The Accidental Tech Podcast

84: The Load-Bearing Finger


00:00:00   If this is a sleepy case he's got to work on the whole getting ready to not have any sleep thing [TS]

00:00:05   but lately Marco has been the one thing he's also Libby. [TS]

00:00:08   Yeah my will my kids in school now so now waking up like an hour earlier so I'm closer to Katie's schedule I know you [TS]

00:00:14   already complained about your early wake up time so bad it is harder than you did then you go back home. [TS]

00:00:21   It's funny to me that when I complained and moaned for the first year [TS]

00:00:25   and a half of the show it was so get over it you're fine. [TS]

00:00:28   Now that the king is having to get up early suddenly we all have to go to bed I have a month [TS]

00:00:35   when I really have to get up early but like you get dressed up in nice clothes [TS]

00:00:38   and not come back to his house after e off go to another go to another building where you have to like not smell bad [TS]

00:00:46   and have already eaten and be dressed nice and you're a parking lot [TS]

00:00:51   and then talk about parking lots they have to know what do you want to work on you [TS]

00:00:56   or do have to wear khakis you can you really change you. I only have one set of clothes and you've seen them all. [TS]

00:01:02   That's what I wear. [TS]

00:01:03   I'm not as bad as Marco yet are not as good as markers yet I should say disease is already achieved my ultimate goal [TS]

00:01:08   which is to you know not have to worry about clothes into seven outfit I have not achieved that [TS]

00:01:12   but I would like to basically have a small set of clothes and you've seen them all that's what I wear to work. [TS]

00:01:16   So jeans and like a polo shirt not a polo shirt. You know there are other cars I describe rugby shirts. [TS]

00:01:22   That's all I don't want to have her same difference that their genes make shirts I guess they kind of are now I mean I [TS]

00:01:29   will not dispute the value of having a uniform it doesn't matter what the uniform is no I envy you [TS]

00:01:35   but I kind of do have universities has more variety but the problem is all my uniforms the sleeves shrink [TS]

00:01:40   and then I have to like that otherwise I would use them until they disintegrate like you know like my running shirts [TS]

00:01:45   that are fifteen years old but I still have I just I feel like I mean I am not a fashion conscious kind of guy [TS]

00:01:51   but I feel like I would get bored wearing the same. [TS]

00:01:54   Everyone agrees that you're the best dressed of all of us cases are looking to hear them. [TS]

00:01:58   I'm not fishing for compromise. [TS]

00:02:00   Yes they may be true [TS]

00:02:01   but I'm not fishing for compliments I'm just saying that I don't think of myself as having any fashion sense yet [TS]

00:02:06   or really is really relative among me and Mark Oh yeah. Fashions. [TS]

00:02:10   Oh yeah well I guess that's true but I mean regardless of fashion sense I just feel like looking down [TS]

00:02:15   and seeing the exact same uniform every day would get really pointed you know like down market doesn't care is wearing [TS]

00:02:21   I don't care one way. Yeah that's exactly it readers want which is one not to be pointed at and laughed at. [TS]

00:02:25   So we find something that lets us ignore this for a for the rest of our lives or at least for the next year [TS]

00:02:31   or two until the church disintegrate. I guess Casey you definitely represent humanity in the show. [TS]

00:02:40   Normal normal humanity and let's not let's not talk of normal humanity too much normally had a lot of downsides. [TS]

00:02:48   Did either one of you to actually read any of the follow up before we begin. No I skimmed all of it great. [TS]

00:02:54   I've also I've also skimmed it. [TS]

00:02:57   Everything just published in the chat room they can do follow up and none of us have looked at it. [TS]

00:03:02   I put most of it there. [TS]

00:03:04   OK Would we like to start with a friend of the show Jason smells correction about the i Phone six. [TS]

00:03:14   Yeah so basically we said last show I said last show someone said I think was me summons the last show that the i Phone [TS]

00:03:21   six plus had a slightly higher clock C.P.U. [TS]

00:03:24   Than the six similar to the difference between the i Pad air [TS]

00:03:28   and the Retina i Pad Mini where the errors like you know ten percent faster or something like that. [TS]

00:03:33   Turns out that is I think completely wrong or at least people have we've seen things all over the place here. [TS]

00:03:42   We've seen some benchmark showing that the six is faster than the six plus by some you know little amount like that. [TS]

00:03:47   We've seen some banks are saying they're the same. [TS]

00:03:49   We've seen some benchmarks saying the six plus a stash of in the six. [TS]

00:03:53   So Jason Snell posted a follow up thing he had originally said the safe was a faster he I think then has corrected it [TS]

00:03:59   and said action. That was you know mismeasured or whatever and it's wrong. [TS]

00:04:03   I don't think we know quite what's going on here yet do we. But I mean there's a lot of things that could be done. [TS]

00:04:09   There's things like that I'm a clock speeds happening where you know there could be throttling for thermal reasons [TS]

00:04:15   Apple said it shouldn't happen that it can maintain the full speed all the time [TS]

00:04:18   but we don't actually you know we don't know what kind of condition some of these benchmarks were down into maybe it's [TS]

00:04:22   like you know extreme conditions or in warm environments who knows. [TS]

00:04:26   But regardless there doesn't appear to be a clear difference between the two that's actually reliable. [TS]

00:04:32   So there's occasionally a small difference but it kind of flip flops as to which direction it goes [TS]

00:04:36   and so I think it's more likely to be chalked up to testing conditions [TS]

00:04:40   or benchmarks mis measuring things then the actual actual differences in clock speeds are going to be nice if Apple [TS]

00:04:47   does publish them or at the very least that there was like you can like an Intel C.P.U. [TS]

00:04:50   I read off some registers and find out the clock speed like it's all guesswork [TS]

00:04:54   and it's all kind of get this benchmark app to run [TS]

00:04:57   and like all it does is benchmark app accurately test the speed of this particular C.P.U. [TS]

00:05:02   or Yeah I don't like this guess what business [TS]

00:05:05   but anyway last show I had mentioned that Jason had said conclusively the exact clock speeds and has now recanted [TS]

00:05:11   and so we're back to just not knowing and we as far as anyone knows that look they're probably about the same thing [TS]

00:05:16   and then we of course have a ton of follow up about the Apple Watch. [TS]

00:05:20   And one of the most popular bits of follow up let me back up actually there are two popular bits of our people saying [TS]

00:05:26   either we're insane or we're right on the money for saying that the watches will be expensive [TS]

00:05:31   and we'll talk about that more and moments [TS]

00:05:33   and people theorizing how you can justify the purchase procedure of buying a ten or twenty [TS]

00:05:40   or thirty thousand dollar Apple Watch. [TS]

00:05:42   And what you would do once that piece of electronics gets sold [TS]

00:05:46   and the really frustrating thing about the what you would do is have a lot of people have sent in feedback saying hey [TS]

00:05:52   if you're beating carat gold it stands to reason you could you know melt that down or otherwise recycle it. [TS]

00:05:58   And so perhaps you'll leave. [TS]

00:06:00   The Apple Watch or maybe they'll be a trade in program or something like that [TS]

00:06:03   and this is really annoying because during the last episode I thought to myself you know I wonder if you could just [TS]

00:06:08   like trading in your watch and then you could get a new one and then during the time that you two were talking [TS]

00:06:14   and I was reasoning through this in my head I decided No that's a stupid idea I shouldn't share it [TS]

00:06:18   and like twenty people saying today and so the moral of the story is I should trust my instincts. [TS]

00:06:24   I thought I was actually set in fact I thought all the ideas that have been fed to us via email [TS]

00:06:28   and Twitter were actually mentioned off hand in the show [TS]

00:06:30   but it's obvious that the audience wants to hear more discussion of these things because many people offered elaborate [TS]

00:06:36   theories. [TS]

00:06:37   Well I was going to make this work so we just like mentioning one or two things off hand [TS]

00:06:41   but every people want to expansions on it so I figure it's worth nothing although you skip the actually the first item [TS]

00:06:48   of the fault right before this is someone who has worked in the jewelry industry for twenty years says that over five [TS]

00:06:54   X. Mark ups on fashion jewelry is normal. [TS]

00:06:57   So if people want to put a number on what kind of one of these crazy margins that we're talking about what kind of [TS]

00:07:02   complete disconnect between the cost of goods in the products. More than five X. Is routine. [TS]

00:07:10   And so one of the examples of these theories regarding how you could handle upgrading [TS]

00:07:17   or whatever just was sent in by Phil Compton Apple could have two easy ways to handle the rapid obsolescence of the [TS]

00:07:23   Apple Watch. [TS]

00:07:24   One upgrade ability and to trade ins the upgrade ability would of course need to be done in an Apple store [TS]

00:07:30   but they should be able to keep movements within a set of specifications that could allow easy upgrading of the [TS]

00:07:35   internals of one generation to a newer one. [TS]

00:07:37   I assume they would always be making the watch smaller So although the same adapter may be needed to fill the space [TS]

00:07:42   each new generation fit in the next. [TS]

00:07:44   And actually the genesis of my theory last episode that I never shared so now it sounds like a fabricated it in order [TS]

00:07:51   to sound smart and wise. They mean a lot. [TS]

00:07:53   Well relatively speaking a lot of mention of what is it the ASP One what is powering this thing. Yeah the S. [TS]

00:07:59   One is there. [TS]

00:08:00   There their marketing name for the entire computer in a little tiny case and exactly it isn't on one chip [TS]

00:08:07   but it's a whole bunch of components in some kind of case that is most likely more for water resistant than anything [TS]

00:08:12   else. [TS]

00:08:13   Yeah but it made me think you know if you keep the pin outs of that case [TS]

00:08:17   and the physical shape of that case the same even if the even if the internals get considerably better. [TS]

00:08:23   Maybe that's the way you upgrade it is there some mechanism by which they can get in there [TS]

00:08:29   and replace the yes one input in an S. Two X. [TS]

00:08:32   Turn only looks identical in operates identical from an interface perspective but internally is twice the clock speed [TS]

00:08:38   or what have you. [TS]

00:08:39   This all falls down though if displays get a lot better and [TS]

00:08:43   or it will if that displays a pattern of different sizes for different pen outs [TS]

00:08:48   and John I'm waiting for you to blow a hole in my theory. [TS]

00:08:50   Well so here's here's the deal with the upgrade ability this is definitely one of the things that many different people [TS]

00:08:56   suggested they suggested that there was a part of the watch that would become obsolete [TS]

00:09:00   and there was a part that would not come up the aisle become obsolete. [TS]

00:09:03   The gold case [TS]

00:09:04   or whatever that should be fine in prison with us for most of the cost is you could swap out those internal stuff that [TS]

00:09:10   probably cost less than the band they're probably you know fifty bucks for the last one over ever it is. [TS]

00:09:16   Here's the thing with that in in Apple's history [TS]

00:09:18   and we'll get to this if we actually do get to the i Phone six plus spending. [TS]

00:09:22   Apple has always chosen when they had a choice between keeping the same thickness angries battery life [TS]

00:09:26   or make a center they would just make it thinner and that's where imaging I'm ready for the the i Phone four S. [TS]

00:09:32   Form factor of this watch. [TS]

00:09:34   We all assume this is the first Apple Watch and just like the first Apple phone I'm going to call the Apple phone. [TS]

00:09:41   I switch it around so the Apple phone from now on that thanks like that Apple touch we all assumed they're going to [TS]

00:09:49   make the watch thinner [TS]

00:09:50   when they can that they're not going to say you know what let's keep the Apple Watch case exactly the same size [TS]

00:09:55   and every year. Just make the battery a little bit bigger and you know and. [TS]

00:10:00   Maybe other components smaller something or have they have the S one beast's wobble in and out [TS]

00:10:04   and that's the way it will do upgrades a river like that. This gets back to the product cycles on the wash. [TS]

00:10:10   Do we think they're going to come up with a new watch every year every two years every five years I think they'll do a [TS]

00:10:15   new one every year. [TS]

00:10:16   If they do a new one every year will they try to make it better or will they keep it the same size [TS]

00:10:19   and make the battery think like this all those stores upgradability Never mind that Apple really is not big on [TS]

00:10:24   upgradeability period now they're maxing out with their i Phones now with their i Pods those days are long gone like my [TS]

00:10:30   first mac that I ever got was motherboard upgraded from Maclin twenty K. To a Mac. [TS]

00:10:35   Plus something officially Apple used to sell and do the current Apple is a long way away from that. [TS]

00:10:41   So I have a hard time believing unless there's some really good financial reasons having to do with the way watches are [TS]

00:10:47   normally sold that Apple would never do something like this. [TS]

00:10:52   Both because I just cannot see them keeping the case the same over long periods [TS]

00:10:58   and because they just want you to buy a new one. [TS]

00:11:00   Now I'm not going to rule it out entirely simple because everything we know about how Apple sells technology has to be [TS]

00:11:06   reevaluated in terms of well this isn't really technology this is fashion so maybe a new plan [TS]

00:11:10   and I don't know enough about fashion enough is any precedent for this in like the watch world of replacing the [TS]

00:11:14   movements inside your thing and keeping the gold band of something like that. [TS]

00:11:17   But right now it seems to me that the upgrading thing is one of those things that nerds would like Apple to do kind of [TS]

00:11:26   like replaceable batteries [TS]

00:11:27   or can you just another motherboard upgrade my macro to a new MacPro instead of having to buy a new one. [TS]

00:11:32   The answer from Apple is no we cannot we will not do it as buy a new one I just use this one. [TS]

00:11:37   So I am giving the upgrading thing technically feasible. [TS]

00:11:41   Yes hundred percent feasible but I don't think it's something that that Apple is going to do. [TS]

00:11:47   Given that it may be like thumbs down if I had to pick one [TS]

00:11:50   and if I had to put a percentage by it I'm going to like eighty percent against. [TS]

00:11:54   Yeah I would also bet strongly against it not only for all the reasons you mentioned but even even. [TS]

00:12:00   You ignore the fact that they would probably almost certainly make less money over time doing it that way I don't think [TS]

00:12:06   they would want to constrain themselves [TS]

00:12:08   and their future changes to the watch by by a commitment whether you know what they said [TS]

00:12:14   or whether it's been implied by past performance to keep the upgrades available so you know look at look at the massive [TS]

00:12:21   poop fit that the world through when I change the dock connector into the Lightning connector [TS]

00:12:26   and I was like ten years right. Yeah ten ten years with the same connector I think it was. [TS]

00:12:30   Yeah and people people are still insanely upset [TS]

00:12:33   and thinking Apple did it just to make more money like that is a common a very very common opinion of that changes [TS]

00:12:39   Apple just make more money to make a room buy new cables and accessories. [TS]

00:12:43   If they ever made the watch of great a bill the expectation to keep it a great deal in the future it would be so high [TS]

00:12:51   that they would suffer such severe reputation damage [TS]

00:12:54   and have so many angry people every time they made a backward incompatible change. [TS]

00:12:58   And so that would that would either cause a bunch of poop fits from their customers on a regular basis like every few [TS]

00:13:06   years and ever they make it a breaking change [TS]

00:13:08   or it would constrain them from Oh well we'd like to make this change in next year's version [TS]

00:13:15   but that would break compatibility with upgrades and so we kind of can't or shouldn't do that [TS]

00:13:20   and I don't see Apple ever wanting to be constrained that way in the design of such an important part of their lineup. [TS]

00:13:25   So who what who does upgradability benefit that's the real question like What are the benefits of operating is it a [TS]

00:13:32   benefit to Apple is it a benefit to consumers who would like I think most people coming in from the consumer's [TS]

00:13:37   perspective is hey if I spend there imagining for you know the case of for sake of argument that they have enough money [TS]

00:13:45   to buy the super expensive Apple Watch [TS]

00:13:46   and then they're further imagining that despite having all that money they also don't want to spend that money again [TS]

00:13:51   any time soon as they would like to protect their investment in itself a lot by saying I spent twelve hundred bucks on [TS]

00:13:56   the stand was the OP a life or a stainless steel band. Now the new one is. [TS]

00:14:00   I don't has a faster processor or uses less power. [TS]

00:14:04   I don't want to spend all that money again and then this is same thing people want to upgrade prices for everything [TS]

00:14:09   and I told her how much I have grades my one twenty K. [TS]

00:14:11   That I didn't have it in my purse that deal Plus was he probably died in today's my try like three grand [TS]

00:14:15   or something [TS]

00:14:16   but anyway that the upgrade will cost less money than buying the entire thing out right again so that is a consumer [TS]

00:14:21   benefit. I bought this thing once the better thing is out but I don't want to buy the better thing. [TS]

00:14:27   I want you to take as much as you can from my current thing [TS]

00:14:30   and just swap out the parts that are not good for the better parts to save money that doesn't benefit Apple at all. [TS]

00:14:35   As Mark I was saying before it isn't going to make more money no this is not going to make more money overall they will [TS]

00:14:42   the average selling price of the of their watches will go down. People can do these upgrades. [TS]

00:14:47   It does benefit consumers [TS]

00:14:49   but does it benefit consumers in a way that Apple feels like we should do this because it will make the experience [TS]

00:14:53   better for consumers I mean think like if you had to pretend you were you know magnanimous apple [TS]

00:14:58   and say well we'd like to [TS]

00:15:00   but we feel replacing the parts does not give the cohesive experience of being to be designed to watch [TS]

00:15:05   or to have an entire device it's a balance system where everything works together [TS]

00:15:09   and if you just take the Inside Out of the Apple you know there's all sorts of crazy B.S. [TS]

00:15:14   Reasons you can't [TS]

00:15:14   but some of them have some merit unlike our look at they're designing a product that is arming Syria's parts that you [TS]

00:15:19   can assemble into a product like can you just take the S one out [TS]

00:15:22   and put the S two in suddenly your watch gets faster and it takes less power maybe for a generation or two [TS]

00:15:29   but like Marco said at a certain point you have to have a breaking design change [TS]

00:15:33   or you just want to say you do things in fashion [TS]

00:15:36   and just make it the same all the time fashion has to change so I think this is mostly a techno fantasy having to do [TS]

00:15:44   with people who probably would never drop that much money on a watch anyway even if they could afford it because they [TS]

00:15:48   would feel like it's a waste. [TS]

00:15:49   But then can put themselves into that position and say [TS]

00:15:51   but if I didn't do that I would still have my instincts that think it's a ridiculous expense and [TS]

00:15:56   but I would want a new thing anyway that I would want to pay for it and it's a weird. [TS]

00:16:00   I don't I don't think this actual character case you can bring out the user story index cards. [TS]

00:16:07   I don't think I will character that that needs upgradability for the watch to be a viable thing exists I think it's [TS]

00:16:13   just a sort of a fantasy we're spending out right now. [TS]

00:16:15   Now the second item on the thing trade ins is an entirely different thing [TS]

00:16:18   and I think that is way more plausible because Apple already does that with stuff they have now they will you know take [TS]

00:16:24   year olds that most of this to get recycled. [TS]

00:16:26   But like give me your old thing for a discount on the new thing that I entirely see as being caused by especially if [TS]

00:16:33   it's made of precious metals but is different than upgradability. [TS]

00:16:36   Yeah I think that like recycling [TS]

00:16:38   or trade an approach is way more likely because they already do it for certain certain things you're right about that [TS]

00:16:43   and they already do it and it just makes more sense like it. [TS]

00:16:46   It avoids all the issues of the upgradeability kind of like constraining their options [TS]

00:16:51   and people's expectations there like it avoids all of that and it sounded very mentally friendly [TS]

00:16:57   and it seems economically somewhat responsible if you're if you want to upgrade you can get a good amount of money for [TS]

00:17:04   you know your seamless steel want to whatever the gold [TS]

00:17:06   when you need serious money for because you know the the metal itself is valuable. [TS]

00:17:12   Apple can take it and melted down and recycled in the new Apple watches [TS]

00:17:15   and they will give you good might want to give you like fifty bucks [TS]

00:17:17   or like say do the recycling because they will give you good money for a gold trader. [TS]

00:17:22   You know what I'm thinking about in this is taking just a half step backwards is a lot of us will spend somewhere [TS]

00:17:31   between five hundred thousand dollars every year or every other year on a new phone. [TS]

00:17:36   And just for the sake of conversation let's say it's every year [TS]

00:17:39   and let's say it's an even thousand dollars to make the math easy and let's say an average salary in the U.S. [TS]

00:17:45   Is fifty thousand dollars again just for the sake of making the math easy. [TS]

00:17:48   So if you get a new phone which is a thousand bucks [TS]

00:17:51   and you have fifty thousand dollars salary that's two percent of your what is a gross salary is is one thousand dollars. [TS]

00:17:59   So if. You make one point five million dollars which granted is an unbelievable shed load of money. [TS]

00:18:07   Then thirty thousand dollars is two percent of it and so what I'm driving at is even if an apple watch is thirty K. [TS]

00:18:15   If you're making a million [TS]

00:18:17   and a half as probably more people in the United States do than I care to admit to myself then getting a new thirty [TS]

00:18:25   thousand dollar watch every couple years it's the same is one you know one of us getting a new i Phone every year [TS]

00:18:31   or two. It's everything is relative. [TS]

00:18:34   And although the market is surely smaller than the millions upon millions upon millions of i Phones that are sold in [TS]

00:18:40   Yulee it's still not a bad set up especially since I would assume the markup as we spoke about earlier is just [TS]

00:18:48   tremendous. [TS]

00:18:49   Yeah it's worth reiterating again that we keep concentrating on the high end just because this type of product is [TS]

00:18:54   different for Apple this type of fashion product where the price is so crazily out of whack. [TS]

00:18:59   But they're you know volume wise they're going to sell. Apple hopes tons of the cheap one. [TS]

00:19:05   And so such a small it will be like the mac pro such a small number of these expensive watches are going to be sold [TS]

00:19:11   that I doubt first of all I doubt Apple will break it down for us because they never do [TS]

00:19:15   but I think we can probably you know or if they do or somebody will do the math [TS]

00:19:18   and try to say it's reasonable to assume that percentage wise you know ninety percent of Apple watches over the cheap [TS]

00:19:24   one and then ten percent of the super expensive one and yeah you do make a lot of money of that [TS]

00:19:28   but like really this is the thing about this this type of market is Apple wants to go all the way up to the top [TS]

00:19:35   and the top is really high [TS]

00:19:36   and it's maybe it's about exactly I'd love to see the breakdown of like how many macros are sold versus how many you [TS]

00:19:43   know of the reasonably priced Macs I think will be even more extreme with this expensive watch we're just obsessing [TS]

00:19:49   over because it's just such a novelty [TS]

00:19:51   and we just can't figure out how it's going to work within Apple's current business [TS]

00:19:55   and customers in the way they sell things and everything else. Or sponsor this week is a new sponsor. [TS]

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00:21:30   companies including i Home unique low Marvel and even Tumblr which is where I know them from initially. [TS]

00:21:37   They've built everything from firmware delivery systems to Ward winning recipe apps. Everything top to bottom. [TS]

00:21:44   Now the reason of them from tumblr is because the original tumblr app for i Phone We did actually have an i Phone app [TS]

00:21:50   for a while until we were too busy to make one [TS]

00:21:53   and we didn't have enough staff to you know just hire just have smells do it. Mobile apps actually made one. [TS]

00:22:00   Called Tumbler ed and it was there were a few out there by the people that theirs was by far the best. [TS]

00:22:05   So Tom we just bought it and we paid them for years to maintain it for us an upgrade and everything [TS]

00:22:10   and they were great. [TS]

00:22:11   That's how I know them and then when it [TS]

00:22:12   when it came time for me to need someone to build my paper app for Android I went directly to them because I knew them [TS]

00:22:20   I knew them for a while I knew they were good people [TS]

00:22:22   and because they really are like I would not a trusted that actually just anybody you know you know how much I love [TS]

00:22:28   working with other people. I went to a mobile X. [TS]

00:22:32   Knowing that it would be a good fit because I already had them before and knew they were very good people. [TS]

00:22:36   Both you know both easy to deal with and nice [TS]

00:22:39   and also really talented like their I can't say enough good things about their work. [TS]

00:22:42   They're just really good and really easy to work with. [TS]

00:22:46   So they built the Instagram for Android and it was just I had to do almost nothing. [TS]

00:22:50   I didn't even give them source code I don't even give them assets even just pull assets out of the out of my i Phone [TS]

00:22:55   app for me when it was stuff where they made their own because they have their designers there. [TS]

00:22:59   I give them almost nothing to work with except some very loose A.P.I. [TS]

00:23:03   Documentation and they need the whole app and they didn't have to bug me for anything. It's so easy to work with them. [TS]

00:23:08   Anyway for more info about mobile works or to get them involved with your next project check them out at mobile X. [TS]

00:23:14   Dot com That's all you X. [TS]

00:23:17   Dot com Thanks a lot to our friends at Mobile ox for sponsoring really I cannot recommend it enough. [TS]

00:23:23   All right let's keep talk about Apple Watch. Do we have to. Yes we do. It isn't even out yet. [TS]

00:23:27   I know but that doesn't that doesn't stop us when we come up. [TS]

00:23:31   We've got several more months of this and we have months of follow up. It's never going to end. [TS]

00:23:35   Another thing that we had a lot of discussion about why is how do you sell a ten twenty thirty thousand hour watch in [TS]

00:23:44   an existing Apple store [TS]

00:23:46   and an anonymous Apple employee wrote in to say many existing Apple stores have private business preaching rooms with [TS]

00:23:54   the entire product line not tethered to tables. They exist as a space for Apple to meet with businesses. [TS]

00:24:00   Discuss deals and how to integrate Apple. [TS]

00:24:02   These spaces are a perfect place to showcase high end watches to customers who would like a private area away from the [TS]

00:24:07   crowds. All I really want to know is how do I get that kind of sex. Because you gotta buy my prose. [TS]

00:24:13   You are but little is all about you are evil. [TS]

00:24:16   Well played [TS]

00:24:17   but you're evil because there are Apple store our local Apple store just moved in a few spots down in the local mall [TS]

00:24:24   and now it's actually a belt the right size for the area in which we live. [TS]

00:24:29   But goodness before it moved it was like a locker room in there no matter what time of day you went in so I did not [TS]

00:24:36   know this was a thing but apparently this is a thing [TS]

00:24:38   and I'm assuming if you're coming in looking like the kind of gentleman [TS]

00:24:42   or woman who is going to buy a thirty thousand dollar watch. Not about how you look at what you were just asked. [TS]

00:24:49   I would like to see the Apple Watch edition they say well you have to come to the back with us. [TS]

00:24:53   This as Marcus said the last show I think it's clear that Apple's stores are due for a redesign or an overhaul [TS]

00:25:02   and presumably someplace where you could sell really expensive gold watches will be part of that overall [TS]

00:25:07   but in the meantime whenever that happens to land in the meantime the fact of these rooms apparently exist that we [TS]

00:25:12   don't know about because none of us except for Marco would ever be invited into them. [TS]

00:25:17   It's nice to know that they have been out for some existing stores at least. Exactly all right. [TS]

00:25:23   There was a tweet from Scott McIntyre He noted that something that I had not realized that the Apple Watch edition [TS]

00:25:32   which is a terrible name but it's the expensive Apple Watch you think is worse. [TS]

00:25:36   The Apple Watch edition edition or the Ferrari La Ferrari the La Ferrari [TS]

00:25:40   but only by a shade I think Apple Apple Watch edition is worse because the Ferrari the way better than I watch [TS]

00:25:46   and you can forgive a lot of you can forgive a lot for a Ferrari isn't just a Camry with a gold coating here it's like [TS]

00:25:52   going now it's just a fee it with a gold coating right. They still know you're on her feet. Federica is going. Tell me. [TS]

00:26:00   Anyway so by the way just while we're on the topic of Federico certain or a pattern I was interesting. [TS]

00:26:06   So there's rumors that there's going to be a twelve inch quote i Pad Pro coming out like possibly next spring [TS]

00:26:13   or something and I'm not sure I believe that but assuming that even if it does. [TS]

00:26:18   On a recent episode of what's new protocols connected I was with the names. So the new product called connected. [TS]

00:26:25   Reason ever heard of that Federico mention in passing is that he said he wouldn't buy that i Pad fro [TS]

00:26:31   and I was thinking like if this thing is real if Federico Verty she does not want to buy an i Pad Pro who will. [TS]

00:26:38   I would very Only I penned by was my thing. [TS]

00:26:42   However I will never talk about i Pad Pro since like before that I was really sad that was me saying all that stuff in [TS]

00:26:49   the past episodes. [TS]

00:26:50   Yes I will buy it I think I said the line obviously Well the way I use my i Pad is not as a you know I use it like a [TS]

00:27:00   magazine. [TS]

00:27:01   I like large foreign magazines I didn't like it [TS]

00:27:03   when Edge magazine shrink to the small truck to the small from I think next gen also shrunk with no magazines going [TS]

00:27:08   downhill and they shrink to the Wired magazine I like that big format. [TS]

00:27:12   I want big not not twenty seven and she no but like a twelve inch I think that's fine and I want to be faster [TS]

00:27:19   and I'm multitasking and a split screen and all sorts of awesome stuff like that. [TS]

00:27:22   We talked about this stuff remember I do [TS]

00:27:24   but it just I think I tried to force myself to forget that if you want an i Pad that in almost no way resembles an i [TS]

00:27:32   Pad Now it's still a big screen that you hold in your hand it to resemble a knife always except it's slightly bigger [TS]

00:27:37   that's it and of course it's faster inside [TS]

00:27:39   and you know as more RAM involve a ball blog idea totally resembles an i Pad And anyway did we even finish this tweet I [TS]

00:27:47   didn't think it through. [TS]

00:27:48   Finishing a tweeting about it I was saying and they look round matches the strap [TS]

00:27:52   and yes I knew that I thought everybody knew that [TS]

00:27:54   but he was offering it as an idea of saying well that means maybe the. [TS]

00:28:00   The straps are interchangeable like they showed in the video that the straps coming in [TS]

00:28:03   and out of the major selling point of the logic can't believe some people saw them well you can swap it now because a [TS]

00:28:07   little bit of a crown is color coded so what so what you look at the little cut little crown is red. [TS]

00:28:13   Can you only get red bands now use black ones you can use white ones I don't know any about fashion [TS]

00:28:17   but I know that it's the right right look at the cases for the i Phone five C. [TS]

00:28:21   You know the half of the point of all these different colors was that you can mix [TS]

00:28:25   and match them remember I think was Schiller talked about oh you can have you know a blue phone with a red case for [TS]

00:28:31   this mood in a in a white case for that mood or something like that if you know exactly what he said but [TS]

00:28:35   but you're exactly right that it was they were talking about flipping things up in into liberally getting clashing [TS]

00:28:41   colors to be in so everyone can be their own special snowflake [TS]

00:28:45   and if you don't want that buy get one with a neutral call your over the Blackground as I'm sure there are that they [TS]

00:28:49   have I think the only color grounds I saw was like a maroon ish red that went with like the dark red band [TS]

00:28:54   and then a black one but you know the fact of the Crown's bass does not mean the straps [TS]

00:28:58   and I could be interchangeable they're totally interchangeable. [TS]

00:29:02   All right moving on this was my addition to the follow up. [TS]

00:29:06   Speaking of a friend of the show Jason Snell I was reading his apple watch edition review should we just call this the [TS]

00:29:13   Apple Watch Apple like the Ferrari La Ferrari so anyways he said in his review Yes there's a special box it's covered [TS]

00:29:22   in leather. [TS]

00:29:23   Inside is a magnetic charging cradle [TS]

00:29:26   and on the back of the box space is a slot into which you plug a Lightning connector. [TS]

00:29:31   That's right the Apple Watch edition is so fancy that the box is its own accessory [TS]

00:29:36   and I bring that up for a couple reasons firstly I didn't know that that was a thing and second [TS]

00:29:42   or secondly that how what how is this that how is that something that Apple considers the right thing to do [TS]

00:29:51   and if you're going to stand here [TS]

00:29:52   and tell me that oh a ten thousand dollar watch is way too expensive look at what they're doing for the freakin box I [TS]

00:29:58   wonder the minute. Doesn't come with a charging cable is that yeah I can understand. [TS]

00:30:02   Basically a doc like you know a member of the i Phone has become a doctor and the original came with a doctorate [TS]

00:30:06   and I remember and I think that's right. [TS]

00:30:08   But anyway they used to sell docs [TS]

00:30:10   but it seems like if you buy the Apple Watch edition it comes with essentially a dock which also happens to be the box [TS]

00:30:16   which is a nice place for you to put the watch when you're not using it which also charges it. [TS]

00:30:20   But I'm sure Apple will sell the little charging doohickey thing for all the regular people who don't buy the edition [TS]

00:30:25   edition and so you know it's all the same charging amongst all the boxes [TS]

00:30:30   but this type of luxury thing of like how can we make this as fancy as possible they do that with all their products [TS]

00:30:37   like the boxes are so beautiful when you open them up. [TS]

00:30:39   But it's all disposable stuff you throw away the cardboard box you throw away the little plastic pieces that you peel [TS]

00:30:43   off and everything. This I assume you won't throw away because it's actual accessory. What else is in here. [TS]

00:30:50   Oh a lot of feedback about Chip and PIN. You want to cover this John because I'm going to stumble over it. [TS]

00:30:57   I don't understand Also we're getting glimpses of what payment is like in the rest of the world from individual people [TS]

00:31:02   via mail so these people are wrong I'm sure we'd all right in tell us so. [TS]

00:31:06   Martin Gordon wrote in to say you think it's worth clarifying that the U.S. [TS]

00:31:10   Won't be getting to pimp anytime soon and said we're moving over to the next year chip [TS]

00:31:13   and signature our credit cards will come with chips but we won't be issued a pen [TS]

00:31:17   nor will be will we be required to enter a pin during transaction so that's kind of crappy will have chips in our cards [TS]

00:31:24   but we'll have still have to sign a name on a piece of paper for transactions that require that type of thing. [TS]

00:31:29   Doesn't surprise me but if this is true as disappointing. [TS]

00:31:35   TOM PHILLIPS tennis so two thousand for over the last year or so in the U.K. [TS]

00:31:39   We've had the introduction of contactless debit [TS]

00:31:40   and credit cards Coakley called just contactless you pay a chip unable to MIL's are dedicated contactless points [TS]

00:31:46   or anything under twenty pounds and I have no idea how much that is a real thing if Apple Pay were to arrive in U.K. [TS]

00:31:54   But I do wonder whether it would succeed to our payment system isn't as archaic as the US with contactless becoming [TS]

00:31:59   relatively. Well established popular are the benefits of Apple Pay had cracked enough to get people to switch. [TS]

00:32:04   I'm leaning towards no. [TS]

00:32:05   This goes back to Tim Cook's big thing about it's not just that you get a wave in front of a thing to pay for your [TS]

00:32:10   stuff it's that you get to not have to bring your wallet with you you don't have to bring are going to be undergoing i [TS]

00:32:14   Phone my car keys and my wallet. [TS]

00:32:17   If you want to go out and you want to have a way to pay for things you can just bring your phone [TS]

00:32:21   and I guess you just hope the battery doesn't run out before the bar tab comes at the end of the night anyway is right. [TS]

00:32:28   Apple Pay is a lot a lot easier to sell at sort of the dawning of contactless payment here in the U.S. [TS]

00:32:34   Than it is in other countries where contactless is already well established. [TS]

00:32:39   Yeah I don't I don't know I was going to do there. [TS]

00:32:41   It seem like all the deals Apple announced that the people who are accepting payments the suction of like McDonald's [TS]

00:32:46   that was international but a lot of the other stores look like they were US only. So since we live in the U.S. [TS]

00:32:53   You know we probably be fined if you just left him in the U.S. [TS]

00:32:56   Because everything here is so horrible but you know I don't know how I was going to do it in other countries. [TS]

00:33:03   Some more Apple Pay. Dave Copeland wrote in to say in the U.S. [TS]

00:33:07   The fraud policy of the banks heavily favor the card holder card total colored card holder can pretty easily have [TS]

00:33:12   charges removed by calling the bank who issued the charge in the U.K. [TS]

00:33:16   In Europe the banks are not so lenient with the card holders and it's much more difficult to have charges removed. [TS]

00:33:20   That's what Chip [TS]

00:33:21   and PIN is so prevalent across the pond that's why waiter brings a charging device to you rather than whisking your [TS]

00:33:25   card away to the back so that's another you know differences in the different pain environment of who who accepts the [TS]

00:33:33   who deals with fraud if something goes wrong who has to pay for it in the U.S. [TS]

00:33:38   We're all used to this is one good thing about the rest of us from consumer's perspective sort of kind of is that if [TS]

00:33:43   someone steals your credit card to make so much bogus charges with it [TS]

00:33:45   or some sort of fraud happens we all just zoom over call the credit card company notice take care of it like a creditor [TS]

00:33:51   coming to eat all that because they make so much more money having huge interest rates on everyone doesn't pay their [TS]

00:33:55   bills on time which is why they still make tons of money in the U.S. But and so the toll. [TS]

00:34:00   I'm going to eat all the other charges we just had yet another one of our credit cards stolen online a couple weeks [TS]

00:34:06   back and we're just like oh no big deal yeah they bought a bunch of stuff [TS]

00:34:09   but we know we're not going to pay for that well apparently in other countries it's not that way [TS]

00:34:13   and so there is a demand to be more secure and not just have you know to hear hear your way [TS]

00:34:18   or take my credit card walk away with it I don't care where you go if you skim it or buy something with it online [TS]

00:34:23   or whatever I'm just going to have those charges reversed and they'll send me a new card I want to pay for any of it. [TS]

00:34:27   But that's not true in other countries so they have much more secure payment systems that's interesting. [TS]

00:34:31   And his final point is something I've learned firsthand at one of the first e-commerce sites I made I guess about ten [TS]

00:34:38   years ago now twelve years ago a long time ago. [TS]

00:34:41   Is that a lot of these things you see on websites and in payment processing things like the C.V. [TS]

00:34:46   Code where you have to enter those little three digit number to pay for something with a credit card or signatures [TS]

00:34:52   or anything like that. That's entirely at the discretion of the person of the company selling something. [TS]

00:34:58   So when you do credit card transactions online you send the information to the payment processor [TS]

00:35:02   and they send you back a score that says here's how trustworthy this is [TS]

00:35:05   and you can decide I'm going to go forward with scores of you know above whatever value so well they'll send you back. [TS]

00:35:12   Well you know the card has a middle name but they didn't enter middle name [TS]

00:35:17   and the street address doesn't quite match [TS]

00:35:18   but the everything else in the address matches do you want to perceive this transaction if you say yes you know the [TS]

00:35:23   relationship between a business [TS]

00:35:24   and a credit card processor there is some relationship there over who covers what percent of fraud or whatever. [TS]

00:35:30   So it's up to it's up to the merchant basically to decide how how you know how flexible do you want to be [TS]

00:35:36   and I could say as someone who's implemented this you tend to be motivated highly to be very flexible believe it [TS]

00:35:42   or not because if you are super picky and like well their address says you know one two three Main Street [TS]

00:35:48   and the credit card address on file has one two three main S T N S T is not the same as street [TS]

00:35:54   and our process just to stupid to figure that out [TS]

00:35:56   and so doesn't give it a perfect score a match on that we want to go forward if you can. [TS]

00:36:00   Only went forward on like the highest possible score you would never make any money because you know you would never [TS]

00:36:04   accept anyone's credit cards you know they got the code almost right or they got it right [TS]

00:36:10   but didn't add like the plus for the end of it do you want to go for everything lowers your score if you know exactly [TS]

00:36:14   right and so you have to decide what risk you're willing to tolerate [TS]

00:36:18   and usually you're willing to go forward even if they miss tons of stuff like if they're slightly off on their address [TS]

00:36:23   don't quite get the name right didn't enter the zip code but the card number is right and don't have a C.V. [TS]

00:36:29   Is like just go forward because ninety nine percent of time it'll be fine [TS]

00:36:32   and the other percentage of the time you will see that in the workout so that's something else to keep in mind with all [TS]

00:36:36   of this secure payment type stuff. [TS]

00:36:38   Individual that's why that's why I imagine I don't know this to be the case that's why I imagine a lot of places now [TS]

00:36:44   don't require you to sign your name anymore is because the risk environment has changed they felt like they were not [TS]

00:36:49   getting any additional security from having somebody scribble something on a piece of paper for their five dollar [TS]

00:36:53   credit card purchase orders you know swipe the card and let's go. [TS]

00:36:58   All right George tell me about streamlined Apple Watch shape ideas you know that was not from last week [TS]

00:37:05   and remember what I was thinking of I know the fraud topic was member of the first avalanche I was saying I was [TS]

00:37:11   disappointed that it looks like a little lunch box on your wrist just like a little rectangle with straps coming out of [TS]

00:37:16   it I was hoping that they would do something to blend the strap into the main part of the watch in a way that was like [TS]

00:37:25   forward thinking like well now it's got to be a big chunky thing in your US [TS]

00:37:28   but five years from now won't be quite as chunky and it's best to go with an aesthetic that will seem natural then [TS]

00:37:35   but didn't they didn't try to mask out at all [TS]

00:37:38   and there are lots of ideas about from listeners about what they could do with a more streamlined shape if they had a [TS]

00:37:45   sort of a taper from the big thick part with the battery in the screen to the strap they still have removable strap the [TS]

00:37:51   strap sort of how to incorporate that paper somehow or whatever [TS]

00:37:54   but people are full of ideas of what they could do with that extra volume one of the most popular ideas. [TS]

00:38:00   Why don't they fill that place with a battery. [TS]

00:38:01   Well those little wedges belief in the fat part of the in part that's just another opportunity to shove a battery in [TS]

00:38:06   there. [TS]

00:38:07   I don't like that idea because one I don't like the idea of having battery out there [TS]

00:38:11   or my around my wrist because looking at my own batteries can get very hot and catch fire and stuff [TS]

00:38:16   and I guess it's also true of the wanted inside the watch but that's inside metal [TS]

00:38:19   and I feel a little better about that into I don't think working on batteries take very kindly to being bent which [TS]

00:38:25   means that the taper would have to be sort of a one to make. [TS]

00:38:27   Once you make the taper stiff then that is the number of different risks that it can fit on is drastically altered just [TS]

00:38:35   like you do not want like it's better after you've got the stiff little rectangular part right. [TS]

00:38:39   If you made little wings hanging off of the thing they were also stiff because they contain battery. [TS]

00:38:44   Then they would sit very awkwardly on people with either make it so it it's OK [TS]

00:38:48   and people with very large respond then it looks ridiculous some people small [TS]

00:38:50   or vice versa so that I think is a non-starter. [TS]

00:38:53   They made a tape [TS]

00:38:54   or it would have to I don't think there's anything useful you can do with that paper other than maybe put some sensors [TS]

00:38:59   in and if you want to have like the pulse sensors off centered or something else [TS]

00:39:03   and there are like seven accelerometer in there but I don't think you can use it for battery [TS]

00:39:07   and I don't think you can make it Stephan anyway is not the direction Apple went in. [TS]

00:39:10   I think that's all I was thinking about this one line fall by them. [TS]

00:39:15   We're also sponsored this week once again by Harry's going to Harry's dot com That's H A R R Y S dot com [TS]

00:39:22   or you can put an apostrophe into my name and use a promo code A.T.P. [TS]

00:39:26   To say five dollars off your first purchase for many of us shaving is a pain. [TS]

00:39:31   It sucks it's uncomfortable and causes next cut scrapes and razor burn [TS]

00:39:35   and reader blades today are outrageously expensive. [TS]

00:39:38   Harrison started by two guys who wanted a better product without paying an arm and a leg. [TS]

00:39:42   Harry's make their own blades from their own factory. [TS]

00:39:45   It'll bleed factory in Germany delight so much so they actually bought it. [TS]

00:39:49   Harry's makes high quality high performing German blades crafted by shaving experts. [TS]

00:39:53   You give you a better shave that respects your face and your wallet. Harry's offers factory direct pricing and a fresh. [TS]

00:40:00   Action of the big brands cost Harry's blades are about half the price. [TS]

00:40:04   Plus I guess half of the fractions Plus you don't have to wait around for the guy to come unlock the ante shoplifting [TS]

00:40:10   case the drug store and buy them or anything like that. [TS]

00:40:12   They ship them directly to your door [TS]

00:40:14   and shipping is free on almost every order I think it's over ten dollars for each so pretty much almost every order [TS]

00:40:19   shipping is free so they have a starter set. It's really an amazing deal actually. [TS]

00:40:23   It's fifteen bucks for a starter set and you get a raise or moisturizing shave cream and three razor blades [TS]

00:40:30   and we need more blades there and how many you buy. [TS]

00:40:33   They started just two dollars each and they go down all the way to like a dollar fifty eight [TS]

00:40:37   or something like that if by bunch so a package is fifteen dollars a sixteen pack is just twenty five dollars [TS]

00:40:44   and I would say so they sent me. [TS]

00:40:45   They sent me a set I try to do it I would say Harry's blades are very comparable in the shave quality to fusion [TS]

00:40:55   non-privileged leads they don't really have a particular to look for to the program. [TS]

00:40:59   Strip but I'm a I was a big fan of fusion before [TS]

00:41:02   and I would say Harry's blades are just as good if not better for the shave. [TS]

00:41:06   Now the best price I found on Amazon for fusion blades right before the show I took a look to make sure it was a twelve [TS]

00:41:13   pack for forty one dollars twelve Harry's blades. [TS]

00:41:17   It's only twenty bucks so that is less than half the price of the fusions [TS]

00:41:21   and if you do your own comparisons you will see the Harry's blades are roughly half the price of high end other blades [TS]

00:41:28   from other companies anyway. I was also very impressed by the great packaging they had you know very classy. [TS]

00:41:35   Some might say hipster I would say classy because you know there's a lot from history culture that is quite good [TS]

00:41:41   and worth spreading around so I would say it's very very nice very you know just a classy design it's like kind of like [TS]

00:41:47   calls back to old school shaving designs without being like overly romantic about it just you know a nice classy design [TS]

00:41:54   they have a couple couple handles to choose from I like them both honestly handlers and heavy how they feel. [TS]

00:42:00   I quality I really I was very impressed by them [TS]

00:42:02   and again the packaging is amazing it just it's just overall very nice to deal with them. [TS]

00:42:06   It's I had a very positive experience the entire time anyway [TS]

00:42:11   but here you think it means an ease of ordering online high quality blades a great handle and shaving cream [TS]

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00:42:33   And of course you let them know that you came from here so they should keep buying sponsorships which helps everybody. [TS]

00:42:38   So thanks a lot to Harry's going to Harry's dot com He's from a good A.T.P. [TS]

00:42:41   For five bucks off thank you very much to Harry for sponsoring the show again. OK so we got a lot of feedback. [TS]

00:42:49   Well I thought about the casing of the text watch what are we still talking about the watch. Yes I am. [TS]

00:42:58   John insists that we got to do all this follow that along is a quickie is Robert Thompson prob something I thought was [TS]

00:43:04   funny like are we talking about the small caps thing with the watch [TS]

00:43:08   and I said well you know with the little apple logo in front of it [TS]

00:43:11   and it's kind of silly you know we just write out Apple Watch [TS]

00:43:13   but they would use the little symbol on money doing slides like what we've got a president with Apple T.V. [TS]

00:43:17   Where they show a little apple logo and I'm like well of course T.V. [TS]

00:43:20   Is always capitalized it's you know short of television or whatever. [TS]

00:43:23   But Robert Thompson points out that when they do happen T.V. and I'd forgotten about this they do lower case T.V. [TS]

00:43:28   So so much that I think they did a little apple and the lower case T. [TS]

00:43:31   With a little care on the bottom and anyway there's no rhyme or reason to this [TS]

00:43:36   or so we thought until Jim sent us something that says reference is a classic vocabulary with the all caps like Omega [TS]

00:43:44   Rolex tag or TOG I don't know [TS]

00:43:46   and that other things are said to be that I'm not going to pronounce probably they do auto case in their name brand [TS]

00:43:52   things on their watches. [TS]

00:43:53   Well so maybe I was trying to go with that and again I think it's crazy to do that [TS]

00:43:57   and just use the word watch it is like. Really parody of a Rolex Omega. [TS]

00:44:02   Also watch All right let me explain this to everybody. Apple T.V. [TS]

00:44:09   Is lower cased in the marketing logo worth the Apple logo followed by lower case T.V. [TS]

00:44:14   Because somebody thought it looked good at the time. [TS]

00:44:17   Apple Watch [TS]

00:44:18   when it's built in a marketing way with the Apple logo followed by the all small caps watch is that way because [TS]

00:44:23   somebody thought it looked good that way most likely because it's written very small on the watch [TS]

00:44:27   and very small lettering looks great when it's in small caps. That is why it's that way. It is marketing reasons only. [TS]

00:44:33   It doesn't matter if you think you are going to put the little apple logo on the watch next to the word watch like [TS]

00:44:38   Apple logo watch. Yeah. Didn't they already show that they are doing that. [TS]

00:44:42   I don't know I have I know they put it up on the slide when they introduced it [TS]

00:44:45   but that's another going to have it on the watch itself. [TS]

00:44:48   We've seen pictures of the back in the video so I'm pretty sure that does it doesn't matter it. [TS]

00:44:51   Either way it doesn't matter. They thought it looked good that's why they're there was not. [TS]

00:44:56   I guarantee you there was no thought put into oh well it's different from the way we capitalize Apple T.V. [TS]

00:45:01   I guarantee you no one brought that up and no one cares you can change the capitalization [TS]

00:45:05   and you can change whether you pull out the logo but it's going to be hard to change the name [TS]

00:45:08   and the name is still watch and I guess the name is still T.V. To Apple T.V. [TS]

00:45:14   Somehow sounds better to me than maybe I will get used to [TS]

00:45:17   but I feel like I still have not gotten used to mac book so I just I think I can hold a grudge against this one. [TS]

00:45:22   Mac book is permanently awkward I give you that power because such a great name and MacBook was so awkward. [TS]

00:45:27   I also for whatever it's worth I did think Apple T.V. [TS]

00:45:30   At first was extremely awkward and I got used to it and didn't care anymore. [TS]

00:45:33   But also to talk about that much because who cares. The Apple T.V. You know. [TS]

00:45:38   All right and then John would you like to defend yourself regarding. I watch no I.Q. [TS]

00:45:46   and I think I'm not doing it on purpose. Trying to get better. [TS]

00:45:50   So in the follow up Nathan Watkins Jr sent us that Microsoft paid the N.F.L. [TS]

00:45:56   Four hundred million to use the surface and a couple of commentators still call them I've had. [TS]

00:46:00   And so I assumed that you would place that in the follow up strictly to defend your erroneous I don't know that an [TS]

00:46:07   interesting story like talk about watch being a generic term [TS]

00:46:10   but no name that you pick can be defended against whatever the term is for likely an X. [TS]

00:46:16   Where the name brand becomes genericized into mean you know you have a Kleenex for me [TS]

00:46:21   or God forbid if you live in the south and someone says do you want to coke [TS]

00:46:25   and I say Yeah what kind of give me a sprite. [TS]

00:46:27   I know I never anything to be generous of anything you're not defended against that by picking watched by picking i Pad [TS]

00:46:34   it little tabouli things are so defined by the i Pad product in the same way I guess tissues are so defined by the [TS]

00:46:40   Kleenex brand that the commentators in these N.F.L. [TS]

00:46:44   Programs couldn't help but say all of those guys in a silent holding i Pads are not their Microsoft Surface tablets [TS]

00:46:49   but i Pad is the word that is the placeholder in lots of people's minds for a tablet thing even more so than any i [TS]

00:46:56   Phone is for a smartphone because that I think you know Android sells more than the i Phone [TS]

00:47:01   and it wasn't that far behind [TS]

00:47:02   but Apple was so far ahead in the tablets they were only company made any tablet that anyone cared about at all that [TS]

00:47:07   was and it worth a damn at all for so long like it was a year or two years before I guess the Amazon tablet came out [TS]

00:47:13   or whatever that in the public consciousness if you were holding a thing that looked like a disinvite screen it was an [TS]

00:47:18   i Pad So now providers have paid four hundred million dollars to get service into the hands of only going to help [TS]

00:47:23   people [TS]

00:47:24   and the company which is called the my i Pad in the same way they might call a tissue Kleenex even those not Kleenex [TS]

00:47:29   brand so I feel bad for Microsoft here [TS]

00:47:32   but I mean point putting isn't is that no name you pick even if it's Amy you totally make up like i Pad or you know [TS]

00:47:38   or Kleenex or anything else you're always at risk of being genericized indeed [TS]

00:47:43   and then another piece fall out that I put in a while back. [TS]

00:47:46   There's more I know you know hey I was trying to curb it but we're we're almost on fulfilling time for that [TS]

00:47:52   but they told us he decreed that we will do all of the F.-U. Anyway so I like everyone else. [TS]

00:48:00   Hey if Steve were alive I can say the word I'm looking for but but retort I guess for lack of a better word. [TS]

00:48:07   But but trope thank you that is that is a much better word for it. [TS]

00:48:10   But somebody posted a little while ago a really really really great write up about how the Apple keynote announcing the [TS]

00:48:19   six the six plus the watch perhaps would have gone different gone differently had Steve done it in the typical Steve [TS]

00:48:27   style and if the whole if Steve were alive thing also really turns you off just forget that and just read this. [TS]

00:48:35   This page which will put the show notes just as a general alternative approach to the Keynote [TS]

00:48:42   and there were certainly some like maybe not factual things [TS]

00:48:45   but there were some little idiosyncrasies about this that I didn't totally care for [TS]

00:48:49   but overall I do think that this approach to the Keynote just sounded better in principle to me than the keynote we got [TS]

00:48:59   and I don't know if either of you to read this or had any thoughts about it [TS]

00:49:02   but I definitely think it's worth those of you listening to to read it at your convenience because it was very good. [TS]

00:49:09   Yeah I read it it's on its own. [TS]

00:49:10   GIGOT e dot com And this is really my person in John moon cam and I'm positive I mispronounced that. [TS]

00:49:18   I saw this being spread around and I thought as probably many listeners thought [TS]

00:49:22   when he first saw it I thought oh God it's going to be you know it's going to be somebody complaining that Tim isn't [TS]

00:49:26   Steve basically and and I for some reason I eventually read it against my better judgment. [TS]

00:49:33   And it really did surprise me with you know I thought for sure again like I did that I thought was going to be just [TS]

00:49:38   complaints that Tim is not Stephen because tim tim can't be Steve [TS]

00:49:42   and he's not trying to be Steve he's trying to beat him. [TS]

00:49:45   And that's I think for the best [TS]

00:49:48   but I think we've seen over time from other tech companies people who try to imitate Steve Jobs's presentation style [TS]

00:49:55   always fail and it's really painful. But if you see like when's October. Did it. [TS]

00:50:00   Jeff Bezos tries to do it but God knows everybody from Samsung Tresidder. [TS]

00:50:04   It's painful and you know if you just try to be yourself it's a much better idea anyway. [TS]

00:50:11   So I read this [TS]

00:50:13   and there was a lot in there that I was like you know actually that's a really good point why didn't they do it that [TS]

00:50:19   way or yeah that would have actually been better liked and they plausibly could have done that and [TS]

00:50:25   and I you know the main focus of it I think is like you know [TS]

00:50:29   and we've heard that we've seen other people talk about this to our friend Ben Thompson talked about this a lot as well. [TS]

00:50:35   You know we've seen it in the presentation. [TS]

00:50:39   Tim basically introduces the watch not by saying here's why this is necessary [TS]

00:50:45   but just by showing it just be like here's this thing we've got this really cool look and there it is [TS]

00:50:50   and there's the planet and the sun rises above the planet and then this watch comes in [TS]

00:50:55   and it's like a watch spaceship [TS]

00:50:57   and you see all the cool light reflecting off with an easy watch of spinning around for five minutes and it's [TS]

00:51:01   and then Johnny hides in his white world talking about it [TS]

00:51:03   and it just really it assumes the presumption of the video was this is really cool and you need to buy it. [TS]

00:51:11   And here's why it's so cool. [TS]

00:51:13   And here's this is going to be really big as opposed to the way Steve would usually introduce a new product categories [TS]

00:51:20   like the way he did with the first the i Pod and then the the i Phone of course [TS]

00:51:24   and I've had here introduce it kind of first by saying why it needs to exist why we need to want it [TS]

00:51:31   and then showing it to us and then saying you know here given all of the things I just said [TS]

00:51:35   and why you should want this and why this device need to exist here it is. [TS]

00:51:40   And Tim really didn't do that with the Apple Watch introduction I was at I watch Tim didn't really do that. [TS]

00:51:47   He just showed it and said Here it is [TS]

00:51:49   and we're kind of left to our own devices to figure out well OK this thing is cool and it looks cool [TS]

00:51:56   but why do we want to wear a watch especially for the many. [TS]

00:52:00   Give us for whom we haven't been wearing watches since we got cell phones because cell phones made watches unnecessary [TS]

00:52:05   for almost everybody except for fashion reasons and even then it's not that common [TS]

00:52:10   and especially among younger people so he didn't do that so I think there is a lot of valid criticism to be made about [TS]

00:52:17   the way this was introduced in the presentation. [TS]

00:52:21   And [TS]

00:52:21   and this article on dot com was really good I thought it was you know parts it was like a little bit over the top a little [TS]

00:52:29   bit contrived but overall I'd say it was very good and way better than I expected from the premise. [TS]

00:52:34   Completely Curry I don't really like this article. [TS]

00:52:37   I think I think what it leaned on a lot of is two things One the fact that we all miss Steve Jobs [TS]

00:52:43   and lean on that it's like hey when I was still alive. [TS]

00:52:46   Yes it would and to is played fast [TS]

00:52:50   and loose with the actual things that they were announcing it made Apple announced things that Apple didn't actually. [TS]

00:52:55   announce and boy wouldn't it be cool if Apple had said X. Y. and Z. and Did X. Y. and Z. [TS]

00:53:00   I agree that Steve Jobs would have presented this better than Tim Cook. [TS]

00:53:03   I don't think anyone disagrees that Steve Jobs is a better PRESENTER The root of it is most likely in that the [TS]

00:53:08   particulars of the person in that Steve Jobs has excited about different things than Tim Cook is excited about for the [TS]

00:53:15   price I think Tim Cook really is excited about the watches but in the stew hands in the air [TS]

00:53:18   and shaking his fist like I really believe he is excited but he's excited about different aspects of the product. [TS]

00:53:24   And Steve Jobs is excited about the same aspects of the product that we're excited about. [TS]

00:53:28   Cool technology ways to change your life with with technology particular small features you know the little Genie go in [TS]

00:53:36   and out of the dock like all the things we want to about Steve Jobs also would not attempt is excited about different [TS]

00:53:41   stuff. [TS]

00:53:41   So to me the less relatable PRESENTER The main value to the articles providing what Marco got out is there was no one [TS]

00:53:50   there explained to us in the way that Steve Jobs felt like it was necessary to explain to us why we're doing this. [TS]

00:53:56   Tim tries to explain why or has other people come in stage do. I speak in it. [TS]

00:54:01   It's more kind of like they speak in generalities or in sort of corporate speaker [TS]

00:54:05   and big picture speak where Steve Jobs would break down a much more primal level and say here's a problem. [TS]

00:54:11   Here's what we thought about this before about that here's a solution we think you're going to use it for this [TS]

00:54:15   and there's been good Steve Jobs vision balance the reason I like this article is that like Wouldn't it be great if [TS]

00:54:20   this guy you really love is still alive and he announced things in a super dramatic way [TS]

00:54:24   and also now some cooler things than were announced [TS]

00:54:26   and that I feel like it's just it's cheating I think you know this is not this article is not a guideline viable can to [TS]

00:54:33   present a better presentations unless they can do cooler things [TS]

00:54:36   and resurrect Steve Jobs so I would have rather seen this article. [TS]

00:54:42   I mean I have yet to see the article it says Steve Jobs was alive X. Y. and Z. [TS]

00:54:45   That I've liked [TS]

00:54:46   and this continues that trend sort of better explaining what was wrong with Tim Cook's presentation you can compare it [TS]

00:54:52   to successful presentations by Steve Jobs [TS]

00:54:54   and I think if his actual presentation happen the way they said it would be overblown for what they actually announced [TS]

00:55:00   you know our personal universe company Apple if Apple to the ones they do and it was Steve Jobs it would be ridiculous. [TS]

00:55:06   So you did not like it as much as you guys did but you know it was not perfect [TS]

00:55:12   but I think it did it did make a lot of very good point [TS]

00:55:14   and it did it did show a lot of things that Apple could have done. [TS]

00:55:18   Plausibly and differently and and they chose not to [TS]

00:55:21   and it also depends on like the context I think a couple I mean this most recent probably like this most recent I [TS]

00:55:28   thought was not a Steve Jobs presentation [TS]

00:55:31   but was really good like this is the type of stuff that Steve Jobs wouldn't have known how to describe in interesting [TS]

00:55:37   way all of the the new language the development tools the showing new versions of the O. S. [TS]

00:55:44   All that software [TS]

00:55:45   and developer tool stuff was presented by people who knew about it in a style that is different Steve Jobs style [TS]

00:55:51   and I thought it was one of the better keynote for the audience that was given to maybe not to the press or whatever [TS]

00:55:57   but for a roomful of developers. Everybody was just. [TS]

00:56:00   You know it was jazz that ever had something to be jazzed about in that area you see presentation I think [TS]

00:56:05   but only been to work for them in person [TS]

00:56:07   or whatever I think that was extremely successful compared to the last job study there are these even in very bad [TS]

00:56:13   health there but he didn't have the type of stuff to announce that he likes to announce. [TS]

00:56:17   So the watch room is definitely him. [TS]

00:56:18   Steve Jobs is wheel house but there are other presentations than that are in the current Apple's wheel house. [TS]

00:56:23   Yeah it was very clearly. [TS]

00:56:25   Steve Jobs is always very bad at hiding [TS]

00:56:28   when he didn't feel that strongly about something he did he was very bad in hiding that I think Tim Cook has kind of a [TS]

00:56:35   different problem which is Tim Cook is really excited about certain things [TS]

00:56:39   and he doesn't you know he doesn't understand that he needs to kind of lead us to that point before just telling us how [TS]

00:56:45   excited he is or he doesn't know how to lead us to that point [TS]

00:56:48   or he's excited about things that we're not likely I bet he if he presented to like the organization of people who [TS]

00:56:54   manage supply chains whatever their name is like he would be super excited about the details of those things you know [TS]

00:56:59   like he's he's excited about different things I don't want to hear us talk about finance or supply chains [TS]

00:57:06   or making deals or like they have an example if we ever get to it the Charlie Rose interview [TS]

00:57:13   and the interview that Tim Cook has given show the things that he's excited about. [TS]

00:57:18   They just happen to be the same things as Steve Jobs excite about he's just a different person. [TS]

00:57:22   Like pull on a chair [TS]

00:57:24   and said that that article struck in the Steve Jobs fan section I think that is a reasonable approximation of what it [TS]

00:57:30   is and if you like Steve Jobs and direction then that's a good example of it [TS]

00:57:33   but it was not in the mood for Steve Jobs and fiction I would say that. Let's let's turn to the Tim Cook. [TS]

00:57:40   Charlie Rose in it because we're talking about it anyway. That was first of all very good. [TS]

00:57:44   It took me a second I had to downloading it from somewhere [TS]

00:57:47   and watching it with quick time player at like one point five six is not a fast speaker [TS]

00:57:52   and it got a little bit slow times but so I had to I had to get through it twice before I really. [TS]

00:58:00   Appreciate it at the first going out. [TS]

00:58:03   Switch to other tabs and do a thing and all that's right up play in the background. [TS]

00:58:07   Anyway so I want to pay attention to it it really is quite good. [TS]

00:58:11   It does show like it shows him getting slightly at ease here and there [TS]

00:58:18   and you could tell like the real Tim is coming out when he's slightly off the cuff [TS]

00:58:23   and you can tell he doesn't really go off the cuff ever like [TS]

00:58:26   and this is probably as far as he ever gets you know because he's of he's a very very controlled person in public he [TS]

00:58:33   you could tell he says things very deliberately very thoughtfully. [TS]

00:58:37   But just seeing that a little bit more of his personality in this was I think extremely positive and interesting [TS]

00:58:45   and I want to see more of the Tim Cook that we saw on Charlie Rose like I think he should let more of that come out [TS]

00:58:53   because what we saw there was Tim really caring very strongly about certain things like privacy where like he came out [TS]

00:59:01   so hard in privacy We'll talk about that too I guess. Like Tim is not just some boring paper pusher. [TS]

00:59:08   He has a very strongly principled guy and he feels very strongly about certain things [TS]

00:59:13   and I feel like so far he has not let a lot of that out. [TS]

00:59:18   You know possibly because it wasn't you know he didn't think it was the right time because there are some so much so [TS]

00:59:24   many eyes on him everyone looking for him to like mess up [TS]

00:59:26   or you know do something do something indicate he's not fit for the job or [TS]

00:59:30   or whatever so you know maybe he's been going into it slowly but the Tim Cook that we saw on Charlie Rose. [TS]

00:59:37   I would like to see more from the hear read that was at a Bloomberg interview some lengthy interview with him [TS]

00:59:45   and got into it was with those covers by the way what was that. Yeah well I think those are real. [TS]

00:59:50   Yeah I thought they were fake for the first several tweets to go in the game and reverencing fibrous they were real [TS]

00:59:56   and I join them in their surprise about in their flesh. [TS]

01:00:00   After I had forgot that was a paper magazine had a cover and I was just on line anyway [TS]

01:00:05   but I think it was Boomer I'll try to find a link for the show notes. [TS]

01:00:08   There was an interview that was like a condensed version of what I thought were the most revealing parts of the Charlie [TS]

01:00:12   Rose interview [TS]

01:00:13   and I get sad what what Tim Cook really cares about beyond the things beyond obviously his job which is managing a big [TS]

01:00:22   company and C.E.O. As C.E.O. [TS]

01:00:24   Is usually tend not to talk to the public about aspects of their job because who cares about SEO That's why I was [TS]

01:00:29   saying if Tim Cook was talking to a group of other C.E.O.'s of other people who have similar jobs managing large [TS]

01:00:33   organizations he would have a lot of interesting things to say to them but not to consumers [TS]

01:00:37   and then there's the technology part which Tim Cook appreciates and understands [TS]

01:00:41   but is not a geek about like Steve Jobs was right he's not obsessed with one particular software feature [TS]

01:00:47   or one particular hardware feature and just marveling over it everything you can tell that when you're the C.E.O. [TS]

01:00:53   You can imbue the company with some aspects of your personality and like Mark was saying. [TS]

01:01:00   Tim Cook has been hesitant to do that so thus far kind of like just being the sort of guy behind the scenes like he has [TS]

01:01:06   been for so long but I think maybe in the mac pro you know what was that twenty eleven twenty twelve that's [TS]

01:01:14   when his personality started to come out a little bit more where he was starting to become willing to use Apple the [TS]

01:01:20   company as a vehicle to achieve goals that are personally important to him [TS]

01:01:26   and those goals as expressed on Charlie Rose and his interviews are about the environment privacy and human rights [TS]

01:01:34   and diversity topics. Very little to do with Apple watches or IMAX or anything like that. [TS]

01:01:43   But now he is finally coming out [TS]

01:01:45   and saying I'm the leader of the biggest company in the United States may be the biggest company in the world. [TS]

01:01:50   I have tremendous power. [TS]

01:01:52   I want to use that power to achieve things are important to me because I think they're good ideas. [TS]

01:01:58   They're not the goals of the company Apple is not. [TS]

01:02:00   Turning into you know an organization that just deals with the environment and human rights and privacy. [TS]

01:02:04   But in the course of doing the things our bill does making great products to make people's lives better that they [TS]

01:02:09   really love unlovable all that stuff. [TS]

01:02:12   They can also do these things and part of that is him going on shows [TS]

01:02:15   and saying here's what we really care about like a diversity reporter there was talk in the text interview about the [TS]

01:02:21   diversity report they put out I think you mention on the show saying what percentage of Apple's employees are what age [TS]

01:02:27   would what race what gender all this other stuff. [TS]

01:02:30   And Tim Cook saying that internally there was friction about like should we publish just because we look terrible like [TS]

01:02:36   our diversity numbers are not good. [TS]

01:02:38   Should we even publish this [TS]

01:02:39   and Tim Cook made the decision apparently over the objections of other people like no where we have to walk the walk I [TS]

01:02:45   care about diversity. [TS]

01:02:47   If we're not doing a good job we want to be transparent about that we're going to put out this thing [TS]

01:02:50   and write in the thing that they publish. [TS]

01:02:52   You know Tim Cook saying a little text and things says we are not happy with these numbers. [TS]

01:02:57   How often do you see a gigantic company publish something that they know or centrally make them look bad [TS]

01:03:02   and admit in plain language writing the thing. [TS]

01:03:05   This report shows that we are not achieving our goal as you know as well as I want to. [TS]

01:03:10   We're not happy with this we're going to try to do better but here's what it is anyway. [TS]

01:03:14   So that's what's fascinating to me is that now the biggest company in the world is being run by somebody who cares [TS]

01:03:20   about things and is willing to put his money [TS]

01:03:24   and his company where his mouth is unlike with the whole data center trying to run entire data center of renewable [TS]

01:03:29   energy despite the fact that it adds tremendous complication and cost I'm sure [TS]

01:03:33   and the same thing with a crazy space ship type of thing. [TS]

01:03:36   We haven't money we just throw a data center out there and we just pay for electricity will be fine [TS]

01:03:39   but can we build gigantic solar farms in North Carolina do you just making it harder for yourself you just like it [TS]

01:03:44   doesn't make business sense right. That's like one of the shareholder meeting. [TS]

01:03:48   And Tim Cook practically shouted the guy down [TS]

01:03:50   and said look if you're looking for someone who's just going to make decisions based on return on investment get out of [TS]

01:03:54   the stock. I'm you know tough luck right. That's the real Tim Cook and. [TS]

01:04:00   We don't relate to it as much because like all we like to Steve Jobs he was totally into like the pixels in the cool [TS]

01:04:04   edges and the designs [TS]

01:04:05   and Johnny Ive likes you know carving things with diamonds a robot can cook cares about privacy human rights [TS]

01:04:10   and environment and overall health and those topics although they may not be Technorati. [TS]

01:04:17   It's refreshing to see them sort of bravely and boldly both express and acted on by someone with as much power [TS]

01:04:23   and money as time goes well and I think what Tim is doing is not only like you know interesting [TS]

01:04:30   and progressive from like a social environmental perspective it's also just good business like he's not going to do [TS]

01:04:37   anything that's going to really damage Apple's business. He's smarter than that. [TS]

01:04:41   Everything he does is is carefully measured he knows what he's getting into [TS]

01:04:46   and he's doing it because he has probably decided it's worth it [TS]

01:04:50   and it will be a net gain for the company like you know [TS]

01:04:54   when you're as big as Apple as as they as we all know you get people attacking you for all sorts of crazy stuff you [TS]

01:05:01   know and some of it is fair and some of it isn't [TS]

01:05:03   and it is very important for Apple to maintain its reputation specially in fashion [TS]

01:05:09   but you know it's very important for them to not be known as a company that has all these like you know labor abuses in [TS]

01:05:15   China and not you know to the company that's destroying the environment all the data and everything else like [TS]

01:05:19   and not do as a company that sells your data to advertisers like it is very important for Apple to maintain these these [TS]

01:05:26   images to you know to to to address the issues that are coming up in technology so a few years ago those issues were [TS]

01:05:33   environmental. Today they're diversity like that. [TS]

01:05:36   These issues are coming up and they're being talked about and they're [TS]

01:05:38   and accusations are being thrown around what do you do what do you do about it what are you doing about your companies [TS]

01:05:43   that probably are companies the problem. [TS]

01:05:45   Tim Cook is getting ahead of these things when he can or at least responding to them when he needs to [TS]

01:05:50   and that I think serves Apple well overall. [TS]

01:05:53   You know releasing a diversity report and saying I'm not happy with this and work [TS]

01:05:58   and we're trying to do better than this. That is smart. [TS]

01:06:02   It is it is both socially responsible and good business [TS]

01:06:06   and I think that again what we're seeing from Tim Cook all over the place he does things that are smart [TS]

01:06:11   and good business. [TS]

01:06:13   And he you know because you know the thing on a stock like you it was addressing a question about environmental stuff [TS]

01:06:21   and making things as out of line [TS]

01:06:23   and everything it's like they're like that is not costing Apple a meaningful amount like it is not making them a lot a [TS]

01:06:30   sieve a severely less profitable company [TS]

01:06:33   and certainly is not making an unprofitable company to care about things like this. [TS]

01:06:37   So like it is it isn't harming their business meaningfully like [TS]

01:06:40   and shutting down sometimes shareholder meeting probably helped their business because that was reported everywhere as [TS]

01:06:46   look how good this guy is he is he has things under control [TS]

01:06:49   and he's principled like he does things that help you know I was trying to find the exact thing in that in that [TS]

01:06:57   interview with him [TS]

01:06:58   but it was a similar question from the interviewer about whether there is some tension between you [TS]

01:07:04   and other people your organization about what the company should do [TS]

01:07:08   and the question put to him cook in the role of someone who wanted to just go ahead with something because they were [TS]

01:07:13   like you know one of Johnny I've said it's not good enough or you said well we got to ship something now [TS]

01:07:17   and I can cook it maybe was a different question re would Tim Cook answer made the point that he's not a short term [TS]

01:07:22   C.E.O. [TS]

01:07:23   He's not looking for we got to make our numbers next quarter and that's [TS]

01:07:26   when you're getting a market with like these things look like oh you're being so brave or whatever [TS]

01:07:31   but they also happened to be in the long run better for the company better for the planet better for everybody is just [TS]

01:07:37   that so much thinking especially in large corporations like I don't care what's going to long run just make your money [TS]

01:07:42   now get it while the getting's good and forget about long term consequences [TS]

01:07:46   and the right decision if you if your time winter was longer than a year [TS]

01:07:49   or two the right decision is about renewable energy to care about diversity to care about the working editions in China [TS]

01:07:56   and all those stuff right. Those are actually not only the right thing to do. [TS]

01:08:00   But better for the company in the same way that Apple has proven like if we just care if we pay attention to the [TS]

01:08:04   products we don't make a million products and try to sell [TS]

01:08:06   and every little market category some people want to harbor a keyboard some people don't some people want to big [TS]

01:08:10   computers somebody want to smoke I get to fill every single little thing. [TS]

01:08:13   No they have a small number of products that make them as good as they can. [TS]

01:08:16   The diversify is needed but they're not like all the companies like H.P. [TS]

01:08:19   Just will make a product for every single person every single purpose [TS]

01:08:22   or is going to get the money now going to get a get it. Long term that's not a good long term. [TS]

01:08:25   Apple has focused on the product make a few products really awesome don't get into businesses where just for the hell [TS]

01:08:30   of it like one of things they're talking about is all the different kinds of products that our research [TS]

01:08:34   and decided not to make short term that looks dumb like seems like a waste of money. [TS]

01:08:39   Long term Apple's program for the winning strategy so all these things it does [TS]

01:08:44   and the Apple the company does are always focused on the long term. [TS]

01:08:47   And two people so focused on the short term it seems like they're making the wrong call [TS]

01:08:53   but it is actually the right thing to do and also the thing that will make Apple's successful years [TS]

01:08:58   and years down the line. [TS]

01:09:00   You know whether investors care about that because they want to get in out of the stock of the average [TS]

01:09:05   or the average time a stock is held now these days is like less than a year when you know few minutes now. [TS]

01:09:10   Well hypothetical trading but yeah it's just a different mindset and it is the correct mindset [TS]

01:09:16   and it's kind of an that's nice that's fine for my own type of situation with well if you're Apple you can afford to [TS]

01:09:21   have that thing but it's the reverse. [TS]

01:09:23   If you have that attitude that's your only chance of ever becoming a company like Apple. [TS]

01:09:27   Our final sponsor this week is our friends that hover once again which I now know I'm pronouncing correctly. [TS]

01:09:32   Thanks to cover [TS]

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01:10:22   and that's not a common thing in this business. We all love her. [TS]

01:10:27   Hover gives you the best tools the best support even if you never answer to Maine [TS]

01:10:31   and you will love hover too the service is simple enough to use they will become full figured out yourself [TS]

01:10:36   and support team is always ready if you need a hand they offer really amazing support actually they offer you know [TS]

01:10:41   twenty four seventh's you know various emails of like that and they also have during business hours phone support. [TS]

01:10:47   You can just call them and talk to somebody a real person picks up. [TS]

01:10:50   Evan no hold no weight no transfer phone support policy so you can just call in any time during business hours. [TS]

01:10:56   A real person takes the phone [TS]

01:10:57   and is right there able to help you you don't have to be transferred to a million people you know to wait [TS]

01:11:01   and hold listening to music is even worse than cases for you know hours and hours on end. [TS]

01:11:05   All you gotta do is call them up real person picks up quite amazing. [TS]

01:11:09   They also have this wonderful service called Valley transfer service where if you are transferring from one registrar [TS]

01:11:15   to hover They will your option if you want to get in the [TS]

01:11:20   or logon information they will walk into your old registrar for you and transfer everything for you. [TS]

01:11:25   All notational charge [TS]

01:11:27   and what they're doing you know one transfer ten transfers hundreds of transfer they will do it no charge. [TS]

01:11:35   Some you know doing doing tricks by yourself is not easy even if you know how to do it. [TS]

01:11:40   It's still just tedious at best. [TS]

01:11:42   There's lots of opportunities for small errors [TS]

01:11:44   or big errors especially with moving D.N.A.'s they do all that for you if you want to anyway are now being told by the [TS]

01:11:52   chat room ranting valet wrong don't care maybe it's of a let go of the let you know in the. Service anyway. [TS]

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01:12:13   pay for renewal so check that out as well. [TS]

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01:12:21   and it's good I highly recommend however use them myself they're great. [TS]

01:12:24   So anyway go to hover dot com and use offer code white cars Lall for ten percent off your first order. [TS]

01:12:31   Once again thank you very much to hover for sponsoring our show. [TS]

01:12:34   Don't forget promo code white cars law for ten percent off Marco [TS]

01:12:39   and I both received our new i Phone six is on this past Friday. We are recording on Wednesday night. [TS]

01:12:48   I've had a couple of work days with the i Phone six that I ordered. [TS]

01:12:53   To recap I ordered a i Phone six space gray sixty four gig like pretty much everyone on Twitter [TS]

01:12:59   and I don't know what to think it is too big. Well the four point seven is too big it's too big. [TS]

01:13:07   I've played with one this week. [TS]

01:13:10   Disagree I was pleasantly surprised at how not big this small one felt so I think the problem is is that I like using [TS]

01:13:21   my i Phone one handed quite a lot. [TS]

01:13:24   You could make a legitimate argument that I don't need to most times [TS]

01:13:28   but nevertheless I tend to use my phone one handed and so because of that [TS]

01:13:36   when I hold my phone the way I'm used to which is my pinky covering the lightning port as kind of like the weight [TS]

01:13:45   bearing the load bearing the finger if you will my ring and middle fingers on the left. [TS]

01:13:51   This is my right hand ring in filming middle fingers on the left hand side of the phone my pointer finger basically on [TS]

01:13:58   the Apple logo and then my. My right thumb doing all the operating. [TS]

01:14:03   I can only get about two thirds up the screen you're holding Iran K.Z. [TS]

01:14:07   Know totally how I don't know how you're doing that because it's what I'm used to. [TS]

01:14:11   I forgot to watch you more closely next time I see you didn't seem like the most precarious way to hold this thing like [TS]

01:14:16   I don't have my i Pod touch with if I did the reach test on the i Phone six to see what I can reach with my normal grip [TS]

01:14:22   and I thought this was everybody's number [TS]

01:14:24   but hearing you just described that that is not the way I hold the phone I have with the corner sort of nestled in the [TS]

01:14:28   palm of my hand. [TS]

01:14:29   I can reach everywhere across the face of the six of my thumb except for the farthest corner [TS]

01:14:34   and the farthest corner like maybe half an inch in most. [TS]

01:14:39   I'm missing from this without me shimmying [TS]

01:14:42   or moving my palm at all just palm anchored in my all four fingers wrapped on one side of the phone the other car the [TS]

01:14:48   phone as well as my palm [TS]

01:14:49   and my thumb sweeping the thing I can reach the top right corner I think we should bottom left corner I can reach the [TS]

01:14:54   bottom right corner top left I can't quite reach I would have to guess my grip [TS]

01:14:58   but that's more than I thought I would be able to reach I was in visioning may not be able to reach any corners except [TS]

01:15:03   the one closest to my palm. [TS]

01:15:05   You with the bouncing on the pinky with your pointer finger on the Apple logo I don't know what you do [TS]

01:15:08   and put all four fingers inside of especially now that they have the power button on the side you can hit it with your [TS]

01:15:12   thumb. [TS]

01:15:13   Yeah and to be honest I think you're probably right that I just need to give up several years of a habit [TS]

01:15:19   and it just is that's reasonable but it'll be more secure. [TS]

01:15:24   Saying this other grip even with the five size thing that grip is better with that one you're less likely to drop it. [TS]

01:15:31   No I'm less likely to drop it because I have my pinky blocking it from being dropped No that's you're just making this [TS]

01:15:36   little bounce cradle from and just handle flipping out of the things you know actually gripping it. [TS]

01:15:40   You're just sort of balancing it on it's like sheet music sitting on the sheet music stands on the center of going to [TS]

01:15:46   tumbling off mine I'm actually holding in my hand now in Casey's defense I hold it sounds like the same way as Casey [TS]

01:15:53   and it is it is a quite secure hole if you if you just hold it like with you know the thumb and you know your thumb. [TS]

01:16:00   Whatever that's called on one side and then all four fingers on the other side across the middle then it can fire up [TS]

01:16:06   and down whereas it's like if you take if you just hit the pinky and you bring it down on the bottom [TS]

01:16:11   and you're anchoring the bottom right corner exactly right. I thought that's my son moving anywhere. [TS]

01:16:18   Can't go down because it's literally in the palm and it can go up because I'm gripping with all four fingers on my [TS]

01:16:22   and the side of my hand like I have it in a vice grip it's not as if I don't have to daintily hold it [TS]

01:16:28   and have it sort of nestled in a holster shaped like my hand I'm actually holding it. [TS]

01:16:33   So anyway we could observe also causing intending issues as well because I'm holding it wrong. [TS]

01:16:41   Anyway I do like it if you leave aside the one handed use which I still haven't come to grips with be that my fault be [TS]

01:16:50   it the phones fault one way or another I haven't come to those upon haven't come to grips with one handed use [TS]

01:16:57   but nevertheless the screen itself. I do like I do like it being a little bigger. [TS]

01:17:03   I do think it looks better although I don't I think there must be in my head because the four point seven inch screen [TS]

01:17:10   is pretty much identical to the five S. Screen isn't it. No better viewing angles better. Better color depth. [TS]

01:17:17   And what about the current glass I love the curve that is in the glass love it. [TS]

01:17:21   So here's the thing about the curve glass when I first got my phone and I did not have a case for it yet. [TS]

01:17:28   I really liked the curved glass [TS]

01:17:30   and the most awesome part about the curved glass to me was the swipe from the left edge to the right which is a back [TS]

01:17:39   gesture [TS]

01:17:40   and also an unlocked jester although obviously don't use that too terribly often with Touch ID it makes that gesture so [TS]

01:17:47   much nicer than it was on the squared off five S. but I had a apple leather case for my five S. [TS]

01:17:56   and It was far and away the best case. [TS]

01:18:00   Ever used on any phone I had had bumpers before I came in we would use like battery cases of them at a conference [TS]

01:18:05   and I loved the leather case in the five S. [TS]

01:18:07   So I got one for the six [TS]

01:18:10   and the problem with the Apple weather case for the six is that the way it melts it it kind of covers up the nice bit [TS]

01:18:19   of the edge of the curved edge of the glass and just kind of ruins that feel. [TS]

01:18:24   Yeah I am worried about cases on the curve thing that's what I was thinking about I was holding it how are you going to [TS]

01:18:29   put a case on this and preserve the things that are good about [TS]

01:18:31   and I don't know they they don't really work like I actually got to hold Casey's phone I had the exact same problem [TS]

01:18:37   with it it's like once you have the case on it it really does ruin that curve [TS]

01:18:40   and so I don't know what to do because I am enough of a klutz that I often bang my phone into things because I'm not [TS]

01:18:47   paying attention what I'm doing. Not gone well there's no new wood nearby but knock on glass not found bent aluminum. [TS]

01:18:54   Yeah exactly not convents a limb I haven't dropped a phone ever to the point that the screen shatters. [TS]

01:19:00   But I'm so scared especially since the back in the sides of the singer so darn slippers slippery or sleepy or whatever. [TS]

01:19:07   I'm so scared I'm gonna drop it especially since I can't anchored on my pinky ahem rip it [TS]

01:19:14   or drop it if you did you buy that did you buy the extra insurance. [TS]

01:19:18   I did not expect a boxer at seventy or eighty isn't it now. [TS]

01:19:22   I'll probably buy it just because it's still cheaper than getting like I don't trust myself not to drop it we've got it [TS]

01:19:27   on my wife's phones. [TS]

01:19:28   Course that means she hasn't dropped them [TS]

01:19:29   but I just feel better buying in the grand scheme of things I worry less about it so my policy on that is I stop buying [TS]

01:19:37   Apple Care and various protection plans and warranties a few years ago [TS]

01:19:40   and my current policy is the first time I really need one and regret not having bought one. [TS]

01:19:46   I'll start buying them again. So far it hasn't happened I'm coming out way ahead. [TS]

01:19:50   Yeah I tend to agree with you but remind me of that [TS]

01:19:52   when I take a case of I don't buy it on my Macs I've never really bought IMAX because I was. [TS]

01:20:00   Like they're not going to be in a harsh environment. [TS]

01:20:02   But once I'm carrying something around I have dropped my i Pod Touch many many times just so happens to have been [TS]

01:20:07   broken and you have a case on if I can find a case that I like for the six assuming I buy one that is like this. T.P. [TS]

01:20:15   You Delkin case I have a my Pod touch is I really like this case and in this case totally annihilate the curve. [TS]

01:20:23   But if if the I just feel like this i Pod Touch case was does it's got like a five C. [TS]

01:20:28   It's like a little bath tub like a squared off bath tub. Fine I'll be fine with that I like the how the five C. [TS]

01:20:34   Feels as well I think the sex is great. [TS]

01:20:37   Without a case to see what it's like with cases as I would like the result of my trying the fix in person is that I [TS]

01:20:45   think the six is not too ridiculous [TS]

01:20:46   and now I'm doing just waiting for the October event to see if there's any i Pod Touch action happening there. [TS]

01:20:51   So are you implying that if there is no new i Pod Touch you're going to finally get an i Phone. Probably. [TS]

01:20:57   Wow this is like I'm really I'm guessing there. [TS]

01:21:01   I'm guessing if there's a new i Pod Touch it would not have these bigger screens. [TS]

01:21:05   I'm guessing it would be like you know basically a five S. [TS]

01:21:08   or Less because I think I think the bigger screens really require that harbor display scaler which is probably only in [TS]

01:21:17   the I don't mean a plus I just mean the six size like but no I don't simply put also an A.C.L. [TS]

01:21:22   or Put in a seven and it doesn't have a scalar and it sure doesn't. Yup sure does. [TS]

01:21:27   It's not scaling up anything it's just a higher resolution. [TS]

01:21:30   It's still that the apps when they aren't made for the screen [TS]

01:21:33   or the display of there's only perhaps that aren't updated for the sex right. [TS]

01:21:37   Yeah but either way I'm pretty sure the scalar is there [TS]

01:21:40   and I'm pretty sure that they would not have a device with that size screen in this day [TS]

01:21:45   and age without that scalar which probably means [TS]

01:21:48   and they also probably wouldn't make like a custom part for the i Pod Touch and nobody buys them [TS]

01:21:52   but they made a big deal about the scale of a my i Pad three can run you run double the i Phone apps on the i Pad for [TS]

01:21:58   years it's fine. I'm guessing. [TS]

01:22:00   They're not going to do it until they can put it in it are things like this not the big size because that one that's I [TS]

01:22:07   think you would need it in there to do that [TS]

01:22:09   but to make a great i Pod Touch like that size screen for you know for a kid for the kids thing where you know want to [TS]

01:22:16   give your kid a phone but you want to be able to play I.O.'s games then it's got a bigger screen. [TS]

01:22:21   It's a total win for [TS]

01:22:23   and I bet they still feel like an i Pod Touch thing they want to make I think that size a natural fit the bigger size. [TS]

01:22:28   Not so much. That's an interesting point I agree with you. [TS]

01:22:31   To come back to the i Phones [TS]

01:22:33   and to get toward the six plus a couple other quick thoughts about the six the apple in their case no longer covers the [TS]

01:22:40   bottom of the phone which looks a little jank here [TS]

01:22:45   but is actually kind of convenient because there's no real headphone cut out anymore that you have to worry about. [TS]

01:22:50   And additionally there's no lightning port cut out anymore because I found that I think it was the Amazon lightning [TS]

01:22:57   cables were too thick at that the head in order to get into the little cutout for the lightning port on the five S. [TS]

01:23:04   Case. [TS]

01:23:05   So I do kind of like that and I do love the feel of the apple leather cases [TS]

01:23:09   and it makes the protruding lens not be an issue anymore but I don't know sitting here now. [TS]

01:23:16   I love I think the phone looks good I like having a little bit more real estate more than I thought I wouldn't fact [TS]

01:23:24   however every time I pick up Aaron's phone and she's staying with the five Best Buy your own choice. [TS]

01:23:30   I think to myself what the first thought is holy crap this is tiny. [TS]

01:23:34   The second thought I have is my goodness it feels so much better in my hand. [TS]

01:23:39   Now what do you what do you think Marco first of all let me let me address the cosmetic angle. Both of our friends. [TS]

01:23:47   C G P gray on the most recent episode of hello internet which I highly recommend It's a fantastic pod cast [TS]

01:23:52   but in the Senate see G.P. Gray went on a nice rant in the last episode of hello internet where he basically said he. [TS]

01:24:00   Believe how unbelievably ugly the i Phone six is really [TS]

01:24:03   and also our friend Virginia Robert's blog post I believe it was the other day we'll put that in the sentence as well. [TS]

01:24:10   Making some similar complaints about the appearance of it. [TS]

01:24:13   So so should you be great main complaints were the rounded glass first of all [TS]

01:24:19   and I think we're going to complain about to be around a glass I think I think they're right. [TS]

01:24:23   It doesn't it doesn't look as good like if you see the way the light reflects off of it it doesn't look like a plastic [TS]

01:24:29   covering it it does not look as good however I think it feels so much better that it I think is worth I think it looks [TS]

01:24:37   good too like the ugliest Phone design is five and five S. Design and if I had maybe the three G.S. [TS]

01:24:43   Comes close but I really didn't like the the five five S. [TS]

01:24:46   As I thought it was just terrible [TS]

01:24:48   and always it was a super boring sharp edges no no interest where is the curve glass like that the whole thing is that [TS]

01:24:55   it's curved [TS]

01:24:56   but it's actually made of glass you know it's not the first one to do a ton of the tons so the hundred people are right [TS]

01:25:02   and yes we are aware of many many Android phones about curved glass [TS]

01:25:05   and all sorts of curves in every different directions with the first Avalon fine [TS]

01:25:08   and if they had like it I like that one of the Android phones that like it was on the front I like that one [TS]

01:25:13   but I was on this because it's glass and it's hard it's not some squishy little thing. [TS]

01:25:17   It [TS]

01:25:17   and especially the joint that it makes with the rest of the thing you know tight panel gaps Lexus the relentless pursuit [TS]

01:25:25   of professional ball bearings accent neutral anyway all that's what I think it reflects well on the device I can [TS]

01:25:34   understand some people being annoyed by the antenna lines on the back yeah that was that was the other thing like [TS]

01:25:38   and both great Actually [TS]

01:25:40   when I think Virginia does does Well I think the antenna lines are indeed ugly I think the backs of these phones are a [TS]

01:25:47   little ugly. [TS]

01:25:48   I wouldn't say it's as severe as as with Gracie ripping I do think though those internet bands are indeed ugly [TS]

01:25:55   and I wish I didn't have them however I will also say that I have noticed. [TS]

01:26:00   Significantly improved Wind Fire reception from the five S. [TS]

01:26:04   There are a number of areas in and around my house where used to be like right on the edge [TS]

01:26:08   and sometimes a drop the connection with why far. And with every previous phone up to the five S. [TS]

01:26:14   and Then the six that I've had for the last few days has not had a problem like in the same area as it has like two [TS]

01:26:21   arcs of life. [TS]

01:26:22   I reception and old connection just fine [TS]

01:26:24   and is able to transfer data just fine so whatever it's worth the wife eye is definitely better reception in this [TS]

01:26:31   current design and whether the due to something about something that requires the Baron's who knows. [TS]

01:26:36   I don't like the bands [TS]

01:26:37   but if that's what it takes to Goodwife I reception on edge areas of my house I'll take them all with the bands there. [TS]

01:26:45   They have the same decision like first of all that metal is not radio transparent [TS]

01:26:49   and they want to have metal for like they have a classical on the five C. I think it's great. [TS]

01:26:52   It looks great [TS]

01:26:53   but they obviously want to have a metal on that you can have the hand as you have that something that plastic [TS]

01:26:58   or some other material at the ready waiting it out so they decided We know we have to have a plastic part we don't want [TS]

01:27:04   to make plastic panels top and bottom we don't want to make glass panels from bottom. [TS]

01:27:08   We don't want to do all the things we've done before. We can shove it all through a little glass apple logo. [TS]

01:27:12   We have to have these plastic parts. [TS]

01:27:14   What can we do to make them attractive [TS]

01:27:16   and what they've done with them is like like the curved glass interfacing with the aluminum. [TS]

01:27:21   They're showing off their ability to manufacture to tolerances by making the plastic exactly flush with the metal [TS]

01:27:27   behind it. [TS]

01:27:28   If those strikes were like slightly indented [TS]

01:27:31   or you can catch your fingernails on earth they ever become that way like after you know a month or two months [TS]

01:27:36   or year of use. [TS]

01:27:37   If they start to get on even an expanding contract at different rates or become warped [TS]

01:27:41   or whatever that will ruin the effect. [TS]

01:27:43   But you know these i Phone six is that we've all seen that are brand new from the factory. [TS]

01:27:47   I think them showing off again like panel gap though I look it is like one seamless material isn't that amazing I [TS]

01:27:52   grieve that from a distance looking at it like why those ugly stripes all over it but in the details close up. [TS]

01:27:58   I appreciate the craftsmanship. Like it's kind of like when you do. [TS]

01:28:01   I figured I'd call it would inlays where you someone I would have would work in the chat room anyway. [TS]

01:28:06   Like do you know where you cut out pieces of wood to precisely fit inside next to other pieces of wood [TS]

01:28:12   and you're partial to guess what looks like one continuous piece of wood. [TS]

01:28:16   That's kind of what they've done they've got an antenna inlays they're not ornamental they're fairly straight forward [TS]

01:28:22   but I think that it's it's I think it's a nice look for a necessary evil. [TS]

01:28:28   Again I think the forest design is still the best one because it took on a sort of evil [TS]

01:28:31   and incorporated into the design by making entire back glass entire front glass we all know the problems that were [TS]

01:28:36   but as a piece of sculpture the forest wins. [TS]

01:28:39   But as something I hold in my hand and probably won't ever see the back of it like the six yeah. [TS]

01:28:44   Honestly I think you know I totally agree with with some of the concerns that it is indeed harder to reach things in [TS]

01:28:50   the SEC's like you know going from the forest to the five. [TS]

01:28:54   So certain things on Scheme are hard to Reka specially if you hold on the bottom in most of us do the upper corners [TS]

01:28:59   became much harder to reach with the new one the four point seven [TS]

01:29:03   and the five point five that that it takes it in bigger directions you know it even more things are now harder to reach [TS]

01:29:10   without like an awkward regrip or reach over kind of thing. No question that part is worse. [TS]

01:29:16   However I think overall it's overall the sixty feels way better in the hand even with the awkward reaching needs. [TS]

01:29:26   Now have you noticed improved battery life because you granted these are new devices [TS]

01:29:32   and Stephen Hackett took me to task on that in Naturally any new batteries going to feel a little a little better [TS]

01:29:38   or feel like it lasts longer than an older battery but that being said that and I'm making up numbers here [TS]

01:29:45   when I got done with an average work day with my five S. [TS]

01:29:48   I would be at something around thirty [TS]

01:29:50   or forty percent I don't have a battery percentage on my on my status bars this is all just visually [TS]

01:29:56   but I feel like I'm coming home from an average day at work with. [TS]

01:30:00   Ten or twenty percent more battery power remaining on my six than I ever did on my five S. [TS]

01:30:06   and I was curious Marco if you seem to have noticed similar results or if perhaps I'm just crazy. [TS]

01:30:13   I guess it's better and I don't have a regular schedule so like every day I treat my phone weirdly differently. [TS]

01:30:20   Yeah I know I think it's it's close enough like you know we're not talking about twice as long. [TS]

01:30:26   No no no no no you're talking about maybe twenty percent longer so it's I think it's close enough that it's within the [TS]

01:30:31   realm of like every day variances of how it's being used [TS]

01:30:35   or the age of the battery being one year newer things like that that I don't I don't think we can draw the conclusion [TS]

01:30:40   from that. Enough that the biggest one of batteries is when you get a new device. [TS]

01:30:44   Your old one has a way of least a one year old battery [TS]

01:30:47   and I think that it's always that if you had just simply gotten a new version of the phone you already had you'd like [TS]

01:30:52   well this battery is better that's just a fact of life with with the mind batteries even more severe laptop so you only [TS]

01:30:57   get a new one every four years. Yeah and it's even it's even bigger than the Hey I just saw the new version of the O.S. [TS]

01:31:03   and It feels faster [TS]

01:31:04   but it's just because I rebooted because the battery thing is real measurable difference even just from a year old [TS]

01:31:09   battery use your phone every day. [TS]

01:31:11   Yes the new new battery is always such nice big when I mean I see we got my son and i Pod Touch [TS]

01:31:17   and like how old is that I bought that's not three years old two years old whatever it is. [TS]

01:31:21   When he got a brand new one is better is way better than mine and I should have given a mild one but I didn't. [TS]

01:31:28   Right so let's Any other thoughts about the six and then I'd like to talk about the six plus. [TS]

01:31:33   Well I think some of them I bridge the two is software thoughts like what it's like to use apps they're just bigger. [TS]

01:31:41   So in that case you and I have used the six now for about a week or whatever will live in a week. [TS]

01:31:46   It's weird because you know obviously a lot of that aren't updated yet which is unfortunate because they really do look [TS]

01:31:51   awful when they're not updated and I really I hope developers listen into this. [TS]

01:31:57   If you thought that an update was something that you had to like. [TS]

01:32:00   Maybe kind of casually get to and you haven't really [TS]

01:32:02   and you haven't even submitted it yet I know there's a long submission so you know if you're stuck in this mission Q [TS]

01:32:07   This does not apply to you [TS]

01:32:09   but if if you're a developer who's like well we'll get to it sometime soon you should reconsider that position you [TS]

01:32:15   should really get on because not none of the added apps really do look awful [TS]

01:32:20   and most importantly they don't work very well if you ever bring up the keyboard because the keyboard a scaled also [TS]

01:32:27   which means that everything on the keyboard is slightly differently sized than the native keyboard as in every other [TS]

01:32:33   app on the phone. And so you may come to typos because you like your it slightly off from what you're used to. [TS]

01:32:40   So definitely get your get your ass updated as soon as you can. [TS]

01:32:43   Anyway for apps that have been updated including all the built in ones. [TS]

01:32:48   An example of third party ones I think it's kind of like you know so on our US it's like every Windows always maximized [TS]

01:32:56   or whatever a West-End calls zoomed or different [TS]

01:33:00   and I was it's like everyone knows always maximize the way maximize means on Windows. [TS]

01:33:05   Everything is always full screen edge to edge unless we get a crazy i Pad resizing apps thing but we'll see about that. [TS]

01:33:11   And so when you get a bigger screen you know you don't just have you don't have more room to put apps side by side [TS]

01:33:17   or anything. [TS]

01:33:18   All the apps just get larger they get more space [TS]

01:33:21   and so some of the apps I think are suffering from not knowing how to use the space very well. [TS]

01:33:27   It's you know even looking at something like mail like I even I mean this isn't even I'm not even talking of the six [TS]

01:33:32   plus even just on the six I'm having this problem with mail where it just kind of looks like they don't know what to do [TS]

01:33:39   with the space yet like it looks like you've maximized a window on a on a new bigger monitor [TS]

01:33:45   and everything just spread out more and you know it's it isn't proportionally scaled it by accident [TS]

01:33:51   or I sent over cast out for i Pad exactly you know a little less severe than that [TS]

01:33:56   but if it is that same kind of effect where it's like. [TS]

01:34:00   This was clearly designed for a differently sized screen and it's just being scaled up to to this new one [TS]

01:34:07   but it was obviously designed for a smaller screen [TS]

01:34:10   and it kind of looks ridiculous to an extent I'm getting that feeling all over the place with with this with the six [TS]

01:34:17   the six plus I would imagine is probably worse. [TS]

01:34:19   I did getting both my six plus was right a few hours ago so I haven't had a lot to understand that the reason I got [TS]

01:34:25   both is for developer purposes you know I think we developers have been lucky in all previous years for developing for [TS]

01:34:34   the i Phone or i Pad in that we've never really had to buy extra ones for him if I gave this rant last week I forgot [TS]

01:34:40   but I live here on Twitter. You know we've never had to buy extra phones. [TS]

01:34:45   If you're an Android Developer the center take your developers generally have to buy extra phones beyond the ones they [TS]

01:34:51   would normally get from the cells. [TS]

01:34:52   Just because you need more stuff to test on people if you just bought a new i Phone every year [TS]

01:34:57   or two you were mostly OK. [TS]

01:35:00   This was the first time I really felt like I had to buy an extra one because the six [TS]

01:35:05   and six plus are very different from each other not to mention all previous i Phones I think if you're a developer it's [TS]

01:35:12   very clear it goes from you know just looking at the sales numbers even though they're combined. [TS]

01:35:17   Looking around seeing what is selling I even I asked a guy an Apple store today you know what roughly this is the sales [TS]

01:35:25   mix between the two and he said well you know they're getting a lot fewer of the six pluses. [TS]

01:35:29   So they're selling more sixes [TS]

01:35:31   but if they had them both in stock they probably Sun about equally because every since so many people asking for the [TS]

01:35:36   six plus. [TS]

01:35:38   So I think this is very clear like we're not going to have one of these being the massive majority winner over the [TS]

01:35:46   other one. We're going to see the I think both of these are going to be major selling devices. [TS]

01:35:51   It's important for developers to be able to test on both of them because they're different. [TS]

01:35:55   The six plus is not just the six but bigger it has different size classes it. [TS]

01:36:00   Please make sure I've had interfaces and landscape it has a scalar and it runs at three X. [TS]

01:36:04   and Like the entire screen runs differently [TS]

01:36:08   and the way you hold is different the ergonomics are different where each controls might be different. [TS]

01:36:13   It's these are very different devices from each other and from past ones [TS]

01:36:18   and so I think it's important for developers to have both. [TS]

01:36:20   So what I did was I got my regular eight hundred eighty one for the small one [TS]

01:36:24   and the big one I got an unlocked one at full price in the same capacity same color black sixty four so that I could [TS]

01:36:32   swap the sim into it and so what I'm going to actually do is I'm going to switch to the big one for like a week [TS]

01:36:38   or two here [TS]

01:36:39   or there just so I can get a feel for what it's like to use one so I have some idea of what I should be developing on [TS]

01:36:45   it like where should controls go how should things work like I think it's important for developers to familiarize [TS]

01:36:51   ourselves with both of these devices because they're huge not in size Well that's two [TS]

01:36:55   but they're going to be huge in sales and influence. [TS]

01:36:59   Anyway all that being said I think the six plus is going to have this problem even more of having apps just kind of be [TS]

01:37:06   scaled up and not like in like the old unupdated way [TS]

01:37:09   but even after you have that your absolute OK you make your apple run in this in this banding rectangle. [TS]

01:37:16   It's still not really redesigned for it until you do something special for it [TS]

01:37:20   and I think is going to be a while before developers [TS]

01:37:24   and Apple with its own apps really know how to use the space well enough I think. [TS]

01:37:32   And so income it was what I said last week where I think in a world where the Apple Watch is commonplace I think the [TS]

01:37:39   five plus the six plus will make more sense because a bigger phone is hard to take in and out your pocket [TS]

01:37:46   or wherever it happens to be stored. [TS]

01:37:49   If you have a watch to check out of occasions [TS]

01:37:51   and to do minor actions on you don't need to take out your pocket as much so I think next year [TS]

01:37:57   and in future years the five to six play. [TS]

01:38:00   US liner that the large size line will be more compelling for more people because it's mostly sitting in your pocket [TS]

01:38:06   and you're just not going to watch all day and you're using it when you have to handle vailable. [TS]

01:38:11   This year I think it'll be it'll be very successful but a lot of like us won't be switching to it. [TS]

01:38:18   That being said it's going to be big and I think it's going to take us a year [TS]

01:38:26   or two to even figure out how to use the space. I think you're right. [TS]

01:38:31   We actually saw each other Marco and I this past weekend and I had gotten a few friends together over the weekend [TS]

01:38:39   and one of my friends Phil actually had gotten his six plus that Friday this past Friday [TS]

01:38:47   and so I got to play with this i Phone six plus for a little while. [TS]

01:38:53   And my initial impressions about it were firstly Oh my God enormous second. [TS]

01:39:00   Secondly it was it was just it just felt to me a little bit wrong like the the six still feels like a phone to me. [TS]

01:39:10   Granted I just spent a little while earlier telling you I do think it's a little too big [TS]

01:39:14   but maybe over time I'll adjust the six pluses indisputable e freakin huge [TS]

01:39:20   and huge to the point that I almost I think mentally associate it more as a very small i Pad [TS]

01:39:29   and then I do a very large i Phone. [TS]

01:39:32   Oh yeah I think I think if the if the i Pad was the better selling device they might have called this the i Pad Nano. [TS]

01:39:39   I agree I agree completely. [TS]

01:39:42   I did briefly use it in landscape mode in mail where it had the split view going on [TS]

01:39:48   and I actually really really like that [TS]

01:39:51   and I really thought that was really nice to have that extra bit of context as you're going through email. [TS]

01:39:58   And so presumably that would apply. [TS]

01:40:00   To many other apps that will eventually support the split views but overall it just felt completely wrong to me [TS]

01:40:09   and i even if I was bumping into battery issues constantly like Mike earlier as I would be hard pressed to want to [TS]

01:40:19   carry something that large all the time. [TS]

01:40:22   To me I have my phone when I on the go and I have my i Pad when I don't need to create a lot of things [TS]

01:40:31   but I want something with a little more breathing room. I was the i Pad Mini I should say. [TS]

01:40:36   But you know I have my laptop if I really need to sit down [TS]

01:40:39   and do work I don't personally see were six plus fits in my life. But I mean apparently a bunch of people do think so. [TS]

01:40:49   But man it's just so you know the more I think about the six plus but I still haven't even seen in person [TS]

01:40:54   but the more I think about it in the abstract the more I relate it to my beloved still [TS]

01:41:01   but similarly trouble of the i Pad three in that it just seems like a compromise device. The three X. [TS]

01:41:08   Resolution scaled down I know some people say that you can't tell and doesn't matter and it looks great [TS]

01:41:15   and blah blah blah. But I'm pretty sure I will be able to tell. [TS]

01:41:19   And even if I can't tell it's just such an awkward like what am I gaining out of that like four hundred D.B.I. [TS]

01:41:25   Fine but rendering it three X. [TS]

01:41:27   A scaling down that's not gaining me anything right that is not it's making the hardware work harder. [TS]

01:41:33   Render at a higher resolution and then taking away throwing away a lot of that information [TS]

01:41:39   when it scales it down I don't know if they just couldn't hit the target you know they couldn't get screens that actual [TS]

01:41:46   resolution three X. [TS]

01:41:48   Bothers me because I don't care for three resolutions or multiple to sixteen [TS]

01:41:52   but I do care that they're evenly divisible [TS]

01:41:54   and I guess they all use was moving away from pixel perfect design who cares [TS]

01:41:57   or whatever like why why make that compromise. You don't have to because they can't do it for X. [TS]

01:42:02   That's why it's three X. Four X. Too much they can't even do Native three X. Three X. [TS]

01:42:06   and Scale down just the whole thing seems like a transition point toward something else because we had one X. [TS]

01:42:13   and We had two X. and It was a clear like we waited a while to us when we got it with a clean win three X. [TS]

01:42:18   Scale down is not a clean win big or two X. Fine for X. [TS]

01:42:23   Which we're not there yet fine but this just seems like a way station in between where we are now [TS]

01:42:28   and where we might like to be. Or maybe we can just decide the two X. [TS]

01:42:33   Is enough and there's not any benefit to going to four or three X. [TS]

01:42:36   Scaled down [TS]

01:42:36   but just the plus as a as a hardware device mostly defined by a screen because both are just one big screen I don't [TS]

01:42:44   like it. [TS]

01:42:45   I think your opinion might change if you see one you know academically I get your points about how the scaling is kind [TS]

01:42:53   of gross. [TS]

01:42:54   No question but in person it doesn't really matter [TS]

01:42:58   and the screen just looks really really good you know you don't see the hairline showing when you scroll. [TS]

01:43:02   Single single native pixel lines basically hairlines scroll down what you can see them shimmer I think I don't. [TS]

01:43:09   So far I haven't noticed that. [TS]

01:43:12   Now voted your attention oh yeah there it is very you have to be scrolling the table you know extremely slowly to see [TS]

01:43:18   it and looking for it. [TS]

01:43:20   Also I mean I it's not so much it is really in the like in the idea that this this hardware is is compromised like it's [TS]

01:43:28   because they couldn't do for X. but They didn't want to just do two X. [TS]

01:43:31   That size so they were because they wanted to get higher D.B.I. [TS]

01:43:33   So this is all this is the compromise and I'm only in the same way that I sit there and just wait [TS]

01:43:38   and don't buy any new hardware until the hardware comes out that I was right. [TS]

01:43:43   I kicked off a network well with the i Pad I waited until they had a retina model [TS]

01:43:47   and even that I got compromised because the very first retina wanted if I cared about like three performance [TS]

01:43:51   or whatever it would be which I don't but even just things like scrolling order like weight to the thing you want [TS]

01:43:57   and I didn't buy an i Pad despite what I thought I knew I would love one. [TS]

01:44:00   Still when REDMAN I don't regret that decision. [TS]

01:44:02   I'm sitting here with this two thousand and eight macro not buying into until it's just the right thing [TS]

01:44:06   and in that sort of mindset. [TS]

01:44:09   The plus is not the one like in turn you know I know where they're going they're not there yet this is a transitional [TS]

01:44:15   fossil it will come and go. [TS]

01:44:17   We will forget that it ever existed and you know the correct one that that is a better better fit between C.P.U. G.P.U. [TS]

01:44:25   Screen and resolution three X. Just I don't think I'll ever be happy with that. I don't. 3. X. [TS]

01:44:32   Itself if it was if it was native to the panel I don't think that we have problem [TS]

01:44:36   but I mean first of all I think you're holding the too high of a standard you know the way. [TS]

01:44:40   Oh you know regular people don't care is this is me personally no one else has those values I totally understand. [TS]

01:44:45   Like if your phone is subsidized by your carrier [TS]

01:44:48   and you can get a new one every year for every two years for like three hundred bucks you don't have to worry about [TS]

01:44:54   like you know your macro decision is am I going to be OK for the next five years. [TS]

01:44:59   Your phone decision is am I going to be OK use computer for the next one to two years. [TS]

01:45:02   It's esoteric like I just have specific demands of the heartbreaking people came into retina versus not right now this [TS]

01:45:07   is totally right. [TS]

01:45:08   However I don't like I'm just not I'm talking about me personally like [TS]

01:45:11   when I look at the arc of the hardware if you are a hardware afficionado there are certain machines that are just like [TS]

01:45:17   that was just the right time just the right combination of the all the parts were in harmony no part was unnecessarily [TS]

01:45:23   compromised by being in a transition between an old one and a new one right. [TS]

01:45:28   Like the retina screen likely didn't do much with the screen they didn't change resolution that in changes size until [TS]

01:45:33   they can go retina knows just such a big leap such a clean [TS]

01:45:36   when they could have been compromised in between by tweaking the resolution increasingly be after they didn't this [TS]

01:45:42   three X. One just smells to me like we couldn't do for X. Y. and You know we had to do three X. [TS]

01:45:50   and We couldn't even get a screen that so we had to do three X. [TS]

01:45:53   Scale down and here's your device and maybe the only hope this gives me is that maybe it means a plus size I thought. [TS]

01:46:00   Such actually is in the works because if you going to give a kid something to play games on [TS]

01:46:04   or watch a video on the back of a car and you don't want to give them an i Pad plus size i Pod Touch would be great [TS]

01:46:09   and maybe it's like well we could have had the super high end screen on the i Phone six Plus if we had another fifty [TS]

01:46:15   bucks but we knew we were going to use the exact same screen and the plus size i Pod Touch [TS]

01:46:19   and so we had to go with this crazy compromise but I'm just making excuses for them now does not. [TS]

01:46:24   It offends me on a technique [TS]

01:46:27   or hardware level none of that has anything to do with how successful the product will be in the market. [TS]

01:46:31   I think also you know you you're calling this a compromise device you know similar to the i Pad three [TS]

01:46:37   and I think by that let me know if this is fair [TS]

01:46:40   and I think you're saying like design compromises had to result in something mediocre. Is that a fair characterization. [TS]

01:46:47   Not just mediocre [TS]

01:46:48   but like like River setting a dog he saw like a couple animation to look like him out of started a little more on the [TS]

01:46:54   plus. [TS]

01:46:55   That's something that a consumer could notice that it is smoother on the six [TS]

01:46:59   but even though this is the more expensive model the I think the compromises on this are a lot less significant [TS]

01:47:07   and less obvious than what you might be thinking like the three X. Divide. [TS]

01:47:12   Again I think you're I see what you're saying about how it's offending you like on a nerd level that I get I think the [TS]

01:47:20   overall device looking at it I'm holding one of my hand now looking at this device like I think this is rather than [TS]

01:47:27   saying it's a compromise device I would say it's more like a seventeen inch Power Book. [TS]

01:47:31   Remember that or a macro for a I was also compromised by the ridiculous keyboard floating in the giant sea of aluminum. [TS]

01:47:39   Of course you have a problem with the use of same keyboard on the on that thirteen inch Power Book [TS]

01:47:45   and the twelve inch power. [TS]

01:47:46   Well that was all of these are I think I call a feature too [TS]

01:47:49   but no I didn't really know that these are just part sharing [TS]

01:47:51   but you know it was nice to be consistent with you know your fingers you know [TS]

01:47:55   and you know I can certainly let standardize on the worst keyboard. Oh John are you ever happy. [TS]

01:48:03   Anyway I like the six plus does benefit from having I would assume exactly the same fitting tension cool designing [TS]

01:48:10   curve corners [TS]

01:48:10   and everything like that all the things I say I like about the six of them do it just they are like I'm not saying the [TS]

01:48:15   hardware is just the balance of the the internals in the screen seems off to me. [TS]

01:48:21   I think like the seventeen inch Power Book People are going to love this thing [TS]

01:48:26   and not maybe not all people maybe not even the majority will see it in the majority and how they might go for this. [TS]

01:48:32   Either way it's a radio people care about anything that says that they have this is totally immaterial Mazal has been [TS]

01:48:38   battling all they care is the bigger screen [TS]

01:48:40   and said For them it's price you know do I want to under dollars more for the bigger ones as I said I think the six [TS]

01:48:45   will be the more popular model. [TS]

01:48:46   It's so hard to tell now because this exposes are so incredibly supply constrained that there are we sold out [TS]

01:48:51   everywhere and they could fool fool people into thinking that they are the more popular model [TS]

01:48:54   but they're not it's like the gold iphone. [TS]

01:48:57   Sure [TS]

01:48:57   but I think like you know if if they made a retina seventeen inch MacBook Pro today for my next for my next laptop I [TS]

01:49:08   might buy that because I'm almost always limited on what I can do on my laptop by the screen space [TS]

01:49:14   and yes it has a scaling mode but they make these really tiny and it's hard to see. [TS]

01:49:18   I would almost certainly by a seventeen and try to map a pro if one was available. [TS]

01:49:23   The seventeen year old macro pro and power book didn't sell well as far as I know [TS]

01:49:29   but it's sold because if it was like if that was your only computer and you only if you only had a laptop [TS]

01:49:35   and you were a power user and portability was a little bit less important then no screen space [TS]

01:49:41   and being able to you know use as much as you could in one thing because you had to be very productive on just a laptop [TS]

01:49:46   humid no external monitor. If those are your needs. That was a fantastic computer and those were granted. [TS]

01:49:54   Education needs. But that was a really great solution to it now I think there's a parallel to draw between. [TS]

01:50:00   That and your i Phone being your only mobile device if you don't have a tablet and possibly your primary [TS]

01:50:07   or only computer if you don't even have a P.C. or You don't use one anymore you hardly ever use one. [TS]

01:50:14   So many people use their phones as their only or primary computer these days. It does make sense to have a big screen. [TS]

01:50:22   It's basically have as big of a screen as you can tolerate carrying around [TS]

01:50:25   and using in your hand because so many things on a computer are better on big screens [TS]

01:50:30   and so I think from that point of view this actually isn't a compromised device. [TS]

01:50:36   It's simply another option for people for whom this is their primary computer I think is a compromise implementation of [TS]

01:50:42   a device that everyone knows that there's a demand for which is a big honking phone I'm saying except that a big hunk [TS]

01:50:48   of phone is two levels of Commerce One cut categories big honking phone you're consciously choosing a happy medium [TS]

01:50:55   between all the other devices that you're not going to get to just can have one phone fine. [TS]

01:50:58   Once you establish that type of thing you want to make how do you make a really good big honkin phone [TS]

01:51:02   and the answer is not render three X. and Scaled down to H.D. With a G. View they can barely handle it. [TS]

01:51:09   I don't know honestly. [TS]

01:51:10   I'm I'm I think in the back of my mind there's like a forty percent chance [TS]

01:51:16   or so that I'm actually during my trial of the thing I'm actually like a better [TS]

01:51:20   and switch to it full time because like I'm exactly the kind of user who would like this like I feel like a big phony [TS]

01:51:27   like I'm not saying you know again that category of thing if it turns out that you want to big phone this is this is [TS]

01:51:32   the only big i Phone So really big i Phones This is your only choice [TS]

01:51:36   and it's fine like this is not just it just bothers me [TS]

01:51:39   and I get what it looks like is something that if they if they had a choice they would have done it differently [TS]

01:51:45   but couldn't for reasons of parts availability [TS]

01:51:49   or you know just like something didn't work out so well it seems like to me. Yeah. Again that's fair. [TS]

01:51:55   I just think in real world use it doesn't really matter now. No it doesn't. [TS]

01:52:00   Just just bothers me I mean my i Pad three is exactly the same deal gets too hot it's big [TS]

01:52:04   and it's take it's got a thirty pin connector the G.P.U. [TS]

01:52:06   Can barely handle a screen RASM [TS]

01:52:08   and I was happy with it because I was holding out for as long as I possibly going to get a retina screen [TS]

01:52:12   and retina versa non-relatives totally worth it. [TS]

01:52:14   But I also recognize that of all the Retina i Pads This one is the bad one right. [TS]

01:52:19   Someone like fairly direct and the four came out so quickly after I had four of lightning part right. [TS]

01:52:26   Yeah but anyway the many many parallels and I say this is like I'm still using my i Pad three [TS]

01:52:32   and this is part of Apple's curse that like I have not seen it is a hard I'm going to get replace it with an air of [TS]

01:52:37   actually two but I've watched generations of i Pads come and go [TS]

01:52:40   and every time I said you know my pedestal pretty darn good the screen looks good I use it when I'm on my couch [TS]

01:52:46   and in my bed and it's just fine and I can go to three years getting a new i Pad and i bet Apple hates that [TS]

01:52:52   but that is a testament to the longevity of even the worst Retina i Pad they've ever it was a compromise device [TS]

01:52:58   and I don't feel like you want to get one because my hands are always cold. [TS]

01:53:03   Well like to me like on a personal level for a minute I think I would say now in retrospect now you know having seen [TS]

01:53:12   both the i Pad air and now big phones I would say the i Pad mini is kind of a compromise device. [TS]

01:53:19   The non retina ones just get rid of that. Well that way. Yeah I wish. [TS]

01:53:23   Oh God I hope they stop selling that next month so we can stop supporting a five chips anytime soon. [TS]

01:53:27   The i Pad Mini doesn't fit in most pockets unless you unless you carry a larger bag [TS]

01:53:34   or a big jacket you know the i Pad Mini it's it's not always with you like a phone is also not as specious in feel as [TS]

01:53:42   the full size i Pad even though I notice same resolution but it's also that that is just much nicer [TS]

01:53:46   and also the fault of I've had a just a higher end device you know the the retina many because it's unsubsidized like [TS]

01:53:53   all the like all the i Pads It really is a very low end device it is. It is similar to the i Pod touch in like. [TS]

01:54:00   The quality of components that it that it will probably usually end up getting. [TS]

01:54:03   I think the current one was a fluke in that it had the same a seven as the big one the same [TS]

01:54:07   and the same capabilities and the same I think it even had the same cameras [TS]

01:54:11   and everything like it was just you know slightly clocked lower and lower quality screen. [TS]

01:54:17   Well looking at the i've had ere now [TS]

01:54:21   and having Oh now the retina Mini I think if I if I buy another i Pad will of course I'm going to buy that I bought it [TS]

01:54:27   at some point whatever I've had I buy next. [TS]

01:54:30   I'm almost certain I'm going for the full sized one is I think the full size i Pad is a better i Pad like it's a serve [TS]

01:54:38   and i Pad like role for for the kind of things I would use it for. [TS]

01:54:43   Which is not to bring it around as my as my portable device anymore [TS]

01:54:47   but as like a small tablet in the house like a small tablet to be next to my bed [TS]

01:54:53   or next to the couch you know browse the Internet at you know on furniture. It's great for that. [TS]

01:55:00   I think for portable use the big phones are just going to eat lunch because they're just so much better at portable use [TS]

01:55:07   they're so much smaller. They are always with you. [TS]

01:55:09   They have better cameras [TS]

01:55:10   and their higher end devices there's way way more profit in them so they can afford to have better components better [TS]

01:55:16   cameras other stuff. [TS]

01:55:17   And they're always going to be higher end devices [TS]

01:55:19   and they're always going to have cell plan because you already have a cell plan like you don't to worry about in the SO [TS]

01:55:23   their i Pad having a separate plan [TS]

01:55:25   or pulling with your just in one like it's just such a more compelling argument for portable use to have just a little [TS]

01:55:31   bigger phone and to have no i Pad [TS]

01:55:34   and then have the i Pad if you're going to have a I've had it all have it be the in your house portable casual tablet [TS]

01:55:42   in which case the telling side I think is better than the mini you know my brain knows that you're right. [TS]

01:55:49   But God do I love my my retina i Pad Mini and I having had a third generation i Pad and that's Aaron's i Pad now. [TS]

01:56:00   I just don't see myself ever wanting to go to a big i Pad again. [TS]

01:56:05   But you know teach our own that's what makes walk around [TS]

01:56:07   when the twelve inch comes out the ten one ten one little bit of it maybe going been some some i Phone self I don't [TS]

01:56:16   know I don't like we're over two hours are we really going to keep going. [TS]

01:56:20   We'll do it in the after show thanks but we're three sponsors this week. [TS]

01:56:23   Mobile looks Harry's and hover and we will see you next week. [TS]

01:56:30   Now there's still a silver to be accidental accidental death [TS]

01:56:51   and you are now sitting on the train as it says to that list and the team Michael. [TS]

01:57:30   So you're bending your i Phone already you have even gotten one yet now the i Phone thing this reminds me so much of [TS]

01:57:36   our you know the court screen in testing and scratching with glass and stuff like that [TS]

01:57:40   and I'm only I'm only going to slam this one video that is the only one I saw that was the one featured on Time dot com [TS]

01:57:45   that everyone linked to the guy bending it a guess is the guy bending his i Phone six Plus. [TS]

01:57:53   So it's one part if you're going to make a video of this obviously you're sacrificing a piece of hardware you like I'm [TS]

01:57:58   going to see it was kind of like that. [TS]

01:58:00   Like I was doing with the with the screen I'm going to stab her with a knife I'm going to this is like a torch to see [TS]

01:58:04   what can this device stand out if you're going to go through all this tub trouble [TS]

01:58:08   and destroy a multi hundred dollar device it's like the U.S.B. [TS]

01:58:13   Connector like you would use it [TS]

01:58:16   when she spent some time since it's such a big deal like this guy who's going to use a million devices this video is [TS]

01:58:21   going to cost me hundreds of dollars. [TS]

01:58:22   Let me think for five minutes about how I can how much value can I get out of this device of bending this device how [TS]

01:58:29   much value can I get out of standing the screen with a knife [TS]

01:58:32   and I think you would have to say like you just bending this thing or submitting it to a stress test [TS]

01:58:38   or even if you have a really complicated you know Dr drawing metal stressing machine they'll be like digital readout [TS]

01:58:45   showing how much force [TS]

01:58:46   and where the folk are MS And also there's like you have to compare it to something otherwise we have no idea if it's [TS]

01:58:51   better or worse than the other ones you have to bend the five S. You have to but you you can't just do it in isolation. [TS]

01:58:57   So he takes upon he bends it it's really hard it bends like so what does that tell me you bet your phone for hundreds [TS]

01:59:02   of dollars. You didn't tell me. Well I've been to five S. [TS]

01:59:05   and It was harder it was easier it was like we assume it may be easier you know again doctoring to tell us exactly the [TS]

01:59:11   equations that you know how much more leverage you get on a longer phone and every extra millimeter gives us X. [TS]

01:59:17   Amount of force because of printing [TS]

01:59:18   and where you put the focus you have to compare you have to say stamp this screen with a knife stab the old screen with [TS]

01:59:24   a knife one is harder. [TS]

01:59:26   Just this is basically my asking of the scientists here [TS]

01:59:29   but if you had to strap on the main thing we want to know is is this big giant phone more susceptible to bending then [TS]

01:59:36   the old phones. [TS]

01:59:37   Don't just assume that because you can bend a new phone you have therefore in part of the information that like OK well [TS]

01:59:43   we've got the new phone [TS]

01:59:44   and the only stories about the new phone therefore the new phone is worse no Ben the old phone too. [TS]

01:59:51   So painful [TS]

01:59:53   but as for bending it the only interesting information out of the vending was one that looked really hard to bend [TS]

01:59:59   and to it. [TS]

02:00:00   Ben as they point out in the video event in the weak spot in the side where the volume buttons come through because [TS]

02:00:05   that's the part the little you know semicircular curve is the most weak because it's got you know it's got holes in it [TS]

02:00:11   or whatever. [TS]

02:00:13   All that said I completely believe the story that someone had an i Phone six Plus in the front pocket of their pants [TS]

02:00:20   and at the end of the bending in [TS]

02:00:21   and the reason I believe that is because cloth is very strong surprisingly strong especially to the strength of the you [TS]

02:00:28   know like pulling on it's not going to tear apart that's why we make pants out of cloth right they don't fall apart [TS]

02:00:34   when you wear them. [TS]

02:00:36   So it can and you know big big man's thighs plus a bunch of really tight fitting dress pants pasta phone [TS]

02:00:42   and a pocket I can totally see them imparting enough enough force on a large phone to bend it. [TS]

02:00:50   But it's still that doesn't you know that doesn't answer any of my questions which are Is this a problem unique to the [TS]

02:00:55   six plus or could he also has bent any of the past models would he also have bent [TS]

02:01:00   and I've had many who knows we don't know. So I feel like this story is still an open question. [TS]

02:01:07   If the i Pad is more subtle bending because it is larger [TS]

02:01:10   and because you get more leverage on it maybe a little bit of this responsibility can haunt apple in that if you're [TS]

02:01:19   making a device slightly larger people still might try to use it like an old device by putting it in their pocket is a [TS]

02:01:24   half a mile from a pocket is a little bit bigger. [TS]

02:01:27   This it's in our pocket I'll do that too whereas I think no one was ever trying to shove i Pad Mini into their pockets [TS]

02:01:33   and if they did they would be just as bendy or even more bendy could get even more leverage on it. [TS]

02:01:38   Anyway I don't think this is as big a non-story as everyone else does [TS]

02:01:41   but first of all don't put your devices in your pockets. [TS]

02:01:45   I think going to put on a show I can believe that she put in her pocket [TS]

02:01:48   and she said Why take it out before I sit down don't sit on your vices. [TS]

02:01:51   Don't put it on the front part of the pants because just because I think that it's possible to put it in the front [TS]

02:01:56   pocket your pants and bend it you still feel that like you saw a feeling. [TS]

02:02:00   Your leg the amount of force you need to impart on these metal things to bend them is substantial and [TS]

02:02:04   when you feel that happening in your front pocket God my God like I put my tiny little i Pod touch in my front pocket [TS]

02:02:09   sometimes and when I sit down on a couch I feel a little bit of tension if I over till I get my back up [TS]

02:02:14   and you know just don't do that don't think it's indestructible. [TS]

02:02:18   I disagree with your statement that people should not put their devices in their pockets. [TS]

02:02:22   Yeah but the six plus like it's not so much to put don't [TS]

02:02:25   when you talk about like like for your back pocket like no one is no one's putting like their their phone in their back [TS]

02:02:30   pocket and sitting down in concrete right. [TS]

02:02:34   My very limited understanding of these matters is that a lot of women do precisely that because their front pockets [TS]

02:02:40   simply aren't large enough to handle even a five S. [TS]

02:02:43   but You're cracked the screen like just from like plop in your butt down something there's not enough cushion between [TS]

02:02:48   the glass screen especially if you have no case [TS]

02:02:50   and a thin back pocket of your pants on the concrete you'll end up chipping the glass on a screen while you put you put [TS]

02:02:55   the screen side towards the butt or the legged screen so I didn't get it on are you if you had it. [TS]

02:03:01   Well here's the thing with putting the screen side [TS]

02:03:03   and if you try to do that your front pocket he got a little fake pocket where the i Pod Nano goes there's a little [TS]

02:03:07   metal thing poking out of that so he put the screen in [TS]

02:03:10   when you go into that pocket you'll be putting that melting against your screen. [TS]

02:03:12   Well that's why your left pocket is made for devices because the the little change pocket thing is always only on the [TS]

02:03:19   right side. Yeah but that's only for lefties I agree with John. No you guys are wrong anyway. [TS]

02:03:24   Like putting in your pocket is like you can have in your pocket as long as you don't get that feeling like Oh my God [TS]

02:03:29   I'm now crushing the thing that's in my pocket. [TS]

02:03:31   Right you know you that feeling when you when you sit down with it in your in your pocket the wrong way or it's [TS]

02:03:36   when you're standing up it's fine [TS]

02:03:38   when you start putting it under tension like you're going to feel that you if you put enough force with your pants [TS]

02:03:42   pocket on a device to bend it you will feel that happening [TS]

02:03:45   and you feel it happening going oh it's fine I'm sure it's an instructor nothing will happen to it that's that's on you. [TS]

02:03:50   But this gets back to what we just talked about with the watch. [TS]

02:03:54   If Apple had made the i Phone six plus two millimeters thicker and strengthen. [TS]

02:04:00   So it was heavier and got better battery life. Were people have thought that was the worst of us or a better device. [TS]

02:04:06   I think a better device personally but that's not what Apple wants. [TS]

02:04:10   As you've said several times I go the other the other angle is well why do they keep making a thinner Could you don't [TS]

02:04:16   get too radically thinner in one big jump you have to get there by a little increment [TS]

02:04:20   and if you don't keep getting thinner every year you're never going to get to the end point and someone else will [TS]

02:04:24   and you'll be screwed [TS]

02:04:24   and so I understand Apple's philosophy behind this I think there's room in their product line for one device that [TS]

02:04:30   doesn't make the same tradeoffs. [TS]

02:04:32   I think overall they still need to keep going thinner because that's that's that's making progress I think that's [TS]

02:04:38   moving toward something that is radically better. [TS]

02:04:41   But what all along that path are allowed to be bumps [TS]

02:04:43   and if I was going to make a bomb I would make it with a big honkin sic i Phone six Plus we are moving towards a world [TS]

02:04:49   in this in the first year where there's been more than one new i Phone the five c I don't think counts. [TS]

02:04:54   This is the first year it has been more than one radically new i Phone And so you know if there's going to be like [TS]

02:05:00   obviously the only new i Phone of the year is not going to be some big think battery monster [TS]

02:05:05   but there is room in the lineup as you said for multiple entries and if they had say a third entry [TS]

02:05:11   and it was a six plus plus ninety nine where it had an extra battery [TS]

02:05:17   and everybody has in the back of that would be fine. That said we all keep saying oh yeah we want. [TS]

02:05:24   We'd love that you've made a little thicker have more battery and battery twice as big or whatever [TS]

02:05:29   but I'm not entirely sure that is what we would actually want like you know we we haven't held a device like that we [TS]

02:05:36   don't know batteries are so frickin heavy that we don't know how that would actually feel. [TS]

02:05:44   Apple has most likely tried this. They have labs they try lots of things. [TS]

02:05:48   They've probably tried that you know let's see how big we can make the battery and balance that they can it's [TS]

02:05:54   and I don't think they're bouncing in that way I think they had their design goals are based on. [TS]

02:06:00   And thinner than last year as thin [TS]

02:06:02   or thinner than last year I think he killed them to do the three with the extra back. [TS]

02:06:06   Now and that's I agree [TS]

02:06:07   and I think Jason snow also had a good point in his new show once a call I remember the number of things. [TS]

02:06:12   Agreed yes on a great episode I believe it was [TS]

02:06:15   and one he was talking about how like it seems like Apple has like a like a like a target battery life [TS]

02:06:22   and I don't really feel the need to give more battery life then. Roughly what we have now. [TS]

02:06:27   Well it's a minimum like it has to be as thin as last year or thinner and I think it has a good battery life [TS]

02:06:33   or better and or better and Orson are always good [TS]

02:06:36   but if you can't you know if you can reach those goals I think a barrier you can't be below that [TS]

02:06:41   and they get they had to compromise for the first round and make it a little bit bigger than the two [TS]

02:06:46   and that was all for them but you got to do what you gotta do. [TS]

02:06:50   The thickness is mostly as new battery life [TS]

02:06:52   but the way to where you're going tomorrow is the key point to someplace on a chair on the C.C. One M. [TS]

02:06:57   Eighty two millimeter thinkers [TS]

02:06:58   and you know that it still bends that's why I mentioned not just making if they're going to put in more room for the [TS]

02:07:02   battery but also being willing to make it heavier. [TS]

02:07:04   Have your what do you do with the heavier you could have your strengthening materials in there [TS]

02:07:07   but the bottom line is all these things are bendable they're made of aluminum [TS]

02:07:11   and glass aluminum Benza does not spring back like plastic does. [TS]

02:07:14   Plastic shatters [TS]

02:07:15   or breaks apart like you have you have to just not apply enough force on these things the bend I could take my i Pad [TS]

02:07:22   put half on half off the table and lean on one end of it and break it like you know or bend it or damage [TS]

02:07:27   and in some way and that's why I think pockets in the pocket ability of this becomes a factor [TS]

02:07:32   or at the very least awareness of what's in your pocket [TS]

02:07:35   and what forces are being applied to your bike just because you can kind of barely fit in your pocket [TS]

02:07:38   and then you sit down on concrete and you feel a bunch of clunks or you feel that stretching in your pockets. [TS]

02:07:44   Like don't ignore that feeling that it's not that they're not main made of adamantium or unobtainium [TS]

02:07:50   or any other made up metal this is indestructible. [TS]

02:07:52   They can bend and they can break and we know they can break when they drop them. [TS]

02:07:57   We just you know we try to avoid dropping them we know they can. [TS]

02:08:00   And when you plot the force in them don't put them in a pocket that's going to apply a lot of force to it. [TS]

02:08:04   Yeah I think it's important to keep in mind two major factors. [TS]

02:08:09   When Whenever anyone brings up a problem with the new i Phone which happens every year. [TS]

02:08:14   Number one if you have to ask yourself Does this happen to every phone you know it's a problem with every cell phone [TS]

02:08:22   that comes out and you know therefore it's kind of you know probably unavoidable or at least somewhat reasonable. [TS]

02:08:28   Number two you have to consider that [TS]

02:08:30   when the new i Phone comes out if you can show a flaw with it you'll get tons of attention you'll get tons of page [TS]

02:08:39   views you'll get tons of ad money from those pages. [TS]

02:08:42   You have a lot to gain by pointing out a major flaw in the new i Phone and this will happen every year. [TS]

02:08:50   And people always try to figure out what that form might be. [TS]

02:08:53   First it was the antenna thing on the i Phone four antenna was a much more solid case than bending because the antenna [TS]

02:09:00   was like you don't need a weird use case. [TS]

02:09:01   I can just round it like that and they're going to get with like well so that's fine [TS]

02:09:06   but show me with other phones which is essentially what Apple did when they did their video. [TS]

02:09:09   They didn't just say hey here's all the videos were here's my phone to let me wrap my hands around the denigrate the [TS]

02:09:15   way I look at this no signal as like OK well then show me you know last year's i Phone or previous ones [TS]

02:09:20   and somebody was eventually to do that but that's the key. [TS]

02:09:22   Like if you can just do something [TS]

02:09:24   and say in this bed you have to compare it to something that we either are familiar with [TS]

02:09:29   or find acceptable which is why you know no one complained about bending with every single other I.O.'s device before. [TS]

02:09:34   Maybe all of the previous I was devices were more bendable than the current range. [TS]

02:09:39   We don't know because the comparison has been made all people care about it. [TS]

02:09:42   Well I can bend this one if I try will hard. [TS]

02:09:44   Well try to bend all the other ones or don't bother telling me anything but bending is a crazy right. [TS]

02:09:50   Find other giant phones like you know try to bend the Samsung ones right of any age to see one such a couple of the [TS]

02:09:56   older they develop like they built someone Benz N S four and you can see it. [TS]

02:10:00   Comes the parts of the seams because it's not you know it's plastic [TS]

02:10:02   and then eventually the screen cracks because the plastic allows more bending the aluminum does [TS]

02:10:07   and once you bend the glass a certain amount of shatters you know you're right that it's all the sensationalism as you [TS]

02:10:14   know this is from being the highest profile not the most popular in terms of sale [TS]

02:10:19   but certainly the most popular in terms of like what people care about celebrity essentially i Phone [TS]

02:10:24   and i was devices or the celebrity devices. [TS]

02:10:27   Yeah that you're going to get a lot of interest in the story the show something bad about them [TS]

02:10:31   but as a consumer there is an actual consumer angle here [TS]

02:10:33   and the consumers want to know is this something I should care about [TS]

02:10:36   or is it just one of those things in the way you do that is by saying how does it compare to products I previously [TS]

02:10:41   owned that I know you're with and the best way to do that is to compare to previous i Phones or previous i Pads [TS]

02:10:47   or something like that to say is it better worse or the same. [TS]

02:10:50   Does that give consumers actual information and then they can choose to ignore it [TS]

02:10:54   or not not based on the whole idea of like oh we're always complains about Apple stuff [TS]

02:10:58   and so I should not pay attention or oh that darn Apple they're always doing bad things so this is terrible. [TS]

02:11:03   Let me know. Is it worse than a five S. Better than five S. [TS]

02:11:06   Are the same is by using information [TS]

02:11:08   and I can say this person did this comprehensive test that compared against all your things [TS]

02:11:12   and it turns out that the i Phones are no worse or better than any other one. [TS]

02:11:15   Then I know I can ignore the story but I haven't seen that story and I get into arcs [TS]

02:11:19   and like I stick it into my pocket and sit down with them [TS]

02:11:21   but if that's the type of thing that you do you should be looking for a story that tells you whether this is a concern [TS]

02:11:25   or not. [TS]

02:11:26   So titles and it's a load bearing finger his critique actually where's your holier on Kasab [TS]

02:11:34   or the low bank fingerless because I disagree with Casey's holding technique and I think he's right. [TS]

02:11:40   Oh my God you know it's funny to me that both of you are the self declared official arbiters of everything of all the [TS]

02:11:48   things your horizon is now I know I'm waiting. [TS]

02:11:53   You're holding technique based on the things that you would measure a holding technique on one of the discomfort. [TS]

02:12:00   One has to be clearly like this quite already around is arbitrary because you do it it's bad we're trained the way [TS]

02:12:06   evaluate anything. [TS]

02:12:07   What qualities of a of a way that you hold the phone are important might consider in which way of holding on is better [TS]

02:12:12   than another. [TS]

02:12:13   I don't even know what to say right now it's not the way you evaluate anything as if you know what are not you do. [TS]

02:12:20   Again we get back to the invisible spreadsheet that's a bit of an orifice out there the spreadsheet may be invisible to [TS]

02:12:25   you you may not have control over all the columns of numbers you may not be even aware that they exist but they do. [TS]