The Accidental Tech Podcast

51: Maybe We`re Just Dinosaurs


00:00:00   China's BYD maybe punch even trying to be whiny I had pretty bad internet [TS]

00:00:06   connectivity over the last two days I really don't think it's because of [TS]

00:00:11   viruses weird possible throttling of the service books they have actually denied [TS]

00:00:17   pointing out but that story is crazy [TS]

00:00:20   based on like one of those online chat live with us apart person they don't [TS]

00:00:24   know anything they barely speak English that's the worst non-story I have seen a [TS]

00:00:31   lot of very slow downloads from s3 and a lot of Netflix problems however that's [TS]

00:00:37   not not only is that not new but it probably is not Verizon doing that it's [TS]

00:00:42   probably Netflix being at massive scale where the responsible for like a third [TS]

00:00:47   of the traffic on the internet and no wonder that I have some slowdowns here [TS]

00:00:51   and there during peak hours and some you know some bad quality streaming [TS]

00:00:54   happening it's not that big of a deal [TS]

00:00:56   well there is something is up like ours did a story on this a while back and I [TS]

00:01:00   was really hoping they would get to the bottom of it don't think they did it was [TS]

00:01:03   like why the hell are YouTube videos so slow [TS]

00:01:06   fiber-optic connection and you can't play like it just literally won't play [TS]

00:01:10   this YouTube video they would use one 10,000 of your bandwidth.com and it's [TS]

00:01:15   not the finger-pointing of like Google saying the ISP and ISP saying they're [TS]

00:01:22   not doing anything wrong in like it's not like why would you intend to a [TS]

00:01:25   throttle YouTube like I don't think it's anything nefarious for this some sort of [TS]

00:01:29   networking related problem where all the parties involved just point fingers at [TS]

00:01:32   each other and nothing actually gets a job as some YouTube videos but will play [TS]

00:01:38   in Super to bridge deep perfectly fine I don't even come close to using every [TS]

00:01:43   connection other YouTube videos will just literally never load and it's one [TS]

00:01:46   of those situations impossible to divide the biggest you don't control the server [TS]

00:01:50   you don't control any of the internal routing at the IPO you know is your [TS]

00:01:54   connection to the Internet looks fine in most YouTube videos looks fine but this [TS]

00:01:57   one doesn't the I actually looked into that somewhat extensively about six [TS]

00:02:02   months ago and is really bad for me and a lot of people in files for complaining [TS]

00:02:07   about it and for the life of me I can't remember what the fix was but it didn't [TS]

00:02:11   last very long and it was something along the lines of you needed to like [TS]

00:02:15   intentionally screw up your hosts file for the big city ends or something like [TS]

00:02:20   that I'm probably getting these details wrong he had like like block one of the [TS]

00:02:25   you to make your CD and I he's 22 route to nothing so that it would retry to [TS]

00:02:30   something else that be faster right right they are all you're doing is [TS]

00:02:33   trying is like temporarily running around wherever the problem isn't it [TS]

00:02:37   like we do that's not a we want you to find where the problem is that ok well [TS]

00:02:42   if I go through that server it's really slow so I'll go through a different one [TS]

00:02:45   like yes that's that's the case a lot of the time but like why is it slow when we [TS]

00:02:50   try to go through that one what's going wrong and that's what we want someone to [TS]

00:02:54   fix it it's like i don't know of any that anyone's job presumably someone in [TS]

00:02:58   the eyes peas job and I don't know the funny thing to me is the fix the air [TS]

00:03:04   quotes here to fix for the YouTube slowness was to try to route around the [TS]

00:03:11   content delivery network whose sole job is to get you that data as quickly as [TS]

00:03:16   possible [TS]

00:03:17   whatever but yeah so you also you to do also don't buy into this Verizon is [TS]

00:03:24   immediately throttling everything under the Sun story cuz I do not that they [TS]

00:03:28   could be throwing everything under the Sun but that story is based on nothing [TS]

00:03:33   that supports that like if you're going to do story that the throttle find some [TS]

00:03:37   evidence that's really helped to experimental events that's where I don't [TS]

00:03:40   based on a conversation with a customer support rep on the chat windows because [TS]

00:03:43   that is not a reliable source of anything else going on some follow-up [TS]

00:03:51   actually that's what's going on [TS]

00:03:52   alright so the first items from someone named steven stark Nvidia using the iPad [TS]

00:03:58   to do more stuff and Steven says he's older he's always that us a little bit [TS]

00:04:03   from his email here that I work in an office that use it [TS]

00:04:07   das Lotus 123 and das wordperfect only switch to Windows 3.1 we found that we [TS]

00:04:12   get our job done faster and easier [TS]

00:04:14   those but it using ISDN opposite is true as you mentioned it's harder to complete [TS]

00:04:19   office working I was so the algae of switching to iOS to complete work is the [TS]

00:04:24   same as when we switch from command line DAs to go is just plain wrong I kind of [TS]

00:04:29   get it what he's trying to say here I guess I just read the rest because once [TS]

00:04:35   we switch to Microsoft Excel and Word we found we could do more things that we [TS]

00:04:39   couldn't copy and paste from word excel working with files we just cut and [TS]

00:04:43   pasted or distracting dropped so it's like it's not the same transition [TS]

00:04:48   because trying transitioning to an iPad would make their work harder whereas [TS]

00:04:53   transitioning from das to Windows made their work easier because a couple [TS]

00:04:58   things that player one is switching from a personal computer to an iPad makes a [TS]

00:05:05   lot of things easier for a lot of people maybe not necessarily for this person [TS]

00:05:09   and example I would give us like people who can't do something on a personal [TS]

00:05:14   computer find that they're able to complete that same task on an iPad [TS]

00:05:18   whatever that desk maybe I'm sure you can think of examples of people who you [TS]

00:05:22   know who if left to their own devices could not do something on a personal [TS]

00:05:26   computer to give the iPad they can't even if its symbols like browsing the [TS]

00:05:29   web [TS]

00:05:29   emailing something to someone would be great example is finding an application [TS]

00:05:34   that does something that they're interested in installing it amusing that [TS]

00:05:38   I think it is a really good one because lots and lots and lots of people could [TS]

00:05:42   not do that with a personal computer and maybe didn't notice like you know what I [TS]

00:05:47   wish there was an application that let me keep track of the score and my bridge [TS]

00:05:52   game left to their own devices finding that application downloading installing [TS]

00:05:56   it successfully and not screen up their computer and not getting a virus and not [TS]

00:06:00   down on the wrong things difficult [TS]

00:06:02   whereas if you give someone an iPad and they're interested in keeping score in [TS]

00:06:05   their bridge game they could probably pull it off and at the same time there [TS]

00:06:10   are lots of things were going going back to the doctor to Windows thing there are [TS]

00:06:13   lots of things that you could do in US but you couldn't do in windows or [TS]

00:06:17   couldn't do is easily [TS]

00:06:18   example anyone who was using das a bit like what if you want to do the lead to [TS]

00:06:23   you know who start out star are authorized to begin with the letter A or [TS]

00:06:28   something like all sorts of things you can do from the command line like a sort [TS]

00:06:32   of do that myself and sort things a list view and select Emanuel and drag to the [TS]

00:06:35   trash but it's like before I could just type out a wild-card there was so much [TS]

00:06:38   easier I can enjoy that sucks so saying that in any individual person can or [TS]

00:06:44   can't do something with it with the particular computers it's a very [TS]

00:06:48   contextual type of message and I think it all comes back to what I was saying [TS]

00:06:51   before the notion that iOS is better for people but it is a sweeping [TS]

00:06:55   generalization and I'm trying to sort of take the average of of all the people in [TS]

00:07:01   the entire world what can they do with a personal computer and of all those same [TS]

00:07:05   people the entire world what can make it done with an iPad and that's combined [TS]

00:07:08   with as you noted like the iPad would have to expand its capabilities if you [TS]

00:07:14   can ever hope to take people from office workers or anyone really get them off [TS]

00:07:20   their PC and get them onto the iPad because there are many things that are [TS]

00:07:24   better for everyone that an iPad but it's not a viable option for you if you [TS]

00:07:28   can't do whatever it is that you want to do so that's why I'm saying that I don't [TS]

00:07:32   the iPad would have to expand its capabilities and expand the range of [TS]

00:07:38   models available if it ever wants to do that I think it would want to do that [TS]

00:07:41   because the things that the iPad is better at for all people are also kind [TS]

00:07:46   of better for regular people in the same way the things that Windows is better at [TS]

00:07:49   40 people it was also better ad for you know the more demanding users even if [TS]

00:07:54   they couldn't you wild card something to delete it or do stuff from the command [TS]

00:07:57   line right batch files and stuff like that [TS]

00:07:59   yeah they lost capabilities but there was it was enough for trade off I [TS]

00:08:03   thought more about this since the last show I don't really know if I'm [TS]

00:08:08   convinced as I was before [TS]

00:08:11   related to this but I don't know if you thought about it since then the whole [TS]

00:08:18   notion that appeared to Jupiter's blessedly forget it after the show was [TS]

00:08:21   over not looking at it I haven't really thought about it but I was not convinced [TS]

00:08:24   when we talked about it and I'm still not convinced [TS]

00:08:27   now are you not convinced that it's better for the IRS is better for people [TS]

00:08:30   like in the in the giant general average of all people kind of way to know that I [TS]

00:08:35   am absolutely convinced by that in like Sean Blanca really great story about his [TS]

00:08:39   grandfather now uses his iPad is a camera and how maybe that's largely [TS]

00:08:44   because of screen size its life memory serves it's largely because of its ease [TS]

00:08:48   of use but it's enabled his grandfather to do some things he would have [TS]

00:08:51   otherwise been unable to deal with that's a really great and touching [TS]

00:08:54   example of the story that everyone is telling or has told which is just like [TS]

00:08:59   you said it enables people to do things that they perhaps wouldn't be able to do [TS]

00:09:04   what I want I'm unconvinced about his asshole i petrol think I'm sure it will [TS]

00:09:08   happen in some capacity its own way but to me I don't see anything compelling I [TS]

00:09:12   see no compelling reason for to exist these tools exist phones tablets [TS]

00:09:19   computers there is some overlap between all of them of course and it's like you [TS]

00:09:23   can't you can use just one of those to do all your computing tasks you can if [TS]

00:09:29   you want to and I don't think there is I don't think it had like if if the [TS]

00:09:32   argument is an iPad you could probably do have an iPhone also I don't think [TS]

00:09:37   there's a whole lot of people for whom the tasks they do on iOS must be done on [TS]

00:09:43   an iPad and kendall Jenner on iphone certain screen size dependent things [TS]

00:09:47   notwithstanding but I think most people don't have a lot of those things but [TS]

00:09:52   ultimately these are different kinds of tools and I don't think we need to [TS]

00:09:57   choose you have to choose the point where you have to say you you have to [TS]

00:10:03   buy these devices have to buy what you can afford but you know chances are of [TS]

00:10:10   these three devices for most people at Adelaide is probably the third one to [TS]

00:10:13   buy [TS]

00:10:14   not not the first or second unless you have very very light needs in which case [TS]

00:10:19   you know might be the first that's fine I think a lot of people are trying to [TS]

00:10:24   cram too much into any one of these things and i know im not saying the [TS]

00:10:28   computer is the best one you know there's things you shouldn't come into a [TS]

00:10:31   computer either that that work better on cellular phone I think it's about using [TS]

00:10:35   the right tool for the job [TS]

00:10:36   and when when we have new tools available we can obsess over them [TS]

00:10:41   briefly and try and try to push the boundaries and see what we can do with [TS]

00:10:44   them but then you know then it just becomes a part of a regular toolkit and [TS]

00:10:48   we realize that it no tool is good for everything and that were better off [TS]

00:10:52   using what's best and I think tablature not replacing PCs you know we keep [TS]

00:10:57   seeing over and over again tablets are selling very well but I don't think [TS]

00:11:00   they're replacing PCs from for anybody except people for whom PCs were never [TS]

00:11:05   the right tool in the first place so that we can debate on you know whether [TS]

00:11:09   PCs were the right tool for so many people who are buying them and know how [TS]

00:11:13   big the number is depends on it like I think your argument depends on how the [TS]

00:11:18   numbers I think both of you are still not in my head and neither is everyone [TS]

00:11:22   in the audience and it's my failure to convey this occurs but you keep coming [TS]

00:11:25   back to these these things these you know this choices that don't exist in [TS]

00:11:29   the end these dichotomies that I'm not getting at anything like what I'm [TS]

00:11:33   getting maybe what I'm getting at is too simple and obvious but it's like saying [TS]

00:11:40   in the days before the PC existed that you would look at what most people do [TS]

00:11:45   all day when it's in front of the desk in front of like desk with like stacks [TS]

00:11:49   of paper I'm trying I don't know what it is but like what whatever it is the most [TS]

00:11:53   people think it like Microsoft bob look there's like a desk with an organizer [TS]

00:11:58   and once those flippy card things you made a role in the hand and a giant a [TS]

00:12:03   rotary phone maybe and habit maybe a record player was at that how things [TS]

00:12:07   were actually coming it's trying so hard to get you going to see what what is so [TS]

00:12:15   obvious to me but it's impossible to convey without people extrapolating out [TS]

00:12:19   into it ridiculous scenario sort of you know following it through to its logical [TS]

00:12:23   ridiculous conclusion and then saying that that's not going to happen I mean [TS]

00:12:26   like if if you want to go out in the sales number way PC sales are not [TS]

00:12:30   growing anymore why not do we not need to do the things that personal computers [TS]

00:12:37   did [TS]

00:12:38   anymore no presumably people are buying things other than PCs right and it used [TS]

00:12:43   to be that the PC was the computing device that everybody had and we can say [TS]

00:12:47   our goodbyes now the phone is the computer by said everybody right but [TS]

00:12:50   there are things you can't do on a phone [TS]

00:12:54   want to do anything you wanted to do video editing on a phone number 12 [TS]

00:12:58   creative work like Photoshop on a phone no one wants to development on a phone [TS]

00:13:02   nobody wants to do lots of word processing on a phone like they're just [TS]

00:13:06   tons of things that you do not ever want to do in the fungus is too darned small [TS]

00:13:10   that's the reason it's not like anyone resist you need more space right people [TS]

00:13:15   don't sit at work all day in front of their phone and do all their work on [TS]

00:13:18   their own right and yet PC sales are still not growing like they used to it [TS]

00:13:23   may actually be going down this point and I'm saying if people are sort of [TS]

00:13:29   voting with their feet that they prefer to use these things that run iOS four [TS]

00:13:32   things like them more than they have forty-two species but they can't stop [TS]

00:13:36   using PC is because there are certain things that the PC can do these other [TS]

00:13:41   devices can't I'm saying if you can't hold back with tired of people prefer to [TS]

00:13:45   work with the simplicity and the you know without the legacy hassles whatever [TS]

00:13:51   they are overlapping windows filesystem you know all the things that we got rid [TS]

00:13:55   of an iOS people seem to prefer that and they they're gonna some of their tasks [TS]

00:14:03   down to the device the device has to expand to meet them in some way they're [TS]

00:14:07   not gonna they're not going to willingly wedged themselves into a tablet so I'm [TS]

00:14:11   trying to look forward to the future to think if I was really is better for [TS]

00:14:14   people surely [TS]

00:14:16   and PC sales are going down or staying seminar grown like they used to Shirley [TS]

00:14:20   at some point all those people with PC is like for twenty thirty years are most [TS]

00:14:24   people sitting in front of a PC with overlapping windows access the file [TS]

00:14:27   system in Emmaus and everything [TS]

00:14:30   order some of the people found a way to do their work with an iOS device or [TS]

00:14:35   tablet type device and that's all I'm getting that like I'm in the moment you [TS]

00:14:40   can always say well the tablet not appropriate for that the PC or but you [TS]

00:14:44   could [TS]

00:14:44   replace PC but like many computer well personal computers are good for some [TS]

00:14:47   people but they're really too simple and real people need many computers and [TS]

00:14:51   workstations or whatever you want to put it just like if people prefer to work [TS]

00:14:55   and in that type of environment it seems like it those things have to come [TS]

00:15:00   together like otherwise what's the thing that PC sales slowly declined by the PCs [TS]

00:15:04   and yet none of those people also have replaced their PCs with an electronic [TS]

00:15:08   device or do they do everything on their phone like I'm saying I think the tablet [TS]

00:15:12   can expand to meet some of those needs in the future and my dad to basically [TS]

00:15:17   like will anyone company pulled that off because if if no one does a good job of [TS]

00:15:23   knowing rises to meet those needs to just be using increasingly better and [TS]

00:15:27   simpler PCs and that's that's conceivable as well but I think it's [TS]

00:15:32   either like I said it's easier for iOS to get slightly more capable than it is [TS]

00:15:36   for always tender windows or anything else to get some [TS]

00:15:39   I really only way we can tell just passed over in the universe but I would [TS]

00:15:43   say dwell on look at the horse posts like charts of computer sales look at [TS]

00:15:47   those and think about how like for our life inspired the fault of a working [TS]

00:15:51   person you know a knowledge worker whatever was sitting in front of a PC [TS]

00:15:55   and say well PC sales are going down it was all home users and like it working [TS]

00:16:00   people are gonna forever by some amount of PCs or is that trend line indicate [TS]

00:16:05   that this transition taking place even with out any iPad pro type of thing so [TS]

00:16:11   let me kinda sorta repeat what you said to see if i understand what you're [TS]

00:16:16   saying is since everyone seems to prefer these touch-based devices being a phone [TS]

00:16:22   or perhaps even tablet and that's where all the usage is going then it stands to [TS]

00:16:27   reason that whatever the shortcomings are they will be solved over time and [TS]

00:16:31   that will be that will usher in all these magnificent new features so it's [TS]

00:16:36   not that Apple necessarily will deliberately set out to create a new [TS]

00:16:39   iPad pro that does this this is the iPad pro because we say so it's not an [TS]

00:16:43   evolutionary in an evolutionary way it will become the iPad will become more of [TS]

00:16:47   a more capable device by whatever means we're not really sure what that is [TS]

00:16:53   simply because it's whatever first years so it's a shame because you can't say [TS]

00:16:57   it's going to make it there for people are gonna wanna and people are going to [TS]

00:17:00   want their for Apple's going to make it there has to be comes from both [TS]

00:17:04   directions so it's it's it's sort of like this is a crummy analogy but you [TS]

00:17:10   know when planes were brand-new they can only fly for a few minutes and not [TS]

00:17:14   really take any passengers and things work Romney but everyone knew it was you [TS]

00:17:17   have potential and then trains were still really exciting popular and well [TS]

00:17:21   this is a very un-american very American analogy because our trains are terrible [TS]

00:17:25   but over time planes became the clearly far away winner because that's what [TS]

00:17:30   that's what everyone wanted it to go and so it kind of compel the industry to to [TS]

00:17:35   see sheet that need to move to the next ball by its related and involved maybe [TS]

00:17:42   clarify this next item I just put it in it's based on general feedback and were [TS]

00:17:47   talking about you know having a keyboard in front of some kind of tablet thing to [TS]

00:17:51   solve the text input problem and there are two aspects of this I think are [TS]

00:17:55   worth dwelling on the people send you back about one is one person on Twitter [TS]

00:18:02   said that having you know I could say like an architect's drafting table with [TS]

00:18:08   like some kind of big tablet e-type service on it [TS]

00:18:11   event that is ergonomically worse than having keyboard in front of you [TS]

00:18:16   horizontally and a screen vertically because you're sitting up rate when [TS]

00:18:20   using the typical mouse keyboard PC that thing and you're kind of hunched over [TS]

00:18:24   and architects drafting table during that I'm not entirely sure about that [TS]

00:18:30   but it's it's worth considering like his would that be regression ergonomically [TS]

00:18:36   speaking to work on something [TS]

00:18:39   drafting table style I mean magic have like a stylist or something like that [TS]

00:18:43   and you're you know what would that be a regret an ergonomic regression to do a [TS]

00:18:48   task [TS]

00:18:49   a slanted up very presumably very large tablet with stylus or your hands versus [TS]

00:18:55   looking at a vertical screen and typing on a horizontal keyboard mouse it might [TS]

00:19:00   be worse for your lower back and neck and shoulders yeah I'm not entirely sure [TS]

00:19:06   because I mean the history of people sitting in front of something and doing [TS]

00:19:10   something is pretty long and the history of people sitting in front of computers [TS]

00:19:14   is short so it's tough to make any you know 'cause not like how many centuries [TS]

00:19:20   were monks marched over the little sign two tables writing things with Lincoln [TS]

00:19:26   stuff on it like it was good I know but like that's been going on for a long [TS]

00:19:30   time right [TS]

00:19:32   good as a personal computers have been going on for a short period of time and [TS]

00:19:38   in the short period time we have personal computers that we've also had [TS]

00:19:41   the you know we've been mark and I was conscious and people do have a lot of [TS]

00:19:45   problems sitting in front of computers in the current good ergonomic situation [TS]

00:19:49   as it is I just because we're sitting there way too long as we don't get up is [TS]

00:19:53   it just because now we have the ability to diagnose these are economic problems [TS]

00:19:56   and if they were doctors around in a medieval times it be diagnosing all [TS]

00:20:01   these monks with problems as well [TS]

00:20:04   difficult to say one thing never like something I think they're probably [TS]

00:20:08   people who preferred work in the sort of Architects drafting table type situation [TS]

00:20:15   even today and I'm thinking maybe creative people like animators or [TS]

00:20:18   something or people who are drawing on a stylist if you're drawing on a surface [TS]

00:20:22   for example you don't want to draw a vertical surface so if if the whole idea [TS]

00:20:26   is that you're going to touch the screen whether we're dealing with a stylus or [TS]

00:20:31   something else like people prefer that is the end but they they would rather do [TS]

00:20:38   that they use mouse to get their work done easier better faster to get their [TS]

00:20:42   work done that way you can't have it vertical because no one was strong [TS]

00:20:46   enough article service right there was gonna draw this line is I was that they [TS]

00:20:49   compromising their bodies ergonomics to get a more efficient position for [TS]

00:20:53   drawing or manipulating things I'm not sure but it's it's worth considering [TS]

00:20:58   whether that's an ergonomic regression [TS]

00:21:01   and whether even if people like using their fingers or style is better than [TS]

00:21:04   using a mouse doing so necessarily makes it so that you're going to be discreet [TS]

00:21:09   see I would wager that there might be an improvement the the drafting table or [TS]

00:21:14   the monks table having never worked at one I have to imagine that the reason [TS]

00:21:18   that monks didn't use a flat desk like we all used today is because they found [TS]

00:21:22   that it was comically better not to hunch and so if you could get the iPad [TS]

00:21:28   hypothetically mounted on an incline in such a way that it doesn't go sliding [TS]

00:21:33   down that incline every time you release it I I would actually expected to be an [TS]

00:21:36   improvement I think they would be better if the whole thing is you're touching it [TS]

00:21:40   like obviously vertical screen I mean like that's a non-starter for touching [TS]

00:21:46   because we can't hold her in front of us and drawing on a vertical surfaces much [TS]

00:21:50   more difficult and trying out something that's mark on your lap or so now that [TS]

00:21:53   the second one second thought of it sounds crazy to us but because it sounds [TS]

00:21:58   crazy bring up is getting back to the physical keyboard thing with text input [TS]

00:22:03   and everything [TS]

00:22:04   the possibility of you didn't think of was one of having a physical keyboard is [TS]

00:22:10   not better enough for people to care that's kind of what happened on the [TS]

00:22:14   phone space and you say well the phone cases different cuz they have space [TS]

00:22:17   restrictions and it led the screen get bigger had all these offsets or whatever [TS]

00:22:20   but if you would ask any tech nerd before the iPhone existed [TS]

00:22:24   what do you think about the idea of getting rid of all the hardware [TS]

00:22:26   keyboards replacing the software keyboard well that might work but you [TS]

00:22:29   know for serious text until your keyboard and we're saying exactly the [TS]

00:22:33   same thing about the personal computer well you know you can't iPod and iPad [TS]

00:22:36   screen but it's terrible if anyone's doing serious text input all day of [TS]

00:22:40   course they need a hardware keyboard a minimum can write my Objective C code [TS]

00:22:43   from iOS application piece of glass keyboard any real keyboard right it [TS]

00:22:48   could be that even though we will think that to the day we die like just like [TS]

00:22:53   some BlackBerry users will think that the david i that it won't matter for the [TS]

00:22:57   rest of the world and will get out-voted is not that it's horrifying scenario [TS]

00:23:01   people using the iPad looking things none of them with a physical keyboard [TS]

00:23:04   site just typing [TS]

00:23:06   s terrible day for me to think I would never want to do that but I think it's [TS]

00:23:09   it's worth considering that what we want may not be what everyone else ones and [TS]

00:23:16   how many to computing test these days don't even involved that much text input [TS]

00:23:19   you know if you like browsing news browsing Facebook occasionally typing [TS]

00:23:22   short comments and various things occasionally taking short emails like [TS]

00:23:25   that's not that's not really keyboard intensive and that's one of the reasons [TS]

00:23:30   why so many people can spend so much time on phones and tablets without [TS]

00:23:33   running into the problem very often even for people to type all day like was able [TS]

00:23:39   to find it developers never use a developer types all day like maybe we're [TS]

00:23:43   just dinosaurs and its possible like once you move away from the on-screen [TS]

00:23:48   keyboard being a little picture of a physical keyboard I can imagine and an [TS]

00:23:53   interesting futuristic kind of soft keyboard that incorporates gestures some [TS]

00:23:58   other crazy stuff that would actually make some future developer who wasn't [TS]

00:24:01   born yet more efficient at writing code than we are with our little things we [TS]

00:24:05   press keys that are sort of the modern-day equivalent of the big things [TS]

00:24:09   to be attached to a level that would make a little metal thing work against [TS]

00:24:12   any Griffin make a mark on a piece of paper like I'm not willing to entirely [TS]

00:24:18   rule out the possibility that that physical keyboard could go away on the [TS]

00:24:22   personal computer the same way it went away on the phone even though none of us [TS]

00:24:26   will ever accept that is a good idea here you know this makes me think of a [TS]

00:24:30   couple things firstly you're almost describing when you when you said oh [TS]

00:24:34   well some new kind of keyboard with gestures and whatnot you're making me [TS]

00:24:37   think of graffiti or whatever then what didn't you have an equivalent to palms [TS]

00:24:41   graffiti no no it's just that real handwriting recognition which is why [TS]

00:24:45   didn't work really really badly I love graffiti I love graffiti as well you [TS]

00:24:52   make me think of graffiti which i think for power users could work but for an [TS]

00:24:56   average person I don't know that would work out but you also made me think I [TS]

00:25:00   don't know if you guys had ever paid attention to someone with a Japanese [TS]

00:25:06   keyboard and I'm thinking of [TS]

00:25:09   our friend will hands who who is an australian-born guy who lives in Japan [TS]

00:25:15   and I hung out with him to see several many times and watching him type on that [TS]

00:25:20   keyboard is really weird but really cool and I he explained it to me once I don't [TS]

00:25:26   know how it works in all the japanese users are getting upset at me now but [TS]

00:25:29   basically he somehow put together I guess the the core of the word by way of [TS]

00:25:35   like drawing it because it's all symbols and it would help him auto complete the [TS]

00:25:41   basic word he wanted in again if you know anyone that uses his keyboard seek [TS]

00:25:46   out there [TS]

00:25:46   their two cents because they can explain it much better than I but the the one [TS]

00:25:50   driving it is maybe you could do something like that but with a [TS]

00:25:53   traditional keyboard and sort of graffiti ask but but maybe something [TS]

00:25:58   different and then the final thought I had was you know what if what makes us [TS]

00:26:03   leave a physical keyboard behind is getting a keyboard on a screen feeling [TS]

00:26:09   more like a keyboard on a desk and so that makes me think of what if we could [TS]

00:26:14   do something crazy with haptic so you could get some semblance of touch on a [TS]

00:26:20   flat piece of glass my feeling some videos full round recently that that [TS]

00:26:23   showed a demo of this little things little blisters pop up on the screen [TS]

00:26:28   right right right right so maybe that would be enough to get us over the hump [TS]

00:26:32   of using a glass keyboard I doesn't matter my great-great grandchildren [TS]

00:26:36   entertaining the thought of lumps rising on the screen to simulate keys which are [TS]

00:26:41   simulating the keys on a typewriter and that's stupid like what I was thinking [TS]

00:26:48   of in terms of interfaces fair touch keyboards but one is like a modern-day [TS]

00:26:52   swipe things you know swipe on Android [TS]

00:26:54   where you slide your finger obviously that motion of sliding your finger and [TS]

00:26:58   that would never work on a typewriter on a physical keyboard because like the [TS]

00:27:02   keys to be awkward and keyboard it would not work at all on a typewriter but [TS]

00:27:08   people do it all the time but I think like with programming if you had tiny [TS]

00:27:11   gestures for matching per ends and curlies and indenting regions in [TS]

00:27:16   selecting regions and the things you do in programming that's kind of like well [TS]

00:27:21   you know I type all day I do I write code I can I can use a keyboard on the [TS]

00:27:26   screen and physical keyboard if I find it a fancy physical keyboard with [TS]

00:27:29   special key switches that are ya like I'm trying to think that like it it is [TS]

00:27:34   conceivable to me that someone who's not me [TS]

00:27:37   could be more efficient with a very clever on-screen keyboard and I think [TS]

00:27:43   the whole reason this would come two passes that you know if if tablets to [TS]

00:27:48   become more capable and people continue to prefer to use them for more and more [TS]

00:27:52   task and that's it nigga that sort of goes in tandem where it's like people [TS]

00:27:55   prefer it and so maybe it will expand its capability once it expands [TS]

00:27:58   capability people try it for something used for that purpose and liked it and [TS]

00:28:03   like using their PCs less and less and buy fewer PCs replace their receives [TS]

00:28:08   less often but continued to buy more and more tablets [TS]

00:28:11   you know that that's how the transition will take place so I don't know like I [TS]

00:28:17   did in my personal life I can think of only a few things that I prefer to do my [TS]

00:28:21   iPad to sound like I'm living example this I'm not one of those people who [TS]

00:28:24   tries to live on my iPad never going to give up my personal computers for my [TS]

00:28:27   life you know I like them they're things always want to do there but when I just [TS]

00:28:33   want to read a bunch of long articles I'd rather do that on my iPad and I want [TS]

00:28:38   to watch video I'd rather do that I'm [TS]

00:28:39   iPad and so there's two things right off the bat and I know a lot of other people [TS]

00:28:44   have a much much longer thing list of things to do in their iPad then on the [TS]

00:28:49   personal computer and I'm just I'm just extrapolating the trend so Marco what's [TS]

00:28:55   what's really exciting these days it is our friends once again at lynda.com ly n [TS]

00:29:01   da dot com lynda.com helps anyone learn creative software and business skills to [TS]

00:29:07   achieve your personal and professional goals there were two thousand [TS]

00:29:11   high-quality engaging video courses taught by industry experts and then [TS]

00:29:16   adding new courses every single day this is a very wide breadth courses from [TS]

00:29:21   beginner to advanced levels these videos have animations and diagrams it's very [TS]

00:29:27   easy to find out who you need in their massive catalog and all this you get [TS]

00:29:31   access to their entire catalog for just $25 a month flat unlimited it's really [TS]

00:29:38   that has you the entire course library 25 bucks a month for unlimited access [TS]

00:29:41   over two million people worldwide are using lynda.com to help themselves [TS]

00:29:46   reached a professional goals it's really great you know I actually so when they [TS]

00:29:51   give us a sponsorship I went and watched a few on logic the the audio editing [TS]

00:29:57   software that I use for the show and I learned a lot and I tell you what these [TS]

00:30:01   videos are actually really good I was I was really pleasantly pleased pleasantly [TS]

00:30:07   pleased anyway I was very pleasantly fleeced [TS]

00:30:11   I wasn't surprised to be good anyway I was pleased with the result of these [TS]

00:30:18   videos there they really do you know what they say they put in animations [TS]

00:30:22   diagrams they really did and it's very high production value and I i really did [TS]

00:30:27   learn a lot and I'm gonna keep watching more so I'm very happy with what I [TS]

00:30:31   learned at lynda.com so anyway back to the script here they have easy-to-follow [TS]

00:30:37   videos [TS]

00:30:38   curated course content expert teachers and instructors here are not just like [TS]

00:30:45   you know some random person who r editorial on YouTube and then is giving [TS]

00:30:47   it back to you [TS]

00:30:48   the teachers are experts in their fields who are professionals [TS]

00:30:52   working in the field you can watch me device computer tablet mobile it even [TS]

00:30:57   didn't require me to use flash on my desktop which I was respected work to my [TS]

00:31:02   flesh or Safari which is great so anyway some examples of what they offer they [TS]

00:31:07   have as I mentioned I mentioned to you I i watching me for logic the audio [TS]

00:31:11   editing software they also have other creative Pro software like Photoshop [TS]

00:31:16   Illustrator stuff like that [TS]

00:31:18   Final Cut video stuff they also have development of CIOs I S seven new stuff [TS]

00:31:25   user interface design UNIX principles for Mac programmer stuff like that plus [TS]

00:31:29   web stuff pearl asp.net so you can be just like john Kasay respectively and [TS]

00:31:35   PHP with MySQL so you can be miserable like me and JavaScript if you wanna be [TS]

00:31:40   much cooler than any of us so you can learn all sorts of cool stuff from [TS]

00:31:44   lynda.com gonna ly nba.com for a free seven day trial if you go to / ATP that [TS]

00:31:53   you're also a ly nba.com / ATP you will get a free seven day trial you can check [TS]

00:32:01   out all the videos during the seven days will you can't really cook up some of [TS]

00:32:03   their videos during the seven days and you can see how good they are [TS]

00:32:07   thanks a lot to lynda.com for sponsoring our show once again you know I watched a [TS]

00:32:12   video of pieces of a video earlier tonight [TS]

00:32:15   photography 101 because I don't know anything about taking pictures I know [TS]

00:32:19   that I have an iPhone that takes pretty good pictures as long as I pointed at [TS]

00:32:22   Easton subject and the video is really well done but it does get the way linda [TS]

00:32:26   setup it works even better than you'd expect so there was a transcript that [TS]

00:32:30   was scrolling of the exact words that the that the instructor was saying and [TS]

00:32:35   what was really cool was I wanted to go back and hear what he said again so I [TS]

00:32:40   looked at the transcript and was like and I thought to myself I can and I just [TS]

00:32:45   clicked the sentence that I wanted him to go back to you in this is all without [TS]

00:32:48   flash the videos scrubbed back to exactly where I wanted to be and it [TS]

00:32:52   showed exactly what I want it all over again and I could go on and on for a [TS]

00:32:56   long time but suffice to say this may not sound like it's very good in a very [TS]

00:32:59   good way to learn but I learned a lot in the 100 hours spent watching this video [TS]

00:33:03   I was really impressed [TS]

00:33:04   check out the site to in the one thing that struck me I've heard a lot of the [TS]

00:33:07   new DICOM ads and I assume you have a bunch of video tutorials up there if you [TS]

00:33:12   haven't gone to the site you have no idea how many of you is that they do not [TS]

00:33:15   have like 10 added 10 videos like I said I'm going to learn about Photoshop Adobe [TS]

00:33:19   Photoshop videos this site has like it's not like one or two videos on each topic [TS]

00:33:26   area it's like tens dozens hundreds like every time a possible detail and you [TS]

00:33:32   have the 101 that's a good place to start but if you want to know like I was [TS]

00:33:36   looking at the audio things cause that's what market was looking at two and like [TS]

00:33:38   the best way to Mike instruments for life is like totally super esoteric all [TS]

00:33:44   way up to photography 101 so if you think there's probably there's not any [TS]

00:33:48   video for you because you're too much of a beginner too much of an expert but [TS]

00:33:51   you'll find something so what else do we have going on there's a new Microsoft [TS]

00:33:57   CEO yeah we care I think it's I think it's interesting this week I don't know [TS]

00:34:04   how much longer will be interesting to us i mean you know my theory on this [TS]

00:34:09   which I posted today on my side like I think Microsoft and we've talked but [TS]

00:34:14   that land here so I'm gonna go too far into it but basically I think Microsoft [TS]

00:34:18   really could go two ways they could either keep trying to break into the new [TS]

00:34:23   consumer mobile markets that they are failing at breaking into and that it's [TS]

00:34:29   costing them dearly to keep trying this in both money and an embarrassment and [TS]

00:34:34   just time opportunity cost of like that so they can be can keep trying and [TS]

00:34:38   probably failing to bring into mobile or they can keep further investing and [TS]

00:34:45   focusing on what they're very successful at which is enterprise services and the [TS]

00:34:48   new cloud division and they can build that up somewhere they can see no secure [TS]

00:34:52   that locked down build it up I think because their CEO Mr Brown Satya Nadella [TS]

00:34:58   I'm not sure I believe that's right I googled it beforehand I watch video [TS]

00:35:05   where they where they announced the guy wasn't him saying his own name but it [TS]

00:35:08   was a megaphone some person saying and I played the back nine times like I can't [TS]

00:35:11   tell what you doing at the end of that name and then I googled like how to [TS]

00:35:14   pronounce whatever [TS]

00:35:15   videos people say it and they also follow up the last two syllable so far [TS]

00:35:19   less syllables I can't tell what they're saying but my guess is that's my guess [TS]

00:35:24   ok assuming it for and Satya Nadella new Microsoft CEO Stockton adela comes from [TS]

00:35:31   their their cloud and enterprise division and I think that says a lot [TS]

00:35:37   my one reservation is the the new role that Bill Gates is supposedly taken on [TS]

00:35:45   now part of this could be just kind of a sham to show investors that like odno [TS]

00:35:53   delegate support the sky and therefore you should all be a tease you notice [TS]

00:35:57   during any kind of tradition like this for a big public company especially when [TS]

00:36:00   the dust settles few CEOs Microsoft you know this is a big deal you what you [TS]

00:36:05   want to ease investors concerns so part of the bill gates things saying that [TS]

00:36:09   he's gonna be back three days a week and be you know in charge of some kind of [TS]

00:36:15   technology [TS]

00:36:16   you know BS sending position where it gonna be directing something other that [TS]

00:36:22   sounds a lot like nothing to worry about investors carry on Bill Gates likes this [TS]

00:36:26   guy in supporting him who is that making feel better exactly well social here's [TS]

00:36:34   here's the wild card though Bill Gates has always had this this kind of [TS]

00:36:40   personality complex where he has always clearly been very desperate to prove to [TS]

00:36:45   the world and the industry that that he and his company can defeat and they are [TS]

00:36:52   great inventors and and a really innovative and are making cool stuff for [TS]

00:36:56   consumers that is always been delegated obsession and you could tell in comments [TS]

00:37:01   he's made over the last twenty years how much he cares about that and how he [TS]

00:37:05   keeps having a like yelling at people and so it seems like you know the the [TS]

00:37:13   idea of D emphasizing consumer stuff and just focus on enterprise stuff the idea [TS]

00:37:20   of that does not sound like Bill Gates it doesn't sound like something he would [TS]

00:37:23   do he didn't do it during his during most of his time in [TS]

00:37:27   when most of his power and you know my position is they should literally like [TS]

00:37:33   embrace that they're boring that they serve businesses and cloud stuff well [TS]

00:37:38   that's very boring to consumers it there are gonna go away that Windows PCs are [TS]

00:37:43   still gonna be ubiquitous you know regardless of how well max do that [TS]

00:37:48   matter never gonna have a 12 percent CPR PC market they never will they will [TS]

00:37:52   never even come close to there is a lot of the market they don't dress willingly [TS]

00:37:55   and you know PCs are always going to be needed for things [TS]

00:38:00   yeah we talked about tablets are gonna are taking some of their share but [TS]

00:38:05   ultimately I think PCs are still safe especially in the workplace and so I [TS]

00:38:14   think if Microsoft can have a very successful business being boring that's [TS]

00:38:20   the part of the business that actually worked the best that actually succeed [TS]

00:38:22   where many cases they're the best option and in the consumer space they can just [TS]

00:38:29   keep losing and I'm not saying they should totally withdraw Xbox does fine [TS]

00:38:33   being does OK even windows on consumer PCs ok but it's not it doesn't need to [TS]

00:38:39   be an area where they focused intense amount of effort you know my my position [TS]

00:38:42   in the post was they should just give people what they actually want from [TS]

00:38:46   windows which is keep keep making mostly the same thing and just make slow [TS]

00:38:51   incremental changes that don't you know don't do anything big and derelict [TS]

00:38:55   Windows 8 don't do that again just do slow incremental changes slowly make the [TS]

00:39:00   same thing better we don't want anything new just make the same thing better and [TS]

00:39:05   I'm worried that by if Bill Gates is position is actually real and if he's [TS]

00:39:10   actually gonna be spending a lot of time and it and if he's actually gonna have [TS]

00:39:13   enough power to like push product direction I worry that he's not going to [TS]

00:39:17   let that happen says he's going to continue being so desperate to prove to [TS]

00:39:20   the world that he's a visionary innovator that that he won't let them [TS]

00:39:25   focus on the boring stuff but he hasn't taken that role for a long time so maybe [TS]

00:39:31   he's over it so what you're saying is you want them to be progressive and [TS]

00:39:37   forward-thinking in the server space while simultaneously being boring and [TS]

00:39:42   repressive in the consumer space I don't even think they have to be regressive [TS]

00:39:47   and I think they could have to like just stop trying to make giant sweeping [TS]

00:39:51   changes just accept your position in the consumer space is you power the bulk of [TS]

00:39:57   the PC market which is boring you don't have any meaningful presence in mobile [TS]

00:40:02   or tablets and at the end my my my dad is it is too late for them to do that [TS]

00:40:08   and that you know this this era of mobile and tablets is is decided it's [TS]

00:40:13   one it's a Google and iOS [TS]

00:40:16   gemini is the right word I know what you think about it you know they Google and [TS]

00:40:22   iOS will together dominate the space you know I S will will pretty much have a [TS]

00:40:27   lock on the top and Google have a lot of pretty much everything else for a long [TS]

00:40:31   time you know this is like a generation computing this this is it you know it [TS]

00:40:35   might be 10 or 15 years it's gonna be awhile and Microsoft is not in that game [TS]

00:40:41   and it's too late breaking the game I think you know it's it's just what could [TS]

00:40:46   they possibly do to take you know fifteen twenty thirty percent market [TS]

00:40:51   share [TS]

00:40:51   I don't see it so I think they should focus on the part their businesses that [TS]

00:40:56   work and that have potential for growth and consumer mobile is not it so I guess [TS]

00:41:04   I just seems it seems contradictory that you would want them to kind of just go [TS]

00:41:10   on cruise control and or or I mean I can understand he said bail like ok screw it [TS]

00:41:15   consumers just not working [TS]

00:41:16   mail from everything bill from phone bill from windows as a consumer alas [TS]

00:41:20   fell from xbox bill from it all but it seems a little I don't know [TS]

00:41:25   contradictory to to say well just kind of crews on the consumer side but really [TS]

00:41:32   keep kickin ass on the server side Bullock Apple hasn't stopped making [TS]

00:41:36   iPods FairPoint you know it's it's it's I think it's similar in the market for [TS]

00:41:41   iPod actually think the Windows PC market is even safer long-term than the [TS]

00:41:45   market for iPods long-term you know i i don't think they have [TS]

00:41:51   have to AXA business that is doing very well as long as I can just keep letting [TS]

00:41:58   a do well without investing tons of resources into keeping a doing well you [TS]

00:42:02   know at the expense of things they're doing like if they give you know what [TS]

00:42:06   i'm saying basically is put Windows and Office into something slightly better [TS]

00:42:11   than maintenance mode literally just keep doing what you're doing [TS]

00:42:17   keep giving people windows the way they want it [TS]

00:42:21   shipping update every couple of years with minor changes that's like that's [TS]

00:42:25   all people want what they want but you need you can do that but you need some [TS]

00:42:29   other business to be your next big thing like you can do that as like don't don't [TS]

00:42:33   screw this up [TS]

00:42:34   keep it going making improvements and that will give us the opportunity to [TS]

00:42:38   work on the next big thing because if you don't work on the next big thing and [TS]

00:42:41   just maintain that eventually that thing you're maintaining will become [TS]

00:42:45   irrelevant and gone you'll get from some direction or another by someone else and [TS]

00:42:50   that will be gone and you have to have you have to have something else ready to [TS]

00:42:53   go to next 10 could be that services that I expect things to be cloud or [TS]

00:42:57   whatever whatever you wanna do that's our next big thing that's going to be [TS]

00:43:00   like it will do will do what consumers want with windows and keep adding that [TS]

00:43:03   market over but we're just doing that to sort of keep the lights on and not screw [TS]

00:43:07   up like we have been and will use it as a launching pad to get really big and [TS]

00:43:11   services but I think about services though it is like a a problem for [TS]

00:43:17   shareholders and for Microsoft's new CEO what's the biggest company to you can [TS]

00:43:21   think of that serves only businesses and not consumers IBM and so do you think [TS]

00:43:28   would be happy being the size of IBM in terms of market cap and the character of [TS]

00:43:33   IBM and in the number of employees of IBM and the nature of those employees [TS]

00:43:36   are you think markets are still wants to go to be the microsoft today were in [TS]

00:43:41   terms of how many what percentage of the company you know developers and what's a [TS]

00:43:46   market capital letters a revenue and all this stuff about an action plan at [TS]

00:43:50   Samhain the chad is pointing out things like ASAP in Oracle as other giant [TS]

00:43:54   enterprise companies that consumers don't here right now that's what I was [TS]

00:43:58   thinking about why I was thinking of ASAP and Oracle but I'm thinking like [TS]

00:44:01   does is that is that the IBM [TS]

00:44:04   example but is that the future that microsoft sees for itself why would they [TS]

00:44:08   be content to be better IBM or similar similar to IBM Oracle nsabp and I think [TS]

00:44:15   they would consider that a defeat and I i dont night another number that stopped [TS]

00:44:20   my head but I would imagine would also mean shrinking the company in terms of [TS]

00:44:25   market cap well do they have a choice though like is this is suppose they [TS]

00:44:30   suppose they actually can become as big as those companies [TS]

00:44:35   suppose they actually can be as successful in the enterprise services [TS]

00:44:39   business to be at that scale that's it seems like that's at least plausible if [TS]

00:44:45   not likely what are the other choices do their research for us and say one of the [TS]

00:44:51   Market Cap for IBM as a PR and what whatever their profits been like as [TS]

00:44:56   Microsoft is still making tons of profit and I have a hard time believing the IBM [TS]

00:45:00   are on SIPR making that kind of green at this point but I don't know what you [TS]

00:45:04   know Microsoft is not making profit on as far as I can tell they're not making [TS]

00:45:08   substantial profit on Windows Mobile there I would say their service division [TS]

00:45:13   is doing pretty poorly in a bit like the area that I'm suggesting they they stop [TS]

00:45:18   trying so hard in are the are those like let's get back at the iPad and let's [TS]

00:45:23   defeat Android kinda thing that's the stuff where they keep failing miserably [TS]

00:45:27   you know they they they've gone through this period over the over the last ten [TS]

00:45:32   fifteen years where he had a great piece about this on a site today about how [TS]

00:45:37   late you know their their whole original idea of a computer on every desk and in [TS]

00:45:41   every home and Microsoft software they did it they they want like in the [TS]

00:45:45   mid-nineties like they want and they didn't really know what to do from there [TS]

00:45:49   and so they kinda started flailing and doing all sorts of weird stuff on the [TS]

00:45:53   side that's where you got things like MSN and then like MSNBC and being and [TS]

00:45:59   the Xbox and stuff like that in some of the weird research stuff and a few of [TS]

00:46:04   those things worked although the eighty usually lost ton of money in the process [TS]

00:46:07   of cooking and might still be losing tons of money you the things work but [TS]

00:46:12   none of them have really [TS]

00:46:13   gotten big enough to be like their next big business what I'm suggesting is they [TS]

00:46:20   should probably in a focus on what they can actually do focus on the stuff [TS]

00:46:25   they're they're already there are they already have promised and what the [TS]

00:46:30   British Simmons post about this too about how you know if they focus more on [TS]

00:46:34   Azure and mobile services like they could be a big competitor to Amazon Web [TS]

00:46:37   Services that would be awesome cuz right now there is no big competitor for [TS]

00:46:41   Amazon Web Services and there needs to be a really could use some competition [TS]

00:46:47   there for the good of everybody and you know Microsoft could be it is all these [TS]

00:46:52   things they could do but there instead focusing on all these areas they keep [TS]

00:46:59   losing badly and there's no hope in sight that that might stop that they did [TS]

00:47:04   they might stop losing in these areas surrounded our quick research for us [TS]

00:47:09   Microsoft is 279 billion IBM has 189 ASAP is 89 and Oracle is a number that I [TS]

00:47:17   just lost in this role back there are girls won our goals 161 and this is [TS]

00:47:23   going to profit numbers because I think I would imagine that Microsoft is making [TS]

00:47:27   more profit than those guys at least now I mean what I'm getting at is that any [TS]

00:47:32   of these strategies are going to mean shrinking the company in ways that are [TS]

00:47:37   going to make the new CEO look bad I don't think this is the wrong the wrong [TS]

00:47:40   thing to do but like if you know it's it's kind of thing what is the tolerance [TS]

00:47:47   for this type of thing I could say we want to be a different kind of company [TS]

00:47:50   and that kind of company in necessarily a little bit smaller is ever going to be [TS]

00:47:54   like ok great job in Delhi you're doing what we want or are they going to be [TS]

00:47:58   like oh any backsliding and anything on the growth is seen as a failure for the [TS]

00:48:03   new CEO that's that's what I'm not sure about that they willing to accept [TS]

00:48:08   shrinking the company permanently not like me briefly and then growing it back [TS]

00:48:12   but shrinking it marlys partly to become a different kind of company that is [TS]

00:48:16   necessary little necessarily a little bit smaller or does it have to be [TS]

00:48:19   smaller right can you defined shrinking because IBM is four times as many [TS]

00:48:24   employees as Microsoft [TS]

00:48:25   I know but I sort of getting in terms of nature of employees all those employees [TS]

00:48:28   how many of them are like Microsoft employees and how many of them are like [TS]

00:48:32   contractors and sales people like my BM's a service organization you have [TS]

00:48:36   been very different sort of personnel base when you're a service organization [TS]

00:48:39   versus when your Microsoft you know developing software like you will [TS]

00:48:44   multiply manpower and that I think we did your margins because yet need that [TS]

00:48:48   more people and it's a it's a different kind of business and if Microsoft get [TS]

00:48:52   serious about this and and rededicate their company to you know sort of [TS]

00:48:56   business-to-business you know transactions like they're already in [TS]

00:48:59   that business well that's what they get into presumably that have to take share [TS]

00:49:03   from those companies we just name right like the markets not gonna grow by the [TS]

00:49:06   amount that Microsoft wants they're gonna have to take business from IBM [TS]

00:49:08   taken from Oracle take this message and they're doing that now with their [TS]

00:49:12   various enterprise things but that's what the company is going to be about a [TS]

00:49:16   dozen a growth business to me because I don't think the number of business in [TS]

00:49:22   the world that one technology is growing I think that is going to be down there [TS]

00:49:24   slugging it out with his existing companies that we just named and I think [TS]

00:49:29   it's just a different type of organization and getting back to bill [TS]

00:49:31   gates I think Bill Gates would consider that a failure if Microsoft became like [TS]

00:49:36   IBM Oracle OSAP even if they were the best IBM Oracle ASCP type company and [TS]

00:49:41   even if you don't have to drink the company like cargo said you can tell [TS]

00:49:45   that that's not the kind of Microsoft's Bill Gates wants he wants the one that [TS]

00:49:49   like everybody knows that you know every person in the world uses Microsoft stuff [TS]

00:49:53   and they love it he doesn't want to be you know like ASAP where everyone does [TS]

00:50:00   not use ICP most people don't know what s AP is and the park employees have to [TS]

00:50:03   download it is our sad about it but you know what i'm suggesting that Microsoft [TS]

00:50:10   keep the businesses that are making the most money I'm not suggesting that they [TS]

00:50:15   eliminate most of their profit if anything much just the more probable [TS]

00:50:20   cause they will they will be able to devote less employee time to working on [TS]

00:50:26   radical giant new products that are not going to succeed I think there is a [TS]

00:50:31   glimmer of hope for growth business like Cloud is one thing we discussed where [TS]

00:50:35   how many cloud providers are there out there were the exams [TS]

00:50:38   gonna do a lot of stuff but you can imagine Microsoft doing doing what [TS]

00:50:42   Amazon does but better both because that's not Amazon's main business doing [TS]

00:50:47   business selling your stuff and shipping it to you and also because Amazon is not [TS]

00:50:53   presently would not be as maniacally focused on the enterprise with their [TS]

00:50:57   services as Microsoft could be and there's some synergy there with the [TS]

00:51:00   Microsoft existing enterprise products so that's a potential growth market [TS]

00:51:05   where they could continue to grow their cloud services year after year and that [TS]

00:51:08   will look good you decide you're into cloud every year you do more cloud stuff [TS]

00:51:13   every year revenues your clothes stuff goes up and people like Anna people [TS]

00:51:16   using it that's good I still think you probably want to have some of their [TS]

00:51:21   growth business in there and it said that phone is out of the question tablet [TS]

00:51:29   out of the question PCs are growing so don't even bother with those things [TS]

00:51:32   that's maybe true again [TS]

00:51:34   watchers and certainly bill gates be considered a defeat is like you know [TS]

00:51:38   they do have a thing called the surface and they seemed to kinda like in a bit [TS]

00:51:41   there was that didn't wouldn't fail to do have Windows Phone and canning those [TS]

00:51:45   things would be there will be rough like it would be better if that happened to [TS]

00:51:48   the Bombers watch right and then the new guys comes in well you know the phone [TS]

00:51:52   service things are all gone so we can concentrate on my new strategy but if [TS]

00:51:55   you've got to be the guy to do that that's going to be difficult for him and [TS]

00:51:59   if we trying to think of an area where they can expand we just talked about in [TS]

00:52:02   the beginning part of the show if anyone can make a tablet computer that people [TS]

00:52:07   might use at their desk instead of a Windows PC maybe it's Microsoft I know [TS]

00:52:11   they haven't done it with the surface I know that's not what the services aimed [TS]

00:52:14   at but they have the the magic protection is giving its keeping the [TS]

00:52:19   windows market viable for them is that nobody else wants it and the magic [TS]

00:52:23   protection that you know he may give them the ability to make you know the [TS]

00:52:29   surface pro there I guess there is a service for a more capable larger [TS]

00:52:33   surface for you know for people to use not just for consumers but for people to [TS]

00:52:37   use to do their work [TS]

00:52:38   the giant table yeah well the big-serving is that maybe Apple doesn't [TS]

00:52:43   want that business and maybe a hundred you know Android makers don't go after [TS]

00:52:46   that business so if nobody else does it [TS]

00:52:49   and nobody you know it could fall to Microsoft by default to try and fail [TS]

00:52:53   perhaps and that businesses that have so far in the tablet phone markets but it's [TS]

00:52:59   there I mean I I just don't like that I don't like to think that like we're [TS]

00:53:03   resign ourselves to be boring and to do what we know how to do and even if it's [TS]

00:53:10   not a growth business will take business away from other competitors and it's [TS]

00:53:15   like this just isn't that just don't get that sounds like a defeat to me I would [TS]

00:53:19   rather see Microsoft go down in flames trying to do crazy stuff I'd rather see [TS]

00:53:24   them keep doing the Xbox stuff try to serve to stop it I mean all that stuff [TS]

00:53:31   not a success really but I would rather see them go out of business doing that [TS]

00:53:35   but stand business being like Oracle IBM recipe what if what if people have [TS]

00:53:41   Microsoft don't consider it boring to become the pretty strong player and web [TS]

00:53:45   services it's boring look at Amazon it looked lots of people working on Amazon [TS]

00:53:51   it's been it's become a giant business for them [TS]

00:53:53   Microsoft best bet may be to be acquired by Apple in 20 years because Apple if [TS]

00:53:57   Apple continues not to be able to do you know cloud services that well and [TS]

00:54:00   something is really good at it there's definite synergies there you know if [TS]

00:54:05   eventually they eliminate all the all the places where there wouldn't be a [TS]

00:54:08   good matchup Laguna tablet and we have a tablet OS and we have a fire like if you [TS]

00:54:14   get it down to the point where the acquisition makes sense because [TS]

00:54:16   Microsoft is this is you know the preeminent cloud services company and [TS]

00:54:21   Apple continues to flail [TS]

00:54:23   like well that's a reasonable match up well to avoid us talking about synergy [TS]

00:54:28   ever again in the show we are also brought to you by our friends at [TS]

00:54:32   Squarespace [TS]

00:54:34   all-in-one platform that makes it fast and easy you know I here I here other [TS]

00:54:38   podcasters reading the script and they always remove the word fast they just [TS]

00:54:43   say easy and I wonder if I'm getting a different script or if there aren't [TS]

00:54:46   seeing the word anyway it fast and easy to create your own professional website [TS]

00:54:52   or online portfolio for a free trial and 10% off gonna square space.com and use [TS]

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00:54:59   Casey [TS]

00:55:02   yeah you want this month sorry judge yes I join you get screwed so you get 10% [TS]

00:55:06   off go to scrippsnews.com use offer code Casey this month basis always improving [TS]

00:55:11   their platform with new features new designs and even better support their [TS]

00:55:16   designs are beautiful to start with but you can also customize them what do you [TS]

00:55:19   want to do it the easy way through the nice interface or they wanna go down to [TS]

00:55:22   the code level and injector and CSS and JavaScript you can do that you can do [TS]

00:55:26   whatever you want it's great and all these fans all these fancy designs which [TS]

00:55:30   are designed by actual pro designers they all have matching mobile layouts [TS]

00:55:34   they're responsive designs and so your site look great on any device matter [TS]

00:55:38   what the size it is and it looked like your site looks like some you know like [TS]

00:55:42   they have one mobile template for all they know they have different for every [TS]

00:55:46   theme as fantastic all this ease of use is great but if you need any help they [TS]

00:55:51   have an amazing support team that work 24 hours a day seven days a week with [TS]

00:55:55   over 70 employees right here in new york city to customer support team has won [TS]

00:55:59   tons of awards Squarespace have won tons of awards pretty impressive they also [TS]

00:56:04   about it was about a year ago now they launched this Squarespace commerce [TS]

00:56:09   platform you can its e-commerce that's the word and you can sell physical or [TS]

00:56:16   virtual goods writers Chris paysite integrates with credit card processor [TS]

00:56:20   stripe and has really advanced stuff shipping tracking inventory management [TS]

00:56:26   coupon codes stuff like that really you can make a very advanced or with this [TS]

00:56:30   and now I believe this is a new change now every Squarespace plan from the [TS]

00:56:37   lowest to the highest every Squarespace plan includes Squarespace com mir's you [TS]

00:56:41   can do this made the plans that you want to do so thank you [TS]

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00:56:50   name incentive for a whole year up front so you can start your free trial today [TS]

00:56:54   this is a free trial with no credit card required you don't have to like putting [TS]

00:56:58   all your details and then if you forget to cancel at the bill you nothing like [TS]

00:57:02   that it's a real genuine free trial no credit card required [TS]

00:57:06   square space.com and use the offer code Casey when you do decide to buy to get [TS]

00:57:12   10% off and to show your support for our show [TS]

00:57:15   so thanks let us where space for sponsoring ATP once again offer could [TS]

00:57:19   Casey either way you would be surprised how many people misspell casey's name [TS]

00:57:24   we've seen Cassie we see a lot of Cassie with tuition spell it on every episode [TS]

00:57:30   of the show like a song or jingle remember and actually I was gonna say [TS]

00:57:36   the only problem with using my name as the offer code is that now I'm going to [TS]

00:57:43   here for the next three weeks on Twitter who the hell is can you see over and [TS]

00:57:49   over and over and over again so I'm very thankful for Squarespace for sponsoring [TS]

00:57:54   and for honoring me with that awesome offer code but on my lord I'm doomed a [TS]

00:57:59   you complain when the offer code was Marco this is what you get I didn't [TS]

00:58:03   think telling through not gonna say what else going on well I said before we get [TS]

00:58:09   into Dell I wanna talk briefly about the guy himself and a little bit of [TS]

00:58:13   excitement that I get there are maybe like this I'm not from having this new [TS]

00:58:18   person because it was just announced its like this world of possibilities despite [TS]

00:58:24   the bill gates factor there's new leadership at a company this company has [TS]

00:58:29   not had a lot of CEOs and its lifetime Bill Gates Steve Ballmer than this guy [TS]

00:58:33   that's that's a long time reading them and if you want to consider the bill [TS]

00:58:39   gates two bomber thing has not really much of a transition because the two of [TS]

00:58:42   them were there in the beginning and that the two of them sort of ran the [TS]

00:58:45   company together and then bill gates just kind of opted out of a continuation [TS]

00:58:49   of the dog ate some rain who knows with this new guy will do even though he's a [TS]

00:58:54   company man and has been in the company for 22 years and all that stuff there is [TS]

00:58:59   the potential like there always is when you have a change in leadership for him [TS]

00:59:04   to do [TS]

00:59:05   interesting exciting unexpected radical things we don't know what I don't know [TS]

00:59:10   enough about his personality is he that type of person or is he just kind of [TS]

00:59:13   like a slow and steady not going to do anything crazy [TS]

00:59:16   Steve Ballmer personality wise always seem crazy and insane and and very [TS]

00:59:20   interesting and fun to watch and his developers developers stop throwing [TS]

00:59:23   chairs and stuff like that and yet the way he ran the company was very [TS]

00:59:26   conservative this guy seems like a cool no dude but maybe he's gonna make crazy [TS]

00:59:30   radical Steve Jobs ask moods and since he just a quick job now is a time for me [TS]

00:59:36   to entertain those fantasies until he goes through a year of just doing boring [TS]

00:59:39   stuff tonight when somebody tweeted I don't have in front of me and I [TS]

00:59:44   apologize but somebody tweeted something along the lines of you know if you look [TS]

00:59:48   at Google there's no way what is the psycho guy cycle privacy guide say thank [TS]

00:59:58   you to CEO but i think is he still chairman he's still on the board and so [TS]

01:00:04   the point of the tweet was he was a business guy and you look at is it larry [TS]

01:00:10   that's currently CEO he's some sort of develop development background is he not [TS]

01:00:15   in and such is also a developer you know and so you're finding this trend said [TS]

01:00:21   such as personal saying your findings trend towards developers a CEO's which [TS]

01:00:25   is a very different and powerful thing as opposed to having a bunch of [TS]

01:00:28   businessmen leading these companies with the exception of course of Tim Cook who [TS]

01:00:34   has an MBA and I don't know what he was some sort of Engineering undergraduate I [TS]

01:00:38   would ever consider Tim Cook continuation of the Steve Jobs rain in [TS]

01:00:42   the same way the bomber was a continuation of gates it's like two guys [TS]

01:00:44   who worked in tandem for a large part of the time when they were successful than [TS]

01:00:48   one is gone the other one is sort of continuing that but yea Microsoft seems [TS]

01:00:53   kind of like Apple's Steve Jobs came back in terms of having tons and tons of [TS]

01:00:58   products and tons of different I seem to have a bunch of threads recently too [TS]

01:01:01   much more articles of bad people who develop on Microsoft platforms [TS]

01:01:04   complaining about how much I keep changing minds about technologies and [TS]

01:01:07   API's and it's making their lives more difficult and that's been the case for [TS]

01:01:11   fifteen twenty years that's that's not new at all [TS]

01:01:13   well I mean like its new issue like any windows ninety-five error [TS]

01:01:16   you know like win32 forever and this is exciting new thing I called him a seat [TS]

01:01:21   it's coming in like it was there was some there was a steady period and then [TS]

01:01:25   there was a period of disruption but they kept out to get changed my mind [TS]

01:01:28   every 10 minutes somewhere without already towards the end of Apple's bad [TS]

01:01:33   years when they were like we're gonna you don't remember any of these names [TS]

01:01:36   were gonna do power talk and we're going to do open open open doc has no idea [TS]

01:01:41   Morgan have teams are gonna like they kept changing their mind and they would [TS]

01:01:44   cancel things a quick dry Jackson quick draw 3d and Raven like all these [TS]

01:01:48   technologies that all black people know that you've never heard of and be glad [TS]

01:01:50   you have been there was like this too much confusion and every time they [TS]

01:01:55   announced on and cancel it a try to replace it with something else that was [TS]

01:01:58   better that decreased confidence in that all reverse when Steve Jobs game [TS]

01:02:02   canceled half the company's projects on accounts for crying out loud and was [TS]

01:02:05   like the most boring thinking interesting product Apple had any candid [TS]

01:02:09   and it was he was right to candidate so he could focus the company on what he [TS]

01:02:13   thought they wanted to do so [TS]

01:02:14   the dow could you know take all these things that are confusing people that [TS]

01:02:19   are sending the wrong signals that are making people lose confidence in the [TS]

01:02:22   company and get rid of them and take the heat for getting rid of them the same [TS]

01:02:27   way Steve Jobs took the heat for Cam Newton and start on whatever he thinks [TS]

01:02:30   is the important thing that you know focus the company's get people to people [TS]

01:02:35   who aren't excited leave or get fired and the people who remain I guess [TS]

01:02:38   they're terrified for a short period of time than you inspire them in spire them [TS]

01:02:42   into being exciting and you sort of like that that's the way the rebirth can [TS]

01:02:46   happen is you could have been incredibly painful shrinking process and come out [TS]

01:02:50   of it stronger and I just fear that he is going to be too conservative and too [TS]

01:02:56   afraid to rock the boat into afraid of like you know his first year is the [TS]

01:03:00   investors are gonna be pissed cuz he killed a bunch of profitable product [TS]

01:03:04   lines to concentrate on anything else you want to do I get back to you saying [TS]

01:03:08   before maybe Microsoft is not it would be an easier job of Microsoft is in a [TS]

01:03:14   worse position for the newseum exactly you know Apple when Steve Jobs came back [TS]

01:03:19   to Apple they were dying ninety days worth of money left in the bank or [TS]

01:03:23   something you know if somebody comes in and around drastically here's how to do [TS]

01:03:27   it [TS]

01:03:28   ever find whatever you wanna do whatever we do it Microsoft is making tons of [TS]

01:03:32   money and so it's much harder [TS]

01:03:34   because they are being in so many ways it's much harder for someone to come in [TS]

01:03:39   and acts everything which is why you like like my plan doesn't really acts a [TS]

01:03:42   whole lot but that's why that's why I think it's it's not only most likely but [TS]

01:03:46   what's best for them is it's it's more about no longer doing massive new [TS]

01:03:53   rethinking of the Windows UI and stuff like that it's more about to surrender [TS]

01:03:59   to lay down and die but just kind of hang out no that's not it like I I want [TS]

01:04:07   them I almost want them to go back to how they were about twelve at twelve to [TS]

01:04:13   fifteen years ago [TS]

01:04:14   you know I can lead to thousands on the lead-up to Windows XP like like that was [TS]

01:04:20   they were doing very well and it was mostly because they were working on the [TS]

01:04:26   internals of Windows [TS]

01:04:27   essentially with the anti-drug windows when sixteen tuenti transition would [TS]

01:04:32   ever beheld technology is not what they were doing they're doing well because [TS]

01:04:35   the personal if you drew the chart of PC sales they were going upwards and every [TS]

01:04:40   one of the species result of Windows on it so much going upward that's what was [TS]

01:04:44   bringing them up words it's not so much like always technical things are true [TS]

01:04:48   and like when they started to screw it up their success with the PC market hit [TS]

01:04:52   most of those problems and as soon as the PC market stop growing it at crazy [TS]

01:04:56   rate then all the problems became revealed and they figured out that they [TS]

01:05:01   didn't know what to do and lots of different decisions but I don't you know [TS]

01:05:05   I disagree with that actually I don't think it was about the growth slowing [TS]

01:05:09   down that really hurt them I i mean that's hurting the meeting now a little [TS]

01:05:13   bit but I think what really hurt them was a whole bunch of execution problems [TS]

01:05:17   when they tried to do way too much this again [TS]

01:05:20   sound familiar with Longhorn which became Vista they had these crazy ideas [TS]

01:05:25   file system reference it is create these crazy ideas that you know they had to [TS]

01:05:31   cut almost all of them to get Vista out the door [TS]

01:05:34   five or six years later something mister was very late and it was mostly because [TS]

01:05:39   they were way too ambitious but with with what they want to do [TS]

01:05:43   they want to change too much and it didn't work and Vista came out and [TS]

01:05:47   because it was pretty sloppily done people hated it [TS]

01:05:51   they tried to change too much change to me the wrong things they released a [TS]

01:05:54   sloppy version that everyone hated badly and you could see a lot of that about [TS]

01:05:59   Windows 8 I don't think it I don't think it was as sloppy necessarily but they [TS]

01:06:06   tried to do a lot with it and a lot of it was not very well done and their [TS]

01:06:12   customers hated almost all of it and so that I think you know they're going to [TS]

01:06:19   keep doing that pattern of you trying to reinvent windows to make a major new [TS]

01:06:23   splash with Windows again but that's probably not going to happen and [TS]

01:06:28   historically even before even PCs were going just fine they they weren't very [TS]

01:06:35   good at doing that and one more quick thing to play a little bit of devils [TS]

01:06:39   advocate on the PC growth thing there have been so many other factors in [TS]

01:06:44   addition to the rise of tablets and stuff with that that could also help [TS]

01:06:49   explain the PC sales downturn you know we're talking about new PC sales having [TS]

01:06:57   slow down or stop to regress we're not talking about PC usage necessarily [TS]

01:07:04   slowing down or stopping or regressing this could also be that PCs are being [TS]

01:07:10   used for longer there on a slower replacement cycle and think about what [TS]

01:07:15   might cause that to be the case there's all sorts of really good reasons there [TS]

01:07:19   is the economy the job market really know businesses have to buy new [TS]

01:07:23   computers when they hire new employees right usually if you know that job as [TS]

01:07:28   previously occupied you get somebody else's old crappy computer but you know [TS]

01:07:32   it's like the job market economy those are kinda crappy right now [TS]

01:07:36   Windows itself Windows 8 is not well liked and so a lot of people are you [TS]

01:07:42   know we're not excited to go out and get a new computer with Windows 8 on it a [TS]

01:07:46   lot of businesses held off on upgrades because they want to wait until they [TS]

01:07:50   could get you know something they actually want to lighten could support [TS]

01:07:54   and if you think about why people used to buy a new computer so often after [TS]

01:07:59   performance topped accelerating so quickly passed away but people actually [TS]

01:08:03   needed it a lot of it was because now where would affect their old computer so [TS]

01:08:07   badly they would think the only solution was to get a new one because they would [TS]

01:08:10   think computers are slow down over time and they have to get a new computer has [TS]

01:08:13   been so slow and full of pop-ups that people actually did that massive to a [TS]

01:08:18   massive scale and so maybe the reason why computer sales slowdown didn't have [TS]

01:08:24   as much to do with tablets coming in as just people need to replace computers [TS]

01:08:31   less now because you know they're pretty fast already anti malware stuff is [TS]

01:08:35   pretty good these days it's a lot better than it was ten years ago [TS]

01:08:40   you know maybe maybe that's more you know the problem and so if that is [TS]

01:08:46   what's causing the sales growth owner at least if those are major contributing [TS]

01:08:50   factors that's not saying PCs are going away at the same the average pc buyer [TS]

01:08:55   might keep it for five years instead of two and so you know that's not great for [TS]

01:09:00   the market but that's just the markets are going away it's just you know the [TS]

01:09:06   replacement cycle is slow down like Michael did make many technical mistakes [TS]

01:09:11   but if the PC market is still growing 30% year-over-year it wouldn't matter [TS]

01:09:15   because they would be able to force everyone to upgrade they wouldn't have [TS]

01:09:19   to say it will keep making will be available for ever even though everyone [TS]

01:09:23   hates it because it would be like brothers new customers coming in every [TS]

01:09:27   day and they're going to get the new thing and we have this growth growth you [TS]

01:09:30   know growth like that carries everything and hides all the terrible problems and [TS]

01:09:35   it's very difficult to make especially in the position Microsoft it's very [TS]

01:09:39   difficult to make a product so bad that it overcomes 30% year-over-year growth [TS]

01:09:44   in your market in terms of you know because what also what also what's your [TS]

01:09:50   alternative one of the customers gonna do they had such an incredible lock on [TS]

01:09:53   the market such a huge market share that if you're buying a new personal computer [TS]

01:09:57   and you know your market is growing at 30% year-over-year you have this huge [TS]

01:10:01   number of people who are buying buying computer didn't have one before and [TS]

01:10:05   they're going to get you know [TS]

01:10:06   operating system on and they're just gonna accepted and like what's their [TS]

01:10:11   alternative well I'm not going to buy windows I'm going to buy something else [TS]

01:10:14   what are you gonna get someone to serve your needs you need something that runs [TS]

01:10:17   Windows were the one selling something else and I think this is a good thing or [TS]

01:10:21   a healthy thing I'm just saying like that was able to mask all of their [TS]

01:10:24   problems until it slowed down and I have to see the currents I think it probably [TS]

01:10:29   started to take a dive around what iPad time like 2010 or something but it [TS]

01:10:34   really took when the PC sales turn the other direction I don't know so that the [TS]

01:10:39   Vista debacle we all hated him I thought it was terrible but if you look at [TS]

01:10:42   Microsoft's earnings and everything during that period were doing ok they [TS]

01:10:46   just made they were testing the theory how terrible products we make and still [TS]

01:10:50   be successful and if people don't have an alternative you can make a pretty [TS]

01:10:54   terrible product is still be successful in fact you can delay not really [TS]

01:10:58   surprised for an upgrade windows for five years into this horrible project [TS]

01:11:02   and still be successful and compared it to Apple who couldn't replace their [TS]

01:11:06   operating system for many many years and did not have 30% year-over-year growth [TS]

01:11:10   and almost went on a business so I don't know I i look at Microsoft's portions [TS]

01:11:18   going forward and I i have I still think about them needing to find some market [TS]

01:11:24   with the kind of growth that the PC market had Apple found it was the phone [TS]

01:11:27   market phone market has that kind of growth now it won't always have their [TS]

01:11:30   growth someday that growth will stop and the iPad market at similar growth for [TS]

01:11:34   now I get really depressed when I think about Microsoft never being in another [TS]

01:11:39   business with that kind of growth curve so I should note I actually just came [TS]

01:11:50   out with a new we have one more sponsors hold on I want to talk about my new iOS [TS]

01:11:57   app I came up with one and it's really really clever name do I guess what it is [TS]

01:12:02   is it Xbox one [TS]

01:12:05   bored you know it's not cardboard cuz I thought is that Facebook is Facebook how [TS]

01:12:13   did you know it's called paper that should be fined do we have any thoughts [TS]

01:12:18   on this like I don't even know it say it seems like this is a he said she said I [TS]

01:12:24   feel like this is the the soap opera corner of our industry that I really [TS]

01:12:28   have no interest in like I think it's a David and Goliath tale ok everyone knows [TS]

01:12:33   everyone's kind of being jerks ok I know you guys have thoughts on this [TS]

01:12:38   this system for resolving this you know called the legal system it's boring and [TS]

01:12:45   slow and annoying but when a bunch of people I do the same things and he said [TS]

01:12:50   she said and blogs you can resolve this civil court and I'm assuming that's what [TS]

01:12:55   they'll do that expensive the Facebooks got the money I can tell you that so [TS]

01:13:01   maybe they win by default [TS]

01:13:02   actually so 53 is doing pretty well too I think it's the smaller paper company [TS]

01:13:08   is probably upset about that more than anybody but this stuff is hard there's [TS]

01:13:14   you know I talked I forget what weather is this show or not but I talked at [TS]

01:13:19   length about the president went there for naming overcast and you know my name [TS]

01:13:25   and my name most things I just can't throw some out there and usually just [TS]

01:13:30   works ok enough overcast a new was gonna get a lot of attention my announced it [TS]

01:13:37   and it wasn't ready yet and I wanted protection from a trip from by my [TS]

01:13:43   trademark protection but I didn't want to I don't wanna like pronounce the name [TS]

01:13:49   or have it in the public record and Trademark Office before announce the [TS]

01:13:51   product anyway all these concerns I knew that what I was making now was going to [TS]

01:13:57   get more scrutiny than anything I've made before because my audience a bigger [TS]

01:14:02   now and so will naming this thing I knew that if if there is any potential for [TS]

01:14:10   trademark conflict of any sort that it would buy me I knew it you know if you [TS]

01:14:15   like it for a while industries like new industries and new areas or new platform [TS]

01:14:19   if they're really small and kinda under the radar you can get by squatting on [TS]

01:14:25   somebody's trademark [TS]

01:14:26   inadvertently you know usually tension but you can get by having having a [TS]

01:14:30   trademark conflict because no one's gonna notice cause the title platform no [TS]

01:14:33   one cares about right but [TS]

01:14:36   and for a while I think the App Store was that for the first few years maybe [TS]

01:14:40   but now it's big now it's a giant giant businesses trying to go system that has [TS]

01:14:47   quickly become kinda merged with and partially taken over the whole consumer [TS]

01:14:52   technology space so its massive thing so you know i i knew that whatever name I [TS]

01:15:00   picked I would have to vet as being pretty safe to use and so every name I [TS]

01:15:07   thought about using I went to the USPTO gov site and search them to the [TS]

01:15:12   trademark search for the name and for similar types of spellings and stuff [TS]

01:15:16   I've added everything they want to use and I had to join text file with no like [TS]

01:15:21   in box of check out in like the bottom line and i cant use and most things I [TS]

01:15:26   can't use were because of trademark conflicts that's just the reality of [TS]

01:15:31   once you get into like the the big mass business world you have to worry about [TS]

01:15:36   things like trademark conflicts similarly before I announced the product [TS]

01:15:42   name at all like weeks before I announce the product I filed for the trademark [TS]

01:15:49   because I knew that there is a risk that if I announced to hit and somebody else [TS]

01:15:55   could go trademark filed trademark for it and release something and steal my [TS]

01:16:01   name and i actually to pay money for the name because of another trademark have a [TS]

01:16:08   coach's disagreement with the trademark owner so you know I took the steps to [TS]

01:16:14   both secure the name in a way that I'm unlikely to get threatened or sued [TS]

01:16:20   because I I did enough research to know that I'm probably OK with all trademarks [TS]

01:16:24   except this one and that when I got an agreement for and also filed my own [TS]

01:16:29   trademark application [TS]

01:16:31   to help protect the name from being sold my other people after announce these are [TS]

01:16:36   things that legitimate businesses have to do all the time the App Store is now [TS]

01:16:40   one of those places where you have to do that sort of stuff you can't just [TS]

01:16:44   released an app with a name and hope no one ever quote steals it you know if you [TS]

01:16:49   if you didn't like filed trademark you basically have no case to anybody [TS]

01:16:53   including Apple you can't email apple and say haiti's guys stole my apt name [TS]

01:16:57   and it's some generic term like paper [TS]

01:17:00   apples I can help you there if you say I have a trademark here's a number and [TS]

01:17:04   this is what they will help you a little bit not not a whole lot Apple's App [TS]

01:17:09   Store something so terrible for the naming stuff it as a personal I was [TS]

01:17:14   shocked the first time I realized this way back in to point out is or not have [TS]

01:17:18   service came out that the name that has in your home screen doesn't really have [TS]

01:17:22   to be my guest may be related to the name of the app is not the same thing [TS]

01:17:26   like you get the pic with the short name is really weird so that's kind of [TS]

01:17:29   misleading and the second thing is if Apple had just simply said you can name [TS]

01:17:34   your app once the names have to be unique [TS]

01:17:37   they would have implemented their own de facto trademark system you know me but [TS]

01:17:41   they don't like a domain names work right to me like you know if you if you [TS]

01:17:47   have the dot-com and you start using it for something prominent you don't have [TS]

01:17:51   to worry that much about someone else trademark it after you because there's [TS]

01:17:55   evidence that you were there but there's still a legal system in like you try to [TS]

01:17:58   use coca-cola dot com available come and get it from you cuz they're big company [TS]

01:18:02   like growing up but dunno just for the small guys and for just like the name [TS]

01:18:05   squatters and all that ridiculous stuff just did you know that your name is read [TS]

01:18:10   only in his unique index on it that solve so many problems because it sounds [TS]

01:18:15   like all these people are like reading all the sob stories about they put it in [TS]

01:18:18   a foreign star and then they changed the name and put into USD are not just [TS]

01:18:22   because that that field assume you to belittle it has led to so much evil [TS]

01:18:26   letting people change that name over and over again I don't think it's too much [TS]

01:18:29   to ask to make people pick a name wants you could like say they're limited [TS]

01:18:33   limited character set limited link picture name you get one shot at it if [TS]

01:18:38   you don't if you don't like the name and its first come first serve and it would [TS]

01:18:42   have to be like [TS]

01:18:42   you know you have to upload the appt at that time or maybe you only get the name [TS]

01:18:46   of your apt approved and then you then you stake your claim my name out of [TS]

01:18:49   whatever they come up with it will be self regulating to a degree much higher [TS]

01:18:54   than the current app store and then you only need to go to the stupid legal [TS]

01:18:57   system which is only an option for certain people if you i mean if someone [TS]

01:19:02   else had a name and got their first you felt like you had a right to it like for [TS]

01:19:06   example if you registered trademark and overcast and Apple had the system and [TS]

01:19:10   before you were done with the appt someone upload a nap cold overcast yeah [TS]

01:19:14   now you got it legal system say hey you can't use that name because I have a [TS]

01:19:17   trademark or whatever but if you uploaded overcast with that name [TS]

01:19:21   capitulo everything is lowercase that's it and had to try for sale would you [TS]

01:19:26   feel better knowing that it's impossible for anyone else to upload another app [TS]

01:19:30   called overcast that would be nice but it's not loading up whatever they want [TS]

01:19:35   and rename it to overcast but like a non-breaking space at the end of some og [TS]

01:19:39   or just put a bunch of keywords spam the end once again the App Store is not [TS]

01:19:45   helping hand in this regard and I don't really understand why Apple they're so [TS]

01:19:50   strict about everything else why they were not more strict with happening you [TS]

01:19:54   know it's funny to is that most apps have have found most developers have [TS]

01:19:59   found that because of this the incredibly primitive with an app store [TS]

01:20:04   search works if actually better off putting a bunch keywords after your name [TS]

01:20:08   I remember when Twitterrific change the name of the route from Twitterrific two [TS]

01:20:12   terrific for Twitter and like Jason the search is so bad [TS]

01:20:15   twitter twitter if it for Twitter because people search for Twitter and it [TS]

01:20:20   wouldn't matter you know that the fact that the names can be so long that you [TS]

01:20:25   can keyword spam them that there's not like a unique identifier like ship by [TS]

01:20:28   all means let people change the description have a secondary tagline you [TS]

01:20:32   know like there's a place for people to put in like the elegant note-taking app [TS]

01:20:36   or whatever but having to be the name of the app because of like a side effect of [TS]

01:20:39   where their stupid search works is just like this if I can't have said this [TS]

01:20:44   before if you just picked randomly 10 developers from the App Store put them [TS]

01:20:48   in a room and say [TS]

01:20:50   and a white board and said come up with 10 ideas to make the App Store better [TS]

01:20:53   they would fight to kill each other for this [TS]

01:20:56   ideas are they wouldn't be like Mike and we think of anything like this so many [TS]

01:20:59   obvious things that can improve and just the year after year really really [TS]

01:21:03   improving hey Marco really quickly do you want to tell us about something else [TS]

01:21:08   it's really fun exciting let's do one more it's our friends at ting ting is [TS]

01:21:13   mobile that makes sense there are simple to use mobile service provider from the [TS]

01:21:18   people at two cows behind however he is a reseller of the Sprint network here in [TS]

01:21:23   the you s go to ATP dot dot com to learn more so they have great rates which [TS]

01:21:30   actually at their prices just lowered which is worth noting especially on data [TS]

01:21:33   dramatically reduce the present data so there they had before an even greater [TS]

01:21:38   rates and there's no contracts and no early termination fees you own your [TS]

01:21:44   device out right from the start and then they have this great pay for what you [TS]

01:21:48   use pricing model so you pay a base price its six bucks per month per device [TS]

01:21:53   and then on top of that use it automatically billed with the SEC [TS]

01:21:58   budgeting system for ever [TS]

01:22:00   actual amount of minutes and messaging megabytes that you use that month so [TS]

01:22:04   you'll pay at least six bucks and then you know if you only use couple hundred [TS]

01:22:08   megs of paying a few dollars on top of that if you don't use any texts this [TS]

01:22:11   month you want anything for the text service that month they will [TS]

01:22:15   automatically put you into whatever bucket is cheapest that will fit your [TS]

01:22:18   usage so and have her fluctuates month to month that's the whole point [TS]

01:22:23   fluctuate and you won't you know you don't have to you don't have to worry [TS]

01:22:26   about like going on a trip you gonna need more data to increase at this month [TS]

01:22:31   for the next month and remember to bring it back to charged again nothing like [TS]

01:22:35   that you just pay for what you use its that simple with tank you can even see [TS]

01:22:40   their prices even even if you use like the same at every month basically their [TS]

01:22:47   prices are extremely competitive and are probably cheaper than what you're paying [TS]

01:22:50   now [TS]

01:22:51   good at ATP ducked into a common check out their savings calculator and you can [TS]

01:22:56   enter in your last few bill usage amounts into tank and they will tell you [TS]

01:23:01   you know what you paid your provider and what that would cost you at ten you can [TS]

01:23:05   see even over time you know if you buy the device upfront money paid as much [TS]

01:23:08   per month and you save this [TS]

01:23:09   when you come out ahead of me and whether it's immediately within three [TS]

01:23:13   months on the line whatever the case maybe you can see they had these great [TS]

01:23:16   tools on their site to see just how much you're gonna see if they will even help [TS]

01:23:20   you get out of a contract if you if you if you have to pay a termination fee [TS]

01:23:24   that is great deal where they will give you up to 25% back into in credit of [TS]

01:23:30   your ETF up to $75 which the really great like hurting has great customer [TS]

01:23:35   support with a no holds no weight telephone support line they have online [TS]

01:23:40   help too if you want but this is great you can call them between 8 a.m. and 8 [TS]

01:23:44   p.m. Eastern and a human being picked up the phone was able to help you know hold [TS]

01:23:49   no weight no transfers it's really great so check out ting they have all sorts of [TS]

01:23:55   you can do you can you can have you can pull devices together under one account [TS]

01:23:59   manager free devices you gonna have test devices if you're a developer and you [TS]

01:24:03   don't want to pay a whole bunch of monthly cost for some other phone like [TS]

01:24:06   really fantastic service here to ATP dot ting dot com you can bring your own [TS]

01:24:12   compatible sprint device or you can buy one from them new or used or you can get [TS]

01:24:15   one on ebay whatever doesn't matter how you get any compatible devices to listen [TS]

01:24:20   their site to ATP dot dot com thanks love to take for sponsoring the show [TS]

01:24:26   once again so I'm sorry do you have any more on the paper or App Store stuff I [TS]

01:24:32   don't know I mean it's the funny thing about this is like nobody has clean [TS]

01:24:36   hands in this league there's there is 53 the company who had a naming dispute [TS]

01:24:41   with figure 53 and other company and I gotta say from the blog post on figure [TS]

01:24:47   53 didn't make 53 look great and in 53 amid this paper app that was also not [TS]

01:24:54   great to somebody else already had a nap name paper and in facebook covers law [TS]

01:24:58   makes their app named paper and 53 has tried to file trademark on it now but if [TS]

01:25:06   the trademark on the data Facebook released their app called paper so that [TS]

01:25:09   might be a problem for them who knows it's it's just a mess I think legally [TS]

01:25:14   none of us are are experts enough to know who's legally in the right here I [TS]

01:25:20   think all of them are being dicks though [TS]

01:25:22   and others being dicks like it's kind of stupid like i think is Facebook because [TS]

01:25:29   the paper APIs pretty well established and I always like its helped popularize [TS]

01:25:33   but I've heard of it and I don't do drawing on the iPad so it's like it's [TS]

01:25:38   not a new application it's pretty popular if Facebook's gonna come up with [TS]

01:25:42   this application packet different name you know why why pick you just you just [TS]

01:25:47   making people confused about your own product the search is going to be [TS]

01:25:51   difficult talking about is going to be difficult and it's not as a paper was [TS]

01:25:55   just such a natural name brought Facebook was doing that it's like they [TS]

01:25:57   couldn't resist it really natural name for what they were doing it in fact if [TS]

01:26:01   anything it's a more natural name for a drawing program so I think they're all [TS]

01:26:04   making their own lives more difficult to the exception whoever the first then [TS]

01:26:07   maybe second one the company's name rabbit Facebook no excuse to use paper [TS]

01:26:11   they pick pick a different name it also shows Samia level of arrogance because [TS]

01:26:16   like you said paper the AB the second one might be the first to you believe [TS]

01:26:22   possibly the first but you don't have the paper the paper app that involves [TS]

01:26:28   drawing that we all think of or certainly used to think of as the [TS]

01:26:31   unequivocal paper up until a week ago whenever it is extremely arrogant in my [TS]

01:26:37   in my mind that that Facebook just like you said knows that this exists knows [TS]

01:26:41   that a lot of people know that this exists mean how it was featured on the [TS]

01:26:46   App Store for like a year not yet it's not an obscure app it's extremely [TS]

01:26:50   popular Facebook should come out an application to two-minute billion photos [TS]

01:26:54   virus called Photoshop exactly like it so arrogant Facebook and as such as a [TS]

01:27:02   company that's that I feel like is losing more and more credibility in the [TS]

01:27:07   minds of not only nerds but not nerds that kind of arrogance just seems silly [TS]

01:27:13   to me and it's just it's so unnecessary like Facebook comes out of this looking [TS]

01:27:18   pretty bad and for what you know they can turn in the app anything and it [TS]

01:27:24   would have gotten all it would've gotten the exact same attention to the same [TS]

01:27:27   success you can argue whether they should call it freakin Facebook replace [TS]

01:27:31   their old up with it I mean like there is a there was no reason for this it was [TS]

01:27:34   completely avoidable [TS]

01:27:36   and they think you're ready Casey it's just arrogance its they they had to know [TS]

01:27:41   about the 53 happening paper and they just said you know what doesn't matter [TS]

01:27:45   we're gonna go right in there anyway is it even called Facebook papers just [TS]

01:27:49   start the plot appears the first part of the name you know none of us have [TS]

01:27:51   installed I installed it let me tell you about the install experiences I had [TS]

01:27:57   higher hopes this I installed it right and I launch it and there's an intro [TS]

01:28:01   movie which annoys me and I want me to treat you like seriously people don't [TS]

01:28:05   make an interim movie here I was happy about how important you think it is then [TS]

01:28:09   of course during the interim movie Pretoria thing it crashed cuz I mean [TS]

01:28:13   like I'm running out of my ipod touch you know memories probably fragmented [TS]

01:28:18   its try and god knows how much memory using trying to show me this full screen [TS]

01:28:22   video and tutorial and of course the crash killed remember whatever it is [TS]

01:28:27   like a terrible first launched experience install launch do you get to [TS]

01:28:32   use the app hell no you get to watch our video with audio and try to go through [TS]

01:28:37   the tutorial on then it crashes it was all I could do to make myself tap that [TS]

01:28:40   icon again to say no I actually really do want to see if there's any other app [TS]

01:28:44   or just delete it immediately like sorry failure I mention I got it up and [TS]

01:28:49   running after I just want to just get me to the part where use the app I'm not a [TS]

01:28:54   typical customer I guess but I think it typical customer I don't have to be [TS]

01:28:57   charmed by that kind of reminds me of the welcome video used around the [TS]

01:29:01   beginning of August 10 I guess that's kind of needed your opening up your Mac [TS]

01:29:05   for the first time and it's not that long but I don't think people have [TS]

01:29:09   tolerance that crap on a phone I have not installed it and i'm looking at just [TS]

01:29:14   the site and it seems to me like [TS]

01:29:17   information density is just way too low and a lot of it like when you look at [TS]

01:29:21   their they have an example that oh I just completed my first marathon and [TS]

01:29:26   that takes up like the entire damn screen is that the information density [TS]

01:29:31   the information quality is as many many people have said when they look at this [TS]

01:29:36   like paper would be awesome if all your friends are professional photographer [TS]

01:29:40   model writers [TS]

01:29:43   California right exactly who live in beautiful places yeah it's the same [TS]

01:29:47   problem that Facebook home had remember that thing where they took over under [TS]

01:29:51   its home screen [TS]

01:29:52   exact same problem like Facebook I think that was a better idea though I don't [TS]

01:29:57   know whether they're ignoring the reality or whether they actually don't [TS]

01:30:01   think this is the reality of their product but the reality is people post a [TS]

01:30:06   terrible crap on Facebook and chances are if you use Facebook timelines full [TS]

01:30:09   about a terrible crap and you know its designers who were you are thinking [TS]

01:30:15   about the ideal case rather than the realistic case I think that I Facebook [TS]

01:30:18   home though is actually a very good idea to try to make the phone experience [TS]

01:30:22   people-centric like most people do with their phones like communicate with [TS]

01:30:26   people like texting their friends or whatever and they're already do a lot of [TS]

01:30:29   stuff on Facebook let's try to make it so that like always available this thing [TS]

01:30:33   where you could look around the circular blobs of your friends and message them [TS]

01:30:37   like the implementation wasn't great and they the audience wasn't quite enough [TS]

01:30:41   and it didn't take off you know like I'm saying it was a success is a product but [TS]

01:30:45   at least that's like that's an Facebook's wheelhouse of like people [TS]

01:30:48   like to use Facebook people do use phones to communicate with each other we [TS]

01:30:51   do have a social graph people do sent Facebook messages to each other let's [TS]

01:30:55   try to to surface that in a phone interface whereas papers just like let [TS]

01:30:59   me find the amazing fanciest way possible future just scroll through [TS]

01:31:03   Facebook and that I don't think it is is as innovative or as interesting as [TS]

01:31:08   homeless and home was a failure to so I don't pick up a review failure people [TS]

01:31:13   downloaded and used it that's fine like the skin off their back if they go back [TS]

01:31:17   to the plane Facebook out but seems like a lot of spit and polish for what's [TS]

01:31:23   mostly a turd about Facebook because they have you know they applied [TS]

01:31:30   ridiculous amount of resources into developing and and resources like they [TS]

01:31:36   they applied incredible designers and developers time to do this and there's [TS]

01:31:43   an opportunity cost there to both Facebook and to the world what if [TS]

01:31:46   Facebook didn't buy all these people and people working on their own stuff [TS]

01:31:52   thermostat [TS]

01:31:53   maybe then maybe something else you know one of them did what if Facebook didn't [TS]

01:32:00   use of these people's time to make this app that the world doesn't really need [TS]

01:32:06   and that will probably not even be maintained in a year because it probably [TS]

01:32:10   won't succeed and it doesn't mean it's not even upgrade their existing APIs as [TS]

01:32:15   a side project I mean the world has lost because of this the world has lost value [TS]

01:32:21   and has lost potential new things these people could have done instead and [TS]

01:32:26   Facebook has lost their time and their talent I mean it's this is a problem [TS]

01:32:32   with the sack with higher culture that the people that the products that have [TS]

01:32:38   hired get destroyed usually as part of the deal to get shut down or get sunset [TS]

01:32:45   and the people are then put to work for these big companies working on how to [TS]

01:32:50   make ads prettier some some junk like that like there's a major opportunity [TS]

01:32:55   cost to all of this and the industry you know if if things ever feel stagnant [TS]

01:33:00   maybe that's why I guess you think Mike Maddux uses Facebook maybe not maybe [TS]

01:33:10   that's why it is happening this ideal picture of what Facebook posts were [TS]

01:33:14   actually looking but I don't know me like I would love to see what he would [TS]

01:33:19   we did see part of it you know what he and his company would have done if they [TS]

01:33:24   weren't on my Facebook and I think it would have been better for I think it [TS]

01:33:29   would have been more useful to more people than this way where we see bought [TS]

01:33:33   from with its so far is that Mike managed to push pop press it pushed by [TS]

01:33:39   President and didn't he also work on the UE 4000 I don't know about that someone [TS]

01:33:45   who google it but my memory was that they did as well [TS]

01:33:48   also how terrible is it that I just phrased my question where was he bought [TS]

01:33:52   from a genuinely think that's it that's that's not cool what's accurate I mean I [TS]

01:33:58   don't think the people who work on this I think they seem to be very talented [TS]

01:34:01   and I don't bring them [TS]

01:34:02   at all for you know going where someone wanted to pay them to do great designers [TS]

01:34:07   just you know they're doing it on top of I wonder if they're doing it on top of [TS]

01:34:11   things they themselves don't use which I don't think it in and of itself is a [TS]

01:34:14   condemnation like the job just want my terror that's the job of the designers [TS]

01:34:19   someone's got a job to do they pay you doing the best job possible you don't [TS]

01:34:23   have to be a user of the product may be helped sometimes but it's like it's you [TS]

01:34:27   know if you are a great designer and they pay you do great designer you do a [TS]

01:34:29   great designer you solve a customer problem with your great design then [TS]

01:34:34   you've succeeded and doesn't really matter if that customer problem is not a [TS]

01:34:38   problem that you yourself have but at the same time I i you know you're [TS]

01:34:43   putting a beautiful face on something that's not like I was not deserving of [TS]

01:34:49   that of that beauty and like and maybe giving it to an audience who does not [TS]

01:34:54   value the work that you've done to the degree that you think like maybe if you [TS]

01:34:57   think you're solving a problem that they haven't they don't really have that [TS]

01:35:00   problem so I don't know they slept for three spots this week [TS]

01:35:06   lynda.com Squarespace and ting and we will see you next week now this show [TS]

01:35:15   they didn't even mean to begin [TS]

01:35:18   it was accidental [TS]

01:35:22   accidental john Kasay [TS]

01:35:29   because it was accidental and you can tell thats Casey list and a team are [TS]

01:35:55   cool [TS]

01:36:13   so I gotta tell you that my father's gonna listen to this episode and blow a [TS]

01:36:20   gasket that IBM is boring [TS]

01:36:22   we'll never know actually I don't think that would bother him at all because the [TS]

01:36:25   offer code is Casey no not that either its as he works in investor relations [TS]

01:36:29   for IBM and so because of that he knows you know market cap in all these other [TS]

01:36:34   numbers of its job and so inevitably want something then one of us said is [TS]

01:36:40   going to be wrong in his eyes and only I get to hear the aftermath you should ask [TS]

01:36:45   him but we have an opportunity to ask us if not the entire audience if he was [TS]

01:36:51   investor relations for and he could substitute IBM's numbers in his current [TS]

01:36:56   job and take Microsoft numbers would he take what he do that he has to say [TS]

01:37:00   here's a market cap here's our revenue here's our margins here's what our [TS]

01:37:04   growth was would he trade those numbers from Microsoft numbers either you know [TS]

01:37:08   obviously he would trade the numbers in 1996 right but it ran into Microsoft's [TS]

01:37:12   numbers now that's a good idea of like if our assessment of the size and [TS]

01:37:18   relative health and success and sort of growth profiles of these companies [TS]

01:37:22   anything close to what we were guessing based on no numbers you know is our [TS]

01:37:28   IBM's margins way lower because they have a huge staff and because the [TS]

01:37:32   margins and service are lower than they are in the South America's most of us [TS]

01:37:35   are there is that is IBM's revenue higher but the margins of lorries are [TS]

01:37:38   they similar they're making some other provinces asked him if you could take [TS]

01:37:41   Microsoft numbers for you last year last quarter whatever would you would you do [TS]

01:37:45   that would it be to make people smile more or would it just be a wash right [TS]

01:37:49   yeah and and I don't know very much about any of this so I won't even begin [TS]

01:37:54   to wager a guess but now I'm sure I don't even have to prompt him even if [TS]

01:37:58   this part doesn't make it in the show I'm confident he will seek me out and [TS]

01:38:03   explain to me all the ways in which all of us wrong of course I mean and by the [TS]

01:38:07   way I i really feel the need to clarify my argument is not that Microsoft should [TS]

01:38:13   only do the kinds of things that IBM and HP and Oracle do i'm saying they should [TS]

01:38:19   move into that direction but I'm not saying they need to get rid of Windows [TS]

01:38:23   and Office licensing and stuff like that let's not [TS]

01:38:26   all that is like that is that that's the same thing like continuing to do because [TS]

01:38:32   that that is the new version of what are known as a people I I don't think that's [TS]

01:38:36   a growth market and Mark Salling personal computers to for people to use [TS]

01:38:39   it work and getting back to you think you're so far is it just because people [TS]

01:38:43   using computers for longer like it's so hard to tell that because you can't tell [TS]

01:38:47   until the time comes when they're gonna buy a new one like people to stop buying [TS]

01:38:50   PCs you could say well that's it the PC market is unknown one species anymore [TS]

01:38:54   but it could be the case if they're really just keeping their old ones for [TS]

01:38:56   longer and so you have to wait five years for ten years or fifty years of [TS]

01:39:01   knowing if everyone stopped now known by the new PC for fifty years we would say [TS]

01:39:05   well the PC is dead but fifty years rolls around the altar place their PCs [TS]

01:39:09   like no they just they were just waiting longer between PCs [TS]

01:39:12   it's hard to tell when you're in the midst of ppl customers are synchronized [TS]

01:39:16   in that manner but there are so many factors here that it's like something's [TS]

01:39:21   going on over there and all we know is that this is no longer the growth market [TS]

01:39:24   that it once was is it going to go out and away forever will be installed base [TS]

01:39:29   shrink and computers will eventually break they can't use them forever [TS]

01:39:33   something will happen to them but you have to either decide do I need to [TS]

01:39:37   replace this thing they just broke her do not need this in my life anymore [TS]

01:39:40   maybe maybe not the outside you know fifty years is how long does it take for [TS]

01:39:45   a PC to break or become useless for common tasks because it doesn't have [TS]

01:39:49   like a you know the old in the old days and i cant connect to the internet and [TS]

01:39:54   you can't put anything I kardia so became worthless I don't know I think [TS]

01:39:57   would have to wait and see but anyway I think that business is a serving [TS]

01:40:02   business type of you know I like I think we all agree that it is a place that the [TS]

01:40:06   iPad is going to steal share for the BC it's gonna be consumers first because [TS]

01:40:09   maybe they don't need a PC at home so the enterprise market where you keep [TS]

01:40:15   selling desktops to Windows desktop some people's desks they can keep doing that [TS]

01:40:19   doesn't seem like anyone else wants that business but it doesn't seem like it's [TS]

01:40:23   going to be a big growth business either so I always think they have to find [TS]

01:40:26   their bodies their growth business while they do it while they continue to use [TS]

01:40:30   the marker strategy for you know windows and everything what is there what is [TS]

01:40:35   their growth strategy for the future [TS]

01:40:38   bring XP back that's the grants that start selling XP all over again maybe [TS]

01:40:43   you know experts figure out that they can outlast Sony and Nintendo or Bible [TS]

01:40:51   at how the I think very trying to buy nintendo ones that they may have the [TS]

01:40:54   opportunity I can't imagine that market is substantial enough to matter on their [TS]

01:41:01   balance sheet at the end of the day I really like even if they dominated the [TS]

01:41:04   game console market like who cares at their show how big is how big is that [TS]

01:41:09   market really and and and do you think again that's been going home again you [TS]

01:41:16   know it your argument for Nintendo was always that as long as there continues [TS]

01:41:21   to be a market for dedicated game hardware it's not a growth market well [TS]

01:41:27   but again like I think related to your Nintendo argument my argument for [TS]

01:41:33   Microsoft I think holds as long as there is a market for mass market PCs like as [TS]

01:41:41   long as there is a market for non like high-end specialty like Apple II not [TS]

01:41:45   high-end PCs cheap widespread customizable from God knows who like as [TS]

01:41:52   long as that market it continues to exist [TS]

01:41:55   microsoft and Windows client business will be fine and the windows server [TS]

01:42:00   market depends on that and so that'll be fine I always said that about but [TS]

01:42:04   Nintendo because I don't think they're capable of anything else that's why [TS]

01:42:08   hasn't there been intended to tend to his is confined to that reality because [TS]

01:42:14   they are not capable of making their own mobile operating system app store in [TS]

01:42:18   platform right but I think microsoft is capable of pretty much anything that any [TS]

01:42:22   other technology companies capable of accepting into smartphones and tablets I [TS]

01:42:26   mean had a hard thing to do is to make a platform and microsoft knows how to make [TS]

01:42:31   a platform doesn't mean all their platforms are going to be successful but [TS]

01:42:34   a few companies me entire world that have proven they know how to make an [TS]

01:42:37   supported platform Microsoft is definitely one of them so that's why i [TS]

01:42:41   like like in our place for sure [TS]

01:42:43   well you know they can't all be winners but they think they can do what's [TS]

01:42:48   intended has never done it and it's really hard like you know palm kinda [TS]

01:42:52   sorta did it once we couldn't do it again [TS]

01:42:55   lots of other companies have never been able to make a general-purpose computing [TS]

01:42:59   platform despite trying or never make a long lived 10 just kind of fade away so [TS]

01:43:03   I am not willing to spend on willing to confined to that they can barely do with [TS]

01:43:08   their time now and they just don't have the Microsoft has so many people so many [TS]

01:43:12   smart people so much institutional experience that there is no technology [TS]

01:43:15   section of the market that they should feel is out of reach because they will [TS]

01:43:20   never be able to that is all I can do everything that they should pick what [TS]

01:43:23   they want to do but I'm not willing to say Microsoft basically just better hope [TS]

01:43:28   there continues to be heard because you can't do anything else right despite [TS]

01:43:33   evidence to the contrary where they do it in phone and tablet but I think they [TS]

01:43:39   showed in game consoles even though it again not a growth market there is no [TS]

01:43:43   place with a developer platform and work as successful as the other people who [TS]

01:43:46   are doing similar things so titles yeah whatever cool and interesting like [TS]

01:43:58   listening to back to work this week it interesting that Merlin is is just now [TS]

01:44:03   replacing a 2006 Mac Pro and mostly because Mavericks no lot like maverick [TS]

01:44:12   does not install officially on its just like can i hack the installer and its [TS]

01:44:16   kinda unstable now but you know this is an eight-year-old computer and granted [TS]

01:44:22   it was a very high-end computer years ago but that's still an eight-year-old [TS]

01:44:27   computer that was working just fine until a few months ago [TS]

01:44:32   well that's when it filled up a dander finally [TS]

01:44:35   I was little room left once it felt entirely then you know about slowly [TS]

01:44:40   getting a new one [TS]

01:44:41   exactly but yeah I think you know it's that's that's really that says a lot [TS]

01:44:48   about the market and you know grand yet still little bit different measures of [TS]

01:44:53   PCs but it's not that far off laptops helped a little bit because people break [TS]

01:44:58   them his stuff like that [TS]

01:44:59   laptops can last as long as I think would be harder to find someone who is [TS]

01:45:04   still using a 2006 laptop who hasn't had it repaired its kinda like cars like you [TS]

01:45:09   can keep them for a long time but eventually you're gonna replace so many [TS]

01:45:13   parts of that card so if anyone's got a 2006 laptop either they're they're OK [TS]

01:45:18   with the parts that are falling off they're getting loose or whatever they [TS]

01:45:21   replace parts on it actually I have a bit of a story about that my first Mac [TS]

01:45:26   which was a 2008 ish poly book white poly book I gave that to Aaron when I [TS]

01:45:34   got my late 2011 MacBook Pro and around the time I did that I was able to get [TS]

01:45:43   them get Apple to replace the case because it had split a few spots and [TS]

01:45:48   that was one of the light get out of jail free cards that if the case it [TS]

01:45:52   split on a poly book you could get Apple to give you new case pretty much without [TS]

01:45:57   question so underscore actually came and visited Saturday morning and Aaron had [TS]

01:46:03   to reboot your computer for some reason or another and we were measuring the [TS]

01:46:06   time it took to reboot this 2008 poly book in like tens of minutes almost at [TS]

01:46:13   this point it might have been like 10 or 15 minutes it took to reboot and so I [TS]

01:46:17   ended up going to the Apple store with underscore partial to kill time [TS]

01:46:23   partially to actually impulse buy her either an 11 inch air or a 13 inch hair [TS]

01:46:29   I'd intended to get the 13 and underscores said that missus underscore [TS]

01:46:34   really likes 11 because on rare occasions she will put it in her purse [TS]

01:46:38   blah blah blah [TS]

01:46:39   and so we ended up going to the Apple store of standing the Apple Store [TS]

01:46:43   underscore and invite thing cause I couldn't figure out whether or not [TS]

01:46:47   Aaron would want the eleven of the 13 and she had somewhere else to be as she [TS]

01:46:51   couldn't go with us and I didn't end up buying anything and I still haven't and [TS]

01:46:56   Aaron swears to me there's no point because she really doesn't use your [TS]

01:46:59   computer for that much but I mean that weird uncomfortable moment where I feel [TS]

01:47:04   like it's time for her to get a new Mac probably an air and yet at the others on [TS]

01:47:10   the other side of the coin is justified because all all she does with it is like [TS]

01:47:13   basic word processing occasionally and the web browsing and that's about it [TS]

01:47:19   went to the heirs are at least you can wait longer that's what I said like it [TS]

01:47:23   like when you told me this I said you know that if I if I wasn't in a rush I [TS]

01:47:28   would not buy a Macbook Air right now because the rumors rumors of that 11.9 [TS]

01:47:34   inch retina where I think are very interesting to me that kind of sounds [TS]

01:47:39   like a replacement for the MacBook Air not a new model don't you know that's 12 [TS]

01:47:44   inch iPad probe Marco I love the screen 12 inch screen rumors everywhere [TS]

01:47:50   everyone keeps saying 12 inch iPad 12 inside pets like why is the air not the [TS]

01:47:54   first like that's the main headline read into air screens in the secondary one of [TS]

01:48:00   like suppose it could be 4 12 inch iPad is that is the reverse like well 12 inch [TS]

01:48:03   screen that obviously 12 inch iPad di really I really think if they released a [TS]

01:48:08   thing there's a very good chance that that replaces both MacBook Airs which is [TS]

01:48:14   which is controversial because they would make the smallest Mac a little [TS]

01:48:18   bigger I think it's easy I don't think that's even that controversial because [TS]

01:48:23   by that time like seeing 13 inch new 13 inch MacBook Pros all the time now like [TS]

01:48:29   it's it's so skinny like you don't like the third is practically read I make one [TS]

01:48:34   air attack its super duper skinny fine what do you think of the compromise [TS]

01:48:37   price I think I'm gonna make people feel better about like a 13 inch here [TS]

01:48:42   magnetic fields like the air at the super skinny one there's one of them [TS]

01:48:47   over 13 and 15 and they're both pretty darn skinny too so yeah I mean I totally [TS]

01:48:52   13 retina is so good and so and so thin and light I do think it it largely [TS]

01:48:58   removes the need for there to share and if if something comes out that's closer [TS]

01:49:03   in size 11 then that could be it I mean there will be a few people who would be [TS]

01:49:09   upset by that but you know already like between 11 and 13 like I think there I [TS]

01:49:14   think the ideal size is between those two small yeah and I mean that screen [TS]

01:49:20   resolution the 11 is killer like that in a bad way [TS]

01:49:23   killer like it's really that screen resolution is tight but also in a bad [TS]

01:49:28   way what do all these words mean good in the nineties ruined language and music [TS]

01:49:36   Casey Aaron replacing her thing and not sure that my mother is in a similar [TS]

01:49:46   situation where she think she doesn't need a new laptop and I think she does [TS]

01:49:49   and she too much for a long time but she won't give it up exceeds the optical [TS]

01:49:52   disc in her mind and I've been trying to convince her this is this is not the [TS]

01:49:56   case anyway her current strategy is that she's going to do with the old car [TS]

01:49:59   images can't we just upgraded my laptop and I had to gradually tell her yes this [TS]

01:50:05   is a possible and this is a thing that can be done and so the next time she [TS]

01:50:09   visits I'm giving her more RAM an SST and actually one of the biggest reasons [TS]

01:50:15   not to impulse buy a laptop at the Apple Store is that you're stuck with the [TS]

01:50:21   stock levels of RAM and harddrive and everything else whereas if you go online [TS]

01:50:25   I just checked the stock is only four gigs around which I would not I would [TS]

01:50:30   not buy that today we don't have the Saturn on the motherboard RAM which is [TS]

01:50:35   pretty much all of them now don't think have both models at Apple stores like [TS]

01:50:39   the you know the eight and 16 they usually only carry at Apple stores the [TS]

01:50:43   ones that are there like you know there's four areas you can select to [TS]

01:50:47   start with [TS]

01:50:48   on apple.com 211 213 usually like they'll carry those those for the one [TS]

01:50:54   for the starting in 15 apple.com so each family will have like two or three of [TS]

01:50:57   them but you won't be able to get all the different options usually a shame is [TS]

01:51:02   that really that many options [TS]

01:51:03   yeah actually write these days even few used to because they keep like you know [TS]

01:51:07   soldering on certain things that yeah I mean like like if I were getting a fire [TS]

01:51:13   getting an 11 inch air today for whatever it's worth looking at the base [TS]

01:51:16   model personal there's a storage issue with 128 gigs in I storage aside I would [TS]

01:51:23   not get four gigs I would get a kids are am definitely and you can get a [TS]

01:51:26   substantially faster CPU 450 bucks more [TS]

01:51:31   evernote is asked me should should should I get the i seven hundred bucks [TS]

01:51:34   more of course you get it was 150 but still that's a real it's a relatively [TS]

01:51:38   small amount of money for a computer for what's going to be over time a pretty [TS]

01:51:42   substantial gain in your total usage of the thing similar with the RAM the Rams [TS]

01:51:47   a hundred bucks to go from four to eight gigs [TS]

01:51:49   so I would say base price + 250 bucks for the CPU and RAM that's that's a good [TS]

01:51:54   by where its forty-eight challenging as the storage and whether that's enough [TS]

01:51:59   for you will of course depend on you and I think if I were to do it I think I [TS]

01:52:03   would get a thirteen because I talked to her about missus underscore putting her [TS]

01:52:08   in her purse on occasion and Aaron basically said that that's wonderful [TS]

01:52:13   that it would fit but I can't ever see myself doing that and so I probably get [TS]

01:52:18   her 13 we agree that four gigs is just unacceptable because this would be a [TS]

01:52:22   five- or six-year computer hopefully but I mean I don't believe here's can take [TS]

01:52:31   more than a campaign I don't either but that's life again presumably when they [TS]

01:52:36   read no one's come out there'll be some fancy fancy 12 and share their Copa 16 [TS]

01:52:40   that's true when I should also note that when I bought my personal laptop which [TS]

01:52:46   is effectively the same as my work one its 15 inch anti-glare highres MacBook [TS]

01:52:52   Pro this is pre read now I got I believe I got the most baller what I could [TS]

01:52:58   possibly buy and I think you have the same one of the time but anyway I walked [TS]

01:53:02   in and I walked in and bought that at the store so they actually carried the [TS]

01:53:07   completely SPECT up version I think it had the default amount of RAM but in [TS]

01:53:13   terms of like processor and screen and all that they had the fully expect [TS]

01:53:17   version ready to buy at the store yay was it was different there cuz they have [TS]

01:53:21   the antiglare option as a set and a high res antiglare it is for different screen [TS]

01:53:27   Street View admit I was a little different than but yet I like when I [TS]

01:53:33   bought my retina I would decide to be impatient one night and I'm gonna buy [TS]

01:53:38   one of those things like it was it was a month after WC when it was announced [TS]

01:53:41   like 19 like fighting with my web development trying to get myself look [TS]

01:53:45   right on me you know it's good I'm going to buy one of these the Apple store and [TS]

01:53:48   get the cheapest one they have because they don't need that much for this [TS]

01:53:51   laptop and I did and it worked ok except that it only has eight gigs of ram and I [TS]

01:53:57   want 16 or something like that I like it like the Rams like the one thing I [TS]

01:54:01   regret on it [TS]

01:54:02   you could only get online now they started to the ramen that's another [TS]

01:54:07   reason I'm getting my moms or am I gonna be able to do that for her next back [TS]

01:54:12   it's worth it these days to look at things online and not as a binding on [TS]

01:54:18   impulse in the store to get some guys I ordered a new TiVo to ya Romeo right [TS]

01:54:25   finally given yeah I mean I did it because I looked at the I went to the [TS]

01:54:31   table side looked at my current Property values in the HDX I was upstairs has [TS]

01:54:36   paid for its lifetime service multiple times over at this point so even though [TS]

01:54:40   my current [TS]

01:54:41   has not paid for its lifetime service yet I'm going to keep that going to [TS]

01:54:45   shift it up and supposedly you can actually get money for these old TiVo's [TS]

01:54:50   lifetime service because the person who buys it doesn't have to pay a monthly [TS]

01:54:54   fee like a lifetime service goes with the hardware so eventually be trying to [TS]

01:54:59   see how much of that is true how much money can actually get through this [TS]

01:55:02   thing but it's perfectly good DVR with two tenors the record Sun H D and the [TS]

01:55:07   UI's is faster than the premier it's perfectly good as long as you don't mind [TS]

01:55:11   ads in your DVR which I didn't realize was a thing and somebody pointed out to [TS]

01:55:15   me after the show we talk about this at length how do you of all people put up [TS]

01:55:18   with that they're getting used to not be there at all and you can make them go [TS]

01:55:23   away but they come back it's not like the ad play video in your face or [TS]

01:55:28   anything like that [TS]

01:55:29   like next to the scrubber after you're done watching the show when it says [TS]

01:55:32   you're done with the show would you like to delete or whatever there's an ad [TS]

01:55:35   banner above the little square bar which I i wouldn't even mind that much if it [TS]

01:55:41   was irrelevant and sometimes it is like it'll be an advertisement for some show [TS]

01:55:45   like this shows premiering thumbs-up to record or whatever and like that's [TS]

01:55:48   actually useful feature something like oh yeah I did wanna see that show and [TS]

01:55:52   because I don't watch commercials anymore I'll forget when it shows from [TS]

01:55:54   hearing what pops up that thing if I can just press a button and say a record [TS]

01:55:57   that for me that's good but when it's just like Bounty paper towels are [TS]

01:56:00   awesome and whatever I like it cannot be added on Gmail or it's like eventually [TS]

01:56:05   just don't see them but they keep making worse and worse and worse thing about it [TS]

01:56:09   is that sometimes it takes a while to load that ad so before you get the [TS]

01:56:12   screen that says [TS]

01:56:13   do you want to delete this show or keep it or whatever you're waiting and I [TS]

01:56:17   realize what I waiting for is for it to load the stupid text ad banner so yeah [TS]

01:56:22   that's not great but I still prefer you could keep justifying this however you [TS]

01:56:28   want but it's still be us now you know it's only a matter of time before the [TS]

01:56:32   only reason that doesn't appear in your DVR is because your DVRs doesn't have [TS]

01:56:36   the software for it yet but wait to get there [TS]