The Accidental Tech Podcast

6: Live Like Other People


00:00:00   let's get going we we are going that was so good I'm keeping that so I was I went [TS]

00:00:07   to the mall today and I had to pick up a new Apple TV and a replacement remote [TS]

00:00:13   first of all I do wanna talk a little about my TV so we we were we've had this [TS]

00:00:17   like back Dan / family room / play room in our house as we bought the house and [TS]

00:00:24   we've had we haven't had any furniture and because we just haven't had a need [TS]

00:00:28   for it yet but we have a living room I have an office like we have separate [TS]

00:00:32   rooms for these things so this room against we always said Oh it'll be like [TS]

00:00:35   the kids play room so we just heard you in this room finally now that we have [TS]

00:00:39   the kid and so we we got a couch for that was delivered this morning and I [TS]

00:00:44   got a TV for it and a second Apple TV to plug into the TV and interesting how you [TS]

00:00:53   know and John of course you're famous for you or your research television [TS]

00:00:56   purchase but I thought it was interesting how for this TV I literally [TS]

00:01:01   the only research I did was I search Amazon for TVs in the roughly the size [TS]

00:01:07   range on my iPad Mini in bed one night and just ordered it that's how the rest [TS]

00:01:13   of the world lives Marco I fantasize about purchasing something that way but [TS]

00:01:19   never actually pulled the trigger but just take five more minutes just 10 more [TS]

00:01:25   minutes maybe just one more hour ok maybe three more hours in just three [TS]

00:01:30   hours you invest now you can have this thing for years and foolish and just [TS]

00:01:33   live like other people and just search for TV and trying one that looks nice [TS]

00:01:38   and click Buy but that's what people do so the reason you keep cars for seven [TS]

00:01:43   attorneys is because it takes you seven attorneys to research the next car [TS]

00:01:46   continued I mean like I'm reading a magazine a month I'm continually [TS]

00:01:51   researching with a nice cars going to be there so I am always ready at a moment's [TS]

00:01:55   notice to you know get through the existing field this a potential Karzai [TS]

00:02:00   would get i mean you know I'm even making those things like me while I [TS]

00:02:04   really want to I want the essay or should I wait for the new S Class none [TS]

00:02:08   of his car so I can afford but in case just in case I'm ready to go [TS]

00:02:13   front and like usually I'm like that too which is why I was kind of amused by my [TS]

00:02:18   own lack of interest in doing that for this purchase at the main reason why I [TS]

00:02:22   think for in my case this time was there weren't that many choices that I [TS]

00:02:28   actually want so I wasn't gonna go to a store that that was like I don't care [TS]

00:02:31   because it's a secondary room in the house [TS]

00:02:35   selfishly I'm not gonna often be watching it usually either the babies [TS]

00:02:39   watching it with sesame street on my wife is watching it all hang out with [TS]

00:02:42   the baby and so it is very rare that I will be there watching its second of all [TS]

00:02:48   I know that and ahead of you any smaller is the biggest we can get that would fit [TS]

00:02:53   the spot when it was 37 inches I know you know by old standards it's pretty [TS]

00:02:57   big but by today's standards that's pretty small so far this medium so it [TS]

00:03:02   wasn't like buying a high end items because join us you told me it's pretty [TS]

00:03:07   hard to find small high-end TV models all small TV is a terrible price that so [TS]

00:03:13   many other thing was I i didnt wanna buy a Samsung because I just find Samsung so [TS]

00:03:19   distasteful as a company [TS]

00:03:21   overhaul that I'd rather not support them if if I can avoid it like you know [TS]

00:03:26   sure if if they had the only good option I would have probably suck it up and [TS]

00:03:30   bought it but so anyway so I went and the TV we have firm and TV which I [TS]

00:03:36   bought about seven years ago now is a nice 42 inch Panasonic plasma and I'm [TS]

00:03:42   very happy with it it's a it's great TV 1080p you know really really nice color [TS]

00:03:48   and brightness and contrast levels across the plasma and it's a fantastic [TS]

00:03:53   TV and I've always been very pleased with it so I basically I was on our show [TS]

00:03:59   me TVs that are you know this size roughly of course that rules out all [TS]

00:04:03   platforms which is unfortunate that you liked as much as a technology that it [TS]

00:04:07   just looks so good and in dark detail but it's ok to plasma 37 inches [TS]

00:04:13   so and roulette Samsung ok and roulette things that will ship by Amazon Prime [TS]

00:04:19   because I don't feel like paying some massive ship and charged for some of the [TS]

00:04:21   summit TV ok and that left only like four models and one of them was a [TS]

00:04:27   Panasonic and the Panasonic was the only one that was 1080p [TS]

00:04:31   amazon has terrible toll legislation by the way I'm not surprised you narrowed [TS]

00:04:35   it down to very soon but they do not catch they simply like they carry every [TS]

00:04:39   possible brand of like you know I don't know pen or paper towels or whatever but [TS]

00:04:44   like TVs they do not your best Buy has more selection in terms of models which [TS]

00:04:48   surprises me all the time like how could Amazon not have this but whatever weird [TS]

00:04:53   Matthews different when they carry extremes to exclude a lot of models of [TS]

00:04:56   TV you would think it would be the opposite because the Tams on no they [TS]

00:04:59   don't have the stores I don't know what it is so it was easier it was you know I [TS]

00:05:04   I could to try and some like we are discontinued Sony model or some Samsung [TS]

00:05:07   thing or some like you know covy piece of crap or a Panasonic but I already [TS]

00:05:13   liked the look very similar my current one that had good good customer ratings [TS]

00:05:17   on Amazon I was the only one that was 1080p I mean it was a no-brainer so it [TS]

00:05:21   was like 550 bucks which i think is pretty cheap for for a good TV about [TS]

00:05:26   size saw the Cape that's done at the measurements fit perfectly done and [TS]

00:05:32   arrived today and it's awesome I'm really happy with that I can't believe [TS]

00:05:35   how little research I had to do to get a satisfactory purchase here people that's [TS]

00:05:40   why people buy without research because his blessing if you don't do the [TS]

00:05:44   research you don't know what they're missing and you just get what you want [TS]

00:05:46   like this I i agonized over my small TV purchase because I had exactly the same [TS]

00:05:50   problem I quickly discovered that all the small TV is a terrible because they [TS]

00:05:54   don't make you know there's no market for like high in small TVs you know [TS]

00:05:57   there's more to smartphone market for high-end hatchbacks in there is her [TS]

00:06:01   small titties and so I had to go through all of the models that all had some [TS]

00:06:05   terrible you know fatal flaw that would prevent me from ever wanting you figure [TS]

00:06:09   out which is the least terrible one in the in the end the one I chose I chose [TS]

00:06:15   because it was on sale for like $200 off where you could find in like you know [TS]

00:06:21   best buy price and it was on Amazon Prime shipping ball and I said ok these [TS]

00:06:27   all have something about them that makes me not able to buy them but this one has [TS]

00:06:30   such a steep discount today I have to get it so that's what I ended up with [TS]

00:06:36   the time you know I still look at it and I still am sending you might want to [TS]

00:06:40   save a lot of money on my mind was around $500 to but it was a nicer [TS]

00:06:45   television probably got you sure that is pretty nice but I mean maybe not now [TS]

00:06:50   because I bought mine years ago [TS]

00:06:52   technology marches on but at the time it was it was also the highest rated of all [TS]

00:06:57   the ones I was looking at internet I wish there was a site like dpreview for [TS]

00:07:00   televisions but as far as I can tell there is not there is a CVS forums we're [TS]

00:07:05   just kind of like dpreview but exploded into a million pieces see how to troll [TS]

00:07:09   through the farms if there are people say but like I just want a comprehensive [TS]

00:07:12   in-depth technical review of things the way dpreview.com yeah image comparisons [TS]

00:07:17   with comfortable models like the whole nine yards right and I could balance the [TS]

00:07:21   only thing I found that is what you should have done too well this is just [TS]

00:07:26   like you too disappointed with the way my parents want to get television I just [TS]

00:07:29   told them to go to CNET's television viewers because they have a nice web [TS]

00:07:31   interface they gave you most televisions they do a reasonable job and you can [TS]

00:07:36   just go show me the best TV news for you know under $500 under the size with this [TS]

00:07:42   technology will just show you with star ratings and you can you know you get a [TS]

00:07:46   short list of models menu at Amazon Amazon carries none of those models and [TS]

00:07:49   you'll be sad but that's that's that's a good starting point of like it's kind of [TS]

00:07:54   like the wire cutter TVs but a little bit more comprehensive because they'll [TS]

00:07:57   tell me ok I wanted to be a small TV now I want LCD or plasma and LCD backlight I [TS]

00:08:02   don't care about the backlight by the way what what is the backlight on your [TS]

00:08:05   CEO Mark led yeah they're all you know if they used to be a big distinguishing [TS]

00:08:10   characteristic and it drives me crazy when people call them LED TVs that are [TS]

00:08:15   so misleading the magic america and New Years desires is your schedule let you [TS]

00:08:21   know I don't even know that research it just so happens I think it's great i [TS]

00:08:29   mean it like I mean I use it for [TS]

00:08:31   an hour earlier today if that's the thing about television technology in all [TS]

00:08:35   these technologies have some horrible thought about them including plasma [TS]

00:08:39   progress does Marchand I think you know people were talking about the latest [TS]

00:08:43   crop of Panasonic plasma Panasonic is once again making noises about getting [TS]

00:08:46   out of the plasma business but they like ok well if you buy these sort of middle [TS]

00:08:51   of the road Panasonic plasma that everybody buys it has better picture [TS]

00:08:55   than their super duper top of the line from last generation oops you know and [TS]

00:08:59   so that that's depressing if you have the television like me I bought the top [TS]

00:09:03   of the line you know five years ago and now they're like bargain-basement TV [TS]

00:09:07   probably looks better but it's heartening and that like oh I can it's [TS]

00:09:10   finally getting to the point where if you go out and buy a Panasonic plasma [TS]

00:09:14   today from their current crop of models you probably getting better television [TS]

00:09:17   than I have a lot less money and that's kind of the way technology supposed to [TS]

00:09:20   work and I think you know one reason why was I was willing to almost impulse buy [TS]

00:09:26   a TV is because they're also good now that I mean yet it you know within you [TS]

00:09:32   can you can especially you but you know you the general population [TS]

00:09:36   can can find differences and and identify them in a pic them but in [TS]

00:09:40   reality like whatever TV you buy chances are you'll be fine with it until it [TS]

00:09:47   breaks which is probably at least five years I don't but I said on Twitter 10 [TS]

00:09:51   years i know i cant unresponsive saying that these components do not last that [TS]

00:09:55   long and I might expect more like five to seven ok fine but you know 520 K five [TS]

00:10:01   to seven years that he was in a word for me a TV is a monitor for an Apple TV and [TS]

00:10:09   occasional game system like it's not I'm not masking that much from it and so I [TS]

00:10:15   knew that whatever I bought you know unless it had some weird thing like made [TS]

00:10:19   a weird noise or like the speakers fell out barring some kind of catastrophic [TS]

00:10:24   law almost anything would work just fine for my purposes here I still think the [TS]

00:10:30   distinction between LCD and plasma is significant enough that you know like be [TS]

00:10:36   especially if you're into watching movies [TS]

00:10:39   the motion compensation stuff to leave that on everything looks weird to your [TS]

00:10:43   turn it off and everything looks weird in a slightly different way and and like [TS]

00:10:47   it used to be at all this is still the case because I haven't researched buying [TS]

00:10:50   a new TV recently but it used to be that it was difficult to find even among the [TS]

00:10:55   plasmas you had to be careful to make sure that you got one they could do like [TS]

00:10:59   true 24 frames per second came in from blu-ray player i guess im standards of [TS]

00:11:03   saying like oh put the TV into him up because 24 is not a nice multiple like [TS]

00:11:07   60 or 30 or anything like that in their various blu-ray players and TVs conspire [TS]

00:11:11   to give you the most accurate film like representation of movies that were shot [TS]

00:11:17   at 24 frames per second [TS]

00:11:18   without any weird interpolation without any image processing delays and stuff [TS]

00:11:22   like that and plasmas are still the way to go for that because the LCDs [TS]

00:11:27   necessarily have to do some amount of that we are processing stuff and you [TS]

00:11:32   know the input lag four games and stuff like that but you know from watching [TS]

00:11:36   television shows its my minutes are upstairs bedroom TV is an LCD and watch [TS]

00:11:41   TV shows on in the kids watch movies on it it's not a big deal I will say also I [TS]

00:11:46   mean I haven't have a washington died yet so I'll see you know how how good [TS]

00:11:49   the dark detail is which is one area that was really been better than LCDs [TS]

00:11:53   but I will say just looking at the TV and regular daytime usage you could have [TS]

00:11:59   told me it was a plasma and I would believe that it it really does look that [TS]

00:12:02   good [TS]

00:12:03   LCD has come a long way and also but not in the area and I guess I'm comparing us [TS]

00:12:11   to what I'm most familiar with which is a seven-year-old plasma but my [TS]

00:12:14   seven-year-old plasma is still pretty good bye must hits today and you know [TS]

00:12:19   it's not like totally won the first generation ones that like salt [TS]

00:12:24   just turn turn on all the lights in the room bring up the beginning of a movie [TS]

00:12:27   that's completely black screen with like two directors name in white text in the [TS]

00:12:30   middle and then see what that looks like to look like a giant glowing grace clip [TS]

00:12:35   square with white light in the middle or you know does it look like a black [TS]

00:12:39   square with white white text with a giant halo around it or that's that's [TS]

00:12:43   where you'll see the black levels as you know when all the lights go out in the [TS]

00:12:47   room [TS]

00:12:47   how much how much light is actually admitted from your supposedly black [TS]

00:12:50   television is actually you know what's funny is asked me what kind of TV I have [TS]

00:12:56   in our family room living room or whatever you call it is an ideal watch [TS]

00:13:01   TV I have no idea what kind of TV news I think it's a Toshiba really don't know [TS]

00:13:05   who's a gift [TS]

00:13:06   dunno it it's funny it's easy just one of those things I don't care enough I [TS]

00:13:10   really just don't care enough and in and I'm not saying you guys are wrong to [TS]

00:13:14   care and I kinda wish I cared but I just really don't care for the longest time [TS]

00:13:18   we had a 32 inch TV above our fireplace which everyone who comes here it comes [TS]

00:13:24   into our house that actually cares about this stuff says oh my god how could you [TS]

00:13:26   have the TV that high off the ground you're out of your mind it's terrible I [TS]

00:13:29   don't care why don't you have a bigger TV don't care and it it's just odd to me [TS]

00:13:35   what you know some people care about and some people don't end and again I'm not [TS]

00:13:39   faulting either of you in any capacity for caring I kinda wish I gave enough of [TS]

00:13:44   a crap but I just don't care [TS]

00:13:46   people don't care about the screens either which is the truth of having [TS]

00:13:50   taking family member shopping for iOS devices I have to take great pains to [TS]

00:13:56   show them that there is actual actually difference between running on retina [TS]

00:14:01   iPad screens they just they cannot see it they kinda see it when I showed them [TS]

00:14:05   but like it's a type of thing where if they can't see it just by looking at the [TS]

00:14:11   screens what do they do show so like I was your man on texture I try to save [TS]

00:14:15   you see the Jags around the curve of that thing in like you know it's I [TS]

00:14:20   everything will be ready when is better they see that it's better but it's not [TS]

00:14:25   like alright but it better enough how much more does this one cost or whatever [TS]

00:14:29   I think that's that's why you know Panasonic think of chanting its plasma [TS]

00:14:34   is it because like plasma is superior has superior picture quality and other [TS]

00:14:37   characteristics 20 cities despite all the advances in LCDs but is it better [TS]

00:14:42   enough that and the other thing kills me is like not only were is the image [TS]

00:14:47   quality better but they've been consistently cheaper as well on the high [TS]

00:14:51   end especially like the super high-end [TS]

00:14:54   LCDs were more expensive for the same size of the plasma but it's just not [TS]

00:14:58   better enough and I class Michalek bad rap for you no heat and power plant [TS]

00:15:03   which is true and burning also some which is true and just like you know [TS]

00:15:07   most people buy kind of the middle of the road LCD televisions and it's just [TS]

00:15:11   not enough people who care about image quality to carrying pioneer got out of [TS]

00:15:16   the business after their current models which are like the best looking [TS]

00:15:18   televisions ever for years and years after they stopped making them and some [TS]

00:15:23   people say they still had advantages over existing miles so that is a little [TS]

00:15:25   bit nostalgia but yeah like if you if you're if you're differences not [TS]

00:15:31   distinct enough to capture the hearts and minds of people it's very difficult [TS]

00:15:34   to make a go of that business of Panasonic's like yeah we we are the [TS]

00:15:39   current king of television image quality except those crazy all that things are [TS]

00:15:44   never but not enough people care about that difference they just go on by [TS]

00:15:49   Alcides and we sell CDs too and we're just gonna get out of the plasma thing [TS]

00:15:52   because it at a certain point it becomes untenable to be like the only person [TS]

00:15:55   making class must implement placement to other people do as well but I've been [TS]

00:16:01   actually seriously considering buying whatever the very last high and [TS]

00:16:05   Panasonic plasma is even though I did not plan to replace my television and [TS]

00:16:11   he's got a little bit longer than that it was like I did I plan to keep it for [TS]

00:16:17   many many years that's perfectly fine but I'm like if I don't get this now I [TS]

00:16:22   don't want to be in like five years or seven years [TS]

00:16:25   forced to buy an LCD television is I don't think like old heads you know any [TS]

00:16:31   other technology will be superior to that point so I don't like letting the [TS]

00:16:35   Corolla like you could have bought occur but you didn't stop making its like [TS]

00:16:38   stocking up on the boards [TS]

00:16:40   you know I have I have I i've actually I was the Big Apple standard keyboard to [TS]

00:16:46   use air and so I have a bunch of spares but then I switched like when they are [TS]

00:16:50   psychic then I wanted a keyboard with that took less effort to press the keys [TS]

00:16:54   on despite the fact that I love the Apple extended to and I used it all [TS]

00:16:57   after college so now I have a backlog extended to as I guess I will just save [TS]

00:17:02   them until I can sell them to group [TS]

00:17:05   don't come back in one day one day when he can't find that he's only by like one [TS]

00:17:12   every ten you it's a start maybe they'll start breaking it at a higher rate I've [TS]

00:17:17   got some pretty good condition [TS]

00:17:19   extended to us up in the attic that's good to know it i'm glad you brought up [TS]

00:17:23   the red nothing just very quickly [TS]

00:17:25   my parents came to visit this weekend this past weekend and my dad has a 13 [TS]

00:17:30   inch Retina MacBook Pro and he was asking a few questions about it and so i [TS]

00:17:34   sat down in front of it and instantly I was ruined again and and I have I [TS]

00:17:39   mentioned in the past I believe that I have a 15 inch high res antiglare non [TS]

00:17:44   retina MacBook Pro two of them and and my eyes are actually terrible I have to [TS]

00:17:49   wear hard contacts cuz my sir so bad but I was in front of his retina MacBook Pro [TS]

00:17:53   for 30 seconds before I was real and i got up and I said kind that screen so [TS]

00:17:57   beautiful my mom said you know I just don't see it I don't get it I believe [TS]

00:18:01   you but I don't get it and it's so you john you're dead on about that it's like [TS]

00:18:06   do you think that's because like our parents are all during your vision gets [TS]

00:18:09   worse as you get older is that it is that just it though is it is it [TS]

00:18:13   something else I don't think that's why I think it's it's it's it's a [TS]

00:18:18   combination of attention to that kind of detail and also just caring about that [TS]

00:18:24   particular type of them well and I would like to do that you know and a/b tests [TS]

00:18:28   were you were like like this some sort of reward we're like to try to guess you [TS]

00:18:35   not that you care whether it's you know but can literally just can you tell [TS]

00:18:39   right and we can all tell like you know blink test for them up on the screen for [TS]

00:18:43   half a second but maybe like you know if the same website is insufficient for [TS]

00:18:50   them if they have three seconds five seconds ten seconds and minutes to stare [TS]

00:18:53   at them to shove their nose up to the mike [TS]

00:18:55   what does it take for you to decide it is not separate from its a little better [TS]

00:19:00   but it's not worth it to me vs I literally cannot tell the difference [TS]

00:19:04   yeah I think so going back to the 31st so I was in the Apple Store today [TS]

00:19:10   getting the second Apple TV for for this new television a previously met [TS]

00:19:16   and and this was the first time I'd seen in person [TS]

00:19:21   the new 27 inch iMac and even the 13 inch Retina MacBook Pro which is like [TS]

00:19:26   five months old now but when it's it's it's been a while and I've been busy [TS]

00:19:33   with no family and baby in winter stuff so I have and I haven't had any reason [TS]

00:19:38   to go into an Apple store and pay attention to what was there until now [TS]

00:19:42   and I think a couple things about the shock me one first of all the 27 inch [TS]

00:19:47   iMac the screen is awesome it is the first Apple screen it is the first [TS]

00:19:54   desktop screen has seen in years that I would consider owning because it really [TS]

00:19:58   is far less reflective than the previous generation of giant 27 inch pieces of [TS]

00:20:04   glass they've shipped as cinema displays and IMAX before this and it still is [TS]

00:20:08   pleased so you know we talked about this this new construction they've had where [TS]

00:20:13   they it's similar to the retina MacBook Pro this new construction weather like [TS]

00:20:17   glue in the glass fusing in a certain way these infusion like one fewer glass [TS]

00:20:21   layer them before something extra basically I know some scientific [TS]

00:20:26   personnel tells you know the barrier for refractions a place of the angles light [TS]

00:20:31   changes and changes against you get more internal reflection writes a big [TS]

00:20:34   difference so unlike the previous generation of 15 inch MacBook Pros [TS]

00:20:38   before the retinas I always hated those Larry reflective screens they were [TS]

00:20:43   miserable I own one for a month returned it and then got the anti glare caused it [TS]

00:20:47   it had just become an option but with the retina with that same kind of [TS]

00:20:52   construction I think it's fine in the reflectivity of it has never really been [TS]

00:20:55   an issue for me so yeah I can confirm that the 27 inch iMac has such [TS]

00:21:01   dramatically reduced reflectivity from the previous one and from the same [TS]

00:21:04   displays that not only would I buy one if i if I wanted an iMac not only would [TS]

00:21:09   I not hesitate at all but the reflectivity but if Apple released a [TS]

00:21:13   cinema display or fingers crossed a Retina display using that same [TS]

00:21:17   construction I would buy the heartbeat did you did you have seen in IMAX a [TS]

00:21:21   person who do you think that it had the same oh my god the pictures are on the [TS]

00:21:26   surface of this place looks at the ready [TS]

00:21:28   MacBook Pros house I didn't really get that from a but I was doing it at a [TS]

00:21:34   further distance to such a bigger screen so I'm not really sure that would matter [TS]

00:21:37   as much at that distance board is noticeable but I was looking for that so [TS]

00:21:41   I don't know I feel like that is one of the most startling characteristics of [TS]

00:21:46   the retina MacBook Pro screens is not so much just a resolution but that the that [TS]

00:21:51   the color appears closer to the surface and that that to me is just a startling [TS]

00:21:56   is the higher resolution and you know if using the glass obvious he's going to [TS]

00:22:00   literally make the color car closer to the service I'm just not sure if it [TS]

00:22:03   whatever that may be the glasses just dinner on the laptops or whatever but [TS]

00:22:08   that as they can approach that it was just kind of something when the fused [TS]

00:22:12   glass on the iPhone for whatever that brought in a little bit closer but I [TS]

00:22:17   still like the first read an iPhone did not give me the startling impression [TS]

00:22:22   that the first read MacBook Pro gave me of like the color being on the surface [TS]

00:22:25   of it looking like some sort of mock-up that someone had me and with you know [TS]

00:22:30   with layers of finally laid down paint on the surface of the screen pixels and [TS]

00:22:37   and also an unsuspecting of soils 13 inch MacBook Pro and iPhone 2 15 inch [TS]

00:22:44   since last summer so you know it's not like I'm not like totally amazed easily [TS]

00:22:50   by Redmond stuff anymore cuz I have this awesome laptop but the 13 inch I looked [TS]

00:22:54   at that you know what this is a fantastic computer and I picked it up it [TS]

00:22:58   was it was light it was small I I tried the higher resolution screen modes cuz [TS]

00:23:04   it one of the problems with 13 inch screen is at its base mode is it doubled [TS]

00:23:09   version of only 1280 by 800 which is a pretty terrible screen resolution for us [TS]

00:23:15   for space on the screen [TS]

00:23:17   you really don't get much better that I bumped up and it goes to a simulated [TS]

00:23:20   1440 1688 and I found both of them surprisingly usable in the sixties [TS]

00:23:27   that's that's pretty impressive that's not how I run the 15 most of the time [TS]

00:23:31   you know i'm glad you brought that up because I did the same thing I did a [TS]

00:23:35   very briefly in in granted this is based on a sum total of five minutes of use [TS]

00:23:39   but I thought to myself to some wonder if the high res mode is livable and [TS]

00:23:43   again my eyes are pretty terrible I can see my high res non retina MacBook Pro [TS]

00:23:48   15 inch I read a macro pretty well but if you get me more than I don't know to [TS]

00:23:54   three feet away things are getting blurry and i cant read anything and so I [TS]

00:23:58   figured everything would be microscopic but I had the exact same impression and [TS]

00:24:01   in fact I would even go so far as to say that if I were to buy a computer [TS]

00:24:05   tomorrow after that five-minute experience but I would really consider [TS]

00:24:09   doing is getting a 13 inch Retina MacBook Pro and just leaving it cranked [TS]

00:24:12   up ninety percent of the time it's certainly a very compelling option and I [TS]

00:24:18   struck me as I was there that here I was looking at these two models the 27 inch [TS]

00:24:24   iMac and 13 retina MacBook Pro neither works particularly new at this point I [TS]

00:24:30   mean the iMac is now three months old before even when it came out December [TS]

00:24:34   officially so it's like four months old the retina MacBook Pro 13 is like six [TS]

00:24:40   months old [TS]

00:24:41   you know these things are not new at all and yet this is the first time I've seen [TS]

00:24:45   them and I was so blown away by how good both of them where I I really thought [TS]

00:24:48   like you know I'm or 15 inch guy but that's unusual just like I'm more of a [TS]

00:24:54   Mac Pro guy and most people like IMAX and seems to computers taking that both [TS]

00:25:01   of them are such awesome choices that I think the 27 inch iMac is by far the [TS]

00:25:07   best all-in-one desktop I've ever seen in my life [TS]

00:25:13   such a great choice it's so fast it's so capable it's so good fusion drive it's [TS]

00:25:18   so good and that screen is incredible [TS]

00:25:21   everything's great about the 39 of 40 very similar it's so good it's so fast [TS]

00:25:26   it's small it's light I would much rather have that than a 13 inch MacBook [TS]

00:25:30   Air and I love the MacBook Air and iPhone two of them [TS]

00:25:34   screens now really looking yeah not good they were never good like the air [TS]

00:25:39   screens never had good viewing angle they never had high contrast I knew what [TS]

00:25:43   he wanted me back whenever now they just look they just embarrassing [TS]

00:25:46   and and and the weight difference isn't that big between 13 and 11 sure that [TS]

00:25:51   your only options the air that's a very different size but you know here was [TS]

00:25:55   looking at these two awesome computers very easily could you say that that the [TS]

00:26:00   iMac is the best I've ever made and the 38 right now is the best time ever made [TS]

00:26:05   i mean that those are slightly arguable but only slightly [TS]

00:26:09   it's a very these are two very awesome computers and yet I like I never even [TS]

00:26:16   went to see them which to me five years ago it's an insane and the whole and the [TS]

00:26:23   press mostly glossed over them you know they they were news for about a day each [TS]

00:26:27   and and and and that was about it and like here we are with these awesome [TS]

00:26:32   amazing models of Max and we don't care where samples and innovating and what it [TS]

00:26:38   you know what I've done for us lately and we're complaining about iPhones not [TS]

00:26:42   being big enough for having a new enough skin on the interface and all this crap [TS]

00:26:46   and they're making things that even as recently as like three or four years ago [TS]

00:26:51   we would have cared so much more about how great these new Mac models are and [TS]

00:26:57   now we barely carried all I still care yet we still care but in the grand [TS]

00:27:03   scheme of things the press the public especially the tech press which is [TS]

00:27:06   disaster at this point with Apple but you know it they're making such amazing [TS]

00:27:12   things it's like the Lucy Koh everything's amazing nobody's happy that [TS]

00:27:16   that bit like they do not like I'm on a MacBook Pros people work have my work is [TS]

00:27:21   finally buying Macs several years after I bought when i think is the first Mac [TS]

00:27:26   into the company and so is one of the hottest people to get in some people are [TS]

00:27:29   asking me for advice and one which max they could buy a laptop and it comes [TS]

00:27:34   down to like should I get a MacBook Pro and air and you would think that's a [TS]

00:27:37   no-brainer but I have been hesitant to recommend the current generation MacBook [TS]

00:27:44   Pro retina that's what they're looking at looking at the standard res ones [TS]

00:27:47   because of the four to two factors one is that the GPU can barely handle that [TS]

00:27:54   screen to the max res and that will just take care of itself with the next CPU [TS]

00:27:58   and chipset we all know [TS]

00:27:59   GPUs right so like that makes me say okay that's a first generation thank you [TS]

00:28:04   wanna be the first on your block damn thing you get it but it's not like it's [TS]

00:28:07   it's not you know it's not a deal breaker but it's like you are at the at [TS]

00:28:12   the ragged edge of what that GPU can handle the integrated so that's the [TS]

00:28:17   reason the way and the second one is the guy who sit across from me got the 15 [TS]

00:28:21   inch and you know I saw firsthand the image retention issues that that screen [TS]

00:28:27   had and I also saw firsthand his frustration at like would you take the [TS]

00:28:31   Apple store they put the checkerboard pattern 15 minutes and if you don't see [TS]

00:28:34   your attention by the block but like I saw it in daily use like you could see [TS]

00:28:38   his mail window in the background when it was no longer there were happy [TS]

00:28:41   routinely and in a way that would make me tear my hair out and so for those two [TS]

00:28:46   reasons i picking up we know that the GPU on its gonna be solved NextGen so [TS]

00:28:51   that's a reason to wait now I hope the next round maybe even some to 13 inch I [TS]

00:28:55   know but I hope the next round of display as they get will not have an [TS]

00:28:59   engine issue because Apple does have a policy like to have their lower [TS]

00:29:02   checkerboard testing if your thing they also they give you a new screen but it's [TS]

00:29:06   like it's not it's not a manufacturing defect that's just the nature of the [TS]

00:29:10   screen and I think they've sort of constructed a test that like will [TS]

00:29:13   replace the ones that exhibit at the worst but they're all gonna exhibited to [TS]

00:29:16   some degree make sure you have you seen this Marco on your screen back when [TS]

00:29:21   everyone was discovered missing last summer and fall I actually made my own [TS]

00:29:25   little tester for it on a web page and we can go to forget the Euro helpful and [TS]

00:29:32   entertaining and you know it shows checkerboard that the for like five [TS]

00:29:35   minutes then turns off and goes to grab whatever and you can see and so when I [TS]

00:29:39   run this test on and I can see the artifacts art and artifacts but I've [TS]

00:29:42   never seen them any kind of regular use it so I minor case of it and so enjoy it [TS]

00:29:49   for me to go through the hassle of getting it repaired and going without [TS]

00:29:53   things like I don't think you'd end up with a better screen in fact you could [TS]

00:29:56   possibly end up with the worst one because I don't think it's like I said [TS]

00:29:58   it's not a manufacturing defects just that's just the way this particular crop [TS]

00:30:02   of the generation of screens is he had the worst were like the checkerboard [TS]

00:30:05   wasn't wasn't the worst thing the worst things seem to be [TS]

00:30:08   I don't know who's this particular shades of gray hair color is about [TS]

00:30:11   particular windows that were on screen for a long time those with stake in the [TS]

00:30:15   checkerboard for just faintly visible but you could like clearly see you know [TS]

00:30:19   the Compu some other window like it's quite pure white and black may not be [TS]

00:30:25   the thing that sets it off you can see the checkerboard is too but like all [TS]

00:30:29   that makes me think like these are first generation models in in so many respects [TS]

00:30:35   and if you could possibly wait what I told everybody is like here in the pros [TS]

00:30:38   and cons that screen is gonna look way better than the air screen this great [TS]

00:30:42   care is gonna be way lighter than that fifteen-inch you know thing that you're [TS]

00:30:45   considering if you can possibly wait until the next round of prose you did [TS]

00:30:49   you make it is it is also way faster and like this there are many advantages but [TS]

00:30:55   like it's it's a toss up because I really do love my eyes got the 13 inch [TS]

00:31:00   and I really do like the air despite the terrible screen I really do all the [TS]

00:31:04   advantages of it like it's a dead heat between shoulda by Rainer shoulda [TS]

00:31:08   shoulda by not so I feel like I rarely recommend like totally don't buy the [TS]

00:31:15   first generation but in many cases it's been true like if you had sworn somebody [TS]

00:31:19   off the first generation time book that was the right decision and I feel like [TS]

00:31:23   warning people off the first generation of these 2 1513 but the first generation [TS]

00:31:28   15 inch MacBook Pro or any people often that is the right call at this point I [TS]

00:31:33   mean early not visit the mondaq get it fine but like I feel like it's to [TS]

00:31:38   compromise where is the iMac for I don't think there's any reason to be warned [TS]

00:31:41   often that I feel like it's a it's a next iteration of amateur attack that [TS]

00:31:44   doesn't have any of these drawbacks except that we're looking bulge in the [TS]

00:31:48   back and as you know all thumbs up so I'm I'm patiently waiting for the next [TS]

00:31:52   round as I'm you know I'm sure the next round of not process going to be like [TS]

00:31:55   all that's the one to get I just hope they saw the screen because I'm [TS]

00:31:58   particularly sensitive to visual screen issues like I got my my 22 inch Apple [TS]

00:32:04   Cinema Display the moment a little clearer on the side Alain Juppe like the [TS]

00:32:08   first big one dead pixels were big thing on that when I was like please let me [TS]

00:32:12   get a display that doesn't have any dead pixels are least likely not see the dead [TS]

00:32:16   pixels I had my ability to not look [TS]

00:32:18   for them I don't want to see him just don't tell me that but I immediately saw [TS]

00:32:23   my like two hot pixels and they were not within the range that would replace it [TS]

00:32:27   he said that monitor is really expensive that that would drive me crazy I i've [TS]

00:32:32   been very lucky to have never had a dead pixel and I used actively so I'm very [TS]

00:32:37   happy about that but that would drive me nuts or stuck pixels P right just as bad [TS]

00:32:43   but you know I think I disagree with you about about holding off on the current [TS]

00:32:46   generation right now I guess timing was you know that these were released last [TS]

00:32:51   June or the 50 most recent June this 31 October something that so you know now [TS]

00:32:58   we're all kinda mid-cycle especially with the 15 it's almost too late to be [TS]

00:33:03   buying one now and I guess is that the house will update this coming summer / [TS]

00:33:08   fall that's probably going to be the next CPUs that's probably when the dates [TS]

00:33:13   so as well does from from the the tech news area has a pretty major update and [TS]

00:33:23   so it's probably gonna be worth waiting for you can but besides just cycle [TS]

00:33:27   timing reasons I don't think there is there are major reasons why I would [TS]

00:33:31   recommend against the current generation retinas I agree with you that the GPU is [TS]

00:33:36   really really at at its boundary and and that that can be occasionally bad like [TS]

00:33:43   especially if you run at the upscale resolutions if you're on the 15 if you [TS]

00:33:47   run at the simulated 1924 the scene at sixty you know you will see slow slow [TS]

00:33:53   scrolling on certain things you will see that you when I feel like that's [TS]

00:33:57   inexcusable like you're buying their top of the line model it should scroll like [TS]

00:34:00   butter and it is great it's only money to the skeptical so I understand ok [TS]

00:34:07   that's not ideal but most people are not going to change its so I would not [TS]

00:34:16   recommend against it solely for that and so I don't know why I think [TS]

00:34:22   I would recommend air if you don't care about the screen but you know most [TS]

00:34:26   people don't because a year ago saying the 13 a chair is the best computer ever [TS]

00:34:30   made because it was at the time and all these options are so good i mean they're [TS]

00:34:35   really there used to be even even as recently as like three or four years ago [TS]

00:34:40   they used to be models in the lineup that you would say oh you really really [TS]

00:34:45   shouldn't buy that one and now I feel you look at the lineup and there's [TS]

00:34:49   there's very few of those I would say the only ones that I should that I would [TS]

00:34:53   recommend people definitely don't buy would be the the cheapo 13 inch old [TS]

00:34:59   model the thirty nation on retina MacBook Pro which is very popular [TS]

00:35:05   released was very popular before the right number but I think it still is the [TS]

00:35:10   optical drive write it has everything its chief as an optical drive and as you [TS]

00:35:14   know firewire like it has all the drives imports and it's cheap and it has [TS]

00:35:19   spinning disk hard drive so that keep it cheap also like it's a way to get a [TS]

00:35:23   bunch of stuff for really very little money I think I 1200 bucks to start so [TS]

00:35:29   it is very very cheap and so it's hard for a lot of people to justify the [TS]

00:35:34   premiums or the compromises from the other models however that model has the [TS]

00:35:38   worst screen I've ever seen in a laptop in the last five years and the fact [TS]

00:35:43   they're still shipping a 13 inch laptop with a 1280 by 800 screen which is [TS]

00:35:49   roughly the same pixel area as the 11 inch MacBook Air it's a similar [TS]

00:35:54   resolution but not quite there were 11 inches wider and shorter but similar [TS]

00:35:57   that's inexcusable to me and it's such a terrible resolution and other than that [TS]

00:36:04   though there really like you can get pretty much any model and be fine even [TS]

00:36:09   if you get that one you don't care about the screen space then you're fine too I [TS]

00:36:13   get there aren't really any models that have like dramatically too little RAM [TS]

00:36:18   stock or some major flaw you know a lot of the 13 inch the 13 inch nylon resin [TS]

00:36:26   seeped around thing it's [TS]

00:36:30   400 rpm spinning disk at this point is not like I that model is just on the [TS]

00:36:37   borderline of herding Apple's reputation if you like because the experience of [TS]

00:36:42   using that and using given even the cheapest air you can get is like night [TS]

00:36:45   and day just because of the SSD like anything with spinning disk especially a [TS]

00:36:49   slow I'm assuming there are 400 rpm drug problem that is not that's not the [TS]

00:36:54   experience to the rest of us are having with our Macs and be like they feel like [TS]

00:36:58   they are left out of you know that's not what it's like when we use our computers [TS]

00:37:02   you know you're stuck with Wayne million years and seeing the beach ball and apps [TS]

00:37:06   taken years to launch in Stockton maybe that's acceptable to them but it's a [TS]

00:37:09   shame like it doesn't make give people because once you step up to that SSD [TS]

00:37:14   experience there's no going back [TS]

00:37:16   I can really changes that you were to go back to see what's wrong with this [TS]

00:37:20   computer icon bouncing on the dock so much why is this is relaunching safari [TS]

00:37:25   in opening its five windows taking year and a day all spinning disk just know [TS]

00:37:30   it's no good so I really hope those things either get a SSD is relieved the [TS]

00:37:35   line ASAP but like what would you recommend somebody by if they if they [TS]

00:37:40   want a reasonably priced Apple laptop you know where their value as a priority [TS]

00:37:45   for them and also storage space is there is a priority for them cuz that's the [TS]

00:37:50   problem with the SSDs is that there is no way to get cheap large as D story I [TS]

00:37:55   feel like the areas of cross that threshold and now it was reinforced to [TS]

00:37:58   me when I had a neighbor come over here and she had an old laptop it was like I [TS]

00:38:03   was it the old white MacBooks yeah the white MacBook and and she was looking to [TS]

00:38:10   get a new on and I was telling her about the options you can get an error and [TS]

00:38:13   they have a sixties but they're smaller and more expensive and blah blah blah [TS]

00:38:16   blah blah blah no optical drive the parts the whole nine yards and just like [TS]

00:38:21   you know it took the size of my stuff whatever so I should look at her machine [TS]

00:38:25   and see how bigger iPhoto library is it was nine gigabytes yeah that is thing [TS]

00:38:30   you can get this thing with a 250 gigabyte SSD for not that much money and [TS]

00:38:36   take them is what stock now you're fine like I think we've crossed we present [TS]

00:38:42   our children 13 shares still might go to Mac and I that's another machine I want [TS]

00:38:46   people off I said don't don't get the 13 inch non-runner you get it get an air [TS]

00:38:51   your stuff will fit you'll be fine and like i mean obviously I tell them off [TS]

00:38:55   limits to how much the check when I'm always amazed at how little stuff people [TS]

00:39:00   have angry and it's funny you bring up the sixties worth of discussion because [TS]

00:39:05   I remember I don't know what it was but marco was one of the first people I knew [TS]

00:39:09   that was going on [TS]

00:39:11   humongous grants are happy rants and evangelizing SSDs now I was I would look [TS]

00:39:17   at these prices and think Oh my god they can be worth it it's just it can't be [TS]

00:39:21   that much quicker it's it's it's so little space for so much money on wanna [TS]

00:39:24   do it so I had and have a 15 inch antique IRA's anti-glare MacBook Pro [TS]

00:39:30   with the platter in it and then work got me basically the exact same machine and [TS]

00:39:35   then immediately put a nasty and then put the platter and an external [TS]

00:39:41   enclosure and now that that's happened I almost never use my personal machine [TS]

00:39:47   with Plateau Dr because it's unusable to exactly what you said John I can't use [TS]

00:39:52   it it's so slow nothing happens if I'm using the computer really what I'm doing [TS]

00:39:56   is waiting for the computer and occasionally getting something useful [TS]

00:40:00   done in the ten seconds at the hard drive isn't seeking for something else [TS]

00:40:04   to do [TS]

00:40:05   it's unusable so if there's anyone listening that is as cheap as I am and [TS]

00:40:09   doesn't think analysist is worth it I can assure you you're wrong and you [TS]

00:40:13   should get one and it will change your world people could be in my situation [TS]

00:40:15   where I am I do have a lot of did a lot of computer packrat type thing you know [TS]

00:40:19   where you keep a lot of stuff you have a lot of movies lot of photos and it just [TS]

00:40:23   doesn't fit system in the first SSD I bought was 480 gigabytes to tell you [TS]

00:40:28   about my threshold was before I cities cities became came viable for me 'cause [TS]

00:40:33   forget about hundred 28226 now I just this not it's pointless for me to get to [TS]

00:40:37   dissolve before fusion drive but at this point you know for my next match my all [TS]

00:40:44   my stuff won't fit on a society and even if you can drive didn't exist I would [TS]

00:40:49   still say okay for the next match just gonna go as St and figure out how to do [TS]

00:40:53   my own with tiered storage thing but with Fusion Drive it's a no-brainer I [TS]

00:40:57   mean people have a choice in this fantasy going away but like we are we [TS]

00:41:02   are past the point where even the most conservative person with the most data [TS]

00:41:05   should have an SSD somewhere in the mix in whatever next machine there by like [TS]

00:41:10   it's we've we've cleared that hurdle in for regular people I think we could have [TS]

00:41:14   much sooner than I had thought I didn't realize how little data people have her [TS]

00:41:18   maybe they delete stuff the photos of your kids I don't know nine gigabyte [TS]

00:41:23   seem small with my hundred-plus gigabyte iPhoto library of my two kids over the [TS]

00:41:28   course of eight years he might also like a lot of people are shooting RAW then I [TS]

00:41:33   shall not sure I don't have a fancy camera this is uncertain jpegs room [TS]

00:41:37   ready point and shoot camera has a distinct too many you had a hundred [TS]

00:41:40   jpegs yes that's impressive that that's really impressive I don't delete enough [TS]

00:41:47   pictures from on that note the service sponsored our first sponsor here in ATP [TS]

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00:42:07   photos if you really want to you can post your own website you can make a [TS]

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00:42:39   have to worry about coding all the extra mile by hand cuz they have all these [TS]

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00:42:46   pick one of those our site ATP . FM is hosted by Squarespace you can go take a [TS]

00:42:50   look at one of their default templates and and if you want to you can you can [TS]

00:42:56   inject code yourself if you want to customize stuff you can inject your own [TS]

00:42:59   CSS and JavaScript it's really fantastic so [TS]

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00:43:10   three so that's ATP III you can save 10% off their already low price plans which [TS]

00:43:16   are in about 10 bucks a month check out Squarespace that's where space.com and [TS]

00:43:20   thanks to them for supporting our show then realize how awesome our sponsor [TS]

00:43:24   coupon codes would be three letters I was wondering if people are going to [TS]

00:43:29   misspell mistyping neutral something ATP great friend and a TV 333 letter domain [TS]

00:43:36   but a two-letter extension that was that surprised me I mean [TS]

00:43:39   FM is pretty wide open because it's like 80 bucks a year to register one so I'm [TS]

00:43:46   not that surprised that it was available on FM but still only three letters mean [TS]

00:43:50   that is pretty good you don't even need a link shortener if if people still [TS]

00:43:56   2010 but we don't even need that anymore because we have we have ATP . FM I mean [TS]

00:44:05   that's pretty great so I want to mention about my mall trip today before I move [TS]

00:44:10   on I also stopped down at the Microsoft Store on the way out because I mean [TS]

00:44:15   c'mon you have to because you love that place so much have to be fair and [TS]

00:44:20   balanced you know you're there we read what you said about us fortunately they [TS]

00:44:25   didn't recognize me they did however remember how I had the picture of the [TS]

00:44:30   windows 8 letters and the floor and had to have a guy stationed there tell [TS]

00:44:33   people what step over them their fix that problem now by by putting up big [TS]

00:44:38   lake floor to ceiling glass strips that that attacks at the floor level to those [TS]

00:44:44   letters and so now it's like a big sign and that was probably always the plan [TS]

00:44:48   these wasn't done in time when I was there so now they no longer have to have [TS]

00:44:51   an employee stationed there to tell them one step over them so that's a progress [TS]

00:44:54   at sea know when they update [TS]

00:44:58   and one that I noticed immediately that the store first of all it was empty but [TS]

00:45:02   that said I was there on a Wednesday at like one o'clock in the afternoon so I [TS]

00:45:07   can't I can't fault them for that the tire Lehigh mall traffic time as far as [TS]

00:45:12   I know but the mood in the store among the employees because they are the only [TS]

00:45:18   ones there was so low-key in when I was there for the surface RT launch which is [TS]

00:45:24   also I believe the store's grand opening or very close to it [TS]

00:45:28   employees were really like energized and you could tell they had all been like [TS]

00:45:33   jazzed up by some training exercise to be all high energy and and high pressure [TS]

00:45:39   and he let me show you this cool thing the surface RT can do you know all that [TS]

00:45:42   stuff today there was none of that it was it was like a funeral home in there [TS]

00:45:46   there were like there were only eight employees standing around doing nothing [TS]

00:45:49   I don't know what the staff is that bigger probably shouldn't be the [TS]

00:45:52   Microsoft is really good at wasting money so maybe maybe that's just have to [TS]

00:45:56   figure out the retail think quite yet but wait overstaffed but the salesman [TS]

00:46:02   came over to me and I guess the one guy who designed the next walk-in as [TS]

00:46:07   everyone else around he came over use like can I help you with anything that [TS]

00:46:12   was poorly drab no energy at all just looking around [TS]

00:46:16   ok and he just like understood he walked away it was so so different from the [TS]

00:46:25   last time I was there and [TS]

00:46:27   so much less energy and what i really what I went in there to see was the [TS]

00:46:32   surface pro hadn't seen that in person yet and I was curious about and they [TS]

00:46:37   don't make it easy to find the store still had a lot of surface RT's in like [TS]

00:46:43   the main middle like when you first walk into tables you see those two have [TS]

00:46:47   surface RT's but it was way fewer than before they fill the rest of the story [TS]

00:46:51   up with Windows phones and other laptops and other people's tablets things like [TS]

00:46:57   from Samsung and Toshiba [TS]

00:46:58   like all their partners they're filling up the store with their stuff so that [TS]

00:47:02   the surface is actually being significantly d emphasizing the stories [TS]

00:47:07   I thought was interesting how big the right move didn't sign that well but [TS]

00:47:11   interesting nonetheless and then kind of a shame for them and and the big thing [TS]

00:47:14   was the surface pro there was no sign for it there is no big demo of a surface [TS]

00:47:20   pro being a school laptop that is like a tablet there was nothing like that it [TS]

00:47:24   was there were two table side by side of surface RT's with four tablets on each [TS]

00:47:29   of them on one of them one of those tablets was surface pro and the only way [TS]

00:47:34   you could tell was to look at little like tag on each one to see a little [TS]

00:47:39   lost an upside to see what each one was and there was no calling out of this [TS]

00:47:46   thing is actually something kind of interesting that you might want to look [TS]

00:47:49   at you might wanna know about you know relative to ever get a laptop that this [TS]

00:47:53   is interesting [TS]

00:47:54   noting that office service pro there was only one of them as far as I could tell [TS]

00:47:58   the whole story these [TS]

00:47:59   I could find and so I thought it was it was weird that it looks like Microsoft [TS]

00:48:05   has already given up on the surface honestly and maybe that's not true but [TS]

00:48:08   that's how it looks in the retail store first gen surface Pro is con is like a [TS]

00:48:13   sacrificial lamb because they know the surface pro they don't they [TS]

00:48:19   the power envelope for the the processors they can fit in that thing [TS]

00:48:22   it's not great battery life is not grades under by like that's like to get [TS]

00:48:27   something out of the second generation service pro should be significantly more [TS]

00:48:30   interesting as a as a complete product rather than just curiosity I hope so [TS]

00:48:36   really does what the store looked like to me you the first time when there is [TS]

00:48:39   it was very service [TS]

00:48:41   too heavy and that was interesting and and I think the surface RT was was a [TS]

00:48:45   more successful product then they could have kept the story that way and that [TS]

00:48:50   would have had a lot of long-term value for them now though the Microsoft Store [TS]

00:48:54   doesn't really have any value of like a Best Buy just a whole bunch of computers [TS]

00:48:58   from different people on a row kinda haphazardly laid out nothing really call [TS]

00:49:02   attention to more than the others saw it here buyer walking in there who doesn't [TS]

00:49:07   already know you're looking for [TS]

00:49:09   there's not a lot of reasons it's not very welcoming its not that it isn't a [TS]

00:49:14   very good like cold like first time experience to go in there anymore [TS]

00:49:19   because it's using as to why you should be in there and that of any other [TS]

00:49:23   computer store it still has far fewer products than a Best Buy and that is [TS]

00:49:27   advantageous because if you if someone goes into a Best Buy you are salted on [TS]

00:49:32   all sides by a million flashing blinking things only some of which are tablet [TS]

00:49:37   computers only so much for Microsoft right you going to the Microsoft Store [TS]

00:49:41   even though they carry all those other things you're not gonna look at the TV [TS]

00:49:44   is you're not going to look at the washing machines you're not going to [TS]

00:49:47   look through the racks of DVDs and blu-rays or whatever you're not going to [TS]

00:49:51   you know you're going to you're gonna look at tablets and there's going to be [TS]

00:49:55   a variety of them and they're emphasizing the fact that we have [TS]

00:49:57   tablets that are kinda like PCs but kinda like tablets and so at the very [TS]

00:50:01   least until like tell their leases are up on the historic they get some benefit [TS]

00:50:07   of making people aware that Microsoft just created this product it's like an [TS]

00:50:11   iPad but you can use like a Windows computer and the most recent thing [TS]

00:50:15   that's brought it up on my radar and others come up on your radar is the guy [TS]

00:50:20   guy picked up a service pro and tried using it for sketching and he wrote this [TS]

00:50:24   review of it on the site and that's an application that like the car makers and [TS]

00:50:30   automatic not and not doing what you do why did Microsoft emphasized that wanted [TS]

00:50:37   to show people dancing and cleaning the stupid keyboard not that artists are [TS]

00:50:42   like a big market heiko finally we have the hardest thing but he was interested [TS]

00:50:46   in it because he heard it has a stylist and it's a Windows computer as a [TS]

00:50:49   pressure-sensitive stylus and its portable and you've been drawn into [TS]

00:50:52   unlike the iPad you don't have to use like a capacitive stylus type of thing [TS]

00:50:56   and so as an artist is like he tried sketching on the iPad into wasn't you [TS]

00:51:01   know what you want PCs used to like a Wacom tablet or Wacom announced that the [TS]

00:51:06   Centex which is a different experience in using this beard stubble capacitor [TS]

00:51:09   things and special pressure sensitive and everything so is it ok I'll try this [TS]

00:51:14   link so it was you know you could sketch with it it was small and portable right [TS]

00:51:19   system software issues because Photoshop doesn't support it with the pressure [TS]

00:51:22   sensitive and stuff like that but it was a viable thing they're doing a bunch of [TS]

00:51:26   comments with it and the second thing was since he's a gamer his comments [TS]

00:51:29   about gaming you can play Windows games on it because it's a Windows computer [TS]

00:51:33   and install steam download a bunch of games play games and also use it for [TS]

00:51:38   sketching and there has never been any device like that where you can do those [TS]

00:51:42   two things are even you know one of those things can you play PC games on [TS]

00:51:47   something so small doesn't even have a keyboard like you know just a tiny touch [TS]

00:51:50   screen and can you use something schedule like a tablet with a stylist [TS]

00:51:54   that's an interesting angle it's not a mainstream angled not going to sell an [TS]

00:51:59   item like that but why wasn't there even one at emphasizing that because just [TS]

00:52:03   just this one you know semi famous person's post about this and getting [TS]

00:52:06   passed around read it and hacker news and stuff like that it has produced buzz [TS]

00:52:09   about the surface pro day terribly compromise poor battery life really [TS]

00:52:13   thick fan blows hot air in your hand you know first generation device that [TS]

00:52:18   Microsoft can seem to figure out what was interesting unique about and here's [TS]

00:52:23   one just one thing I'm sure there are other things that are you thinking about [TS]

00:52:25   it too that just it's a shame that Microsoft is not it's game on this yeah [TS]

00:52:32   it is your right that's something that Apple is not going to address that as [TS]

00:52:37   far as we can tell they're not going to address pressure-sensitive resistant [TS]

00:52:41   resistant touchscreens anytime soon if ever you know that's a major market [TS]

00:52:45   where like that actually matters a lot if you if you want to sketch on an iPad [TS]

00:52:50   it's gonna be way way better on a surface that screen and a concert was [TS]

00:52:56   obviously like that's a major difference and yeah you're right they don't didn't [TS]

00:53:00   want to do with that they they instead ignore that in their marketing and and [TS]

00:53:03   Gran Torino others not everybody wants to sketch but I feel like there are [TS]

00:53:07   enough things about the surface pro that make it different from an iPad that [TS]

00:53:12   Microsoft could be showing in their ads and could be pushing the marketing and [TS]

00:53:16   they're just not there they're trying to make it cool and hip and I can't imagine [TS]

00:53:19   it ever will be a pic to one they pick the attachable keyboard and that is a [TS]

00:53:23   distinctive thing but the chiro other there are other distinctive things about [TS]

00:53:27   it and like it so they may have a product they did so well in [TS]

00:53:31   differentiating like it really is a differentiated products and not a [TS]

00:53:35   wannabe iPad like it's not like the Nexus 7 or something like that but good [TS]

00:53:39   like it's it's really differentiated by Ken may be due to too much like the [TS]

00:53:44   style is it runs Windows it's got the desktop you can attach keeper maybe [TS]

00:53:47   that's too much but those are shared those are things that you can hang your [TS]

00:53:51   hat on an ad campaign and get the pic to one of them and kind of glad that it had [TS]

00:53:57   explained it just kind of clicks on a quickie thing like I know this is a [TS]

00:54:01   multi-stage campaign and it's gonna kick in with the other benefits later they [TS]

00:54:05   didn't know why people want to use them still waiting for that sixty-two kicking [TS]

00:54:08   our third or fourth when they have software problems to Windows 8 is kind [TS]

00:54:12   of a hodgepodge you know like it they don't have the total package but I think [TS]

00:54:18   there's enough there that would be really sad if that effort of this type [TS]

00:54:23   of product goes away because I really think there is definitely a place for [TS]

00:54:26   this type of program really I was I was proud of Microsoft they didn't do what [TS]

00:54:31   Google did and just make like I wanna be iPad you know yeah they they really did [TS]

00:54:36   do something different i mean that's with Windows Phone people have said that [TS]

00:54:40   and with as a people I mean it really is different it doesn't look like a total [TS]

00:54:45   ripoff of something else the way Android does honestly and I know we're gonna [TS]

00:54:50   hear from people but not me [TS]

00:54:51   Android looks yes it has done some original things but it has ripped off so [TS]

00:54:56   much from from other operating systems mostly iOS that you kind of feel that [TS]

00:55:02   the whole way through this is kind of a cheaper boss whereas Windows Phone [TS]

00:55:05   actually feels dramatically different in most ways in most certainly more ways [TS]

00:55:11   than Android does and and there's a lot of them a lot of good and bad I mean so [TS]

00:55:15   but also while I was there they have devoted a lot of their store space now [TS]

00:55:21   to Windows Phone which is probably wise as Windows Phone has a pretty poor [TS]

00:55:26   retail presence otherwise as a Microsoft stores it was a problem if you go into [TS]

00:55:30   Verizon store and you asked for last year when his phone there try to talk [TS]

00:55:35   you out of it and then try to talk you into an Android phone you know they get [TS]

00:55:40   better from arising from an Android phone for a few reasons so winners as [TS]

00:55:44   always had issues at cell phone retail with Windows 8 and and so now I should [TS]

00:55:50   Microsoft Windows sorry so I could use in their stores in apush Windows Phone [TS]

00:55:55   aggressively and that's that's wise so I got a chance to use them to look at them [TS]

00:55:59   and first of all I think it's worth mentioning that every Windows Phone they [TS]

00:56:05   had in the store had at least what looked like a four and a half inch [TS]

00:56:09   diagonal screen it was huge [TS]

00:56:11   every Windows Phone looked massive and it most of them with the Nokia 920 and [TS]

00:56:16   there were a few that the HTC eight or something like that so much that I don't [TS]

00:56:22   know people who know when his phone models in there were some Samsung things [TS]

00:56:25   and and some miscellaneous Windows Phone objects and mostly the Nokia 100 and all [TS]

00:56:34   of them are huge and I feel like you know in our previous discussions about a [TS]

00:56:38   potentially large iPhone in the future I feel it more than ever [TS]

00:56:44   Apple needs to do this because you look at any other line up of cell of [TS]

00:56:49   smartphones in any other store in a Verizon store in a Microsoft Store if [TS]

00:56:54   you can actually find one of those buttino any cell phone store you look at [TS]

00:56:56   the lineup and the iPhone looks really small and not necessarily good way I [TS]

00:57:01   look small by comparison and you know while while we can look at them we nerds [TS]

00:57:06   a lot of times at least we can look at them and say oh it's great it's my [TS]

00:57:10   pocket better you know I don't wanna phone that big the fact is those other [TS]

00:57:14   phones look like they're better in a store and its similar you know we talked [TS]

00:57:18   about TVs earlier the house TVs as john you've you've really raised about they [TS]

00:57:23   always have these ridiculous settings in the stores to have to attract people in [TS]

00:57:26   the store even though [TS]

00:57:27   in real life they're they're better off not having that kind of setting a better [TS]

00:57:31   off having something else or are different priorities are different [TS]

00:57:34   different levels of things that doesn't matter in in sales you know it if people [TS]

00:57:41   are seeing all these phones that are a little bit too big for their pockets [TS]

00:57:46   they don't really realize that this is the time to buy it they see a nice big [TS]

00:57:51   screen it looks really good and it's it's gotta be really hard for Apple to [TS]

00:57:56   keep competing with when it's the smallest phone there and has a small [TS]

00:58:01   screen there that that they're gonna be some people who were gonna buy it for [TS]

00:58:04   that because it's small and sleek and thin and light in your pocket but I feel [TS]

00:58:08   that number is really small compared to the number of people who are going to be [TS]

00:58:12   swayed towards larger fun devices just cause they look nicer in the store I [TS]

00:58:19   really to be honest I don't have anything to add because I just don't [TS]

00:58:23   have any interest in a bigger phone and I know and that's the thing is anytime I [TS]

00:58:29   say don't have interest in something I end up getting it in under three years [TS]

00:58:32   later see you like you have no interest in a bit of all the things like that [TS]

00:58:36   which rose to you how I guess just 19 [TS]

00:58:40   typically the more negative my reaction is to something the more I end up [TS]

00:58:44   falling in love with it later take max take my iPhone take my BMW I mean these [TS]

00:58:50   are all things that I poo pooed in years past and now couldn't imagine living [TS]

00:58:54   with living without so my asst another great example so the fact that I'm [TS]

00:58:59   saying is probably a good sign that in a in a few months because I am due to [TS]

00:59:04   upgrade this year's in a few months when the seven-inch iPhone comes out in force [TS]

00:59:08   to get it cause it's the only wanted and then I get it I say to you guys holy God [TS]

00:59:12   you will not believe how awesome the seven-inch iPhone is I can't put in my [TS]

00:59:14   pocket it's looks like a break when I'm actually talking on the phone but oh man [TS]

00:59:19   I can get so much done on that screen is bigger than 9 2009 when he looked [TS]

00:59:24   ridiculously large in a store it look and and I i picked it up and I held my [TS]

00:59:31   hand with the joint security blanket the back but still I picked it up and you [TS]

00:59:34   know this is this [TS]

00:59:36   it's too big for me but not by a massive amount like it could be a little bit [TS]

00:59:42   smaller than that and still be substantially larger than the iPhone 5 [TS]

00:59:45   and it would be fine for my pocket and you know a lot of us in tech you know we [TS]

00:59:50   will see dismissive things like well you know I don't wanna I wanna Mac Pro but [TS]

00:59:56   for other people [TS]

00:59:57   the IMAX file it's always about the other people and it's generally not [TS]

01:00:01   agree attitude to have you don't understand you know what about something [TS]

01:00:05   is great and you can dismiss it as well somebody will find a use for this but [TS]

01:00:09   with the big but the bigger phones I think honestly I would probably get a [TS]

01:00:13   bigger iPhone if they had like I like the bigger screen on the iPhone 5 and if [TS]

01:00:18   they could make one even bigger than that while still maintaining a [TS]

01:00:21   reasonable pocket-sized the phone and I i do things a lot of middle ground [TS]

01:00:25   between 15 and 29 2010 a lot of middle ground there and have made a bigger [TS]

01:00:31   phone I'm not just saying that I think it would say well I'm saying I might [TS]

01:00:34   pick that one even if it had the same resolution as the iPhone 5 and the [TS]

01:00:39   pixels bigger even than I would still probably pick the bigger one I've been [TS]

01:00:43   asking friends that same question I've been saying so Apple comes out with a [TS]

01:00:48   slightly bigger phone and they keep selling the iPhone 5 size one which one [TS]

01:00:54   would you get and then like the modifier questions ok does one of the resolutions [TS]

01:00:58   the same whatever the resolution is different to that change your calculus [TS]

01:01:01   and I've been getting about fifty fifty with people saying that they would stick [TS]

01:01:05   with the iPhone 5 size and they would get the bigger one you know people are [TS]

01:01:08   actually gonna do and I think at this point they the Super Apple nerds I'm [TS]

01:01:13   talking to her if anything biased toward sticking with the iPhone 5 have because [TS]

01:01:17   they really liked it and I'm giving them a hypothetical the product doesn't exist [TS]

01:01:21   but I think the outlook for sales of the larger phone even among a super tech [TS]

01:01:28   nerds look pretty bright yeah definitely I would say the same thing and I have [TS]

01:01:33   been asked anybody cuz I'm not that much of a nerd John but I really do think you [TS]

01:01:39   know I can see not only do I see this as I guess somebody might want that [TS]

01:01:44   I see this as I would actually want that to a degree you know depends on how to [TS]

01:01:49   do it of course but you know I don't think I don't think it being the same [TS]

01:01:53   resolution are not really matter that much in the grand scheme of things I [TS]

01:01:56   don't think it really matters it would matter to a few weeks but it definitely [TS]

01:02:00   matters but it's not a deal breaker I don't think but it did it's one of those [TS]

01:02:05   things where it's going to be one of those that can go back things where it's [TS]

01:02:09   annoying you're gonna hate it cuz you can have to redo your layouts for your [TS]

01:02:12   apps and everything but then once you get that thing in and see how much more [TS]

01:02:18   stuff you can see even if it's just like one extra little sliver of stuff it [TS]

01:02:21   makes little it will make a difference 10 yeah actually use that space as long [TS]

01:02:28   as they don't straighten you want then you go back to you it's like when you go [TS]

01:02:30   back to the iPhone 4 size screen hour for and you feel like we're the rest of [TS]

01:02:35   the screen go and it's not that big of a difference I got one centimeter little [TS]

01:02:38   strip but the bottle indicated it is not that big of a difference but it's not [TS]

01:02:43   there it just feels like your world has been truncated you know so I i think [TS]

01:02:48   it'll be the same effect even if we just get an extra sliver pixel there you know [TS]

01:02:52   I mean maybe maybe 1080p is the inevitable that like no fighting that [TS]

01:02:59   resolution because it's such a comedian matchup with television screens which is [TS]

01:03:02   basically means who cares if it's magic TV screens but just like one of those [TS]

01:03:05   things like stock markets around numbers may just be that that's ballpark of how [TS]

01:03:11   you get a reasonable size iPhone it's not jug antic but not too small and you [TS]

01:03:17   get around you know 400 something dpi can you fit attend a tu mama just just [TS]

01:03:22   go to 1080 I don't think Apple will go to 1080p but like us while the Android [TS]

01:03:26   phones are doing you can see the attraction to it like it that's that's [TS]

01:03:29   lots into it may be a little bit higher maybe having like 500 dpi maybe that's [TS]

01:03:34   crazy maybe you know maybe doesn't work out but that is that seems to be the [TS]

01:03:38   sweet spot for these super high-end Android phones Apple is going to be [TS]

01:03:41   smaller than that [TS]

01:03:42   that and maybe not even this generation but that's that's where I think things [TS]

01:03:47   are going well I don't I don't think the resolution of the center for the matters [TS]

01:03:50   that much honestly as we said earlier people don't really see right now that [TS]

01:03:53   much like on average most people don't really notice a difference as far as we [TS]

01:03:57   can tell a lot of people don't I think whether your screen is 300 dpi or 500 [TS]

01:04:03   dpi there's almost nobody will tell the difference the the big events there is [TS]

01:04:09   definitely you know in marketing and spec comparison things like that [TS]

01:04:11   certainly that's that helps both Android has received the market most people [TS]

01:04:16   don't buy on spec comparisons with Android they buy on how it looks in the [TS]

01:04:21   store [TS]

01:04:22   dealing at retail you know there are some people who buy the specs but not [TS]

01:04:26   most likely they're still using you know a lot of them using the OLED screen [TS]

01:04:32   stellar and some of them are still I think people are people still using that [TS]

01:04:35   pentile thing we don't even have real pics I hope he doesn't like all these [TS]

01:04:40   things that cost saving things because they have this likely they'll compete on [TS]

01:04:45   price by giving you a lower quality screen that is talked about selling a [TS]

01:04:48   retina how hard it is to sell rent or regular people trying to sell people [TS]

01:04:53   like color saturation and contrast and viewing angles that is you know and we [TS]

01:04:59   appreciate that Apple cares about those things and its display is its monitors [TS]

01:05:03   and it's you know handheld devices other people do not yell yeah definitely [TS]

01:05:07   and so like I i hope i buy hold the line on that but that's like that's one of [TS]

01:05:13   the boat anchors at that dragged behind them as they attempt to compete we will [TS]

01:05:17   continue to hold our screens like you know our screens are bigger but they're [TS]

01:05:21   better that's what we keep saying this is the best screen involve a blind like [TS]

01:05:24   it really is really nice green but now you have to drag me behind you as you [TS]

01:05:27   try to compete on price on power on on resolution on all those things that you [TS]

01:05:33   want to compete on while still not sinking to their level in terms of loud [TS]

01:05:38   just give me high dpi resolution and good enough yet so I had a topic I [TS]

01:05:46   wanted to ask you guys about if you need a review of something more pressing I'm [TS]

01:05:53   actually it may end up this is a thirty second thing [TS]

01:05:56   but I'm really intrigued by the garage band released today and its support for [TS]

01:06:02   ya so for those of you who may not know what that this is about so Apple [TS]

01:06:11   obviously has a garage band app for iOS and a few months ago I don't remember [TS]

01:06:17   exactly when some group of people came up with this app called audio bus and [TS]

01:06:22   the general premise of it was you can chain audio sources together it such [TS]

01:06:28   that different apps on your iPad or iPhone game one can feed audio into [TS]

01:06:34   another which can filter it can feed audio into something else or at least [TS]

01:06:38   that's my understanding the premise and this is really interesting because it's [TS]

01:06:41   in her apt communication in a way that really shouldn't be allowed and I think [TS]

01:06:48   my understanding and three guys feel free to write me my understanding of how [TS]

01:06:50   this works as its combination of background audio API the the apps [TS]

01:06:55   allowing audio to be mixed so if you think about like when you have [TS]

01:06:58   navigation on and music on you know you can still hear the navigation while the [TS]

01:07:03   music is on and additionally apparently it's a local network protocols well as [TS]

01:07:08   far as I understood is that at least reasonably accurate at a high level I [TS]

01:07:12   said I don't even know what how they're doing I mean I assume back on audio is [TS]

01:07:15   involved to let them run indefinitely but I i mean they're not using URL [TS]

01:07:20   scheme that's for sure so I think they are in part but not not correct right [TS]

01:07:27   right so anyway so the latest version of GarageBand actually works with audio bus [TS]

01:07:33   and has included they use the audio bus SDK to do it and this to me is extremely [TS]

01:07:39   interesting because for a couple reasons firstly it's Apple getting on board with [TS]

01:07:43   a community community but a third party framework for lack of a better term and [TS]

01:07:50   I think that's very interesting and and I'm hoping that between you guys you can [TS]

01:07:54   point me to other examples of where this has happened the only one I can think of [TS]

01:07:57   is there a bastardized version of all the refresh [TS]

01:08:01   but otherwise I couldn't personally think of any examples of this and I'll [TS]

01:08:04   give you a chance and second to crack me when I thought that was interesting but [TS]

01:08:08   the other thing I thought was interesting and here's another sort of [TS]

01:08:12   tacit admission that inter-process communication is is it isn't it's a need [TS]

01:08:17   in iOS and something they need and something that we are we're all going to [TS]

01:08:20   want going forward and i know we've talked in the past about what was remote [TS]

01:08:25   view controllers and Wii people had discovered a few months ago when I was [TS]

01:08:29   six and I this both excites me in the sense that Apple's getting more on board [TS]

01:08:35   within a process communication but it also scares me a little of that there it [TS]

01:08:39   seems to me if they had a really awesome fix for this problem coming in Iowa 7 [TS]

01:08:45   wouldn't they have held this update to leverage that new thing is I think it's [TS]

01:08:52   something entirely different but actually I had an interesting idea when [TS]

01:08:56   he talked about this a little research on the show but I don't know if you have [TS]

01:09:00   ever seen this but apparently there exists I'm told stereo equipment like I [TS]

01:09:07   guess presumably high-end stereo equipment that has firmware and update [TS]

01:09:11   the firmware on the stereo equipment you put into special CD to the manufacturer [TS]

01:09:14   gives you and you play the audio CD and then it interprets these sounds as you [TS]

01:09:20   know the firmware update itself so this audio bus now we don't have to interact [TS]

01:09:27   communication but once everyone can listen on the audio bus if you can [TS]

01:09:31   encode the data that you want to transfer between applications as audio [TS]

01:09:34   and decoded on the other end there is no reason why you can't pass arbitrary [TS]

01:09:39   structures including no in memory objects or anything else you could [TS]

01:09:42   possibly want to do it for interact communication entirely through audio [TS]

01:09:46   provided you could move the speakers for am sure Apple would love to try to [TS]

01:09:50   approve your application if you choose to do in terms of communication that [TS]

01:09:53   this is the reason I don't think it's like they've held this because this is [TS]

01:09:58   not really interact communication this is really shared access to like audio [TS]

01:10:02   resources it's more like it's more like I like multiple application sharing like [TS]

01:10:07   the proximity sensor like 11 sound good [TS]

01:10:11   application to the audio system the fact that another application can pick up [TS]

01:10:14   that sound intercepted and before it gets through the rest of the audio [TS]

01:10:17   system using the background and stuff that is barely interactive communication [TS]

01:10:23   that's more like it emits more like an existing background API's for some small [TS]

01:10:29   part of your application can still be running and see what's going on in this [TS]

01:10:32   morning's going on systems and other things putting audio input into the [TS]

01:10:35   audio subsystem will let you get it before it goes out the speaker in a man [TS]

01:10:38   but that is a far cry from WI when I'm not running 10 case you you said you [TS]

01:10:44   looked at it briefly and it sounds like the way it works is vile local network [TS]

01:10:48   communication right it's not isn't over over audio buses itself it isn't it over [TS]

01:10:53   local network and that's again I read into a very briefly and candidly I'm [TS]

01:10:58   probably getting this totally wrong that's why this is also a casual but I i [TS]

01:11:05   believe there that somebody had said that there was a network components have [TS]

01:11:09   to see if I can get this link [TS]

01:11:11   look it up so I i think there's there's three things about this i really [TS]

01:11:16   interesting that that make us an interesting one is that it's totally [TS]

01:11:22   possible at all with IOUs today you know cuz the problem with iOS you can do [TS]

01:11:27   anything you want in a partner in the background for 10 minutes and then you [TS]

01:11:31   hit your time and your killed or or suspended so be killed way before then [TS]

01:11:36   if someone wants the game and that's true so you know and when Apple [TS]

01:11:41   introduced multitasking with iOS four they they announce these like you know [TS]

01:11:44   five or six you know officially sanctioned and technically allowed [TS]

01:11:49   methods to keep running in the background indefinitely or periodically [TS]

01:11:54   and and one of those is background audio and so it's kind of a fluke that ok so [TS]

01:12:01   we have a need for apps to work together for more than 10 minutes in the audio [TS]

01:12:06   business that's just kind of lucked out that audio happens to be one of the [TS]

01:12:10   things I was to run for longer than that and in the other makes an impressive is [TS]

01:12:16   it is it is technically possible at all to share a substantial amount of data [TS]

01:12:21   between apps without switching back and forth URL schemes [TS]

01:12:24   themselves wouldn't would have issues with lots and lots of data flowing [TS]

01:12:27   through them so he said you know yet whether it's whether it's like shared [TS]

01:12:32   Core Audio buses or or network communication so sort of let me read you [TS]

01:12:38   a couple of very brief things the first which is less reliable is a post on [TS]

01:12:42   Stack Overflow which is the accepted answer to the question of basically how [TS]

01:12:47   does this work and i'm quoting now my guess is that they use some sort of [TS]

01:12:53   audio over network because I've seen log statements when our apt get started even [TS]

01:12:56   on a different device don't really know about the details of the implementation [TS]

01:12:59   but this could be a way of setting up staying in a sandbox constraint I don't [TS]

01:13:04   know this Lee with with Core Audio I know a little bit more audio and as far [TS]

01:13:09   as I know I don't think you can create any kind of shared between apps using [TS]

01:13:15   the audio frameworks III on iOS device you have to create a virtual device it [TS]

01:13:20   wouldn't be an issue of being a being piped to the speaker will be an issue of [TS]

01:13:23   you even having access to any other apps created audio devices and and and then [TS]

01:13:28   so it's not core audio based probably isn't if it is based on local networking [TS]

01:13:33   then that's interesting too because I don't think people have really besides [TS]

01:13:38   this I don't think people have really explored in her application potential of [TS]

01:13:42   just opening up a local web server or a local socket and communicating over [TS]

01:13:47   local host to some other app I don't think we've really ever discussed that [TS]

01:13:51   and I and i would i would never have assumed that would even be possible a [TS]

01:13:55   guy I would have assumed there were some kind of like perhaps fireball going on [TS]

01:14:00   there but I guess there probably isn'ta mean I would probably pretty hard to do [TS]

01:14:03   and there are probably some problems with it so maybe there isn't any kind of [TS]

01:14:06   protection against local network communication between apps rights only [TS]

01:14:10   reach a couple of other very brief things on the same Stack Overflow [TS]

01:14:13   overflow posted this is a comment now to a different answer this is Sebastian did [TS]

01:14:19   man I'm part of the autumn audio bus team we developed our own SDK for this [TS]

01:14:23   and as has been mentioned before it's basically a network protocol [TS]

01:14:26   and then let me go to the audio bus developer docs and it says blah blah [TS]

01:14:32   blah blah blah this process involves setting up your project enabling [TS]

01:14:36   background audio creating a launch URL and registering your app making sure [TS]

01:14:40   audio session mixing is enabled which is where we were talking earlier john was [TS]

01:14:44   talking earlier about having everyone on the same audio getting access to your [TS]

01:14:49   apps audio unit candidly I'm not really sure what that means and then creating [TS]

01:14:53   instances of the audio bus controller input and output ports and the audio [TS]

01:14:57   unit rapper from your app delegate easy peasy that's what oK so it's using Core [TS]

01:15:01   Audio in the audience but then it's taking the inputs and outputs of it and [TS]

01:15:04   and you know basically pointing out of the car audio side channels like the [TS]

01:15:09   audio unit is probably they're just so it can you want these two samples here [TS]

01:15:13   they are and oh by the way and take them it's like tu team them off into whatever [TS]

01:15:17   its network things so it is definitely worth it sounds like I don't think they [TS]

01:15:23   would do any kind of car don't they can do any kind of cardio thing so so so [TS]

01:15:27   anyway just three things about this I think a really interesting there is the [TS]

01:15:30   fact that steadily possible at all which ok we got that second is that it's been [TS]

01:15:36   permitted so far in the App Store that Apple has and hasn't removed from the [TS]

01:15:40   store told them they can't do this anymore reject them outright mean that's [TS]

01:15:44   that is very interesting that that that Apple is kinda look at their way on this [TS]

01:15:47   because you could argue that it's probably misuse of the background audio [TS]

01:15:53   ATI because each one of those apps like the back on audio AP is made for or is [TS]

01:15:58   intended for one apt to be playing something it wasn't too like like [TS]

01:16:03   Pandora [TS]

01:16:05   like that or or podcast app like that's that's what these are for is something [TS]

01:16:11   that's playing a continuous audio thing that is not the built-in music you know [TS]

01:16:17   that that's what it's for [TS]

01:16:18   so the fact you have multiple apps all doing background audio working together [TS]

01:16:24   to make one combined stream the pipe into something else that is clearly [TS]

01:16:28   against the spirit of what this is for [TS]

01:16:31   so it is surprising an app allows it and now the third interesting part about [TS]

01:16:35   this is that not only have they not only is it possible and then [TS]

01:16:40   permitted it so far but now somebody in the garage band team actually got them [TS]

01:16:45   to let them add support for the garage been so it's kind of an implied [TS]

01:16:49   endorsement of this method and granted you know the company with more than one [TS]

01:16:54   person so it's possible this is like you know one thing that sucked through that [TS]

01:16:59   like doesn't really fit with the overall strategy of iOS but this one person [TS]

01:17:02   known as one team was allowed at nobody noticed you know it's possible that but [TS]

01:17:06   it also is possible that they want to encourage this and and part of it you [TS]

01:17:10   know Apple has always culturally especially with Steve Jobs they have a [TS]

01:17:14   soft spot for music and musicians and and you know that's my garage band was [TS]

01:17:18   one of the first major iPad apps they made that the law should have had to and [TS]

01:17:25   they were so probably no music is great and you know it it's in our culture is [TS]

01:17:30   well respected people of musicians you know and it's very it's very fulfilling [TS]

01:17:36   to a lot of people in in a very basic way it's really hard to explain but you [TS]

01:17:44   know it's it's music is very powerful and so Apple has had a soft spot for so [TS]

01:17:48   maybe this is apples ok you know will let this happen for the musicians and [TS]

01:17:54   music people who are making these things because we like music alot and that's [TS]

01:17:57   fine because I can't imagine also I got another reason they would they would [TS]

01:18:03   allow this would be that if they do something in iOS 7 or any future iOS [TS]

01:18:08   something involving her application that's better something like sharing [TS]

01:18:12   with contracts are intense like Android or Windows Phone 7 Metro whatever if [TS]

01:18:18   they do something like that I don't see anything like that being able to replace [TS]

01:18:23   this architect something like that [TS]

01:18:27   probably couldn't be a stream of constant high bandwidth never [TS]

01:18:32   communication high bandwidth low latency with a bunch of apps in the background I [TS]

01:18:36   can't see that happening it's not that high bandwidth it's actually low [TS]

01:18:39   bandwidth Vegas where they can get away with it [TS]

01:18:41   I think it all comes down to this being audio and not so much in the musical [TS]

01:18:46   sense of how they want to do that although this part of that I think they [TS]

01:18:48   want to encourage ecosystem of applications that cooperate and make it [TS]

01:18:52   more interesting musical device but because perhaps I mean perhaps they're [TS]

01:18:57   wrong about this no sign that it's hard but it's not you're not reaching into [TS]

01:19:01   someone else's you know application root directory in scoring with it you're not [TS]

01:19:06   calling into another application executing arbitrary code audio is seen [TS]

01:19:12   as inert it cannot cause arbitrary as far as the economic woes arbitrary [TS]

01:19:16   execution of code elsewhere it doesn't do any of the things that they want to [TS]

01:19:20   keep people separated for I may already have an API lets you do audio stuff in [TS]

01:19:25   the background [TS]

01:19:26   this is audio stuff it seems safe it's not a security thing presumably that no [TS]

01:19:32   one is actually crazy enough to think I was joking about before actually [TS]

01:19:35   encoding all your inter application communication as an audio stream because [TS]

01:19:39   that would be crazy but I think it'll be awesome so anyone out there that I give [TS]

01:19:43   you up and like you said so they come up with something different they would [TS]

01:19:48   still keep this I think I think the most interesting thing about it is they [TS]

01:19:51   didn't do the Apple thing which is so this is only about guys out there on the [TS]

01:19:54   idea either by them or make something over on this exactly like it and you [TS]

01:20:00   know crush them maybe maybe maybe audio bus got out front maybe they are [TS]

01:20:04   planning to buy them may be waiting for the other shoe to drop but it could mean [TS]

01:20:08   so weird for the modern Apple's like we totally expect them to the body company [TS]

01:20:11   just to get the employees by the protocol or just simply say oh yeah [TS]

01:20:16   that's a good idea can we do that yet do that and then just do something that [TS]

01:20:20   does the exact same thing [TS]

01:20:22   possibly a little better as possible little worse but completely in-house I [TS]

01:20:26   mean maybe this got out in front of them are not on the music scene but it could [TS]

01:20:29   be that you know audio bus look like it was getting traction among people [TS]

01:20:32   developing applications and apple just wanted to join in but it's like i I like [TS]

01:20:36   that activity of them looking into the third party market seeing someone who's [TS]

01:20:40   come up with something and not just attempting to buy them outright not [TS]

01:20:45   attempting to crush them of their implementation and you know dashboard [TS]

01:20:49   style or whatever just say all right what you guys are going with that will [TS]

01:20:53   join into your thing because it makes [TS]

01:20:55   the makes the iOS devices more compelling for people who are interested [TS]

01:20:58   in music to have this ecosystem like as it wasn't compelling enough to have all [TS]

01:21:02   these great music apps now they can cooperate with each other they could be [TS]

01:21:05   the first people to get the benefit of what we've been talking about it like [TS]

01:21:08   Jesus you could just get rid of these silos that are separating the iPad could [TS]

01:21:12   become much more useful device may be there the first people out of the gate [TS]

01:21:15   who are able to do that the musicians so I have a hypothetical question for you [TS]

01:21:21   guys in hearing John you talk about encoding everything is audio and I know [TS]

01:21:24   you say that kinda jokingly and I also know you say it probably not possible [TS]

01:21:28   transfer between out ahead I agree so let me take you on a meandering journey [TS]

01:21:34   that hopefully will end up at a decent point when paced by came out which was [TS]

01:21:38   to my knowledge the first half points out that really people started paying [TS]

01:21:43   attention to maybe that was their first time I don't call but I believe his pay [TS]

01:21:47   spot that tried to run silence in the background in order to stay in open in [TS]

01:21:53   sync constantly because obviously there's only a couple reasons you can [TS]

01:21:57   backgrounder app for more than 10 minutes so they thought I will display [TS]

01:22:00   silenced forever [TS]

01:22:01   use this audio mixing not unlike audio bus so you don't you can still hear [TS]

01:22:05   other things at the same time and Apple ended up saying nice tribe that [TS]

01:22:09   inhabited so you can't leave a nap running constantly and and so Marco this [TS]

01:22:16   also is cued by what you said a moment ago once I wonder if it would be [TS]

01:22:20   possible to do something like have your appt have some sort of server component [TS]

01:22:26   just locally and so let's say you wanted to transfer an easy GIF file between two [TS]

01:22:34   out whatever that may be doesn't matter so what if one says hey I'm about to [TS]

01:22:40   background this task and in starts up a server locally on the phone or the iPad [TS]

01:22:46   whatever does a call a URL scheme into some other app that it's aware of an ex [TS]

01:22:52   callback URL or something along those lines and that second appt up to then [TS]

01:22:57   gets onto a pawns server component or whatever you'd like to call it downloads [TS]

01:23:02   that being naughty mag filed in the span of under 10 minutes because why wouldn't [TS]

01:23:07   it it's all the same device [TS]

01:23:08   and then suddenly you have a way of doing file transfer between apps as long [TS]

01:23:13   as it takes less than 10 minutes does that even make sense with that it feel [TS]

01:23:16   like I think these are all such ridiculous hacks I think it would be [TS]

01:23:25   more wise unless you had a really pressing need to make an appt the did [TS]

01:23:29   this kind of stuff right now I think it just kind of wait and see what iOS does [TS]

01:23:34   to address this and you know because obviously I think with forestall being [TS]

01:23:41   out now it wouldn't surprise me if we start seeing major new directions I was [TS]

01:23:47   we probably won't see what I was seven and just too soon since he's been out [TS]

01:23:50   but you know I think we can we can look at you can look at Apple under Tim Cook [TS]

01:23:56   and we can see things are being shaken up gradually it's not like totally [TS]

01:24:01   transformed overnight to a different company but things are being shaken up [TS]

01:24:05   and we're seeing things that were previously very attributable to Steve [TS]

01:24:12   Jobs [TS]

01:24:13   overlap with things are attributable Scott Forstall forestall a very much [TS]

01:24:19   like anime himself in jobs image or even vice versa I don't know but things like [TS]

01:24:26   everything being so strictly sandboxed and so strictly separated it would [TS]

01:24:31   surprise you start seeing relaxation of that as as a platform features as [TS]

01:24:36   competition gets more strong and an address all those areas wave more [TS]

01:24:40   robustly than Apple does we will I think we'll start seeing development here and [TS]

01:24:45   so you know you mentioned [TS]

01:24:47   view controllers and iOS 6 being behind the scenes for a few things that is [TS]

01:24:52   something to watch and and if we if you think about how Apple would implement [TS]

01:24:57   something like a few controllers for general purpose use an applicant has to [TS]

01:25:03   have like like a low low power state where it's in the background it's not [TS]

01:25:11   rendering interface ideally if you only have to like load up a shearing sheep [TS]

01:25:17   for your app or something and then it goes away and never launched recently [TS]

01:25:20   ideally a good only [TS]

01:25:22   flowed like a small amount of the app and not even since 10 shape the whole [TS]

01:25:26   view hierarchy even if it's not being displayed ideally rapid has some kind of [TS]

01:25:30   like fast loading loan needs mode where could interact with our other apps like [TS]

01:25:35   this and I would still maintain its great battery life and and only loading [TS]

01:25:41   apps whenever needed to be loaded and suspending them for all the times like I [TS]

01:25:46   feel like there there are a lot of technical like Harry details about that [TS]

01:25:51   about how you would do that develop a point of view from our point of view you [TS]

01:25:56   know there's a lot of ways to do it that would suck in some major way for [TS]

01:25:59   somebody to developer or whether the user but I feel like that area the [TS]

01:26:09   entire tech world have been pressuring Apple so hard especially this past year [TS]

01:26:14   to address that particular area and their view controller thing and you [TS]

01:26:19   activity looks like baby steps towards something better there than I feel like [TS]

01:26:26   investing any kind of major time or effort or development or product [TS]

01:26:30   investing any investing heavily into the old ways that you can do things right [TS]

01:26:36   now is probably bad timing because I S seven is gonna be announced in a few [TS]

01:26:42   months all likelihood probably WDC and I feel like we are right on the verge of [TS]

01:26:48   of a change it is very likely to affect this particular area of iOS dramatically [TS]

01:26:55   so I wouldn't put much into it right now it is a short for a very long way of [TS]

01:27:01   saying is what I just said that the short version is I don't think it's the [TS]

01:27:04   right time to invest heavily in in weird workarounds for iOS is lack of good [TS]

01:27:09   communication would be cool I mean I was joking like it's it's a silly thing to [TS]

01:27:15   do but it but if someone did that that would be story they would get passed [TS]

01:27:19   around because it's just you know it's a hack it's it's interesting in this novel [TS]

01:27:22   and I'm sure we could find some sort of technology of protocol for perhaps [TS]

01:27:27   modulating and D modulating audio [TS]

01:27:31   I don't know I'm just so sure i mean you could just you could just like you like [TS]

01:27:35   one bit per sample Rodriguez moved [TS]

01:27:38   have like a sample of 102 negative one does he like you know you can modulate [TS]

01:27:43   into just a very very tiny waveform that is so small that you would not hear any [TS]

01:27:49   kind of speakers or headphones you happen to an iPhone and an encoded it [TS]

01:27:53   that way you can you tutor not like there that's the problem yeah like I was [TS]

01:27:58   trying to think of like who who would given like the ridiculousness of this [TS]

01:28:03   and you know I should just wait for our someone who would actually have the [TS]

01:28:07   resources and poor judgment to attempt something like this the only people I [TS]

01:28:12   could think of have no reason to have service I components and those would be [TS]

01:28:16   like the singer's of the world that would use it as a back door to like [TS]

01:28:19   share information between their applications but they don't need to do [TS]

01:28:23   that they've got a server and noticed just talked to do with the transfer all [TS]

01:28:27   your information to service when you don't know the name game but the same [TS]

01:28:29   manufacturer then all about what you played here and can promote this game [TS]

01:28:33   more by this you know so they don't dislike their application communication [TS]

01:28:37   for that crowd is called the server and that's i mean it works that way for a [TS]

01:28:43   lot of people to like what we really wanted for us like I started stop [TS]

01:28:48   straining my stupid text documents and text editors I have you know that's what [TS]

01:28:52   we all want and you know and those cases you know it's not because you want to [TS]

01:28:56   know i three games from the same maker to be able to know about each other and [TS]

01:29:00   know about your scores and activities I want documents created an application is [TS]

01:29:05   not made by the same vendor to not be in these stupid silos and that's that's [TS]

01:29:09   what we're all waiting for its like you know popping up you eyes is one thing [TS]

01:29:12   and the other thing is the file system or whatever and you know maybe iCloud is [TS]

01:29:16   a solution that but not really do they still sailing off as well so that's what [TS]

01:29:20   that's what I think we're looking for and you know and rapid communication is [TS]

01:29:24   shared UI's type of thing a little bundles with you as you can put in your [TS]

01:29:28   applications and really running but some code this party replication is running [TS]

01:29:31   and some solution to how you can use multiple applications to work on the [TS]

01:29:36   same project you know with file modification from different vendors and [TS]

01:29:40   in the DRDO buses almost cannot really solution it's more like a bunch of [TS]

01:29:44   guitar [TS]

01:29:45   hookup in sequence to elaire effects on but like I feel like the same time to [TS]

01:29:49   think what if you want to do our audio creation and you have audio bosnia like [TS]

01:29:53   geez I wish I could use these seven apps to collaborate to create this is dead [TS]

01:29:57   one kind of the mass rapid actually gets to record the resulting audio and [TS]

01:30:01   everything else is just a bunch of Xboxes and pedals that year you're [TS]

01:30:04   putting in a chain to modify things so they're they're creeping up on it but [TS]

01:30:08   you know they they start long way to go in and has been speculation about the [TS]

01:30:12   forestall jobs thing like any actual information about like everyone likes a [TS]

01:30:17   tribute to get everything they don't like now the source told gone it will [TS]

01:30:21   stop happening in the good things will happen like I don't know is he's the one [TS]

01:30:25   who was insisting on silos it is like why why is his departure make you think [TS]

01:30:30   that this good thing available now finally happened I guess that he was the [TS]

01:30:33   barrier to it I don't know maybe you have information I don't but I have [TS]

01:30:36   known about it I don't I don't see that like I mean it's it's conceivable but [TS]

01:30:43   without any actual connection to information saying like oh you have [TS]

01:30:47   forced I was totally and because I have heard some things about things that he [TS]

01:30:51   was going home for that I disagree with but this was not among them but you know [TS]

01:30:56   I'm hesitant to 10 my hopes on the magic departures got forestall right about [TS]

01:31:04   that honestly I mean I don't have any information to support that it's [TS]

01:31:09   probably wrong who knows we know they need this anyway but like they need lots [TS]

01:31:13   of things and they tend to know there they'll get there eventually [TS]

01:31:17   this is gonna be the Year desktop Linux yeah what we actually do get it [TS]

01:31:22   eventually got hurt we gotta notifications enter such as it is [TS]

01:31:27   eventually it's funny because as you guys were talking I was thinking back [TS]

01:31:32   you know you said well one thing we want is is to be able to pop up view or some [TS]

01:31:38   sort of view controller in another app from within my own app [TS]

01:31:42   and it occurred to me that when I was spit balling about transferring the say [TS]

01:31:47   to this fancy meeting Meg file we can already do that thing is we can't do it [TS]

01:31:51   locally we do it via Dropbox and so I kind of wonder if in addition to being [TS]

01:31:58   able to throw up something small and somebody else's [TS]

01:32:02   III I wander freely what I've been asking for this entire show is now is [TS]

01:32:06   just drop box but local you know something that serves the same purpose [TS]

01:32:10   that Dropbox does the file system gives [TS]

01:32:13   interesting is that you know that iCloud does not address that at all and no [TS]

01:32:23   reason I couldn't work in Dropbox app that Apple doesn't want to do and so [TS]

01:32:27   does I think I think history will show that that particular detail of iCloud is [TS]

01:32:33   a big mistake and and i really I think if you look at something like the photo [TS]

01:32:38   library on iOS that's a really good example of how to do something like this [TS]

01:32:42   better certainly not perfect but you know there's a lot of apps that can [TS]

01:32:46   interact with the same photo library and and it's it's fine could be better but [TS]

01:32:52   its way better than if you have some other type of document or some other [TS]

01:32:58   type of data that you want multiple a stability to be able to interact with [TS]

01:33:01   there's no good option for that except Dropbox which obviously that's not great [TS]

01:33:07   for Apple I really do feel like if I cloud could be broadened to basically [TS]

01:33:14   have different containers for any given mimetypes a or any given set of my most [TS]

01:33:20   part you just bargaining now because I'm working on a project images and some tax [TS]

01:33:26   documents and some audio and some movies and now they're in there in silence by [TS]

01:33:30   type like I mean there's a reason that the the file systems exist the way it [TS]

01:33:35   does because it's like you can't predict had a time of what what what facet you [TS]

01:33:42   want to use to organize things what you know what is the world i'm looking for [TS]

01:33:46   when taxes are never right [TS]

01:33:47   how are you gonna categorize things it by type is it by day is about like oh [TS]

01:33:51   well if you didn't have a file system you can do all of those things we also [TS]

01:33:54   have [TS]

01:33:54   another thing which is like a hierarchy was liked by location bypass project I [TS]

01:33:58   have I have photos that I have to work with for the magazine that are not in my [TS]

01:34:03   photo library for myself that i personal photos like this like there's all sorts [TS]

01:34:07   of everyone has these kind of accepted the project folder maybe a divided up by [TS]

01:34:11   type underneath the project folder maybe a divided up by the secondary category [TS]

01:34:15   now my time but like I think the decision not to have a real thousands [TS]

01:34:19   done in iCloud is the right one they just like that I admire them for [TS]

01:34:24   sticking with I hope they don't cave because they can implement Dropbox they [TS]

01:34:27   could have been prevented Dropbox long time ago but they didn't because the [TS]

01:34:30   city yet we understand that you just give us a shared hierarchy you file [TS]

01:34:34   system on the network links everywhere [TS]

01:34:37   Dropbox does that Apple could do that they've chosen not to because they know [TS]

01:34:42   like how untenable to get the file system is for human beings period like [TS]

01:34:47   non nerd people and so they're holding the line is a no we are not going to [TS]

01:34:51   give you an arbitrary higher give you can always do what you want because [TS]

01:34:54   people have proven they can't work make that work and it just they just haven't [TS]

01:34:58   figured out a workable alternative yet but I but I am proud of them for not [TS]

01:35:03   caving and not saying well you know i cloud documents in the cloud [TS]

01:35:08   well now it's just an arbitrary file system just like Dropbox don't nuts like [TS]

01:35:11   this every year then be like yeah this is great Apple's finally you know done [TS]

01:35:15   what we wanted but I am totally convinced that people in general cannot [TS]

01:35:21   grasp that concept and it's not a question of education in time for [TS]

01:35:25   several generations into the computer age is just it's not something people [TS]

01:35:29   grass is something that we have no problem with him and subset of geeks [TS]

01:35:32   have no problem with but you know the simpler things like to talk about the [TS]

01:35:37   photo-sharing people can kind of kind of grasp that people can kind of grasp the [TS]

01:35:42   stupid limited silos that we all hate this got there's gotta be something that [TS]

01:35:46   doesn't expose the full file something gives us some of the benefits and you [TS]

01:35:50   know we found it yet I feel bad for them and I feel bad for us but I am proud of [TS]

01:35:54   them for not making Dropbox I'll be proud of the right to the point where it [TS]

01:35:58   to my frustration just overflows in [TS]

01:36:00   you know as well as Dropbox around for the nerd that also kind of meeting is it [TS]

01:36:03   ok well you keep working on that but in the meantime you know just using Dropbox [TS]

01:36:08   I kind of feel obviously there's been a lot of discussion last few years about [TS]

01:36:13   about moving away from exposing the file system to users and I feel like it's one [TS]

01:36:19   of those simplifications that the problem is way more complicated than [TS]

01:36:24   that simple solution can properly address and and that you know the reason [TS]

01:36:29   why files have lasted as long as they have as a metaphor for storage [TS]

01:36:34   management for people is that this is a complicated problem and files are a very [TS]

01:36:42   simple and extremely powerful way to address it at the costs of the user [TS]

01:36:47   complexity especially for people who just can't you just don't think that way [TS]

01:36:51   or or who are so new to it they they need time to adjust and we see obviously [TS]

01:36:57   be so many so many failures of of like quote normal people or people who are [TS]

01:37:02   really new to computers are just don't care that much we see so many failures [TS]

01:37:06   of them just not getting the concepts of file storage and files and moving them [TS]

01:37:13   and where they're located on the computer and stuff like that but I feel [TS]

01:37:15   like we're Apple has gone with iCloud with the tremendous you know very strict [TS]

01:37:22   sideloading per app and pretty much no files everything's kind of a collection [TS]

01:37:26   of documents in each app I feel like that's going too far in the other [TS]

01:37:30   direction it doesn't cover the problems facing just doesn't like we all we all [TS]

01:37:36   recognize even it doesn't even cover the problems faced for casual people because [TS]

01:37:39   it solves like like there's nobody for whom that's the shit is adequate because [TS]

01:37:44   even just like my parents like once i cant find their stuff and I explained [TS]

01:37:48   the silo and they like oh that's that's done how do I do that now like I don't [TS]

01:37:53   have a good answer for them like this that I understand nobody this so few [TS]

01:37:56   people in and so is that is that the first step and they have a master plan [TS]

01:38:00   did they want to try that and say hey maybe this is adequate care like what we [TS]

01:38:04   know that work with Dropbox right but like there they haven't figured it out [TS]

01:38:10   yet they have not even come close to covering the problems facing you [TS]

01:38:13   like the simple small simple but powerful tools like that's the continued [TS]

01:38:17   its like UNIX where you know the the ideal of Unix are you have a bunch of [TS]

01:38:21   tiny single purpose tools that you can change together to do amazing things but [TS]

01:38:25   nobody can figure that out right and the other end you have like a big red button [TS]

01:38:28   you press it is just possible that you have Microsoft Excel [TS]

01:38:31   well no actually sounds actually good example of like a small simple tool that [TS]

01:38:37   you can assemble business simple tools we have a grid and there's a few simple [TS]

01:38:40   things are regular people not to do with the grid and people are amazing it [TS]

01:38:43   taking excels like OSU dimensional grid I can solve any problem with that [TS]

01:38:47   because it's like it's likely I'll blocks you know that's terrible solution [TS]

01:38:50   but they can understand this one simple tool right well UNIX you know the series [TS]

01:38:55   simple tool you can make it your solution but the other end of the [TS]

01:38:57   spectrum is there is no small reusable part there is no LEGO brick there is no [TS]

01:39:01   thing that you can snap together make a solution is just one big shiny red [TS]

01:39:04   button your president does whatever the hell we say this thing's gonna do and [TS]

01:39:07   that is inadequate to cover the things that people need to do and there's you [TS]

01:39:12   know that's that's documents mccloud this point there's a huge gap between [TS]

01:39:16   those extremes and there's gotta be something in the middle that can they [TS]

01:39:19   can work for us and it's it would be a failure on Apple's park to ever [TS]

01:39:25   surrender and say finds about system so like they did not work to do but I hope [TS]

01:39:31   they don't just give in you know I think it would be an equally significant [TS]

01:39:35   failure on their part to say we've solved it done it's fine you just gotta [TS]

01:39:43   get used to that mean that they they realized I I don't think that anyone [TS]

01:39:48   thinks that anyone anywhere was ever used to wrap it up you have to kind of a [TS]

01:39:56   true people have been asking for an outro to the show so you know when it's [TS]

01:39:59   ending so you can look at our web-site ATP . FM for AXA don't talk podcast [TS]

01:40:04   follow us on Twitter you have Siracusa s IRA c-usa Casey Lewis chs cyl ISS and [TS]

01:40:14   Marco Arment and IR CEO Aaron ENT and [TS]

01:40:19   that's about it over a dozen iTunes so that we can get more people and stuff [TS]

01:40:22   and I don't think the Squarespace sponsoring what do people usually put [TS]

01:40:27   these actress you're gonna sing a song I i dont think im not im not really in the [TS]

01:40:33   mood to sing tonight maybe maybe we'll record I'm in the shower when thomas [TS]

01:40:38   also do good [TS]

01:40:42   I think Twitter handles are good and and website URLs you probably just on how to [TS]

01:40:49   spell them that they can go faster [TS]

01:40:51   yeah cuz we all have a long spell level if my last name cajuns its 323 our AC [TS]

01:40:59   USA seconds just so you know i i been doin to do it and that's what drives me [TS]

01:41:07   nuts about the stupid Google authenticator things for it for to use [TS]

01:41:10   that for the two-factor no I don't got a good they've got a Google authenticator [TS]

01:41:14   app which is great for Dropbox and i three of them on their house one out [TS]

01:41:17   Google authenticated gives you just the number that's it's your second factor [TS]

01:41:20   right and its six digits and they shut them all together and I come on guys [TS]

01:41:25   what planet you i three like everybody knows you don't put six days just go [TS]

01:41:31   crazy in the middle of his repeated digits you screwed up that's just [TS]

01:41:34   unbelievable to me they didn't put a parking space are a hyphen or something [TS]

01:41:37   2003 please put that as for the love of Christ [TS]

01:41:44   going somewhere [TS]