [TS]

00:48:03   why do you want a higher rank to get rich in the App Store will why would [TS]

00:48:08   that make you rich in the App Store because nobody pays for the grinding all [TS]

00:48:14   kidding aside line of questioning trying to lead you down is that and I believe [TS]

00:48:18   that to some degree underscore David Smith talked about this in his really [TS]

00:48:22   good blog post today but I feel like the end of the five whys of this [TS]

00:48:29   conversation is that discovery is broken and if not discovery then finding a way [TS]

00:48:37   to pitch your app in such so that I don't need to double check your work [TS]

00:48:43   what I mean by that is if I throw up a bunch of really awesome screenshots and [TS]

00:48:48   I throw up a really nice description it you're gonna want to double check from [TS]

00:48:53   real people that I'm not all of it that I'm not lying and I think it's a [TS]

00:48:59   combination of discovery and representation of the app that makes [TS]

00:49:03   this sort of gross behavior necessary because if discovery was really good [TS]

00:49:11   then I would be able to find out very easily and then once I found the app [TS]

00:49:16   that I think I might want if if the selling of it the marketing of it within [TS]

00:49:21   the app store was really good then say if we had a video for example or maybe [TS]

00:49:27   if you had a trial and I'm not tryna go down that road I'm just saying [TS]

00:49:30   hypothetically if you had like a one day trial or whatever then it wouldn't [TS]

00:49:34   matter what the reviews are certainly what matters much with reviews say and [TS]

00:49:38   it wouldn't matter as much with the ratings are but because developers have [TS]

00:49:43   almost no levers to Paul in order to improve their performance to find [TS]

00:49:49   performance everyone in the App Store this is only one of the only leverage [TS]

00:49:52   they've got so dark [TS]

00:49:53   they're gonna pull on it and that's what that was the exercise the five whys [TS]

00:49:57   exercise I was trying to bring you down I think this is the reason this comes up [TS]

00:50:01   at all like the reason is wondering fireball fireball whatever is not so [TS]

00:50:06   much because doing things because I think the App Store has always been you [TS]

00:50:11   know to america's thing from that guy was trying to run for president [TS]

00:50:16   there's the two app stores this is the one that's full of crap we just ignore [TS]

00:50:21   we being you know the Mac nerd blogger whatever people and there's the good App [TS]

00:50:27   Store the attitude we like them or use and the reason this rate me thing comes [TS]

00:50:32   up is because it's not limited to the crap out Store apps that we all like and [TS]

00:50:37   use every day do this [TS]

00:50:39   Instagram like our favorite Twitter client you know my favorite note-taking [TS]

00:50:44   application everybody does it [TS]

00:50:47   the super high-class well-designed well-regarded we love the application [TS]

00:50:51   couldn't live without it everything about it is awesome responsibility [TS]

00:50:55   releases bug fixes has a reasonable prices great application all-round even [TS]

00:50:59   they have stupid to rate me dialog boxes on the not all of them but it's it's an [TS]

00:51:04   infection of annoyance that has crossed over into our world and that's why you [TS]

00:51:08   get someone like John Gruber saying well just gotta stop I mean I love these [TS]

00:51:12   applications that use every day but they gotta get outta my face if there are [TS]

00:51:17   tons of terrible things that happen only in the crap out story like blinking ad [TS]

00:51:21   banners in your face and you know just all sorts of ugly you eyes and and [TS]

00:51:27   things that are motile when they shouldn't be interested in this kind of [TS]

00:51:30   crap applications we don't care what happens over there is it doesn't affect [TS]

00:51:33   us because we know we feel like we're discerning and we talk to each other and [TS]

00:51:36   say what the good applications are making recommendations and then we get [TS]

00:51:39   one is good applications that we use every single day and thrust upon the [TS]

00:51:42   written down boxes boxes it's like a betrayal it's like that's not supposed [TS]

00:51:46   to happen here this is the good AppStore where I'll talk to my friends and [TS]

00:51:49   getting my stuff like it's back to the discovery thing casey was talking about [TS]

00:51:52   where if we had a way to look at an application it said something like I was [TS]

00:51:58   getting on Facebook is scary but it's gonna be like a six-year friends use [TS]

00:52:02   application they like it means so much more than waiting through [TS]

00:52:06   hundred possibly paid for five star reviews from you know Mechanical Turk or [TS]

00:52:11   whatever these developers to do is take it they're scammers using especially [TS]

00:52:14   when you're going into an area that you not that familiar with in the App Store [TS]

00:52:18   the sort of social proof that people who you know and trust have decided this [TS]

00:52:23   application is good that's all you need to see like from three other people [TS]

00:52:27   saying this is good or this is bad that you happen to know they were beaten it [TS]

00:52:31   makes so much more difference than just his reign of you but there's no way to [TS]

00:52:35   put that in that there's no way to you know we have the reputation the [TS]

00:52:38   developer which maybe we know maybe we don't have a home interview that we [TS]

00:52:42   can't even tie back to individual people even if we see a name that we think we [TS]

00:52:45   recognize let me know that the name under which some friend of ours these [TS]

00:52:48   reviews on the idea that we have no idea so the reaction to this in terms of [TS]

00:52:55   putting up with things as what if we you know I've always I mean think about [TS]

00:52:57   asking people to one star rate this is a weird way to suggest one-star rating of [TS]

00:53:01   it it's in effect that's not the way to go about it the actual campaign [TS]

00:53:07   suggestion of a way to the campaign to go about it but what we want to happen [TS]

00:53:10   and what i think is going to happen is not that kind of one-star campaign but a [TS]

00:53:16   socialization of the idea that putting upgrading the dialog box is unacceptable [TS]

00:53:20   in the quote-unquote good app store and that's what we're looking for you know [TS]

00:53:24   get that stuff out of the application is that we like the high quality will [TS]

00:53:28   design application some good developers that we use everyday that really popular [TS]

00:53:31   that we like we've already got this whole thing is like when an application [TS]

00:53:35   goes badly people used to like 20 and then Twitter bought them and it was [TS]

00:53:39   still ok and they changed it now it's crap and now nobody uses the official [TS]

00:53:43   Twitter client r-iowa said they can't help it all that's an application going [TS]

00:53:47   bad was good did conform to sort of are you know taste and social norm [TS]

00:53:52   guidelines in you know the Mac nerd or I was in their community and then it [TS]

00:53:56   didn't anymore we only kicked it outright but all these other [TS]

00:53:59   complications is still doing this we need to socialize all the you know [TS]

00:54:04   software reviewers developers consumers of people think they have good taste [TS]

00:54:09   everything socialized the idea that you can't put up the dialog boxes otherwise [TS]

00:54:14   we will look down [TS]

00:54:16   when you in some way that's all you need to don't need to one-star ratings you [TS]

00:54:19   don't need to attack people or to punish their applications if you socialize [TS]

00:54:25   everybody involved in this good half of the ecosystem that putting a breaking [TS]

00:54:28   dialog boxes unacceptable the problem will take care of itself because no one [TS]

00:54:32   wants to be that out but the problem is that somehow we got to a point where [TS]

00:54:36   that was deemed acceptable by almost everybody involved and I think this [TS]

00:54:40   exercise is going to turn that around if we keep at it without any stupid [TS]

00:54:44   campaigns to read things one star to retaliate or send e-mail e-mail yeah I [TS]

00:54:48   mean that was that was kind of the main argument of my post is like yeah you can [TS]

00:54:52   you can do this and and it works but at what cost to to quality and your [TS]

00:55:01   reputation to your brew and you know if there's lots of things that work [TS]

00:55:06   telemarketing and spam work but you know most reasonable people hate those things [TS]

00:55:11   and said like and the telemarketers and argue well you know we're good we're [TS]

00:55:17   calling you up and you know it's once a week maybe for two seconds and you hang [TS]

00:55:21   up if you don't like it like I've gotten it so it's always good when you when you [TS]

00:55:26   attack a portion of your own audience that's that's when you get the biggest [TS]

00:55:30   feedback but I've gotten so much feedback in the publish my post about [TS]

00:55:36   this from developers saying it's no big deal if you don't like those used to hit [TS]

00:55:40   dismiss and you don't see it for a little while but that is a big deal [TS]

00:55:46   that's like if you're annoying somebody slightly you're still annoying them and [TS]

00:55:52   that builds up over time you you get the the image in people's minds the brand [TS]

00:55:57   image of like of kind of being mediocre on quality on standards that matters at [TS]

00:56:04   all adds up and I don't know my I'm torn on this because it's hard for me to talk [TS]

00:56:10   about this because anything I say people jump down my throat immediately saying [TS]

00:56:15   will you didn't have to do all that cuz you know you were popular or something [TS]

00:56:20   forgetting that the read the way I got popular was be- cause of Instapaper [TS]

00:56:24   not I wasn't properly before launching [TS]

00:56:28   you know that that's so it's hard for me to say it again and for anybody to take [TS]

00:56:34   it seriously in this regard because they just pulled that's fine for Merlin [TS]

00:56:36   argument against me but I really I I can't I can't say enough how much those [TS]

00:56:43   little quality decisions matter and they add up and that's how you get popular [TS]

00:56:48   that's how you get respected as by caring so much about quality that you [TS]

00:56:52   won't annoy your users for a split second every two weeks that really [TS]

00:56:55   matters and I i don't know how else to tell people that without sound like I'm [TS]

00:57:00   attacking them but it is annoying and it it doesn't matter [TS]

00:57:06   let me take a quick break right before your next bigger point tell you about [TS]

00:57:10   our final budget this week it is audible audible is the leading provider of [TS]

00:57:14   downloadable audiobooks with over a hundred and fifty thousand titles in [TS]

00:57:17   virtually every genre have a huge catalog its growing constantly if you [TS]

00:57:22   want to listen to it [TS]

00:57:23   audible has you can listen to audible audiobooks anytime anywhere [TS]

00:57:28   iPhones iPads computers candles even old iPod if you actually have one of those [TS]

00:57:32   still kicking around always offering ATP listeners a free audiobook along with a [TS]

00:57:37   30 day trial go to audible podcast dot com slash ATP to take advantage of this [TS]

00:57:43   special offer now Casey I've heard through the grapevine that you have [TS]

00:57:47   recently listened to a book or read a book did I recently read in this was [TS]

00:57:53   actually recommended by someone on Twitter few months ago when I was going [TS]

00:57:56   to the beach and i wanted to have some books to read so I solicited [TS]

00:58:00   recommendations on Twitter and somebody recommended machine man by Max barry [TS]

00:58:05   varry I just finished reading it I did not read it on an audible but I read the [TS]

00:58:11   book book it was extremely weird and I don't know if I like it or not but it [TS]

00:58:17   was very different and for that alone or recommendation [TS]

00:58:20   yeah exactly for that alone though it may be worth checking out in the the the [TS]

00:58:25   TLDR version is I'm sorry the summary john is that there's a [TS]

00:58:31   guy who's a PhD and he accidentally chops off one of his legs working in his [TS]

00:58:37   lab because he works at like this big equipment and so he gets a prosthetic [TS]

00:58:43   leg and then realizes well you know I could build a better one and so he built [TS]

00:58:47   himself a better prosthetic leg and then realizes you know what this would be [TS]

00:58:51   better as a pair instead of just one and I'll let you read the book to feel I let [TS]

00:58:57   you read the book to fill in where this goes but it was very very very different [TS]

00:59:01   and so I double checked and of course is available on audible and audibles been [TS]

00:59:06   kind enough to sponsor ATP a handful of times and everytime I think of a book [TS]

00:59:11   recommendation even if it's slightly esoteric I go to audible to see before I [TS]

00:59:16   recommend it [TS]

00:59:17   hey is this available on audible in every single time you answered yes so [TS]

00:59:21   feel free to go to audible and get cases weird book recommendation was calling on [TS]

00:59:25   the machine man it's called machine man by Max barry be Arry that he was [TS]

00:59:30   surprised but I don't know I don't think so but it's a lot shorter than your [TS]

00:59:35   recommendation questions [TS]

00:59:38   less than sixty hours over 600 wasn't his night hours and 27 minutes on [TS]

00:59:44   audible so there's a lot to audible once again for sponsoring our show good [TS]

00:59:49   audible podcast dot com slash ATP and really quickly to build on [TS]

00:59:54   not the book but audible you know we're going on a car trip to go to my family's [TS]

01:00:00   soon and the best way in the entire world to kill time on a car trip other [TS]

01:00:07   than listening to the show is to get a book on tape so get to get something [TS]

01:00:13   from Audible and right now I mean they're offering you a free audiobook to [TS]

01:00:18   fill in the case of this particular selection a 10 hour car ride how can you [TS]

01:00:22   say no to that there's no reason not to go check it out or you can get john's [TS]

01:00:26   pic which is the power broker and and fill your next three years of Cara [TS]

01:00:30   alright so the party want to start before that breaks into this might be a [TS]

01:00:37   little bit long so back to Apple and discoverability in search ability i I [TS]

01:00:42   would take the position [TS]

01:00:44   and I know this might not be popular but I think it's realistic that it's no [TS]

01:00:48   longer Apple's responsibility and it might never happen but it's no longer [TS]

01:00:52   Apple responsibility to promote your app in the App Store is just huge [TS]

01:01:00   back in the early days of the web yahoo had this directory where they're trying [TS]

01:01:04   to make a directory of every website basically and it worked in like nineteen [TS]

01:01:09   ninety-five was a really small place eventually though that was abandoned I [TS]

01:01:15   think I think it was abandoned because they were just got too big and a [TS]

01:01:21   directory paradigm was was just there was too much data too much out there on [TS]

01:01:26   the web just didn't fit and so that was pretty much abandoned in favor of [TS]

01:01:32   searched and searched all sorts of challenges it has ranking it has fam [TS]

01:01:37   issues but the directory paradigm did not skill and on the web [TS]

01:01:45   you're on your own to get attention for your site you're on your own to get [TS]

01:01:49   traffic it you know it's something that we merit-based if you can get good [TS]

01:01:51   people to link to you but you know in general you're on your own and making [TS]

01:01:56   something good enough is still on you anyway to get people into so I think the [TS]

01:02:01   App Store has reached that point very clearly where discoverability [TS]

01:02:06   is a word thrown around a lot with this I don't think it's apples problem I [TS]

01:02:11   really don't I think they can have your editorial pics which will cover some [TS]

01:02:15   discoverability [TS]

01:02:17   to the to the whole store you know that's chances are you're not gonna get [TS]

01:02:21   feature that often to matter you know you might get feature once or twice a [TS]

01:02:24   good app chance I can be featured every two weeks or anything so [TS]

01:02:29   discoverability through Apple's official editorial channels is going to help you [TS]

01:02:32   occasionally if ever everyday discoverability is not a problem it's [TS]

01:02:38   your problem it's you as a developer you have to get your own attention you to [TS]

01:02:42   get your own traffic and whether you have to buy that traffic where you have [TS]

01:02:45   to earn it whether you have to look into it if some influential person happens to [TS]

01:02:49   use your happened you know lead to a talk about it or something you know you [TS]

01:02:52   might get that but you have to do your marketing [TS]

01:02:56   that's the right attitude from a developer's perspective because you want [TS]

01:02:59   to be motivated to do the right things right I think that's the correct rate [TS]

01:03:01   for a developer to think about it but in the grand scheme of things it is Apple's [TS]

01:03:05   problem in that if they have a customer who buys an iOS device and they say I [TS]

01:03:10   would really like an application to keep track of my shopping list and they [TS]

01:03:13   search your shopping list on the App Store because they don't know what else [TS]

01:03:16   to do like they shop you today the Google for shopping list app or they [TS]

01:03:20   find the App Store luckily type shopping list into there and they didn't get the [TS]

01:03:24   results and it does serve assault are filled with tons and tons of crap that [TS]

01:03:28   the person looking at the screen says no way to determine whether they're being [TS]

01:03:32   lied to with these are all automated reviews whether you know it just feels [TS]

01:03:36   lost that's a bad experience of the customers like I just wanna shop in this [TS]

01:03:39   in this is too many of them and I can't tell which is which [TS]

01:03:42   and I think that's that's a problem for Apple because they want people to get [TS]

01:03:45   their thing to be able to have a cool shopping list app and surely there are [TS]

01:03:48   many cool shopping list app but the chances of them being anywhere near the [TS]

01:03:51   top of the results for shopping list in the App Store slim I got so many people [TS]

01:03:55   talking about you know we all know the handful of really great Twitter client [TS]

01:03:58   apps out there if you search for Twitter whether a person like that in the App [TS]

01:04:02   Store all the apps that we know and love [TS]

01:04:05   debris think should be at least on the first page of results are somewhat near [TS]

01:04:07   the top are very often are buried and you know is that a problem for its like [TS]

01:04:12   the app developer cansao Apple it's your fault not so much stuff cuz I'm buried [TS]

01:04:16   Arabia has to do their own marketing everything but from Apple's prospective [TS]

01:04:20   they want everyone who buys an iOS device two types in Twitter app to end [TS]

01:04:24   up with a good one [TS]

01:04:25   like one that Apple agrees is good one that everyone agrees is good enough to [TS]

01:04:29   sort through tons and tons of crap I think that's bad experience for Apple's [TS]

01:04:33   customers not gonna on any individual based developer deserves to be at the [TS]

01:04:37   top or whatever but just in terms of how satisfied as the user with that [TS]

01:04:40   experience of typing in shopping list and finding a good job especially with [TS]

01:04:44   no trials and just be another form of torture PCB like download trial delete [TS]

01:04:48   download proudly download trial delete we want some way to like AC was saying [TS]

01:04:53   to look at an application in to be able to tell is this going to be good and I [TS]

01:04:58   being scammed am I being full of users cannot trust these people in these [TS]

01:05:02   reviews right and you know that's why I think it's very important to [TS]

01:05:07   draw distinction here that you know in air quotes discoverability that weren't [TS]

01:05:13   alone that's not a problem [TS]

01:05:15   search is Apple's problem and search ranking and you know so making it so [TS]

01:05:22   that if you search for shopping list and the App Store and you know making it so [TS]

01:05:26   that mostly good / popular apps show up on top that's important and their search [TS]

01:05:32   engine sucks I there's no app store search has always sucked so you know [TS]

01:05:39   that's that they they have tons of room for improvement and they really should [TS]

01:05:43   be working on that however you're still mostly on your own you know assume they [TS]

01:05:49   give assume they make good search you know let's let's say they fix it [TS]

01:05:53   honestly it's probably not happening anytime soon but let's be realistic here [TS]

01:05:56   but assume they actually did make really good search then and so it would be kind [TS]

01:06:02   of Google life which is like the most popular generally the most like Valley [TS]

01:06:08   popular things would generally ranked on top for for any given terms they can't [TS]

01:06:12   use Google thing because Google is all based on the way other people linked to [TS]

01:06:14   them but they web store is closed ecosystem and the problem with a closed [TS]

01:06:18   ecosystem of the App Store in terms of searches you do what is your signal for [TS]

01:06:21   determining what's good or not you can't use user activity is a simple because [TS]

01:06:26   users are not like independent entities like because if you if you keywords spam [TS]

01:06:31   you'll get boosted if you spam people breaking down boxes you'll get boosted [TS]

01:06:36   up in terms of over 1000 that ranks but lots of scummy things that you can do [TS]

01:06:39   and that's the only thing that affects the signals user activity so if you can [TS]

01:06:43   convince tons of users to download the application and they'll give it one star [TS]

01:06:47   reviews but you pay for five times more five star reviews are just random people [TS]

01:06:51   around the world you'll be high ranked have all the signals the Death Star says [TS]

01:06:55   good which is why their search algorithm put this crap near the top because those [TS]

01:06:59   people have you know sort of game system to get near the top of that the only [TS]

01:07:02   input signal then like apples at the mercy of its own rules that in every [TS]

01:07:07   time it changes the rules people discovering people game and again which [TS]

01:07:10   is why the top results for almost any category of APIs filled with crap [TS]

01:07:14   applications and [TS]

01:07:16   like one solution is to open up the ecosystem like the web where you know [TS]

01:07:21   you have to do all the work of the SEO battling stop the Google does with a [TS]

01:07:27   figure out when people make a link farms and combat that is a constant stream of [TS]

01:07:31   battling but within a very narrowly defined App Store with no other similar [TS]

01:07:35   coming into this you know like resembled a social networking type signal of I'm [TS]

01:07:40   friends with this person therefore their opinions and ratings mean more to me [TS]

01:07:43   than these random other people who I don't know or some other source of [TS]

01:07:46   signal it's difficult for Apple to ever make a search that doesn't suck not [TS]

01:07:50   because they don't know what they're doing but because any criteria that you [TS]

01:07:54   choose to rent on will be gamed inside this little bubble oh yeah I mean that [TS]

01:07:59   was always a problem with my first job was enterprise search and that was a big [TS]

01:08:03   problem [TS]

01:08:04   enterprise search even is like if your job as a search engine is to search [TS]

01:08:09   through this company's intranet and they're like tens of thousands or [TS]

01:08:13   millions of documents they haven't liked file stores and stuff there's no there's [TS]

01:08:18   no Pagerank information they're like there's no helpful way to rank results [TS]

01:08:24   of any kind of importance or or popularity there and if you do the if [TS]

01:08:28   you do the sort of incompetent but not evil thing to say well as track activity [TS]

01:08:32   and you could say well people search for vacations schedulers people search for [TS]

01:08:37   the word vacation on the internet and you know eighty percent of the people [TS]

01:08:42   search for vacation click on this link you must be really good will it means [TS]

01:08:45   that link probably can't be at the top for whatever reason and everybody clicks [TS]

01:08:48   on top and everyone goes to it is disappointed by it because it's like [TS]

01:08:51   three years ago the schedule and as more people do that it gets higher and higher [TS]

01:08:56   in the rankings and just get cemented as the number one matches everybody this is [TS]

01:09:00   two years ago [TS]

01:09:01   vacation schedule like that's that's an example where you don't have any other [TS]

01:09:04   input signal so any errors that you have when you're out with them just become [TS]

01:09:08   magnified by things that you didn't intend I totally see that [TS]

01:09:11   the App Store on the topless workers out there like you know what is it the same [TS]

01:09:17   expression I can remember this on the chat room where the rich get richer [TS]

01:09:20   that's not it but it's like that anyway that's good we'll go with that but yeah [TS]

01:09:24   you get in the top of topless and everyone sees you know topless made by [TS]

01:09:27   you which makes you hire in the topless and when you talk about discovered that [TS]

01:09:30   we're talking about is like say I'm not on the top list I'm unknown I didn't [TS]

01:09:35   scan my way to the top [TS]

01:09:36   I don't have a popular application how do I do a breakthrough how do I get [TS]

01:09:40   people to know that I exist I believe I have a good application that's this [TS]

01:09:44   quote unquote discovered billion that's where marketing you have to do your own [TS]

01:09:47   market you can expect Apple to help you get in get in the face of you know get [TS]

01:09:52   on the topless how do I break into the top results but you could do its gonna [TS]

01:09:55   be stuffed apples hopefully battling for you have to do something else is not a [TS]

01:09:58   problem to figure out how do I go from zero into the topless but it is not a [TS]

01:10:02   problem to say look at the ecosystem of apps within any search term or any [TS]

01:10:06   category as a handful of applications that we think are great and we can't [TS]

01:10:10   editorially hand-picked you know every single category that we should have some [TS]

01:10:13   kind of algorithm that will put up the applications that if you talk to anyone [TS]

01:10:18   on the street that would agree are good you know our popular or high quality or [TS]

01:10:23   not pieces and that's also a bit of exploration to you know this is this is [TS]

01:10:28   hard for a lot of people to to even recognized as a possibility or two to [TS]

01:10:32   judge or accept but it's also possible that you're a Peter isn't that good or [TS]

01:10:37   is not compelling you know what if what if no one's buying your app because they [TS]

01:10:42   don't really want it or they're really needed enough to justify the price to [TS]

01:10:45   them there's a clock yeah I mean like of buckshot in the store now for $1 and it [TS]

01:10:52   makes about two to four dollars a day sometimes one but usually 24 I don't do [TS]

01:10:59   any promotion of it in fact mentioning here is the first time I've even thought [TS]

01:11:03   about it besides using it in months and you know that's that's a good example of [TS]

01:11:09   like an everyday app you know it's it's paid it's only a dollar though that so [TS]

01:11:13   it's it's paid but really chief and there is no extra promotion of it except [TS]

01:11:19   a link on my relatively buried link on my site that nobody ever clicks on [TS]

01:11:23   and you know it does poorly less taxes the same way I get excited if I have one [TS]

01:11:30   sale in a day and I would say you know every two or three days I do get a sale [TS]

01:11:35   and I've actually had a really good run of three whole days where I had one sale [TS]

01:11:39   but if I see more than once in a day that's like baby let's go to dinner is [TS]

01:11:44   daddy's risk it all kidding aside it's it's very much the same for me but [TS]

01:11:49   that's that's that's a symptom and you know that in the Buckshot sounds like [TS]

01:11:53   that's a symptom of a lot of different conditions one of which in my case is [TS]

01:11:59   late and probably your case too there's tons of competition has tons of other [TS]

01:12:03   apps many of them free at do roughly the same thing and this is an area like [TS]

01:12:08   Apple could do very well to improve how we were able to communicate what our app [TS]

01:12:12   does like that there is a rumor couple weeks ago they then able to video in one [TS]

01:12:18   apt description and the end people are thinking of what if they enable video [TS]

01:12:22   for all apps in the future and you know and I suppose that comes with pluses and [TS]

01:12:26   minuses the pluses are you could show off more of your app and it'd be easier [TS]

01:12:30   to sell a paid app upfront if people who watch a video about it right there in [TS]

01:12:34   the App Store and you can kind of show off how how good it is to me it's good [TS]

01:12:38   but I'm downside is you'd expect to make a video which is time-consuming and [TS]

01:12:43   potentially expensive so there's there's all sorts of plus or minus is there but [TS]

01:12:49   you know the fact is the absence of very crowded place and if you're if your app [TS]

01:12:53   is selling very badly especially if it's paid up front I mean Instapaper was not [TS]

01:12:57   selling very well in its last year before so I mean it didn't sell that [TS]

01:13:02   well because I was it was a paid app in a crowded App Store like people think [TS]

01:13:06   I'm immune to all these effects but I'm not and look at buckshot it's it's out [TS]

01:13:11   there for a buck and no one buys it [TS]

01:13:13   you do this like popularity on the internet only take you so far and so the [TS]

01:13:21   bigger problem here is not that that Apple has to improve discoverability you [TS]

01:13:27   know in quotes it's the App Store is really crowded and maybe your app just [TS]

01:13:31   isn't taking off in sales because it isn't that compelling for that many [TS]

01:13:36   people [TS]

01:13:37   or there is the need for that kind of app but someone else is doing it for [TS]

01:13:40   free or had or is you know spending more on advertising or or is you know sending [TS]

01:13:47   promo codes to all the people who are on the Mac blogs or something like that and [TS]

01:13:50   other things you have to do to get noticed and if your app is really great [TS]

01:13:54   even if used to a little bit of promotion it rapidly great it will get [TS]

01:13:58   noticed it will spread people find it like that's how I know we all know what [TS]

01:14:03   the good Twitter app so we could probably name all of them are even if we [TS]

01:14:05   don't use them ourselves and the reason we know is because people who write [TS]

01:14:09   about applications review iOS applications who are you a lot of I was [TS]

01:14:14   applications who have popular technology blogs talk about their applications of [TS]

01:14:18   their interview sometimes they ask what your favorite male application what's [TS]

01:14:22   your favorite to do like people talk about things and you know just through [TS]

01:14:25   word of mouth and old fashioned this is the author of organic marketing in [TS]

01:14:28   addition to the regular marketing people doing advertising on podcast buying ads [TS]

01:14:32   in magazines giving promotion code stay ready getting reviewed if you actually [TS]

01:14:36   make a good application that most people who have you had given you know four or [TS]

01:14:40   five stars or thumbs up a generally positive review you will eventually [TS]

01:14:45   start to gain traction and the tragedy of that situation is where I made an [TS]

01:14:50   awesome a patina crowded market but like mine is a popular one its IT people [TS]

01:14:54   think it's interesting people think it's got a new take on the genre or it's a [TS]

01:14:58   great example of the forum has lots of features and its high-quality [TS]

01:15:03   application everybody likes it and people go to the AppStore and search for [TS]

01:15:06   that with a generic term because they can remember your name [TS]

01:15:10   remember your name they can't find it and then just under 10 the results of [TS]

01:15:14   crap and that's where you're just being handicapped by the App Store you like [TS]

01:15:18   unless they have a direct link to my product with the exact iTunes you're out [TS]

01:15:21   if people search for me they're very likely to find a clone application in an [TS]

01:15:26   unrelated application or just generally be distracted by crappy other [TS]

01:15:30   applications that are not what they're looking for even if I get them to go [TS]

01:15:33   there try to find my application that is terrible [TS]

01:15:36   that's where you feel like Apple's actively impairing what would otherwise [TS]

01:15:39   be a successor you have a great application it's you know it's the new [TS]

01:15:44   version Tweetbot go find it [TS]

01:15:45   people can't remember what it was they search for Twitter and tweet bodies on [TS]

01:15:48   page 17 and no one ever finds me and you know there's obviously a lot I can do [TS]

01:15:53   there but if your abs barely selling it is not because you don't have enough [TS]

01:15:58   reviews that's that's not the reason and and let's say you had a bunch of you [TS]

01:16:04   that putting in one of these stupid dialogues and then you're at your sales [TS]

01:16:08   go up like you know 10% the next week or something how's it going to last and [TS]

01:16:13   what else are you willing to do to keep that going and is it really worth it you [TS]

01:16:17   know it the fact is like if your app is selling very badly [TS]

01:16:21   chances are it's because it's not that necessary or not that compelling or not [TS]

01:16:25   priced right or something like that and you to change something it's it's not [TS]

01:16:29   about Lake juicing the sales you have it's about either dropping your price [TS]

01:16:35   they got some other way to make to make money make make a free no doin a [TS]

01:16:39   purchase or you know dropped to a buck and see if that helps [TS]

01:16:43   after the market demands or find find your audience because like say you're [TS]

01:16:47   trying to sell nursing clock and you've just been advertising on Mac tech [TS]

01:16:51   websites you know you gotta find like where we're our new mothers hanging out [TS]

01:16:55   maybe you know find the old days you've got to use Nikkor be posted then you get [TS]

01:17:00   more sales from when you think of posting [TS]

01:17:02   yeah I'm crossing the streams had used that existing its active thing at the [TS]

01:17:06   same time that there anyway you have to find where your audience lives and [TS]

01:17:09   advertised in that context what podcast they listen to what sites they visit [TS]

01:17:12   maybe that's the problem maybe it's not the rap sucks maybe you just haven't [TS]

01:17:15   found the audience and maybe there's an audience of people who want really [TS]

01:17:18   complicated nursing clogs and yours is a simple find the people who want simple [TS]

01:17:22   things like that you know it's it's the same product marketing thing is you know [TS]

01:17:26   as any other to prague fine getting the right features of the right price and [TS]

01:17:30   getting that message in front of the right people [TS]

01:17:32   great writing applications are not the way to do that especially since I said [TS]

01:17:37   if there really is no hard-and-fast evidence that getting more ratings or [TS]

01:17:43   higher [TS]

01:17:43   getting more ratings by bugging people is going to help move you up their rank [TS]

01:17:48   in any significant [TS]

01:17:49   well people say it works I I have no support this like I i treated the other [TS]

01:17:53   day at like there is one version of Instapaper that that due to an App Store [TS]

01:17:57   publishing bogus this is when when everything was being published broken [TS]

01:18:01   signatures and they couldn't log online for like a day two years ago whenever [TS]

01:18:05   that was that version of Instapaper once it was fixed and republished was not [TS]

01:18:10   reviewable and it was in the store with no reviews for however long that was the [TS]

01:18:16   latest version I forgot how long I think it was at least a few weeks maybe even [TS]

01:18:19   longer maybe even a couple of months and it seemed to make no difference in what [TS]

01:18:25   my average daily sales were like none at all and yes sure not every opportunity [TS]

01:18:28   you know just like this they're they're obviously different editions on [TS]

01:18:32   everything but that was just one day appoint a lot of people have given other [TS]

01:18:35   data points saying like well one release I had no reviews and then I didn't sell [TS]

01:18:41   that many in the next release had a bunch of using a lot more that could [TS]

01:18:45   also be due to different factors like it's it's hard to run controlled [TS]

01:18:47   experiments in the App Store so it's you know it's it's hard to really say [TS]

01:18:52   whether it works definitively or not [TS]

01:18:55   chances are a little bit the question is whether it works enough to make it worth [TS]

01:19:00   it to you to have that quality reduction and and that that depends on what your [TS]

01:19:04   priorities lie I think the reason that the big good app developers are [TS]

01:19:09   resorting to their rating dialog boxes as a way to combat the the crappy [TS]

01:19:15   developers like if you go to some crappy application it will have little [TS]

01:19:20   histogram will have a huge number of five star ratings at base camp there [TS]

01:19:23   with and then they'll be a bunch of like one started like you shape whatever if [TS]

01:19:29   you make a really popular application that everybody loves especially since it [TS]

01:19:34   doesn't spend its time writing reviews are reading applications what you'll see [TS]

01:19:37   is a bunch of angry people who read it one star because of backlash because [TS]

01:19:41   they read about it in seven different websites and they tried it and they [TS]

01:19:44   didn't like it so like I read about these websites in their rooms I was [TS]

01:19:46   great but i dont think its great once I wanna start when stark and all the [TS]

01:19:50   people who love your application are not going to rate it and you're like geez [TS]

01:19:53   this is not a one-star application or a two-star obligation I really think this [TS]

01:19:58   is a four star in every place 23 viewed it and every person that's used it is [TS]

01:20:01   said it's great [TS]

01:20:02   why am I reading so bad and if someone does a search with their crappy search [TS]

01:20:05   system and sees will this thing has an average of 4.8 and this one has an [TS]

01:20:10   average of 3.2 3.2 1 month must suck in reality the four point eight one guy [TS]

01:20:15   scandal is reviewed by paying people to rate it five stars or whatever and no [TS]

01:20:19   one rated one star because no there are no legitimate users of that application [TS]

01:20:22   because no one ever willingly downloaded to pay for it and the application that [TS]

01:20:26   is actually good just has the backslash Nagar backs election backlash there you [TS]

01:20:33   go [TS]

01:20:33   is the word that backlash negative views and not enough positive ones maybe have [TS]

01:20:38   some positive ones but not enough and that will bring this developer to feel [TS]

01:20:41   justified in saying look I worked hard and supplication it gets great reviews [TS]

01:20:44   every magazine and website that says good I know I have a lot of users whose [TS]

01:20:48   people are buying it please can you go on rate my application I think this is [TS]

01:20:52   what leads good applications to go bad good applications to throw in your face [TS]

01:20:56   and I like box that says please read my application because they're fighting [TS]

01:21:00   against that crap and that's another case where I think if Apple did [TS]

01:21:04   something about the crap in the App Store these developers would feel less [TS]

01:21:08   pressure and there would be less justified in saying well I'm just asking [TS]

01:21:13   my happy users of my application it's popular to rate things I don't ask them [TS]

01:21:17   in and all the crap applications do ask them to pay people to my application [TS]

01:21:22   looks worse when people buy less and again the role that ablaze in this is [TS]

01:21:27   due to get rid of the bad stuff is something you said earlier John kind of [TS]

01:21:31   got me to thinking a little bit and I was wondering you know you had said [TS]

01:21:35   something about like the facebook facebook if occasion if that's even a [TS]

01:21:40   word which is now of the App Store and you know hey 12 of your friends are [TS]

01:21:47   using this app or whatever kind of thinking that firstly imagine if on the [TS]

01:21:52   App Store you could see that nato X number of your Facebook contacts or [TS]

01:21:59   Twitter followers or or the people you're following on Twitter would [TS]

01:22:02   probably an even better metric [TS]

01:22:04   X number of those people have downloaded this app and then separately why number [TS]

01:22:10   of that same group actually have this app on their device and that would be [TS]

01:22:15   really cool and you know that would be a tremendous amount of data and yes it's a [TS]

01:22:19   little bit creepy but if it was all can I miss you could never find out who [TS]

01:22:23   those people were maybe would be ok that's when I said that Facebook [TS]

01:22:27   application of whatever I was saying in a negative sense because that's a [TS]

01:22:30   privacy thing where the facebook facebook does that but like I would not [TS]

01:22:34   want the App Store to buy the fault show even even just counts for because if you [TS]

01:22:40   see an application like if you know if you friend like two people right and you [TS]

01:22:46   see the number on like your guide to getting a divorce application go up by [TS]

01:22:50   one you know that's one of your friends and you know which one is like totally [TS]

01:22:54   can't be the default it has to be totally opt-in it can't be like facebook [TS]

01:22:59   but that's the reason Facebook and other things do it by default this because [TS]

01:23:02   they can harvest lots of good signal from these relationships in these [TS]

01:23:07   activities and I don't think I should do that but there is there is a place [TS]

01:23:12   between what Apple is doing and what Facebook does even if you just look at [TS]

01:23:17   something like more like when Amazon does Amazon stuff it's basically like [TS]

01:23:20   the App Store in their reviews we're just a bunch of anonymous people most of [TS]

01:23:23   whom were angry writing things that may or may not be true all what is Amazon [TS]

01:23:27   had one tiny extra thing Amazon ads is the ability of other people to respond [TS]

01:23:33   to reviews or write a big angry view and say I got this thing home and it didn't [TS]

01:23:37   work as advertised and it is supposed to do this and it said it did that involve [TS]

01:23:40   block just have one person respond and say oh you didn't see the whatever [TS]

01:23:44   switcher you have to know that you have to look it up to the whatever and then [TS]

01:23:47   it will do the thing that you wanted or if you had read the manual you would [TS]

01:23:50   realize that you have to do this stuff [TS]

01:23:52   thing that's it all they've added is just another level of sort of anonymous [TS]

01:23:56   random garbage even that is better than the App Store just one big long linear [TS]

01:24:01   listen if you're lucky you can scroll through twenty pages and find some [TS]

01:24:04   person correcting somebody who said something totally bogus and bad that's [TS]

01:24:07   one tiny step towards the direction of I see that seven of my trusted friends [TS]

01:24:12   have installed the Senate launched in the last day which is totally creepy [TS]

01:24:14   Facebook stuff it is creepy but nevertheless I could I feel like there's [TS]

01:24:19   a way in which it could be only slightly creepy but very very useful and the [TS]

01:24:24   actual point I was trying to drive ad is what if this is what topsy was for [TS]

01:24:29   because top seeds of my limited understanding top season it was built [TS]

01:24:33   for handling massive amounts of data and to me the only really massive amounts of [TS]

01:24:39   data that happen probably cares about if not Twitter itself is their retail [TS]

01:24:45   stores and the App Store in announcing the top see necessarily is going to do [TS]

01:24:50   this weird thing that I just concocted about who me how many of your friends [TS]

01:24:53   have this and how many of your friends have some devices but I could easily see [TS]

01:24:57   it Missy topsy being used for either one of these things and the other popular [TS]

01:25:02   thing that a few listeners have written about and I think makes sense is if I [TS]

01:25:05   beacons are sprinkled throughout Apple retail stores perhaps aggregating that [TS]

01:25:11   data in seen speaking of being creepy where people walking within an Apple [TS]

01:25:16   store because at that point with enough I beacons and if you have the app [TS]

01:25:20   installed on your phone [TS]

01:25:21   presumably you would be able to maybe even know that much information usage [TS]

01:25:26   data that's going through Google creepy at like you know what happened just [TS]

01:25:29   tracks every time you launch an application and someone suggested [TS]

01:25:32   demarco that you respond to your blog web they tracked how long you use an [TS]

01:25:35   application which almost any metric you pick up can be gained as I think Marco [TS]

01:25:38   pointed out with the how long the use of its punishing applications to get you in [TS]

01:25:42   and out quickly [TS]

01:25:43   the application is sufficient that you don't need to spend a long time and that [TS]

01:25:46   application gets punished versus the one that keeps you inside the application [TS]

01:25:50   because cumbersome to use like a metric you pick is gonna have some downsides [TS]

01:25:54   but there are tons and tons of venues to get some other signal in here and you [TS]

01:25:59   just have to be careful and how do you pick them but I think you need some more [TS]

01:26:02   input [TS]

01:26:03   have to get the closed ecosystem it's much easier to gain and if you have lots [TS]

01:26:07   of different kinds of input that are more difficult to control like the App [TS]

01:26:12   Store viewer you know the sky people can pay people to leave hafez all reviews [TS]

01:26:15   and stuff they will have a much harder time they can't what they can't do is [TS]

01:26:19   pay every single website that reviews iOS applications to give them a good [TS]

01:26:23   review that's much harder than just a one-star review so that signal that [TS]

01:26:26   external signal is harder to control the internal anything that just exist inside [TS]

01:26:31   the App Store is going to be a lot easier to gain anything that involves [TS]

01:26:34   all of us in the trick is to find some way to get useful signal from us in a [TS]

01:26:37   way that's not creepy doesn't track every single thing that we do it doesn't [TS]

01:26:41   you know violate her privacy but showing everybody which applications were [TS]

01:26:44   downloading and using and win but just get this possum out I suppose tops you [TS]

01:26:49   can be involved in looking at that would like any time by any company that you [TS]

01:26:53   know they're not gonna tell us what they're going to do and we just have to [TS]

01:26:56   guess that you can do that you know i i guess that primeSense company they could [TS]

01:27:01   do that I have a sensor for the TV or for the next iPad for their next iPhone [TS]

01:27:05   or for their watch or for a ring they're gonna do the classes or we'll see what [TS]

01:27:12   the only one that was easy was Monday but was that called the child company or [TS]

01:27:17   whatever they redid the store they bought the company that that but they're [TS]

01:27:21   gonna use into the store and as far as I know yes they did and and and nobody [TS]

01:27:26   likes a police feel guess right about what those before they were going to be [TS]

01:27:29   doing with the company when they want them you know I wouldn't have high hopes [TS]

01:27:33   for Apple doing meaningful things here i mean look at how they've improved the [TS]

01:27:38   App Store since its introduction [TS]

01:27:42   the crickets sound effect well they kind of its kind of shut things in one [TS]

01:27:49   direction that it pops out there someplace else and they should be done [TS]

01:27:52   over there and then anything pops out and so they're kind of doing stuff but [TS]

01:27:56   it's all just like equilibrium you know the shift in one direction should [TS]

01:28:00   packing other there's never any like big cleaning push into a whole new realm of [TS]

01:28:05   wind it's always address whatever the most egregious problem is but actually [TS]

01:28:09   caused another one in the address that want to cause another one kind of [TS]

01:28:12   staying in the middle of a problem with the App Store during this whole time is [TS]

01:28:16   during the time that they've been working on trying to tweak it and make [TS]

01:28:20   sure it doesn't get too far out of line the volume has gone up like crazy and [TS]

01:28:23   it's really difficult to do anything useful unless you get it exactly right [TS]

01:28:26   when the volume is growing up so fast because a new kinds of problems are [TS]

01:28:29   cropping up all the time in the solution that would have been perfectly viable [TS]

01:28:32   and it was small is now useless and become of the new solution yet [TS]

01:28:36   implemented in your gonna go up again and like Marco said if eventually you [TS]

01:28:40   reach web-scale then this whole idea of having a directory where they can do [TS]

01:28:46   they're like they're reproducing the web I guess Amazon does the same thing I [TS]

01:28:51   Amazon Amazon I soon will always have more products in the App Store does and [TS]

01:28:56   they managed to do better sort of searching recommendations is very rarely [TS]

01:29:00   do I type something and Amazon and not find the thing I want I can misspelled [TS]

01:29:04   it I can miss remember what it's called as long as I miss remembering in the [TS]

01:29:07   same way that a bunch of other people I miss remembering Amazon seems to have to [TS]

01:29:10   do a good job of keeping track but just like Google keeping track of not the the [TS]

01:29:15   first day result the people click on but the first result that I should leads to [TS]

01:29:18   like a sale or a lingering on a page or whatever they're doing over there at [TS]

01:29:21   Amazon the company acquired merge with you know someone please help them Amazon [TS]

01:29:26   well I mean who who sells out of things and make some discoverable and has a [TS]

01:29:32   reasonable system for buying stuff that people tend to like Amazon right will [TS]

01:29:36   hold on though but yeah you're right about that but you're also talking about [TS]

01:29:39   physical goods and and and audio and things like that when i was just [TS]

01:29:44   wondering is how is Amazon's Appstore for discovery and things of that nature [TS]

01:29:49   problem is they don't have a lot [TS]

01:29:50   perhaps no one uses it and nobody uses it but I mean even amongst the twelve [TS]

01:29:55   people they use it isn't any better [TS]

01:29:57   it may not be we've had a number of comments in the chat room during the [TS]

01:30:01   show that apparently the Google Play Store is is really good about reviews [TS]

01:30:04   and rankings and that makes sense if it's true that makes sense because [TS]

01:30:07   Google is really good at search and ranking [TS]

01:30:11   they they know how to do that well and they prioritize that they are probably [TS]

01:30:16   totally not above keeping track of what every application is launched an Android [TS]

01:30:20   phone and how long people all those stats and they get crackin on misleading [TS]

01:30:24   however you know and then I try to do like but that is that's because that's [TS]

01:30:28   what they do on the web they gather every ounce of signal they can on the [TS]

01:30:31   web and try to block out every source of noise and gaming of the system they can [TS]

01:30:35   for the entire web and that's what the whole company was founded on so of [TS]

01:30:39   course the same tools on a Web Start course they're gonna do better that [TS]

01:30:43   they're not see the the fireplace to talk about that but we talked about last [TS]

01:30:47   week about someone saying why isn't anybody talk about this feature they [TS]

01:30:50   didn't ship and whatever I was talking about the why isn't anybody talking [TS]

01:30:56   about an angle but a lot of people were like I thought I did she buy just loaded [TS]

01:30:59   in work and some people doing it as a joke but some people are kind of like [TS]

01:31:06   half serious than I have to admit to myself like a lots of features that [TS]

01:31:11   Apple shipped back to my back to my Mac feature which also has work sporadically [TS]

01:31:15   for me if Apple ships a feature that has anything to do with the net it's very [TS]

01:31:22   difficult to tell whether the future is missing entirely or just isn't working [TS]

01:31:24   right yet because they hide all but the nuts and bolts from you so I'm back to [TS]

01:31:29   my Mac isn't working if we told you that Apple removed back to my neck from OS 10 [TS]

01:31:32   two years ago versus oh no it's always been there to work for as far as you're [TS]

01:31:36   concerned experiences the same you just it it doesn't seem to do what it's [TS]

01:31:41   supposed to do and maybe this type checkbox for it but you know that's how [TS]

01:31:46   far up as reputations and tree falls in the woods and it never works for anybody [TS]

01:31:50   but so far upper levels reputation has fallen so far that if anything you can [TS]

01:31:55   do it online people to see much it but it didn't work I mean I think App Store [TS]

01:31:59   search you know because you know because searches such a hard problem [TS]

01:32:02   and and you look at the different apparently very well it's not a surprise [TS]

01:32:07   and Apple to the surprise I think this is the kind of problem that Apple will [TS]

01:32:12   probably just never do that well like it's it's just not in their in their DNA [TS]

01:32:18   to really do research and management of this large data said you know management [TS]

01:32:23   of spam and Kim and everything else like it's just not what they do well and [TS]

01:32:28   they've never ever shown an ability to do that kind of thing well nor a [TS]

01:32:34   priority to really put a lot of resources into it and so i dont I would [TS]

01:32:38   not expect the situation to change from there and before we leave this topic is [TS]

01:32:42   one one more thing I want to briefly touch on which is the reason it always [TS]

01:32:44   rains in here and here they are linking to your blog post about writing this [TS]

01:32:50   happened and other responses to saying that Apple you said you can't ban the [TS]

01:32:56   dialog boxes in the zone responded and he responded back to them this idea that [TS]

01:33:01   the space mad the other one solution to this problem of the rating now I boxes [TS]

01:33:06   that Apple could just say you're not allowed to put up a dialog box at Assam [TS]

01:33:09   under a publication and you were saying you can make that religion can enforce [TS]

01:33:14   it and you are going back and forth do you have anything more than that of them [TS]

01:33:17   are you putting the blog but they're not really I mean a lot of people have [TS]

01:33:21   suggested ways they could add a report button or something to get to a wooden [TS]

01:33:25   actually work in practice like a few if they added a report as abuse or [TS]

01:33:31   inappropriate or whatever [TS]

01:33:33   button to every you I'll argue that obviously is very costly and other [TS]

01:33:38   factors and then people to stop using your views [TS]

01:33:41   think it's not that hard to write your own WAP overview like that looks and [TS]

01:33:46   works like a dialog box and just as action as a subview of the window and [TS]

01:33:51   you know what are they gonna do it but never UIView obviously they can't do [TS]

01:33:54   that so there's really no like any kind of like a minor offense that lots of [TS]

01:34:01   apps will do that will appear after a preview time such as spam push [TS]

01:34:07   notifications which are also against the rules but they're very prevalent anyway [TS]

01:34:11   I was gonna say that that's a perfect example because those already are [TS]

01:34:14   against the rules you're not allowed to send people push notifications [TS]

01:34:17   advertisements in it and yet many of us the push notifications which things with [TS]

01:34:22   things in the look alike [TS]

01:34:23   advertisements right all the time and it's for my post like it's very similar [TS]

01:34:29   to that problem which is this thing already is against the rules this [TS]

01:34:32   nation's already against the rules but it's really not enforced because unless [TS]

01:34:38   the reviewer for a preview get this thing during like the five minutes [TS]

01:34:42   they're spending with the app unless they themselves get spammed and notices [TS]

01:34:47   against the rule [TS]

01:34:48   they're never going to catch it really and once it's already in the wild after [TS]

01:34:52   the fact like these are such relatively minor rule violations like it be [TS]

01:34:58   differently if your app passes a preview and then you have a hard-coded like two [TS]

01:35:02   weeks later it it becomes malware somehow that would get noticed and I [TS]

01:35:08   would get shut down cuz that's like that really bad Developer Program whatever [TS]

01:35:13   else fine but something like this like a minor offense like a push notification [TS]

01:35:18   or write this after I like those are not major enough PR problems major enough [TS]

01:35:24   offenses in the App Store that if it happened after review time Apple make a [TS]

01:35:30   big effort to crack down on that and eliminate that it is not important [TS]

01:35:33   enough to do everything else they have to do so realistically speaking it's [TS]

01:35:38   very unlikely that Apple would ever ban these dialogues and if they did it's [TS]

01:35:44   very likely would be enforced so my position on this is that I mostly agree [TS]

01:35:49   with the difficulty of enforcing lewis also agree with the you know like just [TS]

01:35:53   because it's difficult it can be done but I think that if if this agreement [TS]

01:35:58   within Apple this is a new experience they don't want people to have that [TS]

01:36:03   they're using their application and dialog box pops up in a separate [TS]

01:36:06   applications they should absolutely added to the guidelines just like a [TS]

01:36:09   thing that says you're not supposed to get ads and push notifications because [TS]

01:36:11   Apple's decided that getting advertisements push notifications not [TS]

01:36:15   the experience they wanted their phones [TS]

01:36:17   enforceability I think should be not entirely separate but mostly separate [TS]

01:36:21   from making the rules I think the rule against advertising pushing [TS]

01:36:24   is a good rule kinda like the you know the the school zone speed limits which [TS]

01:36:29   are usually set like super low it so that if if they want to they can get [TS]

01:36:33   every single person's goes on a ticket gives you makes it so that like [TS]

01:36:37   everybody is breaking the law and then you can you know anybody over but in [TS]

01:36:42   this case I think it reasonable speed limit if you just put in a role that you [TS]

01:36:45   can put up to rate me too I it's not like it's going to turn the mail what [TS]

01:36:48   now we're how you gonna know that the distinct really put up a dialog box and [TS]

01:36:53   who was it bad that blog post explaining like a big system of a sort of a social [TS]

01:36:58   engineered system we're different people could report violations and then if [TS]

01:37:03   their accuracy there reporting gives their reports a higher ranking and [TS]

01:37:06   there's lots of systems that are possible [TS]

01:37:08   yeah I wouldn't get too bogged down in details so that I would just say if this [TS]

01:37:12   is an experienced it up things you shouldn't have put it in the guidelines [TS]

01:37:15   and maybe it's incredibly spread we enforce almost never enforced the fact [TS]

01:37:21   that it's there and I think it's probably easier to enforce them to push [TS]

01:37:25   notification will be split over his income from like elsewhere the rate me [TS]

01:37:28   think I guess it could be triggered by an external server based thing but the [TS]

01:37:31   code to put the dialogue has to be in your application somewhere it's the type [TS]

01:37:36   of thing where once it becomes a guideline that alone could push it off [TS]

01:37:40   into the crappy section of the absurd that I was talking about before and all [TS]

01:37:44   the good developers of the world applications that we all know and love [TS]

01:37:47   and use all the time would comply with the guy buying because those people are [TS]

01:37:51   willingly sending out push notifications rads either bases against the guidelines [TS]

01:37:54   and so even you know just putting in that guideline even though it can't stop [TS]

01:37:59   all the crap out from doing it just putting it there at all [TS]

01:38:03   would give a position that the protocol good guys in the App Store would follow [TS]

01:38:08   along with it thanks for the most part [TS]

01:38:10   well but there's already like I think everyone for the most part knows that [TS]

01:38:15   it's kind of not okay but most developers who are probably I'm planning [TS]

01:38:21   it because they've they've with a trade if there had been a well I know it's [TS]

01:38:26   kind of annoying to some people and it's kind of not okay but everyone else is [TS]

01:38:32   doing it [TS]

01:38:33   and I need all the help I can get myself so and that same rationale I think would [TS]

01:38:38   would still be there but that cost benefit is gonna be way different if [TS]

01:38:42   it's against the rules you would never knowingly put something on this tour [TS]

01:38:45   that violated a kind especially it was a high profile guideline that came into [TS]

01:38:48   being under circumstances like this for now Apple releases new guideline not [TS]

01:38:52   allowed to operate me you would never put up an application that knowingly [TS]

01:38:55   violate like it's not even subtle like it pops up and says please read this [TS]

01:38:59   application your violin violation none of the good developers would willingly [TS]

01:39:04   violet biggest suddenly the cost benefits like being kinda annoying but [TS]

01:39:07   bubble block versus my app is going to be rejected or there's a chance my Apple [TS]

01:39:12   gonna be rejected or as soon as somebody sees this I have all those backlash [TS]

01:39:16   users saying you need to get this all the storied violates here but I read [TS]

01:39:19   about on this website like I think all the good guys would follow you certainly [TS]

01:39:23   would write you wouldn't put it up now but like I think of a guideline that [TS]

01:39:27   able to come up with that you would willingly flout because you think it [TS]

01:39:30   gave you some minor increase in sales you wouldn't you would just say well [TS]

01:39:33   Apple's change the rules and made like my application unviable you go to [TS]

01:39:37   something else you would not violate the rules and I think that does the [TS]

01:39:40   functions of rules with certain not to eliminate the practice from really to [TS]

01:39:43   further marginalize it and make it socially unacceptable [TS]

01:39:48   agreed not to socially unacceptable but like the smart developers have a clue [TS]

01:39:52   who don't plan registering new Apple IDs for the Apple Developer Program every [TS]

01:39:55   two weeks to keep their business would say I can't you know I can willingly [TS]

01:40:00   violate this you know something I was thinking and I know we should probably [TS]

01:40:04   shouldn't get into the details of how to implement that kind of rating or to [TS]

01:40:08   enforce I should say that kind of reading but it what's stopping apple [TS]

01:40:13   from as part of the scan that they do for private API's what's stopping them [TS]

01:40:18   from from looking for great a nap something that's passed into you I love [TS]

01:40:24   you or you know just doing a string search within the within the compiled [TS]

01:40:28   code for EO rate an appt only couple words away from each other and maybe [TS]

01:40:33   they don't unilaterally rejected upon finding that [TS]

01:40:36   but maybe that you know raises a warning to the reviewers saying take a look at [TS]

01:40:42   this kind of heuristics they could pull off and again this totally not gonna [TS]

01:40:46   stop anybody wants to do it but you gotta text data from a survey you can [TS]

01:40:49   obviously did you know whatever but but yeah that's because more so than push [TS]

01:40:54   notifications come from Ty Lee elsewhere her and I think you have a fighting [TS]

01:40:59   chance it an automated tool that might bring up a flag on this you know and and [TS]

01:41:03   even if the reaction to that was just that the reviewer would contact the [TS]

01:41:06   developer and say you don't have a dog bites that pop up to say rate and then [TS]

01:41:12   they have to lie to you to get through them so no it doesn't have anything like [TS]

01:41:15   that and now you got them on records you know telling a lie and you know I think [TS]

01:41:20   it would be helpful I think we're good thanks like two or three sparked this [TS]

01:41:25   week [TS]

01:41:26   Backblaze cover and audible and we will see you next week now the show they [TS]

01:41:35   didn't even mean to begin [TS]

01:41:37   it was accidental [TS]

01:41:44   Casey [TS]

01:41:48   because it was a depth and you can find the show and he was a team markle [TS]

01:42:31   I'm so upset I missed the joke somebody the chaplain at the much better joke of [TS]

01:42:37   its pronounced TX 10 that would have been much better I I wish I would have [TS]

01:42:43   said that instead [TS]

01:42:47   there was one other additional attack on the great thing to hear these dialogues [TS]

01:42:56   work to kick you over to the absurd to review it is they call special URLs that [TS]

01:43:01   wants the App Store app to particular pages and in iOS 6 and earlier it was [TS]

01:43:07   possible to link directly to the review form for a nap and in seven that was no [TS]

01:43:12   longer possible in seven [TS]

01:43:14   the best you can do is linked to the apps page in the App Store one thing [TS]

01:43:20   Apple could do to me to combat this in a way that would actually be more [TS]

01:43:25   effective than policy is to make it stop working now they can't make links to the [TS]

01:43:31   App Store lab stopped working but one thing somebody suggested on Twitter [TS]

01:43:36   somewhere sorry I forgot who it was [TS]

01:43:38   is that what if they make it so that if the App Store is invoked by a URL for [TS]

01:43:44   their app don't allow the input of a reviewer rating that's an interesting [TS]

01:43:49   point I can be frustrating from a user's perspective because I can rate the [TS]

01:43:57   application and then it's like what did you get that window of their from a link [TS]

01:44:01   from another and that they don't remember what that means it looks like [TS]

01:44:04   their website is broken I don't know if he could that's like you know the people [TS]

01:44:10   who try to punish their dog for pooping connect you yelling at the dog with the [TS]

01:44:14   poopy made five minutes ago one of the things they could do that that I thought [TS]

01:44:18   of also is so they have I believe this is an iOS 6 [TS]

01:44:22   it's at least here in seven where they have this this ability to show like a [TS]

01:44:27   modal sheet for the App Store look for an app within your app without kicking [TS]

01:44:32   over to the App Store app and so what if they were they removed the review input [TS]

01:44:37   method just for those metal sheets and then made it a policy that you were if [TS]

01:44:43   you were going to link to an app whether it's you or someone else if your gonna [TS]

01:44:45   lead to an app from your app from your app you have to do it through one of the [TS]

01:44:49   mobile sheets and you can you are not allowed to take over to the iTunes that [TS]

01:44:54   would be an easier policy to enforce you can even like you know check for those [TS]

01:44:57   URLs or or even make the URL stopped working [TS]

01:45:01   the tution lysing be the idea of something that is triggered from [TS]

01:45:06   application lets you rate the application of that like you almost [TS]

01:45:09   think that if that's the like it has to be at should be on a springboard level [TS]

01:45:14   type thing but no one would ever do that I can in an application you can [TS]

01:45:17   everything's coming up that's why a lot of people are talking about the idea of [TS]

01:45:20   making a new website you know sort of game of fire website where people could [TS]

01:45:26   read applications outside of the App Store and outside of anything else but [TS]

01:45:30   all you do is kind of re-creating a crowd-sourced review website in terms of [TS]

01:45:35   websites to review iOS absence something that Apple people think about this at [TS]

01:45:41   the same time as I do sometimes it's like just got entirely rid of ratings [TS]

01:45:45   and reviews and everything and all they were was a directory of things you could [TS]

01:45:48   download and they had a release notes that was it and they used signal that [TS]

01:45:53   they didn't show you to rank the applications that was probably [TS]

01:45:57   mysterious do whatever they do now but it would actually work in my search for [TS]

01:46:01   2010 best what our clients on the first page of results and I wouldn't care [TS]

01:46:05   about the sort order but then people want reviews and people want all the [TS]

01:46:10   things that Apple has signed up to do that and other kind of stuck with it [TS]

01:46:13   said they had never had refused the left entirely to websites to review their [TS]

01:46:18   stuff that would be a different story maybe that would be an acceptable thing [TS]

01:46:23   to do but if you're probably asking them to do if you so kind of stuck at like 11 [TS]

01:46:28   you start censoring stuff now you're on the hook for anything that comes through [TS]

01:46:31   once you start accepting ratings and reviews now you're on the Apple has not [TS]

01:46:36   done that they win they want the control I don't think they'd like that the [TS]

01:46:41   official source of whether a nap is good or bad is not controlled by them [TS]

01:46:45   well you know the thing we didn't even talk about that every like everyone [TS]

01:46:51   agrees that it should be possible for the developer of application to leave a [TS]

01:46:55   response to review for both parties involved in that process up to that [TS]

01:46:59   thing because nothing is more frustrating as developer having someone [TS]

01:47:02   say I got your to-do application but doesn't let me defeat delete items [TS]

01:47:06   one-star [TS]

01:47:08   viewer right actually does like you do you have to swipe or something like that [TS]

01:47:12   right [TS]

01:47:13   it doesn't mean that the developers going to be correct or is official in [TS]

01:47:17   any capacity but just simple matter of like this then you know you can edit [TS]

01:47:21   your review in the people who are believed that nine Casey review all time [TS]

01:47:26   are constantly adding you can edit your views of a good response they actually [TS]

01:47:29   you can't sweat like you know when to turn into like arguing back and forth [TS]

01:47:33   but if they just get they both have their one things as 11 review and one [TS]

01:47:38   response from the developer the two of them could fight can continually [TS]

01:47:41   updating their response to review if they want to I think it's [TS]

01:47:43   counterproductive but a smart developer would leave in the third hit of response [TS]

01:47:47   to the problems that were you know raised there and that would be that and [TS]

01:47:52   I guess this year there is every single review having a contradictory sponsoring [TS]

01:47:59   the developer and that would be annoying to read like a big giant argument but [TS]

01:48:03   under something like that they have to have some way to have other people be [TS]

01:48:08   able to vote down vote though not like all roads lead back to Apple Miller [TS]

01:48:13   having to learn how to do social stuff which they don't know how to do as [TS]

01:48:16   evidenced by paying debt situation for everybody I think what this boils down [TS]

01:48:20   to is the need for reviews is to give to give more inputs when someone's browsing [TS]

01:48:27   in the end they stumble upon your app to give more signal as to whether the app [TS]

01:48:33   is good and works the way it should and if there's if there are more ways that [TS]

01:48:37   Apple could could communicate that and a trial would certainly help for paid apps [TS]

01:48:42   but I don't think we're gonna get trials it there were other ways if as I said [TS]

01:48:48   earlier videos you know let people upload videos [TS]

01:48:51   develop a response to comments are 22 reviews that is another way for [TS]

01:48:57   developers to communicate their quality level like if if if a developer responds [TS]

01:49:02   to every negative review in a really good way like in a helpful way to say [TS]

01:49:06   like even if they're even if the person review something negative in their right [TS]

01:49:09   and developers like you know sorry that we're working out for the next update [TS]

01:49:13   you know and then you can diffuse on the invalid wants to see all actually exist [TS]

01:49:18   here or the bug reporting is fixed in this version that's up now you know you [TS]

01:49:23   can that's still a venue for you to communicate [TS]

01:49:26   more signal to two browsers to tell them like this is an app that's worth [TS]

01:49:31   checking out of this worth buying as a developer doesn't like everything about [TS]

01:49:35   their responses because then it becomes and coming up on additional reviewers to [TS]

01:49:38   say don't believe anyone develop responses they're entirely fabrications [TS]

01:49:42   you know what I'm thinking that was a formalized structured system for doing [TS]

01:49:47   the equivalent of blurbs in the back of the book thrilling adventure says the [TS]

01:49:51   new york times or whatever and if you had a formal structured system so that [TS]

01:49:55   where you had to link back to be actual source that's another way to pull an [TS]

01:49:59   external signal back when you know macworld gives it five mice right New [TS]

01:50:03   York Times New York Times review of this applications as Baba block link back to [TS]

01:50:08   that article link back to the Macworld thing so that people can read it to you [TS]

01:50:13   this is a well reviewed application in fact I can follow these links to confirm [TS]

01:50:16   that they didn't make up these blurbs and I can actually read the review is [TS]

01:50:20   and again that's how you gonna police that Mr think goes away and blah blah [TS]

01:50:24   but these are all things that have worked in other contexts to give people [TS]

01:50:26   signal that the thing they're looking at is this book popular to lots of people [TS]

01:50:31   like this book you know and so it was like oh I hear about it on the news all [TS]

01:50:34   the time and this is a very popular book arts here done monologues and a late [TS]

01:50:38   night show whatever how to know that the Hunger Games is an exciting thing oh [TS]

01:50:42   they're making a movie of it are you know all the other way is the single [TS]

01:50:46   again unfortunately I'll have occasions have not reached that level I guess [TS]

01:50:50   Angry Birds kind of maybe words with friends [TS]

01:50:53   needed to that level that some people here are these things so that must be [TS]

01:50:56   the application and i could even in that case you like oh well we're friends used [TS]

01:50:59   to be good [TS]

01:51:00   screwed all up and now it's annoying to use and how do you learn about that [TS]

01:51:05   later [TS]

01:51:06   it's not an easy problem and yeah people are people are inscrutable things that I [TS]

01:51:11   think Apple wishes they they weren't [TS]